In a message dated 98-11-20 23:27:36 EST, vscjohn@iamerica.net writes:
> I can't give you the exact weights, but at my advanced age[and advanced
> mental
> deterioation]I can still pick up a Rove block with crank in place, whereas
I
> don't
> even try hoisting a Ford block.
John,
A Ford block is not as heavy as you might imagine, weighing only 127 pounds. I
seem to recall that the BORP block weighs about 85 pounds, 42 pounds less than
the Ford.
All of the Rover is alloy, so to get in the
> same
> ballpark with a ford you need alloy heads, intake, and such. the
> accesseries will
> be about equal.
Good point. With alloy heads and intake on the Ford, the majority of the
weight difference will consist of the differences in the bare block weights,
which means the Ford will probably outweigh the BORP by, what, about 50 pounds
maybe?
> Also,
> the late Rover motor bottom end is stout and better balanced than the
> average
> ford.
I'm curious about that, could you elaborate a bit? The BORP block does extend
below the crank center line, whereas on the Ford, it ends right at the center
line. That is one of the primary factors in keeping the Ford weight down. I
can see where that would make the BORP bottom end a little stouter, but I
don't think there is any problem with the Ford, it's stout enough. I am not at
all familiar with the differences in balancing. The Ford is externally
balanced, but I don't off hand know about the BORP.
The only limit is the absence of good aftermarket heads for the Rover,
> but
> in an MGB, the Rover's combination of goodpower, good torque, and low
weight
> is
> unbeatable. 250-300 horse is within easy reach and the B still handles.
I can't argue with you at all about that. When everything is taken into
consideration, the BORP is really unbeatable as a choice for the MGB. The Ford
is smaller, but who cares, as long as there is enough room for the BORP, which
there certainly is. More power is available, cheaper, with the Ford, but I'm
not sure just how usable that extra power would be in an MGB.
What does it take to get 300 HP from a BORP? For $2195, you can buy a
complete, brand new, engine from Ford, EFI included, which will produce 225
HP. Of course, that's with the iron heads - it takes about $800 more to get
alloy heads. To get 320 HP with alloy heads, it will cost about $4000 for a
brand new Ford 302, complete, ready to run (that's what I have in mine).
> Weight=hp.
That's true, but how much HP does it take to offset 50 pounds? Or even 100? If
a 100 pound increase gets you an extra 100 HP, that's pretty good when you
consider the weight to power ratio of the car as a whole. A 250 HP engine in a
2500 pound car equals 10 lb/HP. A 350 HP engine in a 2600 pound car equals
7.43 lb/HP, more than offsetting the extra weight. Even a 50 HP increase for
an extra 100 pounds gives 8.67 lb/HP. In fact, in the example just given, it
only takes an extra 10 HP to offset an additional 100 pounds. I would be more
concerned with the adverse effect on the handling than on the performance. If
you moved up to over 300 HP, you would probably have to up-grade the rear
axle, which will add a little weight in the rear to offset the added weight in
the front, so the difference in handling would not be quite as bad. Still,
everything you can do to reduce weight, especially un-sprung weight (from the
heavier rear axle), the better off you are.
All the above not-withstanding, I agree wholeheartily with you, that the BORP
is the ideal choice for the MGB. For the TR6, I would have to go with the Ford
as the hands down winner. That still leaves the personal Gee Whiz factor to
contend with, and that's totally subjective - no one else can make that choice
for you. Myself, I would still prefer the Ford, for two reasons - 1) it's a
little different in an MG, and I'm a bit of an odd ball, and 2) since I have a
Ford in my TR6, it would simplify things for me if the MG also had a Ford. Of
course, if the weight diffference really is in the neighborhood of 100 pounds
or so, I'll certainly change my mind.
One thing that hasn't yet been mentioned in this discussion is the "seat-of-
the-pants" feel when comparing any V8 to a 4 cylinder option. For most of us,
using the cars for normal road use, a 200 HP, 2 liter, 4 cylinder will not
give the same kick in the pants that a 200 HP, 3.5 liter, V8 will. To enjoy
the 200 HP from the 4 cylinder, it has to be rev'd up pretty high. Just ease
on down on the gas pedal as you pull out from a stop sign, and you will feel
the torque from the V8.
Dan Masters,
Alcoa, TN
'71 TR6---------3000mile/year driver, fully restored
'71 TR6---------undergoing full restoration and Ford 5.0 V8 insertion - see:
http://www.sky.net/~boballen/mg/Masters/index.html
'74 MGBGT---3000mile/year driver, original condition - slated for a V8 soon
'68 MGBGT---organ donor for the '74
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