[Healeys] BN2 Caster Angle

John Vrugtman javrugtman at htcnet.org
Wed Jan 6 12:57:41 MST 2021 

This is rapidly getting better than : "what oil should I use in my 
healey"  I would ask in this picture where is the gap, at the bottom or 
at the top.

JAV

On 1/6/2021 2:24 PM, Bob Spidell wrote:
> It’s a side load on the shock.
>
>> On Jan 6, 2021, at 10:38 AM, Bluehealey <bluehealey at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>  Sorry Bob - you’re still not gettin’ it.
>> The important bit is -
>>>>
>>>> the weight of the car is carried on the spring and bottom wishbone.
>>>>
>> That is why your jack under the pan lifts the car.
>> Then -
>>>>
>>>> The wheel and stub axle is bearing upwards, LIFTING the car through 
>>>> the top trunnion using the kingpin as a pull-rod to the bottom 
>>>> wishbone and spring.
>>>>
>> If you wish to test this, remove a wheel and place a jack stand under 
>> the spline hub to support the car.  Now unwind the the top nut of the 
>> kingpin a few turns and observe the increasing gap at the bottom the 
>> kingpin.  If you undo the nut all the way you will drop the car on 
>> the deck.
>>
>> Alan - from my iPad
>>
>>> On 6 Jan 2021, at 17:05, Bob Spidell <bspidell at comcast.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>  re: "The whole front end is sat on those two Oilite bronze thrust 
>>> washers."
>>>
>>> Nope. Proof: I have placed my cars on jackstands under the rear 
>>> springs and front trunnions and R&R'd their shock absorbers several 
>>> times (Armstrong shocks are a PITA, but that's a different rant). 
>>> Risky? Maybe, but done right the risk is manageable. My BJ8 rode 
>>> through a Richter 5+ earthquake in this state in San Jose a few 
>>> years ago; obviously, a flat, rugged concrete surface is required 
>>> (note messing with massive springs under compression has risks as 
>>> well). My BN2 is now in this state while I wait for front shock 
>>> rebuilds (though I have the jackstands backed-up by a QuickJack 
>>> under the chassis).
>>>
>>> Though there is a very specific gap called-for for the top trunnion, 
>>> the only reason I can see is too small a gap might cause some 
>>> binding--leading to even more steering effort--and too large could 
>>> result in the shock and bushing/bearing taking a beating.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 1/6/2021 7:39 AM, bluehealey at gmail.com wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Fred.
>>>>
>>>> You are not the first person that I have encountered with this 
>>>> confusion. It is usually held by those that are very familiar with 
>>>> pre-war cars and beam axles. In those cars the steering/stub axle 
>>>> is captured between fixed top & bottom ‘ears’ on the end of the 
>>>> beam.  The weight of the car bears down through the top ear onto 
>>>> the swivel axle. All fairly obvious.
>>>>
>>>> In the case of our cars, with top and bottom wishbones, the weight 
>>>> of the car is carried on the spring and bottom wishbone. The wheel 
>>>> and stub axle is bearing upwards, LIFTING the car through the top 
>>>> trunnion using the kingpin as a pull-rod to the bottom wishbone and 
>>>> spring.
>>>>
>>>> The whole front end is sat on those two Oilite bronze thrust 
>>>> washers. Any reduction in friction here pays dividends – especially 
>>>> in a 6-cylinder car with even more weight over the wheels.
>>>>
>>>> Maybe others can come up with a clearer explanation.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers.
>>>>
>>>> AlanB
>>>>
>>>> <image001.png>
>>>>
>>>> *From:*Fred Wescoe <fredwescoe at gmail.com>
>>>> *Sent:* 06 January 2021 15:14
>>>> *To:* Bluehealey <bluehealey at gmail.com>
>>>> *Cc:* Team.net <lawrence.swift at gmail.com>; Ahealey help 
>>>> <healeys at autox.team.net>
>>>> *Subject:* Re: [Healeys] BN2 Caster Angle
>>>>
>>>> Listers,
>>>>
>>>> I have looked at these top trunnion bearing kits over the years and 
>>>> considered installing them.  However, I simply cannot get my head 
>>>> wrapped around why replacing bearings at the top of the kingpin 
>>>> would reduce the weight of the car and improve steering.  It seems 
>>>> to me that all the weight of the car is pressed against the bottom 
>>>> of the kingpin.  To me, it seems replacing the top bearing would 
>>>> have no effect on the steering effort.  Can someone explain in 
>>>> simple language why this kit would work?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks, mystified,
>>>>
>>>> Fred
>>>>
>>>> 66 BJ8
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Jan 6, 2021 at 9:49 AM Bluehealey <bluehealey at gmail.com 
>>>> <mailto:bluehealey at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>     These are the ones.
>>>>
>>>>     https://www.ahspares.co.uk/austin-healey/big-healey/suspension-front/top-trunnion-bearing-kit-pair.aspx
>>>>     <https://www.ahspares.co.uk/austin-healey/big-healey/suspension-front/top-trunnion-bearing-kit-pair.aspx>
>>>>
>>>>     Well worth doing.
>>>>
>>>>     The other often overlooked source of heavy steering is the
>>>>     Steering Idler. It is rarely lubricated, has no real reservoir
>>>>     for oil, and a poor seal at the bottom. I suggest releasing the
>>>>     ball joints that connect to the drop arm to check it for
>>>>     stiffness. Complete removal of the idler isn’t a difficult job
>>>>     and is the best way to clean and lubricate.
>>>>
>>>>     The caster is pretty good on these cars (the initial design was
>>>>     good). Camber could go from positive to negative to be more
>>>>     compatible with radial tyres. Also check and minimise toe-in.
>>>>     This has a radical impact on steering feel when wrong (in
>>>>     either direction).
>>>>
>>>>     If after all that you still have problems, then go for the
>>>>     caster changes you have in mind and tell us about your
>>>>     findings. The Team may learn something.
>>>>
>>>>     The only other aspect that seems to vary from car to car is
>>>>     bump steer. Some can be horrible on fast bumpies and others are
>>>>     on rails.  I’ve never seen a decent treatise on dealing with
>>>>     this on our Big Healeys.
>>>>     Have fun.
>>>>
>>>>     Alan - from my iPad
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>         On 6 Jan 2021, at 13:35, Team.net <lawrence.swift at gmail.com
>>>>         <mailto:lawrence.swift at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>         When I rebuilt the front end on my BT7, I had the trust
>>>>         bearings at the top of the kingpin replaced with bearings -
>>>>         made a huge difference in the ease of steering.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>             On Jan 5, 2021, at 10:36 AM, Bob Spidell
>>>>             <bspidell at comcast.net <mailto:bspidell at comcast.net>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>             re: "The other two are factory fixed and too dangerous
>>>>             to play with or maintain...even if Kilmartin makes the
>>>>             parts"
>>>>
>>>>             How so?
>>>>
>>>>             On 1/4/2021 9:40 PM, gradea1 at charter.net
>>>>             <mailto:gradea1 at charter.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>                 I'm with the philosophy "set the toe and let 'er
>>>>                 blow" The 1/16-1/8" toe-in is most important for
>>>>                 proper tire wear.  The other two are factory fixed
>>>>                 and too dangerous to play with or maintain...even
>>>>                 if Kilmartin makes the parts. Hank
>>>>
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