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Re: Overheating revisited

To: <Bricklin@autox.team.net>
Subject: Re: Overheating revisited
From: "Mitwelt" <mitwelt@bellsouth.net>
Date: Tue, 21 May 2002 23:55:48 -0400
Bricklins are an odd lot.  Besides hating to idle with the a/c on like most
cars, they tend to overheat in a narrow band of highway speeds.  210deg is
ok, but hovering at  240 is close to the limit of your coolant for boil
over, even if properly pressurized, especially considering meter
inconsistency.   Examining some of the modifications, you managed to hit
upon some good, some questionable, and some that are downright bad.

1) 3 to 4 row radiator core.   Questionable.  Some on the list have claimed
a higher propensity to clog than 3rows.  I'm not so sure, but the density of
the core challenges sufficient air flow.  I wouldn't do this without
addressing the latter.  Cheaper and easier just to re-core the oem.
2) Moving the A/C condenser coil.  Questionable.  I'm not sure here what you
were trying to accomplish.  Maybe some airspace "between" the two coils in
an effort to gather some more air without the resistance or heat of the
condenser??  Hmmm.  A valiant effort, but not necessarily a successful one.

3) Flex fan.  Bad.   First, lets look at the number of blades:  there is  no
direct correlation to increased air flow.  It may increase air speed, but
blade pitch and the space in between each blade has more to do with air
volume, which is what you are looking for.  Think of the analogy of putting
your finger over the end of a running garden hose: greater speed (more
distance), but less volume.  Further, flex fans are designed to flatten at
higher rpms to offer less resistance (read less air flow) and increase
available hp to the wheels.  Most cars do not need fans at highway speeds,
hence fan "clutches" which are centrifugal or temperature controlled.
However, the Bricklin is in an odd beast due to the cowl design.  TT has a
modified unit, but this offers little help at low speeds or heavy traffic.
Finally, most manufacturers have redesigned their cooling systems to include
both mechanical and elec fans, or just elec fans.  These are much better at
maintaining temp, although most newer cars have highly "massaged" gauges
also, and don't eat up hp.

4) 160deg T'stat.  Now here's a can of worms.  Generally, not a great idea.
In your case(Bricklin) certainly not good since this is well beyond the
functionality of the beast.  In other  words, there are many arguments
related to the rate of waterflow and the rate of heat exchange along with
the possibility of cavitations if too little resistance is in the water
path.  Hence, you will see high volume waterpumps on the same page of JEGS
as there are waterpump restrictors!  Like I said, a real can of worms.

You are right to worry about your tranny, as these are much more susceptible
to slightly higher heat than your motor.  Some have added an additional
cooler to take the load off the main radiator core.  Does this work?  It
should, but finding another place and space of good airflow and wedging in
another coil is a real challenge with Bricklins.

So, don't feel bad, people have done more radical things than what you list,
including cutting holes in the front hood, and in the fenders as well.  And
I've got some land in Florida...

Note: Always make sure your fan shroud is properly installed and properly
positioned with the fan blades.  This makes a WORLD of difference when it
comes to airflow.

All this being said, there are many roads to Rome, and there are even more
methods of bringing the temp of your feverish Brick down.  New fan clutches,
fixed fans(non-flex), additional elec push fans, coolant additives and
proper coolant mixes, blade orientation, a good, non-cavitating waterpump, A
FAN SHROUD, and properly functioning T'stat (180/190deg) to name a few.
Heck, even not pegging the a/c control helps a little.

I'm sure others on the list have further insights.

hope this helps

stephan "frequently heated"  #2821



----- Original Message -----
From: <Maycinc@cs.com>
To: <bricklin@autox.team.net>
Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 2002 10:57 PM
Subject: Overheating


> Besides the blown power steering hose I do believe that ol' 1343 is
> overheating.  It ran 210 all the way to and from the show on the freeway.
> Air temp around 80.
> As soon as I got off the freeway it ran up to around 230-240.   The engine
is
> rebuilt but stock.  During the car rebuild here's what I did.
> - Changed the radiator from 3 row to a 4 row.
> - Moved the bottom of the a/c core 1 in out from the radiator
> - Put on a 6 blade high flow flex fan
> - Installed a 160 degree thermostat
>
> I'm wondering if my water pump is up to par as the upper hose seems a lot
> hotter than the lower hose.  It wasn't replaced during the engine rebuild.
>
> Another possibiity is the tranny overheating but how do I check this?  I
have
> an external trans cooler but never installed it.  Would this help?
>
> Marvin
> #1343

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