From b.a.savage at wildblue.net  Thu Jan  6 15:07:48 2011
From: b.a.savage at wildblue.net (Bryan Savage)
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2011 14:07:48 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
Message-ID: <4D263D34.2030804@wildblue.net>

Hi folks,

While reading Howard Nafzger's comments about the car he designed and built,
"How did Charles hook up so much horsepower with two-wheel drive?b


A very interesting question. Before he did it, I couldn't believe you 
could put enough
power down on the salt to exceed 400MPH.

All I can think of is that the car has outstanding aero so it didn't 
have to put down
a lot of power...??

As it was an FIA run, it wasn't a tail wind.

Anyone else have any ideas?

Thanks,
Bryan 

From drmayf at mayfco.com  Thu Jan  6 16:00:23 2011
From: drmayf at mayfco.com (Larry Mayfield)
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2011 15:00:23 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Photographs
Message-ID: <4D264987.3080809@mayfco.com>

Folks, iffn you remember a while back, my computer ate itself. One of 
the things I lost were photos. I need to find a few aerial shots of the 
salt with a meet going on that shows the expanse of the place and   the 
crowds around the starting lines.  If anyone has a photo or two that I 
might use, with attribution of course, I would appreciate you sending 
them to me.

drmayf at mayfco.com      or        larry.mayfield at mayfco.com

would get them to me.

I appreciate it..

mayf

From jonwennerberg at nancyandjon.org  Thu Jan  6 16:43:40 2011
From: jonwennerberg at nancyandjon.org (Jon Wennerberg)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 18:43:40 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <4D263D34.2030804@wildblue.net>
References: <4D263D34.2030804@wildblue.net>
Message-ID: <399AE5FB-AB6F-46B5-81E5-2BD27A93F8BB@nancyandjon.org>

On Jan 6, 2011, at 5:07 PM, Bryan Savage wrote:

Hi folks,

While reading Howard Nafzger's comments about the car he designed and built,
"How did Charles hook up so much horsepower with two-wheel drive?b

A very interesting question. Before he did it, I couldn't believe you could
put enough
power down on the salt to exceed 400MPH.

All I can think of is that the car has outstanding aero so it didn't have to
put down
a lot of power...??

As it was an FIA run, it wasn't a tail wind.

Anyone else have any ideas?

Thanks,
Bryan





Bryan, it's apparent that the 400 mph barrier can be broken with two wheel
drive, witness the four cars that did it this past Shootout (I am pretty sure
the Nish car is 2WD - I know the others are).  The Speed Demon sure looks like
it's very aerodynamically advanced, but the Kenny Hoover/Amir Rosenbaum
"Spectre" doesn't look all that super-duper.  It did the number, though, as
did Nish. So - take it from there.  The Ack Attack bike 'liner is rear wheel
only drive, isn't it?  And therefore it'd go into a similar category as a
two-wheel driven 4 wheeler.

Best wishes for the new year.

Jon a/k/a Seldom Seen Slim

From jonwennerberg at nancyandjon.org  Thu Jan  6 16:46:39 2011
From: jonwennerberg at nancyandjon.org (Jon Wennerberg)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 18:46:39 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Fwd:  Photographs
References: <1A10C8FB-E703-45DD-A931-E89BF73B8ED8@nancyandjon.org>
Message-ID: <DC02500A-51A6-4081-BE3E-437BD8967471@nancyandjon.org>

Mayf, for whatever reason -- I am always unable to get an email to you.  It
may well be your computer's settings and "junk/spam" filtering -- but they
always come back to me.  I just now sent this one to the "larry.mayfield" addy
-- and back it came, in about a minute.  I know the drmayf address will do
that, too.  Wanna do me a favor and reset stuff so I can send to you?  At the
same time -- assuming this one gets through one way or another -- check out
the link to the photo.  I think that'll make it to you unfarkled.

Thanks --

Jon a/k/a SSS



Begin forwarded message:

From: Larry Mayfield <drmayf at mayfco.com>
Date: January 6, 2011 6:00:23 PM EST
To: "land-speed at autox.team.net" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Land-speed] Photographs
Reply-To: drmayf at mayfco.com

Folks, iffn you remember a while back, my computer ate itself. One of the
things I lost were photos. I need to find a few aerial shots of the salt with
a meet going on that shows the expanse of the place and   the crowds around
the starting lines.  If anyone has a photo or two that I might use, with
attribution of course, I would appreciate you sending them to me.

drmayf at mayfco.com      or        larry.mayfield at mayfco.com





Forwarded and bounced message:

Mayf, this is a shot taken by (I think) Rick Byrnes.  It sure does a good job.
It's been published on the landracing.com website -- and I've got it (as found
here) on the personal website of Nancy and me.  I don't know if Rick wants
photo credit.

http://www.nancyandjon.org/images/bonneville/aerial_a_mod.jpg

Best wishes for the new year.


Jon a/k/a Seldom Seen Slim

From sparky.2211 at cox.net  Thu Jan  6 16:47:44 2011
From: sparky.2211 at cox.net (sparky.2211 at cox.net)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 18:47:44 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <4D263D34.2030804@wildblue.net>
Message-ID: <20110106184744.ENKYE.720331.imail@fed1rmwml29>

My GUESS would be MOTEC traction control.


---- Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net> wrote:
> Hi folks,
>
> While reading Howard Nafzger's comments about the car he designed and
built,
> "How did Charles hook up so much horsepower with two-wheel drive?b

>
> A very interesting question. Before he did it, I couldn't believe you
> could put enough
> power down on the salt to exceed 400MPH.
>
> All I can think of is that the car has outstanding aero so it didn't
> have to put down
> a lot of power...??
>
> As it was an FIA run, it wasn't a tail wind.
>
> Anyone else have any ideas?

From NT788 at comcast.net  Thu Jan  6 18:02:47 2011
From: NT788 at comcast.net (NT788 at comcast.net)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 01:02:47 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <20110106184744.ENKYE.720331.imail@fed1rmwml29>
Message-ID: <1732463837.828769.1294362167652.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

-Weight, balance, aero,frontal area,controlability,traction coefficientB and
horsepower. Jack




Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg

My GUESS would be MOTEC traction control.


---- Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net> wrote:
> Hi folks,
>
> While reading Howard Nafzger's comments about the car he designed and
built,
> "How did Charles hook up so much horsepower with two-wheel drive?b
>
> A very interesting question. Before he did it, I couldn't believe you
> could put enough
> power down on the salt to exceed 400MPH.
>
> All I can think of is that the car has outstanding aero so it didn't
> have to put down
> a lot of power...??
>
> As it was an FIA run, it wasn't a tail wind.
>
> Anyone else have any ideas?
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/nt788 at comcast.net

From drmayf at mayfco.com  Thu Jan  6 18:21:39 2011
From: drmayf at mayfco.com (Larry Mayfield)
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2011 17:21:39 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <4D263D34.2030804@wildblue.net>
References: <4D263D34.2030804@wildblue.net>
Message-ID: <4D266AA3.1090402@mayfco.com>

Lots of variables to consider when putting power down. One is the torque 
available at speed. Another is condition of the salt. The salt 
coefficient of friction comes into play as well.  If yo have the torque 
curve of the engine output through the gears drive system you can 
determine the minimum down force or weight needed on the drive tire to 
meet traction needs.  As hp increases over the 5252 rpm then torque 
declines so as long as you can make it through teh peak torque in final 
drive you can lay down the power if the car or bike is loaded correctly. 
IMHO, lol...  Also good aero reduces the drag which translates to the 
power needed.

mayf

On 1/6/2011 2:07 PM, Bryan Savage wrote:
> Hi folks,
>
> While reading Howard Nafzger's comments about the car he designed and 
> built,
> "How did Charles hook up so much horsepower with two-wheel drive?b

>
> A very interesting question. Before he did it, I couldn't believe you 
> could put enough
> power down on the salt to exceed 400MPH.
>
> All I can think of is that the car has outstanding aero so it didn't 
> have to put down
> a lot of power...??
>
> As it was an FIA run, it wasn't a tail wind.
>
> Anyone else have any ideas?
>
> Thanks,
> Bryan _______________________________________________

From dahlgren536 at comcast.net  Thu Jan  6 18:51:46 2011
From: dahlgren536 at comcast.net (Dave Dahlgren)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 20:51:46 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <1732463837.828769.1294362167652.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1732463837.828769.1294362167652.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <615C718BF13E47C9BC548B76D6BD622D@DaveSatellite>

I am on Jack's side here. Traction control Motec or otherwise will save you 
from hurting tires but will never make it faster. Ack went 394 or so out the 
back with 1 tire and I can promise there is no traction control there. Aero 
is everything in the end and frontal area is right there with it. The old 
V^3 problem.. if it has some suspension even better a solid suspension turns 
the tires into an undamped spring and harder to control than might be 
initially thought. For it to work the track has to be perfectly flat and 
smooth, problem is nothing is perfectly flat and smooth. Ever drive a car 
with bad shocks? same thing only at a more exciting pace.
Dave
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <NT788 at comcast.net>
To: "sparky 2211" <sparky.2211 at cox.net>
Cc: "List Land Speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 8:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg


> -Weight, balance, aero,frontal area,controlability,traction coefficientB 
> and
> horsepower. Jack
>
>
>
>
> Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
>
> My GUESS would be MOTEC traction control.
>
>
> ---- Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net> wrote:
>> Hi folks,
>>
>> While reading Howard Nafzger's comments about the car he designed and
> built,
>> "How did Charles hook up so much horsepower with two-wheel drive?b
>>
>> A very interesting question. Before he did it, I couldn't believe you
>> could put enough
>> power down on the salt to exceed 400MPH.
>>
>> All I can think of is that the car has outstanding aero so it didn't
>> have to put down
>> a lot of power...??
>>
>> As it was an FIA run, it wasn't a tail wind.
>>
>> Anyone else have any ideas?

From NT788 at comcast.net  Thu Jan  6 19:06:55 2011
From: NT788 at comcast.net (NT788 at comcast.net)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 02:06:55 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <615C718BF13E47C9BC548B76D6BD622D@DaveSatellite>
Message-ID: <1090937698.832337.1294366015196.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

Dave 

I call what a what a tire does thrust? 

Jack 

I am on Jack's side here. Traction control Motec or otherwise will save you 
from hurting tires but will never make it faster. Ack went 394 or so out the 
back with 1 tire and I can promise there is no traction control there. Aero 
is everything in the end and frontal area is right there with it. The old 
V^3 problem.. if it has some suspension even better a solid suspension turns 
the tires into an undamped spring and harder to control than might be 
initially thought. For it to work the track has to be perfectly flat and 
smooth, problem is nothing is perfectly flat and smooth. Ever drive a car 
with bad shocks? same thing only at a more exciting pace. 
Dave 
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <NT788 at comcast.net> 
To: "sparky 2211" <sparky.2211 at cox.net> 
Cc: "List Land Speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net> 
Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 8:02 PM 
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg 


> -Weight, balance, aero,frontal area,controlability,traction coefficientB 
> and 
> horsepower. Jack 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg 
> 
> My GUESS would be MOTEC traction control. 
> 
> 
> ---- Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net> wrote: 
>> Hi folks, 
>> 
>> While reading Howard Nafzger's comments about the car he designed and 
> built, 
>> "How did Charles hook up so much horsepower with two-wheel drive?b 
>> 
>> A very interesting question. Before he did it, I couldn't believe you 
>> could put enough 
>> power down on the salt to exceed 400MPH. 
>> 
>> All I can think of is that the car has outstanding aero so it didn't 
>> have to put down 
>> a lot of power...?? 
>> 
>> As it was an FIA run, it wasn't a tail wind. 
>> 
>> Anyone else have any ideas? 

From NT788 at comcast.net  Thu Jan  6 19:11:44 2011
From: NT788 at comcast.net (NT788 at comcast.net)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 02:11:44 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <615C718BF13E47C9BC548B76D6BD622D@DaveSatellite>
Message-ID: <1746011016.832525.1294366304103.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

I didn't remove the question mark after thrust, put a period.I:E "I call what a tire does thrust." 

Jack 


I am on Jack's side here. Traction control Motec or otherwise will save you 
from hurting tires but will never make it faster. Ack went 394 or so out the 
back with 1 tire and I can promise there is no traction control there. Aero 
is everything in the end and frontal area is right there with it. The old 
V^3 problem.. if it has some suspension even better a solid suspension turns 
the tires into an undamped spring and harder to control than might be 
initially thought. For it to work the track has to be perfectly flat and 
smooth, problem is nothing is perfectly flat and smooth. Ever drive a car 
with bad shocks? same thing only at a more exciting pace. 
Dave 
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <NT788 at comcast.net> 
To: "sparky 2211" <sparky.2211 at cox.net> 
Cc: "List Land Speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net> 
Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 8:02 PM 
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg 


> -Weight, balance, aero,frontal area,controlability,traction coefficientB 
> and 
> horsepower. Jack 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg 
> 
> My GUESS would be MOTEC traction control. 
> 
> 
> ---- Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net> wrote: 
>> Hi folks, 
>> 
>> While reading Howard Nafzger's comments about the car he designed and 
> built, 
>> "How did Charles hook up so much horsepower with two-wheel drive?b 
>> 
>> A very interesting question. Before he did it, I couldn't believe you 
>> could put enough 
>> power down on the salt to exceed 400MPH. 
>> 
>> All I can think of is that the car has outstanding aero so it didn't 
>> have to put down 
>> a lot of power...?? 
>> 
>> As it was an FIA run, it wasn't a tail wind. 
>> 
>> Anyone else have any ideas? 

From jimwebb at nutsracing.com  Thu Jan  6 19:35:21 2011
From: jimwebb at nutsracing.com (Jim Webb)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 20:35:21 -0600
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <1732463837.828769.1294362167652.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <20110106184744.ENKYE.720331.imail@fed1rmwml29>
	<1732463837.828769.1294362167652.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <DE5A5516278241A190A4C5F439277611@VAIO>

In that order, Jack? About that frontal area... we have enough to share if
anybody wants some!

Jim Webb
Chock Full o' Nuts
AA/PP A/PP B/PP C/PP D/PP ?/FL
 
-----Original Message-----
From: land-speed-bounces at autox.team.net
[mailto:land-speed-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of NT788 at comcast.net
Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 7:03 PM
To: sparky 2211
Cc: List Land Speed
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg

-Weight, balance, aero,frontal area,controlability,traction coefficientB and
horsepower. Jack




Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg

My GUESS would be MOTEC traction control.


---- Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net> wrote:
> Hi folks,
>
> While reading Howard Nafzger's comments about the car he designed and
built,
> "How did Charles hook up so much horsepower with two-wheel drive?b
>
> A very interesting question. Before he did it, I couldn't believe you
> could put enough
> power down on the salt to exceed 400MPH.
>
> All I can think of is that the car has outstanding aero so it didn't
> have to put down
> a lot of power...??
>
> As it was an FIA run, it wasn't a tail wind.
>
> Anyone else have any ideas?
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/nt788 at comcast.net
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/jimwebb at nutsracing.com

From dahlgren536 at comcast.net  Thu Jan  6 20:11:25 2011
From: dahlgren536 at comcast.net (Dave Dahlgren)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 22:11:25 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <1090937698.832337.1294366015196.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1090937698.832337.1294366015196.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <40C1DB8B982B4D02A54FE0F9C6A52B54@DaveSatellite>

You lost me a bit there but if I see what you are hinting at I think the
problem is less with a drive wheel than a driven one. A drive wheel the tire
gets deformed from the loads on it providing thrust so a small deflection
might just unwind it a bit then it gets rewound unless the unwind also unhooks
it from having traction. A driven wheel is more like an over inflated
basketball with about the same amount of damping..
Dave
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: NT788 at comcast.net
  To: Dave Dahlgren
  Cc: List Land Speed ; sparky 2211
  Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 9:06 PM
  Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg


  Dave

  I call what a what a tire does thrust?

  Jack

  I am on Jack's side here. Traction control Motec or otherwise will save you
  from hurting tires but will never make it faster. Ack went 394 or so out the
  back with 1 tire and I can promise there is no traction control there. Aero
  is everything in the end and frontal area is right there with it. The old
  V^3 problem.. if it has some suspension even better a solid suspension turns
  the tires into an undamped spring and harder to control than might be
  initially thought. For it to work the track has to be perfectly flat and
  smooth, problem is nothing is perfectly flat and smooth. Ever drive a car
  with bad shocks? same thing only at a more exciting pace.
  Dave
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: <NT788 at comcast.net>
  To: "sparky 2211" <sparky.2211 at cox.net>
  Cc: "List Land Speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
  Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 8:02 PM
  Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg


  > -Weight, balance, aero,frontal area,controlability,traction coefficientB
  > and
  > horsepower. Jack
  >
  >
  >
  >
  > Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
  >
  > My GUESS would be MOTEC traction control.
  >
  >
  > ---- Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net> wrote:
  >> Hi folks,
  >>
  >> While reading Howard Nafzger's comments about the car he designed and
  > built,
  >> "How did Charles hook up so much horsepower with two-wheel drive?b
  >>
  >> A very interesting question. Before he did it, I couldn't believe you
  >> could put enough
  >> power down on the salt to exceed 400MPH.
  >>
  >> All I can think of is that the car has outstanding aero so it didn't
  >> have to put down
  >> a lot of power...??
  >>
  >> As it was an FIA run, it wasn't a tail wind.
  >>
  >> Anyone else have any ideas?

From drmayf at mayfco.com  Thu Jan  6 20:35:00 2011
From: drmayf at mayfco.com (Larry Mayfield)
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2011 19:35:00 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <1090937698.832337.1294366015196.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1090937698.832337.1294366015196.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <4D2689E4.5040904@mayfco.com>

Jack, Yes.... force transmitted to the salt = thrust forward..

mayf

On 1/6/2011 6:06 PM, NT788 at comcast.net wrote:
> Dave
>
> I call what a what a tire does thrust?
>
> Jack
>
> I am on Jack's side here. Traction control Motec or otherwise will save you
> from hurting tires but will never make it faster. Ack went 394 or so out the
> back with 1 tire and I can promise there is no traction control there. Aero
> is everything in the end and frontal area is right there with it. The old
> V^3 problem.. if it has some suspension even better a solid suspension turns
> the tires into an undamped spring and harder to control than might be
> initially thought. For it to work the track has to be perfectly flat and
> smooth, problem is nothing is perfectly flat and smooth. Ever drive a car
> with bad shocks? same thing only at a more exciting pace.
> Dave
> ----- Original Message -----
> From:<NT788 at comcast.net>
> To: "sparky 2211"<sparky.2211 at cox.net>
> Cc: "List Land Speed"<land-speed at autox.team.net>
> Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 8:02 PM
> Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
>
>
>> -Weight, balance, aero,frontal area,controlability,traction coefficientB
>> and
>> horsepower. Jack
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
>>
>> My GUESS would be MOTEC traction control.
>>
>>
>> ---- Bryan Savage<b.a.savage at wildblue.net>  wrote:
>>> Hi folks,
>>>
>>> While reading Howard Nafzger's comments about the car he designed and
>> built,
>>> "How did Charles hook up so much horsepower with two-wheel drive?b
>>>
>>> A very interesting question. Before he did it, I couldn't believe you
>>> could put enough
>>> power down on the salt to exceed 400MPH.
>>>
>>> All I can think of is that the car has outstanding aero so it didn't
>>> have to put down
>>> a lot of power...??
>>>
>>> As it was an FIA run, it wasn't a tail wind.
>>>
>>> Anyone else have any ideas?
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/drmayf at mayfco.com

From saltrat at pahrump.com  Thu Jan  6 21:36:23 2011
From: saltrat at pahrump.com (Skip Higginbotham)
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2011 20:36:23 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <40C1DB8B982B4D02A54FE0F9C6A52B54@DaveSatellite>
References: <1090937698.832337.1294366015196.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<40C1DB8B982B4D02A54FE0F9C6A52B54@DaveSatellite>
Message-ID: <20110107043557.76EB618764B@autox.team.net>

Any time one can run  300 in the 1/4. The downstream speed will be 
good. That has to figure into the equation.

Skip






At 07:11 PM 1/6/2011, Dave Dahlgren wrote:
>You lost me a bit there but if I see what you are hinting at I think the
>problem is less with a drive wheel than a driven one. A drive wheel the tire
>gets deformed from the loads on it providing thrust so a small deflection
>might just unwind it a bit then it gets rewound unless the unwind also unhooks
>it from having traction. A driven wheel is more like an over inflated
>basketball with about the same amount of damping..
>Dave
>   ----- Original Message -----
>   From: NT788 at comcast.net
>   To: Dave Dahlgren
>   Cc: List Land Speed ; sparky 2211
>   Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 9:06 PM
>   Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
>
>
>   Dave
>
>   I call what a what a tire does thrust?
>
>   Jack
>
>   I am on Jack's side here. Traction control Motec or otherwise will save you
>   from hurting tires but will never make it faster. Ack went 394 or 
> so out the
>   back with 1 tire and I can promise there is no traction control there. Aero
>   is everything in the end and frontal area is right there with it. The old
>   V^3 problem.. if it has some suspension even better a solid 
> suspension turns
>   the tires into an undamped spring and harder to control than might be
>   initially thought. For it to work the track has to be perfectly flat and
>   smooth, problem is nothing is perfectly flat and smooth. Ever drive a car
>   with bad shocks? same thing only at a more exciting pace.
>   Dave
>   ----- Original Message -----
>   From: <NT788 at comcast.net>
>   To: "sparky 2211" <sparky.2211 at cox.net>
>   Cc: "List Land Speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
>   Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 8:02 PM
>   Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
>
>
>   > -Weight, balance, aero,frontal area,controlability,traction coefficientB
>   > and
>   > horsepower. Jack
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   >
>   > Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
>   >
>   > My GUESS would be MOTEC traction control.
>   >
>   >
>   > ---- Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net> wrote:
>   >> Hi folks,
>   >>
>   >> While reading Howard Nafzger's comments about the car he designed and
>   > built,
>   >> "How did Charles hook up so much horsepower with two-wheel drive?b
>   >>
>   >> A very interesting question. Before he did it, I couldn't believe you
>   >> could put enough
>   >> power down on the salt to exceed 400MPH.
>   >>
>   >> All I can think of is that the car has outstanding aero so it didn't
>   >> have to put down
>   >> a lot of power...??
>   >>
>   >> As it was an FIA run, it wasn't a tail wind.
>   >>
>   >> Anyone else have any ideas?
>_______________________________________________
>Land-speed at autox.team.net
>Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
>Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
>Unsubscribe/Manage: 
>http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/saltrat at pahrump.com

From sparky.2211 at cox.net  Thu Jan  6 21:55:21 2011
From: sparky.2211 at cox.net (sparky.2211 at cox.net)
Date: Thu, 6 Jan 2011 23:55:21 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <4D2689E4.5040904@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <20110106235521.B9CON.723499.imail@fed1rmwml43>

I call that TE or tractive effort

> Jack, Yes.... force transmitted to the salt = thrust forward..
> 
> mayf

From b.a.savage at wildblue.net  Thu Jan  6 22:19:17 2011
From: b.a.savage at wildblue.net (Bryan Savage)
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2011 21:19:17 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg  II
In-Reply-To: <1090937698.832337.1294366015196.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1090937698.832337.1294366015196.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <4D26A255.7060405@wildblue.net>

RE:
">> Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles 
Nearburg
>>
>> My GUESS would be MOTEC traction control."

 From the article:
"Nearburg does not rely on traction
control; he prefers to drive on feel, b
I
canbt flat foot it until 300 MPH and can
also spin the tires at will. b
I drive to 
find
traction from the moment we push off
the starting line. We have enough down
force and drag, a combination of factors
working together to exceed 400 MPH.b


Traction control can prevent you from 
slowing down due to excessive tire speed.
The faster you spin a tire the greater 
the centrifugal force which makes the tire
stiffer, and narrower. Both decrease 
traction. You can also loose control 
when you
blow a tire due to wheel spin. I know 
this has happened at Bonneville.
I like to think that a skilled driver 
can do as well as traction control, but 
I also think
traction control can be a safety device 
for a new driver.
Those who think traction control will 
slow you down, should examine the subject
in F-1. You won't find anything on a 20 
million dollar F-1 car that doesn't make
it go faster and they all have traction 
control.

Thanks for the wonderful food for 
thought folks,
Bryan

I'll send the entire article.

From b.a.savage at wildblue.net  Thu Jan  6 22:24:44 2011
From: b.a.savage at wildblue.net (Bryan Savage)
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2011 21:24:44 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Fuel for Thought By Land Speed Louise Ann Noeth.
Message-ID: <4D26A39C.4060403@wildblue.net>

From:
Fuel for Thought By Land Speed Louise Ann Noeth.

The most historically significant
Bonneville Salt Flats news this year came
when world record holder Bill Summers
of Goldenrod fame answered a phone call
from Texan Charles Nearburg in late
September; he was calling minutes after
breaking the Summers Brothers decades old
record averaging 414 MPH driving
his b
Spirit of Rettb
 streamliner.
b
Itbs about time,b
 quipped Bill Summers
to Nearburg, b
We held that record a
long time b 44 years, 10 months and 12
days. That you went that fast with only
one naturally aspirated engine driving
only through two wheels, is a phenomenal
achievement.
Nearburg does not rely on traction
control; he prefers to drive on feel, b
I
canbt flat foot it until 300 MPH and can
also spin the tires at will. b
I drive to find
traction from the moment we push off
the starting line. We have enough down
force and drag, a combination of factors
working together to exceed 400 MPH.b

The Spirit of Rett was built over a
six year time period by Arizona resident
Howard Nafzger who took advantage of
the sportbs broad opportunities to be creative
and later sold the car.
b
I was very surprised, humbled, and
proud,b
 he said, b
Horsepower is easier to
come by than slippery cars. Generally
speaking, once the aerodynamic drag
exceeds the available traction, adding
more horsepower will not make you go
much faster. How did Charles hook up so
much horsepower with two-wheel drive?b


From dahlgren536 at comcast.net  Thu Jan  6 22:31:35 2011
From: dahlgren536 at comcast.net (Dave Dahlgren)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 00:31:35 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
Message-ID: <0BB68A011EF0447B9B6FBC4934BA201E@DaveSatellite>

Whatever you can do between the 2 and 2 1/4 will always add at the 5 sort of 
a given. If 300 is very good then 325 is better unless it is done with 
gearing that peaks at the 3 then it is a long drone for the next 2 miles. It 
is always balance to make best use of the distance available.
Dave
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Skip Higginbotham" <saltrat at pahrump.com>
To: "Dave Dahlgren" <dahlgren536 at comcast.net>; <NT788 at comcast.net>
Cc: "List Land Speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>; "sparky 2211" 
<sparky.2211 at cox.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 11:36 PM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg


> Any time one can run  300 in the 1/4. The downstream speed will be good. 
> That has to figure into the equation.
>
> Skip

From dahlgren536 at comcast.net  Thu Jan  6 23:21:58 2011
From: dahlgren536 at comcast.net (Dave Dahlgren)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 01:21:58 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Fuel for Thought By Land Speed Louise Ann  Noeth.
In-Reply-To: <4D26A39C.4060403@wildblue.net>
References: <4D26A39C.4060403@wildblue.net>
Message-ID: <5DAC69EFEC0D4D14BB3C73C741FFF181@DaveSatellite>

I might be wrong and usually am but didnt Teague Nolen White and Burkland go 
faster? Is this a class record or the ultimate record? They really need a 
record for the ultimate I don't care how you got it done to separate all 
this stuf.
dave
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Bryan Savage" <b.a.savage at wildblue.net>
To: "List Land Speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Friday, January 07, 2011 12:24 AM
Subject: [Land-speed] Fuel for Thought By Land Speed Louise Ann Noeth.


> From:
> Fuel for Thought By Land Speed Louise Ann Noeth.
>
> The most historically significant
> Bonneville Salt Flats news this year came
> when world record holder Bill Summers
> of Goldenrod fame answered a phone call
> from Texan Charles Nearburg in late
> September; he was calling minutes after
> breaking the Summers Brothers decades old
> record averaging 414 MPH driving
> his b
Spirit of Rettb
 streamliner.
> b
Itbs about time,b
 quipped Bill Summers
> to Nearburg, b
We held that record a
> long time b 44 years, 10 months and 12
> days. That you went that fast with only
> one naturally aspirated engine driving
> only through two wheels, is a phenomenal
> achievement.
> Nearburg does not rely on traction
> control; he prefers to drive on feel, b
I
> canbt flat foot it until 300 MPH and can
> also spin the tires at will. b
I drive to find
> traction from the moment we push off
> the starting line. We have enough down
> force and drag, a combination of factors
> working together to exceed 400 MPH.b

> The Spirit of Rett was built over a
> six year time period by Arizona resident
> Howard Nafzger who took advantage of
> the sportbs broad opportunities to be creative
> and later sold the car.
> b
I was very surprised, humbled, and
> proud,b
 he said, b
Horsepower is easier to
> come by than slippery cars. Generally
> speaking, once the aerodynamic drag
> exceeds the available traction, adding
> more horsepower will not make you go
> much faster. How did Charles hook up so
> much horsepower with two-wheel drive?

From rbuck at xmission.com  Thu Jan  6 23:25:28 2011
From: rbuck at xmission.com (Ray Buck)
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2011 23:25:28 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Photographs
In-Reply-To: <4D264987.3080809@mayfco.com>
References: <4D264987.3080809@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <4D26B1D8.2090002@xmission.com>

Mayf, I just posted over 400 photos from SW 2010 here:
http://www.chevyasylum.com/lsr/bsf2010/sw/Welcome.html

There are lots of starting line/crowd fotos....way more than I wanted.  
Well, there were way more people around the starting line than I would 
have liked...but nobody asked for my vote.  :)

Anyway there are tons of LSR photos there...you're welcome to snag any 
off the site...although I sell the originals and/or prints.  But I'm 
cheap and easy, just like my ex-wife.  :)

RtR


On 1/6/2011 4:00 PM, Larry Mayfield wrote:
> Folks, iffn you remember a while back, my computer ate itself. One of 
> the things I lost were photos. I need to find a few aerial shots of 
> the salt with a meet going on that shows the expanse of the place 
> and   the crowds around the starting lines.  If anyone has a photo or 
> two that I might use, with attribution of course, I would appreciate 
> you sending them to me.
>
> drmayf at mayfco.com      or        larry.mayfield at mayfco.com
>
> would get them to me.
>
> I appreciate it..
>
> mayf

From saltfever at comcast.net  Fri Jan  7 02:05:04 2011
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 01:05:04 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg  II
In-Reply-To: <mailman.4148.1294381337.23296.land-speed@autox.team.net>
Message-ID: <4E16ED65BD9B4EEBAF7194F0EFDCC61B@dim8100>

Traction Control  in Formula 1  was banned in 1994. However, creative
"engine management" made it practically unenforceable and the ban was
subsequently rescinded. Finally, in 2008 Traction Control was banned
permanently because the FIM created a universal interface to all engine
management systems and they now can log and view what is going on.  -Kirk

From: Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net>
(Snip). . . Those who think traction control will  slow you down, should
examine the subject in F-1. You won't find anything on a 20  million dollar
F-1 car that doesn't make it go faster and they all have traction  control.

From sparky.2211 at cox.net  Fri Jan  7 07:47:44 2011
From: sparky.2211 at cox.net (sparky.2211 at cox.net)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 9:47:44 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Nearburg-Summers-FIA " 2  ll"
Message-ID: <20110107094744.ZFNJT.720581.imail@fed1rmwml39>

the FIA record they were after was the UNBLOWN- UNLIMITED record---FIA cares not what fuel you run---just size and NA or not.

From RickByrnes at Comcast.net  Fri Jan  7 08:48:05 2011
From: RickByrnes at Comcast.net (Rick Byrnes)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 10:48:05 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
References: <1732463837.828769.1294362167652.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <354F6AA1CA58486CB2217840A7D6DC82@Rick>

quote
-Weight, balance, aero,frontal area,controlability,traction coefficientB and
horsepower. Jack



Not necessarily in that order though.
It certainly is a balancing act.

From NT788 at comcast.net  Fri Jan  7 09:49:06 2011
From: NT788 at comcast.net (NT788 at comcast.net)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 16:49:06 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg  II
In-Reply-To: <4E16ED65BD9B4EEBAF7194F0EFDCC61B@dim8100>
Message-ID: <1266312678.856544.1294418946830.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

ItB could improve your lap times, notB speed!B Jack

Traction Control B in Formula 1 B was banned in 1994. However, creative
"engine management" made it practically unenforceable and the ban was
subsequently rescinded. Finally, in 2008 Traction Control was banned
permanently because the FIM created a universal interface to all engine
management systems and they now can log and view what is going on. B -Kirk

From: Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net>
(Snip). . . Those who think traction control will B slow you down, should
examine the subject in F-1. You won't find anything on a 20 B million dollar
F-1 car that doesn't make it go faster and they all have traction B control.
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/nt788 at comcast.net

From NT788 at comcast.net  Fri Jan  7 09:55:02 2011
From: NT788 at comcast.net (NT788 at comcast.net)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 16:55:02 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Land-speed] Fuel for Thought By Land Speed Louise Ann Noeth.
In-Reply-To: <5DAC69EFEC0D4D14BB3C73C741FFF181@DaveSatellite>
Message-ID: <1339632569.856859.1294419302791.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

BNI 5miB  FIA unlimited

jack

I might be wrong and usually am but didnt Teague Nolen White and Burkland go
faster? Is this a class record or the ultimate record? They really need a
record for the ultimate I don't care how you got it done to separate all
this stuf.
dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bryan Savage" <b.a.savage at wildblue.net>
To: "List Land Speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Friday, January 07, 2011 12:24 AM
Subject: [Land-speed] Fuel for Thought By Land Speed Louise Ann Noeth.


> From:
> Fuel for Thought By Land Speed Louise Ann Noeth.
>
> The most historically significant
> Bonneville Salt Flats news this year came
> when world record holder Bill Summers
> of Goldenrod fame answered a phone call
> from Texan Charles Nearburg in late
> September; he was calling minutes after
> breaking the Summers Brothers decades old
> record averaging 414 MPH driving
> his bSpirit of Rettb streamliner.
> bItbs about time,b quipped Bill Summers
> to Nearburg, bWe held that record a
> long time b 44 years, 10 months and 12
> days. That you went that fast with only
> one naturally aspirated engine driving
> only through two wheels, is a phenomenal
> achievement.
> Nearburg does not rely on traction
> control; he prefers to drive on feel, bI
> canbt flat foot it until 300 MPH and can
> also spin the tires at will. bI drive to find
> traction from the moment we push off
> the starting line. We have enough down
> force and drag, a combination of factors
> working together to exceed 400 MPH.b
> The Spirit of Rett was built over a
> six year time period by Arizona resident
> Howard Nafzger who took advantage of
> the sportbs broad opportunities to be creative
> and later sold the car.
> bI was very surprised, humbled, and
> proud,b he said, bHorsepower is easier to
> come by than slippery cars. Generally
> speaking, once the aerodynamic drag
> exceeds the available traction, adding
> more horsepower will not make you go
> much faster. How did Charles hook up so
> much horsepower with two-wheel drive?
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/nt788 at comcast.net

From saltracer.bryant at gmail.com  Fri Jan  7 10:52:39 2011
From: saltracer.bryant at gmail.com (Tom Bryant)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 09:52:39 -0800 (Pacific Standard Time)
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
References: <1732463837.828769.1294362167652.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
	<615C718BF13E47C9BC548B76D6BD622D@DaveSatellite>
Message-ID: <4D2752E7.000013.00272@TOMSCOMPUTER>

Good discussion...In my case, I found that aero is paramount and having
little HP makes it easier to drive. Our car didn't go 400, but it was well
planted @ near 250 mph. We all drove with the pedal to the metal. Building
cars with too much HP just makes them more difficult to control. We carried
NOX that could have given in excess of 500 HP more, but never got to use it.
I didn't want to apply it until the car was giving me the assurance it was
performing correctly as was. I did monitor downforce/lift at both ends of
the car. It had too much down force on the front which was costing speed, I
suspect. The rear still had downforce at 245 mph. To go the speeds that we
went with the HP (dynoed @ 665 hp - speed 245 mph on gasoline) meant the car
was slippery, aero was good. Our misfortune was wind changing issues.

Tom

[demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of faint_grain.jpg]

[demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/gif which had a name of snowy_letters_final_en.gif]

From dahlgren536 at comcast.net  Fri Jan  7 12:14:06 2011
From: dahlgren536 at comcast.net (Dave Dahlgren)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 14:14:06 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg  II
In-Reply-To: <1266312678.856544.1294418946830.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <1266312678.856544.1294418946830.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <66018CB17DF44DD2BA624573E4FFF94F@DaveSatellite>

You have got it Jack at speed an F1 car has enough down force that spinning 
a tire might be very hard to do but a slow corner a different problem.
Dave
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <NT788 at comcast.net>
To: "Kirkwood" <saltfever at comcast.net>
Cc: <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Friday, January 07, 2011 11:49 AM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg II


> ItB could improve your lap times, notB speed!B Jack
>
> Traction Control B in Formula 1 B was banned in 1994. However, creative
> "engine management" made it practically unenforceable and the ban was
> subsequently rescinded. Finally, in 2008 Traction Control was banned
> permanently because the FIM created a universal interface to all engine
> management systems and they now can log and view what is going on. B -Kirk
>
> From: Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net>
> (Snip). . . Those who think traction control will B slow you down, should
> examine the subject in F-1. You won't find anything on a 20 B million 
> dollar
> F-1 car that doesn't make it go faster and they all have traction B 
> control.

From b.a.savage at wildblue.net  Fri Jan  7 15:44:03 2011
From: b.a.savage at wildblue.net (Bryan Savage)
Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2011 14:44:03 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <0BB68A011EF0447B9B6FBC4934BA201E@DaveSatellite>
References: <0BB68A011EF0447B9B6FBC4934BA201E@DaveSatellite>
Message-ID: <4D279733.5090404@wildblue.net>

I've always looked at Bonneville as a 5 mile sprint race.

Bryan

Dave Dahlgren wrote:
> Whatever you can do between the 2 and 2 1/4 will always add at the 5 
> sort of a given. If 300 is very good then 325 is better unless it is 
> done with gearing that peaks at the 3 then it is a long drone for the 
> next 2 miles. It is always balance to make best use of the distance 
> available.
> Dave
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Skip Higginbotham" 
> <saltrat at pahrump.com>
> To: "Dave Dahlgren" <dahlgren536 at comcast.net>; <NT788 at comcast.net>
> Cc: "List Land Speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>; "sparky 2211" 
> <sparky.2211 at cox.net>
> Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 11:36 PM
> Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
>
>
>> Any time one can run  300 in the 1/4. The downstream speed will be 
>> good. That has to figure into the equation.
>>
>> Skip
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/b.a.savage at wildblue.net

From b.a.savage at wildblue.net  Fri Jan  7 16:56:30 2011
From: b.a.savage at wildblue.net (Bryan Savage)
Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2011 15:56:30 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg  II
In-Reply-To: <4E16ED65BD9B4EEBAF7194F0EFDCC61B@dim8100>
References: <4E16ED65BD9B4EEBAF7194F0EFDCC61B@dim8100>
Message-ID: <4D27A82E.8070801@wildblue.net>

Thank you Kirk.

As I understand it, they banned it too slow the cars down.  Bryan

Bryan


Kirkwood wrote:
> Traction Control  in Formula 1  was banned in 1994. However, creative
> "engine management" made it practically unenforceable and the ban was
> subsequently rescinded. Finally, in 2008 Traction Control was banned
> permanently because the FIM created a universal interface to all engine
> management systems and they now can log and view what is going on.  -Kirk
>
> From: Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net>
> (Snip). . . Those who think traction control will  slow you down, should
> examine the subject in F-1. You won't find anything on a 20  million dollar
> F-1 car that doesn't make it go faster and they all have traction  control.
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/b.a.savage at wildblue.net

From saltfever at comcast.net  Fri Jan  7 17:26:36 2011
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 16:26:36 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg  II
In-Reply-To: <4D27A82E.8070801@wildblue.net>
Message-ID: <36599C2ED0AE47A28FA95B2085CA3F80@dim8100>

As reported in almost all publications, they wanted to get the driver back
into the equation and not a race among automated, robotic machines. A
mistake-free race is not exciting for the fans.  -Kirk.

-----Original Message-----
From: Bryan Savage Jr. 

Thank you Kirk.


As I understand it, they banned it too slow the cars down.  Bryan

From adin at frontier.net  Fri Jan  7 21:14:19 2011
From: adin at frontier.net (David in Durango)
Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 21:14:19 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg  II
References: <36599C2ED0AE47A28FA95B2085CA3F80@dim8100>
Message-ID: <747D7F28A9F44DE794E21C071E10D477@ZTxp>

Pretty much true.  ABS, traction control, programable semi auto trans - not 
much left for the drivers to do.

Better now, but not much.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Kirkwood" <saltfever at comcast.net>
To: "'Bryan Savage'" <b.a.savage at wildblue.net>
Cc: <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Friday, January 07, 2011 5:26 PM
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg II


> As reported in almost all publications, they wanted to get the driver back
> into the equation and not a race among automated, robotic machines. A
> mistake-free race is not exciting for the fans.  -Kirk.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bryan Savage Jr.
>
> Thank you Kirk.
>
>
> As I understand it, they banned it too slow the cars down.  Bryan
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/adin at frontier.net
>
> __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus 
> signature database 5768 (20110107) __________
>
> The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.
>
> http://www.eset.com
>
>
> 


__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature database 5768 (20110107) __________

The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.

http://www.eset.com

From NT788 at comcast.net  Sat Jan  8 13:25:50 2011
From: NT788 at comcast.net (NT788 at comcast.net)
Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2011 20:25:50 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg  II
In-Reply-To: <1444353302.907135.1294517667497.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <1048490691.907470.1294518350232.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

Races are won by whoever has the less average lap time,and gets there
first,B not the highest speed at the end of the straightaway.That's what is
needed at a speed trails (lsr),B whichB is not racing!

B A 100% tire couple can help elapsed time, better than it will help top
speed!( where it is impossible to achieve.) To spend time trying to design a
100% couple in my opinion is counter productive. Unless you lie and say you
have done it!

Jack




As reported in almost all publications, they wanted to get the driver back
into the equation and not a race among automated, robotic machines. A
mistake-free race is not exciting for the fans. B -Kirk.

-----Original Message-----
From: Bryan Savage Jr.

Thank you Kirk.


As I understand it, they banned it too slow the cars down. B Bryan
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/nt788 at comcast.net

From NT788 at comcast.net  Sat Jan  8 13:35:32 2011
From: NT788 at comcast.net (NT788 at comcast.net)
Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2011 20:35:32 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
In-Reply-To: <4D279733.5090404@wildblue.net>
Message-ID: <788559564.907762.1294518932470.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

I've always looked at lsr as place that gives you a long run up to attain the
highest speed, in however much time as it takes! Its not a race! Thats why
slicks arn't popular.

Jack

I've always looked at Bonneville as a 5 mile sprint race.

Bryan

Dave Dahlgren wrote:
> Whatever you can do between the 2 and 2 1/4 will always add at the 5
> sort of a given. If 300 is very good then 325 is better unless it is
> done with gearing that peaks at the 3 then it is a long drone for the
> next 2 miles. It is always balance to make best use of the distance
> available.
> Dave
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Skip Higginbotham"
> <saltrat at pahrump.com>
> To: "Dave Dahlgren" <dahlgren536 at comcast.net>; <NT788 at comcast.net>
> Cc: "List Land Speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>; "sparky 2211"
> <sparky.2211 at cox.net>
> Sent: Thursday, January 06, 2011 11:36 PM
> Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg
>
>
>> Any time one can run B 300 in the 1/4. The downstream speed will be
>> good. That has to figure into the equation.
>>
>> Skip
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/b.a.savage at wildblue.net
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/nt788 at comcast.net

From NT788 at comcast.net  Sun Jan  9 01:03:06 2011
From: NT788 at comcast.net (NT788 at comcast.net)
Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2011 08:03:06 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg  II
In-Reply-To: <829899303.922297.1294559872124.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <979790703.922342.1294560186208.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

List

Please forgive the last sentence about the lie.It wasB clumsy and doesn't
express whatB I meant!
jack




Races are won by whoever has the less average lap time,and gets there
first, not the highest speed at the end of the straightaway.That's what is
needed at a speed trails (lsr), which is not racing!

B A 100% tire couple can help elapsed time, better than it will help top
speed, ( where it is impossible to achieve.) To spend time trying to design a
100% couple in my opinion is counter productive.

Jack




As reported in almost all publications, they wanted to get the driver back
into the equation and not a race among automated, robotic machines. A
mistake-free race is not exciting for the fans. B -Kirk.

-----Original Message-----
From: Bryan Savage Jr.

Thank you Kirk.


As I understand it, they banned it too slow the cars down. B Bryan
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/nt788 at comcast.net
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/nt788 at comcast.net

From b.a.savage at wildblue.net  Sun Jan  9 13:45:39 2011
From: b.a.savage at wildblue.net (Bryan Savage)
Date: Sun, 09 Jan 2011 12:45:39 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] NON LSR
Message-ID: <4D2A1E73.4080108@wildblue.net>

Here's something to forget....

If you ever want to drive on a super high traction road, go to
Scotty's Castle in Death Valley.
I asked the ranger about the strange looking blacktop on the
road to Scotty's and he said that when they paved the road they
brought in tar and made the asphalt at the site. There wasn't any
suitable gravel so they used the lava/cinders from the volcanic
cones in that area. He said it had shown almost no viable wear
since it was paved in the '30's. Early in the morning it had a bit
of a sparkle to because it was a sandy glass stuff. I played around
with my VW. Almost couldn't lock up the wheels with the brakes
and could not get the back end to break loose. I got the inside rear
light enough to spin the rear wheel and scare myself but not a trace
of  a slide.
An interesting experience.

Bryan

From saltfevr at q.com  Sun Jan  9 16:27:12 2011
From: saltfevr at q.com (Tom Shannon)
Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2011 16:27:12 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] St George, UT airstrip For Sale
Message-ID: <SNT126-W358BEECB22F71DF87E8411C90D0@phx.gbl>

All right all:

This is right in your backyard Glen! Start the fundraising... Mebbe, grab some
timing clocks, the Pahrump,Vegas,, & Arizona Bunch and test some LSR vehicles
before the New Strip opens this Week! Asking price seems a little steep. Glen,
start the schmoozing!!

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/50998006-78/airport-anderson-george-million
.html.csp

Tom Shannon
Magna, Utah

From rjdenton479 at gmail.com  Sun Jan  9 16:57:41 2011
From: rjdenton479 at gmail.com (Robert J. Denton)
Date: Sun, 9 Jan 2011 18:57:41 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] NON LSR
In-Reply-To: <4D2A1E73.4080108@wildblue.net>
References: <4D2A1E73.4080108@wildblue.net>
Message-ID: <AANLkTinyvZkGJk9W7s=4Oxd8ffzfD=i3yyKHwr0FePdQ@mail.gmail.com>

In Germany they have added ground up old tires with a very similar effect.

I would hazard to guess that even though the road to Scotty's was old, it
still doesn't get that much traffic wear.

Bbob Denton

On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 3:45 PM, Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net>wrote:

> Here's something to forget....
>
> If you ever want to drive on a super high traction road, go to
> Scotty's Castle in Death Valley.
> I asked the ranger about the strange looking blacktop on the
> road to Scotty's and he said that when they paved the road they
> brought in tar and made the asphalt at the site. There wasn't any
> suitable gravel so they used the lava/cinders from the volcanic
> cones in that area. He said it had shown almost no viable wear
> since it was paved in the '30's. Early in the morning it had a bit
> of a sparkle to because it was a sandy glass stuff. I played around
> with my VW. Almost couldn't lock up the wheels with the brakes
> and could not get the back end to break loose. I got the inside rear
> light enough to spin the rear wheel and scare myself but not a trace
> of  a slide.
> An interesting experience.
>
> Bryan

From ed at vetteracing.com  Sun Jan  9 21:31:53 2011
From: ed at vetteracing.com (Ed Van Scoy)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 04:31:53 +0000
Subject: [Land-speed] NON LSR
Message-ID: <W338021413993831294633913@webmail23>

The road doesn't get that much traffic, but it is subjected to 120+ temps in
the summer and freezing weather and snow in the winter.....
Ed
-----Original Message-----
From: Robert J. Denton [mailto:rjdenton479 at gmail.com]
Sent: Sunday, January 9, 2011 04:57 PM
To: 'Bryan Savage'
Cc: 'List Land Speed'
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] NON LSR

In Germany they have added ground up old tires with a very similar effect. I
would hazard to guess that even though the road to Scotty's was old, it still
doesn't get that much traffic wear. Bbob Denton On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 3:45
PM, Bryan Savage wrote: > Here's something to forget.... > > If you ever want
to drive on a super high traction road, go to > Scotty's Castle in Death
Valley. > I asked the ranger about the strange looking blacktop on the > road
to Scotty's and he said that when they paved the road they > brought in tar
and made the asphalt at the site. There wasn't any > suitable gravel so they
used the lava/cinders from the volcanic > cones in that area. He said it had
shown almost no viable wear > since it was paved in the '30's. Early in the
morning it had a bit > of a sparkle to because it was a sandy glass stuff. I
played around > with my VW. Almost couldn't lock up the wheels with the brakes
> and could not get the back end to break loose. I got the inside rear > light
enough to spin the rear wheel and scare myself but not a trace > of a slide. >
An interesting experience. > > Bryan
_______________________________________________ Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/ed at vetteracing.com

From sparky.2211 at cox.net  Mon Jan 10 08:14:51 2011
From: sparky.2211 at cox.net (sparky.2211 at cox.net)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 10:14:51 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] NON LSR
In-Reply-To: <AANLkTinyvZkGJk9W7s=4Oxd8ffzfD=i3yyKHwr0FePdQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20110110101451.L0DH0.753039.imail@fed1rmwml39>

in Phoenix we have several freeways with asphalt containg ground up tires---rubber to rubber is much quiter than "surfaced" concrete--
---- "Robert J. Denton" <rjdenton479 at gmail.com> wrote: 
> In Germany they have added ground up old tires with a very similar effect.
> 
> I would hazard to guess that even though the road to Scotty's was old, it
> still doesn't get that much traffic wear.
> 
> Bbob Denton
> 
> On Sun, Jan 9, 2011 at 3:45 PM, Bryan Savage <b.a.savage at wildblue.net>wrote:
> 
> > Here's something to forget....

From dahlgren536 at comcast.net  Mon Jan 10 15:30:01 2011
From: dahlgren536 at comcast.net (Dave Dahlgren)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 17:30:01 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg  II
In-Reply-To: <979790703.922342.1294560186208.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
References: <979790703.922342.1294560186208.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <B847D07304B74A36BCAA4FDB5F053964@DaveSatellite>

Jack I think I understand what you are saying. In my work with sporty type 
cars we really don't care about terminal speed but the best average speed. 
So if more downforce costs 5 mph terminal but cuts.3 secords off a lap time 
a real win. That is the venue traction control works well low speed no 
downforce with lots of torque in the lower gears. Best terminal speed for me 
has always had 5 or 6% slip a little bit of slip and tread deformation is 
good for bite. Dave
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <NT788 at comcast.net>
To: <NT788 at comcast.net>
Cc: <land-speed at autox.team.net>; "Kirkwood" <saltfever at comcast.net>
Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2011 3:03 AM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg II


> List
>
> Please forgive the last sentence about the lie.It wasB clumsy and doesn't
> express whatB I meant!
> jack
>
>
>
>
> Races are won by whoever has the less average lap time,and gets there
> first, not the highest speed at the end of the straightaway.That's what is
> needed at a speed trails (lsr), which is not racing!
>
> B A 100% tire couple can help elapsed time, better than it will help top
> speed, ( where it is impossible to achieve.) To spend time trying to 
> design a
> 100% couple in my opinion is counter productive.
>
> Jack
>
>
>
>
> As reported in almost all publications, they wanted to get the driver back
> into the equation and not a race among automated, robotic machines. A
> mistake-free race is not exciting for the fans. B -Kirk.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bryan Savage Jr.
>
> Thank you Kirk.

From saltfever at comcast.net  Mon Jan 10 15:30:29 2011
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 14:30:29 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] St George, UT airstrip For Sale
In-Reply-To: <mailman.13.1294686002.23319.land-speed@autox.team.net>
Message-ID: <BE7054FEFDC04BAA9838354D64EB0C04@dim8100>

Only 6,600 ft long. The 1/4 would be a bit shorter than what we are used to
! LOL

Original from: Tom Shannon <saltfevr at q.com>
(snip . .  .) Mebbe, grab some timing clocks, the Pahrump,Vegas,, & Arizona
Bunch and test some LSR vehicles before the New Strip opens this Week!  . .
. Tom Shannon

From wester6935 at comcast.net  Mon Jan 10 18:08:16 2011
From: wester6935 at comcast.net (Wester Potter)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 18:08:16 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] St George, UT airstrip For Sale
In-Reply-To: <BE7054FEFDC04BAA9838354D64EB0C04@dim8100>
References: <BE7054FEFDC04BAA9838354D64EB0C04@dim8100>
Message-ID: <E8276083-47E7-409A-86EE-3FA3E1F9B94B@comcast.net>

It's on top af a mesa with a LONG drop at one end of the runway.
Top fuelers only run 1,000 feet now.
It has been for sale for several years.  One serious buyer backed out when the
money crunch hit.
Glen is on the other side of some hills, has his place nicely landscaped and
is settled.  No way would he move.


On Jan 10, 2011, at 3:30 PM, Kirkwood wrote:

> Only 6,600 ft long. The 1/4 would be a bit shorter than what we are used to
> ! LOL
>
> Original from: Tom Shannon <saltfevr at q.com>
> (snip . .  .) Mebbe, grab some timing clocks, the Pahrump,Vegas,, & Arizona
> Bunch and test some LSR vehicles before the New Strip opens this Week!  . .
> . Tom Shannon
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/wester6935 at comcast.net

From saltfever at comcast.net  Mon Jan 10 18:17:27 2011
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 17:17:27 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] St George, UT airstrip For Sale
In-Reply-To: <E8276083-47E7-409A-86EE-3FA3E1F9B94B@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <213FE3ECEAE5416AB09E2ECEFCD64B9E@dim8100>

Wasn't talking about the drags. It was the LSR ''1/4''. Is there any other
venue worth discussing? LOL

-----Original Message-----
From: Wester Potter 
(Snip . . . ) Top fuelers only run 1,000 feet now. 

From NT788 at comcast.net  Mon Jan 10 23:18:37 2011
From: NT788 at comcast.net (NT788 at comcast.net)
Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2011 06:18:37 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg  II
In-Reply-To: <B847D07304B74A36BCAA4FDB5F053964@DaveSatellite>
Message-ID: <1288422931.1014397.1294726717796.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

Dave

I like your last sentence! I would add intermittent contact for high speed
lsr.B 

Which would shoot an arrow the farthest, a compound or a single draw bow, with
the same guy pulling the string? Its my way of understanding torque and
horsepower. I think the single draw=rear wheel HP

Jack






Jack I think I understand what you are saying. In my work with sporty type
cars we really don't care about terminal speed but the best average speed.
So if more downforce costs 5 mph terminal but cuts.3 secords off a lap time
a real win. That is the venue traction control works well low speed no
downforce with lots of torque in the lower gears. Best terminal speed for me
has always had 5 or 6% slip a little bit of slip and tread deformation is
good for bite. Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: <NT788 at comcast.net>
To: <NT788 at comcast.net>
Cc: <land-speed at autox.team.net>; "Kirkwood" <saltfever at comcast.net>
Sent: Sunday, January 09, 2011 3:03 AM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Charles Nearburg II


> List
>
> Please forgive the last sentence about the lie.It wasB clumsy and doesn't
> express whatB I meant!
> jack
>
>
>
>
> Races are won by whoever has the less average lap time,and gets there
> first, not the highest speed at the end of the straightaway.That's what is
> needed at a speed trails (lsr), which is not racing!
>
> B A 100% tire couple can help elapsed time, better than it will help top
> speed, ( where it is impossible to achieve.) To spend time trying to
> design a
> 100% couple in my opinion is counter productive.
>
> Jack
>
>
>
>
> As reported in almost all publications, they wanted to get the driver back
> into the equation and not a race among automated, robotic machines. A
> mistake-free race is not exciting for the fans. B -Kirk.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bryan Savage Jr.
>
> Thank you Kirk.
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/nt788 at comcast.net

From jonwennerberg at nancyandjon.org  Wed Jan 12 13:31:22 2011
From: jonwennerberg at nancyandjon.org (Jon Wennerberg)
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 15:31:22 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Shootout 2011
References: <DB557DDC-6D69-4944-905F-1C6A76E65552@yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <B3CA75C6-CAC3-43F3-B0DC-21F43D00EB5B@nancyandjon.org>

I got this news today from Mike Cook Jr. - about the Top Speed Shootout 2011.


>
>
> The dates for the shootout will be September 19-23.  As of today we have
Speed demon, Speed by Spectere, Terry Nish, Mike Charlton's jet bike, and the
new dry lakes hall of fame member Mike Akatiff.  There are more on the hook,
just not confirmed yet.
>
> Mike Cook Jr.
>

Jon a/k/a Seldom Seen Slim

From wester6935 at comcast.net  Wed Jan 12 07:14:17 2011
From: wester6935 at comcast.net (Wester Potter)
Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2011 07:14:17 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Fwd: Oldest jazz club closing?  Non LSR
References: <A88063E182ED43428E060B929FD9D248@mediacenter>
Message-ID: <FDF1F370-4A22-4488-9F0D-5A2DCA9A868B@comcast.net>

Begin forwarded message:

> 
> 
> Baker's Keyboard Lounge in Detroit is shutting down.
> They claim to be the oldest jazz club around.
> Does anyone know if this claim is valid?
> Here's the story:
>  
> http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2011/01/post_43.html
>  
>  Wester Potter

From gmc6power at earthlink.net  Fri Jan 14 13:35:41 2011
From: gmc6power at earthlink.net (James Tone)
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2011 12:35:41 -0800 (GMT-08:00)
Subject: [Land-speed] PRI Show
Message-ID: <17364977.1295037341903.JavaMail.root@elwamui-huard.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Something for the "little" guy in LSR coverage. Check out the Burns Stainless booth at the PRI Show on their facebook page........Now I just need the banner...JD

[demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/bmp which had a name of Burns- PRI picture.bmp]

From gmc6power at earthlink.net  Fri Jan 14 23:24:07 2011
From: gmc6power at earthlink.net (J.D. Tone)
Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2011 22:24:07 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] PRI Show
References: <17364977.1295037341903.JavaMail.root@elwamui-huard.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <7B128580A7394335B0E9E26A11317749@mydf7618c59bbf>

I think I may have attached it
Subject: [Land-speed] PRI Show


> Something for the "little" guy in LSR coverage. Check out the Burns 
> Stainless booth at the PRI Show on their facebook page........Now I just 
> need the banner...JD
>
> [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/bmp which had a name of 
> Burns- PRI picture.bmp]

[demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of PRI 2010.jpg]

From b.a.savage at wildblue.net  Mon Jan 17 19:13:29 2011
From: b.a.savage at wildblue.net (Bryan Savage)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 18:13:29 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Ford Flathead
In-Reply-To: <886146.26223.qm@web51006.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <886146.26223.qm@web51006.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4D34F749.2080507@wildblue.net>

Maybe I'm missing something but it says to me that the engine was 
originally made
to be installed in a PRODUCTION CAR.
Not an airplane or a bulldozer or a boat or a tank or etc.

Maybe I'm stupid but it seems to be very simple English to me.
I admit I only got a "C" in High School English. Maybe that's my problem.

Cheers to all,
Bryan

Rich Fox wrote:
> For Jack and others who favor blanket amnesty for migrant flatheads I have
> devised a short test. You only have to read one short sentence. But you do
> have to read it. No skimming. Try to concentrate. I will type it in all
> capitals to make it easy........XF CLASS CONSISTS OF ANY PRODUCTION
> FORD/MERCURY PASSENGER CAR V-8 FLATHEAD ENGINE......That's it. Go back and
> read it again if you think you need to. Now the test. If you saw or
> understood....FRENCH ARMY TRUCKS...anywhere in that sentence you may have a
> condition that should be studied. 
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/b.a.savage at wildblue.net

From drmayf at mayfco.com  Mon Jan 17 19:59:13 2011
From: drmayf at mayfco.com (Larry Mayfield)
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 18:59:13 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Ford Flathead
In-Reply-To: <4D34F749.2080507@wildblue.net>
References: <886146.26223.qm@web51006.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
	<4D34F749.2080507@wildblue.net>
Message-ID: <4D350201.2040308@mayfco.com>

Hmmm, some how I missed the front end of this annual discussion.  I was 
part of it once just for fun. Well, here I am again... Closer 
examination of the all cap sentence leads me to ask a series of 
questions.  The first is does it really mean Ford/Mercury *_passenger 
cars_*? Would that eliminate any flathead that was originally installed 
in say, a panel truck? Or a pickup? How about a heavier truck? Or 
ambulance?  How would the original pedigree be determined for a v8 motor 
installed in a non passenger car but still a FOMOCO product? Say a 
harvester of some sort?   Or boat? Is there a list of casting numbers 
that delineate the use of the motor?

As to the amnesty, isn't that what amnesty does? Goes around the rules 
to permit an obvious practice to be essentially pardoned?  I know the 
French castings are a better design that the oldies so there is that to 
be considered.  Say, if one was found during a post record run, would it 
be confiscated and destroyed?  What is the punishment for violating the 
rules? Banishment from the salt or dirt?

No, I am not planning on a flathead. Just an interesting thread that 
seems to crop up every year.

mayf

On 1/17/2011 6:13 PM, Bryan Savage wrote:
> Maybe I'm missing something but it says to me that the engine was
> originally made
> to be installed in a PRODUCTION CAR.
> Not an airplane or a bulldozer or a boat or a tank or etc.
>
> Maybe I'm stupid but it seems to be very simple English to me.
> I admit I only got a "C" in High School English. Maybe that's my problem.
>
> Cheers to all,
> Bryan
>
> Rich Fox wrote:
>> For Jack and others who favor blanket amnesty for migrant flatheads I have
>> devised a short test. You only have to read one short sentence. But you do
>> have to read it. No skimming. Try to concentrate. I will type it in all
>> capitals to make it easy........XF CLASS CONSISTS OF ANY PRODUCTION
>> FORD/MERCURY PASSENGER CAR V-8 FLATHEAD ENGINE......That's it. Go back and
>> read it again if you think you need to. Now the test. If you saw or
>> understood....FRENCH ARMY TRUCKS...anywhere in that sentence you may have a
>> condition that should be studied.
>> _______________________________________________
>> Land-speed at autox.team.net
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
>> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/b.a.savage at wildblue.net
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/drmayf at mayfco.com

From dahlgren536 at comcast.net  Tue Jan 18 06:46:00 2011
From: dahlgren536 at comcast.net (Dave Dahlgren)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 08:46:00 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Ford Flathead
In-Reply-To: <4D350201.2040308@mayfco.com>
References: <886146.26223.qm@web51006.mail.re2.yahoo.com><4D34F749.2080507@wildblue.net>
	<4D350201.2040308@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <AEDBAE2DEDAC43DDBF425274AB1D9834@DaveSatellite>

Personally I think many of the rules have left the entire spirit of Hot 
Rodding in general. The reason i make that statement is they used what was 
readily avialable no matter where it came from. It is odd the flathead rule 
is for cars yet the 6 cyl ohv guys can use an engine out of a truck.
Dave
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Larry Mayfield" <drmayf at mayfco.com>
To: <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Monday, January 17, 2011 9:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Ford Flathead


> Hmmm, some how I missed the front end of this annual discussion.  I was
> part of it once just for fun. Well, here I am again... Closer
> examination of the all cap sentence leads me to ask a series of
> questions.  The first is does it really mean Ford/Mercury *_passenger
> cars_*? Would that eliminate any flathead that was originally installed
> in say, a panel truck? Or a pickup? How about a heavier truck? Or
> ambulance?  How would the original pedigree be determined for a v8 motor
> installed in a non passenger car but still a FOMOCO product? Say a
> harvester of some sort?   Or boat? Is there a list of casting numbers
> that delineate the use of the motor?
>
> As to the amnesty, isn't that what amnesty does? Goes around the rules
> to permit an obvious practice to be essentially pardoned?  I know the
> French castings are a better design that the oldies so there is that to
> be considered.  Say, if one was found during a post record run, would it
> be confiscated and destroyed?  What is the punishment for violating the
> rules? Banishment from the salt or dirt?
>
> No, I am not planning on a flathead. Just an interesting thread that
> seems to crop up every year.
>
> mayf
>
> On 1/17/2011 6:13 PM, Bryan Savage wrote:
>> Maybe I'm missing something but it says to me that the engine was
>> originally made
>> to be installed in a PRODUCTION CAR.
>> Not an airplane or a bulldozer or a boat or a tank or etc.
>>
>> Maybe I'm stupid but it seems to be very simple English to me.
>> I admit I only got a "C" in High School English. Maybe that's my problem.
>>
>> Cheers to all,
>> Bryan
>>
>> Rich Fox wrote:
>>> For Jack and others who favor blanket amnesty for migrant flatheads I 
>>> have
>>> devised a short test. You only have to read one short sentence. But you 
>>> do
>>> have to read it. No skimming. Try to concentrate. I will type it in all
>>> capitals to make it easy........XF CLASS CONSISTS OF ANY PRODUCTION
>>> FORD/MERCURY PASSENGER CAR V-8 FLATHEAD ENGINE......That's it. Go back 
>>> and
>>> read it again if you think you need to. Now the test. If you saw or
>>> understood....FRENCH ARMY TRUCKS...anywhere in that sentence you may 
>>> have a
>>> condition that should be studied.

From dahlgren536 at comcast.net  Tue Jan 18 07:10:07 2011
From: dahlgren536 at comcast.net (Dave Dahlgren)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 09:10:07 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Ford Flathead
In-Reply-To: <31902.51175.qm@web39408.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <31902.51175.qm@web39408.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <032D01BF4D0C468ABF3AFBECA10D86A8@DaveSatellite>

Maybe I don't understand the rule I assume there is a place to run a Caddy
flathead should you want to though I don't persoonally.
Dave


        In real life if you have a standard size Ford Flathead, no one will
question weathr it came from a truck or car. The rule is aimed only at Lincoln
based flatheads. Just as Cad and all other flatheads are disallowed.

        ........XF CLASS CONSISTS OF ANY PRODUCTION
        >>> FORD/MERCURY PASSENGER CAR V-8 FLATHEAD ENGINE......That's it. Go
back and
        >>> read it again if you think you need to. Now the test. If you saw
or
        >>> understood....FRENCH ARMY TRUCKS...anywhere in that sentence you
may have a
        >>> condition that should be studied.

From dwarner230 at yahoo.com  Tue Jan 18 07:37:34 2011
From: dwarner230 at yahoo.com (dan warner)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 06:37:34 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Land-speed] Ford Flathead
In-Reply-To: <032D01BF4D0C468ABF3AFBECA10D86A8@DaveSatellite>
Message-ID: <489481.85569.qm@web114719.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

To answer Dave. The XF rule is the way it is because thats how the people who
run the class voted to word it.
 
Other flatheads are able to run in the XO classes, it is XO (X other), not XO
(overhead valve).
The flatheads get additional cubic inches over the truck engines. There is a
very sucessful Hudson 6 running in these classes.
 
DW
--- On Tue, 1/18/11, Dave Dahlgren <dahlgren536 at comcast.net> wrote:


From: Dave Dahlgren <dahlgren536 at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Ford Flathead
To: "Rich Fox" <v4gmr at yahoo.com>
Cc: "lsr list autox" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Date: Tuesday, January 18, 2011, 6:10 AM


Maybe I don't understand the rule I assume there is a place to run a Caddy
flathead should you want to though I don't persoonally.
Dave


        In real life if you have a standard size Ford Flathead, no one will
question weathr it came from a truck or car. The rule is aimed only at
Lincoln
based flatheads. Just as Cad and all other flatheads are disallowed.

        ........XF CLASS CONSISTS OF ANY PRODUCTION
        >>> FORD/MERCURY PASSENGER CAR V-8 FLATHEAD ENGINE......That's it. Go
back and
        >>> read it again if you think you need to. Now the test. If you saw
or
        >>> understood....FRENCH ARMY TRUCKS...anywhere in that sentence you
may have a
        >>> condition that should be studied.
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/dwarner230 at yahoo.com

From v4gmr at yahoo.com  Tue Jan 18 10:52:22 2011
From: v4gmr at yahoo.com (Rich Fox)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 09:52:22 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Land-speed] Ford Flathead
Message-ID: <474187.98979.qm@web39405.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Apparently there are at least three people who believe the Flathead Cad is the
answer. And plan to prove it in 2011. As the Cad is over 325 cid it will run
in XXO with the 375 cid limit. OHV engines otherwise legal for XO and between
325 and 375 cid will also run in XXO. XO legal OHV engines with specialty
heads (Wayne - Skinner) under 325 cid also run in XXO as well as OHV engines
that have had ports added by hard work in the backyard by Hot Rodders. I don't
know about Flathead inline engines with added ports. 

--- On Tue, 1/18/11, Dave Dahlgren <dahlgren536 at comcast.net> wrote:


From: Dave Dahlgren <dahlgren536 at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Ford Flathead
To: "Rich Fox" <v4gmr at yahoo.com>
Cc: "lsr list autox" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Date: Tuesday, January 18, 2011, 6:10 AM





Maybe I don't understand the rule I assume there is a place to run a Caddy
flathead should you want to though I don't persoonally.
Dave







In real life if you have a standard size Ford Flathead, no one will question
weathr it came from a truck or car. The rule is aimed only at Lincoln based
flatheads. Just as Cad and all other flatheads are disallowed.  
 
........XF CLASS CONSISTS OF ANY PRODUCTION
>>> FORD/MERCURY PASSENGER CAR V-8 FLATHEAD ENGINE......That's it. Go back
and
>>> read it again if you think you need to. Now the test. If you saw or
>>> understood....FRENCH ARMY TRUCKS...anywhere in that sentence you may have
a
>>> condition that should be studied.

From neil at dbelltech.com  Tue Jan 18 11:25:09 2011
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 11:25:09 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Inspection
Message-ID: <AB4271C7430644109D07C19E09C528D3@tiger>

List;

Here's a question that I've not seen before:

To have a car that is not quite finished run through tech inspection, is it
necessary to complete an entry form and pay an entry fee?

I hope to have my B/GMS finished by Speed Week but if it's not ready to run,
I'd like to put it through Tech to see if anything needs to be changed or
modified. An inspection would be helpful to see that any problems are
addressed before bringing it to race.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

From jdincau at qnet.com  Tue Jan 18 12:26:50 2011
From: jdincau at qnet.com (Jim Dincau)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 11:26:50 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Inspection
In-Reply-To: <AB4271C7430644109D07C19E09C528D3@tiger>
References: <AB4271C7430644109D07C19E09C528D3@tiger>
Message-ID: <223A7E3FF4D447099DF35B1A2D23C73E@denpc>

Niel,
     It has been done often. Show up, put the car in the tech line, tell the 
inspectors what you want to do.  At El Mirage no new cars are inspected on 
race day morning and it would be polite if you didn't take up time and space 
on the first two days at Speedweek.
Jim in Palmdale


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Neil Albaugh" <neil at dbelltech.com>
To: "landspeed at autox.team.net" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2011 10:25 AM
Subject: [Land-speed] Inspection


> List;
>
> Here's a question that I've not seen before:
>
> To have a car that is not quite finished run through tech inspection, is 
> it
> necessary to complete an entry form and pay an entry fee?
>
> I hope to have my B/GMS finished by Speed Week but if it's not ready to 
> run,
> I'd like to put it through Tech to see if anything needs to be changed or
> modified. An inspection would be helpful to see that any problems are
> addressed before bringing it to race.
>
> Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/jdincau at qnet.com 

From jolylance at earthlink.net  Tue Jan 18 13:41:25 2011
From: jolylance at earthlink.net (Joe & Lynne Lance)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 15:41:25 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Ford Flathead
In-Reply-To: <474187.98979.qm@web39405.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
References: <474187.98979.qm@web39405.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8235A7F72E3D4B819A39592B06C2B6EE@josephb4d4bd9f>

Why is the flathead Cad the "answer"?

If I remember the flathead Cad had the exhaust ports parallel to the intake
ports and exiting at the top of the block.  Is that an advantage compared to
the Ford flathead?

Lance

-----Original Message-----
From: land-speed-bounces at autox.team.net
[mailto:land-speed-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Rich Fox
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2011 12:52 PM
To: Dave Dahlgren
Cc: lsr list autox
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Ford Flathead

Apparently there are at least three people who believe the Flathead Cad is
the
answer. And plan to prove it in 2011. As the Cad is over 325 cid it will run
in XXO with the 375 cid limit. OHV engines otherwise legal for XO and
between
325 and 375 cid will also run in XXO. XO legal OHV engines with specialty
heads (Wayne - Skinner) under 325 cid also run in XXO as well as OHV engines
that have had ports added by hard work in the backyard by Hot Rodders. I
don't
know about Flathead inline engines with added ports. 

--- On Tue, 1/18/11, Dave Dahlgren <dahlgren536 at comcast.net> wrote:


From: Dave Dahlgren <dahlgren536 at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Ford Flathead
To: "Rich Fox" <v4gmr at yahoo.com>
Cc: "lsr list autox" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Date: Tuesday, January 18, 2011, 6:10 AM





Maybe I don't understand the rule I assume there is a place to run a Caddy
flathead should you want to though I don't persoonally.
Dave







In real life if you have a standard size Ford Flathead, no one will question
weathr it came from a truck or car. The rule is aimed only at Lincoln based
flatheads. Just as Cad and all other flatheads are disallowed.  
 
........XF CLASS CONSISTS OF ANY PRODUCTION
>>> FORD/MERCURY PASSENGER CAR V-8 FLATHEAD ENGINE......That's it. Go back
and
>>> read it again if you think you need to. Now the test. If you saw or
>>> understood....FRENCH ARMY TRUCKS...anywhere in that sentence you may
have
a
>>> condition that should be studied.
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/jolylance at earthlink.net

From b.a.savage at wildblue.net  Tue Jan 18 14:08:38 2011
From: b.a.savage at wildblue.net (Bryan Savage)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 13:08:38 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Inspection
In-Reply-To: <223A7E3FF4D447099DF35B1A2D23C73E@denpc>
References: <AB4271C7430644109D07C19E09C528D3@tiger>
	<223A7E3FF4D447099DF35B1A2D23C73E@denpc>
Message-ID: <4D360156.3010602@wildblue.net>

Niel,
We had our car inspected at El Mirage the day before race day. It worked 
wonderful for
us, the inspectors took plenty of time. Four different inspectors 
including Miler Mike. They
found no problems but had three excellent suggestions that we 
implemented the next week.

It was a pleasant _cheap_ trip worth every minute and cent.

Bryan



Jim Dincau wrote:
> Niel,
>      It has been done often. Show up, put the car in the tech line, tell the 
> inspectors what you want to do.  At El Mirage no new cars are inspected on 
> race day morning and it would be polite if you didn't take up time and space 
> on the first two days at Speedweek.
> Jim in Palmdale
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Neil Albaugh" <neil at dbelltech.com>
> To: "landspeed at autox.team.net" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2011 10:25 AM
> Subject: [Land-speed] Inspection
>
>
>   
>> List;
>>
>> Here's a question that I've not seen before:
>>
>> To have a car that is not quite finished run through tech inspection, is 
>> it
>> necessary to complete an entry form and pay an entry fee?
>>
>> I hope to have my B/GMS finished by Speed Week but if it's not ready to 
>> run,
>> I'd like to put it through Tech to see if anything needs to be changed or
>> modified. An inspection would be helpful to see that any problems are
>> addressed before bringing it to race.
>>
>> Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
>> _______________________________________________
>> Land-speed at autox.team.net
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
>> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/jdincau at qnet.com 
>>     
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/b.a.savage at wildblue.net

From 23.weldon at comcast.net  Tue Jan 18 15:03:16 2011
From: 23.weldon at comcast.net (23weldon)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 14:03:16 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] V-8 Flathead  big blocks
References: <474187.98979.qm@web39405.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<8235A7F72E3D4B819A39592B06C2B6EE@josephb4d4bd9f>
Message-ID: <7CA5867FEE7A45308F139BFC6B1D1BA4@edc2750afa5a84>

Beats me.  My hat's off to anyone who can get more horsepower out of a 
Flathead Cad block than an equivalent class GMC 6.
Maybe the "answer" is a specially machined hemi overhead conversion for the 
a 325 inch Cad. I know little about these blocks so whether a suitable head 
could be machined without an aluminum casting to start with is a mystery to 
me.  Start talking patterns and castings and the project starts to look 
pricey even with lost foam pattern construction. On the other hand there are 
a lot of idle CNC machining centers these days; so who knows?
Or maybe the softness exists in the XXO category as a 375" flathead.  Will 
50 cubic inches make up for the need to run the Cad flathead with valves in 
the block against an all out 12 port head?
For a flathead "big block" in the XO category (325" limit) cooling could be 
a problem in the blown or fuel categories; but in unblown gas there is some 
precedent  to show that the potential is there for well designed flathead 
breathing to exceed what modified cast iron stock heads have so far been 
shown to deliver.
 IMHO the superiority of a flathead Cad or Lincoln given the benefit of the 
latest ideas in breathing will not be a lasting thing.  I don't think it 
will take long for the guys committed to GMC sixes to start getting creative 
with what can be done with one of those cast iron heads.  For long they have 
been able to fall back on aftermarket specialty heads to get the horsepower; 
so I think that little corner of engine development has been ignored by 
most.
Note here (and studying the 2010 rulebook) that with a couple of exceptions 
the XO roadster records look pretty soft until you get up into the 200 mph 
area as well as the 6d. modified category.  Not so the XO Vintage Coupe 
category where there have been some very serious competitors in recent 
years.  ............Ed Weldon

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Joe & Lynne Lance" <jolylance at earthlink.net>

> Why is the flathead Cad the "answer"?
> Lance

> -----Original Message-----
> From: land-speed-bounces at autox.team.net
> > Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Ford Flathead
> Apparently there are at least three people who believe the Flathead Cad is
> the answer. 

From neil at dbelltech.com  Tue Jan 18 20:11:53 2011
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 20:11:53 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Inspection
In-Reply-To: <223A7E3FF4D447099DF35B1A2D23C73E@denpc>
References: <AB4271C7430644109D07C19E09C528D3@tiger>
	<223A7E3FF4D447099DF35B1A2D23C73E@denpc>
Message-ID: <76428209A2A247E0835A4E70BCE9DC64@tiger>

OK, Jim-- thanks.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Jim Dincau" <jdincau at qnet.com>
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2011 12:26 PM
To: "Neil Albaugh" <neil at dbelltech.com>; "landspeed at autox.team.net" 
<land-speed at autox.team.net>
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Inspection

> Niel,
>     It has been done often. Show up, put the car in the tech line, tell 
> the inspectors what you want to do.  At El Mirage no new cars are 
> inspected on race day morning and it would be polite if you didn't take up 
> time and space on the first two days at Speedweek.
> Jim in Palmdale
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Neil Albaugh" <neil at dbelltech.com>
> To: "landspeed at autox.team.net" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2011 10:25 AM
> Subject: [Land-speed] Inspection
>
>
>> List;
>>
>> Here's a question that I've not seen before:
>>
>> To have a car that is not quite finished run through tech inspection, is 
>> it
>> necessary to complete an entry form and pay an entry fee?
>>
>> I hope to have my B/GMS finished by Speed Week but if it's not ready to 
>> run,
>> I'd like to put it through Tech to see if anything needs to be changed or
>> modified. An inspection would be helpful to see that any problems are
>> addressed before bringing it to race.
>>
>> Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
>> _______________________________________________
>> Land-speed at autox.team.net
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
>> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/jdincau at qnet.com

From neil at dbelltech.com  Tue Jan 18 20:16:38 2011
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 20:16:38 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Inspection
In-Reply-To: <4D360156.3010602@wildblue.net>
References: <AB4271C7430644109D07C19E09C528D3@tiger>
	<223A7E3FF4D447099DF35B1A2D23C73E@denpc>
	<4D360156.3010602@wildblue.net>
Message-ID: <D4EFA10A609542AB8BD28F4F1363DEA2@tiger>

Thanks, Bryan. I appreciate everyone's help on this question.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ


From: Bryan Savage
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2011 2:08 PM
To: Neil Albaugh
Cc: Jim Dincau ; landspeed at autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Inspection


Niel,
We had our car inspected at El Mirage the day before race day. It worked
wonderful for
us, the inspectors took plenty of time. Four different inspectors including
Miler Mike. They
found no problems but had three excellent suggestions that we implemented the
next week.

It was a pleasant cheap trip worth every minute and cent.

Bryan



Jim Dincau wrote:
Niel,
     It has been done often. Show up, put the car in the tech line, tell the
inspectors what you want to do.  At El Mirage no new cars are inspected on
race day morning and it would be polite if you didn't take up time and space
on the first two days at Speedweek.
Jim in Palmdale


----- Original Message -----
From: "Neil Albaugh" <neil at dbelltech.com>
To: "landspeed at autox.team.net" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Tuesday, January 18, 2011 10:25 AM
Subject: [Land-speed] Inspection


  List;

Here's a question that I've not seen before:

To have a car that is not quite finished run through tech inspection, is
it
necessary to complete an entry form and pay an entry fee?

I hope to have my B/GMS finished by Speed Week but if it's not ready to
run,
I'd like to put it through Tech to see if anything needs to be changed or
modified. An inspection would be helpful to see that any problems are
addressed before bringing it to race.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/jdincau at qnet.com
    _______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/b.a.savage at wildblue.net

From gmc6power at earthlink.net  Tue Jan 18 21:30:01 2011
From: gmc6power at earthlink.net (J.D. Tone)
Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2011 20:30:01 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] V-8 Flathead  big blocks
References: <474187.98979.qm@web39405.mail.mud.yahoo.com><8235A7F72E3D4B819A39592B06C2B6EE@josephb4d4bd9f>
	<7CA5867FEE7A45308F139BFC6B1D1BA4@edc2750afa5a84>
Message-ID: <FD24200CDED3400F9AEE414E5ECF4705@mydf7618c59bbf>

Yep those are sure soft....................JD.

 the XO roadster records look pretty soft 

From sparky.2211 at cox.net  Wed Jan 19 07:05:08 2011
From: sparky.2211 at cox.net (sparky.2211 at cox.net)
Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2011 9:05:08 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] V-8 Flathead  big blocks
In-Reply-To: <FD24200CDED3400F9AEE414E5ECF4705@mydf7618c59bbf>
Message-ID: <20110119090508.DBPI0.896772.imail@fed1rmwml30>

LOL  sparky


---- "J.D. Tone" <gmc6power at earthlink.net> wrote: 

> Yep those are sure soft....................JD.
> 
>  the XO roadster records look pretty soft 
> _______________________________________________

From rbuck at xmission.com  Fri Jan 21 13:24:38 2011
From: rbuck at xmission.com (Ray Buck)
Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2011 13:24:38 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Target 550 website update
In-Reply-To: <B3CA75C6-CAC3-43F3-B0DC-21F43D00EB5B@nancyandjon.org>
References: <DB557DDC-6D69-4944-905F-1C6A76E65552@yahoo.com>
	<B3CA75C6-CAC3-43F3-B0DC-21F43D00EB5B@nancyandjon.org>
Message-ID: <4D39EB86.50004@xmission.com>

It doesn't take me long to catch on to things...I've only been updating 
the Target 550 website for about 15 months now and I just realized I'm 
not announcing the updates here.  DUH!

http://www.target550.com/index.html is the main entry page for the site.

I just posted update #90
http://www.target550.com/gallery/90_lift_hole_plastic_aero_inserts/index.html 
which covers a buncha different ground.

What we (Doc Freud and I) have been doing is for him to go to Jim Hume's 
shop way the hell up near the Canadian border (Freud lives in Everett, 
Wa) at least once a week and shoot a group of photos with a theme or 
area of focus.  Then he adds some captions, sends 'em to me and I update 
the website.  During December, we made a buncha posts in addition to the 
weekly (usually on Friday) stuff.

If you're not familiar with the project, I'll quote the mission 
statement: "*/To exceed the current land speed records by 100 mph." /*In 
order to do that, Marlo Treit, Jim Hume, Jason Hosking, Dave Jeffers and 
Les Davenport (to varying degrees) are building a twin-engine (dual 510 
inch Keith Black Hemis with Whipple blowers) 4wd (one engine for each 
axle), long, slender streamliner (a 1/10th scale model was tested in the 
Western Washington University wind tunnel) that's a work of fine art 
designed to go fast.  It's been under construction for over 10 years, 
but the pace has picked up in the last 18 months or so.  The team (I'm 
fortunate enough to have been designated "web elf" for the team) 
t-shirts show a tunnel opening with a light at the end.  We don't think 
it's a freight train, but rather the completion of the project...as much 
as projects like that ever really get completed.

So if ya feel so inclined, I'd like to invite ya to check it out and see 
what a beautiful job the guys at Hume's "Skunk Works" are cookin up.  Again:
http://www.target550.com/index.html

I hope you enjoy the site.

RtR

From gmc6power at earthlink.net  Fri Jan 21 19:45:14 2011
From: gmc6power at earthlink.net (J.D. Tone)
Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2011 18:45:14 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] New PFC
References: <20110119090508.DBPI0.896772.imail@fed1rmwml30>
Message-ID: <DBA01B56A2094B04819E38F2E6CCEE51@mydf7618c59bbf>

Jean and I just returned home from spending 2 days in San Diego for family 
day and graduation of one our countries newest Marines. Our oldest grandson 
Tyler, Patricks oldest son, followed in his fathers footsteps 22 years later 
by graduating from the United States Marine Recrut Depot San Diego with 452 
of our nation finest. He was a member of Platoon 1030. After 10 days leave, 
he will be stationed at Camp Pendleton for extended rifle and combat 
training before leaving for Lynchburg Va. He graduated 1st class due to his 
5 years in ROTC from the 8th grade thru high school in Chandler Az.

Tyler was denied his first ride in the family roadster in October by a 
broken rocker arm shaft in our GMC. We hope The USMC will see it to fit in 
some leave during race time. His first trip off the base for for a stop at 
In-and-Out for a double-double with cheese..........you west costers will 
know what I mean.............who-ra.....Semper-fi................JD 

From sparky.2211 at cox.net  Fri Jan 21 20:02:11 2011
From: sparky.2211 at cox.net (sparky.2211 at cox.net)
Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2011 22:02:11 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] New PFC
In-Reply-To: <DBA01B56A2094B04819E38F2E6CCEE51@mydf7618c59bbf>
Message-ID: <20110121220211.TSIFF.923236.imail@fed1rmwml29>

JD,  Thanks for rearing a PATRIOT son who served and fathered another PATRIOT son who also serves.  America is free today because of families like ours.  wmts


---- "J.D. Tone" <gmc6power at earthlink.net> wrote: 
> Jean and I just returned home from spending 2 days in San Diego for family 
> day and graduation of one our countries newest Marines. Our oldest grandson 
> Tyler, Patricks oldest son, followed in his fathers footsteps 22 years later 
> by graduating from the United States Marine Recrut Depot San Diego with 452 
> of our nation finest. He was a member of Platoon 1030. After 10 days leave, 
> he will be stationed at Camp Pendleton for extended rifle and combat 
> training before leaving for Lynchburg Va. He graduated 1st class due to his 
> 5 years in ROTC from the 8th grade thru high school in Chandler Az.
> 
> Tyler was denied his first ride in the family roadster in October by a 
> broken rocker arm shaft in our GMC. We hope The USMC will see it to fit in 
> some leave during race time. His first trip off the base for for a stop at 
> In-and-Out for a double-double with cheese..........you west costers will 
> know what I mean.............who-ra.....Semper-fi................JD 
> _______________________________________________

From dmirror3 at yahoo.com  Fri Jan 21 20:04:06 2011
From: dmirror3 at yahoo.com (Dale Krumheuer)
Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2011 19:04:06 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Land-speed] New PFC
In-Reply-To: <DBA01B56A2094B04819E38F2E6CCEE51@mydf7618c59bbf>
Message-ID: <860452.85984.qm@web161701.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>

First and foremost, thank you for raising a family who realizes the value of service to our country. Be proud. I will add Tyler to my list of prayers, for his safety and service.  
Now, as to "We hope The USMC will see it to fit in some leave during race time. "  I hope so as well !  uh..don't count on it, Marines have their own "unique" mindset. :-)
All the best, sincerely,
Dale
Cleveland OH 


"It's a small world, but I wouldn't want to paint it." - Steven Wright



--- On Fri, 1/21/11, J.D. Tone <gmc6power at earthlink.net> wrote:

> From: J.D. Tone <gmc6power at earthlink.net>
> Subject: [Land-speed] New PFC
> To: "landspeed at autox.team.net" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
> Date: Friday, January 21, 2011, 9:45 PM
> Jean and I just returned home from
> spending 2 days in San Diego for family day and graduation
> of one our countries newest Marines. Our oldest grandson
> Tyler, Patricks oldest son, followed in his fathers
> footsteps 22 years later by graduating from the United
> States Marine Recrut Depot San Diego with 452 of our nation
> finest. He was a member of Platoon 1030. After 10 days
> leave, he will be stationed at Camp Pendleton for extended
> rifle and combat training before leaving for Lynchburg Va.
> He graduated 1st class due to his 5 years in ROTC from the
> 8th grade thru high school in Chandler Az.
> 
> Tyler was denied his first ride in the family roadster in
> October by a broken rocker arm shaft in our GMC. We hope The
> USMC will see it to fit in some leave during race time. His
> first trip off the base for for a stop at In-and-Out for a
> double-double with cheese..........you west costers will
> know what I
> mean.............who-ra.....Semper-fi................JD
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/dmirror3 at yahoo.com

From ed at vetteracing.com  Fri Jan 21 20:53:50 2011
From: ed at vetteracing.com (Ed Van Scoy)
Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2011 03:53:50 +0000
Subject: [Land-speed] New PFC
Message-ID: <W682892235928131295668430@webmail64>

Damn JD, I'm proud of you, your son AND PFC Tone!
Semper Fi,
Cpl. Van Scoy
USMC 69-71
-----Original Message-----
From: J.D. Tone [mailto:gmc6power at earthlink.net]
Sent: Friday, January 21, 2011 07:45 PM
To: landspeed at autox.team.net
Subject: [Land-speed] New PFC

Jean and I just returned home from spending 2 days in San Diego for family day
and graduation of one our countries newest Marines. Our oldest grandson Tyler,
Patricks oldest son, followed in his fathers footsteps 22 years later by
graduating from the United States Marine Recrut Depot San Diego with 452 of
our nation finest. He was a member of Platoon 1030. After 10 days leave, he
will be stationed at Camp Pendleton for extended rifle and combat training
before leaving for Lynchburg Va. He graduated 1st class due to his 5 years in
ROTC from the 8th grade thru high school in Chandler Az. Tyler was denied his
first ride in the family roadster in October by a broken rocker arm shaft in
our GMC. We hope The USMC will see it to fit in some leave during race time.
His first trip off the base for for a stop at In-and-Out for a double-double
with cheese..........you west costers will know what I
mean.............who-ra.....Semper-fi................JD
_______________________________________________ Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/ed at vetteracing.com

From ed at vetteracing.com  Fri Jan 21 21:05:07 2011
From: ed at vetteracing.com (Ed Van Scoy)
Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2011 04:05:07 +0000
Subject: [Land-speed] Weird Fact
Message-ID: <W6905226980246431295669107@webmail39>

Wanted to share this interesting fact from an e-mail I received:
OK... try this.. This is Freaky! 

This year we will experience 4 unusual dates... 1/1/11, 1/11/11, 11/1/11 and 11/11/11.. 

Now go figure this out...take the last 2 digits of the year you were born plus the age you will be this year and it will equal to 111..

Weirdly yours,





Ed Van Scoy 
#128 B/GT Corvette 
SCTA-BNI/Gear Grinder 

From neil at dbelltech.com  Sat Jan 22 08:46:39 2011
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2011 08:46:39 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Weird Fact
In-Reply-To: <W6905226980246431295669107@webmail39>
References: <W6905226980246431295669107@webmail39>
Message-ID: <8290123EFB8044CC8B2302AFD309740A@tiger>

Go work on the car, Ed.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Ed Van Scoy" <ed at vetteracing.com>
Sent: Friday, January 21, 2011 9:05 PM
To: "Land-Speed List" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Land-speed] Weird Fact

> Wanted to share this interesting fact from an e-mail I received:
> OK... try this.. This is Freaky!
>
> This year we will experience 4 unusual dates... 1/1/11, 1/11/11, 11/1/11 
> and 11/11/11..
>
> Now go figure this out...take the last 2 digits of the year you were born 
> plus the age you will be this year and it will equal to 111..
>
> Weirdly yours,
>
>
>
>
>
> Ed Van Scoy
> #128 B/GT Corvette
> SCTA-BNI/Gear Grinder
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/neil at dbelltech.com

From neil at dbelltech.com  Sat Jan 22 08:48:51 2011
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2011 08:48:51 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] New PFC
In-Reply-To: <DBA01B56A2094B04819E38F2E6CCEE51@mydf7618c59bbf>
References: <20110119090508.DBPI0.896772.imail@fed1rmwml30>
	<DBA01B56A2094B04819E38F2E6CCEE51@mydf7618c59bbf>
Message-ID: <4D6957BD6A6A4390983E3A5DF79391EF@tiger>

JD;

You can be justifiably proud of Tyler.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

--------------------------------------------------
From: "J.D. Tone" <gmc6power at earthlink.net>
Sent: Friday, January 21, 2011 7:45 PM
To: "landspeed at autox.team.net" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Land-speed] New PFC

> Jean and I just returned home from spending 2 days in San Diego for family 
> day and graduation of one our countries newest Marines. Our oldest 
> grandson Tyler, Patricks oldest son, followed in his fathers footsteps 22 
> years later by graduating from the United States Marine Recrut Depot San 
> Diego with 452 of our nation finest. He was a member of Platoon 1030. 
> After 10 days leave, he will be stationed at Camp Pendleton for extended 
> rifle and combat training before leaving for Lynchburg Va. He graduated 
> 1st class due to his 5 years in ROTC from the 8th grade thru high school 
> in Chandler Az.
>
> Tyler was denied his first ride in the family roadster in October by a 
> broken rocker arm shaft in our GMC. We hope The USMC will see it to fit in 
> some leave during race time. His first trip off the base for for a stop at 
> In-and-Out for a double-double with cheese..........you west costers will 
> know what I mean.............who-ra.....Semper-fi................JD 
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/neil at dbelltech.com

From adin at frontier.net  Sat Jan 22 22:46:29 2011
From: adin at frontier.net (David in Durango)
Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2011 22:46:29 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] barrett jackson
Message-ID: <5ABD8BE0B4EA4700A4FED5462FBA3DA9@ZTxp>

http://www.barrett-jackson.com/application/onlinesubmission/lotdetails.aspx?l
n=1325.3&aid=403&pop=1

sold during commercial break.


__________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus signature
database 5809 (20110122) __________

The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.

http://www.eset.com

From 23.weldon at comcast.net  Sat Jan 22 23:46:32 2011
From: 23.weldon at comcast.net (23weldon)
Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2011 22:46:32 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] barrett jackson
References: <5ABD8BE0B4EA4700A4FED5462FBA3DA9@ZTxp>
Message-ID: <793743AFC7D84775BBEAC8FC7FB4B377@edc2750afa5a84>

I'm having a hard time believing what I see there dates from 1948.  As for 
the price?   Must be some pretty special history that goes along with it.
Anybody know about this one?.
Ed Weldon

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "David in Durango" <adin at frontier.net>
To: "LandSpeed list" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2011 9:46 PM
Subject: [Land-speed] barrett jackson


> http://www.barrett-jackson.com/application/onlinesubmission/lotdetails.aspx?l
> n=1325.3&aid=403&pop=1
>
> sold during commercial break.

From rbuck at xmission.com  Sun Jan 23 07:03:31 2011
From: rbuck at xmission.com (Ray Buck)
Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2011 07:03:31 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] barrett jackson
In-Reply-To: <793743AFC7D84775BBEAC8FC7FB4B377@edc2750afa5a84>
References: <5ABD8BE0B4EA4700A4FED5462FBA3DA9@ZTxp>
	<793743AFC7D84775BBEAC8FC7FB4B377@edc2750afa5a84>
Message-ID: <4D3C3533.5010403@xmission.com>

Isn't this the very first lakester (Burke Bros) that ran on the lakes 
and was in the Henry Ford Museum?

RtR
ps.  Since the url got chopped in the first email, here it is again:
http://www.barrett-jackson.com/application/onlinesubmission/lotdetails.aspx?ln=1325.3&aid=403&pop=1



On 1/22/2011 11:46 PM, 23weldon wrote:
> I'm having a hard time believing what I see there dates from 1948.  As 
> for the price?   Must be some pretty special history that goes along 
> with it.
> Anybody know about this one?.
> Ed Weldon
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "David in Durango" <adin at frontier.net>
> To: "LandSpeed list" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
> Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2011 9:46 PM
> Subject: [Land-speed] barrett jackson
>
>
>> http://www.barrett-jackson.com/application/onlinesubmission/lotdetails.aspx?l 
>>
>> n=1325.3&aid=403&pop=1
>>
>> sold during commercial break.

From dwarner230 at yahoo.com  Sun Jan 23 11:16:07 2011
From: dwarner230 at yahoo.com (dan warner)
Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2011 10:16:07 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Land-speed] barrett jackson
In-Reply-To: <4D3C3533.5010403@xmission.com>
Message-ID: <177518.62944.qm@web114702.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

This car was discussed at length on landracing.com and determined to be not
authentic. Anyone can paint Burke Bros on anything. I think I'll go outside
and paint my truck now.
 
DW
"Bonneville is not a bucket list item, its a life style." Allison Volk Dean
2010


--- On Sun, 1/23/11, Ray Buck <rbuck at xmission.com> wrote:


From: Ray Buck <rbuck at xmission.com>
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] barrett jackson
To: "23weldon" <23.weldon at comcast.net>
Cc: "LandSpeed list" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Date: Sunday, January 23, 2011, 6:03 AM


Isn't this the very first lakester (Burke Bros) that ran on the lakes and was
in the Henry Ford Museum?

RtR
ps.  Since the url got chopped in the first email, here it is again:
http://www.barrett-jackson.com/application/onlinesubmission/lotdetails.aspx?l
n=1325.3&aid=403&pop=1



On 1/22/2011 11:46 PM, 23weldon wrote:
> I'm having a hard time believing what I see there dates from 1948.  As for
the price?   Must be some pretty special history that goes along with it.
> Anybody know about this one?.
> Ed Weldon
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "David in Durango" <adin at frontier.net>
> To: "LandSpeed list" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
> Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2011 9:46 PM
> Subject: [Land-speed] barrett jackson
>
>
>>
http://www.barrett-jackson.com/application/onlinesubmission/lotdetails.aspx?l
>> n=1325.3&aid=403&pop=1
>>
>> sold during commercial break.
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/dwarner230 at yahoo.com

From ifixmgs at cox.net  Sun Jan 23 20:26:12 2011
From: ifixmgs at cox.net (ifixmgs at cox.net)
Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2011 22:26:12 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] New PFC
Message-ID: <20110123222612.RGW3Z.60249.imail@eastrmwml43>

J.D. 
My entire family sends our  thanks  and admiration.  I spent about 4  years  with the Marines during my time in the Navy  including  two six  week  at Pendelton,   a year  in Vietnam,  a month  in and out of Mogadisu,   ten months in  Desert Storm  and a couple years with active and reserve Marines at the Naval Air Station in Memphis.   Without question, they are the finest young men America has to offer.    Those who chose to remain will  keep America strong. And those who chose to return to civilian life will  make  it a better place to live. 
Chili 
USN 1967 -  1992

---- Ed Van Scoy <ed at vetteracing.com> wrote: 
> Damn JD, I'm proud of you, your son AND PFC Tone!
> Semper Fi,
> Cpl. Van Scoy
> USMC 69-71
> -----Original Message-----
> From: J.D. Tone [mailto:gmc6power at earthlink.net]
> Sent: Friday, January 21, 2011 07:45 PM
> To: landspeed at autox.team.net
> Subject: [Land-speed] New PFC
> 
> Jean and I just returned home from spending 2 days in San Diego for family day
> and graduation of one our countries newest Marines. Our oldest grandson Tyler,
> Patricks oldest son, followed in his fathers footsteps 22 years later by
> graduating from the United States Marine Recrut Depot San Diego with 452 of
> our nation finest. He was a member of Platoon 1030. After 10 days leave, he
> will be stationed at Camp Pendleton for extended rifle and combat training
> before leaving for Lynchburg Va. He graduated 1st class due to his 5 years in
> ROTC from the 8th grade thru high school in Chandler Az. Tyler was denied his
> first ride in the family roadster in October by a broken rocker arm shaft in
> our GMC. We hope The USMC will see it to fit in some leave during race time.
> His first trip off the base for for a stop at In-and-Out for a double-double
> with cheese..........you west costers will know what I
> mean.............who-ra.....Semper-fi................JD
> _______________________________________________ Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/ed at vetteracing.com
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/ifixmgs at cox.net

From sparky.2211 at cox.net  Sun Jan 23 22:23:16 2011
From: sparky.2211 at cox.net (sparky.2211 at cox.net)
Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2011 0:23:16 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Fwd: Bellytank
Message-ID: <20110124002316.05FVC.114170.imail@fed1rmwml44>

> Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2011 07:20:09 -0800 (PST)
> From: john mck <jpm49c at yahoo.com>
> Subject: Bellytank
> To: sparky.2211 at cox.net, sparky.2211 at cox.net

[demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of john.jpg]

From wester6935 at comcast.net  Tue Jan 25 18:12:21 2011
From: wester6935 at comcast.net (Wester Potter)
Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2011 18:12:21 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Fwd: Dry Lakes Racing Hall of Fame
References: <3538759326525F4BB67E31915826491B020EE894@fw-mx01.petersen-inc.com>
Message-ID: <10DADEE9-7A5A-4E9C-9C52-E8DE394BC79D@comcast.net>

Begin forwarded message:

> From: "Tom Burkland" <tom.burkland at peterseninc.com>
> Date: January 25, 2011 5:41:49 PM MST
> Subject: Dry Lakes Racing Hall of Fame
>
> It is with great pride I inform you that my Dad, Gene Burkland, will be
inducted into the Dry Lakes Racing Hall of Fame on April 30th in Buellton, CA.
He would be very much honored to be considered among this group of folks he
considered his racing heroes. He made his first trip to Bonneville for
Speedweek in 1954 to celebrate his high school graduation. There were a total
of 16 members of the 200mph club at that point, 10 of them American hot
rodders, and he would see two more added during the week. His goal became
getting in that club, which he achieved in 1978 driving his home built
Studebaker competition coupe to a 255.863mph record average. He continued to
demonstrate the Bonneville spirit with our families racing activities all the
way to the FIA category A, group I, class 11 record of 415.896mph in 2008.
> As part of the preparation for this event we have been asked to submit
stories, photos, and memories for a program to be used at the presentation.
Landspeed Louise Noeth will be assembling these inputs to print the programs
so please feel free to send your notes directly to her, or if she contacts
you, be free with your comments as they are intended for a good cause. There
are many of you that have other land speed racing associates that would be
willing to participate, which I do not have email addresses for. If you would
be so kind as to pass this request along to them so we can get them submitted
by February 15th.
>
> "LandSpeed" Louise Ann Noeth
> 101 Ladue Meadows Lane
> Creve Coeur, MO 63141
>
> Studio: 314.692.0247 C.S. T.
> Mobile: 805.312.0893 C.S. T.
>
> www.landspeedproductions.biz
>
> Thanks in advance for your support of this project,
> Tom
> Tom Burkland
> Chief Engineer
> tomb at peterseninc.com
> Desk: 801-732-2024

From neil at dbelltech.com  Tue Jan 25 19:49:16 2011
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2011 19:49:16 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Fwd: Dry Lakes Racing Hall of Fame
In-Reply-To: <10DADEE9-7A5A-4E9C-9C52-E8DE394BC79D@comcast.net>
References: <3538759326525F4BB67E31915826491B020EE894@fw-mx01.petersen-inc.com>
	<10DADEE9-7A5A-4E9C-9C52-E8DE394BC79D@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <9ACBBFCC5A594FBFAB0F9F2AA2A36E8F@tiger>

That's great- congratulations!

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Wester Potter" <wester6935 at comcast.net>
Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2011 6:12 PM
To: "LAND SPEED LIST" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Land-speed] Fwd: Dry Lakes Racing Hall of Fame

> Begin forwarded message:
>
>> From: "Tom Burkland" <tom.burkland at peterseninc.com>
>> Date: January 25, 2011 5:41:49 PM MST
>> Subject: Dry Lakes Racing Hall of Fame
>>
>> It is with great pride I inform you that my Dad, Gene Burkland, will be
> inducted into the Dry Lakes Racing Hall of Fame on April 30th in Buellton, 
> CA.
> He would be very much honored to be considered among this group of folks 
> he
> considered his racing heroes. He made his first trip to Bonneville for
> Speedweek in 1954 to celebrate his high school graduation. There were a 
> total
> of 16 members of the 200mph club at that point, 10 of them American hot
> rodders, and he would see two more added during the week. His goal became
> getting in that club, which he achieved in 1978 driving his home built
> Studebaker competition coupe to a 255.863mph record average. He continued 
> to
> demonstrate the Bonneville spirit with our families racing activities all 
> the
> way to the FIA category A, group I, class 11 record of 415.896mph in 2008.
>> As part of the preparation for this event we have been asked to submit
> stories, photos, and memories for a program to be used at the 
> presentation.
> Landspeed Louise Noeth will be assembling these inputs to print the 
> programs
> so please feel free to send your notes directly to her, or if she contacts
> you, be free with your comments as they are intended for a good cause. 
> There
> are many of you that have other land speed racing associates that would be
> willing to participate, which I do not have email addresses for. If you 
> would
> be so kind as to pass this request along to them so we can get them 
> submitted
> by February 15th.
>>
>> "LandSpeed" Louise Ann Noeth
>> 101 Ladue Meadows Lane
>> Creve Coeur, MO 63141
>>
>> Studio: 314.692.0247 C.S. T.
>> Mobile: 805.312.0893 C.S. T.
>>
>> www.landspeedproductions.biz
>>
>> Thanks in advance for your support of this project,
>> Tom
>> Tom Burkland
>> Chief Engineer
>> tomb at peterseninc.com
>> Desk: 801-732-2024
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/neil at dbelltech.com

From drmayf at mayfco.com  Tue Jan 25 22:52:39 2011
From: drmayf at mayfco.com (Larry Mayfield)
Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2011 21:52:39 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
Message-ID: <4D3FB6A7.8050008@mayfco.com>

Any of ya'll ever had a custom crank fabricated for your motor?  I mean 
from a raw forging or billet?  I am dickering with folk to do that or at 
least to see what kind of pocket book pain that might bring. I was 
wonder what kinds of costs are involved..anybody got any idea?

Next is how fast have short wheel base cars gone as a max before? I am 
not really keen or runing the sunbeam too much faster with it's 90 inch 
wheel base, but Lightfoo drives the Alfa romeo to about 225 mph and that 
puppy is only 84 inches. So, for those of you that still have some 
memory left (mine seems to be hiding from me occasionally), you remember 
any fast, short cars?  90 inces or less?

Have a good night!
mayf

From turbovortec6 at yahoo.com  Wed Jan 26 06:17:37 2011
From: turbovortec6 at yahoo.com (Randy Will)
Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2011 05:17:37 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
Message-ID: <909233.28854.qm@web32101.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

<p>Larry, My billet Ecotec crank. was $2250 w/knife edge and drilled rod throws.<br>
 <br>
Gary Allen's Monza went 240 with a 96" wheelbase. Rob &amp; Ron Cohen's Monza 250+. Balance is everything.</p>
<p>Randy<br><br></p>
<p>Sent from Yahoo! Mail on Android</p>

From sparky.2211 at cox.net  Wed Jan 26 06:19:46 2011
From: sparky.2211 at cox.net (sparky.2211 at cox.net)
Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2011 8:19:46 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
In-Reply-To: <4D3FB6A7.8050008@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <20110126081946.DP86J.1007407.imail@fed1rmwml36>

My Good Dr. Mayf.

With a good stiff frame, solid or tunable suspension and ZERO scrub radius; in conjunction with a good aero back end I don't think wb would be a controling factor----YMMV.



---- Larry Mayfield <drmayf at mayfco.com> wrote: 
> Any of ya'll ever had a custom crank fabricated for your motor?  I mean 
> from a raw forging or billet?  I am dickering with folk to do that or at 
> least to see what kind of pocket book pain that might bring. I was 
> wonder what kinds of costs are involved..anybody got any idea?
> 
> Next is how fast have short wheel base cars gone as a max before? I am 
> not really keen or runing the sunbeam too much faster with it's 90 inch 
> wheel base, but Lightfoo drives the Alfa romeo to about 225 mph and that 
> puppy is only 84 inches. So, for those of you that still have some 
> memory left (mine seems to be hiding from me occasionally), you remember 
> any fast, short cars?  90 inces or less?
> 
> Have a good night!
> mayf
> _______________________________________________

From jonwennerberg at nancyandjon.org  Wed Jan 26 07:00:41 2011
From: jonwennerberg at nancyandjon.org (Jon Wennerberg)
Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2011 09:00:41 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
In-Reply-To: <4D3FB6A7.8050008@mayfco.com>
References: <4D3FB6A7.8050008@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <E482F82F-3AAE-41BB-91DE-80DD2158D6C7@nancyandjon.org>

On Jan 26, 2011, at 12:52 AM, Larry Mayfield wrote:

Any of ya'll ever had a custom crank fabricated for your motor?  I mean from a
raw forging or billet?  I am dickering with folk to do that or at least to see
what kind of pocket book pain that might bring. I was wonder what kinds of
costs are involved..anybody got any idea?



Mayf, a handful of years ago I got a custom one-off billet stroker crank for
my nitrous bike engine.  Nobody in the US cared to make it, it seems, so we
ended up using Farndon in the UK.  16 months and about $5k plus exchange rate
penalties.

I don't recommend Farndon -- too many "unexpected" delays and obfuscation.
But there's a price for you.

      Jon Wennerberg
Tall guy with moustache
and a pair of 2 Club hats

From Rick at RBMotorsports.com  Wed Jan 26 07:30:38 2011
From: Rick at RBMotorsports.com (Rick Byrnes)
Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2011 09:30:38 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
References: <4D3FB6A7.8050008@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <750E14D6A83C4705B26F2D133081D55B@Rick>

HI Doc
The Billet crank I had done at Rody in Plymouth Mi with full counterweights, 
knife edges etc etc. was around $1600  That was over 10 years ago, so $2k 
might be in the ball park.
His shop does all the rough machining for Moldex plus his own work.
He is very well known for repair of billet and forged cranks.
He fixed one of mine when I blowed it up big.

No experience with 90" Wb cars.

From saltrat at pahrump.com  Wed Jan 26 09:13:49 2011
From: saltrat at pahrump.com (Skip Higginbotham)
Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2011 08:13:49 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
In-Reply-To: <4D3FB6A7.8050008@mayfco.com>
References: <4D3FB6A7.8050008@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <20110126161346.12957187660@autox.team.net>

I would talk to Howard, Scat and/or Callies also Eagle and Crower and 
then check it when it gets here. Chrome-moly. The indexing on my new 
one was off a bit and currently getting fixed. I am told that 
virtually all crank forgings now come from China.

I agree with Sparky. Also, Fred Larsen's liner was very short. Fast 
too! Stretch it to 130"?

Skip




At 09:52 PM 1/25/2011, Larry Mayfield wrote:
>Any of ya'll ever had a custom crank fabricated for your motor?  I 
>mean from a raw forging or billet?  I am dickering with folk to do 
>that or at least to see what kind of pocket book pain that might 
>bring. I was wonder what kinds of costs are involved..anybody got any idea?
>
>Next is how fast have short wheel base cars gone as a max before? I 
>am not really keen or runing the sunbeam too much faster with it's 
>90 inch wheel base, but Lightfoo drives the Alfa romeo to about 225 
>mph and that puppy is only 84 inches. So, for those of you that 
>still have some memory left (mine seems to be hiding from me 
>occasionally), you remember any fast, short cars?  90 inces or less?
>
>Have a good night!
>mayf
>_______________________________________________
>Land-speed at autox.team.net
>Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
>Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
>Unsubscribe/Manage: 
>http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/saltrat at pahrump.com

From neil at dbelltech.com  Wed Jan 26 08:22:38 2011
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2011 08:22:38 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
In-Reply-To: <4D3FB6A7.8050008@mayfco.com>
References: <4D3FB6A7.8050008@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <BBA24DE5BB874D5F92148164516F0390@tiger>

No, Mayf, I don't remember any under 90 inch wheelbase cars. ...and that's 
the long and short of it.  :)

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Larry Mayfield" <drmayf at mayfco.com>
Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2011 10:52 PM
To: <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.

> Any of ya'll ever had a custom crank fabricated for your motor?  I mean 
> from a raw forging or billet?  I am dickering with folk to do that or at 
> least to see what kind of pocket book pain that might bring. I was wonder 
> what kinds of costs are involved..anybody got any idea?
>
> Next is how fast have short wheel base cars gone as a max before? I am not 
> really keen or runing the sunbeam too much faster with it's 90 inch wheel 
> base, but Lightfoo drives the Alfa romeo to about 225 mph and that puppy 
> is only 84 inches. So, for those of you that still have some memory left 
> (mine seems to be hiding from me occasionally), you remember any fast, 
> short cars?  90 inces or less?
>
> Have a good night!
> mayf
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/neil at dbelltech.com

From saltrat at pahrump.com  Wed Jan 26 09:19:53 2011
From: saltrat at pahrump.com (Skip Higginbotham)
Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2011 08:19:53 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
Message-ID: <20110126161951.40FCE187660@autox.team.net>

I would talk to Howard, Scat and/or Callies also Eagle and Crower and 
then check it when it gets here. Chrome-moly. The indexing on my new 
one was off a bit and currently getting fixed. I am told that 
virtually all crank forgings now come from China.

I agree with Sparky. Also, Fred Larsen's liner was very short. Fast 
too! Stretch it to 130"?

Skip




At 09:52 PM 1/25/2011, Larry Mayfield wrote:
>Any of ya'll ever had a custom crank fabricated for your motor?  I 
>mean from a raw forging or billet?  I am dickering with folk to do 
>that or at least to see what kind of pocket book pain that might 
>bring. I was wonder what kinds of costs are involved..anybody got any idea?
>
>Next is how fast have short wheel base cars gone as a max before? I 
>am not really keen or runing the sunbeam too much faster with it's 
>90 inch wheel base, but Lightfoo drives the Alfa romeo to about 225 
>mph and that puppy is only 84 inches. So, for those of you that 
>still have some memory left (mine seems to be hiding from me 
>occasionally), you remember any fast, short cars?  90 inces or less?
>
>Have a good night!
>mayf

From gmc6power at earthlink.net  Wed Jan 26 10:36:10 2011
From: gmc6power at earthlink.net (James Tone)
Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2011 09:36:10 -0800 (GMT-08:00)
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
Message-ID: <26373495.1296063370710.JavaMail.root@elwamui-huard.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

One of our advertizers, Marine Crankshaft in Santa Ana Ca. makes one off cranks. Check them out in the rulebook and give thema a call. 

When you run out of horsepower you will get the ride of your life. So just make it contine to pull thru the full 5 miles. Good Luck

From neil at dbelltech.com  Wed Jan 26 13:57:56 2011
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2011 13:57:56 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
In-Reply-To: <20110126161346.12957187660@autox.team.net>
References: <4D3FB6A7.8050008@mayfco.com>
	<20110126161346.12957187660@autox.team.net>
Message-ID: <E171CFEF19AF4533A2C7D6A24BC69D74@tiger>

Skip;

There was a company called "Louisville Forge" or something like that who did 
the crank forgings for many US companies, at least in the past. I wonder if 
they are still around?

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Skip Higginbotham" <saltrat at pahrump.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 9:13 AM
To: <drmayf at mayfco.com>; <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.

> I would talk to Howard, Scat and/or Callies also Eagle and Crower and then 
> check it when it gets here. Chrome-moly. The indexing on my new one was 
> off a bit and currently getting fixed. I am told that virtually all crank 
> forgings now come from China.
>
> I agree with Sparky. Also, Fred Larsen's liner was very short. Fast too! 
> Stretch it to 130"?
>
> Skip
>
>
>
>
> At 09:52 PM 1/25/2011, Larry Mayfield wrote:
>>Any of ya'll ever had a custom crank fabricated for your motor?  I mean 
>>from a raw forging or billet?  I am dickering with folk to do that or at 
>>least to see what kind of pocket book pain that might bring. I was wonder 
>>what kinds of costs are involved..anybody got any idea?
>>
>>Next is how fast have short wheel base cars gone as a max before? I am not 
>>really keen or runing the sunbeam too much faster with it's 90 inch wheel 
>>base, but Lightfoo drives the Alfa romeo to about 225 mph and that puppy 
>>is only 84 inches. So, for those of you that still have some memory left 
>>(mine seems to be hiding from me occasionally), you remember any fast, 
>>short cars?  90 inces or less?
>>
>>Have a good night!
>>mayf

From yesford at clear.net.nz  Wed Jan 26 15:43:11 2011
From: yesford at clear.net.nz (Chris R Harris)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 11:43:11 +1300
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
References: <4D3FB6A7.8050008@mayfco.com>
	<E482F82F-3AAE-41BB-91DE-80DD2158D6C7@nancyandjon.org>
Message-ID: <001b01cbbdaa$6b7598b0$0201010a@Wendover>

On Jan 26, 2011, at 12:52 AM, Larry Mayfield wrote:

Any of ya'll ever had a custom crank fabricated for your motor?  I mean from a
raw forging or billet?  I am dickering with folk to do that or at least to see
what kind of pocket book pain that might bring. I was wonder what kinds of
costs are involved..anybody got any idea?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Try Tom Lieb at Scat, Redondo Beach, in LA.
Both cranks we use are billets from him.
Chris Harris................NZed.

From saltfever at comcast.net  Wed Jan 26 17:45:31 2011
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2011 16:45:31 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
Message-ID: <81ED8A8222204E528ECD054CDC7AB901@dim8100>

Me thinks since he wants to go slower and we are talking about de-stroking
the SBF crank. AFAIK, there are no forgings available anywhere for strokes
less than 3". (Unless you offset grind a 3" forging to get somewhere near
the 2.950" range).  Since forging dies are so costly, they have been
produced only for stroked sizes. My guess is Mayf is wanting to get down
near the 2.4" range so he can make an "F" motor out of his SBF. That crank
can only be turned (not forged)  out of billet stock. Due to the
proliferation of good NC lathes and crank millers, costs have held steady in
the past few years. Mayf you can plan for a number around $2,000 - plus
$600, minus $200.



Should be interesting. Good luck and keep us in the loop. :-)



From: Skip Higginbotham <saltrat at pahrump.com>

The indexing on my new one was off a bit and currently getting fixed. I am
told that virtually all crank forgings now come from China.

From turbovortec6 at yahoo.com  Thu Jan 27 08:43:18 2011
From: turbovortec6 at yahoo.com (Randy Will)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 07:43:18 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
Message-ID: <935239.31052.qm@web32102.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

<p>Larry,&#160; the only car I could find @ 90 inches or less is the Larsen &amp; Cummings Streamliner. It's been over 300 mph. </p>
<p>Randy</p>
<p>Sent from Yahoo! Mail on Android</p>

From pookie at dslextreme.com  Thu Jan 27 08:55:04 2011
From: pookie at dslextreme.com (pookie @dslextreme.com)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 07:55:04 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
In-Reply-To: <001b01cbbdaa$6b7598b0$0201010a@Wendover>
References: <4D3FB6A7.8050008@mayfco.com>
	<E482F82F-3AAE-41BB-91DE-80DD2158D6C7@nancyandjon.org>
	<001b01cbbdaa$6b7598b0$0201010a@Wendover>
Message-ID: <AANLkTimUAnnBknBz5TNUPtbkEPCHcg=nwEEWtb13ejYX@mail.gmail.com>

 Hi Dr. Mayf, How about Velasco's cranks? They are in Downey, been
around since I was a kid I'm 70 now. The last time I talked to Henry,
I told him what I wanted, he gave me advise and the cost right then
and there.. Good guy...  Phone # 562-862-3110.  I just happen to like
old school..   Mike R.

On 1/26/11, Chris R Harris <yesford at clear.net.nz> wrote:
> On Jan 26, 2011, at 12:52 AM, Larry Mayfield wrote:
>
> Any of ya'll ever had a custom crank fabricated for your motor?  I mean from
> a
> raw forging or billet?  I am dickering with folk to do that or at least to
> see
> what kind of pocket book pain that might bring. I was wonder what kinds of
> costs are involved..anybody got any idea?
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Try Tom Lieb at Scat, Redondo Beach, in LA.
> Both cranks we use are billets from him.
> Chris Harris................NZed.
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/pookie at dslextreme.com

From drmayf at mayfco.com  Thu Jan 27 09:05:14 2011
From: drmayf at mayfco.com (Larry Mayfield)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 08:05:14 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Dumb Questions 2011.1  and 2011.2
Message-ID: <4D4197BA.6080303@mayfco.com>

I have asked so many dumb question that I have had to resort to a 
numbering system to keep track, lol.

Here is today's first question:
1) I use a Ford nine inch rear end with a 4 link suspension. I currently 
use a diagonal link to keep it located and to prevent twisting of the 
rear axle as it moves up and down.  I have that diagonal link located 
between the front of one lower link to the opposite rear of the other 
side lower link.   Drum roll...can I put that link between the front 
upper link and back to the rear upper link heim fittings?  I would like 
to move it up because evry time I jack up the rear of teh car thelink 
and pinion bearing housing try to occupy the same space and I wind up 
having to disconnect the link at one end.

Comments?

And the second question:
2)  Would a triangular top link arrangement be any better? I would 
fabricate a new link which uses the two top 4 link brackets to atach th 
elink to and build a new single location point for that link up front.  
Heim joints would still be used at the ends. Why would this be better or 
worse that the diagonal link arrangement?

Comments?


if you all just want to call me a dumb ass,  that's ok, just do it in a 
separate email please, lol. If you have never used either of these kinds 
of set up, please feel free to comment but let me know you haven't used 
one before. Looking for experience here...

mayf

From dahlgren536 at comcast.net  Thu Jan 27 09:40:13 2011
From: dahlgren536 at comcast.net (Dave Dahlgren)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 11:40:13 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Dumb Questions 2011.1  and 2011.2
In-Reply-To: <4D4197BA.6080303@mayfco.com>
References: <4D4197BA.6080303@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <0AAEF3621E8E449EA7D83AC212915AE3@DaveSatellite>

Do web search on th following
Panard bar
Watts link
Jacobs ladder
Speedway motrs
Coleman racing
Afco suspension
Dave
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Larry Mayfield" <drmayf at mayfco.com>
To: <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2011 11:05 AM
Subject: [Land-speed] Dumb Questions 2011.1 and 2011.2


>I have asked so many dumb question that I have had to resort to a 
> numbering system to keep track, lol.
> 
> Here is today's first question:
> 1) I use a Ford nine inch rear end with a 4 link suspension. I currently 
> use a diagonal link to keep it located and to prevent twisting of the 
> rear axle as it moves up and down.  I have that diagonal link located 
> between the front of one lower link to the opposite rear of the other 
> side lower link.   Drum roll...can I put that link between the front 
> upper link and back to the rear upper link heim fittings?  I would like 
> to move it up because evry time I jack up the rear of teh car thelink 
> and pinion bearing housing try to occupy the same space and I wind up 
> having to disconnect the link at one end.
> 
> Comments?
> 
> And the second question:
> 2)  Would a triangular top link arrangement be any better? I would 
> fabricate a new link which uses the two top 4 link brackets to atach th 
> elink to and build a new single location point for that link up front.  
> Heim joints would still be used at the ends. Why would this be better or 
> worse that the diagonal link arrangement?
> 
> Comments?

From NT788 at comcast.net  Thu Jan 27 10:22:10 2011
From: NT788 at comcast.net (NT788 at comcast.net)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 17:22:10 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Land-speed] Dumb Questions 2011.1  and 2011.2
In-Reply-To: <783388001.1873166.1296148780832.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <3440298.1873390.1296148930902.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>

Mayf

I think the most accurate and the suspension to study is the Ford torque tube,
and buggy spring,it says it all!B Any lateral control links could cause yaw.
Consider angling two control arms together (a triangle). t\Try to eliminate
one sided lateral control.

Jack



Subject: [Land-speed] Dumb Questions 2011.1 B and 2011.2

I have asked so many dumb question that I have had to resort to a
numbering system to keep track, lol .

Here is today's first question:
1) I use a Ford nine inch rear end with a 4 link suspension. I currently
use a diagonal link to keep it located and to prevent twisting of the
rear axle as it moves up and down. B I have that diagonal link located
between the front of one lower link to the opposite rear of the other
side lower link. B  Drum roll...can I put that link between the front
upper link and back to the rear upper link heim fittings? B I would like
to move it up because evry time I jack up the rear of teh car thelink
and pinion bearing housing try to occupy the same space and I wind up
having to disconnect the link at one end.

Comments?

And the second question:
2) B Would a triangular top link arrangement be any better? I would
fabricate a new link which uses the two top 4 link brackets to atach th
elink to and build a new single location point for that link up front. B 
Heim joints would still be used at the ends. Why would this be better or
worse that the diagonal link arrangement?

Comments?


if you all just want to call me a dumb ass, B that's ok , just do it in a
separate email please, lol . If you have never used either of these kinds
of set up, please feel free to comment but let me know you haven't used
one before. Looking for experience here...

mayf
_______________________________________________
Land-speed@ autox .team.net
Donate: http :// www .team.net/donate. html
Archive: http :// www .team.net/archive
Forums: http :// www .team.net/forums
Unsubscribe /Manage: http :// autox
.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/nt788 at comcast.net

From 23.weldon at comcast.net  Thu Jan 27 13:10:57 2011
From: 23.weldon at comcast.net (23weldon)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 12:10:57 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Ground tarps for Bonneville
References: <3440298.1873390.1296148930902.JavaMail.root@sz0044a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net>
Message-ID: <B6125426E6144F7298D668AF0545EF58@edc2750afa5a84>

Costco out my way(CA bay area) this week has a package of two 12' x 16' 
plastic tarps, one side brown and the other side silver for 20 bucks.  Black 
plastic grommets every two feet (total 28).  Look like decent quality tarps; 
but not so expensive as to make you squirm if one has to go in the dumpster.
Note the finished size is 12 x 16!  If your sunshade frame is designed for 
the typical 6 inch undersize tarp this one may not work well for that 
application.  You won't want to discover this while you're standing on the 
Salt.
The link below is simply a forum found in a Google search with some comments 
about these particular tarps.
http://machineunderground.com/shade-tree-lounge/2131-tarps-costco.html
Ed Weldon 

From jpszalay01 at insightbb.com  Thu Jan 27 14:15:50 2011
From: jpszalay01 at insightbb.com (John Szalay)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 16:15:50 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.
In-Reply-To: <E171CFEF19AF4533A2C7D6A24BC69D74@tiger>
References: <4D3FB6A7.8050008@mayfco.com>
	<20110126161346.12957187660@autox.team.net>
	<E171CFEF19AF4533A2C7D6A24BC69D74@tiger>
Message-ID: <4E662B59E16348D995E99328D5BC13A1@Dell4400>

Yes , but,  they were forced out of their Louisville location by the airport
expansion, and have merged with another company.
now in Georgetown Ky.

 http://www.louisvilleforge.com/

                      John


TRIVIA:
the Louisville Forge plant used to be the International Harvester plant and
 before that, it was the Curtis  plant  building C-46A Commando transport
airplanes.


--------------------------------------------------
From: "Neil Albaugh" <neil at dbelltech.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 3:57 PM
To: <drmayf at mayfco.com>; <land-speed at autox.team.net>; "Skip Higginbotham" 
<saltrat at pahrump.com>
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Couple of questions.

> Skip;
>
> There was a company called "Louisville Forge" or something like that who 
> did the crank forgings for many US companies, at least in the past. I 
> wonder if they are still around?
>
> Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

From neil at dbelltech.com  Thu Jan 27 17:13:04 2011
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 17:13:04 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Dumb Questions 2011.1  and 2011.2
In-Reply-To: <4D4197BA.6080303@mayfco.com>
References: <4D4197BA.6080303@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <A84C24F66B7E4809BA95FB2B3B9CF6DC@tiger>

Mayf;

There are lots of ways to keep your rear axle from moving laterally so use 
whatever is most convenient to you particular application. Look out for up & 
down motion moving it sideways, though. Watts linkage might also be a 
possible choice.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Larry Mayfield" <drmayf at mayfco.com>
Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2011 9:05 AM
To: <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Land-speed] Dumb Questions 2011.1  and 2011.2

> I have asked so many dumb question that I have had to resort to a 
> numbering system to keep track, lol.
>
> Here is today's first question:
> 1) I use a Ford nine inch rear end with a 4 link suspension. I currently 
> use a diagonal link to keep it located and to prevent twisting of the rear 
> axle as it moves up and down.  I have that diagonal link located between 
> the front of one lower link to the opposite rear of the other side lower 
> link.   Drum roll...can I put that link between the front upper link and 
> back to the rear upper link heim fittings?  I would like to move it up 
> because evry time I jack up the rear of teh car thelink and pinion bearing 
> housing try to occupy the same space and I wind up having to disconnect 
> the link at one end.
>
> Comments?
>
> And the second question:
> 2)  Would a triangular top link arrangement be any better? I would 
> fabricate a new link which uses the two top 4 link brackets to atach th 
> elink to and build a new single location point for that link up front. 
> Heim joints would still be used at the ends. Why would this be better or 
> worse that the diagonal link arrangement?
>
> Comments?
>
>
> if you all just want to call me a dumb ass,  that's ok, just do it in a 
> separate email please, lol. If you have never used either of these kinds 
> of set up, please feel free to comment but let me know you haven't used 
> one before. Looking for experience here...
>
> mayf
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/neil at dbelltech.com

From jdincau at qnet.com  Thu Jan 27 19:08:50 2011
From: jdincau at qnet.com (Jim Dincau)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 18:08:50 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] pilot bearing
Message-ID: <CA63620ACE44401EBB382AA3C87DE8F4@denpc>

What do you like ? Bushing or roller? I currently have a needle bearing 
unit, it is trash after about 80 miles of running. Trans input shaft 
alignment to crank is good and bell housing face is square with crank also. 

From 23.weldon at comcast.net  Thu Jan 27 19:29:51 2011
From: 23.weldon at comcast.net (23weldon)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 18:29:51 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] pilot bearing
References: <CA63620ACE44401EBB382AA3C87DE8F4@denpc>
Message-ID: <35976018E5374CC0A443CBD2B60BC3F1@edc2750afa5a84>

Jim - Ball bearing if you have the right mounting space and shield on the 
outer side (to hold in the grease)and bronze oilite bushing in that order. 
Needle bearings don't like misalignment and aren't too happy with high 
speeds either.  Also the drawn cup Torrington needle bearings have to be 
installed exactly to their specs with the right kind of press tool (see 
their catalog). Also they need a full hardness inner race (58Rc+) or a 
ground shaft to the same hardness.   A conventional roller bearing (the kind 
with cylindrical rollers and thick ground inner and outer races will take 
heavier loads than a ball bearing but are somewhat less tolerant of 
misalignment.  They come in the same dimensions as ball bearings; but are 
hard to find and pricey.
Ed Weldon

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jim Dincau" <jdincau at qnet.com>
To: "land Speed List" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2011 6:08 PM
Subject: [Land-speed] pilot bearing


> What do you like ? Bushing or roller? I currently have a needle bearing 
> unit, it is trash after about 80 miles of running. Trans input shaft 
> alignment to crank is good and bell housing face is square with crank 
> also.

From jdincau at qnet.com  Thu Jan 27 19:38:22 2011
From: jdincau at qnet.com (Jim Dincau)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 18:38:22 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] pilot bearing
In-Reply-To: <35976018E5374CC0A443CBD2B60BC3F1@edc2750afa5a84>
References: <CA63620ACE44401EBB382AA3C87DE8F4@denpc>
	<35976018E5374CC0A443CBD2B60BC3F1@edc2750afa5a84>
Message-ID: <0EEB4EDBB7D944EEA64F10ED53A1AB27@denpc>

Ed,
     I havent been able to find a sealed bearing that will fit in my crank 
(4 cyl Chevy II, same as an L6 or SB V-8). They all seem to be much larger 
OD for late model LS V-8s. I remember using sealed rollers drag racing but 
they all went in the flywheel not the crank. It looks like I will change to 
an oilite bushing.
Jim

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "23weldon" <23.weldon at comcast.net>
To: "Jim Dincau" <jdincau at qnet.com>; "land Speed List" 
<land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2011 6:29 PM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] pilot bearing


> Jim - Ball bearing if you have the right mounting space and shield on the 
> outer side (to hold in the grease)and bronze oilite bushing in that order. 
> Needle bearings don't like misalignment and aren't too happy with high 
> speeds either.  Also the drawn cup Torrington needle bearings have to be 
> installed exactly to their specs with the right kind of press tool (see 
> their catalog). Also they need a full hardness inner race (58Rc+) or a 
> ground shaft to the same hardness.   A conventional roller bearing (the 
> kind with cylindrical rollers and thick ground inner and outer races will 
> take heavier loads than a ball bearing but are somewhat less tolerant of 
> misalignment.  They come in the same dimensions as ball bearings; but are 
> hard to find and pricey.
> Ed Weldon
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jim Dincau" <jdincau at qnet.com>
> To: "land Speed List" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
> Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2011 6:08 PM
> Subject: [Land-speed] pilot bearing
>
>
>> What do you like ? Bushing or roller? I currently have a needle bearing 
>> unit, it is trash after about 80 miles of running. Trans input shaft 
>> alignment to crank is good and bell housing face is square with crank 
>> also.

From lft at clear.net.nz  Thu Jan 27 19:39:31 2011
From: lft at clear.net.nz (lft at clear.net.nz)
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2011 15:39:31 +1300
Subject: [Land-speed] Dumb Questions 2011.1  and 2011.2
Message-ID: <4d422c63.276.14f3.1605@clear.net.nz>

Attaching the diagonal across the upper 4 link bars will
certainly keep the rear end located laterally. It will also
however raise the rear roll center which may or may not be a
concern unless you get a little sideways......I'd research
this a little more.

Nigel...Down in NZ...least I was until work took me to Chile
for a few weeks....still warm mind.... 


----- Original Message Follows -----
> I have asked so many dumb question that I have had to
> resort to a  numbering system to keep track, lol.
> 
> Here is today's first question:
> 1) I use a Ford nine inch rear end with a 4 link
> suspension. I currently  use a diagonal link to keep it
> located and to prevent twisting of the  rear axle as it
> moves up and down.  I have that diagonal link located 
> between the front of one lower link to the opposite rear
> of the other  side lower link.   Drum roll...can I put
> that link between the front  upper link and back to the
> rear upper link heim fittings?  I would like  to move it
> up because evry time I jack up the rear of teh car thelink
> and pinion bearing housing try to occupy the same space
> and I wind up  having to disconnect the link at one end.
> 
> Comments?
> 
> And the second question:
> 2)  Would a triangular top link arrangement be any better?
> I would  fabricate a new link which uses the two top 4
> link brackets to atach th  elink to and build a new single
> location point for that link up front.   Heim joints would
> still be used at the ends. Why would this be better or 
> worse that the diagonal link arrangement?
> 
> Comments?
> 
> 
> if you all just want to call me a dumb ass,  that's ok,
> just do it in a  separate email please, lol. If you have
> never used either of these kinds  of set up, please feel
> free to comment but let me know you haven't used  one
> before. Looking for experience here...
> 
> mayf
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
>
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/lft at clear.net.nz

From joyseydevil at comcast.net  Thu Jan 27 21:54:02 2011
From: joyseydevil at comcast.net (John Burk)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 23:54:02 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] pilot bearing -
Message-ID: <5D27DAF2D87A4D79AD23D70862C81D01@john>

Jim

I'd vote for an oilite bushing . Could the clutch disc be out of balance or 
one side of the pressure plate be engaging first . Is the pilot bearing to 
shaft fit ok ? Have you checked the input shaft for run out .

John Burk


> What do you like ? Bushing or roller? I currently have a needle bearing 
> unit, it is trash after about 80 miles of running. Trans input shaft 
> alignment to crank is good and bell housing face is square with crank 
> also. _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/joyseydevil at comcast.net

From jdincau at qnet.com  Thu Jan 27 22:17:55 2011
From: jdincau at qnet.com (Jim Dincau)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 21:17:55 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] pilot bearing -
In-Reply-To: <5D27DAF2D87A4D79AD23D70862C81D01@john>
References: <5D27DAF2D87A4D79AD23D70862C81D01@john>
Message-ID: <5A306043D5174AF6AB8A33E48592E58B@denpc>

John.
     The trans and clutch seem to be OK, I think there is just no way to 
keep the dust out and the lube in without a seal on the bearing.
Jim
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Burk" <joyseydevil at comcast.net>
To: "LandSpeed List" <Land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2011 8:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] pilot bearing -


> Jim
>
> I'd vote for an oilite bushing . Could the clutch disc be out of balance 
> or one side of the pressure plate be engaging first . Is the pilot bearing 
> to shaft fit ok ? Have you checked the input shaft for run out .
>
> John Burk
/land-speed/jdincau at qnet.com 

From mark at bradakis.com  Thu Jan 27 22:26:21 2011
From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis)
Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2011 22:26:21 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] That was interesting
Message-ID: <4D42537D.9030401@bradakis.com>

I am currently working as an auto parts driver.  Some aspects of the job
are nice, some aren't.  Today I made a delivery to this one shop which
rarely orders from us, but it happens.  It was a carb rebuild kit for a
1970 Ford Torino big block.  I walk in and the guy says "Utah Fast Pass,
nice."

I had sort of forgotten I was wearing the hat I got from the first running
of Utah Fast Pass back in 2006.  I may have mentioned it on this list
before.  Anyway that was the event where during the top speed segment
a Ferrari Enzo got a little scraped up.  Okay, it left the pavement at
close to 200 mph and rolled about half a dozen times, if not more.  So
when the guy comments on the hat I tell about being on the road events
crew and picking up over a million dollars worth of Ferrari a handful at
a time.  He says "Oh, Richard's car" and tells me what happened since
then.

The guy, Richard Lossee, rebuilt the car to slightly different specs, and
has been running it on the Salt Flats.  He set a record for C/BFMS in the
World Finals of 237.871 back in October.  Not bad for what was once a
basket case.

mjb.

From joyseydevil at comcast.net  Thu Jan 27 22:46:39 2011
From: joyseydevil at comcast.net (John Burk)
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2011 00:46:39 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] That was interesting -
References: <4D42537D.9030401@bradakis.com>
Message-ID: <B6BC3D1E7C104656BC5ED22AE0E3719F@john>

Mark is that the one with the rear mounted BB Chevy engine ?


>I am currently working as an auto parts driver.  Some aspects of the job
> are nice, some aren't.  Today I made a delivery to this one shop which
> rarely orders from us, but it happens.  It was a carb rebuild kit for a
> 1970 Ford Torino big block.  I walk in and the guy says "Utah Fast Pass,
> nice."
>
> I had sort of forgotten I was wearing the hat I got from the first running
> of Utah Fast Pass back in 2006.  I may have mentioned it on this list
> before.  Anyway that was the event where during the top speed segment
> a Ferrari Enzo got a little scraped up.  Okay, it left the pavement at
> close to 200 mph and rolled about half a dozen times, if not more.  So
> when the guy comments on the hat I tell about being on the road events
> crew and picking up over a million dollars worth of Ferrari a handful at
> a time.  He says "Oh, Richard's car" and tells me what happened since
> then.
>
> The guy, Richard Lossee, rebuilt the car to slightly different specs, and
> has been running it on the Salt Flats.  He set a record for C/BFMS in the
> World Finals of 237.871 back in October.  Not bad for what was once a
> basket case.
>
> mjb.
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage: 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/joyseydevil at comcast.net

From rbuck at xmission.com  Fri Jan 28 02:48:10 2011
From: rbuck at xmission.com (Ray Buck)
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2011 02:48:10 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] That was interesting
In-Reply-To: <4D42537D.9030401@bradakis.com>
References: <4D42537D.9030401@bradakis.com>
Message-ID: <4D4290DA.7070704@xmission.com>

A lotta photos here:
http://www.chevyasylum.com/lsr/bsf2010/wf/pix/Welcome0014.html  This is 
the last thumbnail page.  Work backward from there.

RtR


On 1/27/2011 10:26 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote:
> I am currently working as an auto parts driver.  Some aspects of the job
> are nice, some aren't.  Today I made a delivery to this one shop which
> rarely orders from us, but it happens.  It was a carb rebuild kit for a
> 1970 Ford Torino big block.  I walk in and the guy says "Utah Fast Pass,
> nice."
>
> I had sort of forgotten I was wearing the hat I got from the first 
> running
> of Utah Fast Pass back in 2006.  I may have mentioned it on this list
> before.  Anyway that was the event where during the top speed segment
> a Ferrari Enzo got a little scraped up.  Okay, it left the pavement at
> close to 200 mph and rolled about half a dozen times, if not more.  So
> when the guy comments on the hat I tell about being on the road events
> crew and picking up over a million dollars worth of Ferrari a handful at
> a time.  He says "Oh, Richard's car" and tells me what happened since
> then.
>
> The guy, Richard Lossee, rebuilt the car to slightly different specs, and
> has been running it on the Salt Flats.  He set a record for C/BFMS in the
> World Finals of 237.871 back in October.  Not bad for what was once a
> basket case.

From rbuck at xmission.com  Fri Jan 28 02:49:26 2011
From: rbuck at xmission.com (Ray Buck)
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2011 02:49:26 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] That was interesting -
In-Reply-To: <B6BC3D1E7C104656BC5ED22AE0E3719F@john>
References: <4D42537D.9030401@bradakis.com>
	<B6BC3D1E7C104656BC5ED22AE0E3719F@john>
Message-ID: <4D429126.7050704@xmission.com>

No.  That one is the Black Horse Racing 308:
http://www.chevyasylum.com/lsr/bsf2010/wf/pix/20101009%20054_jpg.html

RtR


On 1/27/2011 10:46 PM, John Burk wrote:
> Mark is that the one with the rear mounted BB Chevy engine ?
>
>
>> I am currently working as an auto parts driver.  Some aspects of the job
>> are nice, some aren't.  Today I made a delivery to this one shop which
>> rarely orders from us, but it happens.  It was a carb rebuild kit for a
>> 1970 Ford Torino big block.  I walk in and the guy says "Utah Fast Pass,
>> nice."
>>
>> I had sort of forgotten I was wearing the hat I got from the first 
>> running
>> of Utah Fast Pass back in 2006.  I may have mentioned it on this list
>> before.  Anyway that was the event where during the top speed segment
>> a Ferrari Enzo got a little scraped up.  Okay, it left the pavement at
>> close to 200 mph and rolled about half a dozen times, if not more.  So
>> when the guy comments on the hat I tell about being on the road events
>> crew and picking up over a million dollars worth of Ferrari a handful at
>> a time.  He says "Oh, Richard's car" and tells me what happened since
>> then.
>>
>> The guy, Richard Lossee, rebuilt the car to slightly different specs, 
>> and
>> has been running it on the Salt Flats.  He set a record for C/BFMS in 
>> the
>> World Finals of 237.871 back in October.  Not bad for what was once a
>> basket case.

From dwarner230 at yahoo.com  Fri Jan 28 08:23:34 2011
From: dwarner230 at yahoo.com (dan warner)
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2011 07:23:34 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Land-speed] That was interesting -
In-Reply-To: <B6BC3D1E7C104656BC5ED22AE0E3719F@john>
Message-ID: <411693.19228.qm@web113810.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

No,  added twin turbos to the Enzo engine puts the car into Blown Modified
Sports.
 
DW


--- On Thu, 1/27/11, John Burk <joyseydevil at comcast.net> wrote:


From: John Burk <joyseydevil at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] That was interesting -
To: "LandSpeed List" <Land-speed at autox.team.net>
Date: Thursday, January 27, 2011, 9:46 PM


Mark is that the one with the rear mounted BB Chevy engine ?


>I am currently working as an auto parts driver.  Some aspects of the job
> are nice, some aren't.  Today I made a delivery to this one shop which
> rarely orders from us, but it happens.  It was a carb rebuild kit for a
> 1970 Ford Torino big block.  I walk in and the guy says "Utah Fast Pass,
> nice."
>
> I had sort of forgotten I was wearing the hat I got from the first running
> of Utah Fast Pass back in 2006.  I may have mentioned it on this list
> before.  Anyway that was the event where during the top speed segment
> a Ferrari Enzo got a little scraped up.  Okay, it left the pavement at
> close to 200 mph and rolled about half a dozen times, if not more.  So
> when the guy comments on the hat I tell about being on the road events
> crew and picking up over a million dollars worth of Ferrari a handful at
> a time.  He says "Oh, Richard's car" and tells me what happened since
> then.
>
> The guy, Richard Lossee, rebuilt the car to slightly different specs, and
> has been running it on the Salt Flats.  He set a record for C/BFMS in the
> World Finals of 237.871 back in October.  Not bad for what was once a
> basket case.
>
> mjb.
> _______________________________________________
> Land-speed at autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/joyseydevil at comcast.net
_______________________________________________
Land-speed at autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/land-speed/dwarner230 at yahoo.com

From rbuck at xmission.com  Fri Jan 28 13:11:25 2011
From: rbuck at xmission.com (Ray Buck)
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2011 13:11:25 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Target 550 update 91
Message-ID: <4D4322ED.5070006@xmission.com>

Update 91. Subject: Throttle and fuel shutoff cables, Oil tank drains 
and the new oil scavenge pumps.

As Freud says, the empty spaces are getting smaller and smaller. Next 
weeks post will include the plumbing for the water tanks.

They just keep doing it. More beautiful craftsmanship from the guys at 
the Skunk Works.

http://www.target550.com/gallery/91_throttle-fuel_cables_oil_drains_new_oil_pumps/index.html

RtR