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Re: A crusty marine engineers armchair solution to U20 timeing

To: Datsun Roadsters <datsun-roadsters@autox.team.net>
Subject: Re: A crusty marine engineers armchair solution to U20 timeing
From: Thomas - Sweden <csp311@telia.com>
Date: Thu, 09 May 2002 15:28:18 +0200
Timing belts dont like oil so either a duplex cam chain
inside or a timing belt outside the engine. The problem
with the U20 head is the limited space for any larger
diameter timing gear on the camshaft.

Thomas

Jim Cawrse wrote:

> For all:This dosnt concern me (pushrod 2L guy), but from anarmchair
> engineering standpoint a toothed gear, belt, andspring loaded
> tensioner might be the way to go. Its a basic engineering fact that
> the speed relationship betweenthe crank and the cam (and the funky
> jackshaft on U20s) isthe same on any 4 stroke engine. Therefore, all
> someone has to do is find the right toothed pullysfrom the right donor
> car that will fit  inside the U20 front coverand then arrange a spring
> loaded tensioner mounted to maintaintension on the back (smooth) side
> of the toothed belt. Issues with bore diameters of the pulleys could
> be fixed cheaplyby a machine shop boreing out or sleeveing the
> pulleys, in factthey could make up a bunch of them, all at a price
> far, far,less than re-creating the whole original system. If done
> properly, this would allow for a much quieter engine, andwould perhaps
> allow greater peak RPM. All you U20 guys need is a dedicated junkyard
> smart handson engineering type guy to get this thing rolling, he
> couldactually make a fair piece of money from it if he did it right,at
> the same time doing the U20 guys a big service. Just my two cents here
> at 0647 before even one cup of coffee....Best Regards,JimChesapeake
> Virginia67 pushrod 2L/5spd72 510 wagon
>
>      ----- Original Message -----
>      From: datsunmike
>      Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2002 6:27 AM
>      To: Thomas - Sweden; datsun-roadsters@autox.team.net
>      Subject: Re: U20 timing stuff
>       Or an engine swap.
>
>      Mike
>
>      ----- Original Message -----
>      From: "Thomas - Sweden" <csp311@telia.com>
>      To: <datsun-roadsters@autox.team.net>
>      Sent: Thursday, May 09, 2002 4:48 AM
>      Subject: Re: U20 timing stuff
>
>
>      > Nissan will trash all the tools and molds because they
>      > want you to buy a new Altima and not drive around
>      > in an old Datsun. ;-)
>      >
>      > There are most likely sources in Japan for new old parts
>      > but unless you have the right contacts it's a closed world
>
>      > for the rest of us.
>      >
>      > In the end you will be making this investment choise,
>      > a new cam chain set or a secondhand Ferrari.
>      >
>      > Thomas
>      >
>      > Andrew Murphy wrote:
>      >
>      > > I seem to remember a vendor telling me that Nissan would
>      not do this
>      because
>      > > they originally outsourced the manufacture of the timing
>      components and
>      will
>      > > honor the contracts even after the demise of the company
>      or products.
>      > >
>      > > So unless you can contact the outsource company and
>      convince them to
>      fork
>      > > them over (not gonna happen) you are out of luck.
>      > >
>      > > Andrew Murphy
>      > > SoCalROC
>      > >
>      > > From: Mitch Planck <mitch.planck@mail.ias.net>
>      > > To: 'Andrew Murphy' <solex67@hotmail.com>,
>      "'orangedawg@hotmail.com'"
>      > > <orangedawg@hotmail.com>,
>      "'datsun-roadsters@autox.team.net'"
>      > > <datsun-roadsters@autox.team.net>
>      > > Subject: RE: U20 timing stuff
>      > > Date: Wed, 8 May 2002 16:47:15 -0400
>      > >
>      > > In reading this email, I had the idea about this that
>      has a small chance
>      of
>      > > solving this. Basically the problem is getting the molds
>      and machining
>      to
>      > > produce the timing components. Has anyone ever tried
>      contacting the
>      > > manufacturing plant where these cars were made in Japan
>      to see if the
>      master
>      > > molds are avaliable? I don't know if auto companies hold
>      onto stuff like
>      > > this or just trash it after awhile, but it would be
>      worth a shot.
>      > > http://www.nissan-global.com is the company website and
>      indicates that
>      the
>      > > plant in Oppama was built in 1920 or so and seems to be
>      the oldest
>      plant. If
>      > > someone on the list with some Japanese speaking skills
>      called them up
>      (Tel:
>      > > 0468-67-5000) maybe we could find out... Unless someone
>      has further
>      > > knowledge on this, it's probably at least worth a shot.
>      > >
>      > > Mitch Planck
>      > > '69 1600
>      > > '70 1600, sans body
>      > > Chelsea, MI
>      > >
>      > > -----Original Message-----
>      > > From: owner-datsun-roadsters@autox.team.net
>      > > [mailto:owner-datsun-roadsters@autox.team.net]On Behalf
>      Of Andrew Murphy
>      > > Sent: Wednesday, May 08, 2002 3:44 PM
>      > > To: orangedawg@hotmail.com;
>      datsun-roadsters@autox.team.net
>      > > Subject: Re: U20 timing stuff
>      > >
>      > > Allen,
>      > >
>      > > It's virtually impossible to find individual U20 timing
>      components for
>      sale.
>      > >
>      > > Once in a great while you will see some timing stuff on
>      ebay but the
>      vendors
>      > >
>      > > generally don't sell the individual components any more
>      as they are so
>      rare.
>      > >
>      > > I recently forked over a sizeable chunk of money for a
>      complete set.
>      When I
>      > > rebuild my engine, I am keeping all of my timing stuff
>      for spares.
>      > >
>      > > As for finding gears and tensioners, well those are the
>      really hard to
>      find
>      > > items. The chains and guides are more available but it's
>      the tensioners
>      and
>      > > gears that are so rare and difficult to reproduce. I
>      have talked with
>      all
>      > > the vendors and they pretty much say the same thing-
>      "It's not going to
>      be
>      > > cost effective to build the reproduction timing
>      components because
>      someone
>      > > will need to foot the bill for the molds and machining.
>      As soon as that
>      is
>      > > done, it would be a simple matter to undercut the price
>      and steal the
>      > > business. Sad but true."
>      > >
>      > > My advice would be to look for a U20 engine that is
>      complete and for
>      sale.
>      > > Check the timing components and see if they are in
>      decent shape. It
>      would
>      > > also be good to have the rest of the U20 engine there
>      for spare parts. I
>      am
>      > > doing this with my U20 engine. Any part replaced will be
>      kept for
>      spares.
>      > >
>      > > FWIW
>      > >
>      > > Andrew Murphy
>      > > SoCalROC
>      > >
>      > > From: "Allen Blackmon" <orangedawg@hotmail.com>
>      > > Reply-To: "Allen Blackmon" <orangedawg@hotmail.com>
>      > > To: datsun-roadsters@autox.team.net
>      > > Subject: U20 timing stuff
>      > > Date: Wed, 08 May 2002 18:03:45 +0000
>      > >
>      > > To List,
>      > >
>      > > Horror upon horrors, but a very knowledgable lister took
>      a look at my
>      timing
>      > > gears and upper tensioner and announced that they need
>      to be replaced.
>      > > Curses!!  Anyone got any info for me?  Particularly
>      jackshaft and am
>      gears
>      > > as well as upper tensioner?  Perhaps a real good used
>      set.  I've found a
>      > > crank gear and I've got chains, just need the above.
>      Anyone switched
>      over
>      > > to toothed gears and belts?  Anyone interested in that?
>      > >
>      > > Allen
>      > > 1970 2000
>      > >
>      > >
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>
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