From jniolon at bham.rr.com Sat Mar 1 06:26:14 2008 From: jniolon at bham.rr.com (john niolon) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 07:26:14 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] drilling holes in sheetmetal Message-ID: <017601c87b9f$d30f9750$6401a8c0@niolon> 10 gauge is pretty thick for a cheap knockout 0.139" that's better than a 1/8". I doubt that the HF punches would hold up long cutting that...Greenlee yes, but HF ?? I'd go with the unibit or the holesaw since cosmetics isn't that important and keep my punches for lighter stuff that has to be pretty. john Free your heart from hate. Free your mind from worry. Live simple, give more, expect less From jandkstone99 at msn.com Sat Mar 1 10:27:52 2008 From: jandkstone99 at msn.com (Jim Stone) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 11:27:52 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers Message-ID: My parents have a gas light in front of their house that was converted years ago to run off DC current. The conversion seems to be through some sort of kit. It uses two bulbs that look to be standard 12V automotive light bulbs and a 24V DC transformer. It has worked fine for about 30 years, but recently stopped working. I checked the transformer and it had died, so I replaced it with a standard Home Depot door bell transformer with selectable voltages of 8V, 16V or 24V. The original transformer was a plug-in type and whoever installed the conversion kit simply hard wired the last foot of an extension cord into an existing junction box and plugged it in. I removed that cord and properly attached the new transformer to the same junction box and hooked up the old wires to the light. The light worked for about 10 minutes, then quit. I checked the transformer and it was dead. I knew my wiring was good, so I took the transformer back and exchanged it for another one. That one died just as quickly. I thought HD may have gotten a bad batch of transformers so I returned that one and bought an identical one at Lowes. This time, I wired it to a plug and plugged it in at my house. I ran it for several hours with no problems, so I installed it at my parents. It blew within about 10 minutes. The problem definitely exists there. Here's what I know. The original circuit where the transformer is located is a 20 amp circuit. Certainly overkill for the porch light, but the original installer probably used it because it was close to where the wire came in. The circuit breaker has never tripped. I put my voltmeter on the line and it registers 120V, the same as my house. The line is ungrounded. I don't know what else is on that line, but know it is nothing used frequently as I forgot to flip the power back on and no one noticed when it was off for a week. I can try putting a new one on a different circuit, but hate to blow a fifth one without knowing why the first four (including the original one) have all died. Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions? As always, Thanks! Jim _________________________________________________________________ Shed those extra pounds with MSN and The Biggest Loser! http://biggestloser.msn.com/ From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Sat Mar 1 10:50:28 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 09:50:28 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20080301175029.YYYA10598.mta9.adelphia.net@randall> > a 24V DC transformer. Any idea why the DC ? I know there are transformers that have rectifiers inside (so the output is DC with a lot of ripple), but can't see why it would matter in this application. > so I replaced it with a standard Home Depot door > bell transformer with selectable voltages of 8V, 16V or 24V. So you converted to AC ? Or is there an external rectifier somewhere ? If so, might there also be a capacitor (which will derate the transformer) ? > Does anyone have > any ideas or suggestions? I'd be looking at the load side of the transformer, rather than the source side. Maybe figure out how much current the one you used is rated for, and put in a fuse for that current. Also wondering how much continuous load a "door bell" transformer will take. Did you have a load on it when you tried it at your house ? Randall From jblair1948 at cox.net Sat Mar 1 11:09:16 2008 From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T. Blair) Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 13:09:16 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20080301130916.00a5c690@pop.east.cox.net> At 11:27 AM 3/1/2008 -0600, Jim Stone wrote: >My parents have a gas light in front of their house that was converted years >ago to run off DC current. The conversion seems to be through some sort of >kit. It uses two bulbs that look to be standard 12V automotive light bulbs >and a 24V DC transformer.... >so I replaced it with a standard Home Depot door bell transformer with >selectable voltages of 8V, 16V or 24V.The light worked for about 10 minutes, >then quit. I checked the transformer and it was dead. I knew my wiring was >good, so I took the transformer back and exchanged it for another one..... >I can try putting a new one on a different circuit, but hate to blow a fifth >one without knowing why the first four (including the original one) have all >died. Does anyone have any ideas or suggestions? Jim, My guess is that you are drawing a lot more current for the 2 light bulbs than the door bell chime does. Is there anything on the door bell xformer that lists is current - ie 1A or 200ma? Next you'll want to disconnect the wires from the xformer and using the Ohms setting of your multi meter measure the resistance between the 2 wires. This will tell you what the cold resistance of the wire & 2 bulbs is. >From that you can calculate about how much power you need to supply. V = I * R , You'll now V = 24, the Resistance of the bulbs is R, so I = V/R. Now you know the current that you'll require. Then I'd go with a safety factor of 2 or 2 times as much current as the calculations say. The other possibility is, are the bulbs marked as to how many watts they are? If so, then Power = V * I. So if we assume the bulbs are 20w each, you are using 40W of power. So I = P/V, or 40/24V is approximately 2 amps of current. Again, double the 2 amps and find a 24V xformer that will handle 4 amps. I think you'll find that your bell xformer is rated at either 250 or 500 ma or 1/4 to 1/2 amp max. So you are trying to get it to output at least 4X what it can handle. John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/www/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From james.f.juhas at snet.net Sat Mar 1 11:32:36 2008 From: james.f.juhas at snet.net (Jim Juhas) Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 13:32:36 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.20080301130916.00a5c690@pop.east.cox.net> References: <3.0.5.32.20080301130916.00a5c690@pop.east.cox.net> Message-ID: <47C9A144.5010802@snet.net> The cold current calculation (with V = I * R) will be higher than the running current, and this failure occurs after it's been running for a while. The P = E * I is a better indicator of what you are working with. John T. Blair wrote: > > Next you'll want to disconnect the wires from the xformer and using the Ohms > setting of your multi meter measure the resistance between the 2 wires. > This will tell you what the cold resistance of the wire & 2 bulbs is. > > >From that you can calculate about how much power you need to supply. > > V = I * R , You'll now V = 24, the Resistance of the bulbs is R, so > I = V/R. Now you know the current that you'll require. Then I'd go > with a safety factor of 2 or 2 times as much current as the calculations > say. > > The other possibility is, are the bulbs marked as to how many watts they > are? If so, then Power = V * I. So if we assume the bulbs are 20w each, > you are using 40W of power. So I = P/V, or 40/24V is approximately 2 amps > of current. Again, double the 2 amps and find a 24V xformer that will handle > 4 amps. > > I think you'll find that your bell xformer is rated at either 250 or 500 ma > or 1/4 to 1/2 amp max. So you are trying to get it to output at least 4X > what it can handle. > > John > > > John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net > Va. Beach, Va > Phone: (757) 495-8229 > > 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) > 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III > 65 Rambler Classic > > Morgan: www.team.net/www/morgan > Bricklin: www.bricklin.org > > If you can read this - Thank a teacher! > If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as james.f.juhas at snet.net > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive From rlwhitetr3b at hotmail.com Sat Mar 1 13:09:42 2008 From: rlwhitetr3b at hotmail.com (Rich White) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 14:09:42 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers Message-ID: Jim, I think your problem is that the replacement transformer is not up to the job. As others has said you could calculate the cold resistance, but maybe it would be better to measure the current before dies. When picking out a replacement, you have to look at the continuous load rating. A door bell would be a very short duration load and I would not expect the transformer to handle its rated output continuously.Rich White St. Joseph, IL USA '63 TR3B TCF587L That ain't a scrap pile, that is my car! See it moves! From jandkstone99 at msn.com Sat Mar 1 14:41:12 2008 From: jandkstone99 at msn.com (Jim Stone) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 15:41:12 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks guys. I suspect this is the problem. I did discover shortly after posting this that I was mistaken about the transformers being DC; both the original one and the doorbell ones are AC. Fortunately, I decided to save the original one until I had permanently fixed the light. The original transformer output is 24VAC-50VA, while the doorbell one is 24VAC-20VA. Not four times as John suspected, but I am sure that 2.5 times is way too much. Plus, as everyone guesses, the doorbell ones are almost definitely not designed for a continuous load. Now, I just have to find the right transformer. I don't think any of the big box stores carry them; I'll do a little surfing and see what I can come up with. Thanks again. > From: rlwhitetr3b at hotmail.com > To: shop-talk at autox.team.net > Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 14:09:42 -0600 > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers > > Jim, > > I think your problem is that the replacement transformer is not up to the > job. > As others has said you could calculate the cold resistance, but maybe it would > be better to measure the current before dies. > > When picking out a replacement, you have to look at the continuous load > rating. A door bell would be a very short duration load and I would not > expect the transformer to handle its rated output continuously.Rich White St. > Joseph, IL USA > '63 TR3B TCF587L > That ain't a scrap pile, that is my car! > See it moves! > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as jandkstone99 at msn.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive _________________________________________________________________ Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM, we give. http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/Home/?source=text_hotmail_join From jblair1948 at cox.net Sat Mar 1 15:26:28 2008 From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T. Blair) Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 17:26:28 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20080301172628.00a61388@pop.east.cox.net> At 03:41 PM 3/1/2008 -0600, Jim Stone wrote: >The original transformer output is 24VAC-50VA, while the doorbell one is >24VAC-20VA. If that's the case, it means you are drawing a little over2 amps, P = 24 * 2 = 48. You should be able to find one at radio shack. But I just checked their web site, and I don't see any transformers for building things, only to convert European to American. I find that hard to believe. But... If you have any electronic house in your area, they should be able to sell you a transformer. Connect the primary side to the 120, and the output 24V to the light wiring. Simple if you can find the xformer. Here's are some This one is a little over kill - but probably your best bet: 24 V.C.T. @ 5 AMP POWER TRANSFORMER CAT# @ $ 20.50 each - TX-245 http://www.allelectronics.com/cgi-bin/item/TX-245/790/24_V.C.T._%22#64;_5_AM P_POWER_TRANSFORMER_.html This one is marginal: 24 V.C.T. @ 2 AMP POWER TRANSFORMER @ $ 11.20 each - CAT# TX-242 http://www.allelectronics.com/cgi-bin/item/TX-242/790/24_V.C.T._%22#64;_2_AM P_POWER_TRANSFORMER_.html This is is OK: 24 VCT 4 AMPS @ $ 17.75 each - CAT# TX-244 http://www.allelectronics.com/cgi-bin/item/TX-244/790/24_VCT_4_AMPS_.html this one should do the trick nicely: 24 V.C.T. @ 3 AMP POWER TRANSFORMER @ $ 14.25 each - CAT# TX-243 http://www.allelectronics.com/cgi-bin/item/TX-243/790/24_V.C.T._%22#64;_3_AM P_POWER_TRANSFORMER_.html John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/www/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From strovato at optonline.net Sat Mar 1 15:28:49 2008 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 17:28:49 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] drilling holes in sheetmetal In-Reply-To: <017601c87b9f$d30f9750$6401a8c0@niolon> References: <017601c87b9f$d30f9750$6401a8c0@niolon> Message-ID: <0JX2009WTP49F8E0@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> He said 16 gauge (0.060") in the original post. At 08:26 AM 3/1/2008, john niolon wrote: >10 gauge is pretty thick for a cheap knockout 0.139" From roadsters at hornesystemstx.com Sat Mar 1 15:57:09 2008 From: roadsters at hornesystemstx.com (Pat Horne) Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 16:57:09 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47C9DF45.7030202@hornesystemstx.com> Just as a different way to express what I see as the problem. A doorbell transformer is used for short bursts and not continued use, therefore the 50VA that it is rated is probably not continuous duty, sort of like a welder. Radio shack used to sell lots of parts for electronics projects, but dropped them in favor of cell phone skins and other higher volume parts. As someone else stated, you may have to find an electronics parts store, but you can always order a transformer from Digi-key or Mouser. Another place to try would be an A/C supply parts store. They may have 24V transformers even though most furnaces I've seen have been 12V. I would suggest looking for a 3A or 4A transformer. Something else to try would be connecting a couple of car batteries in series and measuring the current draw of the light. Remove the light bulbs and make sure that the current drops to zero, indicating that the wires aren't shorted. Good luck and let us know what you find. Peace, Pat Thusly spake Jim Stone: > Thanks guys. I suspect this is the problem. I did discover shortly > after posting this that I was mistaken about the transformers being DC; > both the original one and the doorbell ones are AC. Fortunately, I > decided to save the original one until I had permanently fixed the light. > The > original transformer output is 24VAC-50VA, while the doorbell one is > 24VAC-20VA. Not four times as John suspected, but I am sure that 2.5 times is > way too much. Plus, as everyone guesses, the doorbell ones are almost > definitely not designed for a continuous load. Now, I just have to find the > right transformer. I don't think any of the big box stores carry them; I'll > do a little surfing and see what I can come up with. > > Thanks again. > > >> From: rlwhitetr3b at hotmail.com >> To: shop-talk at autox.team.net >> Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 14:09:42 -0600 >> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers >> >> Jim, >> >> I think your problem is that the replacement transformer is not up to the >> job. >> As others has said you could calculate the cold resistance, but maybe it >> > would > >> be better to measure the current before dies. >> >> When picking out a replacement, you have to look at the continuous load >> rating. A door bell would be a very short duration load and I would not >> expect the transformer to handle its rated output continuously.Rich White >> > St. > >> Joseph, IL USA >> '63 TR3B TCF587L >> That ain't a scrap pile, that is my car! >> See it moves! >> _______________________________________________ >> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> You are subscribed as jandkstone99 at msn.com >> >> Shop-talk mailing list >> >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk >> >> http://www.team.net/archive >> > > _________________________________________________________________ > Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM, we give. > http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/Home/?source=text_hotmail_join > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as roadsters at hornesystemstx.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive > > > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Sat Mar 1 16:30:14 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 15:30:14 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.20080301172628.00a61388@pop.east.cox.net> Message-ID: <20080301233013.UNQY9254.mta13.adelphia.net@randall> > Here's are some Or if used doesn't bother you, here's a nice unit on flea-bay : http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130202154142 Rated nearly twice what the original was (96va), and clearly continuous duty, so should last much longer. Randall From jandkstone99 at msn.com Sat Mar 1 17:02:11 2008 From: jandkstone99 at msn.com (Jim Stone) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 18:02:11 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: <20080301233013.UNQY9254.mta13.adelphia.net@randall> References: <3.0.5.32.20080301172628.00a61388@pop.east.cox.net> <20080301233013.UNQY9254.mta13.adelphia.net@randall> Message-ID: Thanks guys. Lots of good options online. I just came back from a little shopping and nothing seems available locally. Radio Shack does have a 1 amp unit that might do the trick, but I might as well go with the original size. I'm thinking about getting another plug in one, since that was what was there originally. Of course, I'll put a proper outlet on the junction box, rather then the way it was done originally. This looks like the best deal I've found: http://www.a1securitycameras.com/Vitek-VT-24VAC-50.html Alternatively, I wonder if this one would do the trick: http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-24-V-40-VA-Control-Transformer-Heating-Thermostat_W0Q QitemZ220206175461QQihZ012QQcategoryZ53296QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewIt em Its not quite as powerful, but would certainly be easy to install. > From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com > To: shop-talk at autox.team.net > Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 15:30:14 -0800 > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers > > > Here's are some > > Or if used doesn't bother you, here's a nice unit on flea-bay : > > http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130202154142 > > Rated nearly twice what the original was (96va), and clearly continuous > duty, so should last much longer. > > Randall > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as jandkstone99 at msn.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_Wave2_sharelife_012008 From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Sat Mar 1 17:27:48 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 16:27:48 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20080302002747.JKLG26616.mta10.adelphia.net@randall> From: Jim Stone [mailto:jandkstone99 at msn.com] > Alternatively, I wonder if this one would do the trick: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-24-V-40-VA-Control-Transformer-Heating-Thermostat_W0 QQitemZ220206175461QQihZ012QQcategoryZ53296QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZView Item > Its not quite as powerful, but would certainly be easy to install. I'm always suspicious when transformers fail; as normally they should last nearly forever. Going down in rating for a transformer that failed for no apparent reason seems like a bad idea to me. At the very least, I would want to check the actual load. A typical 1156 brake light bulb is rated for 2.1 amps, and 24 volts times 2.1 amps is 50.4va. But it's not unusual for a "24v" transformer to put out more than it's rated voltage (especially if the line input is above the minimum voltage, which it usually is), so the actual power may have been even higher. Caveat : If you mentioned what bulbs it has, I didn't notice. I'm just guessing that it might be a pair of 1156 as they are very common. But the point is that the original 50va unit may have already been overloaded, so the 40va would be even more so (and hence prone to early failure). Randall From jandkstone99 at msn.com Sat Mar 1 17:40:17 2008 From: jandkstone99 at msn.com (Jim Stone) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 18:40:17 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: <20080302002747.JKLG26616.mta10.adelphia.net@randall> References: <20080302002747.JKLG26616.mta10.adelphia.net@randall> Message-ID: Good point Randall. I won't go any lower. And while the original did fail, it was around 30 years old. That seems "nearly forever" in electrical terms. > From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com > To: shop-talk at autox.team.net > Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 16:27:48 -0800 > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers > > From: Jim Stone [mailto:jandkstone99 at msn.com] > > > Alternatively, I wonder if this one would do the trick: > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-24-V-40-VA-Control-Transformer-Heating-Thermostat_W0 > QQitemZ220206175461QQihZ012QQcategoryZ53296QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZView > Item > > > Its not quite as powerful, but would certainly be easy to install. > > I'm always suspicious when transformers fail; as normally they should last > nearly forever. Going down in rating for a transformer that failed for no > apparent reason seems like a bad idea to me. > > At the very least, I would want to check the actual load. A typical 1156 > brake light bulb is rated for 2.1 amps, and 24 volts times 2.1 amps is > 50.4va. But it's not unusual for a "24v" transformer to put out more than > it's rated voltage (especially if the line input is above the minimum > voltage, which it usually is), so the actual power may have been even > higher. > > Caveat : If you mentioned what bulbs it has, I didn't notice. I'm just > guessing that it might be a pair of 1156 as they are very common. But the > point is that the original 50va unit may have already been overloaded, so > the 40va would be even more so (and hence prone to early failure). > > Randall > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as jandkstone99 at msn.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive _________________________________________________________________ Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail.-get your "fix". http://www.msnmobilefix.com/Default.aspx From doug at dougbraun.com Sat Mar 1 17:44:25 2008 From: doug at dougbraun.com (Doug Braun) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 16:44:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <560652.92125.qm@web603.biz.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Can't you buy a transformer that is designed for low-voltage exterior lighting? Or: Can't the lamp be rewired to use regular 120 volt bulbs and not need a transformer at all? Doug --- Jim Stone wrote: > Thanks guys. I suspect this is the problem. I did > discover shortly > after posting this that I was mistaken about the > transformers being DC; > both the original one and the doorbell ones are AC. > Fortunately, I > decided to save the original one until I had > permanently fixed the light. From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Sat Mar 1 20:01:50 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 19:01:50 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20080302030150.HXAU2695.mta16.adelphia.net@randall> > And while the > original did fail, it was around 30 years old. That seems > "nearly forever" in electrical terms. My point of view : 30 years should be just getting started for a transformer. I have several of them in daily use that are pushing 50 (including the main line transformer for my house); and others that date from WWII. Not sure, but that old tube radio from my late wife's grandparents might be older than that, and it still works (well did, last time I fired it up). Randall From dmscheidt at gmail.com Sat Mar 1 20:13:23 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Sat, 1 Mar 2008 22:13:23 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: <20080302030150.HXAU2695.mta16.adelphia.net@randall> References: <20080302030150.HXAU2695.mta16.adelphia.net@randall> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803011913q1d3a638coc18fb4dccd70010f@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, Mar 1, 2008 at 10:01 PM, Randall wrote: > > And while the > > original did fail, it was around 30 years old. That seems > > "nearly forever" in electrical terms. > > My point of view : 30 years should be just getting started for a > transformer. I have several of them in daily use that are pushing 50 > (including the main line transformer for my house); and others that date > from WWII. Not sure, but that old tube radio from my late wife's > grandparents might be older than that, and it still works (well did, last > time I fired it up). I'm with Randall. An AC/AC transformer is just a hunk of iron with wire wrapped around it. No moving parts, not much that can fail. As long as they don't overheat, and don't get exposed to weather, they should last a century or three. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From james.f.juhas at snet.net Sat Mar 1 21:46:41 2008 From: james.f.juhas at snet.net (Jim Juhas) Date: Sat, 01 Mar 2008 23:46:41 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.5.32.20080301172628.00a61388@pop.east.cox.net> <20080301233013.UNQY9254.mta13.adelphia.net@randall> Message-ID: <47CA3131.3000304@snet.net> Jim: Take a look at what these guys have to offer. Follow through to the "transformer" pages. Some nice heavy duty options. I have always been satisfied with their stuff. Reliable and fast delivery. NFI. www.allelectronics.com Jim Stone wrote: > Thanks guys. Lots of good options online. I just came back from a little > shopping and nothing seems available locally. Radio Shack does have a 1 amp > unit that might do the trick, but I might as well go with the original size. > I'm thinking about getting another plug in one, since that was what was there > originally. Of course, I'll put a proper outlet on the junction box, rather > then the way it was done originally. This looks like the best deal I've > found: > > http://www.a1securitycameras.com/Vitek-VT-24VAC-50.html > > Alternatively, I wonder if this one would do the trick: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-24-V-40-VA-Control-Transformer-Heating-Thermostat_W0Q > QitemZ220206175461QQihZ012QQcategoryZ53296QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewIt > em > > Its not quite as powerful, but would certainly be easy to install. From trevor at boicey.com Sat Mar 1 22:28:11 2008 From: trevor at boicey.com (Trevor Boicey) Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2008 00:28:11 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: <2400a5d40803011913q1d3a638coc18fb4dccd70010f@mail.gmail.com> References: <20080302030150.HXAU2695.mta16.adelphia.net@randall> <2400a5d40803011913q1d3a638coc18fb4dccd70010f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47CA3AEB.7020408@boicey.com> David Scheidt wrote: > I'm with Randall. An AC/AC transformer is just a hunk of iron with > wire wrapped around it. No moving parts, not much that can fail. As > long as they don't overheat, and don't get exposed to weather, they > should last a century or three. Agreed, but who knows what else is in there that won't last 30 years... some glues or something holding it together, some primitive plastic insulators, who knows. Something gets old and cracks, humidity gets in, corrosion.... Iron plus air doesn't last forever... From jandkstone99 at msn.com Sun Mar 2 07:20:17 2008 From: jandkstone99 at msn.com (Jim Stone) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 08:20:17 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: <47CA3AEB.7020408@boicey.com> References: <20080302030150.HXAU2695.mta16.adelphia.net@randall> <2400a5d40803011913q1d3a638coc18fb4dccd70010f@mail.gmail.com> <47CA3AEB.7020408@boicey.com> Message-ID: The original ones does say "Warning: Fused secondary. Do not short." so there is a little more than iron and wire in there. I have thought about opening it up and seeing if the fuse could be replaced, but have not. At least not yet. > Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 00:28:11 -0500 > From: trevor at boicey.com > To: dmscheidt at gmail.com > CC: shop-talk at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers > > David Scheidt wrote: > > I'm with Randall. An AC/AC transformer is just a hunk of iron with > > wire wrapped around it. No moving parts, not much that can fail. As > > long as they don't overheat, and don't get exposed to weather, they > > should last a century or three. > > Agreed, but who knows what else is in there that won't last 30 > years... some glues or something holding it together, some primitive > plastic insulators, who knows. > > Something gets old and cracks, humidity gets in, corrosion.... > > Iron plus air doesn't last forever... > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as jandkstone99 at msn.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_Wave2_sharelife_012008 From rlwhitetr3b at hotmail.com Sun Mar 2 08:53:24 2008 From: rlwhitetr3b at hotmail.com (Rich White) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 09:53:24 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: <47CA3AEB.7020408@boicey.com> References: <20080302030150.HXAU2695.mta16.adelphia.net@randall> <2400a5d40803011913q1d3a638coc18fb4dccd70010f@mail.gmail.com> <47CA3AEB.7020408@boicey.com> Message-ID: If the new one lasts 30 years, will anyone on this list care when it breaks?Rich White St. Joseph, IL USA '63 TR3B TCF587L That ain't a scrap pile, that is my car! See it moves! From jandkstone99 at msn.com Sun Mar 2 09:21:02 2008 From: jandkstone99 at msn.com (Jim Stone) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 10:21:02 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: References: <20080302030150.HXAU2695.mta16.adelphia.net@randall> <2400a5d40803011913q1d3a638coc18fb4dccd70010f@mail.gmail.com> <47CA3AEB.7020408@boicey.com> Message-ID: My father will be 121 and my mother 120. I doubt they will be too concerned. I, on the other hand, will be a young and active 85 and plan on driving by the house regularly to make sure the light is still on! > From: rlwhitetr3b at hotmail.com > To: shop-talk at autox.team.net > Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 09:53:24 -0600 > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers > > If the new one lasts 30 years, will anyone on this list care when it > breaks?Rich White St. Joseph, IL USA > '63 TR3B TCF587L > That ain't a scrap pile, that is my car! > See it moves! > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as jandkstone99 at msn.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive _________________________________________________________________ Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM, we give. http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/Home/?source=text_hotmail_join From jblair1948 at cox.net Sun Mar 2 10:21:46 2008 From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T. Blair) Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2008 12:21:46 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: References: <47CA3AEB.7020408@boicey.com> <20080302030150.HXAU2695.mta16.adelphia.net@randall> <2400a5d40803011913q1d3a638coc18fb4dccd70010f@mail.gmail.com> <47CA3AEB.7020408@boicey.com> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20080302122146.00a67a48@pop.east.cox.net> At 08:20 AM 3/2/2008 -0600, Jim Stone wrote: >The original ones does say "Warning: Fused secondary. Do not short." so >there is a little more than iron and wire in there. I have thought about >opening it up and seeing if the fuse could be replaced, but have not. At >least not yet. Jim, This is a pretty common thing to happen. I don't know if you remeber the old TRS80 Model I computers. But they had a transformer to suppy power to the keyboard computer. It had a fuse inside it. (I don't remember is it was on the primary or secondary.) These fuses would blow, and then your computer didn't work. The energetic owners learned to cut the Xformer case open and replace the fuse. John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/www/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From bobkegel at seanet.com Sun Mar 2 10:37:50 2008 From: bobkegel at seanet.com (Bob Kegel) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 09:37:50 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000001c87c8c$263ee1a0$0200a8c0@8sv5f01> > If the new one lasts 30 years, will anyone on this list care > when it breaks? They were saying that about our cars 30 years ago. Bob Kegel 1970 BMW 2002 From nick at landform.co.uk Sun Mar 2 10:51:56 2008 From: nick at landform.co.uk (Nick Brearley) Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2008 17:51:56 +0000 Subject: [Shop-talk] Drilling holes in sheet metal In-Reply-To: <47CAE6E7.1090307@yahoo.co.uk> References: <84159.64259.qm@web612.biz.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <47CAE6E7.1090307@yahoo.co.uk> Message-ID: <47CAE93C.1030307@landform.co.uk> njb wrote: > Doug Braun wrote: >> Hello, >> >> What's the best way to drill a nice clean, round 3/4" >> hole in 16 gauge (0.060") sheet steel? This a car >> body, so it would be hard to back up the hole with >> anything. >> > Belated reply to this one. Bought a metric set of these a long time > ago when they were on a clearance offer: > > http://www.hougen.com/cutters/sheetmetal/Rotacut.html > > Very happy with the performance. Whether they will ever pay for > themselves is another matter... > > Nick Brearley From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Sun Mar 2 11:04:31 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 10:04:31 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20080302180430.CJIM14551.mta11.adelphia.net@randall> > If the new one lasts 30 years, will anyone on this list care > when it breaks? Perhaps not. But as both a craftsman and aficionado of antiques, I like to build things that last as long as possible. "Planned obsolescence" is for Sony, not me. And, since "They don't build them like they used to" is such a clichi, who's to say that a 2000 transformer will live as long with a slight overload as a 1970 transformer did ? Randall From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Sun Mar 2 11:07:02 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 10:07:02 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20080302180702.CXAY2695.mta16.adelphia.net@randall> > The original ones does say "Warning: Fused secondary. Do not > short." so there is a little more than iron and wire in > there. Oh well, that's a different story. Fuses do sometimes get old and fail even within their normal limits. Randall From dmscheidt at gmail.com Sun Mar 2 11:38:46 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 13:38:46 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: References: <20080302030150.HXAU2695.mta16.adelphia.net@randall> <2400a5d40803011913q1d3a638coc18fb4dccd70010f@mail.gmail.com> <47CA3AEB.7020408@boicey.com> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803021038w51242cf8iae532b14f1e1aea3@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 2, 2008 at 9:20 AM, Jim Stone wrote: > The original ones does say "Warning: Fused secondary. Do not short." so > there is a little more than iron and wire in there. I have thought about > opening it up and seeing if the fuse could be replaced, but have not. At > least not yet. > It certainly won't hurt to try. It's old enough it's probably designed to be opened. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From parkanzky at gmail.com Sun Mar 2 11:54:54 2008 From: parkanzky at gmail.com (Paul Parkanzky) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 13:54:54 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: References: <20080302030150.HXAU2695.mta16.adelphia.net@randall> <2400a5d40803011913q1d3a638coc18fb4dccd70010f@mail.gmail.com> <47CA3AEB.7020408@boicey.com> Message-ID: Well, I'm 31. What if I buy that house? On 3/2/08, Rich White wrote: > If the new one lasts 30 years, will anyone on this list care when it > breaks?Rich White St. Joseph, IL USA > > '63 TR3B TCF587L > That ain't a scrap pile, that is my car! > See it moves! From cak at dimebank.com Sun Mar 2 12:04:58 2008 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2008 11:04:58 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Drilling holes in sheet metal In-Reply-To: <47CAE93C.1030307@landform.co.uk> References: <84159.64259.qm@web612.biz.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <47CAE6E7.1090307@yahoo.co.uk> <47CAE93C.1030307@landform.co.uk> Message-ID: <47CAFA5A.4010304@dimebank.com> Nick Brearley wrote: > njb wrote: >> Doug Braun wrote: >>> Hello, >>> >>> What's the best way to drill a nice clean, round 3/4" >>> hole in 16 gauge (0.060") sheet steel? This a car >>> body, so it would be hard to back up the hole with >>> anything. >>> >> Belated reply to this one. Bought a metric set of these a long time >> ago when they were on a clearance offer: >> >> http://www.hougen.com/cutters/sheetmetal/Rotacut.html >> >> Very happy with the performance. Whether they will ever pay for >> themselves is another matter... >> I'll second that - I have a set of these (then called Rotabroach, but the same item) and they're really great. Not sure they work as well as a unibit on some materials - I have both. The unibit gives a wider range of sizes, but won't work on thick stuff. The rotacut can wander a bit. From jandkstone99 at msn.com Sun Mar 2 12:57:21 2008 From: jandkstone99 at msn.com (Jim Stone) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 13:57:21 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: References: <20080302030150.HXAU2695.mta16.adelphia.net@randall> <2400a5d40803011913q1d3a638coc18fb4dccd70010f@mail.gmail.com> <47CA3AEB.7020408@boicey.com> Message-ID: You will know just what to do - and not to do - when it fails in 2038. > Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 13:54:54 -0500 > From: parkanzky at gmail.com > To: rlwhitetr3b at hotmail.com > CC: shop-talk at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers > > Well, I'm 31. What if I buy that house? > > On 3/2/08, Rich White wrote: > > If the new one lasts 30 years, will anyone on this list care when it > > breaks?Rich White St. Joseph, IL USA > > > > '63 TR3B TCF587L > > That ain't a scrap pile, that is my car! > > See it moves! > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as jandkstone99 at msn.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGHM_Wave2_sharelife_012008 From jandkstone99 at msn.com Sun Mar 2 13:01:55 2008 From: jandkstone99 at msn.com (Jim Stone) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 14:01:55 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: <20080302180430.CJIM14551.mta11.adelphia.net@randall> References: <20080302180430.CJIM14551.mta11.adelphia.net@randall> Message-ID: > Perhaps not. But as both a craftsman and aficionado of antiques, I like to > build things that last as long as possible. "Planned obsolescence" is for > Sony, not me. Whenever I am doing something around the house, especially when it is something that is likely to be unseen for decades, I frequently think about what the then owner of the house will say when he sees it. I know I have frequently cursed the DPO of my houses; I never want someone cursing me or my work, even if I am long gone. _________________________________________________________________ Need to know the score, the latest news, or you need your Hotmail.-get your "fix". http://www.msnmobilefix.com/Default.aspx From cornerexit at gmail.com Sun Mar 2 16:00:33 2008 From: cornerexit at gmail.com (cornerexit) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 15:00:33 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fabric for gravel driveway Message-ID: <091301c87cb9$392c55e0$0201a8c0@Waynehouseputer> I need to put in a couple of gravel driveways on a couple of pieces of property this summer and was wondering what the fabric is that's used as an underlayment is called? Geo something? Somebody told me they use "dryer felt"? What the heck is dryer felt? Is this Geo fabric the same stuff that I see silt fences made out of? What type of store should I go to for this fabric? From pethier at comcast.net Sun Mar 2 16:14:25 2008 From: pethier at comcast.net (pethier at comcast.net) Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2008 23:14:25 +0000 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fabric for gravel driveway Message-ID: <030220082314.15182.47CB34D10001E6F800003B4E22007358349D0A07089B0A9F@comcast.net> Landscape Fabric? Lets water go down, does not let dirt come up. -- Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA 1962 Triumph TR4 CT2846L, 1992 Saturn SL2, 1993 Suburban, 1994 Miata C package pethier [at] comcast [dot] net http://forum.mnautox.com/forums/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/pethier I decry the textmessagization of the American-English language. -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: "cornerexit" > I need to put in a couple of gravel driveways on a couple of pieces of > property this summer and was wondering what the fabric is that's used as an > underlayment is called? Geo something? Somebody told me they use "dryer > felt"? What the heck is dryer felt? From gerrybraz at cablespeed.com Sun Mar 2 16:21:37 2008 From: gerrybraz at cablespeed.com (Gerald Brazil) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 18:21:37 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fabric for gravel driveway In-Reply-To: <091301c87cb9$392c55e0$0201a8c0@Waynehouseputer> Message-ID: <003501c87cbc$2cd101d0$0301a8c0@DADSTOY> Try A. M. Leonard https://www.amleo.com/ Look for landscape fabric. They sell professional level stuff...I have found them a good supplier. -----Original Message----- From: shop-talk-bounces+gerrybraz=cablespeed.com at autox.team.net [mailto:shop-talk-bounces+gerrybraz=cablespeed.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of cornerexit Sent: Sunday, March 02, 2008 6:01 PM To: 'Shop Talk' Subject: [Shop-talk] Fabric for gravel driveway I need to put in a couple of gravel driveways on a couple of pieces of property this summer and was wondering what the fabric is that's used as an underlayment is called? Geo something? Somebody told me they use "dryer felt"? What the heck is dryer felt? Is this Geo fabric the same stuff that I see silt fences made out of? What type of store should I go to for this fabric? You are subscribed as gerrybraz at cablespeed.com Shop-talk mailing list http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk http://www.team.net/archive From dmscheidt at gmail.com Sun Mar 2 16:57:51 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 18:57:51 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fabric for gravel driveway In-Reply-To: <091301c87cb9$392c55e0$0201a8c0@Waynehouseputer> References: <091301c87cb9$392c55e0$0201a8c0@Waynehouseputer> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803021557l63911907p7dcb77a81ad175b1@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 2, 2008 at 6:00 PM, cornerexit wrote: > I need to put in a couple of gravel driveways on a couple of pieces of > property this summer and was wondering what the fabric is that's used as an > underlayment is called? Geo something? Somebody told me they use "dryer > felt"? What the heck is dryer felt? > > > > Is this Geo fabric the same stuff that I see silt fences made out of? > "geo texile". Depending on what your subsoil is like, what the material you're building out of, and what kind traffic it's going to see, you may need it or not. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From shiples at comcast.net Sun Mar 2 17:12:17 2008 From: shiples at comcast.net (Steve Shipley) Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2008 16:12:17 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fabric for gravel driveway In-Reply-To: <091301c87cb9$392c55e0$0201a8c0@Waynehouseputer> Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20080302161125.0379f790@mail.comcast.net> At 03:00 PM 3/2/2008 -0800, cornerexit wrote: >I need to put in a couple of gravel driveways on a couple of pieces of >property this summer and was wondering what the fabric is that's used as an >underlayment is called? Geo something? Somebody told me they use "dryer >felt"? What the heck is dryer felt? I didn't think that fabric was used under driveways. In the past, I've used filter cloth for footing drains and weed block for landscaping. In my neighborhood, there's a lumberyard that's only open M-F 7-5. That's where I go when I want to know what the local professionals are doing. Pretty fun place to visit, the guys who work there are kind of proud that their hours of business determines what kind of customer they serve. I sent a girlfriend to run an errand for me and apparently they were quite rude. From wmc_st at xxiii.com Sun Mar 2 17:34:54 2008 From: wmc_st at xxiii.com (Wayne) Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2008 19:34:54 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fabric for gravel driveway In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.0.20080302161125.0379f790@mail.comcast.net> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20080302161125.0379f790@mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <47CB47AE.2000809@xxiii.com> Steve Shipley wrote: > the guys who work there are kind of proud that > their hours of business determines what kind of customer they serve. > I sent a girlfriend to run an errand for me and apparently they were > quite rude. They sound like a bunch of pompous, misogynistic assholes. Please tell us who they are, so they can be avoided. -Wayne From shiples at comcast.net Sun Mar 2 19:16:48 2008 From: shiples at comcast.net (Steve Shipley) Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2008 18:16:48 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fabric for gravel driveway In-Reply-To: <47CB47AE.2000809@xxiii.com> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20080302161125.0379f790@mail.comcast.net> <5.2.1.1.0.20080302161125.0379f790@mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20080302170802.048818a0@mail.comcast.net> At 07:34 PM 3/2/2008 -0500, Wayne wrote: >Steve Shipley wrote: > > the guys who work there are kind of proud that > > their hours of business determines what kind of customer they serve. > > I sent a girlfriend to run an errand for me and apparently they were > > quite rude. > >They sound like a bunch of pompous, misogynistic assholes. I wouldn't call them pompous, but I think the prejudiced part is pretty accurate. I don't think these guys ever attended "Creating a Respectful Workplace" or Customer Service training. They specialize in serving the local tradesman. Sure, they might let an occasional profanity slip, but you get what you need and you're on your way. >Please tell us who they are, so they can be avoided. Sorry, trade secret. For you, I'd recommend either Home Depot or Lowe's. Open Saturdays and Sundays. Weekdays till 9. From dmscheidt at gmail.com Sun Mar 2 19:23:26 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 21:23:26 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fabric for gravel driveway In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.0.20080302170802.048818a0@mail.comcast.net> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20080302161125.0379f790@mail.comcast.net> <47CB47AE.2000809@xxiii.com> <5.2.1.1.0.20080302170802.048818a0@mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803021823v66bf1q5bfcfc50480100d1@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 2, 2008 at 9:16 PM, Steve Shipley wrote: > At 07:34 PM 3/2/2008 -0500, Wayne wrote: > >Steve Shipley wrote: > > > the guys who work there are kind of proud that > > > their hours of business determines what kind of customer they serve. > > > I sent a girlfriend to run an errand for me and apparently they were > > > quite rude. > > > >They sound like a bunch of pompous, misogynistic assholes. > > I wouldn't call them pompous, but I think the prejudiced part is pretty > accurate. > I don't think these guys ever attended "Creating a Respectful Workplace" or > Customer Service training. They specialize in serving the local tradesman. > Sure, they might let an occasional profanity slip, but you get what you need > and you're on your way. > As long as you're white and male, eh? -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From shiples at comcast.net Sun Mar 2 20:30:17 2008 From: shiples at comcast.net (Steve Shipley) Date: Sun, 02 Mar 2008 19:30:17 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Privilege at the lumber yard In-Reply-To: <2400a5d40803021823v66bf1q5bfcfc50480100d1@mail.gmail.com> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20080302170802.048818a0@mail.comcast.net> <5.2.1.1.0.20080302161125.0379f790@mail.comcast.net> <47CB47AE.2000809@xxiii.com> <5.2.1.1.0.20080302170802.048818a0@mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20080302182735.0379fad0@mail.comcast.net> >As long as you're white and male, eh? It's not prejudice based on race or sex. They are sizing you up to determine if you're there to purchase materials to complete a project. If they think that you'll be better served by shopping at Home Depot they will encourage you to take your business there. The first step in determining who they deal with is the hours of operation. The mistreatment of my girlfriend was probably based on clothing. She was probably 40 at the time, and never had been inside a Kmart until I took her. She used clothes, jewelry, and other wealth signaling devices to make a statement about her place in society. The guys at the lumber yard encouraged her to shop elsewhere. I didn't understand until later that my levis and tshirts were part of the reason that I can purchase filter cloth and other secret ingredients unknown to the staff at Home Depot. Please accept my apologies for taking this way off topic but does everyone understand white privilege? Here is a link to a classic work (by a white woman I believe!) http://seamonkey.ed.asu.edu/~mcisaac/emc598ge/Unpacking.html#daily I found it on Wikipedia. Sometimes I think about social justice in the shop It's a wonder I get anything done at all.... From 57healey at gmail.com Sun Mar 2 20:40:11 2008 From: 57healey at gmail.com (Patton Dickson) Date: Sun, 2 Mar 2008 21:40:11 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fabric for gravel driveway In-Reply-To: <2400a5d40803021823v66bf1q5bfcfc50480100d1@mail.gmail.com> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20080302161125.0379f790@mail.comcast.net> <47CB47AE.2000809@xxiii.com> <5.2.1.1.0.20080302170802.048818a0@mail.comcast.net> <2400a5d40803021823v66bf1q5bfcfc50480100d1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <743b1e2f0803021940x7140dc08u2b2a26281cce4c95@mail.gmail.com> Wow, how did you make that leap?!?!?!? On Sun, Mar 2, 2008 at 8:23 PM, David Scheidt wrote: > > > I don't think these guys ever attended "Creating a Respectful > Workplace" or > > Customer Service training. They specialize in serving the local > tradesman. > > Sure, they might let an occasional profanity slip, but you get what you > need > > and you're on your way. > > > > As long as you're white and male, eh? > > -- > -- Patton Dickson - http://Austin-Healeys.com - Plano, TX 1957 Austin-Healey 100-Six "Built to run 'til the road wears out." From james.f.juhas at snet.net Sun Mar 2 22:31:00 2008 From: james.f.juhas at snet.net (Jim Juhas) Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 0:31:00 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fabric for gravel driveway Message-ID: <20080303052743.D38FD187877@autox.team.net> The guy who put in a gravel driveway for me called it a membrane, designed to keep the gravel from pushing down in to the mud, and keeping the wter and mud down. It's in a virtual swamp nd has been stable for six years. Jim 1957 MGA #311 -----Original Message----- From: "cornerexit" Subj: [Shop-talk] Fabric for gravel driveway Date: Sun Mar 2, 2008 5:58 pm Size: 633 bytes To: "'Shop Talk'" I need to put in a couple of gravel driveways on a couple of pieces of property this summer and was wondering what the fabric is that's used as an underlayment is called? Geo something? Somebody told me they use "dryer felt"? What the heck is dryer felt? Is this Geo fabric the same stuff that I see silt fences made out of? What type of store should I go to for this fabric? You are subscribed as james.f.juhas at snet.net Shop-talk mailing list http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk http://www.team.net/archive From nick at landform.co.uk Mon Mar 3 02:54:40 2008 From: nick at landform.co.uk (Nick Brearley) Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2008 09:54:40 +0000 Subject: [Shop-talk] Drilling holes in sheet metal In-Reply-To: <47CAFA5A.4010304@dimebank.com> References: <84159.64259.qm@web612.biz.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <47CAE6E7.1090307@yahoo.co.uk> <47CAE93C.1030307@landform.co.uk> <47CAFA5A.4010304@dimebank.com> Message-ID: <47CBCAE0.9060509@landform.co.uk> Chris Kantarjiev wrote: > > I'll second that - I have a set of these (then called Rotabroach, but > the same item) and they're really great. Not sure they work as well as > a unibit on some materials - I have both. The unibit gives a wider > range of sizes, but won't work on thick stuff. The rotacut can wander > a bit. > > Important to centrepunch the hole well and keep the Rotacut centreguide sliding freely. A little cutting oil works wonders. The fullsize Rotabroach machine is a very impressive piece of kit when you see it clamped in the middle of a large sheet cutting a two inch hole effortlessly. From dmscheidt at gmail.com Mon Mar 3 04:32:25 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2008 06:32:25 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fabric for gravel driveway In-Reply-To: <743b1e2f0803021940x7140dc08u2b2a26281cce4c95@mail.gmail.com> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20080302161125.0379f790@mail.comcast.net> <47CB47AE.2000809@xxiii.com> <5.2.1.1.0.20080302170802.048818a0@mail.comcast.net> <2400a5d40803021823v66bf1q5bfcfc50480100d1@mail.gmail.com> <743b1e2f0803021940x7140dc08u2b2a26281cce4c95@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803030332ve69d461o2ea2a087c197f37b@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 2, 2008 at 10:40 PM, Patton Dickson <57healey at gmail.com> wrote: > Wow, how did you make that leap?!?!?!? > > Experience with dealing with that sort of place. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From chad at linuxeg.com Mon Mar 3 11:26:21 2008 From: chad at linuxeg.com (Chadwick E. Labno) Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2008 13:26:21 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Drilling holes in sheet metal In-Reply-To: <47CBCAE0.9060509@landform.co.uk> References: <84159.64259.qm@web612.biz.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <47CAE6E7.1090307@yahoo.co.uk> <47CAE93C.1030307@landform.co.uk> <47CAFA5A.4010304@dimebank.com> <47CBCAE0.9060509@landform.co.uk> Message-ID: <47CC42CD.3090707@linuxeg.com> Can a Rotabroach (annular cutter) be used in something other then a Rotabroach machine (mag base drill), IE: milldrill, drill press, hand held drill motor, etc.? chad Nick Brearley wrote: >Chris Kantarjiev wrote: > > >>I'll second that - I have a set of these (then called Rotabroach, but >>the same item) and they're really great. Not sure they work as well as >>a unibit on some materials - I have both. The unibit gives a wider >>range of sizes, but won't work on thick stuff. The rotacut can wander >>a bit. >> >> >> >> >Important to centrepunch the hole well and keep the Rotacut centreguide >sliding freely. A little cutting oil works wonders. The fullsize >Rotabroach machine is a very impressive piece of kit when you see it >clamped in the middle of a large sheet cutting a two inch hole effortlessly. >_______________________________________________ >Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > >You are subscribed as chad at linuxeg.com > >Shop-talk mailing list > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > >http://www.team.net/archive From chad at linuxeg.com Mon Mar 3 19:31:53 2008 From: chad at linuxeg.com (Chadwick E. Labno) Date: Mon, 03 Mar 2008 21:31:53 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Stainless steel welding Message-ID: <47CCB499.8050509@linuxeg.com> I need to gas weld a stainless steel exhaust system and I'm looking for suggestions on the correct filler rod. I heard - read - stainless TIG rods will work but the counter man at the welding supply tells me that is a bad choice but could not offer an alternative. Unless I can find some stainless coat hangers I'm at a loss. Ok, just joking about the hangers but what I may end up doing is cutting strips off the exhaust pipes and use that. Any ideas? Thanks in advance. chad From dmscheidt at gmail.com Tue Mar 4 14:45:48 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 16:45:48 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Stainless steel welding In-Reply-To: <47CCB499.8050509@linuxeg.com> References: <47CCB499.8050509@linuxeg.com> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803041345ub4ae25fgdd01dd401e402585@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 9:31 PM, Chadwick E. Labno wrote: > I need to gas weld a stainless steel exhaust system and I'm looking for > suggestions on the correct filler rod. I heard - read - stainless TIG > rods will work but the counter man at the welding supply tells > me that is a bad choice but could not offer an alternative. Unless I can > find some stainless coat hangers I'm at a loss. Ok, just joking about > the hangers but what I may end up doing is cutting strips off > the exhaust pipes and use that. Any ideas? Thanks in advance. > chad > I don't know much about welding stainless, but I know it can be done with a torch. It requires a flux, I think. What sort of filler is to be used depends on the alloy the parts are made of. Lots of stainlesses have problems with welding, because the alloy changes, so different fillers are required, or the welded joints are less corrosion resistant. Sorry I can't be more helpful. The tin man has a booklet about welding stainless, and sells a flux. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From mark at sccaprepared.com Tue Mar 4 15:53:59 2008 From: mark at sccaprepared.com (Mark Andy) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 17:53:59 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank Message-ID: Howdy, Anyone have any hand tool recommendations for tool buying on a budget? I'm outfitting a 2nd toolbox for the race car trailer. The budget doesn't allow 'real' tools like snap-on, mac, matco, etc. I'd even rather not stretch it to Craftsman. What I'm looking for specifically is a set of screwdrivers with machined tips that would include #1, #2, and #3 phillips, plus the usual range of flat heads. I'm also looking for a set of six point 1/4" drive regular and deep sockets in metric and sae. I found ok versions for this one at HF though. Any favorites in the bargain bin set out there? Mark From dhlocker at comcast.net Tue Mar 4 16:31:02 2008 From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker) Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2008 18:31:02 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Stainless steel welding In-Reply-To: <2400a5d40803041345ub4ae25fgdd01dd401e402585@mail.gmail.com> References: <47CCB499.8050509@linuxeg.com> <2400a5d40803041345ub4ae25fgdd01dd401e402585@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47CDDBB6.9090708@comcast.net> Hi, Chad. (and David) From Metals And How To Weld Them (James F Lincoln Arc Welding Foundation,) Chapter 15 (pp 233-254) is devoted entirely to Stainless Steels and High-Chromium Alloys; I won't choose any selections from it unless there are specific questions. p. 152: (addressing carbide precipitation and the effect on the HAZ and corrosion resistance.) ------------------- beginning of quoted material ------------------- Stainless steels of the nickel-chromium variety are austenitic by nature even at room temperatures. When such steels are heated, as by welding operations, carbide precipitation is apt to occur. The carbides, or carbon compounds, are chromium as well as iron. When chromium is used up in this way, in chemical union with the precipitated carbon, the remaining austenite is deficient in the chromium element. The result is a serious reduction int he corrosion-resisting properties of the stainless steel. When the carbides are precipitated in stainless steel, they appear mainly at the grain boundaries. If subjected to corrosion, ethe carbides along the grain boundaries will be attacked readily. Severe corrosive conditions will cause the grains to lose there coherence and the steel to fail. In making a weld on stainless, there will always be a region some distance back from the weld where the base metal will be at the exact temperature of the precipitation range: 800-1500 F (Fig. 9-3). Consequently the stainless qualities of the structure will be lost unless steps are taken to prevent precipitation. Austenitic stainless steels may be stabilized against carbide precipitation by the addition of elements known as stabilizers. Such elements are columbium and titanium. These elements have a ready affinity for carbon; they will grab and hold fast the carbon that might otherwise have been attracted to the chromium. Moreover, both titanium and columbium carbide resemble stainless steel itself in having high resistance to corrosion. Stabilized stainless steels, therefore, will not fail under the combination of heat and corrosive attack. Austenitic stainless steels also are available in several grades with extra low carbon (ELC). Since there is less carbon, the possibility of chromium migration to the grain boundaries is minimized. It is well to remember that the stabilized and ELC austenitic steels will resist carbide precipitation. If the welded stainless is to be subjected to corrosive conditions, particularly at elevated temperatures, the base metal should be a stabilized steel and it should be welded with electrodes or filler rods that have also been stabilized. ---------------------- end of quoted material ---------------------- HTH, Donald. David Scheidt wrote: > On Mon, Mar 3, 2008 at 9:31 PM, Chadwick E. Labno wrote: >> I need to gas weld a stainless steel exhaust system and I'm looking for >> suggestions on the correct filler rod. I heard - read - stainless TIG >> rods will work but the counter man at the welding supply tells >> me that is a bad choice but could not offer an alternative. Unless I can >> find some stainless coat hangers I'm at a loss. Ok, just joking about >> the hangers but what I may end up doing is cutting strips off >> the exhaust pipes and use that. Any ideas? Thanks in advance. >> chad >> > > I don't know much about welding stainless, but I know it can be done > with a torch. It requires a flux, I think. What sort of filler is to > be used depends on the alloy the parts are made of. Lots of > stainlesses have problems with welding, because the alloy changes, so > different fillers are required, or the welded joints are less > corrosion resistant. Sorry I can't be more helpful. > > The tin man has a booklet about welding stainless, and sells a flux. From ejrussell at mebtel.net Tue Mar 4 17:03:40 2008 From: ejrussell at mebtel.net (Eric J Russell) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 19:03:40 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank References: Message-ID: <002101c87e54$6d258ff0$ae10c263@ejrussell> For a tool that I will only use rarely, H-F is often adequate. For a tool that will get occasional or frequent use, better quality is a worthwhile investment. I do often use a Stanley "6 in 1" screwdriver (and I keep one each vehicle). It has a large & small flat blade, a large & small phillips, plus two sizes of hex drive (1/4" & 5/16" I think). Its only draw back is for situations where you need to reach down into a small access hole - the shank is larger in diameter than a standard screwdriver. Eric Russell Mebane, NC http://home.mebtel.net/~ejrussell ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Andy" > Anyone have any hand tool recommendations for tool buying on a > budget? > I'm outfitting a 2nd toolbox for the race car trailer. From strovato at optonline.net Tue Mar 4 17:12:52 2008 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2008 19:12:52 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <0JX8006HNDXOR5M0@mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Mark, You can get an eight piece craftsman screwdriver set for 10 bucks. http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00947136000P?keyword=screwdriver+set I hope you're not really THAT poor. -Steve At 05:53 PM 3/4/2008, Mark Andy wrote: >Howdy, > >Anyone have any hand tool recommendations for tool buying on a budget? >I'm outfitting a 2nd toolbox for the race car trailer. The budget doesn't >allow 'real' tools like snap-on, mac, matco, etc. I'd even rather not >stretch it to Craftsman. From doug at dougbraun.com Tue Mar 4 17:17:00 2008 From: doug at dougbraun.com (Doug Braun) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 16:17:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <739912.22741.qm@web611.biz.mail.mud.yahoo.com> A while ago a friend of mine got a fairly complete socket set (1/4 + 3/8 + 1/2") at Sam's Club. It was branded Coleman or Stanley, I believe. It looked well-made, definitely better than typical HF, and the price was very reasonable. Doug From jniolon at bham.rr.com Tue Mar 4 18:49:48 2008 From: jniolon at bham.rr.com (john niolon) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 19:49:48 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank References: Message-ID: <012901c87e63$32adeb60$6401a8c0@niolon> Mark, if you have a Lowe's nearly or a Home Depot you might look at the Kobalt (lowes) or Husky (HD) brand... I like the Kobalt better, nice finish, fit your hand.. pretty well made...at least as well as the latest Crapsman. I buy them when they are on sale. My box is full of Crapsman with a few good snap-ons. I'm not brand loyal but will usually try to buy industrial... Williams, Proto, Armstrong at the flea markets and yard sales. I don have a set of Cresent tools in a molded case that I use as a travel set for repairs at my daughters house out of town... in fact I bought her the same set... decent occasional use tools for homeowners stuff... no mechanic would use them for fear of being laughed at for not being 'truck bought' http://www.benmeadows.com/store/item/104627/ give em a look... later John Free your heart from hate. Free your mind from worry. Live simple, give more, expect less ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Andy" To: Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 4:53 PM Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank > Howdy, > > Anyone have any hand tool recommendations for tool buying on a budget? > I'm outfitting a 2nd toolbox for the race car trailer. The budget doesn't > allow 'real' tools like snap-on, mac, matco, etc. I'd even rather not > stretch it to Craftsman. > > What I'm looking for specifically is a set of screwdrivers with machined > tips that would include #1, #2, and #3 phillips, plus the usual range of > flat heads. > > I'm also looking for a set of six point 1/4" drive regular and deep > sockets in metric and sae. I found ok versions for this one at HF though. > > Any favorites in the bargain bin set out there? > > Mark > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as jniolon at bham.rr.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.21.4/1310 - Release Date: 3/4/2008 > 8:35 AM From dmscheidt at gmail.com Tue Mar 4 19:09:05 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 21:09:05 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank In-Reply-To: <002101c87e54$6d258ff0$ae10c263@ejrussell> References: <002101c87e54$6d258ff0$ae10c263@ejrussell> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803041809s3ff7c5e3q19473bb21ae2370@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, Mar 4, 2008 at 7:03 PM, Eric J Russell wrote: > For a tool that I will only use rarely, H-F is often adequate. > > For a tool that will get occasional or frequent use, better quality is > a worthwhile investment. > > I do often use a Stanley "6 in 1" screwdriver (and I keep one each > vehicle). It has a large & small flat blade, a large & small phillips, > plus two sizes of hex drive (1/4" & 5/16" I think). Its only draw back > is for situations where you need to reach down into a small access > hole - the shank is larger in diameter than a standard screwdriver. If you can resist the urge to use a screwdriver as a chisel, hammer, and pry bar, an interchangable bit driver is quite cost effective. You can spend money on good quality bits where it matters, and not on the handle, which doesn't much effect how the tool works. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From dmscheidt at gmail.com Tue Mar 4 19:18:06 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 21:18:06 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Stainless steel welding In-Reply-To: <47CDDBB6.9090708@comcast.net> References: <47CCB499.8050509@linuxeg.com> <2400a5d40803041345ub4ae25fgdd01dd401e402585@mail.gmail.com> <47CDDBB6.9090708@comcast.net> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803041818j2dc71108me9b30567d7ef9b40@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, Mar 4, 2008 at 6:31 PM, Donald H Locker wrote: > Hi, Chad. (and David) > > From Metals And How To Weld Them (James F Lincoln Arc Welding Foundation,) > > Chapter 15 (pp 233-254) is devoted entirely to Stainless Steels and > High-Chromium Alloys; I won't choose any selections from it unless there are > specific questions. Thanks for that. I think I knew all that, once... Columbium is more commonly known as niobium, outside of American circles. (Element 41, Nb. ) -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From mark at sccaprepared.com Tue Mar 4 20:42:07 2008 From: mark at sccaprepared.com (Mark Andy) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 22:42:07 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank In-Reply-To: <002101c87e54$6d258ff0$ae10c263@ejrussell> References: <002101c87e54$6d258ff0$ae10c263@ejrussell> Message-ID: Howdy, On Tue, 4 Mar 2008, Eric J Russell wrote: > For a tool that I will only use rarely, H-F is often adequate. > > For a tool that will get occasional or frequent use, better quality is a > worthwhile investment. I've found there to be a whole range of stuff at HF... For instance, this is one of the better "regular" ratchets I've ever used: http://www.harborfreightusa.com/usa/itemdisplay/displayItem.do?itemid=94586&CategoryName=&SubCategoryName= ... and I've used lots of craftsman, snap-on, mac, etc. stuff. > I do often use a Stanley "6 in 1" screwdriver (and I keep one each > vehicle). It has a large & small flat blade, a large & small phillips, > plus two sizes of hex drive (1/4" & 5/16" I think). Its only draw back > is for situations where you need to reach down into a small access hole > - the shank is larger in diameter than a standard screwdriver. I've got a bunch of those too, but I don't really like them for work on a car. Half because the shaft is bigger and sometimes doesn't fit and half because its about guaranteed that it'll come apart when I'm contorted in some weird position. Mark From mark at sccaprepared.com Tue Mar 4 20:44:28 2008 From: mark at sccaprepared.com (Mark Andy) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 22:44:28 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank In-Reply-To: <0JX8006HNDXOR5M0@mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> References: <0JX8006HNDXOR5M0@mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Message-ID: Howdy, On Tue, 4 Mar 2008, Steven Trovato wrote: > You can get an eight piece craftsman screwdriver set for 10 bucks. > > http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00947136000P?keyword=screwdriver+set > > I hope you're not really THAT poor. :-) That's certainly affordable. Are the tips good on the phillips screw drivers in that set? And there's no #3 phillips... Mark From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Tue Mar 4 21:08:19 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 20:08:19 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20080305040819.WNLG4595.mta15.adelphia.net@randall> > I've got a bunch of those too, but I don't really like them > for work on a car. Half because the shaft is bigger and > sometimes doesn't fit and half because its about guaranteed > that it'll come apart when I'm contorted in some weird position. Ditto. Not to mention having to fuss with changing bits, while you're laying on the back of your neck under the dash. Randall From eltonclark at gmail.com Tue Mar 4 21:22:59 2008 From: eltonclark at gmail.com (Elton E. (Tony) Clark) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 22:22:59 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank In-Reply-To: <20080305040819.WNLG4595.mta15.adelphia.net@randall> References: <20080305040819.WNLG4595.mta15.adelphia.net@randall> Message-ID: *I have a number of good 3/8 drive rachets including S-K but my fave continues to be a 40 year old "Thoresen" . . . smallest head of any rachet I've ever seen; gets one in impossible places.* *Tony* From strovato at optonline.net Tue Mar 4 21:37:55 2008 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Tue, 04 Mar 2008 23:37:55 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank In-Reply-To: References: <0JX8006HNDXOR5M0@mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Message-ID: <0JX80076PQ7VPFV0@mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Well, they're OK. They also sell them individually and in a bunch of other set configurations. A #3 Phillips does exist, it's $7 by itself. Point is, Craftsman isn't in the stratosphere, price-wise. We're talking about Sears here. Unless you live on the moon, there's got to be a Sears or Kmart near you. Go check them out for yourself. (No offense to lunar dwellers intended). At 10:44 PM 3/4/2008, Mark Andy wrote: >Howdy, > >On Tue, 4 Mar 2008, Steven Trovato wrote: > > You can get an eight piece craftsman screwdriver set for 10 bucks. > > > > > http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00947136000P?keyword=screwdriver+set > > > > I hope you're not really THAT poor. > >:-) That's certainly affordable. Are the tips good on the phillips screw >drivers in that set? And there's no #3 phillips... From mistertwo at sbcglobal.net Tue Mar 4 21:57:17 2008 From: mistertwo at sbcglobal.net (RandE) Date: Tue, 4 Mar 2008 22:57:17 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank References: <0JX8006HNDXOR5M0@mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <0JX80076PQ7VPFV0@mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Message-ID: <009c01c87e7d$c0fd59e0$6400a8c0@poweredge> The best thing about Craftsman is that there is usually a store close to get them replaced when the break. Randy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Trovato" To: "Mark Andy" ; Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 10:37 PM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank > Well, they're OK. They also sell them individually and in a bunch of > other set configurations. A #3 Phillips does exist, it's $7 by > itself. Point is, Craftsman isn't in the stratosphere, > price-wise. We're talking about Sears here. Unless you live on the > moon, there's got to be a Sears or Kmart near you. Go check them out > for yourself. (No offense to lunar dwellers intended). > > At 10:44 PM 3/4/2008, Mark Andy wrote: > >Howdy, > > > >On Tue, 4 Mar 2008, Steven Trovato wrote: > > > You can get an eight piece craftsman screwdriver set for 10 bucks. > > > > > > > > http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00947136000P?keyword=screwdriver+set > > > > > > I hope you're not really THAT poor. > > > >:-) That's certainly affordable. Are the tips good on the phillips screw > >drivers in that set? And there's no #3 phillips... > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as mistertwo at sbcglobal.net > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive From rtdengr at charter.net Tue Mar 4 23:17:52 2008 From: rtdengr at charter.net (Bob Dicke) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 00:17:52 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank In-Reply-To: <009c01c87e7d$c0fd59e0$6400a8c0@poweredge> References: <0JX8006HNDXOR5M0@mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net><0JX80076PQ7VPFV0@mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <009c01c87e7d$c0fd59e0$6400a8c0@poweredge> Message-ID: <01bc01c87e88$a4f0ddc0$6401a8c0@RTDHP763n> I've taken in 30 year old Craftsman screwdrivers that have obviously been abused and said "It doesn't work right" and they gave me a new one. Bob -----Original Message----- From: shop-talk-bounces+rtdengr=charter.net at autox.team.net [mailto:shop-talk-bounces+rtdengr=charter.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of RandE Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 10:57 PM To: shop-talk at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank The best thing about Craftsman is that there is usually a store close to get them replaced when the break. Randy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Trovato" To: "Mark Andy" ; Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2008 10:37 PM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank > Well, they're OK. They also sell them individually and in a bunch of > other set configurations. A #3 Phillips does exist, it's $7 by > itself. Point is, Craftsman isn't in the stratosphere, > price-wise. We're talking about Sears here. Unless you live on the > moon, there's got to be a Sears or Kmart near you. Go check them out > for yourself. (No offense to lunar dwellers intended). > > At 10:44 PM 3/4/2008, Mark Andy wrote: > >Howdy, > > > >On Tue, 4 Mar 2008, Steven Trovato wrote: > > > You can get an eight piece craftsman screwdriver set for 10 bucks. > > > > > > > > http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00947136000P?keyword=screwdriver+se t > > > > > > I hope you're not really THAT poor. > > > >:-) That's certainly affordable. Are the tips good on the phillips screw > >drivers in that set? And there's no #3 phillips... > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as mistertwo at sbcglobal.net > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive You are subscribed as rtdengr at charter.net Shop-talk mailing list http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk http://www.team.net/archive From james.f.juhas at snet.net Wed Mar 5 07:46:18 2008 From: james.f.juhas at snet.net (James F Juhas) Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2008 09:46:18 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Stainless steel welding In-Reply-To: <47CCB499.8050509@linuxeg.com> References: <47CCB499.8050509@linuxeg.com> Message-ID: <47CEB23A.8040804@snet.net> The Henrob/Dillon torch is touted as being an effective tool to weld stainless. It's true that its low pressure flame can solve a lot of problems, I believe that many techniques can be duplicated with another brand small torch. (However, I have a Henrob, and like it, so haven't tried to duplicate its features.) Anyway, a Henrob supplier offers on-line instruction, including the stainless welding process: http://www.cut-like-plasma.com/info_welding_stainless_steel.htm That said, can you braze instead of welding the exhaust system? Chadwick E. Labno wrote: > I need to gas weld a stainless steel exhaust system and I'm looking for > suggestions on the correct filler rod. I heard - read - stainless TIG > rods will work but the counter man at the welding supply tells > me that is a bad choice but could not offer an alternative. Unless I can > find some stainless coat hangers I'm at a loss. Ok, just joking about > the hangers but what I may end up doing is cutting strips off > the exhaust pipes and use that. Any ideas? Thanks in advance. > chad From jniolon at bham.rr.com Wed Mar 5 08:10:52 2008 From: jniolon at bham.rr.com (john niolon) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 09:10:52 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sams Club tool box Message-ID: <594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC> I'm looking for some more tool storage.... can't (won't) pay the price for truck tool boxes...will not take out 2nd mort. for snap-on stuff. I've looked at Crapsman stuff and H.F. and it isn't the quality of what I bought 10 years ago and I don't like the wrinkle finish on the H.F. boxes and too many shallow drawers. Found this one on Sam's club website. The SS doesn't excite me or the diamond plate, but I like the long deeper drawers. Anyone got any experience with this box.. Details are kinda sketchy on sam's site. I know it's Taiwan made by CSPS but even their site gives no detail. http://www.samsclub.com/shopping/navigate.do?dest=5&item=348961 tell me all you know... thanks John At my age... there's nothing left to learn the hard way. From pethier at comcast.net Wed Mar 5 09:18:23 2008 From: pethier at comcast.net (pethier at comcast.net) Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2008 16:18:23 +0000 Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank Message-ID: <030520081618.21027.47CEC7CF0001AA320000522322135285739D0A07089B0A9F@comcast.net> From: "RandE" > The best thing about Craftsman is that there is usually a store close to get > them replaced when the break. > > Randy Bingo. I don't work as a pro mechanic. I broke the tip on a Snap-On screwdriver. Took a bit of logistics to get the Snap-On truck to meet me in front of my downtown office. -- Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA 1962 Triumph TR4 CT2846L, 1992 Saturn SL2, 1993 Suburban, 1994 Miata C package pethier [at] comcast [dot] net http://forum.mnautox.com/forums/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/pethier I decry the textmessagization of the American-English language. From Tim.Mullen at ngc.com Wed Mar 5 09:21:17 2008 From: Tim.Mullen at ngc.com (Mullen, Tim) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 10:21:17 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank In-Reply-To: <0JX8006HNDXOR5M0@mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> References: <0JX8006HNDXOR5M0@mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Message-ID: <9C2F69BA6FB69F43ABCDBCFFC282C79701068050@XMBIL103.northgrum.com> Steven Trovato wrote: > > You can get an eight piece craftsman screwdriver set for 10 > bucks. Besides the screw driver sets, if you watch the sale ads, you can get lots of tools for cheap. I've bought 1/4 socket set - complete with case and ratchet - for $10. Same for 3/8 sockets sets in their strip. Watch for similar sales for combination wrench sets. They are cheap enough that I've outfitted a couple of tool sets - one that's kept in the car, one that travels to the kids houses/apartments for when they need work done. Tim Mullen Chantilly, VA From mistertwo at sbcglobal.net Wed Mar 5 09:43:59 2008 From: mistertwo at sbcglobal.net (Rand E) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 08:43:59 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank In-Reply-To: <9C2F69BA6FB69F43ABCDBCFFC282C79701068050@XMBIL103.northgrum.com> Message-ID: <41142.27331.qm@web82408.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Also, check the Seats Outlet stores, if you have one in your area. Usually some good deals there. Some are scratch-and-dent, others are closeouts, etc. Last week I saw a 122-piece socket/tool-set, retail price was $130, sale price was $99, Outlet price was $69. Just yesterday I bought a 14-drawer rolling toolcart, original price was $830. I got it for $415. It was slightly damaged, though. The front lip of the top drawer was bent (easy fix, nothing structural, only cosmetic) and the slide had come off track on the same corner because the edge of the support was out of position. Pushed the support back into position, straightened the drawer and works like new. They also have others that are with more damage and other items that have been repaired. Sometimes the manager will deal even on the prices. Randy --- "Mullen, Tim" wrote: > Steven Trovato wrote: > > > > You can get an eight piece craftsman screwdriver > set for 10 > > bucks. > > Besides the screw driver sets, if you watch the sale > ads, you can get > lots of tools for cheap. > > I've bought 1/4 socket set - complete with case and > ratchet - for $10. > Same for 3/8 sockets sets in their strip. Watch for > similar sales for > combination wrench sets. They are cheap enough that > I've outfitted a > couple of tool sets - one that's kept in the car, > one that travels to > the kids houses/apartments for when they need work > done. > > Tim Mullen > > Chantilly, VA > _______________________________________________ From arvidj at visi.com Wed Mar 5 12:03:57 2008 From: arvidj at visi.com (Arvid Jedlicka) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 13:03:57 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sams Club tool box - part one Message-ID: <005e01c87ef3$aa74e780$ef281aac@behavioral.com> All that I know about them: They are made by this company http://www.cspsmetal.com/toolchests/index.html I have three similar sets - two 41in 7 drawer bottoms and 5 drawer tops and one 56in 12 drawer bottom and 10 drawer top. The specific one you referenced does not appear to be on the CSPS web site but I do not find that to be a strange. None of the ones that I have are currently on the CSPS web site either. The 41in units are three years old and are "plain". The 56in unit is 18 months old and had the "diamond plate" finish. My personal preference is for the plain finish but the 56in unit was only available in diamond plate. All were purchased at the local Sam's club so no shipping was involved. Note that the following is not from a specification sheet but just an "eye-ball" assessment of the picture you provided and my experience with my setup. I am guessing that the bottom section is one drawer 7.6in tall - 9in face, two drawers 3.7in tall - 4.75in face, three drawers 1.8in tall - 3in face and one drawer 1.4in tall - 2.5in face. Again a guess that the top section is one drawer 3.7in tall - 4.75in face, two drawers 1.8in tall - 3in face and two drawer 1.4in tall - 2.5 face. And I am guessing it has two gas struts to hold the top up. Based on the picture I am guessing that the lid is simply that - a lid - and the top of the top box is a "compartment" that has four sides on it. For those of you who are asking "what the heck is he talking about?", the two 41in tops I have are exactly as I have described but the top of the 56in does not have a front side on it - the "front" is attached to the lid. The advantage of "no front edge" is that those of use who are height challenged can see everything that is on the top 56in shelf and not have to get a stool to look into the compartment in the top of the 41in box. I have mitigated this by not putting little stuff in the top of the cabinets where it will get lost because I can not see it - only tall stuff that will not fit in the drawers - see below - goes up there. Of course this means I can't close the lid because of all the tall stuff - never a perfect solution to these things! More to come ... From arvidj at visi.com Wed Mar 5 12:04:42 2008 From: arvidj at visi.com (Arvid Jedlicka) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 13:04:42 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sams Club tool box - part two Message-ID: <006301c87ef3$c5152870$ef281aac@behavioral.com> continued from part one ... The really big drawer at the bottom has a 9in face and holds a lot of big heavy stuff. It has two ball bearing slides on each side and I'm quite surprised what I can put in there and it still open - like multiple 8 lb sledge hammers, etc. The big drawers - 4.75in face - second and third from the bottom on the bottom section - are also good size and hold a reasonable amount of stuff. The medium drawers - 3in face - and the small drawers - 2.5in face are a challenge to use effectively. I have the quarter inch sockets, handles, extensions in a 2.5in face drawer and the three quarters and half inch sockets, handles and extensions in the 3in face drawer. But all of the sockets are on their side in either Lisle socket holders or on plastic peg type folders. None of the medium or smaller drawers are tall enough to allow all of the sockets to stand straight up - especially the deep well sockets. The same issue with wrenches. I have most of the wrenches - box ends - open ends - combinations - in three separate 3in face drawers in plastic holders that angle them back about 45 degrees. The really big wrenches lie flat in the drawer. On occasion I have considered converting some of the small and medium drawers to be larger drawer by applying the saws-all to the bottom of a drawer and then use the pop-rivet gun to attach it to the drawer directly below it, but I have not yet acted upon the impulse. It comes with shelf liners but I was not impressed with them and installed a thicker "bead" type that I like better. The casters are very robust, as are the handles. I don't mind the stainless steel and the smudges wipe up easily. The slides seem to handle everything that I've put in the drawers without issue. I wish the slides held the drawers shut a little better. They work, and hold the drawer shut, but the term "just barely" applies. There is no 'safety' mechanism on the drawers so I am assuming that if I open three or four of them at the same time it will fall over. This also means that I need to shut them all and lock it if I am going to roll it a long distance around the garage. Note also that at one time I saw similar items from the same manufacturer - different drawer configurations, etc. at Costco but I've not seen them there for quite some time. Even the local Sam's Club stores seem to only have them on an "every now and then" basis rather than a regular stock item. In summary, I was very impressed with what I got for the money. In my opinion it was at least as nice as the medium priced stuff at Sears and much less expensive. And they seemed to be much nicer in fit and finish compared to the Harbor Freight stuff for a similar price. At this point everyone is regretting that John asked for all that I know about them. Arvid From foxtrapper at aceweb.com Wed Mar 5 12:19:59 2008 From: foxtrapper at aceweb.com (Nolan) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 14:19:59 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sams Club tool box References: <594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <002001c87ef5$ec3fa360$8f29c40a@mde.state.md.us> Old card catalog file cabinets make dandy deep drawer tool boxes as well. Cheap, and very good ball bearing slides. From jblair1948 at cox.net Wed Mar 5 13:34:30 2008 From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T. Blair) Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2008 15:34:30 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sams Club tool box In-Reply-To: <594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20080305153430.00a69b20@pop.east.cox.net> At 09:10 AM 3/5/2008 -0600, john niolon wrote: >I'm looking for some more tool storage.... can't (won't) pay the price for >truck tool boxes... will not take out 2nd mort. for snap-on stuff. I've >looked at Crapsman stuff and H.F. and it isn't the quality of what I bought > >Found this one on Sam's club website. >http://www.samsclub.com/shopping/navigate.do?dest=5&item=348961 John I don't know much about that one, but you might look at this one at Costco: http://www.costco.com/Browse/Product.aspx?Prodid=11215795&search=tool%20ches t&Mo=0&cm_re=1_en-_-Top_Left_Nav-_-Top_search&lang=en-US&Nr=P_CatalogName:BC &Sp=S&N=5000043&whse=BC&Dx=mode+matchallpartial&Ntk=Text_Search&Dr=P_Catalog Name:BC&Ne=4000000&D=tool%20chest&Ntt=tool%20chest&No=0&Ntx=mode+matchallpar tial&Nty=1&topnav=&s=1 A friend got this one, it's quite nice. One thing he suggested was to spray paint it with clear so the SS doesn't get finger prints all over it. John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/www/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From parkanzky at gmail.com Wed Mar 5 13:43:27 2008 From: parkanzky at gmail.com (Paul Parkanzky) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 15:43:27 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sams Club tool box In-Reply-To: <594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC> References: <594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC> Message-ID: I just went through a similar process and ended up buying this: http://www.gregsmithequipment.com/ATLAS-21-Drawer-Tool-Cabinet-p/httb4411bbs.htm The drawers aren't terribly shallow and the quality isn't too bad. It helped that they knocked some money off because I was buying it with my lift and accessories, but I had already decided that it was the one I was going to buy even if they didn't deal. Now I've just got to get my tools organized in it... Good luck, -Paul On Wed, Mar 5, 2008 at 10:10 AM, john niolon wrote: > I'm looking for some more tool storage.... can't (won't) pay the price for > truck tool boxes...will not take out 2nd mort. for snap-on stuff. I've > looked at Crapsman stuff and H.F. and it isn't the quality of what I bought 10 > years ago and I don't like the wrinkle finish on the H.F. boxes and too many > shallow drawers. Found this one on Sam's club website. The SS doesn't excite > me or the diamond plate, but I like the long deeper drawers. Anyone got any > experience with this box.. Details are kinda sketchy on sam's site. I know > it's Taiwan made by CSPS but even their site gives no detail. > > > http://www.samsclub.com/shopping/navigate.do?dest=5&item=348961 > > tell me all you know... > > thanks > John > > At my age... there's nothing left to learn the hard way. From chad at linuxeg.com Wed Mar 5 19:45:34 2008 From: chad at linuxeg.com (Chadwick E. Labno) Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2008 21:45:34 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Stainless steel welding In-Reply-To: <47CEB23A.8040804@snet.net> References: <47CCB499.8050509@linuxeg.com> <47CEB23A.8040804@snet.net> Message-ID: <47CF5ACE.205@linuxeg.com> Thanks for the replies, very interesting reading but the fact is I'm welding an auto exhaust not a nuke plant so I just may get a couple of 308 TIG rods and see what happens. It's under the car so no one will see it. It's not structural, only needs to be leak free. I'll let you know. thanks again, chad From rusd at sitestar.net Wed Mar 5 20:15:56 2008 From: rusd at sitestar.net (Dave Russell) Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2008 20:15:56 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] Stainless steel welding In-Reply-To: <47CF5ACE.205@linuxeg.com> References: <47CCB499.8050509@linuxeg.com> <47CEB23A.8040804@snet.net> <47CF5ACE.205@linuxeg.com> Message-ID: <47CF61EC.9040309@sitestar.net> I have found "Thermacote-Welco" flux for torch welding of 300 & 400 series stainless to work very well. It comes as a dry powder to be mixed with water. I expect that your local welding supply shop could supply it or an equivalent. The welding doesn't work so well at all without a flux. Dave Russell Chadwick E. Labno wrote: >Thanks for the replies, very interesting reading but the fact is >I'm welding an auto exhaust not a nuke plant so I just may >get a couple of 308 TIG rods and see what happens. It's >under the car so no one will see it. It's not structural, only >needs to be leak free. I'll let you know. >thanks again, >chad From salbrigh at nycap.rr.com Wed Mar 5 20:23:05 2008 From: salbrigh at nycap.rr.com (Skip Albright) Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2008 22:23:05 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] battery powered tools In-Reply-To: <47CF61EC.9040309@sitestar.net> References: <47CCB499.8050509@linuxeg.com> <47CEB23A.8040804@snet.net> <47CF5ACE.205@linuxeg.com> <47CF61EC.9040309@sitestar.net> Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20080305221923.02ab58a0@pop.nycap.rr.com> Last fall I had to buy a battery powered impact wrench for on the road use. I put it off as long as possible, and now I wish I hadn't. I find that battery tools are much handier around the shop than air or electric ones, and they work as well or better. I hate to fire up the big compressor, unless I am doing a lot of work. Just my .02 skip From chad at linuxeg.com Wed Mar 5 20:36:43 2008 From: chad at linuxeg.com (Chadwick E. Labno) Date: Wed, 05 Mar 2008 22:36:43 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Stainless steel welding In-Reply-To: <47CF61EC.9040309@sitestar.net> References: <47CCB499.8050509@linuxeg.com> <47CEB23A.8040804@snet.net> <47CF5ACE.205@linuxeg.com> <47CF61EC.9040309@sitestar.net> Message-ID: <47CF66CB.9060207@linuxeg.com> Thanks, I'll definitely give that a try. chad Dave Russell wrote: > I have found "Thermacote-Welco" flux for torch welding of 300 & 400 > series stainless to work very well. It comes as a dry powder to be > mixed with water. I expect that your local welding supply shop could > supply it or an equivalent. The welding doesn't work so well at all > without a flux. > > Dave Russell > > Chadwick E. Labno wrote: > >> Thanks for the replies, very interesting reading but the fact is >> I'm welding an auto exhaust not a nuke plant so I just may >> get a couple of 308 TIG rods and see what happens. It's >> under the car so no one will see it. It's not structural, only >> needs to be leak free. I'll let you know. >> thanks again, >> chad From mark at sccaprepared.com Wed Mar 5 20:50:36 2008 From: mark at sccaprepared.com (Mark Andy) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 22:50:36 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Shop-talk] Sams Club tool box In-Reply-To: References: <594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC> Message-ID: Howdy, That box looks, to me, to be very similar to the HF box here: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=90320 http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=92099 Anyone know if they're made by the same company / same quality? I've been very impressed by the HF toolbox, FWIW. Much more so than the Sam's Club boxes I've played with. Mark On Wed, 5 Mar 2008, Paul Parkanzky wrote: > I just went through a similar process and ended up buying this: > > http://www.gregsmithequipment.com/ATLAS-21-Drawer-Tool-Cabinet-p/httb4411bbs.htm > > The drawers aren't terribly shallow and the quality isn't too bad. It > helped that they knocked some money off because I was buying it with > my lift and accessories, but I had already decided that it was the one > I was going to buy even if they didn't deal. > > Now I've just got to get my tools organized in it... > > Good luck, > > -Paul > > On Wed, Mar 5, 2008 at 10:10 AM, john niolon wrote: >> I'm looking for some more tool storage.... can't (won't) pay the price for >> truck tool boxes...will not take out 2nd mort. for snap-on stuff. I've >> looked at Crapsman stuff and H.F. and it isn't the quality of what I bought 10 >> years ago and I don't like the wrinkle finish on the H.F. boxes and too many >> shallow drawers. Found this one on Sam's club website. The SS doesn't excite >> me or the diamond plate, but I like the long deeper drawers. Anyone got any >> experience with this box.. Details are kinda sketchy on sam's site. I know >> it's Taiwan made by CSPS but even their site gives no detail. >> >> >> http://www.samsclub.com/shopping/navigate.do?dest=5&item=348961 >> >> tell me all you know... >> >> thanks >> John >> >> At my age... there's nothing left to learn the hard way. > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as mark at sccaprepared.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive From jibjib at att.net Wed Mar 5 21:02:47 2008 From: jibjib at att.net (Jack Brooks) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 20:02:47 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] hand tool recommendations that don't break the bank In-Reply-To: <9C2F69BA6FB69F43ABCDBCFFC282C79701068050@XMBIL103.northgrum.com> References: <0JX8006HNDXOR5M0@mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <9C2F69BA6FB69F43ABCDBCFFC282C79701068050@XMBIL103.northgrum.com> Message-ID: <006801c87f3e$f0df6010$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> You just missed (a month or so ago) a $5 web coupon good for any tool purchase. Call me cheap, but there is a Sears virtually on my way home from work and I made a fair number of small ($6-10) purchases in a two week period. Jack > You can get an eight piece craftsman screwdriver set for 10 bucks. From jibjib at att.net Wed Mar 5 21:04:20 2008 From: jibjib at att.net (Jack Brooks) Date: Wed, 5 Mar 2008 20:04:20 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sams Club tool box In-Reply-To: <594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC> References: <594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <006901c87f3f$289cc8d0$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> > I'm looking for some more tool storage.... I have two five drawer bureaus from when I was a kid, over 30 years ago. They are stacked and work pretty well. Jack From jblair1948 at cox.net Thu Mar 6 05:14:18 2008 From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T. Blair) Date: Thu, 06 Mar 2008 07:14:18 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sams Club tool box In-Reply-To: <006901c87f3f$289cc8d0$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> References: <594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC> <594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20080306071418.00a78e78@pop.east.cox.net> At 08:04 PM 3/5/2008 -0800, Jack Brooks wrote: >I have two five drawer bureaus from when I was a kid, over 30 years ago. >They are stacked and work pretty well. I agree with Jack. Unless you really need the castors to roll around the cabinet, I have 2 old free standing kitchen cabnets, 1 wood & 1 metal. Several of my neighbors had remodled there kitchens and taken the old cabinets and hung them on the wall all around their garage. Keep your eyes open and you may find someone redoing their kitchen, or look for a discount/used cabinets house and scratch and dent sales. John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/www/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From jniolon at bham.rr.com Thu Mar 6 05:45:18 2008 From: jniolon at bham.rr.com (john niolon) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 06:45:18 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sam's Club Toolbox - report and you thought Arvid told you everything ! Message-ID: Made a trip to Sam's last nite to investigate the shiny toolbox. After waiting 10 minutes for someone with a key, I got to look it over. At first blush it looks pretty good. It is constructed and finished well... heavy hard rubber casters work smoothly with no load... with 500 # of tools ?? I can't say. One of my purchase criteria is one (or two) full width drawers as the top drawer in the bottom cabinet that is deep enough to hold deep well sockets on racks standing up ( 3" ?) and hopefully next drawer down will be at least 2.5" to hold wrenches in racks. This killed it for me. The top two drawers were shallow... like 1.5" shallow. Third down was about 1 3/4". The guides are plastic friction slide type, no bearings and one to each drawer side ... on the deep bottom drawer there were two on each side. And, while not difficult to pull out it seems to me they would be much harder with a load in the drawer. The top box is all shallow drawers with the deepest being 1-3/4". Best used for screwdrivers, pliers and wrenches lying flat in drawers. I doubt that you could get a normal flashlight in there and close the drawer. One nice feature was that when you lifted the lid on the upper box the front face panel of the top section rose with it leaving a ' flat area" instead of an enclosed tray that is harder to access for height challenged operators. Double gas cylinders hold the cover up. Over kill here, they are strong enough together to pull the lid out of your hand. One would have been plenty. Drawer liners are included but not the nice knobby type.. just slick coated rubber stuff that wouldn't 'hold' tools in place. It's main function is to protect drawer bottom from scratches. The shiny diamond plate exterior is all for show. it's actually a stamped thin sheet metal faceplace on the drawers. There are no detents or individual drawer latches so if you move the box you need to lock both cabinets. If you're just looking for a place to put the tools that your wife and kids gave you for Christmas, or you occasionally fix a lamp or tighten a chain on a bicycle...it's not a bad buy and would probably hold everything you own easily. If you're serious about organization of your tools and function I don't think this box is layed out well at all. If you're like me and have duplicates of everything... it's not enough box. the search continues..... later John At my age... there's nothing left to learn the hard way. From bill at gingerich.us Thu Mar 6 19:36:29 2008 From: bill at gingerich.us (Bill Gingerich) Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2008 20:36:29 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sams Club tool box In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.20080306071418.00a78e78@pop.east.cox.net> References: <594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC><594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC> <3.0.5.32.20080306071418.00a78e78@pop.east.cox.net> Message-ID: <014801c87ffc$0cf04c20$64dea8c0@shack2> A few years ago I found a whole slew of cabinets that were just about to enter the dumpster from a neighbors' remodel. I grabbed my 2 wheeler and hauled them all down the street to my place. One piece was a 5' "peninsula" cabinet. I did mount 4 locking casters on it to make a rolling tool bench and cabinet. The other cabinets got mounted to the walls in the garage, and served my purpose beautifully. Bill G Newalla, OK -----Original Message----- From: shop-talk-bounces+bill=gingerich.us at autox.team.net [mailto:shop-talk-bounces+bill=gingerich.us at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of John T. Blair Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2008 6:14 AM To: shop-talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sams Club tool box At 08:04 PM 3/5/2008 -0800, Jack Brooks wrote: >I have two five drawer bureaus from when I was a kid, over 30 years ago. >They are stacked and work pretty well. I agree with Jack. Unless you really need the castors to roll around the cabinet, I have 2 old free standing kitchen cabnets, 1 wood & 1 metal. Several of my neighbors had remodled there kitchens and taken the old cabinets and hung them on the wall all around their garage. Keep your eyes open and you may find someone redoing their kitchen, or look for a discount/used cabinets house and scratch and dent sales. John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/www/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From paul.mele at usermail.com Fri Mar 7 07:42:50 2008 From: paul.mele at usermail.com (Paul Mele) Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2008 09:42:50 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] tool boxes and storage thoughts In-Reply-To: <014801c87ffc$0cf04c20$64dea8c0@shack2> References: <594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC><594EE160E09A408EAFB221DC06FFF506@OwnerPC> <3.0.5.32.20080306071418.00a78e78@pop.east.cox.net> <014801c87ffc$0cf04c20$64dea8c0@shack2> Message-ID: <007d01c88061$8586dbd0$90949370$@mele@usermail.com> Our local PTA often has nice ball bearing file cabinets of several styles. The less-common "lateral file" (drawer is wider than deep) make a nice place for longer/ heavy tools. I pay an average of $8 each. The 2 drawer/ "half height" cabinets make a nice base for a 42 to 48" square work bench with a half sheet of plywood on top; roll around base frame helps if you like to rearrange the furniture often. Of course, these are the deeper, ball-bearing versions. I bought 16 of them when the local dept store relocated; they were the company office file cabinets, and again the ball-bearing high-dollar variety. I keep tools in these as well. They were $20 each. I also second/ third the kitchen cabinet recycle ideas. Lastly, I was lucky a few years back when Duke University went from the (3x5) card catalog system for the library, to computerized indexing. I got some of the nicely made/ dovetail/ oak card catalogs with about 300 drawers that are 3 x 5 x 17 deep. They house most of my small parts. Ended the collection of plastic drawer/ bins that I'd started. I am also happy with the Sears ball bearing stuff that I've bought on sale over the years; the cheaper friction block/ slide job that was my first tool cabinet is now for the "uncommon" tools, since they're not as good as the BB jobs. HTH PM From dirtbeard at pacbell.net Sat Mar 8 13:05:38 2008 From: dirtbeard at pacbell.net (old dirtbeard) Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 12:05:38 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] hoist and trolley for engine installation Message-ID: <009901c88157$c8493d40$0502a8c0@B50SS> Hi guys, Ready to replace the engine and transmission in my '74 TR6, and my "new" garage has a 10"x4"x3/8" I-beam across one of the bays (the guy who built it clearly put it there for a hoist). It also is pre-wired for 240 AC in case I wanted an electric hoist. Looking at McMaster, I see a = ton hand chain CM 622 hoist and trolley combination for about $300 and a one ton combo for about $360. I am not going to be pulling engines daily (or even yearly), so installing a hoist would be an indulgence (one I would like to think I deserve), but I do have a pretty good hydraulic floor engine hoist I used to take the engine out, so I could use it to put it back in. But a trolley hoist would seem like a nice addition to the garage nonetheless. My questions for the group are: 1. Would the above CM 622 work well or would you recommend some other options? 2. Electric would be nice, but they are pretty pricey - any ideas for locating a used hoist (I am in the Los Angeles area if there are some locals here - Randall?) 3. I am assuming that an I-beam hoist will be a lot nicer to use than a floor hoist, but what is your experience? (here I am wondering about positioning the engine - the trolley will allow me lateral movement, but for fore and aft, I suppose I would need to push the car as opposed to pushing the floor hoist around -- car could not be on jack stands, etc.). Any other tips or advice would be appreciated greatly before I spend unwisely. Thank you. best, doug ____________________ '72 BSA B50SS '74 Triumph TR6 '01 HD XHL 883 '03 GMC Cargo Van From dmscheidt at gmail.com Sat Mar 8 13:26:49 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 15:26:49 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] hoist and trolley for engine installation In-Reply-To: <009901c88157$c8493d40$0502a8c0@B50SS> References: <009901c88157$c8493d40$0502a8c0@B50SS> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803081226l73fc02ddr4fa791ce0297338c@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, Mar 8, 2008 at 3:05 PM, old dirtbeard wrote: > Hi guys, > > 3. I am assuming that an I-beam hoist will be a lot nicer to use than > a floor hoist, but what is your experience? (here I am wondering about > positioning the engine - the trolley will allow me lateral movement, but for > fore and aft, I suppose I would need to push the car as opposed to pushing > the floor hoist around -- car could not be on jack stands, etc.). It's been my experience that if you've got nice level floor, a cherry picker type hoist is easier to use. being able to move it side-to-side as well as back-to-front makes things much nicer. It sounds like yours goes side to side, though, and all the ones I've used went front to back. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From jamesf at groupwbench.org Sat Mar 8 14:27:30 2008 From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin) Date: Sat, 08 Mar 2008 16:27:30 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Cast iron to PVC soil pipe adapter? Message-ID: I'm adding a half bath in the basement and I'm toying with doing the plumbing myself. My soil pipe is cast iron, laid horizontally just under the surface of the slab. Then there are 2 45s to bring it vertical. I need to yank out the 45s and insert a 90. I've seen adapters online for inserting vertically PVC pipe into cast iron flanges, but never horizontal where the water will theoretically sit on the joint. Do I use the same fitting or is it a different process? Is there a brand name fitting? Which sealant or caulk? thanks, jim From kvacek at ameritech.net Sat Mar 8 15:04:37 2008 From: kvacek at ameritech.net (Karl Vacek) Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 16:04:37 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] Cast iron to PVC soil pipe adapter? References: Message-ID: <006d01c88168$66a7e440$6e01a8c0@KARL> Why not just use cast iron ? It's not that horribly expensive compared to the hassle of trying to reliably join PVC to cast iron. And no leading is required below grade nowadays - at least not here in the northeast part of the Peoples Republic of Illinois, where the unions make sure we have some pretty tight codes. You just put in a rubber insert and lubricant, and pop the fitting together. Karl > I'm adding a half bath in the basement and I'm toying with doing the > plumbing myself. My soil pipe is cast iron, laid horizontally just > under the surface of the slab. Then there are 2 45s to bring it > vertical. I need to yank out the 45s and insert a 90. I've seen > adapters online for inserting vertically PVC pipe into cast iron > flanges, but never horizontal where the water will theoretically sit > on the joint. Do I use the same fitting or is it a different process? > Is there a brand name fitting? Which sealant or caulk? > > thanks, > jim From jandkstone99 at msn.com Sat Mar 8 16:31:24 2008 From: jandkstone99 at msn.com (Jim Stone) Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 17:31:24 -0600 Subject: [Shop-talk] hoist and trolley for engine installation In-Reply-To: <009901c88157$c8493d40$0502a8c0@B50SS> References: <009901c88157$c8493d40$0502a8c0@B50SS> Message-ID: I've done it both ways on my Alpine. I made my own cross bar out of 2x4's (two of them joined together for strength) a few years ago and simply used a come-along to lift the engine. It worked fine, I just rolled the car back and forth to position it. However, IMHO using a cherry picker is definitely easier and they allow you to move the engine around as needed. Plus, cherry pickers have lots of other uses around the house. I've used my to remove an old window air conditioner, uproot a bush, and pull up a porch lantern base that was set in concrete. You can't do any of those with a garage I-beam. > From: dirtbeard at pacbell.net > To: shop-talk at autox.team.net > Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 12:05:38 -0800 > Subject: [Shop-talk] hoist and trolley for engine installation > > Hi guys, > > Ready to replace the engine and transmission in my '74 TR6, and my "new" > garage has a 10"x4"x3/8" I-beam across one of the bays (the guy who built it > clearly put it there for a hoist). It also is pre-wired for 240 AC in case I > wanted an electric hoist. > > Looking at McMaster, I see a = ton hand chain CM 622 hoist and trolley > combination for about $300 and a one ton combo for about $360. > > I am not going to be pulling engines daily (or even yearly), so installing a > hoist would be an indulgence (one I would like to think I deserve), but I do > have a pretty good hydraulic floor engine hoist I used to take the engine > out, so I could use it to put it back in. But a trolley hoist would seem > like a nice addition to the garage nonetheless. > > My questions for the group are: > 1. Would the above CM 622 work well or would you recommend some other > options? > 2. Electric would be nice, but they are pretty pricey - any ideas for > locating a used hoist (I am in the Los Angeles area if there are some locals > here - Randall?) > 3. I am assuming that an I-beam hoist will be a lot nicer to use than > a floor hoist, but what is your experience? (here I am wondering about > positioning the engine - the trolley will allow me lateral movement, but for > fore and aft, I suppose I would need to push the car as opposed to pushing > the floor hoist around -- car could not be on jack stands, etc.). > > Any other tips or advice would be appreciated greatly before I spend > unwisely. Thank you. > > best, > > doug > ____________________ > '72 BSA B50SS > '74 Triumph TR6 > '01 HD XHL 883 > '03 GMC Cargo Van > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as jandkstone99 at msn.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive _________________________________________________________________ Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM, we give. http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/Home/?source=text_hotmail_join From rwil at sbcglobal.net Sat Mar 8 17:12:54 2008 From: rwil at sbcglobal.net (rwil at sbcglobal.net) Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 00:12:54 +0000 Subject: [Shop-talk] hoist and trolley for engine installation In-Reply-To: References: <009901c88157$c8493d40$0502a8c0@B50SS> Message-ID: <735621835-1205021574-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-316842647-@bxe033.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> There is one limitation on a cherry picker. You have to be able to place the wheels under the car far enough to keep the picker from just tipping over when you try to lift the engine. And that can limit your ability to maneuver the load. But I have successfully pulled and replaced a six cyl Austin Healey engine and tranny single handed with my picker, so I am happy. -Roland Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T -----Original Message----- From: Jim Stone Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 17:31:24 To:old dirtbeard , Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] hoist and trolley for engine installation I've done it both ways on my Alpine. I made my own cross bar out of 2x4's (two of them joined together for strength) a few years ago and simply used a come-along to lift the engine. It worked fine, I just rolled the car back and forth to position it. However, IMHO using a cherry picker is definitely easier and they allow you to move the engine around as needed. Plus, cherry pickers have lots of other uses around the house. I've used my to remove an old window air conditioner, uproot a bush, and pull up a porch lantern base that was set in concrete. You can't do any of those with a garage I-beam. > From: dirtbeard at pacbell.net > To: shop-talk at autox.team.net > Date: Sat, 8 Mar 2008 12:05:38 -0800 > Subject: [Shop-talk] hoist and trolley for engine installation > > Hi guys, > > Ready to replace the engine and transmission in my '74 TR6, and my "new" > garage has a 10"x4"x3/8" I-beam across one of the bays (the guy who built it > clearly put it there for a hoist). It also is pre-wired for 240 AC in case I > wanted an electric hoist. > > Looking at McMaster, I see a = ton hand chain CM 622 hoist and trolley > combination for about $300 and a one ton combo for about $360. > > I am not going to be pulling engines daily (or even yearly), so installing a > hoist would be an indulgence (one I would like to think I deserve), but I do > have a pretty good hydraulic floor engine hoist I used to take the engine > out, so I could use it to put it back in. But a trolley hoist would seem > like a nice addition to the garage nonetheless. > > My questions for the group are: > 1. Would the above CM 622 work well or would you recommend some other > options? > 2. Electric would be nice, but they are pretty pricey - any ideas for > locating a used hoist (I am in the Los Angeles area if there are some locals > here - Randall?) > 3. I am assuming that an I-beam hoist will be a lot nicer to use than > a floor hoist, but what is your experience? (here I am wondering about > positioning the engine - the trolley will allow me lateral movement, but for > fore and aft, I suppose I would need to push the car as opposed to pushing > the floor hoist around -- car could not be on jack stands, etc.). > > Any other tips or advice would be appreciated greatly before I spend > unwisely. Thank you. > > best, > > doug > ____________________ > '72 BSA B50SS > '74 Triumph TR6 > '01 HD XHL 883 > '03 GMC Cargo Van > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as jandkstone99 at msn.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive _________________________________________________________________ Helping your favorite cause is as easy as instant messaging. You IM, we give. http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/Home/?source=text_hotmail_join _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html You are subscribed as rwil at sbcglobal.net Shop-talk mailing list http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk http://www.team.net/archive From jem at milleredp.com Sat Mar 8 21:43:34 2008 From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller) Date: Sat, 08 Mar 2008 20:43:34 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] hoist and trolley for engine installation In-Reply-To: References: <009901c88157$c8493d40$0502a8c0@B50SS> Message-ID: <47D36AF6.1050409@milleredp.com> > pickers have lots of other uses around the house. I've used my to remove an > old window air conditioner, uproot a bush, and pull up a porch lantern base > that was set in concrete. You can't do any of those with a garage I-beam. We once inherited this what-was-then-big Mitsubishi television from my wife's sister. It was built like a moderate-quality coffin and weighed about as much as a small-block Ford. It sat out in the garage while we tried to find friends who didn't suddenly have back problems. Finally one morning while my wife was visiting her mother I managed to cherry-picker it onto a castered piece of plywood sitting on the front-door landing over the threshold, dismantled the cherry picker, laid out some plywood on the floor, reassembled the cherry picker in the hallway, rolled the plywood in a ways, slung the TV from the cherry-picker on some nylon straps, lowered it down into our sunken living room, half-disassembled the hoist and moved it down into the living room, slung the TV again, nailed together a little stand to support the TV in front of its niche at the proper height, put some Teflon strips under the TV's feet, lowered it onto the stand and heaved it into where it was going, then dismantled and removed all the support apparatus. It took a bit for my wife to notice it when she got home, fortunately I'd recorded the process in photos... John. From bugi1960 at gmail.com Sun Mar 9 05:11:45 2008 From: bugi1960 at gmail.com (Phil Nase) Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 08:11:45 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] hoist and trolley for engine installation In-Reply-To: <735621835-1205021574-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-316842647-@bxe033.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> References: <009901c88157$c8493d40$0502a8c0@B50SS> <735621835-1205021574-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-316842647-@bxe033.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Message-ID: <000d01c881de$bf362a60$2e01a8c0@na.sjcount.com> I have a cherry picker I use to remove and install small engines. I have good luck with it. Even with the legs folded up it still uses a lot of floor space in a cramped garage. I've seen the electric hoists and thought about getting one to free up some space but I can adjust the crane in all directions and get the engines in and out by myself without dinging the bodywork. I have a leveler to tilt the engines as I put them in but it binds up at the worst time. It's a hand crank type I got from Eastwood. What do you guys use? Have you found a different type that works well? Phil Nase Quakertown, PA http://home.comcast.net/~philnasecpa From arvidj at visi.com Sun Mar 9 06:03:35 2008 From: arvidj at visi.com (Arvid Jedlicka) Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 08:03:35 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sam's Club Toolbox - report and you thought Arvid told you everything ! References: Message-ID: <007101c881e5$fc540dc0$80a8a8c0@dellc84024> ----- Original Message ----- From: "john niolon" Subject: [Shop-talk] Sam's Club Toolbox - report and you thought Arvid told you everything ! > Made a trip to Sam's ... The guides are plastic friction slide type, no > bearings > ... The shiny diamond plate exterior is all for show. it's actually a > stamped > thin sheet metal faceplace on the drawers. Your analysis made me go look at mine again - just to make sure they had the features I thought they did. All three of mine have ball bearing slides and the front face plates are actually the front of the drawers, not simply a facade. It seems as thought the new ones are a step down in quality from the earlier ones - a sign of our times. Arvid From mark at nashvilletn.org Sun Mar 9 09:44:02 2008 From: mark at nashvilletn.org (Mark) Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 11:44:02 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Floor Jacks Message-ID: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> Two years ago my kids gave me a Sears Chinaman floor jack, one of the $200 aluminum types. Twelve months later it started leaking and lost most of it's oil on my garage floor. After much badgering and letters to corporate Sears finally replaced it, under protest and scolding, with another just like it. Now, another 12 months has passed and guess what? The second one is also leaking. I did a little checking and found that I am not the only one with the problem, in fact it seems that they all leak. Anybody tried to fix one of these things? Of course, Sears lists all of the repair parts with part numbers leading one to think they are repairable, but none are available. Short of finding a successful solution, are there any suggestions for a good jack. I have found that there is at least one "MADE IN USA" jack made by Hein-Werner, any experience with them? Mark Nashville http://www.arrestmered.com 58 "Bugeye" 66 TR4A From dmscheidt at gmail.com Sun Mar 9 10:12:02 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 13:12:02 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Floor Jacks In-Reply-To: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> References: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803091012i20cf46ffx89b80b42fc7f8604@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 9, 2008 at 12:44 PM, Mark wrote: > > Short of finding a successful solution, are there any suggestions for a good > jack. I have found that there is at least one "MADE IN USA" jack made by > Hein-Werner, any experience with them? > The Hein-Werner is prety much the standard Lincoln or walker floor jacks that used to be very common. It's, I'm told -- I don't have one, nor have I used one regularly -- a good jack. The shops I've worked in have had Norco jacks, which are great. I've also used a number of Milwaukee (not the same company as the power tools) jacks, which are very well built (in Milwaukee, even), but are quite spendy. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From robolane at sbcglobal.net Sun Mar 9 11:17:55 2008 From: robolane at sbcglobal.net (ROBERT LANE) Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 11:17:55 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Shop-talk] Cherry Piker Use Message-ID: <149254.48782.qm@web82007.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I bought a 4 ft x 9 ft welding table that separates in the middle and only has the 4 corner legs. The table was located against a wall in a building with a rough dirt floor. The guy I purchased it from said it took 4 people to put it in the building. They had tried to use a cherry picker but it wouldn't roll over the rough floor. I bolted cheap HF pneumatic tires to the outside of the arm wheel locations . For base I added the the same size tires to 2 pcs, of square tubing with shims to make fit inside of the base tubing. When I went to pickup it up the guy couldn't believe that that setup would work. He started to break down the table. I told him to just leave it together, because I didn't want to reassemble when I got it moved. It was a little struggle but with a tilt bed trailer and a hand winch I hooked on the picker and winch the whole thing on the trailer. The matter of necessity makes people do creative things. CATCH YOU LATER, ROBO From kvacek at ameritech.net Sun Mar 9 15:44:52 2008 From: kvacek at ameritech.net (Karl Vacek) Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 17:44:52 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Floor Jacks References: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> <2400a5d40803091012i20cf46ffx89b80b42fc7f8604@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <008701c88237$30ebc8b0$6e01a8c0@KARL> The Hein-Werner looks like a somewhat updated model of the 2-1/2-ton 1954 Walker that I bought rebuilt in 1971. Can't tell from the pictures if it's as heavily made, but it weighs about the same as mine. It began to stick in the 1980's or 1990's and I had it repaired, along with replacing the universal joint on the valve. That's it. Never added fluid, never did a thing. And I think that when I had it repaired all he did was disassemble it and reassemble it - he only charged me $20 or so. I did spend $175 on it back then, which was a heck of a lot of money. Back then the cheap import jacks were just beginning to come out, and they were similar in price to what I got, just far less beefy. It's heavy, but it's always been there for me, working as it was designed. Highly recommended. Karl > The Hein-Werner is prety much the standard Lincoln or walker floor > jacks that used to be very common. It's, I'm told -- I don't have > one, nor have I used one regularly -- a good jack. >> Short of finding a successful solution, are there any suggestions for a >> good >> jack. I have found that there is at least one "MADE IN USA" jack made >> by >> Hein-Werner, any experience with them? From dmscheidt at gmail.com Sun Mar 9 18:19:33 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 21:19:33 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Floor Jacks In-Reply-To: <008701c88237$30ebc8b0$6e01a8c0@KARL> References: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> <2400a5d40803091012i20cf46ffx89b80b42fc7f8604@mail.gmail.com> <008701c88237$30ebc8b0$6e01a8c0@KARL> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803091819u4ab5c97es196f7b9d19b8d28b@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 9, 2008 at 6:44 PM, Karl Vacek wrote: > The Hein-Werner looks like a somewhat updated model of the 2-1/2-ton 1954 > Walker that I bought rebuilt in 1971. Can't tell from the pictures if it's > If I understand correctly, it uses the same repair kits. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From jeffers at mwt.net Sun Mar 9 18:56:44 2008 From: jeffers at mwt.net (Jeffers) Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2008 20:56:44 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Floor Jacks In-Reply-To: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> References: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> Message-ID: <47D4955C.5060705@mwt.net> I have an AC Hydraulics DK13HLQ and love it. I bought it 6 years ago and every time I use it, I am glad I did not let the high cost stop me from buying it. This is a quality tool that you will use more than you think. http://www2.northerntool.com/product/200330414.htm Tom Mark wrote: > Two years ago my kids gave me a Sears Chinaman floor jack, one of the $200 > aluminum types. Twelve months later it started leaking and lost most of it's > oil on my garage floor. After much badgering and letters to corporate Sears > finally replaced it, under protest and scolding, with another just like it. > Now, another 12 months has passed and guess what? The second one is also > leaking. I did a little checking and found that I am not the only one with > the problem, in fact it seems that they all leak. Anybody tried to fix one > of these things? Of course, Sears lists all of the repair parts with part > numbers leading one to think they are repairable, but none are available. > > Short of finding a successful solution, are there any suggestions for a good > jack. I have found that there is at least one "MADE IN USA" jack made by > Hein-Werner, any experience with them? > > Mark > Nashville > http://www.arrestmered.com > 58 "Bugeye" > 66 TR4A > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as jeffers at mwt.net > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive From roadsters at hornesystemstx.com Sun Mar 9 19:14:13 2008 From: roadsters at hornesystemstx.com (Pat Horne) Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2008 21:14:13 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Floor Jacks In-Reply-To: <008701c88237$30ebc8b0$6e01a8c0@KARL> References: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> <2400a5d40803091012i20cf46ffx89b80b42fc7f8604@mail.gmail.com> <008701c88237$30ebc8b0$6e01a8c0@KARL> Message-ID: <47D49975.20006@hornesystemstx.com> Back in the mid 70's I bought a Hein-Warner "o-boy" 1.25 ton floor jack. It worked flawlessly for me until one day it was stole. I found another one at a local hydraulics shop used and bought it. The only problem I've had with that one in 20 years is that it has started to leak around the pump. I have not taken the time to repair it, just put more jack oil in it as needed. I plan on replacing all the seals in it when I get around to it. Both of these jacks were great and I'd do it again in a heartbeat. Peace, Pat Thusly spake Karl Vacek: > The Hein-Werner looks like a somewhat updated model of the 2-1/2-ton 1954 > Walker that I bought rebuilt in 1971. Can't tell from the pictures if it's > as heavily made, but it weighs about the same as mine. It began to stick in > the 1980's or 1990's and I had it repaired, along with replacing the > universal joint on the valve. That's it. Never added fluid, never did a > thing. And I think that when I had it repaired all he did was disassemble > it and reassemble it - he only charged me $20 or so. > > I did spend $175 on it back then, which was a heck of a lot of money. Back > then the cheap import jacks were just beginning to come out, and they were > similar in price to what I got, just far less beefy. It's heavy, but it's > always been there for me, working as it was designed. > > Highly recommended. > > Karl > > > > >> The Hein-Werner is prety much the standard Lincoln or walker floor >> jacks that used to be very common. It's, I'm told -- I don't have >> one, nor have I used one regularly -- a good jack. >> > > >>> Short of finding a successful solution, are there any suggestions for a >>> good >>> jack. I have found that there is at least one "MADE IN USA" jack made >>> by >>> Hein-Werner, any experience with them? >>> > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as roadsters at hornesystemstx.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive > > > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- From mikey at b2systems.com Sun Mar 9 21:21:40 2008 From: mikey at b2systems.com (Mike Rambour) Date: Sun, 09 Mar 2008 21:21:40 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] Floor Jacks In-Reply-To: <47D4955C.5060705@mwt.net> References: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> <47D4955C.5060705@mwt.net> Message-ID: <47D4B754.7070405@b2systems.com> awesome floor jack...I have the same AC jack for 4 years now with fairly heavy use it no longer looks good but still works great. Jeffers wrote: > I have an AC Hydraulics DK13HLQ and love it. I bought it 6 years ago > and every time I use it, I am glad I did not let the high cost stop me > from buying it. This is a quality tool that you will use more than you > think. > > http://www2.northerntool.com/product/200330414.htm > > Tom > > Mark wrote: > >> Two years ago my kids gave me a Sears Chinaman floor jack, one of the $200 >> aluminum types. Twelve months later it started leaking and lost most of it's >> oil on my garage floor. After much badgering and letters to corporate Sears >> finally replaced it, under protest and scolding, with another just like it. >> Now, another 12 months has passed and guess what? The second one is also >> leaking. I did a little checking and found that I am not the only one with >> the problem, in fact it seems that they all leak. Anybody tried to fix one >> of these things? Of course, Sears lists all of the repair parts with part >> numbers leading one to think they are repairable, but none are available. >> >> Short of finding a successful solution, are there any suggestions for a good >> jack. I have found that there is at least one "MADE IN USA" jack made by >> Hein-Werner, any experience with them? >> >> Mark >> Nashville >> http://www.arrestmered.com >> 58 "Bugeye" >> 66 TR4A >> _______________________________________________ >> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> You are subscribed as jeffers at mwt.net >> >> Shop-talk mailing list >> >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk >> >> http://www.team.net/archive >> > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as mikey at b2systems.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive From wmgilroy at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 01:18:35 2008 From: wmgilroy at gmail.com (Bill Gilroy) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 01:18:35 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] Floor Jacks In-Reply-To: <47D4B754.7070405@b2systems.com> References: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> <47D4955C.5060705@mwt.net> <47D4B754.7070405@b2systems.com> Message-ID: <441250190803100118g38d2de03s23ecb486a130f443@mail.gmail.com> Ditto, on the AC. Just used it a couple of hours ago to put new brakes in my truck. Great jack. See http://www.ultimategarage.com/ach-overview.html Quality costs money. I have heard good things about Comaq jacks from Denmark. Lincoln made a good jack until they more their factory offshore about 5 years ago. Just wondering where did you find a Hein-Werner and how much will that set you back. I purchased a cheap sears bottle jack to make a power carpet stretcher that I used in some tight spaces. Oil was leaking out of that bad boy first use. Got lucky and got some cardboard under before it stained the carpet. -g On 3/9/08, Mike Rambour wrote: > > awesome floor jack...I have the same AC jack for 4 years now with > fairly heavy use it no longer looks good but still works great. > > Jeffers wrote: > > I have an AC Hydraulics DK13HLQ and love it. I bought it 6 years ago > > and every time I use it, I am glad I did not let the high cost stop me > > from buying it. This is a quality tool that you will use more than you > > think. > > > > http://www2.northerntool.com/product/200330414.htm > > > > Tom > > > > Mark wrote: > > > >> Two years ago my kids gave me a Sears Chinaman floor jack, one of the > $200 > >> aluminum types. Twelve months later it started leaking and lost most of > it's > >> oil on my garage floor. After much badgering and letters to corporate > Sears > >> finally replaced it, under protest and scolding, with another just like > it. > >> Now, another 12 months has passed and guess what? The second one is > also > >> leaking. I did a little checking and found that I am not the only one > with > >> the problem, in fact it seems that they all leak. Anybody tried to fix > one > >> of these things? Of course, Sears lists all of the repair parts with > part > >> numbers leading one to think they are repairable, but none are > available. > >> > >> Short of finding a successful solution, are there any suggestions for a > good > >> jack. I have found that there is at least one "MADE IN USA" jack made > by > >> Hein-Werner, any experience with them? > >> > >> Mark > >> Nashville > >> http://www.arrestmered.com > >> 58 "Bugeye" > >> 66 TR4A > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > >> > >> You are subscribed as jeffers at mwt.net > >> > >> Shop-talk mailing list > >> > >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > >> > >> http://www.team.net/archive > >> > > _______________________________________________ > > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > You are subscribed as mikey at b2systems.com > > > > Shop-talk mailing list > > > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as wmgilroy at gmail.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive From eabb at loc.gov Mon Mar 10 09:24:32 2008 From: eabb at loc.gov (Eugene D Abbondelo) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 12:24:32 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Floor Jacks In-Reply-To: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> References: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> Message-ID: <47D528800200007400036415@ntgwgate.loc.gov> Mark: I've had a Hein-Werner for about 20 years and love it. No problems for 19 B= years and I have been hard on it. About 8 months ago it started to leak--but not a bad leak. I loved the jack so much I decided to have it completely rebuilt for almost $300 by a jack specialist firm in Baltimore, Maryland. I hope it's good for another 20 years. I understand the parent company for H-W is Lincoln. Gene Short of finding a successful solution, are there any suggestions for a good jack. I have found that there is at least one "MADE IN USA" jack made by Hein-Werner, any experience with them? Mark Nashville From paul.mele at usermail.com Mon Mar 10 10:05:22 2008 From: paul.mele at usermail.com (Paul Mele) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 13:05:22 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Floor Jacks; Oh-boy In-Reply-To: <47D528800200007400036415@ntgwgate.loc.gov> References: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> <47D528800200007400036415@ntgwgate.loc.gov> Message-ID: <000d01c882d0$edfa4730$c9eed590$@mele@usermail.com> I bought a used "oh boy" from a gas station / mechanic that was retiring in 1973; who knows how old it was; always a good jack. replaced the rubbers around 1978; used it until 1995 or so...leaking again; gave it to a friend as project/ first jack. I bought a HF 2-ton job (# not handy); has worked fine since then. Only gets used one project a month or so, however. <> From eric at megageek.com Mon Mar 10 11:45:00 2008 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 14:45:00 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) Message-ID: You all know those LCD picture frames that are selling like hot cakes now-a-days? I will be deploying to Iraq (again) in a few months and I wanted one for me there. But instead of packing and bringing one with me, I was hoping to find a software package that allows me to let me laptop work as one when I'm not using it. I know that there are packages out there that do that, but I don't want to get burned with spyware and adware. So, does anyone know a good cheap (free is best) software package to make a regular laptop into a picture frame viewer? TIA. Moose "We all know we're dying, And there's no sign of a parachute." Tori Amos From parkanzky at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 11:55:26 2008 From: parkanzky at gmail.com (Paul Parkanzky) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 14:55:26 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I have a Macbook, and I have the screensaver set to cycle randomly through a folder full of pictures. I remember doing the same thing when I used to have my PC notebooks, and I don't think that I had to get any special software to do it. Do the current versions of Windoze not offer this anymore? I have XP on my work notebook and I can't figure out where the screensaver settings are... -Paul On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 2:45 PM, wrote: > You all know those LCD picture frames that are selling like hot cakes > now-a-days? > > I will be deploying to Iraq (again) in a few months and I wanted one for me > there. But instead of packing and bringing one with me, I was hoping to > find a software package that allows me to let me laptop work as one when > I'm not using it. > > I know that there are packages out there that do that, but I don't want to > get burned with spyware and adware. > > So, does anyone know a good cheap (free is best) software package to make a > regular laptop into a picture frame viewer? TIA. > > > > Moose > > "We all know we're dying, And there's no sign of a parachute." > Tori Amos > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as parkanzky at gmail.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive From jniolon at bham.rr.com Mon Mar 10 11:57:54 2008 From: jniolon at bham.rr.com (john niolon) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 13:57:54 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] lcd picture frame Message-ID: <6746F0F83C244D49A3D4F0A42F9A0D05@OwnerPC> both XP and Vista have a choice in the screen saver pull down that is "slide show" or something similar... just click on settings and tell it where to look (folder) john The reason congressmen try so hard to get re-elected is that they would hate to have to make a living under the laws they've passed. From dmscheidt at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 11:58:15 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 14:58:15 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 2:55 PM, Paul Parkanzky wrote: > I have a Macbook, and I have the screensaver set to cycle randomly > through a folder full of pictures. I remember doing the same thing > when I used to have my PC notebooks, and I don't think that I had to > get any special software to do it. Do the current versions of Windoze > not offer this anymore? I have XP on my work notebook and I can't > figure out where the screensaver settings are... Control panel->display->screen saver tab There's a "my pictures slideshow" option that does what Inch wants. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From strovato at optonline.net Mon Mar 10 11:53:11 2008 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 14:53:11 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) Message-ID: <0JXJ00J5C34P6K01@mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> What operating system are you running? Windows already has a screen saver that provides exactly this capability. I know it is standard in XP, not sure where else. -Steve Trovato strovato at optonline.net From eric at megageek.com Mon Mar 10 12:09:53 2008 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 15:09:53 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) Message-ID: DUH! I never use the screen savers (and I don't use windows normally) But that was the answer. Thanks all for the fast response! Moose "We all know we're dying, And there's no sign of a parachute." Tori Amos From parkanzky at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 12:19:36 2008 From: parkanzky at gmail.com (Paul Parkanzky) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 15:19:36 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) In-Reply-To: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> References: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: First place I looked. I don't have that tab. Must be something our IT people remove for some reason. Our computers lock automatically after a short period of time. Disabling the screensaver must be part of that deal. -Paul On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 2:58 PM, David Scheidt wrote: > On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 2:55 PM, Paul Parkanzky wrote: > > I have a Macbook, and I have the screensaver set to cycle randomly > > through a folder full of pictures. I remember doing the same thing > > when I used to have my PC notebooks, and I don't think that I had to > > get any special software to do it. Do the current versions of Windoze > > not offer this anymore? I have XP on my work notebook and I can't > > figure out where the screensaver settings are... > > Control panel->display->screen saver tab > > There's a "my pictures slideshow" option that does what Inch wants. > > -- > David Scheidt > dmscheidt at gmail.com From Tim.Mullen at ngc.com Mon Mar 10 12:30:16 2008 From: Tim.Mullen at ngc.com (Mullen, Tim) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 14:30:16 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) In-Reply-To: References: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9C2F69BA6FB69F43ABCDBCFFC282C7970109B6C8@XMBIL103.northgrum.com> Paul Parkanzky wrote: > > First place I looked. I don't have that tab. Must be > something our IT people remove for some reason. Our > computers lock automatically after a short period of time. > Disabling the screensaver must be part of that deal. I don't have such a tab either. But I just right click on a blank spot of the desktop, and select "Properties" on the menu that pops up. Then on the "Display Properties" window that pops up, select the "Screen Saver" tab. Under "Screen saver" should be a pull down list of available screen savers. Click the down arrow, and hopefully, there will be a selection that says "My Pictures Slideshow". Select it, then click the "Settings" button and point it to the directory where you have your photos... Our systems are set to force us to have a screen saver to "lock" our computers (need a password to get back on), but they allow us to pick our own screen saver (can't change the time out or anything)... Tim Mullen From parkanzky at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 12:35:23 2008 From: parkanzky at gmail.com (Paul Parkanzky) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 15:35:23 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) In-Reply-To: <9C2F69BA6FB69F43ABCDBCFFC282C7970109B6C8@XMBIL103.northgrum.com> References: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> <9C2F69BA6FB69F43ABCDBCFFC282C7970109B6C8@XMBIL103.northgrum.com> Message-ID: Still no dice. I have no screensaver tab in the Display Properties window. When ours lock it is the 'computer lock' you get when you press Windows-L, not a screensaver lock. -Paul On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 3:30 PM, Mullen, Tim wrote: > Paul Parkanzky wrote: > > > > First place I looked. I don't have that tab. Must be > > something our IT people remove for some reason. Our > > computers lock automatically after a short period of time. > > Disabling the screensaver must be part of that deal. > > > I don't have such a tab either. > > But I just right click on a blank spot of the desktop, and select > "Properties" on the menu that pops up. > > Then on the "Display Properties" window that pops up, select the "Screen > Saver" tab. > > Under "Screen saver" should be a pull down list of available screen > savers. > Click the down arrow, and hopefully, there will be a selection that says > "My Pictures Slideshow". Select it, then click the "Settings" button > and point it to the directory where you have your photos... > > Our systems are set to force us to have a screen saver to "lock" our > computers (need a password to get back on), but they allow us to pick > our own screen saver (can't change the time out or anything)... > > > Tim Mullen > > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as parkanzky at gmail.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive From Tim.Mullen at ngc.com Mon Mar 10 13:07:35 2008 From: Tim.Mullen at ngc.com (Mullen, Tim) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 15:07:35 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) In-Reply-To: References: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> <9C2F69BA6FB69F43ABCDBCFFC282C7970109B6C8@XMBIL103.northgrum.com> Message-ID: <9C2F69BA6FB69F43ABCDBCFFC282C7970109B738@XMBIL103.northgrum.com> Paul Parkanzky wrote: > > Still no dice. I have no screensaver tab in the > Display Properties window. When ours lock it is > the 'computer lock' you get when you press > Windows-L, not a screensaver lock. Bummer. We get the screen saver, and when you touch a key/move the mouse, Then we get the Windows-L logon. Sounds like your people are even more anal than ours. Tim Mullen From peter.steinberg at thermofisher.com Mon Mar 10 12:48:11 2008 From: peter.steinberg at thermofisher.com (Steinberg, Peter) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 15:48:11 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) In-Reply-To: References: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <498C5B1BA52B354C99634271817561290D8F6FFF1B@USWAL-MXVS1.amer.thermo.com> Go into the registry editor and change the key: HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Policies\ System\NoDispScrSavPage to be 0. That will restore the the screensaver page in the display properties. Peter -----Original Message----- From: shop-talk-bounces+peter.steinberg=thermofisher.com at autox.team.net [mailto:shop-talk-bounces+peter.steinberg=thermofisher.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Paul Parkanzky Sent: Monday, March 10, 2008 2:20 PM To: David Scheidt Cc: shop-talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) First place I looked. I don't have that tab. Must be something our IT people remove for some reason. Our computers lock automatically after a short period of time. Disabling the screensaver must be part of that deal. -Paul On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 2:58 PM, David Scheidt wrote: > On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 2:55 PM, Paul Parkanzky wrote: > > I have a Macbook, and I have the screensaver set to cycle randomly > > through a folder full of pictures. I remember doing the same thing > > when I used to have my PC notebooks, and I don't think that I had to > > get any special software to do it. Do the current versions of > > Windoze not offer this anymore? I have XP on my work notebook and > > I can't figure out where the screensaver settings are... > > Control panel->display->screen saver tab > > There's a "my pictures slideshow" option that does what Inch wants. > > -- > David Scheidt > dmscheidt at gmail.com You are subscribed as peter.steinberg at thermofisher.com Shop-talk mailing list http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk http://www.team.net/archive From strovato at optonline.net Mon Mar 10 14:08:47 2008 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 17:08:47 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) References: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <0JXJ006XD9EOK881@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> You mean there are system administrators who don't trust their users to manage a screensaver, but they let them have access to edit the registry? What's wrong with this picture? -Steve Trovato strovato at optonline.net At 03:48 PM 3/10/2008, Steinberg, Peter wrote: >Go into the registry editor and change the key: > HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Policies\ >System\NoDispScrSavPage >to be 0. > >That will restore the the screensaver page in the display properties. > >Peter From jamesf at groupwbench.org Mon Mar 10 15:21:46 2008 From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 18:21:46 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Cast iron to PVC soil pipe adapter? In-Reply-To: <006d01c88168$66a7e440$6e01a8c0@KARL> References: <006d01c88168$66a7e440$6e01a8c0@KARL> Message-ID: <0AF472AA-FE75-4BD3-8094-3ACEF156233B@groupwbench.org> I was in HD yesterday and the only cast iron I saw was a toilet flange. Actually I saw about 12 different types of flanges. Oy. I tore up the slab a bit and what I have is a wye and a 45 in the bull to make it vertical. This stuff is 80 years old. What are the chances the lead will come undone nicely without cracking the cast iron? ObShop: This bathroom is for the shop :-) jim On Mar 8, 2008, at 5:04 PM, Karl Vacek wrote: > Why not just use cast iron ? It's not that horribly expensive > compared to > the hassle of trying to reliably join PVC to cast iron. And no > leading is > required below grade nowadays - at least not here in the northeast > part of > the Peoples Republic of Illinois, where the unions make sure we > have some > pretty tight codes. You just put in a rubber insert and lubricant, > and pop > the fitting together. > > Karl > > > >> I'm adding a half bath in the basement and I'm toying with doing the >> plumbing myself. My soil pipe is cast iron, laid horizontally just >> under the surface of the slab. Then there are 2 45s to bring it >> vertical. I need to yank out the 45s and insert a 90. I've seen >> adapters online for inserting vertically PVC pipe into cast iron >> flanges, but never horizontal where the water will theoretically sit >> on the joint. Do I use the same fitting or is it a different process? >> Is there a brand name fitting? Which sealant or caulk? >> >> thanks, >> jim > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as jamesf at groupwbench.org > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive From rbeels at yahoo.com Mon Mar 10 17:03:46 2008 From: rbeels at yahoo.com (Richard Beels) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 20:03:46 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Floor Jacks In-Reply-To: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> References: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> Message-ID: <6.2.5.6.2.20080310193041.03690a68@yahoo.com> Norco. Made in Taiwan with Japanese seals. Every unit is unboxed and tested when it hits the warehouse in AZ before they get shipped out. LIFETIME warranty. They have a few different models in each x-ton space - depends on what you want exactly. Lincoln is a sad story. Lincoln got sold to Pentair. Pentair believed that they could take the product to Taiwan (first) and keep the market the price the same thus increasing the margin. They thought that they could just close the Jonesboro, AR plant and send the equipment over and bang out what they thought was a commodity called "hydraulic jack". NOT. Container after container were shipped to the USA with defective product and it trashed the good Lincoln name. After a couple of years of torture, Pentair sold the jack division to CLORE and the Lincoln Lube to someone else (along with the exclusive rights to the Lincoln brand name). The lube folks did not want CLORE using the Lincoln name anymore and gave them six months to eliminate it. That's when they started using Marquette name on the old 93642 Lincoln part number. CLORE made battery chargers/testers and didn't have a clue about hydraulics. Worse yet they hired a guy from Sherwin Williams to run the division. It was destined to fail. After another two years of ****ing up the product line, Shinn Fu bought what was left. The purchase also included the Blackhawk and Hein Werner brand names. Shinn Fu has since started selling the old made in USA product under the Hein Werner name. The 93642 is now being sold as a Hein Werner and is made by a shop in Iowa. Everyone is scared to death to buy anything looking like a Lincoln. Shinn Fu is working at it but it is going to be tough to come back... At 3/9/2008 at 12:44, Shakespearean monkeys danced on Mark's keyboard and said: >Two years ago my kids gave me a Sears Chinaman floor jack, one of the $200 >aluminum types. Twelve months later it started leaking and lost most of it's >oil on my garage floor. After much badgering and letters to corporate Sears >finally replaced it, under protest and scolding, with another just like it. >Now, another 12 months has passed and guess what? The second one is also >leaking. I did a little checking and found that I am not the only one with >the problem, in fact it seems that they all leak. Anybody tried to fix one >of these things? Of course, Sears lists all of the repair parts with part >numbers leading one to think they are repairable, but none are available. > >Short of finding a successful solution, are there any suggestions for a good >jack. I have found that there is at least one "MADE IN USA" jack made by >Hein-Werner, any experience with them? Cheers! From jibjib at att.net Mon Mar 10 17:43:41 2008 From: jibjib at att.net (Jack Brooks) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 17:43:41 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) In-Reply-To: <0JXJ006XD9EOK881@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> References: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> <0JXJ006XD9EOK881@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Message-ID: <02b601c88310$f511f7d0$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> Access the registry??? I can't even run a defrag on my work laptop. Jack -----Original Message----- From: shop-talk-bounces+jibjib=att.net at autox.team.net [mailto:shop-talk-bounces+jibjib=att.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Steven Trovato Sent: Monday, March 10, 2008 2:09 PM To: Steinberg, Peter Cc: shop-talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) You mean there are system administrators who don't trust their users to manage a screensaver, but they let them have access to edit the registry? What's wrong with this picture? -Steve Trovato strovato at optonline.net At 03:48 PM 3/10/2008, Steinberg, Peter wrote: >Go into the registry editor and change the key: > >HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Policies\ >System\NoDispScrSavPage >to be 0. > >That will restore the the screensaver page in the display properties. > >Peter You are subscribed as jibjib at att.net Shop-talk mailing list http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk http://www.team.net/archive From eric at megageek.com Mon Mar 10 17:42:27 2008 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 20:42:27 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] One more question about the screen saver photos (LCD Frame) Message-ID: Is there a way to add that default XP screen saver to Win2000? (I use win 2000 on my work laptop and that is the one I'll be using in country.) Thanks. Moose "We all know we're dying, And there's no sign of a parachute." Tori Amos From jibjib at att.net Mon Mar 10 17:48:00 2008 From: jibjib at att.net (Jack Brooks) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 17:48:00 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] hoist and trolley for engine installation In-Reply-To: <009901c88157$c8493d40$0502a8c0@B50SS> References: <009901c88157$c8493d40$0502a8c0@B50SS> Message-ID: <02b701c88311$8f4e86b0$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> A regular hoist will, as you state, allow for x & Y movement. With my TR3, I needed to move the engine/tranny combo in both directions to get it completely installed without dinging any paint. Moving the car should work fine. On the other hand, the nice thing about TR's is that you can drop the tranny in through the cockpit pretty easily. Jack -----Original Message----- From: shop-talk-bounces+jibjib=att.net at autox.team.net [mailto:shop-talk-bounces+jibjib=att.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of old dirtbeard Sent: Saturday, March 08, 2008 12:06 PM To: shop-talk at autox.team.net Subject: [Shop-talk] hoist and trolley for engine installation Hi guys, Ready to replace the engine and transmission in my '74 TR6, and my "new" garage has a 10"x4"x3/8" I-beam across one of the bays (the guy who built it clearly put it there for a hoist). It also is pre-wired for 240 AC in case I wanted an electric hoist. Looking at McMaster, I see a = ton hand chain CM 622 hoist and trolley combination for about $300 and a one ton combo for about $360. I am not going to be pulling engines daily (or even yearly), so installing a hoist would be an indulgence (one I would like to think I deserve), but I do have a pretty good hydraulic floor engine hoist I used to take the engine out, so I could use it to put it back in. But a trolley hoist would seem like a nice addition to the garage nonetheless. My questions for the group are: 1. Would the above CM 622 work well or would you recommend some other options? 2. Electric would be nice, but they are pretty pricey - any ideas for locating a used hoist (I am in the Los Angeles area if there are some locals here - Randall?) 3. I am assuming that an I-beam hoist will be a lot nicer to use than a floor hoist, but what is your experience? (here I am wondering about positioning the engine - the trolley will allow me lateral movement, but for fore and aft, I suppose I would need to push the car as opposed to pushing the floor hoist around -- car could not be on jack stands, etc.). Any other tips or advice would be appreciated greatly before I spend unwisely. Thank you. best, doug ____________________ '72 BSA B50SS '74 Triumph TR6 '01 HD XHL 883 '03 GMC Cargo Van You are subscribed as jibjib at att.net Shop-talk mailing list http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk http://www.team.net/archive From parkanzky at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 18:02:31 2008 From: parkanzky at gmail.com (Paul Parkanzky) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 21:02:31 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) In-Reply-To: <02b601c88310$f511f7d0$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> References: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> <0JXJ006XD9EOK881@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <02b601c88310$f511f7d0$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> Message-ID: Correct. No regedit for me. On 3/10/08, Jack Brooks wrote: > Access the registry??? I can't even run a defrag on my work laptop. > > Jack > > > -----Original Message----- > From: shop-talk-bounces+jibjib=att.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:shop-talk-bounces+jibjib=att.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Steven > Trovato > Sent: Monday, March 10, 2008 2:09 PM > To: Steinberg, Peter > Cc: shop-talk > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) > > > You mean there are system administrators who don't trust their users to > manage a screensaver, but they let them have access to edit the registry? > What's wrong with this picture? > > -Steve Trovato > strovato at optonline.net > > At 03:48 PM 3/10/2008, Steinberg, Peter wrote: > >Go into the registry editor and change the key: > > > >HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Policies\ > >System\NoDispScrSavPage > >to be 0. > > > >That will restore the the screensaver page in the display properties. > > > >Peter > > You are subscribed as jibjib at att.net > > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as parkanzky at gmail.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive From dirtbeard at pacbell.net Mon Mar 10 19:00:33 2008 From: dirtbeard at pacbell.net (old dirtbeard) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 19:00:33 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] 9,500 kWh of production in first year Message-ID: <013a01c8831b$b8f63d00$0502a8c0@B50SS> Hi all, It was one year ago today that we installed a 6 kWh, residential PV system (30 Kyocera 200W panels and a SMA 6000U inverter, located in the Los Angeles area). After 365 days, it has generated 9,559 kWh on 4,396 hours, averaging about 26.2 kWh/day. We are on 12-month, net metering, and I won't get the final bill for a while, but we will run a small surplus this year (generated more than we consumed). The year before we used more than a million watt hours of power, so in addition to generating the power, we reduced our consumption a little. I switched to CF lighting in most locations without dimmers, reduced the wattage of many of the incandescent lights, put timers and motion sensor switches, etc. I have posted this before, but here are photos of the array and the inverter: http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~shook/images/Picture%20002.jpg http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~shook/images/Picture%20008.jpg http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~shook/images/Picture%20009.jpg http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~shook/images/Picture%20010.jpg http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~shook/images/Picture%20011.jpg http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~shook/images/Picture%20012.jpg I am very glad we did it. With no increase in utility rates, it should pay for itself in less than seven years (we are on Edison and many months we were paying the 200% over baseline rates which can quadruple the cost per watt). If you are operating at baseline rates, it probably would take you longer to achieve a 100% ROI. I have to confess, I find myself standing in front of the inverter on sunny days "just watching" the power. The peak generation I have observed was 6,015 watts at 387 VDC -- it will spin that utility meter backwards like a son-of-gun. Best, doug From parkanzky at gmail.com Mon Mar 10 19:08:27 2008 From: parkanzky at gmail.com (Paul Parkanzky) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 22:08:27 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] 9,500 kWh of production in first year In-Reply-To: <013a01c8831b$b8f63d00$0502a8c0@B50SS> References: <013a01c8831b$b8f63d00$0502a8c0@B50SS> Message-ID: It's very cool! But between our dreary winters and lower energy costs I don't think that we can begin to justify it. Maybe in a few years when we build our dream home. -Paul in Grand Rapids, MI On 3/10/08, old dirtbeard wrote: > Hi all, > > It was one year ago today that we installed a 6 kWh, residential PV system > (30 Kyocera 200W panels and a SMA 6000U inverter, located in the Los Angeles > area). > > After 365 days, it has generated 9,559 kWh on 4,396 hours, averaging about > 26.2 kWh/day. We are on 12-month, net metering, and I won't get the final > bill for a while, but we will run a small surplus this year (generated more > than we consumed). > > The year before we used more than a million watt hours of power, so in > addition to generating the power, we reduced our consumption a little. I > switched to CF lighting in most locations without dimmers, reduced the > wattage of many of the incandescent lights, put timers and motion sensor > switches, etc. > > I have posted this before, but here are photos of the array and the > inverter: > > http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~shook/images/Picture%20002.jpg > http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~shook/images/Picture%20008.jpg > http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~shook/images/Picture%20009.jpg > http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~shook/images/Picture%20010.jpg > http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~shook/images/Picture%20011.jpg > http://www-rcf.usc.edu/~shook/images/Picture%20012.jpg > > I am very glad we did it. > > With no increase in utility rates, it should pay for itself in less than > seven years (we are on Edison and many months we were paying the 200% over > baseline rates which can quadruple the cost per watt). If you are operating > at baseline rates, it probably would take you longer to achieve a 100% ROI. > > I have to confess, I find myself standing in front of the inverter on sunny > days "just watching" the power. The peak generation I have observed was > 6,015 watts at 387 VDC -- it will spin that utility meter backwards like a > son-of-gun. > > Best, > > doug > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as parkanzky at gmail.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive From wmc_st at xxiii.com Mon Mar 10 19:18:01 2008 From: wmc_st at xxiii.com (Wayne) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 22:18:01 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' In-Reply-To: <02b601c88310$f511f7d0$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> References: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> <0JXJ006XD9EOK881@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <02b601c88310$f511f7d0$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> Message-ID: <47D5EBD9.90603@xxiii.com> Jack Brooks wrote: > Access the registry??? I can't even run a defrag on my work laptop. As a SysAdmin sorta guy myself, I probably shouldn't tell ya'. But security via obscurity is BS anyway (that's why I generally avoid windoze boxes). Google around -- there are many password crack utilities for Windows NT, 2000 & XP. Most will boot Linux, then mount the NTFS C: partition and run a registry editor to let you overwrite the Admin password. The system's SID is not modified, so it shouldn't affect your ability to login to the domain @ work. Then use "services" from the controls and make sure "Run As Service" is enabled. You can then right click on Defrag, select "Run As", enter the admin password you selected and do what you want. -Wayne From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Mon Mar 10 20:23:15 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 19:23:15 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] LCD Picture Frames (slightly shop related) In-Reply-To: <0JXJ006XD9EOK881@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Message-ID: <20080311022315.VMOC20654.mta10.adelphia.net@randall> > You mean there are system administrators who don't trust > their users to manage a screensaver, but they let them have > access to edit the registry? What's wrong with this picture? SHHH !!! Actually, there is a certain warped logic to that ... as you know, many virii masquerade as screen savers. So some suit makes an executive decision "There will be no screensavers". But said suit thinks a registry is only for getting married so there's no such prohibition for that. So, the IT folk, being sympathetic but also wanting to keep their jobs, leave the obvious back door open; hoping that anyone sophisticated enough to use it is also NOT going to let their computers be infected by such an obvious method. Randall From strovato at optonline.net Mon Mar 10 19:29:07 2008 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 22:29:07 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' In-Reply-To: <47D5EBD9.90603@xxiii.com> References: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> <0JXJ006XD9EOK881@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <02b601c88310$f511f7d0$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> <47D5EBD9.90603@xxiii.com> Message-ID: <0JXJ009DGO9V2EU0@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> I guess it depends how much you want to defy your company's policies. Doing all that makes it pretty clear that you are going out of your way to beat the system. Is it really worth risking your job, or even just pissing off your management so you can run defrag? Doesn't seem worth it to me. Now if you could beat the porn filter on the internet, maybe that would be worth it. :-) At 10:18 PM 3/10/2008, Wayne wrote: >Jack Brooks wrote: > > Access the registry??? I can't even run a defrag on my work laptop. > >As a SysAdmin sorta guy myself, I probably shouldn't tell ya'. But >security via obscurity is BS anyway (that's why I generally avoid >windoze boxes). Google around -- there are many password crack >utilities for Windows NT, 2000 & XP. Most will boot Linux, then mount >the NTFS C: partition and run a registry editor to let you overwrite the >Admin password. The system's SID is not modified, so it shouldn't >affect your ability to login to the domain @ work. Then use "services" >from the controls and make sure "Run As Service" is enabled. You can >then right click on Defrag, select "Run As", enter the admin password >you selected and do what you want. From wmc_st at xxiii.com Mon Mar 10 19:33:03 2008 From: wmc_st at xxiii.com (Wayne) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 22:33:03 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] 9,500 kWh of production in first year In-Reply-To: <013a01c8831b$b8f63d00$0502a8c0@B50SS> References: <013a01c8831b$b8f63d00$0502a8c0@B50SS> Message-ID: <47D5EF5F.2060206@xxiii.com> old dirtbeard wrote: > It was one year ago today that we installed a 6 kWh, residential PV system > (30 Kyocera 200W panels and a SMA 6000U inverter, located in the Los Angeles Very Cool, Doug! Thanks for the status report. I remember your post from last year. I didn't realize at the time that PV systems had gotten efficient enough to be viable. I've been doing some research on them since. A house with a PV system and geothermal heat pump would be a really kick-ass setup. I'm not a hard-core greenie, but as someone with an engineering background I really appreciate efficiency. -Wayne From kvacek at ameritech.net Mon Mar 10 19:37:33 2008 From: kvacek at ameritech.net (Karl Vacek) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 21:37:33 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fw: Cast iron to PVC soil pipe adapter? Message-ID: <009501c88320$dcecaeb0$6e01a8c0@KARL> Well, HD isn't much of a plumbing supply - you'll have to go to a real plumbing supply for this one. 80 years old, there's a chance it's XH (extra heavy) instead of S (service weight). That may be a problem to mate to Service, which is probably all you'll find available most places today, but your supplier can advice you how to mate that. If you have service weight in there now, it should be easy. As far as removing the old lead, just drill holes in it pretty much the entire distance from the bell to the pipe. A few bug holes and you can begin to pry out chunks of lead. Once you get started you can wiggle the pipes a little and pry the rest loose. Don't worry - the lead is NOT tinned onto the iron - it's just poured into the joint, and as it cools it pulls away a bit. The final step in leading a joint is to peen the lead in - to expand it out to contact the iron to fully seal. Once you get the lead out, pick the oakum out (it'll probably be pretty nasty towards the bottom). Clean everything, slip in the rubber, and pop the fittings together. Or, if you don't want to pour the lead yourself, you could either use oakum and lead wool (just pound it in like oakum, and it suffices OK), or maybe make up the connections, put in the oakum, and have a plumber with a pot and ropes come in to lead it for you. Shouldn't be too expensive for just that. I've tried the "no lead" gook that's supposed to set up and seal the joint, and I've had NO luck at all. Reminds me of Plastic Wood, which has never worked for me either... Your plumbing supplier should be able to offer lots of advice and alternatives. Good luck ! Karl >I was in HD yesterday and the only cast iron I saw was a toilet > flange. Actually I saw about 12 different types of flanges. Oy. > > I tore up the slab a bit and what I have is a wye and a 45 in the > bull to make it vertical. This stuff is 80 years old. What are the > chances the lead will come undone nicely without cracking the cast iron? > > ObShop: This bathroom is for the shop :-) > > jim From jamesf at groupwbench.org Mon Mar 10 19:53:13 2008 From: jamesf at groupwbench.org (Jim Franklin) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 22:53:13 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fw: Cast iron to PVC soil pipe adapter? In-Reply-To: <009501c88320$dcecaeb0$6e01a8c0@KARL> References: <009501c88320$dcecaeb0$6e01a8c0@KARL> Message-ID: <2F3585E7-D915-4A5F-BC02-2004B3D8B2E7@groupwbench.org> I opened up my copy of Renovations by Litchfield and he had a bit on extending the pipe via the cleanout. So I went down and had a better look at the wye and the cleanout is threaded into a leaded adapter, not into the wye itself like I originally thought. I was able to get enough lead out, and there's enough altitude drop, that it seems suitable to use this method and not disturb the wye. Was XH called XH before SV was introduced? All the markings I can see are CEPCO, and a W or M on one hub. I'll get a gasket type thing for both from the "real" plumbing supply in the morning. If I can't get it to seal with that, I have a box of lead wool that my dad had since before I was born. Finally, I know what it's for :-) thanks, jim On Mar 10, 2008, at 10:37 PM, Karl Vacek wrote: > Well, HD isn't much of a plumbing supply - you'll have to go to a real > plumbing > supply for this one. > > 80 years old, there's a chance it's XH (extra heavy) instead of S > (service weight). That may be a problem to mate to Service, which is > probably all you'll find available most places today, but your > supplier can > advice you how to mate that. If you have service weight in there > now, it > should be easy. > > As far as removing the old lead, just drill holes in it pretty much > the > entire distance from the bell to the pipe. A few bug holes and you > can > begin to pry out chunks of lead. Once you get started you can > wiggle the > pipes a little and pry the rest loose. Don't worry - the lead is > NOT tinned > onto the iron - it's just poured into the joint, and as it cools it > pulls > away a bit. The final step in leading a joint is to peen the lead > in - to > expand it out to contact the iron to fully seal. > > Once you get the lead out, pick the oakum out (it'll probably be > pretty > nasty towards the bottom). Clean everything, slip in the rubber, > and pop > the fittings together. > > Or, if you don't want to pour the lead yourself, you could either > use oakum > and lead wool (just pound it in like oakum, and it suffices OK), or > maybe > make up the connections, put in the oakum, and have a plumber with > a pot and > ropes come in to lead it for you. Shouldn't be too expensive for > just that. > I've tried the "no lead" gook that's supposed to set up and seal > the joint, > and I've had NO luck at all. Reminds me of Plastic Wood, which has > never > worked for me either... > > Your plumbing supplier should be able to offer lots of advice and > alternatives. > > Good luck ! > Karl From kvacek at ameritech.net Mon Mar 10 20:09:53 2008 From: kvacek at ameritech.net (Karl Vacek) Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2008 22:09:53 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fw: Cast iron to PVC soil pipe adapter? References: <009501c88320$dcecaeb0$6e01a8c0@KARL> <2F3585E7-D915-4A5F-BC02-2004B3D8B2E7@groupwbench.org> Message-ID: <002b01c88325$60ea1000$6e01a8c0@KARL> Hey - you're on your way. I don't know what M or W stands for - if it's anything the plumbing supply will know, but I bet it's service weight. The weights haven't changed in a looong time, and actually, 80 years isn't that old. If the rubber insert fits just a little loose, lots of silicone works fine as an adjunct. In a recent floor-drain job, I had to mate service weight into an XH hub and every "official" adapter rubber I could find was too loose. I used silicone on the seal and also put a well-siliconed mission coupling on top of everything just to make sure. Kind of belt-and-suspenders, but I was putting oak floors over a concrete slab and didn't want any chance of extra moisture from a weep. Karl >I opened up my copy of Renovations by Litchfield and he had a bit on > extending the pipe via the cleanout. So I went down and had a better > look at the wye and the cleanout is threaded into a leaded adapter, > not into the wye itself like I originally thought. I was able to get > enough lead out, and there's enough altitude drop, that it seems > suitable to use this method and not disturb the wye. > > Was XH called XH before SV was introduced? All the markings I can see > are CEPCO, and a W or M on one hub. I'll get a gasket type thing for > both from the "real" plumbing supply in the morning. If I can't get > it to seal with that, I have a box of lead wool that my dad had since > before I was born. Finally, I know what it's for :-) > > thanks, > jim > > On Mar 10, 2008, at 10:37 PM, Karl Vacek wrote: > >> Well, HD isn't much of a plumbing supply - you'll have to go to a real >> plumbing >> supply for this one. >> >> 80 years old, there's a chance it's XH (extra heavy) instead of S >> (service weight). That may be a problem to mate to Service, which is >> probably all you'll find available most places today, but your >> supplier can >> advice you how to mate that. If you have service weight in there >> now, it >> should be easy. >> >> As far as removing the old lead, just drill holes in it pretty much >> the >> entire distance from the bell to the pipe. A few bug holes and you >> can >> begin to pry out chunks of lead. Once you get started you can >> wiggle the >> pipes a little and pry the rest loose. Don't worry - the lead is >> NOT tinned >> onto the iron - it's just poured into the joint, and as it cools it >> pulls >> away a bit. The final step in leading a joint is to peen the lead >> in - to >> expand it out to contact the iron to fully seal. >> >> Once you get the lead out, pick the oakum out (it'll probably be >> pretty >> nasty towards the bottom). Clean everything, slip in the rubber, >> and pop >> the fittings together. >> >> Or, if you don't want to pour the lead yourself, you could either >> use oakum >> and lead wool (just pound it in like oakum, and it suffices OK), or >> maybe >> make up the connections, put in the oakum, and have a plumber with >> a pot and >> ropes come in to lead it for you. Shouldn't be too expensive for >> just that. >> I've tried the "no lead" gook that's supposed to set up and seal >> the joint, >> and I've had NO luck at all. Reminds me of Plastic Wood, which has >> never >> worked for me either... >> >> Your plumbing supplier should be able to offer lots of advice and >> alternatives. >> >> Good luck ! >> Karl > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as kvacek at ameritech.net > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive From mark at sccaprepared.com Tue Mar 11 07:59:53 2008 From: mark at sccaprepared.com (Mark Andy) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 10:59:53 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Shop-talk] Floor Jacks In-Reply-To: <47D4955C.5060705@mwt.net> References: <00ef01c88204$c8d82e30$0600a8c0@Dell9200> <47D4955C.5060705@mwt.net> Message-ID: Howdy, On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, Jeffers wrote: > I have an AC Hydraulics DK13HLQ and love it. I bought it 6 years ago > and every time I use it, I am glad I did not let the high cost stop me > from buying it. This is a quality tool that you will use more than you > think. > > http://www2.northerntool.com/product/200330414.htm I've thought numerous times about getting one of these... The idea of a low profile jack that could lift a lowered race car to high jackstand height in one go without needing to deal with spacer blocks is pretty cool. I've always been concerned with the fairly low weight rating. What's your experience been using this jack in terms of how much weight it'll reliably lift? Any bending or binding with the long arm & links? Thanks! Mark From mark at sccaprepared.com Tue Mar 11 08:51:27 2008 From: mark at sccaprepared.com (Mark Andy) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 11:51:27 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' In-Reply-To: <47D5EBD9.90603@xxiii.com> References: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> <0JXJ006XD9EOK881@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <02b601c88310$f511f7d0$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> <47D5EBD9.90603@xxiii.com> Message-ID: Howdy, On Mon, 10 Mar 2008, Wayne wrote: > As a SysAdmin sorta guy myself, I probably shouldn't tell ya'. But > security via obscurity is BS anyway (that's why I generally avoid > windoze boxes). Google around -- there are many password crack > utilities for Windows NT, 2000 & XP. Most will boot Linux, then mount > the NTFS C: partition and run a registry editor to let you overwrite the > Admin password. The system's SID is not modified, so it shouldn't > affect your ability to login to the domain @ work. Then use "services" > from the controls and make sure "Run As Service" is enabled. You can > then right click on Defrag, select "Run As", enter the admin password > you selected and do what you want. And, when the friendly helpdesk person tries to log into your computer, can't because you changed the password, and you get fired... Think again about how much you care about having pictures show up on your screen saver. :-) Its your work's computer. If they want to lock it down (even if you & I think its stupid), they can. And chances are there are fairly strict policies in place about how to deal with folks that willfully circumvent their security. Hopefully they wouldn't be that insane, but in my experience, network admin folks (particularly ones that lock stuff like this down) have a very poor sense of humor. Mark From wmc_st at xxiii.com Tue Mar 11 10:54:57 2008 From: wmc_st at xxiii.com (Wayne) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 13:54:57 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' In-Reply-To: <0JXJ009DGO9V2EU0@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> References: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> <0JXJ006XD9EOK881@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <02b601c88310$f511f7d0$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> <47D5EBD9.90603@xxiii.com> <0JXJ009DGO9V2EU0@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Message-ID: <47D6C771.3040307@xxiii.com> Steven Trovato wrote: > I guess it depends how much you want to defy your company's > policies. Doing all that makes it pretty clear that you are going > out of your way to beat the system. Is it really worth risking your > job, or even just pissing off your management so you can run > defrag? Doesn't seem worth it to me. Now if you could beat the porn > filter on the internet, maybe that would be worth it. :-) Ouch! Yeah, you're right. I should have mentioned that. Check your employer's Acceptable Use Policy or other stuff you may have signed there. Defragging your PC is just keeping it running better so you can do our job more efficiently, IMO. As a sysadmin, I got really pissed at some folks at my former employer who were grossly abusing internet usage. Right before I left, I found one salaried guy was spending 20 to 30 hours a week surfing for porn and personal ads. I confronted him about it, and he just seemed clueless, and made some comment like "well, it's just normal guy stuff". I tried to explain I like T&A as much as the next straight guy, but it just wasn't what he was getting paid the big bucks to do. He didn't get it. He did get fired several months after I left, and the place went bankrupt. I still wonder how much was due to 'net slacking. -Wayne From wmc_st at xxiii.com Tue Mar 11 10:55:35 2008 From: wmc_st at xxiii.com (Wayne) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 13:55:35 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' In-Reply-To: References: <2400a5d40803101158r2b70a499i52de91ac6150fd9a@mail.gmail.com> <0JXJ006XD9EOK881@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <02b601c88310$f511f7d0$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> <47D5EBD9.90603@xxiii.com> Message-ID: <47D6C797.2060903@xxiii.com> Mark Andy wrote: > And, when the friendly helpdesk person tries to log into your computer, > can't because you changed the password, and you get fired... Think again > about how much you care about having pictures show up on your screen Yes, you are correct. I thought I sent out a retraction last night, but it looks like I messed up and didn't send it to the list. I will resend. Your work PC is a tool to do your work and not a toy. I resent limitations on doing reasonable things with your work PC, but they seem to be common at many companies. OTH the place I used to work wouldn't let me lock them down as much as I wanted to. I probably could have spent half my time doing more productive things for the company (being a programmer and not a pc tech') if I wasn't fixing all the rubbish people inflicted on their 'puters. -Wayne From battmain at yahoo.com Tue Mar 11 11:29:58 2008 From: battmain at yahoo.com (Battmain) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 11:29:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' In-Reply-To: <47D5EBD9.90603@xxiii.com> Message-ID: <403932.27479.qm@web57003.mail.re3.yahoo.com> > Jack Brooks wrote: > > Access the registry??? I can't even run a defrag on my work laptop. IMNSHO, blocking defrag is a darn waste of sys admin authority. Where there is a will there is a way. If you screw up, that's when the company gripes at you. ;p I can see reasons to block access to the registry, but even with security policies on certain keys, there are ways around it. A little study over on the Windoz' security forums will gain you access without much work. Brian battmain at yahoo.com ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Tue Mar 11 10:56:45 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 09:56:45 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20080311165645.MLAN24323.mta13.adelphia.net@randall> > And, when the friendly helpdesk person tries to log into your > computer, can't because you changed the password, Nope, doesn't work that way. The helpdesk doesn't use the 'administrator' account, but another account set up for them. Besides, there is no proof that you were the one that changed the password. Physical security is bound to be lax (otherwise no need for such draconian computer measures; physical security is the only real security) so pretty much anyone could have wandered in and changed the password. That quasi-legal janitor that can't speak English but seems to understand what you say ... Randall - ex-head of IT From mark at sccaprepared.com Tue Mar 11 12:56:11 2008 From: mark at sccaprepared.com (Mark Andy) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:56:11 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' In-Reply-To: <403932.27479.qm@web57003.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <403932.27479.qm@web57003.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Howdy, On Tue, 11 Mar 2008, Battmain wrote: >>> Access the registry??? I can't even run a defrag on my work laptop. > > IMNSHO, blocking defrag is a darn waste of sys admin authority. Where > there is a will there is a way. If you screw up, that's when the company > gripes at you. ;p Dude, their goal is very unlikely to be to block defrag... Its almost certainly to block something else and the 'easy' way was to block a whole group of things, one of which was defrag. Mark From mark at sccaprepared.com Tue Mar 11 12:58:25 2008 From: mark at sccaprepared.com (Mark Andy) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:58:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' In-Reply-To: <20080311165645.MLAN24323.mta13.adelphia.net@randall> References: <20080311165645.MLAN24323.mta13.adelphia.net@randall> Message-ID: Howdy, On Tue, 11 Mar 2008, Randall wrote: >> And, when the friendly helpdesk person tries to log into your >> computer, can't because you changed the password, > > Nope, doesn't work that way. The helpdesk doesn't use the 'administrator' > account, but another account set up for them. That, in my experience, is highly dependent on how your company's infrastructure is setup, coupled with what needs to be done on your pc. > Besides, there is no proof that you were the one that changed the > password. Physical security is bound to be lax (otherwise no need for > such draconian computer measures; physical security is the only real > security) so pretty much anyone could have wandered in and changed the > password. That quasi-legal janitor that can't speak English but seems > to understand what you say ... Yes, you very likely would win the lawsuit under those grounds. Really want to go through a lawsuit so that you can put pictures on your screen saver? Mark From dmscheidt at gmail.com Tue Mar 11 13:13:45 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 16:13:45 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' In-Reply-To: References: <403932.27479.qm@web57003.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803111313r1b75e10dwbf11c542b51e5ca2@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, Mar 11, 2008 at 3:56 PM, Mark Andy wrote: > Howdy, > > > On Tue, 11 Mar 2008, Battmain wrote: > >>> Access the registry??? I can't even run a defrag on my work laptop. > > > > IMNSHO, blocking defrag is a darn waste of sys admin authority. Where > > there is a will there is a way. If you screw up, that's when the company > > gripes at you. ;p > > Dude, their goal is very unlikely to be to block defrag... Its almost > certainly to block something else and the 'easy' way was to block a whole > group of things, one of which was defrag. If you can run a defragger, you can read and rewrite every block on the disk. That means you've got control of the machine. It the business's machine, they control the use of it. You wouldn't object if they told you you couldn't take the company car to the track, would you? The way I defrag machines is to reinstall the image, which is much faster and more reliable. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From pj_mcgarvey at hotmail.com Tue Mar 11 13:21:50 2008 From: pj_mcgarvey at hotmail.com (PJ McGarvey) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 16:21:50 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' In-Reply-To: <20080311165645.MLAN24323.mta13.adelphia.net@randall> References: <20080311165645.MLAN24323.mta13.adelphia.net@randall> Message-ID: And what's recently made the news, but been known publicly since 2006 I think... If you run Windows or OS X, you're also vulnerable to having the admin password stolen by using the FireWire port, just by plugging in another computer capable of reading the password from memory. It's not even a bug, it's just the way FireWire is designed. PJ ---------------------------------------- > From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com > To: shop-talk at autox.team.net > Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 09:56:45 -0800 > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' > > > And, when the friendly helpdesk person tries to log into your > > computer, can't because you changed the password, > > Nope, doesn't work that way. The helpdesk doesn't use the 'administrator' > account, but another account set up for them. > > Besides, there is no proof that you were the one that changed the password. > Physical security is bound to be lax (otherwise no need for such draconian > computer measures; physical security is the only real security) so pretty > much anyone could have wandered in and changed the password. That > quasi-legal janitor that can't speak English but seems to understand what > you say ... > > Randall - ex-head of IT > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as pj_mcgarvey at hotmail.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. From jniolon at bham.rr.com Tue Mar 11 13:59:36 2008 From: jniolon at bham.rr.com (john niolon) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:59:36 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] PC GESTAPO Message-ID: <72CD811594614F5A8DB7F703F01B79D0@OwnerPC> Besides, there is no proof that you were the one that changed the password. > Physical security is bound to be lax (otherwise no need for such draconian > computer measures; physical security is the only real security) so pretty > much anyone could have wandered in and changed the password. That > quasi-legal janitor that can't speak English but seems to understand what > you say ... The company from which I just retired had total and complete control/access to each p.c. on the network with or without your knowledge. You signed a compliance agreement stating that you would only use that equipment for legitimate business purposes (which in effect said nothing personal...not even a letter to grandma on your lunch hour or after work.) They considered any form of computer media...disc, cd's, memory sticks, tapes, whatever as 'their' property ...subject to search/seizure if it was on their premises. They logged every network file accessed and every internet (of the few they didn't have blocked) visited, every email sent and received including attachments. Every thing you did and probably thought was mirrored and shadowed onto network drives. Encryption was no help and they would if needed recreate every file needed to hang your ass. You needed deep level scrubbing (read government/military) to completely remove files and somehow they had blocked most of those from running on individual machines..haven't quite figured out how they did that). Each person was issued a username/password and you were expected to logoff your pc each and every time you left your desk. YOU were considered responsible for any activity on that machine 24 hours a day. Machines with multiple users were executed 'group' style. Six to a gallows at a time. You could not add/delete/change hardware or software configurations... you couldn't even add a printer or a memory stick without asking in writing for permission which was reviewed by the IT queen and her minions. Corporate Auditors/Security at home office was sent reports weekly on 'flagged' activity and the interrogations began from there. The run command along with all 'system' commands were removed from menus. The machines were almost as useful as dumb mainframe terminals... almost, the dumb terminals were faster than the emulation software. They periodically wander their properties looking for 'hot spots' and illegal wireless activity. I am an outside contractor now working on site still. We learned this week that each contractor p.c. and laptop had to be registered with plant security and was subject to inspection by them. They spell ANAL with all capital letters and in a large uncomfortable font. Don't ask me how I know... my suggestion... depending on the IT managers/legal a'holes degree of paranoia/self importance/moat digging it's best to just leave it alone and stare at the company logo on the screen... it's just as good a time waster as pics of junior. This of course, Inch does not apply to you or anyone serving this company. I'd hope that IT directors would give preferential treatment to anyone who is issued an M-16. john The reason congressmen try so hard to get re-elected is that they would hate to have to make a living under the laws they've passed. From jem at milleredp.com Tue Mar 11 14:51:28 2008 From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 14:51:28 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] PC GESTAPO In-Reply-To: <72CD811594614F5A8DB7F703F01B79D0@OwnerPC> References: <72CD811594614F5A8DB7F703F01B79D0@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <47D6FEE0.9030806@milleredp.com> > This of course, Inch does not apply to you or anyone serving this company. > I'd hope that IT directors would give preferential treatment to anyone who is > issued an M-16. Having been on the other end, that is the end responsible for establishing policies like this (or not, as the case may be): There are some very good reasons for not letting users fiddle much with their systems. There's equally good reasons to keep personal machines off corporate networks. Believe me, everyone in IT really wishes the whole company were self-supporting, knew what they were doing when installing software, editing the registry, disabling the virus-checker because it won't let them open that wonderful email attachment from their friend in Engineering (never mind the SMTP headers say it came from Azerbaijan), setting the machine to automatically log them on to their laptop at boot and disable the password lock on their screensaver because it's just too much work to log on again after they leave their machine at their table at Starbucks and go take a whizz... Most of the really good attacks these days start as social-engineering efforts - tiny success ratio x enormous volume = enough success to kill a company. Even just letting a mail client load images referenced in an HTML email message from an off-site server can tell the sender of the message (friendly or not) a whole lot about who/when/where/how the mail message was read. John. From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Tue Mar 11 16:27:36 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:27:36 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20080311222736.GDSI20654.mta10.adelphia.net@randall> > Really want to go through a lawsuit so that you can put > pictures on your screen saver? No, the lawsuit would be to ensure that I never again have to work for a company stupid enough to fire me for something that did no harm, and very possibly I didn't do. But of course I'm betting it would never go that far ... I can just see the CIO trying to explain to the CEO that someone has to be fired for having a screen-saver on their computer; when the CEO almost certainly has one on his computer. Randall From roadsters at hornesystemstx.com Tue Mar 11 19:07:13 2008 From: roadsters at hornesystemstx.com (Pat Horne) Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 21:07:13 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] PC Hackin' In-Reply-To: References: <20080311165645.MLAN24323.mta13.adelphia.net@randall> Message-ID: <47D73AD1.6030708@hornesystemstx.com> Have you looked to see if the "run" button is on the start menu? If it is, type cmd and when the window comes up, type "defrag". It will list the options, so type it again with the options you want. Peace, Pat Thusly spake Mark Andy: > Howdy, > > On Tue, 11 Mar 2008, Randall wrote: > >>> And, when the friendly helpdesk person tries to log into your >>> computer, can't because you changed the password, >>> >> Nope, doesn't work that way. The helpdesk doesn't use the 'administrator' >> account, but another account set up for them. >> > > That, in my experience, is highly dependent on how your company's > infrastructure is setup, coupled with what needs to be done on your pc. > > >> Besides, there is no proof that you were the one that changed the >> password. Physical security is bound to be lax (otherwise no need for >> such draconian computer measures; physical security is the only real >> security) so pretty much anyone could have wandered in and changed the >> password. That quasi-legal janitor that can't speak English but seems >> to understand what you say ... >> > > Yes, you very likely would win the lawsuit under those grounds. > > Really want to go through a lawsuit so that you can put pictures on your > screen saver? > > Mark > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as roadsters at hornesystemstx.com > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive > > > -- Pat Horne, Owner, Horne Systems (512) 797-7501 Voice 5026 FM 2001 Pat at HorneSystemsTx.com Lockhart, TX 78644-4443 www.hornesystemstx.com -- We support Habitat for Humanity - a hand UP, not a hand OUT -- From 57healey at gmail.com Wed Mar 12 11:25:57 2008 From: 57healey at gmail.com (Patton Dickson) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 13:25:57 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] 9,500 kWh of production in first year In-Reply-To: <47D5EF5F.2060206@xxiii.com> References: <013a01c8831b$b8f63d00$0502a8c0@B50SS> <47D5EF5F.2060206@xxiii.com> Message-ID: <743b1e2f0803121125o57ccbefft285190e643c8a4b5@mail.gmail.com> We don't get the major tax credits in Texas that you get in CA, but I would be interested if it gets down to a 5 to 10 year ROI. The geothermal heat pumps would really be a boost, but system cost is too high here at this time. I can't complain too much, based on lots of state and federal backing, Texas is now the #1 producer of wind power, and the growth is accelerating. With our outrageous summers, the trend here is radiant heat barriers. I may try the ceramic paint this spring. Patton On Mon, Mar 10, 2008 at 9:33 PM, Wayne wrote: > old dirtbeard wrote: > > It was one year ago today that we installed a 6 kWh, residential PV system > > (30 Kyocera 200W panels and a SMA 6000U inverter, located in the Los Angeles > > Very Cool, Doug! Thanks for the status report. > > I remember your post from last year. I didn't realize at the time that > PV systems had gotten efficient enough to be viable. I've been doing > some research on them since. A house with a PV system and geothermal > heat pump would be a really kick-ass setup. > > I'm not a hard-core greenie, but as someone with an engineering > background I really appreciate efficiency. > > -Wayne -- Patton Dickson - http://Austin-Healeys.com - Plano, TX 1957 Austin-Healey 100-Six "Built to run 'til the road wears out." From mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org Wed Mar 12 13:30:07 2008 From: mayfield+shoptalk at sackheads.org (Jimmie Mayfield) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 16:30:07 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] 9,500 kWh of production in first year In-Reply-To: <743b1e2f0803121125o57ccbefft285190e643c8a4b5@mail.gmail.com> References: <013a01c8831b$b8f63d00$0502a8c0@B50SS> <47D5EF5F.2060206@xxiii.com> <743b1e2f0803121125o57ccbefft285190e643c8a4b5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20080312203007.GA88882@sackheads.org> On Wed, Mar 12, 2008 at 01:25:57PM -0500, Patton Dickson wrote: > We don't get the major tax credits in Texas that you get in CA, but I > would be interested if it gets down to a 5 to 10 year ROI. The > geothermal heat pumps would really be a boost, but system cost is too > high here at this time. Something to keep in mind is the new generation of low-cost panels is here. Last December, a company named Nanosolar announced that it has shipped its first low-cost panels ($1 per watt). As more companies ramp up production of printed solar panels (using techniques not unlike those used by inkjet printers), the cost per watt will fall even further. -- Jimmie Mayfield http://www.sackheads.org/jimmie email: jimmie+shoptalk at sackheads.org My mail provider does not welcome UCE -- http://www.sackheads.org/uce From 57healey at gmail.com Wed Mar 12 13:38:49 2008 From: 57healey at gmail.com (Patton Dickson) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 15:38:49 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] 9,500 kWh of production in first year In-Reply-To: <20080312203007.GA88882@sackheads.org> References: <013a01c8831b$b8f63d00$0502a8c0@B50SS> <47D5EF5F.2060206@xxiii.com> <743b1e2f0803121125o57ccbefft285190e643c8a4b5@mail.gmail.com> <20080312203007.GA88882@sackheads.org> Message-ID: <743b1e2f0803121338y69800670l33c02021eb6dc530@mail.gmail.com> It will be interesting to see how long that takes to reach the market. From what I read here, http://www.solarbuzz.com/Moduleprices.htm , that would be a significant reduction. On Wed, Mar 12, 2008 at 3:30 PM, Jimmie Mayfield wrote: > Something to keep in mind is the new generation of low-cost panels > is here. Last December, a company named Nanosolar announced that it has > shipped its first low-cost panels ($1 per watt). As more companies ramp > up production of printed solar panels (using techniques not unlike those > used by inkjet printers), the cost per watt will fall even further. -- Patton Dickson - http://Austin-Healeys.com - Plano, TX 1957 Austin-Healey 100-Six "Built to run 'til the road wears out." From cak at dimebank.com Wed Mar 12 13:48:47 2008 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 13:48:47 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] 9,500 kWh of production in first year In-Reply-To: <743b1e2f0803121338y69800670l33c02021eb6dc530@mail.gmail.com> References: <013a01c8831b$b8f63d00$0502a8c0@B50SS> <47D5EF5F.2060206@xxiii.com> <743b1e2f0803121125o57ccbefft285190e643c8a4b5@mail.gmail.com> <20080312203007.GA88882@sackheads.org> <743b1e2f0803121338y69800670l33c02021eb6dc530@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <47D841AF.1030007@dimebank.com> nanosolar's technology is very promising, but they are on a slow production ramp, and all of their output is already spoken for for at least 12-18 months. end consumers won't see their panels for a couple of years, and possibly longer than that in the US (Germany is the current solar hotbed, and that's where nanosolar are doing most of their production, though they've built a plant in San Jose) The US, sadly, isn't a very interesting market for solar. http://nanosolar.com/ From dmscheidt at gmail.com Wed Mar 12 13:49:25 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 16:49:25 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] 9,500 kWh of production in first year In-Reply-To: <743b1e2f0803121338y69800670l33c02021eb6dc530@mail.gmail.com> References: <013a01c8831b$b8f63d00$0502a8c0@B50SS> <47D5EF5F.2060206@xxiii.com> <743b1e2f0803121125o57ccbefft285190e643c8a4b5@mail.gmail.com> <20080312203007.GA88882@sackheads.org> <743b1e2f0803121338y69800670l33c02021eb6dc530@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803121349ld19cf72s99c1fc0f8c1aa932@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, Mar 12, 2008 at 4:38 PM, Patton Dickson <57healey at gmail.com> wrote: > It will be interesting to see how long that takes to reach the market. > From what I read here, > http://www.solarbuzz.com/Moduleprices.htm , that would be a > significant reduction. > Keep in mind that a constant price for watt, which is what solar has been for the last 2 or three years, is a price decrease, relative to any non-renewable source. The cost per watt of fossil fuel sourced power is going up, and is unlikely to come down in the long term. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From dirtbeard at pacbell.net Wed Mar 12 21:27:46 2008 From: dirtbeard at pacbell.net (old dirtbeard) Date: Wed, 12 Mar 2008 21:27:46 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] 9,500 kWh of production in first year References: <013a01c8831b$b8f63d00$0502a8c0@B50SS> <47D5EF5F.2060206@xxiii.com> <743b1e2f0803121125o57ccbefft285190e643c8a4b5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <025901c884c2$97846fe0$0502a8c0@B50SS> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Patton Dickson" <57healey at gmail.com> To: "Wayne" Cc: "Shop Talk List" Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2008 11:25 AM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] 9,500 kWh of production in first year > We don't get the major tax credits in Texas that you get in CA, but I > would be interested if it gets down to a 5 to 10 year ROI. The > geothermal heat pumps would really be a boost, but system cost is too > high here at this time. > > I can't complain too much, based on lots of state and federal backing, > Texas is now the #1 producer of wind power, and the growth is > accelerating. > > With our outrageous summers, the trend here is radiant heat barriers. > I may try the ceramic paint this spring. > > Patton Patton, One nice thing about the PV arrays on your roof is that they sit 4-6 inches above the roof so that air flow underneath them will cool them (they generally are efficiency rated at 68F degrees, and their efficiency drops as the temperature rises). As a result, they functionally as tremendously effective "sun shades" for your roof, totally blocking the sun from your roof where they are mounted and they circulate cool air between them and your roof. Even on a "Texas summer day," the roof under your panels will be cool to the touch. This can decrease attic temperatures greatly and also reduce the amount of electricity you need to use for AC (here you might be able to size your array smaller based upon the AC energy savings). This would be even more important if you have vaulted ceilings on a south facing exposure. I know someone who lives in Woodland Hills, CA, where it can get to 118F degrees, his house has vaulted ceilings and faces north-south. You need about 80-90 sq.ft. per kW of array, so for every kW you generate, you also shade up to 90 sq. ft. of your roof from the blazing sun. It is a win-win. best, doug From jniolon at bham.rr.com Thu Mar 13 11:05:35 2008 From: jniolon at bham.rr.com (john niolon) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 13:05:35 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] air operated grease guns. Message-ID: <685561D41898454FA25680C5D2C0C042@OwnerPC> I've got one grease fitting on an 03 tahoe that is almost impossible to get to..... up on top of the steering linkage about 1" from the underside of the frame rail. I've tried those 90 degree grease gun couplers, but you have to have it exactly in the right place. You have to hold the coupling on the fitting with one hand, hold the grease gun with the other... ??? wait ?? how can you pump the gun ?? I love those nice Lincoln battery operated guns but not for 200 bucks... I see air operated guns at Sears and online but I wonder how good the 'home' versions really are. always used "Alemite" brand guns in the old service station days... anyone have experience with air operated home grease guns ?? thanks John The reason congressmen try so hard to get re-elected is that they would hate to have to make a living under the laws they've passed. From arvidj at visi.com Thu Mar 13 11:31:25 2008 From: arvidj at visi.com (Arvid Jedlicka) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 13:31:25 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] air operated grease guns. References: <685561D41898454FA25680C5D2C0C042@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <003b01c88538$72003c60$ef281aac@behavioral.com> I have two of the nothern tool guns http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_12803_12803 Both still work after three years - way back when they were under $20 each. I like them because (a) I am lazy, (b) I have been infected with the Tim Allen 'power tools disease' and (c) exactly as you mentioned, there are several fittings on the tractor and several of the implements where I would simply run out of appendages if I had to pump it by hand. The obvious down side is that I have to drag an air hose out every time I want to grease something, but I usually have a hose close at hand anyway so its not that big a deal - to the point of not being able to remember the last time I used the manual gun hanging on the wall next to the air powered ones. Arvid ----- Original Message ----- From: "john niolon" > I've got one grease fitting on an 03 tahoe that is almost impossible to get > to..... up on top of the steering linkage about 1" from the underside of the > frame rail. I've tried those 90 degree grease gun couplers, but you have to > have it exactly in the right place. You have to hold the coupling on the > fitting with one hand, hold the grease gun with the other... ??? wait ?? how > can you pump the gun ?? > > I love those nice Lincoln battery operated guns but not for 200 bucks... I see > air operated guns at Sears and online but I wonder how good the 'home' > versions really are. always used "Alemite" brand guns in the old service > station days... > > anyone have experience with air operated home grease guns ?? > > thanks > John From bspidell at comcast.net Thu Mar 13 11:37:37 2008 From: bspidell at comcast.net (Bob Spidell) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 18:37:37 +0000 Subject: [Shop-talk] air operated grease guns. Message-ID: <031320081837.21331.47D974710005839B00005353220075894204040A0B079F9C0D@comcast.net> Not the exact answer to your question, but ... For (probably) less than $20, get one of the small, "pistol-grip" cartridge greasers. They don't hold a lot of grease--maybe enough to do your Tahoe twice--but you only need one hand to operate, and you don't have to fire up your compressor. These are available at most any hardware (OSH, ect.) or car parts store. I prefer the type with the trigger lever on the same side as the grease outlet. bs -- *************************************************************** Bob Spidell San Jose, CA bspidell at comcast.net '67 Austin-Healey 3000 '56 Austin-Healey 100M *************************************************************** -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: "john niolon" > I've got one grease fitting on an 03 tahoe that is almost impossible to get > to..... up on top of the steering linkage about 1" from the underside of the > frame rail. I've tried those 90 degree grease gun couplers, but you have to > have it exactly in the right place. You have to hold the coupling on the > fitting with one hand, hold the grease gun with the other... ??? wait ?? how > can you pump the gun ?? > > I love those nice Lincoln battery operated guns but not for 200 bucks... I see > air operated guns at Sears and online but I wonder how good the 'home' > versions really are. always used "Alemite" brand guns in the old service > station days... > > anyone have experience with air operated home grease guns ?? > > thanks > John > > > > The reason congressmen try so hard to get re-elected is that they would hate > to have to make a living under the laws they've passed. > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as bspidell at comcast.net > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive From Tim.Mullen at ngc.com Thu Mar 13 11:44:22 2008 From: Tim.Mullen at ngc.com (Mullen, Tim) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 13:44:22 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] air operated grease guns. In-Reply-To: <031320081837.21331.47D974710005839B00005353220075894204040A0B079F9C0D@comcast.net> References: <031320081837.21331.47D974710005839B00005353220075894204040A0B079F9C0D@comcast.net> Message-ID: <9C2F69BA6FB69F43ABCDBCFFC282C797010DB3C5@XMBIL103.northgrum.com> Bob Spidell wrote: > > For (probably) less than $20, get one of the small, > "pistol-grip" cartridge greasers. They don't hold > a lot of grease--maybe enough to do your Tahoe > twice--but you only need one hand to operate, and > you don't have to fire up your compressor. Bob beat me to it. I've been using one for at least 20 years. I don't have many grease fitting to use them on, but it works great. I have a hose on the gun, so I push the fitting on with one hand, and pump with the "pistol-grip" with the other. It works just fine. I still have my old "big" pump handle grease gun, and I never use it simply because it's more cumbersome. At the very least get the small one for the hard to reach fitting. Tim Mullen From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Thu Mar 13 14:15:11 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 14:15:11 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] air operated grease guns. In-Reply-To: <685561D41898454FA25680C5D2C0C042@OwnerPC> References: <685561D41898454FA25680C5D2C0C042@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <437101c8854f$529fe3e0$6a5636cc@jdnet.deere.com> > You have to hold the > coupling on the > fitting with one hand, hold the grease gun with the other... > ??? wait ?? how > can you pump the gun ?? I used to use one of the 'mini' guns as others recommend, but got tired of using up cartridges so fast (over 20 grease zerks on my 59 TR3A). So I found a full-size gun that has a pistol grip and fitted it with a flexible hose. Don't recall what brand (Plews maybe), but if you Google for 'pistol grip grease gun' without the quotes, you'll get lots of hits. http://tinyurl.com/2dmqyn or http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_55454_554 54 Randall From dmscheidt at gmail.com Thu Mar 13 14:44:36 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2008 17:44:36 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] air operated grease guns. In-Reply-To: <437101c8854f$529fe3e0$6a5636cc@jdnet.deere.com> References: <685561D41898454FA25680C5D2C0C042@OwnerPC> <437101c8854f$529fe3e0$6a5636cc@jdnet.deere.com> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803131444w337af876w50a434d5c44cdc2c@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 13, 2008 at 5:15 PM, Randall wrote: > > You have to hold the > > coupling on the > > fitting with one hand, hold the grease gun with the other... > > ??? wait ?? how > > can you pump the gun ?? > > I used to use one of the 'mini' guns as others recommend, but got tired of > using up cartridges so fast (over 20 grease zerks on my 59 TR3A). So I > I've fitted my mini-greasegun with a zerk fitting so it can be refilled from a bigger one. Much easier (and cheaper) than using cartridges. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From jibjib at att.net Fri Mar 14 16:55:22 2008 From: jibjib at att.net (Jack Brooks) Date: Fri, 14 Mar 2008 16:55:22 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] air operated grease guns. In-Reply-To: <685561D41898454FA25680C5D2C0C042@OwnerPC> References: <685561D41898454FA25680C5D2C0C042@OwnerPC> Message-ID: <003d01c8862e$de7cd640$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> >I've got one grease fitting on an 03 tahoe that is almost impossible to get to..... Pipe it out to somewhere you can reach. Jack From jandkstone99 at msn.com Mon Mar 17 18:48:35 2008 From: jandkstone99 at msn.com (Jim Stone) Date: Mon, 17 Mar 2008 20:48:35 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Mystery of the blown transformers In-Reply-To: References: <20080302030150.HXAU2695.mta16.adelphia.net@randall> <2400a5d40803011913q1d3a638coc18fb4dccd70010f@mail.gmail.com> <47CA3AEB.7020408@boicey.com> Message-ID: I want to update everyone on the final outcome of my effort to fix my parents' porch light. The group was absolutely right: the problem was using too small a transformer. I did a little digging online and ended up buying one marketed as being for security cameras, as it was the same specs as the original one. The were available from multiple places; I bought mine from securityideas.com, simply because they seemed to be the least expensive. I installed it on Saturday and it is still working this evening, which is considerably longer than the 10 minutes I got out of the doorbell transformers! My thanks again to all who weighed in on this. Your advice, as always, was invaluable! Jim Stone _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live Hotmail is giving away Zunes. Enter for your chance to win. http://www.windowslive-hotmail.com/ZuneADay/?locale=en-US&ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Mobi le_Zune_V3 From jem at milleredp.com Sun Mar 23 15:25:24 2008 From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 15:25:24 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] It's spring... Message-ID: <47E6D8D4.6050701@milleredp.com> ...and that means I'm six months overdue on doing the brick facing on the outdoor kitchen I framed up last year. It's a welded-steel frame faced with Wonderboard with gas grill and the like, and that part's all done, I just need to face it now. I've got a large pile of brick sitting here, from various parts of our house (fireplace, exterior trim) pre-remodel, and I think I know how to mix mortar, and I've pretty much figured out all the dimensions. So how does one cut brick? I know it's been done with hammers and chisels, and I suppose if that's the RIGHT way I've got lots of extra brick to practice on. I own angle grinders and a Harbor Freight metal cutoff saw and the usual collection of other power apparatus, but no wet-saws or anything of that nature. I haven't yet tried running the circular saw with the masonry blade over a brick to see what happens. John. From scott.hall at comcast.net Sun Mar 23 16:58:49 2008 From: scott.hall at comcast.net (scott.hall at comcast.net) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 23:58:49 +0000 Subject: [Shop-talk] It's spring... Message-ID: <032320082358.6718.47E6EEB9000B1E8800001A3E220702157304040E08D29B9B010C9C@comcast.net> the guys that were facing an office next to a job site I saw were using chisels and what looked like a wet tile saw. they used a big gas-powered circular saw for the landscape blocks. whatever you learn, I'd like to learn, too. I'll have an addition to brick pretty soon... -------------- Original message ---------------------- From: John Miller > ...and that means I'm six months overdue on doing the brick facing on > the outdoor kitchen I framed up last year. It's a welded-steel frame > faced with Wonderboard with gas grill and the like, and that part's all > done, I just need to face it now. > > I've got a large pile of brick sitting here, from various parts of our > house (fireplace, exterior trim) pre-remodel, and I think I know how to > mix mortar, and I've pretty much figured out all the dimensions. > > So how does one cut brick? > > I know it's been done with hammers and chisels, and I suppose if that's > the RIGHT way I've got lots of extra brick to practice on. > > I own angle grinders and a Harbor Freight metal cutoff saw and the usual > collection of other power apparatus, but no wet-saws or anything of that > nature. > > I haven't yet tried running the circular saw with the masonry blade over > a brick to see what happens. From dmscheidt at gmail.com Sun Mar 23 17:19:03 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Sun, 23 Mar 2008 20:19:03 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] It's spring... In-Reply-To: <032320082358.6718.47E6EEB9000B1E8800001A3E220702157304040E08D29B9B010C9C@comcast.net> References: <032320082358.6718.47E6EEB9000B1E8800001A3E220702157304040E08D29B9B010C9C@comcast.net> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803231719s24d2a41bm82b3a8e90ede07fa@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 23, 2008 at 7:58 PM, wrote: > the guys that were facing an office next to a job site I saw were using chisels and what looked like a wet tile saw. they used a big gas-powered circular saw for the landscape blocks. whatever you learn, I'd like to learn, too. I'll have an addition to brick pretty soon... > It's not that hard to cut bricks using a bolster -- that's the wide-bladed chisel used for cutting bricks. It needs to be wider than the brick. Score the back side, flip it over, and whack it with the chisel. Even a complete hack like me can do one a minute at least. A masonry blade in an angle grinder will work too, but it's not really any faster, unless you've got complex shape to cut. If you've got lots to cut, you can get diamond blades, or rent a brick cutting machine. (If you lay out your work carefully, you can make all the cuts at once, and only need the machine for a day or half a day. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From eric at megageek.com Tue Mar 25 04:46:27 2008 From: eric at megageek.com (eric at megageek.com) Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 07:46:27 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Testing this list Message-ID: I've have some email changes recently and I haven't heard any traffic here lately, so I want to make sure I'm still getting messages from here. Sorry for the interuption. Moose "We all know we're dying, And there's no sign of a parachute." Tori Amos From wolfeb at verizon.net Tue Mar 25 05:51:25 2008 From: wolfeb at verizon.net (wolfeb at verizon.net) Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 07:51:25 -0500 (CDT) Subject: [Shop-talk] It's spring... Message-ID: <997609.130581206449485539.JavaMail.javamailuser@localhost> >> I haven't yet tried running the circular saw with the masonry blade >> over a brick to see what happens. I did. The result was predictable. After about 30 minutes of creating brick dust, the cheapo sleeve bearing in my Craftsman gave out. Sorry Honey, gotta run to the store and pick me up a nice Porter Cable to replace it with. While I was there, I rented their wet saw for the day and got all the pieces fit. Piece of cake. But wear gloves. That same grit that ruined the bearing will just plain wear your finger tips off. Its VERY painful, but only after the fact. Don't ask me how I know. ;) The brick layers for our house would just pick up a brick and smack it hard with the straight edge of their trowel breaking off the majority of the brick. Flip it over and trim the other edge with a similar, but less violent blow. Much faster. Less accurate. Practice makes perfect. YMMV. From jniolon at bham.rr.com Tue Mar 25 06:20:30 2008 From: jniolon at bham.rr.com (john niolon) Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 08:20:30 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] It's spring... In-Reply-To: <997609.130581206449485539.JavaMail.javamailuser@localhost> References: <997609.130581206449485539.JavaMail.javamailuser@localhost> Message-ID: The brick layers for our house would just pick up a brick and smack it > hard with the straight edge of their trowel breaking off the majority of > the brick. Flip it over and trim the other edge with a similar, but less > violent blow. Much faster. Less accurate. Practice makes perfect. YMMV. THAT is why you have 500- 3/4 bricks left to pick up when you build a new house.. Have you ever seen a brick layer stoop down and pick up that 3/4 brick and use it again ??? It's got another good end on it... but Nope ...just whack off a new one. I can remember my uncle (old-time block / brick mason) using every available bit of material he could. You wouldn't have a bucket load of waste from their jobs... Now a days they don't care... time is money and it ain't THEIR money they are wasting anyway. later John From dgcole01 at bellsouth.net Tue Mar 25 15:13:37 2008 From: dgcole01 at bellsouth.net (David Cole) Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 17:13:37 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] riding mower gas fumes Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.1.20080325165728.01d51008@mail.bhm.bellsouth.net> Hello all, I have a problem with my riding mower. Perhaps someone on the list can help me or direct me to a mailing list/forum for help. I have a 2003 Craftsman riding mower. DLT 3000 42" cut with a Kohler 20hp twin. It's been flawless and required nothing other than oil changes and a couple of blade replacements. The problem is gas fumes coming from the the tank/gas cap after shutdown when it's parked in the garage. The mower has a 4 gal tank under the seat with the gas cap on the fender. The gas cap has small hole (1/16") in the top as a vent. I would assume the vent is supposed to be one way to allow air into the tank to replace the gas as it's used. The underside of the cap has a rubber gasket and a large 1/8" hole that matches up the with outside hole. I can see a foam type filter inside the cap through the hole. I do not know if there is a one way rubber flapper valve inside the cap or not. Gas is getting up inside the cap and causing fumes. I have put a piece of plastic bag between the cap and tank and that helps somewhat once the gas inside the cap finally evaporates. If I do not put the plastic between them it seems to keep emitting fumes for days. It's as if the tank is building pressure and pushing fumes into the cap, keeping what gas is in there from evaporating. There were no problem for almost the first 4 years I owned the mower, but then the problem started at the end of last season. I have already replaced the cap with a new one and the problem is still just as bad. I've looked, but can't find any obvious leaks from the tank or lines Thanks David Cole From cavanadd at verizon.net Tue Mar 25 20:00:06 2008 From: cavanadd at verizon.net (David C.) Date: Tue, 25 Mar 2008 20:00:06 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] It's spring... In-Reply-To: <997609.130581206449485539.JavaMail.javamailuser@localhost> References: <997609.130581206449485539.JavaMail.javamailuser@localhost> Message-ID: <0JYB00D3YHOCRTG0@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> When I was a kid I used to watch guys lay brick, and I remember seeing them do this all the time. Remember when you were a kid and had time to do things like stand around and watch guys lay brick? What happened? At 05:51 AM 3/25/2008, wolfeb at verizon.net wrote: >The brick layers for our house would just pick up a brick and smack it >hard with the straight edge of their trowel breaking off the majority of >the brick. Flip it over and trim the other edge with a similar, but less >violent blow. Much faster. Less accurate. Practice makes perfect From Carscarscarz at aol.com Wed Mar 26 23:11:18 2008 From: Carscarscarz at aol.com (Carscarscarz at aol.com) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 02:11:18 EDT Subject: [Shop-talk] Removing chuck from drill motor Message-ID: Hey All~ I have a Dewalt DW100 drill. I would like to replace the chuck but can't figure out how to remove it. Can anyone offer any help? Thanks, ~Steve ************** Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home. (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15?ncid=aolhom0003 0000000001) From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Thu Mar 27 00:29:37 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Wed, 26 Mar 2008 23:29:37 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Removing chuck from drill motor In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20080327062928.UWII1365.mta11.adelphia.net@randall> > I have a Dewalt DW100 drill. I would like to replace the > chuck but can't figure out how to remove it. Can anyone offer > any help? I don't know anything about that model in particular; but generally you have to open the chuck jaws all the way, then remove the left-hand screw that is inside. Most likely Allen head, but might be slotted/Philips. Then put the chuck key in, and smack it with a hammer to break the chuck loose on it's right-hand threads. Randall From ronglue at yahoo.com Thu Mar 27 06:02:46 2008 From: ronglue at yahoo.com (Ron Horwitz) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 06:02:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Shop-talk] riding mower gas fumes Message-ID: <630392.39694.qm@web36314.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I had a 2001 (?) DLT2000 that was flawless till last season when it started filling the garage with gas fumes. On mine the tank started leaking at the seam, in a not too obvious place. I found a site called gardenweb (?) that had a riding mower forum, and this was apparently a common Sears problem. Upon their advice, I took the entire metal deck off - not too many fasteners, and less daunting than it seems. Much better than trying to snake the tank out. You might at least take the body off so that you can see the whole tank to make sure you don't see any wet spots. New one was approx $50. Mine was a little different - the filler was centered on the tank under the seat, and the mower was a little older, but your story sounds very familiar. Mine started faint and just kept getting worse. Ron --- David Cole wrote: > I have a 2003 Craftsman riding mower. DLT 3000 42" > cut with a > Kohler 20hp twin. It's been flawless and required > The problem is gas > fumes coming from the the tank/gas cap after > shutdown when it's > parked in the garage. ____________________________________________________________________________________ Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping From drew at DasRogges.com Thu Mar 27 06:34:05 2008 From: drew at DasRogges.com (Drew Rogge) Date: Thu, 27 Mar 2008 06:34:05 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] Removing chuck from drill motor In-Reply-To: <20080327062928.UWII1365.mta11.adelphia.net@randall> References: <20080327062928.UWII1365.mta11.adelphia.net@randall> Message-ID: <47EBA24D.3040902@DasRogges.com> Instead of wacking on the chuck key another thing you can do is to tightly chuck up a large allen wrench and wack on the end of that. Drew Randall wrote: >> I have a Dewalt DW100 drill. I would like to replace the >> chuck but can't figure out how to remove it. Can anyone offer >> any help? > > I don't know anything about that model in particular; but generally you have > to open the chuck jaws all the way, then remove the left-hand screw that is > inside. Most likely Allen head, but might be slotted/Philips. Then put the > chuck key in, and smack it with a hammer to break the chuck loose on it's > right-hand threads. > > Randall From Carscarscarz at aol.com Thu Mar 27 23:47:07 2008 From: Carscarscarz at aol.com (Carscarscarz at aol.com) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 02:47:07 EDT Subject: [Shop-talk] Removing chuck from drill motor Message-ID: Thank you for the responses. I forgot to mention in the original post there is no screw in the bottom of the chuck opening. ~Steve ************** Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home. (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15&ncid=aolh om00030000000001) From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Fri Mar 28 11:41:07 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 11:41:07 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] Removing chuck from drill motor In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <11b101c89103$48fed9d0$6a5636cc@jdnet.deere.com> > Thank you for the responses. I forgot to mention in the > original post there > is no screw in the bottom of the chuck opening. Interesting. Apparently DeWalt has found a way to save $.35 on each drill. According to a forum post I turned up with Google, they use Loctite instead and it can "be a bear" to remove. However, the instructions on DeWalt's site essentially echo those I gave. http://tinyurl.com/2rfvf5 And the parts explosion seems to show the DW100 has a threaded chuck (with no holding screw). http://tinyurl.com/32ls36 So I'd conclude you just need a bigger hammer ... Randall From cavanadd at verizon.net Fri Mar 28 19:10:17 2008 From: cavanadd at verizon.net (David C.) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 19:10:17 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] Removing chuck from drill motor In-Reply-To: <11b101c89103$48fed9d0$6a5636cc@jdnet.deere.com> References: <11b101c89103$48fed9d0$6a5636cc@jdnet.deere.com> Message-ID: <0JYG00JWFZBL5DH5@vms173001.mailsrvcs.net> At 11:41 AM 3/28/2008, Randall wrote: >So I'd conclude you just need a bigger hammer ... And maybe some heat; most conventional threadlockers break down above a couple hundred degrees. DC From Carscarscarz at aol.com Fri Mar 28 22:54:17 2008 From: Carscarscarz at aol.com (Carscarscarz at aol.com) Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2008 01:54:17 EDT Subject: [Shop-talk] Removing chuck from drill motor Message-ID: I'll get going with my finely calibrated whackin' stick (BFH) and a little heat. I really appreciate the advise. This has been a good tool that I really like and anything to keep it going makes me happy. Again, thank you very much, ~Steve ************** Create a Home Theater Like the Pros. Watch the video on AOL Home. (http://home.aol.com/diy/home-improvement-eric-stromer?video=15&ncid=aolh om00030000000001) From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Sat Mar 29 00:09:58 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Fri, 28 Mar 2008 23:09:58 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Removing chuck from drill motor In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20080329061024.MCRA25784.mta9.adelphia.net@randall> > I'll get going with my finely calibrated whackin' stick (BFH) > and a little heat. You might want to have a peek inside the housing before applying heat ... that big gear might well be nylon or similar that could be damaged by not-very-much heat. Randall From salbrigh at nycap.rr.com Sun Mar 30 05:11:43 2008 From: salbrigh at nycap.rr.com (Skip Albright) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 08:11:43 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Bexane Message-ID: <6.2.3.4.2.20080330080928.02c38420@pop.nycap.rr.com> I found 4 cans of Bexane in the trunk of a car that followed me home yesterday. any one heard of it? seems like an industrial epoxy. It's dated 1997 , shelf life? worth keeping or should I toss it? thanks skip Nothing is as it appears Skip Albright Glenmont NY salbrigh at nycap.rr.com From gerrybraz at cablespeed.com Sun Mar 30 07:35:47 2008 From: gerrybraz at cablespeed.com (Gerald Brazil) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 10:35:47 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Here's your chance to wade in on a family argument..... Message-ID: <000801c89273$5b12eb40$0301a8c0@DADSTOY> and not get any bruises. My wife has populated every room in the house with these little devices that plug into an outlet. They have a little red led and an opening that looks like a tiny speaker. According to her, they are for keeping insects and rodents away. I personally believe (and have told her so, at risk of bodily harm, a number of times) that the only thing that I think they keep away is elephants. ......at that, they are very successful. We have never suffered from an infestation of elephants since she has been using them. So, does anybody really know what is inside of those things and what they really do? From strovato at optonline.net Sun Mar 30 07:55:27 2008 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 10:55:27 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Bexane In-Reply-To: <6.2.3.4.2.20080330080928.02c38420@pop.nycap.rr.com> References: <6.2.3.4.2.20080330080928.02c38420@pop.nycap.rr.com> Message-ID: <0JYJ00G8UTHQ6WJ0@mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Is this the stuff? http://www.certifiedlabs.com/certified/productView_byName.asp?cat_id=11&countryName=United+States&country=USA&language=English&language_id=4&product_cat=name&product_cat_desc=Products+By+Name&pName=BEXANE Hopefully some of those cans say base and some say hardener. Personally, I would try it for some non-life-critical application. At 08:11 AM 3/30/2008, Skip Albright wrote: >I found 4 cans of Bexane in the trunk of a car that followed me home >yesterday. > >any one heard of it? > >seems like an industrial epoxy. > >It's dated 1997 , shelf life? > >worth keeping or should I toss it? From strovato at optonline.net Sun Mar 30 08:12:32 2008 From: strovato at optonline.net (Steven Trovato) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 11:12:32 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Here's your chance to wade in on a family argument..... In-Reply-To: <000801c89273$5b12eb40$0301a8c0@DADSTOY> References: <000801c89273$5b12eb40$0301a8c0@DADSTOY> Message-ID: <0JYJ0043OUAWWW00@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> I think they are supposed to emit some sort of ultrasonic frequency that makes the insects go to your neighbor's house instead. In fact, I think they just make the insects laugh and realize how gullible you (or your wife) are. I have never seen any evidence from a reputable source indicating that these things do anything other than rid your house of excess cash. And of course elephants. At 10:35 AM 3/30/2008, Gerald Brazil wrote: > and not get any bruises. > >My wife has populated every room in the house with these little devices that >plug into an outlet. They have a little red led and an opening that looks >like a tiny speaker. According to her, they are for keeping insects and >rodents away. I personally believe (and have told her so, at risk of bodily >harm, a number of times) that the only thing that I think they keep away is >elephants. ......at that, they are very successful. We have never suffered >from an infestation of elephants since she has been using them. > >So, does anybody really know what is inside of those things and what they >really do? >_______________________________________________ >Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > >You are subscribed as strovato at optonline.net > >Shop-talk mailing list > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > >http://www.team.net/archive From ejrussell at mebtel.net Sun Mar 30 08:39:21 2008 From: ejrussell at mebtel.net (ejrussell at mebtel.net) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 03:39:21 -1200 Subject: [Shop-talk] Here's your chance to wade in on a family argument..... Message-ID: <47efb429.3b0.113c7.377930079@ml2.myemail.com> I know nothing about those devices but I do know about keeping the elephants away... When our kids were young we'd give them 'jobs' to do around the house. When my son questioned why, I explained that everyone in our home had a job they could do. Mom cooked the food, Dad earned the money, and he could take out the trash. He then pointed to the dog napping on the living room rug. "What is Rover's job?" "He keeps the elephants away." I replied. "Haven't you noticed that we have not had any problems with elephants in this house? Good job, Rover!" Eric Russell Mebane, NC > the only thing that I think they keep away is elephants. > ......at that, they are very successful. We have never > suffered from an infestation of elephants since she has > been using them. Login from home, work, school. Anywhere! From wmc_st at xxiii.com Sun Mar 30 09:33:56 2008 From: wmc_st at xxiii.com (Wayne) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 12:33:56 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Here's your chance to wade in on a family argument..... In-Reply-To: <000801c89273$5b12eb40$0301a8c0@DADSTOY> References: <000801c89273$5b12eb40$0301a8c0@DADSTOY> Message-ID: <47EFC0F4.8030502@xxiii.com> Gerald Brazil wrote: > My wife has populated every room in the house with these little devices that > plug into an outlet. They have a little red led and an opening that looks > like a tiny speaker. According to her, they are for keeping insects and > rodents away. I personally believe (and have told her so, at risk of bodily The ones I've seen claim to emit ultrasonic sound, and repel pests. From stuff I've read online, they have little or no effect on pests. Someone plugged a number of them in around my mom's house. I wanted to get rid of them, but was vetoed and told "they didn't seem to be hurting anything." Well, that turned to BS. One of them overheated, melted the plastic faceplate and the electrical outlet and its cover! Obviously they were all discarded after that. Googling ultrasonic pest turned up a bunch of stuff, including: http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2001/05/fyi0128.shtm -Wayne From jblair1948 at cox.net Sun Mar 30 10:52:22 2008 From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T. Blair) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 12:52:22 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Here's your chance to wade in on a family argument..... In-Reply-To: <000801c89273$5b12eb40$0301a8c0@DADSTOY> Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20080330125222.00a42440@pop.east.cox.net> At 10:35 AM 3/30/2008 -0400, Gerald Brazil wrote: > >My wife has populated every room in the house with these little devices that >plug into an outlet. They have a little red led and an opening that looks >like a tiny speaker. According to her, they are for keeping insects and >rodents away. I personally believe (and have told her so, at risk of bodily >harm, a number of times) that the only thing that I think they keep away is >elephants. ......at that, they are very successful. We have never suffered >from an infestation of elephants since she has been using them. I can't say that to work, and if it's anything like the dog ultrasonic whistles, it doesn't bother my dad's dog. Dad has a couple of them in his garage. The garage started as a 2 car garage, then dad and I added to more bays to the front so it became 44ft long and 22 ft wide or something close. Then we added another section on the right side just about the length of the garage so now its about 3 wide and 2 deep. We keep my 65 Morgan, and had dad's 48 TR1800, in there until he sold it last year, plus his 2 street cars and all the tools. Lots of cardboard, various pieces of cloth and car covers, etc. The neighbor behind him is about a 5 acre grave yard. In the 40 years he's lived there, we've found all kinds of animals, from rabbits, mise, rats, snakes etc around the yard and house. But I can't recall ever having any damage done to the cars due to pests like mise, rats or squarles. So while I really wonder about their effectiveness, they appear to work. John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/www/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From tvacc at lotusowners.com Sun Mar 30 12:33:20 2008 From: tvacc at lotusowners.com (Tony Vaccaro) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 15:33:20 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Here's your chance to wade in on a family argument..... In-Reply-To: <5259F9675C6A406897B9020B64D35AA0@amicroinc.local> References: <000801c89273$5b12eb40$0301a8c0@DADSTOY> <5259F9675C6A406897B9020B64D35AA0@amicroinc.local> Message-ID: <023101c8929c$e9370630$6e01a8c0@amicroinc.local> For some reason that I have not been able to determine, this will probably go to you and not the list. Feel free to post it out to the list if you don't see it come up. Back in the 1970's I was involved in extensive research on the effect of ultrasonic frequencies on rodents. Our research showed that those frequencies (I used to know the exact range) do affect mice, rats, squirrels and the like. It was best if the sound emitted was of varying frequency and sound level (db). We also found that different levels of sound affected rats and mice differently. Rats and mice were are primary subjects as this was done for a company making such a device for controlling rats and mice. This research was done both in the field and at the University of Guelph near Toronto, Canada. A doctor of science from a Toledo, OH University was also involved but I have forgotten his name. I had to drive out there several times. I became quite good at setting up systems for deterring and controlling rodents and I could walk into a space and sense if rodents were present. It was my first and only job that I worked for someone other than myself. It was 1974-1976. Tony V www.lotusowners.com -----Original Message----- From: shop-talk-bounces+tvacc=lotusowners.com at autox.team.net [mailto:shop-talk-bounces+tvacc=lotusowners.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of John T. Blair Sent: Sunday, March 30, 2008 1:07 PM To: shop-talk at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Here's your chance to wade in on a family argument..... At 10:35 AM 3/30/2008 -0400, Gerald Brazil wrote: > >My wife has populated every room in the house with these little devices that >plug into an outlet. They have a little red led and an opening that looks >like a tiny speaker. According to her, they are for keeping insects and >rodents away. I personally believe (and have told her so, at risk of bodily >harm, a number of times) that the only thing that I think they keep away is >elephants. ......at that, they are very successful. We have never suffered >from an infestation of elephants since she has been using them. I can't say that to work, and if it's anything like the dog ultrasonic whistles, it doesn't bother my dad's dog. Dad has a couple of them in his garage. The garage started as a 2 car garage, then dad and I added to more bays to the front so it became 44ft long and 22 ft wide or something close. Then we added another section on the right side just about the length of the garage so now its about 3 wide and 2 deep. We keep my 65 Morgan, and had dad's 48 TR1800, in there until he sold it last year, plus his 2 street cars and all the tools. Lots of cardboard, various pieces of cloth and car covers, etc. The neighbor behind him is about a 5 acre grave yard. In the 40 years he's lived there, we've found all kinds of animals, from rabbits, mise, rats, snakes etc around the yard and house. But I can't recall ever having any damage done to the cars due to pests like mise, rats or squarles. So while I really wonder about their effectiveness, they appear to work. John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/www/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! You are subscribed as tvacc at lotusowners.com Shop-talk mailing list http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk http://www.team.net/archive From tbott1 at bellsouth.net Sun Mar 30 12:38:27 2008 From: tbott1 at bellsouth.net (Tom Bott) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 15:38:27 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fw: Here's your chance to wade in on a family argument..... Message-ID: <009f01c8929d$a07fccf0$6402a8c0@SONY> Tony, John, or anyone. Can someone please post a brand name of one that seems to work, please?? I have been fighting something in my motorhome for weeks now. It probably is a rat or mouse, but could be a squirrel as we have a number of them in the yard. It can lick the peanut butter off of traps, knows not to walk in the sticky paper stuff, and I believe loves the smell of moth balls. Help Please and Thanks, Tom Bott, K4SVH From tvacc at lotusowners.com Sun Mar 30 13:00:17 2008 From: tvacc at lotusowners.com (Tony Vaccaro) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 16:00:17 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Fw: Here's your chance to wade in on a family argument..... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <023201c892a0$acdf7f10$6e01a8c0@amicroinc.local> For a mouse you want a lower db unit. Anything really powerful will blow their ear drums. Once you blow their ears...they walk around with sound impunity. If it is a rat...all you want to do is scramble their senses so that they will eat the poison (which they wont if they have sensed it as trouble before). I don't know of any recent brands. I just know the technical aspects and how they work. When we installed a system at a grain mill on a Friday in Byron NY in 1975, by the end of the weekend there were so many rats we had to pick them up with a small dozer. They did not have bobcats back then. There were thousands of dead rats. Basically the ultrasonic sounds scrambled their sense enough that they ate the poison we had laid out. They would not do that previously. It was a fun job...I think. Tony V -----Original Message----- From: shop-talk-bounces+tvacc=lotusowners.com at autox.team.net [mailto:shop-talk-bounces+tvacc=lotusowners.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Tom Bott Sent: Sunday, March 30, 2008 3:55 PM To: Shop-Talk Subject: [Shop-talk] Fw: Here's your chance to wade in on a family argument..... Tony, John, or anyone. Can someone please post a brand name of one that seems to work, please?? I have been fighting something in my motorhome for weeks now. It probably is a rat or mouse, but could be a squirrel as we have a number of them in the yard. It can lick the peanut butter off of traps, knows not to walk in the sticky paper stuff, and I believe loves the smell of moth balls. Help Please and Thanks, Tom Bott, K4SVH You are subscribed as tvacc at lotusowners.com Shop-talk mailing list http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk http://www.team.net/archive From nogera at worldnet.att.net Sun Mar 30 13:47:32 2008 From: nogera at worldnet.att.net (Bob Nogueira) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 15:47:32 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Here's your chance to wade in on a family argument..... In-Reply-To: <000801c89273$5b12eb40$0301a8c0@DADSTOY> Message-ID: <000001c892a7$479af330$4101a8c0@CARROOM> Gerald I'm going to tell my wife about those devices, she already has things plugged into every socket that kills the odor of the elephants. Bob Nogueira > -----Original Message----- > From: > shop-talk-bounces+nogera=worldnet.att.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:shop-talk-bounces+nogera=worldnet.att.net at autox.team.n > My wife has populated every room in the house with these > little devices that plug into an outlet. They have a little > red led and an opening that looks like a tiny speaker. > According to her, they are for keeping insects and rodents > away. I personally believe (and have told her so, at risk of > bodily harm, a number of times) that the only thing that I > think they keep away is elephants. ......at that, they are > very successful. We have never suffered from an infestation > of elephants since she has been using them. > > So, does anybody really know what is inside of those things > and what they really do? From nogera at worldnet.att.net Sun Mar 30 13:47:32 2008 From: nogera at worldnet.att.net (Bob Nogueira) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 15:47:32 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Bexane In-Reply-To: <0JYJ00G8UTHQ6WJ0@mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Message-ID: <000101c892a7$483389b0$4101a8c0@CARROOM> I've seen dozens of epoxy ' fix it' stuff for sale. Always wondered, is there really a difference between them? I figured they were all epoxy mixed with a filler, basically bondo with aluminum or steel filings rather than talc power. Anyone know? Bob Nogueira > -----Original Message----- > From: > shop-talk-bounces+nogera=worldnet.att.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:shop-talk-bounces+nogera=worldnet.att.net at autox.team.n > et] On Behalf Of Steven Trovato > Sent: Sunday, March 30, 2008 9:55 AM > To: Skip Albright; shop-talk at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Bexane > > > Is this the stuff? > > http://www.certifiedlabs.com/certified/productView_byName.asp? cat_id=11&countryName=United+States&country=USA&language=English&language_id =4&product_cat=name&product_cat_desc=Products+By+Name&pName=BEXANE From dmscheidt at gmail.com Sun Mar 30 14:12:35 2008 From: dmscheidt at gmail.com (David Scheidt) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 17:12:35 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Bexane In-Reply-To: <000101c892a7$483389b0$4101a8c0@CARROOM> References: <0JYJ00G8UTHQ6WJ0@mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <000101c892a7$483389b0$4101a8c0@CARROOM> Message-ID: <2400a5d40803301412g56ffcfe9r2c17894224010feb@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 30, 2008 at 4:47 PM, Bob Nogueira wrote: > I've seen dozens of epoxy ' fix it' stuff for sale. Always wondered, is > there really a difference between them? I figured they were all epoxy mixed > with a filler, basically bondo with aluminum or steel filings rather than > talc power. Anyone know? > Yes, they're different, and no, they're not. Epoxy packagers buy their basic resin and hardeners from a fairly small group of manufacturers. They then add their own fillers, modifiers, colors, etc. The basic resins are all the same. The hard eners are all the same. There's not much difference in the additives. What's different is which hardener they use with which resin, and with what additives. Using different hardeners can effect the working properties (temp it cures at, speed it cures, working viscosity, etc). Some fillers are easier to work with after it's cured than others. Some fillers are basically solvents, which thin the product. Clear as mud? -- David Scheidt dmscheidt at gmail.com From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Sun Mar 30 16:41:39 2008 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 15:41:39 -0800 Subject: [Shop-talk] Bexane In-Reply-To: <000101c892a7$483389b0$4101a8c0@CARROOM> Message-ID: <20080330224133.PXQR21903.mta15.adelphia.net@randall> > I've seen dozens of epoxy ' fix it' stuff for sale. Always > wondered, is there really a difference between them? I > figured they were all epoxy mixed with a filler, basically > bondo with aluminum or steel filings rather than talc power. > Anyone know? I don't know anything about composition, but I do know that the "5 minute" version of JB Weld is MUCH weaker than the slow-curing version. And the tensile strength of the slow curing variety can be considerably improved by impregnating fiberglass cloth with it, or even just mixing some fiberglass strands into the epoxy. My impression is that JB Weld doesn't have a filler, but I could be mistaken about that. It certainly seems a lot harder and stronger than Bondo body putty, though, and I can't imagine that mixing metal filings with Bondo would improve it that much. Randall From jblair1948 at cox.net Sun Mar 30 15:59:03 2008 From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T. Blair) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 17:59:03 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Here's your chance to wade in on a family Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20080330175903.00a48ee0@pop.east.cox.net> I'm forwarding this to the list per Tony's request: --------- For some reason that I have not been able to determine, this will probably go to you and not the list. Feel free to post it out to the list if you don't see it come up. Back in the 1970's I was involved in extensive research on the effect of ultrasonic frequencies on rodents. Our research showed that those frequencies (I used to know the exact range) do affect mice, rats, squirrels and the like. It was best if the sound emitted was of varying frequency and sound level (db). We also found that different levels of sound affected rats and mice differently. Rats and mice were are primary subjects as this was done for a company making such a device for controlling rats and mice. This research was done both in the field and at the University of Guelph near Toronto, Canada. A doctor of science from a Toledo, OH University was also involved but I have forgotten his name. I had to drive out there several times. I became quite good at setting up systems for deterring and controlling rodents and I could walk into a space and sense if rodents were present. It was my first and only job that I worked for someone other than myself. It was 1974-1976. Tony V www.lotusowners.com -------------- John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/www/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From ejrussell at mebtel.net Sun Mar 30 19:30:10 2008 From: ejrussell at mebtel.net (Eric J Russell) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 21:30:10 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Here's your chance to wade in on a family argument..... References: <000001c892a7$479af330$4101a8c0@CARROOM> Message-ID: <003c01c892d7$29dbe540$ae10c263@ejrussell> But what about the peanuts on their breath? Eric Russell Mebane, NC http://home.mebtel.net/~ejrussell ----- Original Message ----- > I'm going to tell my wife about those devices, she already has > things plugged into every socket that kills the odor of the > elephants. > > Bob Nogueira From rlwhitetr3b at hotmail.com Sun Mar 30 19:38:05 2008 From: rlwhitetr3b at hotmail.com (Rich White) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 21:38:05 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] painting steps with POR-15 Message-ID: I need some advice from this knowledgeable group... We have a set of metal steps that need work. These are heavy site build steps not the type you see on trailers. The tread surface is diamond plate and was replaced last year. Nothing was done to protect them after the repair. I was thinking of blasting them and then painting them with POR-15 this summer. Is this a good idea? Will the surface be too slick?I do not own any blasting or compressor equipment. What will I need to do the job?Is it something I might be able to rent?Rich White St. Joseph, IL USA'63 TR3B TCF587LThat ain't a scrap pile, that is my car!See it moves! From jem at milleredp.com Sun Mar 30 21:37:01 2008 From: jem at milleredp.com (John Miller) Date: Sun, 30 Mar 2008 21:37:01 -0700 Subject: [Shop-talk] painting steps with POR-15 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <47F06A6D.2070805@milleredp.com> Rich White wrote: > I need some advice from this knowledgeable group... We have a set of metal > steps that need work. These are heavy site build steps not the type you see > on trailers. The tread surface is diamond plate and was replaced last year. > Nothing was done to protect them after the repair. I was thinking of blasting > them and then painting them with POR-15 this summer. Is this a good idea? Things to consider: a) POR-15 is tough stuff, but... b) It sticks well to rough bare-metal surfaces, poorly to smooth bare surfaces, not at all to other coatings. c) The standard black POR-15 disintegrates within a few days if left exposed to solar UV. d) Topcoating POR-15 basically has to be done while it's still tacky; if you wait until it's hard NOTHING will stick unless the base POR-15 is abraded enough to provide 'tooth' (in your case that might require a lightly-abrasive blasting of the cured surface.) e) In your application I'd be concerned that the topcoated surface would see enough wear that it'd leave the base POR-15 exposed, which would then begin to peel. John. From jblair1948 at cox.net Mon Mar 31 05:57:50 2008 From: jblair1948 at cox.net (John T. Blair) Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2008 07:57:50 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] painting steps with POR-15 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20080331075750.00a493a0@pop.east.cox.net> At 09:38 PM 3/30/2008 -0500, Rich White wrote: >I need some advice from this knowledgeable group... >I was thinking of blasting them and then painting them with POR-15 this >summer. Is this a good idea?... Rich, Sand blasting is a great idea! You can also wire brush old metal. POR-15 likes old surface rusted metal, it doesn't like new shinny metal. You might want to read my POR FAQ: http://www.team.net/www/morgan/tech/por15faq.html John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948 at cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/www/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From rlwhitetr3b at hotmail.com Mon Mar 31 17:42:36 2008 From: rlwhitetr3b at hotmail.com (Rich White) Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2008 19:42:36 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Other options for metal steps Message-ID: Ok, I got a yes and a no on the POR-15 for my rusty steps, thanks John and John. Is there a better option? They are way too big to powder coat!Rich White St. Joseph, IL USA'63 TR3B TCF587LThat ain't a scrap pile, that is my car!See it moves! From ejrussell at mebtel.net Mon Mar 31 18:53:38 2008 From: ejrussell at mebtel.net (Eric J Russell) Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2008 20:53:38 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] Other options for metal steps References: Message-ID: <007d01c8939b$420bc260$ae10c263@ejrussell> I'd vote for the POR-15. I've thought about the 'wearing off' factor of the topcoat required. While that is an issue I think it'd be fairly minor. The POR-15 (under an appropriate top coat) will protect all the other areas and a couple of layers of a durable top coat will provide the POR-15 with fairly long-lasting protection in the high wear areas. The treads thus might need occasional re-coating but they'd need it no matter what type paint is applied. Maybe the POR-15 could be top-coated with an epoxy paint - at least for the tread areas? Eric Russell Mebane, NC http://home.mebtel.net/~ejrussell ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rich White" > Ok, I got a yes and a no on the POR-15 for my rusty steps, From dhlocker at comcast.net Mon Mar 31 18:02:02 2008 From: dhlocker at comcast.net (Donald H Locker) Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2008 21:02:02 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Other options for metal steps In-Reply-To: <007d01c8939b$420bc260$ae10c263@ejrussell> References: <007d01c8939b$420bc260$ae10c263@ejrussell> Message-ID: <47F1898A.90705@comcast.net> My inclination, given my vast experience in this area (I've never done this or anything like it,) would be to use a wire brush, apply phosphoric acid and paint with a sand-filled epoxy. Donald. Eric J Russell wrote: > I'd vote for the POR-15. > > I've thought about the 'wearing off' factor of the topcoat required. > While that is an issue I think it'd be fairly minor. The POR-15 (under > an appropriate top coat) will protect all the other areas and a couple > of layers of a durable top coat will provide the POR-15 with fairly > long-lasting protection in the high wear areas. The treads thus might > need occasional re-coating but they'd need it no matter what type > paint is applied. > > Maybe the POR-15 could be top-coated with an epoxy paint - at least > for the tread areas? > > Eric Russell > Mebane, NC > http://home.mebtel.net/~ejrussell From frede.thomas2 at verizon.net Mon Mar 31 19:53:29 2008 From: frede.thomas2 at verizon.net (FRED E THOMAS) Date: Mon, 31 Mar 2008 22:53:29 -0400 Subject: [Shop-talk] Other options for metal steps References: <007d01c8939b$420bc260$ae10c263@ejrussell> Message-ID: <00df01c893a3$90d79920$c8187847@fred8kwiskhcfu> Rich, unless you put down sand or some other traction material you will be in a very dangerous situation each day, just the slighest bit of moisture and away you go, think of the law suits you could be open for, not a good idea as slippery as POR-15 is. "FT" ================================================================================================= ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric J Russell" To: "Rich White" ; "shop-talk List" Sent: Monday, March 31, 2008 9:53 PM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Other options for metal steps > I'd vote for the POR-15. > > I've thought about the 'wearing off' factor of the topcoat required. > While that is an issue I think it'd be fairly minor. The POR-15 (under > an appropriate top coat) will protect all the other areas and a couple > of layers of a durable top coat will provide the POR-15 with fairly > long-lasting protection in the high wear areas. The treads thus might > need occasional re-coating but they'd need it no matter what type > paint is applied. > > Maybe the POR-15 could be top-coated with an epoxy paint - at least > for the tread areas? > > Eric Russell > Mebane, NC > http://home.mebtel.net/~ejrussell > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Rich White" > >> Ok, I got a yes and a no on the POR-15 for my rusty steps, > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > You are subscribed as frede.thomas2 at verizon.net > > Shop-talk mailing list > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/shop-talk > > http://www.team.net/archive