[Healeys] FW: Radiator flush
Bob Spidell
bspidell at comcast.net
Mon Apr 8 19:48:17 MDT 2019
To be totally a-retentive, water is called the 'Universal Solvent'
because it will dissolve many /inorganic/ compounds--esp. 'salts'--as
they are polar compounds (one side of the molecule is positive, and one
side is negative, and the H+/OH- ions in water will 'pull' the salt
apart into its constituent ions and dissolve it). Water is a
particularly lousy solvent of organic (non-polar) compounds; try mixing
vegetable or motor oil with it sometime.
Water is not an oxidizing agent--it is the product of an
oxidation/reduction reaction itself between hydrogen and oxygen--but
when it has polar salts dissolved in it it does conduct current, which
facilitates oxidation-reduction reactions (e.g. 'rust'). Distilled
water will dissolve more salts than (most) tap water, as the tap water
is already further along in saturation. I've heard people say distilled
water is 'ion hungry,' which, for the life of me I don't understand
(unless they mean it will dissolve a bigger pile of salt than really
hard water, which is true).
bs
On 4/8/2019 3:32 PM, WILLIAM B LAWRENCE wrote:
> I have to agree with the theory that grounding can affect an alloy
> radiator. If you have a problem with corrosion despite using corrosion
> inhibitors then the problem is not the fluid component of the system
> it is more likely electrolytic corrosion. Maybe the problem isn't
> engine to chassis grounding, but radiator to chassis grounding. It
> sounds like some effort needs to be made to isolate the radiator
> (electrically) from the chassis. or to neutralize the electrolytic
> forces in the system.
>
> Either keeping the radiator out of the electrical loop or assuring it
> is on the cathode side seems to be a good idea since aluminum is much
> lower on the noble scale than iron. In a positive ground system the
> chassis is the anode and if the radiator is grounded to the chassis it
> will also be an anode and will thus be subject to electrolytic
> corrosion. (The anode, positive pole, in any circuit gives up
> electrons which carry the electrical current. Loss of large numbers of
> electrons weakens the atomic structure of anode material and causes it
> to break down or corrode.)
>
> I don't think that distilled water is necessary and as a matter of
> fact distilled water should be considered more corrosive than tap
> water. Water has the propensity to oxidize most other types of
> materials (universal solvent and all that) and distilled water has
> more of that propensity than harder water because in that case it has
> been partially saturated by dissolved minerals. The argument for
> distilled water is that it carries no calcium or other minerals into
> the cooling system which might eventually foul the heat exchange
> surfaces. That is a minor danger and would only be a problem if you
> were adding large volumes of water on a regular basis. If your cooling
> system is tight it should never be a problem.
>
> Bill Lawrence
> BN1 #554
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* Healeys <healeys-bounces at autox.team.net> on behalf of Michael
> Salter <michael.salter at gmail.com>
> *Sent:* Monday, April 8, 2019 5:34 PM
> *To:* Robert Begani
> *Cc:* healeys at autox.team.net
> *Subject:* Re: [Healeys] FW: Radiator flush
> Much and all as that sounds like a good theory I am having difficulty
> with the logic.
> A starter won't work if an engine isn't adequately grounded and a
> ground of sufficient size to operate a starter will definitely be big
> enough to eliminate any EMF difference between the engine and the
> chassis.
> I've had an aluminum radiator corrode to worthlessness after only 3
> years, with corrosion inhibitors in the coolant, and have yet to hear
> a realistic explanation for why it happened.
>
> M
>
> On Mon, Apr 8, 2019, 11:56 AM Robert Begani, <rfbegani at gmail.com
> <mailto:rfbegani at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Back to the matter of using Distilled Water. I discussed this
> comment with my German/American friend who was installing a
> aluminum radiator in his Lagonda Drop Head Coup. He has owned
> various European Vehicles with aluminum radiators, and classic
> cars with aluminum radiators. He cannot understand the need for
> distilled water if you are using antifreeze which includes
> anti-corrosion additives or using such additive separately.
> Furthermore, the biggest problem with alloy radiators is the
> matter of a good grounded engine. His experience the failure of
> the alloy radiator is a poorly grounded engine which causes the
> electric current to run to ground via the water in coolant system
> hence destroy the aluminum being dissimilar metal. So check the
> soundness of the ground.
>
> Bob Begani
>
> BJ8 67
>
> *From:* Healeys <healeys-bounces at autox.team.net
> <mailto:healeys-bounces at autox.team.net>> *On Behalf Of *Michael Salter
> *Sent:* Wednesday, April 3, 2019 5:51 PM
> *To:* David Nock BCS <healeydoc at sbcglobal.net
> <mailto:healeydoc at sbcglobal.net>>
> *Cc:* Ahealey help <healeys at autox.team.net
> <mailto:healeys at autox.team.net>>; i erbs <eyera3000 at gmail.com
> <mailto:eyera3000 at gmail.com>>
> *Subject:* Re: [Healeys] Radiator flush
>
> " If you are installing a alloy radiator be sure and use Distilled
> water"
>
> Those are definitely the words of someone who "has suffered the
> consequences" ...
>
> M
>
> On Wed, Apr 3, 2019 at 5:47 PM David Nock BCS
> <healeydoc at sbcglobal.net <mailto:healeydoc at sbcglobal.net>> wrote:
>
> If you are installing a alloy radiator be sure and use
> Distilled water.
>
> The water flows thru the radiator top to bottom. It flows thru
> the heater from the lower hose thru the heater returning to
> the head.
>
> Water will not flow backwards thru the heater valve.
>
> David Nock
> British Car Specialists
> 209-948-8767
> www.britishcarspecialists.com
> <http://www.britishcarspecialists.com>
>
> *From:*i erbs <mailto:eyera3000 at gmail.com>
>
> *Sent:*Wednesday, April 03, 2019 11:10 AM
>
> *To:*Ahealey help <mailto:healeys at autox.team.net>
>
> *Subject:*[Healeys] Radiator flush
>
> Hello all, __
>
> Preparing to install my alum radiator. Thought I would flush
> the cooling system.
>
> Which diretion direction does water flow? From block though
> Shut off vavle into heater core, or through pipe and back into
> block through the shut off valve?
>
> Is my valve in open ir closed position? Heater controls not
> reinstalled yet. Unit get hot so Ill asume open, but want to
> confirm. Removed thermostat to help water flush ststem easier.
> Im going to add extra hose and splice in a water hose bib.
> That way I can remove it and put system back in place.
>
> Im off this week, but the rain gods are laughing at me. So I'm
> just getting everything ready for the sweet spot of having
> time and sunshine so I can back the car out of the garage and
> flush the system. I plan to drain the anti freeze and fill
> with flush chemicals and water when I'm ready to flush. Bought
> new anti freeze for my new radiator.
>
> Driving season is fast approaching.
>
> Happy roads and saftey fast
>
> Ira Erbs
> Portland, OR
> typos and artifacts are the fault of my phone
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
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