From jniolon at att.net Thu Jul 1 20:56:24 2021 From: jniolon at att.net (john niolon) Date: Thu, 1 Jul 2021 21:56:24 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] weight capacity of aluminum channel References: <1UZ2jB6kD5.2FWo8X8OZYN.ref@johns-desktop> Message-ID: <1UZ2jB6kD5.2FWo8X8OZYN@johns-desktop> I'm thinking about using aluminum channel for a set of ramps for my car hauler. I have some 'available' that is 10" wide with .50 web thickness and almost 3" flange... about 15# per ft. ramps will be 7-8' long ?.. and will go from ground to 17" high trailer deck... truck weight is 5300 +/- ? with front end weighting 3840. I can't find a table telling me weight capacity of channel with the load traveling up the wide web... like this any ideas on capacity ?? thanks john -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: OEClassicImg87ABA31D.png Type: image/x-png Size: 28318 bytes Desc: not available URL: From dhlocker at comcast.net Fri Jul 2 04:16:19 2021 From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker) Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2021 06:16:19 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] weight capacity of aluminum channel In-Reply-To: <1UZ2jB6kD5.2FWo8X8OZYN@johns-desktop> References: <1UZ2jB6kD5.2FWo8X8OZYN.ref@johns-desktop> <1UZ2jB6kD5.2FWo8X8OZYN@johns-desktop> Message-ID: BIG NOTE: please check my calculations and assumptions; I haven't actually done any of this for nearly 40 years. TLDR: They might not work. The significant supporting bits are the two flanges (3in x 0.5in); the plate across the top adds very little strength. All calculations below in pounds and inches. The maximum stress on the webs (if the weight is perfectly divided between them; more on that later) will be (equation 1-1 in reference 1) with the weight at the center of the ramp. Fb (bending stress in the flange of the channel) must be less than the yield stress of the channel material. Fb = M*c/I [Ref 2] M for each web: PL/8 = P*120in/8 = P*15in [P is point load, lb] [email] c for each web: 1.5in [Ref 4] I for each web: (b*(h^3))/12 = ((0.5in)*(3in)^3)/12 = 1.125in^4 Fb = (P*15in*1.5in)/1.125in^4 = P*20 lb/in^2 For the given situation, p=3840lb, so Fb (max) is 3840*20 = 76800lb/in^2 distributed between the two channels, each with two flanges. Since Fb must be less than the material yield stress, 10000 psi for some kind of structural Al, but not high-strength material [Ref 3], this doesn't look very good. Each flange would be loaded to about 19200lb/in^2 if all loads were perfectly distributed. (Note that high-strength Al (e.g. 6061) can have a yield stress of 45000lb/in^2 so looks much more likely to succeed, but I don't know how much I'd trust that.) My biggest concerns would be the division of stresses between flanges (if one channel tilts a little or is not sitting perfectly flat on the trailer or ground, stress sharing will be uneven and one flange make take all stress) and the potential for flange instability (see notes in 1.3.1.5 in Ref 1.) This may not be a problem because the flanges are not particularly deep, but I watched a boat hung from I-beams drop when a structural I-beam twisted slightly from imperfect loading and the entire structure quickly twisted into a totally unsupportive mess. References: 1 Beam stress/strain: 2 Beam force/reaction: 3 Material properties: 4 Area moments: ATB, Donald. -- *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue () no proprietary attachments; no html mail /\ On 2021-07-01 10:56 p.m., john niolon wrote: > I'm thinking about using aluminum channel for a set of ramps for my car > hauler.? I have some 'available' that is? 10" wide with .50 web > thickness and almost 3" flange... about 15# per ft. > ? > ramps will be 7-8' long ?..? and will go from ground to 17" high trailer > deck...? truck weight is 5300 +/- ? with front end weighting 3840.?? I > can't find a table telling me weight capacity of > channel with the load traveling up the wide web...?? like this?? any > ideas on capacity ?? > ? > Image87ABA31D > ? > thanks > john > ? > ? > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dhlocker at comcast.net > From dhlocker at comcast.net Fri Jul 2 04:29:07 2021 From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker) Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2021 06:29:07 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] weight capacity of aluminum channel In-Reply-To: References: <1UZ2jB6kD5.2FWo8X8OZYN.ref@johns-desktop> <1UZ2jB6kD5.2FWo8X8OZYN@johns-desktop> Message-ID: <881859ea-f471-0c1a-c52f-02d94118e4cb@comcast.net> First oops - I used 10ft length, not 8ft. At 8ft, the numbers look better by about 20% Donald. -- *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue () no proprietary attachments; no html mail /\ On 2021-07-02 6:16 a.m., Donald H Locker wrote: > BIG NOTE: please check my calculations and assumptions; I haven't > actually done any of this for nearly 40 years. > > TLDR: They might not work. > > The significant supporting bits are the two flanges (3in x 0.5in); the > plate across the top adds very little strength. > > All calculations below in pounds and inches. > > The maximum stress on the webs (if the weight is perfectly divided > between them; more on that later) will be (equation 1-1 in reference 1) > with the weight at the center of the ramp. Fb (bending stress in the > flange of the channel) must be less than the yield stress of the channel > material. > > Fb = M*c/I > > [Ref 2] M for each web: PL/8 = P*120in/8 = P*15in [P is point load, lb] > [email] c for each web: 1.5in > [Ref 4] I for each web: (b*(h^3))/12 = ((0.5in)*(3in)^3)/12 = 1.125in^4 > > Fb = (P*15in*1.5in)/1.125in^4 = P*20 lb/in^2 > > For the given situation, p=3840lb, so Fb (max) is 3840*20 = 76800lb/in^2 > distributed between the two channels, each with two flanges. Since Fb > must be less than the material yield stress, 10000 psi for some kind of > structural Al, but not high-strength material [Ref 3], this doesn't look > very good. Each flange would be loaded to about 19200lb/in^2 if all > loads were perfectly distributed. (Note that high-strength Al (e.g. > 6061) can have a yield stress of 45000lb/in^2 so looks much more likely > to succeed, but I don't know how much I'd trust that.) > > My biggest concerns would be the division of stresses between flanges > (if one channel tilts a little or is not sitting perfectly flat on the > trailer or ground, stress sharing will be uneven and one flange make > take all stress) and the potential for flange instability (see notes in > 1.3.1.5 in Ref 1.) This may not be a problem because the flanges are not > particularly deep, but I watched a boat hung from I-beams drop when a > structural I-beam twisted slightly from imperfect loading and the entire > structure quickly twisted into a totally unsupportive mess. > > References: > 1 Beam stress/strain: > > > 2 Beam force/reaction: > > > 3 Material properties: > > > 4 Area moments: > > > ATB, > Donald. > -- > *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue > () no proprietary attachments; no html mail > /\ > > On 2021-07-01 10:56 p.m., john niolon wrote: >> I'm thinking about using aluminum channel for a set of ramps for my car >> hauler.? I have some 'available' that is? 10" wide with .50 web >> thickness and almost 3" flange... about 15# per ft. >> ? >> ramps will be 7-8' long ?..? and will go from ground to 17" high trailer >> deck...? truck weight is 5300 +/- ? with front end weighting 3840.?? I >> can't find a table telling me weight capacity of >> channel with the load traveling up the wide web...?? like this?? any >> ideas on capacity ?? >> ? >> Image87ABA31D >> ? >> thanks >> john >> ? >> ? >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive >> >> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dhlocker at comcast.net >> From fishplate at gmail.com Fri Jul 2 06:42:16 2021 From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough) Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2021 08:42:16 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] weight capacity of aluminum channel In-Reply-To: <881859ea-f471-0c1a-c52f-02d94118e4cb@comcast.net> References: <1UZ2jB6kD5.2FWo8X8OZYN.ref@johns-desktop> <1UZ2jB6kD5.2FWo8X8OZYN@johns-desktop> <881859ea-f471-0c1a-c52f-02d94118e4cb@comcast.net> Message-ID: I haven't done it on 35 years, but at least your equations look familiar. I find that comforting. If the capability is questionable, would solid wood blocks of a suitable height to support the channel somewhere near the center help? On Fri, Jul 2, 2021, 06:34 Donald H Locker wrote: > First oops - I used 10ft length, not 8ft. At 8ft, the numbers look > better by about 20% > > Donald. > -- > *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue > () no proprietary attachments; no html mail > /\ > > On 2021-07-02 6:16 a.m., Donald H Locker wrote: > > BIG NOTE: please check my calculations and assumptions; I haven't > > actually done any of this for nearly 40 years. > > > > TLDR: They might not work. > > > > The significant supporting bits are the two flanges (3in x 0.5in); the > > plate across the top adds very little strength. > > > > All calculations below in pounds and inches. > > > > The maximum stress on the webs (if the weight is perfectly divided > > between them; more on that later) will be (equation 1-1 in reference 1) > > with the weight at the center of the ramp. Fb (bending stress in the > > flange of the channel) must be less than the yield stress of the channel > > material. > > > > Fb = M*c/I > > > > [Ref 2] M for each web: PL/8 = P*120in/8 = P*15in [P is point load, lb] > > [email] c for each web: 1.5in > > [Ref 4] I for each web: (b*(h^3))/12 = ((0.5in)*(3in)^3)/12 = 1.125in^4 > > > > Fb = (P*15in*1.5in)/1.125in^4 = P*20 lb/in^2 > > > > For the given situation, p=3840lb, so Fb (max) is 3840*20 = 76800lb/in^2 > > distributed between the two channels, each with two flanges. Since Fb > > must be less than the material yield stress, 10000 psi for some kind of > > structural Al, but not high-strength material [Ref 3], this doesn't look > > very good. Each flange would be loaded to about 19200lb/in^2 if all > > loads were perfectly distributed. (Note that high-strength Al (e.g. > > 6061) can have a yield stress of 45000lb/in^2 so looks much more likely > > to succeed, but I don't know how much I'd trust that.) > > > > My biggest concerns would be the division of stresses between flanges > > (if one channel tilts a little or is not sitting perfectly flat on the > > trailer or ground, stress sharing will be uneven and one flange make > > take all stress) and the potential for flange instability (see notes in > > 1.3.1.5 in Ref 1.) This may not be a problem because the flanges are not > > particularly deep, but I watched a boat hung from I-beams drop when a > > structural I-beam twisted slightly from imperfect loading and the entire > > structure quickly twisted into a totally unsupportive mess. > > > > References: > > 1 Beam stress/strain: > > < > https://engineeringlibrary.org/reference/simple-beam-bending-air-force-stress-manual > > > > > > 2 Beam force/reaction: > > < > https://engineeringlibrary.org/reference/beam-forces-moments-air-force-stress-manual > > > > > > 3 Material properties: > > > > > > > 4 Area moments: > > > > > > ATB, > > Donald. > > -- > > *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue > > () no proprietary attachments; no html mail > > /\ > > > > On 2021-07-01 10:56 p.m., john niolon wrote: > >> I'm thinking about using aluminum channel for a set of ramps for my car > >> hauler. I have some 'available' that is 10" wide with .50 web > >> thickness and almost 3" flange... about 15# per ft. > >> > >> ramps will be 7-8' long ?.. and will go from ground to 17" high trailer > >> deck... truck weight is 5300 +/- ? with front end weighting 3840. I > >> can't find a table telling me weight capacity of > >> channel with the load traveling up the wide web... like this any > >> ideas on capacity ?? > >> > >> Image87ABA31D > >> > >> thanks > >> john > >> > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> > >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net > >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 > >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > >> > >> Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dhlocker at comcast.net > >> > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate at gmail.com > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dhlocker at comcast.net Fri Jul 2 07:11:50 2021 From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker) Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2021 09:11:50 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] weight capacity of aluminum channel In-Reply-To: References: <1UZ2jB6kD5.2FWo8X8OZYN.ref@johns-desktop> <1UZ2jB6kD5.2FWo8X8OZYN@johns-desktop> <881859ea-f471-0c1a-c52f-02d94118e4cb@comcast.net> Message-ID: <2f83be75-ae83-6f0d-4bf8-200a3b71949e@comcast.net> Some central supports would certainly help. I think my bigger concern (which a good central support would help) would be stress distribution and channel twisting. If either of the channels tipped (due to unbalanced loading or uneven ground) the loads would not be squarely on the flanges and could twist the channel => bad bongos! A central support the prevented twisting would be a great boon to reliability, I expect. I am NOT a structural engineer; all I've said could be wrong, so check carefully. (But I'd probably try it myself, FWIW.) Donald. -- *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue () no proprietary attachments; no html mail /\ On 2021-07-02 8:42 a.m., Jeff Scarbrough wrote: > I haven't done it on 35 years, but at least your equations look > familiar.? I find that comforting. > > If the capability is questionable, would solid wood blocks of a suitable > height to support the channel somewhere near the center help? > > On Fri, Jul 2, 2021, 06:34 Donald H Locker > wrote: > > First oops - I used 10ft length, not 8ft. At 8ft, the numbers look > better by about 20% > > Donald. > -- > *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue > () no proprietary attachments; no html mail > /\ > > > On 2021-07-02 6:16 a.m., Donald H Locker wrote: > > BIG NOTE: please check my calculations and assumptions; I haven't > > actually done any of this for nearly 40 years. > > > > TLDR: They might not work. > > > > The significant supporting bits are the two flanges (3in x 0.5in); the > > plate across the top adds very little strength. > > > > All calculations below in pounds and inches. > > > > The maximum stress on the webs (if the weight is perfectly divided > > between them; more on that later) will be (equation 1-1 in > reference 1) > > with the weight at the center of the ramp. Fb (bending stress in the > > flange of the channel) must be less than the yield stress of the > channel > > material. > > > >? ?Fb = M*c/I > > > > [Ref 2] M for each web: PL/8 = P*120in/8 = P*15in [P is point > load, lb] > > [email] c for each web: 1.5in > > [Ref 4] I for each web: (b*(h^3))/12 = ((0.5in)*(3in)^3)/12 = > 1.125in^4 > > > >? ?Fb = (P*15in*1.5in)/1.125in^4 = P*20 lb/in^2 > > > > For the given situation, p=3840lb, so Fb (max) is 3840*20 = > 76800lb/in^2 > > distributed between the two channels, each with two flanges. Since Fb > > must be less than the material yield stress, 10000 psi for some > kind of > > structural Al, but not high-strength material [Ref 3], this > doesn't look > > very good. Each flange would be loaded to about 19200lb/in^2 if all > > loads were perfectly distributed. (Note that high-strength Al (e.g. > > 6061) can have a yield stress of 45000lb/in^2 so looks much more > likely > > to succeed, but I don't know how much I'd trust that.) > > > > My biggest concerns would be the division of stresses between flanges > > (if one channel tilts a little or is not sitting perfectly flat on the > > trailer or ground, stress sharing will be uneven and one flange make > > take all stress) and the potential for flange instability (see > notes in > > 1.3.1.5 in Ref 1.) This may not be a problem because the flanges > are not > > particularly deep, but I watched a boat hung from I-beams drop when a > > structural I-beam twisted slightly from imperfect loading and the > entire > > structure quickly twisted into a totally unsupportive mess. > > > > References: > > 1 Beam stress/strain: > > > > > > > > 2 Beam force/reaction: > > > > > > > > 3 Material properties: > > > > > > > > 4 Area moments: > > > > > > > > ATB, > > Donald. > > -- > > *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue > > () no proprietary attachments; no html mail > > /\ > > > > > On 2021-07-01 10:56 p.m., john niolon wrote: > >> I'm thinking about using aluminum channel for a set of ramps for > my car > >> hauler.? I have some 'available' that is? 10" wide with .50 web > >> thickness and almost 3" flange... about 15# per ft. > >> ? > >> ramps will be 7-8' long ?..? and will go from ground to 17" high > trailer > >> deck...? truck weight is 5300 +/- ? with front end weighting > 3840.?? I > >> can't find a table telling me weight capacity of > >> channel with the load traveling up the wide web...?? like this?? any > >> ideas on capacity ?? > >> ? > >> Image87ABA31D > >> ? > >> thanks > >> john > >> ? > >> ? > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> > >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net > >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > >> Suggested annual donation? $12.96 > >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > > http://autox.team.net/archive > >> > >> Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dhlocker at comcast.net > > >> > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Suggested annual donation? $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate at gmail.com > > From pj_mcgarvey at hotmail.com Fri Jul 2 07:29:23 2021 From: pj_mcgarvey at hotmail.com (PJ McGarvey) Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2021 13:29:23 +0000 Subject: [Shop-talk] "Smart" garage heater Message-ID: I've recently been enjoying the benefits of adding a smart plug (https://wyze.com/wyze-plug.html) to the AC unit in my detached workshop/garage so I can remotely turn it on and off, and also monitor it using a remote temp/humidity sensor from Govee. Makes it easy to turn on the AC before I decide to go out there, or turn it off if I decide not to. I've also added one to our attic fan for those really hot days. This has me thinking it would be great to be able to do this with my hardwired electric heater as well for the winter months. I've used this heater for a few years now and find it does a great job to maintain temps but can take a few hours to get the temps up on the colder days: https://www.lowes.com/pd/Comfort-Zone-17065-BTU-Ceiling-Mount-Electric-Fan-Forced-Industrial-Utility-Heater-Furnace-with-Safety-Overheat-Protection/1003054570?cm_mmc=shp-_-c-_-prd-_-sol-_-google-_-pla-_--_-sosheatingandcoolers-_-1003054570-_-0&placeholder=null&ds_rl=1286981&gclid=Cj0KCQjw8vqGBhC_ARIsADMSd1DJfbgivVS-Z2JpGFJV22vCzRj8CZB6sI-z5FXzgVIAXGz0e0J5bNwaAt0hEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds I had been thinking the only way to do it was to add a "smart" breaker to the subpanel I have in the garage but those seem a bit pricey and was wondering if it would be good for the unit to power it on and off repeatedly using the breaker. I was amazed to find that someone did a nice writeup on adding automation to this exact heater model using some pretty affordable pieces: https://thesmartcave.com/how-to-make-smart-garage-heater/ I have plenty of time to plan this out before cold weather, but was curious if anyone has done something like this, something similar to automate hardwired devices like heaters, or thinks this is a safe way to go about it? Thx PJ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From patintexas at icloud.com Fri Jul 2 08:16:21 2021 From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne) Date: Fri, 2 Jul 2021 09:16:21 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] weight capacity of aluminum channel In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8F76882B-BE8B-4688-8A1D-3E2828042F33@icloud.com> You might want to consider adding supports under the center of the ramps so the effective length of the ramps is half of the overall length. Peace, Pat Pat Horne We support Habitat for Humanity On Jul 2, 2021, at 5:18 AM, Donald H Locker wrote: ?BIG NOTE: please check my calculations and assumptions; I haven't actually done any of this for nearly 40 years. TLDR: They might not work. The significant supporting bits are the two flanges (3in x 0.5in); the plate across the top adds very little strength. All calculations below in pounds and inches. The maximum stress on the webs (if the weight is perfectly divided between them; more on that later) will be (equation 1-1 in reference 1) with the weight at the center of the ramp. Fb (bending stress in the flange of the channel) must be less than the yield stress of the channel material. Fb = M*c/I [Ref 2] M for each web: PL/8 = P*120in/8 = P*15in [P is point load, lb] [email] c for each web: 1.5in [Ref 4] I for each web: (b*(h^3))/12 = ((0.5in)*(3in)^3)/12 = 1.125in^4 Fb = (P*15in*1.5in)/1.125in^4 = P*20 lb/in^2 For the given situation, p=3840lb, so Fb (max) is 3840*20 = 76800lb/in^2 distributed between the two channels, each with two flanges. Since Fb must be less than the material yield stress, 10000 psi for some kind of structural Al, but not high-strength material [Ref 3], this doesn't look very good. Each flange would be loaded to about 19200lb/in^2 if all loads were perfectly distributed. (Note that high-strength Al (e.g. 6061) can have a yield stress of 45000lb/in^2 so looks much more likely to succeed, but I don't know how much I'd trust that.) My biggest concerns would be the division of stresses between flanges (if one channel tilts a little or is not sitting perfectly flat on the trailer or ground, stress sharing will be uneven and one flange make take all stress) and the potential for flange instability (see notes in 1.3.1.5 in Ref 1.) This may not be a problem because the flanges are not particularly deep, but I watched a boat hung from I-beams drop when a structural I-beam twisted slightly from imperfect loading and the entire structure quickly twisted into a totally unsupportive mess. References: 1 Beam stress/strain: 2 Beam force/reaction: 3 Material properties: 4 Area moments: ATB, Donald. -- *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue () no proprietary attachments; no html mail /\ On 2021-07-01 10:56 p.m., john niolon wrote: > I'm thinking about using aluminum channel for a set of ramps for my car > hauler. I have some 'available' that is 10" wide with .50 web > thickness and almost 3" flange... about 15# per ft. > > ramps will be 7-8' long ?.. and will go from ground to 17" high trailer > deck... truck weight is 5300 +/- ? with front end weighting 3840. I > can't find a table telling me weight capacity of > channel with the load traveling up the wide web... like this any > ideas on capacity ?? > > Image87ABA31D > > thanks > john > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dhlocker at comcast.net > _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com From strovato at optonline.net Fri Jul 2 08:49:35 2021 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Fri, 02 Jul 2021 10:49:35 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] "Smart" garage heater In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <26.18.01419.B282FD06@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> PJ, I was considering doing something similar. The heater I have keeps the fan running for a couple of minutes when the thermostat stops calling for heat. While it can handle having the power cut completely, the manufacturer said that doing that repeatedly was bad for the heater and could shorten its life. My plan was instead to wire the relay into the line going to the thermostat so it would continue to function in the usual way. The relay being open would be the same as the thermostat being open, not calling for heat. Unfortunately, this thought experiment is as far as I have gotten. This project remains on my "maybe I'll get to it someday" list. -Steve T. At 09:29 AM 7/2/2021, PJ McGarvey wrote: >Content-Language: en-US >Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > >boundary="_000_TU4PR8401MB04169EFBB6E89119FE1ED5249A1F9TU4PR8401MB0416_" > >I've recently been enjoying the benefits of adding a smart plug >(https://wyze.com/wyze-plug.html) >to the AC unit in my detached workshop/garage so I can remotely turn >it on and off, and also monitor it using a remote temp/humidity >sensor from Govee. Makes it easy to turn on the AC before I decide >to go out there, or turn it off if I decide not to. I've also added >one to our attic fan for those really hot days. > >This has me thinking it would be great to be able to do this with my >hardwired electric heater as well for the winter months. I've used >this heater for a few years now and find it does a great job to >maintain temps but can take a few hours to get the temps up on the >colder >days: >https://www.lowes.com/pd/Comfort-Zone-17065-BTU-Ceiling-Mount-Electric-Fan-Forced-Industrial-Utility-Heater-Furnace-with-Safety-Overheat-Protection/1003054570?cm_mmc=shp-_-c-_-prd-_-sol-_-google-_-pla-_--_-sosheatingandcoolers-_-1003054570-_-0&placeholder=null&ds_rl=1286981&gclid=Cj0KCQjw8vqGBhC_ARIsADMSd1DJfbgivVS-Z2JpGFJV22vCzRj8CZB6sI-z5FXzgVIAXGz0e0J5bNwaAt0hEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds > >I had been thinking the only way to do it was to add a "smart" >breaker to the subpanel I have in the garage but those seem a bit >pricey and was wondering if it would be good for the unit to power >it on and off repeatedly using the breaker. > >I was amazed to find that someone did a nice writeup on adding >automation to this exact heater model using some pretty affordable >pieces: >https://thesmartcave.com/how-to-make-smart-garage-heater/ > >I have plenty of time to plan this out before cold weather, but was >curious if anyone has done something like this, something similar to >automate hardwired devices like heaters, or thinks this is a safe >way to go about it? > >Thx >PJ -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lee at automate-it.com Thu Jul 8 16:02:56 2021 From: lee at automate-it.com (lee at automate-it.com) Date: Thu, 08 Jul 2021 17:02:56 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Gojo no longer the Go-To Message-ID: <065240d47057189fa1d5a2a56936b123@automate-it.com> I've used the Gojo "1204" dispenser for years, when it runs out just plop another 4.5-lb canister on it and your good to go. But apparently no longer. https://amz.run/4iwJ Even though the canister looks the same, and may even still have the instructions on the side for mounting on the dispenser, it does not work. With a little searching I find that one may be able to empty the contents of the new canister into an old one, but there's evidence that the new formula will just run out of the nozzle. I found one review that included this quote from Gojo: "Please note, due to a necessary formulation upgrade in 2018, this product is no longer compatible with the #1204 dispenser." Which also probably means that it doesn't work as well as the old formulation. I hope I'm wrong. I've used Goop and a couple of others, and none were as effective as Original-formula Gojo. Suggestions for the best replacement? - Lee From lee at automate-it.com Thu Jul 8 16:10:58 2021 From: lee at automate-it.com (lee at automate-it.com) Date: Thu, 08 Jul 2021 17:10:58 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Gojo no longer the Go-To In-Reply-To: <065240d47057189fa1d5a2a56936b123@automate-it.com> References: <065240d47057189fa1d5a2a56936b123@automate-it.com> Message-ID: At least Gojo has not removed the reviews from their own web site. The product page (https://www.gojo.com/en/Product/1115-06) "GOJO ORIGINAL FORMULA Hand Cleaner" has 16 reviews - and ALL 16 are 1-star reviews! Remember "New Coke", anyone? - Lee On 2021-07-08 17:02, lee at automate-it.com wrote: > I've used the Gojo "1204" dispenser for years, when it runs out just > plop another 4.5-lb canister on it and your good to go. > But apparently no longer. https://amz.run/4iwJ > > Even though the canister looks the same, and may even still have the > instructions on the side for mounting on the dispenser, it does not > work. With a little searching I find that one may be able to empty the > contents of the new canister into an old one, but there's evidence > that the new formula will just run out of the nozzle. > > I found one review that included this quote from Gojo: "Please note, > due to a necessary formulation upgrade in 2018, this product is no > longer compatible with the #1204 dispenser." Which also probably means > that it doesn't work as well as the old formulation. I hope I'm wrong. > I've used Goop and a couple of others, and none were as effective as > Original-formula Gojo. > > Suggestions for the best replacement? > > - Lee From strovato at optonline.net Thu Jul 8 16:20:43 2021 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Thu, 08 Jul 2021 18:20:43 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Gojo no longer the Go-To In-Reply-To: <065240d47057189fa1d5a2a56936b123@automate-it.com> References: <065240d47057189fa1d5a2a56936b123@automate-it.com> Message-ID: My son is a machinist, and he turned me on to Kresto Classic hand cleaner. It is much grittier than the Gojo. I like it. Here's a link: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B06XGRNKRC -Steve At 06:02 PM 7/8/2021, lee at automate-it.com wrote: >I've used the Gojo "1204" dispenser for years, when it runs out just >plop another 4.5-lb canister on it and your good to go. >But apparently no longer. https://amz.run/4iwJ > >Even though the canister looks the same, and may even still have the >instructions on the side for mounting on the dispenser, it does not >work. With a little searching I find that one may be able to empty >the contents of the new canister into an old one, but there's >evidence that the new formula will just run out of the nozzle. > >I found one review that included this quote from Gojo: "Please note, >due to a necessary formulation upgrade in 2018, this product is no >longer compatible with the #1204 dispenser." Which also probably >means that it doesn't work as well as the old formulation. I hope >I'm wrong. I've used Goop and a couple of others, and none were as >effective as Original-formula Gojo. > >Suggestions for the best replacement? > > - Lee -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org Thu Jul 8 17:57:14 2021 From: mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org (Jimmie Mayfield) Date: Thu, 8 Jul 2021 19:57:14 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Gojo no longer the Go-To In-Reply-To: <065240d47057189fa1d5a2a56936b123@automate-it.com> References: <065240d47057189fa1d5a2a56936b123@automate-it.com> Message-ID: <4fbbe4b6-c492-ee8e-f260-5dc5214a27f9@sackheads.org> On 7/8/21 6:02 PM, lee at automate-it.com wrote: > I found one review that included this quote from Gojo: "Please note, > due to a necessary formulation upgrade in 2018, this product is no > longer compatible with the #1204 dispenser." Which also probably means > that it doesn't work as well as the old formulation. I hope I'm wrong. > I've used Goop and a couple of others, and none were as effective as > Original-formula Gojo. > > Suggestions for the best replacement? I have a Fast Orange pump in my garage.? About the only thing it found that it doesn't work well on is epoxy resin.? I've even used it, mixed with purple Simple Green, to remove oil stains from my garage floor.? It does leave your hands smelly, though. J From doug at dougbraun.com Thu Jul 8 18:22:37 2021 From: doug at dougbraun.com (Doug Braun) Date: Thu, 8 Jul 2021 20:22:37 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Gojo no longer the Go-To In-Reply-To: <4fbbe4b6-c492-ee8e-f260-5dc5214a27f9@sackheads.org> References: <065240d47057189fa1d5a2a56936b123@automate-it.com> <4fbbe4b6-c492-ee8e-f260-5dc5214a27f9@sackheads.org> Message-ID: Household vinegar works very well for cleaning up uncured epoxy. I'm building a boat that needs 15 gallons of epoxy, and I have gone through 4 or 5 gallons of vinegar so far. I'm surprised that the instructions on little hardware-store tubes of epoxy don't tell you this. Doug On Thu, Jul 8, 2021 at 7:57 PM Jimmie Mayfield < mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org> wrote: > > > I have a Fast Orange pump in my garage. About the only thing it found > that it doesn't work well on is epoxy resin. I've even used it, mixed > with purple Simple Green, to remove oil stains from my garage floor. It > does leave your hands smelly, though. > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com Sat Jul 10 17:12:30 2021 From: tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com (Tim .) Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2021 23:12:30 +0000 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hanging heavy shop wall art Message-ID: Hey all, I hesitated to ask this because I think it makes me sound like a moron. But, in my defense, I am a moron who can't cut wood to save his life: measure six times and STILL frell up the cut. So....here goes: I finally acquired a Datsun tail gate to hang next to a Datsun Roadster hood that is just about totally covered by lichen. I want to hang these so they stay on the wall. Shop walls are bare stud. (I started to insulate and hang OSB so the wall would be more solid that drywall. Once I notice that the fool who built this garage put the untreated 2x4s bare on the slab so they are not going to last to make it worthwhile to insulate.) Since I am in WI we get a lot of humidity so I don't want to just put hooks in the studs and place the sheet metal on them. I am thinking of some sort of wire like hanging a picture with two or three mount points on the wall. But, what should I use for the wire? It needs to be something that won't corrode (obviously). I've been in bars and restaurants where there has been big stuff hanging from the ceiling. I've even seen an F1 car hanging. SO, WTF are they using for this? Sorry for the verbose ask here. thanks tim -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jdinnis at gmail.com Sat Jul 10 17:28:59 2021 From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis) Date: Sat, 10 Jul 2021 18:28:59 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hanging heavy shop wall art In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: When I did something similar, I used a cleat. I cut a 1x6 in half lengthwise on the table saw with the blade tilted over to 45 degrees. This gave me two pieces of wood that would lock together. I screwed one to the wall (aking sure to hit the studs). I screwed the other to the giant heavy sign I wanted to hang. With the Angled part of the cut facing "out" and up on the wall and out and "down" on the sign. The angle holds the piece tight against the wall and the 1x is strong enough to carry a lot of weight. Here is another use of the same idea. https://rockclimberstrainingmanual.files.wordpress.com/2014/04/graphics-pics-for-adjustable-hb-mount_page_5.jpg?w=244&h=300 On Sat, Jul 10, 2021 at 6:12 PM Tim . wrote: > Hey all, > > I hesitated to ask this because I think it makes me sound like a moron. > But, in my defense, I am a moron who can't cut wood to save his life: > measure six times and STILL frell up the cut. So....here goes: > > I finally acquired a Datsun tail gate to hang next to a Datsun Roadster > hood that is just about totally covered by lichen. I want to hang these so > they stay on the wall. Shop walls are bare stud. (I started to insulate and > hang OSB so the wall would be more solid that drywall. Once I notice that > the fool who built this garage put the untreated 2x4s bare on the slab so > they are not going to last to make it worthwhile to insulate.) Since I am > in WI we get a lot of humidity so I don't want to just put hooks in the > studs and place the sheet metal on them. > > I am thinking of some sort of wire like hanging a picture with two or > three mount points on the wall. But, what should I use for the wire? It > needs to be something that won't corrode (obviously). > > I've been in bars and restaurants where there has been big stuff hanging > from the ceiling. I've even seen an F1 car hanging. SO, WTF are they using > for this? > > Sorry for the verbose ask here. > thanks > tim > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com > > -- ================================= = Never offend people with style when you = = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown = ================================= -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jblair1948 at cox.net Fri Jul 30 15:37:24 2021 From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T. Blair) Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2021 17:37:24 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Tool for getting frozen nuts loose Message-ID: <6.2.5.6.1.20210730173146.04a45a78@cox.net> Gang, Was just talking to a friend on the phone about all kind of things and working on rusted items. I was telling him about 2 tools I've seen, but I can't remember what they are called. So I thought someone here would maybe know what I'm talking about. 1. Is a tool that I've seen you put over a nuts, like a manifold nut, and it uses some sort of magnetic / rf energy to break the item loose. 2. Is neat tool that will let you actually burn a broken bolt out of say an engine block. Anyone know what either or both of these are called? I want to find a video of them to send to my friend. John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." In God We Trust Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for oneself; freedom from control or restriction -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From patintexas at icloud.com Fri Jul 30 15:45:28 2021 From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne) Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2021 16:45:28 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Tool for getting frozen nuts loose In-Reply-To: <6.2.5.6.1.20210730173146.04a45a78@cox.net> References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210730173146.04a45a78@cox.net> Message-ID: John, #1 is an induction or eddy current heater #2 is an electro machining (I think) Both work really well. Peace, Pat Pat Horne We support Habitat for Humanity On Jul 30, 2021, at 4:41 PM, John T. Blair wrote: ? Gang, Was just talking to a friend on the phone about all kind of things and working on rusted items. I was telling him about 2 tools I've seen, but I can't remember what they are called. So I thought someone here would maybe know what I'm talking about. 1. Is a tool that I've seen you put over a nuts, like a manifold nut, and it uses some sort of magnetic / rf energy to break the item loose. 2. Is neat tool that will let you actually burn a broken bolt out of say an engine block. Anyone know what either or both of these are called? I want to find a video of them to send to my friend. John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." In God We Trust Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for oneself; freedom from control or restriction -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com From darrellw360 at mac.com Fri Jul 30 15:54:57 2021 From: darrellw360 at mac.com (Darrell Walker) Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2021 14:54:57 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] Tool for getting frozen nuts loose In-Reply-To: <6.2.5.6.1.20210730173146.04a45a78@cox.net> References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210730173146.04a45a78@cox.net> Message-ID: <8C78F886-9598-4E9D-8CD4-E0E51B1757BC@mac.com> For #1, perhaps you are thinking of a inductive heater? https://www.amazon.com/Solary-Magnetic-Induction-Automotive-Flameless/dp/B0851C6Q22/ No experience, just found that with Google. Sort of sounds like #2, but it doesn?t burn it out, just gets it really hot. -Darrell > On Jul 30, 2021, at 2:37 PM, John T. Blair wrote: > > > Gang, > > Was just talking to a friend on the phone about all kind of things and > working on rusted items. I was telling him about 2 tools I've seen, but I > can't remember what they are called. So I thought someone here would > maybe know what I'm talking about. > > 1. Is a tool that I've seen you put over a nuts, like a manifold nut, and it > uses some sort of magnetic / rf energy to break the item loose. > > 2. Is neat tool that will let you actually burn a broken bolt out of say an engine block. > > Anyone know what either or both of these are called? I want to find a > video of them to send to my friend. > > John > > John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net > Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 > > 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) > 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III > 65 Rambler Classic > > Morgan: www.team.net/morgan > Bricklin: www.bricklin.org > > If you can read this - Thank a teacher! > If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! > > From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: > e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." > In God We Trust > Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for > oneself; freedom from control or restriction > > > > > -- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/darrellw360 at mac.com > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lists at dinospider.com Fri Jul 30 16:01:32 2021 From: lists at dinospider.com (Mike Rambour) Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2021 15:01:32 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] Tool for getting frozen nuts loose In-Reply-To: <8C78F886-9598-4E9D-8CD4-E0E51B1757BC@mac.com> References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210730173146.04a45a78@cox.net> <8C78F886-9598-4E9D-8CD4-E0E51B1757BC@mac.com> Message-ID: ?I just used the blue wrench (torch) yesterday on some stuff... I really like the idea of the heater in the link below, think i will try it out ??? mike On 7/30/21 2:54 PM, Darrell Walker wrote: > > For #1, perhaps you are thinking of a inductive heater? > > https://www.amazon.com/Solary-Magnetic-Induction-Automotive-Flameless/dp/B0851C6Q22/ > > > No experience, just found that with Google. ?Sort of sounds like #2, > but it doesn?t burn it out, just gets it really hot. > > -Darrell > >> On Jul 30, 2021, at 2:37 PM, John T. Blair > > wrote: >> >> >> Gang, >> >> Was just talking to a friend on the phone about all kind of things and >> working on rusted items. ?I was telling him about 2 tools I've seen, >> but I >> can't remember what they are called. ?So I thought someone here would >> maybe know what I'm talking about. >> >> 1. Is a tool that I've seen you put over a nuts, like a manifold nut, >> and it >> uses some sort of magnetic / rf energy to break the item loose. >> >> 2. Is neat tool that will let you actually burn a broken bolt out of >> say an engine block. >> >> Anyone know what either or both of these are called? ?I want to find a >> video of them to send to my friend. >> >> John >> >> John T. Blair ?WA4OHZ email: ?jblair1948 at cox.net >> >> Va. Beach, Va ?????????????????Phone: ?(757) 495-8229 >> >> ?????????48 TR1800 ???48 #4 Midget ???65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) >> ????75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) ???77 Spitfire ???71 Saab Sonett III >> ??????????????????????65 Rambler Classic >> >> Morgan: www.team.net/morgan >> Bricklin: www.bricklin.org >> >> If you can read this ????????????- Thank a teacher! >> If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! >> >> From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: >> ????e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." >> ????In God We Trust >> ????Liberty - the ?power ?of ?choosing, ?thinking, ?and ?acting ?for >> ?????????????????oneself; freedom ?from ?control ?or ?restriction >> >> >> >> >> -- >> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >> https://www.avast.com/antivirus >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation ?$12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk >> http://autox.team.net/archive >> >> Unsubscribe/Manage: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/darrellw360 at mac.com >> > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/lists at dinospider.com > -- A gun is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have it, you'll probably never need one again. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From strovato at optonline.net Fri Jul 30 21:34:15 2021 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2021 23:34:15 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Tool for getting frozen nuts loose In-Reply-To: <6.2.5.6.1.20210730173146.04a45a78@cox.net> References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210730173146.04a45a78@cox.net> Message-ID: <3F.68.07690.BD4C4016@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> 1. Induction bolt heater: www.amazon.com/Automotive-Flameless-Induction-Hand-held-Thread-Lock/dp/B089D8GSD9/ref=sr_1_4_sspa 2. EDM Machine: https://www.amazon.com/SFX-Removal-Portable-Disintegrator-Extractor/dp/B07R6QZR69 Amazon links are just examples. With the information there I'm sure you can find some videos. -Steve T. At 05:37 PM 7/30/2021, John T. Blair wrote: >Gang, > >Was just talking to a friend on the phone about all kind of things and >working on rusted items. I was telling him about 2 tools I've seen, but I >can't remember what they are called. So I thought someone here would >maybe know what I'm talking about. > >1. Is a tool that I've seen you put over a nuts, like a manifold nut, and it >uses some sort of magnetic / rf energy to break the item loose. > >2. Is neat tool that will let you actually burn a broken bolt out of >say an engine block. -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From jblair1948 at cox.net Fri Jul 30 21:39:52 2021 From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T. Blair) Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2021 23:39:52 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] power hatch opener/closers Message-ID: <6.2.5.6.1.20210730233319.04cf5990@cox.net> Gang, You all were so great at my last question, I've got another one for you. Anyone know how these power hatch opener & closers work? A neighbor said she went to pick something up and told the person putting it in the back of her SUV NOT to close the hatch, she'd get it. But the person grabbed the hatch and pulled it down. Ever since it has been intermittant. I went looking for any info I could find on how they work and I couldn't find anything. I was thinking there were linear actuactors. But if that were the case I don't think they should have been able to close the hatch manually. I though a linear actuactor was basically a long bolt (all thread) attached to a motor with a nut that was attached to the item you wanted to more. If that's the case, then you shouldn't be able to force the hatch closed as the nut would not slide on the rod and the rod wouldn't turn to let the nut slide down. So what's in those tubes? From what I can tell, one is an assist strut (I'm assuming gas filled) and the other is the actual lifting/closing unit. John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." In God We Trust Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for oneself; freedom from control or restriction -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From patintexas at icloud.com Fri Jul 30 22:50:50 2021 From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne) Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2021 23:50:50 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] power hatch opener/closers In-Reply-To: <6.2.5.6.1.20210730233319.04cf5990@cox.net> References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210730233319.04cf5990@cox.net> Message-ID: <6E3A543A-CAE3-40F8-B5A2-16D8EDB48CD6@icloud.com> All actuators I?ve seen have been screw & nut but I suppose there could be some kind of override to allow it to be opened or closed manually in an emergency. I?ll have to look into that one. You say it?s internet. In what way? Peace, Pat Pat Horne We support Habitat for Humanity On Jul 30, 2021, at 10:42 PM, John T. Blair wrote: ? Gang, You all were so great at my last question, I've got another one for you. Anyone know how these power hatch opener & closers work? A neighbor said she went to pick something up and told the person putting it in the back of her SUV NOT to close the hatch, she'd get it. But the person grabbed the hatch and pulled it down. Ever since it has been intermittant. I went looking for any info I could find on how they work and I couldn't find anything. I was thinking there were linear actuactors. But if that were the case I don't think they should have been able to close the hatch manually. I though a linear actuactor was basically a long bolt (all thread) attached to a motor with a nut that was attached to the item you wanted to more. If that's the case, then you shouldn't be able to force the hatch closed as the nut would not slide on the rod and the rod wouldn't turn to let the nut slide down. So what's in those tubes? From what I can tell, one is an assist strut (I'm assuming gas filled) and the other is the actual lifting/closing unit. John This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. www.avast.com John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." In God We Trust Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for oneself; freedom from control or restriction _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From shannahquilts at gmail.com Fri Jul 30 23:52:34 2021 From: shannahquilts at gmail.com (Shannah Miller) Date: Fri, 30 Jul 2021 22:52:34 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] power hatch opener/closers In-Reply-To: <6.2.5.6.1.20210730233319.04cf5990@cox.net> References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210730233319.04cf5990@cox.net> Message-ID: My spouse and I discussed it, since I have a car with one of those closers, too. We came up with a small list of possible causes: 1. Messed up screw threads that cause it to "miss" and not close well 2. Could it be a bent latch? 3. Is the switch/actuator working properly? 4. Maybe the sensor to tell when it's shut completely is misaligned, or damaged, and thinks it's shut when it isn't? When you find the problem, I'd be interested to hear what it was. Shannah 2018 Buick Envision "The Moose" On Fri, Jul 30, 2021 at 8:41 PM John T. Blair wrote: > > Gang, > > You all were so great at my last question, I've got another one for you. > > Anyone know how these power hatch opener & closers work? A neighbor said > she > went to pick something up and told the person putting it in the back of > her SUV > NOT to close the hatch, she'd get it. But the person grabbed the hatch > and pulled > it down. Ever since it has been intermittant. > > I went looking for any info I could find on how they work and I couldn't > find > anything. I was thinking there were linear actuactors. But if that were > the case > I don't think they should have been able to close the hatch manually. I > though > a linear actuactor was basically a long bolt (all thread) attached to a > motor with a > nut that was attached to the item you wanted to more. If that's the case, > then > you shouldn't be able to force the hatch closed as the nut would not slide > on the > rod and the rod wouldn't turn to let the nut slide down. > > So what's in those tubes? From what I can tell, one is an assist strut > (I'm > assuming gas filled) and the other is the actual lifting/closing unit. > > John > > > > ------------------------------ > [image: Avast logo] > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > www.avast.com > > <#m_5298863878289192855_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> > > John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net > Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 > > 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) > 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III > 65 Rambler Classic > > Morgan: www.team.net/morgan > Bricklin: www.bricklin.org > > If you can read this - Thank a teacher! > If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! > > From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: > e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." > In God We Trust > Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for > oneself; freedom from control or restriction > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shannahquilts at gmail.com > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: