From marka at maracing.com Wed Dec 1 06:21:46 2010 From: marka at maracing.com (Mark Andy) Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2010 08:21:46 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Shop-talk] 35mm slide scanner? In-Reply-To: <222376815.1800526.1291176434831.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <222376815.1800526.1291176434831.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: Howdy, On Wed, 1 Dec 2010, pethier at comcast.net wrote: >> For us, it was a one time deal to get old >> photos >> digital and there'd be no need once we'd done it once, so ScanCafe.com >> was >> cheaper, easier, and took a lot less time. > I'd like to have some professionals do this, but I'd rather drive to a > local outfit than ship them off to Bangalore India. If you have a good local outfit in your area that you can afford, than this might be a good option. For us, the India folks were the right choice. Mark From jem at milleredp.com Wed Dec 1 09:29:42 2010 From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller) Date: Wed, 01 Dec 2010 08:29:42 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] 35mm slide scanner? In-Reply-To: References: <222376815.1800526.1291176434831.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <4CF677F6.3070805@milleredp.com> >> I'd like to have some professionals do this, but I'd rather drive to a >> local outfit than ship them off to Bangalore India. > > If you have a good local outfit in your area that you can afford, than > this might be a good option. > > For us, the India folks were the right choice. I agree with the sentiment of wanting it done locally, but the economics militated very strongly against it. John. From bjshov8 at tx.rr.com Wed Dec 1 15:21:12 2010 From: bjshov8 at tx.rr.com (bjshov8 at tx.rr.com) Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2010 17:21:12 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] 35mm slide scanner? In-Reply-To: <4CF677F6.3070805@milleredp.com> Message-ID: <20101201222112.BNU8U.185105.root@cdptpa-web12-z02> Probably depends on where you are. I would guess that there is a service in my big city that would do this, but I haven't looked yet. I was close to buying a slide scanner some years ago but didn't. Now they are harder to find and more expensive. One big factor is the method of handling dust. Some scanners will automatically eliminate it, others require you to do it by hand in photoshop. All of the scanners are slow so you spend a lot of time feeding in slides and babysitting the computer. One day I realized that I used to see slide duplicators for sale. They were a lens system and fixture that you mounted to the front of your camera. Then put a slide in it and photograph the slide with your camera onto slide film, then have it processed. I have a macro lens that will focus close enough to do this so I've been interested in trying it on my DSLR. I would have to build something with cardboard tubes and so forth for testing. I think the downside of this is that the contrast and dynamic range will be affected, and of course you still have the dust to deal with, but it would be faster than a scanner. Maybe I'll try that this winter in my spare time. > >> I'd like to have some professionals do this, but I'd rather drive to a > >> local outfit than ship them off to Bangalore India. > > > > If you have a good local outfit in your area that you can afford, than > > this might be a good option. > > > > For us, the India folks were the right choice. > > I agree with the sentiment of wanting it done locally, but the economics > militated very strongly against it. From Gil.Fuqua at cci-ir.com Wed Dec 1 15:41:23 2010 From: Gil.Fuqua at cci-ir.com (Gil Fuqua) Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2010 16:41:23 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] 35mm slide scanner? In-Reply-To: <20101201222112.BNU8U.185105.root@cdptpa-web12-z02> References: <4CF677F6.3070805@milleredp.com> <20101201222112.BNU8U.185105.root@cdptpa-web12-z02> Message-ID: <2968A0FF9B6E7A4EB08A6B3FED65DBC654E6B2@bnaexg01.cci-ir.com> You can buy a generic slide duplicator that attaches to the front of your lens. It includes a holder for the slide and they are cheap on eBay. $20 will buy one that attaches like a filter to your front element. See the Prinz on eBay as an example. http://cgi.ebay.com/MIB-SLIDE-DUPLICATOR-PRINZ-SERIES-VII-/390226529460? pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5adb504cb4#ht_500wt_922 Gil Nashville -----Original Message----- From: shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of bjshov8 at tx.rr.com Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 2010 4:21 PM To: shop-talk at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] 35mm slide scanner? Probably depends on where you are. I would guess that there is a service in my big city that would do this, but I haven't looked yet. I was close to buying a slide scanner some years ago but didn't. Now they are harder to find and more expensive. One big factor is the method of handling dust. Some scanners will automatically eliminate it, others require you to do it by hand in photoshop. All of the scanners are slow so you spend a lot of time feeding in slides and babysitting the computer. One day I realized that I used to see slide duplicators for sale. They were a lens system and fixture that you mounted to the front of your camera. Then put a slide in it and photograph the slide with your camera onto slide film, then have it processed. I have a macro lens that will focus close enough to do this so I've been interested in trying it on my DSLR. I would have to build something with cardboard tubes and so forth for testing. I think the downside of this is that the contrast and dynamic range will be affected, and of course you still have the dust to deal with, but it would be faster than a scanner. Maybe I'll try that this winter in my spare time. > >> I'd like to have some professionals do this, but I'd rather drive to a > >> local outfit than ship them off to Bangalore India. > > > > If you have a good local outfit in your area that you can afford, than > > this might be a good option. > > > > For us, the India folks were the right choice. > > I agree with the sentiment of wanting it done locally, but the economics > militated very strongly against it. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/gil.fuqua at cci-ir.com From bjshov8 at tx.rr.com Wed Dec 1 18:32:21 2010 From: bjshov8 at tx.rr.com (BJNoSHOV8) Date: Wed, 01 Dec 2010 19:32:21 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] 35mm slide scanner? In-Reply-To: <2968A0FF9B6E7A4EB08A6B3FED65DBC654E6B2@bnaexg01.cci-ir.com> References: <4CF677F6.3070805@milleredp.com> <20101201222112.BNU8U.185105.root@cdptpa-web12-z02> <2968A0FF9B6E7A4EB08A6B3FED65DBC654E6B2@bnaexg01.cci-ir.com> Message-ID: <4CF6F725.4060200@tx.rr.com> My camera is not expensive enough for that. :) The reason is that the slide duplicator is made for a 35mm SLR so it will recreate a 24mmx36mm transparency onto a 24mmx36mm negative/transparency/digital sensor. The problem is that most DSLR's have sensors that are only 16mmx24mm or smaller, so they would only get the center part of the image (44% of the area). However there may be similar devices made recently that will work with the smaller sensors. Canon and Nikon both make DSLR's with so-called "full frame" sensors, but they are too expensive for me right now. The other issue is that these things have lenses builtin that are probably not so good. Since I already have a macro lens that will focus close enough to duplicate a slide, I just need a fixture to hold it in front of the lens. And then experiment with it a little bit. Or maybe I should buy the most expensive slide scanner I can find and start my own home business. > You can buy a generic slide duplicator that attaches to the front of > your lens. It includes a holder for the slide and they are cheap on > eBay. $20 will buy one that attaches like a filter to your front > element. See the Prinz on eBay as an example. > > http://cgi.ebay.com/MIB-SLIDE-DUPLICATOR-PRINZ-SERIES-VII-/390226529460? > pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item5adb504cb4#ht_500wt_922 From eric at megageek.com Wed Dec 1 20:23:17 2010 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2010 22:23:17 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] 35mm slide scanner? In-Reply-To: <4CF6F725.4060200@tx.rr.com> Message-ID: BJNoSHOV8 writes... >Or maybe I should buy the most expensive slide scanner I can find and >start my own home business. Or, you could buy the most expensive one you can find, scan your slides in a day or so and then return it to the store. 8>) (Note, I do not condone this action, I was just making a joke!) 8>) Moose "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson From bjshov8 at tx.rr.com Wed Dec 1 20:45:08 2010 From: bjshov8 at tx.rr.com (BJNoSHOV8) Date: Wed, 01 Dec 2010 21:45:08 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] 35mm slide scanner? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4CF71644.6030803@tx.rr.com> My understanding is that even working round the clock I couldn't scan all of my slides in a day or so. > Or, you could buy the most expensive one you can find, scan your > slides in a day or so and then return it to the store. > 8>)(Note, I do not condone this action, I was just making a joke!) 8>) From TR3driver at ca.rr.com Wed Dec 1 21:54:46 2010 From: TR3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Wed, 1 Dec 2010 20:54:46 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] 35mm slide scanner? In-Reply-To: References: <4CF6F725.4060200@tx.rr.com> Message-ID: <069c01cb91dd$0ad82b10$0301a8c0@randall> > (Note, I do not condone this action, I was just making a joke!) 8>) FWIW, my late wife used to do that all the time. She would even tell the store personnel at the time of purchase that she intended to return it. They always said something along the lines of "That's fine." -- Randall From jniolon at bham.rr.com Fri Dec 3 15:17:32 2010 From: jniolon at bham.rr.com (John Niolon) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2010 16:17:32 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] building a gorilla lift Message-ID: <27519FF4FE9E46BF84A451817A14EB6B@john5043a2d406> got a new trailer with a 6' ramp gate. I'm an old sissy and this gate is heavy. I looked at the gorilla lift assist systems but 200 bucks is a little high .. so I though I'd research building one the system is nothing but a piece of 2x2 tubing, a garage door spring, a cable and two rollers. I've ordered the rollers, got the tubing and cable but wondering on the spring. Garage door springs come in 10# increments from 50-160#s. what do you guys think would be the best to buy ??? It has to let the gate down easy and raise it easily... I know I can adjust it by moving the attach point of the cable to the gate and also I guess I could move the spring in the housing tube .... but what # spring to buy ?? suggestions John I've learned in life that my primary goal is to serve as a bad example From pat at hornesystemstx.com Fri Dec 3 17:10:15 2010 From: pat at hornesystemstx.com (Pat Horne) Date: Fri, 03 Dec 2010 18:10:15 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] building a gorilla lift In-Reply-To: <27519FF4FE9E46BF84A451817A14EB6B@john5043a2d406> References: <27519FF4FE9E46BF84A451817A14EB6B@john5043a2d406> Message-ID: <4CF986E7.2050605@hornesystemstx.com> Around here garage doors worth their salt make their own springs and can make any weight needed. Check with companies that install custom doors and you should find a source for the spring you need. Peace, Pat Thusly spake John Niolon, On 12/3/2010 4:17 PM: > got a new trailer with a 6' ramp gate. I'm an old sissy and this gate is > heavy. I looked at the gorilla lift assist systems but 200 bucks is a little > high .. so I though I'd research building one > > the system is nothing but a piece of 2x2 tubing, a garage door spring, a cable > and two rollers. I've ordered the rollers, got the tubing and cable but > wondering on the spring. Garage door springs come in 10# increments from > 50-160#s. > > what do you guys think would be the best to buy ??? It has to let the gate > down easy and raise it easily... I know I can adjust it by moving the attach > point of the cable to the gate and also I guess I could move the spring in > the housing tube .... but what # spring to buy ?? > > suggestions > > John > > > > > > > I've learned in life that my primary goal > is to serve as a bad example > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pat at hornesystemstx.com > > > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- From tputland at charter.net Fri Dec 3 17:31:26 2010 From: tputland at charter.net (Tim) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2010 16:31:26 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] building a gorilla lift In-Reply-To: <4CF986E7.2050605@hornesystemstx.com> Message-ID: <20101203193126.202PC.73083.root@mp12> I think John is looking for a spring strength recomendtion, not a source there for.....Or is my head stuck in my nether region again/still???? Tim ---- Pat Horne wrote: ============= Around here garage doors worth their salt make their own springs and can make any weight needed. Check with companies that install custom doors and you should find a source for the spring you need. Peace, Pat Thusly spake John Niolon, On 12/3/2010 4:17 PM: > got a new trailer with a 6' ramp gate. I'm an old sissy and this gate is > heavy. I looked at the gorilla lift assist systems but 200 bucks is a little > high .. so I though I'd research building one > > the system is nothing but a piece of 2x2 tubing, a garage door spring, a cable > and two rollers. I've ordered the rollers, got the tubing and cable but > wondering on the spring. Garage door springs come in 10# increments from > 50-160#s. > > what do you guys think would be the best to buy ??? It has to let the gate > down easy and raise it easily... I know I can adjust it by moving the attach > point of the cable to the gate and also I guess I could move the spring in > the housing tube .... but what # spring to buy ?? > > suggestions > > John > > > > > > > I've learned in life that my primary goal > is to serve as a bad example > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pat at hornesystemstx.com > > > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tputland at charter.net From jferguson at bellsouth.net Fri Dec 3 17:45:52 2010 From: jferguson at bellsouth.net (Jim Ferguson) Date: Fri, 03 Dec 2010 19:45:52 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] building a gorilla lift Message-ID: <4CF98F40.8040203@bellsouth.net> I built one like that for my wife's horse trailer. I used an old garage door spring that a pile of "stuff to save because you may need it someday". I have no idea of the rating of the spring. It was a lot of trial and error. I ended up with a compound pulley system and attaching at he midpoint of the ramp. I put the spring in a length of plastic pipe for protection. It has worked well for many years. The spring was almost 3" in diameter and about 2' long. Jim From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Fri Dec 3 17:48:51 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2010 16:48:51 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] building a gorilla lift In-Reply-To: <27519FF4FE9E46BF84A451817A14EB6B@john5043a2d406> References: <27519FF4FE9E46BF84A451817A14EB6B@john5043a2d406> Message-ID: <04d001cb934d$061315b0$12394110$@rr.com> > what do you guys think would be the best to buy ??? It has to let the > gate > down easy and raise it easily... I know I can adjust it by moving the > attach > point of the cable to the gate and also I guess I could move the > spring in > the housing tube .... but what # spring to buy ?? Well, you want the force from the spring to be zero with the ramp closed, so the spring needs to be fully relaxed/retracted at that point. And the force should be just slightly less than what it takes to lift the ramp off the ground at full extension. So figure out how far it can stretch between those two extremes, and choose a spring that supplies that much force at that much extension. But unless I'm missing something, I think you will be unhappy with the result. The force from the spring is more or less linear with displacement, while the force to lift the door depends on the cosine of the angle between the door & the ground. If your spring is strong enough to nearly lift the door off the ground, I suspect it's going to slam into the trailer plenty hard enough to smash fingers, tear up the trailer and so on. Swinging garage doors actually have multiple cam actions built into the hinges, to deal with this problem. -- Randall From eric at megageek.com Fri Dec 3 18:08:52 2010 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2010 20:08:52 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] building a gorilla lift In-Reply-To: <27519FF4FE9E46BF84A451817A14EB6B@john5043a2d406> Message-ID: john, I've seen systems that work much better and aren't in the way for trailer lift gates. In fact, the car trailer I just rebuilt has a great way to do it. It uses a leaf spring in the center of the trailer that connects to the rear of the gate. It is almost completely hidden and works much better. Plus, it's heavy duty and will not break like garage springs or cable. Here is a quick link to two pics I have of the trailer handy. I can take better pics if you want them... Moose "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson From gsteve at hammatt.com Fri Dec 3 18:25:49 2010 From: gsteve at hammatt.com (Steve Hammatt Mount Vernon WA USA) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2010 17:25:49 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Cable assist for car trailer ramp Message-ID: Hi I've got a 24' enclosed car trailer. It's got cable assist (both sides) to help with opening and closing the rear ramp door. It appears to be similar to the horizontal spring used to assist garage door openers. Is anyone familiar with this use and know of the most common supplier? I'd like to increase the assist but wanted to review the procedure before jumping in on this. Thanks. Steve Hammatt Mount Vernon WA USA From eltonclark at gmail.com Fri Dec 3 19:14:14 2010 From: eltonclark at gmail.com (Elton E. (Tony) Clark) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2010 20:14:14 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] building a gorilla lift In-Reply-To: <04d001cb934d$061315b0$12394110$@rr.com> References: <27519FF4FE9E46BF84A451817A14EB6B@john5043a2d406> <04d001cb934d$061315b0$12394110$@rr.com> Message-ID: *It's not that complicated, our factory installed ramp/door has the normal* *garage door torsion spring and cable arrangement . . the gate just* *floats at ground level but allows a one hand lift to within a foot of* *being closed;** an easy push finishes the chore . .It doesn't need* *to be spring-slammed shut but that would be okay.* * Another case where* *close enough is just right.* ** On Fri, Dec 3, 2010 at 6:48 PM, Randall wrote: Well, you want the force from the spring to be zero with the ramp closed, so the spring needs to be fully relaxed/retracted at that point. And the force should be just slightly less than what it takes to lift the ramp off the ground at full extension. So figure out how far it can stretch between those two extremes, and choose a spring that supplies that much force at that much extension. But unless I'm missing something, I think you will be unhappy with the result. The force from the spring is more or less linear with displacement, while the force to lift the door depends on the cosine of the angle between the door & the ground. If your spring is strong enough to nearly lift the door off the ground, I suspect it's going to slam into the trailer plenty hard enough to smash fingers, tear up the trailer and so on. Swinging garage doors actually have multiple cam actions built into the hinges, to deal with this problem. -- Randall > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/eltonclark at gmail.com From mark at bradakis.com Fri Dec 3 21:15:12 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Fri, 3 Dec 2010 21:15:12 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Shop-talk] Spam, servers, service and such Message-ID: <20101204041512.D11EC2E0B2@bradakis.com> I wrote this for another list, but there are possibly a few of you who here who might want some advance warning of possible Team.Net downtime. I don't want to be the cause of even more hoilday panic! Anyway, here's the message: Yes, there are still some spam messages from hijacked email accounts getting through now and then. I've been working on the issue a bit, but it is turning out to be a case of 'shipwright's disease' as we know it, applied to computers. If you don't know what I am talking about, check out http://www.team.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=32 Basically to tighten up security and improve a few things I'm planning on updating the operating system and all the user level programs that Team.Net uses. Not a small undertaking, but well within my abilities. Currently there is no budget for hardware upgrades, perhaps after the spring fund drive. Of course, if you haven't yet spent all your loot on holiday gifts and such and wanted to donate [ link below ] I would not complain ;-) The process will take a fair bit of time over who knows how many late nights at the keyboard. With luck it will all be unnoticed by you folks, transparent to the user, as they say. But there is always a chance of service not being available for some period of time, hopefully no more than minutes at a time. It could be something simple, like a stupid typo in a config file, or it could be one of the cats jumping the the keyboard as I go to fetch some more refrehments and somehow managing to hit the CONFIRM REFORMAT OF ALL DISKS button. I remember what it was like when the ISP I was using for the DSL line went belly up and Team.Net was off the air for 8 days - not a good thing. Actually, I wonder what the up vs. down time percentages might be over the last 19 years and 7 months of Team.Net. I won't count the years before that when I ran it from the U of U. Anyway, short story is if Team.Net disappears at times over the next few weeks, don't panic, I'll be working on it. mjb. From cavanadd at frontier.com Fri Dec 3 23:16:52 2010 From: cavanadd at frontier.com (David C.) Date: Fri, 03 Dec 2010 22:16:52 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] On line discount Rx? Message-ID: <4CF9DCD4.9070101@frontier.com> OK, this has nothing to do with shop stuff other than staying healthy will let me spend more time doing shop stuff. Plus this group seems to have the answer to just about anything.... Anyway, can anyone recommend a good on line discount pharmacy? I may need to fill some prescriptions out of pocket and may be able to get a better deal on-line. However, a lot (ok, nearly all) the web sites for discount internet pharmacies look kind of scary. Any recommendations? I would rather not order drugs from India, but Canada might not be out of the question... thanks Dave From darmstrong at nexicom.net Sat Dec 4 07:35:59 2010 From: darmstrong at nexicom.net (Doug Armstrong) Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2010 09:35:59 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Water Alarm Message-ID: <201012041435.oB4EZvCi016966@smtp.nexicom.net> I believe that there was a discussion last week about setting up a remote water alarm. I saw this today in a flyer: http://www.protectedhome.com/homesitter-p-118-l-en.html The HS-700 HomeSitter from Protected Home is the lowest cost multi-functional home monitoring system on the market! The HomeSitter will sound an audible alarm and call up to three telephone numbers to protect your home from damage caused by temperature extremes, water leaks or power failures. Alarm set-up takes just a few minutes and there are no monitoring fees or installation costs! All you need is a phone line and a power outlet. No Landline? See the Cell Link Adapter page. Automatically calls to up to three telephone numbers upon alarm 7 Sounds local built-in siren upon all alarms 7 Monitors for a temperature loss/rise (below 450F/70C or rise above 850F/340C) 7 Monitors for water leaks or over-flowing sump pumps (water sensor included) 7 Monitors for power outages 7 Monitors the back-up battery status Since it relies on the phone line, I doubt you can call your home number because it will be in use. Looks like an interesting product. In Canada they are for sale at TSC. Doug Armstrong From TR3driver at ca.rr.com Sat Dec 4 15:13:38 2010 From: TR3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2010 14:13:38 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] On line discount Rx? In-Reply-To: <4CF9DCD4.9070101@frontier.com> References: <4CF9DCD4.9070101@frontier.com> Message-ID: <008b01cb9400$80917bc0$0301a8c0@randall> > However, a lot (ok, nearly all) the web > sites for > discount internet pharmacies look kind of scary. Any > recommendations? What I did was to get the list of low cost prescription drugs available from Costco, Wal-Mart, K-mart and Target. My prescriptions were not on the list, but I found some drugs that were in the same family and were on the list. Called my doctor with that information and asked if the cheaper drugs would work for me. He said "Yes", so my cost dropped from roughly $60/month (and going up every month) to about $20/month. And the BP cuff confirms they work just as well. BTW, my MD had absolutely no idea which ones were cheaper. I had previously asked for a generic, which turned out to be even more expensive than the name brand he prescribed in the first place. -- Randall From jmitch at snet.net Sat Dec 4 15:43:54 2010 From: jmitch at snet.net (John Mitchell) Date: Sat, 04 Dec 2010 17:43:54 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hardwood floor saddle Message-ID: <4CFAC42A.9060105@snet.net> Hi all, In my bedroom I have hardwood flooring and there was wood saddle where the hardwood met the tile going into the bathroom as the tile was a little lower than the wood. I've redone the tile flooring so that it is now level with the hardwood. When the saddle was removed, the wood underneath is no longer the same color or texture as the rest. I've tried sanding and putting on a coat of polyurethane, but it still looks ugly. I'm wondering if there is some kind of a thin wood strip that I can apply to hide the area. I don't really want to use the old saddle, as it was very thick, and was a tripping hazard. Any ideas short of re-doing the whole floor would be appreciated. Thanks John Mitchell Shelton, CT From trmarty at hotmail.com Sat Dec 4 16:03:50 2010 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2010 18:03:50 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Was water alarm, now sump pump. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I posted something last week asking about water alarms now let me pester the group with a sump pump question. History.. The house is 11 years old with a sump pump in the basement. The pump discharges up and through the basement wall at a height of about 6 or 7 feet from the bottom of the pump crock. Then goes out to a ditch at the road. Pipe is 1-1/2 inch PVC. Total run of pipe is around 240 foot. The drop from where it leaves the house to where it discharges into the ditch is about 2 foot. The original pump took a dump about 3 years after we moved in naturally when we weren't home. The first pump was all hard plumbed in. When I replace the pump I used some rubber couplings, the kind with a couple of hose clamps on the ends to tie things together. Had an issue a while ago where one of the couplings separated from the pipe and the gusher flooded part of the basement. I figured I had not tightened the clamps sufficiently. Tightened everything up and checked them every couple of months to make sure they were tight. All was well until last week when one blew apart again. Water in the basement AGAIN. So OK I'm figuring I should not have used the rubber couplings. After putting the carpet back down today I move over the pump to take those rubber couplings out and hard plumb things back together. From trmarty at hotmail.com Sat Dec 4 16:20:02 2010 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2010 18:20:02 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] FW: Was water alarm, now sump pump. MORE In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: Well that was weird, I did not think I hit the send button. Please continue reading at the bottom. Marty From: trmarty at hotmail.com To: shop-talk at autox.team.net Subject: Was water alarm, now sump pump. Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2010 18:03:50 -0500 I posted something last week asking about water alarms now let me pester the group with a sump pump question. History.. The house is 11 years old with a sump pump in the basement. The pump discharges up and through the basement wall at a height of about 6 or 7 feet from the bottom of the pump crock. Then goes out to a ditch at the road. Pipe is 1-1/2 inch PVC. Total run of pipe is around 240 foot. The drop from where it leaves the house to where it discharges into the ditch is about 2 foot. The original pump took a dump about 3 years after we moved in naturally when we weren't home. The first pump was all hard plumbed in. When I replace the pump I used some rubber couplings, the kind with a couple of hose clamps on the ends to tie things together. Had an issue a while ago where one of the couplings separated from the pipe and the gusher flooded part of the basement. I figured I had not tightened the clamps sufficiently. Tightened everything up and checked them every couple of months to make sure they were tight. All was well until last week when one blew apart again. Water in the basement AGAIN. So OK I'm figuring I should not have used the rubber couplings. After putting the carpet back down today I move over the pump to take those rubber couplings out and hard plumb things back together. As I took apart the discharge pipe the water gushed back into the crock with a lot of force. So much came out I measured it as I scooped it out in order to empty the crock so I could work on the pipe. 24 gallons of water came out. According to my calculations (might be wrong) 240 foot of 1-1/2 inch pipe would hold about 24 gallons of water. This is puzzling to me. Observations. When the pump turns on the water flows freely out the end at the ditch. The pipe where it goes into the ditch is well above the water level in the ditch. The water that flowed back through the pipe back into the crock when I separated the pipe was clear. I could understand there being water in the vertical line where it goes up and out the wall. I would think all the rest of the water would drain out due to the slope to the ditch. If there was a hole in the line some place I would think some muddy water would be flowing back into the crock. What could cause this or is it normal and I am worrying over nothing. Thanks, Marty From eltonclark at gmail.com Sat Dec 4 16:29:32 2010 From: eltonclark at gmail.com (Elton E. (Tony) Clark) Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2010 17:29:32 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] On line discount Rx? In-Reply-To: <008b01cb9400$80917bc0$0301a8c0@randall> References: <4CF9DCD4.9070101@frontier.com> <008b01cb9400$80917bc0$0301a8c0@randall> Message-ID: *I had about the same experience as Randall but my drug insurance provider, Humana, made the suggestions which I then cleared with my doc . . one BP med dropped 40 bucks a month.* On Sat, Dec 4, 2010 at 4:13 PM, Randall wrote: > > However, a lot (ok, nearly all) the web > > sites for > > discount internet pharmacies look kind of scary. Any > > recommendations? > > What I did was to get the list of low cost prescription drugs available > from > Costco, Wal-Mart, K-mart and Target. My prescriptions were not on the > list, but I found some drugs that were in the same family and were on the > list. Called my doctor with that information and asked if the cheaper > drugs > would work for me. He said "Yes", so my cost dropped from roughly > $60/month > (and going up every month) to about $20/month. And the BP cuff confirms > they work just as well. > > BTW, my MD had absolutely no idea which ones were cheaper. I had > previously > asked for a generic, which turned out to be even more expensive than the > name brand he prescribed in the first place. > > -- Randall > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/eltonclark at gmail.com From shochschild at att.net Sat Dec 4 16:45:45 2010 From: shochschild at att.net (shochschild at att.net) Date: Sat, 04 Dec 2010 17:45:45 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hardwood floor saddle In-Reply-To: <4CFAC42A.9060105@snet.net> References: <4CFAC42A.9060105@snet.net> Message-ID: <4CFAD2A9.4070209@att.net> Do you have a planer? On 12/4/2010 4:43 PM, John Mitchell wrote: > Hi all, In my bedroom I have hardwood flooring and there was wood > saddle where the hardwood met the tile going into the bathroom as the > tile was a little lower than the wood. I've redone the tile flooring > so that it is now level with the hardwood. When the saddle was > removed, the wood underneath is no longer the same color or texture as > the rest. I've tried sanding and putting on a coat of polyurethane, > but it still looks ugly. I'm wondering if there is some kind of a > thin wood strip that I can apply to hide the area. I don't really want > to use the old saddle, as it was very thick, and was a tripping > hazard. Any ideas short of re-doing the whole floor would be > appreciated. Thanks John Mitchell Shelton, CT > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shochschild at att.net From jmitch at snet.net Sat Dec 4 16:57:43 2010 From: jmitch at snet.net (John Mitchell) Date: Sat, 04 Dec 2010 18:57:43 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hardwood floor saddle In-Reply-To: <4CFAD2A9.4070209@att.net> References: <4CFAC42A.9060105@snet.net> <4CFAD2A9.4070209@att.net> Message-ID: <4CFAD577.9050704@snet.net> It's funny, I just talked to my nephew about using his to thin down the old saddle. Thanks On 12/4/2010 6:45 PM, shochschild at att.net wrote: > Do you have a planer? > > On 12/4/2010 4:43 PM, John Mitchell wrote: >> Hi all, In my bedroom I have hardwood flooring and there was wood >> saddle where the hardwood met the tile going into the bathroom as the >> tile was a little lower than the wood. I've redone the tile flooring >> so that it is now level with the hardwood. When the saddle was >> removed, the wood underneath is no longer the same color or texture >> as the rest. I've tried sanding and putting on a coat of >> polyurethane, but it still looks ugly. I'm wondering if there is >> some kind of a thin wood strip that I can apply to hide the area. I >> don't really want to use the old saddle, as it was very thick, and >> was a tripping hazard. Any ideas short of re-doing the whole floor >> would be appreciated. Thanks John Mitchell Shelton, CT >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe/Manage: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shochschild at att.net From trmarty at hotmail.com Sat Dec 4 18:47:34 2010 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2010 20:47:34 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] FW: Was water alarm, now sump pump. MORE In-Reply-To: References: , , , Message-ID: Doug, Brad, list. I think figured it out. I double checked the slope. Yup, 28 inches from house to ditch. But when I got to thinking about it something dawned on me. I see the pipe as it comes out of the house and goes down next to the outside wall but have no idea how far down it goes before it goes horizontal towards the road. It probably(might) goes down below the frost line and then out to the ditch which means it would have to go UPHILL. Duh, why did I think of that before. Marty > Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2010 20:07:12 -0500 > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] FW: Was water alarm, now sump pump. MORE > From: doug at dougbraun.com > To: trmarty at hotmail.com > > Maybe it's not really going downhill, but just looks like it is? Is > there a non-return valve at the outlet of the pump? If that is > securely attached to the pipe, a break in the line from the pump to > the valve would now do what you described. > > Doug From bjshov8 at tx.rr.com Sat Dec 4 20:40:49 2010 From: bjshov8 at tx.rr.com (bjshov8 at tx.rr.com) Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2010 22:40:49 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hardwood floor saddle In-Reply-To: <4CFAD577.9050704@snet.net> Message-ID: <20101205034049.748AZ.211045.root@cdptpa-web28-z02> If you can make the old piece work, then ok. Otherwise you can buy the same wood type, cut and shape it to fit, and stain to match. We did this and had stain custom-mixed to match our flooring. Or you could try your luck at buying stain at the store. ---- John Mitchell wrote: > It's funny, I just talked to my nephew about using his to thin down the > old saddle. Thanks > > On 12/4/2010 6:45 PM, shochschild at att.net wrote: > > Do you have a planer? > > > > On 12/4/2010 4:43 PM, John Mitchell wrote: > >> Hi all, In my bedroom I have hardwood flooring and there was wood > >> saddle where the hardwood met the tile going into the bathroom as the > >> tile was a little lower than the wood. I've redone the tile flooring > >> so that it is now level with the hardwood. When the saddle was > >> removed, the wood underneath is no longer the same color or texture > >> as the rest. I've tried sanding and putting on a coat of > >> polyurethane, but it still looks ugly. I'm wondering if there is > >> some kind of a thin wood strip that I can apply to hide the area. I > >> don't really want to use the old saddle, as it was very thick, and > >> was a tripping hazard. Any ideas short of re-doing the whole floor > >> would be appreciated. Thanks John Mitchell Shelton, CT > >> _______________________________________________ > >> > >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net > >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 > >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > >> Unsubscribe/Manage: > >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shochschild at att.net > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bjshov8 at tx.rr.com From pat at hornesystemstx.com Sat Dec 4 21:44:37 2010 From: pat at hornesystemstx.com (Pat Horne) Date: Sat, 04 Dec 2010 22:44:37 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] FW: Was water alarm, now sump pump. MORE In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: <4CFB18B5.1070402@hornesystemstx.com> Marty, You could always put in an automatic vent at the top of the pipe outside the wall. That would allow any water in the pipe between the vent and the ditch that is not below the outlet end of the pipe to drain out. Another thing you could do is put a check valve in line with the pipe to keep the water from backing up into the pump. I was talking to our propane delivery guy yesterday and he told me that about once a year, when we get our first hard freeze, that the hose couplings on their delivery trucks leak really badly because the hoses shrink, making the clamps loose. Is it possible that you clamps are loosening up, allowing the hoses to blow off? Thusly spake marty sukey, On 12/4/2010 5:20 PM: > Well that was weird, I did not think I hit the send button. Please continue > reading at the bottom. > > Marty > > From: trmarty at hotmail.com > To: shop-talk at autox.team.net > Subject: Was water alarm, now sump pump. > Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2010 18:03:50 -0500 > > > > > > > > > I posted something last week asking about water alarms now let me pester the > group with a sump pump question. History.. The house is 11 years old with a > sump pump in the basement. The pump discharges up and through the basement > wall at a height of about 6 or 7 feet from the bottom of the pump crock. Then > goes out to a ditch at the road. Pipe is 1-1/2 inch PVC. Total run of pipe is > around 240 foot. The drop from where it leaves the house to where it > discharges into the ditch is about 2 foot. The original pump took a dump about > 3 years after we moved in naturally when we weren't home. The first pump was > all hard plumbed in. When I replace the pump I used some rubber couplings, > the kind with a couple of hose clamps on the ends to tie things together. Had > an issue a while ago where one of the couplings separated from the pipe and > the gusher flooded part of the basement. I figured I had not tightened the > clamps sufficiently. Tightened everything up and checked them every couple of > months to make sure they were tight. All was well until last week when one > blew apart again. Water in the basement AGAIN. So OK I'm figuring I should > not have used the rubber couplings. After putting the carpet back down today I > move over the pump to take those rubber couplings out and hard plumb things > back together. > > As I took apart the discharge pipe the water gushed back into the crock with a > lot of force. So much came out I measured it as I scooped it out in order to > empty the crock so I could work on the pipe. 24 gallons of water came out. > According to my calculations (might be wrong) 240 foot of 1-1/2 inch pipe > would hold about 24 gallons of water. This is puzzling to me. Observations. > When the pump turns on the water flows freely out the end at the ditch. The > pipe where it goes into the ditch is well above the water level in the ditch. > The water that flowed back through the pipe back into the crock when I > separated the pipe was clear. I could understand there being water in the > vertical line where it goes up and out the wall. I would think all the rest of > the water would drain out due to the slope to the ditch. If there was a hole > in the line some place I would think some muddy water would be flowing back > into the crock. What could cause this or is it normal and I am worrying over > nothing. > > Thanks, > Marty > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pat at hornesystemstx.com > > > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- From marka at maracing.com Sat Dec 4 22:19:08 2010 From: marka at maracing.com (Mark Andy) Date: Sun, 5 Dec 2010 00:19:08 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Shop-talk] xmas lights, shunts, and magic Message-ID: Howdy, So the xmas light strand only has half the lights on when we pull it out this year. I hate xmas lights. As we're in the store to buy a new replacement strand, I see a little pistol shaped gizmo that promises to fix it. Its got some kinda voltage detector, a bulb detector, and a magical 'shunt' fixer. The story on the box is that the shunt gets clogged up like a drain. Obviously isn't can't actually be the case, but it is true that we plugged the thing into a non-working bulb on a strand that was out, and then pulled the trigger a few times and the lights on the strand started working again. What the hell actually happened? Mark From TR3driver at ca.rr.com Sat Dec 4 23:52:58 2010 From: TR3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2010 22:52:58 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] xmas lights, shunts, and magic In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <012301cb9449$0ddc3590$0301a8c0@randall> > The story on the box is that the shunt gets clogged up like a drain. Well, apparently that isn't too far from the truth. According to this: http://www.planetchristmas.com/Minis.htm (scroll to the explanation at the bottom) modern Xmas bulbs do have a kind of shunt built into the bottom of the bulb, that is supposed to short out the bulb if it sees full line voltage (due to the filament being burned out). With a bad bulb shorted, the other bulbs continue to light (somewhat more brightly, since they now get a larger share of the line voltage). But if more than one bulb fails while no power is applied (from rough handling), then the bad bulbs never see full line voltage and the shunt never gets activated. Most likely, your "fixer" sends a high voltage (but low power) kick through the string, to try to get the nearest open shunt to close. -- Randall From arobs at u.washington.edu Sun Dec 5 00:52:51 2010 From: arobs at u.washington.edu (Andrew Roberts) Date: Sat, 4 Dec 2010 23:52:51 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Shop-talk] Was water alarm, now sump pump. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Don't rule out the use of flexible hoses; it's quite possible that the particular ones you've been using aren't appropriate for the application or weren't installed correctly. It's not uncommon to see short lengths of rubberized hose used to reduce the transmission of vibrations from a pump to the piping. It is perilous, however, to clamp a hose, directly to PVC pipe. What you need is a hose barb cemented to the pipe that will provide a "barbed" clamping surface. On boats, it's considered good practice (and ABYC standard) to use two stainless-steel hose clamps side-by-side on each connection below the waterline. PVC's pretty soft, which makes it hard to clamp to without a hose barb. On the other hand, the softness of PVC is such that the vibrations from a small pump probably aren't worth the trouble of flexible couplings if it's easier to make a direct connection. In either case, it's important to make sure that the pump is supported and secured properly on it's own, not by it's pipe connections, and to be sure that all PVC connections are cleaned, primed, and bonded with the correct cement. Good luck. On Sat, 4 Dec 2010, marty sukey wrote: > I posted something last week asking about water alarms now let me pester the > group with a sump pump question. History.. The house is 11 years old with a > sump pump in the basement. The pump discharges up and through the basement > wall at a height of about 6 or 7 feet from the bottom of the pump crock. Then > goes out to a ditch at the road. Pipe is 1-1/2 inch PVC. Total run of pipe is > around 240 foot. The drop from where it leaves the house to where it > discharges into the ditch is about 2 foot. The original pump took a dump about > 3 years after we moved in naturally when we weren't home. The first pump was > all hard plumbed in. When I replace the pump I used some rubber couplings, > the kind with a couple of hose clamps on the ends to tie things together. Had > an issue a while ago where one of the couplings separated from the pipe and > the gusher flooded part of the basement. I figured I had not tightened the > clamps sufficiently. Tightened everything up and checked them every couple of > months to make sure they were tight. All was well until last week when one > blew apart again. Water in the basement AGAIN. So OK I'm figuring I should > not have used the rubber couplings. After putting the carpet back down today I > move over the pump to take those rubber couplings out and hard plumb things > back together. > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/arobs at u.washington.edu From jamesf at groupwbench.org Sun Dec 5 09:14:51 2010 From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin) Date: Sun, 5 Dec 2010 11:14:51 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] FW: Was water alarm, now sump pump. MORE In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: On Dec 4, 2010, at 6:20 PM, marty sukey wrote: > > > As I took apart the discharge pipe the water gushed back into the crock with a > lot of force. So much came out I measured it as I scooped it out in order to > empty the crock so I could work on the pipe. 24 gallons of water came out. > According to my calculations (might be wrong) 240 foot of 1-1/2 inch pipe > would hold about 24 gallons of water. Either the slope to the ditch isn't as slopey as you think, and you have a large column of water pressurizing the system, or it's only 8' of water pressure but with no air inlet that 8' column is siphoning all 240' of water back inside when you open things up (though I'd expect the 240' to siphon everything out to the ditch if the slope was correct, ,and leave you with an empty system after a few minutes of "straw in an empty cup" sucking sound). I'd put a check valve inside the house about 2' above the crock, and an air valve outside as close to the house as possible. If there's a horizontal section inside the house I'd put it there if you get below freezing. Something like this: http://www.ipscorp.com/studor From cavanadd at frontier.com Sun Dec 5 13:37:46 2010 From: cavanadd at frontier.com (David C.) Date: Sun, 05 Dec 2010 12:37:46 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] xmas lights, shunts, and magic In-Reply-To: <012301cb9449$0ddc3590$0301a8c0@randall> References: <012301cb9449$0ddc3590$0301a8c0@randall> Message-ID: <4CFBF81A.9060601@frontier.com> Ok, I'll be the first to admit that I'm not up on Christmas lights and decorations. My primary response to the holidays, and Christmas in particular, is to ignore them/it to the fullest extent possible. I haven't bought Christmas lights in probably 25 years. Given that, I was under the impression that: 1. Pretty much all Christmas lights these days are LED; and 2. Series wired Christmas lights went out sometime around the middle of the first Eisenhower administration. Shunts? Seems like a solution looking for a problem. BTW, thanks for the answers on internet Rx. Pretty much confirmed my suspicions. I guess I'll take an old fashioned paper prescription to Wally World. Randall wrote: >> The story on the box is that the shunt gets clogged up like a drain. > > Well, apparently that isn't too far from the truth. According to this: From scott.hall.personal at gmail.com Sun Dec 5 14:34:10 2010 From: scott.hall.personal at gmail.com (Scott Hall) Date: Sun, 5 Dec 2010 16:34:10 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] xmas lights, shunts, and magic In-Reply-To: <4CFBF81A.9060601@frontier.com> References: <012301cb9449$0ddc3590$0301a8c0@randall> <4CFBF81A.9060601@frontier.com> Message-ID: I'm by no means an expert on Christmas lights, but I have to buy more of them than I'd like each year, and I can tell you for sure that LED lights are available but still way to expensive for my taste. I don't know about the series-wired vs. non series-wired, but I know that a lot of new strings funciton the exact same way they did when I was a kid. Which wasn't the first Eisenhower administration, but I'll bet the technology is similar. Scott On Sun, Dec 5, 2010 at 3:37 PM, David C. wrote: > Ok, I'll be the first to admit that I'm not up on Christmas lights and > decorations. My primary response to the holidays, and Christmas in > particular, is to ignore them/it to the fullest extent possible. I haven't > bought Christmas lights in probably 25 years. Given that, I was under the > impression that: > 1. Pretty much all Christmas lights these days are LED; and > 2. Series wired Christmas lights went out sometime around the middle of > the first Eisenhower administration. Shunts? Seems like a solution looking > for a problem. From dmscheidt at gmail.com Sun Dec 5 14:36:18 2010 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Sun, 5 Dec 2010 16:36:18 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] xmas lights, shunts, and magic In-Reply-To: <4CFBF81A.9060601@frontier.com> References: <012301cb9449$0ddc3590$0301a8c0@randall> <4CFBF81A.9060601@frontier.com> Message-ID: On Sun, Dec 5, 2010 at 3:37 PM, David C. wrote: > Ok, I'll be the first to admit that I'm not up on Christmas lights and > decorations. B My primary response to the holidays, and Christmas in > particular, is to ignore them/it to the fullest extent possible. B I haven't > bought Christmas lights in probably 25 years. B Given that, I was under the > impression that: > 1. B Pretty much all Christmas lights these days are LED; and > 2. B Series wired Christmas lights went out sometime around the middle of the > first Eisenhower administration. B Shunts? Seems like a solution looking for > a problem. Heh. All LED lights are series wired. (Someone, somewhere, probably makes a very, very expensive set where that's not true. But it's true of anything you're going to get at a mass market store.) They've got between 20 and 40 diodes wired in series, plus a current limiting resistor. If there are more bulbs than that, it's because there are two (or more) strands wired in parallel. Some of the nicer ones apparently have a reverse voltage diode, but none of the ones I've taken apart have had one. They've got shunts, too. not because LEDs burn out, but because they get stepped on or hit with hammers. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From pat at hornesystemstx.com Sun Dec 5 15:29:11 2010 From: pat at hornesystemstx.com (Pat Horne) Date: Sun, 05 Dec 2010 16:29:11 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] xmas lights, shunts, and magic In-Reply-To: <4CFBF81A.9060601@frontier.com> References: <012301cb9449$0ddc3590$0301a8c0@randall> <4CFBF81A.9060601@frontier.com> Message-ID: <4CFC1237.8020906@hornesystemstx.com> My understanding is that the shunts are just anodized wire wrapped around the 2 leads of the lamp, inside the bulb. With the lamp working the voltage differential across the leads is very low, in the order of 1 to 3 volts. When the bulb burns out the voltage differential is not line voltage, or up to 170 volts peak, which causes the anodized layer to puncture and short to the two leads of the lamp. Everything is fine until the lamp is disturbed and the very small spot welds the anodized wire made are now damaged, and because of other opens in the string (other shunts open) can not get the 120 volts across the lamp to re-fuse them. If you look inside the lamp you will see this piece of wire wrapped around the leads.\ I have a client who has me put up and take down his Christmas decorations each year. He does not want to replace them, so for the last 6 years I have been repairing them each year before I put them up. It costs him more to do it this way, but for some reason he doesn't want to replace them. I try to replace all the defective lamps when I take the lights down, but the next year I spend hours replacing lamps until I get everything working again. Every 3 years I replace all the lamps, which makes for a more reliable year. I hope to talk him into going with LED lights when I take them down this year. LEDs are not a reliable as folks think they are. Even though they have a 20,000 hour MTBF, because of the sheer number of lights, you will have one or 2 burn out each week. For a rather in-depth article on this subject, check out: http://www.ciphersbyritter.com/RADELECT/LITES/LEDLITES.HTM I know Terry and he can take the most mundane subject and spend weeks making it fun! If you want to get your mind numbed, check out some of his other articles. He actually developed the Motorola MC6809 "for fun" on paper, then went to work for Motorola to build the chip. Peace, Pat Thusly spake David C., On 12/5/2010 2:37 PM: > Ok, I'll be the first to admit that I'm not up on Christmas lights and > decorations. My primary response to the holidays, and Christmas in > particular, is to ignore them/it to the fullest extent possible. I > haven't bought Christmas lights in probably 25 years. Given that, I > was under the impression that: > 1. Pretty much all Christmas lights these days are LED; and > 2. Series wired Christmas lights went out sometime around the middle > of the first Eisenhower administration. Shunts? Seems like a solution > looking for a problem. > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- From eric at megageek.com Sun Dec 5 19:35:41 2010 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Sun, 5 Dec 2010 21:35:41 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] building a gorilla lift Message-ID: OK, I took a couple photos of the underneath of my trailer. You can see how the leaf spring works. Let me know if you need any more information on it... Moose "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson From kennedybc at comcast.net Sun Dec 5 20:43:17 2010 From: kennedybc at comcast.net (Brian Kennedy) Date: Sun, 5 Dec 2010 19:43:17 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] xmas lights, shunts, and magic In-Reply-To: References: <012301cb9449$0ddc3590$0301a8c0@randall> <4CFBF81A.9060601@frontier.com> Message-ID: <7F3B3BB7-DB60-481B-B458-E38EBEE24691@comcast.net> A long story, but I bought LED outdoor lights to replace my aging strings. Shoulda looked at the colors. Is purple now a Xmas color? They use crinkley bulbs, I'm guessing to make up for less brightness? In any event, I repaired the old strings. They are parallel, so I just remove a socket when needed due to squirrel damage and they work fine. Replaced a few bulbs. Bought a good stock of spares for the future and am returning the LED string. Brian C Kennedy On Dec 5, 2010, at 1:36 PM, David Scheidt wrote: > On Sun, Dec 5, 2010 at 3:37 PM, David C. wrote: >> Ok, I'll be the first to admit that I'm not up on Christmas lights and >> decorations. B My primary response to the holidays, and Christmas in >> particular, is to ignore them/it to the fullest extent possible. B I > haven't >> bought Christmas lights in probably 25 years. B Given that, I was under the >> impression that: >> 1. B Pretty much all Christmas lights these days are LED; and >> 2. B Series wired Christmas lights went out sometime around the middle of > the >> first Eisenhower administration. B Shunts? Seems like a solution looking > for >> a problem. > > Heh. All LED lights are series wired. (Someone, somewhere, probably > makes a very, very expensive set where that's not true. But it's true > of anything you're going to get at a mass market store.) They've got > between 20 and 40 diodes wired in series, plus a current limiting > resistor. If there are more bulbs than that, it's because there are > two (or more) strands wired in parallel. Some of the nicer ones > apparently have a reverse voltage diode, but none of the ones I've > taken apart have had one. They've got shunts, too. not because LEDs > burn out, but because they get stepped on or hit with hammers. > > > -- > David Scheidt > dmscheidt at gmail.com > __ From wmc_st at xxiii.com Mon Dec 6 10:11:17 2010 From: wmc_st at xxiii.com (Wayne) Date: Mon, 06 Dec 2010 12:11:17 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] DVM / Multimeter recommendations Message-ID: <4CFD1935.2000804@xxiii.com> Hey Guys, Wondering if anyone can recommend a DVM / Multimeter for me. I've had a couple basic ones over the years; currently using the $4 H.F. bargain bin model. I'd like to get something with a capacitance range, for checking motor and HVAC capacitors. AND a tachometer for engine work. Anyone know of one unit with both features? Seems like to get either, you need to go to a high-dollar expensive model, then it won't have BOTH. So you need two expensive meters. Wouldn't mind going used, either. I know Fluke is top line, and I can afford Ebay prices for them. -Thanks, Wayne From jamesf at groupwbench.org Mon Dec 6 10:47:47 2010 From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin) Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2010 12:47:47 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Flooring for uneven basement? Message-ID: <98742299-45A7-42B3-989E-23A131D57517@groupwbench.org> I'm renovating a basement and need to put down a finish floor. The concrete is 90 years old and very uneven. Other than 1000 gallons of self-levelling goop, I'm at a loss as to how to accomplish this other than making a 2 sq ft grid and shimming each joint. 2 problems with this- I can't lose more than 3" of height, and the entire basement would need to be cleared to do this, and there's many cubic yards of stuff down there that has nowhere to go. thanks, From pethier at comcast.net Mon Dec 6 11:44:55 2010 From: pethier at comcast.net (pethier at comcast.net) Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2010 18:44:55 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Shop-talk] Flooring for uneven basement? In-Reply-To: <98742299-45A7-42B3-989E-23A131D57517@groupwbench.org> Message-ID: <2051589228.276108.1291661095525.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> You have perfectly described the original-garage portion of my car shop. I don't know what to do, either. Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UB "uncle jack" 2004 Suburban 8.1 2005 Lotus Elise 2007 Saturn Ion 3 2.4 pethier [at] comcast [dot] net http://www.flickr.com/photos/pethier http://www.triumphtransamerica.org http://www.mnautox.com ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jim Franklin" > To: "shop-talk List" > Sent: Monday, December 6, 2010 11:47:47 AM > Subject: [Shop-talk] Flooring for uneven basement? > > I'm renovating a basement and need to put down a finish floor. The > concrete is > 90 years old and very uneven. Other than 1000 gallons of > self-levelling goop, > I'm at a loss as to how to accomplish this other than making a 2 sq ft > grid > and shimming each joint. 2 problems with this- I can't lose more than > 3" of > height, and the entire basement would need to be cleared to do this, > and > there's many cubic yards of stuff down there that has nowhere to go. > > thanks, > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pethier at comcast.net From doug at dougbraun.com Mon Dec 6 11:48:31 2010 From: doug at dougbraun.com (Douglas Braun) Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2010 13:48:31 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Flooring for uneven basement? In-Reply-To: <98742299-45A7-42B3-989E-23A131D57517@groupwbench.org> References: <98742299-45A7-42B3-989E-23A131D57517@groupwbench.org> Message-ID: I agonized over this exact same problem about 5 years ago when we decided to redo our basement. We ended up haring some people to apply a thin layer of cement in all the low spots. We were not even trying to get it perfectly flat, just acceptably flat. A couple of years later, we noticed a couple of places where the cement layer was heaving upwards, putting lumps in the cork flooring we had placed over it. Then a few weeks later, the dishwasher broke and flooded the basement. Of course, the cork flooring was ruined. Once it was removed, we chiseled out the messed-up cement layer and repaired it with more carefully-applied cement and self-leveling cement. The damage was bizarre: you would expect a cement layer to shrink and crack, but this stuff expanded and heaved upwards! After fixing the cement, we put down a layer of OvrX insulated subflooring (www.ovrx.com) and put carpet over it. That was 2 or 3 years ago, and so far, all is well. I recommend the Ovrx product. To summarize: Any possibly solution will be expensive and a pain in the ass. O lot of contractor will not want to mess with the job. Good Luck, Doug On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 12:47 PM, Jim Franklin wrote: > I'm renovating a basement and need to put down a finish floor. The concrete is > 90 years old and very uneven. Other than 1000 gallons of self-levelling goop, > I'm at a loss as to how to accomplish this other than making a 2 sq ft grid > and shimming each joint. 2 problems with this- I can't lose more than 3" of > height, and the entire basement would need to be cleared to do this, and > there's many cubic yards of stuff down there that has nowhere to go. > > thanks, > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/doug at dougbraun.com From bjshov8 at tx.rr.com Mon Dec 6 17:52:55 2010 From: bjshov8 at tx.rr.com (BJNoSHOV8) Date: Mon, 06 Dec 2010 18:52:55 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] building a gorilla lift In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4CFD8567.7040805@tx.rr.com> This is a lot simpler mechanism than the garage door spring would be. It might take a little experimenting to get the angles and lengths just right though. With the garage door spring, assuming you are talking about a spring that twists and carries the force in torsion, consider this: The average garage door can be pretty heavy, with a single spring carrying 100# or more. The garage door moves nearly 7 feet as it opens, and the spring rotates enough to reel up that much length of cable. Your lift gate will be lighter, but it will move less as you pick it up. For instance if you have a 6' long gate and you attach the cable to the mid point of the gate, as the gate goes from down on the ground to vertical it will need to reel up only a little over 3 feet of cable. So for 3 feet of movement it picks up X pounds, for normal garage door use the spring picks up Y pounds in approximately 7 feet of movement. You can do the math to get a ballpark spring capacity. You can fine tune it by moving the connection point closer to or farther from the hinge for the gate. > OK, I took a couple photos of the underneath of my trailer. You can see > how the leaf spring works. > > Let me know if you need any more information on it... > > From pat at hornesystemstx.com Mon Dec 6 14:42:44 2010 From: pat at hornesystemstx.com (Pat Horne) Date: Mon, 06 Dec 2010 15:42:44 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Flooring for uneven basement? In-Reply-To: <98742299-45A7-42B3-989E-23A131D57517@groupwbench.org> References: <98742299-45A7-42B3-989E-23A131D57517@groupwbench.org> Message-ID: <4CFD58D4.6030006@hornesystemstx.com> Jim, The normal method is to add what are called sleepers under the new floor. Sleepers are treated 2x? material that sits on edge on the floor with the top level and the bottom scribed to match the floor. How accurately you scribe the sleepers depends on what the area is going to be used for. Living area, they need to be close, while storage can be pretty unlevel. The sleepers go down on either 16" or 2' increments, depending on how thick the flooring is going to be and how much load you intend. The trick is to set the floor based on the highest spot in the floor, which with a bunch of "stuff" in there may be hard to find. You don't need to clean out the whole space, but eh more you do clean, the easier it will be to work. I'd recommend at least 6' along one of the longest walls to start with. Start with a sleeper along the wall at the correct height, then come out parallel to that one and add more until you reach 4'. Cover with plywood, screwed and glued to all sleepers leaving half of the 2x? at the free edge half exposed for the next row of sheets. Move the next 4' of "Stuff" onto this new floor and repeat for the next 4'. Start each row with alternating half or full sheets so that the seams don't line up. Repeat as many times as necessary until the "stuff is all on the new floor and the floor is completed. Since this is a basement, I would recommend painting the cut edge of the sleepers with whatever stuff the lumber is treated with, using tar paper or at least heavy plastic on top of the old slab, use treated plywood also, and seal the floor once it is down. It's a bunch of work, but it needs to be a good job or you may be doing it again too soon. I saw a really poor man's raised floor in a lumber yard, but I don't think I would even try it. They had loads of left over pallets, so they just put down pallets, sort of leveled them, then covered the whole thing with plywood. Worked well enough for their use! Peace, Pat Thusly spake Jim Franklin, On 12/6/2010 11:47 AM: > I'm renovating a basement and need to put down a finish floor. The concrete is > 90 years old and very uneven. Other than 1000 gallons of self-levelling goop, > I'm at a loss as to how to accomplish this other than making a 2 sq ft grid > and shimming each joint. 2 problems with this- I can't lose more than 3" of > height, and the entire basement would need to be cleared to do this, and > there's many cubic yards of stuff down there that has nowhere to go. > > thanks, > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- From jamesf at groupwbench.org Wed Dec 8 07:20:38 2010 From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin) Date: Wed, 8 Dec 2010 09:20:38 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Flooring for uneven basement? In-Reply-To: References: <98742299-45A7-42B3-989E-23A131D57517@groupwbench.org> Message-ID: <32DDB69F-AB09-4EF5-8C90-8BD16B5DA54E@groupwbench.org> On Dec 6, 2010, at 2:29 PM, David Scheidt wrote: > On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 12:47 PM, Jim Franklin wrote: >> I'm renovating a basement and need to put down a finish floor. The concrete is >> 90 years old and very uneven. > > Put some numbers on that. How big are the differences, is it pitched > from side to side (or center to sides), does it have big uneven bumps > and holes, or what? If it's flatish, and just not level, you can put > a number of things (like a floating laminate, if it's dry) down. The > resulting floor might pitch, but that's not always awful. THere's too much stuff down there to tell if it pitches overall, but the localized differences (holes and humps, mountains and valleys) are no more than 3". > > Self-leveling stuff is very expensive, and for big areas, with big > holes to fill, trowelable stuff works fine, is cheaper. Don't forget > to consider lowering the high spots. The high spots are too wide. Think Appalachians, not Rockies :-) I think troweling in the depressions to make it shimmable is the best option. Advantek over sleepers should be sturdy enough, but I'd sure love a recessed, top-adjustable threaded fastener. Something like a locking (like Nylok) T-nut on 16" centers, whose protruding shaft I could cut off once the adjustment was done. Actually that might work if she doesn't balk at the cost... From gsteve at hammatt.com Tue Dec 7 17:30:20 2010 From: gsteve at hammatt.com (Steve Hammatt Mount Vernon WA USA) Date: Tue, 7 Dec 2010 16:30:20 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Cable assist for car trailer ramp In-Reply-To: <463476885.348057.1291752082722.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <463476885.348057.1291752082722.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <04714347988C456FB216D93172843D4F@DesktopPC> I agree! Steve Hammatt Mount Vernon WA USA ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Steve Hammatt Mount Vernon WA USA" Cc: "Shop Talk" Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 2010 12:01 PM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Cable assist for car trailer ramp > Unless you absolutely know what you are doing with this, take it to > at garage-door or tralier technician. Emergency-room professionals > are familiar with folks who wanted to work on their own garage > doors. > > Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA > 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UB "uncle jack" > 2004 Suburban 8.1 > 2005 Lotus Elise > 2007 Saturn Ion 3 2.4 > pethier [at] comcast [dot] net > http://www.flickr.com/photos/pethier > http://www.triumphtransamerica.org > http://www.mnautox.com > > > ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: "Steve Hammatt Mount Vernon WA USA" >> To: "Shop Talk" >> Sent: Friday, December 3, 2010 7:25:49 PM >> Subject: [Shop-talk] Cable assist for car trailer ramp >> >> Hi >> I've got a 24' enclosed car trailer. It's got >> cable assist (both sides) to help with opening >> and closing the rear ramp door. It appears to >> be similar to the horizontal spring used to assist >> garage door openers. Is anyone familiar with >> this use and know of the most common supplier? >> I'd like to increase the assist but wanted to >> review the procedure before jumping in on this. >> Thanks. >> >> Steve Hammatt >> Mount Vernon WA USA >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe/Manage: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pethier at comcast.net From dmscheidt at gmail.com Mon Dec 6 12:29:14 2010 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2010 14:29:14 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Flooring for uneven basement? In-Reply-To: <98742299-45A7-42B3-989E-23A131D57517@groupwbench.org> References: <98742299-45A7-42B3-989E-23A131D57517@groupwbench.org> Message-ID: On Mon, Dec 6, 2010 at 12:47 PM, Jim Franklin wrote: > I'm renovating a basement and need to put down a finish floor. The concrete is > 90 years old and very uneven. Put some numbers on that. How big are the differences, is it pitched from side to side (or center to sides), does it have big uneven bumps and holes, or what? If it's flatish, and just not level, you can put a number of things (like a floating laminate, if it's dry) down. The resulting floor might pitch, but that's not always awful. Self-leveling stuff is very expensive, and for big areas, with big holes to fill, trowelable stuff works fine, is cheaper. Don't forget to consider lowering the high spots. As for the stuff in the way problem, that's a problem whatever you do. If you can divide the space into sections, and clear each area to work on it. Might mean moving a whole lot of stuff a number of times... -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From scott.hall.personal at gmail.com Thu Dec 9 04:45:02 2010 From: scott.hall.personal at gmail.com (Scott Hall) Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 06:45:02 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Flooring for uneven basement? In-Reply-To: <32DDB69F-AB09-4EF5-8C90-8BD16B5DA54E@groupwbench.org> References: <98742299-45A7-42B3-989E-23A131D57517@groupwbench.org> <32DDB69F-AB09-4EF5-8C90-8BD16B5DA54E@groupwbench.org> Message-ID: <4D00C13E.20007@gmail.com> It's probably not the answer you want, but I'd empty the basement and do it 'right'. Grand down (or break up) the high spots and use self-leveler to do the rest. That sounds like something that could very quickly turn bad if you don't bite the bullet and do it right the first time. Scott On 12/8/2010 9:20 AM, Jim Franklin wrote: > The high spots are too wide. Think Appalachians, not Rockies :-) > I think troweling in the depressions to make it shimmable is the best option. > Advantek over sleepers should be sturdy enough, but I'd sure love a recessed, > top-adjustable threaded fastener. Something like a locking (like Nylok) T-nut > on 16" centers, whose protruding shaft I could cut off once the adjustment was > done. Actually that might work if she doesn't balk at the cost... From jamesf at groupwbench.org Thu Dec 9 07:45:09 2010 From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2010 09:45:09 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Flooring for uneven basement? In-Reply-To: <4D00C13E.20007@gmail.com> References: <98742299-45A7-42B3-989E-23A131D57517@groupwbench.org> <32DDB69F-AB09-4EF5-8C90-8BD16B5DA54E@groupwbench.org> <4D00C13E.20007@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Dec 9, 2010, at 6:45 AM, Scott Hall wrote: > It's probably not the answer you want, but I'd empty the basement and do it 'right'. Grand down (or break up) the high spots and use self-leveler to do the rest. That sounds like something that could very quickly turn bad if you don't bite the bullet and do it right the first time. > > Scott I agree with doing it right, but it's up to the homeowner, and I doubt she wants to buy several hundred gallons of self leveler. We decided yesterday to only do half the basement and leave the workbench area (including boiler) alone. So now I have a place to put stuff. But. In looking at the lally columns, and the disintegrating floor around them, it appears someone poured a topcoat of concrete onto the original slab. The lallys sit on the original pour and seem ok, but the topcoat is disintegrating, and sounds hollow when wacked with a hammer. So grinding would remove the 2" or so of weak topcoat and holy cow I do not want that cleanup job. Pat- the floor is too uneven for scribing sleepers, I'd still be doing them in my grave. From eric at megageek.com Thu Dec 9 08:13:09 2010 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2010 10:13:09 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Flooring for uneven basement? In-Reply-To: <4D00C13E.20007@gmail.com> Message-ID: I'm with Scott. I was cleaning up an attic over one of my garages and I tried the "not removing everything" method. I think I moved each item at least 3 times, plus, I didn't get it as perfectly organized as I should have. If there is too much stuff to remove, then why worry about leveling it? Chances are you can't see much of the floor! 8>) I just helped a friend locate a 20X8 sea container at his house so he can empty one room at a time and clean and organize. I'll more than likely buy the container from him when he is done. I was impressed with how cheap they can be had for. I did use some autoleveling concrete stuff a while back, it was expensive, but it is still perfect! Moose "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson Scott Hall Sent by: shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net 12/09/2010 06:31 To shop-talk at autox.team.net cc Subject Re: [Shop-talk] Flooring for uneven basement? It's probably not the answer you want, but I'd empty the basement and do it 'right'. Grand down (or break up) the high spots and use self-leveler to do the rest. That sounds like something that could very quickly turn bad if you don't bite the bullet and do it right the first time. Scott From bjshov8 at tx.rr.com Thu Dec 9 10:14:16 2010 From: bjshov8 at tx.rr.com (BJNoSHOV8) Date: Thu, 09 Dec 2010 11:14:16 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Flooring for uneven basement? In-Reply-To: References: <98742299-45A7-42B3-989E-23A131D57517@groupwbench.org> Message-ID: <4D010E68.7040505@tx.rr.com> There are a variety of products available for floor levelling, some are structural and some are not. For calculation purposes, if the amplitude of mountains in your floor is approximately 3", then the average thickness of leveling material required would be about 1 1/2". 1 1/2" average thickness would be .94 gallons for every square foot of floor space. Of course if you have the ability to grind down the high spots, you could reduce the volume of levelling compound considerably. >> I'm renovating a basement and need to put down a finish floor. The concrete is >> 90 years old and very uneven. > Put some numbers on that. How big are the differences, is it pitched > from side to side (or center to sides), does it have big uneven bumps > and holes, or what? If it's flatish, and just not level, you can put > a number of things (like a floating laminate, if it's dry) down. The > resulting floor might pitch, but that's not always awful. > > Self-leveling stuff is very expensive, and for big areas, with big > holes to fill, trowelable stuff works fine, is cheaper. Don't forget > to consider lowering the high spots. From dmscheidt at gmail.com Thu Dec 9 13:21:01 2010 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2010 15:21:01 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Flooring for uneven basement? In-Reply-To: References: <98742299-45A7-42B3-989E-23A131D57517@groupwbench.org> <32DDB69F-AB09-4EF5-8C90-8BD16B5DA54E@groupwbench.org> <4D00C13E.20007@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Thu, Dec 9, 2010 at 9:45 AM, Jim Franklin wrote: > In looking at the lally columns, and the disintegrating floor around them, it > appears someone poured a topcoat of concrete onto the original slab. The > lallys sit on the original pour and seem ok, but the topcoat is > disintegrating, and sounds hollow when wacked with a hammer. So grinding would > remove the 2" or so of weak topcoat and holy cow I do not want that cleanup > job. I think you need to figure out why the topcoat is failing. Poor choice of material or mixture, or poor workmanship is one thing. Failure because there's water movement or something like that is something else again. I also wonder what the topcoat was done for, since it clearly didn't level the floor. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From bob at texmog.com Thu Dec 9 22:29:43 2010 From: bob at texmog.com (bob at texmog.com) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2010 23:29:43 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' Message-ID: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM> My daughter is having a problem with her Rudd electric water heater. The flow of hot water has slowed to a dribble at all the faucets. I went over and checked things out and the first problem was the Home builder ( 6 year old house) installed the water heater backwards, the cold water coming into the HOT labeled outlet and the Hot water coming out the Cold labeled outlet. I swapped them but only a small increase in pressure. The drain at the bottom of the tank appears to have pretty good pressure so I figure the problem is in the out side of the heater. Checking out the web for suggestions I read about 'Heat Traps' that are now installed (because Uncle Sam likes them) on both inlet and outlets. When I was switching the lines I did not notice anything in the pipes but then I really wasn't looking for anything. So my questions, can these 'Heat Traps' be removed from the heater? Is it possible the heat trap is located lower in the pipe? What's the best way to get to it? Bob Nogueira From TR3driver at ca.rr.com Thu Dec 9 22:53:11 2010 From: TR3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Thu, 9 Dec 2010 21:53:11 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM> References: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM> Message-ID: <06b401cb982e$875b8270$0301a8c0@randall> > When I was switching the lines I did not notice anything > in the pipes but > then I really wasn't looking for anything. "Heat traps" can be check valves, but normally they are just pipe. The idea is just that you form a U-bend (kind of like a sewer trap), to help interrupt circulation within the pipes due to convection. Eg, http://tinyurl.com/36xh656 My guess would be that the builder left out the dielectric unions at the heater connections. I would pull apart the heat trap on the outlet side, and check for pipes clogged with galvanic corrosion. If that's what you find, replace the pipe along with a dielectric union. You should also check whether the builder used the water pipes for safety ground. If so, my suggestion would be to wire the grounds directly to a ground rod and not use water pipe. If that isn't feasible, at least make sure they aren't tied into the hot water pipes. -- Randall From wmc_st at xxiii.com Fri Dec 10 06:36:40 2010 From: wmc_st at xxiii.com (Wayne) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 08:36:40 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM> References: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM> Message-ID: <4D022CE8.9040507@xxiii.com> On 12/10/2010 12:29 AM, bob at texmog.com wrote: > My daughter is having a problem with her Rudd electric water heater. The > flow of hot water has slowed to a dribble at all the faucets. I went over > and checked things out and the first problem was the Home builder ( 6 year > old house) installed the water heater backwards, the cold water coming into > the HOT labeled outlet and the Hot water coming out the Cold labeled outlet. That sucks. Had thew same at TWO different rental apts I was in as a kid. Had a bitch of a time convincing the landlord it was really a problem. You got about 60 seconds of hot shower and ice cold at 4 minutes. > I swapped them but only a small increase in pressure. The drain at the > bottom of the tank appears to have pretty good pressure so I figure the > problem is in the out side of the heater. > Checking out the web for suggestions I read about 'Heat Traps' that are > now installed (because Uncle Sam likes them) on both inlet and outlets. Dat Mean ol' Gubmient is just trying to save you money on your utility bills. The same plumber that's too f*****g incompetent to put the pipes on the right connectors probably won't install $1 worth of traps that can save many times that in energy over the life of the unit. Aftermarket traps were sometimes incorporated into the dielectric unions, or otherwise separate thread-ins. But the factory ones I've seen are incorporated into the tubes or fittings and may not be removable. Only thing you'll hurt removing them (if possible) is a little wasted energy. Years of backwards flow through the thing could have deteriorated the plastic dip tube on the hot side, and now it's clogged. This site has lots of good water heater info, and replacement dip tubes and other parts (though they're quite expensive): http://www.waterheaterrescue.com/ If you put a new one in, I'd suggest extra $$ for ball-valve shut offs and pipe unions on both the inlet and outlet. -wayne From bjzwissler at gmail.com Fri Dec 10 08:58:24 2010 From: bjzwissler at gmail.com (Benjamin Zwissler) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 10:58:24 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: <4D022CE8.9040507@xxiii.com> References: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM> <4D022CE8.9040507@xxiii.com> Message-ID: A friend had this problem and the issue was the dip tube disintegrated and releasd small plastic particles that plugged the aerators at all the faucets. Remove an aerater to see if that's the problem. If you see plastic granules in there its likely the dip tube. Apparently there was a time period where the dip tube material was changed and caused this problem on lots of water heaters. Ben....... On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 8:36 AM, Wayne wrote: > On 12/10/2010 12:29 AM, bob at texmog.com wrote: > >> My daughter is having a problem with her Rudd electric water heater. The >> flow of hot water has slowed to a dribble at all the faucets. I went over >> and checked things out and the first problem was the Home builder ( 6 year >> old house) installed the water heater backwards, the cold water coming >> into >> the HOT labeled outlet and the Hot water coming out the Cold labeled >> outlet. >> > > That sucks. Had thew same at TWO different rental apts I was in as a kid. > Had a bitch of a time convincing the landlord it was really a problem. You > got about 60 seconds of hot shower and ice cold at 4 minutes. > > > I swapped them but only a small increase in pressure. The drain at the >> bottom of the tank appears to have pretty good pressure so I figure the >> problem is in the out side of the heater. >> Checking out the web for suggestions I read about 'Heat Traps' that are >> now installed (because Uncle Sam likes them) on both inlet and outlets. >> > > Dat Mean ol' Gubmient is just trying to save you money on your utility > bills. The same plumber that's too f*****g incompetent to put the pipes on > the right connectors probably won't install $1 worth of traps that can save > many times that in energy over the life of the unit. > > Aftermarket traps were sometimes incorporated into the dielectric unions, > or otherwise separate thread-ins. But the factory ones I've seen are > incorporated into the tubes or fittings and may not be removable. Only > thing you'll hurt removing them (if possible) is a little wasted energy. > > Years of backwards flow through the thing could have deteriorated the > plastic dip tube on the hot side, and now it's clogged. This site has lots > of good water heater info, and replacement dip tubes and other parts (though > they're quite expensive): > > http://www.waterheaterrescue.com/ > > If you put a new one in, I'd suggest extra $$ for ball-valve shut offs and > pipe unions on both the inlet and outlet. > > -wayne > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bjzwissler at gmail.com From dmscheidt at gmail.com Fri Dec 10 09:35:48 2010 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 11:35:48 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: <4D022CE8.9040507@xxiii.com> References: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM> <4D022CE8.9040507@xxiii.com> Message-ID: On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 8:36 AM, Wayne wrote: > > Years of backwards flow through the thing could have deteriorated the > plastic dip tube on the hot side, and now it's clogged. B This site has lots > of good water heater info, and replacement dip tubes and other parts (though > they're quite expensive): > > http://www.waterheaterrescue.com/ > They also claim that aluminum causes alzheimers disease. That makes them suspect about anything, in my book. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From dmscheidt at gmail.com Fri Dec 10 09:36:20 2010 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 11:36:20 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: References: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM> <4D022CE8.9040507@xxiii.com> Message-ID: On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 10:58 AM, Benjamin Zwissler wrote: > A friend had this problem and the issue was the dip tube disintegrated and > releasd small plastic particles that plugged the aerators at all the > faucets. B Remove an aerater to see if that's the problem. B If you see > plastic granules in there its likely the dip tube. B Apparently there was a > time period where the dip tube material was changed and caused this problem > on lots of water heaters. > the tubes were made over 15 years ago. I doubt many of those water heaters are still in service, even if they didn't suffer dip tube failure. Dip tubes do fail, even when not made of disintegrating plastic; they can get plugged with scale, as well. scale, rust, and other crud can block spouts just as well as plastic bits. So can sand in the water, which is a problem in some well systems. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From jblair1948 at cox.net Fri Dec 10 09:58:35 2010 From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T. Blair) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 11:58:35 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM> References: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM> Message-ID: <6.2.5.6.1.20101210115022.04e1c9c0@cox.net> At 12:29 AM 12/10/2010, bob at texmog.com wrote: >My daughter is having a problem with her Rudd electric water heater. The >flow of hot water has slowed to a dribble at all the faucets. I went over >and checked things out and the first problem was the Home builder ( 6 year >old house) installed the water heater backwards, the cold water coming into >the HOT labeled outlet and the Hot water coming out the Cold labeled outlet. Bob, Sounds like the problem I had last January. The problem started with the hot water running out very quickly, which was unusual. Normally we could take 4 showers in 2 bathrooms and not run out of hot water. Then all of a sudden, we couldn't take 2 showers without running out of hot water. Then the faucets started to have decreased water flow and pressure. As others said, the problem was the dip tube dissentigrated. The tiny pieces blocked the airators and since the cold water was income in at the top of the heater where the hot water was, the hot water was being deluted too quickly. So I replaced the hot water heater and that solved the hot water issue. Then I had to clean out all the airators. John > I swapped them but only a small increase in pressure. The drain at the >bottom of the tank appears to have pretty good pressure so I figure the >problem is in the out side of the heater. > Checking out the web for suggestions I read about 'Heat Traps' that are >now installed (because Uncle Sam likes them) on both inlet and outlets. > When I was switching the lines I did not notice anything in the pipes but >then I really wasn't looking for anything. > >So my questions, can these 'Heat Traps' be removed from the heater? Is it >possible the heat trap is located lower in the pipe? What's the best way to >get to it? > >Bob Nogueira >_______________________________________________ > >Shop-talk at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Suggested annual donation $12.96 >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe/Manage: >http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jblair1948 at cox.net John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/www/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From TR3driver at ca.rr.com Fri Dec 10 10:06:24 2010 From: TR3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 09:06:24 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: References: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM><4D022CE8.9040507@xxiii.com> Message-ID: <073001cb988c$93d31a00$0301a8c0@randall> > They also claim that aluminum causes alzheimers disease. Er, no, they didn't say that. What they said is that it has been linked to Alzheimer's, which is true. A majority of Alzheimer's patients show unusually high amounts of aluminum in their (damaged) brain tissue. As far as I know, no one has yet been able to show conclusively whether the aluminum caused the Alzheimer's, or the Alzheimer's caused the aluminum, or something else caused both of them. Correlation does not imply causation. Only took us 2000 years to figure out that lead is poison; and aluminum has only been in common use for less than 100 years. Might be we don't know everything there is to know about it. -- Randall From dirtbeard at pacbell.net Fri Dec 10 10:48:25 2010 From: dirtbeard at pacbell.net (old dirtbeard) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 09:48:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: <073001cb988c$93d31a00$0301a8c0@randall> References: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM><4D022CE8.9040507@xxiii.com> <073001cb988c$93d31a00$0301a8c0@randall> Message-ID: <682310.20052.qm@web81305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I agree 100 percent with Randall here. That much said, I have an aluminum rod in my water heater (some are magnesium) that I replaced a year ago (the original one was nothing but a wire after five years). It is good practice to replace your sacrificial anode every five years or so--this, combined with a good ball valve on the drain and regular flushing it can greatly prolong the life of a heater. The anode "sacrifices itself" instead of tank. The fact that the aluminum from that rod went into the water (although I also see some flecks of aluminum when I flush the tank) does not worry me much as I do not drink hot water, and any aluminum induced into the water supply by the anode would only affect the hot water supply. best, doug ____________________ '72 BSA B50SS '74 Triumph TR6 '01 HD XHL 883 '03 GMC Cargo Van '07 Aprilia SXV 550 ________________________________ From: Randall Cc: Shop Talk List Sent: Fri, December 10, 2010 9:06:24 AM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' > They also claim that aluminum causes alzheimers disease. Er, no, they didn't say that. What they said is that it has been linked to Alzheimer's, which is true. A majority of Alzheimer's patients show unusually high amounts of aluminum in their (damaged) brain tissue. As far as I know, no one has yet been able to show conclusively whether the aluminum caused the Alzheimer's, or the Alzheimer's caused the aluminum, or something else caused both of them. Correlation does not imply causation. Only took us 2000 years to figure out that lead is poison; and aluminum has only been in common use for less than 100 years. Might be we don't know everything there is to know about it. -- Randall _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard at pacbell.net From pethier at comcast.net Fri Dec 10 11:26:41 2010 From: pethier at comcast.net (pethier at comcast.net) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 18:26:41 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: <682310.20052.qm@web81305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <683624871.529488.1292005601394.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> ----- Original Message ----- > From: "old dirtbeard" > To: "Randall" > Cc: "Shop Talk List" > Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 11:48:25 AM > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' > > I agree 100 percent with Randall here. > > That much said, I have an aluminum rod in my water heater (some are > magnesium) I thought they were zinc. Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UB "uncle jack" 2004 Suburban 8.1 2005 Lotus Elise 2007 Saturn Ion 3 2.4 pethier [at] comcast [dot] net http://www.flickr.com/photos/pethier http://www.triumphtransamerica.org http://www.mnautox.com From racertod at racertodd.com Fri Dec 10 18:32:35 2010 From: racertod at racertodd.com (Todd Walke) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 17:32:35 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: <073001cb988c$93d31a00$0301a8c0@randall> References: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM> <4D022CE8.9040507@xxiii.com> Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.2.20101210173059.00bde250@mail.avvanta.com> Randall wrote: >Er, no, they didn't say that. What they said is that it has been linked to >Alzheimer's, which is true. Here is a page on the Alzheimer's Society webpage about the connection (or lack thereof) between the disease and aluminum: Todd Seattle,WA '86 GTI, Red of course. (exciting racey car) 272,000 miles '01 Golf TDI, silver. (new work car) 265,000 miles '87 Golf, Polar Silver. (retired work car) 654,000 miles <- Gone to a new home :( http://www.pureluckdesign.com <-Ferrari & VW stuff From dmscheidt at gmail.com Fri Dec 10 20:36:23 2010 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 22:36:23 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: <073001cb988c$93d31a00$0301a8c0@randall> References: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM> <4D022CE8.9040507@xxiii.com> <073001cb988c$93d31a00$0301a8c0@randall> Message-ID: On Fri, Dec 10, 2010 at 12:06 PM, Randall wrote: >> They also claim that aluminum causes alzheimers disease. > > Er, no, they didn't say that. B What they said is that it has been linked to > Alzheimer's, which is true. B A majority of Alzheimer's patients show > unusually high amounts of aluminum in their (damaged) brain tissue. B As far > as I know, no one has yet been able to show conclusively whether the > aluminum caused the Alzheimer's, or the Alzheimer's caused the aluminum, or > something else caused both of them. B Correlation does not imply causation. There's good evidence it's not causative. (There are a number of diseases that cause the body to retain aluminum. sufferers of these diseases don't have different rates of AZ than normal, for instance.) There isn't even very good evidence that there's increased aluminum in the brains of AZ patients, either in the plaques or the brain generally. They're saying it in the context of "buy our expensive alternative because Scary!". That's dishonest, and if they're going to lie about that (or not care to get the facts straight) about what else are they going to lie or not bother to get facts straight? > > Only took us 2000 years to figure out that lead is poison; and aluminum has > only been in common use for less than 100 years. B Might be we don't know > everything there is to know about it. The Romans knew lead was a poison. They knew asbestos caused lung cancer, too. There's not a higher rate of AZ in societies that drink lots of tea. (Tea takes up aluminum, and it's present in relatively large amounts in the beverage. One would expect a higher AZ rate, were Al a cause.) -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From dirtbeard at pacbell.net Fri Dec 10 21:11:38 2010 From: dirtbeard at pacbell.net (old dirtbeard) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 20:11:38 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: <683624871.529488.1292005601394.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <683624871.529488.1292005601394.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <748667.71051.qm@web81307.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Dear Phil, Most of the rods are aluminum or magnesium. Some are aluminum/zinc/tin combinations if water orders are a problem: http://www.plumbingstore.com/sacrificial_rods.html best, doug ____________________ '72 BSA B50SS '74 Triumph TR6 '01 HD XHL 883 '03 GMC Cargo Van '07 Aprilia SXV 550 To: old dirtbeard Cc: Shop Talk List ; Randall Sent: Fri, December 10, 2010 10:26:41 AM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' ----- Original Message ----- > From: "old dirtbeard" > To: "Randall" > Cc: "Shop Talk List" > Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 11:48:25 AM > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' > > I agree 100 percent with Randall here. > > That much said, I have an aluminum rod in my water heater (some are > magnesium) I thought they were zinc. Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UB "uncle jack" 2004 Suburban 8.1 2005 Lotus Elise 2007 Saturn Ion 3 2.4 pethier [at] comcast [dot] net http://www.flickr.com/photos/pethier http://www.triumphtransamerica.org http://www.mnautox.com From jibjib at att.net Fri Dec 10 22:51:49 2010 From: jibjib at att.net (Jack Brooks) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 21:51:49 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: References: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM><4D022CE8.9040507@xxiii.com> Message-ID: > the tubes were made over 15 years ago. I doubt many of those water > heaters are still in service, My water heater was in the "bad" diptube batch years. The house is 17 years old and the original water heater is going strong. I've replaced the anode and the dip tube. A good hardware store will stock the parts that will fit 95% of the water heaters out there. This simple maintenance will add years and years to the live of your hot water heater. Draining and flushing every year or three will help a lot too, especially on a gas fired unit, as it gets all the stuff off the bottom of the water heater and allow the heat to transfer more easily. Jack From TR3driver at ca.rr.com Fri Dec 10 23:21:31 2010 From: TR3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Fri, 10 Dec 2010 22:21:31 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Hot Water Heater 'Heat Trap' In-Reply-To: References: <60DBA4EB684B45B4ABB3397979C199A8@CARROOM><4D022CE8.9040507@xxiii.com><073001cb988c$93d31a00$0301a8c0@randall> Message-ID: <07e001cb98fb$a75686b0$0301a8c0@randall> > That's dishonest, Yeah, about as dishonest as saying there is no difference between "has been linked to" and "causes". > The Romans knew lead was a poison. Yeah, except they thought it was only poison in high concentrations. That's why they kept making things like water pipes out of lead, and all got lead poisoning. 30 years ago we were still using lead in water pipes, because everyone "knew" it was safe. -- Randall From ronnie.day at gmail.com Sat Dec 11 14:54:54 2010 From: ronnie.day at gmail.com (Ronnie Day) Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2010 15:54:54 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] GM 4l60e transmission problem Message-ID: We have a '93 GMC PU, 4.3 V-6 with the 4l60e trans. This is your basic short wheel base, standard cab, rubber floor mat work truck. It's got around 125K on it. Our son's been using it for most of the year to drive from his apartment in north Arlington to north of DFW, about a 20 mile (one way) highway commute. He was down over Thanksgiving weekend and everything appeared fine. The truck drove fine and shifted okay. He called me on Tuesday and said the truck wouldn't shift into Drive. I called the shop in Temple that works on the truck when I don't want to and I was told it could just be a solenoid. Friday James took it to a place in Arlington that our Honda specialist up there recommended. These guys checked it out and said the trans was DOA, suggesting a rebuild for $1600. OUCH!! Monday I'm going to call my guy in Temple and get his thoughts on rebuilding, and I'm planning to get the truck towed back down here. A couple of online troubleshooting sites did say that the exhibited symptoms were probably due to worn 3rd gear clutches and the "fix" is a rebuild. Assuming the DOA diagnosis is correct I see a couple of alternatives. Just for grins I called the local O'Reilly's to see what they get for a reman. They get $1607 plus a $200 core charge. I know these guys pretty well (it's the only parts store in a town of about 6,000) and the manager said I could probably get a new tranny from GM for about the same price. I'll probably have my guy down here look at it and have him either rebuild it or see what I can get a new trans for and get it installed. I have neither a place, the tools or the desire to tackle this myself right now. Has anyone on the list had a similar experience with a vehicle equipped with this transmission? TIA -- Ron From TR3driver at ca.rr.com Sat Dec 11 16:03:52 2010 From: TR3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2010 15:03:52 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] GM 4l60e transmission problem In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <089701cb9987$ae74b570$0301a8c0@randall> > Has anyone on the list had a similar experience with a vehicle > equipped with this transmission? I believe that's the same transmission in my 95 Buick. It's been having a little trouble with the very last shift it makes (not sure if that is OD or converter lockup, but kind of seems like the latter). No doubt it is living on borrowed time with some 240,000 miles on it, but a can of aftermarket chemical (sorry, I've forgotten which one offhand) seems to have improved the shift considerably. So I'm hoping that maybe some fresh fluid will help. Went through a similar experience many decades ago with an ancestor of the 4L60E (TH400). Shop swore it was worn out, and literally said it would not get the car home. Changed the fluid & filter, dumped in a can of Trans-medic, and it worked fine as long as we kept the car. -- Randall From gsteve at hammatt.com Sat Dec 11 16:21:40 2010 From: gsteve at hammatt.com (Steve Hammatt Mount Vernon WA USA) Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2010 15:21:40 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Trailer towing Message-ID: I'm looking to update our 2002 GMC 2500HD Extended Cab pickup/short bed for a later truck. It is fitted with a towing package, 6.2L V8 with unknown model automatic transmission. We tow a 24' enclosed car trailer with workbench and closets built-in. Currently my largest car we haul is a '32 LaSalle weighing over 4600 lbs. We're thinking of a heavy-duty 3/4 ton diesel with automatic as the new baseline model we're considering. I like the idea of the extra torque for the mountain passes we have to cross. My wife is liking the RAM or Ford models and I'm liking to keep her happy I'm also looking for something at least 4 years old to keep the costs down. Are there any special models or engines in the Ford or RAM line to stay away from? We do want the Crew Cab features but can easily use the short bed option. Thanks for your thoughts. Steve Hammatt Mount Vernon WA USA From jem at milleredp.com Sat Dec 11 16:55:24 2010 From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller) Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2010 15:55:24 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Trailer towing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4D040F6C.6050609@milleredp.com> > My wife is liking the RAM or Ford models and I'm liking to > keep her happy I'm also looking for something at least > 4 years old to keep the costs down. I'm just wondering about her rationale for liking the Fords and Dodge/Ram models. I don't know a lot about the current Ram (which is too new to fit your shopping list anyway) and others probably have more experience than I with this topic in general, but relative to the older HD models I've always found the GM trucks to be by far the best in terms of on-road driveability, ESPECIALLY if you're talking 4WD. There might be some benefit to the others' use of stick axles in their 4x4s in terms of ultimate durability, but it costs them in on-road behavior. The GMs also had, as far as I'm concerned, the nicest interiors in the timeframe you're talking about. > Are there any special models or engines in the Ford or RAM line > to stay away from? We do want the Crew Cab features but can > easily use the short bed option. The 6-liter Ford/Navistar diesel of a few years back got a really, truly nasty reputation when it was released, Ford rolled out a pile of fixes for it, then replaced it with a related 6.4L motor and they're now rolling out their own in-house-designed diesel. I have friends who tell me the fixes for the 6L work fine but I don't have any personal experience on that front. Aside from that, I think I'd pay more attention to transmission durability issues. John. From jdinnis at gmail.com Sat Dec 11 17:10:46 2010 From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis) Date: Sat, 11 Dec 2010 18:10:46 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] GM 4l60e transmission problem In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: $1600 for a rebuild job sounds pretty darn high. Round here the shops charge $600 if you pull the tranny and about $1000 if they remove and reinstall. You can get a decent, low mile unit at the scrapyard for less than $700. But be careful on the year. There were a lot of variations on these. The '95 is the worst, the one used on the trucks that year does not interchange with any other year. On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 3:54 PM, Ronnie Day wrote: > We have a '93 GMC PU, 4.3 V-6 with the 4l60e trans. This is your basic > short wheel base, standard cab, rubber floor mat work truck. It's got > around 125K on it. Our son's been using it for most of the year to > drive from his apartment in north Arlington to north of DFW, about a > 20 mile (one way) highway commute. He was down over Thanksgiving > weekend and everything appeared fine. The truck drove fine and shifted > okay. > > He called me on Tuesday and said the truck wouldn't shift into Drive. > I called the shop in Temple that works on the truck when I don't want > to and I was told it could just be a solenoid. Friday James took it to > a place in Arlington that our Honda specialist up there recommended. > These guys checked it out and said the trans was DOA, suggesting a > rebuild for $1600. OUCH!! Monday I'm going to call my guy in Temple > and get his thoughts on rebuilding, and I'm planning to get the truck > towed back down here. A couple of online troubleshooting sites did say > that the exhibited symptoms were probably due to worn 3rd gear > clutches and the "fix" is a rebuild. Assuming the DOA diagnosis is > correct I see a couple of alternatives. > > Just for grins I called the local O'Reilly's to see what they get for > a reman. They get $1607 plus a $200 core charge. I know these guys > pretty well (it's the only parts store in a town of about 6,000) and > the manager said I could probably get a new tranny from GM for about > the same price. I'll probably have my guy down here look at it and > have him either rebuild it or see what I can get a new trans for and > get it installed. I have neither a place, the tools or the desire to > tackle this myself right now. > > Has anyone on the list had a similar experience with a vehicle > equipped with this transmission? > > TIA > -- > Ron > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com > > -- ================================= = Never offend people with style when you = = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown = ================================= From dmscheidt at gmail.com Sat Dec 11 22:04:18 2010 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Sun, 12 Dec 2010 00:04:18 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] GM 4l60e transmission problem In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 7:10 PM, John Innis wrote: > $1600 for a rebuild job sounds pretty darn high. B Round here the shops > charge $600 if you pull the tranny and about $1000 if they remove and > reinstall. B You can get a decent, low mile unit at the scrapyard for > less than $700. B But be careful on the year. B There were a lot of > variations on these. B The '95 is the worst, the one used on the trucks > that year does not interchange with any other year. > There's a pretty big range of what can be in "rebuilt" transmission. For six hundred bucks, I wouldn't expect much than "fix what's busted". (Actually, from the shops here, I doubt I'd expect "fix what's busted", but just "install kit of usual failed parts and pray". Other shops might employ people with diagnostic skills.) 1600 does seem a bit steep; I'd shop around, and check what all that includes. From ericm at lne.com Fri Dec 17 15:39:39 2010 From: ericm at lne.com (Eric Murray) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 14:39:39 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe Message-ID: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> I have a tailpipe that I need to cut to get out of the car. It's stainless, 3" diameter. I'm putting a rorty exhaust on my Mazdaspeed3. I have a sawz-all, an air die grinder and an angle grinder. Which is the best tool to use (cutoff wheel in the grinders). Or should I buy an exhaust cutoff tool? I assume that a hacksaw will take forever. Eric From jem at milleredp.com Fri Dec 17 15:40:47 2010 From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 14:40:47 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> References: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> Message-ID: <4D0BE6EF.8070705@milleredp.com> On 12/17/2010 2:39 PM, Eric Murray wrote: > I have a tailpipe that I need to cut to get out of the car. > It's stainless, 3" diameter. I'm putting a rorty exhaust on my Mazdaspeed3. > > I have a sawz-all, an air die grinder and an angle grinder. > > Which is the best tool to use (cutoff wheel in the grinders). Sawzall, good 18-24TPI blades, lots of lubricating oil. If you've got room for the blade travel. Try to make sure to get the end square. John. From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Fri Dec 17 15:46:00 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 14:46:00 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> References: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> Message-ID: <0b8a01cb9e3c$2dc51c30$894f5490$@rr.com> > I have a tailpipe that I need to cut to get out of the car. Angle grinder with a cutoff wheel rated for use with metal would be my choice. In fact I did just that a few months ago, except my exhaust was mild steel. -- Randall From hillman at planet-torque.com Fri Dec 17 15:46:20 2010 From: hillman at planet-torque.com (David Hillman) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 17:46:20 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: <4D0BE6EF.8070705@milleredp.com> References: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> <4D0BE6EF.8070705@milleredp.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 17 Dec 2010, John Miller wrote: > If you've got room for the blade travel. Watch out for the gas tank ;) HTH, -- David Hillman From arvidj at visi.com Fri Dec 17 15:52:49 2010 From: arvidj at visi.com (Arvid Jedlicka) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 16:52:49 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> References: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> Message-ID: <139B408DDD86497DA86E0D21FB621290@HP62011> IMHO ... it depends on where you want to cut it and what's around it. My first thought would be the sawz-all but that would only be if it was reasonably attached to something. My experience with them is they cut great as long as what you are cutting will "stand still", but if it wiggles just a little then the saw blade will move what ever I am cutting back and forth but not actually cut it. And a very fine tooth metal blade would be best. Second would be the angle grinder with a cutoff wheel. The hard part with that might be getting all the way around the pipe as you would need a 7 inch diameter wheel to cut all the way thru a 3 inch pipe from just one side. Last would be the die grinder. I have all three tools available to me and I have to admit that the die grinder would never have occurred to me for such a task. As I said, depends on where the cut will be made and what ... like the floor pan ... is around it that will either get in the way of the sawz-all blade or the angle grinder. Arvid -----Original Message----- From: Eric Murray Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 4:39 PM To: shop-talk at autox.team.net Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe I have a tailpipe that I need to cut to get out of the car. It's stainless, 3" diameter. I'm putting a rorty exhaust on my Mazdaspeed3. I have a sawz-all, an air die grinder and an angle grinder. Which is the best tool to use (cutoff wheel in the grinders). Or should I buy an exhaust cutoff tool? I assume that a hacksaw will take forever. Eric _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/arvidj at visi.com From wmc_st at xxiii.com Fri Dec 17 16:02:47 2010 From: wmc_st at xxiii.com (Wayne) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 18:02:47 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> References: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> Message-ID: <4D0BEC17.8070401@xxiii.com> On 12/17/2010 5:39 PM, Eric Murray wrote: > I have a tailpipe that I need to cut to get out of the car. > It's stainless, 3" diameter. I'm putting a rorty exhaust on my Mazdaspeed3. > I have a sawz-all, an air die grinder and an angle grinder. > Which is the best tool to use (cutoff wheel in the grinders). Sounds like a good excuse to buy a plasma cutter. Or, as others said, saw or air grinder w. cut-off wheel. Is there no reasonable way to get it out without cutting? It sounds like a not-so-old car; could be worth bucks, or shoot, you might want to put it back on someday. -Wayne From doug at dougbraun.com Fri Dec 17 16:21:25 2010 From: doug at dougbraun.com (Douglas Braun) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 18:21:25 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> References: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> Message-ID: I think you should do whatever would cause the least damage to the surrounding area. Doug On Dec 17, 2010 5:37 PM, "Eric Murray" wrote: > I have a tailpipe that I need to cut to get out of the car. > It's stainless, 3" diameter. I'm putting a rorty exhaust on my Mazdaspeed3. > > I have a sawz-all, an air die grinder and an angle grinder. > > Which is the best tool to use (cutoff wheel in the grinders). > > Or should I buy an exhaust cutoff tool? > > I assume that a hacksaw will take forever. > > Eric > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/doug at dougbraun.com From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Fri Dec 17 16:24:18 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 15:24:18 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: <139B408DDD86497DA86E0D21FB621290@HP62011> References: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> <139B408DDD86497DA86E0D21FB621290@HP62011> Message-ID: <0b9501cb9e41$882c5260$9884f720$@rr.com> > as you would need a 7 > inch > diameter wheel to cut all the way thru a 3 inch pipe from just one > side. Not so. Just takes a few extra cuts. -- Randall From ejrussell at mebtel.net Fri Dec 17 16:24:57 2010 From: ejrussell at mebtel.net (Eric J Russell) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 18:24:57 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: <4D0BEC17.8070401@xxiii.com> References: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> <4D0BEC17.8070401@xxiii.com> Message-ID: Will this work? http://www.harborfreight.com/exhaust-pipe-cut-off-tool-91292.html Eric Russell Mebane, NC http://home.mebtel.net/~ejrussell From arvidj at visi.com Fri Dec 17 16:38:36 2010 From: arvidj at visi.com (Arvid Jedlicka) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 17:38:36 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: <0b9501cb9e41$882c5260$9884f720$@rr.com> References: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> <139B408DDD86497DA86E0D21FB621290@HP62011> <0b9501cb9e41$882c5260$9884f720$@rr.com> Message-ID: Not "Not so". I think I stated "cut from just one side" which implied 'like a cutoff saw' or that "extra cuts" or working your way around the pipe or hacking the pipe out in several pieces was not a viable option. If he can get all the way around the pipe or is willing to take it out in pieces so he can make room to get to the other side of the pipe then a wheel slightly larger than the nut to hold it on the spindle would be all that is need. -----Original Message----- From: Randall Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 5:24 PM To: shop-talk at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe > as you would need a 7 > inch > diameter wheel to cut all the way thru a 3 inch pipe from just one > side. Not so. Just takes a few extra cuts. -- Randall _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/arvidj at visi.com From jem at milleredp.com Fri Dec 17 17:00:42 2010 From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 16:00:42 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: References: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> <4D0BEC17.8070401@xxiii.com> Message-ID: <4D0BF9AA.8010706@milleredp.com> On 12/17/2010 3:24 PM, Eric J Russell wrote: > Will this work? > http://www.harborfreight.com/exhaust-pipe-cut-off-tool-91292.html Maybe. Let me recap: This needs about a 120-150 degree swing to work, and I don't know how well Harbor Freight cutting wheels will handle stainless exhaust pipe. I have a KD Tools or whatever equivalent and it's worked for me but I wouldn't use it in preference to a Sawzall if I had room. I also have a big Ridgid pipe cutter that I use for loose pipe but it needs 360 degree access. A Sawzall will do the job with less access, but you have to be careful of what if anything the blade might poke into above the pipe. To do it with an angle grinder requires either 360 degree access to the pipe or a much bigger angle grinder than I want to hold above my head (which will probably still need about 150 degree access A die grinder with a cutting wheel needs 360 degree access and is going to be a PITA to deal with on a job like this. John. From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Fri Dec 17 17:10:49 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 16:10:49 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: References: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> <139B408DDD86497DA86E0D21FB621290@HP62011> <0b9501cb9e41$882c5260$9884f720$@rr.com> Message-ID: <0b9901cb9e48$0c3142e0$2493c8a0$@rr.com> > I think I stated "cut from just one side" which implied > 'like > a cutoff saw' or that "extra cuts" or working your way around the pipe > or > hacking the pipe out in several pieces was not a viable option. Sorry, my mistake. I did not think "cut from just one side" excluded taking it out in pieces. But if the issue is just that one side of the pipe is up against a panel, then you can cut a pipe thicker than the radius of your cutoff wheel. In my case, two intersecting angle cuts let me remove part of the pipe, which got close enough that I could go the rest of the way with a 90 degree cut. But if that won't do, you can make two 90 degree cuts across the pipe but some distance apart, as deep as your blade will allow, and then two more cuts along the length of the pipe to connect the first two cuts. Remove that section of pipe and repeat the process as many times as needed. -- Randall From ericm at lne.com Fri Dec 17 17:16:46 2010 From: ericm at lne.com (Eric Murray) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 16:16:46 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: <4D0BF9AA.8010706@milleredp.com> References: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> <4D0BEC17.8070401@xxiii.com> <4D0BF9AA.8010706@milleredp.com> Message-ID: <20101218001646.GC6206@slack> I think I'll go with the sawzall. I may drop the pipe first, strap it down and support it, then cut. That way I'll have more room. Removing the pipe without cutting requires dropping the rear suspension subframe, and I don't want to do that. Actually its not dropping it that bothers me, it's getting it back on. If I need the stock pipe again I can get it welded up (with flanges). The plasma cutter would be cool but I'd have to hide it from my wife... she tends to start demolition before there is a plan for reconstruction. She's already forbidden from using the sawzall without supervision. Eric From jandkstone99 at msn.com Fri Dec 17 19:28:28 2010 From: jandkstone99 at msn.com (Jim Stone) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 20:28:28 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: <20101218001646.GC6206@slack> References: <20101217223939.GA6206@slack> <4D0BEC17.8070401@xxiii.com>, , <4D0BF9AA.8010706@milleredp.com>, <20101218001646.GC6206@slack> Message-ID: Its not as much fun as a sawzall, but I recently used Advance Auto's tool loan program to 'borrow' a kit that included a chain cutter (http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_Kit-42--- Exhaust-Set-%284-Piece%29-Alltrade-Tools_9150002-P_N3494_T|GRP2083____). The cutter did a perfect job of cutting straight and only needed a few degrees of back and forth movement to cut through both stainless and steel pipe. It is a little more work than using power tools, but also idiot proof enough that I will go that route again the next time I need to cut pipe while still on the car. > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe > > I think I'll go with the sawzall. I may drop the pipe first, strap > it down and support it, then cut. That way I'll have more room. > > > Removing the pipe without cutting requires dropping the rear suspension > subframe, and I don't want to do that. Actually its not dropping it > that bothers me, it's getting it back on. > > If I need the stock pipe again I can get it welded up (with flanges). > > The plasma cutter would be cool but I'd have to hide it > from my wife... she tends to start demolition before there is a > plan for reconstruction. She's already forbidden from using > the sawzall without supervision. > > > Eric > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jandkstone99 at msn.com From eric at megageek.com Fri Dec 17 19:59:40 2010 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 21:59:40 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks Jim, now I finally have an item to go on my Christmas list!! 8>) Moose "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson Jim Stone Sent by: shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net 12/17/2010 21:15 To cc Subject Re: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe Its not as much fun as a sawzall, but I recently used Advance Auto's tool loan program to 'borrow' a kit that included a chain cutter ( http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_Kit-42--- Exhaust-Set-%284-Piece%29-Alltrade-Tools_9150002-P_N3494_T|GRP2083____). The cutter did a perfect job of cutting straight and only needed a few degrees of back and forth movement to cut through both stainless and steel pipe. It is a little more work than using power tools, but also idiot proof enough that I will go that route again the next time I need to cut pipe while still on the car. From gsteve at hammatt.com Fri Dec 17 20:23:15 2010 From: gsteve at hammatt.com (Steve Hammatt Mount Vernon WA USA) Date: Fri, 17 Dec 2010 19:23:15 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <87165A6D4D5B43B78CF9E172E3CC72E2@DesktopPC> Difficulty with the URL? Try this http://tinyurl.com/2btlej7 Steve Hammatt Mount Vernon WA USA ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Jim Stone" Cc: Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 6:59 PM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe > Thanks Jim, now I finally have an item to go on my Christmas list!! > 8>) > > Moose > "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a > rational > being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." > Ralph > Waldo Emerson > > > > > Jim Stone > Sent by: shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net > 12/17/2010 21:15 > > To > > cc > > Subject > Re: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe > > > > > > > Its not as much fun as a sawzall, but I recently used Advance Auto's > tool > loan > program to 'borrow' a kit that included a chain cutter > ( > http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_Kit-42--- > > Exhaust-Set-%284-Piece%29-Alltrade-Tools_9150002-P_N3494_T|GRP2083____). > The > cutter did a perfect job of cutting straight and only needed a few > degrees > of > back and forth movement to cut through both stainless and steel > pipe. It > is a > little more work than using power tools, but also idiot proof enough > that > I > will go that route again the next time I need to cut pipe while > still on > the > car. > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/gsteve at hammatt.com From pethier at comcast.net Sat Dec 18 14:13:21 2010 From: pethier at comcast.net (pethier at comcast.net) Date: Sat, 18 Dec 2010 21:13:21 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Eric J Russell" > To: "Shop Talk List" > Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 5:24:57 PM > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] cutting exhaust pipe > > Will this work? > http://www.harborfreight.com/exhaust-pipe-cut-off-tool-91292.html Needs at least a 90-degree swing. Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UB "uncle jack" 2004 Suburban 8.1 2005 Lotus Elise 2007 Saturn Ion 3 2.4 pethier [at] comcast [dot] net http://www.flickr.com/photos/pethier http://www.triumphtransamerica.org http://www.mnautox.com From arvidj at visi.com Mon Dec 20 08:20:28 2010 From: arvidj at visi.com (Arvid Jedlicka) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 09:20:28 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> The week before last the neighbor brought home a snow blower that had been at his mom's house for several years. It has a rather ubiquitous single cylinder carbureted four cycle engine on it. On Friday he got it started but it would only run if the choke was full on. It ran well enough that he could clean the light snow from the driveway so he thought he was "home free". The next day he tried to start it and nothing other that starting ether sprayed in the carb would make it run. After watching him for a while I went over to see if there was anything I could do. Like any good doctor I wanted the patients family history. The machine had sat unused unprepared for long term storage for two years. Last year he had tried to get it going but couldn't so he left the new gas that he had put in the tank just sit there and allowed the machine to sit idle for another year. Which brings us to last week. He had sprayed carb cleaner down the throat of the carb and had removed the float bowl. While I was there we removed the idle and main jet adjustments and used the straw of the carb cleaner to shoot cleaner thru the internals. Based on what I saw the passage from the idle adjustment to throat of the carb is clear ... or at least allows carb cleaner to flow easily ... and the same from the idle adjustment back to the fuel bowl. The same appears to be true for the main jet ... at least some flow to the throat and the other end sits in the fuel bowl so that end works. We then checked the float level and when hanging freely fuel flows quite nicely from the tank, when the seam on the float it horizontal ... or parallel with the bowl base the fuel stops and does not start again as the float reaches the end of it travel. So we feel the fuel system up to the float in the bowl is working correctly. We put it all back together and tired it and zero, zilch, nothing. On a whim I stuck my thumb over the throat of the carb and blocked off 95% of the opening. When I did so it actually started and would run as long as my thumb was there. This really surprised me because the opening to the throat of the carb was so small I didn't think enough air would get in for any combustion to take place. The bad part is that when I remove my thumb the motor dies. Full choke does not seem to block off enough to either get it started or to allow it to run. The only way we can make it run is with a thumb in the throat of the carb ... or 95% of the throat blocked off. Adjustment of both the idle and main jets do not seem to have any effect on the percentage. We had them anywhere from 1/2 turn to 3 turns from "seated" and no difference. As mentioned, I was awestruck that it ran at all with such a small opening to the outside air. We spent some time looking for a vacuum leak just to make sure air wasn't coming in from somewhere else. But with only a carb, a three inch long, two 90 degree bends, cast metal intake manifold and then the flathead cylinder, there are only two gaskets to check, and both passed the "spray ether on them" vacuum leak test. At this point I am open to any and all suggestions as to what to do next. Thanks, Arvid From doug at dougbraun.com Mon Dec 20 09:31:54 2010 From: doug at dougbraun.com (Douglas Braun) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 11:31:54 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> Message-ID: Crack in the plastic fuel line? Cracks in any other plastic parts? Doug From kvacek at ameritech.net Mon Dec 20 10:14:46 2010 From: kvacek at ameritech.net (Karl Vacek) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 11:14:46 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> Message-ID: <003c01cba069$67c75cc0$37561640$@ameritech.net> Sounds normal for an engine not getting enough gas. It will indeed run with very little throttle opening. The choke opening is just as small - so what you're seeing with your thumb isn't much smaller than what it gets at full choke. The inlet needle should begin to admit fuel before the float reaches the end of its travel. Something blocking it will produce the symptoms you describe. Some inlet needles have elastomeric tips, which can swell or fall off. Be aware too that many small engines nowadays use a TINY rubber seat with a steel needle. You might not expect it to be there, and the rubber seat might not be very visible till your air gun blows that seat into the neighbor's yard. Then will definitely have to go get another one. It might be sticky or hard or broken and blocking the passage too. I'd try a good off-the-engine carb cleaning before much else, and I'd just go buy a carb kit to get new gaskets and a new needle and seat before even starting. Personally I've had very mixed results with on-the-engine carb cleaning. Karl -----Original Message----- From: Arvid Jedlicka Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... He had sprayed carb cleaner down the throat of the carb and had removed the float bowl. While I was there we removed the idle and main jet adjustments and used the straw of the carb cleaner to shoot cleaner thru the internals. We then checked the float level and when hanging freely fuel flows quite nicely from the tank, when the seam on the float it horizontal ... or parallel with the bowl base the fuel stops and does not start again as the float reaches the end of it travel. So we feel the fuel system up to the float in the bowl is working correctly. We put it all back together and tired it and zero, zilch, nothing. On a whim I stuck my thumb over the throat of the carb and blocked off 95% of the opening. When I did so it actually started and would run as long as my thumb was there. This really surprised me because the opening to the throat of the carb was so small I didn't think enough air would get in for any combustion to take place. From TR3driver at ca.rr.com Mon Dec 20 12:02:06 2010 From: TR3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 11:02:06 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run... In-Reply-To: <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> Message-ID: <005b01cba078$654ce910$0301a8c0@randall> > At this point I am open to any and all suggestions as to what > to do next. IMO, you've still got a fuel passage somewhere that is nearly blocked. It takes only a tiny amount of air (and fuel) for the engine to idle, so the only unusual part is that it takes nearly full manifold vacuum to pull enough fuel through the jet. I went through something similar with a stored lawnmower, seems that what they sell for gasoline in CA these days dries to a hard white substance that "carb cleaner" will not touch. Randall From ericm at lne.com Mon Dec 20 12:47:07 2010 From: ericm at lne.com (Eric Murray) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 11:47:07 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> Message-ID: <20101220194707.GA26748@slack> On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 09:20:28AM -0600, Arvid Jedlicka wrote: > The week before last the neighbor brought home a snow blower that > had been at his mom's house for several years. It has a rather > ubiquitous single cylinder carbureted four cycle engine on it. On > Friday he got it started but it would only run if the choke was full > on. Classic symptom of clogged carb jets. Clean and/or replace them. Eric From kennedybc at comcast.net Mon Dec 20 12:45:29 2010 From: kennedybc at comcast.net (Brian Kennedy) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 11:45:29 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run... In-Reply-To: <005b01cba078$654ce910$0301a8c0@randall> References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> <005b01cba078$654ce910$0301a8c0@randall> Message-ID: <070CC48A-8001-4844-8264-E1D2F2EE36E0@comcast.net> I had good success once dunking the entire carburetor from my lawn mower in a can of GUNK overnight. I didn't think to remove the O ring and it swelled up pretty big. Took a day or two to dry out. Mower worked fine after that. So, you might try sticking as many of the fuel parts as you can in GUNK for awhile. Any rubber parts either run something through them or replace them. Brian K On Dec 20, 2010, at 11:02 AM, Randall wrote: >> At this point I am open to any and all suggestions as to what >> to do next. > > IMO, you've still got a fuel passage somewhere that is nearly blocked. It > takes only a tiny amount of air (and fuel) for the engine to idle, so the > only unusual part is that it takes nearly full manifold vacuum to pull > enough fuel through the jet. > > I went through something similar with a stored lawnmower, seems that what > they sell for gasoline in CA these days dries to a hard white substance that > "carb cleaner" will not touch. > > Randall From dmscheidt at gmail.com Mon Dec 20 12:51:33 2010 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 14:51:33 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: <003c01cba069$67c75cc0$37561640$@ameritech.net> References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> <003c01cba069$67c75cc0$37561640$@ameritech.net> Message-ID: On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 12:14 PM, Karl Vacek wrote: > I'd try a good off-the-engine carb cleaning before much else, and I'd just > go buy a carb kit to get new gaskets and a new needle and seat before even > starting. B Personally I've had very mixed results with on-the-engine carb > cleaning. I'd check the cost of a whole new carb, first though. Some small engine carbs are stupidly expensive, while others are stupidly cheap. I don't know what the owner's futz v. fix properly numbers are, but I don't see it's worth futzing with if a new carb is cheap. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From marka at maracing.com Mon Dec 20 13:24:29 2010 From: marka at maracing.com (Mark Andy) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 15:24:29 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> <003c01cba069$67c75cc0$37561640$@ameritech.net> Message-ID: Howdy, On Mon, 20 Dec 2010, David Scheidt wrote: >> I'd try a good off-the-engine carb cleaning before much else, and I'd just >> go buy a carb kit to get new gaskets and a new needle and seat before even >> starting. B Personally I've had very mixed results with on-the-engine carb >> cleaning. > > I'd check the cost of a whole new carb, first though. Some small engine > carbs are stupidly expensive, while others are stupidly cheap. I don't > know what the owner's futz v. fix properly numbers are, but I don't see > it's worth futzing with if a new carb is cheap. It'd have to be pretty cheap... Pull the carb, pull the bowl, and disassemble the entire carb. Be a little careful and you should be able to reuse all the gaskets and whatnot. Blow carb cleaner through everything and visually check the jets. The two times something like this has happened to me, it was because I had a jet clogged with a piece of crap. Also replace gas with new if you haven't already, and check the plug. Mark From wmc_st at xxiii.com Mon Dec 20 13:24:42 2010 From: wmc_st at xxiii.com (Wayne) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 15:24:42 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run... In-Reply-To: <005b01cba078$654ce910$0301a8c0@randall> References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> <005b01cba078$654ce910$0301a8c0@randall> Message-ID: <4D0FBB8A.4070202@xxiii.com> On 12/20/2010 2:02 PM, Randall wrote: > IMO, you've still got a fuel passage somewhere that is nearly blocked. It > takes only a tiny amount of air (and fuel) for the engine to idle, so the > only unusual part is that it takes nearly full manifold vacuum to pull Have to concur. Over the last summer, I've had both a lawnmower and chipper where the fuel line was rotting, and clogging things with black granules of decaying rubber. cleaning the carb gets them going, but you have to cure the root cause. -Wayne From mg_garage at comcast.net Mon Dec 20 14:03:23 2010 From: mg_garage at comcast.net (gordies garage) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 16:03:23 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net><90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> Message-ID: <00022F1217924FBF9D70D26D507D85E1@stargate> on my gas blower I discovered that the plastic fuel line (<1/4") went into the fuel tank simply through a hole punched in the plastic tank. Over time, the hole in the fuel tank had cracked and would only pull enough fuel to keep it running once it was running (through use of ether). Yeh, check where the fuel line enters the tank. HTH gordie From eltonclark at gmail.com Mon Dec 20 15:30:25 2010 From: eltonclark at gmail.com (Elton E. (Tony) Clark) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 16:30:25 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: <00022F1217924FBF9D70D26D507D85E1@stargate> References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> <00022F1217924FBF9D70D26D507D85E1@stargate> Message-ID: *I have no facts to support this but an amazing number of people with small aircooled motors think that the alcohol in today's fuel is the cause for all the plugged up **fuel systems . . Even after they add filters in the fuel lines, they're getting repeated plug ups . . they think it's the alcohol attacking the zink-like metals. We have a little Yamaha pit bike on which the starting enrichment system plugs up repeatedly . . . we finally gave up and keep some WD 40 strapped on it for starting. I try to run my lawn equipment dry when I shut down and I use Stabil or empty the tank for winter storage,* *Good luck* From jdinnis at gmail.com Mon Dec 20 16:26:57 2010 From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 17:26:57 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> <00022F1217924FBF9D70D26D507D85E1@stargate> Message-ID: I don't know if this is still true, but in the 80's Briggs and Tecumseh both would not honor a warranty on a motor if they found ethanol in the tank. We used to have a test kit that would give us the exact amount of ethanol in the gas. Trace amount were allowed but anything over 5% and they voided the warranty. In the 90's I think they allowed 10%, but then they shifted gears and started complaining to the oil companies whenever we found a sample that had more than 10%. On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 4:30 PM, Elton E. (Tony) Clark wrote: > *I have no facts to support this but an amazing number of people with small > aircooled motors think that the alcohol in today's fuel is the cause for all > the plugged up **fuel systems . . Even after they add filters in the fuel > lines, they're getting repeated plug ups . . they think it's the alcohol > attacking the zink-like metals. We have a little Yamaha pit bike on which > the starting enrichment system plugs up repeatedly . . . we finally gave up > and keep some WD 40 strapped on it for starting. I try to run my lawn > equipment dry when I shut down and I use Stabil or empty the tank for winter > storage,* > *Good luck* > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com > > -- ================================= = Never offend people with style when you = = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown = ================================= From TR3driver at ca.rr.com Mon Dec 20 17:29:16 2010 From: TR3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 16:29:16 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net><90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011><00022F1217924FBF9D70D26D507D85E1@stargate> Message-ID: <00c801cba0a6$1a154d10$0301a8c0@randall> > *I have no facts to support this but an amazing number of > people with small > aircooled motors think that the alcohol in today's fuel is > the cause for all > the plugged up **fuel systems I likewise can't prove it, but I believe there is more to it than just ethanol. "Reformulated" gasoline has a whole bunch of restrictions as to vapor pressure, sulfur content and so on. It looks, smells and acts a lot different than I would expect from just dumping a pint of "white lightning" into every gallon of "classic" gasoline. And ethanol by itself evaporates cleanly, rather than leaving that hard, white deposit that clogs jets and so on. -- Randall From bjshov8 at tx.rr.com Mon Dec 20 17:37:06 2010 From: bjshov8 at tx.rr.com (BJNoSHOV8) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 18:37:06 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> <003c01cba069$67c75cc0$37561640$@ameritech.net> Message-ID: <4D0FF6B2.8020701@tx.rr.com> Jets are one thing, but then the fuel has to go up through other passages to the openings in the venturi. You have to make sure all of those passages are clear too. Another thing I'll mention although it's only a small chance that this is a problem- I had a mower that would run for awhile and then stall. I took it back to the store and they started it, ran it, etc. and it ran fine. They finally cranked it and just let it set outside and run, and they noticed that after awhile it died. They checked and there was a suction built up in the fuel tank. The fuel cap did not have the vent openings that it was supposed to have, so when suction built up the fuel would no longer flow into the carb. > Pull the carb, pull the bowl, and disassemble the entire carb. Be a > little careful and you should be able to reuse all the gaskets and > whatnot. Blow carb cleaner through everything and visually check the > jets. The two times something like this has happened to me, it was > because I had a jet clogged with a piece of crap. From dmscheidt at gmail.com Mon Dec 20 18:51:21 2010 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Mon, 20 Dec 2010 20:51:21 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> <003c01cba069$67c75cc0$37561640$@ameritech.net> Message-ID: On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 3:24 PM, Mark Andy wrote: > Howdy, > > It'd have to be pretty cheap... > > Pull the carb, pull the bowl, and disassemble the entire carb. B Be a little > careful and you should be able to reuse all the gaskets and whatnot. B Blow > carb cleaner through everything and visually check the jets. B The two times > something like this has happened to me, it was because I had a jet clogged > with a piece of crap. > The one I bought last summer cost $35 bucks. The carb kit, which had gaskets, a needle valve, and a couple o-rings was $15. Twenty bucks to not have to build a carb that had sat for five or six years, when what was wrong with the carb was all the whatnot was now wasnot, seems like a pretty good value. Particularly if you're fixing the thing because it's a tool, and you want to use it, and not because you're fixing it to fix something. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From opposumking at verizon.net Tue Dec 21 07:22:08 2010 From: opposumking at verizon.net (Nolan) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 09:22:08 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> Message-ID: <18DE2140547E48C1869B9F01819286F8@mde.state.md.us> Snow King engine? Those were very common some years ago on snow blowers, and are notorious for needing to have the choke on in order to run, even when warmed up. And, they surge and splutter nicely, especially when not under a load. Do watch out for ethanol and the needle seat. The seat is made of a white rubber that swells when soaked in ethanol, strangling fuel supply. It is the seat, not the needle that is rubber. From arvidj at visi.com Tue Dec 21 09:26:20 2010 From: arvidj at visi.com (Arvid Jedlicka) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 10:26:20 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: <18DE2140547E48C1869B9F01819286F8@mde.state.md.us> References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net><90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> <18DE2140547E48C1869B9F01819286F8@mde.state.md.us> Message-ID: Based on all of the excellent feedback we have taken the carb off and I'm soaking it in some real carb cleaner ... the kind that comes in a gallon can, has the little basket in it, requires rubber gloves, etc.. That should either clean it up or render it totally useless. I'll keep you posted on the outcome as there is more snow in the forecast for Minnesota later in the week. Arvid From pat at hornesystemstx.com Tue Dec 21 09:58:27 2010 From: pat at hornesystemstx.com (Pat Horne) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 10:58:27 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net><90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> <18DE2140547E48C1869B9F01819286F8@mde.state.md.us> Message-ID: <4D10DCB3.4060903@hornesystemstx.com> One alternative that has not been mentioned yet is to move South. Here in Texas the only thing that we call a snow blower is the thing that you set up to make fake snow for parades and such! It's cold today, 66F and we are all tired of winter! Peace, Pat Thusly spake Arvid Jedlicka, On 12/21/2010 10:26 AM: > Based on all of the excellent feedback we have taken the carb off and > I'm soaking it in some real carb cleaner ... the kind that comes in a > gallon can, has the little basket in it, requires rubber gloves, etc.. > > That should either clean it up or render it totally useless. > > I'll keep you posted on the outcome as there is more snow in the > forecast for Minnesota later in the week. > > Arvid _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pat at hornesystemstx.com > > > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- From scott.hall.personal at gmail.com Tue Dec 21 10:00:11 2010 From: scott.hall.personal at gmail.com (scott.hall.personal at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 17:00:11 +0000 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will notrun ... In-Reply-To: <4D10DCB3.4060903@hornesystemstx.com> References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net><90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011><18DE2140547E48C1869B9F01819286F8@mde.state.md.us><4D10DCB3.4060903@hornesystemstx.com> Message-ID: That's a poor suggestion. If you live north of the Mason Dixon, please stay there. Except to visit. Thanks. :-) Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: Pat Horne Sender: shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 10:58:27 To: Reply-To: pat at hornesystemstx.com Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... One alternative that has not been mentioned yet is to move South. Here in Texas the only thing that we call a snow blower is the thing that you set up to make fake snow for parades and such! It's cold today, 66F and we are all tired of winter! Peace, Pat Thusly spake Arvid Jedlicka, On 12/21/2010 10:26 AM: > Based on all of the excellent feedback we have taken the carb off and > I'm soaking it in some real carb cleaner ... the kind that comes in a > gallon can, has the little basket in it, requires rubber gloves, etc.. > > That should either clean it up or render it totally useless. > > I'll keep you posted on the outcome as there is more snow in the > forecast for Minnesota later in the week. > > Arvid _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pat at hornesystemstx.com > > > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/scott.hall.personal at gmail.com From tputland at charter.net Tue Dec 21 10:16:35 2010 From: tputland at charter.net (Tim) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 9:16:35 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: <20101221165959.0BE451878BD@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <20101221121635.YBRLC.10819359.root@mp08> "If you live north of the Mason Dixon, please stay there" Yea, um, no worries there. NO worries, at all. Please reciprocate. Tim Dairyland Datsuns ---- scott.hall.personal at gmail.com wrote: ============= That's a poor suggestion. If you live north of the Mason Dixon, please stay there. Except to visit. Thanks. :-) Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: Pat Horne Sender: shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 10:58:27 To: Reply-To: pat at hornesystemstx.com Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... One alternative that has not been mentioned yet is to move South. Here in Texas the only thing that we call a snow blower is the thing that you set up to make fake snow for parades and such! It's cold today, 66F and we are all tired of winter! Peace, Pat Thusly spake Arvid Jedlicka, On 12/21/2010 10:26 AM: > Based on all of the excellent feedback we have taken the carb off and > I'm soaking it in some real carb cleaner ... the kind that comes in a > gallon can, has the little basket in it, requires rubber gloves, etc.. > > That should either clean it up or render it totally useless. > > I'll keep you posted on the outcome as there is more snow in the > forecast for Minnesota later in the week. > > Arvid _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pat at hornesystemstx.com > > > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/scott.hall.personal at gmail.com _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tputland at charter.net From scott.hall.personal at gmail.com Tue Dec 21 11:11:40 2010 From: scott.hall.personal at gmail.com (scott.hall.personal at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 18:11:40 +0000 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will notrun ... In-Reply-To: <20101221121635.YBRLC.10819359.root@mp08> References: <20101221165959.0BE451878BD@autox.team.net><20101221121635.YBRLC.10819359.root@mp08> Message-ID: I keeeeeeeeed, Tim. Us Rebs just get tired of you-uns coming down here an' whinin'. Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: Tim Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 9:16:35 To: ; ; Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... "If you live north of the Mason Dixon, please stay there" Yea, um, no worries there. NO worries, at all. Please reciprocate. Tim Dairyland Datsuns ---- scott.hall.personal at gmail.com wrote: ============= That's a poor suggestion. If you live north of the Mason Dixon, please stay there. Except to visit. Thanks. :-) Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: Pat Horne Sender: shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 10:58:27 To: Reply-To: pat at hornesystemstx.com Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... One alternative that has not been mentioned yet is to move South. Here in Texas the only thing that we call a snow blower is the thing that you set up to make fake snow for parades and such! It's cold today, 66F and we are all tired of winter! Peace, Pat Thusly spake Arvid Jedlicka, On 12/21/2010 10:26 AM: > Based on all of the excellent feedback we have taken the carb off and > I'm soaking it in some real carb cleaner ... the kind that comes in a > gallon can, has the little basket in it, requires rubber gloves, etc.. > > That should either clean it up or render it totally useless. > > I'll keep you posted on the outcome as there is more snow in the > forecast for Minnesota later in the week. > > Arvid _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pat at hornesystemstx.com > > > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/scott.hall.personal at gmail.com _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tputland at charter.net From tputland at charter.net Tue Dec 21 11:23:26 2010 From: tputland at charter.net (Tim) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 10:23:26 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will notrun ... In-Reply-To: <543705876-1292955101-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-348161763-@bda454.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Message-ID: <20101221132326.XF20C.10820559.root@mp08> Is that "whining" or "winning" ?! How 'bout them cowboys! Tim ---- scott.hall.personal at gmail.com wrote: ============= I keeeeeeeeed, Tim. Us Rebs just get tired of you-uns coming down here an' whinin'. Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: Tim Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 9:16:35 To: ; ; Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... "If you live north of the Mason Dixon, please stay there" Yea, um, no worries there. NO worries, at all. Please reciprocate. Tim Dairyland Datsuns ---- scott.hall.personal at gmail.com wrote: ============= That's a poor suggestion. If you live north of the Mason Dixon, please stay there. Except to visit. Thanks. :-) Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: Pat Horne Sender: shop-talk-bounces at autox.team.net Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 10:58:27 To: Reply-To: pat at hornesystemstx.com Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... One alternative that has not been mentioned yet is to move South. Here in Texas the only thing that we call a snow blower is the thing that you set up to make fake snow for parades and such! It's cold today, 66F and we are all tired of winter! Peace, Pat Thusly spake Arvid Jedlicka, On 12/21/2010 10:26 AM: > Based on all of the excellent feedback we have taken the carb off and > I'm soaking it in some real carb cleaner ... the kind that comes in a > gallon can, has the little basket in it, requires rubber gloves, etc.. > > That should either clean it up or render it totally useless. > > I'll keep you posted on the outcome as there is more snow in the > forecast for Minnesota later in the week. > > Arvid _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pat at hornesystemstx.com > > > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/scott.hall.personal at gmail.com _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tputland at charter.net From doug at dougbraun.com Tue Dec 21 11:48:26 2010 From: doug at dougbraun.com (Douglas Braun) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 13:48:26 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Garnet blast media? Message-ID: I was in Tractor Supply yesterday and I noticed that they had 80-grit Garnet media for only $25. How would garnet compare to glass beads in a blast cabinet? I have been using glass beads, but they are a bit wimpy for rusted stuff. Thanks, Doug From pethier at comcast.net Tue Dec 21 11:57:52 2010 From: pethier at comcast.net (pethier at comcast.net) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 18:57:52 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: <4D10DCB3.4060903@hornesystemstx.com> Message-ID: <1711419105.148563.1292957872274.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> > One alternative that has not been mentioned yet is to move South. Here > in Texas the only thing that we call a snow blower is the thing that > you > set up to make fake snow for parades and such! In your part of Texas, between San Antonio and Austin, I don't suppose it snows very often. Up north of Dallas and in the panhandle it's not such a rarity. I do recall a recent winter when snowed in Houston, which seemed like quite a case of global weirding to me. I've had limited experience of your part of the world in the summer. As long as the wind was from the west, I was OK with the 108 degrees F. When the wind was from the east was a different story. It ain't high temperature that kills this northern boy, it's high dewpoint. Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UB "uncle jack" 2004 Suburban 8.1 2005 Lotus Elise 2007 Saturn Ion 3 2.4 pethier [at] comcast [dot] net http://www.flickr.com/photos/pethier http://www.triumphtransamerica.org http://www.mnautox.com From cavanadd at frontier.com Tue Dec 21 12:13:02 2010 From: cavanadd at frontier.com (David C.) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 11:13:02 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Garnet blast media? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4D10FC3E.60106@frontier.com> Garnet would probably be a lot more aggressive than glass beads and good for rusty stuff. It's commonly used as the "sand" in sandpaper. I wouldn't use it on aluminum or anything soft, though. I leave glass beads in my blasting cabinet, and save the rougher media for the pot feeder to be used outside on larger and/or more rusty stuff. Douglas Braun wrote: > I was in Tractor Supply yesterday and I noticed that they had 80-grit > Garnet media for only $25. How would garnet compare to glass beads in > a blast cabinet? I have been using glass beads, but they are a bit > wimpy for rusted stuff. > > Thanks, > Doug > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/cavanadd at frontier.com From jamesf at groupwbench.org Tue Dec 21 15:22:23 2010 From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 17:22:23 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Overhead, retractable kitchen storage? Message-ID: <00E80242-A2F6-4037-8F75-006F3B80D947@groupwbench.org> I've been tasked with building a stationary shelf to hold a Kitchen Aid mixer overhead. Knowing the inhabitants, this recipe has all the ingredients for a greasy lazy reach and falling on a head. I'd like to build a shelf that can be lowered to use the mixer, then raised up out of the way, mixer staying on it. I see all the mechanisms for storing the mixer on a shelf inside a base cabinet, but nothing for overhead storage. thanks, From ggelhar at earthlink.net Tue Dec 21 16:46:41 2010 From: ggelhar at earthlink.net (Greg Gelhar) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 17:46:41 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Another Snow Blower Question Message-ID: <410-2201012221234641963@earthlink.net> Hi, I'm from Minneapolis Minnesota and we are about to break our December snow fall record. Today I broke a shear pin (bolt) on my 1971 Eska snowblower. To finish the job, I simply put in a bolt to replace that shear pin. I want to do it right and make a new pin. (The old one is lost in the five foot snow banks that line my driveway). Are there any rules of thumb as to how deep the grooves should be in the new pin? It should be a quick job on my lathe. I can't beleive that pin only lasted 39 years. Greg Gelhar From jdinnis at gmail.com Tue Dec 21 17:14:08 2010 From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 18:14:08 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Another Snow Blower Question In-Reply-To: <410-2201012221234641963@earthlink.net> References: <410-2201012221234641963@earthlink.net> Message-ID: Not sure about your application but the grooves on the shear pins for my Ariens are about 0.010" smaller in diameter than the rest of the pin. It appears to be a grade 5 bolt originally. On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 5:46 PM, Greg Gelhar wrote: > Hi, I'm from Minneapolis Minnesota and we are about to break our December > snow fall record. Today I broke a shear pin (bolt) on my 1971 Eska > snowblower. To finish the job, I simply put in a bolt to replace that shear > pin. > I want to do it right and make a new pin. (The old one is lost in the five > foot snow banks that line my driveway). Are there any rules of thumb as to > how deep the grooves should be in the new pin? It should be a quick job on > my lathe. I can't beleive that pin only lasted 39 years. > > Greg Gelhar > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com > > -- ================================= = Never offend people with style when you = = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown = ================================= From dmscheidt at gmail.com Tue Dec 21 17:14:11 2010 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 19:14:11 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Overhead, retractable kitchen storage? In-Reply-To: <00E80242-A2F6-4037-8F75-006F3B80D947@groupwbench.org> References: <00E80242-A2F6-4037-8F75-006F3B80D947@groupwbench.org> Message-ID: On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 5:22 PM, Jim Franklin wrote: > I've been tasked with building a stationary shelf to hold a Kitchen Aid mixer > overhead. Knowing the inhabitants, this recipe has all the ingredients for a > greasy lazy reach and falling on a head. I'd like to build a shelf that can be > lowered to use the mixer, then raised up out of the way, mixer staying on it. > I see all the mechanisms for storing the mixer on a shelf inside a base > cabinet, but nothing for overhead storage. Rev a shelf make some things that make the contents of a wall cabinet reachable by swinging out and down. Might work for a mixer. Might not. http://www.rev-a-shelf.com/Common/Products.aspx?Class=Wall%20Accessories&Family=Chrome%20Accessories&Category=Pull-Down%20Shelving%20System&Series=5PD%20Series&PartNo=5PD-24CR doesn't give any useful specifications, like, oh, how much weight it can handle. From dmscheidt at gmail.com Tue Dec 21 17:40:05 2010 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 19:40:05 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Another Snow Blower Question In-Reply-To: <410-2201012221234641963@earthlink.net> References: <410-2201012221234641963@earthlink.net> Message-ID: On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 6:46 PM, Greg Gelhar wrote: > Hi, I'm from Minneapolis Minnesota and we are about to break our December > snow fall record. B Today I broke a shear pin (bolt) on my 1971 Eska > snowblower. To finish the job, I simply put in a bolt to replace that shear > pin. > I want to do it right and make a new pin. (The old one is lost in the five > foot snow banks that line my driveway). Are there any rules of thumb as to > how deep the grooves should be in the new pin? It should be a quick job on > my lathe. I can't beleive that pin only lasted 39 years. > My hardware store, and I bet any in Minnesota, has a pretty big selection of them. They cost about a buck a piece. The ones I've been using have a pair of groves cut in them, about a 1/16 thick. Neither the original ones (which are pins, held with cotter key) or the replacements, which are threaded, have any grade makrings on them. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From kvacek at ameritech.net Tue Dec 21 18:44:36 2010 From: kvacek at ameritech.net (Karl Vacek) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 19:44:36 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Another Snow Blower Question In-Reply-To: References: <410-2201012221234641963@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <002301cba179$cab0cbd0$60126370$@ameritech.net> They shouldn't be Grade 5 or any high-strength material - Grade 5 is tough, resisting breakage despite bending. Use a plain old hardware store bolt if you have to cut your own grooves - it's supposed to break if it needs to. > Neither the original ones (which are pins, held with cotter key) or the > replacements, which are threaded, have any grade makrings on them. From jdinnis at gmail.com Tue Dec 21 19:09:30 2010 From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 20:09:30 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Another Snow Blower Question In-Reply-To: <002301cba179$cab0cbd0$60126370$@ameritech.net> References: <410-2201012221234641963@earthlink.net> <002301cba179$cab0cbd0$60126370$@ameritech.net> Message-ID: The bolts an my Ariens are definitely grade 5. They are even called out that way in the parts manual. I suspect there is enough load on these that a regualr bolt would not last long in this application. On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 7:44 PM, Karl Vacek wrote: > They shouldn't be Grade 5 or any high-strength material - Grade 5 is tough, > resisting breakage despite bending. > Use a plain old hardware store bolt if you have to cut your own grooves - > it's supposed to break if it needs to. > >> Neither the original ones (which are pins, held with cotter key) or the >> replacements, which are threaded, have any grade makrings on them. > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com > > -- ================================= = Never offend people with style when you = = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown = ================================= From shiples at comcast.net Tue Dec 21 21:34:11 2010 From: shiples at comcast.net (Steve Shipley) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 20:34:11 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Another Snow Blower Question In-Reply-To: References: <002301cba179$cab0cbd0$60126370$@ameritech.net> <410-2201012221234641963@earthlink.net> <002301cba179$cab0cbd0$60126370$@ameritech.net> Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20101221203022.042176a0@mail.comcast.net> At 08:09 PM 12/21/2010 -0600, John Innis wrote: >The bolts an my Ariens are definitely grade 5. They are even called >out that way in the parts manual. I suspect there is enough load on >these that a regualr bolt would not last long in this application. > >On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 7:44 PM, Karl Vacek wrote: > > They shouldn't be Grade 5 or any high-strength material - Grade 5 is tough, > > resisting breakage despite bending. I've been under the impression that Grade 5 bolts are rated for tension, not for shear. And certainly not intended to be bent. From bjshov8 at tx.rr.com Tue Dec 21 21:38:49 2010 From: bjshov8 at tx.rr.com (BJNoSHOV8) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 22:38:49 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: <1711419105.148563.1292957872274.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <1711419105.148563.1292957872274.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <4D1180D9.1090501@tx.rr.com> I have photos of a snowman on the campus of the University of Texas. That winter I left home in north Texas at the end of christmas break heading back to college, right as a winter storm hit. It took me 3 days to get to Austin. > > In your part of Texas, between San Antonio and Austin, I don't suppose it snows very often. Up north of Dallas and in the panhandle it's not such a rarity. I do recall a recent winter when snowed in Houston, which seemed like quite a case of global weirding to me. From bjshov8 at tx.rr.com Tue Dec 21 21:51:34 2010 From: bjshov8 at tx.rr.com (BJNoSHOV8) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 22:51:34 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Another Snow Blower Question In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.0.20101221203022.042176a0@mail.comcast.net> References: <002301cba179$cab0cbd0$60126370$@ameritech.net> <410-2201012221234641963@earthlink.net> <002301cba179$cab0cbd0$60126370$@ameritech.net> <5.2.1.1.0.20101221203022.042176a0@mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <4D1183D6.6030003@tx.rr.com> Strength of steel in flexure and shear is all proportional to its strength in tension. Not that grade 5 bolts aren't used in automobiles mainly in places where they are in tension and not shear, but there are other factors involved. > At 08:09 PM 12/21/2010 -0600, John Innis wrote: >> The bolts an my Ariens are definitely grade 5. They are even called >> out that way in the parts manual. I suspect there is enough load on >> these that a regualr bolt would not last long in this application. >> >> On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 7:44 PM, Karl Vacek wrote: >>> They shouldn't be Grade 5 or any high-strength material - Grade 5 is tough, >>> resisting breakage despite bending. > I've been under the impression that Grade 5 bolts are rated for > tension, not for shear. And certainly not intended to be bent. > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bjshov8 at tx.rr.com > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 9.0.872 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3330 - Release Date: 12/21/10 13:34:00 From mdporter at dfn.com Tue Dec 21 21:55:31 2010 From: mdporter at dfn.com (Michael Porter) Date: Tue, 21 Dec 2010 21:55:31 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] Another Snow Blower Question In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.0.20101221203022.042176a0@mail.comcast.net> References: <002301cba179$cab0cbd0$60126370$@ameritech.net> <410-2201012221234641963@earthlink.net> <002301cba179$cab0cbd0$60126370$@ameritech.net> <5.2.1.1.0.20101221203022.042176a0@mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <4D1184C3.90501@dfn.com> On 12/21/2010 9:34 PM, Steve Shipley wrote: > > I've been under the impression that Grade 5 bolts are rated for > tension, not for shear. And certainly not intended to be bent. Umm, just for drill, all grades have shear ratings. Shear strength is derived mathematically from tensile strength tests (nominally, for engineering purposes, I think it's something around 65% of tensile). So, if tensile yield is XXXX, shear yield is 65% of that, and that's the figure used to determine if the bolt meets proof loads in shear. No bolt is intended to be bent, but, many are subject to shear loads, too, so they have to be calculated for a given application. I've seen 3/4" GR8 bolts with u-sections bent into them from shear loads between two plates that someone didn't calculate properly and didn't anticipate the shear loads exceeding the ability of the clamping force to keep the plates in position (too much slop in the through holes combined with high shear forces causing the plates to slide back and forth and bang against the bolt shank). Cheers. -- Michael Porter Roswell, NM Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking distance.... From darmstrong at nexicom.net Wed Dec 22 06:27:52 2010 From: darmstrong at nexicom.net (darmstrong at nexicom.net) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2010 08:27:52 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Overhead, retractable kitchen storage? Message-ID: <4d11fcd8.6b48.48950940.7930300a@nexicom.net> This does the opposite to what you want - bring the shelf up for use, but it may work: http://www.leevalley.com/US/hardware/page.aspx?p=40150&cat=3,50659 Good luck, Doug Armstrong On Tuesday 21/12/2010 at 5:23 pm, Jim Franklin wrote: > I've been tasked with building a stationary shelf to hold a Kitchen > Aid mixer > overhead. Knowing the inhabitants, this recipe has all the ingredients > for a > greasy lazy reach and falling on a head. I'd like to build a shelf > that can be > lowered to use the mixer, then raised up out of the way, mixer staying > on it. > I see all the mechanisms for storing the mixer on a shelf inside a > base > cabinet, but nothing for overhead storage. > > thanks, > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/darmstrong at nexicom.net From opposumking at verizon.net Wed Dec 22 07:38:20 2010 From: opposumking at verizon.net (Nolan) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2010 09:38:20 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Another Snow Blower Question References: <410-2201012221234641963@earthlink.net> Message-ID: Usually the auger sheer pins are grade 2 bolts. You want them soft to protect the gears. From jniolon at bham.rr.com Wed Dec 22 08:25:35 2010 From: jniolon at bham.rr.com (john niolon) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2010 09:25:35 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] dewalt battery charger testing Message-ID: <94C1A9538A554CAB9FB348C9022682F0@OwnerPC> I'm having trouble charging Dewalt batteries... some it may be old batteries but I'm wondering if my one hour charger is dying... Dewalt 9107 one hour charger when I put a meter across the contacts down in the charger I read NO d.c. voltage. although the battery is getting warm and slowly taking a charge... I had a completely dead 12v battery and started charging it with a hotter power supply 26volt for a few minutes... it came up to about 8 volts and I then stuck it in the 9107.... 4 hours later it's up to about 10 volts ??? This is a 2.8 amp charger and should do better than this... discounting a bad battery pack... how can I test the charger ??? thanks John Nothing says "Poor Workmanship" like wrinkles in your duct tape!! From dmscheidt at gmail.com Wed Dec 22 08:47:18 2010 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2010 10:47:18 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] dewalt battery charger testing In-Reply-To: <94C1A9538A554CAB9FB348C9022682F0@OwnerPC> References: <94C1A9538A554CAB9FB348C9022682F0@OwnerPC> Message-ID: On Wed, Dec 22, 2010 at 10:25 AM, john niolon wrote: > I'm having trouble charging Dewalt batteries... some it may be old batteries > but I'm wondering if my one hour charger is dying... B Dewalt 9107 B one hour > charger B when I put a meter across the contacts down in the charger I read NO > d.c. voltage. B although the battery is getting warm and slowly taking a > charge... I had a completely dead 12v battery and started charging it with a > hotter power supply 26volt B for a few minutes... it came up to about 8 volts > and I then stuck it in the 9107.... B 4 hours later it's up to about 10 volts > ??? B This is a 2.8 amp charger and should do better than this... B discounting > a bad battery pack... how can I test the charger ??? > As i recall, that's a multi-voltage charger. The batteries have terminals that tell the charger which voltage they are, depending on how they're wired. I have no idea what the pinouts are, but I'll say this: if it works at all, it's fine, and your battery is shot. (There are basically two failure modes with this sort of battery charger: dead, and fire.) Test it with a known good pack. If you don't have a known good pack, tis the season for good deals on new drills... -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From wmc_st at xxiii.com Wed Dec 22 09:00:35 2010 From: wmc_st at xxiii.com (Wayne) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2010 11:00:35 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] dewalt battery charger testing In-Reply-To: <94C1A9538A554CAB9FB348C9022682F0@OwnerPC> References: <94C1A9538A554CAB9FB348C9022682F0@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <4D1220A3.6030804@xxiii.com> On 12/22/2010 10:25 AM, john niolon wrote: > I'm having trouble charging Dewalt batteries... some it may be old batteries > but I'm wondering if my one hour charger is dying... Dewalt 9107 one hour > charger when I put a meter across the contacts down in the charger I read NO > d.c. voltage. although the battery is getting warm and slowly taking a > charge... I had a completely dead 12v battery and started charging it with a I actually read the instructions (little embarrassed to say..) last week for a DeWalt drill I own. Surprised to see the warning that the charger has "AC line voltage present at the terminals." Hmmm... So I ignored the warnings "not to probe the charger's terminals" and stuck the multimeter on it. On AC it read 100V one way, and zero with the probes swapped. On DC it read 50V. Wish I owned a 'scope; I do not. I *think* that means it has 100V peak to peak AC with a 50VDC bias on it??? I really need to buy a 'scope. If so, the DeWalt batteries must have internal rectifiers and regulation. Guess this is why you can charge any of the batteries on the same charger? -Wayne From arvidj at visi.com Wed Dec 22 09:11:30 2010 From: arvidj at visi.com (Arvid Jedlicka) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2010 10:11:30 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] dewalt battery charger testing In-Reply-To: References: <94C1A9538A554CAB9FB348C9022682F0@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <9AD0E79CA7ED4FC3BE631099DD079CDC@HP62011> I also think there is a temperature sensing terminal on the battery that the charger needs to see before it will apply a charge. At least there is on my Hitachi charger. So unless you can simulate a real battery in the charger socket you will get zero volts on the two battery terminals. Maybe some small wires jammed in along with the the battery will allow you to determine the charging voltage being applied to the battery. Of course I take no responsibility for the small wires going hay wire and causing the charger to assume either the dead or fire mode that David mentioned ;-} Arvid -----Original Message----- From: David Scheidt Sent: Wednesday, December 22, 2010 9:47 AM To: john niolon Cc: shop-talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] dewalt battery charger testing On Wed, Dec 22, 2010 at 10:25 AM, john niolon wrote: > I'm having trouble charging Dewalt batteries... some it may be old batteries > but I'm wondering if my one hour charger is dying... B Dewalt 9107 B one hour > charger B when I put a meter across the contacts down in the charger I > read NO > d.c. voltage. B although the battery is getting warm and slowly taking a > charge... I had a completely dead 12v battery and started charging it with a > hotter power supply 26volt B for a few minutes... it came up to about 8 volts > and I then stuck it in the 9107.... B 4 hours later it's up to about 10 volts > ??? B This is a 2.8 amp charger and should do better than this... B discounting > a bad battery pack... how can I test the charger ??? > As i recall, that's a multi-voltage charger. The batteries have terminals that tell the charger which voltage they are, depending on how they're wired. I have no idea what the pinouts are, but I'll say this: if it works at all, it's fine, and your battery is shot. (There are basically two failure modes with this sort of battery charger: dead, and fire.) Test it with a known good pack. If you don't have a known good pack, tis the season for good deals on new drills... -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com _______________________________________________ Shop-talk at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $12.96 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/arvidj at visi.com From pat at hornesystemstx.com Wed Dec 22 09:53:25 2010 From: pat at hornesystemstx.com (Pat Horne) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2010 10:53:25 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] dewalt battery charger testing In-Reply-To: <94C1A9538A554CAB9FB348C9022682F0@OwnerPC> References: <94C1A9538A554CAB9FB348C9022682F0@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <4D122D05.40309@hornesystemstx.com> If you have a DeWalt service center locally, they have a quick test they can run while you wait. Peace, Pat Thusly spake john niolon, On 12/22/2010 9:25 AM: > I'm having trouble charging Dewalt batteries... some it may be old batteries > but I'm wondering if my one hour charger is dying... Dewalt 9107 one hour > charger when I put a meter across the contacts down in the charger I read NO > d.c. voltage. although the battery is getting warm and slowly taking a > charge... I had a completely dead 12v battery and started charging it with a > hotter power supply 26volt for a few minutes... it came up to about 8 volts > and I then stuck it in the 9107.... 4 hours later it's up to about 10 volts > ??? This is a 2.8 amp charger and should do better than this... discounting > a bad battery pack... how can I test the charger ??? > > thanks > John > > > > > > > Nothing says "Poor Workmanship" like wrinkles in your duct tape!! > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pat at hornesystemstx.com > > > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- From jniolon at bham.rr.com Wed Dec 22 10:05:27 2010 From: jniolon at bham.rr.com (john niolon) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2010 11:05:27 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] dewalt battery charger testing In-Reply-To: <4D122D05.40309@hornesystemstx.com> References: <94C1A9538A554CAB9FB348C9022682F0@OwnerPC> <4D122D05.40309@hornesystemstx.com> Message-ID: never thought of that Pat.... short trip from work, I'll check it out thanks and Merry Christmas to all john ----- Original Message ----- From: "Pat Horne" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 22, 2010 10:53 AM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] dewalt battery charger testing > If you have a DeWalt service center locally, they have a quick test they > can run while you wait. > > Peace, > Pat > > Thusly spake john niolon, On 12/22/2010 9:25 AM: >> I'm having trouble charging Dewalt batteries... some it may be old >> batteries >> but I'm wondering if my one hour charger is dying... Dewalt 9107 one >> hour >> charger when I put a meter across the contacts down in the charger I >> read NO >> d.c. voltage. although the battery is getting warm and slowly taking a >> charge... I had a completely dead 12v battery and started charging it >> with a >> hotter power supply 26volt for a few minutes... it came up to about 8 >> volts >> and I then stuck it in the 9107.... 4 hours later it's up to about 10 >> volts >> ??? This is a 2.8 amp charger and should do better than this... >> discounting >> a bad battery pack... how can I test the charger ??? >> >> thanks >> John >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Nothing says "Poor Workmanship" like wrinkles in your duct tape!! >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe/Manage: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pat at hornesystemstx.com >> >> >> > > -- > Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems > (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 > Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 > www.hornesystemstx.com > -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jniolon at bham.rr.com > > > > ----- > No virus found in this message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 10.0.1188 / Virus Database: 426/3331 - Release Date: 12/22/10 From bk13 at earthlink.net Wed Dec 22 15:55:04 2010 From: bk13 at earthlink.net (Brian Kemp) Date: Wed, 22 Dec 2010 14:55:04 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] dewalt battery charger testing In-Reply-To: <94C1A9538A554CAB9FB348C9022682F0@OwnerPC> References: <94C1A9538A554CAB9FB348C9022682F0@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <4D1281C8.7060603@earthlink.net> John - If it went completely dead, I suspect the battery is done. There are some cures that someone here may suggest like shocking the battery with with a higher voltage, but don't expect miracles. If your battery is newer, there are probably screws to take it apart. Measure the voltage at individual cells and I expect you will find at least one dead. Some specialty electronics stores will sell replacement cells, but I suspect if you have one bad, the others are close. It may be better to just buy a replacement. A quick check at Amazon for "dewalt 12v battery" shows some for about $30. Don't know why they are so expensive. When the batteries from my first Dewalt 12V drill became worthless, it was actually cheaper to by a new drill with two batteries at Costco than get the batteries individually. As to measuring the voltage at the charger terminals, don't expect accurate readings without a load. You could take a couple fine wires as someone else suggested, but be careful you don't short anything or you will be in the marked for a charger as well. Brian On 12/22/2010 7:25 AM, john niolon wrote: > I'm having trouble charging Dewalt batteries... some it may be old batteries > but I'm wondering if my one hour charger is dying... Dewalt 9107 one hour > charger when I put a meter across the contacts down in the charger I read NO > d.c. voltage. although the battery is getting warm and slowly taking a > charge... I had a completely dead 12v battery and started charging it with a > hotter power supply 26volt for a few minutes... it came up to about 8 volts > and I then stuck it in the 9107.... 4 hours later it's up to about 10 volts > ??? This is a 2.8 amp charger and should do better than this... discounting > a bad battery pack... how can I test the charger ??? > > thanks > John > > > > > > > Nothing says "Poor Workmanship" like wrinkles in your duct tape!! > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bk13 at earthlink.net From eric at megageek.com Wed Dec 29 14:19:39 2010 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2010 16:19:39 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Truck cross reference challenge Message-ID: Ok, here is the deal. I have a light duty Snowbear plow for my Ford Explorer (I just plow my driveway, so I don't need anything bigger.) I wanted to be able to mount this on my 1998 GMC 3500 (SC3) truck. This truck isn't 4 wheel drive so I can't really put a bigger/heavy duty plow on it. Plus I already own the snowbear. Here is the problem. I can't find my truck listed in their product guide for a mounting bracket. Here is their mount guide... http://www.snowbear.com/images/stories/contents/snowplow/pdf/Mount-Guide-2010.pdf Is there anyway to know if one of these will fit on my 3500? With the plow there is a "cross member" which is a steel plate with two 1" nubs sticking out of the front and that is what the plow connects to. I would hope to have another plate so I can mount the plow to either truck if I need to so since I'll be making a cross member, I don't mind twiking the frame mounts for the plow to fit so if I can find one that is 'close' to my truck I'll be fine. Thanks in advance. Moose "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson From jdinnis at gmail.com Wed Dec 29 14:47:48 2010 From: jdinnis at gmail.com (John Innis) Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2010 15:47:48 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Truck cross reference challenge In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Don't know about this type of plow, but I think the Uni-Mount system from western uses the same truck-side mount for the 1/2, 3/4 and 1-ton Chevy's until 99. If this system attaches to the frame the same as the western plows do, the mount they list for the 1/2 ton should work. On Wed, Dec 29, 2010 at 3:19 PM, wrote: > Ok, here is the deal. I have a light duty Snowbear plow for my Ford > Explorer (I just plow my driveway, so I don't need anything bigger.) > > I wanted to be able to mount this on my 1998 GMC 3500 (SC3) truck. This > truck isn't 4 wheel drive so I can't really put a bigger/heavy duty plow > on it. Plus I already own the snowbear. > > Here is the problem. I can't find my truck listed in their product guide > for a mounting bracket. > > Here is their mount guide... > > http://www.snowbear.com/images/stories/contents/snowplow/pdf/Mount-Guide-2010 .pdf > > > Is there anyway to know if one of these will fit on my 3500? With the > plow there is a "cross member" which is a steel plate with two 1" nubs > sticking out of the front and that is what the plow connects to. > > I would hope to have another plate so I can mount the plow to either truck > if I need to so since I'll be making a cross member, I don't mind twiking > the frame mounts for the plow to fit so if I can find one that is 'close' > to my truck I'll be fine. > > Thanks in advance. > > Moose > "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational > being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph > Waldo Emerson > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis at gmail.com > > -- ================================= = Never offend people with style when you = = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown = ================================= From arvidj at visi.com Wed Dec 29 15:47:45 2010 From: arvidj at visi.com (Arvid Jedlicka) Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2010 16:47:45 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Update on ... Need some thoughts an a snow blower that will not run ... In-Reply-To: <4D0FF6B2.8020701@tx.rr.com> References: <171202711.18391.1292706801062.JavaMail.root@sz0119a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net><90749A1D78284063910CCA07ED9D22CD@HP62011> <003c01cba069$67c75cc0$37561640$@ameritech.net> <4D0FF6B2.8020701@tx.rr.com> Message-ID: <7F4EFBB7D23346E7AF344CF7F847ABBB@HP62011> Well the snow blower is now running reasonably well. Things I learned or confirmed ... This list is a great resource. That NAPA actually has carb kits for these things on hand. The motor was a Tecumseh HS-50 which is a pretty ubiquitous device. The carb was a "Series 1" carb of which there appear to be multiple flavors but all share the basics pieces so even I could not get it wrong. NAPA's "Carb Cleaner in a gallon can with a basket" does a great job on just about everything ... but where it fails is important. The directions suggest soaking for 15 to 20 minutes. After a 24 hour soak there was still crap in several important ports that required a toothpick and\or very small wire to open up. I think it was Randal that pointed out the newer gas leaves deposits that even the best carb cleaners will not remove. I think this is evidence that the statement is true!! When looking at the brass fitting that is part of the high speed jet system, there is one large port that may need to be cleaned by hand and there is one very small port that is very easy to miss but will also need to be cleaned by hand. Don't forget to take out the soft needle seat before putting the body of the carb into the carb cleaner. If you think you removed it ... or looked in the port and didn't see it so you didn't think there is one to be remove ... then rest assured it will no longer be there after the soak ... and rest assured that NAPA has a needle and seat available for less than the price of a beer. So all in all it was an interesting exercise that took about a week to resolve. But now the neighbor is happy he has a snow blower that works. Not that he was ever in any danger of being snowed in as I usually do his and several other driveways when I do mine with the tractor. Again, thanks to the list for all the advise, Arvid From eric at megageek.com Thu Dec 30 18:31:25 2010 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2010 20:31:25 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Removing a large freezer Message-ID: In my basement, there is a huge chest freezer down there. I'm not sure how it got there, because it doesn't seem to want to fix any doors to go out. I need to remove it and I was wondering what is the best way to reduce it's size with the least amount of mess? Can I cut it up? bend it somehow? Any ideas? (I was planning on scraping whatever materials I can when I'm done.) Thanks. Moose "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson From ejrussell at mebtel.net Thu Dec 30 19:18:12 2010 From: ejrussell at mebtel.net (Eric J Russell) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2010 21:18:12 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Removing a large freezer In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Unless the house was built around it it must have gone in somehow. If the freezer's door/lid is removed will it fit through a door? If the room's door is removed will it fit? How close are we measurement-wise? Eric Russell Mebane, NC http://home.mebtel.net/~ejrussell ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, December 30, 2010 8:31 PM Subject: [Shop-talk] Removing a large freezer > In my basement, there is a huge chest freezer down there. I'm not sure > how it got there, because it doesn't seem to want to fix any doors to go > out. From wmc_st at xxiii.com Thu Dec 30 21:17:51 2010 From: wmc_st at xxiii.com (Wayne) Date: Thu, 30 Dec 2010 23:17:51 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Removing a large freezer In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4D1D596F.6030500@xxiii.com> On 12/30/2010 8:31 PM, eric at megageek.com wrote: > In my basement, there is a huge chest freezer down there. I'm not sure > how it got there, because it doesn't seem to want to [fit] any doors to go > out. Is it the kind with the lift-up door on top? Maybe if you remove the door, and flip it on its side it would clear the door? (esp if you took the door off the hinges.) Guess it's quite possible it's been there since before the finished basement was done. You could take a sawzall to it, but the foam / fiberglass insulation and the plastic would make a heck of a mess. -Wayne From eric at megageek.com Fri Dec 31 02:40:02 2010 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2010 04:40:02 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fw: Removing a large freezer Message-ID: I guess I should have explained the situation better. More than likely, this freezer was brought into the basement through an access door for the wood storage area. Since it was put in, a huge, wood fired boiler has been installed in the house. That is why the chest freezer is still in the house when they sold it. Thanks for all the advice. I'll let you know how it turns out. Moose "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson From bk13 at earthlink.net Fri Dec 31 10:24:12 2010 From: bk13 at earthlink.net (Brian Kemp) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2010 09:24:12 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fw: Removing a large freezer In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4D1E11BC.2090105@earthlink.net> How about finding an alternate purpose. I think you said it was a chest freezer. How about an oversize parts washer or sandblast cabinet? If it is old enough to be sturdy, you could also put a big plywood top on it to be an assembly table. If you have a big dog, put a drain in and use it as a dog bath. I think you said something about rescue diving. With a drain, it could also be used as a big tub to clean you dive gear. If you garden, put dirt in it and use a grow light to start your plants inside in the winter. Brian On 12/31/2010 1:40 AM, eric at megageek.com wrote: > I guess I should have explained the situation better. > > More than likely, this freezer was brought into the basement through an > access door for the wood storage area. Since it was put in, a huge, wood > fired boiler has been installed in the house. That is why the chest > freezer is still in the house when they sold it. > > Thanks for all the advice. I'll let you know how it turns out. > > Moose > "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational > being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph > Waldo Emerson > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bk13 at earthlink.net From pat at hornesystemstx.com Fri Dec 31 10:50:53 2010 From: pat at hornesystemstx.com (Pat Horne) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2010 11:50:53 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fw: Removing a large freezer In-Reply-To: <4D1E11BC.2090105@earthlink.net> References: <4D1E11BC.2090105@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <4D1E17FD.3070901@hornesystemstx.com> I agree with Brian. Repurposing it may be a good thing. How about dry storage for tools or things that you don't use very often that could get damaged or eaten just sitting in a box or on a shelf? Be sure to put the drain plug in so that rodents won't be able to get in. If you want to convert into vertical storage, just build a base the size of one end and remove the lid springs. The magnetic gasket should hold it shut. You could also remove the compressor to save weight and sell it for scrap, just be sure to recycle the freon before you cut the lines. Peace, Pat Thusly spake Brian Kemp, On 12/31/2010 11:24 AM: > How about finding an alternate purpose. I think you said it was a > chest freezer. How about an oversize parts washer or sandblast > cabinet? If it is old enough to be sturdy, you could also put a big > plywood top on it to be an assembly table. If you have a big dog, put > a drain in and use it as a dog bath. I think you said something about > rescue diving. With a drain, it could also be used as a big tub to > clean you dive gear. If you garden, put dirt in it and use a grow > light to start your plants inside in the winter. > > Brian > > On 12/31/2010 1:40 AM, eric at megageek.com wrote: >> I guess I should have explained the situation better. >> >> More than likely, this freezer was brought into the basement through an >> access door for the wood storage area. Since it was put in, a huge, >> wood >> fired boiler has been installed in the house. That is why the chest >> freezer is still in the house when they sold it. >> >> Thanks for all the advice. I'll let you know how it turns out. >> >> Moose >> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a >> rational >> being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph >> Waldo Emerson >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe/Manage: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bk13 at earthlink.net > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pat at hornesystemstx.com > > > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- From marka at maracing.com Fri Dec 31 12:55:58 2010 From: marka at maracing.com (Mark Andy) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2010 14:55:58 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Shop-talk] Fw: Removing a large freezer In-Reply-To: <4D1E17FD.3070901@hornesystemstx.com> References: <4D1E11BC.2090105@earthlink.net> <4D1E17FD.3070901@hornesystemstx.com> Message-ID: Howdy, In the time you've spent asking the question here, I'd have cut it in half with a sawzall and would have already swept up the mess. :-) Mark From pj_thomas at comcast.net Fri Dec 31 13:24:28 2010 From: pj_thomas at comcast.net (Peter J. Thomas) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2010 15:24:28 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fw: Removing a large freezer In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4D1E3BFC.1080609@comcast.net> On 12/31/2010 4:40 AM, eric at megageek.com wrote: > I guess I should have explained the situation better. > > More than likely, this freezer was brought into the basement through an > access door for the wood storage area. Since it was put in, a huge, wood > fired boiler has been installed in the house. That is why the chest > freezer is still in the house when they sold it. > > Thanks for all the advice. I'll let you know how it turns out. Not sure if you can't get around the furnace or it won't fit though the door. If the latter and you only need an inch or so, consider removing the door AND FRAME. The rough opening is at least two inches wider, probably more, than the frame opening. Removing and rehanging a door isn't that difficult, probably easier than cutting up the freezer. Just mark where the trim goes so you can rehang the frame in the original location. Alternately you could disassemble the freezer. Once the outer skin is removed it may fit through the door. Peter T. > Moose > "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational > being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph > Waldo Emerson > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pj_thomas at comcast.net From cavanadd at frontier.com Fri Dec 31 14:23:28 2010 From: cavanadd at frontier.com (David C.) Date: Fri, 31 Dec 2010 13:23:28 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fw: Removing a large freezer In-Reply-To: References: <4D1E11BC.2090105@earthlink.net> <4D1E17FD.3070901@hornesystemstx.com> Message-ID: <4D1E49D0.8030608@frontier.com> Yup. Sounds like a good reason to get a half rack, a couple of buds and a sawzall... Mark Andy wrote: > In the time you've spent asking the question here, I'd have cut it in > half with a sawzall and would have already swept up the mess.