From achd73 at yahoo.com  Wed Feb  3 11:12:18 2010
From: achd73 at yahoo.com (Tony Somebody)
Date: Wed, 3 Feb 2010 10:12:18 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [Alpines] Holbay engine help
Message-ID: <700672.10412.qm@web30405.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

As some members know I have both Tigers and Alpines I have been attempting to
build a better than stock 1725 for my S5 w/ OD My first setback was the
machine shop some how lost a beautiful head I had spent lots of time porting
then paid a pro to finish up- soon I decided I would like to have a Holbay
engine and had made friends with a chap in the UK who had bought a Holbay
head, intake and headers several years back and was willing to sell them to me
for what he paid- what a great person this gentleman is but upon searching his
workshop the parts where missing It seems his neighborhood has changed over
the years and what used to be left unlocked is now in need of alarms as crime
is up in the UK too- long story short he had been burglarized but wasnt aware
his Beam parts had also been removed. He is an older gent and says he has so
many bits he may never know what all was taken. Next I met a guy selling
Holbay items on epay and although I wasnt able to
 get the head, he has another Holbay engine. I have help in getting the
smaller parts to the USA but I dont think the block is one that can be
brought. I need to know if the Holbay uses the same 1725 as the stock block. I
know it uses a different head and of course the cam isnt the same or even the
intake and it uses flat head pistons to raise compression. There is prolly an
American flat head piston that would work BUT thats a guess and wishful
thinking ANY information on the similarities or the differences between the
Holbay and the stock 1725 know to our members would be appreciated.Feel free
to contact me off list
Thanks in advance
TtT
PS- I sent this to the Tiger list as well because I know we have members that
have a broad knowledge of Sunbeams other than the Tiger.

From jarrid_gross at earthlink.net  Wed Feb  3 12:45:24 2010
From: jarrid_gross at earthlink.net (jarrid_gross at earthlink.net)
Date: Wed, 3 Feb 2010 14:45:24 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [Alpines] Holbay engine help
Message-ID: <1591048.1265226324486.JavaMail.root@wamui-haziran.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Tony,

The holbay setup in an alpine can use any 1725 block.
The Hunter 1725 block has side motor mounts, so you cant use early alpine 1725 blocks
in a hunter, but you can use hunter 1725 (or alpine blocks) in an alpine.


HTH

Jarrid Gross


-----Original Message-----
>From: Tony Somebody <achd73 at yahoo.com>
>Sent: Feb 3, 2010 1:12 PM
>To: Alpine List <alpines at autox.team.net>, Beamclub <tigers at autox.team.net>
>Subject: [Alpines] Holbay engine help
>
>As some members know I have both Tigers and Alpines I have been attempting to
>build a better than stock 1725 for my S5 w/ OD My first setback was the
>machine shop some how lost a beautiful head I had spent lots of time porting
>then paid a pro to finish up- soon I decided I would like to have a Holbay
>engine and had made friends with a chap in the UK who had bought a Holbay
>head, intake and headers several years back and was willing to sell them to me
>for what he paid- what a great person this gentleman is but upon searching his
>workshop the parts where missing It seems his neighborhood has changed over
>the years and what used to be left unlocked is now in need of alarms as crime
>is up in the UK too- long story short he had been burglarized but wasnt aware
>his Beam parts had also been removed. He is an older gent and says he has so
>many bits he may never know what all was taken. Next I met a guy selling
>Holbay items on epay and although I wasnt able to
> get the head, he has another Holbay engine. I have help in getting the
>smaller parts to the USA but I dont think the block is one that can be
>brought. I need to know if the Holbay uses the same 1725 as the stock block. I
>know it uses a different head and of course the cam isnt the same or even the
>intake and it uses flat head pistons to raise compression. There is prolly an
>American flat head piston that would work BUT thats a guess and wishful
>thinking ANY information on the similarities or the differences between the
>Holbay and the stock 1725 know to our members would be appreciated.Feel free
>to contact me off list
>Thanks in advance

From tom.hill at att.net  Wed Feb  3 16:03:04 2010
From: tom.hill at att.net (tom.hill at att.net)
Date: Wed, 03 Feb 2010 23:03:04 +0000
Subject: [Alpines] Holbay engine help
In-Reply-To: <1591048.1265226324486.JavaMail.root@wamui-haziran.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <020320102303.29528.4B6A00A800060A760000735822228869349B0A02D29B9B0EBF04040708D203019B@att.net>

Tony,

I have a Holbay head on my original SV Alpine block.  It fits perfectly with no modifications required to either the block or head.  As you observed, the combustion chamber has been reshaped on the Holbay head and you must use flat top pistions to restore the compression ratio.

One thing to be aware of is the intake runners in the Holbay head are smaller than the standard Alpine head and the Hunter engine was tilted over 15 degrees or so.  This means the Holbay intake cannot be used on the Alpine without being cut and rewelded to account for the 15 degress.  And, if you use a manifold that was intended for use on the standard Alpine head, there will be a "step" between the intake and head.  Not the best scenario for performance.

I have the setup on my car and it made 120HP at the crankshaft on the dyno.  I had the Holbay side draft intake modified but it was still too close to the steering box.  I am using the Redline manifold and it fits fine.  I had the inside of the intake runners welded up and smoothed to match the Holbay head.  I haven't finished the installation so I can't comment on the "roadability" of the setup

Good Luck,

Tom Hill
-------------- Original message from "jarrid_gross at earthlink.net" <jarrid_gross at earthlink.net>: -------------- 


> Tony, 
> 
> The holbay setup in an alpine can use any 1725 block. The Hunter 1725 block has side motor mounts, so you cant use early alpine 1725 
> blocks 
> in a hunter, but you can use hunter 1725 (or alpine blocks) in an alpine. 
> 
> 
> HTH 
> 
> Jarrid Gross 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message----- 
> >From: Tony Somebody 
> >Sent: Feb 3, 2010 1:12 PM 
> >To: Alpine List , Beamclub 
> >Subject: [Alpines] Holbay engine help 
> > 
> >As some members know I have both Tigers and Alpines I have been attempting to 
> >build a better than stock 1725 for my S5 w/ OD My first setback was the 
> >machine shop some how lost a beautiful head I had spent lots of time porting 
> >then paid a pro to finish up- soon I decided I would like to have a Holbay 
> >engine and had made friends with a chap in the UK who had bought a Holbay 
> >head, intake and headers several years back and was willing to sell them to me 
> >for what he paid- what a great person this gentleman is but upon searching his 
> >workshop the parts where missing It seems his neighborhood has changed over 
> >the years and what used to be left unlocked is now in need of alarms as crime 
> >is up in the UK too- long story short he had been burglarized but wasnt aware 
> >his Beam parts had also been removed. He is an older gent and says he has so 
> >many bits he may never know what all was taken. Next I met a guy selling 
> >Holbay items on epay and although I wasnt able to 
> > get the head, he has another Holbay engine. I have help in getting the 
> >smaller parts to the USA but I dont think the block is one that can be 
> >brought. I need to know if the Holbay uses the same 1725 as the stock block. I 
> >know it uses a different head and of course the cam isnt the same or even the 
> >intake and it uses flat head pistons to raise compression. There is prolly an 
> >American flat head piston that would work BUT thats a guess and wishful 
> >thinking ANY information on the similarities or the differences between the 
> >Holbay and the stock 1725 know to our members would be appreciated.Feel free 
> >to contact me off list 
> >Thanks in advance 
> _______________________________________________ 
> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html 
> 
> Alpines at autox.team.net 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/alpines 
> 
> http://www.team.net/archive 

From fredlevit at earthlink.net  Thu Feb  4 17:23:57 2010
From: fredlevit at earthlink.net (Fred Levit)
Date: Thu, 4 Feb 2010 18:23:57 -0600
Subject: [Alpines] shift knob decal ??
Message-ID: <26437DEF-6832-40FF-B72E-F7AE3F9A7503@earthlink.net>

Does anyone know if there is a source for a decal of the shift  
pattern for a shift knob? I have had to have a Series 4 transmission  
put in my Series 3 and want to put the shift pattern on the knob. I  
can have a silk screen made, but for a single job that is a bit  
expensive.

Fred Levit

From wiencek at anl.gov  Fri Feb  5 09:58:04 2010
From: wiencek at anl.gov (Wiencek, Thomas)
Date: Fri, 5 Feb 2010 10:58:04 -0600
Subject: [Alpines] Holbay engine help
In-Reply-To: <020320102303.29528.4B6A00A800060A760000735822228869349B0A02D29B9B0EBF04040708D203019B@att.net>
References: <1591048.1265226324486.JavaMail.root@wamui-haziran.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<020320102303.29528.4B6A00A800060A760000735822228869349B0A02D29B9B0EBF04040708D203019B@att.net>
Message-ID: <1FA56BB961B62E4BBF260430AFBEF71967991A35@HETFIELD.anl.gov>

Can you make up the compression loss by skimming the head and using dished
pistons?

-----Original Message-----
From: alpines-bounces at autox.team.net [mailto:alpines-bounces at autox.team.net]
On Behalf Of tom.hill at att.net
Sent: Wednesday, February 03, 2010 5:03 PM
To: Tony Somebody; Alpine List; Beamclub
Subject: Re: [Alpines] Holbay engine help

Tony,

I have a Holbay head on my original SV Alpine block.  It fits perfectly with
no modifications required to either the block or head.  As you observed, the
combustion chamber has been reshaped on the Holbay head and you must use flat
top pistions to restore the compression ratio.

One thing to be aware of is the intake runners in the Holbay head are smaller
than the standard Alpine head and the Hunter engine was tilted over 15 degrees
or so.  This means the Holbay intake cannot be used on the Alpine without
being cut and rewelded to account for the 15 degress.  And, if you use a
manifold that was intended for use on the standard Alpine head, there will be
a "step" between the intake and head.  Not the best scenario for performance.

I have the setup on my car and it made 120HP at the crankshaft on the dyno.  I
had the Holbay side draft intake modified but it was still too close to the
steering box.  I am using the Redline manifold and it fits fine.  I had the
inside of the intake runners welded up and smoothed to match the Holbay head.
I haven't finished the installation so I can't comment on the "roadability" of
the setup

Good Luck,

Tom Hill
-------------- Original message from "jarrid_gross at earthlink.net"
<jarrid_gross at earthlink.net>: --------------


> Tony,
>
> The holbay setup in an alpine can use any 1725 block. The Hunter 1725 block
has side motor mounts, so you cant use early alpine 1725
> blocks
> in a hunter, but you can use hunter 1725 (or alpine blocks) in an alpine.
>
>
> HTH
>
> Jarrid Gross
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> >From: Tony Somebody
> >Sent: Feb 3, 2010 1:12 PM
> >To: Alpine List , Beamclub
> >Subject: [Alpines] Holbay engine help
> >
> >As some members know I have both Tigers and Alpines I have been attempting
to
> >build a better than stock 1725 for my S5 w/ OD My first setback was the
> >machine shop some how lost a beautiful head I had spent lots of time
porting
> >then paid a pro to finish up- soon I decided I would like to have a Holbay
> >engine and had made friends with a chap in the UK who had bought a Holbay
> >head, intake and headers several years back and was willing to sell them to
me
> >for what he paid- what a great person this gentleman is but upon searching
his
> >workshop the parts where missing It seems his neighborhood has changed
over
> >the years and what used to be left unlocked is now in need of alarms as
crime
> >is up in the UK too- long story short he had been burglarized but wasnt
aware
> >his Beam parts had also been removed. He is an older gent and says he has
so
> >many bits he may never know what all was taken. Next I met a guy selling
> >Holbay items on epay and although I wasnt able to
> > get the head, he has another Holbay engine. I have help in getting the
> >smaller parts to the USA but I dont think the block is one that can be
> >brought. I need to know if the Holbay uses the same 1725 as the stock
block. I
> >know it uses a different head and of course the cam isnt the same or even
the
> >intake and it uses flat head pistons to raise compression. There is prolly
an
> >American flat head piston that would work BUT thats a guess and wishful
> >thinking ANY information on the similarities or the differences between
the
> >Holbay and the stock 1725 know to our members would be appreciated.Feel
free
> >to contact me off list
> >Thanks in advance
> _______________________________________________
> Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html
>
> Alpines at autox.team.net
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/alpines
>
> http://www.team.net/archive
Alpines at autox.team.net
http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/alpines

http://www.team.net/archive

From deiland1 at elp.rr.com  Sat Feb  6 08:19:38 2010
From: deiland1 at elp.rr.com (Dan Eiland)
Date: Sat, 6 Feb 2010 08:19:38 -0700
Subject: [Alpines] Speedometer Repair Manual
Message-ID: <06ABDDE2D57C4F4D8581BA5FE3D49A29@owner95291b1f9>

I received this from another car list and felt it was worth sharing with 
those that might be interested.

This manual is available as a PDF file. A new 2004 update is in the works 
right now.

Smiths / Jaeger Speedometer Repair Manual in PDF format (1340K) (UPDATED 
12/02)

It is really informative and if nothing else helps to understand how our 
speedomters and tachs work even if you don't plan to rebuild your own 
instruments.

Dan Eiland

From deiland1 at elp.rr.com  Sat Feb  6 08:23:15 2010
From: deiland1 at elp.rr.com (Dan Eiland)
Date: Sat, 6 Feb 2010 08:23:15 -0700
Subject: [Alpines] Speedometer Repair Manual
Message-ID: <459DD7210FA8470DBE5D35E982EFE0E6@owner95291b1f9>

Sorry that the hyperlink didn't transmit correctly. I'll try again:

http://home.comcast.net/~rhodes/speedo.html



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Dan Eiland" <deiland1 at elp.rr.com>
To: "Texas Jensens" <TexasJensens at yahoogroups.com>; "Tiger List" 
<tigers at autox.team.net>; "Jensen List" <jensen-cars at british-steel.org>; 
"Alpine List" <alpines at autox.team.net>
Sent: Saturday, February 06, 2010 8:19 AM
Subject: Speedometer Repair Manual


>I received this from another car list and felt it was worth sharing with 
>those that might be interested.
>
> This manual is available as a PDF file. A new 2004 update is in the works 
> right now.
>
> Smiths / Jaeger Speedometer Repair Manual in PDF format (1340K) (UPDATED 
> 12/02)
>
> It is really informative and if nothing else helps to understand how our 
> speedomters and tachs work even if you don't plan to rebuild your own 
> instruments.
>
> Dan Eiland

From ross_hulse at sbcglobal.net  Sat Feb  6 17:38:55 2010
From: ross_hulse at sbcglobal.net (Ross)
Date: Sat, 6 Feb 2010 16:38:55 -0800
Subject: [Alpines] [Tigers] Mediterranean Blue Tiger with a White Top?
In-Reply-To: <C7933D09.C9C%m_dangelo@verizon.net>
References: <D313717D-A7E6-4959-9CE8-5F651C5755FF@comcast.net>
	<C7933D09.C9C%m_dangelo@verizon.net>
Message-ID: <0F66A204520244C3986B8E60CF18C1C1@ROSS>

Has anyone ever seen a Mediterranean Blue Tiger with a white soft top
(hood)?  I need a top and am considering either this or black.  I wish I had
pictures to look at...  Thanks.  Mauro

Here is a picture of a Commodore Blue car with a light tan top.

[demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type image/jpeg which had a name of P1010033.JPG]

From mark at bradakis.com  Mon Feb  8 19:42:07 2010
From: mark at bradakis.com (Mark J Bradakis)
Date: Mon,  8 Feb 2010 19:42:07 -0700 (MST)
Subject: [Alpines] Team.Net Slowness
Message-ID: <20100209024207.B57A92E02F@bradakis.com>

Currently there is some issue with the main Team.Net
mail server.  Messages come in to the server, get handed
off to the mailing list manager and then for some as yet
unknown reason don't get sent out for roughly two hours,
maybe two and a half.  Ah, the wonders of modern technology.

I'm looking into it, hopefully will have the situation
improved soon.  That's why I get paid the big bucks here!


mjb.