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While this discussion regards collision I think the greater concern =
would be liability. I mean, yea, eating $50K on a damaged Tiger is a =
loss, but being liable for hundreds of thousands of dollars (or more) is =
a far greater risk. That said I think liability would be full time =
=E2=80=93 regardless, because anytime of the day someone could steal =
your car and create havoc. So, I can=E2=80=99t see how =
=E2=80=9Cuse=E2=80=9D would not cover liability under any circumstance. =
Through my collector insurance (20+ years) I was told that 2,500 max =
miles, not a daily driver and in their words =E2=80=9Can occasional =
Sunday drive=E2=80=9D (not limited to Sunday) is OK. The persons parting =
words were, =E2=80=9CJust don=E2=80=99t drive it to work.=E2=80=9D
I have three lesser =E2=80=9Ccollector=E2=80=9D cars. They are valued =
at $3,000 each. I don=E2=80=99t think I put more than 250 miles on =
anyone of them in a year. Neither my wife, kids, nor anyone else have =
ever driven them. In my opinion driving them to the store for parts, to =
eliminate flats spots in tires, cook off condensation etc. are all part =
of what is necessary for =E2=80=9Cmaintaining=E2=80=9D the car. Frankly =
I find what is termed =E2=80=9Cuse=E2=80=9D is rather ambiguously =
stated. Stated in a way to control your driving, but wonder how it holds =
up in court. Sort of like the parent that threatens to beat the =
daylights out of you regarding your behavior =E2=80=93 but legally =
can=E2=80=99t do so. Again, I=E2=80=99m more looking at the liability =
side of insurance. I doubt I=E2=80=99d ever put a claim in on a $3,000 =
car.=20
From: CoolVT--- via Tigers=20
Sent: Monday, August 24, 2015 2:36 PM
To: jefferyrandall@gmail.com ; sabre2tgr@gmail.com=20
Cc: tigers@autox.team.net=20
Subject: Re: [Tigers] Fwd: Driven Tger nsurance
I think it makes a big difference on where you are located. I pay State =
Farm $202 for a stated value, classic car policy. This is in Vermont =
where the rates are more reasonable than a highly populated area. For =
example I've been quoted prices from State Farm on another vehicle in =
both Vermont and Florida. The Florida quote was almost double the VT =
quote.
In a message dated 8/24/2015 5:26:41 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, =
tigers@autox.team.net writes:
I had to get an appraiser's stated value in writing that cost me $275, =
that valued the car at 52.5, the writer for Commerce said they would =
only insure the car for 48 with a 500 deductible. If you want the =
freedom to use the car it's gonna cost ya.
Jeff
On Sun, Aug 23, 2015 at 6:50 PM, Stu via Tigers =
<tigers@autox.team.net> wrote:
I just went through this, and Hagerty seemed a little more liberal =
than Grundy. Their use restrictions mostly fit my use model. =
Occasional pleasure drives, car shows, cruise nights, maybe to a family =
party to show off, rarely to work (once in the last year and a half), =
all the family at home have their own cars, no family under 25 who know =
how to drive a stick, evening or weekend drives to try to track down =
that pesky problem, and so on. From what their stuff says, these would =
be mostly OK.
Stu
On Sun, Aug 23, 2015 at 6:22 PM, Jay Laifman via Tigers =
<tigers@autox.team.net> wrote:
I have had the same issue - this is also for my early 911 and 912. =
There are a number of issues with all the classic car policies. As =
you've noted, it can't be your daily driver. Not only that, you have to =
have a car that is at least 15 years old for all drivers in the house. =
My 2000 Boxster, which is still like new isn't good enough. One company =
said I might be able to get a waiver of this one. Some said there is no =
waiver. =20
Another issue is that no one under 25 can drive the car. So if =
my son and I drive to a car show, he can't drive at all. I kind of get =
it. But, life's too short not to enjoy these cars with my kids here and =
now.
Another issue is that you can use it to go to work once and a =
while. But that is on a rare occasion when you are doing something =
else. So if you want to drive it every Friday or a week here and there, =
you won't be covered. That means NO coverage. Some of them were really =
strict on this - like if you get in an accident on a Wednesday morning =
at 7:00 am on your route to work, don't expect getting coverage for the =
accident without a huge fight.
One of the places, and I think it was Grundy's, I asked if I could =
stop at a hardware store on the weekends. She gasped and recounted how =
she saw a Ferrari parked at the far end of a Home Depot over the weekend =
and thought to herself that she sure hopes she doesn't insure that car! =
Geeze, really? Us car guys can't stop at a hardware store and park at =
the far end? That's a show stopper for me. Note some others said it was =
ok if it was part of a joy ride and not a weekend errand drive.
Believe me, I called EVERY ONE of the companies and asked them all =
the same questions. They all basically gave the same answers. Yes, you =
can get their insurance and figure they will never know. And they may =
give half answers about how they cover various things. But, if you =
really put them to specific questions, they don't give good answers. =20
I get it. They have to evaluate their risk and what they want to =
insure. They want to insure parade cars and joy ride cars, and will =
take the risk for a restaurant with your wife here and there. That's =
not me, and never will be. =20
I guess you can look at it another way too. I have not paid more =
than $10k for any of my cars. So in one way, if something bad happened, =
I would be out only $10k plus the expenses over the years. I know, two =
of these cars are probably (definitely?) worth over $100k in investment =
terms. So I could lose much more in paper. I don't like looking at it =
this way, but it is a way to rationalize it.
Right now, I do a lot of self insurance by being especially =
careful where I park the cars, how long I am away from them, how well =
they are locked up, etc. It's not perfect. But, I'd rather be =
underinsured than have NO insurance because I have a classic policy and =
I'm using it to actually drive.
Jay
On Sun, Aug 23, 2015 at 2:59 PM, genepadgett--- via Tigers =
<tigers@autox.team.net> wrote:
I did not see this post to my own e-mail and am thinking that =
somehow it did not go through. I am re-sending it in hopes that it will =
go through this time. Confirmation of receipt from anyone on the List =
would be appreciated.
TIA, Gene
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: genepadgett@comcast.net
To: "tigers" <tigers@autox.team.net>
Sent: Friday, August 21, 2015 12:28:53 PM
Subject: Driven Tger nsurance
Hi All,
With the recent jump in auction prices for our cars, I am =
wondering what people like me who just enjoy driving their cars are =
doing for insurance. I just got turned down by Grundy because the =
"vehicle cannot be used as backup, primary or secondary transportation". =
This dispite the fact both my wife and I have other cars which serve =
as our regular daily driver vehicles.
To me, being able to take the Tiger out when and where I want to =
go is the essence of having and enjoying the car in the first place. =
It is the journey not the destination that matters to me. I bought =
the car new in 1967 and have never thought of it as a collectible or =
investment. Still with the recent escalation in apparent values, I do =
not want to be stupid about insurance.
Anyone else on the List that might be of a similar mind as me =
and own their Tiger for the enjoyment of driving it can bring? If so =
what do you do for insurance?
TIA,
Gene
_______________________________________________
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------=_NextPart_000_004A_01D0DF18.493C1D70
charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content=3D"text/html; charset=3DUS-ASCII" =
http-equiv=3DContent-Type>
<META name=3DGENERATOR content=3D"MSHTML 11.00.9600.17963"></HEAD>
<BODY id=3Drole_body style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; =
COLOR: #000000"=20
dir=3Dltr bottomMargin=3D7 leftMargin=3D7 rightMargin=3D7 topMargin=3D7>
<DIV dir=3Dltr>
<DIV style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri'; COLOR: #000000">
<DIV>While this discussion regards collision I think the greater concern =
would=20
be liability. I mean, yea, eating $50K on a damaged Tiger is a loss, but =
being=20
liable for hundreds of thousands of dollars (or more) is a far greater=20
risk. That said I think liability would be full time =E2=80=93 =
regardless, because=20
anytime of the day someone could steal your car and create havoc. So, I =
can=E2=80=99t=20
see how =E2=80=9Cuse=E2=80=9D would not cover liability under any =
circumstance. Through my=20
collector insurance (20+ years) I was told that 2,500 max miles, not a =
daily=20
driver and in their words =E2=80=9Can occasional Sunday drive=E2=80=9D =
(not limited to Sunday)=20
is OK. The persons parting words were, =E2=80=9CJust don=E2=80=99t drive =
it to work.=E2=80=9D</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> I have three lesser =E2=80=9Ccollector=E2=80=9D cars. They =
are valued at $3,000=20
each. I don=E2=80=99t think I put more than 250 miles on anyone of them =
in a year.=20
Neither my wife, kids, nor anyone else have ever driven them. In my =
opinion=20
driving them to the store for parts, to eliminate flats spots in tires, =
cook off=20
condensation etc. are all part of what is necessary for =
=E2=80=9Cmaintaining=E2=80=9D the=20
car. Frankly I find what is termed =E2=80=9Cuse=E2=80=9D is rather =
ambiguously stated.=20
Stated in a way to control your driving, but wonder how it holds up in=20
court. Sort of like the parent that threatens to beat the =
daylights out of=20
you regarding your behavior =E2=80=93 but legally can=E2=80=99t do so. =
Again, I=E2=80=99m more looking=20
at the liability side of insurance. I doubt I=E2=80=99d ever put a claim =
in on a $3,000=20
car. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D'FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: =
"Calibri"; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; =
DISPLAY: inline'></DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt tahoma">
<DIV style=3D"BACKGROUND: #f5f5f5">
<DIV style=3D"font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A =
title=3Dtigers@autox.team.net=20
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net";>CoolVT--- via Tigers</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Monday, August 24, 2015 2:36 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=3Djefferyrandall@gmail.com=20
href=3D"mailto:jefferyrandall@gmail.com";>jefferyrandall@gmail.com</A> ; =
<A=20
title=3Dsabre2tgr@gmail.com=20
href=3D"mailto:sabre2tgr@gmail.com";>sabre2tgr@gmail.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Cc:</B> <A title=3Dtigers@autox.team.net=20
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net";>tigers@autox.team.net</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Tigers] Fwd: Driven Tger =
nsurance</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D'FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: =
"Calibri"; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; =
DISPLAY: inline'><FONT=20
id=3Drole_document color=3D#000000 size=3D3 face=3DArial>
<DIV><STRONG>I think it makes a big difference on where you are located. =
I pay=20
State Farm $202 for a stated value, classic car policy. This is in =
Vermont=20
where the rates are more reasonable than a highly populated area. =
For=20
example I've been quoted prices from State Farm on another vehicle in =
both=20
Vermont and Florida. The Florida quote was almost double the VT=20
quote.</STRONG></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>In a message dated 8/24/2015 5:26:41 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,=20
tigers@autox.team.net writes:</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: blue 2px =
solid"><FONT=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" color=3D#000000 size=3D2 =
face=3DArial>
<DIV dir=3Dltr>
<DIV>I had to get an appraiser's stated value in writing that cost me =
$275,=20
that valued the car at 52.5, the writer for Commerce said they would =
only=20
insure the car for 48 with a 500 deductible. If you want the freedom =
to use=20
the car it's gonna cost ya.</DIV>
<DIV> Jeff</DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=3Dgmail_extra>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV class=3Dgmail_quote>On Sun, Aug 23, 2015 at 6:50 PM, Stu via =
Tigers <SPAN=20
dir=3Dltr><<A title=3Dmailto:tigers@autox.team.net=20
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"=20
target=3D_blank>tigers@autox.team.net</A>></SPAN> wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=3Dgmail_quote=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: =
#ccc 1px solid">
<DIV dir=3Dltr>
<DIV class=3Dgmail_default style=3D"FONT-SIZE: small">I just went =
through this,=20
and Hagerty seemed a little more liberal than Grundy. Their =
use=20
restrictions mostly fit my use model. Occasional pleasure =
drives, car=20
shows, cruise nights, maybe to a family party to show off, rarely to =
work=20
(once in the last year and a half), all the family at home have =
their own=20
cars, no family under 25 who know how to drive a stick, evening or =
weekend=20
drives to try to track down that pesky problem, and so on. =
>From what=20
their stuff says, these would be mostly OK.</DIV>
<DIV class=3Dgmail_default style=3D"FONT-SIZE: small"> </DIV>
<DIV class=3Dgmail_default style=3D"FONT-SIZE: =
small">Stu</DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=3Dgmail_extra>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV class=3Dgmail_quote>
<DIV>
<DIV class=3Dh5>On Sun, Aug 23, 2015 at 6:22 PM, Jay Laifman via =
Tigers <SPAN=20
dir=3Dltr><<A title=3Dmailto:tigers@autox.team.net=20
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"=20
target=3D_blank>tigers@autox.team.net</A>></SPAN> =
wrote:<BR></DIV></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=3Dgmail_quote=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: =
rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid">
<DIV>
<DIV class=3Dh5>
<DIV dir=3Dltr>I have had the same issue - this is also for my =
early 911 and=20
912. There are a number of issues with all the classic car=20
policies. As you've noted, it can't be your daily =
driver. Not=20
only that, you have to have a car that is at least 15 years old =
for all=20
drivers in the house. My 2000 Boxster, which is still like =
new isn't=20
good enough. One company said I might be able to get a waiver of =
this=20
one. Some said there is no waiver. =20
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Another issue is that no one under 25 can drive the =
car. =20
So if my son and I drive to a car show, he can't drive at =
all. I=20
kind of get it. But, life's too short not to enjoy these =
cars with=20
my kids here and now.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Another issue is that you can use it to go to work once and a =
while. But that is on a rare occasion when you are doing =
something=20
else. So if you want to drive it every Friday or a week here =
and=20
there, you won't be covered. That means NO coverage. =
Some of=20
them were really strict on this - like if you get in an accident =
on a=20
Wednesday morning at 7:00 am on your route to work, don't expect =
getting=20
coverage for the accident without a huge fight.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>One of the places, and I think it was Grundy's, I asked if I =
could=20
stop at a hardware store on the weekends. She gasped and =
recounted=20
how she saw a Ferrari parked at the far end of a Home Depot over =
the=20
weekend and thought to herself that she sure hopes she doesn't =
insure that=20
car! Geeze, really? Us car guys can't stop at a =
hardware store=20
and park at the far end? That's a show stopper for me. Note =
some=20
others said it was ok if it was part of a joy ride and not a =
weekend=20
errand drive.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Believe me, I called EVERY ONE of the companies and asked =
them all=20
the same questions. They all basically gave the same =
answers. =20
Yes, you can get their insurance and figure they will never =
know. =20
And they may give half answers about how they cover various =
things. =20
But, if you really put them to specific questions, they don't give =
good=20
answers. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I get it. They have to evaluate their risk and what =
they want=20
to insure. They want to insure parade cars and joy ride =
cars, and=20
will take the risk for a restaurant with your wife here and =
there. =20
That's not me, and never will be. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>I guess you can look at it another way too. I have not =
paid=20
more than $10k for any of my cars. So in one way, if =
something bad=20
happened, I would be out only $10k plus the expenses over the =
years. =20
I know, two of these cars are probably (definitely?) worth over =
$100k in=20
investment terms. So I could lose much more in paper. =
I don't=20
like looking at it this way, but it is a way to rationalize =
it.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Right now, I do a lot of self insurance by being especially =
careful=20
where I park the cars, how long I am away from them, how well they =
are=20
locked up, etc. It's not perfect. But, I'd rather be=20
underinsured than have NO insurance because I have a classic =
policy and=20
I'm using it to actually drive.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Jay</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=3Dgmail_extra>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV class=3Dgmail_quote>On Sun, Aug 23, 2015 at 2:59 PM, =
genepadgett--- via=20
Tigers <SPAN dir=3Dltr><<A title=3Dmailto:tigers@autox.team.net =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"=20
target=3D_blank>tigers@autox.team.net</A>></SPAN> wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=3Dgmail_quote=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; =
BORDER-LEFT: rgb(204,204,204) 1px solid">
<DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman; COLOR: =
rgb(0,0,0)">
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: =
helvetica,arial,sans-serif; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); =
FONT-STYLE: normal">
<DIV=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman; COLOR: =
rgb(0,0,0)">
<DIV>I did not see this post to my own e-mail and am thinking =
that=20
somehow it did not go through. I am re-sending it in hopes =
that it=20
will go through this time. Confirmation of receipt =
from=20
anyone on the List would be appreciated.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>TIA, Gene</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<HR>
<DIV=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: =
helvetica,arial,sans-serif; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); =
FONT-STYLE: normal"><B>From:=20
</B><A title=3Dmailto:genepadgett@comcast.net=20
href=3D"mailto:genepadgett@comcast.net"=20
target=3D_blank>genepadgett@comcast.net</A><BR><B>To: =
</B>"tigers" <<A=20
title=3Dmailto:tigers@autox.team.net =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"=20
target=3D_blank>tigers@autox.team.net</A>><BR><B>Sent: =
</B>Friday,=20
August 21, 2015 12:28:53 PM<BR><B>Subject: </B>Driven Tger =
nsurance<BR>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: times new roman; COLOR: =
rgb(0,0,0)">
<DIV>Hi All,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>With the recent jump in auction prices for our cars, I am =
wondering=20
what people like me who just enjoy driving their cars are doing =
for=20
insurance. I just got turned down by Grundy because =
the=20
"vehicle cannot be used as backup, primary or secondary=20
transportation". This dispite the fact both my wife =
and I=20
have other cars which serve as our regular daily driver =
vehicles.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>To me, being able to take the Tiger out when and where I =
want to go=20
is the essence of having and enjoying the car in the first=20
place. It is the journey not the destination that =
matters to=20
me. I bought the car new in 1967 and have =
never=20
thought of it as a collectible or investment. Still =
with the=20
recent escalation in apparent values, I do not want to be stupid =
about=20
insurance.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Anyone else on the List that might be of a similar mind as =
me and=20
own their Tiger for the enjoyment of driving it can =
bring? =20
If so what do you do for insurance?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>TIA,</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Gene</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV></DIV>
=
<DIV> </DIV></DIV></DIV><BR>________________________________________=
_______<BR><BR><A=20
title=3Dmailto:tigers@autox.team.net =
href=3D"mailto:tigers@autox.team.net"=20
target=3D_blank>tigers@autox.team.net</A><BR><BR>Donate: <A=20
title=3Dhttp://www.team.net/donate.html=20
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target=3D_blank>http://www.team.net/donate.html</A><BR>Archive: =
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target=3D_blank>http://www.team.net/archive</A><BR>Forums:=20
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