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Perry,I hear what you're saying and you may have a point. I will check the=
width of the gap between 3 and 4 and also between 1 and 2. At least that =
will give me something to check and determine if there are differences the=
re. I did not measure if there was any overlap when I put the head gasket =
in place and then the head. Again, I will check that with a new head gaske=
t.I received word today that my head is making its way to a shop capable o=
f welding cast iron. If I use it or not, I am going to repair it if it can=
be repaired. The shop it is going to is aware of cracking problems in thi=
s style head and will check for said cracks before and after the "fix".=C2=
=A0Right now, it's a hurry up and wait scenario, but I am bound and determ=
ined to get this machine back on the road and motoring under its own power=
. As to the sizes of the sleeves and the "previous" head work, not much I =
can do about that now other than be extremely careful as to the size of th=
e next head gasket, or head, or all of the above.As for the fault? I can o=
nly guess, and my guess leads me to the copper head gasket. I do not belie=
ve it was a Payen, it was the one offered in the Moss catalogue. Maker? No=
idea. The previous owner was using a steel gasket and I had no idea how m=
any times it had been used, so I opted for the copper as I was advised the=
newer supplies of copper gaskets were of better quality. If I had the abi=
lity to go back in time with the knowledge I have now, I would have opted =
to install a new steel head gasket. Live and learn, no crying over spilled=
milk or coolant. Just pay better attention.Again, thank you all for your =
thoughts and suggestions.Steven K.=C2=A0On Feb 23, 2022, at 2:58 PM, heale=
yguy@aol.com wrote:Steven Some thoughts.=C2=A0 Please advise if my assump=
tions are correct or not.=C2=A0Looking at your photos I can offer the foll=
owing: Anybody have a penny?AssumptionsThe gasket erosion occurred between=
cylinders 3 and 4.The erosion of the head material matches the gasket ero=
sion shown in the block and gasket.The head has had machine work done adja=
cent to the area of head erosion (as shown in the photos)=C2=A0The install=
ed block cylinder sleeves were stock inner and outer diameter.=C2=A0=C2=A0=
Thoughts:The block sleeving and combustion chamber machine work appears to=
have reduced=C2=A0the sealing area for the gasket crimp.in the area of th=
e erosion.The erosion would appear to have started in number 4 cylinder.Th=
at area has one of the larger water galleries in the 100 block, even thoug=
h it is somewhat squeezed between cylinders 3 and 4.=C2=A0The Payden style=
gaskets have sometimes failed in non-stock engine builds. That said we ru=
n 10.25 to one compression in our 100.=C2=A0Since you were able to get rea=
sonable drivability=C2=A0for the first 1500 miles and then added another 1=
500 miles without reported backfiring through exhaust or intake, It would =
seem=C2=A0things held together reasonably=C2=A0well until the gasket faile=
d and the head was eroded by the high speed exhaust gases.=C2=A0 Mr Lawren=
ce mentioned bad gaskets producing an overlap of the gasket into the bore.=
=C2=A0In this case it may not have been the gasket at fault but previous m=
achining on the head and or the size of the sleeves that reduced the gaske=
t crimp..Perry-----Original Message----- From: Steven Kingsbury via Healey=
s <healeys@autox.team.net>Subject: [Healeys] Head Gasket Woes Part Three =
Let me start with a little history with this email. My engine has just a =
shade under 3,000 miles on it since rebuild. The head was checked for crac=
ks, none found and was ever so slightly shaved to make sure it was complet=
ely flat. The machine shop I use builds race engines and they do really go=
od, reliable work.Then the block was gone through, new sleeves inserted an=
d bored so to fit my new pistons. Again the top of the block was checked a=
nd double checked to make sure it was flat and mated to the head.When I fi=
red this engine up for the first time after rebuild, she lept to life! No =
turning it over and over and over. She fired right up. I was quite pleased=
. I ran the engine for about twenty minutes at 2,000 RPM, never got above =
180 degrees and then took her out on the road. I took care not to over rev=
, and drove up a long hill in third gear at low RPM to help set the rings.=
=C2=A0I did have some problems with the distributor, but that was fixed an=
d at fifty miles I checked the head again for torque. I drove the car more=
and retorqued the head again at 150 miles, all was fine.I checked again a=
t 500 miles and again at 1500 miles. All was fine.=C2=A0Anyway, this histo=
ry is to let you know I think I did everything I could and did everything =
overly cautious to break this engine in correctly. And this engine was run=
ning great! My car was a joy to drive and loved cruising down the freeway =
at 80 mph! Seventy was a sweet spot and was a joy to drive. I'm now thinki=
ng of going with the aluminum head thanks to the combined wisdom of this l=
ist. Aluminum head with the steel gasket. I've heard nothing but good news=
about them and I don't want to have that worry/doubt while driving down t=
he road. I am also going to continue down the path of fixing this head as =
I think it's worth it in the long run.=C2=A0I want to thank all of those s=
ending in suggestions and tips and cautionary tales and things to look for=
and all of the views have led me to believe, bite the bullet and spend th=
e money.Thank you all and I will report back!Steven KingsburyBN1=C2=A0____=
___________________________________________m
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<html><body><div><div>Perry,<br></div><div>I hear what you're saying and you
may have =
a point. I will check the width of the gap between 3 and 4 and also betwee=
n 1 and 2. At least that will give me something to check and determine if =
there are differences there. I did not measure if there was any overlap wh=
en I put the head gasket in place and then the head. Again, I will check t=
hat with a new head gasket.<br></div><div>I received word today that my he=
ad is making its way to a shop capable of welding cast iron. If I use it o=
r not, I am going to repair it if it can be repaired. The shop it is going=
to is aware of cracking problems in this style head and will check for sa=
id cracks before and after the "fix". <br></div><div>Right now, it's =
a hurry up and wait scenario, but I am bound and determined to get this ma=
chine back on the road and motoring under its own power. As to the sizes o=
f the sleeves and the "previous" head work, not much I can do about that n=
ow other than be extremely careful as to the size of the next head gasket,=
or head, or all of the above.<br></div><div>As for the fault? I can only =
guess, and my guess leads me to the copper head gasket. I do not believe i=
t was a Payen, it was the one offered in the Moss catalogue. Maker? No ide=
a. The previous owner was using a steel gasket and I had no idea how many =
times it had been used, so I opted for the copper as I was advised the new=
er supplies of copper gaskets were of better quality. If I had the ability=
to go back in time with the knowledge I have now, I would have opted to i=
nstall a new steel head gasket. Live and learn, no crying over spilled mil=
k or coolant. Just pay better attention.<br></div><div>Again, thank you al=
l for your thoughts and suggestions.<br></div><div>Steven K. <br></di=
v><div><br></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div>On Feb 23, 2022, at 2:58 P=
M, healeyguy@aol.com wrote:<br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><d=
iv style=3D"color:black;font: 10pt Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;"><div sty=
le=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica;font-size:10pt;color:black"><div id=3D"y=
iv1593726861"><div><div style=3D"color:black;font:10pt Arial, Helvetica, s=
ans-serif;"><div style=3D""><div style=3D"" id=3D"yiv1593726861"><div styl=
e=3D""><div style=3D"font-stretch:normal;line-height:normal;"><div><span s=
tyle=3D""><span style=3D"font-size:10pt" class=3D"size">Steven </span></sp=
an> <br></div><div style=3D"color:black;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans=
-serif;font-size:10pt;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;">Some thoughts=
. Please advise if my assumptions are correct or not. <br></div=
><div style=3D"color:black;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-s=
ize:10pt;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;"><br></div><div style=3D"co=
lor:black;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;font-sty=
le:normal;font-weight:normal;">Looking at your photos I can offer the foll=
owing: Anybody have a penny?<br></div><div style=3D"color:black;font-famil=
y:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;font-style:normal;font-weigh=
t:normal;"><br></div><div style=3D"color:black;font-family:Arial, Helvetic=
a, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;">Assump=
tions<br></div><div style=3D"color:black;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, san=
s-serif;font-size:10pt;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;">The gasket e=
rosion occurred between cylinders 3 and 4.<br></div><div style=3D"color:bl=
ack;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;font-style:nor=
mal;font-weight:normal;">The erosion of the head material matches the gask=
et erosion shown in the block and gasket.<br></div><div style=3D"color:bla=
ck;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;font-style:norm=
al;font-weight:normal;">The head has had machine work done adjacent to the=
area of head erosion (as shown in the photos) <br></div><div style=3D=
"color:black;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;font-=
style:normal;font-weight:normal;">The installed block cylinder sleeves wer=
e stock inner and outer diameter. <br></div><div style=3D"color=
:black;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;font-style:=
normal;font-weight:normal;"><br></div><div style=3D"color:black;font-famil=
y:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;font-style:normal;font-weigh=
t:normal;">Thoughts:<br></div><div style=3D"color:black;font-family:Arial,=
Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal=
;">The block sleeving and combustion chamber machine work appears to have =
reduced<span style=3D"background-color: transparent;"><span style=3D"font-=
size:13.3333px" class=3D"size"> the sealing area for the gasket crimp=
.in the area of the erosion.</span></span><br></div><div style=3D"color:bl=
ack;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;font-style:nor=
mal;font-weight:normal;"><span style=3D"background-color: transparent;"><s=
pan style=3D"font-size:13.3333px" class=3D"size">The erosion would appear =
to have started in number 4 cylinder.</span></span><br></div><div style=3D=
"color:black;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;font-=
style:normal;font-weight:normal;"><span style=3D"background-color: transpa=
rent;"><span style=3D"font-size:13.3333px" class=3D"size">That area has on=
e of the larger water galleries in the 100 block, even though it is somewh=
at squeezed between cylinders 3 and 4. </span></span><br></div><div s=
tyle=3D"color:black;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:10p=
t;font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;"><span style=3D"background-color: =
transparent;"><span style=3D"font-size:13.3333px" class=3D"size">The Payde=
n style gaskets have sometimes failed in non-stock engine builds. That sai=
d we run 10.25 to one compression in our 100. </span></span><br></div=
><div style=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:transparent;"><span style=
=3D""><span style=3D"font-size:13.3333px" class=3D"size"></span></span></s=
pan><br></div><div style=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:transparent;=
"><span style=3D""><span style=3D"font-size:13.3333px" class=3D"size">Sinc=
e you were able to get reasonable drivability for the first 1500 mile=
s and then added another 1500 miles without reported backfiring through ex=
haust or intake, It would seem </span></span></span><br></div><div st=
yle=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:transparent;"><span style=3D""><s=
pan style=3D"font-size:13.3333px" class=3D"size">things held together reas=
onably well until the gasket failed and the head was eroded by the hi=
gh speed exhaust gases. Mr Lawrence mentioned bad gaskets producing =
an overlap of the gasket into the bore. </span></span></span><br></di=
v><div style=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:transparent;"><span styl=
e=3D""><span style=3D"font-size:13.3333px" class=3D"size">In this case it =
may not have been the gasket at fault but previous machining on the head a=
nd or the size of the sleeves that reduced the gasket crimp..</span></span=
></span><br></div><div style=3D""><span style=3D"background-color:transpar=
ent;"><span style=3D""><span style=3D"font-size:13.3333px" class=3D"size">=
Perry</span></span></span><br></div><div style=3D"color:black;font-family:=
Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;font-style:normal;font-weight:=
normal;"><span style=3D"background-color: transparent;"><span style=3D"fon=
t-size:13.3333px" class=3D"size"></span></span><br></div><div style=3D"col=
or:black;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:10pt;font-styl=
e:normal;font-weight:normal;"><div><br></div><div><br></div><div style=3D"=
font-family:arial, helvetica;font-size:10pt;color:black;"><div><span style=
=3D"font-size:13px" class=3D"size">-----Original Message-----<br clear=3D"=
none"> From: Steven Kingsbury via Healeys <healeys@autox.team.net><b=
r clear=3D"none">Subject: [Healeys] Head Gasket Woes Part Three<br clear=3D=
"none"> <br clear=3D"none"> </span> </div><div class=3D"yiv1593726861yqt21=
14312721" id=3D"yiv1593726861yqt72536"><div class=3D"yiv1593726861yqt32467=
14327" id=3D"yiv1593726861yqt21330"><div id=3D"yiv1593726861"><div><div>Le=
t me start with a little history with this email. My engine has just a sha=
de under 3,000 miles on it since rebuild. The head was checked for cracks,=
none found and was ever so slightly shaved to make sure it was completely=
flat. The machine shop I use builds race engines and they do really good,=
reliable work.<br></div><div>Then the block was gone through, new sleeves=
inserted and bored so to fit my new pistons. Again the top of the block w=
as checked and double checked to make sure it was flat and mated to the he=
ad.<br></div><div>When I fired this engine up for the first time after reb=
uild, she lept to life! No turning it over and over and over. She fired ri=
ght up. I was quite pleased. <br></div><div>I ran the engine for about twe=
nty minutes at 2,000 RPM, never got above 180 degrees and then took her ou=
t on the road. I took care not to over rev, and drove up a long hill in th=
ird gear at low RPM to help set the rings. <br></div><div>I did have =
some problems with the distributor, but that was fixed and at fifty miles =
I checked the head again for torque. I drove the car more and retorqued th=
e head again at 150 miles, all was fine.<br></div><div>I checked again at =
500 miles and again at 1500 miles. All was fine. <br></div><div>Anywa=
y, this history is to let you know I think I did everything I could and di=
d everything overly cautious to break this engine in correctly. And this e=
ngine was running great! My car was a joy to drive and loved cruising down=
the freeway at 80 mph! Seventy was a sweet spot and was a joy to drive. <=
br></div><div>I'm now thinking of going with the aluminum head thanks to t=
he combined wisdom of this list. Aluminum head with the steel gasket. I've=
heard nothing but good news about them and I don't want to have that worr=
y/doubt while driving down the road. I am also going to continue down the =
path of fixing this head as I think it's worth it in the long run. <b=
r></div><div>I want to thank all of those sending in suggestions and tips =
and cautionary tales and things to look for and all of the views have led =
me to believe, bite the bullet and spend the money.<br></div><div>Thank yo=
u all and I will report back!<br></div><div>Steven Kingsbury<br></div><div=
>BN1 <br></div></div></div></div></div><div>_________________________=
______________________<br></div><div><a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mail=
man/options/healeys/healeyguy@aol.com" shape=3D"rect" rel=3D"noopener nore=
ferrer">m</a><br></div><div> <br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div=
></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div><div><br></div></body></html>
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