From parlanti at comcast.net Fri Jan 4 11:23:10 2008 From: parlanti at comcast.net (Joe Parlanti) Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2008 13:23:10 -0500 Subject: [Alpines] Series 1 / 2 Seats Message-ID: <000701c84efe$e1e80c80$a5b82580$@net> Folks, A friend of mine is looking for a pair of Series 1 /2 seats. Condition of the covers are not important. If anyone has any or could point me toward some, I'd be most appreciative. Feel free to contact me directly. Thanks, Joe Parlanti From WSuman at aol.com Fri Jan 4 23:24:08 2008 From: WSuman at aol.com (WSuman at aol.com) Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2008 01:24:08 EST Subject: [Alpines] Dakar Rally Cancelled Message-ID: Terrorism fears and threats. _http://news.scotsman.com/latestnews/Dakar-Rally-is-alQaeda-victim.3643433.jp_ (http://news.scotsman.com/latestnews/Dakar-Rally-is-alQaeda-victim.3643433.jp) This stinks. Walt **************Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape. http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp00300000002489 From awtiger at cox.net Mon Jan 7 13:54:19 2008 From: awtiger at cox.net (awtiger at cox.net) Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2008 15:54:19 -0500 Subject: [Alpines] Clutch compatibility Message-ID: <20080107155419.8JYWL.96761.root@eastrmwml08.mgt.cox.net> Okay, here goes...first, the condensed version (on my Series I vintage racer): Current set-up: Series IV 1600 motor Series III transmission Series V flywheel Series V clutch disc and pressure plate (with roller release bearing) Series V bell housing and clutch actuating arm Problem: Prior to the restoration/rebuild of my race car, it had a complete Series V drivetrain in it (1725 engine, Series V transmission and a Series V clutch and bell housing). This motor was not legal for the group I run with, but a 1600 was. Consequently, I built a Series IV 1600 and installed a Series III close-ratio gearbox (legal in my group). However, I may have made a mistake by retaining the 1725 flywheel, clutch set up and bell housing. Prior to doing all of this, my clutch worked perfectly. After all the changes were made, my clutch began releasing way at the top of the pedal throw and the transmission started grinding to beat the band going into 2nd gear on a downshift from 3rd. Fact: I am using the same exact clutch that I had in the Series V drivetrain, including the roller release bearing...they were all in excellent condition. Fact: We have the transmission out and disassembled. The synchros, bearings, gears and shift forks appear to be in excellent condition, with the exception of 1st gear and the reverse gear cluster (leading edge of the teeth are chewed, which is not surprising as there is no synchro action for these gears) No changes were made to the clutch hydraulics, other than freshening them. I'm beginning to wonder if the cutch parts and/or bell housing and clutch actuating arm are somehow mis-matched for my application. Are there differences in the bell housings and/or the clutch actuating arm between the Series of Alpines??? Given what engine/transmission/bell housing combo I have, can someone out there educate me on what pieces I need to make this all work properly? Also, since it's been a while since it all came apart, I've wondered if I have the slave cylinder mounted correctly. I mounted it with the mounting ears on the rear of the block rather than on the front. Is that correct or do I have it installed wrong? I'm trying my best to get the car sorted out for a race in February and any help would be much appreciated!!!! Thanks so much, __________________ Andy Walker Edmond, OK B9006857LRX - Alpine Series I (vintage racer) B382001600LRXFE - Tiger Mk1A From peter at wizardclassics.co.uk Tue Jan 8 04:36:44 2008 From: peter at wizardclassics.co.uk (Peter Chadbund) Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2008 11:36:44 -0000 Subject: [Alpines] Clutch compatibility References: <20080107155419.8JYWL.96761.root@eastrmwml08.mgt.cox.net> Message-ID: <003201c851ea$bf96d730$0202a8c0@wizardbusiness1> I believe your problem is that you have mounted the slave cylinder on the wrong side of the bell housing flange. I attach the appropriate diagram from the 1725cc light cars manual which shows the correct fitting. I had exactly the same problem when I did the same thing on my wife's Alpine serV. We all learn the hard way. Pete Chadbund Buckingham, England peter at wizardclassics.co.uk Mark II Hillman Hunter GL Series V Sunbeam Alpine ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Monday, January 07, 2008 8:54 PM Subject: [Alpines] Clutch compatibility > Okay, here goes...first, the condensed version (on my Series I vintage > racer): > > Current set-up: > > Series IV 1600 motor > Series III transmission > Series V flywheel > Series V clutch disc and pressure plate (with roller release bearing) > Series V bell housing and clutch actuating arm > > Problem: Prior to the restoration/rebuild of my race car, it had a > complete Series V drivetrain in it (1725 engine, Series V transmission and > a Series V clutch and bell housing). This motor was not legal for the > group I run with, but a 1600 was. Consequently, I built a Series IV 1600 > and installed a Series III close-ratio gearbox (legal in my group). > However, I may have made a mistake by retaining the 1725 flywheel, clutch > set up and bell housing. Prior to doing all of this, my clutch worked > perfectly. After all the changes were made, my clutch began releasing way > at the top of the pedal throw and the transmission started grinding to > beat the band going into 2nd gear on a downshift from 3rd. > > Fact: I am using the same exact clutch that I had in the Series V > drivetrain, including the roller release bearing...they were all in > excellent condition. > Fact: We have the transmission out and disassembled. The synchros, > bearings, gears and shift forks appear to be in excellent condition, with > the exception of 1st gear and the reverse gear cluster (leading edge of > the teeth are chewed, which is not surprising as there is no synchro > action for these gears) > > No changes were made to the clutch hydraulics, other than freshening them. > I'm beginning to wonder if the cutch parts and/or bell housing and clutch > actuating arm are somehow mis-matched for my application. Are there > differences in the bell housings and/or the clutch actuating arm between > the Series of Alpines??? > > Given what engine/transmission/bell housing combo I have, can someone out > there educate me on what pieces I need to make this all work properly? > Also, since it's been a while since it all came apart, I've wondered if I > have the slave cylinder mounted correctly. I mounted it with the mounting > ears on the rear of the block rather than on the front. Is that correct or > do I have it installed wrong? > > I'm trying my best to get the car sorted out for a race in February and > any help would be much appreciated!!!! > > Thanks so much, > __________________ > Andy Walker > Edmond, OK > B9006857LRX - Alpine Series I (vintage racer) > B382001600LRXFE - Tiger Mk1A > _______________________________________________ > Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Alpines at autox.team.net > http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/alpines > > http://www.team.net/archive [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type application/pdf which had a name of D6.pdf] From JACranwell at aol.com Tue Jan 8 10:54:36 2008 From: JACranwell at aol.com (JACranwell at aol.com) Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2008 12:54:36 EST Subject: [Alpines] Clutch compatibility Message-ID: Andy, I believe you need to match the master and slave cylinders to the clutch cover/pressure plate. To SIII had the heavy spring type, and SV the lighter diaphragm type. The travel will be different, and would therefore need to match the cylinders. It may be only the master that would be different. The manual shows a different type of master used from the SIV onwards, P/N 7293, the older type shown as P/N 5461. There is no difference shown for the slave. The clutch plate itself also differs, but you must have this covered, as it is determined by the differing splines on the gearbox input shaft. FYI, I'm using all SV parts, including the gearbox, clutch and cylinders in my SIII, and all works very well. Good luck, Julian. From mrtebo at shaw.ca Tue Jan 8 11:11:41 2008 From: mrtebo at shaw.ca (Ron Tebo) Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2008 11:11:41 -0700 Subject: [Alpines] Clutch compatibility In-Reply-To: <20080107155419.8JYWL.96761.root@eastrmwml08.mgt.cox.net> References: <20080107155419.8JYWL.96761.root@eastrmwml08.mgt.cox.net> Message-ID: <4783BCDD.3030009@shaw.ca> Andy: I think you and Peter Chadbund have already established that you have the slave cyl. installed on the wrong side, but I just wanted to assure you that this is true with all of the slave cylinders, not just the 1725 models. I have an early Series I (B9000627) and had a problem on my first brake job due to mounting the slave on the wrong side. (I have a Series V transmission, but Series I flywheel, clutch, and T/O bearing, so my setup is not standard either). Glad to hear you are getting ready to race, and let us know howit goes, no matter what result! Ron Tebo awtiger at cox.net wrote: >Okay, here goes...first, the condensed version (on my Series I vintage racer): > >Current set-up: > >Series IV 1600 motor >Series III transmission >Series V flywheel >Series V clutch disc and pressure plate (with roller release bearing) >Series V bell housing and clutch actuating arm > >Problem: Prior to the restoration/rebuild of my race car, it had a complete Series V drivetrain in it (1725 engine, Series V transmission and a Series V clutch and bell housing). This motor was not legal for the group I run with, but a 1600 was. Consequently, I built a Series IV 1600 and installed a Series III close-ratio gearbox (legal in my group). However, I may have made a mistake by retaining the 1725 flywheel, clutch set up and bell housing. Prior to doing all of this, my clutch worked perfectly. After all the changes were made, my clutch began releasing way at the top of the pedal throw and the transmission started grinding to beat the band going into 2nd gear on a downshift from 3rd. > >Fact: I am using the same exact clutch that I had in the Series V drivetrain, including the roller release bearing...they were all in excellent condition. >Fact: We have the transmission out and disassembled. The synchros, bearings, gears and shift forks appear to be in excellent condition, with the exception of 1st gear and the reverse gear cluster (leading edge of the teeth are chewed, which is not surprising as there is no synchro action for these gears) > >No changes were made to the clutch hydraulics, other than freshening them. I'm beginning to wonder if the cutch parts and/or bell housing and clutch actuating arm are somehow mis-matched for my application. Are there differences in the bell housings and/or the clutch actuating arm between the Series of Alpines??? > >Given what engine/transmission/bell housing combo I have, can someone out there educate me on what pieces I need to make this all work properly? Also, since it's been a while since it all came apart, I've wondered if I have the slave cylinder mounted correctly. I mounted it with the mounting ears on the rear of the block rather than on the front. Is that correct or do I have it installed wrong? > >I'm trying my best to get the car sorted out for a race in February and any help would be much appreciated!!!! > >Thanks so much, >__________________ >Andy Walker >Edmond, OK >B9006857LRX - Alpine Series I (vintage racer) >B382001600LRXFE - Tiger Mk1A >_______________________________________________ >Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html > >Alpines at autox.team.net >http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/alpines > >http://www.team.net/archive From awtiger at cox.net Fri Jan 11 21:27:17 2008 From: awtiger at cox.net (awtiger at cox.net) Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2008 23:27:17 -0500 Subject: [Alpines] Release bearing fork Message-ID: <20080111232717.KT6WM.273334.root@fed1wml05.mgt.cox.net> Hey, guys: Here I go again...working on my Series I vintage racer. I hate it when I do that!!!! I've run into yet another situation where it appears that parts from different Series of Alpines have been combined to make one car run...my car. If any of you remember, I was having clutch/transmission/shifting issues. We pulled it all down and have discovered some mildly weak parts in the transmission that we intend to replace. I think we've about got the transmission problem licked. Today, we pulled the clutch out to have a look. To make a long story short, we're evidently running a Series II/III 9-spring pressure plate with an 8 1/2" disc. The problem is that the release bearing fork (called a "clutch withdrawal lever" in the Rootes factory parts manual) appears to be too tall; i.e., it has been contacting the pressure plate. So much so, in fact, that not only is the pressure plate marked up by the contact, but it has worn a groove in both the fork and the aluminum stand that the fork pins to on the bell housing. After looking at the factory parts manual, it is obvious that there were several different designs for this arm. The first three designs, however, were superceded by one design that was in production up to the B941 cars (Series I through early Series IV), with the next design being used in the B941 cars and up (late Series IV and Series V). The problem is that the pressure plates for the earlier cars up to but not including the late Series IVs are taller than their late Series IV and Series V counterparts. So, it would obviously follow that the earlier cars used a shorter release bearing fork, while the later cars used a taller release bearing fork (the reason, of course, is the issue with clearance for the pressure plate and the relative distance from the release bearing to the pressure plate). I evidently have an incorrect matchup of parts; I have the taller Series II/III 9-spring pressure plate AND the tall (later) release bearing fork. Hence, the clearance issue. Now that I just wrote a book, does anyone out there have an early fork and fork mounting bracket that they could part with to help me out? I really want to run the earlier clutch as it is supposedly stronger, not to mention bigger, than the later unit. But, that is going to require me to find the correct release bearing fork and bracket. Is there anyone out there who can help me with this? As a bit of assistance, if anyone out there has the Rootes factory parts manual for the Series I-IV, the parts I'm talking about show up on Plates A & B of Section F, with the plate reference numbers for the fork being A55, B56, B57 & B58. The mounting brackets for the forks are listed with the plate reference numbers of A61, B62 & B63. If anyone out there can help me out, please contact me asap. Maybe we can compare notes and take a few measurements to make sure it is what I need. Thanks very much for the any help!!!! Andy Walker Edmond, OK From canisdog at aol.com Sat Jan 12 07:18:51 2008 From: canisdog at aol.com (canisdog at aol.com) Date: Sat, 12 Jan 2008 09:18:51 -0500 Subject: [Alpines] Release bearing fork In-Reply-To: <20080111232717.KT6WM.273334.root@fed1wml05.mgt.cox.net> References: <20080111232717.KT6WM.273334.root@fed1wml05.mgt.cox.net> Message-ID: <8CA233D3071DC4D-958-5595@WEBMAIL-DG18.sysops.aol.com> Andy, I have a box full of different height's of pedestal's and forks.? If you can send me the demmensions of the one you need I can mail it.? You pick up the postage. Paul -----Original Message----- From: awtiger at cox.net To: alpines at autox.team.net Sent: Fri, 11 Jan 2008 9:27 pm Subject: [Alpines] Release bearing fork Hey, guys: Here I go again...working on my Series I vintage racer. I hate it when I do that!!!! I've run into yet another situation where it appears that parts from different Series of Alpines have been combined to make one car run...my car. If any of you remember, I was having clutch/transmission/shifting issues. We pulled it all down and have discovered some mildly weak parts in the transmission that we intend to replace. I think we've about got the transmission problem licked. Today, we pulled the clutch out to have a look. To make a long story short, we're evidently running a Series II/III 9-spring pressure plate with an 8 1/2" disc. The problem is that the release bearing fork (called a "clutch withdrawal lever" in the Rootes factory parts manual) appears to be too tall; i.e., it has been contacting the pressure plate. So much so, in fact, that not only is the pressure plate marked up by the contact, but it has worn a groove in both the fork and the aluminum stand that the fork pins to on the bell housing. After looking at the factory parts manual, it is obvious that there were several different designs for this arm. The first three designs, however, were superceded by one design that was in production up to the B941 cars (Series I through early Series IV), with the next design being used in the B941 cars and up (late Series IV and Series V). The problem is that the pressure plates for the earlier cars up to but not including the late Series IVs are taller than their late Series IV and Series V counterparts. So, it would obviously follow that the earlier cars used a shorter release bearing fork, while the later cars used a taller release bearing fork (the reason, of course, is the issue with clearance for the pressure plate and the relative distance from the release bearing to the pressure plate). I evidently have an incorrect matchup of parts; I have the taller Series II/III 9-spring pressure plate AND the tall (later) release bearing fork. Hence, the clearance issue. Now that I just wrote a book, does anyone out there have an early fork and fork mounting bracket that they could part with to help me out? I really want to run the earlier clutch as it is supposedly stronger, not to mention bigger, than the later unit. But, that is going to require me to find the correct release bearing fork and bracket. Is there anyone out there who can help me with this? As a bit of assistance, if anyone out there has the Rootes factory parts manual for the Series I-IV, the parts I'm talking about show up on Plates A & B of Section F, with the plate reference numbers for the fork being A55, B56, B57 & B58. The mounting brackets for the forks are listed with the plate reference numbers of A61, B62 & B63. If anyone out there can help me out, please contact me asap. Maybe we can compare notes and take a few measurements to make sure it is what I need. Thanks very much for the any help!!!! Andy Walker Edmond, OK _______________________________________________ Support Team.Net http://www.team.net/donate.html Alpines at autox.team.net http://autox.team.net/mailman/listinfo/alpines http://www.team.net/archive ________________________________________________________________________ More new features than ever. Check out the new AOL Mail ! - http://webmail.aol.com From paul at bit.net.au Sat Jan 12 17:10:36 2008 From: paul at bit.net.au (Paul Heuer) Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2008 10:40:36 +1030 Subject: [Alpines] Release bearing fork Message-ID: Andy, I have a SIII, running the 8.5 in clutch and roller bearing and I swapped the pedestal/fork around (tho not sure what actually ended up with). In my car if I press the clutch all the way into the carpet there is a metal on metal scraping that I suspect is release fork on pressure plate. You may want to rig up a test to make sure this doesn't happen to you if you are cooking up a combination of parts. Just checked - there is a *little* more info at: http://www.geocities.com/motorcity/4081/alpine/my_tech.html#clutch Good luck, Paul.