From gsteve at hammatt.com  Wed Mar  4 16:32:27 2020
From: gsteve at hammatt.com (Steve Hammatt, Mount Vernon WA USA)
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2020 15:32:27 -0800
Subject: [Shop-talk] air line system install
Message-ID: <6EB6F0CCB72049DAA57EC34F08911D47@DESKTOPTOA1F5G>

I?m planning the airline system install in my new shop.  It will be 
a circle pattern so that it will wrap round the entire room near 
ceiling height.  Is anyone familiar with the recommended pitch 
or incline recommended for water (condensate) drainage to the 
designated vertical drops for line blowdown?
Steve Hammatt
Mount Vernon WA USA
www.leatherplates.com


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From patintexas at icloud.com  Wed Mar  4 16:42:47 2020
From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne)
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2020 17:42:47 -0600
Subject: [Shop-talk] air line system install
In-Reply-To: <6EB6F0CCB72049DAA57EC34F08911D47@DESKTOPTOA1F5G>
References: <6EB6F0CCB72049DAA57EC34F08911D47@DESKTOPTOA1F5G>
Message-ID: <E37A3E1B-7C41-448B-A24B-4612082BBC38@icloud.com>

Don?t know specifically on air lines, but sewer line recommend fall is 1/4?/foot with 1/8?/foot being the flattest slope. Remember that this slope is based on solid waste flow. 
My air lines are hard copper with a slope of 1-1/2? in 20 feet. Even if the line is level, opening up the drain on the air line should produce enough flow to pull the water out of the lines. 

Peace,
Pat

Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


> On Mar 4, 2020, at 5:32 PM, Steve Hammatt, Mount Vernon WA USA via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 

?
I?m planning the airline system install in my new shop.  It will be
a circle pattern so that it will wrap round the entire room near
ceiling height.  Is anyone familiar with the recommended pitch
or incline recommended for water (condensate) drainage to the
designated vertical drops for line blowdown?
Steve Hammatt
Mount Vernon WA USA
www.leatherplates.com


_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com

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From ejrussell at mebtel.net  Wed Mar  4 18:30:24 2020
From: ejrussell at mebtel.net (Eric Russell)
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2020 20:30:24 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] air line system install
In-Reply-To: <6EB6F0CCB72049DAA57EC34F08911D47@DESKTOPTOA1F5G>
References: <6EB6F0CCB72049DAA57EC34F08911D47@DESKTOPTOA1F5G>
Message-ID: <40dd5b9b-1984-54e7-7d03-04d83fdadaee@mebtel.net>

TP Tools has info on air lines. Note the risers before the drops - they 
come off the top of the horizontal lines. Presumably this would minimize 
getting condensed water into the drops.

https://cached.tptools.com/Images/airline-piping-diagram.pdf

Eric Russell
Mebane, NC

On 3/4/2020 6:32 PM, Steve Hammatt, Mount Vernon WA USA via Shop-talk wrote:
> I?m planning the airline system install in my new shop. It will be
> a circle pattern so that it will wrap round the entire room near
> ceiling height.? Is anyone familiar with the recommended pitch
> or incline recommended for water (condensate) drainage to the
> designated vertical drops for line blowdown?
> Steve Hammatt

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From eugene.abbondelo at gmail.com  Thu Mar  5 06:21:11 2020
From: eugene.abbondelo at gmail.com (Gene Abbondelo)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2020 08:21:11 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Hoses
Message-ID: <CALk0K8g4C0QW3LFyg+6NsHn66MpWaPmWYdyTH2Ztu++CUaXhRg@mail.gmail.com>

Need some recommendations on a decent air line hose for my garage that
stays pliable in cold weather.

Also need recommendations on clear hose to use on a brake bleeder setup.
Hose that won't get hard and brittle.

Thanks,

Gene
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From parkanzky at gmail.com  Thu Mar  5 06:35:55 2020
From: parkanzky at gmail.com (Paul Parkanzky)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2020 08:35:55 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Hoses
In-Reply-To: <CALk0K8g4C0QW3LFyg+6NsHn66MpWaPmWYdyTH2Ztu++CUaXhRg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALk0K8g4C0QW3LFyg+6NsHn66MpWaPmWYdyTH2Ztu++CUaXhRg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAOEriimxLzThtv7Nqsi54mXTFKjMAyqxBNO23vKbYbep3H1FDQ@mail.gmail.com>

Any of the quality natural rubber hoses will stiffen less in cold
weather. That's a "buy once, cry once" purchase.

For bleeding brakes, the best I've been able to come up with is Tygon
tubing and then just have it warmed up before you want to use it. So
either keep it in the house that morning or run a heat gun (or even
your propane torch) along the length that you're going to use right
before you bleed brakes or fill a diff or whatever.

-Paul

On Thu, Mar 5, 2020 at 8:22 AM Gene Abbondelo via Shop-talk
<shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> Need some recommendations on a decent air line hose for my garage that stays pliable in cold weather.
>
> Also need recommendations on clear hose to use on a brake bleeder setup.  Hose that won't get hard and brittle.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Gene

From jamesf at groupwbench.org  Thu Mar  5 06:45:37 2020
From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2020 08:45:37 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Hoses
In-Reply-To: <CALk0K8g4C0QW3LFyg+6NsHn66MpWaPmWYdyTH2Ztu++CUaXhRg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALk0K8g4C0QW3LFyg+6NsHn66MpWaPmWYdyTH2Ztu++CUaXhRg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <B946EF79-2797-4092-AE5D-9987DA5E83A2@groupwbench.org>

I second this. Bought a 25' for a small second mortgage and I've added enough years to my life by not yelling at the plastic hose to pay it off. Buy quality high flow couplings white you're at it. I've had this link saved:

https://toolguyd.com/quick-guide-to-air-line-couplers-plugs/

jim

> On Mar 5, 2020, at 8:21 AM, Gene Abbondelo via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> Need some recommendations on a decent air line hose for my garage that stays pliable in cold weather.
> 
> Also need recommendations on clear hose to use on a brake bleeder setup.  Hose that won't get hard and brittle.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Gene
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jamesf at groupwbench.org
> 

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From tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com  Thu Mar  5 07:34:03 2020
From: tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com (Tim .)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2020 14:34:03 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] Hoses
In-Reply-To: <CALk0K8g4C0QW3LFyg+6NsHn66MpWaPmWYdyTH2Ztu++CUaXhRg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALk0K8g4C0QW3LFyg+6NsHn66MpWaPmWYdyTH2Ztu++CUaXhRg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <DM6PR04MB5147F76B4E7963A36FB7716DB4E20@DM6PR04MB5147.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>

I bought a (goodyear stamped on the hose) rubber air hose at horriblefreight some years ago--I don't remember if there was more than once "brand" choice. It's been great so far. I live in Wisconsin and it does get used in the middle of winter regularly as tyres loose pressure in the cold.

tim

________________________________
From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> on behalf of Gene Abbondelo via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, March 5, 2020 7:21 AM
To: Shop-talk at autox.team.net <Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Shop-talk] Hoses

Need some recommendations on a decent air line hose for my garage that stays pliable in cold weather.

Also need recommendations on clear hose to use on a brake bleeder setup.  Hose that won't get hard and brittle.

Thanks,

Gene
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From maynerdfamily at msn.com  Thu Mar  5 07:54:33 2020
From: maynerdfamily at msn.com (Brian and Wendy)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2020 14:54:33 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] Hoses
In-Reply-To: <CALk0K8g4C0QW3LFyg+6NsHn66MpWaPmWYdyTH2Ztu++CUaXhRg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALk0K8g4C0QW3LFyg+6NsHn66MpWaPmWYdyTH2Ztu++CUaXhRg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <DM5PR07MB3975D0C74D213E0DA91196E8BBE20@DM5PR07MB3975.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>

I don't buy any of the pre-made hoses. I go to my local hose and fitting store and get a length of the hose for push on fittings. The push on fittings work great and no hose clamp involved. This type of hose is good quality. Plus it is easy to make custom lengths if needed

Here is  McMaster link to the type of hose I am talking about.

https://www.mcmaster.com/air-hose/air-hose-for-push-on-fittings/

Fittings

https://www.mcmaster.com/push-on-hose-fittings


Brian Warrick
Nampa, ID



________________________________
From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> on behalf of Gene Abbondelo via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, March 5, 2020 6:21 AM
To: Shop-talk at autox.team.net <Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Shop-talk] Hoses

Need some recommendations on a decent air line hose for my garage that stays pliable in cold weather.

Also need recommendations on clear hose to use on a brake bleeder setup.  Hose that won't get hard and brittle.

Thanks,

Gene
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From dhlocker at comcast.net  Thu Mar  5 08:32:09 2020
From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2020 10:32:09 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Hoses
In-Reply-To: <CAOEriimxLzThtv7Nqsi54mXTFKjMAyqxBNO23vKbYbep3H1FDQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALk0K8g4C0QW3LFyg+6NsHn66MpWaPmWYdyTH2Ztu++CUaXhRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAOEriimxLzThtv7Nqsi54mXTFKjMAyqxBNO23vKbYbep3H1FDQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1b960aab-6598-d98b-a903-f2c0c4cdfc57@comcast.net>

I'm with the Tygon tubing for bleeding brakes. I also do it slightly 
differently - rather than dangle the end of the tube into a jar, I use a 
long length and suspend the non-bleedscrew end up in the air where I can 
see it from the cockpit.

This keeps the bleedscrew "pressurised" with fluif* (to prevent air from 
entering when I release the pedal) and allows me to see when air bubbles 
stop rising from the cylinder/caliper (and lets me know when I have to 
drain the tube because it's getting too full). My only helper is a 
stepladder and clip.

HTH,
Donald.
* - with regards to Joe Curry, if he's around here.
--
*Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
() no proprietary attachments; no html mail
/\ <https://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml>

On 2020-03-05 8:35 a.m., Paul Parkanzky via Shop-talk wrote:
> Any of the quality natural rubber hoses will stiffen less in cold
> weather. That's a "buy once, cry once" purchase.
> 
> For bleeding brakes, the best I've been able to come up with is Tygon
> tubing and then just have it warmed up before you want to use it. So
> either keep it in the house that morning or run a heat gun (or even
> your propane torch) along the length that you're going to use right
> before you bleed brakes or fill a diff or whatever.
> 
> -Paul
> 
> On Thu, Mar 5, 2020 at 8:22 AM Gene Abbondelo via Shop-talk
> <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>>
>> Need some recommendations on a decent air line hose for my garage that stays pliable in cold weather.
>>
>> Also need recommendations on clear hose to use on a brake bleeder setup.  Hose that won't get hard and brittle.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Gene

From jem at milleredp.com  Thu Mar  5 09:52:30 2020
From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2020 08:52:30 -0800
Subject: [Shop-talk] Hoses
In-Reply-To: <DM6PR04MB5147F76B4E7963A36FB7716DB4E20@DM6PR04MB5147.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CALk0K8g4C0QW3LFyg+6NsHn66MpWaPmWYdyTH2Ztu++CUaXhRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <DM6PR04MB5147F76B4E7963A36FB7716DB4E20@DM6PR04MB5147.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <72ca089f-027a-0e6b-b223-6956dba43d00@milleredp.com>

On 3/5/2020 6:34 AM, Tim . via Shop-talk wrote:
> I bought a (goodyear stamped on the hose) rubber air hose at 
> horriblefreight some years ago--I don't remember if there was more than 
> once "brand" choice. It's been great so far. I live in Wisconsin and it 
> does get used in the middle of winter regularly as tyres loose pressure 
> in the cold.

Air:

(a) Rubber hose.

(b) Distributed clamping and strain reliefs at fittings - I use 2-3 
Oetiker-style band clamps with a layer or two of heavy heat-shrink over 
the clamps extending out onto the hose.

(c) A lighter-duty more flexible (and presumably stored indoors) whip 
hose on the tool/tire chuck will reduce stress on the end of the hose, 
where it'll most likely fail.

(d) Then you cut it back six inches and do it again.

Clear brake-bleeder tubing:

(a) Whatever you buy, buy three times what you need so you have it to 
swap out when you need to.

(b) McMaster-Carr as a source.

I don't use clear hoses for brake bleeding, I think mine are silicone. 
I use three-packs of ketchup bottles from Smart & Final with a piece of 
hard brake line down to the bottom of the bottle, the hose over both the 
hard line and the squeeze-spout, and a clamp to hold them together. 
Add 1in of brake fluid in bottom of bottle, connect, crack bleeder, then 
bleed until you've got ~2in of fluid in the bottle.   You can also add a 
loop of fishing line to hang the bottle from the bleed screw.

John.

From ronnie.day at gmail.com  Wed Mar  4 17:24:08 2020
From: ronnie.day at gmail.com (Ronnie Day)
Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2020 18:24:08 -0600
Subject: [Shop-talk] air line system install
In-Reply-To: <E37A3E1B-7C41-448B-A24B-4612082BBC38@icloud.com>
References: <6EB6F0CCB72049DAA57EC34F08911D47@DESKTOPTOA1F5G>
 <E37A3E1B-7C41-448B-A24B-4612082BBC38@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <CAMHhs6cayEXHigbpD2rj6fZEGY3bs738g+1uTMtG27mSPbbzJQ@mail.gmail.com>

Check out the TP Tools website. They offer a lot of info on setting up air
supply systems.

On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 5:43 PM Pat Horne via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Don?t know specifically on air lines, but sewer line recommend fall is
> 1/4?/foot with 1/8?/foot being the flattest slope. Remember that this slope
> is based on solid waste flow.
> My air lines are hard copper with a slope of 1-1/2? in 20 feet. Even if
> the line is level, opening up the drain on the air line should produce
> enough flow to pull the water out of the lines.
>
> Peace,
> Pat
>
> Pat Horne
> We support Habitat for Humanity
>
>
> On Mar 4, 2020, at 5:32 PM, Steve Hammatt, Mount Vernon WA USA via
> Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> ?
> I?m planning the airline system install in my new shop.  It will be
> a circle pattern so that it will wrap round the entire room near
> ceiling height.  Is anyone familiar with the recommended pitch
> or incline recommended for water (condensate) drainage to the
> designated vertical drops for line blowdown?
> Steve Hammatt
> Mount Vernon WA USA
> www.leatherplates.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie.day at gmail.com
>
>
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From marka at maracing.com  Thu Mar  5 06:57:21 2020
From: marka at maracing.com (Mark Andy)
Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2020 08:57:21 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Hoses
In-Reply-To: <B946EF79-2797-4092-AE5D-9987DA5E83A2@groupwbench.org>
References: <CALk0K8g4C0QW3LFyg+6NsHn66MpWaPmWYdyTH2Ztu++CUaXhRg@mail.gmail.com>
 <B946EF79-2797-4092-AE5D-9987DA5E83A2@groupwbench.org>
Message-ID: <CAAoSWGNDo1K9qkucH6OEsERXof+wDURHHtNamXRHZkyZ+jEQgg@mail.gmail.com>

Howdy,

These days, it seems like most mechanics have gotten rid of air tools
almost entirely and gone the battery route.  I'm very much not a pro, but I
can't say that I miss tripping over air hoses now that I've updated to
battery powered impact guns, in particular.

FWIW.

Mark

On Thu, Mar 5, 2020 at 8:45 AM Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> I second this. Bought a 25' for a small second mortgage and I've added
> enough years to my life by not yelling at the plastic hose to pay it off.
> Buy quality high flow couplings white you're at it. I've had this link
> saved:
>
> https://toolguyd.com/quick-guide-to-air-line-couplers-plugs/
>
> jim
>
> > On Mar 5, 2020, at 8:21 AM, Gene Abbondelo via Shop-talk <
> shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> >
> > Need some recommendations on a decent air line hose for my garage that
> stays pliable in cold weather.
> >
> > Also need recommendations on clear hose to use on a brake bleeder
> setup.  Hose that won't get hard and brittle.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Gene
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> > Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
> >
> > Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jamesf at groupwbench.org
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka at maracing.com
>
>
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From tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com  Thu Mar 12 06:26:05 2020
From: tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com (Tim .)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2020 12:26:05 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
Message-ID: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>

Sending this inquiry to you all since I know there are more than a few IT guys in this group.....

I bought three 512GB flash drives for archiving here at work. One locked up in each of our offices and one for me to add to files as necessary as files are amended. They have approximately 450GB on them.

One of the three failed as soon as I finished filling it. I bought a different brand and made a replacement copy for the safe in our Madison office. A second, the same brand as the first one that failed is locked up in our MKE office and will also be replaced now because the third one (the one that has amended archived files) is also failing. I am having a hard time retrieving the amended files before this drive takes a final crap on me. It took over 15 hours to pull one 87MB file from the dying drive. I can't even attempt to pull more than one file at a time. Not that this should matter, but the files are mixed word, pdf, saved outlook emails and miscellaneous audio or video files and possibly other items.

What I am wondering/hoping is that someone might know of a solution to this nearly impossible retrieval process. Or am I just screwed here?

Next year we will be storing everything in the cloud so I won't have to deal with this PITA process.

Thanks
tim
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From jdinnis at gmail.com  Thu Mar 12 06:34:00 2020
From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2020 07:34:00 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <CANuE7YAAm_65+iYCffZptHckWQ2PDn7aNLy4gKy+XNv7uR+bJA@mail.gmail.com>

One thing that often works for us is to freeze the drive (if it has a cold
solder join this will often keep it working long enough to get the data
off.  If that doesn't work you can try baking it.  Less common, but
sometime the post coat the manufactures use one these is sensitive to
humidity.  Baking them in a 250 degree oven for a couple hours might dry it
out enough to work.

On Thu, Mar 12, 2020 at 7:26 AM Tim . via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Sending this inquiry to you all since I know there are more than a few IT
> guys in this group.....
>
> I bought three 512GB flash drives for archiving here at work. One locked
> up in each of our offices and one for me to add to files as necessary as
> files are amended. They have approximately 450GB on them.
>
> One of the three failed as soon as I finished filling it. I bought a
> different brand and made a replacement copy for the safe in our Madison
> office. A second, the same brand as the first one that failed is locked up
> in our MKE office and will also be replaced now because the third one (the
> one that has amended archived files) is also failing. I am having a hard
> time retrieving the amended files before this drive takes a final crap on
> me. It took over 15 hours to pull one 87MB file from the dying drive. I
> can't even attempt to pull more than one file at a time. Not that this
> should matter, but the files are mixed word, pdf, saved outlook emails and
> miscellaneous audio or video files and possibly other items.
>
> What I am wondering/hoping is that someone might know of a solution to
> this nearly impossible retrieval process. Or am I just screwed here?
>
> Next year we will be storing everything in the cloud so I won't have to
> deal with this PITA process.
>
> Thanks
> tim
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com
>
>

-- 
=================================
= Never offend people with style when you   =
= can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =
=================================
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From dirtbeard at gmail.com  Thu Mar 12 07:30:10 2020
From: dirtbeard at gmail.com (old dirtbeard)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2020 06:30:10 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <CAG1pxgaHPPCvu05+D8hH-3q0BeuhEfedPOsZx4jdDr-GvWpymg@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Tim,

I think you got some good advice on what to try to retrieve the data, and
your last sentence is the solution:

              Next year we will be storing everything in the cloud so I
won't have to deal with this PITA process.

I would sign-up today for Google or O365 and move everything to One Drive
or Google Drive.

best,

doug


On Thu, Mar 12, 2020 at 5:26 AM Tim . via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Sending this inquiry to you all since I know there are more than a few IT
> guys in this group.....
>
> I bought three 512GB flash drives for archiving here at work. One locked
> up in each of our offices and one for me to add to files as necessary as
> files are amended. They have approximately 450GB on them.
>
> One of the three failed as soon as I finished filling it. I bought a
> different brand and made a replacement copy for the safe in our Madison
> office. A second, the same brand as the first one that failed is locked up
> in our MKE office and will also be replaced now because the third one (the
> one that has amended archived files) is also failing. I am having a hard
> time retrieving the amended files before this drive takes a final crap on
> me. It took over 15 hours to pull one 87MB file from the dying drive. I
> can't even attempt to pull more than one file at a time. Not that this
> should matter, but the files are mixed word, pdf, saved outlook emails and
> miscellaneous audio or video files and possibly other items.
>
> What I am wondering/hoping is that someone might know of a solution to
> this nearly impossible retrieval process. Or am I just screwed here?
>
> Next year we will be storing everything in the cloud so I won't have to
> deal with this PITA process.
>
> Thanks
> tim
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard at gmail.com
>
>
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From scott.hall.personal at gmail.com  Thu Mar 12 12:40:13 2020
From: scott.hall.personal at gmail.com (Scott Hall)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2020 13:40:13 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <CAK73_u6GcRWLqNFmc=bWUKVYF8BwCuCb-5Grdx=KwZopqwMHVQ@mail.gmail.com>

I think I'm a late adopter and certainly not as sophisticated as I'd like,
but I bought and finally put drives in a QNAP 3-bay NAS (networked attached
storage). It's using RAID5 so it can tolerate one drive failure without
losing the data. I'm now looking for an online backup for that, my thought
being that even if the NAS dies I'll have it backed up as well.

The issue I'm having is that the NAS holds 8TB of files and cloud backup of
8TB is expensive. Or more expensive than I thought it would be, anyway.

For 512 GB, I'd think you could get a NAS with RAID6 (I think, Google it
and don't listen to me) that tolerates two drive failures and a cheap
online backup system. I'd sleep pretty well with that setup. And 512GB HDDs
are downright cheap any more.

The thing I bought says it'll auto-backup stuff from independent machines.
Or rather, I assume you install a utility on the individual computers and
schedule backups. Seems pretty nifty, even if I don't plan on using it.

Scott

On Thu, Mar 12, 2020 at 7:26 AM Tim . via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Sending this inquiry to you all since I know there are more than a few IT
> guys in this group.....
>
> I bought three 512GB flash drives for archiving here at work. One locked
> up in each of our offices and one for me to add to files as necessary as
> files are amended. They have approximately 450GB on them.
>
> One of the three failed as soon as I finished filling it. I bought a
> different brand and made a replacement copy for the safe in our Madison
> office. A second, the same brand as the first one that failed is locked up
> in our MKE office and will also be replaced now because the third one (the
> one that has amended archived files) is also failing. I am having a hard
> time retrieving the amended files before this drive takes a final crap on
> me. It took over 15 hours to pull one 87MB file from the dying drive. I
> can't even attempt to pull more than one file at a time. Not that this
> should matter, but the files are mixed word, pdf, saved outlook emails and
> miscellaneous audio or video files and possibly other items.
>
> What I am wondering/hoping is that someone might know of a solution to
> this nearly impossible retrieval process. Or am I just screwed here?
>
> Next year we will be storing everything in the cloud so I won't have to
> deal with this PITA process.
>
> Thanks
> tim
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/scott.hall.personal at gmail.com
>
>
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From doug at dougbraun.com  Thu Mar 12 12:57:32 2020
From: doug at dougbraun.com (Doug Braun)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2020 14:57:32 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <CAOtbU9UHuwa5JmLsq5Q0ee6xPC7P5FLP+Lz95LL6+=AgbaNp8A@mail.gmail.com>

A USB portable hard drive (the real, spinning kind) should be much more
reliable than a run-of-the-mill USB flash drive, as long as you don't
handle it roughly.

Doug

On Thu, Mar 12, 2020, 8:26 AM Tim . via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
wrote:

> Sending this inquiry to you all since I know there are more than a few IT
> guys in this group.....
>
> I bought three 512GB flash drives for archiving here at work. One locked
> up in each of our offices and one for me to add to files as necessary as
> files are amended. They have approximately 450GB on them.
>
> One of the three failed as soon as I finished filling it. I bought a
> different brand and made a replacement copy for the safe in our Madison
> office. A second, the same brand as the first one that failed is locked up
> in our MKE office and will also be replaced now because the third one (the
> one that has amended archived files) is also failing. I am having a hard
> time retrieving the amended files before this drive takes a final crap on
> me. It took over 15 hours to pull one 87MB file from the dying drive. I
> can't even attempt to pull more than one file at a time. Not that this
> should matter, but the files are mixed word, pdf, saved outlook emails and
> miscellaneous audio or video files and possibly other items.
>
> What I am wondering/hoping is that someone might know of a solution to
> this nearly impossible retrieval process. Or am I just screwed here?
>
> Next year we will be storing everything in the cloud so I won't have to
> deal with this PITA process.
>
> Thanks
> tim
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/doug at dougbraun.com
>
>
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From alfuller194 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 13 08:15:12 2020
From: alfuller194 at gmail.com (alfuller194 at gmail.com)
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2020 10:15:12 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
Message-ID: <106c01d5f941$cfdec010$6f9c4030$@gmail.com>

Tim:  At the end of last year I had what looked for all the world like a
memory problem in my main desktop. Although I know better, it was not backed
up and the problem turned out to be a bad hard drive. This stranded ~1-2 Gb
of data, and I was close to panic! I tried using my copy of SpinRite, but
the drive was too far gone for that. 

 

Eventually I wound up sending the drive to $300 Data Recovery in Los
Angeles. A couple of weeks later I paid them around $300 and got back a new
SSD with 99% of the data on it, along with the old drive - which it turns
out had a bad head.  

 

You might give them a call and see if they can help.  See:
https://www.300dollardatarecovery.com/our-abilities/

----------------

All the best,

Al Fuller

 

Sending this inquiry to you all since I know there are more than a few IT
guys in this group.....

 

I bought three 512GB flash drives for archiving here at work. One locked up
in each of our offices and one for me to add to files as necessary as files
are amended. They have approximately 450GB on them.

 

One of the three failed as soon as I finished filling it. I bought a
different brand and made a replacement copy for the safe in our Madison
office. A second, the same brand as the first one that failed is locked up
in our MKE office and will also be replaced now because the third one (the
one that has amended archived files) is also failing. I am having a hard
time retrieving the amended files before this drive takes a final crap on
me. It took over 15 hours to pull one 87MB file from the dying drive. I
can't even attempt to pull more than one file at a time. Not that this
should matter, but the files are mixed word, pdf, saved outlook emails and
miscellaneous audio or video files and possibly other items. 

 

What I am wondering/hoping is that someone might know of a solution to this
nearly impossible retrieval process. Or am I just screwed here? 

 

Next year we will be storing everything in the cloud so I won't have to deal
with this PITA process. 

 

Thanks

tim

 

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From peterwmurray at gmail.com  Fri Mar 13 15:17:01 2020
From: peterwmurray at gmail.com (Peter Murray)
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2020 17:17:01 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <CAG1pxgaHPPCvu05+D8hH-3q0BeuhEfedPOsZx4jdDr-GvWpymg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
 <CAG1pxgaHPPCvu05+D8hH-3q0BeuhEfedPOsZx4jdDr-GvWpymg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJ8HLP8KZKkvtmtMeakttL1Rn9qxexygxN=B8x-a_58qu-89qw@mail.gmail.com>

If you go with the freezer route, seal the drive in a ziploc bag (you may
need some RTV or other sealant to ensure the bag is sealed around the
cables, as you'll want to run the drive while its cold) so the drive
doesn't get condensate throughout when you pull it out of the freezer. Some
desiccant in the bag would be helpful (could be rice or silica gel).

It also could be further helpful to start with the bagged drive in a warm
oven (not over 125 F) to drive moisture out and into the desiccant,
followed by
a graduated transition to the freezer (or the refrigerator, if sufficient).
Don't just throw it directly from the oven into the freezer!

The cloud is handy, but don't forget to back it up. I use OneDrive (as part
of my Office 365 account), and use sync software on my NAS to sync
the OneDrive. The NAS then backs up to BackBlaze B2 buckets.

-Peter

On Thu, Mar 12, 2020 at 9:31 AM old dirtbeard via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Hi Tim,
>
> I think you got some good advice on what to try to retrieve the data, and
> your last sentence is the solution:
>
>               Next year we will be storing everything in the cloud so I
> won't have to deal with this PITA process.
>
> I would sign-up today for Google or O365 and move everything to One Drive
> or Google Drive.
>
> best,
>
> doug
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 12, 2020 at 5:26 AM Tim . via Shop-talk <
> shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
>> Sending this inquiry to you all since I know there are more than a few IT
>> guys in this group.....
>>
>> I bought three 512GB flash drives for archiving here at work. One locked
>> up in each of our offices and one for me to add to files as necessary as
>> files are amended. They have approximately 450GB on them.
>>
>> One of the three failed as soon as I finished filling it. I bought a
>> different brand and made a replacement copy for the safe in our Madison
>> office. A second, the same brand as the first one that failed is locked up
>> in our MKE office and will also be replaced now because the third one (the
>> one that has amended archived files) is also failing. I am having a hard
>> time retrieving the amended files before this drive takes a final crap on
>> me. It took over 15 hours to pull one 87MB file from the dying drive. I
>> can't even attempt to pull more than one file at a time. Not that this
>> should matter, but the files are mixed word, pdf, saved outlook emails and
>> miscellaneous audio or video files and possibly other items.
>>
>> What I am wondering/hoping is that someone might know of a solution to
>> this nearly impossible retrieval process. Or am I just screwed here?
>>
>> Next year we will be storing everything in the cloud so I won't have to
>> deal with this PITA process.
>>
>> Thanks
>> tim
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
>> http://autox.team.net/archive
>>
>> Unsubscribe/Manage:
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard at gmail.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/peterwmurray at gmail.com
>
>
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From peterwmurray at gmail.com  Fri Mar 13 15:28:30 2020
From: peterwmurray at gmail.com (Peter Murray)
Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2020 17:28:30 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <CAK73_u6GcRWLqNFmc=bWUKVYF8BwCuCb-5Grdx=KwZopqwMHVQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
 <CAK73_u6GcRWLqNFmc=bWUKVYF8BwCuCb-5Grdx=KwZopqwMHVQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJ8HLP_fdnOSsMUVC6D4YawErz9MHHufd=nX=MnjhoSnLbJ6bQ@mail.gmail.com>

Scott-

Look at Hybrid Backup Sync on your QNAP for automatic backup capability.
I'd look at a combination of local USB drive
as a backup destination, as well as BackBlaze B2 (also via HBS). They're
one of the least expensive cloud storage
providers out there, and they've been excellent for me thus far.

I have a QNAP TS-873 at home, and I really like it. It is an investment,
but it just works, and doesn't require constant
fiddling to keep it working, unlike my 1986 BMW R80RT.

-Peter

On Thu, Mar 12, 2020 at 2:41 PM Scott Hall via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> I think I'm a late adopter and certainly not as sophisticated as I'd like,
> but I bought and finally put drives in a QNAP 3-bay NAS (networked attached
> storage). It's using RAID5 so it can tolerate one drive failure without
> losing the data. I'm now looking for an online backup for that, my thought
> being that even if the NAS dies I'll have it backed up as well.
>
> The issue I'm having is that the NAS holds 8TB of files and cloud backup
> of 8TB is expensive. Or more expensive than I thought it would be, anyway.
>
> For 512 GB, I'd think you could get a NAS with RAID6 (I think, Google it
> and don't listen to me) that tolerates two drive failures and a cheap
> online backup system. I'd sleep pretty well with that setup. And 512GB HDDs
> are downright cheap any more.
>
> The thing I bought says it'll auto-backup stuff from independent machines.
> Or rather, I assume you install a utility on the individual computers and
> schedule backups. Seems pretty nifty, even if I don't plan on using it.
>
> Scott
>
> On Thu, Mar 12, 2020 at 7:26 AM Tim . via Shop-talk <
> shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
>> Sending this inquiry to you all since I know there are more than a few IT
>> guys in this group.....
>>
>> I bought three 512GB flash drives for archiving here at work. One locked
>> up in each of our offices and one for me to add to files as necessary as
>> files are amended. They have approximately 450GB on them.
>>
>> One of the three failed as soon as I finished filling it. I bought a
>> different brand and made a replacement copy for the safe in our Madison
>> office. A second, the same brand as the first one that failed is locked up
>> in our MKE office and will also be replaced now because the third one (the
>> one that has amended archived files) is also failing. I am having a hard
>> time retrieving the amended files before this drive takes a final crap on
>> me. It took over 15 hours to pull one 87MB file from the dying drive. I
>> can't even attempt to pull more than one file at a time. Not that this
>> should matter, but the files are mixed word, pdf, saved outlook emails and
>> miscellaneous audio or video files and possibly other items.
>>
>> What I am wondering/hoping is that someone might know of a solution to
>> this nearly impossible retrieval process. Or am I just screwed here?
>>
>> Next year we will be storing everything in the cloud so I won't have to
>> deal with this PITA process.
>>
>> Thanks
>> tim
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
>> http://autox.team.net/archive
>>
>> Unsubscribe/Manage:
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/scott.hall.personal at gmail.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/peterwmurray at gmail.com
>
>
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From tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com  Sat Mar 14 09:21:41 2020
From: tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com (Tim .)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 15:21:41 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <CH2PR04MB6505B1BBDAB0253E53F6FB8DB4FB0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>

Thanks for the replies all.

A few of my own:

freeze the drive?probably try this.

baking it?it?s coated in rubber so probably not a good idea.

One Drive or Google Drive?We will be in totally in the cloud once our new case management system is done being built.

Flash drives or spinning hard drives?as the title of the post says: ?Flash drives?

A USB portable hard drive should be much more reliable?this is what I wanted to do/use but management told me to get flash drives.

John Innis?great reply thanks. I?ll pass this one to the idiots?er?I mean management.

Al Fuller?I?ll pass your info along if I am not able to access this drive after freezing it.

Thanks again.
tim

________________________________
From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, March 12, 2020 7:26 AM
To: Shop Talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives

Sending this inquiry to you all since I know there are more than a few IT guys in this group.....

I bought three 512GB flash drives for archiving here at work. One locked up in each of our offices and one for me to add to files as necessary as files are amended. They have approximately 450GB on them.

One of the three failed as soon as I finished filling it. I bought a different brand and made a replacement copy for the safe in our Madison office. A second, the same brand as the first one that failed is locked up in our MKE office and will also be replaced now because the third one (the one that has amended archived files) is also failing. I am having a hard time retrieving the amended files before this drive takes a final crap on me. It took over 15 hours to pull one 87MB file from the dying drive. I can't even attempt to pull more than one file at a time. Not that this should matter, but the files are mixed word, pdf, saved outlook emails and miscellaneous audio or video files and possibly other items.

What I am wondering/hoping is that someone might know of a solution to this nearly impossible retrieval process. Or am I just screwed here?

Next year we will be storing everything in the cloud so I won't have to deal with this PITA process.

Thanks
tim
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From eric at megageek.com  Sat Mar 14 09:36:30 2020
From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 11:36:30 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Eye Pro
Message-ID: <OFF69745FC.D3F71425-ON8525852B.004BDD6D-8525852B.0055BD52@mail.megageek.com>

Hello everyone,  I hope all are doing well as the stupid Covid-19 panic is 
sweeping the world. 

 I'm sure you are all getting more shop time.

I have a question about eye protection.  I ALWAYS wear eye pro in the 
shop, so they often get scratched and marred and need replacement.

What is a good method for eye pro?  Should I go cheap and just replace 
when they get scratched?  Or are there better quality ones out there that 
don't get scratch easily and can last longer?

And where is a good source to get them?

Thanks in advance.  Stay safe!

Eric
"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational 
being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
Waldo Emerson 
-Who is John Galt?
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From jem at milleredp.com  Sat Mar 14 10:10:38 2020
From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 09:10:38 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Eye Pro
In-Reply-To: <OFF69745FC.D3F71425-ON8525852B.004BDD6D-8525852B.0055BD52@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OFF69745FC.D3F71425-ON8525852B.004BDD6D-8525852B.0055BD52@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <c7e06962-5f25-732e-9f9f-0910f62c91f7@milleredp.com>

> What is a good method for eye pro? ?Should I go cheap and just replace 
> when they get scratched? ?Or are there better quality ones out there 
> that don't get scratch easily and can last longer?
> 
> And where is a good source to get them?

I just buy them in bulk from ULINE and toss when they're uglier than I 
want to try cleaning.

John.

From eric at megageek.com  Sat Mar 14 12:09:35 2020
From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 14:09:35 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Eye Pro
Message-ID: <OFFCDAC1BA.015B7BD0-ON8525852B.00639230-8525852B.0063C15A@mail.megageek.com>

Hello all, I'm sending this again because I didn't see it come through at 
all

Question about eye protection.

Is it better to get cheap ones and toss them when they get scratched or 
are there better quality ones that don't scratch as easy?

I am looking for a source to get more, but I was wondering what others may 
have found over the years.

Thanks.


"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational 
being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
Waldo Emerson 
-Who is John Galt?
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From fishplate at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 12:13:53 2020
From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 14:13:53 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Eye Pro
In-Reply-To: <c7e06962-5f25-732e-9f9f-0910f62c91f7@milleredp.com>
References: <OFF69745FC.D3F71425-ON8525852B.004BDD6D-8525852B.0055BD52@mail.megageek.com>
 <c7e06962-5f25-732e-9f9f-0910f62c91f7@milleredp.com>
Message-ID: <CAO8Q7CMS-ipMFr983CPcfgfiFo7hAvM5e_2LA1SCY2M8Gip0Cw@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Mar 14, 2020 at 12:11 PM John Miller via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> > What is a good method for eye pro?
>

Buy them in bulk so there's always a pair handy no matter where you're
working.  And wear them.


> > And where is a good source to get them?
>
> I just buy them in bulk from ULINE and toss when they're uglier than I
> want to try cleaning.
>

I recently took a tour of the BMW factory in South Carolina.  Best tour I
ever took, because they introduced me to a brand of safety glasses that
actually fit over my regular prescription glasses.

https://www.amazon.com/MCR-OG112AF-Safety-Glasses-Anti-Fog/dp/B07Q84TFDD?th=1

Once you know the make and model you want, Google Shopping is your friend.
 I can find these for less than $4 a pair, which makes them cheap enough to
buy in bulk, and cheap enough to toss when they are too nasty to see
through.

Make sure that whatever you buy has the proper ANSI rating and is from a
reputable source.  You can spend a lot on safety glasses and still spend
less than you would on a replacement eyeball.

Jeff Scarbrough
Corrosion Acres, Ga.
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From fishplate at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 12:15:34 2020
From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 14:15:34 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <CH2PR04MB6505B1BBDAB0253E53F6FB8DB4FB0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
 <CH2PR04MB6505B1BBDAB0253E53F6FB8DB4FB0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <CAO8Q7COa9r-1PdBS+Ry0peWRu9T58201+pPSL-sa=4hzGMss+A@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Mar 14, 2020 at 11:22 AM Tim . via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:


> A USB portable hard drive should be much more reliable?this is what I
> wanted to do/use but management told me to get flash drives.
>

I hope management have been informed of the cost of that decision.
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From tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com  Sat Mar 14 12:33:58 2020
From: tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com (Tim .)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 18:33:58 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <CAO8Q7COa9r-1PdBS+Ry0peWRu9T58201+pPSL-sa=4hzGMss+A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
 <CH2PR04MB6505B1BBDAB0253E53F6FB8DB4FB0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>,
 <CAO8Q7COa9r-1PdBS+Ry0peWRu9T58201+pPSL-sa=4hzGMss+A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <DM6PR04MB6511741FE83C14FBC81B39B9B4FB0@DM6PR04MB6511.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>

oh yea. I've told my supervisor where it most likely won't go anywhere else.

________________________________
From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> on behalf of Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2020 1:15 PM
To: shop-talk at autox.team.net <Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives



On Sat, Mar 14, 2020 at 11:22 AM Tim . via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net<mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:

A USB portable hard drive should be much more reliable?this is what I wanted to do/use but management told me to get flash drives.

I hope management have been informed of the cost of that decision.
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From tr3driver at ca.rr.com  Sat Mar 14 12:40:51 2020
From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 11:40:51 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Eye Pro
In-Reply-To: <OFFCDAC1BA.015B7BD0-ON8525852B.00639230-8525852B.0063C15A@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OFFCDAC1BA.015B7BD0-ON8525852B.00639230-8525852B.0063C15A@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <7E96B716-D157-46D6-83F2-807AE8EF2C49@ca.rr.com>

All glasses get scratched eventually. My experience has been that cheap ones are no worse than expensive ones in that regard.

But I worry that cheap ones are more likely to shatter when hit with something major. No evidence of that as yet, but something to think about. How much is your eyesight worth?
-- Randall

On 14 March 2020 11:09:35 GMT-07:00, eric--- via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>Hello all, I'm sending this again because I didn't see it come through
>at 
>all
>
>Question about eye protection.
>
>Is it better to get cheap ones and toss them when they get scratched or
>
>are there better quality ones that don't scratch as easy?
>
>I am looking for a source to get more, but I was wondering what others
>may 
>have found over the years.
>
>Thanks.
>
>
>"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a
>rational 
>being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
>Waldo Emerson 
>-Who is John Galt?
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From strovato at optonline.net  Sat Mar 14 12:44:33 2020
From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 14:44:33 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <CAOtbU9UHuwa5JmLsq5Q0ee6xPC7P5FLP+Lz95LL6+=AgbaNp8A@mail.g
 mail.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
 <CAOtbU9UHuwa5JmLsq5Q0ee6xPC7P5FLP+Lz95LL6+=AgbaNp8A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <E3.A4.27934.6362D6E5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net>

Why is that?  At first glance, I would think that something with no 
moving parts would be more reliable than something with moving parts, 
if both are manufactured to the same standard.

-Steve T.

At 02:57 PM 3/12/2020, Doug Braun via Shop-talk wrote:
>A USB portable hard drive (the real, spinning kind) should be much 
>more reliable than a run-of-the-mill USB flash drive, as long as you 
>don't handle it roughly.
>
>Doug


-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus


From patintexas at icloud.com  Sat Mar 14 12:50:39 2020
From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 13:50:39 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Eye Pro
In-Reply-To: <7E96B716-D157-46D6-83F2-807AE8EF2C49@ca.rr.com>
References: <7E96B716-D157-46D6-83F2-807AE8EF2C49@ca.rr.com>
Message-ID: <B10D0129-C466-4779-9AFB-3F8F1BA7FDEC@icloud.com>

I wear safety regular glasses all the time. I don?t keep the side shields on them unless I am grinding or such. My glasses insurance covers one replacement lens set and/or frame per year. Hardly ever use regular safety glasses except when weed eating or working under vehicles. 

Peace,
Pat

Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


> On Mar 14, 2020, at 1:41 PM, Randall via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 

?All glasses get scratched eventually. My experience has been that cheap ones are no worse than expensive ones in that regard.

But I worry that cheap ones are more likely to shatter when hit with something major. No evidence of that as yet, but something to think about. How much is your eyesight worth?
-- Randall

> On 14 March 2020 11:09:35 GMT-07:00, eric--- via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> Hello all, I'm sending this again because I didn't see it come through at all 
> 
> Question about eye protection. 
> 
> Is it better to get cheap ones and toss them when they get scratched or are there better quality ones that don't scratch as easy? 
> 
> I am looking for a source to get more, but I was wondering what others may have found over the years. 
> 
> Thanks. 
> 
> 
> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson 
> -Who is John Galt?
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com

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From fishplate at gmail.com  Sat Mar 14 12:57:08 2020
From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 14:57:08 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <E3.A4.27934.6362D6E5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net>
References: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
 <CAOtbU9UHuwa5JmLsq5Q0ee6xPC7P5FLP+Lz95LL6+=AgbaNp8A@mail.gmail.com>
 <E3.A4.27934.6362D6E5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net>
Message-ID: <CAO8Q7CP_50PcgoKMLG6wTPmP-aJwz_VcD=69Gt7kOPw626adsA@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Mar 14, 2020 at 2:45 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Why is that?  At first glance, I would think that something with no
> moving parts would be more reliable than something with moving parts,
> if both are manufactured to the same standard.


Flash memory has a limited number of read-write cycles.  It's usually a
large number, but the process is inherently riskier than magnetic memory
(or so I'm told).

Modern hard drives park the heads when it's not in operation, so if the
drive isn't spinning, it's difficult to damage the media short of a long
drop or submersion.
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From patintexas at icloud.com  Sat Mar 14 13:06:22 2020
From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 14:06:22 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <CAO8Q7CP_50PcgoKMLG6wTPmP-aJwz_VcD=69Gt7kOPw626adsA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAO8Q7CP_50PcgoKMLG6wTPmP-aJwz_VcD=69Gt7kOPw626adsA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <A78F1AE2-37D0-4E75-940E-3DE496B267A9@icloud.com>

My understanding of flash drive wear out is that it?s not as bad as it seems. While the write count is in the thousands, it takes a long time to get there. The flash file system spreads the writes - even rewrites out to even out the writes on the media. Let?s say you have a number that you increment as a counter. Each time it is rewritten it is written in a different place, making the drives pretty robust. Another thing, when a location eventually dies, the previous data is still there, just becomes read only, so the data can bee retrieved. 

Peace,
Pat

Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


> On Mar 14, 2020, at 1:57 PM, Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 

?


> On Sat, Mar 14, 2020 at 2:45 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> Why is that?  At first glance, I would think that something with no 
> moving parts would be more reliable than something with moving parts, 
> if both are manufactured to the same standard.

Flash memory has a limited number of read-write cycles.  It's usually a large number, but the process is inherently riskier than magnetic memory (or so I'm told).

Modern hard drives park the heads when it's not in operation, so if the drive isn't spinning, it's difficult to damage the media short of a long drop or submersion.   
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com

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From jem at milleredp.com  Sat Mar 14 14:26:25 2020
From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller)
Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2020 13:26:25 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Eye Pro
In-Reply-To: <CAO8Q7CMS-ipMFr983CPcfgfiFo7hAvM5e_2LA1SCY2M8Gip0Cw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <OFF69745FC.D3F71425-ON8525852B.004BDD6D-8525852B.0055BD52@mail.megageek.com>
 <c7e06962-5f25-732e-9f9f-0910f62c91f7@milleredp.com>
 <CAO8Q7CMS-ipMFr983CPcfgfiFo7hAvM5e_2LA1SCY2M8Gip0Cw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <3e7b9f76-9fb1-0978-4ade-0520a083a802@milleredp.com>

On 3/14/2020 11:13 AM, Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk wrote:
> You can spend a lot on safety glasses and still spend less than you 
> would on a replacement eyeball.

Word.

John.

From jamesf at groupwbench.org  Sun Mar 15 11:35:31 2020
From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2020 13:35:31 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Quarantine project fun
Message-ID: <4A0B3CC4-BCB6-4D6D-90CF-8B63DB6BC2ED@groupwbench.org>

A friend gave another friend an old Weber gas grill. New recipient somehow proceeds to set it on fire and demands giver come get it and take it away. Third friend (me) is tired of the bickering and retrieves it and keeps it. 

Over the winter I bought new burners, knobs, igniter, full gas tank. Assembled it all today. Turn it on. Foomp burner one. Foomp burner two. Foomp burner three.

There are only two burners.

Turns out the valve is clamped on to the manifold by one screw, and years of manipulating the valve knob had loosened the screw enough to open a sizable gap between the valve and manifold. 

In hindsight I probably should not have tested it in the garage, but at least I could see the flames, something that later proved impossible in the bright sun during test fire #2 (successful). 

jim
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From dreinsch at swbell.net  Sun Mar 15 13:30:31 2020
From: dreinsch at swbell.net (Dwade Reinsch)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2020 15:30:31 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Quarantine project fun
In-Reply-To: <4A0B3CC4-BCB6-4D6D-90CF-8B63DB6BC2ED@groupwbench.org>
References: <4A0B3CC4-BCB6-4D6D-90CF-8B63DB6BC2ED@groupwbench.org>
Message-ID: <A95004F9-649D-41E2-A640-6A5FCA5611DB@swbell.net>

Who is test number two successful because the Weber did catch on fire! Or because it didn?t catch on fire!?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 15, 2020, at 1:35 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> ?A friend gave another friend an old Weber gas grill. New recipient somehow proceeds to set it on fire and demands giver come get it and take it away. Third friend (me) is tired of the bickering and retrieves it and keeps it. 
> 
> Over the winter I bought new burners, knobs, igniter, full gas tank. Assembled it all today. Turn it on. Foomp burner one. Foomp burner two. Foomp burner three.
> 
> There are only two burners.
> 
> Turns out the valve is clamped on to the manifold by one screw, and years of manipulating the valve knob had loosened the screw enough to open a sizable gap between the valve and manifold. 
> 
> In hindsight I probably should not have tested it in the garage, but at least I could see the flames, something that later proved impossible in the bright sun during test fire #2 (successful). 
> 
> jim_______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dreinsch at swbell.net
> 


From dreinsch at swbell.net  Sun Mar 15 13:30:31 2020
From: dreinsch at swbell.net (Dwade Reinsch)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2020 15:30:31 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Quarantine project fun
In-Reply-To: <4A0B3CC4-BCB6-4D6D-90CF-8B63DB6BC2ED@groupwbench.org>
References: <4A0B3CC4-BCB6-4D6D-90CF-8B63DB6BC2ED@groupwbench.org>
Message-ID: <A95004F9-649D-41E2-A640-6A5FCA5611DB@swbell.net>

Who is test number two successful because the Weber did catch on fire! Or because it didn?t catch on fire!?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 15, 2020, at 1:35 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> ?A friend gave another friend an old Weber gas grill. New recipient somehow proceeds to set it on fire and demands giver come get it and take it away. Third friend (me) is tired of the bickering and retrieves it and keeps it. 
> 
> Over the winter I bought new burners, knobs, igniter, full gas tank. Assembled it all today. Turn it on. Foomp burner one. Foomp burner two. Foomp burner three.
> 
> There are only two burners.
> 
> Turns out the valve is clamped on to the manifold by one screw, and years of manipulating the valve knob had loosened the screw enough to open a sizable gap between the valve and manifold. 
> 
> In hindsight I probably should not have tested it in the garage, but at least I could see the flames, something that later proved impossible in the bright sun during test fire #2 (successful). 
> 
> jim_______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dreinsch at swbell.net
> 


From jamesf at groupwbench.org  Sun Mar 15 13:38:46 2020
From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2020 15:38:46 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Quarantine project fun
In-Reply-To: <A95004F9-649D-41E2-A640-6A5FCA5611DB@swbell.net>
References: <4A0B3CC4-BCB6-4D6D-90CF-8B63DB6BC2ED@groupwbench.org>
 <A95004F9-649D-41E2-A640-6A5FCA5611DB@swbell.net>
Message-ID: <6BF2A244-ABF0-4D4C-BD76-094E52BF5B85@groupwbench.org>

It didn't. Re-using the old seals worked, at least well enough to not leak combustible amounts of gas. I was able to use a piece of cardboard to shade the sun and confirm flame was everywhere it should be and nowhere it shouldn't. 

jim

> On Mar 15, 2020, at 3:30 PM, Dwade Reinsch <dreinsch at swbell.net> wrote:
> 
> Who is test number two successful because the Weber did catch on fire! Or because it didn?t catch on fire!?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Mar 15, 2020, at 1:35 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>> 
>> ?A friend gave another friend an old Weber gas grill. New recipient somehow proceeds to set it on fire and demands giver come get it and take it away. Third friend (me) is tired of the bickering and retrieves it and keeps it. 
>> 
>> Over the winter I bought new burners, knobs, igniter, full gas tank. Assembled it all today. Turn it on. Foomp burner one. Foomp burner two. Foomp burner three.
>> 
>> There are only two burners.
>> 
>> Turns out the valve is clamped on to the manifold by one screw, and years of manipulating the valve knob had loosened the screw enough to open a sizable gap between the valve and manifold. 
>> 
>> In hindsight I probably should not have tested it in the garage, but at least I could see the flames, something that later proved impossible in the bright sun during test fire #2 (successful). 
>> 
>> jim_______________________________________________
>> 
>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>> 
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dreinsch at swbell.net
>> 
> 

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From nogera at icloud.com  Sun Mar 15 22:12:01 2020
From: nogera at icloud.com (Robert Nogueirao)
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2020 23:12:01 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Fence posts
Message-ID: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>


Folks, I have a 4 foot high cedar wood fence in bad shape that I need to fix. While I will replacing the rails and pickets with new wood the posts appear to be in good condition,  ie: no rot, except for the fact they are set in concrete and the posts have shrunk a bit so the posts are loose on the concrete.
What would be the easiest way to firm up the posts in those holes? 
I?m only looking for a fix that will last 5 or so years.
Bob Nogueira 

From fishplate at gmail.com  Mon Mar 16 04:15:11 2020
From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 06:15:11 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Fence posts
In-Reply-To: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>
References: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <CAO8Q7CPtuC9AGmEaW0As-pYvLTtPbGoHbMSTK4YLakJWh9W41w@mail.gmail.com>

How about some plastic door/window shims?  Cheap enough, and you should be
able to jam them between the post and the concrete.  Bonus is you can use
two or four per hole if you need to plumb it up.  (Two, assuming the rails
will hold it plum from side to side, otherwise four to hold it
independently of the efence).

Jeff Scarbrough
Corrosion Acres, Ga.

On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 12:12 AM Robert Nogueirao via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

>
> Folks, I have a 4 foot high cedar wood fence in bad shape that I need to
> fix. While I will replacing the rails and pickets with new wood the posts
> appear to be in good condition,  ie: no rot, except for the fact they are
> set in concrete and the posts have shrunk a bit so the posts are loose on
> the concrete.
> What would be the easiest way to firm up the posts in those holes?
> I?m only looking for a fix that will last 5 or so years.
> Bob Nogueira
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate at gmail.com
>
>
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From jamesf at groupwbench.org  Mon Mar 16 05:41:48 2020
From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 07:41:48 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Fence posts
In-Reply-To: <CAO8Q7CPtuC9AGmEaW0As-pYvLTtPbGoHbMSTK4YLakJWh9W41w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>
 <CAO8Q7CPtuC9AGmEaW0As-pYvLTtPbGoHbMSTK4YLakJWh9W41w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <15323895-B348-48A3-85B6-452A203E1909@groupwbench.org>

I would do this, even cedar shims would likely last long enough, or pour more cement (with no aggregate) into the gaps. 

jim

> On Mar 16, 2020, at 6:15 AM, Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> How about some plastic door/window shims?  Cheap enough, and you should be able to jam them between the post and the concrete.  Bonus is you can use two or four per hole if you need to plumb it up.  (Two, assuming the rails will hold it plum from side to side, otherwise four to hold it independently of the efence).
> 
> Jeff Scarbrough
> Corrosion Acres, Ga.
> 
> On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 12:12 AM Robert Nogueirao via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:
> 
> Folks, I have a 4 foot high cedar wood fence in bad shape that I need to fix. While I will replacing the rails and pickets with new wood the posts appear to be in good condition,  ie: no rot, except for the fact they are set in concrete and the posts have shrunk a bit so the posts are loose on the concrete.
> What would be the easiest way to firm up the posts in those holes? 
> I?m only looking for a fix that will last 5 or so years.
> Bob Nogueira 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html <http://www.team.net/donate.html>
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk <http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk> http://autox.team.net/archive <http://autox.team.net/archive>
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate at gmail.com <http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate at gmail.com>
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jamesf at groupwbench.org
> 

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From nick at landform.co.uk  Mon Mar 16 06:06:04 2020
From: nick at landform.co.uk (nick brearley)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 12:06:04 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] Fence posts
In-Reply-To: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>
References: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <80caa4e4-a869-3ed8-726c-b1780d300b5c@landform.co.uk>

I would try expanding pu foam. Used it in the past for similar needs and 
been surprised at its durability. Got the idea after seeing it used for 
fixing median safety barriers. Concrete block cast in the ground with a 
hole in, post dropped in the hole during fence fix then foamed into 
place. Got the impression it was a temporary job during road works. But 
even so it was beside live traffic so you imagine somebody signed it off 
as suitable.

Cheap and easy.

Nick Brearley

On 16/03/2020 04:12, Robert Nogueirao via Shop-talk wrote:
> Folks, I have a 4 foot high cedar wood fence in bad shape that I need to fix. While I will replacing the rails and pickets with new wood the posts appear to be in good condition,  ie: no rot, except for the fact they are set in concrete and the posts have shrunk a bit so the posts are loose on the concrete.
> What would be the easiest way to firm up the posts in those holes?
> I?m only looking for a fix that will last 5 or so years.
> Bob Nogueira
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/nick at landform.co.uk
>


From dirtbeard at gmail.com  Mon Mar 16 06:20:19 2020
From: dirtbeard at gmail.com (old dirtbeard)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 05:20:19 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Fence posts
In-Reply-To: <80caa4e4-a869-3ed8-726c-b1780d300b5c@landform.co.uk>
References: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>
 <80caa4e4-a869-3ed8-726c-b1780d300b5c@landform.co.uk>
Message-ID: <CAG1pxgaCSsTh_Jf4VpVMmq0wruPF7E=Y6ZB=7nyXSK3YtNyfdA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Bob,

I have not tried it for your particular application here, but polymeric
sand might work well. It is the sand that you use to lock pavers into place:

https://www.acehardware.com/departments/building-supplies/concrete-cement-and-masonry/sand-and-gravel/5409594?x429=true&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI55_S5_ye6AIVlBh9Ch3YfAHlEAQYASABEgKeCPD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds



On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 5:06 AM nick brearley via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> I would try expanding pu foam. Used it in the past for similar needs and
> been surprised at its durability. Got the idea after seeing it used for
> fixing median safety barriers. Concrete block cast in the ground with a
> hole in, post dropped in the hole during fence fix then foamed into
> place. Got the impression it was a temporary job during road works. But
> even so it was beside live traffic so you imagine somebody signed it off
> as suitable.
>
> Cheap and easy.
>
> Nick Brearley
>
> On 16/03/2020 04:12, Robert Nogueirao via Shop-talk wrote:
> > Folks, I have a 4 foot high cedar wood fence in bad shape that I need to
> fix. While I will replacing the rails and pickets with new wood the posts
> appear to be in good condition,  ie: no rot, except for the fact they are
> set in concrete and the posts have shrunk a bit so the posts are loose on
> the concrete.
> > What would be the easiest way to firm up the posts in those holes?
> > I?m only looking for a fix that will last 5 or so years.
> > Bob Nogueira
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> > Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
> >
> > Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/nick at landform.co.uk
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard at gmail.com
>
>
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From jem at milleredp.com  Mon Mar 16 09:39:02 2020
From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 08:39:02 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Fence posts
In-Reply-To: <CAO8Q7CPtuC9AGmEaW0As-pYvLTtPbGoHbMSTK4YLakJWh9W41w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>
 <CAO8Q7CPtuC9AGmEaW0As-pYvLTtPbGoHbMSTK4YLakJWh9W41w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <ad232343-627e-4e0d-bbb6-f34e625fd56c@milleredp.com>

On 3/16/2020 3:15 AM, Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk wrote:
> How about some plastic door/window shims? 

I was thinking Simpson foundation epoxy.

John.

From shop-talk2 at mcfetridge.org  Mon Mar 16 10:43:21 2020
From: shop-talk2 at mcfetridge.org (Ian McFetridge)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 12:43:21 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Fence posts
In-Reply-To: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>
References: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <CAFnfnRVrPwVOYD42HgjH_j0RKt9yx_HwrAR4ZNMcMFvBNzAh3Q@mail.gmail.com>

I've used crushed granite (fine gray gravel) for this on my posts.  In
fact, I only used concrete on the corners and the line posts are just set
in CG.  The upside is that it self-settles around the post and is easy to
top-off.  Note, this is crushed granite, which forms a hard pack versus
composed granite, which makes for soft walking paths.

On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 12:12 AM Robert Nogueirao via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

>
> Folks, I have a 4 foot high cedar wood fence in bad shape that I need to
> fix. While I will replacing the rails and pickets with new wood the posts
> appear to be in good condition,  ie: no rot, except for the fact they are
> set in concrete and the posts have shrunk a bit so the posts are loose on
> the concrete.
> What would be the easiest way to firm up the posts in those holes?
> I?m only looking for a fix that will last 5 or so years.
> Bob Nogueira
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shop-talk2 at mcfetridge.org
>
>
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From alfuller194 at gmail.com  Mon Mar 16 12:14:26 2020
From: alfuller194 at gmail.com (alfuller194 at gmail.com)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 14:14:26 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <CAO8Q7CP_50PcgoKMLG6wTPmP-aJwz_VcD=69Gt7kOPw626adsA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
 <CAOtbU9UHuwa5JmLsq5Q0ee6xPC7P5FLP+Lz95LL6+=AgbaNp8A@mail.gmail.com>
 <E3.A4.27934.6362D6E5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net>
 <CAO8Q7CP_50PcgoKMLG6wTPmP-aJwz_VcD=69Gt7kOPw626adsA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <02c401d5fbbe$bab46440$301d2cc0$@gmail.com>

This discussion of using flash [or other electronic non-volatile memory for storage] reminds me of how we used to treat magnetic tape used for backups. Since it was known to have a limited number of cycles, we kept track of use, and retired the media BEFORE it began to show symptoms of degrading.  I suspect people still using tape continue to actively manage the media?

 

----------------

All the best,

 

Al Fuller

 

From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> On Behalf Of Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk
Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2020 2:57 PM
To: Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives

 

 

 

On Sat, Mar 14, 2020 at 2:45 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net> > wrote:

Why is that?  At first glance, I would think that something with no 
moving parts would be more reliable than something with moving parts, 
if both are manufactured to the same standard.

 

Flash memory has a limited number of read-write cycles.  It's usually a large number, but the process is inherently riskier than magnetic memory (or so I'm told).

 

Modern hard drives park the heads when it's not in operation, so if the drive isn't spinning, it's difficult to damage the media short of a long drop or submersion.   

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From alfuller194 at gmail.com  Mon Mar 16 12:24:26 2020
From: alfuller194 at gmail.com (alfuller194 at gmail.com)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 14:24:26 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Eye Pro
In-Reply-To: <3e7b9f76-9fb1-0978-4ade-0520a083a802@milleredp.com>
References: <OFF69745FC.D3F71425-ON8525852B.004BDD6D-8525852B.0055BD52@mail.megageek.com>
 <c7e06962-5f25-732e-9f9f-0910f62c91f7@milleredp.com>
 <CAO8Q7CMS-ipMFr983CPcfgfiFo7hAvM5e_2LA1SCY2M8Gip0Cw@mail.gmail.com>
 <3e7b9f76-9fb1-0978-4ade-0520a083a802@milleredp.com>
Message-ID: <02cb01d5fbc0$2054ab10$60fe0130$@gmail.com>

What he said... 

I was hit directly in the eye on a racquetball court twice in a long playing
career. Once I had on eyeguards, and (only) had to have my face x-rayed to
ensure the orbit socket wasn't broken. One of the few times I didn't have
them on I got hit and lost sight in the eye. Luckily it came back (with some
permanent loss of vision), and I have never been on a court - even to
practice - without eyeguards in 20+ years. 

In the shop, there is a pair sitting literally ON the grinder, and several
pair hanging on a curtain rod in the top tool box.  

----------------
All the best,

Al Fuller

-----Original Message-----
From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> On Behalf Of John Miller
via Shop-talk
Sent: Saturday, March 14, 2020 4:26 PM
To: shop-talk at autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Eye Pro

On 3/14/2020 11:13 AM, Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk wrote:
> You can spend a lot on safety glasses and still spend less than you 
> would on a replacement eyeball.

Word.

John.
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/alfuller194 at gmail.com



From jem at milleredp.com  Mon Mar 16 12:30:40 2020
From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 11:30:40 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Eye Pro
In-Reply-To: <02cb01d5fbc0$2054ab10$60fe0130$@gmail.com>
References: <OFF69745FC.D3F71425-ON8525852B.004BDD6D-8525852B.0055BD52@mail.megageek.com>
 <c7e06962-5f25-732e-9f9f-0910f62c91f7@milleredp.com>
 <CAO8Q7CMS-ipMFr983CPcfgfiFo7hAvM5e_2LA1SCY2M8Gip0Cw@mail.gmail.com>
 <3e7b9f76-9fb1-0978-4ade-0520a083a802@milleredp.com>
 <02cb01d5fbc0$2054ab10$60fe0130$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <5ae0f6ec-fa0c-ccaa-8c71-4dce0d158435@milleredp.com>

On 3/16/2020 11:24 AM, Al Fuller via Shop-talk wrote:
> What he said...
> 
> I was hit directly in the eye on a racquetball court twice in a long playing
> career. Once I had on eyeguards, and (only) had to have my face x-rayed to
> ensure the orbit socket wasn't broken. One of the few times I didn't have
> them on I got hit and lost sight in the eye. Luckily it came back (with some
> permanent loss of vision), and I have never been on a court - even to
> practice - without eyeguards in 20+ years.
> 
> In the shop, there is a pair sitting literally ON the grinder, and several
> pair hanging on a curtain rod in the top tool box.

I'll throw these out there, as they're what I've ordered at times:

https://www.uline.com/BL_8952/Uline-Economy-Safety-Goggles

The basic answer if you need something that fits over glasses, do not 
need splash protection, and is readily disposable if abraded.

John.

From pethier7 at gmail.com  Mon Mar 16 12:34:26 2020
From: pethier7 at gmail.com (Philip Ethier)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 13:34:26 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
Message-ID: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>

Covid-19 is around.  How are you doing?

-- 
Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA
1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue
2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red
2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl
2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White
2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White
http://www.mnautox.com
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From patintexas at icloud.com  Mon Mar 16 12:40:49 2020
From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 13:40:49 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <05611C39-3E93-4316-B5AC-4D0BCF74E693@icloud.com>

Just finishing off a case of Strep Throat so I?m planning on delaying Corvid-19 for a bit. Seriously, not counting the military-controlled folks there are 4 cases within 50 mile radius of me, 20 miles south of austin tx. 

Peace,
Pat

Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


> On Mar 16, 2020, at 1:34 PM, Philip Ethier via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 

?
Covid-19 is around.  How are you doing?

-- 
Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA
1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue
2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red
2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl
2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White
2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White
http://www.mnautox.com
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com

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From maynerdfamily at msn.com  Mon Mar 16 12:43:25 2020
From: maynerdfamily at msn.com (Brian and Wendy)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 18:43:25 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>

Doing ok in Nampa, ID. Wondering with amazement at the folks that are panic buying toilet paper. Man, we would have a heck of a time in this country if we were ever faced with an actual crisis.

Brian Warrick
Nampa, ID

________________________________
From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> on behalf of Philip Ethier via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Sent: Monday, March 16, 2020 12:34 PM
To: Shop-Talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?

Covid-19 is around.  How are you doing?

--
Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA
1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue
2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red
2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl
2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White
2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White
http://www.mnautox.com<http://www.mnautox.com/>
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From fishplate at gmail.com  Mon Mar 16 12:49:10 2020
From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 14:49:10 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO8Q7CORrvdVUwyPZbT_A4Ocr71VEQxb=fkFgMDkN-naH58q6A@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 2:34 PM Philip Ethier via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Covid-19 is around.  How are you doing?
>

Terrible cold/allergies.  Pollen season began last week.  I can do without
the virus.

3 cases of COVID-19 reported in our area (within 10 mile radius).  No
details yet on who they are or where they have been, so everyone is on
edge.  Social Distancing is working OK so far.  Schools are
closed, including the University,, and almost 40 different restaurants have
closed their dining rooms but offer call ahead/curbside pickup, so you can
still get a meal.   My burrito place has the dining room still open, but
the salsa bar is gone, plus all of the lids, condiments, etc are behind the
counter.  Everything is served in a single-use bag now instead of on a
tray.  Makes sense to me.

We are supposed to be practicing telework today, to see if the system can
handle it, but my job doesn't lend itself to that many days, including this
one.
Mostly, it's just eerily quiet for a college town.

Jeff Scarbrough
Corrosion Acres, Ga.
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From jdinnis at gmail.com  Mon Mar 16 12:50:16 2020
From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 13:50:16 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>

Lots of precaution around Iowa, very little actual infection.  I think we
are still fewer than 25 cases in the state so far.  Schools are all closed
around here.  Our office has implemented optional work form home and
mandatory quarantine for returning travelers.  No outbound travel
permitted.  Hopefully the prevention has kicked in and we won't see a bunch
of new cases around here.

On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 1:34 PM Philip Ethier via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Covid-19 is around.  How are you doing?
>
> --
> Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA
> 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue
> 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red
> 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl
> 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White
> 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White
> http://www.mnautox.com
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com
>
>

-- 
=================================
= Never offend people with style when you   =
= can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =
=================================
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From rwil at sbcglobal.net  Mon Mar 16 14:24:09 2020
From: rwil at sbcglobal.net (rwil at sbcglobal.net)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 13:24:09 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <imnv6f52as7ncdrurnmfgjjr98psohns65@4ax.com>

Currently 39 cases in San Diego County (CA).  That is about a 50 mile
radius.  "House arrest" sucks but I'm 82 and staying put.  With test
kits more available and drive-in sites being set up over the weekend,
more accurate numbers should be appearing soon.  

-Roland Wilhelmy

On Mon, 16 Mar 2020 13:34:26 -0500, Phil wrote:

>Covid-19 is around.  How are you doing?

-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus


From 1789alpine at gmail.com  Mon Mar 16 14:24:31 2020
From: 1789alpine at gmail.com (Jim Stone)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 16:24:31 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>

All is well in Southampton, with only one community spread case in the area, although we worry how much longer that will last.  It is starting to feel like summer in the Hamptons, as everyone with summer homes has decided this is a better place to be than New York City and surrounding areas.  What they bring with them is the concern, especially as our hospital is pretty much sized for the year round population, not the rich and famous who spend their summers - and now, virus shutdowns - with us.  Still, my family (daughter, son-in-law and granddaughter have joined the exodus and are staying with us for the duration) are all safe and healthy.  Long may that continue!

Hope everyone else stays well, too.  

> On Mar 16, 2020, at 2:50 PM, John Innis via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> Lots of precaution around Iowa, very little actual infection.  I think we are still fewer than 25 cases in the state so far.  Schools are all closed around here.  Our office has implemented optional work form home and mandatory quarantine for returning travelers.  No outbound travel permitted.  Hopefully the prevention has kicked in and we won't see a bunch of new cases around here.
> 
> On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 1:34 PM Philip Ethier via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:
> Covid-19 is around.  How are you doing?
> 
> -- 
> Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA
> 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue
> 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red
> 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl
> 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White
> 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White
> http://www.mnautox.com <http://www.mnautox.com/>
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html <http://www.team.net/donate.html>
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk <http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk> http://autox.team.net/archive <http://autox.team.net/archive>
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com <http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com>
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> =================================
> = Never offend people with style when you   =
> = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =
> =================================
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html <http://www.team.net/donate.html>
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk <http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk> http://autox.team.net/archive <http://autox.team.net/archive>
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine at gmail.com <http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine at gmail.com>
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From phoenix722 at comcast.net  Mon Mar 16 15:23:19 2020
From: phoenix722 at comcast.net (Mike Sinclair)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 14:23:19 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>

Here in the US Ground Zero (Seattle), everything is shut down.? They are 
even talking about an evening curfew.? Not a whole lot one can do except 
be safe and use common sense.? Here in King County we have 420 cases, 
with 37 confirmed deaths, almost all of them in people with compromised 
health to begin with.? Not sure what it means to be ''confirmed dead''.

Mike

On 3/16/2020 1:24 PM, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote:
> All is well in Southampton, with only one community spread case in the 
> area, although we worry how much longer that will last. ?It is 
> starting to feel like summer in the Hamptons, as everyone with summer 
> homes has decided this is a better place to be than New York City and 
> surrounding areas. ?What they bring with them is the concern, 
> especially as our hospital is pretty much sized for the year round 
> population, not the rich and famous who spend their summers - and now, 
> virus shutdowns - with us. ?Still, my family (daughter, son-in-law and 
> granddaughter have joined the exodus and are staying with us for the 
> duration) are all safe and healthy. ?Long may that continue!
>
> Hope everyone else stays well, too.
>
>> On Mar 16, 2020, at 2:50 PM, John Innis via Shop-talk 
>> <shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>>
>> Lots of precaution around Iowa, very little actual infection.? I 
>> think we are still fewer than 25 cases in the state so far. Schools 
>> are all closed around here.? Our office has implemented optional work 
>> form home and mandatory quarantine for returning travelers.? No 
>> outbound travel permitted.? Hopefully the prevention has kicked in 
>> and we won't see a bunch of new cases around here.
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 1:34 PM Philip Ethier via Shop-talk 
>> <shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>>
>>     Covid-19 is around.? How are you doing?
>>
>>     --
>>     Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA
>>     1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue
>>     2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red
>>     2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl
>>     2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White
>>     2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White
>>     http://www.mnautox.com <http://www.mnautox.com/>
>>     _______________________________________________
>>
>>     Shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
>>     Donate:http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>     Suggested annual donation? $12.96
>>     Archive:http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talkhttp://autox.team.net/archive
>>
>>     Unsubscribe/Manage:http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> =================================
>> = Never offend people with style when you?? =
>> = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown? =
>> =================================
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
>> Donate:http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation ?$12.96
>> Archive:http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talkhttp://autox.team.net/archive
>>
>> Unsubscribe/Manage:http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine at gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/phoenix722 at comcast.net
>


-- 
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From 1789alpine at gmail.com  Mon Mar 16 15:25:41 2020
From: 1789alpine at gmail.com (Jim Stone)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 17:25:41 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
 <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <667CD5DA-CEC8-41BE-B508-92C72DC10A04@gmail.com>

I should also add that, at 67, I really hate hearing ?over 60? and ?elderly? being used interchangeably.  Still, I guess the shoe fits.

> On Mar 16, 2020, at 5:23 PM, Mike Sinclair via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> Here in the US Ground Zero (Seattle), everything is shut down.  They are even talking about an evening curfew.  Not a whole lot one can do except be safe and use common sense.  Here in King County we have 420 cases, with 37 confirmed deaths, almost all of them in people with compromised health to begin with.  Not sure what it means to be ''confirmed dead''.
> 
> Mike
> 
> On 3/16/2020 1:24 PM, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote:
>> All is well in Southampton, with only one community spread case in the area, although we worry how much longer that will last.  It is starting to feel like summer in the Hamptons, as everyone with summer homes has decided this is a better place to be than New York City and surrounding areas.  What they bring with them is the concern, especially as our hospital is pretty much sized for the year round population, not the rich and famous who spend their summers - and now, virus shutdowns - with us.  Still, my family (daughter, son-in-law and granddaughter have joined the exodus and are staying with us for the duration) are all safe and healthy.  Long may that continue!
>> 
>> Hope everyone else stays well, too.  
>> 
>>> On Mar 16, 2020, at 2:50 PM, John Innis via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Lots of precaution around Iowa, very little actual infection.  I think we are still fewer than 25 cases in the state so far.  Schools are all closed around here.  Our office has implemented optional work form home and mandatory quarantine for returning travelers.  No outbound travel permitted.  Hopefully the prevention has kicked in and we won't see a bunch of new cases around here.
>>> 
>>> On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 1:34 PM Philip Ethier via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>>> Covid-19 is around.  How are you doing?
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA
>>> 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue
>>> 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red
>>> 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl
>>> 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White
>>> 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White
>>> http://www.mnautox.com <http://www.mnautox.com/>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> 
>>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html <http://www.team.net/donate.html>
>>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk <http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk> http://autox.team.net/archive <http://autox.team.net/archive>
>>> 
>>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com <http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> =================================
>>> = Never offend people with style when you   =
>>> = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =
>>> =================================
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> 
>>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html <http://www.team.net/donate.html>
>>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk <http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk> http://autox.team.net/archive <http://autox.team.net/archive>
>>> 
>>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine at gmail.com <http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine at gmail.com>
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> 
>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html <http://www.team.net/donate.html>
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk <http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk> http://autox.team.net/archive <http://autox.team.net/archive>
>> 
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/phoenix722 at comcast.net <http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/phoenix722 at comcast.net>
>> 
> 
>  <http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient>	Virus-free. www.avg.com <http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=emailclient> <x-msg://45/#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>_______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine at gmail.com
> 

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From dhlocker at comcast.net  Mon Mar 16 17:09:30 2020
From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 19:09:30 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <cf46760d-f600-7c22-0662-852fc72db301@comcast.net>

South East Michigan is mostly OK. Several known cases in Washtenaw 
County, but so far so good. I'm with Jim Stone about the "over 60" bit 
(I'm just a couple of months shy of 68 now) and am not nearly "elderly."

Michigan is in lockdown for gathering places that can host more than 50 
people. Smaller places are supposed to keep at less than 50% capacity, 
and restaurants are to only do takeout or delivery, so basically 
EVERYONE is down. Schools, SSA offices (I just retired,) restaurants, 
bars, theaters, ... The ballet company with which I perform has 
postponed its Spring performances and the studio is shut down. The whole 
town is eerily quiet.

Keep safe; keep healthy all,
Donald.
--
*Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
() no proprietary attachments; no html mail
/\ <https://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml>

On 2020-03-16 2:34 p.m., Philip Ethier via Shop-talk wrote:
> Covid-19 is around.? How are you doing?
> 
> -- 
> Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA
> 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue
> 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red
> 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl
> 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White
> 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White
> http://www.mnautox.com <http://www.mnautox.com/>
> 

From eric at megageek.com  Mon Mar 16 17:39:13 2020
From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 19:39:13 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>

Brian writes...

> Wondering with amazement at the folks that are panic buying toilet 
paper. Man, we would have a heck of a time in this country if we were ever 
faced with an actual crisis.

You said it!  I work for the NJ State Police in the Intelligence Center. 
The Governor and his staff is now there daily. 

The real problem is the media using this as a ratings grab across the 
world.  Look at the numbers, the number of people that died of the flu, in 
the US only, this year exceeds total worldwide fatalities by ORDERS of 
magnitude.  Every year, we see this activity.  But, because this one has a 
different signature, lets all lose our minds.

Business are going to go under, and people are not going to be able to pay 
their bills and can lose their homes as a result of the panic they are 
instilling.

This is no different then swine flu, bird flu, Sars, or any of the other 
types of outbreaks we have recently had.  But this one has the media 
waging the dog.

/soapbox



"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational 
being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
Waldo Emerson 
-Who is John Galt?
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From jniolon at att.net  Mon Mar 16 17:41:24 2020
From: jniolon at att.net (john niolon)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 18:41:24 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] corona lock down
References: <383C680A6CB44998A87CE7E168679624.ref@Johnsdesktop>
Message-ID: <383C680A6CB44998A87CE7E168679624@Johnsdesktop>

here in Alabama a total of 22 cases state wide.... 17 in Jefferson county (b?ham area... MY area) all the schools, daycares kindergartens shut down toll 4/7/20    ... everyone that can working from home   
Jeffco announced today that gatherings of more than 25 people prohibited and all bars/restaurants are limited to carry out or deliveries  and deliveries are frowned on.

they will re-evaluate restaurant situation in one week... several drive in test sites, one sponsored by my church (Church of the Highlands)  We have 22 locations in the state and in 20 of the correctional facilities... everything went online yesterday... no large group meets.  

Grocery stores are getting picked over in meat dept ( there was one pack of organic hot dogs in a space that used to hold a hundred... one pack of baloney and the lunch meat was just about gone...kids lunches cleaned that out probably.  paper products were thin, still got water and canned products, produce.... people are buying crazy stuff.  I went today to pick up prescriptions and few groceries. I bathed in sanitizer before going in and after leaving... sprayed everything with Lysol when I got it home and took another sanitizer bath after that and changed clothes as our local health dept recommends.   The store was a zoo with all the old folks (like me 72) and kids running wild.  They are actively wiping down carts before they give you one and constantly wiping down key pads, counters, computers, etc... three people in my store doing that.. so Publix market seems to be proactive on this.

We?re just hanging out at home and I?m working on my ?53 truck, wife is baking Easter cookies, but we?re wondering if our usual Easter gathering at our house will occur... I have some less than scholarly inlaw/outlaws.  I?m considered ?high risk? with diabetes.

I?ve got a big time truck gathering in Pigeon Forge in middle of May... hoping it isn?t cancelled, but it don?t look promising.

Plenty of projects to keep me busy if the dang rain will let up.  We get 4 days of rain and 1 sunny day and repeat.  Bham usually gets 11 or inches of rain this time of year... we?ve had over 24 so far... my yard is squishy.


john

https://jniolon.classicpickup.com/
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From ejrussell at mebtel.net  Mon Mar 16 17:44:32 2020
From: ejrussell at mebtel.net (ERIC RUSSELL)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 19:44:32 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <989633582.64446015.1584402272920.JavaMail.zimbra@mebtel.net>

> Covid-19 is around.  How are you doing? 
Our family is well. Being retired makes staying home easy. Being half Finnish makes maintaining social distance feel natural. As a retired ER nurse I am worried about the stress those folks are/will be under. Many places are reporting insufficient stocks of basic PPE (Personal Protective Equipment). Management is trying to get them to re-use equipment &/or telling them it is not needed. They worry about bringing something home. If you need medical care be patient with the staff. Eric RussellMebane, NC 
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From fishplate at gmail.com  Mon Mar 16 18:06:09 2020
From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 20:06:09 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 7:43 PM someone wrote:


> This is no different then swine flu, bird flu, Sars, or any of the other
> types of outbreaks we have recently had.  But this one has the media waging
> the dog.
>

I am not an epidemiologist.  But I do help to keep a high-containment
infectious disease lab running, so some of this has rubbed off...

This is, of course, very much like SARS - they are cousins on the virii
family tree (Coronavirus is also called SARS-CoV-2).  It is like swine flu
and bird flu, in that it seems to be transmitted as an aerosol.

What makes it different is that it is a novel coronavirus.  That means we
haven't seen it before.   H1N1 flu is very similar to H5N9 and a host of
other variants - but we understand the virus in general, and have a good
chance to make a vaccine to prevent it or reduce its effect, depending on
how well we guess that year's mutation.  But this virus is taking some time
to understand it...meanwhile, we aren't 100% sure how it is transmitted
(though there are some educated guesses), and we aren't very close to any
sort of vaccine.  Latest estimates from CDC and WHO indicate it is fatal in
about 3% off cases - though that's in /known/ cases, which is a number we
don't have any handle on at all.  The actual rate could be less, but it
definitely goes up with age and impaired physical condition.

We are behind the 8 ball here for a number of reasons - and yes, some of
them are political - so we have to do the best with what we know.  And what
we know is that if you are in a room with infected people, your chance of
exposure goes up.  If you don't wash your hands, your risk of exposure goes
up.  And, you can be infested - and shedding virus - and not know it.

So, if you dig down through all the noise, you find the media actually
saying:

Wash your hands frequently.  If you can't wash them, use hand sanitizer.

Avoid being in small spaces with lots of other people.

If you start showing symptoms, look to your local public health agency for
guidance.  Look at the CDC web site.

My county is debating a curfew (which won't help much, except to limit
exposure to drunks in college bars) and debating a limit on the number of
people that can gather in a public or semi-public place (which might
actually help, but it's something you can do already).

So, you have a shop, right?  And a pile of projects, right?  So, avoid Cars
& Coffee this month, and finish that overhaul you started six years ago.
That's my two cents.

Jeff Scarbrough
Corrosion Acres, Ga.

.
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From jdinnis at gmail.com  Mon Mar 16 18:07:02 2020
From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 19:07:02 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <CANuE7YDRyrv20jijnaJuwLkX+O5fGjo-ja9Hm2-Ppi_deXqqvw@mail.gmail.com>

I get where you are coming form, the media blasts everything out of
proportion, no doubt about that.  But I don't know jack about epidemiology,
so I have to take advice from someone who does.  That ain't the cheeto in
chief.  I am getting my advice from WHO and CDC.  Those boffins say take
this seriously, so I am.  For me that means monitoring the number of cases
reported near me and avoiding any unnecessary risk.  I got vaccinated
against the flu, so did a bunch of other people in the US.  We know that
even a nasty strain of flu won't run rampant through the nation.  Only like
one person in the world has been vaccinated against this stuff, and with no
idea if it is going to work or not.  The flu generally gets rolling in
October or November and dies down by May, so you have a limited exposure
window.  It is not yet know if this virus will follow the same pattern.
But early looks form the southern hemisphere, where it is now summer, seem
to indicate this isn't going to slow down on it's own.

On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 6:43 PM eric--- via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Brian writes...
>
> > Wondering with amazement at the folks that are panic buying toilet
> paper. Man, we would have a heck of a time in this country if we were ever
> faced with an actual crisis.
>
> You said it!  I work for the NJ State Police in the Intelligence Center.
> The Governor and his staff is now there daily.
>
> The real problem is the media using this as a ratings grab across the
> world.  Look at the numbers, the number of people that died of the flu, in
> the US only, this year exceeds total worldwide fatalities by ORDERS of
> magnitude.  Every year, we see this activity.  But, because this one has a
> different signature, lets all lose our minds.
>
> Business are going to go under, and people are not going to be able to pay
> their bills and can lose their homes as a result of the panic they are
> instilling.
>
> This is no different then swine flu, bird flu, Sars, or any of the other
> types of outbreaks we have recently had.  But this one has the media waging
> the dog.
>
> /soapbox
>
>
>
> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational
> being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph
> Waldo Emerson
> -Who is John Galt?_______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com
>
>

-- 
=================================
= Never offend people with style when you   =
= can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =
=================================
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From mdporter at dfn.com  Mon Mar 16 18:45:48 2020
From: mdporter at dfn.com (Michael Porter)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 18:45:48 -0600
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>

On 3/16/2020 6:06 PM, Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk wrote:
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 7:43 PM someone wrote:
>
>     This is no different then swine flu, bird flu, Sars, or any of the
>     other types of outbreaks we have recently had. ?But this one has
>     the media waging the dog.
>
>
> I am not an epidemiologist.? But I do help to keep a high-containment 
> infectious disease lab running, so some of this has rubbed off...
>
> This is, of course, very much like SARS - they are cousins on the 
> virii family tree (Coronavirus is also called SARS-CoV-2).? It is like 
> swine flu and bird flu, in that it seems to be transmitted as an aerosol.
>
> What makes it different is that it is a novel coronavirus.? That means 
> we haven't seen it before.

I'm thinking that history doesn't repeat itself, and doesn't rhyme (as 
Mark Twain averred) so much as it coughs up the same sort of phlegm 
every once in a while for the same reasons.? It's now right around 100 
years ago that the "Spanish" flu killed an estimated 50-60 million 
worldwide, when the world population was about 35-40% of what it is 
now.? There /are/ pandemics, and some of them have rather high death 
rates.? The rate of death from the Spanish flu was about 2%.? The CDC is 
estimating a rate of death from this virus of 3%, so it's nothing to 
sneeze at.? In hard-hit regions, the death rate is around 4-5%, probably 
because in those populations, malnutrition is higher and access to care 
is less prevalent, and people are dying at a higher rate from 
opportunistic secondary infections, such as bacterial pneumonia. The 
death rate in this country each year from garden-variety influenza is 
about 0.1%, so we are dealing with something that is more virulent and 
has a much greater potential for harm, so, all in all, warnings to 
behave exceptionally because the threat is exceptional are appropriate.? 
Does the media magnify the threat? Yeah, because getting eyeballs is the 
core of the business.? But, if the advice comes from reputable sources, 
best to listen to it, instead of the nitwits.


Cheers.



-- 


Michael Porter
Roswell, NM


Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking distance....

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From bobkegel at comcast.net  Mon Mar 16 19:13:34 2020
From: bobkegel at comcast.net (Bob Kegel)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 18:13:34 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
 <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <mailman.47.1584407618.2961.shop-talk@autox.team.net>

I?m a two-hour drive from Ground Zero, on the coast. Only one confirmed case out here so far, but I expect that to change. Too many folks with no doctor and poor hand-washing skills. 
My office is already socially-isolated. If I do have to meet the public, I have gloves, N95 masks, and Tyvek suits.

Bob K

From: Mike Sinclair via Shop-talk
Sent: Monday, March 16, 2020 14:23
To: shop-talk at autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?

Here in the US Ground Zero (Seattle), everything is shut down

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From marka at maracing.com  Mon Mar 16 19:25:38 2020
From: marka at maracing.com (Mark Andy)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 21:25:38 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <20200317011341.5B940A0BC7@autox.team.net>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
 <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
 <20200317011341.5B940A0BC7@autox.team.net>
Message-ID: <CAAoSWGMHpfNsHEZuQExJtzHmecV_vYFV4v4eUwkRMBMMfeq28w@mail.gmail.com>

Howdy,

Given the apparent near total lack of testing, I'm not putting much faith
in 'reported case' #'s.  And, like others have said, I think when the CDC,
WHO, and the politicians are all saying "this is serious, stop fucking
around" then I'm going to take it seriously and stop fucking around.

We've been avoiding contact with the outside world since Thursday.  Prior
to that we were doing the washing of hands / sanitizer things for a few
days.  Right now I think we have enough food to not have to leave the house
for another week anyway, perhaps longer, and I have no plans to do that.
Complicating that a little bit is that Ohio has an election tomorrow...
maybe. The Governor tried to delay it today at 4pm, was shot down in court
at 7pm after many news outlets reported it as a done deal, and apparently
is going to appeal.  I do know that I won't be going to the polls and will
be doing everything I can to prevent my wife from going.  There's nothing
on the ballot as pressing as keeping us alive and a 1% or 5% or 1/2% chance
of death is more risk than I want to take even if I totally discount all of
the other aspects of trying to slow the spread of the virus.

Mark

On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 9:13 PM Bob Kegel via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> I?m a two-hour drive from Ground Zero, on the coast. Only one confirmed
> case out here so far, but I expect that to change. Too many folks with no
> doctor and poor hand-washing skills.
>
> My office is already socially-isolated. If I do have to meet the public, I
> have gloves, N95 masks, and Tyvek suits.
>
>
>
> Bob K
>
>
>
> *From: *Mike Sinclair via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
> *Sent: *Monday, March 16, 2020 14:23
> *To: *shop-talk at autox.team.net
> *Subject: *Re: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
>
>
>
> Here in the US Ground Zero (Seattle), everything is shut down
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka at maracing.com
>
>
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From bobkegel at comcast.net  Mon Mar 16 19:28:26 2020
From: bobkegel at comcast.net (Bob Kegel)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 18:28:26 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Fence posts
In-Reply-To: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>
References: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <mailman.48.1584408510.2961.shop-talk@autox.team.net>

You could pour fine sand in the gap between post and concrete. Whack the post to settle it and follow with water to compact it. I?ve set posts using beach sand and they were rock-solid for at least 5 years.

Bob K

From: Robert Nogueirao via Shop-talk
Sent: Sunday, March 15, 2020 21:12
To: Shop Talk
Subject: [Shop-talk] Fence posts


Folks, I have a 4 foot high cedar wood fence in bad shape that I need to fix. While I will replacing the rails and pickets with new wood the posts appear to be in good condition,  ie: no rot, except for the fact they are set in concrete and the posts have shrunk a bit so the posts are loose on the concrete.
What would be the easiest way to firm up the posts in those holes? 
I?m only looking for a fix that will last 5 or so years.
Bob Nogueira 

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From jdinnis at gmail.com  Thu Mar 12 13:41:24 2020
From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis)
Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2020 14:41:24 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] OT flash drives
In-Reply-To: <CAOtbU9UHuwa5JmLsq5Q0ee6xPC7P5FLP+Lz95LL6+=AgbaNp8A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB65051F40CA881A612B227AA3B4FD0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
 <CAOtbU9UHuwa5JmLsq5Q0ee6xPC7P5FLP+Lz95LL6+=AgbaNp8A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANuE7YB24wxMdhW9jNtBAdwXz+B=kLr3O5LpBv=nmRH=5eQWuA@mail.gmail.com>

I have had mixed results with these.  Actually pretty much the same results
I see with flash-based drives.  The cheap ones seem to fail often, where
the good ones seem to last forever.  Forever meaning at least a few years.
I have had a number of mechanical drives fail while sitting on the shelf
for years at a time.  Flash seems less susceptible to the bit rot issue.
Generally speaking, you want your backups running on drives that are hooked
up and updating.  Preferably in a RAID arrangement that provides some level
of redundancy.  If you don't want to go the RAID route, rotate drives so
your backups are redundant.
A note on cloud based services.  They are generally very good at what they
do, but there are different risk when using the cloud.  For example this
week an un-patched bug was announced in windows 10 that could have security
implications for some cloud based services.  There is a risk that hackers
could get in and steal your data or ransom it.  Cloud is great for off site
backup in the event of fire or other local disaster, and for getting data
to other locations, but I would not trust is as my only source of backups.


On Thu, Mar 12, 2020 at 2:00 PM Doug Braun via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> A USB portable hard drive (the real, spinning kind) should be much more
> reliable than a run-of-the-mill USB flash drive, as long as you don't
> handle it roughly.
>
> Doug
>
> On Thu, Mar 12, 2020, 8:26 AM Tim . via Shop-talk <
> shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
>> Sending this inquiry to you all since I know there are more than a few IT
>> guys in this group.....
>>
>> I bought three 512GB flash drives for archiving here at work. One locked
>> up in each of our offices and one for me to add to files as necessary as
>> files are amended. They have approximately 450GB on them.
>>
>> One of the three failed as soon as I finished filling it. I bought a
>> different brand and made a replacement copy for the safe in our Madison
>> office. A second, the same brand as the first one that failed is locked up
>> in our MKE office and will also be replaced now because the third one (the
>> one that has amended archived files) is also failing. I am having a hard
>> time retrieving the amended files before this drive takes a final crap on
>> me. It took over 15 hours to pull one 87MB file from the dying drive. I
>> can't even attempt to pull more than one file at a time. Not that this
>> should matter, but the files are mixed word, pdf, saved outlook emails and
>> miscellaneous audio or video files and possibly other items.
>>
>> What I am wondering/hoping is that someone might know of a solution to
>> this nearly impossible retrieval process. Or am I just screwed here?
>>
>> Next year we will be storing everything in the cloud so I won't have to
>> deal with this PITA process.
>>
>> Thanks
>> tim
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
>> http://autox.team.net/archive
>>
>> Unsubscribe/Manage:
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/doug at dougbraun.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com
>
>

-- 
=================================
= Never offend people with style when you   =
= can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =
=================================
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From stearman809 at gmail.com  Mon Mar 16 13:22:02 2020
From: stearman809 at gmail.com (Karl Vacek)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 14:22:02 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <170e4cbbb90.28bf.cd27845553c78383775132770b7455be@gmail.com>

The University of Chicago is scrupulously following the closure 
recommendations.
Been in serious back pain for 7 weeks.  Surgery was scheduled for 7 
tomorrow morning.  Shoulda walked out that afternoon.
But nooooo - they called this morning and now I wait till April 16.
PS - I'm one of those people for whom nothing alleviates pain.  Nothing.  
Booze sort of, but I can't get anything done staying oiled up all day.
Damn

On March 16, 2020 1:50:30 PM John Innis via Shop-talk 
<shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> Lots of precaution around Iowa, very little actual infection.  I think we 
> are still fewer than 25 cases in the state so far.  Schools are all closed 
> around here.  Our office has implemented optional work form home and 
> mandatory quarantine for returning travelers.  No outbound travel 
> permitted.  Hopefully the prevention has kicked in and we won't see a bunch 
> of new cases around here.
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 1:34 PM Philip Ethier via Shop-talk 
> <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> Covid-19 is around.  How are you doing?
>
>
> --
>
> Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA
> 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue
> 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red
> 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl
> 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White
> 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White
> http://www.mnautox.com
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com
>
>
>
> --
>
> =================================
> = Never offend people with style when you   =
> = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =
> =================================_______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/stearman809 at gmail.com

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From mark at bradakis.com  Mon Mar 16 22:55:05 2020
From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis)
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2020 22:55:05 -0600
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <cf46760d-f600-7c22-0662-852fc72db301@comcast.net>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <cf46760d-f600-7c22-0662-852fc72db301@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <bd4d78ea-1138-8660-2ba8-ab8f1184ea39@bradakis.com>

As for me, I'll just shake my head in wonderment at the amazing rash of 
stupidity sweeping the world while I continue to plug away on keeping 
Team.Net on the air, as I've been doing for all these years.? And I'll 
hope that when I get overwhelmed by the hysteria I can still retreat to 
a nearby tavern for a relaxing pint.

Cheers!

mjb.



From scott.hall.personal at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 00:38:35 2020
From: scott.hall.personal at gmail.com (Scott Hall)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 01:38:35 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAK73_u7adzsOaCWV679rCYEbUfg8Ufd5uSoQeOOkwusU_RTP4w@mail.gmail.com>

The metro St. Louis area could go either way, I think. I ran out of paper
towels this weekend. Costco and Wal Mart tonight look worse than Florida
during hurricane prep. The toilet paper thing is real here--I would be
willing to bet there's none in stores anywhere in the metro area. No paper
towels either. The meat cases at Costco were empty, completely. Wal Mart
had some fresh produce--plum tomatoes and cabbage, but no bananas or
onions. Costco was the most unsettling--they had a list at the door of what
was sold out and the massive pallets of produce were just gone. The area
was mostly just empty. People were rolling out with cases of bottled water.
As if the water supply was in jeopardy. No flour. No butter, milk almost
gone. I'm not sure how bad people think it will be when they buy all the
fifty-pound bags of flour.

Schools are closed starting tomorrow; I told my guys last week they could
work from home. The rumors were going hard at work--they're going to be a
quarantine, banks are closing, gas stations are closing. Illinois is closed
all 'non-essential' business which, while probably the right way to stop a
biological agent, drive the spread of the stupid fear-mongering.

I was thinking about this a lot like Eric--just wash your damn hands (often
and well), maintain social distancing, and if you're under 60 the worst
you're going to get here is what amounts to a bad cold. Stay out of the ER
unless the paramedics take you there themselves and this will all blow over
in a few weeks. Even at the stated mortality rate you won't know anyone
that dies from this and if we don't tilt the hospitals they can probably
save most of the truly bad cases. If we all do our part this will be mostly
a non-event for most people.

After today I'm less worried about the virus itself and more about the
stupid running around. I lived through Florida hurricanes that seemed like
nothing compared to the people obviously barely containing their panic.
Toilet paper panic buying? Or attempted price gouging? Seriously?

And apparently my pop-epidemiology isn't great either--this is a bigger
deal than I thought and I should have sent everyone home at least a week
before I did. Maybe that 2% fatality rate is soft and it's not sticking to
the (sorry, fellas) elderly.

I figure I've got enough food probably two months, minimum. If I had to not
leave the house at all, that'd be achievable. But after watching and
hearing my fellow citizens I'm starting to think I should have laid into a
stockpile of ammunition.

I dunno, I'm a little unsettled. I've evacuated from hurricanes. I lived
through *not* evacuating from hurricanes and had no power or running water
for six weeks. In August. I never thought society was even close to to
approaching mass panic, it was just sweaty. Watching these people around
here...I'm not so sure about this. It's almost like they want to melt down
and have been waiting for an excuse. Even on Fox no one was claiming banks
and gas stations would shut down but people made that up in their heads.
Normal news stations just kept repeating schools would close and people
just got more wound up.

I'll probably feel better in the morning. Something about watching people
load up cases of bottled water in front of a store of empty shelves. It was
like they needed to buy *something*.

On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 1:34 PM Philip Ethier via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Covid-19 is around.  How are you doing?
>
> --
> Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA
> 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue
> 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red
> 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl
> 2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White
> 2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White
> http://www.mnautox.com
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/scott.hall.personal at gmail.com
>
>
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From dirtbeard at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 06:04:48 2020
From: dirtbeard at gmail.com (old dirtbeard)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 05:04:48 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <bd4d78ea-1138-8660-2ba8-ab8f1184ea39@bradakis.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <cf46760d-f600-7c22-0662-852fc72db301@comcast.net>
 <bd4d78ea-1138-8660-2ba8-ab8f1184ea39@bradakis.com>
Message-ID: <CAG1pxgbfOXi6Rs0rFG0dKdgdkBneeD-OxzWQ9cPGM+cV+ZpmiA@mail.gmail.com>

HI Mark,

Here in LA they are closing taverns as a precaution, so even that is no
longer an option...

best,

doug

On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 9:55 PM Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> As for me, I'll just shake my head in wonderment at the amazing rash of
> stupidity sweeping the world while I continue to plug away on keeping
> Team.Net on the air, as I've been doing for all these years.  And I'll
> hope that when I get overwhelmed by the hysteria I can still retreat to
> a nearby tavern for a relaxing pint.
>
> Cheers!
>
> mjb.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard at gmail.com
>
>
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From jamesf at groupwbench.org  Tue Mar 17 06:46:57 2020
From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 08:46:57 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <bd4d78ea-1138-8660-2ba8-ab8f1184ea39@bradakis.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <cf46760d-f600-7c22-0662-852fc72db301@comcast.net>
 <bd4d78ea-1138-8660-2ba8-ab8f1184ea39@bradakis.com>
Message-ID: <93B8FC57-3F1C-40FD-9C06-C17D8AD01E30@groupwbench.org>

You mean the stupidity of people continuing to go out and socialize despite that having not worked out so well for Italy? I know. Saturday night we tried to go out for dinner, figuring it'd be deserted. Couldn't get a reservation until 9pm. Then we realized how much people weren't getting it (including us) and were not surprised when later that night the gov't stepped in. The realization of just how bad this could get, and that it was getting worse faster than our brains could grasp it, set in. KInda like a small fire in the shop, where while you're reaching for the fire extinguisher you turn around and realize you need to reach for the telephone and the exit at the same time. 

Here in Boston it's major lockdown since Sunday, like in most denseley populated areas. We can still go shop, etc. but all public gatherings of any kind are banned. 

At 55 I'm not so concerned about me, but I do wonder if the tightness in my lungs last week was nothing, or something, and did I spread something before I knew that was possible?

It's a good week to clean the garage. Do I really need 20+ hammers? A pneumatic wrench my dad had in the 70s that won't undo lug nuts anymore? We watched Ford vs Ferrari Saturday night and after 25 years of playing with motorcycles exclusively, felt the hankering for a car project again.

Thanks for keeping the lights on Mark. We're going to need it for a while. 

jim

> On Mar 17, 2020, at 12:55 AM, Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> As for me, I'll just shake my head in wonderment at the amazing rash of stupidity sweeping the world while I continue to plug away on keeping Team.Net on the air, as I've been doing for all these years.  And I'll hope that when I get overwhelmed by the hysteria I can still retreat to a nearby tavern for a relaxing pint.
> 
> Cheers!
> 
> mjb.
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jamesf at groupwbench.org
> 

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From fishplate at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 07:24:13 2020
From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 09:24:13 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAAoSWGMHpfNsHEZuQExJtzHmecV_vYFV4v4eUwkRMBMMfeq28w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
 <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
 <20200317011341.5B940A0BC7@autox.team.net>
 <CAAoSWGMHpfNsHEZuQExJtzHmecV_vYFV4v4eUwkRMBMMfeq28w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO8Q7CNbbMo06YSwVHtMXcggrG4BF5RzUn4ACv_-hmJTXDjnag@mail.gmail.com>

On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 9:26 PM Mark Andy via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

>
> And, like others have said, I think when the CDC, WHO, and the politicians
> are all saying "this is serious, stop fucking around" then I'm going to
> take it seriously and stop fucking around.
>

It needs to be said:  Some politicians keep telling us it's all going to be
fine, and we don't need to worry about any of this.  And people listen to
him instead of the CDC and the WHO.

That is what keeps me awake at night.
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From dhlocker at comcast.net  Tue Mar 17 07:33:38 2020
From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 09:33:38 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAO8Q7CNbbMo06YSwVHtMXcggrG4BF5RzUn4ACv_-hmJTXDjnag@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
 <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
 <20200317011341.5B940A0BC7@autox.team.net>
 <CAAoSWGMHpfNsHEZuQExJtzHmecV_vYFV4v4eUwkRMBMMfeq28w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAO8Q7CNbbMo06YSwVHtMXcggrG4BF5RzUn4ACv_-hmJTXDjnag@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b0bd9409-fd99-5f63-dfc4-4b4280fa0191@comcast.net>

Keeps me awake too. One problem that we will run into is that if the 
measures are sufficiently effective, we won't have a catastrophe, and 
many people will complain, "Well, that was all for naught!" and won't 
want to take appropriate measures next time.

The only way we will know if the measures were ineffective is if we do 
have a catastrophe. This reasoning applies to other situations we are 
facing, as well.

Donald.
--
*Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
() no proprietary attachments; no html mail
/\ <https://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml>

On 2020-03-17 9:24 a.m., Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk wrote:
> 
> 
> On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 9:26 PM Mark Andy via Shop-talk 
> <shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:
> 
> 
>     And, like others have said, I think when the CDC, WHO, and the
>     politicians are all saying "this is serious, stop fucking around"
>     then I'm going to take it seriously and stop fucking around.
> 
> 
> It needs to be said:? Some politicians keep telling us it's all going to 
> be fine, and we don't need to worry about any of this.? And people 
> listen to him instead of the CDC and the WHO.
> 
> That is what keeps me awake at night.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dhlocker at comcast.net
> 

From fishplate at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 07:36:56 2020
From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 09:36:56 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <b0bd9409-fd99-5f63-dfc4-4b4280fa0191@comcast.net>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
 <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
 <20200317011341.5B940A0BC7@autox.team.net>
 <CAAoSWGMHpfNsHEZuQExJtzHmecV_vYFV4v4eUwkRMBMMfeq28w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAO8Q7CNbbMo06YSwVHtMXcggrG4BF5RzUn4ACv_-hmJTXDjnag@mail.gmail.com>
 <b0bd9409-fd99-5f63-dfc4-4b4280fa0191@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <CAO8Q7CNBSf3KL0zMak7zbxtsHYzphUEfHhUAxHQC8kd2rsP-ow@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Mar 17, 2020 at 9:33 AM Donald H Locker via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:


> One problem that we will run into is that if the
> measures are sufficiently effective, we won't have a catastrophe, and
> many people will complain, "Well, that was all for naught!" and won't
> want to take appropriate measures next time.


Like Y2k.  I'ts never been clear to me how much of the lack of catastrophe
was due to overhype, and how much was due to a bunch of people buckling
down and fixing it before it was a problem.
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From jamesf at groupwbench.org  Tue Mar 17 07:48:42 2020
From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 09:48:42 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAO8Q7CNBSf3KL0zMak7zbxtsHYzphUEfHhUAxHQC8kd2rsP-ow@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
 <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
 <20200317011341.5B940A0BC7@autox.team.net>
 <CAAoSWGMHpfNsHEZuQExJtzHmecV_vYFV4v4eUwkRMBMMfeq28w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAO8Q7CNbbMo06YSwVHtMXcggrG4BF5RzUn4ACv_-hmJTXDjnag@mail.gmail.com>
 <b0bd9409-fd99-5f63-dfc4-4b4280fa0191@comcast.net>
 <CAO8Q7CNBSf3KL0zMak7zbxtsHYzphUEfHhUAxHQC8kd2rsP-ow@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9C2835CA-2CB1-42B9-BFBA-9505268950AD@groupwbench.org>



> On Mar 17, 2020, at 9:36 AM, Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> On Tue, Mar 17, 2020 at 9:33 AM Donald H Locker via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>  
> One problem that we will run into is that if the 
> measures are sufficiently effective, we won't have a catastrophe, and 
> many people will complain, "Well, that was all for naught!" and won't 
> want to take appropriate measures next time.
> 
> Like Y2k.  I'ts never been clear to me how much of the lack of catastrophe was due to overhype, and how much was due to a bunch of people buckling down and fixing it before it was a problem. 

Both. There was a lot of fixing that went on, but we didn't know what we didn't know until we started digging into it. Not too different from now - some people are freaking out, some people are being overly cavalier, because we just don't know and are learning new things every day. 

It's different from a hurricane because we've had hurricanes, you can see it, you can see the damage it does, and you can figure out how to keep yourself safe, and how to survive. The virus, can't see it, don't fully know how it gets passed on, how will it damage +me+ vs. my neighbor, etc. 

jim

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From jamesf at groupwbench.org  Tue Mar 17 07:52:58 2020
From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 09:52:58 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Small compressors
Message-ID: <3A09C5BA-397E-4720-B0EF-F36C654BAE02@groupwbench.org>

My Porter Cable pancake has a pinhole in the tank. I have abused it for 10+ years and it doesn't owe me anything at this point. What do people like for small, wheeled, quiet, inexpensive? I don't see myself staying in this house much longer so I won't be installing lines and a nice stand up unit, but I do need to fill car tires, run a framing nail gun. 

thanks,
jim
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From patintexas at icloud.com  Tue Mar 17 07:58:57 2020
From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 08:58:57 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Small compressors
In-Reply-To: <3A09C5BA-397E-4720-B0EF-F36C654BAE02@groupwbench.org>
References: <3A09C5BA-397E-4720-B0EF-F36C654BAE02@groupwbench.org>
Message-ID: <A16B2C25-9CDB-42FC-93B4-9DB95FEDFA18@icloud.com>

I have a great small compressor that I use on construction sites that is a porter cable. It doesn?t have wheels, so I won?t bother posting the model number. 

One thing I?d recommend is that you check out cpooutlets.com. I?ve been using them for years & never been disappointed. 

Peace,
Pat

Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


> On Mar 17, 2020, at 8:53 AM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 

?My Porter Cable pancake has a pinhole in the tank. I have abused it for 10+ years and it doesn't owe me anything at this point. What do people like for small, wheeled, quiet, inexpensive? I don't see myself staying in this house much longer so I won't be installing lines and a nice stand up unit, but I do need to fill car tires, run a framing nail gun. 

thanks,
jim_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com


From parkanzky at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 08:03:54 2020
From: parkanzky at gmail.com (Paul Parkanzky)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 10:03:54 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Small compressors
In-Reply-To: <3A09C5BA-397E-4720-B0EF-F36C654BAE02@groupwbench.org>
References: <3A09C5BA-397E-4720-B0EF-F36C654BAE02@groupwbench.org>
Message-ID: <CAOEriinXed0emea-66AQOCZEKrzivCXcFHUTtHzaUp9b5wYCdQ@mail.gmail.com>

I had an oilless craftsman standup for years until I upgraded to a big
IR oiled machine. When I did, I gave the Craftsman to a buddy of mine
and he runs it nearly constantly in his amateur machine shop and for
all of our ridiculous vehicle projects. I bought the nicer of the
Harbor Freight hose reels (rubber hose) when I bought it and mounted
that to the ceiling so it would reach anywhere I'd want air and we
moved the same setup to Joe's shop when I gave it to him.

It is small (15-20 gallon, I think), fairly cheap, will even run a
small blasting cabinet for short bursts, but it's mighty loud. So it's
my hands-down recommendation if you're willing to endure the noise.

If you're not, your options are sort of limited. In my experience,
anything oilless is pretty loud and when you step up to oiled they're
much more expensive and if you get a bigger one (which the oiled tend
to be) then they make more noise because they're making so much more
air.

Regards,

-Paul

On Tue, Mar 17, 2020 at 9:53 AM Jim Franklin via Shop-talk
<shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> My Porter Cable pancake has a pinhole in the tank. I have abused it for 10+ years and it doesn't owe me anything at this point. What do people like for small, wheeled, quiet, inexpensive? I don't see myself staying in this house much longer so I won't be installing lines and a nice stand up unit, but I do need to fill car tires, run a framing nail gun.
>
> thanks,
> jim_______________________________________________
>

From marka at maracing.com  Tue Mar 17 09:35:10 2020
From: marka at maracing.com (Mark Andy)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 11:35:10 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Was Y2k real: was everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAO8Q7CNBSf3KL0zMak7zbxtsHYzphUEfHhUAxHQC8kd2rsP-ow@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
 <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
 <20200317011341.5B940A0BC7@autox.team.net>
 <CAAoSWGMHpfNsHEZuQExJtzHmecV_vYFV4v4eUwkRMBMMfeq28w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAO8Q7CNbbMo06YSwVHtMXcggrG4BF5RzUn4ACv_-hmJTXDjnag@mail.gmail.com>
 <b0bd9409-fd99-5f63-dfc4-4b4280fa0191@comcast.net>
 <CAO8Q7CNBSf3KL0zMak7zbxtsHYzphUEfHhUAxHQC8kd2rsP-ow@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAAoSWGN423EQTUekipTnoP_FWcSWUT19vEdrrcO+gzwiU55CXA@mail.gmail.com>

Howdy,

As someone intimately involved with Y2k back in the day...

The software systems I worked on would for sure have broken with any dates
> 12/31/1999.  Now, those systems were all health insurance related, so
unlikely to cause everything to just shut off, but I would imagine billing
systems for utility companies issuing shut off orders for lack of payment,
etc. etc. would also have been affected.

I don't think the world would have ended, but there was legitimately a year
or so of necessary work to make Y2k not being a thing that actually
happened.

FWIW.

Mark

On Tue, Mar 17, 2020 at 9:37 AM Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

>
>
> On Tue, Mar 17, 2020 at 9:33 AM Donald H Locker via Shop-talk <
> shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
>
>> One problem that we will run into is that if the
>> measures are sufficiently effective, we won't have a catastrophe, and
>> many people will complain, "Well, that was all for naught!" and won't
>> want to take appropriate measures next time.
>
>
> Like Y2k.  I'ts never been clear to me how much of the lack of catastrophe
> was due to overhype, and how much was due to a bunch of people buckling
> down and fixing it before it was a problem.
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka at maracing.com
>
>
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From marka at maracing.com  Tue Mar 17 09:37:32 2020
From: marka at maracing.com (Mark Andy)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 11:37:32 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Small compressors
In-Reply-To: <3A09C5BA-397E-4720-B0EF-F36C654BAE02@groupwbench.org>
References: <3A09C5BA-397E-4720-B0EF-F36C654BAE02@groupwbench.org>
Message-ID: <CAAoSWGO1wSr9ptDqgks3rWjfHf73EkVNZWk01xiF=+=AVHSevw@mail.gmail.com>

Howdy,

I haven't ever actually used one, but the first thing I'd check out would
be the inexpensive quiet compressors.  Stuff like this, though there are
obviously others...

https://www.harborfreight.com/air-tools-compressors/air-compressors-tanks/2-gallon-135-psi-ultra-quiet-hand-carry-jobsite-air-compressor-64596.html


Mark

On Tue, Mar 17, 2020 at 9:53 AM Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> My Porter Cable pancake has a pinhole in the tank. I have abused it for
> 10+ years and it doesn't owe me anything at this point. What do people like
> for small, wheeled, quiet, inexpensive? I don't see myself staying in this
> house much longer so I won't be installing lines and a nice stand up unit,
> but I do need to fill car tires, run a framing nail gun.
>
> thanks,
> jim_______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka at maracing.com
>
>
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From mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org  Tue Mar 17 11:57:03 2020
From: mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org (Jimmie Mayfield)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 13:57:03 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Small compressors
In-Reply-To: <3A09C5BA-397E-4720-B0EF-F36C654BAE02@groupwbench.org>
References: <3A09C5BA-397E-4720-B0EF-F36C654BAE02@groupwbench.org>
Message-ID: <d983d952-3ffd-f13f-2bc8-556e4b675312@sackheads.org>

I have a 25gal Craftsman Pro oil-filled compressor.? At 25 gallons, it's 
at the larger end of what I'd consider "small" but it is on pneumatic 
wheels so rolling it around isn't a problem.? I use it for everything 
from filling tires to blowing out the sprinkler lines in the fall (I 
usually aim a fan at the pump for the latter...the pump runs continuous 
for an hour or two so this keeps the pump cool to the touch).


On 3/17/20 09:52, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote:
> My Porter Cable pancake has a pinhole in the tank. I have abused it for 10+ years and it doesn't owe me anything at this point. What do people like for small, wheeled, quiet, inexpensive? I don't see myself staying in this house much longer so I won't be installing lines and a nice stand up unit, but I do need to fill car tires, run a framing nail gun.
>
> thanks,
> jim
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org
>

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From dmscheidt at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 12:42:30 2020
From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 13:42:30 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Fwd:  Small compressors
In-Reply-To: <CA+k5surWivRHboqKoUBXOt4j4EE3yCfz9STSU5V-6X7ZGk7YTA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <3A09C5BA-397E-4720-B0EF-F36C654BAE02@groupwbench.org>
 <CAAoSWGO1wSr9ptDqgks3rWjfHf73EkVNZWk01xiF=+=AVHSevw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CA+k5surWivRHboqKoUBXOt4j4EE3yCfz9STSU5V-6X7ZGk7YTA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+k5suokmTH4+nAYY_wWMBim+or_4VP3ncVNHuXFEd7tNzgxeQ@mail.gmail.com>

forgot to include the list.
On Tue, Mar 17, 2020 at 10:37 AM Mark Andy via Shop-talk
<shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> Howdy,
>
> I haven't ever actually used one, but the first thing I'd check out would be the inexpensive quiet compressors.  Stuff like this, though there are obviously others...
>
> https://www.harborfreight.com/air-tools-compressors/air-compressors-tanks/2-gallon-135-psi-ultra-quiet-hand-carry-jobsite-air-compressor-64596.html
>

I'll repeat what I said somewhere else about quiet compressors:


There are two or three companies making the small quiet compressors,
which are sold under lots of different brand names. There are
sometimes slight differences between them: some versions have steel
tanks, some have aluminum, some are slightly lower pressure than
others. These compressors are not designed to last forever, the
expected pump life is only a few thousand hours. That?s a year on a
job site, and probably the rest of my life in my hobby and home
improvement shop. The two gallon compressors produce about 2
cfm/minute, which is enough for any trim nailer use, and inflating
tires and such like. The best of them are ~60 db. My dishwasher is
claimed to be 60db, and it?s a quiet machine.

I would not buy an expensive compressor from HF. They have only a 90
day warranty, no parts support (Even things they claim to have parts
for, they don?t), so if it breaks you can?t easily fix it. For about
the same money, you can buy the same machine from someone willing to
put a warranty on it. I?d buy one of the cheap pancakes if I had a
need for one, because I?m sure they?d last long enough for me to feel
I?d got what I needed it for, but for $150, I want something that will
last.

The Bostitch framing nailer I have requires something like 9 cfm of
air at 80psi?but that?s to shoot 100 nails a minute. If you?re not
doing production framing, you might be able to get along with one of
these.

Since  I wrote that, I bought one from Menards.  It was on sale, and
cheaper than the HF one, not on sale, it's about the same price.  It's
got a real warranty, from someone who knows what that means.  It's
dead silent, less noise than my dishwasher.  It does fine for tires
and dusting, and a small nailer.  I haven't done any framing with it,
but I did test the nailer with it; it fires two or three nails before
the compressor turns on.  I think it would be okay for small things,
and unusable for something like a fence, or building a house.



--
David Scheidt
dmscheidt at gmail.com


-- 
David Scheidt
dmscheidt at gmail.com

From brabel at comcast.net  Tue Mar 17 13:13:59 2020
From: brabel at comcast.net (Bill Rabel)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 12:13:59 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Small compressors
In-Reply-To: <CAAoSWGO1wSr9ptDqgks3rWjfHf73EkVNZWk01xiF=+=AVHSevw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAAoSWGO1wSr9ptDqgks3rWjfHf73EkVNZWk01xiF=+=AVHSevw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7824E1D6-F253-4451-A44A-3493FDD79DA0@comcast.net>

I bought one of those Harbor Freight 4-gallon compressors after hearing how quiet it is. Don?t dismiss it before you check it out. 

- Bill Rabel
  Anacortes

?I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as a cause for withdrawing from a friend.? 

Thomas Jefferson


> On Mar 17, 2020, at 8:37 AM, Mark Andy via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> ?
> Howdy,
> 
> I haven't ever actually used one, but the first thing I'd check out would be the inexpensive quiet compressors.  Stuff like this, though there are obviously others...
> 
> https://www.harborfreight.com/air-tools-compressors/air-compressors-tanks/2-gallon-135-psi-ultra-quiet-hand-carry-jobsite-air-compressor-64596.html 
> 
> Mark 
> 
>> On Tue, Mar 17, 2020 at 9:53 AM Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>> My Porter Cable pancake has a pinhole in the tank. I have abused it for 10+ years and it doesn't owe me anything at this point. What do people like for small, wheeled, quiet, inexpensive? I don't see myself staying in this house much longer so I won't be installing lines and a nice stand up unit, but I do need to fill car tires, run a framing nail gun. 
>> 
>> thanks,
>> jim_______________________________________________
>> 
>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>> 
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka at maracing.com
>> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/brabel at comcast.net
> 
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From brabel at comcast.net  Tue Mar 17 18:09:27 2020
From: brabel at comcast.net (Bill Rabel)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 17:09:27 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Small compressors
In-Reply-To: <4216C062-B918-4EBD-AF2D-D462A14B9FF6@me.com>
References: <4216C062-B918-4EBD-AF2D-D462A14B9FF6@me.com>
Message-ID: <DD290A67-1C0D-45BF-B2E2-59F6BA57E4EA@comcast.net>

?I have to comment about the 20%-off coupon. I took my coupon in, and it specifically exempts some items from the discount, one being the compressor.

- Bill Rabel
  Anacortes


On Mar 17, 2020, at 4:44 PM, Arvid <arvidj999 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Between me being a little hard of hearing, the radio being on and how quiet it is I never know when it is running. Very light and easy to carry. 20% off coupon and $160 out the door.
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From bspidell at comcast.net  Tue Mar 17 18:41:14 2020
From: bspidell at comcast.net (Bob Spidell)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 17:41:14 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Small compressors
In-Reply-To: <DD290A67-1C0D-45BF-B2E2-59F6BA57E4EA@comcast.net>
References: <4216C062-B918-4EBD-AF2D-D462A14B9FF6@me.com>
 <DD290A67-1C0D-45BF-B2E2-59F6BA57E4EA@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <ee4e6d56-1f49-097f-3f85-cb24f30e0bba@comcast.net>

... another being welders, unfortunately (although they do put them on 
sale from time to time, usually a week or two after I buy one).

Bob


On 3/17/2020 5:09 PM, Bill Rabel via Shop-talk wrote:
> ?I have to comment about the 20%-off coupon. I took my coupon in, and 
> it specifically exempts some items from the discount, one being the 
> compressor.
>
> - Bill Rabel
> ? Anacortes
>
>
> On Mar 17, 2020, at 4:44 PM, Arvid <arvidj999 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:arvidj999 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>> Between me being a little hard of hearing, the radio being on and how 
>> quiet it is I never know when it is running. Very light and easy to 
>> carry. 20% off coupon and $160 out the door.
>

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From bspidell at comcast.net  Tue Mar 17 18:42:03 2020
From: bspidell at comcast.net (Bob Spidell)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 17:42:03 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Small compressors
In-Reply-To: <DD290A67-1C0D-45BF-B2E2-59F6BA57E4EA@comcast.net>
References: <4216C062-B918-4EBD-AF2D-D462A14B9FF6@me.com>
 <DD290A67-1C0D-45BF-B2E2-59F6BA57E4EA@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <6f57cf9c-253f-57b9-b739-bd6dbeae890a@comcast.net>

ps.? Went to HF this morning; looks like they had a run on nitrile gloves.


On 3/17/2020 5:09 PM, Bill Rabel via Shop-talk wrote:
> ?I have to comment about the 20%-off coupon. I took my coupon in, and 
> it specifically exempts some items from the discount, one being the 
> compressor.
>
> - Bill Rabel
> ? Anacortes
>
>
> On Mar 17, 2020, at 4:44 PM, Arvid <arvidj999 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:arvidj999 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>> Between me being a little hard of hearing, the radio being on and how 
>> quiet it is I never know when it is running. Very light and easy to 
>> carry. 20% off coupon and $160 out the door.
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bspidell at comcast.net
>

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From Ronald.Griffing at comcast.net  Tue Mar 17 18:45:07 2020
From: Ronald.Griffing at comcast.net (RONALD GRIFFING)
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2020 00:45:07 -0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] Small compressors
Message-ID: <98995623.1.1584492306046@localhost>

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From nogera at icloud.com  Tue Mar 17 20:50:51 2020
From: nogera at icloud.com (Robert Nogueirao)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 21:50:51 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <bd4d78ea-1138-8660-2ba8-ab8f1184ea39@bradakis.com>
References: <bd4d78ea-1138-8660-2ba8-ab8f1184ea39@bradakis.com>
Message-ID: <B9E7CCAC-D6C9-4B0A-AFDC-07220EE3DADD@icloud.com>

Mark, as George Carlin said,  l think about how dumb the average person is, then realize half of them are dumber than that!?

Bob Nogueira 

> On Mar 16, 2020, at 11:55 PM, Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> ?As for me, I'll just shake my head in wonderment at the amazing rash of stupidity sweeping the world while I continue to plug away on keeping Team.Net on the air, as I've been doing for all these years.  And I'll hope that when I get overwhelmed by the hysteria I can still retreat to a nearby tavern for a relaxing pint.
> 
> Cheers!
> 
> mjb.
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/nogera at icloud.com
> 

From pj_mcgarvey at hotmail.com  Wed Mar 18 05:46:05 2020
From: pj_mcgarvey at hotmail.com (PJ McGarvey)
Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2020 11:46:05 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <B9E7CCAC-D6C9-4B0A-AFDC-07220EE3DADD@icloud.com>
References: <bd4d78ea-1138-8660-2ba8-ab8f1184ea39@bradakis.com>,
 <B9E7CCAC-D6C9-4B0A-AFDC-07220EE3DADD@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <MN2PR11MB43187FD04847C476FF264E6E9AF70@MN2PR11MB4318.namprd11.prod.outlook.com>

If you're running out to buy all the toilet paper, but you text while driving on the way... there is something wrong.

________________________________
From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> on behalf of Robert Nogueirao via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2020 10:50 PM
To: Mark J Bradakis <mark at bradakis.com>
Cc: shop-talk at autox.team.net <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?

Mark, as George Carlin said,  l think about how dumb the average person is, then realize half of them are dumber than that!?

Bob Nogueira

> On Mar 16, 2020, at 11:55 PM, Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> ?As for me, I'll just shake my head in wonderment at the amazing rash of stupidity sweeping the world while I continue to plug away on keeping Team.Net on the air, as I've been doing for all these years.  And I'll hope that when I get overwhelmed by the hysteria I can still retreat to a nearby tavern for a relaxing pint.
>
> Cheers!
>
> mjb.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/nogera at icloud.com
>
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

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From JIBrooks at live.com  Wed Mar 18 21:25:45 2020
From: JIBrooks at live.com (Jack Brooks)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 03:25:45 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] Fence posts
In-Reply-To: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>
References: <A378567B-9375-4351-ADE7-8EE8968DEC3C@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <MWHPR06MB315117D642A08F17FB819483A8F40@MWHPR06MB3151.namprd06.prod.outlook.com>

When I have a bad post, but the concrete is good, I yank the post, often in pieces, bit, by bit, plane down the new post so it fits easily, then pile up construction sand around the base of the post.  Wiggle it around for a few minutes and it'll lock in place.  In another month, with some rain, etc., it's like you put it in new concrete.

One back of sand should solve your issue.

Jack

-----Original Message-----
From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> On Behalf Of Robert Nogueirao via Shop-talk
Sent: Sunday, March 15, 2020 9:12 PM
To: Shop Talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Shop-talk] Fence posts


Folks, I have a 4 foot high cedar wood fence in bad shape that I need to fix. While I will replacing the rails and pickets with new wood the posts appear to be in good condition,  ie: no rot, except for the fact they are set in concrete and the posts have shrunk a bit so the posts are loose on the concrete.
What would be the easiest way to firm up the posts in those holes? 
I?m only looking for a fix that will last 5 or so years.
Bob Nogueira 
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jibrooks at live.com


From JIBrooks at live.com  Wed Mar 18 21:36:05 2020
From: JIBrooks at live.com (Jack Brooks)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 03:36:05 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
 <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <MWHPR06MB3151AA3F26CA97470D53B919A8F40@MWHPR06MB3151.namprd06.prod.outlook.com>

Doing ok and having fun with a cute woman I discovered on the couch after running out of garage projects.

King County, WA Epicenter resident here too.  63 years old and mostly barricaded at home, except for occasional 6 AM forays to Home Depot for project supplies and some back country skiing on and off Tuesday through Thursday to avoid others.

On a positive note, I and I suspect many of you, have at least a couple of N95 masks in the garage, just in case.

Jack

From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> On Behalf Of Mike Sinclair via Shop-talk
Sent: Monday, March 16, 2020 2:23 PM
To: shop-talk at autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?


Here in the US Ground Zero (Seattle), everything is shut down.  They are even talking about an evening curfew.  Not a whole lot one can do except be safe and use common sense.  Here in King County we have 420 cases, with 37 confirmed deaths, almost all of them in people with compromised health to begin with.  Not sure what it means to be ''confirmed dead''.

Mike
On 3/16/2020 1:24 PM, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote:
All is well in Southampton, with only one community spread case in the area, although we worry how much longer that will last.  It is starting to feel like summer in the Hamptons, as everyone with summer homes has decided this is a better place to be than New York City and surrounding areas.  What they bring with them is the concern, especially as our hospital is pretty much sized for the year round population, not the rich and famous who spend their summers - and now, virus shutdowns - with us.  Still, my family (daughter, son-in-law and granddaughter have joined the exodus and are staying with us for the duration) are all safe and healthy.  Long may that continue!

Hope everyone else stays well, too.

On Mar 16, 2020, at 2:50 PM, John Innis via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net<mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:

Lots of precaution around Iowa, very little actual infection.  I think we are still fewer than 25 cases in the state so far.  Schools are all closed around here.  Our office has implemented optional work from home and mandatory quarantine for returning travelers.  No outbound travel permitted.  Hopefully the prevention has kicked in and we won't see a bunch of new cases around here.

On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 1:34 PM Philip Ethier via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net<mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:
Covid-19 is around.  How are you doing?

--
Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA
1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue
2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red
2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl
2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White
2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White
http://www.mnautox.com<http://www.mnautox.com/>
_______________________________________________

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=================================
= Never offend people with style when you   =
= can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =
=================================
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From markmiller at threeboysfarm.com  Thu Mar 19 01:13:51 2020
From: markmiller at threeboysfarm.com (Mark Miller)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 00:13:51 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Confirmed dead. was: everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <mailman.10431.1584589034.2964.shop-talk@autox.team.net>
References: <mailman.10431.1584589034.2964.shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Message-ID: <7e71e132-57f2-e9f4-38ea-90a8b530c485@threeboysfarm.com>

Confirmed dead was first used in a cult 1939 film about a teen from 
Kansas who killed someone at the beginning of the story and then, with a 
gang she assembled, killed her sister towards the end of it.? It was 
announced in a macabre song '.....And she is not just nearly dead, she's 
really most sincerely dead.'


Regards,

Mark Miller   707-490-5834
markmiller at threeboysfarm.com

On 3/18/2020 8:37 PM, shop-talk-request at autox.team.net wrote:
> Here in the US Ground Zero (Seattle), everything is shut down.  They are even talking about an evening curfew.  Not a whole lot one can do except be safe and use common sense.  Here in King County we have 420 cases, with 37 confirmed deaths, almost all of them in people with compromised health to begin with.  Not sure what it means to be ''confirmed dead''.
>
> Mike

From 1789alpine at gmail.com  Thu Mar 19 07:09:18 2020
From: 1789alpine at gmail.com (Jim Stone)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 09:09:18 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <MWHPR06MB3151AA3F26CA97470D53B919A8F40@MWHPR06MB3151.namprd06.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
 <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
 <MWHPR06MB3151AA3F26CA97470D53B919A8F40@MWHPR06MB3151.namprd06.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <D2DFC693-5EAE-4286-974D-70BCC4E699F4@gmail.com>

Is there a prize here for the best response to a question?  If so, I nominate Jack!

> On Mar 18, 2020, at 11:36 PM, Jack Brooks via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> Doing ok and having fun with a cute woman I discovered on the couch after running out of garage projects.

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From arvidj999 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 17:44:25 2020
From: arvidj999 at gmail.com (Arvid)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 18:44:25 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Small compressors
In-Reply-To: <7824E1D6-F253-4451-A44A-3493FDD79DA0@comcast.net>
References: <CAAoSWGO1wSr9ptDqgks3rWjfHf73EkVNZWk01xiF=+=AVHSevw@mail.gmail.com>
 <7824E1D6-F253-4451-A44A-3493FDD79DA0@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <e68e4917-e8af-7653-4b53-e30d7e65c175@gmail.com>

I have the 2-gallon version. Is great for staplers, filling tires, nail gun, etc. Will actually run a small cutoff wheel for about 30 seconds. Don't laugh. It only took 26 seconds to make the steel rod shorter!!! And it seems to have reasonable recovery time.

Between me being a little hard of hearing, the radio being on and how quiet it is I never know when it is running. Very light and easy to carry. 20% off coupon and $160 out the door.

I think the 1-gallon is too small and the 4-gallon was heavier than I wanted for a portable compressor. I have an 80 gallon 5hp if I need to do anything serious but I can't remember the last time I bothered to get the hose and find the nearest fitting. Easier to just carry the little one over and plug it in.

On 3/17/20 2:13 PM, Bill Rabel via Shop-talk wrote:
> I bought one of those Harbor Freight 4-gallon compressors after hearing how quiet it is. Don?t dismiss it before you check it out.
>
> - Bill Rabel
> ? Anacortes
>
> ?I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as a cause for withdrawing from a friend.?
>
> Thomas Jefferson
>
>
>> On Mar 17, 2020, at 8:37 AM, Mark Andy via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>>
>> ?
>> Howdy,
>>
>> I haven't ever actually used one, but the first thing I'd check out would be the inexpensive quiet compressors.? Stuff like this, though there are obviously others...
>>
>> https://www.harborfreight.com/air-tools-compressors/air-compressors-tanks/2-gallon-135-psi-ultra-quiet-hand-carry-jobsite-air-compressor-64596.html
>>
>> Mark
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 17, 2020 at 9:53 AM Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>>
>>     My Porter Cable pancake has a pinhole in the tank. I have abused it for 10+ years and it doesn't owe me anything at this point. What do people like for small, wheeled, quiet, inexpensive? I don't see myself staying in this house much longer so I won't be installing lines and a nice stand up unit, but I do need to fill car tires, run a framing nail gun.
>>
>>     thanks,
>>     jim_______________________________________________
>>
>>     Shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
>>     Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>     Suggested annual donation? $12.96
>>     Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>>
>>     Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka at maracing.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation ?$12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>>
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/brabel at comcast.net
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/arvidj999 at gmail.com
>
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From dave1massey at cs.com  Tue Mar 17 06:24:32 2020
From: dave1massey at cs.com (DAVID MASSEY)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 12:24:32 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
 <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
Message-ID: <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>

  In 1918, the flu hit the east coast early.? The health commissioner in St. Louis took early and drastic measures closing public spaces such as pubs, libraries, theaters and such and took much derision as a result.? But, the death rate in St. Louis was 347 per 100,000 people, 1/8 of that of Philadelphia.? The results speak for them selves.
Dealing with this situation with wishful thinking is a recipe for disaster.
  
Dave 

 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Michael Porter via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
To: Jeff Scarbrough <fishplate at gmail.com>
Cc: Shop-Talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Sent: Mon, Mar 16, 2020 7:46 pm
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?

 On 3/16/2020 6:06 PM, Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk wrote:
  
 
 
  
  On Mon, Mar 16, 2020 at 7:43 PM someone wrote:
  ? 
This is no different then swine flu, bird flu, Sars, or any of the other types of outbreaks we have recently had. ?But this one has the media waging the dog. 
 
 
  I am not an epidemiologist.? But I do help to keep a high-containment infectious disease lab running, so some of this has rubbed off... 
  This is, of course, very much like SARS - they are cousins on the virii family tree (Coronavirus is also called SARS-CoV-2).? It is like swine flu and bird flu, in that it seems to be transmitted as an aerosol. 
  What makes it different is that it is a novel coronavirus.? That means we haven't seen it before.   I'm thinking that history doesn't repeat itself, and doesn't rhyme (as Mark Twain averred) so much as it coughs up the same sort of phlegm every once in a while for the same reasons.? It's now right around 100 years ago that the "Spanish" flu killed an estimated 50-60 million worldwide, when the world population was about 35-40% of what it is now.? There are pandemics, and some of them have rather high death rates.? The rate of death from the Spanish flu was about 2%.? The CDC is estimating a rate of death from this virus of 3%, so it's nothing to sneeze at.? In hard-hit regions, the death rate is around 4-5%, probably because in those populations, malnutrition is higher and access to care is less prevalent, and people are dying at a higher rate from opportunistic secondary infections, such as bacterial pneumonia.? The death rate in this country each year from garden-variety influenza is about 0.1%, so we are dealing with something that is more virulent and has a much greater potential for harm, so, all in all, warnings to behave exceptionally because the threat is exceptional are appropriate.? Does the media magnify the threat?? Yeah, because getting eyeballs is the core of the business.? But, if the advice comes from reputable sources, best to listen to it, instead of the nitwits. 
  Cheers.
  
   
  -- 


Michael Porter
Roswell, NM


Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking distance.... _______________________________________________

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From arvidj999 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 17 19:53:11 2020
From: arvidj999 at gmail.com (Arvid)
Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2020 20:53:11 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Was Y2k real: was everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAAoSWGN423EQTUekipTnoP_FWcSWUT19vEdrrcO+gzwiU55CXA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
 <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
 <20200317011341.5B940A0BC7@autox.team.net>
 <CAAoSWGMHpfNsHEZuQExJtzHmecV_vYFV4v4eUwkRMBMMfeq28w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAO8Q7CNbbMo06YSwVHtMXcggrG4BF5RzUn4ACv_-hmJTXDjnag@mail.gmail.com>
 <b0bd9409-fd99-5f63-dfc4-4b4280fa0191@comcast.net>
 <CAO8Q7CNBSf3KL0zMak7zbxtsHYzphUEfHhUAxHQC8kd2rsP-ow@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAAoSWGN423EQTUekipTnoP_FWcSWUT19vEdrrcO+gzwiU55CXA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <fbddf73f-4a3f-53c8-f0e3-80e4ed895462@gmail.com>

I also worked in health insurance IT around Y2K.

There appeared to be two ways to fix it. One was to extend all date fields to accommodate the century. The other was to leave the date field as is and add logic where it was used to "do the right thing". It was assumed that most people were not over 100 years old so birthdays were assumed to be in the century appropriate for someone under 100. 01/01/00 was assumed to be in 2000, not 1900. Same way with dates of service, etc. ... assumed to be within the last 10 years.

Still took several years to go thru all the code that had been written over the last 20 years to get everything tested and working. All the effort turned it into a non-event.

Note that it will probably happen again with Y2K38 when the Linux epoch date rolls over but I am quite certain that will be somebody else's problem ;-}

On 3/17/20 10:35 AM, Mark Andy via Shop-talk wrote:
> Howdy,
>
> As someone intimately involved with?Y2k back in the day...
>
> The software systems I worked on would for sure have broken with any dates > 12/31/1999.? Now, those systems were all health insurance related, so unlikely to cause everything to just shut off, but I would imagine billing systems for utility companies issuing shut off orders for lack of payment, etc. etc. would also have been affected.
>
> I don't think the world would have ended, but there was legitimately a year or so of necessary work to make Y2k not being a thing that actually happened.
>
> FWIW.
>
> Mark
>
> On Tue, Mar 17, 2020 at 9:37 AM Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>
>
>
>     On Tue, Mar 17, 2020 at 9:33 AM Donald H Locker via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>
>         One problem that we will run into is that if the
>         measures are sufficiently effective, we won't have a catastrophe, and
>         many people will complain, "Well, that was all for naught!" and won't
>         want to take appropriate measures next time.
>
>
>     Like Y2k.? I'ts never been clear to me how much of the lack of catastrophe was due to overhype, and how much was due to a bunch of people buckling down and fixing it before it was a problem.
>     _______________________________________________
>
>     Shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
>     Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>     Suggested annual donation? $12.96
>     Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
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>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
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> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
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From eric at megageek.com  Thu Mar 19 11:46:38 2020
From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 13:46:38 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
 <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
 <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>

Dave writes
>Dealing with this situation with wishful thinking is a recipe for 
disaster.

No disrespect to you, Dave, but your post brought up the problem I'm 
having with all this. None of this is directed at you or anyone here, just 
my frustration with this situation.

First, we loose tens of thousands of people each year to the flu, but 
there is never a whisper of it.  In fact, many of the people that are 
shaking in their boots now are the same people that parrot the 'I'm not 
getting a flu shot, that will just get me sick" manta.  But if they 
released an untested vaccine today, they would be lining up by the 
millions.  I hate hypocrisy.  (I'm not suggesting that you are in any way 
one of these people.)

Next, of course 'professionals' in the industry will claim that this is 
the end of days.  Just look how money is flowing into labs without 
question.  I can't say I blame them, they have most likely been fighting 
for grants for the past decade, it makes sense to hype it up for funding 
now.

Finally, the news networks (both sides) have been driving this agenda to 
sell ad space.  I will stand by my guns here and say that this is nothing 
more than any of the other flus that go around this time of year.  If the 
media wasn't crying about a falling sky, people wouldn't panic and life 
would be much more predictable.  They will cause more panic before this is 
over.

I say this as a person (almost 50) WITH respiratory issues and I will NOT 
change any habit as a result of this.  But I am getting more shop time and 
it's awesome!

One more final note-  I have looked in all my sofas, under all my 
cushions, and I didn't find ANY women to spend time with.  8>(  I guess I 
need to shop at better furniture stores!



"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational 
being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
Waldo Emerson 
-Who is John Galt?
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From jamesf at groupwbench.org  Thu Mar 19 12:12:06 2020
From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 14:12:06 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
 <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
 <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>
 <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <5C077348-1E33-474D-AC4F-0334EC17E445@groupwbench.org>



> On Mar 19, 2020, at 1:46 PM, eric--- via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> First, we loose tens of thousands of people each year to the flu, but there is never a whisper of it.

Based on the ridiculously small amount of testing we've done, this virus is 10x deadlier than the flu. That could change once testing is able to identify people who are asymptomatic, but still it's only been around for 3 months. Comparing it to the flu is irrelevant except that they are both viruses. as is the common cold, herpes, HIV, etc. etc.

> 
> Next, of course 'professionals' in the industry will claim that this is the end of days.  Just look how money is flowing into labs without question.  I can't say I blame them, they have most likely been fighting for grants for the past decade, it makes sense to hype it up for funding now. 

The corona virus family will not go away. This is #4 in our lifetimes. The more we encroach on wildlife, the more viruses will cross over from animals to humans. And we don't seem to be making fewer humans, globally speaking. 

> 
> Finally, the news networks (both sides) have been driving this agenda to sell ad space.  I will stand by my guns here and say that this is nothing more than any of the other flus that go around this time of year.  If the media wasn't crying about a falling sky, people wouldn't panic and life would be much more predictable.  They will cause more panic before this is over. 

People are free to buy their own news instead of choosing the ad-funded channel that best confirms their biases and frames of mind. The CDC news is free and as accurate as we have. What's worse than the over-reaction to the news is the under-reaction, or the resistance to react, because someone doesn't like the source. Refusing to believe the news because it seems overhyped is not differnet than refusing to get a flu shot because it seems overhyped. My sister is a nurse in NY where everyone has a Godfather-like sense of entitlement and are still walking around like they can't be inconvenienced. Yet if one of their elderly relatives got sick from it, you'd never hear the end of it. There's your hypocricy. 

> 
> I say this as a person (almost 50) WITH respiratory issues and I will NOT change any habit as a result of this.

Then I wish you the best of luck. Just don't give it to anyone else if you're out and about feeling fine. Asymptomatic vectors are very real and have spread this thing far more than the sick people have. 

>  But I am getting more shop time and it's awesome! 

I was completely unprepared in this regard. The BBQ flab? was fun but short-lived. Even once I decide on a compressor there is only a bicycle to ready. 

> 
> One more final note-  I have looked in all my sofas, under all my cushions, and I didn't find ANY women to spend time with.  8>(  I guess I need to shop at better furniture stores! 

Maybe Amazon can help? We now have a few good recommendations for quiet copressors :-D

jim


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From fishplate at gmail.com  Thu Mar 19 12:55:38 2020
From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 14:55:38 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <5C077348-1E33-474D-AC4F-0334EC17E445@groupwbench.org>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
 <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
 <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>
 <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
 <5C077348-1E33-474D-AC4F-0334EC17E445@groupwbench.org>
Message-ID: <CAO8Q7CN841gQYUuTv1Odcr9G9r6MnrBn1j5Y7qqoA7++d1igBw@mail.gmail.com>

I really can't add much to Jim's response, but I want to emphasize this:

"Then I wish you the best of luck. Just don't give it to anyone else if
you're out and about feeling fine. Asymptomatic vectors are very real and
have spread this thing far more than the sick people have."

That's the gist of it.  Go to the CDC or the WHO or your state public
health agency for the information you need.   They will tell you that if
you /have? to go out among your neighbors, wash your hands, avoid groups,
and keep your distance.  Sure, it's a pain in the ass, but we are literally
all in this together, whether we like it or not.

On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 2:20 PM Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

>
>
> On Mar 19, 2020, at 1:46 PM, eric--- via Shop-talk <
> shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> First, we loose tens of thousands of people each year to the flu, but
> there is never a whisper of it.
>
>
> Based on the ridiculously small amount of testing we've done, this virus
> is 10x deadlier than the flu. That could change once testing is able to
> identify people who are asymptomatic, but still it's only been around for 3
> months. Comparing it to the flu is irrelevant except that they are both
> viruses. as is the common cold, herpes, HIV, etc. etc.
>
>
> Next, of course 'professionals' in the industry will claim that this is
> the end of days.  Just look how money is flowing into labs without
> question.  I can't say I blame them, they have most likely been fighting
> for grants for the past decade, it makes sense to hype it up for funding
> now.
>
>
> The corona virus family will not go away. This is #4 in our lifetimes. The
> more we encroach on wildlife, the more viruses will cross over from animals
> to humans. And we don't seem to be making fewer humans, globally speaking.
>
>
> Finally, the news networks (both sides) have been driving this agenda to
> sell ad space.  I will stand by my guns here and say that this is nothing
> more than any of the other flus that go around this time of year.  If the
> media wasn't crying about a falling sky, people wouldn't panic and life
> would be much more predictable.  They will cause more panic before this is
> over.
>
>
> People are free to buy their own news instead of choosing the ad-funded
> channel that best confirms their biases and frames of mind. The CDC news is
> free and as accurate as we have. What's worse than the over-reaction to the
> news is the under-reaction, or the resistance to react, because someone
> doesn't like the source. Refusing to believe the news because it seems
> overhyped is not differnet than refusing to get a flu shot because it seems
> overhyped. My sister is a nurse in NY where everyone has a Godfather-like
> sense of entitlement and are still walking around like they can't be
> inconvenienced. Yet if one of their elderly relatives got sick from it,
> you'd never hear the end of it. There's your hypocricy.
>
>
> I say this as a person (almost 50) WITH respiratory issues and I will NOT
> change any habit as a result of this.
>
>
> Then I wish you the best of luck. Just don't give it to anyone else if
> you're out and about feeling fine. Asymptomatic vectors are very real and
> have spread this thing far more than the sick people have.
>
>  But I am getting more shop time and it's awesome!
>
>
> I was completely unprepared in this regard. The BBQ flab? was fun but
> short-lived. Even once I decide on a compressor there is only a bicycle to
> ready.
>
>
> One more final note-  I have looked in all my sofas, under all my
> cushions, and I didn't find ANY women to spend time with.  8>(  I guess I
> need to shop at better furniture stores!
>
>
> Maybe Amazon can help? We now have a few good recommendations for quiet
> copressors :-D
>
> jim
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate at gmail.com
>
>
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From TR3driver at ca.rr.com  Thu Mar 19 15:13:17 2020
From: TR3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 14:13:17 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
 <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
 <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>
 <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <BCA136F1C7A24E1B86607088E2C008AB@RYPC>


> First, we loose tens of thousands of people each year to the 
> flu, but there is never a whisper of it. 

And the current projection is that we may lose over 2 million people to this
new form of flu.  Any form of death that suddenly jumps by a factor of 100
(estimated) is bound to attract attention.

> I will stand by my guns here 
> and say that this is nothing more than any of the other flus 
> that go around this time of year.

Ok, maybe it's no worse than the Spanish flu.  But the Spanish flu killed
more people worldwide than died in WWI.

>  If the media wasn't crying 
> about a falling sky, people wouldn't panic and life would be 
> much more predictable.

True; but that prediction currently includes a roughly 1% chance of drowning
in your own phlegm, because there aren't enough ventilators and hospital
beds to go around.  Crappy way for anyone to die, even if it doesn't get you
personally.

I suppose, to a large extent, it boils down to what a human life is worth.
But every one of those 2.2 million potential deaths is someone's son, or
daughter, or grandkid, or grandparent, etc.  So maybe they are worth trying
to save after all.

> One more final note-  I have looked in all my sofas, under 
> all my cushions, and I didn't find ANY women to spend time 
> with.  8>(  I guess I need to shop at better furniture stores! 

And perhaps that is part of the issue.  Even though my first wife already
passed, I do have some great-grandkids that I want to grow up happy and
healthy even if I'm not there to see it.

-- Randall



From eric at megageek.com  Thu Mar 19 16:31:23 2020
From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 18:31:23 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <BCA136F1C7A24E1B86607088E2C008AB@RYPC>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
 <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
 <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>
 <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
 <BCA136F1C7A24E1B86607088E2C008AB@RYPC>
Message-ID: <OF5546FC78.E5F2CAEC-ON85258530.00789F75-85258530.007BB9FA@mail.megageek.com>

I do appreciate everyone's comments here.  I'm not trying to start a war 
or anything, and I will stop if no one wants to hear my side (just let me 
know)

But I'm guessing we all have some extra time on our hands now and this is 
a great way to stay in touch with others, without risk.

A few rebuttals, 

Yes, they are saying that this seems to be more fatal then the flu, 
however, I believe there are 2 main reasons for that.
1-where it started, china then moved to Iran.  Both of these places have 
poor nutrition, poor medical care (and even poorer access to it.), and 
elderly populations.  Italy also has poor medical care (albeit better than 
the other two.)  So fatalities were higher than average modern 
populations. 

2-Then, there is most likely a vast populations (even in those areas) that 
got the virus, and shrugged it off as the flu, got better, and never 
reported it.  So that means that you can track 100% of the fatalities, but 
you do not know how many 'sick but were fine' people you had.  This will 
artificially inflate fatality statistics.

So, that is why it may SEEM to be worst. Next, comparing this to the 
Spanish flu is unfair as we have a way more advance medical machine 
worldwide now.  Even if that flu hit today, there wouldn't be the same 
amount of deaths.

For my job. I have been living and breathing this stuff for almost two 
weeks. We are taking a in depth look at every aspect.  The victims in our 
state all had other serious health issues. In fact the first person to die 
here had just about every major issue you can think of. 
Is it sad people are dying? Yes. I am not trying to down play it.  But 
these were all people that the flu most likely would have impacted as 
well.  It doesn't make it any less tragic, but it does instill fear in the 
rest of the population for something they can't see the details on. People 
see a "number of fatalities" statistic.  But they don't see the 
"aggravating factors for each person" facts.

My point is that the response may be way worst than the virus itself. 
Entire cities/states/countries shutting down.  Livelihoods lost.  People 
losing jobs, and means to support their families. Even with stimulus 
packages (that further reduce the dollars worth) business will be closed 
for good, jobs that don't come back. All because populations of people 
that were vulnerable to the flu or other viruses, contracted one called 
'covid-19.'  If they contracted the regular flu and died, it would have 
been like any other year. I hate to sound so insensitive, but it is 
because I'm rooting for the whole society and what's best for the vast 
majority. (yes, I'm sure sounds like the plot to an original Star Trek 
episode.)

Populations are panicking, I hope we don't see riots for food and supplies 
as people are being bombarded with more and more fear mongering by the 
media. And yes, people choose their media,but the vast majority of people 
just watch one side of the 24h networks and have no idea how mis-informed 
they are. I can say without reservations that the people on this list are 
unequivocally in the 'better informed and educated' group, but go talk to 
the average person on the street if you want to see how mis-informed 
people are. A good test is to ask 100 people "who the speaker of the house 
is?"  I'd be amaze if you got 10 correct answers (and if more than 20 
people even had an educated guess.) 

Even if it doesn't come to riots, the stress on people, the loss of 
educational opportunities (many college students may have to repeat 
classes or entire semesters, delaying their graduations.)

Or, if there is a REAL emergency that comes later, how many people will 
completely ignore it because covid-19 was a big nothing burger?

I'm not even going to go into my future prediction, as this is already 
enough of a bummer.

To leave on a positive note, it is awesome that most families are going to 
get to spend a ton of time together.  It's great that we get time to 
pursue our passions and hobbies. It is also great that this is happening 
when we are entering spring and the weather is breaking.

Please feel free to comment, I will not respond unless asked to as I don't 
want this to drag out unless there is enough interest.  This list has been 
a great resource for me for decades, and I respect each and ever one of 
you opinions and advice.

Now, I'm going back to look in the sofa cushions to see if I missed 
something.  8>)

"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational 
being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
Waldo Emerson 
-Who is John Galt?
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From dhlocker at comcast.net  Thu Mar 19 18:12:51 2020
From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 20:12:51 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <OF5546FC78.E5F2CAEC-ON85258530.00789F75-85258530.007BB9FA@mail.megageek.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
 <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
 <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>
 <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
 <BCA136F1C7A24E1B86607088E2C008AB@RYPC>
 <OF5546FC78.E5F2CAEC-ON85258530.00789F75-85258530.007BB9FA@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <4af1dd7d-a187-ab58-0dac-603c8cf2477a@comcast.net>

But we know that Italy has good health care, as does Germany and the US. 
We are succumbing because the virus is more dangerous and has a 
mortality rate that exceeds that of influenza by a factor of 20x-40x. 
(China in general may not have the best of health everywhere, but Wuhan 
is a very modern, sophisticated, healthy city. Even there, the mortality 
rate was 4.6% (3130/67800 as of today) - that is HUGE by any measure. 
Italy's mortality rate is 8.3% (3405/41035); USA is at 1.5% (200/13680) 
as of 15 minutes ago.

This is not a disease to take lightly from all the evidence.

We'll be able to tell if we haven't taken adequate precautions because 
we will have a catastrophe. If we take adequate or more-than adequate 
precautions, we will have a nothingburger - that is the goal and we 
should all strive for it, IMO. The catastrophe scenario (1918 Flu, Flint 
water, Fukushima) is not one I wish on anyone.

Donald.

*Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
() no proprietary attachments; no html mail
/\ <https://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml>

On 2020-03-19 6:31 p.m., eric--- via Shop-talk wrote:
> I do appreciate everyone's comments here. ?I'm not trying to start a war 
> or anything, and I will stop if no one wants to hear my side (just let 
> me know)
> 
> But I'm guessing we all have some extra time on our hands now and this 
> is a great way to stay in touch with others, without risk.
> 
> A few rebuttals,
> 
> Yes, they are saying that this seems to be more fatal then the flu, 
> however, I believe there are 2 main reasons for that.
> 1-where it started, china then moved to Iran. ?Both of these places have 
> poor nutrition, poor medical care (and even poorer access to it.), and 
> elderly populations. ?Italy also has poor medical care (albeit better 
> than the other two.) ?So fatalities were higher than average modern 
> populations.
> 
> 2-Then, there is most likely a vast populations (even in those areas) 
> that got the virus, and shrugged it off as the flu, got better, and 
> never reported it. ?So that means that you can track 100% of the 
> fatalities, but you do not know how many 'sick but were fine' people you 
> had. ?This will artificially inflate fatality statistics.
> 
> So, that is why it may SEEM to be worst. Next, comparing this to the 
> Spanish flu is unfair as we have a way more advance medical machine 
> worldwide now. ?Even if that flu hit today, there wouldn't be the same 
> amount of deaths.
> 
> For my job. I have been living and breathing this stuff for almost two 
> weeks. We are taking a in depth look at every aspect. ?The victims in 
> our state all had other serious health issues. In fact the first person 
> to die here had just about every major issue you can think of.
> Is it sad people are dying? Yes. I am not trying to down play it. ?But 
> these were all people that the flu most likely would have impacted as 
> well. ?It doesn't make it any less tragic, but it does instill fear in 
> the rest of the population for something they can't see the details on. 
> People see a "number of fatalities" statistic. ?But they don't see the 
> "aggravating factors for each person" facts.
> 
> My point is that the response may be way worst than the virus itself. 
> Entire cities/states/countries shutting down. ?Livelihoods lost. ?People 
> losing jobs, and means to support their families. Even with stimulus 
> packages (that further reduce the dollars worth) business will be closed 
> for good, jobs that don't come back. All because populations of people 
> that were vulnerable to the flu or other viruses, contracted one called 
> 'covid-19.' ?If they contracted the regular flu and died, it would have 
> been like any other year. I hate to sound so insensitive, but it is 
> because I'm rooting for the whole society and what's best for the vast 
> majority. (yes, I'm sure sounds like the plot to an original Star Trek 
> episode.)
> 
> Populations are panicking, I hope we don't see riots for food and 
> supplies as people are being bombarded with more and more fear mongering 
> by the media. And yes, people choose their media,but the vast majority 
> of people just watch one side of the 24h networks and have no idea how 
> mis-informed they are. I can say without reservations that the people on 
> this list are unequivocally in the 'better informed and educated' group, 
> but go talk to the average person on the street if you want to see how 
> mis-informed people are. A good test is to ask 100 people "who the 
> speaker of the house is?" ?I'd be amaze if you got 10 correct answers 
> (and if more than 20 people even had an educated guess.)
> 
> Even if it doesn't come to riots, the stress on people, the loss of 
> educational opportunities (many college students may have to repeat 
> classes or entire semesters, delaying their graduations.)
> 
> Or, if there is a REAL emergency that comes later, how many people will 
> completely ignore it because covid-19 was a big nothing burger?
> 
> I'm not even going to go into my future prediction, as this is already 
> enough of a bummer.
> 
> To leave on a positive note, it is awesome that most families are going 
> to get to spend a ton of time together. ?It's great that we get time to 
> pursue our passions and hobbies. It is also great that this is happening 
> when we are entering spring and the weather is breaking.
> 
> Please feel free to comment, I will not respond unless asked to as I 
> don't want this to drag out unless there is enough interest. ?This list 
> has been a great resource for me for decades, and I respect each and 
> ever one of you opinions and advice.
> 
> Now, I'm going back to look in the sofa cushions to see if I missed 
> something. ?8>)
> 
> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a 
> rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your 
> territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson
> -Who is John Galt?

From brabel at comcast.net  Thu Mar 19 18:36:46 2020
From: brabel at comcast.net (Bill Rabel)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 17:36:46 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <4af1dd7d-a187-ab58-0dac-603c8cf2477a@comcast.net>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
 <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
 <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>
 <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
 <BCA136F1C7A24E1B86607088E2C008AB@RYPC>
 <OF5546FC78.E5F2CAEC-ON85258530.00789F75-85258530.007BB9FA@mail.megageek.com>
 <4af1dd7d-a187-ab58-0dac-603c8cf2477a@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <22BD3B8F-2A78-456A-9D1F-BF22692593D4@comcast.net>

Italy is experiencing what happens when there is a surge of patients that overwhelms the facilities that have to deal with them. Read this article from the Wall Street Journal.

Yes, Flatten the Curve

 <https://www.wsj.com/articles/yes-flatten-the-curve-11584571566?emailToken=c88fc14202045fe10c3c5f23e00da591tk9bWtzKEEOEm+N8VgtDUItbwMMzWA2cJrcff3cjz2BePIvZ8cEAosLA8TEa0BYP1JoiVUyiGqRes8QPSmJgEg%3D%3D&reflink=article_email_share>- Bill Rabel
  Anacortes
  Sheltering In Place with a Gin & Tonic at the moment


> On Mar 19, 2020, at 5:12 PM, Donald H Locker via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> But we know that Italy has good health care, as does Germany and the US. We are succumbing because the virus is more dangerous and has a mortality rate that exceeds that of influenza by a factor of 20x-40x. (China in general may not have the best of health everywhere, but Wuhan is a very modern, sophisticated, healthy city. Even there, the mortality rate was 4.6% (3130/67800 as of today) - that is HUGE by any measure. Italy's mortality rate is 8.3% (3405/41035); USA is at 1.5% (200/13680) as of 15 minutes ago.
> 
> This is not a disease to take lightly from all the evidence.
> 
> We'll be able to tell if we haven't taken adequate precautions because we will have a catastrophe. If we take adequate or more-than adequate precautions, we will have a nothingburger - that is the goal and we should all strive for it, IMO. The catastrophe scenario (1918 Flu, Flint water, Fukushima) is not one I wish on anyone.
> 
> Donald.
> 
> *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
> () no proprietary attachments; no html mail
> /\ <https://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml>
> 
> On 2020-03-19 6:31 p.m., eric--- via Shop-talk wrote:
>> I do appreciate everyone's comments here.  I'm not trying to start a war or anything, and I will stop if no one wants to hear my side (just let me know)
>> But I'm guessing we all have some extra time on our hands now and this is a great way to stay in touch with others, without risk.
>> A few rebuttals,
>> Yes, they are saying that this seems to be more fatal then the flu, however, I believe there are 2 main reasons for that.
>> 1-where it started, china then moved to Iran.  Both of these places have poor nutrition, poor medical care (and even poorer access to it.), and elderly populations.  Italy also has poor medical care (albeit better than the other two.)  So fatalities were higher than average modern populations.
>> 2-Then, there is most likely a vast populations (even in those areas) that got the virus, and shrugged it off as the flu, got better, and never reported it.  So that means that you can track 100% of the fatalities, but you do not know how many 'sick but were fine' people you had.  This will artificially inflate fatality statistics.
>> So, that is why it may SEEM to be worst. Next, comparing this to the Spanish flu is unfair as we have a way more advance medical machine worldwide now.  Even if that flu hit today, there wouldn't be the same amount of deaths.
>> For my job. I have been living and breathing this stuff for almost two weeks. We are taking a in depth look at every aspect.  The victims in our state all had other serious health issues. In fact the first person to die here had just about every major issue you can think of.
>> Is it sad people are dying? Yes. I am not trying to down play it.  But these were all people that the flu most likely would have impacted as well.  It doesn't make it any less tragic, but it does instill fear in the rest of the population for something they can't see the details on. People see a "number of fatalities" statistic.  But they don't see the "aggravating factors for each person" facts.
>> My point is that the response may be way worst than the virus itself. Entire cities/states/countries shutting down.  Livelihoods lost.  People losing jobs, and means to support their families. Even with stimulus packages (that further reduce the dollars worth) business will be closed for good, jobs that don't come back. All because populations of people that were vulnerable to the flu or other viruses, contracted one called 'covid-19.'  If they contracted the regular flu and died, it would have been like any other year. I hate to sound so insensitive, but it is because I'm rooting for the whole society and what's best for the vast majority. (yes, I'm sure sounds like the plot to an original Star Trek episode.)
>> Populations are panicking, I hope we don't see riots for food and supplies as people are being bombarded with more and more fear mongering by the media. And yes, people choose their media,but the vast majority of people just watch one side of the 24h networks and have no idea how mis-informed they are. I can say without reservations that the people on this list are unequivocally in the 'better informed and educated' group, but go talk to the average person on the street if you want to see how mis-informed people are. A good test is to ask 100 people "who the speaker of the house is?"  I'd be amaze if you got 10 correct answers (and if more than 20 people even had an educated guess.)
>> Even if it doesn't come to riots, the stress on people, the loss of educational opportunities (many college students may have to repeat classes or entire semesters, delaying their graduations.)
>> Or, if there is a REAL emergency that comes later, how many people will completely ignore it because covid-19 was a big nothing burger?
>> I'm not even going to go into my future prediction, as this is already enough of a bummer.
>> To leave on a positive note, it is awesome that most families are going to get to spend a ton of time together.  It's great that we get time to pursue our passions and hobbies. It is also great that this is happening when we are entering spring and the weather is breaking.
>> Please feel free to comment, I will not respond unless asked to as I don't want this to drag out unless there is enough interest.  This list has been a great resource for me for decades, and I respect each and ever one of you opinions and advice.
>> Now, I'm going back to look in the sofa cushions to see if I missed something.  8>)
>> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson
>> -Who is John Galt?
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/brabel at comcast.net
> 

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From pethier7 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 07:49:35 2020
From: pethier7 at gmail.com (Philip Ethier)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 08:49:35 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <22BD3B8F-2A78-456A-9D1F-BF22692593D4@comcast.net>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
 <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
 <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>
 <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
 <BCA136F1C7A24E1B86607088E2C008AB@RYPC>
 <OF5546FC78.E5F2CAEC-ON85258530.00789F75-85258530.007BB9FA@mail.megageek.com>
 <4af1dd7d-a187-ab58-0dac-603c8cf2477a@comcast.net>
 <22BD3B8F-2A78-456A-9D1F-BF22692593D4@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <CAE16_w2QHgDqKTk1TQJoqtaR6T4TD=6V9B7NPSr10McBtPei=w@mail.gmail.com>

I'm washing my hands
I'm washing my hands
There's COVID-19 here
I'm washing my hands

I'm washing my hands
I'm washing my hands
It takes twenty seconds
I'm washing my hands
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From pethier7 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 07:56:54 2020
From: pethier7 at gmail.com (Philip Ethier)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 08:56:54 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
 <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
 <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>
 <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <CAE16_w1HYD=rra8xoNhQX=PVyXbYZVOzvLNd+fGKXQm7UTCjwA@mail.gmail.com>

Eric, I can't square your outlook with what has happened in northern Italy.

On Thu, Mar 19, 2020 at 12:46 PM eric--- via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Dave writes
> >Dealing with this situation with wishful thinking is a recipe for
> disaster.
>
> No disrespect to you, Dave, but your post brought up the problem I'm
> having with all this. None of this is directed at you or anyone here, just
> my frustration with this situation.
>
> First, we loose tens of thousands of people each year to the flu, but
> there is never a whisper of it.  In fact, many of the people that are
> shaking in their boots now are the same people that parrot the 'I'm not
> getting a flu shot, that will just get me sick" manta.  But if they
> released an untested vaccine today, they would be lining up by the
> millions.  I hate hypocrisy.  (I'm not suggesting that you are in any way
> one of these people.)
>
> Next, of course 'professionals' in the industry will claim that this is
> the end of days.  Just look how money is flowing into labs without
> question.  I can't say I blame them, they have most likely been fighting
> for grants for the past decade, it makes sense to hype it up for funding
> now.
>
> Finally, the news networks (both sides) have been driving this agenda to
> sell ad space.  I will stand by my guns here and say that this is nothing
> more than any of the other flus that go around this time of year.  If the
> media wasn't crying about a falling sky, people wouldn't panic and life
> would be much more predictable.  They will cause more panic before this is
> over.
>
> I say this as a person (almost 50) WITH respiratory issues and I will NOT
> change any habit as a result of this.  But I am getting more shop time and
> it's awesome!
>
> One more final note-  I have looked in all my sofas, under all my
> cushions, and I didn't find ANY women to spend time with.  8>(  I guess I
> need to shop at better furniture stores!
>
>
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From eric at megageek.com  Fri Mar 20 08:06:43 2020
From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 10:06:43 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19  (haiku)
In-Reply-To: <CAE16_w2QHgDqKTk1TQJoqtaR6T4TD=6V9B7NPSr10McBtPei=w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
 <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
 <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>
 <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
 <BCA136F1C7A24E1B86607088E2C008AB@RYPC>
 <OF5546FC78.E5F2CAEC-ON85258530.00789F75-85258530.007BB9FA@mail.megageek.com>
 <4af1dd7d-a187-ab58-0dac-603c8cf2477a@comcast.net>
 <22BD3B8F-2A78-456A-9D1F-BF22692593D4@comcast.net>
 <CAE16_w2QHgDqKTk1TQJoqtaR6T4TD=6V9B7NPSr10McBtPei=w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <OF5900E3AB.F371AA10-ON85258531.004C4514-85258531.004D85B4@mail.megageek.com>

Philip writes the hand washing song.  But, a all things geek, I need to 
make it work better, so here it is as a series of haikus!

I'm washing my hands
There is COVID-19 here
It's bright in the loo

I'm washing my hands
for twenty seconds, I scrub
Why is that guy here?

He's looking at me
But the germs are washed away
Where do they go now? 

Peace and calm, I am
Fear? I do not fear anything
Smaller than a van



"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational 
being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
Waldo Emerson 
-Who is John Galt?



From:   Philip Ethier via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
To:     Philip Ethier <pethier7 at gmail.com>
Cc:     shop-talk List <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Date:   03/20/2020 09:49
Subject:        Re: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
Sent by:        "Shop-talk" <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net>



I'm washing my hands
I'm washing my hands
There's COVID-19 here
I'm washing my hands

I'm washing my hands
I'm washing my hands
It takes twenty seconds
I'm washing my hands

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk 
http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: 
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/eric at megageek.com


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From dave1massey at cs.com  Fri Mar 20 08:20:10 2020
From: dave1massey at cs.com (DAVID MASSEY)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 14:20:10 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <CAE16_w2QHgDqKTk1TQJoqtaR6T4TD=6V9B7NPSr10McBtPei=w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
 <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
 <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>
 <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
 <BCA136F1C7A24E1B86607088E2C008AB@RYPC>
 <OF5546FC78.E5F2CAEC-ON85258530.00789F75-85258530.007BB9FA@mail.megageek.com>
 <4af1dd7d-a187-ab58-0dac-603c8cf2477a@comcast.net>
 <22BD3B8F-2A78-456A-9D1F-BF22692593D4@comcast.net>
 <CAE16_w2QHgDqKTk1TQJoqtaR6T4TD=6V9B7NPSr10McBtPei=w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1752062795.916600.1584714010950@mail.yahoo.com>

 A technical explanation can be found here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WU-DfYU9BU0
 
Dave 

 
 
-----Original Message-----
From: Philip Ethier via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
To: Philip Ethier <pethier7 at gmail.com>
Cc: shop-talk List <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Sent: Fri, Mar 20, 2020 8:49 am
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?

I'm washing my hands
I'm washing my hands
There's COVID-19 here
I'm washing my hands

I'm washing my hands
I'm washing my hands
It takes twenty seconds
I'm washing my hands


_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation? $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dave1massey at cs.com

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From dhlocker at comcast.net  Fri Mar 20 09:13:14 2020
From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 11:13:14 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <1752062795.916600.1584714010950@mail.yahoo.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <MW2PR07MB39782291CB1EF6966DFEB424BBF90@MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com>
 <OFB646E1A8.C9E7F92E-ON8525852D.00816C30-8525852D.0081EFEA@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAO8Q7COma7k6Q-9FpX21kN-Mw3A64G=wmqAvspmRd9gM1b1Tug@mail.gmail.com>
 <264fbe30-490e-b18a-dc51-efcca081854f@dfn.com>
 <1558077923.4074766.1584447872807@mail.yahoo.com>
 <OF22DF3C6D.0D1B6289-ON85258530.006033CB-85258530.0061A6F2@mail.megageek.com>
 <BCA136F1C7A24E1B86607088E2C008AB@RYPC>
 <OF5546FC78.E5F2CAEC-ON85258530.00789F75-85258530.007BB9FA@mail.megageek.com>
 <4af1dd7d-a187-ab58-0dac-603c8cf2477a@comcast.net>
 <22BD3B8F-2A78-456A-9D1F-BF22692593D4@comcast.net>
 <CAE16_w2QHgDqKTk1TQJoqtaR6T4TD=6V9B7NPSr10McBtPei=w@mail.gmail.com>
 <1752062795.916600.1584714010950@mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4a99e991-71a1-045a-553a-b99df17c6d03@comcast.net>

I thought his hands were clean enough after all the soap. Oh, well.

Donald.

*Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
() no proprietary attachments; no html mail
/\ <https://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml>

On 2020-03-20 10:20 a.m., DAVID MASSEY via Shop-talk wrote:
> A technical explanation can be found here:
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WU-DfYU9BU0
> 
> Dave
> 


From alfuller194 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 09:26:13 2020
From: alfuller194 at gmail.com (alfuller194 at gmail.com)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 11:26:13 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
Message-ID: <086401d5fecb$e4c1cce0$ae4566a0$@gmail.com>

Hi Eric - I have one question and one comment: 

 

Question: I am interested to know the basis for your statement below that
Italy has "poor medical care". All the information I have found indicate it
to be the exact opposite.  See, e.g., Organization for Economic Co-Operation
and Development's website
https://www.oecd.org/els/oecd-reviews-of-health-care-quality-italy-2014-9789
264225428-en.htm or pretty much everything else that comes up in the search
engine for 'quality of healthcare in Italy'.

 

Comment: I am beginning to be seriously concerned that political commentary
is swamping shop-related and other technical discussion, to the point where
the utility of the list is diminished for me.

----------------

All the best,

 

Al Fuller

 

From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> On Behalf Of eric--- via
Shop-talk
Sent: Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:31 PM
To: Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?

 

I do appreciate everyone's comments here.  I'm not trying to start a war or
anything, and I will stop if no one wants to hear my side (just let me know)


But I'm guessing we all have some extra time on our hands now and this is a
great way to stay in touch with others, without risk. 

A few rebuttals, 

Yes, they are saying that this seems to be more fatal then the flu, however,
I believe there are 2 main reasons for that. 
1-where it started, china then moved to Iran.  Both of these places have
poor nutrition, poor medical care (and even poorer access to it.), and
elderly populations.  Italy also has poor medical care (albeit better than
the other two.)  So fatalities were higher than average modern populations. 

2-Then, there is most likely a vast populations (even in those areas) that
got the virus, and shrugged it off as the flu, got better, and never
reported it.  So that means that you can track 100% of the fatalities, but
you do not know how many 'sick but were fine' people you had.  This will
artificially inflate fatality statistics. 

So, that is why it may SEEM to be worst. Next, comparing this to the Spanish
flu is unfair as we have a way more advance medical machine worldwide now.
Even if that flu hit today, there wouldn't be the same amount of deaths. 

For my job. I have been living and breathing this stuff for almost two
weeks. We are taking a in depth look at every aspect.  The victims in our
state all had other serious health issues. In fact the first person to die
here had just about every major issue you can think of. 
Is it sad people are dying? Yes. I am not trying to down play it.  But these
were all people that the flu most likely would have impacted as well.  It
doesn't make it any less tragic, but it does instill fear in the rest of the
population for something they can't see the details on. People see a "number
of fatalities" statistic.  But they don't see the "aggravating factors for
each person" facts. 

My point is that the response may be way worst than the virus itself. Entire
cities/states/countries shutting down.  Livelihoods lost.  People losing
jobs, and means to support their families. Even with stimulus packages (that
further reduce the dollars worth) business will be closed for good, jobs
that don't come back. All because populations of people that were vulnerable
to the flu or other viruses, contracted one called 'covid-19.'  If they
contracted the regular flu and died, it would have been like any other year.
I hate to sound so insensitive, but it is because I'm rooting for the whole
society and what's best for the vast majority. (yes, I'm sure sounds like
the plot to an original Star Trek episode.) 

Populations are panicking, I hope we don't see riots for food and supplies
as people are being bombarded with more and more fear mongering by the
media. And yes, people choose their media,but the vast majority of people
just watch one side of the 24h networks and have no idea how mis-informed
they are. I can say without reservations that the people on this list are
unequivocally in the 'better informed and educated' group, but go talk to
the average person on the street if you want to see how mis-informed people
are. A good test is to ask 100 people "who the speaker of the house is?"
I'd be amaze if you got 10 correct answers (and if more than 20 people even
had an educated guess.)   

Even if it doesn't come to riots, the stress on people, the loss of
educational opportunities (many college students may have to repeat classes
or entire semesters, delaying their graduations.) 

Or, if there is a REAL emergency that comes later, how many people will
completely ignore it because covid-19 was a big nothing burger? 

I'm not even going to go into my future prediction, as this is already
enough of a bummer. 

To leave on a positive note, it is awesome that most families are going to
get to spend a ton of time together.  It's great that we get time to pursue
our passions and hobbies. It is also great that this is happening when we
are entering spring and the weather is breaking. 

Please feel free to comment, I will not respond unless asked to as I don't
want this to drag out unless there is enough interest.  This list has been a
great resource for me for decades, and I respect each and ever one of you
opinions and advice. 

Now, I'm going back to look in the sofa cushions to see if I missed
something.  8>)

"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational
being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo
Emerson 
-Who is John Galt?

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From mark at bradakis.com  Fri Mar 20 09:37:38 2020
From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 09:37:38 -0600
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <086401d5fecb$e4c1cce0$ae4566a0$@gmail.com>
References: <086401d5fecb$e4c1cce0$ae4566a0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <42c8e887-93ef-8ddc-6912-f98b21935ddd@bradakis.com>


> Comment: I am beginning to be seriously concerned that political 
> commentary is swamping shop-related and other technical discussion, to 
> the point where the utility of the list is diminished for me.
>
Everyone who wishes to continue this discussion go to 
http://www.team.net/mailman/listinfo/the-local and subscribe to that 
list. It is intended for this sort of thing.

Doctor's orders!

mjb.



From stearman809 at gmail.com  Thu Mar 19 17:53:36 2020
From: stearman809 at gmail.com (Karl Vacek)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2020 18:53:36 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Small compressors
In-Reply-To: <e68e4917-e8af-7653-4b53-e30d7e65c175@gmail.com>
References: <CAAoSWGO1wSr9ptDqgks3rWjfHf73EkVNZWk01xiF=+=AVHSevw@mail.gmail.com>
 <7824E1D6-F253-4451-A44A-3493FDD79DA0@comcast.net>
 <e68e4917-e8af-7653-4b53-e30d7e65c175@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <170f5377000.28bf.cd27845553c78383775132770b7455be@gmail.com>

Love mine too.  Incredibly quiet for the power.
Karl

On March 19, 2020 12:17:17 PM Arvid via Shop-talk 
<shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> I have the 2-gallon version. Is great for staplers, filling tires, nail 
> gun, etc. Will actually run a small cutoff wheel for about 30 seconds. 
> Don't laugh. It only took 26 seconds to make the steel rod shorter!!! And 
> it seems to have reasonable recovery time.
> Between me being a little hard of hearing, the radio being on and how quiet 
> it is I never know when it is running. Very light and easy to carry. 20% 
> off coupon and $160 out the door.
> I think the 1-gallon is too small and the 4-gallon was heavier than I 
> wanted for a portable compressor. I have an 80 gallon 5hp if I need to do 
> anything serious but I can't remember the last time I bothered to get the 
> hose and find the nearest fitting. Easier to just carry the little one over 
> and plug it in.
> On 3/17/20 2:13 PM, Bill Rabel via Shop-talk wrote:
>> I bought one of those Harbor Freight 4-gallon compressors after hearing how 
>> quiet it is. Don?t dismiss it before you check it out.
>>
>> - Bill Rabel
>> Anacortes
>>
>>
>> ?I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in 
>> philosophy, as a cause for withdrawing from a friend.?
>> Thomas Jefferson
>>
>>> On Mar 17, 2020, at 8:37 AM, Mark Andy via Shop-talk 
>>> <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>>> Howdy,
>>>
>>> I haven't ever actually used one, but the first thing I'd check out would 
>>> be the inexpensive quiet compressors.  Stuff like this, though there are 
>>> obviously others...
>>>
>>> https://www.harborfreight.com/air-tools-compressors/air-compressors-tanks/2-gallon-135-psi-ultra-quiet-hand-carry-jobsite-air-compressor-64596.html
>>>
>>> Mark
>>>
>>> On Tue, Mar 17, 2020 at 9:53 AM Jim Franklin via Shop-talk 
>>> <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>>> My Porter Cable pancake has a pinhole in the tank. I have abused it for 10+ 
>>> years and it doesn't owe me anything at this point. What do people like for 
>>> small, wheeled, quiet, inexpensive? I don't see myself staying in this 
>>> house much longer so I won't be installing lines and a nice stand up unit, 
>>> but I do need to fill car tires, run a framing nail gun.
>>>
>>> thanks,
>>> jim_______________________________________________
>>>
>>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>>>
>>> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka at maracing.com
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>>>
>>> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/brabel at comcast.net
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk 
>> http://autox.team.net/archive Unsubscribe/Manage: 
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/arvidj999 at gmail.com
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/stearman809 at gmail.com

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From scott.hall.personal at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 14:19:43 2020
From: scott.hall.personal at gmail.com (Scott Hall)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 15:19:43 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
In-Reply-To: <086401d5fecb$e4c1cce0$ae4566a0$@gmail.com>
References: <086401d5fecb$e4c1cce0$ae4566a0$@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAK73_u6p9oMSVYFjd3e=sibkLGXBnr6+6uHotg6R3MaNstkgdw@mail.gmail.com>

Italy has very good medical care. As good as the U.S., and they're on a
U.K.-like national plan so no one's avoiding going for financial reasons.
They do have private hospitals that are *very* good, then the public ones
that are just as good as ones you'd see in the U.S., then some in the
sticks that would be like those in tiny U.S. towns...except most of those
have long since closed. Americans might look down on those, but the
alternative in the U.S. would be a hospital that doesn't exist any more.

On Fri, Mar 20, 2020 at 10:28 AM Al Fuller via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Hi Eric ? I have one question and one comment:
>
>
>
> Question: I am interested to know the basis for your statement below that
> Italy has ?poor medical care?. All the information I have found indicate it
> to be the exact opposite.  See, e.g., Organization for Economic
> Co-Operation and Development?s website
> https://www.oecd.org/els/oecd-reviews-of-health-care-quality-italy-2014-9789264225428-en.htm
> or pretty much everything else that comes up in the search engine for
> ?quality of healthcare in Italy?.
>
>
>
> Comment: I am beginning to be seriously concerned that political
> commentary is swamping shop-related and other technical discussion, to the
> point where the utility of the list is diminished for me.
>
> ----------------
>
> All the best,
>
>
>
> Al Fuller
>
>
>
> *From:* Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> *On Behalf Of *eric---
> via Shop-talk
> *Sent:* Thursday, March 19, 2020 6:31 PM
> *To:* Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> *Subject:* Re: [Shop-talk] everybody OK with Covid-19?
>
>
>
> I do appreciate everyone's comments here.  I'm not trying to start a war
> or anything, and I will stop if no one wants to hear my side (just let me
> know)
>
> But I'm guessing we all have some extra time on our hands now and this is
> a great way to stay in touch with others, without risk.
>
> A few rebuttals,
>
> Yes, they are saying that this seems to be more fatal then the flu,
> however, I believe there are 2 main reasons for that.
> 1-where it started, china then moved to Iran.  Both of these places have
> poor nutrition, poor medical care (and even poorer access to it.), and
> elderly populations.  Italy also has poor medical care (albeit better than
> the other two.)  So fatalities were higher than average modern populations.
>
> 2-Then, there is most likely a vast populations (even in those areas) that
> got the virus, and shrugged it off as the flu, got better, and never
> reported it.  So that means that you can track 100% of the fatalities, but
> you do not know how many 'sick but were fine' people you had.  This will
> artificially inflate fatality statistics.
>
> So, that is why it may SEEM to be worst. Next, comparing this to the
> Spanish flu is unfair as we have a way more advance medical machine
> worldwide now.  Even if that flu hit today, there wouldn't be the same
> amount of deaths.
>
> For my job. I have been living and breathing this stuff for almost two
> weeks. We are taking a in depth look at every aspect.  The victims in our
> state all had other serious health issues. In fact the first person to die
> here had just about every major issue you can think of.
> Is it sad people are dying? Yes. I am not trying to down play it.  But
> these were all people that the flu most likely would have impacted as
> well.  It doesn't make it any less tragic, but it does instill fear in the
> rest of the population for something they can't see the details on. People
> see a "number of fatalities" statistic.  But they don't see the
> "aggravating factors for each person" facts.
>
> My point is that the response may be way worst than the virus itself.
> Entire cities/states/countries shutting down.  Livelihoods lost.  People
> losing jobs, and means to support their families. Even with stimulus
> packages (that further reduce the dollars worth) business will be closed
> for good, jobs that don't come back. All because populations of people that
> were vulnerable to the flu or other viruses, contracted one called
> 'covid-19.'  If they contracted the regular flu and died, it would have
> been like any other year. I hate to sound so insensitive, but it is because
> I'm rooting for the whole society and what's best for the vast majority.
> (yes, I'm sure sounds like the plot to an original Star Trek episode.)
>
> Populations are panicking, I hope we don't see riots for food and supplies
> as people are being bombarded with more and more fear mongering by the
> media. And yes, people choose their media,but the vast majority of people
> just watch one side of the 24h networks and have no idea how mis-informed
> they are. I can say without reservations that the people on this list are
> unequivocally in the 'better informed and educated' group, but go talk to
> the average person on the street if you want to see how mis-informed people
> are. A good test is to ask 100 people "who the speaker of the house is?"
>  I'd be amaze if you got 10 correct answers (and if more than 20 people
> even had an educated guess.)
>
> Even if it doesn't come to riots, the stress on people, the loss of
> educational opportunities (many college students may have to repeat classes
> or entire semesters, delaying their graduations.)
>
> Or, if there is a REAL emergency that comes later, how many people will
> completely ignore it because covid-19 was a big nothing burger?
>
> I'm not even going to go into my future prediction, as this is already
> enough of a bummer.
>
> To leave on a positive note, it is awesome that most families are going to
> get to spend a ton of time together.  It's great that we get time to pursue
> our passions and hobbies. It is also great that this is happening when we
> are entering spring and the weather is breaking.
>
> Please feel free to comment, I will not respond unless asked to as I don't
> want this to drag out unless there is enough interest.  This list has been
> a great resource for me for decades, and I respect each and ever one of you
> opinions and advice.
>
> Now, I'm going back to look in the sofa cushions to see if I missed
> something.  8>)
>
> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational
> being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph
> Waldo Emerson
> -Who is John Galt?
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/scott.hall.personal at gmail.com
>
>
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From scott.hall.personal at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 16:48:34 2020
From: scott.hall.personal at gmail.com (Scott Hall)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 17:48:34 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] NOT Covid-related
Message-ID: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>

Well, except that I can spend more time at home, I guess.

Overall question: how smart can a mouse actually be?

So I noticed some mouse activity in the garage and the house. Put out glue
traps and snap traps. Caught maybe five or six.  Haven't caught any in
months.

But a few days ago I smelled...mouse. At least I think that's the smell.
Sort of sickly sweet, like Simple Green. I didn't see any droppings. I was
under a heat register when it kicked on, and the smell was very noticeable.
Then, last night while I was in bed...I heard them. Scurrying in the vents.

There are mice in the vents.

Option 1) Burn the house down, claim insurance, rebuild.

Option 2) get them out of there, clean the vents.

Here's my dilemma: I must have a dozen traps around the house. Most in the
kitchen, pantry, and garage, where I saw them last. I haven't caught
anything in them forever. And I put traps near all the registers, nothing
there either.

When I initially saw mice I put all the food in the pantry in glass or
metal containers and I don't see any evidence in the pantry either. I don't
think they're eating any of my food. If it weren't for the smell and the
noise I wouldn't even know they're there. I have no idea what they are
eating, but I assume they're not starving because they're still there.
They're not touching ANY of the traps. It's like they've...learned. Can
mice do that? That's disconcerting.

I pulled off the registers. I figure I can drop glue traps down there, and
snap traps if I'm really careful, but it's not like I'm just looking down
at the sheetmetal of the duct--the registers seem to be attached to a piece
of 3-inch tubing to the main duct. So while I can probably get traps in,
I'm not sure I could get them out. To say nothing of cleaning the ducts
themselves.

The ducts are all behind finished drywall. So before I just demolish the
drywall and disassemble my HVAC system, I thought I'd ask you guys for
advice.

The garage I can do the paint bucket with water and a log-roll type PVC
tube. And poison.

I don't have pets or small children at home so I'm not worried about
collateral damage and I'm so filled with hatred that I'm not worried about
being humane. I just want these little bastards gone.
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From patintexas at icloud.com  Fri Mar 20 16:54:59 2020
From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 17:54:59 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] NOT Covid-related
In-Reply-To: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <778BE32D-3DD0-4E0B-8FF9-20821B210EFC@icloud.com>

Check around your filter for droppings. If you have external air piped into your system they might be coming into that duct outside to get out of the elements. 

Good luck. 

Peace,
Pat

Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


> On Mar 20, 2020, at 5:49 PM, Scott Hall via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 

?
Well, except that I can spend more time at home, I guess.

Overall question: how smart can a mouse actually be?

So I noticed some mouse activity in the garage and the house. Put out glue traps and snap traps. Caught maybe five or six.  Haven't caught any in months.

But a few days ago I smelled...mouse. At least I think that's the smell. Sort of sickly sweet, like Simple Green. I didn't see any droppings. I was under a heat register when it kicked on, and the smell was very noticeable. Then, last night while I was in bed...I heard them. Scurrying in the vents.

There are mice in the vents.

Option 1) Burn the house down, claim insurance, rebuild.

Option 2) get them out of there, clean the vents.

Here's my dilemma: I must have a dozen traps around the house. Most in the kitchen, pantry, and garage, where I saw them last. I haven't caught anything in them forever. And I put traps near all the registers, nothing there either.

When I initially saw mice I put all the food in the pantry in glass or metal containers and I don't see any evidence in the pantry either. I don't think they're eating any of my food. If it weren't for the smell and the noise I wouldn't even know they're there. I have no idea what they are eating, but I assume they're not starving because they're still there. They're not touching ANY of the traps. It's like they've...learned. Can mice do that? That's disconcerting.

I pulled off the registers. I figure I can drop glue traps down there, and snap traps if I'm really careful, but it's not like I'm just looking down at the sheetmetal of the duct--the registers seem to be attached to a piece of 3-inch tubing to the main duct. So while I can probably get traps in, I'm not sure I could get them out. To say nothing of cleaning the ducts themselves.

The ducts are all behind finished drywall. So before I just demolish the drywall and disassemble my HVAC system, I thought I'd ask you guys for advice.

The garage I can do the paint bucket with water and a log-roll type PVC tube. And poison.

I don't have pets or small children at home so I'm not worried about collateral damage and I'm so filled with hatred that I'm not worried about being humane. I just want these little bastards gone.
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas at icloud.com


From jamesf at groupwbench.org  Fri Mar 20 16:58:52 2020
From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 18:58:52 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] NOT Covid-related
In-Reply-To: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9EE8FC69-CEFB-4645-976B-9271809E9467@groupwbench.org>

Glue traps - the mice will gnaw off their own leg(s) to escape, and possibly die in an inaccessible place. Besides, they're ffreakin cruel. 

Snap traps - only bait I've had success with is peanut butter, and it has never failed me. Enough that it will have a scent for a few days. However it will mold eventually and they seem to avoid that in my experience.

I had some in my attic and could not catch them for love or money putting traps in all the places they could possibly get in. They were living under the 18" of blown in insulation and I tried placing a board with an array of traps on top of the insulation. Then one day I added a good fresh wad of PB and bangbangbanbbang got 'em all, did another round, haven't heard any since. 

I use the ones with the fake cheese platform, it holds more peanut butter than the metal one. If you do put them down the vents make sure it won't slide out of reach when it trips. 

jim

> On Mar 20, 2020, at 6:48 PM, Scott Hall via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> Well, except that I can spend more time at home, I guess.
> 
> Overall question: how smart can a mouse actually be?
> 
> So I noticed some mouse activity in the garage and the house. Put out glue traps and snap traps. Caught maybe five or six.  Haven't caught any in months.
> 
> But a few days ago I smelled...mouse. At least I think that's the smell. Sort of sickly sweet, like Simple Green. I didn't see any droppings. I was under a heat register when it kicked on, and the smell was very noticeable. Then, last night while I was in bed...I heard them. Scurrying in the vents.
> 
> There are mice in the vents.
> 
> Option 1) Burn the house down, claim insurance, rebuild.
> 
> Option 2) get them out of there, clean the vents.
> 
> Here's my dilemma: I must have a dozen traps around the house. Most in the kitchen, pantry, and garage, where I saw them last. I haven't caught anything in them forever. And I put traps near all the registers, nothing there either.
> 
> When I initially saw mice I put all the food in the pantry in glass or metal containers and I don't see any evidence in the pantry either. I don't think they're eating any of my food. If it weren't for the smell and the noise I wouldn't even know they're there. I have no idea what they are eating, but I assume they're not starving because they're still there. They're not touching ANY of the traps. It's like they've...learned. Can mice do that? That's disconcerting.
> 
> I pulled off the registers. I figure I can drop glue traps down there, and snap traps if I'm really careful, but it's not like I'm just looking down at the sheetmetal of the duct--the registers seem to be attached to a piece of 3-inch tubing to the main duct. So while I can probably get traps in, I'm not sure I could get them out. To say nothing of cleaning the ducts themselves.
> 
> The ducts are all behind finished drywall. So before I just demolish the drywall and disassemble my HVAC system, I thought I'd ask you guys for advice.
> 
> The garage I can do the paint bucket with water and a log-roll type PVC tube. And poison.
> 
> I don't have pets or small children at home so I'm not worried about collateral damage and I'm so filled with hatred that I'm not worried about being humane. I just want these little bastards gone.
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jamesf at groupwbench.org
> 

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From rande90 at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 17:06:45 2020
From: rande90 at gmail.com (RandE)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 18:06:45 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] NOT Covid-related
In-Reply-To: <9EE8FC69-CEFB-4645-976B-9271809E9467@groupwbench.org>
References: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>
 <9EE8FC69-CEFB-4645-976B-9271809E9467@groupwbench.org>
Message-ID: <CAAWW_U0GPR4H3h6WUR=5nAMjHt2taB6AXn41j9pxFUw-vGjCdA@mail.gmail.com>

You can attach a wire to the trap and slide it down the vents.  Attach the
other end to a nail or hook so you can pull it back out.

Randy


On Fri, Mar 20, 2020 at 6:03 PM Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Glue traps - the mice will gnaw off their own leg(s) to escape, and
> possibly die in an inaccessible place. Besides, they're ffreakin cruel.
>
> Snap traps - only bait I've had success with is peanut butter, and it has
> never failed me. Enough that it will have a scent for a few days. However
> it will mold eventually and they seem to avoid that in my experience.
>
> I had some in my attic and could not catch them for love or money putting
> traps in all the places they could possibly get in. They were living under
> the 18" of blown in insulation and I tried placing a board with an array of
> traps on top of the insulation. Then one day I added a good fresh wad of PB
> and bangbangbanbbang got 'em all, did another round, haven't heard any
> since.
>
> I use the ones with the fake cheese platform, it holds more peanut butter
> than the metal one. If you do put them down the vents make sure it won't
> slide out of reach when it trips.
>
> jim
>
> > On Mar 20, 2020, at 6:48 PM, Scott Hall via Shop-talk <
> shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> >
> > Well, except that I can spend more time at home, I guess.
> >
> > Overall question: how smart can a mouse actually be?
> >
> > So I noticed some mouse activity in the garage and the house. Put out
> glue traps and snap traps. Caught maybe five or six.  Haven't caught any in
> months.
> >
> > But a few days ago I smelled...mouse. At least I think that's the smell.
> Sort of sickly sweet, like Simple Green. I didn't see any droppings. I was
> under a heat register when it kicked on, and the smell was very noticeable.
> Then, last night while I was in bed...I heard them. Scurrying in the vents.
> >
> > There are mice in the vents.
> >
> > Option 1) Burn the house down, claim insurance, rebuild.
> >
> > Option 2) get them out of there, clean the vents.
> >
> > Here's my dilemma: I must have a dozen traps around the house. Most in
> the kitchen, pantry, and garage, where I saw them last. I haven't caught
> anything in them forever. And I put traps near all the registers, nothing
> there either.
> >
> > When I initially saw mice I put all the food in the pantry in glass or
> metal containers and I don't see any evidence in the pantry either. I don't
> think they're eating any of my food. If it weren't for the smell and the
> noise I wouldn't even know they're there. I have no idea what they are
> eating, but I assume they're not starving because they're still there.
> They're not touching ANY of the traps. It's like they've...learned. Can
> mice do that? That's disconcerting.
> >
> > I pulled off the registers. I figure I can drop glue traps down there,
> and snap traps if I'm really careful, but it's not like I'm just looking
> down at the sheetmetal of the duct--the registers seem to be attached to a
> piece of 3-inch tubing to the main duct. So while I can probably get traps
> in, I'm not sure I could get them out. To say nothing of cleaning the ducts
> themselves.
> >
> > The ducts are all behind finished drywall. So before I just demolish the
> drywall and disassemble my HVAC system, I thought I'd ask you guys for
> advice.
> >
> > The garage I can do the paint bucket with water and a log-roll type PVC
> tube. And poison.
> >
> > I don't have pets or small children at home so I'm not worried about
> collateral damage and I'm so filled with hatred that I'm not worried about
> being humane. I just want these little bastards gone.
> > _______________________________________________
> >
> > Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> > Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
> >
> > Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jamesf at groupwbench.org
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/rande at pobox.com
>
>
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From dhlocker at comcast.net  Fri Mar 20 17:36:38 2020
From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 19:36:38 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] NOT Covid-related
In-Reply-To: <9EE8FC69-CEFB-4645-976B-9271809E9467@groupwbench.org>
References: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>
 <9EE8FC69-CEFB-4645-976B-9271809E9467@groupwbench.org>
Message-ID: <9b721a07-a6d7-9b38-3275-b159f14ac391@comcast.net>

I agree with not using the glue traps. Same for poisons - not only do 
you lose control of where the target animal dies, you lose control of 
where the poison goes - which can be into an innocent raptor or 
scavenger (who is otherwise very helpful.)

Donald.
--
*Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
() no proprietary attachments; no html mail
/\ <https://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml>

On 2020-03-20 6:58 p.m., Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote:
> Glue traps - the mice will gnaw off their own leg(s) to escape, and possibly die in an inaccessible place. Besides, they're ffreakin cruel.
> 
> Snap traps - only bait I've had success with is peanut butter, and it has never failed me. Enough that it will have a scent for a few days. However it will mold eventually and they seem to avoid that in my experience.
> 
> I had some in my attic and could not catch them for love or money putting traps in all the places they could possibly get in. They were living under the 18" of blown in insulation and I tried placing a board with an array of traps on top of the insulation. Then one day I added a good fresh wad of PB and bangbangbanbbang got 'em all, did another round, haven't heard any since.
> 
> I use the ones with the fake cheese platform, it holds more peanut butter than the metal one. If you do put them down the vents make sure it won't slide out of reach when it trips.
> 
> jim


[snip]

From bk13 at earthlink.net  Fri Mar 20 17:41:22 2020
From: bk13 at earthlink.net (Brian Kemp)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 16:41:22 -0700 (GMT-07:00)
Subject: [Shop-talk] NOT Covid-related
Message-ID: <1455870028.10655.1584747682808@wamui-quail.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

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From brabel at comcast.net  Fri Mar 20 17:48:13 2020
From: brabel at comcast.net (Bill Rabel)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 16:48:13 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] NOT Covid-related
In-Reply-To: <1455870028.10655.1584747682808@wamui-quail.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <1455870028.10655.1584747682808@wamui-quail.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <0D2826AE-A110-4E72-834C-3AFA15808030@comcast.net>

Another place to check for rodent entry is drain pipes. I found that rats were entering a rental unit of mine through the drain pipe where there was no washing machine installed. 

Big snap traps with PB did them in, and I put a wad of copper wool in the pipe.

- Bill Rabel
  Anacortes

?I never considered a difference of opinion in politics, in religion, in philosophy, as a cause for withdrawing from a friend.? - Thomas Jefferson

> On Mar 20, 2020, at 4:43 PM, Brian Kemp via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> ?
> I'm dealing with a similar problem.  Had an actual rat in my air duct in my brand new system.  Saw it through the register.  Put traps with peanut butter in the ducts.  Attached a length of electrical wire that came out and was secured between the register and the wall.  Only problem is that the heat is on and the peanut butter dried out right away.  I put a bunch of baits under the house and in the attic near where I found droppings.  Thought they were gone, but heard them in the wall again.
> 
> Make sure you block any openings where they might be getting in from outside.  I put new screen on my crawlspace vents and that got rid of them until the new furnace install.  Discovered a new hole they made in the siding after the install.  Blocked it and still at war with the rats.
> 
> Brian
> 
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: Scott Hall via Shop-talk 
> Sent: Mar 20, 2020 3:48 PM 
> To: "shop-talk at autox.team.net" 
> Subject: [Shop-talk] NOT Covid-related 
> 
> Well, except that I can spend more time at home, I guess.
> 
> Overall question: how smart can a mouse actually be?
> 
> So I noticed some mouse activity in the garage and the house. Put out glue traps and snap traps. Caught maybe five or six.  Haven't caught any in months.
> 
> But a few days ago I smelled...mouse. At least I think that's the smell. Sort of sickly sweet, like Simple Green. I didn't see any droppings. I was under a heat register when it kicked on, and the smell was very noticeable. Then, last night while I was in bed...I heard them. Scurrying in the vents.
> 
> There are mice in the vents.
> 
> Option 1) Burn the house down, claim insurance, rebuild.
> 
> Option 2) get them out of there, clean the vents.
> 
> Here's my dilemma: I must have a dozen traps around the house. Most in the kitchen, pantry, and garage, where I saw them last. I haven't caught anything in them forever. And I put traps near all the registers, nothing there either.
> 
> When I initially saw mice I put all the food in the pantry in glass or metal containers and I don't see any evidence in the pantry either. I don't think they're eating any of my food. If it weren't for the smell and the noise I wouldn't even know they're there. I have no idea what they are eating, but I assume they're not starving because they're still there. They're not touching ANY of the traps. It's like they've...learned. Can mice do that? That's disconcerting.
> 
> I pulled off the registers. I figure I can drop glue traps down there, and snap traps if I'm really careful, but it's not like I'm just looking down at the sheetmetal of the duct--the registers seem to be attached to a piece of 3-inch tubing to the main duct. So while I can probably get traps in, I'm not sure I could get them out. To say nothing of cleaning the ducts themselves.
> 
> The ducts are all behind finished drywall. So before I just demolish the drywall and disassemble my HVAC system, I thought I'd ask you guys for advice.
> 
> The garage I can do the paint bucket with water and a log-roll type PVC tube. And poison.
> 
> I don't have pets or small children at home so I'm not worried about collateral damage and I'm so filled with hatred that I'm not worried about being humane. I just want these little bastards gone.
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/brabel at comcast.net
> 
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From rwil at sbcglobal.net  Fri Mar 20 18:20:36 2020
From: rwil at sbcglobal.net (rwil at sbcglobal.net)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 17:20:36 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] NOT Covid-related
In-Reply-To: <9b721a07-a6d7-9b38-3275-b159f14ac391@comcast.net>
References: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>
 <9EE8FC69-CEFB-4645-976B-9271809E9467@groupwbench.org>
 <9b721a07-a6d7-9b38-3275-b159f14ac391@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <45na7ft5t76j5jalmhct40mcmtsunb7r1q@4ax.com>

The other reason not to use poison is that the rodents will go off and
die in some inaccessible spot and you get to smell their decaying
bodies for weeks.  Right up there with dead skunk.  Once I had a rat
die in space between studs where I could smell it, and reach it but
couldn't see it.  I had to reach in with double gloved hand and grope
around until I found it.  Not fun.
-Roland

On Fri, 20 Mar 2020 19:36:38 -0400, you wrote:

>I agree with not using the glue traps. Same for poisons - not only do 
>you lose control of where the target animal dies, you lose control of 
>where the poison goes - which can be into an innocent raptor or 
>scavenger (who is otherwise very helpful.)
>
>Donald.

-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus


From rwil at sbcglobal.net  Fri Mar 20 18:20:36 2020
From: rwil at sbcglobal.net (rwil at sbcglobal.net)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 17:20:36 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] NOT Covid-related
In-Reply-To: <9b721a07-a6d7-9b38-3275-b159f14ac391@comcast.net>
References: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>
 <9EE8FC69-CEFB-4645-976B-9271809E9467@groupwbench.org>
 <9b721a07-a6d7-9b38-3275-b159f14ac391@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <45na7ft5t76j5jalmhct40mcmtsunb7r1q@4ax.com>

The other reason not to use poison is that the rodents will go off and
die in some inaccessible spot and you get to smell their decaying
bodies for weeks.  Right up there with dead skunk.  Once I had a rat
die in space between studs where I could smell it, and reach it but
couldn't see it.  I had to reach in with double gloved hand and grope
around until I found it.  Not fun.
-Roland

On Fri, 20 Mar 2020 19:36:38 -0400, you wrote:

>I agree with not using the glue traps. Same for poisons - not only do 
>you lose control of where the target animal dies, you lose control of 
>where the poison goes - which can be into an innocent raptor or 
>scavenger (who is otherwise very helpful.)
>
>Donald.

-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus


From mark at bradakis.com  Fri Mar 20 20:28:13 2020
From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 20:28:13 -0600
Subject: [Shop-talk] NOT Covid-related
In-Reply-To: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <b4c40931-2b5e-c29a-e020-328ded0213b4@bradakis.com>

Go to big pet store, buy snake large enough to eat mouse.? Turn loose in 
ducts.

mjb.



From shannahquilts at gmail.com  Fri Mar 20 22:00:54 2020
From: shannahquilts at gmail.com (Shannah Miller)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 21:00:54 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] NOT Covid-related
In-Reply-To: <b4c40931-2b5e-c29a-e020-328ded0213b4@bradakis.com>
References: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>
 <b4c40931-2b5e-c29a-e020-328ded0213b4@bradakis.com>
Message-ID: <CAAy7z=2QmvP3BUHzdr7S3G+AZcdpxqLEAAK7_nszY6du011GKg@mail.gmail.com>

I laughed when I read about the snake, but my
favorite rodent elimination method, the cat, seems
unlikely to go into the ducts in any useful way.  So
maybe the snake is a good idea - how would you lure
it back out of the ducts, though?

I will say that once we started keeping cats
again, we haven't had a rodent problem.

Shannah

On Fri, Mar 20, 2020 at 7:28 PM Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Go to big pet store, buy snake large enough to eat mouse.  Turn loose in
> ducts.
>
> mjb.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shannahquilts at gmail.com
>
>
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From rkg at teleport.com  Fri Mar 20 23:42:22 2020
From: rkg at teleport.com (Richard George)
Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2020 22:42:22 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] NOT Covid-related
In-Reply-To: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAK73_u7pT1L99gn2zp6jKuaaOAYLKKT-C549yFX7cwL1DMJVcA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <36d595f0-ee53-45ea-c045-ca412dd537b8@teleport.com>

Oh jeez, just check out this guy's channel - he tries out all kinds of 
mousetraps....

https://www.youtube.com/user/historichunter

Good Luck,

rkg

(Richard George)

On 3/20/2020 3:48 PM, Scott Hall via Shop-talk wrote:
> Well, except that I can spend more time at home, I guess.
>
> Overall question: how smart can a mouse actually be?
>
> So I noticed some mouse activity in the garage and the house. Put out 
> glue traps and snap traps. Caught?maybe five or six.? Haven't caught 
> any in months.
>
> But a few days ago I smelled...mouse. At least I think that's the 
> smell. Sort of sickly sweet, like Simple Green. I didn't see any 
> droppings. I was under a heat register when it kicked on, and the 
> smell was very noticeable. Then, last night while I was in bed...I 
> heard them. Scurrying in the vents.
>
> There are mice in the vents.
>
> Option 1) Burn the house down, claim insurance, rebuild.
>
> Option 2) get them out of there, clean the vents.
>
> Here's my dilemma: I must have a dozen traps around the house. Most in 
> the kitchen, pantry, and garage, where I saw them last. I haven't 
> caught anything in them forever. And I put traps near all the 
> registers, nothing there either.
>
> When I initially saw mice I put all the food in the pantry in glass or 
> metal containers and I don't see any evidence in the pantry either. I 
> don't think they're eating any of my food. If it weren't for the smell 
> and the noise I wouldn't even know they're there. I have no idea what 
> they are eating, but I assume they're not starving because they're 
> still there. They're not touching ANY of the traps. It's like 
> they've...learned. Can mice do that? That's disconcerting.
>
> I pulled off the registers. I figure I can drop glue traps down there, 
> and snap traps if I'm really careful, but it's not like I'm just 
> looking down at the sheetmetal of the duct--the registers seem to be 
> attached to a piece of 3-inch tubing to the main duct. So while I can 
> probably get traps in, I'm not sure I could get them out. To say 
> nothing of cleaning the ducts themselves.
>
> The ducts are all behind finished drywall. So before I just demolish 
> the drywall and disassemble my HVAC system, I thought I'd ask you guys 
> for advice.
>
> The garage I can do the paint bucket with water and a log-roll type 
> PVC tube. And poison.
>
> I don't have pets or small children at home so I'm not worried about 
> collateral damage and I'm so filled with hatred that I'm not worried 
> about being humane. I just want these little bastards gone.
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/rkg at teleport.com
>
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From arvidj999 at gmail.com  Tue Mar 24 14:25:01 2020
From: arvidj999 at gmail.com (Arvid)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2020 15:25:01 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] In case anyone is interested ... 2hp HF compressor
 $129.99 coupon.
In-Reply-To: <fbddf73f-4a3f-53c8-f0e3-80e4ed895462@gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
 <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
 <20200317011341.5B940A0BC7@autox.team.net>
 <CAAoSWGMHpfNsHEZuQExJtzHmecV_vYFV4v4eUwkRMBMMfeq28w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAO8Q7CNbbMo06YSwVHtMXcggrG4BF5RzUn4ACv_-hmJTXDjnag@mail.gmail.com>
 <b0bd9409-fd99-5f63-dfc4-4b4280fa0191@comcast.net>
 <CAO8Q7CNBSf3KL0zMak7zbxtsHYzphUEfHhUAxHQC8kd2rsP-ow@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAAoSWGN423EQTUekipTnoP_FWcSWUT19vEdrrcO+gzwiU55CXA@mail.gmail.com>
 <fbddf73f-4a3f-53c8-f0e3-80e4ed895462@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1fb910f7-bea0-5242-3d4e-670d155ff25a@gmail.com>

Just got an email from HF with a coupon ... 27052229 ... good thru April 5th for the 2hp ultra-quiet compressor for $129.99.

If anyone wants one but did not get the email let me know and I'll forward it to you.

Arvid


From dmscheidt at gmail.com  Tue Mar 24 15:19:49 2020
From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt)
Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2020 16:19:49 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] In case anyone is interested ... 2hp HF compressor
 $129.99 coupon.
In-Reply-To: <1fb910f7-bea0-5242-3d4e-670d155ff25a@gmail.com>
References: <CAE16_w1_M3OR4qPDtYe0eZprpfuOHX5vxv0K-Sy=uCSkzr9qxA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CANuE7YCtuZuuc6-dXA3kW3+64PC+jfC_gK_4LbhM8ytk9NCw=A@mail.gmail.com>
 <4FA554B9-F588-4C45-A6DE-BDEF98C06FF2@gmail.com>
 <0790a86d-0de4-393e-9e2e-61b9e2d35773@comcast.net>
 <20200317011341.5B940A0BC7@autox.team.net>
 <CAAoSWGMHpfNsHEZuQExJtzHmecV_vYFV4v4eUwkRMBMMfeq28w@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAO8Q7CNbbMo06YSwVHtMXcggrG4BF5RzUn4ACv_-hmJTXDjnag@mail.gmail.com>
 <b0bd9409-fd99-5f63-dfc4-4b4280fa0191@comcast.net>
 <CAO8Q7CNBSf3KL0zMak7zbxtsHYzphUEfHhUAxHQC8kd2rsP-ow@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAAoSWGN423EQTUekipTnoP_FWcSWUT19vEdrrcO+gzwiU55CXA@mail.gmail.com>
 <fbddf73f-4a3f-53c8-f0e3-80e4ed895462@gmail.com>
 <1fb910f7-bea0-5242-3d4e-670d155ff25a@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+k5supDuwDxy8MdEzH5JnzeEC4NuoX=+RcxRQ_9qoKa2O=AJg@mail.gmail.com>

On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 3:25 PM Arvid via Shop-talk
<shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> Just got an email from HF with a coupon ... 27052229 ... good thru April 5th for the 2hp ultra-quiet compressor for $129.99.
>
> If anyone wants one but did not get the email let me know and I'll forward it to you.
>

You don't need the coupon, just the number on it.  Cashiers are
perfectly happy to type it in.
Most HF coupons appear at HFQPD.com eventually:
http://www.hfqpdb.com/best_coupon/FORTRESS+2+GALLON%2C+1.2+HP%2C+135+PSI+ULTRA-QUIET%2C+OIL-FREE+PROFESSIONAL+AIR+COMPRESSOR


> Arvid
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dmscheidt at gmail.com
>


-- 
David Scheidt
dmscheidt at gmail.com

From markmiller at threeboysfarm.com  Wed Mar 25 12:57:33 2020
From: markmiller at threeboysfarm.com (Mark Miller)
Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2020 11:57:33 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] HF coupons
In-Reply-To: <mailman.8.1585159202.21232.shop-talk@autox.team.net>
References: <mailman.8.1585159202.21232.shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Message-ID: <0380e8ec-85df-d49f-d0a8-54014c251b85@threeboysfarm.com>

I have an app on my phone for their coupons.? It searches out all of the 
various sources (emails, mailings, their website, etc) and lists all 
current coupons.? You can select the ones you might want and put them in 
a folder, then just show them from your phone to the cashier and s/he 
scans them.? Good for when you are out and pass their store and realize 
there is something you need.? Both of the quiet compressors are in there 
as well as the larger and the smaller 'normal' ones.? In the android 
store it is called 'HF Coupons' - whoever thought that name up should 
get a big bonus.

Regards,

Mark Miller   707-490-5834
markmiller at threeboysfarm.com

On 3/25/2020 11:00 AM, shop-talk-request at autox.team.net wrote:
> On Tue, Mar 24, 2020 at 3:25 PM Arvid via Shop-talk
> <shop-talk at autox.team.net>  wrote:
>> Just got an email from HF with a coupon ... 27052229 ... good thru April 5th for the 2hp ultra-quiet compressor for $129.99.
>>
>> If anyone wants one but did not get the email let me know and I'll forward it to you.
>>
> You don't need the coupon, just the number on it.  Cashiers are
> perfectly happy to type it in.
> Most HF coupons appear at HFQPD.com eventually:
> http://www.hfqpdb.com/best_coupon/FORTRESS+2+GALLON%2C+1.2+HP%2C+135+PSI+ULTRA-QUIET%2C+OIL-FREE+PROFESSIONAL+AIR+COMPRESSOR
>
>
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From nogera at icloud.com  Thu Mar 26 09:32:27 2020
From: nogera at icloud.com (Robert Nogueirao)
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2020 10:32:27 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Pressure testing 1 1/2 inch PVC
Message-ID: <A28BC66F-6072-48FF-B7FE-176E95A9D07A@icloud.com>

I?m trying to check a buried 1 1/2 inch PVC pipe (pool) for a leak. I plan on pressurizing it to see if a leak is exposed.   What?s a safe pressure that won?t blow apart fittings?

Bob Nogueira

Bob Nogueira 

From markmiller at threeboysfarm.com  Thu Mar 26 14:44:34 2020
From: markmiller at threeboysfarm.com (Mark Miller)
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2020 13:44:34 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] PVC pressure
In-Reply-To: <mailman.7.1585245603.18260.shop-talk@autox.team.net>
References: <mailman.7.1585245603.18260.shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Message-ID: <96634a4a-386c-274c-1f14-dbda12109e26@threeboysfarm.com>

There are a large number of 'ifs' in any answer:
If it is all sch 40 piping and fittings (none of the thin wall sch 125 
stuff or flexible piping)
if the fittings were properly glued in
if it is not under stress from shifting after installation

That all said: the raw pipe is good for close to 200psi, burst strength 
is 5X that.? Give it no more than 20 and be very safe.? Or fill the 
piping with water and then pressurize above the water line with air and 
be even safer.? Or connect clear tubing to the pipe, hold it as high up 
as you can, and fill that all with water and see if the level drops, 
it's just under 1/2 PSI per foot of water elevation.


Regards, Mark Miller 707-490-5834 markmiller at threeboysfarm.com


On 3/26/2020 11:00 AM, shop-talk-request at autox.team.net wrote:
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2020 10:32:27 -0500
> From: Robert Nogueirao<nogera at icloud.com>
> To: Shop Talk<shop-talk at autox.team.net>
> Subject: [Shop-talk] Pressure testing 1 1/2 inch PVC
> Message-ID:<A28BC66F-6072-48FF-B7FE-176E95A9D07A at icloud.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> I?m trying to check a buried 1 1/2 inch PVC pipe (pool) for a leak. I plan on pressurizing it to see if a leak is exposed.   What?s a safe pressure that won?t blow apart fittings?
>
> Bob Nogueira

From tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com  Thu Mar 26 16:13:52 2020
From: tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com (Tim .)
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2020 22:13:52 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] sound bars, older flat screens,
 not that big of an audiophile and OT
Message-ID: <CH2PR04MB6505143ED2FE8D30A278AA5DB4CF0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>

Hey guys,

Hope everyone is safe and healthy.

I have a Sharp Aquos flat screen that is on borrowed time. A friend bought the same exact size and model about the same time we did and his died three or so years ago. I assume mine is still alive because we turn off the power filter every night.

Anyway, while the flat screen still works and the picture is still decent (I just try VERY HARD to not compare it to the modern flat screens), the audio is getting bad about a quick as my hearing.

I have a Bose speaker system, 301s, 701s and a sound bar, that I can feed from my stereo. But, the stereo really needs to be replaced and the remote for it is dead. So, I can either buy a universal remote which I don't want to do for an outdated receiver, or I can try to feed the sound bar direct from the TV.

My issue is, the sound bar is proper wires into pinch connectors and the TV is RCA jacks.

Am I over thinking this or can I simply take and RCA cable and cut the female end off and put the wires into my sound bar? Or should I but an adapter? I am looking for cheap-ish since at some point I'll have to buy a new flat screen that will hopefully be able to feed my speakers properly.

Thanks
stay healthy
tim
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From fishplate at gmail.com  Thu Mar 26 16:40:02 2020
From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough)
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2020 18:40:02 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Pressure testing 1 1/2 inch PVC
In-Reply-To: <A28BC66F-6072-48FF-B7FE-176E95A9D07A@icloud.com>
References: <A28BC66F-6072-48FF-B7FE-176E95A9D07A@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <CAO8Q7CPPN9ULa9h-hX_RY2=5YZp8W-8CwfLxp12nNd6i91F00Q@mail.gmail.com>

DWV pipe is tested around 5 psi and hold for two hours.  Try that first.

On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 11:32 AM Robert Nogueirao via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> I?m trying to check a buried 1 1/2 inch PVC pipe (pool) for a leak. I plan
> on pressurizing it to see if a leak is exposed.   What?s a safe pressure
> that won?t blow apart fittings?
>
> Bob Nogueira
>
> Bob Nogueira
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate at gmail.com
>
>
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From jdinnis at gmail.com  Thu Mar 26 16:42:07 2020
From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis)
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2020 17:42:07 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] sound bars, older flat screens,
 not that big of an audiophile and OT
In-Reply-To: <CH2PR04MB6505143ED2FE8D30A278AA5DB4CF0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB6505143ED2FE8D30A278AA5DB4CF0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <CANuE7YDyEcN07OqxYD+C5H6u+QHpzYQWkdM5_UVAWbwe9aSBNQ@mail.gmail.com>

If your soundbar has speaker-wire type inputs, you probably can't feed it
directly from the TV.  It will need some sort of amplifier to bring the
line level output from the TV (RCA jacks) up to speaker level.  You could
get a new receiver, they go pretty cheap on WOOT and monoprice.  Or you
could get a new soundbar with a line level input ( I have seen some good
deals at Sams club on these).

John

On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 5:14 PM Tim . via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Hey guys,
>
> Hope everyone is safe and healthy.
>
> I have a Sharp Aquos flat screen that is on borrowed time. A friend bought
> the same exact size and model about the same time we did and his died three
> or so years ago. I assume mine is still alive because we turn off the power
> filter every night.
>
> Anyway, while the flat screen still works and the picture is still decent
> (I just try VERY HARD to not compare it to the modern flat screens), the
> audio is getting bad about a quick as my hearing.
>
> I have a Bose speaker system, 301s, 701s and a sound bar, that I can feed
> from my stereo. But, the stereo really needs to be replaced and the remote
> for it is dead. So, I can either buy a universal remote which I don't want
> to do for an outdated receiver, or I can try to feed the sound bar direct
> from the TV.
>
> My issue is, the sound bar is proper wires into pinch connectors and the
> TV is RCA jacks.
>
> Am I over thinking this or can I simply take and RCA cable and cut the
> female end off and put the wires into my sound bar? Or should I but an
> adapter? I am looking for cheap-ish since at some point I'll have to buy a
> new flat screen that will hopefully be able to feed my speakers properly.
>
> Thanks
> stay healthy
> tim
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com
>
>

-- 
=================================
= Never offend people with style when you   =
= can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =
=================================
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From fishplate at gmail.com  Thu Mar 26 16:46:19 2020
From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough)
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2020 18:46:19 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] sound bars, older flat screens,
 not that big of an audiophile and OT
In-Reply-To: <CANuE7YDyEcN07OqxYD+C5H6u+QHpzYQWkdM5_UVAWbwe9aSBNQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB6505143ED2FE8D30A278AA5DB4CF0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
 <CANuE7YDyEcN07OqxYD+C5H6u+QHpzYQWkdM5_UVAWbwe9aSBNQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO8Q7CMEz-p_nSbCoPV4KYDdTNd5vUQWBLVhb3TKiYWgGnLTjg@mail.gmail.com>

What about something like this?

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/597466-REG/Pyle_Pro_PCA2_PCA2_Mini_2_x.html


On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 6:42 PM John Innis via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> If your soundbar has speaker-wire type inputs, you probably can't feed it
> directly from the TV.  It will need some sort of amplifier to bring the
> line level output from the TV (RCA jacks) up to speaker level.  You could
> get a new receiver, they go pretty cheap on WOOT and monoprice.  Or you
> could get a new soundbar with a line level input ( I have seen some good
> deals at Sams club on these).
>
> John
>
> On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 5:14 PM Tim . via Shop-talk <
> shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
>> Hey guys,
>>
>> Hope everyone is safe and healthy.
>>
>> I have a Sharp Aquos flat screen that is on borrowed time. A friend
>> bought the same exact size and model about the same time we did and his
>> died three or so years ago. I assume mine is still alive because we turn
>> off the power filter every night.
>>
>> Anyway, while the flat screen still works and the picture is still decent
>> (I just try VERY HARD to not compare it to the modern flat screens), the
>> audio is getting bad about a quick as my hearing.
>>
>> I have a Bose speaker system, 301s, 701s and a sound bar, that I can feed
>> from my stereo. But, the stereo really needs to be replaced and the remote
>> for it is dead. So, I can either buy a universal remote which I don't want
>> to do for an outdated receiver, or I can try to feed the sound bar direct
>> from the TV.
>>
>> My issue is, the sound bar is proper wires into pinch connectors and the
>> TV is RCA jacks.
>>
>> Am I over thinking this or can I simply take and RCA cable and cut the
>> female end off and put the wires into my sound bar? Or should I but an
>> adapter? I am looking for cheap-ish since at some point I'll have to buy a
>> new flat screen that will hopefully be able to feed my speakers properly.
>>
>> Thanks
>> stay healthy
>> tim
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
>> http://autox.team.net/archive
>>
>> Unsubscribe/Manage:
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com
>>
>>
>
> --
> =================================
> = Never offend people with style when you   =
> = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =
> =================================
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate at gmail.com
>
>
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From ronnie.day at gmail.com  Thu Mar 26 19:46:49 2020
From: ronnie.day at gmail.com (Ronnie Day)
Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2020 20:46:49 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] sound bars, older flat screens,
 not that big of an audiophile and OT
In-Reply-To: <CAO8Q7CMEz-p_nSbCoPV4KYDdTNd5vUQWBLVhb3TKiYWgGnLTjg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB6505143ED2FE8D30A278AA5DB4CF0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
 <CANuE7YDyEcN07OqxYD+C5H6u+QHpzYQWkdM5_UVAWbwe9aSBNQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAO8Q7CMEz-p_nSbCoPV4KYDdTNd5vUQWBLVhb3TKiYWgGnLTjg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMHhs6e1Mx_8YMS+fVcM=iFJzhOcTcUBxcUb+BN04b8gQ=e_Tg@mail.gmail.com>

What model number is the TV? Our first couple of flat screens years were
Aquos. I don't remember them having speaker level outputs, just line level.
You can't/shouldn't try to drive a line level input with a speaker level
signal. You can use a small two or three piece powered speaker system
designed primarily for computer use. The inputs to those are usually 3.5 mm
stereo plugs so you'd need an adapter if the audio outs on the TV are RCA
as I expect they are. ll sorts of choices and prices floating around that
should work for you now and later.

RD

On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 5:47 PM Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> What about something like this?
>
>
> https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/597466-REG/Pyle_Pro_PCA2_PCA2_Mini_2_x.html
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 6:42 PM John Innis via Shop-talk <
> shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
>> If your soundbar has speaker-wire type inputs, you probably can't feed it
>> directly from the TV.  It will need some sort of amplifier to bring the
>> line level output from the TV (RCA jacks) up to speaker level.  You could
>> get a new receiver, they go pretty cheap on WOOT and monoprice.  Or you
>> could get a new soundbar with a line level input ( I have seen some good
>> deals at Sams club on these).
>>
>> John
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 26, 2020 at 5:14 PM Tim . via Shop-talk <
>> shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Hey guys,
>>>
>>> Hope everyone is safe and healthy.
>>>
>>> I have a Sharp Aquos flat screen that is on borrowed time. A friend
>>> bought the same exact size and model about the same time we did and his
>>> died three or so years ago. I assume mine is still alive because we turn
>>> off the power filter every night.
>>>
>>> Anyway, while the flat screen still works and the picture is still
>>> decent (I just try VERY HARD to not compare it to the modern flat screens),
>>> the audio is getting bad about a quick as my hearing.
>>>
>>> I have a Bose speaker system, 301s, 701s and a sound bar, that I can
>>> feed from my stereo. But, the stereo really needs to be replaced and the
>>> remote for it is dead. So, I can either buy a universal remote which I
>>> don't want to do for an outdated receiver, or I can try to feed the sound
>>> bar direct from the TV.
>>>
>>> My issue is, the sound bar is proper wires into pinch connectors and the
>>> TV is RCA jacks.
>>>
>>> Am I over thinking this or can I simply take and RCA cable and cut the
>>> female end off and put the wires into my sound bar? Or should I but an
>>> adapter? I am looking for cheap-ish since at some point I'll have to buy a
>>> new flat screen that will hopefully be able to feed my speakers properly.
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>> stay healthy
>>> tim
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
>>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
>>> http://autox.team.net/archive
>>>
>>> Unsubscribe/Manage:
>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> =================================
>> = Never offend people with style when you   =
>> = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =
>> =================================
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
>> http://autox.team.net/archive
>>
>> Unsubscribe/Manage:
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate at gmail.com
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie.day at gmail.com
>
>
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From tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com  Fri Mar 27 08:54:45 2020
From: tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com (Tim .)
Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2020 14:54:45 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] sound bars, older flat screens,
 not that big of an audiophile and OT
In-Reply-To: <CH2PR04MB6505143ED2FE8D30A278AA5DB4CF0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB6505143ED2FE8D30A278AA5DB4CF0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <CH2PR04MB65059DCC00F1C06064FFC0A3B4CC0@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>

Thanks guys.

________________________________
From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2020 5:13 PM
To: Shop Talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Shop-talk] sound bars, older flat screens, not that big of an audiophile and OT

Hey guys,

Hope everyone is safe and healthy.

I have a Sharp Aquos flat screen that is on borrowed time. A friend bought the same exact size and model about the same time we did and his died three or so years ago. I assume mine is still alive because we turn off the power filter every night.

Anyway, while the flat screen still works and the picture is still decent (I just try VERY HARD to not compare it to the modern flat screens), the audio is getting bad about a quick as my hearing.

I have a Bose speaker system, 301s, 701s and a sound bar, that I can feed from my stereo. But, the stereo really needs to be replaced and the remote for it is dead. So, I can either buy a universal remote which I don't want to do for an outdated receiver, or I can try to feed the sound bar direct from the TV.

My issue is, the sound bar is proper wires into pinch connectors and the TV is RCA jacks.

Am I over thinking this or can I simply take and RCA cable and cut the female end off and put the wires into my sound bar? Or should I but an adapter? I am looking for cheap-ish since at some point I'll have to buy a new flat screen that will hopefully be able to feed my speakers properly.

Thanks
stay healthy
tim
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From jamesf at groupwbench.org  Sun Mar 29 11:40:15 2020
From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 13:40:15 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Re-adhering ceramic tiles?
Message-ID: <6F3E27B6-9C57-4F7C-A43C-C7A086019B9C@groupwbench.org>

My house settled after a major remodel and some 12x24 ceramic tiles have popped up along a line. But only one side of them. If I try and pry them up it's clear they're on a slight hump and only one side of the hump let go. They only move enough to keep cracking the grout and make a hollow sound if I tap on them- maybe 1/16 of an inch. 

Is there a product that will get in there through the grout channels that will stabilize the tiles? I'd rather not go through doing it the right way of lifting the whole tile and laying it as a new one. 

thanks,
jim
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From eric at megageek.com  Sun Mar 29 11:58:29 2020
From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 13:58:29 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
Message-ID: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>

Ok, I know I've asked some weird questions before, but I think this one 
will take the cake.

I live out in the country, and often work well into the night with a large 
shop door open.  With having bears, coyotes and other large animals in the 
area, I got to thinking, it might be a good idea to keep a pistol in the 
garage to scare off any would be 'late night snackers."
Actually, I had a run-in the other night that made me think about this.

So my question is, if I have a pistol, in a rapid access safe in a shop 
environment, what factors should I consider?  I understand that humidity 
will play a huge role, as will dust (I have to see how 'sealed' the safe 
is.)

Is there anything I'm missing that I should consider?  I understand that I 
will most likely have to clean the weapon often, but is there anything I 
need to think about?

Also, I'm open to suggestions for a weapon type.  I thinking an XD-M elite 
polymer hand gun.  With mostly composite parts.  Similar to a Glock. 
(Note, I don't have anything against Glock, I just never owned one.  I do 
have and love my XD however, so Glock isn't out of consideration.)

I don't want this to turn into a 2nd amendment thread.  Just a 'what to 
consider' for leaving a pistol in a shop.

Note, in my shop I do just about everything, metal work, wood work, car 
and heavy equipment work, etc. 

Thanks in advance.


"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational 
being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
Waldo Emerson 
-Who is John Galt?
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From patintexas at icloud.com  Sun Mar 29 12:07:46 2020
From: patintexas at icloud.com (Pat Horne)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 13:07:46 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <03370F6E-24C2-4E02-992F-CE54A478514C@icloud.com>

Good questions. 

I have a .38 pistol in my shop office file cabinet in a zip lock bag. I pulled it out the other day & it wasn?t so great. I cleaned it & put some desiccate packs in the bag with it. Can?t say if this will help yet. I had ammunition stored in the same bag & wonder if this is a bad idea. 

Before anyone says that it isn?t safe enough to just have it hidden, I live alone & have very few visitors. A lock or safe is on my to get list.  

Peace,
Pat

Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


> On Mar 29, 2020, at 12:58 PM, eric--- via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 

?Ok, I know I've asked some weird questions before, but I think this one will take the cake. 

I live out in the country, and often work well into the night with a large shop door open.  With having bears, coyotes and other large animals in the area, I got to thinking, it might be a good idea to keep a pistol in the garage to scare off any would be 'late night snackers." 
Actually, I had a run-in the other night that made me think about this. 

So my question is, if I have a pistol, in a rapid access safe in a shop environment, what factors should I consider?  I understand that humidity will play a huge role, as will dust (I have to see how 'sealed' the safe is.) 

Is there anything I'm missing that I should consider?  I understand that I will most likely have to clean the weapon often, but is there anything I need to think about? 

Also, I'm open to suggestions for a weapon type.  I thinking an XD-M elite polymer hand gun.  With mostly composite parts.  Similar to a Glock.  (Note, I don't have anything against Glock, I just never owned one.  I do have and love my XD however, so Glock isn't out of consideration.) 

I don't want this to turn into a 2nd amendment thread.  Just a 'what to consider' for leaving a pistol in a shop. 

Note, in my shop I do just about everything, metal work, wood work, car and heavy equipment work, etc.   

Thanks in advance. 


"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson 
-Who is John Galt? _______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

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From eric at megageek.com  Sun Mar 29 12:13:39 2020
From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 14:13:39 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <03370F6E-24C2-4E02-992F-CE54A478514C@icloud.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
 <03370F6E-24C2-4E02-992F-CE54A478514C@icloud.com>
Message-ID: <OFBBE88907.6E72D3F9-ON8525853A.0063DE5D-8525853A.00642099@mail.megageek.com>

A couple people already mentioned the plastic bag...

I had bad experience with this in the past.  Not to mention that it really 
slows the response time down if I have to deal with a plastic bag.

I may put the safe under a plastic sheet or something.  I will put 
desiccate packs in the safe for sure.

Thanks again and keep the ideas coming!  I'd hate to miss something 
important.


"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational 
being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
Waldo Emerson 
-Who is John Galt?

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From ronnie.day at gmail.com  Sun Mar 29 12:33:03 2020
From: ronnie.day at gmail.com (Ronnie Day)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 13:33:03 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <OFBBE88907.6E72D3F9-ON8525853A.0063DE5D-8525853A.00642099@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
 <03370F6E-24C2-4E02-992F-CE54A478514C@icloud.com>
 <OFBBE88907.6E72D3F9-ON8525853A.0063DE5D-8525853A.00642099@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <CAMHhs6evO9Z-CkVRf3NGdRhiD2fpr19jqXeDAgOS_hoBgEigaQ@mail.gmail.com>

I think a plastic bag is a bad idea. You need reasonable circulation, not
an airtight bag. Haven't owned firearms in years, but my dad was a
collector, hunter, reloader. There was air circulation in his gun safe.
Hand guns were in individual cases/pouches wrapped in oil cloth. Not soaked
in oil, just very light amounts.

On Sun, Mar 29, 2020 at 1:13 PM eric--- via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> A couple people already mentioned the plastic bag...
>
> I had bad experience with this in the past.  Not to mention that it really
> slows the response time down if I have to deal with a plastic bag.
>
> I may put the safe under a plastic sheet or something.  I will put desiccate
> packs in the safe for sure.
>
> Thanks again and keep the ideas coming!  I'd hate to miss something
> important.
>
>
> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational
> being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph
> Waldo Emerson
> -Who is John Galt?
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie.day at gmail.com
>
>
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From dhlocker at comcast.net  Sun Mar 29 12:34:41 2020
From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 14:34:41 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <OFBBE88907.6E72D3F9-ON8525853A.0063DE5D-8525853A.00642099@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
 <03370F6E-24C2-4E02-992F-CE54A478514C@icloud.com>
 <OFBBE88907.6E72D3F9-ON8525853A.0063DE5D-8525853A.00642099@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <157d3269-92cd-7dda-847f-1409c628e502@comcast.net>

A low wattage (15W is sufficient, IIRC) incandescent light bulb stored 
with a tool can effectively keep humidity at bay. As long as the tool is 
warmer than the exterior, humidity will not condense on it.

Donald.

*Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
() no proprietary attachments; no html mail
/\ <https://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml>

On 2020-03-29 2:13 p.m., eric--- via Shop-talk wrote:
> A couple people already mentioned the plastic bag...
> 
> I had bad experience with this in the past. ?Not to mention that it 
> really slows the response time down if I have to deal with a plastic bag.
> 
> I may put the safe under a plastic sheet or something. ?I will put 
> desiccate packs in the safe for sure.
> 
> Thanks again and keep the ideas coming! ?I'd hate to miss something 
> important.
> 
> 
> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a 
> rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your 
> territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson
> -Who is John Galt?

From 1789alpine at gmail.com  Sun Mar 29 13:43:51 2020
From: 1789alpine at gmail.com (Jim Stone)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 15:43:51 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <157d3269-92cd-7dda-847f-1409c628e502@comcast.net>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
 <03370F6E-24C2-4E02-992F-CE54A478514C@icloud.com>
 <OFBBE88907.6E72D3F9-ON8525853A.0063DE5D-8525853A.00642099@mail.megageek.com>
 <157d3269-92cd-7dda-847f-1409c628e502@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <9234E84B-3DA5-4859-8FAE-65CA212656EE@gmail.com>

I don?t own a gun and know nothing about maintaining them, but just out of curiosity, would vacuum sealing it work?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Mar 29, 2020, at 2:34 PM, Donald H Locker via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> A low wattage (15W is sufficient, IIRC) incandescent light bulb stored with a tool can effectively keep humidity at bay. As long as the tool is warmer than the exterior, humidity will not condense on it.
> 
> Donald.
> 
> *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
> () no proprietary attachments; no html mail
> /\ <https://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml>
> 
>> On 2020-03-29 2:13 p.m., eric--- via Shop-talk wrote:
>> A couple people already mentioned the plastic bag...
>> I had bad experience with this in the past.  Not to mention that it really slows the response time down if I have to deal with a plastic bag.
>> I may put the safe under a plastic sheet or something.  I will put desiccate packs in the safe for sure.
>> Thanks again and keep the ideas coming!  I'd hate to miss something important.
>> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson
>> -Who is John Galt?
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine at gmail.com
> 

From markmiller at threeboysfarm.com  Sun Mar 29 14:36:12 2020
From: markmiller at threeboysfarm.com (Mark Miller)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 13:36:12 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Keeping a gun safe in a gun safe (and definately not
 2nd amendment stuff)
In-Reply-To: <mailman.11.1585504802.7763.shop-talk@autox.team.net>
References: <mailman.11.1585504802.7763.shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Message-ID: <9d0921f7-d608-2cb1-a515-90265df3bed5@threeboysfarm.com>

Thank you for specifically not making this a second amendment issue.? 
Then you would be dealing with air holes, sanitation, food and water 
requirements, etc. for the militia you would have in the safe along with 
the pistol.

I think you would be well served by adding desiccants 
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07TCGPZXK/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_U_ttqGEbE368Q6E
and anti-rust pads: 
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00150H0FW/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_U_yrqGEbKANGCF4.
You might consider adding a few flash bang grenades in addition to the gun:
https://www.militarytimes.com/off-duty/gearscout/irons/2019/05/07/you-are-100-going-to-want-a-few-of-these-civilian-legal-flashbangs-when-theyre-back-in-stock/

And plan to change out the ammo as you do batteries in a smoke detector.

Regards,

Mark Miller   707-490-5834
markmiller at threeboysfarm.com

On 3/29/2020 11:00 AM, shop-talk-request at autox.team.net wrote:
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 13:58:29 -0400
> From:eric at megageek.com
> To:Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked
> 	here.
> Message-ID:
> 	<OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38 at mail.megageek.com>
> 	
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Ok, I know I've asked some weird questions before, but I think this one
> will take the cake.
>
> I live out in the country, and often work well into the night with a large
> shop door open.  With having bears, coyotes and other large animals in the
> area, I got to thinking, it might be a good idea to keep a pistol in the
> garage to scare off any would be 'late night snackers."
> Actually, I had a run-in the other night that made me think about this.
>
> So my question is, if I have a pistol, in a rapid access safe in a shop
> environment, what factors should I consider?  I understand that humidity
> will play a huge role, as will dust (I have to see how 'sealed' the safe
> is.)
>
> Is there anything I'm missing that I should consider?  I understand that I
> will most likely have to clean the weapon often, but is there anything I
> need to think about?
>
> Also, I'm open to suggestions for a weapon type.  I thinking an XD-M elite
> polymer hand gun.  With mostly composite parts.  Similar to a Glock.
> (Note, I don't have anything against Glock, I just never owned one.  I do
> have and love my XD however, so Glock isn't out of consideration.)
>
> I don't want this to turn into a 2nd amendment thread.  Just a 'what to
> consider' for leaving a pistol in a shop.
>
> Note, in my shop I do just about everything, metal work, wood work, car
> and heavy equipment work, etc.
>
> Thanks in advance.

From lists at dinospider.com  Sun Mar 29 15:08:38 2020
From: lists at dinospider.com (Mike Rambour)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 14:08:38 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Keeping a gun safe in a gun safe (and definately
 not 2nd amendment stuff)
In-Reply-To: <9d0921f7-d608-2cb1-a515-90265df3bed5@threeboysfarm.com>
References: <9d0921f7-d608-2cb1-a515-90265df3bed5@threeboysfarm.com>
Message-ID: <A0BC67E8-1A6C-4FD0-BB42-741F74792929@dinospider.com>


Any gun should work in that environment.  I would look at a stainless something and wipe it down once a month.  A blued gun maybe a little more often.   Remember polymer guns still have metal slides so not much of a difference when it comes to rust control.  You still have to wipe the slide every so often.  

 Personally I would get a ?golden rod? put that In your safe and be done with it.  If you are going with a desktop type safe then just get some desiccant 

  Mike

Sent via rubber ducky

> On Mar 29, 2020, at 1:36 PM, Mark Miller via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> ?Thank you for specifically not making this a second amendment issue.  Then you would be dealing with air holes, sanitation, food and water requirements, etc. for the militia you would have in the safe along with the pistol.
> 
> I think you would be well served by adding desiccants https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07TCGPZXK/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_U_ttqGEbE368Q6E
> and anti-rust pads: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00150H0FW/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_U_yrqGEbKANGCF4.
> You might consider adding a few flash bang grenades in addition to the gun:
> https://www.militarytimes.com/off-duty/gearscout/irons/2019/05/07/you-are-100-going-to-want-a-few-of-these-civilian-legal-flashbangs-when-theyre-back-in-stock/
> 
> And plan to change out the ammo as you do batteries in a smoke detector.
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Mark Miller   707-490-5834
> markmiller at threeboysfarm.com
> 
>> On 3/29/2020 11:00 AM, shop-talk-request at autox.team.net wrote:
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 13:58:29 -0400
>> From:eric at megageek.com
>> To:Shop-talk at autox.team.net
>> Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked
>>    here.
>> Message-ID:
>>    <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38 at mail.megageek.com>
>>    
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>> 
>> Ok, I know I've asked some weird questions before, but I think this one
>> will take the cake.
>> 
>> I live out in the country, and often work well into the night with a large
>> shop door open.  With having bears, coyotes and other large animals in the
>> area, I got to thinking, it might be a good idea to keep a pistol in the
>> garage to scare off any would be 'late night snackers."
>> Actually, I had a run-in the other night that made me think about this.
>> 
>> So my question is, if I have a pistol, in a rapid access safe in a shop
>> environment, what factors should I consider?  I understand that humidity
>> will play a huge role, as will dust (I have to see how 'sealed' the safe
>> is.)
>> 
>> Is there anything I'm missing that I should consider?  I understand that I
>> will most likely have to clean the weapon often, but is there anything I
>> need to think about?
>> 
>> Also, I'm open to suggestions for a weapon type.  I thinking an XD-M elite
>> polymer hand gun.  With mostly composite parts.  Similar to a Glock.
>> (Note, I don't have anything against Glock, I just never owned one.  I do
>> have and love my XD however, so Glock isn't out of consideration.)
>> 
>> I don't want this to turn into a 2nd amendment thread.  Just a 'what to
>> consider' for leaving a pistol in a shop.
>> 
>> Note, in my shop I do just about everything, metal work, wood work, car
>> and heavy equipment work, etc.
>> 
>> Thanks in advance.
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/lists at dinospider.com
> 


From bspidell at comcast.net  Sun Mar 29 17:45:26 2020
From: bspidell at comcast.net (Bob Spidell)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 16:45:26 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <157d3269-92cd-7dda-847f-1409c628e502@comcast.net>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
 <03370F6E-24C2-4E02-992F-CE54A478514C@icloud.com>
 <OFBBE88907.6E72D3F9-ON8525853A.0063DE5D-8525853A.00642099@mail.megageek.com>
 <157d3269-92cd-7dda-847f-1409c628e502@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <3d138153-5288-28fc-fc37-9b23c95b3adf@comcast.net>

I got a rechargeable desiccant container in my gun safe (recommended by 
a gunsmith).? It's colored, so when the blue turns pink you plug it into 
a wall socket for a few hours and it's good to go.

Bob

On 3/29/2020 11:34 AM, Donald H Locker via Shop-talk wrote:
> A low wattage (15W is sufficient, IIRC) incandescent light bulb stored 
> with a tool can effectively keep humidity at bay. As long as the tool 
> is warmer than the exterior, humidity will not condense on it.
>
> Donald.
>
> *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
> () no proprietary attachments; no html mail
> /\ <https://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml>
>
> On 2020-03-29 2:13 p.m., eric--- via Shop-talk wrote:
>> A couple people already mentioned the plastic bag...
>>
>> I had bad experience with this in the past. ?Not to mention that it 
>> really slows the response time down if I have to deal with a plastic 
>> bag.
>>
>> I may put the safe under a plastic sheet or something. ?I will put 
>> desiccate packs in the safe for sure.
>>
>> Thanks again and keep the ideas coming! ?I'd hate to miss something 
>> important.
>>
>>
>> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a 
>> rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your 
>> territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson
>> -Who is John Galt?
>


From bspidell at comcast.net  Sun Mar 29 17:49:14 2020
From: bspidell at comcast.net (Bob Spidell)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 16:49:14 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Keeping a gun safe in a gun safe (and definately
 not 2nd amendment stuff)
In-Reply-To: <A0BC67E8-1A6C-4FD0-BB42-741F74792929@dinospider.com>
References: <9d0921f7-d608-2cb1-a515-90265df3bed5@threeboysfarm.com>
 <A0BC67E8-1A6C-4FD0-BB42-741F74792929@dinospider.com>
Message-ID: <224980ee-5df3-bb0b-9949-e3bae41e94e8@comcast.net>

OK, I give up; what's a 'golden rod?'

On 3/29/2020 2:08 PM, Mike Rambour via Shop-talk wrote:
> Any gun should work in that environment.  I would look at a stainless something and wipe it down once a month.  A blued gun maybe a little more often.   Remember polymer guns still have metal slides so not much of a difference when it comes to rust control.  You still have to wipe the slide every so often.
>
>   Personally I would get a ?golden rod? put that In your safe and be done with it.  If you are going with a desktop type safe then just get some desiccant
>
>    Mike
>
> Sent via rubber ducky
>
>> On Mar 29, 2020, at 1:36 PM, Mark Miller via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>>
>> ?Thank you for specifically not making this a second amendment issue.  Then you would be dealing with air holes, sanitation, food and water requirements, etc. for the militia you would have in the safe along with the pistol.
>>
>> I think you would be well served by adding desiccants https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07TCGPZXK/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_U_ttqGEbE368Q6E
>> and anti-rust pads: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00150H0FW/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_U_yrqGEbKANGCF4.
>> You might consider adding a few flash bang grenades in addition to the gun:
>> https://www.militarytimes.com/off-duty/gearscout/irons/2019/05/07/you-are-100-going-to-want-a-few-of-these-civilian-legal-flashbangs-when-theyre-back-in-stock/
>>
>> And plan to change out the ammo as you do batteries in a smoke detector.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Mark Miller   707-490-5834
>> markmiller at threeboysfarm.com
>>
>>


From lists at dinospider.com  Sun Mar 29 18:01:42 2020
From: lists at dinospider.com (Mike Rambour)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 17:01:42 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Keeping a gun safe in a gun safe (and definately
 not 2nd amendment stuff)
In-Reply-To: <224980ee-5df3-bb0b-9949-e3bae41e94e8@comcast.net>
References: <224980ee-5df3-bb0b-9949-e3bae41e94e8@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <8C6896E8-6872-40C4-9B99-1F6283267EB3@dinospider.com>

https://www.cabelas.com/product/GOLDEN-ROD-DEHUMIDIFIER-ROD/1769596.uts?productVariantId=3773289&WT.tsrc=PPC&WT.mc_id=GoogleProductAds&WT.z_mc_id1=03823153&rid=20&ds_rl=1246555&ds_rl=1246558&ds_rl=1252245&gclid=Cj0KCQjwjoH0BRD6ARIsAEWO9Dtw-15MYioD9a8gD3oPrF952KORtnDO-kVJIaw3MtT18RlmKcSb0TkaAguhEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

We use them on boats also 

Sent via rubber ducky

> On Mar 29, 2020, at 4:49 PM, Bob Spidell via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> ?OK, I give up; what's a 'golden rod?'
> 
>> On 3/29/2020 2:08 PM, Mike Rambour via Shop-talk wrote:
>> Any gun should work in that environment.  I would look at a stainless something and wipe it down once a month.  A blued gun maybe a little more often.   Remember polymer guns still have metal slides so not much of a difference when it comes to rust control.  You still have to wipe the slide every so often.
>> 
>>  Personally I would get a ?golden rod? put that In your safe and be done with it.  If you are going with a desktop type safe then just get some desiccant
>> 
>>   Mike
>> 
>> Sent via rubber ducky
>> 
>>>> On Mar 29, 2020, at 1:36 PM, Mark Miller via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>>> 
>>> ?Thank you for specifically not making this a second amendment issue.  Then you would be dealing with air holes, sanitation, food and water requirements, etc. for the militia you would have in the safe along with the pistol.
>>> 
>>> I think you would be well served by adding desiccants https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07TCGPZXK/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_U_ttqGEbE368Q6E
>>> and anti-rust pads: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00150H0FW/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_U_yrqGEbKANGCF4.
>>> You might consider adding a few flash bang grenades in addition to the gun:
>>> https://www.militarytimes.com/off-duty/gearscout/irons/2019/05/07/you-are-100-going-to-want-a-few-of-these-civilian-legal-flashbangs-when-theyre-back-in-stock/
>>> 
>>> And plan to change out the ammo as you do batteries in a smoke detector.
>>> 
>>> Regards,
>>> 
>>> Mark Miller   707-490-5834
>>> markmiller at threeboysfarm.com
>>> 
>>> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/lists at dinospider.com
> 
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From dhlocker at comcast.net  Sun Mar 29 18:02:55 2020
From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 20:02:55 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Keeping a gun safe in a gun safe (and definately
 not 2nd amendment stuff)
In-Reply-To: <224980ee-5df3-bb0b-9949-e3bae41e94e8@comcast.net>
References: <9d0921f7-d608-2cb1-a515-90265df3bed5@threeboysfarm.com>
 <A0BC67E8-1A6C-4FD0-BB42-741F74792929@dinospider.com>
 <224980ee-5df3-bb0b-9949-e3bae41e94e8@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <bde821a4-78ae-b6f6-80b8-f786e13a5141@comcast.net>

It's a small heating rod. (Kind of like a low-power toaster rod. 
https://www.lockdown.com/products/moisture-control/dehumidifier-rods/ 
for example.)

Donald.
--
*Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
() no proprietary attachments; no html mail
/\ <https://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml>

On 2020-03-29 7:49 p.m., Bob Spidell via Shop-talk wrote:
> OK, I give up; what's a 'golden rod?'
> 
> On 3/29/2020 2:08 PM, Mike Rambour via Shop-talk wrote:
>> Any gun should work in that environment.? I would look at a stainless 
>> something and wipe it down once a month.? A blued gun maybe a little 
>> more often.?? Remember polymer guns still have metal slides so not 
>> much of a difference when it comes to rust control.? You still have to 
>> wipe the slide every so often.
>>
>> ? Personally I would get a ?golden rod? put that In your safe and be 
>> done with it.? If you are going with a desktop type safe then just get 
>> some desiccant
>>
>> ?? Mike
>>
>> Sent via rubber ducky
>>
>>> On Mar 29, 2020, at 1:36 PM, Mark Miller via Shop-talk 
>>> <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> ?Thank you for specifically not making this a second amendment 
>>> issue.? Then you would be dealing with air holes, sanitation, food 
>>> and water requirements, etc. for the militia you would have in the 
>>> safe along with the pistol.
>>>
>>> I think you would be well served by adding desiccants 
>>> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07TCGPZXK/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_U_ttqGEbE368Q6E 
>>>
>>> and anti-rust pads: 
>>> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00150H0FW/ref=cm_sw_em_r_mt_dp_U_yrqGEbKANGCF4. 
>>>
>>> You might consider adding a few flash bang grenades in addition to 
>>> the gun:
>>> https://www.militarytimes.com/off-duty/gearscout/irons/2019/05/07/you-are-100-going-to-want-a-few-of-these-civilian-legal-flashbangs-when-theyre-back-in-stock/ 
>>>
>>>
>>> And plan to change out the ammo as you do batteries in a smoke detector.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>> Mark Miller?? 707-490-5834
>>> markmiller at threeboysfarm.com


From bspidell at comcast.net  Sun Mar 29 18:22:55 2020
From: bspidell at comcast.net (Bob Spidell)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 17:22:55 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Keeping a gun safe in a gun safe (and definately
 not 2nd amendment stuff)
In-Reply-To: <8C6896E8-6872-40C4-9B99-1F6283267EB3@dinospider.com>
References: <224980ee-5df3-bb0b-9949-e3bae41e94e8@comcast.net>
 <8C6896E8-6872-40C4-9B99-1F6283267EB3@dinospider.com>
Message-ID: <4e4cd56b-a885-f840-53b4-af451532be49@comcast.net>

Ah, thanks.


On 3/29/2020 5:01 PM, Mike Rambour wrote:
> https://www.cabelas.com/product/GOLDEN-ROD-DEHUMIDIFIER-ROD/1769596.uts?productVariantId=3773289&WT.tsrc=PPC&WT.mc_id=GoogleProductAds&WT.z_mc_id1=03823153&rid=20&ds_rl=1246555&ds_rl=1246558&ds_rl=1252245&gclid=Cj0KCQjwjoH0BRD6ARIsAEWO9Dtw-15MYioD9a8gD3oPrF952KORtnDO-kVJIaw3MtT18RlmKcSb0TkaAguhEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds 
>
>
> We use them on boats also
>
> Sent via rubber ducky
>
>> On Mar 29, 2020, at 4:49 PM, Bob Spidell via Shop-talk 
>> <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>>
>> ?OK, I give up; what's a 'golden rod?'
>>
>> On 3/29/2020 2:08 PM, Mike Rambour via Shop-talk wrote:
>>> Any gun should work in that environment. ?I would look at a 
>>> stainless something and wipe it down once a month. ?A blued gun 
>>> maybe a little more often. ??Remember polymer guns still have metal 
>>> slides so not much of a difference when it comes to rust control. 
>>> ?You still have to wipe the slide every so often.
>>>
>>> ?Personally I would get a ?golden rod? put that In your safe and be 
>>> done with it. ?If you are going with a desktop type safe then just 
>>> get some desiccant
>>>
>>> ??Mike
>>>


From bspidell at comcast.net  Sun Mar 29 18:23:57 2020
From: bspidell at comcast.net (Bob Spidell)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 17:23:57 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Keeping a gun safe in a gun safe (and definately
 not 2nd amendment stuff)
In-Reply-To: <bde821a4-78ae-b6f6-80b8-f786e13a5141@comcast.net>
References: <9d0921f7-d608-2cb1-a515-90265df3bed5@threeboysfarm.com>
 <A0BC67E8-1A6C-4FD0-BB42-741F74792929@dinospider.com>
 <224980ee-5df3-bb0b-9949-e3bae41e94e8@comcast.net>
 <bde821a4-78ae-b6f6-80b8-f786e13a5141@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <b40b09e9-f14e-f616-cc52-4f2cec55565b@comcast.net>

Thanks.

On 3/29/2020 5:02 PM, Donald H Locker via Shop-talk wrote:
> It's a small heating rod. (Kind of like a low-power toaster rod. 
> https://www.lockdown.com/products/moisture-control/dehumidifier-rods/ 
> for example.)
>
> Donald.
> -- 
> *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
> () no proprietary attachments; no html mail
> /\ <https://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml>
>
> On 2020-03-29 7:49 p.m., Bob Spidell via Shop-talk wrote:
>> OK, I give up; what's a 'golden rod?'
>>
>> On 3/29/2020 2:08 PM, Mike Rambour via Shop-talk wrote:
>>> Any gun should work in that environment.? I would look at a 
>>> stainless something and wipe it down once a month.? A blued gun 
>>> maybe a little more often.?? Remember polymer guns still have metal 
>>> slides so not much of a difference when it comes to rust control.? 
>>> You still have to wipe the slide every so often.
>>>
>>> ? Personally I would get a ?golden rod? put that In your safe and be 
>>> done with it.? If you are going with a desktop type safe then just 
>>> get some desiccant
>>>
>>> ?? Mike
>>>


From fishplate at gmail.com  Sun Mar 29 18:34:36 2020
From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 20:34:36 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Keeping a gun safe in a gun safe (and definately
 not 2nd amendment stuff)
In-Reply-To: <224980ee-5df3-bb0b-9949-e3bae41e94e8@comcast.net>
References: <9d0921f7-d608-2cb1-a515-90265df3bed5@threeboysfarm.com>
 <A0BC67E8-1A6C-4FD0-BB42-741F74792929@dinospider.com>
 <224980ee-5df3-bb0b-9949-e3bae41e94e8@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <CAO8Q7CN0rBWRV5KqPPxtD7b4-irPrs4bN_x5GiT+PZtvj+jwfQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Mar 29, 2020 at 7:49 PM Bob Spidell via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> OK, I give up; what's a 'golden rod?'


Growing up in Florida without air conditioning, my parents had something
like this in their walk-in closet to prevent mildew.  A fancy low-wattage
light bulb...
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From pethier7 at gmail.com  Sun Mar 29 18:38:11 2020
From: pethier7 at gmail.com (Philip Ethier)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 19:38:11 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <CAE16_w0rnBEwPP8qkcWVt4vznNW_XS4mowKM6OkWTmGh2On5tQ@mail.gmail.com>

I'd recommend a stainless double-action revolver, attached to your person
in a holster designed to make it impossible for the cylinder to revolve
until the weapon is removed from the holster.



On Sun, Mar 29, 2020 at 12:58 PM eric--- via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> Ok, I know I've asked some weird questions before, but I think this one
> will take the cake.
>
> I live out in the country, and often work well into the night with a large
> shop door open.  With having bears, coyotes and other large animals in the
> area, I got to thinking, it might be a good idea to keep a pistol in the
> garage to scare off any would be 'late night snackers."
> Actually, I had a run-in the other night that made me think about this.
>
> So my question is, if I have a pistol, in a rapid access safe in a shop
> environment, what factors should I consider?  I understand that humidity
> will play a huge role, as will dust (I have to see how 'sealed' the safe
> is.)
>
> Is there anything I'm missing that I should consider?  I understand that I
> will most likely have to clean the weapon often, but is there anything I
> need to think about?
>
> Also, I'm open to suggestions for a weapon type.  I thinking an XD-M elite
> polymer hand gun.  With mostly composite parts.  Similar to a Glock.
>  (Note, I don't have anything against Glock, I just never owned one.  I do
> have and love my XD however, so Glock isn't out of consideration.)
>
> I don't want this to turn into a 2nd amendment thread.  Just a 'what to
> consider' for leaving a pistol in a shop.
>
> Note, in my shop I do just about everything, metal work, wood work, car
> and heavy equipment work, etc.
>
> Thanks in advance.
>
>
> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational
> being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph
> Waldo Emerson
> -Who is John Galt? _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pethier7 at gmail.com
>
>

-- 
Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA
1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue
2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red
2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl
2006 Gulf Stream Conquest Super C, 8.1, White
2017 Ford Fusion SE 2.0 Turbo, Oxford White
http://www.mnautox.com
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From fishplate at gmail.com  Sun Mar 29 18:43:37 2020
From: fishplate at gmail.com (Jeff Scarbrough)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 20:43:37 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] [TR] Some list admin comments
In-Reply-To: <3FD69E63-7F8E-4A91-8745-E44338A767F7@yahoo.com>
References: <b939fc9d-c741-16a2-ca26-d63f32fc4422@bradakis.com>
 <3FD69E63-7F8E-4A91-8745-E44338A767F7@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CAO8Q7CP00aJMg54T_522jXsLgrN=jkR7x=nubd165hsF6fDRfw@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Mar 29, 2020 at 11:15 AM bill beecher <notakitcar at yahoo.com> wrote:

> Mark,
> Thanks for the update, which reminds me it?s been while since a kicked a
> few bucks towards the Fat Chance Garage and Email Hosting Service.
>

And thanks for the reminder to kick in my annual $12.96 to fund this stuff.
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From mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org  Sun Mar 29 20:36:38 2020
From: mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org (Jimmie Mayfield)
Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2020 22:36:38 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Re-adhering ceramic tiles?
In-Reply-To: <6F3E27B6-9C57-4F7C-A43C-C7A086019B9C@groupwbench.org>
References: <6F3E27B6-9C57-4F7C-A43C-C7A086019B9C@groupwbench.org>
Message-ID: <2490bec3-a4ff-c650-bf5c-eff4f20e6780@sackheads.org>

Have you addressed the underlying cause of the movement?? Were 
load-bearing structures compromised or weight limits exceeded by the 
remodel?

On 2020-03-29 13:40, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote:
> My house settled after a major remodel and some 12x24 ceramic tiles have popped up along a line. But only one side of them. If I try and pry them up it's clear they're on a slight hump and only one side of the hump let go. They only move enough to keep cracking the grout and make a hollow sound if I tap on them- maybe 1/16 of an inch.
>
> Is there a product that will get in there through the grout channels that will stabilize the tiles? I'd rather not go through doing it the right way of lifting the whole tile and laying it as a new one.
>
> thanks,
> jim
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org
>

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From neiljsherry at talktalk.net  Mon Mar 30 01:20:26 2020
From: neiljsherry at talktalk.net (neiljsherry at talktalk.net)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 08:20:26 +0100
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <OFBBE88907.6E72D3F9-ON8525853A.0063DE5D-8525853A.00642099@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
 <03370F6E-24C2-4E02-992F-CE54A478514C@icloud.com>
 <OFBBE88907.6E72D3F9-ON8525853A.0063DE5D-8525853A.00642099@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <2A83E746-81AC-43C5-BF9F-9DC4CEDE512F@talktalk.net>

I know little about guns, but if push came to shove could you not fire while it's in the bag still. Maybe not the ideal surface to grip, but I assume the bullet would find its way out

On 29 March 2020 19:13:39 BST, eric--- via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>A couple people already mentioned the plastic bag...
>
>I had bad experience with this in the past.  Not to mention that it
>really 
>slows the response time down if I have to deal with a plastic bag.
>
>I may put the safe under a plastic sheet or something.  I will put 
>desiccate packs in the safe for sure.
>
>Thanks again and keep the ideas coming!  I'd hate to miss something 
>important.
>
>
>"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a
>rational 
>being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
>Waldo Emerson 
>-Who is John Galt?

-- 
Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
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From jamesf at groupwbench.org  Mon Mar 30 05:23:31 2020
From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 07:23:31 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Re-adhering ceramic tiles?
In-Reply-To: <2490bec3-a4ff-c650-bf5c-eff4f20e6780@sackheads.org>
References: <6F3E27B6-9C57-4F7C-A43C-C7A086019B9C@groupwbench.org>
 <2490bec3-a4ff-c650-bf5c-eff4f20e6780@sackheads.org>
Message-ID: <AB97F48E-9A5B-4EDC-ADA9-0302FC38C064@groupwbench.org>

No, there was so much that happened at once, it's impossible to tell. It's definitely not a load issue though; the house is a simple split-entry rectangle with the 1st floor on slab and the 2nd floor joists running between the long foundation walls and a central girder. And I don't remember when the tile went in compared to the work below. But the bathroom also has some loose tiles so I think it's a mortar or adhesion issue more than too much movement in the house. The tiles are cheap ones from Lowe's, maybe $2 each, so mabybe the underside had adhesion issues? I did backbutter them. 

jim

> On Mar 29, 2020, at 10:36 PM, Jimmie Mayfield via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> Have you addressed the underlying cause of the movement?  Were load-bearing structures compromised or weight limits exceeded by the remodel?
> 
> On 2020-03-29 13:40, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote:
>> My house settled after a major remodel and some 12x24 ceramic tiles have popped up along a line. But only one side of them. If I try and pry them up it's clear they're on a slight hump and only one side of the hump let go. They only move enough to keep cracking the grout and make a hollow sound if I tap on them- maybe 1/16 of an inch. 
>> 
>> Is there a product that will get in there through the grout channels that will stabilize the tiles? I'd rather not go through doing it the right way of lifting the whole tile and laying it as a new one. 
>> 
>> thanks,
>> jim
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> 
>> Shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html <http://www.team.net/donate.html>
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk <http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk> http://autox.team.net/archive <http://autox.team.net/archive>
>> 
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org <http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org>
>> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jamesf at groupwbench.org
> 

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From dhlocker at comcast.net  Mon Mar 30 05:52:05 2020
From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 07:52:05 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Re-adhering ceramic tiles?
In-Reply-To: <AB97F48E-9A5B-4EDC-ADA9-0302FC38C064@groupwbench.org>
References: <6F3E27B6-9C57-4F7C-A43C-C7A086019B9C@groupwbench.org>
 <2490bec3-a4ff-c650-bf5c-eff4f20e6780@sackheads.org>
 <AB97F48E-9A5B-4EDC-ADA9-0302FC38C064@groupwbench.org>
Message-ID: <94e28630-0806-85e3-d866-095328916459@comcast.net>

Had they adequately adhered, they would likely have broken. Ceramic 
tiles really don't bend. I've never tried to inject mortar beneath an 
existing tile; if the bond is weak enough, you should be able to pop the 
tile loose, clean up the mortar, and reset the tile. That would be the 
only way I'd try to fix it. (If you get some mortar beneath an edge, the 
unsupported portion of the tile will eventually take a bit of a load and 
crack there.)

Donald.
--
*Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue
() no proprietary attachments; no html mail
/\ <https://www.georgedillon.com/web/html_email_is_evil.shtml>

On 2020-03-30 7:23 a.m., Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote:
> No, there was so much that happened at once, it's impossible to tell. 
> It's definitely not a load issue though; the house is a simple 
> split-entry rectangle with the 1st floor on slab and the 2nd floor 
> joists running between the long foundation walls and a central girder. 
> And I don't remember when the tile went in compared to the work below. 
> But the bathroom also has some loose tiles so I think it's a mortar or 
> adhesion issue more than too much movement in the house. The tiles are 
> cheap ones from Lowe's, maybe $2 each, so mabybe the underside had 
> adhesion issues? I did backbutter them.
> 
> jim
> 
>> On Mar 29, 2020, at 10:36 PM, Jimmie Mayfield via Shop-talk 
>> <shop-talk at autox.team.net <mailto:shop-talk at autox.team.net>> wrote:
>>
>> Have you addressed the underlying cause of the movement?? Were 
>> load-bearing structures compromised or weight limits exceeded by the 
>> remodel?
>>
>> On 2020-03-29 13:40, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote:
>>> My house settled after a major remodel and some 12x24 ceramic tiles have popped up along a line. But only one side of them. If I try and pry them up it's clear they're on a slight hump and only one side of the hump let go. They only move enough to keep cracking the grout and make a hollow sound if I tap on them- maybe 1/16 of an inch.
>>>
>>> Is there a product that will get in there through the grout channels that will stabilize the tiles? I'd rather not go through doing it the right way of lifting the whole tile and laying it as a new one.
>>>
>>> thanks,
>>> jim

From eric at megageek.com  Mon Mar 30 06:08:18 2020
From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 08:08:18 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] [TR] Some list admin comments
In-Reply-To: <CAO8Q7CP00aJMg54T_522jXsLgrN=jkR7x=nubd165hsF6fDRfw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b939fc9d-c741-16a2-ca26-d63f32fc4422@bradakis.com>
 <3FD69E63-7F8E-4A91-8745-E44338A767F7@yahoo.com>
 <CAO8Q7CP00aJMg54T_522jXsLgrN=jkR7x=nubd165hsF6fDRfw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <OF1DBF17A1.843650A1-ON8525853B.00425DC0-8525853B.0042AE22@mail.megageek.com>

Jeff writes--

>>Thanks for the update, which reminds me it?s been while since a kicked a 
few bucks towards the Fat Chance Garage and Email Hosting Service.  

>And thanks for the reminder to kick in my annual $12.96 to fund this 
stuff. _______________________________________________

And thank you for the reminder.  I kicked in a little more since I'm the 
biggest pain on this list!
8>)


"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational 
being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
Waldo Emerson 
-Who is John Galt?



From:   Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
To:     "shop-talk at autox.team.net" <Shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Date:   03/29/2020 20:44
Subject:        Re: [Shop-talk] [TR] Some list admin comments
Sent by:        "Shop-talk" <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net>





On Sun, Mar 29, 2020 at 11:15 AM bill beecher <notakitcar at yahoo.com> 
wrote:
Mark,
Thanks for the update, which reminds me it?s been while since a kicked a 
few bucks towards the Fat Chance Garage and Email Hosting Service.  

And thanks for the reminder to kick in my annual $12.96 to fund this 
stuff. _______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk 
http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: 
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/eric at megageek.com



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From eric at megageek.com  Mon Mar 30 06:10:41 2020
From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 08:10:41 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] [TR] Some list admin comments
In-Reply-To: <OF1DBF17A1.843650A1-ON8525853B.00425DC0-8525853B.0042AE22@mail.megageek.com>
References: <b939fc9d-c741-16a2-ca26-d63f32fc4422@bradakis.com>
 <3FD69E63-7F8E-4A91-8745-E44338A767F7@yahoo.com>
 <CAO8Q7CP00aJMg54T_522jXsLgrN=jkR7x=nubd165hsF6fDRfw@mail.gmail.com>
 <OF1DBF17A1.843650A1-ON8525853B.00425DC0-8525853B.0042AE22@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <OF1B70B7B4.FE78C0A9-ON8525853B.0042B8F0-8525853B.0042E5FE@mail.megageek.com>

DOH!

Sorry all, this was meant to go to Jeff only.  It's too early.  Now, where 
did I put my covfefe? 8>)


"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational 
being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
Waldo Emerson 
-Who is John Galt?



From:   eric--- via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
To:     Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Date:   03/30/2020 08:08
Subject:        Re: [Shop-talk] [TR] Some list admin comments
Sent by:        "Shop-talk" <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net>



Jeff writes-- 

>>Thanks for the update, which reminds me it?s been while since a kicked a 
few bucks towards the Fat Chance Garage and Email Hosting Service. 

>And thanks for the reminder to kick in my annual $12.96 to fund this 
stuff. _______________________________________________ 

And thank you for the reminder.  I kicked in a little more since I'm the 
biggest pain on this list! 
8>) 


"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational 
being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
Waldo Emerson 
-Who is John Galt? 



From:        Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> 
To:        "shop-talk at autox.team.net" <Shop-talk at autox.team.net> 
Date:        03/29/2020 20:44 
Subject:        Re: [Shop-talk] [TR] Some list admin comments 
Sent by:        "Shop-talk" <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> 





On Sun, Mar 29, 2020 at 11:15 AM bill beecher <notakitcar at yahoo.com> 
wrote: 
Mark,
Thanks for the update, which reminds me it?s been while since a kicked a 
few bucks towards the Fat Chance Garage and Email Hosting Service. 

And thanks for the reminder to kick in my annual $12.96 to fund this 
stuff. _______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk 
http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: 
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/eric at megageek.com

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk 
http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: 
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/eric at megageek.com



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From eric at megageek.com  Mon Mar 30 06:15:04 2020
From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 08:15:04 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirdest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <CALUbS3EKa2sFDG7EUG+D3abU0M=wwOZzBM+z0GDzWtsbFzckuA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAE16_w0rnBEwPP8qkcWVt4vznNW_XS4mowKM6OkWTmGh2On5tQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CALUbS3EKa2sFDG7EUG+D3abU0M=wwOZzBM+z0GDzWtsbFzckuA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <OFA7CC7E48.20493E6D-ON8525853B.0042F6C3-8525853B.00434CB6@mail.megageek.com>

OK, this one I MEAN to go to the list.

I few have written back about holstering a weapon.  My question then is, 
does anyone here do that?  I can't even work on stuff if I have anything 
in my pockets, I couldn't image safely maneuvering around, under, through 
tight places in cars, etc with a piece of iron strapped to my side.

Not to mention how beat up it would get (I get REALLY banged up daily, not 
sure I would want to put a piece through that regularly.)

Thanks again for all the suggestions,  It's really helping me plan this 
properly.


"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational 
being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph 
Waldo Emerson 
-Who is John Galt?
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From mark at bradakis.com  Mon Mar 30 06:25:29 2020
From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 06:25:29 -0600
Subject: [Shop-talk] [TR] Some list admin comments
In-Reply-To: <CAO8Q7CP00aJMg54T_522jXsLgrN=jkR7x=nubd165hsF6fDRfw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <b939fc9d-c741-16a2-ca26-d63f32fc4422@bradakis.com>
 <3FD69E63-7F8E-4A91-8745-E44338A767F7@yahoo.com>
 <CAO8Q7CP00aJMg54T_522jXsLgrN=jkR7x=nubd165hsF6fDRfw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <f05cf88e-03b9-6676-aafe-9b7a010c1344@bradakis.com>

For those wondering, the message I sent to the Triumph list is included 
here, as it was not sent to this list.



The sump gasket thread brought up a couple of issues. First off, I am 
not sure why some addresses, usually AOL based, send out two copies of a 
reply to the list. Don't know if it some bogus setting, operator error, 
bad software or what. Certainly not a big deal.


Secondly:

"I just did this a couple months ago and asked the same question, 
perhaps the thread will be in the archives."

I discovered a while back there is a problem with the search function of 
the archives.? Messages are indeed getting added to the archives [ link 
below for real time, near top for digest ] but the search function 
apparently quit adding new messages to the database some years ago.? 
This is, at least to me, a serious problem.? The Team Net email archives 
are an incredible source of information collected over the decades, I 
would like them to be as useful as possible.? Broken searching is not 
useful.

Maybe when I retire in a while I'll have more time to wade through the 
twisty little maze of old. unsupported, outdated software that is behind 
the archives, figure out the problem and get things to where they should 
be.? I'll poke around some before then, not sure how long it may take.

I'm not getting any younger, will be hitting 66 years old in a couple 
weeks, Team Net will be 29 on the same day, so retirement may be just 
around the corner.? We shall see.

But at least for now I will make sure the basic list functions keep on 
keepin' on, as more folks are sitting at home looking for ways to 
entertain, amuse and educate themselves.

Stay healthy, friends.

mjb.


From ronnie.day at gmail.com  Mon Mar 30 07:44:35 2020
From: ronnie.day at gmail.com (Ronnie Day)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 08:44:35 -0500
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <2A83E746-81AC-43C5-BF9F-9DC4CEDE512F@talktalk.net>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
 <03370F6E-24C2-4E02-992F-CE54A478514C@icloud.com>
 <OFBBE88907.6E72D3F9-ON8525853A.0063DE5D-8525853A.00642099@mail.megageek.com>
 <2A83E746-81AC-43C5-BF9F-9DC4CEDE512F@talktalk.net>
Message-ID: <CAMHhs6fc+uwpC7kK_otrM3=x6gf5WuhSFOuhRUT6NL9D-QQ4Vw@mail.gmail.com>

One thought that I just had. Firearms, just like anything else mechanical,
require, regular routine inspection and maintenance if we expect them to
function when needed. Seems an obvious point, but I find it interesting
that none of us have mentioned this in this thread.

RD

On Mon, Mar 30, 2020 at 2:20 AM neiljsherry--- via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> I know little about guns, but if push came to shove could you not fire
> while it's in the bag still. Maybe not the ideal surface to grip, but I
> assume the bullet would find its way out
>
> On 29 March 2020 19:13:39 BST, eric--- via Shop-talk <
> shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>>
>> A couple people already mentioned the plastic bag...
>>
>> I had bad experience with this in the past.  Not to mention that it
>> really slows the response time down if I have to deal with a plastic bag.
>>
>> I may put the safe under a plastic sheet or something.  I will put desiccate
>> packs in the safe for sure.
>>
>> Thanks again and keep the ideas coming!  I'd hate to miss something
>> important.
>>
>>
>> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational
>> being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph
>> Waldo Emerson
>> -Who is John Galt?
>>
>
> --
> Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie.day at gmail.com
>
>
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From peterwmurray at gmail.com  Mon Mar 30 09:18:29 2020
From: peterwmurray at gmail.com (Peter Murray)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 11:18:29 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirdest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <OFA7CC7E48.20493E6D-ON8525853B.0042F6C3-8525853B.00434CB6@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAE16_w0rnBEwPP8qkcWVt4vznNW_XS4mowKM6OkWTmGh2On5tQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CALUbS3EKa2sFDG7EUG+D3abU0M=wwOZzBM+z0GDzWtsbFzckuA@mail.gmail.com>
 <OFA7CC7E48.20493E6D-ON8525853B.0042F6C3-8525853B.00434CB6@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <CAJ8HLP9oamujNV=0NV8_vK2JyBihuXFY1nm_T37rGm95ZzEhRw@mail.gmail.com>

I also thought "why not just keep it in a holster", but I certainly can
understand the discomfort of lying on the side that has the pistol attached.

That said, my Ruger LC9s has never bothered me. Single-stack, and durable.
I use a Versacarry Zero Bulk, which further minimizes the discomfort.

I wouldn't want to rely on something I don't handle regularly.

-Peter

On Mon, Mar 30, 2020 at 8:17 AM eric--- via Shop-talk <
shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:

> OK, this one I MEAN to go to the list.
>
> I few have written back about holstering a weapon.  My question then is,
> does anyone here do that?  I can't even work on stuff if I have anything in
> my pockets, I couldn't image safely maneuvering around, under, through
> tight places in cars, etc with a piece of iron strapped to my side.
>
> Not to mention how beat up it would get (I get REALLY banged up daily, not
> sure I would want to put a piece through that regularly.)
>
> Thanks again for all the suggestions,  It's really helping me plan this
> properly.
>
>
> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational
> being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph
> Waldo Emerson
> -Who is John Galt?_______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/peterwmurray at gmail.com
>
>
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From lists at dinospider.com  Mon Mar 30 11:05:49 2020
From: lists at dinospider.com (Mike Rambour)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 10:05:49 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirdest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <OFA7CC7E48.20493E6D-ON8525853B.0042F6C3-8525853B.00434CB6@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAE16_w0rnBEwPP8qkcWVt4vznNW_XS4mowKM6OkWTmGh2On5tQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CALUbS3EKa2sFDG7EUG+D3abU0M=wwOZzBM+z0GDzWtsbFzckuA@mail.gmail.com>
 <OFA7CC7E48.20493E6D-ON8525853B.0042F6C3-8525853B.00434CB6@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <f78364a8-3dcd-75a0-77c0-61d41bc8d6ea@dinospider.com>


 ?Yes, there are some that do that (not me), my brother-in-law is one 
and I belong to a gun club where there is always some type of discussion 
about in home carry, my firearms stay in the safe, but i am in a safe 
part of town and don't have coyotes around like you do.

 ? You would not want to see my brother-in-law's carry around the 
shop/yard weapon, its a small Ruger stainless security six, 2" barrel 
(he bought it CHEAP with a bulged barrel due to a squib and had the 
barrel cut down) and tore up to "poop", scratched (which can be fixed on 
a stainless gun) and gouged (which can't be fixed), its ugly but its 
been on his hip or small of his back for decades.? Get a cheap weapon, a 
revolver that you don't care about and you will get used to it on your 
hip or back, heck maybe even try a shoulder holster (kidding but they 
are comfortable while in the way).

 ?Personally, I would just get a small handgun safe, put it near the 
door and just get in the habit of opening it every time I walked in the 
garage and closing EVERY time you walk out.? Just leave it in the safe 
with door open.

 ?Here is some shop/manufacturing content :)? get the small safe and rig 
a light switch to it, so when you open the door it turns on a light that 
way when you are done for the day, you will remember to close the safe 
since the light will be on, make it a bright LED so you can't miss the 
light and it does not use much electricity during the day,? BONUS points 
if you rig it so you can't turn off the light while the safe door is 
open and closing the door turns off the light.

 ??? mike


On 3/30/2020 5:15 AM, eric--- via Shop-talk wrote:
> OK, this one I MEAN to go to the list.
>
> I few have written back about holstering a weapon. ?My question then 
> is, does anyone here do that? ?I can't even work on stuff if I have 
> anything in my pockets, I couldn't image safely maneuvering around, 
> under, through tight places in cars, etc with a piece of iron strapped 
> to my side.
>
> Not to mention how beat up it would get (I get REALLY banged up daily, 
> not sure I would want to put a piece through that regularly.)
>
> Thanks again for all the suggestions, ?It's really helping me plan 
> this properly.
>
>
> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a 
> rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your 
> territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson
> -Who is John Galt?
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/lists at dinospider.com
>

-- 
A gun is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have it,
you'll probably never need one again.

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From vintagenick42 at yahoo.com  Mon Mar 30 12:23:51 2020
From: vintagenick42 at yahoo.com (Nick Black)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 11:23:51 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <5BC31542-DF6B-4FB9-B103-E991B9C1E502@yahoo.com>

Eric
Most any weapon with a bit of maintenance will do the job.
More important is placement! No good havin a Gun at one end of the shop when you are backed into the opposite corner.
Suggest putting it at the place in the shop with a second point of exit.

I have similar animal issues but only have had deer snakes and turkeys come into the shop. And don?t demean a male turkey in rut inside your shop...scary!

Snakes in a shop???
Nick

Sent from the wilds of NorCal 

> On Mar 29, 2020, at 10:58 AM, eric--- via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> ?Ok, I know I've asked some weird questions before, but I think this one will take the cake. 
> 
> I live out in the country, and often work well into the night with a large shop door open.  With having bears, coyotes and other large animals in the area, I got to thinking, it might be a good idea to keep a pistol in the garage to scare off any would be 'late night snackers." 
> Actually, I had a run-in the other night that made me think about this. 
> 
> So my question is, if I have a pistol, in a rapid access safe in a shop environment, what factors should I consider?  I understand that humidity will play a huge role, as will dust (I have to see how 'sealed' the safe is.) 
> 
> Is there anything I'm missing that I should consider?  I understand that I will most likely have to clean the weapon often, but is there anything I need to think about? 
> 
> Also, I'm open to suggestions for a weapon type.  I thinking an XD-M elite polymer hand gun.  With mostly composite parts.  Similar to a Glock.  (Note, I don't have anything against Glock, I just never owned one.  I do have and love my XD however, so Glock isn't out of consideration.) 
> 
> I don't want this to turn into a 2nd amendment thread.  Just a 'what to consider' for leaving a pistol in a shop. 
> 
> Note, in my shop I do just about everything, metal work, wood work, car and heavy equipment work, etc.   
> 
> Thanks in advance. 
> 
> 
> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson 
> -Who is John Galt? _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/vintagenick42 at yahoo.com
> 
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From vintagenick42 at yahoo.com  Mon Mar 30 12:23:51 2020
From: vintagenick42 at yahoo.com (Nick Black)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 11:23:51 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <5BC31542-DF6B-4FB9-B103-E991B9C1E502@yahoo.com>

Eric
Most any weapon with a bit of maintenance will do the job.
More important is placement! No good havin a Gun at one end of the shop when you are backed into the opposite corner.
Suggest putting it at the place in the shop with a second point of exit.

I have similar animal issues but only have had deer snakes and turkeys come into the shop. And don?t demean a male turkey in rut inside your shop...scary!

Snakes in a shop???
Nick

Sent from the wilds of NorCal 

> On Mar 29, 2020, at 10:58 AM, eric--- via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
> 
> ?Ok, I know I've asked some weird questions before, but I think this one will take the cake. 
> 
> I live out in the country, and often work well into the night with a large shop door open.  With having bears, coyotes and other large animals in the area, I got to thinking, it might be a good idea to keep a pistol in the garage to scare off any would be 'late night snackers." 
> Actually, I had a run-in the other night that made me think about this. 
> 
> So my question is, if I have a pistol, in a rapid access safe in a shop environment, what factors should I consider?  I understand that humidity will play a huge role, as will dust (I have to see how 'sealed' the safe is.) 
> 
> Is there anything I'm missing that I should consider?  I understand that I will most likely have to clean the weapon often, but is there anything I need to think about? 
> 
> Also, I'm open to suggestions for a weapon type.  I thinking an XD-M elite polymer hand gun.  With mostly composite parts.  Similar to a Glock.  (Note, I don't have anything against Glock, I just never owned one.  I do have and love my XD however, so Glock isn't out of consideration.) 
> 
> I don't want this to turn into a 2nd amendment thread.  Just a 'what to consider' for leaving a pistol in a shop. 
> 
> Note, in my shop I do just about everything, metal work, wood work, car and heavy equipment work, etc.   
> 
> Thanks in advance. 
> 
> 
> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson 
> -Who is John Galt? _______________________________________________
> 
> Shop-talk at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
> 
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/vintagenick42 at yahoo.com
> 
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From strovato at optonline.net  Mon Mar 30 13:06:05 2020
From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 15:06:05 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@
 mail.megageek.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
Message-ID: <B4.71.27934.A93428E5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net>

I'm going to start with the "I don't know much about guns" opening 
line and then go ahead anyway!  You say you want to "scare off" 
animals.  If that's what you really want to do, how about an air 
horn?  You can have a few of those around without worrying about 
securing them.  If you want to do more than scare them, how about a 
shotgun?  It would still have to be secured and the same concerns 
about corrosion, etc would apply.  It seems to me that the main 
advantage of a pistol is that it is easier to carry.  If you aren't 
going to carry it, then perhaps a shotgun would serve your needs.

-Steve T.

At 01:58 PM 3/29/2020, eric--- via Shop-talk wrote:
>Ok, I know I've asked some weird questions before, but I think this 
>one will take the cake.
>
>I live out in the country, and often work well into the night with a 
>large shop door open.  With having bears, coyotes and other large 
>animals in the area, I got to thinking, it might be a good idea to 
>keep a pistol in the garage to scare off any would be 'late night snackers."
>Actually, I had a run-in the other night that made me think about this.


-- 
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From bspidell at comcast.net  Mon Mar 30 18:27:18 2020
From: bspidell at comcast.net (Bob Spidell)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 17:27:18 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] Harbor Freight ...
Message-ID: <cf1ee50b-f1dd-25df-5537-95267b047656@comcast.net>

... is the butt of lots of jokes (maybe even a few here).? But, I 
stopped by today to pick up a cheap-o welding cart and they had donated 
all their nitrile glove stocks to local hospitals.? I bought a couple 
boxes a couple weeks ago and they were flying off the shelves.

Kudos to them.

Bob

From tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com  Mon Mar 30 19:28:15 2020
From: tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com (Tim .)
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2020 01:28:15 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] permatex thread lock
Message-ID: <CH2PR04MB6505B1B22D635006B78B8729B4C80@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>

easy one tonight folks

Is this stuff's effectiveness affected by being frozen over winter in my shop?

cheers
stay healthy
tim
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From strovato at optonline.net  Mon Mar 30 19:57:18 2020
From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 21:57:18 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] permatex thread lock
In-Reply-To: <CH2PR04MB6505B1B22D635006B78B8729B4C80@CH2PR04MB6505.nampr
 d04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB6505B1B22D635006B78B8729B4C80@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <57.B4.09282.8A3A28E5@mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net>

These guys think you should throw it out and buy a fresh one:
<https://www.fourwheeler.com/how-to/tech-qa/1706-nuts-and-bolts-does-loctite-go-bad/>https://www.fourwheeler.com/how-to/tech-qa/1706-nuts-and-bolts-does-loctite-go-bad/ 

I think I agree with them.

-Steve T.

At 09:28 PM 3/30/2020, Tim . via Shop-talk wrote:
>Content-Language: en-US
>Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
> 
>boundary="_000_CH2PR04MB6505B1B22D635006B78B8729B4C80CH2PR04MB6505namp_"
>
>easy one tonight folks
>
>Is this stuff's effectiveness affected by being frozen over winter in my shop?
>
>cheers
>stay healthy
>tim


-- 
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From TR3driver at ca.rr.com  Mon Mar 30 22:32:57 2020
From: TR3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 21:32:57 -0700
Subject: [Shop-talk] permatex thread lock
In-Reply-To: <CH2PR04MB6505B1B22D635006B78B8729B4C80@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB6505B1B22D635006B78B8729B4C80@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <8C0CEB6CF831450A922C2933C3034855@RYPC>

Permatex says that storage below 8C (roughly 46F) or above 28C (roughly 82F)
can affect product performance.
https://is.gd/4nnNkI

FWIW Loctite says the same thing.

-- Randall 
56 TR3 TS13571L once and future daily driver
71 Stag LE1473 - awaiting engine rebuild
71-2-3 Stag - awaiting gearbox rebuild 

> easy one tonight folks
> 
> Is this stuff's effectiveness affected by being frozen over 
> winter in my shop?


From tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com  Tue Mar 31 07:35:23 2020
From: tims_datsun_stuff at outlook.com (Tim .)
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2020 13:35:23 +0000
Subject: [Shop-talk] permatex thread lock
In-Reply-To: <CH2PR04MB6505B1B22D635006B78B8729B4C80@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <CH2PR04MB6505B1B22D635006B78B8729B4C80@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <CH2PR04MB65055F0799CEC8C1E7CB15E8B4C80@CH2PR04MB6505.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>

Thanks for the replies. Since I am using it on an office chair (and nothing critical) that I brought home to work from home, I think I'll chance it.

________________________________
From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Sent: Monday, March 30, 2020 8:28 PM
To: Shop Talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Shop-talk] permatex thread lock

easy one tonight folks

Is this stuff's effectiveness affected by being frozen over winter in my shop?

cheers
stay healthy
tim
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From fitzgibbon3 at comcast.net  Mon Mar 30 09:34:50 2020
From: fitzgibbon3 at comcast.net (Thomas FitzGibbon)
Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2020 11:34:50 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <CAE16_w0rnBEwPP8qkcWVt4vznNW_XS4mowKM6OkWTmGh2On5tQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAE16_w0rnBEwPP8qkcWVt4vznNW_XS4mowKM6OkWTmGh2On5tQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1031304452.38386.1585582490874@connect.xfinity.com>

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From parkanzky at gmail.com  Tue Mar 31 08:57:02 2020
From: parkanzky at gmail.com (Paul Parkanzky)
Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2020 10:57:02 -0400
Subject: [Shop-talk] Maybe the weirest shop related question asked here.
In-Reply-To: <1031304452.38386.1585582490874@connect.xfinity.com>
References: <OFB9E9E154.DB93AABC-ON8525853A.006156AC-8525853A.0062BD38@mail.megageek.com>
 <CAE16_w0rnBEwPP8qkcWVt4vznNW_XS4mowKM6OkWTmGh2On5tQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <1031304452.38386.1585582490874@connect.xfinity.com>
Message-ID: <CAOErii==7i9xHA6WQgao=-G05aJqmPcOPs=O2=dhDgLmyp6+4w@mail.gmail.com>

I don't think a revolver is a poor choice but there's no way I'd store
an expensive revolver like that in the garage.

I agree with other commenters that say that if he doesn't have any
intention of carrying the firearm that there's no reason to compromise
with a handgun. I'd choose either a cheap AR-pattern rifle or an
inexpensive shotgun in one of Hornady's rapidsafe wall mounts or a
similar secured wall mount.

-Paul

On Tue, Mar 31, 2020 at 10:50 AM Thomas FitzGibbon via Shop-talk
<shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> Eric,
>
> I second the stainless steel revolver recommendation, maybe a Colt Python in .357 magnum.  I'd be concerned that a semi-auto would be more sensitive to that kind of environment, but either way it should not be too challenging.  Desiccant packs are going to be critical, especially to protect the ammo as the gun itself should be OK with a light coat of oil.
>
> Good luck.
>
> Tom
>
> On March 29, 2020 at 8:38 PM Philip Ethier via Shop-talk <shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> I'd recommend a stainless double-action revolver, attached to your person in a holster designed to make it impossible for the cylinder to revolve until the weapon is removed from the holster.
>
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 29, 2020 at 12:58 PM eric--- via Shop-talk < shop-talk at autox.team.net> wrote:
>
> Ok, I know I've asked some weird questions before, but I think this one will take the cake.
>
> I live out in the country, and often work well into the night with a large shop door open.  With having bears, coyotes and other large animals in the area, I got to thinking, it might be a good idea to keep a pistol in the garage to scare off any would be 'late night snackers."
> Actually, I had a run-in the other night that made me think about this.
>
> So my question is, if I have a pistol, in a rapid access safe in a shop environment, what factors should I consider?  I understand that humidity will play a huge role, as will dust (I have to see how 'sealed' the safe is.)
>
> Is there anything I'm missing that I should consider?  I understand that I will most likely have to clean the weapon often, but is there anything I need to think about?
>
> Also, I'm open to suggestions for a weapon type.  I thinking an XD-M elite polymer hand gun.  With mostly composite parts.  Similar to a Glock.  (Note, I don't have anything against Glock, I just never owned one.  I do have and love my XD however, so Glock isn't out of consideration.)
>
> I don't want this to turn into a 2nd amendment thread.  Just a 'what to consider' for leaving a pistol in a shop.
>
> Note, in my shop I do just about everything, metal work, wood work, car and heavy equipment work, etc.
>
> Thanks in advance.