[Healeys] Leaking rear hub flange

cjerryadams at yahoo.com cjerryadams at yahoo.com
Sat Jun 29 12:38:01 MDT 2019 

I used a grocery paper sack to make a gasket with. That was 45 years ago before I knew of sources. All BMC dealers had quit selling Healey parts by then. Gasket still in place no leaks no problem.
Jerry
BN2

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 28, 2019, at 9:12 AM, Michael Oritt <michael.oritt at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Steve--
> 
> In light of your email of yesterday telling me you felt that a paper gasket measuring .015" was too thick to provide sufficient grip between the abutment shoulder and hub flange to prfevent a spun bearing, this morning I removed the left axle shaft to check the amount of protrusion of the outer race beyond the face of the Moss gasket that I recently installed.  I was able to pass a .004" feeler leaf--but no more--between the face of the hub bearing's outer race and the face of the hub plus paper gasket, which is within the specification. 
> 
> Maybe this is due to the paper gasket's having already been under compression since I installed it last week, and do you think that perhaps this critical measurement needs to be made after one assembly/disassembly of the axle shaft to the hub, as obviously the gasket is going to compress a bit under torquing?  
> 
> BTW I measured a new, spare paper gasket that came along with the one installed and it is .014" thick.  In any case thanks for focusing on this issue and I feel better knowing that apparently all is okay.
> 
> Best--Michael Oritt
> 
>> On Thu, Jun 27, 2019 at 5:22 PM Michael Oritt <michael.oritt at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Steve--
>> 
>> I'm going to check my setup tomorrow morning.  I'm also going to see if I can find my expensive micrometer versus the cheap HF one....  Thanks in any case for the tip.
>> 
>> Bear--Michael
>> 
>>> On Thu, Jun 27, 2019 at 3:21 PM Steve Gerow <sgerow2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> OK, that's too thick and will allow the bearing to spin. Per my experiments it needs to be .003" - .004" in order to work. I made mine out of copier paper, using the Moss as a pattern.
>>> 
>>>> On Thu, Jun 27, 2019 at 8:48 AM Michael Oritt <michael.oritt at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Steve--
>>>> 
>>>> The new paper gasket from Moss mike's to about .015"
>>>> 
>>>>> On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 11:07 PM Steve Gerow <sgerow2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Maybe they've thinned it down. I reported my findings to Michael Grant, QA Mgr at Moss at the time (since retired).
>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 6:04 PM Michael Oritt <michael.oritt at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Steve--
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I began seeing a slightly oily "footprint" under my left rear tire a few weeks ago and figured I would have to replace the lip seal.  However when I removed the axle I found that there was no paper gasket between the axle flange and the hub, nor any trace of one, nor was there an O ring!
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> My memory is not the best but i know that in the 15 or so years and 60K miles since the car was professionally restored I have never pulled an axle on nor had any leaks from either rear hub.  If there was a paper gasket or O ring or sealant it was all gone and the only thing providing any seal at all was the metal-to-metal contact
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> After cleaning everything up and putting in an O ring and paper gasket coated with hylomar I thought that I had better check the oil level as I expected it to be down from the leak.  Amazingly the oil level was almost up to the very top with no need to add any at all.  So I closed everything up and as I said in my previous post I have probably driven 30-50 miles since with no leak.  
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> BTW the paper gasket that Moss supplies is very thin though I did not mike it.  I have a spare and will do so tomorrow and will let you know.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Best--Michael
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> IO
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 5:07 PM Steve Gerow <sgerow2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>> ...or before any trips. How thick was the old gasket you removed?
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 2:04 PM Steve Gerow <sgerow2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>> What started me thinking was I had leaking seal and a spun bearing. Spoke with Tom Monaco (tom's toys) and he said he'd replaced 80+ of those bearings which didn't sound right to me. He said the heat from the spun bearing ate the seal. So I performed the experiment shown in my gallery pix and reviewed the section in the manual - both of which made it obvious what was happening.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Your fix may last for a while or forever - dunno. Did you have to freeze the bearing and heat the hub to install the bearing? If so it'll probably stay for a while.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Might just want to budget time to check it out after the summer driving season.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 1:56 PM Michael Oritt <michael.oritt at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> BTW just last week i put in a Moss paper gasket and hylomar to stop a slight leak at the flange. Not recognizing the issue I did not think to check clearance.  I have driven the car perhaps 25-30 miles since with no problem or further leakage so I guess I am asking whether you think the issue would by now have presented itself if the gasket were clamping the bearing race?  Or do I need to tear everything apart again?
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Best--Michael
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 4:51 PM Michael Oritt <michael.oritt at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Steve--
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Later 100's such as mine have the same rear axle, etc. so this would not be unique to 6 cylinder cars.  In any case I think I get the picture....
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks--Michael
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 4:43 PM Steve Gerow <sgerow2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>> Also maybe this problem isn't occurring on the 100s.
>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Jun 25, 2019, 1:28 PM Michael Oritt <michael.oritt at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>> Steve--
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> Offlist....  Please explain why a too-thick paper gasket would cause the bearing to spin?  Wouldn't it simply create more space between the inner face of the axle shaft flange and the outer face of the hub, which in any case should ride correctly on the end of the axle housing/bearing surface regardless?  Or does it somehow clamp the inner race of the hub bearing, but if so how and why?
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>> Best--Michael
>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Jun 25, 2019 at 4:13 PM Steve Gerow <sgerow2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Neil,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Leaking axle seals are often caused by spun bearings. Use of too-thick Moss cardboard gaskets causes bearing to be insufficiently gripped (as specified in the manual). Heat from spun bearing causes seal to leak. Therefore replacing the seal is not sufficient unless you correct the gasket / spun bearing situation.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> For documentation, see:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://pbase.com/stevegerow/healey_rear_bearing
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: Neil McDonald <nmcd10 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: Healey List <Healeys at autox.team.net>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Cc: 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Bcc: 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2019 10:45:57 -0700
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [Healeys] Leaking Rear Hub Flange
>>>>>>>>>>>>> A lot of list chatter about how to stop oil leaks at the rear hub flange by replacing the paper gasket or using goo of some sort. Am I right in thinking that fitting a new oil seal inboard of the wheel bearing makes this issue redundant, or is this not necessarily the case?
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Neil
>>>>>>>>>>>>> BN6
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Steve Gerow
>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
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>>>>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>>> Steve
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>> Steve
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> -- 
>>>>> Steve
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> Steve
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