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<DIV>to further complicate, the lobe center may not be at the</DIV>
<DIV>point of maximum lift.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>art de armond</DIV>
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<DIV style="font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=fot@autox.team.net
href="mailto:fot@autox.team.net">patrickmannion1--- via Fot</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, October 25, 2017 10:25 PM</DIV>
<DIV><B>To:</B> <A title=duncan.charlton54@gmail.com
href="mailto:duncan.charlton54@gmail.com">duncan.charlton54@gmail.com</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Cc:</B> <A title=fot@autox.team.net
href="mailto:fot@autox.team.net">fot@autox.team.net</A> </DIV>
<DIV><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Fot] Re TR4 camshafts</DIV></DIV></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></DIV>
<DIV
style='FONT-SIZE: small; TEXT-DECORATION: none; FONT-FAMILY: "Calibri"; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; COLOR: #000000; FONT-STYLE: normal; DISPLAY: inline'>
<DIV>Hi Duncan, John and all,</DIV>
<DIV>I sent the proper information to Newmans in June and again this week but
haven't had any response.I was wrong when I posted the lift figure, on Monday.
When I didn't get a response from Newman in June with accurate timing events I
through my notes in a box and misread them the other night, the lift was
actually .015" less than specified in lift at cam which would be .022" less lift
at the valve.</DIV>
<DIV>The total lift, rise figure at TDC, and the figure at which max rise should
occur did not match what their website specified. The two sentence response from
them was like a politician saying "trust me", it only stated</DIV><PRE>"The best way to set the camshaft is that you have maximum valve lift on the
inlet 110° after top dead centre" with no other information to second verify events</PRE>
<DIV>In the past when we've ever had a figure on a timing card that didn't match
our cam grinder would get back and be able to say, check timing events at this
lift and verify by checking lobe centers and he would give you ways to verify
that all was correct. His cams always worked great.</DIV>
<DIV>I have three different types of cams, I'm going to plot and graph them
later in the week but will just use a camshaft from now on from a source I
trust.</DIV>
<DIV>thanks for you responses</DIV>
<DIV>Pat Mannion, Santa Cruz<BR><BR>---------- Original Message
----------<BR>From: Duncan Charlton <duncan.charlton54@gmail.com><BR>To:
Triumph 'Friends of Triumph <fot@autox.team.net><BR>Cc:
patrickmannion1@netzero.com<BR>Subject: Re: [Fot] Re TR4 camshafts<BR>Date: Tue,
24 Oct 2017 06:50:56 -0500<BR><BR>
<P>Hi Patrick,</P>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>You didn’t say whether you determined how many degrees of advance/retard
you’re putting in by setting max lift at 110˚ ATDC. Confirming that figure
ought to give you some confidence that what they’re telling you is in the
ballpark. 2 to 4 degrees advance seems appropriate for a street
engine.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Since you've been in the business for a while (I’ve heard your name in
Morgan circles for many years) I assume you already have the tools and knowledge
to do this, so I won’t go into a long-winded description of the process, but for
those reading this who haven’t done this before: put a degree wheel on the
crank, zero it at true TDC and measure lift at the cam or at the valve using a
dial indicator, starting a few degrees before max lift and ending a few degrees
after max lift to be sure you’ve found mean maximum lift. Do this for both
intake and exhaust and calculate the midpoint between those two mean maximum
lift points. That gives you the cam's “zero” point. Decide whether
to advance or retard a few degrees from zero. Advancing moves torque lower
down on the rpm scale (but also decreases intake valve to piston
clearance). I find I have to plot this on paper so I can make sense of it
and to make sure I don’t move the the wrong direction in altering the valve
timing.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Newman overstated lift by 34%. Wow.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Duncan</DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV>On Oct 23, 2017, at 2:48 PM, John Styduhar via Fot <<A
href="mailto:fot@autox.team.net">fot@autox.team.net</A>> wrote:</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV dir=ltr>
<DIV class=gmail_default style="FONT-SIZE: small">Follow the instructions for
setting the cam and you will be fine. An adjustable cam sprocket will
make the job easier. </DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=gmail_extra>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV class=gmail_quote>On Mon, Oct 23, 2017 at 11:54 AM, riverside--- via Fot
<SPAN dir=ltr><<A href="mailto:fot@autox.team.net"
target=_blank>fot@autox.team.net</A>></SPAN> wrote:<BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote
style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; BORDER-LEFT: #ccc 1px solid">Yikes!
I have always had great success with Dema's cams.<BR>I hope his shop
survived the fires.<BR><BR>art de armond<BR><BR>-----Original Message-----
From: patrickmannion1--- via Fot<BR>Sent: Saturday, October 21, 2017 5:11
PM<BR>To: <A href="mailto:fot@autox.team.net"
target=_blank>fot@autox.team.net</A><BR>Subject: [Fot] Re TR4
camshafts<SPAN><BR><BR>Hello all,<BR>I have always nearly always built
Triumph TR4 engines with cams from Dema Elgin Superlobes in Santa Rosa.
Occasionally I had installed other cams supplied by customers that had a
valid timing card supplied. I decided with the English pound being low vs
the Dollar I would try the PH1 Cam from Newman Cams in England. I had heard
good things about their PH1 cam as being a great street cam.<BR><BR>When
installing the cam. Information on there website stated peak cam lift was
.295" (it is only .220") resulting in a lift at the valve being .120" less
than stated. Starting off with" incorrect lift figure all valve event
figures on the website are wrong. After several emails I got a two sentence
email saying ,set Intake for max lift at 110 degrees ATDC and the cam will
work,<BR><BR>After doing lots of engine modifications I would like a more
scientific answer than the cam will work. Has anyone used this cam or a
Newman cam before, or found that the information supplied by Newman was
incorrect. I hate to eat the cost of the camshafts I bought or incur the
cost of sending them back to England, but I would have no confidence in
using a camshaft without having a correct timing card for the camshaft.
-<BR>thanks<BR>Pat Mannion<BR>Santa Cruz
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