[Fot] Triumph 4 speed O/D's and Layshaft bearing failures.

Sun Aug 11 12:55:57 MDT 2019

Well that's pretty cool!
I'm not sure those steel plates are big enough though😬
Did it screw up the case since it looks like your pulling from somewhere
midway on the laygear.
Thanks
Glenn

On Sun, Aug 11, 2019 at 1:26 PM Greg Blake <gblake58tr3 at icloud.com> wrote:

> I had one stuck last year. This is the little pulled I made from 2 exhaust
> clamps and some all thread rod. Worked like a champ.
>
> Greg
> [image: image1.jpeg]
> [image: image2.jpeg]
> [image: image3.jpeg]
> [image: image4.jpeg]
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> On Aug 11, 2019, at 11:45 AM, barry rosenberg via Fot <fot at autox.team.net>
> wrote:
>
> Tapered bearings do not work very well in the TR7/8 5 speed so I would not
> expect much better in the TR3-6 box. Why not chuck the lay gear in your
> lathe, bore out the hole a little deeper and make a long bronze oil-lite
> bearing for it? I have done this dozens of time with no problems. Also mich
> the replacement lay shaft as the ones for MGBs are .0025" too small!
>
> Barry
>
> On Sunday, August 11, 2019, 11:31:25 AM CDT, Glenn Franco via Fot <
> fot at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
>
> Yes exactly right.
> By writing this post, I was actually hoping that someone had come up with
> a good method or tool to get that bugger out of the case.
> So far I have not.
> Its hard enough to get the left over shell of that bearing out of the
> laygear when you can get the thrust washer out. I have had to resort to
> grinding a slot in the bearing shell to remove it.
> I would appreciate it if someone has a procedure for installing a tapered
> roller bearing. I would be interested in giving it a try.
> Glenn
>
> On Sun, Aug 11, 2019 at 9:55 AM fubog1 <fubog1 at aol.com> wrote:
>
> Yes Glenn that's exactly what happens.
> It's not an issue with the circlip gears converted to the shell bearings
> obviously but too common with the pressed only.
> I put a little loctite on them, they're usually a bitch to remove anyway.
> In addition to the high load on the rear of the laygear & bearing, it's
> exacerbated by all of the little bits of metal generated directly above by
> the graunching going into 1st & reverse, that stuff gets behind the thrust
> washer and eats up the backside of the washer & the case.
> I share your pain...
> Glen
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Glenn Franco <brakey6666 at gmail.com>
> To: fubog1 <fubog1 at aol.com>
> Cc: John Styduhar <johnstydo at gmail.com>; FOT list <fot at autox.team.net>
> Sent: Sun, Aug 11, 2019 8:43 am
> Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumph 4 speed O/D's and Layshaft bearing failures.
>
> Just to clarify, the problem is on both 4 speed and 4 speed O/D
> transmissions.
> Every failure I encounter is with the caged needle bearings not the loose
> needle bearings in the very early transmissions. The last few years I have
> been rebuilding many TR3 and TR4 Transmissions.
> The bearing shell (that holds the needles in place) works/walks along the
> shaft and forces itself into the small thrust washer that is near the
> smaller 1st gear. The shell will then fracture into pieces and the
> remaining will dig into the thrust washer and then the case if not removed
> soon enough.
> The caged bearing shells are available through Moss but the problem is
> getting that laygear out of the transmission case. As I stated earlier, to
> remove the laygear ( after the shaft is removed ) the small thrust washer
> needs to be removed so the laygear can tilt and worked out of the case.
> When the bearing shell machines its way into the thrust washer its almost
> impossible to get it out. Then you have a scrap case on your hands.
> Glenn with 2 n's
>
> On Sun, Aug 11, 2019 at 8:14 AM fubog1 <fubog1 at aol.com> wrote:
>
> That problem isn't unique to the O/D boxes.
>
> Glen with 1 "n".
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: John Styduhar via Fot <fot at autox.team.net>
> To: Glenn Franco <brakey6666 at gmail.com>
> Cc: FOT list <fot at autox.team.net>
> Sent: Sat, Aug 10, 2019 6:41 pm
> Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumph 4 speed O/D's and Layshaft bearing failures.
>
> Glenn, are you saying that the layshaft bearing failure you described is
> more prevalent when the tranny has an O/D or is it a general problem?
> Thanks
>
>
> On Sat, Aug 10, 2019 at 3:52 PM Glenn Franco via Fot <fot at autox.team.net>
> wrote:
>
> Just finished another A Type Overdrive rebuild this afternoon. Next one I
> do I'm going to insist that the owner bring a spare 4 speed for parts or
> maybe 2.
> I very rarely find an overdrive transmission that the layshaft bearing
> next to 1st that hasn't walked and tried to escape the case through the
> thrust bearing. I have tried in vane to remove the laygear with one that
> ground its way into the thrust bearing and sometimes the case. I sometimes
> get the laygear out but in most cases the trans case with the laygear is
> sent to scrap.
> Does anyone have a solution, trick, special tool, to ease the laygear out.
> The normal way is to remove the small thust bearing with a magnet so you
> can tilt the laygear enough to get it out. I have even once resorted to a "
> Slugger Slide Hammer" and chain wrapped around the laygear to get it out.
> Didn't end well however.
> I did read somewhere that someone is using a tapered roller bearing on
> that end which would make more sense than the original design.
> Please advise
> Thanks in advance
> Glenn
> TR6, TR250, Miata, 47 MG TC For Sale, 73 BMW E10 2002 being restored
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