[Healeys] Part III Knock offs

[Tom Felts]

FWIW, I use copper anti-seize also.
----- Original Message -----
From: Max Byers <sbyers at ec.rr.com>
To: healeys at autox.team.net
Sent: Mon, 11 May 2020 06:39:57 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: [Healeys] Part III Knock offs

Relative motion between two
metallic surfaces in contact under high load can result in fretting of the
surfaces and possible stress corrosion cracking.  Lubrication is
necessary on the splines and conical surfaces of the wheel and hub to minimize
fretting.  I’ve used only grease to lubricate the wheel and hub surfaces for 36
years and I do not leave the wheels on for years without cleaning and
re-lubrication.  Never had a wheel seize on the hub, and the splines show no
signs of wear on the wheels or hubs after 80,000 miles – except that there is
some slight evidence of fretting on the inboard conical surfaces.  Steve ByersHBJ8L/36666BJ8 RegistryAHCA Delegate at LargeHavelock, NC  USAFrom: Healeys
[mailto:healeys-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mirek Sharp
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 7:36 PM
To: 'Perry'
Cc: healeys at autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [Healeys] Part III Knock offs Perhaps a little tangential to the main
thread, and fully aware of the likelihood of me being accused of being pedantic
(which never happens on this list J), but regarding what to use on splines to
stop the wheel seizing on, I have never understood why the recommendation is
always for grease.  Grease is designed to lubricate parts, whereas 
the intent of applying it to the splines is to prevent them seizing on, not
reduce friction (i.e., lubricate).  For that reason I have always used an
anti-seizing product, my favourite being Permatex Copper Anti-Seize Lubricant
(they call it a lubricant, but woe betide anyone who actually uses it to
lubricate). It should be used very sparingly, and I have never had an issue
with a wheel sizing on the splines.  A very fine smear of grease on the
outside of the taper on the knock-off I agree is a good thing as the intent
there IS to lubricate.  Also, providing it is used sparingly, I have never
had it seep out of the hub and onto the spokes, avoiding the (in my opinion)
terrible practice of smearing sillycone (mis-spell intended) over the spoke
heads inside the hub.  Not to say grease does not work, it will, but why
not use a product designed for the purpose, and achieve clean spokes at the
same time? Cheers, MirekFrom: Healeys
[mailto:healeys-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of gradea1 at charter.net
Sent: May-10-20 1:39 PM
To: 'Perry'
Cc: 'healeys at autox.team.net'
Subject: Re: [Healeys] Part III Knock offs Replacement parts-not NOS-what if the
knockoff  bottoms out on the spline face before it tightens to the cone of
the wire wheel?  A combination of measured errors on replacement parts
could create this condition-front to back. The knockoffs were made to tighten,
but not be whaled upon.  If properly applied each side they are self
tightening and I normally spin them on hand tight, hit them with the rawhide
snug while still up in the air, and then wack them one more time on the ground
with the copper side of Thor. One time in the early '70s I witnessed a
BMC "mechanic" whaling on a knockoff of the Healey, still hanging on
the lube rack, with a ten pound long handle sledge hammer!  Flat ears? you
betcha. I would make sure that when mounted, the
front edge of the wheel is just forward of the inner depth of the knockoff so
that it actually contacts metal as it snugs it to the rear ring on the
hub.  Also-grease-not
to much- but be sure splines, and ring of hub, and knockoff threads have a
light smear. I use HD wheel bearing grease  so it doesn't seep out the
spoke nibs like moly or light grease would. Hank-----------------------------------------From:
"Perry via Healeys" 

To: "rrengineer.mike at att.net"

Cc: "healeys at autox.team.net"

Sent: Sunday May 10 2020 9:01:21AM

Subject: Re: [Healeys] The Saturday Night Rant - Part III Knock offsMichael et al,Contemplate the mechanical connections
between the hub extension, wire wheel hub and the knockoff. The hub extension is bolted to the axle
using tapered nuts that seat in the face of the extension. No rotational
movement.The wire wheel is connected to the hub
extension via the splines. The tolerances in the splines may allow for some
rotational movement but they have to be loose enough to get the wheel off the
extension. What else holds the wheel in place…the
knockoff. The cone in the knock off forces the wire wheel hub against the hub
extension, The contact interface is the tapers on the hub extension and the
wire wheel hub. You know the little area that we are frequently reminded to
apply a smear of grease to stop the little squeaky noise at low speed. If the
knock off is tight enough there is not movement here either.So Mike, if you see movement between the
knock off and the wire wheel, the knock off is not tight enough.  Suspect that the folks that developed knock
offs understood the problem of owners/mechanics not getting them tight enough
and used the handed (left and right) threads that self tighten. Gentlemen, remember your Mother today!Perry Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Michael MacLean
Sent: Sunday, May 10, 2020 12:57 AM
To: Healeys
Subject: [Healeys] The Saturday Night Rant - Part III At
my age (approaching this side of 70) I am on lock down at my house.  I
even have my groceries delivered.  I will only go out to eat at a drive through
with an N95 mask on.  My Boston Terrier that goes with me does not wear
one.  He refuses, but he is only three years old.  So, being
sequestered to my domicile I have taken up the restoration of my BN2 with a
vengeance.  I did not know I knew so many off color phrases. 
Everything to be done on this car is difficult due to parts incompatibility,
parts fit, parts unavailability or just  my general ignorance and/or
incompetence.  This evening I finished mounting the right side front hub
with all new parts.  I thought I had done a nice job.  No lateral
play in the hub.  Turns easily without binding.  The correct amount
of shims after much trial and error.  Disc brake conversion was mounted
and braided stainless steel flex brake lines hooked up at both ends.  I
have yet to run the brake lines.  Maybe next.   This rant is
about the brand new Dayton wire wheels.  I mounted the wire wheels which
have temporary used tires on them so I can move the car when it is down off the
dollies.  After mounting the wheel I gave the two eared knockoff several
pretty good whacks.  Now the moment of truth.  I grabbed the wheel at
9 and 3 o'clock position and pulled straight back and forth.  Yay! No
play, but when I rocked the wheel it moved slightly.  I thought it was the
hub, but looking closely you can see the wire wheel hub rocking back and forth
in the knockoff!  What!?!  How hard are you supposed to hit those
knockoffs?Mike
MacLean 

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