Subject: Re: [TR] Without the radiator?

From: "[email-masked]" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2018 07:00:43 +0100

Possibly but I wouldn’t recommend it. 

Wait until you have the cooling system installed, with a fan, before you move forward.   It sounds like you want to test the engine but the cooling system is an important part and all need to be checked together as designed. 

Bill

Sent from my Handspring Treo

On Sep 8, 2018, at 9:28 PM, Paul Dorsey <[email-masked]> wrote:

 Another dream :  Can I Crank it up and run it for five minutes without the radiator attached?
** [email-masked] **

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From: Peter Ryner <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2018 11:16:44 +0000

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Paul,
I can't say if I got a full 5 minutes, but I've set mine up on the chassis =
and run it for a few minutes to check the engine out before putting the bod=
y back on without a radiator.  I had the fuel pump hooked up to a gas suppl=
y and made an electrical circuit with an on switch for power to the distrib=
uter and a starter relay for the starter.  Don't see why you couldn't just =
fill the carbs but it won't run very long and won't test the fuel circuit f=
rom the pump all the way through the carbs. I had a oil gauge hooked up to =
verify oil pressure and used an IR non contact thermometer to watch the blo=
ck temp.
Pete
Get Outlook for Android<https://aka.ms/ghei36>

________________________________
From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> on behalf of Paul Dorsey <=
[email-masked]>
Sent: Saturday, September 8, 2018 8:28:14 PM
To: Triumph list Team.net
Subject: [TR] Without the radiator?

 Another dream :  Can I Crank it up and run it for five minutes without the=
 radiator attached?

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<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-f=
amily:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Paul,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-f=
amily:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">I can&#8217;t say if I got =
a full 5 minutes, but I&#8217;ve set mine up on the chassis and run it for =
a few minutes to check the engine out before putting the body
 back on without a radiator.&nbsp; I had the fuel pump hooked up to a gas s=
upply and made an electrical circuit with an on switch for power to the dis=
tributer and a starter relay for the starter.&nbsp; Don&#8217;t see why you=
 couldn&#8217;t just fill the carbs but it won&#8217;t run very
 long and won&#8217;t test the fuel circuit from the pump all the way throu=
gh the carbs. I had a oil gauge hooked up to verify oil pressure and used a=
n IR non contact thermometer to watch the block temp.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-f=
amily:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Pete<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-se=
rif;color:black">Get
<a href=3D"https://aka.ms/ghei36">Outlook for Android</a><o:p></o:p></span>=
</p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-se=
rif;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span=
 style=3D"color:black"> Triumphs &lt;[email-masked]&gt; on=
 behalf of Paul Dorsey &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, September 8, 2018 8:28:14 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Triumph list Team.net<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [TR] Without the radiator?</span> <o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;Another dream : &nbsp;Can I Crank it up and ru=
n it for five minutes without the radiator attached?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</body>
</html>

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From: Peter Ryner <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2018 11:16:44 +0000

Paul,

---

From: Paul Dorsey <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2018 08:09:56 -0400

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 OK I won=E2=80=99t do that . But if I have to do it without the radiator I=
=E2=80=99ll
attach a hose to the inlet isn=E2=80=99t that on the bottom of the engine? =
Paul

On Sun, Sep 9, 2018 at 7:16 AM Peter Ryner <[email-masked]> wrote:

> Paul,
>
> I can=E2=80=99t say if I got a full 5 minutes, but I=E2=80=99ve set mine =
up on the chassis
> and run it for a few minutes to check the engine out before putting the
> body back on without a radiator.  I had the fuel pump hooked up to a gas
> supply and made an electrical circuit with an on switch for power to the
> distributer and a starter relay for the starter.  Don=E2=80=99t see why y=
ou
> couldn=E2=80=99t just fill the carbs but it won=E2=80=99t run very long a=
nd won=E2=80=99t test the
> fuel circuit from the pump all the way through the carbs. I had a oil gau=
ge
> hooked up to verify oil pressure and used an IR non contact thermometer t=
o
> watch the block temp.
>
> Pete
>
> Get Outlook for Android <https://aka.ms/ghei36>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> *From:* Triumphs <[email-masked]> on behalf of Paul
> Dorsey <[email-masked]>
> *Sent:* Saturday, September 8, 2018 8:28:14 PM
> *To:* Triumph list Team.net
> *Subject:* [TR] Without the radiator?
>
>
>

--0000000000001afa2c05756f1f22
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div><div dir=3D"auto">=C2=A0OK I won=E2=80=99t do that . But if I have to =
do it without the radiator I=E2=80=99ll attach a hose to the inlet isn=E2=
=80=99t that on the bottom of the engine? Paul=C2=A0</div></div><div><br><d=
iv class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr">On Sun, Sep 9, 2018 at 7:16 AM Pe=
ter Ryner &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&=
gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0=
 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">

<div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"m_-8447940903778798900WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-f=
amily:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Paul,<u></u><u></u></span><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-f=
amily:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">I can=E2=80=99t say if I go=
t a full 5 minutes, but I=E2=80=99ve set mine up on the chassis and run it =
for a few minutes to check the engine out before putting the body
 back on without a radiator.=C2=A0 I had the fuel pump hooked up to a gas s=
upply and made an electrical circuit with an on switch for power to the dis=
tributer and a starter relay for the starter.=C2=A0 Don=E2=80=99t see why y=
ou couldn=E2=80=99t just fill the carbs but it won=E2=80=99t run very
 long and won=E2=80=99t test the fuel circuit from the pump all the way thr=
ough the carbs. I had a oil gauge hooked up to verify oil pressure and used=
 an IR non contact thermometer to watch the block temp.<u></u><u></u></span=
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span style=3D"font-f=
amily:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif;color:black">Pete<u></u><u></u></span></=
p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-se=
rif;color:black">Get
<a href=3D"https://aka.ms/ghei36" target=3D"_blank">Outlook for Android</a>=
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-se=
rif;color:black"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div class=3D"MsoNormal" align=3D"center" style=3D"text-align:center">
<hr size=3D"2" width=3D"98%" align=3D"center">
</div>
<div id=3D"m_-8447940903778798900divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"color:black">From:</span></b><span=
 style=3D"color:black"> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:triumphs-bounces@aut=
ox.team.net" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; on b=
ehalf of Paul Dorsey &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_b=
lank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, September 8, 2018 8:28:14 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Triumph list Team.net<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [TR] Without the radiator?</span> <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0Another dream : =C2=A0Can I Crank it up and ru=
n it for five minutes without the radiator attached?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div></div>

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From: Paul Dorsey <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2018 08:09:56 -0400

up on the chassis
ou
ge
o

---

From: "Randall" <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2018 11:06:33 -0400

> minutes without the radiator attached?

5 minutes is way too long without coolant; a sure recipe for a cracked head
or worse.

You might be able to get that much if you find a way to fill it with water
and top it up when it starts boiling.  But even that is a risk, IMO, both to
the engine and you.  It may eject boiling water just as you look at it and a
face full of boiling water can ruin your whole day!

-- Randall

---

From: Paul Dorsey <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2018 11:09:15 -0400

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Thanks!

> face full of boiling water can ruin your whole day!

--000000000000607895057571a0ac
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div>Thanks!</div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr">On S=
un, Sep 9, 2018 at 11:06 AM Randall &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
om">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_=
quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1=
ex">&gt;=C2=A0 Another dream :=C2=A0 Can I Crank it up and run it for five =
<br>
&gt; minutes without the radiator attached?<br>
<br>
5 minutes is way too long without coolant; a sure recipe for a cracked head=
<br>
or worse.<br>
<br>
You might be able to get that much if you find a way to fill it with water<=
br>
and top it up when it starts boiling.=C2=A0 But even that is a risk, IMO, b=
oth to<br>
the engine and you.=C2=A0 It may eject boiling water just as you look at it=
 and a<br>
face full of boiling water can ruin your whole day!<br>
<br>
-- Randall=C2=A0 <br>
<br>
</blockquote></div></div>

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From: Geo Hahn <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 9 Sep 2018 16:41:38 -0700

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I drove mine w/o a radiator but probably less than a minute (times two).

I really don't remember doing it but looking at photos the other day, that
is the only way it could have ended up in the street looking like this
(just pressure-washed the front bits prior to timing chain work):

On Sun, Sep 9, 2018 at 8:09 AM, Paul Dorsey <[email-masked]> wrote:

> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/
> options/triumphs/[email-masked]
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr">I drove mine w/o a radiator but probably less than a minut=
e (times two).<div><br></div><div>I really don&#39;t remember doing it but =
looking at photos the other day, that is the only way it could have ended u=
p in the street looking like this (just pressure-washed the front bits prio=
r to timing chain work):</div><div><br></div><div><div><img src=3D"cid:ii_j=
lvi4qm30_165c0b5c32a310ce" width=3D"472" height=3D"472"><br></div><br></div=
></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Sun, Se=
p 9, 2018 at 8:09 AM, Paul Dorsey <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:d=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;</span> wrot=
e:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-l=
eft:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div>Thanks!</div><div class=3D"HOEnZb=
"><div class=3D"h5"><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr">On=
 Sun, Sep 9, 2018 at 11:06 AM Randall &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
.com" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockq=
uote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc =
solid;padding-left:1ex">&gt;=C2=A0 Another dream :=C2=A0 Can I Crank it up =
and run it for five <br>
&gt; minutes without the radiator attached?<br>
<br>
5 minutes is way too long without coolant; a sure recipe for a cracked head=
<br>
or worse.<br>
<br>
You might be able to get that much if you find a way to fill it with water<=
br>
and top it up when it starts boiling.=C2=A0 But even that is a risk, IMO, b=
oth to<br>
the engine and you.=C2=A0 It may eject boiling water just as you look at it=
 and a<br>
face full of boiling water can ruin your whole day!<br>
<br>
-- Randall=C2=A0 <br>
<br>
</blockquote></div></div>
</div></div><br>** <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">triumphs@auto=
x.team.net</a> **<br>
<br>
et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.<wbr>html</a><br>
Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs" rel=3D"noreferr=
er" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/pipermail/<wbr>triumphs</a>=C2=A0=
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hs/[email-masked]" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.=
team.net/mailman/<wbr>options/triumphs/ahwahneetr@<wbr>gmail.com</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>

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From: "John Macartney" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2018 11:32:57 +0100

This is a multipart message in MIME format.

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Certainly wouldn=E2=80=99t disagree about running the engine without coolan=
t. That said, the old wet liner four could take an enormous amount of abuse=
=2E I sold a new TR4A to a guy in the States just after the TR250 had been =
announced. He couldn=E2=80=99t wait for the 8 week build process and so too=
k on a 4A to US spec that we had in export stock. The car was driven under =
its own power from Coventry to London (about 100 miles) for preparation and=
 on arrival, it was discovered the engine had never been topped off with an=
ti-freeze, the core plugs had blown out after a very heavy frost and there =
was very little coolant left. London Service Division pulled the head to se=
e if the cylinders were scored and then dropped the sump to check the main =
bearings. All OK. The guy took delivery and disappeared never to be heard o=
f for a long while. Two years later, I received a letter from him. Seemingl=
y he=E2=80=99d caned the car all over Europe and had ventured as far as the=
 edge of the Sahara desert in Algeria before shipping it home. He=E2=80=99d=
 never bothered to break it in and said he=E2=80=99d done several east coas=
t to west coast and back trips in the US and had red-lined the engine all t=
he way, but as he was married, the car had to go as the first baby was on t=
he way.

Personally, I wouldn=E2=80=99t have treated any engine as he appeared to ha=
ve done but to have done 100 miles with effectively zero coolant indicates =
the wet-liner four was a tough old thing and could take (almost) any amount=
 of abuse. I don=E2=80=99t suggest anyone tries to imitate this exercise!

Jonmac

From: Triumphs <[email-masked]> On Behalf Of Geo Hahn
Sent: 10 September 2018 00:42
To: Paul Dorsey <[email-masked]>
Cc: Triumph list Team.net <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [TR] Without the radiator?

I really don't remember doing it but looking at photos the other day, that =
is the only way it could have ended up in the street looking like this (jus=
t pressure-washed the front bits prior to timing chain work):

[email-masked]> > wrote:

Thanks!

or worse.

You might be able to get that much if you find a way to fill it with water
and top it up when it starts boiling.  But even that is a risk, IMO, both t=
o
the engine and you.  It may eject boiling water just as you look at it and =
a
face full of boiling water can ruin your whole day!

-- Randall  

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs  http://www.team.net/archiv=
e

[email-masked]

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<o:idmap v:ext=3D"edit" data=3D"1" />
</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=3DEN-GB link=3Dblue vli=
nk=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSection1><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'm=
so-fareast-language:EN-US'>Certainly wouldn=E2=80=99t disagree about runnin=
g the engine without coolant. That said, the old wet liner four could take =
an enormous amount of abuse. I sold a new TR4A to a guy in the States just =
after the TR250 had been announced. He couldn=E2=80=99t wait for the 8 week=
 build process and so took on a 4A to US spec that we had in export stock. =
The car was driven under its own power from Coventry to London (about 100 m=
iles) for preparation and on arrival, it was discovered the engine had neve=
r been topped off with anti-freeze, the core plugs had blown out after a ve=
ry heavy frost and there was very little coolant left. London Service Divis=
ion pulled the head to see if the cylinders were scored and then dropped th=
e sump to check the main bearings. All OK. The guy took delivery and disapp=
eared never to be heard of for a long while. Two years later, I received a =
letter from him. Seemingly he=E2=80=99d caned the car all over Europe and h=
ad ventured as far as the edge of the Sahara desert in Algeria before shipp=
ing it home. He=E2=80=99d never bothered to break it in and said he=E2=80=
=99d done several east coast to west coast and back trips in the US and had=
 red-lined the engine all the way, but as he was married, the car had to go=
 as the first baby was on the way.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNorma=
l><span style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Personally, I wouldn=E2=80=99t=
 have treated any engine as he appeared to have done but to have done 100 m=
iles with effectively zero coolant indicates the wet-liner four was a tough=
 old thing and could take (almost) any amount of abuse. I don=E2=80=99t sug=
gest anyone tries to imitate this exercise!<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=
=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></=
span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'mso-fareast-language:EN-US'>Jo=
nmac<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'mso-fareast-l=
anguage:EN-US'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span la=
ng=3DEN-US>From:</span></b><span lang=3DEN-US> Triumphs &lt;triumphs-bounce=
[email-masked]&gt; <b>On Behalf Of </b>Geo Hahn<br><b>Sent:</b> 10 Septem=
ber 2018 00:42<br><b>To:</b> Paul Dorsey &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br><b>C=
c:</b> Triumph list Team.net &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br><b>Subject:=
</b> Re: [TR] Without the radiator?<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNorm=
al><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>I drove mine w/o a radiat=
or but probably less than a minute (times two).<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=
=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>I really =
don't remember doing it but looking at photos the other day, that is the on=
ly way it could have ended up in the street looking like this (just pressur=
e-washed the front bits prior to timing chain work):<o:p></o:p></p></div><d=
iv><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div><div><div><p class=3DMso=
Normal><img width=3D472 height=3D472 style=3D'width:4.9166in;height:4.9166i=
n' id=3D"_x0000_i1025" src=3D"cid:[email-masked]"><o:p></o:=
p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div></div><div><p c=
lass=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>On Sun, Sep=
 9, 2018 at 8:09 AM, Paul Dorsey &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p><blockquo=
te style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm=
 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm'><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>Thanks=
!<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p>=
</p><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal>On Sun, Sep 9, 2018 at 11:06 AM Randall =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]=
r.com</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><blockquote style=3D'border:none;b=
order-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;=
margin-right:0cm'><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'>&gt;&=
nbsp; Another dream :&nbsp; Can I Crank it up and run it for five <br>&gt; =
minutes without the radiator attached?<br><br>5 minutes is way too long wit=
hout coolant; a sure recipe for a cracked head<br>or worse.<br><br>You migh=
t be able to get that much if you find a way to fill it with water<br>and t=
op it up when it starts boiling.&nbsp; But even that is a risk, IMO, both t=
o<br>the engine and you.&nbsp; It may eject boiling water just as you look =
at it and a<br>face full of boiling water can ruin your whole day!<br><br>-=
- Randall&nbsp; <o:p></o:p></p></blockquote></div></div></div></div><p clas=
s=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>** <a href=3D"mailto:trium=
[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a> **<br><br>Donate: <a href=
=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/=
donate.html</a><br>Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/triump=
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lockquote></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div></div><div =
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---

From: Paul Dorsey <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 10 Sep 2018 08:27:17 -0400

--===============0321098786784006077==

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 If the radiator is installed, I would  Cut my hands on the fins  trying to
turn it over.  I wish I would=E2=80=99ve taken the radiator out internal
frequently!

On Mon, Sep 10, 2018 at 6:32 AM John Macartney <[email-masked]=
k>
wrote:

> Certainly wouldn=E2=80=99t disagree about running the engine without cool=
ant. That
> said, the old wet liner four could take an enormous amount of abuse. I so=
ld
> a new TR4A to a guy in the States just after the TR250 had been announced=
.
> He couldn=E2=80=99t wait for the 8 week build process and so took on a 4A=
 to US
> spec that we had in export stock. The car was driven under its own power
> from Coventry to London (about 100 miles) for preparation and on arrival,
> it was discovered the engine had never been topped off with anti-freeze,
> the core plugs had blown out after a very heavy frost and there was very
> little coolant left. London Service Division pulled the head to see if th=
e
> cylinders were scored and then dropped the sump to check the main bearing=
s.
> All OK. The guy took delivery and disappeared never to be heard of for a
> long while. Two years later, I received a letter from him. Seemingly he=
=E2=80=99d
> caned the car all over Europe and had ventured as far as the edge of the
> Sahara desert in Algeria before shipping it home. He=E2=80=99d never both=
ered to
> break it in and said he=E2=80=99d done several east coast to west coast a=
nd back
> trips in the US and had red-lined the engine all the way, but as he was
> married, the car had to go as the first baby was on the way.
>
> Personally, I wouldn=E2=80=99t have treated any engine as he appeared to =
have done
> but to have done 100 miles with effectively zero coolant indicates the
> wet-liner four was a tough old thing and could take (almost) any amount o=
f
> abuse. I don=E2=80=99t suggest anyone tries to imitate this exercise!
>
>
>
> Jonmac
>
>
>
> *From:* Triumphs <[email-masked]> *On Behalf Of *Geo Hah=
n
> *Sent:* 10 September 2018 00:42
> *To:* Paul Dorsey <[email-masked]>
> *Cc:* Triumph list Team.net <[email-masked]>
> *Subject:* Re: [TR] Without the radiator?
>
>
>
> I really don't remember doing it but looking at photos the other day, tha=
t
> 5 minutes is way too long without coolant; a sure recipe for a cracked he=
ad
> or worse.
>
> You might be able to get that much if you find a way to fill it with wate=
r
> the engine and you.  It may eject boiling water just as you look at it an=
d
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]
>
>
>
>
> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=3Demail&utm_source=3Dlink&utm=
_campaign=3Dsig-email&utm_content=3Demailclient> Virus-free.
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>

--00000000000002e0c90575837bb3
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<div><div dir=3D"auto">=C2=A0If the radiator is installed, I would =C2=A0Cu=
t my hands on the fins =C2=A0trying to turn it over.=C2=A0 I wish I would=
=E2=80=99ve taken the radiator out internal frequently!=C2=A0</div></div><d=
iv><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr">On Mon, Sep 10, 2018 at =
6:32 AM John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"g=
mail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-l=
eft:1ex"><div lang=3D"EN-GB" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div class=3D"m=
_3637041784300002490WordSection1"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Certainly wo=
uldn=E2=80=99t disagree about running the engine without coolant. That said=
, the old wet liner four could take an enormous amount of abuse. I sold a n=
ew TR4A to a guy in the States just after the TR250 had been announced. He =
couldn=E2=80=99t wait for the 8 week build process and so took on a 4A to U=
S spec that we had in export stock. The car was driven under its own power =
from Coventry to London (about 100 miles) for preparation and on arrival, i=
t was discovered the engine had never been topped off with anti-freeze, the=
 core plugs had blown out after a very heavy frost and there was very littl=
e coolant left. London Service Division pulled the head to see if the cylin=
ders were scored and then dropped the sump to check the main bearings. All =
OK. The guy took delivery and disappeared never to be heard of for a long w=
hile. Two years later, I received a letter from him. Seemingly he=E2=80=99d=
 caned the car all over Europe and had ventured as far as the edge of the S=
ahara desert in Algeria before shipping it home. He=E2=80=99d never bothere=
d to break it in and said he=E2=80=99d done several east coast to west coas=
t and back trips in the US and had red-lined the engine all the way, but as=
 he was married, the car had to go as the first baby was on the way.<u></u>=
<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Personally, I wouldn=E2=80=
=99t have treated any engine as he appeared to have done but to have done 1=
00 miles with effectively zero coolant indicates the wet-liner four was a t=
ough old thing and could take (almost) any amount of abuse. I don=E2=80=99t=
 suggest anyone tries to imitate this exercise!<u></u><u></u></span></p><p =
class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNor=
mal"><span>Jonmac<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u><=
/u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US">F=
rom:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:triumph=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]=
</a>&gt; <b>On Behalf Of </b>Geo Hahn<br><b>Sent:</b> 10 September 2018 00:=
42<br><b>To:</b> Paul Dorsey &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" targ=
et=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br><b>Cc:</b> Triumph list Team.ne=
t &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">triumphs=
@autox.team.net</a>&gt;<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Without the radiator?<u=
></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div>=
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I drove mine w/o a radiator but probably less than a=
 minute (times two).<u></u><u></u></p></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-GB"=
 link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div class=3D"m_3637041784300002490WordSect=
ion1"><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p></div><div><=
p class=3D"MsoNormal">I really don&#39;t remember doing it but looking at p=
hotos the other day, that is the only way it could have ended up in the str=
eet looking like this (just pressure-washed the front bits prior to timing =
chain work):<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=
=A0<u></u></p></div><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><img src=3D"cid:165c37=
07c56b11963101" style=3D"width:472px;max-width:100%"><u></u><u></u></p></di=
v><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p></div></div></div></div><d=
iv lang=3D"EN-GB" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div class=3D"m_3637041784=
300002490WordSection1"><div></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-GB" link=3D"b=
lue" vlink=3D"purple"><div class=3D"m_3637041784300002490WordSection1"><div=
><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"=
>On Sun, Sep 9, 2018 at 8:09 AM, Paul Dorsey &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dorpaul1=
@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></=
u></p><blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padd=
ing:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm"><div><p class=3D"=
MsoNormal">Thanks!<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNor=
mal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Sun, Sep 9=
, 2018 at 11:06 AM Randall &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" targe=
t=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p></div><blo=
ckquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0c=
m 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm"><p class=3D"MsoNormal" styl=
e=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">&gt;=C2=A0 Another dream :=C2=A0 Can I Crank it =
up and run it for five <br>&gt; minutes without the radiator attached?<br><=
br>5 minutes is way too long without coolant; a sure recipe for a cracked h=
ead<br>or worse.<br><br>You might be able to get that much if you find a wa=
y to fill it with water<br>and top it up when it starts boiling.=C2=A0 But =
even that is a risk, IMO, both to<br>the engine and you.=C2=A0 It may eject=
 boiling water just as you look at it and a<br>face full of boiling water c=
an ruin your whole day!<br><br>-- Randall=C2=A0 <u></u><u></u></p></blockqu=
ote></div></div></div></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:1=
2.0pt"><br>** <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">=
[email-masked]</a> **<br><br>Donate: <a href=3D"http://www.team.ne=
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hive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs" target=3D"_blank">=
http://www.team.net/pipermail/triumphs</a>=C2=A0 <a href=3D"http://www.team=
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---

From: Chris Simo <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2018 20:20:01 -0400

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Not that hard to put the radiator in.  Just use water for the initial start
and warm up cycles.

Sent from my TRASH-80

On Mon, Sep 10, 2018, 8:54 PM Paul Dorsey <[email-masked]> wrote:

>  If the radiator is installed, I would  Cut my hands on the fins  trying
> to turn it over.  I wish I would=E2=80=99ve taken the radiator out intern=
al
> frequently!
>
> On Mon, Sep 10, 2018 at 6:32 AM John Macartney <
> [email-masked]> wrote:
>
>> Certainly wouldn=E2=80=99t disagree about running the engine without coo=
lant.
>> That said, the old wet liner four could take an enormous amount of abuse=
. I
>> sold a new TR4A to a guy in the States just after the TR250 had been
>> announced. He couldn=E2=80=99t wait for the 8 week build process and so =
took on a
>> 4A to US spec that we had in export stock. The car was driven under its =
own
>> power from Coventry to London (about 100 miles) for preparation and on
>> arrival, it was discovered the engine had never been topped off with
>> anti-freeze, the core plugs had blown out after a very heavy frost and
>> there was very little coolant left. London Service Division pulled the h=
ead
>> to see if the cylinders were scored and then dropped the sump to check t=
he
>> main bearings. All OK. The guy took delivery and disappeared never to be
>> heard of for a long while. Two years later, I received a letter from him=
.
>> Seemingly he=E2=80=99d caned the car all over Europe and had ventured as=
 far as the
>> edge of the Sahara desert in Algeria before shipping it home. He=E2=80=
=99d never
>> bothered to break it in and said he=E2=80=99d done several east coast to=
 west coast
>> and back trips in the US and had red-lined the engine all the way, but a=
s
>> he was married, the car had to go as the first baby was on the way.
>>
>> Personally, I wouldn=E2=80=99t have treated any engine as he appeared to=
 have
>> done but to have done 100 miles with effectively zero coolant indicates =
the
>> wet-liner four was a tough old thing and could take (almost) any amount =
of
>> *From:* Triumphs <[email-masked]> *On Behalf Of *Geo
>> Hahn
>> I really don't remember doing it but looking at photos the other day,
>> that is the only way it could have ended up in the street looking like t=
his
>> You might be able to get that much if you find a way to fill it with wat=
er
>> and top it up when it starts boiling.  But even that is a risk, IMO, bot=
h
>> to
>> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=3Demail&utm_source=3Dlink&ut=
m_campaign=3Dsig-email&utm_content=3Demailclient> Virus-free.
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2AA1F9FDF2>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/triumphs/[email-masked]
>

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<div dir=3D"auto">Not that hard to put the radiator in.=C2=A0 Just use wate=
r for the initial start and warm up cycles.<br><br><div data-smartmail=3D"g=
mail_signature">Sent from my TRASH-80</div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_qu=
ote"><div dir=3D"ltr">On Mon, Sep 10, 2018, 8:54 PM Paul Dorsey &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><=
blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px=
 #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div dir=3D"auto">=C2=A0If the radiator =
is installed, I would =C2=A0Cut my hands on the fins =C2=A0trying to turn i=
t over.=C2=A0 I wish I would=E2=80=99ve taken the radiator out internal fre=
quently!=C2=A0</div></div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"l=
tr">On Mon, Sep 10, 2018 at 6:32 AM John Macartney &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jo=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">john.macar=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote=
" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><=
div lang=3D"EN-GB" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div class=3D"m_619512270=
8412758107m_3637041784300002490WordSection1"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>C=
ertainly wouldn=E2=80=99t disagree about running the engine without coolant=
. That said, the old wet liner four could take an enormous amount of abuse.=
 I sold a new TR4A to a guy in the States just after the TR250 had been ann=
ounced. He couldn=E2=80=99t wait for the 8 week build process and so took o=
n a 4A to US spec that we had in export stock. The car was driven under its=
 own power from Coventry to London (about 100 miles) for preparation and on=
 arrival, it was discovered the engine had never been topped off with anti-=
freeze, the core plugs had blown out after a very heavy frost and there was=
 very little coolant left. London Service Division pulled the head to see i=
f the cylinders were scored and then dropped the sump to check the main bea=
rings. All OK. The guy took delivery and disappeared never to be heard of f=
or a long while. Two years later, I received a letter from him. Seemingly h=
e=E2=80=99d caned the car all over Europe and had ventured as far as the ed=
ge of the Sahara desert in Algeria before shipping it home. He=E2=80=99d ne=
ver bothered to break it in and said he=E2=80=99d done several east coast t=
o west coast and back trips in the US and had red-lined the engine all the =
way, but as he was married, the car had to go as the first baby was on the =
way.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Personally, I wou=
ldn=E2=80=99t have treated any engine as he appeared to have done but to ha=
ve done 100 miles with effectively zero coolant indicates the wet-liner fou=
r was a tough old thing and could take (almost) any amount of abuse. I don=
=E2=80=99t suggest anyone tries to imitate this exercise!<u></u><u></u></sp=
an></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Jonmac<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=
<span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=
=3D"EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"> Triumphs &lt;<a href=3D"ma=
ilto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; <b>On Behalf Of </b>Geo Hahn<br><b>=
Sent:</b> 10 September 2018 00:42<br><b>To:</b> Paul Dorsey &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">dorpaul1@gm=
ail.com</a>&gt;<br><b>Cc:</b> Triumph list Team.net &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:t=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">triumphs@autox=
.team.net</a>&gt;<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [TR] Without the radiator?<u></u><=
u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div><p cla=
ss=3D"MsoNormal">I drove mine w/o a radiator but probably less than a minut=
e (times two).<u></u><u></u></p></div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-GB" link=
=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div class=3D"m_6195122708412758107m_36370417843=
00002490WordSection1"><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u>=
</p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">I really don&#39;t remember doing it =
but looking at photos the other day, that is the only way it could have end=
ed up in the street looking like this (just pressure-washed the front bits =
prior to timing chain work):<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNor=
mal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p></div><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><img sr=
c=3D"cid:165c3707c56b11963101" style=3D"width:472px;max-width:100%"><u></u>=
<u></u></p></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p></div></div=
></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-GB" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div class=
=3D"m_6195122708412758107m_3637041784300002490WordSection1"><div></div></di=
v></div><div lang=3D"EN-GB" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div class=3D"m_=
6195122708412758107m_3637041784300002490WordSection1"><div><p class=3D"MsoN=
ormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Sun, Sep 9, 2=
018 at 8:09 AM, Paul Dorsey &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" targe=
t=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u>=
</u></p><blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;pa=
dding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm"><div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks!<u></u><u></u></p></div><div><div><div><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Sun, S=
ep 9, 2018 at 11:06 AM Randall &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" t=
arget=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<u></=
u><u></u></p></div><blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccc=
cc 1.0pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm"><p c=
lass=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">&gt;=C2=A0 Another dream =
:=C2=A0 Can I Crank it up and run it for five <br>&gt; minutes without the =
radiator attached?<br><br>5 minutes is way too long without coolant; a sure=
 recipe for a cracked head<br>or worse.<br><br>You might be able to get tha=
t much if you find a way to fill it with water<br>and top it up when it sta=
rts boiling.=C2=A0 But even that is a risk, IMO, both to<br>the engine and =
you.=C2=A0 It may eject boiling water just as you look at it and a<br>face =
full of boiling water can ruin your whole day!<br><br>-- Randall=C2=A0 <u><=
/u><u></u></p></blockquote></div></div></div></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" s=
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