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    <p>Thanks everyone,<br>
    </p>
    <p>I will do some more investigating.  I should mention that the
      lights just kind of flicker so it is not real obvious.<br>
    </p>
    <p>Thanks again,<br>
      Roger <br>
    </p>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 11/13/2019 9:20 AM, David
      Friedlander wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAJ1eQwgMm+SH1DH6mjmK-k7YFsc3SX1fCgNuR+Ntsg30OicWaA@mail.gmail.com">
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        <div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans
          ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000099">Doesn't Moss sell
          tail light bulb holders with grounding tabs?</div>
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          ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000099"><br>
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        <div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans
          ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000099"><a
            href="https://mossmotors.com/bulb-holder-turn-reverse"
            moz-do-not-send="true">https://mossmotors.com/bulb-holder-turn-reverse</a> </div>
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          ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000099"><br>
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        <div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:comic sans
          ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000099">Dave <br>
        </div>
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          ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000099"><br>
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          ms,sans-serif;font-size:large;color:#000099">
          <div><img src="cid:part2.64AE6CBB.1B0FE895@rmi.net"
              alt="image.png" class="" width="481" height="231"><br>
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      <br>
      <div class="gmail_quote">
        <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Wed, Nov 13, 2019 at 12:15
          AM Brian Kemp <<a href="mailto:bk13@earthlink.net"
            moz-do-not-send="true">bk13@earthlink.net</a>> wrote:<br>
        </div>
        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px
          0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
          <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"> I seem to remember once upon a time,
            somebody made a light socket with a ground wire or a ground
            tab.  I looked a few months ago for my GT6, but couldn't
            find it at the usual vendors.  I imagine you could add a
            ground wire, but some of my sockets are pretty bad, so I was
            looking for new ones that already had the wire.<br>
            <br>
            On my TR6, I did have a socket that didn't conduct well to
            ground.  The problem was the connection between the metal
            base and the metal fingers.  I just hit the area with a wire
            brush in the Dremel then soldered the two bits together and
            it fixed that problem.<br>
            <br>
            Brian<br>
            <br>
            <div>On 11/12/2019 2:38 PM, Roger Elliott wrote:<br>
            </div>
            <blockquote type="cite">
              <p>I decided to give up on the issue.  <br>
              </p>
              <p>There did not seem to be much of a voltage drop across
                the battery - about .05 volts as near as I could make
                out.  It's possible that either the meter or myself were
                not quick enough to read accurately.<br>
              </p>
              <p>As far as I could tell there is not a ground terminal
                on the sockets.  There was about .009 volts between the
                lamp housing and the battery.  I did run additional
                wires from the lamp housing to a ground (to the tank
                mounting bolts).<br>
              </p>
              <p>The brake/tail lights still varied with the turn
                signals, in opposition, got brighter when the turn
                signals were off.<br>
              </p>
              <p>Tested the lights with regular brake lights instead of
                LEDs. I noticed the brake/tail lights still varied with
                the turn signals.  This is when I decided to give up and
                just live with it.<br>
              </p>
              <p>Oh, the third brake light that I have wired in - power
                from the brake lights and grounded to the body flash
                when ever the brake lights and turn signals are on (like
                the brake/tail lights in opposition.<br>
                <br>
              </p>
              <p>Thanks for your help.<br>
                Roger<br>
              </p>
              <div>On 11/3/2019 4:37 PM, Randall wrote:<br>
              </div>
              <blockquote type="cite">
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal">Yes, that’s the idea.  You want
                    all the lights on (including turn signals) during
                    this test.</p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal">What you’re looking at is how
                    much voltage drop there is through the ground path.</p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal">-- Randall</p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                  <div
style="border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-top:1pt
                    solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
                    <p class="MsoNormal" style="border:none;padding:0in"><b>From:
                      </b><a href="mailto:elliottr@rmi.net"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">Roger
                        Elliott</a><br>
                      <b>Sent: </b>Sunday, November 3, 2019 1:26 PM<br>
                      <b>To: </b><a
                        href="mailto:triumphs@autox.team.net"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">triumphs@autox.team.net</a><br>
                      <b>Subject: </b>Re: [TR] TR250 LED tail light
                      problem</p>
                  </div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                  <p><span style="font-size:10pt">HI Randall,</span></p>
                  <p><span style="font-size:10pt">Thanks for the
                      information and the tests.</span></p>
                  <p><span style="font-size:10pt">I just want to check
                      something on the tests since my electrical trouble
                      shooting ability is very limited.</span></p>
                  <p><span style="font-size:10pt">This section is also
                      done with the lights on, right?:  </span></p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal">To check for grounding issues, I
                    suggest running a wire to the negative battery
                    terminal or negative starter cable, so you can
                    connect the ground lead of your DMM to that.  Then
                    you can probe at the rear lights, to see how well
                    they are actually grounded.  0.2 volt is probably
                    acceptable, anything more than that represents a
                    problem that could be fixed.</p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"> <br>
                    Thanks,<br>
                    Roger</p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">On 11/2/19 4:07 PM, Randall
                      wrote:</p>
                  </div>
                  <blockquote style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
                    <p class="MsoNormal">There may not be a good
                      solution, Roger.  The incandescent turn signals
                      draw a fair amount of current, which is likely
                      more than the stock alternator can deliver (along
                      with tail lights and so on) at idle.  So it may be
                      that the battery voltage is dropping from 13+
                      volts (alternator supplying all power to car) to 
                      12.6 volts (battery supplying some of the power)
                      and the LEDs you’re using are sensitive enough to
                      show the difference in voltage.</p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">To check, connect a good
                      voltmeter or DMM to the battery, then watch what
                      it does when the tail lights and flashers are both
                      on.  If I’m right, you’ll see the battery voltage
                      sag in time with the turn signals.  The only fix
                      would be to convert to a more modern alternator,
                      that can keep up with the lights at idle.  (I’m
                      not certain, but I think there is a Lester unit
                      that would look and fit the same as the stock
                      Lucas but give more current across the board. 
                      Check with the Jaguar folks.)</p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">Another fix might be LEDs that
                      use an active current source (so are much less
                      sensitive to supply voltage), but I have no idea
                      where to buy such things.  I made my own using a
                      simple 2-transistor active current limiter.</p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">To check for grounding issues,
                      I suggest running a wire to the negative battery
                      terminal or negative starter cable, so you can
                      connect the ground lead of your DMM to that.  Then
                      you can probe at the rear lights, to see how well
                      they are actually grounded.  0.2 volt is probably
                      acceptable, anything more than that represents a
                      problem that could be fixed.</p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">I’m not sure how the TR250 tail
                      lights are wired.  On my TR3, all the rear lamps
                      ground only through their mounting screws, which
                      go into clip nuts fastened to the sheet metal. 
                      Very insecure, especially if the sheet metal has a
                      fresh coat of paint.  </p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">However, each lamp has a
                      terminal inside the housing for a ground wire. 
                      So, I made up a ground wire that daisy-chains
                      across all the rear lamp holders, then leads
                      around the trunk to one of the fuel tank mounting
                      bolts.</p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">-- Randall</p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                    <div
style="border-right:none;border-bottom:none;border-left:none;border-top:1pt
                      solid rgb(225,225,225);padding:3pt 0in 0in">
                      <p class="MsoNormal"><b>From: </b><a
                          href="mailto:elliottr@rmi.net" target="_blank"
                          moz-do-not-send="true">Roger Elliott</a><br>
                        <b>Sent: </b>Friday, November 1, 2019 12:50 PM<br>
                        <b>To: </b><a
                          href="mailto:triumphs@autox.team.net"
                          target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">triumphs@autox.team.net</a><br>
                        <b>Subject: </b>[TR] TR250 LED tail light
                        problem</p>
                    </div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">Here's the problem.  When the
                      tail lights are on and I use the flasher, </p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">the tail/brake lights flicker
                      with the flasher.  They don't go on and </p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">off but the get brighter and
                      dimmer.  When the third brake light is </p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">hooked up it does the same
                      thing.</p>
                    <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                  </blockquote>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"
                    style="margin-right:0.5in;margin-bottom:5pt;margin-left:0.5in"> </p>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                </div>
              </blockquote>
              <br>
              <fieldset></fieldset>
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