[Fot] FW: brake pad and rotor discovery and update
Larry Young
cartravel at pobox.com
Wed Jul 18 21:51:31 MDT 2018
I'm surprised no one has mentioned the old clamshell TR3 rotors have
pads with significantly larger area. I kept the old calipers for that
reason. Newer isn't always better.
- Larry
On 7/12/2018 8:56 AM, John H. Hasty via Fot wrote:
>
> I was wondering about exactly this. The 6 rotor is 10.5” and the 3
> rotor is 11”
>
>
>
> *John H. Hasty*
>
> /Attorney at Law/
>
> *Mullen Holland & Cooper P.A.*
>
> 301 S. York St.,
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>
> Gastonia, NC 28053
>
> 704.864.6751 (p) 704.861.8394 (f)
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> <mailto:akisby-meadows at mhc-law.com>
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> *From:* Ashley Page [mailto:apage at prosystembrakes.com]
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 11, 2018 9:35 PM
> *To:* John H. Hasty <jhasty at mhc-law.com>
> *Cc:* timmmurphh at gmail.com; fot at autox.team.net
> *Subject:* Re: [Fot] FW: brake pad and rotor discovery and update
>
> As far as braking effect it’s simple math. Assuming the master
> cylinder, pad compound and rotors are not changed then the calipers
> with the largest dia pistons will, for a given pedal effort, generate
> more clamping force. If you care to to go to extremes then you would
> also factor in the distance from the axle center to the CG of the pad
> friction which is the “friction radius” - but that’s picking the fly
> poop out of the pepper for what you are doing.
>
> Other considerations:
>
> Assuming the TR6 caliper will bolt up to the TR3 knuckle, you would
> need to make sure the rotor path through the caliper would accept the
> bigger rotor- likely would but should be checked. At some point a
> rotor with larger dia than the caliper is designed for will touch the
> rotor path at the ends of the caliper (to small of rotor will touch in
> the path next to the pad opening). In both those extremes the pads
> typically won’t fit either.
>
> Another issue to check is rotor thickness. If the TR3 rotor is thinner
> then make sure as the pads wear that a caliper piston can’t come out
> of the caliper.
>
> Also check the pad to make sure it’s annulus is not larger than the
> TR3 rotor. You don’t want overhang or under hang of friction material.
> Also you want the friction to cover the rotor with very little unused
> swept area of rotor ID or OD. To much unused iron can be a problem also.
>
> Get Outlook for iOS <https://aka.ms/o0ukef>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 8:23 PM -0400, "John H. Hasty"
> <jhasty at mhc-law.com <mailto:jhasty at mhc-law.com>> wrote:
>
> What is the effect of using TR6 calipers designed for use on 10.75
> rotors on TR3 11” rotors ?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
> On Jul 11, 2018, at 6:27 PM, Ashley Page via Fot
> <fot at autox.team.net <mailto:fot at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>
> As Glenn pointed out ID to OD taper happens with some pads.
>
> Can also be a sign of loose wheel bearings.
>
> But probably as he describes due to higher rubbing speed on OD.
>
> You can easily taper cut the pads with a 4” diamond masonry
> blade from just about any hardware or Lowe’s. You can do it
> with any number of ways even a hacksaw but anything but
> diamond will wear quickly
>
> Get Outlook for iOS <https://aka.ms/o0ukef>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jul 11, 2018 at 2:08 PM -0400, "timmmurphh--- via Fot"
> <fot at autox.team.net <mailto:fot at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>
> *From:* timmmurphh at gmail.com <mailto:timmmurphh at gmail.com>
> <timmmurphh at gmail.com <mailto:timmmurphh at gmail.com>>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, July 11, 2018 8:36 AM
> *To:* 'DAVE HOGYE' <dlhogye at comcast.net
> <mailto:dlhogye at comcast.net>>
> *Subject:* RE: [Fot] brake pad and rotor discovery and update
>
> Thanks for this report. We have had some issues with the
> Carbotech pads on our TR4 at Blackhawk and the Kcup. We
> use the CT2-XP10 compound. I will check our pad to
> caliper slot clearance. Does anyone know offhand of the
> slot on the 16P calipers on our TR4 is the same as the TR3
> at 3.095”?
>
> Tim Murphy
>
> #317 TR4
>
> *From:* Fot <fot-bounces at autox.team.net
> <mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net>> *On Behalf Of *DAVE
> HOGYE via Fot
> *Sent:* Tuesday, July 10, 2018 3:22 PM
> *To:* Friends of Triumph <Fot at autox.team.net
> <mailto:Fot at autox.team.net>>
> *Subject:* [Fot] brake pad and rotor discovery and update
>
> Hello Friends,
>
> I have been finding out quite a bit about the unusual and
> developing front brake pad, rotor and caliper issues that
> I have discovered on my TR3.
>
> What I found was that the Carbotech CT-57 pads were
> causing the problem.
>
> The supporting or backing plates of the pads had been
> ground down at Carbotech, far under the normal plate width
> that I measured in 4 other production pads that I have on
> hand. Besides that, they were not ground down squarely.
>
> This allowed the piston to take tremendous side load under
> braking causing the uneven and diagonal wear pattern in
> the pads. This also caused the rotor to contact the
> caliper as the pads took on heavy uneven wear.
>
> The slot in the TR6 caliper is 3.095" and the four
> non-Carbotech pads sets have a plate width of no less than
> 3.082". The Carbotech plates have an out of square
> measurement of 3.030-3.050". That's as much as .065"
> clearance in the caliper slot.
>
> The plates have too much clearance. I found that a
> maximum of .010" backing plate to caliper slot clearance
> is more normal. One set of pads have only .005" clearance.
>
> Furthermore, the corners of the Carbotech plates and pads
> were ground down far enough that the lower end of the pads
> hardly made contact with the caliper slot allowing more
> stress on the caliper piston.
>
> I have been going back and forth with Carbotech on this
> matter and I will be sending back the badly worn set along
> with a brand set that have the same production issues. I
> bought the two sets at the same time last August.
>
> What I found is that any backing plates that show evidence
> of sanding or grinding marks should be measured for proper
> clearance, but that really, there should be no sanding or
> grinding marks...ever.
>
> All of the other pads I have show no evidence of sanding
> or grinding marks. The previously shaped friction pads
> are cleanly attached to the backing plates and the backing
> plate is revealed around the friction material. Only the
> backing plate makes contact with the caliper slot.
>
> It looks like I have to find another race pad supplier.
>
> Thoughts?
>
> Dave H.
>
> 831-234-4928
>
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