From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Tue Mar 2 19:09:56 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 18:09:56 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Car Chase video (No Triumphs) Message-ID: <1C211269-8457-4BBE-9AD9-CE6534AE36F8@earthlink.net> No TR's but certainly worth watching! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmbh1lWyUj0 ~Steve From ablake2 at austin.rr.com Tue Mar 2 20:39:48 2010 From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com (Greg & Alison Blake) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 21:39:48 -0600 Subject: [Fot] headlights for TR3A Message-ID: <000001caba83$2d0ae010$6501a8c0@blake1> Does anyone know if the headlight buckets from a TR4a would work on an early TR3A front apron? My commission number is in the low 30,000 range. There is a complete set on Ebay, but I don't want to bid unless the bucket will bolt up to my apron. Thanks, Greg From lfritz82 at hotmail.com Tue Mar 2 21:40:07 2010 From: lfritz82 at hotmail.com (Lorne Fritz) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 23:40:07 -0500 Subject: [Fot] headlights for TR3A In-Reply-To: <000001caba83$2d0ae010$6501a8c0@blake1> References: <000001caba83$2d0ae010$6501a8c0@blake1> Message-ID: Greg, The headlight buckets will fit even though they are different. The early TR3 buckets have a wider(deeper) ring, but very few people would know they weren't correct. They changed to the later style bucket about 1960 and used it clear thru the last TR6. Lorne > From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 21:39:48 -0600 > Subject: [Fot] headlights for TR3A > > Does anyone know if the headlight buckets from a TR4a would work on an > early TR3A front apron? My commission number is in the low 30,000 > range. There is a complete set on Ebay, but I don't want to bid unless > the bucket will bolt up to my apron. > > Thanks, > > Greg > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/lfritz82 at hotmail.com > > _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsofts powerful SPAM protection. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469226/direct/01/ From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Wed Mar 3 05:10:47 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (Jerry Van Vlack) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 07:10:47 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Old Photo of TR 2 racers Message-ID: <8366A565233844EB926ED56B706D1991@userb38463fba5> http://www.barcboys.com/Images/Berwick59/55%20BrynfanTyddin-TR2start2.jpg From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Wed Mar 3 05:46:25 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (Jerry Van Vlack) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 07:46:25 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Great website Message-ID: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> http://www.barcboys.com/ Click on Enter in the upper right corner From info at dieselperformanceparts.com Wed Mar 3 10:58:07 2010 From: info at dieselperformanceparts.com (Diesel Performance Parts Inc. - Info) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 11:58:07 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Carrillo Rods Message-ID: <55CB8270B7388B478DC7AC2A39A97C5A6E5659@isis.dieselperformanceparts.local> Morning members, Got an extra set of Carrillo rod's for a Spitfire 1300 small crank. They have been run very little and still have the engine bearings in them so you can see the wear pattern. Basically like new. Like to get 650.00 for the four of them. Call me at 615-347-0260 or e mail me. Mark Craig Diesel Performance Parts, INC. 411 Allied Drive Nashville, TN 37211 866-455-7788 Phone 615-834-9923 Fax www.dieselperformanceparts.com From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Wed Mar 3 11:10:23 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 12:10:23 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Carrillo Rods Message-ID: This reminds me, does anyone have an orphaned TR4 Carillo rod for sale? From spyderweb at uwalumni.com Wed Mar 3 12:02:22 2010 From: spyderweb at uwalumni.com (Jim Hill) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 13:02:22 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Great website In-Reply-To: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> References: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> Message-ID: <3afbecf41003031102m5ff47d3el3a9947c7f7d45782@mail.gmail.com> Nice catch Jerry! Especially: http://www.barcboys.com/Images/drivers%201/JerryWalsh.jpg Jim Hill ________________________________ Jerry Van Vlack wrote: http://www.barcboys.com/ Click on Enter in the upper right corner From adams910 at gmail.com Wed Mar 3 12:09:27 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 14:09:27 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Great website In-Reply-To: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> References: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> Message-ID: <673993c51003031109o2df03522y63afeb0d325a9ba5@mail.gmail.com> I just found that site as well. It really covers the Northeast SCCA National scene in the late 50's early 60's. Lots of easily recognizable names (Roger Penske, Bob Holbert, Mark Donohue, Peter Revson, Don Yenko, etc). If you look through the results, you'll see current Triumph vintage racer Dick Stockton in either a B-Mod Healey (Chevy powered), or in GMod with a Elva MkIV. Also look for guys like Randy Canfield (still racing HP @ 80 years old), Buzz Marcus and Sam Feinstein in Super 7's, Gerry Truitt, etc. Bob From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Wed Mar 3 12:58:36 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 14:58:36 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Great website References: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> Message-ID: <003501cabb0b$e9e67770$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> In '08 at the Glen vintage race, these guys had a large tent set up down the paddock a bit from the Triumph area; they appeared to be having a great time! Seemed to be a lot of hot air and cold beverages around! They're a good bunch. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Van Vlack" To: "'Friends of Triumph'" Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 7:46 AM Subject: [Fot] Great website > http://www.barcboys.com/ > > Click on Enter in the upper right corner > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From gaf3 at charter.net Wed Mar 3 16:13:40 2010 From: gaf3 at charter.net (Glenn Franco) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 18:13:40 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable Message-ID: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of questions for the wisdom of the collective groups. Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 engine with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during starting, it takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a third cable to connect to the center carb to get it going. after that it runs to problem. Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the cable. The center carb is not contributing to the starting event. All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and seals. Any ideas out there?? Thanks in advance Glenn Franco 3 TR6's , TR250, Spit race car and a nice 76 rust free spit. From tr6racer21 at earthlink.net Wed Mar 3 16:21:45 2010 From: tr6racer21 at earthlink.net (Chip Collingwood) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 18:21:45 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable Message-ID: <380-22010333232145625@earthlink.net> Glenn, You might try using the cable on the rear (2) carbs as Richard suggests, or you could check with him on his newer (3) cable choke pull setup Chip > [Original Message] > From: Glenn Franco > To: ; Friends of Triumph ; <6pack at autox.team.net> > Date: 3/3/2010 6:15:25 PM > Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable > > With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of > questions for the wisdom of the collective groups. > Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 > engine with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during > starting, it takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a > third cable to connect to the center carb to get it going. after that it > runs to problem. > Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the > cable. The center carb is not contributing to the starting event. > All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and > seals. > Any ideas out there?? > Thanks in advance > Glenn Franco > 3 TR6's , TR250, Spit race car and a nice 76 rust free spit. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr6racer21 at earthlink.net From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Wed Mar 3 16:42:51 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 18:42:51 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR6 headers craigs list Message-ID: <4B8EF3FB.1060006@twcny.rr.com> http://syracuse.craigslist.org/pts/1605517046.html Looks like a deal... From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Wed Mar 3 19:13:21 2010 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 18:13:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable In-Reply-To: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> Message-ID: <878631.64857.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Glenn: I have installed three of these set-ups for customers; a couple of which are on the six-pack list (customers, not carbs). I have always set them up on the back two carbs, and have never had a problem starting. Make sure the cams are adjusted correctly, and that the enrichening (sp?) discs and holes are not plugged up. Thanks - Ed --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Glenn Franco wrote: From: Glenn Franco Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable To: tr6parts at charter.net, "Friends of Triumph" , 6pack at autox.team.net Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 5:13 PM With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of questions for the wisdom of the collective groups. Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 engine with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during starting, it takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a third cable to connect to the center carb to get it going. after that it runs to problem. Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the cable. The center carb is not contributing to the starting event. All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and seals. Any ideas out there?? Thanks in advance Glenn Franco 3 TR6's , TR250, Spit race car and a nice 76 rust free spit. \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net From goodparts at verizon.net Wed Mar 3 20:31:49 2010 From: goodparts at verizon.net (Richard Good) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 22:31:49 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable In-Reply-To: <878631.64857.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <878631.64857.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5BF50D13C55B4222948B40CF43950A9B@AdminPC> Glenn, I have recently started making triple choke cables and have then in stock with either solid wire or stranded cable. Regards, Richard Good -------------------------------------------------- From: "EDWARD BARNARD" Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 9:13 PM To: "Friends of Triumph" ; "Glenn Franco" Subject: Re: [Fot] Choke Cable > Glenn: I have installed three of these set-ups for customers; a couple of > which are on the six-pack list (customers, not carbs). I have always set > them > up on the back two carbs, and have never had a problem starting. Make sure > the > cams are adjusted correctly, and that the enrichening (sp?) discs and > holes > are not plugged up. > Thanks - Ed > --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Glenn Franco wrote: > > > From: Glenn Franco > Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable > To: tr6parts at charter.net, "Friends of Triumph" , > 6pack at autox.team.net > Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 5:13 PM > > > With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of > questions > for the wisdom of the collective groups. > Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 > engine > with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during starting, it > takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a third cable to > connect > to the center carb to get it going. after that it runs to problem. > Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the cable. > The > center carb is not contributing to the starting event. > All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and > seals. > Any ideas out there?? > Thanks in advance > Glenn Franco > \ From lang at isis.mit.edu Thu Mar 4 07:10:52 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 09:10:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] [6pack] Choke Cable In-Reply-To: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> References: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> Message-ID: Hi, Not trying to be funny here, but I found through trial and error that by making the best spark possible, it practically eliminates the need for the choke. On my race with triple Webers, I only need the choke for the first start of the day. When I had that setup in the street car, I had a Crane X700 spark box and I NEVER needed the choke. The car started first twist, even down to the mid-20's (F). regards, rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2009 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From s.janzen at comcast.net Thu Mar 4 08:20:04 2010 From: s.janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 10:20:04 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR6 headers craigs list In-Reply-To: <4B8EF3FB.1060006@twcny.rr.com> References: <4B8EF3FB.1060006@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: has anybody ever tried to put these on a GT6? They should fit the head, but may not clear the frame? On Mar 3, 2010, at 6:42 PM, Mark Eginton wrote: http://syracuse.craigslist.org/pts/1605517046.html Looks like a deal... \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/s.janzen at comcast.net From mdhado at comcast.net Thu Mar 4 16:37:02 2010 From: mdhado at comcast.net (M&M Hado) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 17:37:02 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Crankshaft Thrust Washers Message-ID: Does anyone have a source for oversize TR3/4 crankshaft thrust washers beyond +.005? Moss used to have a .008" but no more apparently. Thanks, Mike From jhassall at blacksburg.net Thu Mar 4 19:45:51 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 21:45:51 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Crankshaft Thrust Washers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B90705F.2060104@blacksburg.net> On 3/4/2010 6:37 PM, M&M Hado wrote: > Does anyone have a source for oversize TR3/4 crankshaft thrust washers > beyond +.005? Moss used to have a .008" but no more apparently. > > Thanks, > > Mike Mike, you might try bonding some shim stock to the non-bearing side of the washers if you can't find the os washers. jim -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From mdhado at comcast.net Thu Mar 4 20:19:30 2010 From: mdhado at comcast.net (M&M Hado) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 21:19:30 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Crankshaft Thrust Washers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks for the replies. It looks like Moss Europe has +.0075" and Greg Solow's Engine Room in Santa Cruz is another lead. Both suggestions from Bob Kramer. Also, 3 others, including Ken Gillanders, suggested bonding a shim to the back side. I tried that already (with stainless and JB weld) held in a vice overnight but couldn't get a good bond. Trying the brass tonight but the safe way is probably the Moss shims on both sides. Appreciate your help in trying to salvage an otherwise good crank. Mike -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of M&M Hado Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 5:37 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Crankshaft Thrust Washers Does anyone have a source for oversize TR3/4 crankshaft thrust washers beyond +.005? Moss used to have a .008" but no more apparently. Thanks, Mike \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mdhado at comcast.net From jmwagner at greenheart.com Thu Mar 4 20:47:36 2010 From: jmwagner at greenheart.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 19:47:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) Message-ID: <4B907ED8.6080905@greenheart.com> Just ran across this on Craigslist... passing the link along... thought it might be of interest... --Justin Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/pts/1629114524.html From jeff_durant at comcast.net Thu Mar 4 21:29:49 2010 From: jeff_durant at comcast.net (jeff_durant at comcast.net) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 04:29:49 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) Message-ID: <325283340-1267763347-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-2105623690-@bda059.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Justin, I spoke to a gent named Ivan who owns the webers. Nice guy. He was asking $2500 a couple weeks back an I mentioned that was a bit high. He also has a complete GT6+ bonnet and some front end bits. He used to race a GT6 in the SF region. Jeff D. ------Original Message------ From: Justin Wagner Sender: fot-bounces at autox.team.net To: Friends of Triumph Subject: [Fot] Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) Sent: Mar 4, 2010 7:47 PM Just ran across this on Craigslist... passing the link along... thought it might be of interest... --Justin Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/pts/1629114524.html \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jeff_durant at comcast.net Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T From n197tr4 at cs.com Thu Mar 4 21:44:52 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 23:44:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] amb transponder Message-ID: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> FOT, Looking for your uneeded AMB Transponder for the AMBRO. Thanks, Joe A From yellow-green at sbcglobal.net Thu Mar 4 22:52:58 2010 From: yellow-green at sbcglobal.net (Dennis DeLap) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 21:52:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] amb transponder In-Reply-To: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <636290.85067.qm@web81704.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Me too - for the TVR 2200S Dennis FOT, Looking for your uneeded AMB Transponder for the AMBRO. Thanks, Joe A \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/yellow-green at sbcglobal.net From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Fri Mar 5 09:55:42 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 08:55:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] amb transponder In-Reply-To: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <911522.85267.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Andy at Armodillo racing out of Seattle can help you out. He supports all the club and historic races in the Northwest. He was at the KAS cup with his trailer. I have purchased my fuel cell, Kirky seat and related safety products from him. He is competitive and is a distributor. I am attaching his web site info. I will be buying a transponder from him in the next month. http://www.armadilloracing.com/ ________________________________ From: "n197tr4 at cs.com" To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Thu, March 4, 2010 8:44:52 PM Subject: [Fot] amb transponder FOT, Looking for your uneeded AMB Transponder for the AMBRO. Thanks, Joe A \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From igofaster at att.net Fri Mar 5 12:45:44 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 11:45:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Jaguar Parts Help needed In-Reply-To: <0782406101C4354E97CB854612FFE70D0FD330CB42@ITMBXEXCH.enterprise.trin.net> References: <0782406101C4354E97CB854612FFE70D0FD330CB42@ITMBXEXCH.enterprise.trin.net> Message-ID: <946135.62855.qm@web180715.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> my great friend Dan Mooney @ www.classicjaguar.com may be able to help locate the panels too.... Bobby Whitehead ________________________________ From: David Pilcher Sent: Fri, March 5, 2010 9:47:50 AM Subject: Jaguar Parts Help needed The below request was forwarded from our member Lisa Richardson, can anyone help? David E. Pilcher TSTI Manager Quality Systems (214) 589-8826 Office From:Lisa Richardson [mailto:lisa at josephvincelli.com] Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 9:06 AM To: David Pilcher Subject: RE: 1st Communique Thanks for this info Dave. On another note, my restorer is looking for some Jaguar body panels (1966 Mark ll 3.8 Looking for both rear panels/fenders. Full or half. Also, Front Fender passenger area) if you can post this with the club maybe some have something to sell and I can put them in contact with each other. They can call Richard at 214-957-1320 if they have something. Lisa Vincelli cell: 972-345-5051 Notice: This email message, including any attachments, contains information belonging to Trinity Industries, Inc. and its business units. It has been sent solely for the use of the intended recipients and may be confidential, proprietary, copyrighted, and legally privileged. If you are not an intended recipient, please advise the sender of the error and permanently delete all copies of this email, including any copies that may reside in your deleted box. The unauthorized review, use, disclosure, distribution, or copying of this email or its contents is strictly prohibited. From gaf3 at charter.net Sat Mar 6 13:05:49 2010 From: gaf3 at charter.net (Glenn Franco) Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2010 15:05:49 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable In-Reply-To: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> References: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> Message-ID: <4B92B59D.8030802@charter.net> Thanks to all that provided feedback on my triple Stromberg choke cable starting issues. Looks like I will be adding an additional cable for cold starts. Thanks again Glenn Glenn Franco wrote: > With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of > questions for the wisdom of the collective groups. > Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 > engine with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during > starting, it takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a > third cable to connect to the center carb to get it going. after that > it runs to problem. > Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the > cable. The center carb is not contributing to the starting event. > All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and > seals. > Any ideas out there?? > Thanks in advance > Glenn Franco > 3 TR6's , TR250, Spit race car and a nice 76 rust free spit. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gaf3 at charter.net From igofaster at att.net Sat Mar 6 13:05:30 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 12:05:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] crankcase ventilation Message-ID: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> My GT6 has been running with a catch tank for the valve cover and plumbing for the crankcase ventilation. I have been running the valve cover blowby into the tank but have run without the crankcase ventilation plumbing into the catch tank. Someone suggested that all British cars run better if the crankcase is being ventilated. This past weekend I ran the crankcase and valve cover blowby into the catch tank...dang... I'm gathering at least a pint of blowby in the emulsion tank in just a 15 minute run... I seem to recall Kas suggested a crankcase pipe of 1/2" inside diameter... my car has about a 3/8" port into the fuel pump spot where it is configureed... The hose for the blow by definately looks more oiley , but what is the opinion of the group of having so much run off in the catch tank... I'm getting blowby mist that I can see when the engine is at idle with the oil cap off... the GT is on the 3rd season without a rebuild... wondering if I retorque the head and adjust the valves if I could reduce the blowby... or?? Bobby Whitehead 1970GT6 DP CVAR looks like I purchased a race preparred Spitfire on eBay this week out in California... so... my wife is allowing a two racecar garage for her hubby..... From LOddTR at aol.com Sat Mar 6 13:23:35 2010 From: LOddTR at aol.com (LOddTR at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 15:23:35 EST Subject: [Fot] Invitation: Fourth Annual Martha McDougal to be awarded at VIR 4/9 - 4/11 Message-ID: <121b.68d2ae2d.38c413c7@aol.com> The Triumph Ghetto is pleased to announce that they will award the Fourth Annual Martha McDougal Trophy, as part of the 2010 VDCA Wild Hare Run, at Virginia International Raceway. The dates for this year's event are April 9th through the 11th. Join your fellow Triumph racers at this prestigious event that serves as the kick-off to the 2010 race season. The Wild Hare features generous amounts of track time, including a free enduro, on one of the most challenging long tracks in the country. Topping off the weekend will be the presentation of the coveted "Martha" trophy to the Triumph racer that displays a high level of performance on track, camaraderie in the paddock and general good-guy/gal-ness. In addition to the standard fun on and off the track, the Ghetto will provide their world famous surf and turf dinner on Friday evening. Here is your link to the entry form for the weekends festivities. We look forward to seeing you there. _http://www.vintagedrive.com/EntryVIR10.pdf_ (http://www.vintagedrive.com/EntryVIR10.pdf) The TR Ghetto PS: Here is Martha's story This race weekend honors Ms. Martha McDougal, a woman who toiled in almost total obscurity for many years at the Triumph automobile plant in Coventry, England. According to sources believed to be reliable, Martha was born in Coventry in January, 1923. Her parents were tragically killed in the Blitz and Martha was left an orphan at age 16. Although she was not overly bright, she was very resourceful and within months had gotten a job at the Standard Triumph factory emptying the dust bins. Throughout the war and until the demise of the company, Martha made the rounds, day after day, month after month, year after year, transferring the trash into her cart and then into the large bins behind the factory, without complaint or even one day's absence. Over the years Martha became known as the single person who had completed the most "laps" of the Triumph factory and, upon her retirement a few months before the final closing of the Coventry plant, she was honored with a bronzed pair of high top Keds, her signature footwear. It is rumored that at the presentation, Sir John himself reminisced about how Martha, who had an endearing habit of assigning nicknames to all the staff, would push past him in the hallway and mumble, "Get out of my way you fat bastard". From tlizzard at msn.com Sat Mar 6 15:23:33 2010 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 17:23:33 -0500 Subject: [Fot] crankcase ventilation In-Reply-To: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: What are the leakdown numbers for the engine? Leakdown checks are really the only sure way of knowing the condition of the rings and or valves in terms of sealing. Terry Stetler From timmurph at fastbytes.com Sat Mar 6 16:21:15 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 17:21:15 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 crankshaft end play Message-ID: <000001cabd83$b89bbca0$29d335e0$@com> When I assembled the reground crank after the center main bearing failed I put new thrust bearings in, 0.005 oversize in front, standard in the rear, which is what the old ones were. The old thrust bearings got particles of the failed center main imbedded in them which is why I replaced them. I had 0.003 end play with the old thrust bearings when I put new main and rod bearings in 2008. I now have 0.001 to 0.0015 end play with the same size new thrust bearings, 0.005 oversize front and standard rear. I'm guessing my old thrust bearings were a bit worn, giving the 0.003 end play in 2008. The book spec is 0.004 to 0.006. If I take the 0.005 oversize out and put a standard in front also I'll be right at the limit of 0.006. Am I better off to run the 0.001 end play or the "at the limit" 0.006? I did notice that the new thrust bearings from BPNW, which are the "County" (I think that's the same as "King") brand, have what appears to be a copper facing on the bearing surface whereas my old ones looked like Babbitt. Maybe the copper was worn off the old ones giving the 0.003 endplay? Thanks for any comments and opinions on this. It would seem that 0.001 would be a bit tight, unless they quickly "wear in" and would give me 0.003 or there about. I'm measuring the end play with a tenth indicator against the ground surface on the flank in front of the rear main journal and "pushing" the crank back and forth with a big screwdriver against the center counter balance and the block. I get the 0.0015 if I push hard and hold and the 0.001 if I push and release. Only the center main bearing block is in and torqued. The front and rear blocks are not installed yet. This is a stock crankshaft and the stock thrust bearings. Tim From s.janzen at comcast.net Sat Mar 6 19:42:52 2010 From: s.janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 21:42:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] crankcase ventilation In-Reply-To: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> Now I'm curious- my GT6 has no crankcase ventilation- where's the breather connection? Also- with all the open space between crankcase and valve cover along the pushrods, why would a 1/2" tube on the crankcase make any difference? Sent from my iPhone On Mar 6, 2010, at 3:05 PM, Bobby Whitehead wrote: > My GT6 has been running with a catch tank for the valve cover and > plumbing for the crankcase ventilation. I have been running the > valve cover blowby into the tank but have run without the crankcase > ventilation plumbing into the catch tank. > Someone suggested that all British cars run better if the crankcase > is being ventilated. This past weekend I ran the crankcase and valve > cover blowby into the catch tank...dang... I'm gathering at least a > pint of blowby in the emulsion tank in just a 15 minute run... > I seem to recall Kas suggested a crankcase pipe of 1/2" inside > diameter... my car has about a 3/8" port into the fuel pump spot > where it is configureed... > The hose for the blow by definately looks more oiley , but what is > the opinion of the group of having so much run off in the catch > tank... I'm getting blowby mist that I can see when the engine is at > idle with the oil cap off... the GT is on the 3rd season without a > rebuild... wondering if I retorque the head and adjust the valves if > I could reduce the blowby... or?? > > Bobby Whitehead 1970GT6 DP CVAR > > looks like I purchased a race preparred Spitfire on eBay this week > out in California... so... my wife is allowing a two racecar garage > for her hubby..... > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/s.janzen at comcast.net From jaboruch at netzero.net Sat Mar 6 20:28:47 2010 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 03:28:47 GMT Subject: [Fot] TR4 crankshaft end play Message-ID: <20100306.222847.24000.0@webmail03.dca.untd.com> Tim, 0.001 is too tight. I would go with the 0.006, but if you want to get closer to the low end of the tolerance, sand 0.003 of the back of half of the thicker bearings. I made a wooden fixture that the bearings fit into so that I could sand them with emery paper on a flat plate, without sanding my finger tips off. It also keeps them level so an even amount is taken off. Joe(B) ---------- Original Message ---------- From: "Tim Murphy" To: Cc: rpm724 at att.net, ryan.murphy at fdlco.wi.gov Subject: [Fot] TR4 crankshaft end play Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 17:21:15 -0600 When I assembled the reground crank after the center main bearing failed I put new thrust bearings in, 0.005 oversize in front, standard in the rear, which is what the old ones were. The old thrust bearings got particles of the failed center main imbedded in them which is why I replaced them. I had 0.003 end play with the old thrust bearings when I put new main and rod bearings in 2008. I now have 0.001 to 0.0015 end play with the same size new thrust bearings, 0.005 oversize front and standard rear. I'm guessing my old thrust bearings were a bit worn, giving the 0.003 end play in 2008. The book spec is 0.004 to 0.006. If I take the 0.005 oversize out and put a standard in front also I'll be right at the limit of 0.006. Am I better off to run the 0.001 end play or the "at the limit" 0.006? I did notice that the new thrust bearings from BPNW, which are the "County" (I think that's the same as "King") brand, have what appears to be a copper facing on the bearing surface whereas my old ones looked like Babbitt. Maybe the copper was worn off the old ones giving the 0.003 endplay? Thanks for any comments and opinions on this. It would seem that 0.001 would be a bit tight, unless they quickly "wear in" and would give me 0.003 or there about. I'm measuring the end play with a tenth indicator against the ground surface on the flank in front of the rear main journal and "pushing" the crank back and forth with a big screwdriver against the center counter balance and the block. I get the 0.0015 if I push hard and hold and the 0.001 if I push and release. Only the center main bearing block is in and torqued. The front and rear blocks are not installed yet. This is a stock crankshaft and the stock thrust bearings. Tim \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jaboruch at netzero.net ____________________________________________________________ Get Free Email with Video Mail & Video Chat! http://www.netzero.net/freeemail?refcd=NZTAGOUT1FREM0210 From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sat Mar 6 21:06:26 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg Lunker Hilyer) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 21:06:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling Message-ID: <9C2735B4-2897-47D4-9DE8-208D4C0F8DED@earthlink.net> While cleaning shop today, I moved a pile of expired harnesses onto a shelf right next to the new tie-downs I just bought. IDEA... The used [useless] harnesses will make for great "over the tire" tie downs. Surprised I never thought of it before and also surprised I've never seen such. Eager to get them mounted. If I lose a car I'll be sure to let you all know. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM By the way, My UPS guy offerd me 2 TR6's ['76 complete and with hardtop, '74 roller with everything in boxes] for $3000. I'm not interested in advertising them &/or fielding a bunch of inquiries but would be willing to take a look for a FoT. From n197tr4 at cs.com Sat Mar 6 21:13:09 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2010 23:13:09 -0500 Subject: [Fot] crankcase ventilation In-Reply-To: <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> Message-ID: <8CC8BC3A182476E-39E4-10E86@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> It's been said before, but I run negative pressure in my crankcase to great effect. There is no oil being pushed past seals and gaskets and there is a belief that negative pressure promotes better ring sealing and reduces internal disturbances. This is not a new idea and it is commonly used by dragsters and stock car racers. SVRA sees it as something that would pass their tech and it always has elsewhere. Inexpensive and simple to install. Joe A -----Original Message----- From: Scott Janzen To: Bobby Whitehead Cc: FoT Triumph Sent: Sat, Mar 6, 2010 8:42 pm Subject: Re: [Fot] crankcase ventilation Now I'm curious- my GT6 has no crankcase ventilation- where's the breather connection? Also- with all the open space between crankcase and valve cover along the pushrods, why would a 1/2" tube on the crankcase make any difference? Sent from my iPhone On Mar 6, 2010, at 3:05 PM, Bobby Whitehead wrote: > My GT6 has been running with a catch tank for the valve cover and > plumbing for the crankcase ventilation. I have been running the > valve cover blowby into the tank but have run without the crankcase > ventilation plumbing into the catch tank. > Someone suggested that all British cars run better if the crankcase > is being ventilated. This past weekend I ran the crankcase and valve > cover blowby into the catch tank...dang... I'm gathering at least a > pint of blowby in the emulsion tank in just a 15 minute run... > I seem to recall Kas suggested a crankcase pipe of 1/2" inside > diameter... my car has about a 3/8" port into the fuel pump spot > where it is configureed... > The hose for the blow by definately looks more oiley , but what is > the opinion of the group of having so much run off in the catch > tank... I'm getting blowby mist that I can see when the engine is at > idle with the oil cap off... the GT is on the 3rd season without a > rebuild... wondering if I retorque the head and adjust the valves if > I could reduce the blowby... or?? > > Bobby Whitehead 1970GT6 DP CVAR > > looks like I purchased a race preparred Spitfire on eBay this week > out in California... so... my wife is allowing a two racecar garage > for her hubby..... > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/s.janzen at comcast.net \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com = From n197tr4 at cs.com Sat Mar 6 21:17:17 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2010 23:17:17 -0500 Subject: [Fot] AMB TRANSPONDERS USED & NEW In-Reply-To: <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> Message-ID: <8CC8BC434ED6878-39E4-10EDF@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> FOT, I found four used transponders four $275 each, while they last. New for $399. Rechargeable, I believe. Joe A From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sat Mar 6 22:07:03 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 22:07:03 -0700 Subject: [Fot] AMB TRANSPONDERS USED & NEW In-Reply-To: <8CC8BC434ED6878-39E4-10EDF@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> <8CC8BC434ED6878-39E4-10EDF@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <456167A2-70DC-495A-8852-8281AADB9EBD@earthlink.net> For what it's worth Joe, That's a great deal. I've sold a couple on E-Bay for $325+. Got a email from AMB awhile back suggesting that since mine is 5+ years old [more like 8] they suggested I send it in for $30 off a replacement. Hah!! Mine still carries a 4 day charge and a friend has now been using his for 16 years. The rechargeables rock! Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Mar 6, 2010, at 9:17 PM, n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: > FOT, > > I found four used transponders four $275 each, while they last. > > New for $399. > > Rechargeable, I believe. > > Joe A > \ From andre at gt6.ca Sun Mar 7 04:55:14 2010 From: andre at gt6.ca (Andre Rousseau) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 06:55:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] AMB TRANSPONDERS USED & NEW In-Reply-To: <456167A2-70DC-495A-8852-8281AADB9EBD@earthlink.net> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> <8CC8BC434ED6878-39E4-10EDF@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> <456167A2-70DC-495A-8852-8281AADB9EBD@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <4362ae391003070355u3542bfefm3765d447c9097721@mail.gmail.com> I got a hardware unit for $300 CND used. New they go for $490. Buggers charges me $50USD to transfer it into my name, but now show it only costs $40.00 http://www.mylaps.com/index.php/us_eng/Websites/B2C/car/products/used_transpo nders Oh well. A. On 7 March 2010 00:07, Greg "Lunker" Hilyer wrote: > For what it's worth Joe, > That's a great deal. I've sold a couple on E-Bay for $325+. Got a email from > AMB awhile back suggesting that since mine is 5+ years old [more like 8] > they suggested I send it in for $30 off a replacement. Hah!! Mine still > carries a 4 day charge and a friend has now been using his for 16 years. The > rechargeables rock! > > Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > On Mar 6, 2010, at 9:17 PM, n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: > >> FOT, >> >> I found four used transponders four $275 each, while they last. >> >> New for $399. >> >> Rechargeable, I believe. >> >> Joe A >> \ > > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/andre at gt6.ca > > > -- Andre Rousseau - andre at gt6.ca '68 Triumph GT6 MK1 - http://www.gt6.ca/ '77 FIAT 124 Vintage Racer #515 - http://www.124racer.com/ Ottawa, ON, Canada From n197tr4 at cs.com Sun Mar 7 06:44:09 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2010 08:44:09 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling.....now over the wheel tie downs In-Reply-To: <9C2735B4-2897-47D4-9DE8-208D4C0F8DED@earthlink.net> References: <9C2735B4-2897-47D4-9DE8-208D4C0F8DED@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <8CC8C13660E80D2-39E4-14154@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> If you go to photobucket.com/ambro you will see an "over the tire' tiedown system I am building for my new trailer. -----Original Message----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer To: fot Triumph Sent: Sat, Mar 6, 2010 10:06 pm Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling While cleaning shop today, I moved a pile of expired harnesses onto a shelf right next to the new tie-downs I just bought. IDEA... The used [useless] harnesses will make for great "over the tire" tie downs. Surprised I never thought of it before and also surprised I've never seen such. Eager to get them mounted. If I lose a car I'll be sure to let you all know. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM By the way, My UPS guy offerd me 2 TR6's ['76 complete and with hardtop, '74 roller with everything in boxes] for $3000. I'm not interested in advertising them &/or fielding a bunch of inquiries but would be willing to take a look for a FoT. \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From andre at gt6.ca Sun Mar 7 07:29:07 2010 From: andre at gt6.ca (Andre Rousseau) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 09:29:07 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling.....now over the wheel tie downs In-Reply-To: <8CC8C13660E80D2-39E4-14154@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> References: <9C2735B4-2897-47D4-9DE8-208D4C0F8DED@earthlink.net> <8CC8C13660E80D2-39E4-14154@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <4362ae391003070629j44a92ba7v3597f46c732c7ee3@mail.gmail.com> AWESOME idea. A. On 7 March 2010 08:44, wrote: > If you go to photobucket.com/ambro you will see an "over the tire' > tiedown system I am building for my new trailer. > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > To: fot Triumph > Sent: Sat, Mar 6, 2010 10:06 pm > Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling > > > While cleaning shop today, I moved a pile of expired harnesses onto a shelf > right next to the new tie-downs I just bought. > IDEA... The used [useless] harnesses will make for great "over the tire" tie > downs. Surprised I never thought of it before and also surprised I've never > seen such. Eager to get them mounted. If I lose a car I'll be sure to let you > all know. > > Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > > By the way, > My UPS guy offerd me 2 TR6's ['76 complete and with hardtop, '74 roller with > everything in boxes] for $3000. I'm not interested in advertising them &/or > fielding a bunch of inquiries but would be willing to take a look for a FoT. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/andre at gt6.ca > > > -- Andre Rousseau - andre at gt6.ca '68 Triumph GT6 MK1 - http://www.gt6.ca/ '77 FIAT 124 Vintage Racer #515 - http://www.124racer.com/ Ottawa, ON, Canada From n197tr4 at cs.com Sun Mar 7 17:01:24 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2010 19:01:24 -0500 Subject: [Fot] RECHARGEABLE AMBs Message-ID: <8CC8C69A0AA76F5-A454-21F0F@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> FYI, wolfcreek141 at yahoo.com has a few left at $275 plus $10 shipping. I'll have mine by Wednesday. She has them listed on eBay and they routinely go over $300 but she will sell directly with payment by PayPal. Joe From timmurph at fastbytes.com Sun Mar 7 19:00:24 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 20:00:24 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 thrust bearing clearance Message-ID: <000001cabe63$1f05e440$5d11acc0$@com> Thanks for all of the responses. I measured the thickness of my old and new thrust bearings today and saw that they were within about a = thousandth of each other. As I had .003 to .004 before I knew I must be doing something different. So I measured the clearance between the thrust bearing and the crank with a feeler, as the workshop manual shows, and I have a nice .004 clearance. Measuring the end play with an indicator and pushing the crank forward and back apparently is not a good way to measure the clearance, which is what the .004 to .006 tolerance is for. SoIll leave the thrust bearings as they are. The old ones which are about the same size worked okay and the clearance is at the low end of the spec. Everything looks pretty good!! I learned quite a bit to boot. Thanks again, much appreciated. Tim From jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au Mon Mar 8 00:57:48 2010 From: jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au (Jim Cun) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 23:57:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] TR-man MP3 In-Reply-To: <561232.57934.qm@web51806.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <561232.57934.qm@web51806.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <990467.55517.qm@web51805.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi Guys. Had this sent too me from a fellow TR-man so if you have not heard this MP3 had a listen [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type audio/mpeg which had a name of TR] From 58tr3a at videotron.ca Mon Mar 8 06:16:22 2010 From: 58tr3a at videotron.ca (Don Elliott) Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 08:16:22 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire Message-ID: Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to be available in August. http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm From dmitchel at sbcglobal.net Mon Mar 8 09:17:06 2010 From: dmitchel at sbcglobal.net (Doug Mitchell) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 08:17:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <641953.43963.qm@web80806.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Not exactly new, I saw a presentation on them in August of 2005, and Michelin showed them at SAE World Congress in 2006. I still wouldn't count on seeing them any time soon. ________________________________ From: Don Elliott <58tr3a at videotron.ca> To: Friends of Triumph Sent: Mon, March 8, 2010 8:16:22 AM Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to be available in August. http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dmitchel at sbcglobal.net From gaf3 at charter.net Mon Mar 8 09:58:07 2010 From: gaf3 at charter.net (Glenn Franco) Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 11:58:07 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B952C9F.6000805@charter.net> I did some research on these in the late 90's and contacted Michelin as to their release date for production. At the time I was trying to find a lightweight spare for the 3 generation Grand Cherokee, but they could not give me a date. Would make a good spare, but I don't think the public's ready to accept it. Glenn Don Elliott wrote: > Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to be available in August. > > http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gaf3 at charter.net From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Mon Mar 8 10:24:34 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 09:24:34 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: <4B952C9F.6000805@charter.net> References: <4B952C9F.6000805@charter.net> Message-ID: I like sidewalls on my tires, they keep water and rocks out of the spinning tires! Imagine going slowly through a puddle, wouldn't the thing collect the water and chuck it around? ~Steve On Mar 8, 2010, at 8:58 AM, Glenn Franco wrote: I did some research on these in the late 90's and contacted Michelin as to their release date for production. At the time I was trying to find a lightweight spare for the 3 generation Grand Cherokee, but they could not give me a date. Would make a good spare, but I don't think the public's ready to accept it. Glenn Don Elliott wrote: > Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer > band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to > be available in August. > > http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ > gaf3 at charter.net \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From kaskas at cox.net Mon Mar 8 11:16:53 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 10:16:53 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20100308131653.BEAAJ.1024792.imail@fed1rmwml32> How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of balance condition..... whoopee. ---- Steven Belfer wrote: ============= I like sidewalls on my tires, they keep water and rocks out of the spinning tires! Imagine going slowly through a puddle, wouldn't the thing collect the water and chuck it around? ~Steve On Mar 8, 2010, at 8:58 AM, Glenn Franco wrote: I did some research on these in the late 90's and contacted Michelin as to their release date for production. At the time I was trying to find a lightweight spare for the 3 generation Grand Cherokee, but they could not give me a date. Would make a good spare, but I don't think the public's ready to accept it. Glenn Don Elliott wrote: > Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer > band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to > be available in August. > > http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ > gaf3 at charter.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From adams910 at gmail.com Mon Mar 8 11:29:28 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 13:29:28 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: References: <4B952C9F.6000805@charter.net> Message-ID: <673993c51003081029r77cf22dbqed6337957acf8877@mail.gmail.com> Here's DC Shoes' spin off this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUfEsJJBUyM Bob From emanteno at gmail.com Mon Mar 8 11:35:36 2010 From: emanteno at gmail.com (Irv Korey) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 12:35:36 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: <20100308131653.BEAAJ.1024792.imail@fed1rmwml32> References: <20100308131653.BEAAJ.1024792.imail@fed1rmwml32> Message-ID: <354a1781003081035m36bee109nbf986ca7e230830a@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 12:16 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of > balance condition..... whoopee. > I can envision a scenario where you park your car in a puddle, only to have it freeze inside those tires overnight, locking your car in place until you are able to free it, maybe in spring. Irv From spitlist at cox.net Mon Mar 8 12:13:29 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 12:13:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: <354a1781003081035m36bee109nbf986ca7e230830a@mail.gmail.com> References: <20100308131653.BEAAJ.1024792.imail@fed1rmwml32> <354a1781003081035m36bee109nbf986ca7e230830a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Each set of tires would include an ice pick for just that sort of situation! :) Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Irv Korey Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 11:36 AM To: Kas Kastner Cc: Friends of Triumph Subject: Re: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 12:16 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of > balance condition..... whoopee. > I can envision a scenario where you park your car in a puddle, only to have it freeze inside those tires overnight, locking your car in place until you are able to free it, maybe in spring. Irv \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From BillDentin at aol.com Mon Mar 8 12:15:21 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 14:15:21 EST Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire Message-ID: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com> In a message dated 03/08/2010 12:32:42 PM Central Standard Time, kaskas at cox.net writes: > How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of > balance condition..... whoopee. > A couple of years ago someone sent me info on these, and I took it to my racing partner Bob Wismer, who was quite familiar with them. They are not a particularly new concept, and Kas is right that snow, ice, mud, debris are all prime issues that have prevented them from going further with them at this time. But consideration as an emergency spare strikes me as interesting. Bill Dentinger From Gt6steve at aol.com Mon Mar 8 13:46:07 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 15:46:07 EST Subject: [Fot] GOOD rollbar padding Message-ID: <2b79c.6cede798.38c6bc0f@aol.com> Hey, Anybody know who's got the best prices on the Hi density rollbar padding? From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Mon Mar 8 16:56:52 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 18:56:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder Message-ID: <4B958EC4.8070606@twcny.rr.com> I was in Lowes and saw some 1/8" steel stock perfect for a scatter shield 3" wide so here is how I spent my weekend: http://www.flickr.com/photos/28599565 at N04 Think it will do the job or is there something I need to consider adding or changing. I plan to run my dad's lightened flywheel which visually has seen a lathe back in the '60s. I had it magnifluxed and it is fine but I still feel the need for a shield - I like being ambulatory... The idea is to keep the car the way he raced it - drive it to the track, pull the windshield and passenger seat - add a plexiglas deflection shield and go have fun. So, I wanted it to hide under the carpet. Thanks, M From tlizzard at msn.com Mon Mar 8 17:21:51 2010 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 19:21:51 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com> References: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com> Message-ID: Seems to me a non-structural sidewall is the answer. Besides, they will need someplace to plaster their logo... Terry Stetler From trmarty at hotmail.com Mon Mar 8 17:47:27 2010 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 19:47:27 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: References: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com>, Message-ID: If they came in 20" and chrome spinners I'd put them on the Spitty :) Marty _________________________________________________________________ Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469229/direct/01/ From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Mon Mar 8 18:01:39 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (Jerry Van Vlack) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 20:01:39 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire References: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com> Message-ID: <426AAF5452124C52B91A8946F196D7F0@userb38463fba5> There is an industrial tire called AirBoss that uses a similar concept but with much greater cross sections and individual segmented sections. I know a lot about that product as I served as the President of the Division for several years until the parent sold the business. In our case the product served a specific niche market on equipment used in aggressive environments. We did a lot of testing and strictly limited the speed that the tire could be used as you build up heat pretty quickly when the rubber is flexing. I'm sure that Michelin has done even more testing since their tire is intended for highway use. We did experience issues with rocks and debris getting into the open air pockets. While I realize that our product and this tire are for very different applications the failure modes might be very similar. The concept was copied by other manufactures eventually and costs became an issue as competitors found ways to make similar tires and we did not change our design. (Much more to that story). It was a good experience for me personally and I learned a lot about the dynamics and chemistry that goes into the design of rubber products. Bill Dentinger and Bob Kramer may remember our tires that were used on Skid-Steers and Variable Reach lift trucks. We were an OE option for several years on Case, New Holland, John Deere and BobCat equipment. JVV ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 2:15 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire > In a message dated 03/08/2010 12:32:42 PM Central Standard Time, > kaskas at cox.net writes: > > >> How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of >> balance condition..... whoopee. >> > > A couple of years ago someone sent me info on these, and I took it to my > racing partner Bob Wismer, who was quite familiar with them. They are not > a > particularly new concept, and Kas is right that snow, ice, mud, debris are > all prime issues that have prevented them from going further with them at > this > time. But consideration as an emergency spare strikes me as interesting. > > Bill Dentinger > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com From budscars at comcast.net Mon Mar 8 18:57:32 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 17:57:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire References: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com>, Message-ID: Absolutely...That's the ticket...Just think..in 30 years those wheels will be Vintage!... Racer Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: "marty sukey" To: "FOT" Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 4:47 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire > If they came in 20" and chrome spinners I'd put them on the Spitty :) > > Marty > > _________________________________________________________________ > Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469229/direct/01/ > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From dos_gusanos at msn.com Mon Mar 8 19:38:38 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 19:38:38 -0700 Subject: [Fot] FW: [Healeys] Amateur Sports Car Racing in the '60s In-Reply-To: <689461.48751.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <689461.48751.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Gotta watch this one....................Henry Morrison, Albuquerque > > This is just the best. A period half-hour video about amateur SCCA racing in > the 60s. Lots of big Healeys and Sprites. Great shots at the Glen before they > put up all the armco. http://vimeo.com/4139756 > > Rick > > > Follow My Nasty Boy Build: http://tinyurl.com/yj52fwo > _______________________________________________ From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Mon Mar 8 20:04:00 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 22:04:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling Message-ID: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Hi guys, I just read that Stirling Moss was injured when he fell down an elevator shaft at his home. The doors evidently opened but there was a malfunction and the elevator car wasn't there. He then somehow fell down the shaft. The article said that he had surgery on his ankles and was banged up but did not have life threatening injuries. It said he fell 30 feet. Wow. I used to see him at the CanAm races where he was the J Wax spokesman. Got lots of free wax for the car. There was the time when Oscar's wife and Jack's wife took an empty J Wax can, cleaned it out, filled it with butterscotch pudding ( which looked about like the wax) and approached Stirling. One of them stuck her finger into the can, swirled it around, and after asking Moss how many calories were in it, plopped it into her mouth! Moss's eyes about came out of his head! Great moment. Hope he does OK. Bill From dlhogye at comcast.net Mon Mar 8 20:54:12 2010 From: dlhogye at comcast.net (davehogye) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 03:54:12 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Fuel cell size Message-ID: <1500220419.1684221268106852436.JavaMail.root@sz0047a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Hello friends, I'm in the market for a fuel cell for my TR3 race car. What is the typical gallon size used for TRs. I've seen a few cars with 8 gallon tanks and a couple with 10 and 12. ATL makes a cell called the "Well Cell" that is 22"dia. and would fit nicely in the spare tire compartment. They have an 8 and 12 gallon size. Both are 22"dia. but the 8 gallon is only 6" tall and I think it will fit without cutting the trunk floor out. The 12 gallon is 9" tall which is more typical. I'll still have to cut the floor for the fill plate with the 8 gallon, but I think it will look pretty "sano". Any thoughts on the subject would be appreciated. Thanks, Dave H. From timmurph at fastbytes.com Mon Mar 8 21:05:34 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 22:05:34 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance Message-ID: <000f01cabf3d$c607a320$5216e960$@com> Thanks again for the replies. I loosened the center main block and "bumped" the crank back and forth to center the block, as suggested. Then retorqued it and checked for clearance and endplay. I still couldn't get much endplay trying to pry the crank front and back so I "wedged" it front and back using a big "tanker" screwdriver as the wedge between the center bearing block and the crank. That worked and I got .004 on the dial indicator and .005 with feeler gauges for clearance. Apparently it takes a bit of force to move the crank back and forward but I'm sure the clutch pushes even harder than my gently tapping the wedge in to move it. At least my measurements now make some sense. Still learning! Tim From kaskas at cox.net Mon Mar 8 21:07:37 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 20:07:37 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <20100308230737.67KIT.437808.imail@fed1rmwml46> I first met Sir Sterling at the old Riverside motel, the Caravan. He was just finished registering and I was just starting and we struck up a conversation, he spent twenty minutes with me just talking about British cars and was so charming, I could hardly believe it. He was driving an Aston Marti and was in a big slide into turn 8 with the brake lights on and in complete control ( or I thought so ) great driver. I hope he sees another twenty years, nice man and a great driver. ---- WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: ============= Hi guys, I just read that Stirling Moss was injured when he fell down an elevator shaft at his home. The doors evidently opened but there was a malfunction and the elevator car wasn't there. He then somehow fell down the shaft. The article said that he had surgery on his ankles and was banged up but did not have life threatening injuries. It said he fell 30 feet. Wow. I used to see him at the CanAm races where he was the J Wax spokesman. Got lots of free wax for the car. There was the time when Oscar's wife and Jack's wife took an empty J Wax can, cleaned it out, filled it with butterscotch pudding ( which looked about like the wax) and approached Stirling. One of them stuck her finger into the can, swirled it around, and after asking Moss how many calories were in it, plopped it into her mouth! Moss's eyes about came out of his head! Great moment. Hope he does OK. Bill _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From timmurph at fastbytes.com Mon Mar 8 21:36:55 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 22:36:55 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder In-Reply-To: <4B958EC4.8070606@twcny.rr.com> References: <4B958EC4.8070606@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <001901cabf42$265175e0$72f461a0$@com> Nice job! We have a similar scatter shield that came with the car but it's out of 5/16 plate! By the damage to the "doghouse" (the sheet metal was literally ripped apart) they blew a clutch big time once and made darn sure they wouldn't get hurt if it happened again. Ours isn't as slick as yours in that the plate isn't compound curved like yours. Ours is only used as a race car so the cockpit is pretty bare. The compound curve would tend to keep the "shrapnel" better contained I'd think. We do sort of like having that chunk of metal down by our feet though. Tim 1961 TR4 #317 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark Eginton Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 5:57 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder I was in Lowes and saw some 1/8" steel stock perfect for a scatter shield 3" wide so here is how I spent my weekend: http://www.flickr.com/photos/28599565 at N04 Think it will do the job or is there something I need to consider adding or changing. I plan to run my dad's lightened flywheel which visually has seen a lathe back in the '60s. I had it magnifluxed and it is fine but I still feel the need for a shield - I like being ambulatory... The idea is to keep the car the way he raced it - drive it to the track, pull the windshield and passenger seat - add a plexiglas deflection shield and go have fun. So, I wanted it to hide under the carpet. Thanks, M \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From tony at tonydrews.com Tue Mar 9 00:12:56 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 01:12:56 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Fuel cell size In-Reply-To: <1500220419.1684221268106852436.JavaMail.root@sz0047a.emery ville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <1500220419.1684221268106852436.JavaMail.root@sz0047a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <20100309071334.11AF318763F@autox.team.net> We couldn't go an hour without refueling with a 7 or 8 gallon fuel cell (can't remember which - it would start to run out at 45 minutes), so I went with a 12 gallon in my car so I could run an enduro without needing to refuel in the middle. - Tony Drews At 09:54 PM 3/8/2010, davehogye wrote: >Hello friends, >I'm in the market for a fuel cell for my TR3 race car. What is the >typical gallon size used for TRs. I've seen a few cars with 8 gallon >tanks and a couple with 10 and 12. ATL makes a cell called the "Well >Cell" that is 22"dia. and would fit nicely in the spare tire >compartment. They have an 8 and 12 gallon size. Both are 22"dia. but >the 8 gallon is only 6" tall and I think it will fit without cutting >the trunk floor out. The 12 gallon is 9" tall which is more typical. >I'll still have to cut the floor for the fill plate with the 8 >gallon, but I think it will look pretty "sano". Any thoughts on the >subject would be appreciated. >Thanks, >Dave H. >\ >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tony at tonydrews.com From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 9 01:28:36 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 09:28:36 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com> Sorry to hear this. I see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes race cars or Jag D-Types. I never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Mar 9 07:40:56 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 09:40:56 EST Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire Message-ID: In a message dated 03/08/2010 7:01:39 PM Central Standard Time, jerryvv at roadrunner.com writes: > Bill Dentinger and Bob Kramer may remember our tires that were used on > Skid-Steers and Variable Reach lift trucks. We were an OE option for > several > years on Case, New Holland, John Deere and BobCat equipment. > These days I have trouble remembering why I am chasing Shirley, but I think I remember those tires. Did they look like a tightly wound Rolodex? Bill Dentinger From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 07:42:14 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 09:42:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com> Message-ID: <8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand Prix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Sorry to hear this. see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes ace cars or Jag D-Types. never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From fasttrs at yahoo.com Tue Mar 9 08:05:46 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 07:05:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling carbon fiber TS Message-ID: <93598.70970.qm@web46103.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Carbon Fiber toilet seat?!!! Now THAT sounds like a good new project for ARE! Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 9, 2010, at 8:42 AM, n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand Prix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Sorry to hear this. see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes ace cars or Jag D-Types. never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 9 08:17:22 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 16:17:22 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com> <8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> What the hell is a = Bath???? Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] Gesendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 An: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand Prix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Sorry to hear this. I see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes race cars or Jag D-Types. I never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Mar 9 08:21:21 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 10:21:21 EST Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling Message-ID: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> In a message dated 03/08/2010 10:33:03 PM Central Standard Time, kaskas at cox.net writes: > I first met Sir Sterling at the old Riverside motel, the Caravan. He was > just finished registering and I was just starting and we struck up a > conversation, he spent twenty minutes with me just talking about British cars > and was so charming, I could hardly believe it. He was driving an Aston > Marti and was in a big slide into turn 8 with the brake lights on and in > complete control ( or I thought so ) great driver. I hope he sees another twenty > years, nice man and a great driver. > Kas... The chance that I might end up in the same race as Sir Sterling Moss borders on unthinkable, but in fact I've raced in the same race sessions with him at two events at ROAD AMERICA and one at BLACKHAWK FARMS (of all places). Ray Irwin hired him as the Grand Marshall of the first Blackhawk Vintage Classic. I stood next to him at several Driver's Meetings, where he was very accessible, and made you feel like...hey! We're all racers together here. 'Charming' is a good choice of words. He had clear concerns about the equipment and talent disparity in vintage racing, and how it should be dealt with. In particular he did not like seeing cars with slicks on the track at the same time as cars with treaded tires. But what I remember best is a Chicago Historic Races event at ROAD AMERICA when there was an ASTON MARTIN/FERRARI CHALLENGE. ASTON MARTIN and FERRARI both sent a gaggle of their museum pieces over here along with world class drivers (including Sir Sterling, who I think drove the DB2). I was in my TR3. I can't remember how many times he lapped me, but I sure remember how it happened each time. My car would be at top speed. I'd see this little green dot in my rear view mirror. I'd get ready. There is always a lot of me hanging out of my TR3, and I'd point my desire to be passed driver's left. In the blink of an eye he'd go by in a flash like I was standing still. The first time I was tempted to get out to see if perhaps I'd stopped. But after the pass there was always a big wave from Sir Sterling. He was a Class Act and very sensitive to us amateur vintage racers. That was a very big deal for me, and a fond memory. Bill Dentinger From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 08:21:18 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 10:21:18 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling carbon fiber TS In-Reply-To: <93598.70970.qm@web46103.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <93598.70970.qm@web46103.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CC8DB34D1771F8-611C-D630@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> There was a time when speed was an issue in the Water Closet. Mayo Clinic took care of that. Bill Babcock has one in his 'Aluminum Overcast' trailer...I think his is just a weight issue, tho. -----Original Message----- From: Mike Munson To: n197tr4 at cs.com Cc: tr4racing at googlemail.com ; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:05 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling carbon fiber TS Carbon Fiber toilet seat?!!! Now THAT sounds like a good new project for ARE! ike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 9, 2010, at 8:42 AM, n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk arms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv Uncle Jack. Joe ----Original Message----- rom: MadMarx o: fot at autox.team.net ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling orry to hear this. ee him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes ce cars or Jag D-Types. ever spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) hris ______________________________________________ t at autox.team.net nate: http://www.team.net/donate.html chive: http://www.team.net/archive rums: http://www.team.net/forums subscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 08:31:42 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 10:31:42 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com><8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> Message-ID: <8CC8DB4C0BC7F58-611C-D965@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling What the hell is a = Bath???? Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe ----Original Message----- rom: MadMarx o: fot at autox.team.net ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling orry to hear this. see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes ace cars or Jag D-Types. never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From billb at bnj.com Tue Mar 9 08:46:03 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 05:46:03 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> References: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> Message-ID: <0030A02D-E280-4D0E-884A-21C17ABA296F@bnj.com> You guys sound like you're doing an eulogy. Sir Stirling is a tough old bird. Reminds me of a Monty Python line: "I'm not dead yet". I've also had the pleasure of meeting him and his charming wife Suzy a few times. I hope to meet him again soon. From billb at bnj.com Tue Mar 9 08:53:57 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 05:53:57 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <0030A02D-E280-4D0E-884A-21C17ABA296F@bnj.com> References: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> <0030A02D-E280-4D0E-884A-21C17ABA296F@bnj.com> Message-ID: <5CCE3761-86B1-4CAE-9585-B47FA743117C@bnj.com> That's odd, the last part got lopped off. It said: Oh, and the reason for the Carbon Fibre seat of ease in Nero is simple--Carbon Fiber makes you go faster. On Mar 9, 2010, at 5:46 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: > You guys sound like you're doing an eulogy. Sir Stirling is a tough old bird. > Reminds me of a Monty Python line: "I'm not dead yet". > > I've also had the pleasure of meeting him and his charming wife Suzy a few > times. I hope to meet him again soon. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From kaskas at cox.net Tue Mar 9 09:43:41 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 8:43:41 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder In-Reply-To: <4B958EC4.8070606@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <20100309114341.HSXYP.382893.imail@fed1rmwml43> That method works okay, I have used it in the past and also using heavy belting. three inches isn't very wide but two pieces welded side to side should be great. History of blows up in that area showed me that it was the clutch that went away first and sometimes takes the flywheel with it. ---- Mark Eginton wrote: ============= I was in Lowes and saw some 1/8" steel stock perfect for a scatter shield 3" wide so here is how I spent my weekend: http://www.flickr.com/photos/28599565 at N04 Think it will do the job or is there something I need to consider adding or changing. I plan to run my dad's lightened flywheel which visually has seen a lathe back in the '60s. I had it magnifluxed and it is fine but I still feel the need for a shield - I like being ambulatory... The idea is to keep the car the way he raced it - drive it to the track, pull the windshield and passenger seat - add a plexiglas deflection shield and go have fun. So, I wanted it to hide under the carpet. Thanks, M _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Tue Mar 9 09:44:00 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 11:44:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com><8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> <8CC8DB4C0BC7F58-611C-D965@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Not to mention crapper, maned after the intrepid British guy who invented it. I read somewhere that he is now Sir Crapper. I'd type more but I have to use the can. The head for you sailers. Gotta go. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 10:31 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > > > What the hell is a = Bath???? > Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] > esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 > n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net > etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand > rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at > lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat > upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. > Joe > ----Original Message----- > rom: MadMarx > o: fot at autox.team.net > ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am > ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > orry to hear this. > see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes > ace cars or Jag D-Types. > never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) > Chris > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 09:47:11 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 11:47:11 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <8CC8DBF4C82B0F7-67A0-15A5@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> You dont have to get ANAL about this. -----Original Message----- From: WILLIAM TOBIN To: n197tr4 at cs.com; tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 10:44 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Not to mention crapper, maned after the intrepid British guy who invented t. I read somewhere that he is now Sir Crapper. I'd type more but I have to use the can. The head for you sailers. Gotta go. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 10:31 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > > > What the hell is a = Bath???? > Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] > esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 > n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net > etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba rand > rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at > lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat > upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. > Joe > ----Original Message----- > rom: MadMarx > o: fot at autox.team.net > ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am > ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > orry to hear this. > see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes > ace cars or Jag D-Types. > never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) > Chris > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: ttp://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 09:58:26 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 11:58:26 -0500 Subject: [Fot] HEARTLAND VINTAGE GRAND PRIX RAMADA / HOLIDAY INN / HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS Message-ID: <8CC8DC0DEA50812-67A0-1938@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> FOT, Entries are coming in for the KASTNER CUP......The host hotel is the Ramada Inn and rooms have been set aside for this event...just mention it in your reservation. The Holiday Inn and Holiday Inn Express are alternatives and are properties owned by the same corporation. Thanks! Joe A From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 9 10:09:48 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 18:09:48 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <20100309113831.2GC8Y.382799.imail@fed1rmwml43> References: <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> <20100309113831.2GC8Y.382799.imail@fed1rmwml43> Message-ID: <003901cabfab$54303a00$fc90ae00$@com> Seems that I have a lack of knowledge about house equipment in US language. -----UrsprC wrote: ============= What the hell is a = Bath???? Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] Gesendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 An: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand Prix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Sorry to hear this. I see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes race cars or Jag D-Types. I never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Tue Mar 9 10:22:57 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 12:22:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling References: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <8CC8DBF4C82B0F7-67A0-15A5@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <010d01cabfad$299357d0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Good one Joe!----- Original Message ----- From: n197tr4 at cs.com To: william.tobin3 at verizon.net ; tr4racing at googlemail.com ; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 11:47 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling You dont have to get ANAL about this. -----Original Message----- From: WILLIAM TOBIN To: n197tr4 at cs.com; tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 10:44 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Not to mention crapper, maned after the intrepid British guy who invented it. I read somewhere that he is now Sir Crapper. I'd type more but I have to use the can. The head for you sailers. Gotta go. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 10:31 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > > > What the hell is a = Bath???? > Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] > esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 > n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net > etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand > rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at > lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat > upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. > Joe > ----Original Message----- > rom: MadMarx > o: fot at autox.team.net > ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am > ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > orry to hear this. > see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes > ace cars or Jag D-Types. > never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) > Chris > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From emanteno at gmail.com Tue Mar 9 10:24:12 2010 From: emanteno at gmail.com (Irv Korey) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 11:24:12 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> References: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> Message-ID: <354a1781003090924k7cd879b1j6736167b10b3295b@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, Mar 9, 2010 at 9:21 AM, wrote: But what I remember best is a Chicago Historic Races event at ROAD AMERICA > when there was an ASTON MARTIN/FERRARI CHALLENGE. ASTON MARTIN and FERRARI both sent a > gaggle of their museum > pieces over here along with world class drivers (including Sir Sterling, > who I > think drove the DB2). I was in my TR3. I can't remember how many times he > lapped me, but I sure remember how it happened each time. My car would be > at > top speed. I'd see this little green dot in my rear view mirror. I'd get > ready. There is always a lot of me hanging out of my TR3, and I'd point my > desire to be passed driver's left. In the blink of an eye he'd go by in a > flash like I was standing still. The first time I was tempted to get out > to > see if perhaps I'd stopped. But after the pass there was always a big wave > from Sir Sterling. He was a Class Act and very sensitive to us amateur > vintage racers. That was a very big deal for me, and a fond memory. > That very race was my first as a corner worker. I remember that Aston very well from my vantage point at Corner 1 (back when we flagged from drivers' right in Corner 1). Every time he went by, he waved and smiled to the workers. What a wonderful memory. Irv From budscars at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 10:48:59 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 09:48:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling References: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> <0030A02D-E280-4D0E-884A-21C17ABA296F@bnj.com> Message-ID: Mark Twain.....Wrote an article in the Territorial Enterprise, Virginia city, NV..."The Reports Of My Death Have Been Greatly Exaggerated" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 7:46 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > You guys sound like you're doing an eulogy. Sir Stirling is a tough old > bird. > Reminds me of a Monty Python line: "I'm not dead yet". > > I've also had the pleasure of meeting him and his charming wife Suzy a few > times. I hope to meet him again soon. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 11:15:41 2010 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (toodamnfunky at comcast.net) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 18:15:41 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] HEARTLAND VINTAGE GRAND PRIX RAMADA / HOLIDAY INN / HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS In-Reply-To: <8CC8DC0DEA50812-67A0-1938@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <1115235081.2153891268158541675.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Joe, The Cup date is in direct conflict with an SCCA date in Colorado. Depending on where I'm at in the points will determine whether I can attend. I won't know until August. Will there be any problems with a late entry ? Thanks, Jim G. ----- Original Message ----- From: n197tr4 at cs.com To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2010 9:58:26 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain Subject: [Fot] HEARTLAND VINTAGE GRAND PRIX RAMADA / HOLIDAY INN / HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS FOT, Entries are coming in for the KASTNER CUP......The host hotel is the Ramada Inn and rooms have been set aside for this event...just mention it in your reservation. The Holiday Inn and Holiday Inn Express are alternatives and are properties owned by the same corporation. Thanks! B Joe A \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/toodamnfunky at comcast.net From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 11:32:04 2010 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 13:32:04 EST Subject: [Fot] HEARTLAND VINTAGE GRAND PRIX Message-ID: <206c5.4206a68c.38c7ee24@cs.com> Jim, There is no penalty for late entries for the FOT. Probably no one else, either. Early Entries would be appreciated, so we have a sense of where we are at. Indications are that this will be strongly attended by the FOT....all things considered, it is not a huge surprise. And we will be VERY WELL RECEIVED. Perhaps entries can be refunded fully intact. I will check on the policy regarding this. This is a first time event and should be VERY user friendly. Hope you can make it, but wish you well in SCCA points. Joe A > Joe, > The Cup date is in direct conflict with an SCCA date in Colorado. > Depending on where > I'm at in the points will determine whether I can attend. I won't know > until August. > Will there be any problems with a late entry ? > Thanks, > Jim G. > > From dlhogye at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 11:33:41 2010 From: dlhogye at comcast.net (davehogye) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 18:33:41 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Fuel cell info, Thanks Message-ID: <1628173668.1894981268159621482.JavaMail.root@sz0047a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Thanks guys for the information, photos and suggestions about fuel cells. The choice was kind of split down middle regarding size, but I don't think that I'd regret having more capacity available. Dave H. From wensley_tr at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 11:45:52 2010 From: wensley_tr at comcast.net (Craig) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 13:45:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com><8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> <8CC8DB4C0BC7F58-611C-D965@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <002001cabfb8$bed29580$3c77c080$@net> Don't forget pit stop Craig -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of WILLIAM TOBIN Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 11:44 AM To: n197tr4 at cs.com; tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Not to mention crapper, maned after the intrepid British guy who invented it. I read somewhere that he is now Sir Crapper. I'd type more but I have to use the can. The head for you sailers. Gotta go. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 10:31 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > > > What the hell is a = Bath???? > Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] > esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 > n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net > etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand > rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at > lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat > upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. > Joe > ----Original Message----- > rom: MadMarx > o: fot at autox.team.net > ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am > ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > orry to hear this. > see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes > ace cars or Jag D-Types. > never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) > Chris > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/wensley_tr at comcast.net From lang at isis.mit.edu Tue Mar 9 11:45:50 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 13:45:50 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Message from Sir Stirling (fwd) Message-ID: hey. Supposedly from Sir Stirling himself... BTW, neat web site (motorsportcollector.com) with kool stuff. NFI, of course. rml ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 12:20:31 -0500 (EST) From: The Motorsport Collector To: blang at mit.edu Subject: Message from Sir Stirling ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ March 9, 2010 Update: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Dear Robert, As most of you know, 80 year old Sir Stirling Moss stepped into an empty elevator shaft in his London home over the weekend, falling 3 stories, suffering broken bones in his feet and ankles and damaged vertebra. The good news is that Stirling's injuries are not life threatening and that his heart and mind (as well as his typing fingers) are as strong as ever. Stirling sent this email message to his many friends and fans around the world: ======================== TO ALL MY FRIENDS (AND ALL THOSE WHO ARE KIND ENOUGH TO CARE), DEAR ALL OF YOU, THE LAST FEW DAYS HAVE BEEN QUITE FANTASTIC AND I'D LIKE TO THANK EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU FOR YOUR KIND THOUGHTS, MESSAGES AND OTHER PARAPHERNALIA. ON SATURDAY EVENING, I WAS AT HOME WITH SUSIE, ELLIOT AND HELEN AND ABOUT TO LEAVE FOR A CURRY, FOR WHICH WE WERE RUNNING LATE. I ASKED HELEN TO JOIN ME IN THE LIFT TO GO DOWNSTAIRS, BECAUSE SUSIE AND ELLIOT WERE SMART ENOUGH NOT TO RIDE IN MY LIFT. I OPENED THE DOOR AND STEPPED INTO THE LIFT, WITH HELEN READY TO FOLLOW ME, WHICH SHE NEVER DID. THAT IS BECAUSE THE LIFT HAD STOPPED ON THE FLOOR ABOVE AND INCORRECTLY ALLOWED THE DOOR BENEATH IT TO OPEN. STILL CHATTING TO HELEN, I STEPPED INTO THE OPEN DOORWAY-- AND FELL TO THE BOTTOM OF THE LIFT SHAFT. THE AMBULANCE WAS CALLED AND ARRIVED AT RACING SPEED, WHEREUPON THEY PUT ME ONTO A SERIES OF ABOUT 10 STRETCHERS! HAVING FINALLY SETTLED ON WHAT MUST HAVE SEEMED A GOOD ONE, I WAS TAKEN, ALONG WITH MY FAMILY TO THE ROYAL LONDON HOSPITAL IN WHITECHAPEL, WHERE THEY USED ANOTHER BATCH OF SIMILAR STRETCHERS! THEY DID A GOOD JOB OF HELPING ME, BUT WERE UNABLE TO DO THE REQUISITE SURGERY. SO, ON THE SUNDAY, I WAS MOVED TO THE PRINCESS GRACE, WHERE A FANTASTICALLY EFFICIENT, KIND AND AMUSING STAFF DID ALL THE JOBS. I AM NOW IN A LOVELY ROOM, NUMBER 222, AND WITH THE HELP OF ELLIOT AND THE PORTER, AM FINALLY ON THE EMAIL. THAT DOES NOT MEAN THAT I WILL BE ABLE TO ACTUALLY SEND THIS TO YOU, BUT I WILL TRY! NOW FOR THE FUTURE... WHICH I CAN SEE WITH SUSIE, HELEN AND ELLIOT AROUND ME, IS GOING TO BE A BLOODY STRUGGLE! AS SOME OF YOU MAY KNOW, SUSIE AND I ARE BOOKED ON A SEABOURN CRUISE FOR OUR 30TH ANNIVERSARY, NEXT MONTH. I HAVE TO CROSS THE HURDLE OF GETTING THE DOCORS, AND FAMLY HANGERS-ON, TO ALLOW ME TO THIN MY BLOOD, IN ORDER TO AVOID ANY ISSUES INVOLVING DEEP VEIN THROMBOSIS. IT WILL BE SIX TO EIGHT WEEKS FROM SUNDAY BEFORE I WILL ABLE TO PUT ANY LOAD ON MY FEET. THEREFORE I'M FACING MY SIXTH OR SEVENTH REDUCTION TO A WHEELCHAIR (SUSIE SAYS SHE'S STOPPED COUNTING) WHICH I MUST ADMIT, IS RATHER BORING. THE GOOD NEWS IS; THAT I DIDN'T SELL THE WHEELCHAIR AFTER THE LAST SHUNT! THE WHOLE THING IS A REAL PAIN IN THE ARSE, IF I HAD LOOKED WHERE I WAS GOING, I WOULDN'T BE HERE AT ALL, SO IT'S MY OWN DAMN FAULT. I HAVE BEEN ABSOLUTELY OVERWHELMED BY YOUR COLLECTIVE CONCERN AND KINDNESS. I CAN TELL YOU THAT CURRENTLY I'M LYING IN HOSPITAL, TAKING DEEP BREATHS, LIFTING ONE ARM WITH THE OTHER, RAISING MY LEGS (WITH PLASTERS ON THE END) AND DOING ALL I CAN DO TO KEEP MYSELF AS MOBILE AS POSSIBLE, BUT, HAVING SAID THAT, I'M NOT YET WINNING THE BATTLE. I'M NOT SURE WHEN I'LL BE ABLE TO GO HOME BUT THE LIFT HAS TO WORK, OTHERWISE I'LL NEVER BE ABLE TO GET UPSTAIRS IN MY WHEELCHAIR, MAYBE I'LL GO AND STAY WITH HELEN AND ELLIOT FOR A WHILE... THIS REALLY HAS OPENED MY EYES TO HOW KIND ALL MY FRIENDS ARE, OVER AN OLD EX- RACING DRIVER, FLOGGING A FADING IMAGE! I LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOU SOON, MANY THANKS FOR ALL OF YOUR THOUGHTS, CIAO From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Tue Mar 9 16:02:40 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 18:02:40 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder In-Reply-To: <20100309114341.HSXYP.382893.imail@fed1rmwml43> References: <20100309114341.HSXYP.382893.imail@fed1rmwml43> Message-ID: <4B96D390.6090206@twcny.rr.com> Do I need to go a full 6" wide. I need more stock so narrower is easier to work with but no sense in scrimping if its necessary. Thanks! M Kas Kastner wrote: > That method works okay, I have used it in the past and also using heavy belting. three inches isn't very wide but two pieces welded side to side should be great. History of blows up in that area showed me that it was the clutch that went away first and sometimes takes the flywheel with it. > ---- Mark Eginton wrote: > > ============= > I was in Lowes and saw some 1/8" steel stock perfect for a scatter > shield 3" wide so here is how I spent my weekend: > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/28599565 at N04 > > Think it will do the job or is there something I need to consider adding > or changing. I plan to run my dad's lightened flywheel which visually > has seen a lathe back in the '60s. I had it magnifluxed and it is fine > but I still feel the need for a shield - I like being ambulatory... > > The idea is to keep the car the way he raced it - drive it to the track, > pull the windshield and passenger seat - add a plexiglas deflection > shield and go have fun. So, I wanted it to hide under the carpet. > > Thanks, > > M > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net > > > > -- > Never be beaten by equipment From mdhado at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 18:39:00 2010 From: mdhado at comcast.net (M&M Hado) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 19:39:00 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance In-Reply-To: <000f01cabf3d$c607a320$5216e960$@com> Message-ID: Hi Tim, Just some more food for thought. No, it should NOT take a lot of force at all to move the crank fore & aft. I'm doing my 3B now and also a TR4 for a friend at the same time and I can push the crank with my fingers alone on one of the crank webs. Do you have the front & rear bearing caps on as well? It sounds to me like your bearing bores are no longer lined up and the crank journals are binding a bit in the bearings. If this is the case with yours, a simple line bore at a machine shop will do wonders. What they do is take off a few thousands of an inch off the bearing cap split lines which lowers them by that much (and makes then slightly egg-shape), and then "line bore" through all three caps at the same time with a long hone back to the original diameter. They are now concentric. This is before putting in the liners, of course. I think I paid about $125 the last time I had it done. Think about the crank sitting in the bearings with .002" clearance or so and, if you really have a straight line, the crank will move VERY easily because of that clearance. It should not bind at all. Also, I agree wholeheartedly about bumping the crank back and forth to "set" the center cap to where the upper and lower halves of the thrust washer are in the same plane. The last bump should be forward, which is the normal direction of thrust. The rear thrust ring is the one that does all of the work when you push on the clutch. Good luck! Mike Hado -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Tim Murphy Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 10:06 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Cc: rpm724 at att.net; ryan.murphy at fdlco.wi.gov Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance Thanks again for the replies. I loosened the center main block and "bumped" the crank back and forth to center the block, as suggested. Then retorqued it and checked for clearance and endplay. I still couldn't get much endplay trying to pry the crank front and back so I "wedged" it front and back using a big "tanker" screwdriver as the wedge between the center bearing block and the crank. That worked and I got .004 on the dial indicator and .005 with feeler gauges for clearance. Apparently it takes a bit of force to move the crank back and forward but I'm sure the clutch pushes even harder than my gently tapping the wedge in to move it. At least my measurements now make some sense. Still learning! Tim \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mdhado at comcast.net From timmurph at fastbytes.com Tue Mar 9 20:15:56 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 21:15:56 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance In-Reply-To: References: <000f01cabf3d$c607a320$5216e960$@com> Message-ID: <002301cac000$009fdc10$01df9430$@com> Good point about pushing it forward in the same direction as the clutch force. When I first did the fore/aft bit to look for end play I just had the center bearing in. The second time I had the center and front bearing in. Even with all 3 mains installed and the rods not yet connected the crank rotated VERY (sorry for the caps, my underline doesn't work on a reply) freely, so I don't think there is any binding in the bearings. Not sure what is going on. I'm pretty sure it will run okay as the new thrust bearings are the same thickness within less than a half thou of the old ones and they worked okay. And the last two times I installed the crank I didn't "center" the center bearing block as I did upon the suggestions this time. Must have gotten lucky! Tim -----Original Message----- From: M&M Hado [mailto:mdhado at comcast.net] Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 7:39 PM To: Tim Murphy Cc: rpm724 at att.net; ryan.murphy at fdlco.wi.gov; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance Hi Tim, Just some more food for thought. No, it should NOT take a lot of force at all to move the crank fore & aft. I'm doing my 3B now and also a TR4 for a friend at the same time and I can push the crank with my fingers alone on one of the crank webs. Do you have the front & rear bearing caps on as well? It sounds to me like your bearing bores are no longer lined up and the crank journals are binding a bit in the bearings. If this is the case with yours, a simple line bore at a machine shop will do wonders. What they do is take off a few thousands of an inch off the bearing cap split lines which lowers them by that much (and makes then slightly egg-shape), and then "line bore" through all three caps at the same time with a long hone back to the original diameter. They are now concentric. This is before putting in the liners, of course. I think I paid about $125 the last time I had it done. Think about the crank sitting in the bearings with .002" clearance or so and, if you really have a straight line, the crank will move VERY easily because of that clearance. It should not bind at all. Also, I agree wholeheartedly about bumping the crank back and forth to "set" the center cap to where the upper and lower halves of the thrust washer are in the same plane. The last bump should be forward, which is the normal direction of thrust. The rear thrust ring is the one that does all of the work when you push on the clutch. Good luck! Mike Hado -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Tim Murphy Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 10:06 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Cc: rpm724 at att.net; ryan.murphy at fdlco.wi.gov Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance Thanks again for the replies. I loosened the center main block and "bumped" the crank back and forth to center the block, as suggested. Then retorqued it and checked for clearance and endplay. I still couldn't get much endplay trying to pry the crank front and back so I "wedged" it front and back using a big "tanker" screwdriver as the wedge between the center bearing block and the crank. That worked and I got .004 on the dial indicator and .005 with feeler gauges for clearance. Apparently it takes a bit of force to move the crank back and forward but I'm sure the clutch pushes even harder than my gently tapping the wedge in to move it. At least my measurements now make some sense. Still learning! Tim \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mdhado at comcast.net From mpendy at dishmail.net Tue Mar 9 20:28:26 2010 From: mpendy at dishmail.net (Mark Pendergrass) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 19:28:26 -0800 Subject: [Fot] webers-manifold Message-ID: FoTer's, had enough horseing around with these hogged-out SU's, looking to see if i find a set of webers and intake for the tr4 . For a race motor, can a guy get the 40's to work well or do i need to step up to the ? Any input would be helpful.....Thanks.....Mark P From rjohns at woh.rr.com Tue Mar 9 21:17:25 2010 From: rjohns at woh.rr.com (Robert Johns) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 23:17:25 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling ( Bob Johns) Message-ID: I enjoyed all the old stories about all of your memories of seeing and meeting Stirling, so I might as well tell my story. In 1955, I had some time to run up to the Nurburgring to get in a few practice laps. When I got there, some factory had the course engaged for practice. I don't remember what team. That isn't important. I was walking around the pit lane and ran into Stirling, also, just standing around at the moment. We talked, and after a bit, he said, "Let's go get a cup of coffee." So, we went across the course to the hotel cafe and sat and enjoyed a cup together. He has always been that easy to access and talk to. This has always been one of my fondest memories of my time in Europe. Bob J From tr4racing at googlemail.com Wed Mar 10 01:28:13 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:28:13 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable chain wheels In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000701cac02b$a1189530$e349bf90$@com> Just a thought. (I hope I get this explained well) There were some worn out distributor drives in the past where the teeth on the cam gear has gone thin and broke after a while. Were on these cams adjustable chain wheels mounted with an aluminum center mounting plate? I saw one of these adjustable chain wheels with aluminum center plate that has worn out at the contact spot with the bearing housing. The cam started floating from that and this might damage the gears after a while. The chain wheel needs only a few races to wear out. There are adjustable chain wheels with steel center plate that should not cause this trouble. Might worth to check your wheels if they have some future trouble in store. Cheers Chris From yellow-green at sbcglobal.net Wed Mar 10 06:37:25 2010 From: yellow-green at sbcglobal.net (Dennis DeLap) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 05:37:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> Message-ID: <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Friends Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line system. This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid to the front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was eliminated. Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. Thanks Dennis From tr4racing at googlemail.com Wed Mar 10 06:47:47 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 14:47:47 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000b01cac058$46c4d440$d44e7cc0$@com> In combination with the rear brakes this restrictor valve takes car that the linings of the front brake don't move away from the rotors. You get less pedal travel with that valve installed. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Dennis DeLap Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 14:37 An: FOT Betreff: [Fot] Restrictor Valve Friends Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line system. This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid to the front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was eliminated. Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. Thanks Dennis \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From mlcooknj at msn.com Wed Mar 10 07:41:18 2010 From: mlcooknj at msn.com (michael cook) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:41:18 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling ( Bob Johns) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I was fortunate to meet Moss at one of the Jaguar launch events he attended over here. It was particular fun to see him get into a car and immediately slam the seat back, giving him the room for his straight-arm driving style. He did this regardless of whether it was a brand-new XJ or a vintage Mark VII or S-type. But my favorite Moss story isn't about Stirling. At Nelson Ledges for the 24-hour back in the 1980s, driver Innes Ireland wandered the paddock wearing a T-shirt that said: "I TAUGHT STIRLING MOSS HOW TO DRIVE" The following year, Ireland had a new shirt saying: "I TAUGHT STIRLING MOSS HOW TO DRINK" But of course he didn't - Moss doesn't drink ... never has. Mike Cook > From: rjohns at woh.rr.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 23:17:25 -0500 > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling ( Bob Johns) > > I enjoyed all the old stories about all of your memories of seeing and meeting > Stirling, so I might as well tell my story. In 1955, I had some time to run > up to the Nurburgring to get in a few practice laps. When I got there, some > factory had the course engaged for practice. I don't remember what team. > That isn't important. I was walking around the pit lane and ran into > Stirling, also, just standing around at the moment. We talked, and after a > bit, he said, "Let's go get a cup of coffee." So, we went across the course > to the hotel cafe and sat and enjoyed a cup together. He has always been that > easy to access and talk to. This has always been one of my fondest memories of > my time in Europe. > Bob J > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mlcooknj at msn.com From cwnfot at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 08:18:07 2010 From: cwnfot at gmail.com (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 10:18:07 -0500 Subject: [Fot] FW: Message from Sir Stirling Moss Message-ID: <006a01cac064$e520b8f0$af622ad0$@com> As most of you know, 80 year old Sir Stirling Moss stepped into an empty elevator shaft in his London home over the weekend, falling 3 stories, suffering broken bones in his feet and ankles and damaged vertebra. The good news is that Stirling's injuries are not life threatening and that his heart and mind (as well as his typing fingers) are as strong as ever. Stirling sent this email message to his many friends and fans around the world: ======================== TO ALL MY FRIENDS (AND ALL THOSE WHO ARE KIND ENOUGH TO CARE), DEAR ALL OF YOU, THE LAST FEW DAYS HAVE BEEN QUITE FANTASTIC AND I'D LIKE TO THANK EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU FOR YOUR KIND THOUGHTS, MESSAGES AND OTHER PARAPHERNALIA. ON SATURDAY EVENING, I WAS AT HOME WITH SUSIE, ELLIOT AND HELEN AND ABOUT TO LEAVE FOR A CURRY, FOR WHICH WE WERE RUNNING LATE. I ASKED HELEN TO JOIN ME IN THE LIFT TO GO DOWNSTAIRS, BECAUSE SUSIE AND ELLIOT WERE SMART ENOUGH NOT TO RIDE IN MY LIFT. I OPENED THE DOOR AND STEPPED INTO THE LIFT, WITH HELEN READY TO FOLLOW ME, WHICH SHE NEVER DID. THAT IS BECAUSE THE LIFT HAD STOPPED ON THE FLOOR ABOVE AND INCORRECTLY ALLOWED THE DOOR BENEATH IT TO OPEN. STILL CHATTING TO HELEN, I STEPPED INTO THE OPEN DOORWAY-- AND FELL TO THE BOTTOM OF THE LIFT SHAFT. THE AMBULANCE WAS CALLED AND ARRIVED AT RACING SPEED, WHEREUPON THEY PUT ME ONTO A SERIES OF ABOUT 10 STRETCHERS! HAVING FINALLY SETTLED ON WHAT MUST HAVE SEEMED A GOOD ONE, I WAS TAKEN, ALONG WITH MY FAMILY TO THE ROYAL LONDON HOSPITAL IN WHITECHAPEL, WHERE THEY USED ANOTHER BATCH OF SIMILAR STRETCHERS! THEY DID A GOOD JOB OF HELPING ME, BUT WERE UNABLE TO DO THE REQUISITE SURGERY. SO, ON THE SUNDAY, I WAS MOVED TO THE PRINCESS GRACE, WHERE A FANTASTICALLY EFFICIENT, KIND AND AMUSING STAFF DID ALL THE JOBS. I AM NOW IN A LOVELY ROOM, NUMBER 222, AND WITH THE HELP OF ELLIOT AND THE PORTER, AM FINALLY ON THE EMAIL. THAT DOES NOT MEAN THAT I WILL BE ABLE TO ACTUALLY SEND THIS TO YOU, BUT I WILL TRY! NOW FOR THE FUTURE... WHICH I CAN SEE WITH SUSIE, HELEN AND ELLIOT AROUND ME, IS GOING TO BE A BLOODY STRUGGLE! AS SOME OF YOU MAY KNOW, SUSIE AND I ARE BOOKED ON A SEABOURN CRUISE FOR OUR 30TH ANNIVERSARY, NEXT MONTH. I HAVE TO CROSS THE HURDLE OF GETTING THE DOCORS, AND FAMLY HANGERS-ON, TO ALLOW ME TO THIN MY BLOOD, IN ORDER TO AVOID ANY ISSUES INVOLVING DEEP VEIN THROMBOSIS. IT WILL BE SIX TO EIGHT WEEKS FROM SUNDAY BEFORE I WILL ABLE TO PUT ANY LOAD ON MY FEET. THEREFORE I'M FACING MY SIXTH OR SEVENTH REDUCTION TO A WHEELCHAIR (SUSIE SAYS SHE'S STOPPED COUNTING) WHICH I MUST ADMIT, IS RATHER BORING. THE GOOD NEWS IS; THAT I DIDN'T SELL THE WHEELCHAIR AFTER THE LAST SHUNT! THE WHOLE THING IS A REAL PAIN IN THE ARSE, IF I HAD LOOKED WHERE I WAS GOING, I WOULDN'T BE HERE AT ALL, SO IT'S MY OWN DAMN FAULT. I HAVE BEEN ABSOLUTELY OVERWHELMED BY YOUR COLLECTIVE CONCERN AND KINDNESS. I CAN TELL YOU THAT CURRENTLY I'M LYING IN HOSPITAL, TAKING DEEP BREATHS, LIFTING ONE ARM WITH THE OTHER, RAISING MY LEGS (WITH PLASTERS ON THE END) AND DOING ALL I CAN DO TO KEEP MYSELF AS MOBILE AS POSSIBLE, BUT, HAVING SAID THAT, I'M NOT YET WINNING THE BATTLE. I'M NOT SURE WHEN I'LL BE ABLE TO GO HOME BUT THE LIFT HAS TO WORK, OTHERWISE I'LL NEVER BE ABLE TO GET UPSTAIRS IN MY WHEELCHAIR, MAYBE I'LL GO AND STAY WITH HELEN AND ELLIOT FOR A WHILE... THIS REALLY HAS OPENED MY EYES TO HOW KIND ALL MY FRIENDS ARE, OVER AN OLD EX- RACING DRIVER, FLOGGING A FADING IMAGE! I LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOU SOON, MANY THANKS FOR ALL OF YOUR THOUGHTS, CIAO ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ This email came from Paul at the MotorSportCollector. email: pz at motorsportcollector.com phone: 630.515.1440 web: http://www.motorsportcollector.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From billb at bnj.com Wed Mar 10 08:38:16 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 05:38:16 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> It's a typical disk brake residual pressure valve that keeps a few pounds of pressure on the calipers to keep the pads from withdrawing too much. On Mar 10, 2010, at 3:37 AM, Dennis DeLap wrote: > Friends > > Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what > Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line system. > This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid to the > front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was eliminated. > Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. > > Thanks > Dennis > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Wed Mar 10 08:44:02 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 07:44:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <069f01cac068$82c9b770$0301a8c0@randall> > Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. It's more accurately called a residual pressure valve; it basically keeps the front brake pistons from being knocked back into the caliper when the spindle flexes. If you simply disable it as many do, the brake pedal may be low after a hard turn. A better solution IMO is the spacers and uprated spindles developed by uncle jack. http://www.zeni.net/trf/TR6-250GC/119.php?s_wt=1680&s_ht=1050 These address the root of the problem, rather than band-aiding the symptom. Randall From tony at tonydrews.com Wed Mar 10 08:59:34 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:59:34 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> Message-ID: <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> If you're converting from a single circuit brake system to a dual circuit one, that valve would stay in the front brake circuit. It's not needed in the rear brake circuit. - Tony At 09:38 AM 3/10/2010, you wrote: >It's a typical disk brake residual pressure valve that keeps a few pounds of >pressure on the calipers to keep the pads from withdrawing too much. >On Mar 10, 2010, at 3:37 AM, Dennis DeLap wrote: > > > Friends > > > > Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what > > Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line >system. > > This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid to >the > > front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was >eliminated. > > Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. > > > > Thanks > > Dennis > > \ From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 10 10:26:40 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 10:26:40 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Message-ID: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> Well, it might be interesting to one or two folks on this list: http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 mjb. From tlizzard at msn.com Wed Mar 10 10:28:47 2010 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 12:28:47 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> Message-ID: I miss those cars and the whole climate of IMSA racing at that time. Watched them run at Mid Ohio many times. Thanks for the heads up. Terry Stetler From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 10 11:14:17 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 11:14:17 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4B97E179.6050908@bradakis.com> Terry Stetler wrote: > I miss those cars and the whole climate of IMSA racing at that time. Watched > them run at Mid Ohio many times. > > I only saw them run once at Sears Point in '84. I recall the Mazda rotary had a rather unpleasant howl, but the cars were fun to watch. This Nissan would be a great toy, but I don't think I'll be getting enough Team.Net donations this week to cover it, shucks. mjb. From BillDentin at aol.com Wed Mar 10 11:20:15 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 13:20:15 EST Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Message-ID: <1f0dd.6c66645f.38c93cdf@aol.com> In a message dated 03/10/2010 12:10:44 PM Central Standard Time, mark at bradakis.com writes: > I only saw them run once at Sears Point in '84. I recall the Mazda > rotary had > a rather unpleasant howl, but the cars were fun to watch. > > This Nissan would be a great toy, but I don't think I'll be getting > enough Team.Net donations this week to cover it, shucks. > > Terry... I don't remember if they were there any of the times you have been wrenching at ROAD AMERICA, but for a while two of those NISSAN cars used to paddock along the fence next to the entrance to the False Grid, and right across the road from our traditional paddock space (especially at the SVRA and BRIC) vintage events. The first time I saw one, I smiled at seeing one at a 'vintage' event, and sent Kas a picture saying, "Look what's parked across the road from us at a 'vintage' event." All Kas wanted to know was, "...is she still FAST?" And of course she was. Bill Dentinger From koblinger at verizon.net Wed Mar 10 11:26:37 2010 From: koblinger at verizon.net (koblinger at verizon.net) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 12:26:37 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Message-ID: <1684428337.316294.1268245597223.JavaMail.root@vms244.mailsrvcs.net> From riverside at southslope.net Wed Mar 10 11:33:10 2010 From: riverside at southslope.net (riverside) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 12:33:10 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We didn't have no on board telemetry. Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight was considered proof that i had been too damn slow in the previous corner. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Drews" To: "Dennis Delap" ; Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2010 9:59 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > If you're converting from a single circuit brake system to a dual circuit > one, that valve would stay in the front brake circuit. It's not needed in > the rear brake circuit. > > - Tony > > At 09:38 AM 3/10/2010, you wrote: >>It's a typical disk brake residual pressure valve that keeps a few pounds >>of >>pressure on the calipers to keep the pads from withdrawing too much. >>On Mar 10, 2010, at 3:37 AM, Dennis DeLap wrote: >> >> > Friends >> > >> > Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what >> > Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line >>system. >> > This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid >> > to >>the >> > front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was >>eliminated. >> > Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. >> > >> > Thanks >> > Dennis >> > \ > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net From billb at bnj.com Wed Mar 10 12:23:56 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:23:56 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Message-ID: <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> That's about right, unless you're using the uprated axle setup. The residual pressure valve only helps a little. I don't use any residual pressure on Peyote (I think--I MIGHT have left the valve in that Wilwoods come with) but with the uprated axle I get a high pedal pretty consistently. I like that. pumping brakes doesn't give confidence entering fast corners. On Mar 10, 2010, at 8:33 AM, riverside wrote: > My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We > didn't have no on board telemetry. > > Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight > was considered proof that i had been too damn slow > in the previous corner. > > art de armond From tr4racing at googlemail.com Wed Mar 10 14:32:09 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 22:32:09 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> Message-ID: <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> I don't use any axle upgrade and don't have a long pedal. I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. Since I use ATE blue all trouble is gone. ATE + EBC brake pads doing a fine job at my car. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Bill Babcock Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 20:24 An: riverside Cc: fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve That's about right, unless you're using the uprated axle setup. The residual pressure valve only helps a little. I don't use any residual pressure on Peyote (I think--I MIGHT have left the valve in that Wilwoods come with) but with the uprated axle I get a high pedal pretty consistently. I like that. pumping brakes doesn't give confidence entering fast corners. On Mar 10, 2010, at 8:33 AM, riverside wrote: > My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We > didn't have no on board telemetry. > > Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight > was considered proof that i had been too damn slow > in the previous corner. > > art de armond _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From billb at bnj.com Wed Mar 10 14:55:40 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 11:55:40 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> Message-ID: The residual pressure valve helps, and you can do as I used to do and fit a stronger one if it's not enough, but your pads will drag a little. I think the biggest advantage of the uprated axle is the ability to shim the bearings for a precise preload and then torque the nut tight. I get a very free=spinning wheel that doesn't wobble and doesn't knock the pads back. Everything helps, but all these things are compromises. On Mar 10, 2010, at 11:32 AM, MadMarx wrote: > I don't use any axle upgrade and don't have a long pedal. > I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. > All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. > Since I use ATE blue all trouble is gone. > ATE + EBC brake pads doing a fine job at my car. > > Cheers > Chris > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Bill Babcock > Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 20:24 > An: riverside > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > That's about right, unless you're using the uprated axle setup. The residual > pressure valve only helps a little. I don't use any residual pressure on > Peyote (I think--I MIGHT have left the valve in that Wilwoods come with) but > with the uprated axle I get a high pedal pretty consistently. I like that. > pumping brakes doesn't give confidence entering fast corners. > > On Mar 10, 2010, at 8:33 AM, riverside wrote: > >> My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We >> didn't have no on board telemetry. >> >> Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight >> was considered proof that i had been too damn slow >> in the previous corner. >> >> art de armond > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tr4racing at googlemail.com Wed Mar 10 15:41:10 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 23:41:10 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> Message-ID: <000601cac0a2$ca2b49f0$5e81ddd0$@com> Maybe the cornering speed is in the game too? My car might not getting fast enough to have trouble with the front axle. This year I have a go with a new cam that might boost the engine power. Maybe this year trouble starts with the brake system. Always you limb in racing speed new problems you are facing. -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: Bill Babcock [mailto:billb at bnj.com] Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 22:56 An: MadMarx Cc: fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve The residual pressure valve helps, and you can do as I used to do and fit a stronger one if it's not enough, but your pads will drag a little. I think the biggest advantage of the uprated axle is the ability to shim the bearings for a precise preload and then torque the nut tight. I get a very free=spinning wheel that doesn't wobble and doesn't knock the pads back. Everything helps, but all these things are compromises. On Mar 10, 2010, at 11:32 AM, MadMarx wrote: > I don't use any axle upgrade and don't have a long pedal. > I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. > All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. > Since I use ATE blue all trouble is gone. > ATE + EBC brake pads doing a fine job at my car. > > Cheers > Chris > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Bill Babcock > Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 20:24 > An: riverside > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > That's about right, unless you're using the uprated axle setup. The residual > pressure valve only helps a little. I don't use any residual pressure on > Peyote (I think--I MIGHT have left the valve in that Wilwoods come with) but > with the uprated axle I get a high pedal pretty consistently. I like that. > pumping brakes doesn't give confidence entering fast corners. > > On Mar 10, 2010, at 8:33 AM, riverside wrote: > >> My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We >> didn't have no on board telemetry. >> >> Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight >> was considered proof that i had been too damn slow >> in the previous corner. >> >> art de armond > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Wed Mar 10 18:21:21 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 17:21:21 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> Message-ID: <04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> > I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. > All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. Just curious, Chris, don't you think there is a connection there? Dragging brakes and excess heat? Possibly my RPV was malfunctioning, but I could feel the drag after releasing the brake pedal, and the front brakes would be hot after a run, even if I used the handbrake to stop at the end. -- Randall From igofaster at att.net Wed Mar 10 22:08:00 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 21:08:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... Message-ID: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... I need to plumb a 1" inside diameter hose from the crankcase (90 degree) and a 1" inside diameter hose to my catch tank. I don't understand the terminology of the references on the likes of the Earl brand hose connectors ... like -8AN -6AN etc.... In the need to know... the crank vent needs to come from the fuel cover plate and take a 90 degree short run. I think I just need to drill out the valve cover and have a 1" connection to my catch tank which will also need to short 90 degree receivers to catch the blow by from my 1" i.d. hoses.... please don't think I'm dumb... I'm still learning.... Bobby Whitehead #39 1970 Triumph GT6 DP #87 1965 Triumph Spitfire EP From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Wed Mar 10 22:24:06 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 21:24:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down force that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was scary to drive. I had so much power.. Pretty fun discussion. Mike Mehl ________________________________ From: Mark J Bradakis To: Friends of Triumph Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Well, it might be interesting to one or two folks on this list: http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 mjb. \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From koblinger at verizon.net Wed Mar 10 22:33:46 2010 From: koblinger at verizon.net (Kurt Oblinger) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 21:33:46 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> <156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4B9880BA.2020706@verizon.net> Here is a pic I shot at Riverside's Turn 6 of the Electramotive Nissan. EFR is in the car and Brabham was co-driver. I don't recall the year. Maybe the same car or a variation thereof. They were great cars and indecently fast! http://yfrog.com/egnissangtpj Cheers, Kurt O. Mike Mehl wrote: > driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the > Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the > induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down force > that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was > scary to drive. I had so much power.. > > Pretty fun discussion. > > Mike Mehl > ________________________________ > From: Mark J Bradakis > To: > Friends of Triumph > Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM > Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting > > Well, it might be interesting to > one or two folks on this list: > > http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 > > mjb. > \ > _______________________________________________ From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 10 23:53:53 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 23:53:53 -0700 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4B989381.6030608@bradakis.com> The AN spec ( Army - Navy ) sizes are based on 1/16th of an inch. A -4 is 4/16ths ID, or 1/4 inch. -6 is 6/16ths. or 3/8ths. AN flares are 37 degree cones, and are good for many make and break cycles without leaking. Pegasus ( pegasusautoracing.com ) has some technical info on their web page, as I recall, which might prove helpful. I've not looked at it in a while. mjb. From tr4racing at googlemail.com Thu Mar 11 01:19:03 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:19:03 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> <04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> Message-ID: <000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Hi Randall, I don't think so. My brakes move freely. If I push them from hand with the wheel on, they rotate about 3-4 times before the wheel stops. We have some tracks which are hard on the brakes...like Hockenheim, Zandvoort. Some of the brake bias is directed to the rear, even then the front has vapor lock if I use normal DOT4 fluid. But as I said, with the performance brake fluid all trouble is gone. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Randall Gesendet: Donnerstag, 11. Mdrz 2010 02:21 Cc: fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. > All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. Just curious, Chris, don't you think there is a connection there? Dragging brakes and excess heat? Possibly my RPV was malfunctioning, but I could feel the drag after releasing the brake pedal, and the front brakes would be hot after a run, even if I used the handbrake to stop at the end. -- Randall _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Thu Mar 11 06:08:48 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 07:08:48 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com><000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com><04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> <000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Message-ID: I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only assume that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. I had spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if everyone is frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "MadMarx" To: "'Randall'" Cc: Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve From tr4racing at googlemail.com Thu Mar 11 06:38:07 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:38:07 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com><000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com><04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> <000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Message-ID: <003801cac120$16f17e80$44d47b80$@com> I also have crisp dust cover seals after a race. I use heat shields with medium success on this issue. The inner seals also fail but they do from the pistons which lost some of their chrome coatings. I now use inox pistons and hope for the best. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Bob Kramer Gesendet: Donnerstag, 11. Mdrz 2010 14:09 Cc: fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only assume that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. I had spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if everyone is frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "MadMarx" To: "'Randall'" Cc: Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From mpendy at dishmail.net Thu Mar 11 06:59:36 2010 From: mpendy at dishmail.net (Mark Pendergrass) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 05:59:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com><000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com><04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com><000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Message-ID: Bob, i dont' even bother with the boot seals, like you said, they may last one or two race weekends, i did say maybe..........MP ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Kramer" Cc: Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 5:08 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they > last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and > rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner > ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling > to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only > assume that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. > I had spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if > everyone is frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years > of racing. > > Bob Kramer > Volente, TX > > Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch > excellence. > Vince Lombardi > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "MadMarx" > To: "'Randall'" > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mpendy at dishmail.net From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Thu Mar 11 07:25:36 2010 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 06:25:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <83432.52222.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Bobby: Speedway Motors also has a good explanation and lower prices than Pegasus; speedwaymotors.com . Of course, it's hard to beat the prices at Jegs or Summit. I think their volume is just so high they get a better break. -Ed- --- On Wed, 3/10/10, Bobby Whitehead wrote: From: Bobby Whitehead Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... To: "FoT Triumph" Date: Wednesday, March 10, 2010, 11:08 PM Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... I need to plumb a 1" inside diameter hose from the crankcase (90 degree) and a 1" inside diameter hose to my catch tank. I don't understand the terminology of the references on the likes of the Earl brand hose connectors ... like -8AN -6AN etc.... In the need to know... the crank vent needs to come from the fuel cover plate and take a 90 degree short run. I think I just need to drill out the valve cover and have a 1" connection to my catch tank which will also need to short 90 degree receivers to catch the blow by from my 1" i.d. hoses.... please don't think I'm dumb... I'm still learning.... Bobby Whitehead #39 1970 Triumph GT6 DP #87 1965 Triumph Spitfire EP _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net From tjwakeman at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 08:11:41 2010 From: tjwakeman at gmail.com (TeriAnn J. Wakeman) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 07:11:41 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> Bobby Whitehead wrote: > Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... > I very highly recommend a book titled: Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI Publishing Company, copyright 1990. Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the effort. Teriann From cartravel at pobox.com Thu Mar 11 08:11:19 2010 From: cartravel at pobox.com (Larry Young) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:11:19 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com><000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com><04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> <000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Message-ID: <4B990817.4010802@pobox.com> I always thought brake rebuilds were one of those things you "should" do once a year. Not that I ever did it that frequently. For a race car, I think the dust boots are a waste of time, so I quit using them. Larry Bob Kramer wrote: > I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long > they last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends > racing and rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers > have one inner ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots > were crispy, crumbling to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had > heat damage. I can only assume that the little rubber seal between the > halfs is also heat damaged. I had spares ready so the job is done but > I'm just a bit curious if everyone is frying these like I am. Mine > were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. > > Bob Kramer > Volente, TX From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Thu Mar 11 08:31:59 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (jerryvv at roadrunner.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 10:31:59 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20100311153159.OXBOV.264151.root@cdptpa-web03-z01> Bob, a bigger question is do we know that the current product is being molded from the proper rubber compound. That certainly applies to many of the rubber bits that are used in non-performance applications and I suspect on some of our engine and transmission mounts that are now being made in unknown foreign factories. Rubber compounds are designed for specific applications and heat and fluid resistance are two of the most critical conditions that rubber development is focused around. I believe Neoprene is the polymer of choice for brake components however that's just a starting point. From there a specific compound is developed using the base polymer. Once the compound is developed testing is done to what's known as a Line Call out to certify that the compound meets the design requirements. I certainly hope that these rebuild kits are still being manufactured by Girling or Lucas or some other reputable supplier. A no name box would give me concern. I've seen a few of those with brake parts in them. Not to mention the assumed liability. JVV ---- Bob Kramer wrote: > I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they > last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and > rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner > ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling > to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only assume > that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. I had > spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if everyone is > frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. > > Bob Kramer > Volente, TX > > Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch > excellence. > Vince Lombardi > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "MadMarx" > To: "'Randall'" > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com From timmurph at fastbytes.com Thu Mar 11 08:43:14 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:43:14 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000001cac131$913bbcd0$b3b33670$@com> I'll second that, Teriann. Fascinating book and well worth the time. One further note, either on the FOT or someplace else awhile back, mention was made of "knock-off" -AN fittings that failed. It is worth the extra bit to get branded fittings such as Aeroquip or XRP so that you know what you are getting. Don't necessarily get the cheapest ones you can find. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of TeriAnn J. Wakeman Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:12 AM To: FOT Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... Bobby Whitehead wrote: > Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... > I very highly recommend a book titled: Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI Publishing Company, copyright 1990. Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the effort. Teriann _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From timmurph at fastbytes.com Thu Mar 11 08:52:27 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:52:27 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <20100311153159.OXBOV.264151.root@cdptpa-web03-z01> References: <20100311153159.OXBOV.264151.root@cdptpa-web03-z01> Message-ID: <000101cac132$dbefc590$93cf50b0$@com> Good point. I had a discussion with Jack Drews regarding the seals from Moss and he questioned whether or not they were the same "type" as the original because they only seemed to last about one or maybe two seasons. We've had the same problem. I put stainless steel pistons in but we get the seals "weeping" when the car stands for any amount of time, ultimately draining all the brake fluid out, like over winter. Under pressure they seem to be sealing just fine, the level stays up in the reservoir during a weekends event. We may have to add some fluid due to pad wear (we have the small style master on the front and back of a dual master system) during a weekend but that's all. I did notice some unusual "staining" on the stainless pistons when we changed the seals last year. Doesn't look like actual scoring. Anybody else seen this with the stainless pistons? I can e-mail photos, which don't really do a good job of showing what it looks like, if anyone is interested. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jerryvv at roadrunner.com Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:32 AM To: Bob Kramer Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve Bob, a bigger question is do we know that the current product is being molded from the proper rubber compound. That certainly applies to many of the rubber bits that are used in non-performance applications and I suspect on some of our engine and transmission mounts that are now being made in unknown foreign factories. Rubber compounds are designed for specific applications and heat and fluid resistance are two of the most critical conditions that rubber development is focused around. I believe Neoprene is the polymer of choice for brake components however that's just a starting point. From there a specific compound is developed using the base polymer. Once the compound is developed testing is done to what's known as a Line Call out to certify that the compound meets the design requirements. I certainly hope that these rebuild kits are still being manufactured by Girling or Lucas or some other reputable supplier. A no name box would give me concern. I've seen a few of those with brake parts in them. Not to mention the assumed liability. JVV ---- Bob Kramer wrote: > I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they > last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and > rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner > ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling > to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only assume > that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. I had > spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if everyone is > frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. > > Bob Kramer > Volente, TX > > Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch > excellence. > Vince Lombardi > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "MadMarx" > To: "'Randall'" > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Mar 11 09:55:49 2010 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:55:49 EST Subject: [Fot] Brake Caliper Replacement Parts Message-ID: <63a2f.2dd261b4.38ca7a95@cs.com> Does the current state of parts quality in brake parts promote an argument for Toyota Conversions? Then it becomes an issue of safety rather than performance. I think I also came across a story of some aftermarket brake pistons (steel, stainless steel, chromed?) with a small sharp edge that cut the embedded seals. Leaky systems with new parts doesnt sound very good. It can say Lucas or Girling on the box, but I suspect that that they might still be substandard. And perhaps we need to look at the pistons under a magnifying glass for very small sharp machined edges or burrs. We have been having more issues with seals not lasting in the TR4...I suspect we need to go back and look more closely at the components, but what do you do with substandard seals? I know that Jack went back and forth on the Toyota conversions, but I cant remember the details. His final answer was to use the Toyotas and it wasnt a performance related issue, I dont think. Important thread. Thanks. I am not trying to make an argument for Toyota conversions, btw....just making observations. Joe A > Good point. I had a discussion with Jack Drews regarding the seals from > Moss and he questioned whether or not they were the same "type" as the > original because they only seemed to last about one or maybe two seasons. > We've had the same problem. I put stainless steel pistons in but we get > the > seals "weeping" when the car stands for any amount of time, ultimately > draining all the brake fluid out, like over winter. Under pressure they > seem to be sealing just fine, the level stays up in the reservoir during a > weekends event. We may have to add some fluid due to pad wear (we have the > small style master on the front and back of a dual master system) during a > weekend but that's all. I did notice some unusual "staining" on the > stainless pistons when we changed the seals last year. Doesn't look like > actual scoring. Anybody else seen this with the stainless pistons? I can > e-mail photos, which don't really do a good job of showing what it looks > like, if anyone is interested. > > Tim > From riverside at southslope.net Thu Mar 11 10:05:27 2010 From: riverside at southslope.net (riverside) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:05:27 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com><156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4B9880BA.2020706@verizon.net> Message-ID: <001401cac13d$0cd9da10$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Whatever became of Geoff Brabham? I remember watching in car footage of him at R/A in an Indy car. Thought he was hell for quick. Kas, do you have any special recollections of him? art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kurt Oblinger" To: "Mike Mehl" Cc: "Triumph Friends of" Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2010 11:33 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting > Here is a pic I shot at Riverside's Turn 6 of the Electramotive Nissan. > EFR is in the car and Brabham was co-driver. I don't recall the year. > Maybe the same car or a variation thereof. They were great cars and > indecently fast! > > http://yfrog.com/egnissangtpj > > Cheers, > Kurt O. > > > Mike Mehl wrote: >> driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the >> Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the >> induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down >> force >> that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was >> scary to drive. I had so much power.. >> >> Pretty fun discussion. >> >> Mike Mehl >> ________________________________ >> From: Mark J Bradakis >> To: >> Friends of Triumph >> Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM >> Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting >> >> Well, it might be interesting to >> one or two folks on this list: >> >> http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 >> mjb. >> \ >> _______________________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Thu Mar 11 10:05:48 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:05:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> Message-ID: <502CE409B8854072984BA917E0CDDA4B@jdnet.deere.com> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" > MBI Publishing Company, copyright 1990. Which, being the fifth volume in his "Tune to Win" series; he supposedly wanted to call "Screw to Win" All good stuff, BTW. -- Randall From spitlist at cox.net Thu Mar 11 10:24:00 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 10:24:00 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <001401cac13d$0cd9da10$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com><156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com><4B9880BA.2020706@verizon.net> <001401cac13d$0cd9da10$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Message-ID: I copied this from Wikipedia: Brabham now works for BMW Group Australia as a driver trainer at many different events around the country teaching others to drive safer and smarter, including teaching drivers to race for BMW supported celebrity races at the Australian Grand Prix. His son Matthew Brabham is also following in the family interest and is a very successful Kart racer. Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of riverside Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 10:05 AM To: Kurt Oblinger; Mike Mehl Cc: Triumph Friends of Subject: Re: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Whatever became of Geoff Brabham? I remember watching in car footage of him at R/A in an Indy car. Thought he was hell for quick. Kas, do you have any special recollections of him? art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kurt Oblinger" To: "Mike Mehl" Cc: "Triumph Friends of" Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2010 11:33 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting > Here is a pic I shot at Riverside's Turn 6 of the Electramotive Nissan. > EFR is in the car and Brabham was co-driver. I don't recall the year. > Maybe the same car or a variation thereof. They were great cars and > indecently fast! > > http://yfrog.com/egnissangtpj > > Cheers, > Kurt O. > > > Mike Mehl wrote: >> driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the >> Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the >> induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down >> force >> that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was >> scary to drive. I had so much power.. >> >> Pretty fun discussion. >> >> Mike Mehl >> ________________________________ >> From: Mark J Bradakis >> To: >> Friends of Triumph >> Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM >> Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting >> >> Well, it might be interesting to >> one or two folks on this list: >> >> http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 >> mjb. >> \ >> _______________________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From riverside at southslope.net Thu Mar 11 10:53:27 2010 From: riverside at southslope.net (riverside) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:53:27 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> Message-ID: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Thu Mar 11 11:17:32 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 10:17:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Bobby, Steve Belfer here. I was new to these fittings but have recently (within the past year) had many custom AN lines made up to completely re-plumb the fuel system and install an Accusump in the Trunk, and Oil cooler, as well as a custom line for the oil press. gauge. Sounds like what you're doing is pretty easy, and easy to make a mistake too and spend extra money. The main way to screw it up is to make the lines too short. You can always shorten them but can not lengthen them. :) 1"ID is -16AN hose. These are big but the right size for the valve cover and crankcase vent. You need to have a -16AN Male "Bung" welded into the valve cover and catch tank. Then you need to have a hose made up that connects the valve cover to the catch tank. This hose will be comprised of the hose and two hose end fittings. Hose end fittings come straight, or 45 degrees or 90 degrees. They can also be purchased in bends up to 180 degrees but you won't need that for this application. Find a local shop that can make up hoses for you. I do not recommend doing it yourself the first time. The braided hose is cut with a special chop-saw. You can tape it and cut yourself with a hack-saw or dremel but I've messed this up by cutting at an angle or by fraying the braids. Find a good chop that knows what they're doing and can shorten the line and rebuild the hose if you need to make tweaks. The hoses bend well but do not twist. They take a set because of the braiding so you have to know which angle the end fittings will point when the hose is in attached. Leave at least 1" of slack so the line can vibrate as the engine moves a little. You do not want the line too tight. Buy "Swivel" end fittings so you can adjust the angle of the end fittings. Do not overtighten AN fittings. They need no sealant, no lubricant and just give them a firm tightening but don't crank on it! If you have any specific questions, I'll be glad to try and answer them for you. ~Steve On Mar 10, 2010, at 9:08 PM, Bobby Whitehead wrote: Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... I need to plumb a 1" inside diameter hose from the crankcase (90 degree) and a 1" inside diameter hose to my catch tank. I don't understand the terminology of the references on the likes of the Earl brand hose connectors ... like -8AN -6AN etc.... In the need to know... the crank vent needs to come from the fuel cover plate and take a 90 degree short run. I think I just need to drill out the valve cover and have a 1" connection to my catch tank which will also need to short 90 degree receivers to catch the blow by from my 1" i.d. hoses.... please don't think I'm dumb... I'm still learning.... Bobby Whitehead #39 1970 Triumph GT6 DP #87 1965 Triumph Spitfire EP _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Mar 11 11:36:19 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 12:36:19 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Brake Caliper Replacement Parts In-Reply-To: <63a2f.2dd261b4.38ca7a95@cs.com> References: <63a2f.2dd261b4.38ca7a95@cs.com> Message-ID: I had forgotten that many people choose to run without the dust seals. I may have to go that way. I definitely try to avoid suspect rubber parts but like others have said there is no guarantee that a Lucas/Girling box means anything. My vintage organization won't allow Toyota conversions but I suppose they wouldn't know. I prefer keeping it original anyway. Larry Young thinks the early/larger TR4 calipers work better, both in cooling and in brake surface area. Now that I have a an early TR4 and a 4A I can compare. I just let mine go too long. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of N197TR4 at cs.com Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 10:56 AM To: timmurph at fastbytes.com; jerryvv at roadrunner.com; rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Brake Caliper Replacement Parts Does the current state of parts quality in brake parts promote an argument for Toyota Conversions? Then it becomes an issue of safety rather than performance. I think I also came across a story of some aftermarket brake pistons (steel, stainless steel, chromed?) with a small sharp edge that cut the embedded seals. Leaky systems with new parts doesnt sound very good. It can say Lucas or Girling on the box, but I suspect that that they might still be substandard. And perhaps we need to look at the pistons under a magnifying glass for very small sharp machined edges or burrs. We have been having more issues with seals not lasting in the TR4...I suspect we need to go back and look more closely at the components, but what do you do with substandard seals? I know that Jack went back and forth on the Toyota conversions, but I cant remember the details. His final answer was to use the Toyotas and it wasnt a performance related issue, I dont think. Important thread. Thanks. I am not trying to make an argument for Toyota conversions, btw....just making observations. Joe A > Good point. I had a discussion with Jack Drews regarding the seals from > Moss and he questioned whether or not they were the same "type" as the > original because they only seemed to last about one or maybe two seasons. > We've had the same problem. I put stainless steel pistons in but we get > the > seals "weeping" when the car stands for any amount of time, ultimately > draining all the brake fluid out, like over winter. Under pressure they > seem to be sealing just fine, the level stays up in the reservoir during a > weekends event. We may have to add some fluid due to pad wear (we have the > small style master on the front and back of a dual master system) during a > weekend but that's all. I did notice some unusual "staining" on the > stainless pistons when we changed the seals last year. Doesn't look like > actual scoring. Anybody else seen this with the stainless pistons? I can > e-mail photos, which don't really do a good job of showing what it looks > like, if anyone is interested. > > Tim > _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com From billb at bnj.com Thu Mar 11 11:40:19 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 08:40:19 -1000 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <68454015-0C3A-4C75-BD81-C29292584A83@bnj.com> Good advice except the part about not doing it yourself. I think anyone that uses these things should learn how to make them up, you can't always get to a shop, and it's not that hard. Tape with a couple of TIGHT wraps of masking tape--not duct tape--it's too stretchy. Mark where you want your cut then wrap another piece of colored masking tape so it's edge is on the mark to give you a nice squared-up cutting line. Use a very fine toothed hacksaw blade--as fine as you can find. stick the line in a vise and cut smoothly with light strokes. Then follow the mfrs. directions. Don't take the tape off until you are ready to stuff the line into the fitting. On Mar 11, 2010, at 8:17 AM, Steven Belfer wrote: > Hi Bobby, Steve Belfer here. > > I was new to these fittings but have recently (within the past year) had many custom AN lines made up to completely re-plumb the fuel system and install an Accusump in the Trunk, and Oil cooler, as well as a custom line for the oil press. gauge. Sounds like what you're doing is pretty easy, and easy to make a mistake too and spend extra money. The main way to screw it up is to make the lines too short. You can always shorten them but can not lengthen them. :) 1"ID is -16AN hose. These are big but the right size for the valve cover and crankcase vent. You need to have a -16AN Male "Bung" welded into the valve cover and catch tank. Then you need to have a hose made up that connects the valve cover to the catch tank. This hose will be comprised of the hose and two hose end fittings. Hose end fittings come straight, or 45 degrees or 90 degrees. They can also be purchased in bends up to 180 degrees but you won't need that for this application. > > Find a local shop that can make up hoses for you. I do not recommend doing it yourself the first time. The braided hose is cut with a special chop-saw. You can tape it and cut yourself with a hack-saw or dremel but I've messed this up by cutting at an angle or by fraying the braids. Find a good chop that knows what they're doing and can shorten the line and rebuild the hose if you need to make tweaks. From bownes at seiri.com Thu Mar 11 11:59:19 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 13:59:19 -0500 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <68454015-0C3A-4C75-BD81-C29292584A83@bnj.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <68454015-0C3A-4C75-BD81-C29292584A83@bnj.com> Message-ID: I've had great luck cutting AN braided hose with a large diameter fibreglas cut off wheel in a chop saw. After wrapping in tape of course. Once you get the hang of making them, you'll never go back to paying to have them made again. I keep a box of fittings and rolls of hose in the trailer. On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:40 PM, Bill Babcock wrote: > Good advice except the part about not doing it yourself. I think anyone > that > uses these things should learn how to make them up, you can't always get to > a > shop, and it's not that hard. Tape with a couple of TIGHT wraps of masking > tape--not duct tape--it's too stretchy. Mark where you want your cut then > wrap > another piece of colored masking tape so it's edge is on the mark to give > you > a nice squared-up cutting line. Use a very fine toothed hacksaw blade--as > fine > as you can find. stick the line in a vise and cut smoothly with light > strokes. > Then follow the mfrs. directions. Don't take the tape off until you are > ready > to stuff the line into the fitting. > > On Mar 11, 2010, at 8:17 AM, Steven Belfer wrote: > > > Hi Bobby, Steve Belfer here. > > > > I was new to these fittings but have recently (within the past year) had > many custom AN lines made up to completely re-plumb the fuel system and > install an Accusump in the Trunk, and Oil cooler, as well as a custom line > for > the oil press. gauge. Sounds like what you're doing is pretty easy, and > easy > to make a mistake too and spend extra money. The main way to screw it up is > to > make the lines too short. You can always shorten them but can not lengthen > them. :) 1"ID is -16AN hose. These are big but the right size for the > valve cover and crankcase vent. You need to have a -16AN Male "Bung" > welded > into the valve cover and catch tank. Then you need to have a hose made up > that connects the valve cover to the catch tank. This hose will be > comprised > of the hose and two hose end fittings. Hose end fittings come straight, or > 45 > degrees or 90 degrees. They can also be purchased in bends up to 180 > degrees > but you won't need that for this application. > > > > Find a local shop that can make up hoses for you. I do not recommend > doing > it yourself the first time. The braided hose is cut with a special > chop-saw. > You can tape it and cut yourself with a hack-saw or dremel but I've messed > this up by cutting at an angle or by fraying the braids. Find a good chop > that > knows what they're doing and can shorten the line and rebuild the hose if > you > need to make tweaks. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From bownes at seiri.com Thu Mar 11 12:00:18 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:00:18 -0500 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <68454015-0C3A-4C75-BD81-C29292584A83@bnj.com> Message-ID: And an important accessory if you are making them yourself is the red and blue sharpies to touch up where you scratch the anodize off of the connectors. ;) On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:59 PM, robert bownes wrote: > I've had great luck cutting AN braided hose with a large diameter fibreglas > cut off wheel in a chop saw. After wrapping in tape of course. > > Once you get the hang of making them, you'll never go back to paying to > have them made again. I keep a box of fittings and rolls of hose in the > trailer. > > > > On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:40 PM, Bill Babcock wrote: > >> Good advice except the part about not doing it yourself. I think anyone >> that >> uses these things should learn how to make them up, you can't always get >> to a >> shop, and it's not that hard. Tape with a couple of TIGHT wraps of masking >> tape--not duct tape--it's too stretchy. Mark where you want your cut then >> wrap >> another piece of colored masking tape so it's edge is on the mark to give >> you >> a nice squared-up cutting line. Use a very fine toothed hacksaw blade--as >> fine >> as you can find. stick the line in a vise and cut smoothly with light >> strokes. >> Then follow the mfrs. directions. Don't take the tape off until you are >> ready >> to stuff the line into the fitting. >> >> On Mar 11, 2010, at 8:17 AM, Steven Belfer wrote: >> >> > Hi Bobby, Steve Belfer here. >> > >> > I was new to these fittings but have recently (within the past year) had >> many custom AN lines made up to completely re-plumb the fuel system and >> install an Accusump in the Trunk, and Oil cooler, as well as a custom line >> for >> the oil press. gauge. Sounds like what you're doing is pretty easy, and >> easy >> to make a mistake too and spend extra money. The main way to screw it up >> is to >> make the lines too short. You can always shorten them but can not lengthen >> them. :) 1"ID is -16AN hose. These are big but the right size for the >> valve cover and crankcase vent. You need to have a -16AN Male "Bung" >> welded >> into the valve cover and catch tank. Then you need to have a hose made up >> that connects the valve cover to the catch tank. This hose will be >> comprised >> of the hose and two hose end fittings. Hose end fittings come straight, >> or 45 >> degrees or 90 degrees. They can also be purchased in bends up to 180 >> degrees >> but you won't need that for this application. >> > >> > Find a local shop that can make up hoses for you. I do not recommend >> doing >> it yourself the first time. The braided hose is cut with a special >> chop-saw. >> You can tape it and cut yourself with a hack-saw or dremel but I've messed >> this up by cutting at an angle or by fraying the braids. Find a good chop >> that >> knows what they're doing and can shorten the line and rebuild the hose if >> you >> need to make tweaks. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From kaskas at cox.net Thu Mar 11 12:13:52 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:13:52 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <4B9880BA.2020706@verizon.net> Message-ID: <20100311141352.4GF64.25208.imail@fed1rmwml46> That car is a 1987 version before the new tub and the Goodyear tires which made the car over 2 seconds faster. That car was later called "Elvis" and was laterr sold to a fellow in Europe.The car was just fast enough for my tastes. 1988 was better when Geoff was on full time and we won 8 races in a row and 10 out of 13. Yes, just fast enough. ---- Kurt Oblinger wrote: ============= Here is a pic I shot at Riverside's Turn 6 of the Electramotive Nissan. EFR is in the car and Brabham was co-driver. I don't recall the year. Maybe the same car or a variation thereof. They were great cars and indecently fast! http://yfrog.com/egnissangtpj Cheers, Kurt O. Mike Mehl wrote: > driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the > Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the > induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down force > that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was > scary to drive. I had so much power.. > > Pretty fun discussion. > > Mike Mehl > ________________________________ > From: Mark J Bradakis > To: > Friends of Triumph > Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM > Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting > > Well, it might be interesting to > one or two folks on this list: > > http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From kaskas at cox.net Thu Mar 11 12:20:13 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:20:13 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <83432.52222.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20100311142013.N5WIM.25337.imail@fed1rmwml46> -Geoff lives is Australia and runs the driving schools for BMW and has done so for quite a few years. Heard from him a regularly, his son Mathew will be racing a formula Ford this year (16 yrs old) at the F-1 race they have in Australia. The kid is chip off the old block and fast. Did very well in carts with Geoff as his mechanic. Mathew carries the same number we had on his Dad's car, 83. --- EDWARD BARNARD wrote: ============= Bobby: Speedway Motors also has a good explanation and lower prices than Pegasus; speedwaymotors.com . Of course, it's hard to beat the prices at Jegs or Summit. I think their volume is just so high they get a better break. -Ed- --- On Wed, 3/10/10, Bobby Whitehead wrote: From: Bobby Whitehead Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... To: "FoT Triumph" Date: Wednesday, March 10, 2010, 11:08 PM Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... I need to plumb a 1" inside diameter hose from the crankcase (90 degree) and a 1" inside diameter hose to my catch tank. I don't understand the terminology of the references on the likes of the Earl brand hose connectors ... like -8AN -6AN etc.... In the need to know... the crank vent needs to come from the fuel cover plate and take a 90 degree short run. I think I just need to drill out the valve cover and have a 1" connection to my catch tank which will also need to short 90 degree receivers to catch the blow by from my 1" i.d. hoses.... please don't think I'm dumb... I'm still learning.... Bobby Whitehead #39 1970 Triumph GT6 DP #87 1965 Triumph Spitfire EP _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From kaskas at cox.net Thu Mar 11 12:44:01 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:44:01 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Message-ID: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> ---- riverside wrote: One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum castings and plastic parts. A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. ============= Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 11 13:02:15 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 13:02:15 -0700 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> Message-ID: <4B994C47.3080107@bradakis.com> I use a cutoff wheel in a die grinder to cut the hose, after taping. Keep in mind that usually the inner hose is some sort of rubber, and it can deteriorate over time and exposure to heat and solvents. Fittings last longer than the hose. With a bit of practice making up hoses is pretty straightforward. And as Kas mentions the outer braid is quite effective at wearing through things it vibrates against. I recall once at IVR I was inspecting a Mallet Corvette that a fellow just purchased for some large sum of money. I was really amazed at some of the poor quality workmanship on it. The thing I had him deal with before he took it out was that a braided oil line was hard against the cable coming from the positive battery terminal. It wouldn't take long for that hose to gnaw through the insulation, I'm sure. On a side note, the Mallet came back from Hallet on a pallet. Not sure how he did it, but he turned the car into many little piles of scrap, I'm told. And speaking of large sums of money for cars, much as I expected I didn't get $100,000 + in donations overnight, so no bids on the GTP car. Guess I'll just have to get a Spitfire running this spring. mjb. From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Thu Mar 11 13:11:48 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 12:11:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> Message-ID: Additionally, make sure the braided hose doesn't contact any electrical wiring or hot contacts. Could cause a short. ~Steve On Mar 11, 2010, at 11:44 AM, Kas Kastner wrote: ---- riverside wrote: One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum castings and plastic parts. A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. ============= Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it > came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth > the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Thu Mar 11 13:11:57 2010 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 15:11:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <4B994C47.3080107@bradakis.com> References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46>, <4B994C47.3080107@bradakis.com> Message-ID: > quality workmanship on it. The thing I had him deal with before > he took it out was that a braided oil line was hard against the cable > coming from the positive battery terminal. It wouldn't take long for > that hose to gnaw through the insulation, I'm sure. Once my students installed a turbine engine on the test stand in such a way that the large (over one inch) braided steel fuel (AVgas) line touched the positive post of the 28VDC ground power unit plug. They learned how to use a fire extinguisher that day. John H. From riverside at southslope.net Thu Mar 11 13:13:55 2010 From: riverside at southslope.net (riverside) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:13:55 -0600 Subject: [Fot] spit front shocks needed Message-ID: <00be01cac157$610e40c0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Any body have a used set of shocks with adjustable spring perches for sale. art de armond From emanteno at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 13:17:40 2010 From: emanteno at gmail.com (Irv Korey) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:17:40 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> References: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> Message-ID: <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:44 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > ---- riverside wrote: > > One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it > rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum > castings and plastic parts. > A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. > If your stainless line is already assembled on the car, and you don't want to disassemble to install shrink tube, you can make a nice hose cover with the inner tube from a bicycle tire and some wire wraps. Irv From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Mar 11 13:32:23 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:32:23 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> References: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: These days you can get hose covered with a abrasion resistant braided cloth cover, in blue and black. These look nice with black AN fittings and maintain a period look from the days before braided SS. They are cheaper and easier to work with to boot. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Irv Korey From tedtsimx at bright.net Thu Mar 11 14:03:13 2010 From: tedtsimx at bright.net (Ted Schumacher) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:03:13 -0500 Subject: [Fot] brake seals, Toyota calipers, et al Message-ID: <4B995A91.8020107@bright.net> Hello list. We need to remember we are talking about race cars and racing. Somehow getting only 1 or 2 seasons out of a set of calipers before they need something is like being "slightly pregnant". After every session they should be checked and after every event they should be thoroughly inspected. Do this immediately after the car is unloaded, not the day before you head out the next time. If you want to help cooling, drill some holes around the perimeter of the piston, where it protrudes beyond the boot. These holes will let the hot gas that builds up inside the piston vent to atmosphere.This will get rid of some of the heat transfer from piston to caliper. Commercial content, we have rebuilt calipers - Spit. GT6, TR4, early and late TR6 for $69.95 each exchange. Toyota 4 piston calipers, rebuilt, including steel braid hose to go from caliper to TR bulkhead fitting (eliminates need to adapt hoses or steel lines) - $225. On another topic. the IMSA GTP cars did indeed generate a huge amount of down force. On the banking at Daytona, tires would blow from down force load. This led to the track installing the chicane at the end of the back straight just before entering NASCAR turn 3. Ted -- Ted Schumacher tedtsimx at bright.net http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com 108 S. Jefferson St. Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 From mdporter at dfn.com Thu Mar 11 14:02:48 2010 From: mdporter at dfn.com (Michael Porter) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:02:48 -0700 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> References: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4B995A78.1080208@dfn.com> Irv Korey wrote: > On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:44 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > > >> ---- riverside wrote: >> >> One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it >> rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum >> castings and plastic parts. >> A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. >> >> > > If your stainless line is already assembled on the car, and you don't want > to disassemble to install shrink tube, you can make a nice hose cover with > the inner tube from a bicycle tire and some wire wraps. > > Irv, Aeroquip (probably other manufacturers, too) now offer high-helix spiral isolators that seem to be made of nylon and can be installed with the hose in place. Very clean and neat. Only proviso is that one has to make sure the isolator is positioned properly so that the isolator actually meets the contact points. Not preferable to proper padded clips, but, still, a pretty good alternative to tearing things down, and very useful where there's a tangle of hoses contacting each other. Cheers. -- Michael Porter Roswell, NM Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking distance.... From bownes at seiri.com Thu Mar 11 14:22:05 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:22:05 -0500 Subject: [Fot] brake seals, Toyota calipers, et al In-Reply-To: <4B995A91.8020107@bright.net> References: <4B995A91.8020107@bright.net> Message-ID: Re downforce of the nissan GTP cars. I remember a certain Friday at Lime Rock Park when John Morton experiences a significant _lack_ of downforce at the top of the uphill. I was @ turn 2 at the time. If you've never seen Roz Rozitoski's photos of the shunt, you are missing a classic. Roz had the old Nikon grinding out 6pfs when John came up the hill and got the front off of the ground. The rest of the car followed, going totally airborne, flipping front over back and landing upside down and backwards, then flipping back over and coming to a stop in more than a few pieces. There are, I think about 5 or 6 frames in the series. By frame 2, the car is in the air. in frame 3, the car hasn't landed yet and the corner worker, Bruce Kohlker is already on his way with a fire bottle. Amazing. Heady days those were. On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 4:03 PM, Ted Schumacher wrote: > Hello list. We need to remember we are talking about race cars and racing. > Somehow getting only 1 or 2 seasons out of a set of calipers before they > need something is like being "slightly pregnant". After every session they > should be checked and after every event they should be thoroughly inspected. > Do this immediately after the car is unloaded, not the day before you head > out the next time. If you want to help cooling, drill some holes around the > perimeter of the piston, where it protrudes beyond the boot. These holes > will let the hot gas that builds up inside the piston vent to > atmosphere.This will get rid of some of the heat transfer from piston to > caliper. Commercial content, we have rebuilt calipers - Spit. GT6, TR4, > early and late TR6 for $69.95 each exchange. Toyota 4 piston calipers, > rebuilt, including steel braid hose to go from caliper to TR bulkhead > fitting (eliminates need to adapt hoses or steel lines) - $225. > On another topic. the IMSA GTP cars did indeed generate a huge amount of > down force. On the banking at Daytona, tires would blow from down force > load. This led to the track installing the chicane at the end of the back > straight just before entering NASCAR turn 3. Ted > > -- > Ted Schumacher > tedtsimx at bright.net > http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com > 108 S. Jefferson St. > Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 > Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) > Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) > Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From kaskas at cox.net Thu Mar 11 14:44:48 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 13:44:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] brake seals, Toyota calipers, et al In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20100311164448.MLA8K.26895.imail@fed1rmwml43> That was a brand new car at Lime Rock. It had never turned a wheel except in the parking lot before loading. Totally destroyed. I went to hospital with John that afternoon. I have seen the photos Roz took and they are really graphic. ---- robert bownes wrote: ============= Re downforce of the nissan GTP cars. I remember a certain Friday at Lime Rock Park when John Morton experiences a significant _lack_ of downforce at the top of the uphill. I was @ turn 2 at the time. If you've never seen Roz Rozitoski's photos of the shunt, you are missing a classic. Roz had the old Nikon grinding out 6pfs when John came up the hill and got the front off of the ground. The rest of the car followed, going totally airborne, flipping front over back and landing upside down and backwards, then flipping back over and coming to a stop in more than a few pieces. There are, I think about 5 or 6 frames in the series. By frame 2, the car is in the air. in frame 3, the car hasn't landed yet and the corner worker, Bruce Kohlker is already on his way with a fire bottle. Amazing. Heady days those were. On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 4:03 PM, Ted Schumacher wrote: > Hello list. We need to remember we are talking about race cars and racing. > Somehow getting only 1 or 2 seasons out of a set of calipers before they > need something is like being "slightly pregnant". After every session they > should be checked and after every event they should be thoroughly inspected. > Do this immediately after the car is unloaded, not the day before you head > out the next time. If you want to help cooling, drill some holes around the > perimeter of the piston, where it protrudes beyond the boot. These holes > will let the hot gas that builds up inside the piston vent to > atmosphere.This will get rid of some of the heat transfer from piston to > caliper. Commercial content, we have rebuilt calipers - Spit. GT6, TR4, > early and late TR6 for $69.95 each exchange. Toyota 4 piston calipers, > rebuilt, including steel braid hose to go from caliper to TR bulkhead > fitting (eliminates need to adapt hoses or steel lines) - $225. > On another topic. the IMSA GTP cars did indeed generate a huge amount of > down force. On the banking at Daytona, tires would blow from down force > load. This led to the track installing the chicane at the end of the back > straight just before entering NASCAR turn 3. Ted > > -- > Ted Schumacher > tedtsimx at bright.net > http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com > 108 S. Jefferson St. > Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 > Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) > Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) > Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From dos_gusanos at msn.com Thu Mar 11 16:36:06 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:36:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help Message-ID: Yes, I know this is lame for this list but I'm just going to start here first. MY 1963 TR4 came with 4 Valve covers. All are different. I need to select the right one for 1963. Two are the TR3 style with the long filler in front but one has a small tab welded on the back end (bachelor #2). One has a long TR3 style filler but it is in the back of the engine(bachelor #3). The other has a low twist on cap in back and a small tube/vent port out of the valve cover probably for the PCV Valve for a later car(bachelor #4). My guess is Bachelor #3 is correct. PLEASE LET ME KNOW IF I AM WRONG It would be a huge embarassment to show up somewhere sporting the wrong cover! Cheers Henry Morrison, Albuquerque. From dos_gusanos at msn.com Thu Mar 11 16:53:29 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:53:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: When I bought my first TR4 it was only 16 years old. I have always looked at TR7's like brand new cars but when I bought one it was 34 years old. What does that have to do with anything? Well it was just a bit rough that with all my mods I got wasted by a Golf TDI Diesel. I figure some Tires will put me even with the Volkzy as i was running my $39 radials. Any tips on a hot 13" Autocross Tire? Cheers Henry Morrison, Albuquerque From jmwagner at tstonramp.com Thu Mar 11 17:12:00 2010 From: jmwagner at tstonramp.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:12:00 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <35DF0D38-2E5B-400D-B721-A541748F467C@tstonramp.com> Small tab cover is TR2. On Mar 11, 2010, at 3:36 PM, wrote: > Yes, I know this is lame for this list but I'm just going to start > here first. > MY 1963 TR4 came with 4 Valve covers. All are different. I need to > select > the right one for 1963. Two are the TR3 style with the long filler > in front > but one has a small tab welded on the back end (bachelor #2). One > has a long > TR3 style filler but it is in the back of the engine(bachelor #3). > The other > has a low twist on cap in back and a small tube/vent port out of the > valve > cover probably for the PCV Valve for a later car(bachelor #4). > > > > My guess is Bachelor #3 is correct. > > > > PLEASE LET ME KNOW IF I AM WRONG > > > > It would be a huge embarassment to show up somewhere sporting the > wrong > cover! > > > > Cheers Henry Morrison, Albuquerque. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jmwagner at greenheart.com From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Thu Mar 11 17:53:32 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:53:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> Message-ID: <491758.27669.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> If anyone would like to email me off line I would be happy to help. We sell hydraulic hose and fittings out of our 7 locations in the Northwest. I plumbed my TR4 with 100R5 Parker 293 hose. It has no wire, is super light weight and can be used for fuel and oil. I used 26 series 37 degree flare crimp fittings. With this hose you can mock up the hose and cut it with out any special tools and take it to a local Parker Store and have them crimp it. I have noted all the advice and figured I would at least offer my help off line. We sell mostly OEM's and large MRO users. Anyway let me know if you have any questions. Mike Mehl ________________________________ From: Steven Belfer To: FOT Sent: Thu, March 11, 2010 12:11:48 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... Additionally, make sure the braided hose doesn't contact any electrical wiring or hot contacts. Could cause a short. ~Steve On Mar 11, 2010, at 11:44 AM, Kas Kastner wrote: ---- riverside wrote: One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum castings and plastic parts. A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. ============= Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From jhassall at blacksburg.net Thu Mar 11 18:24:23 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 20:24:23 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B9997C7.8040900@blacksburg.net> On 3/11/2010 6:36 PM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: > Yes, I know this is lame for this list but I'm just going to start here first. > MY 1963 TR4 came with 4 Valve covers. All are different. I need to select > the right one for 1963. Two are the TR3 style with the long filler in front > but one has a small tab welded on the back end (bachelor #2). One has a long > TR3 style filler but it is in the back of the engine(bachelor #3). The other > has a low twist on cap in back and a small tube/vent port out of the valve > cover probably for the PCV Valve for a later car(bachelor #4). > > > > My guess is Bachelor #3 is correct. > Henry, FWIW, my '63 came with #3, which I believe is original, as nothing on the car had been replaced (or fixed) in its life. jim -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From robertten1 at aol.com Thu Mar 11 18:30:14 2010 From: robertten1 at aol.com (robertten1 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 20:30:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: <8CC8F9AB351753F-1A3C-12E4@webmail-d097.sysops.aol.com> I like my Toyo R888's on my Spit GT autocrosser, originally bought as wet weather tires but have found them to be excellent in the dry as well. ( 185r60x13 ) Good luck, Bob T From LimeyV8 at aol.com Thu Mar 11 19:34:40 2010 From: LimeyV8 at aol.com (LimeyV8 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:34:40 EST Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: <8f465.407f2b53.38cb0240@aol.com> In a message dated 3/11/2010 6:53:47 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, dos_gusanos at msn.com writes: Any tips on a hot 13" Autocross Tire? I have done several seasons in E Stock in TR8s I used to use 205/60 Kumho Victoracers, but you can't get them in that size anymore. more recently, I have used 215/50 Kumho 710s and 225/50 Hoosier A6s (yes, these WILL fit and work on 13 x 5.5 wheels) The Kumhos are a tad stickier to start with - the Hoosiers are better longer - i haven't decided yet whether they are worth the extra $. I have a set of 205/60 Toyo RA1s sitting in the garage waiting for me to finish powder coating the wheels to put them on - i can let you know how they are in a couple weeks. Cheers, Jack Mc From LimeyV8 at aol.com Thu Mar 11 19:38:39 2010 From: LimeyV8 at aol.com (LimeyV8 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:38:39 EST Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> In a message dated 3/11/2010 8:39:48 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, robertten1 at aol.com writes: I like my Toyo R888's on my Spit GT autocrosser, originally bought as wet weather tires but have found them to be excellent in the dry as well. ( 185r60x13 ) I got RA1s because Miata racers told me the R888s were terrible in the wet. what are your thoughts on that? Cheers, Jack Mc From adams910 at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 20:20:30 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 22:20:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> Message-ID: <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com> Full tread RA1's are a better rain tire. Full tread R888's are a better intermediate. In the dry, it's drivers preference, some people love the R888's, others hate them. Keep in mind Spec Miata's are in the 2300-2400lb range per rules, so what whatever tire wear they see might not apply to a much lighter British car. I also believe the R888 comes in different compounds. The 13" size might be a harder compound than the 15", best to check. Another thing, the Toyos (and other road race compound R-Dots) will never get hot enough for maximum performance at an autocross. The A6's and V700s are purpose built for autocrossing. As for the Hoosier A6's. There is a reason SCCA roadracers (SS and IT guys use them for qualifying) and autoxers refer to them as "purple crack". ;) From dos_gusanos at msn.com Thu Mar 11 21:16:03 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:16:03 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thank you for all the responses. I opened the Bonnet and there was yet another, fifth, valve cover similar to Bachelor #3...........................Cheers Henry > From: dos_gusanos at msn.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:36:06 -0700 > Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help > > Yes, I know this is lame for this list but I'm just going to start here first. > MY 1963 TR4 came with 4 Valve covers. All are different. I need to select > the right one for 1963. Two are the TR3 style with the long filler in front > but one has a small tab welded on the back end (bachelor #2). One has a long > TR3 style filler but it is in the back of the engine(bachelor #3). The other > has a low twist on cap in back and a small tube/vent port out of the valve > cover probably for the PCV Valve for a later car(bachelor #4). > > > > My guess is Bachelor #3 is correct. > > > > PLEASE LET ME KNOW IF I AM WRONG > > > > It would be a huge embarassment to show up somewhere sporting the wrong > cover! > > > > Cheers Henry Morrison, Albuquerque. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dos_gusanos at msn.com From timmurph at fastbytes.com Thu Mar 11 21:23:33 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 22:23:33 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <491758.27669.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> <491758.27669.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000001cac19b$c7e02e50$57a08af0$@com> There is a tool called the "Koul Tools" made specifically to assist in making up braided -AN hoses. You can check it out and maybe get some more tips at www.koultools.com or just Google "koul tool". I haven't used one but after making up a number of hoses anything to make it more reliable and easier would be nice! No commercial interest, just FWIW. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mike Mehl Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:54 PM To: Steven Belfer Cc: Triumph Friends of Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... If anyone would like to email me off line I would be happy to help. We sell hydraulic hose and fittings out of our 7 locations in the Northwest. I plumbed my TR4 with 100R5 Parker 293 hose. It has no wire, is super light weight and can be used for fuel and oil. I used 26 series 37 degree flare crimp fittings. With this hose you can mock up the hose and cut it with out any special tools and take it to a local Parker Store and have them crimp it. I have noted all the advice and figured I would at least offer my help off line. We sell mostly OEM's and large MRO users. Anyway let me know if you have any questions. Mike Mehl ________________________________ From: Steven Belfer To: FOT Sent: Thu, March 11, 2010 12:11:48 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... Additionally, make sure the braided hose doesn't contact any electrical wiring or hot contacts. Could cause a short. ~Steve On Mar 11, 2010, at 11:44 AM, Kas Kastner wrote: ---- riverside wrote: One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum castings and plastic parts. A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. ============= Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From adams910 at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 21:57:33 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 23:57:33 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com> First off, what class are you running in? There are really 3 different tire clases. The ST classes use a DOT approved treaded tire with a tire wear rating of 140 being the lowest. The Stock and Street-Prepared classes allow any DOT approved tire. The Prepared and Mod classes allow for a cantilever slick. I wouldn't turn down a set of R888's. You'll probably be fine on the regional level, but if you are in a very competitive division or want to run Nationals and you want to win, you'll need either V710's or the A6's. R-DOTS are basically DOT approved tires that barely meet all the minimum requirements. They're radial designs, and feature at least one groove of 4/32" tread depth. Some come with full tread (Toyos are molded at 6/32", but when shaved to 4/32", they lose most of their tread and just have two grooves). Wear ratings are LOW.. usually in the 40-100 range and they have very stiff sidewalls. Tires like the Hoosier R and A6's , Kumho V710's, and Goodyear GS's are typically molded with a single groove around their circumference. These are sometimes referred to as "cheater R-DOTs". Not sure about autocrossing, but in roadracing, you can only expect 10-12 heat cycles if you're a fast guy with these tires, before they start to cord. They're fast as s**t while they last, but still slower than a full cantilever slick. The next batch: Toyo R888, RA1, Kumho V700, and Yokohama A048 are molded with a wet weather tread pattern, but they're molded pretty shallow. Most racers will shave the tires from 6/32" to 4/32" or more for dry use. 1) it removes most of the tread, making it more slick like , 2) it actually extends the life of the tire as it is less likely to chunk and build up excessive amounts of heat from tread squirm, 3) less rolling mass. These tires are slightly harder and slightly slower than the "cheater R-DOTS". They do last longer, are less finicky to set up, and are cheaper to buy. They're still plenty fast. Bob From adams910 at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 22:16:16 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 00:16:16 -0500 Subject: [Fot] SOVREN CRC - pass while spinning Message-ID: <673993c51003112116v5aa7e35dp6a67a7f92602021@mail.gmail.com> This was just posted on another forum. Arnie Loyning spin and pass in his Lotus Elan. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dz4P6e_Yv3c From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 11 23:34:17 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 23:34:17 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com> <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> > The Prepared and Mod classes allow for a cantilever slick. > > The guys at the tire shop were happy when I switched from cantilever slicks on 6 inch rims to normal sidewall slicks on 8 inch rims. Of course the extra wheel width was all outboard so the car was a bit wider and for a while I was nipping cones by just a hair. I'd like to get back to some sort of racing. Moving all this junk around cleaning up the shop has got me thinking more and more about getting back at it. Are you sure none of you need a Unix/Linux sys admin, email expert, personal chef, Brit car mechanic or some such? Racing can be tough when you have no income! mjb. From spitlist at cox.net Thu Mar 11 23:41:57 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 23:41:57 -0700 Subject: [Fot] SOVREN CRC - pass while spinning In-Reply-To: <673993c51003112116v5aa7e35dp6a67a7f92602021@mail.gmail.com> References: <673993c51003112116v5aa7e35dp6a67a7f92602021@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I bet he couldn't pull that off again if he tried! -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bob Adams Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 10:16 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] SOVREN CRC - pass while spinning This was just posted on another forum. Arnie Loyning spin and pass in his Lotus Elan. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dz4P6e_Yv3c _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From tony at tonydrews.com Thu Mar 11 23:42:14 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 00:42:14 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> Message-ID: <20100312064246.9EBB2187663@autox.team.net> I thought the RA1's were awesome in the wet, even with not a lot of tread - no standing puddles in that particular race. One of my overall victories. Passed that fast Healey 3000 on the outside in the carousel. Heh, heh. - Tony At 08:38 PM 3/11/2010, LimeyV8 at aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 3/11/2010 8:39:48 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, >robertten1 at aol.com writes: > >I like my Toyo R888's on my Spit GT autocrosser, originally bought as wet >weather tires but have found them to be excellent in the dry as well. ( >185r60x13 ) > > > >I got RA1s because Miata racers told me the R888s were terrible in the wet. >what are your thoughts on that? > > >Cheers, >Jack Mc > >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tony at tonydrews.com From igofaster at att.net Fri Mar 12 08:38:06 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 07:38:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] amb transponders... Message-ID: <875652.8947.qm@web180702.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I missed the links on AMB transponders last week... where's the deal on the re-charge units?? My new Spitwad is coming tomorrow without transponder and my GT6 is hard wired... kindest regards my fellow Triumpaholics (no pun to Lindsey Lohan) ... Bobby Whitehead From trmarty at hotmail.com Fri Mar 12 11:22:54 2010 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:22:54 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> Message-ID: Mark, if your ever at a VTR event (or any other event) and I'm there and my car happens to still be running your more than welcome to co-drive. Now if you beat me in my own car like that other guy that uses his initials for his signature we would have to talk:) Marty > > I'd like to get back to some sort of racing. Moving all this junk around > cleaning up the shop has got me thinking more and more about getting back > at it. Are you sure none of you need a Unix/Linux sys admin, email expert, > personal chef, Brit car mechanic or some such? Racing can be tough when > you have no income! > > > mjb. > _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsofts powerful SPAM protection. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/210850552/direct/01/ From lang at isis.mit.edu Fri Mar 12 12:38:43 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 14:38:43 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Mar 2010, marty sukey wrote: > Mark, if your ever at a VTR event (or any other event) and I'm there and my > car happens to still be running your more than welcome to co-drive. Now if > you beat me in my own car like that other guy that uses his initials for his > signature we would have to talk:) Hey - I resemble that comment! But the results say the car was silver. You have nothing to worry about. Yours was blue. :-) > Marty rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From rjl6n at cstone.net Fri Mar 12 12:58:45 2010 From: rjl6n at cstone.net (rjl6n at cstone.net) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 14:58:45 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4094e235badea1464dea17c613271ba0.squirrel@webmail.ntelos.net> That's OK, both rml and mjb have beaten me in my own car at various times... John > On Fri, 12 Mar 2010, marty sukey wrote: > >> Now if you beat me in my own car like that >> otherguy that uses his initials for his >> signature we would have to talk:) > > Robert M. Lang wrote: > Hey - I resemble that comment! From mark at bradakis.com Fri Mar 12 19:02:35 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 19:02:35 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! Message-ID: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> With all the Laylande parts and DGOE carbs, this car has *GOT* to be worth every penny: http://tinyurl.com/yb8yjud And such a nice shade of British Green. Sheesh. mjb. From spitlist at cox.net Fri Mar 12 19:02:13 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 19:02:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! In-Reply-To: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> References: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> Message-ID: Did they really make TR7's with Dolomite Sprint engines? Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark J Bradakis Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 7:03 PM To: 'Friends of Triumph' Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! With all the Laylande parts and DGOE carbs, this car has *GOT* to be worth every penny: http://tinyurl.com/yb8yjud And such a nice shade of British Green. Sheesh. mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From billb at bnj.com Fri Mar 12 19:05:06 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 16:05:06 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! In-Reply-To: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> References: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <2FAD7D03-4CA7-4F14-AFA4-01AFA7BCC68D@bnj.com> Wow, how very... how you say,... excluseyve. And only $17,000!!??!! quel bargaine. On Mar 12, 2010, at 4:02 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > With all the Laylande parts and DGOE carbs, this car has *GOT* to > be worth every penny: > > http://tinyurl.com/yb8yjud > > And such a nice shade of British Green. > > Sheesh. > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From mark at bradakis.com Fri Mar 12 19:12:52 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 19:12:52 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! In-Reply-To: References: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4B9AF4A4.5080504@bradakis.com> Who was it at the Savannah VTR who had the 7 with the dolly sprint head? I had heat stroke and brake fluid poisoning, I don't remember. mjb. From macdonaldp at rogers.com Fri Mar 12 20:12:08 2010 From: macdonaldp at rogers.com (Paul MacDonald) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 22:12:08 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! In-Reply-To: References: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <7CA0AB18999645778301297F23B7556B@your4dacd0ea75> A lot of the sprint engine cars were factory rally TR7s. A few were made non rally. Several have been made in North America, but certainly not worth as much as they cost to build, like $3-5000 for a TR7 convertible plus about 3-4 to do the engine, a waste of money to build a coupe, still worth little. Paul http://www.trdrivers.com/tr7_sprint_.html -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Joe Curry Sent: March 12, 2010 9:02 PM To: 'Mark J Bradakis'; 'Friends of Triumph' Subject: Re: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! Did they really make TR7's with Dolomite Sprint engines? Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark J Bradakis Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 7:03 PM To: 'Friends of Triumph' Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! With all the Laylande parts and DGOE carbs, this car has *GOT* to be worth every penny: http://tinyurl.com/yb8yjud And such a nice shade of British Green. Sheesh. mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/macdonaldp at rogers.com From fasttrs at yahoo.com Fri Mar 12 21:37:21 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 20:37:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! Message-ID: <969760.79330.qm@web46115.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> The only one I know of in the SE belonged to Hal Doby that lives in Snellville Georgia. I'm not sure he still has it though. Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 12, 2010, at 8:12 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: Who was it at the Savannah VTR who had the 7 with the dolly sprint head? I had heat stroke and brake fluid poisoning, I don't remember. mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From mark at bradakis.com Fri Mar 12 23:41:00 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 23:41:00 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com> Anyone remember Phoenix Stahlflex tires? mjb. From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Sat Mar 13 05:32:50 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 07:32:50 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Peyote Message-ID: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Hi all, I just got my Vintage Motorsport magazine, with the 2010 Annual included. On page 69 is a great photo of Bill Babcock in the Peyote dicing with Cameron Healy's Porsche-Cooper. Nice shot. Bill, is this the "Pooper"? I think it was at the Glen last Sept. I had a late 50's Road and Track Magazine with an article about the Pooper that I took to the Vintage GP. The Pooper was parked near me and I went over to give the magazine to the owner.There was an older fellow there (I have to watch when I start talking about older fellows!) talking with the owner. I was told he had built the original car. He ended up with the magazine. And misty eyes. And the owner bought me lunch. Great bunch, these vintage guys. Bill From lang at isis.mit.edu Sat Mar 13 07:45:00 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 09:45:00 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Mar 2010, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > Anyone remember Phoenix Stahlflex tires? Careful, Mark. Comments like that will get you labelled as an Olde Fart! Oddly, those tires were before my time, but if you come across a barn find with a set of those babies on there... > mjb. regards, rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From billb at bnj.com Sat Mar 13 08:43:44 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 05:43:44 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Peyote In-Reply-To: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Yes, it's one of the Poopers, I think there's three, I know there's two--the silver one you saw and a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers. I race with both of them, a fine and spirited competition with guys I trust. Cameron was at the Glen last year in part to make sure the original owner/builder got to see it. His name is on the tip of my tongue but I can't recall it. Cameron is about as nice a guy as you're likely to meet and a hell of a good driver. Besides being competitors we live about 500 yards from each other in Portland, and one island away from each other in Hawaii. Yet somehow the only place we generally get together is the track. On Mar 13, 2010, at 2:32 AM, WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: > Hi all, I just got my Vintage Motorsport magazine, with the 2010 Annual > included. > On page 69 is a great photo of Bill Babcock in the Peyote dicing with Cameron > Healy's Porsche-Cooper. Nice shot. > Bill, is this the "Pooper"? I think it was at the Glen last Sept. > I had a late 50's Road and Track Magazine with an article about the Pooper > that I took to the Vintage GP. The Pooper was parked near me and I went over > to give the magazine to the owner.There was an older fellow there (I have to > watch when I start talking about older fellows!) talking with the owner. I was > told he had built the original car. He ended up with the magazine. And misty > eyes. And the owner bought me lunch. > Great bunch, these vintage guys. > Bill > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From dos_gusanos at msn.com Sat Mar 13 09:04:35 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 09:04:35 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, , <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, , <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, , <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com>, , <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: I bought those Phoenix Tires and they Tranformed my MG Midget. But it wasn't lonng before I needed Yokohama A008's............................Henry Morrison > Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 09:45:00 -0500 > From: lang at isis.mit.edu > To: mark at bradakis.com > CC: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) > > On Fri, 12 Mar 2010, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > > > Anyone remember Phoenix Stahlflex tires? > > Careful, Mark. Comments like that will get you labelled as an Olde Fart! > > Oddly, those tires were before my time, but if you come across a barn find > with a set of those babies on there... > > > mjb. > > regards, > rml > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent > 2010 NER Solo Chair | > Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dos_gusanos at msn.com From britbits at netzero.net Sat Mar 13 21:07:35 2010 From: britbits at netzero.net (britbits at netzero.net) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 04:07:35 GMT Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: <20100313.220735.14532.0@webmail19.dca.untd.com> Mark, You are showing your age. ;) In a related fashion, I'm still trying to remember if the Phoenix was the original name or the "secondary" name for the tire, back in the early 80s. I seem to think Semperit bought the rights, after P-S went under. I used to help prep an '67 MGB-GT for concourse, it had the phoenix tires in the back and Pirelli P3s in front. Also a great tire, until I discovered A008s. ;) Cheers, Jim Dallas jgambony at gcecisp.com ---------- Original Message ---------- From: Mark J Bradakis To: FOT Subject: Re: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 23:41:00 -0700 Anyone remember Phoenix Stahlflex tires? mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/britbits at netzero.net ____________________________________________________________ Criminal Lawyer Criminal Lawyers - Click here. http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2241/c?cp=37OpWVZovjYg7eurXNfxXwAAJ1GU 0HcZ7PRpF0fndYeeSkVqAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAiFgAAAAA= From mark at bradakis.com Sat Mar 13 21:22:07 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 21:22:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4B9C646F.9000807@bradakis.com> > Careful, Mark. Comments like that will get you labelled as an Olde Fart! > What, who, me? I remember my grandfather talking about them, yep, that's the story, honest, trust me! mjb the greenhorn. From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sat Mar 13 22:15:38 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 22:15:38 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: > a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his VW dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. I have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the Seattle area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed out on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter Revson, et.al.,... those were the guys I had my teenage eyes on. But missed a lot I could have learned in that time. Pete Lovely was a VW dealer/customer. Same for Monte Shelton. But he had everything from Lincoln/Mercury to Ferrari and Aston - Best story I can think of from him is a friend who bought his wife a new RR Corniche convert from Monty's guys. Deal was Monty Shelton Motorcars would install a hitch [to tow a Ventnor V12 speedboat] and they would honor the warranty. [If anyone wants a short dissertation on the early version of the RR TH400 trans. fiasco, let me know]. Anyway, both Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton were customers . Actually great, - no b.s. - easy customers. Though I do remember Pete's very Swedish sense of humor - He had a great ludafisk joke. Point is, I knew both of these guys on a first name basis in the late '70's/early '80's and knew nothing about who they were in any racing context. , Not certain but I think Pete is many years gone but Monty might still be around. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm sure neither would remember me, but I sure remember them - regardless of who they "were". Also brings back memories of Carlos from Alfa of Tacoma - former Ferrari F1 mechanic. Anyone know if he's still around? That saint put up with me poking around his shop as a bored teenager and managed to teach me a bit in the process. Sure does explain that little red Sports Racer though. Now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure I have pics of it at SIR maybe as far back as '69. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM P.S. Tomorrow is Pi Day - 3/14 3.14 --- Pi, my Plum Pi's namesake number and Albert Einstein's birthday. From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sat Mar 13 22:37:12 2010 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 21:37:12 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: Greg, Pete Lovely is still around and was racing his Ferrari TR for several years until he sold it several years ago. He also used to bring his Lotus formula car to the race track loaded on the back of a VW transporter. It was a kick to watch him load it on the flatbed VW, he would jack up the front of the VW and had long ramps and pull the Louts up on it. The VW had extensions on the back a couple of feet long to hold the car. Carlos is still running the Alfa shop with Leno. They seem to be doing okay though I haven't stopped in their lately. I usually see him around at the machine shop. Great that you know these guys and I think its great we have them here in Tacoma. Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" To: "fot Triumph" Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 9:15 PM Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper > On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: >> a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers > > WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his VW > dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north > Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back > shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. I > have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the Seattle > area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. > As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed out > on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter Revson, > et.al.,... those were the guys I had my teenage eyes on. But missed a lot > I could have learned in that time. Pete Lovely was a VW dealer/customer. > Same for Monte Shelton. But he had everything from Lincoln/Mercury to > Ferrari and Aston - Best story I can think of from him is a friend who > bought his wife a new RR Corniche convert from Monty's guys. Deal was > Monty Shelton Motorcars would install a hitch [to tow a Ventnor V12 > speedboat] and they would honor the warranty. [If anyone wants a short > dissertation on the early version of the RR TH400 trans. fiasco, let me > know]. > Anyway, both Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton were customers . Actually > great, - no b.s. - easy customers. Though I do remember Pete's very > Swedish sense of humor - He had a great ludafisk joke. Point is, I knew > both of these guys on a first name basis in the late '70's/early '80's > and knew nothing about who they were in any racing context. , > Not certain but I think Pete is many years gone but Monty might still be > around. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm sure neither would remember > me, but I sure remember them - regardless of who they "were". > Also brings back memories of Carlos from Alfa of Tacoma - former Ferrari > F1 mechanic. Anyone know if he's still around? That saint put up with me > poking around his shop as a bored teenager and managed to teach me a bit > in the process. > > Sure does explain that little red Sports Racer though. Now that I think > about it, I'm pretty sure I have pics of it at SIR maybe as far back as > '69. > > Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > > > P.S. Tomorrow is Pi Day - 3/14 > 3.14 --- Pi, my Plum Pi's namesake number and Albert Einstein's birthday. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/charly at mitchelplumbing.com From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sat Mar 13 23:43:20 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 23:43:20 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: Thanks Charley, Crazy! Carlos is still doing his thing! If you ever see him, mention the name "Lunker" Hilyer in conjunction with Ferrari # 13133 or a Maserati 3500 and he just might remember me pestering him. I'm sure he [along with lots of others] has no idea how influential he was to me. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Mar 13, 2010, at 10:37 PM, Charly Mitchel wrote: > Greg, Pete Lovely is still around and was racing his Ferrari TR for > several years until he sold it several years ago. He also used to > bring his Lotus formula car to the race track loaded on the back of > a VW transporter. It was a kick to watch him load it on the flatbed > VW, he would jack up the front of the VW and had long ramps and > pull the Louts up on it. The VW had extensions on the back a > couple of feet long to hold the car. > Carlos is still running the Alfa shop with Leno. They seem to be > doing okay though I haven't stopped in their lately. I usually see > him around at the machine shop. Great that you know these guys and > I think its great we have them here in Tacoma. > Charly Mitchel > TR6 #44 > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" > > To: "fot Triumph" > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 9:15 PM > Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper From norlinengineering at comcast.net Sat Mar 13 23:55:59 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 22:55:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3293C19C138B4662B17279C5CFE7281B@TOSHIBALAPTOP> "but Monty might still be around. Please correct me if I'm wrong." Monte's still around. He came by and visited with me last weekend at PIR. It was the opening SCCA regional. I had the Spitfire out to get my annual tech and was working on some prep for the upcoming Double National at Thunderhill when he stopped by. Monte normally drives a 935, but last year ran against me in a couple of races in his HP Rabbit. Great guy and a very good racer. Jim Norlin From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Sun Mar 14 00:02:57 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 02:02:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: <00fe01cac344$61268fb0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Hi Greg, if my memory is right, Monte Sheldon used to race CanAm cars. Small world. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" To: "fot Triumph" Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 12:15 AM Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper > On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: > > a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers > > WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his > VW dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north > Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back > shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. > I have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the > Seattle area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. > As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed > out on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter > Revson, et.al.,... those were the guys I had my teenage eyes on. But > missed a lot I could have learned in that time. Pete Lovely was a VW > dealer/customer. Same for Monte Shelton. But he had everything from > Lincoln/Mercury to Ferrari and Aston - Best story I can think of from > him is a friend who bought his wife a new RR Corniche convert from > Monty's guys. Deal was Monty Shelton Motorcars would install a hitch > [to tow a Ventnor V12 speedboat] and they would honor the warranty. > [If anyone wants a short dissertation on the early version of the RR > TH400 trans. fiasco, let me know]. > Anyway, both Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton were customers . Actually > great, - no b.s. - easy customers. Though I do remember Pete's very > Swedish sense of humor - He had a great ludafisk joke. Point is, I > knew both of these guys on a first name basis in the late '70's/early > '80's and knew nothing about who they were in any racing context. , > Not certain but I think Pete is many years gone but Monty might still > be around. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm sure neither would > remember me, but I sure remember them - regardless of who they "were". > Also brings back memories of Carlos from Alfa of Tacoma - former > Ferrari F1 mechanic. Anyone know if he's still around? That saint put > up with me poking around his shop as a bored teenager and managed to > teach me a bit in the process. > > Sure does explain that little red Sports Racer though. Now that I > think about it, I'm pretty sure I have pics of it at SIR maybe as far > back as '69. > > Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > > > P.S. Tomorrow is Pi Day - 3/14 > 3.14 --- Pi, my Plum Pi's namesake number and Albert Einstein's > birthday. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sun Mar 14 00:12:48 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 00:12:48 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: <00fe01cac344$61268fb0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> <00fe01cac344$61268fb0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <4255BCAD-8658-40FD-8297-B9D25A0F81AF@earthlink.net> That's what I mean. He raced EVERYTHING but was just a used car guy to me. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Mar 14, 2010, at 12:02 AM, WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: > Hi Greg, if my memory is right, Monte Sheldon used to race CanAm > cars. > Small world. > Bill----- Original Message ----- > From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" > To: "fot Triumph" > Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 12:15 AM > Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper > > >> On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: >>> a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers >> >> WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his >> VW dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north >> Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back >> shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. >> I have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the >> Seattle area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. >> As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed >> out on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter >> Revson, et.al.,... those were the guys I had my teenage eyes on. But >> missed a lot I could have learned in that time. Pete Lovely was a VW >> dealer/customer. Same for Monte Shelton. But he had everything from >> Lincoln/Mercury to Ferrari and Aston - Best story I can think of from >> him is a friend who bought his wife a new RR Corniche convert from >> Monty's guys. Deal was Monty Shelton Motorcars would install a hitch >> [to tow a Ventnor V12 speedboat] and they would honor the warranty. >> [If anyone wants a short dissertation on the early version of the RR >> TH400 trans. fiasco, let me know]. >> Anyway, both Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton were customers . Actually >> great, - no b.s. - easy customers. Though I do remember Pete's very >> Swedish sense of humor - He had a great ludafisk joke. Point is, I >> knew both of these guys on a first name basis in the late '70's/early >> '80's and knew nothing about who they were in any racing context. , >> Not certain but I think Pete is many years gone but Monty might still >> be around. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm sure neither would >> remember me, but I sure remember them - regardless of who they >> "were". >> Also brings back memories of Carlos from Alfa of Tacoma - former >> Ferrari F1 mechanic. Anyone know if he's still around? That saint put >> up with me poking around his shop as a bored teenager and managed to >> teach me a bit in the process. >> >> Sure does explain that little red Sports Racer though. Now that I >> think about it, I'm pretty sure I have pics of it at SIR maybe as far >> back as '69. >> >> Greg "Lunker" Hilyer >> TR4 #314 >> Albuquerque NM >> >> >> P.S. Tomorrow is Pi Day - 3/14 >> 3.14 --- Pi, my Plum Pi's namesake number and Albert Einstein's >> birthday. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ > lunkercars at earthlink.net From billb at bnj.com Sun Mar 14 08:14:23 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 05:14:23 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: Both Pete and Monte are alive and well, and still drive hard and fast. I usually see Pete at races like the Wine Country, occasionally at NW races. I was chasing Pete's Lotus at Sears when Peyote's steering came apart. Usually race with Monte at the Rose Cup in Portland. Both great guys. On Mar 13, 2010, at 7:15 PM, Greg Lunker Hilyer wrote: > On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: >> a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers > > WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his VW dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. I have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the Seattle area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. > As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed out on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter Revson, et.al.,... From jcjcarrera at comcast.net Sun Mar 14 20:31:21 2010 From: jcjcarrera at comcast.net (jcjcarrera at comcast.net) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 03:31:21 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Shelton and Lovely Message-ID: <2037566255.847371268623881311.JavaMail.root@sz0079a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> As a resident of the Pacific NW the last 40 years, I have read with great interest the comments on Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton-two legendsB on the West Coast.B As Bill Babcock pointed out, they are both very accomplished racers. In fact, I have an old Sports Car Illustrated in my files from the late 50's or early 60'sB which has a picture of Pete somewhere in Europe with the Lotus Gran Prix team. Apparently , he was a good enough racer to draw the attention of Lotus and had an extended trial with them. Actually ran some races in what is now F1.B He has a gorgeous well endowed blond with him in the photo. I believe this lady turned out to be his wife Nevely whom I met at a party in Tacoma in the early 1980's. What drew my attention to her was the shirt she was wearing. On the front of the shirt was the rear end of a car with two round red taillights blinking in a provocative location. Nevely passed away a few years ago. Some other tidbits on Pete, he won the first ever professional race at Laguna Seca . My first Monterey Historics was in 94 when Ferrari was the featured marque and he was racing his recently restored Testa Rossa . I marvelled how precise of a driver he was as he shifted at the exact same spot from 2nd to 3rd on the straight lap after lap. He won his race, cleaned up the TR and took it to Pebble the next day and won his class there! He had a VW dealership in Fife, WA (suburb of Tacoma)B for many years which he sold, but kept the buildings and property and leased them to a " Datsun " dealer and then a Volvo dealership. Not sure if he still owns the property. As Charly Mitchel pointed out, Carlos and his brother Leno still run Alfa of Tacoma in a building owned by Pete and I believe he still owns the shop run by Carlos. Monte is a Porsche legend from the 70's and 80's running 911 RSR's and 935's, etc. His son Neal is also an outstanding driver and probably could have gone pro but manages the family car business in downtown Portland. When I had a business meeting with Neal about ten years ago, he toured me through their dealership and garage in the back street. Great race cars, rare classics from the 30's and even a TR4 with under 10K miles! Not sure if he still has the TR.B Shelton MotorsB still sell Jags and Saabs and Monte and Neal share a Porsche 962 in vintage IMSA races. The thing that always impressed me about the Pete and Neal was their accessibility and friendliness. John James TR4 #116 B From igofaster at att.net Mon Mar 15 08:34:10 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 08:34:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment Message-ID: <973308.64134.qm@web180710.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. I'll give a photo shop on the cars when I get some time. I need to adjust the torque on the 1300 cc head and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. The Spit has been raced sine 1973 from Seattle to Huntington Beach with the VARA. I don't think CVAR is going to let me run the car so much as there is a full cage which extends beyond the firewall to the front area of the frame and radiator... we'll see.... It was a great deal on the Spitwad and I'll get a chance to run it with other clubs I'm sure... All the best.... Bobby Whitehead 1971 TR6 1970 GT6 DP 1965 Spitfire EP and ONE happy wife....... well..... the TR6 IS her car... From norlinengineering at comcast.net Mon Mar 15 09:52:29 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 09:52:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <973308.64134.qm@web180710.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5E77D78A789E432F9E620FBC7023B30F@TOSHIBALAPTOP> The way I adjust the valves on the Spit is to first loosen all the jam nuts. Rotate the engine until two of the valves are fully open or nearly so. Then adjust the mirror image valves of the two that are down. In otherwords, if 1 and 7 are down, adjust 8 and 2. Keep doing this until all the jam nuts are tight again. The Spit goes on the chassis dyno this afternoon. We're heading out to Thunderhill for the Double National on Wed evening. Any other FOT'er going to be there? Jim Norlin -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bobby Whitehead Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 8:34 AM To: FoT Triumph Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. I'll give a photo shop on the cars when I get some time. I need to adjust the torque on the 1300 cc head and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. The Spit has been raced sine 1973 from Seattle to Huntington Beach with the VARA. I don't think CVAR is going to let me run the car so much as there is a full cage which extends beyond the firewall to the front area of the frame and radiator... we'll see.... It was a great deal on the Spitwad and I'll get a chance to run it with other clubs I'm sure... All the best.... Bobby Whitehead 1971 TR6 1970 GT6 DP 1965 Spitfire EP and ONE happy wife....... well..... the TR6 IS her car... _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/norlinengineering at comcast.net From Gt6steve at aol.com Mon Mar 15 10:06:28 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:06:28 EDT Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment Message-ID: <4d14b.4be89180.38cfc314@aol.com> I LOVE Thunderhill. Just wish it wasn't so far away... Good Luck and have a great time. In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:02:24 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, norlinengineering at comcast.net writes: The way I adjust the valves on the Spit is to first loosen all the jam nuts. Rotate the engine until two of the valves are fully open or nearly so. Then adjust the mirror image valves of the two that are down. In otherwords, if 1 and 7 are down, adjust 8 and 2. Keep doing this until all the jam nuts are tight again. The Spit goes on the chassis dyno this afternoon. We're heading out to Thunderhill for the Double National on Wed evening. Any other FOT'er going to be there? Jim Norlin -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bobby Whitehead Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 8:34 AM To: FoT Triumph Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. I'll give a photo shop on the cars when I get some time. I need to adjust the torque on the 1300 cc head and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. The Spit has been raced sine 1973 from Seattle to Huntington Beach with the VARA. I don't think CVAR is going to let me run the car so much as there is a full cage which extends beyond the firewall to the front area of the frame and radiator... we'll see.... It was a great deal on the Spitwad and I'll get a chance to run it with other clubs I'm sure... All the best.... Bobby Whitehead 1971 TR6 1970 GT6 DP 1965 Spitfire EP and ONE happy wife....... well..... the TR6 IS her car... _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/norlinengineering at comcast.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com From mark at bradakis.com Mon Mar 15 10:06:53 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:06:53 -0600 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <973308.64134.qm@web180710.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <973308.64134.qm@web180710.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4B9E692D.8090307@bradakis.com> Bobby Whitehead wrote: > We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now > a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. > > > Nice. > and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. > > Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and exhaust for some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed and the intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that cylinder's mate. On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the firing order it goes fairly quickly. mjb. From Gt6steve at aol.com Mon Mar 15 10:08:47 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:08:47 EDT Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment Message-ID: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. Pro's and cons? In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:07:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, mark at bradakis.com writes: Bobby Whitehead wrote: > We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now > a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. > > > Nice. > and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. > > Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and exhaust for some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed and the intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that cylinder's mate. On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the firing order it goes fairly quickly. mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com From mark at bradakis.com Mon Mar 15 10:18:40 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:18:40 -0600 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> References: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> Message-ID: <4B9E6BF0.8000301@bradakis.com> Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: > Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we > missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? > > I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. > > Pro's and cons? I like my way, as it is easy to keep track of which valves have been done, and I think it takes fewer turns of the crank. In theory, though, either method should be able to cover all the valves withing two revolutions of the crank. mjb. From dmitchel at sbcglobal.net Mon Mar 15 10:38:02 2010 From: dmitchel at sbcglobal.net (Doug Mitchell) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 10:38:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 Message-ID: <563670.46921.qm@web80807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Amici, Check out this Racetorations "resto-mod". http://www.dep-o.co.uk/page339.asp Doug From tlizzard at msn.com Mon Mar 15 14:57:08 2010 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 17:57:08 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <563670.46921.qm@web80807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <563670.46921.qm@web80807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: WOW! Just wow! Terry Stetler From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Mon Mar 15 17:58:53 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 20:58:53 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> Wow is an understatement. How did he get the stance? TR4 rear end and spacers up front or did he do it with custom offset wheels. Looks great! M From n197tr4 at cs.com Mon Mar 15 18:11:22 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 21:11:22 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Peyote In-Reply-To: <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: <8CC92BCBA0497C3-A64-447F@webmail-m006.sysops.aol.com> That Pooper was also owned by one of our favorite midwestern racers, 'DUCK' WADDLE. -----Original Message----- From: Bill Babcock To: WILLIAM TOBIN Cc: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Sat, Mar 13, 2010 9:43 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Peyote Yes, it's one of the Poopers, I think there's three, I know there's two--the ilver one you saw and a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by enny Akers. I race with both of them, a fine and spirited competition with uys I trust. Cameron was at the Glen last year in part to make sure the riginal owner/builder got to see it. His name is on the tip of my tongue but can't recall it. Cameron is about as nice a guy as you're likely to meet and a hell of a good river. Besides being competitors we live about 500 yards from each other in ortland, and one island away from each other in Hawaii. Yet somehow the only lace we generally get together is the track. n Mar 13, 2010, at 2:32 AM, WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: > Hi all, I just got my Vintage Motorsport magazine, with the 2010 Annual included. On page 69 is a great photo of Bill Babcock in the Peyote dicing with ameron Healy's Porsche-Cooper. Nice shot. Bill, is this the "Pooper"? I think it was at the Glen last Sept. I had a late 50's Road and Track Magazine with an article about the Pooper that I took to the Vintage GP. The Pooper was parked near me and I went ver to give the magazine to the owner.There was an older fellow there (I have o watch when I start talking about older fellows!) talking with the owner. I as told he had built the original car. He ended up with the magazine. And isty eyes. And the owner bought me lunch. Great bunch, these vintage guys. Bill _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com _______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From adams910 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 19:33:05 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 22:33:05 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> References: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's farther along than the pictures show. I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. From n197tr4 at cs.com Mon Mar 15 20:25:38 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 23:25:38 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> References: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8CC92CF7BE8CDA9-5A4C-8DE5@webmail-m072.sysops.aol.com> Not only have we been in contact with, I was planning to nominate him to the FOT. And I invited hin to join us at Heartland Park in August. Coincidently, I will be in his neighborhood of New Orleans tomorrow afternoon. Always a small world when you are a FOT. >From the Natchez Trace.....Jackson, MS -----Original Message----- From: Bob Adams To: Mark Eginton Cc: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, Mar 15, 2010 9:33 pm Subject: Re: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 ttp://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's arther along than the pictures show. I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. _______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From triosan at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 21:06:48 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 21:06:48 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Tim Suddard email address Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003152106k2ebb9817yedce92d21b2a93a4@mail.gmail.com> Tim, I need your email address. I have several pretty nice pictures of the TR250K you might like to see, if not use, in conjunction with the Mitty this year. Bill Hart and Tony Garmey willing that is. Oh, and Tom Krieger also. Chuck -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Tue Mar 16 09:20:06 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 09:20:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> References: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <16C93800-E85A-4522-93F6-50A45107BCB7@earthlink.net> Well that one looks a little too nice. A jewel of a tractor engine. ~Steve On Mar 15, 2010, at 7:33 PM, Bob Adams wrote: Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's farther along than the pictures show. I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Tue Mar 16 10:37:43 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (jerryvv at roadrunner.com) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 17:37:43 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <16C93800-E85A-4522-93F6-50A45107BCB7@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20100316173743.069SK.599315.root@cdptpa-web08-z02> If it wasn't for all of the pop up ads it might be an interesting site to view. One of the ads would not go away so the website went away, never to be viewed by me again. JVV ---- Steven Belfer wrote: > Well that one looks a little too nice. A jewel of a tractor engine. > > ~Steve > > > On Mar 15, 2010, at 7:33 PM, Bob Adams wrote: > > Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 > http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's > farther along than the pictures show. > > I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com From billb at bnj.com Tue Mar 16 10:46:28 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 07:46:28 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <20100316173743.069SK.599315.root@cdptpa-web08-z02> References: <20100316173743.069SK.599315.root@cdptpa-web08-z02> Message-ID: <7A72E5F7-FEA3-453C-AA3B-ACA7E2E12777@bnj.com> You need a better browser, or at least better configuration. Firefox, Safari and Chrome all have pretty good pop up protection. I haven't used IE for years, but I assume it does to. On Mar 16, 2010, at 7:37 AM, wrote: > If it wasn't for all of the pop up ads it might be an interesting site to view. > One of the ads would not go away so the website went away, never to be viewed by me again. > JVV > > ---- Steven Belfer wrote: >> Well that one looks a little too nice. A jewel of a tractor engine. >> >> ~Steve >> >> >> On Mar 15, 2010, at 7:33 PM, Bob Adams wrote: >> >> Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 >> http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's >> farther along than the pictures show. >> >> I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From cartravel at pobox.com Tue Mar 16 11:40:23 2010 From: cartravel at pobox.com (Larry Young) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 13:40:23 -0500 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> References: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> Message-ID: <4B9FD097.9020803@pobox.com> Ok, I'll jump in and try to make this way too technical. Both methods are using the fact that the cylinder "mate" has it's lobes 180 degrees apart. The rule of 9's is a bit more explicit, because it identifies the exact lobes which are 180 degrees apart. For a 110 lobe separation and taking the first lobe to be 0, the other lobes are at angles of: 0, 110, 20, 270, 90, 200, 290, 180 You can see that when lobe 1 is at zero lobe 8 is at 180 or exactly opposite. Since two of the lobes are within 20 degrees of each other, you might as well set those at the same time as Jim and Steve suggest. Mark is setting the valves when the cam is split between intake and exhaust centers. When the first two lobes are at +55 and -55, he would set the last two lobes, which will be 55 degrees on each side of 180. I have a small concern with this method, because some lift curves can have ramps that extend 110 degrees are more from the centerline. Adding that to the 55 gives you 165, which gives an allowance of 15 degrees for error. If you're going to use this method, you need to make sure your cam doesn't have long ramps. I use the other method for this reason. Larry Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: > Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we > missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? > > I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. > > Pro's and cons? > > > In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:07:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > mark at bradakis.com writes: > > Bobby Whitehead wrote: > >> We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 >> > and now > >> a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. >> >> >> >> > Nice. > > >> and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual >> > yet. > >> >> > > Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and > exhaust for > some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed > and the > intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that > cylinder's mate. > On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the > firing order it goes fairly quickly. > > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cartravel at pobox.com From kaskas at cox.net Tue Mar 16 12:51:49 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 12:51:49 -0700 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <4B9FD097.9020803@pobox.com> Message-ID: <20100316155149.MPO7U.91815.imail@fed1rmwml36> I too always used the rule of 9. Takes all worries out of the cam design. Good comment of the ramps being long on some designs, that was another thing I liked a lot. ---- Larry Young wrote: ============= Ok, I'll jump in and try to make this way too technical. Both methods are using the fact that the cylinder "mate" has it's lobes 180 degrees apart. The rule of 9's is a bit more explicit, because it identifies the exact lobes which are 180 degrees apart. For a 110 lobe separation and taking the first lobe to be 0, the other lobes are at angles of: 0, 110, 20, 270, 90, 200, 290, 180 You can see that when lobe 1 is at zero lobe 8 is at 180 or exactly opposite. Since two of the lobes are within 20 degrees of each other, you might as well set those at the same time as Jim and Steve suggest. Mark is setting the valves when the cam is split between intake and exhaust centers. When the first two lobes are at +55 and -55, he would set the last two lobes, which will be 55 degrees on each side of 180. I have a small concern with this method, because some lift curves can have ramps that extend 110 degrees are more from the centerline. Adding that to the 55 gives you 165, which gives an allowance of 15 degrees for error. If you're going to use this method, you need to make sure your cam doesn't have long ramps. I use the other method for this reason. Larry Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: > Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we > missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? > > I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. > > Pro's and cons? > > > In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:07:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > mark at bradakis.com writes: > > Bobby Whitehead wrote: > >> We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 >> > and now > >> a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. >> >> >> >> > Nice. > > >> and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual >> > yet. > >> >> > > Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and > exhaust for > some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed > and the > intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that > cylinder's mate. > On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the > firing order it goes fairly quickly. > > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cartravel at pobox.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 16:10:53 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 16:10:53 -0700 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <20100316155149.MPO7U.91815.imail@fed1rmwml36> References: <4B9FD097.9020803@pobox.com> <20100316155149.MPO7U.91815.imail@fed1rmwml36> Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003161610i45352e8cwa15f1a15ed5aa59b@mail.gmail.com> Course those of us with a 6 use the rule of 13. On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 12:51 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > I too always used the rule of 9. Takes all worries out of the cam design. Good comment of the ramps being long on some designs, that was another thing I liked a lot. > ---- Larry Young wrote: > > ============= > Ok, I'll jump in and try to make this way too technical. Both methods > are using the fact that the cylinder "mate" has it's lobes 180 degrees > apart. The rule of 9's is a bit more explicit, because it identifies > the exact lobes which are 180 degrees apart. For a 110 lobe separation > and taking the first lobe to be 0, the other lobes are at angles of: > 0, 110, 20, 270, 90, 200, 290, 180 > You can see that when lobe 1 is at zero lobe 8 is at 180 or exactly > opposite. Since two of the lobes are within 20 degrees of each other, > you might as well set those at the same time as Jim and Steve suggest. > Mark is setting the valves when the cam is split between intake and > exhaust centers. When the first two lobes are at +55 and -55, he would > set the last two lobes, which will be 55 degrees on each side of 180. I > have a small concern with this method, because some lift curves can have > ramps that extend 110 degrees are more from the centerline. Adding that > to the 55 gives you 165, which gives an allowance of 15 degrees for > error. If you're going to use this method, you need to make sure your > cam doesn't have long ramps. I use the other method for this reason. > Larry > > Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: >> Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we >> missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? >> >> I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. >> >> Pro's and cons? >> >> >> In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:07:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, >> mark at bradakis.com writes: >> >> Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> >>> We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 >>> >> and now >> >>> a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. >>> >>> >>> >>> >> Nice. >> >> >>> and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual >>> >> yet. >> >>> >>> >> >> Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and >> exhaust for >> some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed >> and the >> intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that >> cylinder's mate. >> On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the >> firing order it goes fairly quickly. >> >> >> mjb. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cartravel at pobox.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net > > > > -- > Never be beaten by equipment > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/triosan at gmail.com > > > -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Tue Mar 16 17:02:12 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 17:02:12 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: spitfire head torque and valve adjustment References: <21170FFA-CF4F-461D-A104-A93924C18B2E@earthlink.net> Message-ID: Here's a cool video of a guy adjusting valves on an MG. If you haven't done it too many times, you may find this helpful or at least mildly entertaining. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fezXUwVfH7U ~Steve From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Wed Mar 17 09:12:48 2010 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 12:12:48 -0400 Subject: [Fot] FW: tr3 race clutch?? In-Reply-To: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Amici: Can anyone help Jim out? I haven't been paying attention! There used to be a way to search the archives, but I don't see it now. Just a list of all the threads. John H. Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 08:36:05 -0700 From: jimbooth019 at yahoo.com Subject: tr3 race clutch?? To: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Hey JR, We are working on a Peerless GT vintage race car.(TR3 powered) Looking for performance clutch. any suggestions? jim From dave at microworks.net Wed Mar 17 09:23:16 2010 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 09:23:16 -0700 Subject: [Fot] FW: tr3 race clutch?? In-Reply-To: References: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4BA101F4.7020204@microworks.net> Look down at the bottom of the email. Click on the link to the Archives Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Select "fot" from the Names column - not Date or Thread from the Current Index column John Herrera wrote: > Amici: > > > > Can anyone help Jim out? I haven't been paying attention! > > > > There used to be a way to search the archives, but I don't see it now. Just a > list of all the threads. > > > > John H. > > > > Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 08:36:05 -0700 > From: jimbooth019 at yahoo.com > Subject: tr3 race clutch?? > To: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com > > > > > > Hey JR, > We are working on a Peerless GT vintage race car.(TR3 powered) Looking for > performance clutch. any suggestions? > jim > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dave at microworks.net From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 17 09:39:29 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 10:39:29 -0600 Subject: [Fot] FW: tr3 race clutch?? In-Reply-To: <4BA101F4.7020204@microworks.net> References: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4BA101F4.7020204@microworks.net> Message-ID: <4BA105C1.5050503@bradakis.com> David W. Riddle wrote: > Look down at the bottom of the email. > > Click on the link to the Archives > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Select "fot" from the Names column - not Date or Thread from the > Current Index column If you do select 'Date' or 'Thread' from the archive page, you should still get a search box right up under the heading. Interesting. If I select 'Date' I get commercial Google ads under the search box and above the listings. Those are the kind that pay me a few cents when people click on them. If I go to the 'Thread' listing, I get a non-paying public service ad. I recently made some changes, I guess it is taking Google a while to get everything updated on their end. mjb. From igofaster at att.net Wed Mar 17 10:35:22 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 10:35:22 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> eBay item 140391785085.... some people should never TOUCH a triumph Bobby Whitehad From rjl6n at cstone.net Wed Mar 17 10:47:58 2010 From: rjl6n at cstone.net (rjl6n at cstone.net) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 13:47:58 -0400 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <726f2de542a079fa64e723d559b639d7.squirrel@webmail.ntelos.net> That just might be the definition of "fugly" John On Wed, March 17, 2010 1:35 pm, Bobby Whitehead wrote: > eBay item 140391785085.... > > some people should never TOUCH a triumph > > > Bobby Whitehad > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rjl at gt-classics.com From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 17 10:59:56 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 11:59:56 -0600 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> That's the same car I pointed out a couple of weeks ago. Nobody wanted it then, wonder if it might sell this time. mjb. From emanteno at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 11:13:33 2010 From: emanteno at gmail.com (Irv Korey) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 13:13:33 -0500 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <354a1781003171113g2ab1a7d2mad42268a18703ad3@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, Mar 17, 2010 at 12:59 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > That's the same car I pointed out a couple of weeks ago. > Nobody wanted it then, wonder if it might sell this time. > There's no reserve on it now. Maybe someone will buy it and put it out of its misery. Irv From bownes at seiri.com Wed Mar 17 11:17:46 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 14:17:46 -0400 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> Message-ID: Maybe we can raise a fund to have it crushed. On Wed, Mar 17, 2010 at 1:59 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > That's the same car I pointed out a couple of weeks ago. > Nobody wanted it then, wonder if it might sell this time. > > mjb. > > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 17 11:19:00 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 12:19:00 -0600 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <354a1781003171113g2ab1a7d2mad42268a18703ad3@mail.gmail.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> <354a1781003171113g2ab1a7d2mad42268a18703ad3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4BA11D14.6000209@bradakis.com> Irv Korey wrote: > > > There's no reserve on it now. Maybe someone will buy it and put it out > of its misery. > Yep. $500 seems about right. Actually, once that hideous top is removed it might be a nice looking car. And as mentioned before, it looks like someone did a good job in relocating the hood bulge. mjb. From bownes at seiri.com Wed Mar 17 11:28:41 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 14:28:41 -0400 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <4BA11D14.6000209@bradakis.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> <354a1781003171113g2ab1a7d2mad42268a18703ad3@mail.gmail.com> <4BA11D14.6000209@bradakis.com> Message-ID: 24 hours of lemons! On Wed, Mar 17, 2010 at 2:19 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > Irv Korey wrote: > >> >> >> There's no reserve on it now. Maybe someone will buy it and put it out of >> its misery. >> >> > Yep. $500 seems about right. Actually, once that hideous top is removed > it might be a nice looking car. And as mentioned before, it looks like > someone > did a good job in relocating the hood bulge. > > mjb. > > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Wed Mar 17 12:03:26 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 14:03:26 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR transmission bushing I.D. and O.D. Message-ID: Friends, Are there specs for the I.D. and O.D. for the big TR transmissions? I've rebuilt a bunch of them over the years and occasionally I have trouble with a tranny that doesn't like downshifting into second gear. I think that the gear is hanging up on the O.D. of the bush and the bushing and gear start spinning on the mainshaft, screwing up the speed matching of the synchros. I build them with the bush tight enough that it should not spin on the mainshaft as long as the gear is spinning freely on the bush. I suspect bad repro bushes. Does anyone have an opinion or other experiences? Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 From adcronin at ameritech.net Wed Mar 17 13:15:41 2010 From: adcronin at ameritech.net (A Daniel Cronin) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 13:15:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Tabcon1 Photobucket Picture sequence---RATCO Frame Message-ID: <250880.58152.qm@web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> 3/17 Lists The site above was pointed out by Bob Adams a day or so ago in an email about Restomods. ( http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/y77/Tabcon1/ ) and contained photos of a very nice upgrade of the TR four cylinder motor---along with four frames showing RATCO's newly manufactured frame for this TR4 "restomod". I noticed that a couple of the photos had a red cross bar spanning the rear shock mounting brackets and since I also have one of Tony's (RATCO) new frames for my "restomod TR2 project" I inquired about this unfamiliar connector link. Here is the story: RATCO also makes tube shock conversion kits for TR2/3b's and rear sway bar kits. When the k as installed on some original frame vehicles there were isolated incidents of the shock brackets breaking at the frame joint, so RATCO set out to rectify the problem or stop selling the kits for original framed cars (no problems with the new frames as they are much stronger). I will quote from Tony's response as follows; "The rotation force of the lever shock on a stock frame is longitudinal and the rotation of the tube shock conversion on the bracket/frame is transverse. That places a different set of forces on the frame rails which in any case, connects the shock system to the structural base. The new tube shock mounts also have a longer are and hence a greater rotational torque. In old frames, if the weld between the shock bracket and frame has lost some structural integrity, then the chance of a break is possible. The red cross bar in the photos on Tabcon1's site was designed to transfer some of the shock pulse to the other side of the frame. The forces in the tube conversion rotate around the longitudinal axis so this brace transfers force to the opposite side during a pulse to any one side. When a simultaneous shock is hit, the effect is nilled by the brace which then takes the full force of the pulse. This "fix" will not help however if an original frame is structurally unsound." I am passing this information along in case anyone out there had preformed the tube shock and or rear sway bar upgrades on an original frame TR and is looking for a bit of "insurance" is unsure of their frames true condition. NFI Regards, Dan Cronin From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Wed Mar 17 13:33:49 2010 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 16:33:49 -0400 Subject: [Fot] FW: tr3 race clutch?? In-Reply-To: <4BA105C1.5050503@bradakis.com> References: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com>, , <4BA101F4.7020204@microworks.net>, <4BA105C1.5050503@bradakis.com> Message-ID: > If you do select 'Date' or 'Thread' from the archive page, you should still > get a search box right up under the heading. Now I see it. Thanks! John From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Wed Mar 17 18:16:03 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 20:16:03 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR transmission bushing I.D. and O.D. References: Message-ID: <5F59B0FA8CFF4D4EB1AFFF12763A0E2E@latitudefb1e41> Thanks to Bob Lang, Randall and Dean Tetterton for their input. I got home tonight and finished tearing the gearbox down. What I though looked like a nice set of gears had 2 problems. The bronze top hat bushing was broken (answering the question why it didn't want to shift down) and the forward countershaft busing was galling the countershaft. This is particularly "galling" to me since I spent time making sure the bearing all rolled, cleaning out the rollers and WD40 them until they rolled freely. The advice I got included the fact the TRF bronze top hats are too tight and need to be opened up. Mine was from TRF. Other advice was that the mainshaft gets galled from metal particles rubbing between the bushings and mainshaft. This happens when gearboxes fail, like failing galled countereshafts. Although I remember cleaning and polishing the shaft, it doesn't look perfect anymore. This would indicate that the bushings were not freely spinning on the shaft. The gears all spin on the bushings. Lesson learned. I didn't think the bushings needed much clearance when placed on the shaft. I made them just loose enough to push them on. I don't know if this cause the top hat failure or it was just one of those things, but I think a careful rebuild will fix it. Thanks Bob, Dean amd Randall. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kramer, Robert" To: "FOT" Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2010 2:03 PM Subject: [Fot] TR transmission bushing I.D. and O.D. > Friends, > > Are there specs for the I.D. and O.D. for the big TR transmissions? I've > rebuilt a bunch of them over the years and occasionally I have trouble > with a > tranny that doesn't like downshifting into second gear. I think that the > gear > is hanging up on the O.D. of the bush and the bushing and gear start > spinning > on the mainshaft, screwing up the speed matching of the synchros. I build > them > with the bush tight enough that it should not spin on the mainshaft as > long as > the gear is spinning freely on the bush. I suspect bad repro bushes. Does > anyone have an opinion or other experiences? > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From vintage.racer at comcast.net Wed Mar 17 18:25:18 2010 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 18:25:18 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Great British Film Message-ID: <000001cac639$dfc22a80$9f467f80$@racer@comcast.net> Yes, the subject is MG but this is a great period company film. Classic commentary and music and wonderful footage inside the Abington factory. Gary http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=81695 From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 17 20:36:51 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 21:36:51 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR transmission bushing I.D. and O.D. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4BA19FD3.1060704@bradakis.com> Kramer, Robert wrote > I've > rebuilt a bunch of them over the years and occasionally I have trouble with a > tranny that doesn't like downshifting into second gear. > Is the polished, conical synchro grabbing face of the gear actually polished and at the proper angle? mjb. From tony at tonydrews.com Sat Mar 20 00:22:27 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 02:22:27 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) Message-ID: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews From dmitchel at sbcglobal.net Sat Mar 20 04:43:36 2010 From: dmitchel at sbcglobal.net (Doug Mitchell) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 07:43:36 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <006301cac822$94141db0$bc3c5910$@net> Funny you should send this link. In a past life, I flew gliders while I was stationed in the UK. I watched it the other day and it reminded me of the great time I had. If you watch it to the end, the same guy has a link to his 'MakerBot' additive manufacturing machine. This is also neat, and brings me to my current day job making AM parts. The MakerBot is a home assembled AM machine that you can link to your computer and make just about anything you can design in CAD. Or you can download parts from Thingiverse. www.makerbot.com and www.thingiverse.com. Doug -- Doug Mitchell dmitchel at sbcglobal.net -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Tony Drews Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 3:22 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dmitchel at sbcglobal.net From ehusmann53 at yahoo.com Sat Mar 20 05:01:04 2010 From: ehusmann53 at yahoo.com (Ernest Husmann) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 05:01:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <171635.23434.qm@web57613.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Wow, how do I get a ticket on that plane? --- On Sat, 3/20/10, Tony Drews wrote: From: Tony Drews Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) To: fot at autox.team.net Date: Saturday, March 20, 2010, 2:22 AM I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ehusmann53 at yahoo.com From n197tr4 at cs.com Sat Mar 20 07:26:42 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 10:26:42 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <8CC96507EF2920C-91C-DB2E@webmail-m049.sysops.aol.com> The high banks and bluffs of the Missippi River between Lansing and Prairie Du Chien provide some entertainment for low level flying. Landing at Meigs (former) Field while looking up at the Sears (former) Building provides a little of the same sensation for small town Iowa Boys. Especially when the tower control frequency dropped out and there was a scramble to get clearance on ground control. 'WHAT'S YOUR POSITION 32 ALPHA?" "DOWNWIND TO 18" "CLEARED TO LAND!!!!" 1960s radios were not all that reliable. >From a Louisiana Bayou...... -----Original Message----- From: Tony Drews To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Sat, Mar 20, 2010 2:22 am Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com = From tarch at bellsouth.net Sat Mar 20 08:58:26 2010 From: tarch at bellsouth.net (Richard Taylor) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 11:58:26 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <8CC96507EF2920C-91C-DB2E@webmail-m049.sysops.aol.com> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> <8CC96507EF2920C-91C-DB2E@webmail-m049.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <000801cac846$2d5f32c0$881d9840$@net> Wow! That's as far removed to glider flying in the South as it gets! Soaring, down here, is a miserly endeavor. Every moment is spent salvaging altitude and caging airspeeds....kind like driving an over-weight, underpowered TR-4 where momentum is everything. Richard -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of n197tr4 at cs.com Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 10:27 AM To: tony at tonydrews.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) The high banks and bluffs of the Missippi River between Lansing and Prairie Du Chien provide some entertainment for low level flying. Landing at Meigs (former) Field while looking up at the Sears (former) Building provides a little of the same sensation for small town Iowa Boys. Especially when the tower control frequency dropped out and there was a scramble to get clearance on ground control. 'WHAT'S YOUR POSITION 32 ALPHA?" "DOWNWIND TO 18" "CLEARED TO LAND!!!!" 1960s radios were not all that reliable. >From a Louisiana Bayou...... -----Original Message----- From: Tony Drews To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Sat, Mar 20, 2010 2:22 am Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com = _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tarch at bellsouth.net From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Sat Mar 20 19:34:04 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:34:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Message-ID: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl From budscars at comcast.net Sat Mar 20 20:01:31 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 20:01:31 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <184B4D18B4E048B59FD00BC7C2DEC93B@Bud> Woooohoo!....Good Job Guys....Go Baby go!!..Thanks for sending!..terrific stuff...including the Happy Dog running back and forth and the cute little kid slowly moving closer and closer to the excitement! God Bless! Racer Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Mehl" To: "Triumph Friends of" Cc: "Mike Mehl" Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:34 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of > my > race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor > issues > that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the > link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water > leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is > leaking > and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the > bolts) > and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it > around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. > > I am pretty > excited!! > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > > Mike Mehl > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From mark at bradakis.com Sat Mar 20 21:28:40 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 22:28:40 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4BA5A078.7040501@bradakis.com> Nice!! mjb. From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sat Mar 20 21:44:59 2010 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 21:44:59 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1384B905A5AA4AF98F812C8AE96D67CE@desktop> Good work Mike, see ya soon at the track! Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Mehl" To: "Triumph Friends of" Cc: "Mike Mehl" Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:34 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of > my > race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor > issues > that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the > link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water > leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is > leaking > and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the > bolts) > and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it > around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. > > I am pretty > excited!! > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > > Mike Mehl > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/charly at mitchelplumbing.com From tony at tonydrews.com Sat Mar 20 22:40:41 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 00:40:41 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20100321064020.6485D187653@autox.team.net> Mike, Congratulations! It's been a long time coming! I have one concern, however. I think your trunk support may not be substantial enough. :) - Tony Drews At 09:34 PM 3/20/2010, Mike Mehl wrote: >Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my >race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues >that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the >link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water >leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking >and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) >and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it >around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. > >I am pretty >excited!! > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > >Mike Mehl From BillDentin at aol.com Sun Mar 21 06:55:50 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 09:55:50 EDT Subject: [Fot] Triumph TR5 (WASP) Prototypes... Message-ID: <74d4e.4fbaa6a8.38d77f66@aol.com> Amici... The current issue of Triumph World magazine has a letter from a guy named Mike Geddes over in England, who is in the process of restoring X753, one of the TR5 (Wasp) prototypes. He describes the car as an engine test bed, with a prototype chassis set up and several factory body mods. He considers the car's history to be particularly interesting because it spent some time in the USA. We didn't see many TR5s over here because of emissions issues. He suspects this one may have been used over here for emissions testing. He is looking to make contact with anyone who might have information about the car. I never heard of this prototype. Kas? Incidentally, in the same issue, Paul Richardson has a great article about the late Peter Cox. Coxy was a guy I never met, but I sure felt I knew him, and he sure was the source of genuine Triumph competition parts for many, many years. Bill Dentinger From kaskas at cox.net Sun Mar 21 08:25:40 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 8:25:40 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Triumph TR5 (WASP) Prototypes... In-Reply-To: <74d4e.4fbaa6a8.38d77f66@aol.com> Message-ID: <20100321112540.USJAL.156191.imail@fed1rmwml43> I have been asked about this TR-5 car before. I knew nothing of it. I suppose it was in Michigan for the emission testing. It failed I presume and is why the TR-6 had twin carbs instead. If this is the same Peter Cox thatt worked in the Competition Department at the factory I did know him and furnished him camshafts at one time. ---- BillDentin at aol.com wrote: ============= Amici... The current issue of Triumph World magazine has a letter from a guy named Mike Geddes over in England, who is in the process of restoring X753, one of the TR5 (Wasp) prototypes. He describes the car as an engine test bed, with a prototype chassis set up and several factory body mods. He considers the car's history to be particularly interesting because it spent some time in the USA. We didn't see many TR5s over here because of emissions issues. He suspects this one may have been used over here for emissions testing. He is looking to make contact with anyone who might have information about the car. I never heard of this prototype. Kas? Incidentally, in the same issue, Paul Richardson has a great article about the late Peter Cox. Coxy was a guy I never met, but I sure felt I knew him, and he sure was the source of genuine Triumph competition parts for many, many years. Bill Dentinger _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From jhassall at blacksburg.net Sun Mar 21 08:42:45 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 11:42:45 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <4BA63E75.4000404@blacksburg.net> On 3/20/2010 3:22 AM, Tony Drews wrote: > I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot > background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video > that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. > http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm > > - Tony Drews Kewl. When I had about 200 hours SEL I decided to get a glider rating, so I showed up at the airport carrying my usual accouterment of pilot gear, including my headsets. Not one of the glider guys laughed at me (at least not while I was looking). I was absolutely blown away by how quiet the flights were - you could actually hear changes in the air! But then we didn't have "tunes" playing, either. I guess out west you can get away with flying as low as the video guy did. Here in the east there's too much radar coverage to allow that sort of stunt w/o a visit from the FAA. Tnx for sharing it Tony. jim -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Sun Mar 21 09:18:57 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 11:18:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumph TR5 (WASP) Prototypes... References: <20100321112540.USJAL.156191.imail@fed1rmwml43> Message-ID: <8B18A6AB55C7469C81CBED7A89A939D1@latitudefb1e41> There is a guy nearby to austin that has a WASP TR4 with a 6 cylinder engine. I've seen the number tag on the keys that says WASP. He says it was the TR250 Emmission test car. It is available for sale as an uncompleted restoration if anyone is interested. He has always thought it was worth a lot more than it is. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kas Kastner" To: ; Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 10:25 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumph TR5 (WASP) Prototypes... >I have been asked about this TR-5 car before. I knew nothing of it. I >suppose it was in Michigan for the emission testing. It failed I presume >and is why the TR-6 had twin carbs instead. If this is the same Peter Cox >thatt worked in the Competition Department at the factory I did know him >and furnished him camshafts at one time. > ---- BillDentin at aol.com wrote: > > ============= > Amici... > > The current issue of Triumph World magazine has a letter from a guy named > Mike Geddes over in England, who is in the process of restoring X753, one > of > the TR5 (Wasp) prototypes. He describes the car as an engine test bed, > with > a prototype chassis set up and several factory body mods. He considers > the > car's history to be particularly interesting because it spent some time in > the USA. We didn't see many TR5s over here because of emissions issues. > He > suspects this one may have been used over here for emissions testing. He > is looking to make contact with anyone who might have information about > the > car. I never heard of this prototype. Kas? > > Incidentally, in the same issue, Paul Richardson has a great article about > the late Peter Cox. Coxy was a guy I never met, but I sure felt I knew > him, > and he sure was the source of genuine Triumph competition parts for many, > many years. > > Bill Dentinger > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net > > > > -- > Never be beaten by equipment > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From adams910 at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 09:22:10 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 12:22:10 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <4BA63E75.4000404@blacksburg.net> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> <4BA63E75.4000404@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: <673993c51003210922r613b9c2fuc375f0828029f15c@mail.gmail.com> You guys might appreciate this then, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttz5oPpF1Js From m-syork at comcast.net Sun Mar 21 10:07:47 2010 From: m-syork at comcast.net (Mark York) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 10:07:47 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000001cac919$0877e140$d1ab1218@markv8zno7deim> Mike Glad to have another Triumph in the Northwest, we really have a great group of guys. I look forward to seeing you; let me know if I can help in any way. Mark York TR3A #:14 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mike Mehl Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:34 PM To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/m-syork at comcast.net From timmurph at fastbytes.com Sun Mar 21 12:33:59 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 14:33:59 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002501cac92d$7556bb10$60043130$@com> Congratulations, Mike! I know the sweet feeling of starting it up for the first time after a lot of work. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mike Mehl Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 9:34 PM To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Sun Mar 21 12:42:48 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 12:42:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. Mike ________________________________ From: Mike Mehl To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From billb at bnj.com Sun Mar 21 12:50:30 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 09:50:30 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: It sounded like the pump. You might try a little belt dressing and see if it quits, or change the tension. To be sure it isn't coming from the motor remove the belt and see if it's still there. On Mar 21, 2010, at 9:42 AM, Mike Mehl wrote: > Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is > the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump > pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if > I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak > with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing > but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new > also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it > squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. > Mike > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Mike Mehl > > To: Triumph Friends of > Cc: Mike > Mehl > Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM > Subject: [Fot] > Started the TR4 today!!! > > Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button > today with the help of my > race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. > We had a few minor issues > that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help > solve. I am attaching the > link to the you tube video my son shot. I have > some small isuses. Water > leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of > the valve cover is leaking > and the new water pump is squealing (could be the > pulley rubbing on the bolts) > and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the > end of the day i drove it > around the block. You can hear the water pump in > the video. > > I am pretty > excited!! > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > > Mike Mehl > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Sun Mar 21 12:53:23 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 12:53:23 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Sounds like you must use the process of elimination to determine the source of the squeaking. First, get a piece of tubing about 24" long and at least 1/2 ID and use it as a listening device. Have your assistant work the throttle and listen to the areas you suspect as if you are a Doctor with a stethascope. It may help you pinpoint the location. I suppose the belt could squeak if the belt tension is too loose or if it is lubricated in some way. You could put a little belt dressing on the belt to eliminate any slippage and make sure it's tight. If you think it's the water pump, you may want to try a different one. I know it's a pain to drain the water but it's not too tough to change. I do not run an alternator on my TR3. You could use a shorter belt and bypass the alternator to see if it still squeaks. ~Steve On Mar 21, 2010, at 12:42 PM, Mike Mehl wrote: Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. Mike ________________________________ From: Mike Mehl To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Sun Mar 21 13:50:50 2010 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 16:50:50 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>, <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: > pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if > I could get it to squeak. No luck. Running the water pump with a drill would not put side loads on it like running it with a belt would, and might not cause it to squeak like it would when run by a belt. John From budscars at comcast.net Sun Mar 21 14:49:08 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 14:49:08 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>, <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <354E17843ADE4175A683BEF4012AE57E@Bud> problem may just be a new tight belt...OLD FASHIONED TEST...start the car...take a hard stick grease...touch it gently to the inside of the belt for about 5 seconds(be careful of course)...see if the sound changes/goes away.. Racer Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Herrera" To: ; "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 1:50 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! >> pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see > if >> I could get it to squeak. No luck. > > > > Running the water pump with a drill would not put side loads on it like > running it with a belt would, and might not cause it to squeak like it > would > when run by a belt. > > > > John > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From jmwagner at greenheart.com Sun Mar 21 15:05:41 2010 From: jmwagner at greenheart.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 15:05:41 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <354E17843ADE4175A683BEF4012AE57E@Bud> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>, <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <354E17843ADE4175A683BEF4012AE57E@Bud> Message-ID: <4BA69835.1000406@greenheart.com> I find spraying or squirting a little belt dressing on the belt and seeing if that causes the sound to change works well... though the stuff does tend to fly off onto the paint, etc. --Justin RACER BUD wrote: > problem may just be a new tight belt...OLD FASHIONED TEST...start the > car...take a hard stick grease...touch it gently to the inside of the > belt for about 5 seconds(be careful of course)...see if the sound > changes/goes away.. > Racer Bud > ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Herrera" > > To: ; "Friends of Triumph" > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 1:50 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > > >>> pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill >>> to see >> >> if >> >>> I could get it to squeak. No luck. >> >> >> >> >> Running the water pump with a drill would not put side loads on it like >> running it with a belt would, and might not cause it to squeak like >> it would >> when run by a belt. >> >> >> >> John >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net > > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jmwagner at greenheart.com From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Sun Mar 21 19:33:41 2010 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 19:33:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <292451.31285.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Mike: Are you running a cogged belt? I have found these to squeak more often then non-cogged belts. Try an old style solid belt if you are using a cogged one. Just my two cents worth. -Ed- --- On Sun, 3/21/10, Mike Mehl wrote: From: Mike Mehl Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! To: "Triumph Friends of" Date: Sunday, March 21, 2010, 2:42 PM Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. Mike ________________________________ From: Mike Mehl To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Sun Mar 21 22:17:13 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 22:17:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <03ca01cac97e$ef3ac970$0301a8c0@randall> > Any thoughts??? Just because no one else mentioned it : check to be sure that the belt isn't riding against the bottom of any of the pulleys. If it is, you'll need a wider (or unworn) belt; or a narrower (or unworn) pulley. If the paint is polished off the bottom of the groove, the belt is hitting it. Randall From lang at isis.mit.edu Mon Mar 22 07:52:40 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 10:52:40 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] TR4 First Start VidZ Message-ID: Hi, Congrats on the first start on your TR4. There really is nothing quite like that initial euphoria/surprise/joy/relief when all those hours start to pay off. When I was watching the RAW vid, two things really jumped out at me: 1. there's a new, budding Triumph fan in the form of a younger child walking toward the car in the background, obviously trying to figure out what's going on. How kool is that! 2. I think the dog barking and running back and forth was kind of fun... sort of like watching sheepdogs herding sheep. Not sure why, but it struck me funny. I think I was thinking about herding cats at the time. Which would be sort of true for Triumph people. Good luck with your race car!!! It sounds awesome. rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From cwnfot at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 07:56:20 2010 From: cwnfot at gmail.com (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 10:56:20 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! - squeak In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <009501cac9cf$d693bca0$83bb35e0$@com> Does the engine still have the squeak if the belt is removed? We had a squeak in a MGTD engine, turns out the front cam bearing was improperly made/sized and tight on the cam. It stuck to the cam and rotated in the block, ultimately a disaster! Clark Clark W. Nicholls 1972 Stag 1974 Spitfire (and 1 rusty GT6 needing restoration) "Reality, it's not what you think." From triosan at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 10:25:54 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 10:25:54 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From triosan at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 10:35:09 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 10:35:09 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it just got worse, so I only got one long session in. So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out if it helps until race day. OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! Thanks, Chuck -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From tr4racing at googlemail.com Mon Mar 22 10:39:35 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 18:39:35 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> I would try to remove the rev limiter first and then test. They might go bad after years. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 18:35 An: Friends; Triumph; TR list Betreff: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it just got worse, so I only got one long session in. So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out if it helps until race day. OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! Thanks, Chuck -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 11:05:36 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 08:05:36 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <452A731C-C017-4664-B744-57EECE0CEC4B@bnj.com> Are you running an alternator? I've found electronic ignition is sometimes unreliable on a battery-only system. Pertronix used to be unreliable at lower voltages, but they seem to do better now--Tony put a Pertronix back into Peyote when he stuck a small alternator on it. The alternator didn't last, but the Pertronix is working OK. Battery-only systems run at 12.5 volts or lower, when you have an alternator the system is usually at 14 volts. You also should check your wiring gauge and connections. The wiring for most electronic ignition requires a high current capacity wire to the box. It doesn't draw high current constantly, but any excess resistance in this wire will screw things up. In the past I have both crimped and soldered the connectors to the ignition system since any vibrational jitters cause problems. On Mar 22, 2010, at 7:35 AM, Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley wrote: > I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor > [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock > dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car > this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First > two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension > issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over > the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to > 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach > would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is > setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and > found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had > "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it > belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it > just got worse, so I only got one long session in. > > So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the > Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. > What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual > point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out > if it helps until race day. > > OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run > a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! > > Thanks, > > Chuck > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Mon Mar 22 11:47:14 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 13:47:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Chuck, We had talked about getting some 700 lb springs made up. I tightened up my rear swaybar all the way and improved my car a bit but I'd still be interested in a set of springs if somebody is going to get them made. I'm pretty sure Ted Schumacher can do this for us. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:26 PM To: Friends Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com From fasttrs at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 12:00:24 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 12:00:24 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <163293.69843.qm@web46110.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Chuck, I have 2.5 I.d. Coilover springs on mine with spacers. They will fit the rear spring perches just not the front. Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 12:25 PM, "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" wrote: Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From fasttrs at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 12:05:52 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 12:05:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice Message-ID: <50003.91023.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> How are your Egts when it is cutting out on you? Are you sure you are getting proper fuel delivery for the FI? Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 12:35 PM, "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" wrote: I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it just got worse, so I only got one long session in. So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out if it helps until race day. OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! Thanks, Chuck -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From lang at isis.mit.edu Mon Mar 22 12:29:58 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 15:29:58 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, I'm running 600 pounders (by my calcs... Triumph Tune says slightly less), but they are the Triumph Tune "Sprint" springs. My car squats pretty easily when I tromp on it. Count me in as interested in something stiffer in the rear spring dept. Hmmm. That doesn't sound right, for some reason. :-) But 700 pound springs would be something interesting to try on my autocross TR6. rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lang at isis.mit.edu Mon Mar 22 12:34:12 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 15:34:12 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <163293.69843.qm@web46110.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <163293.69843.qm@web46110.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Mar 2010, Mike Munson wrote: > Chuck, I have 2.5 I.d. Coilover springs on mine with spacers. They will > fit the rear spring perches just not the front. Ah - right. We went down this path before. Thanks for the reminder, Mike! > Mike regards, rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From fasttrs at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 13:33:12 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 13:33:12 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <616142.58250.qm@web46106.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> 900 pounders wow. Those sound like the RR boxcar springs (inners). That I had on my auto cross car. The wire was huge on those springs. I have heard that Toms whole car doesn't weigh much more than that ;-) Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 12:25 PM, "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" wrote: Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Mon Mar 22 15:02:43 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 17:02:43 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <006001caca0b$6681bcf0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> I don't know much about the PI, but I had the same problem a while ago with carbs and it was fuel related. Does the PI have any kind of filter or screen in line? Could it be debris in the fuel system or a partial clog? Are you running braided lines? They can deteriorate inside. Do you run a pressure gauge and if so, what does the presure do? What happens if you switch off the fuel pump (I'm assuming it's electric) for a couple seconds , then switch it back on? A wise man once told me that about half of ignition problems were actually fuel related. Or maybe it was the other way around; I'm getting old and sometimes forget! Either way, check all possibilities. Good luck, Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" To: "Friends" ; "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net>; "TR list" Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:35 PM Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice > I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor > [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock > dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car > this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First > two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension > issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over > the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to > 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach > would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is > setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and > found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had > "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it > belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it > just got worse, so I only got one long session in. > > So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the > Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. > What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual > point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out > if it helps until race day. > > OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run > a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! > > Thanks, > > Chuck > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From n197tr4 at cs.com Mon Mar 22 14:13:34 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 17:13:34 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Race Car Problem Now ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS In-Reply-To: <881240.45638.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <881240.45638.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CC981BAAA61C2A-B94-A574@webmail-d053.sysops.aol.com> ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS JEFF SCHLEMMER MINNESOTA I met Jeff at a BMTA Conference......and subsequently visited his facilities in Minnesota. Recently, I invited him to join us at Heartland Park and he is looking closely at his calendar. He would make a great resource at the track for the FOT....AND EVERYONE. I hope he makes it. Joe A. -----Original Message----- From: michael lunsford To: 6pack at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, Mar 22, 2010 3:11 pm Subject: [6pack] Race Car Problem Chuck, ave you considered whether or not the new dizzy and crane setup calls for a allasted or non ballasted coil. I recently had my dizzy rebuilt by Advanced istributors (NFI) and had him install the pertronix insert installed he was oing the rebuild. The guy (sorry don't racall who but he did a great Job) anted me to be sure that I had the proper coil installed since I told him I ad problems with Pertronix ignitions in the past. My 1970 came with an nballasted ignition setup which he said probably provided too much voltage to he pertronix setup and burnt it out. The symptoms you described are the same s I observed on the old setup that went bad. Good luck. ike Lunsford ______________________________________________ 6pack at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/6pack/n197tr4 at cs.com From kaskas at cox.net Mon Mar 22 14:36:12 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 14:36:12 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Race Car Problem Now ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS In-Reply-To: <8CC981BAAA61C2A-B94-A574@webmail-d053.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <20100322173612.M7URX.175913.imail@fed1rmwml35> That would be cool to have him there. He did the distributor for the GT-6 project that I am writing about to finish up my new book. Looks great and expect it to be a world better that the usual stock unit. Should be going to the dyno in the near future. ---- n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: ============= ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS JEFF SCHLEMMER MINNESOTA I met Jeff at a BMTA Conference......and subsequently visited his facilities in Minnesota. Recently, I invited him to join us at Heartland Park and he is looking closely at his calendar. He would make a great resource at the track for the FOT....AND EVERYONE. I hope he makes it. Joe A. -----Original Message----- From: michael lunsford To: 6pack at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, Mar 22, 2010 3:11 pm Subject: [6pack] Race Car Problem Chuck, ave you considered whether or not the new dizzy and crane setup calls for a allasted or non ballasted coil. I recently had my dizzy rebuilt by Advanced istributors (NFI) and had him install the pertronix insert installed he was oing the rebuild. The guy (sorry don't racall who but he did a great Job) anted me to be sure that I had the proper coil installed since I told him I ad problems with Pertronix ignitions in the past. My 1970 came with an nballasted ignition setup which he said probably provided too much voltage to he pertronix setup and burnt it out. The symptoms you described are the same s I observed on the old setup that went bad. Good luck. ike Lunsford ______________________________________________ 6pack at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/6pack/n197tr4 at cs.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From budscars at comcast.net Mon Mar 22 14:41:13 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 14:41:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Fw: Emailing: Dick Scott, Alfa Message-ID: Hi Gang...what's wrong with this photo?..or...FP was tough in those days! Racer Bud..Spitfire #21 The message is ready to be sent with the following file or link attachments: Dick Scott, Alfa Note: To protect against computer viruses, e-mail programs may prevent sending or receiving certain types of file attachments. Check your e-mail security settings to determine how attachments are handled. [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Dick Scott, Alfa.jpg] From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Mon Mar 22 14:43:46 2010 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (toodamnfunky at comcast.net) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 21:43:46 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <006001caca0b$6681bcf0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <376756342.6580351269294226856.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> When I ran Strombergs I had a similar problem and it turned out to be one of my dashpots was dry and sticking. Jim G ----- Original Message ----- From: "WILLIAM TOBIN" To: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" , "Friends" , "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net>, "TR list" Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 4:02:43 PM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain Subject: Re: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice B B I don't know much about the PI, but I had the same problem a while ago with carbs and it was fuel related. B B Does the PI have any kind of filter or screen in line? Could it be debris in the fuel system or a partial clog? B B Are you running braided lines? B They can deteriorate inside. Do you run a pressure gauge and if so, what does the presure do? What happens if you switch off the fuel pump (I'm assuming it's electric) for a couple seconds , then switch it back on? B B A wise man once told me that about half of ignition problems were actually fuel related. Or maybe it was the other way around; I'm getting old and sometimes forget! Either way, check all possibilities. B B Good luck, Bill----- Original Message ----- B B From: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" B B To: "Friends" ; "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net>; "TR list" B B Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:35 PM B B Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice B B > I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. B It has a Pertronix distributor B B > [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock B B > dizzy]. B I also have a Crane ignition. B First time out with the car B B > this year. B Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. B First B B > two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension B B > issues, but worked those out]. B The third session was longer, and over B B > the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to B B > 5500 RPM. B It did not do this always, but most of the time. B The tach B B > would swing wildly. B It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is B B > setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. B I did some investigating and B B > found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had B B > "walked" to quite far advanced. B I though putting it back to where it B B > belonged would fix the issue. B IT did not. B At the Sunday event it B B > just got worse, so I only got one long session in. B B > B B > So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the B B > Crane. B I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. B B > What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? B I do have a dual B B > point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out B B > if it helps until race day. B B > B B > OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run B B > a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! B B > B B > Thanks, B B > B B > Chuck B B > B B > -- B B > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley B B > B B > _______________________________________________ B B > fot at autox.team.net B B > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html B B > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive B B > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums B B > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/toodamnfunky at comcast.net From billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 15:02:22 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 12:02:22 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <006001caca0b$6681bcf0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> <006001caca0b$6681bcf0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: Definitely the other way around. Most fuel problem wind up to be ignition. I once worked for a mechanic who kept track of the troubleshooting he did, literally wrote it down in a notebook. Wore lab coats to work--pressed--pain in the ass guy, but I learned a few things from him. He showed me once that the huge majority of the problems with a misfire he worked on were caused by ignition. On Mar 22, 2010, at 12:02 PM, WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: > I don't know much about the PI, but I had the same problem a while ago > with carbs and it was fuel related. > Does the PI have any kind of filter or screen in line? Could it be debris > in the fuel system or a partial clog? > Are you running braided lines? They can deteriorate inside. Do you run a > pressure gauge and if so, what does the presure do? What happens if you > switch off the fuel pump (I'm assuming it's electric) for a couple seconds , > then switch it back on? > A wise man once told me that about half of ignition problems were actually > fuel related. Or maybe it was the other way around; I'm getting old and > sometimes forget! Either way, check all possibilities. > Good luck, Bill----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" > To: "Friends" ; "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net>; "TR > list" > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:35 PM > Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice From tr4racing at googlemail.com Mon Mar 22 16:10:34 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 00:10:34 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> I belive in soft main springs and hard swaybars. My car is using the stock springs with a little rubber uprate at front and stock leafs at rear. Swaybars at front and rear balance the car. At the moment I'm working at making the swaybars stiffer than they was last year. Less bodyroll. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Kramer, Robert Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 19:47 An: Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley; Friends Betreff: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Chuck, We had talked about getting some 700 lb springs made up. I tightened up my rear swaybar all the way and improved my car a bit but I'd still be interested in a set of springs if somebody is going to get them made. I'm pretty sure Ted Schumacher can do this for us. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:26 PM To: Friends Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From Billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 16:39:05 2010 From: Billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 13:39:05 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> Message-ID: <9BE2284A-0B98-466F-85D5-E9DE73877B9D@bnj.com> I don't think much of stiff springs either unless you can't get the suspension to work Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 1:10 PM, "MadMarx" wrote: > I belive in soft main springs and hard swaybars. > My car is using the stock springs with a little rubber uprate at > front and > stock leafs at rear. > Swaybars at front and rear balance the car. At the moment I'm > working at > making the swaybars stiffer than they was last year. Less bodyroll. > > Cheers > Chris > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Kramer, Robert > Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 19:47 > An: Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley; Friends > Betreff: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Chuck, > > We had talked about getting some 700 lb springs made up. I tightened > up my > rear swaybar all the way and improved my car a bit but I'd still be > interested > in a set of springs if somebody is going to get them made. I'm > pretty sure > Ted > Schumacher can do this for us. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] > On > Behalf > Of Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:26 PM > To: Friends > Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran > poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy > turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I > would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked > about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN > race on April 10th. > > PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back > asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get > heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From adams910 at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 19:06:56 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 22:06:56 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> Message-ID: <673993c51003221906j5f7cb565ra0be44fb15152ef3@mail.gmail.com> I remember this conversation last time it came around. Keep in mind you spring to the tires. A 9" wide cantilever slick is going to produce a ton more grip than a Hoosier Speedster will ever produce. Just one of many things to keep in mind. Bob From kaskas at cox.net Mon Mar 22 19:07:57 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 19:07:57 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <9BE2284A-0B98-466F-85D5-E9DE73877B9D@bnj.com> Message-ID: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> Well, it might be true for a lot of cars, but the IRS Triumph needs some umph in the rear end. Anything around 600 pounds is a disaster and SLOW. I am talking about the stock suspension not the SCCA version. Like beer, try it you'll like it. ---- Bill Babcock wrote: ============= I don't think much of stiff springs either unless you can't get the suspension to work Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 1:10 PM, "MadMarx" wrote: > I belive in soft main springs and hard swaybars. > My car is using the stock springs with a little rubber uprate at > front and > stock leafs at rear. > Swaybars at front and rear balance the car. At the moment I'm > working at > making the swaybars stiffer than they was last year. Less bodyroll. > > Cheers > Chris > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Kramer, Robert > Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 19:47 > An: Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley; Friends > Betreff: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Chuck, > > We had talked about getting some 700 lb springs made up. I tightened > up my > rear swaybar all the way and improved my car a bit but I'd still be > interested > in a set of springs if somebody is going to get them made. I'm > pretty sure > Ted > Schumacher can do this for us. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] > On > Behalf > Of Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:26 PM > To: Friends > Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran > poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy > turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I > would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked > about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN > race on April 10th. > > PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back > asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get > heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 19:25:11 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 19:25:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Race Car Problem Now ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS In-Reply-To: <8CC981BAAA61C2A-B94-A574@webmail-d053.sysops.aol.com> References: <881240.45638.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <8CC981BAAA61C2A-B94-A574@webmail-d053.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <710421.30346.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> He did my TR4 Distributor. First class job. Mike Mehl ________________________________ From: "n197tr4 at cs.com" To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, March 22, 2010 2:13:34 PM Subject: [Fot] Race Car Problem Now ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS JEFF SCHLEMMER MINNESOTA I met Jeff at a BMTA Conference......and subsequently visited his facilities in Minnesota. Recently, I invited him to join us at Heartland Park and he is looking closely at his calendar. He would make a great resource at the track for the FOT....AND EVERYONE. I hope he makes it. Joe A. -----Original Message----- From: michael lunsford To: 6pack at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, Mar 22, 2010 3:11 pm Subject: [6pack] Race Car Problem Chuck, ave you considered whether or not the new dizzy and crane setup calls for a allasted or non ballasted coil. I recently had my dizzy rebuilt by Advanced istributors (NFI) and had him install the pertronix insert installed he was oing the rebuild. The guy (sorry don't racall who but he did a great Job) anted me to be sure that I had the proper coil installed since I told him I ad problems with Pertronix ignitions in the past. My 1970 came with an nballasted ignition setup which he said probably provided too much voltage to he pertronix setup and burnt it out. The symptoms you described are the same s I observed on the old setup that went bad. Good luck. ike Lunsford ______________________________________________ 6pack at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/6pack/n197tr4 at cs.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From norlinengineering at comcast.net Mon Mar 22 20:50:19 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 20:50:19 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Thunderhill Double National Race Report Message-ID: <2C0A7FA91B9049E0A4D3D355976D3306@TOSHIBALAPTOP> My first (and second) races at Thunderhill were a wonderful experience. I was the only Triumph at the event, but ran into several old Triumph racers and some new ones as well - nomination to follow. There were 6 entries in H Production and I was the slowest. However, by the end of the weekend I was within 7 seconds of the HP lap record and had a very good race long battle with a Fiat X19 and a Toyota Yaris. Finished 5th on Saturday and 4th on Sunday. Not bad considering first time driving the track with a vintage car on DOT tires. The track is so different from my home track at Portland. I couldn't belive the amount of time I spent at full throttle in fourth gear in turns. And then there were the blind corners. Those just take seat time to get the confidence level built up. Virtually no time to relax. The facilities are great with lots of paddock space, hot showers, an on-site mini mart and self serve race fuel at racer friendly prices. Had a great time, met some good folks, learned a lot and have already ordered a few bits to improve the brakes on the Spit. Looking forward to the rest of the season. Jim Norlin From norlinengineering at comcast.net Mon Mar 22 21:01:09 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 21:01:09 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Nomination Message-ID: I'd like to nominate Tim Pettenati as a new member of our distinguished non-organization. I met Tim this weekend at Thunderhill. He's involved with SCCA, HMSA and other race organizations and has recently purchased a Spitfire race car. He's working on preparing it to race in HMSA and ??. If we can get a second, I'll get Tim to fill you in more on his background and his Spitfire. Jim Norlin From billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 21:08:10 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 18:08:10 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Nomination In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1C600482-E2E8-4D16-81AA-AC599EFAB9BA@bnj.com> I'll second, even though I'd normally wait for a spitty driver to pipe up On Mar 22, 2010, at 6:01 PM, Norlin Engineering wrote: > I'd like to nominate Tim Pettenati as a new member of our distinguished > non-organization. > > I met Tim this weekend at Thunderhill. He's involved with SCCA, HMSA and > other race organizations and has recently purchased a Spitfire race car. > He's working on preparing it to race in HMSA and ??. > > If we can get a second, I'll get Tim to fill you in more on his background > and his Spitfire. > > Jim Norlin > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tony at tonydrews.com Mon Mar 22 21:40:55 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 23:40:55 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> Message-ID: <20100323054033.16BB3187652@autox.team.net> I had a problem with cutting out and wildly swinging electric tach that was a loose ignition wire on my ignition switch in the dash. Was a 2 minute fix once I found it. - Tony Drews At 12:39 PM 3/22/2010, MadMarx wrote: >I would try to remove the rev limiter first and then test. They might go bad >after years. > >Cheers >Chris > > >-----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- >Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im >Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley >Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 18:35 >An: Friends; Triumph; TR list >Betreff: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice > >I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor >[the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock >dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car >this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First >two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension >issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over >the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to >5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach >would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is >setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and >found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had >"walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it >belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it >just got worse, so I only got one long session in. > >So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the >Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. >What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual >point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out >if it helps until race day. > >OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run >a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! > >Thanks, > >Chuck > >-- >Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: >http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tony at tonydrews.com From Billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 21:50:32 2010 From: Billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 18:50:32 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> References: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> Message-ID: <48093840-016A-4A8D-857D-F78990A8944C@bnj.com> I'm sure it does. I bet it needs to be locked down so it doesn't move at all. I took one look at the IRS of the TR4 and TR6 and thought "no thanks". Hard to see why they designed it that way. I would point out that I DID say "unless you can't get the suspension to work". I don't have any idea how that monkey motion stock suspension could be made to work. I think the biggest advantage of soft springing is compliance of the car to the track surface--you want the wheels to do their own thing but keep as big a contact patch as possible in the corners and over the rough stuff, and probably be on the edges of the tires down the straights. When I ran a lot of roll/bumps in simulation software for Peyote I found a stiff spring for a given wheel load overcomes the shock damping so the wheel winds up bouncing on rebound. If you increase the damping it moves the bounce to compression and the shock pumps down. With an ideal suspension setup the best spring weight is what is required to hold the fully loaded car off the ground at the required ride height with the suspension more or less centered in it's travel. At least that's the case in software. In the real world, I increased the stiffness of the springing in my Radical to accommodate my fat ass because I was grinding the splitter away and bottoming the rear suspension in some bumps. Lost about four seconds around PIR. FOUR fricking seconds, went from 1:22:yada with the chicane to 1:26:sumpthin. Played with tire pressures, shock tuning, roll bars and got about two seconds back, sort of. sometimes. You know how that goes. Put everything back to stock and got my four seconds back. Went to a lower downforce splitter and dialed most of the wing off, ground off half of the wing wickerbill, and it stopped bottoming and I got another two-three seconds. Wahoo. Went from thirds and fourths to firsts and seconds. Of course guys like Garmey can run you down in a Corvette with suspension from a Conestoga wagon and pass you with his wheels bouncing up and down like superballs. But he's F&$%ing nuts. On Mar 22, 2010, at 4:07 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > Well, it might be true for a lot of cars, but the IRS Triumph needs some umph in the rear end. Anything around 600 pounds is a disaster and SLOW. I am talking about the stock suspension not the SCCA version. Like beer, try it you'll like it. > ---- Bill Babcock wrote: > > ============= > I don't think much of stiff springs either unless you can't get the > suspension to work > > Sent from my iPhone From tpettenati at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 22:23:06 2010 From: tpettenati at yahoo.com (Tim Pettenati) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 22:23:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Nomination In-Reply-To: <1C600482-E2E8-4D16-81AA-AC599EFAB9BA@bnj.com> References: <1C600482-E2E8-4D16-81AA-AC599EFAB9BA@bnj.com> Message-ID: <711899.1492.qm@web180308.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Hi All, Intro - My wife and I have been involved in SCCA racing since the late 80's when I started crewing on a Formula Atlantic, and my wife started working grid. If you've participated to a CSRG or HMSA event in the past several years, I've been working Tech and Black Flag, and my wife Darlyn has been working Grid. In other words - she's the one you love to see, and I'm the one you hope not to see. I don't take it personally - really! Darlyn went through SCCA drivers school last year in a Spec Miata and now has her novice comp license. She'll be driving the Spit, and I'll be the wrench for the time being. Maybe next year will be my turn for drivers school. About the Spitfire - It's a 1964 1147cc and has a competition history back to the early 80's. Ran mostly at Riverside. Supposedly built with help from Lee Mueller, and has Mother Mueller comp parts. It sat in Oceanside for about 17 years before the most recent owner bought it and restored it to a period correct race car. It was back on the track for 4 races in 2009 with VARA and then HMSA Coronado last Sept.. I bought it and towed it home Feb. 2010 from Carlsbad. It currently sports a 2.5" straight-through sidepipe. I know it will need muffled before I can run anywhere in NorCal. Sounds great, but will never pass sound. So it needs just a few minor fixes before it will be track ready again. Regards, Tim Pettenati P.S. - Thanks for the nomination Jim & nice meeting you. ----- Original Message ---- From: Bill Babcock To: Norlin Engineering Cc: FoT Triumph ; tpettenati at yahoo.com Sent: Mon, March 22, 2010 9:08:10 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Nomination I'll second, even though I'd normally wait for a spitty driver to pipe up On Mar 22, 2010, at 6:01 PM, Norlin Engineering wrote: > I'd like to nominate Tim Pettenati as a new member of our distinguished > non-organization. > > I met Tim this weekend at Thunderhill. He's involved with SCCA, HMSA and > other race organizations and has recently purchased a Spitfire race car. > He's working on preparing it to race in HMSA and ??. > > If we can get a second, I'll get Tim to fill you in more on his background > and his Spitfire. > > Jim Norlin > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From kaskas at cox.net Tue Mar 23 08:07:29 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 8:07:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <48093840-016A-4A8D-857D-F78990A8944C@bnj.com> Message-ID: <20100323110729.MVD6A.184394.imail@fed1rmwml30> I have to agree about the design. Why? Why? Why? I can only figure that an upright with an axle that would not fall off and proper control arms top and bottom would have been too many pieces and alignment to put together for a production car while you just throw that big casting on and it's done. They had engineers that were smart enough to gather up the right parts and design a good setup, so cost and production line problems in my opinion are the guilty figures. ---- Bill Babcock wrote: ============= I'm sure it does. I bet it needs to be locked down so it doesn't move at all. I took one look at the IRS of the TR4 and TR6 and thought "no thanks". Hard to see why they designed it that way. I would point out that I DID say "unless you can't get the suspension to work". I don't have any idea how that monkey motion stock suspension could be made to work. I think the biggest advantage of soft springing is compliance of the car to the track surface--you want the wheels to do their own thing but keep as big a contact patch as possible in the corners and over the rough stuff, and probably be on the edges of the tires down the straights. When I ran a lot of roll/bumps in simulation software for Peyote I found a stiff spring for a given wheel load overcomes the shock damping so the wheel winds up bouncing on rebound. If you increase the damping it moves the bounce to compression and the shock pumps down. With an ideal suspension setup the best spring weight is what is required to hold the fully loaded car off the ground at the required ride height with the suspension more or less centered in it's travel. At least that's the case in software. In the real world, I increased the stiffness of the springing in my Radical to accommodate my fat ass because I was grinding the splitter away and bottoming the rear suspension in some bumps. Lost about four seconds around PIR. FOUR fricking seconds, went from 1:22:yada with the chicane to 1:26:sumpthin. Played with tire pressures, shock tuning, roll bars and got about two seconds back, sort of. sometimes. You know how that goes. Put everything back to stock and got my four seconds back. Went to a lower downforce splitter and dialed most of the wing off, ground off half of the wing wickerbill, and it stopped bottoming and I got another two-three seconds. Wahoo. Went from thirds and fourths to firsts and seconds. Of course guys like Garmey can run you down in a Corvette with suspension from a Conestoga wagon and pass you with his wheels bouncing up and down like superballs. But he's F&$%ing nuts. On Mar 22, 2010, at 4:07 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > Well, it might be true for a lot of cars, but the IRS Triumph needs some umph in the rear end. Anything around 600 pounds is a disaster and SLOW. I am talking about the stock suspension not the SCCA version. Like beer, try it you'll like it. > ---- Bill Babcock wrote: > > ============= > I don't think much of stiff springs either unless you can't get the > suspension to work > > Sent from my iPhone -- Never be beaten by equipment From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 09:03:54 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 09:03:54 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003230903u33f40848l430c051bb16f661@mail.gmail.com> Hi Kas, need a translation of "umph". I am assuming you mean a spring stiffer than 600 pounds [as Tom Kreiger indicted]? What Tom told me was that the rear end squats as power is applied in a corner. This causes the front to raise slightly producing under steer. By making the rear very stiff there is no squat and then the car will over steer giving you the ability to steer with the throttle coming out of corners =much faster. Correct? Chuck From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 09:15:21 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 09:15:21 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <4ba8465c.6344f10a.5adf.4eabSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> <4ba8465c.6344f10a.5adf.4eabSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003230915t71256879p34d2a3ff8ab9286c@mail.gmail.com> Now that is the best answer I have heard yet! Cannot check anything out till Saturday. There is one more confounding piece to all of this. I have an Innovate LM1 O2 sensor system. Hooked to it is an LM3 "Auxbox". The Auxbox captures RPM and MAP and the LM1 records it. The green wire from the Crane that go to the Tach also go to the LM3, as does a wire from where the Tach grounds. To allow the system to measure ambient air pressure before starting the car, a twelve volt feed also goes to the LM3. The wiring method is confusing [hot 12V, ground 12V are the first two; next comes the tach feed and it is Ground [-] feed then [+] Tach feed. I wired ththe tach feed backward [reversed the polarity]. I do not know if somehow this threw off a signal to the Crane that has caused damage to it. The problem I have experienced persists even though the LM 3 is now unconnected. On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 9:40 PM, Tony Drews wrote: > I had a problem with cutting out and wildly swinging electric tach that was > a loose ignition wire on my ignition switch in the dash. Was a 2 minute fix > once I found it. > > - Tony Drews From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 23 09:13:41 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 17:13:41 +0100 Subject: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003230903u33f40848l430c051bb16f661@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003230903u33f40848l430c051bb16f661@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <001101cacaa3$cfda7140$6f8f53c0$@com> Oomph? It is a German Gothic Metal band. Didn't know that Kas is metal fan ;-) http://www.youtube.com/user/OOMPHBand -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. Mdrz 2010 17:04 An: Kastner; Friends Betreff: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" Hi Kas, need a translation of "umph". I am assuming you mean a spring stiffer than 600 pounds [as Tom Kreiger indicted]? What Tom told me was that the rear end squats as power is applied in a corner. This causes the front to raise slightly producing under steer. By making the rear very stiff there is no squat and then the car will over steer giving you the ability to steer with the throttle coming out of corners =much faster. Correct? Chuck _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 09:19:16 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 09:19:16 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" In-Reply-To: <001101cacaa3$cfda7140$6f8f53c0$@com> References: <8cbd782d1003230903u33f40848l430c051bb16f661@mail.gmail.com> <001101cacaa3$cfda7140$6f8f53c0$@com> Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003230919ia3850ddic8d356286e7289fe@mail.gmail.com> Gotta think Kas has been into heavy [and hot] metal all his life-- and loves the "music" it produces! As a matter of fact, the current problem with my car is that it is not producing pleasing music! On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 9:13 AM, MadMarx wrote: > Oomph? It is a German Gothic Metal band. > Didn't know that Kas is metal fan ;-) > > http://www.youtube.com/user/OOMPHBand > > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley > Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. Mdrz 2010 17:04 > An: Kastner; Friends > Betreff: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" > > Hi Kas, need a translation of "umph". I am assuming you mean a spring > stiffer than 600 pounds [as Tom Kreiger indicted]? > > What Tom told me was that the rear end squats as power is applied in a > corner. This causes the front to raise slightly producing under > steer. By making the rear very stiff there is no squat and then the > car will over steer giving you the ability to steer with the throttle > coming out of corners =much faster. > > Correct? > > Chuck > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/triosan at gmail.com > > > -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 23 09:21:13 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 17:21:13 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003230915t71256879p34d2a3ff8ab9286c@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> <4ba8465c.6344f10a.5adf.4eabSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> <8cbd782d1003230915t71256879p34d2a3ff8ab9286c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <001201cacaa4$dcdc1aa0$96944fe0$@com> Bill had a good point with the connection of the coil to the system..... I had trouble that at hot my engine didn't start after a stall and had also misfire from time to time. Cause was the resistor at the coil. When the resistor became hot the value rised form 1.6 ohms to 1.9 ohms. The voltage dropped and the engine didn't start. Since then I use a cooled 1.5 ohms resistor that cured all ignition problems with my pertronix. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. Mdrz 2010 17:15 An: Tony Drews; Friends Betreff: Re: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice Now that is the best answer I have heard yet! Cannot check anything out till Saturday. There is one more confounding piece to all of this. I have an Innovate LM1 O2 sensor system. Hooked to it is an LM3 "Auxbox". The Auxbox captures RPM and MAP and the LM1 records it. The green wire from the Crane that go to the Tach also go to the LM3, as does a wire from where the Tach grounds. To allow the system to measure ambient air pressure before starting the car, a twelve volt feed also goes to the LM3. The wiring method is confusing [hot 12V, ground 12V are the first two; next comes the tach feed and it is Ground [-] feed then [+] Tach feed. I wired ththe tach feed backward [reversed the polarity]. I do not know if somehow this threw off a signal to the Crane that has caused damage to it. The problem I have experienced persists even though the LM 3 is now unconnected. On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 9:40 PM, Tony Drews wrote: > I had a problem with cutting out and wildly swinging electric tach that was > a loose ignition wire on my ignition switch in the dash. Was a 2 minute fix > once I found it. > > - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 12:10:50 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 12:10:50 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Recap on Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003231210y3d962a33xdec609b92dfddd48@mail.gmail.com> 1.Racing Triumphs with IRS need really stiff rear springs [700-900 range]. 2. Tom K has not weighed in -- guess he does not read the FOT mail [or do so very often]. 3. Off list if anybody has a phone number for him I would like it. 4. Does anybody have a source for ready made really stiff springs? 5. If not, I would be willing to work with Kramer and Ted S to get some made. [the faster the better -- I now understand that horrible feeling and sound coming out of power corners are my 540 pound rear springs bottoming out and first race is in three weeks! [Guess I could cut down some extra's I have and use spacerr to get proper height. -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From rodkent at cox.net Tue Mar 23 14:13:26 2010 From: rodkent at cox.net (rodkent at cox.net) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 17:13:26 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Recap on Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003231210y3d962a33xdec609b92dfddd48@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20100323171326.HT2U8.199334.imail@fed1rmwml39> Hi, As someone mentioned in an earlier post, coil over springs will work, and the quality will be much better that something a custom spring producer will come up with. The range available is endless. ---- Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley wrote: 1.Racing Triumphs with IRS need really stiff rear springs [700-900 range]. 2. Tom K has not weighed in -- guess he does not read the FOT mail [or do so very often]. 3. Off list if anybody has a phone number for him I would like it. 4. Does anybody have a source for ready made really stiff springs? 5. If not, I would be willing to work with Kramer and Ted S to get some made. [the faster the better -- I now understand that horrible feeling and sound coming out of power corners are my 540 pound rear springs bottoming out and first race is in three weeks! [Guess I could cut down some extra's I have and use spacerr to get proper height. -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rodkent at cox.net From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Tue Mar 23 15:12:57 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 17:12:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Recap on Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs References: <8cbd782d1003231210y3d962a33xdec609b92dfddd48@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20805D58B90C4E90B75F1D8262ADDF00@latitudefb1e41> I was talking to another Tr6 guy today and he pointed out that whatever spring rate we apply to the back of the IRS cars, some of the rate is lost due to the design, The spring is forward of the axle at an angle that changes with suspension movement. He surmised that we need the extra stiffness just to get a higher effective spring rate. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" To: "Friends" Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 2:10 PM Subject: [Fot] Recap on Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > 1.Racing Triumphs with IRS need really stiff rear springs [700-900 range]. > > 2. Tom K has not weighed in -- guess he does not read the FOT mail [or > do so very often]. > > 3. Off list if anybody has a phone number for him I would like it. > > 4. Does anybody have a source for ready made really stiff springs? > > 5. If not, I would be willing to work with Kramer and Ted S to get > some made. [the faster the better -- I now understand that horrible > feeling and sound coming out of power corners are my 540 pound rear > springs bottoming out and first race is in three weeks! [Guess I > could cut down some extra's I have and use spacerr to get proper > height. > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Tue Mar 23 17:32:02 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 20:32:02 -0400 Subject: [Fot] www.racingsportscars.com Message-ID: <4BA95D82.1090806@twcny.rr.com> I apologize if I did not search the archives correctly but I was surprised someone had not turned this site up before. I found races both my parents participated in '59 and '60 with my car. I have some old photos and news clips I'll have to contribute e.g. a front page 4 shot sequence of a lotus coupe rolling over with my dad hot on his tail from a racing rag at Santa Barbra - yes there was contact but the corner worker exonerated my dad (as he told it). As a kid, I remember the dent - I was at the track that day... Fun stuff... M From fasttrs at yahoo.com Tue Mar 23 19:02:18 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 19:02:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Fw: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> References: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> Message-ID: <730172.77519.qm@web46115.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> ----- Forwarded Message ---- From: Mike Munson To: Kas Kastner ; MadMarx ; Bill Babcock Cc: Chuck at autox.team.net; Friends Sent: Tue, March 23, 2010 6:21:29 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs I just did some rough measurements on a trailing arm. Pivot point to tire patch is 22 inches. Pivot point to center of spring perch is 11 inches. Now I am no math genius but that would tell me that effective spring rate is half of the spring rating you are using. BTW Kas, Sam is the only TR6 that I know of that has utilized the SCCA rules to improve the rear suspension. I am still suffering with the (to quote Bill) Monkey Motion stock suspension. Mike ________________________________ From mpendy at dishmail.net Tue Mar 23 20:56:34 2010 From: mpendy at dishmail.net (Mark Pendergrass) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 20:56:34 -0700 Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy Message-ID: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for the first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 gal. of fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive or not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know wonder this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up with.....he's at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) From tony at tonydrews.com Tue Mar 23 22:44:19 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 00:44:19 -0500 Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy In-Reply-To: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> References: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> Message-ID: <20100324064403.3EDCD18765A@autox.team.net> Mark, without driver and with a partially full fuel cell (5 to 10 gallons), my TR-4 is 2150 lbs and Jack's TR-4 was 1950 lbs. I'm not going to comment on weight with driver... :) - Tony Drews At 10:56 PM 3/23/2010, Mark Pendergrass wrote: >FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for the >first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage >folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 gal. of >fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive or >not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know wonder >this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up with.....he's >at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Wed Mar 24 05:23:30 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 07:23:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy References: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> Message-ID: My TR4A weighs in right at 2,000 lbs. less driver. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Pendergrass" To: "friends of triumph" Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 10:56 PM Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy > FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for > the > first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage > folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 > gal. of > fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive > or > not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know > wonder > this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up > with.....he's > at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From sbarr at McCarty-Law.com Wed Mar 24 05:51:03 2010 From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com (Barr, Scott) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 07:51:03 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Transport to NY? Message-ID: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74017023F1@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Is there anyone headed from or across the Midwest to New York with an available spot on a trailer? I'm selling a GT6 body shell and a potential buyer is worried about transportation. Scott B. PS - yes, Joe (C.), this is the same one I dragged back from AZ :-) From timmurph at fastbytes.com Wed Mar 24 10:50:50 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 12:50:50 -0500 Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy In-Reply-To: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> References: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> Message-ID: <000001cacb7a$8c454900$a4cfdb00$@com> When the car was weighed at Gingerman for the VSCDA ERA Correct it was a total or 2120 without driver and about 5 gallons of gas, as I recall. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark Pendergrass Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 10:57 PM To: friends of triumph Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for the first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 gal. of fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive or not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know wonder this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up with.....he's at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From rikrock at aol.com Wed Mar 24 13:56:47 2010 From: rikrock at aol.com (rikrock at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 16:56:47 -0400 Subject: [Fot] TR6 Engine Part Needed Message-ID: <8CC99ABA6E96B06-2F4-2E92@webmail-d011.sysops.aol.com> Amici, I'm looking for a distributor drive shaft (with gear) for a TR6 motor. This is the part that is driven by the gear on the cam and engages the distributor on the top side and the oil pump driveshaft on the bottom. Please let me know if you have one to sell. Thanks! Rich Rock From rblake36 at yahoo.com Wed Mar 24 14:43:42 2010 From: rblake36 at yahoo.com (Robert Blake) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 14:43:42 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <772286.73137.qm@web58501.mail.re3.yahoo.com> I have a 63 that tips the scales at a whopping 1972 lbs. Distribution is 1061 front and 911 rear. Bob Blake Dripping Springs, Texas --- On Wed, 3/24/10, Bob Kramer wrote: From: Bob Kramer Subject: Re: [Fot] am i that heavy To: "Mark Pendergrass" , "friends of triumph" Date: Wednesday, March 24, 2010, 7:23 AM My TR4A weighs in right at 2,000 lbs. less driver. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Pendergrass" To: "friends of triumph" Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 10:56 PM Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy > FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for the > first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage > folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 gal. of > fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive or > not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know wonder > this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up with.....he's > at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rblake36 at yahoo.com From ablake2 at austin.rr.com Wed Mar 24 19:23:08 2010 From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com (Greg & Alison Blake) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 20:23:08 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000101cacbc2$1c68e1d0$6501a8c0@blake1> For what it is worth, you can use the 2.5" coil over type springs (I use AFCO) in the front of a TR3 if you use the aluminum spacer and shave a bit off the OD of spacer to accept the ID of the coil over springs. I have not looked at a TR4 or TR6 front end, but I imagine you could use a similar setup by using a shorter spring and using a modified spacer as I did on the 3. It makes for cheap springs and any rate you could possibly want to use pretty much any length too. Greg -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Robert M. Lang Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 1:34 PM To: Mike Munson Cc: Friends Subject: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs On Mon, 22 Mar 2010, Mike Munson wrote: > Chuck, I have 2.5 I.d. Coilover springs on mine with spacers. They will > fit the rear spring perches just not the front. Ah - right. We went down this path before. Thanks for the reminder, Mike! > Mike regards, rml ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --- _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ablake2 at austin.rr.com From klynch_6 at msn.com Wed Mar 24 20:36:12 2010 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 21:36:12 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Dolomite/Sprint remembered Message-ID: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/classiccars/7399511/Classic-Triumph-Dolom ite-Sprint.html KL From mpendy at dishmail.net Wed Mar 24 20:41:22 2010 From: mpendy at dishmail.net (Mark Pendergrass) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 20:41:22 -0700 Subject: [Fot] AM I THAT HEAVEY Message-ID: Thanks everyone who responded to my inquirery about my cars weight, seems i'am in the ball park, but have some work to do...........Mark Pendy 63TR4 From sbarr at McCarty-Law.com Thu Mar 25 05:26:00 2010 From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com (Barr, Scott) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 07:26:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] FW: Dolomite/Sprint remembered Message-ID: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C7401702421@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Try this link: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/classiccars/7399511/Classic-Triumph- Dolomite-Sprint.html -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of KEVIN LYNCH Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 10:36 PM To: FOT Subject: [Fot] Dolomite/Sprint remembered http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/classiccars/7399511/Classic-Triumph- Dolom ite-Sprint.html Message-ID: Non - Triumph content Joe, can you contact me off line? The Historic Race Group is trying to contact your son about T & S for an upcoming event. thanks mike h. G. Michael Harmuth From tr4racing at googlemail.com Thu Mar 25 07:45:58 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 15:45:58 +0100 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> Hi Greg, You can't prevent the car from transferring weight under braking or acceleration, you only can work on the dive of the suspension during this circumstances. A good thing would be to install an anti-dive system for the braking but this is not easy to create on the TR3/4 front end as the lower wishbone can't be tilted. But besides this the main thing is that the car doesn't bottom out the suspension under braking or acceleration. The main spring ration should cover the maximum bumps on the particular track. The smoother the surface the less hard you can go. On tracks like the Nordschleife with huge bumps you need also lots of travel way of the suspension. I don't have any trouble with the car diving under braking. If the front end is lower at corner entry than getting in the corner is more crisp as the dive induce a little oversteer which makes life easier. When accelerating out of the corner the weight is transferred to the rear axle and the corners outside wheel. That will cause oversteer too but with the front inside wheel slightly touching the ground you have a little understeer too. If the car is well balanced you can achieve a smooth 4 wheel slide out of corners that makes the car quite fast and does save tires too. Have a look on these photos to see how the front wheel is almost touching the ground. http://www.tr4-racing.de/pic/2009/spa/04.0709Spa6Classic010.jpg http://www.tr4-racing.de/pic/2009/rgb-nurburgring/n%FCrburg%20b%20049.jpg http://www.tr4-racing.de/pic/2009/spa/03.07.09Spa7Classic054.jpg Take also in account that a wheel that has only little load can't be steered too far in the corner, so the anti Ackermann is the way to go to leave the inside front wheel more straight as it has less load but should help with steering the car. An unloaded wheel has only a very small slip angle. I'm going to rise the front end grip as high as I can and adjust the rear end to force the car to a little oversteer. Cheers Chris From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Mar 25 08:35:22 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 10:35:22 -0500 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> Message-ID: Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere around 800 lb rate. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of MadMarx Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM To: 'Friends' Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs From billb at bnj.com Thu Mar 25 09:00:07 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 06:00:07 -1000 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> Message-ID: <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's progressively wound. On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The > Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 > inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I > buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere > around 800 lb rate. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of MadMarx > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM > To: 'Friends' > Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tr4racing at googlemail.com Thu Mar 25 09:18:47 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 17:18:47 +0100 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> Message-ID: <001b01cacc36$db54aba0$91fe02e0$@com> The windings does infect the spring rate. The formula is: D = (G * dD^4) / (8 *dF^3 *n) [N/mm] dD = wire diameter [mm] dF = Spring diameter at wire center [mm] n = number of windings G = Modul [N/mm2] (for Springsteel 79500 N/mm2) -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: Bill Babcock [mailto:billb at bnj.com] Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. Mdrz 2010 17:00 An: Kramer, Robert Cc: MadMarx; 'Friends' Betreff: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's progressively wound. On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The > Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 > inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I > buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere > around 800 lb rate. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of MadMarx > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM > To: 'Friends' > Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From spitlist at cox.net Thu Mar 25 09:41:05 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 09:41:05 -0700 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> Message-ID: <5BEB333EECB0426BB0FB562C1F6BA7ED@joepentiumnew> I beg to differ. Think about it this way. If you have a piece of spring steel 20 feet long and extend it between two fixed points and then apply a weight to the center, it will droop a given amount. The cut off a portion of it and move the end points closer together and reapply the same weight. It will sag less. Wind that steel into a coil and you get the same effect. The spring rate of the steel did not change (unless you heat it changing the properties) but the total amount of travel will become less, making the spring stiffer. The same thing happens with leaf springs. Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bill Babcock Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:00 AM To: Kramer, Robert Cc: 'Friends' Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's progressively wound. On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The > Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 > inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I > buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere > around 800 lb rate. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of MadMarx > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM > To: 'Friends' > Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Thu Mar 25 09:41:19 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 09:41:19 -0700 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> Message-ID: <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> > spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring Ah, but it does. Say for example you start with two 400 lb/in springs and stack them together. Apply 400 pounds, and the stack deflects by 2 inches (making it a 200 lb/in stack). Separate the springs and they go from 200 lb/in to 400 lb/in. Randall From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 09:47:30 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 10:47:30 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> Message-ID: <4BAB93A2.7030604@bradakis.com> Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? > http://www.alternativecarparts.com/utilities/coilsprings.html mjb. From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 10:01:03 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> Message-ID: <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com> >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring >> If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and change the coil count, it does get stiffer. mjb. From s.janzen at comcast.net Thu Mar 25 10:45:08 2010 From: s.janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 13:45:08 -0400 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> Message-ID: <3F6726A1-8658-442C-9EC3-64F5C475A810@comcast.net> so an 8" long, 500 lb per inch spring is a different wire size than a 10" long, 500 lb/inch spring, assuming the metallurgy and coil diameter? On Mar 25, 2010, at 12:41 PM, Randall wrote: > spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring Ah, but it does. Say for example you start with two 400 lb/in springs and stack them together. Apply 400 pounds, and the stack deflects by 2 inches (making it a 200 lb/in stack). Separate the springs and they go from 200 lb/in to 400 lb/in. Randall _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/s.janzen at comcast.net From billb at bnj.com Thu Mar 25 10:58:41 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 07:58:41 -1000 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <5BEB333EECB0426BB0FB562C1F6BA7ED@joepentiumnew> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <5BEB333EECB0426BB0FB562C1F6BA7ED@joepentiumnew> Message-ID: Yeah, I wasn't thinking. Coil springs are torsion bars, make them shorter and the rate goes up. On Mar 25, 2010, at 6:41 AM, Joe Curry wrote: > I beg to differ. > > Think about it this way. If you have a piece of spring steel 20 feet long > and extend it between two fixed points and then apply a weight to the > center, it will droop a given amount. The cut off a portion of it and move > the end points closer together and reapply the same weight. It will sag > less. Wind that steel into a coil and you get the same effect. > > The spring rate of the steel did not change (unless you heat it changing the > properties) but the total amount of travel will become less, making the > spring stiffer. > > The same thing happens with leaf springs. > > Joe C. > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On > Behalf Of Bill Babcock > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:00 AM > To: Kramer, Robert > Cc: 'Friends' > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's > progressively > wound. > > On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > >> Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? > The >> Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and > 14 >> inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. > If > I >> buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate > somewhere >> around 800 lb rate. >> >> Bob Kramer >> Sales Manager >> RDO Equipment Company >> 16415 N. IH 35 >> Pflugerville, TX 78660 >> 512-272-4141 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On > Behalf >> Of MadMarx >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM >> To: 'Friends' >> Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 11:00:24 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 12:00:24 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <3F6726A1-8658-442C-9EC3-64F5C475A810@comcast.net> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> <3F6726A1-8658-442C-9EC3-64F5C475A810@comcast.net> Message-ID: <4BABA4B8.1010109@bradakis.com> Scott Janzen wrote: > so an 8" long, 500 lb per inch spring is a different wire size than a > 10" long, 500 lb/inch spring, assuming the metallurgy and coil diameter? > > Maybe, maybe not. You'll notice that in the various forms of the spring rate equations free length is not a factor. The two springs you mention may have the exact same wire diameter and number of coils. In the 10 inch spring the coils would be farther apart than in the 8 inch spring. Free length is not that important. Fitted length and fitted load are what really matter to ride height. mjb. From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Mar 25 11:08:55 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 13:08:55 -0500 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <001b01cacc36$db54aba0$91fe02e0$@com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <001b01cacc36$db54aba0$91fe02e0$@com> Message-ID: So it looks like the ticket is to buy the AFCO 8" 700 lb coil over springs and use a couple of 1/2" spacers to get my 9 " free length back. Then, if that is not enough rear spring, to go to the 10" 700 lb springs and cut them to fit (once I do the math), holding out the even stiffer option of using 12" springs if I need an even stiffer solution. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx [mailto:tr4racing at googlemail.com] Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:19 AM To: 'Bill Babcock'; Kramer, Robert Cc: 'Friends' Subject: AW: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs The windings does infect the spring rate. The formula is: D = (G * dD^4) / (8 *dF^3 *n) [N/mm] dD = wire diameter [mm] dF = Spring diameter at wire center [mm] n = number of windings G = Modul [N/mm2] (for Springsteel 79500 N/mm2) -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: Bill Babcock [mailto:billb at bnj.com] Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. Mdrz 2010 17:00 An: Kramer, Robert Cc: MadMarx; 'Friends' Betreff: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's progressively wound. On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The > Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 > inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I > buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere > around 800 lb rate. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of MadMarx > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM > To: 'Friends' > Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From horizonracing at msn.com Thu Mar 25 11:35:07 2010 From: horizonracing at msn.com (Tony and Annie Garmey) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:35:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com> Message-ID: As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear springs with "Nascar" spring rubbers. Smooth track= use the spring rubber,rough track= put in a softer one or remove it ! :) > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 > From: mark at bradakis.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring > >> > > > If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil > count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and > change the coil count, it does get stiffer. > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracing at msn.com From cofrog at q.com Thu Mar 25 12:13:51 2010 From: cofrog at q.com (Dan Forgey) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 19:13:51 +0000 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, , <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: Anyone know where to source the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? Thanks, Dan Forgey > From: horizonracing at msn.com > To: mark at bradakis.com; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:35:07 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear springs with "Nascar" spring rubbers. Smooth > track= use the spring rubber,rough track= put in a softer one or remove it ! > :) > > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 > > From: mark at bradakis.com > > To: fot at autox.team.net > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > > > >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring > > >> > > > > > > If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil > > count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and > > change the coil count, it does get stiffer. > > > > mjb. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracing at msn.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cofrog at q.com From horizonracing at msn.com Thu Mar 25 12:28:35 2010 From: horizonracing at msn.com (Tony and Annie Garmey) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 12:28:35 -0700 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, , <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, , Message-ID: start with stock car products. From: cofrog at q.com To: horizonracing at msn.com; mark at bradakis.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 19:13:51 +0000 Anyone know where to source the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? Thanks, Dan Forgey > From: horizonracing at msn.com > To: mark at bradakis.com; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:35:07 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear springs with "Nascar" spring rubbers. Smooth > track= use the spring rubber,rough track= put in a softer one or remove it ! > :) > > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 > > From: mark at bradakis.com > > To: fot at autox.team.net > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > > > >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring > > >> > > > > > > If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil > > count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and > > change the coil count, it does get stiffer. > > > > mjb. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracing at msn.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cofrog at q.com From tedtsimx at bright.net Thu Mar 25 13:29:01 2010 From: tedtsimx at bright.net (Ted Schumacher) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 15:29:01 -0500 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <001b01cacc36$db54aba0$91fe02e0$@com> Message-ID: <4BABC78D.4010502@bright.net> Bob and list. We have springs made for us - ran about 2000 pieces in the last 2 years - so we are somewhat conversant with this topic. Our TR6 uprated street springs will increase rate by about 8 psi for every 1/8" cut off. So cutting 1 coil will yield a 64 psi rate increaseon this particular spring. However, we sell springs other than the ones we list for the street cars. We can supply 8", 9" and 10" surface ground end springs in a large variety of rates. $59.95/each. These are 2 1/2" ID springs. Many spring suppliers, such as AFCO, do not make their own springs. Our spring manufacturer holds the tightest tolerances in the industry, +/- 2%. We have rate checked springs that have varied as much as 10%. If we can help, please let us know. Thaks for your time.Ted Kramer, Robert wrote: > So it looks like the ticket is to buy the AFCO 8" 700 lb coil over springs and > use a couple of 1/2" spacers to get my 9 " free length back. Then, if that is > not enough rear spring, to go to the 10" 700 lb springs and cut them to fit > (once I do the math), holding out the even stiffer option of using 12" springs > if I need an even stiffer solution. > > > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx [mailto:tr4racing at googlemail.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:19 AM > To: 'Bill Babcock'; Kramer, Robert > Cc: 'Friends' > Subject: AW: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > The windings does infect the spring rate. > > The formula is: > > D = (G * dD^4) / (8 *dF^3 *n) [N/mm] > > dD = wire diameter [mm] > dF = Spring diameter at wire center [mm] > n = number of windings > G = Modul [N/mm2] (for Springsteel 79500 N/mm2) > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: Bill Babcock [mailto:billb at bnj.com] > Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. Mdrz 2010 17:00 > An: Kramer, Robert > Cc: MadMarx; 'Friends' > Betreff: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's > progressively wound. > > On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > > >> Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? >> > The > >> Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and >> > 14 > >> inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. >> > If I > >> buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate >> > somewhere > >> around 800 lb rate. >> >> Bob Kramer >> Sales Manager >> RDO Equipment Company >> 16415 N. IH 35 >> Pflugerville, TX 78660 >> 512-272-4141 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On >> > Behalf > >> Of MadMarx >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM >> To: 'Friends' >> Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tedtsimx at bright.net > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.437 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2769 - Release Date: 03/25/10 07:33:00 > > -- Ted Schumacher tedtsimx at bright.net http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com 108 S. Jefferson St. Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 From fasttrs at yahoo.com Thu Mar 25 12:49:33 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 12:49:33 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <399716.89446.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Www.springrubber.com Now;...What durometer rating do you get? Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 25, 2010, at 2:13 PM, Dan Forgey wrote: Anyone know where to source the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? Thanks, Dan From adams910 at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 13:21:05 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 16:21:05 -0400 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <399716.89446.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <399716.89446.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <673993c51003251321l2536e2ag214341fee9dc9661@mail.gmail.com> If you want to get real fancy, you can get bump stops with progressive rates. I have two different length/rate bumpstops in the top of my tool box, plus a different set on my Miata. You can also space them out, so they engage at a different point. Bob From fasttrs at yahoo.com Thu Mar 25 13:32:31 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 13:32:31 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <411436.80978.qm@web46102.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I prefer to bump the Miatas without any rubber between me and them. They fly off the track and out of the way faster. Oh wait... Are we talking about the same thing ? :D :D :D Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 25, 2010, at 3:21 PM, Bob Adams wrote: If you want to get real fancy, you can get bump stops with progressive rates. I have two different length/rate bumpstops in the top of my tool box, plus a different set on my Miata. You can also space them out, so they engage at a different point. Bob From lang at isis.mit.edu Thu Mar 25 14:28:25 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 17:28:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] Hard line materials Message-ID: Hi, Seeing that we're all being technical... my AN braided lines for my fuel system are now about 10 years old. I figure I should get a leg up on this - yes, I know the rubber rots over time. I was thinking about replacing a good portion of the flex with hard metal lines instead with just a few short flex lines where it matters. I have fabbed up steel bundy tubed used AN 818/819 steel sleeves and nuts and that seems to work okay. The question is - is there any obvious reason NOT to use aluminum tube and aluminum sleeves / nuts? I was thinking 6061T6 3/8" with .065 thick walls. This is low pressure (less than 3 psi) fuel, not PI or anything like that. I'm just curious. But the aluminum looks nicer than the steel does and it's probably lighter although we're talking ounces of material here, not pounds. regards, rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 14:57:24 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 15:57:24 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Hard line materials In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4BABDC44.8010407@bradakis.com> On the Killer Spit I used blue anodized 3/8 al-u-min-i-um from Summit, I think it was. Pretty easy to make the flares, bends and such. Looks nice and lasts a long time. mjb. From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Thu Mar 25 17:26:00 2010 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (Jim Gray) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 18:26:00 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, ,<093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: I hear those NASCAR spring rubbers act weird in right hand corners jim g -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team .net] On Behalf Of Dan Forgey Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 1:14 PM To: horizonracing at msn.com; mark at bradakis.com; triumph fot Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Anyone know where to source the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? Thanks, Dan Forgey > From: horizonracing at msn.com > To: mark at bradakis.com; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:35:07 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear springs with "Nascar" spring rubbers. Smooth > track= use the spring rubber,rough track= put in a softer one or remove it ! > :) > > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 > > From: mark at bradakis.com > > To: fot at autox.team.net > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > > > >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring > > >> > > > > > > If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil > > count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and > > change the coil count, it does get stiffer. > > > > mjb. > > > > ______________________________ _________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.htm l > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/ options/fot/horizonracing at msn. com > > ______________________________ _________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.htm l > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/ options/fot/cofrog at q.com ______________________________ _________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.htm l Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/ options/fot/toodamnfunky at comca st.net From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 17:30:07 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 18:30:07 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, ,<093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: <4BAC000F.6040506@bradakis.com> Jim Gray wrote: > I hear those NASCAR spring > rubbers act weird in right > hand corners > They work just fine in right handers if you put them in upside down. But then left handers are a bit of a sticky wicket. mjb. From rblake36 at yahoo.com Thu Mar 25 19:25:20 2010 From: rblake36 at yahoo.com (Robert Blake) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 19:25:20 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 Message-ID: <761127.22877.qm@web58502.mail.re3.yahoo.com> FOT I installed a HITEST14088 alternator in place of my original alternator about 5 months ago and it seemed to function although the lead placement was not the same as the original setup. Lately it seems to be spotty and I would like to check the output to determine if I have wiring issues or a grumpy alternator. I have individually cheched readings between the negative terminal of the battery and the three connectors on the alternator and gotten readings between 0.20 and 0.50 volts. These readings seem odd but being electrically challanged I don't trust my technique. Would appreciate suggestions and or internet references. Bob Blake Dripping Springs, TX From timmurph at fastbytes.com Fri Mar 26 08:43:53 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 10:43:53 -0500 Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 In-Reply-To: <761127.22877.qm@web58502.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <761127.22877.qm@web58502.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002901caccfb$2648e710$72dab530$@com> With the engine off the battery voltage should be about 13 volts, ideally 13.2 volts (2.2 volts per cell time 6 cells in the battery). With the engine running and the alternator working the voltage at the battery should be about 14.0 to 14.5 volts. Not sure what your 3 wires are going to but the largest should be carrying the current from the alternator to the battery and this terminal should be the 14.0 to 14.5 when running, same and the battery terminal to which it is connected. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Robert Blake Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:25 PM To: FOT Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 FOT I installed a HITEST14088 alternator in place of my original alternator about 5 months ago and it seemed to function although the lead placement was not the same as the original setup. Lately it seems to be spotty and I would like to check the output to determine if I have wiring issues or a grumpy alternator. I have individually cheched readings between the negative terminal of the battery and the three connectors on the alternator and gotten readings between 0.20 and 0.50 volts. These readings seem odd but being electrically challanged I don't trust my technique. Would appreciate suggestions and or internet references. Bob Blake Dripping Springs, TX _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From ehusmann53 at yahoo.com Fri Mar 26 10:43:49 2010 From: ehusmann53 at yahoo.com (Ernest Husmann) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 10:43:49 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] car inspection help Message-ID: <770892.57253.qm@web57605.mail.re1.yahoo.com> FOT: Is there anyone in the Omaha, KC or Topeka area that would be willing to take a look at a TR7 located in Falls City, NE. I'm told by the seller Falls City is roughly 90 minutes from all three cities. If you would be willing to help me out please contact me off the list. Thank you, Ernie From billbab at me.com Fri Mar 26 11:06:35 2010 From: billbab at me.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 08:06:35 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs References: <7D25BA73-095C-494D-813C-FACFEB2AC3F6@bnj.com> Message-ID: Begin forwarded message: > From: Bill Babcock > Date: March 26, 2010 7:23:17 AM HST > To: Greg & Alison Blake > Cc: MadMarx , Friends Triumph > Subject: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Weight transfer is not that big an issue on little cars, and what there is, is more benefit than problem. I use the weight transfer forward under braking to control understeer. A little tap on the brakes when the front end is pushing can make the car dive nicely to the apex. In all cases I expect the weight to transfer forward under heavy braking and that's why I have adjustable brake bias and my front disks are as good as are allowed. If Peyote had more than 130 hp I might worry about rear weight transfer, but it is unfortunately, no problem. We might find some performance in managing weight transfer by having better shocks on the car, but Peyote uses Armstrongs in the rear, and they have all the damping consistency of a screen door closer. > > On Mar 24, 2010, at 4:23 PM, Greg & Alison Blake wrote: From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Fri Mar 26 14:13:22 2010 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (toodamnfunky at comcast.net) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 21:13:22 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. Message-ID: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> NOTICE OF DECERTIFICATION; NOTICE TO CEASE AND DESIST AND TERMINATION OF ALL CONTRACTS OF PARTICIPATION ISSUED TO IMPACT RACING SFI Foundation, Inc., has issued a Notice of Decertification; Notice of Cease and Desist, and a notice terminating all Contracts of Participation to Impact Racing. Effective AprilB 27,B 2010 , all products manufactured and/or distributed by Impact Racing pursuant to SFI Specification Programs 3.2A, 3.3, 16.1, and 16.5 are decertified. Evidence obtained by SFI shows that over a period of years Impact Racing has engaged in the production and use of counterfeit SFI conformance labels and patches, and affixed them to Impact products for use in motorsports. Under the Contracts of Participation between SFI and Impact, SFI conformance labels and patches may only be obtained from SFI and no other source. Evidence shows that Impact had counterfeit SFI labels and patches made in Asia and then affixed them to Impact products it distributed to members of the racing community. To SFIbs knowledge, Impact never advised its customers that its products contained phony SFI labels and patches. Impact never advised SFI of its systematic and longstanding practice of counterfeiting and distributing SFI patches and labeling. Impact has been directed to cease and desist from this practice. SFI has directed Impact to immediately notify all affected customers to remove the counterfeit labeling and to offer the affected customers a full refund of the purchase price. SFI is requesting that all counterfeit conformance labels removed from Impact products be sent to SFI. SFI has elected not to decertify these products immediately in order to minimize the potential hardships to members of the racing community that have been brought about by Impactbs counterfeiting activities. SFI has also elected to terminate all Contracts of Participation with Impact Racing effective 90 days from March 24,B 2010. Under the terms of the Contracts, either party may terminate the agreements without penalty upon 90 days notice. This means that Impact will no longer be able to participate in any SFI programs after this 90 day period. SFI has taken these actions in the best interests of the safety and integrity of the racing community. This is in keeping with SFIbs mission and purpose. That's just great, All of my gear is made by Impact. Jim G. From cwnfot at gmail.com Fri Mar 26 16:57:52 2010 From: cwnfot at gmail.com (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 19:57:52 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. In-Reply-To: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <00f301cacd40$2696d2a0$73c477e0$@com> Can you source this information about Impact Racing before it is spread all over. Just in case it is bogus... http://www.impactraceproducts.com Clark Clark W. Nicholls 1972 Stag 1974 Spitfire (and 1 rusty GT6 needing restoration) "Reality, it's not what you think." From tr6nut at verizon.net Fri Mar 26 18:04:23 2010 From: tr6nut at verizon.net (Hugh Barber) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 21:04:23 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. In-Reply-To: <00f301cacd40$2696d2a0$73c477e0$@com> References: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <00f301cacd40$2696d2a0$73c477e0$@com> Message-ID: <4BAD5997.8090708@verizon.net> http://www.sfifoundation.com/ It's on the front page of the website On 3/26/2010 07:57, Clark W. Nicholls wrote: > Can you source this information about Impact Racing before it is spread all > over. > Just in case it is bogus... > http://www.impactraceproducts.com From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Fri Mar 26 18:22:07 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 21:22:07 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket Message-ID: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> Got the head back - dressed it up and assembled. Noticed that with .090 shaved off, the headgasket (stock 86mm) protrudes into the chamber under the exhaust valve. Jack notes predicts this but not quite sure the best way to deal with it. I worked up the edge of the copper and can probably shave it back and roll it over again but it would get pretty close to the water relief. Can I run it protruding Jack notes says it won't last but I'm only .090 not racing all the time so... How do you guys deal with this? M From enquiries at roadandtrack.net.au Fri Mar 26 20:00:08 2010 From: enquiries at roadandtrack.net.au (Enquiries Road & Track) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 13:00:08 +1000 Subject: [Fot] help with finding flywheel bolts Message-ID: <1e4b466c1003262000l4d70b6fy32e4dc98864de458@mail.gmail.com> I have been unsucessfully chasing various local & UK vendors for new "proper" triumph 6 cyl flywheel bolts that were originally used on the 2.5 engines that had a long tail, eg pre 1972, and possibly various other models the part number forged into the bolt head is either UKC4264 or 151287. they were specially made high tensile bolts with a long shank (unthreaded bit). I dont want the generic "bolt shop" replacements , which is what Rimmers seem to offer. I have a custom crank & alloy flywheel and I want these 'long" bolts to maximize thread engagement and stability in the flywheel hole I've looked at the ARP ones, and they are a bit too short for my liking, and much shorter than these factory bolts. can anyone help me with a likely vendor in the USA, or even sell me some good ones. I would prefer new ones, but used ones that are not stretched would be OK. I have sorted thru a pile of them here, and most of them have stretched threads from overtightening or flywheel mis-haps thanks Terry O'Beirne australia From billb at bnj.com Fri Mar 26 20:08:57 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 17:08:57 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket In-Reply-To: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> References: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <94851D33-E556-4029-AE83-5B00682410FE@bnj.com> Sounds like you are using a composite gasket. Don't. It won't last with anything projecting into the combustion chamber, and won't last if the fire ring is cut. Either get a shim steel comp gasket or one of the solid copper ones On Mar 26, 2010, at 3:22 PM, Mark Eginton wrote: > Got the head back - dressed it up and assembled. Noticed that with .090 shaved off, the headgasket (stock 86mm) protrudes into the chamber under the exhaust valve. Jack notes predicts this but not quite sure the best way to deal with it. I worked up the edge of the copper and can probably shave it back and roll it over again but it would get pretty close to the water relief. Can I run it protruding Jack notes says it won't last but I'm only .090 not racing all the time so... > > How do you guys deal with this? > > M > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From 19to1tr6 at comcast.net Fri Mar 26 22:31:55 2010 From: 19to1tr6 at comcast.net (Rob) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 01:31:55 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. In-Reply-To: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <99B47D8331C14EB4A0BA7E85409A7BD3@INSPIRON> That's crazy Didn't Simpson just start up this company a few years ago.Could it spill over to the Simpson products Leopards don't change there spots. I was considering Impacts products last season but fortunately went with Alpine Stars. Guess this sport can be a little more dangerous than we think Book em DANO and loose the key. It will be interesting to see how many NASCAR drivers are wearing the product this weekend. rob ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "fot" Sent: Friday, March 26, 2010 5:13 PM Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. > NOTICE OF DECERTIFICATION; NOTICE TO CEASE AND DESIST AND TERMINATION OF > ALL > CONTRACTS OF PARTICIPATION ISSUED TO IMPACT RACING > > > > SFI Foundation, Inc., has issued a Notice of Decertification; Notice of > Cease > and Desist, and a notice terminating all Contracts of Participation to > Impact > Racing. Effective AprilB 27,B 2010 , all products manufactured and/or > distributed by Impact Racing pursuant to SFI Specification Programs 3.2A, > 3.3, > 16.1, and 16.5 are decertified. Evidence obtained by SFI shows that over a > period of years Impact Racing has engaged in the production and use of > counterfeit SFI conformance labels and patches, and affixed them to Impact > products for use in motorsports. Under the Contracts of Participation > between > SFI and Impact, SFI conformance labels and patches may only be obtained > from > SFI and no other source. Evidence shows that Impact had counterfeit SFI > labels > and patches made in Asia and then affixed them to Impact products it > distributed to members of the racing community. To SFIbs knowledge, > Impact > never advised its customers that its products contained phony SFI labels > and > patches. Impact never advised SFI of its systematic and longstanding > practice > of counterfeiting and distributing SFI patches and labeling. > > Impact has been directed to cease and desist from this practice. SFI has > directed Impact to immediately notify all affected customers to remove the > counterfeit labeling and to offer the affected customers a full refund of > the > purchase price. SFI is requesting that all counterfeit conformance labels > removed from Impact products be sent to SFI. > > SFI has elected not to decertify these products immediately in order to > minimize the potential hardships to members of the racing community that > have > been brought about by Impactbs counterfeiting activities. > > SFI has also elected to terminate all Contracts of Participation with > Impact > Racing effective 90 days from March 24,B 2010. Under the terms of the > Contracts, either party may terminate the agreements without penalty upon > 90 > days notice. This means that Impact will no longer be able to participate > in > any SFI programs after this 90 day period. > > SFI has taken these actions in the best interests of the safety and > integrity > of the racing community. This is in keeping with SFIbs mission and > purpose. > > > > That's just great, All of my gear is made by Impact. > > Jim G. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/19to1tr6 at comcast.net From igofaster at att.net Sun Mar 21 08:15:39 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 08:15:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] our new Spitfire racer Message-ID: <150512.69134.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I recently purchased a 1965 Spitfire from "Mac" McArthur in Huntington Beach California. Mac raced the spitwad for a few seasons with VARA. I was fortunate enough to receive the SCCA log book dating the car back to 1973 events. It was championed by Darwin Fontenot from 05-23-1973 through 09-04-1976. There is a 20 year gap in the log book when it shows Jeff Fontenot racing the car in the Polar Prix February 1997 and the Fiesta Carrera in July 1998. There is a March Madness and Blue Bonnet Sprint dated without the years, only the dates 04-12-?? On 02-13-98 SW division Houston SCCA "El Nino" event. There is also a March Madhatter 03-14-98 which appears to be the last event with a Fontenot family member. There is another log book International Conference of Sports Car Clubs. A Robert Hodge had two events 09-29-2007 and 08-03-2008. Glad to have some evidence of the past life. I'm in the process of sorting out the wiring, there's no fuse buss in the car. Have some new Painless Wiring stuff coming. Bought a new AMB transponder, new Holley Red fuel pump, and I found a new Safequip quick release on the 'bay I like versus the Simpson latch system that came with the car. I went with George Curl wednesday up to Eagles Canyon for a few hours to see if I could log some laps while he sorted out his fresh MGB rebuild when I re-adjusted the head and valves (fresh head) when I noticed one of the valve springs gave way. Hope to have the little Spitwad sorted out for Hallet in a few weeks. Thought some of you might like to know the story behind my bright idea to own 2 racer Triumphs, and Barbra's 1971 TR6 which gets some long needed seat rebuilds and finish up on the interior. All the best, Bobby Whitehead 1970 GT6 DP 1956 Spitfire EP 1971 TR6 From dos_gusanos at msn.com Sat Mar 27 06:40:57 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 07:40:57 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself Message-ID: My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim Hassal, the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly fused broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, drills, repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly intact in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. Cheers, Henry Morrison, New Mexico From jhassall at blacksburg.net Sat Mar 27 07:20:54 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim Hassal, > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly fused > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, drills, > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly intact > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. > Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never looked at it again. If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. jim -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From dos_gusanos at msn.com Sat Mar 27 07:35:03 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 08:35:03 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> References: , <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: Jim it's fine, I would have sent you the same thing and merely consider it another challenge. Pales in comparison to most of my boat projects where I cut my teeth on most rusty bolts, drills, jb weld and duct tape....................Cheers Henry > Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 > From: jhassall at blacksburg.net > To: dos_gusanos at msn.com > CC: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > > On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: > > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim Hassal, > > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly fused > > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, drills, > > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly intact > > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. > > > Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a > half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed > it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never > looked at it again. > > If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. > > jim > > -- > Jim Hassall > Blacksburg VA > '63 TR4 in autox preparation > 99% finished, 90% to go From kaskas at cox.net Sat Mar 27 12:41:47 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 12:41:47 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Still kicking Message-ID: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> Contrary to popular rumor the past couple days, I am not sick, not dying and damn well not dead!! -- Never be beaten by equipment From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Mar 27 12:47:31 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 15:47:31 EDT Subject: [Fot] alloy tubing? Message-ID: <1084f.54c405ce.38dfbad3@aol.com> Did I see a query during the week asking about alloy tubing in our cars? I remember a response about blue tubing from summit but no more. Is anyone using alloy tubing in their cars?? I talked to a bunch of drag racers this morning that love it but I worry about fatigue cracks in our environments. Hate to lose a race to save three ounces;-)) From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Mar 27 13:25:13 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 16:25:13 EDT Subject: [Fot] Still kicking Message-ID: <12164.35d4ec4c.38dfc3a9@aol.com> Well I'm damned glad ya got better! ;-)) What did Mark Twain say, "The reports of my death are greatly exaggerated" :56 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, kaskas at cox.net writes: Contrary to popular rumor the past couple days, I am not sick, not dying and damn well not dead!! -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com From spitlist at cox.net Sat Mar 27 13:49:38 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 13:49:38 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Still kicking In-Reply-To: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> References: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> Message-ID: <1AEF8B89A03F4B0CB035C28ACE0D7CC8@joepentiumnew> Good to know! :) Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas Kastner Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 12:42 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Still kicking Contrary to popular rumor the past couple days, I am not sick, not dying and damn well not dead!! -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From garygret at sbcglobal.net Sat Mar 27 15:40:10 2010 From: garygret at sbcglobal.net (Gary Schneider) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 15:40:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket In-Reply-To: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> References: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <1232.97639.qm@web81507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I have my Uncle Jack engine apart for maintenance right now. On my o-ringed engine he used the AE330 copper-faced composite gasket, and carefully rolled the copper-foil fold of the fire ring a little further back in the valve pocket. I would guess by patient and gentle tapping. Beautiful work and it lasted for years. Regards, Gary Schneider ________________________________ From: Mark Eginton To: "fot at autox.team.net" Sent: Fri, March 26, 2010 8:22:07 PM Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket Got the head back - dressed it up and assembled. Noticed that with .090 shaved off, the headgasket (stock 86mm) protrudes into the chamber under the exhaust valve. Jack notes predicts this but not quite sure the best way to deal with it. I worked up the edge of the copper and can probably shave it back and roll it over again but it would get pretty close to the water relief. Can I run it protruding Jack notes says it won't last but I'm only .090 not racing all the time so... How do you guys deal with this? M _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/garygret at sbcglobal.net From mark at bradakis.com Sat Mar 27 15:46:02 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 16:46:02 -0600 Subject: [Fot] alloy tubing? In-Reply-To: <1084f.54c405ce.38dfbad3@aol.com> References: <1084f.54c405ce.38dfbad3@aol.com> Message-ID: <4BAE8AAA.2000905@bradakis.com> Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: > Did I see a query during the week asking about alloy tubing in our cars? > I remember a response about blue tubing from summit but no more. Bob Lang started it: http://www.team.net/mharc/archives/html/fot/2010-03/msg00319.html > > I was the one who responded that I used 3/8 inch aluminum hard line along the chassis for fuel delivery. Basically one long piece connected to the pump and filter setup through flexible rubber in the vicinity of the trunk and more flex line in the engine bay connected to the regulator, mjb. From norlinengineering at comcast.net Sat Mar 27 16:11:16 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 16:11:16 -0700 Subject: [Fot] alloy tubing? In-Reply-To: <1084f.54c405ce.38dfbad3@aol.com> Message-ID: <099E9A65214A4E6696AD50AECECCA0DC@TOSHIBALAPTOP> I've got aluminum tubing on my AFFF fire system - came with the system. This year I noticed that one of the tubing flares had disappeared - apparently fatigued from vibrations. Easy enough to make a new flare, but I would hate to think what might have happened if this was a fuel line. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Gt6steve at aol.com Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 12:48 PM To: FOT at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] alloy tubing? Did I see a query during the week asking about alloy tubing in our cars? I remember a response about blue tubing from summit but no more. Is anyone using alloy tubing in their cars?? I talked to a bunch of drag racers this morning that love it but I worry about fatigue cracks in our environments. Hate to lose a race to save three ounces;-)) _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/norlinengineering at comcast.net From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Sat Mar 27 18:00:16 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 18:00:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <292451.31285.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <292451.31285.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <445864.4535.qm@web46116.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Well I worked on the TR4 again today. I followed Ed's thoughts and used an non cogged belt. No squeak now. I am getting there!!! Thanks ED and FOT. Mike ________________________________ From: EDWARD BARNARD To: Triumph Friends of ; Mike Mehl Sent: Sun, March 21, 2010 7:33:41 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Mike: Are you running a cogged belt? I have found these to squeak more often then non-cogged belts. Try an old style solid belt if you are using a cogged one. Just my two cents worth. -Ed- --- On Sun, 3/21/10, Mike Mehl wrote: >From: Mike Mehl >Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! >To: "Triumph Friends of" >Date: Sunday, March 21, 2010, 2:42 PM > > >Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is >the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump >pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if >I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak >with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing >but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new >also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it >squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. >Mike > > > > >________________________________ >From: Mike Mehl > >To: Triumph Friends of >Cc: Mike >Mehl >Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM >Subject: [Fot] >Started the TR4 today!!! > >Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button >today with the help of my >race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. >We had a few minor issues >that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help >solve. I am attaching the >link to the you tube video my son shot. I have >some small isuses. Water >leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of >the valve cover is leaking >and the new water pump is squealing (could be the >pulley rubbing on the bolts) >and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the >end of the day i drove it >around the block. You can hear the water pump in >the video. > >I am pretty >excited!! >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > >Mike Mehl >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: >http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: >http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: >http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com > >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net From budscars at comcast.net Sat Mar 27 18:52:37 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 18:52:37 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! References: <292451.31285.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <445864.4535.qm@web46116.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Terrific!... RB ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Mehl" To: "EDWARD BARNARD" Cc: "Triumph Friends of" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 6:00 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > Well I worked on the TR4 again today. I followed Ed's thoughts and used > an > non cogged belt. No squeak now. > > I am getting there!!! > > Thanks ED and FOT. > Mike > > > > > ________________________________ > From: EDWARD BARNARD > > To: Triumph Friends of ; Mike > Mehl > Sent: Sun, March 21, 2010 7:33:41 PM > Subject: Re: > [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > > > Mike: Are you running a cogged belt? I have > found these to squeak more often then non-cogged belts. Try an old style > solid belt if you are using a cogged one. > Just my two cents worth. > -Ed- > --- On > Sun, 3/21/10, Mike Mehl wrote: > > >>From: Mike Mehl > >>Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! >>To: > "Triumph Friends of" >>Date: Sunday, March 21, 2010, 2:42 > PM >> >> >>Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. > One is >>the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the > pump >>pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to > see if >>I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just > squeak >>with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out > bearing >>but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is > new >>also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs > and it >>squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be > helpful. >>Mike >> >> >> >> >>________________________________ >>From: Mike Mehl >> >>To: Triumph Friends of >>Cc: Mike >>Mehl >>Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM >>Subject: > [Fot] >>Started the TR4 today!!! >> >>Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the > button >>today with the help of my >>race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car > started. >>We had a few minor issues >>that a quick call to Jeff Quick in > Seattle help >>solve. I am attaching the >>link to the you tube video my son > shot. I have >>some small isuses. Water >>leaks with my Ford aluminum > radiator, the rear of >>the valve cover is leaking >>and the new water pump is > squealing (could be the >>pulley rubbing on the bolts) >>and the oil temp gauge > is not working. By the >>end of the day i drove it >>around the block. You can > hear the water pump in >>the video. >> >>I am pretty >>excited!! >>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA >>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU >> >>Mike Mehl >>_______________________________________________ >>fot at autox.team.net >>Donate: >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >>Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >>Forums: >>http://www.team.net/forums >>Unsubscribe: >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com >> >>_______________________________________________ >>fot at autox.team.net >>Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.html >>Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >>Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums >>Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Mar 27 19:05:20 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 22:05:20 EDT Subject: [Fot] Motorcycle sites Message-ID: <26db.4cc0029.38e01360@aol.com> Amigos, I'm pushed into selling my lovely T140V Bonneville Triumph Motorcycle. Just don't have the space to keep it because I admit I'll not be riding it again. Know any good websites to advertise where the right kind of enthusiast will get it? From rocky at spitfire4.com Sat Mar 27 19:16:30 2010 From: rocky at spitfire4.com (Rocky Entriken) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 21:16:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself References: , <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: Sounds to me like Henry's not complaining, he's bragging. Yeah, that's pretty cool to get that @#$%^ stud out and leave the threads in perfect shape! --Rocky Entriken ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Cc: "fot" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:35 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > Jim it's fine, I would have sent you the same thing and merely consider it > another challenge. Pales in comparison to most of my boat projects where > I > cut my teeth on most rusty bolts, drills, jb weld and duct > tape....................Cheers Henry > >> Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 >> From: jhassall at blacksburg.net >> To: dos_gusanos at msn.com >> CC: fot at autox.team.net >> Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself >> >> On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: >> > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim > Hassal, >> > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly > fused >> > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, > drills, >> > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly > intact >> > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. >> > >> Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a >> half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed >> it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never >> looked at it again. >> >> If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. >> >> jim >> >> -- >> Jim Hassall >> Blacksburg VA >> '63 TR4 in autox preparation >> 99% finished, 90% to go > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rocky at spitfire4.com From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Sun Mar 28 06:03:25 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 08:03:25 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself References: , <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: <326EB9F0415145CDB1AE630615E1AD5E@latitudefb1e41> I know the feeling. I spent a week working on getting 6 screws out of a sterring wheel adapter. I was ready to grind them flat and drill 6 new holes, but I persevered and by drilling progressively larger holes I got the nasty old steering wheel off and eventually got the screws out with no damage to the aluminum hub. I wish I knew the make of the steering wheel. All it says is made in Italy. The hub is stamped 120. I suppose I could recovet it and use it. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rocky Entriken" To: ; Cc: "fot" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:16 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > Sounds to me like Henry's not complaining, he's bragging. > > Yeah, that's pretty cool to get that @#$%^ stud out and leave the threads > in perfect shape! > > --Rocky Entriken > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Cc: "fot" > Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:35 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > > >> Jim it's fine, I would have sent you the same thing and merely consider >> it >> another challenge. Pales in comparison to most of my boat projects where >> I >> cut my teeth on most rusty bolts, drills, jb weld and duct >> tape....................Cheers Henry >> >>> Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 >>> From: jhassall at blacksburg.net >>> To: dos_gusanos at msn.com >>> CC: fot at autox.team.net >>> Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself >>> >>> On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: >>> > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim >> Hassal, >>> > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly >> fused >>> > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, >> drills, >>> > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly >> intact >>> > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. >>> > >>> Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a >>> half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed >>> it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never >>> looked at it again. >>> >>> If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. >>> >>> jim >>> >>> -- >>> Jim Hassall >>> Blacksburg VA >>> '63 TR4 in autox preparation >>> 99% finished, 90% to go >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rocky at spitfire4.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From jhassall at blacksburg.net Sun Mar 28 08:09:05 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 11:09:05 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: References: , <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: <4BAF7111.5060700@blacksburg.net> On 3/27/2010 10:16 PM, Rocky Entriken wrote: > Sounds to me like Henry's not complaining, he's bragging. Rocky, tnx for making that observation. Henry, I apologize for jumping the gun and reading the email with "prejudiced eyes". My family is under a lot of external stress right now and I'm mentally in foxhole mode. I applaud your persistence and skill; I'd probably have been tempted to use C4. jim > > Yeah, that's pretty cool to get that @#$%^ stud out and leave the > threads in perfect shape! > > --Rocky Entriken > > ----- Original Message ----- From: > To: > Cc: "fot" > Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:35 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > > >> Jim it's fine, I would have sent you the same thing and merely >> consider it >> another challenge. Pales in comparison to most of my boat projects >> where I >> cut my teeth on most rusty bolts, drills, jb weld and duct >> tape....................Cheers Henry >> >>> Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 >>> From: jhassall at blacksburg.net >>> To: dos_gusanos at msn.com >>> CC: fot at autox.team.net >>> Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself >>> >>> On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: >>> > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim >> Hassal, >>> > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly >> fused >>> > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, >> drills, >>> > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly >> intact >>> > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. >>> > >>> Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a >>> half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed >>> it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never >>> looked at it again. >>> >>> If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. >>> >>> jim >>> >>> -- >>> Jim Hassall >>> Blacksburg VA >>> '63 TR4 in autox preparation >>> 99% finished, 90% to go >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rocky at spitfire4.com >> >> >> > > -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From jmwagner at greenheart.com Sun Mar 28 11:13:10 2010 From: jmwagner at greenheart.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 11:13:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4BAF9C36.2050104@greenheart.com> If there's anything I have learned about frozen studs, nuts, bolts, etc..... It is to STOP, the second one realizes they've got a problem. STOP, and think about the best approach, the best tool, etc. And while devising a plan, let it sit in a bath of sprayed on WD40, etc. If the best tool for the given job isn't available at the moment, take the time to get it. Over the years, it seems to me that over half of the difficulty in solving such issues is having to work around the first 30 minutes of testosterone driven carnage. I've slowly been building up a little collection of odd tools specifically designed to deal with these things. Yet, even with all these special tools, more often than not, only one of them is right for any given task. And even then, it's often some simple tool that I need, that's gone missing. And regardless of the game plan, one shouldn't proceed with each step until it's fully engaged. i.e. If one is using a vis-grip, that initial squeeze to lock it in place should hurt. If a hole is to be drilled for a tool to engage, one should take the time to drill it right (properly locate the drill, drill at 90 degrees, drill it as deep as recommended, etc.) If one is dremeling a slot for a screw driver, get it right and use a screw driver that fits the slot perfectly. If leverage would help, take the time to create additional leverage (like pipe to extend handles, etc.). Patience and planning. --Justin From billb at bnj.com Sun Mar 28 12:21:23 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 09:21:23 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: <4BAF9C36.2050104@greenheart.com> References: <4BAF9C36.2050104@greenheart.com> Message-ID: <2D25E67C-6223-4BD4-A38A-E7735D056B89@bnj.com> Good advice. One other bit. When you get a little twinge of a thought that you're doing the wrong thing, stop. Go back and think it through. I can't tell you how many times I've thought "Man, if that bolt breaks my knuckles are going to...OUCH". Or "I probably shouldn't used vise grips for this because...DAMN, I shouldn't have used vise grips. " Telling yourself "I saw that coming" means you didn't trust your experience and knowledge. If you know better, act better. Saves a lot of time and bandaids. On Mar 28, 2010, at 8:13 AM, Justin Wagner wrote: > If there's anything I have learned about frozen studs, nuts, bolts, etc..... It is to STOP, the second one realizes they've got a problem. STOP, and think about the best approach, the best tool, etc. And while devising a plan, let it sit in a bath of sprayed on WD40, etc. If the best tool for the given job isn't available at the moment, take the time to get it. Over the years, it seems to me that over half of the difficulty in solving such issues is having to work around the first 30 minutes of testosterone driven carnage. > > I've slowly been building up a little collection of odd tools specifically designed to deal with these things. Yet, even with all these special tools, more often than not, only one of them is right for any given task. And even then, it's often some simple tool that I need, that's gone missing. > And regardless of the game plan, one shouldn't proceed with each step until it's fully engaged. i.e. If one is using a vis-grip, that initial squeeze to lock it in place should hurt. If a hole is to be drilled for a tool to engage, one should take the time to drill it right (properly locate the drill, drill at 90 degrees, drill it as deep as recommended, etc.) If one is dremeling a slot for a screw driver, get it right and use a screw driver that fits the slot perfectly. If leverage would help, take the time to create additional leverage (like pipe to extend handles, etc.). > > Patience and planning. > > --Justin From jmwagner at greenheart.com Sun Mar 28 12:55:07 2010 From: jmwagner at greenheart.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 12:55:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: <2D25E67C-6223-4BD4-A38A-E7735D056B89@bnj.com> References: <4BAF9C36.2050104@greenheart.com> <2D25E67C-6223-4BD4-A38A-E7735D056B89@bnj.com> Message-ID: <4BAFB41B.1090608@greenheart.com> LOL.... good extra bit! Yes, we should listen to that little extra voice inside! I was working on a Nissan TV commercial years ago... and after a long motion control camera move around the spinning red four door pick up truck, the truck comes to a stop and all the four doors close, at once, for the ending beauty shot... There I am... all in black... hiding inside the truck... pulling on four cables I had rigged to close the doors on cue... as I laid there on the floor of the Nissan... and the camera was rolling... and computers were marking the camera move and the car to spin on a giant turntable... I started thinking to myself... "this isn't a good position, if the lead on one of these things breaks, I'm going to hit myself in the...." The director: (heard over the radio hidden in the car with me) "...and ACTION, Justin.... ....Justin? ....action Justin. Hello... Justin? Action" Justin: (after a long pause, his dizzy voice heard over the radio) "ummm... folks... Justin's going to need a little reset time here... He knocked himself out." It was a little embarrassing having a black eye for the remainder of the shoot. --Justin Bill Babcock wrote: >Good advice. One other bit. When you get a little twinge of a thought that you're doing the wrong thing, stop. Go back and think it through. I can't tell you how many times I've thought "Man, if that bolt breaks my knuckles are going to...OUCH". Or "I probably shouldn't used vise grips for this because...DAMN, I shouldn't have used vise grips. " > >Telling yourself "I saw that coming" means you didn't trust your experience and knowledge. If you know better, act better. Saves a lot of time and bandaids. > >On Mar 28, 2010, at 8:13 AM, Justin Wagner wrote: > > > >>If there's anything I have learned about frozen studs, nuts, bolts, etc..... It is to STOP, the second one realizes they've got a problem. STOP, and think about the best approach, the best tool, etc. And while devising a plan, let it sit in a bath of sprayed on WD40, etc. If the best tool for the given job isn't available at the moment, take the time to get it. Over the years, it seems to me that over half of the difficulty in solving such issues is having to work around the first 30 minutes of testosterone driven carnage. >> >>I've slowly been building up a little collection of odd tools specifically designed to deal with these things. Yet, even with all these special tools, more often than not, only one of them is right for any given task. And even then, it's often some simple tool that I need, that's gone missing. >>And regardless of the game plan, one shouldn't proceed with each step until it's fully engaged. i.e. If one is using a vis-grip, that initial squeeze to lock it in place should hurt. If a hole is to be drilled for a tool to engage, one should take the time to drill it right (properly locate the drill, drill at 90 degrees, drill it as deep as recommended, etc.) If one is dremeling a slot for a screw driver, get it right and use a screw driver that fits the slot perfectly. If leverage would help, take the time to create additional leverage (like pipe to extend handles, etc.). >> >>Patience and planning. >> >>--Justin From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Sun Mar 28 17:44:45 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 20:44:45 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket In-Reply-To: <1232.97639.qm@web81507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <1232.97639.qm@web81507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4BAFF7FD.8040001@twcny.rr.com> Interesting, thats pretty much what I ended up doing since I already had the gasket and nothing to lose. I gently lifted up the fire ring up with a razer blade on my composite gasket and carefully removed some material beneath it with an exacto knife. Then I trimmed and rolled the copper fire ring in flattening it back in place so it followed the new contour of my head. It seemed to look ok so I decided to use it. We will see... M From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Sun Mar 28 17:48:16 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 20:48:16 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Timing gear alignment Message-ID: <4BAFF8D0.5060300@twcny.rr.com> My timing gears with one .010 spacer still appears to have .025 clearance when I straight edge from the cam gear. This is the first engine I noticed this much offset. Are any of you needing to space the crank gear .035 or should I be searching a problem? Thanks, M From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Sun Mar 28 17:50:38 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 20:50:38 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Still kicking In-Reply-To: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> References: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> Message-ID: <4BAFF95E.3040004@twcny.rr.com> The rumors of my death are greatly exaggerated... Mark Twain Always great news indeed... M From budscars at comcast.net Sun Mar 28 18:24:15 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 18:24:15 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Still kicking References: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> <4BAFF95E.3040004@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: Yours Too?..this must be a plot! RB ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Eginton" To: Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:50 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Still kicking > The rumors of my death are greatly exaggerated... > > Mark Twain > > Always great news indeed... > > M > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Sun Mar 28 21:39:14 2010 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 21:39:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] New Racing Data Site Message-ID: <211724.5425.qm@web81208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Group: Here is a site that has gathered up race statistics. This site is neat! http://race- database. com/ "Welcome to race-database. com, the first site that will offer complete statistics for every major racing series. These data include what are considered complete box scores, including data on sponsors, chassis, and lap leaders that are not available on many sites. Although some sites have complete coverage for a set of one or more of these series, none has complete coverage of elite races in multiple racing disciplines. This site is intended for the general racing fan, who wants results for all major races, all in one place. Series covered: * Formula One, 1950-present * NASCAR Cup, 1967-present * CART/Champ Car, 1979-2007 * IRL IndyCar, 1996-present * ALMS, 1999-present * Grand-Am, 2000-present * Indy 500, 1911-present * Daytona 500, 1959-present * 24 Hours of Le Mans, 1923-present " Enjoy - Ed From harmug at us.ibm.com Mon Mar 29 05:25:07 2010 From: harmug at us.ibm.com (George Harmuth) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 08:25:07 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Impact racing belts Decertified Message-ID: Looks like Impact has been cutting corners. Check your belts, you don't want to be surprised at Tech or in a crash. March 26, 2010 - NOTICE OF DECERTIFICATION; NOTICE TO CEASE AND DESIST AND TERMINATION OF ALL CONTRACTS OF PARTICIPATION ISSUED TO IMPACT RACING SFI Foundation, Inc., has issued a Notice of Decertification; Notice of Cease and Desist, and a notice terminating all Contracts of Participation to Impact Racing. Effective April 27, 2010, all products manufactured and/or distributed by Impact Racing pursuant to SFI Specification Programs 3.2A, 3.3, 16.1, and 16.5 are decertified. Evidence obtained by SFI shows that over a period of years Impact Racing has engaged in the production and use of counterfeit SFI conformance labels and patches, and affixed them to Impact products for use in motorsports. Under the Contracts of Participation between SFI and Impact, SFI conformance labels and patches may only be obtained from SFI and no other source. Evidence shows that Impact had counterfeit SFI labels and patches made in Asia and then affixed them to Impact products it distributed to members of the racing community. To SFIbs knowledge, Impact never advised its customers that its products contained phony SFI labels and patches. Impact never advised SFI of its systematic and longstanding practice of counterfeiting and distributing SFI patches and labeling. Impact has been directed to cease and desist from this practice. SFI has directed Impact to immediately notify all affected customers to remove the counterfeit labeling and to offer the affected customers a full refund of the purchase price. SFI is requesting that all counterfeit conformance labels removed from Impact products be sent to SFI. SFI has elected not to decertify these products immediately in order to minimize the potential hardships to members of the racing community that have been brought about by Impactbs counterfeiting activities. SFI has also elected to terminate all Contracts of Participation with Impact Racing effective 90 days from March 24, 2010. Under the terms of the Contracts, either party may terminate the agreements without penalty upon 90 days notice. This means that Impact will no longer be able to participate in any SFI programs after this 90 day period. SFI has taken these actions in the best interests of the safety and integrity of the racing community. This is in keeping with SFIbs mission and purpose. For a downloadable .pdf of this notice, please click on the following link: >Decertification Notice 03-26-10. G. Michael Harmuth Software Engineer Automated Material Handling Equipment Engineering Services From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Mon Mar 29 06:42:34 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 08:42:34 -0500 Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 References: <761127.22877.qm@web58502.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <009901cacf45$b038b580$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Hi, in the old days we checked voltage drop between the battery and the connections along the way to the alternator. Anything over .1 or .2 volts pointed to a problem. That's 1 or 2 tenths of a volt. Over that level could be a loose connection, corrosion/high resistance, maybe faulty wiring. And being it's British and older, check all grounds; they seem to be the Bugaboo in a lot of cases. Be sure the engine is grounded to the frame. I know one guy who had a problem with a Cheve pickup not charging; it turned out to be a loose connection where the battery cable bolts to the starter solenoid. Don't ask who the guy was! Good luck, Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Blake" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:25 PM Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 > FOT > > I installed a HITEST14088 alternator in place of my original alternator about > 5 months ago and it seemed to function although the lead placement was not the > same as the original setup. Lately it seems to be spotty and I would like to > check the output to determine if I have wiring issues or a grumpy > alternator. I have individually cheched readings between the negative > terminal of the battery and the three connectors on the alternator and gotten > readings between 0.20 and 0.50 volts. These readings seem odd but being > electrically challanged I don't trust my technique. Would appreciate > suggestions and or internet references. > > Bob Blake > Dripping Springs, TX > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Mon Mar 29 06:46:32 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 08:46:32 -0500 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, ,<093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: <00aa01cacf46$3e3d3720$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Thanks for the laugh; Thanks, I needed that! Hai Karate, I think it was, '60's. Be careful how you use it. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Gray" To: "'Dan Forgey'" ; ; ; "'triumph fot'" Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:26 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > I hear those NASCAR spring > rubbers act weird in right > hand corners > > jim g > > -----Original Message----- > From: > fot-bounces at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team > .net] On Behalf Of Dan Forgey > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 > 1:14 PM > To: horizonracing at msn.com; > mark at bradakis.com; triumph fot > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging > Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Anyone know where to source > the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Dan Forgey > > > From: horizonracing at msn.com > > To: mark at bradakis.com; > fot at autox.team.net > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 > 11:35:07 -0700 > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: > Paging Tom Krieger re: rear > springs > > > > As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear > springs with "Nascar" spring > rubbers. Smooth > > track= use the spring > rubber,rough track= put in a > softer one or remove it > ! > > :) > > > > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 > 11:01:03 -0600 > > > From: mark at bradakis.com > > > To: fot at autox.team.net > > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: > Paging Tom Krieger re: rear > springs > > > > > > >> spring rate doesn't > change when you shorten a > spring > > > >> > > > > > > > > > If you shorten it by > compressing and heating, > leaving the coil > > > count the same, that is > true. If you physically cut > the spring and > > > change the coil count, it > does get stiffer. > > > > > > mjb. > > > > > > > ______________________________ > _________________ > > > fot at autox.team.net > > > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.htm > l > > > Archive: > http://www.team.net/archive > > > Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums > > > Unsubscribe: > > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/ > options/fot/horizonracing at msn. > com > > > > > ______________________________ > _________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.htm > l > > Archive: > http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/ > options/fot/cofrog at q.com > > ______________________________ > _________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.htm > l > Archive: > http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/ > options/fot/toodamnfunky at comca > st.net > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Mon Mar 29 14:24:25 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 16:24:25 -0500 Subject: [Fot] later TR6 2nd gear Message-ID: I am looking for a good condition second gear for the mid to later TR6 mainshaft. Anyone have one for sale? Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 It's not what you've got, it's what you use that makes a difference. Zig Ziglar From triosan at gmail.com Wed Mar 31 09:43:07 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 09:43:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Need a TR6 rod Message-ID: I need one, and better two, rods for a TR6 of the variety that does not have a small hole in it above the rod bearing area. I have 12 of those that do have holes and would be glad to swap a set for a couple without holes. I had a rod failure and have the other five rods/pistons all balanced and would like to just replace the one rod rather than prep 6 more. Thanks, -- Chuck Arnold From Spitfire_Racing at twcny.rr.com Wed Mar 31 13:54:30 2010 From: Spitfire_Racing at twcny.rr.com (Spitfire Racing) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 16:54:30 -0400 Subject: [Fot] engines available Message-ID: <001801cad114$5c399870$14acc950$@rr.com> I have a neighbor who has two BMC A Series engines he wants to sell off. One is a 1275 and the other is a bit smaller. He also has a bare TR-3 Block to sell. I have no financial interest in this. If you have interest, please e-mail me off list and I will send his contact information. He was a racer for some 30 years. The BMC engines were spares for his Formula Junior if he needed them. These are located near Ithaca NY. Russ Moore From jeff_durant at comcast.net Wed Mar 31 14:17:50 2010 From: jeff_durant at comcast.net (jeff_durant at comcast.net) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 21:17:50 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Need a TR6 rod Message-ID: <906749465-1270070271-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1715018818-@bda059.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Chuck, Give me a call, I've plenty. Jeff ------Original Message------ From: Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Sender: fot-bounces at autox.team.net To: Friends To: Triumph Subject: [Fot] Need a TR6 rod Sent: Mar 31, 2010 9:43 AM I need one, and better two, rods for a TR6 of the variety that does not have a small hole in it above the rod bearing area. I have 12 of those that do have holes and would be glad to swap a set for a couple without holes. I had a rod failure and have the other five rods/pistons all balanced and would like to just replace the one rod rather than prep 6 more. Thanks, -- Chuck Arnold _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jeff_durant at comcast.net Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T From greenman62 at hotmail.com Wed Mar 31 15:55:01 2010 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (Greg Petrolati) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 22:55:01 +0000 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: I'd like to nominate Bob Pengraph and Becky Phelan (bob at nwspeedshots.com, gofastergirl at hotmail.com) Bob should need no introduction and Becky's dad has a TR2 and comes from a British car family. Greg Petrolati Greg Petrolati Lafayette, Oregon That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... From tom at squeelerracing.com Wed Mar 31 18:14:13 2010 From: tom at squeelerracing.com (Tom Kreger) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 18:14:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Bob and Becky References: Message-ID: <0499B8E122CF490698046B35951355A9@laptop> A harty second from me. Bob is a great guy! TK ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Petrolati" To: Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:55 PM Subject: [Fot] (no subject) > I'd like to nominate Bob Pengraph and Becky Phelan > (bob at nwspeedshots.com, gofastergirl at hotmail.com) Bob should need no > introduction and Becky's dad has a TR2 and comes from a British car > family. > > > > Greg Petrolati > > > > Greg Petrolati Lafayette, Oregon > > > > That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tom at squeelerracing.com From cwnfot at gmail.com Wed Mar 31 18:30:34 2010 From: cwnfot at gmail.com (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 21:30:34 -0400 Subject: [Fot] SCCA statement on Impact products Message-ID: <000001cad13a$edb98ff0$c92cafd0$@com> SCCA statement on Impact products: http://www.averillpark.net/documents/RM%2010-04.pdf Forum on the subject: http://www.averillpark.net/thisendup/index.php?/archives/25-SCCA-statement-o n-Impact-Racing-products.html Interesting website: http://www.na-motorsports.com/index.html Clark Clark W. Nicholls 1972 Stag 1974 Spitfire (and 1 rusty GT6 needing restoration) "Reality, it's not what you think." From horizonracing at msn.com Wed Mar 31 21:35:27 2010 From: horizonracing at msn.com (Tony and Annie Garmey) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 21:35:27 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Bob and Becky In-Reply-To: <0499B8E122CF490698046B35951355A9@laptop> References: , <0499B8E122CF490698046B35951355A9@laptop> Message-ID: Just as Tom say's............. Great guy. Gives a lot and asks for nothing. > From: tom at squeelerracing.com > To: greenman62 at hotmail.com; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 18:14:13 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Fot] Bob and Becky > > A harty second from me. Bob is a great guy! TK > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Greg Petrolati" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:55 PM > Subject: [Fot] (no subject) > > > > I'd like to nominate Bob Pengraph and Becky Phelan > > (bob at nwspeedshots.com, gofastergirl at hotmail.com) Bob should need no > > introduction and Becky's dad has a TR2 and comes from a British car > > family. > > > > > > > > Greg Petrolati > > > > > > > > Greg Petrolati Lafayette, Oregon > > > > > > > > That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > > > > _______________________________________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tom at squeelerracing.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracing at msn.com From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Tue Mar 2 19:09:56 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 18:09:56 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Car Chase video (No Triumphs) Message-ID: <1C211269-8457-4BBE-9AD9-CE6534AE36F8@earthlink.net> No TR's but certainly worth watching! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmbh1lWyUj0 ~Steve From ablake2 at austin.rr.com Tue Mar 2 20:39:48 2010 From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com (Greg & Alison Blake) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 21:39:48 -0600 Subject: [Fot] headlights for TR3A Message-ID: <000001caba83$2d0ae010$6501a8c0@blake1> Does anyone know if the headlight buckets from a TR4a would work on an early TR3A front apron? My commission number is in the low 30,000 range. There is a complete set on Ebay, but I don't want to bid unless the bucket will bolt up to my apron. Thanks, Greg From lfritz82 at hotmail.com Tue Mar 2 21:40:07 2010 From: lfritz82 at hotmail.com (Lorne Fritz) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 23:40:07 -0500 Subject: [Fot] headlights for TR3A In-Reply-To: <000001caba83$2d0ae010$6501a8c0@blake1> References: <000001caba83$2d0ae010$6501a8c0@blake1> Message-ID: Greg, The headlight buckets will fit even though they are different. The early TR3 buckets have a wider(deeper) ring, but very few people would know they weren't correct. They changed to the later style bucket about 1960 and used it clear thru the last TR6. Lorne > From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 21:39:48 -0600 > Subject: [Fot] headlights for TR3A > > Does anyone know if the headlight buckets from a TR4a would work on an > early TR3A front apron? My commission number is in the low 30,000 > range. There is a complete set on Ebay, but I don't want to bid unless > the bucket will bolt up to my apron. > > Thanks, > > Greg > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/lfritz82 at hotmail.com > > _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsofts powerful SPAM protection. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469226/direct/01/ From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Wed Mar 3 05:10:47 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (Jerry Van Vlack) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 07:10:47 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Old Photo of TR 2 racers Message-ID: <8366A565233844EB926ED56B706D1991@userb38463fba5> http://www.barcboys.com/Images/Berwick59/55%20BrynfanTyddin-TR2start2.jpg From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Wed Mar 3 05:46:25 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (Jerry Van Vlack) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 07:46:25 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Great website Message-ID: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> http://www.barcboys.com/ Click on Enter in the upper right corner From info at dieselperformanceparts.com Wed Mar 3 10:58:07 2010 From: info at dieselperformanceparts.com (Diesel Performance Parts Inc. - Info) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 11:58:07 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Carrillo Rods Message-ID: <55CB8270B7388B478DC7AC2A39A97C5A6E5659@isis.dieselperformanceparts.local> Morning members, Got an extra set of Carrillo rod's for a Spitfire 1300 small crank. They have been run very little and still have the engine bearings in them so you can see the wear pattern. Basically like new. Like to get 650.00 for the four of them. Call me at 615-347-0260 or e mail me. Mark Craig Diesel Performance Parts, INC. 411 Allied Drive Nashville, TN 37211 866-455-7788 Phone 615-834-9923 Fax www.dieselperformanceparts.com From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Wed Mar 3 11:10:23 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 12:10:23 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Carrillo Rods Message-ID: This reminds me, does anyone have an orphaned TR4 Carillo rod for sale? From spyderweb at uwalumni.com Wed Mar 3 12:02:22 2010 From: spyderweb at uwalumni.com (Jim Hill) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 13:02:22 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Great website In-Reply-To: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> References: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> Message-ID: <3afbecf41003031102m5ff47d3el3a9947c7f7d45782@mail.gmail.com> Nice catch Jerry! Especially: http://www.barcboys.com/Images/drivers%201/JerryWalsh.jpg Jim Hill ________________________________ Jerry Van Vlack wrote: http://www.barcboys.com/ Click on Enter in the upper right corner From adams910 at gmail.com Wed Mar 3 12:09:27 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 14:09:27 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Great website In-Reply-To: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> References: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> Message-ID: <673993c51003031109o2df03522y63afeb0d325a9ba5@mail.gmail.com> I just found that site as well. It really covers the Northeast SCCA National scene in the late 50's early 60's. Lots of easily recognizable names (Roger Penske, Bob Holbert, Mark Donohue, Peter Revson, Don Yenko, etc). If you look through the results, you'll see current Triumph vintage racer Dick Stockton in either a B-Mod Healey (Chevy powered), or in GMod with a Elva MkIV. Also look for guys like Randy Canfield (still racing HP @ 80 years old), Buzz Marcus and Sam Feinstein in Super 7's, Gerry Truitt, etc. Bob From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Wed Mar 3 12:58:36 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 14:58:36 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Great website References: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> Message-ID: <003501cabb0b$e9e67770$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> In '08 at the Glen vintage race, these guys had a large tent set up down the paddock a bit from the Triumph area; they appeared to be having a great time! Seemed to be a lot of hot air and cold beverages around! They're a good bunch. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Van Vlack" To: "'Friends of Triumph'" Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 7:46 AM Subject: [Fot] Great website > http://www.barcboys.com/ > > Click on Enter in the upper right corner > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From gaf3 at charter.net Wed Mar 3 16:13:40 2010 From: gaf3 at charter.net (Glenn Franco) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 18:13:40 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable Message-ID: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of questions for the wisdom of the collective groups. Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 engine with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during starting, it takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a third cable to connect to the center carb to get it going. after that it runs to problem. Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the cable. The center carb is not contributing to the starting event. All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and seals. Any ideas out there?? Thanks in advance Glenn Franco 3 TR6's , TR250, Spit race car and a nice 76 rust free spit. From tr6racer21 at earthlink.net Wed Mar 3 16:21:45 2010 From: tr6racer21 at earthlink.net (Chip Collingwood) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 18:21:45 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable Message-ID: <380-22010333232145625@earthlink.net> Glenn, You might try using the cable on the rear (2) carbs as Richard suggests, or you could check with him on his newer (3) cable choke pull setup Chip > [Original Message] > From: Glenn Franco > To: ; Friends of Triumph ; <6pack at autox.team.net> > Date: 3/3/2010 6:15:25 PM > Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable > > With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of > questions for the wisdom of the collective groups. > Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 > engine with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during > starting, it takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a > third cable to connect to the center carb to get it going. after that it > runs to problem. > Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the > cable. The center carb is not contributing to the starting event. > All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and > seals. > Any ideas out there?? > Thanks in advance > Glenn Franco > 3 TR6's , TR250, Spit race car and a nice 76 rust free spit. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr6racer21 at earthlink.net From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Wed Mar 3 16:42:51 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 18:42:51 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR6 headers craigs list Message-ID: <4B8EF3FB.1060006@twcny.rr.com> http://syracuse.craigslist.org/pts/1605517046.html Looks like a deal... From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Wed Mar 3 19:13:21 2010 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 18:13:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable In-Reply-To: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> Message-ID: <878631.64857.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Glenn: I have installed three of these set-ups for customers; a couple of which are on the six-pack list (customers, not carbs). I have always set them up on the back two carbs, and have never had a problem starting. Make sure the cams are adjusted correctly, and that the enrichening (sp?) discs and holes are not plugged up. Thanks - Ed --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Glenn Franco wrote: From: Glenn Franco Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable To: tr6parts at charter.net, "Friends of Triumph" , 6pack at autox.team.net Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 5:13 PM With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of questions for the wisdom of the collective groups. Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 engine with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during starting, it takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a third cable to connect to the center carb to get it going. after that it runs to problem. Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the cable. The center carb is not contributing to the starting event. All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and seals. Any ideas out there?? Thanks in advance Glenn Franco 3 TR6's , TR250, Spit race car and a nice 76 rust free spit. \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net From goodparts at verizon.net Wed Mar 3 20:31:49 2010 From: goodparts at verizon.net (Richard Good) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 22:31:49 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable In-Reply-To: <878631.64857.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <878631.64857.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5BF50D13C55B4222948B40CF43950A9B@AdminPC> Glenn, I have recently started making triple choke cables and have then in stock with either solid wire or stranded cable. Regards, Richard Good -------------------------------------------------- From: "EDWARD BARNARD" Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 9:13 PM To: "Friends of Triumph" ; "Glenn Franco" Subject: Re: [Fot] Choke Cable > Glenn: I have installed three of these set-ups for customers; a couple of > which are on the six-pack list (customers, not carbs). I have always set > them > up on the back two carbs, and have never had a problem starting. Make sure > the > cams are adjusted correctly, and that the enrichening (sp?) discs and > holes > are not plugged up. > Thanks - Ed > --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Glenn Franco wrote: > > > From: Glenn Franco > Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable > To: tr6parts at charter.net, "Friends of Triumph" , > 6pack at autox.team.net > Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 5:13 PM > > > With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of > questions > for the wisdom of the collective groups. > Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 > engine > with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during starting, it > takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a third cable to > connect > to the center carb to get it going. after that it runs to problem. > Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the cable. > The > center carb is not contributing to the starting event. > All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and > seals. > Any ideas out there?? > Thanks in advance > Glenn Franco > \ From lang at isis.mit.edu Thu Mar 4 07:10:52 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 09:10:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] [6pack] Choke Cable In-Reply-To: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> References: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> Message-ID: Hi, Not trying to be funny here, but I found through trial and error that by making the best spark possible, it practically eliminates the need for the choke. On my race with triple Webers, I only need the choke for the first start of the day. When I had that setup in the street car, I had a Crane X700 spark box and I NEVER needed the choke. The car started first twist, even down to the mid-20's (F). regards, rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2009 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From s.janzen at comcast.net Thu Mar 4 08:20:04 2010 From: s.janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 10:20:04 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR6 headers craigs list In-Reply-To: <4B8EF3FB.1060006@twcny.rr.com> References: <4B8EF3FB.1060006@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: has anybody ever tried to put these on a GT6? They should fit the head, but may not clear the frame? On Mar 3, 2010, at 6:42 PM, Mark Eginton wrote: http://syracuse.craigslist.org/pts/1605517046.html Looks like a deal... \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/s.janzen at comcast.net From mdhado at comcast.net Thu Mar 4 16:37:02 2010 From: mdhado at comcast.net (M&M Hado) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 17:37:02 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Crankshaft Thrust Washers Message-ID: Does anyone have a source for oversize TR3/4 crankshaft thrust washers beyond +.005? Moss used to have a .008" but no more apparently. Thanks, Mike From jhassall at blacksburg.net Thu Mar 4 19:45:51 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 21:45:51 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Crankshaft Thrust Washers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B90705F.2060104@blacksburg.net> On 3/4/2010 6:37 PM, M&M Hado wrote: > Does anyone have a source for oversize TR3/4 crankshaft thrust washers > beyond +.005? Moss used to have a .008" but no more apparently. > > Thanks, > > Mike Mike, you might try bonding some shim stock to the non-bearing side of the washers if you can't find the os washers. jim -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From mdhado at comcast.net Thu Mar 4 20:19:30 2010 From: mdhado at comcast.net (M&M Hado) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 21:19:30 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Crankshaft Thrust Washers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks for the replies. It looks like Moss Europe has +.0075" and Greg Solow's Engine Room in Santa Cruz is another lead. Both suggestions from Bob Kramer. Also, 3 others, including Ken Gillanders, suggested bonding a shim to the back side. I tried that already (with stainless and JB weld) held in a vice overnight but couldn't get a good bond. Trying the brass tonight but the safe way is probably the Moss shims on both sides. Appreciate your help in trying to salvage an otherwise good crank. Mike -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of M&M Hado Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 5:37 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Crankshaft Thrust Washers Does anyone have a source for oversize TR3/4 crankshaft thrust washers beyond +.005? Moss used to have a .008" but no more apparently. Thanks, Mike \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mdhado at comcast.net From jmwagner at greenheart.com Thu Mar 4 20:47:36 2010 From: jmwagner at greenheart.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 19:47:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) Message-ID: <4B907ED8.6080905@greenheart.com> Just ran across this on Craigslist... passing the link along... thought it might be of interest... --Justin Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/pts/1629114524.html From jeff_durant at comcast.net Thu Mar 4 21:29:49 2010 From: jeff_durant at comcast.net (jeff_durant at comcast.net) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 04:29:49 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) Message-ID: <325283340-1267763347-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-2105623690-@bda059.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Justin, I spoke to a gent named Ivan who owns the webers. Nice guy. He was asking $2500 a couple weeks back an I mentioned that was a bit high. He also has a complete GT6+ bonnet and some front end bits. He used to race a GT6 in the SF region. Jeff D. ------Original Message------ From: Justin Wagner Sender: fot-bounces at autox.team.net To: Friends of Triumph Subject: [Fot] Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) Sent: Mar 4, 2010 7:47 PM Just ran across this on Craigslist... passing the link along... thought it might be of interest... --Justin Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/pts/1629114524.html \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jeff_durant at comcast.net Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T From n197tr4 at cs.com Thu Mar 4 21:44:52 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 23:44:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] amb transponder Message-ID: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> FOT, Looking for your uneeded AMB Transponder for the AMBRO. Thanks, Joe A From yellow-green at sbcglobal.net Thu Mar 4 22:52:58 2010 From: yellow-green at sbcglobal.net (Dennis DeLap) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 21:52:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] amb transponder In-Reply-To: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <636290.85067.qm@web81704.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Me too - for the TVR 2200S Dennis FOT, Looking for your uneeded AMB Transponder for the AMBRO. Thanks, Joe A \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/yellow-green at sbcglobal.net From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Fri Mar 5 09:55:42 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 08:55:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] amb transponder In-Reply-To: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <911522.85267.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Andy at Armodillo racing out of Seattle can help you out. He supports all the club and historic races in the Northwest. He was at the KAS cup with his trailer. I have purchased my fuel cell, Kirky seat and related safety products from him. He is competitive and is a distributor. I am attaching his web site info. I will be buying a transponder from him in the next month. http://www.armadilloracing.com/ ________________________________ From: "n197tr4 at cs.com" To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Thu, March 4, 2010 8:44:52 PM Subject: [Fot] amb transponder FOT, Looking for your uneeded AMB Transponder for the AMBRO. Thanks, Joe A \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From igofaster at att.net Fri Mar 5 12:45:44 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 11:45:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Jaguar Parts Help needed In-Reply-To: <0782406101C4354E97CB854612FFE70D0FD330CB42@ITMBXEXCH.enterprise.trin.net> References: <0782406101C4354E97CB854612FFE70D0FD330CB42@ITMBXEXCH.enterprise.trin.net> Message-ID: <946135.62855.qm@web180715.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> my great friend Dan Mooney @ www.classicjaguar.com may be able to help locate the panels too.... Bobby Whitehead ________________________________ From: David Pilcher Sent: Fri, March 5, 2010 9:47:50 AM Subject: Jaguar Parts Help needed The below request was forwarded from our member Lisa Richardson, can anyone help? David E. Pilcher TSTI Manager Quality Systems (214) 589-8826 Office From:Lisa Richardson [mailto:lisa at josephvincelli.com] Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 9:06 AM To: David Pilcher Subject: RE: 1st Communique Thanks for this info Dave. On another note, my restorer is looking for some Jaguar body panels (1966 Mark ll 3.8 Looking for both rear panels/fenders. Full or half. Also, Front Fender passenger area) if you can post this with the club maybe some have something to sell and I can put them in contact with each other. They can call Richard at 214-957-1320 if they have something. Lisa Vincelli cell: 972-345-5051 Notice: This email message, including any attachments, contains information belonging to Trinity Industries, Inc. and its business units. It has been sent solely for the use of the intended recipients and may be confidential, proprietary, copyrighted, and legally privileged. If you are not an intended recipient, please advise the sender of the error and permanently delete all copies of this email, including any copies that may reside in your deleted box. The unauthorized review, use, disclosure, distribution, or copying of this email or its contents is strictly prohibited. From gaf3 at charter.net Sat Mar 6 13:05:49 2010 From: gaf3 at charter.net (Glenn Franco) Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2010 15:05:49 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable In-Reply-To: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> References: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> Message-ID: <4B92B59D.8030802@charter.net> Thanks to all that provided feedback on my triple Stromberg choke cable starting issues. Looks like I will be adding an additional cable for cold starts. Thanks again Glenn Glenn Franco wrote: > With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of > questions for the wisdom of the collective groups. > Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 > engine with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during > starting, it takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a > third cable to connect to the center carb to get it going. after that > it runs to problem. > Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the > cable. The center carb is not contributing to the starting event. > All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and > seals. > Any ideas out there?? > Thanks in advance > Glenn Franco > 3 TR6's , TR250, Spit race car and a nice 76 rust free spit. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gaf3 at charter.net From igofaster at att.net Sat Mar 6 13:05:30 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 12:05:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] crankcase ventilation Message-ID: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> My GT6 has been running with a catch tank for the valve cover and plumbing for the crankcase ventilation. I have been running the valve cover blowby into the tank but have run without the crankcase ventilation plumbing into the catch tank. Someone suggested that all British cars run better if the crankcase is being ventilated. This past weekend I ran the crankcase and valve cover blowby into the catch tank...dang... I'm gathering at least a pint of blowby in the emulsion tank in just a 15 minute run... I seem to recall Kas suggested a crankcase pipe of 1/2" inside diameter... my car has about a 3/8" port into the fuel pump spot where it is configureed... The hose for the blow by definately looks more oiley , but what is the opinion of the group of having so much run off in the catch tank... I'm getting blowby mist that I can see when the engine is at idle with the oil cap off... the GT is on the 3rd season without a rebuild... wondering if I retorque the head and adjust the valves if I could reduce the blowby... or?? Bobby Whitehead 1970GT6 DP CVAR looks like I purchased a race preparred Spitfire on eBay this week out in California... so... my wife is allowing a two racecar garage for her hubby..... From LOddTR at aol.com Sat Mar 6 13:23:35 2010 From: LOddTR at aol.com (LOddTR at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 15:23:35 EST Subject: [Fot] Invitation: Fourth Annual Martha McDougal to be awarded at VIR 4/9 - 4/11 Message-ID: <121b.68d2ae2d.38c413c7@aol.com> The Triumph Ghetto is pleased to announce that they will award the Fourth Annual Martha McDougal Trophy, as part of the 2010 VDCA Wild Hare Run, at Virginia International Raceway. The dates for this year's event are April 9th through the 11th. Join your fellow Triumph racers at this prestigious event that serves as the kick-off to the 2010 race season. The Wild Hare features generous amounts of track time, including a free enduro, on one of the most challenging long tracks in the country. Topping off the weekend will be the presentation of the coveted "Martha" trophy to the Triumph racer that displays a high level of performance on track, camaraderie in the paddock and general good-guy/gal-ness. In addition to the standard fun on and off the track, the Ghetto will provide their world famous surf and turf dinner on Friday evening. Here is your link to the entry form for the weekends festivities. We look forward to seeing you there. _http://www.vintagedrive.com/EntryVIR10.pdf_ (http://www.vintagedrive.com/EntryVIR10.pdf) The TR Ghetto PS: Here is Martha's story This race weekend honors Ms. Martha McDougal, a woman who toiled in almost total obscurity for many years at the Triumph automobile plant in Coventry, England. According to sources believed to be reliable, Martha was born in Coventry in January, 1923. Her parents were tragically killed in the Blitz and Martha was left an orphan at age 16. Although she was not overly bright, she was very resourceful and within months had gotten a job at the Standard Triumph factory emptying the dust bins. Throughout the war and until the demise of the company, Martha made the rounds, day after day, month after month, year after year, transferring the trash into her cart and then into the large bins behind the factory, without complaint or even one day's absence. Over the years Martha became known as the single person who had completed the most "laps" of the Triumph factory and, upon her retirement a few months before the final closing of the Coventry plant, she was honored with a bronzed pair of high top Keds, her signature footwear. It is rumored that at the presentation, Sir John himself reminisced about how Martha, who had an endearing habit of assigning nicknames to all the staff, would push past him in the hallway and mumble, "Get out of my way you fat bastard". From tlizzard at msn.com Sat Mar 6 15:23:33 2010 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 17:23:33 -0500 Subject: [Fot] crankcase ventilation In-Reply-To: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: What are the leakdown numbers for the engine? Leakdown checks are really the only sure way of knowing the condition of the rings and or valves in terms of sealing. Terry Stetler From timmurph at fastbytes.com Sat Mar 6 16:21:15 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 17:21:15 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 crankshaft end play Message-ID: <000001cabd83$b89bbca0$29d335e0$@com> When I assembled the reground crank after the center main bearing failed I put new thrust bearings in, 0.005 oversize in front, standard in the rear, which is what the old ones were. The old thrust bearings got particles of the failed center main imbedded in them which is why I replaced them. I had 0.003 end play with the old thrust bearings when I put new main and rod bearings in 2008. I now have 0.001 to 0.0015 end play with the same size new thrust bearings, 0.005 oversize front and standard rear. I'm guessing my old thrust bearings were a bit worn, giving the 0.003 end play in 2008. The book spec is 0.004 to 0.006. If I take the 0.005 oversize out and put a standard in front also I'll be right at the limit of 0.006. Am I better off to run the 0.001 end play or the "at the limit" 0.006? I did notice that the new thrust bearings from BPNW, which are the "County" (I think that's the same as "King") brand, have what appears to be a copper facing on the bearing surface whereas my old ones looked like Babbitt. Maybe the copper was worn off the old ones giving the 0.003 endplay? Thanks for any comments and opinions on this. It would seem that 0.001 would be a bit tight, unless they quickly "wear in" and would give me 0.003 or there about. I'm measuring the end play with a tenth indicator against the ground surface on the flank in front of the rear main journal and "pushing" the crank back and forth with a big screwdriver against the center counter balance and the block. I get the 0.0015 if I push hard and hold and the 0.001 if I push and release. Only the center main bearing block is in and torqued. The front and rear blocks are not installed yet. This is a stock crankshaft and the stock thrust bearings. Tim From s.janzen at comcast.net Sat Mar 6 19:42:52 2010 From: s.janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 21:42:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] crankcase ventilation In-Reply-To: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> Now I'm curious- my GT6 has no crankcase ventilation- where's the breather connection? Also- with all the open space between crankcase and valve cover along the pushrods, why would a 1/2" tube on the crankcase make any difference? Sent from my iPhone On Mar 6, 2010, at 3:05 PM, Bobby Whitehead wrote: > My GT6 has been running with a catch tank for the valve cover and > plumbing for the crankcase ventilation. I have been running the > valve cover blowby into the tank but have run without the crankcase > ventilation plumbing into the catch tank. > Someone suggested that all British cars run better if the crankcase > is being ventilated. This past weekend I ran the crankcase and valve > cover blowby into the catch tank...dang... I'm gathering at least a > pint of blowby in the emulsion tank in just a 15 minute run... > I seem to recall Kas suggested a crankcase pipe of 1/2" inside > diameter... my car has about a 3/8" port into the fuel pump spot > where it is configureed... > The hose for the blow by definately looks more oiley , but what is > the opinion of the group of having so much run off in the catch > tank... I'm getting blowby mist that I can see when the engine is at > idle with the oil cap off... the GT is on the 3rd season without a > rebuild... wondering if I retorque the head and adjust the valves if > I could reduce the blowby... or?? > > Bobby Whitehead 1970GT6 DP CVAR > > looks like I purchased a race preparred Spitfire on eBay this week > out in California... so... my wife is allowing a two racecar garage > for her hubby..... > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/s.janzen at comcast.net From jaboruch at netzero.net Sat Mar 6 20:28:47 2010 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 03:28:47 GMT Subject: [Fot] TR4 crankshaft end play Message-ID: <20100306.222847.24000.0@webmail03.dca.untd.com> Tim, 0.001 is too tight. I would go with the 0.006, but if you want to get closer to the low end of the tolerance, sand 0.003 of the back of half of the thicker bearings. I made a wooden fixture that the bearings fit into so that I could sand them with emery paper on a flat plate, without sanding my finger tips off. It also keeps them level so an even amount is taken off. Joe(B) ---------- Original Message ---------- From: "Tim Murphy" To: Cc: rpm724 at att.net, ryan.murphy at fdlco.wi.gov Subject: [Fot] TR4 crankshaft end play Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 17:21:15 -0600 When I assembled the reground crank after the center main bearing failed I put new thrust bearings in, 0.005 oversize in front, standard in the rear, which is what the old ones were. The old thrust bearings got particles of the failed center main imbedded in them which is why I replaced them. I had 0.003 end play with the old thrust bearings when I put new main and rod bearings in 2008. I now have 0.001 to 0.0015 end play with the same size new thrust bearings, 0.005 oversize front and standard rear. I'm guessing my old thrust bearings were a bit worn, giving the 0.003 end play in 2008. The book spec is 0.004 to 0.006. If I take the 0.005 oversize out and put a standard in front also I'll be right at the limit of 0.006. Am I better off to run the 0.001 end play or the "at the limit" 0.006? I did notice that the new thrust bearings from BPNW, which are the "County" (I think that's the same as "King") brand, have what appears to be a copper facing on the bearing surface whereas my old ones looked like Babbitt. Maybe the copper was worn off the old ones giving the 0.003 endplay? Thanks for any comments and opinions on this. It would seem that 0.001 would be a bit tight, unless they quickly "wear in" and would give me 0.003 or there about. I'm measuring the end play with a tenth indicator against the ground surface on the flank in front of the rear main journal and "pushing" the crank back and forth with a big screwdriver against the center counter balance and the block. I get the 0.0015 if I push hard and hold and the 0.001 if I push and release. Only the center main bearing block is in and torqued. The front and rear blocks are not installed yet. This is a stock crankshaft and the stock thrust bearings. Tim \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jaboruch at netzero.net ____________________________________________________________ Get Free Email with Video Mail & Video Chat! http://www.netzero.net/freeemail?refcd=NZTAGOUT1FREM0210 From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sat Mar 6 21:06:26 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg Lunker Hilyer) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 21:06:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling Message-ID: <9C2735B4-2897-47D4-9DE8-208D4C0F8DED@earthlink.net> While cleaning shop today, I moved a pile of expired harnesses onto a shelf right next to the new tie-downs I just bought. IDEA... The used [useless] harnesses will make for great "over the tire" tie downs. Surprised I never thought of it before and also surprised I've never seen such. Eager to get them mounted. If I lose a car I'll be sure to let you all know. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM By the way, My UPS guy offerd me 2 TR6's ['76 complete and with hardtop, '74 roller with everything in boxes] for $3000. I'm not interested in advertising them &/or fielding a bunch of inquiries but would be willing to take a look for a FoT. From n197tr4 at cs.com Sat Mar 6 21:13:09 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2010 23:13:09 -0500 Subject: [Fot] crankcase ventilation In-Reply-To: <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> Message-ID: <8CC8BC3A182476E-39E4-10E86@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> It's been said before, but I run negative pressure in my crankcase to great effect. There is no oil being pushed past seals and gaskets and there is a belief that negative pressure promotes better ring sealing and reduces internal disturbances. This is not a new idea and it is commonly used by dragsters and stock car racers. SVRA sees it as something that would pass their tech and it always has elsewhere. Inexpensive and simple to install. Joe A -----Original Message----- From: Scott Janzen To: Bobby Whitehead Cc: FoT Triumph Sent: Sat, Mar 6, 2010 8:42 pm Subject: Re: [Fot] crankcase ventilation Now I'm curious- my GT6 has no crankcase ventilation- where's the breather connection? Also- with all the open space between crankcase and valve cover along the pushrods, why would a 1/2" tube on the crankcase make any difference? Sent from my iPhone On Mar 6, 2010, at 3:05 PM, Bobby Whitehead wrote: > My GT6 has been running with a catch tank for the valve cover and > plumbing for the crankcase ventilation. I have been running the > valve cover blowby into the tank but have run without the crankcase > ventilation plumbing into the catch tank. > Someone suggested that all British cars run better if the crankcase > is being ventilated. This past weekend I ran the crankcase and valve > cover blowby into the catch tank...dang... I'm gathering at least a > pint of blowby in the emulsion tank in just a 15 minute run... > I seem to recall Kas suggested a crankcase pipe of 1/2" inside > diameter... my car has about a 3/8" port into the fuel pump spot > where it is configureed... > The hose for the blow by definately looks more oiley , but what is > the opinion of the group of having so much run off in the catch > tank... I'm getting blowby mist that I can see when the engine is at > idle with the oil cap off... the GT is on the 3rd season without a > rebuild... wondering if I retorque the head and adjust the valves if > I could reduce the blowby... or?? > > Bobby Whitehead 1970GT6 DP CVAR > > looks like I purchased a race preparred Spitfire on eBay this week > out in California... so... my wife is allowing a two racecar garage > for her hubby..... > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/s.janzen at comcast.net \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com = From n197tr4 at cs.com Sat Mar 6 21:17:17 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2010 23:17:17 -0500 Subject: [Fot] AMB TRANSPONDERS USED & NEW In-Reply-To: <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> Message-ID: <8CC8BC434ED6878-39E4-10EDF@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> FOT, I found four used transponders four $275 each, while they last. New for $399. Rechargeable, I believe. Joe A From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sat Mar 6 22:07:03 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 22:07:03 -0700 Subject: [Fot] AMB TRANSPONDERS USED & NEW In-Reply-To: <8CC8BC434ED6878-39E4-10EDF@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> <8CC8BC434ED6878-39E4-10EDF@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <456167A2-70DC-495A-8852-8281AADB9EBD@earthlink.net> For what it's worth Joe, That's a great deal. I've sold a couple on E-Bay for $325+. Got a email from AMB awhile back suggesting that since mine is 5+ years old [more like 8] they suggested I send it in for $30 off a replacement. Hah!! Mine still carries a 4 day charge and a friend has now been using his for 16 years. The rechargeables rock! Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Mar 6, 2010, at 9:17 PM, n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: > FOT, > > I found four used transponders four $275 each, while they last. > > New for $399. > > Rechargeable, I believe. > > Joe A > \ From andre at gt6.ca Sun Mar 7 04:55:14 2010 From: andre at gt6.ca (Andre Rousseau) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 06:55:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] AMB TRANSPONDERS USED & NEW In-Reply-To: <456167A2-70DC-495A-8852-8281AADB9EBD@earthlink.net> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> <8CC8BC434ED6878-39E4-10EDF@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> <456167A2-70DC-495A-8852-8281AADB9EBD@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <4362ae391003070355u3542bfefm3765d447c9097721@mail.gmail.com> I got a hardware unit for $300 CND used. New they go for $490. Buggers charges me $50USD to transfer it into my name, but now show it only costs $40.00 http://www.mylaps.com/index.php/us_eng/Websites/B2C/car/products/used_transpo nders Oh well. A. On 7 March 2010 00:07, Greg "Lunker" Hilyer wrote: > For what it's worth Joe, > That's a great deal. I've sold a couple on E-Bay for $325+. Got a email from > AMB awhile back suggesting that since mine is 5+ years old [more like 8] > they suggested I send it in for $30 off a replacement. Hah!! Mine still > carries a 4 day charge and a friend has now been using his for 16 years. The > rechargeables rock! > > Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > On Mar 6, 2010, at 9:17 PM, n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: > >> FOT, >> >> I found four used transponders four $275 each, while they last. >> >> New for $399. >> >> Rechargeable, I believe. >> >> Joe A >> \ > > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/andre at gt6.ca > > > -- Andre Rousseau - andre at gt6.ca '68 Triumph GT6 MK1 - http://www.gt6.ca/ '77 FIAT 124 Vintage Racer #515 - http://www.124racer.com/ Ottawa, ON, Canada From n197tr4 at cs.com Sun Mar 7 06:44:09 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2010 08:44:09 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling.....now over the wheel tie downs In-Reply-To: <9C2735B4-2897-47D4-9DE8-208D4C0F8DED@earthlink.net> References: <9C2735B4-2897-47D4-9DE8-208D4C0F8DED@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <8CC8C13660E80D2-39E4-14154@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> If you go to photobucket.com/ambro you will see an "over the tire' tiedown system I am building for my new trailer. -----Original Message----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer To: fot Triumph Sent: Sat, Mar 6, 2010 10:06 pm Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling While cleaning shop today, I moved a pile of expired harnesses onto a shelf right next to the new tie-downs I just bought. IDEA... The used [useless] harnesses will make for great "over the tire" tie downs. Surprised I never thought of it before and also surprised I've never seen such. Eager to get them mounted. If I lose a car I'll be sure to let you all know. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM By the way, My UPS guy offerd me 2 TR6's ['76 complete and with hardtop, '74 roller with everything in boxes] for $3000. I'm not interested in advertising them &/or fielding a bunch of inquiries but would be willing to take a look for a FoT. \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From andre at gt6.ca Sun Mar 7 07:29:07 2010 From: andre at gt6.ca (Andre Rousseau) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 09:29:07 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling.....now over the wheel tie downs In-Reply-To: <8CC8C13660E80D2-39E4-14154@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> References: <9C2735B4-2897-47D4-9DE8-208D4C0F8DED@earthlink.net> <8CC8C13660E80D2-39E4-14154@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <4362ae391003070629j44a92ba7v3597f46c732c7ee3@mail.gmail.com> AWESOME idea. A. On 7 March 2010 08:44, wrote: > If you go to photobucket.com/ambro you will see an "over the tire' > tiedown system I am building for my new trailer. > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > To: fot Triumph > Sent: Sat, Mar 6, 2010 10:06 pm > Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling > > > While cleaning shop today, I moved a pile of expired harnesses onto a shelf > right next to the new tie-downs I just bought. > IDEA... The used [useless] harnesses will make for great "over the tire" tie > downs. Surprised I never thought of it before and also surprised I've never > seen such. Eager to get them mounted. If I lose a car I'll be sure to let you > all know. > > Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > > By the way, > My UPS guy offerd me 2 TR6's ['76 complete and with hardtop, '74 roller with > everything in boxes] for $3000. I'm not interested in advertising them &/or > fielding a bunch of inquiries but would be willing to take a look for a FoT. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/andre at gt6.ca > > > -- Andre Rousseau - andre at gt6.ca '68 Triumph GT6 MK1 - http://www.gt6.ca/ '77 FIAT 124 Vintage Racer #515 - http://www.124racer.com/ Ottawa, ON, Canada From n197tr4 at cs.com Sun Mar 7 17:01:24 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2010 19:01:24 -0500 Subject: [Fot] RECHARGEABLE AMBs Message-ID: <8CC8C69A0AA76F5-A454-21F0F@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> FYI, wolfcreek141 at yahoo.com has a few left at $275 plus $10 shipping. I'll have mine by Wednesday. She has them listed on eBay and they routinely go over $300 but she will sell directly with payment by PayPal. Joe From timmurph at fastbytes.com Sun Mar 7 19:00:24 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 20:00:24 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 thrust bearing clearance Message-ID: <000001cabe63$1f05e440$5d11acc0$@com> Thanks for all of the responses. I measured the thickness of my old and new thrust bearings today and saw that they were within about a = thousandth of each other. As I had .003 to .004 before I knew I must be doing something different. So I measured the clearance between the thrust bearing and the crank with a feeler, as the workshop manual shows, and I have a nice .004 clearance. Measuring the end play with an indicator and pushing the crank forward and back apparently is not a good way to measure the clearance, which is what the .004 to .006 tolerance is for. SoIll leave the thrust bearings as they are. The old ones which are about the same size worked okay and the clearance is at the low end of the spec. Everything looks pretty good!! I learned quite a bit to boot. Thanks again, much appreciated. Tim From jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au Mon Mar 8 00:57:48 2010 From: jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au (Jim Cun) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 23:57:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] TR-man MP3 In-Reply-To: <561232.57934.qm@web51806.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <561232.57934.qm@web51806.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <990467.55517.qm@web51805.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi Guys. Had this sent too me from a fellow TR-man so if you have not heard this MP3 had a listen [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type audio/mpeg which had a name of TR] From 58tr3a at videotron.ca Mon Mar 8 06:16:22 2010 From: 58tr3a at videotron.ca (Don Elliott) Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 08:16:22 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire Message-ID: Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to be available in August. http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm From dmitchel at sbcglobal.net Mon Mar 8 09:17:06 2010 From: dmitchel at sbcglobal.net (Doug Mitchell) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 08:17:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <641953.43963.qm@web80806.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Not exactly new, I saw a presentation on them in August of 2005, and Michelin showed them at SAE World Congress in 2006. I still wouldn't count on seeing them any time soon. ________________________________ From: Don Elliott <58tr3a at videotron.ca> To: Friends of Triumph Sent: Mon, March 8, 2010 8:16:22 AM Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to be available in August. http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dmitchel at sbcglobal.net From gaf3 at charter.net Mon Mar 8 09:58:07 2010 From: gaf3 at charter.net (Glenn Franco) Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 11:58:07 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B952C9F.6000805@charter.net> I did some research on these in the late 90's and contacted Michelin as to their release date for production. At the time I was trying to find a lightweight spare for the 3 generation Grand Cherokee, but they could not give me a date. Would make a good spare, but I don't think the public's ready to accept it. Glenn Don Elliott wrote: > Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to be available in August. > > http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gaf3 at charter.net From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Mon Mar 8 10:24:34 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 09:24:34 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: <4B952C9F.6000805@charter.net> References: <4B952C9F.6000805@charter.net> Message-ID: I like sidewalls on my tires, they keep water and rocks out of the spinning tires! Imagine going slowly through a puddle, wouldn't the thing collect the water and chuck it around? ~Steve On Mar 8, 2010, at 8:58 AM, Glenn Franco wrote: I did some research on these in the late 90's and contacted Michelin as to their release date for production. At the time I was trying to find a lightweight spare for the 3 generation Grand Cherokee, but they could not give me a date. Would make a good spare, but I don't think the public's ready to accept it. Glenn Don Elliott wrote: > Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer > band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to > be available in August. > > http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ > gaf3 at charter.net \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From kaskas at cox.net Mon Mar 8 11:16:53 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 10:16:53 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20100308131653.BEAAJ.1024792.imail@fed1rmwml32> How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of balance condition..... whoopee. ---- Steven Belfer wrote: ============= I like sidewalls on my tires, they keep water and rocks out of the spinning tires! Imagine going slowly through a puddle, wouldn't the thing collect the water and chuck it around? ~Steve On Mar 8, 2010, at 8:58 AM, Glenn Franco wrote: I did some research on these in the late 90's and contacted Michelin as to their release date for production. At the time I was trying to find a lightweight spare for the 3 generation Grand Cherokee, but they could not give me a date. Would make a good spare, but I don't think the public's ready to accept it. Glenn Don Elliott wrote: > Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer > band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to > be available in August. > > http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ > gaf3 at charter.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From adams910 at gmail.com Mon Mar 8 11:29:28 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 13:29:28 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: References: <4B952C9F.6000805@charter.net> Message-ID: <673993c51003081029r77cf22dbqed6337957acf8877@mail.gmail.com> Here's DC Shoes' spin off this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUfEsJJBUyM Bob From emanteno at gmail.com Mon Mar 8 11:35:36 2010 From: emanteno at gmail.com (Irv Korey) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 12:35:36 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: <20100308131653.BEAAJ.1024792.imail@fed1rmwml32> References: <20100308131653.BEAAJ.1024792.imail@fed1rmwml32> Message-ID: <354a1781003081035m36bee109nbf986ca7e230830a@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 12:16 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of > balance condition..... whoopee. > I can envision a scenario where you park your car in a puddle, only to have it freeze inside those tires overnight, locking your car in place until you are able to free it, maybe in spring. Irv From spitlist at cox.net Mon Mar 8 12:13:29 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 12:13:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: <354a1781003081035m36bee109nbf986ca7e230830a@mail.gmail.com> References: <20100308131653.BEAAJ.1024792.imail@fed1rmwml32> <354a1781003081035m36bee109nbf986ca7e230830a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Each set of tires would include an ice pick for just that sort of situation! :) Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Irv Korey Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 11:36 AM To: Kas Kastner Cc: Friends of Triumph Subject: Re: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 12:16 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of > balance condition..... whoopee. > I can envision a scenario where you park your car in a puddle, only to have it freeze inside those tires overnight, locking your car in place until you are able to free it, maybe in spring. Irv \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From BillDentin at aol.com Mon Mar 8 12:15:21 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 14:15:21 EST Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire Message-ID: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com> In a message dated 03/08/2010 12:32:42 PM Central Standard Time, kaskas at cox.net writes: > How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of > balance condition..... whoopee. > A couple of years ago someone sent me info on these, and I took it to my racing partner Bob Wismer, who was quite familiar with them. They are not a particularly new concept, and Kas is right that snow, ice, mud, debris are all prime issues that have prevented them from going further with them at this time. But consideration as an emergency spare strikes me as interesting. Bill Dentinger From Gt6steve at aol.com Mon Mar 8 13:46:07 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 15:46:07 EST Subject: [Fot] GOOD rollbar padding Message-ID: <2b79c.6cede798.38c6bc0f@aol.com> Hey, Anybody know who's got the best prices on the Hi density rollbar padding? From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Mon Mar 8 16:56:52 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 18:56:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder Message-ID: <4B958EC4.8070606@twcny.rr.com> I was in Lowes and saw some 1/8" steel stock perfect for a scatter shield 3" wide so here is how I spent my weekend: http://www.flickr.com/photos/28599565 at N04 Think it will do the job or is there something I need to consider adding or changing. I plan to run my dad's lightened flywheel which visually has seen a lathe back in the '60s. I had it magnifluxed and it is fine but I still feel the need for a shield - I like being ambulatory... The idea is to keep the car the way he raced it - drive it to the track, pull the windshield and passenger seat - add a plexiglas deflection shield and go have fun. So, I wanted it to hide under the carpet. Thanks, M From tlizzard at msn.com Mon Mar 8 17:21:51 2010 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 19:21:51 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com> References: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com> Message-ID: Seems to me a non-structural sidewall is the answer. Besides, they will need someplace to plaster their logo... Terry Stetler From trmarty at hotmail.com Mon Mar 8 17:47:27 2010 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 19:47:27 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: References: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com>, Message-ID: If they came in 20" and chrome spinners I'd put them on the Spitty :) Marty _________________________________________________________________ Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469229/direct/01/ From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Mon Mar 8 18:01:39 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (Jerry Van Vlack) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 20:01:39 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire References: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com> Message-ID: <426AAF5452124C52B91A8946F196D7F0@userb38463fba5> There is an industrial tire called AirBoss that uses a similar concept but with much greater cross sections and individual segmented sections. I know a lot about that product as I served as the President of the Division for several years until the parent sold the business. In our case the product served a specific niche market on equipment used in aggressive environments. We did a lot of testing and strictly limited the speed that the tire could be used as you build up heat pretty quickly when the rubber is flexing. I'm sure that Michelin has done even more testing since their tire is intended for highway use. We did experience issues with rocks and debris getting into the open air pockets. While I realize that our product and this tire are for very different applications the failure modes might be very similar. The concept was copied by other manufactures eventually and costs became an issue as competitors found ways to make similar tires and we did not change our design. (Much more to that story). It was a good experience for me personally and I learned a lot about the dynamics and chemistry that goes into the design of rubber products. Bill Dentinger and Bob Kramer may remember our tires that were used on Skid-Steers and Variable Reach lift trucks. We were an OE option for several years on Case, New Holland, John Deere and BobCat equipment. JVV ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 2:15 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire > In a message dated 03/08/2010 12:32:42 PM Central Standard Time, > kaskas at cox.net writes: > > >> How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of >> balance condition..... whoopee. >> > > A couple of years ago someone sent me info on these, and I took it to my > racing partner Bob Wismer, who was quite familiar with them. They are not > a > particularly new concept, and Kas is right that snow, ice, mud, debris are > all prime issues that have prevented them from going further with them at > this > time. But consideration as an emergency spare strikes me as interesting. > > Bill Dentinger > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com From budscars at comcast.net Mon Mar 8 18:57:32 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 17:57:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire References: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com>, Message-ID: Absolutely...That's the ticket...Just think..in 30 years those wheels will be Vintage!... Racer Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: "marty sukey" To: "FOT" Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 4:47 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire > If they came in 20" and chrome spinners I'd put them on the Spitty :) > > Marty > > _________________________________________________________________ > Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469229/direct/01/ > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From dos_gusanos at msn.com Mon Mar 8 19:38:38 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 19:38:38 -0700 Subject: [Fot] FW: [Healeys] Amateur Sports Car Racing in the '60s In-Reply-To: <689461.48751.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <689461.48751.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Gotta watch this one....................Henry Morrison, Albuquerque > > This is just the best. A period half-hour video about amateur SCCA racing in > the 60s. Lots of big Healeys and Sprites. Great shots at the Glen before they > put up all the armco. http://vimeo.com/4139756 > > Rick > > > Follow My Nasty Boy Build: http://tinyurl.com/yj52fwo > _______________________________________________ From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Mon Mar 8 20:04:00 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 22:04:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling Message-ID: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Hi guys, I just read that Stirling Moss was injured when he fell down an elevator shaft at his home. The doors evidently opened but there was a malfunction and the elevator car wasn't there. He then somehow fell down the shaft. The article said that he had surgery on his ankles and was banged up but did not have life threatening injuries. It said he fell 30 feet. Wow. I used to see him at the CanAm races where he was the J Wax spokesman. Got lots of free wax for the car. There was the time when Oscar's wife and Jack's wife took an empty J Wax can, cleaned it out, filled it with butterscotch pudding ( which looked about like the wax) and approached Stirling. One of them stuck her finger into the can, swirled it around, and after asking Moss how many calories were in it, plopped it into her mouth! Moss's eyes about came out of his head! Great moment. Hope he does OK. Bill From dlhogye at comcast.net Mon Mar 8 20:54:12 2010 From: dlhogye at comcast.net (davehogye) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 03:54:12 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Fuel cell size Message-ID: <1500220419.1684221268106852436.JavaMail.root@sz0047a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Hello friends, I'm in the market for a fuel cell for my TR3 race car. What is the typical gallon size used for TRs. I've seen a few cars with 8 gallon tanks and a couple with 10 and 12. ATL makes a cell called the "Well Cell" that is 22"dia. and would fit nicely in the spare tire compartment. They have an 8 and 12 gallon size. Both are 22"dia. but the 8 gallon is only 6" tall and I think it will fit without cutting the trunk floor out. The 12 gallon is 9" tall which is more typical. I'll still have to cut the floor for the fill plate with the 8 gallon, but I think it will look pretty "sano". Any thoughts on the subject would be appreciated. Thanks, Dave H. From timmurph at fastbytes.com Mon Mar 8 21:05:34 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 22:05:34 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance Message-ID: <000f01cabf3d$c607a320$5216e960$@com> Thanks again for the replies. I loosened the center main block and "bumped" the crank back and forth to center the block, as suggested. Then retorqued it and checked for clearance and endplay. I still couldn't get much endplay trying to pry the crank front and back so I "wedged" it front and back using a big "tanker" screwdriver as the wedge between the center bearing block and the crank. That worked and I got .004 on the dial indicator and .005 with feeler gauges for clearance. Apparently it takes a bit of force to move the crank back and forward but I'm sure the clutch pushes even harder than my gently tapping the wedge in to move it. At least my measurements now make some sense. Still learning! Tim From kaskas at cox.net Mon Mar 8 21:07:37 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 20:07:37 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <20100308230737.67KIT.437808.imail@fed1rmwml46> I first met Sir Sterling at the old Riverside motel, the Caravan. He was just finished registering and I was just starting and we struck up a conversation, he spent twenty minutes with me just talking about British cars and was so charming, I could hardly believe it. He was driving an Aston Marti and was in a big slide into turn 8 with the brake lights on and in complete control ( or I thought so ) great driver. I hope he sees another twenty years, nice man and a great driver. ---- WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: ============= Hi guys, I just read that Stirling Moss was injured when he fell down an elevator shaft at his home. The doors evidently opened but there was a malfunction and the elevator car wasn't there. He then somehow fell down the shaft. The article said that he had surgery on his ankles and was banged up but did not have life threatening injuries. It said he fell 30 feet. Wow. I used to see him at the CanAm races where he was the J Wax spokesman. Got lots of free wax for the car. There was the time when Oscar's wife and Jack's wife took an empty J Wax can, cleaned it out, filled it with butterscotch pudding ( which looked about like the wax) and approached Stirling. One of them stuck her finger into the can, swirled it around, and after asking Moss how many calories were in it, plopped it into her mouth! Moss's eyes about came out of his head! Great moment. Hope he does OK. Bill _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From timmurph at fastbytes.com Mon Mar 8 21:36:55 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 22:36:55 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder In-Reply-To: <4B958EC4.8070606@twcny.rr.com> References: <4B958EC4.8070606@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <001901cabf42$265175e0$72f461a0$@com> Nice job! We have a similar scatter shield that came with the car but it's out of 5/16 plate! By the damage to the "doghouse" (the sheet metal was literally ripped apart) they blew a clutch big time once and made darn sure they wouldn't get hurt if it happened again. Ours isn't as slick as yours in that the plate isn't compound curved like yours. Ours is only used as a race car so the cockpit is pretty bare. The compound curve would tend to keep the "shrapnel" better contained I'd think. We do sort of like having that chunk of metal down by our feet though. Tim 1961 TR4 #317 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark Eginton Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 5:57 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder I was in Lowes and saw some 1/8" steel stock perfect for a scatter shield 3" wide so here is how I spent my weekend: http://www.flickr.com/photos/28599565 at N04 Think it will do the job or is there something I need to consider adding or changing. I plan to run my dad's lightened flywheel which visually has seen a lathe back in the '60s. I had it magnifluxed and it is fine but I still feel the need for a shield - I like being ambulatory... The idea is to keep the car the way he raced it - drive it to the track, pull the windshield and passenger seat - add a plexiglas deflection shield and go have fun. So, I wanted it to hide under the carpet. Thanks, M \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From tony at tonydrews.com Tue Mar 9 00:12:56 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 01:12:56 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Fuel cell size In-Reply-To: <1500220419.1684221268106852436.JavaMail.root@sz0047a.emery ville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <1500220419.1684221268106852436.JavaMail.root@sz0047a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <20100309071334.11AF318763F@autox.team.net> We couldn't go an hour without refueling with a 7 or 8 gallon fuel cell (can't remember which - it would start to run out at 45 minutes), so I went with a 12 gallon in my car so I could run an enduro without needing to refuel in the middle. - Tony Drews At 09:54 PM 3/8/2010, davehogye wrote: >Hello friends, >I'm in the market for a fuel cell for my TR3 race car. What is the >typical gallon size used for TRs. I've seen a few cars with 8 gallon >tanks and a couple with 10 and 12. ATL makes a cell called the "Well >Cell" that is 22"dia. and would fit nicely in the spare tire >compartment. They have an 8 and 12 gallon size. Both are 22"dia. but >the 8 gallon is only 6" tall and I think it will fit without cutting >the trunk floor out. The 12 gallon is 9" tall which is more typical. >I'll still have to cut the floor for the fill plate with the 8 >gallon, but I think it will look pretty "sano". Any thoughts on the >subject would be appreciated. >Thanks, >Dave H. >\ >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tony at tonydrews.com From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 9 01:28:36 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 09:28:36 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com> Sorry to hear this. I see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes race cars or Jag D-Types. I never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Mar 9 07:40:56 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 09:40:56 EST Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire Message-ID: In a message dated 03/08/2010 7:01:39 PM Central Standard Time, jerryvv at roadrunner.com writes: > Bill Dentinger and Bob Kramer may remember our tires that were used on > Skid-Steers and Variable Reach lift trucks. We were an OE option for > several > years on Case, New Holland, John Deere and BobCat equipment. > These days I have trouble remembering why I am chasing Shirley, but I think I remember those tires. Did they look like a tightly wound Rolodex? Bill Dentinger From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 07:42:14 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 09:42:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com> Message-ID: <8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand Prix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Sorry to hear this. see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes ace cars or Jag D-Types. never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From fasttrs at yahoo.com Tue Mar 9 08:05:46 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 07:05:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling carbon fiber TS Message-ID: <93598.70970.qm@web46103.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Carbon Fiber toilet seat?!!! Now THAT sounds like a good new project for ARE! Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 9, 2010, at 8:42 AM, n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand Prix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Sorry to hear this. see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes ace cars or Jag D-Types. never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 9 08:17:22 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 16:17:22 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com> <8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> What the hell is a = Bath???? Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] Gesendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 An: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand Prix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Sorry to hear this. I see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes race cars or Jag D-Types. I never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Mar 9 08:21:21 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 10:21:21 EST Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling Message-ID: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> In a message dated 03/08/2010 10:33:03 PM Central Standard Time, kaskas at cox.net writes: > I first met Sir Sterling at the old Riverside motel, the Caravan. He was > just finished registering and I was just starting and we struck up a > conversation, he spent twenty minutes with me just talking about British cars > and was so charming, I could hardly believe it. He was driving an Aston > Marti and was in a big slide into turn 8 with the brake lights on and in > complete control ( or I thought so ) great driver. I hope he sees another twenty > years, nice man and a great driver. > Kas... The chance that I might end up in the same race as Sir Sterling Moss borders on unthinkable, but in fact I've raced in the same race sessions with him at two events at ROAD AMERICA and one at BLACKHAWK FARMS (of all places). Ray Irwin hired him as the Grand Marshall of the first Blackhawk Vintage Classic. I stood next to him at several Driver's Meetings, where he was very accessible, and made you feel like...hey! We're all racers together here. 'Charming' is a good choice of words. He had clear concerns about the equipment and talent disparity in vintage racing, and how it should be dealt with. In particular he did not like seeing cars with slicks on the track at the same time as cars with treaded tires. But what I remember best is a Chicago Historic Races event at ROAD AMERICA when there was an ASTON MARTIN/FERRARI CHALLENGE. ASTON MARTIN and FERRARI both sent a gaggle of their museum pieces over here along with world class drivers (including Sir Sterling, who I think drove the DB2). I was in my TR3. I can't remember how many times he lapped me, but I sure remember how it happened each time. My car would be at top speed. I'd see this little green dot in my rear view mirror. I'd get ready. There is always a lot of me hanging out of my TR3, and I'd point my desire to be passed driver's left. In the blink of an eye he'd go by in a flash like I was standing still. The first time I was tempted to get out to see if perhaps I'd stopped. But after the pass there was always a big wave from Sir Sterling. He was a Class Act and very sensitive to us amateur vintage racers. That was a very big deal for me, and a fond memory. Bill Dentinger From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 08:21:18 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 10:21:18 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling carbon fiber TS In-Reply-To: <93598.70970.qm@web46103.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <93598.70970.qm@web46103.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CC8DB34D1771F8-611C-D630@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> There was a time when speed was an issue in the Water Closet. Mayo Clinic took care of that. Bill Babcock has one in his 'Aluminum Overcast' trailer...I think his is just a weight issue, tho. -----Original Message----- From: Mike Munson To: n197tr4 at cs.com Cc: tr4racing at googlemail.com ; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:05 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling carbon fiber TS Carbon Fiber toilet seat?!!! Now THAT sounds like a good new project for ARE! ike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 9, 2010, at 8:42 AM, n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk arms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv Uncle Jack. Joe ----Original Message----- rom: MadMarx o: fot at autox.team.net ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling orry to hear this. ee him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes ce cars or Jag D-Types. ever spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) hris ______________________________________________ t at autox.team.net nate: http://www.team.net/donate.html chive: http://www.team.net/archive rums: http://www.team.net/forums subscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 08:31:42 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 10:31:42 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com><8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> Message-ID: <8CC8DB4C0BC7F58-611C-D965@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling What the hell is a = Bath???? Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe ----Original Message----- rom: MadMarx o: fot at autox.team.net ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling orry to hear this. see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes ace cars or Jag D-Types. never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From billb at bnj.com Tue Mar 9 08:46:03 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 05:46:03 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> References: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> Message-ID: <0030A02D-E280-4D0E-884A-21C17ABA296F@bnj.com> You guys sound like you're doing an eulogy. Sir Stirling is a tough old bird. Reminds me of a Monty Python line: "I'm not dead yet". I've also had the pleasure of meeting him and his charming wife Suzy a few times. I hope to meet him again soon. From billb at bnj.com Tue Mar 9 08:53:57 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 05:53:57 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <0030A02D-E280-4D0E-884A-21C17ABA296F@bnj.com> References: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> <0030A02D-E280-4D0E-884A-21C17ABA296F@bnj.com> Message-ID: <5CCE3761-86B1-4CAE-9585-B47FA743117C@bnj.com> That's odd, the last part got lopped off. It said: Oh, and the reason for the Carbon Fibre seat of ease in Nero is simple--Carbon Fiber makes you go faster. On Mar 9, 2010, at 5:46 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: > You guys sound like you're doing an eulogy. Sir Stirling is a tough old bird. > Reminds me of a Monty Python line: "I'm not dead yet". > > I've also had the pleasure of meeting him and his charming wife Suzy a few > times. I hope to meet him again soon. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From kaskas at cox.net Tue Mar 9 09:43:41 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 8:43:41 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder In-Reply-To: <4B958EC4.8070606@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <20100309114341.HSXYP.382893.imail@fed1rmwml43> That method works okay, I have used it in the past and also using heavy belting. three inches isn't very wide but two pieces welded side to side should be great. History of blows up in that area showed me that it was the clutch that went away first and sometimes takes the flywheel with it. ---- Mark Eginton wrote: ============= I was in Lowes and saw some 1/8" steel stock perfect for a scatter shield 3" wide so here is how I spent my weekend: http://www.flickr.com/photos/28599565 at N04 Think it will do the job or is there something I need to consider adding or changing. I plan to run my dad's lightened flywheel which visually has seen a lathe back in the '60s. I had it magnifluxed and it is fine but I still feel the need for a shield - I like being ambulatory... The idea is to keep the car the way he raced it - drive it to the track, pull the windshield and passenger seat - add a plexiglas deflection shield and go have fun. So, I wanted it to hide under the carpet. Thanks, M _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Tue Mar 9 09:44:00 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 11:44:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com><8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> <8CC8DB4C0BC7F58-611C-D965@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Not to mention crapper, maned after the intrepid British guy who invented it. I read somewhere that he is now Sir Crapper. I'd type more but I have to use the can. The head for you sailers. Gotta go. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 10:31 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > > > What the hell is a = Bath???? > Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] > esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 > n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net > etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand > rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at > lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat > upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. > Joe > ----Original Message----- > rom: MadMarx > o: fot at autox.team.net > ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am > ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > orry to hear this. > see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes > ace cars or Jag D-Types. > never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) > Chris > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 09:47:11 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 11:47:11 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <8CC8DBF4C82B0F7-67A0-15A5@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> You dont have to get ANAL about this. -----Original Message----- From: WILLIAM TOBIN To: n197tr4 at cs.com; tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 10:44 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Not to mention crapper, maned after the intrepid British guy who invented t. I read somewhere that he is now Sir Crapper. I'd type more but I have to use the can. The head for you sailers. Gotta go. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 10:31 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > > > What the hell is a = Bath???? > Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] > esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 > n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net > etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba rand > rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at > lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat > upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. > Joe > ----Original Message----- > rom: MadMarx > o: fot at autox.team.net > ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am > ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > orry to hear this. > see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes > ace cars or Jag D-Types. > never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) > Chris > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: ttp://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 09:58:26 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 11:58:26 -0500 Subject: [Fot] HEARTLAND VINTAGE GRAND PRIX RAMADA / HOLIDAY INN / HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS Message-ID: <8CC8DC0DEA50812-67A0-1938@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> FOT, Entries are coming in for the KASTNER CUP......The host hotel is the Ramada Inn and rooms have been set aside for this event...just mention it in your reservation. The Holiday Inn and Holiday Inn Express are alternatives and are properties owned by the same corporation. Thanks! Joe A From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 9 10:09:48 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 18:09:48 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <20100309113831.2GC8Y.382799.imail@fed1rmwml43> References: <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> <20100309113831.2GC8Y.382799.imail@fed1rmwml43> Message-ID: <003901cabfab$54303a00$fc90ae00$@com> Seems that I have a lack of knowledge about house equipment in US language. -----UrsprC wrote: ============= What the hell is a = Bath???? Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] Gesendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 An: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand Prix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Sorry to hear this. I see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes race cars or Jag D-Types. I never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Tue Mar 9 10:22:57 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 12:22:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling References: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <8CC8DBF4C82B0F7-67A0-15A5@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <010d01cabfad$299357d0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Good one Joe!----- Original Message ----- From: n197tr4 at cs.com To: william.tobin3 at verizon.net ; tr4racing at googlemail.com ; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 11:47 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling You dont have to get ANAL about this. -----Original Message----- From: WILLIAM TOBIN To: n197tr4 at cs.com; tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 10:44 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Not to mention crapper, maned after the intrepid British guy who invented it. I read somewhere that he is now Sir Crapper. I'd type more but I have to use the can. The head for you sailers. Gotta go. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 10:31 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > > > What the hell is a = Bath???? > Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] > esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 > n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net > etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand > rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at > lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat > upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. > Joe > ----Original Message----- > rom: MadMarx > o: fot at autox.team.net > ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am > ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > orry to hear this. > see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes > ace cars or Jag D-Types. > never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) > Chris > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From emanteno at gmail.com Tue Mar 9 10:24:12 2010 From: emanteno at gmail.com (Irv Korey) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 11:24:12 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> References: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> Message-ID: <354a1781003090924k7cd879b1j6736167b10b3295b@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, Mar 9, 2010 at 9:21 AM, wrote: But what I remember best is a Chicago Historic Races event at ROAD AMERICA > when there was an ASTON MARTIN/FERRARI CHALLENGE. ASTON MARTIN and FERRARI both sent a > gaggle of their museum > pieces over here along with world class drivers (including Sir Sterling, > who I > think drove the DB2). I was in my TR3. I can't remember how many times he > lapped me, but I sure remember how it happened each time. My car would be > at > top speed. I'd see this little green dot in my rear view mirror. I'd get > ready. There is always a lot of me hanging out of my TR3, and I'd point my > desire to be passed driver's left. In the blink of an eye he'd go by in a > flash like I was standing still. The first time I was tempted to get out > to > see if perhaps I'd stopped. But after the pass there was always a big wave > from Sir Sterling. He was a Class Act and very sensitive to us amateur > vintage racers. That was a very big deal for me, and a fond memory. > That very race was my first as a corner worker. I remember that Aston very well from my vantage point at Corner 1 (back when we flagged from drivers' right in Corner 1). Every time he went by, he waved and smiled to the workers. What a wonderful memory. Irv From budscars at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 10:48:59 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 09:48:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling References: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> <0030A02D-E280-4D0E-884A-21C17ABA296F@bnj.com> Message-ID: Mark Twain.....Wrote an article in the Territorial Enterprise, Virginia city, NV..."The Reports Of My Death Have Been Greatly Exaggerated" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 7:46 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > You guys sound like you're doing an eulogy. Sir Stirling is a tough old > bird. > Reminds me of a Monty Python line: "I'm not dead yet". > > I've also had the pleasure of meeting him and his charming wife Suzy a few > times. I hope to meet him again soon. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 11:15:41 2010 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (toodamnfunky at comcast.net) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 18:15:41 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] HEARTLAND VINTAGE GRAND PRIX RAMADA / HOLIDAY INN / HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS In-Reply-To: <8CC8DC0DEA50812-67A0-1938@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <1115235081.2153891268158541675.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Joe, The Cup date is in direct conflict with an SCCA date in Colorado. Depending on where I'm at in the points will determine whether I can attend. I won't know until August. Will there be any problems with a late entry ? Thanks, Jim G. ----- Original Message ----- From: n197tr4 at cs.com To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2010 9:58:26 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain Subject: [Fot] HEARTLAND VINTAGE GRAND PRIX RAMADA / HOLIDAY INN / HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS FOT, Entries are coming in for the KASTNER CUP......The host hotel is the Ramada Inn and rooms have been set aside for this event...just mention it in your reservation. The Holiday Inn and Holiday Inn Express are alternatives and are properties owned by the same corporation. Thanks! B Joe A \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/toodamnfunky at comcast.net From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 11:32:04 2010 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 13:32:04 EST Subject: [Fot] HEARTLAND VINTAGE GRAND PRIX Message-ID: <206c5.4206a68c.38c7ee24@cs.com> Jim, There is no penalty for late entries for the FOT. Probably no one else, either. Early Entries would be appreciated, so we have a sense of where we are at. Indications are that this will be strongly attended by the FOT....all things considered, it is not a huge surprise. And we will be VERY WELL RECEIVED. Perhaps entries can be refunded fully intact. I will check on the policy regarding this. This is a first time event and should be VERY user friendly. Hope you can make it, but wish you well in SCCA points. Joe A > Joe, > The Cup date is in direct conflict with an SCCA date in Colorado. > Depending on where > I'm at in the points will determine whether I can attend. I won't know > until August. > Will there be any problems with a late entry ? > Thanks, > Jim G. > > From dlhogye at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 11:33:41 2010 From: dlhogye at comcast.net (davehogye) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 18:33:41 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Fuel cell info, Thanks Message-ID: <1628173668.1894981268159621482.JavaMail.root@sz0047a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Thanks guys for the information, photos and suggestions about fuel cells. The choice was kind of split down middle regarding size, but I don't think that I'd regret having more capacity available. Dave H. From wensley_tr at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 11:45:52 2010 From: wensley_tr at comcast.net (Craig) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 13:45:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com><8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> <8CC8DB4C0BC7F58-611C-D965@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <002001cabfb8$bed29580$3c77c080$@net> Don't forget pit stop Craig -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of WILLIAM TOBIN Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 11:44 AM To: n197tr4 at cs.com; tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Not to mention crapper, maned after the intrepid British guy who invented it. I read somewhere that he is now Sir Crapper. I'd type more but I have to use the can. The head for you sailers. Gotta go. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 10:31 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > > > What the hell is a = Bath???? > Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] > esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 > n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net > etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand > rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at > lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat > upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. > Joe > ----Original Message----- > rom: MadMarx > o: fot at autox.team.net > ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am > ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > orry to hear this. > see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes > ace cars or Jag D-Types. > never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) > Chris > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/wensley_tr at comcast.net From lang at isis.mit.edu Tue Mar 9 11:45:50 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 13:45:50 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Message from Sir Stirling (fwd) Message-ID: hey. Supposedly from Sir Stirling himself... BTW, neat web site (motorsportcollector.com) with kool stuff. NFI, of course. rml ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 12:20:31 -0500 (EST) From: The Motorsport Collector To: blang at mit.edu Subject: Message from Sir Stirling ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ March 9, 2010 Update: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Dear Robert, As most of you know, 80 year old Sir Stirling Moss stepped into an empty elevator shaft in his London home over the weekend, falling 3 stories, suffering broken bones in his feet and ankles and damaged vertebra. The good news is that Stirling's injuries are not life threatening and that his heart and mind (as well as his typing fingers) are as strong as ever. Stirling sent this email message to his many friends and fans around the world: ======================== TO ALL MY FRIENDS (AND ALL THOSE WHO ARE KIND ENOUGH TO CARE), DEAR ALL OF YOU, THE LAST FEW DAYS HAVE BEEN QUITE FANTASTIC AND I'D LIKE TO THANK EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU FOR YOUR KIND THOUGHTS, MESSAGES AND OTHER PARAPHERNALIA. ON SATURDAY EVENING, I WAS AT HOME WITH SUSIE, ELLIOT AND HELEN AND ABOUT TO LEAVE FOR A CURRY, FOR WHICH WE WERE RUNNING LATE. I ASKED HELEN TO JOIN ME IN THE LIFT TO GO DOWNSTAIRS, BECAUSE SUSIE AND ELLIOT WERE SMART ENOUGH NOT TO RIDE IN MY LIFT. I OPENED THE DOOR AND STEPPED INTO THE LIFT, WITH HELEN READY TO FOLLOW ME, WHICH SHE NEVER DID. THAT IS BECAUSE THE LIFT HAD STOPPED ON THE FLOOR ABOVE AND INCORRECTLY ALLOWED THE DOOR BENEATH IT TO OPEN. STILL CHATTING TO HELEN, I STEPPED INTO THE OPEN DOORWAY-- AND FELL TO THE BOTTOM OF THE LIFT SHAFT. THE AMBULANCE WAS CALLED AND ARRIVED AT RACING SPEED, WHEREUPON THEY PUT ME ONTO A SERIES OF ABOUT 10 STRETCHERS! HAVING FINALLY SETTLED ON WHAT MUST HAVE SEEMED A GOOD ONE, I WAS TAKEN, ALONG WITH MY FAMILY TO THE ROYAL LONDON HOSPITAL IN WHITECHAPEL, WHERE THEY USED ANOTHER BATCH OF SIMILAR STRETCHERS! THEY DID A GOOD JOB OF HELPING ME, BUT WERE UNABLE TO DO THE REQUISITE SURGERY. SO, ON THE SUNDAY, I WAS MOVED TO THE PRINCESS GRACE, WHERE A FANTASTICALLY EFFICIENT, KIND AND AMUSING STAFF DID ALL THE JOBS. I AM NOW IN A LOVELY ROOM, NUMBER 222, AND WITH THE HELP OF ELLIOT AND THE PORTER, AM FINALLY ON THE EMAIL. THAT DOES NOT MEAN THAT I WILL BE ABLE TO ACTUALLY SEND THIS TO YOU, BUT I WILL TRY! NOW FOR THE FUTURE... WHICH I CAN SEE WITH SUSIE, HELEN AND ELLIOT AROUND ME, IS GOING TO BE A BLOODY STRUGGLE! AS SOME OF YOU MAY KNOW, SUSIE AND I ARE BOOKED ON A SEABOURN CRUISE FOR OUR 30TH ANNIVERSARY, NEXT MONTH. I HAVE TO CROSS THE HURDLE OF GETTING THE DOCORS, AND FAMLY HANGERS-ON, TO ALLOW ME TO THIN MY BLOOD, IN ORDER TO AVOID ANY ISSUES INVOLVING DEEP VEIN THROMBOSIS. IT WILL BE SIX TO EIGHT WEEKS FROM SUNDAY BEFORE I WILL ABLE TO PUT ANY LOAD ON MY FEET. THEREFORE I'M FACING MY SIXTH OR SEVENTH REDUCTION TO A WHEELCHAIR (SUSIE SAYS SHE'S STOPPED COUNTING) WHICH I MUST ADMIT, IS RATHER BORING. THE GOOD NEWS IS; THAT I DIDN'T SELL THE WHEELCHAIR AFTER THE LAST SHUNT! THE WHOLE THING IS A REAL PAIN IN THE ARSE, IF I HAD LOOKED WHERE I WAS GOING, I WOULDN'T BE HERE AT ALL, SO IT'S MY OWN DAMN FAULT. I HAVE BEEN ABSOLUTELY OVERWHELMED BY YOUR COLLECTIVE CONCERN AND KINDNESS. I CAN TELL YOU THAT CURRENTLY I'M LYING IN HOSPITAL, TAKING DEEP BREATHS, LIFTING ONE ARM WITH THE OTHER, RAISING MY LEGS (WITH PLASTERS ON THE END) AND DOING ALL I CAN DO TO KEEP MYSELF AS MOBILE AS POSSIBLE, BUT, HAVING SAID THAT, I'M NOT YET WINNING THE BATTLE. I'M NOT SURE WHEN I'LL BE ABLE TO GO HOME BUT THE LIFT HAS TO WORK, OTHERWISE I'LL NEVER BE ABLE TO GET UPSTAIRS IN MY WHEELCHAIR, MAYBE I'LL GO AND STAY WITH HELEN AND ELLIOT FOR A WHILE... THIS REALLY HAS OPENED MY EYES TO HOW KIND ALL MY FRIENDS ARE, OVER AN OLD EX- RACING DRIVER, FLOGGING A FADING IMAGE! I LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOU SOON, MANY THANKS FOR ALL OF YOUR THOUGHTS, CIAO From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Tue Mar 9 16:02:40 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 18:02:40 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder In-Reply-To: <20100309114341.HSXYP.382893.imail@fed1rmwml43> References: <20100309114341.HSXYP.382893.imail@fed1rmwml43> Message-ID: <4B96D390.6090206@twcny.rr.com> Do I need to go a full 6" wide. I need more stock so narrower is easier to work with but no sense in scrimping if its necessary. Thanks! M Kas Kastner wrote: > That method works okay, I have used it in the past and also using heavy belting. three inches isn't very wide but two pieces welded side to side should be great. History of blows up in that area showed me that it was the clutch that went away first and sometimes takes the flywheel with it. > ---- Mark Eginton wrote: > > ============= > I was in Lowes and saw some 1/8" steel stock perfect for a scatter > shield 3" wide so here is how I spent my weekend: > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/28599565 at N04 > > Think it will do the job or is there something I need to consider adding > or changing. I plan to run my dad's lightened flywheel which visually > has seen a lathe back in the '60s. I had it magnifluxed and it is fine > but I still feel the need for a shield - I like being ambulatory... > > The idea is to keep the car the way he raced it - drive it to the track, > pull the windshield and passenger seat - add a plexiglas deflection > shield and go have fun. So, I wanted it to hide under the carpet. > > Thanks, > > M > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net > > > > -- > Never be beaten by equipment From mdhado at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 18:39:00 2010 From: mdhado at comcast.net (M&M Hado) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 19:39:00 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance In-Reply-To: <000f01cabf3d$c607a320$5216e960$@com> Message-ID: Hi Tim, Just some more food for thought. No, it should NOT take a lot of force at all to move the crank fore & aft. I'm doing my 3B now and also a TR4 for a friend at the same time and I can push the crank with my fingers alone on one of the crank webs. Do you have the front & rear bearing caps on as well? It sounds to me like your bearing bores are no longer lined up and the crank journals are binding a bit in the bearings. If this is the case with yours, a simple line bore at a machine shop will do wonders. What they do is take off a few thousands of an inch off the bearing cap split lines which lowers them by that much (and makes then slightly egg-shape), and then "line bore" through all three caps at the same time with a long hone back to the original diameter. They are now concentric. This is before putting in the liners, of course. I think I paid about $125 the last time I had it done. Think about the crank sitting in the bearings with .002" clearance or so and, if you really have a straight line, the crank will move VERY easily because of that clearance. It should not bind at all. Also, I agree wholeheartedly about bumping the crank back and forth to "set" the center cap to where the upper and lower halves of the thrust washer are in the same plane. The last bump should be forward, which is the normal direction of thrust. The rear thrust ring is the one that does all of the work when you push on the clutch. Good luck! Mike Hado -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Tim Murphy Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 10:06 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Cc: rpm724 at att.net; ryan.murphy at fdlco.wi.gov Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance Thanks again for the replies. I loosened the center main block and "bumped" the crank back and forth to center the block, as suggested. Then retorqued it and checked for clearance and endplay. I still couldn't get much endplay trying to pry the crank front and back so I "wedged" it front and back using a big "tanker" screwdriver as the wedge between the center bearing block and the crank. That worked and I got .004 on the dial indicator and .005 with feeler gauges for clearance. Apparently it takes a bit of force to move the crank back and forward but I'm sure the clutch pushes even harder than my gently tapping the wedge in to move it. At least my measurements now make some sense. Still learning! Tim \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mdhado at comcast.net From timmurph at fastbytes.com Tue Mar 9 20:15:56 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 21:15:56 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance In-Reply-To: References: <000f01cabf3d$c607a320$5216e960$@com> Message-ID: <002301cac000$009fdc10$01df9430$@com> Good point about pushing it forward in the same direction as the clutch force. When I first did the fore/aft bit to look for end play I just had the center bearing in. The second time I had the center and front bearing in. Even with all 3 mains installed and the rods not yet connected the crank rotated VERY (sorry for the caps, my underline doesn't work on a reply) freely, so I don't think there is any binding in the bearings. Not sure what is going on. I'm pretty sure it will run okay as the new thrust bearings are the same thickness within less than a half thou of the old ones and they worked okay. And the last two times I installed the crank I didn't "center" the center bearing block as I did upon the suggestions this time. Must have gotten lucky! Tim -----Original Message----- From: M&M Hado [mailto:mdhado at comcast.net] Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 7:39 PM To: Tim Murphy Cc: rpm724 at att.net; ryan.murphy at fdlco.wi.gov; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance Hi Tim, Just some more food for thought. No, it should NOT take a lot of force at all to move the crank fore & aft. I'm doing my 3B now and also a TR4 for a friend at the same time and I can push the crank with my fingers alone on one of the crank webs. Do you have the front & rear bearing caps on as well? It sounds to me like your bearing bores are no longer lined up and the crank journals are binding a bit in the bearings. If this is the case with yours, a simple line bore at a machine shop will do wonders. What they do is take off a few thousands of an inch off the bearing cap split lines which lowers them by that much (and makes then slightly egg-shape), and then "line bore" through all three caps at the same time with a long hone back to the original diameter. They are now concentric. This is before putting in the liners, of course. I think I paid about $125 the last time I had it done. Think about the crank sitting in the bearings with .002" clearance or so and, if you really have a straight line, the crank will move VERY easily because of that clearance. It should not bind at all. Also, I agree wholeheartedly about bumping the crank back and forth to "set" the center cap to where the upper and lower halves of the thrust washer are in the same plane. The last bump should be forward, which is the normal direction of thrust. The rear thrust ring is the one that does all of the work when you push on the clutch. Good luck! Mike Hado -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Tim Murphy Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 10:06 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Cc: rpm724 at att.net; ryan.murphy at fdlco.wi.gov Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance Thanks again for the replies. I loosened the center main block and "bumped" the crank back and forth to center the block, as suggested. Then retorqued it and checked for clearance and endplay. I still couldn't get much endplay trying to pry the crank front and back so I "wedged" it front and back using a big "tanker" screwdriver as the wedge between the center bearing block and the crank. That worked and I got .004 on the dial indicator and .005 with feeler gauges for clearance. Apparently it takes a bit of force to move the crank back and forward but I'm sure the clutch pushes even harder than my gently tapping the wedge in to move it. At least my measurements now make some sense. Still learning! Tim \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mdhado at comcast.net From mpendy at dishmail.net Tue Mar 9 20:28:26 2010 From: mpendy at dishmail.net (Mark Pendergrass) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 19:28:26 -0800 Subject: [Fot] webers-manifold Message-ID: FoTer's, had enough horseing around with these hogged-out SU's, looking to see if i find a set of webers and intake for the tr4 . For a race motor, can a guy get the 40's to work well or do i need to step up to the ? Any input would be helpful.....Thanks.....Mark P From rjohns at woh.rr.com Tue Mar 9 21:17:25 2010 From: rjohns at woh.rr.com (Robert Johns) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 23:17:25 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling ( Bob Johns) Message-ID: I enjoyed all the old stories about all of your memories of seeing and meeting Stirling, so I might as well tell my story. In 1955, I had some time to run up to the Nurburgring to get in a few practice laps. When I got there, some factory had the course engaged for practice. I don't remember what team. That isn't important. I was walking around the pit lane and ran into Stirling, also, just standing around at the moment. We talked, and after a bit, he said, "Let's go get a cup of coffee." So, we went across the course to the hotel cafe and sat and enjoyed a cup together. He has always been that easy to access and talk to. This has always been one of my fondest memories of my time in Europe. Bob J From tr4racing at googlemail.com Wed Mar 10 01:28:13 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:28:13 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable chain wheels In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000701cac02b$a1189530$e349bf90$@com> Just a thought. (I hope I get this explained well) There were some worn out distributor drives in the past where the teeth on the cam gear has gone thin and broke after a while. Were on these cams adjustable chain wheels mounted with an aluminum center mounting plate? I saw one of these adjustable chain wheels with aluminum center plate that has worn out at the contact spot with the bearing housing. The cam started floating from that and this might damage the gears after a while. The chain wheel needs only a few races to wear out. There are adjustable chain wheels with steel center plate that should not cause this trouble. Might worth to check your wheels if they have some future trouble in store. Cheers Chris From yellow-green at sbcglobal.net Wed Mar 10 06:37:25 2010 From: yellow-green at sbcglobal.net (Dennis DeLap) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 05:37:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> Message-ID: <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Friends Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line system. This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid to the front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was eliminated. Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. Thanks Dennis From tr4racing at googlemail.com Wed Mar 10 06:47:47 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 14:47:47 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000b01cac058$46c4d440$d44e7cc0$@com> In combination with the rear brakes this restrictor valve takes car that the linings of the front brake don't move away from the rotors. You get less pedal travel with that valve installed. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Dennis DeLap Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 14:37 An: FOT Betreff: [Fot] Restrictor Valve Friends Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line system. This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid to the front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was eliminated. Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. Thanks Dennis \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From mlcooknj at msn.com Wed Mar 10 07:41:18 2010 From: mlcooknj at msn.com (michael cook) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:41:18 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling ( Bob Johns) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I was fortunate to meet Moss at one of the Jaguar launch events he attended over here. It was particular fun to see him get into a car and immediately slam the seat back, giving him the room for his straight-arm driving style. He did this regardless of whether it was a brand-new XJ or a vintage Mark VII or S-type. But my favorite Moss story isn't about Stirling. At Nelson Ledges for the 24-hour back in the 1980s, driver Innes Ireland wandered the paddock wearing a T-shirt that said: "I TAUGHT STIRLING MOSS HOW TO DRIVE" The following year, Ireland had a new shirt saying: "I TAUGHT STIRLING MOSS HOW TO DRINK" But of course he didn't - Moss doesn't drink ... never has. Mike Cook > From: rjohns at woh.rr.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 23:17:25 -0500 > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling ( Bob Johns) > > I enjoyed all the old stories about all of your memories of seeing and meeting > Stirling, so I might as well tell my story. In 1955, I had some time to run > up to the Nurburgring to get in a few practice laps. When I got there, some > factory had the course engaged for practice. I don't remember what team. > That isn't important. I was walking around the pit lane and ran into > Stirling, also, just standing around at the moment. We talked, and after a > bit, he said, "Let's go get a cup of coffee." So, we went across the course > to the hotel cafe and sat and enjoyed a cup together. He has always been that > easy to access and talk to. This has always been one of my fondest memories of > my time in Europe. > Bob J > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mlcooknj at msn.com From cwnfot at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 08:18:07 2010 From: cwnfot at gmail.com (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 10:18:07 -0500 Subject: [Fot] FW: Message from Sir Stirling Moss Message-ID: <006a01cac064$e520b8f0$af622ad0$@com> As most of you know, 80 year old Sir Stirling Moss stepped into an empty elevator shaft in his London home over the weekend, falling 3 stories, suffering broken bones in his feet and ankles and damaged vertebra. The good news is that Stirling's injuries are not life threatening and that his heart and mind (as well as his typing fingers) are as strong as ever. Stirling sent this email message to his many friends and fans around the world: ======================== TO ALL MY FRIENDS (AND ALL THOSE WHO ARE KIND ENOUGH TO CARE), DEAR ALL OF YOU, THE LAST FEW DAYS HAVE BEEN QUITE FANTASTIC AND I'D LIKE TO THANK EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU FOR YOUR KIND THOUGHTS, MESSAGES AND OTHER PARAPHERNALIA. ON SATURDAY EVENING, I WAS AT HOME WITH SUSIE, ELLIOT AND HELEN AND ABOUT TO LEAVE FOR A CURRY, FOR WHICH WE WERE RUNNING LATE. I ASKED HELEN TO JOIN ME IN THE LIFT TO GO DOWNSTAIRS, BECAUSE SUSIE AND ELLIOT WERE SMART ENOUGH NOT TO RIDE IN MY LIFT. I OPENED THE DOOR AND STEPPED INTO THE LIFT, WITH HELEN READY TO FOLLOW ME, WHICH SHE NEVER DID. THAT IS BECAUSE THE LIFT HAD STOPPED ON THE FLOOR ABOVE AND INCORRECTLY ALLOWED THE DOOR BENEATH IT TO OPEN. STILL CHATTING TO HELEN, I STEPPED INTO THE OPEN DOORWAY-- AND FELL TO THE BOTTOM OF THE LIFT SHAFT. THE AMBULANCE WAS CALLED AND ARRIVED AT RACING SPEED, WHEREUPON THEY PUT ME ONTO A SERIES OF ABOUT 10 STRETCHERS! HAVING FINALLY SETTLED ON WHAT MUST HAVE SEEMED A GOOD ONE, I WAS TAKEN, ALONG WITH MY FAMILY TO THE ROYAL LONDON HOSPITAL IN WHITECHAPEL, WHERE THEY USED ANOTHER BATCH OF SIMILAR STRETCHERS! THEY DID A GOOD JOB OF HELPING ME, BUT WERE UNABLE TO DO THE REQUISITE SURGERY. SO, ON THE SUNDAY, I WAS MOVED TO THE PRINCESS GRACE, WHERE A FANTASTICALLY EFFICIENT, KIND AND AMUSING STAFF DID ALL THE JOBS. I AM NOW IN A LOVELY ROOM, NUMBER 222, AND WITH THE HELP OF ELLIOT AND THE PORTER, AM FINALLY ON THE EMAIL. THAT DOES NOT MEAN THAT I WILL BE ABLE TO ACTUALLY SEND THIS TO YOU, BUT I WILL TRY! NOW FOR THE FUTURE... WHICH I CAN SEE WITH SUSIE, HELEN AND ELLIOT AROUND ME, IS GOING TO BE A BLOODY STRUGGLE! AS SOME OF YOU MAY KNOW, SUSIE AND I ARE BOOKED ON A SEABOURN CRUISE FOR OUR 30TH ANNIVERSARY, NEXT MONTH. I HAVE TO CROSS THE HURDLE OF GETTING THE DOCORS, AND FAMLY HANGERS-ON, TO ALLOW ME TO THIN MY BLOOD, IN ORDER TO AVOID ANY ISSUES INVOLVING DEEP VEIN THROMBOSIS. IT WILL BE SIX TO EIGHT WEEKS FROM SUNDAY BEFORE I WILL ABLE TO PUT ANY LOAD ON MY FEET. THEREFORE I'M FACING MY SIXTH OR SEVENTH REDUCTION TO A WHEELCHAIR (SUSIE SAYS SHE'S STOPPED COUNTING) WHICH I MUST ADMIT, IS RATHER BORING. THE GOOD NEWS IS; THAT I DIDN'T SELL THE WHEELCHAIR AFTER THE LAST SHUNT! THE WHOLE THING IS A REAL PAIN IN THE ARSE, IF I HAD LOOKED WHERE I WAS GOING, I WOULDN'T BE HERE AT ALL, SO IT'S MY OWN DAMN FAULT. I HAVE BEEN ABSOLUTELY OVERWHELMED BY YOUR COLLECTIVE CONCERN AND KINDNESS. I CAN TELL YOU THAT CURRENTLY I'M LYING IN HOSPITAL, TAKING DEEP BREATHS, LIFTING ONE ARM WITH THE OTHER, RAISING MY LEGS (WITH PLASTERS ON THE END) AND DOING ALL I CAN DO TO KEEP MYSELF AS MOBILE AS POSSIBLE, BUT, HAVING SAID THAT, I'M NOT YET WINNING THE BATTLE. I'M NOT SURE WHEN I'LL BE ABLE TO GO HOME BUT THE LIFT HAS TO WORK, OTHERWISE I'LL NEVER BE ABLE TO GET UPSTAIRS IN MY WHEELCHAIR, MAYBE I'LL GO AND STAY WITH HELEN AND ELLIOT FOR A WHILE... THIS REALLY HAS OPENED MY EYES TO HOW KIND ALL MY FRIENDS ARE, OVER AN OLD EX- RACING DRIVER, FLOGGING A FADING IMAGE! I LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOU SOON, MANY THANKS FOR ALL OF YOUR THOUGHTS, CIAO ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ This email came from Paul at the MotorSportCollector. email: pz at motorsportcollector.com phone: 630.515.1440 web: http://www.motorsportcollector.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From billb at bnj.com Wed Mar 10 08:38:16 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 05:38:16 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> It's a typical disk brake residual pressure valve that keeps a few pounds of pressure on the calipers to keep the pads from withdrawing too much. On Mar 10, 2010, at 3:37 AM, Dennis DeLap wrote: > Friends > > Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what > Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line system. > This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid to the > front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was eliminated. > Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. > > Thanks > Dennis > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Wed Mar 10 08:44:02 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 07:44:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <069f01cac068$82c9b770$0301a8c0@randall> > Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. It's more accurately called a residual pressure valve; it basically keeps the front brake pistons from being knocked back into the caliper when the spindle flexes. If you simply disable it as many do, the brake pedal may be low after a hard turn. A better solution IMO is the spacers and uprated spindles developed by uncle jack. http://www.zeni.net/trf/TR6-250GC/119.php?s_wt=1680&s_ht=1050 These address the root of the problem, rather than band-aiding the symptom. Randall From tony at tonydrews.com Wed Mar 10 08:59:34 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:59:34 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> Message-ID: <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> If you're converting from a single circuit brake system to a dual circuit one, that valve would stay in the front brake circuit. It's not needed in the rear brake circuit. - Tony At 09:38 AM 3/10/2010, you wrote: >It's a typical disk brake residual pressure valve that keeps a few pounds of >pressure on the calipers to keep the pads from withdrawing too much. >On Mar 10, 2010, at 3:37 AM, Dennis DeLap wrote: > > > Friends > > > > Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what > > Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line >system. > > This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid to >the > > front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was >eliminated. > > Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. > > > > Thanks > > Dennis > > \ From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 10 10:26:40 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 10:26:40 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Message-ID: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> Well, it might be interesting to one or two folks on this list: http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 mjb. From tlizzard at msn.com Wed Mar 10 10:28:47 2010 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 12:28:47 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> Message-ID: I miss those cars and the whole climate of IMSA racing at that time. Watched them run at Mid Ohio many times. Thanks for the heads up. Terry Stetler From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 10 11:14:17 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 11:14:17 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4B97E179.6050908@bradakis.com> Terry Stetler wrote: > I miss those cars and the whole climate of IMSA racing at that time. Watched > them run at Mid Ohio many times. > > I only saw them run once at Sears Point in '84. I recall the Mazda rotary had a rather unpleasant howl, but the cars were fun to watch. This Nissan would be a great toy, but I don't think I'll be getting enough Team.Net donations this week to cover it, shucks. mjb. From BillDentin at aol.com Wed Mar 10 11:20:15 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 13:20:15 EST Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Message-ID: <1f0dd.6c66645f.38c93cdf@aol.com> In a message dated 03/10/2010 12:10:44 PM Central Standard Time, mark at bradakis.com writes: > I only saw them run once at Sears Point in '84. I recall the Mazda > rotary had > a rather unpleasant howl, but the cars were fun to watch. > > This Nissan would be a great toy, but I don't think I'll be getting > enough Team.Net donations this week to cover it, shucks. > > Terry... I don't remember if they were there any of the times you have been wrenching at ROAD AMERICA, but for a while two of those NISSAN cars used to paddock along the fence next to the entrance to the False Grid, and right across the road from our traditional paddock space (especially at the SVRA and BRIC) vintage events. The first time I saw one, I smiled at seeing one at a 'vintage' event, and sent Kas a picture saying, "Look what's parked across the road from us at a 'vintage' event." All Kas wanted to know was, "...is she still FAST?" And of course she was. Bill Dentinger From koblinger at verizon.net Wed Mar 10 11:26:37 2010 From: koblinger at verizon.net (koblinger at verizon.net) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 12:26:37 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Message-ID: <1684428337.316294.1268245597223.JavaMail.root@vms244.mailsrvcs.net> From riverside at southslope.net Wed Mar 10 11:33:10 2010 From: riverside at southslope.net (riverside) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 12:33:10 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We didn't have no on board telemetry. Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight was considered proof that i had been too damn slow in the previous corner. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Drews" To: "Dennis Delap" ; Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2010 9:59 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > If you're converting from a single circuit brake system to a dual circuit > one, that valve would stay in the front brake circuit. It's not needed in > the rear brake circuit. > > - Tony > > At 09:38 AM 3/10/2010, you wrote: >>It's a typical disk brake residual pressure valve that keeps a few pounds >>of >>pressure on the calipers to keep the pads from withdrawing too much. >>On Mar 10, 2010, at 3:37 AM, Dennis DeLap wrote: >> >> > Friends >> > >> > Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what >> > Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line >>system. >> > This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid >> > to >>the >> > front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was >>eliminated. >> > Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. >> > >> > Thanks >> > Dennis >> > \ > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net From billb at bnj.com Wed Mar 10 12:23:56 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:23:56 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Message-ID: <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> That's about right, unless you're using the uprated axle setup. The residual pressure valve only helps a little. I don't use any residual pressure on Peyote (I think--I MIGHT have left the valve in that Wilwoods come with) but with the uprated axle I get a high pedal pretty consistently. I like that. pumping brakes doesn't give confidence entering fast corners. On Mar 10, 2010, at 8:33 AM, riverside wrote: > My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We > didn't have no on board telemetry. > > Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight > was considered proof that i had been too damn slow > in the previous corner. > > art de armond From tr4racing at googlemail.com Wed Mar 10 14:32:09 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 22:32:09 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> Message-ID: <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> I don't use any axle upgrade and don't have a long pedal. I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. Since I use ATE blue all trouble is gone. ATE + EBC brake pads doing a fine job at my car. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Bill Babcock Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 20:24 An: riverside Cc: fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve That's about right, unless you're using the uprated axle setup. The residual pressure valve only helps a little. I don't use any residual pressure on Peyote (I think--I MIGHT have left the valve in that Wilwoods come with) but with the uprated axle I get a high pedal pretty consistently. I like that. pumping brakes doesn't give confidence entering fast corners. On Mar 10, 2010, at 8:33 AM, riverside wrote: > My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We > didn't have no on board telemetry. > > Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight > was considered proof that i had been too damn slow > in the previous corner. > > art de armond _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From billb at bnj.com Wed Mar 10 14:55:40 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 11:55:40 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> Message-ID: The residual pressure valve helps, and you can do as I used to do and fit a stronger one if it's not enough, but your pads will drag a little. I think the biggest advantage of the uprated axle is the ability to shim the bearings for a precise preload and then torque the nut tight. I get a very free=spinning wheel that doesn't wobble and doesn't knock the pads back. Everything helps, but all these things are compromises. On Mar 10, 2010, at 11:32 AM, MadMarx wrote: > I don't use any axle upgrade and don't have a long pedal. > I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. > All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. > Since I use ATE blue all trouble is gone. > ATE + EBC brake pads doing a fine job at my car. > > Cheers > Chris > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Bill Babcock > Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 20:24 > An: riverside > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > That's about right, unless you're using the uprated axle setup. The residual > pressure valve only helps a little. I don't use any residual pressure on > Peyote (I think--I MIGHT have left the valve in that Wilwoods come with) but > with the uprated axle I get a high pedal pretty consistently. I like that. > pumping brakes doesn't give confidence entering fast corners. > > On Mar 10, 2010, at 8:33 AM, riverside wrote: > >> My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We >> didn't have no on board telemetry. >> >> Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight >> was considered proof that i had been too damn slow >> in the previous corner. >> >> art de armond > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tr4racing at googlemail.com Wed Mar 10 15:41:10 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 23:41:10 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> Message-ID: <000601cac0a2$ca2b49f0$5e81ddd0$@com> Maybe the cornering speed is in the game too? My car might not getting fast enough to have trouble with the front axle. This year I have a go with a new cam that might boost the engine power. Maybe this year trouble starts with the brake system. Always you limb in racing speed new problems you are facing. -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: Bill Babcock [mailto:billb at bnj.com] Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 22:56 An: MadMarx Cc: fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve The residual pressure valve helps, and you can do as I used to do and fit a stronger one if it's not enough, but your pads will drag a little. I think the biggest advantage of the uprated axle is the ability to shim the bearings for a precise preload and then torque the nut tight. I get a very free=spinning wheel that doesn't wobble and doesn't knock the pads back. Everything helps, but all these things are compromises. On Mar 10, 2010, at 11:32 AM, MadMarx wrote: > I don't use any axle upgrade and don't have a long pedal. > I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. > All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. > Since I use ATE blue all trouble is gone. > ATE + EBC brake pads doing a fine job at my car. > > Cheers > Chris > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Bill Babcock > Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 20:24 > An: riverside > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > That's about right, unless you're using the uprated axle setup. The residual > pressure valve only helps a little. I don't use any residual pressure on > Peyote (I think--I MIGHT have left the valve in that Wilwoods come with) but > with the uprated axle I get a high pedal pretty consistently. I like that. > pumping brakes doesn't give confidence entering fast corners. > > On Mar 10, 2010, at 8:33 AM, riverside wrote: > >> My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We >> didn't have no on board telemetry. >> >> Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight >> was considered proof that i had been too damn slow >> in the previous corner. >> >> art de armond > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Wed Mar 10 18:21:21 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 17:21:21 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> Message-ID: <04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> > I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. > All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. Just curious, Chris, don't you think there is a connection there? Dragging brakes and excess heat? Possibly my RPV was malfunctioning, but I could feel the drag after releasing the brake pedal, and the front brakes would be hot after a run, even if I used the handbrake to stop at the end. -- Randall From igofaster at att.net Wed Mar 10 22:08:00 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 21:08:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... Message-ID: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... I need to plumb a 1" inside diameter hose from the crankcase (90 degree) and a 1" inside diameter hose to my catch tank. I don't understand the terminology of the references on the likes of the Earl brand hose connectors ... like -8AN -6AN etc.... In the need to know... the crank vent needs to come from the fuel cover plate and take a 90 degree short run. I think I just need to drill out the valve cover and have a 1" connection to my catch tank which will also need to short 90 degree receivers to catch the blow by from my 1" i.d. hoses.... please don't think I'm dumb... I'm still learning.... Bobby Whitehead #39 1970 Triumph GT6 DP #87 1965 Triumph Spitfire EP From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Wed Mar 10 22:24:06 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 21:24:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down force that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was scary to drive. I had so much power.. Pretty fun discussion. Mike Mehl ________________________________ From: Mark J Bradakis To: Friends of Triumph Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Well, it might be interesting to one or two folks on this list: http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 mjb. \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From koblinger at verizon.net Wed Mar 10 22:33:46 2010 From: koblinger at verizon.net (Kurt Oblinger) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 21:33:46 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> <156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4B9880BA.2020706@verizon.net> Here is a pic I shot at Riverside's Turn 6 of the Electramotive Nissan. EFR is in the car and Brabham was co-driver. I don't recall the year. Maybe the same car or a variation thereof. They were great cars and indecently fast! http://yfrog.com/egnissangtpj Cheers, Kurt O. Mike Mehl wrote: > driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the > Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the > induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down force > that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was > scary to drive. I had so much power.. > > Pretty fun discussion. > > Mike Mehl > ________________________________ > From: Mark J Bradakis > To: > Friends of Triumph > Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM > Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting > > Well, it might be interesting to > one or two folks on this list: > > http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 > > mjb. > \ > _______________________________________________ From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 10 23:53:53 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 23:53:53 -0700 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4B989381.6030608@bradakis.com> The AN spec ( Army - Navy ) sizes are based on 1/16th of an inch. A -4 is 4/16ths ID, or 1/4 inch. -6 is 6/16ths. or 3/8ths. AN flares are 37 degree cones, and are good for many make and break cycles without leaking. Pegasus ( pegasusautoracing.com ) has some technical info on their web page, as I recall, which might prove helpful. I've not looked at it in a while. mjb. From tr4racing at googlemail.com Thu Mar 11 01:19:03 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:19:03 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> <04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> Message-ID: <000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Hi Randall, I don't think so. My brakes move freely. If I push them from hand with the wheel on, they rotate about 3-4 times before the wheel stops. We have some tracks which are hard on the brakes...like Hockenheim, Zandvoort. Some of the brake bias is directed to the rear, even then the front has vapor lock if I use normal DOT4 fluid. But as I said, with the performance brake fluid all trouble is gone. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Randall Gesendet: Donnerstag, 11. Mdrz 2010 02:21 Cc: fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. > All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. Just curious, Chris, don't you think there is a connection there? Dragging brakes and excess heat? Possibly my RPV was malfunctioning, but I could feel the drag after releasing the brake pedal, and the front brakes would be hot after a run, even if I used the handbrake to stop at the end. -- Randall _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Thu Mar 11 06:08:48 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 07:08:48 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com><000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com><04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> <000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Message-ID: I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only assume that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. I had spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if everyone is frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "MadMarx" To: "'Randall'" Cc: Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve From tr4racing at googlemail.com Thu Mar 11 06:38:07 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:38:07 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com><000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com><04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> <000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Message-ID: <003801cac120$16f17e80$44d47b80$@com> I also have crisp dust cover seals after a race. I use heat shields with medium success on this issue. The inner seals also fail but they do from the pistons which lost some of their chrome coatings. I now use inox pistons and hope for the best. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Bob Kramer Gesendet: Donnerstag, 11. Mdrz 2010 14:09 Cc: fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only assume that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. I had spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if everyone is frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "MadMarx" To: "'Randall'" Cc: Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From mpendy at dishmail.net Thu Mar 11 06:59:36 2010 From: mpendy at dishmail.net (Mark Pendergrass) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 05:59:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com><000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com><04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com><000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Message-ID: Bob, i dont' even bother with the boot seals, like you said, they may last one or two race weekends, i did say maybe..........MP ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Kramer" Cc: Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 5:08 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they > last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and > rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner > ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling > to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only > assume that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. > I had spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if > everyone is frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years > of racing. > > Bob Kramer > Volente, TX > > Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch > excellence. > Vince Lombardi > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "MadMarx" > To: "'Randall'" > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mpendy at dishmail.net From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Thu Mar 11 07:25:36 2010 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 06:25:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <83432.52222.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Bobby: Speedway Motors also has a good explanation and lower prices than Pegasus; speedwaymotors.com . Of course, it's hard to beat the prices at Jegs or Summit. I think their volume is just so high they get a better break. -Ed- --- On Wed, 3/10/10, Bobby Whitehead wrote: From: Bobby Whitehead Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... To: "FoT Triumph" Date: Wednesday, March 10, 2010, 11:08 PM Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... I need to plumb a 1" inside diameter hose from the crankcase (90 degree) and a 1" inside diameter hose to my catch tank. I don't understand the terminology of the references on the likes of the Earl brand hose connectors ... like -8AN -6AN etc.... In the need to know... the crank vent needs to come from the fuel cover plate and take a 90 degree short run. I think I just need to drill out the valve cover and have a 1" connection to my catch tank which will also need to short 90 degree receivers to catch the blow by from my 1" i.d. hoses.... please don't think I'm dumb... I'm still learning.... Bobby Whitehead #39 1970 Triumph GT6 DP #87 1965 Triumph Spitfire EP _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net From tjwakeman at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 08:11:41 2010 From: tjwakeman at gmail.com (TeriAnn J. Wakeman) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 07:11:41 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> Bobby Whitehead wrote: > Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... > I very highly recommend a book titled: Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI Publishing Company, copyright 1990. Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the effort. Teriann From cartravel at pobox.com Thu Mar 11 08:11:19 2010 From: cartravel at pobox.com (Larry Young) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:11:19 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com><000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com><04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> <000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Message-ID: <4B990817.4010802@pobox.com> I always thought brake rebuilds were one of those things you "should" do once a year. Not that I ever did it that frequently. For a race car, I think the dust boots are a waste of time, so I quit using them. Larry Bob Kramer wrote: > I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long > they last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends > racing and rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers > have one inner ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots > were crispy, crumbling to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had > heat damage. I can only assume that the little rubber seal between the > halfs is also heat damaged. I had spares ready so the job is done but > I'm just a bit curious if everyone is frying these like I am. Mine > were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. > > Bob Kramer > Volente, TX From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Thu Mar 11 08:31:59 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (jerryvv at roadrunner.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 10:31:59 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20100311153159.OXBOV.264151.root@cdptpa-web03-z01> Bob, a bigger question is do we know that the current product is being molded from the proper rubber compound. That certainly applies to many of the rubber bits that are used in non-performance applications and I suspect on some of our engine and transmission mounts that are now being made in unknown foreign factories. Rubber compounds are designed for specific applications and heat and fluid resistance are two of the most critical conditions that rubber development is focused around. I believe Neoprene is the polymer of choice for brake components however that's just a starting point. From there a specific compound is developed using the base polymer. Once the compound is developed testing is done to what's known as a Line Call out to certify that the compound meets the design requirements. I certainly hope that these rebuild kits are still being manufactured by Girling or Lucas or some other reputable supplier. A no name box would give me concern. I've seen a few of those with brake parts in them. Not to mention the assumed liability. JVV ---- Bob Kramer wrote: > I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they > last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and > rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner > ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling > to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only assume > that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. I had > spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if everyone is > frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. > > Bob Kramer > Volente, TX > > Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch > excellence. > Vince Lombardi > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "MadMarx" > To: "'Randall'" > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com From timmurph at fastbytes.com Thu Mar 11 08:43:14 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:43:14 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000001cac131$913bbcd0$b3b33670$@com> I'll second that, Teriann. Fascinating book and well worth the time. One further note, either on the FOT or someplace else awhile back, mention was made of "knock-off" -AN fittings that failed. It is worth the extra bit to get branded fittings such as Aeroquip or XRP so that you know what you are getting. Don't necessarily get the cheapest ones you can find. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of TeriAnn J. Wakeman Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:12 AM To: FOT Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... Bobby Whitehead wrote: > Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... > I very highly recommend a book titled: Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI Publishing Company, copyright 1990. Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the effort. Teriann _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From timmurph at fastbytes.com Thu Mar 11 08:52:27 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:52:27 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <20100311153159.OXBOV.264151.root@cdptpa-web03-z01> References: <20100311153159.OXBOV.264151.root@cdptpa-web03-z01> Message-ID: <000101cac132$dbefc590$93cf50b0$@com> Good point. I had a discussion with Jack Drews regarding the seals from Moss and he questioned whether or not they were the same "type" as the original because they only seemed to last about one or maybe two seasons. We've had the same problem. I put stainless steel pistons in but we get the seals "weeping" when the car stands for any amount of time, ultimately draining all the brake fluid out, like over winter. Under pressure they seem to be sealing just fine, the level stays up in the reservoir during a weekends event. We may have to add some fluid due to pad wear (we have the small style master on the front and back of a dual master system) during a weekend but that's all. I did notice some unusual "staining" on the stainless pistons when we changed the seals last year. Doesn't look like actual scoring. Anybody else seen this with the stainless pistons? I can e-mail photos, which don't really do a good job of showing what it looks like, if anyone is interested. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jerryvv at roadrunner.com Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:32 AM To: Bob Kramer Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve Bob, a bigger question is do we know that the current product is being molded from the proper rubber compound. That certainly applies to many of the rubber bits that are used in non-performance applications and I suspect on some of our engine and transmission mounts that are now being made in unknown foreign factories. Rubber compounds are designed for specific applications and heat and fluid resistance are two of the most critical conditions that rubber development is focused around. I believe Neoprene is the polymer of choice for brake components however that's just a starting point. From there a specific compound is developed using the base polymer. Once the compound is developed testing is done to what's known as a Line Call out to certify that the compound meets the design requirements. I certainly hope that these rebuild kits are still being manufactured by Girling or Lucas or some other reputable supplier. A no name box would give me concern. I've seen a few of those with brake parts in them. Not to mention the assumed liability. JVV ---- Bob Kramer wrote: > I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they > last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and > rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner > ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling > to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only assume > that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. I had > spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if everyone is > frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. > > Bob Kramer > Volente, TX > > Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch > excellence. > Vince Lombardi > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "MadMarx" > To: "'Randall'" > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Mar 11 09:55:49 2010 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:55:49 EST Subject: [Fot] Brake Caliper Replacement Parts Message-ID: <63a2f.2dd261b4.38ca7a95@cs.com> Does the current state of parts quality in brake parts promote an argument for Toyota Conversions? Then it becomes an issue of safety rather than performance. I think I also came across a story of some aftermarket brake pistons (steel, stainless steel, chromed?) with a small sharp edge that cut the embedded seals. Leaky systems with new parts doesnt sound very good. It can say Lucas or Girling on the box, but I suspect that that they might still be substandard. And perhaps we need to look at the pistons under a magnifying glass for very small sharp machined edges or burrs. We have been having more issues with seals not lasting in the TR4...I suspect we need to go back and look more closely at the components, but what do you do with substandard seals? I know that Jack went back and forth on the Toyota conversions, but I cant remember the details. His final answer was to use the Toyotas and it wasnt a performance related issue, I dont think. Important thread. Thanks. I am not trying to make an argument for Toyota conversions, btw....just making observations. Joe A > Good point. I had a discussion with Jack Drews regarding the seals from > Moss and he questioned whether or not they were the same "type" as the > original because they only seemed to last about one or maybe two seasons. > We've had the same problem. I put stainless steel pistons in but we get > the > seals "weeping" when the car stands for any amount of time, ultimately > draining all the brake fluid out, like over winter. Under pressure they > seem to be sealing just fine, the level stays up in the reservoir during a > weekends event. We may have to add some fluid due to pad wear (we have the > small style master on the front and back of a dual master system) during a > weekend but that's all. I did notice some unusual "staining" on the > stainless pistons when we changed the seals last year. Doesn't look like > actual scoring. Anybody else seen this with the stainless pistons? I can > e-mail photos, which don't really do a good job of showing what it looks > like, if anyone is interested. > > Tim > From riverside at southslope.net Thu Mar 11 10:05:27 2010 From: riverside at southslope.net (riverside) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:05:27 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com><156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4B9880BA.2020706@verizon.net> Message-ID: <001401cac13d$0cd9da10$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Whatever became of Geoff Brabham? I remember watching in car footage of him at R/A in an Indy car. Thought he was hell for quick. Kas, do you have any special recollections of him? art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kurt Oblinger" To: "Mike Mehl" Cc: "Triumph Friends of" Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2010 11:33 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting > Here is a pic I shot at Riverside's Turn 6 of the Electramotive Nissan. > EFR is in the car and Brabham was co-driver. I don't recall the year. > Maybe the same car or a variation thereof. They were great cars and > indecently fast! > > http://yfrog.com/egnissangtpj > > Cheers, > Kurt O. > > > Mike Mehl wrote: >> driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the >> Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the >> induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down >> force >> that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was >> scary to drive. I had so much power.. >> >> Pretty fun discussion. >> >> Mike Mehl >> ________________________________ >> From: Mark J Bradakis >> To: >> Friends of Triumph >> Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM >> Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting >> >> Well, it might be interesting to >> one or two folks on this list: >> >> http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 >> mjb. >> \ >> _______________________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Thu Mar 11 10:05:48 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:05:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> Message-ID: <502CE409B8854072984BA917E0CDDA4B@jdnet.deere.com> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" > MBI Publishing Company, copyright 1990. Which, being the fifth volume in his "Tune to Win" series; he supposedly wanted to call "Screw to Win" All good stuff, BTW. -- Randall From spitlist at cox.net Thu Mar 11 10:24:00 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 10:24:00 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <001401cac13d$0cd9da10$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com><156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com><4B9880BA.2020706@verizon.net> <001401cac13d$0cd9da10$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Message-ID: I copied this from Wikipedia: Brabham now works for BMW Group Australia as a driver trainer at many different events around the country teaching others to drive safer and smarter, including teaching drivers to race for BMW supported celebrity races at the Australian Grand Prix. His son Matthew Brabham is also following in the family interest and is a very successful Kart racer. Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of riverside Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 10:05 AM To: Kurt Oblinger; Mike Mehl Cc: Triumph Friends of Subject: Re: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Whatever became of Geoff Brabham? I remember watching in car footage of him at R/A in an Indy car. Thought he was hell for quick. Kas, do you have any special recollections of him? art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kurt Oblinger" To: "Mike Mehl" Cc: "Triumph Friends of" Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2010 11:33 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting > Here is a pic I shot at Riverside's Turn 6 of the Electramotive Nissan. > EFR is in the car and Brabham was co-driver. I don't recall the year. > Maybe the same car or a variation thereof. They were great cars and > indecently fast! > > http://yfrog.com/egnissangtpj > > Cheers, > Kurt O. > > > Mike Mehl wrote: >> driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the >> Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the >> induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down >> force >> that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was >> scary to drive. I had so much power.. >> >> Pretty fun discussion. >> >> Mike Mehl >> ________________________________ >> From: Mark J Bradakis >> To: >> Friends of Triumph >> Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM >> Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting >> >> Well, it might be interesting to >> one or two folks on this list: >> >> http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 >> mjb. >> \ >> _______________________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From riverside at southslope.net Thu Mar 11 10:53:27 2010 From: riverside at southslope.net (riverside) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:53:27 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> Message-ID: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Thu Mar 11 11:17:32 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 10:17:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Bobby, Steve Belfer here. I was new to these fittings but have recently (within the past year) had many custom AN lines made up to completely re-plumb the fuel system and install an Accusump in the Trunk, and Oil cooler, as well as a custom line for the oil press. gauge. Sounds like what you're doing is pretty easy, and easy to make a mistake too and spend extra money. The main way to screw it up is to make the lines too short. You can always shorten them but can not lengthen them. :) 1"ID is -16AN hose. These are big but the right size for the valve cover and crankcase vent. You need to have a -16AN Male "Bung" welded into the valve cover and catch tank. Then you need to have a hose made up that connects the valve cover to the catch tank. This hose will be comprised of the hose and two hose end fittings. Hose end fittings come straight, or 45 degrees or 90 degrees. They can also be purchased in bends up to 180 degrees but you won't need that for this application. Find a local shop that can make up hoses for you. I do not recommend doing it yourself the first time. The braided hose is cut with a special chop-saw. You can tape it and cut yourself with a hack-saw or dremel but I've messed this up by cutting at an angle or by fraying the braids. Find a good chop that knows what they're doing and can shorten the line and rebuild the hose if you need to make tweaks. The hoses bend well but do not twist. They take a set because of the braiding so you have to know which angle the end fittings will point when the hose is in attached. Leave at least 1" of slack so the line can vibrate as the engine moves a little. You do not want the line too tight. Buy "Swivel" end fittings so you can adjust the angle of the end fittings. Do not overtighten AN fittings. They need no sealant, no lubricant and just give them a firm tightening but don't crank on it! If you have any specific questions, I'll be glad to try and answer them for you. ~Steve On Mar 10, 2010, at 9:08 PM, Bobby Whitehead wrote: Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... I need to plumb a 1" inside diameter hose from the crankcase (90 degree) and a 1" inside diameter hose to my catch tank. I don't understand the terminology of the references on the likes of the Earl brand hose connectors ... like -8AN -6AN etc.... In the need to know... the crank vent needs to come from the fuel cover plate and take a 90 degree short run. I think I just need to drill out the valve cover and have a 1" connection to my catch tank which will also need to short 90 degree receivers to catch the blow by from my 1" i.d. hoses.... please don't think I'm dumb... I'm still learning.... Bobby Whitehead #39 1970 Triumph GT6 DP #87 1965 Triumph Spitfire EP _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Mar 11 11:36:19 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 12:36:19 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Brake Caliper Replacement Parts In-Reply-To: <63a2f.2dd261b4.38ca7a95@cs.com> References: <63a2f.2dd261b4.38ca7a95@cs.com> Message-ID: I had forgotten that many people choose to run without the dust seals. I may have to go that way. I definitely try to avoid suspect rubber parts but like others have said there is no guarantee that a Lucas/Girling box means anything. My vintage organization won't allow Toyota conversions but I suppose they wouldn't know. I prefer keeping it original anyway. Larry Young thinks the early/larger TR4 calipers work better, both in cooling and in brake surface area. Now that I have a an early TR4 and a 4A I can compare. I just let mine go too long. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of N197TR4 at cs.com Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 10:56 AM To: timmurph at fastbytes.com; jerryvv at roadrunner.com; rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Brake Caliper Replacement Parts Does the current state of parts quality in brake parts promote an argument for Toyota Conversions? Then it becomes an issue of safety rather than performance. I think I also came across a story of some aftermarket brake pistons (steel, stainless steel, chromed?) with a small sharp edge that cut the embedded seals. Leaky systems with new parts doesnt sound very good. It can say Lucas or Girling on the box, but I suspect that that they might still be substandard. And perhaps we need to look at the pistons under a magnifying glass for very small sharp machined edges or burrs. We have been having more issues with seals not lasting in the TR4...I suspect we need to go back and look more closely at the components, but what do you do with substandard seals? I know that Jack went back and forth on the Toyota conversions, but I cant remember the details. His final answer was to use the Toyotas and it wasnt a performance related issue, I dont think. Important thread. Thanks. I am not trying to make an argument for Toyota conversions, btw....just making observations. Joe A > Good point. I had a discussion with Jack Drews regarding the seals from > Moss and he questioned whether or not they were the same "type" as the > original because they only seemed to last about one or maybe two seasons. > We've had the same problem. I put stainless steel pistons in but we get > the > seals "weeping" when the car stands for any amount of time, ultimately > draining all the brake fluid out, like over winter. Under pressure they > seem to be sealing just fine, the level stays up in the reservoir during a > weekends event. We may have to add some fluid due to pad wear (we have the > small style master on the front and back of a dual master system) during a > weekend but that's all. I did notice some unusual "staining" on the > stainless pistons when we changed the seals last year. Doesn't look like > actual scoring. Anybody else seen this with the stainless pistons? I can > e-mail photos, which don't really do a good job of showing what it looks > like, if anyone is interested. > > Tim > _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com From billb at bnj.com Thu Mar 11 11:40:19 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 08:40:19 -1000 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <68454015-0C3A-4C75-BD81-C29292584A83@bnj.com> Good advice except the part about not doing it yourself. I think anyone that uses these things should learn how to make them up, you can't always get to a shop, and it's not that hard. Tape with a couple of TIGHT wraps of masking tape--not duct tape--it's too stretchy. Mark where you want your cut then wrap another piece of colored masking tape so it's edge is on the mark to give you a nice squared-up cutting line. Use a very fine toothed hacksaw blade--as fine as you can find. stick the line in a vise and cut smoothly with light strokes. Then follow the mfrs. directions. Don't take the tape off until you are ready to stuff the line into the fitting. On Mar 11, 2010, at 8:17 AM, Steven Belfer wrote: > Hi Bobby, Steve Belfer here. > > I was new to these fittings but have recently (within the past year) had many custom AN lines made up to completely re-plumb the fuel system and install an Accusump in the Trunk, and Oil cooler, as well as a custom line for the oil press. gauge. Sounds like what you're doing is pretty easy, and easy to make a mistake too and spend extra money. The main way to screw it up is to make the lines too short. You can always shorten them but can not lengthen them. :) 1"ID is -16AN hose. These are big but the right size for the valve cover and crankcase vent. You need to have a -16AN Male "Bung" welded into the valve cover and catch tank. Then you need to have a hose made up that connects the valve cover to the catch tank. This hose will be comprised of the hose and two hose end fittings. Hose end fittings come straight, or 45 degrees or 90 degrees. They can also be purchased in bends up to 180 degrees but you won't need that for this application. > > Find a local shop that can make up hoses for you. I do not recommend doing it yourself the first time. The braided hose is cut with a special chop-saw. You can tape it and cut yourself with a hack-saw or dremel but I've messed this up by cutting at an angle or by fraying the braids. Find a good chop that knows what they're doing and can shorten the line and rebuild the hose if you need to make tweaks. From bownes at seiri.com Thu Mar 11 11:59:19 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 13:59:19 -0500 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <68454015-0C3A-4C75-BD81-C29292584A83@bnj.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <68454015-0C3A-4C75-BD81-C29292584A83@bnj.com> Message-ID: I've had great luck cutting AN braided hose with a large diameter fibreglas cut off wheel in a chop saw. After wrapping in tape of course. Once you get the hang of making them, you'll never go back to paying to have them made again. I keep a box of fittings and rolls of hose in the trailer. On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:40 PM, Bill Babcock wrote: > Good advice except the part about not doing it yourself. I think anyone > that > uses these things should learn how to make them up, you can't always get to > a > shop, and it's not that hard. Tape with a couple of TIGHT wraps of masking > tape--not duct tape--it's too stretchy. Mark where you want your cut then > wrap > another piece of colored masking tape so it's edge is on the mark to give > you > a nice squared-up cutting line. Use a very fine toothed hacksaw blade--as > fine > as you can find. stick the line in a vise and cut smoothly with light > strokes. > Then follow the mfrs. directions. Don't take the tape off until you are > ready > to stuff the line into the fitting. > > On Mar 11, 2010, at 8:17 AM, Steven Belfer wrote: > > > Hi Bobby, Steve Belfer here. > > > > I was new to these fittings but have recently (within the past year) had > many custom AN lines made up to completely re-plumb the fuel system and > install an Accusump in the Trunk, and Oil cooler, as well as a custom line > for > the oil press. gauge. Sounds like what you're doing is pretty easy, and > easy > to make a mistake too and spend extra money. The main way to screw it up is > to > make the lines too short. You can always shorten them but can not lengthen > them. :) 1"ID is -16AN hose. These are big but the right size for the > valve cover and crankcase vent. You need to have a -16AN Male "Bung" > welded > into the valve cover and catch tank. Then you need to have a hose made up > that connects the valve cover to the catch tank. This hose will be > comprised > of the hose and two hose end fittings. Hose end fittings come straight, or > 45 > degrees or 90 degrees. They can also be purchased in bends up to 180 > degrees > but you won't need that for this application. > > > > Find a local shop that can make up hoses for you. I do not recommend > doing > it yourself the first time. The braided hose is cut with a special > chop-saw. > You can tape it and cut yourself with a hack-saw or dremel but I've messed > this up by cutting at an angle or by fraying the braids. Find a good chop > that > knows what they're doing and can shorten the line and rebuild the hose if > you > need to make tweaks. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From bownes at seiri.com Thu Mar 11 12:00:18 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:00:18 -0500 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <68454015-0C3A-4C75-BD81-C29292584A83@bnj.com> Message-ID: And an important accessory if you are making them yourself is the red and blue sharpies to touch up where you scratch the anodize off of the connectors. ;) On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:59 PM, robert bownes wrote: > I've had great luck cutting AN braided hose with a large diameter fibreglas > cut off wheel in a chop saw. After wrapping in tape of course. > > Once you get the hang of making them, you'll never go back to paying to > have them made again. I keep a box of fittings and rolls of hose in the > trailer. > > > > On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:40 PM, Bill Babcock wrote: > >> Good advice except the part about not doing it yourself. I think anyone >> that >> uses these things should learn how to make them up, you can't always get >> to a >> shop, and it's not that hard. Tape with a couple of TIGHT wraps of masking >> tape--not duct tape--it's too stretchy. Mark where you want your cut then >> wrap >> another piece of colored masking tape so it's edge is on the mark to give >> you >> a nice squared-up cutting line. Use a very fine toothed hacksaw blade--as >> fine >> as you can find. stick the line in a vise and cut smoothly with light >> strokes. >> Then follow the mfrs. directions. Don't take the tape off until you are >> ready >> to stuff the line into the fitting. >> >> On Mar 11, 2010, at 8:17 AM, Steven Belfer wrote: >> >> > Hi Bobby, Steve Belfer here. >> > >> > I was new to these fittings but have recently (within the past year) had >> many custom AN lines made up to completely re-plumb the fuel system and >> install an Accusump in the Trunk, and Oil cooler, as well as a custom line >> for >> the oil press. gauge. Sounds like what you're doing is pretty easy, and >> easy >> to make a mistake too and spend extra money. The main way to screw it up >> is to >> make the lines too short. You can always shorten them but can not lengthen >> them. :) 1"ID is -16AN hose. These are big but the right size for the >> valve cover and crankcase vent. You need to have a -16AN Male "Bung" >> welded >> into the valve cover and catch tank. Then you need to have a hose made up >> that connects the valve cover to the catch tank. This hose will be >> comprised >> of the hose and two hose end fittings. Hose end fittings come straight, >> or 45 >> degrees or 90 degrees. They can also be purchased in bends up to 180 >> degrees >> but you won't need that for this application. >> > >> > Find a local shop that can make up hoses for you. I do not recommend >> doing >> it yourself the first time. The braided hose is cut with a special >> chop-saw. >> You can tape it and cut yourself with a hack-saw or dremel but I've messed >> this up by cutting at an angle or by fraying the braids. Find a good chop >> that >> knows what they're doing and can shorten the line and rebuild the hose if >> you >> need to make tweaks. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From kaskas at cox.net Thu Mar 11 12:13:52 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:13:52 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <4B9880BA.2020706@verizon.net> Message-ID: <20100311141352.4GF64.25208.imail@fed1rmwml46> That car is a 1987 version before the new tub and the Goodyear tires which made the car over 2 seconds faster. That car was later called "Elvis" and was laterr sold to a fellow in Europe.The car was just fast enough for my tastes. 1988 was better when Geoff was on full time and we won 8 races in a row and 10 out of 13. Yes, just fast enough. ---- Kurt Oblinger wrote: ============= Here is a pic I shot at Riverside's Turn 6 of the Electramotive Nissan. EFR is in the car and Brabham was co-driver. I don't recall the year. Maybe the same car or a variation thereof. They were great cars and indecently fast! http://yfrog.com/egnissangtpj Cheers, Kurt O. Mike Mehl wrote: > driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the > Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the > induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down force > that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was > scary to drive. I had so much power.. > > Pretty fun discussion. > > Mike Mehl > ________________________________ > From: Mark J Bradakis > To: > Friends of Triumph > Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM > Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting > > Well, it might be interesting to > one or two folks on this list: > > http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From kaskas at cox.net Thu Mar 11 12:20:13 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:20:13 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <83432.52222.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20100311142013.N5WIM.25337.imail@fed1rmwml46> -Geoff lives is Australia and runs the driving schools for BMW and has done so for quite a few years. Heard from him a regularly, his son Mathew will be racing a formula Ford this year (16 yrs old) at the F-1 race they have in Australia. The kid is chip off the old block and fast. Did very well in carts with Geoff as his mechanic. Mathew carries the same number we had on his Dad's car, 83. --- EDWARD BARNARD wrote: ============= Bobby: Speedway Motors also has a good explanation and lower prices than Pegasus; speedwaymotors.com . Of course, it's hard to beat the prices at Jegs or Summit. I think their volume is just so high they get a better break. -Ed- --- On Wed, 3/10/10, Bobby Whitehead wrote: From: Bobby Whitehead Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... To: "FoT Triumph" Date: Wednesday, March 10, 2010, 11:08 PM Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... I need to plumb a 1" inside diameter hose from the crankcase (90 degree) and a 1" inside diameter hose to my catch tank. I don't understand the terminology of the references on the likes of the Earl brand hose connectors ... like -8AN -6AN etc.... In the need to know... the crank vent needs to come from the fuel cover plate and take a 90 degree short run. I think I just need to drill out the valve cover and have a 1" connection to my catch tank which will also need to short 90 degree receivers to catch the blow by from my 1" i.d. hoses.... please don't think I'm dumb... I'm still learning.... Bobby Whitehead #39 1970 Triumph GT6 DP #87 1965 Triumph Spitfire EP _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From kaskas at cox.net Thu Mar 11 12:44:01 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:44:01 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Message-ID: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> ---- riverside wrote: One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum castings and plastic parts. A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. ============= Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 11 13:02:15 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 13:02:15 -0700 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> Message-ID: <4B994C47.3080107@bradakis.com> I use a cutoff wheel in a die grinder to cut the hose, after taping. Keep in mind that usually the inner hose is some sort of rubber, and it can deteriorate over time and exposure to heat and solvents. Fittings last longer than the hose. With a bit of practice making up hoses is pretty straightforward. And as Kas mentions the outer braid is quite effective at wearing through things it vibrates against. I recall once at IVR I was inspecting a Mallet Corvette that a fellow just purchased for some large sum of money. I was really amazed at some of the poor quality workmanship on it. The thing I had him deal with before he took it out was that a braided oil line was hard against the cable coming from the positive battery terminal. It wouldn't take long for that hose to gnaw through the insulation, I'm sure. On a side note, the Mallet came back from Hallet on a pallet. Not sure how he did it, but he turned the car into many little piles of scrap, I'm told. And speaking of large sums of money for cars, much as I expected I didn't get $100,000 + in donations overnight, so no bids on the GTP car. Guess I'll just have to get a Spitfire running this spring. mjb. From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Thu Mar 11 13:11:48 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 12:11:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> Message-ID: Additionally, make sure the braided hose doesn't contact any electrical wiring or hot contacts. Could cause a short. ~Steve On Mar 11, 2010, at 11:44 AM, Kas Kastner wrote: ---- riverside wrote: One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum castings and plastic parts. A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. ============= Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it > came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth > the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Thu Mar 11 13:11:57 2010 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 15:11:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <4B994C47.3080107@bradakis.com> References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46>, <4B994C47.3080107@bradakis.com> Message-ID: > quality workmanship on it. The thing I had him deal with before > he took it out was that a braided oil line was hard against the cable > coming from the positive battery terminal. It wouldn't take long for > that hose to gnaw through the insulation, I'm sure. Once my students installed a turbine engine on the test stand in such a way that the large (over one inch) braided steel fuel (AVgas) line touched the positive post of the 28VDC ground power unit plug. They learned how to use a fire extinguisher that day. John H. From riverside at southslope.net Thu Mar 11 13:13:55 2010 From: riverside at southslope.net (riverside) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:13:55 -0600 Subject: [Fot] spit front shocks needed Message-ID: <00be01cac157$610e40c0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Any body have a used set of shocks with adjustable spring perches for sale. art de armond From emanteno at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 13:17:40 2010 From: emanteno at gmail.com (Irv Korey) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:17:40 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> References: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> Message-ID: <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:44 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > ---- riverside wrote: > > One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it > rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum > castings and plastic parts. > A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. > If your stainless line is already assembled on the car, and you don't want to disassemble to install shrink tube, you can make a nice hose cover with the inner tube from a bicycle tire and some wire wraps. Irv From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Mar 11 13:32:23 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:32:23 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> References: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: These days you can get hose covered with a abrasion resistant braided cloth cover, in blue and black. These look nice with black AN fittings and maintain a period look from the days before braided SS. They are cheaper and easier to work with to boot. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Irv Korey From tedtsimx at bright.net Thu Mar 11 14:03:13 2010 From: tedtsimx at bright.net (Ted Schumacher) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:03:13 -0500 Subject: [Fot] brake seals, Toyota calipers, et al Message-ID: <4B995A91.8020107@bright.net> Hello list. We need to remember we are talking about race cars and racing. Somehow getting only 1 or 2 seasons out of a set of calipers before they need something is like being "slightly pregnant". After every session they should be checked and after every event they should be thoroughly inspected. Do this immediately after the car is unloaded, not the day before you head out the next time. If you want to help cooling, drill some holes around the perimeter of the piston, where it protrudes beyond the boot. These holes will let the hot gas that builds up inside the piston vent to atmosphere.This will get rid of some of the heat transfer from piston to caliper. Commercial content, we have rebuilt calipers - Spit. GT6, TR4, early and late TR6 for $69.95 each exchange. Toyota 4 piston calipers, rebuilt, including steel braid hose to go from caliper to TR bulkhead fitting (eliminates need to adapt hoses or steel lines) - $225. On another topic. the IMSA GTP cars did indeed generate a huge amount of down force. On the banking at Daytona, tires would blow from down force load. This led to the track installing the chicane at the end of the back straight just before entering NASCAR turn 3. Ted -- Ted Schumacher tedtsimx at bright.net http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com 108 S. Jefferson St. Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 From mdporter at dfn.com Thu Mar 11 14:02:48 2010 From: mdporter at dfn.com (Michael Porter) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:02:48 -0700 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> References: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4B995A78.1080208@dfn.com> Irv Korey wrote: > On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:44 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > > >> ---- riverside wrote: >> >> One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it >> rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum >> castings and plastic parts. >> A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. >> >> > > If your stainless line is already assembled on the car, and you don't want > to disassemble to install shrink tube, you can make a nice hose cover with > the inner tube from a bicycle tire and some wire wraps. > > Irv, Aeroquip (probably other manufacturers, too) now offer high-helix spiral isolators that seem to be made of nylon and can be installed with the hose in place. Very clean and neat. Only proviso is that one has to make sure the isolator is positioned properly so that the isolator actually meets the contact points. Not preferable to proper padded clips, but, still, a pretty good alternative to tearing things down, and very useful where there's a tangle of hoses contacting each other. Cheers. -- Michael Porter Roswell, NM Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking distance.... From bownes at seiri.com Thu Mar 11 14:22:05 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:22:05 -0500 Subject: [Fot] brake seals, Toyota calipers, et al In-Reply-To: <4B995A91.8020107@bright.net> References: <4B995A91.8020107@bright.net> Message-ID: Re downforce of the nissan GTP cars. I remember a certain Friday at Lime Rock Park when John Morton experiences a significant _lack_ of downforce at the top of the uphill. I was @ turn 2 at the time. If you've never seen Roz Rozitoski's photos of the shunt, you are missing a classic. Roz had the old Nikon grinding out 6pfs when John came up the hill and got the front off of the ground. The rest of the car followed, going totally airborne, flipping front over back and landing upside down and backwards, then flipping back over and coming to a stop in more than a few pieces. There are, I think about 5 or 6 frames in the series. By frame 2, the car is in the air. in frame 3, the car hasn't landed yet and the corner worker, Bruce Kohlker is already on his way with a fire bottle. Amazing. Heady days those were. On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 4:03 PM, Ted Schumacher wrote: > Hello list. We need to remember we are talking about race cars and racing. > Somehow getting only 1 or 2 seasons out of a set of calipers before they > need something is like being "slightly pregnant". After every session they > should be checked and after every event they should be thoroughly inspected. > Do this immediately after the car is unloaded, not the day before you head > out the next time. If you want to help cooling, drill some holes around the > perimeter of the piston, where it protrudes beyond the boot. These holes > will let the hot gas that builds up inside the piston vent to > atmosphere.This will get rid of some of the heat transfer from piston to > caliper. Commercial content, we have rebuilt calipers - Spit. GT6, TR4, > early and late TR6 for $69.95 each exchange. Toyota 4 piston calipers, > rebuilt, including steel braid hose to go from caliper to TR bulkhead > fitting (eliminates need to adapt hoses or steel lines) - $225. > On another topic. the IMSA GTP cars did indeed generate a huge amount of > down force. On the banking at Daytona, tires would blow from down force > load. This led to the track installing the chicane at the end of the back > straight just before entering NASCAR turn 3. Ted > > -- > Ted Schumacher > tedtsimx at bright.net > http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com > 108 S. Jefferson St. > Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 > Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) > Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) > Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From kaskas at cox.net Thu Mar 11 14:44:48 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 13:44:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] brake seals, Toyota calipers, et al In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20100311164448.MLA8K.26895.imail@fed1rmwml43> That was a brand new car at Lime Rock. It had never turned a wheel except in the parking lot before loading. Totally destroyed. I went to hospital with John that afternoon. I have seen the photos Roz took and they are really graphic. ---- robert bownes wrote: ============= Re downforce of the nissan GTP cars. I remember a certain Friday at Lime Rock Park when John Morton experiences a significant _lack_ of downforce at the top of the uphill. I was @ turn 2 at the time. If you've never seen Roz Rozitoski's photos of the shunt, you are missing a classic. Roz had the old Nikon grinding out 6pfs when John came up the hill and got the front off of the ground. The rest of the car followed, going totally airborne, flipping front over back and landing upside down and backwards, then flipping back over and coming to a stop in more than a few pieces. There are, I think about 5 or 6 frames in the series. By frame 2, the car is in the air. in frame 3, the car hasn't landed yet and the corner worker, Bruce Kohlker is already on his way with a fire bottle. Amazing. Heady days those were. On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 4:03 PM, Ted Schumacher wrote: > Hello list. We need to remember we are talking about race cars and racing. > Somehow getting only 1 or 2 seasons out of a set of calipers before they > need something is like being "slightly pregnant". After every session they > should be checked and after every event they should be thoroughly inspected. > Do this immediately after the car is unloaded, not the day before you head > out the next time. If you want to help cooling, drill some holes around the > perimeter of the piston, where it protrudes beyond the boot. These holes > will let the hot gas that builds up inside the piston vent to > atmosphere.This will get rid of some of the heat transfer from piston to > caliper. Commercial content, we have rebuilt calipers - Spit. GT6, TR4, > early and late TR6 for $69.95 each exchange. Toyota 4 piston calipers, > rebuilt, including steel braid hose to go from caliper to TR bulkhead > fitting (eliminates need to adapt hoses or steel lines) - $225. > On another topic. the IMSA GTP cars did indeed generate a huge amount of > down force. On the banking at Daytona, tires would blow from down force > load. This led to the track installing the chicane at the end of the back > straight just before entering NASCAR turn 3. Ted > > -- > Ted Schumacher > tedtsimx at bright.net > http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com > 108 S. Jefferson St. > Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 > Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) > Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) > Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From dos_gusanos at msn.com Thu Mar 11 16:36:06 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:36:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help Message-ID: Yes, I know this is lame for this list but I'm just going to start here first. MY 1963 TR4 came with 4 Valve covers. All are different. I need to select the right one for 1963. Two are the TR3 style with the long filler in front but one has a small tab welded on the back end (bachelor #2). One has a long TR3 style filler but it is in the back of the engine(bachelor #3). The other has a low twist on cap in back and a small tube/vent port out of the valve cover probably for the PCV Valve for a later car(bachelor #4). My guess is Bachelor #3 is correct. PLEASE LET ME KNOW IF I AM WRONG It would be a huge embarassment to show up somewhere sporting the wrong cover! Cheers Henry Morrison, Albuquerque. From dos_gusanos at msn.com Thu Mar 11 16:53:29 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:53:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: When I bought my first TR4 it was only 16 years old. I have always looked at TR7's like brand new cars but when I bought one it was 34 years old. What does that have to do with anything? Well it was just a bit rough that with all my mods I got wasted by a Golf TDI Diesel. I figure some Tires will put me even with the Volkzy as i was running my $39 radials. Any tips on a hot 13" Autocross Tire? Cheers Henry Morrison, Albuquerque From jmwagner at tstonramp.com Thu Mar 11 17:12:00 2010 From: jmwagner at tstonramp.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:12:00 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <35DF0D38-2E5B-400D-B721-A541748F467C@tstonramp.com> Small tab cover is TR2. On Mar 11, 2010, at 3:36 PM, wrote: > Yes, I know this is lame for this list but I'm just going to start > here first. > MY 1963 TR4 came with 4 Valve covers. All are different. I need to > select > the right one for 1963. Two are the TR3 style with the long filler > in front > but one has a small tab welded on the back end (bachelor #2). One > has a long > TR3 style filler but it is in the back of the engine(bachelor #3). > The other > has a low twist on cap in back and a small tube/vent port out of the > valve > cover probably for the PCV Valve for a later car(bachelor #4). > > > > My guess is Bachelor #3 is correct. > > > > PLEASE LET ME KNOW IF I AM WRONG > > > > It would be a huge embarassment to show up somewhere sporting the > wrong > cover! > > > > Cheers Henry Morrison, Albuquerque. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jmwagner at greenheart.com From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Thu Mar 11 17:53:32 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:53:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> Message-ID: <491758.27669.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> If anyone would like to email me off line I would be happy to help. We sell hydraulic hose and fittings out of our 7 locations in the Northwest. I plumbed my TR4 with 100R5 Parker 293 hose. It has no wire, is super light weight and can be used for fuel and oil. I used 26 series 37 degree flare crimp fittings. With this hose you can mock up the hose and cut it with out any special tools and take it to a local Parker Store and have them crimp it. I have noted all the advice and figured I would at least offer my help off line. We sell mostly OEM's and large MRO users. Anyway let me know if you have any questions. Mike Mehl ________________________________ From: Steven Belfer To: FOT Sent: Thu, March 11, 2010 12:11:48 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... Additionally, make sure the braided hose doesn't contact any electrical wiring or hot contacts. Could cause a short. ~Steve On Mar 11, 2010, at 11:44 AM, Kas Kastner wrote: ---- riverside wrote: One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum castings and plastic parts. A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. ============= Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From jhassall at blacksburg.net Thu Mar 11 18:24:23 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 20:24:23 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B9997C7.8040900@blacksburg.net> On 3/11/2010 6:36 PM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: > Yes, I know this is lame for this list but I'm just going to start here first. > MY 1963 TR4 came with 4 Valve covers. All are different. I need to select > the right one for 1963. Two are the TR3 style with the long filler in front > but one has a small tab welded on the back end (bachelor #2). One has a long > TR3 style filler but it is in the back of the engine(bachelor #3). The other > has a low twist on cap in back and a small tube/vent port out of the valve > cover probably for the PCV Valve for a later car(bachelor #4). > > > > My guess is Bachelor #3 is correct. > Henry, FWIW, my '63 came with #3, which I believe is original, as nothing on the car had been replaced (or fixed) in its life. jim -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From robertten1 at aol.com Thu Mar 11 18:30:14 2010 From: robertten1 at aol.com (robertten1 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 20:30:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: <8CC8F9AB351753F-1A3C-12E4@webmail-d097.sysops.aol.com> I like my Toyo R888's on my Spit GT autocrosser, originally bought as wet weather tires but have found them to be excellent in the dry as well. ( 185r60x13 ) Good luck, Bob T From LimeyV8 at aol.com Thu Mar 11 19:34:40 2010 From: LimeyV8 at aol.com (LimeyV8 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:34:40 EST Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: <8f465.407f2b53.38cb0240@aol.com> In a message dated 3/11/2010 6:53:47 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, dos_gusanos at msn.com writes: Any tips on a hot 13" Autocross Tire? I have done several seasons in E Stock in TR8s I used to use 205/60 Kumho Victoracers, but you can't get them in that size anymore. more recently, I have used 215/50 Kumho 710s and 225/50 Hoosier A6s (yes, these WILL fit and work on 13 x 5.5 wheels) The Kumhos are a tad stickier to start with - the Hoosiers are better longer - i haven't decided yet whether they are worth the extra $. I have a set of 205/60 Toyo RA1s sitting in the garage waiting for me to finish powder coating the wheels to put them on - i can let you know how they are in a couple weeks. Cheers, Jack Mc From LimeyV8 at aol.com Thu Mar 11 19:38:39 2010 From: LimeyV8 at aol.com (LimeyV8 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:38:39 EST Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> In a message dated 3/11/2010 8:39:48 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, robertten1 at aol.com writes: I like my Toyo R888's on my Spit GT autocrosser, originally bought as wet weather tires but have found them to be excellent in the dry as well. ( 185r60x13 ) I got RA1s because Miata racers told me the R888s were terrible in the wet. what are your thoughts on that? Cheers, Jack Mc From adams910 at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 20:20:30 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 22:20:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> Message-ID: <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com> Full tread RA1's are a better rain tire. Full tread R888's are a better intermediate. In the dry, it's drivers preference, some people love the R888's, others hate them. Keep in mind Spec Miata's are in the 2300-2400lb range per rules, so what whatever tire wear they see might not apply to a much lighter British car. I also believe the R888 comes in different compounds. The 13" size might be a harder compound than the 15", best to check. Another thing, the Toyos (and other road race compound R-Dots) will never get hot enough for maximum performance at an autocross. The A6's and V700s are purpose built for autocrossing. As for the Hoosier A6's. There is a reason SCCA roadracers (SS and IT guys use them for qualifying) and autoxers refer to them as "purple crack". ;) From dos_gusanos at msn.com Thu Mar 11 21:16:03 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:16:03 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thank you for all the responses. I opened the Bonnet and there was yet another, fifth, valve cover similar to Bachelor #3...........................Cheers Henry > From: dos_gusanos at msn.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:36:06 -0700 > Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help > > Yes, I know this is lame for this list but I'm just going to start here first. > MY 1963 TR4 came with 4 Valve covers. All are different. I need to select > the right one for 1963. Two are the TR3 style with the long filler in front > but one has a small tab welded on the back end (bachelor #2). One has a long > TR3 style filler but it is in the back of the engine(bachelor #3). The other > has a low twist on cap in back and a small tube/vent port out of the valve > cover probably for the PCV Valve for a later car(bachelor #4). > > > > My guess is Bachelor #3 is correct. > > > > PLEASE LET ME KNOW IF I AM WRONG > > > > It would be a huge embarassment to show up somewhere sporting the wrong > cover! > > > > Cheers Henry Morrison, Albuquerque. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dos_gusanos at msn.com From timmurph at fastbytes.com Thu Mar 11 21:23:33 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 22:23:33 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <491758.27669.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> <491758.27669.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000001cac19b$c7e02e50$57a08af0$@com> There is a tool called the "Koul Tools" made specifically to assist in making up braided -AN hoses. You can check it out and maybe get some more tips at www.koultools.com or just Google "koul tool". I haven't used one but after making up a number of hoses anything to make it more reliable and easier would be nice! No commercial interest, just FWIW. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mike Mehl Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:54 PM To: Steven Belfer Cc: Triumph Friends of Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... If anyone would like to email me off line I would be happy to help. We sell hydraulic hose and fittings out of our 7 locations in the Northwest. I plumbed my TR4 with 100R5 Parker 293 hose. It has no wire, is super light weight and can be used for fuel and oil. I used 26 series 37 degree flare crimp fittings. With this hose you can mock up the hose and cut it with out any special tools and take it to a local Parker Store and have them crimp it. I have noted all the advice and figured I would at least offer my help off line. We sell mostly OEM's and large MRO users. Anyway let me know if you have any questions. Mike Mehl ________________________________ From: Steven Belfer To: FOT Sent: Thu, March 11, 2010 12:11:48 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... Additionally, make sure the braided hose doesn't contact any electrical wiring or hot contacts. Could cause a short. ~Steve On Mar 11, 2010, at 11:44 AM, Kas Kastner wrote: ---- riverside wrote: One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum castings and plastic parts. A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. ============= Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From adams910 at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 21:57:33 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 23:57:33 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com> First off, what class are you running in? There are really 3 different tire clases. The ST classes use a DOT approved treaded tire with a tire wear rating of 140 being the lowest. The Stock and Street-Prepared classes allow any DOT approved tire. The Prepared and Mod classes allow for a cantilever slick. I wouldn't turn down a set of R888's. You'll probably be fine on the regional level, but if you are in a very competitive division or want to run Nationals and you want to win, you'll need either V710's or the A6's. R-DOTS are basically DOT approved tires that barely meet all the minimum requirements. They're radial designs, and feature at least one groove of 4/32" tread depth. Some come with full tread (Toyos are molded at 6/32", but when shaved to 4/32", they lose most of their tread and just have two grooves). Wear ratings are LOW.. usually in the 40-100 range and they have very stiff sidewalls. Tires like the Hoosier R and A6's , Kumho V710's, and Goodyear GS's are typically molded with a single groove around their circumference. These are sometimes referred to as "cheater R-DOTs". Not sure about autocrossing, but in roadracing, you can only expect 10-12 heat cycles if you're a fast guy with these tires, before they start to cord. They're fast as s**t while they last, but still slower than a full cantilever slick. The next batch: Toyo R888, RA1, Kumho V700, and Yokohama A048 are molded with a wet weather tread pattern, but they're molded pretty shallow. Most racers will shave the tires from 6/32" to 4/32" or more for dry use. 1) it removes most of the tread, making it more slick like , 2) it actually extends the life of the tire as it is less likely to chunk and build up excessive amounts of heat from tread squirm, 3) less rolling mass. These tires are slightly harder and slightly slower than the "cheater R-DOTS". They do last longer, are less finicky to set up, and are cheaper to buy. They're still plenty fast. Bob From adams910 at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 22:16:16 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 00:16:16 -0500 Subject: [Fot] SOVREN CRC - pass while spinning Message-ID: <673993c51003112116v5aa7e35dp6a67a7f92602021@mail.gmail.com> This was just posted on another forum. Arnie Loyning spin and pass in his Lotus Elan. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dz4P6e_Yv3c From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 11 23:34:17 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 23:34:17 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com> <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> > The Prepared and Mod classes allow for a cantilever slick. > > The guys at the tire shop were happy when I switched from cantilever slicks on 6 inch rims to normal sidewall slicks on 8 inch rims. Of course the extra wheel width was all outboard so the car was a bit wider and for a while I was nipping cones by just a hair. I'd like to get back to some sort of racing. Moving all this junk around cleaning up the shop has got me thinking more and more about getting back at it. Are you sure none of you need a Unix/Linux sys admin, email expert, personal chef, Brit car mechanic or some such? Racing can be tough when you have no income! mjb. From spitlist at cox.net Thu Mar 11 23:41:57 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 23:41:57 -0700 Subject: [Fot] SOVREN CRC - pass while spinning In-Reply-To: <673993c51003112116v5aa7e35dp6a67a7f92602021@mail.gmail.com> References: <673993c51003112116v5aa7e35dp6a67a7f92602021@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I bet he couldn't pull that off again if he tried! -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bob Adams Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 10:16 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] SOVREN CRC - pass while spinning This was just posted on another forum. Arnie Loyning spin and pass in his Lotus Elan. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dz4P6e_Yv3c _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From tony at tonydrews.com Thu Mar 11 23:42:14 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 00:42:14 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> Message-ID: <20100312064246.9EBB2187663@autox.team.net> I thought the RA1's were awesome in the wet, even with not a lot of tread - no standing puddles in that particular race. One of my overall victories. Passed that fast Healey 3000 on the outside in the carousel. Heh, heh. - Tony At 08:38 PM 3/11/2010, LimeyV8 at aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 3/11/2010 8:39:48 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, >robertten1 at aol.com writes: > >I like my Toyo R888's on my Spit GT autocrosser, originally bought as wet >weather tires but have found them to be excellent in the dry as well. ( >185r60x13 ) > > > >I got RA1s because Miata racers told me the R888s were terrible in the wet. >what are your thoughts on that? > > >Cheers, >Jack Mc > >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tony at tonydrews.com From igofaster at att.net Fri Mar 12 08:38:06 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 07:38:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] amb transponders... Message-ID: <875652.8947.qm@web180702.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I missed the links on AMB transponders last week... where's the deal on the re-charge units?? My new Spitwad is coming tomorrow without transponder and my GT6 is hard wired... kindest regards my fellow Triumpaholics (no pun to Lindsey Lohan) ... Bobby Whitehead From trmarty at hotmail.com Fri Mar 12 11:22:54 2010 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:22:54 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> Message-ID: Mark, if your ever at a VTR event (or any other event) and I'm there and my car happens to still be running your more than welcome to co-drive. Now if you beat me in my own car like that other guy that uses his initials for his signature we would have to talk:) Marty > > I'd like to get back to some sort of racing. Moving all this junk around > cleaning up the shop has got me thinking more and more about getting back > at it. Are you sure none of you need a Unix/Linux sys admin, email expert, > personal chef, Brit car mechanic or some such? Racing can be tough when > you have no income! > > > mjb. > _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsofts powerful SPAM protection. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/210850552/direct/01/ From lang at isis.mit.edu Fri Mar 12 12:38:43 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 14:38:43 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Mar 2010, marty sukey wrote: > Mark, if your ever at a VTR event (or any other event) and I'm there and my > car happens to still be running your more than welcome to co-drive. Now if > you beat me in my own car like that other guy that uses his initials for his > signature we would have to talk:) Hey - I resemble that comment! But the results say the car was silver. You have nothing to worry about. Yours was blue. :-) > Marty rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From rjl6n at cstone.net Fri Mar 12 12:58:45 2010 From: rjl6n at cstone.net (rjl6n at cstone.net) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 14:58:45 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4094e235badea1464dea17c613271ba0.squirrel@webmail.ntelos.net> That's OK, both rml and mjb have beaten me in my own car at various times... John > On Fri, 12 Mar 2010, marty sukey wrote: > >> Now if you beat me in my own car like that >> otherguy that uses his initials for his >> signature we would have to talk:) > > Robert M. Lang wrote: > Hey - I resemble that comment! From mark at bradakis.com Fri Mar 12 19:02:35 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 19:02:35 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! Message-ID: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> With all the Laylande parts and DGOE carbs, this car has *GOT* to be worth every penny: http://tinyurl.com/yb8yjud And such a nice shade of British Green. Sheesh. mjb. From spitlist at cox.net Fri Mar 12 19:02:13 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 19:02:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! In-Reply-To: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> References: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> Message-ID: Did they really make TR7's with Dolomite Sprint engines? Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark J Bradakis Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 7:03 PM To: 'Friends of Triumph' Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! With all the Laylande parts and DGOE carbs, this car has *GOT* to be worth every penny: http://tinyurl.com/yb8yjud And such a nice shade of British Green. Sheesh. mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From billb at bnj.com Fri Mar 12 19:05:06 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 16:05:06 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! In-Reply-To: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> References: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <2FAD7D03-4CA7-4F14-AFA4-01AFA7BCC68D@bnj.com> Wow, how very... how you say,... excluseyve. And only $17,000!!??!! quel bargaine. On Mar 12, 2010, at 4:02 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > With all the Laylande parts and DGOE carbs, this car has *GOT* to > be worth every penny: > > http://tinyurl.com/yb8yjud > > And such a nice shade of British Green. > > Sheesh. > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From mark at bradakis.com Fri Mar 12 19:12:52 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 19:12:52 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! In-Reply-To: References: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4B9AF4A4.5080504@bradakis.com> Who was it at the Savannah VTR who had the 7 with the dolly sprint head? I had heat stroke and brake fluid poisoning, I don't remember. mjb. From macdonaldp at rogers.com Fri Mar 12 20:12:08 2010 From: macdonaldp at rogers.com (Paul MacDonald) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 22:12:08 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! In-Reply-To: References: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <7CA0AB18999645778301297F23B7556B@your4dacd0ea75> A lot of the sprint engine cars were factory rally TR7s. A few were made non rally. Several have been made in North America, but certainly not worth as much as they cost to build, like $3-5000 for a TR7 convertible plus about 3-4 to do the engine, a waste of money to build a coupe, still worth little. Paul http://www.trdrivers.com/tr7_sprint_.html -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Joe Curry Sent: March 12, 2010 9:02 PM To: 'Mark J Bradakis'; 'Friends of Triumph' Subject: Re: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! Did they really make TR7's with Dolomite Sprint engines? Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark J Bradakis Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 7:03 PM To: 'Friends of Triumph' Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! With all the Laylande parts and DGOE carbs, this car has *GOT* to be worth every penny: http://tinyurl.com/yb8yjud And such a nice shade of British Green. Sheesh. mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/macdonaldp at rogers.com From fasttrs at yahoo.com Fri Mar 12 21:37:21 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 20:37:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! Message-ID: <969760.79330.qm@web46115.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> The only one I know of in the SE belonged to Hal Doby that lives in Snellville Georgia. I'm not sure he still has it though. Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 12, 2010, at 8:12 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: Who was it at the Savannah VTR who had the 7 with the dolly sprint head? I had heat stroke and brake fluid poisoning, I don't remember. mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From mark at bradakis.com Fri Mar 12 23:41:00 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 23:41:00 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com> Anyone remember Phoenix Stahlflex tires? mjb. From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Sat Mar 13 05:32:50 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 07:32:50 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Peyote Message-ID: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Hi all, I just got my Vintage Motorsport magazine, with the 2010 Annual included. On page 69 is a great photo of Bill Babcock in the Peyote dicing with Cameron Healy's Porsche-Cooper. Nice shot. Bill, is this the "Pooper"? I think it was at the Glen last Sept. I had a late 50's Road and Track Magazine with an article about the Pooper that I took to the Vintage GP. The Pooper was parked near me and I went over to give the magazine to the owner.There was an older fellow there (I have to watch when I start talking about older fellows!) talking with the owner. I was told he had built the original car. He ended up with the magazine. And misty eyes. And the owner bought me lunch. Great bunch, these vintage guys. Bill From lang at isis.mit.edu Sat Mar 13 07:45:00 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 09:45:00 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Mar 2010, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > Anyone remember Phoenix Stahlflex tires? Careful, Mark. Comments like that will get you labelled as an Olde Fart! Oddly, those tires were before my time, but if you come across a barn find with a set of those babies on there... > mjb. regards, rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From billb at bnj.com Sat Mar 13 08:43:44 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 05:43:44 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Peyote In-Reply-To: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Yes, it's one of the Poopers, I think there's three, I know there's two--the silver one you saw and a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers. I race with both of them, a fine and spirited competition with guys I trust. Cameron was at the Glen last year in part to make sure the original owner/builder got to see it. His name is on the tip of my tongue but I can't recall it. Cameron is about as nice a guy as you're likely to meet and a hell of a good driver. Besides being competitors we live about 500 yards from each other in Portland, and one island away from each other in Hawaii. Yet somehow the only place we generally get together is the track. On Mar 13, 2010, at 2:32 AM, WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: > Hi all, I just got my Vintage Motorsport magazine, with the 2010 Annual > included. > On page 69 is a great photo of Bill Babcock in the Peyote dicing with Cameron > Healy's Porsche-Cooper. Nice shot. > Bill, is this the "Pooper"? I think it was at the Glen last Sept. > I had a late 50's Road and Track Magazine with an article about the Pooper > that I took to the Vintage GP. The Pooper was parked near me and I went over > to give the magazine to the owner.There was an older fellow there (I have to > watch when I start talking about older fellows!) talking with the owner. I was > told he had built the original car. He ended up with the magazine. And misty > eyes. And the owner bought me lunch. > Great bunch, these vintage guys. > Bill > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From dos_gusanos at msn.com Sat Mar 13 09:04:35 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 09:04:35 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, , <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, , <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, , <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com>, , <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: I bought those Phoenix Tires and they Tranformed my MG Midget. But it wasn't lonng before I needed Yokohama A008's............................Henry Morrison > Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 09:45:00 -0500 > From: lang at isis.mit.edu > To: mark at bradakis.com > CC: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) > > On Fri, 12 Mar 2010, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > > > Anyone remember Phoenix Stahlflex tires? > > Careful, Mark. Comments like that will get you labelled as an Olde Fart! > > Oddly, those tires were before my time, but if you come across a barn find > with a set of those babies on there... > > > mjb. > > regards, > rml > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent > 2010 NER Solo Chair | > Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dos_gusanos at msn.com From britbits at netzero.net Sat Mar 13 21:07:35 2010 From: britbits at netzero.net (britbits at netzero.net) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 04:07:35 GMT Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: <20100313.220735.14532.0@webmail19.dca.untd.com> Mark, You are showing your age. ;) In a related fashion, I'm still trying to remember if the Phoenix was the original name or the "secondary" name for the tire, back in the early 80s. I seem to think Semperit bought the rights, after P-S went under. I used to help prep an '67 MGB-GT for concourse, it had the phoenix tires in the back and Pirelli P3s in front. Also a great tire, until I discovered A008s. ;) Cheers, Jim Dallas jgambony at gcecisp.com ---------- Original Message ---------- From: Mark J Bradakis To: FOT Subject: Re: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 23:41:00 -0700 Anyone remember Phoenix Stahlflex tires? mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/britbits at netzero.net ____________________________________________________________ Criminal Lawyer Criminal Lawyers - Click here. http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2241/c?cp=37OpWVZovjYg7eurXNfxXwAAJ1GU 0HcZ7PRpF0fndYeeSkVqAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAiFgAAAAA= From mark at bradakis.com Sat Mar 13 21:22:07 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 21:22:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4B9C646F.9000807@bradakis.com> > Careful, Mark. Comments like that will get you labelled as an Olde Fart! > What, who, me? I remember my grandfather talking about them, yep, that's the story, honest, trust me! mjb the greenhorn. From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sat Mar 13 22:15:38 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 22:15:38 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: > a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his VW dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. I have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the Seattle area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed out on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter Revson, et.al.,... those were the guys I had my teenage eyes on. But missed a lot I could have learned in that time. Pete Lovely was a VW dealer/customer. Same for Monte Shelton. But he had everything from Lincoln/Mercury to Ferrari and Aston - Best story I can think of from him is a friend who bought his wife a new RR Corniche convert from Monty's guys. Deal was Monty Shelton Motorcars would install a hitch [to tow a Ventnor V12 speedboat] and they would honor the warranty. [If anyone wants a short dissertation on the early version of the RR TH400 trans. fiasco, let me know]. Anyway, both Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton were customers . Actually great, - no b.s. - easy customers. Though I do remember Pete's very Swedish sense of humor - He had a great ludafisk joke. Point is, I knew both of these guys on a first name basis in the late '70's/early '80's and knew nothing about who they were in any racing context. , Not certain but I think Pete is many years gone but Monty might still be around. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm sure neither would remember me, but I sure remember them - regardless of who they "were". Also brings back memories of Carlos from Alfa of Tacoma - former Ferrari F1 mechanic. Anyone know if he's still around? That saint put up with me poking around his shop as a bored teenager and managed to teach me a bit in the process. Sure does explain that little red Sports Racer though. Now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure I have pics of it at SIR maybe as far back as '69. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM P.S. Tomorrow is Pi Day - 3/14 3.14 --- Pi, my Plum Pi's namesake number and Albert Einstein's birthday. From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sat Mar 13 22:37:12 2010 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 21:37:12 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: Greg, Pete Lovely is still around and was racing his Ferrari TR for several years until he sold it several years ago. He also used to bring his Lotus formula car to the race track loaded on the back of a VW transporter. It was a kick to watch him load it on the flatbed VW, he would jack up the front of the VW and had long ramps and pull the Louts up on it. The VW had extensions on the back a couple of feet long to hold the car. Carlos is still running the Alfa shop with Leno. They seem to be doing okay though I haven't stopped in their lately. I usually see him around at the machine shop. Great that you know these guys and I think its great we have them here in Tacoma. Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" To: "fot Triumph" Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 9:15 PM Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper > On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: >> a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers > > WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his VW > dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north > Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back > shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. I > have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the Seattle > area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. > As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed out > on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter Revson, > et.al.,... those were the guys I had my teenage eyes on. But missed a lot > I could have learned in that time. Pete Lovely was a VW dealer/customer. > Same for Monte Shelton. But he had everything from Lincoln/Mercury to > Ferrari and Aston - Best story I can think of from him is a friend who > bought his wife a new RR Corniche convert from Monty's guys. Deal was > Monty Shelton Motorcars would install a hitch [to tow a Ventnor V12 > speedboat] and they would honor the warranty. [If anyone wants a short > dissertation on the early version of the RR TH400 trans. fiasco, let me > know]. > Anyway, both Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton were customers . Actually > great, - no b.s. - easy customers. Though I do remember Pete's very > Swedish sense of humor - He had a great ludafisk joke. Point is, I knew > both of these guys on a first name basis in the late '70's/early '80's > and knew nothing about who they were in any racing context. , > Not certain but I think Pete is many years gone but Monty might still be > around. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm sure neither would remember > me, but I sure remember them - regardless of who they "were". > Also brings back memories of Carlos from Alfa of Tacoma - former Ferrari > F1 mechanic. Anyone know if he's still around? That saint put up with me > poking around his shop as a bored teenager and managed to teach me a bit > in the process. > > Sure does explain that little red Sports Racer though. Now that I think > about it, I'm pretty sure I have pics of it at SIR maybe as far back as > '69. > > Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > > > P.S. Tomorrow is Pi Day - 3/14 > 3.14 --- Pi, my Plum Pi's namesake number and Albert Einstein's birthday. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/charly at mitchelplumbing.com From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sat Mar 13 23:43:20 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 23:43:20 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: Thanks Charley, Crazy! Carlos is still doing his thing! If you ever see him, mention the name "Lunker" Hilyer in conjunction with Ferrari # 13133 or a Maserati 3500 and he just might remember me pestering him. I'm sure he [along with lots of others] has no idea how influential he was to me. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Mar 13, 2010, at 10:37 PM, Charly Mitchel wrote: > Greg, Pete Lovely is still around and was racing his Ferrari TR for > several years until he sold it several years ago. He also used to > bring his Lotus formula car to the race track loaded on the back of > a VW transporter. It was a kick to watch him load it on the flatbed > VW, he would jack up the front of the VW and had long ramps and > pull the Louts up on it. The VW had extensions on the back a > couple of feet long to hold the car. > Carlos is still running the Alfa shop with Leno. They seem to be > doing okay though I haven't stopped in their lately. I usually see > him around at the machine shop. Great that you know these guys and > I think its great we have them here in Tacoma. > Charly Mitchel > TR6 #44 > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" > > To: "fot Triumph" > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 9:15 PM > Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper From norlinengineering at comcast.net Sat Mar 13 23:55:59 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 22:55:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3293C19C138B4662B17279C5CFE7281B@TOSHIBALAPTOP> "but Monty might still be around. Please correct me if I'm wrong." Monte's still around. He came by and visited with me last weekend at PIR. It was the opening SCCA regional. I had the Spitfire out to get my annual tech and was working on some prep for the upcoming Double National at Thunderhill when he stopped by. Monte normally drives a 935, but last year ran against me in a couple of races in his HP Rabbit. Great guy and a very good racer. Jim Norlin From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Sun Mar 14 00:02:57 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 02:02:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: <00fe01cac344$61268fb0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Hi Greg, if my memory is right, Monte Sheldon used to race CanAm cars. Small world. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" To: "fot Triumph" Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 12:15 AM Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper > On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: > > a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers > > WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his > VW dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north > Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back > shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. > I have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the > Seattle area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. > As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed > out on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter > Revson, et.al.,... those were the guys I had my teenage eyes on. But > missed a lot I could have learned in that time. Pete Lovely was a VW > dealer/customer. Same for Monte Shelton. But he had everything from > Lincoln/Mercury to Ferrari and Aston - Best story I can think of from > him is a friend who bought his wife a new RR Corniche convert from > Monty's guys. Deal was Monty Shelton Motorcars would install a hitch > [to tow a Ventnor V12 speedboat] and they would honor the warranty. > [If anyone wants a short dissertation on the early version of the RR > TH400 trans. fiasco, let me know]. > Anyway, both Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton were customers . Actually > great, - no b.s. - easy customers. Though I do remember Pete's very > Swedish sense of humor - He had a great ludafisk joke. Point is, I > knew both of these guys on a first name basis in the late '70's/early > '80's and knew nothing about who they were in any racing context. , > Not certain but I think Pete is many years gone but Monty might still > be around. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm sure neither would > remember me, but I sure remember them - regardless of who they "were". > Also brings back memories of Carlos from Alfa of Tacoma - former > Ferrari F1 mechanic. Anyone know if he's still around? That saint put > up with me poking around his shop as a bored teenager and managed to > teach me a bit in the process. > > Sure does explain that little red Sports Racer though. Now that I > think about it, I'm pretty sure I have pics of it at SIR maybe as far > back as '69. > > Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > > > P.S. Tomorrow is Pi Day - 3/14 > 3.14 --- Pi, my Plum Pi's namesake number and Albert Einstein's > birthday. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sun Mar 14 00:12:48 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 00:12:48 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: <00fe01cac344$61268fb0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> <00fe01cac344$61268fb0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <4255BCAD-8658-40FD-8297-B9D25A0F81AF@earthlink.net> That's what I mean. He raced EVERYTHING but was just a used car guy to me. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Mar 14, 2010, at 12:02 AM, WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: > Hi Greg, if my memory is right, Monte Sheldon used to race CanAm > cars. > Small world. > Bill----- Original Message ----- > From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" > To: "fot Triumph" > Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 12:15 AM > Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper > > >> On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: >>> a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers >> >> WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his >> VW dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north >> Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back >> shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. >> I have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the >> Seattle area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. >> As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed >> out on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter >> Revson, et.al.,... those were the guys I had my teenage eyes on. But >> missed a lot I could have learned in that time. Pete Lovely was a VW >> dealer/customer. Same for Monte Shelton. But he had everything from >> Lincoln/Mercury to Ferrari and Aston - Best story I can think of from >> him is a friend who bought his wife a new RR Corniche convert from >> Monty's guys. Deal was Monty Shelton Motorcars would install a hitch >> [to tow a Ventnor V12 speedboat] and they would honor the warranty. >> [If anyone wants a short dissertation on the early version of the RR >> TH400 trans. fiasco, let me know]. >> Anyway, both Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton were customers . Actually >> great, - no b.s. - easy customers. Though I do remember Pete's very >> Swedish sense of humor - He had a great ludafisk joke. Point is, I >> knew both of these guys on a first name basis in the late '70's/early >> '80's and knew nothing about who they were in any racing context. , >> Not certain but I think Pete is many years gone but Monty might still >> be around. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm sure neither would >> remember me, but I sure remember them - regardless of who they >> "were". >> Also brings back memories of Carlos from Alfa of Tacoma - former >> Ferrari F1 mechanic. Anyone know if he's still around? That saint put >> up with me poking around his shop as a bored teenager and managed to >> teach me a bit in the process. >> >> Sure does explain that little red Sports Racer though. Now that I >> think about it, I'm pretty sure I have pics of it at SIR maybe as far >> back as '69. >> >> Greg "Lunker" Hilyer >> TR4 #314 >> Albuquerque NM >> >> >> P.S. Tomorrow is Pi Day - 3/14 >> 3.14 --- Pi, my Plum Pi's namesake number and Albert Einstein's >> birthday. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ > lunkercars at earthlink.net From billb at bnj.com Sun Mar 14 09:14:23 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 05:14:23 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: Both Pete and Monte are alive and well, and still drive hard and fast. I usually see Pete at races like the Wine Country, occasionally at NW races. I was chasing Pete's Lotus at Sears when Peyote's steering came apart. Usually race with Monte at the Rose Cup in Portland. Both great guys. On Mar 13, 2010, at 7:15 PM, Greg Lunker Hilyer wrote: > On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: >> a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers > > WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his VW dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. I have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the Seattle area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. > As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed out on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter Revson, et.al.,... From jcjcarrera at comcast.net Sun Mar 14 21:31:21 2010 From: jcjcarrera at comcast.net (jcjcarrera at comcast.net) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 03:31:21 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Shelton and Lovely Message-ID: <2037566255.847371268623881311.JavaMail.root@sz0079a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> As a resident of the Pacific NW the last 40 years, I have read with great interest the comments on Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton-two legendsB on the West Coast.B As Bill Babcock pointed out, they are both very accomplished racers. In fact, I have an old Sports Car Illustrated in my files from the late 50's or early 60'sB which has a picture of Pete somewhere in Europe with the Lotus Gran Prix team. Apparently , he was a good enough racer to draw the attention of Lotus and had an extended trial with them. Actually ran some races in what is now F1.B He has a gorgeous well endowed blond with him in the photo. I believe this lady turned out to be his wife Nevely whom I met at a party in Tacoma in the early 1980's. What drew my attention to her was the shirt she was wearing. On the front of the shirt was the rear end of a car with two round red taillights blinking in a provocative location. Nevely passed away a few years ago. Some other tidbits on Pete, he won the first ever professional race at Laguna Seca . My first Monterey Historics was in 94 when Ferrari was the featured marque and he was racing his recently restored Testa Rossa . I marvelled how precise of a driver he was as he shifted at the exact same spot from 2nd to 3rd on the straight lap after lap. He won his race, cleaned up the TR and took it to Pebble the next day and won his class there! He had a VW dealership in Fife, WA (suburb of Tacoma)B for many years which he sold, but kept the buildings and property and leased them to a " Datsun " dealer and then a Volvo dealership. Not sure if he still owns the property. As Charly Mitchel pointed out, Carlos and his brother Leno still run Alfa of Tacoma in a building owned by Pete and I believe he still owns the shop run by Carlos. Monte is a Porsche legend from the 70's and 80's running 911 RSR's and 935's, etc. His son Neal is also an outstanding driver and probably could have gone pro but manages the family car business in downtown Portland. When I had a business meeting with Neal about ten years ago, he toured me through their dealership and garage in the back street. Great race cars, rare classics from the 30's and even a TR4 with under 10K miles! Not sure if he still has the TR.B Shelton MotorsB still sell Jags and Saabs and Monte and Neal share a Porsche 962 in vintage IMSA races. The thing that always impressed me about the Pete and Neal was their accessibility and friendliness. John James TR4 #116 B From igofaster at att.net Mon Mar 15 09:34:10 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 08:34:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment Message-ID: <973308.64134.qm@web180710.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. I'll give a photo shop on the cars when I get some time. I need to adjust the torque on the 1300 cc head and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. The Spit has been raced sine 1973 from Seattle to Huntington Beach with the VARA. I don't think CVAR is going to let me run the car so much as there is a full cage which extends beyond the firewall to the front area of the frame and radiator... we'll see.... It was a great deal on the Spitwad and I'll get a chance to run it with other clubs I'm sure... All the best.... Bobby Whitehead 1971 TR6 1970 GT6 DP 1965 Spitfire EP and ONE happy wife....... well..... the TR6 IS her car... From norlinengineering at comcast.net Mon Mar 15 10:52:29 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 09:52:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <973308.64134.qm@web180710.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5E77D78A789E432F9E620FBC7023B30F@TOSHIBALAPTOP> The way I adjust the valves on the Spit is to first loosen all the jam nuts. Rotate the engine until two of the valves are fully open or nearly so. Then adjust the mirror image valves of the two that are down. In otherwords, if 1 and 7 are down, adjust 8 and 2. Keep doing this until all the jam nuts are tight again. The Spit goes on the chassis dyno this afternoon. We're heading out to Thunderhill for the Double National on Wed evening. Any other FOT'er going to be there? Jim Norlin -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bobby Whitehead Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 8:34 AM To: FoT Triumph Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. I'll give a photo shop on the cars when I get some time. I need to adjust the torque on the 1300 cc head and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. The Spit has been raced sine 1973 from Seattle to Huntington Beach with the VARA. I don't think CVAR is going to let me run the car so much as there is a full cage which extends beyond the firewall to the front area of the frame and radiator... we'll see.... It was a great deal on the Spitwad and I'll get a chance to run it with other clubs I'm sure... All the best.... Bobby Whitehead 1971 TR6 1970 GT6 DP 1965 Spitfire EP and ONE happy wife....... well..... the TR6 IS her car... _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/norlinengineering at comcast.net From Gt6steve at aol.com Mon Mar 15 11:06:28 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:06:28 EDT Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment Message-ID: <4d14b.4be89180.38cfc314@aol.com> I LOVE Thunderhill. Just wish it wasn't so far away... Good Luck and have a great time. In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:02:24 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, norlinengineering at comcast.net writes: The way I adjust the valves on the Spit is to first loosen all the jam nuts. Rotate the engine until two of the valves are fully open or nearly so. Then adjust the mirror image valves of the two that are down. In otherwords, if 1 and 7 are down, adjust 8 and 2. Keep doing this until all the jam nuts are tight again. The Spit goes on the chassis dyno this afternoon. We're heading out to Thunderhill for the Double National on Wed evening. Any other FOT'er going to be there? Jim Norlin -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bobby Whitehead Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 8:34 AM To: FoT Triumph Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. I'll give a photo shop on the cars when I get some time. I need to adjust the torque on the 1300 cc head and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. The Spit has been raced sine 1973 from Seattle to Huntington Beach with the VARA. I don't think CVAR is going to let me run the car so much as there is a full cage which extends beyond the firewall to the front area of the frame and radiator... we'll see.... It was a great deal on the Spitwad and I'll get a chance to run it with other clubs I'm sure... All the best.... Bobby Whitehead 1971 TR6 1970 GT6 DP 1965 Spitfire EP and ONE happy wife....... well..... the TR6 IS her car... _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/norlinengineering at comcast.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com From mark at bradakis.com Mon Mar 15 11:06:53 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:06:53 -0600 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <973308.64134.qm@web180710.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <973308.64134.qm@web180710.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4B9E692D.8090307@bradakis.com> Bobby Whitehead wrote: > We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now > a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. > > > Nice. > and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. > > Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and exhaust for some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed and the intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that cylinder's mate. On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the firing order it goes fairly quickly. mjb. From Gt6steve at aol.com Mon Mar 15 11:08:47 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:08:47 EDT Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment Message-ID: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. Pro's and cons? In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:07:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, mark at bradakis.com writes: Bobby Whitehead wrote: > We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now > a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. > > > Nice. > and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. > > Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and exhaust for some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed and the intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that cylinder's mate. On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the firing order it goes fairly quickly. mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com From mark at bradakis.com Mon Mar 15 11:18:40 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:18:40 -0600 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> References: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> Message-ID: <4B9E6BF0.8000301@bradakis.com> Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: > Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we > missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? > > I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. > > Pro's and cons? I like my way, as it is easy to keep track of which valves have been done, and I think it takes fewer turns of the crank. In theory, though, either method should be able to cover all the valves withing two revolutions of the crank. mjb. From dmitchel at sbcglobal.net Mon Mar 15 11:38:02 2010 From: dmitchel at sbcglobal.net (Doug Mitchell) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 10:38:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 Message-ID: <563670.46921.qm@web80807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Amici, Check out this Racetorations "resto-mod". http://www.dep-o.co.uk/page339.asp Doug From tlizzard at msn.com Mon Mar 15 15:57:08 2010 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 17:57:08 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <563670.46921.qm@web80807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <563670.46921.qm@web80807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: WOW! Just wow! Terry Stetler From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Mon Mar 15 18:58:53 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 20:58:53 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> Wow is an understatement. How did he get the stance? TR4 rear end and spacers up front or did he do it with custom offset wheels. Looks great! M From n197tr4 at cs.com Mon Mar 15 19:11:22 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 21:11:22 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Peyote In-Reply-To: <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: <8CC92BCBA0497C3-A64-447F@webmail-m006.sysops.aol.com> That Pooper was also owned by one of our favorite midwestern racers, 'DUCK' WADDLE. -----Original Message----- From: Bill Babcock To: WILLIAM TOBIN Cc: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Sat, Mar 13, 2010 9:43 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Peyote Yes, it's one of the Poopers, I think there's three, I know there's two--the ilver one you saw and a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by enny Akers. I race with both of them, a fine and spirited competition with uys I trust. Cameron was at the Glen last year in part to make sure the riginal owner/builder got to see it. His name is on the tip of my tongue but can't recall it. Cameron is about as nice a guy as you're likely to meet and a hell of a good river. Besides being competitors we live about 500 yards from each other in ortland, and one island away from each other in Hawaii. Yet somehow the only lace we generally get together is the track. n Mar 13, 2010, at 2:32 AM, WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: > Hi all, I just got my Vintage Motorsport magazine, with the 2010 Annual included. On page 69 is a great photo of Bill Babcock in the Peyote dicing with ameron Healy's Porsche-Cooper. Nice shot. Bill, is this the "Pooper"? I think it was at the Glen last Sept. I had a late 50's Road and Track Magazine with an article about the Pooper that I took to the Vintage GP. The Pooper was parked near me and I went ver to give the magazine to the owner.There was an older fellow there (I have o watch when I start talking about older fellows!) talking with the owner. I as told he had built the original car. He ended up with the magazine. And isty eyes. And the owner bought me lunch. Great bunch, these vintage guys. Bill _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com _______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From adams910 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 20:33:05 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 22:33:05 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> References: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's farther along than the pictures show. I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. From n197tr4 at cs.com Mon Mar 15 21:25:38 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 23:25:38 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> References: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8CC92CF7BE8CDA9-5A4C-8DE5@webmail-m072.sysops.aol.com> Not only have we been in contact with, I was planning to nominate him to the FOT. And I invited hin to join us at Heartland Park in August. Coincidently, I will be in his neighborhood of New Orleans tomorrow afternoon. Always a small world when you are a FOT. >From the Natchez Trace.....Jackson, MS -----Original Message----- From: Bob Adams To: Mark Eginton Cc: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, Mar 15, 2010 9:33 pm Subject: Re: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 ttp://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's arther along than the pictures show. I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. _______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From triosan at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 22:06:48 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 21:06:48 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Tim Suddard email address Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003152106k2ebb9817yedce92d21b2a93a4@mail.gmail.com> Tim, I need your email address. I have several pretty nice pictures of the TR250K you might like to see, if not use, in conjunction with the Mitty this year. Bill Hart and Tony Garmey willing that is. Oh, and Tom Krieger also. Chuck -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Tue Mar 16 10:20:06 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 09:20:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> References: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <16C93800-E85A-4522-93F6-50A45107BCB7@earthlink.net> Well that one looks a little too nice. A jewel of a tractor engine. ~Steve On Mar 15, 2010, at 7:33 PM, Bob Adams wrote: Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's farther along than the pictures show. I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Tue Mar 16 11:37:43 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (jerryvv at roadrunner.com) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 17:37:43 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <16C93800-E85A-4522-93F6-50A45107BCB7@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20100316173743.069SK.599315.root@cdptpa-web08-z02> If it wasn't for all of the pop up ads it might be an interesting site to view. One of the ads would not go away so the website went away, never to be viewed by me again. JVV ---- Steven Belfer wrote: > Well that one looks a little too nice. A jewel of a tractor engine. > > ~Steve > > > On Mar 15, 2010, at 7:33 PM, Bob Adams wrote: > > Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 > http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's > farther along than the pictures show. > > I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com From billb at bnj.com Tue Mar 16 11:46:28 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 07:46:28 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <20100316173743.069SK.599315.root@cdptpa-web08-z02> References: <20100316173743.069SK.599315.root@cdptpa-web08-z02> Message-ID: <7A72E5F7-FEA3-453C-AA3B-ACA7E2E12777@bnj.com> You need a better browser, or at least better configuration. Firefox, Safari and Chrome all have pretty good pop up protection. I haven't used IE for years, but I assume it does to. On Mar 16, 2010, at 7:37 AM, wrote: > If it wasn't for all of the pop up ads it might be an interesting site to view. > One of the ads would not go away so the website went away, never to be viewed by me again. > JVV > > ---- Steven Belfer wrote: >> Well that one looks a little too nice. A jewel of a tractor engine. >> >> ~Steve >> >> >> On Mar 15, 2010, at 7:33 PM, Bob Adams wrote: >> >> Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 >> http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's >> farther along than the pictures show. >> >> I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From cartravel at pobox.com Tue Mar 16 12:40:23 2010 From: cartravel at pobox.com (Larry Young) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 13:40:23 -0500 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> References: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> Message-ID: <4B9FD097.9020803@pobox.com> Ok, I'll jump in and try to make this way too technical. Both methods are using the fact that the cylinder "mate" has it's lobes 180 degrees apart. The rule of 9's is a bit more explicit, because it identifies the exact lobes which are 180 degrees apart. For a 110 lobe separation and taking the first lobe to be 0, the other lobes are at angles of: 0, 110, 20, 270, 90, 200, 290, 180 You can see that when lobe 1 is at zero lobe 8 is at 180 or exactly opposite. Since two of the lobes are within 20 degrees of each other, you might as well set those at the same time as Jim and Steve suggest. Mark is setting the valves when the cam is split between intake and exhaust centers. When the first two lobes are at +55 and -55, he would set the last two lobes, which will be 55 degrees on each side of 180. I have a small concern with this method, because some lift curves can have ramps that extend 110 degrees are more from the centerline. Adding that to the 55 gives you 165, which gives an allowance of 15 degrees for error. If you're going to use this method, you need to make sure your cam doesn't have long ramps. I use the other method for this reason. Larry Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: > Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we > missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? > > I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. > > Pro's and cons? > > > In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:07:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > mark at bradakis.com writes: > > Bobby Whitehead wrote: > >> We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 >> > and now > >> a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. >> >> >> >> > Nice. > > >> and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual >> > yet. > >> >> > > Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and > exhaust for > some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed > and the > intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that > cylinder's mate. > On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the > firing order it goes fairly quickly. > > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cartravel at pobox.com From kaskas at cox.net Tue Mar 16 13:51:49 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 12:51:49 -0700 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <4B9FD097.9020803@pobox.com> Message-ID: <20100316155149.MPO7U.91815.imail@fed1rmwml36> I too always used the rule of 9. Takes all worries out of the cam design. Good comment of the ramps being long on some designs, that was another thing I liked a lot. ---- Larry Young wrote: ============= Ok, I'll jump in and try to make this way too technical. Both methods are using the fact that the cylinder "mate" has it's lobes 180 degrees apart. The rule of 9's is a bit more explicit, because it identifies the exact lobes which are 180 degrees apart. For a 110 lobe separation and taking the first lobe to be 0, the other lobes are at angles of: 0, 110, 20, 270, 90, 200, 290, 180 You can see that when lobe 1 is at zero lobe 8 is at 180 or exactly opposite. Since two of the lobes are within 20 degrees of each other, you might as well set those at the same time as Jim and Steve suggest. Mark is setting the valves when the cam is split between intake and exhaust centers. When the first two lobes are at +55 and -55, he would set the last two lobes, which will be 55 degrees on each side of 180. I have a small concern with this method, because some lift curves can have ramps that extend 110 degrees are more from the centerline. Adding that to the 55 gives you 165, which gives an allowance of 15 degrees for error. If you're going to use this method, you need to make sure your cam doesn't have long ramps. I use the other method for this reason. Larry Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: > Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we > missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? > > I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. > > Pro's and cons? > > > In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:07:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > mark at bradakis.com writes: > > Bobby Whitehead wrote: > >> We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 >> > and now > >> a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. >> >> >> >> > Nice. > > >> and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual >> > yet. > >> >> > > Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and > exhaust for > some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed > and the > intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that > cylinder's mate. > On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the > firing order it goes fairly quickly. > > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cartravel at pobox.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 17:10:53 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 16:10:53 -0700 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <20100316155149.MPO7U.91815.imail@fed1rmwml36> References: <4B9FD097.9020803@pobox.com> <20100316155149.MPO7U.91815.imail@fed1rmwml36> Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003161610i45352e8cwa15f1a15ed5aa59b@mail.gmail.com> Course those of us with a 6 use the rule of 13. On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 12:51 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > I too always used the rule of 9. Takes all worries out of the cam design. Good comment of the ramps being long on some designs, that was another thing I liked a lot. > ---- Larry Young wrote: > > ============= > Ok, I'll jump in and try to make this way too technical. Both methods > are using the fact that the cylinder "mate" has it's lobes 180 degrees > apart. The rule of 9's is a bit more explicit, because it identifies > the exact lobes which are 180 degrees apart. For a 110 lobe separation > and taking the first lobe to be 0, the other lobes are at angles of: > 0, 110, 20, 270, 90, 200, 290, 180 > You can see that when lobe 1 is at zero lobe 8 is at 180 or exactly > opposite. Since two of the lobes are within 20 degrees of each other, > you might as well set those at the same time as Jim and Steve suggest. > Mark is setting the valves when the cam is split between intake and > exhaust centers. When the first two lobes are at +55 and -55, he would > set the last two lobes, which will be 55 degrees on each side of 180. I > have a small concern with this method, because some lift curves can have > ramps that extend 110 degrees are more from the centerline. Adding that > to the 55 gives you 165, which gives an allowance of 15 degrees for > error. If you're going to use this method, you need to make sure your > cam doesn't have long ramps. I use the other method for this reason. > Larry > > Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: >> Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we >> missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? >> >> I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. >> >> Pro's and cons? >> >> >> In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:07:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, >> mark at bradakis.com writes: >> >> Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> >>> We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 >>> >> and now >> >>> a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. >>> >>> >>> >>> >> Nice. >> >> >>> and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual >>> >> yet. >> >>> >>> >> >> Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and >> exhaust for >> some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed >> and the >> intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that >> cylinder's mate. >> On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the >> firing order it goes fairly quickly. >> >> >> mjb. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cartravel at pobox.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net > > > > -- > Never be beaten by equipment > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/triosan at gmail.com > > > -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Tue Mar 16 18:02:12 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 17:02:12 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: spitfire head torque and valve adjustment References: <21170FFA-CF4F-461D-A104-A93924C18B2E@earthlink.net> Message-ID: Here's a cool video of a guy adjusting valves on an MG. If you haven't done it too many times, you may find this helpful or at least mildly entertaining. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fezXUwVfH7U ~Steve From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Wed Mar 17 10:12:48 2010 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 12:12:48 -0400 Subject: [Fot] FW: tr3 race clutch?? In-Reply-To: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Amici: Can anyone help Jim out? I haven't been paying attention! There used to be a way to search the archives, but I don't see it now. Just a list of all the threads. John H. Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 08:36:05 -0700 From: jimbooth019 at yahoo.com Subject: tr3 race clutch?? To: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Hey JR, We are working on a Peerless GT vintage race car.(TR3 powered) Looking for performance clutch. any suggestions? jim From dave at microworks.net Wed Mar 17 10:23:16 2010 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 09:23:16 -0700 Subject: [Fot] FW: tr3 race clutch?? In-Reply-To: References: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4BA101F4.7020204@microworks.net> Look down at the bottom of the email. Click on the link to the Archives Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Select "fot" from the Names column - not Date or Thread from the Current Index column John Herrera wrote: > Amici: > > > > Can anyone help Jim out? I haven't been paying attention! > > > > There used to be a way to search the archives, but I don't see it now. Just a > list of all the threads. > > > > John H. > > > > Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 08:36:05 -0700 > From: jimbooth019 at yahoo.com > Subject: tr3 race clutch?? > To: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com > > > > > > Hey JR, > We are working on a Peerless GT vintage race car.(TR3 powered) Looking for > performance clutch. any suggestions? > jim > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dave at microworks.net From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 17 10:39:29 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 10:39:29 -0600 Subject: [Fot] FW: tr3 race clutch?? In-Reply-To: <4BA101F4.7020204@microworks.net> References: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4BA101F4.7020204@microworks.net> Message-ID: <4BA105C1.5050503@bradakis.com> David W. Riddle wrote: > Look down at the bottom of the email. > > Click on the link to the Archives > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Select "fot" from the Names column - not Date or Thread from the > Current Index column If you do select 'Date' or 'Thread' from the archive page, you should still get a search box right up under the heading. Interesting. If I select 'Date' I get commercial Google ads under the search box and above the listings. Those are the kind that pay me a few cents when people click on them. If I go to the 'Thread' listing, I get a non-paying public service ad. I recently made some changes, I guess it is taking Google a while to get everything updated on their end. mjb. From igofaster at att.net Wed Mar 17 11:35:22 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 10:35:22 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> eBay item 140391785085.... some people should never TOUCH a triumph Bobby Whitehad From rjl6n at cstone.net Wed Mar 17 11:47:58 2010 From: rjl6n at cstone.net (rjl6n at cstone.net) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 13:47:58 -0400 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <726f2de542a079fa64e723d559b639d7.squirrel@webmail.ntelos.net> That just might be the definition of "fugly" John On Wed, March 17, 2010 1:35 pm, Bobby Whitehead wrote: > eBay item 140391785085.... > > some people should never TOUCH a triumph > > > Bobby Whitehad > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rjl at gt-classics.com From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 17 11:59:56 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 11:59:56 -0600 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> That's the same car I pointed out a couple of weeks ago. Nobody wanted it then, wonder if it might sell this time. mjb. From emanteno at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 12:13:33 2010 From: emanteno at gmail.com (Irv Korey) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 13:13:33 -0500 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <354a1781003171113g2ab1a7d2mad42268a18703ad3@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, Mar 17, 2010 at 12:59 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > That's the same car I pointed out a couple of weeks ago. > Nobody wanted it then, wonder if it might sell this time. > There's no reserve on it now. Maybe someone will buy it and put it out of its misery. Irv From bownes at seiri.com Wed Mar 17 12:17:46 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 14:17:46 -0400 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> Message-ID: Maybe we can raise a fund to have it crushed. On Wed, Mar 17, 2010 at 1:59 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > That's the same car I pointed out a couple of weeks ago. > Nobody wanted it then, wonder if it might sell this time. > > mjb. > > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 17 12:19:00 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 12:19:00 -0600 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <354a1781003171113g2ab1a7d2mad42268a18703ad3@mail.gmail.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> <354a1781003171113g2ab1a7d2mad42268a18703ad3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4BA11D14.6000209@bradakis.com> Irv Korey wrote: > > > There's no reserve on it now. Maybe someone will buy it and put it out > of its misery. > Yep. $500 seems about right. Actually, once that hideous top is removed it might be a nice looking car. And as mentioned before, it looks like someone did a good job in relocating the hood bulge. mjb. From bownes at seiri.com Wed Mar 17 12:28:41 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 14:28:41 -0400 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <4BA11D14.6000209@bradakis.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> <354a1781003171113g2ab1a7d2mad42268a18703ad3@mail.gmail.com> <4BA11D14.6000209@bradakis.com> Message-ID: 24 hours of lemons! On Wed, Mar 17, 2010 at 2:19 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > Irv Korey wrote: > >> >> >> There's no reserve on it now. Maybe someone will buy it and put it out of >> its misery. >> >> > Yep. $500 seems about right. Actually, once that hideous top is removed > it might be a nice looking car. And as mentioned before, it looks like > someone > did a good job in relocating the hood bulge. > > mjb. > > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Wed Mar 17 13:03:26 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 14:03:26 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR transmission bushing I.D. and O.D. Message-ID: Friends, Are there specs for the I.D. and O.D. for the big TR transmissions? I've rebuilt a bunch of them over the years and occasionally I have trouble with a tranny that doesn't like downshifting into second gear. I think that the gear is hanging up on the O.D. of the bush and the bushing and gear start spinning on the mainshaft, screwing up the speed matching of the synchros. I build them with the bush tight enough that it should not spin on the mainshaft as long as the gear is spinning freely on the bush. I suspect bad repro bushes. Does anyone have an opinion or other experiences? Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 From adcronin at ameritech.net Wed Mar 17 14:15:41 2010 From: adcronin at ameritech.net (A Daniel Cronin) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 13:15:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Tabcon1 Photobucket Picture sequence---RATCO Frame Message-ID: <250880.58152.qm@web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> 3/17 Lists The site above was pointed out by Bob Adams a day or so ago in an email about Restomods. ( http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/y77/Tabcon1/ ) and contained photos of a very nice upgrade of the TR four cylinder motor---along with four frames showing RATCO's newly manufactured frame for this TR4 "restomod". I noticed that a couple of the photos had a red cross bar spanning the rear shock mounting brackets and since I also have one of Tony's (RATCO) new frames for my "restomod TR2 project" I inquired about this unfamiliar connector link. Here is the story: RATCO also makes tube shock conversion kits for TR2/3b's and rear sway bar kits. When the k as installed on some original frame vehicles there were isolated incidents of the shock brackets breaking at the frame joint, so RATCO set out to rectify the problem or stop selling the kits for original framed cars (no problems with the new frames as they are much stronger). I will quote from Tony's response as follows; "The rotation force of the lever shock on a stock frame is longitudinal and the rotation of the tube shock conversion on the bracket/frame is transverse. That places a different set of forces on the frame rails which in any case, connects the shock system to the structural base. The new tube shock mounts also have a longer are and hence a greater rotational torque. In old frames, if the weld between the shock bracket and frame has lost some structural integrity, then the chance of a break is possible. The red cross bar in the photos on Tabcon1's site was designed to transfer some of the shock pulse to the other side of the frame. The forces in the tube conversion rotate around the longitudinal axis so this brace transfers force to the opposite side during a pulse to any one side. When a simultaneous shock is hit, the effect is nilled by the brace which then takes the full force of the pulse. This "fix" will not help however if an original frame is structurally unsound." I am passing this information along in case anyone out there had preformed the tube shock and or rear sway bar upgrades on an original frame TR and is looking for a bit of "insurance" is unsure of their frames true condition. NFI Regards, Dan Cronin From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Wed Mar 17 14:33:49 2010 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 16:33:49 -0400 Subject: [Fot] FW: tr3 race clutch?? In-Reply-To: <4BA105C1.5050503@bradakis.com> References: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com>, , <4BA101F4.7020204@microworks.net>, <4BA105C1.5050503@bradakis.com> Message-ID: > If you do select 'Date' or 'Thread' from the archive page, you should still > get a search box right up under the heading. Now I see it. Thanks! John From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Wed Mar 17 19:16:03 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 20:16:03 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR transmission bushing I.D. and O.D. References: Message-ID: <5F59B0FA8CFF4D4EB1AFFF12763A0E2E@latitudefb1e41> Thanks to Bob Lang, Randall and Dean Tetterton for their input. I got home tonight and finished tearing the gearbox down. What I though looked like a nice set of gears had 2 problems. The bronze top hat bushing was broken (answering the question why it didn't want to shift down) and the forward countershaft busing was galling the countershaft. This is particularly "galling" to me since I spent time making sure the bearing all rolled, cleaning out the rollers and WD40 them until they rolled freely. The advice I got included the fact the TRF bronze top hats are too tight and need to be opened up. Mine was from TRF. Other advice was that the mainshaft gets galled from metal particles rubbing between the bushings and mainshaft. This happens when gearboxes fail, like failing galled countereshafts. Although I remember cleaning and polishing the shaft, it doesn't look perfect anymore. This would indicate that the bushings were not freely spinning on the shaft. The gears all spin on the bushings. Lesson learned. I didn't think the bushings needed much clearance when placed on the shaft. I made them just loose enough to push them on. I don't know if this cause the top hat failure or it was just one of those things, but I think a careful rebuild will fix it. Thanks Bob, Dean amd Randall. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kramer, Robert" To: "FOT" Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2010 2:03 PM Subject: [Fot] TR transmission bushing I.D. and O.D. > Friends, > > Are there specs for the I.D. and O.D. for the big TR transmissions? I've > rebuilt a bunch of them over the years and occasionally I have trouble > with a > tranny that doesn't like downshifting into second gear. I think that the > gear > is hanging up on the O.D. of the bush and the bushing and gear start > spinning > on the mainshaft, screwing up the speed matching of the synchros. I build > them > with the bush tight enough that it should not spin on the mainshaft as > long as > the gear is spinning freely on the bush. I suspect bad repro bushes. Does > anyone have an opinion or other experiences? > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From vintage.racer at comcast.net Wed Mar 17 19:25:18 2010 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 18:25:18 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Great British Film Message-ID: <000001cac639$dfc22a80$9f467f80$@racer@comcast.net> Yes, the subject is MG but this is a great period company film. Classic commentary and music and wonderful footage inside the Abington factory. Gary http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=81695 From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 17 21:36:51 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 21:36:51 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR transmission bushing I.D. and O.D. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4BA19FD3.1060704@bradakis.com> Kramer, Robert wrote > I've > rebuilt a bunch of them over the years and occasionally I have trouble with a > tranny that doesn't like downshifting into second gear. > Is the polished, conical synchro grabbing face of the gear actually polished and at the proper angle? mjb. From tony at tonydrews.com Sat Mar 20 01:22:27 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 02:22:27 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) Message-ID: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews From dmitchel at sbcglobal.net Sat Mar 20 05:43:36 2010 From: dmitchel at sbcglobal.net (Doug Mitchell) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 07:43:36 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <006301cac822$94141db0$bc3c5910$@net> Funny you should send this link. In a past life, I flew gliders while I was stationed in the UK. I watched it the other day and it reminded me of the great time I had. If you watch it to the end, the same guy has a link to his 'MakerBot' additive manufacturing machine. This is also neat, and brings me to my current day job making AM parts. The MakerBot is a home assembled AM machine that you can link to your computer and make just about anything you can design in CAD. Or you can download parts from Thingiverse. www.makerbot.com and www.thingiverse.com. Doug -- Doug Mitchell dmitchel at sbcglobal.net -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Tony Drews Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 3:22 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dmitchel at sbcglobal.net From ehusmann53 at yahoo.com Sat Mar 20 06:01:04 2010 From: ehusmann53 at yahoo.com (Ernest Husmann) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 05:01:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <171635.23434.qm@web57613.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Wow, how do I get a ticket on that plane? --- On Sat, 3/20/10, Tony Drews wrote: From: Tony Drews Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) To: fot at autox.team.net Date: Saturday, March 20, 2010, 2:22 AM I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ehusmann53 at yahoo.com From n197tr4 at cs.com Sat Mar 20 08:26:42 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 10:26:42 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <8CC96507EF2920C-91C-DB2E@webmail-m049.sysops.aol.com> The high banks and bluffs of the Missippi River between Lansing and Prairie Du Chien provide some entertainment for low level flying. Landing at Meigs (former) Field while looking up at the Sears (former) Building provides a little of the same sensation for small town Iowa Boys. Especially when the tower control frequency dropped out and there was a scramble to get clearance on ground control. 'WHAT'S YOUR POSITION 32 ALPHA?" "DOWNWIND TO 18" "CLEARED TO LAND!!!!" 1960s radios were not all that reliable. >From a Louisiana Bayou...... -----Original Message----- From: Tony Drews To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Sat, Mar 20, 2010 2:22 am Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com = From tarch at bellsouth.net Sat Mar 20 09:58:26 2010 From: tarch at bellsouth.net (Richard Taylor) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 11:58:26 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <8CC96507EF2920C-91C-DB2E@webmail-m049.sysops.aol.com> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> <8CC96507EF2920C-91C-DB2E@webmail-m049.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <000801cac846$2d5f32c0$881d9840$@net> Wow! That's as far removed to glider flying in the South as it gets! Soaring, down here, is a miserly endeavor. Every moment is spent salvaging altitude and caging airspeeds....kind like driving an over-weight, underpowered TR-4 where momentum is everything. Richard -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of n197tr4 at cs.com Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 10:27 AM To: tony at tonydrews.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) The high banks and bluffs of the Missippi River between Lansing and Prairie Du Chien provide some entertainment for low level flying. Landing at Meigs (former) Field while looking up at the Sears (former) Building provides a little of the same sensation for small town Iowa Boys. Especially when the tower control frequency dropped out and there was a scramble to get clearance on ground control. 'WHAT'S YOUR POSITION 32 ALPHA?" "DOWNWIND TO 18" "CLEARED TO LAND!!!!" 1960s radios were not all that reliable. >From a Louisiana Bayou...... -----Original Message----- From: Tony Drews To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Sat, Mar 20, 2010 2:22 am Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com = _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tarch at bellsouth.net From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Sat Mar 20 20:34:04 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:34:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Message-ID: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl From budscars at comcast.net Sat Mar 20 21:01:31 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 20:01:31 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <184B4D18B4E048B59FD00BC7C2DEC93B@Bud> Woooohoo!....Good Job Guys....Go Baby go!!..Thanks for sending!..terrific stuff...including the Happy Dog running back and forth and the cute little kid slowly moving closer and closer to the excitement! God Bless! Racer Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Mehl" To: "Triumph Friends of" Cc: "Mike Mehl" Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:34 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of > my > race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor > issues > that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the > link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water > leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is > leaking > and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the > bolts) > and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it > around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. > > I am pretty > excited!! > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > > Mike Mehl > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From mark at bradakis.com Sat Mar 20 22:28:40 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 22:28:40 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4BA5A078.7040501@bradakis.com> Nice!! mjb. From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sat Mar 20 22:44:59 2010 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 21:44:59 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1384B905A5AA4AF98F812C8AE96D67CE@desktop> Good work Mike, see ya soon at the track! Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Mehl" To: "Triumph Friends of" Cc: "Mike Mehl" Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:34 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of > my > race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor > issues > that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the > link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water > leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is > leaking > and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the > bolts) > and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it > around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. > > I am pretty > excited!! > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > > Mike Mehl > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/charly at mitchelplumbing.com From tony at tonydrews.com Sat Mar 20 23:40:41 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 00:40:41 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20100321064020.6485D187653@autox.team.net> Mike, Congratulations! It's been a long time coming! I have one concern, however. I think your trunk support may not be substantial enough. :) - Tony Drews At 09:34 PM 3/20/2010, Mike Mehl wrote: >Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my >race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues >that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the >link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water >leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking >and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) >and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it >around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. > >I am pretty >excited!! > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > >Mike Mehl From BillDentin at aol.com Sun Mar 21 07:55:50 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 09:55:50 EDT Subject: [Fot] Triumph TR5 (WASP) Prototypes... Message-ID: <74d4e.4fbaa6a8.38d77f66@aol.com> Amici... The current issue of Triumph World magazine has a letter from a guy named Mike Geddes over in England, who is in the process of restoring X753, one of the TR5 (Wasp) prototypes. He describes the car as an engine test bed, with a prototype chassis set up and several factory body mods. He considers the car's history to be particularly interesting because it spent some time in the USA. We didn't see many TR5s over here because of emissions issues. He suspects this one may have been used over here for emissions testing. He is looking to make contact with anyone who might have information about the car. I never heard of this prototype. Kas? Incidentally, in the same issue, Paul Richardson has a great article about the late Peter Cox. Coxy was a guy I never met, but I sure felt I knew him, and he sure was the source of genuine Triumph competition parts for many, many years. Bill Dentinger From kaskas at cox.net Sun Mar 21 09:25:40 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 8:25:40 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Triumph TR5 (WASP) Prototypes... In-Reply-To: <74d4e.4fbaa6a8.38d77f66@aol.com> Message-ID: <20100321112540.USJAL.156191.imail@fed1rmwml43> I have been asked about this TR-5 car before. I knew nothing of it. I suppose it was in Michigan for the emission testing. It failed I presume and is why the TR-6 had twin carbs instead. If this is the same Peter Cox thatt worked in the Competition Department at the factory I did know him and furnished him camshafts at one time. ---- BillDentin at aol.com wrote: ============= Amici... The current issue of Triumph World magazine has a letter from a guy named Mike Geddes over in England, who is in the process of restoring X753, one of the TR5 (Wasp) prototypes. He describes the car as an engine test bed, with a prototype chassis set up and several factory body mods. He considers the car's history to be particularly interesting because it spent some time in the USA. We didn't see many TR5s over here because of emissions issues. He suspects this one may have been used over here for emissions testing. He is looking to make contact with anyone who might have information about the car. I never heard of this prototype. Kas? Incidentally, in the same issue, Paul Richardson has a great article about the late Peter Cox. Coxy was a guy I never met, but I sure felt I knew him, and he sure was the source of genuine Triumph competition parts for many, many years. Bill Dentinger _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From jhassall at blacksburg.net Sun Mar 21 09:42:45 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 11:42:45 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <4BA63E75.4000404@blacksburg.net> On 3/20/2010 3:22 AM, Tony Drews wrote: > I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot > background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video > that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. > http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm > > - Tony Drews Kewl. When I had about 200 hours SEL I decided to get a glider rating, so I showed up at the airport carrying my usual accouterment of pilot gear, including my headsets. Not one of the glider guys laughed at me (at least not while I was looking). I was absolutely blown away by how quiet the flights were - you could actually hear changes in the air! But then we didn't have "tunes" playing, either. I guess out west you can get away with flying as low as the video guy did. Here in the east there's too much radar coverage to allow that sort of stunt w/o a visit from the FAA. Tnx for sharing it Tony. jim -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Sun Mar 21 10:18:57 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 11:18:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumph TR5 (WASP) Prototypes... References: <20100321112540.USJAL.156191.imail@fed1rmwml43> Message-ID: <8B18A6AB55C7469C81CBED7A89A939D1@latitudefb1e41> There is a guy nearby to austin that has a WASP TR4 with a 6 cylinder engine. I've seen the number tag on the keys that says WASP. He says it was the TR250 Emmission test car. It is available for sale as an uncompleted restoration if anyone is interested. He has always thought it was worth a lot more than it is. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kas Kastner" To: ; Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 10:25 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumph TR5 (WASP) Prototypes... >I have been asked about this TR-5 car before. I knew nothing of it. I >suppose it was in Michigan for the emission testing. It failed I presume >and is why the TR-6 had twin carbs instead. If this is the same Peter Cox >thatt worked in the Competition Department at the factory I did know him >and furnished him camshafts at one time. > ---- BillDentin at aol.com wrote: > > ============= > Amici... > > The current issue of Triumph World magazine has a letter from a guy named > Mike Geddes over in England, who is in the process of restoring X753, one > of > the TR5 (Wasp) prototypes. He describes the car as an engine test bed, > with > a prototype chassis set up and several factory body mods. He considers > the > car's history to be particularly interesting because it spent some time in > the USA. We didn't see many TR5s over here because of emissions issues. > He > suspects this one may have been used over here for emissions testing. He > is looking to make contact with anyone who might have information about > the > car. I never heard of this prototype. Kas? > > Incidentally, in the same issue, Paul Richardson has a great article about > the late Peter Cox. Coxy was a guy I never met, but I sure felt I knew > him, > and he sure was the source of genuine Triumph competition parts for many, > many years. > > Bill Dentinger > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net > > > > -- > Never be beaten by equipment > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From adams910 at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 10:22:10 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 12:22:10 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <4BA63E75.4000404@blacksburg.net> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> <4BA63E75.4000404@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: <673993c51003210922r613b9c2fuc375f0828029f15c@mail.gmail.com> You guys might appreciate this then, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttz5oPpF1Js From m-syork at comcast.net Sun Mar 21 11:07:47 2010 From: m-syork at comcast.net (Mark York) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 10:07:47 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000001cac919$0877e140$d1ab1218@markv8zno7deim> Mike Glad to have another Triumph in the Northwest, we really have a great group of guys. I look forward to seeing you; let me know if I can help in any way. Mark York TR3A #:14 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mike Mehl Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:34 PM To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/m-syork at comcast.net From timmurph at fastbytes.com Sun Mar 21 13:33:59 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 14:33:59 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002501cac92d$7556bb10$60043130$@com> Congratulations, Mike! I know the sweet feeling of starting it up for the first time after a lot of work. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mike Mehl Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 9:34 PM To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Sun Mar 21 13:42:48 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 12:42:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. Mike ________________________________ From: Mike Mehl To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From billb at bnj.com Sun Mar 21 13:50:30 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 09:50:30 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: It sounded like the pump. You might try a little belt dressing and see if it quits, or change the tension. To be sure it isn't coming from the motor remove the belt and see if it's still there. On Mar 21, 2010, at 9:42 AM, Mike Mehl wrote: > Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is > the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump > pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if > I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak > with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing > but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new > also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it > squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. > Mike > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Mike Mehl > > To: Triumph Friends of > Cc: Mike > Mehl > Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM > Subject: [Fot] > Started the TR4 today!!! > > Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button > today with the help of my > race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. > We had a few minor issues > that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help > solve. I am attaching the > link to the you tube video my son shot. I have > some small isuses. Water > leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of > the valve cover is leaking > and the new water pump is squealing (could be the > pulley rubbing on the bolts) > and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the > end of the day i drove it > around the block. You can hear the water pump in > the video. > > I am pretty > excited!! > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > > Mike Mehl > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Sun Mar 21 13:53:23 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 12:53:23 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Sounds like you must use the process of elimination to determine the source of the squeaking. First, get a piece of tubing about 24" long and at least 1/2 ID and use it as a listening device. Have your assistant work the throttle and listen to the areas you suspect as if you are a Doctor with a stethascope. It may help you pinpoint the location. I suppose the belt could squeak if the belt tension is too loose or if it is lubricated in some way. You could put a little belt dressing on the belt to eliminate any slippage and make sure it's tight. If you think it's the water pump, you may want to try a different one. I know it's a pain to drain the water but it's not too tough to change. I do not run an alternator on my TR3. You could use a shorter belt and bypass the alternator to see if it still squeaks. ~Steve On Mar 21, 2010, at 12:42 PM, Mike Mehl wrote: Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. Mike ________________________________ From: Mike Mehl To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Sun Mar 21 14:50:50 2010 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 16:50:50 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>, <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: > pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if > I could get it to squeak. No luck. Running the water pump with a drill would not put side loads on it like running it with a belt would, and might not cause it to squeak like it would when run by a belt. John From budscars at comcast.net Sun Mar 21 15:49:08 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 14:49:08 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>, <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <354E17843ADE4175A683BEF4012AE57E@Bud> problem may just be a new tight belt...OLD FASHIONED TEST...start the car...take a hard stick grease...touch it gently to the inside of the belt for about 5 seconds(be careful of course)...see if the sound changes/goes away.. Racer Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Herrera" To: ; "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 1:50 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! >> pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see > if >> I could get it to squeak. No luck. > > > > Running the water pump with a drill would not put side loads on it like > running it with a belt would, and might not cause it to squeak like it > would > when run by a belt. > > > > John > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From jmwagner at greenheart.com Sun Mar 21 16:05:41 2010 From: jmwagner at greenheart.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 15:05:41 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <354E17843ADE4175A683BEF4012AE57E@Bud> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>, <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <354E17843ADE4175A683BEF4012AE57E@Bud> Message-ID: <4BA69835.1000406@greenheart.com> I find spraying or squirting a little belt dressing on the belt and seeing if that causes the sound to change works well... though the stuff does tend to fly off onto the paint, etc. --Justin RACER BUD wrote: > problem may just be a new tight belt...OLD FASHIONED TEST...start the > car...take a hard stick grease...touch it gently to the inside of the > belt for about 5 seconds(be careful of course)...see if the sound > changes/goes away.. > Racer Bud > ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Herrera" > > To: ; "Friends of Triumph" > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 1:50 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > > >>> pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill >>> to see >> >> if >> >>> I could get it to squeak. No luck. >> >> >> >> >> Running the water pump with a drill would not put side loads on it like >> running it with a belt would, and might not cause it to squeak like >> it would >> when run by a belt. >> >> >> >> John >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net > > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jmwagner at greenheart.com From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Sun Mar 21 20:33:41 2010 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 19:33:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <292451.31285.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Mike: Are you running a cogged belt? I have found these to squeak more often then non-cogged belts. Try an old style solid belt if you are using a cogged one. Just my two cents worth. -Ed- --- On Sun, 3/21/10, Mike Mehl wrote: From: Mike Mehl Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! To: "Triumph Friends of" Date: Sunday, March 21, 2010, 2:42 PM Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. Mike ________________________________ From: Mike Mehl To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Sun Mar 21 23:17:13 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 22:17:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <03ca01cac97e$ef3ac970$0301a8c0@randall> > Any thoughts??? Just because no one else mentioned it : check to be sure that the belt isn't riding against the bottom of any of the pulleys. If it is, you'll need a wider (or unworn) belt; or a narrower (or unworn) pulley. If the paint is polished off the bottom of the groove, the belt is hitting it. Randall From lang at isis.mit.edu Mon Mar 22 08:52:40 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 10:52:40 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] TR4 First Start VidZ Message-ID: Hi, Congrats on the first start on your TR4. There really is nothing quite like that initial euphoria/surprise/joy/relief when all those hours start to pay off. When I was watching the RAW vid, two things really jumped out at me: 1. there's a new, budding Triumph fan in the form of a younger child walking toward the car in the background, obviously trying to figure out what's going on. How kool is that! 2. I think the dog barking and running back and forth was kind of fun... sort of like watching sheepdogs herding sheep. Not sure why, but it struck me funny. I think I was thinking about herding cats at the time. Which would be sort of true for Triumph people. Good luck with your race car!!! It sounds awesome. rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From cwnfot at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 08:56:20 2010 From: cwnfot at gmail.com (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 10:56:20 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! - squeak In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <009501cac9cf$d693bca0$83bb35e0$@com> Does the engine still have the squeak if the belt is removed? We had a squeak in a MGTD engine, turns out the front cam bearing was improperly made/sized and tight on the cam. It stuck to the cam and rotated in the block, ultimately a disaster! Clark Clark W. Nicholls 1972 Stag 1974 Spitfire (and 1 rusty GT6 needing restoration) "Reality, it's not what you think." From triosan at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 11:25:54 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 10:25:54 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From triosan at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 11:35:09 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 10:35:09 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it just got worse, so I only got one long session in. So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out if it helps until race day. OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! Thanks, Chuck -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From tr4racing at googlemail.com Mon Mar 22 11:39:35 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 18:39:35 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> I would try to remove the rev limiter first and then test. They might go bad after years. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 18:35 An: Friends; Triumph; TR list Betreff: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it just got worse, so I only got one long session in. So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out if it helps until race day. OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! Thanks, Chuck -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 12:05:36 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 08:05:36 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <452A731C-C017-4664-B744-57EECE0CEC4B@bnj.com> Are you running an alternator? I've found electronic ignition is sometimes unreliable on a battery-only system. Pertronix used to be unreliable at lower voltages, but they seem to do better now--Tony put a Pertronix back into Peyote when he stuck a small alternator on it. The alternator didn't last, but the Pertronix is working OK. Battery-only systems run at 12.5 volts or lower, when you have an alternator the system is usually at 14 volts. You also should check your wiring gauge and connections. The wiring for most electronic ignition requires a high current capacity wire to the box. It doesn't draw high current constantly, but any excess resistance in this wire will screw things up. In the past I have both crimped and soldered the connectors to the ignition system since any vibrational jitters cause problems. On Mar 22, 2010, at 7:35 AM, Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley wrote: > I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor > [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock > dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car > this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First > two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension > issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over > the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to > 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach > would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is > setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and > found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had > "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it > belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it > just got worse, so I only got one long session in. > > So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the > Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. > What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual > point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out > if it helps until race day. > > OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run > a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! > > Thanks, > > Chuck > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Mon Mar 22 12:47:14 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 13:47:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Chuck, We had talked about getting some 700 lb springs made up. I tightened up my rear swaybar all the way and improved my car a bit but I'd still be interested in a set of springs if somebody is going to get them made. I'm pretty sure Ted Schumacher can do this for us. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:26 PM To: Friends Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com From fasttrs at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 13:00:24 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 12:00:24 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <163293.69843.qm@web46110.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Chuck, I have 2.5 I.d. Coilover springs on mine with spacers. They will fit the rear spring perches just not the front. Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 12:25 PM, "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" wrote: Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From fasttrs at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 13:05:52 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 12:05:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice Message-ID: <50003.91023.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> How are your Egts when it is cutting out on you? Are you sure you are getting proper fuel delivery for the FI? Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 12:35 PM, "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" wrote: I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it just got worse, so I only got one long session in. So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out if it helps until race day. OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! Thanks, Chuck -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From lang at isis.mit.edu Mon Mar 22 13:29:58 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 15:29:58 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, I'm running 600 pounders (by my calcs... Triumph Tune says slightly less), but they are the Triumph Tune "Sprint" springs. My car squats pretty easily when I tromp on it. Count me in as interested in something stiffer in the rear spring dept. Hmmm. That doesn't sound right, for some reason. :-) But 700 pound springs would be something interesting to try on my autocross TR6. rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lang at isis.mit.edu Mon Mar 22 13:34:12 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 15:34:12 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <163293.69843.qm@web46110.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <163293.69843.qm@web46110.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Mar 2010, Mike Munson wrote: > Chuck, I have 2.5 I.d. Coilover springs on mine with spacers. They will > fit the rear spring perches just not the front. Ah - right. We went down this path before. Thanks for the reminder, Mike! > Mike regards, rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From fasttrs at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 14:33:12 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 13:33:12 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <616142.58250.qm@web46106.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> 900 pounders wow. Those sound like the RR boxcar springs (inners). That I had on my auto cross car. The wire was huge on those springs. I have heard that Toms whole car doesn't weigh much more than that ;-) Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 12:25 PM, "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" wrote: Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Mon Mar 22 16:02:43 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 17:02:43 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <006001caca0b$6681bcf0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> I don't know much about the PI, but I had the same problem a while ago with carbs and it was fuel related. Does the PI have any kind of filter or screen in line? Could it be debris in the fuel system or a partial clog? Are you running braided lines? They can deteriorate inside. Do you run a pressure gauge and if so, what does the presure do? What happens if you switch off the fuel pump (I'm assuming it's electric) for a couple seconds , then switch it back on? A wise man once told me that about half of ignition problems were actually fuel related. Or maybe it was the other way around; I'm getting old and sometimes forget! Either way, check all possibilities. Good luck, Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" To: "Friends" ; "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net>; "TR list" Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:35 PM Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice > I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor > [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock > dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car > this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First > two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension > issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over > the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to > 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach > would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is > setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and > found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had > "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it > belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it > just got worse, so I only got one long session in. > > So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the > Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. > What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual > point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out > if it helps until race day. > > OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run > a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! > > Thanks, > > Chuck > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From n197tr4 at cs.com Mon Mar 22 15:13:34 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 17:13:34 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Race Car Problem Now ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS In-Reply-To: <881240.45638.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <881240.45638.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CC981BAAA61C2A-B94-A574@webmail-d053.sysops.aol.com> ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS JEFF SCHLEMMER MINNESOTA I met Jeff at a BMTA Conference......and subsequently visited his facilities in Minnesota. Recently, I invited him to join us at Heartland Park and he is looking closely at his calendar. He would make a great resource at the track for the FOT....AND EVERYONE. I hope he makes it. Joe A. -----Original Message----- From: michael lunsford To: 6pack at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, Mar 22, 2010 3:11 pm Subject: [6pack] Race Car Problem Chuck, ave you considered whether or not the new dizzy and crane setup calls for a allasted or non ballasted coil. I recently had my dizzy rebuilt by Advanced istributors (NFI) and had him install the pertronix insert installed he was oing the rebuild. The guy (sorry don't racall who but he did a great Job) anted me to be sure that I had the proper coil installed since I told him I ad problems with Pertronix ignitions in the past. My 1970 came with an nballasted ignition setup which he said probably provided too much voltage to he pertronix setup and burnt it out. The symptoms you described are the same s I observed on the old setup that went bad. Good luck. ike Lunsford ______________________________________________ 6pack at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/6pack/n197tr4 at cs.com From kaskas at cox.net Mon Mar 22 15:36:12 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 14:36:12 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Race Car Problem Now ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS In-Reply-To: <8CC981BAAA61C2A-B94-A574@webmail-d053.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <20100322173612.M7URX.175913.imail@fed1rmwml35> That would be cool to have him there. He did the distributor for the GT-6 project that I am writing about to finish up my new book. Looks great and expect it to be a world better that the usual stock unit. Should be going to the dyno in the near future. ---- n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: ============= ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS JEFF SCHLEMMER MINNESOTA I met Jeff at a BMTA Conference......and subsequently visited his facilities in Minnesota. Recently, I invited him to join us at Heartland Park and he is looking closely at his calendar. He would make a great resource at the track for the FOT....AND EVERYONE. I hope he makes it. Joe A. -----Original Message----- From: michael lunsford To: 6pack at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, Mar 22, 2010 3:11 pm Subject: [6pack] Race Car Problem Chuck, ave you considered whether or not the new dizzy and crane setup calls for a allasted or non ballasted coil. I recently had my dizzy rebuilt by Advanced istributors (NFI) and had him install the pertronix insert installed he was oing the rebuild. The guy (sorry don't racall who but he did a great Job) anted me to be sure that I had the proper coil installed since I told him I ad problems with Pertronix ignitions in the past. My 1970 came with an nballasted ignition setup which he said probably provided too much voltage to he pertronix setup and burnt it out. The symptoms you described are the same s I observed on the old setup that went bad. Good luck. ike Lunsford ______________________________________________ 6pack at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/6pack/n197tr4 at cs.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From budscars at comcast.net Mon Mar 22 15:41:13 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 14:41:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Fw: Emailing: Dick Scott, Alfa Message-ID: Hi Gang...what's wrong with this photo?..or...FP was tough in those days! Racer Bud..Spitfire #21 The message is ready to be sent with the following file or link attachments: Dick Scott, Alfa Note: To protect against computer viruses, e-mail programs may prevent sending or receiving certain types of file attachments. Check your e-mail security settings to determine how attachments are handled. [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Dick Scott, Alfa.jpg] From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Mon Mar 22 15:43:46 2010 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (toodamnfunky at comcast.net) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 21:43:46 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <006001caca0b$6681bcf0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <376756342.6580351269294226856.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> When I ran Strombergs I had a similar problem and it turned out to be one of my dashpots was dry and sticking. Jim G ----- Original Message ----- From: "WILLIAM TOBIN" To: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" , "Friends" , "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net>, "TR list" Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 4:02:43 PM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain Subject: Re: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice B B I don't know much about the PI, but I had the same problem a while ago with carbs and it was fuel related. B B Does the PI have any kind of filter or screen in line? Could it be debris in the fuel system or a partial clog? B B Are you running braided lines? B They can deteriorate inside. Do you run a pressure gauge and if so, what does the presure do? What happens if you switch off the fuel pump (I'm assuming it's electric) for a couple seconds , then switch it back on? B B A wise man once told me that about half of ignition problems were actually fuel related. Or maybe it was the other way around; I'm getting old and sometimes forget! Either way, check all possibilities. B B Good luck, Bill----- Original Message ----- B B From: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" B B To: "Friends" ; "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net>; "TR list" B B Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:35 PM B B Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice B B > I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. B It has a Pertronix distributor B B > [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock B B > dizzy]. B I also have a Crane ignition. B First time out with the car B B > this year. B Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. B First B B > two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension B B > issues, but worked those out]. B The third session was longer, and over B B > the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to B B > 5500 RPM. B It did not do this always, but most of the time. B The tach B B > would swing wildly. B It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is B B > setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. B I did some investigating and B B > found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had B B > "walked" to quite far advanced. B I though putting it back to where it B B > belonged would fix the issue. B IT did not. B At the Sunday event it B B > just got worse, so I only got one long session in. B B > B B > So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the B B > Crane. B I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. B B > What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? B I do have a dual B B > point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out B B > if it helps until race day. B B > B B > OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run B B > a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! B B > B B > Thanks, B B > B B > Chuck B B > B B > -- B B > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley B B > B B > _______________________________________________ B B > fot at autox.team.net B B > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html B B > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive B B > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums B B > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/toodamnfunky at comcast.net From billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 16:02:22 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 12:02:22 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <006001caca0b$6681bcf0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> <006001caca0b$6681bcf0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: Definitely the other way around. Most fuel problem wind up to be ignition. I once worked for a mechanic who kept track of the troubleshooting he did, literally wrote it down in a notebook. Wore lab coats to work--pressed--pain in the ass guy, but I learned a few things from him. He showed me once that the huge majority of the problems with a misfire he worked on were caused by ignition. On Mar 22, 2010, at 12:02 PM, WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: > I don't know much about the PI, but I had the same problem a while ago > with carbs and it was fuel related. > Does the PI have any kind of filter or screen in line? Could it be debris > in the fuel system or a partial clog? > Are you running braided lines? They can deteriorate inside. Do you run a > pressure gauge and if so, what does the presure do? What happens if you > switch off the fuel pump (I'm assuming it's electric) for a couple seconds , > then switch it back on? > A wise man once told me that about half of ignition problems were actually > fuel related. Or maybe it was the other way around; I'm getting old and > sometimes forget! Either way, check all possibilities. > Good luck, Bill----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" > To: "Friends" ; "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net>; "TR > list" > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:35 PM > Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice From tr4racing at googlemail.com Mon Mar 22 17:10:34 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 00:10:34 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> I belive in soft main springs and hard swaybars. My car is using the stock springs with a little rubber uprate at front and stock leafs at rear. Swaybars at front and rear balance the car. At the moment I'm working at making the swaybars stiffer than they was last year. Less bodyroll. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Kramer, Robert Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 19:47 An: Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley; Friends Betreff: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Chuck, We had talked about getting some 700 lb springs made up. I tightened up my rear swaybar all the way and improved my car a bit but I'd still be interested in a set of springs if somebody is going to get them made. I'm pretty sure Ted Schumacher can do this for us. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:26 PM To: Friends Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From Billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 17:39:05 2010 From: Billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 13:39:05 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> Message-ID: <9BE2284A-0B98-466F-85D5-E9DE73877B9D@bnj.com> I don't think much of stiff springs either unless you can't get the suspension to work Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 1:10 PM, "MadMarx" wrote: > I belive in soft main springs and hard swaybars. > My car is using the stock springs with a little rubber uprate at > front and > stock leafs at rear. > Swaybars at front and rear balance the car. At the moment I'm > working at > making the swaybars stiffer than they was last year. Less bodyroll. > > Cheers > Chris > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Kramer, Robert > Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 19:47 > An: Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley; Friends > Betreff: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Chuck, > > We had talked about getting some 700 lb springs made up. I tightened > up my > rear swaybar all the way and improved my car a bit but I'd still be > interested > in a set of springs if somebody is going to get them made. I'm > pretty sure > Ted > Schumacher can do this for us. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] > On > Behalf > Of Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:26 PM > To: Friends > Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran > poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy > turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I > would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked > about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN > race on April 10th. > > PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back > asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get > heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From adams910 at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 20:06:56 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 22:06:56 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> Message-ID: <673993c51003221906j5f7cb565ra0be44fb15152ef3@mail.gmail.com> I remember this conversation last time it came around. Keep in mind you spring to the tires. A 9" wide cantilever slick is going to produce a ton more grip than a Hoosier Speedster will ever produce. Just one of many things to keep in mind. Bob From kaskas at cox.net Mon Mar 22 20:07:57 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 19:07:57 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <9BE2284A-0B98-466F-85D5-E9DE73877B9D@bnj.com> Message-ID: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> Well, it might be true for a lot of cars, but the IRS Triumph needs some umph in the rear end. Anything around 600 pounds is a disaster and SLOW. I am talking about the stock suspension not the SCCA version. Like beer, try it you'll like it. ---- Bill Babcock wrote: ============= I don't think much of stiff springs either unless you can't get the suspension to work Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 1:10 PM, "MadMarx" wrote: > I belive in soft main springs and hard swaybars. > My car is using the stock springs with a little rubber uprate at > front and > stock leafs at rear. > Swaybars at front and rear balance the car. At the moment I'm > working at > making the swaybars stiffer than they was last year. Less bodyroll. > > Cheers > Chris > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Kramer, Robert > Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 19:47 > An: Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley; Friends > Betreff: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Chuck, > > We had talked about getting some 700 lb springs made up. I tightened > up my > rear swaybar all the way and improved my car a bit but I'd still be > interested > in a set of springs if somebody is going to get them made. I'm > pretty sure > Ted > Schumacher can do this for us. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] > On > Behalf > Of Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:26 PM > To: Friends > Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran > poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy > turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I > would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked > about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN > race on April 10th. > > PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back > asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get > heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 20:25:11 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 19:25:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Race Car Problem Now ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS In-Reply-To: <8CC981BAAA61C2A-B94-A574@webmail-d053.sysops.aol.com> References: <881240.45638.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <8CC981BAAA61C2A-B94-A574@webmail-d053.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <710421.30346.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> He did my TR4 Distributor. First class job. Mike Mehl ________________________________ From: "n197tr4 at cs.com" To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, March 22, 2010 2:13:34 PM Subject: [Fot] Race Car Problem Now ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS JEFF SCHLEMMER MINNESOTA I met Jeff at a BMTA Conference......and subsequently visited his facilities in Minnesota. Recently, I invited him to join us at Heartland Park and he is looking closely at his calendar. He would make a great resource at the track for the FOT....AND EVERYONE. I hope he makes it. Joe A. -----Original Message----- From: michael lunsford To: 6pack at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, Mar 22, 2010 3:11 pm Subject: [6pack] Race Car Problem Chuck, ave you considered whether or not the new dizzy and crane setup calls for a allasted or non ballasted coil. I recently had my dizzy rebuilt by Advanced istributors (NFI) and had him install the pertronix insert installed he was oing the rebuild. The guy (sorry don't racall who but he did a great Job) anted me to be sure that I had the proper coil installed since I told him I ad problems with Pertronix ignitions in the past. My 1970 came with an nballasted ignition setup which he said probably provided too much voltage to he pertronix setup and burnt it out. The symptoms you described are the same s I observed on the old setup that went bad. Good luck. ike Lunsford ______________________________________________ 6pack at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/6pack/n197tr4 at cs.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From norlinengineering at comcast.net Mon Mar 22 21:50:19 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 20:50:19 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Thunderhill Double National Race Report Message-ID: <2C0A7FA91B9049E0A4D3D355976D3306@TOSHIBALAPTOP> My first (and second) races at Thunderhill were a wonderful experience. I was the only Triumph at the event, but ran into several old Triumph racers and some new ones as well - nomination to follow. There were 6 entries in H Production and I was the slowest. However, by the end of the weekend I was within 7 seconds of the HP lap record and had a very good race long battle with a Fiat X19 and a Toyota Yaris. Finished 5th on Saturday and 4th on Sunday. Not bad considering first time driving the track with a vintage car on DOT tires. The track is so different from my home track at Portland. I couldn't belive the amount of time I spent at full throttle in fourth gear in turns. And then there were the blind corners. Those just take seat time to get the confidence level built up. Virtually no time to relax. The facilities are great with lots of paddock space, hot showers, an on-site mini mart and self serve race fuel at racer friendly prices. Had a great time, met some good folks, learned a lot and have already ordered a few bits to improve the brakes on the Spit. Looking forward to the rest of the season. Jim Norlin From norlinengineering at comcast.net Mon Mar 22 22:01:09 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 21:01:09 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Nomination Message-ID: I'd like to nominate Tim Pettenati as a new member of our distinguished non-organization. I met Tim this weekend at Thunderhill. He's involved with SCCA, HMSA and other race organizations and has recently purchased a Spitfire race car. He's working on preparing it to race in HMSA and ??. If we can get a second, I'll get Tim to fill you in more on his background and his Spitfire. Jim Norlin From billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 22:08:10 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 18:08:10 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Nomination In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1C600482-E2E8-4D16-81AA-AC599EFAB9BA@bnj.com> I'll second, even though I'd normally wait for a spitty driver to pipe up On Mar 22, 2010, at 6:01 PM, Norlin Engineering wrote: > I'd like to nominate Tim Pettenati as a new member of our distinguished > non-organization. > > I met Tim this weekend at Thunderhill. He's involved with SCCA, HMSA and > other race organizations and has recently purchased a Spitfire race car. > He's working on preparing it to race in HMSA and ??. > > If we can get a second, I'll get Tim to fill you in more on his background > and his Spitfire. > > Jim Norlin > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tony at tonydrews.com Mon Mar 22 22:40:55 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 23:40:55 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> Message-ID: <20100323054033.16BB3187652@autox.team.net> I had a problem with cutting out and wildly swinging electric tach that was a loose ignition wire on my ignition switch in the dash. Was a 2 minute fix once I found it. - Tony Drews At 12:39 PM 3/22/2010, MadMarx wrote: >I would try to remove the rev limiter first and then test. They might go bad >after years. > >Cheers >Chris > > >-----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- >Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im >Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley >Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 18:35 >An: Friends; Triumph; TR list >Betreff: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice > >I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor >[the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock >dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car >this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First >two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension >issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over >the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to >5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach >would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is >setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and >found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had >"walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it >belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it >just got worse, so I only got one long session in. > >So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the >Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. >What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual >point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out >if it helps until race day. > >OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run >a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! > >Thanks, > >Chuck > >-- >Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: >http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tony at tonydrews.com From Billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 22:50:32 2010 From: Billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 18:50:32 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> References: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> Message-ID: <48093840-016A-4A8D-857D-F78990A8944C@bnj.com> I'm sure it does. I bet it needs to be locked down so it doesn't move at all. I took one look at the IRS of the TR4 and TR6 and thought "no thanks". Hard to see why they designed it that way. I would point out that I DID say "unless you can't get the suspension to work". I don't have any idea how that monkey motion stock suspension could be made to work. I think the biggest advantage of soft springing is compliance of the car to the track surface--you want the wheels to do their own thing but keep as big a contact patch as possible in the corners and over the rough stuff, and probably be on the edges of the tires down the straights. When I ran a lot of roll/bumps in simulation software for Peyote I found a stiff spring for a given wheel load overcomes the shock damping so the wheel winds up bouncing on rebound. If you increase the damping it moves the bounce to compression and the shock pumps down. With an ideal suspension setup the best spring weight is what is required to hold the fully loaded car off the ground at the required ride height with the suspension more or less centered in it's travel. At least that's the case in software. In the real world, I increased the stiffness of the springing in my Radical to accommodate my fat ass because I was grinding the splitter away and bottoming the rear suspension in some bumps. Lost about four seconds around PIR. FOUR fricking seconds, went from 1:22:yada with the chicane to 1:26:sumpthin. Played with tire pressures, shock tuning, roll bars and got about two seconds back, sort of. sometimes. You know how that goes. Put everything back to stock and got my four seconds back. Went to a lower downforce splitter and dialed most of the wing off, ground off half of the wing wickerbill, and it stopped bottoming and I got another two-three seconds. Wahoo. Went from thirds and fourths to firsts and seconds. Of course guys like Garmey can run you down in a Corvette with suspension from a Conestoga wagon and pass you with his wheels bouncing up and down like superballs. But he's F&$%ing nuts. On Mar 22, 2010, at 4:07 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > Well, it might be true for a lot of cars, but the IRS Triumph needs some umph in the rear end. Anything around 600 pounds is a disaster and SLOW. I am talking about the stock suspension not the SCCA version. Like beer, try it you'll like it. > ---- Bill Babcock wrote: > > ============= > I don't think much of stiff springs either unless you can't get the > suspension to work > > Sent from my iPhone From tpettenati at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 23:23:06 2010 From: tpettenati at yahoo.com (Tim Pettenati) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 22:23:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Nomination In-Reply-To: <1C600482-E2E8-4D16-81AA-AC599EFAB9BA@bnj.com> References: <1C600482-E2E8-4D16-81AA-AC599EFAB9BA@bnj.com> Message-ID: <711899.1492.qm@web180308.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Hi All, Intro - My wife and I have been involved in SCCA racing since the late 80's when I started crewing on a Formula Atlantic, and my wife started working grid. If you've participated to a CSRG or HMSA event in the past several years, I've been working Tech and Black Flag, and my wife Darlyn has been working Grid. In other words - she's the one you love to see, and I'm the one you hope not to see. I don't take it personally - really! Darlyn went through SCCA drivers school last year in a Spec Miata and now has her novice comp license. She'll be driving the Spit, and I'll be the wrench for the time being. Maybe next year will be my turn for drivers school. About the Spitfire - It's a 1964 1147cc and has a competition history back to the early 80's. Ran mostly at Riverside. Supposedly built with help from Lee Mueller, and has Mother Mueller comp parts. It sat in Oceanside for about 17 years before the most recent owner bought it and restored it to a period correct race car. It was back on the track for 4 races in 2009 with VARA and then HMSA Coronado last Sept.. I bought it and towed it home Feb. 2010 from Carlsbad. It currently sports a 2.5" straight-through sidepipe. I know it will need muffled before I can run anywhere in NorCal. Sounds great, but will never pass sound. So it needs just a few minor fixes before it will be track ready again. Regards, Tim Pettenati P.S. - Thanks for the nomination Jim & nice meeting you. ----- Original Message ---- From: Bill Babcock To: Norlin Engineering Cc: FoT Triumph ; tpettenati at yahoo.com Sent: Mon, March 22, 2010 9:08:10 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Nomination I'll second, even though I'd normally wait for a spitty driver to pipe up On Mar 22, 2010, at 6:01 PM, Norlin Engineering wrote: > I'd like to nominate Tim Pettenati as a new member of our distinguished > non-organization. > > I met Tim this weekend at Thunderhill. He's involved with SCCA, HMSA and > other race organizations and has recently purchased a Spitfire race car. > He's working on preparing it to race in HMSA and ??. > > If we can get a second, I'll get Tim to fill you in more on his background > and his Spitfire. > > Jim Norlin > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From kaskas at cox.net Tue Mar 23 09:07:29 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 8:07:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <48093840-016A-4A8D-857D-F78990A8944C@bnj.com> Message-ID: <20100323110729.MVD6A.184394.imail@fed1rmwml30> I have to agree about the design. Why? Why? Why? I can only figure that an upright with an axle that would not fall off and proper control arms top and bottom would have been too many pieces and alignment to put together for a production car while you just throw that big casting on and it's done. They had engineers that were smart enough to gather up the right parts and design a good setup, so cost and production line problems in my opinion are the guilty figures. ---- Bill Babcock wrote: ============= I'm sure it does. I bet it needs to be locked down so it doesn't move at all. I took one look at the IRS of the TR4 and TR6 and thought "no thanks". Hard to see why they designed it that way. I would point out that I DID say "unless you can't get the suspension to work". I don't have any idea how that monkey motion stock suspension could be made to work. I think the biggest advantage of soft springing is compliance of the car to the track surface--you want the wheels to do their own thing but keep as big a contact patch as possible in the corners and over the rough stuff, and probably be on the edges of the tires down the straights. When I ran a lot of roll/bumps in simulation software for Peyote I found a stiff spring for a given wheel load overcomes the shock damping so the wheel winds up bouncing on rebound. If you increase the damping it moves the bounce to compression and the shock pumps down. With an ideal suspension setup the best spring weight is what is required to hold the fully loaded car off the ground at the required ride height with the suspension more or less centered in it's travel. At least that's the case in software. In the real world, I increased the stiffness of the springing in my Radical to accommodate my fat ass because I was grinding the splitter away and bottoming the rear suspension in some bumps. Lost about four seconds around PIR. FOUR fricking seconds, went from 1:22:yada with the chicane to 1:26:sumpthin. Played with tire pressures, shock tuning, roll bars and got about two seconds back, sort of. sometimes. You know how that goes. Put everything back to stock and got my four seconds back. Went to a lower downforce splitter and dialed most of the wing off, ground off half of the wing wickerbill, and it stopped bottoming and I got another two-three seconds. Wahoo. Went from thirds and fourths to firsts and seconds. Of course guys like Garmey can run you down in a Corvette with suspension from a Conestoga wagon and pass you with his wheels bouncing up and down like superballs. But he's F&$%ing nuts. On Mar 22, 2010, at 4:07 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > Well, it might be true for a lot of cars, but the IRS Triumph needs some umph in the rear end. Anything around 600 pounds is a disaster and SLOW. I am talking about the stock suspension not the SCCA version. Like beer, try it you'll like it. > ---- Bill Babcock wrote: > > ============= > I don't think much of stiff springs either unless you can't get the > suspension to work > > Sent from my iPhone -- Never be beaten by equipment From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 10:03:54 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 09:03:54 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003230903u33f40848l430c051bb16f661@mail.gmail.com> Hi Kas, need a translation of "umph". I am assuming you mean a spring stiffer than 600 pounds [as Tom Kreiger indicted]? What Tom told me was that the rear end squats as power is applied in a corner. This causes the front to raise slightly producing under steer. By making the rear very stiff there is no squat and then the car will over steer giving you the ability to steer with the throttle coming out of corners =much faster. Correct? Chuck From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 10:15:21 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 09:15:21 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <4ba8465c.6344f10a.5adf.4eabSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> <4ba8465c.6344f10a.5adf.4eabSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003230915t71256879p34d2a3ff8ab9286c@mail.gmail.com> Now that is the best answer I have heard yet! Cannot check anything out till Saturday. There is one more confounding piece to all of this. I have an Innovate LM1 O2 sensor system. Hooked to it is an LM3 "Auxbox". The Auxbox captures RPM and MAP and the LM1 records it. The green wire from the Crane that go to the Tach also go to the LM3, as does a wire from where the Tach grounds. To allow the system to measure ambient air pressure before starting the car, a twelve volt feed also goes to the LM3. The wiring method is confusing [hot 12V, ground 12V are the first two; next comes the tach feed and it is Ground [-] feed then [+] Tach feed. I wired ththe tach feed backward [reversed the polarity]. I do not know if somehow this threw off a signal to the Crane that has caused damage to it. The problem I have experienced persists even though the LM 3 is now unconnected. On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 9:40 PM, Tony Drews wrote: > I had a problem with cutting out and wildly swinging electric tach that was > a loose ignition wire on my ignition switch in the dash. Was a 2 minute fix > once I found it. > > - Tony Drews From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 23 10:13:41 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 17:13:41 +0100 Subject: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003230903u33f40848l430c051bb16f661@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003230903u33f40848l430c051bb16f661@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <001101cacaa3$cfda7140$6f8f53c0$@com> Oomph? It is a German Gothic Metal band. Didn't know that Kas is metal fan ;-) http://www.youtube.com/user/OOMPHBand -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. Mdrz 2010 17:04 An: Kastner; Friends Betreff: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" Hi Kas, need a translation of "umph". I am assuming you mean a spring stiffer than 600 pounds [as Tom Kreiger indicted]? What Tom told me was that the rear end squats as power is applied in a corner. This causes the front to raise slightly producing under steer. By making the rear very stiff there is no squat and then the car will over steer giving you the ability to steer with the throttle coming out of corners =much faster. Correct? Chuck _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 10:19:16 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 09:19:16 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" In-Reply-To: <001101cacaa3$cfda7140$6f8f53c0$@com> References: <8cbd782d1003230903u33f40848l430c051bb16f661@mail.gmail.com> <001101cacaa3$cfda7140$6f8f53c0$@com> Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003230919ia3850ddic8d356286e7289fe@mail.gmail.com> Gotta think Kas has been into heavy [and hot] metal all his life-- and loves the "music" it produces! As a matter of fact, the current problem with my car is that it is not producing pleasing music! On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 9:13 AM, MadMarx wrote: > Oomph? It is a German Gothic Metal band. > Didn't know that Kas is metal fan ;-) > > http://www.youtube.com/user/OOMPHBand > > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley > Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. Mdrz 2010 17:04 > An: Kastner; Friends > Betreff: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" > > Hi Kas, need a translation of "umph". I am assuming you mean a spring > stiffer than 600 pounds [as Tom Kreiger indicted]? > > What Tom told me was that the rear end squats as power is applied in a > corner. This causes the front to raise slightly producing under > steer. By making the rear very stiff there is no squat and then the > car will over steer giving you the ability to steer with the throttle > coming out of corners =much faster. > > Correct? > > Chuck > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/triosan at gmail.com > > > -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 23 10:21:13 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 17:21:13 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003230915t71256879p34d2a3ff8ab9286c@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> <4ba8465c.6344f10a.5adf.4eabSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> <8cbd782d1003230915t71256879p34d2a3ff8ab9286c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <001201cacaa4$dcdc1aa0$96944fe0$@com> Bill had a good point with the connection of the coil to the system..... I had trouble that at hot my engine didn't start after a stall and had also misfire from time to time. Cause was the resistor at the coil. When the resistor became hot the value rised form 1.6 ohms to 1.9 ohms. The voltage dropped and the engine didn't start. Since then I use a cooled 1.5 ohms resistor that cured all ignition problems with my pertronix. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. Mdrz 2010 17:15 An: Tony Drews; Friends Betreff: Re: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice Now that is the best answer I have heard yet! Cannot check anything out till Saturday. There is one more confounding piece to all of this. I have an Innovate LM1 O2 sensor system. Hooked to it is an LM3 "Auxbox". The Auxbox captures RPM and MAP and the LM1 records it. The green wire from the Crane that go to the Tach also go to the LM3, as does a wire from where the Tach grounds. To allow the system to measure ambient air pressure before starting the car, a twelve volt feed also goes to the LM3. The wiring method is confusing [hot 12V, ground 12V are the first two; next comes the tach feed and it is Ground [-] feed then [+] Tach feed. I wired ththe tach feed backward [reversed the polarity]. I do not know if somehow this threw off a signal to the Crane that has caused damage to it. The problem I have experienced persists even though the LM 3 is now unconnected. On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 9:40 PM, Tony Drews wrote: > I had a problem with cutting out and wildly swinging electric tach that was > a loose ignition wire on my ignition switch in the dash. Was a 2 minute fix > once I found it. > > - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 13:10:50 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 12:10:50 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Recap on Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003231210y3d962a33xdec609b92dfddd48@mail.gmail.com> 1.Racing Triumphs with IRS need really stiff rear springs [700-900 range]. 2. Tom K has not weighed in -- guess he does not read the FOT mail [or do so very often]. 3. Off list if anybody has a phone number for him I would like it. 4. Does anybody have a source for ready made really stiff springs? 5. If not, I would be willing to work with Kramer and Ted S to get some made. [the faster the better -- I now understand that horrible feeling and sound coming out of power corners are my 540 pound rear springs bottoming out and first race is in three weeks! [Guess I could cut down some extra's I have and use spacerr to get proper height. -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From rodkent at cox.net Tue Mar 23 15:13:26 2010 From: rodkent at cox.net (rodkent at cox.net) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 17:13:26 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Recap on Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003231210y3d962a33xdec609b92dfddd48@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20100323171326.HT2U8.199334.imail@fed1rmwml39> Hi, As someone mentioned in an earlier post, coil over springs will work, and the quality will be much better that something a custom spring producer will come up with. The range available is endless. ---- Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley wrote: 1.Racing Triumphs with IRS need really stiff rear springs [700-900 range]. 2. Tom K has not weighed in -- guess he does not read the FOT mail [or do so very often]. 3. Off list if anybody has a phone number for him I would like it. 4. Does anybody have a source for ready made really stiff springs? 5. If not, I would be willing to work with Kramer and Ted S to get some made. [the faster the better -- I now understand that horrible feeling and sound coming out of power corners are my 540 pound rear springs bottoming out and first race is in three weeks! [Guess I could cut down some extra's I have and use spacerr to get proper height. -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rodkent at cox.net From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Tue Mar 23 16:12:57 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 17:12:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Recap on Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs References: <8cbd782d1003231210y3d962a33xdec609b92dfddd48@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20805D58B90C4E90B75F1D8262ADDF00@latitudefb1e41> I was talking to another Tr6 guy today and he pointed out that whatever spring rate we apply to the back of the IRS cars, some of the rate is lost due to the design, The spring is forward of the axle at an angle that changes with suspension movement. He surmised that we need the extra stiffness just to get a higher effective spring rate. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" To: "Friends" Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 2:10 PM Subject: [Fot] Recap on Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > 1.Racing Triumphs with IRS need really stiff rear springs [700-900 range]. > > 2. Tom K has not weighed in -- guess he does not read the FOT mail [or > do so very often]. > > 3. Off list if anybody has a phone number for him I would like it. > > 4. Does anybody have a source for ready made really stiff springs? > > 5. If not, I would be willing to work with Kramer and Ted S to get > some made. [the faster the better -- I now understand that horrible > feeling and sound coming out of power corners are my 540 pound rear > springs bottoming out and first race is in three weeks! [Guess I > could cut down some extra's I have and use spacerr to get proper > height. > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Tue Mar 23 18:32:02 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 20:32:02 -0400 Subject: [Fot] www.racingsportscars.com Message-ID: <4BA95D82.1090806@twcny.rr.com> I apologize if I did not search the archives correctly but I was surprised someone had not turned this site up before. I found races both my parents participated in '59 and '60 with my car. I have some old photos and news clips I'll have to contribute e.g. a front page 4 shot sequence of a lotus coupe rolling over with my dad hot on his tail from a racing rag at Santa Barbra - yes there was contact but the corner worker exonerated my dad (as he told it). As a kid, I remember the dent - I was at the track that day... Fun stuff... M From fasttrs at yahoo.com Tue Mar 23 20:02:18 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 19:02:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Fw: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> References: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> Message-ID: <730172.77519.qm@web46115.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> ----- Forwarded Message ---- From: Mike Munson To: Kas Kastner ; MadMarx ; Bill Babcock Cc: Chuck at autox.team.net; Friends Sent: Tue, March 23, 2010 6:21:29 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs I just did some rough measurements on a trailing arm. Pivot point to tire patch is 22 inches. Pivot point to center of spring perch is 11 inches. Now I am no math genius but that would tell me that effective spring rate is half of the spring rating you are using. BTW Kas, Sam is the only TR6 that I know of that has utilized the SCCA rules to improve the rear suspension. I am still suffering with the (to quote Bill) Monkey Motion stock suspension. Mike ________________________________ From mpendy at dishmail.net Tue Mar 23 21:56:34 2010 From: mpendy at dishmail.net (Mark Pendergrass) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 20:56:34 -0700 Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy Message-ID: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for the first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 gal. of fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive or not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know wonder this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up with.....he's at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) From tony at tonydrews.com Tue Mar 23 23:44:19 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 00:44:19 -0500 Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy In-Reply-To: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> References: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> Message-ID: <20100324064403.3EDCD18765A@autox.team.net> Mark, without driver and with a partially full fuel cell (5 to 10 gallons), my TR-4 is 2150 lbs and Jack's TR-4 was 1950 lbs. I'm not going to comment on weight with driver... :) - Tony Drews At 10:56 PM 3/23/2010, Mark Pendergrass wrote: >FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for the >first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage >folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 gal. of >fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive or >not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know wonder >this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up with.....he's >at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Wed Mar 24 06:23:30 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 07:23:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy References: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> Message-ID: My TR4A weighs in right at 2,000 lbs. less driver. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Pendergrass" To: "friends of triumph" Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 10:56 PM Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy > FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for > the > first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage > folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 > gal. of > fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive > or > not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know > wonder > this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up > with.....he's > at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From sbarr at McCarty-Law.com Wed Mar 24 06:51:03 2010 From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com (Barr, Scott) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 07:51:03 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Transport to NY? Message-ID: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74017023F1@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Is there anyone headed from or across the Midwest to New York with an available spot on a trailer? I'm selling a GT6 body shell and a potential buyer is worried about transportation. Scott B. PS - yes, Joe (C.), this is the same one I dragged back from AZ :-) From timmurph at fastbytes.com Wed Mar 24 11:50:50 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 12:50:50 -0500 Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy In-Reply-To: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> References: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> Message-ID: <000001cacb7a$8c454900$a4cfdb00$@com> When the car was weighed at Gingerman for the VSCDA ERA Correct it was a total or 2120 without driver and about 5 gallons of gas, as I recall. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark Pendergrass Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 10:57 PM To: friends of triumph Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for the first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 gal. of fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive or not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know wonder this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up with.....he's at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From rikrock at aol.com Wed Mar 24 14:56:47 2010 From: rikrock at aol.com (rikrock at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 16:56:47 -0400 Subject: [Fot] TR6 Engine Part Needed Message-ID: <8CC99ABA6E96B06-2F4-2E92@webmail-d011.sysops.aol.com> Amici, I'm looking for a distributor drive shaft (with gear) for a TR6 motor. This is the part that is driven by the gear on the cam and engages the distributor on the top side and the oil pump driveshaft on the bottom. Please let me know if you have one to sell. Thanks! Rich Rock From rblake36 at yahoo.com Wed Mar 24 15:43:42 2010 From: rblake36 at yahoo.com (Robert Blake) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 14:43:42 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <772286.73137.qm@web58501.mail.re3.yahoo.com> I have a 63 that tips the scales at a whopping 1972 lbs. Distribution is 1061 front and 911 rear. Bob Blake Dripping Springs, Texas --- On Wed, 3/24/10, Bob Kramer wrote: From: Bob Kramer Subject: Re: [Fot] am i that heavy To: "Mark Pendergrass" , "friends of triumph" Date: Wednesday, March 24, 2010, 7:23 AM My TR4A weighs in right at 2,000 lbs. less driver. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Pendergrass" To: "friends of triumph" Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 10:56 PM Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy > FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for the > first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage > folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 gal. of > fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive or > not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know wonder > this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up with.....he's > at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rblake36 at yahoo.com From ablake2 at austin.rr.com Wed Mar 24 20:23:08 2010 From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com (Greg & Alison Blake) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 20:23:08 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000101cacbc2$1c68e1d0$6501a8c0@blake1> For what it is worth, you can use the 2.5" coil over type springs (I use AFCO) in the front of a TR3 if you use the aluminum spacer and shave a bit off the OD of spacer to accept the ID of the coil over springs. I have not looked at a TR4 or TR6 front end, but I imagine you could use a similar setup by using a shorter spring and using a modified spacer as I did on the 3. It makes for cheap springs and any rate you could possibly want to use pretty much any length too. Greg -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Robert M. Lang Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 1:34 PM To: Mike Munson Cc: Friends Subject: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs On Mon, 22 Mar 2010, Mike Munson wrote: > Chuck, I have 2.5 I.d. Coilover springs on mine with spacers. They will > fit the rear spring perches just not the front. Ah - right. We went down this path before. Thanks for the reminder, Mike! > Mike regards, rml ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --- _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ablake2 at austin.rr.com From klynch_6 at msn.com Wed Mar 24 21:36:12 2010 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 21:36:12 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Dolomite/Sprint remembered Message-ID: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/classiccars/7399511/Classic-Triumph-Dolom ite-Sprint.html KL From mpendy at dishmail.net Wed Mar 24 21:41:22 2010 From: mpendy at dishmail.net (Mark Pendergrass) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 20:41:22 -0700 Subject: [Fot] AM I THAT HEAVEY Message-ID: Thanks everyone who responded to my inquirery about my cars weight, seems i'am in the ball park, but have some work to do...........Mark Pendy 63TR4 From sbarr at McCarty-Law.com Thu Mar 25 06:26:00 2010 From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com (Barr, Scott) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 07:26:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] FW: Dolomite/Sprint remembered Message-ID: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C7401702421@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Try this link: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/classiccars/7399511/Classic-Triumph- Dolomite-Sprint.html -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of KEVIN LYNCH Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 10:36 PM To: FOT Subject: [Fot] Dolomite/Sprint remembered http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/classiccars/7399511/Classic-Triumph- Dolom ite-Sprint.html Message-ID: Non - Triumph content Joe, can you contact me off line? The Historic Race Group is trying to contact your son about T & S for an upcoming event. thanks mike h. G. Michael Harmuth From tr4racing at googlemail.com Thu Mar 25 08:45:58 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 15:45:58 +0100 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> Hi Greg, You can't prevent the car from transferring weight under braking or acceleration, you only can work on the dive of the suspension during this circumstances. A good thing would be to install an anti-dive system for the braking but this is not easy to create on the TR3/4 front end as the lower wishbone can't be tilted. But besides this the main thing is that the car doesn't bottom out the suspension under braking or acceleration. The main spring ration should cover the maximum bumps on the particular track. The smoother the surface the less hard you can go. On tracks like the Nordschleife with huge bumps you need also lots of travel way of the suspension. I don't have any trouble with the car diving under braking. If the front end is lower at corner entry than getting in the corner is more crisp as the dive induce a little oversteer which makes life easier. When accelerating out of the corner the weight is transferred to the rear axle and the corners outside wheel. That will cause oversteer too but with the front inside wheel slightly touching the ground you have a little understeer too. If the car is well balanced you can achieve a smooth 4 wheel slide out of corners that makes the car quite fast and does save tires too. Have a look on these photos to see how the front wheel is almost touching the ground. http://www.tr4-racing.de/pic/2009/spa/04.0709Spa6Classic010.jpg http://www.tr4-racing.de/pic/2009/rgb-nurburgring/n%FCrburg%20b%20049.jpg http://www.tr4-racing.de/pic/2009/spa/03.07.09Spa7Classic054.jpg Take also in account that a wheel that has only little load can't be steered too far in the corner, so the anti Ackermann is the way to go to leave the inside front wheel more straight as it has less load but should help with steering the car. An unloaded wheel has only a very small slip angle. I'm going to rise the front end grip as high as I can and adjust the rear end to force the car to a little oversteer. Cheers Chris From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Mar 25 09:35:22 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 10:35:22 -0500 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> Message-ID: Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere around 800 lb rate. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of MadMarx Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM To: 'Friends' Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs From billb at bnj.com Thu Mar 25 10:00:07 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 06:00:07 -1000 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> Message-ID: <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's progressively wound. On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The > Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 > inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I > buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere > around 800 lb rate. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of MadMarx > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM > To: 'Friends' > Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tr4racing at googlemail.com Thu Mar 25 10:18:47 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 17:18:47 +0100 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> Message-ID: <001b01cacc36$db54aba0$91fe02e0$@com> The windings does infect the spring rate. The formula is: D = (G * dD^4) / (8 *dF^3 *n) [N/mm] dD = wire diameter [mm] dF = Spring diameter at wire center [mm] n = number of windings G = Modul [N/mm2] (for Springsteel 79500 N/mm2) -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: Bill Babcock [mailto:billb at bnj.com] Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. Mdrz 2010 17:00 An: Kramer, Robert Cc: MadMarx; 'Friends' Betreff: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's progressively wound. On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The > Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 > inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I > buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere > around 800 lb rate. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of MadMarx > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM > To: 'Friends' > Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From spitlist at cox.net Thu Mar 25 10:41:05 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 09:41:05 -0700 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> Message-ID: <5BEB333EECB0426BB0FB562C1F6BA7ED@joepentiumnew> I beg to differ. Think about it this way. If you have a piece of spring steel 20 feet long and extend it between two fixed points and then apply a weight to the center, it will droop a given amount. The cut off a portion of it and move the end points closer together and reapply the same weight. It will sag less. Wind that steel into a coil and you get the same effect. The spring rate of the steel did not change (unless you heat it changing the properties) but the total amount of travel will become less, making the spring stiffer. The same thing happens with leaf springs. Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bill Babcock Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:00 AM To: Kramer, Robert Cc: 'Friends' Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's progressively wound. On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The > Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 > inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I > buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere > around 800 lb rate. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of MadMarx > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM > To: 'Friends' > Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Thu Mar 25 10:41:19 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 09:41:19 -0700 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> Message-ID: <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> > spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring Ah, but it does. Say for example you start with two 400 lb/in springs and stack them together. Apply 400 pounds, and the stack deflects by 2 inches (making it a 200 lb/in stack). Separate the springs and they go from 200 lb/in to 400 lb/in. Randall From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 10:47:30 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 10:47:30 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> Message-ID: <4BAB93A2.7030604@bradakis.com> Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? > http://www.alternativecarparts.com/utilities/coilsprings.html mjb. From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 11:01:03 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> Message-ID: <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com> >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring >> If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and change the coil count, it does get stiffer. mjb. From s.janzen at comcast.net Thu Mar 25 11:45:08 2010 From: s.janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 13:45:08 -0400 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> Message-ID: <3F6726A1-8658-442C-9EC3-64F5C475A810@comcast.net> so an 8" long, 500 lb per inch spring is a different wire size than a 10" long, 500 lb/inch spring, assuming the metallurgy and coil diameter? On Mar 25, 2010, at 12:41 PM, Randall wrote: > spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring Ah, but it does. Say for example you start with two 400 lb/in springs and stack them together. Apply 400 pounds, and the stack deflects by 2 inches (making it a 200 lb/in stack). Separate the springs and they go from 200 lb/in to 400 lb/in. Randall _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/s.janzen at comcast.net From billb at bnj.com Thu Mar 25 11:58:41 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 07:58:41 -1000 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <5BEB333EECB0426BB0FB562C1F6BA7ED@joepentiumnew> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <5BEB333EECB0426BB0FB562C1F6BA7ED@joepentiumnew> Message-ID: Yeah, I wasn't thinking. Coil springs are torsion bars, make them shorter and the rate goes up. On Mar 25, 2010, at 6:41 AM, Joe Curry wrote: > I beg to differ. > > Think about it this way. If you have a piece of spring steel 20 feet long > and extend it between two fixed points and then apply a weight to the > center, it will droop a given amount. The cut off a portion of it and move > the end points closer together and reapply the same weight. It will sag > less. Wind that steel into a coil and you get the same effect. > > The spring rate of the steel did not change (unless you heat it changing the > properties) but the total amount of travel will become less, making the > spring stiffer. > > The same thing happens with leaf springs. > > Joe C. > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On > Behalf Of Bill Babcock > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:00 AM > To: Kramer, Robert > Cc: 'Friends' > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's > progressively > wound. > > On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > >> Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? > The >> Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and > 14 >> inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. > If > I >> buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate > somewhere >> around 800 lb rate. >> >> Bob Kramer >> Sales Manager >> RDO Equipment Company >> 16415 N. IH 35 >> Pflugerville, TX 78660 >> 512-272-4141 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On > Behalf >> Of MadMarx >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM >> To: 'Friends' >> Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 12:00:24 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 12:00:24 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <3F6726A1-8658-442C-9EC3-64F5C475A810@comcast.net> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> <3F6726A1-8658-442C-9EC3-64F5C475A810@comcast.net> Message-ID: <4BABA4B8.1010109@bradakis.com> Scott Janzen wrote: > so an 8" long, 500 lb per inch spring is a different wire size than a > 10" long, 500 lb/inch spring, assuming the metallurgy and coil diameter? > > Maybe, maybe not. You'll notice that in the various forms of the spring rate equations free length is not a factor. The two springs you mention may have the exact same wire diameter and number of coils. In the 10 inch spring the coils would be farther apart than in the 8 inch spring. Free length is not that important. Fitted length and fitted load are what really matter to ride height. mjb. From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Mar 25 12:08:55 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 13:08:55 -0500 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <001b01cacc36$db54aba0$91fe02e0$@com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <001b01cacc36$db54aba0$91fe02e0$@com> Message-ID: So it looks like the ticket is to buy the AFCO 8" 700 lb coil over springs and use a couple of 1/2" spacers to get my 9 " free length back. Then, if that is not enough rear spring, to go to the 10" 700 lb springs and cut them to fit (once I do the math), holding out the even stiffer option of using 12" springs if I need an even stiffer solution. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx [mailto:tr4racing at googlemail.com] Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:19 AM To: 'Bill Babcock'; Kramer, Robert Cc: 'Friends' Subject: AW: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs The windings does infect the spring rate. The formula is: D = (G * dD^4) / (8 *dF^3 *n) [N/mm] dD = wire diameter [mm] dF = Spring diameter at wire center [mm] n = number of windings G = Modul [N/mm2] (for Springsteel 79500 N/mm2) -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: Bill Babcock [mailto:billb at bnj.com] Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. Mdrz 2010 17:00 An: Kramer, Robert Cc: MadMarx; 'Friends' Betreff: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's progressively wound. On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The > Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 > inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I > buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere > around 800 lb rate. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of MadMarx > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM > To: 'Friends' > Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From horizonracing at msn.com Thu Mar 25 12:35:07 2010 From: horizonracing at msn.com (Tony and Annie Garmey) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:35:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com> Message-ID: As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear springs with "Nascar" spring rubbers. Smooth track= use the spring rubber,rough track= put in a softer one or remove it ! :) > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 > From: mark at bradakis.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring > >> > > > If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil > count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and > change the coil count, it does get stiffer. > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracing at msn.com From cofrog at q.com Thu Mar 25 13:13:51 2010 From: cofrog at q.com (Dan Forgey) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 19:13:51 +0000 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, , <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: Anyone know where to source the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? Thanks, Dan Forgey > From: horizonracing at msn.com > To: mark at bradakis.com; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:35:07 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear springs with "Nascar" spring rubbers. Smooth > track= use the spring rubber,rough track= put in a softer one or remove it ! > :) > > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 > > From: mark at bradakis.com > > To: fot at autox.team.net > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > > > >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring > > >> > > > > > > If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil > > count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and > > change the coil count, it does get stiffer. > > > > mjb. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracing at msn.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cofrog at q.com From horizonracing at msn.com Thu Mar 25 13:28:35 2010 From: horizonracing at msn.com (Tony and Annie Garmey) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 12:28:35 -0700 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, , <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, , Message-ID: start with stock car products. From: cofrog at q.com To: horizonracing at msn.com; mark at bradakis.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 19:13:51 +0000 Anyone know where to source the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? Thanks, Dan Forgey > From: horizonracing at msn.com > To: mark at bradakis.com; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:35:07 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear springs with "Nascar" spring rubbers. Smooth > track= use the spring rubber,rough track= put in a softer one or remove it ! > :) > > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 > > From: mark at bradakis.com > > To: fot at autox.team.net > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > > > >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring > > >> > > > > > > If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil > > count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and > > change the coil count, it does get stiffer. > > > > mjb. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracing at msn.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cofrog at q.com From tedtsimx at bright.net Thu Mar 25 14:29:01 2010 From: tedtsimx at bright.net (Ted Schumacher) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 15:29:01 -0500 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <001b01cacc36$db54aba0$91fe02e0$@com> Message-ID: <4BABC78D.4010502@bright.net> Bob and list. We have springs made for us - ran about 2000 pieces in the last 2 years - so we are somewhat conversant with this topic. Our TR6 uprated street springs will increase rate by about 8 psi for every 1/8" cut off. So cutting 1 coil will yield a 64 psi rate increaseon this particular spring. However, we sell springs other than the ones we list for the street cars. We can supply 8", 9" and 10" surface ground end springs in a large variety of rates. $59.95/each. These are 2 1/2" ID springs. Many spring suppliers, such as AFCO, do not make their own springs. Our spring manufacturer holds the tightest tolerances in the industry, +/- 2%. We have rate checked springs that have varied as much as 10%. If we can help, please let us know. Thaks for your time.Ted Kramer, Robert wrote: > So it looks like the ticket is to buy the AFCO 8" 700 lb coil over springs and > use a couple of 1/2" spacers to get my 9 " free length back. Then, if that is > not enough rear spring, to go to the 10" 700 lb springs and cut them to fit > (once I do the math), holding out the even stiffer option of using 12" springs > if I need an even stiffer solution. > > > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx [mailto:tr4racing at googlemail.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:19 AM > To: 'Bill Babcock'; Kramer, Robert > Cc: 'Friends' > Subject: AW: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > The windings does infect the spring rate. > > The formula is: > > D = (G * dD^4) / (8 *dF^3 *n) [N/mm] > > dD = wire diameter [mm] > dF = Spring diameter at wire center [mm] > n = number of windings > G = Modul [N/mm2] (for Springsteel 79500 N/mm2) > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: Bill Babcock [mailto:billb at bnj.com] > Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. Mdrz 2010 17:00 > An: Kramer, Robert > Cc: MadMarx; 'Friends' > Betreff: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's > progressively wound. > > On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > > >> Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? >> > The > >> Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and >> > 14 > >> inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. >> > If I > >> buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate >> > somewhere > >> around 800 lb rate. >> >> Bob Kramer >> Sales Manager >> RDO Equipment Company >> 16415 N. IH 35 >> Pflugerville, TX 78660 >> 512-272-4141 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On >> > Behalf > >> Of MadMarx >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM >> To: 'Friends' >> Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tedtsimx at bright.net > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.437 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2769 - Release Date: 03/25/10 07:33:00 > > -- Ted Schumacher tedtsimx at bright.net http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com 108 S. Jefferson St. Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 From fasttrs at yahoo.com Thu Mar 25 13:49:33 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 12:49:33 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <399716.89446.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Www.springrubber.com Now;...What durometer rating do you get? Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 25, 2010, at 2:13 PM, Dan Forgey wrote: Anyone know where to source the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? Thanks, Dan From adams910 at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 14:21:05 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 16:21:05 -0400 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <399716.89446.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <399716.89446.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <673993c51003251321l2536e2ag214341fee9dc9661@mail.gmail.com> If you want to get real fancy, you can get bump stops with progressive rates. I have two different length/rate bumpstops in the top of my tool box, plus a different set on my Miata. You can also space them out, so they engage at a different point. Bob From fasttrs at yahoo.com Thu Mar 25 14:32:31 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 13:32:31 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <411436.80978.qm@web46102.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I prefer to bump the Miatas without any rubber between me and them. They fly off the track and out of the way faster. Oh wait... Are we talking about the same thing ? :D :D :D Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 25, 2010, at 3:21 PM, Bob Adams wrote: If you want to get real fancy, you can get bump stops with progressive rates. I have two different length/rate bumpstops in the top of my tool box, plus a different set on my Miata. You can also space them out, so they engage at a different point. Bob From lang at isis.mit.edu Thu Mar 25 15:28:25 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 17:28:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] Hard line materials Message-ID: Hi, Seeing that we're all being technical... my AN braided lines for my fuel system are now about 10 years old. I figure I should get a leg up on this - yes, I know the rubber rots over time. I was thinking about replacing a good portion of the flex with hard metal lines instead with just a few short flex lines where it matters. I have fabbed up steel bundy tubed used AN 818/819 steel sleeves and nuts and that seems to work okay. The question is - is there any obvious reason NOT to use aluminum tube and aluminum sleeves / nuts? I was thinking 6061T6 3/8" with .065 thick walls. This is low pressure (less than 3 psi) fuel, not PI or anything like that. I'm just curious. But the aluminum looks nicer than the steel does and it's probably lighter although we're talking ounces of material here, not pounds. regards, rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 15:57:24 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 15:57:24 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Hard line materials In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4BABDC44.8010407@bradakis.com> On the Killer Spit I used blue anodized 3/8 al-u-min-i-um from Summit, I think it was. Pretty easy to make the flares, bends and such. Looks nice and lasts a long time. mjb. From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Thu Mar 25 18:26:00 2010 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (Jim Gray) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 18:26:00 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, ,<093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: I hear those NASCAR spring rubbers act weird in right hand corners jim g -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team .net] On Behalf Of Dan Forgey Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 1:14 PM To: horizonracing at msn.com; mark at bradakis.com; triumph fot Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Anyone know where to source the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? Thanks, Dan Forgey > From: horizonracing at msn.com > To: mark at bradakis.com; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:35:07 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear springs with "Nascar" spring rubbers. Smooth > track= use the spring rubber,rough track= put in a softer one or remove it ! > :) > > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 > > From: mark at bradakis.com > > To: fot at autox.team.net > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > > > >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring > > >> > > > > > > If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil > > count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and > > change the coil count, it does get stiffer. > > > > mjb. > > > > ______________________________ _________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.htm l > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/ options/fot/horizonracing at msn. com > > ______________________________ _________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.htm l > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/ options/fot/cofrog at q.com ______________________________ _________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.htm l Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/ options/fot/toodamnfunky at comca st.net From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 18:30:07 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 18:30:07 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, ,<093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: <4BAC000F.6040506@bradakis.com> Jim Gray wrote: > I hear those NASCAR spring > rubbers act weird in right > hand corners > They work just fine in right handers if you put them in upside down. But then left handers are a bit of a sticky wicket. mjb. From rblake36 at yahoo.com Thu Mar 25 20:25:20 2010 From: rblake36 at yahoo.com (Robert Blake) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 19:25:20 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 Message-ID: <761127.22877.qm@web58502.mail.re3.yahoo.com> FOT I installed a HITEST14088 alternator in place of my original alternator about 5 months ago and it seemed to function although the lead placement was not the same as the original setup. Lately it seems to be spotty and I would like to check the output to determine if I have wiring issues or a grumpy alternator. I have individually cheched readings between the negative terminal of the battery and the three connectors on the alternator and gotten readings between 0.20 and 0.50 volts. These readings seem odd but being electrically challanged I don't trust my technique. Would appreciate suggestions and or internet references. Bob Blake Dripping Springs, TX From timmurph at fastbytes.com Fri Mar 26 09:43:53 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 10:43:53 -0500 Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 In-Reply-To: <761127.22877.qm@web58502.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <761127.22877.qm@web58502.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002901caccfb$2648e710$72dab530$@com> With the engine off the battery voltage should be about 13 volts, ideally 13.2 volts (2.2 volts per cell time 6 cells in the battery). With the engine running and the alternator working the voltage at the battery should be about 14.0 to 14.5 volts. Not sure what your 3 wires are going to but the largest should be carrying the current from the alternator to the battery and this terminal should be the 14.0 to 14.5 when running, same and the battery terminal to which it is connected. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Robert Blake Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:25 PM To: FOT Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 FOT I installed a HITEST14088 alternator in place of my original alternator about 5 months ago and it seemed to function although the lead placement was not the same as the original setup. Lately it seems to be spotty and I would like to check the output to determine if I have wiring issues or a grumpy alternator. I have individually cheched readings between the negative terminal of the battery and the three connectors on the alternator and gotten readings between 0.20 and 0.50 volts. These readings seem odd but being electrically challanged I don't trust my technique. Would appreciate suggestions and or internet references. Bob Blake Dripping Springs, TX _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From ehusmann53 at yahoo.com Fri Mar 26 11:43:49 2010 From: ehusmann53 at yahoo.com (Ernest Husmann) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 10:43:49 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] car inspection help Message-ID: <770892.57253.qm@web57605.mail.re1.yahoo.com> FOT: Is there anyone in the Omaha, KC or Topeka area that would be willing to take a look at a TR7 located in Falls City, NE. I'm told by the seller Falls City is roughly 90 minutes from all three cities. If you would be willing to help me out please contact me off the list. Thank you, Ernie From billbab at me.com Fri Mar 26 12:06:35 2010 From: billbab at me.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 08:06:35 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs References: <7D25BA73-095C-494D-813C-FACFEB2AC3F6@bnj.com> Message-ID: Begin forwarded message: > From: Bill Babcock > Date: March 26, 2010 7:23:17 AM HST > To: Greg & Alison Blake > Cc: MadMarx , Friends Triumph > Subject: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Weight transfer is not that big an issue on little cars, and what there is, is more benefit than problem. I use the weight transfer forward under braking to control understeer. A little tap on the brakes when the front end is pushing can make the car dive nicely to the apex. In all cases I expect the weight to transfer forward under heavy braking and that's why I have adjustable brake bias and my front disks are as good as are allowed. If Peyote had more than 130 hp I might worry about rear weight transfer, but it is unfortunately, no problem. We might find some performance in managing weight transfer by having better shocks on the car, but Peyote uses Armstrongs in the rear, and they have all the damping consistency of a screen door closer. > > On Mar 24, 2010, at 4:23 PM, Greg & Alison Blake wrote: From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Fri Mar 26 15:13:22 2010 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (toodamnfunky at comcast.net) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 21:13:22 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. Message-ID: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> NOTICE OF DECERTIFICATION; NOTICE TO CEASE AND DESIST AND TERMINATION OF ALL CONTRACTS OF PARTICIPATION ISSUED TO IMPACT RACING SFI Foundation, Inc., has issued a Notice of Decertification; Notice of Cease and Desist, and a notice terminating all Contracts of Participation to Impact Racing. Effective AprilB 27,B 2010 , all products manufactured and/or distributed by Impact Racing pursuant to SFI Specification Programs 3.2A, 3.3, 16.1, and 16.5 are decertified. Evidence obtained by SFI shows that over a period of years Impact Racing has engaged in the production and use of counterfeit SFI conformance labels and patches, and affixed them to Impact products for use in motorsports. Under the Contracts of Participation between SFI and Impact, SFI conformance labels and patches may only be obtained from SFI and no other source. Evidence shows that Impact had counterfeit SFI labels and patches made in Asia and then affixed them to Impact products it distributed to members of the racing community. To SFIbs knowledge, Impact never advised its customers that its products contained phony SFI labels and patches. Impact never advised SFI of its systematic and longstanding practice of counterfeiting and distributing SFI patches and labeling. Impact has been directed to cease and desist from this practice. SFI has directed Impact to immediately notify all affected customers to remove the counterfeit labeling and to offer the affected customers a full refund of the purchase price. SFI is requesting that all counterfeit conformance labels removed from Impact products be sent to SFI. SFI has elected not to decertify these products immediately in order to minimize the potential hardships to members of the racing community that have been brought about by Impactbs counterfeiting activities. SFI has also elected to terminate all Contracts of Participation with Impact Racing effective 90 days from March 24,B 2010. Under the terms of the Contracts, either party may terminate the agreements without penalty upon 90 days notice. This means that Impact will no longer be able to participate in any SFI programs after this 90 day period. SFI has taken these actions in the best interests of the safety and integrity of the racing community. This is in keeping with SFIbs mission and purpose. That's just great, All of my gear is made by Impact. Jim G. From cwnfot at gmail.com Fri Mar 26 17:57:52 2010 From: cwnfot at gmail.com (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 19:57:52 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. In-Reply-To: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <00f301cacd40$2696d2a0$73c477e0$@com> Can you source this information about Impact Racing before it is spread all over. Just in case it is bogus... http://www.impactraceproducts.com Clark Clark W. Nicholls 1972 Stag 1974 Spitfire (and 1 rusty GT6 needing restoration) "Reality, it's not what you think." From tr6nut at verizon.net Fri Mar 26 19:04:23 2010 From: tr6nut at verizon.net (Hugh Barber) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 21:04:23 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. In-Reply-To: <00f301cacd40$2696d2a0$73c477e0$@com> References: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <00f301cacd40$2696d2a0$73c477e0$@com> Message-ID: <4BAD5997.8090708@verizon.net> http://www.sfifoundation.com/ It's on the front page of the website On 3/26/2010 07:57, Clark W. Nicholls wrote: > Can you source this information about Impact Racing before it is spread all > over. > Just in case it is bogus... > http://www.impactraceproducts.com From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Fri Mar 26 19:22:07 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 21:22:07 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket Message-ID: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> Got the head back - dressed it up and assembled. Noticed that with .090 shaved off, the headgasket (stock 86mm) protrudes into the chamber under the exhaust valve. Jack notes predicts this but not quite sure the best way to deal with it. I worked up the edge of the copper and can probably shave it back and roll it over again but it would get pretty close to the water relief. Can I run it protruding Jack notes says it won't last but I'm only .090 not racing all the time so... How do you guys deal with this? M From enquiries at roadandtrack.net.au Fri Mar 26 21:00:08 2010 From: enquiries at roadandtrack.net.au (Enquiries Road & Track) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 13:00:08 +1000 Subject: [Fot] help with finding flywheel bolts Message-ID: <1e4b466c1003262000l4d70b6fy32e4dc98864de458@mail.gmail.com> I have been unsucessfully chasing various local & UK vendors for new "proper" triumph 6 cyl flywheel bolts that were originally used on the 2.5 engines that had a long tail, eg pre 1972, and possibly various other models the part number forged into the bolt head is either UKC4264 or 151287. they were specially made high tensile bolts with a long shank (unthreaded bit). I dont want the generic "bolt shop" replacements , which is what Rimmers seem to offer. I have a custom crank & alloy flywheel and I want these 'long" bolts to maximize thread engagement and stability in the flywheel hole I've looked at the ARP ones, and they are a bit too short for my liking, and much shorter than these factory bolts. can anyone help me with a likely vendor in the USA, or even sell me some good ones. I would prefer new ones, but used ones that are not stretched would be OK. I have sorted thru a pile of them here, and most of them have stretched threads from overtightening or flywheel mis-haps thanks Terry O'Beirne australia From billb at bnj.com Fri Mar 26 21:08:57 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 17:08:57 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket In-Reply-To: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> References: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <94851D33-E556-4029-AE83-5B00682410FE@bnj.com> Sounds like you are using a composite gasket. Don't. It won't last with anything projecting into the combustion chamber, and won't last if the fire ring is cut. Either get a shim steel comp gasket or one of the solid copper ones On Mar 26, 2010, at 3:22 PM, Mark Eginton wrote: > Got the head back - dressed it up and assembled. Noticed that with .090 shaved off, the headgasket (stock 86mm) protrudes into the chamber under the exhaust valve. Jack notes predicts this but not quite sure the best way to deal with it. I worked up the edge of the copper and can probably shave it back and roll it over again but it would get pretty close to the water relief. Can I run it protruding Jack notes says it won't last but I'm only .090 not racing all the time so... > > How do you guys deal with this? > > M > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From 19to1tr6 at comcast.net Fri Mar 26 23:31:55 2010 From: 19to1tr6 at comcast.net (Rob) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 01:31:55 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. In-Reply-To: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <99B47D8331C14EB4A0BA7E85409A7BD3@INSPIRON> That's crazy Didn't Simpson just start up this company a few years ago.Could it spill over to the Simpson products Leopards don't change there spots. I was considering Impacts products last season but fortunately went with Alpine Stars. Guess this sport can be a little more dangerous than we think Book em DANO and loose the key. It will be interesting to see how many NASCAR drivers are wearing the product this weekend. rob ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "fot" Sent: Friday, March 26, 2010 5:13 PM Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. > NOTICE OF DECERTIFICATION; NOTICE TO CEASE AND DESIST AND TERMINATION OF > ALL > CONTRACTS OF PARTICIPATION ISSUED TO IMPACT RACING > > > > SFI Foundation, Inc., has issued a Notice of Decertification; Notice of > Cease > and Desist, and a notice terminating all Contracts of Participation to > Impact > Racing. Effective AprilB 27,B 2010 , all products manufactured and/or > distributed by Impact Racing pursuant to SFI Specification Programs 3.2A, > 3.3, > 16.1, and 16.5 are decertified. Evidence obtained by SFI shows that over a > period of years Impact Racing has engaged in the production and use of > counterfeit SFI conformance labels and patches, and affixed them to Impact > products for use in motorsports. Under the Contracts of Participation > between > SFI and Impact, SFI conformance labels and patches may only be obtained > from > SFI and no other source. Evidence shows that Impact had counterfeit SFI > labels > and patches made in Asia and then affixed them to Impact products it > distributed to members of the racing community. To SFIbs knowledge, > Impact > never advised its customers that its products contained phony SFI labels > and > patches. Impact never advised SFI of its systematic and longstanding > practice > of counterfeiting and distributing SFI patches and labeling. > > Impact has been directed to cease and desist from this practice. SFI has > directed Impact to immediately notify all affected customers to remove the > counterfeit labeling and to offer the affected customers a full refund of > the > purchase price. SFI is requesting that all counterfeit conformance labels > removed from Impact products be sent to SFI. > > SFI has elected not to decertify these products immediately in order to > minimize the potential hardships to members of the racing community that > have > been brought about by Impactbs counterfeiting activities. > > SFI has also elected to terminate all Contracts of Participation with > Impact > Racing effective 90 days from March 24,B 2010. Under the terms of the > Contracts, either party may terminate the agreements without penalty upon > 90 > days notice. This means that Impact will no longer be able to participate > in > any SFI programs after this 90 day period. > > SFI has taken these actions in the best interests of the safety and > integrity > of the racing community. This is in keeping with SFIbs mission and > purpose. > > > > That's just great, All of my gear is made by Impact. > > Jim G. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/19to1tr6 at comcast.net From igofaster at att.net Sun Mar 21 09:15:39 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 08:15:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] our new Spitfire racer Message-ID: <150512.69134.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I recently purchased a 1965 Spitfire from "Mac" McArthur in Huntington Beach California. Mac raced the spitwad for a few seasons with VARA. I was fortunate enough to receive the SCCA log book dating the car back to 1973 events. It was championed by Darwin Fontenot from 05-23-1973 through 09-04-1976. There is a 20 year gap in the log book when it shows Jeff Fontenot racing the car in the Polar Prix February 1997 and the Fiesta Carrera in July 1998. There is a March Madness and Blue Bonnet Sprint dated without the years, only the dates 04-12-?? On 02-13-98 SW division Houston SCCA "El Nino" event. There is also a March Madhatter 03-14-98 which appears to be the last event with a Fontenot family member. There is another log book International Conference of Sports Car Clubs. A Robert Hodge had two events 09-29-2007 and 08-03-2008. Glad to have some evidence of the past life. I'm in the process of sorting out the wiring, there's no fuse buss in the car. Have some new Painless Wiring stuff coming. Bought a new AMB transponder, new Holley Red fuel pump, and I found a new Safequip quick release on the 'bay I like versus the Simpson latch system that came with the car. I went with George Curl wednesday up to Eagles Canyon for a few hours to see if I could log some laps while he sorted out his fresh MGB rebuild when I re-adjusted the head and valves (fresh head) when I noticed one of the valve springs gave way. Hope to have the little Spitwad sorted out for Hallet in a few weeks. Thought some of you might like to know the story behind my bright idea to own 2 racer Triumphs, and Barbra's 1971 TR6 which gets some long needed seat rebuilds and finish up on the interior. All the best, Bobby Whitehead 1970 GT6 DP 1956 Spitfire EP 1971 TR6 From dos_gusanos at msn.com Sat Mar 27 07:40:57 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 07:40:57 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself Message-ID: My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim Hassal, the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly fused broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, drills, repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly intact in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. Cheers, Henry Morrison, New Mexico From jhassall at blacksburg.net Sat Mar 27 08:20:54 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim Hassal, > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly fused > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, drills, > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly intact > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. > Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never looked at it again. If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. jim -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From dos_gusanos at msn.com Sat Mar 27 08:35:03 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 08:35:03 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> References: , <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: Jim it's fine, I would have sent you the same thing and merely consider it another challenge. Pales in comparison to most of my boat projects where I cut my teeth on most rusty bolts, drills, jb weld and duct tape....................Cheers Henry > Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 > From: jhassall at blacksburg.net > To: dos_gusanos at msn.com > CC: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > > On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: > > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim Hassal, > > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly fused > > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, drills, > > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly intact > > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. > > > Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a > half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed > it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never > looked at it again. > > If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. > > jim > > -- > Jim Hassall > Blacksburg VA > '63 TR4 in autox preparation > 99% finished, 90% to go From kaskas at cox.net Sat Mar 27 13:41:47 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 12:41:47 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Still kicking Message-ID: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> Contrary to popular rumor the past couple days, I am not sick, not dying and damn well not dead!! -- Never be beaten by equipment From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Mar 27 13:47:31 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 15:47:31 EDT Subject: [Fot] alloy tubing? Message-ID: <1084f.54c405ce.38dfbad3@aol.com> Did I see a query during the week asking about alloy tubing in our cars? I remember a response about blue tubing from summit but no more. Is anyone using alloy tubing in their cars?? I talked to a bunch of drag racers this morning that love it but I worry about fatigue cracks in our environments. Hate to lose a race to save three ounces;-)) From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Mar 27 14:25:13 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 16:25:13 EDT Subject: [Fot] Still kicking Message-ID: <12164.35d4ec4c.38dfc3a9@aol.com> Well I'm damned glad ya got better! ;-)) What did Mark Twain say, "The reports of my death are greatly exaggerated" :56 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, kaskas at cox.net writes: Contrary to popular rumor the past couple days, I am not sick, not dying and damn well not dead!! -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com From spitlist at cox.net Sat Mar 27 14:49:38 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 13:49:38 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Still kicking In-Reply-To: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> References: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> Message-ID: <1AEF8B89A03F4B0CB035C28ACE0D7CC8@joepentiumnew> Good to know! :) Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas Kastner Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 12:42 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Still kicking Contrary to popular rumor the past couple days, I am not sick, not dying and damn well not dead!! -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From garygret at sbcglobal.net Sat Mar 27 16:40:10 2010 From: garygret at sbcglobal.net (Gary Schneider) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 15:40:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket In-Reply-To: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> References: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <1232.97639.qm@web81507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I have my Uncle Jack engine apart for maintenance right now. On my o-ringed engine he used the AE330 copper-faced composite gasket, and carefully rolled the copper-foil fold of the fire ring a little further back in the valve pocket. I would guess by patient and gentle tapping. Beautiful work and it lasted for years. Regards, Gary Schneider ________________________________ From: Mark Eginton To: "fot at autox.team.net" Sent: Fri, March 26, 2010 8:22:07 PM Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket Got the head back - dressed it up and assembled. Noticed that with .090 shaved off, the headgasket (stock 86mm) protrudes into the chamber under the exhaust valve. Jack notes predicts this but not quite sure the best way to deal with it. I worked up the edge of the copper and can probably shave it back and roll it over again but it would get pretty close to the water relief. Can I run it protruding Jack notes says it won't last but I'm only .090 not racing all the time so... How do you guys deal with this? M _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/garygret at sbcglobal.net From mark at bradakis.com Sat Mar 27 16:46:02 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 16:46:02 -0600 Subject: [Fot] alloy tubing? In-Reply-To: <1084f.54c405ce.38dfbad3@aol.com> References: <1084f.54c405ce.38dfbad3@aol.com> Message-ID: <4BAE8AAA.2000905@bradakis.com> Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: > Did I see a query during the week asking about alloy tubing in our cars? > I remember a response about blue tubing from summit but no more. Bob Lang started it: http://www.team.net/mharc/archives/html/fot/2010-03/msg00319.html > > I was the one who responded that I used 3/8 inch aluminum hard line along the chassis for fuel delivery. Basically one long piece connected to the pump and filter setup through flexible rubber in the vicinity of the trunk and more flex line in the engine bay connected to the regulator, mjb. From norlinengineering at comcast.net Sat Mar 27 17:11:16 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 16:11:16 -0700 Subject: [Fot] alloy tubing? In-Reply-To: <1084f.54c405ce.38dfbad3@aol.com> Message-ID: <099E9A65214A4E6696AD50AECECCA0DC@TOSHIBALAPTOP> I've got aluminum tubing on my AFFF fire system - came with the system. This year I noticed that one of the tubing flares had disappeared - apparently fatigued from vibrations. Easy enough to make a new flare, but I would hate to think what might have happened if this was a fuel line. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Gt6steve at aol.com Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 12:48 PM To: FOT at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] alloy tubing? Did I see a query during the week asking about alloy tubing in our cars? I remember a response about blue tubing from summit but no more. Is anyone using alloy tubing in their cars?? I talked to a bunch of drag racers this morning that love it but I worry about fatigue cracks in our environments. Hate to lose a race to save three ounces;-)) _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/norlinengineering at comcast.net From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Sat Mar 27 19:00:16 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 18:00:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <292451.31285.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <292451.31285.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <445864.4535.qm@web46116.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Well I worked on the TR4 again today. I followed Ed's thoughts and used an non cogged belt. No squeak now. I am getting there!!! Thanks ED and FOT. Mike ________________________________ From: EDWARD BARNARD To: Triumph Friends of ; Mike Mehl Sent: Sun, March 21, 2010 7:33:41 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Mike: Are you running a cogged belt? I have found these to squeak more often then non-cogged belts. Try an old style solid belt if you are using a cogged one. Just my two cents worth. -Ed- --- On Sun, 3/21/10, Mike Mehl wrote: >From: Mike Mehl >Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! >To: "Triumph Friends of" >Date: Sunday, March 21, 2010, 2:42 PM > > >Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is >the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump >pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if >I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak >with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing >but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new >also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it >squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. >Mike > > > > >________________________________ >From: Mike Mehl > >To: Triumph Friends of >Cc: Mike >Mehl >Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM >Subject: [Fot] >Started the TR4 today!!! > >Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button >today with the help of my >race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. >We had a few minor issues >that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help >solve. I am attaching the >link to the you tube video my son shot. I have >some small isuses. Water >leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of >the valve cover is leaking >and the new water pump is squealing (could be the >pulley rubbing on the bolts) >and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the >end of the day i drove it >around the block. You can hear the water pump in >the video. > >I am pretty >excited!! >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > >Mike Mehl >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: >http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: >http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: >http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com > >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net From budscars at comcast.net Sat Mar 27 19:52:37 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 18:52:37 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! References: <292451.31285.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <445864.4535.qm@web46116.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Terrific!... RB ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Mehl" To: "EDWARD BARNARD" Cc: "Triumph Friends of" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 6:00 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > Well I worked on the TR4 again today. I followed Ed's thoughts and used > an > non cogged belt. No squeak now. > > I am getting there!!! > > Thanks ED and FOT. > Mike > > > > > ________________________________ > From: EDWARD BARNARD > > To: Triumph Friends of ; Mike > Mehl > Sent: Sun, March 21, 2010 7:33:41 PM > Subject: Re: > [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > > > Mike: Are you running a cogged belt? I have > found these to squeak more often then non-cogged belts. Try an old style > solid belt if you are using a cogged one. > Just my two cents worth. > -Ed- > --- On > Sun, 3/21/10, Mike Mehl wrote: > > >>From: Mike Mehl > >>Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! >>To: > "Triumph Friends of" >>Date: Sunday, March 21, 2010, 2:42 > PM >> >> >>Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. > One is >>the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the > pump >>pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to > see if >>I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just > squeak >>with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out > bearing >>but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is > new >>also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs > and it >>squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be > helpful. >>Mike >> >> >> >> >>________________________________ >>From: Mike Mehl >> >>To: Triumph Friends of >>Cc: Mike >>Mehl >>Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM >>Subject: > [Fot] >>Started the TR4 today!!! >> >>Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the > button >>today with the help of my >>race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car > started. >>We had a few minor issues >>that a quick call to Jeff Quick in > Seattle help >>solve. I am attaching the >>link to the you tube video my son > shot. I have >>some small isuses. Water >>leaks with my Ford aluminum > radiator, the rear of >>the valve cover is leaking >>and the new water pump is > squealing (could be the >>pulley rubbing on the bolts) >>and the oil temp gauge > is not working. By the >>end of the day i drove it >>around the block. You can > hear the water pump in >>the video. >> >>I am pretty >>excited!! >>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA >>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU >> >>Mike Mehl >>_______________________________________________ >>fot at autox.team.net >>Donate: >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >>Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >>Forums: >>http://www.team.net/forums >>Unsubscribe: >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com >> >>_______________________________________________ >>fot at autox.team.net >>Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.html >>Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >>Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums >>Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Mar 27 20:05:20 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 22:05:20 EDT Subject: [Fot] Motorcycle sites Message-ID: <26db.4cc0029.38e01360@aol.com> Amigos, I'm pushed into selling my lovely T140V Bonneville Triumph Motorcycle. Just don't have the space to keep it because I admit I'll not be riding it again. Know any good websites to advertise where the right kind of enthusiast will get it? From rocky at spitfire4.com Sat Mar 27 20:16:30 2010 From: rocky at spitfire4.com (Rocky Entriken) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 21:16:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself References: , <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: Sounds to me like Henry's not complaining, he's bragging. Yeah, that's pretty cool to get that @#$%^ stud out and leave the threads in perfect shape! --Rocky Entriken ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Cc: "fot" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:35 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > Jim it's fine, I would have sent you the same thing and merely consider it > another challenge. Pales in comparison to most of my boat projects where > I > cut my teeth on most rusty bolts, drills, jb weld and duct > tape....................Cheers Henry > >> Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 >> From: jhassall at blacksburg.net >> To: dos_gusanos at msn.com >> CC: fot at autox.team.net >> Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself >> >> On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: >> > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim > Hassal, >> > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly > fused >> > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, > drills, >> > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly > intact >> > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. >> > >> Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a >> half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed >> it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never >> looked at it again. >> >> If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. >> >> jim >> >> -- >> Jim Hassall >> Blacksburg VA >> '63 TR4 in autox preparation >> 99% finished, 90% to go > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rocky at spitfire4.com From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Sun Mar 28 07:03:25 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 08:03:25 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself References: , <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: <326EB9F0415145CDB1AE630615E1AD5E@latitudefb1e41> I know the feeling. I spent a week working on getting 6 screws out of a sterring wheel adapter. I was ready to grind them flat and drill 6 new holes, but I persevered and by drilling progressively larger holes I got the nasty old steering wheel off and eventually got the screws out with no damage to the aluminum hub. I wish I knew the make of the steering wheel. All it says is made in Italy. The hub is stamped 120. I suppose I could recovet it and use it. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rocky Entriken" To: ; Cc: "fot" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:16 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > Sounds to me like Henry's not complaining, he's bragging. > > Yeah, that's pretty cool to get that @#$%^ stud out and leave the threads > in perfect shape! > > --Rocky Entriken > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Cc: "fot" > Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:35 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > > >> Jim it's fine, I would have sent you the same thing and merely consider >> it >> another challenge. Pales in comparison to most of my boat projects where >> I >> cut my teeth on most rusty bolts, drills, jb weld and duct >> tape....................Cheers Henry >> >>> Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 >>> From: jhassall at blacksburg.net >>> To: dos_gusanos at msn.com >>> CC: fot at autox.team.net >>> Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself >>> >>> On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: >>> > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim >> Hassal, >>> > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly >> fused >>> > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, >> drills, >>> > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly >> intact >>> > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. >>> > >>> Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a >>> half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed >>> it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never >>> looked at it again. >>> >>> If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. >>> >>> jim >>> >>> -- >>> Jim Hassall >>> Blacksburg VA >>> '63 TR4 in autox preparation >>> 99% finished, 90% to go >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rocky at spitfire4.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From jhassall at blacksburg.net Sun Mar 28 09:09:05 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 11:09:05 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: References: , <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: <4BAF7111.5060700@blacksburg.net> On 3/27/2010 10:16 PM, Rocky Entriken wrote: > Sounds to me like Henry's not complaining, he's bragging. Rocky, tnx for making that observation. Henry, I apologize for jumping the gun and reading the email with "prejudiced eyes". My family is under a lot of external stress right now and I'm mentally in foxhole mode. I applaud your persistence and skill; I'd probably have been tempted to use C4. jim > > Yeah, that's pretty cool to get that @#$%^ stud out and leave the > threads in perfect shape! > > --Rocky Entriken > > ----- Original Message ----- From: > To: > Cc: "fot" > Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:35 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > > >> Jim it's fine, I would have sent you the same thing and merely >> consider it >> another challenge. Pales in comparison to most of my boat projects >> where I >> cut my teeth on most rusty bolts, drills, jb weld and duct >> tape....................Cheers Henry >> >>> Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 >>> From: jhassall at blacksburg.net >>> To: dos_gusanos at msn.com >>> CC: fot at autox.team.net >>> Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself >>> >>> On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: >>> > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim >> Hassal, >>> > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly >> fused >>> > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, >> drills, >>> > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly >> intact >>> > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. >>> > >>> Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a >>> half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed >>> it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never >>> looked at it again. >>> >>> If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. >>> >>> jim >>> >>> -- >>> Jim Hassall >>> Blacksburg VA >>> '63 TR4 in autox preparation >>> 99% finished, 90% to go >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rocky at spitfire4.com >> >> >> > > -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From jmwagner at greenheart.com Sun Mar 28 12:13:10 2010 From: jmwagner at greenheart.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 11:13:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4BAF9C36.2050104@greenheart.com> If there's anything I have learned about frozen studs, nuts, bolts, etc..... It is to STOP, the second one realizes they've got a problem. STOP, and think about the best approach, the best tool, etc. And while devising a plan, let it sit in a bath of sprayed on WD40, etc. If the best tool for the given job isn't available at the moment, take the time to get it. Over the years, it seems to me that over half of the difficulty in solving such issues is having to work around the first 30 minutes of testosterone driven carnage. I've slowly been building up a little collection of odd tools specifically designed to deal with these things. Yet, even with all these special tools, more often than not, only one of them is right for any given task. And even then, it's often some simple tool that I need, that's gone missing. And regardless of the game plan, one shouldn't proceed with each step until it's fully engaged. i.e. If one is using a vis-grip, that initial squeeze to lock it in place should hurt. If a hole is to be drilled for a tool to engage, one should take the time to drill it right (properly locate the drill, drill at 90 degrees, drill it as deep as recommended, etc.) If one is dremeling a slot for a screw driver, get it right and use a screw driver that fits the slot perfectly. If leverage would help, take the time to create additional leverage (like pipe to extend handles, etc.). Patience and planning. --Justin From billb at bnj.com Sun Mar 28 13:21:23 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 09:21:23 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: <4BAF9C36.2050104@greenheart.com> References: <4BAF9C36.2050104@greenheart.com> Message-ID: <2D25E67C-6223-4BD4-A38A-E7735D056B89@bnj.com> Good advice. One other bit. When you get a little twinge of a thought that you're doing the wrong thing, stop. Go back and think it through. I can't tell you how many times I've thought "Man, if that bolt breaks my knuckles are going to...OUCH". Or "I probably shouldn't used vise grips for this because...DAMN, I shouldn't have used vise grips. " Telling yourself "I saw that coming" means you didn't trust your experience and knowledge. If you know better, act better. Saves a lot of time and bandaids. On Mar 28, 2010, at 8:13 AM, Justin Wagner wrote: > If there's anything I have learned about frozen studs, nuts, bolts, etc..... It is to STOP, the second one realizes they've got a problem. STOP, and think about the best approach, the best tool, etc. And while devising a plan, let it sit in a bath of sprayed on WD40, etc. If the best tool for the given job isn't available at the moment, take the time to get it. Over the years, it seems to me that over half of the difficulty in solving such issues is having to work around the first 30 minutes of testosterone driven carnage. > > I've slowly been building up a little collection of odd tools specifically designed to deal with these things. Yet, even with all these special tools, more often than not, only one of them is right for any given task. And even then, it's often some simple tool that I need, that's gone missing. > And regardless of the game plan, one shouldn't proceed with each step until it's fully engaged. i.e. If one is using a vis-grip, that initial squeeze to lock it in place should hurt. If a hole is to be drilled for a tool to engage, one should take the time to drill it right (properly locate the drill, drill at 90 degrees, drill it as deep as recommended, etc.) If one is dremeling a slot for a screw driver, get it right and use a screw driver that fits the slot perfectly. If leverage would help, take the time to create additional leverage (like pipe to extend handles, etc.). > > Patience and planning. > > --Justin From jmwagner at greenheart.com Sun Mar 28 13:55:07 2010 From: jmwagner at greenheart.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 12:55:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: <2D25E67C-6223-4BD4-A38A-E7735D056B89@bnj.com> References: <4BAF9C36.2050104@greenheart.com> <2D25E67C-6223-4BD4-A38A-E7735D056B89@bnj.com> Message-ID: <4BAFB41B.1090608@greenheart.com> LOL.... good extra bit! Yes, we should listen to that little extra voice inside! I was working on a Nissan TV commercial years ago... and after a long motion control camera move around the spinning red four door pick up truck, the truck comes to a stop and all the four doors close, at once, for the ending beauty shot... There I am... all in black... hiding inside the truck... pulling on four cables I had rigged to close the doors on cue... as I laid there on the floor of the Nissan... and the camera was rolling... and computers were marking the camera move and the car to spin on a giant turntable... I started thinking to myself... "this isn't a good position, if the lead on one of these things breaks, I'm going to hit myself in the...." The director: (heard over the radio hidden in the car with me) "...and ACTION, Justin.... ....Justin? ....action Justin. Hello... Justin? Action" Justin: (after a long pause, his dizzy voice heard over the radio) "ummm... folks... Justin's going to need a little reset time here... He knocked himself out." It was a little embarrassing having a black eye for the remainder of the shoot. --Justin Bill Babcock wrote: >Good advice. One other bit. When you get a little twinge of a thought that you're doing the wrong thing, stop. Go back and think it through. I can't tell you how many times I've thought "Man, if that bolt breaks my knuckles are going to...OUCH". Or "I probably shouldn't used vise grips for this because...DAMN, I shouldn't have used vise grips. " > >Telling yourself "I saw that coming" means you didn't trust your experience and knowledge. If you know better, act better. Saves a lot of time and bandaids. > >On Mar 28, 2010, at 8:13 AM, Justin Wagner wrote: > > > >>If there's anything I have learned about frozen studs, nuts, bolts, etc..... It is to STOP, the second one realizes they've got a problem. STOP, and think about the best approach, the best tool, etc. And while devising a plan, let it sit in a bath of sprayed on WD40, etc. If the best tool for the given job isn't available at the moment, take the time to get it. Over the years, it seems to me that over half of the difficulty in solving such issues is having to work around the first 30 minutes of testosterone driven carnage. >> >>I've slowly been building up a little collection of odd tools specifically designed to deal with these things. Yet, even with all these special tools, more often than not, only one of them is right for any given task. And even then, it's often some simple tool that I need, that's gone missing. >>And regardless of the game plan, one shouldn't proceed with each step until it's fully engaged. i.e. If one is using a vis-grip, that initial squeeze to lock it in place should hurt. If a hole is to be drilled for a tool to engage, one should take the time to drill it right (properly locate the drill, drill at 90 degrees, drill it as deep as recommended, etc.) If one is dremeling a slot for a screw driver, get it right and use a screw driver that fits the slot perfectly. If leverage would help, take the time to create additional leverage (like pipe to extend handles, etc.). >> >>Patience and planning. >> >>--Justin From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Sun Mar 28 18:44:45 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 20:44:45 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket In-Reply-To: <1232.97639.qm@web81507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <1232.97639.qm@web81507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4BAFF7FD.8040001@twcny.rr.com> Interesting, thats pretty much what I ended up doing since I already had the gasket and nothing to lose. I gently lifted up the fire ring up with a razer blade on my composite gasket and carefully removed some material beneath it with an exacto knife. Then I trimmed and rolled the copper fire ring in flattening it back in place so it followed the new contour of my head. It seemed to look ok so I decided to use it. We will see... M From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Sun Mar 28 18:48:16 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 20:48:16 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Timing gear alignment Message-ID: <4BAFF8D0.5060300@twcny.rr.com> My timing gears with one .010 spacer still appears to have .025 clearance when I straight edge from the cam gear. This is the first engine I noticed this much offset. Are any of you needing to space the crank gear .035 or should I be searching a problem? Thanks, M From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Sun Mar 28 18:50:38 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 20:50:38 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Still kicking In-Reply-To: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> References: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> Message-ID: <4BAFF95E.3040004@twcny.rr.com> The rumors of my death are greatly exaggerated... Mark Twain Always great news indeed... M From budscars at comcast.net Sun Mar 28 19:24:15 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 18:24:15 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Still kicking References: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> <4BAFF95E.3040004@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: Yours Too?..this must be a plot! RB ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Eginton" To: Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:50 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Still kicking > The rumors of my death are greatly exaggerated... > > Mark Twain > > Always great news indeed... > > M > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Sun Mar 28 22:39:14 2010 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 21:39:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] New Racing Data Site Message-ID: <211724.5425.qm@web81208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Group: Here is a site that has gathered up race statistics. This site is neat! http://race- database. com/ "Welcome to race-database. com, the first site that will offer complete statistics for every major racing series. These data include what are considered complete box scores, including data on sponsors, chassis, and lap leaders that are not available on many sites. Although some sites have complete coverage for a set of one or more of these series, none has complete coverage of elite races in multiple racing disciplines. This site is intended for the general racing fan, who wants results for all major races, all in one place. Series covered: * Formula One, 1950-present * NASCAR Cup, 1967-present * CART/Champ Car, 1979-2007 * IRL IndyCar, 1996-present * ALMS, 1999-present * Grand-Am, 2000-present * Indy 500, 1911-present * Daytona 500, 1959-present * 24 Hours of Le Mans, 1923-present " Enjoy - Ed From harmug at us.ibm.com Mon Mar 29 06:25:07 2010 From: harmug at us.ibm.com (George Harmuth) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 08:25:07 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Impact racing belts Decertified Message-ID: Looks like Impact has been cutting corners. Check your belts, you don't want to be surprised at Tech or in a crash. March 26, 2010 - NOTICE OF DECERTIFICATION; NOTICE TO CEASE AND DESIST AND TERMINATION OF ALL CONTRACTS OF PARTICIPATION ISSUED TO IMPACT RACING SFI Foundation, Inc., has issued a Notice of Decertification; Notice of Cease and Desist, and a notice terminating all Contracts of Participation to Impact Racing. Effective April 27, 2010, all products manufactured and/or distributed by Impact Racing pursuant to SFI Specification Programs 3.2A, 3.3, 16.1, and 16.5 are decertified. Evidence obtained by SFI shows that over a period of years Impact Racing has engaged in the production and use of counterfeit SFI conformance labels and patches, and affixed them to Impact products for use in motorsports. Under the Contracts of Participation between SFI and Impact, SFI conformance labels and patches may only be obtained from SFI and no other source. Evidence shows that Impact had counterfeit SFI labels and patches made in Asia and then affixed them to Impact products it distributed to members of the racing community. To SFIbs knowledge, Impact never advised its customers that its products contained phony SFI labels and patches. Impact never advised SFI of its systematic and longstanding practice of counterfeiting and distributing SFI patches and labeling. Impact has been directed to cease and desist from this practice. SFI has directed Impact to immediately notify all affected customers to remove the counterfeit labeling and to offer the affected customers a full refund of the purchase price. SFI is requesting that all counterfeit conformance labels removed from Impact products be sent to SFI. SFI has elected not to decertify these products immediately in order to minimize the potential hardships to members of the racing community that have been brought about by Impactbs counterfeiting activities. SFI has also elected to terminate all Contracts of Participation with Impact Racing effective 90 days from March 24, 2010. Under the terms of the Contracts, either party may terminate the agreements without penalty upon 90 days notice. This means that Impact will no longer be able to participate in any SFI programs after this 90 day period. SFI has taken these actions in the best interests of the safety and integrity of the racing community. This is in keeping with SFIbs mission and purpose. For a downloadable .pdf of this notice, please click on the following link: >Decertification Notice 03-26-10. G. Michael Harmuth Software Engineer Automated Material Handling Equipment Engineering Services From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Mon Mar 29 07:42:34 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 08:42:34 -0500 Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 References: <761127.22877.qm@web58502.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <009901cacf45$b038b580$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Hi, in the old days we checked voltage drop between the battery and the connections along the way to the alternator. Anything over .1 or .2 volts pointed to a problem. That's 1 or 2 tenths of a volt. Over that level could be a loose connection, corrosion/high resistance, maybe faulty wiring. And being it's British and older, check all grounds; they seem to be the Bugaboo in a lot of cases. Be sure the engine is grounded to the frame. I know one guy who had a problem with a Cheve pickup not charging; it turned out to be a loose connection where the battery cable bolts to the starter solenoid. Don't ask who the guy was! Good luck, Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Blake" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:25 PM Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 > FOT > > I installed a HITEST14088 alternator in place of my original alternator about > 5 months ago and it seemed to function although the lead placement was not the > same as the original setup. Lately it seems to be spotty and I would like to > check the output to determine if I have wiring issues or a grumpy > alternator. I have individually cheched readings between the negative > terminal of the battery and the three connectors on the alternator and gotten > readings between 0.20 and 0.50 volts. These readings seem odd but being > electrically challanged I don't trust my technique. Would appreciate > suggestions and or internet references. > > Bob Blake > Dripping Springs, TX > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Mon Mar 29 07:46:32 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 08:46:32 -0500 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, ,<093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: <00aa01cacf46$3e3d3720$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Thanks for the laugh; Thanks, I needed that! Hai Karate, I think it was, '60's. Be careful how you use it. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Gray" To: "'Dan Forgey'" ; ; ; "'triumph fot'" Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:26 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > I hear those NASCAR spring > rubbers act weird in right > hand corners > > jim g > > -----Original Message----- > From: > fot-bounces at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team > .net] On Behalf Of Dan Forgey > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 > 1:14 PM > To: horizonracing at msn.com; > mark at bradakis.com; triumph fot > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging > Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Anyone know where to source > the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Dan Forgey > > > From: horizonracing at msn.com > > To: mark at bradakis.com; > fot at autox.team.net > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 > 11:35:07 -0700 > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: > Paging Tom Krieger re: rear > springs > > > > As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear > springs with "Nascar" spring > rubbers. Smooth > > track= use the spring > rubber,rough track= put in a > softer one or remove it > ! > > :) > > > > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 > 11:01:03 -0600 > > > From: mark at bradakis.com > > > To: fot at autox.team.net > > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: > Paging Tom Krieger re: rear > springs > > > > > > >> spring rate doesn't > change when you shorten a > spring > > > >> > > > > > > > > > If you shorten it by > compressing and heating, > leaving the coil > > > count the same, that is > true. If you physically cut > the spring and > > > change the coil count, it > does get stiffer. > > > > > > mjb. > > > > > > > ______________________________ > _________________ > > > fot at autox.team.net > > > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.htm > l > > > Archive: > http://www.team.net/archive > > > Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums > > > Unsubscribe: > > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/ > options/fot/horizonracing at msn. > com > > > > > ______________________________ > _________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.htm > l > > Archive: > http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/ > options/fot/cofrog at q.com > > ______________________________ > _________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.htm > l > Archive: > http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/ > options/fot/toodamnfunky at comca > st.net > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Mon Mar 29 15:24:25 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 16:24:25 -0500 Subject: [Fot] later TR6 2nd gear Message-ID: I am looking for a good condition second gear for the mid to later TR6 mainshaft. Anyone have one for sale? Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 It's not what you've got, it's what you use that makes a difference. Zig Ziglar From triosan at gmail.com Wed Mar 31 10:43:07 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 09:43:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Need a TR6 rod Message-ID: I need one, and better two, rods for a TR6 of the variety that does not have a small hole in it above the rod bearing area. I have 12 of those that do have holes and would be glad to swap a set for a couple without holes. I had a rod failure and have the other five rods/pistons all balanced and would like to just replace the one rod rather than prep 6 more. Thanks, -- Chuck Arnold From Spitfire_Racing at twcny.rr.com Wed Mar 31 14:54:30 2010 From: Spitfire_Racing at twcny.rr.com (Spitfire Racing) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 16:54:30 -0400 Subject: [Fot] engines available Message-ID: <001801cad114$5c399870$14acc950$@rr.com> I have a neighbor who has two BMC A Series engines he wants to sell off. One is a 1275 and the other is a bit smaller. He also has a bare TR-3 Block to sell. I have no financial interest in this. If you have interest, please e-mail me off list and I will send his contact information. He was a racer for some 30 years. The BMC engines were spares for his Formula Junior if he needed them. These are located near Ithaca NY. Russ Moore From jeff_durant at comcast.net Wed Mar 31 15:17:50 2010 From: jeff_durant at comcast.net (jeff_durant at comcast.net) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 21:17:50 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Need a TR6 rod Message-ID: <906749465-1270070271-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1715018818-@bda059.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Chuck, Give me a call, I've plenty. Jeff ------Original Message------ From: Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Sender: fot-bounces at autox.team.net To: Friends To: Triumph Subject: [Fot] Need a TR6 rod Sent: Mar 31, 2010 9:43 AM I need one, and better two, rods for a TR6 of the variety that does not have a small hole in it above the rod bearing area. I have 12 of those that do have holes and would be glad to swap a set for a couple without holes. I had a rod failure and have the other five rods/pistons all balanced and would like to just replace the one rod rather than prep 6 more. Thanks, -- Chuck Arnold _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jeff_durant at comcast.net Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T From greenman62 at hotmail.com Wed Mar 31 16:55:01 2010 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (Greg Petrolati) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 22:55:01 +0000 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: I'd like to nominate Bob Pengraph and Becky Phelan (bob at nwspeedshots.com, gofastergirl at hotmail.com) Bob should need no introduction and Becky's dad has a TR2 and comes from a British car family. Greg Petrolati Greg Petrolati Lafayette, Oregon That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... From tom at squeelerracing.com Wed Mar 31 19:14:13 2010 From: tom at squeelerracing.com (Tom Kreger) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 18:14:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Bob and Becky References: Message-ID: <0499B8E122CF490698046B35951355A9@laptop> A harty second from me. Bob is a great guy! TK ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Petrolati" To: Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:55 PM Subject: [Fot] (no subject) > I'd like to nominate Bob Pengraph and Becky Phelan > (bob at nwspeedshots.com, gofastergirl at hotmail.com) Bob should need no > introduction and Becky's dad has a TR2 and comes from a British car > family. > > > > Greg Petrolati > > > > Greg Petrolati Lafayette, Oregon > > > > That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tom at squeelerracing.com From cwnfot at gmail.com Wed Mar 31 19:30:34 2010 From: cwnfot at gmail.com (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 21:30:34 -0400 Subject: [Fot] SCCA statement on Impact products Message-ID: <000001cad13a$edb98ff0$c92cafd0$@com> SCCA statement on Impact products: http://www.averillpark.net/documents/RM%2010-04.pdf Forum on the subject: http://www.averillpark.net/thisendup/index.php?/archives/25-SCCA-statement-o n-Impact-Racing-products.html Interesting website: http://www.na-motorsports.com/index.html Clark Clark W. Nicholls 1972 Stag 1974 Spitfire (and 1 rusty GT6 needing restoration) "Reality, it's not what you think." From horizonracing at msn.com Wed Mar 31 22:35:27 2010 From: horizonracing at msn.com (Tony and Annie Garmey) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 21:35:27 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Bob and Becky In-Reply-To: <0499B8E122CF490698046B35951355A9@laptop> References: , <0499B8E122CF490698046B35951355A9@laptop> Message-ID: Just as Tom say's............. Great guy. Gives a lot and asks for nothing. > From: tom at squeelerracing.com > To: greenman62 at hotmail.com; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 18:14:13 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Fot] Bob and Becky > > A harty second from me. Bob is a great guy! TK > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Greg Petrolati" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:55 PM > Subject: [Fot] (no subject) > > > > I'd like to nominate Bob Pengraph and Becky Phelan > > (bob at nwspeedshots.com, gofastergirl at hotmail.com) Bob should need no > > introduction and Becky's dad has a TR2 and comes from a British car > > family. > > > > > > > > Greg Petrolati > > > > > > > > Greg Petrolati Lafayette, Oregon > > > > > > > > That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > > > > _______________________________________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tom at squeelerracing.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracing at msn.com From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Tue Mar 2 19:09:56 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 18:09:56 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Car Chase video (No Triumphs) Message-ID: <1C211269-8457-4BBE-9AD9-CE6534AE36F8@earthlink.net> No TR's but certainly worth watching! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rmbh1lWyUj0 ~Steve From ablake2 at austin.rr.com Tue Mar 2 20:39:48 2010 From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com (Greg & Alison Blake) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 21:39:48 -0600 Subject: [Fot] headlights for TR3A Message-ID: <000001caba83$2d0ae010$6501a8c0@blake1> Does anyone know if the headlight buckets from a TR4a would work on an early TR3A front apron? My commission number is in the low 30,000 range. There is a complete set on Ebay, but I don't want to bid unless the bucket will bolt up to my apron. Thanks, Greg From lfritz82 at hotmail.com Tue Mar 2 21:40:07 2010 From: lfritz82 at hotmail.com (Lorne Fritz) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 23:40:07 -0500 Subject: [Fot] headlights for TR3A In-Reply-To: <000001caba83$2d0ae010$6501a8c0@blake1> References: <000001caba83$2d0ae010$6501a8c0@blake1> Message-ID: Greg, The headlight buckets will fit even though they are different. The early TR3 buckets have a wider(deeper) ring, but very few people would know they weren't correct. They changed to the later style bucket about 1960 and used it clear thru the last TR6. Lorne > From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2010 21:39:48 -0600 > Subject: [Fot] headlights for TR3A > > Does anyone know if the headlight buckets from a TR4a would work on an > early TR3A front apron? My commission number is in the low 30,000 > range. There is a complete set on Ebay, but I don't want to bid unless > the bucket will bolt up to my apron. > > Thanks, > > Greg > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/lfritz82 at hotmail.com > > _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsofts powerful SPAM protection. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469226/direct/01/ From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Wed Mar 3 05:10:47 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (Jerry Van Vlack) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 07:10:47 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Old Photo of TR 2 racers Message-ID: <8366A565233844EB926ED56B706D1991@userb38463fba5> http://www.barcboys.com/Images/Berwick59/55%20BrynfanTyddin-TR2start2.jpg From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Wed Mar 3 05:46:25 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (Jerry Van Vlack) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 07:46:25 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Great website Message-ID: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> http://www.barcboys.com/ Click on Enter in the upper right corner From info at dieselperformanceparts.com Wed Mar 3 10:58:07 2010 From: info at dieselperformanceparts.com (Diesel Performance Parts Inc. - Info) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 11:58:07 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Carrillo Rods Message-ID: <55CB8270B7388B478DC7AC2A39A97C5A6E5659@isis.dieselperformanceparts.local> Morning members, Got an extra set of Carrillo rod's for a Spitfire 1300 small crank. They have been run very little and still have the engine bearings in them so you can see the wear pattern. Basically like new. Like to get 650.00 for the four of them. Call me at 615-347-0260 or e mail me. Mark Craig Diesel Performance Parts, INC. 411 Allied Drive Nashville, TN 37211 866-455-7788 Phone 615-834-9923 Fax www.dieselperformanceparts.com From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Wed Mar 3 11:10:23 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 12:10:23 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Carrillo Rods Message-ID: This reminds me, does anyone have an orphaned TR4 Carillo rod for sale? From spyderweb at uwalumni.com Wed Mar 3 12:02:22 2010 From: spyderweb at uwalumni.com (Jim Hill) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 13:02:22 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Great website In-Reply-To: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> References: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> Message-ID: <3afbecf41003031102m5ff47d3el3a9947c7f7d45782@mail.gmail.com> Nice catch Jerry! Especially: http://www.barcboys.com/Images/drivers%201/JerryWalsh.jpg Jim Hill ________________________________ Jerry Van Vlack wrote: http://www.barcboys.com/ Click on Enter in the upper right corner From adams910 at gmail.com Wed Mar 3 12:09:27 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 14:09:27 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Great website In-Reply-To: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> References: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> Message-ID: <673993c51003031109o2df03522y63afeb0d325a9ba5@mail.gmail.com> I just found that site as well. It really covers the Northeast SCCA National scene in the late 50's early 60's. Lots of easily recognizable names (Roger Penske, Bob Holbert, Mark Donohue, Peter Revson, Don Yenko, etc). If you look through the results, you'll see current Triumph vintage racer Dick Stockton in either a B-Mod Healey (Chevy powered), or in GMod with a Elva MkIV. Also look for guys like Randy Canfield (still racing HP @ 80 years old), Buzz Marcus and Sam Feinstein in Super 7's, Gerry Truitt, etc. Bob From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Wed Mar 3 12:58:36 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 14:58:36 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Great website References: <0907D765357F4FE685563C3496B6902F@userb38463fba5> Message-ID: <003501cabb0b$e9e67770$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> In '08 at the Glen vintage race, these guys had a large tent set up down the paddock a bit from the Triumph area; they appeared to be having a great time! Seemed to be a lot of hot air and cold beverages around! They're a good bunch. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Jerry Van Vlack" To: "'Friends of Triumph'" Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 7:46 AM Subject: [Fot] Great website > http://www.barcboys.com/ > > Click on Enter in the upper right corner > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From gaf3 at charter.net Wed Mar 3 16:13:40 2010 From: gaf3 at charter.net (Glenn Franco) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 18:13:40 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable Message-ID: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of questions for the wisdom of the collective groups. Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 engine with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during starting, it takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a third cable to connect to the center carb to get it going. after that it runs to problem. Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the cable. The center carb is not contributing to the starting event. All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and seals. Any ideas out there?? Thanks in advance Glenn Franco 3 TR6's , TR250, Spit race car and a nice 76 rust free spit. From tr6racer21 at earthlink.net Wed Mar 3 16:21:45 2010 From: tr6racer21 at earthlink.net (Chip Collingwood) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 18:21:45 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable Message-ID: <380-22010333232145625@earthlink.net> Glenn, You might try using the cable on the rear (2) carbs as Richard suggests, or you could check with him on his newer (3) cable choke pull setup Chip > [Original Message] > From: Glenn Franco > To: ; Friends of Triumph ; <6pack at autox.team.net> > Date: 3/3/2010 6:15:25 PM > Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable > > With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of > questions for the wisdom of the collective groups. > Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 > engine with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during > starting, it takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a > third cable to connect to the center carb to get it going. after that it > runs to problem. > Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the > cable. The center carb is not contributing to the starting event. > All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and > seals. > Any ideas out there?? > Thanks in advance > Glenn Franco > 3 TR6's , TR250, Spit race car and a nice 76 rust free spit. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr6racer21 at earthlink.net From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Wed Mar 3 16:42:51 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 18:42:51 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR6 headers craigs list Message-ID: <4B8EF3FB.1060006@twcny.rr.com> http://syracuse.craigslist.org/pts/1605517046.html Looks like a deal... From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Wed Mar 3 19:13:21 2010 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2010 18:13:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable In-Reply-To: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> Message-ID: <878631.64857.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Glenn: I have installed three of these set-ups for customers; a couple of which are on the six-pack list (customers, not carbs). I have always set them up on the back two carbs, and have never had a problem starting. Make sure the cams are adjusted correctly, and that the enrichening (sp?) discs and holes are not plugged up. Thanks - Ed --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Glenn Franco wrote: From: Glenn Franco Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable To: tr6parts at charter.net, "Friends of Triumph" , 6pack at autox.team.net Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 5:13 PM With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of questions for the wisdom of the collective groups. Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 engine with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during starting, it takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a third cable to connect to the center carb to get it going. after that it runs to problem. Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the cable. The center carb is not contributing to the starting event. All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and seals. Any ideas out there?? Thanks in advance Glenn Franco 3 TR6's , TR250, Spit race car and a nice 76 rust free spit. \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net From goodparts at verizon.net Wed Mar 3 20:31:49 2010 From: goodparts at verizon.net (Richard Good) Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2010 22:31:49 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable In-Reply-To: <878631.64857.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <878631.64857.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5BF50D13C55B4222948B40CF43950A9B@AdminPC> Glenn, I have recently started making triple choke cables and have then in stock with either solid wire or stranded cable. Regards, Richard Good -------------------------------------------------- From: "EDWARD BARNARD" Sent: Wednesday, March 03, 2010 9:13 PM To: "Friends of Triumph" ; "Glenn Franco" Subject: Re: [Fot] Choke Cable > Glenn: I have installed three of these set-ups for customers; a couple of > which are on the six-pack list (customers, not carbs). I have always set > them > up on the back two carbs, and have never had a problem starting. Make sure > the > cams are adjusted correctly, and that the enrichening (sp?) discs and > holes > are not plugged up. > Thanks - Ed > --- On Wed, 3/3/10, Glenn Franco wrote: > > > From: Glenn Franco > Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable > To: tr6parts at charter.net, "Friends of Triumph" , > 6pack at autox.team.net > Date: Wednesday, March 3, 2010, 5:13 PM > > > With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of > questions > for the wisdom of the collective groups. > Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 > engine > with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during starting, it > takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a third cable to > connect > to the center carb to get it going. after that it runs to problem. > Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the cable. > The > center carb is not contributing to the starting event. > All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and > seals. > Any ideas out there?? > Thanks in advance > Glenn Franco > \ From lang at isis.mit.edu Thu Mar 4 07:10:52 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 09:10:52 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] [6pack] Choke Cable In-Reply-To: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> References: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> Message-ID: Hi, Not trying to be funny here, but I found through trial and error that by making the best spark possible, it practically eliminates the need for the choke. On my race with triple Webers, I only need the choke for the first start of the day. When I had that setup in the street car, I had a Crane X700 spark box and I NEVER needed the choke. The car started first twist, even down to the mid-20's (F). regards, rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2009 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From s.janzen at comcast.net Thu Mar 4 08:20:04 2010 From: s.janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 10:20:04 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR6 headers craigs list In-Reply-To: <4B8EF3FB.1060006@twcny.rr.com> References: <4B8EF3FB.1060006@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: has anybody ever tried to put these on a GT6? They should fit the head, but may not clear the frame? On Mar 3, 2010, at 6:42 PM, Mark Eginton wrote: http://syracuse.craigslist.org/pts/1605517046.html Looks like a deal... \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/s.janzen at comcast.net From mdhado at comcast.net Thu Mar 4 16:37:02 2010 From: mdhado at comcast.net (M&M Hado) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 17:37:02 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Crankshaft Thrust Washers Message-ID: Does anyone have a source for oversize TR3/4 crankshaft thrust washers beyond +.005? Moss used to have a .008" but no more apparently. Thanks, Mike From jhassall at blacksburg.net Thu Mar 4 19:45:51 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 21:45:51 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Crankshaft Thrust Washers In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B90705F.2060104@blacksburg.net> On 3/4/2010 6:37 PM, M&M Hado wrote: > Does anyone have a source for oversize TR3/4 crankshaft thrust washers > beyond +.005? Moss used to have a .008" but no more apparently. > > Thanks, > > Mike Mike, you might try bonding some shim stock to the non-bearing side of the washers if you can't find the os washers. jim -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From mdhado at comcast.net Thu Mar 4 20:19:30 2010 From: mdhado at comcast.net (M&M Hado) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 21:19:30 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Crankshaft Thrust Washers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks for the replies. It looks like Moss Europe has +.0075" and Greg Solow's Engine Room in Santa Cruz is another lead. Both suggestions from Bob Kramer. Also, 3 others, including Ken Gillanders, suggested bonding a shim to the back side. I tried that already (with stainless and JB weld) held in a vice overnight but couldn't get a good bond. Trying the brass tonight but the safe way is probably the Moss shims on both sides. Appreciate your help in trying to salvage an otherwise good crank. Mike -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of M&M Hado Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 5:37 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Crankshaft Thrust Washers Does anyone have a source for oversize TR3/4 crankshaft thrust washers beyond +.005? Moss used to have a .008" but no more apparently. Thanks, Mike \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mdhado at comcast.net From jmwagner at greenheart.com Thu Mar 4 20:47:36 2010 From: jmwagner at greenheart.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 19:47:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) Message-ID: <4B907ED8.6080905@greenheart.com> Just ran across this on Craigslist... passing the link along... thought it might be of interest... --Justin Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/pts/1629114524.html From jeff_durant at comcast.net Thu Mar 4 21:29:49 2010 From: jeff_durant at comcast.net (jeff_durant at comcast.net) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 04:29:49 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) Message-ID: <325283340-1267763347-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-2105623690-@bda059.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Justin, I spoke to a gent named Ivan who owns the webers. Nice guy. He was asking $2500 a couple weeks back an I mentioned that was a bit high. He also has a complete GT6+ bonnet and some front end bits. He used to race a GT6 in the SF region. Jeff D. ------Original Message------ From: Justin Wagner Sender: fot-bounces at autox.team.net To: Friends of Triumph Subject: [Fot] Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) Sent: Mar 4, 2010 7:47 PM Just ran across this on Craigslist... passing the link along... thought it might be of interest... --Justin Triple Side-Draft Weber 40DCOE-2 & Manifolds - $2000 (gilroy) http://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/pts/1629114524.html \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jeff_durant at comcast.net Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T From n197tr4 at cs.com Thu Mar 4 21:44:52 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2010 23:44:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] amb transponder Message-ID: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> FOT, Looking for your uneeded AMB Transponder for the AMBRO. Thanks, Joe A From yellow-green at sbcglobal.net Thu Mar 4 22:52:58 2010 From: yellow-green at sbcglobal.net (Dennis DeLap) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2010 21:52:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] amb transponder In-Reply-To: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <636290.85067.qm@web81704.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Me too - for the TVR 2200S Dennis FOT, Looking for your uneeded AMB Transponder for the AMBRO. Thanks, Joe A \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/yellow-green at sbcglobal.net From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Fri Mar 5 09:55:42 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 08:55:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] amb transponder In-Reply-To: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> References: <8CC8A35BAA721AD-6130-DC24@webmail-m035.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <911522.85267.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Andy at Armodillo racing out of Seattle can help you out. He supports all the club and historic races in the Northwest. He was at the KAS cup with his trailer. I have purchased my fuel cell, Kirky seat and related safety products from him. He is competitive and is a distributor. I am attaching his web site info. I will be buying a transponder from him in the next month. http://www.armadilloracing.com/ ________________________________ From: "n197tr4 at cs.com" To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Thu, March 4, 2010 8:44:52 PM Subject: [Fot] amb transponder FOT, Looking for your uneeded AMB Transponder for the AMBRO. Thanks, Joe A \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From igofaster at att.net Fri Mar 5 12:45:44 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2010 11:45:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Jaguar Parts Help needed In-Reply-To: <0782406101C4354E97CB854612FFE70D0FD330CB42@ITMBXEXCH.enterprise.trin.net> References: <0782406101C4354E97CB854612FFE70D0FD330CB42@ITMBXEXCH.enterprise.trin.net> Message-ID: <946135.62855.qm@web180715.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> my great friend Dan Mooney @ www.classicjaguar.com may be able to help locate the panels too.... Bobby Whitehead ________________________________ From: David Pilcher Sent: Fri, March 5, 2010 9:47:50 AM Subject: Jaguar Parts Help needed The below request was forwarded from our member Lisa Richardson, can anyone help? David E. Pilcher TSTI Manager Quality Systems (214) 589-8826 Office From:Lisa Richardson [mailto:lisa at josephvincelli.com] Sent: Friday, March 05, 2010 9:06 AM To: David Pilcher Subject: RE: 1st Communique Thanks for this info Dave. On another note, my restorer is looking for some Jaguar body panels (1966 Mark ll 3.8 Looking for both rear panels/fenders. Full or half. Also, Front Fender passenger area) if you can post this with the club maybe some have something to sell and I can put them in contact with each other. They can call Richard at 214-957-1320 if they have something. Lisa Vincelli cell: 972-345-5051 Notice: This email message, including any attachments, contains information belonging to Trinity Industries, Inc. and its business units. It has been sent solely for the use of the intended recipients and may be confidential, proprietary, copyrighted, and legally privileged. If you are not an intended recipient, please advise the sender of the error and permanently delete all copies of this email, including any copies that may reside in your deleted box. The unauthorized review, use, disclosure, distribution, or copying of this email or its contents is strictly prohibited. From gaf3 at charter.net Sat Mar 6 13:05:49 2010 From: gaf3 at charter.net (Glenn Franco) Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2010 15:05:49 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Choke Cable In-Reply-To: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> References: <4B8EED24.4020306@charter.net> Message-ID: <4B92B59D.8030802@charter.net> Thanks to all that provided feedback on my triple Stromberg choke cable starting issues. Looks like I will be adding an additional cable for cold starts. Thanks again Glenn Glenn Franco wrote: > With the recent thread on the 6 pack email list, I have a couple of > questions for the wisdom of the collective groups. > Just installed a triple stromberg (Good setup) on a rebuilt early TR6 > engine with a cam this past fall. The only problem I have is during > starting, it takes more than two carbs to start the beast. I need a > third cable to connect to the center carb to get it going. after that > it runs to problem. > Any one else had this issue? I have the front and rear carbs on the > cable. The center carb is not contributing to the starting event. > All three carbs were extensively rebuilt including throttle shafts and > seals. > Any ideas out there?? > Thanks in advance > Glenn Franco > 3 TR6's , TR250, Spit race car and a nice 76 rust free spit. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gaf3 at charter.net From igofaster at att.net Sat Mar 6 13:05:30 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 12:05:30 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] crankcase ventilation Message-ID: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> My GT6 has been running with a catch tank for the valve cover and plumbing for the crankcase ventilation. I have been running the valve cover blowby into the tank but have run without the crankcase ventilation plumbing into the catch tank. Someone suggested that all British cars run better if the crankcase is being ventilated. This past weekend I ran the crankcase and valve cover blowby into the catch tank...dang... I'm gathering at least a pint of blowby in the emulsion tank in just a 15 minute run... I seem to recall Kas suggested a crankcase pipe of 1/2" inside diameter... my car has about a 3/8" port into the fuel pump spot where it is configureed... The hose for the blow by definately looks more oiley , but what is the opinion of the group of having so much run off in the catch tank... I'm getting blowby mist that I can see when the engine is at idle with the oil cap off... the GT is on the 3rd season without a rebuild... wondering if I retorque the head and adjust the valves if I could reduce the blowby... or?? Bobby Whitehead 1970GT6 DP CVAR looks like I purchased a race preparred Spitfire on eBay this week out in California... so... my wife is allowing a two racecar garage for her hubby..... From LOddTR at aol.com Sat Mar 6 13:23:35 2010 From: LOddTR at aol.com (LOddTR at aol.com) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 15:23:35 EST Subject: [Fot] Invitation: Fourth Annual Martha McDougal to be awarded at VIR 4/9 - 4/11 Message-ID: <121b.68d2ae2d.38c413c7@aol.com> The Triumph Ghetto is pleased to announce that they will award the Fourth Annual Martha McDougal Trophy, as part of the 2010 VDCA Wild Hare Run, at Virginia International Raceway. The dates for this year's event are April 9th through the 11th. Join your fellow Triumph racers at this prestigious event that serves as the kick-off to the 2010 race season. The Wild Hare features generous amounts of track time, including a free enduro, on one of the most challenging long tracks in the country. Topping off the weekend will be the presentation of the coveted "Martha" trophy to the Triumph racer that displays a high level of performance on track, camaraderie in the paddock and general good-guy/gal-ness. In addition to the standard fun on and off the track, the Ghetto will provide their world famous surf and turf dinner on Friday evening. Here is your link to the entry form for the weekends festivities. We look forward to seeing you there. _http://www.vintagedrive.com/EntryVIR10.pdf_ (http://www.vintagedrive.com/EntryVIR10.pdf) The TR Ghetto PS: Here is Martha's story This race weekend honors Ms. Martha McDougal, a woman who toiled in almost total obscurity for many years at the Triumph automobile plant in Coventry, England. According to sources believed to be reliable, Martha was born in Coventry in January, 1923. Her parents were tragically killed in the Blitz and Martha was left an orphan at age 16. Although she was not overly bright, she was very resourceful and within months had gotten a job at the Standard Triumph factory emptying the dust bins. Throughout the war and until the demise of the company, Martha made the rounds, day after day, month after month, year after year, transferring the trash into her cart and then into the large bins behind the factory, without complaint or even one day's absence. Over the years Martha became known as the single person who had completed the most "laps" of the Triumph factory and, upon her retirement a few months before the final closing of the Coventry plant, she was honored with a bronzed pair of high top Keds, her signature footwear. It is rumored that at the presentation, Sir John himself reminisced about how Martha, who had an endearing habit of assigning nicknames to all the staff, would push past him in the hallway and mumble, "Get out of my way you fat bastard". From tlizzard at msn.com Sat Mar 6 15:23:33 2010 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 17:23:33 -0500 Subject: [Fot] crankcase ventilation In-Reply-To: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: What are the leakdown numbers for the engine? Leakdown checks are really the only sure way of knowing the condition of the rings and or valves in terms of sealing. Terry Stetler From timmurph at fastbytes.com Sat Mar 6 16:21:15 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 17:21:15 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 crankshaft end play Message-ID: <000001cabd83$b89bbca0$29d335e0$@com> When I assembled the reground crank after the center main bearing failed I put new thrust bearings in, 0.005 oversize in front, standard in the rear, which is what the old ones were. The old thrust bearings got particles of the failed center main imbedded in them which is why I replaced them. I had 0.003 end play with the old thrust bearings when I put new main and rod bearings in 2008. I now have 0.001 to 0.0015 end play with the same size new thrust bearings, 0.005 oversize front and standard rear. I'm guessing my old thrust bearings were a bit worn, giving the 0.003 end play in 2008. The book spec is 0.004 to 0.006. If I take the 0.005 oversize out and put a standard in front also I'll be right at the limit of 0.006. Am I better off to run the 0.001 end play or the "at the limit" 0.006? I did notice that the new thrust bearings from BPNW, which are the "County" (I think that's the same as "King") brand, have what appears to be a copper facing on the bearing surface whereas my old ones looked like Babbitt. Maybe the copper was worn off the old ones giving the 0.003 endplay? Thanks for any comments and opinions on this. It would seem that 0.001 would be a bit tight, unless they quickly "wear in" and would give me 0.003 or there about. I'm measuring the end play with a tenth indicator against the ground surface on the flank in front of the rear main journal and "pushing" the crank back and forth with a big screwdriver against the center counter balance and the block. I get the 0.0015 if I push hard and hold and the 0.001 if I push and release. Only the center main bearing block is in and torqued. The front and rear blocks are not installed yet. This is a stock crankshaft and the stock thrust bearings. Tim From s.janzen at comcast.net Sat Mar 6 19:42:52 2010 From: s.janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 21:42:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] crankcase ventilation In-Reply-To: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> Now I'm curious- my GT6 has no crankcase ventilation- where's the breather connection? Also- with all the open space between crankcase and valve cover along the pushrods, why would a 1/2" tube on the crankcase make any difference? Sent from my iPhone On Mar 6, 2010, at 3:05 PM, Bobby Whitehead wrote: > My GT6 has been running with a catch tank for the valve cover and > plumbing for the crankcase ventilation. I have been running the > valve cover blowby into the tank but have run without the crankcase > ventilation plumbing into the catch tank. > Someone suggested that all British cars run better if the crankcase > is being ventilated. This past weekend I ran the crankcase and valve > cover blowby into the catch tank...dang... I'm gathering at least a > pint of blowby in the emulsion tank in just a 15 minute run... > I seem to recall Kas suggested a crankcase pipe of 1/2" inside > diameter... my car has about a 3/8" port into the fuel pump spot > where it is configureed... > The hose for the blow by definately looks more oiley , but what is > the opinion of the group of having so much run off in the catch > tank... I'm getting blowby mist that I can see when the engine is at > idle with the oil cap off... the GT is on the 3rd season without a > rebuild... wondering if I retorque the head and adjust the valves if > I could reduce the blowby... or?? > > Bobby Whitehead 1970GT6 DP CVAR > > looks like I purchased a race preparred Spitfire on eBay this week > out in California... so... my wife is allowing a two racecar garage > for her hubby..... > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/s.janzen at comcast.net From jaboruch at netzero.net Sat Mar 6 20:28:47 2010 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 03:28:47 GMT Subject: [Fot] TR4 crankshaft end play Message-ID: <20100306.222847.24000.0@webmail03.dca.untd.com> Tim, 0.001 is too tight. I would go with the 0.006, but if you want to get closer to the low end of the tolerance, sand 0.003 of the back of half of the thicker bearings. I made a wooden fixture that the bearings fit into so that I could sand them with emery paper on a flat plate, without sanding my finger tips off. It also keeps them level so an even amount is taken off. Joe(B) ---------- Original Message ---------- From: "Tim Murphy" To: Cc: rpm724 at att.net, ryan.murphy at fdlco.wi.gov Subject: [Fot] TR4 crankshaft end play Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 17:21:15 -0600 When I assembled the reground crank after the center main bearing failed I put new thrust bearings in, 0.005 oversize in front, standard in the rear, which is what the old ones were. The old thrust bearings got particles of the failed center main imbedded in them which is why I replaced them. I had 0.003 end play with the old thrust bearings when I put new main and rod bearings in 2008. I now have 0.001 to 0.0015 end play with the same size new thrust bearings, 0.005 oversize front and standard rear. I'm guessing my old thrust bearings were a bit worn, giving the 0.003 end play in 2008. The book spec is 0.004 to 0.006. If I take the 0.005 oversize out and put a standard in front also I'll be right at the limit of 0.006. Am I better off to run the 0.001 end play or the "at the limit" 0.006? I did notice that the new thrust bearings from BPNW, which are the "County" (I think that's the same as "King") brand, have what appears to be a copper facing on the bearing surface whereas my old ones looked like Babbitt. Maybe the copper was worn off the old ones giving the 0.003 endplay? Thanks for any comments and opinions on this. It would seem that 0.001 would be a bit tight, unless they quickly "wear in" and would give me 0.003 or there about. I'm measuring the end play with a tenth indicator against the ground surface on the flank in front of the rear main journal and "pushing" the crank back and forth with a big screwdriver against the center counter balance and the block. I get the 0.0015 if I push hard and hold and the 0.001 if I push and release. Only the center main bearing block is in and torqued. The front and rear blocks are not installed yet. This is a stock crankshaft and the stock thrust bearings. Tim \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jaboruch at netzero.net ____________________________________________________________ Get Free Email with Video Mail & Video Chat! http://www.netzero.net/freeemail?refcd=NZTAGOUT1FREM0210 From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sat Mar 6 21:06:26 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg Lunker Hilyer) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 21:06:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling Message-ID: <9C2735B4-2897-47D4-9DE8-208D4C0F8DED@earthlink.net> While cleaning shop today, I moved a pile of expired harnesses onto a shelf right next to the new tie-downs I just bought. IDEA... The used [useless] harnesses will make for great "over the tire" tie downs. Surprised I never thought of it before and also surprised I've never seen such. Eager to get them mounted. If I lose a car I'll be sure to let you all know. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM By the way, My UPS guy offerd me 2 TR6's ['76 complete and with hardtop, '74 roller with everything in boxes] for $3000. I'm not interested in advertising them &/or fielding a bunch of inquiries but would be willing to take a look for a FoT. From n197tr4 at cs.com Sat Mar 6 21:13:09 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2010 23:13:09 -0500 Subject: [Fot] crankcase ventilation In-Reply-To: <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> Message-ID: <8CC8BC3A182476E-39E4-10E86@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> It's been said before, but I run negative pressure in my crankcase to great effect. There is no oil being pushed past seals and gaskets and there is a belief that negative pressure promotes better ring sealing and reduces internal disturbances. This is not a new idea and it is commonly used by dragsters and stock car racers. SVRA sees it as something that would pass their tech and it always has elsewhere. Inexpensive and simple to install. Joe A -----Original Message----- From: Scott Janzen To: Bobby Whitehead Cc: FoT Triumph Sent: Sat, Mar 6, 2010 8:42 pm Subject: Re: [Fot] crankcase ventilation Now I'm curious- my GT6 has no crankcase ventilation- where's the breather connection? Also- with all the open space between crankcase and valve cover along the pushrods, why would a 1/2" tube on the crankcase make any difference? Sent from my iPhone On Mar 6, 2010, at 3:05 PM, Bobby Whitehead wrote: > My GT6 has been running with a catch tank for the valve cover and > plumbing for the crankcase ventilation. I have been running the > valve cover blowby into the tank but have run without the crankcase > ventilation plumbing into the catch tank. > Someone suggested that all British cars run better if the crankcase > is being ventilated. This past weekend I ran the crankcase and valve > cover blowby into the catch tank...dang... I'm gathering at least a > pint of blowby in the emulsion tank in just a 15 minute run... > I seem to recall Kas suggested a crankcase pipe of 1/2" inside > diameter... my car has about a 3/8" port into the fuel pump spot > where it is configureed... > The hose for the blow by definately looks more oiley , but what is > the opinion of the group of having so much run off in the catch > tank... I'm getting blowby mist that I can see when the engine is at > idle with the oil cap off... the GT is on the 3rd season without a > rebuild... wondering if I retorque the head and adjust the valves if > I could reduce the blowby... or?? > > Bobby Whitehead 1970GT6 DP CVAR > > looks like I purchased a race preparred Spitfire on eBay this week > out in California... so... my wife is allowing a two racecar garage > for her hubby..... > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/s.janzen at comcast.net \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com = From n197tr4 at cs.com Sat Mar 6 21:17:17 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2010 23:17:17 -0500 Subject: [Fot] AMB TRANSPONDERS USED & NEW In-Reply-To: <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> Message-ID: <8CC8BC434ED6878-39E4-10EDF@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> FOT, I found four used transponders four $275 each, while they last. New for $399. Rechargeable, I believe. Joe A From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sat Mar 6 22:07:03 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2010 22:07:03 -0700 Subject: [Fot] AMB TRANSPONDERS USED & NEW In-Reply-To: <8CC8BC434ED6878-39E4-10EDF@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> <8CC8BC434ED6878-39E4-10EDF@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <456167A2-70DC-495A-8852-8281AADB9EBD@earthlink.net> For what it's worth Joe, That's a great deal. I've sold a couple on E-Bay for $325+. Got a email from AMB awhile back suggesting that since mine is 5+ years old [more like 8] they suggested I send it in for $30 off a replacement. Hah!! Mine still carries a 4 day charge and a friend has now been using his for 16 years. The rechargeables rock! Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Mar 6, 2010, at 9:17 PM, n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: > FOT, > > I found four used transponders four $275 each, while they last. > > New for $399. > > Rechargeable, I believe. > > Joe A > \ From andre at gt6.ca Sun Mar 7 04:55:14 2010 From: andre at gt6.ca (Andre Rousseau) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 06:55:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] AMB TRANSPONDERS USED & NEW In-Reply-To: <456167A2-70DC-495A-8852-8281AADB9EBD@earthlink.net> References: <657029.97148.qm@web180716.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <16529598-700C-4D8E-A032-24056B3E2513@comcast.net> <8CC8BC434ED6878-39E4-10EDF@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> <456167A2-70DC-495A-8852-8281AADB9EBD@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <4362ae391003070355u3542bfefm3765d447c9097721@mail.gmail.com> I got a hardware unit for $300 CND used. New they go for $490. Buggers charges me $50USD to transfer it into my name, but now show it only costs $40.00 http://www.mylaps.com/index.php/us_eng/Websites/B2C/car/products/used_transpo nders Oh well. A. On 7 March 2010 00:07, Greg "Lunker" Hilyer wrote: > For what it's worth Joe, > That's a great deal. I've sold a couple on E-Bay for $325+. Got a email from > AMB awhile back suggesting that since mine is 5+ years old [more like 8] > they suggested I send it in for $30 off a replacement. Hah!! Mine still > carries a 4 day charge and a friend has now been using his for 16 years. The > rechargeables rock! > > Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > On Mar 6, 2010, at 9:17 PM, n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: > >> FOT, >> >> I found four used transponders four $275 each, while they last. >> >> New for $399. >> >> Rechargeable, I believe. >> >> Joe A >> \ > > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/andre at gt6.ca > > > -- Andre Rousseau - andre at gt6.ca '68 Triumph GT6 MK1 - http://www.gt6.ca/ '77 FIAT 124 Vintage Racer #515 - http://www.124racer.com/ Ottawa, ON, Canada From n197tr4 at cs.com Sun Mar 7 06:44:09 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2010 08:44:09 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling.....now over the wheel tie downs In-Reply-To: <9C2735B4-2897-47D4-9DE8-208D4C0F8DED@earthlink.net> References: <9C2735B4-2897-47D4-9DE8-208D4C0F8DED@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <8CC8C13660E80D2-39E4-14154@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> If you go to photobucket.com/ambro you will see an "over the tire' tiedown system I am building for my new trailer. -----Original Message----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer To: fot Triumph Sent: Sat, Mar 6, 2010 10:06 pm Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling While cleaning shop today, I moved a pile of expired harnesses onto a shelf right next to the new tie-downs I just bought. IDEA... The used [useless] harnesses will make for great "over the tire" tie downs. Surprised I never thought of it before and also surprised I've never seen such. Eager to get them mounted. If I lose a car I'll be sure to let you all know. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM By the way, My UPS guy offerd me 2 TR6's ['76 complete and with hardtop, '74 roller with everything in boxes] for $3000. I'm not interested in advertising them &/or fielding a bunch of inquiries but would be willing to take a look for a FoT. \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From andre at gt6.ca Sun Mar 7 07:29:07 2010 From: andre at gt6.ca (Andre Rousseau) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 09:29:07 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling.....now over the wheel tie downs In-Reply-To: <8CC8C13660E80D2-39E4-14154@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> References: <9C2735B4-2897-47D4-9DE8-208D4C0F8DED@earthlink.net> <8CC8C13660E80D2-39E4-14154@webmail-d039.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <4362ae391003070629j44a92ba7v3597f46c732c7ee3@mail.gmail.com> AWESOME idea. A. On 7 March 2010 08:44, wrote: > If you go to photobucket.com/ambro you will see an "over the tire' > tiedown system I am building for my new trailer. > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > To: fot Triumph > Sent: Sat, Mar 6, 2010 10:06 pm > Subject: [Fot] Harness recycling > > > While cleaning shop today, I moved a pile of expired harnesses onto a shelf > right next to the new tie-downs I just bought. > IDEA... The used [useless] harnesses will make for great "over the tire" tie > downs. Surprised I never thought of it before and also surprised I've never > seen such. Eager to get them mounted. If I lose a car I'll be sure to let you > all know. > > Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > > By the way, > My UPS guy offerd me 2 TR6's ['76 complete and with hardtop, '74 roller with > everything in boxes] for $3000. I'm not interested in advertising them &/or > fielding a bunch of inquiries but would be willing to take a look for a FoT. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/andre at gt6.ca > > > -- Andre Rousseau - andre at gt6.ca '68 Triumph GT6 MK1 - http://www.gt6.ca/ '77 FIAT 124 Vintage Racer #515 - http://www.124racer.com/ Ottawa, ON, Canada From n197tr4 at cs.com Sun Mar 7 17:01:24 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 07 Mar 2010 19:01:24 -0500 Subject: [Fot] RECHARGEABLE AMBs Message-ID: <8CC8C69A0AA76F5-A454-21F0F@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> FYI, wolfcreek141 at yahoo.com has a few left at $275 plus $10 shipping. I'll have mine by Wednesday. She has them listed on eBay and they routinely go over $300 but she will sell directly with payment by PayPal. Joe From timmurph at fastbytes.com Sun Mar 7 19:00:24 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 20:00:24 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 thrust bearing clearance Message-ID: <000001cabe63$1f05e440$5d11acc0$@com> Thanks for all of the responses. I measured the thickness of my old and new thrust bearings today and saw that they were within about a = thousandth of each other. As I had .003 to .004 before I knew I must be doing something different. So I measured the clearance between the thrust bearing and the crank with a feeler, as the workshop manual shows, and I have a nice .004 clearance. Measuring the end play with an indicator and pushing the crank forward and back apparently is not a good way to measure the clearance, which is what the .004 to .006 tolerance is for. SoIll leave the thrust bearings as they are. The old ones which are about the same size worked okay and the clearance is at the low end of the spec. Everything looks pretty good!! I learned quite a bit to boot. Thanks again, much appreciated. Tim From jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au Mon Mar 8 00:57:48 2010 From: jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au (Jim Cun) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2010 23:57:48 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] TR-man MP3 In-Reply-To: <561232.57934.qm@web51806.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <561232.57934.qm@web51806.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <990467.55517.qm@web51805.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi Guys. Had this sent too me from a fellow TR-man so if you have not heard this MP3 had a listen [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type audio/mpeg which had a name of TR] From 58tr3a at videotron.ca Mon Mar 8 06:16:22 2010 From: 58tr3a at videotron.ca (Don Elliott) Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 08:16:22 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire Message-ID: Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to be available in August. http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm From dmitchel at sbcglobal.net Mon Mar 8 09:17:06 2010 From: dmitchel at sbcglobal.net (Doug Mitchell) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 08:17:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <641953.43963.qm@web80806.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Not exactly new, I saw a presentation on them in August of 2005, and Michelin showed them at SAE World Congress in 2006. I still wouldn't count on seeing them any time soon. ________________________________ From: Don Elliott <58tr3a at videotron.ca> To: Friends of Triumph Sent: Mon, March 8, 2010 8:16:22 AM Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to be available in August. http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dmitchel at sbcglobal.net From gaf3 at charter.net Mon Mar 8 09:58:07 2010 From: gaf3 at charter.net (Glenn Franco) Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 11:58:07 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B952C9F.6000805@charter.net> I did some research on these in the late 90's and contacted Michelin as to their release date for production. At the time I was trying to find a lightweight spare for the 3 generation Grand Cherokee, but they could not give me a date. Would make a good spare, but I don't think the public's ready to accept it. Glenn Don Elliott wrote: > Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to be available in August. > > http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gaf3 at charter.net From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Mon Mar 8 10:24:34 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 09:24:34 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: <4B952C9F.6000805@charter.net> References: <4B952C9F.6000805@charter.net> Message-ID: I like sidewalls on my tires, they keep water and rocks out of the spinning tires! Imagine going slowly through a puddle, wouldn't the thing collect the water and chuck it around? ~Steve On Mar 8, 2010, at 8:58 AM, Glenn Franco wrote: I did some research on these in the late 90's and contacted Michelin as to their release date for production. At the time I was trying to find a lightweight spare for the 3 generation Grand Cherokee, but they could not give me a date. Would make a good spare, but I don't think the public's ready to accept it. Glenn Don Elliott wrote: > Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer > band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to > be available in August. > > http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ > gaf3 at charter.net \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From kaskas at cox.net Mon Mar 8 11:16:53 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 10:16:53 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20100308131653.BEAAJ.1024792.imail@fed1rmwml32> How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of balance condition..... whoopee. ---- Steven Belfer wrote: ============= I like sidewalls on my tires, they keep water and rocks out of the spinning tires! Imagine going slowly through a puddle, wouldn't the thing collect the water and chuck it around? ~Steve On Mar 8, 2010, at 8:58 AM, Glenn Franco wrote: I did some research on these in the late 90's and contacted Michelin as to their release date for production. At the time I was trying to find a lightweight spare for the 3 generation Grand Cherokee, but they could not give me a date. Would make a good spare, but I don't think the public's ready to accept it. Glenn Don Elliott wrote: > Check it out - No tire, no tube, no air, just spokes and an outer > band. You can see right through these tires. They're supposed to > be available in August. > > http://www.fastcoolcars.com/airless-tires.htm > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ > gaf3 at charter.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From adams910 at gmail.com Mon Mar 8 11:29:28 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 13:29:28 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: References: <4B952C9F.6000805@charter.net> Message-ID: <673993c51003081029r77cf22dbqed6337957acf8877@mail.gmail.com> Here's DC Shoes' spin off this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jUfEsJJBUyM Bob From emanteno at gmail.com Mon Mar 8 11:35:36 2010 From: emanteno at gmail.com (Irv Korey) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 12:35:36 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: <20100308131653.BEAAJ.1024792.imail@fed1rmwml32> References: <20100308131653.BEAAJ.1024792.imail@fed1rmwml32> Message-ID: <354a1781003081035m36bee109nbf986ca7e230830a@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 12:16 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of > balance condition..... whoopee. > I can envision a scenario where you park your car in a puddle, only to have it freeze inside those tires overnight, locking your car in place until you are able to free it, maybe in spring. Irv From spitlist at cox.net Mon Mar 8 12:13:29 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 12:13:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: <354a1781003081035m36bee109nbf986ca7e230830a@mail.gmail.com> References: <20100308131653.BEAAJ.1024792.imail@fed1rmwml32> <354a1781003081035m36bee109nbf986ca7e230830a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Each set of tires would include an ice pick for just that sort of situation! :) Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Irv Korey Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 11:36 AM To: Kas Kastner Cc: Friends of Triumph Subject: Re: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 12:16 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of > balance condition..... whoopee. > I can envision a scenario where you park your car in a puddle, only to have it freeze inside those tires overnight, locking your car in place until you are able to free it, maybe in spring. Irv \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From BillDentin at aol.com Mon Mar 8 12:15:21 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 14:15:21 EST Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire Message-ID: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com> In a message dated 03/08/2010 12:32:42 PM Central Standard Time, kaskas at cox.net writes: > How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of > balance condition..... whoopee. > A couple of years ago someone sent me info on these, and I took it to my racing partner Bob Wismer, who was quite familiar with them. They are not a particularly new concept, and Kas is right that snow, ice, mud, debris are all prime issues that have prevented them from going further with them at this time. But consideration as an emergency spare strikes me as interesting. Bill Dentinger From Gt6steve at aol.com Mon Mar 8 13:46:07 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 15:46:07 EST Subject: [Fot] GOOD rollbar padding Message-ID: <2b79c.6cede798.38c6bc0f@aol.com> Hey, Anybody know who's got the best prices on the Hi density rollbar padding? From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Mon Mar 8 16:56:52 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 18:56:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder Message-ID: <4B958EC4.8070606@twcny.rr.com> I was in Lowes and saw some 1/8" steel stock perfect for a scatter shield 3" wide so here is how I spent my weekend: http://www.flickr.com/photos/28599565 at N04 Think it will do the job or is there something I need to consider adding or changing. I plan to run my dad's lightened flywheel which visually has seen a lathe back in the '60s. I had it magnifluxed and it is fine but I still feel the need for a shield - I like being ambulatory... The idea is to keep the car the way he raced it - drive it to the track, pull the windshield and passenger seat - add a plexiglas deflection shield and go have fun. So, I wanted it to hide under the carpet. Thanks, M From tlizzard at msn.com Mon Mar 8 17:21:51 2010 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 19:21:51 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com> References: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com> Message-ID: Seems to me a non-structural sidewall is the answer. Besides, they will need someplace to plaster their logo... Terry Stetler From trmarty at hotmail.com Mon Mar 8 17:47:27 2010 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 19:47:27 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire In-Reply-To: References: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com>, Message-ID: If they came in 20" and chrome spinners I'd put them on the Spitty :) Marty _________________________________________________________________ Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469229/direct/01/ From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Mon Mar 8 18:01:39 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (Jerry Van Vlack) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 20:01:39 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire References: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com> Message-ID: <426AAF5452124C52B91A8946F196D7F0@userb38463fba5> There is an industrial tire called AirBoss that uses a similar concept but with much greater cross sections and individual segmented sections. I know a lot about that product as I served as the President of the Division for several years until the parent sold the business. In our case the product served a specific niche market on equipment used in aggressive environments. We did a lot of testing and strictly limited the speed that the tire could be used as you build up heat pretty quickly when the rubber is flexing. I'm sure that Michelin has done even more testing since their tire is intended for highway use. We did experience issues with rocks and debris getting into the open air pockets. While I realize that our product and this tire are for very different applications the failure modes might be very similar. The concept was copied by other manufactures eventually and costs became an issue as competitors found ways to make similar tires and we did not change our design. (Much more to that story). It was a good experience for me personally and I learned a lot about the dynamics and chemistry that goes into the design of rubber products. Bill Dentinger and Bob Kramer may remember our tires that were used on Skid-Steers and Variable Reach lift trucks. We were an OE option for several years on Case, New Holland, John Deere and BobCat equipment. JVV ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 2:15 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire > In a message dated 03/08/2010 12:32:42 PM Central Standard Time, > kaskas at cox.net writes: > > >> How about snow and ice build up in freezing weather..talk about an out of >> balance condition..... whoopee. >> > > A couple of years ago someone sent me info on these, and I took it to my > racing partner Bob Wismer, who was quite familiar with them. They are not > a > particularly new concept, and Kas is right that snow, ice, mud, debris are > all prime issues that have prevented them from going further with them at > this > time. But consideration as an emergency spare strikes me as interesting. > > Bill Dentinger > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com From budscars at comcast.net Mon Mar 8 18:57:32 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 17:57:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire References: <2529f.7c36524e.38c6a6c9@aol.com>, Message-ID: Absolutely...That's the ticket...Just think..in 30 years those wheels will be Vintage!... Racer Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: "marty sukey" To: "FOT" Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 4:47 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire > If they came in 20" and chrome spinners I'd put them on the Spitty :) > > Marty > > _________________________________________________________________ > Your E-mail and More On-the-Go. Get Windows Live Hotmail Free. > http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469229/direct/01/ > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From dos_gusanos at msn.com Mon Mar 8 19:38:38 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 19:38:38 -0700 Subject: [Fot] FW: [Healeys] Amateur Sports Car Racing in the '60s In-Reply-To: <689461.48751.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <689461.48751.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Gotta watch this one....................Henry Morrison, Albuquerque > > This is just the best. A period half-hour video about amateur SCCA racing in > the 60s. Lots of big Healeys and Sprites. Great shots at the Glen before they > put up all the armco. http://vimeo.com/4139756 > > Rick > > > Follow My Nasty Boy Build: http://tinyurl.com/yj52fwo > _______________________________________________ From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Mon Mar 8 20:04:00 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Mon, 08 Mar 2010 22:04:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling Message-ID: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Hi guys, I just read that Stirling Moss was injured when he fell down an elevator shaft at his home. The doors evidently opened but there was a malfunction and the elevator car wasn't there. He then somehow fell down the shaft. The article said that he had surgery on his ankles and was banged up but did not have life threatening injuries. It said he fell 30 feet. Wow. I used to see him at the CanAm races where he was the J Wax spokesman. Got lots of free wax for the car. There was the time when Oscar's wife and Jack's wife took an empty J Wax can, cleaned it out, filled it with butterscotch pudding ( which looked about like the wax) and approached Stirling. One of them stuck her finger into the can, swirled it around, and after asking Moss how many calories were in it, plopped it into her mouth! Moss's eyes about came out of his head! Great moment. Hope he does OK. Bill From dlhogye at comcast.net Mon Mar 8 20:54:12 2010 From: dlhogye at comcast.net (davehogye) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 03:54:12 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Fuel cell size Message-ID: <1500220419.1684221268106852436.JavaMail.root@sz0047a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Hello friends, I'm in the market for a fuel cell for my TR3 race car. What is the typical gallon size used for TRs. I've seen a few cars with 8 gallon tanks and a couple with 10 and 12. ATL makes a cell called the "Well Cell" that is 22"dia. and would fit nicely in the spare tire compartment. They have an 8 and 12 gallon size. Both are 22"dia. but the 8 gallon is only 6" tall and I think it will fit without cutting the trunk floor out. The 12 gallon is 9" tall which is more typical. I'll still have to cut the floor for the fill plate with the 8 gallon, but I think it will look pretty "sano". Any thoughts on the subject would be appreciated. Thanks, Dave H. From timmurph at fastbytes.com Mon Mar 8 21:05:34 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 22:05:34 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance Message-ID: <000f01cabf3d$c607a320$5216e960$@com> Thanks again for the replies. I loosened the center main block and "bumped" the crank back and forth to center the block, as suggested. Then retorqued it and checked for clearance and endplay. I still couldn't get much endplay trying to pry the crank front and back so I "wedged" it front and back using a big "tanker" screwdriver as the wedge between the center bearing block and the crank. That worked and I got .004 on the dial indicator and .005 with feeler gauges for clearance. Apparently it takes a bit of force to move the crank back and forward but I'm sure the clutch pushes even harder than my gently tapping the wedge in to move it. At least my measurements now make some sense. Still learning! Tim From kaskas at cox.net Mon Mar 8 21:07:37 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 20:07:37 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <20100308230737.67KIT.437808.imail@fed1rmwml46> I first met Sir Sterling at the old Riverside motel, the Caravan. He was just finished registering and I was just starting and we struck up a conversation, he spent twenty minutes with me just talking about British cars and was so charming, I could hardly believe it. He was driving an Aston Marti and was in a big slide into turn 8 with the brake lights on and in complete control ( or I thought so ) great driver. I hope he sees another twenty years, nice man and a great driver. ---- WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: ============= Hi guys, I just read that Stirling Moss was injured when he fell down an elevator shaft at his home. The doors evidently opened but there was a malfunction and the elevator car wasn't there. He then somehow fell down the shaft. The article said that he had surgery on his ankles and was banged up but did not have life threatening injuries. It said he fell 30 feet. Wow. I used to see him at the CanAm races where he was the J Wax spokesman. Got lots of free wax for the car. There was the time when Oscar's wife and Jack's wife took an empty J Wax can, cleaned it out, filled it with butterscotch pudding ( which looked about like the wax) and approached Stirling. One of them stuck her finger into the can, swirled it around, and after asking Moss how many calories were in it, plopped it into her mouth! Moss's eyes about came out of his head! Great moment. Hope he does OK. Bill _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From timmurph at fastbytes.com Mon Mar 8 21:36:55 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2010 22:36:55 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder In-Reply-To: <4B958EC4.8070606@twcny.rr.com> References: <4B958EC4.8070606@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <001901cabf42$265175e0$72f461a0$@com> Nice job! We have a similar scatter shield that came with the car but it's out of 5/16 plate! By the damage to the "doghouse" (the sheet metal was literally ripped apart) they blew a clutch big time once and made darn sure they wouldn't get hurt if it happened again. Ours isn't as slick as yours in that the plate isn't compound curved like yours. Ours is only used as a race car so the cockpit is pretty bare. The compound curve would tend to keep the "shrapnel" better contained I'd think. We do sort of like having that chunk of metal down by our feet though. Tim 1961 TR4 #317 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark Eginton Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 5:57 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder I was in Lowes and saw some 1/8" steel stock perfect for a scatter shield 3" wide so here is how I spent my weekend: http://www.flickr.com/photos/28599565 at N04 Think it will do the job or is there something I need to consider adding or changing. I plan to run my dad's lightened flywheel which visually has seen a lathe back in the '60s. I had it magnifluxed and it is fine but I still feel the need for a shield - I like being ambulatory... The idea is to keep the car the way he raced it - drive it to the track, pull the windshield and passenger seat - add a plexiglas deflection shield and go have fun. So, I wanted it to hide under the carpet. Thanks, M \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From tony at tonydrews.com Tue Mar 9 00:12:56 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 01:12:56 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Fuel cell size In-Reply-To: <1500220419.1684221268106852436.JavaMail.root@sz0047a.emery ville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <1500220419.1684221268106852436.JavaMail.root@sz0047a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <20100309071334.11AF318763F@autox.team.net> We couldn't go an hour without refueling with a 7 or 8 gallon fuel cell (can't remember which - it would start to run out at 45 minutes), so I went with a 12 gallon in my car so I could run an enduro without needing to refuel in the middle. - Tony Drews At 09:54 PM 3/8/2010, davehogye wrote: >Hello friends, >I'm in the market for a fuel cell for my TR3 race car. What is the >typical gallon size used for TRs. I've seen a few cars with 8 gallon >tanks and a couple with 10 and 12. ATL makes a cell called the "Well >Cell" that is 22"dia. and would fit nicely in the spare tire >compartment. They have an 8 and 12 gallon size. Both are 22"dia. but >the 8 gallon is only 6" tall and I think it will fit without cutting >the trunk floor out. The 12 gallon is 9" tall which is more typical. >I'll still have to cut the floor for the fill plate with the 8 >gallon, but I think it will look pretty "sano". Any thoughts on the >subject would be appreciated. >Thanks, >Dave H. >\ >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tony at tonydrews.com From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 9 01:28:36 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 09:28:36 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com> Sorry to hear this. I see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes race cars or Jag D-Types. I never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Mar 9 07:40:56 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 09:40:56 EST Subject: [Fot] Michelin's new spoked tire Message-ID: In a message dated 03/08/2010 7:01:39 PM Central Standard Time, jerryvv at roadrunner.com writes: > Bill Dentinger and Bob Kramer may remember our tires that were used on > Skid-Steers and Variable Reach lift trucks. We were an OE option for > several > years on Case, New Holland, John Deere and BobCat equipment. > These days I have trouble remembering why I am chasing Shirley, but I think I remember those tires. Did they look like a tightly wound Rolodex? Bill Dentinger From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 07:42:14 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 09:42:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com> Message-ID: <8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand Prix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Sorry to hear this. see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes ace cars or Jag D-Types. never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From fasttrs at yahoo.com Tue Mar 9 08:05:46 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 07:05:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling carbon fiber TS Message-ID: <93598.70970.qm@web46103.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Carbon Fiber toilet seat?!!! Now THAT sounds like a good new project for ARE! Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 9, 2010, at 8:42 AM, n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand Prix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Sorry to hear this. see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes ace cars or Jag D-Types. never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 9 08:17:22 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 16:17:22 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com> <8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> What the hell is a = Bath???? Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] Gesendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 An: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand Prix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Sorry to hear this. I see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes race cars or Jag D-Types. I never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Mar 9 08:21:21 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 10:21:21 EST Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling Message-ID: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> In a message dated 03/08/2010 10:33:03 PM Central Standard Time, kaskas at cox.net writes: > I first met Sir Sterling at the old Riverside motel, the Caravan. He was > just finished registering and I was just starting and we struck up a > conversation, he spent twenty minutes with me just talking about British cars > and was so charming, I could hardly believe it. He was driving an Aston > Marti and was in a big slide into turn 8 with the brake lights on and in > complete control ( or I thought so ) great driver. I hope he sees another twenty > years, nice man and a great driver. > Kas... The chance that I might end up in the same race as Sir Sterling Moss borders on unthinkable, but in fact I've raced in the same race sessions with him at two events at ROAD AMERICA and one at BLACKHAWK FARMS (of all places). Ray Irwin hired him as the Grand Marshall of the first Blackhawk Vintage Classic. I stood next to him at several Driver's Meetings, where he was very accessible, and made you feel like...hey! We're all racers together here. 'Charming' is a good choice of words. He had clear concerns about the equipment and talent disparity in vintage racing, and how it should be dealt with. In particular he did not like seeing cars with slicks on the track at the same time as cars with treaded tires. But what I remember best is a Chicago Historic Races event at ROAD AMERICA when there was an ASTON MARTIN/FERRARI CHALLENGE. ASTON MARTIN and FERRARI both sent a gaggle of their museum pieces over here along with world class drivers (including Sir Sterling, who I think drove the DB2). I was in my TR3. I can't remember how many times he lapped me, but I sure remember how it happened each time. My car would be at top speed. I'd see this little green dot in my rear view mirror. I'd get ready. There is always a lot of me hanging out of my TR3, and I'd point my desire to be passed driver's left. In the blink of an eye he'd go by in a flash like I was standing still. The first time I was tempted to get out to see if perhaps I'd stopped. But after the pass there was always a big wave from Sir Sterling. He was a Class Act and very sensitive to us amateur vintage racers. That was a very big deal for me, and a fond memory. Bill Dentinger From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 08:21:18 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 10:21:18 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling carbon fiber TS In-Reply-To: <93598.70970.qm@web46103.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <93598.70970.qm@web46103.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CC8DB34D1771F8-611C-D630@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> There was a time when speed was an issue in the Water Closet. Mayo Clinic took care of that. Bill Babcock has one in his 'Aluminum Overcast' trailer...I think his is just a weight issue, tho. -----Original Message----- From: Mike Munson To: n197tr4 at cs.com Cc: tr4racing at googlemail.com ; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:05 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling carbon fiber TS Carbon Fiber toilet seat?!!! Now THAT sounds like a good new project for ARE! ike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 9, 2010, at 8:42 AM, n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk arms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv Uncle Jack. Joe ----Original Message----- rom: MadMarx o: fot at autox.team.net ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling orry to hear this. ee him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes ce cars or Jag D-Types. ever spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) hris ______________________________________________ t at autox.team.net nate: http://www.team.net/donate.html chive: http://www.team.net/archive rums: http://www.team.net/forums subscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 08:31:42 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 10:31:42 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com><8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> Message-ID: <8CC8DB4C0BC7F58-611C-D965@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling What the hell is a = Bath???? Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe ----Original Message----- rom: MadMarx o: fot at autox.team.net ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling orry to hear this. see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes ace cars or Jag D-Types. never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com ______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From billb at bnj.com Tue Mar 9 08:46:03 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 05:46:03 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> References: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> Message-ID: <0030A02D-E280-4D0E-884A-21C17ABA296F@bnj.com> You guys sound like you're doing an eulogy. Sir Stirling is a tough old bird. Reminds me of a Monty Python line: "I'm not dead yet". I've also had the pleasure of meeting him and his charming wife Suzy a few times. I hope to meet him again soon. From billb at bnj.com Tue Mar 9 08:53:57 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 05:53:57 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <0030A02D-E280-4D0E-884A-21C17ABA296F@bnj.com> References: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> <0030A02D-E280-4D0E-884A-21C17ABA296F@bnj.com> Message-ID: <5CCE3761-86B1-4CAE-9585-B47FA743117C@bnj.com> That's odd, the last part got lopped off. It said: Oh, and the reason for the Carbon Fibre seat of ease in Nero is simple--Carbon Fiber makes you go faster. On Mar 9, 2010, at 5:46 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: > You guys sound like you're doing an eulogy. Sir Stirling is a tough old bird. > Reminds me of a Monty Python line: "I'm not dead yet". > > I've also had the pleasure of meeting him and his charming wife Suzy a few > times. I hope to meet him again soon. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From kaskas at cox.net Tue Mar 9 09:43:41 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 8:43:41 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder In-Reply-To: <4B958EC4.8070606@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <20100309114341.HSXYP.382893.imail@fed1rmwml43> That method works okay, I have used it in the past and also using heavy belting. three inches isn't very wide but two pieces welded side to side should be great. History of blows up in that area showed me that it was the clutch that went away first and sometimes takes the flywheel with it. ---- Mark Eginton wrote: ============= I was in Lowes and saw some 1/8" steel stock perfect for a scatter shield 3" wide so here is how I spent my weekend: http://www.flickr.com/photos/28599565 at N04 Think it will do the job or is there something I need to consider adding or changing. I plan to run my dad's lightened flywheel which visually has seen a lathe back in the '60s. I had it magnifluxed and it is fine but I still feel the need for a shield - I like being ambulatory... The idea is to keep the car the way he raced it - drive it to the track, pull the windshield and passenger seat - add a plexiglas deflection shield and go have fun. So, I wanted it to hide under the carpet. Thanks, M _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Tue Mar 9 09:44:00 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 11:44:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com><8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> <8CC8DB4C0BC7F58-611C-D965@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Not to mention crapper, maned after the intrepid British guy who invented it. I read somewhere that he is now Sir Crapper. I'd type more but I have to use the can. The head for you sailers. Gotta go. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 10:31 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > > > What the hell is a = Bath???? > Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] > esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 > n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net > etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand > rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at > lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat > upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. > Joe > ----Original Message----- > rom: MadMarx > o: fot at autox.team.net > ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am > ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > orry to hear this. > see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes > ace cars or Jag D-Types. > never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) > Chris > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 09:47:11 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 11:47:11 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <8CC8DBF4C82B0F7-67A0-15A5@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> You dont have to get ANAL about this. -----Original Message----- From: WILLIAM TOBIN To: n197tr4 at cs.com; tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 10:44 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Not to mention crapper, maned after the intrepid British guy who invented t. I read somewhere that he is now Sir Crapper. I'd type more but I have to use the can. The head for you sailers. Gotta go. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 10:31 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > > > What the hell is a = Bath???? > Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] > esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 > n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net > etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba rand > rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at > lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat > upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. > Joe > ----Original Message----- > rom: MadMarx > o: fot at autox.team.net > ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am > ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > orry to hear this. > see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes > ace cars or Jag D-Types. > never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) > Chris > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: ttp://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From n197tr4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 09:58:26 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 11:58:26 -0500 Subject: [Fot] HEARTLAND VINTAGE GRAND PRIX RAMADA / HOLIDAY INN / HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS Message-ID: <8CC8DC0DEA50812-67A0-1938@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> FOT, Entries are coming in for the KASTNER CUP......The host hotel is the Ramada Inn and rooms have been set aside for this event...just mention it in your reservation. The Holiday Inn and Holiday Inn Express are alternatives and are properties owned by the same corporation. Thanks! Joe A From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 9 10:09:48 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 18:09:48 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <20100309113831.2GC8Y.382799.imail@fed1rmwml43> References: <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> <20100309113831.2GC8Y.382799.imail@fed1rmwml43> Message-ID: <003901cabfab$54303a00$fc90ae00$@com> Seems that I have a lack of knowledge about house equipment in US language. -----UrsprC wrote: ============= What the hell is a = Bath???? Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] Gesendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 An: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand Prix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at Blackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat supplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. Joe -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Sorry to hear this. I see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes race cars or Jag D-Types. I never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) Chris _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Tue Mar 9 10:22:57 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 12:22:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling References: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <8CC8DBF4C82B0F7-67A0-15A5@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <010d01cabfad$299357d0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Good one Joe!----- Original Message ----- From: n197tr4 at cs.com To: william.tobin3 at verizon.net ; tr4racing at googlemail.com ; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 11:47 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling You dont have to get ANAL about this. -----Original Message----- From: WILLIAM TOBIN To: n197tr4 at cs.com; tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 10:44 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Not to mention crapper, maned after the intrepid British guy who invented it. I read somewhere that he is now Sir Crapper. I'd type more but I have to use the can. The head for you sailers. Gotta go. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 10:31 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > > > What the hell is a = Bath???? > Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] > esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 > n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net > etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand > rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at > lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat > upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. > Joe > ----Original Message----- > rom: MadMarx > o: fot at autox.team.net > ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am > ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > orry to hear this. > see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes > ace cars or Jag D-Types. > never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) > Chris > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From emanteno at gmail.com Tue Mar 9 10:24:12 2010 From: emanteno at gmail.com (Irv Korey) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 11:24:12 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> References: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> Message-ID: <354a1781003090924k7cd879b1j6736167b10b3295b@mail.gmail.com> On Tue, Mar 9, 2010 at 9:21 AM, wrote: But what I remember best is a Chicago Historic Races event at ROAD AMERICA > when there was an ASTON MARTIN/FERRARI CHALLENGE. ASTON MARTIN and FERRARI both sent a > gaggle of their museum > pieces over here along with world class drivers (including Sir Sterling, > who I > think drove the DB2). I was in my TR3. I can't remember how many times he > lapped me, but I sure remember how it happened each time. My car would be > at > top speed. I'd see this little green dot in my rear view mirror. I'd get > ready. There is always a lot of me hanging out of my TR3, and I'd point my > desire to be passed driver's left. In the blink of an eye he'd go by in a > flash like I was standing still. The first time I was tempted to get out > to > see if perhaps I'd stopped. But after the pass there was always a big wave > from Sir Sterling. He was a Class Act and very sensitive to us amateur > vintage racers. That was a very big deal for me, and a fond memory. > That very race was my first as a corner worker. I remember that Aston very well from my vantage point at Corner 1 (back when we flagged from drivers' right in Corner 1). Every time he went by, he waved and smiled to the workers. What a wonderful memory. Irv From budscars at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 10:48:59 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 09:48:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling References: <117f2.5d989e5e.38c7c171@aol.com> <0030A02D-E280-4D0E-884A-21C17ABA296F@bnj.com> Message-ID: Mark Twain.....Wrote an article in the Territorial Enterprise, Virginia city, NV..."The Reports Of My Death Have Been Greatly Exaggerated" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 7:46 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > You guys sound like you're doing an eulogy. Sir Stirling is a tough old > bird. > Reminds me of a Monty Python line: "I'm not dead yet". > > I've also had the pleasure of meeting him and his charming wife Suzy a few > times. I hope to meet him again soon. > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 11:15:41 2010 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (toodamnfunky at comcast.net) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 18:15:41 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] HEARTLAND VINTAGE GRAND PRIX RAMADA / HOLIDAY INN / HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS In-Reply-To: <8CC8DC0DEA50812-67A0-1938@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <1115235081.2153891268158541675.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Joe, The Cup date is in direct conflict with an SCCA date in Colorado. Depending on where I'm at in the points will determine whether I can attend. I won't know until August. Will there be any problems with a late entry ? Thanks, Jim G. ----- Original Message ----- From: n197tr4 at cs.com To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2010 9:58:26 AM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain Subject: [Fot] HEARTLAND VINTAGE GRAND PRIX RAMADA / HOLIDAY INN / HOLIDAY INN EXPRESS FOT, Entries are coming in for the KASTNER CUP......The host hotel is the Ramada Inn and rooms have been set aside for this event...just mention it in your reservation. The Holiday Inn and Holiday Inn Express are alternatives and are properties owned by the same corporation. Thanks! B Joe A \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/toodamnfunky at comcast.net From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Mar 9 11:32:04 2010 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 13:32:04 EST Subject: [Fot] HEARTLAND VINTAGE GRAND PRIX Message-ID: <206c5.4206a68c.38c7ee24@cs.com> Jim, There is no penalty for late entries for the FOT. Probably no one else, either. Early Entries would be appreciated, so we have a sense of where we are at. Indications are that this will be strongly attended by the FOT....all things considered, it is not a huge surprise. And we will be VERY WELL RECEIVED. Perhaps entries can be refunded fully intact. I will check on the policy regarding this. This is a first time event and should be VERY user friendly. Hope you can make it, but wish you well in SCCA points. Joe A > Joe, > The Cup date is in direct conflict with an SCCA date in Colorado. > Depending on where > I'm at in the points will determine whether I can attend. I won't know > until August. > Will there be any problems with a late entry ? > Thanks, > Jim G. > > From dlhogye at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 11:33:41 2010 From: dlhogye at comcast.net (davehogye) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 18:33:41 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Fuel cell info, Thanks Message-ID: <1628173668.1894981268159621482.JavaMail.root@sz0047a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Thanks guys for the information, photos and suggestions about fuel cells. The choice was kind of split down middle regarding size, but I don't think that I'd regret having more capacity available. Dave H. From wensley_tr at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 11:45:52 2010 From: wensley_tr at comcast.net (Craig) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 13:45:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling In-Reply-To: <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <008301cabf35$2e364180$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><000001cabf62$84df3000$8e9d9000$@com><8CC8DADD748A398-611C-C9D2@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> <004101cabf9b$9fa5f4d0$def1de70$@com> <8CC8DB4C0BC7F58-611C-D965@webmail-m045.sysops.aol.com> <00eb01cabfa7$b8ec0680$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <002001cabfb8$bed29580$3c77c080$@net> Don't forget pit stop Craig -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of WILLIAM TOBIN Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 11:44 AM To: n197tr4 at cs.com; tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling Not to mention crapper, maned after the intrepid British guy who invented it. I read somewhere that he is now Sir Crapper. I'd type more but I have to use the can. The head for you sailers. Gotta go. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 10:31 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > Common US term for Water Closet.....Toilet....Shitter > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 9:17 am > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > > > What the hell is a = Bath???? > Von: n197tr4 at cs.com [mailto:n197tr4 at cs.com] > esendet: Dienstag, 9. Mdrz 2010 15:42 > n: tr4racing at googlemail.com; fot at autox.team.net > etreff: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > I have an autographed poster of Stirling driving the Birdcage at Cuba Grand > rix. It is in our 1/2 Bath, right across the poster of Irv Korey at > lackhawk Farms. The bathroom also features a carbon fibre toilet seat > upplied by Irv & Uncle Jack. > Joe > ----Original Message----- > rom: MadMarx > o: fot at autox.team.net > ent: Tue, Mar 9, 2010 2:28 am > ubject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling > orry to hear this. > see him occasionally at Spa or Nurburgring when he drives the Mercedes > ace cars or Jag D-Types. > never spoke to him....me is too shy for that. ;-) > Chris > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > > ______________________________________________ > ot at autox.team.net > onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > rchive: http://www.team.net/archive > orums: http://www.team.net/forums > nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/wensley_tr at comcast.net From lang at isis.mit.edu Tue Mar 9 11:45:50 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 13:45:50 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Message from Sir Stirling (fwd) Message-ID: hey. Supposedly from Sir Stirling himself... BTW, neat web site (motorsportcollector.com) with kool stuff. NFI, of course. rml ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 12:20:31 -0500 (EST) From: The Motorsport Collector To: blang at mit.edu Subject: Message from Sir Stirling ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ March 9, 2010 Update: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Dear Robert, As most of you know, 80 year old Sir Stirling Moss stepped into an empty elevator shaft in his London home over the weekend, falling 3 stories, suffering broken bones in his feet and ankles and damaged vertebra. The good news is that Stirling's injuries are not life threatening and that his heart and mind (as well as his typing fingers) are as strong as ever. Stirling sent this email message to his many friends and fans around the world: ======================== TO ALL MY FRIENDS (AND ALL THOSE WHO ARE KIND ENOUGH TO CARE), DEAR ALL OF YOU, THE LAST FEW DAYS HAVE BEEN QUITE FANTASTIC AND I'D LIKE TO THANK EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU FOR YOUR KIND THOUGHTS, MESSAGES AND OTHER PARAPHERNALIA. ON SATURDAY EVENING, I WAS AT HOME WITH SUSIE, ELLIOT AND HELEN AND ABOUT TO LEAVE FOR A CURRY, FOR WHICH WE WERE RUNNING LATE. I ASKED HELEN TO JOIN ME IN THE LIFT TO GO DOWNSTAIRS, BECAUSE SUSIE AND ELLIOT WERE SMART ENOUGH NOT TO RIDE IN MY LIFT. I OPENED THE DOOR AND STEPPED INTO THE LIFT, WITH HELEN READY TO FOLLOW ME, WHICH SHE NEVER DID. THAT IS BECAUSE THE LIFT HAD STOPPED ON THE FLOOR ABOVE AND INCORRECTLY ALLOWED THE DOOR BENEATH IT TO OPEN. STILL CHATTING TO HELEN, I STEPPED INTO THE OPEN DOORWAY-- AND FELL TO THE BOTTOM OF THE LIFT SHAFT. THE AMBULANCE WAS CALLED AND ARRIVED AT RACING SPEED, WHEREUPON THEY PUT ME ONTO A SERIES OF ABOUT 10 STRETCHERS! HAVING FINALLY SETTLED ON WHAT MUST HAVE SEEMED A GOOD ONE, I WAS TAKEN, ALONG WITH MY FAMILY TO THE ROYAL LONDON HOSPITAL IN WHITECHAPEL, WHERE THEY USED ANOTHER BATCH OF SIMILAR STRETCHERS! THEY DID A GOOD JOB OF HELPING ME, BUT WERE UNABLE TO DO THE REQUISITE SURGERY. SO, ON THE SUNDAY, I WAS MOVED TO THE PRINCESS GRACE, WHERE A FANTASTICALLY EFFICIENT, KIND AND AMUSING STAFF DID ALL THE JOBS. I AM NOW IN A LOVELY ROOM, NUMBER 222, AND WITH THE HELP OF ELLIOT AND THE PORTER, AM FINALLY ON THE EMAIL. THAT DOES NOT MEAN THAT I WILL BE ABLE TO ACTUALLY SEND THIS TO YOU, BUT I WILL TRY! NOW FOR THE FUTURE... WHICH I CAN SEE WITH SUSIE, HELEN AND ELLIOT AROUND ME, IS GOING TO BE A BLOODY STRUGGLE! AS SOME OF YOU MAY KNOW, SUSIE AND I ARE BOOKED ON A SEABOURN CRUISE FOR OUR 30TH ANNIVERSARY, NEXT MONTH. I HAVE TO CROSS THE HURDLE OF GETTING THE DOCORS, AND FAMLY HANGERS-ON, TO ALLOW ME TO THIN MY BLOOD, IN ORDER TO AVOID ANY ISSUES INVOLVING DEEP VEIN THROMBOSIS. IT WILL BE SIX TO EIGHT WEEKS FROM SUNDAY BEFORE I WILL ABLE TO PUT ANY LOAD ON MY FEET. THEREFORE I'M FACING MY SIXTH OR SEVENTH REDUCTION TO A WHEELCHAIR (SUSIE SAYS SHE'S STOPPED COUNTING) WHICH I MUST ADMIT, IS RATHER BORING. THE GOOD NEWS IS; THAT I DIDN'T SELL THE WHEELCHAIR AFTER THE LAST SHUNT! THE WHOLE THING IS A REAL PAIN IN THE ARSE, IF I HAD LOOKED WHERE I WAS GOING, I WOULDN'T BE HERE AT ALL, SO IT'S MY OWN DAMN FAULT. I HAVE BEEN ABSOLUTELY OVERWHELMED BY YOUR COLLECTIVE CONCERN AND KINDNESS. I CAN TELL YOU THAT CURRENTLY I'M LYING IN HOSPITAL, TAKING DEEP BREATHS, LIFTING ONE ARM WITH THE OTHER, RAISING MY LEGS (WITH PLASTERS ON THE END) AND DOING ALL I CAN DO TO KEEP MYSELF AS MOBILE AS POSSIBLE, BUT, HAVING SAID THAT, I'M NOT YET WINNING THE BATTLE. I'M NOT SURE WHEN I'LL BE ABLE TO GO HOME BUT THE LIFT HAS TO WORK, OTHERWISE I'LL NEVER BE ABLE TO GET UPSTAIRS IN MY WHEELCHAIR, MAYBE I'LL GO AND STAY WITH HELEN AND ELLIOT FOR A WHILE... THIS REALLY HAS OPENED MY EYES TO HOW KIND ALL MY FRIENDS ARE, OVER AN OLD EX- RACING DRIVER, FLOGGING A FADING IMAGE! I LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOU SOON, MANY THANKS FOR ALL OF YOUR THOUGHTS, CIAO From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Tue Mar 9 16:02:40 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2010 18:02:40 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Scattershield - playdate with a welder In-Reply-To: <20100309114341.HSXYP.382893.imail@fed1rmwml43> References: <20100309114341.HSXYP.382893.imail@fed1rmwml43> Message-ID: <4B96D390.6090206@twcny.rr.com> Do I need to go a full 6" wide. I need more stock so narrower is easier to work with but no sense in scrimping if its necessary. Thanks! M Kas Kastner wrote: > That method works okay, I have used it in the past and also using heavy belting. three inches isn't very wide but two pieces welded side to side should be great. History of blows up in that area showed me that it was the clutch that went away first and sometimes takes the flywheel with it. > ---- Mark Eginton wrote: > > ============= > I was in Lowes and saw some 1/8" steel stock perfect for a scatter > shield 3" wide so here is how I spent my weekend: > > http://www.flickr.com/photos/28599565 at N04 > > Think it will do the job or is there something I need to consider adding > or changing. I plan to run my dad's lightened flywheel which visually > has seen a lathe back in the '60s. I had it magnifluxed and it is fine > but I still feel the need for a shield - I like being ambulatory... > > The idea is to keep the car the way he raced it - drive it to the track, > pull the windshield and passenger seat - add a plexiglas deflection > shield and go have fun. So, I wanted it to hide under the carpet. > > Thanks, > > M > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net > > > > -- > Never be beaten by equipment From mdhado at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 18:39:00 2010 From: mdhado at comcast.net (M&M Hado) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 19:39:00 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance In-Reply-To: <000f01cabf3d$c607a320$5216e960$@com> Message-ID: Hi Tim, Just some more food for thought. No, it should NOT take a lot of force at all to move the crank fore & aft. I'm doing my 3B now and also a TR4 for a friend at the same time and I can push the crank with my fingers alone on one of the crank webs. Do you have the front & rear bearing caps on as well? It sounds to me like your bearing bores are no longer lined up and the crank journals are binding a bit in the bearings. If this is the case with yours, a simple line bore at a machine shop will do wonders. What they do is take off a few thousands of an inch off the bearing cap split lines which lowers them by that much (and makes then slightly egg-shape), and then "line bore" through all three caps at the same time with a long hone back to the original diameter. They are now concentric. This is before putting in the liners, of course. I think I paid about $125 the last time I had it done. Think about the crank sitting in the bearings with .002" clearance or so and, if you really have a straight line, the crank will move VERY easily because of that clearance. It should not bind at all. Also, I agree wholeheartedly about bumping the crank back and forth to "set" the center cap to where the upper and lower halves of the thrust washer are in the same plane. The last bump should be forward, which is the normal direction of thrust. The rear thrust ring is the one that does all of the work when you push on the clutch. Good luck! Mike Hado -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Tim Murphy Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 10:06 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Cc: rpm724 at att.net; ryan.murphy at fdlco.wi.gov Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance Thanks again for the replies. I loosened the center main block and "bumped" the crank back and forth to center the block, as suggested. Then retorqued it and checked for clearance and endplay. I still couldn't get much endplay trying to pry the crank front and back so I "wedged" it front and back using a big "tanker" screwdriver as the wedge between the center bearing block and the crank. That worked and I got .004 on the dial indicator and .005 with feeler gauges for clearance. Apparently it takes a bit of force to move the crank back and forward but I'm sure the clutch pushes even harder than my gently tapping the wedge in to move it. At least my measurements now make some sense. Still learning! Tim \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mdhado at comcast.net From timmurph at fastbytes.com Tue Mar 9 20:15:56 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 21:15:56 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance In-Reply-To: References: <000f01cabf3d$c607a320$5216e960$@com> Message-ID: <002301cac000$009fdc10$01df9430$@com> Good point about pushing it forward in the same direction as the clutch force. When I first did the fore/aft bit to look for end play I just had the center bearing in. The second time I had the center and front bearing in. Even with all 3 mains installed and the rods not yet connected the crank rotated VERY (sorry for the caps, my underline doesn't work on a reply) freely, so I don't think there is any binding in the bearings. Not sure what is going on. I'm pretty sure it will run okay as the new thrust bearings are the same thickness within less than a half thou of the old ones and they worked okay. And the last two times I installed the crank I didn't "center" the center bearing block as I did upon the suggestions this time. Must have gotten lucky! Tim -----Original Message----- From: M&M Hado [mailto:mdhado at comcast.net] Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2010 7:39 PM To: Tim Murphy Cc: rpm724 at att.net; ryan.murphy at fdlco.wi.gov; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance Hi Tim, Just some more food for thought. No, it should NOT take a lot of force at all to move the crank fore & aft. I'm doing my 3B now and also a TR4 for a friend at the same time and I can push the crank with my fingers alone on one of the crank webs. Do you have the front & rear bearing caps on as well? It sounds to me like your bearing bores are no longer lined up and the crank journals are binding a bit in the bearings. If this is the case with yours, a simple line bore at a machine shop will do wonders. What they do is take off a few thousands of an inch off the bearing cap split lines which lowers them by that much (and makes then slightly egg-shape), and then "line bore" through all three caps at the same time with a long hone back to the original diameter. They are now concentric. This is before putting in the liners, of course. I think I paid about $125 the last time I had it done. Think about the crank sitting in the bearings with .002" clearance or so and, if you really have a straight line, the crank will move VERY easily because of that clearance. It should not bind at all. Also, I agree wholeheartedly about bumping the crank back and forth to "set" the center cap to where the upper and lower halves of the thrust washer are in the same plane. The last bump should be forward, which is the normal direction of thrust. The rear thrust ring is the one that does all of the work when you push on the clutch. Good luck! Mike Hado -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Tim Murphy Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 10:06 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Cc: rpm724 at att.net; ryan.murphy at fdlco.wi.gov Subject: [Fot] TR4 crank endplay/thrust clearance Thanks again for the replies. I loosened the center main block and "bumped" the crank back and forth to center the block, as suggested. Then retorqued it and checked for clearance and endplay. I still couldn't get much endplay trying to pry the crank front and back so I "wedged" it front and back using a big "tanker" screwdriver as the wedge between the center bearing block and the crank. That worked and I got .004 on the dial indicator and .005 with feeler gauges for clearance. Apparently it takes a bit of force to move the crank back and forward but I'm sure the clutch pushes even harder than my gently tapping the wedge in to move it. At least my measurements now make some sense. Still learning! Tim \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mdhado at comcast.net From mpendy at dishmail.net Tue Mar 9 20:28:26 2010 From: mpendy at dishmail.net (Mark Pendergrass) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 19:28:26 -0800 Subject: [Fot] webers-manifold Message-ID: FoTer's, had enough horseing around with these hogged-out SU's, looking to see if i find a set of webers and intake for the tr4 . For a race motor, can a guy get the 40's to work well or do i need to step up to the ? Any input would be helpful.....Thanks.....Mark P From rjohns at woh.rr.com Tue Mar 9 21:17:25 2010 From: rjohns at woh.rr.com (Robert Johns) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 23:17:25 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling ( Bob Johns) Message-ID: I enjoyed all the old stories about all of your memories of seeing and meeting Stirling, so I might as well tell my story. In 1955, I had some time to run up to the Nurburgring to get in a few practice laps. When I got there, some factory had the course engaged for practice. I don't remember what team. That isn't important. I was walking around the pit lane and ran into Stirling, also, just standing around at the moment. We talked, and after a bit, he said, "Let's go get a cup of coffee." So, we went across the course to the hotel cafe and sat and enjoyed a cup together. He has always been that easy to access and talk to. This has always been one of my fondest memories of my time in Europe. Bob J From tr4racing at googlemail.com Wed Mar 10 01:28:13 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:28:13 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable chain wheels In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000701cac02b$a1189530$e349bf90$@com> Just a thought. (I hope I get this explained well) There were some worn out distributor drives in the past where the teeth on the cam gear has gone thin and broke after a while. Were on these cams adjustable chain wheels mounted with an aluminum center mounting plate? I saw one of these adjustable chain wheels with aluminum center plate that has worn out at the contact spot with the bearing housing. The cam started floating from that and this might damage the gears after a while. The chain wheel needs only a few races to wear out. There are adjustable chain wheels with steel center plate that should not cause this trouble. Might worth to check your wheels if they have some future trouble in store. Cheers Chris From yellow-green at sbcglobal.net Wed Mar 10 06:37:25 2010 From: yellow-green at sbcglobal.net (Dennis DeLap) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 05:37:25 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> Message-ID: <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Friends Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line system. This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid to the front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was eliminated. Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. Thanks Dennis From tr4racing at googlemail.com Wed Mar 10 06:47:47 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 14:47:47 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000b01cac058$46c4d440$d44e7cc0$@com> In combination with the rear brakes this restrictor valve takes car that the linings of the front brake don't move away from the rotors. You get less pedal travel with that valve installed. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Dennis DeLap Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 14:37 An: FOT Betreff: [Fot] Restrictor Valve Friends Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line system. This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid to the front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was eliminated. Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. Thanks Dennis \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From mlcooknj at msn.com Wed Mar 10 07:41:18 2010 From: mlcooknj at msn.com (michael cook) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:41:18 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sir Stirling ( Bob Johns) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I was fortunate to meet Moss at one of the Jaguar launch events he attended over here. It was particular fun to see him get into a car and immediately slam the seat back, giving him the room for his straight-arm driving style. He did this regardless of whether it was a brand-new XJ or a vintage Mark VII or S-type. But my favorite Moss story isn't about Stirling. At Nelson Ledges for the 24-hour back in the 1980s, driver Innes Ireland wandered the paddock wearing a T-shirt that said: "I TAUGHT STIRLING MOSS HOW TO DRIVE" The following year, Ireland had a new shirt saying: "I TAUGHT STIRLING MOSS HOW TO DRINK" But of course he didn't - Moss doesn't drink ... never has. Mike Cook > From: rjohns at woh.rr.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2010 23:17:25 -0500 > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sir Stirling ( Bob Johns) > > I enjoyed all the old stories about all of your memories of seeing and meeting > Stirling, so I might as well tell my story. In 1955, I had some time to run > up to the Nurburgring to get in a few practice laps. When I got there, some > factory had the course engaged for practice. I don't remember what team. > That isn't important. I was walking around the pit lane and ran into > Stirling, also, just standing around at the moment. We talked, and after a > bit, he said, "Let's go get a cup of coffee." So, we went across the course > to the hotel cafe and sat and enjoyed a cup together. He has always been that > easy to access and talk to. This has always been one of my fondest memories of > my time in Europe. > Bob J > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mlcooknj at msn.com From cwnfot at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 08:18:07 2010 From: cwnfot at gmail.com (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 10:18:07 -0500 Subject: [Fot] FW: Message from Sir Stirling Moss Message-ID: <006a01cac064$e520b8f0$af622ad0$@com> As most of you know, 80 year old Sir Stirling Moss stepped into an empty elevator shaft in his London home over the weekend, falling 3 stories, suffering broken bones in his feet and ankles and damaged vertebra. The good news is that Stirling's injuries are not life threatening and that his heart and mind (as well as his typing fingers) are as strong as ever. Stirling sent this email message to his many friends and fans around the world: ======================== TO ALL MY FRIENDS (AND ALL THOSE WHO ARE KIND ENOUGH TO CARE), DEAR ALL OF YOU, THE LAST FEW DAYS HAVE BEEN QUITE FANTASTIC AND I'D LIKE TO THANK EACH AND EVERY ONE OF YOU FOR YOUR KIND THOUGHTS, MESSAGES AND OTHER PARAPHERNALIA. ON SATURDAY EVENING, I WAS AT HOME WITH SUSIE, ELLIOT AND HELEN AND ABOUT TO LEAVE FOR A CURRY, FOR WHICH WE WERE RUNNING LATE. I ASKED HELEN TO JOIN ME IN THE LIFT TO GO DOWNSTAIRS, BECAUSE SUSIE AND ELLIOT WERE SMART ENOUGH NOT TO RIDE IN MY LIFT. I OPENED THE DOOR AND STEPPED INTO THE LIFT, WITH HELEN READY TO FOLLOW ME, WHICH SHE NEVER DID. THAT IS BECAUSE THE LIFT HAD STOPPED ON THE FLOOR ABOVE AND INCORRECTLY ALLOWED THE DOOR BENEATH IT TO OPEN. STILL CHATTING TO HELEN, I STEPPED INTO THE OPEN DOORWAY-- AND FELL TO THE BOTTOM OF THE LIFT SHAFT. THE AMBULANCE WAS CALLED AND ARRIVED AT RACING SPEED, WHEREUPON THEY PUT ME ONTO A SERIES OF ABOUT 10 STRETCHERS! HAVING FINALLY SETTLED ON WHAT MUST HAVE SEEMED A GOOD ONE, I WAS TAKEN, ALONG WITH MY FAMILY TO THE ROYAL LONDON HOSPITAL IN WHITECHAPEL, WHERE THEY USED ANOTHER BATCH OF SIMILAR STRETCHERS! THEY DID A GOOD JOB OF HELPING ME, BUT WERE UNABLE TO DO THE REQUISITE SURGERY. SO, ON THE SUNDAY, I WAS MOVED TO THE PRINCESS GRACE, WHERE A FANTASTICALLY EFFICIENT, KIND AND AMUSING STAFF DID ALL THE JOBS. I AM NOW IN A LOVELY ROOM, NUMBER 222, AND WITH THE HELP OF ELLIOT AND THE PORTER, AM FINALLY ON THE EMAIL. THAT DOES NOT MEAN THAT I WILL BE ABLE TO ACTUALLY SEND THIS TO YOU, BUT I WILL TRY! NOW FOR THE FUTURE... WHICH I CAN SEE WITH SUSIE, HELEN AND ELLIOT AROUND ME, IS GOING TO BE A BLOODY STRUGGLE! AS SOME OF YOU MAY KNOW, SUSIE AND I ARE BOOKED ON A SEABOURN CRUISE FOR OUR 30TH ANNIVERSARY, NEXT MONTH. I HAVE TO CROSS THE HURDLE OF GETTING THE DOCORS, AND FAMLY HANGERS-ON, TO ALLOW ME TO THIN MY BLOOD, IN ORDER TO AVOID ANY ISSUES INVOLVING DEEP VEIN THROMBOSIS. IT WILL BE SIX TO EIGHT WEEKS FROM SUNDAY BEFORE I WILL ABLE TO PUT ANY LOAD ON MY FEET. THEREFORE I'M FACING MY SIXTH OR SEVENTH REDUCTION TO A WHEELCHAIR (SUSIE SAYS SHE'S STOPPED COUNTING) WHICH I MUST ADMIT, IS RATHER BORING. THE GOOD NEWS IS; THAT I DIDN'T SELL THE WHEELCHAIR AFTER THE LAST SHUNT! THE WHOLE THING IS A REAL PAIN IN THE ARSE, IF I HAD LOOKED WHERE I WAS GOING, I WOULDN'T BE HERE AT ALL, SO IT'S MY OWN DAMN FAULT. I HAVE BEEN ABSOLUTELY OVERWHELMED BY YOUR COLLECTIVE CONCERN AND KINDNESS. I CAN TELL YOU THAT CURRENTLY I'M LYING IN HOSPITAL, TAKING DEEP BREATHS, LIFTING ONE ARM WITH THE OTHER, RAISING MY LEGS (WITH PLASTERS ON THE END) AND DOING ALL I CAN DO TO KEEP MYSELF AS MOBILE AS POSSIBLE, BUT, HAVING SAID THAT, I'M NOT YET WINNING THE BATTLE. I'M NOT SURE WHEN I'LL BE ABLE TO GO HOME BUT THE LIFT HAS TO WORK, OTHERWISE I'LL NEVER BE ABLE TO GET UPSTAIRS IN MY WHEELCHAIR, MAYBE I'LL GO AND STAY WITH HELEN AND ELLIOT FOR A WHILE... THIS REALLY HAS OPENED MY EYES TO HOW KIND ALL MY FRIENDS ARE, OVER AN OLD EX- RACING DRIVER, FLOGGING A FADING IMAGE! I LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOU SOON, MANY THANKS FOR ALL OF YOUR THOUGHTS, CIAO ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ This email came from Paul at the MotorSportCollector. email: pz at motorsportcollector.com phone: 630.515.1440 web: http://www.motorsportcollector.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From billb at bnj.com Wed Mar 10 08:38:16 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 05:38:16 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> It's a typical disk brake residual pressure valve that keeps a few pounds of pressure on the calipers to keep the pads from withdrawing too much. On Mar 10, 2010, at 3:37 AM, Dennis DeLap wrote: > Friends > > Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what > Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line system. > This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid to the > front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was eliminated. > Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. > > Thanks > Dennis > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Wed Mar 10 08:44:02 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 07:44:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <069f01cac068$82c9b770$0301a8c0@randall> > Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. It's more accurately called a residual pressure valve; it basically keeps the front brake pistons from being knocked back into the caliper when the spindle flexes. If you simply disable it as many do, the brake pedal may be low after a hard turn. A better solution IMO is the spacers and uprated spindles developed by uncle jack. http://www.zeni.net/trf/TR6-250GC/119.php?s_wt=1680&s_ht=1050 These address the root of the problem, rather than band-aiding the symptom. Randall From tony at tonydrews.com Wed Mar 10 08:59:34 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:59:34 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net> <552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> Message-ID: <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> If you're converting from a single circuit brake system to a dual circuit one, that valve would stay in the front brake circuit. It's not needed in the rear brake circuit. - Tony At 09:38 AM 3/10/2010, you wrote: >It's a typical disk brake residual pressure valve that keeps a few pounds of >pressure on the calipers to keep the pads from withdrawing too much. >On Mar 10, 2010, at 3:37 AM, Dennis DeLap wrote: > > > Friends > > > > Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what > > Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line >system. > > This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid to >the > > front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was >eliminated. > > Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. > > > > Thanks > > Dennis > > \ From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 10 10:26:40 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 10:26:40 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Message-ID: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> Well, it might be interesting to one or two folks on this list: http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 mjb. From tlizzard at msn.com Wed Mar 10 10:28:47 2010 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 12:28:47 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> Message-ID: I miss those cars and the whole climate of IMSA racing at that time. Watched them run at Mid Ohio many times. Thanks for the heads up. Terry Stetler From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 10 11:14:17 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 11:14:17 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4B97E179.6050908@bradakis.com> Terry Stetler wrote: > I miss those cars and the whole climate of IMSA racing at that time. Watched > them run at Mid Ohio many times. > > I only saw them run once at Sears Point in '84. I recall the Mazda rotary had a rather unpleasant howl, but the cars were fun to watch. This Nissan would be a great toy, but I don't think I'll be getting enough Team.Net donations this week to cover it, shucks. mjb. From BillDentin at aol.com Wed Mar 10 11:20:15 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 13:20:15 EST Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Message-ID: <1f0dd.6c66645f.38c93cdf@aol.com> In a message dated 03/10/2010 12:10:44 PM Central Standard Time, mark at bradakis.com writes: > I only saw them run once at Sears Point in '84. I recall the Mazda > rotary had > a rather unpleasant howl, but the cars were fun to watch. > > This Nissan would be a great toy, but I don't think I'll be getting > enough Team.Net donations this week to cover it, shucks. > > Terry... I don't remember if they were there any of the times you have been wrenching at ROAD AMERICA, but for a while two of those NISSAN cars used to paddock along the fence next to the entrance to the False Grid, and right across the road from our traditional paddock space (especially at the SVRA and BRIC) vintage events. The first time I saw one, I smiled at seeing one at a 'vintage' event, and sent Kas a picture saying, "Look what's parked across the road from us at a 'vintage' event." All Kas wanted to know was, "...is she still FAST?" And of course she was. Bill Dentinger From koblinger at verizon.net Wed Mar 10 11:26:37 2010 From: koblinger at verizon.net (koblinger at verizon.net) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 12:26:37 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Message-ID: <1684428337.316294.1268245597223.JavaMail.root@vms244.mailsrvcs.net> From riverside at southslope.net Wed Mar 10 11:33:10 2010 From: riverside at southslope.net (riverside) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 12:33:10 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We didn't have no on board telemetry. Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight was considered proof that i had been too damn slow in the previous corner. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Drews" To: "Dennis Delap" ; Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2010 9:59 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > If you're converting from a single circuit brake system to a dual circuit > one, that valve would stay in the front brake circuit. It's not needed in > the rear brake circuit. > > - Tony > > At 09:38 AM 3/10/2010, you wrote: >>It's a typical disk brake residual pressure valve that keeps a few pounds >>of >>pressure on the calipers to keep the pads from withdrawing too much. >>On Mar 10, 2010, at 3:37 AM, Dennis DeLap wrote: >> >> > Friends >> > >> > Most of our TR3's and TR4's came equipped from the factory with what >> > Moss calls a restrictor valve - installed in the brake hydraulic line >>system. >> > This valve sits atop the 5way connection that distributes brake fluid >> > to >>the >> > front and rear brakes. Some where in the TR4A run this valve was >>eliminated. >> > Does anyone know the purpose, function, or reason for this valve. >> > >> > Thanks >> > Dennis >> > \ > \ > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net From billb at bnj.com Wed Mar 10 12:23:56 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 09:23:56 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Message-ID: <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> That's about right, unless you're using the uprated axle setup. The residual pressure valve only helps a little. I don't use any residual pressure on Peyote (I think--I MIGHT have left the valve in that Wilwoods come with) but with the uprated axle I get a high pedal pretty consistently. I like that. pumping brakes doesn't give confidence entering fast corners. On Mar 10, 2010, at 8:33 AM, riverside wrote: > My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We > didn't have no on board telemetry. > > Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight > was considered proof that i had been too damn slow > in the previous corner. > > art de armond From tr4racing at googlemail.com Wed Mar 10 14:32:09 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 22:32:09 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> Message-ID: <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> I don't use any axle upgrade and don't have a long pedal. I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. Since I use ATE blue all trouble is gone. ATE + EBC brake pads doing a fine job at my car. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Bill Babcock Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 20:24 An: riverside Cc: fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve That's about right, unless you're using the uprated axle setup. The residual pressure valve only helps a little. I don't use any residual pressure on Peyote (I think--I MIGHT have left the valve in that Wilwoods come with) but with the uprated axle I get a high pedal pretty consistently. I like that. pumping brakes doesn't give confidence entering fast corners. On Mar 10, 2010, at 8:33 AM, riverside wrote: > My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We > didn't have no on board telemetry. > > Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight > was considered proof that i had been too damn slow > in the previous corner. > > art de armond _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From billb at bnj.com Wed Mar 10 14:55:40 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 11:55:40 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> Message-ID: The residual pressure valve helps, and you can do as I used to do and fit a stronger one if it's not enough, but your pads will drag a little. I think the biggest advantage of the uprated axle is the ability to shim the bearings for a precise preload and then torque the nut tight. I get a very free=spinning wheel that doesn't wobble and doesn't knock the pads back. Everything helps, but all these things are compromises. On Mar 10, 2010, at 11:32 AM, MadMarx wrote: > I don't use any axle upgrade and don't have a long pedal. > I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. > All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. > Since I use ATE blue all trouble is gone. > ATE + EBC brake pads doing a fine job at my car. > > Cheers > Chris > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Bill Babcock > Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 20:24 > An: riverside > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > That's about right, unless you're using the uprated axle setup. The residual > pressure valve only helps a little. I don't use any residual pressure on > Peyote (I think--I MIGHT have left the valve in that Wilwoods come with) but > with the uprated axle I get a high pedal pretty consistently. I like that. > pumping brakes doesn't give confidence entering fast corners. > > On Mar 10, 2010, at 8:33 AM, riverside wrote: > >> My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We >> didn't have no on board telemetry. >> >> Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight >> was considered proof that i had been too damn slow >> in the previous corner. >> >> art de armond > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tr4racing at googlemail.com Wed Mar 10 15:41:10 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 23:41:10 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com> <20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net> <001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> Message-ID: <000601cac0a2$ca2b49f0$5e81ddd0$@com> Maybe the cornering speed is in the game too? My car might not getting fast enough to have trouble with the front axle. This year I have a go with a new cam that might boost the engine power. Maybe this year trouble starts with the brake system. Always you limb in racing speed new problems you are facing. -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: Bill Babcock [mailto:billb at bnj.com] Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 22:56 An: MadMarx Cc: fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve The residual pressure valve helps, and you can do as I used to do and fit a stronger one if it's not enough, but your pads will drag a little. I think the biggest advantage of the uprated axle is the ability to shim the bearings for a precise preload and then torque the nut tight. I get a very free=spinning wheel that doesn't wobble and doesn't knock the pads back. Everything helps, but all these things are compromises. On Mar 10, 2010, at 11:32 AM, MadMarx wrote: > I don't use any axle upgrade and don't have a long pedal. > I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. > All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. > Since I use ATE blue all trouble is gone. > ATE + EBC brake pads doing a fine job at my car. > > Cheers > Chris > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Bill Babcock > Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. Mdrz 2010 20:24 > An: riverside > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > That's about right, unless you're using the uprated axle setup. The residual > pressure valve only helps a little. I don't use any residual pressure on > Peyote (I think--I MIGHT have left the valve in that Wilwoods come with) but > with the uprated axle I get a high pedal pretty consistently. I like that. > pumping brakes doesn't give confidence entering fast corners. > > On Mar 10, 2010, at 8:33 AM, riverside wrote: > >> My TR3 racing experience was not very scientific. We >> didn't have no on board telemetry. >> >> Anything less than 3 pumps of the brake on the straight >> was considered proof that i had been too damn slow >> in the previous corner. >> >> art de armond > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Wed Mar 10 18:21:21 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 17:21:21 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> Message-ID: <04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> > I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. > All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. Just curious, Chris, don't you think there is a connection there? Dragging brakes and excess heat? Possibly my RPV was malfunctioning, but I could feel the drag after releasing the brake pedal, and the front brakes would be hot after a run, even if I used the handbrake to stop at the end. -- Randall From igofaster at att.net Wed Mar 10 22:08:00 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 21:08:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... Message-ID: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... I need to plumb a 1" inside diameter hose from the crankcase (90 degree) and a 1" inside diameter hose to my catch tank. I don't understand the terminology of the references on the likes of the Earl brand hose connectors ... like -8AN -6AN etc.... In the need to know... the crank vent needs to come from the fuel cover plate and take a 90 degree short run. I think I just need to drill out the valve cover and have a 1" connection to my catch tank which will also need to short 90 degree receivers to catch the blow by from my 1" i.d. hoses.... please don't think I'm dumb... I'm still learning.... Bobby Whitehead #39 1970 Triumph GT6 DP #87 1965 Triumph Spitfire EP From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Wed Mar 10 22:24:06 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 21:24:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down force that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was scary to drive. I had so much power.. Pretty fun discussion. Mike Mehl ________________________________ From: Mark J Bradakis To: Friends of Triumph Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Well, it might be interesting to one or two folks on this list: http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 mjb. \ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From koblinger at verizon.net Wed Mar 10 22:33:46 2010 From: koblinger at verizon.net (Kurt Oblinger) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 21:33:46 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com> <156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4B9880BA.2020706@verizon.net> Here is a pic I shot at Riverside's Turn 6 of the Electramotive Nissan. EFR is in the car and Brabham was co-driver. I don't recall the year. Maybe the same car or a variation thereof. They were great cars and indecently fast! http://yfrog.com/egnissangtpj Cheers, Kurt O. Mike Mehl wrote: > driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the > Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the > induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down force > that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was > scary to drive. I had so much power.. > > Pretty fun discussion. > > Mike Mehl > ________________________________ > From: Mark J Bradakis > To: > Friends of Triumph > Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM > Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting > > Well, it might be interesting to > one or two folks on this list: > > http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 > > mjb. > \ > _______________________________________________ From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 10 23:53:53 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2010 23:53:53 -0700 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4B989381.6030608@bradakis.com> The AN spec ( Army - Navy ) sizes are based on 1/16th of an inch. A -4 is 4/16ths ID, or 1/4 inch. -6 is 6/16ths. or 3/8ths. AN flares are 37 degree cones, and are good for many make and break cycles without leaking. Pegasus ( pegasusautoracing.com ) has some technical info on their web page, as I recall, which might prove helpful. I've not looked at it in a while. mjb. From tr4racing at googlemail.com Thu Mar 11 01:19:03 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:19:03 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com> <000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com> <04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> Message-ID: <000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Hi Randall, I don't think so. My brakes move freely. If I push them from hand with the wheel on, they rotate about 3-4 times before the wheel stops. We have some tracks which are hard on the brakes...like Hockenheim, Zandvoort. Some of the brake bias is directed to the rear, even then the front has vapor lock if I use normal DOT4 fluid. But as I said, with the performance brake fluid all trouble is gone. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Randall Gesendet: Donnerstag, 11. Mdrz 2010 02:21 Cc: fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > I use the restrictor valve and hope it does work. > All brake trouble at my car was caused by hot brake fluid. Just curious, Chris, don't you think there is a connection there? Dragging brakes and excess heat? Possibly my RPV was malfunctioning, but I could feel the drag after releasing the brake pedal, and the front brakes would be hot after a run, even if I used the handbrake to stop at the end. -- Randall _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Thu Mar 11 06:08:48 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 07:08:48 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com><000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com><04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> <000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Message-ID: I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only assume that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. I had spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if everyone is frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "MadMarx" To: "'Randall'" Cc: Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve From tr4racing at googlemail.com Thu Mar 11 06:38:07 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:38:07 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com><000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com><04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> <000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Message-ID: <003801cac120$16f17e80$44d47b80$@com> I also have crisp dust cover seals after a race. I use heat shields with medium success on this issue. The inner seals also fail but they do from the pistons which lost some of their chrome coatings. I now use inox pistons and hope for the best. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Bob Kramer Gesendet: Donnerstag, 11. Mdrz 2010 14:09 Cc: fot at autox.team.net Betreff: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only assume that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. I had spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if everyone is frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "MadMarx" To: "'Randall'" Cc: Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From mpendy at dishmail.net Thu Mar 11 06:59:36 2010 From: mpendy at dishmail.net (Mark Pendergrass) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 05:59:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com><000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com><04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com><000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Message-ID: Bob, i dont' even bother with the boot seals, like you said, they may last one or two race weekends, i did say maybe..........MP ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bob Kramer" Cc: Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 5:08 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they > last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and > rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner > ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling > to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only > assume that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. > I had spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if > everyone is frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years > of racing. > > Bob Kramer > Volente, TX > > Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch > excellence. > Vince Lombardi > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "MadMarx" > To: "'Randall'" > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mpendy at dishmail.net From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Thu Mar 11 07:25:36 2010 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 06:25:36 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <83432.52222.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Bobby: Speedway Motors also has a good explanation and lower prices than Pegasus; speedwaymotors.com . Of course, it's hard to beat the prices at Jegs or Summit. I think their volume is just so high they get a better break. -Ed- --- On Wed, 3/10/10, Bobby Whitehead wrote: From: Bobby Whitehead Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... To: "FoT Triumph" Date: Wednesday, March 10, 2010, 11:08 PM Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... I need to plumb a 1" inside diameter hose from the crankcase (90 degree) and a 1" inside diameter hose to my catch tank. I don't understand the terminology of the references on the likes of the Earl brand hose connectors ... like -8AN -6AN etc.... In the need to know... the crank vent needs to come from the fuel cover plate and take a 90 degree short run. I think I just need to drill out the valve cover and have a 1" connection to my catch tank which will also need to short 90 degree receivers to catch the blow by from my 1" i.d. hoses.... please don't think I'm dumb... I'm still learning.... Bobby Whitehead #39 1970 Triumph GT6 DP #87 1965 Triumph Spitfire EP _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net From tjwakeman at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 08:11:41 2010 From: tjwakeman at gmail.com (TeriAnn J. Wakeman) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 07:11:41 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> Bobby Whitehead wrote: > Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... > I very highly recommend a book titled: Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI Publishing Company, copyright 1990. Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the effort. Teriann From cartravel at pobox.com Thu Mar 11 08:11:19 2010 From: cartravel at pobox.com (Larry Young) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:11:19 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: References: <20100309074551.jx4363qjzdskswc4@webmail.FoxValley.net><552065.17903.qm@web81703.mail.mud.yahoo.com><358A4708-86B6-4675-92BE-5E7553E6D2CC@bnj.com><20100310160010.851A1187655@autox.team.net><001e01cac080$2b07aa70$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2><1B3D288B-A44D-422E-99D3-8C73DAFF360D@bnj.com><000001cac099$261ca060$7255e120$@com><04FC6ADE012F4724BF267E73162C6576@jdnet.deere.com> <000501cac0f3$8427d7b0$8c778710$@com> Message-ID: <4B990817.4010802@pobox.com> I always thought brake rebuilds were one of those things you "should" do once a year. Not that I ever did it that frequently. For a race car, I think the dust boots are a waste of time, so I quit using them. Larry Bob Kramer wrote: > I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long > they last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends > racing and rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers > have one inner ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots > were crispy, crumbling to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had > heat damage. I can only assume that the little rubber seal between the > halfs is also heat damaged. I had spares ready so the job is done but > I'm just a bit curious if everyone is frying these like I am. Mine > were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. > > Bob Kramer > Volente, TX From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Thu Mar 11 08:31:59 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (jerryvv at roadrunner.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 10:31:59 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20100311153159.OXBOV.264151.root@cdptpa-web03-z01> Bob, a bigger question is do we know that the current product is being molded from the proper rubber compound. That certainly applies to many of the rubber bits that are used in non-performance applications and I suspect on some of our engine and transmission mounts that are now being made in unknown foreign factories. Rubber compounds are designed for specific applications and heat and fluid resistance are two of the most critical conditions that rubber development is focused around. I believe Neoprene is the polymer of choice for brake components however that's just a starting point. From there a specific compound is developed using the base polymer. Once the compound is developed testing is done to what's known as a Line Call out to certify that the compound meets the design requirements. I certainly hope that these rebuild kits are still being manufactured by Girling or Lucas or some other reputable supplier. A no name box would give me concern. I've seen a few of those with brake parts in them. Not to mention the assumed liability. JVV ---- Bob Kramer wrote: > I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they > last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and > rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner > ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling > to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only assume > that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. I had > spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if everyone is > frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. > > Bob Kramer > Volente, TX > > Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch > excellence. > Vince Lombardi > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "MadMarx" > To: "'Randall'" > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com From timmurph at fastbytes.com Thu Mar 11 08:43:14 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:43:14 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> Message-ID: <000001cac131$913bbcd0$b3b33670$@com> I'll second that, Teriann. Fascinating book and well worth the time. One further note, either on the FOT or someplace else awhile back, mention was made of "knock-off" -AN fittings that failed. It is worth the extra bit to get branded fittings such as Aeroquip or XRP so that you know what you are getting. Don't necessarily get the cheapest ones you can find. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of TeriAnn J. Wakeman Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:12 AM To: FOT Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... Bobby Whitehead wrote: > Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... > I very highly recommend a book titled: Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI Publishing Company, copyright 1990. Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the effort. Teriann _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From timmurph at fastbytes.com Thu Mar 11 08:52:27 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:52:27 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Restrictor Valve In-Reply-To: <20100311153159.OXBOV.264151.root@cdptpa-web03-z01> References: <20100311153159.OXBOV.264151.root@cdptpa-web03-z01> Message-ID: <000101cac132$dbefc590$93cf50b0$@com> Good point. I had a discussion with Jack Drews regarding the seals from Moss and he questioned whether or not they were the same "type" as the original because they only seemed to last about one or maybe two seasons. We've had the same problem. I put stainless steel pistons in but we get the seals "weeping" when the car stands for any amount of time, ultimately draining all the brake fluid out, like over winter. Under pressure they seem to be sealing just fine, the level stays up in the reservoir during a weekends event. We may have to add some fluid due to pad wear (we have the small style master on the front and back of a dual master system) during a weekend but that's all. I did notice some unusual "staining" on the stainless pistons when we changed the seals last year. Doesn't look like actual scoring. Anybody else seen this with the stainless pistons? I can e-mail photos, which don't really do a good job of showing what it looks like, if anyone is interested. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jerryvv at roadrunner.com Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:32 AM To: Bob Kramer Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve Bob, a bigger question is do we know that the current product is being molded from the proper rubber compound. That certainly applies to many of the rubber bits that are used in non-performance applications and I suspect on some of our engine and transmission mounts that are now being made in unknown foreign factories. Rubber compounds are designed for specific applications and heat and fluid resistance are two of the most critical conditions that rubber development is focused around. I believe Neoprene is the polymer of choice for brake components however that's just a starting point. From there a specific compound is developed using the base polymer. Once the compound is developed testing is done to what's known as a Line Call out to certify that the compound meets the design requirements. I certainly hope that these rebuild kits are still being manufactured by Girling or Lucas or some other reputable supplier. A no name box would give me concern. I've seen a few of those with brake parts in them. Not to mention the assumed liability. JVV ---- Bob Kramer wrote: > I'd like to change the topic a little, to caliper seals and how long they > last under racing conditions. I just came back from a weekends racing and > rebuilt my calipers. The late TR4/early TR6 style calipers have one inner > ring and a rubber boot type seal. In mine the boots were crispy, crumbling > to the touch and one of the 4 inner rings had heat damage. I can only assume > that the little rubber seal between the halfs is also heat damaged. I had > spares ready so the job is done but I'm just a bit curious if everyone is > frying these like I am. Mine were on there for nearly 4 years of racing. > > Bob Kramer > Volente, TX > > Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch > excellence. > Vince Lombardi > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "MadMarx" > To: "'Randall'" > Cc: > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 2:19 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Restrictor Valve > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Mar 11 09:55:49 2010 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:55:49 EST Subject: [Fot] Brake Caliper Replacement Parts Message-ID: <63a2f.2dd261b4.38ca7a95@cs.com> Does the current state of parts quality in brake parts promote an argument for Toyota Conversions? Then it becomes an issue of safety rather than performance. I think I also came across a story of some aftermarket brake pistons (steel, stainless steel, chromed?) with a small sharp edge that cut the embedded seals. Leaky systems with new parts doesnt sound very good. It can say Lucas or Girling on the box, but I suspect that that they might still be substandard. And perhaps we need to look at the pistons under a magnifying glass for very small sharp machined edges or burrs. We have been having more issues with seals not lasting in the TR4...I suspect we need to go back and look more closely at the components, but what do you do with substandard seals? I know that Jack went back and forth on the Toyota conversions, but I cant remember the details. His final answer was to use the Toyotas and it wasnt a performance related issue, I dont think. Important thread. Thanks. I am not trying to make an argument for Toyota conversions, btw....just making observations. Joe A > Good point. I had a discussion with Jack Drews regarding the seals from > Moss and he questioned whether or not they were the same "type" as the > original because they only seemed to last about one or maybe two seasons. > We've had the same problem. I put stainless steel pistons in but we get > the > seals "weeping" when the car stands for any amount of time, ultimately > draining all the brake fluid out, like over winter. Under pressure they > seem to be sealing just fine, the level stays up in the reservoir during a > weekends event. We may have to add some fluid due to pad wear (we have the > small style master on the front and back of a dual master system) during a > weekend but that's all. I did notice some unusual "staining" on the > stainless pistons when we changed the seals last year. Doesn't look like > actual scoring. Anybody else seen this with the stainless pistons? I can > e-mail photos, which don't really do a good job of showing what it looks > like, if anyone is interested. > > Tim > From riverside at southslope.net Thu Mar 11 10:05:27 2010 From: riverside at southslope.net (riverside) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:05:27 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com><156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4B9880BA.2020706@verizon.net> Message-ID: <001401cac13d$0cd9da10$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Whatever became of Geoff Brabham? I remember watching in car footage of him at R/A in an Indy car. Thought he was hell for quick. Kas, do you have any special recollections of him? art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kurt Oblinger" To: "Mike Mehl" Cc: "Triumph Friends of" Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2010 11:33 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting > Here is a pic I shot at Riverside's Turn 6 of the Electramotive Nissan. > EFR is in the car and Brabham was co-driver. I don't recall the year. > Maybe the same car or a variation thereof. They were great cars and > indecently fast! > > http://yfrog.com/egnissangtpj > > Cheers, > Kurt O. > > > Mike Mehl wrote: >> driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the >> Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the >> induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down >> force >> that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was >> scary to drive. I had so much power.. >> >> Pretty fun discussion. >> >> Mike Mehl >> ________________________________ >> From: Mark J Bradakis >> To: >> Friends of Triumph >> Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM >> Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting >> >> Well, it might be interesting to >> one or two folks on this list: >> >> http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 >> mjb. >> \ >> _______________________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Thu Mar 11 10:05:48 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:05:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> Message-ID: <502CE409B8854072984BA917E0CDDA4B@jdnet.deere.com> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" > MBI Publishing Company, copyright 1990. Which, being the fifth volume in his "Tune to Win" series; he supposedly wanted to call "Screw to Win" All good stuff, BTW. -- Randall From spitlist at cox.net Thu Mar 11 10:24:00 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 10:24:00 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <001401cac13d$0cd9da10$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> References: <4B97D650.7080102@bradakis.com><156572.81534.qm@web46107.mail.sp1.yahoo.com><4B9880BA.2020706@verizon.net> <001401cac13d$0cd9da10$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Message-ID: I copied this from Wikipedia: Brabham now works for BMW Group Australia as a driver trainer at many different events around the country teaching others to drive safer and smarter, including teaching drivers to race for BMW supported celebrity races at the Australian Grand Prix. His son Matthew Brabham is also following in the family interest and is a very successful Kart racer. Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of riverside Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 10:05 AM To: Kurt Oblinger; Mike Mehl Cc: Triumph Friends of Subject: Re: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting Whatever became of Geoff Brabham? I remember watching in car footage of him at R/A in an Indy car. Thought he was hell for quick. Kas, do you have any special recollections of him? art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kurt Oblinger" To: "Mike Mehl" Cc: "Triumph Friends of" Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2010 11:33 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting > Here is a pic I shot at Riverside's Turn 6 of the Electramotive Nissan. > EFR is in the car and Brabham was co-driver. I don't recall the year. > Maybe the same car or a variation thereof. They were great cars and > indecently fast! > > http://yfrog.com/egnissangtpj > > Cheers, > Kurt O. > > > Mike Mehl wrote: >> driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the >> Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the >> induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down >> force >> that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was >> scary to drive. I had so much power.. >> >> Pretty fun discussion. >> >> Mike Mehl >> ________________________________ >> From: Mark J Bradakis >> To: >> Friends of Triumph >> Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM >> Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting >> >> Well, it might be interesting to >> one or two folks on this list: >> >> http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 >> mjb. >> \ >> _______________________________________________ > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From riverside at southslope.net Thu Mar 11 10:53:27 2010 From: riverside at southslope.net (riverside) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:53:27 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4B99082D.80105@gmail.com> Message-ID: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Thu Mar 11 11:17:32 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 10:17:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Bobby, Steve Belfer here. I was new to these fittings but have recently (within the past year) had many custom AN lines made up to completely re-plumb the fuel system and install an Accusump in the Trunk, and Oil cooler, as well as a custom line for the oil press. gauge. Sounds like what you're doing is pretty easy, and easy to make a mistake too and spend extra money. The main way to screw it up is to make the lines too short. You can always shorten them but can not lengthen them. :) 1"ID is -16AN hose. These are big but the right size for the valve cover and crankcase vent. You need to have a -16AN Male "Bung" welded into the valve cover and catch tank. Then you need to have a hose made up that connects the valve cover to the catch tank. This hose will be comprised of the hose and two hose end fittings. Hose end fittings come straight, or 45 degrees or 90 degrees. They can also be purchased in bends up to 180 degrees but you won't need that for this application. Find a local shop that can make up hoses for you. I do not recommend doing it yourself the first time. The braided hose is cut with a special chop-saw. You can tape it and cut yourself with a hack-saw or dremel but I've messed this up by cutting at an angle or by fraying the braids. Find a good chop that knows what they're doing and can shorten the line and rebuild the hose if you need to make tweaks. The hoses bend well but do not twist. They take a set because of the braiding so you have to know which angle the end fittings will point when the hose is in attached. Leave at least 1" of slack so the line can vibrate as the engine moves a little. You do not want the line too tight. Buy "Swivel" end fittings so you can adjust the angle of the end fittings. Do not overtighten AN fittings. They need no sealant, no lubricant and just give them a firm tightening but don't crank on it! If you have any specific questions, I'll be glad to try and answer them for you. ~Steve On Mar 10, 2010, at 9:08 PM, Bobby Whitehead wrote: Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... I need to plumb a 1" inside diameter hose from the crankcase (90 degree) and a 1" inside diameter hose to my catch tank. I don't understand the terminology of the references on the likes of the Earl brand hose connectors ... like -8AN -6AN etc.... In the need to know... the crank vent needs to come from the fuel cover plate and take a 90 degree short run. I think I just need to drill out the valve cover and have a 1" connection to my catch tank which will also need to short 90 degree receivers to catch the blow by from my 1" i.d. hoses.... please don't think I'm dumb... I'm still learning.... Bobby Whitehead #39 1970 Triumph GT6 DP #87 1965 Triumph Spitfire EP _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Mar 11 11:36:19 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 12:36:19 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Brake Caliper Replacement Parts In-Reply-To: <63a2f.2dd261b4.38ca7a95@cs.com> References: <63a2f.2dd261b4.38ca7a95@cs.com> Message-ID: I had forgotten that many people choose to run without the dust seals. I may have to go that way. I definitely try to avoid suspect rubber parts but like others have said there is no guarantee that a Lucas/Girling box means anything. My vintage organization won't allow Toyota conversions but I suppose they wouldn't know. I prefer keeping it original anyway. Larry Young thinks the early/larger TR4 calipers work better, both in cooling and in brake surface area. Now that I have a an early TR4 and a 4A I can compare. I just let mine go too long. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of N197TR4 at cs.com Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 10:56 AM To: timmurph at fastbytes.com; jerryvv at roadrunner.com; rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Brake Caliper Replacement Parts Does the current state of parts quality in brake parts promote an argument for Toyota Conversions? Then it becomes an issue of safety rather than performance. I think I also came across a story of some aftermarket brake pistons (steel, stainless steel, chromed?) with a small sharp edge that cut the embedded seals. Leaky systems with new parts doesnt sound very good. It can say Lucas or Girling on the box, but I suspect that that they might still be substandard. And perhaps we need to look at the pistons under a magnifying glass for very small sharp machined edges or burrs. We have been having more issues with seals not lasting in the TR4...I suspect we need to go back and look more closely at the components, but what do you do with substandard seals? I know that Jack went back and forth on the Toyota conversions, but I cant remember the details. His final answer was to use the Toyotas and it wasnt a performance related issue, I dont think. Important thread. Thanks. I am not trying to make an argument for Toyota conversions, btw....just making observations. Joe A > Good point. I had a discussion with Jack Drews regarding the seals from > Moss and he questioned whether or not they were the same "type" as the > original because they only seemed to last about one or maybe two seasons. > We've had the same problem. I put stainless steel pistons in but we get > the > seals "weeping" when the car stands for any amount of time, ultimately > draining all the brake fluid out, like over winter. Under pressure they > seem to be sealing just fine, the level stays up in the reservoir during a > weekends event. We may have to add some fluid due to pad wear (we have the > small style master on the front and back of a dual master system) during a > weekend but that's all. I did notice some unusual "staining" on the > stainless pistons when we changed the seals last year. Doesn't look like > actual scoring. Anybody else seen this with the stainless pistons? I can > e-mail photos, which don't really do a good job of showing what it looks > like, if anyone is interested. > > Tim > _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com From billb at bnj.com Thu Mar 11 11:40:19 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 08:40:19 -1000 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <68454015-0C3A-4C75-BD81-C29292584A83@bnj.com> Good advice except the part about not doing it yourself. I think anyone that uses these things should learn how to make them up, you can't always get to a shop, and it's not that hard. Tape with a couple of TIGHT wraps of masking tape--not duct tape--it's too stretchy. Mark where you want your cut then wrap another piece of colored masking tape so it's edge is on the mark to give you a nice squared-up cutting line. Use a very fine toothed hacksaw blade--as fine as you can find. stick the line in a vise and cut smoothly with light strokes. Then follow the mfrs. directions. Don't take the tape off until you are ready to stuff the line into the fitting. On Mar 11, 2010, at 8:17 AM, Steven Belfer wrote: > Hi Bobby, Steve Belfer here. > > I was new to these fittings but have recently (within the past year) had many custom AN lines made up to completely re-plumb the fuel system and install an Accusump in the Trunk, and Oil cooler, as well as a custom line for the oil press. gauge. Sounds like what you're doing is pretty easy, and easy to make a mistake too and spend extra money. The main way to screw it up is to make the lines too short. You can always shorten them but can not lengthen them. :) 1"ID is -16AN hose. These are big but the right size for the valve cover and crankcase vent. You need to have a -16AN Male "Bung" welded into the valve cover and catch tank. Then you need to have a hose made up that connects the valve cover to the catch tank. This hose will be comprised of the hose and two hose end fittings. Hose end fittings come straight, or 45 degrees or 90 degrees. They can also be purchased in bends up to 180 degrees but you won't need that for this application. > > Find a local shop that can make up hoses for you. I do not recommend doing it yourself the first time. The braided hose is cut with a special chop-saw. You can tape it and cut yourself with a hack-saw or dremel but I've messed this up by cutting at an angle or by fraying the braids. Find a good chop that knows what they're doing and can shorten the line and rebuild the hose if you need to make tweaks. From bownes at seiri.com Thu Mar 11 11:59:19 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 13:59:19 -0500 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <68454015-0C3A-4C75-BD81-C29292584A83@bnj.com> References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <68454015-0C3A-4C75-BD81-C29292584A83@bnj.com> Message-ID: I've had great luck cutting AN braided hose with a large diameter fibreglas cut off wheel in a chop saw. After wrapping in tape of course. Once you get the hang of making them, you'll never go back to paying to have them made again. I keep a box of fittings and rolls of hose in the trailer. On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:40 PM, Bill Babcock wrote: > Good advice except the part about not doing it yourself. I think anyone > that > uses these things should learn how to make them up, you can't always get to > a > shop, and it's not that hard. Tape with a couple of TIGHT wraps of masking > tape--not duct tape--it's too stretchy. Mark where you want your cut then > wrap > another piece of colored masking tape so it's edge is on the mark to give > you > a nice squared-up cutting line. Use a very fine toothed hacksaw blade--as > fine > as you can find. stick the line in a vise and cut smoothly with light > strokes. > Then follow the mfrs. directions. Don't take the tape off until you are > ready > to stuff the line into the fitting. > > On Mar 11, 2010, at 8:17 AM, Steven Belfer wrote: > > > Hi Bobby, Steve Belfer here. > > > > I was new to these fittings but have recently (within the past year) had > many custom AN lines made up to completely re-plumb the fuel system and > install an Accusump in the Trunk, and Oil cooler, as well as a custom line > for > the oil press. gauge. Sounds like what you're doing is pretty easy, and > easy > to make a mistake too and spend extra money. The main way to screw it up is > to > make the lines too short. You can always shorten them but can not lengthen > them. :) 1"ID is -16AN hose. These are big but the right size for the > valve cover and crankcase vent. You need to have a -16AN Male "Bung" > welded > into the valve cover and catch tank. Then you need to have a hose made up > that connects the valve cover to the catch tank. This hose will be > comprised > of the hose and two hose end fittings. Hose end fittings come straight, or > 45 > degrees or 90 degrees. They can also be purchased in bends up to 180 > degrees > but you won't need that for this application. > > > > Find a local shop that can make up hoses for you. I do not recommend > doing > it yourself the first time. The braided hose is cut with a special > chop-saw. > You can tape it and cut yourself with a hack-saw or dremel but I've messed > this up by cutting at an angle or by fraying the braids. Find a good chop > that > knows what they're doing and can shorten the line and rebuild the hose if > you > need to make tweaks. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From bownes at seiri.com Thu Mar 11 12:00:18 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:00:18 -0500 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: References: <176748.42936.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <68454015-0C3A-4C75-BD81-C29292584A83@bnj.com> Message-ID: And an important accessory if you are making them yourself is the red and blue sharpies to touch up where you scratch the anodize off of the connectors. ;) On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:59 PM, robert bownes wrote: > I've had great luck cutting AN braided hose with a large diameter fibreglas > cut off wheel in a chop saw. After wrapping in tape of course. > > Once you get the hang of making them, you'll never go back to paying to > have them made again. I keep a box of fittings and rolls of hose in the > trailer. > > > > On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:40 PM, Bill Babcock wrote: > >> Good advice except the part about not doing it yourself. I think anyone >> that >> uses these things should learn how to make them up, you can't always get >> to a >> shop, and it's not that hard. Tape with a couple of TIGHT wraps of masking >> tape--not duct tape--it's too stretchy. Mark where you want your cut then >> wrap >> another piece of colored masking tape so it's edge is on the mark to give >> you >> a nice squared-up cutting line. Use a very fine toothed hacksaw blade--as >> fine >> as you can find. stick the line in a vise and cut smoothly with light >> strokes. >> Then follow the mfrs. directions. Don't take the tape off until you are >> ready >> to stuff the line into the fitting. >> >> On Mar 11, 2010, at 8:17 AM, Steven Belfer wrote: >> >> > Hi Bobby, Steve Belfer here. >> > >> > I was new to these fittings but have recently (within the past year) had >> many custom AN lines made up to completely re-plumb the fuel system and >> install an Accusump in the Trunk, and Oil cooler, as well as a custom line >> for >> the oil press. gauge. Sounds like what you're doing is pretty easy, and >> easy >> to make a mistake too and spend extra money. The main way to screw it up >> is to >> make the lines too short. You can always shorten them but can not lengthen >> them. :) 1"ID is -16AN hose. These are big but the right size for the >> valve cover and crankcase vent. You need to have a -16AN Male "Bung" >> welded >> into the valve cover and catch tank. Then you need to have a hose made up >> that connects the valve cover to the catch tank. This hose will be >> comprised >> of the hose and two hose end fittings. Hose end fittings come straight, >> or 45 >> degrees or 90 degrees. They can also be purchased in bends up to 180 >> degrees >> but you won't need that for this application. >> > >> > Find a local shop that can make up hoses for you. I do not recommend >> doing >> it yourself the first time. The braided hose is cut with a special >> chop-saw. >> You can tape it and cut yourself with a hack-saw or dremel but I've messed >> this up by cutting at an angle or by fraying the braids. Find a good chop >> that >> knows what they're doing and can shorten the line and rebuild the hose if >> you >> need to make tweaks. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From kaskas at cox.net Thu Mar 11 12:13:52 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:13:52 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting In-Reply-To: <4B9880BA.2020706@verizon.net> Message-ID: <20100311141352.4GF64.25208.imail@fed1rmwml46> That car is a 1987 version before the new tub and the Goodyear tires which made the car over 2 seconds faster. That car was later called "Elvis" and was laterr sold to a fellow in Europe.The car was just fast enough for my tastes. 1988 was better when Geoff was on full time and we won 8 races in a row and 10 out of 13. Yes, just fast enough. ---- Kurt Oblinger wrote: ============= Here is a pic I shot at Riverside's Turn 6 of the Electramotive Nissan. EFR is in the car and Brabham was co-driver. I don't recall the year. Maybe the same car or a variation thereof. They were great cars and indecently fast! http://yfrog.com/egnissangtpj Cheers, Kurt O. Mike Mehl wrote: > driven by Geoff Brabham and EFR (Elliott Forbes Robinson). One of the > Nissan's sits in the motorsports hall of fame. I talked to EFR at the > induction ceromony a few years ago. He said the car had so much down force > that they were overloading the tires and having failures. He said it was > scary to drive. I had so much power.. > > Pretty fun discussion. > > Mike Mehl > ________________________________ > From: Mark J Bradakis > To: > Friends of Triumph > Sent: Wed, March 10, 2010 9:26:40 AM > Subject: [Fot] Off topic, but interesting > > Well, it might be interesting to > one or two folks on this list: > > http://tinyurl.com/ygzxh96 > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From kaskas at cox.net Thu Mar 11 12:20:13 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:20:13 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <83432.52222.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20100311142013.N5WIM.25337.imail@fed1rmwml46> -Geoff lives is Australia and runs the driving schools for BMW and has done so for quite a few years. Heard from him a regularly, his son Mathew will be racing a formula Ford this year (16 yrs old) at the F-1 race they have in Australia. The kid is chip off the old block and fast. Did very well in carts with Geoff as his mechanic. Mathew carries the same number we had on his Dad's car, 83. --- EDWARD BARNARD wrote: ============= Bobby: Speedway Motors also has a good explanation and lower prices than Pegasus; speedwaymotors.com . Of course, it's hard to beat the prices at Jegs or Summit. I think their volume is just so high they get a better break. -Ed- --- On Wed, 3/10/10, Bobby Whitehead wrote: From: Bobby Whitehead Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... To: "FoT Triumph" Date: Wednesday, March 10, 2010, 11:08 PM Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the fittings used on our race cars... I need to plumb a 1" inside diameter hose from the crankcase (90 degree) and a 1" inside diameter hose to my catch tank. I don't understand the terminology of the references on the likes of the Earl brand hose connectors ... like -8AN -6AN etc.... In the need to know... the crank vent needs to come from the fuel cover plate and take a 90 degree short run. I think I just need to drill out the valve cover and have a 1" connection to my catch tank which will also need to short 90 degree receivers to catch the blow by from my 1" i.d. hoses.... please don't think I'm dumb... I'm still learning.... Bobby Whitehead #39 1970 Triumph GT6 DP #87 1965 Triumph Spitfire EP _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From kaskas at cox.net Thu Mar 11 12:44:01 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 11:44:01 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Message-ID: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> ---- riverside wrote: One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum castings and plastic parts. A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. ============= Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 11 13:02:15 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 13:02:15 -0700 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> Message-ID: <4B994C47.3080107@bradakis.com> I use a cutoff wheel in a die grinder to cut the hose, after taping. Keep in mind that usually the inner hose is some sort of rubber, and it can deteriorate over time and exposure to heat and solvents. Fittings last longer than the hose. With a bit of practice making up hoses is pretty straightforward. And as Kas mentions the outer braid is quite effective at wearing through things it vibrates against. I recall once at IVR I was inspecting a Mallet Corvette that a fellow just purchased for some large sum of money. I was really amazed at some of the poor quality workmanship on it. The thing I had him deal with before he took it out was that a braided oil line was hard against the cable coming from the positive battery terminal. It wouldn't take long for that hose to gnaw through the insulation, I'm sure. On a side note, the Mallet came back from Hallet on a pallet. Not sure how he did it, but he turned the car into many little piles of scrap, I'm told. And speaking of large sums of money for cars, much as I expected I didn't get $100,000 + in donations overnight, so no bids on the GTP car. Guess I'll just have to get a Spitfire running this spring. mjb. From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Thu Mar 11 13:11:48 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 12:11:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> Message-ID: Additionally, make sure the braided hose doesn't contact any electrical wiring or hot contacts. Could cause a short. ~Steve On Mar 11, 2010, at 11:44 AM, Kas Kastner wrote: ---- riverside wrote: One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum castings and plastic parts. A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. ============= Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it > came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth > the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Thu Mar 11 13:11:57 2010 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 15:11:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <4B994C47.3080107@bradakis.com> References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46>, <4B994C47.3080107@bradakis.com> Message-ID: > quality workmanship on it. The thing I had him deal with before > he took it out was that a braided oil line was hard against the cable > coming from the positive battery terminal. It wouldn't take long for > that hose to gnaw through the insulation, I'm sure. Once my students installed a turbine engine on the test stand in such a way that the large (over one inch) braided steel fuel (AVgas) line touched the positive post of the 28VDC ground power unit plug. They learned how to use a fire extinguisher that day. John H. From riverside at southslope.net Thu Mar 11 13:13:55 2010 From: riverside at southslope.net (riverside) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:13:55 -0600 Subject: [Fot] spit front shocks needed Message-ID: <00be01cac157$610e40c0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> Any body have a used set of shocks with adjustable spring perches for sale. art de armond From emanteno at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 13:17:40 2010 From: emanteno at gmail.com (Irv Korey) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:17:40 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> References: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> Message-ID: <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:44 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > ---- riverside wrote: > > One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it > rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum > castings and plastic parts. > A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. > If your stainless line is already assembled on the car, and you don't want to disassemble to install shrink tube, you can make a nice hose cover with the inner tube from a bicycle tire and some wire wraps. Irv From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Mar 11 13:32:23 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:32:23 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> References: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: These days you can get hose covered with a abrasion resistant braided cloth cover, in blue and black. These look nice with black AN fittings and maintain a period look from the days before braided SS. They are cheaper and easier to work with to boot. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Irv Korey From tedtsimx at bright.net Thu Mar 11 14:03:13 2010 From: tedtsimx at bright.net (Ted Schumacher) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:03:13 -0500 Subject: [Fot] brake seals, Toyota calipers, et al Message-ID: <4B995A91.8020107@bright.net> Hello list. We need to remember we are talking about race cars and racing. Somehow getting only 1 or 2 seasons out of a set of calipers before they need something is like being "slightly pregnant". After every session they should be checked and after every event they should be thoroughly inspected. Do this immediately after the car is unloaded, not the day before you head out the next time. If you want to help cooling, drill some holes around the perimeter of the piston, where it protrudes beyond the boot. These holes will let the hot gas that builds up inside the piston vent to atmosphere.This will get rid of some of the heat transfer from piston to caliper. Commercial content, we have rebuilt calipers - Spit. GT6, TR4, early and late TR6 for $69.95 each exchange. Toyota 4 piston calipers, rebuilt, including steel braid hose to go from caliper to TR bulkhead fitting (eliminates need to adapt hoses or steel lines) - $225. On another topic. the IMSA GTP cars did indeed generate a huge amount of down force. On the banking at Daytona, tires would blow from down force load. This led to the track installing the chicane at the end of the back straight just before entering NASCAR turn 3. Ted -- Ted Schumacher tedtsimx at bright.net http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com 108 S. Jefferson St. Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 From mdporter at dfn.com Thu Mar 11 14:02:48 2010 From: mdporter at dfn.com (Michael Porter) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 14:02:48 -0700 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> References: <006001cac143$c0b83df0$0301a8c0@your55e5f9e3d2> <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> <354a1781003111217y5165f0aat74d8a0e80c891079@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4B995A78.1080208@dfn.com> Irv Korey wrote: > On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 1:44 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > > >> ---- riverside wrote: >> >> One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it >> rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum >> castings and plastic parts. >> A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. >> >> > > If your stainless line is already assembled on the car, and you don't want > to disassemble to install shrink tube, you can make a nice hose cover with > the inner tube from a bicycle tire and some wire wraps. > > Irv, Aeroquip (probably other manufacturers, too) now offer high-helix spiral isolators that seem to be made of nylon and can be installed with the hose in place. Very clean and neat. Only proviso is that one has to make sure the isolator is positioned properly so that the isolator actually meets the contact points. Not preferable to proper padded clips, but, still, a pretty good alternative to tearing things down, and very useful where there's a tangle of hoses contacting each other. Cheers. -- Michael Porter Roswell, NM Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking distance.... From bownes at seiri.com Thu Mar 11 14:22:05 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:22:05 -0500 Subject: [Fot] brake seals, Toyota calipers, et al In-Reply-To: <4B995A91.8020107@bright.net> References: <4B995A91.8020107@bright.net> Message-ID: Re downforce of the nissan GTP cars. I remember a certain Friday at Lime Rock Park when John Morton experiences a significant _lack_ of downforce at the top of the uphill. I was @ turn 2 at the time. If you've never seen Roz Rozitoski's photos of the shunt, you are missing a classic. Roz had the old Nikon grinding out 6pfs when John came up the hill and got the front off of the ground. The rest of the car followed, going totally airborne, flipping front over back and landing upside down and backwards, then flipping back over and coming to a stop in more than a few pieces. There are, I think about 5 or 6 frames in the series. By frame 2, the car is in the air. in frame 3, the car hasn't landed yet and the corner worker, Bruce Kohlker is already on his way with a fire bottle. Amazing. Heady days those were. On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 4:03 PM, Ted Schumacher wrote: > Hello list. We need to remember we are talking about race cars and racing. > Somehow getting only 1 or 2 seasons out of a set of calipers before they > need something is like being "slightly pregnant". After every session they > should be checked and after every event they should be thoroughly inspected. > Do this immediately after the car is unloaded, not the day before you head > out the next time. If you want to help cooling, drill some holes around the > perimeter of the piston, where it protrudes beyond the boot. These holes > will let the hot gas that builds up inside the piston vent to > atmosphere.This will get rid of some of the heat transfer from piston to > caliper. Commercial content, we have rebuilt calipers - Spit. GT6, TR4, > early and late TR6 for $69.95 each exchange. Toyota 4 piston calipers, > rebuilt, including steel braid hose to go from caliper to TR bulkhead > fitting (eliminates need to adapt hoses or steel lines) - $225. > On another topic. the IMSA GTP cars did indeed generate a huge amount of > down force. On the banking at Daytona, tires would blow from down force > load. This led to the track installing the chicane at the end of the back > straight just before entering NASCAR turn 3. Ted > > -- > Ted Schumacher > tedtsimx at bright.net > http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com > 108 S. Jefferson St. > Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 > Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) > Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) > Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From kaskas at cox.net Thu Mar 11 14:44:48 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 13:44:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] brake seals, Toyota calipers, et al In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20100311164448.MLA8K.26895.imail@fed1rmwml43> That was a brand new car at Lime Rock. It had never turned a wheel except in the parking lot before loading. Totally destroyed. I went to hospital with John that afternoon. I have seen the photos Roz took and they are really graphic. ---- robert bownes wrote: ============= Re downforce of the nissan GTP cars. I remember a certain Friday at Lime Rock Park when John Morton experiences a significant _lack_ of downforce at the top of the uphill. I was @ turn 2 at the time. If you've never seen Roz Rozitoski's photos of the shunt, you are missing a classic. Roz had the old Nikon grinding out 6pfs when John came up the hill and got the front off of the ground. The rest of the car followed, going totally airborne, flipping front over back and landing upside down and backwards, then flipping back over and coming to a stop in more than a few pieces. There are, I think about 5 or 6 frames in the series. By frame 2, the car is in the air. in frame 3, the car hasn't landed yet and the corner worker, Bruce Kohlker is already on his way with a fire bottle. Amazing. Heady days those were. On Thu, Mar 11, 2010 at 4:03 PM, Ted Schumacher wrote: > Hello list. We need to remember we are talking about race cars and racing. > Somehow getting only 1 or 2 seasons out of a set of calipers before they > need something is like being "slightly pregnant". After every session they > should be checked and after every event they should be thoroughly inspected. > Do this immediately after the car is unloaded, not the day before you head > out the next time. If you want to help cooling, drill some holes around the > perimeter of the piston, where it protrudes beyond the boot. These holes > will let the hot gas that builds up inside the piston vent to > atmosphere.This will get rid of some of the heat transfer from piston to > caliper. Commercial content, we have rebuilt calipers - Spit. GT6, TR4, > early and late TR6 for $69.95 each exchange. Toyota 4 piston calipers, > rebuilt, including steel braid hose to go from caliper to TR bulkhead > fitting (eliminates need to adapt hoses or steel lines) - $225. > On another topic. the IMSA GTP cars did indeed generate a huge amount of > down force. On the banking at Daytona, tires would blow from down force > load. This led to the track installing the chicane at the end of the back > straight just before entering NASCAR turn 3. Ted > > -- > Ted Schumacher > tedtsimx at bright.net > http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com > 108 S. Jefferson St. > Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 > Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) > Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) > Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From dos_gusanos at msn.com Thu Mar 11 16:36:06 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:36:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help Message-ID: Yes, I know this is lame for this list but I'm just going to start here first. MY 1963 TR4 came with 4 Valve covers. All are different. I need to select the right one for 1963. Two are the TR3 style with the long filler in front but one has a small tab welded on the back end (bachelor #2). One has a long TR3 style filler but it is in the back of the engine(bachelor #3). The other has a low twist on cap in back and a small tube/vent port out of the valve cover probably for the PCV Valve for a later car(bachelor #4). My guess is Bachelor #3 is correct. PLEASE LET ME KNOW IF I AM WRONG It would be a huge embarassment to show up somewhere sporting the wrong cover! Cheers Henry Morrison, Albuquerque. From dos_gusanos at msn.com Thu Mar 11 16:53:29 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:53:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: When I bought my first TR4 it was only 16 years old. I have always looked at TR7's like brand new cars but when I bought one it was 34 years old. What does that have to do with anything? Well it was just a bit rough that with all my mods I got wasted by a Golf TDI Diesel. I figure some Tires will put me even with the Volkzy as i was running my $39 radials. Any tips on a hot 13" Autocross Tire? Cheers Henry Morrison, Albuquerque From jmwagner at tstonramp.com Thu Mar 11 17:12:00 2010 From: jmwagner at tstonramp.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:12:00 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <35DF0D38-2E5B-400D-B721-A541748F467C@tstonramp.com> Small tab cover is TR2. On Mar 11, 2010, at 3:36 PM, wrote: > Yes, I know this is lame for this list but I'm just going to start > here first. > MY 1963 TR4 came with 4 Valve covers. All are different. I need to > select > the right one for 1963. Two are the TR3 style with the long filler > in front > but one has a small tab welded on the back end (bachelor #2). One > has a long > TR3 style filler but it is in the back of the engine(bachelor #3). > The other > has a low twist on cap in back and a small tube/vent port out of the > valve > cover probably for the PCV Valve for a later car(bachelor #4). > > > > My guess is Bachelor #3 is correct. > > > > PLEASE LET ME KNOW IF I AM WRONG > > > > It would be a huge embarassment to show up somewhere sporting the > wrong > cover! > > > > Cheers Henry Morrison, Albuquerque. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jmwagner at greenheart.com From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Thu Mar 11 17:53:32 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:53:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> Message-ID: <491758.27669.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> If anyone would like to email me off line I would be happy to help. We sell hydraulic hose and fittings out of our 7 locations in the Northwest. I plumbed my TR4 with 100R5 Parker 293 hose. It has no wire, is super light weight and can be used for fuel and oil. I used 26 series 37 degree flare crimp fittings. With this hose you can mock up the hose and cut it with out any special tools and take it to a local Parker Store and have them crimp it. I have noted all the advice and figured I would at least offer my help off line. We sell mostly OEM's and large MRO users. Anyway let me know if you have any questions. Mike Mehl ________________________________ From: Steven Belfer To: FOT Sent: Thu, March 11, 2010 12:11:48 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... Additionally, make sure the braided hose doesn't contact any electrical wiring or hot contacts. Could cause a short. ~Steve On Mar 11, 2010, at 11:44 AM, Kas Kastner wrote: ---- riverside wrote: One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum castings and plastic parts. A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. ============= Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From jhassall at blacksburg.net Thu Mar 11 18:24:23 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 20:24:23 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B9997C7.8040900@blacksburg.net> On 3/11/2010 6:36 PM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: > Yes, I know this is lame for this list but I'm just going to start here first. > MY 1963 TR4 came with 4 Valve covers. All are different. I need to select > the right one for 1963. Two are the TR3 style with the long filler in front > but one has a small tab welded on the back end (bachelor #2). One has a long > TR3 style filler but it is in the back of the engine(bachelor #3). The other > has a low twist on cap in back and a small tube/vent port out of the valve > cover probably for the PCV Valve for a later car(bachelor #4). > > > > My guess is Bachelor #3 is correct. > Henry, FWIW, my '63 came with #3, which I believe is original, as nothing on the car had been replaced (or fixed) in its life. jim -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From robertten1 at aol.com Thu Mar 11 18:30:14 2010 From: robertten1 at aol.com (robertten1 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 20:30:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: <8CC8F9AB351753F-1A3C-12E4@webmail-d097.sysops.aol.com> I like my Toyo R888's on my Spit GT autocrosser, originally bought as wet weather tires but have found them to be excellent in the dry as well. ( 185r60x13 ) Good luck, Bob T From LimeyV8 at aol.com Thu Mar 11 19:34:40 2010 From: LimeyV8 at aol.com (LimeyV8 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:34:40 EST Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: <8f465.407f2b53.38cb0240@aol.com> In a message dated 3/11/2010 6:53:47 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, dos_gusanos at msn.com writes: Any tips on a hot 13" Autocross Tire? I have done several seasons in E Stock in TR8s I used to use 205/60 Kumho Victoracers, but you can't get them in that size anymore. more recently, I have used 215/50 Kumho 710s and 225/50 Hoosier A6s (yes, these WILL fit and work on 13 x 5.5 wheels) The Kumhos are a tad stickier to start with - the Hoosiers are better longer - i haven't decided yet whether they are worth the extra $. I have a set of 205/60 Toyo RA1s sitting in the garage waiting for me to finish powder coating the wheels to put them on - i can let you know how they are in a couple weeks. Cheers, Jack Mc From LimeyV8 at aol.com Thu Mar 11 19:38:39 2010 From: LimeyV8 at aol.com (LimeyV8 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:38:39 EST Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> In a message dated 3/11/2010 8:39:48 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, robertten1 at aol.com writes: I like my Toyo R888's on my Spit GT autocrosser, originally bought as wet weather tires but have found them to be excellent in the dry as well. ( 185r60x13 ) I got RA1s because Miata racers told me the R888s were terrible in the wet. what are your thoughts on that? Cheers, Jack Mc From adams910 at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 20:20:30 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 22:20:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> Message-ID: <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com> Full tread RA1's are a better rain tire. Full tread R888's are a better intermediate. In the dry, it's drivers preference, some people love the R888's, others hate them. Keep in mind Spec Miata's are in the 2300-2400lb range per rules, so what whatever tire wear they see might not apply to a much lighter British car. I also believe the R888 comes in different compounds. The 13" size might be a harder compound than the 15", best to check. Another thing, the Toyos (and other road race compound R-Dots) will never get hot enough for maximum performance at an autocross. The A6's and V700s are purpose built for autocrossing. As for the Hoosier A6's. There is a reason SCCA roadracers (SS and IT guys use them for qualifying) and autoxers refer to them as "purple crack". ;) From dos_gusanos at msn.com Thu Mar 11 21:16:03 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 21:16:03 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thank you for all the responses. I opened the Bonnet and there was yet another, fifth, valve cover similar to Bachelor #3...........................Cheers Henry > From: dos_gusanos at msn.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 16:36:06 -0700 > Subject: [Fot] Valve Cover Help > > Yes, I know this is lame for this list but I'm just going to start here first. > MY 1963 TR4 came with 4 Valve covers. All are different. I need to select > the right one for 1963. Two are the TR3 style with the long filler in front > but one has a small tab welded on the back end (bachelor #2). One has a long > TR3 style filler but it is in the back of the engine(bachelor #3). The other > has a low twist on cap in back and a small tube/vent port out of the valve > cover probably for the PCV Valve for a later car(bachelor #4). > > > > My guess is Bachelor #3 is correct. > > > > PLEASE LET ME KNOW IF I AM WRONG > > > > It would be a huge embarassment to show up somewhere sporting the wrong > cover! > > > > Cheers Henry Morrison, Albuquerque. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dos_gusanos at msn.com From timmurph at fastbytes.com Thu Mar 11 21:23:33 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 22:23:33 -0600 Subject: [Fot] explaination of fittings... In-Reply-To: <491758.27669.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <20100311144401.96ZAM.25813.imail@fed1rmwml46> <491758.27669.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000001cac19b$c7e02e50$57a08af0$@com> There is a tool called the "Koul Tools" made specifically to assist in making up braided -AN hoses. You can check it out and maybe get some more tips at www.koultools.com or just Google "koul tool". I haven't used one but after making up a number of hoses anything to make it more reliable and easier would be nice! No commercial interest, just FWIW. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mike Mehl Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 6:54 PM To: Steven Belfer Cc: Triumph Friends of Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... If anyone would like to email me off line I would be happy to help. We sell hydraulic hose and fittings out of our 7 locations in the Northwest. I plumbed my TR4 with 100R5 Parker 293 hose. It has no wire, is super light weight and can be used for fuel and oil. I used 26 series 37 degree flare crimp fittings. With this hose you can mock up the hose and cut it with out any special tools and take it to a local Parker Store and have them crimp it. I have noted all the advice and figured I would at least offer my help off line. We sell mostly OEM's and large MRO users. Anyway let me know if you have any questions. Mike Mehl ________________________________ From: Steven Belfer To: FOT Sent: Thu, March 11, 2010 12:11:48 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... Additionally, make sure the braided hose doesn't contact any electrical wiring or hot contacts. Could cause a short. ~Steve On Mar 11, 2010, at 11:44 AM, Kas Kastner wrote: ---- riverside wrote: One note on the stainless braided line. Check the routing as anything it rubs against it will slowly ground away or through including aluminum castings and plastic parts. A bit of shrink tube over the hose at the chaff points fixes it though. ============= Mega dittos on Smith's book. Been my bible for decades. art de armond ----- Original Message ----- From: "TeriAnn J. Wakeman" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 9:11 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] explaination of fittings... > Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> Could someone point me in the right direction to understanding the >> fittings used on our race cars... >> > I very highly recommend a book titled: > > Carroll Smith's Nuts, bolts, fasteners and plumbing Handbook" MBI > Publishing Company, copyright 1990. > > Reading it convinced me that I was just the rawest neophyte when it came > to the subjects and half of everything I had been told wasn't correct. > The book takes some effort to wade through but it is more than worth the > effort. > > Teriann > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/riverside at southslope.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From adams910 at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 21:57:33 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 23:57:33 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com> First off, what class are you running in? There are really 3 different tire clases. The ST classes use a DOT approved treaded tire with a tire wear rating of 140 being the lowest. The Stock and Street-Prepared classes allow any DOT approved tire. The Prepared and Mod classes allow for a cantilever slick. I wouldn't turn down a set of R888's. You'll probably be fine on the regional level, but if you are in a very competitive division or want to run Nationals and you want to win, you'll need either V710's or the A6's. R-DOTS are basically DOT approved tires that barely meet all the minimum requirements. They're radial designs, and feature at least one groove of 4/32" tread depth. Some come with full tread (Toyos are molded at 6/32", but when shaved to 4/32", they lose most of their tread and just have two grooves). Wear ratings are LOW.. usually in the 40-100 range and they have very stiff sidewalls. Tires like the Hoosier R and A6's , Kumho V710's, and Goodyear GS's are typically molded with a single groove around their circumference. These are sometimes referred to as "cheater R-DOTs". Not sure about autocrossing, but in roadracing, you can only expect 10-12 heat cycles if you're a fast guy with these tires, before they start to cord. They're fast as s**t while they last, but still slower than a full cantilever slick. The next batch: Toyo R888, RA1, Kumho V700, and Yokohama A048 are molded with a wet weather tread pattern, but they're molded pretty shallow. Most racers will shave the tires from 6/32" to 4/32" or more for dry use. 1) it removes most of the tread, making it more slick like , 2) it actually extends the life of the tire as it is less likely to chunk and build up excessive amounts of heat from tread squirm, 3) less rolling mass. These tires are slightly harder and slightly slower than the "cheater R-DOTS". They do last longer, are less finicky to set up, and are cheaper to buy. They're still plenty fast. Bob From adams910 at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 22:16:16 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 00:16:16 -0500 Subject: [Fot] SOVREN CRC - pass while spinning Message-ID: <673993c51003112116v5aa7e35dp6a67a7f92602021@mail.gmail.com> This was just posted on another forum. Arnie Loyning spin and pass in his Lotus Elan. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dz4P6e_Yv3c From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 11 23:34:17 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 23:34:17 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com> <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> > The Prepared and Mod classes allow for a cantilever slick. > > The guys at the tire shop were happy when I switched from cantilever slicks on 6 inch rims to normal sidewall slicks on 8 inch rims. Of course the extra wheel width was all outboard so the car was a bit wider and for a while I was nipping cones by just a hair. I'd like to get back to some sort of racing. Moving all this junk around cleaning up the shop has got me thinking more and more about getting back at it. Are you sure none of you need a Unix/Linux sys admin, email expert, personal chef, Brit car mechanic or some such? Racing can be tough when you have no income! mjb. From spitlist at cox.net Thu Mar 11 23:41:57 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2010 23:41:57 -0700 Subject: [Fot] SOVREN CRC - pass while spinning In-Reply-To: <673993c51003112116v5aa7e35dp6a67a7f92602021@mail.gmail.com> References: <673993c51003112116v5aa7e35dp6a67a7f92602021@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I bet he couldn't pull that off again if he tried! -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bob Adams Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2010 10:16 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] SOVREN CRC - pass while spinning This was just posted on another forum. Arnie Loyning spin and pass in his Lotus Elan. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dz4P6e_Yv3c _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From tony at tonydrews.com Thu Mar 11 23:42:14 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 00:42:14 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com> Message-ID: <20100312064246.9EBB2187663@autox.team.net> I thought the RA1's were awesome in the wet, even with not a lot of tread - no standing puddles in that particular race. One of my overall victories. Passed that fast Healey 3000 on the outside in the carousel. Heh, heh. - Tony At 08:38 PM 3/11/2010, LimeyV8 at aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 3/11/2010 8:39:48 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, >robertten1 at aol.com writes: > >I like my Toyo R888's on my Spit GT autocrosser, originally bought as wet >weather tires but have found them to be excellent in the dry as well. ( >185r60x13 ) > > > >I got RA1s because Miata racers told me the R888s were terrible in the wet. >what are your thoughts on that? > > >Cheers, >Jack Mc > >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tony at tonydrews.com From igofaster at att.net Fri Mar 12 08:38:06 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 07:38:06 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] amb transponders... Message-ID: <875652.8947.qm@web180702.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I missed the links on AMB transponders last week... where's the deal on the re-charge units?? My new Spitwad is coming tomorrow without transponder and my GT6 is hard wired... kindest regards my fellow Triumpaholics (no pun to Lindsey Lohan) ... Bobby Whitehead From trmarty at hotmail.com Fri Mar 12 11:22:54 2010 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 13:22:54 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> Message-ID: Mark, if your ever at a VTR event (or any other event) and I'm there and my car happens to still be running your more than welcome to co-drive. Now if you beat me in my own car like that other guy that uses his initials for his signature we would have to talk:) Marty > > I'd like to get back to some sort of racing. Moving all this junk around > cleaning up the shop has got me thinking more and more about getting back > at it. Are you sure none of you need a Unix/Linux sys admin, email expert, > personal chef, Brit car mechanic or some such? Racing can be tough when > you have no income! > > > mjb. > _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsofts powerful SPAM protection. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/210850552/direct/01/ From lang at isis.mit.edu Fri Mar 12 12:38:43 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 14:38:43 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Mar 2010, marty sukey wrote: > Mark, if your ever at a VTR event (or any other event) and I'm there and my > car happens to still be running your more than welcome to co-drive. Now if > you beat me in my own car like that other guy that uses his initials for his > signature we would have to talk:) Hey - I resemble that comment! But the results say the car was silver. You have nothing to worry about. Yours was blue. :-) > Marty rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From rjl6n at cstone.net Fri Mar 12 12:58:45 2010 From: rjl6n at cstone.net (rjl6n at cstone.net) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 14:58:45 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4094e235badea1464dea17c613271ba0.squirrel@webmail.ntelos.net> That's OK, both rml and mjb have beaten me in my own car at various times... John > On Fri, 12 Mar 2010, marty sukey wrote: > >> Now if you beat me in my own car like that >> otherguy that uses his initials for his >> signature we would have to talk:) > > Robert M. Lang wrote: > Hey - I resemble that comment! From mark at bradakis.com Fri Mar 12 19:02:35 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 19:02:35 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! Message-ID: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> With all the Laylande parts and DGOE carbs, this car has *GOT* to be worth every penny: http://tinyurl.com/yb8yjud And such a nice shade of British Green. Sheesh. mjb. From spitlist at cox.net Fri Mar 12 19:02:13 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 19:02:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! In-Reply-To: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> References: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> Message-ID: Did they really make TR7's with Dolomite Sprint engines? Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark J Bradakis Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 7:03 PM To: 'Friends of Triumph' Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! With all the Laylande parts and DGOE carbs, this car has *GOT* to be worth every penny: http://tinyurl.com/yb8yjud And such a nice shade of British Green. Sheesh. mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From billb at bnj.com Fri Mar 12 19:05:06 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 16:05:06 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! In-Reply-To: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> References: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <2FAD7D03-4CA7-4F14-AFA4-01AFA7BCC68D@bnj.com> Wow, how very... how you say,... excluseyve. And only $17,000!!??!! quel bargaine. On Mar 12, 2010, at 4:02 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > With all the Laylande parts and DGOE carbs, this car has *GOT* to > be worth every penny: > > http://tinyurl.com/yb8yjud > > And such a nice shade of British Green. > > Sheesh. > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From mark at bradakis.com Fri Mar 12 19:12:52 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 19:12:52 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! In-Reply-To: References: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4B9AF4A4.5080504@bradakis.com> Who was it at the Savannah VTR who had the 7 with the dolly sprint head? I had heat stroke and brake fluid poisoning, I don't remember. mjb. From macdonaldp at rogers.com Fri Mar 12 20:12:08 2010 From: macdonaldp at rogers.com (Paul MacDonald) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 22:12:08 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! In-Reply-To: References: <4B9AF23B.2080502@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <7CA0AB18999645778301297F23B7556B@your4dacd0ea75> A lot of the sprint engine cars were factory rally TR7s. A few were made non rally. Several have been made in North America, but certainly not worth as much as they cost to build, like $3-5000 for a TR7 convertible plus about 3-4 to do the engine, a waste of money to build a coupe, still worth little. Paul http://www.trdrivers.com/tr7_sprint_.html -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Joe Curry Sent: March 12, 2010 9:02 PM To: 'Mark J Bradakis'; 'Friends of Triumph' Subject: Re: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! Did they really make TR7's with Dolomite Sprint engines? Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark J Bradakis Sent: Friday, March 12, 2010 7:03 PM To: 'Friends of Triumph' Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! With all the Laylande parts and DGOE carbs, this car has *GOT* to be worth every penny: http://tinyurl.com/yb8yjud And such a nice shade of British Green. Sheesh. mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/macdonaldp at rogers.com From fasttrs at yahoo.com Fri Mar 12 21:37:21 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 20:37:21 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Cheaper than the GTP car! Message-ID: <969760.79330.qm@web46115.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> The only one I know of in the SE belonged to Hal Doby that lives in Snellville Georgia. I'm not sure he still has it though. Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 12, 2010, at 8:12 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: Who was it at the Savannah VTR who had the 7 with the dolly sprint head? I had heat stroke and brake fluid poisoning, I don't remember. mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From mark at bradakis.com Fri Mar 12 23:41:00 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 23:41:00 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com> Anyone remember Phoenix Stahlflex tires? mjb. From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Sat Mar 13 05:32:50 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 07:32:50 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Peyote Message-ID: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Hi all, I just got my Vintage Motorsport magazine, with the 2010 Annual included. On page 69 is a great photo of Bill Babcock in the Peyote dicing with Cameron Healy's Porsche-Cooper. Nice shot. Bill, is this the "Pooper"? I think it was at the Glen last Sept. I had a late 50's Road and Track Magazine with an article about the Pooper that I took to the Vintage GP. The Pooper was parked near me and I went over to give the magazine to the owner.There was an older fellow there (I have to watch when I start talking about older fellows!) talking with the owner. I was told he had built the original car. He ended up with the magazine. And misty eyes. And the owner bought me lunch. Great bunch, these vintage guys. Bill From lang at isis.mit.edu Sat Mar 13 07:45:00 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 09:45:00 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com> References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com> Message-ID: On Fri, 12 Mar 2010, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > Anyone remember Phoenix Stahlflex tires? Careful, Mark. Comments like that will get you labelled as an Olde Fart! Oddly, those tires were before my time, but if you come across a barn find with a set of those babies on there... > mjb. regards, rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From billb at bnj.com Sat Mar 13 08:43:44 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 05:43:44 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Peyote In-Reply-To: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Yes, it's one of the Poopers, I think there's three, I know there's two--the silver one you saw and a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers. I race with both of them, a fine and spirited competition with guys I trust. Cameron was at the Glen last year in part to make sure the original owner/builder got to see it. His name is on the tip of my tongue but I can't recall it. Cameron is about as nice a guy as you're likely to meet and a hell of a good driver. Besides being competitors we live about 500 yards from each other in Portland, and one island away from each other in Hawaii. Yet somehow the only place we generally get together is the track. On Mar 13, 2010, at 2:32 AM, WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: > Hi all, I just got my Vintage Motorsport magazine, with the 2010 Annual > included. > On page 69 is a great photo of Bill Babcock in the Peyote dicing with Cameron > Healy's Porsche-Cooper. Nice shot. > Bill, is this the "Pooper"? I think it was at the Glen last Sept. > I had a late 50's Road and Track Magazine with an article about the Pooper > that I took to the Vintage GP. The Pooper was parked near me and I went over > to give the magazine to the owner.There was an older fellow there (I have to > watch when I start talking about older fellows!) talking with the owner. I was > told he had built the original car. He ended up with the magazine. And misty > eyes. And the owner bought me lunch. > Great bunch, these vintage guys. > Bill > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From dos_gusanos at msn.com Sat Mar 13 09:04:35 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 09:04:35 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, , <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, , <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, , <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com>, , <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: I bought those Phoenix Tires and they Tranformed my MG Midget. But it wasn't lonng before I needed Yokohama A008's............................Henry Morrison > Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 09:45:00 -0500 > From: lang at isis.mit.edu > To: mark at bradakis.com > CC: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) > > On Fri, 12 Mar 2010, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > > > Anyone remember Phoenix Stahlflex tires? > > Careful, Mark. Comments like that will get you labelled as an Olde Fart! > > Oddly, those tires were before my time, but if you come across a barn find > with a set of those babies on there... > > > mjb. > > regards, > rml > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent > 2010 NER Solo Chair | > Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dos_gusanos at msn.com From britbits at netzero.net Sat Mar 13 21:07:35 2010 From: britbits at netzero.net (britbits at netzero.net) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 04:07:35 GMT Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Message-ID: <20100313.220735.14532.0@webmail19.dca.untd.com> Mark, You are showing your age. ;) In a related fashion, I'm still trying to remember if the Phoenix was the original name or the "secondary" name for the tire, back in the early 80s. I seem to think Semperit bought the rights, after P-S went under. I used to help prep an '67 MGB-GT for concourse, it had the phoenix tires in the back and Pirelli P3s in front. Also a great tire, until I discovered A008s. ;) Cheers, Jim Dallas jgambony at gcecisp.com ---------- Original Message ---------- From: Mark J Bradakis To: FOT Subject: Re: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2010 23:41:00 -0700 Anyone remember Phoenix Stahlflex tires? mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/britbits at netzero.net ____________________________________________________________ Criminal Lawyer Criminal Lawyers - Click here. http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2241/c?cp=37OpWVZovjYg7eurXNfxXwAAJ1GU 0HcZ7PRpF0fndYeeSkVqAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAiFgAAAAA= From mark at bradakis.com Sat Mar 13 21:22:07 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 21:22:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Well I went Autocrossing (need help with tires) In-Reply-To: References: <8f828.5b8c3da7.38cb032f@aol.com>, <673993c51003111920i1de46d57gd55315615bd4dc42@mail.gmail.com>, <673993c51003112057t6425c9b3nb4e90848169c65bb@mail.gmail.com>, <4B99E069.6020902@bradakis.com> <4B9B337C.10700@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <4B9C646F.9000807@bradakis.com> > Careful, Mark. Comments like that will get you labelled as an Olde Fart! > What, who, me? I remember my grandfather talking about them, yep, that's the story, honest, trust me! mjb the greenhorn. From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sat Mar 13 22:15:38 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 22:15:38 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: > a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his VW dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. I have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the Seattle area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed out on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter Revson, et.al.,... those were the guys I had my teenage eyes on. But missed a lot I could have learned in that time. Pete Lovely was a VW dealer/customer. Same for Monte Shelton. But he had everything from Lincoln/Mercury to Ferrari and Aston - Best story I can think of from him is a friend who bought his wife a new RR Corniche convert from Monty's guys. Deal was Monty Shelton Motorcars would install a hitch [to tow a Ventnor V12 speedboat] and they would honor the warranty. [If anyone wants a short dissertation on the early version of the RR TH400 trans. fiasco, let me know]. Anyway, both Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton were customers . Actually great, - no b.s. - easy customers. Though I do remember Pete's very Swedish sense of humor - He had a great ludafisk joke. Point is, I knew both of these guys on a first name basis in the late '70's/early '80's and knew nothing about who they were in any racing context. , Not certain but I think Pete is many years gone but Monty might still be around. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm sure neither would remember me, but I sure remember them - regardless of who they "were". Also brings back memories of Carlos from Alfa of Tacoma - former Ferrari F1 mechanic. Anyone know if he's still around? That saint put up with me poking around his shop as a bored teenager and managed to teach me a bit in the process. Sure does explain that little red Sports Racer though. Now that I think about it, I'm pretty sure I have pics of it at SIR maybe as far back as '69. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM P.S. Tomorrow is Pi Day - 3/14 3.14 --- Pi, my Plum Pi's namesake number and Albert Einstein's birthday. From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sat Mar 13 22:37:12 2010 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 21:37:12 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: Greg, Pete Lovely is still around and was racing his Ferrari TR for several years until he sold it several years ago. He also used to bring his Lotus formula car to the race track loaded on the back of a VW transporter. It was a kick to watch him load it on the flatbed VW, he would jack up the front of the VW and had long ramps and pull the Louts up on it. The VW had extensions on the back a couple of feet long to hold the car. Carlos is still running the Alfa shop with Leno. They seem to be doing okay though I haven't stopped in their lately. I usually see him around at the machine shop. Great that you know these guys and I think its great we have them here in Tacoma. Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" To: "fot Triumph" Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 9:15 PM Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper > On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: >> a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers > > WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his VW > dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north > Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back > shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. I > have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the Seattle > area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. > As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed out > on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter Revson, > et.al.,... those were the guys I had my teenage eyes on. But missed a lot > I could have learned in that time. Pete Lovely was a VW dealer/customer. > Same for Monte Shelton. But he had everything from Lincoln/Mercury to > Ferrari and Aston - Best story I can think of from him is a friend who > bought his wife a new RR Corniche convert from Monty's guys. Deal was > Monty Shelton Motorcars would install a hitch [to tow a Ventnor V12 > speedboat] and they would honor the warranty. [If anyone wants a short > dissertation on the early version of the RR TH400 trans. fiasco, let me > know]. > Anyway, both Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton were customers . Actually > great, - no b.s. - easy customers. Though I do remember Pete's very > Swedish sense of humor - He had a great ludafisk joke. Point is, I knew > both of these guys on a first name basis in the late '70's/early '80's > and knew nothing about who they were in any racing context. , > Not certain but I think Pete is many years gone but Monty might still be > around. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm sure neither would remember > me, but I sure remember them - regardless of who they "were". > Also brings back memories of Carlos from Alfa of Tacoma - former Ferrari > F1 mechanic. Anyone know if he's still around? That saint put up with me > poking around his shop as a bored teenager and managed to teach me a bit > in the process. > > Sure does explain that little red Sports Racer though. Now that I think > about it, I'm pretty sure I have pics of it at SIR maybe as far back as > '69. > > Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > > > P.S. Tomorrow is Pi Day - 3/14 > 3.14 --- Pi, my Plum Pi's namesake number and Albert Einstein's birthday. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/charly at mitchelplumbing.com From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sat Mar 13 23:43:20 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 23:43:20 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae><86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: Thanks Charley, Crazy! Carlos is still doing his thing! If you ever see him, mention the name "Lunker" Hilyer in conjunction with Ferrari # 13133 or a Maserati 3500 and he just might remember me pestering him. I'm sure he [along with lots of others] has no idea how influential he was to me. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Mar 13, 2010, at 10:37 PM, Charly Mitchel wrote: > Greg, Pete Lovely is still around and was racing his Ferrari TR for > several years until he sold it several years ago. He also used to > bring his Lotus formula car to the race track loaded on the back of > a VW transporter. It was a kick to watch him load it on the flatbed > VW, he would jack up the front of the VW and had long ramps and > pull the Louts up on it. The VW had extensions on the back a > couple of feet long to hold the car. > Carlos is still running the Alfa shop with Leno. They seem to be > doing okay though I haven't stopped in their lately. I usually see > him around at the machine shop. Great that you know these guys and > I think its great we have them here in Tacoma. > Charly Mitchel > TR6 #44 > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" > > To: "fot Triumph" > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 9:15 PM > Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper From norlinengineering at comcast.net Sat Mar 13 23:55:59 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2010 22:55:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3293C19C138B4662B17279C5CFE7281B@TOSHIBALAPTOP> "but Monty might still be around. Please correct me if I'm wrong." Monte's still around. He came by and visited with me last weekend at PIR. It was the opening SCCA regional. I had the Spitfire out to get my annual tech and was working on some prep for the upcoming Double National at Thunderhill when he stopped by. Monte normally drives a 935, but last year ran against me in a couple of races in his HP Rabbit. Great guy and a very good racer. Jim Norlin From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Sun Mar 14 00:02:57 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 02:02:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: <00fe01cac344$61268fb0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Hi Greg, if my memory is right, Monte Sheldon used to race CanAm cars. Small world. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" To: "fot Triumph" Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 12:15 AM Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper > On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: > > a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers > > WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his > VW dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north > Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back > shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. > I have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the > Seattle area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. > As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed > out on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter > Revson, et.al.,... those were the guys I had my teenage eyes on. But > missed a lot I could have learned in that time. Pete Lovely was a VW > dealer/customer. Same for Monte Shelton. But he had everything from > Lincoln/Mercury to Ferrari and Aston - Best story I can think of from > him is a friend who bought his wife a new RR Corniche convert from > Monty's guys. Deal was Monty Shelton Motorcars would install a hitch > [to tow a Ventnor V12 speedboat] and they would honor the warranty. > [If anyone wants a short dissertation on the early version of the RR > TH400 trans. fiasco, let me know]. > Anyway, both Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton were customers . Actually > great, - no b.s. - easy customers. Though I do remember Pete's very > Swedish sense of humor - He had a great ludafisk joke. Point is, I > knew both of these guys on a first name basis in the late '70's/early > '80's and knew nothing about who they were in any racing context. , > Not certain but I think Pete is many years gone but Monty might still > be around. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm sure neither would > remember me, but I sure remember them - regardless of who they "were". > Also brings back memories of Carlos from Alfa of Tacoma - former > Ferrari F1 mechanic. Anyone know if he's still around? That saint put > up with me poking around his shop as a bored teenager and managed to > teach me a bit in the process. > > Sure does explain that little red Sports Racer though. Now that I > think about it, I'm pretty sure I have pics of it at SIR maybe as far > back as '69. > > Greg "Lunker" Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > > > P.S. Tomorrow is Pi Day - 3/14 > 3.14 --- Pi, my Plum Pi's namesake number and Albert Einstein's > birthday. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Sun Mar 14 00:12:48 2010 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 00:12:48 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: <00fe01cac344$61268fb0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> <00fe01cac344$61268fb0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <4255BCAD-8658-40FD-8297-B9D25A0F81AF@earthlink.net> That's what I mean. He raced EVERYTHING but was just a used car guy to me. Greg "Lunker" Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Mar 14, 2010, at 12:02 AM, WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: > Hi Greg, if my memory is right, Monte Sheldon used to race CanAm > cars. > Small world. > Bill----- Original Message ----- > From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" > To: "fot Triumph" > Sent: Sunday, March 14, 2010 12:15 AM > Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper > > >> On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: >>> a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers >> >> WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his >> VW dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north >> Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back >> shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. >> I have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the >> Seattle area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. >> As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed >> out on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter >> Revson, et.al.,... those were the guys I had my teenage eyes on. But >> missed a lot I could have learned in that time. Pete Lovely was a VW >> dealer/customer. Same for Monte Shelton. But he had everything from >> Lincoln/Mercury to Ferrari and Aston - Best story I can think of from >> him is a friend who bought his wife a new RR Corniche convert from >> Monty's guys. Deal was Monty Shelton Motorcars would install a hitch >> [to tow a Ventnor V12 speedboat] and they would honor the warranty. >> [If anyone wants a short dissertation on the early version of the RR >> TH400 trans. fiasco, let me know]. >> Anyway, both Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton were customers . Actually >> great, - no b.s. - easy customers. Though I do remember Pete's very >> Swedish sense of humor - He had a great ludafisk joke. Point is, I >> knew both of these guys on a first name basis in the late '70's/early >> '80's and knew nothing about who they were in any racing context. , >> Not certain but I think Pete is many years gone but Monty might still >> be around. Please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm sure neither would >> remember me, but I sure remember them - regardless of who they >> "were". >> Also brings back memories of Carlos from Alfa of Tacoma - former >> Ferrari F1 mechanic. Anyone know if he's still around? That saint put >> up with me poking around his shop as a bored teenager and managed to >> teach me a bit in the process. >> >> Sure does explain that little red Sports Racer though. Now that I >> think about it, I'm pretty sure I have pics of it at SIR maybe as far >> back as '69. >> >> Greg "Lunker" Hilyer >> TR4 #314 >> Albuquerque NM >> >> >> P.S. Tomorrow is Pi Day - 3/14 >> 3.14 --- Pi, my Plum Pi's namesake number and Albert Einstein's >> birthday. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ > lunkercars at earthlink.net From billb at bnj.com Sun Mar 14 09:14:23 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2010 05:14:23 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Pete Lovely's Pooper In-Reply-To: References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: Both Pete and Monte are alive and well, and still drive hard and fast. I usually see Pete at races like the Wine Country, occasionally at NW races. I was chasing Pete's Lotus at Sears when Peyote's steering came apart. Usually race with Monte at the Rose Cup in Portland. Both great guys. On Mar 13, 2010, at 7:15 PM, Greg Lunker Hilyer wrote: > On Mar 13, 2010, at 8:43 AM, Bill Babcock wrote: >> a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by Denny Akers > > WOW!! I used to sell Pete Lovely cars from the auto auction for his VW dealership in Ballard Wa. [I think. .. Ballard... an area of north Seattle]. Remember seeing a retired Porsche powered racer in the back shop area. Never knew what it was until today. Definitely the Pooper. I have to assume Denny Akers is of Akers Auto Acres also from the Seattle area. Used to sell him cars too - from the salvage pool. > As much as I've thought I knew about racing in those years, I missed out on some gems. Peter Gregg, Hurley Haywood, Mark Donahue, Peter Revson, et.al.,... From jcjcarrera at comcast.net Sun Mar 14 21:31:21 2010 From: jcjcarrera at comcast.net (jcjcarrera at comcast.net) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 03:31:21 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Shelton and Lovely Message-ID: <2037566255.847371268623881311.JavaMail.root@sz0079a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> As a resident of the Pacific NW the last 40 years, I have read with great interest the comments on Pete Lovely and Monte Shelton-two legendsB on the West Coast.B As Bill Babcock pointed out, they are both very accomplished racers. In fact, I have an old Sports Car Illustrated in my files from the late 50's or early 60'sB which has a picture of Pete somewhere in Europe with the Lotus Gran Prix team. Apparently , he was a good enough racer to draw the attention of Lotus and had an extended trial with them. Actually ran some races in what is now F1.B He has a gorgeous well endowed blond with him in the photo. I believe this lady turned out to be his wife Nevely whom I met at a party in Tacoma in the early 1980's. What drew my attention to her was the shirt she was wearing. On the front of the shirt was the rear end of a car with two round red taillights blinking in a provocative location. Nevely passed away a few years ago. Some other tidbits on Pete, he won the first ever professional race at Laguna Seca . My first Monterey Historics was in 94 when Ferrari was the featured marque and he was racing his recently restored Testa Rossa . I marvelled how precise of a driver he was as he shifted at the exact same spot from 2nd to 3rd on the straight lap after lap. He won his race, cleaned up the TR and took it to Pebble the next day and won his class there! He had a VW dealership in Fife, WA (suburb of Tacoma)B for many years which he sold, but kept the buildings and property and leased them to a " Datsun " dealer and then a Volvo dealership. Not sure if he still owns the property. As Charly Mitchel pointed out, Carlos and his brother Leno still run Alfa of Tacoma in a building owned by Pete and I believe he still owns the shop run by Carlos. Monte is a Porsche legend from the 70's and 80's running 911 RSR's and 935's, etc. His son Neal is also an outstanding driver and probably could have gone pro but manages the family car business in downtown Portland. When I had a business meeting with Neal about ten years ago, he toured me through their dealership and garage in the back street. Great race cars, rare classics from the 30's and even a TR4 with under 10K miles! Not sure if he still has the TR.B Shelton MotorsB still sell Jags and Saabs and Monte and Neal share a Porsche 962 in vintage IMSA races. The thing that always impressed me about the Pete and Neal was their accessibility and friendliness. John James TR4 #116 B From igofaster at att.net Mon Mar 15 09:34:10 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 08:34:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment Message-ID: <973308.64134.qm@web180710.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. I'll give a photo shop on the cars when I get some time. I need to adjust the torque on the 1300 cc head and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. The Spit has been raced sine 1973 from Seattle to Huntington Beach with the VARA. I don't think CVAR is going to let me run the car so much as there is a full cage which extends beyond the firewall to the front area of the frame and radiator... we'll see.... It was a great deal on the Spitwad and I'll get a chance to run it with other clubs I'm sure... All the best.... Bobby Whitehead 1971 TR6 1970 GT6 DP 1965 Spitfire EP and ONE happy wife....... well..... the TR6 IS her car... From norlinengineering at comcast.net Mon Mar 15 10:52:29 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 09:52:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <973308.64134.qm@web180710.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <5E77D78A789E432F9E620FBC7023B30F@TOSHIBALAPTOP> The way I adjust the valves on the Spit is to first loosen all the jam nuts. Rotate the engine until two of the valves are fully open or nearly so. Then adjust the mirror image valves of the two that are down. In otherwords, if 1 and 7 are down, adjust 8 and 2. Keep doing this until all the jam nuts are tight again. The Spit goes on the chassis dyno this afternoon. We're heading out to Thunderhill for the Double National on Wed evening. Any other FOT'er going to be there? Jim Norlin -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bobby Whitehead Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 8:34 AM To: FoT Triumph Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. I'll give a photo shop on the cars when I get some time. I need to adjust the torque on the 1300 cc head and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. The Spit has been raced sine 1973 from Seattle to Huntington Beach with the VARA. I don't think CVAR is going to let me run the car so much as there is a full cage which extends beyond the firewall to the front area of the frame and radiator... we'll see.... It was a great deal on the Spitwad and I'll get a chance to run it with other clubs I'm sure... All the best.... Bobby Whitehead 1971 TR6 1970 GT6 DP 1965 Spitfire EP and ONE happy wife....... well..... the TR6 IS her car... _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/norlinengineering at comcast.net From Gt6steve at aol.com Mon Mar 15 11:06:28 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:06:28 EDT Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment Message-ID: <4d14b.4be89180.38cfc314@aol.com> I LOVE Thunderhill. Just wish it wasn't so far away... Good Luck and have a great time. In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:02:24 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, norlinengineering at comcast.net writes: The way I adjust the valves on the Spit is to first loosen all the jam nuts. Rotate the engine until two of the valves are fully open or nearly so. Then adjust the mirror image valves of the two that are down. In otherwords, if 1 and 7 are down, adjust 8 and 2. Keep doing this until all the jam nuts are tight again. The Spit goes on the chassis dyno this afternoon. We're heading out to Thunderhill for the Double National on Wed evening. Any other FOT'er going to be there? Jim Norlin -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bobby Whitehead Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 8:34 AM To: FoT Triumph Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. I'll give a photo shop on the cars when I get some time. I need to adjust the torque on the 1300 cc head and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. The Spit has been raced sine 1973 from Seattle to Huntington Beach with the VARA. I don't think CVAR is going to let me run the car so much as there is a full cage which extends beyond the firewall to the front area of the frame and radiator... we'll see.... It was a great deal on the Spitwad and I'll get a chance to run it with other clubs I'm sure... All the best.... Bobby Whitehead 1971 TR6 1970 GT6 DP 1965 Spitfire EP and ONE happy wife....... well..... the TR6 IS her car... _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/norlinengineering at comcast.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com From mark at bradakis.com Mon Mar 15 11:06:53 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:06:53 -0600 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <973308.64134.qm@web180710.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <973308.64134.qm@web180710.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4B9E692D.8090307@bradakis.com> Bobby Whitehead wrote: > We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now > a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. > > > Nice. > and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. > > Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and exhaust for some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed and the intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that cylinder's mate. On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the firing order it goes fairly quickly. mjb. From Gt6steve at aol.com Mon Mar 15 11:08:47 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 13:08:47 EDT Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment Message-ID: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. Pro's and cons? In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:07:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, mark at bradakis.com writes: Bobby Whitehead wrote: > We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 and now > a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. > > > Nice. > and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual yet. > > Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and exhaust for some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed and the intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that cylinder's mate. On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the firing order it goes fairly quickly. mjb. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com From mark at bradakis.com Mon Mar 15 11:18:40 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 11:18:40 -0600 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> References: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> Message-ID: <4B9E6BF0.8000301@bradakis.com> Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: > Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we > missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? > > I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. > > Pro's and cons? I like my way, as it is easy to keep track of which valves have been done, and I think it takes fewer turns of the crank. In theory, though, either method should be able to cover all the valves withing two revolutions of the crank. mjb. From dmitchel at sbcglobal.net Mon Mar 15 11:38:02 2010 From: dmitchel at sbcglobal.net (Doug Mitchell) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 10:38:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 Message-ID: <563670.46921.qm@web80807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Amici, Check out this Racetorations "resto-mod". http://www.dep-o.co.uk/page339.asp Doug From tlizzard at msn.com Mon Mar 15 15:57:08 2010 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 17:57:08 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <563670.46921.qm@web80807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <563670.46921.qm@web80807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: WOW! Just wow! Terry Stetler From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Mon Mar 15 18:58:53 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 20:58:53 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> Wow is an understatement. How did he get the stance? TR4 rear end and spacers up front or did he do it with custom offset wheels. Looks great! M From n197tr4 at cs.com Mon Mar 15 19:11:22 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 21:11:22 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Peyote In-Reply-To: <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> References: <00d001cac2a9$4c192ba0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> <86C3D284-7797-449B-9B26-70E373D4EA7D@bnj.com> Message-ID: <8CC92BCBA0497C3-A64-447F@webmail-m006.sysops.aol.com> That Pooper was also owned by one of our favorite midwestern racers, 'DUCK' WADDLE. -----Original Message----- From: Bill Babcock To: WILLIAM TOBIN Cc: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Sat, Mar 13, 2010 9:43 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Peyote Yes, it's one of the Poopers, I think there's three, I know there's two--the ilver one you saw and a red one built by Pete Lovely and currently owned by enny Akers. I race with both of them, a fine and spirited competition with uys I trust. Cameron was at the Glen last year in part to make sure the riginal owner/builder got to see it. His name is on the tip of my tongue but can't recall it. Cameron is about as nice a guy as you're likely to meet and a hell of a good river. Besides being competitors we live about 500 yards from each other in ortland, and one island away from each other in Hawaii. Yet somehow the only lace we generally get together is the track. n Mar 13, 2010, at 2:32 AM, WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: > Hi all, I just got my Vintage Motorsport magazine, with the 2010 Annual included. On page 69 is a great photo of Bill Babcock in the Peyote dicing with ameron Healy's Porsche-Cooper. Nice shot. Bill, is this the "Pooper"? I think it was at the Glen last Sept. I had a late 50's Road and Track Magazine with an article about the Pooper that I took to the Vintage GP. The Pooper was parked near me and I went ver to give the magazine to the owner.There was an older fellow there (I have o watch when I start talking about older fellows!) talking with the owner. I as told he had built the original car. He ended up with the magazine. And isty eyes. And the owner bought me lunch. Great bunch, these vintage guys. Bill _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com _______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From adams910 at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 20:33:05 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 22:33:05 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> References: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's farther along than the pictures show. I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. From n197tr4 at cs.com Mon Mar 15 21:25:38 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 23:25:38 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> References: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8CC92CF7BE8CDA9-5A4C-8DE5@webmail-m072.sysops.aol.com> Not only have we been in contact with, I was planning to nominate him to the FOT. And I invited hin to join us at Heartland Park in August. Coincidently, I will be in his neighborhood of New Orleans tomorrow afternoon. Always a small world when you are a FOT. >From the Natchez Trace.....Jackson, MS -----Original Message----- From: Bob Adams To: Mark Eginton Cc: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, Mar 15, 2010 9:33 pm Subject: Re: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 ttp://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's arther along than the pictures show. I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. _______________________________________________ ot at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com From triosan at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 22:06:48 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2010 21:06:48 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Tim Suddard email address Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003152106k2ebb9817yedce92d21b2a93a4@mail.gmail.com> Tim, I need your email address. I have several pretty nice pictures of the TR250K you might like to see, if not use, in conjunction with the Mitty this year. Bill Hart and Tony Garmey willing that is. Oh, and Tom Krieger also. Chuck -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Tue Mar 16 10:20:06 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 09:20:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> References: <4B9ED7CD.1040506@twcny.rr.com> <673993c51003151933m36ec39a3n81b54f4e82523f00@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <16C93800-E85A-4522-93F6-50A45107BCB7@earthlink.net> Well that one looks a little too nice. A jewel of a tractor engine. ~Steve On Mar 15, 2010, at 7:33 PM, Bob Adams wrote: Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's farther along than the pictures show. I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From jerryvv at roadrunner.com Tue Mar 16 11:37:43 2010 From: jerryvv at roadrunner.com (jerryvv at roadrunner.com) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 17:37:43 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <16C93800-E85A-4522-93F6-50A45107BCB7@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20100316173743.069SK.599315.root@cdptpa-web08-z02> If it wasn't for all of the pop up ads it might be an interesting site to view. One of the ads would not go away so the website went away, never to be viewed by me again. JVV ---- Steven Belfer wrote: > Well that one looks a little too nice. A jewel of a tractor engine. > > ~Steve > > > On Mar 15, 2010, at 7:33 PM, Bob Adams wrote: > > Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 > http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's > farther along than the pictures show. > > I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com From billb at bnj.com Tue Mar 16 11:46:28 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 07:46:28 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Resto-Mod TR3 In-Reply-To: <20100316173743.069SK.599315.root@cdptpa-web08-z02> References: <20100316173743.069SK.599315.root@cdptpa-web08-z02> Message-ID: <7A72E5F7-FEA3-453C-AA3B-ACA7E2E12777@bnj.com> You need a better browser, or at least better configuration. Firefox, Safari and Chrome all have pretty good pop up protection. I haven't used IE for years, but I assume it does to. On Mar 16, 2010, at 7:37 AM, wrote: > If it wasn't for all of the pop up ads it might be an interesting site to view. > One of the ads would not go away so the website went away, never to be viewed by me again. > JVV > > ---- Steven Belfer wrote: >> Well that one looks a little too nice. A jewel of a tractor engine. >> >> ~Steve >> >> >> On Mar 15, 2010, at 7:33 PM, Bob Adams wrote: >> >> Speaking of restomods, check out this TR4 >> http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/yy77/Tabcon1/ . I pretty sure he's >> farther along than the pictures show. >> >> I know some on the FOT have been in contact with him. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jerryvv at roadrunner.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From cartravel at pobox.com Tue Mar 16 12:40:23 2010 From: cartravel at pobox.com (Larry Young) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 13:40:23 -0500 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> References: <4d48c.642c2196.38cfc39f@aol.com> Message-ID: <4B9FD097.9020803@pobox.com> Ok, I'll jump in and try to make this way too technical. Both methods are using the fact that the cylinder "mate" has it's lobes 180 degrees apart. The rule of 9's is a bit more explicit, because it identifies the exact lobes which are 180 degrees apart. For a 110 lobe separation and taking the first lobe to be 0, the other lobes are at angles of: 0, 110, 20, 270, 90, 200, 290, 180 You can see that when lobe 1 is at zero lobe 8 is at 180 or exactly opposite. Since two of the lobes are within 20 degrees of each other, you might as well set those at the same time as Jim and Steve suggest. Mark is setting the valves when the cam is split between intake and exhaust centers. When the first two lobes are at +55 and -55, he would set the last two lobes, which will be 55 degrees on each side of 180. I have a small concern with this method, because some lift curves can have ramps that extend 110 degrees are more from the centerline. Adding that to the 55 gives you 165, which gives an allowance of 15 degrees for error. If you're going to use this method, you need to make sure your cam doesn't have long ramps. I use the other method for this reason. Larry Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: > Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we > missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? > > I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. > > Pro's and cons? > > > In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:07:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > mark at bradakis.com writes: > > Bobby Whitehead wrote: > >> We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 >> > and now > >> a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. >> >> >> >> > Nice. > > >> and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual >> > yet. > >> >> > > Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and > exhaust for > some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed > and the > intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that > cylinder's mate. > On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the > firing order it goes fairly quickly. > > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cartravel at pobox.com From kaskas at cox.net Tue Mar 16 13:51:49 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 12:51:49 -0700 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <4B9FD097.9020803@pobox.com> Message-ID: <20100316155149.MPO7U.91815.imail@fed1rmwml36> I too always used the rule of 9. Takes all worries out of the cam design. Good comment of the ramps being long on some designs, that was another thing I liked a lot. ---- Larry Young wrote: ============= Ok, I'll jump in and try to make this way too technical. Both methods are using the fact that the cylinder "mate" has it's lobes 180 degrees apart. The rule of 9's is a bit more explicit, because it identifies the exact lobes which are 180 degrees apart. For a 110 lobe separation and taking the first lobe to be 0, the other lobes are at angles of: 0, 110, 20, 270, 90, 200, 290, 180 You can see that when lobe 1 is at zero lobe 8 is at 180 or exactly opposite. Since two of the lobes are within 20 degrees of each other, you might as well set those at the same time as Jim and Steve suggest. Mark is setting the valves when the cam is split between intake and exhaust centers. When the first two lobes are at +55 and -55, he would set the last two lobes, which will be 55 degrees on each side of 180. I have a small concern with this method, because some lift curves can have ramps that extend 110 degrees are more from the centerline. Adding that to the 55 gives you 165, which gives an allowance of 15 degrees for error. If you're going to use this method, you need to make sure your cam doesn't have long ramps. I use the other method for this reason. Larry Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: > Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we > missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? > > I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. > > Pro's and cons? > > > In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:07:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, > mark at bradakis.com writes: > > Bobby Whitehead wrote: > >> We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 >> > and now > >> a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. >> >> >> >> > Nice. > > >> and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual >> > yet. > >> >> > > Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and > exhaust for > some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed > and the > intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that > cylinder's mate. > On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the > firing order it goes fairly quickly. > > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cartravel at pobox.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 17:10:53 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 16:10:53 -0700 Subject: [Fot] spitfire head torque and valve adjustment In-Reply-To: <20100316155149.MPO7U.91815.imail@fed1rmwml36> References: <4B9FD097.9020803@pobox.com> <20100316155149.MPO7U.91815.imail@fed1rmwml36> Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003161610i45352e8cwa15f1a15ed5aa59b@mail.gmail.com> Course those of us with a 6 use the rule of 13. On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 12:51 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > I too always used the rule of 9. Takes all worries out of the cam design. Good comment of the ramps being long on some designs, that was another thing I liked a lot. > ---- Larry Young wrote: > > ============= > Ok, I'll jump in and try to make this way too technical. Both methods > are using the fact that the cylinder "mate" has it's lobes 180 degrees > apart. The rule of 9's is a bit more explicit, because it identifies > the exact lobes which are 180 degrees apart. For a 110 lobe separation > and taking the first lobe to be 0, the other lobes are at angles of: > 0, 110, 20, 270, 90, 200, 290, 180 > You can see that when lobe 1 is at zero lobe 8 is at 180 or exactly > opposite. Since two of the lobes are within 20 degrees of each other, > you might as well set those at the same time as Jim and Steve suggest. > Mark is setting the valves when the cam is split between intake and > exhaust centers. When the first two lobes are at +55 and -55, he would > set the last two lobes, which will be 55 degrees on each side of 180. I > have a small concern with this method, because some lift curves can have > ramps that extend 110 degrees are more from the centerline. Adding that > to the 55 gives you 165, which gives an allowance of 15 degrees for > error. If you're going to use this method, you need to make sure your > cam doesn't have long ramps. I use the other method for this reason. > Larry > > Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: >> Now's the opportunity for the "Great Rocker Debate". Seeing as how we >> missed "Is it Vintage" this winter? >> >> I adjust as Jim mentioned, Chuck adjusts on the rock as Mark says. >> >> Pro's and cons? >> >> >> In a message dated 3/15/2010 10:07:03 A.M. Pacific Daylight Time, >> mark at bradakis.com writes: >> >> Bobby Whitehead wrote: >> >>> We'll we're are a three Triumph car family, two race cars now. The GT6 >>> >> and now >> >>> a 1965 Spitfire we bought from Mac out in L.A. >>> >>> >>> >>> >> Nice. >> >> >>> and I need the valve adjustment sequence as I do not have a shop manual >>> >> yet. >> >>> >>> >> >> Normally the way I do valves is turn the crank until the intake and >> exhaust for >> some cylinder are 'on the rock' where the exhaust is just about closed >> and the >> intake just starting to open. Then I adjust the valves for that >> cylinder's mate. >> On the Spits that would be cylinders 1 & 4 and 2 & 3. If you follow the >> firing order it goes fairly quickly. >> >> >> mjb. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cartravel at pobox.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net > > > > -- > Never be beaten by equipment > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/triosan at gmail.com > > > -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Tue Mar 16 18:02:12 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2010 17:02:12 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: spitfire head torque and valve adjustment References: <21170FFA-CF4F-461D-A104-A93924C18B2E@earthlink.net> Message-ID: Here's a cool video of a guy adjusting valves on an MG. If you haven't done it too many times, you may find this helpful or at least mildly entertaining. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fezXUwVfH7U ~Steve From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Wed Mar 17 10:12:48 2010 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 12:12:48 -0400 Subject: [Fot] FW: tr3 race clutch?? In-Reply-To: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Amici: Can anyone help Jim out? I haven't been paying attention! There used to be a way to search the archives, but I don't see it now. Just a list of all the threads. John H. Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 08:36:05 -0700 From: jimbooth019 at yahoo.com Subject: tr3 race clutch?? To: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Hey JR, We are working on a Peerless GT vintage race car.(TR3 powered) Looking for performance clutch. any suggestions? jim From dave at microworks.net Wed Mar 17 10:23:16 2010 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 09:23:16 -0700 Subject: [Fot] FW: tr3 race clutch?? In-Reply-To: References: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4BA101F4.7020204@microworks.net> Look down at the bottom of the email. Click on the link to the Archives Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Select "fot" from the Names column - not Date or Thread from the Current Index column John Herrera wrote: > Amici: > > > > Can anyone help Jim out? I haven't been paying attention! > > > > There used to be a way to search the archives, but I don't see it now. Just a > list of all the threads. > > > > John H. > > > > Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 08:36:05 -0700 > From: jimbooth019 at yahoo.com > Subject: tr3 race clutch?? > To: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com > > > > > > Hey JR, > We are working on a Peerless GT vintage race car.(TR3 powered) Looking for > performance clutch. any suggestions? > jim > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dave at microworks.net From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 17 10:39:29 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 10:39:29 -0600 Subject: [Fot] FW: tr3 race clutch?? In-Reply-To: <4BA101F4.7020204@microworks.net> References: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <4BA101F4.7020204@microworks.net> Message-ID: <4BA105C1.5050503@bradakis.com> David W. Riddle wrote: > Look down at the bottom of the email. > > Click on the link to the Archives > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Select "fot" from the Names column - not Date or Thread from the > Current Index column If you do select 'Date' or 'Thread' from the archive page, you should still get a search box right up under the heading. Interesting. If I select 'Date' I get commercial Google ads under the search box and above the listings. Those are the kind that pay me a few cents when people click on them. If I go to the 'Thread' listing, I get a non-paying public service ad. I recently made some changes, I guess it is taking Google a while to get everything updated on their end. mjb. From igofaster at att.net Wed Mar 17 11:35:22 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 10:35:22 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> eBay item 140391785085.... some people should never TOUCH a triumph Bobby Whitehad From rjl6n at cstone.net Wed Mar 17 11:47:58 2010 From: rjl6n at cstone.net (rjl6n at cstone.net) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 13:47:58 -0400 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <726f2de542a079fa64e723d559b639d7.squirrel@webmail.ntelos.net> That just might be the definition of "fugly" John On Wed, March 17, 2010 1:35 pm, Bobby Whitehead wrote: > eBay item 140391785085.... > > some people should never TOUCH a triumph > > > Bobby Whitehad > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rjl at gt-classics.com From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 17 11:59:56 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 11:59:56 -0600 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> That's the same car I pointed out a couple of weeks ago. Nobody wanted it then, wonder if it might sell this time. mjb. From emanteno at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 12:13:33 2010 From: emanteno at gmail.com (Irv Korey) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 13:13:33 -0500 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> Message-ID: <354a1781003171113g2ab1a7d2mad42268a18703ad3@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, Mar 17, 2010 at 12:59 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > That's the same car I pointed out a couple of weeks ago. > Nobody wanted it then, wonder if it might sell this time. > There's no reserve on it now. Maybe someone will buy it and put it out of its misery. Irv From bownes at seiri.com Wed Mar 17 12:17:46 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 14:17:46 -0400 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> Message-ID: Maybe we can raise a fund to have it crushed. On Wed, Mar 17, 2010 at 1:59 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > That's the same car I pointed out a couple of weeks ago. > Nobody wanted it then, wonder if it might sell this time. > > mjb. > > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 17 12:19:00 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 12:19:00 -0600 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <354a1781003171113g2ab1a7d2mad42268a18703ad3@mail.gmail.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> <354a1781003171113g2ab1a7d2mad42268a18703ad3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4BA11D14.6000209@bradakis.com> Irv Korey wrote: > > > There's no reserve on it now. Maybe someone will buy it and put it out > of its misery. > Yep. $500 seems about right. Actually, once that hideous top is removed it might be a nice looking car. And as mentioned before, it looks like someone did a good job in relocating the hood bulge. mjb. From bownes at seiri.com Wed Mar 17 12:28:41 2010 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 14:28:41 -0400 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) In-Reply-To: <4BA11D14.6000209@bradakis.com> References: <181692.80155.qm@web180712.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <4BA1189C.9000303@bradakis.com> <354a1781003171113g2ab1a7d2mad42268a18703ad3@mail.gmail.com> <4BA11D14.6000209@bradakis.com> Message-ID: 24 hours of lemons! On Wed, Mar 17, 2010 at 2:19 PM, Mark J Bradakis wrote: > Irv Korey wrote: > >> >> >> There's no reserve on it now. Maybe someone will buy it and put it out of >> its misery. >> >> > Yep. $500 seems about right. Actually, once that hideous top is removed > it might be a nice looking car. And as mentioned before, it looks like > someone > did a good job in relocating the hood bulge. > > mjb. > > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bownes at web9.com From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Wed Mar 17 13:03:26 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 14:03:26 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR transmission bushing I.D. and O.D. Message-ID: Friends, Are there specs for the I.D. and O.D. for the big TR transmissions? I've rebuilt a bunch of them over the years and occasionally I have trouble with a tranny that doesn't like downshifting into second gear. I think that the gear is hanging up on the O.D. of the bush and the bushing and gear start spinning on the mainshaft, screwing up the speed matching of the synchros. I build them with the bush tight enough that it should not spin on the mainshaft as long as the gear is spinning freely on the bush. I suspect bad repro bushes. Does anyone have an opinion or other experiences? Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 From adcronin at ameritech.net Wed Mar 17 14:15:41 2010 From: adcronin at ameritech.net (A Daniel Cronin) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 13:15:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Tabcon1 Photobucket Picture sequence---RATCO Frame Message-ID: <250880.58152.qm@web81304.mail.mud.yahoo.com> 3/17 Lists The site above was pointed out by Bob Adams a day or so ago in an email about Restomods. ( http://s779.photobucket.com/albums/y77/Tabcon1/ ) and contained photos of a very nice upgrade of the TR four cylinder motor---along with four frames showing RATCO's newly manufactured frame for this TR4 "restomod". I noticed that a couple of the photos had a red cross bar spanning the rear shock mounting brackets and since I also have one of Tony's (RATCO) new frames for my "restomod TR2 project" I inquired about this unfamiliar connector link. Here is the story: RATCO also makes tube shock conversion kits for TR2/3b's and rear sway bar kits. When the k as installed on some original frame vehicles there were isolated incidents of the shock brackets breaking at the frame joint, so RATCO set out to rectify the problem or stop selling the kits for original framed cars (no problems with the new frames as they are much stronger). I will quote from Tony's response as follows; "The rotation force of the lever shock on a stock frame is longitudinal and the rotation of the tube shock conversion on the bracket/frame is transverse. That places a different set of forces on the frame rails which in any case, connects the shock system to the structural base. The new tube shock mounts also have a longer are and hence a greater rotational torque. In old frames, if the weld between the shock bracket and frame has lost some structural integrity, then the chance of a break is possible. The red cross bar in the photos on Tabcon1's site was designed to transfer some of the shock pulse to the other side of the frame. The forces in the tube conversion rotate around the longitudinal axis so this brace transfers force to the opposite side during a pulse to any one side. When a simultaneous shock is hit, the effect is nilled by the brace which then takes the full force of the pulse. This "fix" will not help however if an original frame is structurally unsound." I am passing this information along in case anyone out there had preformed the tube shock and or rear sway bar upgrades on an original frame TR and is looking for a bit of "insurance" is unsure of their frames true condition. NFI Regards, Dan Cronin From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Wed Mar 17 14:33:49 2010 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 16:33:49 -0400 Subject: [Fot] FW: tr3 race clutch?? In-Reply-To: <4BA105C1.5050503@bradakis.com> References: <111375.10223.qm@web37305.mail.mud.yahoo.com>, , <4BA101F4.7020204@microworks.net>, <4BA105C1.5050503@bradakis.com> Message-ID: > If you do select 'Date' or 'Thread' from the archive page, you should still > get a search box right up under the heading. Now I see it. Thanks! John From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Wed Mar 17 19:16:03 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 20:16:03 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR transmission bushing I.D. and O.D. References: Message-ID: <5F59B0FA8CFF4D4EB1AFFF12763A0E2E@latitudefb1e41> Thanks to Bob Lang, Randall and Dean Tetterton for their input. I got home tonight and finished tearing the gearbox down. What I though looked like a nice set of gears had 2 problems. The bronze top hat bushing was broken (answering the question why it didn't want to shift down) and the forward countershaft busing was galling the countershaft. This is particularly "galling" to me since I spent time making sure the bearing all rolled, cleaning out the rollers and WD40 them until they rolled freely. The advice I got included the fact the TRF bronze top hats are too tight and need to be opened up. Mine was from TRF. Other advice was that the mainshaft gets galled from metal particles rubbing between the bushings and mainshaft. This happens when gearboxes fail, like failing galled countereshafts. Although I remember cleaning and polishing the shaft, it doesn't look perfect anymore. This would indicate that the bushings were not freely spinning on the shaft. The gears all spin on the bushings. Lesson learned. I didn't think the bushings needed much clearance when placed on the shaft. I made them just loose enough to push them on. I don't know if this cause the top hat failure or it was just one of those things, but I think a careful rebuild will fix it. Thanks Bob, Dean amd Randall. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kramer, Robert" To: "FOT" Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2010 2:03 PM Subject: [Fot] TR transmission bushing I.D. and O.D. > Friends, > > Are there specs for the I.D. and O.D. for the big TR transmissions? I've > rebuilt a bunch of them over the years and occasionally I have trouble > with a > tranny that doesn't like downshifting into second gear. I think that the > gear > is hanging up on the O.D. of the bush and the bushing and gear start > spinning > on the mainshaft, screwing up the speed matching of the synchros. I build > them > with the bush tight enough that it should not spin on the mainshaft as > long as > the gear is spinning freely on the bush. I suspect bad repro bushes. Does > anyone have an opinion or other experiences? > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From vintage.racer at comcast.net Wed Mar 17 19:25:18 2010 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 18:25:18 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Great British Film Message-ID: <000001cac639$dfc22a80$9f467f80$@racer@comcast.net> Yes, the subject is MG but this is a great period company film. Classic commentary and music and wonderful footage inside the Abington factory. Gary http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=81695 From mark at bradakis.com Wed Mar 17 21:36:51 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2010 21:36:51 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR transmission bushing I.D. and O.D. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4BA19FD3.1060704@bradakis.com> Kramer, Robert wrote > I've > rebuilt a bunch of them over the years and occasionally I have trouble with a > tranny that doesn't like downshifting into second gear. > Is the polished, conical synchro grabbing face of the gear actually polished and at the proper angle? mjb. From tony at tonydrews.com Sat Mar 20 01:22:27 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 02:22:27 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) Message-ID: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews From dmitchel at sbcglobal.net Sat Mar 20 05:43:36 2010 From: dmitchel at sbcglobal.net (Doug Mitchell) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 07:43:36 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <006301cac822$94141db0$bc3c5910$@net> Funny you should send this link. In a past life, I flew gliders while I was stationed in the UK. I watched it the other day and it reminded me of the great time I had. If you watch it to the end, the same guy has a link to his 'MakerBot' additive manufacturing machine. This is also neat, and brings me to my current day job making AM parts. The MakerBot is a home assembled AM machine that you can link to your computer and make just about anything you can design in CAD. Or you can download parts from Thingiverse. www.makerbot.com and www.thingiverse.com. Doug -- Doug Mitchell dmitchel at sbcglobal.net -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Tony Drews Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 3:22 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/dmitchel at sbcglobal.net From ehusmann53 at yahoo.com Sat Mar 20 06:01:04 2010 From: ehusmann53 at yahoo.com (Ernest Husmann) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 05:01:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <171635.23434.qm@web57613.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Wow, how do I get a ticket on that plane? --- On Sat, 3/20/10, Tony Drews wrote: From: Tony Drews Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) To: fot at autox.team.net Date: Saturday, March 20, 2010, 2:22 AM I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ehusmann53 at yahoo.com From n197tr4 at cs.com Sat Mar 20 08:26:42 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 10:26:42 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <8CC96507EF2920C-91C-DB2E@webmail-m049.sysops.aol.com> The high banks and bluffs of the Missippi River between Lansing and Prairie Du Chien provide some entertainment for low level flying. Landing at Meigs (former) Field while looking up at the Sears (former) Building provides a little of the same sensation for small town Iowa Boys. Especially when the tower control frequency dropped out and there was a scramble to get clearance on ground control. 'WHAT'S YOUR POSITION 32 ALPHA?" "DOWNWIND TO 18" "CLEARED TO LAND!!!!" 1960s radios were not all that reliable. >From a Louisiana Bayou...... -----Original Message----- From: Tony Drews To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Sat, Mar 20, 2010 2:22 am Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com = From tarch at bellsouth.net Sat Mar 20 09:58:26 2010 From: tarch at bellsouth.net (Richard Taylor) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 11:58:26 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <8CC96507EF2920C-91C-DB2E@webmail-m049.sysops.aol.com> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> <8CC96507EF2920C-91C-DB2E@webmail-m049.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <000801cac846$2d5f32c0$881d9840$@net> Wow! That's as far removed to glider flying in the South as it gets! Soaring, down here, is a miserly endeavor. Every moment is spent salvaging altitude and caging airspeeds....kind like driving an over-weight, underpowered TR-4 where momentum is everything. Richard -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of n197tr4 at cs.com Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 10:27 AM To: tony at tonydrews.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) The high banks and bluffs of the Missippi River between Lansing and Prairie Du Chien provide some entertainment for low level flying. Landing at Meigs (former) Field while looking up at the Sears (former) Building provides a little of the same sensation for small town Iowa Boys. Especially when the tower control frequency dropped out and there was a scramble to get clearance on ground control. 'WHAT'S YOUR POSITION 32 ALPHA?" "DOWNWIND TO 18" "CLEARED TO LAND!!!!" 1960s radios were not all that reliable. >From a Louisiana Bayou...... -----Original Message----- From: Tony Drews To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Sat, Mar 20, 2010 2:22 am Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/n197tr4 at cs.com = _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tarch at bellsouth.net From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Sat Mar 20 20:34:04 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 19:34:04 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Message-ID: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl From budscars at comcast.net Sat Mar 20 21:01:31 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 20:01:31 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <184B4D18B4E048B59FD00BC7C2DEC93B@Bud> Woooohoo!....Good Job Guys....Go Baby go!!..Thanks for sending!..terrific stuff...including the Happy Dog running back and forth and the cute little kid slowly moving closer and closer to the excitement! God Bless! Racer Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Mehl" To: "Triumph Friends of" Cc: "Mike Mehl" Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:34 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of > my > race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor > issues > that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the > link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water > leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is > leaking > and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the > bolts) > and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it > around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. > > I am pretty > excited!! > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > > Mike Mehl > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From mark at bradakis.com Sat Mar 20 22:28:40 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 22:28:40 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4BA5A078.7040501@bradakis.com> Nice!! mjb. From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sat Mar 20 22:44:59 2010 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2010 21:44:59 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1384B905A5AA4AF98F812C8AE96D67CE@desktop> Good work Mike, see ya soon at the track! Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Mehl" To: "Triumph Friends of" Cc: "Mike Mehl" Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:34 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of > my > race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor > issues > that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the > link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water > leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is > leaking > and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the > bolts) > and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it > around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. > > I am pretty > excited!! > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > > Mike Mehl > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/charly at mitchelplumbing.com From tony at tonydrews.com Sat Mar 20 23:40:41 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 00:40:41 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20100321064020.6485D187653@autox.team.net> Mike, Congratulations! It's been a long time coming! I have one concern, however. I think your trunk support may not be substantial enough. :) - Tony Drews At 09:34 PM 3/20/2010, Mike Mehl wrote: >Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my >race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues >that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the >link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water >leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking >and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) >and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it >around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. > >I am pretty >excited!! > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > >Mike Mehl From BillDentin at aol.com Sun Mar 21 07:55:50 2010 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 09:55:50 EDT Subject: [Fot] Triumph TR5 (WASP) Prototypes... Message-ID: <74d4e.4fbaa6a8.38d77f66@aol.com> Amici... The current issue of Triumph World magazine has a letter from a guy named Mike Geddes over in England, who is in the process of restoring X753, one of the TR5 (Wasp) prototypes. He describes the car as an engine test bed, with a prototype chassis set up and several factory body mods. He considers the car's history to be particularly interesting because it spent some time in the USA. We didn't see many TR5s over here because of emissions issues. He suspects this one may have been used over here for emissions testing. He is looking to make contact with anyone who might have information about the car. I never heard of this prototype. Kas? Incidentally, in the same issue, Paul Richardson has a great article about the late Peter Cox. Coxy was a guy I never met, but I sure felt I knew him, and he sure was the source of genuine Triumph competition parts for many, many years. Bill Dentinger From kaskas at cox.net Sun Mar 21 09:25:40 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 8:25:40 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Triumph TR5 (WASP) Prototypes... In-Reply-To: <74d4e.4fbaa6a8.38d77f66@aol.com> Message-ID: <20100321112540.USJAL.156191.imail@fed1rmwml43> I have been asked about this TR-5 car before. I knew nothing of it. I suppose it was in Michigan for the emission testing. It failed I presume and is why the TR-6 had twin carbs instead. If this is the same Peter Cox thatt worked in the Competition Department at the factory I did know him and furnished him camshafts at one time. ---- BillDentin at aol.com wrote: ============= Amici... The current issue of Triumph World magazine has a letter from a guy named Mike Geddes over in England, who is in the process of restoring X753, one of the TR5 (Wasp) prototypes. He describes the car as an engine test bed, with a prototype chassis set up and several factory body mods. He considers the car's history to be particularly interesting because it spent some time in the USA. We didn't see many TR5s over here because of emissions issues. He suspects this one may have been used over here for emissions testing. He is looking to make contact with anyone who might have information about the car. I never heard of this prototype. Kas? Incidentally, in the same issue, Paul Richardson has a great article about the late Peter Cox. Coxy was a guy I never met, but I sure felt I knew him, and he sure was the source of genuine Triumph competition parts for many, many years. Bill Dentinger _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From jhassall at blacksburg.net Sun Mar 21 09:42:45 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 11:42:45 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <4BA63E75.4000404@blacksburg.net> On 3/20/2010 3:22 AM, Tony Drews wrote: > I was just going to send this to Joe (A) since he's got the pilot > background but thought y'all might enjoy this too. It's a 4 min video > that seemed like only a minute or two to me. What a thrill this must be. > http://www.flixxy.com/glider-airplane-ridge-soaring.htm > > - Tony Drews Kewl. When I had about 200 hours SEL I decided to get a glider rating, so I showed up at the airport carrying my usual accouterment of pilot gear, including my headsets. Not one of the glider guys laughed at me (at least not while I was looking). I was absolutely blown away by how quiet the flights were - you could actually hear changes in the air! But then we didn't have "tunes" playing, either. I guess out west you can get away with flying as low as the video guy did. Here in the east there's too much radar coverage to allow that sort of stunt w/o a visit from the FAA. Tnx for sharing it Tony. jim -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Sun Mar 21 10:18:57 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 11:18:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumph TR5 (WASP) Prototypes... References: <20100321112540.USJAL.156191.imail@fed1rmwml43> Message-ID: <8B18A6AB55C7469C81CBED7A89A939D1@latitudefb1e41> There is a guy nearby to austin that has a WASP TR4 with a 6 cylinder engine. I've seen the number tag on the keys that says WASP. He says it was the TR250 Emmission test car. It is available for sale as an uncompleted restoration if anyone is interested. He has always thought it was worth a lot more than it is. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kas Kastner" To: ; Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 10:25 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumph TR5 (WASP) Prototypes... >I have been asked about this TR-5 car before. I knew nothing of it. I >suppose it was in Michigan for the emission testing. It failed I presume >and is why the TR-6 had twin carbs instead. If this is the same Peter Cox >thatt worked in the Competition Department at the factory I did know him >and furnished him camshafts at one time. > ---- BillDentin at aol.com wrote: > > ============= > Amici... > > The current issue of Triumph World magazine has a letter from a guy named > Mike Geddes over in England, who is in the process of restoring X753, one > of > the TR5 (Wasp) prototypes. He describes the car as an engine test bed, > with > a prototype chassis set up and several factory body mods. He considers > the > car's history to be particularly interesting because it spent some time in > the USA. We didn't see many TR5s over here because of emissions issues. > He > suspects this one may have been used over here for emissions testing. He > is looking to make contact with anyone who might have information about > the > car. I never heard of this prototype. Kas? > > Incidentally, in the same issue, Paul Richardson has a great article about > the late Peter Cox. Coxy was a guy I never met, but I sure felt I knew > him, > and he sure was the source of genuine Triumph competition parts for many, > many years. > > Bill Dentinger > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net > > > > -- > Never be beaten by equipment > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From adams910 at gmail.com Sun Mar 21 10:22:10 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 12:22:10 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Ridge riding (no Triumph content, but kool) In-Reply-To: <4BA63E75.4000404@blacksburg.net> References: <20100320082219.9793E18765F@autox.team.net> <4BA63E75.4000404@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: <673993c51003210922r613b9c2fuc375f0828029f15c@mail.gmail.com> You guys might appreciate this then, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttz5oPpF1Js From m-syork at comcast.net Sun Mar 21 11:07:47 2010 From: m-syork at comcast.net (Mark York) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 10:07:47 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000001cac919$0877e140$d1ab1218@markv8zno7deim> Mike Glad to have another Triumph in the Northwest, we really have a great group of guys. I look forward to seeing you; let me know if I can help in any way. Mark York TR3A #:14 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mike Mehl Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 7:34 PM To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/m-syork at comcast.net From timmurph at fastbytes.com Sun Mar 21 13:33:59 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 14:33:59 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002501cac92d$7556bb10$60043130$@com> Congratulations, Mike! I know the sweet feeling of starting it up for the first time after a lot of work. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mike Mehl Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2010 9:34 PM To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Sun Mar 21 13:42:48 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 12:42:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. Mike ________________________________ From: Mike Mehl To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From billb at bnj.com Sun Mar 21 13:50:30 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 09:50:30 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: It sounded like the pump. You might try a little belt dressing and see if it quits, or change the tension. To be sure it isn't coming from the motor remove the belt and see if it's still there. On Mar 21, 2010, at 9:42 AM, Mike Mehl wrote: > Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is > the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump > pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if > I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak > with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing > but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new > also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it > squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. > Mike > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Mike Mehl > > To: Triumph Friends of > Cc: Mike > Mehl > Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM > Subject: [Fot] > Started the TR4 today!!! > > Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button > today with the help of my > race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. > We had a few minor issues > that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help > solve. I am attaching the > link to the you tube video my son shot. I have > some small isuses. Water > leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of > the valve cover is leaking > and the new water pump is squealing (could be the > pulley rubbing on the bolts) > and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the > end of the day i drove it > around the block. You can hear the water pump in > the video. > > I am pretty > excited!! > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > > Mike Mehl > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Sun Mar 21 13:53:23 2010 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steven Belfer) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 12:53:23 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Sounds like you must use the process of elimination to determine the source of the squeaking. First, get a piece of tubing about 24" long and at least 1/2 ID and use it as a listening device. Have your assistant work the throttle and listen to the areas you suspect as if you are a Doctor with a stethascope. It may help you pinpoint the location. I suppose the belt could squeak if the belt tension is too loose or if it is lubricated in some way. You could put a little belt dressing on the belt to eliminate any slippage and make sure it's tight. If you think it's the water pump, you may want to try a different one. I know it's a pain to drain the water but it's not too tough to change. I do not run an alternator on my TR3. You could use a shorter belt and bypass the alternator to see if it still squeaks. ~Steve On Mar 21, 2010, at 12:42 PM, Mike Mehl wrote: Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. Mike ________________________________ From: Mike Mehl To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/colordog.1 at earthlink.net From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Sun Mar 21 14:50:50 2010 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 16:50:50 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>, <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: > pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if > I could get it to squeak. No luck. Running the water pump with a drill would not put side loads on it like running it with a belt would, and might not cause it to squeak like it would when run by a belt. John From budscars at comcast.net Sun Mar 21 15:49:08 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 14:49:08 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>, <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <354E17843ADE4175A683BEF4012AE57E@Bud> problem may just be a new tight belt...OLD FASHIONED TEST...start the car...take a hard stick grease...touch it gently to the inside of the belt for about 5 seconds(be careful of course)...see if the sound changes/goes away.. Racer Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Herrera" To: ; "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 1:50 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! >> pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see > if >> I could get it to squeak. No luck. > > > > Running the water pump with a drill would not put side loads on it like > running it with a belt would, and might not cause it to squeak like it > would > when run by a belt. > > > > John > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From jmwagner at greenheart.com Sun Mar 21 16:05:41 2010 From: jmwagner at greenheart.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 15:05:41 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <354E17843ADE4175A683BEF4012AE57E@Bud> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com>, <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <354E17843ADE4175A683BEF4012AE57E@Bud> Message-ID: <4BA69835.1000406@greenheart.com> I find spraying or squirting a little belt dressing on the belt and seeing if that causes the sound to change works well... though the stuff does tend to fly off onto the paint, etc. --Justin RACER BUD wrote: > problem may just be a new tight belt...OLD FASHIONED TEST...start the > car...take a hard stick grease...touch it gently to the inside of the > belt for about 5 seconds(be careful of course)...see if the sound > changes/goes away.. > Racer Bud > ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Herrera" > > To: ; "Friends of Triumph" > Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2010 1:50 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > > >>> pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill >>> to see >> >> if >> >>> I could get it to squeak. No luck. >> >> >> >> >> Running the water pump with a drill would not put side loads on it like >> running it with a belt would, and might not cause it to squeak like >> it would >> when run by a belt. >> >> >> >> John >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net > > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jmwagner at greenheart.com From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Sun Mar 21 20:33:41 2010 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 19:33:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <292451.31285.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Mike: Are you running a cogged belt? I have found these to squeak more often then non-cogged belts. Try an old style solid belt if you are using a cogged one. Just my two cents worth. -Ed- --- On Sun, 3/21/10, Mike Mehl wrote: From: Mike Mehl Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! To: "Triumph Friends of" Date: Sunday, March 21, 2010, 2:42 PM Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. Mike ________________________________ From: Mike Mehl To: Triumph Friends of Cc: Mike Mehl Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button today with the help of my race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. We had a few minor issues that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help solve. I am attaching the link to the you tube video my son shot. I have some small isuses. Water leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of the valve cover is leaking and the new water pump is squealing (could be the pulley rubbing on the bolts) and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the end of the day i drove it around the block. You can hear the water pump in the video. I am pretty excited!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU Mike Mehl _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Sun Mar 21 23:17:13 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 22:17:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <03ca01cac97e$ef3ac970$0301a8c0@randall> > Any thoughts??? Just because no one else mentioned it : check to be sure that the belt isn't riding against the bottom of any of the pulleys. If it is, you'll need a wider (or unworn) belt; or a narrower (or unworn) pulley. If the paint is polished off the bottom of the groove, the belt is hitting it. Randall From lang at isis.mit.edu Mon Mar 22 08:52:40 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 10:52:40 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] TR4 First Start VidZ Message-ID: Hi, Congrats on the first start on your TR4. There really is nothing quite like that initial euphoria/surprise/joy/relief when all those hours start to pay off. When I was watching the RAW vid, two things really jumped out at me: 1. there's a new, budding Triumph fan in the form of a younger child walking toward the car in the background, obviously trying to figure out what's going on. How kool is that! 2. I think the dog barking and running back and forth was kind of fun... sort of like watching sheepdogs herding sheep. Not sure why, but it struck me funny. I think I was thinking about herding cats at the time. Which would be sort of true for Triumph people. Good luck with your race car!!! It sounds awesome. rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From cwnfot at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 08:56:20 2010 From: cwnfot at gmail.com (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 10:56:20 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! - squeak In-Reply-To: <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <638343.91390.qm@web46109.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> <78923.46967.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <009501cac9cf$d693bca0$83bb35e0$@com> Does the engine still have the squeak if the belt is removed? We had a squeak in a MGTD engine, turns out the front cam bearing was improperly made/sized and tight on the cam. It stuck to the cam and rotated in the block, ultimately a disaster! Clark Clark W. Nicholls 1972 Stag 1974 Spitfire (and 1 rusty GT6 needing restoration) "Reality, it's not what you think." From triosan at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 11:25:54 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 10:25:54 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From triosan at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 11:35:09 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 10:35:09 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it just got worse, so I only got one long session in. So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out if it helps until race day. OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! Thanks, Chuck -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From tr4racing at googlemail.com Mon Mar 22 11:39:35 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 18:39:35 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> I would try to remove the rev limiter first and then test. They might go bad after years. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 18:35 An: Friends; Triumph; TR list Betreff: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it just got worse, so I only got one long session in. So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out if it helps until race day. OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! Thanks, Chuck -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 12:05:36 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 08:05:36 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <452A731C-C017-4664-B744-57EECE0CEC4B@bnj.com> Are you running an alternator? I've found electronic ignition is sometimes unreliable on a battery-only system. Pertronix used to be unreliable at lower voltages, but they seem to do better now--Tony put a Pertronix back into Peyote when he stuck a small alternator on it. The alternator didn't last, but the Pertronix is working OK. Battery-only systems run at 12.5 volts or lower, when you have an alternator the system is usually at 14 volts. You also should check your wiring gauge and connections. The wiring for most electronic ignition requires a high current capacity wire to the box. It doesn't draw high current constantly, but any excess resistance in this wire will screw things up. In the past I have both crimped and soldered the connectors to the ignition system since any vibrational jitters cause problems. On Mar 22, 2010, at 7:35 AM, Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley wrote: > I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor > [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock > dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car > this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First > two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension > issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over > the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to > 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach > would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is > setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and > found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had > "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it > belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it > just got worse, so I only got one long session in. > > So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the > Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. > What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual > point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out > if it helps until race day. > > OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run > a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! > > Thanks, > > Chuck > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Mon Mar 22 12:47:14 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 13:47:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Chuck, We had talked about getting some 700 lb springs made up. I tightened up my rear swaybar all the way and improved my car a bit but I'd still be interested in a set of springs if somebody is going to get them made. I'm pretty sure Ted Schumacher can do this for us. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:26 PM To: Friends Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com From fasttrs at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 13:00:24 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 12:00:24 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <163293.69843.qm@web46110.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Chuck, I have 2.5 I.d. Coilover springs on mine with spacers. They will fit the rear spring perches just not the front. Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 12:25 PM, "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" wrote: Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From fasttrs at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 13:05:52 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 12:05:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice Message-ID: <50003.91023.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> How are your Egts when it is cutting out on you? Are you sure you are getting proper fuel delivery for the FI? Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 12:35 PM, "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" wrote: I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it just got worse, so I only got one long session in. So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out if it helps until race day. OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! Thanks, Chuck -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From lang at isis.mit.edu Mon Mar 22 13:29:58 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 15:29:58 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, I'm running 600 pounders (by my calcs... Triumph Tune says slightly less), but they are the Triumph Tune "Sprint" springs. My car squats pretty easily when I tromp on it. Count me in as interested in something stiffer in the rear spring dept. Hmmm. That doesn't sound right, for some reason. :-) But 700 pound springs would be something interesting to try on my autocross TR6. rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lang at isis.mit.edu Mon Mar 22 13:34:12 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 15:34:12 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <163293.69843.qm@web46110.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <163293.69843.qm@web46110.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 22 Mar 2010, Mike Munson wrote: > Chuck, I have 2.5 I.d. Coilover springs on mine with spacers. They will > fit the rear spring perches just not the front. Ah - right. We went down this path before. Thanks for the reminder, Mike! > Mike regards, rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From fasttrs at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 14:33:12 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 13:33:12 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <616142.58250.qm@web46106.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> 900 pounders wow. Those sound like the RR boxcar springs (inners). That I had on my auto cross car. The wire was huge on those springs. I have heard that Toms whole car doesn't weigh much more than that ;-) Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 12:25 PM, "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" wrote: Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/fasttrs at yahoo.com From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Mon Mar 22 16:02:43 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 17:02:43 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <006001caca0b$6681bcf0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> I don't know much about the PI, but I had the same problem a while ago with carbs and it was fuel related. Does the PI have any kind of filter or screen in line? Could it be debris in the fuel system or a partial clog? Are you running braided lines? They can deteriorate inside. Do you run a pressure gauge and if so, what does the presure do? What happens if you switch off the fuel pump (I'm assuming it's electric) for a couple seconds , then switch it back on? A wise man once told me that about half of ignition problems were actually fuel related. Or maybe it was the other way around; I'm getting old and sometimes forget! Either way, check all possibilities. Good luck, Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" To: "Friends" ; "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net>; "TR list" Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:35 PM Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice > I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor > [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock > dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car > this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First > two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension > issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over > the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to > 5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach > would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is > setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and > found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had > "walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it > belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it > just got worse, so I only got one long session in. > > So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the > Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. > What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual > point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out > if it helps until race day. > > OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run > a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! > > Thanks, > > Chuck > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From n197tr4 at cs.com Mon Mar 22 15:13:34 2010 From: n197tr4 at cs.com (n197tr4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 17:13:34 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Race Car Problem Now ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS In-Reply-To: <881240.45638.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <881240.45638.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CC981BAAA61C2A-B94-A574@webmail-d053.sysops.aol.com> ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS JEFF SCHLEMMER MINNESOTA I met Jeff at a BMTA Conference......and subsequently visited his facilities in Minnesota. Recently, I invited him to join us at Heartland Park and he is looking closely at his calendar. He would make a great resource at the track for the FOT....AND EVERYONE. I hope he makes it. Joe A. -----Original Message----- From: michael lunsford To: 6pack at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, Mar 22, 2010 3:11 pm Subject: [6pack] Race Car Problem Chuck, ave you considered whether or not the new dizzy and crane setup calls for a allasted or non ballasted coil. I recently had my dizzy rebuilt by Advanced istributors (NFI) and had him install the pertronix insert installed he was oing the rebuild. The guy (sorry don't racall who but he did a great Job) anted me to be sure that I had the proper coil installed since I told him I ad problems with Pertronix ignitions in the past. My 1970 came with an nballasted ignition setup which he said probably provided too much voltage to he pertronix setup and burnt it out. The symptoms you described are the same s I observed on the old setup that went bad. Good luck. ike Lunsford ______________________________________________ 6pack at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/6pack/n197tr4 at cs.com From kaskas at cox.net Mon Mar 22 15:36:12 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 14:36:12 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Race Car Problem Now ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS In-Reply-To: <8CC981BAAA61C2A-B94-A574@webmail-d053.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <20100322173612.M7URX.175913.imail@fed1rmwml35> That would be cool to have him there. He did the distributor for the GT-6 project that I am writing about to finish up my new book. Looks great and expect it to be a world better that the usual stock unit. Should be going to the dyno in the near future. ---- n197tr4 at cs.com wrote: ============= ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS JEFF SCHLEMMER MINNESOTA I met Jeff at a BMTA Conference......and subsequently visited his facilities in Minnesota. Recently, I invited him to join us at Heartland Park and he is looking closely at his calendar. He would make a great resource at the track for the FOT....AND EVERYONE. I hope he makes it. Joe A. -----Original Message----- From: michael lunsford To: 6pack at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, Mar 22, 2010 3:11 pm Subject: [6pack] Race Car Problem Chuck, ave you considered whether or not the new dizzy and crane setup calls for a allasted or non ballasted coil. I recently had my dizzy rebuilt by Advanced istributors (NFI) and had him install the pertronix insert installed he was oing the rebuild. The guy (sorry don't racall who but he did a great Job) anted me to be sure that I had the proper coil installed since I told him I ad problems with Pertronix ignitions in the past. My 1970 came with an nballasted ignition setup which he said probably provided too much voltage to he pertronix setup and burnt it out. The symptoms you described are the same s I observed on the old setup that went bad. Good luck. ike Lunsford ______________________________________________ 6pack at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/6pack/n197tr4 at cs.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From budscars at comcast.net Mon Mar 22 15:41:13 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 14:41:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Fw: Emailing: Dick Scott, Alfa Message-ID: Hi Gang...what's wrong with this photo?..or...FP was tough in those days! Racer Bud..Spitfire #21 The message is ready to be sent with the following file or link attachments: Dick Scott, Alfa Note: To protect against computer viruses, e-mail programs may prevent sending or receiving certain types of file attachments. Check your e-mail security settings to determine how attachments are handled. [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Dick Scott, Alfa.jpg] From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Mon Mar 22 15:43:46 2010 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (toodamnfunky at comcast.net) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 21:43:46 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <006001caca0b$6681bcf0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: <376756342.6580351269294226856.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> When I ran Strombergs I had a similar problem and it turned out to be one of my dashpots was dry and sticking. Jim G ----- Original Message ----- From: "WILLIAM TOBIN" To: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" , "Friends" , "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net>, "TR list" Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 4:02:43 PM GMT -07:00 US/Canada Mountain Subject: Re: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice B B I don't know much about the PI, but I had the same problem a while ago with carbs and it was fuel related. B B Does the PI have any kind of filter or screen in line? Could it be debris in the fuel system or a partial clog? B B Are you running braided lines? B They can deteriorate inside. Do you run a pressure gauge and if so, what does the presure do? What happens if you switch off the fuel pump (I'm assuming it's electric) for a couple seconds , then switch it back on? B B A wise man once told me that about half of ignition problems were actually fuel related. Or maybe it was the other way around; I'm getting old and sometimes forget! Either way, check all possibilities. B B Good luck, Bill----- Original Message ----- B B From: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" B B To: "Friends" ; "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net>; "TR list" B B Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:35 PM B B Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice B B > I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. B It has a Pertronix distributor B B > [the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock B B > dizzy]. B I also have a Crane ignition. B First time out with the car B B > this year. B Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. B First B B > two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension B B > issues, but worked those out]. B The third session was longer, and over B B > the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to B B > 5500 RPM. B It did not do this always, but most of the time. B The tach B B > would swing wildly. B It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is B B > setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. B I did some investigating and B B > found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had B B > "walked" to quite far advanced. B I though putting it back to where it B B > belonged would fix the issue. B IT did not. B At the Sunday event it B B > just got worse, so I only got one long session in. B B > B B > So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the B B > Crane. B I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. B B > What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? B I do have a dual B B > point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out B B > if it helps until race day. B B > B B > OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run B B > a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! B B > B B > Thanks, B B > B B > Chuck B B > B B > -- B B > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley B B > B B > _______________________________________________ B B > fot at autox.team.net B B > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html B B > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive B B > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums B B > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/toodamnfunky at comcast.net From billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 16:02:22 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 12:02:22 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <006001caca0b$6681bcf0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> <006001caca0b$6681bcf0$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Message-ID: Definitely the other way around. Most fuel problem wind up to be ignition. I once worked for a mechanic who kept track of the troubleshooting he did, literally wrote it down in a notebook. Wore lab coats to work--pressed--pain in the ass guy, but I learned a few things from him. He showed me once that the huge majority of the problems with a misfire he worked on were caused by ignition. On Mar 22, 2010, at 12:02 PM, WILLIAM TOBIN wrote: > I don't know much about the PI, but I had the same problem a while ago > with carbs and it was fuel related. > Does the PI have any kind of filter or screen in line? Could it be debris > in the fuel system or a partial clog? > Are you running braided lines? They can deteriorate inside. Do you run a > pressure gauge and if so, what does the presure do? What happens if you > switch off the fuel pump (I'm assuming it's electric) for a couple seconds , > then switch it back on? > A wise man once told me that about half of ignition problems were actually > fuel related. Or maybe it was the other way around; I'm getting old and > sometimes forget! Either way, check all possibilities. > Good luck, Bill----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" > To: "Friends" ; "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net>; "TR > list" > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:35 PM > Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice From tr4racing at googlemail.com Mon Mar 22 17:10:34 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 00:10:34 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> I belive in soft main springs and hard swaybars. My car is using the stock springs with a little rubber uprate at front and stock leafs at rear. Swaybars at front and rear balance the car. At the moment I'm working at making the swaybars stiffer than they was last year. Less bodyroll. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Kramer, Robert Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 19:47 An: Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley; Friends Betreff: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Chuck, We had talked about getting some 700 lb springs made up. I tightened up my rear swaybar all the way and improved my car a bit but I'd still be interested in a set of springs if somebody is going to get them made. I'm pretty sure Ted Schumacher can do this for us. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:26 PM To: Friends Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN race on April 10th. PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From Billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 17:39:05 2010 From: Billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 13:39:05 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> Message-ID: <9BE2284A-0B98-466F-85D5-E9DE73877B9D@bnj.com> I don't think much of stiff springs either unless you can't get the suspension to work Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 1:10 PM, "MadMarx" wrote: > I belive in soft main springs and hard swaybars. > My car is using the stock springs with a little rubber uprate at > front and > stock leafs at rear. > Swaybars at front and rear balance the car. At the moment I'm > working at > making the swaybars stiffer than they was last year. Less bodyroll. > > Cheers > Chris > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Kramer, Robert > Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 19:47 > An: Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley; Friends > Betreff: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Chuck, > > We had talked about getting some 700 lb springs made up. I tightened > up my > rear swaybar all the way and improved my car a bit but I'd still be > interested > in a set of springs if somebody is going to get them made. I'm > pretty sure > Ted > Schumacher can do this for us. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] > On > Behalf > Of Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:26 PM > To: Friends > Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran > poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy > turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I > would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked > about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN > race on April 10th. > > PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back > asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get > heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From adams910 at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 20:06:56 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 22:06:56 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> References: <8cbd782d1003221025j7a05d7c6v8837ad8cca25b6f4@mail.gmail.com> <000001caca14$e1e81340$a5b839c0$@com> Message-ID: <673993c51003221906j5f7cb565ra0be44fb15152ef3@mail.gmail.com> I remember this conversation last time it came around. Keep in mind you spring to the tires. A 9" wide cantilever slick is going to produce a ton more grip than a Hoosier Speedster will ever produce. Just one of many things to keep in mind. Bob From kaskas at cox.net Mon Mar 22 20:07:57 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 19:07:57 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <9BE2284A-0B98-466F-85D5-E9DE73877B9D@bnj.com> Message-ID: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> Well, it might be true for a lot of cars, but the IRS Triumph needs some umph in the rear end. Anything around 600 pounds is a disaster and SLOW. I am talking about the stock suspension not the SCCA version. Like beer, try it you'll like it. ---- Bill Babcock wrote: ============= I don't think much of stiff springs either unless you can't get the suspension to work Sent from my iPhone On Mar 22, 2010, at 1:10 PM, "MadMarx" wrote: > I belive in soft main springs and hard swaybars. > My car is using the stock springs with a little rubber uprate at > front and > stock leafs at rear. > Swaybars at front and rear balance the car. At the moment I'm > working at > making the swaybars stiffer than they was last year. Less bodyroll. > > Cheers > Chris > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Kramer, Robert > Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 19:47 > An: Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley; Friends > Betreff: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Chuck, > > We had talked about getting some 700 lb springs made up. I tightened > up my > rear swaybar all the way and improved my car a bit but I'd still be > interested > in a set of springs if somebody is going to get them made. I'm > pretty sure > Ted > Schumacher can do this for us. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] > On > Behalf > Of Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley > Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 12:26 PM > To: Friends > Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Was nice to see you yesterday at the Alfa day at PIR. My car ran > poorly [see next email], but handled well. IT does squat in heavy > turn in and acceleration like in 2b [top of chicane] or 7. So, I > would like to know the source of the heavy duty springs you talked > about. Sure would like to beef mine up [500 pounds now] before SOVREN > race on April 10th. > > PS, not surre Tom reads this, so if I get no response I will be back > asking the group for contact information -- or info on where to get > heavy duty springs. Tom runs 900 pounders in the rrrar of his 6! > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer at rdoequipment.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/kaskas at cox.net -- Never be beaten by equipment From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 20:25:11 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 19:25:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Race Car Problem Now ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS In-Reply-To: <8CC981BAAA61C2A-B94-A574@webmail-d053.sysops.aol.com> References: <881240.45638.qm@web51402.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <8CC981BAAA61C2A-B94-A574@webmail-d053.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <710421.30346.qm@web46114.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> He did my TR4 Distributor. First class job. Mike Mehl ________________________________ From: "n197tr4 at cs.com" To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, March 22, 2010 2:13:34 PM Subject: [Fot] Race Car Problem Now ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS ADVANCED DISTRIBUTORS JEFF SCHLEMMER MINNESOTA I met Jeff at a BMTA Conference......and subsequently visited his facilities in Minnesota. Recently, I invited him to join us at Heartland Park and he is looking closely at his calendar. He would make a great resource at the track for the FOT....AND EVERYONE. I hope he makes it. Joe A. -----Original Message----- From: michael lunsford To: 6pack at autox.team.net Sent: Mon, Mar 22, 2010 3:11 pm Subject: [6pack] Race Car Problem Chuck, ave you considered whether or not the new dizzy and crane setup calls for a allasted or non ballasted coil. I recently had my dizzy rebuilt by Advanced istributors (NFI) and had him install the pertronix insert installed he was oing the rebuild. The guy (sorry don't racall who but he did a great Job) anted me to be sure that I had the proper coil installed since I told him I ad problems with Pertronix ignitions in the past. My 1970 came with an nballasted ignition setup which he said probably provided too much voltage to he pertronix setup and burnt it out. The symptoms you described are the same s I observed on the old setup that went bad. Good luck. ike Lunsford ______________________________________________ 6pack at autox.team.net onate: http://www.team.net/donate.html rchive: http://www.team.net/archive orums: http://www.team.net/forums nsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/6pack/n197tr4 at cs.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com From norlinengineering at comcast.net Mon Mar 22 21:50:19 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 20:50:19 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Thunderhill Double National Race Report Message-ID: <2C0A7FA91B9049E0A4D3D355976D3306@TOSHIBALAPTOP> My first (and second) races at Thunderhill were a wonderful experience. I was the only Triumph at the event, but ran into several old Triumph racers and some new ones as well - nomination to follow. There were 6 entries in H Production and I was the slowest. However, by the end of the weekend I was within 7 seconds of the HP lap record and had a very good race long battle with a Fiat X19 and a Toyota Yaris. Finished 5th on Saturday and 4th on Sunday. Not bad considering first time driving the track with a vintage car on DOT tires. The track is so different from my home track at Portland. I couldn't belive the amount of time I spent at full throttle in fourth gear in turns. And then there were the blind corners. Those just take seat time to get the confidence level built up. Virtually no time to relax. The facilities are great with lots of paddock space, hot showers, an on-site mini mart and self serve race fuel at racer friendly prices. Had a great time, met some good folks, learned a lot and have already ordered a few bits to improve the brakes on the Spit. Looking forward to the rest of the season. Jim Norlin From norlinengineering at comcast.net Mon Mar 22 22:01:09 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 21:01:09 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Nomination Message-ID: I'd like to nominate Tim Pettenati as a new member of our distinguished non-organization. I met Tim this weekend at Thunderhill. He's involved with SCCA, HMSA and other race organizations and has recently purchased a Spitfire race car. He's working on preparing it to race in HMSA and ??. If we can get a second, I'll get Tim to fill you in more on his background and his Spitfire. Jim Norlin From billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 22:08:10 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 18:08:10 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Nomination In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1C600482-E2E8-4D16-81AA-AC599EFAB9BA@bnj.com> I'll second, even though I'd normally wait for a spitty driver to pipe up On Mar 22, 2010, at 6:01 PM, Norlin Engineering wrote: > I'd like to nominate Tim Pettenati as a new member of our distinguished > non-organization. > > I met Tim this weekend at Thunderhill. He's involved with SCCA, HMSA and > other race organizations and has recently purchased a Spitfire race car. > He's working on preparing it to race in HMSA and ??. > > If we can get a second, I'll get Tim to fill you in more on his background > and his Spitfire. > > Jim Norlin > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tony at tonydrews.com Mon Mar 22 22:40:55 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 23:40:55 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> Message-ID: <20100323054033.16BB3187652@autox.team.net> I had a problem with cutting out and wildly swinging electric tach that was a loose ignition wire on my ignition switch in the dash. Was a 2 minute fix once I found it. - Tony Drews At 12:39 PM 3/22/2010, MadMarx wrote: >I would try to remove the rev limiter first and then test. They might go bad >after years. > >Cheers >Chris > > >-----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- >Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im >Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley >Gesendet: Montag, 22. Mdrz 2010 18:35 >An: Friends; Triumph; TR list >Betreff: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice > >I have a petrol injected TR6 race car. It has a Pertronix distributor >[the whole distributor, not just the points replacement in a stock >dizzy]. I also have a Crane ignition. First time out with the car >this year. Drove a few sessions Friday, then more on Sunday. First >two runs Friday went OK as far as the engine goes [had suspension >issues, but worked those out]. The third session was longer, and over >the course of it the car started to cut out under WOT at about 4500 to >5500 RPM. It did not do this always, but most of the time. The tach >would swing wildly. It felt a little like a rev limiter [which is >setto 7000 RPM],but only for an instant. I did some investigating and >found that I did not have the distributor fully locked, and it had >"walked" to quite far advanced. I though putting it back to where it >belonged would fix the issue. IT did not. At the Sunday event it >just got worse, so I only got one long session in. > >So, I beleieve there is a problem with either the Pertronix or the >Crane. I am asking for advice from all the TR groups I belong to. >What do you think, and how should I diagnose it? I do have a dual >point Mallory dizzy I can install -- but may have no way to check out >if it helps until race day. > >OR, do any of my Seattle area race buddies know of a road I could run >a couple of test on [6K in second will do it] \! > >Thanks, > >Chuck > >-- >Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: >http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tony at tonydrews.com From Billb at bnj.com Mon Mar 22 22:50:32 2010 From: Billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 18:50:32 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> References: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> Message-ID: <48093840-016A-4A8D-857D-F78990A8944C@bnj.com> I'm sure it does. I bet it needs to be locked down so it doesn't move at all. I took one look at the IRS of the TR4 and TR6 and thought "no thanks". Hard to see why they designed it that way. I would point out that I DID say "unless you can't get the suspension to work". I don't have any idea how that monkey motion stock suspension could be made to work. I think the biggest advantage of soft springing is compliance of the car to the track surface--you want the wheels to do their own thing but keep as big a contact patch as possible in the corners and over the rough stuff, and probably be on the edges of the tires down the straights. When I ran a lot of roll/bumps in simulation software for Peyote I found a stiff spring for a given wheel load overcomes the shock damping so the wheel winds up bouncing on rebound. If you increase the damping it moves the bounce to compression and the shock pumps down. With an ideal suspension setup the best spring weight is what is required to hold the fully loaded car off the ground at the required ride height with the suspension more or less centered in it's travel. At least that's the case in software. In the real world, I increased the stiffness of the springing in my Radical to accommodate my fat ass because I was grinding the splitter away and bottoming the rear suspension in some bumps. Lost about four seconds around PIR. FOUR fricking seconds, went from 1:22:yada with the chicane to 1:26:sumpthin. Played with tire pressures, shock tuning, roll bars and got about two seconds back, sort of. sometimes. You know how that goes. Put everything back to stock and got my four seconds back. Went to a lower downforce splitter and dialed most of the wing off, ground off half of the wing wickerbill, and it stopped bottoming and I got another two-three seconds. Wahoo. Went from thirds and fourths to firsts and seconds. Of course guys like Garmey can run you down in a Corvette with suspension from a Conestoga wagon and pass you with his wheels bouncing up and down like superballs. But he's F&$%ing nuts. On Mar 22, 2010, at 4:07 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > Well, it might be true for a lot of cars, but the IRS Triumph needs some umph in the rear end. Anything around 600 pounds is a disaster and SLOW. I am talking about the stock suspension not the SCCA version. Like beer, try it you'll like it. > ---- Bill Babcock wrote: > > ============= > I don't think much of stiff springs either unless you can't get the > suspension to work > > Sent from my iPhone From tpettenati at yahoo.com Mon Mar 22 23:23:06 2010 From: tpettenati at yahoo.com (Tim Pettenati) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2010 22:23:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Nomination In-Reply-To: <1C600482-E2E8-4D16-81AA-AC599EFAB9BA@bnj.com> References: <1C600482-E2E8-4D16-81AA-AC599EFAB9BA@bnj.com> Message-ID: <711899.1492.qm@web180308.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> Hi All, Intro - My wife and I have been involved in SCCA racing since the late 80's when I started crewing on a Formula Atlantic, and my wife started working grid. If you've participated to a CSRG or HMSA event in the past several years, I've been working Tech and Black Flag, and my wife Darlyn has been working Grid. In other words - she's the one you love to see, and I'm the one you hope not to see. I don't take it personally - really! Darlyn went through SCCA drivers school last year in a Spec Miata and now has her novice comp license. She'll be driving the Spit, and I'll be the wrench for the time being. Maybe next year will be my turn for drivers school. About the Spitfire - It's a 1964 1147cc and has a competition history back to the early 80's. Ran mostly at Riverside. Supposedly built with help from Lee Mueller, and has Mother Mueller comp parts. It sat in Oceanside for about 17 years before the most recent owner bought it and restored it to a period correct race car. It was back on the track for 4 races in 2009 with VARA and then HMSA Coronado last Sept.. I bought it and towed it home Feb. 2010 from Carlsbad. It currently sports a 2.5" straight-through sidepipe. I know it will need muffled before I can run anywhere in NorCal. Sounds great, but will never pass sound. So it needs just a few minor fixes before it will be track ready again. Regards, Tim Pettenati P.S. - Thanks for the nomination Jim & nice meeting you. ----- Original Message ---- From: Bill Babcock To: Norlin Engineering Cc: FoT Triumph ; tpettenati at yahoo.com Sent: Mon, March 22, 2010 9:08:10 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Nomination I'll second, even though I'd normally wait for a spitty driver to pipe up On Mar 22, 2010, at 6:01 PM, Norlin Engineering wrote: > I'd like to nominate Tim Pettenati as a new member of our distinguished > non-organization. > > I met Tim this weekend at Thunderhill. He's involved with SCCA, HMSA and > other race organizations and has recently purchased a Spitfire race car. > He's working on preparing it to race in HMSA and ??. > > If we can get a second, I'll get Tim to fill you in more on his background > and his Spitfire. > > Jim Norlin > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From kaskas at cox.net Tue Mar 23 09:07:29 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 8:07:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <48093840-016A-4A8D-857D-F78990A8944C@bnj.com> Message-ID: <20100323110729.MVD6A.184394.imail@fed1rmwml30> I have to agree about the design. Why? Why? Why? I can only figure that an upright with an axle that would not fall off and proper control arms top and bottom would have been too many pieces and alignment to put together for a production car while you just throw that big casting on and it's done. They had engineers that were smart enough to gather up the right parts and design a good setup, so cost and production line problems in my opinion are the guilty figures. ---- Bill Babcock wrote: ============= I'm sure it does. I bet it needs to be locked down so it doesn't move at all. I took one look at the IRS of the TR4 and TR6 and thought "no thanks". Hard to see why they designed it that way. I would point out that I DID say "unless you can't get the suspension to work". I don't have any idea how that monkey motion stock suspension could be made to work. I think the biggest advantage of soft springing is compliance of the car to the track surface--you want the wheels to do their own thing but keep as big a contact patch as possible in the corners and over the rough stuff, and probably be on the edges of the tires down the straights. When I ran a lot of roll/bumps in simulation software for Peyote I found a stiff spring for a given wheel load overcomes the shock damping so the wheel winds up bouncing on rebound. If you increase the damping it moves the bounce to compression and the shock pumps down. With an ideal suspension setup the best spring weight is what is required to hold the fully loaded car off the ground at the required ride height with the suspension more or less centered in it's travel. At least that's the case in software. In the real world, I increased the stiffness of the springing in my Radical to accommodate my fat ass because I was grinding the splitter away and bottoming the rear suspension in some bumps. Lost about four seconds around PIR. FOUR fricking seconds, went from 1:22:yada with the chicane to 1:26:sumpthin. Played with tire pressures, shock tuning, roll bars and got about two seconds back, sort of. sometimes. You know how that goes. Put everything back to stock and got my four seconds back. Went to a lower downforce splitter and dialed most of the wing off, ground off half of the wing wickerbill, and it stopped bottoming and I got another two-three seconds. Wahoo. Went from thirds and fourths to firsts and seconds. Of course guys like Garmey can run you down in a Corvette with suspension from a Conestoga wagon and pass you with his wheels bouncing up and down like superballs. But he's F&$%ing nuts. On Mar 22, 2010, at 4:07 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > Well, it might be true for a lot of cars, but the IRS Triumph needs some umph in the rear end. Anything around 600 pounds is a disaster and SLOW. I am talking about the stock suspension not the SCCA version. Like beer, try it you'll like it. > ---- Bill Babcock wrote: > > ============= > I don't think much of stiff springs either unless you can't get the > suspension to work > > Sent from my iPhone -- Never be beaten by equipment From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 10:03:54 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 09:03:54 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003230903u33f40848l430c051bb16f661@mail.gmail.com> Hi Kas, need a translation of "umph". I am assuming you mean a spring stiffer than 600 pounds [as Tom Kreiger indicted]? What Tom told me was that the rear end squats as power is applied in a corner. This causes the front to raise slightly producing under steer. By making the rear very stiff there is no squat and then the car will over steer giving you the ability to steer with the throttle coming out of corners =much faster. Correct? Chuck From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 10:15:21 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 09:15:21 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <4ba8465c.6344f10a.5adf.4eabSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> <4ba8465c.6344f10a.5adf.4eabSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003230915t71256879p34d2a3ff8ab9286c@mail.gmail.com> Now that is the best answer I have heard yet! Cannot check anything out till Saturday. There is one more confounding piece to all of this. I have an Innovate LM1 O2 sensor system. Hooked to it is an LM3 "Auxbox". The Auxbox captures RPM and MAP and the LM1 records it. The green wire from the Crane that go to the Tach also go to the LM3, as does a wire from where the Tach grounds. To allow the system to measure ambient air pressure before starting the car, a twelve volt feed also goes to the LM3. The wiring method is confusing [hot 12V, ground 12V are the first two; next comes the tach feed and it is Ground [-] feed then [+] Tach feed. I wired ththe tach feed backward [reversed the polarity]. I do not know if somehow this threw off a signal to the Crane that has caused damage to it. The problem I have experienced persists even though the LM 3 is now unconnected. On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 9:40 PM, Tony Drews wrote: > I had a problem with cutting out and wildly swinging electric tach that was > a loose ignition wire on my ignition switch in the dash. Was a 2 minute fix > once I found it. > > - Tony Drews From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 23 10:13:41 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 17:13:41 +0100 Subject: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003230903u33f40848l430c051bb16f661@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003230903u33f40848l430c051bb16f661@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <001101cacaa3$cfda7140$6f8f53c0$@com> Oomph? It is a German Gothic Metal band. Didn't know that Kas is metal fan ;-) http://www.youtube.com/user/OOMPHBand -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. Mdrz 2010 17:04 An: Kastner; Friends Betreff: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" Hi Kas, need a translation of "umph". I am assuming you mean a spring stiffer than 600 pounds [as Tom Kreiger indicted]? What Tom told me was that the rear end squats as power is applied in a corner. This causes the front to raise slightly producing under steer. By making the rear very stiff there is no squat and then the car will over steer giving you the ability to steer with the throttle coming out of corners =much faster. Correct? Chuck _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 10:19:16 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 09:19:16 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" In-Reply-To: <001101cacaa3$cfda7140$6f8f53c0$@com> References: <8cbd782d1003230903u33f40848l430c051bb16f661@mail.gmail.com> <001101cacaa3$cfda7140$6f8f53c0$@com> Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003230919ia3850ddic8d356286e7289fe@mail.gmail.com> Gotta think Kas has been into heavy [and hot] metal all his life-- and loves the "music" it produces! As a matter of fact, the current problem with my car is that it is not producing pleasing music! On Tue, Mar 23, 2010 at 9:13 AM, MadMarx wrote: > Oomph? It is a German Gothic Metal band. > Didn't know that Kas is metal fan ;-) > > http://www.youtube.com/user/OOMPHBand > > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im > Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley > Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. Mdrz 2010 17:04 > An: Kastner; Friends > Betreff: [Fot] TR6 springs and "umph" > > Hi Kas, need a translation of "umph". I am assuming you mean a spring > stiffer than 600 pounds [as Tom Kreiger indicted]? > > What Tom told me was that the rear end squats as power is applied in a > corner. This causes the front to raise slightly producing under > steer. By making the rear very stiff there is no squat and then the > car will over steer giving you the ability to steer with the throttle > coming out of corners =much faster. > > Correct? > > Chuck > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/triosan at gmail.com > > > -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From tr4racing at googlemail.com Tue Mar 23 10:21:13 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 17:21:13 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003230915t71256879p34d2a3ff8ab9286c@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d1003221035s6ca4f69bj19ffaf1b4ecfb04b@mail.gmail.com> <002201cac9e6$a51a5d70$ef4f1850$@com> <4ba8465c.6344f10a.5adf.4eabSMTPIN_ADDED@mx.google.com> <8cbd782d1003230915t71256879p34d2a3ff8ab9286c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <001201cacaa4$dcdc1aa0$96944fe0$@com> Bill had a good point with the connection of the coil to the system..... I had trouble that at hot my engine didn't start after a stall and had also misfire from time to time. Cause was the resistor at the coil. When the resistor became hot the value rised form 1.6 ohms to 1.9 ohms. The voltage dropped and the engine didn't start. Since then I use a cooled 1.5 ohms resistor that cured all ignition problems with my pertronix. Cheers Chris -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] Im Auftrag von Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Gesendet: Dienstag, 23. Mdrz 2010 17:15 An: Tony Drews; Friends Betreff: Re: [Fot] Got a problem with the race car, need advice Now that is the best answer I have heard yet! Cannot check anything out till Saturday. There is one more confounding piece to all of this. I have an Innovate LM1 O2 sensor system. Hooked to it is an LM3 "Auxbox". The Auxbox captures RPM and MAP and the LM1 records it. The green wire from the Crane that go to the Tach also go to the LM3, as does a wire from where the Tach grounds. To allow the system to measure ambient air pressure before starting the car, a twelve volt feed also goes to the LM3. The wiring method is confusing [hot 12V, ground 12V are the first two; next comes the tach feed and it is Ground [-] feed then [+] Tach feed. I wired ththe tach feed backward [reversed the polarity]. I do not know if somehow this threw off a signal to the Crane that has caused damage to it. The problem I have experienced persists even though the LM 3 is now unconnected. On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 9:40 PM, Tony Drews wrote: > I had a problem with cutting out and wildly swinging electric tach that was > a loose ignition wire on my ignition switch in the dash. Was a 2 minute fix > once I found it. > > - Tony Drews _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tr4racing at googlemail.com From triosan at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 13:10:50 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 12:10:50 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Recap on Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <8cbd782d1003231210y3d962a33xdec609b92dfddd48@mail.gmail.com> 1.Racing Triumphs with IRS need really stiff rear springs [700-900 range]. 2. Tom K has not weighed in -- guess he does not read the FOT mail [or do so very often]. 3. Off list if anybody has a phone number for him I would like it. 4. Does anybody have a source for ready made really stiff springs? 5. If not, I would be willing to work with Kramer and Ted S to get some made. [the faster the better -- I now understand that horrible feeling and sound coming out of power corners are my 540 pound rear springs bottoming out and first race is in three weeks! [Guess I could cut down some extra's I have and use spacerr to get proper height. -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley From rodkent at cox.net Tue Mar 23 15:13:26 2010 From: rodkent at cox.net (rodkent at cox.net) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 17:13:26 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Recap on Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d1003231210y3d962a33xdec609b92dfddd48@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20100323171326.HT2U8.199334.imail@fed1rmwml39> Hi, As someone mentioned in an earlier post, coil over springs will work, and the quality will be much better that something a custom spring producer will come up with. The range available is endless. ---- Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley wrote: 1.Racing Triumphs with IRS need really stiff rear springs [700-900 range]. 2. Tom K has not weighed in -- guess he does not read the FOT mail [or do so very often]. 3. Off list if anybody has a phone number for him I would like it. 4. Does anybody have a source for ready made really stiff springs? 5. If not, I would be willing to work with Kramer and Ted S to get some made. [the faster the better -- I now understand that horrible feeling and sound coming out of power corners are my 540 pound rear springs bottoming out and first race is in three weeks! [Guess I could cut down some extra's I have and use spacerr to get proper height. -- Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rodkent at cox.net From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Tue Mar 23 16:12:57 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 17:12:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Recap on Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs References: <8cbd782d1003231210y3d962a33xdec609b92dfddd48@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20805D58B90C4E90B75F1D8262ADDF00@latitudefb1e41> I was talking to another Tr6 guy today and he pointed out that whatever spring rate we apply to the back of the IRS cars, some of the rate is lost due to the design, The spring is forward of the axle at an angle that changes with suspension movement. He surmised that we need the extra stiffness just to get a higher effective spring rate. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley" To: "Friends" Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 2:10 PM Subject: [Fot] Recap on Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > 1.Racing Triumphs with IRS need really stiff rear springs [700-900 range]. > > 2. Tom K has not weighed in -- guess he does not read the FOT mail [or > do so very often]. > > 3. Off list if anybody has a phone number for him I would like it. > > 4. Does anybody have a source for ready made really stiff springs? > > 5. If not, I would be willing to work with Kramer and Ted S to get > some made. [the faster the better -- I now understand that horrible > feeling and sound coming out of power corners are my 540 pound rear > springs bottoming out and first race is in three weeks! [Guess I > could cut down some extra's I have and use spacerr to get proper > height. > > -- > Chuck Arnold and Kathleen Kelley > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Tue Mar 23 18:32:02 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 20:32:02 -0400 Subject: [Fot] www.racingsportscars.com Message-ID: <4BA95D82.1090806@twcny.rr.com> I apologize if I did not search the archives correctly but I was surprised someone had not turned this site up before. I found races both my parents participated in '59 and '60 with my car. I have some old photos and news clips I'll have to contribute e.g. a front page 4 shot sequence of a lotus coupe rolling over with my dad hot on his tail from a racing rag at Santa Barbra - yes there was contact but the corner worker exonerated my dad (as he told it). As a kid, I remember the dent - I was at the track that day... Fun stuff... M From fasttrs at yahoo.com Tue Mar 23 20:02:18 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 19:02:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Fw: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> References: <20100322220757.658OW.180446.imail@fed1rmwml37> Message-ID: <730172.77519.qm@web46115.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> ----- Forwarded Message ---- From: Mike Munson To: Kas Kastner ; MadMarx ; Bill Babcock Cc: Chuck at autox.team.net; Friends Sent: Tue, March 23, 2010 6:21:29 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs I just did some rough measurements on a trailing arm. Pivot point to tire patch is 22 inches. Pivot point to center of spring perch is 11 inches. Now I am no math genius but that would tell me that effective spring rate is half of the spring rating you are using. BTW Kas, Sam is the only TR6 that I know of that has utilized the SCCA rules to improve the rear suspension. I am still suffering with the (to quote Bill) Monkey Motion stock suspension. Mike ________________________________ From mpendy at dishmail.net Tue Mar 23 21:56:34 2010 From: mpendy at dishmail.net (Mark Pendergrass) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2010 20:56:34 -0700 Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy Message-ID: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for the first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 gal. of fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive or not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know wonder this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up with.....he's at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) From tony at tonydrews.com Tue Mar 23 23:44:19 2010 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 00:44:19 -0500 Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy In-Reply-To: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> References: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> Message-ID: <20100324064403.3EDCD18765A@autox.team.net> Mark, without driver and with a partially full fuel cell (5 to 10 gallons), my TR-4 is 2150 lbs and Jack's TR-4 was 1950 lbs. I'm not going to comment on weight with driver... :) - Tony Drews At 10:56 PM 3/23/2010, Mark Pendergrass wrote: >FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for the >first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage >folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 gal. of >fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive or >not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know wonder >this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up with.....he's >at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Wed Mar 24 06:23:30 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 07:23:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy References: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> Message-ID: My TR4A weighs in right at 2,000 lbs. less driver. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Pendergrass" To: "friends of triumph" Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 10:56 PM Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy > FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for > the > first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage > folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 > gal. of > fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive > or > not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know > wonder > this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up > with.....he's > at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From sbarr at McCarty-Law.com Wed Mar 24 06:51:03 2010 From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com (Barr, Scott) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 07:51:03 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Transport to NY? Message-ID: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74017023F1@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Is there anyone headed from or across the Midwest to New York with an available spot on a trailer? I'm selling a GT6 body shell and a potential buyer is worried about transportation. Scott B. PS - yes, Joe (C.), this is the same one I dragged back from AZ :-) From timmurph at fastbytes.com Wed Mar 24 11:50:50 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 12:50:50 -0500 Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy In-Reply-To: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> References: <2837C9C9B573448D9FCF53AE28450E7F@Pendys> Message-ID: <000001cacb7a$8c454900$a4cfdb00$@com> When the car was weighed at Gingerman for the VSCDA ERA Correct it was a total or 2120 without driver and about 5 gallons of gas, as I recall. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark Pendergrass Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 10:57 PM To: friends of triumph Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for the first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 gal. of fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive or not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know wonder this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up with.....he's at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From rikrock at aol.com Wed Mar 24 14:56:47 2010 From: rikrock at aol.com (rikrock at aol.com) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 16:56:47 -0400 Subject: [Fot] TR6 Engine Part Needed Message-ID: <8CC99ABA6E96B06-2F4-2E92@webmail-d011.sysops.aol.com> Amici, I'm looking for a distributor drive shaft (with gear) for a TR6 motor. This is the part that is driven by the gear on the cam and engages the distributor on the top side and the oil pump driveshaft on the bottom. Please let me know if you have one to sell. Thanks! Rich Rock From rblake36 at yahoo.com Wed Mar 24 15:43:42 2010 From: rblake36 at yahoo.com (Robert Blake) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 14:43:42 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <772286.73137.qm@web58501.mail.re3.yahoo.com> I have a 63 that tips the scales at a whopping 1972 lbs. Distribution is 1061 front and 911 rear. Bob Blake Dripping Springs, Texas --- On Wed, 3/24/10, Bob Kramer wrote: From: Bob Kramer Subject: Re: [Fot] am i that heavy To: "Mark Pendergrass" , "friends of triumph" Date: Wednesday, March 24, 2010, 7:23 AM My TR4A weighs in right at 2,000 lbs. less driver. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Pendergrass" To: "friends of triumph" Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2010 10:56 PM Subject: [Fot] am i that heavy > FoT'ers, at our first regional race this year, i got the tr4 weighed for the > first time since i accuired it, ( they don't like to do that for vintage > folks), not me ,the car! anyway, at 180lbs for driver and approx. 7.5 gal. of > fuel, this hotrod came in at 2216lbs, and i don't know if thats excessive or > not.Never had anyone share their dark secret, anyone care to? It's know wonder > this factory lightweight datsun i race with is hard to keep up with.....he's > at 1800lbs Mark P. (lard-ass) > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rblake36 at yahoo.com From ablake2 at austin.rr.com Wed Mar 24 20:23:08 2010 From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com (Greg & Alison Blake) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 20:23:08 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <000101cacbc2$1c68e1d0$6501a8c0@blake1> For what it is worth, you can use the 2.5" coil over type springs (I use AFCO) in the front of a TR3 if you use the aluminum spacer and shave a bit off the OD of spacer to accept the ID of the coil over springs. I have not looked at a TR4 or TR6 front end, but I imagine you could use a similar setup by using a shorter spring and using a modified spacer as I did on the 3. It makes for cheap springs and any rate you could possibly want to use pretty much any length too. Greg -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Robert M. Lang Sent: Monday, March 22, 2010 1:34 PM To: Mike Munson Cc: Friends Subject: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs On Mon, 22 Mar 2010, Mike Munson wrote: > Chuck, I have 2.5 I.d. Coilover springs on mine with spacers. They will > fit the rear spring perches just not the front. Ah - right. We went down this path before. Thanks for the reminder, Mike! > Mike regards, rml ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 ------------------------------------------------------------------------ --- _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/ablake2 at austin.rr.com From klynch_6 at msn.com Wed Mar 24 21:36:12 2010 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 21:36:12 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Dolomite/Sprint remembered Message-ID: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/classiccars/7399511/Classic-Triumph-Dolom ite-Sprint.html KL From mpendy at dishmail.net Wed Mar 24 21:41:22 2010 From: mpendy at dishmail.net (Mark Pendergrass) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 20:41:22 -0700 Subject: [Fot] AM I THAT HEAVEY Message-ID: Thanks everyone who responded to my inquirery about my cars weight, seems i'am in the ball park, but have some work to do...........Mark Pendy 63TR4 From sbarr at McCarty-Law.com Thu Mar 25 06:26:00 2010 From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com (Barr, Scott) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 07:26:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] FW: Dolomite/Sprint remembered Message-ID: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C7401702421@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Try this link: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/classiccars/7399511/Classic-Triumph- Dolomite-Sprint.html -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of KEVIN LYNCH Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2010 10:36 PM To: FOT Subject: [Fot] Dolomite/Sprint remembered http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/classiccars/7399511/Classic-Triumph- Dolom ite-Sprint.html Message-ID: Non - Triumph content Joe, can you contact me off line? The Historic Race Group is trying to contact your son about T & S for an upcoming event. thanks mike h. G. Michael Harmuth From tr4racing at googlemail.com Thu Mar 25 08:45:58 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 15:45:58 +0100 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> Hi Greg, You can't prevent the car from transferring weight under braking or acceleration, you only can work on the dive of the suspension during this circumstances. A good thing would be to install an anti-dive system for the braking but this is not easy to create on the TR3/4 front end as the lower wishbone can't be tilted. But besides this the main thing is that the car doesn't bottom out the suspension under braking or acceleration. The main spring ration should cover the maximum bumps on the particular track. The smoother the surface the less hard you can go. On tracks like the Nordschleife with huge bumps you need also lots of travel way of the suspension. I don't have any trouble with the car diving under braking. If the front end is lower at corner entry than getting in the corner is more crisp as the dive induce a little oversteer which makes life easier. When accelerating out of the corner the weight is transferred to the rear axle and the corners outside wheel. That will cause oversteer too but with the front inside wheel slightly touching the ground you have a little understeer too. If the car is well balanced you can achieve a smooth 4 wheel slide out of corners that makes the car quite fast and does save tires too. Have a look on these photos to see how the front wheel is almost touching the ground. http://www.tr4-racing.de/pic/2009/spa/04.0709Spa6Classic010.jpg http://www.tr4-racing.de/pic/2009/rgb-nurburgring/n%FCrburg%20b%20049.jpg http://www.tr4-racing.de/pic/2009/spa/03.07.09Spa7Classic054.jpg Take also in account that a wheel that has only little load can't be steered too far in the corner, so the anti Ackermann is the way to go to leave the inside front wheel more straight as it has less load but should help with steering the car. An unloaded wheel has only a very small slip angle. I'm going to rise the front end grip as high as I can and adjust the rear end to force the car to a little oversteer. Cheers Chris From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Mar 25 09:35:22 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 10:35:22 -0500 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> Message-ID: Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere around 800 lb rate. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of MadMarx Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM To: 'Friends' Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs From billb at bnj.com Thu Mar 25 10:00:07 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 06:00:07 -1000 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> Message-ID: <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's progressively wound. On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The > Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 > inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I > buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere > around 800 lb rate. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of MadMarx > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM > To: 'Friends' > Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From tr4racing at googlemail.com Thu Mar 25 10:18:47 2010 From: tr4racing at googlemail.com (MadMarx) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 17:18:47 +0100 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> Message-ID: <001b01cacc36$db54aba0$91fe02e0$@com> The windings does infect the spring rate. The formula is: D = (G * dD^4) / (8 *dF^3 *n) [N/mm] dD = wire diameter [mm] dF = Spring diameter at wire center [mm] n = number of windings G = Modul [N/mm2] (for Springsteel 79500 N/mm2) -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: Bill Babcock [mailto:billb at bnj.com] Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. Mdrz 2010 17:00 An: Kramer, Robert Cc: MadMarx; 'Friends' Betreff: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's progressively wound. On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The > Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 > inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I > buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere > around 800 lb rate. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of MadMarx > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM > To: 'Friends' > Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From spitlist at cox.net Thu Mar 25 10:41:05 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 09:41:05 -0700 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> Message-ID: <5BEB333EECB0426BB0FB562C1F6BA7ED@joepentiumnew> I beg to differ. Think about it this way. If you have a piece of spring steel 20 feet long and extend it between two fixed points and then apply a weight to the center, it will droop a given amount. The cut off a portion of it and move the end points closer together and reapply the same weight. It will sag less. Wind that steel into a coil and you get the same effect. The spring rate of the steel did not change (unless you heat it changing the properties) but the total amount of travel will become less, making the spring stiffer. The same thing happens with leaf springs. Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Bill Babcock Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:00 AM To: Kramer, Robert Cc: 'Friends' Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's progressively wound. On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The > Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 > inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I > buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere > around 800 lb rate. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of MadMarx > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM > To: 'Friends' > Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From tr3driver at ca.rr.com Thu Mar 25 10:41:19 2010 From: tr3driver at ca.rr.com (Randall) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 09:41:19 -0700 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> Message-ID: <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> > spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring Ah, but it does. Say for example you start with two 400 lb/in springs and stack them together. Apply 400 pounds, and the stack deflects by 2 inches (making it a 200 lb/in stack). Separate the springs and they go from 200 lb/in to 400 lb/in. Randall From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 10:47:30 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 10:47:30 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> Message-ID: <4BAB93A2.7030604@bradakis.com> Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? > http://www.alternativecarparts.com/utilities/coilsprings.html mjb. From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 11:01:03 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> Message-ID: <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com> >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring >> If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and change the coil count, it does get stiffer. mjb. From s.janzen at comcast.net Thu Mar 25 11:45:08 2010 From: s.janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 13:45:08 -0400 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> Message-ID: <3F6726A1-8658-442C-9EC3-64F5C475A810@comcast.net> so an 8" long, 500 lb per inch spring is a different wire size than a 10" long, 500 lb/inch spring, assuming the metallurgy and coil diameter? On Mar 25, 2010, at 12:41 PM, Randall wrote: > spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring Ah, but it does. Say for example you start with two 400 lb/in springs and stack them together. Apply 400 pounds, and the stack deflects by 2 inches (making it a 200 lb/in stack). Separate the springs and they go from 200 lb/in to 400 lb/in. Randall _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/s.janzen at comcast.net From billb at bnj.com Thu Mar 25 11:58:41 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 07:58:41 -1000 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <5BEB333EECB0426BB0FB562C1F6BA7ED@joepentiumnew> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <5BEB333EECB0426BB0FB562C1F6BA7ED@joepentiumnew> Message-ID: Yeah, I wasn't thinking. Coil springs are torsion bars, make them shorter and the rate goes up. On Mar 25, 2010, at 6:41 AM, Joe Curry wrote: > I beg to differ. > > Think about it this way. If you have a piece of spring steel 20 feet long > and extend it between two fixed points and then apply a weight to the > center, it will droop a given amount. The cut off a portion of it and move > the end points closer together and reapply the same weight. It will sag > less. Wind that steel into a coil and you get the same effect. > > The spring rate of the steel did not change (unless you heat it changing the > properties) but the total amount of travel will become less, making the > spring stiffer. > > The same thing happens with leaf springs. > > Joe C. > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On > Behalf Of Bill Babcock > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:00 AM > To: Kramer, Robert > Cc: 'Friends' > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's > progressively > wound. > > On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > >> Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? > The >> Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and > 14 >> inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. > If > I >> buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate > somewhere >> around 800 lb rate. >> >> Bob Kramer >> Sales Manager >> RDO Equipment Company >> 16415 N. IH 35 >> Pflugerville, TX 78660 >> 512-272-4141 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On > Behalf >> Of MadMarx >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM >> To: 'Friends' >> Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 12:00:24 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 12:00:24 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <3F6726A1-8658-442C-9EC3-64F5C475A810@comcast.net> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall> <3F6726A1-8658-442C-9EC3-64F5C475A810@comcast.net> Message-ID: <4BABA4B8.1010109@bradakis.com> Scott Janzen wrote: > so an 8" long, 500 lb per inch spring is a different wire size than a > 10" long, 500 lb/inch spring, assuming the metallurgy and coil diameter? > > Maybe, maybe not. You'll notice that in the various forms of the spring rate equations free length is not a factor. The two springs you mention may have the exact same wire diameter and number of coils. In the 10 inch spring the coils would be farther apart than in the 8 inch spring. Free length is not that important. Fitted length and fitted load are what really matter to ride height. mjb. From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Mar 25 12:08:55 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 13:08:55 -0500 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <001b01cacc36$db54aba0$91fe02e0$@com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <001b01cacc36$db54aba0$91fe02e0$@com> Message-ID: So it looks like the ticket is to buy the AFCO 8" 700 lb coil over springs and use a couple of 1/2" spacers to get my 9 " free length back. Then, if that is not enough rear spring, to go to the 10" 700 lb springs and cut them to fit (once I do the math), holding out the even stiffer option of using 12" springs if I need an even stiffer solution. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 -----Original Message----- From: MadMarx [mailto:tr4racing at googlemail.com] Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:19 AM To: 'Bill Babcock'; Kramer, Robert Cc: 'Friends' Subject: AW: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs The windings does infect the spring rate. The formula is: D = (G * dD^4) / (8 *dF^3 *n) [N/mm] dD = wire diameter [mm] dF = Spring diameter at wire center [mm] n = number of windings G = Modul [N/mm2] (for Springsteel 79500 N/mm2) -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- Von: Bill Babcock [mailto:billb at bnj.com] Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. Mdrz 2010 17:00 An: Kramer, Robert Cc: MadMarx; 'Friends' Betreff: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's progressively wound. On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? The > Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and 14 > inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. If I > buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate somewhere > around 800 lb rate. > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of MadMarx > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM > To: 'Friends' > Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From horizonracing at msn.com Thu Mar 25 12:35:07 2010 From: horizonracing at msn.com (Tony and Annie Garmey) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:35:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com> References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com> Message-ID: As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear springs with "Nascar" spring rubbers. Smooth track= use the spring rubber,rough track= put in a softer one or remove it ! :) > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 > From: mark at bradakis.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring > >> > > > If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil > count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and > change the coil count, it does get stiffer. > > mjb. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracing at msn.com From cofrog at q.com Thu Mar 25 13:13:51 2010 From: cofrog at q.com (Dan Forgey) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 19:13:51 +0000 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, , <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: Anyone know where to source the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? Thanks, Dan Forgey > From: horizonracing at msn.com > To: mark at bradakis.com; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:35:07 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear springs with "Nascar" spring rubbers. Smooth > track= use the spring rubber,rough track= put in a softer one or remove it ! > :) > > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 > > From: mark at bradakis.com > > To: fot at autox.team.net > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > > > >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring > > >> > > > > > > If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil > > count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and > > change the coil count, it does get stiffer. > > > > mjb. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracing at msn.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cofrog at q.com From horizonracing at msn.com Thu Mar 25 13:28:35 2010 From: horizonracing at msn.com (Tony and Annie Garmey) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 12:28:35 -0700 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, , <093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, , Message-ID: start with stock car products. From: cofrog at q.com To: horizonracing at msn.com; mark at bradakis.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 19:13:51 +0000 Anyone know where to source the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? Thanks, Dan Forgey > From: horizonracing at msn.com > To: mark at bradakis.com; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:35:07 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear springs with "Nascar" spring rubbers. Smooth > track= use the spring rubber,rough track= put in a softer one or remove it ! > :) > > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 > > From: mark at bradakis.com > > To: fot at autox.team.net > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > > > >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring > > >> > > > > > > If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil > > count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and > > change the coil count, it does get stiffer. > > > > mjb. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracing at msn.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/cofrog at q.com From tedtsimx at bright.net Thu Mar 25 14:29:01 2010 From: tedtsimx at bright.net (Ted Schumacher) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 15:29:01 -0500 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com> <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com> <001b01cacc36$db54aba0$91fe02e0$@com> Message-ID: <4BABC78D.4010502@bright.net> Bob and list. We have springs made for us - ran about 2000 pieces in the last 2 years - so we are somewhat conversant with this topic. Our TR6 uprated street springs will increase rate by about 8 psi for every 1/8" cut off. So cutting 1 coil will yield a 64 psi rate increaseon this particular spring. However, we sell springs other than the ones we list for the street cars. We can supply 8", 9" and 10" surface ground end springs in a large variety of rates. $59.95/each. These are 2 1/2" ID springs. Many spring suppliers, such as AFCO, do not make their own springs. Our spring manufacturer holds the tightest tolerances in the industry, +/- 2%. We have rate checked springs that have varied as much as 10%. If we can help, please let us know. Thaks for your time.Ted Kramer, Robert wrote: > So it looks like the ticket is to buy the AFCO 8" 700 lb coil over springs and > use a couple of 1/2" spacers to get my 9 " free length back. Then, if that is > not enough rear spring, to go to the 10" 700 lb springs and cut them to fit > (once I do the math), holding out the even stiffer option of using 12" springs > if I need an even stiffer solution. > > > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Company > 16415 N. IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > > -----Original Message----- > From: MadMarx [mailto:tr4racing at googlemail.com] > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 11:19 AM > To: 'Bill Babcock'; Kramer, Robert > Cc: 'Friends' > Subject: AW: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > The windings does infect the spring rate. > > The formula is: > > D = (G * dD^4) / (8 *dF^3 *n) [N/mm] > > dD = wire diameter [mm] > dF = Spring diameter at wire center [mm] > n = number of windings > G = Modul [N/mm2] (for Springsteel 79500 N/mm2) > > -----Urspr|ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: Bill Babcock [mailto:billb at bnj.com] > Gesendet: Donnerstag, 25. Mdrz 2010 17:00 > An: Kramer, Robert > Cc: MadMarx; 'Friends' > Betreff: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring unless it's > progressively wound. > > On Mar 25, 2010, at 5:35 AM, Kramer, Robert wrote: > > >> Is there a formula to determine spring rates when you shorten a spring? >> > The > >> Afco 2 5/8" springs that Greg Blake has pointed out come in 8, 10, 12 and >> > 14 > >> inch free lengths. I want a 9" free length spring to keep my ride height. >> > If I > >> buy a 700 lb 10" spring and cut off an inch I would guess at a rate >> > somewhere > >> around 800 lb rate. >> >> Bob Kramer >> Sales Manager >> RDO Equipment Company >> 16415 N. IH 35 >> Pflugerville, TX 78660 >> 512-272-4141 >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On >> > Behalf > >> Of MadMarx >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:46 AM >> To: 'Friends' >> Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tedtsimx at bright.net > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.437 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2769 - Release Date: 03/25/10 07:33:00 > > -- Ted Schumacher tedtsimx at bright.net http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com 108 S. Jefferson St. Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 From fasttrs at yahoo.com Thu Mar 25 13:49:33 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 12:49:33 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <399716.89446.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Www.springrubber.com Now;...What durometer rating do you get? Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 25, 2010, at 2:13 PM, Dan Forgey wrote: Anyone know where to source the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? Thanks, Dan From adams910 at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 14:21:05 2010 From: adams910 at gmail.com (Bob Adams) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 16:21:05 -0400 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: <399716.89446.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> References: <399716.89446.qm@web46113.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <673993c51003251321l2536e2ag214341fee9dc9661@mail.gmail.com> If you want to get real fancy, you can get bump stops with progressive rates. I have two different length/rate bumpstops in the top of my tool box, plus a different set on my Miata. You can also space them out, so they engage at a different point. Bob From fasttrs at yahoo.com Thu Mar 25 14:32:31 2010 From: fasttrs at yahoo.com (Mike Munson) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 13:32:31 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Message-ID: <411436.80978.qm@web46102.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I prefer to bump the Miatas without any rubber between me and them. They fly off the track and out of the way faster. Oh wait... Are we talking about the same thing ? :D :D :D Mike Sent from my iPhone On Mar 25, 2010, at 3:21 PM, Bob Adams wrote: If you want to get real fancy, you can get bump stops with progressive rates. I have two different length/rate bumpstops in the top of my tool box, plus a different set on my Miata. You can also space them out, so they engage at a different point. Bob From lang at isis.mit.edu Thu Mar 25 15:28:25 2010 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert M. Lang) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 17:28:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] Hard line materials Message-ID: Hi, Seeing that we're all being technical... my AN braided lines for my fuel system are now about 10 years old. I figure I should get a leg up on this - yes, I know the rubber rots over time. I was thinking about replacing a good portion of the flex with hard metal lines instead with just a few short flex lines where it matters. I have fabbed up steel bundy tubed used AN 818/819 steel sleeves and nuts and that seems to work okay. The question is - is there any obvious reason NOT to use aluminum tube and aluminum sleeves / nuts? I was thinking 6061T6 3/8" with .065 thick walls. This is low pressure (less than 3 psi) fuel, not PI or anything like that. I'm just curious. But the aluminum looks nicer than the steel does and it's probably lighter although we're talking ounces of material here, not pounds. regards, rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Triumph TR6!! | This space for rent 2010 NER Solo Chair | Voice:617-253-7438 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 15:57:24 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 15:57:24 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Hard line materials In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4BABDC44.8010407@bradakis.com> On the Killer Spit I used blue anodized 3/8 al-u-min-i-um from Summit, I think it was. Pretty easy to make the flares, bends and such. Looks nice and lasts a long time. mjb. From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Thu Mar 25 18:26:00 2010 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (Jim Gray) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 18:26:00 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, ,<093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: I hear those NASCAR spring rubbers act weird in right hand corners jim g -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team .net] On Behalf Of Dan Forgey Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 1:14 PM To: horizonracing at msn.com; mark at bradakis.com; triumph fot Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs Anyone know where to source the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? Thanks, Dan Forgey > From: horizonracing at msn.com > To: mark at bradakis.com; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:35:07 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear springs with "Nascar" spring rubbers. Smooth > track= use the spring rubber,rough track= put in a softer one or remove it ! > :) > > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 11:01:03 -0600 > > From: mark at bradakis.com > > To: fot at autox.team.net > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > > > >> spring rate doesn't change when you shorten a spring > > >> > > > > > > If you shorten it by compressing and heating, leaving the coil > > count the same, that is true. If you physically cut the spring and > > change the coil count, it does get stiffer. > > > > mjb. > > > > ______________________________ _________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.htm l > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/ options/fot/horizonracing at msn. com > > ______________________________ _________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.htm l > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/ options/fot/cofrog at q.com ______________________________ _________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.htm l Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/ options/fot/toodamnfunky at comca st.net From mark at bradakis.com Thu Mar 25 18:30:07 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 18:30:07 -0600 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs In-Reply-To: References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, ,<093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: <4BAC000F.6040506@bradakis.com> Jim Gray wrote: > I hear those NASCAR spring > rubbers act weird in right > hand corners > They work just fine in right handers if you put them in upside down. But then left handers are a bit of a sticky wicket. mjb. From rblake36 at yahoo.com Thu Mar 25 20:25:20 2010 From: rblake36 at yahoo.com (Robert Blake) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 19:25:20 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 Message-ID: <761127.22877.qm@web58502.mail.re3.yahoo.com> FOT I installed a HITEST14088 alternator in place of my original alternator about 5 months ago and it seemed to function although the lead placement was not the same as the original setup. Lately it seems to be spotty and I would like to check the output to determine if I have wiring issues or a grumpy alternator. I have individually cheched readings between the negative terminal of the battery and the three connectors on the alternator and gotten readings between 0.20 and 0.50 volts. These readings seem odd but being electrically challanged I don't trust my technique. Would appreciate suggestions and or internet references. Bob Blake Dripping Springs, TX From timmurph at fastbytes.com Fri Mar 26 09:43:53 2010 From: timmurph at fastbytes.com (Tim Murphy) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 10:43:53 -0500 Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 In-Reply-To: <761127.22877.qm@web58502.mail.re3.yahoo.com> References: <761127.22877.qm@web58502.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002901caccfb$2648e710$72dab530$@com> With the engine off the battery voltage should be about 13 volts, ideally 13.2 volts (2.2 volts per cell time 6 cells in the battery). With the engine running and the alternator working the voltage at the battery should be about 14.0 to 14.5 volts. Not sure what your 3 wires are going to but the largest should be carrying the current from the alternator to the battery and this terminal should be the 14.0 to 14.5 when running, same and the battery terminal to which it is connected. Tim -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Robert Blake Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:25 PM To: FOT Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 FOT I installed a HITEST14088 alternator in place of my original alternator about 5 months ago and it seemed to function although the lead placement was not the same as the original setup. Lately it seems to be spotty and I would like to check the output to determine if I have wiring issues or a grumpy alternator. I have individually cheched readings between the negative terminal of the battery and the three connectors on the alternator and gotten readings between 0.20 and 0.50 volts. These readings seem odd but being electrically challanged I don't trust my technique. Would appreciate suggestions and or internet references. Bob Blake Dripping Springs, TX _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/timmurph at fastbytes.com From ehusmann53 at yahoo.com Fri Mar 26 11:43:49 2010 From: ehusmann53 at yahoo.com (Ernest Husmann) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 10:43:49 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] car inspection help Message-ID: <770892.57253.qm@web57605.mail.re1.yahoo.com> FOT: Is there anyone in the Omaha, KC or Topeka area that would be willing to take a look at a TR7 located in Falls City, NE. I'm told by the seller Falls City is roughly 90 minutes from all three cities. If you would be willing to help me out please contact me off the list. Thank you, Ernie From billbab at me.com Fri Mar 26 12:06:35 2010 From: billbab at me.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 08:06:35 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs References: <7D25BA73-095C-494D-813C-FACFEB2AC3F6@bnj.com> Message-ID: Begin forwarded message: > From: Bill Babcock > Date: March 26, 2010 7:23:17 AM HST > To: Greg & Alison Blake > Cc: MadMarx , Friends Triumph > Subject: Re: [Fot] Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Weight transfer is not that big an issue on little cars, and what there is, is more benefit than problem. I use the weight transfer forward under braking to control understeer. A little tap on the brakes when the front end is pushing can make the car dive nicely to the apex. In all cases I expect the weight to transfer forward under heavy braking and that's why I have adjustable brake bias and my front disks are as good as are allowed. If Peyote had more than 130 hp I might worry about rear weight transfer, but it is unfortunately, no problem. We might find some performance in managing weight transfer by having better shocks on the car, but Peyote uses Armstrongs in the rear, and they have all the damping consistency of a screen door closer. > > On Mar 24, 2010, at 4:23 PM, Greg & Alison Blake wrote: From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Fri Mar 26 15:13:22 2010 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (toodamnfunky at comcast.net) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 21:13:22 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. Message-ID: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> NOTICE OF DECERTIFICATION; NOTICE TO CEASE AND DESIST AND TERMINATION OF ALL CONTRACTS OF PARTICIPATION ISSUED TO IMPACT RACING SFI Foundation, Inc., has issued a Notice of Decertification; Notice of Cease and Desist, and a notice terminating all Contracts of Participation to Impact Racing. Effective AprilB 27,B 2010 , all products manufactured and/or distributed by Impact Racing pursuant to SFI Specification Programs 3.2A, 3.3, 16.1, and 16.5 are decertified. Evidence obtained by SFI shows that over a period of years Impact Racing has engaged in the production and use of counterfeit SFI conformance labels and patches, and affixed them to Impact products for use in motorsports. Under the Contracts of Participation between SFI and Impact, SFI conformance labels and patches may only be obtained from SFI and no other source. Evidence shows that Impact had counterfeit SFI labels and patches made in Asia and then affixed them to Impact products it distributed to members of the racing community. To SFIbs knowledge, Impact never advised its customers that its products contained phony SFI labels and patches. Impact never advised SFI of its systematic and longstanding practice of counterfeiting and distributing SFI patches and labeling. Impact has been directed to cease and desist from this practice. SFI has directed Impact to immediately notify all affected customers to remove the counterfeit labeling and to offer the affected customers a full refund of the purchase price. SFI is requesting that all counterfeit conformance labels removed from Impact products be sent to SFI. SFI has elected not to decertify these products immediately in order to minimize the potential hardships to members of the racing community that have been brought about by Impactbs counterfeiting activities. SFI has also elected to terminate all Contracts of Participation with Impact Racing effective 90 days from March 24,B 2010. Under the terms of the Contracts, either party may terminate the agreements without penalty upon 90 days notice. This means that Impact will no longer be able to participate in any SFI programs after this 90 day period. SFI has taken these actions in the best interests of the safety and integrity of the racing community. This is in keeping with SFIbs mission and purpose. That's just great, All of my gear is made by Impact. Jim G. From cwnfot at gmail.com Fri Mar 26 17:57:52 2010 From: cwnfot at gmail.com (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 19:57:52 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. In-Reply-To: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <00f301cacd40$2696d2a0$73c477e0$@com> Can you source this information about Impact Racing before it is spread all over. Just in case it is bogus... http://www.impactraceproducts.com Clark Clark W. Nicholls 1972 Stag 1974 Spitfire (and 1 rusty GT6 needing restoration) "Reality, it's not what you think." From tr6nut at verizon.net Fri Mar 26 19:04:23 2010 From: tr6nut at verizon.net (Hugh Barber) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 21:04:23 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. In-Reply-To: <00f301cacd40$2696d2a0$73c477e0$@com> References: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> <00f301cacd40$2696d2a0$73c477e0$@com> Message-ID: <4BAD5997.8090708@verizon.net> http://www.sfifoundation.com/ It's on the front page of the website On 3/26/2010 07:57, Clark W. Nicholls wrote: > Can you source this information about Impact Racing before it is spread all > over. > Just in case it is bogus... > http://www.impactraceproducts.com From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Fri Mar 26 19:22:07 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 21:22:07 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket Message-ID: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> Got the head back - dressed it up and assembled. Noticed that with .090 shaved off, the headgasket (stock 86mm) protrudes into the chamber under the exhaust valve. Jack notes predicts this but not quite sure the best way to deal with it. I worked up the edge of the copper and can probably shave it back and roll it over again but it would get pretty close to the water relief. Can I run it protruding Jack notes says it won't last but I'm only .090 not racing all the time so... How do you guys deal with this? M From enquiries at roadandtrack.net.au Fri Mar 26 21:00:08 2010 From: enquiries at roadandtrack.net.au (Enquiries Road & Track) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 13:00:08 +1000 Subject: [Fot] help with finding flywheel bolts Message-ID: <1e4b466c1003262000l4d70b6fy32e4dc98864de458@mail.gmail.com> I have been unsucessfully chasing various local & UK vendors for new "proper" triumph 6 cyl flywheel bolts that were originally used on the 2.5 engines that had a long tail, eg pre 1972, and possibly various other models the part number forged into the bolt head is either UKC4264 or 151287. they were specially made high tensile bolts with a long shank (unthreaded bit). I dont want the generic "bolt shop" replacements , which is what Rimmers seem to offer. I have a custom crank & alloy flywheel and I want these 'long" bolts to maximize thread engagement and stability in the flywheel hole I've looked at the ARP ones, and they are a bit too short for my liking, and much shorter than these factory bolts. can anyone help me with a likely vendor in the USA, or even sell me some good ones. I would prefer new ones, but used ones that are not stretched would be OK. I have sorted thru a pile of them here, and most of them have stretched threads from overtightening or flywheel mis-haps thanks Terry O'Beirne australia From billb at bnj.com Fri Mar 26 21:08:57 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2010 17:08:57 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket In-Reply-To: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> References: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <94851D33-E556-4029-AE83-5B00682410FE@bnj.com> Sounds like you are using a composite gasket. Don't. It won't last with anything projecting into the combustion chamber, and won't last if the fire ring is cut. Either get a shim steel comp gasket or one of the solid copper ones On Mar 26, 2010, at 3:22 PM, Mark Eginton wrote: > Got the head back - dressed it up and assembled. Noticed that with .090 shaved off, the headgasket (stock 86mm) protrudes into the chamber under the exhaust valve. Jack notes predicts this but not quite sure the best way to deal with it. I worked up the edge of the copper and can probably shave it back and roll it over again but it would get pretty close to the water relief. Can I run it protruding Jack notes says it won't last but I'm only .090 not racing all the time so... > > How do you guys deal with this? > > M > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/billb at bnj.com From 19to1tr6 at comcast.net Fri Mar 26 23:31:55 2010 From: 19to1tr6 at comcast.net (Rob) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 01:31:55 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. In-Reply-To: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> References: <659260733.8148281269638002850.JavaMail.root@sz0004a.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net> Message-ID: <99B47D8331C14EB4A0BA7E85409A7BD3@INSPIRON> That's crazy Didn't Simpson just start up this company a few years ago.Could it spill over to the Simpson products Leopards don't change there spots. I was considering Impacts products last season but fortunately went with Alpine Stars. Guess this sport can be a little more dangerous than we think Book em DANO and loose the key. It will be interesting to see how many NASCAR drivers are wearing the product this weekend. rob ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "fot" Sent: Friday, March 26, 2010 5:13 PM Subject: [Fot] Impact Racing has lost it's SFI Cert. > NOTICE OF DECERTIFICATION; NOTICE TO CEASE AND DESIST AND TERMINATION OF > ALL > CONTRACTS OF PARTICIPATION ISSUED TO IMPACT RACING > > > > SFI Foundation, Inc., has issued a Notice of Decertification; Notice of > Cease > and Desist, and a notice terminating all Contracts of Participation to > Impact > Racing. Effective AprilB 27,B 2010 , all products manufactured and/or > distributed by Impact Racing pursuant to SFI Specification Programs 3.2A, > 3.3, > 16.1, and 16.5 are decertified. Evidence obtained by SFI shows that over a > period of years Impact Racing has engaged in the production and use of > counterfeit SFI conformance labels and patches, and affixed them to Impact > products for use in motorsports. Under the Contracts of Participation > between > SFI and Impact, SFI conformance labels and patches may only be obtained > from > SFI and no other source. Evidence shows that Impact had counterfeit SFI > labels > and patches made in Asia and then affixed them to Impact products it > distributed to members of the racing community. To SFIbs knowledge, > Impact > never advised its customers that its products contained phony SFI labels > and > patches. Impact never advised SFI of its systematic and longstanding > practice > of counterfeiting and distributing SFI patches and labeling. > > Impact has been directed to cease and desist from this practice. SFI has > directed Impact to immediately notify all affected customers to remove the > counterfeit labeling and to offer the affected customers a full refund of > the > purchase price. SFI is requesting that all counterfeit conformance labels > removed from Impact products be sent to SFI. > > SFI has elected not to decertify these products immediately in order to > minimize the potential hardships to members of the racing community that > have > been brought about by Impactbs counterfeiting activities. > > SFI has also elected to terminate all Contracts of Participation with > Impact > Racing effective 90 days from March 24,B 2010. Under the terms of the > Contracts, either party may terminate the agreements without penalty upon > 90 > days notice. This means that Impact will no longer be able to participate > in > any SFI programs after this 90 day period. > > SFI has taken these actions in the best interests of the safety and > integrity > of the racing community. This is in keeping with SFIbs mission and > purpose. > > > > That's just great, All of my gear is made by Impact. > > Jim G. > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/19to1tr6 at comcast.net From igofaster at att.net Sun Mar 21 09:15:39 2010 From: igofaster at att.net (Bobby Whitehead) Date: Sun, 21 Mar 2010 08:15:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] our new Spitfire racer Message-ID: <150512.69134.qm@web180706.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> I recently purchased a 1965 Spitfire from "Mac" McArthur in Huntington Beach California. Mac raced the spitwad for a few seasons with VARA. I was fortunate enough to receive the SCCA log book dating the car back to 1973 events. It was championed by Darwin Fontenot from 05-23-1973 through 09-04-1976. There is a 20 year gap in the log book when it shows Jeff Fontenot racing the car in the Polar Prix February 1997 and the Fiesta Carrera in July 1998. There is a March Madness and Blue Bonnet Sprint dated without the years, only the dates 04-12-?? On 02-13-98 SW division Houston SCCA "El Nino" event. There is also a March Madhatter 03-14-98 which appears to be the last event with a Fontenot family member. There is another log book International Conference of Sports Car Clubs. A Robert Hodge had two events 09-29-2007 and 08-03-2008. Glad to have some evidence of the past life. I'm in the process of sorting out the wiring, there's no fuse buss in the car. Have some new Painless Wiring stuff coming. Bought a new AMB transponder, new Holley Red fuel pump, and I found a new Safequip quick release on the 'bay I like versus the Simpson latch system that came with the car. I went with George Curl wednesday up to Eagles Canyon for a few hours to see if I could log some laps while he sorted out his fresh MGB rebuild when I re-adjusted the head and valves (fresh head) when I noticed one of the valve springs gave way. Hope to have the little Spitwad sorted out for Hallet in a few weeks. Thought some of you might like to know the story behind my bright idea to own 2 racer Triumphs, and Barbra's 1971 TR6 which gets some long needed seat rebuilds and finish up on the interior. All the best, Bobby Whitehead 1970 GT6 DP 1956 Spitfire EP 1971 TR6 From dos_gusanos at msn.com Sat Mar 27 07:40:57 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 07:40:57 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself Message-ID: My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim Hassal, the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly fused broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, drills, repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly intact in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. Cheers, Henry Morrison, New Mexico From jhassall at blacksburg.net Sat Mar 27 08:20:54 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim Hassal, > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly fused > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, drills, > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly intact > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. > Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never looked at it again. If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. jim -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From dos_gusanos at msn.com Sat Mar 27 08:35:03 2010 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 08:35:03 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> References: , <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: Jim it's fine, I would have sent you the same thing and merely consider it another challenge. Pales in comparison to most of my boat projects where I cut my teeth on most rusty bolts, drills, jb weld and duct tape....................Cheers Henry > Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 > From: jhassall at blacksburg.net > To: dos_gusanos at msn.com > CC: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > > On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: > > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim Hassal, > > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly fused > > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, drills, > > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly intact > > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. > > > Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a > half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed > it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never > looked at it again. > > If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. > > jim > > -- > Jim Hassall > Blacksburg VA > '63 TR4 in autox preparation > 99% finished, 90% to go From kaskas at cox.net Sat Mar 27 13:41:47 2010 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 12:41:47 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Still kicking Message-ID: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> Contrary to popular rumor the past couple days, I am not sick, not dying and damn well not dead!! -- Never be beaten by equipment From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Mar 27 13:47:31 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 15:47:31 EDT Subject: [Fot] alloy tubing? Message-ID: <1084f.54c405ce.38dfbad3@aol.com> Did I see a query during the week asking about alloy tubing in our cars? I remember a response about blue tubing from summit but no more. Is anyone using alloy tubing in their cars?? I talked to a bunch of drag racers this morning that love it but I worry about fatigue cracks in our environments. Hate to lose a race to save three ounces;-)) From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Mar 27 14:25:13 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 16:25:13 EDT Subject: [Fot] Still kicking Message-ID: <12164.35d4ec4c.38dfc3a9@aol.com> Well I'm damned glad ya got better! ;-)) What did Mark Twain say, "The reports of my death are greatly exaggerated" :56 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, kaskas at cox.net writes: Contrary to popular rumor the past couple days, I am not sick, not dying and damn well not dead!! -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gt6steve at aol.com From spitlist at cox.net Sat Mar 27 14:49:38 2010 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 13:49:38 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Still kicking In-Reply-To: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> References: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> Message-ID: <1AEF8B89A03F4B0CB035C28ACE0D7CC8@joepentiumnew> Good to know! :) Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas Kastner Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 12:42 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Still kicking Contrary to popular rumor the past couple days, I am not sick, not dying and damn well not dead!! -- Never be beaten by equipment _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/spitlist at cox.net From garygret at sbcglobal.net Sat Mar 27 16:40:10 2010 From: garygret at sbcglobal.net (Gary Schneider) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 15:40:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket In-Reply-To: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> References: <4BAD5DBF.7050001@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: <1232.97639.qm@web81507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> I have my Uncle Jack engine apart for maintenance right now. On my o-ringed engine he used the AE330 copper-faced composite gasket, and carefully rolled the copper-foil fold of the fire ring a little further back in the valve pocket. I would guess by patient and gentle tapping. Beautiful work and it lasted for years. Regards, Gary Schneider ________________________________ From: Mark Eginton To: "fot at autox.team.net" Sent: Fri, March 26, 2010 8:22:07 PM Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket Got the head back - dressed it up and assembled. Noticed that with .090 shaved off, the headgasket (stock 86mm) protrudes into the chamber under the exhaust valve. Jack notes predicts this but not quite sure the best way to deal with it. I worked up the edge of the copper and can probably shave it back and roll it over again but it would get pretty close to the water relief. Can I run it protruding Jack notes says it won't last but I'm only .090 not racing all the time so... How do you guys deal with this? M _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/garygret at sbcglobal.net From mark at bradakis.com Sat Mar 27 16:46:02 2010 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 16:46:02 -0600 Subject: [Fot] alloy tubing? In-Reply-To: <1084f.54c405ce.38dfbad3@aol.com> References: <1084f.54c405ce.38dfbad3@aol.com> Message-ID: <4BAE8AAA.2000905@bradakis.com> Gt6steve at aol.com wrote: > Did I see a query during the week asking about alloy tubing in our cars? > I remember a response about blue tubing from summit but no more. Bob Lang started it: http://www.team.net/mharc/archives/html/fot/2010-03/msg00319.html > > I was the one who responded that I used 3/8 inch aluminum hard line along the chassis for fuel delivery. Basically one long piece connected to the pump and filter setup through flexible rubber in the vicinity of the trunk and more flex line in the engine bay connected to the regulator, mjb. From norlinengineering at comcast.net Sat Mar 27 17:11:16 2010 From: norlinengineering at comcast.net (Norlin Engineering) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 16:11:16 -0700 Subject: [Fot] alloy tubing? In-Reply-To: <1084f.54c405ce.38dfbad3@aol.com> Message-ID: <099E9A65214A4E6696AD50AECECCA0DC@TOSHIBALAPTOP> I've got aluminum tubing on my AFFF fire system - came with the system. This year I noticed that one of the tubing flares had disappeared - apparently fatigued from vibrations. Easy enough to make a new flare, but I would hate to think what might have happened if this was a fuel line. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Gt6steve at aol.com Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 12:48 PM To: FOT at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] alloy tubing? Did I see a query during the week asking about alloy tubing in our cars? I remember a response about blue tubing from summit but no more. Is anyone using alloy tubing in their cars?? I talked to a bunch of drag racers this morning that love it but I worry about fatigue cracks in our environments. Hate to lose a race to save three ounces;-)) _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/norlinengineering at comcast.net From mike.mehl at yahoo.com Sat Mar 27 19:00:16 2010 From: mike.mehl at yahoo.com (Mike Mehl) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 18:00:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! In-Reply-To: <292451.31285.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <292451.31285.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <445864.4535.qm@web46116.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Well I worked on the TR4 again today. I followed Ed's thoughts and used an non cogged belt. No squeak now. I am getting there!!! Thanks ED and FOT. Mike ________________________________ From: EDWARD BARNARD To: Triumph Friends of ; Mike Mehl Sent: Sun, March 21, 2010 7:33:41 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! Mike: Are you running a cogged belt? I have found these to squeak more often then non-cogged belts. Try an old style solid belt if you are using a cogged one. Just my two cents worth. -Ed- --- On Sun, 3/21/10, Mike Mehl wrote: >From: Mike Mehl >Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! >To: "Triumph Friends of" >Date: Sunday, March 21, 2010, 2:42 PM > > >Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. One is >the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the pump >pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to see if >I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just squeak >with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out bearing >but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is new >also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs and it >squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be helpful. >Mike > > > > >________________________________ >From: Mike Mehl > >To: Triumph Friends of >Cc: Mike >Mehl >Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM >Subject: [Fot] >Started the TR4 today!!! > >Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the button >today with the help of my >race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car started. >We had a few minor issues >that a quick call to Jeff Quick in Seattle help >solve. I am attaching the >link to the you tube video my son shot. I have >some small isuses. Water >leaks with my Ford aluminum radiator, the rear of >the valve cover is leaking >and the new water pump is squealing (could be the >pulley rubbing on the bolts) >and the oil temp gauge is not working. By the >end of the day i drove it >around the block. You can hear the water pump in >the video. > >I am pretty >excited!! >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU > >Mike Mehl >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: >http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: >http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: >http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com > >_______________________________________________ >fot at autox.team.net >Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net From budscars at comcast.net Sat Mar 27 19:52:37 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 18:52:37 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! References: <292451.31285.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <445864.4535.qm@web46116.mail.sp1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Terrific!... RB ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Mehl" To: "EDWARD BARNARD" Cc: "Triumph Friends of" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 6:00 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > Well I worked on the TR4 again today. I followed Ed's thoughts and used > an > non cogged belt. No squeak now. > > I am getting there!!! > > Thanks ED and FOT. > Mike > > > > > ________________________________ > From: EDWARD BARNARD > > To: Triumph Friends of ; Mike > Mehl > Sent: Sun, March 21, 2010 7:33:41 PM > Subject: Re: > [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! > > > Mike: Are you running a cogged belt? I have > found these to squeak more often then non-cogged belts. Try an old style > solid belt if you are using a cogged one. > Just my two cents worth. > -Ed- > --- On > Sun, 3/21/10, Mike Mehl wrote: > > >>From: Mike Mehl > >>Subject: Re: [Fot] Started the TR4 today!!! >>To: > "Triumph Friends of" >>Date: Sunday, March 21, 2010, 2:42 > PM >> >> >>Well today I started chasing some of the things that need sorted out. > One is >>the squeaking (you can hear it in the video). I thought is was the > pump >>pulley. It is not. The water pump is new and I ran it with a drill to > see if >>I could get it to squeak. No luck. Do these aluminum pulleys just > squeak >>with the belt running over them. I thought maybe it is the throw out > bearing >>but it is not a howl. I guess it could be the alternator but that is > new >>also. Any thoughts??? At idle it does not squeak. Give it some revs > and it >>squeaks. I really think it is the water pump. Any imput would be > helpful. >>Mike >> >> >> >> >>________________________________ >>From: Mike Mehl >> >>To: Triumph Friends of >>Cc: Mike >>Mehl >>Sent: Sat, March 20, 2010 7:34:04 PM >>Subject: > [Fot] >>Started the TR4 today!!! >> >>Well after 18 months of work, I pushed the > button >>today with the help of my >>race rabbit friend Dave Barton and the car > started. >>We had a few minor issues >>that a quick call to Jeff Quick in > Seattle help >>solve. I am attaching the >>link to the you tube video my son > shot. I have >>some small isuses. Water >>leaks with my Ford aluminum > radiator, the rear of >>the valve cover is leaking >>and the new water pump is > squealing (could be the >>pulley rubbing on the bolts) >>and the oil temp gauge > is not working. By the >>end of the day i drove it >>around the block. You can > hear the water pump in >>the video. >> >>I am pretty >>excited!! >>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l1veQZ-pqRA >>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRRQ5wTUfsU >> >>Mike Mehl >>_______________________________________________ >>fot at autox.team.net >>Donate: >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >>Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >>Forums: >>http://www.team.net/forums >>Unsubscribe: >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/mike.mehl at yahoo.com >> >>_______________________________________________ >>fot at autox.team.net >>Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.html >>Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >>Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums >>Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/edwardbarnard at prodigy.net > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Mar 27 20:05:20 2010 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 22:05:20 EDT Subject: [Fot] Motorcycle sites Message-ID: <26db.4cc0029.38e01360@aol.com> Amigos, I'm pushed into selling my lovely T140V Bonneville Triumph Motorcycle. Just don't have the space to keep it because I admit I'll not be riding it again. Know any good websites to advertise where the right kind of enthusiast will get it? From rocky at spitfire4.com Sat Mar 27 20:16:30 2010 From: rocky at spitfire4.com (Rocky Entriken) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 21:16:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself References: , <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: Sounds to me like Henry's not complaining, he's bragging. Yeah, that's pretty cool to get that @#$%^ stud out and leave the threads in perfect shape! --Rocky Entriken ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Cc: "fot" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:35 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > Jim it's fine, I would have sent you the same thing and merely consider it > another challenge. Pales in comparison to most of my boat projects where > I > cut my teeth on most rusty bolts, drills, jb weld and duct > tape....................Cheers Henry > >> Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 >> From: jhassall at blacksburg.net >> To: dos_gusanos at msn.com >> CC: fot at autox.team.net >> Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself >> >> On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: >> > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim > Hassal, >> > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly > fused >> > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, > drills, >> > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly > intact >> > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. >> > >> Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a >> half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed >> it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never >> looked at it again. >> >> If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. >> >> jim >> >> -- >> Jim Hassall >> Blacksburg VA >> '63 TR4 in autox preparation >> 99% finished, 90% to go > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rocky at spitfire4.com From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Sun Mar 28 07:03:25 2010 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 08:03:25 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself References: , <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: <326EB9F0415145CDB1AE630615E1AD5E@latitudefb1e41> I know the feeling. I spent a week working on getting 6 screws out of a sterring wheel adapter. I was ready to grind them flat and drill 6 new holes, but I persevered and by drilling progressively larger holes I got the nasty old steering wheel off and eventually got the screws out with no damage to the aluminum hub. I wish I knew the make of the steering wheel. All it says is made in Italy. The hub is stamped 120. I suppose I could recovet it and use it. Bob Kramer Volente, TX Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence. Vince Lombardi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rocky Entriken" To: ; Cc: "fot" Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:16 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > Sounds to me like Henry's not complaining, he's bragging. > > Yeah, that's pretty cool to get that @#$%^ stud out and leave the threads > in perfect shape! > > --Rocky Entriken > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Cc: "fot" > Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:35 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > > >> Jim it's fine, I would have sent you the same thing and merely consider >> it >> another challenge. Pales in comparison to most of my boat projects where >> I >> cut my teeth on most rusty bolts, drills, jb weld and duct >> tape....................Cheers Henry >> >>> Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 >>> From: jhassall at blacksburg.net >>> To: dos_gusanos at msn.com >>> CC: fot at autox.team.net >>> Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself >>> >>> On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: >>> > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim >> Hassal, >>> > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly >> fused >>> > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, >> drills, >>> > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly >> intact >>> > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. >>> > >>> Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a >>> half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed >>> it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never >>> looked at it again. >>> >>> If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. >>> >>> jim >>> >>> -- >>> Jim Hassall >>> Blacksburg VA >>> '63 TR4 in autox preparation >>> 99% finished, 90% to go >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rocky at spitfire4.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From jhassall at blacksburg.net Sun Mar 28 09:09:05 2010 From: jhassall at blacksburg.net (J.C. Hassall) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 11:09:05 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: References: , <4BAE1446.4090509@blacksburg.net> Message-ID: <4BAF7111.5060700@blacksburg.net> On 3/27/2010 10:16 PM, Rocky Entriken wrote: > Sounds to me like Henry's not complaining, he's bragging. Rocky, tnx for making that observation. Henry, I apologize for jumping the gun and reading the email with "prejudiced eyes". My family is under a lot of external stress right now and I'm mentally in foxhole mode. I applaud your persistence and skill; I'd probably have been tempted to use C4. jim > > Yeah, that's pretty cool to get that @#$%^ stud out and leave the > threads in perfect shape! > > --Rocky Entriken > > ----- Original Message ----- From: > To: > Cc: "fot" > Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2010 9:35 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself > > >> Jim it's fine, I would have sent you the same thing and merely >> consider it >> another challenge. Pales in comparison to most of my boat projects >> where I >> cut my teeth on most rusty bolts, drills, jb weld and duct >> tape....................Cheers Henry >> >>> Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2010 10:20:54 -0400 >>> From: jhassall at blacksburg.net >>> To: dos_gusanos at msn.com >>> CC: fot at autox.team.net >>> Subject: Re: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself >>> >>> On 3/27/2010 9:40 AM, dos_gusanos at msn.com wrote: >>> > My wife was not very impressed, maybe you will be. Remember, Mr Jim >> Hassal, >>> > the exhaust manifold you sold me for the '63 TR4 with the 1 seemingly >> fused >>> > broken rusty stud in it? Well using a combination of drills, torches, >> drills, >>> > repeated heatings and the easy out, it was removed. Threads perfectly >> intact >>> > in the manifold. It has just set a good mood for the day. >>> > >>> Henry, I didn't know how badly the stud was stuck as I only made a >>> half-hearted attempt to remove it, sorry it was such a PITA. I removed >>> it from my car 15 years ago, parked it in the parts pile and never >>> looked at it again. >>> >>> If you'll remind me what you paid for it, I'll send you a check. >>> >>> jim >>> >>> -- >>> Jim Hassall >>> Blacksburg VA >>> '63 TR4 in autox preparation >>> 99% finished, 90% to go >> >> _______________________________________________ >> fot at autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Archive: http://www.team.net/archive >> Forums: http://www.team.net/forums >> Unsubscribe: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/rocky at spitfire4.com >> >> >> > > -- Jim Hassall Blacksburg VA '63 TR4 in autox preparation 99% finished, 90% to go From jmwagner at greenheart.com Sun Mar 28 12:13:10 2010 From: jmwagner at greenheart.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 11:13:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4BAF9C36.2050104@greenheart.com> If there's anything I have learned about frozen studs, nuts, bolts, etc..... It is to STOP, the second one realizes they've got a problem. STOP, and think about the best approach, the best tool, etc. And while devising a plan, let it sit in a bath of sprayed on WD40, etc. If the best tool for the given job isn't available at the moment, take the time to get it. Over the years, it seems to me that over half of the difficulty in solving such issues is having to work around the first 30 minutes of testosterone driven carnage. I've slowly been building up a little collection of odd tools specifically designed to deal with these things. Yet, even with all these special tools, more often than not, only one of them is right for any given task. And even then, it's often some simple tool that I need, that's gone missing. And regardless of the game plan, one shouldn't proceed with each step until it's fully engaged. i.e. If one is using a vis-grip, that initial squeeze to lock it in place should hurt. If a hole is to be drilled for a tool to engage, one should take the time to drill it right (properly locate the drill, drill at 90 degrees, drill it as deep as recommended, etc.) If one is dremeling a slot for a screw driver, get it right and use a screw driver that fits the slot perfectly. If leverage would help, take the time to create additional leverage (like pipe to extend handles, etc.). Patience and planning. --Justin From billb at bnj.com Sun Mar 28 13:21:23 2010 From: billb at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 09:21:23 -1000 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: <4BAF9C36.2050104@greenheart.com> References: <4BAF9C36.2050104@greenheart.com> Message-ID: <2D25E67C-6223-4BD4-A38A-E7735D056B89@bnj.com> Good advice. One other bit. When you get a little twinge of a thought that you're doing the wrong thing, stop. Go back and think it through. I can't tell you how many times I've thought "Man, if that bolt breaks my knuckles are going to...OUCH". Or "I probably shouldn't used vise grips for this because...DAMN, I shouldn't have used vise grips. " Telling yourself "I saw that coming" means you didn't trust your experience and knowledge. If you know better, act better. Saves a lot of time and bandaids. On Mar 28, 2010, at 8:13 AM, Justin Wagner wrote: > If there's anything I have learned about frozen studs, nuts, bolts, etc..... It is to STOP, the second one realizes they've got a problem. STOP, and think about the best approach, the best tool, etc. And while devising a plan, let it sit in a bath of sprayed on WD40, etc. If the best tool for the given job isn't available at the moment, take the time to get it. Over the years, it seems to me that over half of the difficulty in solving such issues is having to work around the first 30 minutes of testosterone driven carnage. > > I've slowly been building up a little collection of odd tools specifically designed to deal with these things. Yet, even with all these special tools, more often than not, only one of them is right for any given task. And even then, it's often some simple tool that I need, that's gone missing. > And regardless of the game plan, one shouldn't proceed with each step until it's fully engaged. i.e. If one is using a vis-grip, that initial squeeze to lock it in place should hurt. If a hole is to be drilled for a tool to engage, one should take the time to drill it right (properly locate the drill, drill at 90 degrees, drill it as deep as recommended, etc.) If one is dremeling a slot for a screw driver, get it right and use a screw driver that fits the slot perfectly. If leverage would help, take the time to create additional leverage (like pipe to extend handles, etc.). > > Patience and planning. > > --Justin From jmwagner at greenheart.com Sun Mar 28 13:55:07 2010 From: jmwagner at greenheart.com (Justin Wagner) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 12:55:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sometimes I amaze, even Myself In-Reply-To: <2D25E67C-6223-4BD4-A38A-E7735D056B89@bnj.com> References: <4BAF9C36.2050104@greenheart.com> <2D25E67C-6223-4BD4-A38A-E7735D056B89@bnj.com> Message-ID: <4BAFB41B.1090608@greenheart.com> LOL.... good extra bit! Yes, we should listen to that little extra voice inside! I was working on a Nissan TV commercial years ago... and after a long motion control camera move around the spinning red four door pick up truck, the truck comes to a stop and all the four doors close, at once, for the ending beauty shot... There I am... all in black... hiding inside the truck... pulling on four cables I had rigged to close the doors on cue... as I laid there on the floor of the Nissan... and the camera was rolling... and computers were marking the camera move and the car to spin on a giant turntable... I started thinking to myself... "this isn't a good position, if the lead on one of these things breaks, I'm going to hit myself in the...." The director: (heard over the radio hidden in the car with me) "...and ACTION, Justin.... ....Justin? ....action Justin. Hello... Justin? Action" Justin: (after a long pause, his dizzy voice heard over the radio) "ummm... folks... Justin's going to need a little reset time here... He knocked himself out." It was a little embarrassing having a black eye for the remainder of the shoot. --Justin Bill Babcock wrote: >Good advice. One other bit. When you get a little twinge of a thought that you're doing the wrong thing, stop. Go back and think it through. I can't tell you how many times I've thought "Man, if that bolt breaks my knuckles are going to...OUCH". Or "I probably shouldn't used vise grips for this because...DAMN, I shouldn't have used vise grips. " > >Telling yourself "I saw that coming" means you didn't trust your experience and knowledge. If you know better, act better. Saves a lot of time and bandaids. > >On Mar 28, 2010, at 8:13 AM, Justin Wagner wrote: > > > >>If there's anything I have learned about frozen studs, nuts, bolts, etc..... It is to STOP, the second one realizes they've got a problem. STOP, and think about the best approach, the best tool, etc. And while devising a plan, let it sit in a bath of sprayed on WD40, etc. If the best tool for the given job isn't available at the moment, take the time to get it. Over the years, it seems to me that over half of the difficulty in solving such issues is having to work around the first 30 minutes of testosterone driven carnage. >> >>I've slowly been building up a little collection of odd tools specifically designed to deal with these things. Yet, even with all these special tools, more often than not, only one of them is right for any given task. And even then, it's often some simple tool that I need, that's gone missing. >>And regardless of the game plan, one shouldn't proceed with each step until it's fully engaged. i.e. If one is using a vis-grip, that initial squeeze to lock it in place should hurt. If a hole is to be drilled for a tool to engage, one should take the time to drill it right (properly locate the drill, drill at 90 degrees, drill it as deep as recommended, etc.) If one is dremeling a slot for a screw driver, get it right and use a screw driver that fits the slot perfectly. If leverage would help, take the time to create additional leverage (like pipe to extend handles, etc.). >> >>Patience and planning. >> >>--Justin From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Sun Mar 28 18:44:45 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 20:44:45 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Head Gasket In-Reply-To: <1232.97639.qm@web81507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <1232.97639.qm@web81507.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4BAFF7FD.8040001@twcny.rr.com> Interesting, thats pretty much what I ended up doing since I already had the gasket and nothing to lose. I gently lifted up the fire ring up with a razer blade on my composite gasket and carefully removed some material beneath it with an exacto knife. Then I trimmed and rolled the copper fire ring in flattening it back in place so it followed the new contour of my head. It seemed to look ok so I decided to use it. We will see... M From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Sun Mar 28 18:48:16 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 20:48:16 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Timing gear alignment Message-ID: <4BAFF8D0.5060300@twcny.rr.com> My timing gears with one .010 spacer still appears to have .025 clearance when I straight edge from the cam gear. This is the first engine I noticed this much offset. Are any of you needing to space the crank gear .035 or should I be searching a problem? Thanks, M From markconsultation at twcny.rr.com Sun Mar 28 18:50:38 2010 From: markconsultation at twcny.rr.com (Mark Eginton) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 20:50:38 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Still kicking In-Reply-To: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> References: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> Message-ID: <4BAFF95E.3040004@twcny.rr.com> The rumors of my death are greatly exaggerated... Mark Twain Always great news indeed... M From budscars at comcast.net Sun Mar 28 19:24:15 2010 From: budscars at comcast.net (RACER BUD) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 18:24:15 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Still kicking References: <20100327154147.R99GX.246640.imail@fed1rmwml28> <4BAFF95E.3040004@twcny.rr.com> Message-ID: Yours Too?..this must be a plot! RB ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Eginton" To: Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:50 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Still kicking > The rumors of my death are greatly exaggerated... > > Mark Twain > > Always great news indeed... > > M > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/budscars at comcast.net From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Sun Mar 28 22:39:14 2010 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2010 21:39:14 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] New Racing Data Site Message-ID: <211724.5425.qm@web81208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Group: Here is a site that has gathered up race statistics. This site is neat! http://race- database. com/ "Welcome to race-database. com, the first site that will offer complete statistics for every major racing series. These data include what are considered complete box scores, including data on sponsors, chassis, and lap leaders that are not available on many sites. Although some sites have complete coverage for a set of one or more of these series, none has complete coverage of elite races in multiple racing disciplines. This site is intended for the general racing fan, who wants results for all major races, all in one place. Series covered: * Formula One, 1950-present * NASCAR Cup, 1967-present * CART/Champ Car, 1979-2007 * IRL IndyCar, 1996-present * ALMS, 1999-present * Grand-Am, 2000-present * Indy 500, 1911-present * Daytona 500, 1959-present * 24 Hours of Le Mans, 1923-present " Enjoy - Ed From harmug at us.ibm.com Mon Mar 29 06:25:07 2010 From: harmug at us.ibm.com (George Harmuth) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 08:25:07 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Impact racing belts Decertified Message-ID: Looks like Impact has been cutting corners. Check your belts, you don't want to be surprised at Tech or in a crash. March 26, 2010 - NOTICE OF DECERTIFICATION; NOTICE TO CEASE AND DESIST AND TERMINATION OF ALL CONTRACTS OF PARTICIPATION ISSUED TO IMPACT RACING SFI Foundation, Inc., has issued a Notice of Decertification; Notice of Cease and Desist, and a notice terminating all Contracts of Participation to Impact Racing. Effective April 27, 2010, all products manufactured and/or distributed by Impact Racing pursuant to SFI Specification Programs 3.2A, 3.3, 16.1, and 16.5 are decertified. Evidence obtained by SFI shows that over a period of years Impact Racing has engaged in the production and use of counterfeit SFI conformance labels and patches, and affixed them to Impact products for use in motorsports. Under the Contracts of Participation between SFI and Impact, SFI conformance labels and patches may only be obtained from SFI and no other source. Evidence shows that Impact had counterfeit SFI labels and patches made in Asia and then affixed them to Impact products it distributed to members of the racing community. To SFIbs knowledge, Impact never advised its customers that its products contained phony SFI labels and patches. Impact never advised SFI of its systematic and longstanding practice of counterfeiting and distributing SFI patches and labeling. Impact has been directed to cease and desist from this practice. SFI has directed Impact to immediately notify all affected customers to remove the counterfeit labeling and to offer the affected customers a full refund of the purchase price. SFI is requesting that all counterfeit conformance labels removed from Impact products be sent to SFI. SFI has elected not to decertify these products immediately in order to minimize the potential hardships to members of the racing community that have been brought about by Impactbs counterfeiting activities. SFI has also elected to terminate all Contracts of Participation with Impact Racing effective 90 days from March 24, 2010. Under the terms of the Contracts, either party may terminate the agreements without penalty upon 90 days notice. This means that Impact will no longer be able to participate in any SFI programs after this 90 day period. SFI has taken these actions in the best interests of the safety and integrity of the racing community. This is in keeping with SFIbs mission and purpose. For a downloadable .pdf of this notice, please click on the following link: >Decertification Notice 03-26-10. G. Michael Harmuth Software Engineer Automated Material Handling Equipment Engineering Services From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Mon Mar 29 07:42:34 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 08:42:34 -0500 Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 References: <761127.22877.qm@web58502.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <009901cacf45$b038b580$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Hi, in the old days we checked voltage drop between the battery and the connections along the way to the alternator. Anything over .1 or .2 volts pointed to a problem. That's 1 or 2 tenths of a volt. Over that level could be a loose connection, corrosion/high resistance, maybe faulty wiring. And being it's British and older, check all grounds; they seem to be the Bugaboo in a lot of cases. Be sure the engine is grounded to the frame. I know one guy who had a problem with a Cheve pickup not charging; it turned out to be a loose connection where the battery cable bolts to the starter solenoid. Don't ask who the guy was! Good luck, Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Blake" To: "FOT" Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 9:25 PM Subject: [Fot] HITEST14088 ALTERNATOR FOR tr6 > FOT > > I installed a HITEST14088 alternator in place of my original alternator about > 5 months ago and it seemed to function although the lead placement was not the > same as the original setup. Lately it seems to be spotty and I would like to > check the output to determine if I have wiring issues or a grumpy > alternator. I have individually cheched readings between the negative > terminal of the battery and the three connectors on the alternator and gotten > readings between 0.20 and 0.50 volts. These readings seem odd but being > electrically challanged I don't trust my technique. Would appreciate > suggestions and or internet references. > > Bob Blake > Dripping Springs, TX > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From william.tobin3 at verizon.net Mon Mar 29 07:46:32 2010 From: william.tobin3 at verizon.net (WILLIAM TOBIN) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 08:46:32 -0500 Subject: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs References: <000c01cacc29$e32e0590$a98a10b0$@com>, , <46ED0BA3-20A8-41C3-82DB-6CF2A7C8C50A@bnj.com>, ,<093301cacc39$ff130840$0301a8c0@randall>, , <4BAB96CF.3050906@bradakis.com>, Message-ID: <00aa01cacf46$3e3d3720$2f01a8c0@ownereq69gs6ae> Thanks for the laugh; Thanks, I needed that! Hai Karate, I think it was, '60's. Be careful how you use it. Bill----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Gray" To: "'Dan Forgey'" ; ; ; "'triumph fot'" Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 7:26 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging Tom Krieger re: rear springs > I hear those NASCAR spring > rubbers act weird in right > hand corners > > jim g > > -----Original Message----- > From: > fot-bounces at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces at autox.team > .net] On Behalf Of Dan Forgey > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2010 > 1:14 PM > To: horizonracing at msn.com; > mark at bradakis.com; triumph fot > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: Paging > Tom Krieger re: rear springs > > Anyone know where to source > the "NASCAR" spring rubbers? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Dan Forgey > > > From: horizonracing at msn.com > > To: mark at bradakis.com; > fot at autox.team.net > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 > 11:35:07 -0700 > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: > Paging Tom Krieger re: rear > springs > > > > As on the TR 250 K: 500 rear > springs with "Nascar" spring > rubbers. Smooth > > track= use the spring > rubber,rough track= put in a > softer one or remove it > ! > > :) > > > > > Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2010 > 11:01:03 -0600 > > > From: mark at bradakis.com > > > To: fot at autox.team.net > > > Subject: Re: [Fot] WG: > Paging Tom Krieger re: rear > springs > > > > > > >> spring rate doesn't > change when you shorten a > spring > > > >> > > > > > > > > > If you shorten it by > compressing and heating, > leaving the coil > > > count the same, that is > true. If you physically cut > the spring and > > > change the coil count, it > does get stiffer. > > > > > > mjb. > > > > > > > ______________________________ > _________________ > > > fot at autox.team.net > > > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.htm > l > > > Archive: > http://www.team.net/archive > > > Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums > > > Unsubscribe: > > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/ > options/fot/horizonracing at msn. > com > > > > > ______________________________ > _________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.htm > l > > Archive: > http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/ > options/fot/cofrog at q.com > > ______________________________ > _________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: > http://www.team.net/donate.htm > l > Archive: > http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: > http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/ > options/fot/toodamnfunky at comca > st.net > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/william.tobin3 at verizon.net From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Mon Mar 29 15:24:25 2010 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2010 16:24:25 -0500 Subject: [Fot] later TR6 2nd gear Message-ID: I am looking for a good condition second gear for the mid to later TR6 mainshaft. Anyone have one for sale? Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Company 16415 N. IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 It's not what you've got, it's what you use that makes a difference. Zig Ziglar From triosan at gmail.com Wed Mar 31 10:43:07 2010 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 09:43:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Need a TR6 rod Message-ID: I need one, and better two, rods for a TR6 of the variety that does not have a small hole in it above the rod bearing area. I have 12 of those that do have holes and would be glad to swap a set for a couple without holes. I had a rod failure and have the other five rods/pistons all balanced and would like to just replace the one rod rather than prep 6 more. Thanks, -- Chuck Arnold From Spitfire_Racing at twcny.rr.com Wed Mar 31 14:54:30 2010 From: Spitfire_Racing at twcny.rr.com (Spitfire Racing) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 16:54:30 -0400 Subject: [Fot] engines available Message-ID: <001801cad114$5c399870$14acc950$@rr.com> I have a neighbor who has two BMC A Series engines he wants to sell off. One is a 1275 and the other is a bit smaller. He also has a bare TR-3 Block to sell. I have no financial interest in this. If you have interest, please e-mail me off list and I will send his contact information. He was a racer for some 30 years. The BMC engines were spares for his Formula Junior if he needed them. These are located near Ithaca NY. Russ Moore From jeff_durant at comcast.net Wed Mar 31 15:17:50 2010 From: jeff_durant at comcast.net (jeff_durant at comcast.net) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 21:17:50 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Need a TR6 rod Message-ID: <906749465-1270070271-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1715018818-@bda059.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Chuck, Give me a call, I've plenty. Jeff ------Original Message------ From: Chuck Arnold and/or Kathleen Kelley Sender: fot-bounces at autox.team.net To: Friends To: Triumph Subject: [Fot] Need a TR6 rod Sent: Mar 31, 2010 9:43 AM I need one, and better two, rods for a TR6 of the variety that does not have a small hole in it above the rod bearing area. I have 12 of those that do have holes and would be glad to swap a set for a couple without holes. I had a rod failure and have the other five rods/pistons all balanced and would like to just replace the one rod rather than prep 6 more. Thanks, -- Chuck Arnold _______________________________________________ fot at autox.team.net Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html Archive: http://www.team.net/archive Forums: http://www.team.net/forums Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/jeff_durant at comcast.net Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T From greenman62 at hotmail.com Wed Mar 31 16:55:01 2010 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (Greg Petrolati) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 22:55:01 +0000 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: I'd like to nominate Bob Pengraph and Becky Phelan (bob at nwspeedshots.com, gofastergirl at hotmail.com) Bob should need no introduction and Becky's dad has a TR2 and comes from a British car family. Greg Petrolati Greg Petrolati Lafayette, Oregon That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... From tom at squeelerracing.com Wed Mar 31 19:14:13 2010 From: tom at squeelerracing.com (Tom Kreger) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 18:14:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Bob and Becky References: Message-ID: <0499B8E122CF490698046B35951355A9@laptop> A harty second from me. Bob is a great guy! TK ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Petrolati" To: Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:55 PM Subject: [Fot] (no subject) > I'd like to nominate Bob Pengraph and Becky Phelan > (bob at nwspeedshots.com, gofastergirl at hotmail.com) Bob should need no > introduction and Becky's dad has a TR2 and comes from a British car > family. > > > > Greg Petrolati > > > > Greg Petrolati Lafayette, Oregon > > > > That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tom at squeelerracing.com From cwnfot at gmail.com Wed Mar 31 19:30:34 2010 From: cwnfot at gmail.com (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 21:30:34 -0400 Subject: [Fot] SCCA statement on Impact products Message-ID: <000001cad13a$edb98ff0$c92cafd0$@com> SCCA statement on Impact products: http://www.averillpark.net/documents/RM%2010-04.pdf Forum on the subject: http://www.averillpark.net/thisendup/index.php?/archives/25-SCCA-statement-o n-Impact-Racing-products.html Interesting website: http://www.na-motorsports.com/index.html Clark Clark W. Nicholls 1972 Stag 1974 Spitfire (and 1 rusty GT6 needing restoration) "Reality, it's not what you think." From horizonracing at msn.com Wed Mar 31 22:35:27 2010 From: horizonracing at msn.com (Tony and Annie Garmey) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 21:35:27 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Bob and Becky In-Reply-To: <0499B8E122CF490698046B35951355A9@laptop> References: , <0499B8E122CF490698046B35951355A9@laptop> Message-ID: Just as Tom say's............. Great guy. Gives a lot and asks for nothing. > From: tom at squeelerracing.com > To: greenman62 at hotmail.com; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 18:14:13 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Fot] Bob and Becky > > A harty second from me. Bob is a great guy! TK > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Greg Petrolati" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:55 PM > Subject: [Fot] (no subject) > > > > I'd like to nominate Bob Pengraph and Becky Phelan > > (bob at nwspeedshots.com, gofastergirl at hotmail.com) Bob should need no > > introduction and Becky's dad has a TR2 and comes from a British car > > family. > > > > > > > > Greg Petrolati > > > > > > > > Greg Petrolati Lafayette, Oregon > > > > > > > > That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > > > > _______________________________________________ > > fot at autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > > Unsubscribe: > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/tom at squeelerracing.com > > _______________________________________________ > fot at autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/horizonracing at msn.com