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No you couldn't have. For example read the history of legal battles between
Lionel trains and Mikes train house. contractor for MTH approached Lionel about
new designs for cheep. Lionel bit and produced these new designs thinking they
were from an inhouse designer. Instead they were MTH stolen plans. Almost
bankrupted Lionel. They couldn't do anything legal against the designer since
they were both using same manufacturing contractor.
Ryan
----- Original Message -----
From: "John Innis via Spridgets" <spridgets@autox.team.net>
To: "Mark Haynes" <220caribou@gmail.com>
Cc: "spridgets" <spridgets@autox.team.net>
Sent: Wednesday, January 20, 2016 1:43:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Spridgets] Spridgets Digest, Vol 58, Issue 6
That is all true, BUT, there is another layer to this. My company has also done
business with sub-contractors in China, and I spent some time there getting the
subs up to speed on the work they were doing for us. They work we got form them
was of acceptable quality, but definitely the minimum possible quality that we
could accept. The subs that we worked with did not care if we rejected some
product, it was cheaper for them to have rework than to do the work to a higher
standard. So we basically had to inspect everything we got from them. The
reject rate was definitely much higher than any of the other subcontractors we
worked with.
Then there is the IP issue. Just about every design that the China-based sub
worked on for us ended up getting ripped off and marketed by a different
Chinese company shortly after out contract ended. Both companies were owned by
the government of China, so it seems likely they deliberately transferred our
technology to one of our competitors. Fortunately they did NOT try to sell our
design in the US. I am pretty sure we could have stopped them, but it would
have been expensive.
On Wed, Jan 20, 2016 at 8:39 AM, Mark Haynes via Spridgets <
spridgets@autox.team.net > wrote:
This article is right on point, My brother in-law has traveled to China for
business (very astute Engineer BTW) and stated that the Chinese will make
anything that you want to whatever price/quality point YOU define. They CAN
make very good tools, but its up to the outsourcing company to tell them what
level of quality they want.
Unfortunately most of the US firms are more concerned with cost to produce
rather than longevity and quality (Are you listening HF?).
JMHO,
Mark Haynes
It only goes one way- Pay It Forward
On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 12:00 PM, < spridgets-request@autox.team.net > wrote:
<blockquote>
Send Spridgets mailing list submissions to
spridgets@autox.team.net
To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/spridgets
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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You can reach the person managing the list at
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Spridgets digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Insightful article on Chinese tools (Trevor Jessie)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2016 17:28:06 -0500
From: Trevor Jessie < trevor.jessie@gmail.com >
To: Spridgets < spridgets@autox.team.net >
Subject: [Spridgets] Insightful article on Chinese tools
< CAHkEVvTAkj-M7wsFcKk_u9P0F06UwVBBgk9yjD__xLon2uqA0w@mail.gmail.com >
http://hackaday.com/2016/01/18/whats-in-a-tool-a-case-for-made-in-usa/
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Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
</blockquote>
--
=================================
= Never offend people with style when you =
= can offend with substance --- Sam Brown =
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Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
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<html><body><div style=3D"font-family: Arial; font-size: 12pt; color: #0000=
00"><div aria-label=3D"Compose body">No you couldn't have. For exampl=
e read the history of legal battles between Lionel trains and Mikes train h=
ouse. contractor for MTH approached Lionel about new designs for chee=
p. Lionel bit and produced these new designs thinking they were from an inh=
ouse designer. Instead they were MTH stolen plans. Almost bankr=
upted Lionel. They couldn't do anything legal against the designer since th=
ey were both using same manufacturing contractor.</div><div aria-label=3D"C=
ompose body">Ryan</div><div><br></div><hr id=3D"zwchr"><div style=3D"color:=
#000;font-weight:normal;font-style:normal;text-decoration:none;font-family:=
Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:12pt;" data-mce-style=3D"color: #000; =
font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; text-decoration: none; font-family=
: Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;"><b>From: </b>"John Innis vi=
a Spridgets" <spridgets@autox.team.net><br><b>To: </b>"Mark Haynes" &=
lt;220caribou@gmail.com><br><b>Cc: </b>"spridgets" <spridgets@autox.t=
eam.net><br><b>Sent: </b>Wednesday, January 20, 2016 1:43:50 PM<br><b>Su=
bject: </b>Re: [Spridgets] Spridgets Digest, Vol 58, Issue 6<br><div><br></=
div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>That is all true, BUT, there is another layer to =
this. My company has also done business with sub-contractors in China=
, and I spent some time there getting the subs up to speed on the work they=
were doing for us. They work we got form them was of acceptable qual=
ity, but definitely the minimum possible quality that we could accept. =
; The subs that we worked with did not care if we rejected some product, it=
was cheaper for them to have rework than to do the work to a higher standa=
rd. So we basically had to inspect everything we got from them. =
The reject rate was definitely much higher than any of the other subcontra=
ctors we worked with. <br><div><br></div></div>Then there is the IP i=
ssue. Just about every design that the China-based sub worked on for =
us ended up getting ripped off and marketed by a different Chinese company =
shortly after out contract ended. Both companies were owned by the go=
vernment of China, so it seems likely they deliberately transferred our tec=
hnology to one of our competitors. Fortunately they did NOT try to se=
ll our design in the US. I am pretty sure we could have stopped them,=
but it would have been expensive. <br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extr=
a"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Jan 20, 2016 at 8:39 AM, Mark Hay=
nes via Spridgets <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:spridgets@autox.t=
eam.net" target=3D"_blank" data-mce-href=3D"mailto:spridgets@autox.team.net=
">spridgets@autox.team.net</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gm=
ail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-le=
ft:1ex" data-mce-style=3D"margin: 0 0 0 .8ex; border-left: 1px #ccc solid; =
padding-left: 1ex;"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div>This article is right on poi=
nt, My brother in-law has traveled to China for business (very astute Engin=
eer BTW) and stated that the Chinese will make anything that you want to wh=
atever price/quality point YOU define. They CAN make very good tools, but i=
ts up to the outsourcing company to tell them what level of quality they wa=
nt.<br></div>Unfortunately most of the US firms are more concerned with cos=
t to produce rather than longevity and quality (Are you listening HF?).<br>=
</div>JMHO,<br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br clear=3D"all"><div><div=
><div dir=3D"ltr"><div>Mark Haynes<br></div>It only goes one way- Pay It Fo=
rward<br></div></div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 19, 2=
016 at 12:00 PM, <span dir=3D"ltr"><<a href=3D"mailto:spridgets-request@=
autox.team.net" target=3D"_blank" data-mce-href=3D"mailto:spridgets-request=
@autox.team.net">spridgets-request@autox.team.net</a>></span> wrote:<br>=
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex" data-mce-style=3D"margin: 0 0 0 .8ex; border=
-left: 1px #ccc solid; padding-left: 1ex;">Send Spridgets mailing list subm=
issions to<br> <a href=3D"mailto:spridgets@auto=
x.team.net" target=3D"_blank" data-mce-href=3D"mailto:spridgets@autox.team.=
net">spridgets@autox.team.net</a><br> <br> To subscribe or unsubscribe via =
the World Wide Web, visit<br> <a href=3D"http:/=
/autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/spridgets" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_b=
lank" data-mce-href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/spridgets";>ht=
tp://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/spridgets</a><br> or, via email, send =
a message with subject or body 'help' to<br> <a=
href=3D"mailto:spridgets-request@autox.team.net"; target=3D"_blank" data-mc=
e-href=3D"mailto:spridgets-request@autox.team.net";>spridgets-request@autox.=
team.net</a><br> <br> You can reach the person managing the list at<br> &nb=
sp; <a href=3D"mailto:spridgets-owner@autox.team.net"; =
target=3D"_blank" data-mce-href=3D"mailto:spridgets-owner@autox.team.net";>s=
pridgets-owner@autox.team.net</a><br> <br> When replying, please edit your =
Subject line so it is more specific<br> than "Re: Contents of Spridgets dig=
est..."<br> <br> <br> Today's Topics:<br> <br> 1. Insightful a=
rticle on Chinese tools (Trevor Jessie)<br> <br> <br> ---------------------=
-------------------------------------------------<br> <br> Message: 1<br> D=
ate: Mon, 18 Jan 2016 17:28:06 -0500<br> From: Trevor Jessie <<a href=3D=
"mailto:trevor.jessie@gmail.com"; target=3D"_blank" data-mce-href=3D"mailto:=
trevor.jessie@gmail.com">trevor.jessie@gmail.com</a>><br> To: Spridgets =
<<a href=3D"mailto:spridgets@autox.team.net"; target=3D"_blank" data-mce-=
href=3D"mailto:spridgets@autox.team.net";>spridgets@autox.team.net</a>><b=
r> Subject: [Spridgets] Insightful article on Chinese tools<br> Message-ID:=
<br> <<a href=3D"mailto:CAHkEVvTAkj-M7wsFcKk=
_u9P0F06UwVBBgk9yjD__xLon2uqA0w@mail.gmail.com" target=3D"_blank" data-mce-=
href=3D"mailto:CAHkEVvTAkj-M7wsFcKk_u9P0F06UwVBBgk9yjD__xLon2uqA0w@mail.gma=
il.com">CAHkEVvTAkj-M7wsFcKk_u9P0F06UwVBBgk9yjD__xLon2uqA0w@mail.gmail.com<=
/a>><br> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"utf-8"<br> <br> <a href=3D=
"http://hackaday.com/2016/01/18/whats-in-a-tool-a-case-for-made-in-usa/"; re=
l=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" data-mce-href=3D"http://hackaday.com/201=
6/01/18/whats-in-a-tool-a-case-for-made-in-usa/">http://hackaday.com/2016/0=
1/18/whats-in-a-tool-a-case-for-made-in-usa/</a><br> -------------- next pa=
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