Craig,
We voted to run only STR as out Street Touring class last year.
The logic was that STS cars could run completely according to
national rules inside our Street Tire class. So we don't dump them
together, they are actually run in separate run groups.
No problem for competitors in ST- ST -- as you suggest, we use the
STR PAX for comparison with other Street Tire cars. Within the set
of ST-ST cars -- actually STS, exactly -- the PAX they are assigned
makes no difference. They all have the same index.
If a Street Touring car wants to run PAX class, they need R tires to be
competitive. Not required of course, but good for one's times.
So I don't get "honoring" the STS PAX. What having a specific STS index
would do is allow STS drivers to calculate an indexed time that moved
them up in the overall indexed order of finish. But, this is just a fun
listing
anyway -- there's no sanctioned competition there. It's a mind game. And
in the game people can adjust their times any way the want in the privacy of
their
own home -- including calculating their indexed time using the STS index.
What is missing is the STS trophies. You have to WIN Street Tire to
get a trophy, instead of just winning in the smaller STS group. The rules
are pretty weird with respect to Street Touring/Street Modified. They are
defined ONLY in an appendix, unlike the other categories. In 1999 the
rules made it clear that it was a template for Regional classes. The
wording
in 2000 is different, and these are Nationally run classes now. Perhaps
we should review it in the Steering Committee.
I would be happy to calculate ST Street Tire entrants on the overall lists
using the STS index, if there are any competitors who will use it. Just
have
them come to the Steering Committee and we can work out the details.
We had no ST Street Tire entrants in Round 1. We had one I saw yesterday,
and he was a first-timer, I think. Who would really be affected by this
issue?
Are you planning to run ST- Street Tire? I guess it sort of bugs me to
have
people make us do work on strictly theoretical grounds. I would want to see
a
group of interested competitors before I voted for any change. That's how
Street Touring got started in SFR, that's how Karts got started here.
The move to STR instead of STS was at the request of Street Touring
entrants.
What's your interest, Craig?
Jerry
Jerry Mouton mailto:jerry@moutons.org Laissez les bons temps
rouler!
----- Original Message -----
From: Craig Boyle <craig_boyle@yahoo.com>
To: <ba-autox@autox.team.net>
Cc: <lollipop@ricochet.net>; <jerry@moutons.org>
Sent: Sunday, March 12, 2000 8:50 PM
Subject: Re: FW: 2000 PAX Street Touring Index
>
> Aren't STS and STR separate national classes?,
> therefore shouldn't we honor both of them individually
> rather than collectively? I noticed that the round 1
> results dumped both classes together and with the same
> (STR) pax.
>
> It *would* be unfair if someone were to enter an STS
> car in the catch-all street tire pax class. All we
> have to do is prohibit this or use the STR pax for
> this case.
>
> However as long as an STS car only enters STS or the
> general PAX class, what's the problem honoring the STS
> pax?
>
> The merge of STS/STR "screws" anyone running an STS
> car. And since STS is a national class, rather than a
> local class like street tire, STS should come first.
>
>
>
> ...>
> > I don't think CSCC is right. The STS index can't be
> > used to handicap
> > Street Touring cars.
> >
> > Remember that the Street Tire PAX for other classes,
> > like CSP, are
> > compiled using R Tire competition. If you use the
> > STS PAX, you
> > are comparing apples to oranges, and giving Street
> > Touring a 2 second
> > per minute advantage in Street Tire class. I think
> > that's what Barry was
> > referring to.
> >
> > Running a BS car against a Street Touring car in
> > Street Tire, you will have
> > just about the same index. That's not too far off.
> >
> > If you use the STS index for Street Touring Street
> > Tire, you will be indexed
> > just
> > about the same as an HS car running against you.
> > Not fair.
> >
> > We need to use the STR index for Street Touring.
> >
> > Jerry
> >
> >
> > Jerry Mouton mailto:jerry@moutons.org
> > Laissez les bons temps
> > rouler!
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Pat Kelly <lollipop@ricochet.net>
> > To: <bchafin@attglobal.net>
> > Cc: Jerry Mouton <jerry@moutons.org>; Jesus
> > Villarreal <jesvilla@gte.net>
> > Sent: Friday, March 03, 2000 8:37 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Fwd: [Fwd: Fwd: 1999 PAX Street
> > Touring Index]]
> >
> >
> > > CSCC is correct. .783 for STS. STR is .810; and SM
> > is .846. AAS needs to
> > > update. It's all on the lower left hand corner of
> > page 2 of the Feb. issue
> > of
> > > Pylon.
> > > --Pat K
> > >
> > > bchafin@attglobal.net wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hey Pat,
> > > >
> > > > Any progress on the official PAX?
> > > >
> > > > CSCC scored Street Touring @ .783 PAX on 2/13/00
> > and I noticed the AAS
> > > > web site is using .829
> > (http://www.americanauto-x.com/class/pax.asp).
> > > > At .783 I might just want to sell the Kumhos and
> > run ST-ST :^).
> > > >
> > > > Thanks,
> > > >
> > > > Barry
> > > >
> > > >
> >
> http://streettouring.homepage.com/st_drivers/b_chaffin/barry_1.jpg
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > Subject: [Fwd: Fwd: 1999 PAX Street Touring
> > Index]
> > > > Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 09:09:47 -0800
> > > > From: bchafin@attglobal.net
> > > > To: Pat Kelly <lollipop@ricochet.net>,
> > > > Jerry Mouton <jerry@moutons.org>
> > > > CC: Andy McKee <andrewmckee@yahoo.com>,
> > > > Charlie Davis <Smokerbros@aol.com>, Chris
> > Kannan <CKannan@aol.com>,
> > > > "Esra, Phil" <PEsra@air.org>, Gary McDaniel
> > <garymac@usa.net>,
> > > > Phil Esra <pesra@yahoo.com>, "Watson, Mark"
> > <Mark.Watson@Schwab.COM>
> > > >
> > > > Pat/Jerry,
> > > >
> > > > I had a chance to run Street Touring - Street
> > Tire with the Competition
> > > > Sports Car Club on Sunday, thanks Chris.
> > > >
> > > > Finishing with a run of 100.219 I went to look
> > at the index and see that
> > > > the web information is ST = .829
> > (http://www.sfrscca.org/solo2/PAX.html)
> > > > and as of last event of '99 (Slush Round 5) we
> > were using ST = Index:
> > > > 0.812
> > > >
> >
> (http://www.sfrscca.org/solo2/Results/1999/Slush/round5.html#sto).
> > > >
> > > > If I read the note below (Lloyd Loring July 9,
> > 1999) correctly, Street
> > > > Touring as implemented in SFR last year ('99
> > National recommendations ST
> > > > = Street Touring on street tires) we could of
> > indexed at .789 vs. .829
> > > > where we began '99 or .812 ('99 STR -Street
> > Touring on DOT-Rs), the
> > > > index we finished the year with.
> > > >
> > > > If we're using Lloyd's '99 index to begin the
> > season looks like I'd use
> > > > the .812 index to figure out my Street Tire
> > "class time".
> > > >
> > > > Does that make sense?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks,
> > > >
> > > > Barry - # 40 SFR SCCA Solo2 Street Touring
> > Nissan Maxima
> > > >
> >
> http://streettouring.homepage.com/st_drivers/b_chaffin/barry_1.jpg
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > > Subject: Fwd: 1999 PAX Street Touring Index
> > > > Date: Thu, 15 Jul 1999 19:10:31 +0000 (GMT)
> > > > From: Phil Esra <pesra@yahoo.com>
> > > > To: ba-autox@autox.team.net,
> > mark.watson@schwab.com
> > > >
> > > > I Don't think this info made it to the bay area
> > list...
> > > >
> > > > phil
> > > >
> > > > --- Lloyd Loring <lloydl@skyenet.net> wrote:
> > > > > Date: Fri, 9 Jul 1999 09:25:47 -0500
> > > > > To: autox@autox.team.net
> > > > > From: Lloyd Loring <lloydl@skyenet.net>
> > > > > Subject: 1999 PAX Street Touring Index
> > > > > Reply-to: Lloyd Loring <lloydl@skyenet.net>
> > > > >
> > > > > Dave Beck has asked me to post these indexes
> > to team.net.
> > > > >
> > > > > 1999 PAX Street Touring Index
> > > > > ST .789
> > > > > STR .812
> > > > > STU .825
> > > > >
> > > > > Here's the complete set of PAX Indexes:
> > > > >
> > > > > 1999 PAX INDEX
> > > > >
> > > > > SS .830
> > > > > AS .815 ASP .852 AP .871 AM 1.000
> > > > > BS .811 BSP .846 BP .874 BM .955
> > > > > CS .802 CSP .844 CP .857 CM .925
> > > > > DS .800 DSP .820 DP .853 DM .900
> > > > > ES .786 ESP .822 EP .872 EM .909
> > > > > FS .807 ST .789 FM .904
> > > > > GS .788 STR .812 F125 .950
> > > > > HS .785 STU .825
> > > > >
> > > > > Lloyd Loring <lloydl@skyenet.net>
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> >
> _________________________________________________________
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