[Fot] Charlie Kates and his TR4 BAT vs GATOR

Bill Dentinger billdentin at aol.com
Mon Sep 30 09:16:32 MDT 2019 

Bruce...
All these names sure bring back memories.
Ken Gillanders was a Piece of Work (meant as a complimentary description!)  Ken's original Claim to Fame was drag racing his TR2 against Corvettes (handicapped) in the early 1950s.  And it was a Champion too.  No one was more enthusiastic about TRIUMPH than Ken.  If I remember correctly, he was a local politician (Orange County, CA?), and like all politicians, he was verbose (chatty).  He could and would...talk your arm off.  Later on he started British Frame and Engine, a mail order source of TRIUMPH competition parts.  Another, lesser known, fact about Ken, was his love of MAGIC.  I believe there is some sort of MAGIC HALL of FAME in his home town, and Ken was a frequent visitor, and loved to show it off to visitors.  
Sadly, both he and his wife had serious health problems at the end, impacting dealing with British Frame and Engine.

Ken was a Piece of Work.  I miss him.
Bill Dentinger


-----Original Message-----
From: Bruce Stutzman via Fot <fot at autox.team.net>
To: Vince G <vangoughv at hotmail.com>
Cc: fot at autox.team.net <fot at autox.team.net>; fubog1 <fubog1 at aol.com>
Sent: Mon, Sep 30, 2019 7:45 am
Subject: Re: [Fot] Charlie Kates and his TR4 BAT vs GATOR

Since we are telling Charlie Kates stories:Bill Fornwalt and I were racing a TR4 in SVRA events in the mid 80s.Charlie and his friend Bill Clark approached me at the 1986 VTR national.Charlie wanted to go racing and did so with much enthusiasm.He became Ken Gillanders' eastern test bed.Any new hot racing part that Ken got Charlie got it first.If it was going to fail or cause damage to the car Ken made sure the driver (Charlie) was thousands of miles away and could only reach him by phone and not by the neck.Bruce


On Fri, Sep 27, 2019 at 3:16 PM Vince G via Fot <fot at autox.team.net> wrote:

Great hearing the stories from fellow FOT’s.   Priceless    Thanks for sharing...

Vince
On Sep 27, 2019, at 1:40 PM, Mike Jackson via Fot <fot at autox.team.net> wrote:


Yea, not a dream.  Back in the day when SVRA had a spring race down here in South Florida and Charlie had a relative that lives near by to visit.Not only was he actually hanging upside down, in a FULL Batman costume but he had his little portable potty stationed back there with a rubber alligator placed as if it were about to be flushed down AND a boom box playing "See You Later Alligator" by Bill Haley and the Cometshttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ch1UQ47rWKU
Oh yea, Charlie's business is as a caterer/chef so he had purchased some 'gator chunks locally and fried them up to hand out to those passing by.That evening a friend found a certificate for labeling a bat roost which we filled out and stuck to the side of his trailer.
And then he retired from racing and wasnt heard from for several years until after his wife passed away.  Out of the blue he calls me years later and says "Well, my wife is dead so I guess it's about time I get back to racing"  He was interested  in finding another TR4 and I located one in the Midwest to send him to see.  Irv Corey's car as I recall.  Before he got there I mailed Irv a bat-a-gator to put in the car.  In the end he bought a different Brit car but at least we got him back!  
And, the bat-a-gators are another chapter that involved an argument about whether his Bat or my Gator was male vs female.  But seriously, think about it, have you ever seen a gator that looked female?  Me neither and I've seen a bundle of 'em down here.  Including the one that used to live in my pond, we named him Burt, after BS Levy.

-----Original Message----- 
From: fubog1 
Sent: Sep 27, 2019 10:30 AM 
To: grandwazoo at earthlink.net 
Cc: fot at Autox.Team.Net 
Subject: Re: [Fot] Charlie Kates and his TR4 BAT vs GATOR 

I remember a dream I had of him in a batman suit, hanging from the roof inside of his racecar trailer, down @ PBIR...Strange dream.Glen


-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Jackson <grandwazoo at earthlink.net>
To: fubog1 <fubog1 at aol.com>
Sent: Fri, Sep 27, 2019 10:25 am
Subject: Re: [Fot] Charlie Kates and his TR4 BAT vs GATOR

I just love that picture!
I'd have liked to tell either the Batman story  from PBIR or the Bat-a-Gator one from Rd Atl or the "Circle of Truth" from PBIR but they all take much too much explanation.

-----Original Message----- 
From: fubog1 
Sent: Sep 27, 2019 7:41 AM 
To: billdentin at aol.com, grandwazoo at earthlink.net, tr3a58dean at gmail.com,fot at autox.team.net 
Cc: charlie106 at att.net 
Subject: Re: [Fot] Charlie Kates and his TR4 BAT vs GATOR 

I have one of Charlies (cardboard) bats right here in my office!And then there's this photo if it goes through the innernets...Glen



-----Original Message-----
From: Bill Dentinger via Fot <fot at autox.team.net>
To: grandwazoo <grandwazoo at earthlink.net>; tr3a58dean <tr3a58dean at gmail.com>; fot <fot at autox.team.net>
Cc: charlie106 <charlie106 at att.net>
Sent: Thu, Sep 26, 2019 2:45 pm
Subject: Re: [Fot] Charlie Kates and his TR4

The infamous BAT vs GATOR race.  
I was there.  I seen it.  
They waved, when they went by.
Bill Dentinger.



-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Jackson via Fot <fot at autox.team.net>
To: Dean <tr3a58dean at gmail.com>; fot at autox.team.net <fot at autox.team.net>
Cc: charlie106 <charlie106 at att.net>
Sent: Thu, Sep 26, 2019 11:35 am
Subject: [Fot] Charlie Kates and his TR4

Charlies old TR4 is now owned and extremely well driven by Mark Wheatley.  It is a joy to see it every time its at the track with us.
I dont want to bore everyone with a hundred stories of that '92 weekend.  But, here's my favorite..Charlie and I remain great friends even tho he races some Jap thingy now.  We had been running literally door handle to door handle all weekend long and having a great time at it.  His wife Betty passed away some years ago but she and my wife Sandy were on the hillside at the keyhole for the "big" race that weekend.  During the race as we continued to come thru the corner either nose to tail or side by side Betty says to Sandy "I sure am glad Charlie doesnt take this too seriously and only does it for fun".  Sandy bit her lip and said nothing.  After the race she got Charlie off to the side and told him that he would "owe her forever" for not explaining to Betty just how seriously we did, in fact, take it.  
Ok, one more... in the paddock he blipped the throttle and it ran up more like an F1 car of the era.  "Charlie you POS, it's supposed to have a flywheel on it!"  His reply "It does".... "Well it's supposed to have a weight at least in two digits"...."It does!  Eight point five"
Dear God, there are so many more Charlie Kates stories both that weekend and thru the years.
Mike
-----Original Message----- 
From: Dean via Fot 
Sent: Sep 26, 2019 12:11 PM 
To: "fot at autox.team.net" 
Subject: [Fot] 1992 Mid Ohio 

Don’t know if this will transfer, but this is from the race in 1992 carried in Vintage Motorsports Annual. I PhotoShowing Mike Jackson and Charlie Kates. Sent from Mail for Windows 10 
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