[Fot] What makes a Triumph a Triumph
Bob Kramer
rkramer3 at austin.rr.com
Sat Dec 12 08:04:38 MST 2015
I think we have to draw a line somewhere "back in the day" to be a Triumph derivative. The TVR 2500 used a lot of Standard Triumph parts; I think it went beyond drivetrain into front suspension but that does not make it a derivative.
A Swallow Doretti, Italia or a Peerless among others that used a TR3 frame and drivetrain were derivatives. Those cars could not have been built without the Triumph supplied parts.
Amphicar, Saab, Morgan and TVR were parts buyers from the Standard Triumph supply chain. Those brands could have designed in alternative drive trains and in fact they did at some point before or after their Triumph relationship ended.
Sent from my iPhone
> On Dec 11, 2015, at 8:02 PM, Duncan Charlton <duncan.charlton54 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Maybe being called a Triumph derivative requires using the entire running gear from a Triumph, as provided by Triumph. Or perhaps it had to do with using Triumph’s new car distribution network?
>
> Morgans used the Standard Vanguard and TR engines, but not frames, axles or gearboxes, and only on the 1951-1968 Plus 4 models.
>
> (Morgan has never made their own engines, and they have had a more or less continuous relationship with Ford from 1934 to present. Ford (and perhaps Rover as well) probably provided more engines to Morgan than Triumph ever did.)
>
> Duncan
>
>> On Dec 9, 2015, at 10:23 AM, Gertjan van de Klashorst <klokhuis67 at t-online.de> wrote:
>>
>> Good question. Saab used engines produced by Triumph, Morgan used Triumph engines as did some Peerless and Warwick and Doretti, also Italia. Now the last four are seen at the TR International in Malvern and seen as Triumph derivatives. I have never heard anybody calling Saab and Morgan Triumph derivatives.
>>
>> There must be more that have used Triumph parts for their cars. Formula One Lotus was using a Triumph suspension part, they called the triumph-link. A South African single seater, called Protea, is using Triumph engine and gear box. The Devin could be equipped with TR engine, but with many others as well.
>> So anybody can define where it starts and ends?
>>
>> Gert
>>
>> Van: Bob Bownes -Seiri [mailto:bownes at seiri.com]
>> Verzonden: 09 December 2015 16:04
>> Aan: John Styduhar
>> CC: John Hasty; J Roenigk; Triumph 'Friends of Triumph; klokhuis67
>> Onderwerp: Re: [Fot] TR3B register of remaining TR3Bs
>>
>> When it is a TVR? ;)
>>
>>> On Nov 30, 2015, at 13:44, John Styduhar <johnstydo at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> That's interesting information John. I wonder how many other TR-sourced cars were built. When is a Triumph a Triumph??
>>>
>>> On Mon, Nov 30, 2015 at 1:28 PM, John Hasty <jhasty at mhc-law.com> wrote:
>>> John…..I may be wrong, but I think Triumph only sold mechanicals to Vignale who built and sold the Italia….
>>>
>>> From: Fot [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Pierce, Russell
>>> Sent: Monday, November 30, 2015 1:22 PM
>>> To: John Styduhar; klokhuis67; Triumph 'Friends of Triumph
>>>
>>> Cc: J Roenigk
>>> Subject: Re: [Fot] TR3B register of remaining TR3Bs
>>>
>>> He parker it next to my car at the car show during the K cup. Can’t remember his name but he is good friends with Ronnie Babbitt. I’m sure he told me he actually has two and this was not the better one.
>>>
>>> <image001.jpg>
>>> Russell A. Pierce
>>> Wealth Manager/ Retirement Consultant
>>> 314 Corder Road
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>>>
>>> From: Fot [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of John Styduhar
>>> Sent: Monday, November 30, 2015 11:12 AM
>>> To: klokhuis67; Triumph 'Friends of Triumph
>>> Cc: J Roenigk
>>> Subject: Re: [Fot] TR3B register of remaining TR3Bs
>>>
>>> I saw a beautiful red Italia at the Kastner Cup this year at Summit Point. Can't remember who the owner was. I think it is the most beautiful car that Triumph made.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Nov 30, 2015 at 4:56 AM, klokhuis67 <klokhuis67 at t-online.de> wrote:
>>> Certainly interested in the info. From what I know is that the last 30 TRFs, 501-530 were used for Italia's.
>>>
>>> I also have a link to the Italia Registrar of the UK TR Register.
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>>
>>> Gertjan van de Klashorst
>>>
>>> Sent from my Samsung tablet
>>>
>>> Rich Roenigk <rroenigk at aol.com> wrote:
>>> Kurt….not aware that happened….let’s see what Gert says.
>>>
>>> Thx
>>>
>>> Rich
>>>
>>> From: Kurt Oblinger [mailto:koblinger at verizon.net]
>>> Sent: Sunday, November 29, 2015 9:51 PM
>>> To: John Styduhar; gertjan van de klashorst; J Roenigk
>>> Subject: Re: [Fot] TR3B register of remaining TR3Bs
>>>
>>> I have an Italia 2000 built on a TR3B (TSF) chassis. Would you like that info?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Kurt O.
>>>
>>>> On 11/29/2015 5:37 PM, John Styduhar wrote:
>>>> Amici,
>>>> If any owner of a TR3B is interested in including their car in a register of remaining TR3Bs and receive a numbered certificate of confirmation, please forward the following information to Gert J. van de Klashorst, registrar:
>>>>
>>>> Titled Date-
>>>> Commission Number-
>>>> Body Serial Number-
>>>> Engine Number-
>>>> Rear Axle Serial Number-
>>>> Gearbox Serial Number-
>>>> Current owner's name, address, and contact information-
>>>> Owned since date-
>>>> Car history if known-
>>>> Current photo-
>>>>
>>>> Gert's email address is klokhuis67 at t-online.de
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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