From scvc70 at epix.net Mon Aug 8 16:31:23 2011 From: scvc70 at epix.net (Carr&Edwards) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2011 18:31:23 -0400 Subject: [Mg-mmm] PA ignition switch Message-ID: <8F01A64D8FC5433BB4B0D907712C99CA@valuedea617bbe> I haven't seen a posting on this list in quite a while, so here's one to break the silence: I'm sorting through the bits of PA0935 for the first time in 25+ years, and need to know which (if either) of the the two ignition switches I have is the correct one. Both are Lucas, and marked "PLC2" on the back. #1 -- FP series key window shows "1 2 side" "Lucas" stamped into face 7 wiring connectors on the back: F2/D/F1 [top]; L/T/A/H [bottom] #2 -- MRN series key window shows "Off Side Head" "Lucas" printed on face 4 connectors on the back: A [top]; L/T/H [bottom] Comparison with the wiring diagrams in the PA Instruction Manual and Philip Smith's book show that #1 is more likely correct, though even that one isn't a perfect match (I don't see an "F2" in the Handbook diagram). The #2 switch reminds me of TC, though it doesn't match any of the diagrams in Smith. Can anybody out there help? Thanks in advance, Sarah Carr PA0935 in Penna. From lpalmer at roundaboutmanor.com Mon Aug 8 19:27:47 2011 From: lpalmer at roundaboutmanor.com (Lew Palmer) Date: Mon, 8 Aug 2011 20:27:47 -0500 Subject: [Mg-mmm] PA ignition switch In-Reply-To: <8F01A64D8FC5433BB4B0D907712C99CA@valuedea617bbe> References: <8F01A64D8FC5433BB4B0D907712C99CA@valuedea617bbe> Message-ID: <003301cc5633$8bfd5ce0$a3f816a0$@com> Neither one is correct, Sarah. The PLC2 is the right model, however, the switch should have FOUR positions and no window. The positions are "Low" or "Summer", "High" or "Winter", "Side" and "Head". This assumes use of the original cutout/fusebox. F1 and F2 positions lead to the cutout from whence these is a lead to the field coil of the dynamo. I hope this helps a bit. Cheers, Lew Palmer -----Original Message----- From: mg-mmm-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:mg-mmm-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Carr&Edwards Sent: Monday, August 08, 2011 5:31 PM To: Listserve Triple-M Subject: [Mg-mmm] PA ignition switch I haven't seen a posting on this list in quite a while, so here's one to break the silence: I'm sorting through the bits of PA0935 for the first time in 25+ years, and need to know which (if either) of the the two ignition switches I have is the correct one. Both are Lucas, and marked "PLC2" on the back. #1 -- FP series key window shows "1 2 side" "Lucas" stamped into face 7 wiring connectors on the back: F2/D/F1 [top]; L/T/A/H [bottom] #2 -- MRN series key window shows "Off Side Head" "Lucas" printed on face 4 connectors on the back: A [top]; L/T/H [bottom] Comparison with the wiring diagrams in the PA Instruction Manual and Philip Smith's book show that #1 is more likely correct, though even that one isn't a perfect match (I don't see an "F2" in the Handbook diagram). The #2 switch reminds me of TC, though it doesn't match any of the diagrams in Smith. Can anybody out there help? Thanks in advance, Sarah Carr PA0935 in Penna. _______________________________________________ Mg-mmm at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $11.47 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mg-mmm/lpalmer at roundaboutmanor.com From scvc70 at epix.net Thu Aug 11 10:20:54 2011 From: scvc70 at epix.net (Carr&Edwards) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2011 12:20:54 -0400 Subject: [Mg-mmm] ignition switch re-visited Message-ID: <9F79D2CCBC1B4A23B429F00ACFA0DBFF@valuedea617bbe> Here's a fine state of affairs! Two people who certainly should know their MMM's have different opinions on whether this switch is correct for PA0935: FP series key window shows "1 2 side head" [I omitted the 4th position on my original post, so that part of Lew's comment is irrelevant] "Lucas" stamped into face (not printed on) 7 wiring connectors on the back: F2/D/F1 [top]; L/T/A/H [bottom] Lew Palmer says "no" : The PLC2 is the right model, however, the switch should have FOUR positions and no window. The positions are "Low" or "Summer", "High" or "Winter", "Side" and "Head". This assumes use of the original cutout/fusebox. F1 and F2 positions lead to the cutout from whence there is a lead to the field coil of the dynamo. Jerry Felper says "yes": The 1,2, side, head is the proper switch for the PA. Does anyone else want to venture an opinion on this??? (I think I remember seeing a no-window, "Low/High" with my SA parts, but they're long gone). Sarah Carr PA0935 in Penna. From lpalmer at roundaboutmanor.com Thu Aug 11 11:07:29 2011 From: lpalmer at roundaboutmanor.com (Lew Palmer) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2011 12:07:29 -0500 Subject: [Mg-mmm] ignition switch re-visited In-Reply-To: <9F79D2CCBC1B4A23B429F00ACFA0DBFF@valuedea617bbe> References: <9F79D2CCBC1B4A23B429F00ACFA0DBFF@valuedea617bbe> Message-ID: <000e01cc5849$276d1960$76474c20$@com> Jerry is correct in so far as the 4 position switch. However, the PA (and the J2, PB, etc.) did not use a switch with a window. So, the switch is usable, but not technically correct. The PA switch should also use a spade key and not one with the more modern "cut" key. But having said that, I went to various reference books to confirm my belief and found numerous pictures of both style switches on Triple-M cars. So I guess if you aren't picky, either one seems acceptable. Cheers, Lew -----Original Message----- From: mg-mmm-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:mg-mmm-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Carr&Edwards Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2011 11:21 AM To: Listserve Triple-M Subject: [Mg-mmm] ignition switch re-visited Here's a fine state of affairs! Two people who certainly should know their MMM's have different opinions on whether this switch is correct for PA0935: FP series key window shows "1 2 side head" [I omitted the 4th position on my original post, so that part of Lew's comment is irrelevant] "Lucas" stamped into face (not printed on) 7 wiring connectors on the back: F2/D/F1 [top]; L/T/A/H [bottom] Lew Palmer says "no" : The PLC2 is the right model, however, the switch should have FOUR positions and no window. The positions are "Low" or "Summer", "High" or "Winter", "Side" and "Head". This assumes use of the original cutout/fusebox. F1 and F2 positions lead to the cutout from whence there is a lead to the field coil of the dynamo. Jerry Felper says "yes": The 1,2, side, head is the proper switch for the PA. Does anyone else want to venture an opinion on this??? (I think I remember seeing a no-window, "Low/High" with my SA parts, but they're long gone). Sarah Carr PA0935 in Penna. _______________________________________________ Mg-mmm at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $11.47 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mg-mmm/lpalmer at roundaboutmanor.com From lpalmer at roundaboutmanor.com Thu Aug 11 11:30:10 2011 From: lpalmer at roundaboutmanor.com (Lew Palmer) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2011 12:30:10 -0500 Subject: [Mg-mmm] ignition switch re-visited In-Reply-To: <9F79D2CCBC1B4A23B429F00ACFA0DBFF@valuedea617bbe> References: <9F79D2CCBC1B4A23B429F00ACFA0DBFF@valuedea617bbe> Message-ID: <001c01cc584c$528a0ec0$f79e2c40$@com> The following is a comment from Tom Metcalf who knows as much about Triple-M authenticity as anyone I know. And even he isn't completely sure: ============ You're right about the window but I didn't delve into that one because of typical variations. I use black Lucas 4 position on J's (OFF D S H) and brown Rotax on P/N's with same markings. I do think MAYBE some were summer/winter or low/high, but truthfully I really think those were TA era. PLC 2 sounds right without looking it up. But basically, I think the 2 positions of OFF D allowed the dynamo to either be OFF or ON, whereas the TA charging system allowed a LOW and HIGH charge. No expert but that's my take based on what I've seen. Also, why would MG use Lucas on earlier cars, and Rotax on later P's and N's? Best guess is Lucas ended up with tons of brown Rotax PLC's after Rotax and CAVwere consumed by Lucas, hence ending up with that kool little 3 spoke steering wheel looking logo for the combined companies. ========== -----Original Message----- From: mg-mmm-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:mg-mmm-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Carr&Edwards Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2011 11:21 AM To: Listserve Triple-M Subject: [Mg-mmm] ignition switch re-visited Here's a fine state of affairs! Two people who certainly should know their MMM's have different opinions on whether this switch is correct for PA0935: FP series key window shows "1 2 side head" [I omitted the 4th position on my original post, so that part of Lew's comment is irrelevant] "Lucas" stamped into face (not printed on) 7 wiring connectors on the back: F2/D/F1 [top]; L/T/A/H [bottom] Lew Palmer says "no" : The PLC2 is the right model, however, the switch should have FOUR positions and no window. The positions are "Low" or "Summer", "High" or "Winter", "Side" and "Head". This assumes use of the original cutout/fusebox. F1 and F2 positions lead to the cutout from whence there is a lead to the field coil of the dynamo. Jerry Felper says "yes": The 1,2, side, head is the proper switch for the PA. Does anyone else want to venture an opinion on this??? (I think I remember seeing a no-window, "Low/High" with my SA parts, but they're long gone). Sarah Carr PA0935 in Penna. _______________________________________________ Mg-mmm at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $11.47 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mg-mmm/lpalmer at roundaboutmanor.com From mgtom at zoominternet.net Thu Aug 11 12:20:49 2011 From: mgtom at zoominternet.net (Tom Metcalf) Date: Thu, 11 Aug 2011 14:20:49 -0400 Subject: [Mg-mmm] ignition switch re-visited In-Reply-To: <001c01cc584c$528a0ec0$f79e2c40$@com> References: <9F79D2CCBC1B4A23B429F00ACFA0DBFF@valuedea617bbe> <001c01cc584c$528a0ec0$f79e2c40$@com> Message-ID: <4E441D81.1080209@zoominternet.net> Sarah, Just to clarify, a P-Type typically used a brown Rotax switch with OFF D S H being the 4 positions. The back would be marked with P.L.C.5 (not 2). Spade key. tommm On 8/11/2011 1:30 PM, Lew Palmer wrote: > The following is a comment from Tom Metcalf who knows as much about Triple-M > authenticity as anyone I know. And even he isn't completely sure: > ============ > You're right about the window but I didn't delve into that one because of > typical variations. I use black Lucas 4 position on J's (OFF D S H) and > brown Rotax on P/N's with same markings. I do think MAYBE some were > summer/winter or low/high, but truthfully I really think those were TA era. > PLC 2 sounds right without looking it up. > > But basically, I think the 2 positions of OFF D allowed the dynamo to either > be OFF or ON, whereas the TA charging system allowed a LOW and HIGH charge. > > No expert but that's my take based on what I've seen. > > Also, why would MG use Lucas on earlier cars, and Rotax on later P's and > N's? Best guess is Lucas ended up with tons of brown Rotax PLC's after Rotax > and CAVwere consumed by Lucas, hence ending up with that kool little 3 spoke > steering wheel looking logo for the combined companies. > ========== > -----Original Message----- > From: mg-mmm-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:mg-mmm-bounces at autox.team.net] > On Behalf Of Carr&Edwards > Sent: Thursday, August 11, 2011 11:21 AM > To: Listserve Triple-M > Subject: [Mg-mmm] ignition switch re-visited > > Here's a fine state of affairs! Two people who certainly should know their > MMM's have different opinions on whether this switch is correct for PA0935: > > FP series key > window shows "1 2 side head" [I omitted the 4th position on my > original post, > so that part of Lew's comment is irrelevant] > "Lucas" stamped into face (not printed on) > 7 wiring connectors on the back: F2/D/F1 [top]; L/T/A/H [bottom] > > Lew Palmer says "no" : > The PLC2 is the right model, however, the switch should have FOUR > positions > and no window. The positions are "Low" or "Summer", "High" or "Winter", > "Side" and "Head". This assumes use of the original cutout/fusebox. F1 and > F2 positions lead to the cutout from whence there is a lead to the field > coil of the dynamo. > > Jerry Felper says "yes": > The 1,2, side, head is the proper switch for the PA. > > > Does anyone else want to venture an opinion on this??? (I think I remember > seeing a no-window, "Low/High" with my SA parts, but they're long gone). > > > Sarah Carr > PA0935 in Penna. > _______________________________________________ > > Mg-mmm at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $11.47 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mg-mmm/lpalmer at roundaboutmanor.com > _______________________________________________ > > Mg-mmm at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $11.47 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mg-mmm/mgtom at zoominternet.net From taterry at aol.com Mon Aug 22 17:59:35 2011 From: taterry at aol.com (taterry at aol.com) Date: Mon, 22 Aug 2011 19:59:35 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Mg-mmm] a J2 story Message-ID: <8CE2F3EAD64A340-760-12DF8@webmail-d013.sysops.aol.com> >From my friend Fred Loeser has been restoring his J2 for 53 years and I thought 12 years was a long time on my NA0613!! Here is part of his story: 53 Years and counting. J2 3006 With the certain knowledge that someone will wonder how anyone can nurse a project this long and maintain the absolute assurance that it would not only be finished but a credit to the make and despite the fact that he didn't have the slightest idea of what he was getting into,only that whatever was done was to bring the car back to "original". It all started in the summer of 1958 while visiting friends whose neighbor invited me to inspect his latest project. It was a rather tired looking roadster that I recognized as some sort of an MG but not anything like the T series that were popular at the time and into which he had stuffed a Ford V8 60 engine and transmission. I can't remember if he ever drove it or just decided life was too precious but he offered it to me ,engine and all for $500. Within a month I had the engine out and started going through the remaining bits. A friend put me in touch with the local MG owners club which in turn led to joining the Triple M Society and corresponding to members in England. My intent in restoring the car was reinforced by the help and encouragment I received from some really fine people who wanted nothing more than the satisfaction of being able to assist. Among them was the late Mike Hawke, Steve Dear from Bristol, D.G.E.Taylor from Brigg,Lincolnshire and especially Stuart Lightbody who at the time was a London cop and used a J2 for everyday transportation. Not the least of these is Editor Sanders who informed me that J2 3006 competed in the 1933 Monte Carlo Rally. Incentive indeed. With the help of people like Mike Dowley of Sports and Vintage, Joe Curto,the SU guy who I've gone to recently the pieces are starting to fall together-now if only the budget cooperates I'll be able to collect some bets. Terry...do whatever you want with this. I'm hoping to arouse some questions I can answer in later notes. Thanks Fred From scvc70 at epix.net Thu Aug 25 14:37:45 2011 From: scvc70 at epix.net (Carr&Edwards) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 16:37:45 -0400 Subject: [Mg-mmm] headlamp lens? Message-ID: <32D5768243ED4381AF3BC2C5DFD4791A@valuedea617bbe> I'm still trying to sort out what's what among the bits of PA0935. I have a pair of headlamp lenses, in original Lucas boxes, Lucas # 551308; lenses have U-shaped ribs, and are marked on the rim "No. D 714-3"; outside diameter 7-3/4". I have no rims into which to test-fit them -- can one of you experts tell me if they're correct? Many thanks, Sarah Carr PA0935 in Penna. From gweber at weberarchitecture.com Thu Aug 25 18:46:32 2011 From: gweber at weberarchitecture.com (Gerry Weber) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 20:46:32 -0400 Subject: [Mg-mmm] headlamp lens? In-Reply-To: <32D5768243ED4381AF3BC2C5DFD4791A@valuedea617bbe> References: <32D5768243ED4381AF3BC2C5DFD4791A@valuedea617bbe> Message-ID: <65715F5180A7E7498A3DD25F1AEA35D20F56DF@WEBERDC.weberarchitecture.local> Sounds right to me. That's what I have for PA0297. Came with the car in 1977 when I bought it in 1977. Gerry Weber PA 0297 in Cleveland -----Original Message----- From: mg-mmm-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:mg-mmm-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Carr&Edwards Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2011 4:38 PM To: Listserve Triple-M Subject: [Mg-mmm] headlamp lens? I'm still trying to sort out what's what among the bits of PA0935. I have a pair of headlamp lenses, in original Lucas boxes, Lucas # 551308; lenses have U-shaped ribs, and are marked on the rim "No. D 714-3"; outside diameter 7-3/4". I have no rims into which to test-fit them -- can one of you experts tell me if they're correct? Many thanks, Sarah Carr PA0935 in Penna. _______________________________________________ Mg-mmm at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $11.47 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mg-mmm/gweber at weberarchitecture.co m From lpalmer at roundaboutmanor.com Thu Aug 25 19:05:57 2011 From: lpalmer at roundaboutmanor.com (Lew Palmer) Date: Thu, 25 Aug 2011 20:05:57 -0500 Subject: [Mg-mmm] headlamp lens? In-Reply-To: <32D5768243ED4381AF3BC2C5DFD4791A@valuedea617bbe> References: <32D5768243ED4381AF3BC2C5DFD4791A@valuedea617bbe> Message-ID: <021001cc638c$5026c0b0$f0744210$@com> Sarah, They certainly sound correct to me. This is what they should look like. http://www.vintage-headlamp-restoration.com/MgFS.jpg Cheers, Lew Palmer -----Original Message----- From: mg-mmm-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:mg-mmm-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Carr&Edwards Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2011 3:38 PM To: Listserve Triple-M Subject: [Mg-mmm] headlamp lens? I'm still trying to sort out what's what among the bits of PA0935. I have a pair of headlamp lenses, in original Lucas boxes, Lucas # 551308; lenses have U-shaped ribs, and are marked on the rim "No. D 714-3"; outside diameter 7-3/4". I have no rims into which to test-fit them -- can one of you experts tell me if they're correct? Many thanks, Sarah Carr PA0935 in Penna. _______________________________________________ Mg-mmm at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Suggested annual donation $11.47 Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mg-mmm/lpalmer at roundaboutmanor.com [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of image001.jpg]