- 1. SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: Andrew_Bettencourt@kingston.com
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 08:21:11 -0800
- Just as a point of fact for those who are unfamiliar with the capabilities of the Supra in question: ~100hp+ gain (claiming 400hp at the wheels) 1998 Pro Solo ESP champion Trophy in ESP with cones on
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01293.html (7,999 bytes)
- 2. RE: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: "Mohler, Jeff" <jeff.mohler@wilcom.com>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 12:59:18 -0600
- -- Suprising to hear the owner claim those numbers, because its not possible without boost control. 100Hp on a MK4 would require at least an additional 7-8psi of boost.
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01310.html (8,069 bytes)
- 3. SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: richj50@bit-net.com
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 16:09:07 -0500 (EST)
- Here's a few data points. I've heard that the Supra in question claims 400hp at the rear wheels. For those of you that think that the big, powerful f-bodies can top or equal that, here are some dyno
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01330.html (8,516 bytes)
- 4. Re: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: "Fedja Jeleskovic" <Fedja_Jeleskovic@pictel.com>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 16:21:46 -0500
- I would not expect that there are a lot of people who would argue that Supra TT should stay in ESP. But, after so many post about this issue (stock exhaust for turbo cars), I don't see any other car
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01334.html (8,529 bytes)
- 5. Re: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: "Jeffrey Lloyd" <jslz3@hotmail.com>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 13:38:56 PST
- Obviously In the Z28 world Torque (or area under the curve) Dosent exist, and peak hp is the only judge of a motors performance. Right? Peak HP means just that peak, for one fraction of a second.. An
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01336.html (9,352 bytes)
- 6. Re: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: "richard nichols" <rnichol1@san.rr.com>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 13:44:49 -0800
- I agree. Though my level of ax experience doesn't match yours, an experienced autcrosser once told me (as I mentioned earlier in a private post), "hp doesn't win races, torque does". Richard Nichols
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01337.html (10,264 bytes)
- 7. Re: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: richj50@bit-net.com
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 16:54:06 -0500 (EST)
- Now who ever said that the Supra TT lacks torque? We aren't talking about a 1.8L Honda motor that makes 400+ hp at 10,000 rpm. If the Supra bogged out of every corner and then hit boost just before g
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01339.html (9,073 bytes)
- 8. Re: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: Andrew_Bettencourt@kingston.com
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 13:56:53 -0800
- 400hp at the rear wheels does seem a little bit high. If you have ever seen this Supra at a Pro, you might think twice. Spinning a pair of 315 BFG's *through* 2nd gear. This car visually out accelera
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01340.html (10,343 bytes)
- 9. RE: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: "Mohler, Jeff" <jeff.mohler@wilcom.com>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 16:05:59 -0600
- 315FtLbs at crank at stock everything..not bad, but way up there at 4,000rpm. HP Peak stock is about 5600rpm. Not exactly a corner kicker at low RPMs
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01341.html (8,593 bytes)
- 10. RE: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: Andrew_Bettencourt@kingston.com
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 14:15:33 -0800
- That figure is the peak...do we know how flat that curve is? 300+ft/lbs is a ton!!!!!!! AB -- 315FtLbs at crank at stock everything..not bad, but way up there at 4,000rpm. HP Peak stock is about 5600
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01342.html (8,820 bytes)
- 11. RE: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: "Stevens, Kevin" <kstevens@ventritex.com>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 14:21:30 -0800
- C'mon, let's have some useful numbers if we're going to play numbers. Hell, my LS1 makes 350 ft-lbs at 4800 rpm, does that make it peaky? No, because it's already over 300 by like 2000rpm! KeS
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01343.html (9,454 bytes)
- 12. RE: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: "Stevens, Kevin" <kstevens@ventritex.com>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 14:29:00 -0800
- Probably around 250 crank hp - 15% = 210-215 at the wheels. What car is that? Rationale: the times are about right for a 285 (crank) HP '94 LT1 Z28, which weighs about 10% more. 285 -10% - 15% drive
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01344.html (9,085 bytes)
- 13. RE: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: "Mohler, Jeff" <jeff.mohler@wilcom.com>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 15:34:27 -0700
- http://198.252.200.66/readersrides/benjamin_treynor/Supra_dyno_run.jpg Thats a fairly good representation of a stock MK4 (Run #1) and a modified MK4 (Run #5). The modified run seems totally de-tuned
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01345.html (10,071 bytes)
- 14. Re: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: "Kent Rafferty" <gs96@sgi.net>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 17:38:03 -0500
- As an owner of a Supra TT and a Corvette V8 (LT4), I can make a comparison: The Stock Chevy has substantially more grunt coming out of turns than my ESP Supra. The Supra has more power on-boost, but
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01346.html (9,932 bytes)
- 15. Re: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: "Kent Rafferty" <gs96@sgi.net>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 17:46:55 -0500
- As an owner of a Supra TT and a Corvette LT4, I can make a comparison: The Stock Chevy has substantially more grunt coming out of turns than my ESP Supra. The Supra has more power on-boost, but at a
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01347.html (9,913 bytes)
- 16. RE: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: "Mohler, Jeff" <jeff.mohler@wilcom.com>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 16:49:35 -0600
- -- Even if I was very very loose with the rules, theres no way you could pull 400rwhp on a MK4 without breaking lots of rules.
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01348.html (9,117 bytes)
- 17. Re: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: "msmith2" <msmith2@columbus.rr.com>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 18:20:13 -0800
- How else could 230hp 3rd gen Camarobirds compete with 285-305hp 4th gen ones at similar weights and with a distinct front suspension disadvantage? Having raced both for quite a while, I'd vouch for t
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01351.html (11,344 bytes)
- 18. Re: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: Sam Strano <strano@stranoparts.com>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 18:38:42 -0500
- Ahhhhh, because a 3rd gen car has a front suspension ADvantage. I've driven both, and had 20+ mph roll-on's in 2nd gear with an LT1, and gotten waxed. Just to prove it, how could a 3rd gen with a the
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01352.html (9,425 bytes)
- 19. RE: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: Lindsay Wilson <lwilson1@ford.com>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 17:03:03 -0700
- <cut> I've driven both, and had 20+ mph roll-on's in 2nd gear with an LT1, and gotten waxed. Just to prove it, how could a 3rd gen with a the same 325 foot pounds as a LT1 have won nationals in '97?
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01358.html (9,138 bytes)
- 20. RE: SP rules and ESP Clarification (score: 1)
- Author: Sam Strano <strano@stranoparts.com>
- Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 19:18:51 -0500
- Chris Ramey, 92 B4C Camaro. 305 5-speed. I forgot to mention FS. Sorry, not used to being somewheres else now-days. Sam Strano Jr. Strano Performance Parts 800-729-1831 814-849-3417 (tech.) www.stran
- /html/autox/1999-03/msg01359.html (9,181 bytes)
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