Reply to: RE>Lotus/Toyota Gearbox Swaps
Howdy Tim, Phillip, All.
Tim, yes I agree it is *entirely* likely, that Ken at Dave Bean is =
confusing the
various Toyota parts. The thing is, I was sorta hoping that Phillip =
would be
able to tell us specifically which tranny his is.... I would be =
speculating at this
point, if I tried to figure it out, based on the limited and conflicting =
info we
have to date!
> It "Couldn't" (figurative term - disbelief) be the Excel's Supra box. =
The
> Eclat's chassis (Lotus & Getrag 5-spd's fit) had to be revised/widened =
to
> accept the Toyota box in the Excel. I find it hard to believe it =
would
> slip into a tiny Elan.
Hmm... OK, based on your observations I agree, your conclusion is =
probably
correct.
> Erik, what was the current Supra of the period and what transmission =
did
> it use? That would be the Excel 5-spd.
Well... I am pretty certain that all of the various Supra 'boxes are =
members of
the Toyota W5X gearbox family. See the below chart.
W50 78-81 Celica
W55 82 Carina (3T-GTE), 86 Soarer/Supra (1G-GE), Crown (1G-E some,
1G-GE, 6M-GE some, 2L/2L-T some) 86 Cressida (1S, 21R some, 1G-E some,
1G-GE, 2L/2L-T some)
W57 83-86 Celica Supra (some), 86 Supra (1G-E), 86 Crown (6M-GE som=
e),
86 Cressida (1G-E some, 5M-GE)
W58 82-92 Supra (5M-GE, 7M-GE), 86 Supra/Soarer/Cressida (1G-GTE)
W59 ?
I suspect that the Excel 'box is either the W55, W57, or W58. Oddly =
enough,
the '82 context does not narrow the list of possible Excel 'boxes very =
much,
because several different W5X 'boxes were in production then... On the
other hand, I believe all these to be quite similar in dimensions; but to =
be
sure of this I would need to consult the Toyota gurus! (Phil Bradshaw, =
do
you know if the W5X 'boxes all used a similar configuration case?)
Most of these engine applications are either 6 cylinder or blown 4 =
cylinder,
so I think the W5X 'boxes are heavier than what you would really want, =
not
to mention too big, for many of our applications. Maybe about right for =
the
larger 900 series Lotus cars, tho.....
> Phillip, when I first talked to you, you gave me the impression your =
Elan's
> gearbox was a Toyota 5-spd from a 4-cyl. car...
Sure, that sounds plausible. But that is not sufficient information to =
identify
it. Based on that info alone, it could theoretically be either a W50, =
T50, or
possibly even a K50!
We really kinda need Phillip to tell us what Toyota model it came =
from...... or,
to put us in touch with the PO?
Erik
------------------------------
Date: 3/12/97 7:50 AM
To: Berg, Erik
From: Tim Engel
Chapman-era subscribers,
This thread started off-line with a message I sent to Phillip Babcock and
Erik Berg. Phillip has a Toyota 5-spd transmission installed in his =
Lotus
Elan and will hopefully be posting the details to the list. Phillip had
e-mailed me Feb 24th, and I was woefully delinquent in getting back to =
him.
For your reference the full first message is tacked onto the end of =
this
reply.
12 Mar 1997, Erik Berg <Erik.Berg@trw.com> wrote to Phillip Babcock:
> Do you know which Toyota 5 speed this is? T-50?
> W-50? W-57?
>
> Or alternatively, which year/model car did it come
> from? Ken at DBE said that he thought you used
> the same one as in the Excel, which is (I think?)
> the Supra 'box.
12 Mar 1997, Tim Engel wrote:
It "Couldn't" (figurative term - disbelief) be the Excel's Supra box. =
The
Eclat's chassis (Lotus & Getrag 5-spd's fit) had to be revised/widened to
accept the Toyota box in the Excel. I find it hard to believe it would
slip into a tiny Elan.
The Supra has evolved through the years. Excel production started in
October 1982. Erik, what was the current Supra of the period and what
transmission did it use? That would be the Excel 5-spd. Phillip, what
Toyota 5-spd is in your Elan?
I think Ken at Dave Bean is confusing/mixing Toyota parts. I have had a
similar conversation with Ken and came away with the sense that he was
confusing the "EXCEL" Supra 5-spd with "ALL" Supra 5-spds like it was =
just
one entity. Erik, is that the case?
Also, in that conversation with Ken, I was specifically inquiring about
the EXCEL's Supra 5-spd as a possible alternative for my Eclat. He =
didn't
know for sure, but referred me to Phillip as someone who had swapped THE
Toyota box into an Elan. His wording was such that it sounded like he =
was
referring to the Supra box as used in the Excel. However, Phillip, =
when
I first talk to you, you gave me the impression your Elan's gearbox was =
a
Toyota 5-spd from a 4-cyl. car... not the Supra 5-spd.
Anyway.... I think there are two conversations getting mixed here and =
now
would be the time to separate them. Once that's done, we can pursue =
them
both as valid but separate subjects.
1) A Toyota 5-spd swap appropriate for an Elan. Phillip, which =
Toyota
5-spd is it and how about publishing the details to the chapman-era list. =
I understand you didn't perform the swap, but any details you have would =
be
appreciated.
2) The Toyota Supra/Excel 5-spd as an alternative for the Eclat... my
original quest. I'm beginning to think this is a less practical
alternative than the Eclat 2.2's Getrag 5-spd. The Yoda box is less
expensive initially and would have better ratios; but would require much
more fabrication work and chassis modification to make it fit. By the
time it's in the car, the Yoda swap would probably be more expensive. =
(??)
> By the way, Tim.... (you're in the Bay area, right?)
> TRW S&EG in Los Angeles is doing big time hiring
> right now, if you're interested.....
Nope, Minneapolis. However, every winter I tell myself it's time to =
move
to a warmer climate... one where I can drive the fun cars all year. Is
TRW S&EG (what's S&EG) looking for engineering management types?
Tim Engel
tengel@isd.net
**********************************************
REPEAT ORIGINAL MESSAGE
> 24 Feb 1997, Phillip Babcock wrote:
> I have some not all the info on my Toyota/Lotus
> gearbox. This is my first out-going mail so let me
> know if you get this. Shop address is:
DYNOPHILLIPBABCOCK@worldnet.att.net
> Home address is:
PHILLIPBABCOCK@worldnet.att.net
> I have a dyno shop with a Dynojet chassis dyno. so I
> am doing a lot of development work on my Elan. Let
> me know where the other Lotus people hang out.
Phillip, cc: Erik
Been feeling ignored? I've been distracted. I was laid off from work
awhile ago and my priorities have shifted a little as a result.
I'm still interested in the Toyota / Lotus gearbox swap as are the other
people on the chapman-era mailing list. That list is just starting up =
and
hasn't been very active. I guess that's one of the reasons I've not
followed up with you... the general level of discussion has been kinda =
slow
Erik Berg is the person that started the chapman-era list and he is very
interested in your swap. I suggest you join the list AND make specific
contact with Erik. Keep me in the loop please but I may not be very
active for awhile.
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