[Mgs] . Re: H4 or HS4 carbs on an MGA 1600 and Electronic Ignition or Points (Robert J. Guinness)

Charley & Peggy Robinson ccrobins at ktc.com
Thu Jan 11 16:06:52 MST 2018


Wow, that's a lot of miles on that little long-stroke 4-banger!

CR

On 1/11/2018 10:15 AM, Joel Martin via Mgs wrote:
> Robert
>
> The aftermarket distributors are prone to quality control issues and I 
> would avoid them if possible.  I would recommend sending your original 
> distributor to Advanced and having it rebuilt and install a Petronix 
> module instead of the points. (Petronix verses points, always a 
> difference of opinion) Keep a new set of points, rotor and condensor 
> in the car in case the Petronix fails.  It has not happened to me but 
> best to be prepared - this will at least get you going again.
>
> I am the original owner of a 1973 MGB with over 223,000 miles on the 
> car.  The next thing we did was send the HIF4 carbs to Mr. Johnson in 
> OK and had them rebuilt with new throttle shafts - they were leaking.  
> Spray some carb cleaner on the throttle shafts while the car is 
> running.  If RPM's change - shafts are leaking.  New coil, spark plugs 
> and plug wires and you should be all set.
>
> With these changes, the car starts on the first turn of key, runs and 
> idles excellent.  About 8,000 miles since the above changes were 
> made.  I wish we had done this years ago - made a big difference for 
> around $500 total.
>
> Best of luck.
>
> Joel Martin
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* "mgs-request at autox.team.net" <mgs-request at autox.team.net>
> *To:* mgs at autox.team.net
> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 10, 2018 5:03 PM
> *Subject:* Mgs Digest, Vol 128, Issue 4
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>   1. H4 or HS4 carbs on an MGA 1600 and Electronic Ignition or
>       Points (Charley & Peggy Robinson)Re:
>   2. Re: H4 or HS4 carbs on an MGA 1600 and Electronic Ignition or
>       Points (Robert J. Guinness)
>   3. Re: H4 or HS4 carbs on an MGA 1600 and Electronic Ignition
>       (Eric Russell)
>   4. Re: H4 or HS4 carbs on an MGA 1600 and Electronic Ignition or
>       Points (John DiFede)
>   5. Re: H4 or HS4 carbs on an MGA 1600 and Electronic Ignition or
>       Points (Osborne, Paul)
>   6. Re: H4 or HS4 carbs on an MGA 1600 and Electronic Ignition
>       (Andrew Lundgren)
>   7. Re: H4 or HS4 carbs on an MGA 1600 and Electronic Ignition or
>       Points (PaulHunt73)
>   8. Re: H4 or HS4 carbs on an MGA 1600 and Electronic Ignition or
>       Points (Robert J. Guinness)
>   9. Re: H4 or HS4 carbs on an MGA 1600 and Electronic Ignition or
>       Points (Charley & Peggy Robinson)
> How well does the engine run?  If it runs well I wouldn't mess with it.
>
> CR
>
> On 1/9/2018 10:52 AM, Robert J. Guinness via Mgs wrote:
>> I bought an MGA 1600 with HS4 carbs conversion and a crane fireball 
>> electronic ignition.  I would like to go back to a stock set up.  
>> What are the *significant* pros and cons for doing so, for example 
>> power (rather than ease of maintenance)?  I know the H4s, but I am 
>> unfamiliar with working with HS4s (same with points vs electronic 
>> ignition).
>> -- 
>> e-mail signature
>> Robert Guinness
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
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>
> It ran great for @400 miles on a run from Raleigh, NC to just North of 
> Caryville, TN in the New Years Eve subzero weather, then quit. Would 
> fade and then rev back up (until it didn't anymore).  Probably a 
> combination of fuel pump, bad fuel, coil, and voltage regulator 
> issues. Man was it cold on that mountain waiting for AAA!
>
> On 1/9/2018 2:40 PM, Charley & Peggy Robinson wrote:
>> How well does the engine run?  If it runs well I wouldn't mess with it.
>>
>> CR
>>
>> On 1/9/2018 10:52 AM, Robert J. Guinness via Mgs wrote:
>>> I bought an MGA 1600 with HS4 carbs conversion and a crane fireball 
>>> electronic ignition.  I would like to go back to a stock set up.  
>>> What are the *significant* pros and cons for doing so, for example 
>>> power (rather than ease of maintenance)?  I know the H4s, but I am 
>>> unfamiliar with working with HS4s (same with points vs electronic 
>>> ignition).
>>> -- 
>>> e-mail signature
>>> Robert Guinness
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>> Mgs at autox.team.net <mailto:Mgs at autox.team.net>
>>> Donate:http://www.team.net/donate.html
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>>
>
> -- 
> e-mail signature
> Robert Guinness
> I can't imagine any significant power difference between H4 & HS4 carbs.
> The throats are the same. I suspect the HS4 carbs will be a little less
> leak-prone. (the rubber grommets on the H4 float bowl tend to be a weak
> point, IME) I don't think HS4's came with the decel valve in the
> throttle plate - if they did that could be a small difference in power.
>
> I am not a fan of replacement electronic ignition systems. When they
> work they work just fine. But when they don't work, replacement of the
> entire unit seems like the only option. With points, an occasional
> tune-up keeps it working fine. And if something does go wrong when
> you're on the road, a tiny kit with spare points & condensor is almost
> surely all you'd need to get going again.
>
> Eric Russell
> Mebane, NC
> > Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2018 10:52:13 -0600
> > From: "Robert J. Guinness" <guinness at stclegal.com 
> <mailto:guinness at stclegal.com>>
> > To: mgs at autox.team.net <mailto:mgs at autox.team.net>
> > Subject: [Mgs] H4 or HS4 carbs on an MGA 1600 and Electronic Ignition
> >
> > I bought an MGA 1600 with HS4 carbs conversion and a crane fireball
> > electronic ignition.? I would like to go back to a stock set up.? What
> > are the *significant* pros and cons for doing so, for example power
> > (rather than ease of maintenance)?? I know the H4s, but I am unfamiliar
> > with working with HS4s (same with points vs electronic ignition).
> >
>
>
>
> If you decide to go with an electronic ignition get a pertronix unit. 
>  I have used both , the crane set up with its brackets and screws and 
> shutter wheel is difficult to set up correctly and can loosen up and 
> fail.  The benefit of electronic ignition is not having to set up the 
> points at tune up time.  Keep a set of points and condenser in the 
> glove box in the event the electronic system fails
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jan 9, 2018, at 11:52 AM, Robert J. Guinness via Mgs 
> <mgs at autox.team.net <mailto:mgs at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>
>> I bought an MGA 1600 with HS4 carbs conversion and a crane fireball 
>> electronic ignition.  I would like to go back to a stock set up.  
>> What are the *significant* pros and cons for doing so, for example 
>> power (rather than ease of maintenance)?  I know the H4s, but I am 
>> unfamiliar with working with HS4s (same with points vs electronic 
>> ignition).
>> -- 
>> e-mail signature
>> Robert Guinness
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Mgs at autox.team.net <mailto:Mgs at autox.team.net>
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> I assume that your back home.  First I would work on why it stopped 
> running. Getting back running reliable before I would do anything.
>
> paul
>
>
> Paul Osborne
> Department of Electrical and Computer Eng.
> University of Rochester
> 201 Hopeman Building RC
> Rochester NY 14627
> 585-275-5226
>
>
>
> On Jan 9, 2018, at 3:59 PM, Robert J. Guinness via Mgs 
> <mgs at autox.team.net <mailto:mgs at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>
>> It ran great for @400 miles on a run from Raleigh, NC to just North 
>> of Caryville, TN in the New Years Eve subzero weather, then quit.  
>> Would fade and then rev back up (until it didn't anymore).  Probably 
>> a combination of fuel pump, bad fuel, coil, and voltage regulator 
>> issues. Man was it cold on that mountain waiting for AAA!
>>
>> On 1/9/2018 2:40 PM, Charley & Peggy Robinson wrote:
>>> How well does the engine run?  If it runs well I wouldn't mess with it.
>>>
>>> CR
>>>
>>> On 1/9/2018 10:52 AM, Robert J. Guinness via Mgs wrote:
>>>> I bought an MGA 1600 with HS4 carbs conversion and a crane fireball 
>>>> electronic ignition.  I would like to go back to a stock set up.  
>>>> What are the *significant* pros and cons for doing so, for example 
>>>> power (rather than ease of maintenance)?  I know the H4s, but I am 
>>>> unfamiliar with working with HS4s (same with points vs electronic 
>>>> ignition).
>>>> -- 
>>>> e-mail signature
>>>> Robert Guinness
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>
>>>> Mgs at autox.team.net <mailto:Mgs at autox.team.net>
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>>>
>>
>> -- 
>> e-mail signature
>> Robert Guinness
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Mgs at autox.team.net <mailto:Mgs at autox.team.net>
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>
> If it were me, I'd put a set of points in the tool box in case the 
> electronics fail and not worry about the carbs.
>
> But my cars need me to spend money and time on things that are broken, 
> and I'm not that much of a purist. I go original generally but it 
> doesn't need to be the same year if something else works out. But my 
> cars will never be concourse.
>
> I've got a 70 B with electric ignition and non original engine, and a 
> 78 with SUs, that has been converted to chrome and lowered.
>
> Andrew
>
> On Jan 9, 2018 6:32 PM, "Eric Russell via Mgs" <mgs at autox.team.net 
> <mailto:mgs at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>
>     I can't imagine any significant power difference between H4 & HS4
>     carbs. The throats are the same. I suspect the HS4 carbs will be a
>     little less leak-prone. (the rubber grommets on the H4 float bowl
>     tend to be a weak point, IME) I don't think HS4's came with the
>     decel valve in the throttle plate - if they did that could be a
>     small difference in power.
>
>     I am not a fan of replacement electronic ignition systems. When
>     they work they work just fine. But when they don't work,
>     replacement of the entire unit seems like the only option. With
>     points, an occasional tune-up keeps it working fine. And if
>     something does go wrong when you're on the road, a tiny kit with
>     spare points & condensor is almost surely all you'd need to get
>     going again.
>
>     Eric Russell
>     Mebane, NC
>
>         Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2018 10:52:13 -0600
>         From: "Robert J. Guinness" <guinness at stclegal.com
>         <mailto:guinness at stclegal.com>>
>         To: mgs at autox.team.net <mailto:mgs at autox.team.net>
>         Subject: [Mgs] H4 or HS4 carbs on an MGA 1600 and Electronic
>         Ignition
>
>         I bought an MGA 1600 with HS4 carbs conversion and a crane
>         fireball
>         electronic ignition.? I would like to go back to a stock set
>         up.? What
>         are the *significant* pros and cons for doing so, for example
>         power
>         (rather than ease of maintenance)?? I know the H4s, but I am
>         unfamiliar
>         with working with HS4s (same with points vs electronic ignition).
>
>
>     ______________________________ _________________
>
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> e-mail signature
> Under those circumstances a fault has obviously developed.  I'd 
> definitely resolve that first.  If you start messing changing major 
> components and still have problems you won't know whether the original 
> fault is still there, or it is something you have done, or both.  But 
> why do you think four things all happened to go wrong at the same time?
> PaulH.
>
>     ----- Original Message -----
>
>     It ran great for @400 miles on a run from Raleigh, NC to just
>     North of Caryville, TN in the New Years Eve subzero weather, then
>     quit. Would fade and then rev back up (until it didn't anymore). 
>     Probably a combination of fuel pump, bad fuel, coil, and voltage
>     regulator issues. Man was it cold on that mountain waiting for AAA!
>
> Here are the reasons for my suspicions.
> The prior owner did not drive the car very much.
> Fuel Pump (weak slow clicking from the points and sharp blow to the 
> pump caused increase in performance)
> Bad Gas (Problems began almost immediately after refueling.  Lack of 
> prior driving and severe cold may have settled some debris & water in 
> bottom of the tank).
> Coil (I had similar problems on another MGA that turned out to be an 
> overheating and failing coil)
> Voltage Regulator ( Problems arose after turned on lights and wipers 
> and heater  --  the starter would not crank and no electrics on 
> failure.  Started it a couple of time with the hand crank though. The 
> seller gave me the charger as part of the deal and he had a trickle 
> charger installed permanently in the car.  I was able to recharge the 
> battery overnight  and then it cranked well.  Of course, it could be 
> the generator or wiring downstream from the regulator.  It is on my to 
> do list )
> The heater control valve also sprang a leak over the distributor, but 
> that seems to have occurred only after the breakdown.
> My question really is whether I should go back to the OEM set up 
> (which I have n irrational preference for) assuming all the other 
> problems are already sorted.  Or would I be giving up some significant 
> performance enhancements.  It did go over the Continental Divide in NC 
> strong and well at 60 MPH.
>
>
> On 1/10/2018 2:13 AM, PaulHunt73 wrote:
>> e-mail signature
>> Under those circumstances a fault has obviously developed.  I'd 
>> definitely resolve that first.  If you start messing changing major 
>> components and still have problems you won't know whether the 
>> original fault is still there, or it is something you have done, or 
>> both.  But why do you think four things all happened to go wrong at 
>> the same time?
>> PaulH.
>>
>>     ----- Original Message -----
>>
>>     It ran great for @400 miles on a run from Raleigh, NC to just
>>     North of Caryville, TN in the New Years Eve subzero weather, then
>>     quit.  Would fade and then rev back up (until it didn't
>>     anymore).  Probably a combination of fuel pump, bad fuel, coil,
>>     and voltage regulator issues. Man was it cold on that mountain
>>     waiting for AAA!
>>
>
> -- 
> e-mail signature
> Robert Guinness
> Agreed, need to find out why it stopped running first.
>
> CR
> On 1/10/2018 2:13 AM, PaulHunt73 via Mgs wrote:
>> e-mail signature
>> Under those circumstances a fault has obviously developed.  I'd 
>> definitely resolve that first.  If you start messing changing major 
>> components and still have problems you won't know whether the 
>> original fault is still there, or it is something you have done, or 
>> both.  But why do you think four things all happened to go wrong at 
>> the same time?
>> PaulH.
>>
>
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