From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Nov 1 09:56:50 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 12:56:50 EDT Subject: [Fot] 87mm Pistons wanted Message-ID: List, I am looking for a very good set of new or used pistons for my Wet Sleeved Wonder. Perhaps someone has a set on the shelf with no planned usage. Thanks, Joe Alexander From dave at microworks.net Thu Nov 1 10:32:20 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2007 10:32:20 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Max Mosley confirms he is a fool Message-ID: <20071101173620.MGVT22006.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> First Max is saying that Sir Jackie is crazy and now after seeing one of the closest fought F1 Championships in years and Max Mosley is complaining that Lewis Hamilton may be bad for the sport because he is too good. http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=41215 What an idiot. From markvaden at gmail.com Thu Nov 1 13:07:29 2007 From: markvaden at gmail.com (Mark Vaden) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 13:07:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Hi All, I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion on a tr4? I see that revington tr has a bolt on one, but it is really pricey. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks in advance, Mark From spitlist at cox.net Thu Nov 1 13:24:49 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 13:24:49 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <00e301c81cc5$40736ae0$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Not a TR4, but I did a two circuit setup on my Spit using two single circuit master cylinder tied together using the Tilton Balance bar. One side works the front disks and the other side works the rear drums. Works pretty well and wasn't terribly expensive to implement. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Vaden" To: Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 1:07 PM Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Hi All, > > I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, > and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion > on a tr4? I see that revington tr has a bolt on one, but it is really > pricey. Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > Thanks in advance, > Mark > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Fubog1 at aol.com Thu Nov 1 13:19:03 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:19:03 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/1/2007 4:07:44 PM Eastern Daylight Time, markvaden at gmail.com writes: I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion on a tr4? Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling cylinders, the same way it has been done for decades. I don't think there is such a thing as a bolt-in kit for these cars. Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From tr5racer at btinternet.com Thu Nov 1 13:27:43 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 20:27:43 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Max Mosley confirms he is a fool Message-ID: <704462.51653.qm@web86601.mail.ird.yahoo.com> What do you expect from someone whose father was the founder of the British Fascist party and in whose ranks were the notorious 'blackshirts' and who was interned for most of the Second World War as he supported Hitler and his policies. Mike Hughes --------------------------------- Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now. From henry at henryfrye.com Thu Nov 1 13:36:36 2007 From: henry at henryfrye.com (Henry Frye) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:36:36 -0400 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB4F@server.Triumph.local> > Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling > cylinders, the same way it has been done for decades. Of course Glen is right on the money. The only twist on the plot I have seen is taking a TR6 dual circuit master cylinder and a TR6 pedal box and fit it to the TR4. That's how my car was done, sans booster, and it stops fine. High pedal effort, but I like it that way. Front to rear bias can be changed with different sized rear wheel cylinders and/or messing around with the pad and shoe linings. From markvaden at gmail.com Thu Nov 1 13:36:51 2007 From: markvaden at gmail.com (Mark Vaden) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 13:36:51 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <285b8a860711011336o44ed58cbu2b52d806989d2dea@mail.gmail.com> > Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling cylinders, the same > way it has been done for decade Do I use the same bore cylinders? Meaning to I just use two stock tr4 brake master cylinders? -Mark From Fubog1 at aol.com Thu Nov 1 13:47:02 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:47:02 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/1/2007 4:37:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time, markvaden at gmail.com writes: Do I use the same bore cylinders? Meaning to I just use two stock tr4 brake master cylinders? Depending on what brakes you have, friction material, driver preference, etc you can play around with cylinder sizes .625, .70, .750 etc, & pedal ratio, to get the best setup. There's a good chance that you will wind up with the same diameter cylinders without extreme bias adjustment. Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Nov 1 13:48:31 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 15:48:31 -0500 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: <285b8a860711011336o44ed58cbu2b52d806989d2dea@mail.gmail.com> References: <285b8a860711011336o44ed58cbu2b52d806989d2dea@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B3522F9@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I have one of the UK versions with a balance bar, I think it came from Racetorations, maybe TR Enterprises. It came with a remote resorvoir for the brakes like a TR3 so I switched out the M/C's for 3/4" Wildwood with the intregal caps like the CMC. Those cylinders are available for about $50 each from places like Speedway Motors. I don't know why this is true, but my virtually identical Girling CMC clouds up the fluid relatively quickly, but the Wildwoods stay crystal clear. I had the TR6 set-up on my old car and it worked fine. I think the TR4 bulkhead area where the booster mounts was re-inforced when they went to the TR25/TR6. I remember some extra flexing I worried about metal fatigue but never did anything about it. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark Vaden Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 3:37 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling cylinders, the > same way it has been done for decade Do I use the same bore cylinders? Meaning to I just use two stock tr4 brake master cylinders? -Mark Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From S.Janzen at comcast.net Thu Nov 1 13:52:16 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:52:16 -0400 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <011b01c81cc9$16a18ef0$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> I did the same thing Joe did, but with my GT6. You either need to be adept with a welder or know someone who is to modify the brake pedal and weld in the bias bar tube, and to build a new "box" to support the master cylinders. For the latter, I mocked something up out of posterboard, took it to a guy with a sheet metal brake and shear and he cut and bent the pieces to match my posterboard. I then pop riveted those together and had someone else weld it up. Looks a lot like what came from the factory under the hood of your TR4, but a little beefier (18 gauge ?) and holds three masters - one for the clutch and two for the brakes. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Vaden" To: Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 4:07 PM Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Hi All, > > I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, > and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion > on a tr4? I see that revington tr has a bolt on one, but it is really > pricey. Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > Thanks in advance, > Mark > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From adcronin at ameritech.net Thu Nov 1 14:22:34 2007 From: adcronin at ameritech.net (A Daniel Cronin) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 14:22:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB4F@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: <185909.13778.qm@web81311.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Or pop for one of the aftermarket brake bias valves offered by Moss and a number of the British suppliers, Revington, Cambridge, etc. Henry Frye wrote: > Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling > cylinders, the same way it has been done for decades. Of course Glen is right on the money. The only twist on the plot I have seen is taking a TR6 dual circuit master cylinder and a TR6 pedal box and fit it to the TR4. That's how my car was done, sans booster, and it stops fine. High pedal effort, but I like it that way. Front to rear bias can be changed with different sized rear wheel cylinders and/or messing around with the pad and shoe linings. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Planning & Development Services A. Daniel Cronin 248 761-2673 From markvaden at gmail.com Thu Nov 1 15:49:34 2007 From: markvaden at gmail.com (Mark Vaden) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 15:49:34 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <285b8a860711011549p3a0dacahf53242d3cf7ee1a9@mail.gmail.com> Thanks for all the the responses. I think I can fabricate something. Does anyone have a suggestion on bore sizes to start with. I am running stock TR4 front and rear brakes. Also, I would be interested in hearing what pads people are running? I have stock calipers, and drilled rotors. TIA, Mark From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 1 16:16:10 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:16:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> <285b8a860711011549p3a0dacahf53242d3cf7ee1a9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Personally, I like to use all the same size m/c for clutch, front and rear brakes so you only have to carry one spare rebuild kit and it's always the right one. .070 is a good midpoint size and you'll be able to get the bias adjusted without going to an extreme. Don't forget that you want some residual pressure on the disk pads, and don't forget that some M/Cs come with the residual pressure valve already in them. If you're going to use one for a clutch you have to take the M/C apart and remove the residual pressure valve or it will toast your thrust washers. You also probably don't want residual pressure on the back drums. Drilled rotors are a no-no with a lot of vintage racing organizations. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Mark Vaden Sent: Thu 11/1/2007 3:49 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Thanks for all the the responses. I think I can fabricate something. Does anyone have a suggestion on bore sizes to start with. I am running stock TR4 front and rear brakes. Also, I would be interested in hearing what pads people are running? I have stock calipers, and drilled rotors. TIA, Mark Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dkettler at powercom.net Thu Nov 1 17:32:31 2007 From: dkettler at powercom.net (David Kettler) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:32:31 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Just Sick - car stolen References: <8cbd782d0710291506i7942f068w6850ed865224c5e@mail.gmail.com><001101c81af9$4df35270$c59c3e4b@keng> <8cbd782d0710300812kfda4d80gc8882b9d9067a942@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <007201c81ce7$dbd9b440$091172d8@David> Chuck: Did the car have a logbook? Which race organization? Logbook number? This info may also be helpful to race organizations. I suspect that the chassis numbers are no longer there since it is a racecar. Dave Kettler ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Arnold" To: "BFEKen at copper.net" ; "Friends" ; "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net> Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2007 10:12 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Just Sick - car stolen > Unfortunately the trailer is as plain jane as you could get. I purposely > had no markings on it indicating a race car. It is white. It has a side > door [with the lock broken out]. The inside has gray vinyl flooring. The > front right plywood is broken and the outside bends out a little from > when > the car "got away inside one day" at bumper hight. > Plates are 4476 SW, Washington state. > > Here is what I psoted to our race group: > > This weekend my 16x7 White Road Force trailer was stolen from the 2400 > block > of Westlake Ave North in Seattle. My green 1968 Triumph TR5 race car was > inside. Car number is 444. Trailer license is 4476SW. If anyone gets a > wiff of these please notify the Seattle police. Case number is 07-441715. > > Pictures at: > http://picasaweb.google.com/Triosan/StolenTR5 > > > > On 10/30/07, BFEKen at copper.net wrote: >> >> Chuck, hopefully when the see the race car, they will dump it quick. >> >> KEN >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Chuck Arnold" >> To: "Friends" >> Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 2:06 PM >> Subject: [Fot] Just Sick - car stolen >> >> >> > Came home from a 5 day trip to find only the remnants of the smashed >> > receiver lock where my trailer, containing my TR250 race car, was when >> > I >> > left. Hoped like hell it had been impounded for parking too long in a >> > city >> > lot [I live on a houseboat and the trailer lives in the lot where I >> park]. >> > No such luck. Police report filed, insurance claim in. >> > >> > Information: Trailer was a white 16x7 Road force. No exterior >> markings. >> > Car: BRG #444 TR5. Accusump and dual master cylinders under hood. >> > Battery >> > and cell in rear. Full cage. Stainless lines to the >> injectors. Mallory >> > distributor. Fabricated dash. No speedo. 4 speed, no OD. >> > >> > Photos at: >> > http://picasaweb.google.com/Triosan/StolenTR5 >> > >> > -- >> > Chuck Arnold >> > _______________________________________________ >> > http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > >> > bfeken at copper.net >> > Fot mailing list >> > Fot at autox.team.net >> > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> >> > > > -- > Chuck Arnold > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > dkettler at powercom.net > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From stlnyc at msn.com Thu Nov 1 18:32:43 2007 From: stlnyc at msn.com (Fred & Mary Hodgson) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:32:43 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Nomination Message-ID: I would like to nominate Fred Easton to our honorable [?] band. He has a pair of TR-6's & a Lotus Esprit that he drives to shows. Has no use for a car he can't drive, so there's no trailering or "car under glass" scenarios involved. Second anyone? e-mail is Benchmarkmap at charter.net Fred Hodgson From klynch_6 at msn.com Thu Nov 1 18:36:52 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:36:52 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Nomination References: Message-ID: I'll second that. Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: Fred & Mary Hodgson To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 7:32 PM Subject: [Fot] Nomination I would like to nominate Fred Easton to our honorable [?] band. He has a pair of TR-6's & a Lotus Esprit that he drives to shows. Has no use for a car he can't drive, so there's no trailering or "car under glass" scenarios involved. Second anyone? e-mail is Benchmarkmap at charter.net> Fred Hodgson _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From S.Janzen at comcast.net Thu Nov 1 18:38:51 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 21:38:51 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Kansas City Recommendations Message-ID: <014201c81cf1$1fb23d50$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> I'll be in Kansas City over the weekend - visiting an older uncle with my Mom. Any must-see sites and restaurant (lunch or dinner) recommendations that will satisfy both a vegetarian (+fish) and the rest of us? From wgrosenbach at juno.com Thu Nov 1 18:53:51 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:53:51 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Nomination Message-ID: <20071101.195351.2480.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Triumph & Lotus. That's a good combination. I'll second that. Bill On Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:32:43 -0600 "Fred & Mary Hodgson" writes: > I would like to nominate Fred Easton to our honorable [?] band. He > has a pair > of TR-6's & a Lotus Esprit that he drives to shows. Has no use for > a car he > can't drive, so there's no trailering or "car under glass" scenarios > involved. > Second anyone? > > e-mail is > Benchmarkmap at charter.net > > Fred Hodgson > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tony at tonydrews.com Thu Nov 1 18:57:31 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2007 20:57:31 -0500 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com > References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20071102025710.DA9AF187A1D@autox.team.net> Due to my roll bar arrangement, a tilton pedal assembly woudn't work, so we fabricated a knock off of the revington kit shown here: http://www.revingtontr.com/shop/mainframe.asp?http://www.revingtontr.com/shop/product_display.asp?a=2&mscssid=X0XP0W21QF6M9LLGCRJN3HAGCXN46V5D&SiteLanguage=eng&CarType=TR4&PageType=default&ProductID=RTR4080LAK (part number RTR4080LAK) The sheetmetal is basically the same arrangement as stock, but wider. There's a linkage to connect the stock brake pedal to the dual cylinders that works suprisingly well. You put a spacer on the bolt for the clutch cylinder to cover the new offset, and that works suprisingly well too. I have a different rear brake setup, so can't help with the bore size question, but since the stock system sent the same pressure to all wheels, I'd think the same size cylinders all around are appropriate. I used girling remote reservoir cylinders that I sourced from DRE, the formula vee folks. With several sets of balance bars with the center hole drilled in varying places, you can adjust the bias without having the cockpit adjustable deal that doesn't look very vintage. You need pretty short cylinders, so the normal Tilton master cylinders don't fit. I seem to remember them coming up with some shorty ones recently, though. I can send some pics of the arrangement if desired. We mocked it up and had a local fabricator actually made it. Looks like it belongs there. - Tony At 03:07 PM 11/1/2007, you wrote: >Hi All, > >I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, >and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion >on a tr4? I see that revington tr has a bolt on one, but it is really >pricey. Any suggestions would be appreciated. > >Thanks in advance, >Mark >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From triosan at gmail.com Thu Nov 1 20:56:10 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 20:56:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered today in a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from where I live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to force open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type trailer. Do not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to work hard to push it around with the welded diff. Can sell the wheels [Koenig rewinds in a brown color with nearly new 205x60x15 Yokohama A08s], fuel cell [new this year 12 gallon Fuel safe], fuel pump [Bosch 160 psi], regulator, aluminum radiator, Optima battery, Accusump and racing seat. Not much else. They will never get it started [broken throttle cable] as the PI is very tricky to get the cold start lever right, and even then it takes a lot of cranking. OH, I suppose they could also sell he Konis. I expect it will get stripped, chopped up and dumped in the Sound. Very sad end to such a pretty bridesmaid. She was ready to race, but has never done yet. None-the-less, I will find and/or build a replacement and have it ready for the SOVREN kick off in mid-April. Sigh. -- Chuck Arnold From N197TR4 at cs.com Fri Nov 2 05:58:04 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 08:58:04 EDT Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car Message-ID: Chuck! I admire your great attitude over the whole thing. I know the amount of effort that you have put into this car, since the time that Jan & I delivered this car to you, with a trip over the mountains. It occurs to me that, if these guys DID have any idea of this "TR5", it may be in a container headed for Japan or Australia with a buyer waiting at the other end. Of course, we are all standing by, to help get you back on the track. Joe Alexander > Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered today in > a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from where I > live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to force > open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type trailer. Do > not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to work hard > to push it around with the welded diff. > > Can sell the wheels [Koenig rewinds in a brown color with nearly new > 205x60x15 Yokohama A08s], fuel cell [new this year 12 gallon Fuel safe], > fuel pump [Bosch 160 psi], regulator, aluminum radiator, Optima battery, > Accusump and racing seat. Not much else. They will never get it started > [broken throttle cable] as the PI is very tricky to get the cold start lever > right, and even then it takes a lot of cranking. OH, I suppose they could > also sell he Konis. I expect it will get stripped, chopped up and dumped in > the Sound. Very sad end to such a pretty bridesmaid. She was ready to > race, but has never done yet. > > None-the-less, I will find and/or build a replacement and have it ready for > the SOVREN kick off in mid-April. Sigh. > > -- > Chuck Arnold > _______________________________________________ > From N197TR4 at cs.com Fri Nov 2 06:50:27 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 09:50:27 EDT Subject: [Fot] Piston Search Over Message-ID: Thanks for all of the kind and generous responses. I am back in business. Joe Alexander, MDD (Master's In Dumpster Diving) From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 2 07:17:17 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:17:17 EDT Subject: [Fot] Spit/GT6 valences Message-ID: Anybody know of a supplier that stocks the early Spit-GT6 front valences in fiberglass? My original is bent beyond reason and it's time for a replacement. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From herald948 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 07:29:25 2007 From: herald948 at aol.com (herald948 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 10:29:25 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Spit/GT6 valences In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8C9EB73E70F7076-1C0-11BB@WEBMAIL-MB02.sysops.aol.com> -----Original Message----- From: Gt6steve at aol.com Anybody know of a supplier that stocks the early Spit-GT6 front valences in fiberglass? My original is bent beyond reason and it's time for a replacement. ==AM== You might try Honeybourne Mouldings in the UK. --Andy Mace *Mrs Irrelevant: Oh, is it a jet? *Man: Well, no ... It's not so much of a jet, it's more your, er, Triumph Herald engine with wings. -- Cut-price Airlines Sketch, Monty Python's Flying Circus (22) Check out the North American Triumph Sports 6 (Vitesse 6) and Triumph Herald Database at its new URL: ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com From lunkercars at earthlink.net Fri Nov 2 08:37:40 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg Lunker Hilyer) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 09:37:40 -0600 Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <45ADFB6C-9ABC-4868-AFE8-E8BDAEE330C5@earthlink.net> Chuck, I'm still holding a candle of hope that your car will be recovered. Having lived many years in your area, I've got a couple ideas that may be worth pursuing. First is that South Seattle Auto Auction [Kent] and Puget Sound Auto Auction [Auburn] are both near where the trailer was found - in the years that I managed SSAA, we would occasionally find a stolen vehicle gathering dust in the dealer parking area. Police theory was that it was a inconspicuous area for auto activity to blend in. Also, if someone was trying to get the car transported somewhere, this is where many trucking companies stage their loads. Might be worth a drive by these places. Second would be to contact Cosmopolitan Motors [Seattle] and Park Place Motors [Bellevue]. Although neither would knowingly buy a stolen car, they do both occasionally deal with vintage race cars and so wouldn't be put off by a car without a title. If the car [or parts] are being offered around for sale, they [Cosmopolitan most likely] would probably have heard of it. Another to check with would be the British/German/Italian dismantler on Aurora Ave - Can't remember the name but do remember that they would buy most anything. As for the car being shipped out of the country, I would doubt it... Technically impossible without a title and too long a paper trail for thieves to deal with. If you want to cover all the bases, contact Broadway Title [www.broadwaytitle.com]. They are the largest provider of "alternate titles" around. If someone wanted to get a title to sell the car, it would likely go thru them. Make sure they [and the police report] get any #s you have [engine, body, commission, etc]. one number in the reporting may not be enough since there is always confusion as to what #s to use. Hope this may be of some help. Greg Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 1, 2007, at 9:56 PM, Chuck Arnold wrote: > Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered > today in > a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from > where I > live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to > force > open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type > trailer. Do > not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to > work hard > to push it around with the welded diff. From WEmery7451 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 09:34:30 2007 From: WEmery7451 at aol.com (WEmery7451 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:34:30 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/1/07 2:50:08 PM Pacific Standard Time, markvaden at gmail.com writes: << Does anyone have a suggestion on bore sizes to start with. I am running stoc k TR4 front and rear brakes.>> When I installed the Revington system several years ago when a dual system was required, two standard TR-3/4 brake master cylinders were furnished, along with a TR-4 clutch master cylinder (with the reservoir). Revington's instructions at that time said that no smaller bore master cylinders were made. Now I have heard that Tilton and others may make the smaller bore brake master cylinders. I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had to push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. It didn't take long to get use to this requirement, and in my opinion the system works very well. Don't accidentally take out that little balance valve for the front disc brakes. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 10:24:58 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:24:58 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: Message-ID: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin> I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much harder and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more control on the front/rear balance. Joe C. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:34 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had to > push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. From jfrymark at aol.com Fri Nov 2 10:21:23 2007 From: jfrymark at aol.com (John Frymark) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:21:23 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Kansas City Message-ID: Scott, My wife's from Kansas, so here are her suggestions: Restaurants: Plaza III (best steaks and fish, too. Very $$$), Hereford House (Harry Truman's favorite...steaks as the name implies), The Bristol in Leawood, italian food in Little Italy To do: The Plaza (hopefully the holiday lights are up) is tribute to Seville, Spain, Hall's Dept Store (a hobby of the "Hallmark" Family), Jazz (many places), Riverboat gambling. Nebraska is playing #8 (!) KU saturday so Lawrence (40 minutes away) will be a BIG PARTY! http://www.tripadvisor.com/Attractions-g44535-Activities-c7- Kansas_City_Missouri.html John Frymark (Flying the KU Flag this weekend) From Fubog1 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 10:29:47 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 13:29:47 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: You're splitting the force (pedal effort) between 2 cylinders. Obviously smaller cylinders will make for an easier pedal, with the increase in travel. Some of the modern friction materials are so effective, we can get by with larger cylinders. Glen In a message dated 11/2/2007 1:14:05 PM Eastern Daylight Time, spitlist at cox.net writes: I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much harder and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more control on the front/rear balance. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Fri Nov 2 10:49:58 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:49:58 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Corporate sponsorships for the owner/driver Message-ID: <000201c81d78$c9735900$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Vintage racers, I am seeking some opinions about corporate sponsorships for the cars and drivers in Vintage Racing. Major corporations already support the tracks and clubs. I have been testing the sponsorship waters for the sole purpose of covering travel and sign up expenses to such races as the GP at Watkins Glen and similar high profile races. For me, Watkins Glen is a 3,200 mile round trip and will take a week. Sebring, 3,800 miles, Laguna Seca, 2,500..enough about that said. I don't need to preach to any of you about the expenses of racing. I actually have a prospective sponsor that caters to primarily to the 45 & up crowd. My ( our ) problem is what I ( we ) have little to offer in return. I am certainly not talking about plastering the car with corporate logo's and creating a media circus like NASCAR et.al. Outside the vintage race magazines we get very little if any media coverage. The larger events such as Watkins Glen with the weekend festival offer more opportunity but there is still not a lot. For starters I would offer a catered hospitality tent in the pit. I think if more opportunities were created by the promoters and clubs we, the drivers, could attract some sponsors. I read some where that the GP at Watkins Glen had 60,000 spectators over three days in ' 04. As far as the small local events, I have no idea, my experience in Colorado is the overwhelming majority of the spectators are friends and family so sponsorship at a local level is tough at best. Vintage racing is not a " win at any cost " sport. There are no winners declared at the end of the day, no podium ceremonies and no winners circle. I think many potential sponsors can appreciate that and still participate as long as they can get some exposure and appreciation for their contribution. Many of you may remember the two E types fielded by Jaguar in 2003. The attached link is to an article in Automobile magazine is about Jaguars participation in Vintage racing and I consider it a pretty good read. http://www.automobilemag.com/features/racing/0408_jaguar_select/index.ht ml I have some ideas about how sponsors could benefit and still maintain the vintage spirit but I want to hear what other drivers and club representatives feel about the issue. I'm not looking for huge money to fund my car, I just think racing should be just a little easier for the regular guy or gal on a budget that wants to go racing and has the initiative to get a sponsor for tires, sign up fees or travel expenses. In Colorado we two tracks and four vintage events per year. I really want to get out East and West but it will be near impossible to do on my budget without some help and I know of many others in the same position. In the coming month, I will likely write to the editors of the vintage magazines for public critique. FoT your input would be appreciated and I hope I have not offended and gone against the Vintage spirit. Jim Gray RMVR From lang at isis.mit.edu Fri Nov 2 12:04:39 2007 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert Lang) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:04:39 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] Corporate sponsorships for the owner/driver In-Reply-To: <000201c81d78$c9735900$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> References: <000201c81d78$c9735900$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: Hi, I'm hardly an expert on the matter, but my Vintage GCR which is used as the rules basis for most vintage racing bodies has a few references to sponsor material on the cars... like the 1967 GCR that limits ads to 20 square inches and "in good taste". As far as off the track sponsorship, the various activities like wine and cheese or barbeques, those could be made to work (easily), but you should talk to the event hosts as they'll probably want some return on such things. I actually find it fascinating that the '67 GCR cutoff has this advertising component. my $.02 rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Room N42-140Q | This space for rent Consultant MIT IS&T unix-linux-help | Voice:617-253-7438 FAX: 617-258-9535 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Fri Nov 2 12:06:22 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:06:22 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Message-ID: <003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> The pedal effort required to operate the brakes is determined by the area of the master cylinder or cylinders in relation to the area of the wheel cylinders or caliper pistons. So using two master cylinders of the same size gives WAY more piston area and the effort required will go up damatically. When we put a Tilton balance bar setup on Bill Fink's Morgan SLR a number of years ago we used two 5/8" masters and that still required more pedal effort than the stock single 3/4" master that a Morgan uses. I understand that someone, possibly Wilwood now makes 9/16" Master cylinders. They would be closer in total piston area the a singe 3/4 or .700" master. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Curry" To: ; ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 10:24 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 >I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master > cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much harder > and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual > circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more > control > on the front/rear balance. > > Joe C. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: ; > Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:34 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 >> I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had > to >> push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 12:35:06 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:35:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin> <003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> Message-ID: <007c01c81d87$78ec4640$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Unfortunately, unless you go to a different brand master cylinder, there are no options for Spitfires. The clutch and single circuit brake master cylinders have the same bore. But it does work pretty well as long as you remember that more effort is required. Bill B's comment about using the same size bore for both clutch and brake master cylinders is "Spot On" Keeps things simple. Joe C. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Solow" To: "Joe Curry" ; ; ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 12:06 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > The pedal effort required to operate the brakes is determined by the area of > the master cylinder or cylinders in relation to the area of the wheel > cylinders or caliper pistons. So using two master cylinders of the same size > gives WAY more piston area and the effort required will go up damatically. > When we put a Tilton balance bar setup on Bill Fink's Morgan SLR a number of > years ago we used two 5/8" masters and that still required more pedal effort > than the stock single 3/4" master that a Morgan uses. I understand that > someone, possibly Wilwood now makes 9/16" Master cylinders. They would be > closer in total piston area the a singe 3/4 or .700" master. From spreiss at verizon.net Thu Nov 1 21:18:38 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 15:18:38 +1100 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin> <003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> Message-ID: <002c01c81d07$71d796f0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Is it correct to assume that a single cylinder, dual piston master as commonly found in modern braking systems would similarly require increased pedal pressure? In any case, I'm not sure I understand the restrction on fitting such a master, sourced inexpensively from a Toyota for instance, when the rules seem to allow expensive custom systems from aftermarket manufacturers that were never available to racers "back in the day". Am I being naive? What also of employing brake boosters? They were available as early as 1969 or thereabouts if I'm not mistaken, and though obviously not used on the earlier cars have been fitted to them for street applications with good results for some time. Steve P ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Solow" To: "Joe Curry" ; ; ; Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 6:06 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > The pedal effort required to operate the brakes is determined by the area of > the master cylinder or cylinders in relation to the area of the wheel > cylinders or caliper pistons. So using two master cylinders of the same size > gives WAY more piston area and the effort required will go up damatically. > When we put a Tilton balance bar setup on Bill Fink's Morgan SLR a number of > years ago we used two 5/8" masters and that still required more pedal effort > than the stock single 3/4" master that a Morgan uses. I understand that > someone, possibly Wilwood now makes 9/16" Master cylinders. They would be > closer in total piston area the a singe 3/4 or .700" master. > > Greg Solow > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Joe Curry" > To: ; ; > Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 10:24 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > > > >I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master > > cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much harder > > and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual > > circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more > > control > > on the front/rear balance. > > > > Joe C. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: > > To: ; > > Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:34 AM > > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > >> I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had > > to > >> push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Fubog1 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 12:33:10 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:33:10 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/2/2007 3:25:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time, spreiss at verizon.net writes: Is it correct to assume that a single cylinder, dual piston master as commonly found in modern braking systems would similarly require increased pedal pressure? It doesn't matter what flavor, size is size. As I mentioned previously pedal ratio is a big factor also. HTH Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 12:37:26 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:37:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: Message-ID: It's not a balance vbalve, it's a residual pressure valve. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of WEmery7451 at aol.com Sent: Fri 11/2/2007 9:34 AM To: markvaden at gmail.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In a message dated 11/1/07 2:50:08 PM Pacific Standard Time, markvaden at gmail.com writes: << Does anyone have a suggestion on bore sizes to start with. I am running stoc k TR4 front and rear brakes.>> When I installed the Revington system several years ago when a dual system was required, two standard TR-3/4 brake master cylinders were furnished, along with a TR-4 clutch master cylinder (with the reservoir). Revington's instructions at that time said that no smaller bore master cylinders were made. Now I have heard that Tilton and others may make the smaller bore brake master cylinders. I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had to push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. It didn't take long to get use to this requirement, and in my opinion the system works very well. Don't accidentally take out that little balance valve for the front disc brakes. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tarch at bellsouth.net Fri Nov 2 12:46:53 2007 From: tarch at bellsouth.net (Richard Taylor) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:46:53 -0400 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <008201c81d89$1f0f98a0$8901a8c0@richardiipc> Bill, For those of us who don't know a residual valve from Shinola, what's it do? Although I've been told it is normal, I have never been able to get the front wheels of my TR-4 to rotate absolutely freely (while off the ground) without some pad drag. Richard atlanta It's not a balance vbalve, it's a residual pressure valve. From kaskas at cox.net Fri Nov 2 12:53:39 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:53:39 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin><003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> <002c01c81d07$71d796f0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <008701c81d8a$103fd410$0a10c548@RW> In 1969 I made up a dual brake system for the Competition Department TR-250. The booster chamber unit was removed. I used two 5/8" master cylinders and made my own pedal arm that had a 4.5 to 1 ratio. It worked so well we kept it on the TR-6 that replaced the TR-250 body and when I saw that car in 2002 at Mid-Ohio it still had the same pedal box I had made so long ago. It was the way that I recognized the car as being my old racer. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Preiss" To: "Greg Solow" ; "Joe Curry" ; ; ; Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 9:18 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Is it correct to assume that a single cylinder, dual piston master as > commonly found in modern braking systems would similarly require increased > pedal pressure? In any case, I'm not sure I understand the restrction on > fitting such a master, sourced inexpensively from a Toyota for instance, > when the rules seem to allow expensive custom systems from aftermarket > manufacturers that were never available to racers "back in the day". Am I > being naive? What also of employing brake boosters? They were available as > early as 1969 or thereabouts if I'm not mistaken, and though obviously not > used on the earlier cars have been fitted to them for street applications > with good results for some time. > Steve P > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Greg Solow" > To: "Joe Curry" ; ; > ; > Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 6:06 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > > >> The pedal effort required to operate the brakes is determined by the area > of >> the master cylinder or cylinders in relation to the area of the wheel >> cylinders or caliper pistons. So using two master cylinders of the same > size >> gives WAY more piston area and the effort required will go up >> damatically. >> When we put a Tilton balance bar setup on Bill Fink's Morgan SLR a number > of >> years ago we used two 5/8" masters and that still required more pedal > effort >> than the stock single 3/4" master that a Morgan uses. I understand that >> someone, possibly Wilwood now makes 9/16" Master cylinders. They would be >> closer in total piston area the a singe 3/4 or .700" master. >> >> Greg Solow >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Joe Curry" >> To: ; ; >> Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 10:24 AM >> Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 >> >> >> >I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master >> > cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much > harder >> > and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual >> > circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more >> > control >> > on the front/rear balance. >> > >> > Joe C. >> > >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: >> > To: ; >> > Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:34 AM >> > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 >> >> I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I > had >> > to >> >> push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. >> > _______________________________________________ >> > http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > >> > Fot mailing list >> > Fot at autox.team.net >> > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Fubog1 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 12:55:46 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:55:46 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 ps... Message-ID: In a message dated 11/2/2007 3:25:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time, spreiss at verizon.net writes: single cylinder, dual piston master as commonly found in modern braking systems Many dual circuit cylinders have stepped bores, at least on front disc/rear drum cars. This obviously affects the front/rear balance & displacement issues. Slight changes make big differences... Glen Richard the rpv is to keep very slight pressure in the system to minimize pad kickback ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From kaskas at cox.net Fri Nov 2 12:57:45 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:57:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <008201c81d89$1f0f98a0$8901a8c0@richardiipc> Message-ID: <00a801c81d8a$a2cb8b80$0a10c548@RW> When you stopped the car before jacking it up to test the wheel rotation the pressure was retained by the valve from that last braking effort. If you just pound your fist on the top (side) of the tire that will knock the pads back a bit and everything will be just dandy. The same thing happens when the car is running down the road, the bumps and side effort onto the tread keeps the pads back. The valve wants to help you not get pad knock-back. It works, kind of. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Taylor" To: "'Bill Babcock'" ; ; ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 12:46 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Bill, > For those of us who don't know a residual valve from Shinola, what's it > do? > Although I've been told it is normal, I have never been able to get the > front wheels of my TR-4 to rotate absolutely freely (while off the ground) > without some pad drag. > > Richard > atlanta > > It's not a balance vbalve, it's a residual pressure valve. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 13:14:08 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 13:14:08 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin><003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> <002c01c81d07$71d796f0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> <008701c81d8a$103fd410$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <00bd01c81d8c$ecfa1b20$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Kas, Isn't 5/8 the same size as the clutch and single circuit brake master used on early Spits? If so, that is the same bor I use on my Spit. Joe C. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kas Kastner" To: "Steven Preiss" ; "Greg Solow" ; "Joe Curry" ; ; ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 12:53 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > In 1969 I made up a dual brake system for the Competition Department TR-250. > The booster chamber unit was removed. I used two 5/8" master cylinders and > made my own pedal arm that had a 4.5 to 1 ratio. It worked so well we kept > it on the TR-6 that replaced the TR-250 body and when I saw that car in 2002 > at Mid-Ohio it still had the same pedal box I had made so long ago. It was > the way that I recognized the car as being my old racer. From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 13:35:32 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 13:35:32 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Alonzo and McLaren part ways Message-ID: <00dd01c81d8f$ea5c3760$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Today, I see that what I guess we all knew was inevitable was made official. Alonzo's contract is not being renewed for 2008. It was stated as "A mutual parting of ways", but I think that there is no way that Ron Dennis would bring him back next season considering all the complaining and lack of team effort that Alono diaplayed over the course of this season, not to mention the Stepneygate affair. Which makes one wonder which branch Alonzo will alight on next season. I will be watchng very closely to see who wil take him. Joe C. From jfrymark at aol.com Fri Nov 2 13:51:10 2007 From: jfrymark at aol.com (John Frymark) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 13:51:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing Message-ID: <3AE98E65-A2E1-4847-BCC2-C0A191DF5D66@aol.com> While the topic of Corporate Sponsorship in vintage racing can be viewed (critiqued?) in many ways, there is a tax implication that should be considered. I am no tax expert. I looked into something similar a while ago so I can offer these comments. A sponsor can justify their expenditure as advertising expense if it meets basic "smell tests", i.e. an activity that gets their name or product in front of their target market generating sales and/or goodwill. A for-profit entity receiving this sponsorship treats it as income. Unfortunately, it is impossible to claim that amateur vintage racing by itself, with no prize money, is a for-profit activity. It is therefore considered a hobby and "There is a one-way tax rule for hobbies: Income from a hobby is taxable as "other income" on form 1040; EXPENSES ARE DEDUCTIBLE ONLY TO THE EXTENT YOU REPORT HOBBY INCOME, and the deduction is limited on Schedule A by the 2% adjusted gross income (AGI) floor for miscellaneous deductions. Hobby losses are considered NONDEDUCTIBLE PERSONAL LOSSES. A profitable sale of hobby collection or activity held long term is taxable as a capital gain; losses are NOT deductible." JK Lasser's federal Tax Guide 2003 As we have all seen at Vintage Races, some participants have "sponsorship" by their own businesses. Gil Nickels' Far Niente Winery brought the transporter, cars, support crew, hospitality tent... the whole nine. I am sure this was all part of the winery advertising budget and assets of the business. Generally, the nature of hobby racing makes our expenses purely out-of-pocket...unless we have a sideline income producing business that benefits from our racing activities. Maybe some other FOTers want to weigh in here. From REK46 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 13:52:51 2007 From: REK46 at aol.com (REK46 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 16:52:51 EDT Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing Message-ID: That's the same in SCCA racing as well....unless YOU or DADDY own the business,you can't write off racing unless it has potential for earnings ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From tr5racer at btinternet.com Fri Nov 2 14:00:30 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 21:00:30 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Update on stolen TR5 race car Message-ID: <750090.19142.qm@web86602.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Commiserations to you Chuck on the theft of your TR5 race car. I know I would be gutted if anything like that happened to my TR5. Strangely in the UK in the 23 years that the TR Register Race Championship has been run I don't ever remember any driver having there TR race car stolen and not recovered. A few years back a couple of the race guys had their trailers stolen with their race cars on them and in both cases the cars were found abandoned later minus the trailer! I don't think that was any reflection on the condition of the cars, just that the trailers were easier to dispose of. Hope you are successful in recovering it. Mike Hughes --------------------------------- For ideas on reducing your carbon footprint visit Yahoo! For Good this month. From kaskas at cox.net Fri Nov 2 15:49:53 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:49:53 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys Message-ID: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. From kaskas at cox.net Fri Nov 2 16:27:06 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 16:27:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Message-ID: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box and worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase the ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the other ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 16:41:08 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 16:41:08 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <20071102234552.IZDZ9726.fed1rmmtao101.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Who is going to write a letter to Ralf? HeHe... At 03:49 PM 11/2/2007, Kas Kastner wrote: >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. From spreiss at verizon.net Fri Nov 2 01:43:47 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 19:43:47 +1100 Subject: [Fot] tr 3/4 brakes Message-ID: <008a01c81d2c$7c4b8630$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Is there a published detailed explanation of the state of the art brake hydraulic system for these cars? I know that there are many elements of the system that have not been touched on in this thread, and that the overall performance depends on total engineering (been studying Lotus literature!). All things working in consort, I'm beginning to understand, from the coefficient of friction of the pedal pads to the stiffness of the front spindles to the tire compound, and everything in-between. Guess that's what makes building an effective racing car such a demanding (and rewarding?) undertaking, and also explains the appeal to many of spec racing. From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 16:59:42 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 16:59:42 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <000601c81dac$6f85cfc0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball numbers! By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas Kastner Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 17:07:09 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 17:07:09 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <000701c81dad$7a4159b0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Wait, I see you already speculated on who replaces button. So who goes to Renault to replace Heikki? It is already speculated that Alonzo goes back to Renault (If Flav will take him back) but that still leaves an open seat there since I am guessing Fisichella will not retain his seat? (This is all very confusing!) :) I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball numbers! By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas Kastner Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 17:09:01 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:09:01 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <000601c81dac$6f85cfc0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> <000601c81dac$6f85cfc0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: <20071103001319.VODC27287.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Rumor (and Kas indicated too) had Rosberg headed that way At 04:59 PM 11/2/2007, Joe Curry wrote: >I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that >you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball >numbers! > >By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? > >Joe C. > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net >[mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas >Kastner >Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys > >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button >goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the >post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 17:12:18 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:12:18 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <000701c81dad$7a4159b0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> <000701c81dad$7a4159b0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: <20071103001639.CBGG21541.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Flav is still his manager. Renault has indicated that their drivers are "not" equal and Heikki wants to be equal. Indications he might to McLaren http://www.f1i.com/content/view/8756/1/ At 05:07 PM 11/2/2007, Joe Curry wrote: >Wait, I see you already speculated on who replaces button. So who goes to >Renault to replace Heikki? It is already speculated that Alonzo goes back >to Renault (If Flav will take him back) but that still leaves an open seat >there since I am guessing Fisichella will not retain his seat? > >(This is all very confusing!) :) > > >I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that >you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball >numbers! > >By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? > >Joe C. > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net >[mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas >Kastner >Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys > >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button >goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the >post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Fri Nov 2 18:22:13 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 18:22:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys Message-ID: <002d01c81db7$f6dd0640$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Maybe Ralph will join JPM , Scott Speed and Jack V in Nascar, what a hoot that would be. jim g From chasgee at aol.com Fri Nov 2 17:46:15 2007 From: chasgee at aol.com (chasgee at aol.com) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 20:46:15 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction In-Reply-To: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> References: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <8C9EBCA130939AA-8EC-1D2E@FWM-D44.sysops.aol.com> Just don't let it happen again.... Chuck -----Original Message----- From: Kas Kastner To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 4:27 pm Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box and worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase the ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the other ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com From jibjib at att.net Fri Nov 2 18:15:44 2007 From: jibjib at att.net (Jack Brooks) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 18:15:44 -0700 Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <02ae01c81db7$0fbbb680$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> Chuck, I live in Covington. Please email me with more specifics on the location so both I and my realtor wife can keep our eyes open. She is out in the car all day and knows TR's. Jack -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+jibjib=att.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+jibjib=att.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Chuck Arnold Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 8:56 PM To: Friends; Triumph; Triumph List Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered today in a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from where I live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to force open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type trailer. Do not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to work hard to push it around with the welded diff. Can sell the wheels [Koenig rewinds in a brown color with nearly new 205x60x15 Yokohama A08s], fuel cell [new this year 12 gallon Fuel safe], fuel pump [Bosch 160 psi], regulator, aluminum radiator, Optima battery, Accusump and racing seat. Not much else. They will never get it started [broken throttle cable] as the PI is very tricky to get the cold start lever right, and even then it takes a lot of cranking. OH, I suppose they could also sell he Konis. I expect it will get stripped, chopped up and dumped in the Sound. Very sad end to such a pretty bridesmaid. She was ready to race, but has never done yet. None-the-less, I will find and/or build a replacement and have it ready for the SOVREN kick off in mid-April. Sigh. -- Chuck Arnold Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From koblinger at verizon.net Fri Nov 2 18:17:38 2007 From: koblinger at verizon.net (Kurt Oblinger) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 18:17:38 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <472BCC32.9030103@verizon.net> My $.02, Alonso and Rosberg swap seats. I've read rumors that part of the deal for Dennis to let Alonso go was that he not go to a manufacturer team. Then Mc-Merc would have a British and a German driver. Cheers, Kurt O. Kas Kastner wrote: >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From cak at dimebank.com Fri Nov 2 18:36:47 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 18:36:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] tr 3/4 brakes Message-ID: <200711030136.lA31al0F002983@moose.dimebank.com> You could start with Fred Puhn's "Brake Handbook" ... From budscars at msn.com Fri Nov 2 18:42:14 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (CHARLES DELAUER) Date: Sat, 03 Nov 2007 01:42:14 +0000 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <20071103001319.VODC27287.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: Hi gang..report from The CSRG Race at Thunderhill...Incredible Weather...75-80 degrees at 6pm...The Triumphs that i saw today(I was teching) Racer Bud's Spitfire(Me)..John James' TR4...Gary Horskorta's Tr4..Jeff Abramson's Morgan Super sport....Bill Hart's Triumph special(I saw it in the transporter while I was teching other stuff)....more Tr Stuff may show up tomorrow Racer Bud and...THE OLD GUYS STILL DUMB ENOUGH TO RACE CHALLENGE Gang....Whooohoo! Racer Bud >From: "David W. Riddle" >To: >Subject: Re: [Fot] F-1 guys >Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:09:01 -0700 > >Rumor (and Kas indicated too) had Rosberg headed that way > >At 04:59 PM 11/2/2007, Joe Curry wrote: > >I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that > >you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball > >numbers! > > > >By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his >seat? > > > >Joe C. > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net > >[mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas > >Kastner > >Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM > >To: fot at autox.team.net > >Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys > > > >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button > >goes > >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the > >post > >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 2 19:15:14 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 22:15:14 EDT Subject: [Fot] Fwd: FW: A few more pics...engine bay detail & original patina Message-ID: Amici, this is an attachment leading to a few pics of the magnificent Kastner-Brophy GT6 now for sale after restoration. I know virtually nothing of this car beyond that Kas has said it's the one and I have perceived that he loved it. Can we as a group watch it and document it, storing any pics available and welcoming the new owner to our ranks? This is a significant bit of of Kas history so please keep track of it if you can. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Return-Path: Received: from rly-md10.mx.aol.com (rly-md10.mail.aol.com [172.20.29.148]) by air-md02.mail.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILINMD022-92b472b9d8c8a; Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:58:57 -0400 Received: from xmail2.uslec.net (xmail2.uslec.net [209.92.156.55]) by rly-md10.mx.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINMD103-92b472b9d8c8a; Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:58:36 -0400 Received: (qmail 4822 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2007 17:58:37 -0400 Received: from rrcs-24-123-183-46.se.biz.rr.com (HELO DF7B6GC1) (24.123.183.46) by ridgelakefamilymedicine.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2007 17:58:29 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Brian Simpson" To: Subject: FW: A few more pics...engine bay detail & original patina Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 17:58:25 -0400 Organization: Casa Fiora Message-ID: <00d201c81d9b$7f5396a0$6400a8c0 at DF7B6GC1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 thread-index: AcescrdgKbM1wj90TBqcbRLsGEuZ5RxJonaA X-AOL-IP: 209.92.156.55 X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_helo : X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_822_from : X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/mixed by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Brian Simpson Casa Fiora 704.367.9646 704.367.9648 fax www.casafiora.com -----Original Message----- From: Kent S. Bain [mailto:kent at auto-restore.com] Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2007 2:47 PM To: brian.simpson at casafiora.com Cc: 1-A Kent @home; Brian Rechtiene (BRIAN RECHTIENE); Donna Boccuzzi; Kariann Santarsiero; Taffy Richter 11-04 (Taffy); Tim Richey Subject: A few more pics...engine bay detail & original patina Brian... The subject says it all. __________ NOD32 2325 (20070612) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6 (3).JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6 (4).JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6.JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6 (1).JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6 (2).JPG] From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 20:15:36 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 20:15:36 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <008201c81d89$1f0f98a0$8901a8c0@richardiipc> Message-ID: It makes your pads drag--really. A residual pressure valve temporarily maintains some pressure on the calipers after you lift your foot. When you step on your brakes the pistons inside the calipers press the pads against the disk, These pistons are free to slide forward past the seals as the pads wear, which is why there is no adjustment for disk brakes--they self adjust as the pads wear. The pistons are pulled back away from the disk by the spring tension of the neoprene seals. Essentially the seal sticks to the piston a bit, and when you release the pedal the seal lips pull the piston back. Problem is that the lips may pull it too far back, or the disk might have a little excess runout, so the piston gets pulled back too far, and you have to pump the brakes to get the pads back in contact with the disk. A residual pressure valve maintains some of the pressure against the piston, preventing the piston from fully retracting or getting pushed back by disk runout. They hold about ten or fifteen pounds of pressure in the line. Eventually the pressure leaks away, but while you're driving that pressure is pretty much always applied, so your pads drag a little bit. I know it seems like that would be a bad thing, but it's not. The small amount of braking force applied keeps the pads slightly warm, causes no appreciable wear, and off-gasses the material on the surface--all good stuff. The only time isn't not so good is when you screw up and get fifteen pounds of line pressure applied to a drum brake, which is adjusted close to the drum to begin with, and winds up heating the drums and causing fade, or you have a residual pressure valve in a clutch M/C, which keeps pressure applied to the throwout bearing, which toasts the bearing and can ruin your crankshaft thrust washers. Five pounds residual pressure (or none) is about right for a drum brake. -----Original Message----- From: Richard Taylor [mailto:tarch at bellsouth.net] Sent: Fri 11/2/2007 12:46 PM To: Bill Babcock; WEmery7451 at aol.com; markvaden at gmail.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Bill, For those of us who don't know a residual valve from Shinola, what's it do? Although I've been told it is normal, I have never been able to get the front wheels of my TR-4 to rotate absolutely freely (while off the ground) without some pad drag. Richard atlanta It's not a balance vbalve, it's a residual pressure valve. From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 20:25:10 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 20:25:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing References: <3AE98E65-A2E1-4847-BCC2-C0A191DF5D66@aol.com> Message-ID: The fundamental trick is to have the company doing the sponsorship belong to you. Then you can treat the sponsorship as an advertising expense and have all the depreciable assets belong to the company. I investigated all the aspects of this, and decided it wasn't worth the effort for the relatively small expenditures I was making in racing. It's audit bait--and the IRS will be counting your socks and shorts. In truth, I should have gone ahead and done it--I have the world's most tedious accountant, who keeps everything squeaky clean while still ensuring that no expense goes unreported. The IRS has come visiting on two occasions, and left with their tails between their legs both times. I actually had one auditor tell me he would NEVER audit our company again. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of John Frymark Sent: Fri 11/2/2007 1:51 PM To: toodamnfunky at comcast.net Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing While the topic of Corporate Sponsorship in vintage racing can be viewed (critiqued?) in many ways, there is a tax implication that should be considered. I am no tax expert. I looked into something similar a while ago so I can offer these comments. A sponsor can justify their expenditure as advertising expense if it meets basic "smell tests", i.e. an activity that gets their name or product in front of their target market generating sales and/or goodwill. A for-profit entity receiving this sponsorship treats it as income. Unfortunately, it is impossible to claim that amateur vintage racing by itself, with no prize money, is a for-profit activity. It is therefore considered a hobby and "There is a one-way tax rule for hobbies: Income from a hobby is taxable as "other income" on form 1040; EXPENSES ARE DEDUCTIBLE ONLY TO THE EXTENT YOU REPORT HOBBY INCOME, and the deduction is limited on Schedule A by the 2% adjusted gross income (AGI) floor for miscellaneous deductions. Hobby losses are considered NONDEDUCTIBLE PERSONAL LOSSES. A profitable sale of hobby collection or activity held long term is taxable as a capital gain; losses are NOT deductible." JK Lasser's federal Tax Guide 2003 As we have all seen at Vintage Races, some participants have "sponsorship" by their own businesses. Gil Nickels' Far Niente Winery brought the transporter, cars, support crew, hospitality tent... the whole nine. I am sure this was all part of the winery advertising budget and assets of the business. Generally, the nature of hobby racing makes our expenses purely out-of-pocket...unless we have a sideline income producing business that benefits from our racing activities. Maybe some other FOTers want to weigh in here. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 20:29:32 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 20:29:32 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW><000601c81dac$6f85cfc0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> <20071103001319.VODC27287.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: Lots of Newbies in the wings, and with Hamilton's success the floodgates should open. Of course McLaren has been grooming Hamilton since he was thirteen, but the me-toos won't care. No question that Renault would take Alonso back--they already said it publically. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle Sent: Fri 11/2/2007 5:09 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] F-1 guys Rumor (and Kas indicated too) had Rosberg headed that way At 04:59 PM 11/2/2007, Joe Curry wrote: >I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that >you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball >numbers! > >By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? > >Joe C. > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net >[mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas >Kastner >Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys > >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button >goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the >post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Fri Nov 2 21:04:20 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 00:04:20 EDT Subject: [Fot] honeybourne Message-ID: In a message dated 11/2/2007 8:35:37 AM Pacific Standard Time, fot-request at autox.team.net writes: > You might try Honeybourne Mouldings in the UK. > > Known locally (in the UK) as 'Funnybourne mouldings' L From triosan at gmail.com Fri Nov 2 21:40:00 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 21:40:00 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction In-Reply-To: <8C9EBCA130939AA-8EC-1D2E@FWM-D44.sysops.aol.com> References: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> <8C9EBCA130939AA-8EC-1D2E@FWM-D44.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711022140k6375779y388b32095f94f122@mail.gmail.com> probably cannot help it, as he [and me] forget to remember not to! On 11/2/07, chasgee at aol.com wrote: > > Just don't let it happen again.... > > > > Chuck > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Kas Kastner > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 4:27 pm > Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction > > > > > Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box > and > worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase > the > ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the > other > ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 > pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - > http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > -- Chuck Arnold From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 21:49:58 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 21:49:58 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing References: <004001c81dd6$5187cbc0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: I probably should just let this lie, but I hate to see a fellow FOTer walking into a buzz saw. Having done marketing for most of my adult life, I'll tell you that's a lot of work for $5K. And that's not because marketers are overpaid--it's work even when you're good at it. If you could do a catered hospitality tent for that then more power to you, never mind the rest. I've done a race for two years (the Columbia River Classic here in Portland) and acquired sponsors for charity. We collected about $50K in sponsorships and counted ourselves lucky to clear $10K for the charity. Even though we had food donations we didn't have enough, and people went hungry. Good thing we had lots of Kona beer. I had to personally donate $5K for the raffle prize to clear that (it wasn't unexpected). I'm not trying to discourage you, just to tell you that it's a heck of a lot of work and more expenses everywhere than you'd expect. One small example--most tracks have concessionaires. Doing your own catering can be a challenge, hiring a caterer is absolutely out. You have to use the concessionaire, and that's expensive and not good. Tracks and racing organizations expect to get a piece of anything commercial. It's tricky to fly under that radar without setting up a confrontation that can be very embarrassing for your sponsor, so you have to cross all the I's and dot the T's. There is a book on how to manage sponsorship for racing--I never bought it but I flipped through it. I'd start there with someone who has already gone through the grief. The problem with these kind of things is that there is a huge difference between entertaining a few friends at the track informally, and trying to do something similar for money. The stakes and the complexities rise exponentially, and if you can't get enough budget to actually do it right, then it fails. I've done these kind of things with professionals helping me (indispensable) and I'm pretty good at a number of the elements myself, and I'd tell you everything is much harder than you think, takes ten times longer and costs five times more. Give it a go, but be careful, and do your best not to set expectations you can't meet. From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 21:57:31 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 21:57:31 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing In-Reply-To: References: <3AE98E65-A2E1-4847-BCC2-C0A191DF5D66@aol.com> Message-ID: <20071103050150.SILY18576.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> At 08:25 PM 11/2/2007, Bill Babcock wrote: >The fundamental trick is to have the company doing the sponsorship belong to >you. Then you can treat the sponsorship as an advertising expense and have all >the depreciable assets belong to the company. I investigated all the aspects If you have your own company do what I have done. I sponsored another guys car and he had his company sponsor mine. From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Fri Nov 2 23:27:05 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 23:27:05 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <005d01c81de2$8dec09d0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> You could be right Bill. I understand how things can spiral out of control. As far as catering is concerned I was planning on catering for the sponsors guests only. Tent passes would be issued and limited to 30 or so.Watkins Glen has no problem with that, I just have to clear it with SVRA. The Saturday FoT party in our pit is on me and lasts until the beer runs out. The sponsor will have people there to manage and entertain their guests with me popping in and out as I attend to my own racing issues. Plus there will be others there that could represent the " the team" and help with the sponsor. It sounds like your event was much larger anything I'm planning. Again, you may be right as I have not heard from all my prospective suppliers for catering, graphics & RV rental yet.I don't want to over commit and will try to be conservative. I will find that book you refered to and if things start to get too complex then I will bag the idea. By profession I am a construction project manager so I will certainly apply my planning, budgeting and risk management skills to the project with guarded opitimism. Keep it simple ( as it can be ). If you spent $40K that must have been one hell of an event, how many people did you entertain? Jim G -----Original Message----- From: Bill Babcock [mailto:BillB at bnj.com] Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:50 PM To: Bill Babcock; James Gray Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing I probably should just let this lie, but I hate to see a fellow FOTer walking into a buzz saw. Having done marketing for most of my adult life, I'll tell you that's a lot of work for $5K. And that's not because marketers are overpaid--it's work even when you're good at it. If you could do a catered hospitality tent for that then more power to you, never mind the rest. I've done a race for two years (the Columbia River Classic here in Portland) and acquired sponsors for charity. We collected about $50K in sponsorships and counted ourselves lucky to clear $10K for the charity. Even though we had food donations we didn't have enough, and people went hungry. Good thing we had lots of Kona beer. I had to personally donate $5K for the raffle prize to clear that (it wasn't unexpected). I'm not trying to discourage you, just to tell you that it's a heck of a lot of work and more expenses everywhere than you'd expect. One small example--most tracks have concessionaires. Doing your own catering can be a challenge, hiring a caterer is absolutely out. You have to use the concessionaire, and that's expensive and not good. Tracks and racing organizations expect to get a piece of anything commercial. It's tricky to fly under that radar without setting up a confrontation that can be very embarrassing for your sponsor, so you have to cross all the I's and dot the T's. There is a book on how to manage sponsorship for racing--I never bought it but I flipped through it. I'd start there with someone who has already gone through the grief. The problem with these kind of things is that there is a huge difference between entertaining a few friends at the track informally, and trying to do something similar for money. The stakes and the complexities rise exponentially, and if you can't get enough budget to actually do it right, then it fails. I've done these kind of things with professionals helping me (indispensable) and I'm pretty good at a number of the elements myself, and I'd tell you everything is much harder than you think, takes ten times longer and costs five times more. Give it a go, but be careful, and do your best not to set expectations you can't meet. From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 22:31:36 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 22:31:36 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing In-Reply-To: References: <004001c81dd6$5187cbc0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: <20071103053553.HNIA21541.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> At 09:49 PM 11/2/2007, Bill Babcock wrote: >I probably should just let this lie, but I hate to see a fellow FOTer walking >into a buzz saw. Something else you could look at trying that might be a simple way to start and avoid the buzz saw. I put together a rough prospectus like this once and never had the time to pursue it. Bill is right that the amount of time and energy to put this together by yourself might be better spent with a part time job as a greeter at Walmart to earn the extra cash. Seriously though if your potential sponsor is close to you geographically you might want to try this... Leave the vintage events for you to concentrate on you and your car. Of course you can have guests but if you don't have a "staff" to see to your guests they might feel short changed with your attention if you are having to work on the car to make the next session/race. Instead look at using the Street car DE sessions with local groups like NASA, etc. Put a passenger seat in your car (if it does not have one currently) and allow the sponsor to bring people like guests (his vendors, customers) or employees to reward them. At an event like that you are not stressed and you can socialize with your sponsor and his gusts between sessions and take them for rides on the track. Probably take at least four passengers during the event. From tlizzard at msn.com Sat Nov 3 07:09:12 2007 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:09:12 -0400 Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys Message-ID: The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's Championship. And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. We have done it before. Terry Stetler From Fubog1 at aol.com Sat Nov 3 07:14:53 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:14:53 EDT Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION Message-ID: In a message dated 11/3/2007 10:09:21 AM Eastern Daylight Time, tlizzard at msn.com writes: The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's Championship. And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. We have done it before. This is really sad. I tell myself it is because there isn't enough $$ to be made (yeah, right...). I would like to think that we COULD do it... Glad you brought it up Terry, Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From Group44TR7 at aol.com Sat Nov 3 07:25:21 2007 From: Group44TR7 at aol.com (Group44TR7 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:25:21 EDT Subject: [Fot] Southern Califonia transport to Watkins Glen Message-ID: Good Morning If there are any FOT people who would be interested in having their cars transported to and from San Diego area to Watkins Glen and back by commercial carrier, please let me know. The proposal to the carrier will probably be loading and unloading at one (San Diego) or two (San Diego, LA) locations in S. California. I have not started talking with carrier yet, so I don't have any guess at the price. Based on past experience, I expect its going to be in the $3,000 per car range for transport there and back. Cary ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From BillDentin at aol.com Sat Nov 3 07:27:25 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:27:25 EDT Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Message-ID: In a message dated 11/02/2007 6:46:41 PM Central Standard Time, chasgee at aol.com writes: > Just don't let it happen again.... > > It's not an OPTION. You get to a certain age and "I forgot" comes with the turf. I know...I'm there. Bill Dentinger. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Nov 3 07:43:13 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:43:13 EDT Subject: [Fot] Fwd: FW: A few more pics...engine bay detail & original patina Message-ID: Dang, I forgot about the anti-attachment clause. I will put the pics on Photobucket.Com in the album called GT6Steve. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From kaskas at cox.net Sat Nov 3 07:47:19 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 07:47:19 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION References: Message-ID: <008401c81e28$6fc892c0$0a10c548@RW> There is so much money involved in the "Crash and Bash" racing in this country and poor feeder systems with no defined route to the top levels, gaining a spot in F-1 will be next to impossible for years to come unless a guy goes to Europe in the teens and STAYS there. Maybe a fellow could buy his way in as so many have, but that precludes a requirement for talent, thus, backmarker. We can't even keep a F-1 race in this country, poor state of affairs. There is an excuse for our system or lack of system. That is the huge size of the USA. It would be like all of Europe speaking the same language, hopeless. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 7:14 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION > In a message dated 11/3/2007 10:09:21 AM Eastern Daylight Time, > tlizzard at msn.com writes: > > The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American > drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's > Championship. > And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. > > We have done it before. > This is really sad. > I tell myself it is because there isn't enough $$ to be made (yeah, > right...). > I would like to think that we COULD do it... > Glad you brought it up Terry, > Glen > > > > > > ************************************** See what's new at > http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jerrybarr at charter.net Sat Nov 3 08:30:14 2007 From: jerrybarr at charter.net (Jerry Barr) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:30:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: What were we talking about? I FORGOT. On Nov 3, 2007, at 9:27 AM, BillDentin at aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 11/02/2007 6:46:41 PM Central Standard Time, > chasgee at aol.com writes: > > >> Just don't let it happen again.... >> >> > > It's not an OPTION. You get to a certain age and "I forgot" comes > with the > turf. I know...I'm there. > > Bill Dentinger. > > > > ************************************** > See what's new at http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sat Nov 3 08:54:53 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 08:54:53 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000a01c81e31$dfff9940$2202a8c0@newcomputer> It probably has a lot to do with the distance and the numbers. Since there is plenty of racing in the US, most of the quality drivers stay here rather than going to Europe where you have to be in F1. Very little time is spent during the year outside if that general area and precious little in the US (Even less next season) While the money is good, the odds are not so good of one getting in since there are so few seats available. That can be a deterrent to someone who can make all the money he can spend here in the US of A. I will be interested to see how Sebastian Bordais does next year driving for Toro Rosso. If they can get the aerodynamics right on that car, with Ferrari power, he should be competitive. Joe -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Fubog1 at aol.com Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 7:15 AM To: tlizzard at msn.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION In a message dated 11/3/2007 10:09:21 AM Eastern Daylight Time, tlizzard at msn.com writes: The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's Championship. And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. We have done it before. This is really sad. I tell myself it is because there isn't enough $$ to be made (yeah, right...). I would like to think that we COULD do it... Glad you brought it up Terry, Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From hottr6 at hotmail.com Sat Nov 3 09:08:07 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 12:08:07 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Message-ID: Kas Kastner wrote: > Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box and > worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase the > ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the other > ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 > pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. When I built my brake system, I computed the numbers for a stock TR6 brake system without the servo and a pedal ratio of 4.36 (rather than the paltry stock 3.5). 110 lbs of foot pressure (appropriate for "emergency" braking) on this pedal gives a theoretical pressure at the pads of 1259 pounds. 700 pounds at the pads requires around 60 lbs of foot pressure. But this is all theoretical and the real world does include a lot of losses. I stayed with a ratio of 4.36 because I am running Wilwood 4-pots on 11"-13" vented rotors all round. Unsprung weight for this (and Southwick hubs) is the same as the stock brakes. For a good treatise on modern and racing brake technology, I use Mavrigian and Carley's "Brake Systems", published by HP Books. Dated 1998 so it is a bit old, but non-computerized off-the-shelf systems have not changed much since then. Shane Ingate at 7,500' in NM. _________________________________________________________________ Boo! Scare away worms, viruses and so much more! Try Windows Live OneCare! http://onecare.live.com/standard/en-us/purchase/trial.aspx?s_cid=wl_hotmailne ws From BillB at bnj.com Sat Nov 3 09:24:57 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 09:24:57 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys References: Message-ID: I was at a party the other day and said something about F1. No one knew what I was talking about. Imagine that happening in Brazil or Europe. The current level of F1 requires a perfect storm of talent, experience, equipment, politics, money, sponsorship, physical attributes and mental toughness. The only way to make a winning F1 driver now is to grow a whole bunch of them and pick the best. We don't have the interest in the US. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Terry Stetler Sent: Sat 11/3/2007 7:09 AM To: fot Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's Championship. And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. We have done it before. Terry Stetler Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Sat Nov 3 16:45:51 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Sat, 03 Nov 2007 16:45:51 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Posted a bunch of TR Documents and manuals Message-ID: <20071103235017.JCQZ12415.fed1rmmtao104.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Some of our club members have contributed a BUNCH of TR manuals and documentation in PDF format on our club's website. They are located in our Articles/Documents category section. http://www.dctra.org/?cat=11 Plus we have over 450 pictures from the recently concluded 2007 edition of Triumphest. http://www.dctra.org/?page_id=22 From gkbyrne at optushome.com.au Mon Nov 5 00:47:34 2007 From: gkbyrne at optushome.com.au (Geoffrey Byrne) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 18:47:34 +1100 Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car References: Message-ID: <009e01c81f80$229f7690$24acefdc@co3017577a> Chuck I doubt it will turn up in Aus it will stand out as we say "like dogs balls ". i will put the word out to warn all the Triumph guys here in AUS . If something sus turns up all FOT will hear about it Sorry to hear of your loss good luck with MK2 Geoff Byrne TR6 Racer Down Under PS can you please resend me the pics of the car we will get it in our mags and on WEB sites just to cover all bases ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; <6pack at autox.team.net>; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 11:58 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car > Chuck! > > I admire your great attitude over the whole thing. I know the amount of > effort that you have put into this car, since the time that Jan & I delivered this > car to you, with a trip over the mountains. > > It occurs to me that, if these guys DID have any idea of this "TR5", it may > be in a container headed for Japan or Australia with a buyer waiting at the > other end. > > Of course, we are all standing by, to help get you back on the track. > > Joe Alexander > > > > Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered today in > > a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from where I > > live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to force > > open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type trailer. Do > > not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to work hard > > to push it around with the welded diff. > > > > Can sell the wheels [Koenig rewinds in a brown color with nearly new > > 205x60x15 Yokohama A08s], fuel cell [new this year 12 gallon Fuel safe], > > fuel pump [Bosch 160 psi], regulator, aluminum radiator, Optima battery, > > Accusump and racing seat. Not much else. They will never get it started > > [broken throttle cable] as the PI is very tricky to get the cold start lever > > right, and even then it takes a lot of cranking. OH, I suppose they could > > also sell he Konis. I expect it will get stripped, chopped up and dumped in > > the Sound. Very sad end to such a pretty bridesmaid. She was ready to > > race, but has never done yet. > > > > None-the-less, I will find and/or build a replacement and have it ready for > > the SOVREN kick off in mid-April. Sigh. > > > > -- > > Chuck Arnold > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Mon Nov 5 07:05:50 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 08:05:50 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction In-Reply-To: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> References: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B39F39E@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I don't know about anyone else but I'd love to hear a full explanation of how to set up the pedal ratio to the best effect in a TR. I have the TR Enterprises dual 5/8" set-up with balance bar and I am struggling with pedal feel and front-rear balance. I have to stomp so hard it is difficult to not lock them up. Uphill I lock the rears, downhill the fronts. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas Kastner Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 6:27 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box and worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase the ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the other ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From clarkfot at cwnicholls.net Mon Nov 5 07:41:28 2007 From: clarkfot at cwnicholls.net (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 09:41:28 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil - FW: Rotella Ask Our Expert Message-ID: <005001c81fb9$f479c150$1342a8c0@semperon3400> I don't know what the consensus was on the engine oil thread previously in this group... I was at the SEMA show last week and spoke to the Shell Answer person there, he told me more than I could retain!! Here is an email I got in reply to my inquiry on the rotella website to the answer man (see last portion). I would think that pertinent questions can be referred back to Richard Moore at Shell... Clark Clark W. Nicholls -----Original Message----- From: AskShell at Shell.com [mailto:AskShell at Shell.com] Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 9:21 AM To: cwnicholls at aol.com Subject: RE: Rotella Ask Our Expert: Other Clark, Rotella T with Triple Protection 15W-40 CJ-4 has approximately 1200 ppm zinc. This is 50% more zinc than current passenger car motor oils (API SM/ILSAC GF-4) which contain approximately 800 ppm zinc. Passenger car motor oils had approximately 1200 ppm zinc prior to 2001. In 2001 the zinc was reduced to 1000 ppm and in 2005 reduced again to the current 800 ppm. Thus, the new Rotella T with Triple Protection 15W-40 CJ-4 has the same zinc content that passenger car motor oils had in 2000 before the current problems with flat tappet engines began. http://www.shellusserver.com/products/pdf/RotellaT(CJ-4).pdf If you have any additional questions, please call us at 1-800-231-6950. Thank you for your interest in Shell products. Richard Moore Staff Engineer Shell Global Solutions (US) Inc. Westhollow Technology Center, PO Box 4327, Houston, TX 77210, United States of America -----Original Message----- From: cwnicholls at aol.com [mailto:cwnicholls at aol.com] Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 8:24 AM To: askshell, SLUBE-GSMR/5 Subject: Rotella Ask Our Expert: Other ------------------------------------------------ ROTELLA.com E-mail Form ------------------------------------------------ NAME Clark W. Nicholls E-MAIL ADDRESS cwnicholls at aol.com SUBJECT Other COMMENTS ---------------------------------------------- I spoke with one of you at the SEMA show Friday in the final hour of the show concerning Rotella and old British cars with flat tappet cams (brought on by the change in chemicals in the oils, phosphorous, zink, etc). He mentioned that there is information on this subject on the rotella website, but I need help in finding this. I would like to pass this information on to my Triumph compatriots ASAP as there is much discussion on this subject in the Triumph automobile racing group. ---------------------------------------------- From SpiwakD at aol.com Mon Nov 5 13:03:08 2007 From: SpiwakD at aol.com (SpiwakD at aol.com) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 15:03:08 EST Subject: [Fot] TR head ID Message-ID: I am looking at a TR head and cannot remember how to tell if it is a small-port one, which I believe is the best one to use. Any help? ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From twakeman at razzolink.com Mon Nov 5 16:00:26 2007 From: twakeman at razzolink.com (TeriAnn Wakeman) Date: Mon, 05 Nov 2007 15:00:26 -0800 Subject: [Fot] TR head ID In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <472FA08A.30801@razzolink.com> SpiwakD at aol.com wrote: > I am looking at a TR head and cannot remember how to tell if it is a > small-port one, which I believe is the best one to use. Any help? I wrote a web page about that once: www.tjwakeman.net/TR/FAQ_heads.htm TeriAnn From Gt6steve at aol.com Mon Nov 5 18:10:54 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 20:10:54 EST Subject: [Fot] Larger Valves? Message-ID: Yeah, he's right in the narrow perspective. Just keep in mind these are all V-8 guys telling us how to build. Our machines don't necessarily fit their formulas. Take Chebbie builders with a grain of salt.... ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From BillB at bnj.com Mon Nov 5 19:04:56 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 18:04:56 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Larger Valves? References: Message-ID: Although I have to say, if you want to see how an engine can really be built, there's nothing like the V8 guys. They've been working around limitations for eons, and they build pushrod motors with outputs that Formula One can't diss. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Gt6steve at aol.com Sent: Mon 11/5/2007 5:10 PM To: S.Janzen at comcast.net Cc: FOT at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Larger Valves? Yeah, he's right in the narrow perspective. Just keep in mind these are all V-8 guys telling us how to build. Our machines don't necessarily fit their formulas. Take Chebbie builders with a grain of salt.... ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wgrosenbach at juno.com Mon Nov 5 19:14:06 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 19:14:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil - FW: Rotella Ask Our Expert Message-ID: <20071105.191424.3080.3.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Always impressed with the Rotella. Used it in a Renault 17 that I occasionally flogged up the west side of I-70's Johnson tunnel approach. Oil temp ran much cooler than Valvoline 20W50. It also looked the same after the abuse, where the Valvoline darkened considerably. Would like to have known about it back when I ran the high compression 2.5 L 6 in my GT-6. Bill From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Mon Nov 5 20:39:01 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 22:39:01 EST Subject: [Fot] Engine Oi Message-ID: In a message dated 11/5/2007 10:59:43 AM Pacific Standard Time, fot-request at autox.team.net writes: > Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 09:41:28 -0500 > From: "Clark W. Nicholls" > Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil - FW: Rotella Ask Our Expert > To: > Message-ID: <005001c81fb9$f479c150$1342a8c0 at semperon3400> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > I don't know what the consensus was on the engine oil thread previously in > this group... > > I was at the SEMA show last week and spoke to the Shell Answer person there, > he told me more than I could retain!! > > Here is an email I got in reply to my inquiry on the rotella website to the > answer man (see last portion). > > I would think that pertinent questions can be referred back to Richard Moore > at Shell... > > Clark > Clark W. Nicholls > -----Original Message----- > From: AskShell at Shell.com [mailto:AskShell at Shell.com] > Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 9:21 AM > To: cwnicholls at aol.com > Subject: RE: Rotella Ask Our Expert: Other > > Clark, Rotella T with Triple Protection 15W-40 CJ-4 has approximately 1200 > ppm zinc. This is 50% more zinc than current passenger car motor oils (API > SM/ILSAC GF-4) which contain approximately 800 ppm zinc. Passenger car motor > oils had approximately 1200 ppm zinc prior to 2001. In 2001 the zinc was > reduced to 1000 ppm and in 2005 reduced again to the current 800 ppm. > > Thus, the new Rotella T with Triple Protection 15W-40 CJ-4 has the same zinc > content that passenger car motor oils had in 2000 before the current > problems with flat tappet engines began. > > http://www.shellusserver.com/products/pdf/RotellaT(CJ-4).pdf > > If you have any additional questions, please call us at 1-800-231-6950. > Thank you for your interest in Shell products. > > Richard Moore > Staff Engineer > Shell Global Solutions (US) Inc. > Westhollow Technology Center, PO Box 4327, Houston, TX 77210, United States > of America > > -----Original Message----- > From: cwnicholls at aol.com [mailto:cwnicholls at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 8:24 AM > To: askshell, SLUBE-GSMR/5 > Subject: Rotella Ask Our Expert: Other > > ------------------------------------------------ > ROTELLA.com E-mail Form > ------------------------------------------------ > NAME Clark W. Nicholls > E-MAIL ADDRESS cwnicholls at aol.com > SUBJECT Other > COMMENTS > ---------------------------------------------- > I spoke with one of you at the SEMA show Friday in the final hour of the > show concerning Rotella and old British cars with flat tappet cams (brought > on by the change in chemicals in the oils, phosphorous, zink, etc). He > mentioned that there is information on this subject on the rotella website, > but I need help in finding this. I would like to pass this information on > to my Triumph compatriots ASAP as there is much discussion on this subject > in the Triumph automobile racing group. Rotella is known to be OK, insofar as the ZDDP content is concerned, but unfortunately it is not available in the 20W/50 viscosity recommended for most Triumphs. Leon From ablake2 at austin.rr.com Mon Nov 5 22:32:57 2007 From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com (Greg & Alison Blake) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 23:32:57 -0600 Subject: [Fot] looking for carbs Message-ID: <000201c82036$7d4955a0$6401a8c0@blake1> Anyone have a set of HS6's for sale? Thanks, Greg From clarkfot at cwnicholls.net Mon Nov 5 21:59:58 2007 From: clarkfot at cwnicholls.net (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 23:59:58 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001c01c82031$e2f56b00$1342a8c0@semperon3400> The Shell person also said that 20-50 is not required. That's soooo old news... I've been using non-synthetic 10-40 for years (street Spitfire) and he said I should be using 10-30 If you want to ask about that, drop him an email! Clark -=-=-= Rotella is known to be OK, insofar as the ZDDP content is concerned, but unfortunately it is not available in the 20W/50 viscosity recommended for most Triumphs. Leon From jimhearn1 at comcast.net Mon Nov 5 22:55:58 2007 From: jimhearn1 at comcast.net (jim hearn) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 21:55:58 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Looking for a centerline to measure toe Message-ID: <001601c82039$b41244e0$171a694c@computer> Does anyone have any thoughts on where and how to best locate a centerline on the car in order to measure toe. I have a '74 TR6 but I'm sure there would be commonality among lots of cars. Jim in Sacramento [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] From wgrosenbach at juno.com Tue Nov 6 07:28:10 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 07:28:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil Message-ID: <20071106.073013.2420.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> >>>I've been using non-synthetic 10-40 for years (street Spitfire) and he said I should be using 10-30. The only engine I ever lost on the street from a bearing related issue was while using 10W40. Usually ran 20W50, changed in the fall, then chased the Colorado 1000 (Grand) around the state in my '76 Spitfire. Spent quite a bit of time running flat out. In a Spitfire, your not that afoul of the law running flat out. Survived that, but not the drive down I-25 to Pueblo for a SCCA race. The engine started producing a hammering noise, (which turned out to be a rod bearing cap on #3 that was coming adrift and finally got out far enough for a bolt head to hit the block). Oil pressure never got low enough to light the lights. Stopped, pulled the dip stick, NOTHING on the stick, but it was not completely dry. After getting the race event towing guy to get the car to the track, I again pulled the dipstick. Full, to the mark. The oil got hot enough to become thin enough to leave only a trace film on the stick. The bearing got hammered into a multi layered thin blue band wrapped around the journal. Some small engine manufacturers will not warranty their products if 10W40 oil is used in them. Was my failure related to having sucked it full of water one time? Possibly, but I have never seen any other oil get that thin in any other application. Had to have contributed, though. I have much more faith in 10W30. Always amazed at the difference in engine sound and power output after changing from a SAE 40, to a 20W50, in the 2.5 L 6. Without a proper windage in the pan, a hard braking move with SAE 40 in the pan would wrap all the oil around the crank, bringing the engine to a halt, requiring the better part of a minute to be restarted. The 15W40 is a nice compromise. Bill From Fubog1 at aol.com Tue Nov 6 07:54:54 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 09:54:54 EST Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil Message-ID: ... a 1500 Spitfire... flat-out...failure of #3 big end... 'nuff said... Glen In a message dated 11/6/2007 9:33:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, wgrosenbach at juno.com writes: The only engine I ever lost on the street from a bearing related issue was while using 10W40. Usually ran 20W50, changed in the fall, then chased the Colorado 1000 (Grand) around the state in my '76 Spitfire. Spent quite a bit of time running flat out. In a Spitfire, your not that afoul of the law running flat out. Survived that, but not the drive down I-25 to Pueblo for a SCCA race. The engine started producing a hammering noise, (which turned out to be a rod bearing cap on #3 ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 6 08:30:06 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 06 Nov 2007 08:30:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil Message-ID: <20071106153403.KOTS29613.fed1rmmtao106.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Nice long Article about this topic on our club site. I tried to send the text of the article to the list but it got bounced as being to big. http://www.dctra.org/?p=79 From kaskas at cox.net Tue Nov 6 08:36:19 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 07:36:19 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil References: Message-ID: <001a01c8208a$c6dcbd70$3f0ec548@RW> If you do not fix the oil passages in the 1500 crank it will fail, sometimes sooner than later. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Cc: ; Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2007 6:54 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Engine Oil > ... a 1500 Spitfire... flat-out...failure of #3 big end... > > 'nuff said... > Glen > > > In a message dated 11/6/2007 9:33:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, > wgrosenbach at juno.com writes: > > The only engine I ever lost on the street from a bearing related issue > was while using 10W40. Usually ran 20W50, changed in the fall, then > chased the Colorado 1000 (Grand) around the state in my '76 Spitfire. > Spent quite a bit of time running flat out. In a Spitfire, your not that > afoul of the law running flat out. Survived that, but not the drive down > I-25 to Pueblo for a SCCA race. The engine started producing a hammering > noise, (which turned out to be a rod bearing cap on #3 > > > > > > > ************************************** See what's new at > http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 6 08:58:20 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 07:58:20 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil References: Message-ID: I pretty much thought the same thing. Not something I'd blame on oil. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Fubog1 at aol.com Sent: Tue 11/6/2007 6:54 AM To: wgrosenbach at juno.com; clarkfot at cwnicholls.net Cc: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Engine Oil ... a 1500 Spitfire... flat-out...failure of #3 big end... 'nuff said... Glen In a message dated 11/6/2007 9:33:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, wgrosenbach at juno.com writes: The only engine I ever lost on the street from a bearing related issue was while using 10W40. Usually ran 20W50, changed in the fall, then chased the Colorado 1000 (Grand) around the state in my '76 Spitfire. Spent quite a bit of time running flat out. In a Spitfire, your not that afoul of the law running flat out. Survived that, but not the drive down I-25 to Pueblo for a SCCA race. The engine started producing a hammering noise, (which turned out to be a rod bearing cap on #3 ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tlizzard at msn.com Tue Nov 6 16:06:29 2007 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 18:06:29 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Spoke with Dave at Red Line Oil today. Message-ID: What with all the confusion about our favorite non alcoholic fluid I figured I go to the source. (Or at least one of the sources). Dave (sorry I'm really terrible with names so the his last name is lost to me...) is the guy who mans Red Line's technical help phone line. I'll cut to the chase here. Red Line's "straight weight" (they do behave as multi grades and say so on the bottle) racing synthetic oils have 2400ppm of the zinc anti wear goo in them. (ZDDP). Red Line's multi grade synthetic street oils have 1200ppm. Thought you all might be interested. Terry Stetler From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 6 19:18:49 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 06 Nov 2007 19:18:49 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica Message-ID: <20071107022354.OVRI29613.fed1rmmtao106.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> The best video yet that I have seen of the last lap battle between Massa and Kubica in the rain. Incredible close driving with neither driver giving more then the fraction of an inch that they needed to give. http://vimeo.com/348198/ From jaboruch at netzero.net Tue Nov 6 20:57:02 2007 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 03:57:02 GMT Subject: [Fot] TR4 front suspension Message-ID: <20071106.225702.3977.1@webmail15.dca.untd.com> I am looking to change my front suspension over to coil overs and tubular A-arms. Considering still using the TR4 uprights ( to make hubs and brakes easier to fit, since they will just swap over), but replacing the trunion with a rod end to be more like a ball joint. Has anyone on the list successfuly done a conversion like this? Any idea what the thread on the bottom of the upright actually is supposed to be? The one that I measures looks like a 13/16 - 10 American Standard special thread, but not sure if it was a Whitworth or Acme thread originally and just got worn to look like it does now? I also have a TR6 part, but it has a 9 thread per inch thread that looks like an Acme thread, but does not match up to any Acme thread in my machinists handbook. The TR6 thread is 0.905 inch diameter, which is not quite 15/16 (0.9375"). My handbook does list a 15/16 - 9 American standard thread, but the threads are so flat that they look more like an Acme. Perhaps they are worn flat? Joe(B) _____________________________________________________________ Get the competitive advantage you need with great fish finders. Click now! http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2211/fc/Ioyw6ijnGFrzBAD6yzDDE9S9J8wRv7 mbXwV2iHhGFnQMiqI7EE56Tw/ From jsnook at wcnet.org Wed Nov 7 09:36:32 2007 From: jsnook at wcnet.org (Jeff Snook) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 11:36:32 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets Message-ID: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to remember something posted awhile ago. Thanks, Jeff Snook http://www.snooksdreamcars.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Wed Nov 7 09:49:13 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 11:49:13 EST Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets Message-ID: Uncle Jack....only thing that worked with my headers. > Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to > remember something posted awhile ago. > > Thanks, > > Jeff Snook > http://www.snooksdreamcars.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > From tedtsimx at bright.net Wed Nov 7 10:31:32 2007 From: tedtsimx at bright.net (Ted Schumacher) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 12:31:32 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets In-Reply-To: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> References: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> Message-ID: <4731F674.5070500@bright.net> Jeff Snook wrote: > Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to > remember something posted awhile ago. > > Thanks, > > Jeff Snook > http://www.snooksdreamcars.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > Jeff, buy some header gasket material. You can get this at a speed shop. Trace your OE gaskets on this and head for the Exacto knife. Header gasket material is thicker and also has some give.this allows gasket material to conform to the variations in header flange. Ted -- Ted Schumacher tedtsimx at bright.net http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com 108 S. Jefferson St. Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Wed Nov 7 11:17:13 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 12:17:13 -0600 Subject: [Fot] coated bearings Message-ID: <200711071815.lA7IFLP7292896@ns3.geneseo.net> Here's a link to Calico Coatings. They are the company that does my machine shop's coatings. I highly recommend this process -- the performance advantages described on this web site are really true. I have two sets of bearings at their place right now. (no financial interst) http://www.calicocoatings.com/bearings.html uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Wed Nov 7 11:20:37 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 12:20:37 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets In-Reply-To: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> References: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> Message-ID: <200711071818.lA7IIigk280532@ns3.geneseo.net> At 10:36 AM 11/7/2007, Jeff Snook wrote: >Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to >remember something posted awhile ago. Yep - I've got them. Im having them made specially for us by a major gasket company . Compacted graphite, 1/8" thick, compresses to half the thickness, good for 2000 deg F. Shape slightly modified to make them better. Kinda pricey at $66.95 including shipping because of low production but they solve the problems. >Thanks, > >Jeff Snook >http://www.snooksdreamcars.com >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From S.Janzen at comcast.net Wed Nov 7 12:39:02 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 14:39:02 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets Message-ID: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or TR6 with a double row chain will work. From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 7 14:52:43 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 13:52:43 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica References: <20071107022354.OVRI29613.fed1rmmtao106.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> Message-ID: wow, Kubica is NUTS. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle Sent: Tue 11/6/2007 6:18 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica The best video yet that I have seen of the last lap battle between Massa and Kubica in the rain. Incredible close driving with neither driver giving more then the fraction of an inch that they needed to give. http://vimeo.com/348198/ Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Wed Nov 7 16:23:45 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 16:23:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] If more politicians thought like this... Message-ID: <20071107233753.PYCW18043.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> ...the world would be a better place! http://msn.foxsports.com/other/story/7417982?MSNHPHCP>1=10637 British govt. minister quits to race cars LONDON (AP) - A British government minister has stepped down to follow his dream of becoming a race car driver. Lord Drayson, Britain's defense procurement minister, is taking an indefinite leave of absence to compete in the American Le Mans series, Prime Minister Gordon Brown's office said Wednesday. Paul Drayson, 47, a former pharmaceuticals entrepreneur appointed to the House of Lords in 2004, said last year that he took up competitive motor racing as part of a "mid-life crisis." Drayson, who competes in a bioethanol-fueled Aston Martin, qualified for the U.S. competition by placing second at this year's British GT championship. Drayson was appointed to the Ministry of Defense in 2005 by then-Prime Minister Tony Blair to oversee Britain's $30 billion military hardware budget. In a letter to Brown, Drayson described the chance to compete as a "once-in-a-lifetime opportunity" and "a key step towards my eventual dream of success in the Le Mans 24-hour endurance race." The American Le Mans Series, a North American counterpart to the famous French endurance race, announced earlier this year that almost all its cars would race on biofuel. From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Wed Nov 7 16:42:41 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 15:42:41 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets References: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: <018301c82197$e3728290$1b02a8c0@workstation3> Vernier cam sprocket works nicely, Spitfire, TR6, GT6. TMG1225 Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Janzen" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 11:39 AM Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From koblinger at verizon.net Wed Nov 7 16:56:02 2007 From: koblinger at verizon.net (koblinger at verizon.net) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 17:56:02 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica Message-ID: <13351872.7181061194479762451.JavaMail.root@vms075.mailsrvcs.net> Good, maybe even great, but not as great as Villeneuve - Arnoux..... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sDtn8QnpFg Cheers, Kurt O. >From: Bill Babcock >Date: 2007/11/07 Wed PM 03:52:43 CST >To: "David W. Riddle" , fot at autox.team.net >Subject: Re: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica >wow, Kubica is NUTS. > > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle >Sent: Tue 11/6/2007 6:18 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica > >The best video yet that I have seen of the last lap battle between >Massa and Kubica in the rain. Incredible close driving with neither >driver giving more then the fraction of an inch that they needed to give. > >http://vimeo.com/348198/ >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Wed Nov 7 19:02:42 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 19:02:42 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment Message-ID: <001001c821ab$72d8e380$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Has anyone had any experience with cryo treating. I read enough good stuff about I had it done to all my bearings rods, crank, flywheel, cam & chain tensioner. Crank & rods were shot peened & mag'd too. It was cheap anough and local so I just went for it. Any feedback or prior experience ? Jim G From dave at microworks.net Wed Nov 7 18:11:56 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 18:11:56 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica In-Reply-To: <13351872.7181061194479762451.JavaMail.root@vms075.mailsrvc s.net> References: <13351872.7181061194479762451.JavaMail.root@vms075.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <20071108012957.UNER2804.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> I don't know. I remember thinking during the race and watching the battle live on Speed that this surpassed the Gille v. Rene battle. After all, Massa and Kubica were going at it in the rain on full wet tires! At 04:56 PM 11/7/2007, you wrote: >Good, maybe even great, but not as great as Villeneuve - Arnoux..... > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sDtn8QnpFg > >Cheers, >Kurt O. > > >From: Bill Babcock > >Date: 2007/11/07 Wed PM 03:52:43 CST > >To: "David W. Riddle" , fot at autox.team.net > >Subject: Re: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica > > >wow, Kubica is NUTS. > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle > >Sent: Tue 11/6/2007 6:18 PM > >To: fot at autox.team.net > >Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica > > > >The best video yet that I have seen of the last lap battle between > >Massa and Kubica in the rain. Incredible close driving with neither > >driver giving more then the fraction of an inch that they needed to give. > > > >http://vimeo.com/348198/ > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Wed Nov 7 18:44:42 2007 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (steve) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 17:44:42 -0800 (GMT-08:00) Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment Message-ID: <16511563.1194486282792.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net> I'm from Wisconsin so my TR3 has been cryo treated for 40 winters :) ~Steve -----Original Message----- >From: James Gray >Sent: Nov 7, 2007 6:02 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment > >Has anyone had any experience with cryo treating. I read enough good >stuff about I had it done to all my bearings >rods, crank, flywheel, cam & chain tensioner. Crank & rods were shot >peened & mag'd too. >It was cheap anough and local so I just went for it. Any feedback or >prior experience ? >Jim G >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jaboruch at netzero.net Wed Nov 7 19:27:08 2007 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 02:27:08 GMT Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment Message-ID: <20071107.212708.29942.0@webmail20.dca.untd.com> I have found that cryo treated brake rotors are much less prone to cracking than non treated ones, but that is about the best experience that I have found. It should help billet cranks, but should not do much for cast cranks. I have spoken to metalurgists about cryo treatment and for things like steel crankshafts and rods the treatment basically makes up for a bad heat treatment job. If a part was properly heat treated there should be no reason to cryo treat it. Cryo treatment coverts retained austinite (which is undesirable) to martinsite (desirable). This is because the austinite was not coverted during heat treatment. Cryo treatment is not enough on its own, since the part may be left too brittle. Parts should be tempered after Cryo treatment. There does not appear to be any good reason why cryo works for brake rotors, but it does. Also, not sure why it would do anything for bearing shells, blocks or pistons. I have heard from the cryo treaters that for pistons and blocks the treatment serves to stress relieve the part. I am not quite convinced that it is worth doing blocks, pistons, bearings, rings, etc. How many engine failures are there that stress relieving would have stopped? If I have a block failure it is because a rod went through it because of a head gasket leak or valve failure. Any piston failures have been because of an errant valve or detonation, not just a breakdown of the piston. That's my 2 cents on the topic. Joe(B) -- "James Gray" wrote: Has anyone had any experience with cryo treating. I read enough good stuff about I had it done to all my bearings rods, crank, flywheel, cam & chain tensioner. Crank & rods were shot peened & mag'd too. It was cheap anough and local so I just went for it. Any feedback or prior experience ? Jim G Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _____________________________________________________________ Click to find local singles for dating, romance and fun. http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2211/fc/Ioyw6ijm1qSyAJZsz0b2FuGNGsKzUg v964jdqBOMwhceal2PkgnRSd/ From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Wed Nov 7 19:37:01 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 20:37:01 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets References: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: <003601c821b0$3f4ed1f0$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> British Parts Northwest has them: Click here for bigger image Product Name: Cam Gear Vernier TR250-TR6 Our Price: $192.86 Availability: In Stock Product Number: TMG1225 Product Weight: 2.75 lb. Rating: Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Janzen" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 1:39 PM Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a > Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of TMG1225_m.jpg] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/gif which had a name of star.gif] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/gif which had a name of halfstar.gif] From spyderweb at uwalumni.com Wed Nov 7 20:20:35 2007 From: spyderweb at uwalumni.com (spyderweb at uwalumni.com) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 21:20:35 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica Message-ID: <20071107212035.uf204jyl0gk8wgs8@secure.uwalumni.com> Quoth Bill Babcock: >> >wow, Kubica is NUTS. Perhaps... and being nuts is not a good thing. But letting everyone else on the track THINK you're nuts is a definite advantage :-) Jim Hill From klynch_6 at msn.com Wed Nov 7 20:53:50 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 20:53:50 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment References: <001001c821ab$72d8e380$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: Jim, did my front rotors as a test and have been pleasantly surprised. Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: James Gray To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 7:02 PM Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment Has anyone had any experience with cryo treating. I read enough good stuff about I had it done to all my bearings rods, crank, flywheel, cam & chain tensioner. Crank & rods were shot peened & mag'd too. It was cheap anough and local so I just went for it. Any feedback or prior experience ? Jim G _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vintage.racer at comcast.net Wed Nov 7 21:14:36 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 20:14:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Speed Trap Message-ID: <004701c821bd$e05bd770$a1138650$@racer@comcast.net> Hello: Those of us that have had the unfortunate opportunity to be at the wrong end of a police officer's radar gun will appreciate the following. This was too good not to share with you'all. Gary This is a real News item - Two British traffic patrol officers from North Berwick were involved in an unusual incident while checking for speeding motorists on the A1 Great North Road. One of the officers used a hand-held radar device to check the speed of a vehicle approaching over the crest of a hill, and was surprised when the speed was recorded at over 300 mph. Their radar suddenly stopped working and the officers were not able to reset it. Just then a deafening roar over the treetops revealed that the radar had in fact latched on to a NATO Tornado fighter jet which was engaged in a low-flying exercise over the Border district, approaching from the North Sea. Back at police headquarters the chief constable fired off a stiff complaint to the RAF Liaison office. Back came the reply in true laconic RAF style: "Thank you for your message, which allows us to complete the file on this incident. You may be interested to know that the tactical computer in the Tornado had detected the presence of, and subsequently locked onto, your hostile radar equipment and automatically sent a jamming signal back to it. Furthermore, an air-to-ground missile aboard the fully-armed aircraft had also automatically locked onto your equipment. Fortunately the pilot flying the Tornado recognized the situation for what it was, quickly responded to the missile systems alert status, and was able to override the automated defence system before the missile was launched and your hostile radar installation was destroyed. " From spreiss at verizon.net Wed Nov 7 05:38:50 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 23:38:50 +1100 Subject: [Fot] speed trap Message-ID: <002801c8213b$26bf56c0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Gary Tremendous! Thanks for a really good laugh. Steve P. This is a real News item - Two British traffic patrol officers from North Berwick were involved in an unusual incident while checking for speeding motorists on the A1 Great North Road. From gp89 at charter.net Thu Nov 8 03:20:07 2007 From: gp89 at charter.net (gp89 at charter.net) Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 2:20:07 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets In-Reply-To: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: <20071108052007.SFAQ5.134663.root@mp20> www.aptfast.com part #vcs-07 Jeff Senty ---- Scott Janzen wrote: > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gp89 at charter.net Thu Nov 8 03:23:22 2007 From: gp89 at charter.net (gp89 at charter.net) Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 2:23:22 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets Message-ID: <20071108052322.TXKB0.134670.root@mp20> www.aptfast.com part #vcs-07 Jeff Senty ---- Scott Janzen wrote: > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gp89 at charter.net Thu Nov 8 03:23:35 2007 From: gp89 at charter.net (gp89 at charter.net) Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 2:23:35 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets In-Reply-To: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: <20071108052335.V6LGT.134673.root@mp20> www.aptfast.com part #vcs-07 Jeff Senty ---- Scott Janzen wrote: > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Thu Nov 8 08:48:22 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Thu, 08 Nov 2007 08:48:22 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Think this would beat a Spyker? Message-ID: <20071108155300.RYFZ9950.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> http://www.autoblog.com/2007/11/07/f1-lawn-mower-cuts-down-the-competition-like-schumacher/ From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 9 07:34:58 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 09:34:58 EST Subject: [Fot] Val's Spotted Spitfire Message-ID: Amici, Does anyone have a pic of Val Ascensio's Spitfire they could get to me this morning? Steve ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From jaboruch at netzero.net Fri Nov 9 09:52:33 2007 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 16:52:33 GMT Subject: [Fot] TR3 -TR4A shocks and... Message-ID: <20071109.115233.19660.1@webmail09.dca.untd.com> Does anyone happen to know what the difference in length is between TR3/4 and TR4A/6 front shocks? Next question: Has anyone come up with an easy way to do weight jacking at the front end of TR3-6s? Does not look like my plans to change to front coilovers and tubular A-arms will be economically viable, so on to plan B. I would like to be able to easily adjust front corner weights for different tracks. While most tracks in the Northeast are mostly right turns, NHIS is mostly lefts and Pocono can go either way. I am looking at AFCO adjustable coil spring spacers, but just want to make sure that I am not missing something that is obvious or has already been done. Right now I have a shortened stock spring spacer that I swap from side to side as needed, but it is very time consuming and I seem to have less and less time during the season to make such changes. Joe(B) _____________________________________________________________ Click here to find the inside track on available commercial real estate. http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2211/fc/Ioyw6ijl28Xl0QOb0Dsqfclt7YvxUH LAbO4iIqpxPvFqfSQred7QE6/ From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Fri Nov 9 11:00:30 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 12:00:30 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B4FFC4D@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I'm looking for some advice from somebody with racing experience with Speedie sleeves. Due to grooving on the original parts I have them on the transmission and differential flanges. With very little usage the trans seal gave up the ghost and bow I've wiped out the pinion seal. The diff and tranny are tight so it is not wobbleing apart. It seems to me that the increased diameter must be creating too much friction and heat. New flanges are unobtainable and I am using National brand seals as opposed to the crap the british car suppliers sell. What else can I do? Bob Kramer From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 9 11:02:31 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 13:02:31 EST Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves Message-ID: I've used them alot and heartily recommend them. Easy to install but expensive! ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From gtlund at cyberspeedway.net Fri Nov 9 15:13:04 2007 From: gtlund at cyberspeedway.net (greg) Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2007 15:13:04 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves In-Reply-To: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B4FFC4D@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> References: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B4FFC4D@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> Message-ID: <4734DB70.70503@cyberspeedway.net> Bob, Using a standard National buna or nitrile seal will not last very long with gear oil. Nitrile is listed as having "poor resistance to lubricants containing sulphur or EP additives". Our gear oil has these. Viton works much better. I suspect the original British Triumph seals were made from the proper compounds. I have solved many leakage problems with this one bit of info. I first ran into it with a Mark Williams 9" diff that would leak after a couple of sessions. Here is a link to Timken/National. http://www.timken.com/products/bearings/pdf/NSCInfoSection.pdf Timken owns the National industrial seals division. Look for section 1B. There is also a good listing of Redisleeves. P.S. The O-rings on TR transmission shift rails will actually seal if you use Viton. Anything over 180 degrees F ought to be Viton anyway. Greg Lund Kramer, Robert wrote: > I'm looking for some advice from somebody with racing experience with > Speedie sleeves. Due to grooving on the original parts I have them on > the transmission and differential flanges. With very little usage the > trans seal gave up the ghost and bow I've wiped out the pinion seal. The > diff and tranny are tight so it is not wobbleing apart. It seems to me > that the increased diameter must be creating too much friction and heat. > New flanges are unobtainable and I am using National brand seals as > opposed to the crap the british car suppliers sell. What else can I do? > > Bob Kramer > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Fri Nov 9 15:55:34 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 16:55:34 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves In-Reply-To: <4734DB70.70503@cyberspeedway.net> References: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B4FFC4D@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> <4734DB70.70503@cyberspeedway.net> Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B50013B@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> This is exactly the type of info I needed. The bearing supplier probably matched size to my Moss part in a better quality seal, but did not know enough about the apllication to get me one that would stand up. Thanks Greg. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: greg [mailto:gtlund at cyberspeedway.net] Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 4:13 PM To: Kramer, Robert Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Speedie sleeves Bob, Using a standard National buna or nitrile seal will not last very long with gear oil. Nitrile is listed as having "poor resistance to lubricants containing sulphur or EP additives". Our gear oil has these. Viton works much better. I suspect the original British Triumph seals were made from the proper compounds. I have solved many leakage problems with this one bit of info. I first ran into it with a Mark Williams 9" diff that would leak after a couple of sessions. Here is a link to Timken/National. http://www.timken.com/products/bearings/pdf/NSCInfoSection.pdf Timken owns the National industrial seals division. Look for section 1B. There is also a good listing of Redisleeves. P.S. The O-rings on TR transmission shift rails will actually seal if you use Viton. Anything over 180 degrees F ought to be Viton anyway. Greg Lund Kramer, Robert wrote: > I'm looking for some advice from somebody with racing experience with > Speedie sleeves. Due to grooving on the original parts I have them on > the transmission and differential flanges. With very little usage the > trans seal gave up the ghost and bow I've wiped out the pinion seal. The > diff and tranny are tight so it is not wobbleing apart. It seems to me > that the increased diameter must be creating too much friction and heat. > New flanges are unobtainable and I am using National brand seals as > opposed to the crap the british car suppliers sell. What else can I do? > > Bob Kramer > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Fri Nov 9 16:22:15 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2007 18:22:15 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves Message-ID: <0C77E17B.68416080.00159EE9@cs.com> VITON SEALS are usually the choice of John Deere engineers. >This is exactly the type of info I needed. The bearing supplier probably >matched size to my Moss part in a better quality seal, but did not know >enough about the apllication to get me one that would stand up. >Thanks Greg. > > >Bob Kramer >Sales Manager >RDO Equipment Co. >16415 North IH 35 >Pflugerville, TX 78660 >512-272-4141 >Fx 512-272-9365 > >-----Original Message----- >From: greg [mailto:gtlund at cyberspeedway.net] >Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 4:13 PM >To: Kramer, Robert >Cc: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: Re: [Fot] Speedie sleeves > >Bob, > Using a standard National buna or nitrile seal will not last very >long with gear oil. Nitrile is listed as having "poor resistance to >lubricants containing sulphur or EP additives". Our gear oil has these. >Viton works much better. I suspect the original British Triumph seals >were made from the proper compounds. I have solved many leakage problems >with this one bit of info. I first ran into it with a Mark Williams 9" >diff that would leak after a couple of sessions. Here is a link to >Timken/National. > >http://www.timken.com/products/bearings/pdf/NSCInfoSection.pdf > >Timken owns the National industrial seals division. Look for section 1B. > >There is also a good listing of Redisleeves. > >P.S. The O-rings on TR transmission shift rails will actually seal if >you use Viton. Anything over 180 degrees F ought to be Viton anyway. >Greg Lund > > >Kramer, Robert wrote: >> I'm looking for some advice from somebody with racing experience with >> Speedie sleeves. Due to grooving on the original parts I have them on >> the transmission and differential flanges. With very little usage the >> trans seal gave up the ghost and bow I've wiped out the pinion seal. >The >> diff and tranny are tight so it is not wobbleing apart. It seems to me >> that the increased diameter must be creating too much friction and >heat. >> New flanges are unobtainable and I am using National brand seals as >> opposed to the crap the british car suppliers sell. What else can I >do? >> >> Bob Kramer >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vintage.racer at comcast.net Fri Nov 9 16:31:09 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 15:31:09 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Oil Seal Material Message-ID: <000801c82328$9cd41d70$d67c5850$@racer@comcast.net> Here is a handy chart to compare oil seal materials, not the Dupont Dow Viton listing: www.pspglobal.com/low-temperature-seals.html. Gary From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 9 16:46:26 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 16:46:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] More speculation on F1 2008 season drivers Message-ID: <000701c8232a$be8365a0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Here is the current speculation by the F1-ToGo web site. It this holds true, Kas is partly right in his speculation (Alonzo goes to Renault and Ralf goes to the Post Office to check his mail). But Button stays with Honda And Heikki goes to McLaren instead of Honda. But Williams doesn't get a newbie, instead one of Toro Rosso's castoffs. McLaren : Lewis Hamilton and Heikki Kovalainen BMW : Nick Heidfeld and Robert Kubica Renault : Fernando Alonso and Nelson Piquet Jr Williams : Nico Rosberg and Tonio Liuzzi Honda : Jenson Button and Rubens Barrichello Red Bull : Mark Webber and David Coulthard Toyota : Jarno Trulli and Timo Glock Toro Rosso : Sebastien Bourdais and Sebastian Vettel Super Aguri : Takuma Sato and Anthony Davidson Force India : Adrian Sutil and Roland Rodriquez Isn't this silly season fun? :-) Joe C. From budscars at msn.com Fri Nov 9 16:55:29 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (RACER BUD) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 15:55:29 -0800 Subject: [Fot] More speculation on F1 2008 season drivers References: <000701c8232a$be8365a0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: or they all go to NASCAR? Racer Bud Sonoma, ca. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Curry" To: Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 3:46 PM Subject: [Fot] More speculation on F1 2008 season drivers > Here is the current speculation by the F1-ToGo > web > site. > > It this holds true, Kas is partly right in his speculation (Alonzo goes to > Renault and Ralf goes to the Post Office to check his mail). But Button > stays with Honda And Heikki goes to McLaren instead of Honda. But > Williams > doesn't get a newbie, instead one of Toro Rosso's castoffs. > > > > McLaren : Lewis Hamilton and Heikki Kovalainen > BMW : Nick Heidfeld and Robert Kubica > Renault : Fernando Alonso and Nelson Piquet Jr > Williams : Nico Rosberg and Tonio Liuzzi > Honda : Jenson Button and Rubens Barrichello > Red Bull : Mark Webber and David Coulthard > Toyota : Jarno Trulli and Timo Glock > Toro Rosso : Sebastien Bourdais and Sebastian Vettel > Super Aguri : Takuma Sato and Anthony Davidson > Force India : Adrian Sutil and Roland Rodriquez > > > > Isn't this silly season fun? :-) > > Joe C. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 9 18:43:39 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2007 18:43:39 -0700 Subject: [Fot] More speculation on F1 2008 season drivers In-Reply-To: <000701c8232a$be8365a0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> References: <000701c8232a$be8365a0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: <20071110015214.OGVG5967.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Almost. Tonio might be going to Williams, but the race lineup will be Rosberg and Nakajima. Guess Toyota is wanting a Japanese driver to go with their engine deal at Williams At 04:46 PM 11/9/2007, Joe Curry wrote: >Here is the current speculation by the F1-ToGo web >site. > >It this holds true, Kas is partly right in his speculation (Alonzo goes to >Renault and Ralf goes to the Post Office to check his mail). But Button >stays with Honda And Heikki goes to McLaren instead of Honda. But Williams >doesn't get a newbie, instead one of Toro Rosso's castoffs. > > > >McLaren : Lewis Hamilton and Heikki Kovalainen >BMW : Nick Heidfeld and Robert Kubica >Renault : Fernando Alonso and Nelson Piquet Jr >Williams : Nico Rosberg and Tonio Liuzzi >Honda : Jenson Button and Rubens Barrichello >Red Bull : Mark Webber and David Coulthard >Toyota : Jarno Trulli and Timo Glock >Toro Rosso : Sebastien Bourdais and Sebastian Vettel >Super Aguri : Takuma Sato and Anthony Davidson >Force India : Adrian Sutil and Roland Rodriquez > > > >Isn't this silly season fun? :-) > >Joe C. >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Fri Nov 9 20:15:00 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 19:15:00 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Ring gear Message-ID: <000e01c82347$e140a720$0502a8c0@desktop> Hey Friends, I took a lightweight flywheel to be fitted with a new ring gear to the machine shop today and the machinist asked me which way it went on. I didn't know what to tell him. This is an early (long snout crankshaft) TR6 flywheel and the ring gear has a chamfer on one side. If we use the chamfer to assist guiding the gear to the FW, the chamfered gear teeth face the transmission. This seems opposite of what should be to me. I see most older ring gear are set this way, but does a new installation with a modern starter go like this or with the chamfered teeth edge towards the motor? Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 From gtlund at cyberspeedway.net Fri Nov 9 21:33:48 2007 From: gtlund at cyberspeedway.net (greg) Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2007 21:33:48 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Ring gear In-Reply-To: <000e01c82347$e140a720$0502a8c0@desktop> References: <000e01c82347$e140a720$0502a8c0@desktop> Message-ID: <473534AC.2010609@cyberspeedway.net> Charly, The chamfered teeth face the direction the starter gear comes from. On older cars that used the inertia bendix, the chamfer faced the rear. I know this because I have an old Mueller flywheel that I had to hand chamfer the teeth on the front side for a modern starter. If you don't have the chamfer facing the starter, the gear teeth sometimes hit the ring gear teeth and won't engage. Greg Lund Charly Mitchel wrote: > Hey Friends, > I took a lightweight flywheel to be fitted with a new ring gear to the machine > shop today and the machinist asked me which way it went on. I didn't know > what to tell him. > This is an early (long snout crankshaft) TR6 flywheel and the ring gear has a > chamfer on one side. If we use the chamfer to assist guiding the gear to the > FW, the chamfered gear teeth face the transmission. This seems opposite of > what should be to me. I see most older ring gear are set this way, but does a > new installation with a modern starter go like this or with the chamfered > teeth edge towards the motor? > Charly Mitchel > TR6 #44 > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From triumphs at consolidated.net Sat Nov 10 09:06:47 2007 From: triumphs at consolidated.net (Ken Gano, home) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 10:06:47 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets In-Reply-To: <200711071818.lA7IIigk280532@ns3.geneseo.net> Message-ID: NFI, but a great product. It solved a very long standing problem on my street car. kg -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+triumphs=consolidated.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+triumphs=consolidated.net at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Jack W. Drews Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 12:21 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets At 10:36 AM 11/7/2007, Jeff Snook wrote: >Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to >remember something posted awhile ago. Yep - I've got them. Im having them made specially for us by a major gasket company . Compacted graphite, 1/8" thick, compresses to half the thickness, good for 2000 deg F. Shape slightly modified to make them better. Kinda pricey at $66.95 including shipping because of low production but they solve the problems. >Thanks, > >Jeff Snook >http://www.snooksdreamcars.com >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From walt at hot-tr6.com Sat Nov 10 11:09:45 2007 From: walt at hot-tr6.com (Walter Hollowell) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 11:09:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] SPAX SHOCKS Message-ID: <20071110181054.429E6187A05@autox.team.net> I have a couple of questions for FOT members about Spax adjustable shocks. 1. I have Spax adjustable shocks on all four corners of my TR6 which is a daily driver plus an autocrosser. The rear tube shocks are weak after 4 years of very hard use. My question is this: is there any place I can send these expensive shocks for a rebuild or do I throw them away and buy another pair? 2. I bought a pair of used Spax adjustable shocks on ebaymotors that was supposed to fit a TR6 rear conversion but I don't think they are. The following numbers are stamped into the bottom of the shock: G 933 10906 The shock is 14.5" long when compressed from tip to tip and 19" long when extended. an anyone help me identify these shocks? Thank You Walt Hollowell Abq., NM From jimhearn1 at comcast.net Sat Nov 10 11:58:31 2007 From: jimhearn1 at comcast.net (jim hearn) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 10:58:31 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Message-ID: <000401c823cb$aff2d740$171a694c@computer> Sorry, someone told me how to do this but I can't find the email now. My original question was how to get more negative camber on my '74 TR6 that I use to autocross (no street use). I have adjusted it with shims to a negative 1 = degrees. One person told me about removing part of the spring assembly but I can't find the email or recall the particulars of this email. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated, especially those in the email I have since misplaced. Thanks, Jim Sacramento, CA Two '74 TR6s [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] From trhouse at greenapple.com Sat Nov 10 11:55:05 2007 From: trhouse at greenapple.com (Tom Householder) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 13:55:05 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter Message-ID: I told a friend who was driving to calif about the stolen tr5 race car.... he just called and reported a transporter with 3 TR4s and some other race car on I-40 near Albuquerque NM. Doubt that it's the TR5 but curious as to who and what the race car is.. anyone out there know who is on the move From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Sat Nov 10 12:51:29 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 12:51:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 In-Reply-To: <000401c823cb$aff2d740$171a694c@computer> Message-ID: <000001c823d3$168ed470$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Two ways you can do it. Shorter springs and removing the spacers put some negative in. And/Or, you can; 1. Install longer bolts at the lower control arms and shim out more. 2. Slot the upper control arms at the ball joint and move the top of the trunion inboard. If you pull the spacers out you may want to replace them with the AFCO adjustable spacers so you can corner weight the car and dial in both at the same time. Jim G -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:59 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Sorry, someone told me how to do this but I can't find the email now. My original question was how to get more negative camber on my '74 TR6 that I use to autocross (no street use). I have adjusted it with shims to a negative 1 = degrees. One person told me about removing part of the spring assembly but I can't find the email or recall the particulars of this email. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated, especially those in the email I have since misplaced. Thanks, Jim Sacramento, CA Two '74 TR6s [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jimhearn1 at comcast.net Sat Nov 10 15:26:36 2007 From: jimhearn1 at comcast.net (jim hearn) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 14:26:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment Message-ID: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> Is it enough to tie (with rope) the steering wheel in opposite directions to stop movement in order to align for toe? If not, is there some other method that works. Jim [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] From klynch_6 at msn.com Sat Nov 10 15:40:57 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 15:40:57 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter References: Message-ID: Greg, Walt, Henry????!!!!! ----- Original Message ----- From: Tom Householder To: fot at autox.team.net ; triumphs at autox.team.net Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:55 AM Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter I told a friend who was driving to calif about the stolen tr5 race car.... he just called and reported a transporter with 3 TR4s and some other race car on I-40 near Albuquerque NM. Doubt that it's the TR5 but curious as to who and what the race car is.. anyone out there know who is on the move _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jimhearn1 at comcast.net Sat Nov 10 16:01:49 2007 From: jimhearn1 at comcast.net (jim hearn) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 15:01:49 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 In-Reply-To: <000001c823d3$168ed470$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: <000001c823ed$acf83c70$171a694c@computer> Jim, is it possible to dial in corner weight without actually weighing the corners? Is it possible to work from performance or from others' experience with my particular make and model ('74 TR6)? I had planned to take of my bumpers and windshield this winter but I'm sure this would have some effect on corner weight so maybe I need to calculate a little more before I start removing. Jim -----Original Message----- From: James Gray [mailto:toodamnfunky at comcast.net] Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:51 AM To: 'jim hearn' Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Two ways you can do it. Shorter springs and removing the spacers put some negative in. And/Or, you can; 1. Install longer bolts at the lower control arms and shim out more. 2. Slot the upper control arms at the ball joint and move the top of the trunion inboard. If you pull the spacers out you may want to replace them with the AFCO adjustable spacers so you can corner weight the car and dial in both at the same time. Jim G -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:59 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Sorry, someone told me how to do this but I can't find the email now. My original question was how to get more negative camber on my '74 TR6 that I use to autocross (no street use). I have adjusted it with shims to a negative 1 = degrees. One person told me about removing part of the spring assembly but I can't find the email or recall the particulars of this email. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated, especially those in the email I have since misplaced. Thanks, Jim Sacramento, CA Two '74 TR6s [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sat Nov 10 17:06:50 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 17:06:50 -0700 Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment In-Reply-To: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> References: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> Message-ID: <000e01c823f6$c244e0c0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> When I worked in a front end shop way back in High school, the owner had made a weight (about 10 pounds) with hooks on it that he would place on the bottom of the wheel when he centered it. If the front end moved while doing adjustments, the weight would return it to center. Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 3:27 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment Is it enough to tie (with rope) the steering wheel in opposite directions to stop movement in order to align for toe? If not, is there some other method that works. Jim From spreiss at verizon.net Sat Nov 10 02:05:45 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 20:05:45 +1100 Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment References: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> <000e01c823f6$c244e0c0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: <000801c82378$e152b240$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Just centering the wheel does not ensure that the steering is centered. My TR3 has no doubt had the steering wheel removed many times! I've removed it three or four times myself during the past two years of ownership. (Love those trafficators!) To center of the steering one must measure the degrees of rotation lock to lock and find the center point. The wheel position can then can be adjusted as required to center it. It may take a couple of tries, since the splines are quite closely spaced. Coincidentally, adjustment of the steering box (And perhaps the rack and pinion, though I have no experience with one) should also be performed at "center lock", as is stated in the manuals. This results in the tightest steering action throughout the movement without binding in the center, where wear is least. Steve Preiss ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Curry" To: "'jim hearn'" ; Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 11:06 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment > When I worked in a front end shop way back in High school, the owner had > made a weight (about 10 pounds) with hooks on it that he would place on the > bottom of the wheel when he centered it. If the front end moved while doing > adjustments, the weight would return it to center. > > Joe C. > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn > Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 3:27 PM > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment > > Is it enough to tie (with rope) the steering wheel in opposite directions to > stop movement in order to align for toe? If not, is there some other method > that works. Jim > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sat Nov 10 21:31:59 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 21:31:59 -0700 Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment In-Reply-To: <000801c82378$e152b240$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> References: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> <000e01c823f6$c244e0c0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> <000801c82378$e152b240$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <000a01c8241b$cce7a830$2202a8c0@newcomputer> You are correct sir. But the weight doesn't have to be on the bottom of the centered wheel. It just has to be at the bottom of the wheel when the steering is centered. Then after you have all the adjustments done, you can remove the wheel and properly position it. On a Spitfire or other car with a similar steering shaft (with a cam that cancels the turn signal), you not only center the rack, but you also have to then make sure that the cam is in the correct position (to the left between the cancelling dogs of the switch) and then make sure that the wheel is centered. Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: Steven Preiss [mailto:spreiss at verizon.net] Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 2:06 AM To: Joe Curry; 'jim hearn'; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment Just centering the wheel does not ensure that the steering is centered. My TR3 has no doubt had the steering wheel removed many times! I've removed it three or four times myself during the past two years of ownership. (Love those trafficators!) To center of the steering one must measure the degrees of rotation lock to lock and find the center point. The wheel position can then can be adjusted as required to center it. It may take a couple of tries, since the splines are quite closely spaced. Coincidentally, adjustment of the steering box (And perhaps the rack and pinion, though I have no experience with one) should also be performed at "center lock", as is stated in the manuals. This results in the tightest steering action throughout the movement without binding in the center, where wear is least. Steve Preiss ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Curry" To: "'jim hearn'" ; Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 11:06 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment > When I worked in a front end shop way back in High school, the owner had > made a weight (about 10 pounds) with hooks on it that he would place on the > bottom of the wheel when he centered it. If the front end moved while doing > adjustments, the weight would return it to center. > > Joe C. > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn > Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 3:27 PM > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment > > Is it enough to tie (with rope) the steering wheel in opposite directions to > stop movement in order to align for toe? If not, is there some other method > that works. Jim > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From triosan at gmail.com Sun Nov 11 09:49:43 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 08:49:43 -0800 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711110849x4e931970o6a48cb16c71b2cd9@mail.gmail.com> Thanks -- will be interesting to see if anybody else gets a sighting. On Nov 10, 2007 2:40 PM, KEVIN LYNCH wrote: > Greg, Walt, Henry????!!!!! > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Tom Householder > To: fot at autox.team.net ; > triumphs at autox.team.net > Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:55 AM > Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter > > > I told a friend who was driving to calif about the stolen tr5 race > car.... > he just called and reported a transporter with 3 TR4s and some other race > car on I-40 near Albuquerque NM. Doubt that it's the TR5 but curious as > to > who and what the race car is.. anyone out there know who is on the move > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot< > http://autox.team.net/mailman/li > stinfo/fot> > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > -- Chuck Arnold From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Sun Nov 11 11:08:33 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 11:08:33 -0700 Subject: [Fot] asymetrical corner weighting & custom alignments Message-ID: <000401c8248d$dff25b10$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> I was just curious as to how many members use asymetrical setups and special alignments for different tracks. I know some that setup for predominantly left or right turns or even just a few key corners. By the by, Jim Hearn in Sacramento is looking for some corner scales for a day. Anybody know of a club out that way that has a set ? Jim G From ablake2 at austin.rr.com Sun Nov 11 12:34:48 2007 From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com (Greg & Alison Blake) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 13:34:48 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Head modifications Message-ID: <000a01c82499$ebed8ff0$6401a8c0@blake1> Has anyone had success using an epoxy to change the shape of an intake or exhaust port or is welding the only way to go? Thanks, Greg From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Sun Nov 11 13:35:15 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 13:35:15 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d0711110848w49511a26k1b28d9eddcf4a7f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <001201c824a2$5df4b800$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> This link shows the spacer jg http://www.midwestmotorsportsinc.com/order_part.php?item=20191 &line=AFC -----Original Message----- From: Chuck Arnold [mailto:triosan at gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 9:48 AM To: James Gray Subject: Re: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Please tell me what an AFCO adjustable spacer is. Thanks. On Nov 10, 2007 11:51 AM, James Gray wrote: Two ways you can do it. Shorter springs and removing the spacers put some negative in. And/Or, you can; 1. Install longer bolts at the lower control arms and shim out more. 2. Slot the upper control arms at the ball joint and move the top of the trunion inboard. If you pull the spacers out you may want to replace them with the AFCO adjustable spacers so you can corner weight the car and dial in both at the same time. Jim G -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net ] On Behalf Of jim hearn Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:59 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Sorry, someone told me how to do this but I can't find the email now. My original question was how to get more negative camber on my '74 TR6 that I use to autocross (no street use). I have adjusted it with shims to a negative 1 = degrees. One person told me about removing part of the spring assembly but I can't find the email or recall the particulars of this email. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated, especially those in the email I have since misplaced. Thanks, Jim Sacramento, CA Two '74 TR6s [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot -- Chuck Arnold From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Sun Nov 11 14:35:56 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 15:35:56 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Head modifications In-Reply-To: <000a01c82499$ebed8ff0$6401a8c0@blake1> References: <000a01c82499$ebed8ff0$6401a8c0@blake1> Message-ID: <200711112134.lABLY7fp287303@ns3.geneseo.net> I have used epoxy. I've used JB Weld and it is generally thought to be superior as far as stiction goes, but it is so runny that you have to build a dam to keep it in and then grind all of that away. A product that is easier is Moroso A & B. It comes in two bars about like big Snickers bars. It is made expressly for this purpose. It works fine but you must be very careful to mix it thoroughly before use. I have never tried it in an exhaust port but only in intake ports. I've never had a failure, but the danger is always there, and I no longer use it. I've found ways to make the TR4 head flow just as well without it. One of the most interesting experiments was trying to make a "high velocity" port like they use on high rpm motorcycle engines. I theorized that the best place to restrict the flow was right at the downturn of the port. I built up the radius until there was only about 60% of the port cross sectional area remaining. Then we took the car to a chassis dyno and ran it with a head with epoxy and a head without. Common sense told me that we would lose hp, but I've seen the dyno curves for hot bikes and they showed higher hp so I was really curious about it. Plus I was out of ideas at the time. We found that this experiment lost us 8 hp. I later tumbled to the fact that the cycle guys experience gains above 8000 rpm, not below. At 01:34 PM 11/11/2007, you wrote: >Has anyone had success using an epoxy to change the shape of an intake >or exhaust port or is welding the only way to go? > >Thanks, > >Greg >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From vintage.racer at comcast.net Sun Nov 11 15:01:55 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 14:01:55 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Racing videos from the 1960's Message-ID: <000001c824ae$79931190$6cb934b0$@racer@comcast.net> Hello: Here is a link to some good "vintage" race footage of the Lotus F1 cars of that era along with other racing videos: Gary http://www.blinkx.com/burl?v=Uamw9xGoXYfAAgVv6hiyJg From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Sun Nov 11 18:21:19 2007 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 17:21:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Message-ID: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard From klynch_6 at msn.com Sun Nov 11 18:46:36 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 18:46:36 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Here, here...! A timely post. Kev Lynch ----- Original Message ----- From: EDWARD BARNARD To: FOT Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 6:21 PM Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From lunkercars at earthlink.net Sun Nov 11 19:16:45 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 19:16:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <346C4E05-DE94-4BD8-8074-52242CDCEDE1@earthlink.net> Just picked up this message. Any details? [where, when, parked or moving?] Perhaps to late now but I would be happy to follow up. Greg On Nov 10, 2007, at 11:55 AM, Tom Householder wrote: > I told a friend who was driving to calif about the stolen tr5 race > car.... > he just called and reported a transporter with 3 TR4s and some > other race > car on I-40 near Albuquerque NM. Doubt that it's the TR5 but > curious as to > who and what the race car is.. anyone out there know who is on the > move > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From budscars at msn.com Sun Nov 11 19:18:24 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (RACER BUD) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 18:18:24 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Thanks Ed..I greatly appreciate your email...........I am not a Vet....I am extremely proud to say that...2 of my 4 kids, and 1 son in law are now serving us... My oldest son , Scott(35), is an Officer and Diver for the Coast Guard..securing our ports against terrorism..(he was a rescue swimmer) he's now stationed in Boston...My youngest daughter, Liz(23)...and her husband, Frieden, are Air Force Officers, living in Gulf Breeze Fl...They are both USAFA Grads....Liz is a logistics officer, and Frieden is in Pilot Training.... Good Job Ed! Racer Bud..Sonoma, Ca..spitfire #21 ----- Original Message ----- From: "EDWARD BARNARD" To: "FOT" Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 5:21 PM Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the > other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd > Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From ehusmann53 at yahoo.com Sun Nov 11 19:36:16 2007 From: ehusmann53 at yahoo.com (Ernest Husmann) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 18:36:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <586906.9711.qm@web57615.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Thanks Ed. If you have a copy of Old Glory, fly Her. If nothing else it's a show of support for the kids doing our duty. Ernie EDWARD BARNARD wrote: Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From BillB at bnj.com Sun Nov 11 20:07:59 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 19:07:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Thanks. I kind of forgot it was Veteran's day. I think I'm the only Vet in my company. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of EDWARD BARNARD Sent: Sun 11/11/2007 5:21 PM To: FOT Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tarch at bellsouth.net Mon Nov 12 06:58:14 2007 From: tarch at bellsouth.net (Richard Taylor) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 08:58:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys remember that old stuff? Richard L. Taylor Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From greenman62 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 12 07:20:07 2007 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (greenman62 at hotmail.com) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 14:20:07 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> Message-ID: Sure... 1505s... "Lifers", Blue wool shirts (they made a comeback in the late 60s USAF)... tech school down the road at my old man's Alma Mater (Chanute)... My Chief Observer at Shaw AFB trying to catch my trainer and I napping during a midnight shift by climbing up the shaky weather tower's escape rope... getting half way up and being treated by a shower of cold coffee for his troubles. "Gee, Sgt. Kemp (not his real name) we didn't know you were there!" Sitting in the quiet darkness of a Phillippean night on a loading dock taking a break from editing weather reports with my friends... and suddenly being scared to death when a rice bug the size of a Buick smacked into the steel door behind us... Life was tough at the sharp end of the sling psychrometer. 'Now back in the brown shoe days..." Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > From: tarch at bellsouth.net > To: BillB at bnj.com; edwardbarnard at prodigy.net; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 08:58:14 -0500 > Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and > tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys > remember that old stuff? > > Richard L. Taylor > > Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other > veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all > the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wensley_Tr at comcast.net Mon Nov 12 07:48:19 2007 From: wensley_Tr at comcast.net (Craig) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 09:48:19 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day..In honor of Veteran's Day Message-ID: <002f01c8253b$1128e4d0$0200a8c0@Desktop> Keep it moving, please, even if you've seen it before. It is the VETERAN , not the preacher, who has given us freedom of religion. It is the VETERAN , not the reporter, who has given us freedom of the press. It is the VETERAN , not the poet, who has given us freedom of speech. It is the VETERAN , not the campus organizer, who has given us freedom to assemble. It is the VETERAN , not the lawyer, who has given us the right to a fair trial. It is the VETERAN , not the politician, Who has given us the right to vote. It is the VETERAN , who salutes the Flag, It is the veteran , who serves under the Flag, ETERNAL REST GRANT THEM O LORD, AND LET PERPETUAL LIGHT SHINE UPON THEM. I don't usually suggest that many emails be forwarded, but I'd be EXTREMELY proud if this one reached as many as possible. We can be very proud of our young men and women in the service no matter where they serve. God Bless them all!!! = [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/gif] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg] From stutzmans at comcast.net Mon Nov 12 08:38:41 2007 From: stutzmans at comcast.net (Stutzman) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:38:41 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002201c82542$51a5f8c0$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> aT OUR WPTA meeting SAT. 2 of our members who are Marines, played the Marine Corp. anthem. And of course they reminded us - once a Marine always a Marine. Ed Woods, 67 years old, ran the marithon on DC with his 2 daughters. Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "EDWARD BARNARD" ; "FOT" Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 10:07 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day > Thanks. I kind of forgot it was Veteran's day. I think I'm the only Vet in > my > company. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of EDWARD BARNARD > Sent: Sun 11/11/2007 5:21 PM > To: FOT > Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the > other > veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to > all > the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tarch at bellsouth.net Mon Nov 12 09:14:55 2007 From: tarch at bellsouth.net (Richard Taylor) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 11:14:55 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <002201c82542$51a5f8c0$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <002201c82542$51a5f8c0$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> Message-ID: <006801c82547$2ae0cb20$6401a8c0@richardiipc> "Once a Marine, always a Marine." Hmm, it sounds incurable, maybe something like herpes. Richard (ex Grunt) aT OUR WPTA meeting SAT. 2 of our members who are Marines, played the Marine Corp. anthem. And of course they reminded us - once a Marine always a Marine. Ed Woods, 67 years old, ran the marithon on DC with his 2 daughters. Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "EDWARD BARNARD" ; "FOT" Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 10:07 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day > Thanks. I kind of forgot it was Veteran's day. I think I'm the only Vet in > my > company. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of EDWARD BARNARD > Sent: Sun 11/11/2007 5:21 PM > To: FOT > Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the > other > veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to > all > the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 12 09:31:43 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 11:31:43 EST Subject: [Fot] paging Mark Eden Message-ID: Trip in the offing to Wyotech. First dates available after Thanksgiving. Joe A From ehusmann53 at yahoo.com Mon Nov 12 10:58:53 2007 From: ehusmann53 at yahoo.com (Ernest Husmann) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 09:58:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <581931.78689.qm@web57607.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Chanute ... Falling out at 0330 every day in the middle of winter to march to the chow hall a half mile away. Then reforming to march to the hanger about two miles away. Sorry can't tell you about going up hill both ways because there were no hills at Chanute that would even slightly deflect the damn wind. Made it back to Chanute this past spring. Civilian now, most of the buildings are vacant, the aircraft are gone, as are the manicured lawns. Sad to see the condition it was in. greenman62 at hotmail.com wrote: Sure... 1505s... "Lifers", Blue wool shirts (they made a comeback in the late 60s USAF)... tech school down the road at my old man's Alma Mater (Chanute)... Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From kaskas at cox.net Mon Nov 12 11:38:27 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:38:27 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <581931.78689.qm@web57607.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <00b301c8255b$370e12e0$3f0ec548@RW> Yeah, they've even made Camp Polk a Fort now. I still think that place was a nice spot for a vacant lot. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ernest Husmann" To: ; "'FOT'" Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 9:58 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day > Chanute ... Falling out at 0330 every day in the middle of winter to march > to the chow hall a half mile away. Then reforming to march to the hanger > about two miles away. Sorry can't tell you about going up hill both ways > because there were no hills at Chanute that would even slightly deflect > the damn wind. > > Made it back to Chanute this past spring. Civilian now, most of the > buildings are vacant, the aircraft are gone, as are the manicured lawns. > Sad to see the condition it was in. > > greenman62 at hotmail.com wrote: > Sure... 1505s... "Lifers", Blue wool shirts (they made a comeback in the > late > 60s USAF)... tech school down the road at my old man's Alma Mater > (Chanute)... > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jeff_durant at comcast.net Mon Nov 12 11:37:33 2007 From: jeff_durant at comcast.net (jeff_durant at comcast.net) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 18:37:33 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com><004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> Message-ID: <1077169673-1194892780-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-2096115072-@bxe103.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Richard, Thanks to you and all the other Veterans, we enjoy the freedoms we have today. Long may it be so. My father was also in the 11th Airborne in Korea. He was very proud of it as I'm sure you are. God Bless, Jeff Durant Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T -----Original Message----- From: "Richard Taylor" Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 08:58:14 To:"'Bill Babcock'" , "'EDWARD BARNARD'", "'FOT'" Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys remember that old stuff? Richard L. Taylor Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Mon Nov 12 11:50:19 2007 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:50:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: Veteran's Day Message-ID: <979091.40151.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Note: forwarded message attached. Received: from [75.41.205.147] by web81205.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 PST Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 -0800 (PST) From: EDWARD BARNARD Subject: RE: [Fot] Veteran's Day To: Richard Taylor In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0 at richardiipc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 994 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Richard: Still have my kun#cap hanging with my dress greens in the closet with a pair of boots, one set of jungles and one of deserts. What is it that some things we never get rid of? Funny, today on the radio I hear everybody saying it's Veteran's Day. People remember it as a bank holiday and not Armistice Day. As a kid back home, on the 11th hour, of the 11th day, of the 11th month, the sirens would blow and the church bells would ring. Today people curse it because they're not going to get their mail! - Ed Richard Taylor wrote: As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys remember that old stuff? Richard L. Taylor Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From trhouse at greenapple.com Mon Nov 12 08:54:32 2007 From: trhouse at greenapple.com (Tom Householder) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:54:32 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day WWII Memorial In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 11/12/07 9:20 AM, greenman62 at hotmail.com at greenman62 at hotmail.com wrote: > Sure... 1505s... "Lifers", Blue wool shirts (they made a comeback in the late > 60s USAF)... tech school down the road at my old man's Alma Mater (Chanute)... > My Chief Observer at Shaw AFB trying to catch my trainer and I napping during > a midnight shift by climbing up the shaky weather tower's escape rope... > getting half way up and being treated by a shower of cold coffee for his > troubles. "Gee, Sgt. Kemp (not his real name) we didn't know you were there!" > Sitting in the quiet darkness of a Phillippean night on a loading dock taking > a break from editing weather reports with my friends... and suddenly being > scared to death when a rice bug the size of a Buick smacked into the steel > door behind us... > > Life was tough at the sharp end of the sling psychrometer. > > 'Now back in the brown shoe days..." > > Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois > > That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > > > >> From: tarch at bellsouth.net >> To: BillB at bnj.com; edwardbarnard at prodigy.net; fot at autox.team.net >> Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 08:58:14 -0500 >> Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day >> >> As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and >> tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys >> remember that old stuff? >> >> Richard L. Taylor >> >> Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day >> >> Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other >> veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to > all >> the Corps veteran's! >> -Ed Barnard >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > There was a story in the local paper on the WWII memorial for those who are or have friends /family WWII vets. check this site for there existence there if not there see that they are honored by having there names registerd. http://www.wwiimemorial.com also see "Names still Absent from WWII Registry" article ... Columbus Dispatch Nov 11. 2007 (OHIO) From billsohl at optonline.net Mon Nov 12 12:40:14 2007 From: billsohl at optonline.net (Bill Sohl) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 14:40:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <979091.40151.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <979091.40151.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8E0FCF11FDA7499EBC6185ECD99AC59D@SohlPC> I wish the recent PBS series "The WAR" by Ken Burns would be mandatory viewing for all high school kids. The series (and I only caught 2 of the 7 parts) is truly told on a very personal level...one that really brings to the forefront the sacrifices made by so many. There is a book version also and I read it cover-to-cover and am still in awe as to the sacrifices made by so many on our behalf. I served (US Navy) from 66-70 and even though my ship (DD-781, a destroyer) was in the Vietnam war zone (late 68 through spring 69) providing gunfire support and doing other war time duties we thankfully were never shot at by anyone. I can't imagine the actual feelings one must go through when on the receiving end of enemy gunfire. Anyone who has served, regardless of it being peacetime or wartime deserves my respect because no one ever knows when peacetime can suddenly be wartime on a moments notice putting everyone in the service potentially in harms way. With sincerest respect for all who served, Bill Sohl ----------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "EDWARD BARNARD" To: "FOT" Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 1:50 PM Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: Veteran's Day > Note: forwarded message attached. > Received: from [75.41.205.147] by web81205.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; > Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 PST > Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 -0800 (PST) > From: EDWARD BARNARD > Subject: RE: [Fot] Veteran's Day > To: Richard Taylor > In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0 at richardiipc> > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > Content-Length: 994 > X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d > X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain > > Richard: Still have my kun#cap hanging with my dress greens in the closet > with a pair of boots, one set of jungles and one of deserts. What is it > that some things we never get rid of? Funny, today on the radio I hear > everybody saying it's Veteran's Day. People remember it as a bank holiday > and not Armistice Day. As a kid back home, on the 11th hour, of the 11th > day, of the 11th month, the sirens would blow and the church bells would > ring. Today people curse it because they're not going to get their mail! > - Ed > > Richard Taylor wrote: > As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and > tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys > remember that old stuff? > > Richard L. Taylor > > Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the > other > veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to > all > the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 12 13:32:27 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 15:32:27 -0500 Subject: [Fot] =?iso-8859-1?q?=A0Veteran=27s_Day?= Message-ID: <2933D1CD.25C85F6A.00159EE9@cs.com> THE WAR was extremely interesting...so many facets brought together. AND.... AMERICAN PATRIOT: THE LIFE & WARS OF BUD DAY will get your attention.. Richard Taylor's friend, ROBERT CORAM, ought to be in line for his third Pulitzer nomination for his biography of the nation's most decorated living warrior. And Bud Day should get one last medal for saving 95% of the service benefits that were taken away, after he returned from the Hanoi Hilton. FIGHTER PILOT, LAWYER, IOWAN. JoeA >I wish the recent PBS series "The WAR" by Ken Burns would be mandatory >viewing for all high school kids. The series (and I only caught 2 of the 7 >parts) is truly told on a very personal level...one that really brings to >the forefront the sacrifices made by so many. >There is a book version also and I read it cover-to-cover and am still in >awe as to the sacrifices made by so many on our behalf. > >I served (US Navy) from 66-70 and even though my ship (DD-781, a destroyer) >was in the Vietnam war zone (late 68 through spring 69) providing gunfire >support and doing other war time duties we thankfully were never shot at by >anyone. I can't imagine the actual feelings one must go through when on >the receiving end of enemy gunfire. > >Anyone who has served, regardless of it being peacetime or wartime deserves >my respect because no one ever knows when peacetime can suddenly be wartime >on a moments notice putting everyone in the service potentially in harms >way. > >With sincerest respect for all who served, >Bill Sohl >----------------- >----- Original Message ----- >From: "EDWARD BARNARD" >To: "FOT" >Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 1:50 PM >Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: Veteran's Day > > >> Note: forwarded message attached. >> Received: from [75.41.205.147] by web81205.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; >> Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 PST >> Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 -0800 (PST) >> From: EDWARD BARNARD >> Subject: RE: [Fot] Veteran's Day >> To: Richard Taylor >> In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0 at richardiipc> >> MIME-Version: 1.0 >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >> Content-Length: 994 >> X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d >> X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain >> >> Richard: Still have my kun#cap hanging with my dress greens in the closet >> with a pair of boots, one set of jungles and one of deserts. What is it >> that some things we never get rid of? Funny, today on the radio I hear >> everybody saying it's Veteran's Day. People remember it as a bank holiday >> and not Armistice Day. As a kid back home, on the 11th hour, of the 11th >> day, of the 11th month, the sirens would blow and the church bells would >> ring. Today people curse it because they're not going to get their mail! >> - Ed >> >> Richard Taylor wrote: >> As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and >> tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys >> remember that old stuff? >> >> Richard L. Taylor >> >> Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day >> >> Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the >> other >> veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to >> all >> the Corps veteran's! >> -Ed Barnard >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From trhouse at greenapple.com Mon Nov 12 02:06:09 2007 From: trhouse at greenapple.com (Tom Householder) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 04:06:09 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter In-Reply-To: <346C4E05-DE94-4BD8-8074-52242CDCEDE1@earthlink.net> Message-ID: on 11/11/07 9:16 PM, Greg "Lunker" Hilyer at lunkercars at earthlink.net wrote: > On Nov 10, 2007, at 11:55 AM, Tom Householder wrote: at the original post time and date it was east of Albquerque NM headed west on I 40 From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Mon Nov 12 20:44:49 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 19:44:49 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Oil Seal Material References: <000801c82328$9cd41d70$d67c5850$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: <003001c825a7$8b2cbbf0$6401a8c0@TER2> Actually leather is a pretty high perfromance seal material. One of the perfromance factors that is not mentioned in the chart at the Web Site at PSP is the surface speed of the shaft and seal contact. Leather can tolerate quite high surface speeds compared to most of the other materials. So leather English seals are not just old technology, the material is there for a reason! There are charts that give the surface speed tolerances in some older Chicago Rawhide seal catalogues that I have. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Horstkorta" To: Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 3:31 PM Subject: [Fot] Oil Seal Material > Here is a handy chart to compare oil seal materials, not the Dupont Dow > Viton listing: www.pspglobal.com/low-temperature-seals.html. > > > > Gary > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 13 07:45:11 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 09:45:11 EST Subject: [Fot] [6pack] FOT at The Glen Sept 2008 Message-ID: Thanks Dennis! You have more information than I do at this point on the special activities. www.grandprixfestival.com Egads! there's a lot of Triumph and sportscar stuff going on with the Village Fathers at the Glen. I knew about it, but had no idea of the extent of it until I visited the site: www.grandprixfestival.com We need to make note of that on our fot website, too. Thanks for jumping in....this is going to be a very special event...there will be a few surprises, as well. Joe Alexander Friends of Triumph > Triumph is also the featured marque for the Grand > Prix Festival of Watkins Glen being held on Friday, > September 5, 2008. Triumphs are eligible for the Tour > de Marque which gives you some great perks including > laps around WGI on Friday, lunch at the track and a > great parking spot for the festival which includes a > race reenactment through the streets of Watkins Glen! > There are only 100 spots available and registration > has already opened for previous 'Stone Bridge Drivers' > so get your registration in ASAP. > See www.grandprixfestival.com for more information. > > Dennis Culligan, Highland NY / 1976 TR6 CF57948U TR6IUMPH > From lang at isis.mit.edu Tue Nov 13 08:32:02 2007 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert Lang) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 10:32:02 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Oil Seal Material In-Reply-To: <003001c825a7$8b2cbbf0$6401a8c0@TER2> References: <000801c82328$9cd41d70$d67c5850$@racer@comcast.net> <003001c825a7$8b2cbbf0$6401a8c0@TER2> Message-ID: Hi, So, what you're saying Greg is that just because leather seals are old school, they still perform well. Hmmm, how about that! New isn't always better. I'm shocked. Shocked, I tell you! rml :-) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Room N42-140Q | This space for rent Vintage Consultant MIT IS&T unix-linux-help | Voice:617-253-7438 FAX: 617-258-9535 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 13 09:19:22 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 11:19:22 EST Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn Status for The Glen and a little more.... Message-ID: FoT: If you have been wondering about the status of reservations for the Hampton Inn....."Andrea" is behind in her paperwork and will be back to me with the particulars. "Today", she says. I just gave her a nudge...... I will pass a long her published contact information so that you can make your reservations directly. If you are really special and/or live off shore, I can make your reservations for you. Cary Perket suggests that you might make a better deal if you have a Triple A membership. You likely could make your reservations and then deal with that issue when you arrive on the premises. I didnt want to go back and renegotiate and muddy the water. Presently, the rooms are being reserved under THE FRIENDS OF TRIUMPH WITH a rate of $114.00. One more thing....I have had a couple of folks step forward and volunteer their help: Henry Frye and Tim Suddard: Press Releases Tom Strange: Paddock Coordination Scott Janzen & Ted Schumacher: Event Shirts I have also had a few commercial entities offer support. I am trying to think of role that they can play in this event. I am open to suggestions. Of course, GrassRoots Motors Sports (Classic Motorsports Magazine) is sponsoring the Triumph Race itself. The Roadster Factory is bringing the fabled Le Mans TRS as one of the Pace Cars, and for display. TS Enterprises always does us good on supplying the Event Shirts. Triumph Rescue and Ratco stepped forward, too, but nothing has been planned yet. Thanks! Joe Alexander From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 13 12:24:08 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 12:24:08 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Like riding a bike Message-ID: <20071113193430.DZPA28248.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> Schumacher quickest on F1 return http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=41285 "...Second quickest was Ferrari's regular test driver Luca Badoer, who was 0.2s slower in the sister car. McLaren's test driver Pedro de la Rosa was third fastest but the Spaniard was more than 0.7s slower..." 1. M.SCHUMACHER Ferrari 1m21.922s 2. BADOER Ferrari 1m22.129s 3. DE LA ROSA McLaren 1m22.687s 4. KOVALAINEN Renault 1m22.802s 5. KUBICA BMW 1m22.883s 6. PAFFETT McLaren 1m23.008s 7. NAKAJIMA Williams 1m23.187s 8. COULTHARD Red Bull 1m23.332s 9. TRULLI Toyota 1m23.624s 10. HEIDFELD BMW 1m23.671s 11. ROSBERG Williams 1m23.847s 12. MONTAGNY Toyota 1m23.861s 13. VETTEL Toro Rosso 1m24.048s 14. ZUBER Super Aguri 1m24.065s 15. BOURDAIS Toro Rosso 1m24.193s 16. DAVIDSON Super Aguri 1m24.246s 17. ROSSITER Honda 1m24.480s 18. CHANDHOK Red Bull 1m24.896s 19. VAN DER GARDE Force India 1m25.317s 20. RODRIGUEZ Force India 1m26.973s From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 13 12:26:09 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 12:26:09 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Brawn to Honda Message-ID: <20071113193431.ZEEA18714.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> Now this will be interesting to watch... Ross Brawn is leaving Ferrari and going to Honda as Team Principle. From fal at knology.net Tue Nov 13 13:06:48 2007 From: fal at knology.net (fredd) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 14:06:48 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Fw: Free TR-250 Body Message-ID: <01ec01c82630$bead4010$cbbdfea9@fredds> All, Just got off the phone with a guy in Birmingham, AL that has a TR-250 body that he would like to give away. The car had been modified for racing and a lot of parts were "cut off". However, he does still have the body parts that were removed. There is no engine or transmission and the floors were cut to accomadate a Jaguar engine... Also had a Franklin Quick Change rear end Anyway, if anyone is intersted, it's free to a good home, just got to go get it. His name is Kent Johnston Work- 800-633-4392 Home- 205-599-2204 Dave B From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 13 13:38:01 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 15:38:01 -0500 Subject: [Fot] =?iso-8859-1?q?Fw=3A_=A0Free_TR-250_Body?= Message-ID: <3EA27CA8.1F4BE0A9.00159EE9@cs.com> EGADS! this thing had a V-12 ENGINE in it. I am not sure about but I am going to be there with an empty trailer, anyway. thanks! >All, > > Just got off the phone with a guy in Birmingham, AL that has a TR-250 body > that he would like to give away. The car had been modified for racing > and a lot of parts were "cut off". However, he does still have the > body parts that were removed. There is no engine or transmission and > the floors were cut to accomadate a Jaguar engine... >Also had a Franklin Quick Change rear end > > Anyway, if anyone is intersted, it's free to a good home, just got to > go get it. > > His name is Kent Johnston > Work- 800-633-4392 > Home- 205-599-2204 > > Dave B >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From mark at bradakis.com Wed Nov 14 02:33:13 2007 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J. Bradakis) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 02:33:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] A type overdrive noise? Message-ID: <473AC0D9.2050604@bradakis.com> A local fellow recently purchased a '69 TR6 with overdrive. Starting about 25 - 30 mph the gearbox makes an odd whining sound, sort of like a bad bearing, but not really. The noise stops as soon as you engage the overdrive. Does this symptom sound familiar to anyone? Thanks, mjb. From lunkercars at earthlink.net Wed Nov 14 08:14:23 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg Lunker Hilyer) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 08:14:23 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: That's good as regards Chuck's TR- I would think it pretty unlikely a car stolen in Seattle would be headed west on I-40. Greg Hilyer On Nov 12, 2007, at 2:06 AM, Tom Householder wrote: > > at the original post time and date it was east of Albquerque NM > headed west > on I 40 From walt at hot-tr6.com Wed Nov 14 11:06:10 2007 From: walt at hot-tr6.com (Walter Hollowell) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 11:06:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] ARP question again Message-ID: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> I know the FOT site talked about this question a few weeks ago but I failed to save the informatin. I am building up a couple of TR6 blocks for racing and would like to consider ARP bolts for the main bearing caps. Does anyone have a source and or ARP part number you can forward me. Thanks for the help Walt Hollowell Abq., NM From rikrock at aol.com Wed Nov 14 13:56:52 2007 From: rikrock at aol.com (rikrock at aol.com) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 15:56:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Message-ID: <8C9F5180477D1FE-EC0-FF4@WEBMAIL-MA09.sysops.aol.com> Some interesting stuff at? www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf Rich Rock ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com From cwn.fot at cwnicholls.net Wed Nov 14 15:15:28 2007 From: cwn.fot at cwnicholls.net (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 17:15:28 -0500 Subject: [Fot] ARP question again In-Reply-To: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> References: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <002e01c8270b$df0e9ee0$1342a8c0@semperon3400> You can search the FOT archives at: http://autox.team.net/pipermail/fot/ -----Original Message----- To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] ARP question again I know the FOT site talked about this question a few weeks ago but I failed to save the informatin. I am building up a couple of TR6 blocks for racing and would like to consider ARP bolts for the main bearing caps. Does anyone have a source and or ARP part number you can forward me. Thanks for the help Walt Hollowell Abq., NM From S.Janzen at comcast.net Wed Nov 14 15:59:35 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 17:59:35 -0500 Subject: [Fot] ARP question again References: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> <002e01c8270b$df0e9ee0$1342a8c0@semperon3400> Message-ID: <003901c82712$06dadb40$6501a8c0@vefadvisors.com> You can order from Ted Schumacher (sp?) at TS Imported and I think also straight from ARP, butTed may actually be less expensive. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clark W. Nicholls" To: "'Walter Hollowell'" ; Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 5:15 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] ARP question again > You can search the FOT archives at: > http://autox.team.net/pipermail/fot/ > > -----Original Message----- > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: [Fot] ARP question again > > I know the FOT site talked about this question a few weeks ago but I > failed > to save the informatin. > I am building up a couple of TR6 blocks for racing and would like to > consider ARP bolts for the main bearing caps. > Does anyone have a source and or ARP part number you can forward me. > Thanks for the help > Walt Hollowell > Abq., NM > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From mark at bradakis.com Wed Nov 14 18:44:20 2007 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J. Bradakis) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 18:44:20 -0700 Subject: [Fot] ARP question again In-Reply-To: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> References: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <473BA474.6050106@bradakis.com> >I know the FOT site talked about this question a few weeks ago but I failed >to save the informatin. > > I save it all - http://www.team.net/archive mjb. From rikrock at aol.com Thu Nov 15 09:09:44 2007 From: rikrock at aol.com (rikrock at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:09:44 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 In-Reply-To: <002d01c82692$0f8feb70$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> References: <002d01c82692$0f8feb70$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <8C9F5B91201253E-AD4-1A78@webmail-stg-d09.sysops.aol.com> -----Original Message----- From: Steven Preiss To: rikrock at aol.com Sent: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 2:42 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Heady stuff. This was the time when I was first becoming addicted to sports car racing, and it is thrilling to see the cars as they were at that time. Interesting to see the TR3s fitted out with what look like TR6 wheels. I love the captions and copy, too. Really captures the spirit of the time. The rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. Trying to think why MG is absent. I know the Bs were running at the time. Anyone care to elucidate? Thanks Rich. ----- Original Message ----- From: rikrock at aol.com> To: fot at autox.team.net> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:56 AM Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > Some interesting stuff at? www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf > > > > Rich Rock > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 From Fubog1 at aol.com Thu Nov 15 09:22:56 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:22:56 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/15/2007 11:10:23 AM Eastern Standard Time, rikrock at aol.com writes: The rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. ... and some things haven't changed... Glen hates the evil hun-mobiles ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Nov 15 09:28:04 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:28:04 EST Subject: [Fot] WATKINS GLEN 2008 Message-ID: http://www.grandprixfestival.com/ FoT, If you are FoT and plan to be with us at Watkins Glen, but may not enter the ZIPPO GRAND PRIX................................... The Village of Watkins Glen is featuring the TRIUMPH MARQUE. They have several activities during the weekend and will give some preferential treatment to the TRIUMPH. All of these events have limited enrollment. My contact with the Village indicates that everyone should enroll in these events early. http://www.grandprixfestival.com/ If you have a historically significant car, or a car of special interest, that could be displayed, (such as the Triumph TRS) please let me know, and I will put you in touch with my contact person, directly. Joe A PS: I still have not heard from "ANDREA" on the hotel reservation. From mlcooknj at msn.com Thu Nov 15 10:50:04 2007 From: mlcooknj at msn.com (michael cook) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 12:50:04 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Message-ID: If there was no other choice, I would run TR6 wheels on my TR3 and have a photo from Lime Rock, 1967 showing me going into the esses with those wheels. However, we used them only as a last resort because the wider steel wheels were even more likely at the bolt circle than the narrow ones. I usually had rain tires on them. At the race when the photo was taken, I think one of my American Mags had cracked and I had no spare so used the TR6 wheels. Mike Cook ----- Original Message ----- From: rikrock at aol.com Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 11:09 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 -----Original Message----- From: Steven Preiss To: rikrock at aol.com Sent: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 2:42 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Heady stuff. This was the time when I was first becoming addicted to sports car racing, and it is thrilling to see the cars as they were at that time. Interesting to see the TR3s fitted out with what look like TR6 wheels. I love the captions and copy, too. Really captures the spirit of the time. The rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. Trying to think why MG is absent. I know the Bs were running at the time. Anyone care to elucidate? Thanks Rich. ----- Original Message ----- From: rikrock at aol.com> To: fot at autox.team.net> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:56 AM Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > Some interesting stuff at? www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf > > > > Rich Rock > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolc mp00050000000003 Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From EDENMA at aol.com Thu Nov 15 10:17:28 2007 From: EDENMA at aol.com (EDENMA at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 12:17:28 EST Subject: [Fot] Fot Digest, Vol 12, Issue 23 Message-ID: Hi Joe! When are you planning to go to Wyotech? Cheers! Mark ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Thu Nov 15 10:48:34 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:48:34 -0600 Subject: [Fot] crank Message-ID: <200711151747.lAFHknJs262668@ns3.geneseo.net> I'm going to put a TR3 - 4A crank on eBay but wanted to give the listers first shot at it. It's in unbelievably good condition: STANDARD size - never been ground journals checked - polished - doesn't need to be ground, either magnafluxed - not cracked plugs removed, cleaned, replaced $200 uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From triosan at gmail.com Thu Nov 15 11:34:24 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 10:34:24 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Source for oil pan studs and pictures of crank scraper/windage tray Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711151034j6ddda992o48798043718698bb@mail.gmail.com> A while back I bought a set of stainless steel studs for the TR6 oil pan. These had Allen head holes on the ends to drive them in, and stainless nuts with flanges. Does anyone know a source for this kit? Also, you can see pictures of it, and the crank scraper and the windage tray I had installed on my racing TR6 engine at: http://picasaweb.google.com/Triosan/WindageTrayScraprerAndStuds -- Chuck Arnold From EDENMA at aol.com Thu Nov 15 11:37:23 2007 From: EDENMA at aol.com (EDENMA at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 13:37:23 EST Subject: [Fot] Fot Digest, Vol 12, Issue 23 Message-ID: Woops! Thank you Joe Curry! I must have hit the wrong button and sent my reply to the wrong email address. I had intended to respond to Joe Alexander's page directly. Cheers! Mark ______________________________________________________________________________ ______ In a message dated 11/15/2007 10:26:13 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, spitlist at cox.net writes: Mark, When addressing Joe on the FOT list, you will need to be more specific. There are at least a half dozen of us! :) Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of EDENMA at aol.com Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 10:17 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Fot Digest, Vol 12, Issue 23 Hi Joe! When are you planning to go to Wyotech? Cheers! Mark ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From kaskas at cox.net Thu Nov 15 12:53:53 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:53:53 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 References: <002d01c82692$0f8feb70$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> <8C9F5B91201253E-AD4-1A78@webmail-stg-d09.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <003e01c827c1$4067e060$3f0ec548@RW> In 1968 the MG's were not near quick enough to compete with the Porsche 911, TR-250 and the Datsuns. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 8:09 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > -----Original Message----- > > From: Steven Preiss > > To: rikrock at aol.com > > Sent: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 2:42 am > > Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > > > > > > Heady stuff. This was the time when I was first becoming addicted to > sports car racing, and it is thrilling to see the cars as they were at > that time. Interesting to see the TR3s fitted out with what look like TR6 > wheels. I love the captions and copy, too. Really captures the spirit of > the time. The rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. Trying to > think why MG is absent. I know the Bs were running at the time. Anyone > care to elucidate? Thanks Rich. ----- Original Message ----- From: > rikrock at aol.com> To: fot at autox.team.net> Sent: Thursday, November 15, > 2007 7:56 AM Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > Some > interesting stuff at? www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf > > > > > Rich Rock > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - > http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - > http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From henry at henryfrye.com Thu Nov 15 13:50:37 2007 From: henry at henryfrye.com (Henry Frye) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 15:50:37 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication Message-ID: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> I just looked at Chuck's pictures of his crank scraper and I have been meaning to toss out this question on crank scrapers. I understand their purpose is to cut down on the turbulent atmosphere inside the crankcase. Sounds like a good thing, control the oil better so the crank and rods are spinning in cleaner air. Less resistance to engine rotation, more horsepower. OK, sounds fine, but I always thought it was that chaotic environment of oil being tossed about in the crankcase was the 'splash lubrication' that the cam lobes and tappets need to stay alive. What am I missing??? Not to mention the issue that more and more of our oil choices lack an effective additive package for flat tappet engines... From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 15 14:32:32 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 13:32:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: probably that it's more chaotic than you would believe, and a crank scraper really just pulls the oil off the crank--it doesn't do that much to reduce chaos. You can easily wind two quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that weight -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Henry Frye Sent: Thu 11/15/2007 12:50 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication I just looked at Chuck's pictures of his crank scraper and I have been meaning to toss out this question on crank scrapers. I understand their purpose is to cut down on the turbulent atmosphere inside the crankcase. Sounds like a good thing, control the oil better so the crank and rods are spinning in cleaner air. Less resistance to engine rotation, more horsepower. OK, sounds fine, but I always thought it was that chaotic environment of oil being tossed about in the crankcase was the 'splash lubrication' that the cam lobes and tappets need to stay alive. What am I missing??? Not to mention the issue that more and more of our oil choices lack an effective additive package for flat tappet engines... Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 15 16:14:54 2007 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 18:14:54 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: > really just pulls the oil off the crank--it doesn't do that much to reduce> chaos. You can easily wind two quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that> weight Is that where the term "windage tray" comes from? Is it pronounced windage like Kentucky windage or like what it takes to wind up a toy? John From stutzmans at comcast.net Thu Nov 15 16:59:03 2007 From: stutzmans at comcast.net (Stutzman) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 18:59:03 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 References: Message-ID: <001901c827e3$81f22a50$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> I ran TR6 wheels on my TR4 in SVRA in the mid 80's - why - they were cheap! Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "michael cook" To: ; "fot" Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 12:50 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > If there was no other choice, I would run TR6 wheels on my TR3 and have a > photo from Lime Rock, 1967 showing me going into the esses with those > wheels. > However, we used them only as a last resort because the wider steel wheels > were even more likely at the bolt circle than the narrow ones. I usually > had > rain tires on them. > > At the race when the photo was taken, I think one of my American Mags had > cracked and I had no spare so used the TR6 wheels. > > Mike Cook > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: rikrock at aol.com > Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 11:09 AM > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Steven Preiss > > To: rikrock at aol.com > > Sent: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 2:42 am > > Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > > > > > > Heady stuff. This was the time when I was first becoming addicted to > sports > car racing, and it is thrilling to see the cars as they were at that time. > Interesting to see the TR3s fitted out with what look like TR6 wheels. I > love > the captions and copy, too. Really captures the spirit of the time. The > rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. Trying to think why MG is > absent. I know the Bs were running at the time. Anyone care to elucidate? > Thanks Rich. ----- Original Message ----- From: rikrock at aol.com> To: > fot at autox.team.net> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:56 AM Subject: > [Fot] > Triumphs Racing in 1968 > Some interesting stuff at? > www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf > > > > Rich Rock > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > > > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - > http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - > http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolc > mp00050000000003 > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From kaskas at cox.net Thu Nov 15 17:03:29 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 16:03:29 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: <00cb01c827e4$1ec087a0$3f0ec548@RW> Although oil in "winding up" the expression is windage as in "win-dedge". It pays to pay be aware of his circumstance......... ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Herrera" To: "Bill Babcock" ; "Henry Frye" ; Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 3:14 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication >> really just pulls the oil off the crank--it doesn't do that much to >> reduce> > chaos. You can easily wind two quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that> > weight > Is that where the term "windage tray" comes from? Is it pronounced windage > like Kentucky windage or like what it takes to wind up a toy? > > John > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From britbits at tiu.net Thu Nov 15 21:13:22 2007 From: britbits at tiu.net (Jim) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 22:13:22 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Source for oil pan studs and pictures of crank scraper/windage tray In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d0711151034j6ddda992o48798043718698bb@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d0711151034j6ddda992o48798043718698bb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <000001c82807$07c08a00$05e435cf@jrg> Chuck, Those studs are just long set-screws. Any decent industrial supply house should be able to provide them (pop one out and measure the length) or you can get them from McMaster (www.mcmaster.com). And the shouldered nuts also. Or if you can wait until after Tamale day I'll check locally. We used them all the time at my previous job. Cheers, Jim Dallas '76 DM Spitfire and a few other toys ;) -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+britbits=tiu.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+britbits=tiu.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Chuck Arnold Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 12:34 PM To: Friends; Triumph Subject: [Fot] Source for oil pan studs and pictures of crank scraper/windage tray A while back I bought a set of stainless steel studs for the TR6 oil pan. These had Allen head holes on the ends to drive them in, and stainless nuts with flanges. Does anyone know a source for this kit? Also, you can see pictures of it, and the crank scraper and the windage tray I had installed on my racing TR6 engine at: http://picasaweb.google.com/Triosan/WindageTrayScraprerAndStuds -- Chuck Arnold Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 15 21:54:57 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 20:54:57 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: A windage tray and a scraper are not exactly the same thing. The scraper is a piece of metal shaped to fit close to the crank so it can scrape off the oil that gets wound onto the crank. The windage tray may incorporate a scraper, but it's a cover that fits between the crank and the oil pan intended to keep the oil in the sump from being blown around by the wind generated by the crankshaft. The motor I built for Peyote has a windage tray, a scraper, and a baffled sump, all aimed at getting oil off the crankshaft and down into the sump. And it's pronounced windage as in blowing in the wind. -----Original Message----- From: John Herrera [mailto:jrherrera90 at hotmail.com] Sent: Thu 11/15/2007 3:14 PM To: Bill Babcock; Henry Frye; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > really just pulls the oil off the crank--it doesn't do that much to reduce> chaos. You can easily wind two quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that> weight Is that where the term "windage tray" comes from? Is it pronounced windage like Kentucky windage or like what it takes to wind up a toy? John From henry at henryfrye.com Fri Nov 16 06:46:14 2007 From: henry at henryfrye.com (Henry Frye) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 08:46:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBA0@server.Triumph.local> OK, Bill, I hear you. Thanks... I am having difficulty visualizing two quarts of oil being wound up on the crank, though! > -----Original Message----- > From: Bill Babcock [mailto:BillB at bnj.com] > Sent: November 15, 2007 4:33 PM > To: Henry Frye; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: RE: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > probably that it's more chaotic than you would believe, and a > crank scraper really just pulls the oil off the crank--it > doesn't do that much to reduce chaos. You can easily wind two > quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that weight > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Henry Frye > Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > What am I missing??? From jaxonracing at yahoo.com Fri Nov 16 09:40:46 2007 From: jaxonracing at yahoo.com (Jay Creel) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 08:40:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs Message-ID: <917020.28322.qm@web53511.mail.re2.yahoo.com> FOT, I am looking for a new "dearched" leaf spring for my HP Triumph Spitfire. I had spoken with Rick Cline some time ago regarding a spring but there were some challenges with the supplier at the time. Since then, I have continued to use my "stock" dearched spring but I am looking to upgrade. Does anyone know of a source for a composite leaf spring for a racing spitfire? Contact information and if they have specifications on file?? I will also reach out to Rick C. to discuss the possibility of getting a famous Rick Cline spring. thanks Jay R. Creel ____________________________________________________________________________________ Get easy, one-click access to your favorites. Make Yahoo! your homepage. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From tedtsimx at bright.net Fri Nov 16 12:54:52 2007 From: tedtsimx at bright.net (Ted Schumacher) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 14:54:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBA0@server.Triumph.local> References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBA0@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: <473DF58C.4060104@bright.net> Henry Frye wrote: > OK, Bill, I hear you. Thanks... > > I am having difficulty visualizing two quarts of oil being wound up on > the crank, though! > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Bill Babcock [mailto:BillB at bnj.com] >> Sent: November 15, 2007 4:33 PM >> To: Henry Frye; fot at autox.team.net >> Subject: RE: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication >> >> probably that it's more chaotic than you would believe, and a >> crank scraper really just pulls the oil off the crank--it >> doesn't do that much to reduce chaos. You can easily wind two >> quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that weight >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Henry Frye >> Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication >> >> What am I missing??? >> > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > List, for what it's worth, Chrysler offers, at least used to offer, a windage tray big block Dodge engine. Both 413 and 440. These were common engines in the RV industry in the '70's and '80's. This little $14 option generated 12 hp. Actually, it didn't generate any HP, but rather freed up 12 hp that could be used for other things, such as getting launched from a stop sign or merging. That much power was lost dragging the crank through the oil mist. Remember the IC engine is only an air pump. And, it pumps a lot of air in a big displacement engine. Ted -- Ted Schumacher tedtsimx at bright.net http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com 108 S. Jefferson St. Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 From John.Reed at wilson.com Fri Nov 16 13:24:48 2007 From: John.Reed at wilson.com (John.Reed at wilson.com) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 12:24:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBA0@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: Henry, I put on a crank scraper with my last rebuild. I swear the engine spun quicker. Regards, John Reed Staff Photographer Wilson Sporting Goods Co. 8750 W Bryn Mawr Ave, Chicago, Illinois 60631, USA Tel. + 1.773.714.6895, fax +1.773.714.4585 John.Reed at wilson.com www.wilson.com www.amersports.com Please note that effective immediately, my e-mail , phone number and street address have changed. Please update your files accordingly. "Henry Frye" Sent by: fot-bounces+john.reed=wilson.com at autox.team.net 11/16/07 05:46 AM To "Bill Babcock" , cc Subject Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication OK, Bill, I hear you. Thanks... I am having difficulty visualizing two quarts of oil being wound up on the crank, though! > -----Original Message----- > From: Bill Babcock [mailto:BillB at bnj.com] > Sent: November 15, 2007 4:33 PM > To: Henry Frye; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: RE: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > probably that it's more chaotic than you would believe, and a > crank scraper really just pulls the oil off the crank--it > doesn't do that much to reduce chaos. You can easily wind two > quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that weight > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Henry Frye > Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > What am I missing??? Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot This e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. From tr5racer at btinternet.com Fri Nov 16 13:43:28 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 20:43:28 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Triumphs racing in 1968 Message-ID: <442846.72428.qm@web86602.mail.ird.yahoo.com> I raced from the late 1970's to the mid 1980's with TR6 steel wheels on my TR5 and never had any problems however I only had about 150bhp at the wheels in those days not the 200+ I have now!! Mike Hughes --------------------------------- Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now. From rikrock at aol.com Fri Nov 16 13:56:50 2007 From: rikrock at aol.com (rikrock at aol.com) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 15:56:50 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <8C9F6AA585D7B7C-1268-1BE9@webmail-stg-d10.sysops.aol.com> So, you guys are saying that there is no downside to using a crank scraper in a wet-liner motor? That even with connecting rods that don't have the little oil hole like the stock rods do, enough oil gets?to the cylinder walls?? And that enough oil gets everywhere it needs to get, all the time? Rich Rock ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 16 15:36:32 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 14:36:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <8C9F6AA585D7B7C-1268-1BE9@webmail-stg-d10.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: I've seen a video of the inside of a crankcase in a running 4 cylinder motor. Oil splash to the cylinder walls is not an issue. Remember that the full volume of air is changing under the pistons at 100 times per second at 6K RPM. Two liters of air swapping all over the place at 100 times per second. The crankshaft is dragging a cyclone of oil and air around behind it. We visualize it as something running at 60 RPM, oil spinning lightly off the crankshaft as it slowly turns. It doesn't look anything like that. It's not a gentle gust, it's a vicious tornado. Crank scrapers are diverting the tornado from the crankshaft. Windage trays are keeping it from jumping back out of the sump. Much more dynamic than one would naturally visualize. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of rikrock at aol.com Sent: Fri 11/16/2007 12:56 PM To: John.Reed at wilson.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication So, you guys are saying that there is no downside to using a crank scraper in a wet-liner motor? That even with connecting rods that don't have the little oil hole like the stock rods do, enough oil gets?to the cylinder walls?? And that enough oil gets everywhere it needs to get, all the time? Rich Rock ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolc mp00050000000003 Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spreiss at verizon.net Fri Nov 16 01:14:21 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:14:21 +1100 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <8C9F6AA585D7B7C-1268-1BE9@webmail-stg-d10.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <003f01c82828$b17fe150$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Kind of sheds new light on the impetus behind the development of the Wankel engine! Steve P. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: ; ; Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 9:36 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > I've seen a video of the inside of a crankcase in a running 4 cylinder motor. > Oil splash to the cylinder walls is not an issue. Remember that the full > volume of air is changing under the pistons at 100 times per second at 6K RPM. > Two liters of air swapping all over the place at 100 times per second. The > crankshaft is dragging a cyclone of oil and air around behind it. We visualize > it as something running at 60 RPM, oil spinning lightly off the crankshaft as > it slowly turns. It doesn't look anything like that. It's not a gentle gust, > it's a vicious tornado. Crank scrapers are diverting the tornado from the > crankshaft. Windage trays are keeping it from jumping back out of the sump. > Much more dynamic than one would naturally visualize. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of rikrock at aol.com > Sent: Fri 11/16/2007 12:56 PM > To: John.Reed at wilson.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > So, you guys are saying that there is no downside to using a crank scraper in > a wet-liner motor? That even with connecting rods that don't have the little > oil hole like the stock rods do, enough oil gets?to the cylinder walls?? And > that enough oil gets everywhere it needs to get, all the time? > > Rich Rock > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - > http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolc > mp00050000000003 > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 16 17:47:58 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:47:58 EST Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication Message-ID: Kas has a story of putting a plexi window in the block to see what was going on and the mess was totally obscuring any details. Makes you a believer. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From joeg at neb.rr.com Fri Nov 16 18:57:26 2007 From: joeg at neb.rr.com (Joe Guinan) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:57:26 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001101c828bd$3474d0e0$43a6544c@Guinan> Jay - Talk to George at Flex-A-Form. http://flex-a-form.com He has made several springs for Spitfires, and will make them to your specifications for weight rating and height. Runs about $200? Weighs about 9 pounds or something like that? Joe Guinan 751 Day Drive Fremont, NE 68025 Home Phone - 402-727-8011 joeg at neb.rr.com ------------------------------ From: Jay Creel Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs To: fot at autox.team.net FOT, I am looking for a new "dearched" leaf spring for my HP Triumph Spitfire. I had spoken with Rick Cline some time ago regarding a spring but there were some challenges with the supplier at the time. Since then, I have continued to use my "stock" dearched spring but I am looking to upgrade. Does anyone know of a source for a composite leaf spring for a racing spitfire? Contact information and if they have specifications on file?? I will also reach out to Rick C. to discuss the possibility of getting a famous Rick Cline spring. thanks Jay R. Creel From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Fri Nov 16 20:16:00 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 22:16:00 EST Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up Message-ID: Kas wrote: Although oil in "winding up" the expression is windage as in "win-dedge". It pays to pay be aware of his circumstance......... and Bill Babcock wrote: And it's pronounced windage as in blowing in the wind Whilst I have no disagreement with either of these fine fellows, if those (U.S.born) on this list wish to pronounce it "win-dedge", or "wind-age", or whathaveyou-dedge, then I have no problem with that, as long as they don't make me, (UK born), do the same: I will go merrily on my English way, pronouncing it "wine-didge" "let's call the whole thing off" Thinking about 'ropes' of oil being pulled around inside the crankcase by the crankshaft, as it rotates at howmanyrpm? Best wine-didge regards Leon From mdporter at dfn.com Fri Nov 16 20:25:40 2007 From: mdporter at dfn.com (Michael Porter) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 20:25:40 -0700 Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <473E5F34.3030807@dfn.com> Guyots3 at wmconnect.com wrote: > > I will go merrily on my English way, pronouncing it "wine-didge" > > Gee, I didn't know that they say in England, "my, the wined is blowing briskly today." Learn something every day.... Cheers. -- Michael Porter Roswell, NM Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking distance.... From tr4.tony at virgin.net Sat Nov 17 03:16:17 2007 From: tr4.tony at virgin.net (TR4Tony) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 10:16:17 -0000 Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up References: <473E5F34.3030807@dfn.com> Message-ID: <006101c82902$e44ffd60$0ab5a8c0@PBA.INT> I think that comes after the 'ooooo aaaaar whar's moi coider ......' ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Porter" To: Cc: Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 3:25 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] it's a wind-up > Guyots3 at wmconnect.com wrote: >> >> I will go merrily on my English way, pronouncing it "wine-didge" >> >> > > Gee, I didn't know that they say in England, "my, the wined is blowing > briskly today." > > > Learn something every day.... > > > Cheers. > > -- > > > Michael Porter > Roswell, NM > > > Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking > distance.... > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Sat Nov 17 07:32:22 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 08:32:22 -0600 Subject: [Fot] CVAR Last race of the year Message-ID: <000e01c82926$abe11490$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> I know many in the midwest have packed their cars away for the winter but if you want to race one more time this year, CVAR is holding it's last 2007 (actually first 20087 season) race in far north Texas. The track is new and we will be holding the first ever sanctioned race an we would be remiss if we didn't invite the FoT. There have been plenty of delays in opening this track so we haven't talked it up very much but the reports coming back is that it will become our favorite track. Eagles Canyon Raceway is the beautiful culmination of years worth of research, planning, design, and meticulous construction in the rolling hills of North Central Texas. Designed by Rob Wilson, one of the world's top racing instructors, Eagles Canyon Raceway features 2.55 miles, 4 straights over 1,300 feet long, 15 turns, and 70 feet of elevation change. Eagles Canyon is a true driver's track, and is planned to host all classes of events from the top level racing series to club racing and private HPDE days. http://www.eaglescanyon.com/php/welcome.php November Nov 30th-Dec 2nd 1st Annual Eagles Canyon Extravaganza Eagles Canyon Raceway Slidell, Tx. (Just NW of D/FW) A brand new, top notch facility and track Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Nov 17 08:23:45 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 10:23:45 EST Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up Message-ID: Mike, Do you still have any of the old style wind up watches? ;-)) Steve, who gets winded winding up watches... ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From ofbracing at nefcom.net Sat Nov 17 09:04:40 2007 From: ofbracing at nefcom.net (Don Marshall) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 11:04:40 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumph Ghetto at Roebling Road Message-ID: <001101c82933$900840b0$2001a8c0@Dell5100Laptop> FOTers, dont forget the VDCA event at Roebling Road (Savannah GA) in early December. We expect to have the Triumph Ghetto set up on the grass at turn 3. This is a 3 day event with tons of track time for only $250, plus a track day on Thursday for only $125. If youre anywhere in or near the South and want a final race, this is it. Well be cooking in the Ghetto on Friday evening for Triumph drivers and their crews so please stop by. Cheers, Don No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.0/1135 - Release Date: 11/16/2007 10:58 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.0/1135 - Release Date: 11/16/2007 10:58 PM From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Sat Nov 17 10:20:13 2007 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steve Belfer) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 09:20:13 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: Message-ID: <000b01c8293e$1df3d790$0501000a@Chowdown> What do y'all think about this part ?: Also, what's the difference, if any, between this part and windage tray? http://www.cambridgemotorsport.com/TR4-Sump-Baffle-steel-With-Anti-Surge-Gate-for-Aluminium-Sump ~Steve B ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; ; Sent: Friday, November 16, 2007 4:47 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > Kas has a story of putting a plexi window in the block to see what was > going > on and the mess was totally obscuring any details. Makes you a believer. > > > > ************************************** > See what's new at http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From WEmery7451 at aol.com Sat Nov 17 13:39:31 2007 From: WEmery7451 at aol.com (WEmery7451 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 15:39:31 EST Subject: [Fot] Harden Valve Seats Message-ID: Dear FOT, Whenever my machinist has set up a TR-3/4 engine head for me, he automatically puts in harden valve seats for both the intake and exhaust valves . I gave one of my engine heads to Dan Styduhar, who has been helping me with the TR-3. His machinist highly recommends not to put the harden valve seats in for the intake valve. A lot of material is ground out the cast iron head to install the valve seats, and there is not a lot of material between the intake and exhaust valves to begin with. My initial guesses would be: -There are two different materials involved -- cast iron and steel. Maybe the steel valve seats would not count as material being replaced, and that the cast iron could crack under the seats. -If there is not a great deal of exhaust gasses blowing past the closed intake valves, the intake valves would not need the harden seats -- keeping in mind that there is a tremendous pressure surge during the combustion stroke. Does anyone have any thought on this subject? ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From WEmery7451 at aol.com Sat Nov 17 14:03:57 2007 From: WEmery7451 at aol.com (WEmery7451 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 16:03:57 EST Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR Message-ID: Dear FOT, A battery went dead in one of our Mazdas. Down through the years when this would happen, I would pull out the battery, buy another one, and install it. This time, I was in a hurry and drove the car to an Advanced Auto Parts store so that they could change out the battery in the parking lot. I was told to plug a power source into the cigarette lighter socket before they would disconnect the battery. They said that if they do not do this, some Jap cars lock up and have to be towed to a dealer to be reset. Neither of our Mazdas have this feature, since I have had the batteries disconnected in both of them. Has anybody ever heard of this issue? If this is true, I believe that it is the dumbest thing that any manufacturer could design into a vehicle. Batteries can sometimes disconnect themselves -- corrosion or loose terminals. Someone could be driving in the middle of nowhere out west, get shut down, and have to be towed several hundred miles to a dealer. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From chris at tr4-racing.de Sat Nov 17 15:09:53 2007 From: chris at tr4-racing.de (Marx Christian tr4-racing) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 23:09:53 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Spa - 1966 Message-ID: <00f401c82966$95479ac0$6402a8c0@HOME> I hope you like this......big american movie: http://www.youtube.com/v/iw-MPf4GUU0&rel=1 Cheers Chris From Herald948 at aol.com Sat Nov 17 15:22:00 2007 From: Herald948 at aol.com (Herald948 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 17:22:00 EST Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR Message-ID: In a message dated 11/17/2007 4:04:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, WEmery7451 at aol.com writes: I was told to plug a power source into the cigarette lighter socket before they would disconnect the battery. They said that if they do not do this, some Jap cars lock up and have to be towed to a dealer to be reset. Neither of our Mazdas have this feature, since I have had the batteries disconnected in both of them. Has anybody ever heard of this issue? ==AM== I'm no expert on modern cars, but I've never heard of that, either. One good thing about the power source in the lighter socket is that it might help to preserve radio button presets; otherwise, diconnecting and reconnecting a battery might cause some computer chip in some cars to reboot or restart. After a minute or so, it should reprogram itself and all would be well again. At least that's what I'VE heard. ;-) --Andy Mace (the period Bendix AM/FM is the most sophisticated bit of electronics in the Herald!) *Mrs Irrelevant: Oh, is it a jet? *Man: Well, no ... It's not so much of a jet, it's more your, er, Triumph Herald engine with wings. -- Cut-price Airlines Sketch, Monty Python's Flying Circus (22) Check out the North American Triumph Sports 6 (Vitesse 6) and Triumph Herald Database: _http://triumph-herald.us_ (http://triumph-herald.us/) ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From BillB at bnj.com Sat Nov 17 15:51:23 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 14:51:23 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR References: Message-ID: The reason for connecting a power supply while disconnecting your battery is to maintain any presets that are not sophisticated enough to use non-volatile memory. The more well engineered a car is, the LESS likely this is to be a problem. But the presets are not critical, and they won't lock up your car. This is more a matter of morons behind the counter swapping urban legends than morons at the design table. That said, there are cars that really don't like having no battery power, and a lot of them have two batteries now. My wife's Bently has two, and so does my F350 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of WEmery7451 at aol.com Sent: Sat 11/17/2007 1:03 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR Dear FOT, A battery went dead in one of our Mazdas. Down through the years when this would happen, I would pull out the battery, buy another one, and install it. This time, I was in a hurry and drove the car to an Advanced Auto Parts store so that they could change out the battery in the parking lot. I was told to plug a power source into the cigarette lighter socket before they would disconnect the battery. They said that if they do not do this, some Jap cars lock up and have to be towed to a dealer to be reset. Neither of our Mazdas have this feature, since I have had the batteries disconnected in both of them. Has anybody ever heard of this issue? If this is true, I believe that it is the dumbest thing that any manufacturer could design into a vehicle. Batteries can sometimes disconnect themselves -- corrosion or loose terminals. Someone could be driving in the middle of nowhere out west, get shut down, and have to be towed several hundred miles to a dealer. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sat Nov 17 16:19:35 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (spitlist at cox.net) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 15:19:35 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20071117181935.B0EBX.67659.root@fed1wml06.mgt.cox.net> The really frustrating thing about removing a battery without maintaining power is on those anti-theft radio systems. They require you to remember the codes you put in and if you are like me, you seldom do! Joe C. ---- Herald948 at aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 11/17/2007 4:04:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > WEmery7451 at aol.com writes: > > I was told to plug a power source into the cigarette lighter socket before > they would disconnect the battery. They said that if they do not do this, > some > Jap cars lock up and have to be towed to a dealer to be reset. Neither of > our > Mazdas have this feature, since I have had the batteries disconnected in both > of them. > > Has anybody ever heard of this issue? > > > ==AM== > I'm no expert on modern cars, but I've never heard of that, either. One good > thing about the power source in the lighter socket is that it might help to > preserve radio button presets; otherwise, diconnecting and reconnecting a > battery might cause some computer chip in some cars to reboot or restart. After > a minute or so, it should reprogram itself and all would be well again. At > least that's what I'VE heard. ;-) > > --Andy Mace (the period Bendix AM/FM is the most sophisticated bit of > electronics in the Herald!) From koblinger at verizon.net Sat Nov 17 18:08:16 2007 From: koblinger at verizon.net (Kurt Oblinger) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 17:08:16 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Spa - 1966 In-Reply-To: <00f401c82966$95479ac0$6402a8c0@HOME> References: <00f401c82966$95479ac0$6402a8c0@HOME> Message-ID: <473F9080.4030203@verizon.net> Still takes my breath away. The camera car was a GT40 driven by Phil Hill. It amazes me to look at the track, no barriers, ditches, buildings, phone poles, stone mile markers, all right at the edge of the track. Brilliant and frightening at the same time. Cheers, Kurt O. Marx Christian tr4-racing wrote: >I hope you like this......big american movie: > >http://www.youtube.com/v/iw-MPf4GUU0&rel=1 > >Cheers >Chris >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vintage.racer at comcast.net Sat Nov 17 18:28:25 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 17:28:25 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Spa - 1966 In-Reply-To: <473F9080.4030203@verizon.net> References: <00f401c82966$95479ac0$6402a8c0@HOME> <473F9080.4030203@verizon.net> Message-ID: <000001c82982$50fe75c0$f2fb6140$@racer@comcast.net> Say it over and over until you believe it...I trust my mechanics, I trust my mechanics... Gary -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kurt Oblinger Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 5:08 PM To: Marx Christian tr4-racing Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Spa - 1966 Still takes my breath away. The camera car was a GT40 driven by Phil Hill. It amazes me to look at the track, no barriers, ditches, buildings, phone poles, stone mile markers, all right at the edge of the track. Brilliant and frightening at the same time. Cheers, Kurt O. Marx Christian tr4-racing wrote: >I hope you like this......big american movie: > >http://www.youtube.com/v/iw-MPf4GUU0&rel=1 > >Cheers >Chris >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Sat Nov 17 18:58:35 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 19:58:35 -0600 Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available Message-ID: <200711180156.lAI1upR9342147@ns3.geneseo.net> Some time ago I designed a crank scraper for the TR3 - 4 engine. I designed two, actually - one for the stock crank / stock rod engine, and one for the Moldex / Carillo engine. Several of us are using them. Since designing these things and programming for laser cutting is very time consuming, I have not made them for the Spitfire or TR6 engine. They are made from 1/8" steel and mount under the heads of three main cap bolts. They come with three hardened washers to go between the bolt heads and the scraper. You can see a picture on Tony's site -- www.Tonydrews.com -- link "Jack's Parts" There was not much interest at the time so I had a limited run made of each configuration. I still have a few of them left. I'll sell the ones I still have for $64.95 apiece plus shipping. uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From jaboruch at netzero.net Sat Nov 17 19:42:37 2007 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 02:42:37 GMT Subject: [Fot] Harden Valve Seats Message-ID: <20071117.214237.17726.1@webmail21.dca.untd.com> Bill, I have only been doing them on the exhaust, since that is for the most part where any valve recession should occur. I have noticed, however, that when I do not run air cleaners I have some intake valve recession. I think another challenge on the intake side to to get it to blend well enough not to interfere with intake flow. Joe(B) -- WEmery7451 at aol.com wrote: Dear FOT, Whenever my machinist has set up a TR-3/4 engine head for me, he automatically puts in harden valve seats for both the intake and exhaust valves . I gave one of my engine heads to Dan Styduhar, who has been helping me with the TR-3. His machinist highly recommends not to put the harden valve seats in for the intake valve. A lot of material is ground out the cast iron head to install the valve seats, and there is not a lot of material between the intake and exhaust valves to begin with. My initial guesses would be: -There are two different materials involved -- cast iron and steel. Maybe the steel valve seats would not count as material being replaced, and that the cast iron could crack under the seats. -If there is not a great deal of exhaust gasses blowing past the closed intake valves, the intake valves would not need the harden seats -- keeping in mind that there is a tremendous pressure surge during the combustion stroke. Does anyone have any thought on this subject? ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _____________________________________________________________ Click for free info on rehab treatments for drug & alcohol dependency. http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2211/fc/Ioyw6ijmXabC59PFdUwCqov8km3B4y M40dcPLX3YCSvcpyq7RYnpLq/ From BillDentin at aol.com Sun Nov 18 08:43:13 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 10:43:13 EST Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up Message-ID: In a message dated 11/16/2007 9:16:32 PM Central Standard Time, Guyots3 at wmconnect.com writes: > Whilst I have no disagreement with either of these fine fellows, if those > (U.S.born) on this list wish to pronounce it "win-dedge", or "wind-age", or > whathaveyou-dedge, then I have no problem with that, as long as they don't > make me, > (UK born), do the same: > > I will go merrily on my English way, pronouncing it "wine-didge" > > Leon... We could do that on this side of the pond too (out of respect for our British cars), but my guess is over here it would end up "whine-didge". We're good at that. Bill (Damdinger) PS...actually...in the Beady Eye tent it would end up "wine & cheese-dish" ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 09:53:30 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 11:53:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] CVAR Last race of the year....EAGLE'S CANYON Message-ID: <411F9C8F.64B98CCD.00159EE9@cs.com> Jack & I were there for a Classic Motorsports magazine test day. Contruction was going on and it was difficult to get a sense of the track. However, it is great to know that there is another choice. Joe A >I know many in the midwest have packed their cars away for the winter but if >you want to race one more time this year, CVAR is holding it's last 2007 >(actually first 20087 season) race in far north Texas. The track is new and we >will be holding the first ever sanctioned race an we would be remiss if we >didn't invite the FoT. There have been plenty of delays in opening this track >so we haven't talked it up very much but the reports coming back is that it >will become our favorite track. > >Eagles Canyon Raceway is the beautiful culmination of years worth of research, >planning, design, and meticulous construction in the rolling hills of North >Central Texas. > >Designed by Rob Wilson, one of the world's top racing instructors, Eagles >Canyon Raceway features 2.55 miles, 4 straights over 1,300 feet long, 15 >turns, and 70 feet of elevation change. > >Eagles Canyon is a true driver's track, and is planned to host all classes of >events from the top level racing series to club racing and private HPDE days. > >http://www.eaglescanyon.com/php/welcome.php > > November > > > Nov 30th-Dec 2nd > 1st Annual Eagles Canyon Extravaganza > > > > Eagles Canyon Raceway > > Slidell, Tx. (Just NW of D/FW) > > > > A brand new, top notch facility and track > > > >Bob Kramer >rkramer3 at austin.rr.com >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillDentin at aol.com Sun Nov 18 12:14:20 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 14:14:20 EST Subject: [Fot] Seeking Dennis Delap Message-ID: Dennis... I don't have a current email address for you. Please contact me. Bill Dentinger ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au Sun Nov 18 14:01:44 2007 From: jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au (Jim Cun) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 13:01:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi Guys, Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs steel for a TR race car? Regards Jim Make the switch to the world's best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html From tony at tonydrews.com Sun Nov 18 14:14:37 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 15:14:37 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel In-Reply-To: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20071118211526.F24CC187A46@autox.team.net> Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. - Tony At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >Hi Guys, > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >steel for a TR race car? > >Regards Jim > > > Make the switch to the world's >best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 14:57:34 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 16:57:34 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com> I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of jewelry that I hated to cover up. Joe >Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With >proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more >troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. > >- Tony > >At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>Hi Guys, >> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>steel for a TR race car? >> >>Regards Jim >> >> >> Make the switch to the world's >>best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>_______________________________________________ >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >>Fot mailing list >>Fot at autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au Sun Nov 18 15:13:11 2007 From: jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au (Jim Cun) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 14:13:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <885586.45039.qm@web51812.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Kas, We have a couple of guys "engine builders" here in OZ who say that using an alloy flywheel makes it difficult to get off the line. I would not even consider a steel flywheel unless it has the same shape and weight of alloy. That is not likely. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Cun" To: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:01 PM Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel > Hi Guys, > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs > steel for a TR race car? > > Regards Jim > > > Make the switch to the world's > best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. > http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Make the switch to the world's best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 15:24:12 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 17:24:12 EST Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: Jim, My steel flywheel is 10lbs, has no steel insert, and has always stayed on the crankshaft. The secret of the weight is in the machining. Joe A > I would not > even consider a steel flywheel unless it has the same shape and > weight of > alloy. That is not likely. > From chris at tr4-racing.de Sun Nov 18 16:15:50 2007 From: chris at tr4-racing.de (Marx Christian tr4-racing) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 00:15:50 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <001701c82a38$f997cef0$6402a8c0@HOME> My flywheel is 3,95 kg of weight without ringgear. So far a trouble free unit. Cheers Chris Hi Guys, Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs steel for a TR race car? Regards Jim Make the switch to the world's best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From chris at tr4-racing.de Sun Nov 18 17:04:22 2007 From: chris at tr4-racing.de (Marx Christian tr4-racing) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 01:04:22 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <002c01c82a3f$c91a9d50$6402a8c0@HOME> Sorry I've forgotten......it is a steel wheel. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Drews" To: "Marx Christian tr4-racing" Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 1:00 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > Is it steel or is it aluminum? > > - Tony > > At 05:15 PM 11/18/2007, you wrote: > >My flywheel is 3,95 kg of weight without ringgear. > >So far a trouble free unit. > > > >Cheers > >Chris > > > > > >Hi Guys, > > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs > > steel for a TR race car? > > > > > > Regards Jim > > > > > > > > Make the switch to the world's > > best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. > > http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From kaskas at cox.net Sun Nov 18 17:26:09 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 16:26:09 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com> Message-ID: <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> It is sometimes confusing when referring to other than alloy flywheels, some are steel and others are CAST IRON. With a steel wheel I can see getting the weight out of the outside diameter and the total down but I'd be very very careful doing this with cast iron. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" ; "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:57 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel >I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of jewelry that I >hated to cover up. > > Joe > > > >>Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With >>proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more >>troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. >> >>- Tony >> >>At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>>Hi Guys, >>> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>>steel for a TR race car? >>> >>>Regards Jim >>> >>> >>> Make the switch to the world's >>>best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>>http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>>_______________________________________________ >>>http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> >>>Fot mailing list >>>Fot at autox.team.net >>>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>_______________________________________________ >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >>Fot mailing list >>Fot at autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 17:32:30 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 19:32:30 EST Subject: [Fot] Liners to Be Bored Message-ID: FoT, A couple of us are going to be doing some liner boring in the first week of December. If anyone would like to join in, I can supply address to send them to. There is no financial benefit to me. It does benefit the guy who took the time to develop the fixture, for me, to hold the liners. They dont have to be there by the 1st of December, but that's when ours are going to be done. The set up is pretty easy, but volume is still more efficient. J & L Engines in Allison, Iowa Joe From VANDECARR at aol.com Sun Nov 18 17:56:51 2007 From: VANDECARR at aol.com (VANDECARR at aol.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 19:56:51 EST Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR Message-ID: My brother runs a repair shop and VWs (mainly the new Bugs) must have the CPU reprogrammed by the dealer if the battery goes dead or you disconnect it. German manufacturers, Mercedes, BMW and VW will not release a lot of technical data and say that these repairs must be done by an authorized dealer. Good reason to think twice before buying these cars. Dean VanDeCarr - lots of British but no German cars ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From fojag at hotmail.com Sun Nov 18 18:07:52 2007 From: fojag at hotmail.com (J A G) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 20:07:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs In-Reply-To: <001101c828bd$3474d0e0$43a6544c@Guinan> References: <001101c828bd$3474d0e0$43a6544c@Guinan> Message-ID: Jay,what specs are you considering. My dearched spring is too flat and I am looking for something with more arch and therefore less negative camber Joseph> From: joeg at neb.rr.com> To: fot at autox.team.net; jaxonracing at yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:57:26 -0600> Subject: Re: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs> > Jay - Talk to George at Flex-A-Form. http://flex-a-form.com He has made> several springs for Spitfires, and will make them to your specifications for> weight rating and height. Runs about $200? Weighs about 9 pounds or> something like that?> > > Joe Guinan> 751 Day Drive> Fremont, NE 68025> Home Phone - 402-727-8011> joeg at neb.rr.com> ------------------------------> > From: Jay Creel > Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs> To: fot at autox.team.net> > FOT,> > I am looking for a new "dearched" leaf spring for my HP Triumph Spitfire. I> had spoken with Rick Cline some time ago regarding a spring but there were> some challenges with the supplier at the time. Since then, I have continued> to use my "stock" dearched spring but I am looking to upgrade.> > Does anyone know of a source for a composite leaf spring for a racing> spitfire? Contact information and if they have specifications on file?? I> will also reach out to Rick C. to discuss the possibility of getting a> famous Rick Cline spring.> > thanks> > Jay R. Creel> _______________________________________________> http://www.team.net/donate.html> > Fot mailing list> Fot at autox.team.net> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _________________________________________________________________ Your smile counts. The more smiles you share, the more we donate. Join in. www.windowslive.com/smile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_oprsmilewlhmtagline From fpspitfire at insightbb.com Sun Nov 18 18:11:21 2007 From: fpspitfire at insightbb.com (fpspitfire at insightbb.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 20:11:21 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel In-Reply-To: <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> References: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com> <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> Message-ID: I prefer the steel flywheels over modified cast iron and aluminium flywheels. I use a steel flywheel and it weighs about 6 lbs. aaron ----- Original Message ----- From: Kas Kastner Date: Sunday, November 18, 2007 19:26 Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel To: N197TR4 at cs.com, Tony Drews , Jim Cun , Friends of Triumph > It is sometimes confusing when referring to other than alloy > flywheels, some > are steel and others are CAST IRON. With a steel wheel I can see > getting the > weight out of the outside diameter and the total down but I'd be > very very > careful doing this with cast iron. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" > ; > "Friends of Triumph" > Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:57 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > > > >I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of > jewelry that I > >hated to cover up. > > > > Joe > > > > > > > >>Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the > crankshaft. With > >>proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more > >>troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. > >> > >>- Tony > >> > >>At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: > >>>Hi Guys, > >>> > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs > >>>steel for a TR race car? > >>> > >>>Regards Jim From lunkercars at earthlink.net Sun Nov 18 18:34:23 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:34:23 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel In-Reply-To: <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> References: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com> <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> Message-ID: <524F2685-494C-4D27-9BED-3E64676792B0@earthlink.net> Please elaborate a bit Kas. I've never heard of a steel flywheel for a TR. I always assumed they were all cast iron as OEM. Were there some that were steel from the factory? Or were the steel ones something "trick" from days gone bye? As I recall, my stock flywheel was originally something around 33lbs. and after getting it down to around 22, I have to agree that I couldn't see where any additional weight could be safely taken off. FWIW - I did find the difference to be noticeable [for the better] minus that 11lbs. - been a bit leery of going alloy. Also, I've been considering either a TR6 flywheel [for the TR4] or re- drilling my TR4 flywheel for the sake of the [much lighter] TR6 diaphragm type pressure pressure plate. - Any thoughts? Thanks in advance, Greg Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 18, 2007, at 5:26 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > It is sometimes confusing when referring to other than alloy > flywheels, some > are steel and others are CAST IRON. With a steel wheel I can see > getting the > weight out of the outside diameter and the total down but I'd be > very very > careful doing this with cast iron. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" > ; > "Friends of Triumph" > Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:57 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > > >> I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of >> jewelry that I >> hated to cover up. >> >> Joe >> >> >> >>> Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. >>> With >>> proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more >>> troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. >>> >>> - Tony >>> >>> At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>>> Hi Guys, >>>> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>>> steel for a TR race car? >>>> >>>> Regards Jim >>>> >>>> >>>> Make the switch to the world's >>>> best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>>> http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>>> >>>> Fot mailing list >>>> Fot at autox.team.net >>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>> _______________________________________________ >>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> >>> Fot mailing list >>> Fot at autox.team.net >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dale.oesterle at sbcglobal.net Sun Nov 18 18:37:31 2007 From: dale.oesterle at sbcglobal.net (dale oesterle) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 17:37:31 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <497589.3348.qm@web82208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Can someone detail the rear spring strength for each side in a spitfire? Need stock, cline spring and/ or any other dearched racing spring? Dale J A G wrote: Jay,what specs are you considering. My dearched spring is too flat and I am looking for something with more arch and therefore less negative camber Joseph> From: joeg at neb.rr.com> To: fot at autox.team.net; jaxonracing at yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:57:26 -0600> Subject: Re: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs> > Jay - Talk to George at Flex-A-Form. http://flex-a-form.com He has made> several springs for Spitfires, and will make them to your specifications for> weight rating and height. Runs about $200? Weighs about 9 pounds or> something like that?> > > Joe Guinan> 751 Day Drive> Fremont, NE 68025> Home Phone - 402-727-8011> joeg at neb.rr.com> ------------------------------> > From: Jay Creel > Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs> To: fot at autox.team.net> > FOT,> > I am looking for a new "dearched" leaf spring for my HP Triumph Spitfire. I> had spoken with Rick Cline some time ago regarding a spring but there were> some challenges with the supplier at the time. Since then, I have continued> to use my "stock" dearched spring but I am looking to upgrade.> > Does anyone know of a source for a composite leaf spring for a racing> spitfire? Contact information and if they have specifications on file?? I> will also reach out to Rick C. to discuss the possibility of getting a> famous Rick Cline spring.> > thanks> > Jay R. Creel> _______________________________________________> http://www.team.net/donate.html> > Fot mailing list> Fot at autox.team.net> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _________________________________________________________________ Your smile counts. The more smiles you share, the more we donate. Join in. www.windowslive.com/smile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_oprsmilewlhmtagline Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sun Nov 18 19:34:55 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:34:55 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com><009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> <524F2685-494C-4D27-9BED-3E64676792B0@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <00ee01c82a54$c5fe5ca0$0502a8c0@desktop> Greg, check out this link below. It seems the consensus is steel vs. aluminum. This was my thought also and I now have 2 steel flywheels for the long ended crankshaft. I'm having one of them machined to accept the Tilton racing clutch Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 http://www.cambridgemotorsport.com/TR56-Steel-Flywheels ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" To: "Kas Kastner" Cc: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 5:34 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > Please elaborate a bit Kas. I've never heard of a steel flywheel for > a TR. I always assumed they were all cast iron as OEM. Were there > some that were steel from the factory? Or were the steel ones > something "trick" from days gone bye? As I recall, my stock flywheel > was originally something around 33lbs. and after getting it down to > around 22, I have to agree that I couldn't see where any additional > weight could be safely taken off. > FWIW - I did find the difference to be noticeable [for the better] > minus that 11lbs. - been a bit leery of going alloy. > Also, I've been considering either a TR6 flywheel [for the TR4] or re- > drilling my TR4 flywheel for the sake of the [much lighter] TR6 > diaphragm type pressure pressure plate. - Any thoughts? > Thanks in advance, > Greg Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > > > On Nov 18, 2007, at 5:26 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > >> It is sometimes confusing when referring to other than alloy >> flywheels, some >> are steel and others are CAST IRON. With a steel wheel I can see >> getting the >> weight out of the outside diameter and the total down but I'd be >> very very >> careful doing this with cast iron. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: >> To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" >> ; >> "Friends of Triumph" >> Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:57 PM >> Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel >> >> >>> I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of >>> jewelry that I >>> hated to cover up. >>> >>> Joe >>> >>> >>> >>>> Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. >>>> With >>>> proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more >>>> troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. >>>> >>>> - Tony >>>> >>>> At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>>>> Hi Guys, >>>>> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>>>> steel for a TR race car? >>>>> >>>>> Regards Jim >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Make the switch to the world's >>>>> best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>>>> http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>>>> >>>>> Fot mailing list >>>>> Fot at autox.team.net >>>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>>> >>>> Fot mailing list >>>> Fot at autox.team.net >>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>> _______________________________________________ >>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> >>> Fot mailing list >>> Fot at autox.team.net >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sun Nov 18 19:54:36 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:54:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available References: <200711180156.lAI1upR9342147@ns3.geneseo.net> Message-ID: <010f01c82a57$8590a670$0502a8c0@desktop> Hey Jack are you think of making scrapers for the TR6 motor? I know of at least 2 sales immediately, maybe 3. Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack W. Drews" To: Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 5:58 PM Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available > Some time ago I designed a crank scraper for the TR3 - 4 engine. I > designed two, actually - one for the stock crank / stock rod engine, > and one for the Moldex / Carillo engine. Several of us are using > them. Since designing these things and programming for laser cutting > is very time consuming, I have not made them for the Spitfire or TR6 > engine. > > They are made from 1/8" steel and mount under the heads of three main > cap bolts. They come with three hardened washers to go between the > bolt heads and the scraper. > > You can see a picture on Tony's site -- www.Tonydrews.com -- link > "Jack's Parts" > > There was not much interest at the time so I had a limited run made > of each configuration. I still have a few of them left. > I'll sell the ones I still have for $64.95 apiece plus shipping. > > uncle jack > > > > ------------------------------------------------ > No Virus Found In This Message > Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 20:29:42 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 22:29:42 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <6322EF05.3501AD0B.00159EE9@cs.com> "Charly Mitchel" wrote: >Greg, check out this link below. It seems the consensus is steel vs. >aluminum. This was my thought also and I now have 2 steel flywheels for the >long ended crankshaft. >I'm having one of them machined to accept the Tilton racing clutch >Charly Mitchel >TR6 #44 > STEEL! YES! These have and can be made in the u.s. If there is an order interest of 10 we could revisit the quote & leadtime. I want another one myself. Joe A From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sun Nov 18 21:07:33 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 20:07:33 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Triumph motors Message-ID: <014901c82a61$b67e1650$0502a8c0@desktop> I have a few (4) Spitfire motors I need to get moved if anybody is interested, contact me. Pictures and details are below Thanks, Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/pts/483099149.html From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Sun Nov 18 21:31:46 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 22:31:46 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <6322EF05.3501AD0B.00159EE9@cs.com> Message-ID: <003001c82a65$1982b8c0$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> BPNW stocks a TR4 and TR6 lightweight steel flywheel. They have conflicting info, the blurb says 9.5 lbs. but the link on the order page says 11 lbs. Either way, it's steel and of the same design as the Cambridge version. I have one in my car. I've had the engine out twice and so far so good. Alloy Light Flywheel TR3-4A Product Detail This is a Alloy 9.25 lbs flywheel for a TR3-4A. Unleash the revving potential of your car but this won't be too light for the street. It takes the bolt on ring gear and is drilled for the lighter TR4A Pressure plate. Ring gear is not included. $414.75 Flywheel Alloy TR6 70-76 Product Detail This is a Alloy 9.5 lbs flywheel for a TR6 70-76. Unleash the revving potential of your TR6, being 9.5 pounds the car will rev easily but won't be too light for the street. Ring gear is sold separately. FIA approved. $432.87 Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ""Charly Mitchel"" ; ""Greg "Lunker" Hilyer"" ; ""Kas Kastner"" Cc: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 9:29 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > "Charly Mitchel" wrote: > >>Greg, check out this link below. It seems the consensus is steel vs. >>aluminum. This was my thought also and I now have 2 steel flywheels for >>the >>long ended crankshaft. >>I'm having one of them machined to accept the Tilton racing clutch >>Charly Mitchel >>TR6 #44 >> > STEEL! YES! > > These have and can be made in the u.s. If there is an order interest of > 10 we could revisit the quote & leadtime. I want another one myself. > > Joe A > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From awashatko at wi.rr.com Mon Nov 19 05:33:00 2007 From: awashatko at wi.rr.com (Allen Washatko) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 06:33:00 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line Message-ID: FoT, I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? Allen A l l e n W a s h a t k o 1971 TR6 - Number 6 From tony at tonydrews.com Mon Nov 19 06:18:45 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 07:18:45 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20071119131930.237B3187A78@autox.team.net> I imagine fewer bad things occurring when it's run parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger compartment. It's further from the drivetrain, and further from the exhaust pipe / header. My driveshaft tunnel gets pretty hot during a race. - Tony At 06:33 AM 11/19/2007, Allen Washatko wrote: >FoT, > >I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking >for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines >placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger >compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use >a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? > >Allen > >A l l e n W a s h a t k o >1971 TR6 - Number 6 From wgrosenbach at juno.com Mon Nov 19 07:14:42 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 07:14:42 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate Message-ID: <20071119.071443.2424.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Ok, I will never again laugh at the SCCA for their ridiculous protests; THE FIA can't even figure out how to read a thermometer. The full FIA statement: "The FIA International Court of Appeal met in London on Thursday, November 15, 2007, to examine an appeal lodged by the Motor Sports Association (MSA) on behalf of its licence-holder Vodafone McLaren Mercedes against the decision (document 41) of the Panel of the Stewards of the 2007 Brazilian Grand Prix dated 21 October 2007 and counting towards the 2007 FIA Formula One World Championship. "Following a report from the Technical Delegate indicating that the temperature of fuel pumped into the cars N09 - Nick Heidfeld, N010 - Robert Kubica, N016 - Nico Rosberg and N017 - Kazuki Nakajima, was more than 10 degrees centigrade below ambient temperature, the Stewards of the Meeting met to consider whether a penalty should be imposed. Having heard the evidence they decided not to impose a penalty as they had sufficient doubt as to both the temperature of the fuel on board the car and to the true ambient temperature. "Having heard the explanations of both parties and having examined the various documents and other evidence, the Court decided that the appeal lodged by Vodafone McLaren Mercedes is inadmissible. "The International Court of Appeal was presided over by Mr Jan STOVICEK (Czech Republic), elected President, and composed of Mr John CASSIDY (United States), Mr Vassilis KOUSSIS (Greece) and Mr Jos? MACEDO e CUNHA (Portugal). "The full text of the International Court of Appeal's decision is available, on request, from the secretariat of the FIA International Court of Appeal in Paris." This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, any disclosure, copying, further distribution or use thereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and delete/destroy it. From henry at henryfrye.com Mon Nov 19 08:12:49 2007 From: henry at henryfrye.com (Henry Frye) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 10:12:49 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBBA@server.Triumph.local> I plumbed stainless steel hard line from the fuel pump (located in the bottom of the spare tire well next to the cell) up over the rear bulkhead into the passenger compartment tight against the passenger side rear inner wheel well. Then followed the inner sill up to the passenger footwell. Under the scuttle I have a gentle 90 degree bend upward. The line then goes through the horizontal shelf above the firewall to the regulator, then the fuel distribution block. Flex lines to the carbs. I didn't like the idea of naked fuel line in the passenger compartment so I slipped the hard line into tight fitting rubber fuel hose so there is a VERY thick insulation covering the hard fuel line. This rubber sheath runs from the 90 degree bend under the scuttle back beyond the steel panel that encloses the boot/fuel cell area. BTW, I used stainless because I had it laying about from another project. I am not sure I would buy stainless for this purpose, but it works for me. > -----Original Message----- > From: Allen Washatko > Subject: [Fot] Gas Line > > Any thoughts as to the safest installation? From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 08:27:08 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 10:27:08 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line Message-ID: I ran my line as far from heat sources as possible. I did not run the line inside the cockpit. In my TR6, I ran the line along the left-hand chassis rail, because I did not want the line anywhere near the header. I use a single exhaust pipe along the middle of the chassis. I run the line up the firewall, along the firewall from the left side to the right (where the battery used to live) to the fuel rail, and then to individual lines to the Webers. I found that the commonly accepted method of feeding Webers with a common fuel line led to reduced pressure at the front carb. I ran the line at the back of the engine rather that around the front, because the latter requires a longer line which increases heat soak. Besides, a line around the front is more exposed to damage in case of a shunt. Shane Ingate in NM Alan Washatco asked: > I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking > for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines > placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger > compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use > a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? _________________________________________________________________ You keep typing, we keep giving. Download Messenger and join the im Initiative now. http://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=TAGLM From triosan at gmail.com Mon Nov 19 09:00:47 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 08:00:47 -0800 Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available In-Reply-To: <010f01c82a57$8590a670$0502a8c0@desktop> References: <200711180156.lAI1upR9342147@ns3.geneseo.net> <010f01c82a57$8590a670$0502a8c0@desktop> Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711190800k1a2b6410o3707f9a26f982edf@mail.gmail.com> If jack does not make them, please see Allen Johnson at crank scrapers, inc. He made me a scraper and baffled windage tray in exchange for the oil pan, oil pump and rod I gave him. You can see the results in Kas last book and at: http://www.crank-scrapers.com/Triumph.html As you can see from the site, crank scrapers are $75. Chuck On Nov 18, 2007 6:54 PM, Charly Mitchel wrote: > Hey Jack are you think of making scrapers for the TR6 motor? I know of at > least 2 sales immediately, maybe 3. > Charly Mitchel > TR6 #44 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jack W. Drews" > To: > Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 5:58 PM > Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available > > > > Some time ago I designed a crank scraper for the TR3 - 4 engine. I > > designed two, actually - one for the stock crank / stock rod engine, > > and one for the Moldex / Carillo engine. Several of us are using > > them. Since designing these things and programming for laser cutting > > is very time consuming, I have not made them for the Spitfire or TR6 > > engine. > > > > They are made from 1/8" steel and mount under the heads of three main > > cap bolts. They come with three hardened washers to go between the > > bolt heads and the scraper. > > > > You can see a picture on Tony's site -- www.Tonydrews.com -- link > > "Jack's Parts" > > > > There was not much interest at the time so I had a limited run made > > of each configuration. I still have a few of them left. > > I'll sell the ones I still have for $64.95 apiece plus shipping. > > > > uncle jack > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------ > > No Virus Found In This Message > > Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > -- Chuck Arnold From Fubog1 at aol.com Mon Nov 19 09:00:57 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 11:00:57 EST Subject: [Fot] Gas Line Message-ID: I normally use hard line & aeroquip also but from a safety standpoint I'll also offer something else to consider when it comes to fuel system plumbing, especially the engine bay. Anybody that has had a screwdriver or wrench try to arc weld itself to an Aeroquip hose will understand why I normally DON'T use Aeroquip anywhere in a fuel system when there's a chance that it could get tangled up with electrics in any way, be it the slip of a wrench into a hot lug, stray wiring or uninsulated terminal, or a crash. Although lacking in the "cool" factor, marine-grade fabric reinforced hose is great stuff. Glen BTDT 1 time, nasty sparks & a (pinhole) fuel leak, fortunately no fire, lesson learned... I plan to use a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From sbarr at McCarty-Law.com Mon Nov 19 09:44:43 2007 From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com (Barr, Scott) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 10:44:43 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Christmas shopping Message-ID: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74860F29@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Anybody know if La Carrera Panamericana (Pink Floyd, et. al.) has ever been released on DVD? My in-laws are looking for gift ideas for me and I'd suggest that one, since I've got it on VHS, but no longer have a VCR... Scott From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 19 09:49:57 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 11:49:57 EST Subject: [Fot] OEM Flywheel on eBay and Clutch Assembly Rebuild Message-ID: TR4A Flywheel Lightened for Improved Performance Item number: 170170835593 If any one is interested....low starting bid on flywheel. BTW, if you use the finger style clutch cover, and want it rebuilt. It can be done with new springs, fingers, and resurfacing. I have enough fingers available for three clutch covers. Then finger supply is an issue. They can be welded with hard materials, but that's labor intensive. Clutch Disc Rebuild: The material for the clutch disc is a woven material and superior to OEM and current replacement. There is a limited amount of this clutch material left. Maybe three discs. Rebuilding is well below current direct replacement costs. Joe A From greenman62 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 11:39:10 2007 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (greenman62 at hotmail.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 18:39:10 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Christmas shopping In-Reply-To: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74860F29@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> References: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74860F29@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Message-ID: Try this... http://www.amazon.com/Carrera-Panamericana-Music-Pink-Floyd/dp/B00004RP24 Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 10:44:43 -0600 > From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: [Fot] Christmas shopping > > Anybody know if La Carrera Panamericana (Pink Floyd, et. al.) has ever > been released on DVD? > > My in-laws are looking for gift ideas for me and I'd suggest that one, > since I've got it on VHS, but no longer have a VCR... > > Scott > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillDentin at aol.com Mon Nov 19 12:13:10 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:13:10 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: Amici... I recently obtained a subscription to the magazine TRIUMPH WORLD. While I was aware of this magazine (friends had sent me copies of articles from time to time), I had never seen a copy. I was very impressed. It is glossy, high quality, and covers all things TRIUMPH. The scope of the articles is wide, including competition, history, restoration, social and so on. I've read both issues I've received so far from cover to cover. I sure would recommend it to those of you who would enjoy such a TRIUMPH specific publication. If you are not aware of TRIUMPH WORLD, it is available by subscription, as well as at some newsstand outlets. If you have trouble locating a copy, you might contact their subscription office (tw.mag at kelsey.co.uk). They might be able to help you find a source near you. Bill Dentinger ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From lang at isis.mit.edu Mon Nov 19 12:19:49 2007 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert Lang) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:19:49 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, The US subscriptions are handled through EWA Cars, ewacars.com 2nd class mailing in the US is currently $99 /year. NFI, of course. rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Room N42-140Q | This space for rent Consultant MIT IS&T unix-linux-help | Voice:617-253-7438 FAX: 617-258-9535 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 19 12:30:18 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:30:18 EST Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Confirmation Number 86651177 Message-ID: FoT: Watkins Glen Attendees....please read the following and make your reservations. If anyone needs any help with theirs, please let me know. Regards, Joe Alexander > Dear Mr. Alexander > > This email is to confirm your group reservations for 9/3/08 b 9/8/07. I > have 15 rooms reserved under the name of bFriends of Triumphb at a group of > $114.00 plus tax. Your confirmation # is 86651177. > > Andrea Stowe, CHA > General Manager > Hampton Inn > 9775 Victory Highway > Painted Post, NY 14870 > 607-936-3344 > 607-936-3393 (fax) > Return-Path: Received: from rly-mg10.mx.aol.com (rly-mg10.mail.aol.com [172.20.83.116]) by air-mg02.mail.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILINMG021-a3e4741e0ef2bf; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:16:49 -0400 Received: from ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com (ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com [24.24.2.57]) by rly-mg10.mx.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINMG108-a3e4741e0ef2bf; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:15:59 -0400 Received: from FranzeseLaptop (rrcs-24-39-168-3.nys.biz.rr.com [24.39.168.3]) by ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id lAJJFrGJ010762 for ; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:15:57 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200711191915.lAJJFrGJ010762 at ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com> From: "Andrea Stowe" To: Subject: Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:10:35 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 thread-index: Acgq39z+QSwvgZNhR9ygssZc0YssUQ== X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-AOL-IP: 24.24.2.57 X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_helo : n X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_822_from : n X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Dear Mr. Alexander This email is to confirm your group reservations for 9/3/08 - 9/8/07. I have 15 rooms reserved under the name of "Friends of Triumph" at a group of $114.00 plus tax. Your confirmation # is 86651177. I also have a room reserved for Mr. Kastner. His confirmation # is 87433161. If you have any questions or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact me. Andrea Stowe, CHA General Manager Hampton Inn 9775 Victory Highway Painted Post, NY 14870 607-936-3344 607-936-3393 (fax) From BillDentin at aol.com Mon Nov 19 12:39:47 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:39:47 EST Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Confirmation Number 86651177 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/19/2007 1:30:43 PM Central Standard Time, N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > Watkins Glen Attendees....please read the following and make your > reservations. If anyone needs any help with theirs, please let me know. > Amici... Painted Post, Horseheads, Big Flats, and of course the Town of Dix. I love the names of the little towns in the Watkins Glen area. Steeped in early history back to the revolutionary war. Little known fact...the Town of Dix is where the phrase, "You've got to be shitting me!" originated. Bill (Damdinger0 ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 19 12:51:41 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:51:41 -0500 Subject: [Fot] =?iso-8859-1?q?Hampton_Inn_-_Painted_Post=2C_NY_Confirmatio?= =?iso-8859-1?q?n_Number_=A0_86651177?= Message-ID: <49B17352.16FFA30B.00159EE9@cs.com> ....and if you use GOOGLE EARTH you can get a great view of actual 'GLEN' and the TRACK...... >In a message dated 11/19/2007 1:30:43 PM Central Standard Time, >N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > > >> Watkins Glen Attendees....please read the following and make your >> reservations. If anyone needs any help with theirs, please let me know. >> > >Amici... > >Painted Post, Horseheads, Big Flats, and of course the Town of Dix. I love >the names of the little towns in the Watkins Glen area. Steeped in early >history back to the revolutionary war. Little known fact...the Town of Dix is >where the phrase, "You've got to be shitting me!" originated. > >Bill (Damdinger0 > > >************************************** > See what's new at >http://www.aol.com From jerrybarr at charter.net Mon Nov 19 13:20:38 2007 From: jerrybarr at charter.net (Jerry Barr) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:20:38 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Pistons Message-ID: Hello Listers, I have listed a set of AE Hepolite Triumph Spitfire 1147cc piston set in +040 size on ebay Item Number 260184506739 These are new old stock with pins and ring sets Thanks, Jerry Barr From BillB at bnj.com Mon Nov 19 13:40:47 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 12:40:47 -0800 Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate References: <20071119.071443.2424.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: Actually it makes more sense than it sounds. The rulebook states that the fuel IN THE CAR can't be more than 10 degrees colder than ambient, but the only way the FIA has to measure temperature is the fuel in the filler. This fuel undoubtably is warmed somewhat when it's pumped and mixes with the warmer fuel in the car. Secondly, the rulebook does not say which ambient temperature measurement is official. It is assumed that the temperature provided by the FIA in their network would be official ambient, but the contract meteorologists that most teams use were reporting an ambient temperature a few degrees colder than the FIA temperature. The rulebook is not specific on this issue. What we're seeing here is the difficulty of writing rules that are not subject to interpretation, and the reason why rulebooks get so big and so arcane. Since the World Championship was at stake, I think the FIA and the court did a good job in not deciding the results in the courtroom but rather on the track. I would have been extremely unhappy to see the Iceman stripped of his title by a ruling on an inconsequential error by teams not in competition for the title. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of William G Rosenbach Sent: Mon 11/19/2007 6:14 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate Ok, I will never again laugh at the SCCA for their ridiculous protests; THE FIA can't even figure out how to read a thermometer. The full FIA statement: "The FIA International Court of Appeal met in London on Thursday, November 15, 2007, to examine an appeal lodged by the Motor Sports Association (MSA) on behalf of its licence-holder Vodafone McLaren Mercedes against the decision (document 41) of the Panel of the Stewards of the 2007 Brazilian Grand Prix dated 21 October 2007 and counting towards the 2007 FIA Formula One World Championship. "Following a report from the Technical Delegate indicating that the temperature of fuel pumped into the cars N09 - Nick Heidfeld, N010 - Robert Kubica, N016 - Nico Rosberg and N017 - Kazuki Nakajima, was more than 10 degrees centigrade below ambient temperature, the Stewards of the Meeting met to consider whether a penalty should be imposed. Having heard the evidence they decided not to impose a penalty as they had sufficient doubt as to both the temperature of the fuel on board the car and to the true ambient temperature. "Having heard the explanations of both parties and having examined the various documents and other evidence, the Court decided that the appeal lodged by Vodafone McLaren Mercedes is inadmissible. "The International Court of Appeal was presided over by Mr Jan STOVICEK (Czech Republic), elected President, and composed of Mr John CASSIDY (United States), Mr Vassilis KOUSSIS (Greece) and Mr Jos? MACEDO e CUNHA (Portugal). "The full text of the International Court of Appeal's decision is available, on request, from the secretariat of the FIA International Court of Appeal in Paris." This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, any disclosure, copying, further distribution or use thereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and delete/destroy it. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Mon Nov 19 13:44:54 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 12:44:54 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <20071118211526.F24CC187A46@autox.team.net> Message-ID: I'm not a fan of alloy flywheels, I've had two come adrift despite a lot of modification and prep. The steel flywheels are almost as light and seem bulletproof. The cast ones can't be lightened enough to be worthwhile. Fine for the street. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Tony Drews Sent: Sun 11/18/2007 1:14 PM To: Jim Cun; Friends of Triumph Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. - Tony At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >Hi Guys, > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >steel for a TR race car? > >Regards Jim > > > Make the switch to the world's >best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillDentin at aol.com Mon Nov 19 13:52:34 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 15:52:34 EST Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate Message-ID: In a message dated 11/19/2007 2:43:52 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > What we're seeing here is the difficulty of writing rules that are not > subject > to interpretation, and the reason why rulebooks get so big and so arcane. Seems like I recall Kas telling us that the fact that such rules are subject to interpretation became the basis for his entire career. Bill (Damdinger) ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From TomD4760 at aol.com Mon Nov 19 13:54:51 2007 From: TomD4760 at aol.com (TomD4760 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 15:54:51 EST Subject: [Fot] AH Bugeye Race Car for sale Message-ID: I am selling my 1959 Bugeye Race Car. Please email for spec sheet and pictures. TomD4760 at aol.com Thank you. Tom Deats

**************************************
See what's new at http://www.aol.com From spreiss at verizon.net Sun Nov 18 22:22:53 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:22:53 +1100 Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control Message-ID: <010801c82a6c$3c7a1f10$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> FOT I am thinking of making an objective of reducing the air temperature in the engine compartment of my TR3, and to direct as cool air as possible to the carburetor intakes. I know there are shrouds available to channel maximum outside air through the radiator, but that seems to address only part of the problem. Where does all that heat from the head and exhaust manifold go? Surely not out those two little slits. Louvered bonnets are an attempt to address this no doubt, but it seems they are expensive and not universally done. I know from seat of the pants that as operating temperature rises, performance dwindles. How do others deal with it? Steve Preiss From kaskas at cox.net Mon Nov 19 14:39:03 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 13:39:03 -0800 Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control References: <010801c82a6c$3c7a1f10$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <008401c82af4$9aed7820$3f0ec548@RW> There are some pretty cute ways of doing this. Most obvious is the blocking up of the hood hinges so that the back lip of the hood has a gap to provide an exit for hot air. That also vents to a low pressure area when you have a full screen. You might want to find out if you have a pressure differential under the hood compared to ambient before starting an exercise. Some folks have a vent in the front fender, looks nice and is effective but pretty small and you are depending on the lower pressure at the side of the car ( not always true) You can vent into wheel well with just expanded metal screen in the inner fender panel. Works pretty well, but use a water monometer to check the pressure difference before you cut metal. Probably not legal in most Vintage outfits, but then we are talking about theories anyway. :-) This is without touching on another obvious mod of heat shields for the inlet and exhaust systems. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Preiss" To: Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 9:22 PM Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control > FOT > I am thinking of making an objective of reducing the air temperature in > the > engine compartment of my TR3, and to direct as cool air as possible to the > carburetor intakes. I know there are shrouds available to channel maximum > outside air through the radiator, but that seems to address only part of > the > problem. Where does all that heat from the head and exhaust manifold go? > Surely not out those two little slits. Louvered bonnets are an attempt to > address this no doubt, but it seems they are expensive and not universally > done. I know from seat of the pants that as operating temperature rises, > performance dwindles. How do others deal with it? > Steve Preiss > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rocky at spitfire4.com Mon Nov 19 15:03:38 2007 From: rocky at spitfire4.com (Rocky Entriken) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:03:38 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line References: Message-ID: <002801c82af8$0b748220$6701a8c0@S1099895562> When I rerouted the fuel run in my Spitfire last year. I did it with all braided lines and inside the passenger compartment along the doorsill on the passenger side. Which almost made it a straightline run to the carbs by way of the fuel regulator which is mounted on the little shelf on the right side under the hood. The line is protected not only by the stronger bodywork along the doorsill but also by brace bars of the rollcage immediately above it. I also took the occasion to install a fuel pressure gauge (it's the gauge farthest from me on the dash, which also makes it the closest to the fuel line & carbs). --Rocky Entriken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Allen Washatko" To: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 6:33 AM Subject: [Fot] Gas Line > FoT, > > I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking > for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines > placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger > compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use > a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? > > Allen > > A l l e n W a s h a t k o > 1971 TR6 - Number 6 > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 15:07:09 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 17:07:09 -0500 Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control Message-ID: Kas wrote: > Most obvious is the blocking > up of the hood hinges so that the back lip of the hood has a gap to provide > an exit for hot air. That also vents to a low pressure area when you have a > full screen. I did this with my Pantera, using rubber draw-latchs that accommodate a lot of alignment error, and raising the hood 3/4". I achieved more than 20C temperature differential using this technique. The latches are pretty inexpensive, like this from Pegasus: http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productdetails.asp?RecId=772 Yes, I know, the Pantera motor is in the back, but the radiator is in the front with very little area to vent the hot air. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Put your friends on the big screen with Windows Vista. + Windows Live. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/shop/specialoffers.mspx?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_CPC_M ediaCtr_bigscreen_102007 From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 15:09:20 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 17:09:20 -0500 Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control II Message-ID: I forgot to add: Redline Water Wetter works great! But y'all are probably using this anyway. S. _________________________________________________________________ Put your friends on the big screen with Windows Vista. + Windows Live. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/shop/specialoffers.mspx?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_CPC_M ediaCtr_bigscreen_102007 From kaskas at cox.net Mon Nov 19 15:37:01 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:37:01 -0800 Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate References: Message-ID: <00af01c82afc$b3addbe0$3f0ec548@RW> Yes, Bill. Regulations with lots of words are the meat for a "thinking man". ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 12:52 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate > In a message dated 11/19/2007 2:43:52 PM Central Standard Time, > BillB at bnj.com > writes: > > >> What we're seeing here is the difficulty of writing rules that are not >> subject >> to interpretation, and the reason why rulebooks get so big and so arcane. > > Seems like I recall Kas telling us that the fact that such rules are > subject > to interpretation became the basis for his entire career. > > Bill (Damdinger) > > > > ************************************** > See what's new at http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Mon Nov 19 15:45:59 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:45:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com><20071118211526.F24CC187A46@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <003401c82afd$f4f99930$6401a8c0@TER2> We have been using aluminum alloy flywheels on the TR-4 engines for over 25 years. Then engines we have put them on have ranged from 115 hp to 190 hp. We have had one (1) problem in that time. I t was caused by the engine being consistantly overreved at the Pittsburg Vintage GP. The reves used to cause the flywheel to shear its bolts were over 7600 rpm. Using properly designed flywheels and good ARP flywheel retaining bolts of 3/8" diameter, that was to only problem we have had. By the way, the high rpm stess also caused the front generator bracket to break the same weekend the flywheel bolts failed. On a few of our high horsepower engines, we have used 4 or 6 7/16" fasteners instead of the standard size 3/8" pieces. Most of the engines have used 4 3/8" retaining bolts with #8 flat washers, torqued to 60 psi with loctite "nut lock" on the THREADS ONLY. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" ; "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 12:44 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > I'm not a fan of alloy flywheels, I've had two come adrift despite a lot > of > modification and prep. The steel flywheels are almost as light and seem > bulletproof. The cast ones can't be lightened enough to be worthwhile. > Fine > for the street. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Tony Drews > Sent: Sun 11/18/2007 1:14 PM > To: Jim Cun; Friends of Triumph > Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > > Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With > proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more > troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. > > - Tony > > At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>Hi Guys, >> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>steel for a TR race car? >> >>Regards Jim >> >> >> Make the switch to the world's >>best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>_______________________________________________ >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >>Fot mailing list >>Fot at autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Mon Nov 19 15:47:32 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:47:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com><20071118211526.F24CC187A46@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <003801c82afe$2c494c00$6401a8c0@TER2> Sorry, I understand that the 6 cylinder engine is a "different kettle of fish" and is much harder to keep the flywheel on at high rpm. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" ; "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 12:44 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > I'm not a fan of alloy flywheels, I've had two come adrift despite a lot > of > modification and prep. The steel flywheels are almost as light and seem > bulletproof. The cast ones can't be lightened enough to be worthwhile. > Fine > for the street. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Tony Drews > Sent: Sun 11/18/2007 1:14 PM > To: Jim Cun; Friends of Triumph > Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > > Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With > proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more > troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. > > - Tony > > At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>Hi Guys, >> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>steel for a TR race car? >> >>Regards Jim >> >> >> Make the switch to the world's >>best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>_______________________________________________ >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >>Fot mailing list >>Fot at autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Mon Nov 19 15:54:57 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:54:57 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <8C9F6AA585D7B7C-1268-1BE9@webmail-stg-d10.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <004001c82aff$356333e0$6401a8c0@TER2> We have had some piston scuffing problems in TR-4 engines with "billet" rods that do not squuirt oil onto the cylinders. These problems have only happened whrn the engines were being run at very low rpm, ie, under 2,000 rpm. It turned out that not enough oil was being thrown up on the cylinder walls. These scuffing incidents occured when idling around the pits, driving the car on the street and idling around a parking lot, and when starting the car and idling in a garage. It happened 3 separate times in the same engine. Drilling the rods to that oil was squirted onto the thrust side of the cylinder wall once each revolution of the engine cured the problem! There is not a cam lube problem. Anything regarding the cam is probably a separate issue. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Friday, November 16, 2007 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > So, you guys are saying that there is no downside to using a crank scraper > in a wet-liner motor? That even with connecting rods that don't have the > little oil hole like the stock rods do, enough oil gets?to the cylinder > walls?? And that enough oil gets everywhere it needs to get, all the time? > > Rich Rock > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - > http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Mon Nov 19 15:53:02 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (spitlist at cox.net) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:53:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate In-Reply-To: <20071119.071443.2424.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: <20071119175302.F6XMD.13952.root@fed1wml08.mgt.cox.net> I don't think that the FIA's decision to dismiss the protest was based on the readings of the thermometer, as much as it had to do with the relivance of the readings. Since there is no way to ppropriately measure the temperature of the fuel once it is on board, the readings that they took cannot be accurately applied to the temps of the on-board fuel. And since the regulation specifies the temp of the fuel in the car, the mearurements of the fuel in the rig is meaningless. It is very easy to conclude that the fuel temp will rise dramatically when it is introduced to the very hot car during a race. Joe C. ---- William G Rosenbach wrote: > Ok, I will never again laugh at the SCCA for their ridiculous protests; > THE FIA can't even figure out how to read a thermometer. From gaf3 at charter.net Mon Nov 19 16:46:22 2007 From: gaf3 at charter.net (Glenn Franco) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 18:46:22 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line In-Reply-To: <002801c82af8$0b748220$6701a8c0@S1099895562> References: <002801c82af8$0b748220$6701a8c0@S1099895562> Message-ID: <4742204E.2060404@charter.net> FOT Reading the discussion thread has me wondering what the proper routing path should be in my Spitfire. I have yet to run my fuel line from my fuel cell up to the engine compartment of my Spit. The routing dilemma has had me wondering why anyone would want to run a fuel line anywhere in the passenger compartment. I also have a full cage and could run it inside on the right with full protection afforded by the cage. The possibility of fire, for whatever reason, would have me run it on the outside of the frame rail below the vehicle away from the exhaust. I guess all the years spent in chassis engineering (big three product liability) has me wondering. What advantage is there to running the fuel line in the vehicle? Glenn Franco 72 Spitfire racer under construction Rocky Entriken wrote: > When I rerouted the fuel run in my Spitfire last year. I did it with all > braided lines and inside the passenger compartment along the doorsill on the > passenger side. Which almost made it a straightline run to the carbs by way > of the fuel regulator which is mounted on the little shelf on the right side > under the hood. The line is protected not only by the stronger bodywork > along the doorsill but also by brace bars of the rollcage immediately above > it. I also took the occasion to install a fuel pressure gauge (it's the > gauge farthest from me on the dash, which also makes it the closest to the > fuel line & carbs). > > --Rocky Entriken > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Allen Washatko" > To: "Friends of Triumph" > Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 6:33 AM > Subject: [Fot] Gas Line > > > >> FoT, >> >> I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking >> for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines >> placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger >> compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use >> a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? >> >> Allen >> >> A l l e n W a s h a t k o >> 1971 TR6 - Number 6 >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tony at tonydrews.com Mon Nov 19 17:42:52 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 18:42:52 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line In-Reply-To: <4742204E.2060404@charter.net> References: <002801c82af8$0b748220$6701a8c0@S1099895562> <4742204E.2060404@charter.net> Message-ID: <20071120004337.AD196187A25@autox.team.net> The main advantage of having it in the cockpit is that it's really hard to rip off the fuel line during an off-course excursion. I think the best route is under the car in such a manner that the frame rails protect it from side and bottom impacts but you still have sheet metal between you and the fuel line. I didn't see an easy way to accomplish that in my car (TR-4) without drilling holes in the frame. - Tony At 05:46 PM 11/19/2007, Glenn Franco wrote: >FOT >Reading the discussion thread has me wondering what the proper routing >path should be in my Spitfire. >I have yet to run my fuel line from my fuel cell up to the engine >compartment of my Spit. The routing dilemma has had me wondering why >anyone would >want to run a fuel line anywhere in the passenger compartment. I also >have a full cage and could run it inside on the right with full >protection afforded by >the cage. The possibility of fire, for whatever reason, would have me >run it on the outside of the frame rail below the vehicle away from the >exhaust. >I guess all the years spent in chassis engineering (big three product >liability) has me wondering. > >What advantage is there to running the fuel line in the vehicle? > >Glenn Franco >72 Spitfire racer under construction From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 20:06:20 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 22:06:20 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line Message-ID: Glenn Franco asked: > What advantage is there to running the fuel line in the vehicle? BBQ? Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newways_112007 From klynch_6 at msn.com Mon Nov 19 20:09:25 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 20:09:25 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line References: Message-ID: fries?? er...sorry KL ----- Original Message ----- From: Shane Ingate To: gaf3 at charter.net Cc: Friends of Triumph Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 8:06 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Gas Line Glenn Franco asked: > What advantage is there to running the fuel line in the vehicle? BBQ? Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newways_112007 _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Mon Nov 19 21:40:40 2007 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 20:40:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control In-Reply-To: <010801c82a6c$3c7a1f10$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <361601.53693.qm@web81215.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Steve: When I was building the car that Randy Williams currently owns I went to the CVAR rules committee to ask if I could louver the bonnet. They told me if I did I would need to run the car as a sport racer against other sport racers of the time. Since I thought it unlikely that it could be competitive against the likes of a Lotus 11 or similar cars I chose not to louver the bonnet. They did allow me to open the two bonnet vents as long as it wasn't unsightly. I did have two louvered panels made and I welded them to the inside wheel wells. They can't be seen from the outside when the wheels are mounted, and there is enough stuff under the bonnet to obscure them from view. There is a low pressure area in the wheel wells at speed, and it helps to evacuate the hot air from under the bonnet. Ken G. once told me that in the SoCal region they didn't allow the spacer blocks under the hinges. His trick was to loosen the two nuts that secure the hinges to the scuttle. As speed increased the rear of the bonnet would raise up. When you slowed down the hood would drop back down. During tech everything appeared to be "normal". I'm here to say I know that under the bonnet is a high pressure area. Having had a bonnet open at about 40 mph I can bear witness that the safety latches nor the hinges will keep the bonnet secured to the scuttle. I have the scar from the stitches to prove it. Still dizzy after all these years - Ed Steven Preiss wrote: FOT I am thinking of making an objective of reducing the air temperature in the engine compartment of my TR3, and to direct as cool air as possible to the carburetor intakes. I know there are shrouds available to channel maximum outside air through the radiator, but that seems to address only part of the problem. Where does all that heat from the head and exhaust manifold go? Surely not out those two little slits. Louvered bonnets are an attempt to address this no doubt, but it seems they are expensive and not universally done. I know from seat of the pants that as operating temperature rises, performance dwindles. How do others deal with it? Steve Preiss Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From awashatko at wi.rr.com Tue Nov 20 08:10:03 2007 From: awashatko at wi.rr.com (Allen Washatko) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 09:10:03 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Bill Tobin Message-ID: Bill, Please contact me off line. Thanks, Allen A l l e n W a s h a t k o 1971 TR6 - Number 6 From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 20 12:51:27 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 14:51:27 EST Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Reservations for THE GLEN Message-ID: FoT Entries and Attendees. Please read the note below....if you are unable to make reservations the remainder of the week, please try Andrea next week. Andrea seems to be spread a bit thin, but she is communicating with us. Regards, Joe Alexander > HI Mr. Alexander > > I have been receiving phone calls today for reservations, but just wanted to > let you know (my apologies for not letting you know earlier) that I will be > out of the office the rest of the week at another hotel. If anyone calls > this week, they can speak with any front desk agent, or if they want to wait and > speak directly with me, I will be back in the office on Monday. Ibm sorry > for the inconvenience, but hopefully all will work out well. Please let me > know if you have any questions or concerns. Thanks again and Happy Holidays. > > Andrea > Dear Mr. Alexander This email is to confirm your group reservations for 9/3/08 b 9/8/07. I have 15 rooms reserved under the name of bFriends of Triumphb at a group of $114.00 plus tax. Your confirmation # is 86651177. Return-Path: Received: from rly-md08.mx.aol.com (rly-md08.mail.aol.com [172.20.29.146]) by air-md08.mail.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILINMD082-91a474200db86; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:32:27 -0400 Received: from ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com (ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com [24.24.2.57]) by rly-md08.mx.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINMD082-91a474200db86; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:32:12 -0500 Received: from FranzeseLaptop (rrcs-24-39-168-3.nys.biz.rr.com [24.39.168.3]) by ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id lAJLW5kC027586 for ; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:32:10 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200711192132.lAJLW5kC027586 at ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com> From: "Andrea Stowe" To: Subject: RE: Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:26:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 thread-index: Acgq4yQARvNtdGoESXudUi4xTFndegADtdCw In-Reply-To: X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-AOL-IP: 24.24.2.57 X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_helo : n X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_822_from : n X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain HI Mr. Alexander I have been receiving phone calls today for reservations, but just wanted to let you know (my apologies for not letting you know earlier) that I will be out of the office the rest of the week at another hotel. If anyone calls this week, they can speak with any front desk agent, or if they want to wait and speak directly with me, I will be back in the office on Monday. I'm sorry for the inconvenience, but hopefully all will work out well. Please let me know if you have any questions or concerns. Thanks again and Happy Holidays. Andrea _____ From: N197TR4 at cs.com [mailto:N197TR4 at cs.com] Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 2:34 PM To: AStowe at visions-hotels.com Subject: Re: Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Thanks Andrea! Your phone will start ringing today. Joe Alexander Dear Mr. Alexander This email is to confirm your group reservations for 9/3/08 - 9/8/07. I have 15 rooms reserved under the name of "Friends of Triumph" at a group of $114.00 plus tax. Your confirmation # is 86651177. I also have a room reserved for Mr. Kastner. His confirmation # is 87433161. If you have any questions or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact me. Andrea Stowe, CHA General Manager Hampton Inn 9775 Victory Highway Painted Post, NY 14870 607-936-3344 607-936-3393 (fax) From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 20 13:00:20 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 15:00:20 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: FOT, Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to disturb his artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have to do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. Thanks Greg, Joe A From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 20 13:15:02 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 15:15:02 EST Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY Message-ID: List, I had a conversation with one of the members of the WPTA yesterday. There are mumurings that the WPTA would be willing to volunteer to be in charge of Friends of Triumph Hospitality in the Paddock. They have graciously volunteered to do this in the past. It usually means COFFEE and KRISPY KREMES in the mornings, not to mention all other manner of support in the Paoddock. We used to do stuff late at night with them, but most us are getting too old to stay up past 9:00PM. If we wind up with some kind of Corporate Support, as suggested by one our illustrious Coloradans, we will have no shortage of manpower to see that everyone is suitably taken care of. Of course, Tom Strange is in this mix with Paddock Layout. We arent going to micro manage all of this stuff....it all has a way of flowing into a smooth stream. Joe A From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Nov 20 13:25:03 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 15:25:03 EST Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY Message-ID: In a message dated 11/20/2007 2:15:26 PM Central Standard Time, N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > I had a conversation with one of the members of the WPTA yesterday. > > There are mumurings that the WPTA would be willing to volunteer to be in > charge of Friends of Triumph Hospitality in the Paddock. > > Are those guys out on the street again? Must be some sort of 'Work Release' program. That's fantastic. They're GREAT! Bill (Damdinger) ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From tr5racer at btinternet.com Tue Nov 20 13:59:09 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 20:59:09 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old editorial team. Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the regular contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good mix of articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis very much on advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a younger readership. I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! Mike Hughes --------------------------------- Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now. From REK46 at aol.com Tue Nov 20 14:05:35 2007 From: REK46 at aol.com (REK46 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:05:35 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: I agree with Mike ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Tue Nov 20 14:07:12 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 15:07:12 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> References: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B71CFE0@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I am a "stockist" as part of my local club. We and ship together at distribute at meetings. The cost is now $5.00 an issue under this plan. We were up to 13 member subscriptions until they went monthly. Between the added expense ($30 a year to $60 per) and the changes we are down to 7 members subscribers. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of JOSEPH HUGHES Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 2:59 PM To: Friends of Triumph Subject: [Fot] Triumph World I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old editorial team. Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the regular contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good mix of articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis very much on advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a younger readership. I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! Mike Hughes --------------------------------- Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Tue Nov 20 14:07:38 2007 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:07:38 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Reservations for THE GLEN In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > FoT Entries and Attendees.> > Please read the note below....if you are unable to make reservations the> remainder of the week, please try Andrea next week.> > Andrea seems to be spread a bit thin, but she is communicating with us.> > Regards, Joe Alexander> I didn't know it was necessary to talk to Andrea to make reservations, so I just made a reservation with whomever answered the telephone. It seemed to work out fine! John From lang at isis.mit.edu Tue Nov 20 14:42:41 2007 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert Lang) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:42:41 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> References: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 20 Nov 2007, JOSEPH HUGHES wrote: > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised > Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the > new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old > editorial team. I'm on the fence. On the other hand, I let my subscription lapse because I pretty much stopped reading the mag a while back and I find the new layout "hard to read"... too much like hanging around with ADD people. > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got rid > of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the > regular contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good > mix of articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new > magazine has the emphasis very much on advertising and would appear to > be out to try and attract a younger readership. I can't reply to the why, but I wanted to mention that I believe TOny Beadle was the original editor and if not, he's been in the editor chair since about '97 or '98. But I could be worng on that. One way or the other, I have to admit that I likes his style a bit more then "the new guy". Interestingly, I liked the new guy's column in the past, but I find his copy (the editor of that mag writes a lot of the copy, BTW) to be tiring. I can't put my finger on it. > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers > sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! Time will tell. On the other hand, I'm sure there's a few hundred Triumphs world-wide that haven't been covered yet. :-) I know MINE have never been featured. > Mike Hughes regards, rml p.s. I found it very amusing that as soon as my subscription lapsed, tehy did an article about one of our club's long-standing events - Day of Triumph. Go figure. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Room N42-140Q | This space for rent Consultant MIT IS&T unix-linux-help | Voice:617-253-7438 FAX: 617-258-9535 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Nov 20 14:40:44 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:40:44 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: In a message dated 11/20/2007 2:59:39 PM Central Standard Time, tr5racer at btinternet.com writes: > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised Triumph > World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the new magazine > or whether the ones you have read are from the old editorial team. > > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got rid of > Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the regular > contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good mix of > articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis > very much on advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a > younger readership. > > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers sold > each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! > Mike, you have me at a disadvantage, as I've only seen two issues I have to assume they are by the 'the new team' you describe, as they are the most recent issues. Therefore, I have no basis for comparison with past issues, but the two I saw sure impressed me. The November issue has a ton of regular articles, as well as some great feature articles, including the restoration and upgrades of a Herald, a GT6, and a Toledo (what ever that is). There is a fine article on a Stag factory fastback, and a technical article on the Stage engine. There is a historical article highlighting Design Engineer Lewis Dawtrey. I particularly enjoy the pictures and articles about the models we don't often see over here. I find it interesting that you describe previous issues as 'better,' because those two I saw were very good. I was in business for nearly forty-five years, and I know what makes the world goes around. I never had anything to do with the publishing business, but I am not put off by their need to feature advertisers. It is common knowledge advertising income is critical to magazines. So too attracting younger readers. Does not surprise me. It's a good idea. Older TRIUMPH aficionados like me are dying off like flies. Mike...different strokes for different folks. Participation optional. To each his own, but I stand by my take. Bill ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From GRMTim at aol.com Tue Nov 20 16:07:15 2007 From: GRMTim at aol.com (GRMTim at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 18:07:15 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: You know... I was going to stay out of this, but if you are looking for a magazine witha lot of Triumph content, I do know of one. Our March issue will be a special Triumph issue with a cover story on a Spitfire restoration. We are also working on TR8 story, from mild to wild and wild is the Group 44 car. On a side note, I dragged home an early, early, rust free TR6 yesterday that I found less than 10 miles from my house. Tim Suddard Publisher; Classic Motorsports and Grassroots Motorsports magazines www.classicmotorsports.net www.grassrootsmotorsports.com Phone: (386) 673-4148 Fax: (386) 673-6040 ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From 356drb at indy.net Tue Nov 20 16:58:35 2007 From: 356drb at indy.net (Brett Johnson) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 18:58:35 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> References: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6365AF03-D99B-458E-A618-FA88A8B8143B@indy.net> Hi! I have written the From USA column since day one (April 1995) and indeed Tony was the editor all that time. When the magazine was sold to Kelsey a year or so back, the frequency was increased and Tony told me that they would be alternating my column with the Down Under one and I should write one about half the length. Then, the length was to stay the same and then -- Tony was let go, much to everyone's surprise -- especially Tony. New editor Ted contacted all of the then current contributors and let them know what the new compensation package was. Guess what? Nearly everyone said no thanks! I contributed a couple of shorter columns and they ran two of them. I didn't see my name listed among the contributors last issue, but got a somewhat confusing email today, which implied I should keep sending in material. I also still hear from Tony on occasion. His brother lives up the road in Carmel (Indiana) and he stops by when he is visiting. Tony's background is interestingly in American custom cars. How he and I got the Triumph World jobs makes a pretty strange tale. In the past I have tried to highlight the FoT with some historical and some race reporting. I have enjoyed the interaction and hope that I will still function in this capacity. Thanks for your past input and I hope to be back asking questions as things become more clear. Ted assures me the magazine is not in financial trouble, but as Mike indicates only time will tell. Brett Johnson Indianapolis On Nov 20, 2007, at 3:59 PM, JOSEPH HUGHES wrote: > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised > Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of > the new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old > editorial team. > > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they > got rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and > several of the regular contributors. I much preferred the old > magazine which had a good mix of articles, history, competition and > a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis very much on > advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a younger > readership. > > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the > numbers sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! > > Mike Hughes > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit > now. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dos_gusanos at msn.com Tue Nov 20 16:30:45 2007 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:30:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Will this year's Calendar finally feature my Elva?...................Henry Morrison> From: GRMTim at aol.com> Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 18:07:15 -0500> To: fot at autox.team.net> Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumph World> > You know... I was going to stay out of this, but if you are looking for a > magazine witha lot of Triumph content, I do know of one.> > Our March issue will be a special Triumph issue with a cover story on a > Spitfire restoration. We are also working on TR8 story, from mild to wild and wild > is the Group 44 car.> > On a side note, I dragged home an early, early, rust free TR6 yesterday that > I found less than 10 miles from my house.> > Tim Suddard> Publisher; Classic Motorsports> and Grassroots Motorsports magazines> www.classicmotorsports.net> www.grassrootsmotorsports.com> Phone: (386) 673-4148 Fax: (386) 673-6040> > > > **************************************> Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest > products.> > (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)> _______________________________________________> http://www.team.net/donate.html> > Fot mailing list> Fot at autox.team.net> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From pvucinic at netspace.net.au Tue Nov 20 18:59:06 2007 From: pvucinic at netspace.net.au (Peter Vucinic) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 12:59:06 +1100 Subject: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers Message-ID: Dear Listers, Can anyone give me their experience with Roller Rockers for TR6? Good, Bad or Otherwise? Who's rockers they used? Ratio? And/or whether they experienced any problems with loss of oil pressure/excessive oil flow to rocker shaft? Thanks in advance. Kind Regards Peter Vucinic TR-4 _____________________________________________ Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 20 19:11:10 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 21:11:10 EST Subject: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers Message-ID: Peter! This is a great question. I have heard so many stories that I dont know what to believe. It will be an interesting thread and very informative. I am all ears. Just what are the benefits? What are the downsides? What are the pitfalls? Joe A > Dear Listers, > > > > Can anyone give me their experience with Roller Rockers for TR6? > > Good, Bad or Otherwise? > > Who's rockers they used? Ratio? And/or whether they experienced any problems > with loss of oil pressure/excessive oil flow to rocker shaft? > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > Kind Regards > > Peter Vucinic > > TR-4 > From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Nov 20 19:18:44 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 21:18:44 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: Brett... Do you still have a radio in your 356 race car? Bill Dentinger **************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From stutzmans at comcast.net Tue Nov 20 19:54:26 2007 From: stutzmans at comcast.net (Stutzman) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 21:54:26 -0500 Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY References: Message-ID: <003101c82be9$d4bc8c80$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> must be VanVlack - he never had enough sense to "stifle". "stifle", as in Archie Bunker's advice to meathead. Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY > In a message dated 11/20/2007 2:15:26 PM Central Standard Time, > N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > > >> I had a conversation with one of the members of the WPTA yesterday. >> >> There are mumurings that the WPTA would be willing to volunteer to be in >> charge of Friends of Triumph Hospitality in the Paddock. >> >> > > Are those guys out on the street again? Must be some sort of 'Work > Release' > program. That's fantastic. They're GREAT! > > Bill (Damdinger) > > > > ************************************** > Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest > products. > > (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From 356drb at indy.net Tue Nov 20 20:56:43 2007 From: 356drb at indy.net (Brett Johnson) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 22:56:43 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <324DF41E-2F01-419E-9B8D-227421E48FAF@indy.net> Yes, and the original 1951 wind-up clock (accurate w/i 5 min/day) so I can tell when the session is about to be checkered. Brett On Nov 20, 2007, at 9:18 PM, BillDentin at aol.com wrote: > Brett... > > Do you still have a radio in your 356 race car? > > Bill Dentinger > > > > > Check out AOL Money & Finance's list of the hottest products and > top money wasters of 2007. From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 20 22:21:40 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 22:21:40 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts Message-ID: <20071121052620.XZMZ6284.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Rant on This evening an electrician took my (unattended) Server center down. So I rush over to bring the servers back on line. I pull in the parking lot and there is a guy sitting in his car on his cel. Trunk open and battery cables lying on the ground. I ask, "Need a jump?" Nope he has a flat tire and can I help him. I then noticed that he has a crippled left arm so of course I jump in to get the tire changed for him. Hmmm.... Who put this monster wooden box which huge ass speakers in your truck that has to be removed to get to the stupid ass don-nut spare and jack out of your car I wonder to my self as I remove said box. Get jack under car and get it partially lifted. Remove cover on the wheels to get to the lug nuts. Lug wrench is way to BIG for the lug nuts. I reached in to feel the lug nuts (I forgot to mention he parked in just about the darkest part of the parking lot) and they felt "weird". They are "kinda" rounded with slots running down the length. The guy remembers that he has a special tool for the lug nuts and gets it's out of the glove box along with a barely useable flash light You have about 3/4" of an inch access to the lug nuts. The special tool is about 3" long and the standard lung wrench fits onto it (although pretty sloppy fit). That means that the leverage force you are applying to this 3/4" lug nut is about 5" out in space. Managed to massage four of the lug nuts loose. The fifth however... Someone had been a little eager with their impact wrench. Downstairs from the server room is a full service sign shop that a friend of mine owns. I have the keys to the building so I'll grab some tools. I take one of the lug nuts with me and discover that this a 16mm socket is just a hair to small and a 17mm socket is just as much too big. Same with trying standard sockets. Can't get enough purchase or angle to try and use a crescent wrench. Ended up putting his stuff back in the trunk and helping him call a tow truck to take the car and drop it off at a tire store. Moral of the story. Special lug nuts are not worth it. I would rather have some steal my wheels then to have my "anti-theft" solution leave me stranded on the side of the road and unable to replace a flat tire. Rant off From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 20 23:06:33 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 22:06:33 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts References: <20071121052620.XZMZ6284.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Message-ID: Yep. I have a full set of them sitting in a drawer, never installed. Can't quite bring myself to toss them, but I won't put them on a car after a similar experience. I also took the single locking lug nut off my F350 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle Sent: Tue 11/20/2007 9:21 PM To: wheeltowheel at wheeltowheel.com; fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts Rant on This evening an electrician took my (unattended) Server center down. So I rush over to bring the servers back on line. I pull in the parking lot and there is a guy sitting in his car on his cel. Trunk open and battery cables lying on the ground. I ask, "Need a jump?" Nope he has a flat tire and can I help him. I then noticed that he has a crippled left arm so of course I jump in to get the tire changed for him. Hmmm.... Who put this monster wooden box which huge ass speakers in your truck that has to be removed to get to the stupid ass don-nut spare and jack out of your car I wonder to my self as I remove said box. Get jack under car and get it partially lifted. Remove cover on the wheels to get to the lug nuts. Lug wrench is way to BIG for the lug nuts. I reached in to feel the lug nuts (I forgot to mention he parked in just about the darkest part of the parking lot) and they felt "weird". They are "kinda" rounded with slots running down the length. The guy remembers that he has a special tool for the lug nuts and gets it's out of the glove box along with a barely useable flash light You have about 3/4" of an inch access to the lug nuts. The special tool is about 3" long and the standard lung wrench fits onto it (although pretty sloppy fit). That means that the leverage force you are applying to this 3/4" lug nut is about 5" out in space. Managed to massage four of the lug nuts loose. The fifth however... Someone had been a little eager with their impact wrench. Downstairs from the server room is a full service sign shop that a friend of mine owns. I have the keys to the building so I'll grab some tools. I take one of the lug nuts with me and discover that this a 16mm socket is just a hair to small and a 17mm socket is just as much too big. Same with trying standard sockets. Can't get enough purchase or angle to try and use a crescent wrench. Ended up putting his stuff back in the trunk and helping him call a tow truck to take the car and drop it off at a tire store. Moral of the story. Special lug nuts are not worth it. I would rather have some steal my wheels then to have my "anti-theft" solution leave me stranded on the side of the road and unable to replace a flat tire. Rant off Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Wed Nov 21 00:33:17 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 02:33:17 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World. Message-ID: In a message dated 11/20/2007 3:08:19 PM Pacific Standard Time, fot-request at autox.team.net writes: > To: Friends of Triumph > Subject: [Fot] Triumph World > > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised > Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the > new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old > editorial team. > > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got > rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the > regular contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good > mix of articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new > magazine has the emphasis very much on advertising and would appear to > be out to try and attract a younger readership. > > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers > sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! > > Mike Hughes I agree 100% with Mike. I have every single issue since # 1, right up to # 72. I have not renewed, as it has turned from a decent read into little more than a comic. I am exceedingly disappointed in what Kelsey Publishing have done with it, not to mention the way they treated Tony Beadle - a thoroughly good man btw. With my continuing membership of the TSSC, since 1981, the FoT and other Triumph internet forums, and the most excellent VTR magazine, my needs are met. The cost also went up from $51/year to $99/year...that's the last straw. I would rather spend my money on my Triumph. Regards Leon F Guyot From don at carterdesignassociates.com Wed Nov 21 10:36:54 2007 From: don at carterdesignassociates.com (Don Carter) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 11:36:54 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <002301c82c65$1ea97440$59e8a8c0@donlaptop> I've run roller rockers since 1993 in my 6. At the VTR National Convention in Seattle that year, I met a guy named Richard Good who had started a side business in auto parts for 6's. He had a set of his new roller rockers with him at the event and our friendship started when I made this purchase. I couldn't wait to get back to Texas to try them out. The rocker arms are the 1:1.65 ratio and I couldn't be happier with their performance. It was like putting a mild higher lift cam in the car. As you guys know rolling across the top of the valve stem, opens the valve a little more. There is no wear that I have noticed, but I don't drive the car that often. Since '93 only 25K miles, (after my rebuild at 100K), has been on break-in road trips and a few times a year my wife and I autocross it. The boost in performance was immediate and noticeable. They are easy to adjust. There is no downside that I know of. On a milled head you have to watch the geometry of the set up, just as you do / should with any installation of valve train equipment. I had to make spacers under the rocker shaft chairs, but that was because I milled the head a tad. I also had to adjust the spacing along the shaft with washers to center them on the stems. I'm sure Richard has now made these adjustments in the sets he now sells. I have also run my stock push rods since installation. I told Richard recently that I have almost every thing he makes, and that he should start a new expanded catalog. Don W. Carter, AIA Carter Design Associates 6213 Skyline Dr., Suite 100 Houston, Texas 77057 (713) 529-2288 Telephone (713) 789-2330 Fax don at carterdesignassociates.com -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+don=carterdesignassociates.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+don=carterdesignassociates.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of N197TR4 at cs.com Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 8:11 PM To: pvucinic at netspace.net.au Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers Peter! This is a great question. I have heard so many stories that I dont know what to believe. It will be an interesting thread and very informative. I am all ears. Just what are the benefits? What are the downsides? What are the pitfalls? Joe A > Dear Listers, > > > > Can anyone give me their experience with Roller Rockers for TR6? > > Good, Bad or Otherwise? > > Who's rockers they used? Ratio? And/or whether they experienced any > problems with loss of oil pressure/excessive oil flow to rocker shaft? > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > Kind Regards > > Peter Vucinic > > TR-4 > Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tr5racer at btinternet.com Wed Nov 21 10:59:36 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 17:59:36 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: <6365AF03-D99B-458E-A618-FA88A8B8143B@indy.net> Message-ID: <862842.36824.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> I enjoyed your column Brett as it kept us abreast of what was happening on the other side of the pond. Incidentally the TR Register has now commissioned Tony Beadle to write a series of articles for their magazine, TR Action, and I believe there will in future be an exchange of articles between VTR and the TR Register which will only further cement the friendship between the 2 clubs. Mike Hughes Brett Johnson <356drb at indy.net> wrote: Hi! I have written the From USA column since day one (April 1995) and indeed Tony was the editor all that time. When the magazine was sold to Kelsey a year or so back, the frequency was increased and Tony told me that they would be alternating my column with the Down Under one and I should write one about half the length. Then, the length was to stay the same and then -- Tony was let go, much to everyone's surprise -- especially Tony. New editor Ted contacted all of the then current contributors and let them know what the new compensation package was. Guess what? Nearly everyone said no thanks! I contributed a couple of shorter columns and they ran two of them. I didn't see my name listed among the contributors last issue, but got a somewhat confusing email today, which implied I should keep sending in material. I also still hear from Tony on occasion. His brother lives up the road in Carmel (Indiana) and he stops by when he is visiting. Tony's background is interestingly in American custom cars. How he and I got the Triumph World jobs makes a pretty strange tale. In the past I have tried to highlight the FoT with some historical and some race reporting. I have enjoyed the interaction and hope that I will still function in this capacity. Thanks for your past input and I hope to be back asking questions as things become more clear. Ted assures me the magazine is not in financial trouble, but as Mike indicates only time will tell. Brett Johnson Indianapolis On Nov 20, 2007, at 3:59 PM, JOSEPH HUGHES wrote: > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised > Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of > the new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old > editorial team. > > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they > got rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and > several of the regular contributors. I much preferred the old > magazine which had a good mix of articles, history, competition and > a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis very much on > advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a younger > readership. > > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the > numbers sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! > > Mike Hughes > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit > now. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot --------------------------------- For ideas on reducing your carbon footprint visit Yahoo! For Good this month. From westerneagleracing at att.net Wed Nov 21 14:30:47 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 21:30:47 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: <112120072130.11537.4744A38700085FF000002D1122230647029B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Joe, Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a number of other events have had "polo" shirts. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from N197TR4 at cs.com: -------------- > FOT, > > Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. > > The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! > One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! > There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! > > I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In > Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to > disturb his > artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have to > do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. > > Thanks Greg, > > Joe A > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From REK46 at aol.com Wed Nov 21 14:47:38 2007 From: REK46 at aol.com (REK46 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 16:47:38 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: I agree with Ron...reg shirts can be worn more often,and in differing climates ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Wed Nov 21 15:03:25 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 16:03:25 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B761203@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I have been invloved with running the Texas All Brit day for 17 years now and I have a lot of T-shirts, more than I can wear. We have found the Henley style 3 button T to be very popular. It like a baseball shirt and most brands are a little heavier than the standard cheapo T. You can screen both T's and Henleys in the same runs and still get the volume discounts. We also have done some in black, very popular. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of REK46 at aol.com Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 3:48 PM To: westerneagleracing at att.net; N197TR4 at cs.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 I agree with Ron...reg shirts can be worn more often,and in differing climates ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop0003000000000 1) Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Wed Nov 21 14:58:58 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 16:58:58 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: Ron, Excelllent! I believe the planning is shifting to something more than just another T-shirt. Seems very appropriate. There is also some thinking about expanding the sales beyond just the FoT. But a lot of work needs to be done to lay that groundwork, and I cant speak for Mssrs. Janzen, Sukey, Petrolati, Schumacher, et. al. Thanks and Regards, Joe A > Joe, > Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down > regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a > number of other events have had "polo" shirts. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from N197 From N197TR4 at cs.com Wed Nov 21 15:26:30 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 17:26:30 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: Nice sounding alternative for the SHIRT PEOPLE to look at. Thanks Smilin' Bob! Joe > I have been invloved with running the Texas All Brit day for 17 years > now and I have a lot of T-shirts, more than I can wear. We have found > the Henley style 3 button T to be very popular. It like a baseball shirt > and most brands are a little heavier than the standard cheapo T. You can > screen both T's and Henleys in the same runs and still get the volume > discounts. We also have done some in black, very popular. > > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Co. > 16415 North IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > Fx 512-272-9365 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of REK46 at aol.com > Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 3:48 PM > To: westerneagleracing at att.net; N197TR4 at cs.com > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > > I agree with Ron...reg shirts can be worn more often,and in differing > climates > From jsnook at wcnet.org Wed Nov 21 16:28:19 2007 From: jsnook at wcnet.org (Jeff Snook) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 18:28:19 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 References: <112120072130.11537.4744A38700085FF000002D1122230647029B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Message-ID: <003901c82c96$37824560$0902a8c0@JeffsNotebook> I'll buy whatever is decided, but I've got sooooo many t-shirts and polos I would prefer a button down. Jeff Snook www.snooksdreamcars.com ----- Original Message ----- From: westerneagleracing at att.net To: N197TR4 at cs.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 4:30 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Joe, Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a number of other events have had "polo" shirts. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from N197TR4 at cs.com: -------------- > FOT, > > Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. > > The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! > One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! > There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! > > I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In > Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to > disturb his > artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have to > do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. > > Thanks Greg, > > Joe A > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spreiss at verizon.net Wed Nov 21 05:28:26 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 23:28:26 +1100 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 References: <112120072130.11537.4744A38700085FF000002D1122230647029B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> <003901c82c96$37824560$0902a8c0@JeffsNotebook> Message-ID: <006601c82c3a$0449a640$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> How about sweats and/or hoodies? Can be worn by men and women alike. Very useful of an evening and come fall/winter. Many different color combinations are possible. Just a thought. Steve P. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Snook" To: ; Cc: Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2007 10:28 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > I'll buy whatever is decided, but I've got sooooo many t-shirts and polos I > would prefer a button down. > Jeff Snook > www.snooksdreamcars.com > ----- Original Message ----- > From: westerneagleracing at att.net > To: N197TR4 at cs.com > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 4:30 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > > > Joe, > Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down > regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a > number of other events have had "polo" shirts. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from N197TR4 at cs.com: -------------- > > > > FOT, > > > > Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. > > > > The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! > > One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! > > There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! > > > > I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In > > Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to > > disturb his > > artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have > to > > do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. > > > > Thanks Greg, > > > > Joe A > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 21 22:01:02 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 21:01:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 References: <112120072130.11537.4744A38700085FF000002D1122230647029B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net><003901c82c96$37824560$0902a8c0@JeffsNotebook> <006601c82c3a$0449a640$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: Classy, we could wear the hoodies when we do drive-by fruitings in the Porsche paddock. Shirts can get very spendy, but if they are cool enough you can get the money back. For the Columbia River Classic we had Columbia Sportswear Performance Fishing Gear shirts done with a great logo. We could have sold as many as we had the nerve to buy. In theory we had enough donated for all the drivers and workers/officials, but in reality we ran a few short. People are STILL pissed at me that they didn't get one. This is the shirt we used: http://www.columbia.com/Product.aspx?top=1&p=5071&cat=15020&viewAll=True . It's long sleeve but you can roll the sleeve up and button it. Cool in summer, warm in the fall. Remarkable piece of clothing. We also had T-shirts, women's T's and ball caps made by a company called Wicked Quick. They did it on spec! I'm not sure they still do that, but we sold a lot of shirts. They were so cool the local high-end men's shop in Portland and Seattle--Mario's--was selling them. The women's T's were killer. Somewhere I have some photos from a photoshoot we did at Pittock Mansion with a raft of models. That was fun, if you go for that kind of thing. They do a lot of tatoo style art and the T-shirts are a special kind of light fabric that's extremely comfortable and kind of clingy. Great for girls, but I'm not sure I want to see one on Dentinger. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Steven Preiss Sent: Wed 11/21/2007 4:28 AM To: Jeff Snook; westerneagleracing at att.net; N197TR4 at cs.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 How about sweats and/or hoodies? Can be worn by men and women alike. Very useful of an evening and come fall/winter. Many different color combinations are possible. Just a thought. Steve P. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Snook" To: ; Cc: Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2007 10:28 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > I'll buy whatever is decided, but I've got sooooo many t-shirts and polos I > would prefer a button down. > Jeff Snook > www.snooksdreamcars.com > ----- Original Message ----- > From: westerneagleracing at att.net > To: N197TR4 at cs.com > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 4:30 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > > > Joe, > Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down > regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a > number of other events have had "polo" shirts. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from N197TR4 at cs.com: -------------- > > > > FOT, > > > > Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. > > > > The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! > > One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! > > There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! > > > > I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In > > Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to > > disturb his > > artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have > to > > do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. > > > > Thanks Greg, > > > > Joe A > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From greenman62 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 22 06:56:32 2007 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (greenman62 at hotmail.com) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 13:56:32 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Tshirt design Message-ID: The discussion about the T shirt/hoodies/golf shirt/ 3 button Oxford or any other peripheral stuff, like baseball caps is great! It really doesn't matter to me what we decide on... The FOT gets my "family discount" (25% off) for art work. I love doing cartoons, but I'll be glad to do a logo or both for that matter. How about a logo for embroidered stuff, like fleeces, hoodies and caps and a single color t shirt with a cartoon? I don't need to know right away, but as many of you know next year I'm planning to relocate to the left side of the country so anything I can get started ASAP would be a good thing. Happy Thanksgiving to you all! Greg Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... From jerryvv at adelphia.net Thu Nov 22 07:11:00 2007 From: jerryvv at adelphia.net (Jerry Van Vlack) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:11:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY References: Message-ID: <006a01c82d11$83033aa0$6401a8c0@gmvv> My good friend Bruce Stutzman quoted Archie Bunker and suggested that I should just "Stifle It" when he saw that Joe and I had discussed the WPTA again doing the Hospitality Tent at this years FOT Glen gathering. He equated me to Meatball!. I called Bruce and asked him how he could have referred to me as "Meatball" after all of these years and he had little excuse but to apologize profusely. Apologies are not what they used to be ever since a previous President used them so liberally for every small or big transgression that he was caught doing. So I've decided that Bruce's apology while well meaning lacked real sincerity. Now those of you who know Bruce also know that he likes to occasionally toss a few down. Well his real excuse was that he had a few extra beers that night in celebration of the birth of his 1st Grandson; Cooper Stutzman. He was feeling pretty good by the time he wrote that little epistle. Congratulations Bruce, now we can not only call you "Madman" but also "Grandpa" Will Cooper be riding shotgun anytime soon? JVV ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY > In a message dated 11/20/2007 2:15:26 PM Central Standard Time, > N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > > >> I had a conversation with one of the members of the WPTA yesterday. >> >> There are mumurings that the WPTA would be willing to volunteer to be in >> charge of Friends of Triumph Hospitality in the Paddock. >> >> > > Are those guys out on the street again? Must be some sort of 'Work > Release' > program. That's fantastic. They're GREAT! > > Bill (Damdinger) > > > > ************************************** > Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest > products. > > (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.2/1142 - Release Date: > 11/20/2007 5:44 PM From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Nov 22 07:14:00 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:14:00 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen SHIRT design Message-ID: List, It 'appears' that the thought is migrating to something tasteful and functional. I 'suggest' sticking to one configuration of apparel and a simple design. (I like the Bill Babcock Columbia shirt, but do not know what Ted & Doris can provide) My vision would be the KASTNER CUP wrapped around the FoT Logo on one front side of the shirt. And something WATKINS GLEN on the other front side. It would be nice also to have them largely presold, paid for, and delivered before the event, so that they can be worn with pride at the Glen. We would be cool, and likely better looking than the MG Guys. That being said, the SHIRT GUYS have the last word. Joe A > > The discussion about the T shirt/hoodies/golf shirt/ 3 button Oxford or any > other peripheral stuff, like baseball caps is great! It really doesn't matter > to me what we decide on... > The FOT gets my "family discount" (25% off) for art work. > > I love doing cartoons, but I'll be glad to do a logo or both for that matter. > How about a logo for embroidered stuff, like fleeces, hoodies and caps and a > single color t shirt with a cartoon? > > I don't need to know right away, but as many of you know next year I'm > planning to relocate to the left side of the country so anything I can get > started ASAP would be a good thing. > > Happy Thanksgiving to you all! > > Greg > > Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois > > That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Nov 22 07:19:34 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:19:34 EST Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY Message-ID: May I nominate Bruce Stutzman as Chairman of the Hospitality Tent? Now that he is a Grandfather he will be further exalted as a 'FOG'....that's another organization. One for the elderly. It does not escape me that his grandson is "COOPER S" > My good friend Bruce Stutzman quoted Archie Bunker and suggested that I > should just "Stifle It" when he saw that Joe and I had discussed the WPTA > again doing the Hospitality Tent at this years FOT Glen gathering. > > He equated me to Meatball!. > > I called Bruce and asked him how he could have referred to me as "Meatball" > after all of these years and he had little excuse but to apologize > profusely. Apologies are not what they used to be ever since a previous > President used them so liberally for every small or big transgression that > he was caught doing. So I've decided that Bruce's apology while well meaning > lacked real sincerity. > > Now those of you who know Bruce also know that he likes to occasionally toss > a few down. Well his real excuse was that he had a few extra beers that > night in celebration of the birth of his 1st Grandson; Cooper Stutzman. He > was feeling pretty good by the time he wrote that little epistle. > > Congratulations Bruce, now we can not only call you "Madman" but also > "Grandpa" > > Will Cooper be riding shotgun anytime soon? > > JVV > From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 22 07:40:29 2007 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:40:29 -0500 Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY In-Reply-To: <006a01c82d11$83033aa0$6401a8c0@gmvv> References: <006a01c82d11$83033aa0$6401a8c0@gmvv> Message-ID: > He equated me to Meatball!. You mean "Meathead", you Meathead! John From klynch_6 at msn.com Thu Nov 22 07:53:16 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 07:53:16 -0700 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: Auto Week this morning has a photo/header of Bob Tulius in his TR4 heading to DP win in 63'. Don't know if this will come thru for you or not. Happy Thanksgiving to all. Kev Lynch http://www.autoweek.com/section/50th01 <006a01c82d11$83033aa0$6401a8c0@gmvv> Message-ID: <00b301c82d18$ff7f58a0$6401a8c0@gmvv> Well that confirms it then doesn't it. ----- Original Message ----- From: John Herrera To: Jerry Van Vlack ; billdentin at aol.com ; n197tr4 at cs.com ; fot at autox.team.net Cc: Bruce Stutzman Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2007 9:40 AM Subject: RE: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY > He equated me to Meatball!. You mean "Meathead", you Meathead! John ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.4/1145 - Release Date: 11/22/2007 11:49 AM From tr6racer21 at earthlink.net Thu Nov 22 11:34:00 2007 From: tr6racer21 at earthlink.net (U K MOTORSPORTS) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 13:34:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Pace Car Trailer Message-ID: <380-220071142218340527@earthlink.net> Wanted to offer this to any interested FOTer as this trailer has served me well, thanks Chip Pace 20' enclosed Tag Trailer, 4" Drop tandem 3500# axles w/ electric brakes, white spoke wheels w/ new tires, 3/4 painted plywood floor, 3/8 fir sidewall, rear barn style doors, 36" side door, roof vent, full electrical w/ lights, complete work bench and custom cabinets, winch, custom aluminum ramps, new exterior lighting, tie downs, outfitted for canopy(included), weight distributing hitch, sway control, recent axle/ brake service, glad to email pics, $4000 OBO, 804-564-1839 U K MOTORSPORTS tr6racer21 at earthlink.net From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Fri Nov 23 08:53:49 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007 09:53:49 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Here is some video from the new Eagles Canyon Race track in North Texas Message-ID: <002801c82de9$0ca6ff80$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> Here is some video from the new Eagles Canyon Race track in North Texas from a Porsche club drivers school last weekend. There is still a lot of work to do to pretty it up but it looks like a lot of fun. CVAR will hold the first sanctioned event there next weekend. http://tinyurl.com/2ekzey Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Fri Nov 23 09:24:02 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007 08:24:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] YouTube - Top Gear S10 E06 Motor home racing Message-ID: <008701c82ded$4326bb50$0502a8c0@desktop> I wonder if they'll start a vintage group? Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNFDZsCmPZY From pcdelux at worldnet.att.net Fri Nov 23 14:50:12 2007 From: pcdelux at worldnet.att.net (Bill DeWar) Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007 16:50:12 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts References: <20071121052620.XZMZ6284.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Message-ID: <003401c82e1a$d4e4c910$43544c0c@user90890nvpgh> Amici, "Special" lug nuts locking or otherwise are also the enemy of mechanics. Nothing better than to have a pile of cars in the lot and first one in has these. After playing the find wheel lock key game for a while you finally get all wheels loose except one. Your $16.95 tire rotation special is not looking like such a great idea about now. The best thing is thay are usually on wheels so ugly you'd pay someone to steal them. My personal rant over.. Bill D Triumph Rescue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "David W. Riddle" ; ; ; Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 1:06 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts > Yep. I have a full set of them sitting in a drawer, never installed. Can't > quite bring myself to toss them, but I won't put them on a car after a similar > experience. I also took the single locking lug nut off my F350 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle > Sent: Tue 11/20/2007 9:21 PM > To: wheeltowheel at wheeltowheel.com; fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org > Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts > > Rant on > > This evening an electrician took my (unattended) Server center > down. So I rush over to bring the servers back on line. > > I pull in the parking lot and there is a guy sitting in his car on > his cel. Trunk open and battery cables lying on the ground. > > I ask, "Need a jump?" Nope he has a flat tire and can I help him. > > I then noticed that he has a crippled left arm so of course I jump in > to get the tire changed for him. > > Hmmm.... Who put this monster wooden box which huge ass speakers in > your truck that has to be removed to get to the stupid ass don-nut > spare and jack out of your car I wonder to my self as I remove said box. > > Get jack under car and get it partially lifted. Remove cover on the > wheels to get to the lug nuts. > > Lug wrench is way to BIG for the lug nuts. I reached in to feel the > lug nuts (I forgot to mention he parked in just about the darkest > part of the parking lot) and they felt "weird". They are "kinda" > rounded with slots running down the length. The guy remembers that > he has a special tool for the lug nuts and gets it's out of the glove > box along with a barely useable flash light > > You have about 3/4" of an inch access to the lug nuts. The special > tool is about 3" long and the standard lung wrench fits onto it > (although pretty sloppy fit). That means that the leverage force you > are applying to this 3/4" lug nut is about 5" out in space. > > Managed to massage four of the lug nuts loose. The fifth however... > Someone had been a little eager with their impact wrench. > > Downstairs from the server room is a full service sign shop that a > friend of mine owns. I have the keys to the building so I'll grab > some tools. I take one of the lug nuts with me and discover that > this a 16mm socket is just a hair to small and a 17mm socket is just > as much too big. Same with trying standard sockets. Can't get > enough purchase or angle to try and use a crescent wrench. > > Ended up putting his stuff back in the trunk and helping him call a > tow truck to take the car and drop it off at a tire store. > > Moral of the story. Special lug nuts are not worth it. I would > rather have some steal my wheels then to have my "anti-theft" > solution leave me stranded on the side of the road and unable to > replace a flat tire. > > Rant off > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Fri Nov 23 18:42:51 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007 01:42:51 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] =?utf-8?q?Come_join_me_on_Friends_of_Triumph_on_The_Vintage?= =?utf-8?q?_Racing_League=E2=80=A6?= Message-ID: <8174901.1195868571272.JavaMail.xncore@smtp> We have created a Friends of Triumph group on The Vintage Racing League network. A few of us are already members. This might be a place where we can share pictures and videos amongst ourselves., rather than put them out there for everyone to see. It may also be a way to connect the various segments of your hobby together. In my case the Vintage Racing League is a way to connect FoT and CVAR to family and friends. The FoT group inside the VRL will separate them out from discussions that do not interest them. Time wil tell if this is a valid concept but I'm game. Click here to join: http://www.myvrl.com/group/friendsoftriumph?xgk=38d70d2a38 Thanks, Bob Kramer -- To control which emails you receive on The Vintage Racing League, go to: http://www.myvrl.com/profiles/profile/emailSettings From trmarty at hotmail.com Sat Nov 24 19:50:54 2007 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007 21:50:54 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Imports at Carlisle Autox 2008 Message-ID: I have never been to Imports at Carlisle. Any of you folks participated in the autox they have at the event? Whats it like? I am kicking around the idea but it's a pretty good haul. Any of my fellow Triumphites going to be there running showing all them other foreign cars how it done? Marty Sukey _________________________________________________________________ Put your friends on the big screen with Windows Vista. + Windows Live. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/shop/specialoffers.mspx?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_CPC_M ediaCtr_bigscreen_102007 From hottr6 at hotmail.com Sun Nov 25 12:30:04 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 14:30:04 -0500 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: Marty Sukey asked: > I have never been to Imports at Carlisle. Any of you folks participated in the > autox they have at the event? Whats it like? I am kicking around the idea but > it's a pretty good haul. Any of my fellow Triumphites going to be there > running showing all them other foreign cars how it done? The autoX is pretty lame. It is quite short and in my limited experience did not have any top drivers or cars. It seemed more of an event for show attendees and beginners. Carlisle vendors have really gone down hill. I started attending in 2000 and the number of Triumph-goods sellers was terrific with lots of bargains to be found. This, I have been told, was awful compared to the heady days of the 1990s. Last year and this year, the number of vendors has shrunk by a factor of 4 over past few years. Stick to eBay. On the other hand, the number of club cars shown on the grass seems to have increased, and not just Triumphs. Hell of a long way to drive for an old car show, though. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Share life as it happens with the new Windows Live.Download today it's FREE! http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_sharelife_112007 From igofaster at charter.net Sun Nov 25 16:55:45 2007 From: igofaster at charter.net (igofaster at charter.net) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 15:55:45 -0800 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site Message-ID: <20071125185545.0FCWN.424088.root@fepweb01> Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... best regards! Bobby Whitehead 1970 GT6+ #54 CVAR From fpspitfire at insightbb.com Sun Nov 25 18:37:30 2007 From: fpspitfire at insightbb.com (fpspitfire at insightbb.com) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 19:37:30 -0600 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <20071125185545.0FCWN.424088.root@fepweb01> References: <20071125185545.0FCWN.424088.root@fepweb01> Message-ID: edited for the reason that my brain thought before my fingers typed. But if you have a thick wallet, it all looks cool. aaron ----- Original Message ----- From: igofaster at charter.net Date: Sunday, November 25, 2007 17:56 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site To: fot at autox.team.net > Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for > high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to > dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and > GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com > > Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... > > > best regards! > > Bobby Whitehead > 1970 GT6+ > #54 CVAR > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sun Nov 25 18:38:57 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (spitlist at cox.net) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 20:38:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <20071125185545.0FCWN.424088.root@fepweb01> Message-ID: <20071125203857.SV58F.124283.root@eastrmwml14.mgt.cox.net> My own observation is that while some of their stuff appears to be pretty good, a lot seems to be offered for the benefit of the "Gee Whiz" crowd, that wants something that is impressive looking but of little actual value. Case in point: Check out the Spitfire header that they offer. Joe C. ---- igofaster at charter.net wrote: > Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com > > Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... > > > best regards! > > Bobby Whitehead > 1970 GT6+ > #54 CVAR > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jaxonracing at yahoo.com Sun Nov 25 19:28:00 2007 From: jaxonracing at yahoo.com (Jay Creel) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 18:28:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site Message-ID: <596933.33229.qm@web53504.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I definitely see your point. My interest is in that coil over rear end set up. I have lost 5 tires in as many sessions as the camber in my car is 4.5-5 degrees and from what I understand, Good Year has changed their construction so now the tires will not take that level of camber. I currently run a dearched spring and the rear has been lowered (pumpkin moved up) approx and inch. I have been fortunate enough not to hit anything when I have lost all these tires but the time will come and I am not interested in finding out... lol. I am interested in hearing what Kas and others thinks about this issue. This PRI set up looks pretty good and simple because it is bolt on. I have been leaning towards the adjustable rear uprights, but I am concerned about changing the ride height of the car plus it would change the angle of the spring. Perhaps not that much to matter. ----- Original Message ---- From: "spitlist at cox.net" To: igofaster at charter.net; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2007 8:38:57 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] High End Triumph Site My own observation is that while some of their stuff appears to be pretty good, a lot seems to be offered for the benefit of the "Gee Whiz" crowd, that wants something that is impressive looking but of little actual value. Case in point: Check out the Spitfire header that they offer. Joe C. ---- igofaster at charter.net wrote: > Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com > > Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... > > > best regards! > > Bobby Whitehead > 1970 GT6+ > #54 CVAR > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ____________________________________________________________________________________ Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From spitlist at cox.net Sun Nov 25 20:31:30 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (spitlist at cox.net) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 22:31:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <596933.33229.qm@web53504.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20071125223130.HRV52.125265.root@eastrmwml14.mgt.cox.net> There was a discussion on that very thing on another forum recently. The general consensus was that it reallty does not change what is wrong with the Spitfire rear suspension. It remains a swing axle suspension and therefore still has the issues with the camber varying as the suspension goes through its normal travel. I think that if you really want to make improvements, the best thing to do (if it is allowed by your sanctioning body) is to go with a true independent setup with both upper and lower control arms and a variable length drive axle. Cheers, Joe C. ---- Jay Creel wrote: > I definitely see your point. My interest is in that coil over rear end set up. I have lost 5 tires in as many sessions as the camber in my car is 4.5-5 degrees and from what I understand, Good Year has changed their construction so now the tires will not take that level of camber. I currently run a dearched spring and the rear has been lowered (pumpkin moved up) approx and inch. I have been fortunate enough not to hit anything when I have lost all these tires but the time will come and I am not interested in finding out... lol. > > I am interested in hearing what Kas and others thinks about this issue. This PRI set up looks pretty good and simple because it is bolt on. I have been leaning towards the adjustable rear uprights, but I am concerned about changing the ride height of the car plus it would change the angle of the spring. Perhaps not that much to matter. > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: "spitlist at cox.net" > To: igofaster at charter.net; fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2007 8:38:57 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] High End Triumph Site > > My own observation is that while some of their stuff appears to be pretty good, a lot seems to be offered for the benefit of the "Gee Whiz" crowd, that wants something that is impressive looking but of little actual value. Case in point: Check out the Spitfire header that they offer. > > Joe C. > > ---- igofaster at charter.net wrote: > > Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com > > > > Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... > > > > > > best regards! > > > > Bobby Whitehead > > 1970 GT6+ > > #54 CVAR > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Mon Nov 26 06:41:02 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 07:41:02 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Peter Vucinic Message-ID: <200711261341.lAQDf9mk335974@ns3.geneseo.net> Trying to reach Peter -- please respond Sorry for bombing the list uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From tstrange at sbcglobal.net Mon Nov 26 12:24:54 2007 From: tstrange at sbcglobal.net (tom strange) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 11:24:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] email addresses needed .. Message-ID: <327813.74343.qm@web81112.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Sorry to bomb the list, but I am in need of email addresses for the following ... In case these people dont see this, if anyone else has them I'd appreciate them ... this is for the glen 2008 planning.. Babcock, Bud Bulkowski, Peter Ceilley, Ed Smock, Paul Stadel, Bob Warner, Bill Williams, Randy Wismer, Bob Thanks in advance, Tom http://www.fot-racing.com/spit/caption/tom_strange.htm #4 white spitfire From yellow-green at sbcglobal.net Mon Nov 26 13:01:11 2007 From: yellow-green at sbcglobal.net (yellow-green at sbcglobal.net) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 14:01:11 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Southwick axle conversion Message-ID: Amici - If anyone is thinking about doing a Southwick rear axle conversion for their TR3 or TR4- I have a number of bare axle housings of which I would donate and deliver to Southwick for you. This would only save you one way shipping - after that it's between you and Southwick. No financial interest - just cleaning out the shed. Dennis DeLap Barrington Illinois From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 26 13:21:14 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 15:21:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site Message-ID: Amici, Chris at prirace.com is at the bottom of my list of vendors to recommend. I paid a hefty good-faith deposit on one of his advertised items and after receiving nothing for 2 years, spent the next 2 years trying to get my deposit back. That's when I learned that credit card companies offer no protection after 6 months. I have received nothing from Chris except lame excuses and promise. I've given up trying to get my deposit, but I will make sure that others know of my bad experience. Avoid like the plague, and if you see him, give him a bunch of fives for me. Shane Ingate in NM > Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... > The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm > conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com _________________________________________________________________ You keep typing, we keep giving. Download Messenger and join the im Initiative now. http://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=TAGLM From don at carterdesignassociates.com Mon Nov 26 16:07:23 2007 From: don at carterdesignassociates.com (Don Carter) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 17:07:23 -0600 Subject: [Fot] FW: TR6 Roller Rockers Message-ID: <009901c83081$1d829270$59e8a8c0@donlaptop> -----Original Message----- From: Don Carter [mailto:don at carterdesignassociates.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 11:37 AM To: 'N197TR4 at cs.com'; 'pvucinic at netspace.net.au' Cc: 'fot at autox.team.net' Subject: RE: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers I've run roller rockers since 1993 in my 6. At the VTR National Convention in Seattle that year, I met Richard Good who had started a side business in auto parts for 6's. He had a set of his new roller rockers with him at the event and our friendship started when I made this purchase. I couldn't wait to get back to Texas to try them out. Mine are rocker the 1:1.65 ratio and I couldn't be happier with their performance. It was like putting a mild higher lift cam in the car. It was my first modification to the car as I was a purist to the point of being seriously accused of being a OCD case. As you guys know rolling across the top of the valve stem, and the length ratio of each side of the rocker arm, opens the valves more. There is no noticeable wear that I have noticed, but I don't drive the car that often. Since '93 only 25K miles, (after my rebuild at 100K), has been on break-in road trips and a few times a year my wife and I autocross it. The boost in performance after installation was immediately noticeable. They are easy to adjust. Basically, there is no downside that I know of. On a milled head you have to watch the geometry of the set up, just as you do with any installation of valve train equipment. The arms should be level as possible before they act on the valve, as I've found, so that the push rod socket does not mar the aluminum arm and that it clears the valve cover, of course. I later made brass spacers under the rocker shaft chairs, but that was because I milled the head a tad. I also had to adjust the spacing along the shaft with washers to center them on the stems. I'm sure Richard has now made these adjustments in the sets he now sells. I have also run my stock push rods since installation, which is why I needed the spacers. I've learned these final minor adjustments over the last few years of running them. I told the now well known "Good Parts" owner that I have almost every thing in his catalog, and that he should expand his parts list. It would also be "good" if he would publish something on how to autocross a limited slip diff. I'd like someone to comment on that before I take out more cones as I'm over-powering the courses we run. Don W. Carter, AIA Carter Design Associates 6213 Skyline Dr., Suite 100 Houston, Texas 77057 (713) 529-2288 Telephone (713) 789-2330 Fax don at carterdesignassociates.com -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+don=carterdesignassociates.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+don=carterdesignassociates.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of N197TR4 at cs.com Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 8:11 PM To: pvucinic at netspace.net.au Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers Peter! This is a great question. I have heard so many stories that I dont know what to believe. It will be an interesting thread and very informative. I am all ears. Just what are the benefits? What are the downsides? What are the pitfalls? Joe A > Dear Listers, > > > > Can anyone give me their experience with Roller Rockers for TR6? > > Good, Bad or Otherwise? > > Who's rockers they used? Ratio? And/or whether they experienced any > problems with loss of oil pressure/excessive oil flow to rocker shaft? > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > Kind Regards > > Peter Vucinic > > TR-4 > Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wgrosenbach at juno.com Mon Nov 26 16:15:13 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 16:15:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, at Laguna Seca is? Thanks, Bill From dave at microworks.net Mon Nov 26 17:59:39 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 17:59:39 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> References: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: <20071127010350.NEEO11609.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> http://www.cartracingupdate.com/Tracks/lagunaseca.htm 50 ft? "...The signature corkscrew at Mazda Raceway Laguna Seca (turns 8 and 8A) drops nearly 50 feet. The elevation change from the entrance of the corkscrew to Turn 11 is equivalent to a three-story building..." Nice track primer here: http://www.norcal-saac.org/ot/laguna.pdf At 04:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, >at Laguna Seca is? >Thanks, >Bill >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tony at tonydrews.com Mon Nov 26 18:06:41 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 19:06:41 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> References: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: <20071127010734.1E736187A33@autox.team.net> According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. I've GOT to drive that track at least once. - Tony http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&qs=1021+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy%2c+Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, >at Laguna Seca is? >Thanks, >Bill >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Mon Nov 26 18:04:07 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 18:04:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Race report Message-ID: <20071127010820.NHAJ11609.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> I sent a race report, from my son's race yesterday, to the list but never saw it come through. Thought this stat might be interesting some of you. Talk about close competition around Firebird's 1.6 mile track. He qualified 3rd. -------------- ...The really amazing thing however was seeing the times posted by the top four karts. Pole: 1:06.507 2nd: 1:06.692 3rd: 1:06.865 4th: 1:06.870 Beat out fourth place by 5 one thousands of a second! That's close. Feel good moment. The top 6 places were all filled with karts running purpose built ICC motors other then us running our Honda moto 125. Definitely hitting above his weight today. The really warm fuzzy was the fact that the fourth placed kart and driver took 2nd in class at the SKUSA SuperNationals this past week in Las Vegas (over 400 kats!)... -------------- From lunkercars at earthlink.net Mon Nov 26 18:42:44 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 18:42:44 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Race report In-Reply-To: <20071127010820.NHAJ11609.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> References: <20071127010820.NHAJ11609.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> Message-ID: <975098F8-BE32-4114-A94E-3BF238794B60@earthlink.net> Congrats to Tyler and to you too David. Nobody around checking fuel temps eh? What sort of times might a TR turn at Firebird - Thinking about trying to make your Feb 1st race. Greg Hilyer TR4 # 314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 26, 2007, at 6:04 PM, David W. Riddle wrote: > I sent a race report, from my son's race yesterday, to the list but > never saw it come through. > > Thought this stat might be interesting some of you. Talk about close > competition around Firebird's 1.6 mile track. He qualified 3rd. > > -------------- > ...The really amazing thing however was seeing the times posted by > the top four karts. > > Pole: 1:06.507 > 2nd: 1:06.692 > 3rd: 1:06.865 > 4th: 1:06.870 > > Beat out fourth place by 5 one thousands of a second! That's close. > > Feel good moment. The top 6 places were all filled with karts > running purpose built ICC motors other then us running our Honda moto > 125. Definitely hitting above his weight today. > > The really warm fuzzy was the fact that the fourth placed kart and > driver took 2nd in class at the SKUSA SuperNationals this past week > in Las Vegas (over 400 kats!)... > -------------- > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gkbyrne at optushome.com.au Mon Nov 26 21:46:27 2007 From: gkbyrne at optushome.com.au (Geoffrey Byrne) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:46:27 +1100 Subject: [Fot] TR6 Mechanical Fuel Cam Message-ID: <002601c830b0$79db9470$d40eefdc@co3017577a> FOT Anyone have an update on the manufacture of the mechanical fuel cam for the TR6 PI system . I remember emails about someone looking into manufacturing a number of complete units using the KK adjustment method Geoff Byrne TR6 racer down under From dave at microworks.net Sun Nov 25 21:38:59 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 21:38:59 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Firebird Main Race Report - November 25 Message-ID: <20071126044434.HZII22853.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> The son, Tyler, had an endurance race on his 125 shifter kart this afternoon. The kart had run well at the last event so we have not made any changes to it. Then this morning just prior to the practice session Tyler decided he wanted to try and adjust the throttle cable to help the kart idle better (well, actually to idle at all). Adjusted the cable and off he went to the grid but the kart was activing odd so he asked me to take the tension back out of the cable. Thought I did. He heads out for the track at increasing amounts of throttle. When he approached he first corner where he would need to lift the throttle did not want to cooperate and he had to kill the engine there in the first turn. Missed ALL but about 100 yards of practice. Not real helpful for dusting the cobwebs off. Got the kart back to the paddock after the session and made sure to get rid of the tension in the cable. Gave the rest of the kart a once over and pronounced it ready . Head out for Qualifying with some sticker tires mounted. Not sure how many karts but it was a lot. Not as many as last months 48 karts but certainly more than 30. Qualifying went well except for a short black flag incident where another kart also had a stuck throttle and did not end as well as Tyler's incident. First reports we heard on grid was a "broken ankle". Turned out to be a broken axle. Big difference! The kart did flip and the driver did play superman but other then some bruises he was ok. I was blown away with Tyler's qualifying effort. No practice laps, just 7 full laps run in qualifying and he ended up third! The really amazing thing however was seeing the times posted by the top four karts. Pole: 1:06.507 2nd: 1:06.692 3rd: 1:06.865 4th: 1:06.870 Beat out fourth place by 5 one thousands of a second! That's close. Feel good moment. The top 6 places were all filled with karts running purpose built ICC motors other then us running our Honda moto 125. Definitely hitting above his weight today. The really warm fuzzy was the fact that the fourth placed kart and driver took 2nd in class at the SKUSA SuperNationals this past week in Las Vegas (over 400 kats!). The race. Not so much. The only thing we changed was the plug. Put in one that is a step hotter. Were that close in qualifying I think that maybe that might help. Don't want to change too much. Supposed to be a 45 minute endurance race which will require pit stops for a splash and dash of fuel to make the distance. Got a bad start (yet again - need to have him work on that) and he dropped back to about 11th. Started working his way back up and was making up places. We could see him driving the wheels off the thing as he came around the Tower Turn. Hugging the inside line to decrease the distance around the turn and fighting to catch the kart with handfuls of opposite lock as it skipped and bounced across the bumpy exit. On lap 17 (about 18 minutes) into the race we don't see him come back around. We figure we missed him so we kept watching. Nope. The group he had been running with came back around and he wasn't there. Figure something is wrong and he his back at the paddock. Lug the fuel jug and the water bottles back to find him he's not there. Walk over to the fence. See three karts off in the dirt (nowhere near each other however) and we see a complete front spindle, wheel and brake rotor lying in the dirt. He's not there either. Get in the truck to drive over to the "Looper" to se if he's off over there. Yep there he is. See two other karts off in the area too. Also not anywhere near each other. Tyler said the kart bogged and sputtered on the start and took another lap before it started to feel ok. The downloaded data from the kart bears that out. Pace lap 2:02, Lap 1 1:22, Lap 2 1:10, Lap 3 1:08... He pulled off with what sounds like a problem in the transmission with no power getting to the wheels. Hope it's not too bad. It's got compression, the plug looks good and it rolls in neutral without hearing anything that sounds like a "bag of marbles". We'll clean up the kart this week and pull the motor to get it over to our engine builder. Hope to fight another day. From westerneagleracing at att.net Tue Nov 27 09:51:24 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 16:51:24 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Tony, It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks and you won't be able to get back on tract. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : -------------- > According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it > look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' > of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at > the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another > 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's > a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. > > I've GOT to drive that track at least once. > > - Tony > > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&qs=10 > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy%2c+ > Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 > then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from > http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . > > At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: > >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, > >at Laguna Seca is? > >Thanks, > >Bill > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vintage.racer at comcast.net Tue Nov 27 14:12:48 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 13:12:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Message-ID: <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the approach to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into the turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the while you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and click on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. Gary 62 TR4 69 TR6 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of westerneagleracing at att.net Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM To: Tony Drews Cc: FOT at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Tony, It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks and you won't be able to get back on tract. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : -------------- > According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it > look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' > of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at > the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another > 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's > a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. > > I've GOT to drive that track at least once. > > - Tony > > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q s=10 > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy %2c+ > Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 > then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from > http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . > > At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: > >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, > >at Laguna Seca is? > >Thanks, > >Bill > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 27 14:46:42 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 14:46:42 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20071127215049.UQCJ27415.fed1rmmtao101.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> For a "front bumper" level view that will really give you a view of the corkscrew try these helmet cam videos of 250 SuperKarts that we have on our site. The top two on this page. http://www.southwestkarters.com/?page_id=88 At 02:12 PM 11/27/2007, Gary Horstkorta wrote: >For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna >Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the >track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the approach >to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into the >turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the while >you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. > >www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and click >on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view >videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. > >Gary >62 TR4 >69 TR6 > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net >[mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of >westerneagleracing at att.net >Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM >To: Tony Drews >Cc: FOT at autox.team.net >Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > >Tony, >It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they >redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks and >you won't be able to get back on tract. >Ron Jacobs >Western Eagle Racing >-------------- Original message from Tony Drews : >-------------- > > > > According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it > > look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' > > of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at > > the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another > > 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's > > a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. > > > > I've GOT to drive that track at least once. > > > > - Tony > > > > >http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q >s=10 > > >21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy >%2c+ > > Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 > > then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from > > http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . > > > > At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, > > >at Laguna Seca is? > > >Thanks, > > >Bill > > >_______________________________________________ > > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > > >Fot mailing list > > >Fot at autox.team.net > > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From kaskas at cox.net Tue Nov 27 14:57:08 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 13:57:08 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: <00d901c83140$74e28790$3f0ec548@RW> The first time I raced there (1959) my first lap was in a 3/4 ton pickup truck and going through the corkscrew I never saw the road for about 75 yards. Whoopee. They have slowed the straight and added a couple corners since then, but a terrific place. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Horstkorta" To: ; "'Tony Drews'" Cc: Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 1:12 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna > Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the > track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the > approach > to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into > the > turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the > while > you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. > > www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and > click > on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view > videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > 69 TR6 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > westerneagleracing at att.net > Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM > To: Tony Drews > Cc: FOT at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Tony, > It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they > redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks > and > you won't be able to get back on tract. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : > -------------- > > >> According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it >> look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' >> of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at >> the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another >> 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's >> a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. >> >> I've GOT to drive that track at least once. >> >> - Tony >> >> > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q > s=10 >> > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy > %2c+ >> Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 >> then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from >> http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . >> >> At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: >> >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, >> >at Laguna Seca is? >> >Thanks, >> >Bill >> >_______________________________________________ >> >http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > >> >Fot mailing list >> >Fot at autox.team.net >> >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From greenman62 at hotmail.com Tue Nov 27 15:44:30 2007 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (greenman62 at hotmail.com) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 22:44:30 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: My instructor at an Audi Safe Driving School last year told me of a track day he spent at Laguna Seca. He forgot to turn off the "ESP" (traction control) when he first went out. When the car entered the corkscrew the ESP though the car was falling and shut everything off. I was there two years ago... amazing. Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > From: vintage.racer at comcast.net > To: westerneagleracing at att.net; tony at tonydrews.com > Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 13:12:48 -0800 > CC: FOT at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna > Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the > track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the approach > to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into the > turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the while > you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. > > www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and click > on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view > videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > 69 TR6 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > westerneagleracing at att.net > Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM > To: Tony Drews > Cc: FOT at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Tony, > It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they > redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks and > you won't be able to get back on tract. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : > -------------- > > > > According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it > > look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' > > of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at > > the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another > > 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's > > a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. > > > > I've GOT to drive that track at least once. > > > > - Tony > > > > > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q > s=10 > > > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy > %2c+ > > Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 > > then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from > > http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . > > > > At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, > > >at Laguna Seca is? > > >Thanks, > > >Bill > > >_______________________________________________ > > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > > >Fot mailing list > > >Fot at autox.team.net > > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 27 16:40:29 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:40:29 -0800 Subject: [Fot] New frame for Peyote References: Message-ID: The new frame is done. Took forever, but it's nice work. A local guy in Vancouver, Washington did the work for me. Now I've got to hand sand it all and paint it. I've decided on rattlecan--it's easy to make it pretty again when you have to do something. Powdercoat is a pain in the neck. http://www.allaluminumtour.com/?p=277 pictures here From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 27 16:04:31 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:04:31 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net><000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> <00d901c83140$74e28790$3f0ec548@RW> Message-ID: I raced there some on a motorcycle, the corkscrew is a lot less scary on a bike--you can see where you're going. First time I went around in a car I nearly freaked out--no idea where I was going. I followed a 77 year old motorcycle racer through the corkscrew once--he was on a Ducati 916 racing bike, I was on my stock 916. As the front wheels started loading after the downhill chute he rolled his front tire off the rim. I watched him go down like it was slow motion, bounced once in front of me (body only) and cleared the Armco barrier. I assumed he was either dead or his bones snapped like castanets. I pulled off and ran back to find him brushing himself off casually while he looked for his bike--it went over the armco too. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Kas Kastner Sent: Tue 11/27/2007 1:57 PM To: Gary Horstkorta; westerneagleracing at att.net; 'Tony Drews' Cc: FOT at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca The first time I raced there (1959) my first lap was in a 3/4 ton pickup truck and going through the corkscrew I never saw the road for about 75 yards. Whoopee. They have slowed the straight and added a couple corners since then, but a terrific place. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Horstkorta" To: ; "'Tony Drews'" Cc: Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 1:12 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna > Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the > track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the > approach > to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into > the > turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the > while > you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. > > www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and > click > on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view > videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > 69 TR6 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > westerneagleracing at att.net > Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM > To: Tony Drews > Cc: FOT at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Tony, > It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they > redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks > and > you won't be able to get back on tract. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : > -------------- > > >> According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it >> look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' >> of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at >> the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another >> 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's >> a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. >> >> I've GOT to drive that track at least once. >> >> - Tony >> >> > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q > s=10 >> > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy > %2c+ >> Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 >> then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from >> http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . >> >> At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: >> >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, >> >at Laguna Seca is? >> >Thanks, >> >Bill >> >_______________________________________________ >> >http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > >> >Fot mailing list >> >Fot at autox.team.net >> >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From trmarty at hotmail.com Tue Nov 27 19:23:43 2007 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 21:23:43 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Fellow FOT'r under the weather Message-ID: Ed Ceilley, one of our resident Spitfire/GT6 racers is having some health issues. Ed has been down for a little bit and is having a rough go of it while going through chemo treatments. He is not doing emails at the present time but I'm sure getting a card from his fellow Triumph racers would help lift his spirits. If you felt so inclined drop Ed a get well message at Ed Ceilley 1110 Franklin St. Cedar Falls, IA 50613 Thanks, Marty Sukey _________________________________________________________________ Your smile counts. The more smiles you share, the more we donate. Join in. www.windowslive.com/smile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_oprsmilewlhmtagline From S.Janzen at comcast.net Tue Nov 27 19:54:53 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 21:54:53 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Mocal Oil T stat Message-ID: <000801c8316a$0df91060$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> I'm thinking about putting one of these in my car in line to the oil cooler- noticed that the oil takes a long time to get up to operating temperature. Anyone have any good or bad experience with them? Always reluctant to add one more part that can fail. From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Tue Nov 27 20:15:26 2007 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 20:15:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net><000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> <00d901c83140$74e28790$3f0ec548@RW> Message-ID: <9679FEB5-3220-422E-B8A8-65489FC81D6D@earthlink.net> One of the most exciting/scary/superhuman spectacles I ever witnessed was Kenny Roberts racing against his protigi Freddie Spenser at Laguna Seca [1978?]. I was watching from the inside of turn 8B. Coming off the top of the cork-screw, Lawson had the front wheel off the ground for 100ish feet - when it hit the ground again, it was already turned counter-lock for the next turn and on down the hill he went [every lap]. Spencer wasn't quite there yet. At the infield carnival they had a sit -on-the-bike video game going [very crude by todays standards I'm sure]. Still have my "I beat Freddie Spencer at Laguna Seca" button somewhere. Greg Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 27, 2007, at 4:04 PM, Bill Babcock wrote: > I raced there some on a motorcycle, the corkscrew is a lot less > scary on a > bike--you can see where you're going. First time I went around in a > car I > nearly freaked out--no idea where I was going. I followed a 77 year > old > motorcycle racer through the corkscrew once--he was on a Ducati 916 > racing > bike, I was on my stock 916. As the front wheels started loading > after the > downhill chute he rolled his front tire off the rim. I watched him > go down > like it was slow motion, bounced once in front of me (body only) > and cleared > the Armco barrier. I assumed he was either dead or his bones > snapped like > castanets. I pulled off and ran back to find him brushing himself > off casually > while he looked for his bike--it went over the armco too. From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 27 20:29:42 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 19:29:42 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net><000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> <00d901c83140$74e28790$3f0ec548@RW> <9679FEB5-3220-422E-B8A8-65489FC81D6D@earthlink.net> Message-ID: I was there. I was also there when KR started at the back of the pack and passed everyone in three laps. -----Original Message----- From: Greg "Lunker" Hilyer [mailto:Lunkercars at earthlink.net] Sent: Tue 11/27/2007 7:15 PM To: Bill Babcock Cc: Kas Kastner; Gary Horstkorta; westerneagleracing at att.net; Tony Drews; FOT at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca One of the most exciting/scary/superhuman spectacles I ever witnessed was Kenny Roberts racing against his protigi Freddie Spenser at Laguna Seca [1978?]. I was watching from the inside of turn 8B. Coming off the top of the cork-screw, Lawson had the front wheel off the ground for 100ish feet - when it hit the ground again, it was already turned counter-lock for the next turn and on down the hill he went [every lap]. Spencer wasn't quite there yet. At the infield carnival they had a sit -on-the-bike video game going [very crude by todays standards I'm sure]. Still have my "I beat Freddie Spencer at Laguna Seca" button somewhere. Greg Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 27, 2007, at 4:04 PM, Bill Babcock wrote: > I raced there some on a motorcycle, the corkscrew is a lot less > scary on a > bike--you can see where you're going. First time I went around in a > car I > nearly freaked out--no idea where I was going. I followed a 77 year > old > motorcycle racer through the corkscrew once--he was on a Ducati 916 > racing > bike, I was on my stock 916. As the front wheels started loading > after the > downhill chute he rolled his front tire off the rim. I watched him > go down > like it was slow motion, bounced once in front of me (body only) > and cleared > the Armco barrier. I assumed he was either dead or his bones > snapped like > castanets. I pulled off and ran back to find him brushing himself > off casually > while he looked for his bike--it went over the armco too. From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Wed Nov 28 00:05:29 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 02:05:29 EST Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site Message-ID: In a message dated 11/26/2007 8:46:55 PM Pacific Standard Time, fot-request at autox.team.net writes: > Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 15:21:14 -0500 > From: Shane Ingate > Subject: Re: [Fot] High End Triumph Site > To: Friends of Triumph > Cc: igofaster at charter.net > > I have heard enough about this Chris Cancelli of PRI to recognize that he is > a scam artist of the worst kind, and a liar. There are many people on different Triumph newsgroups in the USA & the UK that have been ripped off by him. It is very simple, SEND NO MONEY, not now, not ever. Looking out for my friends on the FoT. Happy Holidays Lion From dale.oesterle at sbcglobal.net Wed Nov 28 08:48:53 2007 From: dale.oesterle at sbcglobal.net (dale oesterle) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 07:48:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] quiller Message-ID: <925387.27977.qm@web82207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Anyone know why quiller attempted to charge 800 pounds (1600 dollars) for shipping their alloy bellhousing? Oesterle From dave at microworks.net Wed Nov 28 10:12:18 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:12:18 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site Message-ID: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. >I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >service to anyone. From vintage.racer at comcast.net Wed Nov 28 10:16:59 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 09:16:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Diffs Message-ID: <000601c831e2$7cd6a1f0$7683e5d0$@racer@comcast.net> Hello: The current issue of Victory Lane Magazine, December 2007, has an excellent article on the various racing differential types written by Craig Taylor of Taylor Engineering. There is a good description of each of the seven types he covers and reasons why he thinks some are better than others. A good read if anyone is considering buying a diff for their racer. Gary 62 TR4 69 TR6 From sbarr at McCarty-Law.com Wed Nov 28 10:48:03 2007 From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com (Barr, Scott) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 11:48:03 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> References: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74890745@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods and services provided by the companies we all deal with. http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html (Does not appear that there is any entry for PRI) -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+scott.barr=mccarty-law.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+scott.barr=mccarty-law.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of David W. Riddle Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 11:12 AM To: fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. >I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >service to anyone. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From cak at dimebank.com Wed Nov 28 11:23:22 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:23:22 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <474DB21A.70307@dimebank.com> It's funny ... I have driven Laguna Seca a bunch, both in open wheel cars and sedans, and I never found the Corkscrew particularly *scary*. Challenging, yes - but I know the lineup points, and once you get them right, you're basically committed. There's plenty of runoff if you screw up. (Passing there, or being passed, is a different issue entirely) What I find scary is 6 (I guess this was turn 3 in the old config, which would have made it even scarier after the then-longest straight). Braking needs to be done before the bridge, because there's a rise at the bridge where the car gets too light to brake hard. Turn-in is almost blind. There's a dip at the apex which presses the car down nicely when you get it right - you can take the turn very fast if you're confident. But if you screw up, you could end up in Salinas. That part always gets to me! From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 28 11:27:58 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:27:58 -0800 Subject: [Fot] : Re: High End Triumph Site References: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: I don't have any experience with this guy, but in my experience even a company that gives horrible service has a few happy clients. Just one of those random things. When I read the copy on his website my bullshit detector went off loudly. That might not mean anything generally, but remember that I spent a good part of my life marketing stuff, I wrote this kind of stuff. I pick up on waffle, hype and pure BS instantly, and his site is slathered with it. My big question is: Kehin Carbs? What's with that? Individually controlled single throat carbs are a pain in the neck on an old Honda 750, never mind a car. If you're going to step that far away from real, then why not modern injectors. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 9:12 AM To: fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. >I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >service to anyone. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From budscars at msn.com Wed Nov 28 11:32:00 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (budscars at msn.com) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:32:00 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <474DB21A.70307@dimebank.com> References: <474DB21A.70307@dimebank.com> Message-ID: I went to 'Salinas' once..in about 1971 with a Lotus super 7 mounted firmly across the front of my TR4..there was no guard rail then... Racer Bud> Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:23:22 -0800> From: cak at dimebank.com> To: fot at autox.team.net> Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca> > It's funny ... I have driven Laguna Seca a bunch, both in open wheel > cars and sedans, and I never found the Corkscrew particularly *scary*. > Challenging, yes - but I know the lineup points, and once you get them > right, you're basically committed. There's plenty of runoff if you screw > up. (Passing there, or being passed, is a different issue entirely)> > What I find scary is 6 (I guess this was turn 3 in the old config, which > would have made it even scarier after the then-longest straight). > Braking needs to be done before the bridge, because there's a rise at > the bridge where the car gets too light to brake hard. Turn-in is almost > blind. There's a dip at the apex which presses the car down nicely when > you get it right - you can take the turn very fast if you're confident.> > But if you screw up, you could end up in Salinas. That part always gets > to me!> _______________________________________________> http://www.team.net/donate.html> > Fot mailing list> Fot at autox.team.net> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From REK46 at aol.com Wed Nov 28 11:45:03 2007 From: REK46 at aol.com (REK46 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 13:45:03 EST Subject: [Fot] : Re: High End Triumph Site Message-ID: I wonder if PRI was ever on " Dragon's Den ".....kevin would eat him up ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From cak at dimebank.com Wed Nov 28 12:00:25 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 11:00:25 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <474DBAC9.80006@dimebank.com> > Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could > be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods > and services provided by the companies we all deal with. > > http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html > > (Does not appear that there is any entry for PRI) Hee. There's no entry because I'd never heard of the guy. I'm collecting responses and will add something soon! From S.Janzen at comcast.net Wed Nov 28 12:27:42 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 14:27:42 -0500 Subject: [Fot] : Re: Hiigh End Triumph Site References: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: <012901c831f4$c0223e30$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> I have had good luck with their oversize manifold gaskets. However, the web site whas shut down three months for "inventory" or some other reason so I had to wait a while to re-order them. The rest of the product line is so pricey that it's beyond consideration. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "David W. Riddle" ; ; Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 1:27 PM Subject: [Fot] : Re: High End Triumph Site >I don't have any experience with this guy, but in my experience even a >company > that gives horrible service has a few happy clients. Just one of those > random > things. When I read the copy on his website my bullshit detector went off > loudly. That might not mean anything generally, but remember that I spent > a > good part of my life marketing stuff, I wrote this kind of stuff. I pick > up on > waffle, hype and pure BS instantly, and his site is slathered with it. > > My big question is: Kehin Carbs? What's with that? Individually controlled > single throat carbs are a pain in the neck on an old Honda 750, never mind > a > car. If you're going to step that far away from real, then why not modern > injectors. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. > Riddle > Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 9:12 AM > To: fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org > Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site > > This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings > with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. > > >>I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >>Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >>prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >>hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >>in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >>adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >>service to anyone. > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From srcypher at mac.com Wed Nov 28 14:49:02 2007 From: srcypher at mac.com (Scott Cypher (SpitfireRacer)) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 16:49:02 -0500 Subject: [Fot] : Re: Hiigh End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <012901c831f4$c0223e30$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> References: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> <012901c831f4$c0223e30$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: How have you contacted them/him? I have sent email and even called ( left message) about the thick intake/exhaust gasket he reportedly makes for spits, but ive never gotten a response... Thanks -S Scott Cypher SCCA # 362573 #57 HP Spitfire 1500 Spitfireracer at xsmail.com On Nov 28, 2007, at 2:27 PM, Scott Janzen wrote: > I have had good luck with their oversize manifold gaskets. However, > the web > site whas shut down three months for "inventory" or some other > reason so I > had to wait a while to re-order them. The rest of the product line > is so > pricey that it's beyond consideration. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bill Babcock" > To: "David W. Riddle" ; ; > > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 1:27 PM > Subject: [Fot] : Re: High End Triumph Site > > >> I don't have any experience with this guy, but in my experience >> even a >> company >> that gives horrible service has a few happy clients. Just one of >> those >> random >> things. When I read the copy on his website my bullshit detector >> went off >> loudly. That might not mean anything generally, but remember that I >> spent >> a >> good part of my life marketing stuff, I wrote this kind of stuff. I >> pick >> up on >> waffle, hype and pure BS instantly, and his site is slathered with >> it. >> >> My big question is: Kehin Carbs? What's with that? Individually >> controlled >> single throat carbs are a pain in the neck on an old Honda 750, >> never mind >> a >> car. If you're going to step that far away from real, then why not >> modern >> injectors. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. >> Riddle >> Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 9:12 AM >> To: fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org >> Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site >> >> This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings >> with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. >> >> >>> I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >>> Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >>> prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >>> hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >>> in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >>> adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >>> service to anyone. >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From TomD4760 at aol.com Wed Nov 28 16:33:02 2007 From: TomD4760 at aol.com (TomD4760 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 18:33:02 EST Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca website there is no information on it. Does anyone know which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Thanks, Tom Deats


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(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From cak at dimebank.com Wed Nov 28 17:04:55 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 16:04:55 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <474E0227.6060508@dimebank.com> TomD4760 at aol.com wrote: > Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions > there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, > etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there > in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca > website there is no information on it. Does anyone know > which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Depends on the event, and the time you run. There is a negotiated agreement between the track and the surrounding homeowners. It used to be that there were two or three unlimited days per year - those were used for IndyCar, a bike race and maybe the Historics. Most other days were limited to 92dB for most of the day, with slightly tighter controls before 10am. All cars must be off track by 6pm. That may all have changed, but it's going to be something like that. From budscars at msn.com Wed Nov 28 17:25:16 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (RACER BUD) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 16:25:16 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: There is an SCCA vintage race at Laguna seca april 12-13 there is an HMSA race March 15-16, including a tribute to MG..Sound restrictions are very tough at Laguna seca..early morning groups usually as low as 90dcb..Best to check with the Governing group..HMSA or San Francisco Region SCCA Racer Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: TomD4760 at aol.com To: budscars at msn.com ; cak at dimebank.com ; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca website there is no information on it. Does anyone know which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Thanks, Tom Deats ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Wed Nov 28 17:50:28 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 17:50:28 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Mikuni carbs for TR's / high end website Message-ID: <000e01c83221$d63b01c0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> After going to the site in question I was curious about the carbs they claim to use. I did some research and found two companies using Mikunis on vintage and scca cars. Wolf racing is the US importer, they use the twin two barrel setup with 44 or 50 mm in their Datsuns. Vintage Performance uses two single barrel HSR 45 flat slides. These are direct replacements for the SU's and bolt right up. They are highly coveted by the Harley crowd. After some surfing and phone calls I found the HSR's for $ 300.00 each. Vintage Performance want's $ 765.00 for the pair. If they would offer to jet them for 5000 feet I might give it a shot. http://www.v-performance.com/recent.html#mikuni Their using them on Volvo P1800's. Wolf claims to get 30 - 40% increase in HP over stock which sounds optimistic. V/P was a bit more realistic, they said it depends on the motor ( good answer ) but they are getting better results on the dyno over stock SU's on all motors. I read somewhere else the flat slides actually create more velocity and atomization. It's an interesting subject and Iv'e been a big fan of Mikunis for 30 years, their bike carbs are bullet proof. Jim G. From vintage.racer at comcast.net Wed Nov 28 17:58:32 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 16:58:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000001c83222$f6cee450$e46cacf0$@racer@comcast.net> Tom: I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County allows the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an HMSA (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage (www.sfrscca.org) in April. Gary 62 TR4 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of TomD4760 at aol.com Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca website there is no information on it. Does anyone know which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Thanks, Tom Deats


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(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Wed Nov 28 18:40:01 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 19:40:01 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <000001c83222$f6cee450$e46cacf0$%racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: <004301c83228$c3e2cb00$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> I use a 2 1/2" pipe all the way to the back with a Moroso Spiral Flow Muffler, 2 1/2 in. Inlet/2 1/2 in. Outlet. They come in stainless and regular steel. I used the MOR-94050 standard unit at around $50.00. I haven't been to a track with a sound limit to be tested but it sure took the edge off the rat-a-tat and hasn't hurt the performance. Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Horstkorta" To: ; Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 6:58 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > Tom: > > I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db > restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County > allows > the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, > Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry > bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA > vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an > HMSA > (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage > (www.sfrscca.org) in April. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > TomD4760 at aol.com > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM > To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions > there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, > etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there > in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca > website there is no information on it. Does anyone know > which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > Thanks, Tom > Deats


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Check out AOL's > list > of 2007's hottest products.
> (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) HTML> > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Wed Nov 28 19:03:24 2007 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (steve) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 18:03:24 -0800 (GMT-08:00) Subject: [Fot] Stock TR3 / 4 Lifters? Message-ID: <6629062.1196301805148.JavaMail.root@elwamui-ovcar.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Does anybody out there have a bunch of used STOCK TR3 / 4 lifters? I need to have a bunch hardness tested to complete a set. (Tested 16 so far and I think I've got 5 or 6 good ones.) ~Steve From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Wed Nov 28 19:22:29 2007 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 18:22:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <474DBAC9.80006@dimebank.com> Message-ID: <593358.78761.qm@web81202.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Group: I guess I'll add my two cents worth to the thread. I have never had a problem with Chris. I buy my TR6 steel, lightened, flywheels from him, and they are truly works of art. I've purchased six or eight of them so far and have never had an issue with shipping times, pricing, etc. He does favor the bike carbs for car use, but that's because of his background. He also uses bike valves in his head work. Perhaps he has a connection for good pricing on bike parts? Steve Smith used his stuff for years. Perhaps he can add something. Also, Brad and Susan used his method to measure and calculate for pushrod length on some custom rods, and when they got them they were the length requested, but, were the wrong length for the application. They may add something to the thread. I think we had this conversation a couple of years ago...every business has it's happy and dissappointed customers. 100% satisfaction is every businesses GOAL. My two cents. Thanks - Ed Chris Kantarjiev wrote: > Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could > be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods > and services provided by the companies we all deal with. > > http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html > > (Does not appear that there is any entry for PRI) Hee. There's no entry because I'd never heard of the guy. I'm collecting responses and will add something soon! Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From hottr6 at hotmail.com Wed Nov 28 20:03:11 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 22:03:11 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Gary Horstkorta wrote: > I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db > restriction in the past. That seems way little high to me. When I ran the Pantera there in the late 1990s it was 92db, and really hard for me to meet. The sound-level meter was on the right-hand curb just after turn 5...going up the hill. I had to be gentle on the throttle until just past the bridge. Thats OK, everyone else except Viper drivers also had to modulate the throttle for the same reason. The corkscrew was fun but ultimately not really satisfying. Turn 6 was my fave corner, because I could hit it almost without lifting. Corners 9-10 I disliked intensely...I guess I don't like going downhill - I've spent too much time at hillclimbs. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Share life as it happens with the new Windows Live.Download today it's FREE! http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_sharelife_112007 From hottr6 at hotmail.com Wed Nov 28 20:14:59 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 22:14:59 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could > be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods > and services provided by the companies we all deal with. > > http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html Just like eBay feedback! Over the years, I have dealt with almost every Triumph TR vendor in the US and UK and I dare say that ALL of them (with the exception of PRI) have provided exemplary and friendly service. Thinking about Ted S, Uncle Jack, Richard G, Ken G, these guys have helped me as if I was an old friend. One of the main reasons I have stayed with Triumphs have been the terrific people I have met along the way, and the vendors have made that experience very sweet indeed. Except PRI. Grrrrrrr. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newways_112007 From kaskas at cox.net Wed Nov 28 21:36:20 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 20:36:20 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <00f001c83241$63feb8c0$3f0ec548@RW> > When fighting the decibel number remember to simply put a bend on the end > of your tail pipe and point it the OTHER way from the test position. > Don't what that is? Then find out? Huge difference. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "BOB KRAMER" > To: "Gary Horstkorta" ; ; > > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 5:40 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > >>I use a 2 1/2" pipe all the way to the back with a Moroso Spiral Flow >> Muffler, 2 1/2 in. Inlet/2 1/2 in. Outlet. They come in stainless and >> regular steel. I used the MOR-94050 standard unit at around $50.00. I >> haven't been to a track with a sound limit to be tested but it sure took >> the >> edge off the rat-a-tat and hasn't hurt the performance. >> >> Bob Kramer >> rkramer3 at austin.rr.com >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Gary Horstkorta" >> To: ; >> Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 6:58 PM >> Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca >> >> >>> Tom: >>> >>> I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db >>> restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County >>> allows >>> the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, >>> Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry >>> bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA >>> vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an >>> HMSA >>> (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage >>> (www.sfrscca.org) in April. >>> >>> Gary >>> 62 TR4 >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net >>> [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf >>> Of >>> TomD4760 at aol.com >>> Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM >>> To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net >>> Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca >>> >>> Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions >>> there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, >>> etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there >>> in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca >>> website there is no information on it. Does anyone know >>> which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. >>> Thanks, Tom >>> Deats


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Check out >>> AOL's >>> list >>> of 2007's hottest products.
>>> (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)>> HTML> >>> Fot mailing list >>> Fot at autox.team.net >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>> _______________________________________________ >>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> >>> Fot mailing list >>> Fot at autox.team.net >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 28 21:43:22 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 20:43:22 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Mikuni carbs for TR's / high end website References: <000e01c83221$d63b01c0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: Bullet proof, but simple. I love Mikuni carbs too--I understand them forwards and backwards, but I'd never put them on a car, other than the Mikuni Solex weber look-alikes. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of James Gray Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 4:50 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Mikuni carbs for TR's / high end website After going to the site in question I was curious about the carbs they claim to use. I did some research and found two companies using Mikunis on vintage and scca cars. Wolf racing is the US importer, they use the twin two barrel setup with 44 or 50 mm in their Datsuns. Vintage Performance uses two single barrel HSR 45 flat slides. These are direct replacements for the SU's and bolt right up. They are highly coveted by the Harley crowd. After some surfing and phone calls I found the HSR's for $ 300.00 each. Vintage Performance want's $ 765.00 for the pair. If they would offer to jet them for 5000 feet I might give it a shot. http://www.v-performance.com/recent.html#mikuni Their using them on Volvo P1800's. Wolf claims to get 30 - 40% increase in HP over stock which sounds optimistic. V/P was a bit more realistic, they said it depends on the motor ( good answer ) but they are getting better results on the dyno over stock SU's on all motors. I read somewhere else the flat slides actually create more velocity and atomization. It's an interesting subject and Iv'e been a big fan of Mikunis for 30 years, their bike carbs are bullet proof. Jim G. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 28 21:46:11 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 20:46:11 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <000001c83222$f6cee450$e46cacf0$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound metering. I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend pointing at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Gary Horstkorta Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 4:58 PM To: TomD4760 at aol.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Tom: I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County allows the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an HMSA (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage (www.sfrscca.org) in April. Gary 62 TR4 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of TomD4760 at aol.com Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca website there is no information on it. Does anyone know which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Thanks, Tom Deats


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Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 28 21:57:04 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 20:57:04 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: Turn nine is really the best turn at Laguna IMHO. Very difficult, very technical, and costs you a lot when you screw it up. Late, late turn in. Odd for such a slight kink but it's so off camber that an early turn in buys you a spin or worse. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Shane Ingate Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 7:03 PM To: vintage.racer at comcast.net Cc: Friends of Triumph Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Gary Horstkorta wrote: > I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db > restriction in the past. That seems way little high to me. When I ran the Pantera there in the late 1990s it was 92db, and really hard for me to meet. The sound-level meter was on the right-hand curb just after turn 5...going up the hill. I had to be gentle on the throttle until just past the bridge. Thats OK, everyone else except Viper drivers also had to modulate the throttle for the same reason. The corkscrew was fun but ultimately not really satisfying. Turn 6 was my fave corner, because I could hit it almost without lifting. Corners 9-10 I disliked intensely...I guess I don't like going downhill - I've spent too much time at hillclimbs. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Share life as it happens with the new Windows Live.Download today it's FREE! http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_sharelife_112007 Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wensley_Tr at comcast.net Thu Nov 29 06:13:54 2007 From: wensley_Tr at comcast.net (Craig) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:13:54 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <474E0227.6060508@dimebank.com> Message-ID: <001301c83289$b19db430$0200a8c0@Desktop> If you let the homeowners tell you what to do When you were there first Then you can say goodbye to the track Craig ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Kantarjiev" To: Cc: Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 7:04 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > TomD4760 at aol.com wrote: >> Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions >> there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, >> etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there >> in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca >> website there is no information on it. Does anyone know >> which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > > Depends on the event, and the time you run. > > There is a negotiated agreement between the track and the surrounding > homeowners. It used to be that there were two or three unlimited days > per year - those were used for IndyCar, a bike race and maybe the > Historics. Most other days were limited to 92dB for most of the day, > with slightly tighter controls before 10am. All cars must be off track > by 6pm. > > That may all have changed, but it's going to be something like that. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rhlamp at babcock.com Thu Nov 29 06:41:56 2007 From: rhlamp at babcock.com (Lamp, Randy H) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:41:56 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F8FF44C413A3A43880E522C56BA44218BBA55@barbpo3.bwes.net> The first time I talked to PRI ,I was pretty impressed. The guy sounded like he really new his stuff. Most of the products on his web site were pretty expensive, but I was excited to have found a vendor that had trick stuff for my GT6. (not and easy thing to find). So I purchased a few small items, as a test, because a few people warned me to stay away. I was pleased with the quality of the items ,but not so happy about the high cost associated with shipping and handling. I then met a local Triumph guy who was involved in a law sit with PRI. This was just about the same time that I decided to order a set of his (expensive)alloy shocks. When I mentioned the pending law suit to PRI, he went ballistic on me and accused me of being involved with the guy ,just because we happen to live near each other. I hardly knew the guy, but PRI told me he wouldn't sell me anything ever again! I guess you are not suppose to ask certain questions, when your about to lay out large sums of money for stuff to put on your toys. He lost a potentially good customer, who can't hardly resist buying trick parts for Triumphs. Canley Classics anyone? R. Lamp -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rhlamp=babcock.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rhlamp=babcock.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Shane Ingate Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 10:15 PM To: Friends of Triumph Subject: Re: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site > Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could > be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods > and services provided by the companies we all deal with. > > http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html Just like eBay feedback! Over the years, I have dealt with almost every Triumph TR vendor in the US and UK and I dare say that ALL of them (with the exception of PRI) have provided exemplary and friendly service. Thinking about Ted S, Uncle Jack, Richard G, Ken G, these guys have helped me as if I was an old friend. One of the main reasons I have stayed with Triumphs have been the terrific people I have met along the way, and the vendors have made that experience very sweet indeed. Except PRI. Grrrrrrr. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newways_112 007 Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ----------------------------------------- This message is intended only for the individual or entity to which it is addressed and contains information that is proprietary to The Babcock & Wilcox Company and/or its affiliates, or may be otherwise confidential. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or the employee agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete this message from your computer. Thank you. From spitlist at cox.net Thu Nov 29 07:18:32 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:18:32 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <474E0227.6060508@dimebank.com> <001301c83289$b19db430$0200a8c0@Desktop> Message-ID: <000d01c83292$b9530960$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Same scenario as people who buy cheap houing by an airport and then complain about the noise. Joe C. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Craig" To: "Chris Kantarjiev" ; Cc: Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:13 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > If you let the homeowners tell you what to do > When you were there first > Then you can say goodbye to the track > Craig > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chris Kantarjiev" > To: > Cc: > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 7:04 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > > TomD4760 at aol.com wrote: > >> Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions > >> there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, > >> etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there > >> in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca > >> website there is no information on it. Does anyone know > >> which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > > > > Depends on the event, and the time you run. > > > > There is a negotiated agreement between the track and the surrounding > > homeowners. It used to be that there were two or three unlimited days > > per year - those were used for IndyCar, a bike race and maybe the > > Historics. Most other days were limited to 92dB for most of the day, > > with slightly tighter controls before 10am. All cars must be off track > > by 6pm. > > > > That may all have changed, but it's going to be something like that. > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillDentin at aol.com Thu Nov 29 08:05:12 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 10:05:12 EST Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: In a message dated 11/28/2007 10:53:35 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I > suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound > metering. > I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend > pointing > at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler > > > A 4" Cherry Bomb in the muffler? Hell...they'll hear that in Palm Springs. Remember when the five minute warning was a Cherry Bomb? Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From BillDentin at aol.com Thu Nov 29 08:05:12 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 10:05:12 EST Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: In a message dated 11/28/2007 10:53:35 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I > suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound > metering. > I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend > pointing > at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler > > > A 4" Cherry Bomb in the muffler? Hell...they'll hear that in Palm Springs. Remember when the five minute warning was a Cherry Bomb? Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From spitlist at cox.net Thu Nov 29 08:29:26 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:29:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: <002601c8329c$a0d41640$2d02a8c0@Belkin> With all this talk about noise and mufflers, it reminds me that I have a Super Trap muffler that needs a good home. It is 18" long and has a 3" input. I was using it as a side pipe on my Honda Powered Spit until I converted the car to street legality. I now have a Corvette style side pipe and no longer need the Super Trap. I have a number of extra discs for it so you can tune it from very loud to very quiet. I realize that most Triupms have smaler pipes than 3" but this is easily handled by a step-down adapter. Anyone who is interested, please contact me off list at spitlist at cox.net. Price is negotiable. Regards, Joe C. From John.Reed at wilson.com Thu Nov 29 08:25:02 2007 From: John.Reed at wilson.com (John.Reed at wilson.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:25:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I remember the five minute canon at RA. It would recoil two feet!! Regards, John Reed Staff Photographer Wilson Sporting Goods Co. 8750 W Bryn Mawr Ave, Chicago, Illinois 60631, USA Tel. + 1.773.714.6895, fax +1.773.714.4585 John.Reed at wilson.com www.wilson.com www.amersports.com Please note that effective immediately, my e-mail , phone number and street address have changed. Please update your files accordingly. BillDentin at aol.com Sent by: fot-bounces+john.reed=wilson.com at autox.team.net 11/29/07 07:05 AM To BillB at bnj.com, vintage.racer at comcast.net, TomD4760 at aol.com, fot at autox.team.net cc Subject Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca In a message dated 11/28/2007 10:53:35 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I > suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound > metering. > I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend > pointing > at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler > > > A 4" Cherry Bomb in the muffler? Hell...they'll hear that in Palm Springs. Remember when the five minute warning was a Cherry Bomb? Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot This e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 29 08:43:05 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:43:05 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <474E0227.6060508@dimebank.com> <001301c83289$b19db430$0200a8c0@Desktop> Message-ID: Interesting idea, and I certainly don't think it should work any other way, but it does. Ultimately even the most altruistic-seeming politicians and the regulators they appoint respond to money or votes. Nothing else. The ones who don't are back doing what they did before they became politicians. I know that sounds cynical, but it's obviously true as well. Tracks don't have a lot of votes, unless someone works hard on their behalf to garner and organize support. Pissed off homeowners are an automatic vote block that a politician can harvest by "reasonable"actions like noise constraints, or shutting down the track. End of sad story. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Craig Sent: Thu 11/29/2007 5:13 AM To: Chris Kantarjiev; TomD4760 at aol.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca If you let the homeowners tell you what to do When you were there first Then you can say goodbye to the track Craig ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Kantarjiev" To: Cc: Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 7:04 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > TomD4760 at aol.com wrote: >> Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions >> there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, >> etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there >> in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca >> website there is no information on it. Does anyone know >> which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > > Depends on the event, and the time you run. > > There is a negotiated agreement between the track and the surrounding > homeowners. It used to be that there were two or three unlimited days > per year - those were used for IndyCar, a bike race and maybe the > Historics. Most other days were limited to 92dB for most of the day, > with slightly tighter controls before 10am. All cars must be off track > by 6pm. > > That may all have changed, but it's going to be something like that. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 29 08:43:47 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:43:47 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: That reminds me, I have a massive stash of completely illegal (in Oregon) fireworks in Nero accumulated during my pass through the lunatic central states where every third kid must be nicknamed "stumpy". I'd better do something constructive with them before Nero does something dramatic and loud. -----Original Message----- From: BillDentin at aol.com [mailto:BillDentin at aol.com] Sent: Thu 11/29/2007 7:05 AM To: Bill Babcock; vintage.racer at comcast.net; TomD4760 at aol.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca In a message dated 11/28/2007 10:53:35 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I > suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound > metering. > I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend > pointing > at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler > > > A 4" Cherry Bomb in the muffler? Hell...they'll hear that in Palm Springs. Remember when the five minute warning was a Cherry Bomb? Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From BillDentin at aol.com Thu Nov 29 09:06:20 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 11:06:20 EST Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: In a message dated 11/29/2007 9:45:56 AM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > Interesting idea, and I certainly don't think it should work any other way, > but it does. Ultimately even the most altruistic-seeming politicians and the > regulators they appoint respond to money or votes. Nothing else. The ones > who > don't are back doing what they did before they became politicians. I know > that > sounds cynical, but it's obviously true as well. > > Tracks don't have a lot of votes, unless someone works hard on their behalf > to > garner and organize support. Pissed off homeowners are an automatic vote > block > that a politician can harvest by "reasonable"actions like noise constraints, > or shutting down the track. > > End of sad story. > Bill... You, and many others on the FOT list, will recall Bob Wismer's impressive monument at Road America. Originally that monument was to be placed at Blackhawk Farms Raceway, where most of Wismer's Sports 2000 races were run. But at the time Blackhawk Farms was on VERY thin ice. In spite of the track's considerable efforts to be a good neighbor, locals were involved in an effort to get it shut down (noise and nuisance). All indications suggested they would be successful. Then the racers got involved in a letter writing effort. They pointed out that, in fact, Blackhawk Farms was a little jewel in a pretty bleak community. Every week end considerable dollars from outside the community flowed into the economy. Copies were sent to local businesses, and in particular hotels, restaurants, etc. The problem went away. Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From westerneagleracing at att.net Thu Nov 29 09:49:49 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 16:49:49 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <112920071649.24937.474EEDAD000164470000616922218865869B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Tom: The sound station is very visable and is on the outside of the track. One trick is to have your exhaust angled to the inside rather than the outside of the track. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from "Gary Horstkorta" : -------------- > Tom: > > I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db > restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County allows > the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, > Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry > bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA > vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an HMSA > (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage > (www.sfrscca.org) in April. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > TomD4760 at aol.com > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM > To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions > there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, > etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there > in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca > website there is no information on it. Does anyone know > which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > Thanks, Tom > Deats ************************************** Check out AOL's > list > of 2007's hottest products. > (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)> HTML> > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spreiss at verizon.net Wed Nov 28 18:04:00 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 12:04:00 +1100 Subject: [Fot] odd wire wheel Message-ID: <005a01c83223$ba7f53d0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Does anyone know about an odd 4 x 15 x 48 spoke wire wheel that is center laced like the later 60 spoke version? I have one of these, and would like to obtain a match for it. It has about 1/2" less backspacing than the standard, resulting in a wider track and an exaggerated dish that looks great on the rear of my '56 "period prep" TR3 . Steve Preiss From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 29 11:04:18 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 10:04:18 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: My point exactly. Portland International Raceway is always under some kind of fire. It's a city park, and every so often some people who live nearby get a councilman to explore closing it down "can't something more productive be done with that land" or some developer starts tossing money and ideas around. Only one thing stops it--an active group of people who demonstrate clearly that it's a third rail. In fact you don't die just from touching PIR, you can die from talking about touching it. Racetracks and people who care about them should build that group now, not when they need it. They need to be ready to go before any goofy ideas gather momentum. It's easy to crush them when they're small. They also need to demonstrate their power conclusively at least once. Toss some boob out of office, and make sure everyone knows why it happened. Help somebody that's a friend of the track get elected. It's a good lesson for the rest of them. You might gather from my choice of words that I'm a little passionate about this. -----Original Message----- From: BillDentin at aol.com [mailto:BillDentin at aol.com] Sent: Thu 11/29/2007 8:06 AM To: Bill Babcock Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca In a message dated 11/29/2007 9:45:56 AM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > Interesting idea, and I certainly don't think it should work any other way, > but it does. Ultimately even the most altruistic-seeming politicians and the > regulators they appoint respond to money or votes. Nothing else. The ones > who > don't are back doing what they did before they became politicians. I know > that > sounds cynical, but it's obviously true as well. > > Tracks don't have a lot of votes, unless someone works hard on their behalf > to > garner and organize support. Pissed off homeowners are an automatic vote > block > that a politician can harvest by "reasonable"actions like noise constraints, > or shutting down the track. > > End of sad story. > Bill... You, and many others on the FOT list, will recall Bob Wismer's impressive monument at Road America. Originally that monument was to be placed at Blackhawk Farms Raceway, where most of Wismer's Sports 2000 races were run. But at the time Blackhawk Farms was on VERY thin ice. In spite of the track's considerable efforts to be a good neighbor, locals were involved in an effort to get it shut down (noise and nuisance). All indications suggested they would be successful. Then the racers got involved in a letter writing effort. They pointed out that, in fact, Blackhawk Farms was a little jewel in a pretty bleak community. Every week end considerable dollars from outside the community flowed into the economy. Copies were sent to local businesses, and in particular hotels, restaurants, etc. The problem went away. Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From wgrosenbach at juno.com Thu Nov 29 13:17:55 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 13:17:55 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of $1 Billion since opening. As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found a steeper drop in the USA. Bill From bownes at seiri.com Thu Nov 29 13:40:13 2007 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 15:40:13 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> References: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ NHIS, but those are both uphill... On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of > $1 Billion since opening. > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found > a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From westerneagleracing at att.net Thu Nov 29 15:30:10 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 22:30:10 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <112920072230.16523.474F3D72000D58E10000408B22230682229B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Bill: I agree. When you walk the track prior to a race try walking up the corkscrew! Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from William G Rosenbach : -------------- > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of > $1 Billion since opening. > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found > a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From cwn.fot at cwnicholls.net Thu Nov 29 15:43:23 2007 From: cwn.fot at cwnicholls.net (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:43:23 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> References: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: <009201c832d9$41c30110$1342a8c0@semperon3400> How about the downhill under the bridge at Road Atlanta ? Seek and ye shall find. Clark -----Original Message----- Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found a steeper drop in the USA. Bill From kaskas at cox.net Thu Nov 29 15:50:42 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 14:50:42 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> <009201c832d9$41c30110$1342a8c0@semperon3400> Message-ID: <00bb01c832da$45714690$3f0ec548@RW> It is not the total drop that is stimulating, but the drop over the shortest distance, that is where the "corkscrew" is a winner most times. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clark W. Nicholls" To: "'William G Rosenbach'" ; Cc: Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 2:43 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > How about the downhill under the bridge at Road Atlanta ? > Seek and ye shall find. > Clark > > -----Original Message----- > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. > I have not yet found a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From westerneagleracing at att.net Thu Nov 29 16:28:50 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 23:28:50 +0000 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: <112920072328.6999.474F4B31000C9B4000001B5722230704929B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Fot: The Laguna Seca thread has generated as much interest as anything I've seen on the FOT. All of you vintage guy and girls why don't we plan something for the HMSA race in March. Maybe a sort of west coast version of next years Watkins Glen (probably no Kas trophy). The fun thing about a lot TR's would be the fact that the race is a tribute to MG! I am copying Chris at HMSA to get his response. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing From wgrosenbach at juno.com Thu Nov 29 16:29:12 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 16:29:12 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <20071129.162912.2416.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> I've got the bridge to the tower at 7.9%. On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:43:23 -0500 "Clark W. Nicholls" writes: > How about the downhill under the bridge at Road Atlanta ? > Seek and ye shall find. > Clark > > -----Original Message----- > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. > I have not yet found a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill From macdonaldp at rogers.com Thu Nov 29 16:48:00 2007 From: macdonaldp at rogers.com (Paul MacDonald) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:48:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff according to Bill Babcock. Paul -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of robert bownes Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM To: William G Rosenbach Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ NHIS, but those are both uphill... On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of > $1 Billion since opening. > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found > a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From kaskas at cox.net Thu Nov 29 16:55:51 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 15:55:51 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: <00cd01c832e3$5f7a6180$3f0ec548@RW> Mosport is like falling down a very steep hill, Laguna is like falling out a window. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul MacDonald" To: "robert bownes" ; "William G Rosenbach" Cc: ; Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 3:48 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca >I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff according > to Bill Babcock. > > Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of > robert bownes > Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM > To: William G Rosenbach > Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ > NHIS, but those are both uphill... > > > On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: >> >> Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the >> largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of >> $1 Billion since opening. >> >> As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I >> base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming >> there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. >> Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found >> a steeper drop in the USA. >> Bill >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wgrosenbach at juno.com Thu Nov 29 17:04:02 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:04:02 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <20071129.170402.2416.4.wgrosenbach@juno.com> I've been using Google Earth to look for this stuff. I'm confident it is NOT absolutely dead on accurate. At Mosport, I found 181 feet elevation change split between opposite corners of the track. What corners have the drops, so I can go back and look closer. Bill On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:48:00 -0500 "Paul MacDonald" writes: > I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff > according > to Bill Babcock. > > Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf > Of > robert bownes > Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM > To: William G Rosenbach > Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the > bowl @ > NHIS, but those are both uphill... > > > On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place > are the > > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in > excess of > > $1 Billion since opening. > > > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 > ft. I > > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, > assuming > > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between > apexes. > > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet > found > > a steeper drop in the USA. > > Bill > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From macdonaldp at rogers.com Thu Nov 29 17:39:41 2007 From: macdonaldp at rogers.com (Paul MacDonald) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 19:39:41 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071129.170402.2416.4.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: Here is the map of Mospoort http://www.mosport.com/trackmap.htm Corner 2 falls off quickly into a gully then rises up to corner 3. The back straight is uphill too, starting at the hairpin which is itself quite steep. Paul -----Original Message----- From: William G Rosenbach [mailto:wgrosenbach at juno.com] Sent: November 29, 2007 7:04 PM To: macdonaldp at rogers.com Cc: bownes at seiri.com; BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca I've been using Google Earth to look for this stuff. I'm confident it is NOT absolutely dead on accurate. At Mosport, I found 181 feet elevation change split between opposite corners of the track. What corners have the drops, so I can go back and look closer. Bill On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:48:00 -0500 "Paul MacDonald" writes: > I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff > according > to Bill Babcock. > > Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf > Of > robert bownes > Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM > To: William G Rosenbach > Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the > bowl @ > NHIS, but those are both uphill... > > > On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place > are the > > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in > excess of > > $1 Billion since opening. > > > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 > ft. I > > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, > assuming > > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between > apexes. > > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet > found > > a steeper drop in the USA. > > Bill > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From cak at dimebank.com Thu Nov 29 17:42:56 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 16:42:56 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <474F5C90.3060206@dimebank.com> > I agree. When you walk the track prior to a race try walking up the corkscrew! A fellow SCCA corner worker once told me that he was racing MGs in the 50s when the track first opened. He claims that the track was designed to be run clockwise, but the TDs couldn't get up the corkscrew ... so they reversed the sense of the track. I've never tried to verify this, but it's a great story! From yellow-green at sbcglobal.net Thu Nov 29 18:51:23 2007 From: yellow-green at sbcglobal.net (Dennis DeLap) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:51:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] TR6 rear hubs Message-ID: <883765.25532.qm@web81713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Amici - I have a question for those who are racing a TR4A - TR6. What have you done to make the rear axle/hubs safe? Upgrades, modifications, etc. Thanks Dennis DeLap From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 29 19:31:44 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:31:44 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: Laguna Seca is steeper but it's over in a heartbeat. Turn three at Mosport drops, and drops, and drops. The hairpin is probably steeper than the corskscrew, but it's uphill and very short. You can't walk up it. -----Original Message----- From: Paul MacDonald [mailto:macdonaldp at rogers.com] Sent: Thu 11/29/2007 3:48 PM To: robert bownes; William G Rosenbach Cc: Bill Babcock; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] Laguna Seca I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff according to Bill Babcock. Paul -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of robert bownes Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM To: William G Rosenbach Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ NHIS, but those are both uphill... On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of > $1 Billion since opening. > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found > a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From RYoung at navcomtech.com Thu Nov 29 19:42:53 2007 From: RYoung at navcomtech.com (Young Randall) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:42:53 -0800 Subject: [Fot] odd wire wheel In-Reply-To: <005a01c83223$ba7f53d0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> References: <005a01c83223$ba7f53d0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: > Does anyone know about an odd 4 x 15 x 48 spoke wire wheel > that is center > laced like the later 60 spoke version? Just a WAG, but looking at the BWW website, I see a 15x4x48 wheel listed for a Lotus Elite. Could this be it ? http://www.seanet.com/~rsfehr/ELITE11.jpg http://www.sussexsportscars.co.uk/picture.php?stock_id=271&picnum=1 Randall fdpnmailgwapp3.dpn.deere.com made the following annotations --------------------------------------------------------------------- CONFIDENTIALITY. This electronic mail and any files transmitted with it may contain information proprietary to NavCom Technology, Inc., or one of its affiliates, and are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed, shall be maintained in confidence and not disclosed to third parties without the written consent of the sender. If you are not the intended recipient or the person responsible for delivering the electronic mail to the intended recipient, be advised that you have received this electronic mail in error and that any use, dissemination, forwarding, printing, or copying of this electronic mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this electronic mail in error, please immediately notify the sender by return mail. --------------------------------------------------------------------- From rdavis4 at cfl.rr.com Thu Nov 29 19:50:44 2007 From: rdavis4 at cfl.rr.com (Bob) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 21:50:44 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: <009801c832fb$cdfba3e0$0201a8c0@VALUEDA4DE119D> VIR has several very nice elevation changes with one that is up hill and very blind until you crest over the top. And then there is also a down hill cork screw. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul MacDonald" To: "robert bownes" ; "William G Rosenbach" Cc: ; Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:48 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca >I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff according > to Bill Babcock. > > Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of > robert bownes > Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM > To: William G Rosenbach > Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ > NHIS, but those are both uphill... > > > On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: >> >> Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the >> largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of >> $1 Billion since opening. >> >> As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I >> base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming >> there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. >> Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found >> a steeper drop in the USA. >> Bill >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From malaboge at aol.com Thu Nov 29 21:54:26 2007 From: malaboge at aol.com (malaboge at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 23:54:26 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR6 rear hubs In-Reply-To: <883765.25532.qm@web81713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <883765.25532.qm@web81713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CA012437D9A5C9-65C-8988@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> Dennis- No matter what you do, the stock outer axle is the big problem...it will break! I run a basically unbreakable chevy setup.? A corvair outer axle drilled for a TR lug pattern, with a Corvair hub assembly. Cut off all the protrusions on the Corvair hub assembly so it will fit into the TR trailing arm, and weld on a flange to mount onto the TR trailing arm.? Use a GM ujoint and cut down one side so as to mount to the Corvair stub axle on one side and the TR sliding axle on the other. Actually much easier than it sounds. Drivin the?Chevumph...Triolet? ????????? Nick in NorCal -----Original Message----- From: Dennis DeLap To: FOT Sent: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 5:51 pm Subject: [Fot] TR6 rear hubs Amici - I have a question for those who are racing a TR4A - TR6. What have you done to make the rear axle/hubs safe? Upgrades, modifications, etc. Thanks Dennis DeLap Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 From gasket.works at verizon.net Fri Nov 30 10:56:29 2007 From: gasket.works at verizon.net (Gasket Works USA) Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 11:56:29 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Fot] gas welding with H2/02? Message-ID: <5857257.12844641196445389764.JavaMail.root@vms124.mailsrvcs.net> anyone have exp with this ? reply off line (email above). Mordy M.N.Dunst Gasket Works USA, LLC gmt-8 Pacific time 626.358.1616 voice 626.628.3777 fax From gasket.works at verizon.net Fri Nov 30 10:56:19 2007 From: gasket.works at verizon.net (Gasket Works USA) Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 11:56:19 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Fot] gas welding with H2/02? Message-ID: <5470385.12844561196445379329.JavaMail.root@vms124.mailsrvcs.net> anyone have exp with this ? reply off line (email above). Mordy M.N.Dunst Gasket Works USA, LLC gmt-8 Pacific time 626.358.1616 voice 626.628.3777 fax From elkhorn at core.com Fri Nov 30 14:51:03 2007 From: elkhorn at core.com (David Wingett) Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 16:51:03 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR6 / Corvair hubs Message-ID: <001b01c8339b$1a95ee00$0100a8c0@elkhorn> FOT, It's nice to know I had a small part in keeping a few Triumphs out on the track. I haven't made any in a few years now. I've had many requests but it got to be just too big a project. I do have a couple sets of the Alum. hubs I've been saving as spares for my own racing habit. For those that have or are considering Corvair axles this is the major part you need. Sorry but when they are gone I wont be making any more. Best to contact me off line Dave Wingett From bob at CoanPro.com Fri Nov 30 20:59:07 2007 From: bob at CoanPro.com (Bob Coan) Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 19:59:07 -0800 Subject: [Fot] SCCA or Vintage Spitfire for sale Message-ID: <001101c833ce$866f9bc0$934ed340$@com> Hey everyone, I've decided to sell this beautiful SCCA HP ready Spitfire along with a nice stock of spare parts. My Dad and I hoped to make it to the runoffs but its does not look like we will be doing that anytime soon, so instead of letting this car sit in storage, I'll find someone that wants to put it on the track. It could easily be converted to Vintage. Take a look at http://picasaweb.google.com/thinkfreerealtyphotos/SCCAHPTriumphSpitfire The guy I bought it from owned a racing supply business and put over 25k into the car and only ran it a few times. The car has been totally race prepared with a brand new 1147 race motor built by Acme Racing of Spartanburg NC, rebuilt transmission, rebuilt rear end, everything including lug bolts and studs have been rebuilt. The car has Mark Williams axels, modified carbs and Electromotive crank trigger ignition. Gary Johnson of E. TN Race Prep did the final assembly...including front coil over's, new front and rear disc brakes, Electromotive crank trigger ignition and more. I just put the car on e-bay for $5000. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem &sspagename=STRK%3AMESCX%3AIT&viewitem=&item=220178787790&_trksid=p3984.cSCH EDULE.m314.lVI I also have a the enclosed trailer and matching Dodge Ram truck if someone wanted a turnkey setup. All going for good prices. I need to clear out my storage shop over the next 3 weeks, so please forward this info to anyone you think might be interested. It's all located in Tustin, California, which is Southern California near Disneyland. Bob Coan 714-566-5138 From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Nov 1 10:56:50 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 12:56:50 EDT Subject: [Fot] 87mm Pistons wanted Message-ID: List, I am looking for a very good set of new or used pistons for my Wet Sleeved Wonder. Perhaps someone has a set on the shelf with no planned usage. Thanks, Joe Alexander From dave at microworks.net Thu Nov 1 11:32:20 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2007 10:32:20 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Max Mosley confirms he is a fool Message-ID: <20071101173620.MGVT22006.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> First Max is saying that Sir Jackie is crazy and now after seeing one of the closest fought F1 Championships in years and Max Mosley is complaining that Lewis Hamilton may be bad for the sport because he is too good. http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=41215 What an idiot. From markvaden at gmail.com Thu Nov 1 14:07:29 2007 From: markvaden at gmail.com (Mark Vaden) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 13:07:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Hi All, I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion on a tr4? I see that revington tr has a bolt on one, but it is really pricey. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks in advance, Mark From spitlist at cox.net Thu Nov 1 14:24:49 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 13:24:49 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <00e301c81cc5$40736ae0$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Not a TR4, but I did a two circuit setup on my Spit using two single circuit master cylinder tied together using the Tilton Balance bar. One side works the front disks and the other side works the rear drums. Works pretty well and wasn't terribly expensive to implement. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Vaden" To: Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 1:07 PM Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Hi All, > > I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, > and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion > on a tr4? I see that revington tr has a bolt on one, but it is really > pricey. Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > Thanks in advance, > Mark > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Fubog1 at aol.com Thu Nov 1 14:19:03 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:19:03 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/1/2007 4:07:44 PM Eastern Daylight Time, markvaden at gmail.com writes: I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion on a tr4? Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling cylinders, the same way it has been done for decades. I don't think there is such a thing as a bolt-in kit for these cars. Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From tr5racer at btinternet.com Thu Nov 1 14:27:43 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 20:27:43 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Max Mosley confirms he is a fool Message-ID: <704462.51653.qm@web86601.mail.ird.yahoo.com> What do you expect from someone whose father was the founder of the British Fascist party and in whose ranks were the notorious 'blackshirts' and who was interned for most of the Second World War as he supported Hitler and his policies. Mike Hughes --------------------------------- Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now. From henry at henryfrye.com Thu Nov 1 14:36:36 2007 From: henry at henryfrye.com (Henry Frye) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:36:36 -0400 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB4F@server.Triumph.local> > Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling > cylinders, the same way it has been done for decades. Of course Glen is right on the money. The only twist on the plot I have seen is taking a TR6 dual circuit master cylinder and a TR6 pedal box and fit it to the TR4. That's how my car was done, sans booster, and it stops fine. High pedal effort, but I like it that way. Front to rear bias can be changed with different sized rear wheel cylinders and/or messing around with the pad and shoe linings. From markvaden at gmail.com Thu Nov 1 14:36:51 2007 From: markvaden at gmail.com (Mark Vaden) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 13:36:51 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <285b8a860711011336o44ed58cbu2b52d806989d2dea@mail.gmail.com> > Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling cylinders, the same > way it has been done for decade Do I use the same bore cylinders? Meaning to I just use two stock tr4 brake master cylinders? -Mark From Fubog1 at aol.com Thu Nov 1 14:47:02 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:47:02 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/1/2007 4:37:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time, markvaden at gmail.com writes: Do I use the same bore cylinders? Meaning to I just use two stock tr4 brake master cylinders? Depending on what brakes you have, friction material, driver preference, etc you can play around with cylinder sizes .625, .70, .750 etc, & pedal ratio, to get the best setup. There's a good chance that you will wind up with the same diameter cylinders without extreme bias adjustment. Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Nov 1 14:48:31 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 15:48:31 -0500 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: <285b8a860711011336o44ed58cbu2b52d806989d2dea@mail.gmail.com> References: <285b8a860711011336o44ed58cbu2b52d806989d2dea@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B3522F9@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I have one of the UK versions with a balance bar, I think it came from Racetorations, maybe TR Enterprises. It came with a remote resorvoir for the brakes like a TR3 so I switched out the M/C's for 3/4" Wildwood with the intregal caps like the CMC. Those cylinders are available for about $50 each from places like Speedway Motors. I don't know why this is true, but my virtually identical Girling CMC clouds up the fluid relatively quickly, but the Wildwoods stay crystal clear. I had the TR6 set-up on my old car and it worked fine. I think the TR4 bulkhead area where the booster mounts was re-inforced when they went to the TR25/TR6. I remember some extra flexing I worried about metal fatigue but never did anything about it. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark Vaden Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 3:37 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling cylinders, the > same way it has been done for decade Do I use the same bore cylinders? Meaning to I just use two stock tr4 brake master cylinders? -Mark Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From S.Janzen at comcast.net Thu Nov 1 14:52:16 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:52:16 -0400 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <011b01c81cc9$16a18ef0$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> I did the same thing Joe did, but with my GT6. You either need to be adept with a welder or know someone who is to modify the brake pedal and weld in the bias bar tube, and to build a new "box" to support the master cylinders. For the latter, I mocked something up out of posterboard, took it to a guy with a sheet metal brake and shear and he cut and bent the pieces to match my posterboard. I then pop riveted those together and had someone else weld it up. Looks a lot like what came from the factory under the hood of your TR4, but a little beefier (18 gauge ?) and holds three masters - one for the clutch and two for the brakes. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Vaden" To: Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 4:07 PM Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Hi All, > > I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, > and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion > on a tr4? I see that revington tr has a bolt on one, but it is really > pricey. Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > Thanks in advance, > Mark > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From adcronin at ameritech.net Thu Nov 1 15:22:34 2007 From: adcronin at ameritech.net (A Daniel Cronin) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 14:22:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB4F@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: <185909.13778.qm@web81311.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Or pop for one of the aftermarket brake bias valves offered by Moss and a number of the British suppliers, Revington, Cambridge, etc. Henry Frye wrote: > Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling > cylinders, the same way it has been done for decades. Of course Glen is right on the money. The only twist on the plot I have seen is taking a TR6 dual circuit master cylinder and a TR6 pedal box and fit it to the TR4. That's how my car was done, sans booster, and it stops fine. High pedal effort, but I like it that way. Front to rear bias can be changed with different sized rear wheel cylinders and/or messing around with the pad and shoe linings. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Planning & Development Services A. Daniel Cronin 248 761-2673 From markvaden at gmail.com Thu Nov 1 16:49:34 2007 From: markvaden at gmail.com (Mark Vaden) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 15:49:34 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <285b8a860711011549p3a0dacahf53242d3cf7ee1a9@mail.gmail.com> Thanks for all the the responses. I think I can fabricate something. Does anyone have a suggestion on bore sizes to start with. I am running stock TR4 front and rear brakes. Also, I would be interested in hearing what pads people are running? I have stock calipers, and drilled rotors. TIA, Mark From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 1 17:16:10 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:16:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> <285b8a860711011549p3a0dacahf53242d3cf7ee1a9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Personally, I like to use all the same size m/c for clutch, front and rear brakes so you only have to carry one spare rebuild kit and it's always the right one. .070 is a good midpoint size and you'll be able to get the bias adjusted without going to an extreme. Don't forget that you want some residual pressure on the disk pads, and don't forget that some M/Cs come with the residual pressure valve already in them. If you're going to use one for a clutch you have to take the M/C apart and remove the residual pressure valve or it will toast your thrust washers. You also probably don't want residual pressure on the back drums. Drilled rotors are a no-no with a lot of vintage racing organizations. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Mark Vaden Sent: Thu 11/1/2007 3:49 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Thanks for all the the responses. I think I can fabricate something. Does anyone have a suggestion on bore sizes to start with. I am running stock TR4 front and rear brakes. Also, I would be interested in hearing what pads people are running? I have stock calipers, and drilled rotors. TIA, Mark Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dkettler at powercom.net Thu Nov 1 18:32:31 2007 From: dkettler at powercom.net (David Kettler) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:32:31 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Just Sick - car stolen References: <8cbd782d0710291506i7942f068w6850ed865224c5e@mail.gmail.com><001101c81af9$4df35270$c59c3e4b@keng> <8cbd782d0710300812kfda4d80gc8882b9d9067a942@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <007201c81ce7$dbd9b440$091172d8@David> Chuck: Did the car have a logbook? Which race organization? Logbook number? This info may also be helpful to race organizations. I suspect that the chassis numbers are no longer there since it is a racecar. Dave Kettler ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Arnold" To: "BFEKen at copper.net" ; "Friends" ; "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net> Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2007 10:12 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Just Sick - car stolen > Unfortunately the trailer is as plain jane as you could get. I purposely > had no markings on it indicating a race car. It is white. It has a side > door [with the lock broken out]. The inside has gray vinyl flooring. The > front right plywood is broken and the outside bends out a little from > when > the car "got away inside one day" at bumper hight. > Plates are 4476 SW, Washington state. > > Here is what I psoted to our race group: > > This weekend my 16x7 White Road Force trailer was stolen from the 2400 > block > of Westlake Ave North in Seattle. My green 1968 Triumph TR5 race car was > inside. Car number is 444. Trailer license is 4476SW. If anyone gets a > wiff of these please notify the Seattle police. Case number is 07-441715. > > Pictures at: > http://picasaweb.google.com/Triosan/StolenTR5 > > > > On 10/30/07, BFEKen at copper.net wrote: >> >> Chuck, hopefully when the see the race car, they will dump it quick. >> >> KEN >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Chuck Arnold" >> To: "Friends" >> Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 2:06 PM >> Subject: [Fot] Just Sick - car stolen >> >> >> > Came home from a 5 day trip to find only the remnants of the smashed >> > receiver lock where my trailer, containing my TR250 race car, was when >> > I >> > left. Hoped like hell it had been impounded for parking too long in a >> > city >> > lot [I live on a houseboat and the trailer lives in the lot where I >> park]. >> > No such luck. Police report filed, insurance claim in. >> > >> > Information: Trailer was a white 16x7 Road force. No exterior >> markings. >> > Car: BRG #444 TR5. Accusump and dual master cylinders under hood. >> > Battery >> > and cell in rear. Full cage. Stainless lines to the >> injectors. Mallory >> > distributor. Fabricated dash. No speedo. 4 speed, no OD. >> > >> > Photos at: >> > http://picasaweb.google.com/Triosan/StolenTR5 >> > >> > -- >> > Chuck Arnold >> > _______________________________________________ >> > http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > >> > bfeken at copper.net >> > Fot mailing list >> > Fot at autox.team.net >> > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> >> > > > -- > Chuck Arnold > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > dkettler at powercom.net > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From stlnyc at msn.com Thu Nov 1 19:32:43 2007 From: stlnyc at msn.com (Fred & Mary Hodgson) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:32:43 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Nomination Message-ID: I would like to nominate Fred Easton to our honorable [?] band. He has a pair of TR-6's & a Lotus Esprit that he drives to shows. Has no use for a car he can't drive, so there's no trailering or "car under glass" scenarios involved. Second anyone? e-mail is Benchmarkmap at charter.net Fred Hodgson From klynch_6 at msn.com Thu Nov 1 19:36:52 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:36:52 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Nomination References: Message-ID: I'll second that. Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: Fred & Mary Hodgson To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 7:32 PM Subject: [Fot] Nomination I would like to nominate Fred Easton to our honorable [?] band. He has a pair of TR-6's & a Lotus Esprit that he drives to shows. Has no use for a car he can't drive, so there's no trailering or "car under glass" scenarios involved. Second anyone? e-mail is Benchmarkmap at charter.net> Fred Hodgson _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From S.Janzen at comcast.net Thu Nov 1 19:38:51 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 21:38:51 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Kansas City Recommendations Message-ID: <014201c81cf1$1fb23d50$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> I'll be in Kansas City over the weekend - visiting an older uncle with my Mom. Any must-see sites and restaurant (lunch or dinner) recommendations that will satisfy both a vegetarian (+fish) and the rest of us? From wgrosenbach at juno.com Thu Nov 1 19:53:51 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:53:51 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Nomination Message-ID: <20071101.195351.2480.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Triumph & Lotus. That's a good combination. I'll second that. Bill On Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:32:43 -0600 "Fred & Mary Hodgson" writes: > I would like to nominate Fred Easton to our honorable [?] band. He > has a pair > of TR-6's & a Lotus Esprit that he drives to shows. Has no use for > a car he > can't drive, so there's no trailering or "car under glass" scenarios > involved. > Second anyone? > > e-mail is > Benchmarkmap at charter.net > > Fred Hodgson > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tony at tonydrews.com Thu Nov 1 19:57:31 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2007 20:57:31 -0500 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com > References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20071102025710.DA9AF187A1D@autox.team.net> Due to my roll bar arrangement, a tilton pedal assembly woudn't work, so we fabricated a knock off of the revington kit shown here: http://www.revingtontr.com/shop/mainframe.asp?http://www.revingtontr.com/shop/product_display.asp?a=2&mscssid=X0XP0W21QF6M9LLGCRJN3HAGCXN46V5D&SiteLanguage=eng&CarType=TR4&PageType=default&ProductID=RTR4080LAK (part number RTR4080LAK) The sheetmetal is basically the same arrangement as stock, but wider. There's a linkage to connect the stock brake pedal to the dual cylinders that works suprisingly well. You put a spacer on the bolt for the clutch cylinder to cover the new offset, and that works suprisingly well too. I have a different rear brake setup, so can't help with the bore size question, but since the stock system sent the same pressure to all wheels, I'd think the same size cylinders all around are appropriate. I used girling remote reservoir cylinders that I sourced from DRE, the formula vee folks. With several sets of balance bars with the center hole drilled in varying places, you can adjust the bias without having the cockpit adjustable deal that doesn't look very vintage. You need pretty short cylinders, so the normal Tilton master cylinders don't fit. I seem to remember them coming up with some shorty ones recently, though. I can send some pics of the arrangement if desired. We mocked it up and had a local fabricator actually made it. Looks like it belongs there. - Tony At 03:07 PM 11/1/2007, you wrote: >Hi All, > >I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, >and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion >on a tr4? I see that revington tr has a bolt on one, but it is really >pricey. Any suggestions would be appreciated. > >Thanks in advance, >Mark >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From triosan at gmail.com Thu Nov 1 21:56:10 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 20:56:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered today in a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from where I live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to force open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type trailer. Do not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to work hard to push it around with the welded diff. Can sell the wheels [Koenig rewinds in a brown color with nearly new 205x60x15 Yokohama A08s], fuel cell [new this year 12 gallon Fuel safe], fuel pump [Bosch 160 psi], regulator, aluminum radiator, Optima battery, Accusump and racing seat. Not much else. They will never get it started [broken throttle cable] as the PI is very tricky to get the cold start lever right, and even then it takes a lot of cranking. OH, I suppose they could also sell he Konis. I expect it will get stripped, chopped up and dumped in the Sound. Very sad end to such a pretty bridesmaid. She was ready to race, but has never done yet. None-the-less, I will find and/or build a replacement and have it ready for the SOVREN kick off in mid-April. Sigh. -- Chuck Arnold From N197TR4 at cs.com Fri Nov 2 06:58:04 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 08:58:04 EDT Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car Message-ID: Chuck! I admire your great attitude over the whole thing. I know the amount of effort that you have put into this car, since the time that Jan & I delivered this car to you, with a trip over the mountains. It occurs to me that, if these guys DID have any idea of this "TR5", it may be in a container headed for Japan or Australia with a buyer waiting at the other end. Of course, we are all standing by, to help get you back on the track. Joe Alexander > Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered today in > a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from where I > live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to force > open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type trailer. Do > not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to work hard > to push it around with the welded diff. > > Can sell the wheels [Koenig rewinds in a brown color with nearly new > 205x60x15 Yokohama A08s], fuel cell [new this year 12 gallon Fuel safe], > fuel pump [Bosch 160 psi], regulator, aluminum radiator, Optima battery, > Accusump and racing seat. Not much else. They will never get it started > [broken throttle cable] as the PI is very tricky to get the cold start lever > right, and even then it takes a lot of cranking. OH, I suppose they could > also sell he Konis. I expect it will get stripped, chopped up and dumped in > the Sound. Very sad end to such a pretty bridesmaid. She was ready to > race, but has never done yet. > > None-the-less, I will find and/or build a replacement and have it ready for > the SOVREN kick off in mid-April. Sigh. > > -- > Chuck Arnold > _______________________________________________ > From N197TR4 at cs.com Fri Nov 2 07:50:27 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 09:50:27 EDT Subject: [Fot] Piston Search Over Message-ID: Thanks for all of the kind and generous responses. I am back in business. Joe Alexander, MDD (Master's In Dumpster Diving) From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 2 08:17:17 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:17:17 EDT Subject: [Fot] Spit/GT6 valences Message-ID: Anybody know of a supplier that stocks the early Spit-GT6 front valences in fiberglass? My original is bent beyond reason and it's time for a replacement. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From herald948 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 08:29:25 2007 From: herald948 at aol.com (herald948 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 10:29:25 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Spit/GT6 valences In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8C9EB73E70F7076-1C0-11BB@WEBMAIL-MB02.sysops.aol.com> -----Original Message----- From: Gt6steve at aol.com Anybody know of a supplier that stocks the early Spit-GT6 front valences in fiberglass? My original is bent beyond reason and it's time for a replacement. ==AM== You might try Honeybourne Mouldings in the UK. --Andy Mace *Mrs Irrelevant: Oh, is it a jet? *Man: Well, no ... It's not so much of a jet, it's more your, er, Triumph Herald engine with wings. -- Cut-price Airlines Sketch, Monty Python's Flying Circus (22) Check out the North American Triumph Sports 6 (Vitesse 6) and Triumph Herald Database at its new URL: ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com From lunkercars at earthlink.net Fri Nov 2 09:37:40 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg Lunker Hilyer) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 09:37:40 -0600 Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <45ADFB6C-9ABC-4868-AFE8-E8BDAEE330C5@earthlink.net> Chuck, I'm still holding a candle of hope that your car will be recovered. Having lived many years in your area, I've got a couple ideas that may be worth pursuing. First is that South Seattle Auto Auction [Kent] and Puget Sound Auto Auction [Auburn] are both near where the trailer was found - in the years that I managed SSAA, we would occasionally find a stolen vehicle gathering dust in the dealer parking area. Police theory was that it was a inconspicuous area for auto activity to blend in. Also, if someone was trying to get the car transported somewhere, this is where many trucking companies stage their loads. Might be worth a drive by these places. Second would be to contact Cosmopolitan Motors [Seattle] and Park Place Motors [Bellevue]. Although neither would knowingly buy a stolen car, they do both occasionally deal with vintage race cars and so wouldn't be put off by a car without a title. If the car [or parts] are being offered around for sale, they [Cosmopolitan most likely] would probably have heard of it. Another to check with would be the British/German/Italian dismantler on Aurora Ave - Can't remember the name but do remember that they would buy most anything. As for the car being shipped out of the country, I would doubt it... Technically impossible without a title and too long a paper trail for thieves to deal with. If you want to cover all the bases, contact Broadway Title [www.broadwaytitle.com]. They are the largest provider of "alternate titles" around. If someone wanted to get a title to sell the car, it would likely go thru them. Make sure they [and the police report] get any #s you have [engine, body, commission, etc]. one number in the reporting may not be enough since there is always confusion as to what #s to use. Hope this may be of some help. Greg Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 1, 2007, at 9:56 PM, Chuck Arnold wrote: > Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered > today in > a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from > where I > live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to > force > open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type > trailer. Do > not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to > work hard > to push it around with the welded diff. From WEmery7451 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 10:34:30 2007 From: WEmery7451 at aol.com (WEmery7451 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:34:30 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/1/07 2:50:08 PM Pacific Standard Time, markvaden at gmail.com writes: << Does anyone have a suggestion on bore sizes to start with. I am running stoc k TR4 front and rear brakes.>> When I installed the Revington system several years ago when a dual system was required, two standard TR-3/4 brake master cylinders were furnished, along with a TR-4 clutch master cylinder (with the reservoir). Revington's instructions at that time said that no smaller bore master cylinders were made. Now I have heard that Tilton and others may make the smaller bore brake master cylinders. I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had to push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. It didn't take long to get use to this requirement, and in my opinion the system works very well. Don't accidentally take out that little balance valve for the front disc brakes. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 11:24:58 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:24:58 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: Message-ID: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin> I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much harder and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more control on the front/rear balance. Joe C. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:34 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had to > push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. From jfrymark at aol.com Fri Nov 2 11:21:23 2007 From: jfrymark at aol.com (John Frymark) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:21:23 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Kansas City Message-ID: Scott, My wife's from Kansas, so here are her suggestions: Restaurants: Plaza III (best steaks and fish, too. Very $$$), Hereford House (Harry Truman's favorite...steaks as the name implies), The Bristol in Leawood, italian food in Little Italy To do: The Plaza (hopefully the holiday lights are up) is tribute to Seville, Spain, Hall's Dept Store (a hobby of the "Hallmark" Family), Jazz (many places), Riverboat gambling. Nebraska is playing #8 (!) KU saturday so Lawrence (40 minutes away) will be a BIG PARTY! http://www.tripadvisor.com/Attractions-g44535-Activities-c7- Kansas_City_Missouri.html John Frymark (Flying the KU Flag this weekend) From Fubog1 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 11:29:47 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 13:29:47 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: You're splitting the force (pedal effort) between 2 cylinders. Obviously smaller cylinders will make for an easier pedal, with the increase in travel. Some of the modern friction materials are so effective, we can get by with larger cylinders. Glen In a message dated 11/2/2007 1:14:05 PM Eastern Daylight Time, spitlist at cox.net writes: I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much harder and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more control on the front/rear balance. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Fri Nov 2 11:49:58 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:49:58 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Corporate sponsorships for the owner/driver Message-ID: <000201c81d78$c9735900$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Vintage racers, I am seeking some opinions about corporate sponsorships for the cars and drivers in Vintage Racing. Major corporations already support the tracks and clubs. I have been testing the sponsorship waters for the sole purpose of covering travel and sign up expenses to such races as the GP at Watkins Glen and similar high profile races. For me, Watkins Glen is a 3,200 mile round trip and will take a week. Sebring, 3,800 miles, Laguna Seca, 2,500..enough about that said. I don't need to preach to any of you about the expenses of racing. I actually have a prospective sponsor that caters to primarily to the 45 & up crowd. My ( our ) problem is what I ( we ) have little to offer in return. I am certainly not talking about plastering the car with corporate logo's and creating a media circus like NASCAR et.al. Outside the vintage race magazines we get very little if any media coverage. The larger events such as Watkins Glen with the weekend festival offer more opportunity but there is still not a lot. For starters I would offer a catered hospitality tent in the pit. I think if more opportunities were created by the promoters and clubs we, the drivers, could attract some sponsors. I read some where that the GP at Watkins Glen had 60,000 spectators over three days in ' 04. As far as the small local events, I have no idea, my experience in Colorado is the overwhelming majority of the spectators are friends and family so sponsorship at a local level is tough at best. Vintage racing is not a " win at any cost " sport. There are no winners declared at the end of the day, no podium ceremonies and no winners circle. I think many potential sponsors can appreciate that and still participate as long as they can get some exposure and appreciation for their contribution. Many of you may remember the two E types fielded by Jaguar in 2003. The attached link is to an article in Automobile magazine is about Jaguars participation in Vintage racing and I consider it a pretty good read. http://www.automobilemag.com/features/racing/0408_jaguar_select/index.ht ml I have some ideas about how sponsors could benefit and still maintain the vintage spirit but I want to hear what other drivers and club representatives feel about the issue. I'm not looking for huge money to fund my car, I just think racing should be just a little easier for the regular guy or gal on a budget that wants to go racing and has the initiative to get a sponsor for tires, sign up fees or travel expenses. In Colorado we two tracks and four vintage events per year. I really want to get out East and West but it will be near impossible to do on my budget without some help and I know of many others in the same position. In the coming month, I will likely write to the editors of the vintage magazines for public critique. FoT your input would be appreciated and I hope I have not offended and gone against the Vintage spirit. Jim Gray RMVR From lang at isis.mit.edu Fri Nov 2 13:04:39 2007 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert Lang) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:04:39 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] Corporate sponsorships for the owner/driver In-Reply-To: <000201c81d78$c9735900$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> References: <000201c81d78$c9735900$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: Hi, I'm hardly an expert on the matter, but my Vintage GCR which is used as the rules basis for most vintage racing bodies has a few references to sponsor material on the cars... like the 1967 GCR that limits ads to 20 square inches and "in good taste". As far as off the track sponsorship, the various activities like wine and cheese or barbeques, those could be made to work (easily), but you should talk to the event hosts as they'll probably want some return on such things. I actually find it fascinating that the '67 GCR cutoff has this advertising component. my $.02 rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Room N42-140Q | This space for rent Consultant MIT IS&T unix-linux-help | Voice:617-253-7438 FAX: 617-258-9535 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Fri Nov 2 13:06:22 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:06:22 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Message-ID: <003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> The pedal effort required to operate the brakes is determined by the area of the master cylinder or cylinders in relation to the area of the wheel cylinders or caliper pistons. So using two master cylinders of the same size gives WAY more piston area and the effort required will go up damatically. When we put a Tilton balance bar setup on Bill Fink's Morgan SLR a number of years ago we used two 5/8" masters and that still required more pedal effort than the stock single 3/4" master that a Morgan uses. I understand that someone, possibly Wilwood now makes 9/16" Master cylinders. They would be closer in total piston area the a singe 3/4 or .700" master. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Curry" To: ; ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 10:24 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 >I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master > cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much harder > and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual > circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more > control > on the front/rear balance. > > Joe C. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: ; > Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:34 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 >> I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had > to >> push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 13:35:06 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:35:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin> <003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> Message-ID: <007c01c81d87$78ec4640$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Unfortunately, unless you go to a different brand master cylinder, there are no options for Spitfires. The clutch and single circuit brake master cylinders have the same bore. But it does work pretty well as long as you remember that more effort is required. Bill B's comment about using the same size bore for both clutch and brake master cylinders is "Spot On" Keeps things simple. Joe C. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Solow" To: "Joe Curry" ; ; ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 12:06 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > The pedal effort required to operate the brakes is determined by the area of > the master cylinder or cylinders in relation to the area of the wheel > cylinders or caliper pistons. So using two master cylinders of the same size > gives WAY more piston area and the effort required will go up damatically. > When we put a Tilton balance bar setup on Bill Fink's Morgan SLR a number of > years ago we used two 5/8" masters and that still required more pedal effort > than the stock single 3/4" master that a Morgan uses. I understand that > someone, possibly Wilwood now makes 9/16" Master cylinders. They would be > closer in total piston area the a singe 3/4 or .700" master. From spreiss at verizon.net Thu Nov 1 22:18:38 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 15:18:38 +1100 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin> <003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> Message-ID: <002c01c81d07$71d796f0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Is it correct to assume that a single cylinder, dual piston master as commonly found in modern braking systems would similarly require increased pedal pressure? In any case, I'm not sure I understand the restrction on fitting such a master, sourced inexpensively from a Toyota for instance, when the rules seem to allow expensive custom systems from aftermarket manufacturers that were never available to racers "back in the day". Am I being naive? What also of employing brake boosters? They were available as early as 1969 or thereabouts if I'm not mistaken, and though obviously not used on the earlier cars have been fitted to them for street applications with good results for some time. Steve P ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Solow" To: "Joe Curry" ; ; ; Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 6:06 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > The pedal effort required to operate the brakes is determined by the area of > the master cylinder or cylinders in relation to the area of the wheel > cylinders or caliper pistons. So using two master cylinders of the same size > gives WAY more piston area and the effort required will go up damatically. > When we put a Tilton balance bar setup on Bill Fink's Morgan SLR a number of > years ago we used two 5/8" masters and that still required more pedal effort > than the stock single 3/4" master that a Morgan uses. I understand that > someone, possibly Wilwood now makes 9/16" Master cylinders. They would be > closer in total piston area the a singe 3/4 or .700" master. > > Greg Solow > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Joe Curry" > To: ; ; > Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 10:24 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > > > >I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master > > cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much harder > > and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual > > circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more > > control > > on the front/rear balance. > > > > Joe C. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: > > To: ; > > Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:34 AM > > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > >> I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had > > to > >> push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Fubog1 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 13:33:10 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:33:10 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/2/2007 3:25:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time, spreiss at verizon.net writes: Is it correct to assume that a single cylinder, dual piston master as commonly found in modern braking systems would similarly require increased pedal pressure? It doesn't matter what flavor, size is size. As I mentioned previously pedal ratio is a big factor also. HTH Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 13:37:26 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:37:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: Message-ID: It's not a balance vbalve, it's a residual pressure valve. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of WEmery7451 at aol.com Sent: Fri 11/2/2007 9:34 AM To: markvaden at gmail.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In a message dated 11/1/07 2:50:08 PM Pacific Standard Time, markvaden at gmail.com writes: << Does anyone have a suggestion on bore sizes to start with. I am running stoc k TR4 front and rear brakes.>> When I installed the Revington system several years ago when a dual system was required, two standard TR-3/4 brake master cylinders were furnished, along with a TR-4 clutch master cylinder (with the reservoir). Revington's instructions at that time said that no smaller bore master cylinders were made. Now I have heard that Tilton and others may make the smaller bore brake master cylinders. I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had to push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. It didn't take long to get use to this requirement, and in my opinion the system works very well. Don't accidentally take out that little balance valve for the front disc brakes. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tarch at bellsouth.net Fri Nov 2 13:46:53 2007 From: tarch at bellsouth.net (Richard Taylor) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:46:53 -0400 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <008201c81d89$1f0f98a0$8901a8c0@richardiipc> Bill, For those of us who don't know a residual valve from Shinola, what's it do? Although I've been told it is normal, I have never been able to get the front wheels of my TR-4 to rotate absolutely freely (while off the ground) without some pad drag. Richard atlanta It's not a balance vbalve, it's a residual pressure valve. From kaskas at cox.net Fri Nov 2 13:53:39 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:53:39 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin><003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> <002c01c81d07$71d796f0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <008701c81d8a$103fd410$0a10c548@RW> In 1969 I made up a dual brake system for the Competition Department TR-250. The booster chamber unit was removed. I used two 5/8" master cylinders and made my own pedal arm that had a 4.5 to 1 ratio. It worked so well we kept it on the TR-6 that replaced the TR-250 body and when I saw that car in 2002 at Mid-Ohio it still had the same pedal box I had made so long ago. It was the way that I recognized the car as being my old racer. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Preiss" To: "Greg Solow" ; "Joe Curry" ; ; ; Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 9:18 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Is it correct to assume that a single cylinder, dual piston master as > commonly found in modern braking systems would similarly require increased > pedal pressure? In any case, I'm not sure I understand the restrction on > fitting such a master, sourced inexpensively from a Toyota for instance, > when the rules seem to allow expensive custom systems from aftermarket > manufacturers that were never available to racers "back in the day". Am I > being naive? What also of employing brake boosters? They were available as > early as 1969 or thereabouts if I'm not mistaken, and though obviously not > used on the earlier cars have been fitted to them for street applications > with good results for some time. > Steve P > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Greg Solow" > To: "Joe Curry" ; ; > ; > Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 6:06 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > > >> The pedal effort required to operate the brakes is determined by the area > of >> the master cylinder or cylinders in relation to the area of the wheel >> cylinders or caliper pistons. So using two master cylinders of the same > size >> gives WAY more piston area and the effort required will go up >> damatically. >> When we put a Tilton balance bar setup on Bill Fink's Morgan SLR a number > of >> years ago we used two 5/8" masters and that still required more pedal > effort >> than the stock single 3/4" master that a Morgan uses. I understand that >> someone, possibly Wilwood now makes 9/16" Master cylinders. They would be >> closer in total piston area the a singe 3/4 or .700" master. >> >> Greg Solow >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Joe Curry" >> To: ; ; >> Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 10:24 AM >> Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 >> >> >> >I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master >> > cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much > harder >> > and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual >> > circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more >> > control >> > on the front/rear balance. >> > >> > Joe C. >> > >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: >> > To: ; >> > Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:34 AM >> > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 >> >> I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I > had >> > to >> >> push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. >> > _______________________________________________ >> > http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > >> > Fot mailing list >> > Fot at autox.team.net >> > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Fubog1 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 13:55:46 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:55:46 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 ps... Message-ID: In a message dated 11/2/2007 3:25:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time, spreiss at verizon.net writes: single cylinder, dual piston master as commonly found in modern braking systems Many dual circuit cylinders have stepped bores, at least on front disc/rear drum cars. This obviously affects the front/rear balance & displacement issues. Slight changes make big differences... Glen Richard the rpv is to keep very slight pressure in the system to minimize pad kickback ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From kaskas at cox.net Fri Nov 2 13:57:45 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:57:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <008201c81d89$1f0f98a0$8901a8c0@richardiipc> Message-ID: <00a801c81d8a$a2cb8b80$0a10c548@RW> When you stopped the car before jacking it up to test the wheel rotation the pressure was retained by the valve from that last braking effort. If you just pound your fist on the top (side) of the tire that will knock the pads back a bit and everything will be just dandy. The same thing happens when the car is running down the road, the bumps and side effort onto the tread keeps the pads back. The valve wants to help you not get pad knock-back. It works, kind of. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Taylor" To: "'Bill Babcock'" ; ; ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 12:46 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Bill, > For those of us who don't know a residual valve from Shinola, what's it > do? > Although I've been told it is normal, I have never been able to get the > front wheels of my TR-4 to rotate absolutely freely (while off the ground) > without some pad drag. > > Richard > atlanta > > It's not a balance vbalve, it's a residual pressure valve. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 14:14:08 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 13:14:08 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin><003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> <002c01c81d07$71d796f0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> <008701c81d8a$103fd410$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <00bd01c81d8c$ecfa1b20$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Kas, Isn't 5/8 the same size as the clutch and single circuit brake master used on early Spits? If so, that is the same bor I use on my Spit. Joe C. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kas Kastner" To: "Steven Preiss" ; "Greg Solow" ; "Joe Curry" ; ; ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 12:53 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > In 1969 I made up a dual brake system for the Competition Department TR-250. > The booster chamber unit was removed. I used two 5/8" master cylinders and > made my own pedal arm that had a 4.5 to 1 ratio. It worked so well we kept > it on the TR-6 that replaced the TR-250 body and when I saw that car in 2002 > at Mid-Ohio it still had the same pedal box I had made so long ago. It was > the way that I recognized the car as being my old racer. From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 14:35:32 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 13:35:32 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Alonzo and McLaren part ways Message-ID: <00dd01c81d8f$ea5c3760$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Today, I see that what I guess we all knew was inevitable was made official. Alonzo's contract is not being renewed for 2008. It was stated as "A mutual parting of ways", but I think that there is no way that Ron Dennis would bring him back next season considering all the complaining and lack of team effort that Alono diaplayed over the course of this season, not to mention the Stepneygate affair. Which makes one wonder which branch Alonzo will alight on next season. I will be watchng very closely to see who wil take him. Joe C. From jfrymark at aol.com Fri Nov 2 14:51:10 2007 From: jfrymark at aol.com (John Frymark) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 13:51:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing Message-ID: <3AE98E65-A2E1-4847-BCC2-C0A191DF5D66@aol.com> While the topic of Corporate Sponsorship in vintage racing can be viewed (critiqued?) in many ways, there is a tax implication that should be considered. I am no tax expert. I looked into something similar a while ago so I can offer these comments. A sponsor can justify their expenditure as advertising expense if it meets basic "smell tests", i.e. an activity that gets their name or product in front of their target market generating sales and/or goodwill. A for-profit entity receiving this sponsorship treats it as income. Unfortunately, it is impossible to claim that amateur vintage racing by itself, with no prize money, is a for-profit activity. It is therefore considered a hobby and "There is a one-way tax rule for hobbies: Income from a hobby is taxable as "other income" on form 1040; EXPENSES ARE DEDUCTIBLE ONLY TO THE EXTENT YOU REPORT HOBBY INCOME, and the deduction is limited on Schedule A by the 2% adjusted gross income (AGI) floor for miscellaneous deductions. Hobby losses are considered NONDEDUCTIBLE PERSONAL LOSSES. A profitable sale of hobby collection or activity held long term is taxable as a capital gain; losses are NOT deductible." JK Lasser's federal Tax Guide 2003 As we have all seen at Vintage Races, some participants have "sponsorship" by their own businesses. Gil Nickels' Far Niente Winery brought the transporter, cars, support crew, hospitality tent... the whole nine. I am sure this was all part of the winery advertising budget and assets of the business. Generally, the nature of hobby racing makes our expenses purely out-of-pocket...unless we have a sideline income producing business that benefits from our racing activities. Maybe some other FOTers want to weigh in here. From REK46 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 14:52:51 2007 From: REK46 at aol.com (REK46 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 16:52:51 EDT Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing Message-ID: That's the same in SCCA racing as well....unless YOU or DADDY own the business,you can't write off racing unless it has potential for earnings ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From tr5racer at btinternet.com Fri Nov 2 15:00:30 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 21:00:30 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Update on stolen TR5 race car Message-ID: <750090.19142.qm@web86602.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Commiserations to you Chuck on the theft of your TR5 race car. I know I would be gutted if anything like that happened to my TR5. Strangely in the UK in the 23 years that the TR Register Race Championship has been run I don't ever remember any driver having there TR race car stolen and not recovered. A few years back a couple of the race guys had their trailers stolen with their race cars on them and in both cases the cars were found abandoned later minus the trailer! I don't think that was any reflection on the condition of the cars, just that the trailers were easier to dispose of. Hope you are successful in recovering it. Mike Hughes --------------------------------- For ideas on reducing your carbon footprint visit Yahoo! For Good this month. From kaskas at cox.net Fri Nov 2 16:49:53 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:49:53 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys Message-ID: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. From kaskas at cox.net Fri Nov 2 17:27:06 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 16:27:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Message-ID: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box and worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase the ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the other ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 17:41:08 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 16:41:08 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <20071102234552.IZDZ9726.fed1rmmtao101.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Who is going to write a letter to Ralf? HeHe... At 03:49 PM 11/2/2007, Kas Kastner wrote: >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. From spreiss at verizon.net Fri Nov 2 02:43:47 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 19:43:47 +1100 Subject: [Fot] tr 3/4 brakes Message-ID: <008a01c81d2c$7c4b8630$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Is there a published detailed explanation of the state of the art brake hydraulic system for these cars? I know that there are many elements of the system that have not been touched on in this thread, and that the overall performance depends on total engineering (been studying Lotus literature!). All things working in consort, I'm beginning to understand, from the coefficient of friction of the pedal pads to the stiffness of the front spindles to the tire compound, and everything in-between. Guess that's what makes building an effective racing car such a demanding (and rewarding?) undertaking, and also explains the appeal to many of spec racing. From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 17:59:42 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 16:59:42 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <000601c81dac$6f85cfc0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball numbers! By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas Kastner Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 18:07:09 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 17:07:09 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <000701c81dad$7a4159b0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Wait, I see you already speculated on who replaces button. So who goes to Renault to replace Heikki? It is already speculated that Alonzo goes back to Renault (If Flav will take him back) but that still leaves an open seat there since I am guessing Fisichella will not retain his seat? (This is all very confusing!) :) I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball numbers! By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas Kastner Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 18:09:01 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:09:01 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <000601c81dac$6f85cfc0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> <000601c81dac$6f85cfc0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: <20071103001319.VODC27287.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Rumor (and Kas indicated too) had Rosberg headed that way At 04:59 PM 11/2/2007, Joe Curry wrote: >I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that >you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball >numbers! > >By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? > >Joe C. > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net >[mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas >Kastner >Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys > >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button >goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the >post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 18:12:18 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:12:18 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <000701c81dad$7a4159b0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> <000701c81dad$7a4159b0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: <20071103001639.CBGG21541.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Flav is still his manager. Renault has indicated that their drivers are "not" equal and Heikki wants to be equal. Indications he might to McLaren http://www.f1i.com/content/view/8756/1/ At 05:07 PM 11/2/2007, Joe Curry wrote: >Wait, I see you already speculated on who replaces button. So who goes to >Renault to replace Heikki? It is already speculated that Alonzo goes back >to Renault (If Flav will take him back) but that still leaves an open seat >there since I am guessing Fisichella will not retain his seat? > >(This is all very confusing!) :) > > >I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that >you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball >numbers! > >By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? > >Joe C. > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net >[mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas >Kastner >Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys > >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button >goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the >post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Fri Nov 2 19:22:13 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 18:22:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys Message-ID: <002d01c81db7$f6dd0640$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Maybe Ralph will join JPM , Scott Speed and Jack V in Nascar, what a hoot that would be. jim g From chasgee at aol.com Fri Nov 2 18:46:15 2007 From: chasgee at aol.com (chasgee at aol.com) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 20:46:15 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction In-Reply-To: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> References: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <8C9EBCA130939AA-8EC-1D2E@FWM-D44.sysops.aol.com> Just don't let it happen again.... Chuck -----Original Message----- From: Kas Kastner To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 4:27 pm Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box and worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase the ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the other ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com From jibjib at att.net Fri Nov 2 19:15:44 2007 From: jibjib at att.net (Jack Brooks) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 18:15:44 -0700 Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <02ae01c81db7$0fbbb680$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> Chuck, I live in Covington. Please email me with more specifics on the location so both I and my realtor wife can keep our eyes open. She is out in the car all day and knows TR's. Jack -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+jibjib=att.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+jibjib=att.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Chuck Arnold Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 8:56 PM To: Friends; Triumph; Triumph List Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered today in a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from where I live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to force open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type trailer. Do not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to work hard to push it around with the welded diff. Can sell the wheels [Koenig rewinds in a brown color with nearly new 205x60x15 Yokohama A08s], fuel cell [new this year 12 gallon Fuel safe], fuel pump [Bosch 160 psi], regulator, aluminum radiator, Optima battery, Accusump and racing seat. Not much else. They will never get it started [broken throttle cable] as the PI is very tricky to get the cold start lever right, and even then it takes a lot of cranking. OH, I suppose they could also sell he Konis. I expect it will get stripped, chopped up and dumped in the Sound. Very sad end to such a pretty bridesmaid. She was ready to race, but has never done yet. None-the-less, I will find and/or build a replacement and have it ready for the SOVREN kick off in mid-April. Sigh. -- Chuck Arnold Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From koblinger at verizon.net Fri Nov 2 19:17:38 2007 From: koblinger at verizon.net (Kurt Oblinger) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 18:17:38 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <472BCC32.9030103@verizon.net> My $.02, Alonso and Rosberg swap seats. I've read rumors that part of the deal for Dennis to let Alonso go was that he not go to a manufacturer team. Then Mc-Merc would have a British and a German driver. Cheers, Kurt O. Kas Kastner wrote: >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From cak at dimebank.com Fri Nov 2 19:36:47 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 18:36:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] tr 3/4 brakes Message-ID: <200711030136.lA31al0F002983@moose.dimebank.com> You could start with Fred Puhn's "Brake Handbook" ... From budscars at msn.com Fri Nov 2 19:42:14 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (CHARLES DELAUER) Date: Sat, 03 Nov 2007 01:42:14 +0000 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <20071103001319.VODC27287.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: Hi gang..report from The CSRG Race at Thunderhill...Incredible Weather...75-80 degrees at 6pm...The Triumphs that i saw today(I was teching) Racer Bud's Spitfire(Me)..John James' TR4...Gary Horskorta's Tr4..Jeff Abramson's Morgan Super sport....Bill Hart's Triumph special(I saw it in the transporter while I was teching other stuff)....more Tr Stuff may show up tomorrow Racer Bud and...THE OLD GUYS STILL DUMB ENOUGH TO RACE CHALLENGE Gang....Whooohoo! Racer Bud >From: "David W. Riddle" >To: >Subject: Re: [Fot] F-1 guys >Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:09:01 -0700 > >Rumor (and Kas indicated too) had Rosberg headed that way > >At 04:59 PM 11/2/2007, Joe Curry wrote: > >I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that > >you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball > >numbers! > > > >By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his >seat? > > > >Joe C. > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net > >[mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas > >Kastner > >Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM > >To: fot at autox.team.net > >Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys > > > >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button > >goes > >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the > >post > >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 2 20:15:14 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 22:15:14 EDT Subject: [Fot] Fwd: FW: A few more pics...engine bay detail & original patina Message-ID: Amici, this is an attachment leading to a few pics of the magnificent Kastner-Brophy GT6 now for sale after restoration. I know virtually nothing of this car beyond that Kas has said it's the one and I have perceived that he loved it. Can we as a group watch it and document it, storing any pics available and welcoming the new owner to our ranks? This is a significant bit of of Kas history so please keep track of it if you can. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Return-Path: Received: from rly-md10.mx.aol.com (rly-md10.mail.aol.com [172.20.29.148]) by air-md02.mail.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILINMD022-92b472b9d8c8a; Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:58:57 -0400 Received: from xmail2.uslec.net (xmail2.uslec.net [209.92.156.55]) by rly-md10.mx.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINMD103-92b472b9d8c8a; Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:58:36 -0400 Received: (qmail 4822 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2007 17:58:37 -0400 Received: from rrcs-24-123-183-46.se.biz.rr.com (HELO DF7B6GC1) (24.123.183.46) by ridgelakefamilymedicine.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2007 17:58:29 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Brian Simpson" To: Subject: FW: A few more pics...engine bay detail & original patina Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 17:58:25 -0400 Organization: Casa Fiora Message-ID: <00d201c81d9b$7f5396a0$6400a8c0 at DF7B6GC1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 thread-index: AcescrdgKbM1wj90TBqcbRLsGEuZ5RxJonaA X-AOL-IP: 209.92.156.55 X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_helo : X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_822_from : X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/mixed by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Brian Simpson Casa Fiora 704.367.9646 704.367.9648 fax www.casafiora.com -----Original Message----- From: Kent S. Bain [mailto:kent at auto-restore.com] Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2007 2:47 PM To: brian.simpson at casafiora.com Cc: 1-A Kent @home; Brian Rechtiene (BRIAN RECHTIENE); Donna Boccuzzi; Kariann Santarsiero; Taffy Richter 11-04 (Taffy); Tim Richey Subject: A few more pics...engine bay detail & original patina Brian... The subject says it all. __________ NOD32 2325 (20070612) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6 (3).JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6 (4).JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6.JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6 (1).JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6 (2).JPG] From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 21:15:36 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 20:15:36 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <008201c81d89$1f0f98a0$8901a8c0@richardiipc> Message-ID: It makes your pads drag--really. A residual pressure valve temporarily maintains some pressure on the calipers after you lift your foot. When you step on your brakes the pistons inside the calipers press the pads against the disk, These pistons are free to slide forward past the seals as the pads wear, which is why there is no adjustment for disk brakes--they self adjust as the pads wear. The pistons are pulled back away from the disk by the spring tension of the neoprene seals. Essentially the seal sticks to the piston a bit, and when you release the pedal the seal lips pull the piston back. Problem is that the lips may pull it too far back, or the disk might have a little excess runout, so the piston gets pulled back too far, and you have to pump the brakes to get the pads back in contact with the disk. A residual pressure valve maintains some of the pressure against the piston, preventing the piston from fully retracting or getting pushed back by disk runout. They hold about ten or fifteen pounds of pressure in the line. Eventually the pressure leaks away, but while you're driving that pressure is pretty much always applied, so your pads drag a little bit. I know it seems like that would be a bad thing, but it's not. The small amount of braking force applied keeps the pads slightly warm, causes no appreciable wear, and off-gasses the material on the surface--all good stuff. The only time isn't not so good is when you screw up and get fifteen pounds of line pressure applied to a drum brake, which is adjusted close to the drum to begin with, and winds up heating the drums and causing fade, or you have a residual pressure valve in a clutch M/C, which keeps pressure applied to the throwout bearing, which toasts the bearing and can ruin your crankshaft thrust washers. Five pounds residual pressure (or none) is about right for a drum brake. -----Original Message----- From: Richard Taylor [mailto:tarch at bellsouth.net] Sent: Fri 11/2/2007 12:46 PM To: Bill Babcock; WEmery7451 at aol.com; markvaden at gmail.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Bill, For those of us who don't know a residual valve from Shinola, what's it do? Although I've been told it is normal, I have never been able to get the front wheels of my TR-4 to rotate absolutely freely (while off the ground) without some pad drag. Richard atlanta It's not a balance vbalve, it's a residual pressure valve. From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 21:25:10 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 20:25:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing References: <3AE98E65-A2E1-4847-BCC2-C0A191DF5D66@aol.com> Message-ID: The fundamental trick is to have the company doing the sponsorship belong to you. Then you can treat the sponsorship as an advertising expense and have all the depreciable assets belong to the company. I investigated all the aspects of this, and decided it wasn't worth the effort for the relatively small expenditures I was making in racing. It's audit bait--and the IRS will be counting your socks and shorts. In truth, I should have gone ahead and done it--I have the world's most tedious accountant, who keeps everything squeaky clean while still ensuring that no expense goes unreported. The IRS has come visiting on two occasions, and left with their tails between their legs both times. I actually had one auditor tell me he would NEVER audit our company again. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of John Frymark Sent: Fri 11/2/2007 1:51 PM To: toodamnfunky at comcast.net Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing While the topic of Corporate Sponsorship in vintage racing can be viewed (critiqued?) in many ways, there is a tax implication that should be considered. I am no tax expert. I looked into something similar a while ago so I can offer these comments. A sponsor can justify their expenditure as advertising expense if it meets basic "smell tests", i.e. an activity that gets their name or product in front of their target market generating sales and/or goodwill. A for-profit entity receiving this sponsorship treats it as income. Unfortunately, it is impossible to claim that amateur vintage racing by itself, with no prize money, is a for-profit activity. It is therefore considered a hobby and "There is a one-way tax rule for hobbies: Income from a hobby is taxable as "other income" on form 1040; EXPENSES ARE DEDUCTIBLE ONLY TO THE EXTENT YOU REPORT HOBBY INCOME, and the deduction is limited on Schedule A by the 2% adjusted gross income (AGI) floor for miscellaneous deductions. Hobby losses are considered NONDEDUCTIBLE PERSONAL LOSSES. A profitable sale of hobby collection or activity held long term is taxable as a capital gain; losses are NOT deductible." JK Lasser's federal Tax Guide 2003 As we have all seen at Vintage Races, some participants have "sponsorship" by their own businesses. Gil Nickels' Far Niente Winery brought the transporter, cars, support crew, hospitality tent... the whole nine. I am sure this was all part of the winery advertising budget and assets of the business. Generally, the nature of hobby racing makes our expenses purely out-of-pocket...unless we have a sideline income producing business that benefits from our racing activities. Maybe some other FOTers want to weigh in here. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 21:29:32 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 20:29:32 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW><000601c81dac$6f85cfc0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> <20071103001319.VODC27287.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: Lots of Newbies in the wings, and with Hamilton's success the floodgates should open. Of course McLaren has been grooming Hamilton since he was thirteen, but the me-toos won't care. No question that Renault would take Alonso back--they already said it publically. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle Sent: Fri 11/2/2007 5:09 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] F-1 guys Rumor (and Kas indicated too) had Rosberg headed that way At 04:59 PM 11/2/2007, Joe Curry wrote: >I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that >you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball >numbers! > >By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? > >Joe C. > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net >[mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas >Kastner >Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys > >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button >goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the >post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Fri Nov 2 22:04:20 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 00:04:20 EDT Subject: [Fot] honeybourne Message-ID: In a message dated 11/2/2007 8:35:37 AM Pacific Standard Time, fot-request at autox.team.net writes: > You might try Honeybourne Mouldings in the UK. > > Known locally (in the UK) as 'Funnybourne mouldings' L From triosan at gmail.com Fri Nov 2 22:40:00 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 21:40:00 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction In-Reply-To: <8C9EBCA130939AA-8EC-1D2E@FWM-D44.sysops.aol.com> References: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> <8C9EBCA130939AA-8EC-1D2E@FWM-D44.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711022140k6375779y388b32095f94f122@mail.gmail.com> probably cannot help it, as he [and me] forget to remember not to! On 11/2/07, chasgee at aol.com wrote: > > Just don't let it happen again.... > > > > Chuck > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Kas Kastner > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 4:27 pm > Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction > > > > > Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box > and > worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase > the > ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the > other > ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 > pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - > http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > -- Chuck Arnold From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 22:49:58 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 21:49:58 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing References: <004001c81dd6$5187cbc0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: I probably should just let this lie, but I hate to see a fellow FOTer walking into a buzz saw. Having done marketing for most of my adult life, I'll tell you that's a lot of work for $5K. And that's not because marketers are overpaid--it's work even when you're good at it. If you could do a catered hospitality tent for that then more power to you, never mind the rest. I've done a race for two years (the Columbia River Classic here in Portland) and acquired sponsors for charity. We collected about $50K in sponsorships and counted ourselves lucky to clear $10K for the charity. Even though we had food donations we didn't have enough, and people went hungry. Good thing we had lots of Kona beer. I had to personally donate $5K for the raffle prize to clear that (it wasn't unexpected). I'm not trying to discourage you, just to tell you that it's a heck of a lot of work and more expenses everywhere than you'd expect. One small example--most tracks have concessionaires. Doing your own catering can be a challenge, hiring a caterer is absolutely out. You have to use the concessionaire, and that's expensive and not good. Tracks and racing organizations expect to get a piece of anything commercial. It's tricky to fly under that radar without setting up a confrontation that can be very embarrassing for your sponsor, so you have to cross all the I's and dot the T's. There is a book on how to manage sponsorship for racing--I never bought it but I flipped through it. I'd start there with someone who has already gone through the grief. The problem with these kind of things is that there is a huge difference between entertaining a few friends at the track informally, and trying to do something similar for money. The stakes and the complexities rise exponentially, and if you can't get enough budget to actually do it right, then it fails. I've done these kind of things with professionals helping me (indispensable) and I'm pretty good at a number of the elements myself, and I'd tell you everything is much harder than you think, takes ten times longer and costs five times more. Give it a go, but be careful, and do your best not to set expectations you can't meet. From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 22:57:31 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 21:57:31 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing In-Reply-To: References: <3AE98E65-A2E1-4847-BCC2-C0A191DF5D66@aol.com> Message-ID: <20071103050150.SILY18576.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> At 08:25 PM 11/2/2007, Bill Babcock wrote: >The fundamental trick is to have the company doing the sponsorship belong to >you. Then you can treat the sponsorship as an advertising expense and have all >the depreciable assets belong to the company. I investigated all the aspects If you have your own company do what I have done. I sponsored another guys car and he had his company sponsor mine. From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Sat Nov 3 00:27:05 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 23:27:05 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <005d01c81de2$8dec09d0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> You could be right Bill. I understand how things can spiral out of control. As far as catering is concerned I was planning on catering for the sponsors guests only. Tent passes would be issued and limited to 30 or so.Watkins Glen has no problem with that, I just have to clear it with SVRA. The Saturday FoT party in our pit is on me and lasts until the beer runs out. The sponsor will have people there to manage and entertain their guests with me popping in and out as I attend to my own racing issues. Plus there will be others there that could represent the " the team" and help with the sponsor. It sounds like your event was much larger anything I'm planning. Again, you may be right as I have not heard from all my prospective suppliers for catering, graphics & RV rental yet.I don't want to over commit and will try to be conservative. I will find that book you refered to and if things start to get too complex then I will bag the idea. By profession I am a construction project manager so I will certainly apply my planning, budgeting and risk management skills to the project with guarded opitimism. Keep it simple ( as it can be ). If you spent $40K that must have been one hell of an event, how many people did you entertain? Jim G -----Original Message----- From: Bill Babcock [mailto:BillB at bnj.com] Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:50 PM To: Bill Babcock; James Gray Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing I probably should just let this lie, but I hate to see a fellow FOTer walking into a buzz saw. Having done marketing for most of my adult life, I'll tell you that's a lot of work for $5K. And that's not because marketers are overpaid--it's work even when you're good at it. If you could do a catered hospitality tent for that then more power to you, never mind the rest. I've done a race for two years (the Columbia River Classic here in Portland) and acquired sponsors for charity. We collected about $50K in sponsorships and counted ourselves lucky to clear $10K for the charity. Even though we had food donations we didn't have enough, and people went hungry. Good thing we had lots of Kona beer. I had to personally donate $5K for the raffle prize to clear that (it wasn't unexpected). I'm not trying to discourage you, just to tell you that it's a heck of a lot of work and more expenses everywhere than you'd expect. One small example--most tracks have concessionaires. Doing your own catering can be a challenge, hiring a caterer is absolutely out. You have to use the concessionaire, and that's expensive and not good. Tracks and racing organizations expect to get a piece of anything commercial. It's tricky to fly under that radar without setting up a confrontation that can be very embarrassing for your sponsor, so you have to cross all the I's and dot the T's. There is a book on how to manage sponsorship for racing--I never bought it but I flipped through it. I'd start there with someone who has already gone through the grief. The problem with these kind of things is that there is a huge difference between entertaining a few friends at the track informally, and trying to do something similar for money. The stakes and the complexities rise exponentially, and if you can't get enough budget to actually do it right, then it fails. I've done these kind of things with professionals helping me (indispensable) and I'm pretty good at a number of the elements myself, and I'd tell you everything is much harder than you think, takes ten times longer and costs five times more. Give it a go, but be careful, and do your best not to set expectations you can't meet. From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 23:31:36 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 22:31:36 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing In-Reply-To: References: <004001c81dd6$5187cbc0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: <20071103053553.HNIA21541.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> At 09:49 PM 11/2/2007, Bill Babcock wrote: >I probably should just let this lie, but I hate to see a fellow FOTer walking >into a buzz saw. Something else you could look at trying that might be a simple way to start and avoid the buzz saw. I put together a rough prospectus like this once and never had the time to pursue it. Bill is right that the amount of time and energy to put this together by yourself might be better spent with a part time job as a greeter at Walmart to earn the extra cash. Seriously though if your potential sponsor is close to you geographically you might want to try this... Leave the vintage events for you to concentrate on you and your car. Of course you can have guests but if you don't have a "staff" to see to your guests they might feel short changed with your attention if you are having to work on the car to make the next session/race. Instead look at using the Street car DE sessions with local groups like NASA, etc. Put a passenger seat in your car (if it does not have one currently) and allow the sponsor to bring people like guests (his vendors, customers) or employees to reward them. At an event like that you are not stressed and you can socialize with your sponsor and his gusts between sessions and take them for rides on the track. Probably take at least four passengers during the event. From tlizzard at msn.com Sat Nov 3 08:09:12 2007 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:09:12 -0400 Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys Message-ID: The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's Championship. And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. We have done it before. Terry Stetler From Fubog1 at aol.com Sat Nov 3 08:14:53 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:14:53 EDT Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION Message-ID: In a message dated 11/3/2007 10:09:21 AM Eastern Daylight Time, tlizzard at msn.com writes: The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's Championship. And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. We have done it before. This is really sad. I tell myself it is because there isn't enough $$ to be made (yeah, right...). I would like to think that we COULD do it... Glad you brought it up Terry, Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From Group44TR7 at aol.com Sat Nov 3 08:25:21 2007 From: Group44TR7 at aol.com (Group44TR7 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:25:21 EDT Subject: [Fot] Southern Califonia transport to Watkins Glen Message-ID: Good Morning If there are any FOT people who would be interested in having their cars transported to and from San Diego area to Watkins Glen and back by commercial carrier, please let me know. The proposal to the carrier will probably be loading and unloading at one (San Diego) or two (San Diego, LA) locations in S. California. I have not started talking with carrier yet, so I don't have any guess at the price. Based on past experience, I expect its going to be in the $3,000 per car range for transport there and back. Cary ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From BillDentin at aol.com Sat Nov 3 08:27:25 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:27:25 EDT Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Message-ID: In a message dated 11/02/2007 6:46:41 PM Central Standard Time, chasgee at aol.com writes: > Just don't let it happen again.... > > It's not an OPTION. You get to a certain age and "I forgot" comes with the turf. I know...I'm there. Bill Dentinger. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Nov 3 08:43:13 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:43:13 EDT Subject: [Fot] Fwd: FW: A few more pics...engine bay detail & original patina Message-ID: Dang, I forgot about the anti-attachment clause. I will put the pics on Photobucket.Com in the album called GT6Steve. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From kaskas at cox.net Sat Nov 3 08:47:19 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 07:47:19 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION References: Message-ID: <008401c81e28$6fc892c0$0a10c548@RW> There is so much money involved in the "Crash and Bash" racing in this country and poor feeder systems with no defined route to the top levels, gaining a spot in F-1 will be next to impossible for years to come unless a guy goes to Europe in the teens and STAYS there. Maybe a fellow could buy his way in as so many have, but that precludes a requirement for talent, thus, backmarker. We can't even keep a F-1 race in this country, poor state of affairs. There is an excuse for our system or lack of system. That is the huge size of the USA. It would be like all of Europe speaking the same language, hopeless. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 7:14 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION > In a message dated 11/3/2007 10:09:21 AM Eastern Daylight Time, > tlizzard at msn.com writes: > > The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American > drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's > Championship. > And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. > > We have done it before. > This is really sad. > I tell myself it is because there isn't enough $$ to be made (yeah, > right...). > I would like to think that we COULD do it... > Glad you brought it up Terry, > Glen > > > > > > ************************************** See what's new at > http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jerrybarr at charter.net Sat Nov 3 09:30:14 2007 From: jerrybarr at charter.net (Jerry Barr) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:30:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: What were we talking about? I FORGOT. On Nov 3, 2007, at 9:27 AM, BillDentin at aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 11/02/2007 6:46:41 PM Central Standard Time, > chasgee at aol.com writes: > > >> Just don't let it happen again.... >> >> > > It's not an OPTION. You get to a certain age and "I forgot" comes > with the > turf. I know...I'm there. > > Bill Dentinger. > > > > ************************************** > See what's new at http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sat Nov 3 09:54:53 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 08:54:53 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000a01c81e31$dfff9940$2202a8c0@newcomputer> It probably has a lot to do with the distance and the numbers. Since there is plenty of racing in the US, most of the quality drivers stay here rather than going to Europe where you have to be in F1. Very little time is spent during the year outside if that general area and precious little in the US (Even less next season) While the money is good, the odds are not so good of one getting in since there are so few seats available. That can be a deterrent to someone who can make all the money he can spend here in the US of A. I will be interested to see how Sebastian Bordais does next year driving for Toro Rosso. If they can get the aerodynamics right on that car, with Ferrari power, he should be competitive. Joe -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Fubog1 at aol.com Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 7:15 AM To: tlizzard at msn.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION In a message dated 11/3/2007 10:09:21 AM Eastern Daylight Time, tlizzard at msn.com writes: The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's Championship. And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. We have done it before. This is really sad. I tell myself it is because there isn't enough $$ to be made (yeah, right...). I would like to think that we COULD do it... Glad you brought it up Terry, Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From hottr6 at hotmail.com Sat Nov 3 10:08:07 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 12:08:07 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Message-ID: Kas Kastner wrote: > Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box and > worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase the > ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the other > ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 > pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. When I built my brake system, I computed the numbers for a stock TR6 brake system without the servo and a pedal ratio of 4.36 (rather than the paltry stock 3.5). 110 lbs of foot pressure (appropriate for "emergency" braking) on this pedal gives a theoretical pressure at the pads of 1259 pounds. 700 pounds at the pads requires around 60 lbs of foot pressure. But this is all theoretical and the real world does include a lot of losses. I stayed with a ratio of 4.36 because I am running Wilwood 4-pots on 11"-13" vented rotors all round. Unsprung weight for this (and Southwick hubs) is the same as the stock brakes. For a good treatise on modern and racing brake technology, I use Mavrigian and Carley's "Brake Systems", published by HP Books. Dated 1998 so it is a bit old, but non-computerized off-the-shelf systems have not changed much since then. Shane Ingate at 7,500' in NM. _________________________________________________________________ Boo! Scare away worms, viruses and so much more! Try Windows Live OneCare! http://onecare.live.com/standard/en-us/purchase/trial.aspx?s_cid=wl_hotmailne ws From BillB at bnj.com Sat Nov 3 10:24:57 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 09:24:57 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys References: Message-ID: I was at a party the other day and said something about F1. No one knew what I was talking about. Imagine that happening in Brazil or Europe. The current level of F1 requires a perfect storm of talent, experience, equipment, politics, money, sponsorship, physical attributes and mental toughness. The only way to make a winning F1 driver now is to grow a whole bunch of them and pick the best. We don't have the interest in the US. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Terry Stetler Sent: Sat 11/3/2007 7:09 AM To: fot Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's Championship. And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. We have done it before. Terry Stetler Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Sat Nov 3 17:45:51 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Sat, 03 Nov 2007 16:45:51 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Posted a bunch of TR Documents and manuals Message-ID: <20071103235017.JCQZ12415.fed1rmmtao104.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Some of our club members have contributed a BUNCH of TR manuals and documentation in PDF format on our club's website. They are located in our Articles/Documents category section. http://www.dctra.org/?cat=11 Plus we have over 450 pictures from the recently concluded 2007 edition of Triumphest. http://www.dctra.org/?page_id=22 From gkbyrne at optushome.com.au Mon Nov 5 00:47:34 2007 From: gkbyrne at optushome.com.au (Geoffrey Byrne) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 18:47:34 +1100 Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car References: Message-ID: <009e01c81f80$229f7690$24acefdc@co3017577a> Chuck I doubt it will turn up in Aus it will stand out as we say "like dogs balls ". i will put the word out to warn all the Triumph guys here in AUS . If something sus turns up all FOT will hear about it Sorry to hear of your loss good luck with MK2 Geoff Byrne TR6 Racer Down Under PS can you please resend me the pics of the car we will get it in our mags and on WEB sites just to cover all bases ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; <6pack at autox.team.net>; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 11:58 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car > Chuck! > > I admire your great attitude over the whole thing. I know the amount of > effort that you have put into this car, since the time that Jan & I delivered this > car to you, with a trip over the mountains. > > It occurs to me that, if these guys DID have any idea of this "TR5", it may > be in a container headed for Japan or Australia with a buyer waiting at the > other end. > > Of course, we are all standing by, to help get you back on the track. > > Joe Alexander > > > > Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered today in > > a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from where I > > live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to force > > open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type trailer. Do > > not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to work hard > > to push it around with the welded diff. > > > > Can sell the wheels [Koenig rewinds in a brown color with nearly new > > 205x60x15 Yokohama A08s], fuel cell [new this year 12 gallon Fuel safe], > > fuel pump [Bosch 160 psi], regulator, aluminum radiator, Optima battery, > > Accusump and racing seat. Not much else. They will never get it started > > [broken throttle cable] as the PI is very tricky to get the cold start lever > > right, and even then it takes a lot of cranking. OH, I suppose they could > > also sell he Konis. I expect it will get stripped, chopped up and dumped in > > the Sound. Very sad end to such a pretty bridesmaid. She was ready to > > race, but has never done yet. > > > > None-the-less, I will find and/or build a replacement and have it ready for > > the SOVREN kick off in mid-April. Sigh. > > > > -- > > Chuck Arnold > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Mon Nov 5 07:05:50 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 08:05:50 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction In-Reply-To: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> References: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B39F39E@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I don't know about anyone else but I'd love to hear a full explanation of how to set up the pedal ratio to the best effect in a TR. I have the TR Enterprises dual 5/8" set-up with balance bar and I am struggling with pedal feel and front-rear balance. I have to stomp so hard it is difficult to not lock them up. Uphill I lock the rears, downhill the fronts. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas Kastner Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 6:27 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box and worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase the ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the other ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From clarkfot at cwnicholls.net Mon Nov 5 07:41:28 2007 From: clarkfot at cwnicholls.net (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 09:41:28 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil - FW: Rotella Ask Our Expert Message-ID: <005001c81fb9$f479c150$1342a8c0@semperon3400> I don't know what the consensus was on the engine oil thread previously in this group... I was at the SEMA show last week and spoke to the Shell Answer person there, he told me more than I could retain!! Here is an email I got in reply to my inquiry on the rotella website to the answer man (see last portion). I would think that pertinent questions can be referred back to Richard Moore at Shell... Clark Clark W. Nicholls -----Original Message----- From: AskShell at Shell.com [mailto:AskShell at Shell.com] Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 9:21 AM To: cwnicholls at aol.com Subject: RE: Rotella Ask Our Expert: Other Clark, Rotella T with Triple Protection 15W-40 CJ-4 has approximately 1200 ppm zinc. This is 50% more zinc than current passenger car motor oils (API SM/ILSAC GF-4) which contain approximately 800 ppm zinc. Passenger car motor oils had approximately 1200 ppm zinc prior to 2001. In 2001 the zinc was reduced to 1000 ppm and in 2005 reduced again to the current 800 ppm. Thus, the new Rotella T with Triple Protection 15W-40 CJ-4 has the same zinc content that passenger car motor oils had in 2000 before the current problems with flat tappet engines began. http://www.shellusserver.com/products/pdf/RotellaT(CJ-4).pdf If you have any additional questions, please call us at 1-800-231-6950. Thank you for your interest in Shell products. Richard Moore Staff Engineer Shell Global Solutions (US) Inc. Westhollow Technology Center, PO Box 4327, Houston, TX 77210, United States of America -----Original Message----- From: cwnicholls at aol.com [mailto:cwnicholls at aol.com] Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 8:24 AM To: askshell, SLUBE-GSMR/5 Subject: Rotella Ask Our Expert: Other ------------------------------------------------ ROTELLA.com E-mail Form ------------------------------------------------ NAME Clark W. Nicholls E-MAIL ADDRESS cwnicholls at aol.com SUBJECT Other COMMENTS ---------------------------------------------- I spoke with one of you at the SEMA show Friday in the final hour of the show concerning Rotella and old British cars with flat tappet cams (brought on by the change in chemicals in the oils, phosphorous, zink, etc). He mentioned that there is information on this subject on the rotella website, but I need help in finding this. I would like to pass this information on to my Triumph compatriots ASAP as there is much discussion on this subject in the Triumph automobile racing group. ---------------------------------------------- From SpiwakD at aol.com Mon Nov 5 13:03:08 2007 From: SpiwakD at aol.com (SpiwakD at aol.com) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 15:03:08 EST Subject: [Fot] TR head ID Message-ID: I am looking at a TR head and cannot remember how to tell if it is a small-port one, which I believe is the best one to use. Any help? ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From twakeman at razzolink.com Mon Nov 5 16:00:26 2007 From: twakeman at razzolink.com (TeriAnn Wakeman) Date: Mon, 05 Nov 2007 15:00:26 -0800 Subject: [Fot] TR head ID In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <472FA08A.30801@razzolink.com> SpiwakD at aol.com wrote: > I am looking at a TR head and cannot remember how to tell if it is a > small-port one, which I believe is the best one to use. Any help? I wrote a web page about that once: www.tjwakeman.net/TR/FAQ_heads.htm TeriAnn From Gt6steve at aol.com Mon Nov 5 18:10:54 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 20:10:54 EST Subject: [Fot] Larger Valves? Message-ID: Yeah, he's right in the narrow perspective. Just keep in mind these are all V-8 guys telling us how to build. Our machines don't necessarily fit their formulas. Take Chebbie builders with a grain of salt.... ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From BillB at bnj.com Mon Nov 5 19:04:56 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 18:04:56 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Larger Valves? References: Message-ID: Although I have to say, if you want to see how an engine can really be built, there's nothing like the V8 guys. They've been working around limitations for eons, and they build pushrod motors with outputs that Formula One can't diss. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Gt6steve at aol.com Sent: Mon 11/5/2007 5:10 PM To: S.Janzen at comcast.net Cc: FOT at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Larger Valves? Yeah, he's right in the narrow perspective. Just keep in mind these are all V-8 guys telling us how to build. Our machines don't necessarily fit their formulas. Take Chebbie builders with a grain of salt.... ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wgrosenbach at juno.com Mon Nov 5 19:14:06 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 19:14:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil - FW: Rotella Ask Our Expert Message-ID: <20071105.191424.3080.3.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Always impressed with the Rotella. Used it in a Renault 17 that I occasionally flogged up the west side of I-70's Johnson tunnel approach. Oil temp ran much cooler than Valvoline 20W50. It also looked the same after the abuse, where the Valvoline darkened considerably. Would like to have known about it back when I ran the high compression 2.5 L 6 in my GT-6. Bill From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Mon Nov 5 20:39:01 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 22:39:01 EST Subject: [Fot] Engine Oi Message-ID: In a message dated 11/5/2007 10:59:43 AM Pacific Standard Time, fot-request at autox.team.net writes: > Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 09:41:28 -0500 > From: "Clark W. Nicholls" > Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil - FW: Rotella Ask Our Expert > To: > Message-ID: <005001c81fb9$f479c150$1342a8c0 at semperon3400> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > I don't know what the consensus was on the engine oil thread previously in > this group... > > I was at the SEMA show last week and spoke to the Shell Answer person there, > he told me more than I could retain!! > > Here is an email I got in reply to my inquiry on the rotella website to the > answer man (see last portion). > > I would think that pertinent questions can be referred back to Richard Moore > at Shell... > > Clark > Clark W. Nicholls > -----Original Message----- > From: AskShell at Shell.com [mailto:AskShell at Shell.com] > Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 9:21 AM > To: cwnicholls at aol.com > Subject: RE: Rotella Ask Our Expert: Other > > Clark, Rotella T with Triple Protection 15W-40 CJ-4 has approximately 1200 > ppm zinc. This is 50% more zinc than current passenger car motor oils (API > SM/ILSAC GF-4) which contain approximately 800 ppm zinc. Passenger car motor > oils had approximately 1200 ppm zinc prior to 2001. In 2001 the zinc was > reduced to 1000 ppm and in 2005 reduced again to the current 800 ppm. > > Thus, the new Rotella T with Triple Protection 15W-40 CJ-4 has the same zinc > content that passenger car motor oils had in 2000 before the current > problems with flat tappet engines began. > > http://www.shellusserver.com/products/pdf/RotellaT(CJ-4).pdf > > If you have any additional questions, please call us at 1-800-231-6950. > Thank you for your interest in Shell products. > > Richard Moore > Staff Engineer > Shell Global Solutions (US) Inc. > Westhollow Technology Center, PO Box 4327, Houston, TX 77210, United States > of America > > -----Original Message----- > From: cwnicholls at aol.com [mailto:cwnicholls at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 8:24 AM > To: askshell, SLUBE-GSMR/5 > Subject: Rotella Ask Our Expert: Other > > ------------------------------------------------ > ROTELLA.com E-mail Form > ------------------------------------------------ > NAME Clark W. Nicholls > E-MAIL ADDRESS cwnicholls at aol.com > SUBJECT Other > COMMENTS > ---------------------------------------------- > I spoke with one of you at the SEMA show Friday in the final hour of the > show concerning Rotella and old British cars with flat tappet cams (brought > on by the change in chemicals in the oils, phosphorous, zink, etc). He > mentioned that there is information on this subject on the rotella website, > but I need help in finding this. I would like to pass this information on > to my Triumph compatriots ASAP as there is much discussion on this subject > in the Triumph automobile racing group. Rotella is known to be OK, insofar as the ZDDP content is concerned, but unfortunately it is not available in the 20W/50 viscosity recommended for most Triumphs. Leon From ablake2 at austin.rr.com Mon Nov 5 22:32:57 2007 From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com (Greg & Alison Blake) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 23:32:57 -0600 Subject: [Fot] looking for carbs Message-ID: <000201c82036$7d4955a0$6401a8c0@blake1> Anyone have a set of HS6's for sale? Thanks, Greg From clarkfot at cwnicholls.net Mon Nov 5 21:59:58 2007 From: clarkfot at cwnicholls.net (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 23:59:58 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001c01c82031$e2f56b00$1342a8c0@semperon3400> The Shell person also said that 20-50 is not required. That's soooo old news... I've been using non-synthetic 10-40 for years (street Spitfire) and he said I should be using 10-30 If you want to ask about that, drop him an email! Clark -=-=-= Rotella is known to be OK, insofar as the ZDDP content is concerned, but unfortunately it is not available in the 20W/50 viscosity recommended for most Triumphs. Leon From jimhearn1 at comcast.net Mon Nov 5 22:55:58 2007 From: jimhearn1 at comcast.net (jim hearn) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 21:55:58 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Looking for a centerline to measure toe Message-ID: <001601c82039$b41244e0$171a694c@computer> Does anyone have any thoughts on where and how to best locate a centerline on the car in order to measure toe. I have a '74 TR6 but I'm sure there would be commonality among lots of cars. Jim in Sacramento [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] From wgrosenbach at juno.com Tue Nov 6 07:28:10 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 07:28:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil Message-ID: <20071106.073013.2420.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> >>>I've been using non-synthetic 10-40 for years (street Spitfire) and he said I should be using 10-30. The only engine I ever lost on the street from a bearing related issue was while using 10W40. Usually ran 20W50, changed in the fall, then chased the Colorado 1000 (Grand) around the state in my '76 Spitfire. Spent quite a bit of time running flat out. In a Spitfire, your not that afoul of the law running flat out. Survived that, but not the drive down I-25 to Pueblo for a SCCA race. The engine started producing a hammering noise, (which turned out to be a rod bearing cap on #3 that was coming adrift and finally got out far enough for a bolt head to hit the block). Oil pressure never got low enough to light the lights. Stopped, pulled the dip stick, NOTHING on the stick, but it was not completely dry. After getting the race event towing guy to get the car to the track, I again pulled the dipstick. Full, to the mark. The oil got hot enough to become thin enough to leave only a trace film on the stick. The bearing got hammered into a multi layered thin blue band wrapped around the journal. Some small engine manufacturers will not warranty their products if 10W40 oil is used in them. Was my failure related to having sucked it full of water one time? Possibly, but I have never seen any other oil get that thin in any other application. Had to have contributed, though. I have much more faith in 10W30. Always amazed at the difference in engine sound and power output after changing from a SAE 40, to a 20W50, in the 2.5 L 6. Without a proper windage in the pan, a hard braking move with SAE 40 in the pan would wrap all the oil around the crank, bringing the engine to a halt, requiring the better part of a minute to be restarted. The 15W40 is a nice compromise. Bill From Fubog1 at aol.com Tue Nov 6 07:54:54 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 09:54:54 EST Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil Message-ID: ... a 1500 Spitfire... flat-out...failure of #3 big end... 'nuff said... Glen In a message dated 11/6/2007 9:33:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, wgrosenbach at juno.com writes: The only engine I ever lost on the street from a bearing related issue was while using 10W40. Usually ran 20W50, changed in the fall, then chased the Colorado 1000 (Grand) around the state in my '76 Spitfire. Spent quite a bit of time running flat out. In a Spitfire, your not that afoul of the law running flat out. Survived that, but not the drive down I-25 to Pueblo for a SCCA race. The engine started producing a hammering noise, (which turned out to be a rod bearing cap on #3 ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 6 08:30:06 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 06 Nov 2007 08:30:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil Message-ID: <20071106153403.KOTS29613.fed1rmmtao106.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Nice long Article about this topic on our club site. I tried to send the text of the article to the list but it got bounced as being to big. http://www.dctra.org/?p=79 From kaskas at cox.net Tue Nov 6 08:36:19 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 07:36:19 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil References: Message-ID: <001a01c8208a$c6dcbd70$3f0ec548@RW> If you do not fix the oil passages in the 1500 crank it will fail, sometimes sooner than later. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Cc: ; Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2007 6:54 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Engine Oil > ... a 1500 Spitfire... flat-out...failure of #3 big end... > > 'nuff said... > Glen > > > In a message dated 11/6/2007 9:33:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, > wgrosenbach at juno.com writes: > > The only engine I ever lost on the street from a bearing related issue > was while using 10W40. Usually ran 20W50, changed in the fall, then > chased the Colorado 1000 (Grand) around the state in my '76 Spitfire. > Spent quite a bit of time running flat out. In a Spitfire, your not that > afoul of the law running flat out. Survived that, but not the drive down > I-25 to Pueblo for a SCCA race. The engine started producing a hammering > noise, (which turned out to be a rod bearing cap on #3 > > > > > > > ************************************** See what's new at > http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 6 08:58:20 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 07:58:20 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil References: Message-ID: I pretty much thought the same thing. Not something I'd blame on oil. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Fubog1 at aol.com Sent: Tue 11/6/2007 6:54 AM To: wgrosenbach at juno.com; clarkfot at cwnicholls.net Cc: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Engine Oil ... a 1500 Spitfire... flat-out...failure of #3 big end... 'nuff said... Glen In a message dated 11/6/2007 9:33:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, wgrosenbach at juno.com writes: The only engine I ever lost on the street from a bearing related issue was while using 10W40. Usually ran 20W50, changed in the fall, then chased the Colorado 1000 (Grand) around the state in my '76 Spitfire. Spent quite a bit of time running flat out. In a Spitfire, your not that afoul of the law running flat out. Survived that, but not the drive down I-25 to Pueblo for a SCCA race. The engine started producing a hammering noise, (which turned out to be a rod bearing cap on #3 ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tlizzard at msn.com Tue Nov 6 16:06:29 2007 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 18:06:29 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Spoke with Dave at Red Line Oil today. Message-ID: What with all the confusion about our favorite non alcoholic fluid I figured I go to the source. (Or at least one of the sources). Dave (sorry I'm really terrible with names so the his last name is lost to me...) is the guy who mans Red Line's technical help phone line. I'll cut to the chase here. Red Line's "straight weight" (they do behave as multi grades and say so on the bottle) racing synthetic oils have 2400ppm of the zinc anti wear goo in them. (ZDDP). Red Line's multi grade synthetic street oils have 1200ppm. Thought you all might be interested. Terry Stetler From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 6 19:18:49 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 06 Nov 2007 19:18:49 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica Message-ID: <20071107022354.OVRI29613.fed1rmmtao106.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> The best video yet that I have seen of the last lap battle between Massa and Kubica in the rain. Incredible close driving with neither driver giving more then the fraction of an inch that they needed to give. http://vimeo.com/348198/ From jaboruch at netzero.net Tue Nov 6 20:57:02 2007 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 03:57:02 GMT Subject: [Fot] TR4 front suspension Message-ID: <20071106.225702.3977.1@webmail15.dca.untd.com> I am looking to change my front suspension over to coil overs and tubular A-arms. Considering still using the TR4 uprights ( to make hubs and brakes easier to fit, since they will just swap over), but replacing the trunion with a rod end to be more like a ball joint. Has anyone on the list successfuly done a conversion like this? Any idea what the thread on the bottom of the upright actually is supposed to be? The one that I measures looks like a 13/16 - 10 American Standard special thread, but not sure if it was a Whitworth or Acme thread originally and just got worn to look like it does now? I also have a TR6 part, but it has a 9 thread per inch thread that looks like an Acme thread, but does not match up to any Acme thread in my machinists handbook. The TR6 thread is 0.905 inch diameter, which is not quite 15/16 (0.9375"). My handbook does list a 15/16 - 9 American standard thread, but the threads are so flat that they look more like an Acme. Perhaps they are worn flat? Joe(B) _____________________________________________________________ Get the competitive advantage you need with great fish finders. Click now! http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2211/fc/Ioyw6ijnGFrzBAD6yzDDE9S9J8wRv7 mbXwV2iHhGFnQMiqI7EE56Tw/ From jsnook at wcnet.org Wed Nov 7 09:36:32 2007 From: jsnook at wcnet.org (Jeff Snook) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 11:36:32 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets Message-ID: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to remember something posted awhile ago. Thanks, Jeff Snook http://www.snooksdreamcars.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Wed Nov 7 09:49:13 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 11:49:13 EST Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets Message-ID: Uncle Jack....only thing that worked with my headers. > Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to > remember something posted awhile ago. > > Thanks, > > Jeff Snook > http://www.snooksdreamcars.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > From tedtsimx at bright.net Wed Nov 7 10:31:32 2007 From: tedtsimx at bright.net (Ted Schumacher) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 12:31:32 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets In-Reply-To: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> References: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> Message-ID: <4731F674.5070500@bright.net> Jeff Snook wrote: > Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to > remember something posted awhile ago. > > Thanks, > > Jeff Snook > http://www.snooksdreamcars.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > Jeff, buy some header gasket material. You can get this at a speed shop. Trace your OE gaskets on this and head for the Exacto knife. Header gasket material is thicker and also has some give.this allows gasket material to conform to the variations in header flange. Ted -- Ted Schumacher tedtsimx at bright.net http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com 108 S. Jefferson St. Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Wed Nov 7 11:17:13 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 12:17:13 -0600 Subject: [Fot] coated bearings Message-ID: <200711071815.lA7IFLP7292896@ns3.geneseo.net> Here's a link to Calico Coatings. They are the company that does my machine shop's coatings. I highly recommend this process -- the performance advantages described on this web site are really true. I have two sets of bearings at their place right now. (no financial interst) http://www.calicocoatings.com/bearings.html uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Wed Nov 7 11:20:37 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 12:20:37 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets In-Reply-To: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> References: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> Message-ID: <200711071818.lA7IIigk280532@ns3.geneseo.net> At 10:36 AM 11/7/2007, Jeff Snook wrote: >Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to >remember something posted awhile ago. Yep - I've got them. Im having them made specially for us by a major gasket company . Compacted graphite, 1/8" thick, compresses to half the thickness, good for 2000 deg F. Shape slightly modified to make them better. Kinda pricey at $66.95 including shipping because of low production but they solve the problems. >Thanks, > >Jeff Snook >http://www.snooksdreamcars.com >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From S.Janzen at comcast.net Wed Nov 7 12:39:02 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 14:39:02 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets Message-ID: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or TR6 with a double row chain will work. From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 7 14:52:43 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 13:52:43 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica References: <20071107022354.OVRI29613.fed1rmmtao106.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> Message-ID: wow, Kubica is NUTS. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle Sent: Tue 11/6/2007 6:18 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica The best video yet that I have seen of the last lap battle between Massa and Kubica in the rain. Incredible close driving with neither driver giving more then the fraction of an inch that they needed to give. http://vimeo.com/348198/ Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Wed Nov 7 16:23:45 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 16:23:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] If more politicians thought like this... Message-ID: <20071107233753.PYCW18043.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> ...the world would be a better place! http://msn.foxsports.com/other/story/7417982?MSNHPHCP>1=10637 British govt. minister quits to race cars LONDON (AP) - A British government minister has stepped down to follow his dream of becoming a race car driver. Lord Drayson, Britain's defense procurement minister, is taking an indefinite leave of absence to compete in the American Le Mans series, Prime Minister Gordon Brown's office said Wednesday. Paul Drayson, 47, a former pharmaceuticals entrepreneur appointed to the House of Lords in 2004, said last year that he took up competitive motor racing as part of a "mid-life crisis." Drayson, who competes in a bioethanol-fueled Aston Martin, qualified for the U.S. competition by placing second at this year's British GT championship. Drayson was appointed to the Ministry of Defense in 2005 by then-Prime Minister Tony Blair to oversee Britain's $30 billion military hardware budget. In a letter to Brown, Drayson described the chance to compete as a "once-in-a-lifetime opportunity" and "a key step towards my eventual dream of success in the Le Mans 24-hour endurance race." The American Le Mans Series, a North American counterpart to the famous French endurance race, announced earlier this year that almost all its cars would race on biofuel. From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Wed Nov 7 16:42:41 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 15:42:41 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets References: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: <018301c82197$e3728290$1b02a8c0@workstation3> Vernier cam sprocket works nicely, Spitfire, TR6, GT6. TMG1225 Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Janzen" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 11:39 AM Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From koblinger at verizon.net Wed Nov 7 16:56:02 2007 From: koblinger at verizon.net (koblinger at verizon.net) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 17:56:02 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica Message-ID: <13351872.7181061194479762451.JavaMail.root@vms075.mailsrvcs.net> Good, maybe even great, but not as great as Villeneuve - Arnoux..... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sDtn8QnpFg Cheers, Kurt O. >From: Bill Babcock >Date: 2007/11/07 Wed PM 03:52:43 CST >To: "David W. Riddle" , fot at autox.team.net >Subject: Re: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica >wow, Kubica is NUTS. > > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle >Sent: Tue 11/6/2007 6:18 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica > >The best video yet that I have seen of the last lap battle between >Massa and Kubica in the rain. Incredible close driving with neither >driver giving more then the fraction of an inch that they needed to give. > >http://vimeo.com/348198/ >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Wed Nov 7 19:02:42 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 19:02:42 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment Message-ID: <001001c821ab$72d8e380$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Has anyone had any experience with cryo treating. I read enough good stuff about I had it done to all my bearings rods, crank, flywheel, cam & chain tensioner. Crank & rods were shot peened & mag'd too. It was cheap anough and local so I just went for it. Any feedback or prior experience ? Jim G From dave at microworks.net Wed Nov 7 18:11:56 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 18:11:56 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica In-Reply-To: <13351872.7181061194479762451.JavaMail.root@vms075.mailsrvc s.net> References: <13351872.7181061194479762451.JavaMail.root@vms075.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <20071108012957.UNER2804.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> I don't know. I remember thinking during the race and watching the battle live on Speed that this surpassed the Gille v. Rene battle. After all, Massa and Kubica were going at it in the rain on full wet tires! At 04:56 PM 11/7/2007, you wrote: >Good, maybe even great, but not as great as Villeneuve - Arnoux..... > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sDtn8QnpFg > >Cheers, >Kurt O. > > >From: Bill Babcock > >Date: 2007/11/07 Wed PM 03:52:43 CST > >To: "David W. Riddle" , fot at autox.team.net > >Subject: Re: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica > > >wow, Kubica is NUTS. > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle > >Sent: Tue 11/6/2007 6:18 PM > >To: fot at autox.team.net > >Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica > > > >The best video yet that I have seen of the last lap battle between > >Massa and Kubica in the rain. Incredible close driving with neither > >driver giving more then the fraction of an inch that they needed to give. > > > >http://vimeo.com/348198/ > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Wed Nov 7 18:44:42 2007 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (steve) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 17:44:42 -0800 (GMT-08:00) Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment Message-ID: <16511563.1194486282792.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net> I'm from Wisconsin so my TR3 has been cryo treated for 40 winters :) ~Steve -----Original Message----- >From: James Gray >Sent: Nov 7, 2007 6:02 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment > >Has anyone had any experience with cryo treating. I read enough good >stuff about I had it done to all my bearings >rods, crank, flywheel, cam & chain tensioner. Crank & rods were shot >peened & mag'd too. >It was cheap anough and local so I just went for it. Any feedback or >prior experience ? >Jim G >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jaboruch at netzero.net Wed Nov 7 19:27:08 2007 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 02:27:08 GMT Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment Message-ID: <20071107.212708.29942.0@webmail20.dca.untd.com> I have found that cryo treated brake rotors are much less prone to cracking than non treated ones, but that is about the best experience that I have found. It should help billet cranks, but should not do much for cast cranks. I have spoken to metalurgists about cryo treatment and for things like steel crankshafts and rods the treatment basically makes up for a bad heat treatment job. If a part was properly heat treated there should be no reason to cryo treat it. Cryo treatment coverts retained austinite (which is undesirable) to martinsite (desirable). This is because the austinite was not coverted during heat treatment. Cryo treatment is not enough on its own, since the part may be left too brittle. Parts should be tempered after Cryo treatment. There does not appear to be any good reason why cryo works for brake rotors, but it does. Also, not sure why it would do anything for bearing shells, blocks or pistons. I have heard from the cryo treaters that for pistons and blocks the treatment serves to stress relieve the part. I am not quite convinced that it is worth doing blocks, pistons, bearings, rings, etc. How many engine failures are there that stress relieving would have stopped? If I have a block failure it is because a rod went through it because of a head gasket leak or valve failure. Any piston failures have been because of an errant valve or detonation, not just a breakdown of the piston. That's my 2 cents on the topic. Joe(B) -- "James Gray" wrote: Has anyone had any experience with cryo treating. I read enough good stuff about I had it done to all my bearings rods, crank, flywheel, cam & chain tensioner. Crank & rods were shot peened & mag'd too. It was cheap anough and local so I just went for it. Any feedback or prior experience ? Jim G Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _____________________________________________________________ Click to find local singles for dating, romance and fun. http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2211/fc/Ioyw6ijm1qSyAJZsz0b2FuGNGsKzUg v964jdqBOMwhceal2PkgnRSd/ From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Wed Nov 7 19:37:01 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 20:37:01 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets References: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: <003601c821b0$3f4ed1f0$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> British Parts Northwest has them: Click here for bigger image Product Name: Cam Gear Vernier TR250-TR6 Our Price: $192.86 Availability: In Stock Product Number: TMG1225 Product Weight: 2.75 lb. Rating: Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Janzen" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 1:39 PM Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a > Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of TMG1225_m.jpg] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/gif which had a name of star.gif] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/gif which had a name of halfstar.gif] From spyderweb at uwalumni.com Wed Nov 7 20:20:35 2007 From: spyderweb at uwalumni.com (spyderweb at uwalumni.com) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 21:20:35 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica Message-ID: <20071107212035.uf204jyl0gk8wgs8@secure.uwalumni.com> Quoth Bill Babcock: >> >wow, Kubica is NUTS. Perhaps... and being nuts is not a good thing. But letting everyone else on the track THINK you're nuts is a definite advantage :-) Jim Hill From klynch_6 at msn.com Wed Nov 7 20:53:50 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 20:53:50 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment References: <001001c821ab$72d8e380$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: Jim, did my front rotors as a test and have been pleasantly surprised. Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: James Gray To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 7:02 PM Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment Has anyone had any experience with cryo treating. I read enough good stuff about I had it done to all my bearings rods, crank, flywheel, cam & chain tensioner. Crank & rods were shot peened & mag'd too. It was cheap anough and local so I just went for it. Any feedback or prior experience ? Jim G _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vintage.racer at comcast.net Wed Nov 7 21:14:36 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 20:14:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Speed Trap Message-ID: <004701c821bd$e05bd770$a1138650$@racer@comcast.net> Hello: Those of us that have had the unfortunate opportunity to be at the wrong end of a police officer's radar gun will appreciate the following. This was too good not to share with you'all. Gary This is a real News item - Two British traffic patrol officers from North Berwick were involved in an unusual incident while checking for speeding motorists on the A1 Great North Road. One of the officers used a hand-held radar device to check the speed of a vehicle approaching over the crest of a hill, and was surprised when the speed was recorded at over 300 mph. Their radar suddenly stopped working and the officers were not able to reset it. Just then a deafening roar over the treetops revealed that the radar had in fact latched on to a NATO Tornado fighter jet which was engaged in a low-flying exercise over the Border district, approaching from the North Sea. Back at police headquarters the chief constable fired off a stiff complaint to the RAF Liaison office. Back came the reply in true laconic RAF style: "Thank you for your message, which allows us to complete the file on this incident. You may be interested to know that the tactical computer in the Tornado had detected the presence of, and subsequently locked onto, your hostile radar equipment and automatically sent a jamming signal back to it. Furthermore, an air-to-ground missile aboard the fully-armed aircraft had also automatically locked onto your equipment. Fortunately the pilot flying the Tornado recognized the situation for what it was, quickly responded to the missile systems alert status, and was able to override the automated defence system before the missile was launched and your hostile radar installation was destroyed. " From spreiss at verizon.net Wed Nov 7 05:38:50 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 23:38:50 +1100 Subject: [Fot] speed trap Message-ID: <002801c8213b$26bf56c0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Gary Tremendous! Thanks for a really good laugh. Steve P. This is a real News item - Two British traffic patrol officers from North Berwick were involved in an unusual incident while checking for speeding motorists on the A1 Great North Road. From gp89 at charter.net Thu Nov 8 03:20:07 2007 From: gp89 at charter.net (gp89 at charter.net) Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 2:20:07 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets In-Reply-To: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: <20071108052007.SFAQ5.134663.root@mp20> www.aptfast.com part #vcs-07 Jeff Senty ---- Scott Janzen wrote: > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gp89 at charter.net Thu Nov 8 03:23:22 2007 From: gp89 at charter.net (gp89 at charter.net) Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 2:23:22 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets Message-ID: <20071108052322.TXKB0.134670.root@mp20> www.aptfast.com part #vcs-07 Jeff Senty ---- Scott Janzen wrote: > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gp89 at charter.net Thu Nov 8 03:23:35 2007 From: gp89 at charter.net (gp89 at charter.net) Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 2:23:35 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets In-Reply-To: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: <20071108052335.V6LGT.134673.root@mp20> www.aptfast.com part #vcs-07 Jeff Senty ---- Scott Janzen wrote: > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Thu Nov 8 08:48:22 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Thu, 08 Nov 2007 08:48:22 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Think this would beat a Spyker? Message-ID: <20071108155300.RYFZ9950.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> http://www.autoblog.com/2007/11/07/f1-lawn-mower-cuts-down-the-competition-like-schumacher/ From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 9 07:34:58 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 09:34:58 EST Subject: [Fot] Val's Spotted Spitfire Message-ID: Amici, Does anyone have a pic of Val Ascensio's Spitfire they could get to me this morning? Steve ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From jaboruch at netzero.net Fri Nov 9 09:52:33 2007 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 16:52:33 GMT Subject: [Fot] TR3 -TR4A shocks and... Message-ID: <20071109.115233.19660.1@webmail09.dca.untd.com> Does anyone happen to know what the difference in length is between TR3/4 and TR4A/6 front shocks? Next question: Has anyone come up with an easy way to do weight jacking at the front end of TR3-6s? Does not look like my plans to change to front coilovers and tubular A-arms will be economically viable, so on to plan B. I would like to be able to easily adjust front corner weights for different tracks. While most tracks in the Northeast are mostly right turns, NHIS is mostly lefts and Pocono can go either way. I am looking at AFCO adjustable coil spring spacers, but just want to make sure that I am not missing something that is obvious or has already been done. Right now I have a shortened stock spring spacer that I swap from side to side as needed, but it is very time consuming and I seem to have less and less time during the season to make such changes. Joe(B) _____________________________________________________________ Click here to find the inside track on available commercial real estate. http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2211/fc/Ioyw6ijl28Xl0QOb0Dsqfclt7YvxUH LAbO4iIqpxPvFqfSQred7QE6/ From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Fri Nov 9 11:00:30 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 12:00:30 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B4FFC4D@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I'm looking for some advice from somebody with racing experience with Speedie sleeves. Due to grooving on the original parts I have them on the transmission and differential flanges. With very little usage the trans seal gave up the ghost and bow I've wiped out the pinion seal. The diff and tranny are tight so it is not wobbleing apart. It seems to me that the increased diameter must be creating too much friction and heat. New flanges are unobtainable and I am using National brand seals as opposed to the crap the british car suppliers sell. What else can I do? Bob Kramer From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 9 11:02:31 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 13:02:31 EST Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves Message-ID: I've used them alot and heartily recommend them. Easy to install but expensive! ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From gtlund at cyberspeedway.net Fri Nov 9 15:13:04 2007 From: gtlund at cyberspeedway.net (greg) Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2007 15:13:04 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves In-Reply-To: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B4FFC4D@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> References: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B4FFC4D@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> Message-ID: <4734DB70.70503@cyberspeedway.net> Bob, Using a standard National buna or nitrile seal will not last very long with gear oil. Nitrile is listed as having "poor resistance to lubricants containing sulphur or EP additives". Our gear oil has these. Viton works much better. I suspect the original British Triumph seals were made from the proper compounds. I have solved many leakage problems with this one bit of info. I first ran into it with a Mark Williams 9" diff that would leak after a couple of sessions. Here is a link to Timken/National. http://www.timken.com/products/bearings/pdf/NSCInfoSection.pdf Timken owns the National industrial seals division. Look for section 1B. There is also a good listing of Redisleeves. P.S. The O-rings on TR transmission shift rails will actually seal if you use Viton. Anything over 180 degrees F ought to be Viton anyway. Greg Lund Kramer, Robert wrote: > I'm looking for some advice from somebody with racing experience with > Speedie sleeves. Due to grooving on the original parts I have them on > the transmission and differential flanges. With very little usage the > trans seal gave up the ghost and bow I've wiped out the pinion seal. The > diff and tranny are tight so it is not wobbleing apart. It seems to me > that the increased diameter must be creating too much friction and heat. > New flanges are unobtainable and I am using National brand seals as > opposed to the crap the british car suppliers sell. What else can I do? > > Bob Kramer > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Fri Nov 9 15:55:34 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 16:55:34 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves In-Reply-To: <4734DB70.70503@cyberspeedway.net> References: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B4FFC4D@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> <4734DB70.70503@cyberspeedway.net> Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B50013B@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> This is exactly the type of info I needed. The bearing supplier probably matched size to my Moss part in a better quality seal, but did not know enough about the apllication to get me one that would stand up. Thanks Greg. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: greg [mailto:gtlund at cyberspeedway.net] Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 4:13 PM To: Kramer, Robert Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Speedie sleeves Bob, Using a standard National buna or nitrile seal will not last very long with gear oil. Nitrile is listed as having "poor resistance to lubricants containing sulphur or EP additives". Our gear oil has these. Viton works much better. I suspect the original British Triumph seals were made from the proper compounds. I have solved many leakage problems with this one bit of info. I first ran into it with a Mark Williams 9" diff that would leak after a couple of sessions. Here is a link to Timken/National. http://www.timken.com/products/bearings/pdf/NSCInfoSection.pdf Timken owns the National industrial seals division. Look for section 1B. There is also a good listing of Redisleeves. P.S. The O-rings on TR transmission shift rails will actually seal if you use Viton. Anything over 180 degrees F ought to be Viton anyway. Greg Lund Kramer, Robert wrote: > I'm looking for some advice from somebody with racing experience with > Speedie sleeves. Due to grooving on the original parts I have them on > the transmission and differential flanges. With very little usage the > trans seal gave up the ghost and bow I've wiped out the pinion seal. The > diff and tranny are tight so it is not wobbleing apart. It seems to me > that the increased diameter must be creating too much friction and heat. > New flanges are unobtainable and I am using National brand seals as > opposed to the crap the british car suppliers sell. What else can I do? > > Bob Kramer > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Fri Nov 9 16:22:15 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2007 18:22:15 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves Message-ID: <0C77E17B.68416080.00159EE9@cs.com> VITON SEALS are usually the choice of John Deere engineers. >This is exactly the type of info I needed. The bearing supplier probably >matched size to my Moss part in a better quality seal, but did not know >enough about the apllication to get me one that would stand up. >Thanks Greg. > > >Bob Kramer >Sales Manager >RDO Equipment Co. >16415 North IH 35 >Pflugerville, TX 78660 >512-272-4141 >Fx 512-272-9365 > >-----Original Message----- >From: greg [mailto:gtlund at cyberspeedway.net] >Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 4:13 PM >To: Kramer, Robert >Cc: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: Re: [Fot] Speedie sleeves > >Bob, > Using a standard National buna or nitrile seal will not last very >long with gear oil. Nitrile is listed as having "poor resistance to >lubricants containing sulphur or EP additives". Our gear oil has these. >Viton works much better. I suspect the original British Triumph seals >were made from the proper compounds. I have solved many leakage problems >with this one bit of info. I first ran into it with a Mark Williams 9" >diff that would leak after a couple of sessions. Here is a link to >Timken/National. > >http://www.timken.com/products/bearings/pdf/NSCInfoSection.pdf > >Timken owns the National industrial seals division. Look for section 1B. > >There is also a good listing of Redisleeves. > >P.S. The O-rings on TR transmission shift rails will actually seal if >you use Viton. Anything over 180 degrees F ought to be Viton anyway. >Greg Lund > > >Kramer, Robert wrote: >> I'm looking for some advice from somebody with racing experience with >> Speedie sleeves. Due to grooving on the original parts I have them on >> the transmission and differential flanges. With very little usage the >> trans seal gave up the ghost and bow I've wiped out the pinion seal. >The >> diff and tranny are tight so it is not wobbleing apart. It seems to me >> that the increased diameter must be creating too much friction and >heat. >> New flanges are unobtainable and I am using National brand seals as >> opposed to the crap the british car suppliers sell. What else can I >do? >> >> Bob Kramer >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vintage.racer at comcast.net Fri Nov 9 16:31:09 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 15:31:09 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Oil Seal Material Message-ID: <000801c82328$9cd41d70$d67c5850$@racer@comcast.net> Here is a handy chart to compare oil seal materials, not the Dupont Dow Viton listing: www.pspglobal.com/low-temperature-seals.html. Gary From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 9 16:46:26 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 16:46:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] More speculation on F1 2008 season drivers Message-ID: <000701c8232a$be8365a0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Here is the current speculation by the F1-ToGo web site. It this holds true, Kas is partly right in his speculation (Alonzo goes to Renault and Ralf goes to the Post Office to check his mail). But Button stays with Honda And Heikki goes to McLaren instead of Honda. But Williams doesn't get a newbie, instead one of Toro Rosso's castoffs. McLaren : Lewis Hamilton and Heikki Kovalainen BMW : Nick Heidfeld and Robert Kubica Renault : Fernando Alonso and Nelson Piquet Jr Williams : Nico Rosberg and Tonio Liuzzi Honda : Jenson Button and Rubens Barrichello Red Bull : Mark Webber and David Coulthard Toyota : Jarno Trulli and Timo Glock Toro Rosso : Sebastien Bourdais and Sebastian Vettel Super Aguri : Takuma Sato and Anthony Davidson Force India : Adrian Sutil and Roland Rodriquez Isn't this silly season fun? :-) Joe C. From budscars at msn.com Fri Nov 9 16:55:29 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (RACER BUD) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 15:55:29 -0800 Subject: [Fot] More speculation on F1 2008 season drivers References: <000701c8232a$be8365a0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: or they all go to NASCAR? Racer Bud Sonoma, ca. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Curry" To: Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 3:46 PM Subject: [Fot] More speculation on F1 2008 season drivers > Here is the current speculation by the F1-ToGo > web > site. > > It this holds true, Kas is partly right in his speculation (Alonzo goes to > Renault and Ralf goes to the Post Office to check his mail). But Button > stays with Honda And Heikki goes to McLaren instead of Honda. But > Williams > doesn't get a newbie, instead one of Toro Rosso's castoffs. > > > > McLaren : Lewis Hamilton and Heikki Kovalainen > BMW : Nick Heidfeld and Robert Kubica > Renault : Fernando Alonso and Nelson Piquet Jr > Williams : Nico Rosberg and Tonio Liuzzi > Honda : Jenson Button and Rubens Barrichello > Red Bull : Mark Webber and David Coulthard > Toyota : Jarno Trulli and Timo Glock > Toro Rosso : Sebastien Bourdais and Sebastian Vettel > Super Aguri : Takuma Sato and Anthony Davidson > Force India : Adrian Sutil and Roland Rodriquez > > > > Isn't this silly season fun? :-) > > Joe C. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 9 18:43:39 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2007 18:43:39 -0700 Subject: [Fot] More speculation on F1 2008 season drivers In-Reply-To: <000701c8232a$be8365a0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> References: <000701c8232a$be8365a0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: <20071110015214.OGVG5967.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Almost. Tonio might be going to Williams, but the race lineup will be Rosberg and Nakajima. Guess Toyota is wanting a Japanese driver to go with their engine deal at Williams At 04:46 PM 11/9/2007, Joe Curry wrote: >Here is the current speculation by the F1-ToGo web >site. > >It this holds true, Kas is partly right in his speculation (Alonzo goes to >Renault and Ralf goes to the Post Office to check his mail). But Button >stays with Honda And Heikki goes to McLaren instead of Honda. But Williams >doesn't get a newbie, instead one of Toro Rosso's castoffs. > > > >McLaren : Lewis Hamilton and Heikki Kovalainen >BMW : Nick Heidfeld and Robert Kubica >Renault : Fernando Alonso and Nelson Piquet Jr >Williams : Nico Rosberg and Tonio Liuzzi >Honda : Jenson Button and Rubens Barrichello >Red Bull : Mark Webber and David Coulthard >Toyota : Jarno Trulli and Timo Glock >Toro Rosso : Sebastien Bourdais and Sebastian Vettel >Super Aguri : Takuma Sato and Anthony Davidson >Force India : Adrian Sutil and Roland Rodriquez > > > >Isn't this silly season fun? :-) > >Joe C. >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Fri Nov 9 20:15:00 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 19:15:00 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Ring gear Message-ID: <000e01c82347$e140a720$0502a8c0@desktop> Hey Friends, I took a lightweight flywheel to be fitted with a new ring gear to the machine shop today and the machinist asked me which way it went on. I didn't know what to tell him. This is an early (long snout crankshaft) TR6 flywheel and the ring gear has a chamfer on one side. If we use the chamfer to assist guiding the gear to the FW, the chamfered gear teeth face the transmission. This seems opposite of what should be to me. I see most older ring gear are set this way, but does a new installation with a modern starter go like this or with the chamfered teeth edge towards the motor? Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 From gtlund at cyberspeedway.net Fri Nov 9 21:33:48 2007 From: gtlund at cyberspeedway.net (greg) Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2007 21:33:48 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Ring gear In-Reply-To: <000e01c82347$e140a720$0502a8c0@desktop> References: <000e01c82347$e140a720$0502a8c0@desktop> Message-ID: <473534AC.2010609@cyberspeedway.net> Charly, The chamfered teeth face the direction the starter gear comes from. On older cars that used the inertia bendix, the chamfer faced the rear. I know this because I have an old Mueller flywheel that I had to hand chamfer the teeth on the front side for a modern starter. If you don't have the chamfer facing the starter, the gear teeth sometimes hit the ring gear teeth and won't engage. Greg Lund Charly Mitchel wrote: > Hey Friends, > I took a lightweight flywheel to be fitted with a new ring gear to the machine > shop today and the machinist asked me which way it went on. I didn't know > what to tell him. > This is an early (long snout crankshaft) TR6 flywheel and the ring gear has a > chamfer on one side. If we use the chamfer to assist guiding the gear to the > FW, the chamfered gear teeth face the transmission. This seems opposite of > what should be to me. I see most older ring gear are set this way, but does a > new installation with a modern starter go like this or with the chamfered > teeth edge towards the motor? > Charly Mitchel > TR6 #44 > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From triumphs at consolidated.net Sat Nov 10 09:06:47 2007 From: triumphs at consolidated.net (Ken Gano, home) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 10:06:47 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets In-Reply-To: <200711071818.lA7IIigk280532@ns3.geneseo.net> Message-ID: NFI, but a great product. It solved a very long standing problem on my street car. kg -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+triumphs=consolidated.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+triumphs=consolidated.net at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Jack W. Drews Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 12:21 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets At 10:36 AM 11/7/2007, Jeff Snook wrote: >Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to >remember something posted awhile ago. Yep - I've got them. Im having them made specially for us by a major gasket company . Compacted graphite, 1/8" thick, compresses to half the thickness, good for 2000 deg F. Shape slightly modified to make them better. Kinda pricey at $66.95 including shipping because of low production but they solve the problems. >Thanks, > >Jeff Snook >http://www.snooksdreamcars.com >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From walt at hot-tr6.com Sat Nov 10 11:09:45 2007 From: walt at hot-tr6.com (Walter Hollowell) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 11:09:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] SPAX SHOCKS Message-ID: <20071110181054.429E6187A05@autox.team.net> I have a couple of questions for FOT members about Spax adjustable shocks. 1. I have Spax adjustable shocks on all four corners of my TR6 which is a daily driver plus an autocrosser. The rear tube shocks are weak after 4 years of very hard use. My question is this: is there any place I can send these expensive shocks for a rebuild or do I throw them away and buy another pair? 2. I bought a pair of used Spax adjustable shocks on ebaymotors that was supposed to fit a TR6 rear conversion but I don't think they are. The following numbers are stamped into the bottom of the shock: G 933 10906 The shock is 14.5" long when compressed from tip to tip and 19" long when extended. an anyone help me identify these shocks? Thank You Walt Hollowell Abq., NM From jimhearn1 at comcast.net Sat Nov 10 11:58:31 2007 From: jimhearn1 at comcast.net (jim hearn) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 10:58:31 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Message-ID: <000401c823cb$aff2d740$171a694c@computer> Sorry, someone told me how to do this but I can't find the email now. My original question was how to get more negative camber on my '74 TR6 that I use to autocross (no street use). I have adjusted it with shims to a negative 1 = degrees. One person told me about removing part of the spring assembly but I can't find the email or recall the particulars of this email. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated, especially those in the email I have since misplaced. Thanks, Jim Sacramento, CA Two '74 TR6s [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] From trhouse at greenapple.com Sat Nov 10 11:55:05 2007 From: trhouse at greenapple.com (Tom Householder) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 13:55:05 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter Message-ID: I told a friend who was driving to calif about the stolen tr5 race car.... he just called and reported a transporter with 3 TR4s and some other race car on I-40 near Albuquerque NM. Doubt that it's the TR5 but curious as to who and what the race car is.. anyone out there know who is on the move From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Sat Nov 10 12:51:29 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 12:51:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 In-Reply-To: <000401c823cb$aff2d740$171a694c@computer> Message-ID: <000001c823d3$168ed470$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Two ways you can do it. Shorter springs and removing the spacers put some negative in. And/Or, you can; 1. Install longer bolts at the lower control arms and shim out more. 2. Slot the upper control arms at the ball joint and move the top of the trunion inboard. If you pull the spacers out you may want to replace them with the AFCO adjustable spacers so you can corner weight the car and dial in both at the same time. Jim G -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:59 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Sorry, someone told me how to do this but I can't find the email now. My original question was how to get more negative camber on my '74 TR6 that I use to autocross (no street use). I have adjusted it with shims to a negative 1 = degrees. One person told me about removing part of the spring assembly but I can't find the email or recall the particulars of this email. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated, especially those in the email I have since misplaced. Thanks, Jim Sacramento, CA Two '74 TR6s [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jimhearn1 at comcast.net Sat Nov 10 15:26:36 2007 From: jimhearn1 at comcast.net (jim hearn) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 14:26:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment Message-ID: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> Is it enough to tie (with rope) the steering wheel in opposite directions to stop movement in order to align for toe? If not, is there some other method that works. Jim [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] From klynch_6 at msn.com Sat Nov 10 15:40:57 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 15:40:57 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter References: Message-ID: Greg, Walt, Henry????!!!!! ----- Original Message ----- From: Tom Householder To: fot at autox.team.net ; triumphs at autox.team.net Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:55 AM Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter I told a friend who was driving to calif about the stolen tr5 race car.... he just called and reported a transporter with 3 TR4s and some other race car on I-40 near Albuquerque NM. Doubt that it's the TR5 but curious as to who and what the race car is.. anyone out there know who is on the move _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jimhearn1 at comcast.net Sat Nov 10 16:01:49 2007 From: jimhearn1 at comcast.net (jim hearn) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 15:01:49 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 In-Reply-To: <000001c823d3$168ed470$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: <000001c823ed$acf83c70$171a694c@computer> Jim, is it possible to dial in corner weight without actually weighing the corners? Is it possible to work from performance or from others' experience with my particular make and model ('74 TR6)? I had planned to take of my bumpers and windshield this winter but I'm sure this would have some effect on corner weight so maybe I need to calculate a little more before I start removing. Jim -----Original Message----- From: James Gray [mailto:toodamnfunky at comcast.net] Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:51 AM To: 'jim hearn' Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Two ways you can do it. Shorter springs and removing the spacers put some negative in. And/Or, you can; 1. Install longer bolts at the lower control arms and shim out more. 2. Slot the upper control arms at the ball joint and move the top of the trunion inboard. If you pull the spacers out you may want to replace them with the AFCO adjustable spacers so you can corner weight the car and dial in both at the same time. Jim G -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:59 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Sorry, someone told me how to do this but I can't find the email now. My original question was how to get more negative camber on my '74 TR6 that I use to autocross (no street use). I have adjusted it with shims to a negative 1 = degrees. One person told me about removing part of the spring assembly but I can't find the email or recall the particulars of this email. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated, especially those in the email I have since misplaced. Thanks, Jim Sacramento, CA Two '74 TR6s [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sat Nov 10 17:06:50 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 17:06:50 -0700 Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment In-Reply-To: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> References: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> Message-ID: <000e01c823f6$c244e0c0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> When I worked in a front end shop way back in High school, the owner had made a weight (about 10 pounds) with hooks on it that he would place on the bottom of the wheel when he centered it. If the front end moved while doing adjustments, the weight would return it to center. Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 3:27 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment Is it enough to tie (with rope) the steering wheel in opposite directions to stop movement in order to align for toe? If not, is there some other method that works. Jim From spreiss at verizon.net Sat Nov 10 02:05:45 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 20:05:45 +1100 Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment References: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> <000e01c823f6$c244e0c0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: <000801c82378$e152b240$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Just centering the wheel does not ensure that the steering is centered. My TR3 has no doubt had the steering wheel removed many times! I've removed it three or four times myself during the past two years of ownership. (Love those trafficators!) To center of the steering one must measure the degrees of rotation lock to lock and find the center point. The wheel position can then can be adjusted as required to center it. It may take a couple of tries, since the splines are quite closely spaced. Coincidentally, adjustment of the steering box (And perhaps the rack and pinion, though I have no experience with one) should also be performed at "center lock", as is stated in the manuals. This results in the tightest steering action throughout the movement without binding in the center, where wear is least. Steve Preiss ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Curry" To: "'jim hearn'" ; Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 11:06 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment > When I worked in a front end shop way back in High school, the owner had > made a weight (about 10 pounds) with hooks on it that he would place on the > bottom of the wheel when he centered it. If the front end moved while doing > adjustments, the weight would return it to center. > > Joe C. > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn > Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 3:27 PM > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment > > Is it enough to tie (with rope) the steering wheel in opposite directions to > stop movement in order to align for toe? If not, is there some other method > that works. Jim > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sat Nov 10 21:31:59 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 21:31:59 -0700 Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment In-Reply-To: <000801c82378$e152b240$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> References: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> <000e01c823f6$c244e0c0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> <000801c82378$e152b240$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <000a01c8241b$cce7a830$2202a8c0@newcomputer> You are correct sir. But the weight doesn't have to be on the bottom of the centered wheel. It just has to be at the bottom of the wheel when the steering is centered. Then after you have all the adjustments done, you can remove the wheel and properly position it. On a Spitfire or other car with a similar steering shaft (with a cam that cancels the turn signal), you not only center the rack, but you also have to then make sure that the cam is in the correct position (to the left between the cancelling dogs of the switch) and then make sure that the wheel is centered. Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: Steven Preiss [mailto:spreiss at verizon.net] Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 2:06 AM To: Joe Curry; 'jim hearn'; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment Just centering the wheel does not ensure that the steering is centered. My TR3 has no doubt had the steering wheel removed many times! I've removed it three or four times myself during the past two years of ownership. (Love those trafficators!) To center of the steering one must measure the degrees of rotation lock to lock and find the center point. The wheel position can then can be adjusted as required to center it. It may take a couple of tries, since the splines are quite closely spaced. Coincidentally, adjustment of the steering box (And perhaps the rack and pinion, though I have no experience with one) should also be performed at "center lock", as is stated in the manuals. This results in the tightest steering action throughout the movement without binding in the center, where wear is least. Steve Preiss ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Curry" To: "'jim hearn'" ; Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 11:06 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment > When I worked in a front end shop way back in High school, the owner had > made a weight (about 10 pounds) with hooks on it that he would place on the > bottom of the wheel when he centered it. If the front end moved while doing > adjustments, the weight would return it to center. > > Joe C. > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn > Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 3:27 PM > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment > > Is it enough to tie (with rope) the steering wheel in opposite directions to > stop movement in order to align for toe? If not, is there some other method > that works. Jim > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From triosan at gmail.com Sun Nov 11 09:49:43 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 08:49:43 -0800 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711110849x4e931970o6a48cb16c71b2cd9@mail.gmail.com> Thanks -- will be interesting to see if anybody else gets a sighting. On Nov 10, 2007 2:40 PM, KEVIN LYNCH wrote: > Greg, Walt, Henry????!!!!! > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Tom Householder > To: fot at autox.team.net ; > triumphs at autox.team.net > Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:55 AM > Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter > > > I told a friend who was driving to calif about the stolen tr5 race > car.... > he just called and reported a transporter with 3 TR4s and some other race > car on I-40 near Albuquerque NM. Doubt that it's the TR5 but curious as > to > who and what the race car is.. anyone out there know who is on the move > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot< > http://autox.team.net/mailman/li > stinfo/fot> > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > -- Chuck Arnold From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Sun Nov 11 11:08:33 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 11:08:33 -0700 Subject: [Fot] asymetrical corner weighting & custom alignments Message-ID: <000401c8248d$dff25b10$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> I was just curious as to how many members use asymetrical setups and special alignments for different tracks. I know some that setup for predominantly left or right turns or even just a few key corners. By the by, Jim Hearn in Sacramento is looking for some corner scales for a day. Anybody know of a club out that way that has a set ? Jim G From ablake2 at austin.rr.com Sun Nov 11 12:34:48 2007 From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com (Greg & Alison Blake) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 13:34:48 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Head modifications Message-ID: <000a01c82499$ebed8ff0$6401a8c0@blake1> Has anyone had success using an epoxy to change the shape of an intake or exhaust port or is welding the only way to go? Thanks, Greg From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Sun Nov 11 13:35:15 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 13:35:15 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d0711110848w49511a26k1b28d9eddcf4a7f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <001201c824a2$5df4b800$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> This link shows the spacer jg http://www.midwestmotorsportsinc.com/order_part.php?item=20191 &line=AFC -----Original Message----- From: Chuck Arnold [mailto:triosan at gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 9:48 AM To: James Gray Subject: Re: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Please tell me what an AFCO adjustable spacer is. Thanks. On Nov 10, 2007 11:51 AM, James Gray wrote: Two ways you can do it. Shorter springs and removing the spacers put some negative in. And/Or, you can; 1. Install longer bolts at the lower control arms and shim out more. 2. Slot the upper control arms at the ball joint and move the top of the trunion inboard. If you pull the spacers out you may want to replace them with the AFCO adjustable spacers so you can corner weight the car and dial in both at the same time. Jim G -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net ] On Behalf Of jim hearn Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:59 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Sorry, someone told me how to do this but I can't find the email now. My original question was how to get more negative camber on my '74 TR6 that I use to autocross (no street use). I have adjusted it with shims to a negative 1 = degrees. One person told me about removing part of the spring assembly but I can't find the email or recall the particulars of this email. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated, especially those in the email I have since misplaced. Thanks, Jim Sacramento, CA Two '74 TR6s [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot -- Chuck Arnold From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Sun Nov 11 14:35:56 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 15:35:56 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Head modifications In-Reply-To: <000a01c82499$ebed8ff0$6401a8c0@blake1> References: <000a01c82499$ebed8ff0$6401a8c0@blake1> Message-ID: <200711112134.lABLY7fp287303@ns3.geneseo.net> I have used epoxy. I've used JB Weld and it is generally thought to be superior as far as stiction goes, but it is so runny that you have to build a dam to keep it in and then grind all of that away. A product that is easier is Moroso A & B. It comes in two bars about like big Snickers bars. It is made expressly for this purpose. It works fine but you must be very careful to mix it thoroughly before use. I have never tried it in an exhaust port but only in intake ports. I've never had a failure, but the danger is always there, and I no longer use it. I've found ways to make the TR4 head flow just as well without it. One of the most interesting experiments was trying to make a "high velocity" port like they use on high rpm motorcycle engines. I theorized that the best place to restrict the flow was right at the downturn of the port. I built up the radius until there was only about 60% of the port cross sectional area remaining. Then we took the car to a chassis dyno and ran it with a head with epoxy and a head without. Common sense told me that we would lose hp, but I've seen the dyno curves for hot bikes and they showed higher hp so I was really curious about it. Plus I was out of ideas at the time. We found that this experiment lost us 8 hp. I later tumbled to the fact that the cycle guys experience gains above 8000 rpm, not below. At 01:34 PM 11/11/2007, you wrote: >Has anyone had success using an epoxy to change the shape of an intake >or exhaust port or is welding the only way to go? > >Thanks, > >Greg >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From vintage.racer at comcast.net Sun Nov 11 15:01:55 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 14:01:55 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Racing videos from the 1960's Message-ID: <000001c824ae$79931190$6cb934b0$@racer@comcast.net> Hello: Here is a link to some good "vintage" race footage of the Lotus F1 cars of that era along with other racing videos: Gary http://www.blinkx.com/burl?v=Uamw9xGoXYfAAgVv6hiyJg From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Sun Nov 11 18:21:19 2007 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 17:21:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Message-ID: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard From klynch_6 at msn.com Sun Nov 11 18:46:36 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 18:46:36 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Here, here...! A timely post. Kev Lynch ----- Original Message ----- From: EDWARD BARNARD To: FOT Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 6:21 PM Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From lunkercars at earthlink.net Sun Nov 11 19:16:45 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 19:16:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <346C4E05-DE94-4BD8-8074-52242CDCEDE1@earthlink.net> Just picked up this message. Any details? [where, when, parked or moving?] Perhaps to late now but I would be happy to follow up. Greg On Nov 10, 2007, at 11:55 AM, Tom Householder wrote: > I told a friend who was driving to calif about the stolen tr5 race > car.... > he just called and reported a transporter with 3 TR4s and some > other race > car on I-40 near Albuquerque NM. Doubt that it's the TR5 but > curious as to > who and what the race car is.. anyone out there know who is on the > move > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From budscars at msn.com Sun Nov 11 19:18:24 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (RACER BUD) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 18:18:24 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Thanks Ed..I greatly appreciate your email...........I am not a Vet....I am extremely proud to say that...2 of my 4 kids, and 1 son in law are now serving us... My oldest son , Scott(35), is an Officer and Diver for the Coast Guard..securing our ports against terrorism..(he was a rescue swimmer) he's now stationed in Boston...My youngest daughter, Liz(23)...and her husband, Frieden, are Air Force Officers, living in Gulf Breeze Fl...They are both USAFA Grads....Liz is a logistics officer, and Frieden is in Pilot Training.... Good Job Ed! Racer Bud..Sonoma, Ca..spitfire #21 ----- Original Message ----- From: "EDWARD BARNARD" To: "FOT" Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 5:21 PM Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the > other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd > Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From ehusmann53 at yahoo.com Sun Nov 11 19:36:16 2007 From: ehusmann53 at yahoo.com (Ernest Husmann) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 18:36:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <586906.9711.qm@web57615.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Thanks Ed. If you have a copy of Old Glory, fly Her. If nothing else it's a show of support for the kids doing our duty. Ernie EDWARD BARNARD wrote: Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From BillB at bnj.com Sun Nov 11 20:07:59 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 19:07:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Thanks. I kind of forgot it was Veteran's day. I think I'm the only Vet in my company. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of EDWARD BARNARD Sent: Sun 11/11/2007 5:21 PM To: FOT Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tarch at bellsouth.net Mon Nov 12 06:58:14 2007 From: tarch at bellsouth.net (Richard Taylor) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 08:58:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys remember that old stuff? Richard L. Taylor Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From greenman62 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 12 07:20:07 2007 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (greenman62 at hotmail.com) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 14:20:07 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> Message-ID: Sure... 1505s... "Lifers", Blue wool shirts (they made a comeback in the late 60s USAF)... tech school down the road at my old man's Alma Mater (Chanute)... My Chief Observer at Shaw AFB trying to catch my trainer and I napping during a midnight shift by climbing up the shaky weather tower's escape rope... getting half way up and being treated by a shower of cold coffee for his troubles. "Gee, Sgt. Kemp (not his real name) we didn't know you were there!" Sitting in the quiet darkness of a Phillippean night on a loading dock taking a break from editing weather reports with my friends... and suddenly being scared to death when a rice bug the size of a Buick smacked into the steel door behind us... Life was tough at the sharp end of the sling psychrometer. 'Now back in the brown shoe days..." Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > From: tarch at bellsouth.net > To: BillB at bnj.com; edwardbarnard at prodigy.net; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 08:58:14 -0500 > Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and > tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys > remember that old stuff? > > Richard L. Taylor > > Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other > veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all > the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wensley_Tr at comcast.net Mon Nov 12 07:48:19 2007 From: wensley_Tr at comcast.net (Craig) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 09:48:19 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day..In honor of Veteran's Day Message-ID: <002f01c8253b$1128e4d0$0200a8c0@Desktop> Keep it moving, please, even if you've seen it before. It is the VETERAN , not the preacher, who has given us freedom of religion. It is the VETERAN , not the reporter, who has given us freedom of the press. It is the VETERAN , not the poet, who has given us freedom of speech. It is the VETERAN , not the campus organizer, who has given us freedom to assemble. It is the VETERAN , not the lawyer, who has given us the right to a fair trial. It is the VETERAN , not the politician, Who has given us the right to vote. It is the VETERAN , who salutes the Flag, It is the veteran , who serves under the Flag, ETERNAL REST GRANT THEM O LORD, AND LET PERPETUAL LIGHT SHINE UPON THEM. I don't usually suggest that many emails be forwarded, but I'd be EXTREMELY proud if this one reached as many as possible. We can be very proud of our young men and women in the service no matter where they serve. God Bless them all!!! = [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/gif] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg] From stutzmans at comcast.net Mon Nov 12 08:38:41 2007 From: stutzmans at comcast.net (Stutzman) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:38:41 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002201c82542$51a5f8c0$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> aT OUR WPTA meeting SAT. 2 of our members who are Marines, played the Marine Corp. anthem. And of course they reminded us - once a Marine always a Marine. Ed Woods, 67 years old, ran the marithon on DC with his 2 daughters. Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "EDWARD BARNARD" ; "FOT" Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 10:07 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day > Thanks. I kind of forgot it was Veteran's day. I think I'm the only Vet in > my > company. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of EDWARD BARNARD > Sent: Sun 11/11/2007 5:21 PM > To: FOT > Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the > other > veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to > all > the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tarch at bellsouth.net Mon Nov 12 09:14:55 2007 From: tarch at bellsouth.net (Richard Taylor) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 11:14:55 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <002201c82542$51a5f8c0$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <002201c82542$51a5f8c0$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> Message-ID: <006801c82547$2ae0cb20$6401a8c0@richardiipc> "Once a Marine, always a Marine." Hmm, it sounds incurable, maybe something like herpes. Richard (ex Grunt) aT OUR WPTA meeting SAT. 2 of our members who are Marines, played the Marine Corp. anthem. And of course they reminded us - once a Marine always a Marine. Ed Woods, 67 years old, ran the marithon on DC with his 2 daughters. Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "EDWARD BARNARD" ; "FOT" Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 10:07 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day > Thanks. I kind of forgot it was Veteran's day. I think I'm the only Vet in > my > company. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of EDWARD BARNARD > Sent: Sun 11/11/2007 5:21 PM > To: FOT > Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the > other > veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to > all > the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 12 09:31:43 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 11:31:43 EST Subject: [Fot] paging Mark Eden Message-ID: Trip in the offing to Wyotech. First dates available after Thanksgiving. Joe A From ehusmann53 at yahoo.com Mon Nov 12 10:58:53 2007 From: ehusmann53 at yahoo.com (Ernest Husmann) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 09:58:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <581931.78689.qm@web57607.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Chanute ... Falling out at 0330 every day in the middle of winter to march to the chow hall a half mile away. Then reforming to march to the hanger about two miles away. Sorry can't tell you about going up hill both ways because there were no hills at Chanute that would even slightly deflect the damn wind. Made it back to Chanute this past spring. Civilian now, most of the buildings are vacant, the aircraft are gone, as are the manicured lawns. Sad to see the condition it was in. greenman62 at hotmail.com wrote: Sure... 1505s... "Lifers", Blue wool shirts (they made a comeback in the late 60s USAF)... tech school down the road at my old man's Alma Mater (Chanute)... Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From kaskas at cox.net Mon Nov 12 11:38:27 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:38:27 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <581931.78689.qm@web57607.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <00b301c8255b$370e12e0$3f0ec548@RW> Yeah, they've even made Camp Polk a Fort now. I still think that place was a nice spot for a vacant lot. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ernest Husmann" To: ; "'FOT'" Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 9:58 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day > Chanute ... Falling out at 0330 every day in the middle of winter to march > to the chow hall a half mile away. Then reforming to march to the hanger > about two miles away. Sorry can't tell you about going up hill both ways > because there were no hills at Chanute that would even slightly deflect > the damn wind. > > Made it back to Chanute this past spring. Civilian now, most of the > buildings are vacant, the aircraft are gone, as are the manicured lawns. > Sad to see the condition it was in. > > greenman62 at hotmail.com wrote: > Sure... 1505s... "Lifers", Blue wool shirts (they made a comeback in the > late > 60s USAF)... tech school down the road at my old man's Alma Mater > (Chanute)... > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jeff_durant at comcast.net Mon Nov 12 11:37:33 2007 From: jeff_durant at comcast.net (jeff_durant at comcast.net) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 18:37:33 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com><004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> Message-ID: <1077169673-1194892780-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-2096115072-@bxe103.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Richard, Thanks to you and all the other Veterans, we enjoy the freedoms we have today. Long may it be so. My father was also in the 11th Airborne in Korea. He was very proud of it as I'm sure you are. God Bless, Jeff Durant Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T -----Original Message----- From: "Richard Taylor" Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 08:58:14 To:"'Bill Babcock'" , "'EDWARD BARNARD'", "'FOT'" Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys remember that old stuff? Richard L. Taylor Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Mon Nov 12 11:50:19 2007 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:50:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: Veteran's Day Message-ID: <979091.40151.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Note: forwarded message attached. Received: from [75.41.205.147] by web81205.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 PST Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 -0800 (PST) From: EDWARD BARNARD Subject: RE: [Fot] Veteran's Day To: Richard Taylor In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0 at richardiipc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 994 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Richard: Still have my kun#cap hanging with my dress greens in the closet with a pair of boots, one set of jungles and one of deserts. What is it that some things we never get rid of? Funny, today on the radio I hear everybody saying it's Veteran's Day. People remember it as a bank holiday and not Armistice Day. As a kid back home, on the 11th hour, of the 11th day, of the 11th month, the sirens would blow and the church bells would ring. Today people curse it because they're not going to get their mail! - Ed Richard Taylor wrote: As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys remember that old stuff? Richard L. Taylor Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From trhouse at greenapple.com Mon Nov 12 08:54:32 2007 From: trhouse at greenapple.com (Tom Householder) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:54:32 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day WWII Memorial In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 11/12/07 9:20 AM, greenman62 at hotmail.com at greenman62 at hotmail.com wrote: > Sure... 1505s... "Lifers", Blue wool shirts (they made a comeback in the late > 60s USAF)... tech school down the road at my old man's Alma Mater (Chanute)... > My Chief Observer at Shaw AFB trying to catch my trainer and I napping during > a midnight shift by climbing up the shaky weather tower's escape rope... > getting half way up and being treated by a shower of cold coffee for his > troubles. "Gee, Sgt. Kemp (not his real name) we didn't know you were there!" > Sitting in the quiet darkness of a Phillippean night on a loading dock taking > a break from editing weather reports with my friends... and suddenly being > scared to death when a rice bug the size of a Buick smacked into the steel > door behind us... > > Life was tough at the sharp end of the sling psychrometer. > > 'Now back in the brown shoe days..." > > Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois > > That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > > > >> From: tarch at bellsouth.net >> To: BillB at bnj.com; edwardbarnard at prodigy.net; fot at autox.team.net >> Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 08:58:14 -0500 >> Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day >> >> As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and >> tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys >> remember that old stuff? >> >> Richard L. Taylor >> >> Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day >> >> Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other >> veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to > all >> the Corps veteran's! >> -Ed Barnard >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > There was a story in the local paper on the WWII memorial for those who are or have friends /family WWII vets. check this site for there existence there if not there see that they are honored by having there names registerd. http://www.wwiimemorial.com also see "Names still Absent from WWII Registry" article ... Columbus Dispatch Nov 11. 2007 (OHIO) From billsohl at optonline.net Mon Nov 12 12:40:14 2007 From: billsohl at optonline.net (Bill Sohl) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 14:40:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <979091.40151.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <979091.40151.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8E0FCF11FDA7499EBC6185ECD99AC59D@SohlPC> I wish the recent PBS series "The WAR" by Ken Burns would be mandatory viewing for all high school kids. The series (and I only caught 2 of the 7 parts) is truly told on a very personal level...one that really brings to the forefront the sacrifices made by so many. There is a book version also and I read it cover-to-cover and am still in awe as to the sacrifices made by so many on our behalf. I served (US Navy) from 66-70 and even though my ship (DD-781, a destroyer) was in the Vietnam war zone (late 68 through spring 69) providing gunfire support and doing other war time duties we thankfully were never shot at by anyone. I can't imagine the actual feelings one must go through when on the receiving end of enemy gunfire. Anyone who has served, regardless of it being peacetime or wartime deserves my respect because no one ever knows when peacetime can suddenly be wartime on a moments notice putting everyone in the service potentially in harms way. With sincerest respect for all who served, Bill Sohl ----------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "EDWARD BARNARD" To: "FOT" Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 1:50 PM Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: Veteran's Day > Note: forwarded message attached. > Received: from [75.41.205.147] by web81205.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; > Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 PST > Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 -0800 (PST) > From: EDWARD BARNARD > Subject: RE: [Fot] Veteran's Day > To: Richard Taylor > In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0 at richardiipc> > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > Content-Length: 994 > X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d > X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain > > Richard: Still have my kun#cap hanging with my dress greens in the closet > with a pair of boots, one set of jungles and one of deserts. What is it > that some things we never get rid of? Funny, today on the radio I hear > everybody saying it's Veteran's Day. People remember it as a bank holiday > and not Armistice Day. As a kid back home, on the 11th hour, of the 11th > day, of the 11th month, the sirens would blow and the church bells would > ring. Today people curse it because they're not going to get their mail! > - Ed > > Richard Taylor wrote: > As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and > tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys > remember that old stuff? > > Richard L. Taylor > > Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the > other > veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to > all > the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 12 13:32:27 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 15:32:27 -0500 Subject: [Fot] =?iso-8859-1?q?=A0Veteran=27s_Day?= Message-ID: <2933D1CD.25C85F6A.00159EE9@cs.com> THE WAR was extremely interesting...so many facets brought together. AND.... AMERICAN PATRIOT: THE LIFE & WARS OF BUD DAY will get your attention.. Richard Taylor's friend, ROBERT CORAM, ought to be in line for his third Pulitzer nomination for his biography of the nation's most decorated living warrior. And Bud Day should get one last medal for saving 95% of the service benefits that were taken away, after he returned from the Hanoi Hilton. FIGHTER PILOT, LAWYER, IOWAN. JoeA >I wish the recent PBS series "The WAR" by Ken Burns would be mandatory >viewing for all high school kids. The series (and I only caught 2 of the 7 >parts) is truly told on a very personal level...one that really brings to >the forefront the sacrifices made by so many. >There is a book version also and I read it cover-to-cover and am still in >awe as to the sacrifices made by so many on our behalf. > >I served (US Navy) from 66-70 and even though my ship (DD-781, a destroyer) >was in the Vietnam war zone (late 68 through spring 69) providing gunfire >support and doing other war time duties we thankfully were never shot at by >anyone. I can't imagine the actual feelings one must go through when on >the receiving end of enemy gunfire. > >Anyone who has served, regardless of it being peacetime or wartime deserves >my respect because no one ever knows when peacetime can suddenly be wartime >on a moments notice putting everyone in the service potentially in harms >way. > >With sincerest respect for all who served, >Bill Sohl >----------------- >----- Original Message ----- >From: "EDWARD BARNARD" >To: "FOT" >Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 1:50 PM >Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: Veteran's Day > > >> Note: forwarded message attached. >> Received: from [75.41.205.147] by web81205.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; >> Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 PST >> Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 -0800 (PST) >> From: EDWARD BARNARD >> Subject: RE: [Fot] Veteran's Day >> To: Richard Taylor >> In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0 at richardiipc> >> MIME-Version: 1.0 >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >> Content-Length: 994 >> X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d >> X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain >> >> Richard: Still have my kun#cap hanging with my dress greens in the closet >> with a pair of boots, one set of jungles and one of deserts. What is it >> that some things we never get rid of? Funny, today on the radio I hear >> everybody saying it's Veteran's Day. People remember it as a bank holiday >> and not Armistice Day. As a kid back home, on the 11th hour, of the 11th >> day, of the 11th month, the sirens would blow and the church bells would >> ring. Today people curse it because they're not going to get their mail! >> - Ed >> >> Richard Taylor wrote: >> As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and >> tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys >> remember that old stuff? >> >> Richard L. Taylor >> >> Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day >> >> Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the >> other >> veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to >> all >> the Corps veteran's! >> -Ed Barnard >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From trhouse at greenapple.com Mon Nov 12 02:06:09 2007 From: trhouse at greenapple.com (Tom Householder) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 04:06:09 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter In-Reply-To: <346C4E05-DE94-4BD8-8074-52242CDCEDE1@earthlink.net> Message-ID: on 11/11/07 9:16 PM, Greg "Lunker" Hilyer at lunkercars at earthlink.net wrote: > On Nov 10, 2007, at 11:55 AM, Tom Householder wrote: at the original post time and date it was east of Albquerque NM headed west on I 40 From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Mon Nov 12 20:44:49 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 19:44:49 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Oil Seal Material References: <000801c82328$9cd41d70$d67c5850$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: <003001c825a7$8b2cbbf0$6401a8c0@TER2> Actually leather is a pretty high perfromance seal material. One of the perfromance factors that is not mentioned in the chart at the Web Site at PSP is the surface speed of the shaft and seal contact. Leather can tolerate quite high surface speeds compared to most of the other materials. So leather English seals are not just old technology, the material is there for a reason! There are charts that give the surface speed tolerances in some older Chicago Rawhide seal catalogues that I have. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Horstkorta" To: Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 3:31 PM Subject: [Fot] Oil Seal Material > Here is a handy chart to compare oil seal materials, not the Dupont Dow > Viton listing: www.pspglobal.com/low-temperature-seals.html. > > > > Gary > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 13 07:45:11 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 09:45:11 EST Subject: [Fot] [6pack] FOT at The Glen Sept 2008 Message-ID: Thanks Dennis! You have more information than I do at this point on the special activities. www.grandprixfestival.com Egads! there's a lot of Triumph and sportscar stuff going on with the Village Fathers at the Glen. I knew about it, but had no idea of the extent of it until I visited the site: www.grandprixfestival.com We need to make note of that on our fot website, too. Thanks for jumping in....this is going to be a very special event...there will be a few surprises, as well. Joe Alexander Friends of Triumph > Triumph is also the featured marque for the Grand > Prix Festival of Watkins Glen being held on Friday, > September 5, 2008. Triumphs are eligible for the Tour > de Marque which gives you some great perks including > laps around WGI on Friday, lunch at the track and a > great parking spot for the festival which includes a > race reenactment through the streets of Watkins Glen! > There are only 100 spots available and registration > has already opened for previous 'Stone Bridge Drivers' > so get your registration in ASAP. > See www.grandprixfestival.com for more information. > > Dennis Culligan, Highland NY / 1976 TR6 CF57948U TR6IUMPH > From lang at isis.mit.edu Tue Nov 13 08:32:02 2007 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert Lang) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 10:32:02 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Oil Seal Material In-Reply-To: <003001c825a7$8b2cbbf0$6401a8c0@TER2> References: <000801c82328$9cd41d70$d67c5850$@racer@comcast.net> <003001c825a7$8b2cbbf0$6401a8c0@TER2> Message-ID: Hi, So, what you're saying Greg is that just because leather seals are old school, they still perform well. Hmmm, how about that! New isn't always better. I'm shocked. Shocked, I tell you! rml :-) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Room N42-140Q | This space for rent Vintage Consultant MIT IS&T unix-linux-help | Voice:617-253-7438 FAX: 617-258-9535 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 13 09:19:22 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 11:19:22 EST Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn Status for The Glen and a little more.... Message-ID: FoT: If you have been wondering about the status of reservations for the Hampton Inn....."Andrea" is behind in her paperwork and will be back to me with the particulars. "Today", she says. I just gave her a nudge...... I will pass a long her published contact information so that you can make your reservations directly. If you are really special and/or live off shore, I can make your reservations for you. Cary Perket suggests that you might make a better deal if you have a Triple A membership. You likely could make your reservations and then deal with that issue when you arrive on the premises. I didnt want to go back and renegotiate and muddy the water. Presently, the rooms are being reserved under THE FRIENDS OF TRIUMPH WITH a rate of $114.00. One more thing....I have had a couple of folks step forward and volunteer their help: Henry Frye and Tim Suddard: Press Releases Tom Strange: Paddock Coordination Scott Janzen & Ted Schumacher: Event Shirts I have also had a few commercial entities offer support. I am trying to think of role that they can play in this event. I am open to suggestions. Of course, GrassRoots Motors Sports (Classic Motorsports Magazine) is sponsoring the Triumph Race itself. The Roadster Factory is bringing the fabled Le Mans TRS as one of the Pace Cars, and for display. TS Enterprises always does us good on supplying the Event Shirts. Triumph Rescue and Ratco stepped forward, too, but nothing has been planned yet. Thanks! Joe Alexander From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 13 12:24:08 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 12:24:08 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Like riding a bike Message-ID: <20071113193430.DZPA28248.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> Schumacher quickest on F1 return http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=41285 "...Second quickest was Ferrari's regular test driver Luca Badoer, who was 0.2s slower in the sister car. McLaren's test driver Pedro de la Rosa was third fastest but the Spaniard was more than 0.7s slower..." 1. M.SCHUMACHER Ferrari 1m21.922s 2. BADOER Ferrari 1m22.129s 3. DE LA ROSA McLaren 1m22.687s 4. KOVALAINEN Renault 1m22.802s 5. KUBICA BMW 1m22.883s 6. PAFFETT McLaren 1m23.008s 7. NAKAJIMA Williams 1m23.187s 8. COULTHARD Red Bull 1m23.332s 9. TRULLI Toyota 1m23.624s 10. HEIDFELD BMW 1m23.671s 11. ROSBERG Williams 1m23.847s 12. MONTAGNY Toyota 1m23.861s 13. VETTEL Toro Rosso 1m24.048s 14. ZUBER Super Aguri 1m24.065s 15. BOURDAIS Toro Rosso 1m24.193s 16. DAVIDSON Super Aguri 1m24.246s 17. ROSSITER Honda 1m24.480s 18. CHANDHOK Red Bull 1m24.896s 19. VAN DER GARDE Force India 1m25.317s 20. RODRIGUEZ Force India 1m26.973s From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 13 12:26:09 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 12:26:09 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Brawn to Honda Message-ID: <20071113193431.ZEEA18714.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> Now this will be interesting to watch... Ross Brawn is leaving Ferrari and going to Honda as Team Principle. From fal at knology.net Tue Nov 13 13:06:48 2007 From: fal at knology.net (fredd) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 14:06:48 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Fw: Free TR-250 Body Message-ID: <01ec01c82630$bead4010$cbbdfea9@fredds> All, Just got off the phone with a guy in Birmingham, AL that has a TR-250 body that he would like to give away. The car had been modified for racing and a lot of parts were "cut off". However, he does still have the body parts that were removed. There is no engine or transmission and the floors were cut to accomadate a Jaguar engine... Also had a Franklin Quick Change rear end Anyway, if anyone is intersted, it's free to a good home, just got to go get it. His name is Kent Johnston Work- 800-633-4392 Home- 205-599-2204 Dave B From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 13 13:38:01 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 15:38:01 -0500 Subject: [Fot] =?iso-8859-1?q?Fw=3A_=A0Free_TR-250_Body?= Message-ID: <3EA27CA8.1F4BE0A9.00159EE9@cs.com> EGADS! this thing had a V-12 ENGINE in it. I am not sure about but I am going to be there with an empty trailer, anyway. thanks! >All, > > Just got off the phone with a guy in Birmingham, AL that has a TR-250 body > that he would like to give away. The car had been modified for racing > and a lot of parts were "cut off". However, he does still have the > body parts that were removed. There is no engine or transmission and > the floors were cut to accomadate a Jaguar engine... >Also had a Franklin Quick Change rear end > > Anyway, if anyone is intersted, it's free to a good home, just got to > go get it. > > His name is Kent Johnston > Work- 800-633-4392 > Home- 205-599-2204 > > Dave B >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From mark at bradakis.com Wed Nov 14 02:33:13 2007 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J. Bradakis) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 02:33:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] A type overdrive noise? Message-ID: <473AC0D9.2050604@bradakis.com> A local fellow recently purchased a '69 TR6 with overdrive. Starting about 25 - 30 mph the gearbox makes an odd whining sound, sort of like a bad bearing, but not really. The noise stops as soon as you engage the overdrive. Does this symptom sound familiar to anyone? Thanks, mjb. From lunkercars at earthlink.net Wed Nov 14 08:14:23 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg Lunker Hilyer) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 08:14:23 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: That's good as regards Chuck's TR- I would think it pretty unlikely a car stolen in Seattle would be headed west on I-40. Greg Hilyer On Nov 12, 2007, at 2:06 AM, Tom Householder wrote: > > at the original post time and date it was east of Albquerque NM > headed west > on I 40 From walt at hot-tr6.com Wed Nov 14 11:06:10 2007 From: walt at hot-tr6.com (Walter Hollowell) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 11:06:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] ARP question again Message-ID: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> I know the FOT site talked about this question a few weeks ago but I failed to save the informatin. I am building up a couple of TR6 blocks for racing and would like to consider ARP bolts for the main bearing caps. Does anyone have a source and or ARP part number you can forward me. Thanks for the help Walt Hollowell Abq., NM From rikrock at aol.com Wed Nov 14 13:56:52 2007 From: rikrock at aol.com (rikrock at aol.com) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 15:56:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Message-ID: <8C9F5180477D1FE-EC0-FF4@WEBMAIL-MA09.sysops.aol.com> Some interesting stuff at? www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf Rich Rock ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com From cwn.fot at cwnicholls.net Wed Nov 14 15:15:28 2007 From: cwn.fot at cwnicholls.net (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 17:15:28 -0500 Subject: [Fot] ARP question again In-Reply-To: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> References: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <002e01c8270b$df0e9ee0$1342a8c0@semperon3400> You can search the FOT archives at: http://autox.team.net/pipermail/fot/ -----Original Message----- To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] ARP question again I know the FOT site talked about this question a few weeks ago but I failed to save the informatin. I am building up a couple of TR6 blocks for racing and would like to consider ARP bolts for the main bearing caps. Does anyone have a source and or ARP part number you can forward me. Thanks for the help Walt Hollowell Abq., NM From S.Janzen at comcast.net Wed Nov 14 15:59:35 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 17:59:35 -0500 Subject: [Fot] ARP question again References: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> <002e01c8270b$df0e9ee0$1342a8c0@semperon3400> Message-ID: <003901c82712$06dadb40$6501a8c0@vefadvisors.com> You can order from Ted Schumacher (sp?) at TS Imported and I think also straight from ARP, butTed may actually be less expensive. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clark W. Nicholls" To: "'Walter Hollowell'" ; Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 5:15 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] ARP question again > You can search the FOT archives at: > http://autox.team.net/pipermail/fot/ > > -----Original Message----- > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: [Fot] ARP question again > > I know the FOT site talked about this question a few weeks ago but I > failed > to save the informatin. > I am building up a couple of TR6 blocks for racing and would like to > consider ARP bolts for the main bearing caps. > Does anyone have a source and or ARP part number you can forward me. > Thanks for the help > Walt Hollowell > Abq., NM > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From mark at bradakis.com Wed Nov 14 18:44:20 2007 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J. Bradakis) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 18:44:20 -0700 Subject: [Fot] ARP question again In-Reply-To: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> References: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <473BA474.6050106@bradakis.com> >I know the FOT site talked about this question a few weeks ago but I failed >to save the informatin. > > I save it all - http://www.team.net/archive mjb. From rikrock at aol.com Thu Nov 15 09:09:44 2007 From: rikrock at aol.com (rikrock at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:09:44 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 In-Reply-To: <002d01c82692$0f8feb70$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> References: <002d01c82692$0f8feb70$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <8C9F5B91201253E-AD4-1A78@webmail-stg-d09.sysops.aol.com> -----Original Message----- From: Steven Preiss To: rikrock at aol.com Sent: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 2:42 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Heady stuff. This was the time when I was first becoming addicted to sports car racing, and it is thrilling to see the cars as they were at that time. Interesting to see the TR3s fitted out with what look like TR6 wheels. I love the captions and copy, too. Really captures the spirit of the time. The rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. Trying to think why MG is absent. I know the Bs were running at the time. Anyone care to elucidate? Thanks Rich. ----- Original Message ----- From: rikrock at aol.com> To: fot at autox.team.net> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:56 AM Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > Some interesting stuff at? www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf > > > > Rich Rock > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 From Fubog1 at aol.com Thu Nov 15 09:22:56 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:22:56 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/15/2007 11:10:23 AM Eastern Standard Time, rikrock at aol.com writes: The rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. ... and some things haven't changed... Glen hates the evil hun-mobiles ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Nov 15 09:28:04 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:28:04 EST Subject: [Fot] WATKINS GLEN 2008 Message-ID: http://www.grandprixfestival.com/ FoT, If you are FoT and plan to be with us at Watkins Glen, but may not enter the ZIPPO GRAND PRIX................................... The Village of Watkins Glen is featuring the TRIUMPH MARQUE. They have several activities during the weekend and will give some preferential treatment to the TRIUMPH. All of these events have limited enrollment. My contact with the Village indicates that everyone should enroll in these events early. http://www.grandprixfestival.com/ If you have a historically significant car, or a car of special interest, that could be displayed, (such as the Triumph TRS) please let me know, and I will put you in touch with my contact person, directly. Joe A PS: I still have not heard from "ANDREA" on the hotel reservation. From mlcooknj at msn.com Thu Nov 15 10:50:04 2007 From: mlcooknj at msn.com (michael cook) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 12:50:04 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Message-ID: If there was no other choice, I would run TR6 wheels on my TR3 and have a photo from Lime Rock, 1967 showing me going into the esses with those wheels. However, we used them only as a last resort because the wider steel wheels were even more likely at the bolt circle than the narrow ones. I usually had rain tires on them. At the race when the photo was taken, I think one of my American Mags had cracked and I had no spare so used the TR6 wheels. Mike Cook ----- Original Message ----- From: rikrock at aol.com Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 11:09 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 -----Original Message----- From: Steven Preiss To: rikrock at aol.com Sent: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 2:42 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Heady stuff. This was the time when I was first becoming addicted to sports car racing, and it is thrilling to see the cars as they were at that time. Interesting to see the TR3s fitted out with what look like TR6 wheels. I love the captions and copy, too. Really captures the spirit of the time. The rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. Trying to think why MG is absent. I know the Bs were running at the time. Anyone care to elucidate? Thanks Rich. ----- Original Message ----- From: rikrock at aol.com> To: fot at autox.team.net> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:56 AM Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > Some interesting stuff at? www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf > > > > Rich Rock > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolc mp00050000000003 Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From EDENMA at aol.com Thu Nov 15 10:17:28 2007 From: EDENMA at aol.com (EDENMA at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 12:17:28 EST Subject: [Fot] Fot Digest, Vol 12, Issue 23 Message-ID: Hi Joe! When are you planning to go to Wyotech? Cheers! Mark ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Thu Nov 15 10:48:34 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:48:34 -0600 Subject: [Fot] crank Message-ID: <200711151747.lAFHknJs262668@ns3.geneseo.net> I'm going to put a TR3 - 4A crank on eBay but wanted to give the listers first shot at it. It's in unbelievably good condition: STANDARD size - never been ground journals checked - polished - doesn't need to be ground, either magnafluxed - not cracked plugs removed, cleaned, replaced $200 uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From triosan at gmail.com Thu Nov 15 11:34:24 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 10:34:24 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Source for oil pan studs and pictures of crank scraper/windage tray Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711151034j6ddda992o48798043718698bb@mail.gmail.com> A while back I bought a set of stainless steel studs for the TR6 oil pan. These had Allen head holes on the ends to drive them in, and stainless nuts with flanges. Does anyone know a source for this kit? Also, you can see pictures of it, and the crank scraper and the windage tray I had installed on my racing TR6 engine at: http://picasaweb.google.com/Triosan/WindageTrayScraprerAndStuds -- Chuck Arnold From EDENMA at aol.com Thu Nov 15 11:37:23 2007 From: EDENMA at aol.com (EDENMA at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 13:37:23 EST Subject: [Fot] Fot Digest, Vol 12, Issue 23 Message-ID: Woops! Thank you Joe Curry! I must have hit the wrong button and sent my reply to the wrong email address. I had intended to respond to Joe Alexander's page directly. Cheers! Mark ______________________________________________________________________________ ______ In a message dated 11/15/2007 10:26:13 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, spitlist at cox.net writes: Mark, When addressing Joe on the FOT list, you will need to be more specific. There are at least a half dozen of us! :) Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of EDENMA at aol.com Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 10:17 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Fot Digest, Vol 12, Issue 23 Hi Joe! When are you planning to go to Wyotech? Cheers! Mark ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From kaskas at cox.net Thu Nov 15 12:53:53 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:53:53 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 References: <002d01c82692$0f8feb70$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> <8C9F5B91201253E-AD4-1A78@webmail-stg-d09.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <003e01c827c1$4067e060$3f0ec548@RW> In 1968 the MG's were not near quick enough to compete with the Porsche 911, TR-250 and the Datsuns. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 8:09 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > -----Original Message----- > > From: Steven Preiss > > To: rikrock at aol.com > > Sent: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 2:42 am > > Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > > > > > > Heady stuff. This was the time when I was first becoming addicted to > sports car racing, and it is thrilling to see the cars as they were at > that time. Interesting to see the TR3s fitted out with what look like TR6 > wheels. I love the captions and copy, too. Really captures the spirit of > the time. The rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. Trying to > think why MG is absent. I know the Bs were running at the time. Anyone > care to elucidate? Thanks Rich. ----- Original Message ----- From: > rikrock at aol.com> To: fot at autox.team.net> Sent: Thursday, November 15, > 2007 7:56 AM Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > Some > interesting stuff at? www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf > > > > > Rich Rock > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - > http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - > http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From henry at henryfrye.com Thu Nov 15 13:50:37 2007 From: henry at henryfrye.com (Henry Frye) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 15:50:37 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication Message-ID: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> I just looked at Chuck's pictures of his crank scraper and I have been meaning to toss out this question on crank scrapers. I understand their purpose is to cut down on the turbulent atmosphere inside the crankcase. Sounds like a good thing, control the oil better so the crank and rods are spinning in cleaner air. Less resistance to engine rotation, more horsepower. OK, sounds fine, but I always thought it was that chaotic environment of oil being tossed about in the crankcase was the 'splash lubrication' that the cam lobes and tappets need to stay alive. What am I missing??? Not to mention the issue that more and more of our oil choices lack an effective additive package for flat tappet engines... From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 15 14:32:32 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 13:32:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: probably that it's more chaotic than you would believe, and a crank scraper really just pulls the oil off the crank--it doesn't do that much to reduce chaos. You can easily wind two quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that weight -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Henry Frye Sent: Thu 11/15/2007 12:50 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication I just looked at Chuck's pictures of his crank scraper and I have been meaning to toss out this question on crank scrapers. I understand their purpose is to cut down on the turbulent atmosphere inside the crankcase. Sounds like a good thing, control the oil better so the crank and rods are spinning in cleaner air. Less resistance to engine rotation, more horsepower. OK, sounds fine, but I always thought it was that chaotic environment of oil being tossed about in the crankcase was the 'splash lubrication' that the cam lobes and tappets need to stay alive. What am I missing??? Not to mention the issue that more and more of our oil choices lack an effective additive package for flat tappet engines... Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 15 16:14:54 2007 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 18:14:54 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: > really just pulls the oil off the crank--it doesn't do that much to reduce> chaos. You can easily wind two quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that> weight Is that where the term "windage tray" comes from? Is it pronounced windage like Kentucky windage or like what it takes to wind up a toy? John From stutzmans at comcast.net Thu Nov 15 16:59:03 2007 From: stutzmans at comcast.net (Stutzman) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 18:59:03 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 References: Message-ID: <001901c827e3$81f22a50$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> I ran TR6 wheels on my TR4 in SVRA in the mid 80's - why - they were cheap! Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "michael cook" To: ; "fot" Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 12:50 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > If there was no other choice, I would run TR6 wheels on my TR3 and have a > photo from Lime Rock, 1967 showing me going into the esses with those > wheels. > However, we used them only as a last resort because the wider steel wheels > were even more likely at the bolt circle than the narrow ones. I usually > had > rain tires on them. > > At the race when the photo was taken, I think one of my American Mags had > cracked and I had no spare so used the TR6 wheels. > > Mike Cook > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: rikrock at aol.com > Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 11:09 AM > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Steven Preiss > > To: rikrock at aol.com > > Sent: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 2:42 am > > Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > > > > > > Heady stuff. This was the time when I was first becoming addicted to > sports > car racing, and it is thrilling to see the cars as they were at that time. > Interesting to see the TR3s fitted out with what look like TR6 wheels. I > love > the captions and copy, too. Really captures the spirit of the time. The > rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. Trying to think why MG is > absent. I know the Bs were running at the time. Anyone care to elucidate? > Thanks Rich. ----- Original Message ----- From: rikrock at aol.com> To: > fot at autox.team.net> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:56 AM Subject: > [Fot] > Triumphs Racing in 1968 > Some interesting stuff at? > www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf > > > > Rich Rock > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > > > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - > http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - > http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolc > mp00050000000003 > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From kaskas at cox.net Thu Nov 15 17:03:29 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 16:03:29 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: <00cb01c827e4$1ec087a0$3f0ec548@RW> Although oil in "winding up" the expression is windage as in "win-dedge". It pays to pay be aware of his circumstance......... ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Herrera" To: "Bill Babcock" ; "Henry Frye" ; Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 3:14 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication >> really just pulls the oil off the crank--it doesn't do that much to >> reduce> > chaos. You can easily wind two quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that> > weight > Is that where the term "windage tray" comes from? Is it pronounced windage > like Kentucky windage or like what it takes to wind up a toy? > > John > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From britbits at tiu.net Thu Nov 15 21:13:22 2007 From: britbits at tiu.net (Jim) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 22:13:22 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Source for oil pan studs and pictures of crank scraper/windage tray In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d0711151034j6ddda992o48798043718698bb@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d0711151034j6ddda992o48798043718698bb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <000001c82807$07c08a00$05e435cf@jrg> Chuck, Those studs are just long set-screws. Any decent industrial supply house should be able to provide them (pop one out and measure the length) or you can get them from McMaster (www.mcmaster.com). And the shouldered nuts also. Or if you can wait until after Tamale day I'll check locally. We used them all the time at my previous job. Cheers, Jim Dallas '76 DM Spitfire and a few other toys ;) -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+britbits=tiu.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+britbits=tiu.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Chuck Arnold Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 12:34 PM To: Friends; Triumph Subject: [Fot] Source for oil pan studs and pictures of crank scraper/windage tray A while back I bought a set of stainless steel studs for the TR6 oil pan. These had Allen head holes on the ends to drive them in, and stainless nuts with flanges. Does anyone know a source for this kit? Also, you can see pictures of it, and the crank scraper and the windage tray I had installed on my racing TR6 engine at: http://picasaweb.google.com/Triosan/WindageTrayScraprerAndStuds -- Chuck Arnold Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 15 21:54:57 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 20:54:57 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: A windage tray and a scraper are not exactly the same thing. The scraper is a piece of metal shaped to fit close to the crank so it can scrape off the oil that gets wound onto the crank. The windage tray may incorporate a scraper, but it's a cover that fits between the crank and the oil pan intended to keep the oil in the sump from being blown around by the wind generated by the crankshaft. The motor I built for Peyote has a windage tray, a scraper, and a baffled sump, all aimed at getting oil off the crankshaft and down into the sump. And it's pronounced windage as in blowing in the wind. -----Original Message----- From: John Herrera [mailto:jrherrera90 at hotmail.com] Sent: Thu 11/15/2007 3:14 PM To: Bill Babcock; Henry Frye; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > really just pulls the oil off the crank--it doesn't do that much to reduce> chaos. You can easily wind two quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that> weight Is that where the term "windage tray" comes from? Is it pronounced windage like Kentucky windage or like what it takes to wind up a toy? John From henry at henryfrye.com Fri Nov 16 06:46:14 2007 From: henry at henryfrye.com (Henry Frye) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 08:46:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBA0@server.Triumph.local> OK, Bill, I hear you. Thanks... I am having difficulty visualizing two quarts of oil being wound up on the crank, though! > -----Original Message----- > From: Bill Babcock [mailto:BillB at bnj.com] > Sent: November 15, 2007 4:33 PM > To: Henry Frye; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: RE: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > probably that it's more chaotic than you would believe, and a > crank scraper really just pulls the oil off the crank--it > doesn't do that much to reduce chaos. You can easily wind two > quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that weight > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Henry Frye > Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > What am I missing??? From jaxonracing at yahoo.com Fri Nov 16 09:40:46 2007 From: jaxonracing at yahoo.com (Jay Creel) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 08:40:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs Message-ID: <917020.28322.qm@web53511.mail.re2.yahoo.com> FOT, I am looking for a new "dearched" leaf spring for my HP Triumph Spitfire. I had spoken with Rick Cline some time ago regarding a spring but there were some challenges with the supplier at the time. Since then, I have continued to use my "stock" dearched spring but I am looking to upgrade. Does anyone know of a source for a composite leaf spring for a racing spitfire? Contact information and if they have specifications on file?? I will also reach out to Rick C. to discuss the possibility of getting a famous Rick Cline spring. thanks Jay R. Creel ____________________________________________________________________________________ Get easy, one-click access to your favorites. Make Yahoo! your homepage. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From tedtsimx at bright.net Fri Nov 16 12:54:52 2007 From: tedtsimx at bright.net (Ted Schumacher) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 14:54:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBA0@server.Triumph.local> References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBA0@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: <473DF58C.4060104@bright.net> Henry Frye wrote: > OK, Bill, I hear you. Thanks... > > I am having difficulty visualizing two quarts of oil being wound up on > the crank, though! > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Bill Babcock [mailto:BillB at bnj.com] >> Sent: November 15, 2007 4:33 PM >> To: Henry Frye; fot at autox.team.net >> Subject: RE: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication >> >> probably that it's more chaotic than you would believe, and a >> crank scraper really just pulls the oil off the crank--it >> doesn't do that much to reduce chaos. You can easily wind two >> quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that weight >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Henry Frye >> Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication >> >> What am I missing??? >> > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > List, for what it's worth, Chrysler offers, at least used to offer, a windage tray big block Dodge engine. Both 413 and 440. These were common engines in the RV industry in the '70's and '80's. This little $14 option generated 12 hp. Actually, it didn't generate any HP, but rather freed up 12 hp that could be used for other things, such as getting launched from a stop sign or merging. That much power was lost dragging the crank through the oil mist. Remember the IC engine is only an air pump. And, it pumps a lot of air in a big displacement engine. Ted -- Ted Schumacher tedtsimx at bright.net http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com 108 S. Jefferson St. Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 From John.Reed at wilson.com Fri Nov 16 13:24:48 2007 From: John.Reed at wilson.com (John.Reed at wilson.com) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 12:24:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBA0@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: Henry, I put on a crank scraper with my last rebuild. I swear the engine spun quicker. Regards, John Reed Staff Photographer Wilson Sporting Goods Co. 8750 W Bryn Mawr Ave, Chicago, Illinois 60631, USA Tel. + 1.773.714.6895, fax +1.773.714.4585 John.Reed at wilson.com www.wilson.com www.amersports.com Please note that effective immediately, my e-mail , phone number and street address have changed. Please update your files accordingly. "Henry Frye" Sent by: fot-bounces+john.reed=wilson.com at autox.team.net 11/16/07 05:46 AM To "Bill Babcock" , cc Subject Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication OK, Bill, I hear you. Thanks... I am having difficulty visualizing two quarts of oil being wound up on the crank, though! > -----Original Message----- > From: Bill Babcock [mailto:BillB at bnj.com] > Sent: November 15, 2007 4:33 PM > To: Henry Frye; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: RE: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > probably that it's more chaotic than you would believe, and a > crank scraper really just pulls the oil off the crank--it > doesn't do that much to reduce chaos. You can easily wind two > quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that weight > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Henry Frye > Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > What am I missing??? Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot This e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. From tr5racer at btinternet.com Fri Nov 16 13:43:28 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 20:43:28 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Triumphs racing in 1968 Message-ID: <442846.72428.qm@web86602.mail.ird.yahoo.com> I raced from the late 1970's to the mid 1980's with TR6 steel wheels on my TR5 and never had any problems however I only had about 150bhp at the wheels in those days not the 200+ I have now!! Mike Hughes --------------------------------- Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now. From rikrock at aol.com Fri Nov 16 13:56:50 2007 From: rikrock at aol.com (rikrock at aol.com) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 15:56:50 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <8C9F6AA585D7B7C-1268-1BE9@webmail-stg-d10.sysops.aol.com> So, you guys are saying that there is no downside to using a crank scraper in a wet-liner motor? That even with connecting rods that don't have the little oil hole like the stock rods do, enough oil gets?to the cylinder walls?? And that enough oil gets everywhere it needs to get, all the time? Rich Rock ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 16 15:36:32 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 14:36:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <8C9F6AA585D7B7C-1268-1BE9@webmail-stg-d10.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: I've seen a video of the inside of a crankcase in a running 4 cylinder motor. Oil splash to the cylinder walls is not an issue. Remember that the full volume of air is changing under the pistons at 100 times per second at 6K RPM. Two liters of air swapping all over the place at 100 times per second. The crankshaft is dragging a cyclone of oil and air around behind it. We visualize it as something running at 60 RPM, oil spinning lightly off the crankshaft as it slowly turns. It doesn't look anything like that. It's not a gentle gust, it's a vicious tornado. Crank scrapers are diverting the tornado from the crankshaft. Windage trays are keeping it from jumping back out of the sump. Much more dynamic than one would naturally visualize. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of rikrock at aol.com Sent: Fri 11/16/2007 12:56 PM To: John.Reed at wilson.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication So, you guys are saying that there is no downside to using a crank scraper in a wet-liner motor? That even with connecting rods that don't have the little oil hole like the stock rods do, enough oil gets?to the cylinder walls?? And that enough oil gets everywhere it needs to get, all the time? Rich Rock ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolc mp00050000000003 Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spreiss at verizon.net Fri Nov 16 01:14:21 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:14:21 +1100 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <8C9F6AA585D7B7C-1268-1BE9@webmail-stg-d10.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <003f01c82828$b17fe150$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Kind of sheds new light on the impetus behind the development of the Wankel engine! Steve P. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: ; ; Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 9:36 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > I've seen a video of the inside of a crankcase in a running 4 cylinder motor. > Oil splash to the cylinder walls is not an issue. Remember that the full > volume of air is changing under the pistons at 100 times per second at 6K RPM. > Two liters of air swapping all over the place at 100 times per second. The > crankshaft is dragging a cyclone of oil and air around behind it. We visualize > it as something running at 60 RPM, oil spinning lightly off the crankshaft as > it slowly turns. It doesn't look anything like that. It's not a gentle gust, > it's a vicious tornado. Crank scrapers are diverting the tornado from the > crankshaft. Windage trays are keeping it from jumping back out of the sump. > Much more dynamic than one would naturally visualize. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of rikrock at aol.com > Sent: Fri 11/16/2007 12:56 PM > To: John.Reed at wilson.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > So, you guys are saying that there is no downside to using a crank scraper in > a wet-liner motor? That even with connecting rods that don't have the little > oil hole like the stock rods do, enough oil gets?to the cylinder walls?? And > that enough oil gets everywhere it needs to get, all the time? > > Rich Rock > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - > http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolc > mp00050000000003 > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 16 17:47:58 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:47:58 EST Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication Message-ID: Kas has a story of putting a plexi window in the block to see what was going on and the mess was totally obscuring any details. Makes you a believer. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From joeg at neb.rr.com Fri Nov 16 18:57:26 2007 From: joeg at neb.rr.com (Joe Guinan) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:57:26 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001101c828bd$3474d0e0$43a6544c@Guinan> Jay - Talk to George at Flex-A-Form. http://flex-a-form.com He has made several springs for Spitfires, and will make them to your specifications for weight rating and height. Runs about $200? Weighs about 9 pounds or something like that? Joe Guinan 751 Day Drive Fremont, NE 68025 Home Phone - 402-727-8011 joeg at neb.rr.com ------------------------------ From: Jay Creel Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs To: fot at autox.team.net FOT, I am looking for a new "dearched" leaf spring for my HP Triumph Spitfire. I had spoken with Rick Cline some time ago regarding a spring but there were some challenges with the supplier at the time. Since then, I have continued to use my "stock" dearched spring but I am looking to upgrade. Does anyone know of a source for a composite leaf spring for a racing spitfire? Contact information and if they have specifications on file?? I will also reach out to Rick C. to discuss the possibility of getting a famous Rick Cline spring. thanks Jay R. Creel From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Fri Nov 16 20:16:00 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 22:16:00 EST Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up Message-ID: Kas wrote: Although oil in "winding up" the expression is windage as in "win-dedge". It pays to pay be aware of his circumstance......... and Bill Babcock wrote: And it's pronounced windage as in blowing in the wind Whilst I have no disagreement with either of these fine fellows, if those (U.S.born) on this list wish to pronounce it "win-dedge", or "wind-age", or whathaveyou-dedge, then I have no problem with that, as long as they don't make me, (UK born), do the same: I will go merrily on my English way, pronouncing it "wine-didge" "let's call the whole thing off" Thinking about 'ropes' of oil being pulled around inside the crankcase by the crankshaft, as it rotates at howmanyrpm? Best wine-didge regards Leon From mdporter at dfn.com Fri Nov 16 20:25:40 2007 From: mdporter at dfn.com (Michael Porter) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 20:25:40 -0700 Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <473E5F34.3030807@dfn.com> Guyots3 at wmconnect.com wrote: > > I will go merrily on my English way, pronouncing it "wine-didge" > > Gee, I didn't know that they say in England, "my, the wined is blowing briskly today." Learn something every day.... Cheers. -- Michael Porter Roswell, NM Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking distance.... From tr4.tony at virgin.net Sat Nov 17 03:16:17 2007 From: tr4.tony at virgin.net (TR4Tony) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 10:16:17 -0000 Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up References: <473E5F34.3030807@dfn.com> Message-ID: <006101c82902$e44ffd60$0ab5a8c0@PBA.INT> I think that comes after the 'ooooo aaaaar whar's moi coider ......' ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Porter" To: Cc: Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 3:25 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] it's a wind-up > Guyots3 at wmconnect.com wrote: >> >> I will go merrily on my English way, pronouncing it "wine-didge" >> >> > > Gee, I didn't know that they say in England, "my, the wined is blowing > briskly today." > > > Learn something every day.... > > > Cheers. > > -- > > > Michael Porter > Roswell, NM > > > Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking > distance.... > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Sat Nov 17 07:32:22 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 08:32:22 -0600 Subject: [Fot] CVAR Last race of the year Message-ID: <000e01c82926$abe11490$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> I know many in the midwest have packed their cars away for the winter but if you want to race one more time this year, CVAR is holding it's last 2007 (actually first 20087 season) race in far north Texas. The track is new and we will be holding the first ever sanctioned race an we would be remiss if we didn't invite the FoT. There have been plenty of delays in opening this track so we haven't talked it up very much but the reports coming back is that it will become our favorite track. Eagles Canyon Raceway is the beautiful culmination of years worth of research, planning, design, and meticulous construction in the rolling hills of North Central Texas. Designed by Rob Wilson, one of the world's top racing instructors, Eagles Canyon Raceway features 2.55 miles, 4 straights over 1,300 feet long, 15 turns, and 70 feet of elevation change. Eagles Canyon is a true driver's track, and is planned to host all classes of events from the top level racing series to club racing and private HPDE days. http://www.eaglescanyon.com/php/welcome.php November Nov 30th-Dec 2nd 1st Annual Eagles Canyon Extravaganza Eagles Canyon Raceway Slidell, Tx. (Just NW of D/FW) A brand new, top notch facility and track Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Nov 17 08:23:45 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 10:23:45 EST Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up Message-ID: Mike, Do you still have any of the old style wind up watches? ;-)) Steve, who gets winded winding up watches... ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From ofbracing at nefcom.net Sat Nov 17 09:04:40 2007 From: ofbracing at nefcom.net (Don Marshall) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 11:04:40 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumph Ghetto at Roebling Road Message-ID: <001101c82933$900840b0$2001a8c0@Dell5100Laptop> FOTers, dont forget the VDCA event at Roebling Road (Savannah GA) in early December. We expect to have the Triumph Ghetto set up on the grass at turn 3. This is a 3 day event with tons of track time for only $250, plus a track day on Thursday for only $125. If youre anywhere in or near the South and want a final race, this is it. Well be cooking in the Ghetto on Friday evening for Triumph drivers and their crews so please stop by. Cheers, Don No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.0/1135 - Release Date: 11/16/2007 10:58 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.0/1135 - Release Date: 11/16/2007 10:58 PM From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Sat Nov 17 10:20:13 2007 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steve Belfer) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 09:20:13 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: Message-ID: <000b01c8293e$1df3d790$0501000a@Chowdown> What do y'all think about this part ?: Also, what's the difference, if any, between this part and windage tray? http://www.cambridgemotorsport.com/TR4-Sump-Baffle-steel-With-Anti-Surge-Gate-for-Aluminium-Sump ~Steve B ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; ; Sent: Friday, November 16, 2007 4:47 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > Kas has a story of putting a plexi window in the block to see what was > going > on and the mess was totally obscuring any details. Makes you a believer. > > > > ************************************** > See what's new at http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From WEmery7451 at aol.com Sat Nov 17 13:39:31 2007 From: WEmery7451 at aol.com (WEmery7451 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 15:39:31 EST Subject: [Fot] Harden Valve Seats Message-ID: Dear FOT, Whenever my machinist has set up a TR-3/4 engine head for me, he automatically puts in harden valve seats for both the intake and exhaust valves . I gave one of my engine heads to Dan Styduhar, who has been helping me with the TR-3. His machinist highly recommends not to put the harden valve seats in for the intake valve. A lot of material is ground out the cast iron head to install the valve seats, and there is not a lot of material between the intake and exhaust valves to begin with. My initial guesses would be: -There are two different materials involved -- cast iron and steel. Maybe the steel valve seats would not count as material being replaced, and that the cast iron could crack under the seats. -If there is not a great deal of exhaust gasses blowing past the closed intake valves, the intake valves would not need the harden seats -- keeping in mind that there is a tremendous pressure surge during the combustion stroke. Does anyone have any thought on this subject? ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From WEmery7451 at aol.com Sat Nov 17 14:03:57 2007 From: WEmery7451 at aol.com (WEmery7451 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 16:03:57 EST Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR Message-ID: Dear FOT, A battery went dead in one of our Mazdas. Down through the years when this would happen, I would pull out the battery, buy another one, and install it. This time, I was in a hurry and drove the car to an Advanced Auto Parts store so that they could change out the battery in the parking lot. I was told to plug a power source into the cigarette lighter socket before they would disconnect the battery. They said that if they do not do this, some Jap cars lock up and have to be towed to a dealer to be reset. Neither of our Mazdas have this feature, since I have had the batteries disconnected in both of them. Has anybody ever heard of this issue? If this is true, I believe that it is the dumbest thing that any manufacturer could design into a vehicle. Batteries can sometimes disconnect themselves -- corrosion or loose terminals. Someone could be driving in the middle of nowhere out west, get shut down, and have to be towed several hundred miles to a dealer. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From chris at tr4-racing.de Sat Nov 17 15:09:53 2007 From: chris at tr4-racing.de (Marx Christian tr4-racing) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 23:09:53 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Spa - 1966 Message-ID: <00f401c82966$95479ac0$6402a8c0@HOME> I hope you like this......big american movie: http://www.youtube.com/v/iw-MPf4GUU0&rel=1 Cheers Chris From Herald948 at aol.com Sat Nov 17 15:22:00 2007 From: Herald948 at aol.com (Herald948 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 17:22:00 EST Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR Message-ID: In a message dated 11/17/2007 4:04:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, WEmery7451 at aol.com writes: I was told to plug a power source into the cigarette lighter socket before they would disconnect the battery. They said that if they do not do this, some Jap cars lock up and have to be towed to a dealer to be reset. Neither of our Mazdas have this feature, since I have had the batteries disconnected in both of them. Has anybody ever heard of this issue? ==AM== I'm no expert on modern cars, but I've never heard of that, either. One good thing about the power source in the lighter socket is that it might help to preserve radio button presets; otherwise, diconnecting and reconnecting a battery might cause some computer chip in some cars to reboot or restart. After a minute or so, it should reprogram itself and all would be well again. At least that's what I'VE heard. ;-) --Andy Mace (the period Bendix AM/FM is the most sophisticated bit of electronics in the Herald!) *Mrs Irrelevant: Oh, is it a jet? *Man: Well, no ... It's not so much of a jet, it's more your, er, Triumph Herald engine with wings. -- Cut-price Airlines Sketch, Monty Python's Flying Circus (22) Check out the North American Triumph Sports 6 (Vitesse 6) and Triumph Herald Database: _http://triumph-herald.us_ (http://triumph-herald.us/) ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From BillB at bnj.com Sat Nov 17 15:51:23 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 14:51:23 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR References: Message-ID: The reason for connecting a power supply while disconnecting your battery is to maintain any presets that are not sophisticated enough to use non-volatile memory. The more well engineered a car is, the LESS likely this is to be a problem. But the presets are not critical, and they won't lock up your car. This is more a matter of morons behind the counter swapping urban legends than morons at the design table. That said, there are cars that really don't like having no battery power, and a lot of them have two batteries now. My wife's Bently has two, and so does my F350 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of WEmery7451 at aol.com Sent: Sat 11/17/2007 1:03 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR Dear FOT, A battery went dead in one of our Mazdas. Down through the years when this would happen, I would pull out the battery, buy another one, and install it. This time, I was in a hurry and drove the car to an Advanced Auto Parts store so that they could change out the battery in the parking lot. I was told to plug a power source into the cigarette lighter socket before they would disconnect the battery. They said that if they do not do this, some Jap cars lock up and have to be towed to a dealer to be reset. Neither of our Mazdas have this feature, since I have had the batteries disconnected in both of them. Has anybody ever heard of this issue? If this is true, I believe that it is the dumbest thing that any manufacturer could design into a vehicle. Batteries can sometimes disconnect themselves -- corrosion or loose terminals. Someone could be driving in the middle of nowhere out west, get shut down, and have to be towed several hundred miles to a dealer. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sat Nov 17 16:19:35 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (spitlist at cox.net) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 15:19:35 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20071117181935.B0EBX.67659.root@fed1wml06.mgt.cox.net> The really frustrating thing about removing a battery without maintaining power is on those anti-theft radio systems. They require you to remember the codes you put in and if you are like me, you seldom do! Joe C. ---- Herald948 at aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 11/17/2007 4:04:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > WEmery7451 at aol.com writes: > > I was told to plug a power source into the cigarette lighter socket before > they would disconnect the battery. They said that if they do not do this, > some > Jap cars lock up and have to be towed to a dealer to be reset. Neither of > our > Mazdas have this feature, since I have had the batteries disconnected in both > of them. > > Has anybody ever heard of this issue? > > > ==AM== > I'm no expert on modern cars, but I've never heard of that, either. One good > thing about the power source in the lighter socket is that it might help to > preserve radio button presets; otherwise, diconnecting and reconnecting a > battery might cause some computer chip in some cars to reboot or restart. After > a minute or so, it should reprogram itself and all would be well again. At > least that's what I'VE heard. ;-) > > --Andy Mace (the period Bendix AM/FM is the most sophisticated bit of > electronics in the Herald!) From koblinger at verizon.net Sat Nov 17 18:08:16 2007 From: koblinger at verizon.net (Kurt Oblinger) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 17:08:16 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Spa - 1966 In-Reply-To: <00f401c82966$95479ac0$6402a8c0@HOME> References: <00f401c82966$95479ac0$6402a8c0@HOME> Message-ID: <473F9080.4030203@verizon.net> Still takes my breath away. The camera car was a GT40 driven by Phil Hill. It amazes me to look at the track, no barriers, ditches, buildings, phone poles, stone mile markers, all right at the edge of the track. Brilliant and frightening at the same time. Cheers, Kurt O. Marx Christian tr4-racing wrote: >I hope you like this......big american movie: > >http://www.youtube.com/v/iw-MPf4GUU0&rel=1 > >Cheers >Chris >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vintage.racer at comcast.net Sat Nov 17 18:28:25 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 17:28:25 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Spa - 1966 In-Reply-To: <473F9080.4030203@verizon.net> References: <00f401c82966$95479ac0$6402a8c0@HOME> <473F9080.4030203@verizon.net> Message-ID: <000001c82982$50fe75c0$f2fb6140$@racer@comcast.net> Say it over and over until you believe it...I trust my mechanics, I trust my mechanics... Gary -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kurt Oblinger Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 5:08 PM To: Marx Christian tr4-racing Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Spa - 1966 Still takes my breath away. The camera car was a GT40 driven by Phil Hill. It amazes me to look at the track, no barriers, ditches, buildings, phone poles, stone mile markers, all right at the edge of the track. Brilliant and frightening at the same time. Cheers, Kurt O. Marx Christian tr4-racing wrote: >I hope you like this......big american movie: > >http://www.youtube.com/v/iw-MPf4GUU0&rel=1 > >Cheers >Chris >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Sat Nov 17 18:58:35 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 19:58:35 -0600 Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available Message-ID: <200711180156.lAI1upR9342147@ns3.geneseo.net> Some time ago I designed a crank scraper for the TR3 - 4 engine. I designed two, actually - one for the stock crank / stock rod engine, and one for the Moldex / Carillo engine. Several of us are using them. Since designing these things and programming for laser cutting is very time consuming, I have not made them for the Spitfire or TR6 engine. They are made from 1/8" steel and mount under the heads of three main cap bolts. They come with three hardened washers to go between the bolt heads and the scraper. You can see a picture on Tony's site -- www.Tonydrews.com -- link "Jack's Parts" There was not much interest at the time so I had a limited run made of each configuration. I still have a few of them left. I'll sell the ones I still have for $64.95 apiece plus shipping. uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From jaboruch at netzero.net Sat Nov 17 19:42:37 2007 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 02:42:37 GMT Subject: [Fot] Harden Valve Seats Message-ID: <20071117.214237.17726.1@webmail21.dca.untd.com> Bill, I have only been doing them on the exhaust, since that is for the most part where any valve recession should occur. I have noticed, however, that when I do not run air cleaners I have some intake valve recession. I think another challenge on the intake side to to get it to blend well enough not to interfere with intake flow. Joe(B) -- WEmery7451 at aol.com wrote: Dear FOT, Whenever my machinist has set up a TR-3/4 engine head for me, he automatically puts in harden valve seats for both the intake and exhaust valves . I gave one of my engine heads to Dan Styduhar, who has been helping me with the TR-3. His machinist highly recommends not to put the harden valve seats in for the intake valve. A lot of material is ground out the cast iron head to install the valve seats, and there is not a lot of material between the intake and exhaust valves to begin with. My initial guesses would be: -There are two different materials involved -- cast iron and steel. Maybe the steel valve seats would not count as material being replaced, and that the cast iron could crack under the seats. -If there is not a great deal of exhaust gasses blowing past the closed intake valves, the intake valves would not need the harden seats -- keeping in mind that there is a tremendous pressure surge during the combustion stroke. Does anyone have any thought on this subject? ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _____________________________________________________________ Click for free info on rehab treatments for drug & alcohol dependency. http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2211/fc/Ioyw6ijmXabC59PFdUwCqov8km3B4y M40dcPLX3YCSvcpyq7RYnpLq/ From BillDentin at aol.com Sun Nov 18 08:43:13 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 10:43:13 EST Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up Message-ID: In a message dated 11/16/2007 9:16:32 PM Central Standard Time, Guyots3 at wmconnect.com writes: > Whilst I have no disagreement with either of these fine fellows, if those > (U.S.born) on this list wish to pronounce it "win-dedge", or "wind-age", or > whathaveyou-dedge, then I have no problem with that, as long as they don't > make me, > (UK born), do the same: > > I will go merrily on my English way, pronouncing it "wine-didge" > > Leon... We could do that on this side of the pond too (out of respect for our British cars), but my guess is over here it would end up "whine-didge". We're good at that. Bill (Damdinger) PS...actually...in the Beady Eye tent it would end up "wine & cheese-dish" ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 09:53:30 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 11:53:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] CVAR Last race of the year....EAGLE'S CANYON Message-ID: <411F9C8F.64B98CCD.00159EE9@cs.com> Jack & I were there for a Classic Motorsports magazine test day. Contruction was going on and it was difficult to get a sense of the track. However, it is great to know that there is another choice. Joe A >I know many in the midwest have packed their cars away for the winter but if >you want to race one more time this year, CVAR is holding it's last 2007 >(actually first 20087 season) race in far north Texas. The track is new and we >will be holding the first ever sanctioned race an we would be remiss if we >didn't invite the FoT. There have been plenty of delays in opening this track >so we haven't talked it up very much but the reports coming back is that it >will become our favorite track. > >Eagles Canyon Raceway is the beautiful culmination of years worth of research, >planning, design, and meticulous construction in the rolling hills of North >Central Texas. > >Designed by Rob Wilson, one of the world's top racing instructors, Eagles >Canyon Raceway features 2.55 miles, 4 straights over 1,300 feet long, 15 >turns, and 70 feet of elevation change. > >Eagles Canyon is a true driver's track, and is planned to host all classes of >events from the top level racing series to club racing and private HPDE days. > >http://www.eaglescanyon.com/php/welcome.php > > November > > > Nov 30th-Dec 2nd > 1st Annual Eagles Canyon Extravaganza > > > > Eagles Canyon Raceway > > Slidell, Tx. (Just NW of D/FW) > > > > A brand new, top notch facility and track > > > >Bob Kramer >rkramer3 at austin.rr.com >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillDentin at aol.com Sun Nov 18 12:14:20 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 14:14:20 EST Subject: [Fot] Seeking Dennis Delap Message-ID: Dennis... I don't have a current email address for you. Please contact me. Bill Dentinger ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au Sun Nov 18 14:01:44 2007 From: jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au (Jim Cun) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 13:01:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi Guys, Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs steel for a TR race car? Regards Jim Make the switch to the world's best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html From tony at tonydrews.com Sun Nov 18 14:14:37 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 15:14:37 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel In-Reply-To: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20071118211526.F24CC187A46@autox.team.net> Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. - Tony At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >Hi Guys, > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >steel for a TR race car? > >Regards Jim > > > Make the switch to the world's >best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 14:57:34 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 16:57:34 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com> I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of jewelry that I hated to cover up. Joe >Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With >proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more >troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. > >- Tony > >At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>Hi Guys, >> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>steel for a TR race car? >> >>Regards Jim >> >> >> Make the switch to the world's >>best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>_______________________________________________ >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >>Fot mailing list >>Fot at autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au Sun Nov 18 15:13:11 2007 From: jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au (Jim Cun) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 14:13:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <885586.45039.qm@web51812.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Kas, We have a couple of guys "engine builders" here in OZ who say that using an alloy flywheel makes it difficult to get off the line. I would not even consider a steel flywheel unless it has the same shape and weight of alloy. That is not likely. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Cun" To: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:01 PM Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel > Hi Guys, > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs > steel for a TR race car? > > Regards Jim > > > Make the switch to the world's > best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. > http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Make the switch to the world's best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 15:24:12 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 17:24:12 EST Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: Jim, My steel flywheel is 10lbs, has no steel insert, and has always stayed on the crankshaft. The secret of the weight is in the machining. Joe A > I would not > even consider a steel flywheel unless it has the same shape and > weight of > alloy. That is not likely. > From chris at tr4-racing.de Sun Nov 18 16:15:50 2007 From: chris at tr4-racing.de (Marx Christian tr4-racing) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 00:15:50 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <001701c82a38$f997cef0$6402a8c0@HOME> My flywheel is 3,95 kg of weight without ringgear. So far a trouble free unit. Cheers Chris Hi Guys, Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs steel for a TR race car? Regards Jim Make the switch to the world's best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From chris at tr4-racing.de Sun Nov 18 17:04:22 2007 From: chris at tr4-racing.de (Marx Christian tr4-racing) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 01:04:22 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <002c01c82a3f$c91a9d50$6402a8c0@HOME> Sorry I've forgotten......it is a steel wheel. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Drews" To: "Marx Christian tr4-racing" Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 1:00 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > Is it steel or is it aluminum? > > - Tony > > At 05:15 PM 11/18/2007, you wrote: > >My flywheel is 3,95 kg of weight without ringgear. > >So far a trouble free unit. > > > >Cheers > >Chris > > > > > >Hi Guys, > > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs > > steel for a TR race car? > > > > > > Regards Jim > > > > > > > > Make the switch to the world's > > best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. > > http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From kaskas at cox.net Sun Nov 18 17:26:09 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 16:26:09 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com> Message-ID: <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> It is sometimes confusing when referring to other than alloy flywheels, some are steel and others are CAST IRON. With a steel wheel I can see getting the weight out of the outside diameter and the total down but I'd be very very careful doing this with cast iron. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" ; "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:57 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel >I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of jewelry that I >hated to cover up. > > Joe > > > >>Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With >>proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more >>troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. >> >>- Tony >> >>At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>>Hi Guys, >>> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>>steel for a TR race car? >>> >>>Regards Jim >>> >>> >>> Make the switch to the world's >>>best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>>http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>>_______________________________________________ >>>http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> >>>Fot mailing list >>>Fot at autox.team.net >>>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>_______________________________________________ >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >>Fot mailing list >>Fot at autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 17:32:30 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 19:32:30 EST Subject: [Fot] Liners to Be Bored Message-ID: FoT, A couple of us are going to be doing some liner boring in the first week of December. If anyone would like to join in, I can supply address to send them to. There is no financial benefit to me. It does benefit the guy who took the time to develop the fixture, for me, to hold the liners. They dont have to be there by the 1st of December, but that's when ours are going to be done. The set up is pretty easy, but volume is still more efficient. J & L Engines in Allison, Iowa Joe From VANDECARR at aol.com Sun Nov 18 17:56:51 2007 From: VANDECARR at aol.com (VANDECARR at aol.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 19:56:51 EST Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR Message-ID: My brother runs a repair shop and VWs (mainly the new Bugs) must have the CPU reprogrammed by the dealer if the battery goes dead or you disconnect it. German manufacturers, Mercedes, BMW and VW will not release a lot of technical data and say that these repairs must be done by an authorized dealer. Good reason to think twice before buying these cars. Dean VanDeCarr - lots of British but no German cars ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From fojag at hotmail.com Sun Nov 18 18:07:52 2007 From: fojag at hotmail.com (J A G) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 20:07:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs In-Reply-To: <001101c828bd$3474d0e0$43a6544c@Guinan> References: <001101c828bd$3474d0e0$43a6544c@Guinan> Message-ID: Jay,what specs are you considering. My dearched spring is too flat and I am looking for something with more arch and therefore less negative camber Joseph> From: joeg at neb.rr.com> To: fot at autox.team.net; jaxonracing at yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:57:26 -0600> Subject: Re: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs> > Jay - Talk to George at Flex-A-Form. http://flex-a-form.com He has made> several springs for Spitfires, and will make them to your specifications for> weight rating and height. Runs about $200? Weighs about 9 pounds or> something like that?> > > Joe Guinan> 751 Day Drive> Fremont, NE 68025> Home Phone - 402-727-8011> joeg at neb.rr.com> ------------------------------> > From: Jay Creel > Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs> To: fot at autox.team.net> > FOT,> > I am looking for a new "dearched" leaf spring for my HP Triumph Spitfire. I> had spoken with Rick Cline some time ago regarding a spring but there were> some challenges with the supplier at the time. Since then, I have continued> to use my "stock" dearched spring but I am looking to upgrade.> > Does anyone know of a source for a composite leaf spring for a racing> spitfire? Contact information and if they have specifications on file?? I> will also reach out to Rick C. to discuss the possibility of getting a> famous Rick Cline spring.> > thanks> > Jay R. Creel> _______________________________________________> http://www.team.net/donate.html> > Fot mailing list> Fot at autox.team.net> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _________________________________________________________________ Your smile counts. The more smiles you share, the more we donate. Join in. www.windowslive.com/smile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_oprsmilewlhmtagline From fpspitfire at insightbb.com Sun Nov 18 18:11:21 2007 From: fpspitfire at insightbb.com (fpspitfire at insightbb.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 20:11:21 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel In-Reply-To: <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> References: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com> <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> Message-ID: I prefer the steel flywheels over modified cast iron and aluminium flywheels. I use a steel flywheel and it weighs about 6 lbs. aaron ----- Original Message ----- From: Kas Kastner Date: Sunday, November 18, 2007 19:26 Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel To: N197TR4 at cs.com, Tony Drews , Jim Cun , Friends of Triumph > It is sometimes confusing when referring to other than alloy > flywheels, some > are steel and others are CAST IRON. With a steel wheel I can see > getting the > weight out of the outside diameter and the total down but I'd be > very very > careful doing this with cast iron. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" > ; > "Friends of Triumph" > Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:57 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > > > >I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of > jewelry that I > >hated to cover up. > > > > Joe > > > > > > > >>Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the > crankshaft. With > >>proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more > >>troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. > >> > >>- Tony > >> > >>At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: > >>>Hi Guys, > >>> > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs > >>>steel for a TR race car? > >>> > >>>Regards Jim From lunkercars at earthlink.net Sun Nov 18 18:34:23 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:34:23 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel In-Reply-To: <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> References: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com> <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> Message-ID: <524F2685-494C-4D27-9BED-3E64676792B0@earthlink.net> Please elaborate a bit Kas. I've never heard of a steel flywheel for a TR. I always assumed they were all cast iron as OEM. Were there some that were steel from the factory? Or were the steel ones something "trick" from days gone bye? As I recall, my stock flywheel was originally something around 33lbs. and after getting it down to around 22, I have to agree that I couldn't see where any additional weight could be safely taken off. FWIW - I did find the difference to be noticeable [for the better] minus that 11lbs. - been a bit leery of going alloy. Also, I've been considering either a TR6 flywheel [for the TR4] or re- drilling my TR4 flywheel for the sake of the [much lighter] TR6 diaphragm type pressure pressure plate. - Any thoughts? Thanks in advance, Greg Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 18, 2007, at 5:26 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > It is sometimes confusing when referring to other than alloy > flywheels, some > are steel and others are CAST IRON. With a steel wheel I can see > getting the > weight out of the outside diameter and the total down but I'd be > very very > careful doing this with cast iron. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" > ; > "Friends of Triumph" > Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:57 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > > >> I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of >> jewelry that I >> hated to cover up. >> >> Joe >> >> >> >>> Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. >>> With >>> proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more >>> troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. >>> >>> - Tony >>> >>> At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>>> Hi Guys, >>>> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>>> steel for a TR race car? >>>> >>>> Regards Jim >>>> >>>> >>>> Make the switch to the world's >>>> best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>>> http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>>> >>>> Fot mailing list >>>> Fot at autox.team.net >>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>> _______________________________________________ >>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> >>> Fot mailing list >>> Fot at autox.team.net >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dale.oesterle at sbcglobal.net Sun Nov 18 18:37:31 2007 From: dale.oesterle at sbcglobal.net (dale oesterle) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 17:37:31 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <497589.3348.qm@web82208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Can someone detail the rear spring strength for each side in a spitfire? Need stock, cline spring and/ or any other dearched racing spring? Dale J A G wrote: Jay,what specs are you considering. My dearched spring is too flat and I am looking for something with more arch and therefore less negative camber Joseph> From: joeg at neb.rr.com> To: fot at autox.team.net; jaxonracing at yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:57:26 -0600> Subject: Re: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs> > Jay - Talk to George at Flex-A-Form. http://flex-a-form.com He has made> several springs for Spitfires, and will make them to your specifications for> weight rating and height. Runs about $200? Weighs about 9 pounds or> something like that?> > > Joe Guinan> 751 Day Drive> Fremont, NE 68025> Home Phone - 402-727-8011> joeg at neb.rr.com> ------------------------------> > From: Jay Creel > Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs> To: fot at autox.team.net> > FOT,> > I am looking for a new "dearched" leaf spring for my HP Triumph Spitfire. I> had spoken with Rick Cline some time ago regarding a spring but there were> some challenges with the supplier at the time. Since then, I have continued> to use my "stock" dearched spring but I am looking to upgrade.> > Does anyone know of a source for a composite leaf spring for a racing> spitfire? Contact information and if they have specifications on file?? I> will also reach out to Rick C. to discuss the possibility of getting a> famous Rick Cline spring.> > thanks> > Jay R. Creel> _______________________________________________> http://www.team.net/donate.html> > Fot mailing list> Fot at autox.team.net> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _________________________________________________________________ Your smile counts. The more smiles you share, the more we donate. Join in. www.windowslive.com/smile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_oprsmilewlhmtagline Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sun Nov 18 19:34:55 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:34:55 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com><009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> <524F2685-494C-4D27-9BED-3E64676792B0@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <00ee01c82a54$c5fe5ca0$0502a8c0@desktop> Greg, check out this link below. It seems the consensus is steel vs. aluminum. This was my thought also and I now have 2 steel flywheels for the long ended crankshaft. I'm having one of them machined to accept the Tilton racing clutch Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 http://www.cambridgemotorsport.com/TR56-Steel-Flywheels ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" To: "Kas Kastner" Cc: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 5:34 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > Please elaborate a bit Kas. I've never heard of a steel flywheel for > a TR. I always assumed they were all cast iron as OEM. Were there > some that were steel from the factory? Or were the steel ones > something "trick" from days gone bye? As I recall, my stock flywheel > was originally something around 33lbs. and after getting it down to > around 22, I have to agree that I couldn't see where any additional > weight could be safely taken off. > FWIW - I did find the difference to be noticeable [for the better] > minus that 11lbs. - been a bit leery of going alloy. > Also, I've been considering either a TR6 flywheel [for the TR4] or re- > drilling my TR4 flywheel for the sake of the [much lighter] TR6 > diaphragm type pressure pressure plate. - Any thoughts? > Thanks in advance, > Greg Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > > > On Nov 18, 2007, at 5:26 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > >> It is sometimes confusing when referring to other than alloy >> flywheels, some >> are steel and others are CAST IRON. With a steel wheel I can see >> getting the >> weight out of the outside diameter and the total down but I'd be >> very very >> careful doing this with cast iron. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: >> To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" >> ; >> "Friends of Triumph" >> Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:57 PM >> Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel >> >> >>> I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of >>> jewelry that I >>> hated to cover up. >>> >>> Joe >>> >>> >>> >>>> Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. >>>> With >>>> proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more >>>> troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. >>>> >>>> - Tony >>>> >>>> At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>>>> Hi Guys, >>>>> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>>>> steel for a TR race car? >>>>> >>>>> Regards Jim >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Make the switch to the world's >>>>> best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>>>> http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>>>> >>>>> Fot mailing list >>>>> Fot at autox.team.net >>>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>>> >>>> Fot mailing list >>>> Fot at autox.team.net >>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>> _______________________________________________ >>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> >>> Fot mailing list >>> Fot at autox.team.net >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sun Nov 18 19:54:36 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:54:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available References: <200711180156.lAI1upR9342147@ns3.geneseo.net> Message-ID: <010f01c82a57$8590a670$0502a8c0@desktop> Hey Jack are you think of making scrapers for the TR6 motor? I know of at least 2 sales immediately, maybe 3. Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack W. Drews" To: Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 5:58 PM Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available > Some time ago I designed a crank scraper for the TR3 - 4 engine. I > designed two, actually - one for the stock crank / stock rod engine, > and one for the Moldex / Carillo engine. Several of us are using > them. Since designing these things and programming for laser cutting > is very time consuming, I have not made them for the Spitfire or TR6 > engine. > > They are made from 1/8" steel and mount under the heads of three main > cap bolts. They come with three hardened washers to go between the > bolt heads and the scraper. > > You can see a picture on Tony's site -- www.Tonydrews.com -- link > "Jack's Parts" > > There was not much interest at the time so I had a limited run made > of each configuration. I still have a few of them left. > I'll sell the ones I still have for $64.95 apiece plus shipping. > > uncle jack > > > > ------------------------------------------------ > No Virus Found In This Message > Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 20:29:42 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 22:29:42 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <6322EF05.3501AD0B.00159EE9@cs.com> "Charly Mitchel" wrote: >Greg, check out this link below. It seems the consensus is steel vs. >aluminum. This was my thought also and I now have 2 steel flywheels for the >long ended crankshaft. >I'm having one of them machined to accept the Tilton racing clutch >Charly Mitchel >TR6 #44 > STEEL! YES! These have and can be made in the u.s. If there is an order interest of 10 we could revisit the quote & leadtime. I want another one myself. Joe A From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sun Nov 18 21:07:33 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 20:07:33 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Triumph motors Message-ID: <014901c82a61$b67e1650$0502a8c0@desktop> I have a few (4) Spitfire motors I need to get moved if anybody is interested, contact me. Pictures and details are below Thanks, Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/pts/483099149.html From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Sun Nov 18 21:31:46 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 22:31:46 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <6322EF05.3501AD0B.00159EE9@cs.com> Message-ID: <003001c82a65$1982b8c0$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> BPNW stocks a TR4 and TR6 lightweight steel flywheel. They have conflicting info, the blurb says 9.5 lbs. but the link on the order page says 11 lbs. Either way, it's steel and of the same design as the Cambridge version. I have one in my car. I've had the engine out twice and so far so good. Alloy Light Flywheel TR3-4A Product Detail This is a Alloy 9.25 lbs flywheel for a TR3-4A. Unleash the revving potential of your car but this won't be too light for the street. It takes the bolt on ring gear and is drilled for the lighter TR4A Pressure plate. Ring gear is not included. $414.75 Flywheel Alloy TR6 70-76 Product Detail This is a Alloy 9.5 lbs flywheel for a TR6 70-76. Unleash the revving potential of your TR6, being 9.5 pounds the car will rev easily but won't be too light for the street. Ring gear is sold separately. FIA approved. $432.87 Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ""Charly Mitchel"" ; ""Greg "Lunker" Hilyer"" ; ""Kas Kastner"" Cc: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 9:29 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > "Charly Mitchel" wrote: > >>Greg, check out this link below. It seems the consensus is steel vs. >>aluminum. This was my thought also and I now have 2 steel flywheels for >>the >>long ended crankshaft. >>I'm having one of them machined to accept the Tilton racing clutch >>Charly Mitchel >>TR6 #44 >> > STEEL! YES! > > These have and can be made in the u.s. If there is an order interest of > 10 we could revisit the quote & leadtime. I want another one myself. > > Joe A > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From awashatko at wi.rr.com Mon Nov 19 05:33:00 2007 From: awashatko at wi.rr.com (Allen Washatko) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 06:33:00 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line Message-ID: FoT, I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? Allen A l l e n W a s h a t k o 1971 TR6 - Number 6 From tony at tonydrews.com Mon Nov 19 06:18:45 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 07:18:45 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20071119131930.237B3187A78@autox.team.net> I imagine fewer bad things occurring when it's run parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger compartment. It's further from the drivetrain, and further from the exhaust pipe / header. My driveshaft tunnel gets pretty hot during a race. - Tony At 06:33 AM 11/19/2007, Allen Washatko wrote: >FoT, > >I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking >for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines >placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger >compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use >a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? > >Allen > >A l l e n W a s h a t k o >1971 TR6 - Number 6 From wgrosenbach at juno.com Mon Nov 19 07:14:42 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 07:14:42 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate Message-ID: <20071119.071443.2424.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Ok, I will never again laugh at the SCCA for their ridiculous protests; THE FIA can't even figure out how to read a thermometer. The full FIA statement: "The FIA International Court of Appeal met in London on Thursday, November 15, 2007, to examine an appeal lodged by the Motor Sports Association (MSA) on behalf of its licence-holder Vodafone McLaren Mercedes against the decision (document 41) of the Panel of the Stewards of the 2007 Brazilian Grand Prix dated 21 October 2007 and counting towards the 2007 FIA Formula One World Championship. "Following a report from the Technical Delegate indicating that the temperature of fuel pumped into the cars N09 - Nick Heidfeld, N010 - Robert Kubica, N016 - Nico Rosberg and N017 - Kazuki Nakajima, was more than 10 degrees centigrade below ambient temperature, the Stewards of the Meeting met to consider whether a penalty should be imposed. Having heard the evidence they decided not to impose a penalty as they had sufficient doubt as to both the temperature of the fuel on board the car and to the true ambient temperature. "Having heard the explanations of both parties and having examined the various documents and other evidence, the Court decided that the appeal lodged by Vodafone McLaren Mercedes is inadmissible. "The International Court of Appeal was presided over by Mr Jan STOVICEK (Czech Republic), elected President, and composed of Mr John CASSIDY (United States), Mr Vassilis KOUSSIS (Greece) and Mr Jos? MACEDO e CUNHA (Portugal). "The full text of the International Court of Appeal's decision is available, on request, from the secretariat of the FIA International Court of Appeal in Paris." This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, any disclosure, copying, further distribution or use thereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and delete/destroy it. From henry at henryfrye.com Mon Nov 19 08:12:49 2007 From: henry at henryfrye.com (Henry Frye) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 10:12:49 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBBA@server.Triumph.local> I plumbed stainless steel hard line from the fuel pump (located in the bottom of the spare tire well next to the cell) up over the rear bulkhead into the passenger compartment tight against the passenger side rear inner wheel well. Then followed the inner sill up to the passenger footwell. Under the scuttle I have a gentle 90 degree bend upward. The line then goes through the horizontal shelf above the firewall to the regulator, then the fuel distribution block. Flex lines to the carbs. I didn't like the idea of naked fuel line in the passenger compartment so I slipped the hard line into tight fitting rubber fuel hose so there is a VERY thick insulation covering the hard fuel line. This rubber sheath runs from the 90 degree bend under the scuttle back beyond the steel panel that encloses the boot/fuel cell area. BTW, I used stainless because I had it laying about from another project. I am not sure I would buy stainless for this purpose, but it works for me. > -----Original Message----- > From: Allen Washatko > Subject: [Fot] Gas Line > > Any thoughts as to the safest installation? From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 08:27:08 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 10:27:08 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line Message-ID: I ran my line as far from heat sources as possible. I did not run the line inside the cockpit. In my TR6, I ran the line along the left-hand chassis rail, because I did not want the line anywhere near the header. I use a single exhaust pipe along the middle of the chassis. I run the line up the firewall, along the firewall from the left side to the right (where the battery used to live) to the fuel rail, and then to individual lines to the Webers. I found that the commonly accepted method of feeding Webers with a common fuel line led to reduced pressure at the front carb. I ran the line at the back of the engine rather that around the front, because the latter requires a longer line which increases heat soak. Besides, a line around the front is more exposed to damage in case of a shunt. Shane Ingate in NM Alan Washatco asked: > I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking > for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines > placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger > compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use > a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? _________________________________________________________________ You keep typing, we keep giving. Download Messenger and join the im Initiative now. http://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=TAGLM From triosan at gmail.com Mon Nov 19 09:00:47 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 08:00:47 -0800 Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available In-Reply-To: <010f01c82a57$8590a670$0502a8c0@desktop> References: <200711180156.lAI1upR9342147@ns3.geneseo.net> <010f01c82a57$8590a670$0502a8c0@desktop> Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711190800k1a2b6410o3707f9a26f982edf@mail.gmail.com> If jack does not make them, please see Allen Johnson at crank scrapers, inc. He made me a scraper and baffled windage tray in exchange for the oil pan, oil pump and rod I gave him. You can see the results in Kas last book and at: http://www.crank-scrapers.com/Triumph.html As you can see from the site, crank scrapers are $75. Chuck On Nov 18, 2007 6:54 PM, Charly Mitchel wrote: > Hey Jack are you think of making scrapers for the TR6 motor? I know of at > least 2 sales immediately, maybe 3. > Charly Mitchel > TR6 #44 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jack W. Drews" > To: > Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 5:58 PM > Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available > > > > Some time ago I designed a crank scraper for the TR3 - 4 engine. I > > designed two, actually - one for the stock crank / stock rod engine, > > and one for the Moldex / Carillo engine. Several of us are using > > them. Since designing these things and programming for laser cutting > > is very time consuming, I have not made them for the Spitfire or TR6 > > engine. > > > > They are made from 1/8" steel and mount under the heads of three main > > cap bolts. They come with three hardened washers to go between the > > bolt heads and the scraper. > > > > You can see a picture on Tony's site -- www.Tonydrews.com -- link > > "Jack's Parts" > > > > There was not much interest at the time so I had a limited run made > > of each configuration. I still have a few of them left. > > I'll sell the ones I still have for $64.95 apiece plus shipping. > > > > uncle jack > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------ > > No Virus Found In This Message > > Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > -- Chuck Arnold From Fubog1 at aol.com Mon Nov 19 09:00:57 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 11:00:57 EST Subject: [Fot] Gas Line Message-ID: I normally use hard line & aeroquip also but from a safety standpoint I'll also offer something else to consider when it comes to fuel system plumbing, especially the engine bay. Anybody that has had a screwdriver or wrench try to arc weld itself to an Aeroquip hose will understand why I normally DON'T use Aeroquip anywhere in a fuel system when there's a chance that it could get tangled up with electrics in any way, be it the slip of a wrench into a hot lug, stray wiring or uninsulated terminal, or a crash. Although lacking in the "cool" factor, marine-grade fabric reinforced hose is great stuff. Glen BTDT 1 time, nasty sparks & a (pinhole) fuel leak, fortunately no fire, lesson learned... I plan to use a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From sbarr at McCarty-Law.com Mon Nov 19 09:44:43 2007 From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com (Barr, Scott) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 10:44:43 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Christmas shopping Message-ID: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74860F29@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Anybody know if La Carrera Panamericana (Pink Floyd, et. al.) has ever been released on DVD? My in-laws are looking for gift ideas for me and I'd suggest that one, since I've got it on VHS, but no longer have a VCR... Scott From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 19 09:49:57 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 11:49:57 EST Subject: [Fot] OEM Flywheel on eBay and Clutch Assembly Rebuild Message-ID: TR4A Flywheel Lightened for Improved Performance Item number: 170170835593 If any one is interested....low starting bid on flywheel. BTW, if you use the finger style clutch cover, and want it rebuilt. It can be done with new springs, fingers, and resurfacing. I have enough fingers available for three clutch covers. Then finger supply is an issue. They can be welded with hard materials, but that's labor intensive. Clutch Disc Rebuild: The material for the clutch disc is a woven material and superior to OEM and current replacement. There is a limited amount of this clutch material left. Maybe three discs. Rebuilding is well below current direct replacement costs. Joe A From greenman62 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 11:39:10 2007 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (greenman62 at hotmail.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 18:39:10 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Christmas shopping In-Reply-To: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74860F29@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> References: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74860F29@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Message-ID: Try this... http://www.amazon.com/Carrera-Panamericana-Music-Pink-Floyd/dp/B00004RP24 Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 10:44:43 -0600 > From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: [Fot] Christmas shopping > > Anybody know if La Carrera Panamericana (Pink Floyd, et. al.) has ever > been released on DVD? > > My in-laws are looking for gift ideas for me and I'd suggest that one, > since I've got it on VHS, but no longer have a VCR... > > Scott > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillDentin at aol.com Mon Nov 19 12:13:10 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:13:10 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: Amici... I recently obtained a subscription to the magazine TRIUMPH WORLD. While I was aware of this magazine (friends had sent me copies of articles from time to time), I had never seen a copy. I was very impressed. It is glossy, high quality, and covers all things TRIUMPH. The scope of the articles is wide, including competition, history, restoration, social and so on. I've read both issues I've received so far from cover to cover. I sure would recommend it to those of you who would enjoy such a TRIUMPH specific publication. If you are not aware of TRIUMPH WORLD, it is available by subscription, as well as at some newsstand outlets. If you have trouble locating a copy, you might contact their subscription office (tw.mag at kelsey.co.uk). They might be able to help you find a source near you. Bill Dentinger ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From lang at isis.mit.edu Mon Nov 19 12:19:49 2007 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert Lang) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:19:49 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, The US subscriptions are handled through EWA Cars, ewacars.com 2nd class mailing in the US is currently $99 /year. NFI, of course. rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Room N42-140Q | This space for rent Consultant MIT IS&T unix-linux-help | Voice:617-253-7438 FAX: 617-258-9535 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 19 12:30:18 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:30:18 EST Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Confirmation Number 86651177 Message-ID: FoT: Watkins Glen Attendees....please read the following and make your reservations. If anyone needs any help with theirs, please let me know. Regards, Joe Alexander > Dear Mr. Alexander > > This email is to confirm your group reservations for 9/3/08 b 9/8/07. I > have 15 rooms reserved under the name of bFriends of Triumphb at a group of > $114.00 plus tax. Your confirmation # is 86651177. > > Andrea Stowe, CHA > General Manager > Hampton Inn > 9775 Victory Highway > Painted Post, NY 14870 > 607-936-3344 > 607-936-3393 (fax) > Return-Path: Received: from rly-mg10.mx.aol.com (rly-mg10.mail.aol.com [172.20.83.116]) by air-mg02.mail.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILINMG021-a3e4741e0ef2bf; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:16:49 -0400 Received: from ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com (ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com [24.24.2.57]) by rly-mg10.mx.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINMG108-a3e4741e0ef2bf; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:15:59 -0400 Received: from FranzeseLaptop (rrcs-24-39-168-3.nys.biz.rr.com [24.39.168.3]) by ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id lAJJFrGJ010762 for ; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:15:57 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200711191915.lAJJFrGJ010762 at ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com> From: "Andrea Stowe" To: Subject: Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:10:35 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 thread-index: Acgq39z+QSwvgZNhR9ygssZc0YssUQ== X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-AOL-IP: 24.24.2.57 X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_helo : n X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_822_from : n X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Dear Mr. Alexander This email is to confirm your group reservations for 9/3/08 - 9/8/07. I have 15 rooms reserved under the name of "Friends of Triumph" at a group of $114.00 plus tax. Your confirmation # is 86651177. I also have a room reserved for Mr. Kastner. His confirmation # is 87433161. If you have any questions or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact me. Andrea Stowe, CHA General Manager Hampton Inn 9775 Victory Highway Painted Post, NY 14870 607-936-3344 607-936-3393 (fax) From BillDentin at aol.com Mon Nov 19 12:39:47 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:39:47 EST Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Confirmation Number 86651177 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/19/2007 1:30:43 PM Central Standard Time, N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > Watkins Glen Attendees....please read the following and make your > reservations. If anyone needs any help with theirs, please let me know. > Amici... Painted Post, Horseheads, Big Flats, and of course the Town of Dix. I love the names of the little towns in the Watkins Glen area. Steeped in early history back to the revolutionary war. Little known fact...the Town of Dix is where the phrase, "You've got to be shitting me!" originated. Bill (Damdinger0 ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 19 12:51:41 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:51:41 -0500 Subject: [Fot] =?iso-8859-1?q?Hampton_Inn_-_Painted_Post=2C_NY_Confirmatio?= =?iso-8859-1?q?n_Number_=A0_86651177?= Message-ID: <49B17352.16FFA30B.00159EE9@cs.com> ....and if you use GOOGLE EARTH you can get a great view of actual 'GLEN' and the TRACK...... >In a message dated 11/19/2007 1:30:43 PM Central Standard Time, >N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > > >> Watkins Glen Attendees....please read the following and make your >> reservations. If anyone needs any help with theirs, please let me know. >> > >Amici... > >Painted Post, Horseheads, Big Flats, and of course the Town of Dix. I love >the names of the little towns in the Watkins Glen area. Steeped in early >history back to the revolutionary war. Little known fact...the Town of Dix is >where the phrase, "You've got to be shitting me!" originated. > >Bill (Damdinger0 > > >************************************** > See what's new at >http://www.aol.com From jerrybarr at charter.net Mon Nov 19 13:20:38 2007 From: jerrybarr at charter.net (Jerry Barr) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:20:38 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Pistons Message-ID: Hello Listers, I have listed a set of AE Hepolite Triumph Spitfire 1147cc piston set in +040 size on ebay Item Number 260184506739 These are new old stock with pins and ring sets Thanks, Jerry Barr From BillB at bnj.com Mon Nov 19 13:40:47 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 12:40:47 -0800 Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate References: <20071119.071443.2424.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: Actually it makes more sense than it sounds. The rulebook states that the fuel IN THE CAR can't be more than 10 degrees colder than ambient, but the only way the FIA has to measure temperature is the fuel in the filler. This fuel undoubtably is warmed somewhat when it's pumped and mixes with the warmer fuel in the car. Secondly, the rulebook does not say which ambient temperature measurement is official. It is assumed that the temperature provided by the FIA in their network would be official ambient, but the contract meteorologists that most teams use were reporting an ambient temperature a few degrees colder than the FIA temperature. The rulebook is not specific on this issue. What we're seeing here is the difficulty of writing rules that are not subject to interpretation, and the reason why rulebooks get so big and so arcane. Since the World Championship was at stake, I think the FIA and the court did a good job in not deciding the results in the courtroom but rather on the track. I would have been extremely unhappy to see the Iceman stripped of his title by a ruling on an inconsequential error by teams not in competition for the title. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of William G Rosenbach Sent: Mon 11/19/2007 6:14 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate Ok, I will never again laugh at the SCCA for their ridiculous protests; THE FIA can't even figure out how to read a thermometer. The full FIA statement: "The FIA International Court of Appeal met in London on Thursday, November 15, 2007, to examine an appeal lodged by the Motor Sports Association (MSA) on behalf of its licence-holder Vodafone McLaren Mercedes against the decision (document 41) of the Panel of the Stewards of the 2007 Brazilian Grand Prix dated 21 October 2007 and counting towards the 2007 FIA Formula One World Championship. "Following a report from the Technical Delegate indicating that the temperature of fuel pumped into the cars N09 - Nick Heidfeld, N010 - Robert Kubica, N016 - Nico Rosberg and N017 - Kazuki Nakajima, was more than 10 degrees centigrade below ambient temperature, the Stewards of the Meeting met to consider whether a penalty should be imposed. Having heard the evidence they decided not to impose a penalty as they had sufficient doubt as to both the temperature of the fuel on board the car and to the true ambient temperature. "Having heard the explanations of both parties and having examined the various documents and other evidence, the Court decided that the appeal lodged by Vodafone McLaren Mercedes is inadmissible. "The International Court of Appeal was presided over by Mr Jan STOVICEK (Czech Republic), elected President, and composed of Mr John CASSIDY (United States), Mr Vassilis KOUSSIS (Greece) and Mr Jos? MACEDO e CUNHA (Portugal). "The full text of the International Court of Appeal's decision is available, on request, from the secretariat of the FIA International Court of Appeal in Paris." This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, any disclosure, copying, further distribution or use thereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and delete/destroy it. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Mon Nov 19 13:44:54 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 12:44:54 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <20071118211526.F24CC187A46@autox.team.net> Message-ID: I'm not a fan of alloy flywheels, I've had two come adrift despite a lot of modification and prep. The steel flywheels are almost as light and seem bulletproof. The cast ones can't be lightened enough to be worthwhile. Fine for the street. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Tony Drews Sent: Sun 11/18/2007 1:14 PM To: Jim Cun; Friends of Triumph Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. - Tony At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >Hi Guys, > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >steel for a TR race car? > >Regards Jim > > > Make the switch to the world's >best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillDentin at aol.com Mon Nov 19 13:52:34 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 15:52:34 EST Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate Message-ID: In a message dated 11/19/2007 2:43:52 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > What we're seeing here is the difficulty of writing rules that are not > subject > to interpretation, and the reason why rulebooks get so big and so arcane. Seems like I recall Kas telling us that the fact that such rules are subject to interpretation became the basis for his entire career. Bill (Damdinger) ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From TomD4760 at aol.com Mon Nov 19 13:54:51 2007 From: TomD4760 at aol.com (TomD4760 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 15:54:51 EST Subject: [Fot] AH Bugeye Race Car for sale Message-ID: I am selling my 1959 Bugeye Race Car. Please email for spec sheet and pictures. TomD4760 at aol.com Thank you. Tom Deats

**************************************
See what's new at http://www.aol.com From spreiss at verizon.net Sun Nov 18 22:22:53 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:22:53 +1100 Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control Message-ID: <010801c82a6c$3c7a1f10$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> FOT I am thinking of making an objective of reducing the air temperature in the engine compartment of my TR3, and to direct as cool air as possible to the carburetor intakes. I know there are shrouds available to channel maximum outside air through the radiator, but that seems to address only part of the problem. Where does all that heat from the head and exhaust manifold go? Surely not out those two little slits. Louvered bonnets are an attempt to address this no doubt, but it seems they are expensive and not universally done. I know from seat of the pants that as operating temperature rises, performance dwindles. How do others deal with it? Steve Preiss From kaskas at cox.net Mon Nov 19 14:39:03 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 13:39:03 -0800 Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control References: <010801c82a6c$3c7a1f10$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <008401c82af4$9aed7820$3f0ec548@RW> There are some pretty cute ways of doing this. Most obvious is the blocking up of the hood hinges so that the back lip of the hood has a gap to provide an exit for hot air. That also vents to a low pressure area when you have a full screen. You might want to find out if you have a pressure differential under the hood compared to ambient before starting an exercise. Some folks have a vent in the front fender, looks nice and is effective but pretty small and you are depending on the lower pressure at the side of the car ( not always true) You can vent into wheel well with just expanded metal screen in the inner fender panel. Works pretty well, but use a water monometer to check the pressure difference before you cut metal. Probably not legal in most Vintage outfits, but then we are talking about theories anyway. :-) This is without touching on another obvious mod of heat shields for the inlet and exhaust systems. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Preiss" To: Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 9:22 PM Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control > FOT > I am thinking of making an objective of reducing the air temperature in > the > engine compartment of my TR3, and to direct as cool air as possible to the > carburetor intakes. I know there are shrouds available to channel maximum > outside air through the radiator, but that seems to address only part of > the > problem. Where does all that heat from the head and exhaust manifold go? > Surely not out those two little slits. Louvered bonnets are an attempt to > address this no doubt, but it seems they are expensive and not universally > done. I know from seat of the pants that as operating temperature rises, > performance dwindles. How do others deal with it? > Steve Preiss > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rocky at spitfire4.com Mon Nov 19 15:03:38 2007 From: rocky at spitfire4.com (Rocky Entriken) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:03:38 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line References: Message-ID: <002801c82af8$0b748220$6701a8c0@S1099895562> When I rerouted the fuel run in my Spitfire last year. I did it with all braided lines and inside the passenger compartment along the doorsill on the passenger side. Which almost made it a straightline run to the carbs by way of the fuel regulator which is mounted on the little shelf on the right side under the hood. The line is protected not only by the stronger bodywork along the doorsill but also by brace bars of the rollcage immediately above it. I also took the occasion to install a fuel pressure gauge (it's the gauge farthest from me on the dash, which also makes it the closest to the fuel line & carbs). --Rocky Entriken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Allen Washatko" To: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 6:33 AM Subject: [Fot] Gas Line > FoT, > > I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking > for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines > placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger > compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use > a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? > > Allen > > A l l e n W a s h a t k o > 1971 TR6 - Number 6 > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 15:07:09 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 17:07:09 -0500 Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control Message-ID: Kas wrote: > Most obvious is the blocking > up of the hood hinges so that the back lip of the hood has a gap to provide > an exit for hot air. That also vents to a low pressure area when you have a > full screen. I did this with my Pantera, using rubber draw-latchs that accommodate a lot of alignment error, and raising the hood 3/4". I achieved more than 20C temperature differential using this technique. The latches are pretty inexpensive, like this from Pegasus: http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productdetails.asp?RecId=772 Yes, I know, the Pantera motor is in the back, but the radiator is in the front with very little area to vent the hot air. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Put your friends on the big screen with Windows Vista. + Windows Live. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/shop/specialoffers.mspx?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_CPC_M ediaCtr_bigscreen_102007 From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 15:09:20 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 17:09:20 -0500 Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control II Message-ID: I forgot to add: Redline Water Wetter works great! But y'all are probably using this anyway. S. _________________________________________________________________ Put your friends on the big screen with Windows Vista. + Windows Live. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/shop/specialoffers.mspx?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_CPC_M ediaCtr_bigscreen_102007 From kaskas at cox.net Mon Nov 19 15:37:01 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:37:01 -0800 Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate References: Message-ID: <00af01c82afc$b3addbe0$3f0ec548@RW> Yes, Bill. Regulations with lots of words are the meat for a "thinking man". ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 12:52 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate > In a message dated 11/19/2007 2:43:52 PM Central Standard Time, > BillB at bnj.com > writes: > > >> What we're seeing here is the difficulty of writing rules that are not >> subject >> to interpretation, and the reason why rulebooks get so big and so arcane. > > Seems like I recall Kas telling us that the fact that such rules are > subject > to interpretation became the basis for his entire career. > > Bill (Damdinger) > > > > ************************************** > See what's new at http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Mon Nov 19 15:45:59 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:45:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com><20071118211526.F24CC187A46@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <003401c82afd$f4f99930$6401a8c0@TER2> We have been using aluminum alloy flywheels on the TR-4 engines for over 25 years. Then engines we have put them on have ranged from 115 hp to 190 hp. We have had one (1) problem in that time. I t was caused by the engine being consistantly overreved at the Pittsburg Vintage GP. The reves used to cause the flywheel to shear its bolts were over 7600 rpm. Using properly designed flywheels and good ARP flywheel retaining bolts of 3/8" diameter, that was to only problem we have had. By the way, the high rpm stess also caused the front generator bracket to break the same weekend the flywheel bolts failed. On a few of our high horsepower engines, we have used 4 or 6 7/16" fasteners instead of the standard size 3/8" pieces. Most of the engines have used 4 3/8" retaining bolts with #8 flat washers, torqued to 60 psi with loctite "nut lock" on the THREADS ONLY. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" ; "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 12:44 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > I'm not a fan of alloy flywheels, I've had two come adrift despite a lot > of > modification and prep. The steel flywheels are almost as light and seem > bulletproof. The cast ones can't be lightened enough to be worthwhile. > Fine > for the street. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Tony Drews > Sent: Sun 11/18/2007 1:14 PM > To: Jim Cun; Friends of Triumph > Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > > Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With > proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more > troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. > > - Tony > > At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>Hi Guys, >> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>steel for a TR race car? >> >>Regards Jim >> >> >> Make the switch to the world's >>best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>_______________________________________________ >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >>Fot mailing list >>Fot at autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Mon Nov 19 15:47:32 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:47:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com><20071118211526.F24CC187A46@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <003801c82afe$2c494c00$6401a8c0@TER2> Sorry, I understand that the 6 cylinder engine is a "different kettle of fish" and is much harder to keep the flywheel on at high rpm. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" ; "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 12:44 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > I'm not a fan of alloy flywheels, I've had two come adrift despite a lot > of > modification and prep. The steel flywheels are almost as light and seem > bulletproof. The cast ones can't be lightened enough to be worthwhile. > Fine > for the street. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Tony Drews > Sent: Sun 11/18/2007 1:14 PM > To: Jim Cun; Friends of Triumph > Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > > Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With > proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more > troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. > > - Tony > > At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>Hi Guys, >> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>steel for a TR race car? >> >>Regards Jim >> >> >> Make the switch to the world's >>best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>_______________________________________________ >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >>Fot mailing list >>Fot at autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Mon Nov 19 15:54:57 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:54:57 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <8C9F6AA585D7B7C-1268-1BE9@webmail-stg-d10.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <004001c82aff$356333e0$6401a8c0@TER2> We have had some piston scuffing problems in TR-4 engines with "billet" rods that do not squuirt oil onto the cylinders. These problems have only happened whrn the engines were being run at very low rpm, ie, under 2,000 rpm. It turned out that not enough oil was being thrown up on the cylinder walls. These scuffing incidents occured when idling around the pits, driving the car on the street and idling around a parking lot, and when starting the car and idling in a garage. It happened 3 separate times in the same engine. Drilling the rods to that oil was squirted onto the thrust side of the cylinder wall once each revolution of the engine cured the problem! There is not a cam lube problem. Anything regarding the cam is probably a separate issue. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Friday, November 16, 2007 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > So, you guys are saying that there is no downside to using a crank scraper > in a wet-liner motor? That even with connecting rods that don't have the > little oil hole like the stock rods do, enough oil gets?to the cylinder > walls?? And that enough oil gets everywhere it needs to get, all the time? > > Rich Rock > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - > http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Mon Nov 19 15:53:02 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (spitlist at cox.net) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:53:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate In-Reply-To: <20071119.071443.2424.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: <20071119175302.F6XMD.13952.root@fed1wml08.mgt.cox.net> I don't think that the FIA's decision to dismiss the protest was based on the readings of the thermometer, as much as it had to do with the relivance of the readings. Since there is no way to ppropriately measure the temperature of the fuel once it is on board, the readings that they took cannot be accurately applied to the temps of the on-board fuel. And since the regulation specifies the temp of the fuel in the car, the mearurements of the fuel in the rig is meaningless. It is very easy to conclude that the fuel temp will rise dramatically when it is introduced to the very hot car during a race. Joe C. ---- William G Rosenbach wrote: > Ok, I will never again laugh at the SCCA for their ridiculous protests; > THE FIA can't even figure out how to read a thermometer. From gaf3 at charter.net Mon Nov 19 16:46:22 2007 From: gaf3 at charter.net (Glenn Franco) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 18:46:22 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line In-Reply-To: <002801c82af8$0b748220$6701a8c0@S1099895562> References: <002801c82af8$0b748220$6701a8c0@S1099895562> Message-ID: <4742204E.2060404@charter.net> FOT Reading the discussion thread has me wondering what the proper routing path should be in my Spitfire. I have yet to run my fuel line from my fuel cell up to the engine compartment of my Spit. The routing dilemma has had me wondering why anyone would want to run a fuel line anywhere in the passenger compartment. I also have a full cage and could run it inside on the right with full protection afforded by the cage. The possibility of fire, for whatever reason, would have me run it on the outside of the frame rail below the vehicle away from the exhaust. I guess all the years spent in chassis engineering (big three product liability) has me wondering. What advantage is there to running the fuel line in the vehicle? Glenn Franco 72 Spitfire racer under construction Rocky Entriken wrote: > When I rerouted the fuel run in my Spitfire last year. I did it with all > braided lines and inside the passenger compartment along the doorsill on the > passenger side. Which almost made it a straightline run to the carbs by way > of the fuel regulator which is mounted on the little shelf on the right side > under the hood. The line is protected not only by the stronger bodywork > along the doorsill but also by brace bars of the rollcage immediately above > it. I also took the occasion to install a fuel pressure gauge (it's the > gauge farthest from me on the dash, which also makes it the closest to the > fuel line & carbs). > > --Rocky Entriken > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Allen Washatko" > To: "Friends of Triumph" > Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 6:33 AM > Subject: [Fot] Gas Line > > > >> FoT, >> >> I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking >> for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines >> placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger >> compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use >> a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? >> >> Allen >> >> A l l e n W a s h a t k o >> 1971 TR6 - Number 6 >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tony at tonydrews.com Mon Nov 19 17:42:52 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 18:42:52 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line In-Reply-To: <4742204E.2060404@charter.net> References: <002801c82af8$0b748220$6701a8c0@S1099895562> <4742204E.2060404@charter.net> Message-ID: <20071120004337.AD196187A25@autox.team.net> The main advantage of having it in the cockpit is that it's really hard to rip off the fuel line during an off-course excursion. I think the best route is under the car in such a manner that the frame rails protect it from side and bottom impacts but you still have sheet metal between you and the fuel line. I didn't see an easy way to accomplish that in my car (TR-4) without drilling holes in the frame. - Tony At 05:46 PM 11/19/2007, Glenn Franco wrote: >FOT >Reading the discussion thread has me wondering what the proper routing >path should be in my Spitfire. >I have yet to run my fuel line from my fuel cell up to the engine >compartment of my Spit. The routing dilemma has had me wondering why >anyone would >want to run a fuel line anywhere in the passenger compartment. I also >have a full cage and could run it inside on the right with full >protection afforded by >the cage. The possibility of fire, for whatever reason, would have me >run it on the outside of the frame rail below the vehicle away from the >exhaust. >I guess all the years spent in chassis engineering (big three product >liability) has me wondering. > >What advantage is there to running the fuel line in the vehicle? > >Glenn Franco >72 Spitfire racer under construction From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 20:06:20 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 22:06:20 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line Message-ID: Glenn Franco asked: > What advantage is there to running the fuel line in the vehicle? BBQ? Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newways_112007 From klynch_6 at msn.com Mon Nov 19 20:09:25 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 20:09:25 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line References: Message-ID: fries?? er...sorry KL ----- Original Message ----- From: Shane Ingate To: gaf3 at charter.net Cc: Friends of Triumph Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 8:06 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Gas Line Glenn Franco asked: > What advantage is there to running the fuel line in the vehicle? BBQ? Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newways_112007 _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Mon Nov 19 21:40:40 2007 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 20:40:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control In-Reply-To: <010801c82a6c$3c7a1f10$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <361601.53693.qm@web81215.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Steve: When I was building the car that Randy Williams currently owns I went to the CVAR rules committee to ask if I could louver the bonnet. They told me if I did I would need to run the car as a sport racer against other sport racers of the time. Since I thought it unlikely that it could be competitive against the likes of a Lotus 11 or similar cars I chose not to louver the bonnet. They did allow me to open the two bonnet vents as long as it wasn't unsightly. I did have two louvered panels made and I welded them to the inside wheel wells. They can't be seen from the outside when the wheels are mounted, and there is enough stuff under the bonnet to obscure them from view. There is a low pressure area in the wheel wells at speed, and it helps to evacuate the hot air from under the bonnet. Ken G. once told me that in the SoCal region they didn't allow the spacer blocks under the hinges. His trick was to loosen the two nuts that secure the hinges to the scuttle. As speed increased the rear of the bonnet would raise up. When you slowed down the hood would drop back down. During tech everything appeared to be "normal". I'm here to say I know that under the bonnet is a high pressure area. Having had a bonnet open at about 40 mph I can bear witness that the safety latches nor the hinges will keep the bonnet secured to the scuttle. I have the scar from the stitches to prove it. Still dizzy after all these years - Ed Steven Preiss wrote: FOT I am thinking of making an objective of reducing the air temperature in the engine compartment of my TR3, and to direct as cool air as possible to the carburetor intakes. I know there are shrouds available to channel maximum outside air through the radiator, but that seems to address only part of the problem. Where does all that heat from the head and exhaust manifold go? Surely not out those two little slits. Louvered bonnets are an attempt to address this no doubt, but it seems they are expensive and not universally done. I know from seat of the pants that as operating temperature rises, performance dwindles. How do others deal with it? Steve Preiss Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From awashatko at wi.rr.com Tue Nov 20 08:10:03 2007 From: awashatko at wi.rr.com (Allen Washatko) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 09:10:03 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Bill Tobin Message-ID: Bill, Please contact me off line. Thanks, Allen A l l e n W a s h a t k o 1971 TR6 - Number 6 From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 20 12:51:27 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 14:51:27 EST Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Reservations for THE GLEN Message-ID: FoT Entries and Attendees. Please read the note below....if you are unable to make reservations the remainder of the week, please try Andrea next week. Andrea seems to be spread a bit thin, but she is communicating with us. Regards, Joe Alexander > HI Mr. Alexander > > I have been receiving phone calls today for reservations, but just wanted to > let you know (my apologies for not letting you know earlier) that I will be > out of the office the rest of the week at another hotel. If anyone calls > this week, they can speak with any front desk agent, or if they want to wait and > speak directly with me, I will be back in the office on Monday. Ibm sorry > for the inconvenience, but hopefully all will work out well. Please let me > know if you have any questions or concerns. Thanks again and Happy Holidays. > > Andrea > Dear Mr. Alexander This email is to confirm your group reservations for 9/3/08 b 9/8/07. I have 15 rooms reserved under the name of bFriends of Triumphb at a group of $114.00 plus tax. Your confirmation # is 86651177. Return-Path: Received: from rly-md08.mx.aol.com (rly-md08.mail.aol.com [172.20.29.146]) by air-md08.mail.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILINMD082-91a474200db86; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:32:27 -0400 Received: from ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com (ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com [24.24.2.57]) by rly-md08.mx.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINMD082-91a474200db86; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:32:12 -0500 Received: from FranzeseLaptop (rrcs-24-39-168-3.nys.biz.rr.com [24.39.168.3]) by ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id lAJLW5kC027586 for ; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:32:10 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200711192132.lAJLW5kC027586 at ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com> From: "Andrea Stowe" To: Subject: RE: Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:26:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 thread-index: Acgq4yQARvNtdGoESXudUi4xTFndegADtdCw In-Reply-To: X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-AOL-IP: 24.24.2.57 X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_helo : n X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_822_from : n X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain HI Mr. Alexander I have been receiving phone calls today for reservations, but just wanted to let you know (my apologies for not letting you know earlier) that I will be out of the office the rest of the week at another hotel. If anyone calls this week, they can speak with any front desk agent, or if they want to wait and speak directly with me, I will be back in the office on Monday. I'm sorry for the inconvenience, but hopefully all will work out well. Please let me know if you have any questions or concerns. Thanks again and Happy Holidays. Andrea _____ From: N197TR4 at cs.com [mailto:N197TR4 at cs.com] Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 2:34 PM To: AStowe at visions-hotels.com Subject: Re: Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Thanks Andrea! Your phone will start ringing today. Joe Alexander Dear Mr. Alexander This email is to confirm your group reservations for 9/3/08 - 9/8/07. I have 15 rooms reserved under the name of "Friends of Triumph" at a group of $114.00 plus tax. Your confirmation # is 86651177. I also have a room reserved for Mr. Kastner. His confirmation # is 87433161. If you have any questions or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact me. Andrea Stowe, CHA General Manager Hampton Inn 9775 Victory Highway Painted Post, NY 14870 607-936-3344 607-936-3393 (fax) From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 20 13:00:20 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 15:00:20 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: FOT, Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to disturb his artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have to do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. Thanks Greg, Joe A From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 20 13:15:02 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 15:15:02 EST Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY Message-ID: List, I had a conversation with one of the members of the WPTA yesterday. There are mumurings that the WPTA would be willing to volunteer to be in charge of Friends of Triumph Hospitality in the Paddock. They have graciously volunteered to do this in the past. It usually means COFFEE and KRISPY KREMES in the mornings, not to mention all other manner of support in the Paoddock. We used to do stuff late at night with them, but most us are getting too old to stay up past 9:00PM. If we wind up with some kind of Corporate Support, as suggested by one our illustrious Coloradans, we will have no shortage of manpower to see that everyone is suitably taken care of. Of course, Tom Strange is in this mix with Paddock Layout. We arent going to micro manage all of this stuff....it all has a way of flowing into a smooth stream. Joe A From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Nov 20 13:25:03 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 15:25:03 EST Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY Message-ID: In a message dated 11/20/2007 2:15:26 PM Central Standard Time, N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > I had a conversation with one of the members of the WPTA yesterday. > > There are mumurings that the WPTA would be willing to volunteer to be in > charge of Friends of Triumph Hospitality in the Paddock. > > Are those guys out on the street again? Must be some sort of 'Work Release' program. That's fantastic. They're GREAT! Bill (Damdinger) ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From tr5racer at btinternet.com Tue Nov 20 13:59:09 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 20:59:09 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old editorial team. Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the regular contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good mix of articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis very much on advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a younger readership. I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! Mike Hughes --------------------------------- Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now. From REK46 at aol.com Tue Nov 20 14:05:35 2007 From: REK46 at aol.com (REK46 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:05:35 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: I agree with Mike ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Tue Nov 20 14:07:12 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 15:07:12 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> References: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B71CFE0@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I am a "stockist" as part of my local club. We and ship together at distribute at meetings. The cost is now $5.00 an issue under this plan. We were up to 13 member subscriptions until they went monthly. Between the added expense ($30 a year to $60 per) and the changes we are down to 7 members subscribers. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of JOSEPH HUGHES Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 2:59 PM To: Friends of Triumph Subject: [Fot] Triumph World I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old editorial team. Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the regular contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good mix of articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis very much on advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a younger readership. I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! Mike Hughes --------------------------------- Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Tue Nov 20 14:07:38 2007 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:07:38 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Reservations for THE GLEN In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > FoT Entries and Attendees.> > Please read the note below....if you are unable to make reservations the> remainder of the week, please try Andrea next week.> > Andrea seems to be spread a bit thin, but she is communicating with us.> > Regards, Joe Alexander> I didn't know it was necessary to talk to Andrea to make reservations, so I just made a reservation with whomever answered the telephone. It seemed to work out fine! John From lang at isis.mit.edu Tue Nov 20 14:42:41 2007 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert Lang) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:42:41 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> References: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 20 Nov 2007, JOSEPH HUGHES wrote: > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised > Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the > new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old > editorial team. I'm on the fence. On the other hand, I let my subscription lapse because I pretty much stopped reading the mag a while back and I find the new layout "hard to read"... too much like hanging around with ADD people. > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got rid > of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the > regular contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good > mix of articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new > magazine has the emphasis very much on advertising and would appear to > be out to try and attract a younger readership. I can't reply to the why, but I wanted to mention that I believe TOny Beadle was the original editor and if not, he's been in the editor chair since about '97 or '98. But I could be worng on that. One way or the other, I have to admit that I likes his style a bit more then "the new guy". Interestingly, I liked the new guy's column in the past, but I find his copy (the editor of that mag writes a lot of the copy, BTW) to be tiring. I can't put my finger on it. > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers > sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! Time will tell. On the other hand, I'm sure there's a few hundred Triumphs world-wide that haven't been covered yet. :-) I know MINE have never been featured. > Mike Hughes regards, rml p.s. I found it very amusing that as soon as my subscription lapsed, tehy did an article about one of our club's long-standing events - Day of Triumph. Go figure. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Room N42-140Q | This space for rent Consultant MIT IS&T unix-linux-help | Voice:617-253-7438 FAX: 617-258-9535 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Nov 20 14:40:44 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:40:44 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: In a message dated 11/20/2007 2:59:39 PM Central Standard Time, tr5racer at btinternet.com writes: > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised Triumph > World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the new magazine > or whether the ones you have read are from the old editorial team. > > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got rid of > Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the regular > contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good mix of > articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis > very much on advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a > younger readership. > > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers sold > each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! > Mike, you have me at a disadvantage, as I've only seen two issues I have to assume they are by the 'the new team' you describe, as they are the most recent issues. Therefore, I have no basis for comparison with past issues, but the two I saw sure impressed me. The November issue has a ton of regular articles, as well as some great feature articles, including the restoration and upgrades of a Herald, a GT6, and a Toledo (what ever that is). There is a fine article on a Stag factory fastback, and a technical article on the Stage engine. There is a historical article highlighting Design Engineer Lewis Dawtrey. I particularly enjoy the pictures and articles about the models we don't often see over here. I find it interesting that you describe previous issues as 'better,' because those two I saw were very good. I was in business for nearly forty-five years, and I know what makes the world goes around. I never had anything to do with the publishing business, but I am not put off by their need to feature advertisers. It is common knowledge advertising income is critical to magazines. So too attracting younger readers. Does not surprise me. It's a good idea. Older TRIUMPH aficionados like me are dying off like flies. Mike...different strokes for different folks. Participation optional. To each his own, but I stand by my take. Bill ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From GRMTim at aol.com Tue Nov 20 16:07:15 2007 From: GRMTim at aol.com (GRMTim at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 18:07:15 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: You know... I was going to stay out of this, but if you are looking for a magazine witha lot of Triumph content, I do know of one. Our March issue will be a special Triumph issue with a cover story on a Spitfire restoration. We are also working on TR8 story, from mild to wild and wild is the Group 44 car. On a side note, I dragged home an early, early, rust free TR6 yesterday that I found less than 10 miles from my house. Tim Suddard Publisher; Classic Motorsports and Grassroots Motorsports magazines www.classicmotorsports.net www.grassrootsmotorsports.com Phone: (386) 673-4148 Fax: (386) 673-6040 ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From 356drb at indy.net Tue Nov 20 16:58:35 2007 From: 356drb at indy.net (Brett Johnson) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 18:58:35 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> References: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6365AF03-D99B-458E-A618-FA88A8B8143B@indy.net> Hi! I have written the From USA column since day one (April 1995) and indeed Tony was the editor all that time. When the magazine was sold to Kelsey a year or so back, the frequency was increased and Tony told me that they would be alternating my column with the Down Under one and I should write one about half the length. Then, the length was to stay the same and then -- Tony was let go, much to everyone's surprise -- especially Tony. New editor Ted contacted all of the then current contributors and let them know what the new compensation package was. Guess what? Nearly everyone said no thanks! I contributed a couple of shorter columns and they ran two of them. I didn't see my name listed among the contributors last issue, but got a somewhat confusing email today, which implied I should keep sending in material. I also still hear from Tony on occasion. His brother lives up the road in Carmel (Indiana) and he stops by when he is visiting. Tony's background is interestingly in American custom cars. How he and I got the Triumph World jobs makes a pretty strange tale. In the past I have tried to highlight the FoT with some historical and some race reporting. I have enjoyed the interaction and hope that I will still function in this capacity. Thanks for your past input and I hope to be back asking questions as things become more clear. Ted assures me the magazine is not in financial trouble, but as Mike indicates only time will tell. Brett Johnson Indianapolis On Nov 20, 2007, at 3:59 PM, JOSEPH HUGHES wrote: > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised > Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of > the new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old > editorial team. > > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they > got rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and > several of the regular contributors. I much preferred the old > magazine which had a good mix of articles, history, competition and > a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis very much on > advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a younger > readership. > > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the > numbers sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! > > Mike Hughes > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit > now. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dos_gusanos at msn.com Tue Nov 20 16:30:45 2007 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:30:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Will this year's Calendar finally feature my Elva?...................Henry Morrison> From: GRMTim at aol.com> Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 18:07:15 -0500> To: fot at autox.team.net> Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumph World> > You know... I was going to stay out of this, but if you are looking for a > magazine witha lot of Triumph content, I do know of one.> > Our March issue will be a special Triumph issue with a cover story on a > Spitfire restoration. We are also working on TR8 story, from mild to wild and wild > is the Group 44 car.> > On a side note, I dragged home an early, early, rust free TR6 yesterday that > I found less than 10 miles from my house.> > Tim Suddard> Publisher; Classic Motorsports> and Grassroots Motorsports magazines> www.classicmotorsports.net> www.grassrootsmotorsports.com> Phone: (386) 673-4148 Fax: (386) 673-6040> > > > **************************************> Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest > products.> > (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)> _______________________________________________> http://www.team.net/donate.html> > Fot mailing list> Fot at autox.team.net> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From pvucinic at netspace.net.au Tue Nov 20 18:59:06 2007 From: pvucinic at netspace.net.au (Peter Vucinic) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 12:59:06 +1100 Subject: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers Message-ID: Dear Listers, Can anyone give me their experience with Roller Rockers for TR6? Good, Bad or Otherwise? Who's rockers they used? Ratio? And/or whether they experienced any problems with loss of oil pressure/excessive oil flow to rocker shaft? Thanks in advance. Kind Regards Peter Vucinic TR-4 _____________________________________________ Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 20 19:11:10 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 21:11:10 EST Subject: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers Message-ID: Peter! This is a great question. I have heard so many stories that I dont know what to believe. It will be an interesting thread and very informative. I am all ears. Just what are the benefits? What are the downsides? What are the pitfalls? Joe A > Dear Listers, > > > > Can anyone give me their experience with Roller Rockers for TR6? > > Good, Bad or Otherwise? > > Who's rockers they used? Ratio? And/or whether they experienced any problems > with loss of oil pressure/excessive oil flow to rocker shaft? > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > Kind Regards > > Peter Vucinic > > TR-4 > From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Nov 20 19:18:44 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 21:18:44 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: Brett... Do you still have a radio in your 356 race car? Bill Dentinger **************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From stutzmans at comcast.net Tue Nov 20 19:54:26 2007 From: stutzmans at comcast.net (Stutzman) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 21:54:26 -0500 Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY References: Message-ID: <003101c82be9$d4bc8c80$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> must be VanVlack - he never had enough sense to "stifle". "stifle", as in Archie Bunker's advice to meathead. Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY > In a message dated 11/20/2007 2:15:26 PM Central Standard Time, > N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > > >> I had a conversation with one of the members of the WPTA yesterday. >> >> There are mumurings that the WPTA would be willing to volunteer to be in >> charge of Friends of Triumph Hospitality in the Paddock. >> >> > > Are those guys out on the street again? Must be some sort of 'Work > Release' > program. That's fantastic. They're GREAT! > > Bill (Damdinger) > > > > ************************************** > Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest > products. > > (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From 356drb at indy.net Tue Nov 20 20:56:43 2007 From: 356drb at indy.net (Brett Johnson) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 22:56:43 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <324DF41E-2F01-419E-9B8D-227421E48FAF@indy.net> Yes, and the original 1951 wind-up clock (accurate w/i 5 min/day) so I can tell when the session is about to be checkered. Brett On Nov 20, 2007, at 9:18 PM, BillDentin at aol.com wrote: > Brett... > > Do you still have a radio in your 356 race car? > > Bill Dentinger > > > > > Check out AOL Money & Finance's list of the hottest products and > top money wasters of 2007. From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 20 22:21:40 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 22:21:40 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts Message-ID: <20071121052620.XZMZ6284.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Rant on This evening an electrician took my (unattended) Server center down. So I rush over to bring the servers back on line. I pull in the parking lot and there is a guy sitting in his car on his cel. Trunk open and battery cables lying on the ground. I ask, "Need a jump?" Nope he has a flat tire and can I help him. I then noticed that he has a crippled left arm so of course I jump in to get the tire changed for him. Hmmm.... Who put this monster wooden box which huge ass speakers in your truck that has to be removed to get to the stupid ass don-nut spare and jack out of your car I wonder to my self as I remove said box. Get jack under car and get it partially lifted. Remove cover on the wheels to get to the lug nuts. Lug wrench is way to BIG for the lug nuts. I reached in to feel the lug nuts (I forgot to mention he parked in just about the darkest part of the parking lot) and they felt "weird". They are "kinda" rounded with slots running down the length. The guy remembers that he has a special tool for the lug nuts and gets it's out of the glove box along with a barely useable flash light You have about 3/4" of an inch access to the lug nuts. The special tool is about 3" long and the standard lung wrench fits onto it (although pretty sloppy fit). That means that the leverage force you are applying to this 3/4" lug nut is about 5" out in space. Managed to massage four of the lug nuts loose. The fifth however... Someone had been a little eager with their impact wrench. Downstairs from the server room is a full service sign shop that a friend of mine owns. I have the keys to the building so I'll grab some tools. I take one of the lug nuts with me and discover that this a 16mm socket is just a hair to small and a 17mm socket is just as much too big. Same with trying standard sockets. Can't get enough purchase or angle to try and use a crescent wrench. Ended up putting his stuff back in the trunk and helping him call a tow truck to take the car and drop it off at a tire store. Moral of the story. Special lug nuts are not worth it. I would rather have some steal my wheels then to have my "anti-theft" solution leave me stranded on the side of the road and unable to replace a flat tire. Rant off From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 20 23:06:33 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 22:06:33 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts References: <20071121052620.XZMZ6284.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Message-ID: Yep. I have a full set of them sitting in a drawer, never installed. Can't quite bring myself to toss them, but I won't put them on a car after a similar experience. I also took the single locking lug nut off my F350 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle Sent: Tue 11/20/2007 9:21 PM To: wheeltowheel at wheeltowheel.com; fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts Rant on This evening an electrician took my (unattended) Server center down. So I rush over to bring the servers back on line. I pull in the parking lot and there is a guy sitting in his car on his cel. Trunk open and battery cables lying on the ground. I ask, "Need a jump?" Nope he has a flat tire and can I help him. I then noticed that he has a crippled left arm so of course I jump in to get the tire changed for him. Hmmm.... Who put this monster wooden box which huge ass speakers in your truck that has to be removed to get to the stupid ass don-nut spare and jack out of your car I wonder to my self as I remove said box. Get jack under car and get it partially lifted. Remove cover on the wheels to get to the lug nuts. Lug wrench is way to BIG for the lug nuts. I reached in to feel the lug nuts (I forgot to mention he parked in just about the darkest part of the parking lot) and they felt "weird". They are "kinda" rounded with slots running down the length. The guy remembers that he has a special tool for the lug nuts and gets it's out of the glove box along with a barely useable flash light You have about 3/4" of an inch access to the lug nuts. The special tool is about 3" long and the standard lung wrench fits onto it (although pretty sloppy fit). That means that the leverage force you are applying to this 3/4" lug nut is about 5" out in space. Managed to massage four of the lug nuts loose. The fifth however... Someone had been a little eager with their impact wrench. Downstairs from the server room is a full service sign shop that a friend of mine owns. I have the keys to the building so I'll grab some tools. I take one of the lug nuts with me and discover that this a 16mm socket is just a hair to small and a 17mm socket is just as much too big. Same with trying standard sockets. Can't get enough purchase or angle to try and use a crescent wrench. Ended up putting his stuff back in the trunk and helping him call a tow truck to take the car and drop it off at a tire store. Moral of the story. Special lug nuts are not worth it. I would rather have some steal my wheels then to have my "anti-theft" solution leave me stranded on the side of the road and unable to replace a flat tire. Rant off Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Wed Nov 21 00:33:17 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 02:33:17 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World. Message-ID: In a message dated 11/20/2007 3:08:19 PM Pacific Standard Time, fot-request at autox.team.net writes: > To: Friends of Triumph > Subject: [Fot] Triumph World > > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised > Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the > new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old > editorial team. > > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got > rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the > regular contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good > mix of articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new > magazine has the emphasis very much on advertising and would appear to > be out to try and attract a younger readership. > > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers > sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! > > Mike Hughes I agree 100% with Mike. I have every single issue since # 1, right up to # 72. I have not renewed, as it has turned from a decent read into little more than a comic. I am exceedingly disappointed in what Kelsey Publishing have done with it, not to mention the way they treated Tony Beadle - a thoroughly good man btw. With my continuing membership of the TSSC, since 1981, the FoT and other Triumph internet forums, and the most excellent VTR magazine, my needs are met. The cost also went up from $51/year to $99/year...that's the last straw. I would rather spend my money on my Triumph. Regards Leon F Guyot From don at carterdesignassociates.com Wed Nov 21 10:36:54 2007 From: don at carterdesignassociates.com (Don Carter) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 11:36:54 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <002301c82c65$1ea97440$59e8a8c0@donlaptop> I've run roller rockers since 1993 in my 6. At the VTR National Convention in Seattle that year, I met a guy named Richard Good who had started a side business in auto parts for 6's. He had a set of his new roller rockers with him at the event and our friendship started when I made this purchase. I couldn't wait to get back to Texas to try them out. The rocker arms are the 1:1.65 ratio and I couldn't be happier with their performance. It was like putting a mild higher lift cam in the car. As you guys know rolling across the top of the valve stem, opens the valve a little more. There is no wear that I have noticed, but I don't drive the car that often. Since '93 only 25K miles, (after my rebuild at 100K), has been on break-in road trips and a few times a year my wife and I autocross it. The boost in performance was immediate and noticeable. They are easy to adjust. There is no downside that I know of. On a milled head you have to watch the geometry of the set up, just as you do / should with any installation of valve train equipment. I had to make spacers under the rocker shaft chairs, but that was because I milled the head a tad. I also had to adjust the spacing along the shaft with washers to center them on the stems. I'm sure Richard has now made these adjustments in the sets he now sells. I have also run my stock push rods since installation. I told Richard recently that I have almost every thing he makes, and that he should start a new expanded catalog. Don W. Carter, AIA Carter Design Associates 6213 Skyline Dr., Suite 100 Houston, Texas 77057 (713) 529-2288 Telephone (713) 789-2330 Fax don at carterdesignassociates.com -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+don=carterdesignassociates.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+don=carterdesignassociates.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of N197TR4 at cs.com Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 8:11 PM To: pvucinic at netspace.net.au Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers Peter! This is a great question. I have heard so many stories that I dont know what to believe. It will be an interesting thread and very informative. I am all ears. Just what are the benefits? What are the downsides? What are the pitfalls? Joe A > Dear Listers, > > > > Can anyone give me their experience with Roller Rockers for TR6? > > Good, Bad or Otherwise? > > Who's rockers they used? Ratio? And/or whether they experienced any > problems with loss of oil pressure/excessive oil flow to rocker shaft? > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > Kind Regards > > Peter Vucinic > > TR-4 > Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tr5racer at btinternet.com Wed Nov 21 10:59:36 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 17:59:36 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: <6365AF03-D99B-458E-A618-FA88A8B8143B@indy.net> Message-ID: <862842.36824.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> I enjoyed your column Brett as it kept us abreast of what was happening on the other side of the pond. Incidentally the TR Register has now commissioned Tony Beadle to write a series of articles for their magazine, TR Action, and I believe there will in future be an exchange of articles between VTR and the TR Register which will only further cement the friendship between the 2 clubs. Mike Hughes Brett Johnson <356drb at indy.net> wrote: Hi! I have written the From USA column since day one (April 1995) and indeed Tony was the editor all that time. When the magazine was sold to Kelsey a year or so back, the frequency was increased and Tony told me that they would be alternating my column with the Down Under one and I should write one about half the length. Then, the length was to stay the same and then -- Tony was let go, much to everyone's surprise -- especially Tony. New editor Ted contacted all of the then current contributors and let them know what the new compensation package was. Guess what? Nearly everyone said no thanks! I contributed a couple of shorter columns and they ran two of them. I didn't see my name listed among the contributors last issue, but got a somewhat confusing email today, which implied I should keep sending in material. I also still hear from Tony on occasion. His brother lives up the road in Carmel (Indiana) and he stops by when he is visiting. Tony's background is interestingly in American custom cars. How he and I got the Triumph World jobs makes a pretty strange tale. In the past I have tried to highlight the FoT with some historical and some race reporting. I have enjoyed the interaction and hope that I will still function in this capacity. Thanks for your past input and I hope to be back asking questions as things become more clear. Ted assures me the magazine is not in financial trouble, but as Mike indicates only time will tell. Brett Johnson Indianapolis On Nov 20, 2007, at 3:59 PM, JOSEPH HUGHES wrote: > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised > Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of > the new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old > editorial team. > > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they > got rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and > several of the regular contributors. I much preferred the old > magazine which had a good mix of articles, history, competition and > a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis very much on > advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a younger > readership. > > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the > numbers sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! > > Mike Hughes > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit > now. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot --------------------------------- For ideas on reducing your carbon footprint visit Yahoo! For Good this month. From westerneagleracing at att.net Wed Nov 21 14:30:47 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 21:30:47 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: <112120072130.11537.4744A38700085FF000002D1122230647029B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Joe, Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a number of other events have had "polo" shirts. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from N197TR4 at cs.com: -------------- > FOT, > > Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. > > The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! > One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! > There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! > > I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In > Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to > disturb his > artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have to > do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. > > Thanks Greg, > > Joe A > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From REK46 at aol.com Wed Nov 21 14:47:38 2007 From: REK46 at aol.com (REK46 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 16:47:38 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: I agree with Ron...reg shirts can be worn more often,and in differing climates ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Wed Nov 21 15:03:25 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 16:03:25 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B761203@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I have been invloved with running the Texas All Brit day for 17 years now and I have a lot of T-shirts, more than I can wear. We have found the Henley style 3 button T to be very popular. It like a baseball shirt and most brands are a little heavier than the standard cheapo T. You can screen both T's and Henleys in the same runs and still get the volume discounts. We also have done some in black, very popular. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of REK46 at aol.com Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 3:48 PM To: westerneagleracing at att.net; N197TR4 at cs.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 I agree with Ron...reg shirts can be worn more often,and in differing climates ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop0003000000000 1) Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Wed Nov 21 14:58:58 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 16:58:58 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: Ron, Excelllent! I believe the planning is shifting to something more than just another T-shirt. Seems very appropriate. There is also some thinking about expanding the sales beyond just the FoT. But a lot of work needs to be done to lay that groundwork, and I cant speak for Mssrs. Janzen, Sukey, Petrolati, Schumacher, et. al. Thanks and Regards, Joe A > Joe, > Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down > regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a > number of other events have had "polo" shirts. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from N197 From N197TR4 at cs.com Wed Nov 21 15:26:30 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 17:26:30 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: Nice sounding alternative for the SHIRT PEOPLE to look at. Thanks Smilin' Bob! Joe > I have been invloved with running the Texas All Brit day for 17 years > now and I have a lot of T-shirts, more than I can wear. We have found > the Henley style 3 button T to be very popular. It like a baseball shirt > and most brands are a little heavier than the standard cheapo T. You can > screen both T's and Henleys in the same runs and still get the volume > discounts. We also have done some in black, very popular. > > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Co. > 16415 North IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > Fx 512-272-9365 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of REK46 at aol.com > Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 3:48 PM > To: westerneagleracing at att.net; N197TR4 at cs.com > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > > I agree with Ron...reg shirts can be worn more often,and in differing > climates > From jsnook at wcnet.org Wed Nov 21 16:28:19 2007 From: jsnook at wcnet.org (Jeff Snook) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 18:28:19 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 References: <112120072130.11537.4744A38700085FF000002D1122230647029B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Message-ID: <003901c82c96$37824560$0902a8c0@JeffsNotebook> I'll buy whatever is decided, but I've got sooooo many t-shirts and polos I would prefer a button down. Jeff Snook www.snooksdreamcars.com ----- Original Message ----- From: westerneagleracing at att.net To: N197TR4 at cs.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 4:30 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Joe, Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a number of other events have had "polo" shirts. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from N197TR4 at cs.com: -------------- > FOT, > > Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. > > The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! > One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! > There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! > > I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In > Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to > disturb his > artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have to > do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. > > Thanks Greg, > > Joe A > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spreiss at verizon.net Wed Nov 21 05:28:26 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 23:28:26 +1100 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 References: <112120072130.11537.4744A38700085FF000002D1122230647029B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> <003901c82c96$37824560$0902a8c0@JeffsNotebook> Message-ID: <006601c82c3a$0449a640$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> How about sweats and/or hoodies? Can be worn by men and women alike. Very useful of an evening and come fall/winter. Many different color combinations are possible. Just a thought. Steve P. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Snook" To: ; Cc: Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2007 10:28 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > I'll buy whatever is decided, but I've got sooooo many t-shirts and polos I > would prefer a button down. > Jeff Snook > www.snooksdreamcars.com > ----- Original Message ----- > From: westerneagleracing at att.net > To: N197TR4 at cs.com > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 4:30 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > > > Joe, > Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down > regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a > number of other events have had "polo" shirts. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from N197TR4 at cs.com: -------------- > > > > FOT, > > > > Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. > > > > The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! > > One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! > > There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! > > > > I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In > > Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to > > disturb his > > artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have > to > > do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. > > > > Thanks Greg, > > > > Joe A > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 21 22:01:02 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 21:01:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 References: <112120072130.11537.4744A38700085FF000002D1122230647029B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net><003901c82c96$37824560$0902a8c0@JeffsNotebook> <006601c82c3a$0449a640$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: Classy, we could wear the hoodies when we do drive-by fruitings in the Porsche paddock. Shirts can get very spendy, but if they are cool enough you can get the money back. For the Columbia River Classic we had Columbia Sportswear Performance Fishing Gear shirts done with a great logo. We could have sold as many as we had the nerve to buy. In theory we had enough donated for all the drivers and workers/officials, but in reality we ran a few short. People are STILL pissed at me that they didn't get one. This is the shirt we used: http://www.columbia.com/Product.aspx?top=1&p=5071&cat=15020&viewAll=True . It's long sleeve but you can roll the sleeve up and button it. Cool in summer, warm in the fall. Remarkable piece of clothing. We also had T-shirts, women's T's and ball caps made by a company called Wicked Quick. They did it on spec! I'm not sure they still do that, but we sold a lot of shirts. They were so cool the local high-end men's shop in Portland and Seattle--Mario's--was selling them. The women's T's were killer. Somewhere I have some photos from a photoshoot we did at Pittock Mansion with a raft of models. That was fun, if you go for that kind of thing. They do a lot of tatoo style art and the T-shirts are a special kind of light fabric that's extremely comfortable and kind of clingy. Great for girls, but I'm not sure I want to see one on Dentinger. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Steven Preiss Sent: Wed 11/21/2007 4:28 AM To: Jeff Snook; westerneagleracing at att.net; N197TR4 at cs.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 How about sweats and/or hoodies? Can be worn by men and women alike. Very useful of an evening and come fall/winter. Many different color combinations are possible. Just a thought. Steve P. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Snook" To: ; Cc: Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2007 10:28 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > I'll buy whatever is decided, but I've got sooooo many t-shirts and polos I > would prefer a button down. > Jeff Snook > www.snooksdreamcars.com > ----- Original Message ----- > From: westerneagleracing at att.net > To: N197TR4 at cs.com > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 4:30 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > > > Joe, > Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down > regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a > number of other events have had "polo" shirts. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from N197TR4 at cs.com: -------------- > > > > FOT, > > > > Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. > > > > The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! > > One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! > > There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! > > > > I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In > > Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to > > disturb his > > artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have > to > > do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. > > > > Thanks Greg, > > > > Joe A > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From greenman62 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 22 06:56:32 2007 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (greenman62 at hotmail.com) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 13:56:32 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Tshirt design Message-ID: The discussion about the T shirt/hoodies/golf shirt/ 3 button Oxford or any other peripheral stuff, like baseball caps is great! It really doesn't matter to me what we decide on... The FOT gets my "family discount" (25% off) for art work. I love doing cartoons, but I'll be glad to do a logo or both for that matter. How about a logo for embroidered stuff, like fleeces, hoodies and caps and a single color t shirt with a cartoon? I don't need to know right away, but as many of you know next year I'm planning to relocate to the left side of the country so anything I can get started ASAP would be a good thing. Happy Thanksgiving to you all! Greg Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... From jerryvv at adelphia.net Thu Nov 22 07:11:00 2007 From: jerryvv at adelphia.net (Jerry Van Vlack) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:11:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY References: Message-ID: <006a01c82d11$83033aa0$6401a8c0@gmvv> My good friend Bruce Stutzman quoted Archie Bunker and suggested that I should just "Stifle It" when he saw that Joe and I had discussed the WPTA again doing the Hospitality Tent at this years FOT Glen gathering. He equated me to Meatball!. I called Bruce and asked him how he could have referred to me as "Meatball" after all of these years and he had little excuse but to apologize profusely. Apologies are not what they used to be ever since a previous President used them so liberally for every small or big transgression that he was caught doing. So I've decided that Bruce's apology while well meaning lacked real sincerity. Now those of you who know Bruce also know that he likes to occasionally toss a few down. Well his real excuse was that he had a few extra beers that night in celebration of the birth of his 1st Grandson; Cooper Stutzman. He was feeling pretty good by the time he wrote that little epistle. Congratulations Bruce, now we can not only call you "Madman" but also "Grandpa" Will Cooper be riding shotgun anytime soon? JVV ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY > In a message dated 11/20/2007 2:15:26 PM Central Standard Time, > N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > > >> I had a conversation with one of the members of the WPTA yesterday. >> >> There are mumurings that the WPTA would be willing to volunteer to be in >> charge of Friends of Triumph Hospitality in the Paddock. >> >> > > Are those guys out on the street again? Must be some sort of 'Work > Release' > program. That's fantastic. They're GREAT! > > Bill (Damdinger) > > > > ************************************** > Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest > products. > > (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.2/1142 - Release Date: > 11/20/2007 5:44 PM From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Nov 22 07:14:00 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:14:00 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen SHIRT design Message-ID: List, It 'appears' that the thought is migrating to something tasteful and functional. I 'suggest' sticking to one configuration of apparel and a simple design. (I like the Bill Babcock Columbia shirt, but do not know what Ted & Doris can provide) My vision would be the KASTNER CUP wrapped around the FoT Logo on one front side of the shirt. And something WATKINS GLEN on the other front side. It would be nice also to have them largely presold, paid for, and delivered before the event, so that they can be worn with pride at the Glen. We would be cool, and likely better looking than the MG Guys. That being said, the SHIRT GUYS have the last word. Joe A > > The discussion about the T shirt/hoodies/golf shirt/ 3 button Oxford or any > other peripheral stuff, like baseball caps is great! It really doesn't matter > to me what we decide on... > The FOT gets my "family discount" (25% off) for art work. > > I love doing cartoons, but I'll be glad to do a logo or both for that matter. > How about a logo for embroidered stuff, like fleeces, hoodies and caps and a > single color t shirt with a cartoon? > > I don't need to know right away, but as many of you know next year I'm > planning to relocate to the left side of the country so anything I can get > started ASAP would be a good thing. > > Happy Thanksgiving to you all! > > Greg > > Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois > > That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Nov 22 07:19:34 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:19:34 EST Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY Message-ID: May I nominate Bruce Stutzman as Chairman of the Hospitality Tent? Now that he is a Grandfather he will be further exalted as a 'FOG'....that's another organization. One for the elderly. It does not escape me that his grandson is "COOPER S" > My good friend Bruce Stutzman quoted Archie Bunker and suggested that I > should just "Stifle It" when he saw that Joe and I had discussed the WPTA > again doing the Hospitality Tent at this years FOT Glen gathering. > > He equated me to Meatball!. > > I called Bruce and asked him how he could have referred to me as "Meatball" > after all of these years and he had little excuse but to apologize > profusely. Apologies are not what they used to be ever since a previous > President used them so liberally for every small or big transgression that > he was caught doing. So I've decided that Bruce's apology while well meaning > lacked real sincerity. > > Now those of you who know Bruce also know that he likes to occasionally toss > a few down. Well his real excuse was that he had a few extra beers that > night in celebration of the birth of his 1st Grandson; Cooper Stutzman. He > was feeling pretty good by the time he wrote that little epistle. > > Congratulations Bruce, now we can not only call you "Madman" but also > "Grandpa" > > Will Cooper be riding shotgun anytime soon? > > JVV > From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 22 07:40:29 2007 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:40:29 -0500 Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY In-Reply-To: <006a01c82d11$83033aa0$6401a8c0@gmvv> References: <006a01c82d11$83033aa0$6401a8c0@gmvv> Message-ID: > He equated me to Meatball!. You mean "Meathead", you Meathead! John From klynch_6 at msn.com Thu Nov 22 07:53:16 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 07:53:16 -0700 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: Auto Week this morning has a photo/header of Bob Tulius in his TR4 heading to DP win in 63'. Don't know if this will come thru for you or not. Happy Thanksgiving to all. Kev Lynch http://www.autoweek.com/section/50th01 <006a01c82d11$83033aa0$6401a8c0@gmvv> Message-ID: <00b301c82d18$ff7f58a0$6401a8c0@gmvv> Well that confirms it then doesn't it. ----- Original Message ----- From: John Herrera To: Jerry Van Vlack ; billdentin at aol.com ; n197tr4 at cs.com ; fot at autox.team.net Cc: Bruce Stutzman Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2007 9:40 AM Subject: RE: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY > He equated me to Meatball!. You mean "Meathead", you Meathead! John ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.4/1145 - Release Date: 11/22/2007 11:49 AM From tr6racer21 at earthlink.net Thu Nov 22 11:34:00 2007 From: tr6racer21 at earthlink.net (U K MOTORSPORTS) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 13:34:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Pace Car Trailer Message-ID: <380-220071142218340527@earthlink.net> Wanted to offer this to any interested FOTer as this trailer has served me well, thanks Chip Pace 20' enclosed Tag Trailer, 4" Drop tandem 3500# axles w/ electric brakes, white spoke wheels w/ new tires, 3/4 painted plywood floor, 3/8 fir sidewall, rear barn style doors, 36" side door, roof vent, full electrical w/ lights, complete work bench and custom cabinets, winch, custom aluminum ramps, new exterior lighting, tie downs, outfitted for canopy(included), weight distributing hitch, sway control, recent axle/ brake service, glad to email pics, $4000 OBO, 804-564-1839 U K MOTORSPORTS tr6racer21 at earthlink.net From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Fri Nov 23 08:53:49 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007 09:53:49 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Here is some video from the new Eagles Canyon Race track in North Texas Message-ID: <002801c82de9$0ca6ff80$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> Here is some video from the new Eagles Canyon Race track in North Texas from a Porsche club drivers school last weekend. There is still a lot of work to do to pretty it up but it looks like a lot of fun. CVAR will hold the first sanctioned event there next weekend. http://tinyurl.com/2ekzey Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Fri Nov 23 09:24:02 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007 08:24:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] YouTube - Top Gear S10 E06 Motor home racing Message-ID: <008701c82ded$4326bb50$0502a8c0@desktop> I wonder if they'll start a vintage group? Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNFDZsCmPZY From pcdelux at worldnet.att.net Fri Nov 23 14:50:12 2007 From: pcdelux at worldnet.att.net (Bill DeWar) Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007 16:50:12 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts References: <20071121052620.XZMZ6284.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Message-ID: <003401c82e1a$d4e4c910$43544c0c@user90890nvpgh> Amici, "Special" lug nuts locking or otherwise are also the enemy of mechanics. Nothing better than to have a pile of cars in the lot and first one in has these. After playing the find wheel lock key game for a while you finally get all wheels loose except one. Your $16.95 tire rotation special is not looking like such a great idea about now. The best thing is thay are usually on wheels so ugly you'd pay someone to steal them. My personal rant over.. Bill D Triumph Rescue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "David W. Riddle" ; ; ; Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 1:06 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts > Yep. I have a full set of them sitting in a drawer, never installed. Can't > quite bring myself to toss them, but I won't put them on a car after a similar > experience. I also took the single locking lug nut off my F350 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle > Sent: Tue 11/20/2007 9:21 PM > To: wheeltowheel at wheeltowheel.com; fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org > Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts > > Rant on > > This evening an electrician took my (unattended) Server center > down. So I rush over to bring the servers back on line. > > I pull in the parking lot and there is a guy sitting in his car on > his cel. Trunk open and battery cables lying on the ground. > > I ask, "Need a jump?" Nope he has a flat tire and can I help him. > > I then noticed that he has a crippled left arm so of course I jump in > to get the tire changed for him. > > Hmmm.... Who put this monster wooden box which huge ass speakers in > your truck that has to be removed to get to the stupid ass don-nut > spare and jack out of your car I wonder to my self as I remove said box. > > Get jack under car and get it partially lifted. Remove cover on the > wheels to get to the lug nuts. > > Lug wrench is way to BIG for the lug nuts. I reached in to feel the > lug nuts (I forgot to mention he parked in just about the darkest > part of the parking lot) and they felt "weird". They are "kinda" > rounded with slots running down the length. The guy remembers that > he has a special tool for the lug nuts and gets it's out of the glove > box along with a barely useable flash light > > You have about 3/4" of an inch access to the lug nuts. The special > tool is about 3" long and the standard lung wrench fits onto it > (although pretty sloppy fit). That means that the leverage force you > are applying to this 3/4" lug nut is about 5" out in space. > > Managed to massage four of the lug nuts loose. The fifth however... > Someone had been a little eager with their impact wrench. > > Downstairs from the server room is a full service sign shop that a > friend of mine owns. I have the keys to the building so I'll grab > some tools. I take one of the lug nuts with me and discover that > this a 16mm socket is just a hair to small and a 17mm socket is just > as much too big. Same with trying standard sockets. Can't get > enough purchase or angle to try and use a crescent wrench. > > Ended up putting his stuff back in the trunk and helping him call a > tow truck to take the car and drop it off at a tire store. > > Moral of the story. Special lug nuts are not worth it. I would > rather have some steal my wheels then to have my "anti-theft" > solution leave me stranded on the side of the road and unable to > replace a flat tire. > > Rant off > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Fri Nov 23 18:42:51 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007 01:42:51 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] =?utf-8?q?Come_join_me_on_Friends_of_Triumph_on_The_Vintage?= =?utf-8?q?_Racing_League=E2=80=A6?= Message-ID: <8174901.1195868571272.JavaMail.xncore@smtp> We have created a Friends of Triumph group on The Vintage Racing League network. A few of us are already members. This might be a place where we can share pictures and videos amongst ourselves., rather than put them out there for everyone to see. It may also be a way to connect the various segments of your hobby together. In my case the Vintage Racing League is a way to connect FoT and CVAR to family and friends. The FoT group inside the VRL will separate them out from discussions that do not interest them. Time wil tell if this is a valid concept but I'm game. Click here to join: http://www.myvrl.com/group/friendsoftriumph?xgk=38d70d2a38 Thanks, Bob Kramer -- To control which emails you receive on The Vintage Racing League, go to: http://www.myvrl.com/profiles/profile/emailSettings From trmarty at hotmail.com Sat Nov 24 19:50:54 2007 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007 21:50:54 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Imports at Carlisle Autox 2008 Message-ID: I have never been to Imports at Carlisle. Any of you folks participated in the autox they have at the event? Whats it like? I am kicking around the idea but it's a pretty good haul. Any of my fellow Triumphites going to be there running showing all them other foreign cars how it done? Marty Sukey _________________________________________________________________ Put your friends on the big screen with Windows Vista. + Windows Live. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/shop/specialoffers.mspx?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_CPC_M ediaCtr_bigscreen_102007 From hottr6 at hotmail.com Sun Nov 25 12:30:04 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 14:30:04 -0500 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: Marty Sukey asked: > I have never been to Imports at Carlisle. Any of you folks participated in the > autox they have at the event? Whats it like? I am kicking around the idea but > it's a pretty good haul. Any of my fellow Triumphites going to be there > running showing all them other foreign cars how it done? The autoX is pretty lame. It is quite short and in my limited experience did not have any top drivers or cars. It seemed more of an event for show attendees and beginners. Carlisle vendors have really gone down hill. I started attending in 2000 and the number of Triumph-goods sellers was terrific with lots of bargains to be found. This, I have been told, was awful compared to the heady days of the 1990s. Last year and this year, the number of vendors has shrunk by a factor of 4 over past few years. Stick to eBay. On the other hand, the number of club cars shown on the grass seems to have increased, and not just Triumphs. Hell of a long way to drive for an old car show, though. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Share life as it happens with the new Windows Live.Download today it's FREE! http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_sharelife_112007 From igofaster at charter.net Sun Nov 25 16:55:45 2007 From: igofaster at charter.net (igofaster at charter.net) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 15:55:45 -0800 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site Message-ID: <20071125185545.0FCWN.424088.root@fepweb01> Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... best regards! Bobby Whitehead 1970 GT6+ #54 CVAR From fpspitfire at insightbb.com Sun Nov 25 18:37:30 2007 From: fpspitfire at insightbb.com (fpspitfire at insightbb.com) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 19:37:30 -0600 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <20071125185545.0FCWN.424088.root@fepweb01> References: <20071125185545.0FCWN.424088.root@fepweb01> Message-ID: edited for the reason that my brain thought before my fingers typed. But if you have a thick wallet, it all looks cool. aaron ----- Original Message ----- From: igofaster at charter.net Date: Sunday, November 25, 2007 17:56 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site To: fot at autox.team.net > Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for > high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to > dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and > GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com > > Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... > > > best regards! > > Bobby Whitehead > 1970 GT6+ > #54 CVAR > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sun Nov 25 18:38:57 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (spitlist at cox.net) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 20:38:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <20071125185545.0FCWN.424088.root@fepweb01> Message-ID: <20071125203857.SV58F.124283.root@eastrmwml14.mgt.cox.net> My own observation is that while some of their stuff appears to be pretty good, a lot seems to be offered for the benefit of the "Gee Whiz" crowd, that wants something that is impressive looking but of little actual value. Case in point: Check out the Spitfire header that they offer. Joe C. ---- igofaster at charter.net wrote: > Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com > > Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... > > > best regards! > > Bobby Whitehead > 1970 GT6+ > #54 CVAR > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jaxonracing at yahoo.com Sun Nov 25 19:28:00 2007 From: jaxonracing at yahoo.com (Jay Creel) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 18:28:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site Message-ID: <596933.33229.qm@web53504.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I definitely see your point. My interest is in that coil over rear end set up. I have lost 5 tires in as many sessions as the camber in my car is 4.5-5 degrees and from what I understand, Good Year has changed their construction so now the tires will not take that level of camber. I currently run a dearched spring and the rear has been lowered (pumpkin moved up) approx and inch. I have been fortunate enough not to hit anything when I have lost all these tires but the time will come and I am not interested in finding out... lol. I am interested in hearing what Kas and others thinks about this issue. This PRI set up looks pretty good and simple because it is bolt on. I have been leaning towards the adjustable rear uprights, but I am concerned about changing the ride height of the car plus it would change the angle of the spring. Perhaps not that much to matter. ----- Original Message ---- From: "spitlist at cox.net" To: igofaster at charter.net; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2007 8:38:57 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] High End Triumph Site My own observation is that while some of their stuff appears to be pretty good, a lot seems to be offered for the benefit of the "Gee Whiz" crowd, that wants something that is impressive looking but of little actual value. Case in point: Check out the Spitfire header that they offer. Joe C. ---- igofaster at charter.net wrote: > Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com > > Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... > > > best regards! > > Bobby Whitehead > 1970 GT6+ > #54 CVAR > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ____________________________________________________________________________________ Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From spitlist at cox.net Sun Nov 25 20:31:30 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (spitlist at cox.net) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 22:31:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <596933.33229.qm@web53504.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20071125223130.HRV52.125265.root@eastrmwml14.mgt.cox.net> There was a discussion on that very thing on another forum recently. The general consensus was that it reallty does not change what is wrong with the Spitfire rear suspension. It remains a swing axle suspension and therefore still has the issues with the camber varying as the suspension goes through its normal travel. I think that if you really want to make improvements, the best thing to do (if it is allowed by your sanctioning body) is to go with a true independent setup with both upper and lower control arms and a variable length drive axle. Cheers, Joe C. ---- Jay Creel wrote: > I definitely see your point. My interest is in that coil over rear end set up. I have lost 5 tires in as many sessions as the camber in my car is 4.5-5 degrees and from what I understand, Good Year has changed their construction so now the tires will not take that level of camber. I currently run a dearched spring and the rear has been lowered (pumpkin moved up) approx and inch. I have been fortunate enough not to hit anything when I have lost all these tires but the time will come and I am not interested in finding out... lol. > > I am interested in hearing what Kas and others thinks about this issue. This PRI set up looks pretty good and simple because it is bolt on. I have been leaning towards the adjustable rear uprights, but I am concerned about changing the ride height of the car plus it would change the angle of the spring. Perhaps not that much to matter. > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: "spitlist at cox.net" > To: igofaster at charter.net; fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2007 8:38:57 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] High End Triumph Site > > My own observation is that while some of their stuff appears to be pretty good, a lot seems to be offered for the benefit of the "Gee Whiz" crowd, that wants something that is impressive looking but of little actual value. Case in point: Check out the Spitfire header that they offer. > > Joe C. > > ---- igofaster at charter.net wrote: > > Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com > > > > Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... > > > > > > best regards! > > > > Bobby Whitehead > > 1970 GT6+ > > #54 CVAR > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Mon Nov 26 06:41:02 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 07:41:02 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Peter Vucinic Message-ID: <200711261341.lAQDf9mk335974@ns3.geneseo.net> Trying to reach Peter -- please respond Sorry for bombing the list uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From tstrange at sbcglobal.net Mon Nov 26 12:24:54 2007 From: tstrange at sbcglobal.net (tom strange) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 11:24:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] email addresses needed .. Message-ID: <327813.74343.qm@web81112.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Sorry to bomb the list, but I am in need of email addresses for the following ... In case these people dont see this, if anyone else has them I'd appreciate them ... this is for the glen 2008 planning.. Babcock, Bud Bulkowski, Peter Ceilley, Ed Smock, Paul Stadel, Bob Warner, Bill Williams, Randy Wismer, Bob Thanks in advance, Tom http://www.fot-racing.com/spit/caption/tom_strange.htm #4 white spitfire From yellow-green at sbcglobal.net Mon Nov 26 13:01:11 2007 From: yellow-green at sbcglobal.net (yellow-green at sbcglobal.net) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 14:01:11 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Southwick axle conversion Message-ID: Amici - If anyone is thinking about doing a Southwick rear axle conversion for their TR3 or TR4- I have a number of bare axle housings of which I would donate and deliver to Southwick for you. This would only save you one way shipping - after that it's between you and Southwick. No financial interest - just cleaning out the shed. Dennis DeLap Barrington Illinois From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 26 13:21:14 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 15:21:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site Message-ID: Amici, Chris at prirace.com is at the bottom of my list of vendors to recommend. I paid a hefty good-faith deposit on one of his advertised items and after receiving nothing for 2 years, spent the next 2 years trying to get my deposit back. That's when I learned that credit card companies offer no protection after 6 months. I have received nothing from Chris except lame excuses and promise. I've given up trying to get my deposit, but I will make sure that others know of my bad experience. Avoid like the plague, and if you see him, give him a bunch of fives for me. Shane Ingate in NM > Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... > The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm > conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com _________________________________________________________________ You keep typing, we keep giving. Download Messenger and join the im Initiative now. http://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=TAGLM From don at carterdesignassociates.com Mon Nov 26 16:07:23 2007 From: don at carterdesignassociates.com (Don Carter) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 17:07:23 -0600 Subject: [Fot] FW: TR6 Roller Rockers Message-ID: <009901c83081$1d829270$59e8a8c0@donlaptop> -----Original Message----- From: Don Carter [mailto:don at carterdesignassociates.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 11:37 AM To: 'N197TR4 at cs.com'; 'pvucinic at netspace.net.au' Cc: 'fot at autox.team.net' Subject: RE: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers I've run roller rockers since 1993 in my 6. At the VTR National Convention in Seattle that year, I met Richard Good who had started a side business in auto parts for 6's. He had a set of his new roller rockers with him at the event and our friendship started when I made this purchase. I couldn't wait to get back to Texas to try them out. Mine are rocker the 1:1.65 ratio and I couldn't be happier with their performance. It was like putting a mild higher lift cam in the car. It was my first modification to the car as I was a purist to the point of being seriously accused of being a OCD case. As you guys know rolling across the top of the valve stem, and the length ratio of each side of the rocker arm, opens the valves more. There is no noticeable wear that I have noticed, but I don't drive the car that often. Since '93 only 25K miles, (after my rebuild at 100K), has been on break-in road trips and a few times a year my wife and I autocross it. The boost in performance after installation was immediately noticeable. They are easy to adjust. Basically, there is no downside that I know of. On a milled head you have to watch the geometry of the set up, just as you do with any installation of valve train equipment. The arms should be level as possible before they act on the valve, as I've found, so that the push rod socket does not mar the aluminum arm and that it clears the valve cover, of course. I later made brass spacers under the rocker shaft chairs, but that was because I milled the head a tad. I also had to adjust the spacing along the shaft with washers to center them on the stems. I'm sure Richard has now made these adjustments in the sets he now sells. I have also run my stock push rods since installation, which is why I needed the spacers. I've learned these final minor adjustments over the last few years of running them. I told the now well known "Good Parts" owner that I have almost every thing in his catalog, and that he should expand his parts list. It would also be "good" if he would publish something on how to autocross a limited slip diff. I'd like someone to comment on that before I take out more cones as I'm over-powering the courses we run. Don W. Carter, AIA Carter Design Associates 6213 Skyline Dr., Suite 100 Houston, Texas 77057 (713) 529-2288 Telephone (713) 789-2330 Fax don at carterdesignassociates.com -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+don=carterdesignassociates.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+don=carterdesignassociates.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of N197TR4 at cs.com Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 8:11 PM To: pvucinic at netspace.net.au Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers Peter! This is a great question. I have heard so many stories that I dont know what to believe. It will be an interesting thread and very informative. I am all ears. Just what are the benefits? What are the downsides? What are the pitfalls? Joe A > Dear Listers, > > > > Can anyone give me their experience with Roller Rockers for TR6? > > Good, Bad or Otherwise? > > Who's rockers they used? Ratio? And/or whether they experienced any > problems with loss of oil pressure/excessive oil flow to rocker shaft? > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > Kind Regards > > Peter Vucinic > > TR-4 > Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wgrosenbach at juno.com Mon Nov 26 16:15:13 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 16:15:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, at Laguna Seca is? Thanks, Bill From dave at microworks.net Mon Nov 26 17:59:39 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 17:59:39 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> References: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: <20071127010350.NEEO11609.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> http://www.cartracingupdate.com/Tracks/lagunaseca.htm 50 ft? "...The signature corkscrew at Mazda Raceway Laguna Seca (turns 8 and 8A) drops nearly 50 feet. The elevation change from the entrance of the corkscrew to Turn 11 is equivalent to a three-story building..." Nice track primer here: http://www.norcal-saac.org/ot/laguna.pdf At 04:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, >at Laguna Seca is? >Thanks, >Bill >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tony at tonydrews.com Mon Nov 26 18:06:41 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 19:06:41 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> References: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: <20071127010734.1E736187A33@autox.team.net> According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. I've GOT to drive that track at least once. - Tony http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&qs=1021+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy%2c+Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, >at Laguna Seca is? >Thanks, >Bill >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Mon Nov 26 18:04:07 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 18:04:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Race report Message-ID: <20071127010820.NHAJ11609.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> I sent a race report, from my son's race yesterday, to the list but never saw it come through. Thought this stat might be interesting some of you. Talk about close competition around Firebird's 1.6 mile track. He qualified 3rd. -------------- ...The really amazing thing however was seeing the times posted by the top four karts. Pole: 1:06.507 2nd: 1:06.692 3rd: 1:06.865 4th: 1:06.870 Beat out fourth place by 5 one thousands of a second! That's close. Feel good moment. The top 6 places were all filled with karts running purpose built ICC motors other then us running our Honda moto 125. Definitely hitting above his weight today. The really warm fuzzy was the fact that the fourth placed kart and driver took 2nd in class at the SKUSA SuperNationals this past week in Las Vegas (over 400 kats!)... -------------- From lunkercars at earthlink.net Mon Nov 26 18:42:44 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 18:42:44 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Race report In-Reply-To: <20071127010820.NHAJ11609.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> References: <20071127010820.NHAJ11609.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> Message-ID: <975098F8-BE32-4114-A94E-3BF238794B60@earthlink.net> Congrats to Tyler and to you too David. Nobody around checking fuel temps eh? What sort of times might a TR turn at Firebird - Thinking about trying to make your Feb 1st race. Greg Hilyer TR4 # 314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 26, 2007, at 6:04 PM, David W. Riddle wrote: > I sent a race report, from my son's race yesterday, to the list but > never saw it come through. > > Thought this stat might be interesting some of you. Talk about close > competition around Firebird's 1.6 mile track. He qualified 3rd. > > -------------- > ...The really amazing thing however was seeing the times posted by > the top four karts. > > Pole: 1:06.507 > 2nd: 1:06.692 > 3rd: 1:06.865 > 4th: 1:06.870 > > Beat out fourth place by 5 one thousands of a second! That's close. > > Feel good moment. The top 6 places were all filled with karts > running purpose built ICC motors other then us running our Honda moto > 125. Definitely hitting above his weight today. > > The really warm fuzzy was the fact that the fourth placed kart and > driver took 2nd in class at the SKUSA SuperNationals this past week > in Las Vegas (over 400 kats!)... > -------------- > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gkbyrne at optushome.com.au Mon Nov 26 21:46:27 2007 From: gkbyrne at optushome.com.au (Geoffrey Byrne) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:46:27 +1100 Subject: [Fot] TR6 Mechanical Fuel Cam Message-ID: <002601c830b0$79db9470$d40eefdc@co3017577a> FOT Anyone have an update on the manufacture of the mechanical fuel cam for the TR6 PI system . I remember emails about someone looking into manufacturing a number of complete units using the KK adjustment method Geoff Byrne TR6 racer down under From dave at microworks.net Sun Nov 25 21:38:59 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 21:38:59 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Firebird Main Race Report - November 25 Message-ID: <20071126044434.HZII22853.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> The son, Tyler, had an endurance race on his 125 shifter kart this afternoon. The kart had run well at the last event so we have not made any changes to it. Then this morning just prior to the practice session Tyler decided he wanted to try and adjust the throttle cable to help the kart idle better (well, actually to idle at all). Adjusted the cable and off he went to the grid but the kart was activing odd so he asked me to take the tension back out of the cable. Thought I did. He heads out for the track at increasing amounts of throttle. When he approached he first corner where he would need to lift the throttle did not want to cooperate and he had to kill the engine there in the first turn. Missed ALL but about 100 yards of practice. Not real helpful for dusting the cobwebs off. Got the kart back to the paddock after the session and made sure to get rid of the tension in the cable. Gave the rest of the kart a once over and pronounced it ready . Head out for Qualifying with some sticker tires mounted. Not sure how many karts but it was a lot. Not as many as last months 48 karts but certainly more than 30. Qualifying went well except for a short black flag incident where another kart also had a stuck throttle and did not end as well as Tyler's incident. First reports we heard on grid was a "broken ankle". Turned out to be a broken axle. Big difference! The kart did flip and the driver did play superman but other then some bruises he was ok. I was blown away with Tyler's qualifying effort. No practice laps, just 7 full laps run in qualifying and he ended up third! The really amazing thing however was seeing the times posted by the top four karts. Pole: 1:06.507 2nd: 1:06.692 3rd: 1:06.865 4th: 1:06.870 Beat out fourth place by 5 one thousands of a second! That's close. Feel good moment. The top 6 places were all filled with karts running purpose built ICC motors other then us running our Honda moto 125. Definitely hitting above his weight today. The really warm fuzzy was the fact that the fourth placed kart and driver took 2nd in class at the SKUSA SuperNationals this past week in Las Vegas (over 400 kats!). The race. Not so much. The only thing we changed was the plug. Put in one that is a step hotter. Were that close in qualifying I think that maybe that might help. Don't want to change too much. Supposed to be a 45 minute endurance race which will require pit stops for a splash and dash of fuel to make the distance. Got a bad start (yet again - need to have him work on that) and he dropped back to about 11th. Started working his way back up and was making up places. We could see him driving the wheels off the thing as he came around the Tower Turn. Hugging the inside line to decrease the distance around the turn and fighting to catch the kart with handfuls of opposite lock as it skipped and bounced across the bumpy exit. On lap 17 (about 18 minutes) into the race we don't see him come back around. We figure we missed him so we kept watching. Nope. The group he had been running with came back around and he wasn't there. Figure something is wrong and he his back at the paddock. Lug the fuel jug and the water bottles back to find him he's not there. Walk over to the fence. See three karts off in the dirt (nowhere near each other however) and we see a complete front spindle, wheel and brake rotor lying in the dirt. He's not there either. Get in the truck to drive over to the "Looper" to se if he's off over there. Yep there he is. See two other karts off in the area too. Also not anywhere near each other. Tyler said the kart bogged and sputtered on the start and took another lap before it started to feel ok. The downloaded data from the kart bears that out. Pace lap 2:02, Lap 1 1:22, Lap 2 1:10, Lap 3 1:08... He pulled off with what sounds like a problem in the transmission with no power getting to the wheels. Hope it's not too bad. It's got compression, the plug looks good and it rolls in neutral without hearing anything that sounds like a "bag of marbles". We'll clean up the kart this week and pull the motor to get it over to our engine builder. Hope to fight another day. From westerneagleracing at att.net Tue Nov 27 09:51:24 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 16:51:24 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Tony, It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks and you won't be able to get back on tract. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : -------------- > According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it > look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' > of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at > the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another > 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's > a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. > > I've GOT to drive that track at least once. > > - Tony > > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&qs=10 > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy%2c+ > Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 > then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from > http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . > > At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: > >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, > >at Laguna Seca is? > >Thanks, > >Bill > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vintage.racer at comcast.net Tue Nov 27 14:12:48 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 13:12:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Message-ID: <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the approach to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into the turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the while you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and click on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. Gary 62 TR4 69 TR6 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of westerneagleracing at att.net Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM To: Tony Drews Cc: FOT at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Tony, It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks and you won't be able to get back on tract. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : -------------- > According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it > look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' > of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at > the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another > 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's > a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. > > I've GOT to drive that track at least once. > > - Tony > > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q s=10 > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy %2c+ > Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 > then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from > http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . > > At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: > >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, > >at Laguna Seca is? > >Thanks, > >Bill > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 27 14:46:42 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 14:46:42 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20071127215049.UQCJ27415.fed1rmmtao101.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> For a "front bumper" level view that will really give you a view of the corkscrew try these helmet cam videos of 250 SuperKarts that we have on our site. The top two on this page. http://www.southwestkarters.com/?page_id=88 At 02:12 PM 11/27/2007, Gary Horstkorta wrote: >For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna >Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the >track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the approach >to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into the >turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the while >you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. > >www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and click >on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view >videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. > >Gary >62 TR4 >69 TR6 > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net >[mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of >westerneagleracing at att.net >Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM >To: Tony Drews >Cc: FOT at autox.team.net >Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > >Tony, >It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they >redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks and >you won't be able to get back on tract. >Ron Jacobs >Western Eagle Racing >-------------- Original message from Tony Drews : >-------------- > > > > According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it > > look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' > > of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at > > the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another > > 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's > > a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. > > > > I've GOT to drive that track at least once. > > > > - Tony > > > > >http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q >s=10 > > >21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy >%2c+ > > Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 > > then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from > > http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . > > > > At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, > > >at Laguna Seca is? > > >Thanks, > > >Bill > > >_______________________________________________ > > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > > >Fot mailing list > > >Fot at autox.team.net > > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From kaskas at cox.net Tue Nov 27 14:57:08 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 13:57:08 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: <00d901c83140$74e28790$3f0ec548@RW> The first time I raced there (1959) my first lap was in a 3/4 ton pickup truck and going through the corkscrew I never saw the road for about 75 yards. Whoopee. They have slowed the straight and added a couple corners since then, but a terrific place. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Horstkorta" To: ; "'Tony Drews'" Cc: Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 1:12 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna > Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the > track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the > approach > to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into > the > turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the > while > you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. > > www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and > click > on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view > videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > 69 TR6 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > westerneagleracing at att.net > Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM > To: Tony Drews > Cc: FOT at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Tony, > It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they > redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks > and > you won't be able to get back on tract. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : > -------------- > > >> According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it >> look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' >> of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at >> the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another >> 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's >> a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. >> >> I've GOT to drive that track at least once. >> >> - Tony >> >> > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q > s=10 >> > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy > %2c+ >> Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 >> then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from >> http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . >> >> At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: >> >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, >> >at Laguna Seca is? >> >Thanks, >> >Bill >> >_______________________________________________ >> >http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > >> >Fot mailing list >> >Fot at autox.team.net >> >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From greenman62 at hotmail.com Tue Nov 27 15:44:30 2007 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (greenman62 at hotmail.com) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 22:44:30 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: My instructor at an Audi Safe Driving School last year told me of a track day he spent at Laguna Seca. He forgot to turn off the "ESP" (traction control) when he first went out. When the car entered the corkscrew the ESP though the car was falling and shut everything off. I was there two years ago... amazing. Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > From: vintage.racer at comcast.net > To: westerneagleracing at att.net; tony at tonydrews.com > Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 13:12:48 -0800 > CC: FOT at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna > Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the > track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the approach > to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into the > turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the while > you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. > > www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and click > on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view > videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > 69 TR6 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > westerneagleracing at att.net > Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM > To: Tony Drews > Cc: FOT at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Tony, > It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they > redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks and > you won't be able to get back on tract. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : > -------------- > > > > According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it > > look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' > > of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at > > the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another > > 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's > > a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. > > > > I've GOT to drive that track at least once. > > > > - Tony > > > > > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q > s=10 > > > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy > %2c+ > > Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 > > then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from > > http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . > > > > At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, > > >at Laguna Seca is? > > >Thanks, > > >Bill > > >_______________________________________________ > > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > > >Fot mailing list > > >Fot at autox.team.net > > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 27 16:40:29 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:40:29 -0800 Subject: [Fot] New frame for Peyote References: Message-ID: The new frame is done. Took forever, but it's nice work. A local guy in Vancouver, Washington did the work for me. Now I've got to hand sand it all and paint it. I've decided on rattlecan--it's easy to make it pretty again when you have to do something. Powdercoat is a pain in the neck. http://www.allaluminumtour.com/?p=277 pictures here From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 27 16:04:31 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:04:31 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net><000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> <00d901c83140$74e28790$3f0ec548@RW> Message-ID: I raced there some on a motorcycle, the corkscrew is a lot less scary on a bike--you can see where you're going. First time I went around in a car I nearly freaked out--no idea where I was going. I followed a 77 year old motorcycle racer through the corkscrew once--he was on a Ducati 916 racing bike, I was on my stock 916. As the front wheels started loading after the downhill chute he rolled his front tire off the rim. I watched him go down like it was slow motion, bounced once in front of me (body only) and cleared the Armco barrier. I assumed he was either dead or his bones snapped like castanets. I pulled off and ran back to find him brushing himself off casually while he looked for his bike--it went over the armco too. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Kas Kastner Sent: Tue 11/27/2007 1:57 PM To: Gary Horstkorta; westerneagleracing at att.net; 'Tony Drews' Cc: FOT at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca The first time I raced there (1959) my first lap was in a 3/4 ton pickup truck and going through the corkscrew I never saw the road for about 75 yards. Whoopee. They have slowed the straight and added a couple corners since then, but a terrific place. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Horstkorta" To: ; "'Tony Drews'" Cc: Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 1:12 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna > Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the > track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the > approach > to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into > the > turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the > while > you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. > > www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and > click > on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view > videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > 69 TR6 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > westerneagleracing at att.net > Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM > To: Tony Drews > Cc: FOT at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Tony, > It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they > redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks > and > you won't be able to get back on tract. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : > -------------- > > >> According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it >> look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' >> of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at >> the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another >> 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's >> a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. >> >> I've GOT to drive that track at least once. >> >> - Tony >> >> > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q > s=10 >> > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy > %2c+ >> Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 >> then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from >> http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . >> >> At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: >> >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, >> >at Laguna Seca is? >> >Thanks, >> >Bill >> >_______________________________________________ >> >http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > >> >Fot mailing list >> >Fot at autox.team.net >> >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From trmarty at hotmail.com Tue Nov 27 19:23:43 2007 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 21:23:43 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Fellow FOT'r under the weather Message-ID: Ed Ceilley, one of our resident Spitfire/GT6 racers is having some health issues. Ed has been down for a little bit and is having a rough go of it while going through chemo treatments. He is not doing emails at the present time but I'm sure getting a card from his fellow Triumph racers would help lift his spirits. If you felt so inclined drop Ed a get well message at Ed Ceilley 1110 Franklin St. Cedar Falls, IA 50613 Thanks, Marty Sukey _________________________________________________________________ Your smile counts. The more smiles you share, the more we donate. Join in. www.windowslive.com/smile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_oprsmilewlhmtagline From S.Janzen at comcast.net Tue Nov 27 19:54:53 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 21:54:53 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Mocal Oil T stat Message-ID: <000801c8316a$0df91060$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> I'm thinking about putting one of these in my car in line to the oil cooler- noticed that the oil takes a long time to get up to operating temperature. Anyone have any good or bad experience with them? Always reluctant to add one more part that can fail. From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Tue Nov 27 20:15:26 2007 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 20:15:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net><000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> <00d901c83140$74e28790$3f0ec548@RW> Message-ID: <9679FEB5-3220-422E-B8A8-65489FC81D6D@earthlink.net> One of the most exciting/scary/superhuman spectacles I ever witnessed was Kenny Roberts racing against his protigi Freddie Spenser at Laguna Seca [1978?]. I was watching from the inside of turn 8B. Coming off the top of the cork-screw, Lawson had the front wheel off the ground for 100ish feet - when it hit the ground again, it was already turned counter-lock for the next turn and on down the hill he went [every lap]. Spencer wasn't quite there yet. At the infield carnival they had a sit -on-the-bike video game going [very crude by todays standards I'm sure]. Still have my "I beat Freddie Spencer at Laguna Seca" button somewhere. Greg Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 27, 2007, at 4:04 PM, Bill Babcock wrote: > I raced there some on a motorcycle, the corkscrew is a lot less > scary on a > bike--you can see where you're going. First time I went around in a > car I > nearly freaked out--no idea where I was going. I followed a 77 year > old > motorcycle racer through the corkscrew once--he was on a Ducati 916 > racing > bike, I was on my stock 916. As the front wheels started loading > after the > downhill chute he rolled his front tire off the rim. I watched him > go down > like it was slow motion, bounced once in front of me (body only) > and cleared > the Armco barrier. I assumed he was either dead or his bones > snapped like > castanets. I pulled off and ran back to find him brushing himself > off casually > while he looked for his bike--it went over the armco too. From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 27 20:29:42 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 19:29:42 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net><000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> <00d901c83140$74e28790$3f0ec548@RW> <9679FEB5-3220-422E-B8A8-65489FC81D6D@earthlink.net> Message-ID: I was there. I was also there when KR started at the back of the pack and passed everyone in three laps. -----Original Message----- From: Greg "Lunker" Hilyer [mailto:Lunkercars at earthlink.net] Sent: Tue 11/27/2007 7:15 PM To: Bill Babcock Cc: Kas Kastner; Gary Horstkorta; westerneagleracing at att.net; Tony Drews; FOT at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca One of the most exciting/scary/superhuman spectacles I ever witnessed was Kenny Roberts racing against his protigi Freddie Spenser at Laguna Seca [1978?]. I was watching from the inside of turn 8B. Coming off the top of the cork-screw, Lawson had the front wheel off the ground for 100ish feet - when it hit the ground again, it was already turned counter-lock for the next turn and on down the hill he went [every lap]. Spencer wasn't quite there yet. At the infield carnival they had a sit -on-the-bike video game going [very crude by todays standards I'm sure]. Still have my "I beat Freddie Spencer at Laguna Seca" button somewhere. Greg Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 27, 2007, at 4:04 PM, Bill Babcock wrote: > I raced there some on a motorcycle, the corkscrew is a lot less > scary on a > bike--you can see where you're going. First time I went around in a > car I > nearly freaked out--no idea where I was going. I followed a 77 year > old > motorcycle racer through the corkscrew once--he was on a Ducati 916 > racing > bike, I was on my stock 916. As the front wheels started loading > after the > downhill chute he rolled his front tire off the rim. I watched him > go down > like it was slow motion, bounced once in front of me (body only) > and cleared > the Armco barrier. I assumed he was either dead or his bones > snapped like > castanets. I pulled off and ran back to find him brushing himself > off casually > while he looked for his bike--it went over the armco too. From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Wed Nov 28 00:05:29 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 02:05:29 EST Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site Message-ID: In a message dated 11/26/2007 8:46:55 PM Pacific Standard Time, fot-request at autox.team.net writes: > Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 15:21:14 -0500 > From: Shane Ingate > Subject: Re: [Fot] High End Triumph Site > To: Friends of Triumph > Cc: igofaster at charter.net > > I have heard enough about this Chris Cancelli of PRI to recognize that he is > a scam artist of the worst kind, and a liar. There are many people on different Triumph newsgroups in the USA & the UK that have been ripped off by him. It is very simple, SEND NO MONEY, not now, not ever. Looking out for my friends on the FoT. Happy Holidays Lion From dale.oesterle at sbcglobal.net Wed Nov 28 08:48:53 2007 From: dale.oesterle at sbcglobal.net (dale oesterle) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 07:48:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] quiller Message-ID: <925387.27977.qm@web82207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Anyone know why quiller attempted to charge 800 pounds (1600 dollars) for shipping their alloy bellhousing? Oesterle From dave at microworks.net Wed Nov 28 10:12:18 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:12:18 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site Message-ID: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. >I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >service to anyone. From vintage.racer at comcast.net Wed Nov 28 10:16:59 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 09:16:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Diffs Message-ID: <000601c831e2$7cd6a1f0$7683e5d0$@racer@comcast.net> Hello: The current issue of Victory Lane Magazine, December 2007, has an excellent article on the various racing differential types written by Craig Taylor of Taylor Engineering. There is a good description of each of the seven types he covers and reasons why he thinks some are better than others. A good read if anyone is considering buying a diff for their racer. Gary 62 TR4 69 TR6 From sbarr at McCarty-Law.com Wed Nov 28 10:48:03 2007 From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com (Barr, Scott) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 11:48:03 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> References: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74890745@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods and services provided by the companies we all deal with. http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html (Does not appear that there is any entry for PRI) -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+scott.barr=mccarty-law.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+scott.barr=mccarty-law.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of David W. Riddle Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 11:12 AM To: fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. >I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >service to anyone. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From cak at dimebank.com Wed Nov 28 11:23:22 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:23:22 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <474DB21A.70307@dimebank.com> It's funny ... I have driven Laguna Seca a bunch, both in open wheel cars and sedans, and I never found the Corkscrew particularly *scary*. Challenging, yes - but I know the lineup points, and once you get them right, you're basically committed. There's plenty of runoff if you screw up. (Passing there, or being passed, is a different issue entirely) What I find scary is 6 (I guess this was turn 3 in the old config, which would have made it even scarier after the then-longest straight). Braking needs to be done before the bridge, because there's a rise at the bridge where the car gets too light to brake hard. Turn-in is almost blind. There's a dip at the apex which presses the car down nicely when you get it right - you can take the turn very fast if you're confident. But if you screw up, you could end up in Salinas. That part always gets to me! From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 28 11:27:58 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:27:58 -0800 Subject: [Fot] : Re: High End Triumph Site References: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: I don't have any experience with this guy, but in my experience even a company that gives horrible service has a few happy clients. Just one of those random things. When I read the copy on his website my bullshit detector went off loudly. That might not mean anything generally, but remember that I spent a good part of my life marketing stuff, I wrote this kind of stuff. I pick up on waffle, hype and pure BS instantly, and his site is slathered with it. My big question is: Kehin Carbs? What's with that? Individually controlled single throat carbs are a pain in the neck on an old Honda 750, never mind a car. If you're going to step that far away from real, then why not modern injectors. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 9:12 AM To: fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. >I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >service to anyone. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From budscars at msn.com Wed Nov 28 11:32:00 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (budscars at msn.com) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:32:00 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <474DB21A.70307@dimebank.com> References: <474DB21A.70307@dimebank.com> Message-ID: I went to 'Salinas' once..in about 1971 with a Lotus super 7 mounted firmly across the front of my TR4..there was no guard rail then... Racer Bud> Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:23:22 -0800> From: cak at dimebank.com> To: fot at autox.team.net> Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca> > It's funny ... I have driven Laguna Seca a bunch, both in open wheel > cars and sedans, and I never found the Corkscrew particularly *scary*. > Challenging, yes - but I know the lineup points, and once you get them > right, you're basically committed. There's plenty of runoff if you screw > up. (Passing there, or being passed, is a different issue entirely)> > What I find scary is 6 (I guess this was turn 3 in the old config, which > would have made it even scarier after the then-longest straight). > Braking needs to be done before the bridge, because there's a rise at > the bridge where the car gets too light to brake hard. Turn-in is almost > blind. There's a dip at the apex which presses the car down nicely when > you get it right - you can take the turn very fast if you're confident.> > But if you screw up, you could end up in Salinas. That part always gets > to me!> _______________________________________________> http://www.team.net/donate.html> > Fot mailing list> Fot at autox.team.net> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From REK46 at aol.com Wed Nov 28 11:45:03 2007 From: REK46 at aol.com (REK46 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 13:45:03 EST Subject: [Fot] : Re: High End Triumph Site Message-ID: I wonder if PRI was ever on " Dragon's Den ".....kevin would eat him up ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From cak at dimebank.com Wed Nov 28 12:00:25 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 11:00:25 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <474DBAC9.80006@dimebank.com> > Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could > be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods > and services provided by the companies we all deal with. > > http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html > > (Does not appear that there is any entry for PRI) Hee. There's no entry because I'd never heard of the guy. I'm collecting responses and will add something soon! From S.Janzen at comcast.net Wed Nov 28 12:27:42 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 14:27:42 -0500 Subject: [Fot] : Re: Hiigh End Triumph Site References: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: <012901c831f4$c0223e30$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> I have had good luck with their oversize manifold gaskets. However, the web site whas shut down three months for "inventory" or some other reason so I had to wait a while to re-order them. The rest of the product line is so pricey that it's beyond consideration. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "David W. Riddle" ; ; Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 1:27 PM Subject: [Fot] : Re: High End Triumph Site >I don't have any experience with this guy, but in my experience even a >company > that gives horrible service has a few happy clients. Just one of those > random > things. When I read the copy on his website my bullshit detector went off > loudly. That might not mean anything generally, but remember that I spent > a > good part of my life marketing stuff, I wrote this kind of stuff. I pick > up on > waffle, hype and pure BS instantly, and his site is slathered with it. > > My big question is: Kehin Carbs? What's with that? Individually controlled > single throat carbs are a pain in the neck on an old Honda 750, never mind > a > car. If you're going to step that far away from real, then why not modern > injectors. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. > Riddle > Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 9:12 AM > To: fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org > Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site > > This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings > with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. > > >>I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >>Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >>prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >>hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >>in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >>adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >>service to anyone. > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From srcypher at mac.com Wed Nov 28 14:49:02 2007 From: srcypher at mac.com (Scott Cypher (SpitfireRacer)) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 16:49:02 -0500 Subject: [Fot] : Re: Hiigh End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <012901c831f4$c0223e30$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> References: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> <012901c831f4$c0223e30$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: How have you contacted them/him? I have sent email and even called ( left message) about the thick intake/exhaust gasket he reportedly makes for spits, but ive never gotten a response... Thanks -S Scott Cypher SCCA # 362573 #57 HP Spitfire 1500 Spitfireracer at xsmail.com On Nov 28, 2007, at 2:27 PM, Scott Janzen wrote: > I have had good luck with their oversize manifold gaskets. However, > the web > site whas shut down three months for "inventory" or some other > reason so I > had to wait a while to re-order them. The rest of the product line > is so > pricey that it's beyond consideration. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bill Babcock" > To: "David W. Riddle" ; ; > > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 1:27 PM > Subject: [Fot] : Re: High End Triumph Site > > >> I don't have any experience with this guy, but in my experience >> even a >> company >> that gives horrible service has a few happy clients. Just one of >> those >> random >> things. When I read the copy on his website my bullshit detector >> went off >> loudly. That might not mean anything generally, but remember that I >> spent >> a >> good part of my life marketing stuff, I wrote this kind of stuff. I >> pick >> up on >> waffle, hype and pure BS instantly, and his site is slathered with >> it. >> >> My big question is: Kehin Carbs? What's with that? Individually >> controlled >> single throat carbs are a pain in the neck on an old Honda 750, >> never mind >> a >> car. If you're going to step that far away from real, then why not >> modern >> injectors. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. >> Riddle >> Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 9:12 AM >> To: fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org >> Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site >> >> This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings >> with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. >> >> >>> I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >>> Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >>> prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >>> hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >>> in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >>> adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >>> service to anyone. >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From TomD4760 at aol.com Wed Nov 28 16:33:02 2007 From: TomD4760 at aol.com (TomD4760 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 18:33:02 EST Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca website there is no information on it. Does anyone know which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Thanks, Tom Deats


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(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From cak at dimebank.com Wed Nov 28 17:04:55 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 16:04:55 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <474E0227.6060508@dimebank.com> TomD4760 at aol.com wrote: > Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions > there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, > etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there > in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca > website there is no information on it. Does anyone know > which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Depends on the event, and the time you run. There is a negotiated agreement between the track and the surrounding homeowners. It used to be that there were two or three unlimited days per year - those were used for IndyCar, a bike race and maybe the Historics. Most other days were limited to 92dB for most of the day, with slightly tighter controls before 10am. All cars must be off track by 6pm. That may all have changed, but it's going to be something like that. From budscars at msn.com Wed Nov 28 17:25:16 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (RACER BUD) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 16:25:16 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: There is an SCCA vintage race at Laguna seca april 12-13 there is an HMSA race March 15-16, including a tribute to MG..Sound restrictions are very tough at Laguna seca..early morning groups usually as low as 90dcb..Best to check with the Governing group..HMSA or San Francisco Region SCCA Racer Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: TomD4760 at aol.com To: budscars at msn.com ; cak at dimebank.com ; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca website there is no information on it. Does anyone know which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Thanks, Tom Deats ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Wed Nov 28 17:50:28 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 17:50:28 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Mikuni carbs for TR's / high end website Message-ID: <000e01c83221$d63b01c0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> After going to the site in question I was curious about the carbs they claim to use. I did some research and found two companies using Mikunis on vintage and scca cars. Wolf racing is the US importer, they use the twin two barrel setup with 44 or 50 mm in their Datsuns. Vintage Performance uses two single barrel HSR 45 flat slides. These are direct replacements for the SU's and bolt right up. They are highly coveted by the Harley crowd. After some surfing and phone calls I found the HSR's for $ 300.00 each. Vintage Performance want's $ 765.00 for the pair. If they would offer to jet them for 5000 feet I might give it a shot. http://www.v-performance.com/recent.html#mikuni Their using them on Volvo P1800's. Wolf claims to get 30 - 40% increase in HP over stock which sounds optimistic. V/P was a bit more realistic, they said it depends on the motor ( good answer ) but they are getting better results on the dyno over stock SU's on all motors. I read somewhere else the flat slides actually create more velocity and atomization. It's an interesting subject and Iv'e been a big fan of Mikunis for 30 years, their bike carbs are bullet proof. Jim G. From vintage.racer at comcast.net Wed Nov 28 17:58:32 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 16:58:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000001c83222$f6cee450$e46cacf0$@racer@comcast.net> Tom: I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County allows the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an HMSA (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage (www.sfrscca.org) in April. Gary 62 TR4 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of TomD4760 at aol.com Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca website there is no information on it. Does anyone know which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Thanks, Tom Deats


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(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Wed Nov 28 18:40:01 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 19:40:01 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <000001c83222$f6cee450$e46cacf0$%racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: <004301c83228$c3e2cb00$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> I use a 2 1/2" pipe all the way to the back with a Moroso Spiral Flow Muffler, 2 1/2 in. Inlet/2 1/2 in. Outlet. They come in stainless and regular steel. I used the MOR-94050 standard unit at around $50.00. I haven't been to a track with a sound limit to be tested but it sure took the edge off the rat-a-tat and hasn't hurt the performance. Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Horstkorta" To: ; Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 6:58 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > Tom: > > I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db > restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County > allows > the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, > Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry > bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA > vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an > HMSA > (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage > (www.sfrscca.org) in April. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > TomD4760 at aol.com > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM > To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions > there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, > etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there > in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca > website there is no information on it. Does anyone know > which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > Thanks, Tom > Deats


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Check out AOL's > list > of 2007's hottest products.
> (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) HTML> > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Wed Nov 28 19:03:24 2007 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (steve) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 18:03:24 -0800 (GMT-08:00) Subject: [Fot] Stock TR3 / 4 Lifters? Message-ID: <6629062.1196301805148.JavaMail.root@elwamui-ovcar.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Does anybody out there have a bunch of used STOCK TR3 / 4 lifters? I need to have a bunch hardness tested to complete a set. (Tested 16 so far and I think I've got 5 or 6 good ones.) ~Steve From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Wed Nov 28 19:22:29 2007 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 18:22:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <474DBAC9.80006@dimebank.com> Message-ID: <593358.78761.qm@web81202.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Group: I guess I'll add my two cents worth to the thread. I have never had a problem with Chris. I buy my TR6 steel, lightened, flywheels from him, and they are truly works of art. I've purchased six or eight of them so far and have never had an issue with shipping times, pricing, etc. He does favor the bike carbs for car use, but that's because of his background. He also uses bike valves in his head work. Perhaps he has a connection for good pricing on bike parts? Steve Smith used his stuff for years. Perhaps he can add something. Also, Brad and Susan used his method to measure and calculate for pushrod length on some custom rods, and when they got them they were the length requested, but, were the wrong length for the application. They may add something to the thread. I think we had this conversation a couple of years ago...every business has it's happy and dissappointed customers. 100% satisfaction is every businesses GOAL. My two cents. Thanks - Ed Chris Kantarjiev wrote: > Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could > be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods > and services provided by the companies we all deal with. > > http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html > > (Does not appear that there is any entry for PRI) Hee. There's no entry because I'd never heard of the guy. I'm collecting responses and will add something soon! Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From hottr6 at hotmail.com Wed Nov 28 20:03:11 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 22:03:11 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Gary Horstkorta wrote: > I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db > restriction in the past. That seems way little high to me. When I ran the Pantera there in the late 1990s it was 92db, and really hard for me to meet. The sound-level meter was on the right-hand curb just after turn 5...going up the hill. I had to be gentle on the throttle until just past the bridge. Thats OK, everyone else except Viper drivers also had to modulate the throttle for the same reason. The corkscrew was fun but ultimately not really satisfying. Turn 6 was my fave corner, because I could hit it almost without lifting. Corners 9-10 I disliked intensely...I guess I don't like going downhill - I've spent too much time at hillclimbs. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Share life as it happens with the new Windows Live.Download today it's FREE! http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_sharelife_112007 From hottr6 at hotmail.com Wed Nov 28 20:14:59 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 22:14:59 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could > be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods > and services provided by the companies we all deal with. > > http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html Just like eBay feedback! Over the years, I have dealt with almost every Triumph TR vendor in the US and UK and I dare say that ALL of them (with the exception of PRI) have provided exemplary and friendly service. Thinking about Ted S, Uncle Jack, Richard G, Ken G, these guys have helped me as if I was an old friend. One of the main reasons I have stayed with Triumphs have been the terrific people I have met along the way, and the vendors have made that experience very sweet indeed. Except PRI. Grrrrrrr. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newways_112007 From kaskas at cox.net Wed Nov 28 21:36:20 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 20:36:20 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <00f001c83241$63feb8c0$3f0ec548@RW> > When fighting the decibel number remember to simply put a bend on the end > of your tail pipe and point it the OTHER way from the test position. > Don't what that is? Then find out? Huge difference. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "BOB KRAMER" > To: "Gary Horstkorta" ; ; > > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 5:40 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > >>I use a 2 1/2" pipe all the way to the back with a Moroso Spiral Flow >> Muffler, 2 1/2 in. Inlet/2 1/2 in. Outlet. They come in stainless and >> regular steel. I used the MOR-94050 standard unit at around $50.00. I >> haven't been to a track with a sound limit to be tested but it sure took >> the >> edge off the rat-a-tat and hasn't hurt the performance. >> >> Bob Kramer >> rkramer3 at austin.rr.com >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Gary Horstkorta" >> To: ; >> Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 6:58 PM >> Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca >> >> >>> Tom: >>> >>> I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db >>> restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County >>> allows >>> the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, >>> Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry >>> bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA >>> vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an >>> HMSA >>> (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage >>> (www.sfrscca.org) in April. >>> >>> Gary >>> 62 TR4 >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net >>> [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf >>> Of >>> TomD4760 at aol.com >>> Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM >>> To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net >>> Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca >>> >>> Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions >>> there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, >>> etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there >>> in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca >>> website there is no information on it. Does anyone know >>> which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. >>> Thanks, Tom >>> Deats


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Check out >>> AOL's >>> list >>> of 2007's hottest products.
>>> (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)>> HTML> >>> Fot mailing list >>> Fot at autox.team.net >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>> _______________________________________________ >>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> >>> Fot mailing list >>> Fot at autox.team.net >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 28 21:43:22 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 20:43:22 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Mikuni carbs for TR's / high end website References: <000e01c83221$d63b01c0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: Bullet proof, but simple. I love Mikuni carbs too--I understand them forwards and backwards, but I'd never put them on a car, other than the Mikuni Solex weber look-alikes. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of James Gray Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 4:50 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Mikuni carbs for TR's / high end website After going to the site in question I was curious about the carbs they claim to use. I did some research and found two companies using Mikunis on vintage and scca cars. Wolf racing is the US importer, they use the twin two barrel setup with 44 or 50 mm in their Datsuns. Vintage Performance uses two single barrel HSR 45 flat slides. These are direct replacements for the SU's and bolt right up. They are highly coveted by the Harley crowd. After some surfing and phone calls I found the HSR's for $ 300.00 each. Vintage Performance want's $ 765.00 for the pair. If they would offer to jet them for 5000 feet I might give it a shot. http://www.v-performance.com/recent.html#mikuni Their using them on Volvo P1800's. Wolf claims to get 30 - 40% increase in HP over stock which sounds optimistic. V/P was a bit more realistic, they said it depends on the motor ( good answer ) but they are getting better results on the dyno over stock SU's on all motors. I read somewhere else the flat slides actually create more velocity and atomization. It's an interesting subject and Iv'e been a big fan of Mikunis for 30 years, their bike carbs are bullet proof. Jim G. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 28 21:46:11 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 20:46:11 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <000001c83222$f6cee450$e46cacf0$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound metering. I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend pointing at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Gary Horstkorta Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 4:58 PM To: TomD4760 at aol.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Tom: I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County allows the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an HMSA (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage (www.sfrscca.org) in April. Gary 62 TR4 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of TomD4760 at aol.com Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca website there is no information on it. Does anyone know which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Thanks, Tom Deats


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Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 28 21:57:04 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 20:57:04 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: Turn nine is really the best turn at Laguna IMHO. Very difficult, very technical, and costs you a lot when you screw it up. Late, late turn in. Odd for such a slight kink but it's so off camber that an early turn in buys you a spin or worse. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Shane Ingate Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 7:03 PM To: vintage.racer at comcast.net Cc: Friends of Triumph Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Gary Horstkorta wrote: > I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db > restriction in the past. That seems way little high to me. When I ran the Pantera there in the late 1990s it was 92db, and really hard for me to meet. The sound-level meter was on the right-hand curb just after turn 5...going up the hill. I had to be gentle on the throttle until just past the bridge. Thats OK, everyone else except Viper drivers also had to modulate the throttle for the same reason. The corkscrew was fun but ultimately not really satisfying. Turn 6 was my fave corner, because I could hit it almost without lifting. Corners 9-10 I disliked intensely...I guess I don't like going downhill - I've spent too much time at hillclimbs. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Share life as it happens with the new Windows Live.Download today it's FREE! http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_sharelife_112007 Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wensley_Tr at comcast.net Thu Nov 29 06:13:54 2007 From: wensley_Tr at comcast.net (Craig) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:13:54 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <474E0227.6060508@dimebank.com> Message-ID: <001301c83289$b19db430$0200a8c0@Desktop> If you let the homeowners tell you what to do When you were there first Then you can say goodbye to the track Craig ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Kantarjiev" To: Cc: Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 7:04 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > TomD4760 at aol.com wrote: >> Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions >> there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, >> etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there >> in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca >> website there is no information on it. Does anyone know >> which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > > Depends on the event, and the time you run. > > There is a negotiated agreement between the track and the surrounding > homeowners. It used to be that there were two or three unlimited days > per year - those were used for IndyCar, a bike race and maybe the > Historics. Most other days were limited to 92dB for most of the day, > with slightly tighter controls before 10am. All cars must be off track > by 6pm. > > That may all have changed, but it's going to be something like that. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rhlamp at babcock.com Thu Nov 29 06:41:56 2007 From: rhlamp at babcock.com (Lamp, Randy H) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:41:56 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F8FF44C413A3A43880E522C56BA44218BBA55@barbpo3.bwes.net> The first time I talked to PRI ,I was pretty impressed. The guy sounded like he really new his stuff. Most of the products on his web site were pretty expensive, but I was excited to have found a vendor that had trick stuff for my GT6. (not and easy thing to find). So I purchased a few small items, as a test, because a few people warned me to stay away. I was pleased with the quality of the items ,but not so happy about the high cost associated with shipping and handling. I then met a local Triumph guy who was involved in a law sit with PRI. This was just about the same time that I decided to order a set of his (expensive)alloy shocks. When I mentioned the pending law suit to PRI, he went ballistic on me and accused me of being involved with the guy ,just because we happen to live near each other. I hardly knew the guy, but PRI told me he wouldn't sell me anything ever again! I guess you are not suppose to ask certain questions, when your about to lay out large sums of money for stuff to put on your toys. He lost a potentially good customer, who can't hardly resist buying trick parts for Triumphs. Canley Classics anyone? R. Lamp -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rhlamp=babcock.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rhlamp=babcock.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Shane Ingate Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 10:15 PM To: Friends of Triumph Subject: Re: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site > Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could > be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods > and services provided by the companies we all deal with. > > http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html Just like eBay feedback! Over the years, I have dealt with almost every Triumph TR vendor in the US and UK and I dare say that ALL of them (with the exception of PRI) have provided exemplary and friendly service. Thinking about Ted S, Uncle Jack, Richard G, Ken G, these guys have helped me as if I was an old friend. One of the main reasons I have stayed with Triumphs have been the terrific people I have met along the way, and the vendors have made that experience very sweet indeed. Except PRI. Grrrrrrr. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newways_112 007 Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ----------------------------------------- This message is intended only for the individual or entity to which it is addressed and contains information that is proprietary to The Babcock & Wilcox Company and/or its affiliates, or may be otherwise confidential. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or the employee agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete this message from your computer. Thank you. From spitlist at cox.net Thu Nov 29 07:18:32 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:18:32 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <474E0227.6060508@dimebank.com> <001301c83289$b19db430$0200a8c0@Desktop> Message-ID: <000d01c83292$b9530960$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Same scenario as people who buy cheap houing by an airport and then complain about the noise. Joe C. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Craig" To: "Chris Kantarjiev" ; Cc: Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:13 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > If you let the homeowners tell you what to do > When you were there first > Then you can say goodbye to the track > Craig > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chris Kantarjiev" > To: > Cc: > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 7:04 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > > TomD4760 at aol.com wrote: > >> Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions > >> there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, > >> etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there > >> in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca > >> website there is no information on it. Does anyone know > >> which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > > > > Depends on the event, and the time you run. > > > > There is a negotiated agreement between the track and the surrounding > > homeowners. It used to be that there were two or three unlimited days > > per year - those were used for IndyCar, a bike race and maybe the > > Historics. Most other days were limited to 92dB for most of the day, > > with slightly tighter controls before 10am. All cars must be off track > > by 6pm. > > > > That may all have changed, but it's going to be something like that. > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillDentin at aol.com Thu Nov 29 08:05:12 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 10:05:12 EST Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: In a message dated 11/28/2007 10:53:35 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I > suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound > metering. > I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend > pointing > at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler > > > A 4" Cherry Bomb in the muffler? Hell...they'll hear that in Palm Springs. Remember when the five minute warning was a Cherry Bomb? Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From BillDentin at aol.com Thu Nov 29 08:05:12 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 10:05:12 EST Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: In a message dated 11/28/2007 10:53:35 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I > suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound > metering. > I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend > pointing > at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler > > > A 4" Cherry Bomb in the muffler? Hell...they'll hear that in Palm Springs. Remember when the five minute warning was a Cherry Bomb? Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From spitlist at cox.net Thu Nov 29 08:29:26 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:29:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: <002601c8329c$a0d41640$2d02a8c0@Belkin> With all this talk about noise and mufflers, it reminds me that I have a Super Trap muffler that needs a good home. It is 18" long and has a 3" input. I was using it as a side pipe on my Honda Powered Spit until I converted the car to street legality. I now have a Corvette style side pipe and no longer need the Super Trap. I have a number of extra discs for it so you can tune it from very loud to very quiet. I realize that most Triupms have smaler pipes than 3" but this is easily handled by a step-down adapter. Anyone who is interested, please contact me off list at spitlist at cox.net. Price is negotiable. Regards, Joe C. From John.Reed at wilson.com Thu Nov 29 08:25:02 2007 From: John.Reed at wilson.com (John.Reed at wilson.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:25:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I remember the five minute canon at RA. It would recoil two feet!! Regards, John Reed Staff Photographer Wilson Sporting Goods Co. 8750 W Bryn Mawr Ave, Chicago, Illinois 60631, USA Tel. + 1.773.714.6895, fax +1.773.714.4585 John.Reed at wilson.com www.wilson.com www.amersports.com Please note that effective immediately, my e-mail , phone number and street address have changed. Please update your files accordingly. BillDentin at aol.com Sent by: fot-bounces+john.reed=wilson.com at autox.team.net 11/29/07 07:05 AM To BillB at bnj.com, vintage.racer at comcast.net, TomD4760 at aol.com, fot at autox.team.net cc Subject Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca In a message dated 11/28/2007 10:53:35 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I > suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound > metering. > I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend > pointing > at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler > > > A 4" Cherry Bomb in the muffler? Hell...they'll hear that in Palm Springs. Remember when the five minute warning was a Cherry Bomb? Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot This e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 29 08:43:05 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:43:05 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <474E0227.6060508@dimebank.com> <001301c83289$b19db430$0200a8c0@Desktop> Message-ID: Interesting idea, and I certainly don't think it should work any other way, but it does. Ultimately even the most altruistic-seeming politicians and the regulators they appoint respond to money or votes. Nothing else. The ones who don't are back doing what they did before they became politicians. I know that sounds cynical, but it's obviously true as well. Tracks don't have a lot of votes, unless someone works hard on their behalf to garner and organize support. Pissed off homeowners are an automatic vote block that a politician can harvest by "reasonable"actions like noise constraints, or shutting down the track. End of sad story. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Craig Sent: Thu 11/29/2007 5:13 AM To: Chris Kantarjiev; TomD4760 at aol.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca If you let the homeowners tell you what to do When you were there first Then you can say goodbye to the track Craig ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Kantarjiev" To: Cc: Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 7:04 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > TomD4760 at aol.com wrote: >> Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions >> there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, >> etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there >> in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca >> website there is no information on it. Does anyone know >> which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > > Depends on the event, and the time you run. > > There is a negotiated agreement between the track and the surrounding > homeowners. It used to be that there were two or three unlimited days > per year - those were used for IndyCar, a bike race and maybe the > Historics. Most other days were limited to 92dB for most of the day, > with slightly tighter controls before 10am. All cars must be off track > by 6pm. > > That may all have changed, but it's going to be something like that. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 29 08:43:47 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:43:47 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: That reminds me, I have a massive stash of completely illegal (in Oregon) fireworks in Nero accumulated during my pass through the lunatic central states where every third kid must be nicknamed "stumpy". I'd better do something constructive with them before Nero does something dramatic and loud. -----Original Message----- From: BillDentin at aol.com [mailto:BillDentin at aol.com] Sent: Thu 11/29/2007 7:05 AM To: Bill Babcock; vintage.racer at comcast.net; TomD4760 at aol.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca In a message dated 11/28/2007 10:53:35 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I > suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound > metering. > I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend > pointing > at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler > > > A 4" Cherry Bomb in the muffler? Hell...they'll hear that in Palm Springs. Remember when the five minute warning was a Cherry Bomb? Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From BillDentin at aol.com Thu Nov 29 09:06:20 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 11:06:20 EST Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: In a message dated 11/29/2007 9:45:56 AM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > Interesting idea, and I certainly don't think it should work any other way, > but it does. Ultimately even the most altruistic-seeming politicians and the > regulators they appoint respond to money or votes. Nothing else. The ones > who > don't are back doing what they did before they became politicians. I know > that > sounds cynical, but it's obviously true as well. > > Tracks don't have a lot of votes, unless someone works hard on their behalf > to > garner and organize support. Pissed off homeowners are an automatic vote > block > that a politician can harvest by "reasonable"actions like noise constraints, > or shutting down the track. > > End of sad story. > Bill... You, and many others on the FOT list, will recall Bob Wismer's impressive monument at Road America. Originally that monument was to be placed at Blackhawk Farms Raceway, where most of Wismer's Sports 2000 races were run. But at the time Blackhawk Farms was on VERY thin ice. In spite of the track's considerable efforts to be a good neighbor, locals were involved in an effort to get it shut down (noise and nuisance). All indications suggested they would be successful. Then the racers got involved in a letter writing effort. They pointed out that, in fact, Blackhawk Farms was a little jewel in a pretty bleak community. Every week end considerable dollars from outside the community flowed into the economy. Copies were sent to local businesses, and in particular hotels, restaurants, etc. The problem went away. Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From westerneagleracing at att.net Thu Nov 29 09:49:49 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 16:49:49 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <112920071649.24937.474EEDAD000164470000616922218865869B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Tom: The sound station is very visable and is on the outside of the track. One trick is to have your exhaust angled to the inside rather than the outside of the track. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from "Gary Horstkorta" : -------------- > Tom: > > I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db > restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County allows > the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, > Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry > bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA > vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an HMSA > (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage > (www.sfrscca.org) in April. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > TomD4760 at aol.com > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM > To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions > there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, > etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there > in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca > website there is no information on it. Does anyone know > which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > Thanks, Tom > Deats ************************************** Check out AOL's > list > of 2007's hottest products. > (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)> HTML> > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spreiss at verizon.net Wed Nov 28 18:04:00 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 12:04:00 +1100 Subject: [Fot] odd wire wheel Message-ID: <005a01c83223$ba7f53d0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Does anyone know about an odd 4 x 15 x 48 spoke wire wheel that is center laced like the later 60 spoke version? I have one of these, and would like to obtain a match for it. It has about 1/2" less backspacing than the standard, resulting in a wider track and an exaggerated dish that looks great on the rear of my '56 "period prep" TR3 . Steve Preiss From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 29 11:04:18 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 10:04:18 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: My point exactly. Portland International Raceway is always under some kind of fire. It's a city park, and every so often some people who live nearby get a councilman to explore closing it down "can't something more productive be done with that land" or some developer starts tossing money and ideas around. Only one thing stops it--an active group of people who demonstrate clearly that it's a third rail. In fact you don't die just from touching PIR, you can die from talking about touching it. Racetracks and people who care about them should build that group now, not when they need it. They need to be ready to go before any goofy ideas gather momentum. It's easy to crush them when they're small. They also need to demonstrate their power conclusively at least once. Toss some boob out of office, and make sure everyone knows why it happened. Help somebody that's a friend of the track get elected. It's a good lesson for the rest of them. You might gather from my choice of words that I'm a little passionate about this. -----Original Message----- From: BillDentin at aol.com [mailto:BillDentin at aol.com] Sent: Thu 11/29/2007 8:06 AM To: Bill Babcock Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca In a message dated 11/29/2007 9:45:56 AM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > Interesting idea, and I certainly don't think it should work any other way, > but it does. Ultimately even the most altruistic-seeming politicians and the > regulators they appoint respond to money or votes. Nothing else. The ones > who > don't are back doing what they did before they became politicians. I know > that > sounds cynical, but it's obviously true as well. > > Tracks don't have a lot of votes, unless someone works hard on their behalf > to > garner and organize support. Pissed off homeowners are an automatic vote > block > that a politician can harvest by "reasonable"actions like noise constraints, > or shutting down the track. > > End of sad story. > Bill... You, and many others on the FOT list, will recall Bob Wismer's impressive monument at Road America. Originally that monument was to be placed at Blackhawk Farms Raceway, where most of Wismer's Sports 2000 races were run. But at the time Blackhawk Farms was on VERY thin ice. In spite of the track's considerable efforts to be a good neighbor, locals were involved in an effort to get it shut down (noise and nuisance). All indications suggested they would be successful. Then the racers got involved in a letter writing effort. They pointed out that, in fact, Blackhawk Farms was a little jewel in a pretty bleak community. Every week end considerable dollars from outside the community flowed into the economy. Copies were sent to local businesses, and in particular hotels, restaurants, etc. The problem went away. Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From wgrosenbach at juno.com Thu Nov 29 13:17:55 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 13:17:55 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of $1 Billion since opening. As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found a steeper drop in the USA. Bill From bownes at seiri.com Thu Nov 29 13:40:13 2007 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 15:40:13 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> References: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ NHIS, but those are both uphill... On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of > $1 Billion since opening. > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found > a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From westerneagleracing at att.net Thu Nov 29 15:30:10 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 22:30:10 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <112920072230.16523.474F3D72000D58E10000408B22230682229B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Bill: I agree. When you walk the track prior to a race try walking up the corkscrew! Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from William G Rosenbach : -------------- > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of > $1 Billion since opening. > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found > a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From cwn.fot at cwnicholls.net Thu Nov 29 15:43:23 2007 From: cwn.fot at cwnicholls.net (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:43:23 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> References: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: <009201c832d9$41c30110$1342a8c0@semperon3400> How about the downhill under the bridge at Road Atlanta ? Seek and ye shall find. Clark -----Original Message----- Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found a steeper drop in the USA. Bill From kaskas at cox.net Thu Nov 29 15:50:42 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 14:50:42 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> <009201c832d9$41c30110$1342a8c0@semperon3400> Message-ID: <00bb01c832da$45714690$3f0ec548@RW> It is not the total drop that is stimulating, but the drop over the shortest distance, that is where the "corkscrew" is a winner most times. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clark W. Nicholls" To: "'William G Rosenbach'" ; Cc: Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 2:43 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > How about the downhill under the bridge at Road Atlanta ? > Seek and ye shall find. > Clark > > -----Original Message----- > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. > I have not yet found a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From westerneagleracing at att.net Thu Nov 29 16:28:50 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 23:28:50 +0000 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: <112920072328.6999.474F4B31000C9B4000001B5722230704929B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Fot: The Laguna Seca thread has generated as much interest as anything I've seen on the FOT. All of you vintage guy and girls why don't we plan something for the HMSA race in March. Maybe a sort of west coast version of next years Watkins Glen (probably no Kas trophy). The fun thing about a lot TR's would be the fact that the race is a tribute to MG! I am copying Chris at HMSA to get his response. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing From wgrosenbach at juno.com Thu Nov 29 16:29:12 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 16:29:12 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <20071129.162912.2416.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> I've got the bridge to the tower at 7.9%. On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:43:23 -0500 "Clark W. Nicholls" writes: > How about the downhill under the bridge at Road Atlanta ? > Seek and ye shall find. > Clark > > -----Original Message----- > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. > I have not yet found a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill From macdonaldp at rogers.com Thu Nov 29 16:48:00 2007 From: macdonaldp at rogers.com (Paul MacDonald) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:48:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff according to Bill Babcock. Paul -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of robert bownes Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM To: William G Rosenbach Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ NHIS, but those are both uphill... On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of > $1 Billion since opening. > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found > a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From kaskas at cox.net Thu Nov 29 16:55:51 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 15:55:51 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: <00cd01c832e3$5f7a6180$3f0ec548@RW> Mosport is like falling down a very steep hill, Laguna is like falling out a window. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul MacDonald" To: "robert bownes" ; "William G Rosenbach" Cc: ; Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 3:48 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca >I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff according > to Bill Babcock. > > Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of > robert bownes > Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM > To: William G Rosenbach > Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ > NHIS, but those are both uphill... > > > On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: >> >> Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the >> largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of >> $1 Billion since opening. >> >> As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I >> base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming >> there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. >> Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found >> a steeper drop in the USA. >> Bill >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wgrosenbach at juno.com Thu Nov 29 17:04:02 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:04:02 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <20071129.170402.2416.4.wgrosenbach@juno.com> I've been using Google Earth to look for this stuff. I'm confident it is NOT absolutely dead on accurate. At Mosport, I found 181 feet elevation change split between opposite corners of the track. What corners have the drops, so I can go back and look closer. Bill On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:48:00 -0500 "Paul MacDonald" writes: > I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff > according > to Bill Babcock. > > Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf > Of > robert bownes > Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM > To: William G Rosenbach > Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the > bowl @ > NHIS, but those are both uphill... > > > On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place > are the > > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in > excess of > > $1 Billion since opening. > > > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 > ft. I > > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, > assuming > > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between > apexes. > > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet > found > > a steeper drop in the USA. > > Bill > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From macdonaldp at rogers.com Thu Nov 29 17:39:41 2007 From: macdonaldp at rogers.com (Paul MacDonald) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 19:39:41 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071129.170402.2416.4.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: Here is the map of Mospoort http://www.mosport.com/trackmap.htm Corner 2 falls off quickly into a gully then rises up to corner 3. The back straight is uphill too, starting at the hairpin which is itself quite steep. Paul -----Original Message----- From: William G Rosenbach [mailto:wgrosenbach at juno.com] Sent: November 29, 2007 7:04 PM To: macdonaldp at rogers.com Cc: bownes at seiri.com; BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca I've been using Google Earth to look for this stuff. I'm confident it is NOT absolutely dead on accurate. At Mosport, I found 181 feet elevation change split between opposite corners of the track. What corners have the drops, so I can go back and look closer. Bill On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:48:00 -0500 "Paul MacDonald" writes: > I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff > according > to Bill Babcock. > > Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf > Of > robert bownes > Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM > To: William G Rosenbach > Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the > bowl @ > NHIS, but those are both uphill... > > > On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place > are the > > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in > excess of > > $1 Billion since opening. > > > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 > ft. I > > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, > assuming > > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between > apexes. > > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet > found > > a steeper drop in the USA. > > Bill > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From cak at dimebank.com Thu Nov 29 17:42:56 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 16:42:56 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <474F5C90.3060206@dimebank.com> > I agree. When you walk the track prior to a race try walking up the corkscrew! A fellow SCCA corner worker once told me that he was racing MGs in the 50s when the track first opened. He claims that the track was designed to be run clockwise, but the TDs couldn't get up the corkscrew ... so they reversed the sense of the track. I've never tried to verify this, but it's a great story! From yellow-green at sbcglobal.net Thu Nov 29 18:51:23 2007 From: yellow-green at sbcglobal.net (Dennis DeLap) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:51:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] TR6 rear hubs Message-ID: <883765.25532.qm@web81713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Amici - I have a question for those who are racing a TR4A - TR6. What have you done to make the rear axle/hubs safe? Upgrades, modifications, etc. Thanks Dennis DeLap From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 29 19:31:44 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:31:44 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: Laguna Seca is steeper but it's over in a heartbeat. Turn three at Mosport drops, and drops, and drops. The hairpin is probably steeper than the corskscrew, but it's uphill and very short. You can't walk up it. -----Original Message----- From: Paul MacDonald [mailto:macdonaldp at rogers.com] Sent: Thu 11/29/2007 3:48 PM To: robert bownes; William G Rosenbach Cc: Bill Babcock; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] Laguna Seca I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff according to Bill Babcock. Paul -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of robert bownes Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM To: William G Rosenbach Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ NHIS, but those are both uphill... On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of > $1 Billion since opening. > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found > a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From RYoung at navcomtech.com Thu Nov 29 19:42:53 2007 From: RYoung at navcomtech.com (Young Randall) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:42:53 -0800 Subject: [Fot] odd wire wheel In-Reply-To: <005a01c83223$ba7f53d0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> References: <005a01c83223$ba7f53d0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: > Does anyone know about an odd 4 x 15 x 48 spoke wire wheel > that is center > laced like the later 60 spoke version? Just a WAG, but looking at the BWW website, I see a 15x4x48 wheel listed for a Lotus Elite. Could this be it ? http://www.seanet.com/~rsfehr/ELITE11.jpg http://www.sussexsportscars.co.uk/picture.php?stock_id=271&picnum=1 Randall fdpnmailgwapp3.dpn.deere.com made the following annotations --------------------------------------------------------------------- CONFIDENTIALITY. This electronic mail and any files transmitted with it may contain information proprietary to NavCom Technology, Inc., or one of its affiliates, and are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed, shall be maintained in confidence and not disclosed to third parties without the written consent of the sender. If you are not the intended recipient or the person responsible for delivering the electronic mail to the intended recipient, be advised that you have received this electronic mail in error and that any use, dissemination, forwarding, printing, or copying of this electronic mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this electronic mail in error, please immediately notify the sender by return mail. --------------------------------------------------------------------- From rdavis4 at cfl.rr.com Thu Nov 29 19:50:44 2007 From: rdavis4 at cfl.rr.com (Bob) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 21:50:44 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: <009801c832fb$cdfba3e0$0201a8c0@VALUEDA4DE119D> VIR has several very nice elevation changes with one that is up hill and very blind until you crest over the top. And then there is also a down hill cork screw. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul MacDonald" To: "robert bownes" ; "William G Rosenbach" Cc: ; Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:48 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca >I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff according > to Bill Babcock. > > Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of > robert bownes > Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM > To: William G Rosenbach > Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ > NHIS, but those are both uphill... > > > On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: >> >> Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the >> largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of >> $1 Billion since opening. >> >> As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I >> base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming >> there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. >> Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found >> a steeper drop in the USA. >> Bill >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From malaboge at aol.com Thu Nov 29 21:54:26 2007 From: malaboge at aol.com (malaboge at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 23:54:26 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR6 rear hubs In-Reply-To: <883765.25532.qm@web81713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <883765.25532.qm@web81713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CA012437D9A5C9-65C-8988@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> Dennis- No matter what you do, the stock outer axle is the big problem...it will break! I run a basically unbreakable chevy setup.? A corvair outer axle drilled for a TR lug pattern, with a Corvair hub assembly. Cut off all the protrusions on the Corvair hub assembly so it will fit into the TR trailing arm, and weld on a flange to mount onto the TR trailing arm.? Use a GM ujoint and cut down one side so as to mount to the Corvair stub axle on one side and the TR sliding axle on the other. Actually much easier than it sounds. Drivin the?Chevumph...Triolet? ????????? Nick in NorCal -----Original Message----- From: Dennis DeLap To: FOT Sent: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 5:51 pm Subject: [Fot] TR6 rear hubs Amici - I have a question for those who are racing a TR4A - TR6. What have you done to make the rear axle/hubs safe? Upgrades, modifications, etc. Thanks Dennis DeLap Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 From gasket.works at verizon.net Fri Nov 30 10:56:29 2007 From: gasket.works at verizon.net (Gasket Works USA) Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 11:56:29 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Fot] gas welding with H2/02? Message-ID: <5857257.12844641196445389764.JavaMail.root@vms124.mailsrvcs.net> anyone have exp with this ? reply off line (email above). Mordy M.N.Dunst Gasket Works USA, LLC gmt-8 Pacific time 626.358.1616 voice 626.628.3777 fax From gasket.works at verizon.net Fri Nov 30 10:56:19 2007 From: gasket.works at verizon.net (Gasket Works USA) Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 11:56:19 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Fot] gas welding with H2/02? Message-ID: <5470385.12844561196445379329.JavaMail.root@vms124.mailsrvcs.net> anyone have exp with this ? reply off line (email above). Mordy M.N.Dunst Gasket Works USA, LLC gmt-8 Pacific time 626.358.1616 voice 626.628.3777 fax From elkhorn at core.com Fri Nov 30 14:51:03 2007 From: elkhorn at core.com (David Wingett) Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 16:51:03 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR6 / Corvair hubs Message-ID: <001b01c8339b$1a95ee00$0100a8c0@elkhorn> FOT, It's nice to know I had a small part in keeping a few Triumphs out on the track. I haven't made any in a few years now. I've had many requests but it got to be just too big a project. I do have a couple sets of the Alum. hubs I've been saving as spares for my own racing habit. For those that have or are considering Corvair axles this is the major part you need. Sorry but when they are gone I wont be making any more. Best to contact me off line Dave Wingett From bob at CoanPro.com Fri Nov 30 20:59:07 2007 From: bob at CoanPro.com (Bob Coan) Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 19:59:07 -0800 Subject: [Fot] SCCA or Vintage Spitfire for sale Message-ID: <001101c833ce$866f9bc0$934ed340$@com> Hey everyone, I've decided to sell this beautiful SCCA HP ready Spitfire along with a nice stock of spare parts. My Dad and I hoped to make it to the runoffs but its does not look like we will be doing that anytime soon, so instead of letting this car sit in storage, I'll find someone that wants to put it on the track. It could easily be converted to Vintage. Take a look at http://picasaweb.google.com/thinkfreerealtyphotos/SCCAHPTriumphSpitfire The guy I bought it from owned a racing supply business and put over 25k into the car and only ran it a few times. The car has been totally race prepared with a brand new 1147 race motor built by Acme Racing of Spartanburg NC, rebuilt transmission, rebuilt rear end, everything including lug bolts and studs have been rebuilt. The car has Mark Williams axels, modified carbs and Electromotive crank trigger ignition. Gary Johnson of E. TN Race Prep did the final assembly...including front coil over's, new front and rear disc brakes, Electromotive crank trigger ignition and more. I just put the car on e-bay for $5000. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem &sspagename=STRK%3AMESCX%3AIT&viewitem=&item=220178787790&_trksid=p3984.cSCH EDULE.m314.lVI I also have a the enclosed trailer and matching Dodge Ram truck if someone wanted a turnkey setup. All going for good prices. I need to clear out my storage shop over the next 3 weeks, so please forward this info to anyone you think might be interested. It's all located in Tustin, California, which is Southern California near Disneyland. Bob Coan 714-566-5138 From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Nov 1 10:56:50 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 12:56:50 EDT Subject: [Fot] 87mm Pistons wanted Message-ID: List, I am looking for a very good set of new or used pistons for my Wet Sleeved Wonder. Perhaps someone has a set on the shelf with no planned usage. Thanks, Joe Alexander From dave at microworks.net Thu Nov 1 11:32:20 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2007 10:32:20 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Max Mosley confirms he is a fool Message-ID: <20071101173620.MGVT22006.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> First Max is saying that Sir Jackie is crazy and now after seeing one of the closest fought F1 Championships in years and Max Mosley is complaining that Lewis Hamilton may be bad for the sport because he is too good. http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=41215 What an idiot. From markvaden at gmail.com Thu Nov 1 14:07:29 2007 From: markvaden at gmail.com (Mark Vaden) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 13:07:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Hi All, I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion on a tr4? I see that revington tr has a bolt on one, but it is really pricey. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks in advance, Mark From spitlist at cox.net Thu Nov 1 14:24:49 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 13:24:49 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <00e301c81cc5$40736ae0$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Not a TR4, but I did a two circuit setup on my Spit using two single circuit master cylinder tied together using the Tilton Balance bar. One side works the front disks and the other side works the rear drums. Works pretty well and wasn't terribly expensive to implement. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Vaden" To: Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 1:07 PM Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Hi All, > > I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, > and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion > on a tr4? I see that revington tr has a bolt on one, but it is really > pricey. Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > Thanks in advance, > Mark > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Fubog1 at aol.com Thu Nov 1 14:19:03 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:19:03 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/1/2007 4:07:44 PM Eastern Daylight Time, markvaden at gmail.com writes: I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion on a tr4? Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling cylinders, the same way it has been done for decades. I don't think there is such a thing as a bolt-in kit for these cars. Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From tr5racer at btinternet.com Thu Nov 1 14:27:43 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 20:27:43 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Max Mosley confirms he is a fool Message-ID: <704462.51653.qm@web86601.mail.ird.yahoo.com> What do you expect from someone whose father was the founder of the British Fascist party and in whose ranks were the notorious 'blackshirts' and who was interned for most of the Second World War as he supported Hitler and his policies. Mike Hughes --------------------------------- Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now. From henry at henryfrye.com Thu Nov 1 14:36:36 2007 From: henry at henryfrye.com (Henry Frye) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:36:36 -0400 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB4F@server.Triumph.local> > Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling > cylinders, the same way it has been done for decades. Of course Glen is right on the money. The only twist on the plot I have seen is taking a TR6 dual circuit master cylinder and a TR6 pedal box and fit it to the TR4. That's how my car was done, sans booster, and it stops fine. High pedal effort, but I like it that way. Front to rear bias can be changed with different sized rear wheel cylinders and/or messing around with the pad and shoe linings. From markvaden at gmail.com Thu Nov 1 14:36:51 2007 From: markvaden at gmail.com (Mark Vaden) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 13:36:51 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <285b8a860711011336o44ed58cbu2b52d806989d2dea@mail.gmail.com> > Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling cylinders, the same > way it has been done for decade Do I use the same bore cylinders? Meaning to I just use two stock tr4 brake master cylinders? -Mark From Fubog1 at aol.com Thu Nov 1 14:47:02 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:47:02 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/1/2007 4:37:13 PM Eastern Daylight Time, markvaden at gmail.com writes: Do I use the same bore cylinders? Meaning to I just use two stock tr4 brake master cylinders? Depending on what brakes you have, friction material, driver preference, etc you can play around with cylinder sizes .625, .70, .750 etc, & pedal ratio, to get the best setup. There's a good chance that you will wind up with the same diameter cylinders without extreme bias adjustment. Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Thu Nov 1 14:48:31 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 15:48:31 -0500 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: <285b8a860711011336o44ed58cbu2b52d806989d2dea@mail.gmail.com> References: <285b8a860711011336o44ed58cbu2b52d806989d2dea@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B3522F9@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I have one of the UK versions with a balance bar, I think it came from Racetorations, maybe TR Enterprises. It came with a remote resorvoir for the brakes like a TR3 so I switched out the M/C's for 3/4" Wildwood with the intregal caps like the CMC. Those cylinders are available for about $50 each from places like Speedway Motors. I don't know why this is true, but my virtually identical Girling CMC clouds up the fluid relatively quickly, but the Wildwoods stay crystal clear. I had the TR6 set-up on my old car and it worked fine. I think the TR4 bulkhead area where the booster mounts was re-inforced when they went to the TR25/TR6. I remember some extra flexing I worried about metal fatigue but never did anything about it. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Mark Vaden Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 3:37 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling cylinders, the > same way it has been done for decade Do I use the same bore cylinders? Meaning to I just use two stock tr4 brake master cylinders? -Mark Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From S.Janzen at comcast.net Thu Nov 1 14:52:16 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:52:16 -0400 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <011b01c81cc9$16a18ef0$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> I did the same thing Joe did, but with my GT6. You either need to be adept with a welder or know someone who is to modify the brake pedal and weld in the bias bar tube, and to build a new "box" to support the master cylinders. For the latter, I mocked something up out of posterboard, took it to a guy with a sheet metal brake and shear and he cut and bent the pieces to match my posterboard. I then pop riveted those together and had someone else weld it up. Looks a lot like what came from the factory under the hood of your TR4, but a little beefier (18 gauge ?) and holds three masters - one for the clutch and two for the brakes. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Vaden" To: Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 4:07 PM Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Hi All, > > I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, > and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion > on a tr4? I see that revington tr has a bolt on one, but it is really > pricey. Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > Thanks in advance, > Mark > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From adcronin at ameritech.net Thu Nov 1 15:22:34 2007 From: adcronin at ameritech.net (A Daniel Cronin) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 14:22:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB4F@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: <185909.13778.qm@web81311.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Or pop for one of the aftermarket brake bias valves offered by Moss and a number of the British suppliers, Revington, Cambridge, etc. Henry Frye wrote: > Local fabrication, a balance bar, & a couple of Girling > cylinders, the same way it has been done for decades. Of course Glen is right on the money. The only twist on the plot I have seen is taking a TR6 dual circuit master cylinder and a TR6 pedal box and fit it to the TR4. That's how my car was done, sans booster, and it stops fine. High pedal effort, but I like it that way. Front to rear bias can be changed with different sized rear wheel cylinders and/or messing around with the pad and shoe linings. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Planning & Development Services A. Daniel Cronin 248 761-2673 From markvaden at gmail.com Thu Nov 1 16:49:34 2007 From: markvaden at gmail.com (Mark Vaden) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 15:49:34 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <285b8a860711011549p3a0dacahf53242d3cf7ee1a9@mail.gmail.com> Thanks for all the the responses. I think I can fabricate something. Does anyone have a suggestion on bore sizes to start with. I am running stock TR4 front and rear brakes. Also, I would be interested in hearing what pads people are running? I have stock calipers, and drilled rotors. TIA, Mark From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 1 17:16:10 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 16:16:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> <285b8a860711011549p3a0dacahf53242d3cf7ee1a9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Personally, I like to use all the same size m/c for clutch, front and rear brakes so you only have to carry one spare rebuild kit and it's always the right one. .070 is a good midpoint size and you'll be able to get the bias adjusted without going to an extreme. Don't forget that you want some residual pressure on the disk pads, and don't forget that some M/Cs come with the residual pressure valve already in them. If you're going to use one for a clutch you have to take the M/C apart and remove the residual pressure valve or it will toast your thrust washers. You also probably don't want residual pressure on the back drums. Drilled rotors are a no-no with a lot of vintage racing organizations. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Mark Vaden Sent: Thu 11/1/2007 3:49 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Thanks for all the the responses. I think I can fabricate something. Does anyone have a suggestion on bore sizes to start with. I am running stock TR4 front and rear brakes. Also, I would be interested in hearing what pads people are running? I have stock calipers, and drilled rotors. TIA, Mark Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dkettler at powercom.net Thu Nov 1 18:32:31 2007 From: dkettler at powercom.net (David Kettler) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:32:31 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Just Sick - car stolen References: <8cbd782d0710291506i7942f068w6850ed865224c5e@mail.gmail.com><001101c81af9$4df35270$c59c3e4b@keng> <8cbd782d0710300812kfda4d80gc8882b9d9067a942@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <007201c81ce7$dbd9b440$091172d8@David> Chuck: Did the car have a logbook? Which race organization? Logbook number? This info may also be helpful to race organizations. I suspect that the chassis numbers are no longer there since it is a racecar. Dave Kettler ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chuck Arnold" To: "BFEKen at copper.net" ; "Friends" ; "Triumph" <6pack at autox.team.net> Sent: Tuesday, October 30, 2007 10:12 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Just Sick - car stolen > Unfortunately the trailer is as plain jane as you could get. I purposely > had no markings on it indicating a race car. It is white. It has a side > door [with the lock broken out]. The inside has gray vinyl flooring. The > front right plywood is broken and the outside bends out a little from > when > the car "got away inside one day" at bumper hight. > Plates are 4476 SW, Washington state. > > Here is what I psoted to our race group: > > This weekend my 16x7 White Road Force trailer was stolen from the 2400 > block > of Westlake Ave North in Seattle. My green 1968 Triumph TR5 race car was > inside. Car number is 444. Trailer license is 4476SW. If anyone gets a > wiff of these please notify the Seattle police. Case number is 07-441715. > > Pictures at: > http://picasaweb.google.com/Triosan/StolenTR5 > > > > On 10/30/07, BFEKen at copper.net wrote: >> >> Chuck, hopefully when the see the race car, they will dump it quick. >> >> KEN >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Chuck Arnold" >> To: "Friends" >> Sent: Monday, October 29, 2007 2:06 PM >> Subject: [Fot] Just Sick - car stolen >> >> >> > Came home from a 5 day trip to find only the remnants of the smashed >> > receiver lock where my trailer, containing my TR250 race car, was when >> > I >> > left. Hoped like hell it had been impounded for parking too long in a >> > city >> > lot [I live on a houseboat and the trailer lives in the lot where I >> park]. >> > No such luck. Police report filed, insurance claim in. >> > >> > Information: Trailer was a white 16x7 Road force. No exterior >> markings. >> > Car: BRG #444 TR5. Accusump and dual master cylinders under hood. >> > Battery >> > and cell in rear. Full cage. Stainless lines to the >> injectors. Mallory >> > distributor. Fabricated dash. No speedo. 4 speed, no OD. >> > >> > Photos at: >> > http://picasaweb.google.com/Triosan/StolenTR5 >> > >> > -- >> > Chuck Arnold >> > _______________________________________________ >> > http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > >> > bfeken at copper.net >> > Fot mailing list >> > Fot at autox.team.net >> > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> >> > > > -- > Chuck Arnold > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > dkettler at powercom.net > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From stlnyc at msn.com Thu Nov 1 19:32:43 2007 From: stlnyc at msn.com (Fred & Mary Hodgson) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:32:43 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Nomination Message-ID: I would like to nominate Fred Easton to our honorable [?] band. He has a pair of TR-6's & a Lotus Esprit that he drives to shows. Has no use for a car he can't drive, so there's no trailering or "car under glass" scenarios involved. Second anyone? e-mail is Benchmarkmap at charter.net Fred Hodgson From klynch_6 at msn.com Thu Nov 1 19:36:52 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:36:52 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Nomination References: Message-ID: I'll second that. Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: Fred & Mary Hodgson To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 7:32 PM Subject: [Fot] Nomination I would like to nominate Fred Easton to our honorable [?] band. He has a pair of TR-6's & a Lotus Esprit that he drives to shows. Has no use for a car he can't drive, so there's no trailering or "car under glass" scenarios involved. Second anyone? e-mail is Benchmarkmap at charter.net> Fred Hodgson _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From S.Janzen at comcast.net Thu Nov 1 19:38:51 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 21:38:51 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Kansas City Recommendations Message-ID: <014201c81cf1$1fb23d50$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> I'll be in Kansas City over the weekend - visiting an older uncle with my Mom. Any must-see sites and restaurant (lunch or dinner) recommendations that will satisfy both a vegetarian (+fish) and the rest of us? From wgrosenbach at juno.com Thu Nov 1 19:53:51 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:53:51 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Nomination Message-ID: <20071101.195351.2480.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Triumph & Lotus. That's a good combination. I'll second that. Bill On Thu, 1 Nov 2007 19:32:43 -0600 "Fred & Mary Hodgson" writes: > I would like to nominate Fred Easton to our honorable [?] band. He > has a pair > of TR-6's & a Lotus Esprit that he drives to shows. Has no use for > a car he > can't drive, so there's no trailering or "car under glass" scenarios > involved. > Second anyone? > > e-mail is > Benchmarkmap at charter.net > > Fred Hodgson > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tony at tonydrews.com Thu Nov 1 19:57:31 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Thu, 01 Nov 2007 20:57:31 -0500 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com > References: <285b8a860711011307t252f72e3i5da5bd78ba76024@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20071102025710.DA9AF187A1D@autox.team.net> Due to my roll bar arrangement, a tilton pedal assembly woudn't work, so we fabricated a knock off of the revington kit shown here: http://www.revingtontr.com/shop/mainframe.asp?http://www.revingtontr.com/shop/product_display.asp?a=2&mscssid=X0XP0W21QF6M9LLGCRJN3HAGCXN46V5D&SiteLanguage=eng&CarType=TR4&PageType=default&ProductID=RTR4080LAK (part number RTR4080LAK) The sheetmetal is basically the same arrangement as stock, but wider. There's a linkage to connect the stock brake pedal to the dual cylinders that works suprisingly well. You put a spacer on the bolt for the clutch cylinder to cover the new offset, and that works suprisingly well too. I have a different rear brake setup, so can't help with the bore size question, but since the stock system sent the same pressure to all wheels, I'd think the same size cylinders all around are appropriate. I used girling remote reservoir cylinders that I sourced from DRE, the formula vee folks. With several sets of balance bars with the center hole drilled in varying places, you can adjust the bias without having the cockpit adjustable deal that doesn't look very vintage. You need pretty short cylinders, so the normal Tilton master cylinders don't fit. I seem to remember them coming up with some shorty ones recently, though. I can send some pics of the arrangement if desired. We mocked it up and had a local fabricator actually made it. Looks like it belongs there. - Tony At 03:07 PM 11/1/2007, you wrote: >Hi All, > >I am working on setting up my tr4 to race next year on the west coast, >and I was wondering if anyone else has done a dual circuit conversion >on a tr4? I see that revington tr has a bolt on one, but it is really >pricey. Any suggestions would be appreciated. > >Thanks in advance, >Mark >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From triosan at gmail.com Thu Nov 1 21:56:10 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 20:56:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered today in a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from where I live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to force open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type trailer. Do not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to work hard to push it around with the welded diff. Can sell the wheels [Koenig rewinds in a brown color with nearly new 205x60x15 Yokohama A08s], fuel cell [new this year 12 gallon Fuel safe], fuel pump [Bosch 160 psi], regulator, aluminum radiator, Optima battery, Accusump and racing seat. Not much else. They will never get it started [broken throttle cable] as the PI is very tricky to get the cold start lever right, and even then it takes a lot of cranking. OH, I suppose they could also sell he Konis. I expect it will get stripped, chopped up and dumped in the Sound. Very sad end to such a pretty bridesmaid. She was ready to race, but has never done yet. None-the-less, I will find and/or build a replacement and have it ready for the SOVREN kick off in mid-April. Sigh. -- Chuck Arnold From N197TR4 at cs.com Fri Nov 2 06:58:04 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 08:58:04 EDT Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car Message-ID: Chuck! I admire your great attitude over the whole thing. I know the amount of effort that you have put into this car, since the time that Jan & I delivered this car to you, with a trip over the mountains. It occurs to me that, if these guys DID have any idea of this "TR5", it may be in a container headed for Japan or Australia with a buyer waiting at the other end. Of course, we are all standing by, to help get you back on the track. Joe Alexander > Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered today in > a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from where I > live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to force > open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type trailer. Do > not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to work hard > to push it around with the welded diff. > > Can sell the wheels [Koenig rewinds in a brown color with nearly new > 205x60x15 Yokohama A08s], fuel cell [new this year 12 gallon Fuel safe], > fuel pump [Bosch 160 psi], regulator, aluminum radiator, Optima battery, > Accusump and racing seat. Not much else. They will never get it started > [broken throttle cable] as the PI is very tricky to get the cold start lever > right, and even then it takes a lot of cranking. OH, I suppose they could > also sell he Konis. I expect it will get stripped, chopped up and dumped in > the Sound. Very sad end to such a pretty bridesmaid. She was ready to > race, but has never done yet. > > None-the-less, I will find and/or build a replacement and have it ready for > the SOVREN kick off in mid-April. Sigh. > > -- > Chuck Arnold > _______________________________________________ > From N197TR4 at cs.com Fri Nov 2 07:50:27 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 09:50:27 EDT Subject: [Fot] Piston Search Over Message-ID: Thanks for all of the kind and generous responses. I am back in business. Joe Alexander, MDD (Master's In Dumpster Diving) From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 2 08:17:17 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:17:17 EDT Subject: [Fot] Spit/GT6 valences Message-ID: Anybody know of a supplier that stocks the early Spit-GT6 front valences in fiberglass? My original is bent beyond reason and it's time for a replacement. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From herald948 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 08:29:25 2007 From: herald948 at aol.com (herald948 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 10:29:25 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Spit/GT6 valences In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8C9EB73E70F7076-1C0-11BB@WEBMAIL-MB02.sysops.aol.com> -----Original Message----- From: Gt6steve at aol.com Anybody know of a supplier that stocks the early Spit-GT6 front valences in fiberglass? My original is bent beyond reason and it's time for a replacement. ==AM== You might try Honeybourne Mouldings in the UK. --Andy Mace *Mrs Irrelevant: Oh, is it a jet? *Man: Well, no ... It's not so much of a jet, it's more your, er, Triumph Herald engine with wings. -- Cut-price Airlines Sketch, Monty Python's Flying Circus (22) Check out the North American Triumph Sports 6 (Vitesse 6) and Triumph Herald Database at its new URL: ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com From lunkercars at earthlink.net Fri Nov 2 09:37:40 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg Lunker Hilyer) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 09:37:40 -0600 Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <45ADFB6C-9ABC-4868-AFE8-E8BDAEE330C5@earthlink.net> Chuck, I'm still holding a candle of hope that your car will be recovered. Having lived many years in your area, I've got a couple ideas that may be worth pursuing. First is that South Seattle Auto Auction [Kent] and Puget Sound Auto Auction [Auburn] are both near where the trailer was found - in the years that I managed SSAA, we would occasionally find a stolen vehicle gathering dust in the dealer parking area. Police theory was that it was a inconspicuous area for auto activity to blend in. Also, if someone was trying to get the car transported somewhere, this is where many trucking companies stage their loads. Might be worth a drive by these places. Second would be to contact Cosmopolitan Motors [Seattle] and Park Place Motors [Bellevue]. Although neither would knowingly buy a stolen car, they do both occasionally deal with vintage race cars and so wouldn't be put off by a car without a title. If the car [or parts] are being offered around for sale, they [Cosmopolitan most likely] would probably have heard of it. Another to check with would be the British/German/Italian dismantler on Aurora Ave - Can't remember the name but do remember that they would buy most anything. As for the car being shipped out of the country, I would doubt it... Technically impossible without a title and too long a paper trail for thieves to deal with. If you want to cover all the bases, contact Broadway Title [www.broadwaytitle.com]. They are the largest provider of "alternate titles" around. If someone wanted to get a title to sell the car, it would likely go thru them. Make sure they [and the police report] get any #s you have [engine, body, commission, etc]. one number in the reporting may not be enough since there is always confusion as to what #s to use. Hope this may be of some help. Greg Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 1, 2007, at 9:56 PM, Chuck Arnold wrote: > Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered > today in > a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from > where I > live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to > force > open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type > trailer. Do > not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to > work hard > to push it around with the welded diff. From WEmery7451 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 10:34:30 2007 From: WEmery7451 at aol.com (WEmery7451 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:34:30 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/1/07 2:50:08 PM Pacific Standard Time, markvaden at gmail.com writes: << Does anyone have a suggestion on bore sizes to start with. I am running stoc k TR4 front and rear brakes.>> When I installed the Revington system several years ago when a dual system was required, two standard TR-3/4 brake master cylinders were furnished, along with a TR-4 clutch master cylinder (with the reservoir). Revington's instructions at that time said that no smaller bore master cylinders were made. Now I have heard that Tilton and others may make the smaller bore brake master cylinders. I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had to push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. It didn't take long to get use to this requirement, and in my opinion the system works very well. Don't accidentally take out that little balance valve for the front disc brakes. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 11:24:58 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:24:58 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: Message-ID: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin> I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much harder and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more control on the front/rear balance. Joe C. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:34 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had to > push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. From jfrymark at aol.com Fri Nov 2 11:21:23 2007 From: jfrymark at aol.com (John Frymark) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:21:23 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Kansas City Message-ID: Scott, My wife's from Kansas, so here are her suggestions: Restaurants: Plaza III (best steaks and fish, too. Very $$$), Hereford House (Harry Truman's favorite...steaks as the name implies), The Bristol in Leawood, italian food in Little Italy To do: The Plaza (hopefully the holiday lights are up) is tribute to Seville, Spain, Hall's Dept Store (a hobby of the "Hallmark" Family), Jazz (many places), Riverboat gambling. Nebraska is playing #8 (!) KU saturday so Lawrence (40 minutes away) will be a BIG PARTY! http://www.tripadvisor.com/Attractions-g44535-Activities-c7- Kansas_City_Missouri.html John Frymark (Flying the KU Flag this weekend) From Fubog1 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 11:29:47 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 13:29:47 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: You're splitting the force (pedal effort) between 2 cylinders. Obviously smaller cylinders will make for an easier pedal, with the increase in travel. Some of the modern friction materials are so effective, we can get by with larger cylinders. Glen In a message dated 11/2/2007 1:14:05 PM Eastern Daylight Time, spitlist at cox.net writes: I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much harder and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more control on the front/rear balance. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Fri Nov 2 11:49:58 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 10:49:58 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Corporate sponsorships for the owner/driver Message-ID: <000201c81d78$c9735900$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Vintage racers, I am seeking some opinions about corporate sponsorships for the cars and drivers in Vintage Racing. Major corporations already support the tracks and clubs. I have been testing the sponsorship waters for the sole purpose of covering travel and sign up expenses to such races as the GP at Watkins Glen and similar high profile races. For me, Watkins Glen is a 3,200 mile round trip and will take a week. Sebring, 3,800 miles, Laguna Seca, 2,500..enough about that said. I don't need to preach to any of you about the expenses of racing. I actually have a prospective sponsor that caters to primarily to the 45 & up crowd. My ( our ) problem is what I ( we ) have little to offer in return. I am certainly not talking about plastering the car with corporate logo's and creating a media circus like NASCAR et.al. Outside the vintage race magazines we get very little if any media coverage. The larger events such as Watkins Glen with the weekend festival offer more opportunity but there is still not a lot. For starters I would offer a catered hospitality tent in the pit. I think if more opportunities were created by the promoters and clubs we, the drivers, could attract some sponsors. I read some where that the GP at Watkins Glen had 60,000 spectators over three days in ' 04. As far as the small local events, I have no idea, my experience in Colorado is the overwhelming majority of the spectators are friends and family so sponsorship at a local level is tough at best. Vintage racing is not a " win at any cost " sport. There are no winners declared at the end of the day, no podium ceremonies and no winners circle. I think many potential sponsors can appreciate that and still participate as long as they can get some exposure and appreciation for their contribution. Many of you may remember the two E types fielded by Jaguar in 2003. The attached link is to an article in Automobile magazine is about Jaguars participation in Vintage racing and I consider it a pretty good read. http://www.automobilemag.com/features/racing/0408_jaguar_select/index.ht ml I have some ideas about how sponsors could benefit and still maintain the vintage spirit but I want to hear what other drivers and club representatives feel about the issue. I'm not looking for huge money to fund my car, I just think racing should be just a little easier for the regular guy or gal on a budget that wants to go racing and has the initiative to get a sponsor for tires, sign up fees or travel expenses. In Colorado we two tracks and four vintage events per year. I really want to get out East and West but it will be near impossible to do on my budget without some help and I know of many others in the same position. In the coming month, I will likely write to the editors of the vintage magazines for public critique. FoT your input would be appreciated and I hope I have not offended and gone against the Vintage spirit. Jim Gray RMVR From lang at isis.mit.edu Fri Nov 2 13:04:39 2007 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert Lang) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:04:39 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Fot] Corporate sponsorships for the owner/driver In-Reply-To: <000201c81d78$c9735900$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> References: <000201c81d78$c9735900$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: Hi, I'm hardly an expert on the matter, but my Vintage GCR which is used as the rules basis for most vintage racing bodies has a few references to sponsor material on the cars... like the 1967 GCR that limits ads to 20 square inches and "in good taste". As far as off the track sponsorship, the various activities like wine and cheese or barbeques, those could be made to work (easily), but you should talk to the event hosts as they'll probably want some return on such things. I actually find it fascinating that the '67 GCR cutoff has this advertising component. my $.02 rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Room N42-140Q | This space for rent Consultant MIT IS&T unix-linux-help | Voice:617-253-7438 FAX: 617-258-9535 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Fri Nov 2 13:06:22 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:06:22 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Message-ID: <003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> The pedal effort required to operate the brakes is determined by the area of the master cylinder or cylinders in relation to the area of the wheel cylinders or caliper pistons. So using two master cylinders of the same size gives WAY more piston area and the effort required will go up damatically. When we put a Tilton balance bar setup on Bill Fink's Morgan SLR a number of years ago we used two 5/8" masters and that still required more pedal effort than the stock single 3/4" master that a Morgan uses. I understand that someone, possibly Wilwood now makes 9/16" Master cylinders. They would be closer in total piston area the a singe 3/4 or .700" master. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Curry" To: ; ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 10:24 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 >I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master > cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much harder > and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual > circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more > control > on the front/rear balance. > > Joe C. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: ; > Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:34 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 >> I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had > to >> push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 13:35:06 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:35:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin> <003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> Message-ID: <007c01c81d87$78ec4640$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Unfortunately, unless you go to a different brand master cylinder, there are no options for Spitfires. The clutch and single circuit brake master cylinders have the same bore. But it does work pretty well as long as you remember that more effort is required. Bill B's comment about using the same size bore for both clutch and brake master cylinders is "Spot On" Keeps things simple. Joe C. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Solow" To: "Joe Curry" ; ; ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 12:06 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > The pedal effort required to operate the brakes is determined by the area of > the master cylinder or cylinders in relation to the area of the wheel > cylinders or caliper pistons. So using two master cylinders of the same size > gives WAY more piston area and the effort required will go up damatically. > When we put a Tilton balance bar setup on Bill Fink's Morgan SLR a number of > years ago we used two 5/8" masters and that still required more pedal effort > than the stock single 3/4" master that a Morgan uses. I understand that > someone, possibly Wilwood now makes 9/16" Master cylinders. They would be > closer in total piston area the a singe 3/4 or .700" master. From spreiss at verizon.net Thu Nov 1 22:18:38 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 15:18:38 +1100 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin> <003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> Message-ID: <002c01c81d07$71d796f0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Is it correct to assume that a single cylinder, dual piston master as commonly found in modern braking systems would similarly require increased pedal pressure? In any case, I'm not sure I understand the restrction on fitting such a master, sourced inexpensively from a Toyota for instance, when the rules seem to allow expensive custom systems from aftermarket manufacturers that were never available to racers "back in the day". Am I being naive? What also of employing brake boosters? They were available as early as 1969 or thereabouts if I'm not mistaken, and though obviously not used on the earlier cars have been fitted to them for street applications with good results for some time. Steve P ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg Solow" To: "Joe Curry" ; ; ; Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 6:06 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > The pedal effort required to operate the brakes is determined by the area of > the master cylinder or cylinders in relation to the area of the wheel > cylinders or caliper pistons. So using two master cylinders of the same size > gives WAY more piston area and the effort required will go up damatically. > When we put a Tilton balance bar setup on Bill Fink's Morgan SLR a number of > years ago we used two 5/8" masters and that still required more pedal effort > than the stock single 3/4" master that a Morgan uses. I understand that > someone, possibly Wilwood now makes 9/16" Master cylinders. They would be > closer in total piston area the a singe 3/4 or .700" master. > > Greg Solow > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Joe Curry" > To: ; ; > Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 10:24 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > > > >I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master > > cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much harder > > and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual > > circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more > > control > > on the front/rear balance. > > > > Joe C. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: > > To: ; > > Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:34 AM > > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > >> I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had > > to > >> push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Fubog1 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 13:33:10 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:33:10 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/2/2007 3:25:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time, spreiss at verizon.net writes: Is it correct to assume that a single cylinder, dual piston master as commonly found in modern braking systems would similarly require increased pedal pressure? It doesn't matter what flavor, size is size. As I mentioned previously pedal ratio is a big factor also. HTH Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 13:37:26 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:37:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: Message-ID: It's not a balance vbalve, it's a residual pressure valve. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of WEmery7451 at aol.com Sent: Fri 11/2/2007 9:34 AM To: markvaden at gmail.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In a message dated 11/1/07 2:50:08 PM Pacific Standard Time, markvaden at gmail.com writes: << Does anyone have a suggestion on bore sizes to start with. I am running stoc k TR4 front and rear brakes.>> When I installed the Revington system several years ago when a dual system was required, two standard TR-3/4 brake master cylinders were furnished, along with a TR-4 clutch master cylinder (with the reservoir). Revington's instructions at that time said that no smaller bore master cylinders were made. Now I have heard that Tilton and others may make the smaller bore brake master cylinders. I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I had to push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. It didn't take long to get use to this requirement, and in my opinion the system works very well. Don't accidentally take out that little balance valve for the front disc brakes. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tarch at bellsouth.net Fri Nov 2 13:46:53 2007 From: tarch at bellsouth.net (Richard Taylor) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:46:53 -0400 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <008201c81d89$1f0f98a0$8901a8c0@richardiipc> Bill, For those of us who don't know a residual valve from Shinola, what's it do? Although I've been told it is normal, I have never been able to get the front wheels of my TR-4 to rotate absolutely freely (while off the ground) without some pad drag. Richard atlanta It's not a balance vbalve, it's a residual pressure valve. From kaskas at cox.net Fri Nov 2 13:53:39 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:53:39 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin><003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> <002c01c81d07$71d796f0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <008701c81d8a$103fd410$0a10c548@RW> In 1969 I made up a dual brake system for the Competition Department TR-250. The booster chamber unit was removed. I used two 5/8" master cylinders and made my own pedal arm that had a 4.5 to 1 ratio. It worked so well we kept it on the TR-6 that replaced the TR-250 body and when I saw that car in 2002 at Mid-Ohio it still had the same pedal box I had made so long ago. It was the way that I recognized the car as being my old racer. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Preiss" To: "Greg Solow" ; "Joe Curry" ; ; ; Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 9:18 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Is it correct to assume that a single cylinder, dual piston master as > commonly found in modern braking systems would similarly require increased > pedal pressure? In any case, I'm not sure I understand the restrction on > fitting such a master, sourced inexpensively from a Toyota for instance, > when the rules seem to allow expensive custom systems from aftermarket > manufacturers that were never available to racers "back in the day". Am I > being naive? What also of employing brake boosters? They were available as > early as 1969 or thereabouts if I'm not mistaken, and though obviously not > used on the earlier cars have been fitted to them for street applications > with good results for some time. > Steve P > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Greg Solow" > To: "Joe Curry" ; ; > ; > Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 6:06 AM > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > > >> The pedal effort required to operate the brakes is determined by the area > of >> the master cylinder or cylinders in relation to the area of the wheel >> cylinders or caliper pistons. So using two master cylinders of the same > size >> gives WAY more piston area and the effort required will go up >> damatically. >> When we put a Tilton balance bar setup on Bill Fink's Morgan SLR a number > of >> years ago we used two 5/8" masters and that still required more pedal > effort >> than the stock single 3/4" master that a Morgan uses. I understand that >> someone, possibly Wilwood now makes 9/16" Master cylinders. They would be >> closer in total piston area the a singe 3/4 or .700" master. >> >> Greg Solow >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Joe Curry" >> To: ; ; >> Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 10:24 AM >> Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 >> >> >> >I noticed the same thing when I installed two Single circuit master >> > cylinders and the Tilton balance bar on my Spit. The petal is much > harder >> > and requires more effort to brake than before. I previously had a dual >> > circuit GT6 master cylinder installed and wanted to gain a bit more >> > control >> > on the front/rear balance. >> > >> > Joe C. >> > >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: >> > To: ; >> > Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:34 AM >> > Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 >> >> I was surprised the first time out on the track with this system. I > had >> > to >> >> push the brake peddle a lot harder to get the same effect. >> > _______________________________________________ >> > http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > >> > Fot mailing list >> > Fot at autox.team.net >> > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Fubog1 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 13:55:46 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:55:46 EDT Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 ps... Message-ID: In a message dated 11/2/2007 3:25:09 PM Eastern Daylight Time, spreiss at verizon.net writes: single cylinder, dual piston master as commonly found in modern braking systems Many dual circuit cylinders have stepped bores, at least on front disc/rear drum cars. This obviously affects the front/rear balance & displacement issues. Slight changes make big differences... Glen Richard the rpv is to keep very slight pressure in the system to minimize pad kickback ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From kaskas at cox.net Fri Nov 2 13:57:45 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 12:57:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <008201c81d89$1f0f98a0$8901a8c0@richardiipc> Message-ID: <00a801c81d8a$a2cb8b80$0a10c548@RW> When you stopped the car before jacking it up to test the wheel rotation the pressure was retained by the valve from that last braking effort. If you just pound your fist on the top (side) of the tire that will knock the pads back a bit and everything will be just dandy. The same thing happens when the car is running down the road, the bumps and side effort onto the tread keeps the pads back. The valve wants to help you not get pad knock-back. It works, kind of. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Taylor" To: "'Bill Babcock'" ; ; ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 12:46 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > Bill, > For those of us who don't know a residual valve from Shinola, what's it > do? > Although I've been told it is normal, I have never been able to get the > front wheels of my TR-4 to rotate absolutely freely (while off the ground) > without some pad drag. > > Richard > atlanta > > It's not a balance vbalve, it's a residual pressure valve. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 14:14:08 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 13:14:08 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <005a01c81d75$4b4bd820$2d02a8c0@Belkin><003201c81d83$75f37570$6401a8c0@TER2> <002c01c81d07$71d796f0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> <008701c81d8a$103fd410$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <00bd01c81d8c$ecfa1b20$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Kas, Isn't 5/8 the same size as the clutch and single circuit brake master used on early Spits? If so, that is the same bor I use on my Spit. Joe C. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kas Kastner" To: "Steven Preiss" ; "Greg Solow" ; "Joe Curry" ; ; ; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 12:53 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 > In 1969 I made up a dual brake system for the Competition Department TR-250. > The booster chamber unit was removed. I used two 5/8" master cylinders and > made my own pedal arm that had a 4.5 to 1 ratio. It worked so well we kept > it on the TR-6 that replaced the TR-250 body and when I saw that car in 2002 > at Mid-Ohio it still had the same pedal box I had made so long ago. It was > the way that I recognized the car as being my old racer. From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 14:35:32 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 13:35:32 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Alonzo and McLaren part ways Message-ID: <00dd01c81d8f$ea5c3760$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Today, I see that what I guess we all knew was inevitable was made official. Alonzo's contract is not being renewed for 2008. It was stated as "A mutual parting of ways", but I think that there is no way that Ron Dennis would bring him back next season considering all the complaining and lack of team effort that Alono diaplayed over the course of this season, not to mention the Stepneygate affair. Which makes one wonder which branch Alonzo will alight on next season. I will be watchng very closely to see who wil take him. Joe C. From jfrymark at aol.com Fri Nov 2 14:51:10 2007 From: jfrymark at aol.com (John Frymark) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 13:51:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing Message-ID: <3AE98E65-A2E1-4847-BCC2-C0A191DF5D66@aol.com> While the topic of Corporate Sponsorship in vintage racing can be viewed (critiqued?) in many ways, there is a tax implication that should be considered. I am no tax expert. I looked into something similar a while ago so I can offer these comments. A sponsor can justify their expenditure as advertising expense if it meets basic "smell tests", i.e. an activity that gets their name or product in front of their target market generating sales and/or goodwill. A for-profit entity receiving this sponsorship treats it as income. Unfortunately, it is impossible to claim that amateur vintage racing by itself, with no prize money, is a for-profit activity. It is therefore considered a hobby and "There is a one-way tax rule for hobbies: Income from a hobby is taxable as "other income" on form 1040; EXPENSES ARE DEDUCTIBLE ONLY TO THE EXTENT YOU REPORT HOBBY INCOME, and the deduction is limited on Schedule A by the 2% adjusted gross income (AGI) floor for miscellaneous deductions. Hobby losses are considered NONDEDUCTIBLE PERSONAL LOSSES. A profitable sale of hobby collection or activity held long term is taxable as a capital gain; losses are NOT deductible." JK Lasser's federal Tax Guide 2003 As we have all seen at Vintage Races, some participants have "sponsorship" by their own businesses. Gil Nickels' Far Niente Winery brought the transporter, cars, support crew, hospitality tent... the whole nine. I am sure this was all part of the winery advertising budget and assets of the business. Generally, the nature of hobby racing makes our expenses purely out-of-pocket...unless we have a sideline income producing business that benefits from our racing activities. Maybe some other FOTers want to weigh in here. From REK46 at aol.com Fri Nov 2 14:52:51 2007 From: REK46 at aol.com (REK46 at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 16:52:51 EDT Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing Message-ID: That's the same in SCCA racing as well....unless YOU or DADDY own the business,you can't write off racing unless it has potential for earnings ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From tr5racer at btinternet.com Fri Nov 2 15:00:30 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 21:00:30 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Update on stolen TR5 race car Message-ID: <750090.19142.qm@web86602.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Commiserations to you Chuck on the theft of your TR5 race car. I know I would be gutted if anything like that happened to my TR5. Strangely in the UK in the 23 years that the TR Register Race Championship has been run I don't ever remember any driver having there TR race car stolen and not recovered. A few years back a couple of the race guys had their trailers stolen with their race cars on them and in both cases the cars were found abandoned later minus the trailer! I don't think that was any reflection on the condition of the cars, just that the trailers were easier to dispose of. Hope you are successful in recovering it. Mike Hughes --------------------------------- For ideas on reducing your carbon footprint visit Yahoo! For Good this month. From kaskas at cox.net Fri Nov 2 16:49:53 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 15:49:53 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys Message-ID: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. From kaskas at cox.net Fri Nov 2 17:27:06 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 16:27:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Message-ID: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box and worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase the ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the other ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 17:41:08 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 16:41:08 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <20071102234552.IZDZ9726.fed1rmmtao101.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Who is going to write a letter to Ralf? HeHe... At 03:49 PM 11/2/2007, Kas Kastner wrote: >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. From spreiss at verizon.net Fri Nov 2 02:43:47 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 19:43:47 +1100 Subject: [Fot] tr 3/4 brakes Message-ID: <008a01c81d2c$7c4b8630$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Is there a published detailed explanation of the state of the art brake hydraulic system for these cars? I know that there are many elements of the system that have not been touched on in this thread, and that the overall performance depends on total engineering (been studying Lotus literature!). All things working in consort, I'm beginning to understand, from the coefficient of friction of the pedal pads to the stiffness of the front spindles to the tire compound, and everything in-between. Guess that's what makes building an effective racing car such a demanding (and rewarding?) undertaking, and also explains the appeal to many of spec racing. From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 17:59:42 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 16:59:42 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <000601c81dac$6f85cfc0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball numbers! By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas Kastner Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 2 18:07:09 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 17:07:09 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <000701c81dad$7a4159b0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Wait, I see you already speculated on who replaces button. So who goes to Renault to replace Heikki? It is already speculated that Alonzo goes back to Renault (If Flav will take him back) but that still leaves an open seat there since I am guessing Fisichella will not retain his seat? (This is all very confusing!) :) I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball numbers! By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas Kastner Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 18:09:01 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:09:01 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <000601c81dac$6f85cfc0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> <000601c81dac$6f85cfc0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: <20071103001319.VODC27287.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Rumor (and Kas indicated too) had Rosberg headed that way At 04:59 PM 11/2/2007, Joe Curry wrote: >I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that >you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball >numbers! > >By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? > >Joe C. > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net >[mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas >Kastner >Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys > >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button >goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the >post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 18:12:18 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:12:18 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <000701c81dad$7a4159b0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> <000701c81dad$7a4159b0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: <20071103001639.CBGG21541.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Flav is still his manager. Renault has indicated that their drivers are "not" equal and Heikki wants to be equal. Indications he might to McLaren http://www.f1i.com/content/view/8756/1/ At 05:07 PM 11/2/2007, Joe Curry wrote: >Wait, I see you already speculated on who replaces button. So who goes to >Renault to replace Heikki? It is already speculated that Alonzo goes back >to Renault (If Flav will take him back) but that still leaves an open seat >there since I am guessing Fisichella will not retain his seat? > >(This is all very confusing!) :) > > >I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that >you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball >numbers! > >By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? > >Joe C. > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net >[mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas >Kastner >Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys > >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button >goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the >post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Fri Nov 2 19:22:13 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 18:22:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys Message-ID: <002d01c81db7$f6dd0640$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Maybe Ralph will join JPM , Scott Speed and Jack V in Nascar, what a hoot that would be. jim g From chasgee at aol.com Fri Nov 2 18:46:15 2007 From: chasgee at aol.com (chasgee at aol.com) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 20:46:15 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction In-Reply-To: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> References: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <8C9EBCA130939AA-8EC-1D2E@FWM-D44.sysops.aol.com> Just don't let it happen again.... Chuck -----Original Message----- From: Kas Kastner To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 4:27 pm Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box and worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase the ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the other ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com From jibjib at att.net Fri Nov 2 19:15:44 2007 From: jibjib at att.net (Jack Brooks) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 18:15:44 -0700 Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d0711012056naaff266q24187e66986a8355@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <02ae01c81db7$0fbbb680$cb01a8c0@HPPavilion> Chuck, I live in Covington. Please email me with more specifics on the location so both I and my realtor wife can keep our eyes open. She is out in the car all day and knows TR's. Jack -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+jibjib=att.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+jibjib=att.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Chuck Arnold Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2007 8:56 PM To: Friends; Triumph; Triumph List Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered today in a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from where I live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to force open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type trailer. Do not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to work hard to push it around with the welded diff. Can sell the wheels [Koenig rewinds in a brown color with nearly new 205x60x15 Yokohama A08s], fuel cell [new this year 12 gallon Fuel safe], fuel pump [Bosch 160 psi], regulator, aluminum radiator, Optima battery, Accusump and racing seat. Not much else. They will never get it started [broken throttle cable] as the PI is very tricky to get the cold start lever right, and even then it takes a lot of cranking. OH, I suppose they could also sell he Konis. I expect it will get stripped, chopped up and dumped in the Sound. Very sad end to such a pretty bridesmaid. She was ready to race, but has never done yet. None-the-less, I will find and/or build a replacement and have it ready for the SOVREN kick off in mid-April. Sigh. -- Chuck Arnold Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From koblinger at verizon.net Fri Nov 2 19:17:38 2007 From: koblinger at verizon.net (Kurt Oblinger) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 18:17:38 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <472BCC32.9030103@verizon.net> My $.02, Alonso and Rosberg swap seats. I've read rumors that part of the deal for Dennis to let Alonso go was that he not go to a manufacturer team. Then Mc-Merc would have a British and a German driver. Cheers, Kurt O. Kas Kastner wrote: >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From cak at dimebank.com Fri Nov 2 19:36:47 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 18:36:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [Fot] tr 3/4 brakes Message-ID: <200711030136.lA31al0F002983@moose.dimebank.com> You could start with Fred Puhn's "Brake Handbook" ... From budscars at msn.com Fri Nov 2 19:42:14 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (CHARLES DELAUER) Date: Sat, 03 Nov 2007 01:42:14 +0000 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys In-Reply-To: <20071103001319.VODC27287.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: Hi gang..report from The CSRG Race at Thunderhill...Incredible Weather...75-80 degrees at 6pm...The Triumphs that i saw today(I was teching) Racer Bud's Spitfire(Me)..John James' TR4...Gary Horskorta's Tr4..Jeff Abramson's Morgan Super sport....Bill Hart's Triumph special(I saw it in the transporter while I was teching other stuff)....more Tr Stuff may show up tomorrow Racer Bud and...THE OLD GUYS STILL DUMB ENOUGH TO RACE CHALLENGE Gang....Whooohoo! Racer Bud >From: "David W. Riddle" >To: >Subject: Re: [Fot] F-1 guys >Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:09:01 -0700 > >Rumor (and Kas indicated too) had Rosberg headed that way > >At 04:59 PM 11/2/2007, Joe Curry wrote: > >I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that > >you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball > >numbers! > > > >By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his >seat? > > > >Joe C. > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net > >[mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas > >Kastner > >Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM > >To: fot at autox.team.net > >Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys > > > >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button > >goes > >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the > >post > >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 2 20:15:14 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 22:15:14 EDT Subject: [Fot] Fwd: FW: A few more pics...engine bay detail & original patina Message-ID: Amici, this is an attachment leading to a few pics of the magnificent Kastner-Brophy GT6 now for sale after restoration. I know virtually nothing of this car beyond that Kas has said it's the one and I have perceived that he loved it. Can we as a group watch it and document it, storing any pics available and welcoming the new owner to our ranks? This is a significant bit of of Kas history so please keep track of it if you can. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Return-Path: Received: from rly-md10.mx.aol.com (rly-md10.mail.aol.com [172.20.29.148]) by air-md02.mail.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILINMD022-92b472b9d8c8a; Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:58:57 -0400 Received: from xmail2.uslec.net (xmail2.uslec.net [209.92.156.55]) by rly-md10.mx.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINMD103-92b472b9d8c8a; Fri, 02 Nov 2007 17:58:36 -0400 Received: (qmail 4822 invoked from network); 2 Nov 2007 17:58:37 -0400 Received: from rrcs-24-123-183-46.se.biz.rr.com (HELO DF7B6GC1) (24.123.183.46) by ridgelakefamilymedicine.com with SMTP; 2 Nov 2007 17:58:29 -0400 Reply-To: From: "Brian Simpson" To: Subject: FW: A few more pics...engine bay detail & original patina Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 17:58:25 -0400 Organization: Casa Fiora Message-ID: <00d201c81d9b$7f5396a0$6400a8c0 at DF7B6GC1> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 thread-index: AcescrdgKbM1wj90TBqcbRLsGEuZ5RxJonaA X-AOL-IP: 209.92.156.55 X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_helo : X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_822_from : X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/mixed by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Brian Simpson Casa Fiora 704.367.9646 704.367.9648 fax www.casafiora.com -----Original Message----- From: Kent S. Bain [mailto:kent at auto-restore.com] Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2007 2:47 PM To: brian.simpson at casafiora.com Cc: 1-A Kent @home; Brian Rechtiene (BRIAN RECHTIENE); Donna Boccuzzi; Kariann Santarsiero; Taffy Richter 11-04 (Taffy); Tim Richey Subject: A few more pics...engine bay detail & original patina Brian... The subject says it all. __________ NOD32 2325 (20070612) Information __________ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6 (3).JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6 (4).JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6.JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6 (1).JPG] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of Choniere GT-6 (2).JPG] From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 21:15:36 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 20:15:36 -0700 Subject: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 References: <008201c81d89$1f0f98a0$8901a8c0@richardiipc> Message-ID: It makes your pads drag--really. A residual pressure valve temporarily maintains some pressure on the calipers after you lift your foot. When you step on your brakes the pistons inside the calipers press the pads against the disk, These pistons are free to slide forward past the seals as the pads wear, which is why there is no adjustment for disk brakes--they self adjust as the pads wear. The pistons are pulled back away from the disk by the spring tension of the neoprene seals. Essentially the seal sticks to the piston a bit, and when you release the pedal the seal lips pull the piston back. Problem is that the lips may pull it too far back, or the disk might have a little excess runout, so the piston gets pulled back too far, and you have to pump the brakes to get the pads back in contact with the disk. A residual pressure valve maintains some of the pressure against the piston, preventing the piston from fully retracting or getting pushed back by disk runout. They hold about ten or fifteen pounds of pressure in the line. Eventually the pressure leaks away, but while you're driving that pressure is pretty much always applied, so your pads drag a little bit. I know it seems like that would be a bad thing, but it's not. The small amount of braking force applied keeps the pads slightly warm, causes no appreciable wear, and off-gasses the material on the surface--all good stuff. The only time isn't not so good is when you screw up and get fifteen pounds of line pressure applied to a drum brake, which is adjusted close to the drum to begin with, and winds up heating the drums and causing fade, or you have a residual pressure valve in a clutch M/C, which keeps pressure applied to the throwout bearing, which toasts the bearing and can ruin your crankshaft thrust washers. Five pounds residual pressure (or none) is about right for a drum brake. -----Original Message----- From: Richard Taylor [mailto:tarch at bellsouth.net] Sent: Fri 11/2/2007 12:46 PM To: Bill Babcock; WEmery7451 at aol.com; markvaden at gmail.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] dual circuit brakes on a tr4 Bill, For those of us who don't know a residual valve from Shinola, what's it do? Although I've been told it is normal, I have never been able to get the front wheels of my TR-4 to rotate absolutely freely (while off the ground) without some pad drag. Richard atlanta It's not a balance vbalve, it's a residual pressure valve. From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 21:25:10 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 20:25:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing References: <3AE98E65-A2E1-4847-BCC2-C0A191DF5D66@aol.com> Message-ID: The fundamental trick is to have the company doing the sponsorship belong to you. Then you can treat the sponsorship as an advertising expense and have all the depreciable assets belong to the company. I investigated all the aspects of this, and decided it wasn't worth the effort for the relatively small expenditures I was making in racing. It's audit bait--and the IRS will be counting your socks and shorts. In truth, I should have gone ahead and done it--I have the world's most tedious accountant, who keeps everything squeaky clean while still ensuring that no expense goes unreported. The IRS has come visiting on two occasions, and left with their tails between their legs both times. I actually had one auditor tell me he would NEVER audit our company again. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of John Frymark Sent: Fri 11/2/2007 1:51 PM To: toodamnfunky at comcast.net Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing While the topic of Corporate Sponsorship in vintage racing can be viewed (critiqued?) in many ways, there is a tax implication that should be considered. I am no tax expert. I looked into something similar a while ago so I can offer these comments. A sponsor can justify their expenditure as advertising expense if it meets basic "smell tests", i.e. an activity that gets their name or product in front of their target market generating sales and/or goodwill. A for-profit entity receiving this sponsorship treats it as income. Unfortunately, it is impossible to claim that amateur vintage racing by itself, with no prize money, is a for-profit activity. It is therefore considered a hobby and "There is a one-way tax rule for hobbies: Income from a hobby is taxable as "other income" on form 1040; EXPENSES ARE DEDUCTIBLE ONLY TO THE EXTENT YOU REPORT HOBBY INCOME, and the deduction is limited on Schedule A by the 2% adjusted gross income (AGI) floor for miscellaneous deductions. Hobby losses are considered NONDEDUCTIBLE PERSONAL LOSSES. A profitable sale of hobby collection or activity held long term is taxable as a capital gain; losses are NOT deductible." JK Lasser's federal Tax Guide 2003 As we have all seen at Vintage Races, some participants have "sponsorship" by their own businesses. Gil Nickels' Far Niente Winery brought the transporter, cars, support crew, hospitality tent... the whole nine. I am sure this was all part of the winery advertising budget and assets of the business. Generally, the nature of hobby racing makes our expenses purely out-of-pocket...unless we have a sideline income producing business that benefits from our racing activities. Maybe some other FOTers want to weigh in here. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 21:29:32 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 20:29:32 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys References: <014e01c81da2$af347fe0$0a10c548@RW><000601c81dac$6f85cfc0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> <20071103001319.VODC27287.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: Lots of Newbies in the wings, and with Hamilton's success the floodgates should open. Of course McLaren has been grooming Hamilton since he was thirteen, but the me-toos won't care. No question that Renault would take Alonso back--they already said it publically. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle Sent: Fri 11/2/2007 5:09 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] F-1 guys Rumor (and Kas indicated too) had Rosberg headed that way At 04:59 PM 11/2/2007, Joe Curry wrote: >I am saving this email for future reference. If indeed it turns out that >you are 100 percent correct, I will be asking you for the Power Ball >numbers! > >By the way, If Button goes to McLaren, who goes to Honda to take his seat? > >Joe C. > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net >[mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas >Kastner >Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 3:50 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] F-1 guys > >Okay, so Fernando goes back to Renault, Keikki goes to Honda, and Button >goes >to McLaren. All Brit drivers then at McLaren, Ralf Schumacher goes to the >post >office to check his mail. Williams is now ready for a newbie. >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Fri Nov 2 22:04:20 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 00:04:20 EDT Subject: [Fot] honeybourne Message-ID: In a message dated 11/2/2007 8:35:37 AM Pacific Standard Time, fot-request at autox.team.net writes: > You might try Honeybourne Mouldings in the UK. > > Known locally (in the UK) as 'Funnybourne mouldings' L From triosan at gmail.com Fri Nov 2 22:40:00 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 21:40:00 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction In-Reply-To: <8C9EBCA130939AA-8EC-1D2E@FWM-D44.sysops.aol.com> References: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> <8C9EBCA130939AA-8EC-1D2E@FWM-D44.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711022140k6375779y388b32095f94f122@mail.gmail.com> probably cannot help it, as he [and me] forget to remember not to! On 11/2/07, chasgee at aol.com wrote: > > Just don't let it happen again.... > > > > Chuck > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Kas Kastner > To: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 4:27 pm > Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction > > > > > Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box > and > worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase > the > ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the > other > ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 > pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - > http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > -- Chuck Arnold From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 2 22:49:58 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 21:49:58 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing References: <004001c81dd6$5187cbc0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: I probably should just let this lie, but I hate to see a fellow FOTer walking into a buzz saw. Having done marketing for most of my adult life, I'll tell you that's a lot of work for $5K. And that's not because marketers are overpaid--it's work even when you're good at it. If you could do a catered hospitality tent for that then more power to you, never mind the rest. I've done a race for two years (the Columbia River Classic here in Portland) and acquired sponsors for charity. We collected about $50K in sponsorships and counted ourselves lucky to clear $10K for the charity. Even though we had food donations we didn't have enough, and people went hungry. Good thing we had lots of Kona beer. I had to personally donate $5K for the raffle prize to clear that (it wasn't unexpected). I'm not trying to discourage you, just to tell you that it's a heck of a lot of work and more expenses everywhere than you'd expect. One small example--most tracks have concessionaires. Doing your own catering can be a challenge, hiring a caterer is absolutely out. You have to use the concessionaire, and that's expensive and not good. Tracks and racing organizations expect to get a piece of anything commercial. It's tricky to fly under that radar without setting up a confrontation that can be very embarrassing for your sponsor, so you have to cross all the I's and dot the T's. There is a book on how to manage sponsorship for racing--I never bought it but I flipped through it. I'd start there with someone who has already gone through the grief. The problem with these kind of things is that there is a huge difference between entertaining a few friends at the track informally, and trying to do something similar for money. The stakes and the complexities rise exponentially, and if you can't get enough budget to actually do it right, then it fails. I've done these kind of things with professionals helping me (indispensable) and I'm pretty good at a number of the elements myself, and I'd tell you everything is much harder than you think, takes ten times longer and costs five times more. Give it a go, but be careful, and do your best not to set expectations you can't meet. From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 22:57:31 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 21:57:31 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing In-Reply-To: References: <3AE98E65-A2E1-4847-BCC2-C0A191DF5D66@aol.com> Message-ID: <20071103050150.SILY18576.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> At 08:25 PM 11/2/2007, Bill Babcock wrote: >The fundamental trick is to have the company doing the sponsorship belong to >you. Then you can treat the sponsorship as an advertising expense and have all >the depreciable assets belong to the company. I investigated all the aspects If you have your own company do what I have done. I sponsored another guys car and he had his company sponsor mine. From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Sat Nov 3 00:27:05 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Fri, 2 Nov 2007 23:27:05 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <005d01c81de2$8dec09d0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> You could be right Bill. I understand how things can spiral out of control. As far as catering is concerned I was planning on catering for the sponsors guests only. Tent passes would be issued and limited to 30 or so.Watkins Glen has no problem with that, I just have to clear it with SVRA. The Saturday FoT party in our pit is on me and lasts until the beer runs out. The sponsor will have people there to manage and entertain their guests with me popping in and out as I attend to my own racing issues. Plus there will be others there that could represent the " the team" and help with the sponsor. It sounds like your event was much larger anything I'm planning. Again, you may be right as I have not heard from all my prospective suppliers for catering, graphics & RV rental yet.I don't want to over commit and will try to be conservative. I will find that book you refered to and if things start to get too complex then I will bag the idea. By profession I am a construction project manager so I will certainly apply my planning, budgeting and risk management skills to the project with guarded opitimism. Keep it simple ( as it can be ). If you spent $40K that must have been one hell of an event, how many people did you entertain? Jim G -----Original Message----- From: Bill Babcock [mailto:BillB at bnj.com] Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 9:50 PM To: Bill Babcock; James Gray Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing I probably should just let this lie, but I hate to see a fellow FOTer walking into a buzz saw. Having done marketing for most of my adult life, I'll tell you that's a lot of work for $5K. And that's not because marketers are overpaid--it's work even when you're good at it. If you could do a catered hospitality tent for that then more power to you, never mind the rest. I've done a race for two years (the Columbia River Classic here in Portland) and acquired sponsors for charity. We collected about $50K in sponsorships and counted ourselves lucky to clear $10K for the charity. Even though we had food donations we didn't have enough, and people went hungry. Good thing we had lots of Kona beer. I had to personally donate $5K for the raffle prize to clear that (it wasn't unexpected). I'm not trying to discourage you, just to tell you that it's a heck of a lot of work and more expenses everywhere than you'd expect. One small example--most tracks have concessionaires. Doing your own catering can be a challenge, hiring a caterer is absolutely out. You have to use the concessionaire, and that's expensive and not good. Tracks and racing organizations expect to get a piece of anything commercial. It's tricky to fly under that radar without setting up a confrontation that can be very embarrassing for your sponsor, so you have to cross all the I's and dot the T's. There is a book on how to manage sponsorship for racing--I never bought it but I flipped through it. I'd start there with someone who has already gone through the grief. The problem with these kind of things is that there is a huge difference between entertaining a few friends at the track informally, and trying to do something similar for money. The stakes and the complexities rise exponentially, and if you can't get enough budget to actually do it right, then it fails. I've done these kind of things with professionals helping me (indispensable) and I'm pretty good at a number of the elements myself, and I'd tell you everything is much harder than you think, takes ten times longer and costs five times more. Give it a go, but be careful, and do your best not to set expectations you can't meet. From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 2 23:31:36 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 02 Nov 2007 22:31:36 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Sponsorship of Vintage Racing In-Reply-To: References: <004001c81dd6$5187cbc0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: <20071103053553.HNIA21541.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> At 09:49 PM 11/2/2007, Bill Babcock wrote: >I probably should just let this lie, but I hate to see a fellow FOTer walking >into a buzz saw. Something else you could look at trying that might be a simple way to start and avoid the buzz saw. I put together a rough prospectus like this once and never had the time to pursue it. Bill is right that the amount of time and energy to put this together by yourself might be better spent with a part time job as a greeter at Walmart to earn the extra cash. Seriously though if your potential sponsor is close to you geographically you might want to try this... Leave the vintage events for you to concentrate on you and your car. Of course you can have guests but if you don't have a "staff" to see to your guests they might feel short changed with your attention if you are having to work on the car to make the next session/race. Instead look at using the Street car DE sessions with local groups like NASA, etc. Put a passenger seat in your car (if it does not have one currently) and allow the sponsor to bring people like guests (his vendors, customers) or employees to reward them. At an event like that you are not stressed and you can socialize with your sponsor and his gusts between sessions and take them for rides on the track. Probably take at least four passengers during the event. From tlizzard at msn.com Sat Nov 3 08:09:12 2007 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:09:12 -0400 Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys Message-ID: The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's Championship. And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. We have done it before. Terry Stetler From Fubog1 at aol.com Sat Nov 3 08:14:53 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:14:53 EDT Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION Message-ID: In a message dated 11/3/2007 10:09:21 AM Eastern Daylight Time, tlizzard at msn.com writes: The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's Championship. And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. We have done it before. This is really sad. I tell myself it is because there isn't enough $$ to be made (yeah, right...). I would like to think that we COULD do it... Glad you brought it up Terry, Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From Group44TR7 at aol.com Sat Nov 3 08:25:21 2007 From: Group44TR7 at aol.com (Group44TR7 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:25:21 EDT Subject: [Fot] Southern Califonia transport to Watkins Glen Message-ID: Good Morning If there are any FOT people who would be interested in having their cars transported to and from San Diego area to Watkins Glen and back by commercial carrier, please let me know. The proposal to the carrier will probably be loading and unloading at one (San Diego) or two (San Diego, LA) locations in S. California. I have not started talking with carrier yet, so I don't have any guess at the price. Based on past experience, I expect its going to be in the $3,000 per car range for transport there and back. Cary ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From BillDentin at aol.com Sat Nov 3 08:27:25 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:27:25 EDT Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Message-ID: In a message dated 11/02/2007 6:46:41 PM Central Standard Time, chasgee at aol.com writes: > Just don't let it happen again.... > > It's not an OPTION. You get to a certain age and "I forgot" comes with the turf. I know...I'm there. Bill Dentinger. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Nov 3 08:43:13 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:43:13 EDT Subject: [Fot] Fwd: FW: A few more pics...engine bay detail & original patina Message-ID: Dang, I forgot about the anti-attachment clause. I will put the pics on Photobucket.Com in the album called GT6Steve. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From kaskas at cox.net Sat Nov 3 08:47:19 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 07:47:19 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION References: Message-ID: <008401c81e28$6fc892c0$0a10c548@RW> There is so much money involved in the "Crash and Bash" racing in this country and poor feeder systems with no defined route to the top levels, gaining a spot in F-1 will be next to impossible for years to come unless a guy goes to Europe in the teens and STAYS there. Maybe a fellow could buy his way in as so many have, but that precludes a requirement for talent, thus, backmarker. We can't even keep a F-1 race in this country, poor state of affairs. There is an excuse for our system or lack of system. That is the huge size of the USA. It would be like all of Europe speaking the same language, hopeless. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 7:14 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION > In a message dated 11/3/2007 10:09:21 AM Eastern Daylight Time, > tlizzard at msn.com writes: > > The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American > drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's > Championship. > And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. > > We have done it before. > This is really sad. > I tell myself it is because there isn't enough $$ to be made (yeah, > right...). > I would like to think that we COULD do it... > Glad you brought it up Terry, > Glen > > > > > > ************************************** See what's new at > http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jerrybarr at charter.net Sat Nov 3 09:30:14 2007 From: jerrybarr at charter.net (Jerry Barr) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 10:30:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: What were we talking about? I FORGOT. On Nov 3, 2007, at 9:27 AM, BillDentin at aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 11/02/2007 6:46:41 PM Central Standard Time, > chasgee at aol.com writes: > > >> Just don't let it happen again.... >> >> > > It's not an OPTION. You get to a certain age and "I forgot" comes > with the > turf. I know...I'm there. > > Bill Dentinger. > > > > ************************************** > See what's new at http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sat Nov 3 09:54:53 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 08:54:53 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000a01c81e31$dfff9940$2202a8c0@newcomputer> It probably has a lot to do with the distance and the numbers. Since there is plenty of racing in the US, most of the quality drivers stay here rather than going to Europe where you have to be in F1. Very little time is spent during the year outside if that general area and precious little in the US (Even less next season) While the money is good, the odds are not so good of one getting in since there are so few seats available. That can be a deterrent to someone who can make all the money he can spend here in the US of A. I will be interested to see how Sebastian Bordais does next year driving for Toro Rosso. If they can get the aerodynamics right on that car, with Ferrari power, he should be competitive. Joe -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Fubog1 at aol.com Sent: Saturday, November 03, 2007 7:15 AM To: tlizzard at msn.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] F1 Guys GOOD QUESTION In a message dated 11/3/2007 10:09:21 AM Eastern Daylight Time, tlizzard at msn.com writes: The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's Championship. And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. We have done it before. This is really sad. I tell myself it is because there isn't enough $$ to be made (yeah, right...). I would like to think that we COULD do it... Glad you brought it up Terry, Glen ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From hottr6 at hotmail.com Sat Nov 3 10:08:07 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 12:08:07 -0400 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Message-ID: Kas Kastner wrote: > Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box and > worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase the > ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the other > ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 > pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. When I built my brake system, I computed the numbers for a stock TR6 brake system without the servo and a pedal ratio of 4.36 (rather than the paltry stock 3.5). 110 lbs of foot pressure (appropriate for "emergency" braking) on this pedal gives a theoretical pressure at the pads of 1259 pounds. 700 pounds at the pads requires around 60 lbs of foot pressure. But this is all theoretical and the real world does include a lot of losses. I stayed with a ratio of 4.36 because I am running Wilwood 4-pots on 11"-13" vented rotors all round. Unsprung weight for this (and Southwick hubs) is the same as the stock brakes. For a good treatise on modern and racing brake technology, I use Mavrigian and Carley's "Brake Systems", published by HP Books. Dated 1998 so it is a bit old, but non-computerized off-the-shelf systems have not changed much since then. Shane Ingate at 7,500' in NM. _________________________________________________________________ Boo! Scare away worms, viruses and so much more! Try Windows Live OneCare! http://onecare.live.com/standard/en-us/purchase/trial.aspx?s_cid=wl_hotmailne ws From BillB at bnj.com Sat Nov 3 10:24:57 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sat, 3 Nov 2007 09:24:57 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys References: Message-ID: I was at a party the other day and said something about F1. No one knew what I was talking about. Imagine that happening in Brazil or Europe. The current level of F1 requires a perfect storm of talent, experience, equipment, politics, money, sponsorship, physical attributes and mental toughness. The only way to make a winning F1 driver now is to grow a whole bunch of them and pick the best. We don't have the interest in the US. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Terry Stetler Sent: Sat 11/3/2007 7:09 AM To: fot Subject: [Fot] F1 Guys The really sad and astonishing thing to me is that there are no American drivers of a high enough calibre to contest for the Driver's Championship. And I know that there must be some who could do it in today's climate. We have done it before. Terry Stetler Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Sat Nov 3 17:45:51 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Sat, 03 Nov 2007 16:45:51 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Posted a bunch of TR Documents and manuals Message-ID: <20071103235017.JCQZ12415.fed1rmmtao104.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Some of our club members have contributed a BUNCH of TR manuals and documentation in PDF format on our club's website. They are located in our Articles/Documents category section. http://www.dctra.org/?cat=11 Plus we have over 450 pictures from the recently concluded 2007 edition of Triumphest. http://www.dctra.org/?page_id=22 From gkbyrne at optushome.com.au Mon Nov 5 00:47:34 2007 From: gkbyrne at optushome.com.au (Geoffrey Byrne) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 18:47:34 +1100 Subject: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car References: Message-ID: <009e01c81f80$229f7690$24acefdc@co3017577a> Chuck I doubt it will turn up in Aus it will stand out as we say "like dogs balls ". i will put the word out to warn all the Triumph guys here in AUS . If something sus turns up all FOT will hear about it Sorry to hear of your loss good luck with MK2 Geoff Byrne TR6 Racer Down Under PS can you please resend me the pics of the car we will get it in our mags and on WEB sites just to cover all bases ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; <6pack at autox.team.net>; Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 11:58 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] update on my stolen TR5 race car > Chuck! > > I admire your great attitude over the whole thing. I know the amount of > effort that you have put into this car, since the time that Jan & I delivered this > car to you, with a trip over the mountains. > > It occurs to me that, if these guys DID have any idea of this "TR5", it may > be in a container headed for Japan or Australia with a buyer waiting at the > other end. > > Of course, we are all standing by, to help get you back on the track. > > Joe Alexander > > > > Well, much to my surprise, the trailer stolen Sunday was recovered today in > > a quiet residential neighborhood in Kent, Wa, about 20 miles from where I > > live in Seattle. Sadly, no car. Thieves went to a lot of work to force > > open the drop down back door of the enclosed Wells Cargo type trailer. Do > > not know what they are possibly going to do with it. Sure had to work hard > > to push it around with the welded diff. > > > > Can sell the wheels [Koenig rewinds in a brown color with nearly new > > 205x60x15 Yokohama A08s], fuel cell [new this year 12 gallon Fuel safe], > > fuel pump [Bosch 160 psi], regulator, aluminum radiator, Optima battery, > > Accusump and racing seat. Not much else. They will never get it started > > [broken throttle cable] as the PI is very tricky to get the cold start lever > > right, and even then it takes a lot of cranking. OH, I suppose they could > > also sell he Konis. I expect it will get stripped, chopped up and dumped in > > the Sound. Very sad end to such a pretty bridesmaid. She was ready to > > race, but has never done yet. > > > > None-the-less, I will find and/or build a replacement and have it ready for > > the SOVREN kick off in mid-April. Sigh. > > > > -- > > Chuck Arnold > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Mon Nov 5 07:05:50 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 08:05:50 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction In-Reply-To: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> References: <015501c81da7$e1f1c000$0a10c548@RW> Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B39F39E@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I don't know about anyone else but I'd love to hear a full explanation of how to set up the pedal ratio to the best effect in a TR. I have the TR Enterprises dual 5/8" set-up with balance bar and I am struggling with pedal feel and front-rear balance. I have to stomp so hard it is difficult to not lock them up. Uphill I lock the rears, downhill the fronts. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kas Kastner Sent: Friday, November 02, 2007 6:27 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Pedal ratio correction Jimmy Coan just called me and reminded me that when I did that pedal box and worked out the pedal ratio that it was WRONG and that I had to increase the ratio to 7 to 1 as we could only get about 700 pounds pressure with the other ratio of 4.5. With the corrected ratio the pressure went right up to 1500 pounds. My excuse is: I FORGOT. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From clarkfot at cwnicholls.net Mon Nov 5 07:41:28 2007 From: clarkfot at cwnicholls.net (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 09:41:28 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil - FW: Rotella Ask Our Expert Message-ID: <005001c81fb9$f479c150$1342a8c0@semperon3400> I don't know what the consensus was on the engine oil thread previously in this group... I was at the SEMA show last week and spoke to the Shell Answer person there, he told me more than I could retain!! Here is an email I got in reply to my inquiry on the rotella website to the answer man (see last portion). I would think that pertinent questions can be referred back to Richard Moore at Shell... Clark Clark W. Nicholls -----Original Message----- From: AskShell at Shell.com [mailto:AskShell at Shell.com] Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 9:21 AM To: cwnicholls at aol.com Subject: RE: Rotella Ask Our Expert: Other Clark, Rotella T with Triple Protection 15W-40 CJ-4 has approximately 1200 ppm zinc. This is 50% more zinc than current passenger car motor oils (API SM/ILSAC GF-4) which contain approximately 800 ppm zinc. Passenger car motor oils had approximately 1200 ppm zinc prior to 2001. In 2001 the zinc was reduced to 1000 ppm and in 2005 reduced again to the current 800 ppm. Thus, the new Rotella T with Triple Protection 15W-40 CJ-4 has the same zinc content that passenger car motor oils had in 2000 before the current problems with flat tappet engines began. http://www.shellusserver.com/products/pdf/RotellaT(CJ-4).pdf If you have any additional questions, please call us at 1-800-231-6950. Thank you for your interest in Shell products. Richard Moore Staff Engineer Shell Global Solutions (US) Inc. Westhollow Technology Center, PO Box 4327, Houston, TX 77210, United States of America -----Original Message----- From: cwnicholls at aol.com [mailto:cwnicholls at aol.com] Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 8:24 AM To: askshell, SLUBE-GSMR/5 Subject: Rotella Ask Our Expert: Other ------------------------------------------------ ROTELLA.com E-mail Form ------------------------------------------------ NAME Clark W. Nicholls E-MAIL ADDRESS cwnicholls at aol.com SUBJECT Other COMMENTS ---------------------------------------------- I spoke with one of you at the SEMA show Friday in the final hour of the show concerning Rotella and old British cars with flat tappet cams (brought on by the change in chemicals in the oils, phosphorous, zink, etc). He mentioned that there is information on this subject on the rotella website, but I need help in finding this. I would like to pass this information on to my Triumph compatriots ASAP as there is much discussion on this subject in the Triumph automobile racing group. ---------------------------------------------- From SpiwakD at aol.com Mon Nov 5 13:03:08 2007 From: SpiwakD at aol.com (SpiwakD at aol.com) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 15:03:08 EST Subject: [Fot] TR head ID Message-ID: I am looking at a TR head and cannot remember how to tell if it is a small-port one, which I believe is the best one to use. Any help? ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From twakeman at razzolink.com Mon Nov 5 16:00:26 2007 From: twakeman at razzolink.com (TeriAnn Wakeman) Date: Mon, 05 Nov 2007 15:00:26 -0800 Subject: [Fot] TR head ID In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <472FA08A.30801@razzolink.com> SpiwakD at aol.com wrote: > I am looking at a TR head and cannot remember how to tell if it is a > small-port one, which I believe is the best one to use. Any help? I wrote a web page about that once: www.tjwakeman.net/TR/FAQ_heads.htm TeriAnn From Gt6steve at aol.com Mon Nov 5 18:10:54 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 20:10:54 EST Subject: [Fot] Larger Valves? Message-ID: Yeah, he's right in the narrow perspective. Just keep in mind these are all V-8 guys telling us how to build. Our machines don't necessarily fit their formulas. Take Chebbie builders with a grain of salt.... ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From BillB at bnj.com Mon Nov 5 19:04:56 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 18:04:56 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Larger Valves? References: Message-ID: Although I have to say, if you want to see how an engine can really be built, there's nothing like the V8 guys. They've been working around limitations for eons, and they build pushrod motors with outputs that Formula One can't diss. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Gt6steve at aol.com Sent: Mon 11/5/2007 5:10 PM To: S.Janzen at comcast.net Cc: FOT at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Larger Valves? Yeah, he's right in the narrow perspective. Just keep in mind these are all V-8 guys telling us how to build. Our machines don't necessarily fit their formulas. Take Chebbie builders with a grain of salt.... ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wgrosenbach at juno.com Mon Nov 5 19:14:06 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 19:14:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil - FW: Rotella Ask Our Expert Message-ID: <20071105.191424.3080.3.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Always impressed with the Rotella. Used it in a Renault 17 that I occasionally flogged up the west side of I-70's Johnson tunnel approach. Oil temp ran much cooler than Valvoline 20W50. It also looked the same after the abuse, where the Valvoline darkened considerably. Would like to have known about it back when I ran the high compression 2.5 L 6 in my GT-6. Bill From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Mon Nov 5 20:39:01 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 22:39:01 EST Subject: [Fot] Engine Oi Message-ID: In a message dated 11/5/2007 10:59:43 AM Pacific Standard Time, fot-request at autox.team.net writes: > Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 09:41:28 -0500 > From: "Clark W. Nicholls" > Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil - FW: Rotella Ask Our Expert > To: > Message-ID: <005001c81fb9$f479c150$1342a8c0 at semperon3400> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > > I don't know what the consensus was on the engine oil thread previously in > this group... > > I was at the SEMA show last week and spoke to the Shell Answer person there, > he told me more than I could retain!! > > Here is an email I got in reply to my inquiry on the rotella website to the > answer man (see last portion). > > I would think that pertinent questions can be referred back to Richard Moore > at Shell... > > Clark > Clark W. Nicholls > -----Original Message----- > From: AskShell at Shell.com [mailto:AskShell at Shell.com] > Sent: Monday, November 05, 2007 9:21 AM > To: cwnicholls at aol.com > Subject: RE: Rotella Ask Our Expert: Other > > Clark, Rotella T with Triple Protection 15W-40 CJ-4 has approximately 1200 > ppm zinc. This is 50% more zinc than current passenger car motor oils (API > SM/ILSAC GF-4) which contain approximately 800 ppm zinc. Passenger car motor > oils had approximately 1200 ppm zinc prior to 2001. In 2001 the zinc was > reduced to 1000 ppm and in 2005 reduced again to the current 800 ppm. > > Thus, the new Rotella T with Triple Protection 15W-40 CJ-4 has the same zinc > content that passenger car motor oils had in 2000 before the current > problems with flat tappet engines began. > > http://www.shellusserver.com/products/pdf/RotellaT(CJ-4).pdf > > If you have any additional questions, please call us at 1-800-231-6950. > Thank you for your interest in Shell products. > > Richard Moore > Staff Engineer > Shell Global Solutions (US) Inc. > Westhollow Technology Center, PO Box 4327, Houston, TX 77210, United States > of America > > -----Original Message----- > From: cwnicholls at aol.com [mailto:cwnicholls at aol.com] > Sent: Sunday, November 04, 2007 8:24 AM > To: askshell, SLUBE-GSMR/5 > Subject: Rotella Ask Our Expert: Other > > ------------------------------------------------ > ROTELLA.com E-mail Form > ------------------------------------------------ > NAME Clark W. Nicholls > E-MAIL ADDRESS cwnicholls at aol.com > SUBJECT Other > COMMENTS > ---------------------------------------------- > I spoke with one of you at the SEMA show Friday in the final hour of the > show concerning Rotella and old British cars with flat tappet cams (brought > on by the change in chemicals in the oils, phosphorous, zink, etc). He > mentioned that there is information on this subject on the rotella website, > but I need help in finding this. I would like to pass this information on > to my Triumph compatriots ASAP as there is much discussion on this subject > in the Triumph automobile racing group. Rotella is known to be OK, insofar as the ZDDP content is concerned, but unfortunately it is not available in the 20W/50 viscosity recommended for most Triumphs. Leon From ablake2 at austin.rr.com Mon Nov 5 22:32:57 2007 From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com (Greg & Alison Blake) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 23:32:57 -0600 Subject: [Fot] looking for carbs Message-ID: <000201c82036$7d4955a0$6401a8c0@blake1> Anyone have a set of HS6's for sale? Thanks, Greg From clarkfot at cwnicholls.net Mon Nov 5 21:59:58 2007 From: clarkfot at cwnicholls.net (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 23:59:58 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001c01c82031$e2f56b00$1342a8c0@semperon3400> The Shell person also said that 20-50 is not required. That's soooo old news... I've been using non-synthetic 10-40 for years (street Spitfire) and he said I should be using 10-30 If you want to ask about that, drop him an email! Clark -=-=-= Rotella is known to be OK, insofar as the ZDDP content is concerned, but unfortunately it is not available in the 20W/50 viscosity recommended for most Triumphs. Leon From jimhearn1 at comcast.net Mon Nov 5 22:55:58 2007 From: jimhearn1 at comcast.net (jim hearn) Date: Mon, 5 Nov 2007 21:55:58 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Looking for a centerline to measure toe Message-ID: <001601c82039$b41244e0$171a694c@computer> Does anyone have any thoughts on where and how to best locate a centerline on the car in order to measure toe. I have a '74 TR6 but I'm sure there would be commonality among lots of cars. Jim in Sacramento [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] From wgrosenbach at juno.com Tue Nov 6 07:28:10 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 07:28:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil Message-ID: <20071106.073013.2420.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> >>>I've been using non-synthetic 10-40 for years (street Spitfire) and he said I should be using 10-30. The only engine I ever lost on the street from a bearing related issue was while using 10W40. Usually ran 20W50, changed in the fall, then chased the Colorado 1000 (Grand) around the state in my '76 Spitfire. Spent quite a bit of time running flat out. In a Spitfire, your not that afoul of the law running flat out. Survived that, but not the drive down I-25 to Pueblo for a SCCA race. The engine started producing a hammering noise, (which turned out to be a rod bearing cap on #3 that was coming adrift and finally got out far enough for a bolt head to hit the block). Oil pressure never got low enough to light the lights. Stopped, pulled the dip stick, NOTHING on the stick, but it was not completely dry. After getting the race event towing guy to get the car to the track, I again pulled the dipstick. Full, to the mark. The oil got hot enough to become thin enough to leave only a trace film on the stick. The bearing got hammered into a multi layered thin blue band wrapped around the journal. Some small engine manufacturers will not warranty their products if 10W40 oil is used in them. Was my failure related to having sucked it full of water one time? Possibly, but I have never seen any other oil get that thin in any other application. Had to have contributed, though. I have much more faith in 10W30. Always amazed at the difference in engine sound and power output after changing from a SAE 40, to a 20W50, in the 2.5 L 6. Without a proper windage in the pan, a hard braking move with SAE 40 in the pan would wrap all the oil around the crank, bringing the engine to a halt, requiring the better part of a minute to be restarted. The 15W40 is a nice compromise. Bill From Fubog1 at aol.com Tue Nov 6 07:54:54 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 09:54:54 EST Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil Message-ID: ... a 1500 Spitfire... flat-out...failure of #3 big end... 'nuff said... Glen In a message dated 11/6/2007 9:33:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, wgrosenbach at juno.com writes: The only engine I ever lost on the street from a bearing related issue was while using 10W40. Usually ran 20W50, changed in the fall, then chased the Colorado 1000 (Grand) around the state in my '76 Spitfire. Spent quite a bit of time running flat out. In a Spitfire, your not that afoul of the law running flat out. Survived that, but not the drive down I-25 to Pueblo for a SCCA race. The engine started producing a hammering noise, (which turned out to be a rod bearing cap on #3 ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 6 08:30:06 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 06 Nov 2007 08:30:06 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil Message-ID: <20071106153403.KOTS29613.fed1rmmtao106.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Nice long Article about this topic on our club site. I tried to send the text of the article to the list but it got bounced as being to big. http://www.dctra.org/?p=79 From kaskas at cox.net Tue Nov 6 08:36:19 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 07:36:19 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil References: Message-ID: <001a01c8208a$c6dcbd70$3f0ec548@RW> If you do not fix the oil passages in the 1500 crank it will fail, sometimes sooner than later. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Cc: ; Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2007 6:54 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Engine Oil > ... a 1500 Spitfire... flat-out...failure of #3 big end... > > 'nuff said... > Glen > > > In a message dated 11/6/2007 9:33:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, > wgrosenbach at juno.com writes: > > The only engine I ever lost on the street from a bearing related issue > was while using 10W40. Usually ran 20W50, changed in the fall, then > chased the Colorado 1000 (Grand) around the state in my '76 Spitfire. > Spent quite a bit of time running flat out. In a Spitfire, your not that > afoul of the law running flat out. Survived that, but not the drive down > I-25 to Pueblo for a SCCA race. The engine started producing a hammering > noise, (which turned out to be a rod bearing cap on #3 > > > > > > > ************************************** See what's new at > http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 6 08:58:20 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 07:58:20 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Engine Oil References: Message-ID: I pretty much thought the same thing. Not something I'd blame on oil. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Fubog1 at aol.com Sent: Tue 11/6/2007 6:54 AM To: wgrosenbach at juno.com; clarkfot at cwnicholls.net Cc: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Engine Oil ... a 1500 Spitfire... flat-out...failure of #3 big end... 'nuff said... Glen In a message dated 11/6/2007 9:33:02 AM Eastern Standard Time, wgrosenbach at juno.com writes: The only engine I ever lost on the street from a bearing related issue was while using 10W40. Usually ran 20W50, changed in the fall, then chased the Colorado 1000 (Grand) around the state in my '76 Spitfire. Spent quite a bit of time running flat out. In a Spitfire, your not that afoul of the law running flat out. Survived that, but not the drive down I-25 to Pueblo for a SCCA race. The engine started producing a hammering noise, (which turned out to be a rod bearing cap on #3 ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tlizzard at msn.com Tue Nov 6 16:06:29 2007 From: tlizzard at msn.com (Terry Stetler) Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2007 18:06:29 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Spoke with Dave at Red Line Oil today. Message-ID: What with all the confusion about our favorite non alcoholic fluid I figured I go to the source. (Or at least one of the sources). Dave (sorry I'm really terrible with names so the his last name is lost to me...) is the guy who mans Red Line's technical help phone line. I'll cut to the chase here. Red Line's "straight weight" (they do behave as multi grades and say so on the bottle) racing synthetic oils have 2400ppm of the zinc anti wear goo in them. (ZDDP). Red Line's multi grade synthetic street oils have 1200ppm. Thought you all might be interested. Terry Stetler From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 6 19:18:49 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 06 Nov 2007 19:18:49 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica Message-ID: <20071107022354.OVRI29613.fed1rmmtao106.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> The best video yet that I have seen of the last lap battle between Massa and Kubica in the rain. Incredible close driving with neither driver giving more then the fraction of an inch that they needed to give. http://vimeo.com/348198/ From jaboruch at netzero.net Tue Nov 6 20:57:02 2007 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 03:57:02 GMT Subject: [Fot] TR4 front suspension Message-ID: <20071106.225702.3977.1@webmail15.dca.untd.com> I am looking to change my front suspension over to coil overs and tubular A-arms. Considering still using the TR4 uprights ( to make hubs and brakes easier to fit, since they will just swap over), but replacing the trunion with a rod end to be more like a ball joint. Has anyone on the list successfuly done a conversion like this? Any idea what the thread on the bottom of the upright actually is supposed to be? The one that I measures looks like a 13/16 - 10 American Standard special thread, but not sure if it was a Whitworth or Acme thread originally and just got worn to look like it does now? I also have a TR6 part, but it has a 9 thread per inch thread that looks like an Acme thread, but does not match up to any Acme thread in my machinists handbook. The TR6 thread is 0.905 inch diameter, which is not quite 15/16 (0.9375"). My handbook does list a 15/16 - 9 American standard thread, but the threads are so flat that they look more like an Acme. Perhaps they are worn flat? Joe(B) _____________________________________________________________ Get the competitive advantage you need with great fish finders. Click now! http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2211/fc/Ioyw6ijnGFrzBAD6yzDDE9S9J8wRv7 mbXwV2iHhGFnQMiqI7EE56Tw/ From jsnook at wcnet.org Wed Nov 7 09:36:32 2007 From: jsnook at wcnet.org (Jeff Snook) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 11:36:32 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets Message-ID: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to remember something posted awhile ago. Thanks, Jeff Snook http://www.snooksdreamcars.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Wed Nov 7 09:49:13 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 11:49:13 EST Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets Message-ID: Uncle Jack....only thing that worked with my headers. > Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to > remember something posted awhile ago. > > Thanks, > > Jeff Snook > http://www.snooksdreamcars.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > From tedtsimx at bright.net Wed Nov 7 10:31:32 2007 From: tedtsimx at bright.net (Ted Schumacher) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 12:31:32 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets In-Reply-To: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> References: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> Message-ID: <4731F674.5070500@bright.net> Jeff Snook wrote: > Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to > remember something posted awhile ago. > > Thanks, > > Jeff Snook > http://www.snooksdreamcars.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > Jeff, buy some header gasket material. You can get this at a speed shop. Trace your OE gaskets on this and head for the Exacto knife. Header gasket material is thicker and also has some give.this allows gasket material to conform to the variations in header flange. Ted -- Ted Schumacher tedtsimx at bright.net http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com 108 S. Jefferson St. Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Wed Nov 7 11:17:13 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 12:17:13 -0600 Subject: [Fot] coated bearings Message-ID: <200711071815.lA7IFLP7292896@ns3.geneseo.net> Here's a link to Calico Coatings. They are the company that does my machine shop's coatings. I highly recommend this process -- the performance advantages described on this web site are really true. I have two sets of bearings at their place right now. (no financial interst) http://www.calicocoatings.com/bearings.html uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Wed Nov 7 11:20:37 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 12:20:37 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets In-Reply-To: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> References: <00b801c8215c$5b9d9160$6401a8c0@JeffSnook> Message-ID: <200711071818.lA7IIigk280532@ns3.geneseo.net> At 10:36 AM 11/7/2007, Jeff Snook wrote: >Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to >remember something posted awhile ago. Yep - I've got them. Im having them made specially for us by a major gasket company . Compacted graphite, 1/8" thick, compresses to half the thickness, good for 2000 deg F. Shape slightly modified to make them better. Kinda pricey at $66.95 including shipping because of low production but they solve the problems. >Thanks, > >Jeff Snook >http://www.snooksdreamcars.com >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From S.Janzen at comcast.net Wed Nov 7 12:39:02 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 14:39:02 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets Message-ID: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or TR6 with a double row chain will work. From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 7 14:52:43 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 13:52:43 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica References: <20071107022354.OVRI29613.fed1rmmtao106.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> Message-ID: wow, Kubica is NUTS. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle Sent: Tue 11/6/2007 6:18 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica The best video yet that I have seen of the last lap battle between Massa and Kubica in the rain. Incredible close driving with neither driver giving more then the fraction of an inch that they needed to give. http://vimeo.com/348198/ Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Wed Nov 7 16:23:45 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 16:23:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] If more politicians thought like this... Message-ID: <20071107233753.PYCW18043.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> ...the world would be a better place! http://msn.foxsports.com/other/story/7417982?MSNHPHCP>1=10637 British govt. minister quits to race cars LONDON (AP) - A British government minister has stepped down to follow his dream of becoming a race car driver. Lord Drayson, Britain's defense procurement minister, is taking an indefinite leave of absence to compete in the American Le Mans series, Prime Minister Gordon Brown's office said Wednesday. Paul Drayson, 47, a former pharmaceuticals entrepreneur appointed to the House of Lords in 2004, said last year that he took up competitive motor racing as part of a "mid-life crisis." Drayson, who competes in a bioethanol-fueled Aston Martin, qualified for the U.S. competition by placing second at this year's British GT championship. Drayson was appointed to the Ministry of Defense in 2005 by then-Prime Minister Tony Blair to oversee Britain's $30 billion military hardware budget. In a letter to Brown, Drayson described the chance to compete as a "once-in-a-lifetime opportunity" and "a key step towards my eventual dream of success in the Le Mans 24-hour endurance race." The American Le Mans Series, a North American counterpart to the famous French endurance race, announced earlier this year that almost all its cars would race on biofuel. From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Wed Nov 7 16:42:41 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 15:42:41 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets References: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: <018301c82197$e3728290$1b02a8c0@workstation3> Vernier cam sprocket works nicely, Spitfire, TR6, GT6. TMG1225 Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Janzen" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 11:39 AM Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From koblinger at verizon.net Wed Nov 7 16:56:02 2007 From: koblinger at verizon.net (koblinger at verizon.net) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 17:56:02 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica Message-ID: <13351872.7181061194479762451.JavaMail.root@vms075.mailsrvcs.net> Good, maybe even great, but not as great as Villeneuve - Arnoux..... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sDtn8QnpFg Cheers, Kurt O. >From: Bill Babcock >Date: 2007/11/07 Wed PM 03:52:43 CST >To: "David W. Riddle" , fot at autox.team.net >Subject: Re: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica >wow, Kubica is NUTS. > > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle >Sent: Tue 11/6/2007 6:18 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica > >The best video yet that I have seen of the last lap battle between >Massa and Kubica in the rain. Incredible close driving with neither >driver giving more then the fraction of an inch that they needed to give. > >http://vimeo.com/348198/ >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Wed Nov 7 19:02:42 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 19:02:42 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment Message-ID: <001001c821ab$72d8e380$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Has anyone had any experience with cryo treating. I read enough good stuff about I had it done to all my bearings rods, crank, flywheel, cam & chain tensioner. Crank & rods were shot peened & mag'd too. It was cheap anough and local so I just went for it. Any feedback or prior experience ? Jim G From dave at microworks.net Wed Nov 7 18:11:56 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 18:11:56 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica In-Reply-To: <13351872.7181061194479762451.JavaMail.root@vms075.mailsrvc s.net> References: <13351872.7181061194479762451.JavaMail.root@vms075.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <20071108012957.UNER2804.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> I don't know. I remember thinking during the race and watching the battle live on Speed that this surpassed the Gille v. Rene battle. After all, Massa and Kubica were going at it in the rain on full wet tires! At 04:56 PM 11/7/2007, you wrote: >Good, maybe even great, but not as great as Villeneuve - Arnoux..... > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6sDtn8QnpFg > >Cheers, >Kurt O. > > >From: Bill Babcock > >Date: 2007/11/07 Wed PM 03:52:43 CST > >To: "David W. Riddle" , fot at autox.team.net > >Subject: Re: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica > > >wow, Kubica is NUTS. > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle > >Sent: Tue 11/6/2007 6:18 PM > >To: fot at autox.team.net > >Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica > > > >The best video yet that I have seen of the last lap battle between > >Massa and Kubica in the rain. Incredible close driving with neither > >driver giving more then the fraction of an inch that they needed to give. > > > >http://vimeo.com/348198/ > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Wed Nov 7 18:44:42 2007 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (steve) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 17:44:42 -0800 (GMT-08:00) Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment Message-ID: <16511563.1194486282792.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net> I'm from Wisconsin so my TR3 has been cryo treated for 40 winters :) ~Steve -----Original Message----- >From: James Gray >Sent: Nov 7, 2007 6:02 PM >To: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment > >Has anyone had any experience with cryo treating. I read enough good >stuff about I had it done to all my bearings >rods, crank, flywheel, cam & chain tensioner. Crank & rods were shot >peened & mag'd too. >It was cheap anough and local so I just went for it. Any feedback or >prior experience ? >Jim G >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jaboruch at netzero.net Wed Nov 7 19:27:08 2007 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 02:27:08 GMT Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment Message-ID: <20071107.212708.29942.0@webmail20.dca.untd.com> I have found that cryo treated brake rotors are much less prone to cracking than non treated ones, but that is about the best experience that I have found. It should help billet cranks, but should not do much for cast cranks. I have spoken to metalurgists about cryo treatment and for things like steel crankshafts and rods the treatment basically makes up for a bad heat treatment job. If a part was properly heat treated there should be no reason to cryo treat it. Cryo treatment coverts retained austinite (which is undesirable) to martinsite (desirable). This is because the austinite was not coverted during heat treatment. Cryo treatment is not enough on its own, since the part may be left too brittle. Parts should be tempered after Cryo treatment. There does not appear to be any good reason why cryo works for brake rotors, but it does. Also, not sure why it would do anything for bearing shells, blocks or pistons. I have heard from the cryo treaters that for pistons and blocks the treatment serves to stress relieve the part. I am not quite convinced that it is worth doing blocks, pistons, bearings, rings, etc. How many engine failures are there that stress relieving would have stopped? If I have a block failure it is because a rod went through it because of a head gasket leak or valve failure. Any piston failures have been because of an errant valve or detonation, not just a breakdown of the piston. That's my 2 cents on the topic. Joe(B) -- "James Gray" wrote: Has anyone had any experience with cryo treating. I read enough good stuff about I had it done to all my bearings rods, crank, flywheel, cam & chain tensioner. Crank & rods were shot peened & mag'd too. It was cheap anough and local so I just went for it. Any feedback or prior experience ? Jim G Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _____________________________________________________________ Click to find local singles for dating, romance and fun. http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2211/fc/Ioyw6ijm1qSyAJZsz0b2FuGNGsKzUg v964jdqBOMwhceal2PkgnRSd/ From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Wed Nov 7 19:37:01 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 20:37:01 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets References: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: <003601c821b0$3f4ed1f0$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> British Parts Northwest has them: Click here for bigger image Product Name: Cam Gear Vernier TR250-TR6 Our Price: $192.86 Availability: In Stock Product Number: TMG1225 Product Weight: 2.75 lb. Rating: Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Janzen" To: Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 1:39 PM Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a > Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of TMG1225_m.jpg] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/gif which had a name of star.gif] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/gif which had a name of halfstar.gif] From spyderweb at uwalumni.com Wed Nov 7 20:20:35 2007 From: spyderweb at uwalumni.com (spyderweb at uwalumni.com) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 21:20:35 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Massa v. Kubica Message-ID: <20071107212035.uf204jyl0gk8wgs8@secure.uwalumni.com> Quoth Bill Babcock: >> >wow, Kubica is NUTS. Perhaps... and being nuts is not a good thing. But letting everyone else on the track THINK you're nuts is a definite advantage :-) Jim Hill From klynch_6 at msn.com Wed Nov 7 20:53:50 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 20:53:50 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment References: <001001c821ab$72d8e380$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: Jim, did my front rotors as a test and have been pleasantly surprised. Kevin ----- Original Message ----- From: James Gray To: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 7:02 PM Subject: [Fot] Cryo treatment Has anyone had any experience with cryo treating. I read enough good stuff about I had it done to all my bearings rods, crank, flywheel, cam & chain tensioner. Crank & rods were shot peened & mag'd too. It was cheap anough and local so I just went for it. Any feedback or prior experience ? Jim G _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vintage.racer at comcast.net Wed Nov 7 21:14:36 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2007 20:14:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Speed Trap Message-ID: <004701c821bd$e05bd770$a1138650$@racer@comcast.net> Hello: Those of us that have had the unfortunate opportunity to be at the wrong end of a police officer's radar gun will appreciate the following. This was too good not to share with you'all. Gary This is a real News item - Two British traffic patrol officers from North Berwick were involved in an unusual incident while checking for speeding motorists on the A1 Great North Road. One of the officers used a hand-held radar device to check the speed of a vehicle approaching over the crest of a hill, and was surprised when the speed was recorded at over 300 mph. Their radar suddenly stopped working and the officers were not able to reset it. Just then a deafening roar over the treetops revealed that the radar had in fact latched on to a NATO Tornado fighter jet which was engaged in a low-flying exercise over the Border district, approaching from the North Sea. Back at police headquarters the chief constable fired off a stiff complaint to the RAF Liaison office. Back came the reply in true laconic RAF style: "Thank you for your message, which allows us to complete the file on this incident. You may be interested to know that the tactical computer in the Tornado had detected the presence of, and subsequently locked onto, your hostile radar equipment and automatically sent a jamming signal back to it. Furthermore, an air-to-ground missile aboard the fully-armed aircraft had also automatically locked onto your equipment. Fortunately the pilot flying the Tornado recognized the situation for what it was, quickly responded to the missile systems alert status, and was able to override the automated defence system before the missile was launched and your hostile radar installation was destroyed. " From spreiss at verizon.net Wed Nov 7 05:38:50 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Wed, 07 Nov 2007 23:38:50 +1100 Subject: [Fot] speed trap Message-ID: <002801c8213b$26bf56c0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Gary Tremendous! Thanks for a really good laugh. Steve P. This is a real News item - Two British traffic patrol officers from North Berwick were involved in an unusual incident while checking for speeding motorists on the A1 Great North Road. From gp89 at charter.net Thu Nov 8 03:20:07 2007 From: gp89 at charter.net (gp89 at charter.net) Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 2:20:07 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets In-Reply-To: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: <20071108052007.SFAQ5.134663.root@mp20> www.aptfast.com part #vcs-07 Jeff Senty ---- Scott Janzen wrote: > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gp89 at charter.net Thu Nov 8 03:23:22 2007 From: gp89 at charter.net (gp89 at charter.net) Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 2:23:22 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets Message-ID: <20071108052322.TXKB0.134670.root@mp20> www.aptfast.com part #vcs-07 Jeff Senty ---- Scott Janzen wrote: > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gp89 at charter.net Thu Nov 8 03:23:35 2007 From: gp89 at charter.net (gp89 at charter.net) Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 2:23:35 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Adjustable cam sprockets In-Reply-To: <003001c82175$d9f37340$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: <20071108052335.V6LGT.134673.root@mp20> www.aptfast.com part #vcs-07 Jeff Senty ---- Scott Janzen wrote: > Can anybody recommend a source or have any experience with adjustable cam > sprockets that would work on a GT6? I would guess whatever works on a Spit or > TR6 with a double row chain will work. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Thu Nov 8 08:48:22 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Thu, 08 Nov 2007 08:48:22 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Think this would beat a Spyker? Message-ID: <20071108155300.RYFZ9950.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> http://www.autoblog.com/2007/11/07/f1-lawn-mower-cuts-down-the-competition-like-schumacher/ From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 9 07:34:58 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 09:34:58 EST Subject: [Fot] Val's Spotted Spitfire Message-ID: Amici, Does anyone have a pic of Val Ascensio's Spitfire they could get to me this morning? Steve ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From jaboruch at netzero.net Fri Nov 9 09:52:33 2007 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 16:52:33 GMT Subject: [Fot] TR3 -TR4A shocks and... Message-ID: <20071109.115233.19660.1@webmail09.dca.untd.com> Does anyone happen to know what the difference in length is between TR3/4 and TR4A/6 front shocks? Next question: Has anyone come up with an easy way to do weight jacking at the front end of TR3-6s? Does not look like my plans to change to front coilovers and tubular A-arms will be economically viable, so on to plan B. I would like to be able to easily adjust front corner weights for different tracks. While most tracks in the Northeast are mostly right turns, NHIS is mostly lefts and Pocono can go either way. I am looking at AFCO adjustable coil spring spacers, but just want to make sure that I am not missing something that is obvious or has already been done. Right now I have a shortened stock spring spacer that I swap from side to side as needed, but it is very time consuming and I seem to have less and less time during the season to make such changes. Joe(B) _____________________________________________________________ Click here to find the inside track on available commercial real estate. http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2211/fc/Ioyw6ijl28Xl0QOb0Dsqfclt7YvxUH LAbO4iIqpxPvFqfSQred7QE6/ From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Fri Nov 9 11:00:30 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 12:00:30 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B4FFC4D@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I'm looking for some advice from somebody with racing experience with Speedie sleeves. Due to grooving on the original parts I have them on the transmission and differential flanges. With very little usage the trans seal gave up the ghost and bow I've wiped out the pinion seal. The diff and tranny are tight so it is not wobbleing apart. It seems to me that the increased diameter must be creating too much friction and heat. New flanges are unobtainable and I am using National brand seals as opposed to the crap the british car suppliers sell. What else can I do? Bob Kramer From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 9 11:02:31 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 13:02:31 EST Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves Message-ID: I've used them alot and heartily recommend them. Easy to install but expensive! ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From gtlund at cyberspeedway.net Fri Nov 9 15:13:04 2007 From: gtlund at cyberspeedway.net (greg) Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2007 15:13:04 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves In-Reply-To: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B4FFC4D@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> References: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B4FFC4D@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> Message-ID: <4734DB70.70503@cyberspeedway.net> Bob, Using a standard National buna or nitrile seal will not last very long with gear oil. Nitrile is listed as having "poor resistance to lubricants containing sulphur or EP additives". Our gear oil has these. Viton works much better. I suspect the original British Triumph seals were made from the proper compounds. I have solved many leakage problems with this one bit of info. I first ran into it with a Mark Williams 9" diff that would leak after a couple of sessions. Here is a link to Timken/National. http://www.timken.com/products/bearings/pdf/NSCInfoSection.pdf Timken owns the National industrial seals division. Look for section 1B. There is also a good listing of Redisleeves. P.S. The O-rings on TR transmission shift rails will actually seal if you use Viton. Anything over 180 degrees F ought to be Viton anyway. Greg Lund Kramer, Robert wrote: > I'm looking for some advice from somebody with racing experience with > Speedie sleeves. Due to grooving on the original parts I have them on > the transmission and differential flanges. With very little usage the > trans seal gave up the ghost and bow I've wiped out the pinion seal. The > diff and tranny are tight so it is not wobbleing apart. It seems to me > that the increased diameter must be creating too much friction and heat. > New flanges are unobtainable and I am using National brand seals as > opposed to the crap the british car suppliers sell. What else can I do? > > Bob Kramer > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Fri Nov 9 15:55:34 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 16:55:34 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves In-Reply-To: <4734DB70.70503@cyberspeedway.net> References: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B4FFC4D@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> <4734DB70.70503@cyberspeedway.net> Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B50013B@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> This is exactly the type of info I needed. The bearing supplier probably matched size to my Moss part in a better quality seal, but did not know enough about the apllication to get me one that would stand up. Thanks Greg. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: greg [mailto:gtlund at cyberspeedway.net] Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 4:13 PM To: Kramer, Robert Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Speedie sleeves Bob, Using a standard National buna or nitrile seal will not last very long with gear oil. Nitrile is listed as having "poor resistance to lubricants containing sulphur or EP additives". Our gear oil has these. Viton works much better. I suspect the original British Triumph seals were made from the proper compounds. I have solved many leakage problems with this one bit of info. I first ran into it with a Mark Williams 9" diff that would leak after a couple of sessions. Here is a link to Timken/National. http://www.timken.com/products/bearings/pdf/NSCInfoSection.pdf Timken owns the National industrial seals division. Look for section 1B. There is also a good listing of Redisleeves. P.S. The O-rings on TR transmission shift rails will actually seal if you use Viton. Anything over 180 degrees F ought to be Viton anyway. Greg Lund Kramer, Robert wrote: > I'm looking for some advice from somebody with racing experience with > Speedie sleeves. Due to grooving on the original parts I have them on > the transmission and differential flanges. With very little usage the > trans seal gave up the ghost and bow I've wiped out the pinion seal. The > diff and tranny are tight so it is not wobbleing apart. It seems to me > that the increased diameter must be creating too much friction and heat. > New flanges are unobtainable and I am using National brand seals as > opposed to the crap the british car suppliers sell. What else can I do? > > Bob Kramer > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Fri Nov 9 16:22:15 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2007 18:22:15 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Speedie sleeves Message-ID: <0C77E17B.68416080.00159EE9@cs.com> VITON SEALS are usually the choice of John Deere engineers. >This is exactly the type of info I needed. The bearing supplier probably >matched size to my Moss part in a better quality seal, but did not know >enough about the apllication to get me one that would stand up. >Thanks Greg. > > >Bob Kramer >Sales Manager >RDO Equipment Co. >16415 North IH 35 >Pflugerville, TX 78660 >512-272-4141 >Fx 512-272-9365 > >-----Original Message----- >From: greg [mailto:gtlund at cyberspeedway.net] >Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 4:13 PM >To: Kramer, Robert >Cc: fot at autox.team.net >Subject: Re: [Fot] Speedie sleeves > >Bob, > Using a standard National buna or nitrile seal will not last very >long with gear oil. Nitrile is listed as having "poor resistance to >lubricants containing sulphur or EP additives". Our gear oil has these. >Viton works much better. I suspect the original British Triumph seals >were made from the proper compounds. I have solved many leakage problems >with this one bit of info. I first ran into it with a Mark Williams 9" >diff that would leak after a couple of sessions. Here is a link to >Timken/National. > >http://www.timken.com/products/bearings/pdf/NSCInfoSection.pdf > >Timken owns the National industrial seals division. Look for section 1B. > >There is also a good listing of Redisleeves. > >P.S. The O-rings on TR transmission shift rails will actually seal if >you use Viton. Anything over 180 degrees F ought to be Viton anyway. >Greg Lund > > >Kramer, Robert wrote: >> I'm looking for some advice from somebody with racing experience with >> Speedie sleeves. Due to grooving on the original parts I have them on >> the transmission and differential flanges. With very little usage the >> trans seal gave up the ghost and bow I've wiped out the pinion seal. >The >> diff and tranny are tight so it is not wobbleing apart. It seems to me >> that the increased diameter must be creating too much friction and >heat. >> New flanges are unobtainable and I am using National brand seals as >> opposed to the crap the british car suppliers sell. What else can I >do? >> >> Bob Kramer >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vintage.racer at comcast.net Fri Nov 9 16:31:09 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 15:31:09 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Oil Seal Material Message-ID: <000801c82328$9cd41d70$d67c5850$@racer@comcast.net> Here is a handy chart to compare oil seal materials, not the Dupont Dow Viton listing: www.pspglobal.com/low-temperature-seals.html. Gary From spitlist at cox.net Fri Nov 9 16:46:26 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 16:46:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] More speculation on F1 2008 season drivers Message-ID: <000701c8232a$be8365a0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Here is the current speculation by the F1-ToGo web site. It this holds true, Kas is partly right in his speculation (Alonzo goes to Renault and Ralf goes to the Post Office to check his mail). But Button stays with Honda And Heikki goes to McLaren instead of Honda. But Williams doesn't get a newbie, instead one of Toro Rosso's castoffs. McLaren : Lewis Hamilton and Heikki Kovalainen BMW : Nick Heidfeld and Robert Kubica Renault : Fernando Alonso and Nelson Piquet Jr Williams : Nico Rosberg and Tonio Liuzzi Honda : Jenson Button and Rubens Barrichello Red Bull : Mark Webber and David Coulthard Toyota : Jarno Trulli and Timo Glock Toro Rosso : Sebastien Bourdais and Sebastian Vettel Super Aguri : Takuma Sato and Anthony Davidson Force India : Adrian Sutil and Roland Rodriquez Isn't this silly season fun? :-) Joe C. From budscars at msn.com Fri Nov 9 16:55:29 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (RACER BUD) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 15:55:29 -0800 Subject: [Fot] More speculation on F1 2008 season drivers References: <000701c8232a$be8365a0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: or they all go to NASCAR? Racer Bud Sonoma, ca. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Curry" To: Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 3:46 PM Subject: [Fot] More speculation on F1 2008 season drivers > Here is the current speculation by the F1-ToGo > web > site. > > It this holds true, Kas is partly right in his speculation (Alonzo goes to > Renault and Ralf goes to the Post Office to check his mail). But Button > stays with Honda And Heikki goes to McLaren instead of Honda. But > Williams > doesn't get a newbie, instead one of Toro Rosso's castoffs. > > > > McLaren : Lewis Hamilton and Heikki Kovalainen > BMW : Nick Heidfeld and Robert Kubica > Renault : Fernando Alonso and Nelson Piquet Jr > Williams : Nico Rosberg and Tonio Liuzzi > Honda : Jenson Button and Rubens Barrichello > Red Bull : Mark Webber and David Coulthard > Toyota : Jarno Trulli and Timo Glock > Toro Rosso : Sebastien Bourdais and Sebastian Vettel > Super Aguri : Takuma Sato and Anthony Davidson > Force India : Adrian Sutil and Roland Rodriquez > > > > Isn't this silly season fun? :-) > > Joe C. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Fri Nov 9 18:43:39 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2007 18:43:39 -0700 Subject: [Fot] More speculation on F1 2008 season drivers In-Reply-To: <000701c8232a$be8365a0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> References: <000701c8232a$be8365a0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: <20071110015214.OGVG5967.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Almost. Tonio might be going to Williams, but the race lineup will be Rosberg and Nakajima. Guess Toyota is wanting a Japanese driver to go with their engine deal at Williams At 04:46 PM 11/9/2007, Joe Curry wrote: >Here is the current speculation by the F1-ToGo web >site. > >It this holds true, Kas is partly right in his speculation (Alonzo goes to >Renault and Ralf goes to the Post Office to check his mail). But Button >stays with Honda And Heikki goes to McLaren instead of Honda. But Williams >doesn't get a newbie, instead one of Toro Rosso's castoffs. > > > >McLaren : Lewis Hamilton and Heikki Kovalainen >BMW : Nick Heidfeld and Robert Kubica >Renault : Fernando Alonso and Nelson Piquet Jr >Williams : Nico Rosberg and Tonio Liuzzi >Honda : Jenson Button and Rubens Barrichello >Red Bull : Mark Webber and David Coulthard >Toyota : Jarno Trulli and Timo Glock >Toro Rosso : Sebastien Bourdais and Sebastian Vettel >Super Aguri : Takuma Sato and Anthony Davidson >Force India : Adrian Sutil and Roland Rodriquez > > > >Isn't this silly season fun? :-) > >Joe C. >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Fri Nov 9 20:15:00 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Fri, 9 Nov 2007 19:15:00 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Ring gear Message-ID: <000e01c82347$e140a720$0502a8c0@desktop> Hey Friends, I took a lightweight flywheel to be fitted with a new ring gear to the machine shop today and the machinist asked me which way it went on. I didn't know what to tell him. This is an early (long snout crankshaft) TR6 flywheel and the ring gear has a chamfer on one side. If we use the chamfer to assist guiding the gear to the FW, the chamfered gear teeth face the transmission. This seems opposite of what should be to me. I see most older ring gear are set this way, but does a new installation with a modern starter go like this or with the chamfered teeth edge towards the motor? Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 From gtlund at cyberspeedway.net Fri Nov 9 21:33:48 2007 From: gtlund at cyberspeedway.net (greg) Date: Fri, 09 Nov 2007 21:33:48 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Ring gear In-Reply-To: <000e01c82347$e140a720$0502a8c0@desktop> References: <000e01c82347$e140a720$0502a8c0@desktop> Message-ID: <473534AC.2010609@cyberspeedway.net> Charly, The chamfered teeth face the direction the starter gear comes from. On older cars that used the inertia bendix, the chamfer faced the rear. I know this because I have an old Mueller flywheel that I had to hand chamfer the teeth on the front side for a modern starter. If you don't have the chamfer facing the starter, the gear teeth sometimes hit the ring gear teeth and won't engage. Greg Lund Charly Mitchel wrote: > Hey Friends, > I took a lightweight flywheel to be fitted with a new ring gear to the machine > shop today and the machinist asked me which way it went on. I didn't know > what to tell him. > This is an early (long snout crankshaft) TR6 flywheel and the ring gear has a > chamfer on one side. If we use the chamfer to assist guiding the gear to the > FW, the chamfered gear teeth face the transmission. This seems opposite of > what should be to me. I see most older ring gear are set this way, but does a > new installation with a modern starter go like this or with the chamfered > teeth edge towards the motor? > Charly Mitchel > TR6 #44 > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From triumphs at consolidated.net Sat Nov 10 09:06:47 2007 From: triumphs at consolidated.net (Ken Gano, home) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 10:06:47 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets In-Reply-To: <200711071818.lA7IIigk280532@ns3.geneseo.net> Message-ID: NFI, but a great product. It solved a very long standing problem on my street car. kg -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+triumphs=consolidated.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+triumphs=consolidated.net at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of Jack W. Drews Sent: Wednesday, November 07, 2007 12:21 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] TR3/4 Intake Manifold Gaskets At 10:36 AM 11/7/2007, Jeff Snook wrote: >Is someone out there selling an upgraded intake manifold gasket. Seem to >remember something posted awhile ago. Yep - I've got them. Im having them made specially for us by a major gasket company . Compacted graphite, 1/8" thick, compresses to half the thickness, good for 2000 deg F. Shape slightly modified to make them better. Kinda pricey at $66.95 including shipping because of low production but they solve the problems. >Thanks, > >Jeff Snook >http://www.snooksdreamcars.com >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From walt at hot-tr6.com Sat Nov 10 11:09:45 2007 From: walt at hot-tr6.com (Walter Hollowell) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 11:09:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] SPAX SHOCKS Message-ID: <20071110181054.429E6187A05@autox.team.net> I have a couple of questions for FOT members about Spax adjustable shocks. 1. I have Spax adjustable shocks on all four corners of my TR6 which is a daily driver plus an autocrosser. The rear tube shocks are weak after 4 years of very hard use. My question is this: is there any place I can send these expensive shocks for a rebuild or do I throw them away and buy another pair? 2. I bought a pair of used Spax adjustable shocks on ebaymotors that was supposed to fit a TR6 rear conversion but I don't think they are. The following numbers are stamped into the bottom of the shock: G 933 10906 The shock is 14.5" long when compressed from tip to tip and 19" long when extended. an anyone help me identify these shocks? Thank You Walt Hollowell Abq., NM From jimhearn1 at comcast.net Sat Nov 10 11:58:31 2007 From: jimhearn1 at comcast.net (jim hearn) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 10:58:31 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Message-ID: <000401c823cb$aff2d740$171a694c@computer> Sorry, someone told me how to do this but I can't find the email now. My original question was how to get more negative camber on my '74 TR6 that I use to autocross (no street use). I have adjusted it with shims to a negative 1 = degrees. One person told me about removing part of the spring assembly but I can't find the email or recall the particulars of this email. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated, especially those in the email I have since misplaced. Thanks, Jim Sacramento, CA Two '74 TR6s [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] From trhouse at greenapple.com Sat Nov 10 11:55:05 2007 From: trhouse at greenapple.com (Tom Householder) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 13:55:05 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter Message-ID: I told a friend who was driving to calif about the stolen tr5 race car.... he just called and reported a transporter with 3 TR4s and some other race car on I-40 near Albuquerque NM. Doubt that it's the TR5 but curious as to who and what the race car is.. anyone out there know who is on the move From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Sat Nov 10 12:51:29 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 12:51:29 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 In-Reply-To: <000401c823cb$aff2d740$171a694c@computer> Message-ID: <000001c823d3$168ed470$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Two ways you can do it. Shorter springs and removing the spacers put some negative in. And/Or, you can; 1. Install longer bolts at the lower control arms and shim out more. 2. Slot the upper control arms at the ball joint and move the top of the trunion inboard. If you pull the spacers out you may want to replace them with the AFCO adjustable spacers so you can corner weight the car and dial in both at the same time. Jim G -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:59 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Sorry, someone told me how to do this but I can't find the email now. My original question was how to get more negative camber on my '74 TR6 that I use to autocross (no street use). I have adjusted it with shims to a negative 1 = degrees. One person told me about removing part of the spring assembly but I can't find the email or recall the particulars of this email. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated, especially those in the email I have since misplaced. Thanks, Jim Sacramento, CA Two '74 TR6s [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jimhearn1 at comcast.net Sat Nov 10 15:26:36 2007 From: jimhearn1 at comcast.net (jim hearn) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 14:26:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment Message-ID: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> Is it enough to tie (with rope) the steering wheel in opposite directions to stop movement in order to align for toe? If not, is there some other method that works. Jim [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] From klynch_6 at msn.com Sat Nov 10 15:40:57 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 15:40:57 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter References: Message-ID: Greg, Walt, Henry????!!!!! ----- Original Message ----- From: Tom Householder To: fot at autox.team.net ; triumphs at autox.team.net Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:55 AM Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter I told a friend who was driving to calif about the stolen tr5 race car.... he just called and reported a transporter with 3 TR4s and some other race car on I-40 near Albuquerque NM. Doubt that it's the TR5 but curious as to who and what the race car is.. anyone out there know who is on the move _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jimhearn1 at comcast.net Sat Nov 10 16:01:49 2007 From: jimhearn1 at comcast.net (jim hearn) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 15:01:49 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 In-Reply-To: <000001c823d3$168ed470$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: <000001c823ed$acf83c70$171a694c@computer> Jim, is it possible to dial in corner weight without actually weighing the corners? Is it possible to work from performance or from others' experience with my particular make and model ('74 TR6)? I had planned to take of my bumpers and windshield this winter but I'm sure this would have some effect on corner weight so maybe I need to calculate a little more before I start removing. Jim -----Original Message----- From: James Gray [mailto:toodamnfunky at comcast.net] Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:51 AM To: 'jim hearn' Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Two ways you can do it. Shorter springs and removing the spacers put some negative in. And/Or, you can; 1. Install longer bolts at the lower control arms and shim out more. 2. Slot the upper control arms at the ball joint and move the top of the trunion inboard. If you pull the spacers out you may want to replace them with the AFCO adjustable spacers so you can corner weight the car and dial in both at the same time. Jim G -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:59 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Sorry, someone told me how to do this but I can't find the email now. My original question was how to get more negative camber on my '74 TR6 that I use to autocross (no street use). I have adjusted it with shims to a negative 1 = degrees. One person told me about removing part of the spring assembly but I can't find the email or recall the particulars of this email. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated, especially those in the email I have since misplaced. Thanks, Jim Sacramento, CA Two '74 TR6s [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sat Nov 10 17:06:50 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 17:06:50 -0700 Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment In-Reply-To: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> References: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> Message-ID: <000e01c823f6$c244e0c0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> When I worked in a front end shop way back in High school, the owner had made a weight (about 10 pounds) with hooks on it that he would place on the bottom of the wheel when he centered it. If the front end moved while doing adjustments, the weight would return it to center. Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 3:27 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment Is it enough to tie (with rope) the steering wheel in opposite directions to stop movement in order to align for toe? If not, is there some other method that works. Jim From spreiss at verizon.net Sat Nov 10 02:05:45 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 20:05:45 +1100 Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment References: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> <000e01c823f6$c244e0c0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> Message-ID: <000801c82378$e152b240$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Just centering the wheel does not ensure that the steering is centered. My TR3 has no doubt had the steering wheel removed many times! I've removed it three or four times myself during the past two years of ownership. (Love those trafficators!) To center of the steering one must measure the degrees of rotation lock to lock and find the center point. The wheel position can then can be adjusted as required to center it. It may take a couple of tries, since the splines are quite closely spaced. Coincidentally, adjustment of the steering box (And perhaps the rack and pinion, though I have no experience with one) should also be performed at "center lock", as is stated in the manuals. This results in the tightest steering action throughout the movement without binding in the center, where wear is least. Steve Preiss ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Curry" To: "'jim hearn'" ; Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 11:06 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment > When I worked in a front end shop way back in High school, the owner had > made a weight (about 10 pounds) with hooks on it that he would place on the > bottom of the wheel when he centered it. If the front end moved while doing > adjustments, the weight would return it to center. > > Joe C. > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn > Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 3:27 PM > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment > > Is it enough to tie (with rope) the steering wheel in opposite directions to > stop movement in order to align for toe? If not, is there some other method > that works. Jim > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sat Nov 10 21:31:59 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Sat, 10 Nov 2007 21:31:59 -0700 Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment In-Reply-To: <000801c82378$e152b240$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> References: <000001c823e8$c1aaf310$171a694c@computer> <000e01c823f6$c244e0c0$2202a8c0@newcomputer> <000801c82378$e152b240$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <000a01c8241b$cce7a830$2202a8c0@newcomputer> You are correct sir. But the weight doesn't have to be on the bottom of the centered wheel. It just has to be at the bottom of the wheel when the steering is centered. Then after you have all the adjustments done, you can remove the wheel and properly position it. On a Spitfire or other car with a similar steering shaft (with a cam that cancels the turn signal), you not only center the rack, but you also have to then make sure that the cam is in the correct position (to the left between the cancelling dogs of the switch) and then make sure that the wheel is centered. Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: Steven Preiss [mailto:spreiss at verizon.net] Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 2:06 AM To: Joe Curry; 'jim hearn'; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment Just centering the wheel does not ensure that the steering is centered. My TR3 has no doubt had the steering wheel removed many times! I've removed it three or four times myself during the past two years of ownership. (Love those trafficators!) To center of the steering one must measure the degrees of rotation lock to lock and find the center point. The wheel position can then can be adjusted as required to center it. It may take a couple of tries, since the splines are quite closely spaced. Coincidentally, adjustment of the steering box (And perhaps the rack and pinion, though I have no experience with one) should also be performed at "center lock", as is stated in the manuals. This results in the tightest steering action throughout the movement without binding in the center, where wear is least. Steve Preiss ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Curry" To: "'jim hearn'" ; Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 11:06 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment > When I worked in a front end shop way back in High school, the owner had > made a weight (about 10 pounds) with hooks on it that he would place on the > bottom of the wheel when he centered it. If the front end moved while doing > adjustments, the weight would return it to center. > > Joe C. > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of jim hearn > Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 3:27 PM > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: [Fot] To hold the steering wheel in place for alignment > > Is it enough to tie (with rope) the steering wheel in opposite directions to > stop movement in order to align for toe? If not, is there some other method > that works. Jim > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From triosan at gmail.com Sun Nov 11 09:49:43 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 08:49:43 -0800 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711110849x4e931970o6a48cb16c71b2cd9@mail.gmail.com> Thanks -- will be interesting to see if anybody else gets a sighting. On Nov 10, 2007 2:40 PM, KEVIN LYNCH wrote: > Greg, Walt, Henry????!!!!! > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Tom Householder > To: fot at autox.team.net ; > triumphs at autox.team.net > Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:55 AM > Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter > > > I told a friend who was driving to calif about the stolen tr5 race > car.... > he just called and reported a transporter with 3 TR4s and some other race > car on I-40 near Albuquerque NM. Doubt that it's the TR5 but curious as > to > who and what the race car is.. anyone out there know who is on the move > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot< > http://autox.team.net/mailman/li > stinfo/fot> > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > -- Chuck Arnold From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Sun Nov 11 11:08:33 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 11:08:33 -0700 Subject: [Fot] asymetrical corner weighting & custom alignments Message-ID: <000401c8248d$dff25b10$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> I was just curious as to how many members use asymetrical setups and special alignments for different tracks. I know some that setup for predominantly left or right turns or even just a few key corners. By the by, Jim Hearn in Sacramento is looking for some corner scales for a day. Anybody know of a club out that way that has a set ? Jim G From ablake2 at austin.rr.com Sun Nov 11 12:34:48 2007 From: ablake2 at austin.rr.com (Greg & Alison Blake) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 13:34:48 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Head modifications Message-ID: <000a01c82499$ebed8ff0$6401a8c0@blake1> Has anyone had success using an epoxy to change the shape of an intake or exhaust port or is welding the only way to go? Thanks, Greg From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Sun Nov 11 13:35:15 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 13:35:15 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d0711110848w49511a26k1b28d9eddcf4a7f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <001201c824a2$5df4b800$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> This link shows the spacer jg http://www.midwestmotorsportsinc.com/order_part.php?item=20191 &line=AFC -----Original Message----- From: Chuck Arnold [mailto:triosan at gmail.com] Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 9:48 AM To: James Gray Subject: Re: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Please tell me what an AFCO adjustable spacer is. Thanks. On Nov 10, 2007 11:51 AM, James Gray wrote: Two ways you can do it. Shorter springs and removing the spacers put some negative in. And/Or, you can; 1. Install longer bolts at the lower control arms and shim out more. 2. Slot the upper control arms at the ball joint and move the top of the trunion inboard. If you pull the spacers out you may want to replace them with the AFCO adjustable spacers so you can corner weight the car and dial in both at the same time. Jim G -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+toodamnfunky=comcast.net at autox.team.net ] On Behalf Of jim hearn Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2007 11:59 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Getting more negative camber on the front of a TR6 Sorry, someone told me how to do this but I can't find the email now. My original question was how to get more negative camber on my '74 TR6 that I use to autocross (no street use). I have adjusted it with shims to a negative 1 = degrees. One person told me about removing part of the spring assembly but I can't find the email or recall the particulars of this email. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated, especially those in the email I have since misplaced. Thanks, Jim Sacramento, CA Two '74 TR6s [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/ms-tnef which had a name of winmail.dat] Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot -- Chuck Arnold From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Sun Nov 11 14:35:56 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 15:35:56 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Head modifications In-Reply-To: <000a01c82499$ebed8ff0$6401a8c0@blake1> References: <000a01c82499$ebed8ff0$6401a8c0@blake1> Message-ID: <200711112134.lABLY7fp287303@ns3.geneseo.net> I have used epoxy. I've used JB Weld and it is generally thought to be superior as far as stiction goes, but it is so runny that you have to build a dam to keep it in and then grind all of that away. A product that is easier is Moroso A & B. It comes in two bars about like big Snickers bars. It is made expressly for this purpose. It works fine but you must be very careful to mix it thoroughly before use. I have never tried it in an exhaust port but only in intake ports. I've never had a failure, but the danger is always there, and I no longer use it. I've found ways to make the TR4 head flow just as well without it. One of the most interesting experiments was trying to make a "high velocity" port like they use on high rpm motorcycle engines. I theorized that the best place to restrict the flow was right at the downturn of the port. I built up the radius until there was only about 60% of the port cross sectional area remaining. Then we took the car to a chassis dyno and ran it with a head with epoxy and a head without. Common sense told me that we would lose hp, but I've seen the dyno curves for hot bikes and they showed higher hp so I was really curious about it. Plus I was out of ideas at the time. We found that this experiment lost us 8 hp. I later tumbled to the fact that the cycle guys experience gains above 8000 rpm, not below. At 01:34 PM 11/11/2007, you wrote: >Has anyone had success using an epoxy to change the shape of an intake >or exhaust port or is welding the only way to go? > >Thanks, > >Greg >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From vintage.racer at comcast.net Sun Nov 11 15:01:55 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 14:01:55 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Racing videos from the 1960's Message-ID: <000001c824ae$79931190$6cb934b0$@racer@comcast.net> Hello: Here is a link to some good "vintage" race footage of the Lotus F1 cars of that era along with other racing videos: Gary http://www.blinkx.com/burl?v=Uamw9xGoXYfAAgVv6hiyJg From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Sun Nov 11 18:21:19 2007 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 17:21:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Message-ID: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard From klynch_6 at msn.com Sun Nov 11 18:46:36 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 18:46:36 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Here, here...! A timely post. Kev Lynch ----- Original Message ----- From: EDWARD BARNARD To: FOT Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 6:21 PM Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From lunkercars at earthlink.net Sun Nov 11 19:16:45 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 19:16:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <346C4E05-DE94-4BD8-8074-52242CDCEDE1@earthlink.net> Just picked up this message. Any details? [where, when, parked or moving?] Perhaps to late now but I would be happy to follow up. Greg On Nov 10, 2007, at 11:55 AM, Tom Householder wrote: > I told a friend who was driving to calif about the stolen tr5 race > car.... > he just called and reported a transporter with 3 TR4s and some > other race > car on I-40 near Albuquerque NM. Doubt that it's the TR5 but > curious as to > who and what the race car is.. anyone out there know who is on the > move > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From budscars at msn.com Sun Nov 11 19:18:24 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (RACER BUD) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 18:18:24 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Thanks Ed..I greatly appreciate your email...........I am not a Vet....I am extremely proud to say that...2 of my 4 kids, and 1 son in law are now serving us... My oldest son , Scott(35), is an Officer and Diver for the Coast Guard..securing our ports against terrorism..(he was a rescue swimmer) he's now stationed in Boston...My youngest daughter, Liz(23)...and her husband, Frieden, are Air Force Officers, living in Gulf Breeze Fl...They are both USAFA Grads....Liz is a logistics officer, and Frieden is in Pilot Training.... Good Job Ed! Racer Bud..Sonoma, Ca..spitfire #21 ----- Original Message ----- From: "EDWARD BARNARD" To: "FOT" Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 5:21 PM Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the > other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd > Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From ehusmann53 at yahoo.com Sun Nov 11 19:36:16 2007 From: ehusmann53 at yahoo.com (Ernest Husmann) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 18:36:16 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <586906.9711.qm@web57615.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Thanks Ed. If you have a copy of Old Glory, fly Her. If nothing else it's a show of support for the kids doing our duty. Ernie EDWARD BARNARD wrote: Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From BillB at bnj.com Sun Nov 11 20:07:59 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sun, 11 Nov 2007 19:07:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Thanks. I kind of forgot it was Veteran's day. I think I'm the only Vet in my company. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of EDWARD BARNARD Sent: Sun 11/11/2007 5:21 PM To: FOT Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tarch at bellsouth.net Mon Nov 12 06:58:14 2007 From: tarch at bellsouth.net (Richard Taylor) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 08:58:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys remember that old stuff? Richard L. Taylor Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From greenman62 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 12 07:20:07 2007 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (greenman62 at hotmail.com) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 14:20:07 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> Message-ID: Sure... 1505s... "Lifers", Blue wool shirts (they made a comeback in the late 60s USAF)... tech school down the road at my old man's Alma Mater (Chanute)... My Chief Observer at Shaw AFB trying to catch my trainer and I napping during a midnight shift by climbing up the shaky weather tower's escape rope... getting half way up and being treated by a shower of cold coffee for his troubles. "Gee, Sgt. Kemp (not his real name) we didn't know you were there!" Sitting in the quiet darkness of a Phillippean night on a loading dock taking a break from editing weather reports with my friends... and suddenly being scared to death when a rice bug the size of a Buick smacked into the steel door behind us... Life was tough at the sharp end of the sling psychrometer. 'Now back in the brown shoe days..." Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > From: tarch at bellsouth.net > To: BillB at bnj.com; edwardbarnard at prodigy.net; fot at autox.team.net > Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 08:58:14 -0500 > Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and > tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys > remember that old stuff? > > Richard L. Taylor > > Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other > veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all > the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wensley_Tr at comcast.net Mon Nov 12 07:48:19 2007 From: wensley_Tr at comcast.net (Craig) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 09:48:19 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day..In honor of Veteran's Day Message-ID: <002f01c8253b$1128e4d0$0200a8c0@Desktop> Keep it moving, please, even if you've seen it before. It is the VETERAN , not the preacher, who has given us freedom of religion. It is the VETERAN , not the reporter, who has given us freedom of the press. It is the VETERAN , not the poet, who has given us freedom of speech. It is the VETERAN , not the campus organizer, who has given us freedom to assemble. It is the VETERAN , not the lawyer, who has given us the right to a fair trial. It is the VETERAN , not the politician, Who has given us the right to vote. It is the VETERAN , who salutes the Flag, It is the veteran , who serves under the Flag, ETERNAL REST GRANT THEM O LORD, AND LET PERPETUAL LIGHT SHINE UPON THEM. I don't usually suggest that many emails be forwarded, but I'd be EXTREMELY proud if this one reached as many as possible. We can be very proud of our young men and women in the service no matter where they serve. God Bless them all!!! = [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/gif] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg] [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg] From stutzmans at comcast.net Mon Nov 12 08:38:41 2007 From: stutzmans at comcast.net (Stutzman) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:38:41 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002201c82542$51a5f8c0$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> aT OUR WPTA meeting SAT. 2 of our members who are Marines, played the Marine Corp. anthem. And of course they reminded us - once a Marine always a Marine. Ed Woods, 67 years old, ran the marithon on DC with his 2 daughters. Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "EDWARD BARNARD" ; "FOT" Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 10:07 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day > Thanks. I kind of forgot it was Veteran's day. I think I'm the only Vet in > my > company. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of EDWARD BARNARD > Sent: Sun 11/11/2007 5:21 PM > To: FOT > Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the > other > veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to > all > the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tarch at bellsouth.net Mon Nov 12 09:14:55 2007 From: tarch at bellsouth.net (Richard Taylor) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 11:14:55 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <002201c82542$51a5f8c0$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <002201c82542$51a5f8c0$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> Message-ID: <006801c82547$2ae0cb20$6401a8c0@richardiipc> "Once a Marine, always a Marine." Hmm, it sounds incurable, maybe something like herpes. Richard (ex Grunt) aT OUR WPTA meeting SAT. 2 of our members who are Marines, played the Marine Corp. anthem. And of course they reminded us - once a Marine always a Marine. Ed Woods, 67 years old, ran the marithon on DC with his 2 daughters. Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "EDWARD BARNARD" ; "FOT" Sent: Sunday, November 11, 2007 10:07 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day > Thanks. I kind of forgot it was Veteran's day. I think I'm the only Vet in > my > company. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of EDWARD BARNARD > Sent: Sun 11/11/2007 5:21 PM > To: FOT > Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the > other > veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to > all > the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 12 09:31:43 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 11:31:43 EST Subject: [Fot] paging Mark Eden Message-ID: Trip in the offing to Wyotech. First dates available after Thanksgiving. Joe A From ehusmann53 at yahoo.com Mon Nov 12 10:58:53 2007 From: ehusmann53 at yahoo.com (Ernest Husmann) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 09:58:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <581931.78689.qm@web57607.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Chanute ... Falling out at 0330 every day in the middle of winter to march to the chow hall a half mile away. Then reforming to march to the hanger about two miles away. Sorry can't tell you about going up hill both ways because there were no hills at Chanute that would even slightly deflect the damn wind. Made it back to Chanute this past spring. Civilian now, most of the buildings are vacant, the aircraft are gone, as are the manicured lawns. Sad to see the condition it was in. greenman62 at hotmail.com wrote: Sure... 1505s... "Lifers", Blue wool shirts (they made a comeback in the late 60s USAF)... tech school down the road at my old man's Alma Mater (Chanute)... Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com From kaskas at cox.net Mon Nov 12 11:38:27 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:38:27 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day References: <581931.78689.qm@web57607.mail.re1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <00b301c8255b$370e12e0$3f0ec548@RW> Yeah, they've even made Camp Polk a Fort now. I still think that place was a nice spot for a vacant lot. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ernest Husmann" To: ; "'FOT'" Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 9:58 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day > Chanute ... Falling out at 0330 every day in the middle of winter to march > to the chow hall a half mile away. Then reforming to march to the hanger > about two miles away. Sorry can't tell you about going up hill both ways > because there were no hills at Chanute that would even slightly deflect > the damn wind. > > Made it back to Chanute this past spring. Civilian now, most of the > buildings are vacant, the aircraft are gone, as are the manicured lawns. > Sad to see the condition it was in. > > greenman62 at hotmail.com wrote: > Sure... 1505s... "Lifers", Blue wool shirts (they made a comeback in the > late > 60s USAF)... tech school down the road at my old man's Alma Mater > (Chanute)... > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around > http://mail.yahoo.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jeff_durant at comcast.net Mon Nov 12 11:37:33 2007 From: jeff_durant at comcast.net (jeff_durant at comcast.net) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 18:37:33 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> References: <452453.98144.qm@web81201.mail.mud.yahoo.com><004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0@richardiipc> Message-ID: <1077169673-1194892780-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-2096115072-@bxe103.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Richard, Thanks to you and all the other Veterans, we enjoy the freedoms we have today. Long may it be so. My father was also in the 11th Airborne in Korea. He was very proud of it as I'm sure you are. God Bless, Jeff Durant Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T -----Original Message----- From: "Richard Taylor" Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 08:58:14 To:"'Bill Babcock'" , "'EDWARD BARNARD'", "'FOT'" Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys remember that old stuff? Richard L. Taylor Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Mon Nov 12 11:50:19 2007 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:50:19 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: Veteran's Day Message-ID: <979091.40151.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Note: forwarded message attached. Received: from [75.41.205.147] by web81205.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 PST Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 -0800 (PST) From: EDWARD BARNARD Subject: RE: [Fot] Veteran's Day To: Richard Taylor In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0 at richardiipc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Length: 994 X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Richard: Still have my kun#cap hanging with my dress greens in the closet with a pair of boots, one set of jungles and one of deserts. What is it that some things we never get rid of? Funny, today on the radio I hear everybody saying it's Veteran's Day. People remember it as a bank holiday and not Armistice Day. As a kid back home, on the 11th hour, of the 11th day, of the 11th month, the sirens would blow and the church bells would ring. Today people curse it because they're not going to get their mail! - Ed Richard Taylor wrote: As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys remember that old stuff? Richard L. Taylor Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to all the Corps veteran's! -Ed Barnard Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From trhouse at greenapple.com Mon Nov 12 08:54:32 2007 From: trhouse at greenapple.com (Tom Householder) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:54:32 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day WWII Memorial In-Reply-To: Message-ID: on 11/12/07 9:20 AM, greenman62 at hotmail.com at greenman62 at hotmail.com wrote: > Sure... 1505s... "Lifers", Blue wool shirts (they made a comeback in the late > 60s USAF)... tech school down the road at my old man's Alma Mater (Chanute)... > My Chief Observer at Shaw AFB trying to catch my trainer and I napping during > a midnight shift by climbing up the shaky weather tower's escape rope... > getting half way up and being treated by a shower of cold coffee for his > troubles. "Gee, Sgt. Kemp (not his real name) we didn't know you were there!" > Sitting in the quiet darkness of a Phillippean night on a loading dock taking > a break from editing weather reports with my friends... and suddenly being > scared to death when a rice bug the size of a Buick smacked into the steel > door behind us... > > Life was tough at the sharp end of the sling psychrometer. > > 'Now back in the brown shoe days..." > > Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois > > That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > > > >> From: tarch at bellsouth.net >> To: BillB at bnj.com; edwardbarnard at prodigy.net; fot at autox.team.net >> Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 08:58:14 -0500 >> Subject: Re: [Fot] Veteran's Day >> >> As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and >> tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys >> remember that old stuff? >> >> Richard L. Taylor >> >> Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day >> >> Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the other >> veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to > all >> the Corps veteran's! >> -Ed Barnard >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > There was a story in the local paper on the WWII memorial for those who are or have friends /family WWII vets. check this site for there existence there if not there see that they are honored by having there names registerd. http://www.wwiimemorial.com also see "Names still Absent from WWII Registry" article ... Columbus Dispatch Nov 11. 2007 (OHIO) From billsohl at optonline.net Mon Nov 12 12:40:14 2007 From: billsohl at optonline.net (Bill Sohl) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 14:40:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: Veteran's Day In-Reply-To: <979091.40151.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <979091.40151.qm@web81206.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8E0FCF11FDA7499EBC6185ECD99AC59D@SohlPC> I wish the recent PBS series "The WAR" by Ken Burns would be mandatory viewing for all high school kids. The series (and I only caught 2 of the 7 parts) is truly told on a very personal level...one that really brings to the forefront the sacrifices made by so many. There is a book version also and I read it cover-to-cover and am still in awe as to the sacrifices made by so many on our behalf. I served (US Navy) from 66-70 and even though my ship (DD-781, a destroyer) was in the Vietnam war zone (late 68 through spring 69) providing gunfire support and doing other war time duties we thankfully were never shot at by anyone. I can't imagine the actual feelings one must go through when on the receiving end of enemy gunfire. Anyone who has served, regardless of it being peacetime or wartime deserves my respect because no one ever knows when peacetime can suddenly be wartime on a moments notice putting everyone in the service potentially in harms way. With sincerest respect for all who served, Bill Sohl ----------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "EDWARD BARNARD" To: "FOT" Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 1:50 PM Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: Veteran's Day > Note: forwarded message attached. > Received: from [75.41.205.147] by web81205.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; > Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 PST > Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 -0800 (PST) > From: EDWARD BARNARD > Subject: RE: [Fot] Veteran's Day > To: Richard Taylor > In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0 at richardiipc> > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit > Content-Length: 994 > X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d > X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain > > Richard: Still have my kun#cap hanging with my dress greens in the closet > with a pair of boots, one set of jungles and one of deserts. What is it > that some things we never get rid of? Funny, today on the radio I hear > everybody saying it's Veteran's Day. People remember it as a bank holiday > and not Armistice Day. As a kid back home, on the 11th hour, of the 11th > day, of the 11th month, the sirens would blow and the church bells would > ring. Today people curse it because they're not going to get their mail! > - Ed > > Richard Taylor wrote: > As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and > tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys > remember that old stuff? > > Richard L. Taylor > > Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day > > Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the > other > veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to > all > the Corps veteran's! > -Ed Barnard > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 12 13:32:27 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 15:32:27 -0500 Subject: [Fot] =?iso-8859-1?q?=A0Veteran=27s_Day?= Message-ID: <2933D1CD.25C85F6A.00159EE9@cs.com> THE WAR was extremely interesting...so many facets brought together. AND.... AMERICAN PATRIOT: THE LIFE & WARS OF BUD DAY will get your attention.. Richard Taylor's friend, ROBERT CORAM, ought to be in line for his third Pulitzer nomination for his biography of the nation's most decorated living warrior. And Bud Day should get one last medal for saving 95% of the service benefits that were taken away, after he returned from the Hanoi Hilton. FIGHTER PILOT, LAWYER, IOWAN. JoeA >I wish the recent PBS series "The WAR" by Ken Burns would be mandatory >viewing for all high school kids. The series (and I only caught 2 of the 7 >parts) is truly told on a very personal level...one that really brings to >the forefront the sacrifices made by so many. >There is a book version also and I read it cover-to-cover and am still in >awe as to the sacrifices made by so many on our behalf. > >I served (US Navy) from 66-70 and even though my ship (DD-781, a destroyer) >was in the Vietnam war zone (late 68 through spring 69) providing gunfire >support and doing other war time duties we thankfully were never shot at by >anyone. I can't imagine the actual feelings one must go through when on >the receiving end of enemy gunfire. > >Anyone who has served, regardless of it being peacetime or wartime deserves >my respect because no one ever knows when peacetime can suddenly be wartime >on a moments notice putting everyone in the service potentially in harms >way. > >With sincerest respect for all who served, >Bill Sohl >----------------- >----- Original Message ----- >From: "EDWARD BARNARD" >To: "FOT" >Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 1:50 PM >Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: Veteran's Day > > >> Note: forwarded message attached. >> Received: from [75.41.205.147] by web81205.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; >> Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 PST >> Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 10:49:47 -0800 (PST) >> From: EDWARD BARNARD >> Subject: RE: [Fot] Veteran's Day >> To: Richard Taylor >> In-Reply-To: <004f01c82534$122b8bf0$6401a8c0 at richardiipc> >> MIME-Version: 1.0 >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >> Content-Length: 994 >> X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d >> X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain >> >> Richard: Still have my kun#cap hanging with my dress greens in the closet >> with a pair of boots, one set of jungles and one of deserts. What is it >> that some things we never get rid of? Funny, today on the radio I hear >> everybody saying it's Veteran's Day. People remember it as a bank holiday >> and not Armistice Day. As a kid back home, on the 11th hour, of the 11th >> day, of the 11th month, the sirens would blow and the church bells would >> ring. Today people curse it because they're not going to get their mail! >> - Ed >> >> Richard Taylor wrote: >> As a Korean War vet (11th Airborne) I dug up my old kun-cap for show and >> tell at the office. Airborne wasn't issued flying saucers. Any of you guys >> remember that old stuff? >> >> Richard L. Taylor >> >> Subject: [Fot] Veteran's Day >> >> Surprised no one has said it yet but...Happy Veteran's Day to all the >> other >> veteran's on the list! And a belated (yesterday) Happy 232nd Birthday to >> all >> the Corps veteran's! >> -Ed Barnard >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From trhouse at greenapple.com Mon Nov 12 02:06:09 2007 From: trhouse at greenapple.com (Tom Householder) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 04:06:09 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter In-Reply-To: <346C4E05-DE94-4BD8-8074-52242CDCEDE1@earthlink.net> Message-ID: on 11/11/07 9:16 PM, Greg "Lunker" Hilyer at lunkercars at earthlink.net wrote: > On Nov 10, 2007, at 11:55 AM, Tom Householder wrote: at the original post time and date it was east of Albquerque NM headed west on I 40 From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Mon Nov 12 20:44:49 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 19:44:49 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Oil Seal Material References: <000801c82328$9cd41d70$d67c5850$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: <003001c825a7$8b2cbbf0$6401a8c0@TER2> Actually leather is a pretty high perfromance seal material. One of the perfromance factors that is not mentioned in the chart at the Web Site at PSP is the surface speed of the shaft and seal contact. Leather can tolerate quite high surface speeds compared to most of the other materials. So leather English seals are not just old technology, the material is there for a reason! There are charts that give the surface speed tolerances in some older Chicago Rawhide seal catalogues that I have. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Horstkorta" To: Sent: Friday, November 09, 2007 3:31 PM Subject: [Fot] Oil Seal Material > Here is a handy chart to compare oil seal materials, not the Dupont Dow > Viton listing: www.pspglobal.com/low-temperature-seals.html. > > > > Gary > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 13 07:45:11 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 09:45:11 EST Subject: [Fot] [6pack] FOT at The Glen Sept 2008 Message-ID: Thanks Dennis! You have more information than I do at this point on the special activities. www.grandprixfestival.com Egads! there's a lot of Triumph and sportscar stuff going on with the Village Fathers at the Glen. I knew about it, but had no idea of the extent of it until I visited the site: www.grandprixfestival.com We need to make note of that on our fot website, too. Thanks for jumping in....this is going to be a very special event...there will be a few surprises, as well. Joe Alexander Friends of Triumph > Triumph is also the featured marque for the Grand > Prix Festival of Watkins Glen being held on Friday, > September 5, 2008. Triumphs are eligible for the Tour > de Marque which gives you some great perks including > laps around WGI on Friday, lunch at the track and a > great parking spot for the festival which includes a > race reenactment through the streets of Watkins Glen! > There are only 100 spots available and registration > has already opened for previous 'Stone Bridge Drivers' > so get your registration in ASAP. > See www.grandprixfestival.com for more information. > > Dennis Culligan, Highland NY / 1976 TR6 CF57948U TR6IUMPH > From lang at isis.mit.edu Tue Nov 13 08:32:02 2007 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert Lang) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 10:32:02 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Oil Seal Material In-Reply-To: <003001c825a7$8b2cbbf0$6401a8c0@TER2> References: <000801c82328$9cd41d70$d67c5850$@racer@comcast.net> <003001c825a7$8b2cbbf0$6401a8c0@TER2> Message-ID: Hi, So, what you're saying Greg is that just because leather seals are old school, they still perform well. Hmmm, how about that! New isn't always better. I'm shocked. Shocked, I tell you! rml :-) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Room N42-140Q | This space for rent Vintage Consultant MIT IS&T unix-linux-help | Voice:617-253-7438 FAX: 617-258-9535 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 13 09:19:22 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 11:19:22 EST Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn Status for The Glen and a little more.... Message-ID: FoT: If you have been wondering about the status of reservations for the Hampton Inn....."Andrea" is behind in her paperwork and will be back to me with the particulars. "Today", she says. I just gave her a nudge...... I will pass a long her published contact information so that you can make your reservations directly. If you are really special and/or live off shore, I can make your reservations for you. Cary Perket suggests that you might make a better deal if you have a Triple A membership. You likely could make your reservations and then deal with that issue when you arrive on the premises. I didnt want to go back and renegotiate and muddy the water. Presently, the rooms are being reserved under THE FRIENDS OF TRIUMPH WITH a rate of $114.00. One more thing....I have had a couple of folks step forward and volunteer their help: Henry Frye and Tim Suddard: Press Releases Tom Strange: Paddock Coordination Scott Janzen & Ted Schumacher: Event Shirts I have also had a few commercial entities offer support. I am trying to think of role that they can play in this event. I am open to suggestions. Of course, GrassRoots Motors Sports (Classic Motorsports Magazine) is sponsoring the Triumph Race itself. The Roadster Factory is bringing the fabled Le Mans TRS as one of the Pace Cars, and for display. TS Enterprises always does us good on supplying the Event Shirts. Triumph Rescue and Ratco stepped forward, too, but nothing has been planned yet. Thanks! Joe Alexander From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 13 12:24:08 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 12:24:08 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Like riding a bike Message-ID: <20071113193430.DZPA28248.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> Schumacher quickest on F1 return http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=41285 "...Second quickest was Ferrari's regular test driver Luca Badoer, who was 0.2s slower in the sister car. McLaren's test driver Pedro de la Rosa was third fastest but the Spaniard was more than 0.7s slower..." 1. M.SCHUMACHER Ferrari 1m21.922s 2. BADOER Ferrari 1m22.129s 3. DE LA ROSA McLaren 1m22.687s 4. KOVALAINEN Renault 1m22.802s 5. KUBICA BMW 1m22.883s 6. PAFFETT McLaren 1m23.008s 7. NAKAJIMA Williams 1m23.187s 8. COULTHARD Red Bull 1m23.332s 9. TRULLI Toyota 1m23.624s 10. HEIDFELD BMW 1m23.671s 11. ROSBERG Williams 1m23.847s 12. MONTAGNY Toyota 1m23.861s 13. VETTEL Toro Rosso 1m24.048s 14. ZUBER Super Aguri 1m24.065s 15. BOURDAIS Toro Rosso 1m24.193s 16. DAVIDSON Super Aguri 1m24.246s 17. ROSSITER Honda 1m24.480s 18. CHANDHOK Red Bull 1m24.896s 19. VAN DER GARDE Force India 1m25.317s 20. RODRIGUEZ Force India 1m26.973s From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 13 12:26:09 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 12:26:09 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Brawn to Honda Message-ID: <20071113193431.ZEEA18714.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> Now this will be interesting to watch... Ross Brawn is leaving Ferrari and going to Honda as Team Principle. From fal at knology.net Tue Nov 13 13:06:48 2007 From: fal at knology.net (fredd) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 14:06:48 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Fw: Free TR-250 Body Message-ID: <01ec01c82630$bead4010$cbbdfea9@fredds> All, Just got off the phone with a guy in Birmingham, AL that has a TR-250 body that he would like to give away. The car had been modified for racing and a lot of parts were "cut off". However, he does still have the body parts that were removed. There is no engine or transmission and the floors were cut to accomadate a Jaguar engine... Also had a Franklin Quick Change rear end Anyway, if anyone is intersted, it's free to a good home, just got to go get it. His name is Kent Johnston Work- 800-633-4392 Home- 205-599-2204 Dave B From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 13 13:38:01 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2007 15:38:01 -0500 Subject: [Fot] =?iso-8859-1?q?Fw=3A_=A0Free_TR-250_Body?= Message-ID: <3EA27CA8.1F4BE0A9.00159EE9@cs.com> EGADS! this thing had a V-12 ENGINE in it. I am not sure about but I am going to be there with an empty trailer, anyway. thanks! >All, > > Just got off the phone with a guy in Birmingham, AL that has a TR-250 body > that he would like to give away. The car had been modified for racing > and a lot of parts were "cut off". However, he does still have the > body parts that were removed. There is no engine or transmission and > the floors were cut to accomadate a Jaguar engine... >Also had a Franklin Quick Change rear end > > Anyway, if anyone is intersted, it's free to a good home, just got to > go get it. > > His name is Kent Johnston > Work- 800-633-4392 > Home- 205-599-2204 > > Dave B >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From mark at bradakis.com Wed Nov 14 02:33:13 2007 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J. Bradakis) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 02:33:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] A type overdrive noise? Message-ID: <473AC0D9.2050604@bradakis.com> A local fellow recently purchased a '69 TR6 with overdrive. Starting about 25 - 30 mph the gearbox makes an odd whining sound, sort of like a bad bearing, but not really. The noise stops as soon as you engage the overdrive. Does this symptom sound familiar to anyone? Thanks, mjb. From lunkercars at earthlink.net Wed Nov 14 08:14:23 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg Lunker Hilyer) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 08:14:23 -0700 Subject: [Fot] TRIUMPS on Transporter In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: That's good as regards Chuck's TR- I would think it pretty unlikely a car stolen in Seattle would be headed west on I-40. Greg Hilyer On Nov 12, 2007, at 2:06 AM, Tom Householder wrote: > > at the original post time and date it was east of Albquerque NM > headed west > on I 40 From walt at hot-tr6.com Wed Nov 14 11:06:10 2007 From: walt at hot-tr6.com (Walter Hollowell) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 11:06:10 -0700 Subject: [Fot] ARP question again Message-ID: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> I know the FOT site talked about this question a few weeks ago but I failed to save the informatin. I am building up a couple of TR6 blocks for racing and would like to consider ARP bolts for the main bearing caps. Does anyone have a source and or ARP part number you can forward me. Thanks for the help Walt Hollowell Abq., NM From rikrock at aol.com Wed Nov 14 13:56:52 2007 From: rikrock at aol.com (rikrock at aol.com) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 15:56:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Message-ID: <8C9F5180477D1FE-EC0-FF4@WEBMAIL-MA09.sysops.aol.com> Some interesting stuff at? www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf Rich Rock ________________________________________________________________________ Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com From cwn.fot at cwnicholls.net Wed Nov 14 15:15:28 2007 From: cwn.fot at cwnicholls.net (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 17:15:28 -0500 Subject: [Fot] ARP question again In-Reply-To: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> References: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <002e01c8270b$df0e9ee0$1342a8c0@semperon3400> You can search the FOT archives at: http://autox.team.net/pipermail/fot/ -----Original Message----- To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] ARP question again I know the FOT site talked about this question a few weeks ago but I failed to save the informatin. I am building up a couple of TR6 blocks for racing and would like to consider ARP bolts for the main bearing caps. Does anyone have a source and or ARP part number you can forward me. Thanks for the help Walt Hollowell Abq., NM From S.Janzen at comcast.net Wed Nov 14 15:59:35 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 17:59:35 -0500 Subject: [Fot] ARP question again References: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> <002e01c8270b$df0e9ee0$1342a8c0@semperon3400> Message-ID: <003901c82712$06dadb40$6501a8c0@vefadvisors.com> You can order from Ted Schumacher (sp?) at TS Imported and I think also straight from ARP, butTed may actually be less expensive. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clark W. Nicholls" To: "'Walter Hollowell'" ; Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2007 5:15 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] ARP question again > You can search the FOT archives at: > http://autox.team.net/pipermail/fot/ > > -----Original Message----- > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: [Fot] ARP question again > > I know the FOT site talked about this question a few weeks ago but I > failed > to save the informatin. > I am building up a couple of TR6 blocks for racing and would like to > consider ARP bolts for the main bearing caps. > Does anyone have a source and or ARP part number you can forward me. > Thanks for the help > Walt Hollowell > Abq., NM > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From mark at bradakis.com Wed Nov 14 18:44:20 2007 From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J. Bradakis) Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 18:44:20 -0700 Subject: [Fot] ARP question again In-Reply-To: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> References: <20071114180729.520041879EB@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <473BA474.6050106@bradakis.com> >I know the FOT site talked about this question a few weeks ago but I failed >to save the informatin. > > I save it all - http://www.team.net/archive mjb. From rikrock at aol.com Thu Nov 15 09:09:44 2007 From: rikrock at aol.com (rikrock at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:09:44 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 In-Reply-To: <002d01c82692$0f8feb70$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> References: <002d01c82692$0f8feb70$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <8C9F5B91201253E-AD4-1A78@webmail-stg-d09.sysops.aol.com> -----Original Message----- From: Steven Preiss To: rikrock at aol.com Sent: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 2:42 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Heady stuff. This was the time when I was first becoming addicted to sports car racing, and it is thrilling to see the cars as they were at that time. Interesting to see the TR3s fitted out with what look like TR6 wheels. I love the captions and copy, too. Really captures the spirit of the time. The rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. Trying to think why MG is absent. I know the Bs were running at the time. Anyone care to elucidate? Thanks Rich. ----- Original Message ----- From: rikrock at aol.com> To: fot at autox.team.net> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:56 AM Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > Some interesting stuff at? www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf > > > > Rich Rock > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 From Fubog1 at aol.com Thu Nov 15 09:22:56 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:22:56 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/15/2007 11:10:23 AM Eastern Standard Time, rikrock at aol.com writes: The rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. ... and some things haven't changed... Glen hates the evil hun-mobiles ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Nov 15 09:28:04 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:28:04 EST Subject: [Fot] WATKINS GLEN 2008 Message-ID: http://www.grandprixfestival.com/ FoT, If you are FoT and plan to be with us at Watkins Glen, but may not enter the ZIPPO GRAND PRIX................................... The Village of Watkins Glen is featuring the TRIUMPH MARQUE. They have several activities during the weekend and will give some preferential treatment to the TRIUMPH. All of these events have limited enrollment. My contact with the Village indicates that everyone should enroll in these events early. http://www.grandprixfestival.com/ If you have a historically significant car, or a car of special interest, that could be displayed, (such as the Triumph TRS) please let me know, and I will put you in touch with my contact person, directly. Joe A PS: I still have not heard from "ANDREA" on the hotel reservation. From mlcooknj at msn.com Thu Nov 15 10:50:04 2007 From: mlcooknj at msn.com (michael cook) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 12:50:04 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Message-ID: If there was no other choice, I would run TR6 wheels on my TR3 and have a photo from Lime Rock, 1967 showing me going into the esses with those wheels. However, we used them only as a last resort because the wider steel wheels were even more likely at the bolt circle than the narrow ones. I usually had rain tires on them. At the race when the photo was taken, I think one of my American Mags had cracked and I had no spare so used the TR6 wheels. Mike Cook ----- Original Message ----- From: rikrock at aol.com Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 11:09 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 -----Original Message----- From: Steven Preiss To: rikrock at aol.com Sent: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 2:42 am Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 Heady stuff. This was the time when I was first becoming addicted to sports car racing, and it is thrilling to see the cars as they were at that time. Interesting to see the TR3s fitted out with what look like TR6 wheels. I love the captions and copy, too. Really captures the spirit of the time. The rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. Trying to think why MG is absent. I know the Bs were running at the time. Anyone care to elucidate? Thanks Rich. ----- Original Message ----- From: rikrock at aol.com> To: fot at autox.team.net> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:56 AM Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > Some interesting stuff at? www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf > > > > Rich Rock > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolc mp00050000000003 Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From EDENMA at aol.com Thu Nov 15 10:17:28 2007 From: EDENMA at aol.com (EDENMA at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 12:17:28 EST Subject: [Fot] Fot Digest, Vol 12, Issue 23 Message-ID: Hi Joe! When are you planning to go to Wyotech? Cheers! Mark ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Thu Nov 15 10:48:34 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:48:34 -0600 Subject: [Fot] crank Message-ID: <200711151747.lAFHknJs262668@ns3.geneseo.net> I'm going to put a TR3 - 4A crank on eBay but wanted to give the listers first shot at it. It's in unbelievably good condition: STANDARD size - never been ground journals checked - polished - doesn't need to be ground, either magnafluxed - not cracked plugs removed, cleaned, replaced $200 uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From triosan at gmail.com Thu Nov 15 11:34:24 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 10:34:24 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Source for oil pan studs and pictures of crank scraper/windage tray Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711151034j6ddda992o48798043718698bb@mail.gmail.com> A while back I bought a set of stainless steel studs for the TR6 oil pan. These had Allen head holes on the ends to drive them in, and stainless nuts with flanges. Does anyone know a source for this kit? Also, you can see pictures of it, and the crank scraper and the windage tray I had installed on my racing TR6 engine at: http://picasaweb.google.com/Triosan/WindageTrayScraprerAndStuds -- Chuck Arnold From EDENMA at aol.com Thu Nov 15 11:37:23 2007 From: EDENMA at aol.com (EDENMA at aol.com) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 13:37:23 EST Subject: [Fot] Fot Digest, Vol 12, Issue 23 Message-ID: Woops! Thank you Joe Curry! I must have hit the wrong button and sent my reply to the wrong email address. I had intended to respond to Joe Alexander's page directly. Cheers! Mark ______________________________________________________________________________ ______ In a message dated 11/15/2007 10:26:13 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, spitlist at cox.net writes: Mark, When addressing Joe on the FOT list, you will need to be more specific. There are at least a half dozen of us! :) Joe C. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+spitlist=cox.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of EDENMA at aol.com Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 10:17 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Fot Digest, Vol 12, Issue 23 Hi Joe! When are you planning to go to Wyotech? Cheers! Mark ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From kaskas at cox.net Thu Nov 15 12:53:53 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 11:53:53 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 References: <002d01c82692$0f8feb70$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> <8C9F5B91201253E-AD4-1A78@webmail-stg-d09.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <003e01c827c1$4067e060$3f0ec548@RW> In 1968 the MG's were not near quick enough to compete with the Porsche 911, TR-250 and the Datsuns. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 8:09 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > -----Original Message----- > > From: Steven Preiss > > To: rikrock at aol.com > > Sent: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 2:42 am > > Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > > > > > > Heady stuff. This was the time when I was first becoming addicted to > sports car racing, and it is thrilling to see the cars as they were at > that time. Interesting to see the TR3s fitted out with what look like TR6 > wheels. I love the captions and copy, too. Really captures the spirit of > the time. The rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. Trying to > think why MG is absent. I know the Bs were running at the time. Anyone > care to elucidate? Thanks Rich. ----- Original Message ----- From: > rikrock at aol.com> To: fot at autox.team.net> Sent: Thursday, November 15, > 2007 7:56 AM Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > Some > interesting stuff at? www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf > > > > > Rich Rock > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - > http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - > http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From henry at henryfrye.com Thu Nov 15 13:50:37 2007 From: henry at henryfrye.com (Henry Frye) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 15:50:37 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication Message-ID: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> I just looked at Chuck's pictures of his crank scraper and I have been meaning to toss out this question on crank scrapers. I understand their purpose is to cut down on the turbulent atmosphere inside the crankcase. Sounds like a good thing, control the oil better so the crank and rods are spinning in cleaner air. Less resistance to engine rotation, more horsepower. OK, sounds fine, but I always thought it was that chaotic environment of oil being tossed about in the crankcase was the 'splash lubrication' that the cam lobes and tappets need to stay alive. What am I missing??? Not to mention the issue that more and more of our oil choices lack an effective additive package for flat tappet engines... From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 15 14:32:32 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 13:32:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: probably that it's more chaotic than you would believe, and a crank scraper really just pulls the oil off the crank--it doesn't do that much to reduce chaos. You can easily wind two quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that weight -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Henry Frye Sent: Thu 11/15/2007 12:50 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication I just looked at Chuck's pictures of his crank scraper and I have been meaning to toss out this question on crank scrapers. I understand their purpose is to cut down on the turbulent atmosphere inside the crankcase. Sounds like a good thing, control the oil better so the crank and rods are spinning in cleaner air. Less resistance to engine rotation, more horsepower. OK, sounds fine, but I always thought it was that chaotic environment of oil being tossed about in the crankcase was the 'splash lubrication' that the cam lobes and tappets need to stay alive. What am I missing??? Not to mention the issue that more and more of our oil choices lack an effective additive package for flat tappet engines... Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 15 16:14:54 2007 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 18:14:54 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: > really just pulls the oil off the crank--it doesn't do that much to reduce> chaos. You can easily wind two quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that> weight Is that where the term "windage tray" comes from? Is it pronounced windage like Kentucky windage or like what it takes to wind up a toy? John From stutzmans at comcast.net Thu Nov 15 16:59:03 2007 From: stutzmans at comcast.net (Stutzman) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 18:59:03 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 References: Message-ID: <001901c827e3$81f22a50$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> I ran TR6 wheels on my TR4 in SVRA in the mid 80's - why - they were cheap! Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: "michael cook" To: ; "fot" Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 12:50 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > If there was no other choice, I would run TR6 wheels on my TR3 and have a > photo from Lime Rock, 1967 showing me going into the esses with those > wheels. > However, we used them only as a last resort because the wider steel wheels > were even more likely at the bolt circle than the narrow ones. I usually > had > rain tires on them. > > At the race when the photo was taken, I think one of my American Mags had > cracked and I had no spare so used the TR6 wheels. > > Mike Cook > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: rikrock at aol.com > Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 11:09 AM > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Steven Preiss > > To: rikrock at aol.com > > Sent: Wed, 14 Nov 2007 2:42 am > > Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumphs Racing in 1968 > > > > > > Heady stuff. This was the time when I was first becoming addicted to > sports > car racing, and it is thrilling to see the cars as they were at that time. > Interesting to see the TR3s fitted out with what look like TR6 wheels. I > love > the captions and copy, too. Really captures the spirit of the time. The > rivalry seemed to be between Porches and TRs. Trying to think why MG is > absent. I know the Bs were running at the time. Anyone care to elucidate? > Thanks Rich. ----- Original Message ----- From: rikrock at aol.com> To: > fot at autox.team.net> Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 7:56 AM Subject: > [Fot] > Triumphs Racing in 1968 > Some interesting stuff at? > www.templeoftriumph.org/tsoa/TSOAMar69.pdf > > > > Rich Rock > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > > > Email and AIM finally together. You've gotta check out free AOL Mail! - > http://mail.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - > http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolc > mp00050000000003 > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From kaskas at cox.net Thu Nov 15 17:03:29 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 16:03:29 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: <00cb01c827e4$1ec087a0$3f0ec548@RW> Although oil in "winding up" the expression is windage as in "win-dedge". It pays to pay be aware of his circumstance......... ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Herrera" To: "Bill Babcock" ; "Henry Frye" ; Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 3:14 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication >> really just pulls the oil off the crank--it doesn't do that much to >> reduce> > chaos. You can easily wind two quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that> > weight > Is that where the term "windage tray" comes from? Is it pronounced windage > like Kentucky windage or like what it takes to wind up a toy? > > John > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From britbits at tiu.net Thu Nov 15 21:13:22 2007 From: britbits at tiu.net (Jim) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 22:13:22 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Source for oil pan studs and pictures of crank scraper/windage tray In-Reply-To: <8cbd782d0711151034j6ddda992o48798043718698bb@mail.gmail.com> References: <8cbd782d0711151034j6ddda992o48798043718698bb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <000001c82807$07c08a00$05e435cf@jrg> Chuck, Those studs are just long set-screws. Any decent industrial supply house should be able to provide them (pop one out and measure the length) or you can get them from McMaster (www.mcmaster.com). And the shouldered nuts also. Or if you can wait until after Tamale day I'll check locally. We used them all the time at my previous job. Cheers, Jim Dallas '76 DM Spitfire and a few other toys ;) -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+britbits=tiu.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+britbits=tiu.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Chuck Arnold Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 12:34 PM To: Friends; Triumph Subject: [Fot] Source for oil pan studs and pictures of crank scraper/windage tray A while back I bought a set of stainless steel studs for the TR6 oil pan. These had Allen head holes on the ends to drive them in, and stainless nuts with flanges. Does anyone know a source for this kit? Also, you can see pictures of it, and the crank scraper and the windage tray I had installed on my racing TR6 engine at: http://picasaweb.google.com/Triosan/WindageTrayScraprerAndStuds -- Chuck Arnold Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 15 21:54:57 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 20:54:57 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FB9E@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: A windage tray and a scraper are not exactly the same thing. The scraper is a piece of metal shaped to fit close to the crank so it can scrape off the oil that gets wound onto the crank. The windage tray may incorporate a scraper, but it's a cover that fits between the crank and the oil pan intended to keep the oil in the sump from being blown around by the wind generated by the crankshaft. The motor I built for Peyote has a windage tray, a scraper, and a baffled sump, all aimed at getting oil off the crankshaft and down into the sump. And it's pronounced windage as in blowing in the wind. -----Original Message----- From: John Herrera [mailto:jrherrera90 at hotmail.com] Sent: Thu 11/15/2007 3:14 PM To: Bill Babcock; Henry Frye; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > really just pulls the oil off the crank--it doesn't do that much to reduce> chaos. You can easily wind two quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that> weight Is that where the term "windage tray" comes from? Is it pronounced windage like Kentucky windage or like what it takes to wind up a toy? John From henry at henryfrye.com Fri Nov 16 06:46:14 2007 From: henry at henryfrye.com (Henry Frye) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 08:46:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBA0@server.Triumph.local> OK, Bill, I hear you. Thanks... I am having difficulty visualizing two quarts of oil being wound up on the crank, though! > -----Original Message----- > From: Bill Babcock [mailto:BillB at bnj.com] > Sent: November 15, 2007 4:33 PM > To: Henry Frye; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: RE: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > probably that it's more chaotic than you would believe, and a > crank scraper really just pulls the oil off the crank--it > doesn't do that much to reduce chaos. You can easily wind two > quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that weight > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Henry Frye > Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > What am I missing??? From jaxonracing at yahoo.com Fri Nov 16 09:40:46 2007 From: jaxonracing at yahoo.com (Jay Creel) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 08:40:46 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs Message-ID: <917020.28322.qm@web53511.mail.re2.yahoo.com> FOT, I am looking for a new "dearched" leaf spring for my HP Triumph Spitfire. I had spoken with Rick Cline some time ago regarding a spring but there were some challenges with the supplier at the time. Since then, I have continued to use my "stock" dearched spring but I am looking to upgrade. Does anyone know of a source for a composite leaf spring for a racing spitfire? Contact information and if they have specifications on file?? I will also reach out to Rick C. to discuss the possibility of getting a famous Rick Cline spring. thanks Jay R. Creel ____________________________________________________________________________________ Get easy, one-click access to your favorites. Make Yahoo! your homepage. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From tedtsimx at bright.net Fri Nov 16 12:54:52 2007 From: tedtsimx at bright.net (Ted Schumacher) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 14:54:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBA0@server.Triumph.local> References: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBA0@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: <473DF58C.4060104@bright.net> Henry Frye wrote: > OK, Bill, I hear you. Thanks... > > I am having difficulty visualizing two quarts of oil being wound up on > the crank, though! > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Bill Babcock [mailto:BillB at bnj.com] >> Sent: November 15, 2007 4:33 PM >> To: Henry Frye; fot at autox.team.net >> Subject: RE: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication >> >> probably that it's more chaotic than you would believe, and a >> crank scraper really just pulls the oil off the crank--it >> doesn't do that much to reduce chaos. You can easily wind two >> quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that weight >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Henry Frye >> Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication >> >> What am I missing??? >> > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > List, for what it's worth, Chrysler offers, at least used to offer, a windage tray big block Dodge engine. Both 413 and 440. These were common engines in the RV industry in the '70's and '80's. This little $14 option generated 12 hp. Actually, it didn't generate any HP, but rather freed up 12 hp that could be used for other things, such as getting launched from a stop sign or merging. That much power was lost dragging the crank through the oil mist. Remember the IC engine is only an air pump. And, it pumps a lot of air in a big displacement engine. Ted -- Ted Schumacher tedtsimx at bright.net http://www.tsimportedautomotive.com 108 S. Jefferson St. Pandora, Ohio, USA 45877 Fax: 419.384.3272 (24 Hrs.) Phone: 800.543.6648 (US & Canada) Tech/ Gen. Information/ Worldwide: 419.384.3022 From John.Reed at wilson.com Fri Nov 16 13:24:48 2007 From: John.Reed at wilson.com (John.Reed at wilson.com) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 12:24:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBA0@server.Triumph.local> Message-ID: Henry, I put on a crank scraper with my last rebuild. I swear the engine spun quicker. Regards, John Reed Staff Photographer Wilson Sporting Goods Co. 8750 W Bryn Mawr Ave, Chicago, Illinois 60631, USA Tel. + 1.773.714.6895, fax +1.773.714.4585 John.Reed at wilson.com www.wilson.com www.amersports.com Please note that effective immediately, my e-mail , phone number and street address have changed. Please update your files accordingly. "Henry Frye" Sent by: fot-bounces+john.reed=wilson.com at autox.team.net 11/16/07 05:46 AM To "Bill Babcock" , cc Subject Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication OK, Bill, I hear you. Thanks... I am having difficulty visualizing two quarts of oil being wound up on the crank, though! > -----Original Message----- > From: Bill Babcock [mailto:BillB at bnj.com] > Sent: November 15, 2007 4:33 PM > To: Henry Frye; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: RE: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > probably that it's more chaotic than you would believe, and a > crank scraper really just pulls the oil off the crank--it > doesn't do that much to reduce chaos. You can easily wind two > quarts of oil onto a crank--think of that weight > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Henry Frye > Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > What am I missing??? Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot This e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. From tr5racer at btinternet.com Fri Nov 16 13:43:28 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 20:43:28 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Triumphs racing in 1968 Message-ID: <442846.72428.qm@web86602.mail.ird.yahoo.com> I raced from the late 1970's to the mid 1980's with TR6 steel wheels on my TR5 and never had any problems however I only had about 150bhp at the wheels in those days not the 200+ I have now!! Mike Hughes --------------------------------- Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now. From rikrock at aol.com Fri Nov 16 13:56:50 2007 From: rikrock at aol.com (rikrock at aol.com) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 15:56:50 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <8C9F6AA585D7B7C-1268-1BE9@webmail-stg-d10.sysops.aol.com> So, you guys are saying that there is no downside to using a crank scraper in a wet-liner motor? That even with connecting rods that don't have the little oil hole like the stock rods do, enough oil gets?to the cylinder walls?? And that enough oil gets everywhere it needs to get, all the time? Rich Rock ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 From BillB at bnj.com Fri Nov 16 15:36:32 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 14:36:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <8C9F6AA585D7B7C-1268-1BE9@webmail-stg-d10.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: I've seen a video of the inside of a crankcase in a running 4 cylinder motor. Oil splash to the cylinder walls is not an issue. Remember that the full volume of air is changing under the pistons at 100 times per second at 6K RPM. Two liters of air swapping all over the place at 100 times per second. The crankshaft is dragging a cyclone of oil and air around behind it. We visualize it as something running at 60 RPM, oil spinning lightly off the crankshaft as it slowly turns. It doesn't look anything like that. It's not a gentle gust, it's a vicious tornado. Crank scrapers are diverting the tornado from the crankshaft. Windage trays are keeping it from jumping back out of the sump. Much more dynamic than one would naturally visualize. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of rikrock at aol.com Sent: Fri 11/16/2007 12:56 PM To: John.Reed at wilson.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication So, you guys are saying that there is no downside to using a crank scraper in a wet-liner motor? That even with connecting rods that don't have the little oil hole like the stock rods do, enough oil gets?to the cylinder walls?? And that enough oil gets everywhere it needs to get, all the time? Rich Rock ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolc mp00050000000003 Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spreiss at verizon.net Fri Nov 16 01:14:21 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:14:21 +1100 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <8C9F6AA585D7B7C-1268-1BE9@webmail-stg-d10.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <003f01c82828$b17fe150$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Kind of sheds new light on the impetus behind the development of the Wankel engine! Steve P. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: ; ; Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 9:36 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > I've seen a video of the inside of a crankcase in a running 4 cylinder motor. > Oil splash to the cylinder walls is not an issue. Remember that the full > volume of air is changing under the pistons at 100 times per second at 6K RPM. > Two liters of air swapping all over the place at 100 times per second. The > crankshaft is dragging a cyclone of oil and air around behind it. We visualize > it as something running at 60 RPM, oil spinning lightly off the crankshaft as > it slowly turns. It doesn't look anything like that. It's not a gentle gust, > it's a vicious tornado. Crank scrapers are diverting the tornado from the > crankshaft. Windage trays are keeping it from jumping back out of the sump. > Much more dynamic than one would naturally visualize. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of rikrock at aol.com > Sent: Fri 11/16/2007 12:56 PM > To: John.Reed at wilson.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > > So, you guys are saying that there is no downside to using a crank scraper in > a wet-liner motor? That even with connecting rods that don't have the little > oil hole like the stock rods do, enough oil gets?to the cylinder walls?? And > that enough oil gets everywhere it needs to get, all the time? > > Rich Rock > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - > http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolc > mp00050000000003 > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Gt6steve at aol.com Fri Nov 16 17:47:58 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:47:58 EST Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication Message-ID: Kas has a story of putting a plexi window in the block to see what was going on and the mess was totally obscuring any details. Makes you a believer. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From joeg at neb.rr.com Fri Nov 16 18:57:26 2007 From: joeg at neb.rr.com (Joe Guinan) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:57:26 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001101c828bd$3474d0e0$43a6544c@Guinan> Jay - Talk to George at Flex-A-Form. http://flex-a-form.com He has made several springs for Spitfires, and will make them to your specifications for weight rating and height. Runs about $200? Weighs about 9 pounds or something like that? Joe Guinan 751 Day Drive Fremont, NE 68025 Home Phone - 402-727-8011 joeg at neb.rr.com ------------------------------ From: Jay Creel Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs To: fot at autox.team.net FOT, I am looking for a new "dearched" leaf spring for my HP Triumph Spitfire. I had spoken with Rick Cline some time ago regarding a spring but there were some challenges with the supplier at the time. Since then, I have continued to use my "stock" dearched spring but I am looking to upgrade. Does anyone know of a source for a composite leaf spring for a racing spitfire? Contact information and if they have specifications on file?? I will also reach out to Rick C. to discuss the possibility of getting a famous Rick Cline spring. thanks Jay R. Creel From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Fri Nov 16 20:16:00 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 22:16:00 EST Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up Message-ID: Kas wrote: Although oil in "winding up" the expression is windage as in "win-dedge". It pays to pay be aware of his circumstance......... and Bill Babcock wrote: And it's pronounced windage as in blowing in the wind Whilst I have no disagreement with either of these fine fellows, if those (U.S.born) on this list wish to pronounce it "win-dedge", or "wind-age", or whathaveyou-dedge, then I have no problem with that, as long as they don't make me, (UK born), do the same: I will go merrily on my English way, pronouncing it "wine-didge" "let's call the whole thing off" Thinking about 'ropes' of oil being pulled around inside the crankcase by the crankshaft, as it rotates at howmanyrpm? Best wine-didge regards Leon From mdporter at dfn.com Fri Nov 16 20:25:40 2007 From: mdporter at dfn.com (Michael Porter) Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 20:25:40 -0700 Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <473E5F34.3030807@dfn.com> Guyots3 at wmconnect.com wrote: > > I will go merrily on my English way, pronouncing it "wine-didge" > > Gee, I didn't know that they say in England, "my, the wined is blowing briskly today." Learn something every day.... Cheers. -- Michael Porter Roswell, NM Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking distance.... From tr4.tony at virgin.net Sat Nov 17 03:16:17 2007 From: tr4.tony at virgin.net (TR4Tony) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 10:16:17 -0000 Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up References: <473E5F34.3030807@dfn.com> Message-ID: <006101c82902$e44ffd60$0ab5a8c0@PBA.INT> I think that comes after the 'ooooo aaaaar whar's moi coider ......' ----- Original Message ----- From: "Michael Porter" To: Cc: Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 3:25 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] it's a wind-up > Guyots3 at wmconnect.com wrote: >> >> I will go merrily on my English way, pronouncing it "wine-didge" >> >> > > Gee, I didn't know that they say in England, "my, the wined is blowing > briskly today." > > > Learn something every day.... > > > Cheers. > > -- > > > Michael Porter > Roswell, NM > > > Never let anyone drive you crazy when you know it's within walking > distance.... > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Sat Nov 17 07:32:22 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 08:32:22 -0600 Subject: [Fot] CVAR Last race of the year Message-ID: <000e01c82926$abe11490$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> I know many in the midwest have packed their cars away for the winter but if you want to race one more time this year, CVAR is holding it's last 2007 (actually first 20087 season) race in far north Texas. The track is new and we will be holding the first ever sanctioned race an we would be remiss if we didn't invite the FoT. There have been plenty of delays in opening this track so we haven't talked it up very much but the reports coming back is that it will become our favorite track. Eagles Canyon Raceway is the beautiful culmination of years worth of research, planning, design, and meticulous construction in the rolling hills of North Central Texas. Designed by Rob Wilson, one of the world's top racing instructors, Eagles Canyon Raceway features 2.55 miles, 4 straights over 1,300 feet long, 15 turns, and 70 feet of elevation change. Eagles Canyon is a true driver's track, and is planned to host all classes of events from the top level racing series to club racing and private HPDE days. http://www.eaglescanyon.com/php/welcome.php November Nov 30th-Dec 2nd 1st Annual Eagles Canyon Extravaganza Eagles Canyon Raceway Slidell, Tx. (Just NW of D/FW) A brand new, top notch facility and track Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From Gt6steve at aol.com Sat Nov 17 08:23:45 2007 From: Gt6steve at aol.com (Gt6steve at aol.com) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 10:23:45 EST Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up Message-ID: Mike, Do you still have any of the old style wind up watches? ;-)) Steve, who gets winded winding up watches... ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From ofbracing at nefcom.net Sat Nov 17 09:04:40 2007 From: ofbracing at nefcom.net (Don Marshall) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 11:04:40 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumph Ghetto at Roebling Road Message-ID: <001101c82933$900840b0$2001a8c0@Dell5100Laptop> FOTers, dont forget the VDCA event at Roebling Road (Savannah GA) in early December. We expect to have the Triumph Ghetto set up on the grass at turn 3. This is a 3 day event with tons of track time for only $250, plus a track day on Thursday for only $125. If youre anywhere in or near the South and want a final race, this is it. Well be cooking in the Ghetto on Friday evening for Triumph drivers and their crews so please stop by. Cheers, Don No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.0/1135 - Release Date: 11/16/2007 10:58 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.0/1135 - Release Date: 11/16/2007 10:58 PM From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Sat Nov 17 10:20:13 2007 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (Steve Belfer) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 09:20:13 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: Message-ID: <000b01c8293e$1df3d790$0501000a@Chowdown> What do y'all think about this part ?: Also, what's the difference, if any, between this part and windage tray? http://www.cambridgemotorsport.com/TR4-Sump-Baffle-steel-With-Anti-Surge-Gate-for-Aluminium-Sump ~Steve B ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; ; Sent: Friday, November 16, 2007 4:47 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > Kas has a story of putting a plexi window in the block to see what was > going > on and the mess was totally obscuring any details. Makes you a believer. > > > > ************************************** > See what's new at http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From WEmery7451 at aol.com Sat Nov 17 13:39:31 2007 From: WEmery7451 at aol.com (WEmery7451 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 15:39:31 EST Subject: [Fot] Harden Valve Seats Message-ID: Dear FOT, Whenever my machinist has set up a TR-3/4 engine head for me, he automatically puts in harden valve seats for both the intake and exhaust valves . I gave one of my engine heads to Dan Styduhar, who has been helping me with the TR-3. His machinist highly recommends not to put the harden valve seats in for the intake valve. A lot of material is ground out the cast iron head to install the valve seats, and there is not a lot of material between the intake and exhaust valves to begin with. My initial guesses would be: -There are two different materials involved -- cast iron and steel. Maybe the steel valve seats would not count as material being replaced, and that the cast iron could crack under the seats. -If there is not a great deal of exhaust gasses blowing past the closed intake valves, the intake valves would not need the harden seats -- keeping in mind that there is a tremendous pressure surge during the combustion stroke. Does anyone have any thought on this subject? ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From WEmery7451 at aol.com Sat Nov 17 14:03:57 2007 From: WEmery7451 at aol.com (WEmery7451 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 16:03:57 EST Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR Message-ID: Dear FOT, A battery went dead in one of our Mazdas. Down through the years when this would happen, I would pull out the battery, buy another one, and install it. This time, I was in a hurry and drove the car to an Advanced Auto Parts store so that they could change out the battery in the parking lot. I was told to plug a power source into the cigarette lighter socket before they would disconnect the battery. They said that if they do not do this, some Jap cars lock up and have to be towed to a dealer to be reset. Neither of our Mazdas have this feature, since I have had the batteries disconnected in both of them. Has anybody ever heard of this issue? If this is true, I believe that it is the dumbest thing that any manufacturer could design into a vehicle. Batteries can sometimes disconnect themselves -- corrosion or loose terminals. Someone could be driving in the middle of nowhere out west, get shut down, and have to be towed several hundred miles to a dealer. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From chris at tr4-racing.de Sat Nov 17 15:09:53 2007 From: chris at tr4-racing.de (Marx Christian tr4-racing) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 23:09:53 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Spa - 1966 Message-ID: <00f401c82966$95479ac0$6402a8c0@HOME> I hope you like this......big american movie: http://www.youtube.com/v/iw-MPf4GUU0&rel=1 Cheers Chris From Herald948 at aol.com Sat Nov 17 15:22:00 2007 From: Herald948 at aol.com (Herald948 at aol.com) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 17:22:00 EST Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR Message-ID: In a message dated 11/17/2007 4:04:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, WEmery7451 at aol.com writes: I was told to plug a power source into the cigarette lighter socket before they would disconnect the battery. They said that if they do not do this, some Jap cars lock up and have to be towed to a dealer to be reset. Neither of our Mazdas have this feature, since I have had the batteries disconnected in both of them. Has anybody ever heard of this issue? ==AM== I'm no expert on modern cars, but I've never heard of that, either. One good thing about the power source in the lighter socket is that it might help to preserve radio button presets; otherwise, diconnecting and reconnecting a battery might cause some computer chip in some cars to reboot or restart. After a minute or so, it should reprogram itself and all would be well again. At least that's what I'VE heard. ;-) --Andy Mace (the period Bendix AM/FM is the most sophisticated bit of electronics in the Herald!) *Mrs Irrelevant: Oh, is it a jet? *Man: Well, no ... It's not so much of a jet, it's more your, er, Triumph Herald engine with wings. -- Cut-price Airlines Sketch, Monty Python's Flying Circus (22) Check out the North American Triumph Sports 6 (Vitesse 6) and Triumph Herald Database: _http://triumph-herald.us_ (http://triumph-herald.us/) ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From BillB at bnj.com Sat Nov 17 15:51:23 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 14:51:23 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR References: Message-ID: The reason for connecting a power supply while disconnecting your battery is to maintain any presets that are not sophisticated enough to use non-volatile memory. The more well engineered a car is, the LESS likely this is to be a problem. But the presets are not critical, and they won't lock up your car. This is more a matter of morons behind the counter swapping urban legends than morons at the design table. That said, there are cars that really don't like having no battery power, and a lot of them have two batteries now. My wife's Bently has two, and so does my F350 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of WEmery7451 at aol.com Sent: Sat 11/17/2007 1:03 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR Dear FOT, A battery went dead in one of our Mazdas. Down through the years when this would happen, I would pull out the battery, buy another one, and install it. This time, I was in a hurry and drove the car to an Advanced Auto Parts store so that they could change out the battery in the parking lot. I was told to plug a power source into the cigarette lighter socket before they would disconnect the battery. They said that if they do not do this, some Jap cars lock up and have to be towed to a dealer to be reset. Neither of our Mazdas have this feature, since I have had the batteries disconnected in both of them. Has anybody ever heard of this issue? If this is true, I believe that it is the dumbest thing that any manufacturer could design into a vehicle. Batteries can sometimes disconnect themselves -- corrosion or loose terminals. Someone could be driving in the middle of nowhere out west, get shut down, and have to be towed several hundred miles to a dealer. ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sat Nov 17 16:19:35 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (spitlist at cox.net) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 15:19:35 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20071117181935.B0EBX.67659.root@fed1wml06.mgt.cox.net> The really frustrating thing about removing a battery without maintaining power is on those anti-theft radio systems. They require you to remember the codes you put in and if you are like me, you seldom do! Joe C. ---- Herald948 at aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 11/17/2007 4:04:25 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > WEmery7451 at aol.com writes: > > I was told to plug a power source into the cigarette lighter socket before > they would disconnect the battery. They said that if they do not do this, > some > Jap cars lock up and have to be towed to a dealer to be reset. Neither of > our > Mazdas have this feature, since I have had the batteries disconnected in both > of them. > > Has anybody ever heard of this issue? > > > ==AM== > I'm no expert on modern cars, but I've never heard of that, either. One good > thing about the power source in the lighter socket is that it might help to > preserve radio button presets; otherwise, diconnecting and reconnecting a > battery might cause some computer chip in some cars to reboot or restart. After > a minute or so, it should reprogram itself and all would be well again. At > least that's what I'VE heard. ;-) > > --Andy Mace (the period Bendix AM/FM is the most sophisticated bit of > electronics in the Herald!) From koblinger at verizon.net Sat Nov 17 18:08:16 2007 From: koblinger at verizon.net (Kurt Oblinger) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 17:08:16 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Spa - 1966 In-Reply-To: <00f401c82966$95479ac0$6402a8c0@HOME> References: <00f401c82966$95479ac0$6402a8c0@HOME> Message-ID: <473F9080.4030203@verizon.net> Still takes my breath away. The camera car was a GT40 driven by Phil Hill. It amazes me to look at the track, no barriers, ditches, buildings, phone poles, stone mile markers, all right at the edge of the track. Brilliant and frightening at the same time. Cheers, Kurt O. Marx Christian tr4-racing wrote: >I hope you like this......big american movie: > >http://www.youtube.com/v/iw-MPf4GUU0&rel=1 > >Cheers >Chris >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vintage.racer at comcast.net Sat Nov 17 18:28:25 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 17:28:25 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Spa - 1966 In-Reply-To: <473F9080.4030203@verizon.net> References: <00f401c82966$95479ac0$6402a8c0@HOME> <473F9080.4030203@verizon.net> Message-ID: <000001c82982$50fe75c0$f2fb6140$@racer@comcast.net> Say it over and over until you believe it...I trust my mechanics, I trust my mechanics... Gary -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Kurt Oblinger Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 5:08 PM To: Marx Christian tr4-racing Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Spa - 1966 Still takes my breath away. The camera car was a GT40 driven by Phil Hill. It amazes me to look at the track, no barriers, ditches, buildings, phone poles, stone mile markers, all right at the edge of the track. Brilliant and frightening at the same time. Cheers, Kurt O. Marx Christian tr4-racing wrote: >I hope you like this......big american movie: > >http://www.youtube.com/v/iw-MPf4GUU0&rel=1 > >Cheers >Chris >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Sat Nov 17 18:58:35 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Sat, 17 Nov 2007 19:58:35 -0600 Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available Message-ID: <200711180156.lAI1upR9342147@ns3.geneseo.net> Some time ago I designed a crank scraper for the TR3 - 4 engine. I designed two, actually - one for the stock crank / stock rod engine, and one for the Moldex / Carillo engine. Several of us are using them. Since designing these things and programming for laser cutting is very time consuming, I have not made them for the Spitfire or TR6 engine. They are made from 1/8" steel and mount under the heads of three main cap bolts. They come with three hardened washers to go between the bolt heads and the scraper. You can see a picture on Tony's site -- www.Tonydrews.com -- link "Jack's Parts" There was not much interest at the time so I had a limited run made of each configuration. I still have a few of them left. I'll sell the ones I still have for $64.95 apiece plus shipping. uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From jaboruch at netzero.net Sat Nov 17 19:42:37 2007 From: jaboruch at netzero.net (Joe Boruch) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 02:42:37 GMT Subject: [Fot] Harden Valve Seats Message-ID: <20071117.214237.17726.1@webmail21.dca.untd.com> Bill, I have only been doing them on the exhaust, since that is for the most part where any valve recession should occur. I have noticed, however, that when I do not run air cleaners I have some intake valve recession. I think another challenge on the intake side to to get it to blend well enough not to interfere with intake flow. Joe(B) -- WEmery7451 at aol.com wrote: Dear FOT, Whenever my machinist has set up a TR-3/4 engine head for me, he automatically puts in harden valve seats for both the intake and exhaust valves . I gave one of my engine heads to Dan Styduhar, who has been helping me with the TR-3. His machinist highly recommends not to put the harden valve seats in for the intake valve. A lot of material is ground out the cast iron head to install the valve seats, and there is not a lot of material between the intake and exhaust valves to begin with. My initial guesses would be: -There are two different materials involved -- cast iron and steel. Maybe the steel valve seats would not count as material being replaced, and that the cast iron could crack under the seats. -If there is not a great deal of exhaust gasses blowing past the closed intake valves, the intake valves would not need the harden seats -- keeping in mind that there is a tremendous pressure surge during the combustion stroke. Does anyone have any thought on this subject? ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _____________________________________________________________ Click for free info on rehab treatments for drug & alcohol dependency. http://thirdpartyoffers.netzero.net/TGL2211/fc/Ioyw6ijmXabC59PFdUwCqov8km3B4y M40dcPLX3YCSvcpyq7RYnpLq/ From BillDentin at aol.com Sun Nov 18 08:43:13 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 10:43:13 EST Subject: [Fot] it's a wind-up Message-ID: In a message dated 11/16/2007 9:16:32 PM Central Standard Time, Guyots3 at wmconnect.com writes: > Whilst I have no disagreement with either of these fine fellows, if those > (U.S.born) on this list wish to pronounce it "win-dedge", or "wind-age", or > whathaveyou-dedge, then I have no problem with that, as long as they don't > make me, > (UK born), do the same: > > I will go merrily on my English way, pronouncing it "wine-didge" > > Leon... We could do that on this side of the pond too (out of respect for our British cars), but my guess is over here it would end up "whine-didge". We're good at that. Bill (Damdinger) PS...actually...in the Beady Eye tent it would end up "wine & cheese-dish" ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 09:53:30 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 11:53:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] CVAR Last race of the year....EAGLE'S CANYON Message-ID: <411F9C8F.64B98CCD.00159EE9@cs.com> Jack & I were there for a Classic Motorsports magazine test day. Contruction was going on and it was difficult to get a sense of the track. However, it is great to know that there is another choice. Joe A >I know many in the midwest have packed their cars away for the winter but if >you want to race one more time this year, CVAR is holding it's last 2007 >(actually first 20087 season) race in far north Texas. The track is new and we >will be holding the first ever sanctioned race an we would be remiss if we >didn't invite the FoT. There have been plenty of delays in opening this track >so we haven't talked it up very much but the reports coming back is that it >will become our favorite track. > >Eagles Canyon Raceway is the beautiful culmination of years worth of research, >planning, design, and meticulous construction in the rolling hills of North >Central Texas. > >Designed by Rob Wilson, one of the world's top racing instructors, Eagles >Canyon Raceway features 2.55 miles, 4 straights over 1,300 feet long, 15 >turns, and 70 feet of elevation change. > >Eagles Canyon is a true driver's track, and is planned to host all classes of >events from the top level racing series to club racing and private HPDE days. > >http://www.eaglescanyon.com/php/welcome.php > > November > > > Nov 30th-Dec 2nd > 1st Annual Eagles Canyon Extravaganza > > > > Eagles Canyon Raceway > > Slidell, Tx. (Just NW of D/FW) > > > > A brand new, top notch facility and track > > > >Bob Kramer >rkramer3 at austin.rr.com >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillDentin at aol.com Sun Nov 18 12:14:20 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 14:14:20 EST Subject: [Fot] Seeking Dennis Delap Message-ID: Dennis... I don't have a current email address for you. Please contact me. Bill Dentinger ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au Sun Nov 18 14:01:44 2007 From: jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au (Jim Cun) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 13:01:44 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi Guys, Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs steel for a TR race car? Regards Jim Make the switch to the world's best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html From tony at tonydrews.com Sun Nov 18 14:14:37 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 15:14:37 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel In-Reply-To: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20071118211526.F24CC187A46@autox.team.net> Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. - Tony At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >Hi Guys, > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >steel for a TR race car? > >Regards Jim > > > Make the switch to the world's >best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 14:57:34 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 16:57:34 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com> I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of jewelry that I hated to cover up. Joe >Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With >proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more >troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. > >- Tony > >At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>Hi Guys, >> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>steel for a TR race car? >> >>Regards Jim >> >> >> Make the switch to the world's >>best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>_______________________________________________ >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >>Fot mailing list >>Fot at autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au Sun Nov 18 15:13:11 2007 From: jimcun2001 at yahoo.com.au (Jim Cun) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 14:13:11 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <885586.45039.qm@web51812.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Kas, We have a couple of guys "engine builders" here in OZ who say that using an alloy flywheel makes it difficult to get off the line. I would not even consider a steel flywheel unless it has the same shape and weight of alloy. That is not likely. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jim Cun" To: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:01 PM Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel > Hi Guys, > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs > steel for a TR race car? > > Regards Jim > > > Make the switch to the world's > best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. > http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Make the switch to the world's best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 15:24:12 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 17:24:12 EST Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: Jim, My steel flywheel is 10lbs, has no steel insert, and has always stayed on the crankshaft. The secret of the weight is in the machining. Joe A > I would not > even consider a steel flywheel unless it has the same shape and > weight of > alloy. That is not likely. > From chris at tr4-racing.de Sun Nov 18 16:15:50 2007 From: chris at tr4-racing.de (Marx Christian tr4-racing) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 00:15:50 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <001701c82a38$f997cef0$6402a8c0@HOME> My flywheel is 3,95 kg of weight without ringgear. So far a trouble free unit. Cheers Chris Hi Guys, Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs steel for a TR race car? Regards Jim Make the switch to the world's best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From chris at tr4-racing.de Sun Nov 18 17:04:22 2007 From: chris at tr4-racing.de (Marx Christian tr4-racing) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 01:04:22 +0100 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <002c01c82a3f$c91a9d50$6402a8c0@HOME> Sorry I've forgotten......it is a steel wheel. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tony Drews" To: "Marx Christian tr4-racing" Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 1:00 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > Is it steel or is it aluminum? > > - Tony > > At 05:15 PM 11/18/2007, you wrote: > >My flywheel is 3,95 kg of weight without ringgear. > >So far a trouble free unit. > > > >Cheers > >Chris > > > > > >Hi Guys, > > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs > > steel for a TR race car? > > > > > > Regards Jim > > > > > > > > Make the switch to the world's > > best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. > > http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From kaskas at cox.net Sun Nov 18 17:26:09 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 16:26:09 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com> Message-ID: <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> It is sometimes confusing when referring to other than alloy flywheels, some are steel and others are CAST IRON. With a steel wheel I can see getting the weight out of the outside diameter and the total down but I'd be very very careful doing this with cast iron. ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" ; "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:57 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel >I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of jewelry that I >hated to cover up. > > Joe > > > >>Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With >>proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more >>troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. >> >>- Tony >> >>At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>>Hi Guys, >>> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>>steel for a TR race car? >>> >>>Regards Jim >>> >>> >>> Make the switch to the world's >>>best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>>http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>>_______________________________________________ >>>http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> >>>Fot mailing list >>>Fot at autox.team.net >>>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>_______________________________________________ >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >>Fot mailing list >>Fot at autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 17:32:30 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 19:32:30 EST Subject: [Fot] Liners to Be Bored Message-ID: FoT, A couple of us are going to be doing some liner boring in the first week of December. If anyone would like to join in, I can supply address to send them to. There is no financial benefit to me. It does benefit the guy who took the time to develop the fixture, for me, to hold the liners. They dont have to be there by the 1st of December, but that's when ours are going to be done. The set up is pretty easy, but volume is still more efficient. J & L Engines in Allison, Iowa Joe From VANDECARR at aol.com Sun Nov 18 17:56:51 2007 From: VANDECARR at aol.com (VANDECARR at aol.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 19:56:51 EST Subject: [Fot] Battery's, Non-TR Message-ID: My brother runs a repair shop and VWs (mainly the new Bugs) must have the CPU reprogrammed by the dealer if the battery goes dead or you disconnect it. German manufacturers, Mercedes, BMW and VW will not release a lot of technical data and say that these repairs must be done by an authorized dealer. Good reason to think twice before buying these cars. Dean VanDeCarr - lots of British but no German cars ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From fojag at hotmail.com Sun Nov 18 18:07:52 2007 From: fojag at hotmail.com (J A G) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 20:07:52 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs In-Reply-To: <001101c828bd$3474d0e0$43a6544c@Guinan> References: <001101c828bd$3474d0e0$43a6544c@Guinan> Message-ID: Jay,what specs are you considering. My dearched spring is too flat and I am looking for something with more arch and therefore less negative camber Joseph> From: joeg at neb.rr.com> To: fot at autox.team.net; jaxonracing at yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:57:26 -0600> Subject: Re: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs> > Jay - Talk to George at Flex-A-Form. http://flex-a-form.com He has made> several springs for Spitfires, and will make them to your specifications for> weight rating and height. Runs about $200? Weighs about 9 pounds or> something like that?> > > Joe Guinan> 751 Day Drive> Fremont, NE 68025> Home Phone - 402-727-8011> joeg at neb.rr.com> ------------------------------> > From: Jay Creel > Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs> To: fot at autox.team.net> > FOT,> > I am looking for a new "dearched" leaf spring for my HP Triumph Spitfire. I> had spoken with Rick Cline some time ago regarding a spring but there were> some challenges with the supplier at the time. Since then, I have continued> to use my "stock" dearched spring but I am looking to upgrade.> > Does anyone know of a source for a composite leaf spring for a racing> spitfire? Contact information and if they have specifications on file?? I> will also reach out to Rick C. to discuss the possibility of getting a> famous Rick Cline spring.> > thanks> > Jay R. Creel> _______________________________________________> http://www.team.net/donate.html> > Fot mailing list> Fot at autox.team.net> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _________________________________________________________________ Your smile counts. The more smiles you share, the more we donate. Join in. www.windowslive.com/smile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_oprsmilewlhmtagline From fpspitfire at insightbb.com Sun Nov 18 18:11:21 2007 From: fpspitfire at insightbb.com (fpspitfire at insightbb.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 20:11:21 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel In-Reply-To: <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> References: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com> <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> Message-ID: I prefer the steel flywheels over modified cast iron and aluminium flywheels. I use a steel flywheel and it weighs about 6 lbs. aaron ----- Original Message ----- From: Kas Kastner Date: Sunday, November 18, 2007 19:26 Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel To: N197TR4 at cs.com, Tony Drews , Jim Cun , Friends of Triumph > It is sometimes confusing when referring to other than alloy > flywheels, some > are steel and others are CAST IRON. With a steel wheel I can see > getting the > weight out of the outside diameter and the total down but I'd be > very very > careful doing this with cast iron. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" > ; > "Friends of Triumph" > Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:57 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > > > >I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of > jewelry that I > >hated to cover up. > > > > Joe > > > > > > > >>Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the > crankshaft. With > >>proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more > >>troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. > >> > >>- Tony > >> > >>At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: > >>>Hi Guys, > >>> > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs > >>>steel for a TR race car? > >>> > >>>Regards Jim From lunkercars at earthlink.net Sun Nov 18 18:34:23 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:34:23 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel In-Reply-To: <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> References: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com> <009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> Message-ID: <524F2685-494C-4D27-9BED-3E64676792B0@earthlink.net> Please elaborate a bit Kas. I've never heard of a steel flywheel for a TR. I always assumed they were all cast iron as OEM. Were there some that were steel from the factory? Or were the steel ones something "trick" from days gone bye? As I recall, my stock flywheel was originally something around 33lbs. and after getting it down to around 22, I have to agree that I couldn't see where any additional weight could be safely taken off. FWIW - I did find the difference to be noticeable [for the better] minus that 11lbs. - been a bit leery of going alloy. Also, I've been considering either a TR6 flywheel [for the TR4] or re- drilling my TR4 flywheel for the sake of the [much lighter] TR6 diaphragm type pressure pressure plate. - Any thoughts? Thanks in advance, Greg Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 18, 2007, at 5:26 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > It is sometimes confusing when referring to other than alloy > flywheels, some > are steel and others are CAST IRON. With a steel wheel I can see > getting the > weight out of the outside diameter and the total down but I'd be > very very > careful doing this with cast iron. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" > ; > "Friends of Triumph" > Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:57 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > > >> I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of >> jewelry that I >> hated to cover up. >> >> Joe >> >> >> >>> Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. >>> With >>> proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more >>> troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. >>> >>> - Tony >>> >>> At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>>> Hi Guys, >>>> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>>> steel for a TR race car? >>>> >>>> Regards Jim >>>> >>>> >>>> Make the switch to the world's >>>> best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>>> http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>>> >>>> Fot mailing list >>>> Fot at autox.team.net >>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>> _______________________________________________ >>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> >>> Fot mailing list >>> Fot at autox.team.net >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dale.oesterle at sbcglobal.net Sun Nov 18 18:37:31 2007 From: dale.oesterle at sbcglobal.net (dale oesterle) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 17:37:31 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <497589.3348.qm@web82208.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Can someone detail the rear spring strength for each side in a spitfire? Need stock, cline spring and/ or any other dearched racing spring? Dale J A G wrote: Jay,what specs are you considering. My dearched spring is too flat and I am looking for something with more arch and therefore less negative camber Joseph> From: joeg at neb.rr.com> To: fot at autox.team.net; jaxonracing at yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 19:57:26 -0600> Subject: Re: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs> > Jay - Talk to George at Flex-A-Form. http://flex-a-form.com He has made> several springs for Spitfires, and will make them to your specifications for> weight rating and height. Runs about $200? Weighs about 9 pounds or> something like that?> > > Joe Guinan> 751 Day Drive> Fremont, NE 68025> Home Phone - 402-727-8011> joeg at neb.rr.com> ------------------------------> > From: Jay Creel > Subject: [Fot] Composite Leaf Springs> To: fot at autox.team.net> > FOT,> > I am looking for a new "dearched" leaf spring for my HP Triumph Spitfire. I> had spoken with Rick Cline some time ago regarding a spring but there were> some challenges with the supplier at the time. Since then, I have continued> to use my "stock" dearched spring but I am looking to upgrade.> > Does anyone know of a source for a composite leaf spring for a racing> spitfire? Contact information and if they have specifications on file?? I> will also reach out to Rick C. to discuss the possibility of getting a> famous Rick Cline spring.> > thanks> > Jay R. Creel> _______________________________________________> http://www.team.net/donate.html> > Fot mailing list> Fot at autox.team.net> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _________________________________________________________________ Your smile counts. The more smiles you share, the more we donate. Join in. www.windowslive.com/smile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_oprsmilewlhmtagline Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sun Nov 18 19:34:55 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:34:55 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <368A5489.2AEC7E3F.00159EE9@cs.com><009d01c82a42$c85ac860$3f0ec548@RW> <524F2685-494C-4D27-9BED-3E64676792B0@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <00ee01c82a54$c5fe5ca0$0502a8c0@desktop> Greg, check out this link below. It seems the consensus is steel vs. aluminum. This was my thought also and I now have 2 steel flywheels for the long ended crankshaft. I'm having one of them machined to accept the Tilton racing clutch Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 http://www.cambridgemotorsport.com/TR56-Steel-Flywheels ----- Original Message ----- From: "Greg "Lunker" Hilyer" To: "Kas Kastner" Cc: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 5:34 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > Please elaborate a bit Kas. I've never heard of a steel flywheel for > a TR. I always assumed they were all cast iron as OEM. Were there > some that were steel from the factory? Or were the steel ones > something "trick" from days gone bye? As I recall, my stock flywheel > was originally something around 33lbs. and after getting it down to > around 22, I have to agree that I couldn't see where any additional > weight could be safely taken off. > FWIW - I did find the difference to be noticeable [for the better] > minus that 11lbs. - been a bit leery of going alloy. > Also, I've been considering either a TR6 flywheel [for the TR4] or re- > drilling my TR4 flywheel for the sake of the [much lighter] TR6 > diaphragm type pressure pressure plate. - Any thoughts? > Thanks in advance, > Greg Hilyer > TR4 #314 > Albuquerque NM > > > On Nov 18, 2007, at 5:26 PM, Kas Kastner wrote: > >> It is sometimes confusing when referring to other than alloy >> flywheels, some >> are steel and others are CAST IRON. With a steel wheel I can see >> getting the >> weight out of the outside diameter and the total down but I'd be >> very very >> careful doing this with cast iron. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: >> To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" >> ; >> "Friends of Triumph" >> Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 1:57 PM >> Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel >> >> >>> I like my steel flywheel....trouble free and like a piece of >>> jewelry that I >>> hated to cover up. >>> >>> Joe >>> >>> >>> >>>> Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. >>>> With >>>> proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more >>>> troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. >>>> >>>> - Tony >>>> >>>> At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>>>> Hi Guys, >>>>> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>>>> steel for a TR race car? >>>>> >>>>> Regards Jim >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Make the switch to the world's >>>>> best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>>>> http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>>>> >>>>> Fot mailing list >>>>> Fot at autox.team.net >>>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>>> >>>> Fot mailing list >>>> Fot at autox.team.net >>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>> _______________________________________________ >>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> >>> Fot mailing list >>> Fot at autox.team.net >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sun Nov 18 19:54:36 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 18:54:36 -0800 Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available References: <200711180156.lAI1upR9342147@ns3.geneseo.net> Message-ID: <010f01c82a57$8590a670$0502a8c0@desktop> Hey Jack are you think of making scrapers for the TR6 motor? I know of at least 2 sales immediately, maybe 3. Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jack W. Drews" To: Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 5:58 PM Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available > Some time ago I designed a crank scraper for the TR3 - 4 engine. I > designed two, actually - one for the stock crank / stock rod engine, > and one for the Moldex / Carillo engine. Several of us are using > them. Since designing these things and programming for laser cutting > is very time consuming, I have not made them for the Spitfire or TR6 > engine. > > They are made from 1/8" steel and mount under the heads of three main > cap bolts. They come with three hardened washers to go between the > bolt heads and the scraper. > > You can see a picture on Tony's site -- www.Tonydrews.com -- link > "Jack's Parts" > > There was not much interest at the time so I had a limited run made > of each configuration. I still have a few of them left. > I'll sell the ones I still have for $64.95 apiece plus shipping. > > uncle jack > > > > ------------------------------------------------ > No Virus Found In This Message > Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Sun Nov 18 20:29:42 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 22:29:42 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel Message-ID: <6322EF05.3501AD0B.00159EE9@cs.com> "Charly Mitchel" wrote: >Greg, check out this link below. It seems the consensus is steel vs. >aluminum. This was my thought also and I now have 2 steel flywheels for the >long ended crankshaft. >I'm having one of them machined to accept the Tilton racing clutch >Charly Mitchel >TR6 #44 > STEEL! YES! These have and can be made in the u.s. If there is an order interest of 10 we could revisit the quote & leadtime. I want another one myself. Joe A From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Sun Nov 18 21:07:33 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 20:07:33 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Triumph motors Message-ID: <014901c82a61$b67e1650$0502a8c0@desktop> I have a few (4) Spitfire motors I need to get moved if anybody is interested, contact me. Pictures and details are below Thanks, Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 http://seattle.craigslist.org/tac/pts/483099149.html From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Sun Nov 18 21:31:46 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Sun, 18 Nov 2007 22:31:46 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <6322EF05.3501AD0B.00159EE9@cs.com> Message-ID: <003001c82a65$1982b8c0$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> BPNW stocks a TR4 and TR6 lightweight steel flywheel. They have conflicting info, the blurb says 9.5 lbs. but the link on the order page says 11 lbs. Either way, it's steel and of the same design as the Cambridge version. I have one in my car. I've had the engine out twice and so far so good. Alloy Light Flywheel TR3-4A Product Detail This is a Alloy 9.25 lbs flywheel for a TR3-4A. Unleash the revving potential of your car but this won't be too light for the street. It takes the bolt on ring gear and is drilled for the lighter TR4A Pressure plate. Ring gear is not included. $414.75 Flywheel Alloy TR6 70-76 Product Detail This is a Alloy 9.5 lbs flywheel for a TR6 70-76. Unleash the revving potential of your TR6, being 9.5 pounds the car will rev easily but won't be too light for the street. Ring gear is sold separately. FIA approved. $432.87 Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ""Charly Mitchel"" ; ""Greg "Lunker" Hilyer"" ; ""Kas Kastner"" Cc: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 9:29 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > "Charly Mitchel" wrote: > >>Greg, check out this link below. It seems the consensus is steel vs. >>aluminum. This was my thought also and I now have 2 steel flywheels for >>the >>long ended crankshaft. >>I'm having one of them machined to accept the Tilton racing clutch >>Charly Mitchel >>TR6 #44 >> > STEEL! YES! > > These have and can be made in the u.s. If there is an order interest of > 10 we could revisit the quote & leadtime. I want another one myself. > > Joe A > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From awashatko at wi.rr.com Mon Nov 19 05:33:00 2007 From: awashatko at wi.rr.com (Allen Washatko) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 06:33:00 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line Message-ID: FoT, I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? Allen A l l e n W a s h a t k o 1971 TR6 - Number 6 From tony at tonydrews.com Mon Nov 19 06:18:45 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 07:18:45 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20071119131930.237B3187A78@autox.team.net> I imagine fewer bad things occurring when it's run parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger compartment. It's further from the drivetrain, and further from the exhaust pipe / header. My driveshaft tunnel gets pretty hot during a race. - Tony At 06:33 AM 11/19/2007, Allen Washatko wrote: >FoT, > >I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking >for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines >placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger >compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use >a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? > >Allen > >A l l e n W a s h a t k o >1971 TR6 - Number 6 From wgrosenbach at juno.com Mon Nov 19 07:14:42 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 07:14:42 -0700 Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate Message-ID: <20071119.071443.2424.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Ok, I will never again laugh at the SCCA for their ridiculous protests; THE FIA can't even figure out how to read a thermometer. The full FIA statement: "The FIA International Court of Appeal met in London on Thursday, November 15, 2007, to examine an appeal lodged by the Motor Sports Association (MSA) on behalf of its licence-holder Vodafone McLaren Mercedes against the decision (document 41) of the Panel of the Stewards of the 2007 Brazilian Grand Prix dated 21 October 2007 and counting towards the 2007 FIA Formula One World Championship. "Following a report from the Technical Delegate indicating that the temperature of fuel pumped into the cars N09 - Nick Heidfeld, N010 - Robert Kubica, N016 - Nico Rosberg and N017 - Kazuki Nakajima, was more than 10 degrees centigrade below ambient temperature, the Stewards of the Meeting met to consider whether a penalty should be imposed. Having heard the evidence they decided not to impose a penalty as they had sufficient doubt as to both the temperature of the fuel on board the car and to the true ambient temperature. "Having heard the explanations of both parties and having examined the various documents and other evidence, the Court decided that the appeal lodged by Vodafone McLaren Mercedes is inadmissible. "The International Court of Appeal was presided over by Mr Jan STOVICEK (Czech Republic), elected President, and composed of Mr John CASSIDY (United States), Mr Vassilis KOUSSIS (Greece) and Mr Jos? MACEDO e CUNHA (Portugal). "The full text of the International Court of Appeal's decision is available, on request, from the secretariat of the FIA International Court of Appeal in Paris." This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, any disclosure, copying, further distribution or use thereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and delete/destroy it. From henry at henryfrye.com Mon Nov 19 08:12:49 2007 From: henry at henryfrye.com (Henry Frye) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 10:12:49 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <2B52E8650115BB4085979C721A085AD405FBBA@server.Triumph.local> I plumbed stainless steel hard line from the fuel pump (located in the bottom of the spare tire well next to the cell) up over the rear bulkhead into the passenger compartment tight against the passenger side rear inner wheel well. Then followed the inner sill up to the passenger footwell. Under the scuttle I have a gentle 90 degree bend upward. The line then goes through the horizontal shelf above the firewall to the regulator, then the fuel distribution block. Flex lines to the carbs. I didn't like the idea of naked fuel line in the passenger compartment so I slipped the hard line into tight fitting rubber fuel hose so there is a VERY thick insulation covering the hard fuel line. This rubber sheath runs from the 90 degree bend under the scuttle back beyond the steel panel that encloses the boot/fuel cell area. BTW, I used stainless because I had it laying about from another project. I am not sure I would buy stainless for this purpose, but it works for me. > -----Original Message----- > From: Allen Washatko > Subject: [Fot] Gas Line > > Any thoughts as to the safest installation? From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 08:27:08 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 10:27:08 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line Message-ID: I ran my line as far from heat sources as possible. I did not run the line inside the cockpit. In my TR6, I ran the line along the left-hand chassis rail, because I did not want the line anywhere near the header. I use a single exhaust pipe along the middle of the chassis. I run the line up the firewall, along the firewall from the left side to the right (where the battery used to live) to the fuel rail, and then to individual lines to the Webers. I found that the commonly accepted method of feeding Webers with a common fuel line led to reduced pressure at the front carb. I ran the line at the back of the engine rather that around the front, because the latter requires a longer line which increases heat soak. Besides, a line around the front is more exposed to damage in case of a shunt. Shane Ingate in NM Alan Washatco asked: > I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking > for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines > placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger > compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use > a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? _________________________________________________________________ You keep typing, we keep giving. Download Messenger and join the im Initiative now. http://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=TAGLM From triosan at gmail.com Mon Nov 19 09:00:47 2007 From: triosan at gmail.com (Chuck Arnold) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 08:00:47 -0800 Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available In-Reply-To: <010f01c82a57$8590a670$0502a8c0@desktop> References: <200711180156.lAI1upR9342147@ns3.geneseo.net> <010f01c82a57$8590a670$0502a8c0@desktop> Message-ID: <8cbd782d0711190800k1a2b6410o3707f9a26f982edf@mail.gmail.com> If jack does not make them, please see Allen Johnson at crank scrapers, inc. He made me a scraper and baffled windage tray in exchange for the oil pan, oil pump and rod I gave him. You can see the results in Kas last book and at: http://www.crank-scrapers.com/Triumph.html As you can see from the site, crank scrapers are $75. Chuck On Nov 18, 2007 6:54 PM, Charly Mitchel wrote: > Hey Jack are you think of making scrapers for the TR6 motor? I know of at > least 2 sales immediately, maybe 3. > Charly Mitchel > TR6 #44 > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jack W. Drews" > To: > Sent: Saturday, November 17, 2007 5:58 PM > Subject: [Fot] crank scrapers available > > > > Some time ago I designed a crank scraper for the TR3 - 4 engine. I > > designed two, actually - one for the stock crank / stock rod engine, > > and one for the Moldex / Carillo engine. Several of us are using > > them. Since designing these things and programming for laser cutting > > is very time consuming, I have not made them for the Spitfire or TR6 > > engine. > > > > They are made from 1/8" steel and mount under the heads of three main > > cap bolts. They come with three hardened washers to go between the > > bolt heads and the scraper. > > > > You can see a picture on Tony's site -- www.Tonydrews.com -- link > > "Jack's Parts" > > > > There was not much interest at the time so I had a limited run made > > of each configuration. I still have a few of them left. > > I'll sell the ones I still have for $64.95 apiece plus shipping. > > > > uncle jack > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------ > > No Virus Found In This Message > > Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > -- Chuck Arnold From Fubog1 at aol.com Mon Nov 19 09:00:57 2007 From: Fubog1 at aol.com (Fubog1 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 11:00:57 EST Subject: [Fot] Gas Line Message-ID: I normally use hard line & aeroquip also but from a safety standpoint I'll also offer something else to consider when it comes to fuel system plumbing, especially the engine bay. Anybody that has had a screwdriver or wrench try to arc weld itself to an Aeroquip hose will understand why I normally DON'T use Aeroquip anywhere in a fuel system when there's a chance that it could get tangled up with electrics in any way, be it the slip of a wrench into a hot lug, stray wiring or uninsulated terminal, or a crash. Although lacking in the "cool" factor, marine-grade fabric reinforced hose is great stuff. Glen BTDT 1 time, nasty sparks & a (pinhole) fuel leak, fortunately no fire, lesson learned... I plan to use a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From sbarr at McCarty-Law.com Mon Nov 19 09:44:43 2007 From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com (Barr, Scott) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 10:44:43 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Christmas shopping Message-ID: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74860F29@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Anybody know if La Carrera Panamericana (Pink Floyd, et. al.) has ever been released on DVD? My in-laws are looking for gift ideas for me and I'd suggest that one, since I've got it on VHS, but no longer have a VCR... Scott From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 19 09:49:57 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 11:49:57 EST Subject: [Fot] OEM Flywheel on eBay and Clutch Assembly Rebuild Message-ID: TR4A Flywheel Lightened for Improved Performance Item number: 170170835593 If any one is interested....low starting bid on flywheel. BTW, if you use the finger style clutch cover, and want it rebuilt. It can be done with new springs, fingers, and resurfacing. I have enough fingers available for three clutch covers. Then finger supply is an issue. They can be welded with hard materials, but that's labor intensive. Clutch Disc Rebuild: The material for the clutch disc is a woven material and superior to OEM and current replacement. There is a limited amount of this clutch material left. Maybe three discs. Rebuilding is well below current direct replacement costs. Joe A From greenman62 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 11:39:10 2007 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (greenman62 at hotmail.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 18:39:10 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Christmas shopping In-Reply-To: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74860F29@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> References: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74860F29@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Message-ID: Try this... http://www.amazon.com/Carrera-Panamericana-Music-Pink-Floyd/dp/B00004RP24 Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 10:44:43 -0600 > From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com > To: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: [Fot] Christmas shopping > > Anybody know if La Carrera Panamericana (Pink Floyd, et. al.) has ever > been released on DVD? > > My in-laws are looking for gift ideas for me and I'd suggest that one, > since I've got it on VHS, but no longer have a VCR... > > Scott > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillDentin at aol.com Mon Nov 19 12:13:10 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:13:10 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: Amici... I recently obtained a subscription to the magazine TRIUMPH WORLD. While I was aware of this magazine (friends had sent me copies of articles from time to time), I had never seen a copy. I was very impressed. It is glossy, high quality, and covers all things TRIUMPH. The scope of the articles is wide, including competition, history, restoration, social and so on. I've read both issues I've received so far from cover to cover. I sure would recommend it to those of you who would enjoy such a TRIUMPH specific publication. If you are not aware of TRIUMPH WORLD, it is available by subscription, as well as at some newsstand outlets. If you have trouble locating a copy, you might contact their subscription office (tw.mag at kelsey.co.uk). They might be able to help you find a source near you. Bill Dentinger ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From lang at isis.mit.edu Mon Nov 19 12:19:49 2007 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert Lang) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:19:49 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, The US subscriptions are handled through EWA Cars, ewacars.com 2nd class mailing in the US is currently $99 /year. NFI, of course. rml --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Room N42-140Q | This space for rent Consultant MIT IS&T unix-linux-help | Voice:617-253-7438 FAX: 617-258-9535 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 19 12:30:18 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:30:18 EST Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Confirmation Number 86651177 Message-ID: FoT: Watkins Glen Attendees....please read the following and make your reservations. If anyone needs any help with theirs, please let me know. Regards, Joe Alexander > Dear Mr. Alexander > > This email is to confirm your group reservations for 9/3/08 b 9/8/07. I > have 15 rooms reserved under the name of bFriends of Triumphb at a group of > $114.00 plus tax. Your confirmation # is 86651177. > > Andrea Stowe, CHA > General Manager > Hampton Inn > 9775 Victory Highway > Painted Post, NY 14870 > 607-936-3344 > 607-936-3393 (fax) > Return-Path: Received: from rly-mg10.mx.aol.com (rly-mg10.mail.aol.com [172.20.83.116]) by air-mg02.mail.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILINMG021-a3e4741e0ef2bf; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:16:49 -0400 Received: from ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com (ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com [24.24.2.57]) by rly-mg10.mx.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINMG108-a3e4741e0ef2bf; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:15:59 -0400 Received: from FranzeseLaptop (rrcs-24-39-168-3.nys.biz.rr.com [24.39.168.3]) by ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id lAJJFrGJ010762 for ; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:15:57 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200711191915.lAJJFrGJ010762 at ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com> From: "Andrea Stowe" To: Subject: Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:10:35 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 thread-index: Acgq39z+QSwvgZNhR9ygssZc0YssUQ== X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-AOL-IP: 24.24.2.57 X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_helo : n X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_822_from : n X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain Dear Mr. Alexander This email is to confirm your group reservations for 9/3/08 - 9/8/07. I have 15 rooms reserved under the name of "Friends of Triumph" at a group of $114.00 plus tax. Your confirmation # is 86651177. I also have a room reserved for Mr. Kastner. His confirmation # is 87433161. If you have any questions or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact me. Andrea Stowe, CHA General Manager Hampton Inn 9775 Victory Highway Painted Post, NY 14870 607-936-3344 607-936-3393 (fax) From BillDentin at aol.com Mon Nov 19 12:39:47 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:39:47 EST Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Confirmation Number 86651177 Message-ID: In a message dated 11/19/2007 1:30:43 PM Central Standard Time, N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > Watkins Glen Attendees....please read the following and make your > reservations. If anyone needs any help with theirs, please let me know. > Amici... Painted Post, Horseheads, Big Flats, and of course the Town of Dix. I love the names of the little towns in the Watkins Glen area. Steeped in early history back to the revolutionary war. Little known fact...the Town of Dix is where the phrase, "You've got to be shitting me!" originated. Bill (Damdinger0 ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From N197TR4 at cs.com Mon Nov 19 12:51:41 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:51:41 -0500 Subject: [Fot] =?iso-8859-1?q?Hampton_Inn_-_Painted_Post=2C_NY_Confirmatio?= =?iso-8859-1?q?n_Number_=A0_86651177?= Message-ID: <49B17352.16FFA30B.00159EE9@cs.com> ....and if you use GOOGLE EARTH you can get a great view of actual 'GLEN' and the TRACK...... >In a message dated 11/19/2007 1:30:43 PM Central Standard Time, >N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > > >> Watkins Glen Attendees....please read the following and make your >> reservations. If anyone needs any help with theirs, please let me know. >> > >Amici... > >Painted Post, Horseheads, Big Flats, and of course the Town of Dix. I love >the names of the little towns in the Watkins Glen area. Steeped in early >history back to the revolutionary war. Little known fact...the Town of Dix is >where the phrase, "You've got to be shitting me!" originated. > >Bill (Damdinger0 > > >************************************** > See what's new at >http://www.aol.com From jerrybarr at charter.net Mon Nov 19 13:20:38 2007 From: jerrybarr at charter.net (Jerry Barr) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:20:38 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Pistons Message-ID: Hello Listers, I have listed a set of AE Hepolite Triumph Spitfire 1147cc piston set in +040 size on ebay Item Number 260184506739 These are new old stock with pins and ring sets Thanks, Jerry Barr From BillB at bnj.com Mon Nov 19 13:40:47 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 12:40:47 -0800 Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate References: <20071119.071443.2424.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: Actually it makes more sense than it sounds. The rulebook states that the fuel IN THE CAR can't be more than 10 degrees colder than ambient, but the only way the FIA has to measure temperature is the fuel in the filler. This fuel undoubtably is warmed somewhat when it's pumped and mixes with the warmer fuel in the car. Secondly, the rulebook does not say which ambient temperature measurement is official. It is assumed that the temperature provided by the FIA in their network would be official ambient, but the contract meteorologists that most teams use were reporting an ambient temperature a few degrees colder than the FIA temperature. The rulebook is not specific on this issue. What we're seeing here is the difficulty of writing rules that are not subject to interpretation, and the reason why rulebooks get so big and so arcane. Since the World Championship was at stake, I think the FIA and the court did a good job in not deciding the results in the courtroom but rather on the track. I would have been extremely unhappy to see the Iceman stripped of his title by a ruling on an inconsequential error by teams not in competition for the title. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of William G Rosenbach Sent: Mon 11/19/2007 6:14 AM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate Ok, I will never again laugh at the SCCA for their ridiculous protests; THE FIA can't even figure out how to read a thermometer. The full FIA statement: "The FIA International Court of Appeal met in London on Thursday, November 15, 2007, to examine an appeal lodged by the Motor Sports Association (MSA) on behalf of its licence-holder Vodafone McLaren Mercedes against the decision (document 41) of the Panel of the Stewards of the 2007 Brazilian Grand Prix dated 21 October 2007 and counting towards the 2007 FIA Formula One World Championship. "Following a report from the Technical Delegate indicating that the temperature of fuel pumped into the cars N09 - Nick Heidfeld, N010 - Robert Kubica, N016 - Nico Rosberg and N017 - Kazuki Nakajima, was more than 10 degrees centigrade below ambient temperature, the Stewards of the Meeting met to consider whether a penalty should be imposed. Having heard the evidence they decided not to impose a penalty as they had sufficient doubt as to both the temperature of the fuel on board the car and to the true ambient temperature. "Having heard the explanations of both parties and having examined the various documents and other evidence, the Court decided that the appeal lodged by Vodafone McLaren Mercedes is inadmissible. "The International Court of Appeal was presided over by Mr Jan STOVICEK (Czech Republic), elected President, and composed of Mr John CASSIDY (United States), Mr Vassilis KOUSSIS (Greece) and Mr Jos? MACEDO e CUNHA (Portugal). "The full text of the International Court of Appeal's decision is available, on request, from the secretariat of the FIA International Court of Appeal in Paris." This communication is for the use of the intended recipient only. It may contain information that is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient of this communication, any disclosure, copying, further distribution or use thereof is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please advise me by return e-mail or by telephone and delete/destroy it. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Mon Nov 19 13:44:54 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 12:44:54 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com> <20071118211526.F24CC187A46@autox.team.net> Message-ID: I'm not a fan of alloy flywheels, I've had two come adrift despite a lot of modification and prep. The steel flywheels are almost as light and seem bulletproof. The cast ones can't be lightened enough to be worthwhile. Fine for the street. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Tony Drews Sent: Sun 11/18/2007 1:14 PM To: Jim Cun; Friends of Triumph Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. - Tony At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >Hi Guys, > Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >steel for a TR race car? > >Regards Jim > > > Make the switch to the world's >best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillDentin at aol.com Mon Nov 19 13:52:34 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 15:52:34 EST Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate Message-ID: In a message dated 11/19/2007 2:43:52 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > What we're seeing here is the difficulty of writing rules that are not > subject > to interpretation, and the reason why rulebooks get so big and so arcane. Seems like I recall Kas telling us that the fact that such rules are subject to interpretation became the basis for his entire career. Bill (Damdinger) ************************************** See what's new at http://www.aol.com From TomD4760 at aol.com Mon Nov 19 13:54:51 2007 From: TomD4760 at aol.com (TomD4760 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 15:54:51 EST Subject: [Fot] AH Bugeye Race Car for sale Message-ID: I am selling my 1959 Bugeye Race Car. Please email for spec sheet and pictures. TomD4760 at aol.com Thank you. Tom Deats

**************************************
See what's new at http://www.aol.com From spreiss at verizon.net Sun Nov 18 22:22:53 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:22:53 +1100 Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control Message-ID: <010801c82a6c$3c7a1f10$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> FOT I am thinking of making an objective of reducing the air temperature in the engine compartment of my TR3, and to direct as cool air as possible to the carburetor intakes. I know there are shrouds available to channel maximum outside air through the radiator, but that seems to address only part of the problem. Where does all that heat from the head and exhaust manifold go? Surely not out those two little slits. Louvered bonnets are an attempt to address this no doubt, but it seems they are expensive and not universally done. I know from seat of the pants that as operating temperature rises, performance dwindles. How do others deal with it? Steve Preiss From kaskas at cox.net Mon Nov 19 14:39:03 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 13:39:03 -0800 Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control References: <010801c82a6c$3c7a1f10$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <008401c82af4$9aed7820$3f0ec548@RW> There are some pretty cute ways of doing this. Most obvious is the blocking up of the hood hinges so that the back lip of the hood has a gap to provide an exit for hot air. That also vents to a low pressure area when you have a full screen. You might want to find out if you have a pressure differential under the hood compared to ambient before starting an exercise. Some folks have a vent in the front fender, looks nice and is effective but pretty small and you are depending on the lower pressure at the side of the car ( not always true) You can vent into wheel well with just expanded metal screen in the inner fender panel. Works pretty well, but use a water monometer to check the pressure difference before you cut metal. Probably not legal in most Vintage outfits, but then we are talking about theories anyway. :-) This is without touching on another obvious mod of heat shields for the inlet and exhaust systems. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steven Preiss" To: Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 9:22 PM Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control > FOT > I am thinking of making an objective of reducing the air temperature in > the > engine compartment of my TR3, and to direct as cool air as possible to the > carburetor intakes. I know there are shrouds available to channel maximum > outside air through the radiator, but that seems to address only part of > the > problem. Where does all that heat from the head and exhaust manifold go? > Surely not out those two little slits. Louvered bonnets are an attempt to > address this no doubt, but it seems they are expensive and not universally > done. I know from seat of the pants that as operating temperature rises, > performance dwindles. How do others deal with it? > Steve Preiss > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rocky at spitfire4.com Mon Nov 19 15:03:38 2007 From: rocky at spitfire4.com (Rocky Entriken) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:03:38 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line References: Message-ID: <002801c82af8$0b748220$6701a8c0@S1099895562> When I rerouted the fuel run in my Spitfire last year. I did it with all braided lines and inside the passenger compartment along the doorsill on the passenger side. Which almost made it a straightline run to the carbs by way of the fuel regulator which is mounted on the little shelf on the right side under the hood. The line is protected not only by the stronger bodywork along the doorsill but also by brace bars of the rollcage immediately above it. I also took the occasion to install a fuel pressure gauge (it's the gauge farthest from me on the dash, which also makes it the closest to the fuel line & carbs). --Rocky Entriken ----- Original Message ----- From: "Allen Washatko" To: "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 6:33 AM Subject: [Fot] Gas Line > FoT, > > I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking > for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines > placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger > compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use > a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? > > Allen > > A l l e n W a s h a t k o > 1971 TR6 - Number 6 > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 15:07:09 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 17:07:09 -0500 Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control Message-ID: Kas wrote: > Most obvious is the blocking > up of the hood hinges so that the back lip of the hood has a gap to provide > an exit for hot air. That also vents to a low pressure area when you have a > full screen. I did this with my Pantera, using rubber draw-latchs that accommodate a lot of alignment error, and raising the hood 3/4". I achieved more than 20C temperature differential using this technique. The latches are pretty inexpensive, like this from Pegasus: http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/productdetails.asp?RecId=772 Yes, I know, the Pantera motor is in the back, but the radiator is in the front with very little area to vent the hot air. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Put your friends on the big screen with Windows Vista. + Windows Live. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/shop/specialoffers.mspx?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_CPC_M ediaCtr_bigscreen_102007 From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 15:09:20 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 17:09:20 -0500 Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control II Message-ID: I forgot to add: Redline Water Wetter works great! But y'all are probably using this anyway. S. _________________________________________________________________ Put your friends on the big screen with Windows Vista. + Windows Live. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/shop/specialoffers.mspx?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_CPC_M ediaCtr_bigscreen_102007 From kaskas at cox.net Mon Nov 19 15:37:01 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:37:01 -0800 Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate References: Message-ID: <00af01c82afc$b3addbe0$3f0ec548@RW> Yes, Bill. Regulations with lots of words are the meat for a "thinking man". ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; ; Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 12:52 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate > In a message dated 11/19/2007 2:43:52 PM Central Standard Time, > BillB at bnj.com > writes: > > >> What we're seeing here is the difficulty of writing rules that are not >> subject >> to interpretation, and the reason why rulebooks get so big and so arcane. > > Seems like I recall Kas telling us that the fact that such rules are > subject > to interpretation became the basis for his entire career. > > Bill (Damdinger) > > > > ************************************** > See what's new at http://www.aol.com > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Mon Nov 19 15:45:59 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:45:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com><20071118211526.F24CC187A46@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <003401c82afd$f4f99930$6401a8c0@TER2> We have been using aluminum alloy flywheels on the TR-4 engines for over 25 years. Then engines we have put them on have ranged from 115 hp to 190 hp. We have had one (1) problem in that time. I t was caused by the engine being consistantly overreved at the Pittsburg Vintage GP. The reves used to cause the flywheel to shear its bolts were over 7600 rpm. Using properly designed flywheels and good ARP flywheel retaining bolts of 3/8" diameter, that was to only problem we have had. By the way, the high rpm stess also caused the front generator bracket to break the same weekend the flywheel bolts failed. On a few of our high horsepower engines, we have used 4 or 6 7/16" fasteners instead of the standard size 3/8" pieces. Most of the engines have used 4 3/8" retaining bolts with #8 flat washers, torqued to 60 psi with loctite "nut lock" on the THREADS ONLY. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" ; "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 12:44 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > I'm not a fan of alloy flywheels, I've had two come adrift despite a lot > of > modification and prep. The steel flywheels are almost as light and seem > bulletproof. The cast ones can't be lightened enough to be worthwhile. > Fine > for the street. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Tony Drews > Sent: Sun 11/18/2007 1:14 PM > To: Jim Cun; Friends of Triumph > Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > > Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With > proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more > troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. > > - Tony > > At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>Hi Guys, >> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>steel for a TR race car? >> >>Regards Jim >> >> >> Make the switch to the world's >>best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>_______________________________________________ >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >>Fot mailing list >>Fot at autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Mon Nov 19 15:47:32 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:47:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Alloy v steel References: <582836.94491.qm@web51803.mail.re2.yahoo.com><20071118211526.F24CC187A46@autox.team.net> Message-ID: <003801c82afe$2c494c00$6401a8c0@TER2> Sorry, I understand that the 6 cylinder engine is a "different kettle of fish" and is much harder to keep the flywheel on at high rpm. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "Tony Drews" ; "Jim Cun" ; "Friends of Triumph" Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 12:44 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > I'm not a fan of alloy flywheels, I've had two come adrift despite a lot > of > modification and prep. The steel flywheels are almost as light and seem > bulletproof. The cast ones can't be lightened enough to be worthwhile. > Fine > for the street. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Tony Drews > Sent: Sun 11/18/2007 1:14 PM > To: Jim Cun; Friends of Triumph > Subject: Re: [Fot] Alloy v steel > > Alloy flywheels seem harder to keep attached to the crankshaft. With > proper care, they work well, though. They seem to be more > troublesome in the 6 cylinder motors, anecdotally. > > - Tony > > At 03:01 PM 11/18/2007, Jim Cun wrote: >>Hi Guys, >> Just wanted to ask your thoughts on an alloy flywheel vs >>steel for a TR race car? >> >>Regards Jim >> >> >> Make the switch to the world's >>best email. Get the new Yahoo!7 Mail now. >>http://au.yahoo.com/worldsbestmail/viagra/index.html >>_______________________________________________ >>http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >>Fot mailing list >>Fot at autox.team.net >>http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com Mon Nov 19 15:54:57 2007 From: gregmogdoc at surfnetusa.com (Greg Solow) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:54:57 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication References: <8C9F6AA585D7B7C-1268-1BE9@webmail-stg-d10.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: <004001c82aff$356333e0$6401a8c0@TER2> We have had some piston scuffing problems in TR-4 engines with "billet" rods that do not squuirt oil onto the cylinders. These problems have only happened whrn the engines were being run at very low rpm, ie, under 2,000 rpm. It turned out that not enough oil was being thrown up on the cylinder walls. These scuffing incidents occured when idling around the pits, driving the car on the street and idling around a parking lot, and when starting the car and idling in a garage. It happened 3 separate times in the same engine. Drilling the rods to that oil was squirted onto the thrust side of the cylinder wall once each revolution of the engine cured the problem! There is not a cam lube problem. Anything regarding the cam is probably a separate issue. Greg Solow ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Friday, November 16, 2007 12:56 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Crank Scrapers and Cam Lubrication > So, you guys are saying that there is no downside to using a crank scraper > in a wet-liner motor? That even with connecting rods that don't have the > little oil hole like the stock rods do, enough oil gets?to the cylinder > walls?? And that enough oil gets everywhere it needs to get, all the time? > > Rich Rock > > ________________________________________________________________________ > More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - > http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Mon Nov 19 15:53:02 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (spitlist at cox.net) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 14:53:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] F-1 Thermometergate In-Reply-To: <20071119.071443.2424.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: <20071119175302.F6XMD.13952.root@fed1wml08.mgt.cox.net> I don't think that the FIA's decision to dismiss the protest was based on the readings of the thermometer, as much as it had to do with the relivance of the readings. Since there is no way to ppropriately measure the temperature of the fuel once it is on board, the readings that they took cannot be accurately applied to the temps of the on-board fuel. And since the regulation specifies the temp of the fuel in the car, the mearurements of the fuel in the rig is meaningless. It is very easy to conclude that the fuel temp will rise dramatically when it is introduced to the very hot car during a race. Joe C. ---- William G Rosenbach wrote: > Ok, I will never again laugh at the SCCA for their ridiculous protests; > THE FIA can't even figure out how to read a thermometer. From gaf3 at charter.net Mon Nov 19 16:46:22 2007 From: gaf3 at charter.net (Glenn Franco) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 18:46:22 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line In-Reply-To: <002801c82af8$0b748220$6701a8c0@S1099895562> References: <002801c82af8$0b748220$6701a8c0@S1099895562> Message-ID: <4742204E.2060404@charter.net> FOT Reading the discussion thread has me wondering what the proper routing path should be in my Spitfire. I have yet to run my fuel line from my fuel cell up to the engine compartment of my Spit. The routing dilemma has had me wondering why anyone would want to run a fuel line anywhere in the passenger compartment. I also have a full cage and could run it inside on the right with full protection afforded by the cage. The possibility of fire, for whatever reason, would have me run it on the outside of the frame rail below the vehicle away from the exhaust. I guess all the years spent in chassis engineering (big three product liability) has me wondering. What advantage is there to running the fuel line in the vehicle? Glenn Franco 72 Spitfire racer under construction Rocky Entriken wrote: > When I rerouted the fuel run in my Spitfire last year. I did it with all > braided lines and inside the passenger compartment along the doorsill on the > passenger side. Which almost made it a straightline run to the carbs by way > of the fuel regulator which is mounted on the little shelf on the right side > under the hood. The line is protected not only by the stronger bodywork > along the doorsill but also by brace bars of the rollcage immediately above > it. I also took the occasion to install a fuel pressure gauge (it's the > gauge farthest from me on the dash, which also makes it the closest to the > fuel line & carbs). > > --Rocky Entriken > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Allen Washatko" > To: "Friends of Triumph" > Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 6:33 AM > Subject: [Fot] Gas Line > > > >> FoT, >> >> I plan on re-routing the gas line of my TR6 race car and was looking >> for some input as to where to place the new line. I've seen lines >> placed parallel to the outer frame member inside the passenger >> compartment and also parallel to the drive shaft tunnel. I plan to use >> a steel braided line. Any thoughts as to the safest installation? >> >> Allen >> >> A l l e n W a s h a t k o >> 1971 TR6 - Number 6 >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tony at tonydrews.com Mon Nov 19 17:42:52 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 18:42:52 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line In-Reply-To: <4742204E.2060404@charter.net> References: <002801c82af8$0b748220$6701a8c0@S1099895562> <4742204E.2060404@charter.net> Message-ID: <20071120004337.AD196187A25@autox.team.net> The main advantage of having it in the cockpit is that it's really hard to rip off the fuel line during an off-course excursion. I think the best route is under the car in such a manner that the frame rails protect it from side and bottom impacts but you still have sheet metal between you and the fuel line. I didn't see an easy way to accomplish that in my car (TR-4) without drilling holes in the frame. - Tony At 05:46 PM 11/19/2007, Glenn Franco wrote: >FOT >Reading the discussion thread has me wondering what the proper routing >path should be in my Spitfire. >I have yet to run my fuel line from my fuel cell up to the engine >compartment of my Spit. The routing dilemma has had me wondering why >anyone would >want to run a fuel line anywhere in the passenger compartment. I also >have a full cage and could run it inside on the right with full >protection afforded by >the cage. The possibility of fire, for whatever reason, would have me >run it on the outside of the frame rail below the vehicle away from the >exhaust. >I guess all the years spent in chassis engineering (big three product >liability) has me wondering. > >What advantage is there to running the fuel line in the vehicle? > >Glenn Franco >72 Spitfire racer under construction From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 19 20:06:20 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 22:06:20 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line Message-ID: Glenn Franco asked: > What advantage is there to running the fuel line in the vehicle? BBQ? Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newways_112007 From klynch_6 at msn.com Mon Nov 19 20:09:25 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 20:09:25 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Gas Line References: Message-ID: fries?? er...sorry KL ----- Original Message ----- From: Shane Ingate To: gaf3 at charter.net Cc: Friends of Triumph Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 8:06 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Gas Line Glenn Franco asked: > What advantage is there to running the fuel line in the vehicle? BBQ? Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newways_112007 _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Mon Nov 19 21:40:40 2007 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 20:40:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] under hood temp control In-Reply-To: <010801c82a6c$3c7a1f10$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: <361601.53693.qm@web81215.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Steve: When I was building the car that Randy Williams currently owns I went to the CVAR rules committee to ask if I could louver the bonnet. They told me if I did I would need to run the car as a sport racer against other sport racers of the time. Since I thought it unlikely that it could be competitive against the likes of a Lotus 11 or similar cars I chose not to louver the bonnet. They did allow me to open the two bonnet vents as long as it wasn't unsightly. I did have two louvered panels made and I welded them to the inside wheel wells. They can't be seen from the outside when the wheels are mounted, and there is enough stuff under the bonnet to obscure them from view. There is a low pressure area in the wheel wells at speed, and it helps to evacuate the hot air from under the bonnet. Ken G. once told me that in the SoCal region they didn't allow the spacer blocks under the hinges. His trick was to loosen the two nuts that secure the hinges to the scuttle. As speed increased the rear of the bonnet would raise up. When you slowed down the hood would drop back down. During tech everything appeared to be "normal". I'm here to say I know that under the bonnet is a high pressure area. Having had a bonnet open at about 40 mph I can bear witness that the safety latches nor the hinges will keep the bonnet secured to the scuttle. I have the scar from the stitches to prove it. Still dizzy after all these years - Ed Steven Preiss wrote: FOT I am thinking of making an objective of reducing the air temperature in the engine compartment of my TR3, and to direct as cool air as possible to the carburetor intakes. I know there are shrouds available to channel maximum outside air through the radiator, but that seems to address only part of the problem. Where does all that heat from the head and exhaust manifold go? Surely not out those two little slits. Louvered bonnets are an attempt to address this no doubt, but it seems they are expensive and not universally done. I know from seat of the pants that as operating temperature rises, performance dwindles. How do others deal with it? Steve Preiss Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From awashatko at wi.rr.com Tue Nov 20 08:10:03 2007 From: awashatko at wi.rr.com (Allen Washatko) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 09:10:03 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Bill Tobin Message-ID: Bill, Please contact me off line. Thanks, Allen A l l e n W a s h a t k o 1971 TR6 - Number 6 From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 20 12:51:27 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 14:51:27 EST Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Reservations for THE GLEN Message-ID: FoT Entries and Attendees. Please read the note below....if you are unable to make reservations the remainder of the week, please try Andrea next week. Andrea seems to be spread a bit thin, but she is communicating with us. Regards, Joe Alexander > HI Mr. Alexander > > I have been receiving phone calls today for reservations, but just wanted to > let you know (my apologies for not letting you know earlier) that I will be > out of the office the rest of the week at another hotel. If anyone calls > this week, they can speak with any front desk agent, or if they want to wait and > speak directly with me, I will be back in the office on Monday. Ibm sorry > for the inconvenience, but hopefully all will work out well. Please let me > know if you have any questions or concerns. Thanks again and Happy Holidays. > > Andrea > Dear Mr. Alexander This email is to confirm your group reservations for 9/3/08 b 9/8/07. I have 15 rooms reserved under the name of bFriends of Triumphb at a group of $114.00 plus tax. Your confirmation # is 86651177. Return-Path: Received: from rly-md08.mx.aol.com (rly-md08.mail.aol.com [172.20.29.146]) by air-md08.mail.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILINMD082-91a474200db86; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:32:27 -0400 Received: from ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com (ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com [24.24.2.57]) by rly-md08.mx.aol.com (v120.9) with ESMTP id MAILRELAYINMD082-91a474200db86; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:32:12 -0500 Received: from FranzeseLaptop (rrcs-24-39-168-3.nys.biz.rr.com [24.39.168.3]) by ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com (8.13.6/8.13.6) with ESMTP id lAJLW5kC027586 for ; Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:32:10 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200711192132.lAJLW5kC027586 at ms-smtp-03.nyroc.rr.com> From: "Andrea Stowe" To: Subject: RE: Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 16:26:47 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 thread-index: Acgq4yQARvNtdGoESXudUi4xTFndegADtdCw In-Reply-To: X-Virus-Scanned: Symantec AntiVirus Scan Engine X-AOL-IP: 24.24.2.57 X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_helo : n X-AOL-SCOLL-AUTHENTICATION: listenair ; SPF_822_from : n X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: from multipart/alternative by demime 1.01d X-Converted-To-Plain-Text: Alternative section used was text/plain HI Mr. Alexander I have been receiving phone calls today for reservations, but just wanted to let you know (my apologies for not letting you know earlier) that I will be out of the office the rest of the week at another hotel. If anyone calls this week, they can speak with any front desk agent, or if they want to wait and speak directly with me, I will be back in the office on Monday. I'm sorry for the inconvenience, but hopefully all will work out well. Please let me know if you have any questions or concerns. Thanks again and Happy Holidays. Andrea _____ From: N197TR4 at cs.com [mailto:N197TR4 at cs.com] Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 2:34 PM To: AStowe at visions-hotels.com Subject: Re: Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Thanks Andrea! Your phone will start ringing today. Joe Alexander Dear Mr. Alexander This email is to confirm your group reservations for 9/3/08 - 9/8/07. I have 15 rooms reserved under the name of "Friends of Triumph" at a group of $114.00 plus tax. Your confirmation # is 86651177. I also have a room reserved for Mr. Kastner. His confirmation # is 87433161. If you have any questions or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact me. Andrea Stowe, CHA General Manager Hampton Inn 9775 Victory Highway Painted Post, NY 14870 607-936-3344 607-936-3393 (fax) From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 20 13:00:20 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 15:00:20 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: FOT, Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to disturb his artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have to do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. Thanks Greg, Joe A From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 20 13:15:02 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 15:15:02 EST Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY Message-ID: List, I had a conversation with one of the members of the WPTA yesterday. There are mumurings that the WPTA would be willing to volunteer to be in charge of Friends of Triumph Hospitality in the Paddock. They have graciously volunteered to do this in the past. It usually means COFFEE and KRISPY KREMES in the mornings, not to mention all other manner of support in the Paoddock. We used to do stuff late at night with them, but most us are getting too old to stay up past 9:00PM. If we wind up with some kind of Corporate Support, as suggested by one our illustrious Coloradans, we will have no shortage of manpower to see that everyone is suitably taken care of. Of course, Tom Strange is in this mix with Paddock Layout. We arent going to micro manage all of this stuff....it all has a way of flowing into a smooth stream. Joe A From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Nov 20 13:25:03 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 15:25:03 EST Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY Message-ID: In a message dated 11/20/2007 2:15:26 PM Central Standard Time, N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > I had a conversation with one of the members of the WPTA yesterday. > > There are mumurings that the WPTA would be willing to volunteer to be in > charge of Friends of Triumph Hospitality in the Paddock. > > Are those guys out on the street again? Must be some sort of 'Work Release' program. That's fantastic. They're GREAT! Bill (Damdinger) ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From tr5racer at btinternet.com Tue Nov 20 13:59:09 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 20:59:09 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old editorial team. Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the regular contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good mix of articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis very much on advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a younger readership. I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! Mike Hughes --------------------------------- Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now. From REK46 at aol.com Tue Nov 20 14:05:35 2007 From: REK46 at aol.com (REK46 at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:05:35 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: I agree with Mike ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Tue Nov 20 14:07:12 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 15:07:12 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> References: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B71CFE0@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I am a "stockist" as part of my local club. We and ship together at distribute at meetings. The cost is now $5.00 an issue under this plan. We were up to 13 member subscriptions until they went monthly. Between the added expense ($30 a year to $60 per) and the changes we are down to 7 members subscribers. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of JOSEPH HUGHES Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 2:59 PM To: Friends of Triumph Subject: [Fot] Triumph World I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old editorial team. Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the regular contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good mix of articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis very much on advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a younger readership. I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! Mike Hughes --------------------------------- Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit now. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Tue Nov 20 14:07:38 2007 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:07:38 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Hampton Inn - Painted Post, NY Reservations for THE GLEN In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > FoT Entries and Attendees.> > Please read the note below....if you are unable to make reservations the> remainder of the week, please try Andrea next week.> > Andrea seems to be spread a bit thin, but she is communicating with us.> > Regards, Joe Alexander> I didn't know it was necessary to talk to Andrea to make reservations, so I just made a reservation with whomever answered the telephone. It seemed to work out fine! John From lang at isis.mit.edu Tue Nov 20 14:42:41 2007 From: lang at isis.mit.edu (Robert Lang) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:42:41 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> References: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 20 Nov 2007, JOSEPH HUGHES wrote: > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised > Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the > new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old > editorial team. I'm on the fence. On the other hand, I let my subscription lapse because I pretty much stopped reading the mag a while back and I find the new layout "hard to read"... too much like hanging around with ADD people. > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got rid > of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the > regular contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good > mix of articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new > magazine has the emphasis very much on advertising and would appear to > be out to try and attract a younger readership. I can't reply to the why, but I wanted to mention that I believe TOny Beadle was the original editor and if not, he's been in the editor chair since about '97 or '98. But I could be worng on that. One way or the other, I have to admit that I likes his style a bit more then "the new guy". Interestingly, I liked the new guy's column in the past, but I find his copy (the editor of that mag writes a lot of the copy, BTW) to be tiring. I can't put my finger on it. > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers > sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! Time will tell. On the other hand, I'm sure there's a few hundred Triumphs world-wide that haven't been covered yet. :-) I know MINE have never been featured. > Mike Hughes regards, rml p.s. I found it very amusing that as soon as my subscription lapsed, tehy did an article about one of our club's long-standing events - Day of Triumph. Go figure. --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Bob Lang Room N42-140Q | This space for rent Consultant MIT IS&T unix-linux-help | Voice:617-253-7438 FAX: 617-258-9535 | Cell: 339-927-4489 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Nov 20 14:40:44 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:40:44 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: In a message dated 11/20/2007 2:59:39 PM Central Standard Time, tr5racer at btinternet.com writes: > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised Triumph > World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the new magazine > or whether the ones you have read are from the old editorial team. > > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got rid of > Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the regular > contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good mix of > articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis > very much on advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a > younger readership. > > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers sold > each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! > Mike, you have me at a disadvantage, as I've only seen two issues I have to assume they are by the 'the new team' you describe, as they are the most recent issues. Therefore, I have no basis for comparison with past issues, but the two I saw sure impressed me. The November issue has a ton of regular articles, as well as some great feature articles, including the restoration and upgrades of a Herald, a GT6, and a Toledo (what ever that is). There is a fine article on a Stag factory fastback, and a technical article on the Stage engine. There is a historical article highlighting Design Engineer Lewis Dawtrey. I particularly enjoy the pictures and articles about the models we don't often see over here. I find it interesting that you describe previous issues as 'better,' because those two I saw were very good. I was in business for nearly forty-five years, and I know what makes the world goes around. I never had anything to do with the publishing business, but I am not put off by their need to feature advertisers. It is common knowledge advertising income is critical to magazines. So too attracting younger readers. Does not surprise me. It's a good idea. Older TRIUMPH aficionados like me are dying off like flies. Mike...different strokes for different folks. Participation optional. To each his own, but I stand by my take. Bill ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From GRMTim at aol.com Tue Nov 20 16:07:15 2007 From: GRMTim at aol.com (GRMTim at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 18:07:15 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: You know... I was going to stay out of this, but if you are looking for a magazine witha lot of Triumph content, I do know of one. Our March issue will be a special Triumph issue with a cover story on a Spitfire restoration. We are also working on TR8 story, from mild to wild and wild is the Group 44 car. On a side note, I dragged home an early, early, rust free TR6 yesterday that I found less than 10 miles from my house. Tim Suddard Publisher; Classic Motorsports and Grassroots Motorsports magazines www.classicmotorsports.net www.grassrootsmotorsports.com Phone: (386) 673-4148 Fax: (386) 673-6040 ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From 356drb at indy.net Tue Nov 20 16:58:35 2007 From: 356drb at indy.net (Brett Johnson) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 18:58:35 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> References: <496414.66990.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6365AF03-D99B-458E-A618-FA88A8B8143B@indy.net> Hi! I have written the From USA column since day one (April 1995) and indeed Tony was the editor all that time. When the magazine was sold to Kelsey a year or so back, the frequency was increased and Tony told me that they would be alternating my column with the Down Under one and I should write one about half the length. Then, the length was to stay the same and then -- Tony was let go, much to everyone's surprise -- especially Tony. New editor Ted contacted all of the then current contributors and let them know what the new compensation package was. Guess what? Nearly everyone said no thanks! I contributed a couple of shorter columns and they ran two of them. I didn't see my name listed among the contributors last issue, but got a somewhat confusing email today, which implied I should keep sending in material. I also still hear from Tony on occasion. His brother lives up the road in Carmel (Indiana) and he stops by when he is visiting. Tony's background is interestingly in American custom cars. How he and I got the Triumph World jobs makes a pretty strange tale. In the past I have tried to highlight the FoT with some historical and some race reporting. I have enjoyed the interaction and hope that I will still function in this capacity. Thanks for your past input and I hope to be back asking questions as things become more clear. Ted assures me the magazine is not in financial trouble, but as Mike indicates only time will tell. Brett Johnson Indianapolis On Nov 20, 2007, at 3:59 PM, JOSEPH HUGHES wrote: > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised > Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of > the new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old > editorial team. > > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they > got rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and > several of the regular contributors. I much preferred the old > magazine which had a good mix of articles, history, competition and > a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis very much on > advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a younger > readership. > > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the > numbers sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! > > Mike Hughes > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit > now. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dos_gusanos at msn.com Tue Nov 20 16:30:45 2007 From: dos_gusanos at msn.com (dos_gusanos at msn.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 16:30:45 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Will this year's Calendar finally feature my Elva?...................Henry Morrison> From: GRMTim at aol.com> Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 18:07:15 -0500> To: fot at autox.team.net> Subject: Re: [Fot] Triumph World> > You know... I was going to stay out of this, but if you are looking for a > magazine witha lot of Triumph content, I do know of one.> > Our March issue will be a special Triumph issue with a cover story on a > Spitfire restoration. We are also working on TR8 story, from mild to wild and wild > is the Group 44 car.> > On a side note, I dragged home an early, early, rust free TR6 yesterday that > I found less than 10 miles from my house.> > Tim Suddard> Publisher; Classic Motorsports> and Grassroots Motorsports magazines> www.classicmotorsports.net> www.grassrootsmotorsports.com> Phone: (386) 673-4148 Fax: (386) 673-6040> > > > **************************************> Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest > products.> > (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)> _______________________________________________> http://www.team.net/donate.html> > Fot mailing list> Fot at autox.team.net> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From pvucinic at netspace.net.au Tue Nov 20 18:59:06 2007 From: pvucinic at netspace.net.au (Peter Vucinic) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 12:59:06 +1100 Subject: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers Message-ID: Dear Listers, Can anyone give me their experience with Roller Rockers for TR6? Good, Bad or Otherwise? Who's rockers they used? Ratio? And/or whether they experienced any problems with loss of oil pressure/excessive oil flow to rocker shaft? Thanks in advance. Kind Regards Peter Vucinic TR-4 _____________________________________________ Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Tue Nov 20 19:11:10 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 21:11:10 EST Subject: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers Message-ID: Peter! This is a great question. I have heard so many stories that I dont know what to believe. It will be an interesting thread and very informative. I am all ears. Just what are the benefits? What are the downsides? What are the pitfalls? Joe A > Dear Listers, > > > > Can anyone give me their experience with Roller Rockers for TR6? > > Good, Bad or Otherwise? > > Who's rockers they used? Ratio? And/or whether they experienced any problems > with loss of oil pressure/excessive oil flow to rocker shaft? > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > Kind Regards > > Peter Vucinic > > TR-4 > From BillDentin at aol.com Tue Nov 20 19:18:44 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 21:18:44 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World Message-ID: Brett... Do you still have a radio in your 356 race car? Bill Dentinger **************************************Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From stutzmans at comcast.net Tue Nov 20 19:54:26 2007 From: stutzmans at comcast.net (Stutzman) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 21:54:26 -0500 Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY References: Message-ID: <003101c82be9$d4bc8c80$6400a8c0@D9DGQM31> must be VanVlack - he never had enough sense to "stifle". "stifle", as in Archie Bunker's advice to meathead. Bruce ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY > In a message dated 11/20/2007 2:15:26 PM Central Standard Time, > N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > > >> I had a conversation with one of the members of the WPTA yesterday. >> >> There are mumurings that the WPTA would be willing to volunteer to be in >> charge of Friends of Triumph Hospitality in the Paddock. >> >> > > Are those guys out on the street again? Must be some sort of 'Work > Release' > program. That's fantastic. They're GREAT! > > Bill (Damdinger) > > > > ************************************** > Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest > products. > > (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From 356drb at indy.net Tue Nov 20 20:56:43 2007 From: 356drb at indy.net (Brett Johnson) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 22:56:43 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <324DF41E-2F01-419E-9B8D-227421E48FAF@indy.net> Yes, and the original 1951 wind-up clock (accurate w/i 5 min/day) so I can tell when the session is about to be checkered. Brett On Nov 20, 2007, at 9:18 PM, BillDentin at aol.com wrote: > Brett... > > Do you still have a radio in your 356 race car? > > Bill Dentinger > > > > > Check out AOL Money & Finance's list of the hottest products and > top money wasters of 2007. From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 20 22:21:40 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 22:21:40 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts Message-ID: <20071121052620.XZMZ6284.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Rant on This evening an electrician took my (unattended) Server center down. So I rush over to bring the servers back on line. I pull in the parking lot and there is a guy sitting in his car on his cel. Trunk open and battery cables lying on the ground. I ask, "Need a jump?" Nope he has a flat tire and can I help him. I then noticed that he has a crippled left arm so of course I jump in to get the tire changed for him. Hmmm.... Who put this monster wooden box which huge ass speakers in your truck that has to be removed to get to the stupid ass don-nut spare and jack out of your car I wonder to my self as I remove said box. Get jack under car and get it partially lifted. Remove cover on the wheels to get to the lug nuts. Lug wrench is way to BIG for the lug nuts. I reached in to feel the lug nuts (I forgot to mention he parked in just about the darkest part of the parking lot) and they felt "weird". They are "kinda" rounded with slots running down the length. The guy remembers that he has a special tool for the lug nuts and gets it's out of the glove box along with a barely useable flash light You have about 3/4" of an inch access to the lug nuts. The special tool is about 3" long and the standard lung wrench fits onto it (although pretty sloppy fit). That means that the leverage force you are applying to this 3/4" lug nut is about 5" out in space. Managed to massage four of the lug nuts loose. The fifth however... Someone had been a little eager with their impact wrench. Downstairs from the server room is a full service sign shop that a friend of mine owns. I have the keys to the building so I'll grab some tools. I take one of the lug nuts with me and discover that this a 16mm socket is just a hair to small and a 17mm socket is just as much too big. Same with trying standard sockets. Can't get enough purchase or angle to try and use a crescent wrench. Ended up putting his stuff back in the trunk and helping him call a tow truck to take the car and drop it off at a tire store. Moral of the story. Special lug nuts are not worth it. I would rather have some steal my wheels then to have my "anti-theft" solution leave me stranded on the side of the road and unable to replace a flat tire. Rant off From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 20 23:06:33 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2007 22:06:33 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts References: <20071121052620.XZMZ6284.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Message-ID: Yep. I have a full set of them sitting in a drawer, never installed. Can't quite bring myself to toss them, but I won't put them on a car after a similar experience. I also took the single locking lug nut off my F350 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle Sent: Tue 11/20/2007 9:21 PM To: wheeltowheel at wheeltowheel.com; fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts Rant on This evening an electrician took my (unattended) Server center down. So I rush over to bring the servers back on line. I pull in the parking lot and there is a guy sitting in his car on his cel. Trunk open and battery cables lying on the ground. I ask, "Need a jump?" Nope he has a flat tire and can I help him. I then noticed that he has a crippled left arm so of course I jump in to get the tire changed for him. Hmmm.... Who put this monster wooden box which huge ass speakers in your truck that has to be removed to get to the stupid ass don-nut spare and jack out of your car I wonder to my self as I remove said box. Get jack under car and get it partially lifted. Remove cover on the wheels to get to the lug nuts. Lug wrench is way to BIG for the lug nuts. I reached in to feel the lug nuts (I forgot to mention he parked in just about the darkest part of the parking lot) and they felt "weird". They are "kinda" rounded with slots running down the length. The guy remembers that he has a special tool for the lug nuts and gets it's out of the glove box along with a barely useable flash light You have about 3/4" of an inch access to the lug nuts. The special tool is about 3" long and the standard lung wrench fits onto it (although pretty sloppy fit). That means that the leverage force you are applying to this 3/4" lug nut is about 5" out in space. Managed to massage four of the lug nuts loose. The fifth however... Someone had been a little eager with their impact wrench. Downstairs from the server room is a full service sign shop that a friend of mine owns. I have the keys to the building so I'll grab some tools. I take one of the lug nuts with me and discover that this a 16mm socket is just a hair to small and a 17mm socket is just as much too big. Same with trying standard sockets. Can't get enough purchase or angle to try and use a crescent wrench. Ended up putting his stuff back in the trunk and helping him call a tow truck to take the car and drop it off at a tire store. Moral of the story. Special lug nuts are not worth it. I would rather have some steal my wheels then to have my "anti-theft" solution leave me stranded on the side of the road and unable to replace a flat tire. Rant off Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Wed Nov 21 00:33:17 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 02:33:17 EST Subject: [Fot] Triumph World. Message-ID: In a message dated 11/20/2007 3:08:19 PM Pacific Standard Time, fot-request at autox.team.net writes: > To: Friends of Triumph > Subject: [Fot] Triumph World > > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised > Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of the > new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old > editorial team. > > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they got > rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and several of the > regular contributors. I much preferred the old magazine which had a good > mix of articles, history, competition and a few adverts. The new > magazine has the emphasis very much on advertising and would appear to > be out to try and attract a younger readership. > > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the numbers > sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! > > Mike Hughes I agree 100% with Mike. I have every single issue since # 1, right up to # 72. I have not renewed, as it has turned from a decent read into little more than a comic. I am exceedingly disappointed in what Kelsey Publishing have done with it, not to mention the way they treated Tony Beadle - a thoroughly good man btw. With my continuing membership of the TSSC, since 1981, the FoT and other Triumph internet forums, and the most excellent VTR magazine, my needs are met. The cost also went up from $51/year to $99/year...that's the last straw. I would rather spend my money on my Triumph. Regards Leon F Guyot From don at carterdesignassociates.com Wed Nov 21 10:36:54 2007 From: don at carterdesignassociates.com (Don Carter) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 11:36:54 -0600 Subject: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <002301c82c65$1ea97440$59e8a8c0@donlaptop> I've run roller rockers since 1993 in my 6. At the VTR National Convention in Seattle that year, I met a guy named Richard Good who had started a side business in auto parts for 6's. He had a set of his new roller rockers with him at the event and our friendship started when I made this purchase. I couldn't wait to get back to Texas to try them out. The rocker arms are the 1:1.65 ratio and I couldn't be happier with their performance. It was like putting a mild higher lift cam in the car. As you guys know rolling across the top of the valve stem, opens the valve a little more. There is no wear that I have noticed, but I don't drive the car that often. Since '93 only 25K miles, (after my rebuild at 100K), has been on break-in road trips and a few times a year my wife and I autocross it. The boost in performance was immediate and noticeable. They are easy to adjust. There is no downside that I know of. On a milled head you have to watch the geometry of the set up, just as you do / should with any installation of valve train equipment. I had to make spacers under the rocker shaft chairs, but that was because I milled the head a tad. I also had to adjust the spacing along the shaft with washers to center them on the stems. I'm sure Richard has now made these adjustments in the sets he now sells. I have also run my stock push rods since installation. I told Richard recently that I have almost every thing he makes, and that he should start a new expanded catalog. Don W. Carter, AIA Carter Design Associates 6213 Skyline Dr., Suite 100 Houston, Texas 77057 (713) 529-2288 Telephone (713) 789-2330 Fax don at carterdesignassociates.com -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+don=carterdesignassociates.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+don=carterdesignassociates.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of N197TR4 at cs.com Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 8:11 PM To: pvucinic at netspace.net.au Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers Peter! This is a great question. I have heard so many stories that I dont know what to believe. It will be an interesting thread and very informative. I am all ears. Just what are the benefits? What are the downsides? What are the pitfalls? Joe A > Dear Listers, > > > > Can anyone give me their experience with Roller Rockers for TR6? > > Good, Bad or Otherwise? > > Who's rockers they used? Ratio? And/or whether they experienced any > problems with loss of oil pressure/excessive oil flow to rocker shaft? > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > Kind Regards > > Peter Vucinic > > TR-4 > Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tr5racer at btinternet.com Wed Nov 21 10:59:36 2007 From: tr5racer at btinternet.com (JOSEPH HUGHES) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 17:59:36 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] Triumph World In-Reply-To: <6365AF03-D99B-458E-A618-FA88A8B8143B@indy.net> Message-ID: <862842.36824.qm@web86605.mail.ird.yahoo.com> I enjoyed your column Brett as it kept us abreast of what was happening on the other side of the pond. Incidentally the TR Register has now commissioned Tony Beadle to write a series of articles for their magazine, TR Action, and I believe there will in future be an exchange of articles between VTR and the TR Register which will only further cement the friendship between the 2 clubs. Mike Hughes Brett Johnson <356drb at indy.net> wrote: Hi! I have written the From USA column since day one (April 1995) and indeed Tony was the editor all that time. When the magazine was sold to Kelsey a year or so back, the frequency was increased and Tony told me that they would be alternating my column with the Down Under one and I should write one about half the length. Then, the length was to stay the same and then -- Tony was let go, much to everyone's surprise -- especially Tony. New editor Ted contacted all of the then current contributors and let them know what the new compensation package was. Guess what? Nearly everyone said no thanks! I contributed a couple of shorter columns and they ran two of them. I didn't see my name listed among the contributors last issue, but got a somewhat confusing email today, which implied I should keep sending in material. I also still hear from Tony on occasion. His brother lives up the road in Carmel (Indiana) and he stops by when he is visiting. Tony's background is interestingly in American custom cars. How he and I got the Triumph World jobs makes a pretty strange tale. In the past I have tried to highlight the FoT with some historical and some race reporting. I have enjoyed the interaction and hope that I will still function in this capacity. Thanks for your past input and I hope to be back asking questions as things become more clear. Ted assures me the magazine is not in financial trouble, but as Mike indicates only time will tell. Brett Johnson Indianapolis On Nov 20, 2007, at 3:59 PM, JOSEPH HUGHES wrote: > I am afraid that I do not share your enthusiasm for the new revised > Triumph World, Bill. I am not sure whether you have received any of > the new magazine or whether the ones you have read are from the old > editorial team. > > Basically it was a good magazine until quite recently when they > got rid of Tony Beadle ( the editor for the past 5 years) and > several of the regular contributors. I much preferred the old > magazine which had a good mix of articles, history, competition and > a few adverts. The new magazine has the emphasis very much on > advertising and would appear to be out to try and attract a younger > readership. > > I believe its days are numbered and will be surprised if the > numbers sold each edition don.t dwindle rapidly! > > Mike Hughes > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! Answers - Get better answers from someone who knows. Tryit > now. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot --------------------------------- For ideas on reducing your carbon footprint visit Yahoo! For Good this month. From westerneagleracing at att.net Wed Nov 21 14:30:47 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 21:30:47 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: <112120072130.11537.4744A38700085FF000002D1122230647029B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Joe, Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a number of other events have had "polo" shirts. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from N197TR4 at cs.com: -------------- > FOT, > > Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. > > The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! > One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! > There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! > > I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In > Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to > disturb his > artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have to > do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. > > Thanks Greg, > > Joe A > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From REK46 at aol.com Wed Nov 21 14:47:38 2007 From: REK46 at aol.com (REK46 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 16:47:38 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: I agree with Ron...reg shirts can be worn more often,and in differing climates ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From RKramer at rdoequipment.com Wed Nov 21 15:03:25 2007 From: RKramer at rdoequipment.com (Kramer, Robert) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 16:03:25 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <950AB6865A0BD9408E0EEFE42B2118820B761203@RDOEXCHG.rdoe.com> I have been invloved with running the Texas All Brit day for 17 years now and I have a lot of T-shirts, more than I can wear. We have found the Henley style 3 button T to be very popular. It like a baseball shirt and most brands are a little heavier than the standard cheapo T. You can screen both T's and Henleys in the same runs and still get the volume discounts. We also have done some in black, very popular. Bob Kramer Sales Manager RDO Equipment Co. 16415 North IH 35 Pflugerville, TX 78660 512-272-4141 Fx 512-272-9365 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of REK46 at aol.com Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 3:48 PM To: westerneagleracing at att.net; N197TR4 at cs.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 I agree with Ron...reg shirts can be worn more often,and in differing climates ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop0003000000000 1) Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From N197TR4 at cs.com Wed Nov 21 14:58:58 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 16:58:58 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: Ron, Excelllent! I believe the planning is shifting to something more than just another T-shirt. Seems very appropriate. There is also some thinking about expanding the sales beyond just the FoT. But a lot of work needs to be done to lay that groundwork, and I cant speak for Mssrs. Janzen, Sukey, Petrolati, Schumacher, et. al. Thanks and Regards, Joe A > Joe, > Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down > regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a > number of other events have had "polo" shirts. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from N197 From N197TR4 at cs.com Wed Nov 21 15:26:30 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 17:26:30 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Message-ID: Nice sounding alternative for the SHIRT PEOPLE to look at. Thanks Smilin' Bob! Joe > I have been invloved with running the Texas All Brit day for 17 years > now and I have a lot of T-shirts, more than I can wear. We have found > the Henley style 3 button T to be very popular. It like a baseball shirt > and most brands are a little heavier than the standard cheapo T. You can > screen both T's and Henleys in the same runs and still get the volume > discounts. We also have done some in black, very popular. > > > Bob Kramer > Sales Manager > RDO Equipment Co. > 16415 North IH 35 > Pflugerville, TX 78660 > 512-272-4141 > Fx 512-272-9365 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+rkramer=rdoequipment.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf > Of REK46 at aol.com > Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 3:48 PM > To: westerneagleracing at att.net; N197TR4 at cs.com > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > > I agree with Ron...reg shirts can be worn more often,and in differing > climates > From jsnook at wcnet.org Wed Nov 21 16:28:19 2007 From: jsnook at wcnet.org (Jeff Snook) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 18:28:19 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 References: <112120072130.11537.4744A38700085FF000002D1122230647029B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Message-ID: <003901c82c96$37824560$0902a8c0@JeffsNotebook> I'll buy whatever is decided, but I've got sooooo many t-shirts and polos I would prefer a button down. Jeff Snook www.snooksdreamcars.com ----- Original Message ----- From: westerneagleracing at att.net To: N197TR4 at cs.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 4:30 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 Joe, Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a number of other events have had "polo" shirts. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from N197TR4 at cs.com: -------------- > FOT, > > Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. > > The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! > One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! > There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! > > I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In > Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to > disturb his > artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have to > do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. > > Thanks Greg, > > Joe A > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot _______________________________________________ http://www.team.net/donate.html Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spreiss at verizon.net Wed Nov 21 05:28:26 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 23:28:26 +1100 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 References: <112120072130.11537.4744A38700085FF000002D1122230647029B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> <003901c82c96$37824560$0902a8c0@JeffsNotebook> Message-ID: <006601c82c3a$0449a640$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> How about sweats and/or hoodies? Can be worn by men and women alike. Very useful of an evening and come fall/winter. Many different color combinations are possible. Just a thought. Steve P. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Snook" To: ; Cc: Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2007 10:28 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > I'll buy whatever is decided, but I've got sooooo many t-shirts and polos I > would prefer a button down. > Jeff Snook > www.snooksdreamcars.com > ----- Original Message ----- > From: westerneagleracing at att.net > To: N197TR4 at cs.com > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 4:30 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > > > Joe, > Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down > regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a > number of other events have had "polo" shirts. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from N197TR4 at cs.com: -------------- > > > > FOT, > > > > Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. > > > > The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! > > One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! > > There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! > > > > I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In > > Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to > > disturb his > > artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have > to > > do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. > > > > Thanks Greg, > > > > Joe A > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 21 22:01:02 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2007 21:01:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 References: <112120072130.11537.4744A38700085FF000002D1122230647029B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net><003901c82c96$37824560$0902a8c0@JeffsNotebook> <006601c82c3a$0449a640$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: Classy, we could wear the hoodies when we do drive-by fruitings in the Porsche paddock. Shirts can get very spendy, but if they are cool enough you can get the money back. For the Columbia River Classic we had Columbia Sportswear Performance Fishing Gear shirts done with a great logo. We could have sold as many as we had the nerve to buy. In theory we had enough donated for all the drivers and workers/officials, but in reality we ran a few short. People are STILL pissed at me that they didn't get one. This is the shirt we used: http://www.columbia.com/Product.aspx?top=1&p=5071&cat=15020&viewAll=True . It's long sleeve but you can roll the sleeve up and button it. Cool in summer, warm in the fall. Remarkable piece of clothing. We also had T-shirts, women's T's and ball caps made by a company called Wicked Quick. They did it on spec! I'm not sure they still do that, but we sold a lot of shirts. They were so cool the local high-end men's shop in Portland and Seattle--Mario's--was selling them. The women's T's were killer. Somewhere I have some photos from a photoshoot we did at Pittock Mansion with a raft of models. That was fun, if you go for that kind of thing. They do a lot of tatoo style art and the T-shirts are a special kind of light fabric that's extremely comfortable and kind of clingy. Great for girls, but I'm not sure I want to see one on Dentinger. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Steven Preiss Sent: Wed 11/21/2007 4:28 AM To: Jeff Snook; westerneagleracing at att.net; N197TR4 at cs.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 How about sweats and/or hoodies? Can be worn by men and women alike. Very useful of an evening and come fall/winter. Many different color combinations are possible. Just a thought. Steve P. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Snook" To: ; Cc: Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2007 10:28 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > I'll buy whatever is decided, but I've got sooooo many t-shirts and polos I > would prefer a button down. > Jeff Snook > www.snooksdreamcars.com > ----- Original Message ----- > From: westerneagleracing at att.net > To: N197TR4 at cs.com > Cc: fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 4:30 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Watkins Glen Shirt Design-2008 > > > Joe, > Do you think we could have more than just t-shirts. CSRG had button down > regular shirts both long and short sleeve for last months charity event and a > number of other events have had "polo" shirts. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from N197TR4 at cs.com: -------------- > > > > FOT, > > > > Obviously the Glen is going to be a very special event. > > > > The featured Marque in the Village is the TRIUMPH! > > One of the featured races at the storied track is the TRIUMPH! > > There is also a 60TH ANNIVERSARY of the TRACK to be CELEBRATED!!! > > > > I have commissioned Greg Petrolati, our almost official FOT Artist In > > Residence, to submit a shirt design for our event shirts. Not wanting to > > disturb his > > artistic inclinations, he has no instructions or directions. All we have > to > > do is figure out how we are going to pay him. Or I do. > > > > Thanks Greg, > > > > Joe A > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From greenman62 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 22 06:56:32 2007 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (greenman62 at hotmail.com) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 13:56:32 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen Tshirt design Message-ID: The discussion about the T shirt/hoodies/golf shirt/ 3 button Oxford or any other peripheral stuff, like baseball caps is great! It really doesn't matter to me what we decide on... The FOT gets my "family discount" (25% off) for art work. I love doing cartoons, but I'll be glad to do a logo or both for that matter. How about a logo for embroidered stuff, like fleeces, hoodies and caps and a single color t shirt with a cartoon? I don't need to know right away, but as many of you know next year I'm planning to relocate to the left side of the country so anything I can get started ASAP would be a good thing. Happy Thanksgiving to you all! Greg Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... From jerryvv at adelphia.net Thu Nov 22 07:11:00 2007 From: jerryvv at adelphia.net (Jerry Van Vlack) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:11:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY References: Message-ID: <006a01c82d11$83033aa0$6401a8c0@gmvv> My good friend Bruce Stutzman quoted Archie Bunker and suggested that I should just "Stifle It" when he saw that Joe and I had discussed the WPTA again doing the Hospitality Tent at this years FOT Glen gathering. He equated me to Meatball!. I called Bruce and asked him how he could have referred to me as "Meatball" after all of these years and he had little excuse but to apologize profusely. Apologies are not what they used to be ever since a previous President used them so liberally for every small or big transgression that he was caught doing. So I've decided that Bruce's apology while well meaning lacked real sincerity. Now those of you who know Bruce also know that he likes to occasionally toss a few down. Well his real excuse was that he had a few extra beers that night in celebration of the birth of his 1st Grandson; Cooper Stutzman. He was feeling pretty good by the time he wrote that little epistle. Congratulations Bruce, now we can not only call you "Madman" but also "Grandpa" Will Cooper be riding shotgun anytime soon? JVV ----- Original Message ----- From: To: ; Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY > In a message dated 11/20/2007 2:15:26 PM Central Standard Time, > N197TR4 at cs.com writes: > > >> I had a conversation with one of the members of the WPTA yesterday. >> >> There are mumurings that the WPTA would be willing to volunteer to be in >> charge of Friends of Triumph Hospitality in the Paddock. >> >> > > Are those guys out on the street again? Must be some sort of 'Work > Release' > program. That's fantastic. They're GREAT! > > Bill (Damdinger) > > > > ************************************** > Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest > products. > > (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.2/1142 - Release Date: > 11/20/2007 5:44 PM From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Nov 22 07:14:00 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:14:00 EST Subject: [Fot] Watkins Glen SHIRT design Message-ID: List, It 'appears' that the thought is migrating to something tasteful and functional. I 'suggest' sticking to one configuration of apparel and a simple design. (I like the Bill Babcock Columbia shirt, but do not know what Ted & Doris can provide) My vision would be the KASTNER CUP wrapped around the FoT Logo on one front side of the shirt. And something WATKINS GLEN on the other front side. It would be nice also to have them largely presold, paid for, and delivered before the event, so that they can be worn with pride at the Glen. We would be cool, and likely better looking than the MG Guys. That being said, the SHIRT GUYS have the last word. Joe A > > The discussion about the T shirt/hoodies/golf shirt/ 3 button Oxford or any > other peripheral stuff, like baseball caps is great! It really doesn't matter > to me what we decide on... > The FOT gets my "family discount" (25% off) for art work. > > I love doing cartoons, but I'll be glad to do a logo or both for that matter. > How about a logo for embroidered stuff, like fleeces, hoodies and caps and a > single color t shirt with a cartoon? > > I don't need to know right away, but as many of you know next year I'm > planning to relocate to the left side of the country so anything I can get > started ASAP would be a good thing. > > Happy Thanksgiving to you all! > > Greg > > Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois > > That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > From N197TR4 at cs.com Thu Nov 22 07:19:34 2007 From: N197TR4 at cs.com (N197TR4 at cs.com) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:19:34 EST Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY Message-ID: May I nominate Bruce Stutzman as Chairman of the Hospitality Tent? Now that he is a Grandfather he will be further exalted as a 'FOG'....that's another organization. One for the elderly. It does not escape me that his grandson is "COOPER S" > My good friend Bruce Stutzman quoted Archie Bunker and suggested that I > should just "Stifle It" when he saw that Joe and I had discussed the WPTA > again doing the Hospitality Tent at this years FOT Glen gathering. > > He equated me to Meatball!. > > I called Bruce and asked him how he could have referred to me as "Meatball" > after all of these years and he had little excuse but to apologize > profusely. Apologies are not what they used to be ever since a previous > President used them so liberally for every small or big transgression that > he was caught doing. So I've decided that Bruce's apology while well meaning > lacked real sincerity. > > Now those of you who know Bruce also know that he likes to occasionally toss > a few down. Well his real excuse was that he had a few extra beers that > night in celebration of the birth of his 1st Grandson; Cooper Stutzman. He > was feeling pretty good by the time he wrote that little epistle. > > Congratulations Bruce, now we can not only call you "Madman" but also > "Grandpa" > > Will Cooper be riding shotgun anytime soon? > > JVV > From jrherrera90 at hotmail.com Thu Nov 22 07:40:29 2007 From: jrherrera90 at hotmail.com (John Herrera) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 09:40:29 -0500 Subject: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY In-Reply-To: <006a01c82d11$83033aa0$6401a8c0@gmvv> References: <006a01c82d11$83033aa0$6401a8c0@gmvv> Message-ID: > He equated me to Meatball!. You mean "Meathead", you Meathead! John From klynch_6 at msn.com Thu Nov 22 07:53:16 2007 From: klynch_6 at msn.com (KEVIN LYNCH) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 07:53:16 -0700 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: Auto Week this morning has a photo/header of Bob Tulius in his TR4 heading to DP win in 63'. Don't know if this will come thru for you or not. Happy Thanksgiving to all. Kev Lynch http://www.autoweek.com/section/50th01 <006a01c82d11$83033aa0$6401a8c0@gmvv> Message-ID: <00b301c82d18$ff7f58a0$6401a8c0@gmvv> Well that confirms it then doesn't it. ----- Original Message ----- From: John Herrera To: Jerry Van Vlack ; billdentin at aol.com ; n197tr4 at cs.com ; fot at autox.team.net Cc: Bruce Stutzman Sent: Thursday, November 22, 2007 9:40 AM Subject: RE: [Fot] The Glen Western PA Triumph Association HOSPITALITY > He equated me to Meatball!. You mean "Meathead", you Meathead! John ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- - No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.4/1145 - Release Date: 11/22/2007 11:49 AM From tr6racer21 at earthlink.net Thu Nov 22 11:34:00 2007 From: tr6racer21 at earthlink.net (U K MOTORSPORTS) Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2007 13:34:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Pace Car Trailer Message-ID: <380-220071142218340527@earthlink.net> Wanted to offer this to any interested FOTer as this trailer has served me well, thanks Chip Pace 20' enclosed Tag Trailer, 4" Drop tandem 3500# axles w/ electric brakes, white spoke wheels w/ new tires, 3/4 painted plywood floor, 3/8 fir sidewall, rear barn style doors, 36" side door, roof vent, full electrical w/ lights, complete work bench and custom cabinets, winch, custom aluminum ramps, new exterior lighting, tie downs, outfitted for canopy(included), weight distributing hitch, sway control, recent axle/ brake service, glad to email pics, $4000 OBO, 804-564-1839 U K MOTORSPORTS tr6racer21 at earthlink.net From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Fri Nov 23 08:53:49 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007 09:53:49 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Here is some video from the new Eagles Canyon Race track in North Texas Message-ID: <002801c82de9$0ca6ff80$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> Here is some video from the new Eagles Canyon Race track in North Texas from a Porsche club drivers school last weekend. There is still a lot of work to do to pretty it up but it looks like a lot of fun. CVAR will hold the first sanctioned event there next weekend. http://tinyurl.com/2ekzey Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com From charly at mitchelplumbing.com Fri Nov 23 09:24:02 2007 From: charly at mitchelplumbing.com (Charly Mitchel) Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007 08:24:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] YouTube - Top Gear S10 E06 Motor home racing Message-ID: <008701c82ded$4326bb50$0502a8c0@desktop> I wonder if they'll start a vintage group? Charly Mitchel TR6 #44 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNFDZsCmPZY From pcdelux at worldnet.att.net Fri Nov 23 14:50:12 2007 From: pcdelux at worldnet.att.net (Bill DeWar) Date: Fri, 23 Nov 2007 16:50:12 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts References: <20071121052620.XZMZ6284.fed1rmmtao102.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> Message-ID: <003401c82e1a$d4e4c910$43544c0c@user90890nvpgh> Amici, "Special" lug nuts locking or otherwise are also the enemy of mechanics. Nothing better than to have a pile of cars in the lot and first one in has these. After playing the find wheel lock key game for a while you finally get all wheels loose except one. Your $16.95 tire rotation special is not looking like such a great idea about now. The best thing is thay are usually on wheels so ugly you'd pay someone to steal them. My personal rant over.. Bill D Triumph Rescue ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "David W. Riddle" ; ; ; Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 1:06 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts > Yep. I have a full set of them sitting in a drawer, never installed. Can't > quite bring myself to toss them, but I won't put them on a car after a similar > experience. I also took the single locking lug nut off my F350 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle > Sent: Tue 11/20/2007 9:21 PM > To: wheeltowheel at wheeltowheel.com; fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org > Subject: [Fot] Why you say NO to "special" lug nuts > > Rant on > > This evening an electrician took my (unattended) Server center > down. So I rush over to bring the servers back on line. > > I pull in the parking lot and there is a guy sitting in his car on > his cel. Trunk open and battery cables lying on the ground. > > I ask, "Need a jump?" Nope he has a flat tire and can I help him. > > I then noticed that he has a crippled left arm so of course I jump in > to get the tire changed for him. > > Hmmm.... Who put this monster wooden box which huge ass speakers in > your truck that has to be removed to get to the stupid ass don-nut > spare and jack out of your car I wonder to my self as I remove said box. > > Get jack under car and get it partially lifted. Remove cover on the > wheels to get to the lug nuts. > > Lug wrench is way to BIG for the lug nuts. I reached in to feel the > lug nuts (I forgot to mention he parked in just about the darkest > part of the parking lot) and they felt "weird". They are "kinda" > rounded with slots running down the length. The guy remembers that > he has a special tool for the lug nuts and gets it's out of the glove > box along with a barely useable flash light > > You have about 3/4" of an inch access to the lug nuts. The special > tool is about 3" long and the standard lung wrench fits onto it > (although pretty sloppy fit). That means that the leverage force you > are applying to this 3/4" lug nut is about 5" out in space. > > Managed to massage four of the lug nuts loose. The fifth however... > Someone had been a little eager with their impact wrench. > > Downstairs from the server room is a full service sign shop that a > friend of mine owns. I have the keys to the building so I'll grab > some tools. I take one of the lug nuts with me and discover that > this a 16mm socket is just a hair to small and a 17mm socket is just > as much too big. Same with trying standard sockets. Can't get > enough purchase or angle to try and use a crescent wrench. > > Ended up putting his stuff back in the trunk and helping him call a > tow truck to take the car and drop it off at a tire store. > > Moral of the story. Special lug nuts are not worth it. I would > rather have some steal my wheels then to have my "anti-theft" > solution leave me stranded on the side of the road and unable to > replace a flat tire. > > Rant off > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Fri Nov 23 18:42:51 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (Bob Kramer) Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007 01:42:51 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [Fot] =?utf-8?q?Come_join_me_on_Friends_of_Triumph_on_The_Vintage?= =?utf-8?q?_Racing_League=E2=80=A6?= Message-ID: <8174901.1195868571272.JavaMail.xncore@smtp> We have created a Friends of Triumph group on The Vintage Racing League network. A few of us are already members. This might be a place where we can share pictures and videos amongst ourselves., rather than put them out there for everyone to see. It may also be a way to connect the various segments of your hobby together. In my case the Vintage Racing League is a way to connect FoT and CVAR to family and friends. The FoT group inside the VRL will separate them out from discussions that do not interest them. Time wil tell if this is a valid concept but I'm game. Click here to join: http://www.myvrl.com/group/friendsoftriumph?xgk=38d70d2a38 Thanks, Bob Kramer -- To control which emails you receive on The Vintage Racing League, go to: http://www.myvrl.com/profiles/profile/emailSettings From trmarty at hotmail.com Sat Nov 24 19:50:54 2007 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Sat, 24 Nov 2007 21:50:54 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Imports at Carlisle Autox 2008 Message-ID: I have never been to Imports at Carlisle. Any of you folks participated in the autox they have at the event? Whats it like? I am kicking around the idea but it's a pretty good haul. Any of my fellow Triumphites going to be there running showing all them other foreign cars how it done? Marty Sukey _________________________________________________________________ Put your friends on the big screen with Windows Vista. + Windows Live. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/shop/specialoffers.mspx?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_CPC_M ediaCtr_bigscreen_102007 From hottr6 at hotmail.com Sun Nov 25 12:30:04 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 14:30:04 -0500 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: Marty Sukey asked: > I have never been to Imports at Carlisle. Any of you folks participated in the > autox they have at the event? Whats it like? I am kicking around the idea but > it's a pretty good haul. Any of my fellow Triumphites going to be there > running showing all them other foreign cars how it done? The autoX is pretty lame. It is quite short and in my limited experience did not have any top drivers or cars. It seemed more of an event for show attendees and beginners. Carlisle vendors have really gone down hill. I started attending in 2000 and the number of Triumph-goods sellers was terrific with lots of bargains to be found. This, I have been told, was awful compared to the heady days of the 1990s. Last year and this year, the number of vendors has shrunk by a factor of 4 over past few years. Stick to eBay. On the other hand, the number of club cars shown on the grass seems to have increased, and not just Triumphs. Hell of a long way to drive for an old car show, though. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Share life as it happens with the new Windows Live.Download today it's FREE! http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_sharelife_112007 From igofaster at charter.net Sun Nov 25 16:55:45 2007 From: igofaster at charter.net (igofaster at charter.net) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 15:55:45 -0800 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site Message-ID: <20071125185545.0FCWN.424088.root@fepweb01> Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... best regards! Bobby Whitehead 1970 GT6+ #54 CVAR From fpspitfire at insightbb.com Sun Nov 25 18:37:30 2007 From: fpspitfire at insightbb.com (fpspitfire at insightbb.com) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 19:37:30 -0600 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <20071125185545.0FCWN.424088.root@fepweb01> References: <20071125185545.0FCWN.424088.root@fepweb01> Message-ID: edited for the reason that my brain thought before my fingers typed. But if you have a thick wallet, it all looks cool. aaron ----- Original Message ----- From: igofaster at charter.net Date: Sunday, November 25, 2007 17:56 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site To: fot at autox.team.net > Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for > high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to > dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and > GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com > > Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... > > > best regards! > > Bobby Whitehead > 1970 GT6+ > #54 CVAR > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spitlist at cox.net Sun Nov 25 18:38:57 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (spitlist at cox.net) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 20:38:57 -0500 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <20071125185545.0FCWN.424088.root@fepweb01> Message-ID: <20071125203857.SV58F.124283.root@eastrmwml14.mgt.cox.net> My own observation is that while some of their stuff appears to be pretty good, a lot seems to be offered for the benefit of the "Gee Whiz" crowd, that wants something that is impressive looking but of little actual value. Case in point: Check out the Spitfire header that they offer. Joe C. ---- igofaster at charter.net wrote: > Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com > > Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... > > > best regards! > > Bobby Whitehead > 1970 GT6+ > #54 CVAR > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From jaxonracing at yahoo.com Sun Nov 25 19:28:00 2007 From: jaxonracing at yahoo.com (Jay Creel) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 18:28:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site Message-ID: <596933.33229.qm@web53504.mail.re2.yahoo.com> I definitely see your point. My interest is in that coil over rear end set up. I have lost 5 tires in as many sessions as the camber in my car is 4.5-5 degrees and from what I understand, Good Year has changed their construction so now the tires will not take that level of camber. I currently run a dearched spring and the rear has been lowered (pumpkin moved up) approx and inch. I have been fortunate enough not to hit anything when I have lost all these tires but the time will come and I am not interested in finding out... lol. I am interested in hearing what Kas and others thinks about this issue. This PRI set up looks pretty good and simple because it is bolt on. I have been leaning towards the adjustable rear uprights, but I am concerned about changing the ride height of the car plus it would change the angle of the spring. Perhaps not that much to matter. ----- Original Message ---- From: "spitlist at cox.net" To: igofaster at charter.net; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2007 8:38:57 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] High End Triumph Site My own observation is that while some of their stuff appears to be pretty good, a lot seems to be offered for the benefit of the "Gee Whiz" crowd, that wants something that is impressive looking but of little actual value. Case in point: Check out the Spitfire header that they offer. Joe C. ---- igofaster at charter.net wrote: > Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com > > Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... > > > best regards! > > Bobby Whitehead > 1970 GT6+ > #54 CVAR > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ____________________________________________________________________________________ Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From spitlist at cox.net Sun Nov 25 20:31:30 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (spitlist at cox.net) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 22:31:30 -0500 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <596933.33229.qm@web53504.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20071125223130.HRV52.125265.root@eastrmwml14.mgt.cox.net> There was a discussion on that very thing on another forum recently. The general consensus was that it reallty does not change what is wrong with the Spitfire rear suspension. It remains a swing axle suspension and therefore still has the issues with the camber varying as the suspension goes through its normal travel. I think that if you really want to make improvements, the best thing to do (if it is allowed by your sanctioning body) is to go with a true independent setup with both upper and lower control arms and a variable length drive axle. Cheers, Joe C. ---- Jay Creel wrote: > I definitely see your point. My interest is in that coil over rear end set up. I have lost 5 tires in as many sessions as the camber in my car is 4.5-5 degrees and from what I understand, Good Year has changed their construction so now the tires will not take that level of camber. I currently run a dearched spring and the rear has been lowered (pumpkin moved up) approx and inch. I have been fortunate enough not to hit anything when I have lost all these tires but the time will come and I am not interested in finding out... lol. > > I am interested in hearing what Kas and others thinks about this issue. This PRI set up looks pretty good and simple because it is bolt on. I have been leaning towards the adjustable rear uprights, but I am concerned about changing the ride height of the car plus it would change the angle of the spring. Perhaps not that much to matter. > > > ----- Original Message ---- > From: "spitlist at cox.net" > To: igofaster at charter.net; fot at autox.team.net > Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2007 8:38:57 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] High End Triumph Site > > My own observation is that while some of their stuff appears to be pretty good, a lot seems to be offered for the benefit of the "Gee Whiz" crowd, that wants something that is impressive looking but of little actual value. Case in point: Check out the Spitfire header that they offer. > > Joe C. > > ---- igofaster at charter.net wrote: > > Hey Group! Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com > > > > Looking forward to Eagles Canyon Raceway next weekend .. ya'll... > > > > > > best regards! > > > > Bobby Whitehead > > 1970 GT6+ > > #54 CVAR > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. > http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs From vinttr4 at geneseo.net Mon Nov 26 06:41:02 2007 From: vinttr4 at geneseo.net (Jack W. Drews) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 07:41:02 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Peter Vucinic Message-ID: <200711261341.lAQDf9mk335974@ns3.geneseo.net> Trying to reach Peter -- please respond Sorry for bombing the list uncle jack ------------------------------------------------ No Virus Found In This Message Scanned at barracuda.geneseo.net From tstrange at sbcglobal.net Mon Nov 26 12:24:54 2007 From: tstrange at sbcglobal.net (tom strange) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 11:24:54 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] email addresses needed .. Message-ID: <327813.74343.qm@web81112.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Sorry to bomb the list, but I am in need of email addresses for the following ... In case these people dont see this, if anyone else has them I'd appreciate them ... this is for the glen 2008 planning.. Babcock, Bud Bulkowski, Peter Ceilley, Ed Smock, Paul Stadel, Bob Warner, Bill Williams, Randy Wismer, Bob Thanks in advance, Tom http://www.fot-racing.com/spit/caption/tom_strange.htm #4 white spitfire From yellow-green at sbcglobal.net Mon Nov 26 13:01:11 2007 From: yellow-green at sbcglobal.net (yellow-green at sbcglobal.net) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 14:01:11 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Southwick axle conversion Message-ID: Amici - If anyone is thinking about doing a Southwick rear axle conversion for their TR3 or TR4- I have a number of bare axle housings of which I would donate and deliver to Southwick for you. This would only save you one way shipping - after that it's between you and Southwick. No financial interest - just cleaning out the shed. Dennis DeLap Barrington Illinois From hottr6 at hotmail.com Mon Nov 26 13:21:14 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 15:21:14 -0500 Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site Message-ID: Amici, Chris at prirace.com is at the bottom of my list of vendors to recommend. I paid a hefty good-faith deposit on one of his advertised items and after receiving nothing for 2 years, spent the next 2 years trying to get my deposit back. That's when I learned that credit card companies offer no protection after 6 months. I have received nothing from Chris except lame excuses and promise. I've given up trying to get my deposit, but I will make sure that others know of my bad experience. Avoid like the plague, and if you see him, give him a bunch of fives for me. Shane Ingate in NM > Don't know if the group is aware of this website for high end Triumph stuff... > The headers are world class, axles to dream about, and the swing arm > conversions for Spitfire and GT6's are unbelievable.... www.prirace.com _________________________________________________________________ You keep typing, we keep giving. Download Messenger and join the im Initiative now. http://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=TAGLM From don at carterdesignassociates.com Mon Nov 26 16:07:23 2007 From: don at carterdesignassociates.com (Don Carter) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 17:07:23 -0600 Subject: [Fot] FW: TR6 Roller Rockers Message-ID: <009901c83081$1d829270$59e8a8c0@donlaptop> -----Original Message----- From: Don Carter [mailto:don at carterdesignassociates.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 11:37 AM To: 'N197TR4 at cs.com'; 'pvucinic at netspace.net.au' Cc: 'fot at autox.team.net' Subject: RE: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers I've run roller rockers since 1993 in my 6. At the VTR National Convention in Seattle that year, I met Richard Good who had started a side business in auto parts for 6's. He had a set of his new roller rockers with him at the event and our friendship started when I made this purchase. I couldn't wait to get back to Texas to try them out. Mine are rocker the 1:1.65 ratio and I couldn't be happier with their performance. It was like putting a mild higher lift cam in the car. It was my first modification to the car as I was a purist to the point of being seriously accused of being a OCD case. As you guys know rolling across the top of the valve stem, and the length ratio of each side of the rocker arm, opens the valves more. There is no noticeable wear that I have noticed, but I don't drive the car that often. Since '93 only 25K miles, (after my rebuild at 100K), has been on break-in road trips and a few times a year my wife and I autocross it. The boost in performance after installation was immediately noticeable. They are easy to adjust. Basically, there is no downside that I know of. On a milled head you have to watch the geometry of the set up, just as you do with any installation of valve train equipment. The arms should be level as possible before they act on the valve, as I've found, so that the push rod socket does not mar the aluminum arm and that it clears the valve cover, of course. I later made brass spacers under the rocker shaft chairs, but that was because I milled the head a tad. I also had to adjust the spacing along the shaft with washers to center them on the stems. I'm sure Richard has now made these adjustments in the sets he now sells. I have also run my stock push rods since installation, which is why I needed the spacers. I've learned these final minor adjustments over the last few years of running them. I told the now well known "Good Parts" owner that I have almost every thing in his catalog, and that he should expand his parts list. It would also be "good" if he would publish something on how to autocross a limited slip diff. I'd like someone to comment on that before I take out more cones as I'm over-powering the courses we run. Don W. Carter, AIA Carter Design Associates 6213 Skyline Dr., Suite 100 Houston, Texas 77057 (713) 529-2288 Telephone (713) 789-2330 Fax don at carterdesignassociates.com -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+don=carterdesignassociates.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+don=carterdesignassociates.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of N197TR4 at cs.com Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 8:11 PM To: pvucinic at netspace.net.au Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] TR6 Roller Rockers Peter! This is a great question. I have heard so many stories that I dont know what to believe. It will be an interesting thread and very informative. I am all ears. Just what are the benefits? What are the downsides? What are the pitfalls? Joe A > Dear Listers, > > > > Can anyone give me their experience with Roller Rockers for TR6? > > Good, Bad or Otherwise? > > Who's rockers they used? Ratio? And/or whether they experienced any > problems with loss of oil pressure/excessive oil flow to rocker shaft? > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > > > Kind Regards > > Peter Vucinic > > TR-4 > Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wgrosenbach at juno.com Mon Nov 26 16:15:13 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 16:15:13 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, at Laguna Seca is? Thanks, Bill From dave at microworks.net Mon Nov 26 17:59:39 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 17:59:39 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> References: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: <20071127010350.NEEO11609.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo01.cox.net> http://www.cartracingupdate.com/Tracks/lagunaseca.htm 50 ft? "...The signature corkscrew at Mazda Raceway Laguna Seca (turns 8 and 8A) drops nearly 50 feet. The elevation change from the entrance of the corkscrew to Turn 11 is equivalent to a three-story building..." Nice track primer here: http://www.norcal-saac.org/ot/laguna.pdf At 04:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, >at Laguna Seca is? >Thanks, >Bill >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From tony at tonydrews.com Mon Nov 26 18:06:41 2007 From: tony at tonydrews.com (Tony Drews) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 19:06:41 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> References: <20071126.161513.1616.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: <20071127010734.1E736187A33@autox.team.net> According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. I've GOT to drive that track at least once. - Tony http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&qs=1021+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy%2c+Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, >at Laguna Seca is? >Thanks, >Bill >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Mon Nov 26 18:04:07 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 18:04:07 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Race report Message-ID: <20071127010820.NHAJ11609.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> I sent a race report, from my son's race yesterday, to the list but never saw it come through. Thought this stat might be interesting some of you. Talk about close competition around Firebird's 1.6 mile track. He qualified 3rd. -------------- ...The really amazing thing however was seeing the times posted by the top four karts. Pole: 1:06.507 2nd: 1:06.692 3rd: 1:06.865 4th: 1:06.870 Beat out fourth place by 5 one thousands of a second! That's close. Feel good moment. The top 6 places were all filled with karts running purpose built ICC motors other then us running our Honda moto 125. Definitely hitting above his weight today. The really warm fuzzy was the fact that the fourth placed kart and driver took 2nd in class at the SKUSA SuperNationals this past week in Las Vegas (over 400 kats!)... -------------- From lunkercars at earthlink.net Mon Nov 26 18:42:44 2007 From: lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 18:42:44 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Race report In-Reply-To: <20071127010820.NHAJ11609.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> References: <20071127010820.NHAJ11609.fed1rmmtao103.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> Message-ID: <975098F8-BE32-4114-A94E-3BF238794B60@earthlink.net> Congrats to Tyler and to you too David. Nobody around checking fuel temps eh? What sort of times might a TR turn at Firebird - Thinking about trying to make your Feb 1st race. Greg Hilyer TR4 # 314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 26, 2007, at 6:04 PM, David W. Riddle wrote: > I sent a race report, from my son's race yesterday, to the list but > never saw it come through. > > Thought this stat might be interesting some of you. Talk about close > competition around Firebird's 1.6 mile track. He qualified 3rd. > > -------------- > ...The really amazing thing however was seeing the times posted by > the top four karts. > > Pole: 1:06.507 > 2nd: 1:06.692 > 3rd: 1:06.865 > 4th: 1:06.870 > > Beat out fourth place by 5 one thousands of a second! That's close. > > Feel good moment. The top 6 places were all filled with karts > running purpose built ICC motors other then us running our Honda moto > 125. Definitely hitting above his weight today. > > The really warm fuzzy was the fact that the fourth placed kart and > driver took 2nd in class at the SKUSA SuperNationals this past week > in Las Vegas (over 400 kats!)... > -------------- > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From gkbyrne at optushome.com.au Mon Nov 26 21:46:27 2007 From: gkbyrne at optushome.com.au (Geoffrey Byrne) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:46:27 +1100 Subject: [Fot] TR6 Mechanical Fuel Cam Message-ID: <002601c830b0$79db9470$d40eefdc@co3017577a> FOT Anyone have an update on the manufacture of the mechanical fuel cam for the TR6 PI system . I remember emails about someone looking into manufacturing a number of complete units using the KK adjustment method Geoff Byrne TR6 racer down under From dave at microworks.net Sun Nov 25 21:38:59 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 21:38:59 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Firebird Main Race Report - November 25 Message-ID: <20071126044434.HZII22853.fed1rmmtao105.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> The son, Tyler, had an endurance race on his 125 shifter kart this afternoon. The kart had run well at the last event so we have not made any changes to it. Then this morning just prior to the practice session Tyler decided he wanted to try and adjust the throttle cable to help the kart idle better (well, actually to idle at all). Adjusted the cable and off he went to the grid but the kart was activing odd so he asked me to take the tension back out of the cable. Thought I did. He heads out for the track at increasing amounts of throttle. When he approached he first corner where he would need to lift the throttle did not want to cooperate and he had to kill the engine there in the first turn. Missed ALL but about 100 yards of practice. Not real helpful for dusting the cobwebs off. Got the kart back to the paddock after the session and made sure to get rid of the tension in the cable. Gave the rest of the kart a once over and pronounced it ready . Head out for Qualifying with some sticker tires mounted. Not sure how many karts but it was a lot. Not as many as last months 48 karts but certainly more than 30. Qualifying went well except for a short black flag incident where another kart also had a stuck throttle and did not end as well as Tyler's incident. First reports we heard on grid was a "broken ankle". Turned out to be a broken axle. Big difference! The kart did flip and the driver did play superman but other then some bruises he was ok. I was blown away with Tyler's qualifying effort. No practice laps, just 7 full laps run in qualifying and he ended up third! The really amazing thing however was seeing the times posted by the top four karts. Pole: 1:06.507 2nd: 1:06.692 3rd: 1:06.865 4th: 1:06.870 Beat out fourth place by 5 one thousands of a second! That's close. Feel good moment. The top 6 places were all filled with karts running purpose built ICC motors other then us running our Honda moto 125. Definitely hitting above his weight today. The really warm fuzzy was the fact that the fourth placed kart and driver took 2nd in class at the SKUSA SuperNationals this past week in Las Vegas (over 400 kats!). The race. Not so much. The only thing we changed was the plug. Put in one that is a step hotter. Were that close in qualifying I think that maybe that might help. Don't want to change too much. Supposed to be a 45 minute endurance race which will require pit stops for a splash and dash of fuel to make the distance. Got a bad start (yet again - need to have him work on that) and he dropped back to about 11th. Started working his way back up and was making up places. We could see him driving the wheels off the thing as he came around the Tower Turn. Hugging the inside line to decrease the distance around the turn and fighting to catch the kart with handfuls of opposite lock as it skipped and bounced across the bumpy exit. On lap 17 (about 18 minutes) into the race we don't see him come back around. We figure we missed him so we kept watching. Nope. The group he had been running with came back around and he wasn't there. Figure something is wrong and he his back at the paddock. Lug the fuel jug and the water bottles back to find him he's not there. Walk over to the fence. See three karts off in the dirt (nowhere near each other however) and we see a complete front spindle, wheel and brake rotor lying in the dirt. He's not there either. Get in the truck to drive over to the "Looper" to se if he's off over there. Yep there he is. See two other karts off in the area too. Also not anywhere near each other. Tyler said the kart bogged and sputtered on the start and took another lap before it started to feel ok. The downloaded data from the kart bears that out. Pace lap 2:02, Lap 1 1:22, Lap 2 1:10, Lap 3 1:08... He pulled off with what sounds like a problem in the transmission with no power getting to the wheels. Hope it's not too bad. It's got compression, the plug looks good and it rolls in neutral without hearing anything that sounds like a "bag of marbles". We'll clean up the kart this week and pull the motor to get it over to our engine builder. Hope to fight another day. From westerneagleracing at att.net Tue Nov 27 09:51:24 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 16:51:24 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Tony, It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks and you won't be able to get back on tract. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : -------------- > According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it > look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' > of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at > the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another > 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's > a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. > > I've GOT to drive that track at least once. > > - Tony > > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&qs=10 > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy%2c+ > Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 > then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from > http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . > > At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: > >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, > >at Laguna Seca is? > >Thanks, > >Bill > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From vintage.racer at comcast.net Tue Nov 27 14:12:48 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 13:12:48 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Message-ID: <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the approach to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into the turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the while you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and click on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. Gary 62 TR4 69 TR6 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of westerneagleracing at att.net Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM To: Tony Drews Cc: FOT at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Tony, It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks and you won't be able to get back on tract. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : -------------- > According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it > look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' > of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at > the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another > 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's > a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. > > I've GOT to drive that track at least once. > > - Tony > > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q s=10 > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy %2c+ > Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 > then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from > http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . > > At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: > >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, > >at Laguna Seca is? > >Thanks, > >Bill > >_______________________________________________ > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > >Fot mailing list > >Fot at autox.team.net > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From dave at microworks.net Tue Nov 27 14:46:42 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 14:46:42 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: <20071127215049.UQCJ27415.fed1rmmtao101.cox.net@fed1rmimpo02.cox.net> For a "front bumper" level view that will really give you a view of the corkscrew try these helmet cam videos of 250 SuperKarts that we have on our site. The top two on this page. http://www.southwestkarters.com/?page_id=88 At 02:12 PM 11/27/2007, Gary Horstkorta wrote: >For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna >Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the >track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the approach >to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into the >turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the while >you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. > >www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and click >on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view >videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. > >Gary >62 TR4 >69 TR6 > >-----Original Message----- >From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net >[mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of >westerneagleracing at att.net >Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM >To: Tony Drews >Cc: FOT at autox.team.net >Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > >Tony, >It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they >redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks and >you won't be able to get back on tract. >Ron Jacobs >Western Eagle Racing >-------------- Original message from Tony Drews : >-------------- > > > > According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it > > look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' > > of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at > > the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another > > 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's > > a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. > > > > I've GOT to drive that track at least once. > > > > - Tony > > > > >http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q >s=10 > > >21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy >%2c+ > > Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 > > then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from > > http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . > > > > At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, > > >at Laguna Seca is? > > >Thanks, > > >Bill > > >_______________________________________________ > > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > > >Fot mailing list > > >Fot at autox.team.net > > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >_______________________________________________ >http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Fot mailing list >Fot at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From kaskas at cox.net Tue Nov 27 14:57:08 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 13:57:08 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: <00d901c83140$74e28790$3f0ec548@RW> The first time I raced there (1959) my first lap was in a 3/4 ton pickup truck and going through the corkscrew I never saw the road for about 75 yards. Whoopee. They have slowed the straight and added a couple corners since then, but a terrific place. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Horstkorta" To: ; "'Tony Drews'" Cc: Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 1:12 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna > Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the > track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the > approach > to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into > the > turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the > while > you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. > > www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and > click > on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view > videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > 69 TR6 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > westerneagleracing at att.net > Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM > To: Tony Drews > Cc: FOT at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Tony, > It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they > redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks > and > you won't be able to get back on tract. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : > -------------- > > >> According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it >> look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' >> of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at >> the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another >> 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's >> a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. >> >> I've GOT to drive that track at least once. >> >> - Tony >> >> > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q > s=10 >> > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy > %2c+ >> Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 >> then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from >> http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . >> >> At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: >> >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, >> >at Laguna Seca is? >> >Thanks, >> >Bill >> >_______________________________________________ >> >http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > >> >Fot mailing list >> >Fot at autox.team.net >> >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From greenman62 at hotmail.com Tue Nov 27 15:44:30 2007 From: greenman62 at hotmail.com (greenman62 at hotmail.com) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 22:44:30 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> <000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: My instructor at an Audi Safe Driving School last year told me of a track day he spent at Laguna Seca. He forgot to turn off the "ESP" (traction control) when he first went out. When the car entered the corkscrew the ESP though the car was falling and shut everything off. I was there two years ago... amazing. Greg Petrolati Champaign, Illinois That's not a leak... My car's just marking its territory... > From: vintage.racer at comcast.net > To: westerneagleracing at att.net; tony at tonydrews.com > Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 13:12:48 -0800 > CC: FOT at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna > Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the > track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the approach > to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into the > turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the while > you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. > > www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and click > on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view > videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > 69 TR6 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > westerneagleracing at att.net > Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM > To: Tony Drews > Cc: FOT at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Tony, > It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they > redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks and > you won't be able to get back on tract. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : > -------------- > > > > According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it > > look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' > > of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at > > the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another > > 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's > > a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. > > > > I've GOT to drive that track at least once. > > > > - Tony > > > > > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q > s=10 > > > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy > %2c+ > > Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 > > then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from > > http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . > > > > At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, > > >at Laguna Seca is? > > >Thanks, > > >Bill > > >_______________________________________________ > > >http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > > >Fot mailing list > > >Fot at autox.team.net > > >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 27 16:40:29 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:40:29 -0800 Subject: [Fot] New frame for Peyote References: Message-ID: The new frame is done. Took forever, but it's nice work. A local guy in Vancouver, Washington did the work for me. Now I've got to hand sand it all and paint it. I've decided on rattlecan--it's easy to make it pretty again when you have to do something. Powdercoat is a pain in the neck. http://www.allaluminumtour.com/?p=277 pictures here From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 27 16:04:31 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 15:04:31 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net><000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> <00d901c83140$74e28790$3f0ec548@RW> Message-ID: I raced there some on a motorcycle, the corkscrew is a lot less scary on a bike--you can see where you're going. First time I went around in a car I nearly freaked out--no idea where I was going. I followed a 77 year old motorcycle racer through the corkscrew once--he was on a Ducati 916 racing bike, I was on my stock 916. As the front wheels started loading after the downhill chute he rolled his front tire off the rim. I watched him go down like it was slow motion, bounced once in front of me (body only) and cleared the Armco barrier. I assumed he was either dead or his bones snapped like castanets. I pulled off and ran back to find him brushing himself off casually while he looked for his bike--it went over the armco too. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Kas Kastner Sent: Tue 11/27/2007 1:57 PM To: Gary Horstkorta; westerneagleracing at att.net; 'Tony Drews' Cc: FOT at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca The first time I raced there (1959) my first lap was in a 3/4 ton pickup truck and going through the corkscrew I never saw the road for about 75 yards. Whoopee. They have slowed the straight and added a couple corners since then, but a terrific place. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Horstkorta" To: ; "'Tony Drews'" Cc: Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 1:12 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > For anyone who hasn't had the pleasure of an on-track experience at Laguna > Seca, the attached link will take you to an in-car video lap around the > track. The video really doesn't do justice to the Corkscrew as the > approach > to the turn is almost blind, then it,s an definite left as you drop into > the > turn followed by an immediate right followed by another left, all the > while > you feel like you're riding a roller coaster. > > www.csrgracing.org/trackscsrg.html then scroll down to Laguna Seca and > click > on the appropriate connection - DSL/cable or dialup. You can also view > videos of Infineon and Thunderhill. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > 69 TR6 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > westerneagleracing at att.net > Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007 8:51 AM > To: Tony Drews > Cc: FOT at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Tony, > It is HMSA's "home" track and lots of fun - just don't go off. since they > redid the runoff areas for the motorcycles if you go off your car sinks > and > you won't be able to get back on tract. > Ron Jacobs > Western Eagle Racing > -------------- Original message from Tony Drews : > -------------- > > >> According to the topographical map at terraserver.microsoft.com, it >> look like about 40', if I'm reading it right. I believe there's 20' >> of elevation between the topographical lines, and there's a line at >> the top, one in the middle and one at the bottom. There's another >> 60' of drop between 8A and turn 9, it appears. If I'm right, that's >> a 2 to 3+ story drop in the corkscrew. >> >> I've GOT to drive that track at least once. >> >> - Tony >> >> > http://terraserver.microsoft.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=10&X=764&Y=5061&W=1&q > s=10 >> > 21+Monterey-Salinas+Highway%7cSalinas%7cCA%7c&Addr=1021+Monterey+Salinas+Hwy > %2c+ >> Salinas%2c+CA+93908&ALon=-121.7616184&ALat=36.5703935 >> then click "Topo map". Or follow the link to TerraServer Imagery from >> http://www.na-motorsports.com/Tracks/CA/Laguna.html . >> >> At 05:15 PM 11/26/2007, William G Rosenbach wrote: >> >Does anyone know what the elevation drop, in feet, from Corner 8 to 8A, >> >at Laguna Seca is? >> >Thanks, >> >Bill >> >_______________________________________________ >> >http://www.team.net/donate.html >> > >> >Fot mailing list >> >Fot at autox.team.net >> >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From trmarty at hotmail.com Tue Nov 27 19:23:43 2007 From: trmarty at hotmail.com (marty sukey) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 21:23:43 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Fellow FOT'r under the weather Message-ID: Ed Ceilley, one of our resident Spitfire/GT6 racers is having some health issues. Ed has been down for a little bit and is having a rough go of it while going through chemo treatments. He is not doing emails at the present time but I'm sure getting a card from his fellow Triumph racers would help lift his spirits. If you felt so inclined drop Ed a get well message at Ed Ceilley 1110 Franklin St. Cedar Falls, IA 50613 Thanks, Marty Sukey _________________________________________________________________ Your smile counts. The more smiles you share, the more we donate. Join in. www.windowslive.com/smile?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_oprsmilewlhmtagline From S.Janzen at comcast.net Tue Nov 27 19:54:53 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 21:54:53 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Mocal Oil T stat Message-ID: <000801c8316a$0df91060$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> I'm thinking about putting one of these in my car in line to the oil cooler- noticed that the oil takes a long time to get up to operating temperature. Anyone have any good or bad experience with them? Always reluctant to add one more part that can fail. From Lunkercars at earthlink.net Tue Nov 27 20:15:26 2007 From: Lunkercars at earthlink.net (Greg "Lunker" Hilyer) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 20:15:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net><000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> <00d901c83140$74e28790$3f0ec548@RW> Message-ID: <9679FEB5-3220-422E-B8A8-65489FC81D6D@earthlink.net> One of the most exciting/scary/superhuman spectacles I ever witnessed was Kenny Roberts racing against his protigi Freddie Spenser at Laguna Seca [1978?]. I was watching from the inside of turn 8B. Coming off the top of the cork-screw, Lawson had the front wheel off the ground for 100ish feet - when it hit the ground again, it was already turned counter-lock for the next turn and on down the hill he went [every lap]. Spencer wasn't quite there yet. At the infield carnival they had a sit -on-the-bike video game going [very crude by todays standards I'm sure]. Still have my "I beat Freddie Spencer at Laguna Seca" button somewhere. Greg Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 27, 2007, at 4:04 PM, Bill Babcock wrote: > I raced there some on a motorcycle, the corkscrew is a lot less > scary on a > bike--you can see where you're going. First time I went around in a > car I > nearly freaked out--no idea where I was going. I followed a 77 year > old > motorcycle racer through the corkscrew once--he was on a Ducati 916 > racing > bike, I was on my stock 916. As the front wheels started loading > after the > downhill chute he rolled his front tire off the rim. I watched him > go down > like it was slow motion, bounced once in front of me (body only) > and cleared > the Armco barrier. I assumed he was either dead or his bones > snapped like > castanets. I pulled off and ran back to find him brushing himself > off casually > while he looked for his bike--it went over the armco too. From BillB at bnj.com Tue Nov 27 20:29:42 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2007 19:29:42 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <112720071651.12300.474C4B0C000AD1D70000300C22243323629B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net><000001c8313a$4431aeb0$cc950c10$@racer@comcast.net> <00d901c83140$74e28790$3f0ec548@RW> <9679FEB5-3220-422E-B8A8-65489FC81D6D@earthlink.net> Message-ID: I was there. I was also there when KR started at the back of the pack and passed everyone in three laps. -----Original Message----- From: Greg "Lunker" Hilyer [mailto:Lunkercars at earthlink.net] Sent: Tue 11/27/2007 7:15 PM To: Bill Babcock Cc: Kas Kastner; Gary Horstkorta; westerneagleracing at att.net; Tony Drews; FOT at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca One of the most exciting/scary/superhuman spectacles I ever witnessed was Kenny Roberts racing against his protigi Freddie Spenser at Laguna Seca [1978?]. I was watching from the inside of turn 8B. Coming off the top of the cork-screw, Lawson had the front wheel off the ground for 100ish feet - when it hit the ground again, it was already turned counter-lock for the next turn and on down the hill he went [every lap]. Spencer wasn't quite there yet. At the infield carnival they had a sit -on-the-bike video game going [very crude by todays standards I'm sure]. Still have my "I beat Freddie Spencer at Laguna Seca" button somewhere. Greg Hilyer TR4 #314 Albuquerque NM On Nov 27, 2007, at 4:04 PM, Bill Babcock wrote: > I raced there some on a motorcycle, the corkscrew is a lot less > scary on a > bike--you can see where you're going. First time I went around in a > car I > nearly freaked out--no idea where I was going. I followed a 77 year > old > motorcycle racer through the corkscrew once--he was on a Ducati 916 > racing > bike, I was on my stock 916. As the front wheels started loading > after the > downhill chute he rolled his front tire off the rim. I watched him > go down > like it was slow motion, bounced once in front of me (body only) > and cleared > the Armco barrier. I assumed he was either dead or his bones > snapped like > castanets. I pulled off and ran back to find him brushing himself > off casually > while he looked for his bike--it went over the armco too. From Guyots3 at wmconnect.com Wed Nov 28 00:05:29 2007 From: Guyots3 at wmconnect.com (Guyots3 at wmconnect.com) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 02:05:29 EST Subject: [Fot] High End Triumph Site Message-ID: In a message dated 11/26/2007 8:46:55 PM Pacific Standard Time, fot-request at autox.team.net writes: > Date: Mon, 26 Nov 2007 15:21:14 -0500 > From: Shane Ingate > Subject: Re: [Fot] High End Triumph Site > To: Friends of Triumph > Cc: igofaster at charter.net > > I have heard enough about this Chris Cancelli of PRI to recognize that he is > a scam artist of the worst kind, and a liar. There are many people on different Triumph newsgroups in the USA & the UK that have been ripped off by him. It is very simple, SEND NO MONEY, not now, not ever. Looking out for my friends on the FoT. Happy Holidays Lion From dale.oesterle at sbcglobal.net Wed Nov 28 08:48:53 2007 From: dale.oesterle at sbcglobal.net (dale oesterle) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 07:48:53 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] quiller Message-ID: <925387.27977.qm@web82207.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Anyone know why quiller attempted to charge 800 pounds (1600 dollars) for shipping their alloy bellhousing? Oesterle From dave at microworks.net Wed Nov 28 10:12:18 2007 From: dave at microworks.net (David W. Riddle) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:12:18 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site Message-ID: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. >I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >service to anyone. From vintage.racer at comcast.net Wed Nov 28 10:16:59 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 09:16:59 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Diffs Message-ID: <000601c831e2$7cd6a1f0$7683e5d0$@racer@comcast.net> Hello: The current issue of Victory Lane Magazine, December 2007, has an excellent article on the various racing differential types written by Craig Taylor of Taylor Engineering. There is a good description of each of the seven types he covers and reasons why he thinks some are better than others. A good read if anyone is considering buying a diff for their racer. Gary 62 TR4 69 TR6 From sbarr at McCarty-Law.com Wed Nov 28 10:48:03 2007 From: sbarr at McCarty-Law.com (Barr, Scott) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 11:48:03 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> References: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: <3D19C37868680F46BA3E66A8945C9C74890745@svr-exch01.mccarty-law.com> Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods and services provided by the companies we all deal with. http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html (Does not appear that there is any entry for PRI) -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+scott.barr=mccarty-law.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+scott.barr=mccarty-law.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of David W. Riddle Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 11:12 AM To: fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. >I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >service to anyone. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From cak at dimebank.com Wed Nov 28 11:23:22 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:23:22 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <474DB21A.70307@dimebank.com> It's funny ... I have driven Laguna Seca a bunch, both in open wheel cars and sedans, and I never found the Corkscrew particularly *scary*. Challenging, yes - but I know the lineup points, and once you get them right, you're basically committed. There's plenty of runoff if you screw up. (Passing there, or being passed, is a different issue entirely) What I find scary is 6 (I guess this was turn 3 in the old config, which would have made it even scarier after the then-longest straight). Braking needs to be done before the bridge, because there's a rise at the bridge where the car gets too light to brake hard. Turn-in is almost blind. There's a dip at the apex which presses the car down nicely when you get it right - you can take the turn very fast if you're confident. But if you screw up, you could end up in Salinas. That part always gets to me! From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 28 11:27:58 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:27:58 -0800 Subject: [Fot] : Re: High End Triumph Site References: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: I don't have any experience with this guy, but in my experience even a company that gives horrible service has a few happy clients. Just one of those random things. When I read the copy on his website my bullshit detector went off loudly. That might not mean anything generally, but remember that I spent a good part of my life marketing stuff, I wrote this kind of stuff. I pick up on waffle, hype and pure BS instantly, and his site is slathered with it. My big question is: Kehin Carbs? What's with that? Individually controlled single throat carbs are a pain in the neck on an old Honda 750, never mind a car. If you're going to step that far away from real, then why not modern injectors. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. Riddle Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 9:12 AM To: fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. >I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >service to anyone. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From budscars at msn.com Wed Nov 28 11:32:00 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (budscars at msn.com) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:32:00 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <474DB21A.70307@dimebank.com> References: <474DB21A.70307@dimebank.com> Message-ID: I went to 'Salinas' once..in about 1971 with a Lotus super 7 mounted firmly across the front of my TR4..there was no guard rail then... Racer Bud> Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 10:23:22 -0800> From: cak at dimebank.com> To: fot at autox.team.net> Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca> > It's funny ... I have driven Laguna Seca a bunch, both in open wheel > cars and sedans, and I never found the Corkscrew particularly *scary*. > Challenging, yes - but I know the lineup points, and once you get them > right, you're basically committed. There's plenty of runoff if you screw > up. (Passing there, or being passed, is a different issue entirely)> > What I find scary is 6 (I guess this was turn 3 in the old config, which > would have made it even scarier after the then-longest straight). > Braking needs to be done before the bridge, because there's a rise at > the bridge where the car gets too light to brake hard. Turn-in is almost > blind. There's a dip at the apex which presses the car down nicely when > you get it right - you can take the turn very fast if you're confident.> > But if you screw up, you could end up in Salinas. That part always gets > to me!> _______________________________________________> http://www.team.net/donate.html> > Fot mailing list> Fot at autox.team.net> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From REK46 at aol.com Wed Nov 28 11:45:03 2007 From: REK46 at aol.com (REK46 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 13:45:03 EST Subject: [Fot] : Re: High End Triumph Site Message-ID: I wonder if PRI was ever on " Dragon's Den ".....kevin would eat him up ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From cak at dimebank.com Wed Nov 28 12:00:25 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 11:00:25 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <474DBAC9.80006@dimebank.com> > Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could > be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods > and services provided by the companies we all deal with. > > http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html > > (Does not appear that there is any entry for PRI) Hee. There's no entry because I'd never heard of the guy. I'm collecting responses and will add something soon! From S.Janzen at comcast.net Wed Nov 28 12:27:42 2007 From: S.Janzen at comcast.net (Scott Janzen) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 14:27:42 -0500 Subject: [Fot] : Re: Hiigh End Triumph Site References: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> Message-ID: <012901c831f4$c0223e30$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> I have had good luck with their oversize manifold gaskets. However, the web site whas shut down three months for "inventory" or some other reason so I had to wait a while to re-order them. The rest of the product line is so pricey that it's beyond consideration. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Babcock" To: "David W. Riddle" ; ; Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 1:27 PM Subject: [Fot] : Re: High End Triumph Site >I don't have any experience with this guy, but in my experience even a >company > that gives horrible service has a few happy clients. Just one of those > random > things. When I read the copy on his website my bullshit detector went off > loudly. That might not mean anything generally, but remember that I spent > a > good part of my life marketing stuff, I wrote this kind of stuff. I pick > up on > waffle, hype and pure BS instantly, and his site is slathered with it. > > My big question is: Kehin Carbs? What's with that? Individually controlled > single throat carbs are a pain in the neck on an old Honda 750, never mind > a > car. If you're going to step that far away from real, then why not modern > injectors. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. > Riddle > Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 9:12 AM > To: fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org > Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site > > This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings > with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. > > >>I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >>Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >>prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >>hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >>in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >>adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >>service to anyone. > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From srcypher at mac.com Wed Nov 28 14:49:02 2007 From: srcypher at mac.com (Scott Cypher (SpitfireRacer)) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 16:49:02 -0500 Subject: [Fot] : Re: Hiigh End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <012901c831f4$c0223e30$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> References: <20071128171622.YXHC25420.fed1rmmtao107.cox.net@fed1rmimpo03.cox.net> <012901c831f4$c0223e30$6601a8c0@vefadvisors.com> Message-ID: How have you contacted them/him? I have sent email and even called ( left message) about the thick intake/exhaust gasket he reportedly makes for spits, but ive never gotten a response... Thanks -S Scott Cypher SCCA # 362573 #57 HP Spitfire 1500 Spitfireracer at xsmail.com On Nov 28, 2007, at 2:27 PM, Scott Janzen wrote: > I have had good luck with their oversize manifold gaskets. However, > the web > site whas shut down three months for "inventory" or some other > reason so I > had to wait a while to re-order them. The rest of the product line > is so > pricey that it's beyond consideration. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bill Babcock" > To: "David W. Riddle" ; ; > > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 1:27 PM > Subject: [Fot] : Re: High End Triumph Site > > >> I don't have any experience with this guy, but in my experience >> even a >> company >> that gives horrible service has a few happy clients. Just one of >> those >> random >> things. When I read the copy on his website my bullshit detector >> went off >> loudly. That might not mean anything generally, but remember that I >> spent >> a >> good part of my life marketing stuff, I wrote this kind of stuff. I >> pick >> up on >> waffle, hype and pure BS instantly, and his site is slathered with >> it. >> >> My big question is: Kehin Carbs? What's with that? Individually >> controlled >> single throat carbs are a pain in the neck on an old Honda 750, >> never mind >> a >> car. If you're going to step that far away from real, then why not >> modern >> injectors. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of David W. >> Riddle >> Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 9:12 AM >> To: fot at autox.team.net; members at dctra.org >> Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site >> >> This is the response of one of the DCTRA members about his dealings >> with this vendor in reply to my forwarding this warning. >> >> >>> I have not found that to be true whatsoever. I purchased my triple >>> Keihen carbs for my TR-6 from him and he has always been helpful and >>> prompt about helping me or getting me parts. I also purchased the >>> hub kits and shocks from him for my Spitfire. He was very helpful >>> in discussing what tires and wheels to buy and also how the >>> adjustment works on the shocks. I would recommend his parts and >>> service to anyone. >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From TomD4760 at aol.com Wed Nov 28 16:33:02 2007 From: TomD4760 at aol.com (TomD4760 at aol.com) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 18:33:02 EST Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca website there is no information on it. Does anyone know which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Thanks, Tom Deats


**************************************
Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From cak at dimebank.com Wed Nov 28 17:04:55 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 16:04:55 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <474E0227.6060508@dimebank.com> TomD4760 at aol.com wrote: > Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions > there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, > etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there > in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca > website there is no information on it. Does anyone know > which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Depends on the event, and the time you run. There is a negotiated agreement between the track and the surrounding homeowners. It used to be that there were two or three unlimited days per year - those were used for IndyCar, a bike race and maybe the Historics. Most other days were limited to 92dB for most of the day, with slightly tighter controls before 10am. All cars must be off track by 6pm. That may all have changed, but it's going to be something like that. From budscars at msn.com Wed Nov 28 17:25:16 2007 From: budscars at msn.com (RACER BUD) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 16:25:16 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: There is an SCCA vintage race at Laguna seca april 12-13 there is an HMSA race March 15-16, including a tribute to MG..Sound restrictions are very tough at Laguna seca..early morning groups usually as low as 90dcb..Best to check with the Governing group..HMSA or San Francisco Region SCCA Racer Bud ----- Original Message ----- From: TomD4760 at aol.com To: budscars at msn.com ; cak at dimebank.com ; fot at autox.team.net Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca website there is no information on it. Does anyone know which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Thanks, Tom Deats ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From toodamnfunky at comcast.net Wed Nov 28 17:50:28 2007 From: toodamnfunky at comcast.net (James Gray) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 17:50:28 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Mikuni carbs for TR's / high end website Message-ID: <000e01c83221$d63b01c0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> After going to the site in question I was curious about the carbs they claim to use. I did some research and found two companies using Mikunis on vintage and scca cars. Wolf racing is the US importer, they use the twin two barrel setup with 44 or 50 mm in their Datsuns. Vintage Performance uses two single barrel HSR 45 flat slides. These are direct replacements for the SU's and bolt right up. They are highly coveted by the Harley crowd. After some surfing and phone calls I found the HSR's for $ 300.00 each. Vintage Performance want's $ 765.00 for the pair. If they would offer to jet them for 5000 feet I might give it a shot. http://www.v-performance.com/recent.html#mikuni Their using them on Volvo P1800's. Wolf claims to get 30 - 40% increase in HP over stock which sounds optimistic. V/P was a bit more realistic, they said it depends on the motor ( good answer ) but they are getting better results on the dyno over stock SU's on all motors. I read somewhere else the flat slides actually create more velocity and atomization. It's an interesting subject and Iv'e been a big fan of Mikunis for 30 years, their bike carbs are bullet proof. Jim G. From vintage.racer at comcast.net Wed Nov 28 17:58:32 2007 From: vintage.racer at comcast.net (Gary Horstkorta) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 16:58:32 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000001c83222$f6cee450$e46cacf0$@racer@comcast.net> Tom: I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County allows the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an HMSA (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage (www.sfrscca.org) in April. Gary 62 TR4 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of TomD4760 at aol.com Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca website there is no information on it. Does anyone know which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Thanks, Tom Deats


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Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rkramer3 at austin.rr.com Wed Nov 28 18:40:01 2007 From: rkramer3 at austin.rr.com (BOB KRAMER) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 19:40:01 -0600 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <000001c83222$f6cee450$e46cacf0$%racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: <004301c83228$c3e2cb00$0264a8c0@DadsComputer> I use a 2 1/2" pipe all the way to the back with a Moroso Spiral Flow Muffler, 2 1/2 in. Inlet/2 1/2 in. Outlet. They come in stainless and regular steel. I used the MOR-94050 standard unit at around $50.00. I haven't been to a track with a sound limit to be tested but it sure took the edge off the rat-a-tat and hasn't hurt the performance. Bob Kramer rkramer3 at austin.rr.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Horstkorta" To: ; Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 6:58 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > Tom: > > I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db > restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County > allows > the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, > Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry > bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA > vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an > HMSA > (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage > (www.sfrscca.org) in April. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > TomD4760 at aol.com > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM > To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions > there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, > etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there > in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca > website there is no information on it. Does anyone know > which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > Thanks, Tom > Deats


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Check out AOL's > list > of 2007's hottest products.
> (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) HTML> > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From colordog.1 at earthlink.net Wed Nov 28 19:03:24 2007 From: colordog.1 at earthlink.net (steve) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 18:03:24 -0800 (GMT-08:00) Subject: [Fot] Stock TR3 / 4 Lifters? Message-ID: <6629062.1196301805148.JavaMail.root@elwamui-ovcar.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Does anybody out there have a bunch of used STOCK TR3 / 4 lifters? I need to have a bunch hardness tested to complete a set. (Tested 16 so far and I think I've got 5 or 6 good ones.) ~Steve From edwardbarnard at prodigy.net Wed Nov 28 19:22:29 2007 From: edwardbarnard at prodigy.net (EDWARD BARNARD) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 18:22:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: <474DBAC9.80006@dimebank.com> Message-ID: <593358.78761.qm@web81202.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Group: I guess I'll add my two cents worth to the thread. I have never had a problem with Chris. I buy my TR6 steel, lightened, flywheels from him, and they are truly works of art. I've purchased six or eight of them so far and have never had an issue with shipping times, pricing, etc. He does favor the bike carbs for car use, but that's because of his background. He also uses bike valves in his head work. Perhaps he has a connection for good pricing on bike parts? Steve Smith used his stuff for years. Perhaps he can add something. Also, Brad and Susan used his method to measure and calculate for pushrod length on some custom rods, and when they got them they were the length requested, but, were the wrong length for the application. They may add something to the thread. I think we had this conversation a couple of years ago...every business has it's happy and dissappointed customers. 100% satisfaction is every businesses GOAL. My two cents. Thanks - Ed Chris Kantarjiev wrote: > Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could > be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods > and services provided by the companies we all deal with. > > http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html > > (Does not appear that there is any entry for PRI) Hee. There's no entry because I'd never heard of the guy. I'm collecting responses and will add something soon! Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From hottr6 at hotmail.com Wed Nov 28 20:03:11 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 22:03:11 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Gary Horstkorta wrote: > I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db > restriction in the past. That seems way little high to me. When I ran the Pantera there in the late 1990s it was 92db, and really hard for me to meet. The sound-level meter was on the right-hand curb just after turn 5...going up the hill. I had to be gentle on the throttle until just past the bridge. Thats OK, everyone else except Viper drivers also had to modulate the throttle for the same reason. The corkscrew was fun but ultimately not really satisfying. Turn 6 was my fave corner, because I could hit it almost without lifting. Corners 9-10 I disliked intensely...I guess I don't like going downhill - I've spent too much time at hillclimbs. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Share life as it happens with the new Windows Live.Download today it's FREE! http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_sharelife_112007 From hottr6 at hotmail.com Wed Nov 28 20:14:59 2007 From: hottr6 at hotmail.com (Shane Ingate) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 22:14:59 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could > be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods > and services provided by the companies we all deal with. > > http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html Just like eBay feedback! Over the years, I have dealt with almost every Triumph TR vendor in the US and UK and I dare say that ALL of them (with the exception of PRI) have provided exemplary and friendly service. Thinking about Ted S, Uncle Jack, Richard G, Ken G, these guys have helped me as if I was an old friend. One of the main reasons I have stayed with Triumphs have been the terrific people I have met along the way, and the vendors have made that experience very sweet indeed. Except PRI. Grrrrrrr. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newways_112007 From kaskas at cox.net Wed Nov 28 21:36:20 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 20:36:20 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <00f001c83241$63feb8c0$3f0ec548@RW> > When fighting the decibel number remember to simply put a bend on the end > of your tail pipe and point it the OTHER way from the test position. > Don't what that is? Then find out? Huge difference. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "BOB KRAMER" > To: "Gary Horstkorta" ; ; > > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 5:40 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > >>I use a 2 1/2" pipe all the way to the back with a Moroso Spiral Flow >> Muffler, 2 1/2 in. Inlet/2 1/2 in. Outlet. They come in stainless and >> regular steel. I used the MOR-94050 standard unit at around $50.00. I >> haven't been to a track with a sound limit to be tested but it sure took >> the >> edge off the rat-a-tat and hasn't hurt the performance. >> >> Bob Kramer >> rkramer3 at austin.rr.com >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Gary Horstkorta" >> To: ; >> Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 6:58 PM >> Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca >> >> >>> Tom: >>> >>> I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db >>> restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County >>> allows >>> the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, >>> Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry >>> bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA >>> vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an >>> HMSA >>> (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage >>> (www.sfrscca.org) in April. >>> >>> Gary >>> 62 TR4 >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net >>> [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf >>> Of >>> TomD4760 at aol.com >>> Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM >>> To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net >>> Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca >>> >>> Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions >>> there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, >>> etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there >>> in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca >>> website there is no information on it. Does anyone know >>> which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. >>> Thanks, Tom >>> Deats


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Check out >>> AOL's >>> list >>> of 2007's hottest products.
>>> (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)>> HTML> >>> Fot mailing list >>> Fot at autox.team.net >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >>> _______________________________________________ >>> http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> >>> Fot mailing list >>> Fot at autox.team.net >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 28 21:43:22 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 20:43:22 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Mikuni carbs for TR's / high end website References: <000e01c83221$d63b01c0$0200a8c0@acme5oy6ykamox> Message-ID: Bullet proof, but simple. I love Mikuni carbs too--I understand them forwards and backwards, but I'd never put them on a car, other than the Mikuni Solex weber look-alikes. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of James Gray Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 4:50 PM To: fot at autox.team.net Subject: [Fot] Mikuni carbs for TR's / high end website After going to the site in question I was curious about the carbs they claim to use. I did some research and found two companies using Mikunis on vintage and scca cars. Wolf racing is the US importer, they use the twin two barrel setup with 44 or 50 mm in their Datsuns. Vintage Performance uses two single barrel HSR 45 flat slides. These are direct replacements for the SU's and bolt right up. They are highly coveted by the Harley crowd. After some surfing and phone calls I found the HSR's for $ 300.00 each. Vintage Performance want's $ 765.00 for the pair. If they would offer to jet them for 5000 feet I might give it a shot. http://www.v-performance.com/recent.html#mikuni Their using them on Volvo P1800's. Wolf claims to get 30 - 40% increase in HP over stock which sounds optimistic. V/P was a bit more realistic, they said it depends on the motor ( good answer ) but they are getting better results on the dyno over stock SU's on all motors. I read somewhere else the flat slides actually create more velocity and atomization. It's an interesting subject and Iv'e been a big fan of Mikunis for 30 years, their bike carbs are bullet proof. Jim G. Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 28 21:46:11 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 20:46:11 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <000001c83222$f6cee450$e46cacf0$@racer@comcast.net> Message-ID: I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound metering. I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend pointing at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Gary Horstkorta Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 4:58 PM To: TomD4760 at aol.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Tom: I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County allows the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an HMSA (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage (www.sfrscca.org) in April. Gary 62 TR4 -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of TomD4760 at aol.com Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca website there is no information on it. Does anyone know which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. Thanks, Tom Deats


**************************************
Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products.
(http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Wed Nov 28 21:57:04 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 20:57:04 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: Turn nine is really the best turn at Laguna IMHO. Very difficult, very technical, and costs you a lot when you screw it up. Late, late turn in. Odd for such a slight kink but it's so off camber that an early turn in buys you a spin or worse. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Shane Ingate Sent: Wed 11/28/2007 7:03 PM To: vintage.racer at comcast.net Cc: Friends of Triumph Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca Gary Horstkorta wrote: > I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db > restriction in the past. That seems way little high to me. When I ran the Pantera there in the late 1990s it was 92db, and really hard for me to meet. The sound-level meter was on the right-hand curb just after turn 5...going up the hill. I had to be gentle on the throttle until just past the bridge. Thats OK, everyone else except Viper drivers also had to modulate the throttle for the same reason. The corkscrew was fun but ultimately not really satisfying. Turn 6 was my fave corner, because I could hit it almost without lifting. Corners 9-10 I disliked intensely...I guess I don't like going downhill - I've spent too much time at hillclimbs. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Share life as it happens with the new Windows Live.Download today it's FREE! http://www.windowslive.com/share.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_sharelife_112007 Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wensley_Tr at comcast.net Thu Nov 29 06:13:54 2007 From: wensley_Tr at comcast.net (Craig) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:13:54 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <474E0227.6060508@dimebank.com> Message-ID: <001301c83289$b19db430$0200a8c0@Desktop> If you let the homeowners tell you what to do When you were there first Then you can say goodbye to the track Craig ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Kantarjiev" To: Cc: Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 7:04 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > TomD4760 at aol.com wrote: >> Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions >> there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, >> etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there >> in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca >> website there is no information on it. Does anyone know >> which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > > Depends on the event, and the time you run. > > There is a negotiated agreement between the track and the surrounding > homeowners. It used to be that there were two or three unlimited days > per year - those were used for IndyCar, a bike race and maybe the > Historics. Most other days were limited to 92dB for most of the day, > with slightly tighter controls before 10am. All cars must be off track > by 6pm. > > That may all have changed, but it's going to be something like that. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From rhlamp at babcock.com Thu Nov 29 06:41:56 2007 From: rhlamp at babcock.com (Lamp, Randy H) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:41:56 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3F8FF44C413A3A43880E522C56BA44218BBA55@barbpo3.bwes.net> The first time I talked to PRI ,I was pretty impressed. The guy sounded like he really new his stuff. Most of the products on his web site were pretty expensive, but I was excited to have found a vendor that had trick stuff for my GT6. (not and easy thing to find). So I purchased a few small items, as a test, because a few people warned me to stay away. I was pleased with the quality of the items ,but not so happy about the high cost associated with shipping and handling. I then met a local Triumph guy who was involved in a law sit with PRI. This was just about the same time that I decided to order a set of his (expensive)alloy shocks. When I mentioned the pending law suit to PRI, he went ballistic on me and accused me of being involved with the guy ,just because we happen to live near each other. I hardly knew the guy, but PRI told me he wouldn't sell me anything ever again! I guess you are not suppose to ask certain questions, when your about to lay out large sums of money for stuff to put on your toys. He lost a potentially good customer, who can't hardly resist buying trick parts for Triumphs. Canley Classics anyone? R. Lamp -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+rhlamp=babcock.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+rhlamp=babcock.com at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Shane Ingate Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 10:15 PM To: Friends of Triumph Subject: Re: [Fot] Fwd: RE: [DCTRA] Fwd: Re: High End Triumph Site > Hmmm, if only there were a Monster List of Vendors somewhere which could > be used to collect buyers' various assessments of the quality of goods > and services provided by the companies we all deal with. > > http://www.dimebank.com/monster/vendors.html Just like eBay feedback! Over the years, I have dealt with almost every Triumph TR vendor in the US and UK and I dare say that ALL of them (with the exception of PRI) have provided exemplary and friendly service. Thinking about Ted S, Uncle Jack, Richard G, Ken G, these guys have helped me as if I was an old friend. One of the main reasons I have stayed with Triumphs have been the terrific people I have met along the way, and the vendors have made that experience very sweet indeed. Except PRI. Grrrrrrr. Shane Ingate in NM _________________________________________________________________ Connect and share in new ways with Windows Live. http://www.windowslive.com/connect.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_Wave2_newways_112 007 Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ----------------------------------------- This message is intended only for the individual or entity to which it is addressed and contains information that is proprietary to The Babcock & Wilcox Company and/or its affiliates, or may be otherwise confidential. If the reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or the employee agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete this message from your computer. Thank you. From spitlist at cox.net Thu Nov 29 07:18:32 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:18:32 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <474E0227.6060508@dimebank.com> <001301c83289$b19db430$0200a8c0@Desktop> Message-ID: <000d01c83292$b9530960$2d02a8c0@Belkin> Same scenario as people who buy cheap houing by an airport and then complain about the noise. Joe C. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Craig" To: "Chris Kantarjiev" ; Cc: Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:13 AM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > If you let the homeowners tell you what to do > When you were there first > Then you can say goodbye to the track > Craig > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Chris Kantarjiev" > To: > Cc: > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 7:04 PM > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > > TomD4760 at aol.com wrote: > >> Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions > >> there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, > >> etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there > >> in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca > >> website there is no information on it. Does anyone know > >> which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > > > > Depends on the event, and the time you run. > > > > There is a negotiated agreement between the track and the surrounding > > homeowners. It used to be that there were two or three unlimited days > > per year - those were used for IndyCar, a bike race and maybe the > > Historics. Most other days were limited to 92dB for most of the day, > > with slightly tighter controls before 10am. All cars must be off track > > by 6pm. > > > > That may all have changed, but it's going to be something like that. > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillDentin at aol.com Thu Nov 29 08:05:12 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 10:05:12 EST Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: In a message dated 11/28/2007 10:53:35 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I > suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound > metering. > I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend > pointing > at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler > > > A 4" Cherry Bomb in the muffler? Hell...they'll hear that in Palm Springs. Remember when the five minute warning was a Cherry Bomb? Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From BillDentin at aol.com Thu Nov 29 08:05:12 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 10:05:12 EST Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: In a message dated 11/28/2007 10:53:35 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I > suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound > metering. > I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend > pointing > at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler > > > A 4" Cherry Bomb in the muffler? Hell...they'll hear that in Palm Springs. Remember when the five minute warning was a Cherry Bomb? Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From spitlist at cox.net Thu Nov 29 08:29:26 2007 From: spitlist at cox.net (Joe Curry) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 08:29:26 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: <002601c8329c$a0d41640$2d02a8c0@Belkin> With all this talk about noise and mufflers, it reminds me that I have a Super Trap muffler that needs a good home. It is 18" long and has a 3" input. I was using it as a side pipe on my Honda Powered Spit until I converted the car to street legality. I now have a Corvette style side pipe and no longer need the Super Trap. I have a number of extra discs for it so you can tune it from very loud to very quiet. I realize that most Triupms have smaler pipes than 3" but this is easily handled by a step-down adapter. Anyone who is interested, please contact me off list at spitlist at cox.net. Price is negotiable. Regards, Joe C. From John.Reed at wilson.com Thu Nov 29 08:25:02 2007 From: John.Reed at wilson.com (John.Reed at wilson.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:25:02 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I remember the five minute canon at RA. It would recoil two feet!! Regards, John Reed Staff Photographer Wilson Sporting Goods Co. 8750 W Bryn Mawr Ave, Chicago, Illinois 60631, USA Tel. + 1.773.714.6895, fax +1.773.714.4585 John.Reed at wilson.com www.wilson.com www.amersports.com Please note that effective immediately, my e-mail , phone number and street address have changed. Please update your files accordingly. BillDentin at aol.com Sent by: fot-bounces+john.reed=wilson.com at autox.team.net 11/29/07 07:05 AM To BillB at bnj.com, vintage.racer at comcast.net, TomD4760 at aol.com, fot at autox.team.net cc Subject Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca In a message dated 11/28/2007 10:53:35 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I > suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound > metering. > I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend > pointing > at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler > > > A 4" Cherry Bomb in the muffler? Hell...they'll hear that in Palm Springs. Remember when the five minute warning was a Cherry Bomb? Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot This e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient (or have received this e-mail in error) please notify the sender immediately and destroy this e-mail. Any unauthorized copying, disclosure or distribution of the material in this e-mail is strictly forbidden. From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 29 08:43:05 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:43:05 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <474E0227.6060508@dimebank.com> <001301c83289$b19db430$0200a8c0@Desktop> Message-ID: Interesting idea, and I certainly don't think it should work any other way, but it does. Ultimately even the most altruistic-seeming politicians and the regulators they appoint respond to money or votes. Nothing else. The ones who don't are back doing what they did before they became politicians. I know that sounds cynical, but it's obviously true as well. Tracks don't have a lot of votes, unless someone works hard on their behalf to garner and organize support. Pissed off homeowners are an automatic vote block that a politician can harvest by "reasonable"actions like noise constraints, or shutting down the track. End of sad story. -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+billb=bnj.com at autox.team.net on behalf of Craig Sent: Thu 11/29/2007 5:13 AM To: Chris Kantarjiev; TomD4760 at aol.com Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca If you let the homeowners tell you what to do When you were there first Then you can say goodbye to the track Craig ----- Original Message ----- From: "Chris Kantarjiev" To: Cc: Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 7:04 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > TomD4760 at aol.com wrote: >> Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions >> there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, >> etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there >> in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca >> website there is no information on it. Does anyone know >> which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > > Depends on the event, and the time you run. > > There is a negotiated agreement between the track and the surrounding > homeowners. It used to be that there were two or three unlimited days > per year - those were used for IndyCar, a bike race and maybe the > Historics. Most other days were limited to 92dB for most of the day, > with slightly tighter controls before 10am. All cars must be off track > by 6pm. > > That may all have changed, but it's going to be something like that. > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 29 08:43:47 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:43:47 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: That reminds me, I have a massive stash of completely illegal (in Oregon) fireworks in Nero accumulated during my pass through the lunatic central states where every third kid must be nicknamed "stumpy". I'd better do something constructive with them before Nero does something dramatic and loud. -----Original Message----- From: BillDentin at aol.com [mailto:BillDentin at aol.com] Sent: Thu 11/29/2007 7:05 AM To: Bill Babcock; vintage.racer at comcast.net; TomD4760 at aol.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca In a message dated 11/28/2007 10:53:35 PM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > I agree that meeting noise restrictions at Laguna Seca is not very hard. I > suspect it's the configuration of the areas surrounding their sound > metering. > I can easily meet their 93db requirement with an open with a 90 bend > pointing > at the underneath of the car, or a simple 4" cherry bomb muffler > > > A 4" Cherry Bomb in the muffler? Hell...they'll hear that in Palm Springs. Remember when the five minute warning was a Cherry Bomb? Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From BillDentin at aol.com Thu Nov 29 09:06:20 2007 From: BillDentin at aol.com (BillDentin at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 11:06:20 EST Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: In a message dated 11/29/2007 9:45:56 AM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > Interesting idea, and I certainly don't think it should work any other way, > but it does. Ultimately even the most altruistic-seeming politicians and the > regulators they appoint respond to money or votes. Nothing else. The ones > who > don't are back doing what they did before they became politicians. I know > that > sounds cynical, but it's obviously true as well. > > Tracks don't have a lot of votes, unless someone works hard on their behalf > to > garner and organize support. Pissed off homeowners are an automatic vote > block > that a politician can harvest by "reasonable"actions like noise constraints, > or shutting down the track. > > End of sad story. > Bill... You, and many others on the FOT list, will recall Bob Wismer's impressive monument at Road America. Originally that monument was to be placed at Blackhawk Farms Raceway, where most of Wismer's Sports 2000 races were run. But at the time Blackhawk Farms was on VERY thin ice. In spite of the track's considerable efforts to be a good neighbor, locals were involved in an effort to get it shut down (noise and nuisance). All indications suggested they would be successful. Then the racers got involved in a letter writing effort. They pointed out that, in fact, Blackhawk Farms was a little jewel in a pretty bleak community. Every week end considerable dollars from outside the community flowed into the economy. Copies were sent to local businesses, and in particular hotels, restaurants, etc. The problem went away. Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From westerneagleracing at att.net Thu Nov 29 09:49:49 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 16:49:49 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <112920071649.24937.474EEDAD000164470000616922218865869B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Tom: The sound station is very visable and is on the outside of the track. One trick is to have your exhaust angled to the inside rather than the outside of the track. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from "Gary Horstkorta" : -------------- > Tom: > > I believe the sound limit is 103db but they have also had a sub-100db > restriction in the past. It depends on the event as Monterey County allows > the track five, no sound limit days per year which includes the Moto GP, > Champ Cars, Monterey Historics, Grand Am and one other. I use a "cherry > bomb" muffler on my TR4 and have not had a problem when I raced the SCCA > vintage event there earlier this year. The first event next year is an HMSA > (www.hmsausa.com) race in March, followed by the SCCA vintage > (www.sfrscca.org) in April. > > Gary > 62 TR4 > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+vintage.racer=comcast.net at autox.team.net] On Behalf Of > TomD4760 at aol.com > Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2007 3:33 PM > To: budscars at msn.com; cak at dimebank.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > Does anyone know what, if any, noise restrictions > there are at Laguna Seca? Requirements for mufflers, > etc. Also, I have heard that there is a vintage event there > in Mid-March, 2008. But when I look at the Laguna Seca > website there is no information on it. Does anyone know > which club's event that will be? And club contact info, if possible. > Thanks, Tom > Deats ************************************** Check out AOL's > list > of 2007's hottest products. > (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001)> HTML> > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From spreiss at verizon.net Wed Nov 28 18:04:00 2007 From: spreiss at verizon.net (Steven Preiss) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 12:04:00 +1100 Subject: [Fot] odd wire wheel Message-ID: <005a01c83223$ba7f53d0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Does anyone know about an odd 4 x 15 x 48 spoke wire wheel that is center laced like the later 60 spoke version? I have one of these, and would like to obtain a match for it. It has about 1/2" less backspacing than the standard, resulting in a wider track and an exaggerated dish that looks great on the rear of my '56 "period prep" TR3 . Steve Preiss From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 29 11:04:18 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 10:04:18 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: My point exactly. Portland International Raceway is always under some kind of fire. It's a city park, and every so often some people who live nearby get a councilman to explore closing it down "can't something more productive be done with that land" or some developer starts tossing money and ideas around. Only one thing stops it--an active group of people who demonstrate clearly that it's a third rail. In fact you don't die just from touching PIR, you can die from talking about touching it. Racetracks and people who care about them should build that group now, not when they need it. They need to be ready to go before any goofy ideas gather momentum. It's easy to crush them when they're small. They also need to demonstrate their power conclusively at least once. Toss some boob out of office, and make sure everyone knows why it happened. Help somebody that's a friend of the track get elected. It's a good lesson for the rest of them. You might gather from my choice of words that I'm a little passionate about this. -----Original Message----- From: BillDentin at aol.com [mailto:BillDentin at aol.com] Sent: Thu 11/29/2007 8:06 AM To: Bill Babcock Cc: fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca In a message dated 11/29/2007 9:45:56 AM Central Standard Time, BillB at bnj.com writes: > Interesting idea, and I certainly don't think it should work any other way, > but it does. Ultimately even the most altruistic-seeming politicians and the > regulators they appoint respond to money or votes. Nothing else. The ones > who > don't are back doing what they did before they became politicians. I know > that > sounds cynical, but it's obviously true as well. > > Tracks don't have a lot of votes, unless someone works hard on their behalf > to > garner and organize support. Pissed off homeowners are an automatic vote > block > that a politician can harvest by "reasonable"actions like noise constraints, > or shutting down the track. > > End of sad story. > Bill... You, and many others on the FOT list, will recall Bob Wismer's impressive monument at Road America. Originally that monument was to be placed at Blackhawk Farms Raceway, where most of Wismer's Sports 2000 races were run. But at the time Blackhawk Farms was on VERY thin ice. In spite of the track's considerable efforts to be a good neighbor, locals were involved in an effort to get it shut down (noise and nuisance). All indications suggested they would be successful. Then the racers got involved in a letter writing effort. They pointed out that, in fact, Blackhawk Farms was a little jewel in a pretty bleak community. Every week end considerable dollars from outside the community flowed into the economy. Copies were sent to local businesses, and in particular hotels, restaurants, etc. The problem went away. Bill Dentinger ************************************** Check out AOL's list of 2007's hottest products. (http://money.aol.com/special/hot-products-2007?NCID=aoltop00030000000001) From wgrosenbach at juno.com Thu Nov 29 13:17:55 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 13:17:55 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of $1 Billion since opening. As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found a steeper drop in the USA. Bill From bownes at seiri.com Thu Nov 29 13:40:13 2007 From: bownes at seiri.com (robert bownes) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 15:40:13 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> References: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ NHIS, but those are both uphill... On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of > $1 Billion since opening. > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found > a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From westerneagleracing at att.net Thu Nov 29 15:30:10 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 22:30:10 +0000 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <112920072230.16523.474F3D72000D58E10000408B22230682229B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Bill: I agree. When you walk the track prior to a race try walking up the corkscrew! Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing -------------- Original message from William G Rosenbach : -------------- > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of > $1 Billion since opening. > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found > a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From cwn.fot at cwnicholls.net Thu Nov 29 15:43:23 2007 From: cwn.fot at cwnicholls.net (Clark W. Nicholls) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:43:23 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> References: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: <009201c832d9$41c30110$1342a8c0@semperon3400> How about the downhill under the bridge at Road Atlanta ? Seek and ye shall find. Clark -----Original Message----- Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found a steeper drop in the USA. Bill From kaskas at cox.net Thu Nov 29 15:50:42 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 14:50:42 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: <20071129.131755.2416.0.wgrosenbach@juno.com> <009201c832d9$41c30110$1342a8c0@semperon3400> Message-ID: <00bb01c832da$45714690$3f0ec548@RW> It is not the total drop that is stimulating, but the drop over the shortest distance, that is where the "corkscrew" is a winner most times. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clark W. Nicholls" To: "'William G Rosenbach'" ; Cc: Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 2:43 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > How about the downhill under the bridge at Road Atlanta ? > Seek and ye shall find. > Clark > > -----Original Message----- > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. > I have not yet found a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From westerneagleracing at att.net Thu Nov 29 16:28:50 2007 From: westerneagleracing at att.net (westerneagleracing at att.net) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 23:28:50 +0000 Subject: [Fot] (no subject) Message-ID: <112920072328.6999.474F4B31000C9B4000001B5722230704929B0A02D29B9B0EBF990E04D2069D@att.net> Fot: The Laguna Seca thread has generated as much interest as anything I've seen on the FOT. All of you vintage guy and girls why don't we plan something for the HMSA race in March. Maybe a sort of west coast version of next years Watkins Glen (probably no Kas trophy). The fun thing about a lot TR's would be the fact that the race is a tribute to MG! I am copying Chris at HMSA to get his response. Ron Jacobs Western Eagle Racing From wgrosenbach at juno.com Thu Nov 29 16:29:12 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 16:29:12 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <20071129.162912.2416.1.wgrosenbach@juno.com> I've got the bridge to the tower at 7.9%. On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:43:23 -0500 "Clark W. Nicholls" writes: > How about the downhill under the bridge at Road Atlanta ? > Seek and ye shall find. > Clark > > -----Original Message----- > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. > I have not yet found a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill From macdonaldp at rogers.com Thu Nov 29 16:48:00 2007 From: macdonaldp at rogers.com (Paul MacDonald) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:48:00 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff according to Bill Babcock. Paul -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of robert bownes Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM To: William G Rosenbach Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ NHIS, but those are both uphill... On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of > $1 Billion since opening. > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found > a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From kaskas at cox.net Thu Nov 29 16:55:51 2007 From: kaskas at cox.net (Kas Kastner) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 15:55:51 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: <00cd01c832e3$5f7a6180$3f0ec548@RW> Mosport is like falling down a very steep hill, Laguna is like falling out a window. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul MacDonald" To: "robert bownes" ; "William G Rosenbach" Cc: ; Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 3:48 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca >I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff according > to Bill Babcock. > > Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of > robert bownes > Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM > To: William G Rosenbach > Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ > NHIS, but those are both uphill... > > > On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: >> >> Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the >> largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of >> $1 Billion since opening. >> >> As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I >> base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming >> there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. >> Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found >> a steeper drop in the USA. >> Bill >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From wgrosenbach at juno.com Thu Nov 29 17:04:02 2007 From: wgrosenbach at juno.com (William G Rosenbach) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:04:02 -0700 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca Message-ID: <20071129.170402.2416.4.wgrosenbach@juno.com> I've been using Google Earth to look for this stuff. I'm confident it is NOT absolutely dead on accurate. At Mosport, I found 181 feet elevation change split between opposite corners of the track. What corners have the drops, so I can go back and look closer. Bill On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:48:00 -0500 "Paul MacDonald" writes: > I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff > according > to Bill Babcock. > > Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf > Of > robert bownes > Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM > To: William G Rosenbach > Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the > bowl @ > NHIS, but those are both uphill... > > > On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place > are the > > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in > excess of > > $1 Billion since opening. > > > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 > ft. I > > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, > assuming > > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between > apexes. > > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet > found > > a steeper drop in the USA. > > Bill > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From macdonaldp at rogers.com Thu Nov 29 17:39:41 2007 From: macdonaldp at rogers.com (Paul MacDonald) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 19:39:41 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: <20071129.170402.2416.4.wgrosenbach@juno.com> Message-ID: Here is the map of Mospoort http://www.mosport.com/trackmap.htm Corner 2 falls off quickly into a gully then rises up to corner 3. The back straight is uphill too, starting at the hairpin which is itself quite steep. Paul -----Original Message----- From: William G Rosenbach [mailto:wgrosenbach at juno.com] Sent: November 29, 2007 7:04 PM To: macdonaldp at rogers.com Cc: bownes at seiri.com; BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca I've been using Google Earth to look for this stuff. I'm confident it is NOT absolutely dead on accurate. At Mosport, I found 181 feet elevation change split between opposite corners of the track. What corners have the drops, so I can go back and look closer. Bill On Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:48:00 -0500 "Paul MacDonald" writes: > I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff > according > to Bill Babcock. > > Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf > Of > robert bownes > Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM > To: William G Rosenbach > Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the > bowl @ > NHIS, but those are both uphill... > > > On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place > are the > > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in > excess of > > $1 Billion since opening. > > > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 > ft. I > > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, > assuming > > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between > apexes. > > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet > found > > a steeper drop in the USA. > > Bill > > _______________________________________________ > > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > > > Fot mailing list > > Fot at autox.team.net > > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From cak at dimebank.com Thu Nov 29 17:42:56 2007 From: cak at dimebank.com (Chris Kantarjiev) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 16:42:56 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <474F5C90.3060206@dimebank.com> > I agree. When you walk the track prior to a race try walking up the corkscrew! A fellow SCCA corner worker once told me that he was racing MGs in the 50s when the track first opened. He claims that the track was designed to be run clockwise, but the TDs couldn't get up the corkscrew ... so they reversed the sense of the track. I've never tried to verify this, but it's a great story! From yellow-green at sbcglobal.net Thu Nov 29 18:51:23 2007 From: yellow-green at sbcglobal.net (Dennis DeLap) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 17:51:23 -0800 (PST) Subject: [Fot] TR6 rear hubs Message-ID: <883765.25532.qm@web81713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Amici - I have a question for those who are racing a TR4A - TR6. What have you done to make the rear axle/hubs safe? Upgrades, modifications, etc. Thanks Dennis DeLap From BillB at bnj.com Thu Nov 29 19:31:44 2007 From: BillB at bnj.com (Bill Babcock) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:31:44 -0800 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: Laguna Seca is steeper but it's over in a heartbeat. Turn three at Mosport drops, and drops, and drops. The hairpin is probably steeper than the corskscrew, but it's uphill and very short. You can't walk up it. -----Original Message----- From: Paul MacDonald [mailto:macdonaldp at rogers.com] Sent: Thu 11/29/2007 3:48 PM To: robert bownes; William G Rosenbach Cc: Bill Babcock; fot at autox.team.net Subject: RE: [Fot] Laguna Seca I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff according to Bill Babcock. Paul -----Original Message----- From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of robert bownes Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM To: William G Rosenbach Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ NHIS, but those are both uphill... On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: > > Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the > largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of > $1 Billion since opening. > > As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I > base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming > there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. > Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found > a steeper drop in the USA. > Bill > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From RYoung at navcomtech.com Thu Nov 29 19:42:53 2007 From: RYoung at navcomtech.com (Young Randall) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 18:42:53 -0800 Subject: [Fot] odd wire wheel In-Reply-To: <005a01c83223$ba7f53d0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> References: <005a01c83223$ba7f53d0$2b01a8c0@stevenhgi8vu27> Message-ID: > Does anyone know about an odd 4 x 15 x 48 spoke wire wheel > that is center > laced like the later 60 spoke version? Just a WAG, but looking at the BWW website, I see a 15x4x48 wheel listed for a Lotus Elite. Could this be it ? http://www.seanet.com/~rsfehr/ELITE11.jpg http://www.sussexsportscars.co.uk/picture.php?stock_id=271&picnum=1 Randall fdpnmailgwapp3.dpn.deere.com made the following annotations --------------------------------------------------------------------- CONFIDENTIALITY. This electronic mail and any files transmitted with it may contain information proprietary to NavCom Technology, Inc., or one of its affiliates, and are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed, shall be maintained in confidence and not disclosed to third parties without the written consent of the sender. If you are not the intended recipient or the person responsible for delivering the electronic mail to the intended recipient, be advised that you have received this electronic mail in error and that any use, dissemination, forwarding, printing, or copying of this electronic mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this electronic mail in error, please immediately notify the sender by return mail. --------------------------------------------------------------------- From rdavis4 at cfl.rr.com Thu Nov 29 19:50:44 2007 From: rdavis4 at cfl.rr.com (Bob) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 21:50:44 -0500 Subject: [Fot] Laguna Seca References: Message-ID: <009801c832fb$cdfba3e0$0201a8c0@VALUEDA4DE119D> VIR has several very nice elevation changes with one that is up hill and very blind until you crest over the top. And then there is also a down hill cork screw. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul MacDonald" To: "robert bownes" ; "William G Rosenbach" Cc: ; Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:48 PM Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca >I wonder how this drop compares to corner 2 at Mosport..the cliff according > to Bill Babcock. > > Paul > > -----Original Message----- > From: fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net > [mailto:fot-bounces+macdonaldp=rogers.com at autox.team.net]On Behalf Of > robert bownes > Sent: November 29, 2007 3:40 PM > To: William G Rosenbach > Cc: BillB at bnj.com; fot at autox.team.net > Subject: Re: [Fot] Laguna Seca > > > I think the uphill @ Lime Rock might be steeper, as might be the bowl @ > NHIS, but those are both uphill... > > > On 11/29/07, William G Rosenbach wrote: >> >> Laguna Seca gets some slack as SCRAMP, the operators of the place are the >> largest charitable entity on the peninsula, having donated in excess of >> $1 Billion since opening. >> >> As for the drop, apex to apex, Corner 8 to 8A, I'm going with 20 ft. I >> base that from photos of someone standing near the upper apex, assuming >> there is 5 feet of him visible, and I can stack 4 of him between apexes. >> Dropping 20 ft. in 130 ft. makes it a 15.38% slope. I have not yet found >> a steeper drop in the USA. >> Bill >> _______________________________________________ >> http://www.team.net/donate.html >> >> Fot mailing list >> Fot at autox.team.net >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot > _______________________________________________ > http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Fot mailing list > Fot at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot From malaboge at aol.com Thu Nov 29 21:54:26 2007 From: malaboge at aol.com (malaboge at aol.com) Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 23:54:26 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR6 rear hubs In-Reply-To: <883765.25532.qm@web81713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <883765.25532.qm@web81713.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8CA012437D9A5C9-65C-8988@WEBMAIL-STG-D01.sysops.aol.com> Dennis- No matter what you do, the stock outer axle is the big problem...it will break! I run a basically unbreakable chevy setup.? A corvair outer axle drilled for a TR lug pattern, with a Corvair hub assembly. Cut off all the protrusions on the Corvair hub assembly so it will fit into the TR trailing arm, and weld on a flange to mount onto the TR trailing arm.? Use a GM ujoint and cut down one side so as to mount to the Corvair stub axle on one side and the TR sliding axle on the other. Actually much easier than it sounds. Drivin the?Chevumph...Triolet? ????????? Nick in NorCal -----Original Message----- From: Dennis DeLap To: FOT Sent: Thu, 29 Nov 2007 5:51 pm Subject: [Fot] TR6 rear hubs Amici - I have a question for those who are racing a TR4A - TR6. What have you done to make the rear axle/hubs safe? Upgrades, modifications, etc. Thanks Dennis DeLap Fot mailing list Fot at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/fot ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://o.aolcdn.com/cdn.webmail.aol.com/mailtour/aol/en-us/text.htm?ncid=aolcmp00050000000003 From gasket.works at verizon.net Fri Nov 30 10:56:29 2007 From: gasket.works at verizon.net (Gasket Works USA) Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 11:56:29 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Fot] gas welding with H2/02? Message-ID: <5857257.12844641196445389764.JavaMail.root@vms124.mailsrvcs.net> anyone have exp with this ? reply off line (email above). Mordy M.N.Dunst Gasket Works USA, LLC gmt-8 Pacific time 626.358.1616 voice 626.628.3777 fax From gasket.works at verizon.net Fri Nov 30 10:56:19 2007 From: gasket.works at verizon.net (Gasket Works USA) Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 11:56:19 -0600 (CST) Subject: [Fot] gas welding with H2/02? Message-ID: <5470385.12844561196445379329.JavaMail.root@vms124.mailsrvcs.net> anyone have exp with this ? reply off line (email above). Mordy M.N.Dunst Gasket Works USA, LLC gmt-8 Pacific time 626.358.1616 voice 626.628.3777 fax From elkhorn at core.com Fri Nov 30 14:51:03 2007 From: elkhorn at core.com (David Wingett) Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 16:51:03 -0500 Subject: [Fot] TR6 / Corvair hubs Message-ID: <001b01c8339b$1a95ee00$0100a8c0@elkhorn> FOT, It's nice to know I had a small part in keeping a few Triumphs out on the track. I haven't made any in a few years now. I've had many requests but it got to be just too big a project. I do have a couple sets of the Alum. hubs I've been saving as spares for my own racing habit. For those that have or are considering Corvair axles this is the major part you need. Sorry but when they are gone I wont be making any more. Best to contact me off line Dave Wingett From bob at CoanPro.com Fri Nov 30 20:59:07 2007 From: bob at CoanPro.com (Bob Coan) Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 19:59:07 -0800 Subject: [Fot] SCCA or Vintage Spitfire for sale Message-ID: <001101c833ce$866f9bc0$934ed340$@com> Hey everyone, I've decided to sell this beautiful SCCA HP ready Spitfire along with a nice stock of spare parts. My Dad and I hoped to make it to the runoffs but its does not look like we will be doing that anytime soon, so instead of letting this car sit in storage, I'll find someone that wants to put it on the track. It could easily be converted to Vintage. Take a look at http://picasaweb.google.com/thinkfreerealtyphotos/SCCAHPTriumphSpitfire The guy I bought it from owned a racing supply business and put over 25k into the car and only ran it a few times. The car has been totally race prepared with a brand new 1147 race motor built by Acme Racing of Spartanburg NC, rebuilt transmission, rebuilt rear end, everything including lug bolts and studs have been rebuilt. The car has Mark Williams axels, modified carbs and Electromotive crank trigger ignition. Gary Johnson of E. TN Race Prep did the final assembly...including front coil over's, new front and rear disc brakes, Electromotive crank trigger ignition and more. I just put the car on e-bay for $5000. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem &sspagename=STRK%3AMESCX%3AIT&viewitem=&item=220178787790&_trksid=p3984.cSCH EDULE.m314.lVI I also have a the enclosed trailer and matching Dodge Ram truck if someone wanted a turnkey setup. All going for good prices. I need to clear out my storage shop over the next 3 weeks, so please forward this info to anyone you think might be interested. It's all located in Tustin, California, which is Southern California near Disneyland. Bob Coan 714-566-5138