From kturk at adelphia.net  Fri Jan  1 04:33:28 2010
From: kturk at adelphia.net (Keith Turk)
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 2010 05:33:28 -0600
Subject: [Land-speed] NEW YEARS
References: <7C95F81DB6C94988A83508DBBA3BE912@GlenPC>
	<4B3D707D.1080901@dol.net>
Message-ID: <E54DFCB9FEDF45A38FEDBEC9CBB76A2D@keithhrijwmm4p>

Got woken up by the fireworks...

Happy New Year folks....  Here's to having a great year for one and all...

K

From websters at pyramid.net  Fri Jan  1 08:01:54 2010
From: websters at pyramid.net (Dan)
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 2010 07:01:54 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Happy New Year
Message-ID: <001301ca8af3$5f4f50c0$ddcba3d8@gateway>

Good Morning and Happy New Year.  May the New Year be a successful one for
all.  Take care  Dan Webster  # 313

From BWANA343 at aol.com  Fri Jan  1 08:28:24 2010
From: BWANA343 at aol.com (BWANA343 at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 2010 10:28:24 EST
Subject: [Land-speed] NEW YEARS
Message-ID: <cbf.520b4ee1.386f6e98@aol.com>

In a message dated 1/1/2010 7:16:50 AM Eastern Standard Time,  
kturk at adelphia.net writes:

KTurk  said.."Got woken up by the fireworks"...


Fireworks, Hell ! You are in Alabama, they're shooting raccoons for  
breakfast.....
Happy, successful, and most importantly, a SAFE LSR New Year for all  !
Bob Wanner, in cold but civilized New York...

From yesford at clear.net.nz  Fri Jan  1 14:29:56 2010
From: yesford at clear.net.nz (Chris Harris)
Date: Sat, 02 Jan 2010 10:29:56 +1300
Subject: [Land-speed] NEW YEARS
In-Reply-To: <4B3D707D.1080901@dol.net>
References: <7C95F81DB6C94988A83508DBBA3BE912@GlenPC>
	<4B3D707D.1080901@dol.net>
Message-ID: <C6D6C8F2D4F4489C950F98D415546668@ChrisHarrisPC>

> Raining with snow, 31 degrees and I'm going to bed early!!! HA, HA, HA !!!

All the very best to friends on the 'List'
Sun pouring down, hot as heck here, extended family yahoo'ing in the pool. 
Even better, when our winter arrives we'll be back at Bonneville.
"Life is Good"
See you all before you know it.
Chris Harris..............NZed. 

From gmc6power at earthlink.net  Fri Jan  1 23:20:23 2010
From: gmc6power at earthlink.net (J.D. Tone)
Date: Fri, 1 Jan 2010 22:20:23 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] NEW YEARS
References: <cbf.520b4ee1.386f6e98@aol.com>
Message-ID: <6C54EB9020EF41F6AC3971DD442D9DA0@mydf7618c59bbf>

slept thru it



> 
> KTurk  said.."Got woken up by the fireworks"...
> 
> 
> Fireworks, Hell ! You are in Alabama, 

From dwarner230 at yahoo.com  Sat Jan  2 12:39:51 2010
From: dwarner230 at yahoo.com (dan warner)
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2010 11:39:51 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Land-speed] NEW YEARS
In-Reply-To: <6C54EB9020EF41F6AC3971DD442D9DA0@mydf7618c59bbf>
Message-ID: <542066.90516.qm@web52506.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

Me too.
 
DW
XanGo, the Whole Fruit Mangosteen Puree!


A natural anti-inflammatory Immune system booster & antioxidant.
http://www.joaniewarner.mymangosteen.com/
1-818-998-4435  Dan and Joanie use XanGo, won't you?
www.mangosteenfruitinfo.com
  

--- On Fri, 1/1/10, J.D. Tone <gmc6power at earthlink.net> wrote:


From: J.D. Tone <gmc6power at earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] NEW YEARS
To: BWANA343 at aol.com, kturk at adelphia.net, land-speed at autox.team.net
Date: Friday, January 1, 2010, 10:20 PM


slept thru it



>
> KTurk  said.."Got woken up by the fireworks"...
>
>
> Fireworks, Hell ! You are in Alabama,
Land-speed mailing list

You are subscribed as dwarner230 at yahoo.com

http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From jdincau at qnet.com  Sat Jan  2 13:28:07 2010
From: jdincau at qnet.com (Jim Dincau)
Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2010 12:28:07 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] NEW YEARS
In-Reply-To: <542066.90516.qm@web52506.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
References: <542066.90516.qm@web52506.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <6AFC9CB8EBD84F61B6430A4A0D72181B@denpc>

Slept thru what?

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "dan warner" <dwarner230 at yahoo.com>
To: <BWANA343 at aol.com>; <kturk at adelphia.net>; <land-speed at autox.team.net>; 
"J.D. Tone" <gmc6power at earthlink.net>
Sent: Saturday, January 02, 2010 11:39 AM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] NEW YEARS


> Me too.
>
> DW
> XanGo, the Whole Fruit Mangosteen Puree!
>
>
> A natural anti-inflammatory Immune system booster & antioxidant.
> http://www.joaniewarner.mymangosteen.com/
> 1-818-998-4435  Dan and Joanie use XanGo, won't you?
> www.mangosteenfruitinfo.com
>
>
> --- On Fri, 1/1/10, J.D. Tone <gmc6power at earthlink.net> wrote:
>
>
> From: J.D. Tone <gmc6power at earthlink.net>
> Subject: Re: [Land-speed] NEW YEARS
> To: BWANA343 at aol.com, kturk at adelphia.net, land-speed at autox.team.net
> Date: Friday, January 1, 2010, 10:20 PM
>
>
> slept thru it
>
>
>
>>
>> KTurk  said.."Got woken up by the fireworks"...
>>
>>
>> Fireworks, Hell ! You are in Alabama,
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as dwarner230 at yahoo.com
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as jdincau at qnet.com
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed 

From sparky.2211 at cox.net  Sun Jan  3 15:33:55 2010
From: sparky.2211 at cox.net (sparky.2211 at cox.net)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2010 17:33:55 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] British bike parts
Message-ID: <20100103173355.FSOCD.414292.imail@fed1rmwml39>

Guys, on  Craigslist  Phoenix there is a shop going out of business that has tons of british bike parts

From mactem at mebtel.net  Sun Jan  3 16:57:01 2010
From: mactem at mebtel.net (David Anderson)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2010 18:57:01 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] British bike parts
Message-ID: <6511C19A243048238CE699F221CE2F69@OwnerPC>

Sparky,  Can you post a link? I can't seem to find it.  Thanks
David

From wolcott_jl at yahoo.com  Sun Jan  3 17:50:51 2010
From: wolcott_jl at yahoo.com (Joel Wolcott)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2010 16:50:51 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Land-speed] British bike parts
In-Reply-To: <6511C19A243048238CE699F221CE2F69@OwnerPC>
References: <6511C19A243048238CE699F221CE2F69@OwnerPC>
Message-ID: <922410.38402.qm@web110616.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

http://phoenix.craigslist.org/nph/mcy/1535330225.html




________________________________
From: David Anderson <mactem at mebtel.net>
To: lsr <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Sun, January 3, 2010 6:57:01 PM
Subject: [Land-speed] British bike parts

Sparky,  Can you post a link? I can't seem to find it.  Thanks
David
Land-speed mailing list

You are subscribed as wolcott_jl at yahoo.com

http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From sparky.2211 at cox.net  Sun Jan  3 17:51:17 2010
From: sparky.2211 at cox.net (sparky.2211 at cox.net)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2010 19:51:17 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] BRIT bike parts
Message-ID: <20100103195117.H7YPX.433781.imail@fed1rmwml40>

http://phoenix.craigslist.org/nph/mcy/1535330225.html

From ifixmgs at cox.net  Sun Jan  3 18:06:44 2010
From: ifixmgs at cox.net (ifixmgs at cox.net)
Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2010 20:06:44 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] British bike parts
In-Reply-To: <6511C19A243048238CE699F221CE2F69@OwnerPC>
Message-ID: <20100103200644.W01FS.120508.imail@eastrmwml30>

http://phoenix.craigslist.org/nph/mcy/1535330225.html

Sparky -  thanks for the tip.  

I'm in the middle of restoring a 67 Bonneville and need a couple parts that I've been desperately looking for.    The shop is in Peoria,  not far from my wife's  Cave Creek home  -  her brother (a Harley guy)  will be taking a run down there this week to see if they have anything I can use  - a  $500 Vincent Black Shadow would be nice...

Mark C

  
---- David Anderson <mactem at mebtel.net> wrote: 
> Sparky,  Can you post a link? I can't seem to find it.  Thanks
> David
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
> 
> Land-speed mailing list
> 
> You are subscribed as ifixmgs at cox.net
> 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From adin at frontier.net  Thu Jan  7 20:59:34 2010
From: adin at frontier.net (David in Durango)
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2010 20:59:34 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] first I heard
Message-ID: <563211399D174B869D8DD0F5FC59C63B@ZTxp>

http://www.target550.com/

From saltfevr at q.com  Thu Jan  7 21:04:22 2010
From: saltfevr at q.com (Tom Shannon)
Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2010 21:04:22 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] (non lsr) Don Prudhomme Retires
Message-ID: <SNT126-W806E96D743F820A4CEA43C9700@phx.gbl>

http://www.nhra.com/story/2010/1/7/prudhomme-announces-retirement-from-drag-r
acing/



So does "The Mongoose" win? LOL

Tom Shannon
Magna, Utah

From fastmetalbdf at aol.com  Fri Jan  8 13:23:14 2010
From: fastmetalbdf at aol.com (fastmetalbdf at aol.com)
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2010 15:23:14 EST
Subject: [Land-speed] Fwd: Bob Tasca,
	longtime Ford Dealer & drag racing sponsor ~
Message-ID: <72fb.2bf786ee.3878ee32@aol.com>

From:  fastmetalbdf at aol.com
To: land-speed at autox.team
CC:  j.demmitt at att.net
Sent: 1/8/2010 3:14:12 P.M. Eastern Standard  Time
Subj: Bob Tasca, longtime Ford Dealer & drag racing sponsor ~  


I just now learned today that Bob Tasca passed away, either today  or 
yesterday, at age 83 ..... his name became famous with the many drag cars  he 
sponsored as his dealership grew larger .  Bob started working  for Ford back 
in 1943 and went on to own his first dealership in Bristol, RI,  in 1953.  A 
large Tasca dealership is now run by his family in Cranston,  RI, near 
Providence.   Many of us oldtime local drag  fans/racers recall seeing Big Bob 
standing up near the starting line at  Connecticut Dragway when one of the 
many drag cars he sponsored over the  years was about to make a run ...... 
Billy Lawton drove Tasca Fords to  fame across America in super stock and 
factory experimental classes, with such  cars as the Mystery 9 Mustang and Zimmy 
1, and Bob's own grandson carries  on the Tasca Ford name today on a nitro 
funny car that he drives on  the NHRA national drag circuit.  Bob was a shrewd 
businessman who  realized that a Ford win on Sunday often meant more Ford 
sales in the  showrooms on Monday, and obviously he shared our love for 
racing and fast  cars. That was the era of storming Ford Thunderbolts, Galaxies, 
and big time  factory involvement, with so many other makes of bad-ass 
muscle cars  ready to duke it out with those Fords .... for Fame as well as 
Fortune  .... at drag strips every weekend ! ...... much great  racing before the 
wilder FX cars evolved into today's plastic-fantastic  Funnycars, and the 
other colorful class of crowd-pleasing cars: the  wheelstanding gassers of 
those years, took a back seat to the big-buck  pro-stocks, still present at 
national meets.   
                                                              
      Bruce in CT. ..... where it is too danged  cold for most all of us 
..... except, of course, our Ice & Snow Guru, Jon  W.   ~  Any heat in your 
garage,  Jon ...... or is that just for us sissies ?   LOL   ~

From saltfevr at q.com  Fri Jan  8 16:22:03 2010
From: saltfevr at q.com (Tom Shannon)
Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2010 16:22:03 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Fwd: Bob Tasca,
 longtime Ford Dealer & drag  racing sponsor ~
In-Reply-To: <72fb.2bf786ee.3878ee32@aol.com>
References: <72fb.2bf786ee.3878ee32@aol.com>
Message-ID: <SNT126-W17823CAF267186C43C49DAC9700@phx.gbl>

Bruce;



Thanks for the news link. Bangshift.com also has more.

Thanks again. Condolences to the Tasca Family.

http://www.bangshift.com

Tom Shannon
Magna, Utah




> From: fastmetalbdf at aol.com
> Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2010 15:23:14 -0500
> To: land-speed at autox.team.net
> Subject: [Land-speed] Fwd: Bob Tasca, longtime Ford Dealer & drag racing
sponsor ~
>
> From: fastmetalbdf at aol.com
> To: land-speed at autox.team
> CC: j.demmitt at att.net
> Sent: 1/8/2010 3:14:12 P.M. Eastern Standard Time
> Subj: Bob Tasca, longtime Ford Dealer & drag racing sponsor ~
>
>
> I just now learned today that Bob Tasca passed away, either today or
> yesterday, at age 83 ..... his name became famous with the many drag cars he
> sponsored as his dealership grew larger . Bob started working for Ford back
> in 1943 and went on to own his first dealership in Bristol, RI, in 1953. A
> large Tasca dealership is now run by his family in Cranston, RI, near
> Providence. Many of us oldtime local drag fans/racers recall seeing Big Bob
> standing up near the starting line at Connecticut Dragway when one of the
> many drag cars he sponsored over the years was about to make a run ......
> Billy Lawton drove Tasca Fords to fame across America in super stock and
> factory experimental classes, with such cars as the Mystery 9 Mustang and
Zimmy
> 1, and Bob's own grandson carries on the Tasca Ford name today on a nitro
> funny car that he drives on the NHRA national drag circuit. Bob was a shrewd
> businessman who realized that a Ford win on Sunday often meant more Ford
> sales in the showrooms on Monday, and obviously he shared our love for
> racing and fast cars. That was the era of storming Ford Thunderbolts,
Galaxies,
> and big time factory involvement, with so many other makes of bad-ass
> muscle cars ready to duke it out with those Fords .... for Fame as well as
> Fortune .... at drag strips every weekend ! ...... much great racing before
the
> wilder FX cars evolved into today's plastic-fantastic Funnycars, and the
> other colorful class of crowd-pleasing cars: the wheelstanding gassers of
> those years, took a back seat to the big-buck pro-stocks, still present at
> national meets.
>
> Bruce in CT. ..... where it is too danged cold for most all of us
> ..... except, of course, our Ice & Snow Guru, Jon W. ~ Any heat in your
> garage, Jon ...... or is that just for us sissies ? LOL ~
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as saltfevr at q.com
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From saltfever at comcast.net  Sat Jan  9 02:39:48 2010
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 2010 01:39:48 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Production and Gas Class
Message-ID: <000001ca910f$aff29c90$0fd7d5b0$@net>

Do the lights, horn and turn signals have to be functional? Page 46,
Paragraph 4.DD defines Street Equipment. However, in all sections dealing
with Production or Gas Coupe, they only have to be stock parts in stock
location. No mention they have to work. I have never seen an inspector check
to see if lights, or turn signals work. In other words, do I have to buy a
wiring harness and hook everything up?

From Mike.Meierle at alcatel-lucent.com  Sat Jan  9 08:07:15 2010
From: Mike.Meierle at alcatel-lucent.com (MEIERLE Mike)
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 2010 09:07:15 -0600
Subject: [Land-speed] Production and Gas Class
In-Reply-To: <000001ca910f$aff29c90$0fd7d5b0$@net>
References: <000001ca910f$aff29c90$0fd7d5b0$@net>
Message-ID: <7C6E77E36A1EAD4BAD7F02E98294BDB20D69F5D6@USDALSMBS01.ad3.ad.alcatel.com>

They do not have to be functional. It's a Aero consideration.

Mike Meierle
Sr. Systems Engineer
Alcatel-Lucent

-----Original Message-----
From: land-speed-bounces at autox.team.net
[mailto:land-speed-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kirkwood
Sent: Saturday, January 09, 2010 4:40 AM
To: land-speed
Subject: [Land-speed] Production and Gas Class

Do the lights, horn and turn signals have to be functional? Page 46,
Paragraph 4.DD defines Street Equipment. However, in all sections
dealing
with Production or Gas Coupe, they only have to be stock parts in stock
location. No mention they have to work. I have never seen an inspector
check
to see if lights, or turn signals work. In other words, do I have to buy
a
wiring harness and hook everything up?
Land-speed mailing list

You are subscribed as mike.meierle at alcatel-lucent.com

http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From saltfever at comcast.net  Sat Jan  9 17:51:19 2010
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Sat, 9 Jan 2010 16:51:19 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Production and Gas Class
Message-ID: <000f01ca918f$06176db0$12464910$@net>

Thank you, for all responses. The car has a complete rat's-nest of wiring
that I want to just rip out and toss. 

From kturk at adelphia.net  Sun Jan 10 22:02:29 2010
From: kturk at adelphia.net (Keith Turk)
Date: Sun, 10 Jan 2010 23:02:29 -0600
Subject: [Land-speed] El Mirage...
Message-ID: <D2CD57DA59794414A55BA8AD5F97BE9F@keithhrijwmm4p>

Just sitting here going through some old photos and up loading them to my
facebook page... and ya know what....   El Mirage has kicked my ass with the
Camaro... but man one day in the Berkeley with Mike Cook, Dan Warner, Mike
Mangelli and Glen Barrett was all it took...

What an incredibly frustrating and historic place to race...  Tough but
damn...

K

From kturk at adelphia.net  Mon Jan 11 05:14:39 2010
From: kturk at adelphia.net (Keith Turk)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 06:14:39 -0600
Subject: [Land-speed] El Mirage...
References: <D2CD57DA59794414A55BA8AD5F97BE9F@keithhrijwmm4p>
Message-ID: <8B9AAB4469254BC38B6E8D2D9D52E3CA@keithhrijwmm4p>

Needed to Add Ed Van Scoy to that FIRST... he was the Crew... ( along with 
Mayf and Dale....

K
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Keith Turk" <kturk at adelphia.net>
To: <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2010 11:02 PM
Subject: [Land-speed] El Mirage...


> Just sitting here going through some old photos and up loading them to my
> facebook page... and ya know what....   El Mirage has kicked my ass with 
> the
> Camaro... but man one day in the Berkeley with Mike Cook, Dan Warner, Mike
> Mangelli and Glen Barrett was all it took...
>
> What an incredibly frustrating and historic place to race...  Tough but
> damn...
>
> K

From drmayf at mayfco.com  Mon Jan 11 06:39:56 2010
From: drmayf at mayfco.com (drmayf)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 05:39:56 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] El Mirage...
In-Reply-To: <8B9AAB4469254BC38B6E8D2D9D52E3CA@keithhrijwmm4p>
References: <D2CD57DA59794414A55BA8AD5F97BE9F@keithhrijwmm4p>
	<8B9AAB4469254BC38B6E8D2D9D52E3CA@keithhrijwmm4p>
Message-ID: <4B4B2A2C.1030104@mayfco.com>

Keith, if you are referring to the Berk/you doing the hat routine at EM, 
yeah, I was also the camera man.. The pictures you have I took as nobody 
else had thought to bring the camera along....  Totally cool.... 

 but I wasn't  much help around the car, lol...  That was Ed... the main 
crew chief, crew, push, tow etc....

mayf


Keith Turk wrote:

> Needed to Add Ed Van Scoy to that FIRST... he was the Crew... ( along 
> with Mayf and Dale....
>
> K
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Keith Turk" <kturk at adelphia.net>
> To: <land-speed at autox.team.net>
> Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2010 11:02 PM
> Subject: [Land-speed] El Mirage...
>
>
>> Just sitting here going through some old photos and up loading them 
>> to my
>> facebook page... and ya know what....   El Mirage has kicked my ass 
>> with the
>> Camaro... but man one day in the Berkeley with Mike Cook, Dan Warner, 
>> Mike
>> Mangelli and Glen Barrett was all it took...
>>
>> What an incredibly frustrating and historic place to race...  Tough but
>> damn...
>>
>> K
>
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as drmayf at mayfco.com
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From ed at vetteracing.com  Mon Jan 11 09:08:15 2010
From: ed at vetteracing.com (Ed Van Scoy)
Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 16:08:15 +0000
Subject: [Land-speed] El Mirage...
Message-ID: <W2589913678323481263226095@webmail59>

All I did was point Keith in the right direction.... the rest was up to him.
Then again, getting KT pointed in the right direction can often be the most
daunting task ;-)
Ed
-----Original Message-----
From: drmayf [mailto:drmayf at mayfco.com]
Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 06:39 AM
To: 'Keith Turk'
Cc: land-speed at autox.team.net
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] El Mirage...

Keith, if you are referring to the Berk/you doing the hat routine at EM, yeah,
I was also the camera man.. The pictures you have I took as nobody else had
thought to bring the camera along.... Totally cool.... but I wasn't much help
around the car, lol... That was Ed... the main crew chief, crew, push, tow
etc.... mayf Keith Turk wrote: > Needed to Add Ed Van Scoy to that FIRST... he
was the Crew... ( along > with Mayf and Dale.... > > K > ----- Original
Message ----- From: "Keith Turk" > To: > Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2010 11:02
PM > Subject: [Land-speed] El Mirage... > > >> Just sitting here going through
some old photos and up loading them >> to my >> facebook page... and ya know
what.... El Mirage has kicked my ass >> with the >> Camaro... but man one day
in the Berkeley with Mike Cook, Dan Warner, >> Mike >> Mangelli and Glen
Barrett was all it took... >> >> What an incredibly frustrating and historic
place to race... Tough but >> damn... >> >> K > >

From Rick at RBMotorsports.com  Wed Jan 13 12:12:10 2010
From: Rick at RBMotorsports.com (Rick Byrnes)
Date: Wed, 13 Jan 2010 14:12:10 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Henry Ford Museum
Message-ID: <001301ca9484$4f17bc70$6601a8c0@Rick>

Hi guys
I post on landracing a bunch of photos of the Engines Exposed event at the
Ford Museum.
Enjoy.

From Saltrat at pahrump.com  Sat Jan 16 08:12:39 2010
From: Saltrat at pahrump.com (Skip Higginbotham)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 07:12:39 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Posting
Message-ID: <20100116151251.10567187652@autox.team.net>

Helllooo! Where is everybody???

Skip

From speedtimer at beyondbb.com  Sat Jan 16 08:30:09 2010
From: speedtimer at beyondbb.com (speedtimer at beyondbb.com)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 08:30:09 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Posting
In-Reply-To: <20100116151251.10567187652@autox.team.net>
References: <20100116151251.10567187652@autox.team.net>
Message-ID: <FDAE5AF7E30F4B4BB2E409E268737DD5@GlenPC>

I am here Skip, it's just been quiet lately. Say Hi to Joyce.
Glen
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Skip Higginbotham" <Saltrat at pahrump.com>
To: <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 8:12 AM
Subject: [Land-speed] Posting


> Helllooo! Where is everybody???
> 
> Skip
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
> 
> Land-speed mailing list
> 
> You are subscribed as speedtimer at beyondbb.com
> 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From jonwennerberg at nancyandjon.org  Sat Jan 16 08:33:38 2010
From: jonwennerberg at nancyandjon.org (Jon Wennerberg)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 10:33:38 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Posting
In-Reply-To: <20100116151251.10567187652@autox.team.net>
References: <20100116151251.10567187652@autox.team.net>
Message-ID: <78DEDA4D-E145-494C-A859-F3D7FA2991D9@nancyandjon.org>

On Jan 16, 2010, at 10:12 AM, Skip Higginbotham wrote:

Helllooo! Where is everybody???

Skip


Loud and clear in Skandia, Michigan.  Quiet, though -- but why not, what with
three or four feet of snow on the ground.  How much snow in Pahrump?

      Jon Wennerberg
Tall guy with moustache
and a pair of 2 Club hats

From adin at frontier.net  Sat Jan 16 08:38:03 2010
From: adin at frontier.net (David in Durango)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 08:38:03 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Posting
References: <20100116151251.10567187652@autox.team.net>
Message-ID: <E7170321BFFF4750AF39631EC22528BC@ZTxp>

Under the b!tch.  Hope all is well!

David
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Skip Higginbotham" <Saltrat at pahrump.com>
To: <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 8:12 AM
Subject: [Land-speed] Posting


> Helllooo! Where is everybody???
> 
> Skip
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
> 
> Land-speed mailing list
> 
> You are subscribed as adin at frontier.net
> 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From neil at dbelltech.com  Sat Jan 16 09:03:24 2010
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 09:03:24 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Posting
In-Reply-To: <20100116151251.10567187652@autox.team.net>
References: <20100116151251.10567187652@autox.team.net>
Message-ID: <EABF82BA65814421B79A8665423863CB@tiger>

Over in the shop-- working on my car!

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Skip Higginbotham" <Saltrat at pahrump.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 8:12 AM
To: <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Land-speed] Posting

> Helllooo! Where is everybody???
> 
> Skip
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
> 
> Land-speed mailing list
> 
> You are subscribed as neil at dbelltech.com
> 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From drmayf at mayfco.com  Sat Jan 16 10:55:05 2010
From: drmayf at mayfco.com (drmayf)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 09:55:05 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Posting
In-Reply-To: <EABF82BA65814421B79A8665423863CB@tiger>
References: <20100116151251.10567187652@autox.team.net>
	<EABF82BA65814421B79A8665423863CB@tiger>
Message-ID: <4B51FD79.1080904@mayfco.com>

Hey, Neil...great!!!! tell  me what you have been doing?  when will the 
car debut? this summer?

mayf
Neil Albaugh wrote:

> Over in the shop-- working on my car!
>
> Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Skip Higginbotham" <Saltrat at pahrump.com>
> Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 8:12 AM
> To: <land-speed at autox.team.net>
> Subject: [Land-speed] Posting
>
>> Helllooo! Where is everybody???
>>
>> Skip
>> _______________________________________________
>> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>
>> Land-speed mailing list
>>
>> You are subscribed as neil at dbelltech.com
>>
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed
>
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as drmayf at mayfco.com
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From ed at vetteracing.com  Sat Jan 16 11:04:23 2010
From: ed at vetteracing.com (Ed Van Scoy)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 18:04:23 +0000
Subject: [Land-speed] Posting
Message-ID: <W648539949185051263665063@webmail22>

I've just been trying to suffer through this 75 degree heat...... Can't work
on anything with so many parts on order so might as well play now. BIG rains
coming..... Maybe we will have the best El Mirage track in years!
Ed
-----Original Message-----
From: Skip Higginbotham [mailto:Saltrat at pahrump.com]
Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 08:12 AM
To: land-speed at autox.team.net
Subject: [Land-speed] Posting

Helllooo! Where is everybody??? Skip

From neil at dbelltech.com  Sat Jan 16 13:05:17 2010
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 13:05:17 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Posting
In-Reply-To: <4B51FD79.1080904@mayfco.com>
References: <20100116151251.10567187652@autox.team.net>
	<EABF82BA65814421B79A8665423863CB@tiger> <4B51FD79.1080904@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <B2663C03512A4E3496AF1E61BD07D22E@tiger>

Mayf;

I've been fabricating  my roll cage & firewall recently-- have a look in the 
Build Diaries under "Mid- Engine Modified Sports" for a few photos. I'd like 
to have it finished by Speed Week but we'll see.....

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

--------------------------------------------------
From: "drmayf" <drmayf at mayfco.com>
Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 10:55 AM
To: "Neil Albaugh" <neil at dbelltech.com>
Cc: <land-speed at autox.team.net>; "Skip Higginbotham" <Saltrat at pahrump.com>
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Posting

> Hey, Neil...great!!!! tell  me what you have been doing?  when will the 
> car debut? this summer?
>
> mayf
> Neil Albaugh wrote:
>
>> Over in the shop-- working on my car!
>>
>> Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> From: "Skip Higginbotham" <Saltrat at pahrump.com>
>> Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 8:12 AM
>> To: <land-speed at autox.team.net>
>> Subject: [Land-speed] Posting
>>
>>> Helllooo! Where is everybody???
>>>
>>> Skip
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>>
>>> Land-speed mailing list
>>>
>>> You are subscribed as neil at dbelltech.com
>>>
>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>
>> Land-speed mailing list
>>
>> You are subscribed as drmayf at mayfco.com
>>
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From dlodom at charter.net  Sat Jan 16 13:44:33 2010
From: dlodom at charter.net (Doug Odom)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 12:44:33 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Posting
References: <W648539949185051263665063@webmail22>
Message-ID: <01ba01ca96ec$b629a030$6401a8c0@YOUR588B4A13EA>

Ed, I was thinking the same thing about EM. Calaway told me it was the way 
it drys that has the most to do with the condition of the surface not the 
amount of water. Being that we on the coast get the rain a couple days 
before you desert rats do I will warn you if you need to move to higher 
ground.

Doug in big ditch


> I've just been trying to suffer through this 75 degree heat...... Can't 
> work
> on anything with so many parts on order so might as well play now. BIG 
> rains
> coming..... Maybe we will have the best El Mirage track in years!
> Ed
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Skip Higginbotham [mailto:Saltrat at pahrump.com]
> Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 08:12 AM
> To: land-speed at autox.team.net
> Subject: [Land-speed] Posting
>
> Helllooo! Where is everybody??? Skip
> _______________________________________________

From joyseydevil at comcast.net  Sat Jan 16 15:37:35 2010
From: joyseydevil at comcast.net (John Burk)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 17:37:35 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Screen Filters
Message-ID: <EE2ADB531845466BA3B6D0FF28FCD4E1@john>

What are your thoughts on monitoring a screen filter between the dry sump pump
and the tank for signs of bearing problems vs. pulling the pan and looking at
the bearings .

John

From kturk at adelphia.net  Sat Jan 16 15:50:43 2010
From: kturk at adelphia.net (Keith Turk)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 16:50:43 -0600
Subject: [Land-speed] Screen Filters
References: <EE2ADB531845466BA3B6D0FF28FCD4E1@john>
Message-ID: <5D1FEA543A97461CAD87BBA6858B2398@keithhrijwmm4p>

Oberg makes a nice one... and we've been running Canton's...

it's a nice way of looking at current motor conditions.... ( just don't get 
to wrapped around the intitial fire up... )

K 

From adin at frontier.net  Sat Jan 16 16:04:18 2010
From: adin at frontier.net (David in Durango)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 16:04:18 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Screen Filters
References: <EE2ADB531845466BA3B6D0FF28FCD4E1@john>
Message-ID: <C6AAC4823A864D3DA3C5EABFBE041102@ZTxp>

Just a guess:  what does the oil analysis tell???????

Of course, one can't do this between runs or overnight.

Can one tell by looking at a filter?  (I'm guessing the a bad bearing won't 
necessarily be in chunks.)

Great question!

David
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Burk" <joyseydevil at comcast.net>
To: "LandSpeed List" <Land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 3:37 PM
Subject: [Land-speed] Screen Filters


> What are your thoughts on monitoring a screen filter between the dry sump 
> pump
> and the tank for signs of bearing problems vs. pulling the pan and looking 
> at
> the bearings .
>
> John
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as adin at frontier.net
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From sparky.2211 at cox.net  Sat Jan 16 16:28:29 2010
From: sparky.2211 at cox.net (sparky.2211 at cox.net)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 18:28:29 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Screen Filters
In-Reply-To: <EE2ADB531845466BA3B6D0FF28FCD4E1@john>
Message-ID: <20100116182829.VJKWT.637041.imail@fed1rmwml46>

I have a tubular one in and out of the tank as well a normal racing filter between pump and block
---- John Burk <joyseydevil at comcast.net> wrote: 
> What are your thoughts on monitoring a screen filter between the dry sump pump
> and the tank for signs of bearing problems vs. pulling the pan and looking at
> the bearings .
> 
> John
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
> 
> Land-speed mailing list
> 
> You are subscribed as sparky.2211 at cox.net
> 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From sparky.2211 at cox.net  Sat Jan 16 16:30:23 2010
From: sparky.2211 at cox.net (sparky.2211 at cox.net)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 18:30:23 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Screen Filters
In-Reply-To: <EE2ADB531845466BA3B6D0FF28FCD4E1@john>
Message-ID: <20100116183023.LKXAV.637057.imail@fed1rmwml46>

I have a tubular one  in and out of my tank---I have shop built tank that could have had a bunch of slag
---- John Burk <joyseydevil at comcast.net> wrote: 



> What are your thoughts on monitoring a screen filter between the dry sump pump
> and the tank for signs of bearing problems vs. pulling the pan and looking at
> the bearings .
> 
> John
> _______________________________________________

From dlodom at charter.net  Sat Jan 16 17:22:08 2010
From: dlodom at charter.net (Doug Odom)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 16:22:08 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Screen Filters
References: <EE2ADB531845466BA3B6D0FF28FCD4E1@john>
	<5D1FEA543A97461CAD87BBA6858B2398@keithhrijwmm4p>
Message-ID: <01d501ca970b$1d0ee3f0$6401a8c0@YOUR588B4A13EA>

Yes Keith is right! I remember about 35 years ago when these first came out. 
The first one I looked at I thought my engine was built in a sand box by the 
looks of the junk in the filter. Now I had built the motor myself in my 
shop. Cleaned out the junk and ran some hot laps and looked again. No 
problem. Later that year some guys that had paid big bucks to a famous 
engine shop came by with their filter to show me. It looked just like mine 
had. Told them to go back and run the motor again and call me if it still 
looked bad. Saw them later and they said it was fine. I have caught motors 
that were starting to have bearing problems before they hurt themselves 
because of the filter. I highly recommend the use of them.

Doug in big ditch


Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Screen Filters


> Oberg makes a nice one... and we've been running Canton's...
>
> it's a nice way of looking at current motor conditions.... ( just don't 
> get to wrapped around the intitial fire up... )
>
> K

From Rick at RBMotorsports.com  Sat Jan 16 18:23:57 2010
From: Rick at RBMotorsports.com (Rick Byrnes)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 20:23:57 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Screen Filters
References: <EE2ADB531845466BA3B6D0FF28FCD4E1@john>
	<5D1FEA543A97461CAD87BBA6858B2398@keithhrijwmm4p>
Message-ID: <002a01ca9713$be7609a0$6601a8c0@Rick>

Gee I'm in the process of switching from Canton/Mecca, to Oberg.
I like the idea of being able to quickly check for trash.
The Canton was buried under coil and wire harness so checking was not quick 
and easy.

Rick

From gmc6power at earthlink.net  Sat Jan 16 18:41:32 2010
From: gmc6power at earthlink.net (J.D. Tone)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 17:41:32 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Screen Filters
References: <EE2ADB531845466BA3B6D0FF28FCD4E1@john>
Message-ID: <68004E4D1EB3435589B944290C17EE63@mydf7618c59bbf>

I run a tubular one, pretty large screen. For me it's just a precaution to 
keep out the "big chunks" from the pump if I lose an engine. I believe it's 
a Canton. It's actually on an external pump wet sump system but I will put 
it on the with the dry sump parts I have if I ever build a pan for my 
GMC...Good Luck
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Burk" <joyseydevil at comcast.net>
To: "LandSpeed List" <Land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Saturday, January 16, 2010 2:37 PM
Subject: [Land-speed] Screen Filters


> What are your thoughts on monitoring a screen filter between the dry sump 
> pump
> and the tank for signs of bearing problems vs. pulling the pan and looking 
> at
> the bearings .
>
> John
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as gmc6power at earthlink.net
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From kturk at adelphia.net  Sat Jan 16 20:11:56 2010
From: kturk at adelphia.net (Keith Turk)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 21:11:56 -0600
Subject: [Land-speed] Screen Filters
References: <EE2ADB531845466BA3B6D0FF28FCD4E1@john>
	<68004E4D1EB3435589B944290C17EE63@mydf7618c59bbf>
Message-ID: <0FDF48C889474714A97CF878085CF938@keithhrijwmm4p>

JD... would you be able to get your car lower with a dry sump pan?

( I'm not sure what to think about a roadster being lower honestly... we 
learned last year that the 238 car liked being high...in the wind tunnel ) 

From gmc6power at earthlink.net  Sat Jan 16 23:41:51 2010
From: gmc6power at earthlink.net (J.D. Tone)
Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2010 22:41:51 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Screen Filters
References: <EE2ADB531845466BA3B6D0FF28FCD4E1@john>
	<68004E4D1EB3435589B944290C17EE63@mydf7618c59bbf>
	<0FDF48C889474714A97CF878085CF938@keithhrijwmm4p>
Message-ID: <7AA920120E58448B8F818ABB21B4E583@mydf7618c59bbf>

No, Not really. Being a center steer I'm stuck over the drive shaft. Rear is 
as low as it can go. I can just side my toe under the center of the grille 
shell in the front. The lowest part under the car is the McCleod bell 
housing and the bottom has already been cut off. Pan is about 1/2" above 
that. Hope to add a little more HP for October. New pistons are here, just 
need to find some time to put them in.  I'm working a lot and and trying to 
do stuff on the house too. Patrick's dirt car is taking time right now. We 
have 2 dates in March and April off. I'll be in Florida for the 4th of July.



> JD... would you be able to get your car lower with a dry sump pan?
>
> ( I'm not sure what to think about a roadster being lower honestly... we 
> learned last year that the 238 car liked being high...in the wind tunnel )

[demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Perris first race 002.jpg]

From kturk at adelphia.net  Sun Jan 17 03:40:35 2010
From: kturk at adelphia.net (Keith Turk)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2010 04:40:35 -0600
Subject: [Land-speed] dirt track cars..
References: <EE2ADB531845466BA3B6D0FF28FCD4E1@john>
	<68004E4D1EB3435589B944290C17EE63@mydf7618c59bbf>
	<0FDF48C889474714A97CF878085CF938@keithhrijwmm4p>
	<7AA920120E58448B8F818ABB21B4E583@mydf7618c59bbf>
Message-ID: <3382EDB178864913913BEC841C69E59A@keithhrijwmm4p>

Dirt track cars just look like a ton of fun..... since you guys didn't get 
the picture the car is a second gen Camaro roundy round car.... Patrick's 
done a nice job.....   Simply a good time...

K
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "J.D. Tone" <gmc6power at earthlink.net>
To: "Keith Turk" <kturk at adelphia.net>; "John Burk" 
<joyseydevil at comcast.net>; "LandSpeed List" <Land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Sunday, January 17, 2010 12:41 AM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Screen Filters


> No, Not really. Being a center steer I'm stuck over the drive shaft. Rear 
> is
> as low as it can go. I can just side my toe under the center of the grille
> shell in the front. The lowest part under the car is the McCleod bell
> housing and the bottom has already been cut off. Pan is about 1/2" above
> that. Hope to add a little more HP for October. New pistons are here, just
> need to find some time to put them in.  I'm working a lot and and trying 
> to
> do stuff on the house too. Patrick's dirt car is taking time right now. We
> have 2 dates in March and April off. I'll be in Florida for the 4th of 
> July.
>
>
>
>> JD... would you be able to get your car lower with a dry sump pan?
>>
>> ( I'm not sure what to think about a roadster being lower honestly... we
>> learned last year that the 238 car liked being high...in the wind 
>> tunnel )

From joyseydevil at comcast.net  Sun Jan 17 18:21:07 2010
From: joyseydevil at comcast.net (John Burk)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2010 20:21:07 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
Message-ID: <F06B414AEDBA449CAF6F67E1A8CC2667@john>

Sealing around the water holes in Copper head gaskets has been discussed
before , silicone w/ thread , Copper coat , caskets with beads . Are there any
new tricks or thoughts on the subject ? Has anybody tried oversizing the water
holes in the gaskets and placing o-rings around each hole ?

John

From jdincau at qnet.com  Sun Jan 17 18:58:48 2010
From: jdincau at qnet.com (Jim Dincau)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2010 17:58:48 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
In-Reply-To: <F06B414AEDBA449CAF6F67E1A8CC2667@john>
References: <F06B414AEDBA449CAF6F67E1A8CC2667@john>
Message-ID: <FF3D5B5C59D84F42924B9940D892A2A0@denpc>

John,
     Ken and I tried of-rings, it didn't work. An o-ring needs a grove to 
remain stable, just squeezing them between the head and block tended to turn 
them into figure eights. We have had good luck with crushable spark plug 
washers and a little high temp silicone. Open the holes in the head gasket 
to just accept the washers. This is only good if the holes you want to seal 
are relatively small , spark plug diameter or less. This was on a blown 
alcohol aluminum block iron head motor. I wish we could take credit for this 
but it was suggested by Nick Arias.
Jim in Palmdale


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Burk" <joyseydevil at comcast.net>
To: "LandSpeed List" <Land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Sunday, January 17, 2010 5:21 PM
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets


> Sealing around the water holes in Copper head gaskets has been discussed
> before , silicone w/ thread , Copper coat , caskets with beads . Are there 
> any
> new tricks or thoughts on the subject ? Has anybody tried oversizing the 
> water
> holes in the gaskets and placing o-rings around each hole ?
>
> John
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as jdincau at qnet.com
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed 

From joyseydevil at comcast.net  Sun Jan 17 19:51:31 2010
From: joyseydevil at comcast.net (John Burk)
Date: Sun, 17 Jan 2010 21:51:31 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Fw:  Copper head gaskets
Message-ID: <4F28141E12534254861B949F08928517@john>

Thanks Jim , the crushable sparkplug gaskets are a neat trick . How much 
water pressure do they retrain ? Could the o-rings have been sucked inward 
by vacuum the first timed the engine cooled ?
John

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jim Dincau" <jdincau at qnet.com>
To: "land Speed List" <land-speed at autox.team.net>; "John Burk" 
<joyseydevil at comcast.net>
Sent: Sunday, January 17, 2010 8:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets


> John,
>     Ken and I tried of-rings, it didn't work. An o-ring needs a grove to 
> remain stable, just squeezing them between the head and block tended to 
> turn them into figure eights. We have had good luck with crushable spark 
> plug washers and a little high temp silicone. Open the holes in the head 
> gasket to just accept the washers. This is only good if the holes you want 
> to seal are relatively small , spark plug diameter or less. This was on a 
> blown alcohol aluminum block iron head motor. I wish we could take credit 
> for this but it was suggested by Nick Arias.
> Jim in Palmdale
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "John Burk" <joyseydevil at comcast.net>
> To: "LandSpeed List" <Land-speed at autox.team.net>
> Sent: Sunday, January 17, 2010 5:21 PM
> Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
>
>
>> Sealing around the water holes in Copper head gaskets has been discussed
>> before , silicone w/ thread , Copper coat , caskets with beads . Are 
>> there any
>> new tricks or thoughts on the subject ? Has anybody tried oversizing the 
>> water
>> holes in the gaskets and placing o-rings around each hole ?
>>
>> John
>> _______________________________________________
>> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>
>> Land-speed mailing list
>>
>> You are subscribed as jdincau at qnet.com
>>
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From jdincau at qnet.com  Mon Jan 18 05:59:40 2010
From: jdincau at qnet.com (Jim Dincau)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2010 04:59:40 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Fw:  Copper head gaskets
In-Reply-To: <4F28141E12534254861B949F08928517@john>
References: <4F28141E12534254861B949F08928517@john>
Message-ID: <96DD2631B3F945249D3056BB42201523@denpc>

John,
     I don't know how much pressure they will take. On our motor the only 
pressure is from restriction to the flow,the system is vented. As you can 
see no vacuum either.
Jim


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "John Burk" <joyseydevil at comcast.net>
To: "LandSpeed List" <Land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Sunday, January 17, 2010 6:51 PM
Subject: [Land-speed] Fw: Copper head gaskets


> Thanks Jim , the crushable sparkplug gaskets are a neat trick . How much 
> water pressure do they retrain ? Could the o-rings have been sucked inward 
> by vacuum the first timed the engine cooled ?
> John
>
autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed 

From saltracer at awwwsome.com  Mon Jan 18 07:58:26 2010
From: saltracer at awwwsome.com (Tom Bryant)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2010 06:58:26 -0800 (Pacific Standard Time)
Subject: [Land-speed] Screen Filters
References: <EE2ADB531845466BA3B6D0FF28FCD4E1@john>
	<5D1FEA543A97461CAD87BBA6858B2398@keithhrijwmm4p>
	<002a01ca9713$be7609a0$6601a8c0@Rick>
Message-ID: <4B547712.000007.04752@TOMSCOMPUTER>

As an Oil filter, I have used the Oberg for years and swear by them. At
first I was scared by all the junk that comes out of the oil. Just have to
be able to recognize bearing material and that can save you a ton of big
problems. Although I have not used the Oberg for fuel filtering, some circle
track guys do, it seems to me it is also a good idea.

Tom




____________________________________________________________


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From desotoman at dslextreme.com  Mon Jan 18 14:41:49 2010
From: desotoman at dslextreme.com (desotoman @dslextreme.com)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2010 13:41:49 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
Message-ID: <51a5f2e01001181341s60e2162rea259c6d3aeafa4e@mail.gmail.com>

Has anyone ever tried these ICS copper head gaskets? They have o rings
embossed onto gasket.

Tom Gerardi

http://www.flangeseal.com/sce-files/SCE%20Catalog.pdf

From yesford at clear.net.nz  Mon Jan 18 15:46:26 2010
From: yesford at clear.net.nz (Chris R Harris)
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2010 11:46:26 +1300
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
References: <51a5f2e01001181341s60e2162rea259c6d3aeafa4e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000201ca9896$acf627d0$8e6a65da@Wendover>

Tom,  Don't know about ICS copper gaskets but just tried a similar pair of Titan brand copper gaskets with all the usual 
plastic embossing round the various water holes etc.  Block decks and head surfaces all perfectly machined but once 
engine was filled with water it dribbled out every where despite 100 ft - lbs torque.  Very disappointing.  Switched to 
Cometic gaskets, worked perfectly.  (super charged engine).
Speaking to others later, none in favour of copper gaskets, strikely 60's technology considering what's available in 
head gaskets today.
Chris Harris.......N.Z.ed. 

From desotoman at dslextreme.com  Mon Jan 18 16:56:18 2010
From: desotoman at dslextreme.com (desotoman @dslextreme.com)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2010 15:56:18 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
In-Reply-To: <000201ca9896$acf627d0$8e6a65da@Wendover>
References: <51a5f2e01001181341s60e2162rea259c6d3aeafa4e@mail.gmail.com>
	<000201ca9896$acf627d0$8e6a65da@Wendover>
Message-ID: <51a5f2e01001181556q2ca802abi2b2a0a11836de3bb@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Chris,

ICS and Titan might be from the same company (SCE), the ones I was looking
at are called ICS Titan, ICS stands for internal combustion seal.  Thanks
for the information on your experience much appreciated.

Tom

On Mon, Jan 18, 2010 at 2:46 PM, Chris R Harris <yesford at clear.net.nz>wrote:

> Tom,  Don't know about ICS copper gaskets but just tried a similar pair of
> Titan brand copper gaskets with all the usual
> plastic embossing round the various water holes etc.  Block decks and head
> surfaces all perfectly machined but once
> engine was filled with water it dribbled out every where despite 100 ft -
> lbs torque.  Very disappointing.  Switched to
> Cometic gaskets, worked perfectly.  (super charged engine).
> Speaking to others later, none in favour of copper gaskets, strikely 60's
> technology considering what's available in
> head gaskets today.
> Chris Harris.......N.Z.ed.

From neil at dbelltech.com  Mon Jan 18 17:24:35 2010
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2010 17:24:35 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
In-Reply-To: <000201ca9896$acf627d0$8e6a65da@Wendover>
References: <51a5f2e01001181341s60e2162rea259c6d3aeafa4e@mail.gmail.com>
	<000201ca9896$acf627d0$8e6a65da@Wendover>
Message-ID: <EDC1877041B84CC9AC3339CE93A4A971@tiger>

Chris, Tom;

For years Cometic has developed gaskets for high performance aerospace 
applications; I'd trust them to know what they're doing.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Chris R Harris" <yesford at clear.net.nz>
Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 3:46 PM
To: "desotoman @dslextreme.com" <desotoman at dslextreme.com>; 
<Land-speed at autox.team.net>; <joyseydevil at comcast.net>; <jdincau at qnet.com>
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets

> Tom,  Don't know about ICS copper gaskets but just tried a similar pair of 
> Titan brand copper gaskets with all the usual
> plastic embossing round the various water holes etc.  Block decks and head 
> surfaces all perfectly machined but once
> engine was filled with water it dribbled out every where despite 100 ft - 
> lbs torque.  Very disappointing.  Switched to
> Cometic gaskets, worked perfectly.  (super charged engine).
> Speaking to others later, none in favour of copper gaskets, strikely 60's 
> technology considering what's available in
> head gaskets today.
> Chris Harris.......N.Z.ed.
> _______________________________________________

From drmayf at mayfco.com  Mon Jan 18 17:54:28 2010
From: drmayf at mayfco.com (drmayf)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2010 16:54:28 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
In-Reply-To: <EDC1877041B84CC9AC3339CE93A4A971@tiger>
References: <51a5f2e01001181341s60e2162rea259c6d3aeafa4e@mail.gmail.com>
	<000201ca9896$acf627d0$8e6a65da@Wendover>
	<EDC1877041B84CC9AC3339CE93A4A971@tiger>
Message-ID: <4B5502C4.5000606@mayfco.com>

Hey, Neil, can you use a set of them from my sunbeam motor? I used them 
up to 18 pis boost and they started to leak between cylinders... torque 
was 110 on long  head studs and 100 on short ones... So far no leaks on 
the SCE ICS Titans which ar eon their first reuse...

mayf
Neil Albaugh wrote:

> Chris, Tom;
>
> For years Cometic has developed gaskets for high performance aerospace 
> applications; I'd trust them to know what they're doing.
>
> Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Chris R Harris" <yesford at clear.net.nz>
> Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 3:46 PM
> To: "desotoman @dslextreme.com" <desotoman at dslextreme.com>; 
> <Land-speed at autox.team.net>; <joyseydevil at comcast.net>; 
> <jdincau at qnet.com>
> Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
>
>> Tom,  Don't know about ICS copper gaskets but just tried a similar 
>> pair of Titan brand copper gaskets with all the usual
>> plastic embossing round the various water holes etc.  Block decks and 
>> head surfaces all perfectly machined but once
>> engine was filled with water it dribbled out every where despite 100 
>> ft - lbs torque.  Very disappointing.  Switched to
>> Cometic gaskets, worked perfectly.  (super charged engine).
>> Speaking to others later, none in favour of copper gaskets, strikely 
>> 60's technology considering what's available in
>> head gaskets today.
>> Chris Harris.......N.Z.ed.
>> _______________________________________________
>
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as drmayf at mayfco.com
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From neil at dbelltech.com  Mon Jan 18 18:22:01 2010
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2010 18:22:01 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
In-Reply-To: <4B5502C4.5000606@mayfco.com>
References: <51a5f2e01001181341s60e2162rea259c6d3aeafa4e@mail.gmail.com>
	<000201ca9896$acf627d0$8e6a65da@Wendover>
	<EDC1877041B84CC9AC3339CE93A4A971@tiger> <4B5502C4.5000606@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <7B67DD3400A3465C935E1D277CF46648@tiger>

Mayf;

The key to success is getting the right type of Cometic gasket; there is a 
bewildering array of materials, finishes, and designs-- some even have gas- 
filled embossed rings. Of course the surface finish and flatness of your 
block & heads is critical to sealing.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

--------------------------------------------------
From: "drmayf" <drmayf at mayfco.com>
Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 5:54 PM
To: "Neil Albaugh" <neil at dbelltech.com>
Cc: "Chris R Harris" <yesford at clear.net.nz>; "desotoman @dslextreme.com" 
<desotoman at dslextreme.com>; <Land-speed at autox.team.net>; 
<joyseydevil at comcast.net>; <jdincau at qnet.com>
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets

> Hey, Neil, can you use a set of them from my sunbeam motor? I used them up 
> to 18 pis boost and they started to leak between cylinders... torque was 
> 110 on long  head studs and 100 on short ones... So far no leaks on the 
> SCE ICS Titans which ar eon their first reuse...
>
> mayf
> Neil Albaugh wrote:
>
>> Chris, Tom;
>>
>> For years Cometic has developed gaskets for high performance aerospace 
>> applications; I'd trust them to know what they're doing.
>>
>> Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> From: "Chris R Harris" <yesford at clear.net.nz>
>> Sent: Monday, January 18, 2010 3:46 PM
>> To: "desotoman @dslextreme.com" <desotoman at dslextreme.com>; 
>> <Land-speed at autox.team.net>; <joyseydevil at comcast.net>; 
>> <jdincau at qnet.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
>>
>>> Tom,  Don't know about ICS copper gaskets but just tried a similar pair 
>>> of Titan brand copper gaskets with all the usual
>>> plastic embossing round the various water holes etc.  Block decks and 
>>> head surfaces all perfectly machined but once
>>> engine was filled with water it dribbled out every where despite 100 
>>> ft - lbs torque.  Very disappointing.  Switched to
>>> Cometic gaskets, worked perfectly.  (super charged engine).
>>> Speaking to others later, none in favour of copper gaskets, strikely 
>>> 60's technology considering what's available in
>>> head gaskets today.
>>> Chris Harris.......N.Z.ed.
>>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>
>> Land-speed mailing list
>>
>> You are subscribed as drmayf at mayfco.com
>>
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From Rick at RBMotorsports.com  Mon Jan 18 21:41:00 2010
From: Rick at RBMotorsports.com (Rick Byrnes)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2010 23:41:00 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
References: <51a5f2e01001181341s60e2162rea259c6d3aeafa4e@mail.gmail.com><000201ca9896$acf627d0$8e6a65da@Wendover><EDC1877041B84CC9AC3339CE93A4A971@tiger>
	<4B5502C4.5000606@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <003c01ca98c1$9ab2ce40$6601a8c0@Rick>

Briefly, the fluid seal on the copper gasket is a band aid, like "print o 
seal" on composite gaskets.  The combustion seal on the ics titan looks to 
me to be some what forgiving relative to surface finish, flatness, and 
waviness that are critical issues with the multi layer steel gasket. 
(Cometic) or many OEM gaskets.   But, copper gaskets are 1960's technology.

  I have a relationship with Cometic, and have helped them with one 
application, and do use their products.  They do work well if all design 
parameters are met, and clamp load is sufficient.  The basic design is not 
optimum, in my mind, but from what I have seen they perform well except in 
the presence of detonation or pre-ignition.   Doc, most turbocharged engine 
gaskets fail after even a small (not noticeable)detonation event.

For surface finish requirements refer to OEM requirements.  4.6L Ford is a 
good example.  The sealing group I worked in released MLS gaskets for this 
engine for 1992 production, but working to the proper machining tolerances 
was quite an experience, and no one wanted to accept a waviness spec. We 
were working on MLS head gaskets in the late 80's but could not retrofit an 
existing engine.  To completely change the machining processes once 
established in an existing plant is almost impossible.

I don't have the machining specs, but many engine machine shops have the 
equipment and knowledge.  If your block and heads were not machined 
specifically for MLS gaskets I would not expect them to work perfectly.

More on gaskets in another note.

Rick

From Rick at RBMotorsports.com  Mon Jan 18 21:58:55 2010
From: Rick at RBMotorsports.com (Rick Byrnes)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2010 23:58:55 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
References: <51a5f2e01001181341s60e2162rea259c6d3aeafa4e@mail.gmail.com><000201ca9896$acf627d0$8e6a65da@Wendover><EDC1877041B84CC9AC3339CE93A4A971@tiger>
	<4B5502C4.5000606@mayfco.com> <7B67DD3400A3465C935E1D277CF46648@tiger>
Message-ID: <005301ca98c4$1b430730$6601a8c0@Rick>

John started this, so lets talk about "O" rings.

In the 80's I used a metallic O ring to seal combustion.  This requires a 
counterbore in the cylinder so the ring is supported all around, and can be 
squeezed about 20 %.  The hollow 1/6" dia tube O rings were filled with "I 
think argon", but the manufacturers will not disclose, nor will they talk 
about their manufacturing process.  This is near perfect sealing of 
combustion gasses unless the cylinder head lifts because of cylinder 
pressures exceeding clamping load.
You guys know all about that stuff, because we all buy ARP studs and nuts. 
Right Doc?  :=d

The elastomer o rings also need to be squeezed about 20% and really need to 
be contained in a counterbore or groove which is what I did so there was no 
head gasket per se.  I suppose that if you used a copper head gasket that 
was the proper thickness and created openings that provide support for the o 
rings it may actually work, however you still need to meter the water 
transfer from block to head. (or head to block)
Ready made gaskets have done that for you.
 Cometic has such a gasket now that uses the metallic O rings with the 
remainder of the gasket being their conventional MLS.  The same surface 
finish requirements would be important.  The metallic o ring supplier is 
Helicoflex.  They have been in the business for years, and I began working 
with them in the mid 80's. (introduced them to the automotive business).

More in another note.  I can't remember what size is max and don't have the 
patience to write too many, but want to do this now.

Rick 

From Rick at RBMotorsports.com  Mon Jan 18 22:14:32 2010
From: Rick at RBMotorsports.com (Rick Byrnes)
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2010 00:14:32 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
References: <51a5f2e01001181341s60e2162rea259c6d3aeafa4e@mail.gmail.com><000201ca9896$acf627d0$8e6a65da@Wendover><EDC1877041B84CC9AC3339CE93A4A971@tiger>
	<4B5502C4.5000606@mayfco.com> <7B67DD3400A3465C935E1D277CF46648@tiger>
Message-ID: <005401ca98c6$49e34c60$6601a8c0@Rick>

One last note tonight
Fel-pro has a gasket for Chevy and Ford small blocks as well as a bunch of 
other engines.  Even the 2.3L Ford. :-d  Gee I wonder how that happened.
It is a great basic design of composite gasket.  Solid SS core, a very good 
non asbestos paper facing, and SS armour, with a wire imbedded in the armour 
(fire ring).  Copper wire for alum components. Steel for iron.  On a 
performance engine, NEVER use anything but solid core.(as opposed to 
expended metal core supporting expanded graphite material.
The solid core is much more stable.
The unit load is increased at the edge of the cylinder and sealing is quite 
positive.  Turbo motors can distort the hoop called the fire ring, with 
cylinder pressures, so it is sometimes backed up by a SS wire imbedded in 
the block, that protrudes no more than .010" that provides additional hoop 
strength.
Surface finishes are not as critical, but sometimes these gaskets have been 
known to weep fluids because the balance between clamp load at the bore, and 
the body of the gasket are not perfect.  If you create too much sealing load 
at the edge of the bore, the body doesn't get enough squeeze.  I used these 
gaskets up to a little more than 100 HP per bore with good success.

More??

Rick

From joyseydevil at comcast.net  Mon Jan 18 22:40:37 2010
From: joyseydevil at comcast.net (John Burk)
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2010 00:40:37 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
Message-ID: <060045DE4321483EB6E3F8A4758FCD97@john>

It's easy to see how a bead of silicone with tons of pressure squeezing it to
'001" thick is not a very resilient seal . Some combination of o-rings has to
be the answer . The Hilborn jet cage o-ring bonded to a steel washer works
well with more pressure than a cooling system usually sees . Maybe appropriate
size Hilborn type steel oring ( =o ) or steel o-ring steel ( =o=  ) seals and
oversize water and oil holes . Maybe short tubes with o-rings ( oI Io ) for
the round holes in the block .

John

From drmayf at mayfco.com  Mon Jan 18 23:00:43 2010
From: drmayf at mayfco.com (drmayf)
Date: Mon, 18 Jan 2010 22:00:43 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
In-Reply-To: <005301ca98c4$1b430730$6601a8c0@Rick>
References: <51a5f2e01001181341s60e2162rea259c6d3aeafa4e@mail.gmail.com><000201ca9896$acf627d0$8e6a65da@Wendover><EDC1877041B84CC9AC3339CE93A4A971@tiger>
	<4B5502C4.5000606@mayfco.com> <7B67DD3400A3465C935E1D277CF46648@tiger>
	<005301ca98c4$1b430730$6601a8c0@Rick>
Message-ID: <4B554A8B.20503@mayfco.com>

On ARP, yup all head stuff is 1/2 inch studs and bottom is as well 
(maybe 7/16 on mains).  All torqued to spec.

mayf
Rick Byrnes wrote:

> John started this, so lets talk about "O" rings.
>
> In the 80's I used a metallic O ring to seal combustion.  This 
> requires a counterbore in the cylinder so the ring is supported all 
> around, and can be squeezed about 20 %.  The hollow 1/6" dia tube O 
> rings were filled with "I think argon", but the manufacturers will not 
> disclose, nor will they talk about their manufacturing process.  This 
> is near perfect sealing of combustion gasses unless the cylinder head 
> lifts because of cylinder pressures exceeding clamping load.
> You guys know all about that stuff, because we all buy ARP studs and 
> nuts. Right Doc?  :=d
>
> The elastomer o rings also need to be squeezed about 20% and really 
> need to be contained in a counterbore or groove which is what I did so 
> there was no head gasket per se.  I suppose that if you used a copper 
> head gasket that was the proper thickness and created openings that 
> provide support for the o rings it may actually work, however you 
> still need to meter the water transfer from block to head. (or head to 
> block)
> Ready made gaskets have done that for you.
> Cometic has such a gasket now that uses the metallic O rings with the 
> remainder of the gasket being their conventional MLS.  The same 
> surface finish requirements would be important.  The metallic o ring 
> supplier is Helicoflex.  They have been in the business for years, and 
> I began working with them in the mid 80's. (introduced them to the 
> automotive business).
>
> More in another note.  I can't remember what size is max and don't 
> have the patience to write too many, but want to do this now.
>
> Rick

From joyseydevil at comcast.net  Mon Jan 18 23:08:36 2010
From: joyseydevil at comcast.net (John Burk)
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2010 01:08:36 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
Message-ID: <7253A4F50ACF4DA29B90D6D4CB42E769@john>

In the 60s with my unblown fuel dragster  427 bbc  lots of nitro  high cr
lots of spark lead  constantly detonating all I ever used was plain old Chevy
embossed steel head gaskets . One compression leak in 300 runs due to a bad
head casting . Copper Coat around the water holes sealed pretty well .

From Rick at RBMotorsports.com  Tue Jan 19 07:04:58 2010
From: Rick at RBMotorsports.com (Rick Byrnes)
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2010 09:04:58 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
References: <51a5f2e01001181341s60e2162rea259c6d3aeafa4e@mail.gmail.com><000201ca9896$acf627d0$8e6a65da@Wendover><EDC1877041B84CC9AC3339CE93A4A971@tiger>
	<4B5502C4.5000606@mayfco.com> <7B67DD3400A3465C935E1D277CF46648@tiger>
	<005301ca98c4$1b430730$6601a8c0@Rick> <4B554A8B.20503@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <002f01ca9910$642f0510$6601a8c0@Rick>

Mayf
did you use the ARP lubricant on the threads.  There is a significant 
difference in clamp load with other lubes.  Fel-Pro and ARP had a little 
battle about this some time ago.  Neither really won, but highest clamp load 
without plastic deformation of the stud, and no failure of any other 
component is what we are after.  But then you know that so I'm just 
preaching......Ok I'll stop.

The OLD steel shim gaskets that John spoke of is still a good gasket, and in 
principal is at the basis of the MLS gaskets.  Precision embossing make them 
even more consistent than in the past.  Like you John I used lots of them in 
another life and they worked ok.  Our acceptance of "leaks" fluid or gaseous 
has changed over the years and the new designs are where it's at.

I still say that most race engine leakage of compression gasses is due to 
detonation or cylinder head lift.  If you had it machined to spec, I'll bet 
a six pack of Labatts that you had a brief excursion into detonation.  Easy 
to do with race type engine calibrations.

But, if you found what works, use it.  Until it doesn't.

Rick

From drmayf at mayfco.com  Tue Jan 19 07:49:15 2010
From: drmayf at mayfco.com (drmayf)
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2010 06:49:15 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
In-Reply-To: <002f01ca9910$642f0510$6601a8c0@Rick>
References: <51a5f2e01001181341s60e2162rea259c6d3aeafa4e@mail.gmail.com><000201ca9896$acf627d0$8e6a65da@Wendover><EDC1877041B84CC9AC3339CE93A4A971@tiger>
	<4B5502C4.5000606@mayfco.com> <7B67DD3400A3465C935E1D277CF46648@tiger>
	<005301ca98c4$1b430730$6601a8c0@Rick> <4B554A8B.20503@mayfco.com>
	<002f01ca9910$642f0510$6601a8c0@Rick>
Message-ID: <4B55C66B.5000207@mayfco.com>

Wow, this is getting interesting, lol. I now have a half dozen emails of 
some sort or another that indicate  I must possibly have been doing 
something stupidly wrong! From surface finishes, to torque, to thread 
lube, to phase of the moon I guess.  By the way folks, I didn't ask for 
help here, I just made two comments on what my experiences with Cometic 
MLS gaskets and  SCE ICS Titan head gaskets have been.  I am happy with 
my setup. YMMV! Go pick on some one else please!  And I am trying to 
understand the old technology vs new technology gimmick. If it works, it 
works, lol. Age of the idea or technique, if it works, doesn't matter! 

Rick, yes, I use ARP thread lubricant on everything in the motor: head 
studs, main bearings, rods. I torque in small steps letting the system 
rest a bit between each round. I come back later and retorque.  When I 
am at the final stage of torque I use a very small hammer to ping the 
fastner.. Why? Threads have siction (sticky friction) even when lubed up 
and small pinging   releases the friction. Then I retorque again. I do 
this on the final torque until nothing changes and that actually takes a 
few rounds or retorque.   After a heat cycle I retorque.  So what have I 
missed? Again, I did no task for help here. I only commented on my 
experiences. 

So get a life folk!

mayf


Rick Byrnes wrote:

> Mayf
> did you use the ARP lubricant on the threads.  There is a significant 
> difference in clamp load with other lubes.  Fel-Pro and ARP had a 
> little battle about this some time ago.  Neither really won, but 
> highest clamp load without plastic deformation of the stud, and no 
> failure of any other component is what we are after.  But then you 
> know that so I'm just preaching......Ok I'll stop.
>
> The OLD steel shim gaskets that John spoke of is still a good gasket, 
> and in principal is at the basis of the MLS gaskets.  Precision 
> embossing make them even more consistent than in the past.  Like you 
> John I used lots of them in another life and they worked ok.  Our 
> acceptance of "leaks" fluid or gaseous has changed over the years and 
> the new designs are where it's at.
>
> I still say that most race engine leakage of compression gasses is due 
> to detonation or cylinder head lift.  If you had it machined to spec, 
> I'll bet a six pack of Labatts that you had a brief excursion into 
> detonation.  Easy to do with race type engine calibrations.
>
> But, if you found what works, use it.  Until it doesn't.
>
> Rick

From dwarner230 at yahoo.com  Tue Jan 19 12:18:56 2010
From: dwarner230 at yahoo.com (dan warner)
Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2010 11:18:56 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
Message-ID: <682940.88295.qm@web52501.mail.re2.yahoo.com>

I'm a big fan of using products and expertise of the rulebook advertisers.
Contact this guy and pick his brain.
 

Clark Copper Head Gaskets           
Richard Clark
763-786-9590
 www.clarkcopperheadgaskets.com
 
DW
XanGo, the Whole Fruit Mangosteen Puree!


A natural anti-inflammatory Immune system booster & antioxidant.
http://www.joaniewarner.mymangosteen.com/
1-818-998-4435  Dan and Joanie use XanGo, won't you?
www.mangosteenfruitinfo.com
  

--- On Mon, 1/18/10, John Burk <joyseydevil at comcast.net> wrote:


From: John Burk <joyseydevil at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Copper head gaskets
To: "LandSpeed List" <Land-speed at autox.team.net>
Date: Monday, January 18, 2010, 10:08 PM


In the 60s with my unblown fuel dragster  427 bbc  lots of nitro  high cr
lots of spark lead  constantly detonating all I ever used was plain old Chevy
embossed steel head gaskets . One compression leak in 300 runs due to a bad
head casting . Copper Coat around the water holes sealed pretty well .
Land-speed mailing list

You are subscribed as dwarner230 at yahoo.com

http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From jdincau at qnet.com  Wed Jan 20 06:35:41 2010
From: jdincau at qnet.com (Jim Dincau)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2010 05:35:41 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Old Bakersfield photos
Message-ID: <0E6170EB5C2846E68BC46D976523FD42@denpc>

Those were the days........ I will bet Skip can identify some of them

http://www.nitrogeezers.com/John%20Moore%20Photos%201.htm

From bobbyhotrods at comcast.net  Wed Jan 20 18:06:30 2010
From: bobbyhotrods at comcast.net (bobbyhotrods at comcast.net)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 01:06:30 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: [Land-speed] new brake line
Message-ID: <1460811257.1309641264035990566.JavaMail.root@sz0018a.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net>

Well, new to me anyway. It bends easily, and a pretty slick double flaring tool can be rented for $25 a week, plus deposit. 

http://store.fedhillusa.com/ 

From saltfevr at q.com  Wed Jan 20 19:25:41 2010
From: saltfevr at q.com (Tom Shannon)
Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2010 19:25:41 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Old Bakersfield photos
In-Reply-To: <0E6170EB5C2846E68BC46D976523FD42@denpc>
References: <0E6170EB5C2846E68BC46D976523FD42@denpc>
Message-ID: <SNT126-W306EDAE2ED9CFA29A5A119C9630@phx.gbl>

Jim;



Thanks for sharing!! Very good stuff! Makes one wonder where those roadsters
are now? Thanks again!

Tom Shannon
Magna, Utah




> From: jdincau at qnet.com
> To: land-speed at autox.team.net
> Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2010 05:35:41 -0800
> Subject: [Land-speed] Old Bakersfield photos
>
> Those were the days........ I will bet Skip can identify some of them
>
> http://www.nitrogeezers.com/John%20Moore%20Photos%201.htm
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as saltfevr at q.com
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From mark at bradakis.com  Thu Jan 21 12:41:03 2010
From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 12:41:03 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Membership/e-mail
Message-ID: <4B58ADCF.9080105@bradakis.com>

A subscriber on another list asked this question, I figured that the
answer might be helpful to some folks on other lists.

And on a side note, for those of you who might be on some
other Team.Net lists,you may have noticed I've been starting
to add to the message trailer. Below the donate link
[ http://www.team.net/donate.html ] I've added a suggested
annual donation amount. For example, on the team-thicko list
which is about Sprites, $9.48.  Spitfires gets the displacement
of the original motor, $11.47.  I wonder what I should do for
this list??

mjb.


> I would like to suspend myself from receiving list e-mail for an undefined
> time, probably 90 days due to some surgery.  Can you help me?


1.  Click on the link at the bottom of this message, the 
mailman/listinfo one.

2.  In the subscriber section, enter your email address and list 
password.

3.  Realize that you should have kept a copy of the monthly reminder with
  your list password.

4.  Delete your address from the first box and enter it into the box labeled
 'Unsubscribe or Edit options" and click on the button.

5.  Click on the password reminder button.

6.  When the reminder message arrives, click on the link, pasting in
  your newly arrived password.

7.  Go down to the 'Mail Delivery' section of the subscription options.

8.  Click on the 'disabled' button.

9.  Go down to the bottom of the page and click on 'Submit my changes'

10.  Getting mail flowing again is the same procedure, except obviously
    you would click on the 'enable' button.


On a side note, this is a handy procedure if you use more than one email 
address.  You can subscribe, say, both your home address and your work
address, and set only one of them to enable.  Having the other address
subscribed will keep messages you send from that address from getting
bounced as non-member spam, but you won't get multiple copies of each
list message.
Mgs at autox.team.net
http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs

http://www.team.net/archive
Alpines at autox.team.net
http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/alpines

http://www.team.net/archive

From 23.weldon at comcast.net  Thu Jan 21 13:48:11 2010
From: 23.weldon at comcast.net (23weldon)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 12:48:11 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Membership/e-mail
References: <4B58ADCF.9080105@bradakis.com>
Message-ID: <7D7BF9CA4B3F436C89998527D950BA09@edc2750afa5a84>

Mark -- How about each year's scheduled Speedweek start date? $8.14 for 
2010.  Not enough?  How about World Finals $10.06 for 2010?
Ed Weldon

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark J Bradakis" <mark at bradakis.com>
To: "land speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2010 11:41 AM
Subject: [Land-speed] Membership/e-mail

> And on a side note, for those of you who might be on some
> other Team.Net lists,you may have noticed I've been starting
> to add to the message trailer. Below the donate link
> [ http://www.team.net/donate.html ] I've added a suggested
> annual donation amount. For example, on the team-thicko list
> which is about Sprites, $9.48.  Spitfires gets the displacement
> of the original motor, $11.47.  I wonder what I should do for
> this list??
>
> mjb.

From drmayf at mayfco.com  Thu Jan 21 14:20:38 2010
From: drmayf at mayfco.com (drmayf)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 13:20:38 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Membership/e-mail
In-Reply-To: <4B58ADCF.9080105@bradakis.com>
References: <4B58ADCF.9080105@bradakis.com>
Message-ID: <4B58C526.2020907@mayfco.com>

Mark, how about this for the Land speed list: Take all teh records for 
car and bikes at EM, ECTA, Bonneville, Tex Mile, etc, and average them. 
Base the fee on that, lol....

mayf
Mark J Bradakis wrote:

> A subscriber on another list asked this question, I figured that the
> answer might be helpful to some folks on other lists.
>
> And on a side note, for those of you who might be on some
> other Team.Net lists,you may have noticed I've been starting
> to add to the message trailer. Below the donate link
> [ http://www.team.net/donate.html ] I've added a suggested
> annual donation amount. For example, on the team-thicko list
> which is about Sprites, $9.48.  Spitfires gets the displacement
> of the original motor, $11.47.  I wonder what I should do for
> this list??
>
> mjb.
>
>
>> I would like to suspend myself from receiving list e-mail for an 
>> undefined
>> time, probably 90 days due to some surgery.  Can you help me?
>
>
>
> 1.  Click on the link at the bottom of this message, the 
> mailman/listinfo one.
>
> 2.  In the subscriber section, enter your email address and list 
> password.
>
> 3.  Realize that you should have kept a copy of the monthly reminder with
>  your list password.
>
> 4.  Delete your address from the first box and enter it into the box 
> labeled
> 'Unsubscribe or Edit options" and click on the button.
>
> 5.  Click on the password reminder button.
>
> 6.  When the reminder message arrives, click on the link, pasting in
>  your newly arrived password.
>
> 7.  Go down to the 'Mail Delivery' section of the subscription options.
>
> 8.  Click on the 'disabled' button.
>
> 9.  Go down to the bottom of the page and click on 'Submit my changes'
>
> 10.  Getting mail flowing again is the same procedure, except obviously
>    you would click on the 'enable' button.
>
>
> On a side note, this is a handy procedure if you use more than one 
> email address.  You can subscribe, say, both your home address and 
> your work
> address, and set only one of them to enable.  Having the other address
> subscribed will keep messages you send from that address from getting
> bounced as non-member spam, but you won't get multiple copies of each
> list message.
> Mgs at autox.team.net
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/mgs

From 23.weldon at comcast.net  Thu Jan 21 15:05:10 2010
From: 23.weldon at comcast.net (23weldon)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 14:05:10 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Membership/e-mail
References: <4B58ADCF.9080105@bradakis.com>
  <4B58C526.2020907@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <F418D623F6E14DF5AC5A36ACE5E3517D@edc2750afa5a84>

Mayf -- Are you talking dollars per mph or cents per mph?
Ed
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "drmayf" <drmayf at mayfco.com>
To: "Mark J Bradakis" <mark at bradakis.com>
Cc: "land speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Thursday, January 21, 2010 1:20 PM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Membership/e-mail


> Mark, how about this for the Land speed list: Take all teh records for 
> car and bikes at EM, ECTA, Bonneville, Tex Mile, etc, and average them. 
> Base the fee on that, lol.... 
> mayf
> Mark J Bradakis wrote:

>> And on a side note, for those of you who might be on some
>> other Team.Net lists,you may have noticed I've been starting
>> to add to the message trailer. Below the donate link
>> [ http://www.team.net/donate.html ] I've added a suggested

From wester6935 at comcast.net  Thu Jan 21 15:50:39 2010
From: wester6935 at comcast.net (Wester Potter)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 15:50:39 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Non LSR ... more sea to space
Message-ID: <B77E119A-B30E-4341-8D28-7EF838884428@comcast.net>

Here's one Dale Pulju must have missed.

http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2010-01/cannon-shooting-supplies-spa
ce

From saltfever at comcast.net  Thu Jan 21 23:03:21 2010
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 22:03:21 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Crush zone
Message-ID: <000001ca9b28$9a78de10$cf6a9a30$@net>

I see a lot of roll cages located to within an inch or two of the A and B
pillars and other body parts of cars. In fact I have seen comments on
Landracing.com indicating how difficult it was to get a cage in the car
without a big space between it and the body.

 

Why? With all of the NASCAR interest in crumble and crush zones and other
impact deforming structures why not have a very wide clearance between the
body and the cage? Wouldn't a large gap act as a crush zone and absorb some
of the energy. Does the driver's cage need to be close to the door?  

From mark at bradakis.com  Fri Jan 22 00:31:10 2010
From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 00:31:10 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Membership/e-mail
In-Reply-To: <F418D623F6E14DF5AC5A36ACE5E3517D@edc2750afa5a84>
References: <4B58ADCF.9080105@bradakis.com> <4B58C526.2020907@mayfco.com>
	<F418D623F6E14DF5AC5A36ACE5E3517D@edc2750afa5a84>
Message-ID: <4B59543E.4070909@bradakis.com>

23weldon wrote:
> Mayf -- Are you talking dollars per mph or cents per mph?

As the list admin, I would certainly appreciate dollars per mile!  But that
might be a bit much.  I like the idea of doing 10 cents a mile based on
your personal best.  146.7 mph - $14.67.  213.9, $21.39

I don't have handy the conversion chart to deal with furlongs per fortnight,
you'll have to work that out yourself.

mjb.

From saltfever at comcast.net  Fri Jan 22 02:06:17 2010
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 01:06:17 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
Message-ID: <000c01ca9b42$2871e4a0$7955ade0$@net>

I picked up some ''special'' tire valves this afternoon from a racing tire
distributor. He said a few folks are using them on their LSR tires. I have
never seen them before and would like your comments.

 

The usual steel valve is inserted from the inside and has a nut screwing
everything together from the outside (with a rubber gasket providing the
seal). These valves have a 1/8 NPT (tapered pipe thread). You just tap the
rim (carefully) and then screw them in from the outside. They are high
quality Schrader tank valves. There is no rubber gasket because the pipe
thread is self-sealing. I don't think any pipe thread is completely leak
proof but the dealer said red Locktite will do the job. There is no rubber
gasket which could be a failure point. What is your experience with the high
pressure (70psi) LSR tires? Is the screw in design as strong as the other
method?  TIA  :-) 

From kturk at adelphia.net  Fri Jan 22 03:52:30 2010
From: kturk at adelphia.net (Keith Turk)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 04:52:30 -0600
Subject: [Land-speed] Crush zone
References: <000001ca9b28$9a78de10$cf6a9a30$@net>
Message-ID: <92743CBFFB5742049C2B12F99F6883B2@keithhrijwmm4p>

Traditionally Nascar has something or someone else to hit... our concerns 
are a bit different ...  though I wouldn't say we don't have a Wall to worry 
about... having seen several cars tumble end for end...

In any case mostly the cage position is about the size of cars we like to 
run ... if your running a Lincoln then it's not much of an issue where you 
put the cage... but in a Berkeley... basically you build the smallest cage 
you can and wrap the car around it...

K 

From joetimney at dol.net  Fri Jan 22 05:52:17 2010
From: joetimney at dol.net (Joe Timney)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 07:52:17 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
In-Reply-To: <000c01ca9b42$2871e4a0$7955ade0$@net>
References: <000c01ca9b42$2871e4a0$7955ade0$@net>
Message-ID: <4B599F81.3090709@dol.net>

Speaking of screw in valve stems...I got this tip from a rim manufacturer:
Red or yellow color coded stems are ok, white or blue are not to be used 
for our application.
joe

Kirkwood wrote:
> I picked up some ''special'' tire valves this afternoon from a racing tire
> distributor. He said a few folks are using them on their LSR tires. I have
> never seen them before and would like your comments.
>
>  
>
> The usual steel valve is inserted from the inside and has a nut screwing
> everything together from the outside (with a rubber gasket providing the
> seal). These valves have a 1/8 NPT (tapered pipe thread). You just tap the
> rim (carefully) and then screw them in from the outside. They are high
> quality Schrader tank valves. There is no rubber gasket because the pipe
> thread is self-sealing. I don't think any pipe thread is completely leak
> proof but the dealer said red Locktite will do the job. There is no rubber
> gasket which could be a failure point. What is your experience with the high
> pressure (70psi) LSR tires? Is the screw in design as strong as the other
> method?  TIA  :-) 

From ddahlgren at snet.net  Fri Jan 22 06:28:55 2010
From: ddahlgren at snet.net (Dave Dahlgren)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 08:28:55 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
In-Reply-To: <4B599F81.3090709@dol.net>
References: <000c01ca9b42$2871e4a0$7955ade0$@net> <4B599F81.3090709@dol.net>
Message-ID: <762D4ACA8A2946F2AD4B1E112E3AE8B7@DaveSatellite>

Actually the previous design is mechanically more robust than any pipe 
thread could ever be where is the upgrade. If you doubt my reasoning install 
one of each in an out rim or pieve of steel and atack it it with a hammer or 
any other way that might put a side load on it and see for yourself. If I 
was a tech inspector no way would I pass an 1/8 inch pipe tire valve.
Dave
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Joe Timney" <joetimney at dol.net>
Cc: "land-speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 7:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Tire Valves


> Speaking of screw in valve stems...I got this tip from a rim manufacturer:
> Red or yellow color coded stems are ok, white or blue are not to be used 
> for our application.
> joe
>
> Kirkwood wrote:
>> I picked up some ''special'' tire valves this afternoon from a racing 
>> tire
>> distributor. He said a few folks are using them on their LSR tires. I 
>> have
>> never seen them before and would like your comments.
>>
>>
>> The usual steel valve is inserted from the inside and has a nut screwing
>> everything together from the outside (with a rubber gasket providing the
>> seal). These valves have a 1/8 NPT (tapered pipe thread). You just tap 
>> the
>> rim (carefully) and then screw them in from the outside. They are high
>> quality Schrader tank valves. There is no rubber gasket because the pipe
>> thread is self-sealing. I don't think any pipe thread is completely leak
>> proof but the dealer said red Locktite will do the job. There is no 
>> rubber
>> gasket which could be a failure point. What is your experience with the 
>> high
>> pressure (70psi) LSR tires? Is the screw in design as strong as the other
>> method?  TIA  :-)
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as ddahlgren at snet.net
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed 

From Mike.Meierle at alcatel-lucent.com  Fri Jan 22 06:55:23 2010
From: Mike.Meierle at alcatel-lucent.com (MEIERLE Mike)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 07:55:23 -0600
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
In-Reply-To: <762D4ACA8A2946F2AD4B1E112E3AE8B7@DaveSatellite>
References: <000c01ca9b42$2871e4a0$7955ade0$@net> <4B599F81.3090709@dol.net>
	<762D4ACA8A2946F2AD4B1E112E3AE8B7@DaveSatellite>
Message-ID: <7C6E77E36A1EAD4BAD7F02E98294BDB20D75D853@USDALSMBS01.ad3.ad.alcatel.com>

What he said... one dragged foot in the pit's and a flat tire and
screwed up rim....

Mike Meierle
Sr. Systems Engineer
Alcatel-Lucent

7751 Windsor Drive
Dublin, OH 43016
(614) 284-6229

-----Original Message-----
From: land-speed-bounces at autox.team.net
[mailto:land-speed-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Dave Dahlgren
Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 8:29 AM
To: Joe Timney
Cc: land-speed
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Tire Valves

Actually the previous design is mechanically more robust than any pipe
thread could ever be where is the upgrade. If you doubt my reasoning
install
one of each in an out rim or pieve of steel and atack it it with a
hammer or
any other way that might put a side load on it and see for yourself. If
I
was a tech inspector no way would I pass an 1/8 inch pipe tire valve.
Dave
----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe Timney" <joetimney at dol.net>
Cc: "land-speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Friday, January 22, 2010 7:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] Tire Valves


> Speaking of screw in valve stems...I got this tip from a rim
manufacturer:
> Red or yellow color coded stems are ok, white or blue are not to be
used
> for our application.
> joe
>
> Kirkwood wrote:
>> I picked up some ''special'' tire valves this afternoon from a racing

>> tire
>> distributor. He said a few folks are using them on their LSR tires. I

>> have
>> never seen them before and would like your comments.
>>
>>
>> The usual steel valve is inserted from the inside and has a nut
screwing
>> everything together from the outside (with a rubber gasket providing
the
>> seal). These valves have a 1/8 NPT (tapered pipe thread). You just
tap
>> the
>> rim (carefully) and then screw them in from the outside. They are
high
>> quality Schrader tank valves. There is no rubber gasket because the
pipe
>> thread is self-sealing. I don't think any pipe thread is completely
leak
>> proof but the dealer said red Locktite will do the job. There is no
>> rubber
>> gasket which could be a failure point. What is your experience with
the
>> high
>> pressure (70psi) LSR tires? Is the screw in design as strong as the
other
>> method?  TIA  :-)
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as ddahlgren at snet.net
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed
Land-speed mailing list

You are subscribed as mike.meierle at alcatel-lucent.com

http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From gmc6power at earthlink.net  Fri Jan 22 07:57:46 2010
From: gmc6power at earthlink.net (James Tone)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 06:57:46 -0800 (GMT-08:00)
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
Message-ID: <30765531.1264172266951.JavaMail.root@elwamui-karabash.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

2 threads on a steel wheel would not cut it for me with 70-80 psi behind it. No thanks..................



>
>I picked up some ''special'' tire valves this afternoon from a racing tire
>distributor. He said a few folks are using them on their LSR tires. I have
>never seen them before and would like your comments.
>
> 
>
>The usual steel valve is inserted from the inside and has a nut screwing
>everything together from the outside (with a rubber gasket providing the
>seal). These valves have a 1/8 NPT (tapered pipe thread). You just tap the
>rim (carefully) and then screw them in from the outside. They are high
>quality Schrader tank valves. There is no rubber gasket because the pipe
>thread is self-sealing. I don't think any pipe thread is completely leak
>proof but the dealer said red Locktite will do the job. There is no rubber
>gasket which could be a failure point. What is your experience with the high
>pressure (70psi) LSR tires? Is the screw in design as strong as the other
>method?  TIA  :-) 
>_______________________________________________
>Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
>Land-speed mailing list
>
>You are subscribed as gmc6power at earthlink.net
>
>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From desotoman at dslextreme.com  Fri Jan 22 13:20:00 2010
From: desotoman at dslextreme.com (desotoman @dslextreme.com)
Date: Fri, 22 Jan 2010 12:20:00 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] valve stems
Message-ID: <51a5f2e01001221220k69453500ia487de8b3f5e7a11@mail.gmail.com>

Before I pass judgment who is the manufacturer or brand name? I would like
to see what they look like.

Tom Gerardi

From saltfever at comcast.net  Sat Jan 23 01:34:55 2010
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2010 00:34:55 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
Message-ID: <000501ca9c06$f159a000$d40ce000$@net>

Thanks for all the comments so far. JT's comment got me thinking so I ran a
few numbers. My rims will be steel and either about .160'' or .190''
thickness. The vendor has mentioned both thicknesses! The 1/8 NPT is 27 TPI
making a thread about .037'' wide. So if I have the .160'' thick rim it will
engage about 4 threads. The nominal diameter of the thread is .405'' and  at
70 psi tire pressure there would be a blow-out force of about 9 lb. I doubt
that pressure is as big an issue as centrifugal force. But it is a force
applied in the correct direction! Centrifugal force is forcing the valve
into the rim and not out. If the rims are thicker then obviously more
threads would be engaged. As a first look, forces appear to be within
reason. But more about Dave's comment next  . . .

From saltfever at comcast.net  Sat Jan 23 01:35:10 2010
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2010 00:35:10 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves II
Message-ID: <000a01ca9c06$fa64b040$ef2e10c0$@net>

Dave I agree with you about the pipe thread. But the principal reason for
using it is to provide a POSITIVE mechanical joint with no leak path! So we
need to weigh your observation with the merits of both designs. Other steel
valves have a rubber grommet sealing the pressure as well as LOCATING the
stem in the hole! I'm sure there are different designs but in the ones I
have seen, the steel stem is surrounded by rubber in the hole. There is no
stiffness provided by metal-to-metal contact of the stem in the hole. The
stiffness comes from the clamping force provided by the nut on the valve
stem. JT, that nut usually has only about 4 or 5 threads on it! So the
question Dave raises would be an interesting test. Hitting the pipe thread
with enough force will cause a certain failure. But, in a pressurized tire,
hitting the rubber-located stem with the same force might cause a
catastrophic leak and failure as well.  Also, (depending on which side of
the rim the nut is located) the centrifugal force could be working AGAINST
that nut with only a few threads on it! I'm not criticizing either design .
. . just thinking out loud here and trying to understand all the issues.
Continued comments are encouraged and . . . thanks in advance.    :-)

From joetimney at dol.net  Sat Jan 23 07:28:03 2010
From: joetimney at dol.net (Joe Timney)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2010 09:28:03 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
In-Reply-To: <000501ca9c06$f159a000$d40ce000$@net>
References: <000501ca9c06$f159a000$d40ce000$@net>
Message-ID: <4B5B0773.7050007@dol.net>

Wall thickness concerns...add two bosses, 180 degrees apart on the 
inside of rim, drill and tap one and balance the rim before adding the tire.

Kirkwood wrote:
> Thanks for all the comments so far. JT's comment got me thinking so I ran a
> few numbers. My rims will be steel and either about .160'' or .190''
> thickness. The vendor has mentioned both thicknesses! The 1/8 NPT is 27 TPI
> making a thread about .037'' wide. So if I have the .160'' thick rim it will
> engage about 4 threads. The nominal diameter of the thread is .405'' and  at
> 70 psi tire pressure there would be a blow-out force of about 9 lb. I doubt
> that pressure is as big an issue as centrifugal force. But it is a force
> applied in the correct direction! Centrifugal force is forcing the valve
> into the rim and not out. If the rims are thicker then obviously more
> threads would be engaged. As a first look, forces appear to be within
> reason. But more about Dave's comment next  . . .
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as joetimney at dol.net
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From saltfever at comcast.net  Sat Jan 23 14:25:16 2010
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2010 13:25:16 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
Message-ID: <000a01ca9c72$8f5a6030$ae0f2090$@net>

Thanks, JT. . .  good idea. I also checked the Machinery's handbook and the
recommended engagement for hand tight is .161'' which is about 4-5 threads.
For high pressure they say ''longer thread engagement is used''  but give no
recommendation. Me thinks added thickness is a good idea. 

From: Joe Timney <joetimney at dol.net>

Wall thickness concerns...add two bosses, 180 degrees apart on the inside of
rim, drill and tap one and balance the rim before adding the tire.

From saltfever at comcast.net  Sat Jan 23 14:30:37 2010
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2010 13:30:37 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
Message-ID: <000f01ca9c73$4e37c3d0$eaa74b70$@net>

Am I missing sumptin here? Paragraph 4 on page 19 says ''metal CAPS shall be
fitted to all tire valve stems''. There is no mention of replacing rubber
stems with steel. Not that I want to; but can you still use rubber valve
stems?

From DAW1 at comcast.net  Sat Jan 23 16:13:51 2010
From: DAW1 at comcast.net (DAW1)
Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2010 18:13:51 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
In-Reply-To: <000a01ca9c72$8f5a6030$ae0f2090$@net>
References: <000a01ca9c72$8f5a6030$ae0f2090$@net>
Message-ID: <07CF908FD03644F6B35EC8908918526C@SallyPC>

As a machinist  I would recommend useing a thread gauge when you tap the 
holes too, so you have the correct engagement. doug
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Kirkwood" <saltfever at comcast.net>
To: "land-speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Saturday, January 23, 2010 4:25 PM
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves


> Thanks, JT. . .  good idea. I also checked the Machinery's handbook and 
> the
> recommended engagement for hand tight is .161'' which is about 4-5 
> threads.
> For high pressure they say ''longer thread engagement is used''  but give 
> no
> recommendation. Me thinks added thickness is a good idea.
>
> From: Joe Timney <joetimney at dol.net>
>
> Wall thickness concerns...add two bosses, 180 degrees apart on the inside 
> of
> rim, drill and tap one and balance the rim before adding the tire.
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as daw1 at comcast.net
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed 

From saltrat at pahrump.com  Sun Jan 24 08:28:53 2010
From: saltrat at pahrump.com (Skip Higginbotham)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2010 07:28:53 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Old Bakersfield photos
In-Reply-To: <0E6170EB5C2846E68BC46D976523FD42@denpc>
References: <0E6170EB5C2846E68BC46D976523FD42@denpc>
Message-ID: <20100124152905.74A4418765F@autox.team.net>

Yes, Jim I did identify a few of them. Really brings back memories! 
But I didn't see my 1959 1320 record holding A/R tilt body roadster 
in there....bummer! The Reath A/H roadster and ours were on the cover 
of Drag News in '59. I wonder if the pics were from '58 and earlier? 
I also have been looking for any photos of my E/S streamliner from 
"63-"64 at Speedweek. Does anyone have a picture of the little green 
car? Lots of folks including Mickey Thompson helped me with that one. 
It was a record setter albeit not very fast. I would really like to 
have one for my scrap book.
Any help will be appreciated!
Thanks,
Skip





At 05:35 AM 1/20/2010, Jim Dincau wrote:
>Those were the days........ I will bet Skip can identify some of them
>
>http://www.nitrogeezers.com/John%20Moore%20Photos%201.htm
>_______________________________________________
>Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
>Land-speed mailing list
>
>You are subscribed as saltrat at pahrump.com
>
>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From dmirror3 at yahoo.com  Sun Jan 24 09:45:30 2010
From: dmirror3 at yahoo.com (Dale Krumheuer)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2010 08:45:30 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
In-Reply-To: <000f01ca9c73$4e37c3d0$eaa74b70$@net>
Message-ID: <163796.14257.qm@web58006.mail.re3.yahoo.com>

The metal valve stem caps replacing a plastic caps are a different issue apart
from  rubber valve stems.

Quality metal valve stem caps have a gasket to better seal the valve stem.
When you think about why that matters, picture the centrifugal force exerted
on the center pin of a Schraeder valve. The faster the wheel spins,
centrifugal force increases. The centrifugal load  on  the center pin of a
Schraeder valve can cause the valve to partially open. Having a quality metal
cap with a gasket will reduce (not stop) air escape through the valve stem.

Metal valve stems are in use on tubeless motorcycle wheels. Motorcycle wheels
are not threaded for accepting the valve stem.
Metal motorcycle valve stems are threaded on the exterior, securing/clamping
the stem through the wheel with gaskets and nuts.

For automotive use, I still prefer a quality rubber valve stem for
flexibility, with a metal cap. For a motorcycle, metal stems are protected
from accidental impact as they are generally in the center of the wheel, out
of harms way.

Dale
Cleveland OH






Wisdom begins in wonder.Socrates


--- On Sat, 1/23/10, Kirkwood <saltfever at comcast.net> wrote:

From: Kirkwood <saltfever at comcast.net>
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
To: "land-speed" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Date: Saturday, January 23, 2010, 4:30 PM

Am I missing sumptin here? Paragraph 4 on page 19 says ''metal CAPS shall be
fitted to all tire valve stems''. There is no mention of replacing rubber
stems with steel. Not that I want to; but can you still use rubber valve
stems?
Land-speed mailing list

You are subscribed as dmirror3 at yahoo.com

http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From Rick at RBMotorsports.com  Sun Jan 24 12:36:30 2010
From: Rick at RBMotorsports.com (Rick Byrnes)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2010 14:36:30 -0500
Subject: [Land-speed] Teacher arrested
Message-ID: <015601ca9d2c$88489360$6601a8c0@Rick>

A public school teacher was arrested today at John F. Kennedy International
Airport as he attempted to board a flight while in possession of a ruler, a
protractor, a compass, a slide-rule, and a calculator.  At a morning press
conference, the Attorney General said he believes the man is a
member of the notorious 'Al-Gebra' movement. He did not identify the man, who
has been charged by the FBI with carrying weapons of math instruction.

'Al-Gebra is a problem for us', the Attorney General said. 'They derive
solutions by means and extremes, and sometimes go off on tangents in search of
absolute values. They use secret code names like 'X' and 'Y' and refer to
themselves as 'unknowns', but we have determined that they
belong to a common denominator of the axis of medieval with coordinates in
every country.'
As the Greek philanderer Isosceles used to say, 'There are 3 sides to every
triangle'.

When asked to comment on the arrest, President Obama said, 'If God had wanted
us to have better weapons of math instruction, he would have given us more
fingers and toes..'  White House aides told reporters they could not recall a
more intelligent or profound statement by the President.
It is believed that the Nobel Prize for Physics will follow.

From mark at bradakis.com  Sun Jan 24 12:58:11 2010
From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2010 12:58:11 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] Teacher arrested
In-Reply-To: <015601ca9d2c$88489360$6601a8c0@Rick>
References: <015601ca9d2c$88489360$6601a8c0@Rick>
Message-ID: <4B5CA653.7080004@bradakis.com>

Rick Byrnes wrote:
>  he would have given us more fingers and toes..'  

I'm not allowed to play blackjack in any of the Wendover casinos anymore.
In order to count to 21 I have to drop my pants.

mjb.

From jdincau at qnet.com  Sun Jan 24 18:34:14 2010
From: jdincau at qnet.com (Jim Dincau)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2010 17:34:14 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Skips car
Message-ID: <2B52EEC5DCEA4680B9A2B03503E8035B@denpc>

 Skip,
 Is this It? Follow the link to a thread on the land speed web site. Someone 
is posting his dad's pictures.
Jim

http://www.landracing.com/forum/index.php/topic,5202.900.html 


[demime removed a uuencoded section named index.jpg which was 94 lines]

From jdincau at qnet.com  Sun Jan 24 18:39:22 2010
From: jdincau at qnet.com (Jim Dincau)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2010 17:39:22 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] More info Skip's car
Message-ID: <717060C27524455DA65081598459E146@denpc>

Skip,
     The guy posting the pictures is Gary Cole, Dwayne's son. He is in 
Gardnerville Nevada.
Jim 

From dmirror3 at yahoo.com  Sun Jan 24 20:07:49 2010
From: dmirror3 at yahoo.com (Dale Krumheuer)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2010 19:07:49 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Land-speed] Skips car
In-Reply-To: <2B52EEC5DCEA4680B9A2B03503E8035B@denpc>
Message-ID: <390256.19193.qm@web58006.mail.re3.yahoo.com>

nice job Jim, hope this will help with the search for more information
Dale
Cleveland OH

Wisdom begins in wonder.Socrates 


--- On Sun, 1/24/10, Jim Dincau <jdincau at qnet.com> wrote:

From: Jim Dincau <jdincau at qnet.com>
Subject: [Land-speed] Skips car
To: "land Speed List" <land-speed at autox.team.net>, "Skip Higginbotham" <saltrat at pahrump.com>
Date: Sunday, January 24, 2010, 8:34 PM

 Skip,
 Is this It? Follow the link to a thread on the land speed web site. Someone 
is posting his dad's pictures.
Jim

From saltfever at comcast.net  Sun Jan 24 23:36:58 2010
From: saltfever at comcast.net (Kirkwood)
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2010 22:36:58 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
In-Reply-To: <mailman.17.1264359603.6213.land-speed@autox.team.net>
References: <mailman.17.1264359603.6213.land-speed@autox.team.net>
Message-ID: <000401ca9d88$cbad0f30$63072d90$@net>

Thanks, Dale. Makes a lot of sense. So the same force wants to bend the
rubber stem over, no? Why do you want flexibility at LSR speeds?

From: Dale Krumheuer <dmirror3 at yahoo.com>
The faster the wheel spins, centrifugal force increases. The centrifugal
load  on the center pin of a Schraeder valve can cause the valve to
partially open. Having a quality metal cap with a gasket will reduce (not
stop) air escape through the valve stem.

From saltrat at pahrump.com  Mon Jan 25 07:34:45 2010
From: saltrat at pahrump.com (Skip Higginbotham)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2010 06:34:45 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Skips car
In-Reply-To: <2B52EEC5DCEA4680B9A2B03503E8035B@denpc>
References: <2B52EEC5DCEA4680B9A2B03503E8035B@denpc>
Message-ID: <20100125143455.A5F2D187645@autox.team.net>

Hi Jim,
Yes it is the car. Built it when I was going to college. Thanks for 
looking for it! I'll see if I can get in touch with Gary. And I'll go 
look at the link.
Thanks again,
Skip (-:






At 05:34 PM 1/24/2010, Jim Dincau wrote:
>  Skip,
>  Is this It? Follow the link to a thread on the land speed web site. Someone
>is posting his dad's pictures.
>Jim
>
>http://www.landracing.com/forum/index.php/topic,5202.900.html

From jet at pistonsandrods.com  Mon Jan 25 08:31:35 2010
From: jet at pistonsandrods.com (Jet Fuel)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2010 07:31:35 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Tire Valves
In-Reply-To: <163796.14257.qm@web58006.mail.re3.yahoo.com>
References: <000f01ca9c73$4e37c3d0$eaa74b70$@net>
	<163796.14257.qm@web58006.mail.re3.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <e8fdd711001250731x16cfa16fp57831531d9a459e7@mail.gmail.com>

On Sun, Jan 24, 2010 at 8:45 AM, Dale Krumheuer <dmirror3 at yahoo.com> wrote:

> When you think about why that matters, picture the centrifugal force
> exerted
> on the center pin of a Schraeder valve. The faster the wheel spins,
> centrifugal force increases. The centrifugal load  on  the center pin of a
> Schraeder valve can cause the valve to partially open.



...and that's precisely what happened to John Howard when he was motorpacing
behind the modified Vesco streamliner on a BICYCLE to achieve his record of
152.2 mph.

He was losing tire pressure during initial runs. Sealed steel caps solved
the problem.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmpxJWAJbFM

-The Other Glen (SCTA 966B)

From saltrat at pahrump.com  Mon Jan 25 16:06:16 2010
From: saltrat at pahrump.com (Skip Higginbotham)
Date: Mon, 25 Jan 2010 15:06:16 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] Old Bakersfield photos
In-Reply-To: <45ac72e91001242019j177db322if572ae9d49b8bc7a@mail.gmail.co
  m>
References: <0E6170EB5C2846E68BC46D976523FD42@denpc>
	<20100124152905.74A4418765F@autox.team.net>
	<45ac72e91001242019j177db322if572ae9d49b8bc7a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20100125230632.3C7B3187653@autox.team.net>

Hi Bob,
I didn't know a Pete Dean nor the roadster "Mother's Cookies" I am 
sorry to say. Most all of my drag racing was centered around the 
central valley of California. I didn't venture much farther south 
than San Fernando. Also, I didn't start racing until '56. We ran a 
'49 Ford with a 392 Chry in it, a '31 A coupe with a Ford in it, the 
'29A roadster with a blown 450 Chry in it and a '27 T roadster on a 
Scottie Fenn chassis and the blown Chry from '56 to '62.
My home track was Famoso and most of my wins and all national records 
we set were set there or Great Bend, Ks. First win was A/Gas coupe at 
Inyokern in '56.

I ran the little green #44 streamliner during '65-'66 although I hit 
the wrong keys and said '63-'64 earlier. The blown Chry was in Bob 
Herda's car in '63 and I crewed on the Sanchez Stude
#400 in '61 and '62 with Clark Cagle.
Skip




At 08:19 PM 1/24/2010, Robert J. Denton wrote:
>Skip,
>
>I'm restoring a '31 roadster called "Mother's Cookies." I was built 
>and run by Pete Dean from San Diego during the late forties or early 
>fifties.. He belonged to the San Diego roadster club. Did you know 
>him? The car? I am trying find out anything about the car.
>
>Bob Denton
>
>On Sun, Jan 24, 2010 at 10:28 AM, Skip Higginbotham 
><<mailto:saltrat at pahrump.com>saltrat at pahrump.com> wrote:
>Yes, Jim I did identify a few of them. Really brings back memories! 
>But I didn't see my 1959 1320 record holding A/R tilt body roadster 
>in there....bummer! The Reath A/H roadster and ours were on the 
>cover of Drag News in '59. I wonder if the pics were from '58 and 
>earlier? I also have been looking for any photos of my E/S 
>streamliner from "63-"64 at Speedweek. Does anyone have a picture of 
>the little green car? Lots of folks including Mickey Thompson helped 
>me with that one. It was a record setter albeit not very fast. I 
>would really like to have one for my scrap book.
>Any help will be appreciated!
>Thanks,
>Skip
>
>
>
>
>
>At 05:35 AM 1/20/2010, Jim Dincau wrote:
>Those were the days........ I will bet Skip can identify some of them
>
><http://www.nitrogeezers.com/John%20Moore%20Photos%201.htm>http://www.nitrogeezers.com/John%20Moore%20Photos%201.htm
>_______________________________________________
>Support 
>Team.Net  <http://www.team.net/donate.html>http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
>Land-speed mailing list
>
>You are subscribed as <mailto:saltrat at pahrump.com>saltrat at pahrump.com
>
>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed
>
>_______________________________________________
>Support 
>Team.Net  <http://www.team.net/donate.html>http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
>Land-speed mailing list
>
>You are subscribed as <mailto:rjdenton479 at gmail.com>rjdenton479 at gmail.com
>
>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed
>
>
>
>
>--
>Photography website
><http://bobdenton.net>bobdenton.net
>
>Everybody is entitled to their own opinions, but not their own facts.

From drmayf at mayfco.com  Sun Jan 31 18:16:37 2010
From: drmayf at mayfco.com (drmayf)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 17:16:37 -0800
Subject: [Land-speed] No News, Good News?
Message-ID: <4B662B75.4040301@mayfco.com>

It has been silent on the list. Was I finally kicked off of it?  Wonder 
why it took so long...

mayf

From saltfevr at q.com  Sun Jan 31 18:32:39 2010
From: saltfevr at q.com (Tom Shannon)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 18:32:39 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] No News, Good News?
In-Reply-To: <4B662B75.4040301@mayfco.com>
References: <4B662B75.4040301@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <SNT126-W12115F867ADAA964C02AA0C9580@phx.gbl>

Mayf:



You're still part of us bud!!

 Guess everyone is busy starting their annual taxes? LOL

I just found my monthly Feb. Harbor Freight ad in the mailbox. As KT says,
"Life is good".

Tom Shannon
Magna, Utah




> Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 17:16:37 -0800
> From: drmayf at mayfco.com
> To: land-speed at autox.team.net
> Subject: [Land-speed] No News, Good News?
>
> It has been silent on the list. Was I finally kicked off of it? Wonder
> why it took so long...
>
> mayf
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Land-speed mailing list
>
> You are subscribed as saltfevr at q.com
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From neil at dbelltech.com  Sun Jan 31 18:59:29 2010
From: neil at dbelltech.com (Neil Albaugh)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 18:59:29 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] No News, Good News?
In-Reply-To: <4B662B75.4040301@mayfco.com>
References: <4B662B75.4040301@mayfco.com>
Message-ID: <38EC0C9146634416ABDDFC15BC40179D@tiger>

You're still on it, Mayf----or I'm off too.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

--------------------------------------------------
From: "drmayf" <drmayf at mayfco.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 6:16 PM
To: "LSR" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Subject: [Land-speed] No News, Good News?

> It has been silent on the list. Was I finally kicked off of it?  Wonder 
> why it took so long...
> 
> mayf
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
> 
> Land-speed mailing list
> 
> You are subscribed as neil at dbelltech.com
> 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed

From speedtimer at beyondbb.com  Sun Jan 31 19:03:36 2010
From: speedtimer at beyondbb.com (speedtimer at beyondbb.com)
Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2010 19:03:36 -0700
Subject: [Land-speed] No News, Good News?
In-Reply-To: <38EC0C9146634416ABDDFC15BC40179D@tiger>
References: <4B662B75.4040301@mayfco.com>
	<38EC0C9146634416ABDDFC15BC40179D@tiger>
Message-ID: <F911B49A813A44E79DADDBB48A12B127@GlenPC>

Were all alive, just been quiet on the site.
Glen
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Neil Albaugh" <neil at dbelltech.com>
To: <drmayf at mayfco.com>; "LSR" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 6:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Land-speed] No News, Good News?


> You're still on it, Mayf----or I'm off too.
> 
> Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
> 
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "drmayf" <drmayf at mayfco.com>
> Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 6:16 PM
> To: "LSR" <land-speed at autox.team.net>
> Subject: [Land-speed] No News, Good News?
> 
>> It has been silent on the list. Was I finally kicked off of it?  Wonder 
>> why it took so long...
>> 
>> mayf
>> _______________________________________________
>> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> 
>> Land-speed mailing list
>> 
>> You are subscribed as neil at dbelltech.com
>> 
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net  http://www.team.net/donate.html
> 
> Land-speed mailing list
> 
> You are subscribed as speedtimer at beyondbb.com
> 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/land-speed