[Fot] TR6 Race Clutch Release Bearing - Annular or Standard Slave Cylinder?

Mon Aug 19 08:25:33 MDT 2024

Yes, leaks are feasible, though I never had a problem. The benefits of annular bearings are substantial—self-adjusting, no radial thrust. Properly set up they are a very neat solution. But yes, you take a chance of leaking. 

> On Aug 19, 2024, at 6:35 AM, Robert Lang via Fot <fot at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I'll jump in again...
> 
> Yes, real production cars have been using annular bearings for a long time. No question. Retrofitting these t/o bearings to our cars can have issues.
> 
> You don't have to mess up the dimensions very much to wind up with a problem.
> 
> There aren't any bolt-in setups that I've had my hands on. I'd be prone to trust the Vitesse setup (Miata gears in a NEW case and bellhousing) as that is a bolt-in. But I haven't had my hands on one, so no data point. As I recall, one of the issues with the aftermarket setups is matching the input shaft housing to the aftermarket part. I'll go out on a limb and suggest that if you're not a machinist or you have access to a  really knowlegable machinist, there are ways to screw it up.
> 
> Regarding clutches - not everyone runs a racing clutch. I use OEM style clutches because I'm not trying to spin the engine like a rotary etc. And I don't build for 3x OEM power. All this is for reliability vs max performance. Also, even with the stock setup, there are ways to screw it up and folks will blame the parts rather than an improper installation... because you can. For example, I've fixed a lot of TR6 clutch problems just by using the proper alignment bolts - this occurs pretty frequently... probably 30% of the cars that I've worked on.
> 
> So, part of the discussion is related to how you will be using the setup, e.g. "real vintage" or "real racing" and then go from there. Racing philosophy also plays into this. And it is possible to make the stock stuff work well and reliably without a lot of engineering.
> 
> Just my "tuppence".
> 
> Regards.
> Bob Lang
> 
> On Monday, August 19, 2024 at 09:14:16 AM EDT, Anthony Parker via Fot <fot at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> 
> I'm amazed to hear all of these stories of bad experiences.
> 
> Many production cars and race cars have used these for years.  Saab used them for ~40 years.
> Many aftermarket manufacturers make them.  Tilton, QuarterMaster, PowerTrain, ...
> 
> Are people using poor quality units, or are they being installed incorrectly?
> 
> Remember that aftermarket/race clutches often require 50-100% more force to disengage than the stock clutch, especially the smaller units.
> 
> Has anyone observed or measured the twist and bend on the stock cross shaft when paired with a race clutch?
> I guess if your bushings are worn enough, then the assembly can tolerate this distortion.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: Fot <fot-bounces at autox.team.net> on behalf of Mike Harmuth via Fot <fot at autox.team.net>
> Sent: Monday, August 19, 2024 8:01 AM
> To: Bert Brown <moosehd2 at pacbell.net>
> Cc: Friends of Triumph Group Email <fot at autox.team.net>
> Subject: Re: [Fot] TR6 Race Clutch Release Bearing - Hydraulic or Standard wSlave Cylinder?
>  
> Sebring 2020, internal throwout bearing leaking.
> 
> <P1015303.JPG>
> 
> On Mon, Aug 19, 2024 at 1:14 AM Bert Brown via Fot <fot at autox.team.net <mailto:fot at autox.team.net>> wrote:
> I was just at the Monterey Historics this weekend hanging out with 2 racer friends and one of their friends pops into our pit space with the news that his internal hydraulic release bearing leaked in the Friday session and the clutch was inoperable.  He had a Cobra and pulling a trans in one of those cars is an absolute bitch!  He wanted to know what our experience was with these bearings and if we had a replacement.  Everyone said they have had many problems with hydraulic leaks with these internal release bearings and "no", they didn't have a spare.  
> 
> Everyone's vote at our pit was to use the external linkage and slave cylinder.  When I used to go to the track with my car I always carried spare hydraulics and the external cylinder on my Spit was a snap to change.
> 
> By the way the Cobra guy couldn't find a replacement at the track and loaded his car on his trailer and missed his race.  All because of a damn internal hydraulic release bearing that he never thought he would have to replace!  Racing is fun!
> 
> Bert Brown
> ex GP Spitfire
> 
> On Sunday, August 18, 2024 at 07:59:48 PM PDT, Charly via Fot <fot at autox.team.net <mailto:fot at autox.team.net>> wrote:
> 
> 
> Mark, I have always run the 'stock' style T.O. bearing.  I've run several different clutches, from Laycock to Tilton, and have always had good luck with it.
> I've known several TR racers who have used the 'hydraulic' type  mechanism and have always had problems at the track and have been difficult if not impossible to fix.
> My vote is the stock linkage and a Tilton clutch,
> BTW, car is still for sale.
> Charly Mitchel
> TR6 #44
> 
> On Sun 18/08/24  7:05 PM , Mark Cook via Fot fot at autox.team.net <mailto:fot at autox.team.net> sent:
> > So, I one of my TR6s has a close ratio transmission with Mcleod hydraulic
> > release bearing, which is leaking.  While there, trying to decide on
> > whether to go back to a stock bearing, yoke etc, with an external slave
> > cylinder.  For reference, as part of the engine rebuild, going with the
> > Racetorations Arrow billet crank, 7 1/4" lightweight flywheel, cover
> > and four paddle clutch disc.
> > Not keen on having to remove the transmission for seal leaks related to the
> > hydraulic release bearing.  At the same time not familiar enough to know if
> > a hydraulic release bearing's failure rate is any worse than a standard
> > release bearing.  Everything I have read makes the hydraulic bearing seem
> > more sensitive to initial set up as well.
> > Thoughts?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Mark Cook
> >
> >
> >
> >
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