It is a "fake" only if the guys trys to pawn it off as an original car.
If he says it is a replica, that is what it is..........
Ray
----- Original Message -----
From: "Pip Bucknell" <mgwizard@caloundra.net>
To: <pthelander@earthlink.net>
Cc: "MMM List UK" <mg-mmm@autox.team.net>
Sent: Saturday, January 05, 2002 8:28 PM
Subject: Re: another disput looming
> Pete, Great stuff.
>
> There are, of course, various versions of English language & they vary a
> bit. Can you honestly tell me that "the owner" did not intend this to be
> his K3 when he says the following in Coys listing.
>
> "In the early '90's the car was purchased by it's enthusiastic owner as
the
> ideal basis on which to fulfil his long held dream of owning a factory
> pointed tail spec. K3."
>
> No sir. He does claim that this was his way of owning a K3. He did not
> want a slab tank spec factory K3 he wanted "a factory pointed tail spec.
> K3." - his own quote.
>
>
> But that is not the point I was trying to make about Replicas. That car
is
> not, was not and can never be a K3 or a K3 replica or a Replica K3.
>
> Read the Oxford Dictionary definition of FAKE :- to tamper with, to do up
> for the purpose of deception. So if you take an original chassis &
tamper
> with it to make it look like a K3, it is a FAKE. I admit that is pretty
> much what I am doing with my Racer built on a P-type chassis. However I am
> not calling it a K3 or a P-type so I am not doing it for the purpose of
> deception, rather for speed.
>
> Now, I am very mindful of your car that has a factory supplied K-type
> chassis as do both versions of K3015. These issues become somewhat
> different from the common practise of the last 20 odd years of making a
> factory supplied chassis into something different from what the factory
> intended. I am also mindful of another K3 who had his chassis repaired by
> the original "people" who made it for MG and a chap who was actually an
> apprentice at that establishment in 1933 did the repair work. Can you get
> any better than these examples of "factory produced" items which are not
> fakes in their own right as a chassis.
>
> So we have generated some interesting thoughts but no one has yet given a
> any argument why cars made from non factory supplied chassis or factory
> supplied chassis turned into something else should not be called what they
> are - fakes. They are not "specials" or Replicas. They are fakes.
>
> Best wishes.
>
> Pip
> AUSTRALIA
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Pete and Fran Thelander" <pthelander@earthlink.net>
> To: "Pip Bucknell" <mgwizard@caloundra.net>
> Sent: Sunday, January 06, 2002 11:36 AM
> Subject: Re: another disput looming
>
>
> > Pip
> >
> > These folks are playing it pretty close to the dividing line. They don't
> > actually call it a K3, but certainly appear to be trying as hard as they
> > dare to put you in position and let you leap to that assumption. I
agree
> > with your distinction that the originals were done BY THE FACTORY.
> >
> > One of the guys I've raced with here since my first races has (or I
should
> > say had) a Peter Gregory K3 boat tail repro. He wasn't bothered by the
> > lack of a true racing history. He only wanted to enjoy racing a vintage
> > style car. I met the new owner of the car and he sounded like he
intended
> > to continue to race it.
> >
> > Has also sold his three wheel Morgan. (I must say I had better luck
> > against the Morgan than the K. The only substitute for cubic inches is
> > boost pressure.) He is currently enamored with his recently acquired
> > 1920's Vauxhaul.
> >
> > Enjoy the new year.
> >
> > Pete
> >
> >
> > > [Original Message]
> > > From: Pip Bucknell <mgwizard@caloundra.net>
> > > To: Pete and Fran Thelander <pthelander@earthlink.net>
> > > Cc: MMM List UK <mg-mmm@autox.team.net>
> > > Date: 1/5/02 5:03:16 PM
> > > Subject: Re: another disput looming
> > >
> > > Pete, That's what it seems to be - purporting to be what it ain't.
> > >
> > > I agree with your earlier comments that MG did more or less the same
> > thing.
> > > That is converted or made something up.
> > >
> > > But that is the difference. It was done by MG.
> > >
> > > Anyone who does it now is FAKING IT - surely!
> > >
> > > Anyhow, it is interesting to hear a wide range of views.
> > > Regards
> > >
> > > Pip
> > > AUSTRALIA
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Pete and Fran Thelander" <pthelander@earthlink.net>
> > > To: "MMM List UK" <mg-mmm@autox.team.net>; "Pip Bucknell"
> > > <mgwizard@caloundra.net>
> > > Sent: Sunday, January 06, 2002 10:00 AM
> > > Subject: RE: another disput looming
> > >
> > >
> > > > Pip
> > > > Interesting that the Coys K type is listed with the chassis number
> > K0147..
> > > > The first K-type was Chassis No. K0251. Where did they get a number
> > > before
> > > > the beginning??? Maybe we need to see what information the restorer
> can
> > > > offer.
> > > > Pete
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > [Original Message]
> > > > > From: Pip Bucknell <mgwizard@caloundra.net>
> > > > > To: MMM List UK <mg-mmm@autox.team.net>
> > > > > Date: 1/5/02 3:15:08 PM
> > > > > Subject: another disput looming
> > > > >
> > > > > My dear friends around the world.
> > > > >
> > > > > It was nice to see the pictures of the destroyed K1 and I thank
you
> > for
> > > > the
> > > > > listing. I am glad the PRESENT owner does not make it out to be a
> K3.
> > > So
> > > > > many do. And what about future owners.
> > > > >
> > > > > However, to call it a meticulous "upgrade to K3 specifications" is
> > > > somewhat
> > > > > wide of the mark.
> > > > >
> > > > > I enjoyed Mr C Sherriff's comments as he accurately describes this
> car
> > > as
> > > > a
> > > > > FAKE. That is, it is purporting to be something that it is not.
> > > > >
> > > > > Perhaps you would all consider if it is time that we gave these
cars
> > > their
> > > > > correct name. This car can only be a modified K1 or a K3 fake.
> > Surely
> > > > it is
> > > > > not a replica.
> > > > >
> > > > > Our new Pre War MG Register Captain in Australia is grappling with
> > these
> > > > terms
> > > > > and it will be interesting to learn what he decides on these
> matters.
> > > > >
> > > > > I have said that I dislike the word "special" when describing MMM
> > MG's.
> > > > The
> > > > > reasons is that, to me, all MMM cars were special. Some specially
> > bad &
> > > > some
> > > > > specially good, but nun the less, still special. So when some one
> > wants
> > > > to
> > > > > change a car from this group, to something that it was not
> originally
> > > > produced
> > > > > to be by making "it" look like something else, isn't it truly a
> FAKE.
> > > > >
> > > > > Well, today is Sunday and I guess it is time to leave you all to
> > ponder
> > > > those
> > > > > words
> > > > >
> > > > > Best wishes to all for 2002.
> > > > >
> > > > > Pip Bucknell
> > > > > AUSTRALIA
> > > > >
> > > > > /// unsubscribe/change address requests to
majordomo@autox.team.net
> > or
> > > > try
> > > > > /// http://www.team.net/cgi-bin/majorcool
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> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --- Pete and Fran Thelander
> > > > --- pthelander@earthlink.net
> > > >
> > > > /// unsubscribe/change address requests to majordomo@autox.team.net
> or
> > > try
> > > > /// http://www.team.net/cgi-bin/majorcool
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> > > > /// Archives at http://www.team.net/cgi-bin/wilma/mg-mmm
> > > > /// Send list postings to mg-mmm@autox.team.net
> > > >
> > > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --- Pete and Fran Thelander
> > --- pthelander@earthlink.net
>
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