[Shop-talk] plumping question

[pethier at comcast.net]

From: "John T. Blair" <jblair1948 at cox.net>
> At 04:09 AM 10/29/2007 +0000, Phil Ethier wrote:
> 
> >You don't have basements in your part of the world?
> 
> Nope!  I'm in Virginia Beach, VA, 

I understand.  Here most houses have basements.  Those that don't are built on a concrete slab.  A house built above an open space would have frozen water pipes.

> >I suggest you get the sewer line televised.  When there are problems, there 
> >is a reason.  A well-designed system in proper condition never needs the 
> >services of a sewer cleaner like Roto-Rooter.
> 
> We have quite a few trees and bushes around the sewer pipe.  So my guess
> is that their roots got into the drain line. 

Typically the method of a sewer-system demise.  Sewer services used to be made of either clay or, for the well-heeled, cast iron.  The pipes were made with bells and fitted together.  The sealing material never lasted, the pipes leaked and the trees headed for a free lunch.  The roots would either clog the pipe or break the pipe or both.  Rainwater would infiltrate, taking soil with it.  In some cases, rats would find the holes this caused.  You can determine if a rat hole connects to a failed sewer with a smoke bomb and a leaf blower.  The smoke will appear from the house vent or in a manhole.  Sometimes the cavity formed by the bad sewer does not appear on the surface.  We had a case up on Rice Street in which a guy parked his car in the front yard and it went right down to the door handles.  He did not know his sewer had failed; his house drains all still worked.  The clay typically used here was only 2 feet long, so there are many joints and they all fail.

Nowadays, contractors use Schedule 40 PVC pipe.  It comes in 10- and 20-foot sticks and therefore requires few joints.  The joints are made with the same plastic cement used by plumbers on inside drain work.  They don't leak and the trees don't know they are there.  In my 20 years in Public Works, I have seen hundreds of failures of clay services and and can not remember any failures of PVC services. 

If you have your service televised and it has some bad spots, I'd recommend you have it all replaced with Schedule 40 PVC.  It's probably cheaper in your area because your sewer services are probably much shallower than ours.  We require that the service be 8 feet deep at the property line.  Schedule 40 PVC is much smoother and slicker than clay, so  we allow 4-inch house services.  Often the contractor can slide this insde the old 6-inch clay.  

Replace that old stuff now and your great-grandchildren won't need RotoRooter.  :-)

Call up your local sewer utility and ask to see your original permit.  We have them back to about 1880, but some cities don't keep records this well.  Also ask if they have a list of outfits who TV sewer services, and if they have any special loan programs.  Here in Saint Paul, we will loan you the money for ten years, regardless of your income.  There are other City departments here that will make no-interest loans based on income.

When you are REALLY bored, ask me about sandrock sewers.  We have some of them here and experienced civil engineers from elsewhere go "huh?" when they hear me talk about sewers 150 feet deep.  :-)

--
Phil Ethier  West Side  Saint Paul Minnesota  USA
1962 Triumph TR4 CT2846L, 1992 Saturn SL2, 1993 Suburban,
1994 Miata C package
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I decry the textmessagization of the American-English language.