Subject: Re: [Tigers] Tiger Today

From: "Rense, Mark (GE, Appl & Light)" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 5 Aug 2013 21:18:45 +0000

Jay,
If I remember  correctly, your car has a smaller Holley 4BBL (465 CFM?) on top
of a F4B manifold. I have also had hot start problems using a similar setup
on one of my cars. When attempting to re-start after the hot car sits for a
few minutes the engine only spins, and when it finally does start it feels
like it is loaded up or the choke is on. In my case this was caused by the
fuel boiling in the bowls, the pressure builds up and the fuel overflows into
the carb, loading up the engine. I tried heat shields and thicker gaskets but
there is no head room with the F4B so you cannot use a decent phenolic
insulator. I fixed this by installing a toggle switch under the dash for the
pump, and I shut off the pump a minute or so before I park the car. When I
come back I switch the pump back on, turn the key to prime the carb for a
couple seconds, and the car starts right up with fresh cool (ish) fuel flowing
into the bowls. The "secret" switch also makes a great theft deterrent.

It's easy to try, there should be a connector of some type or a fuse in your
fuel pump's circuit. Get your car hot and disconnect the power to the pump for
a minute before you shut off the engine. Wait about 15 minutes then reconnect
the pump, turn the key to let it prime for a couple seconds then see if the
engine starts easily. If there is no change in its behavior then it's probably
timing/spark issues.
Bugz

-----Original Message-----
From: Jay Laifman
Sent: Monday, August 05, 2013 11:30 AM
To: Tiger's Den
Subject: [Tigers] Tiger Today

... I'll be back at you for hard hot starting issues later...

Jay
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From: Jay Laifman <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 5 Aug 2013 14:31:07 -0700

Yep, that's the carb and manifold - don't remember the CFM.  I can add the
switch.  In fact, I did exactly that on my Alpine - using the useless Panel
light switch.  Actually I swapped in a headlight switch because it is rated
for higher power.

I have been meaning to check out the spark plugs - as adverturous as that
apparently sounds.  So, perhaps I'll do that and check the timing first.

Thanks.

Jay

On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 2:18 PM, Rense, Mark (GE, Appl & Light) <
[email-masked]> wrote:

> Jay,
> If I remember  correctly, your car has a smaller Holley 4BBL (465 CFM?) on
> top of a F4B manifold. I have also had hot start problems using a similar
> setup  on one of my cars. When attempting to re-start after the hot car
> sits for a few minutes the engine only spins, and when it finally does
> start it feels like it is loaded up or the choke is on. In my case this was
> caused by the fuel boiling in the bowls, the pressure builds up and the
> fuel overflows into the carb, loading up the engine. I tried heat shields
> and thicker gaskets but there is no head room with the F4B so you cannot
> use a decent phenolic insulator. I fixed this by installing a toggle switch
> under the dash for the pump, and I shut off the pump a minute or so before
> I park the car. When I come back I switch the pump back on, turn the key to
> prime the carb for a couple seconds, and the car starts right up with fresh
> cool (ish) fuel flowing into the bowls. The "secret" switch also makes a
> great theft deterrent.
>
> It's easy to try, there should be a connector of some type or a fuse in
> your fuel pump's circuit. Get your car hot and disconnect the power to the
> pump for a minute before you shut off the engine. Wait about 15 minutes
> then reconnect the pump, turn the key to let it prime for a couple seconds
> then see if the engine starts easily. If there is no change in its behavior
> then it's probably timing/spark issues.
> Bugz
>

[email-masked]

---

From: "Teepen, Jere" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 5 Aug 2013 19:41:55 -0400

Any idea about the condition or age of the starter?  A starter that is not
working optimally can perform poorly when hot and it will cause the symptoms
you described.

-----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]] On
Behalf Of Jay Laifman
Sent: Monday, August 05, 2013 2:31 PM
To: Rense, Mark (GE, Appl & Light)
Cc: Tiger's Den
Subject: Re: [Tigers] Tiger Today

Thanks.

Jay

On Mon, Aug 5, 2013 at 2:18 PM, Rense, Mark (GE, Appl & Light) <
[email-masked]> wrote:

> Jay,
> If I remember  correctly, your car has a smaller Holley 4BBL (465
> CFM?) on top of a F4B manifold. I have also had hot start problems
> using a similar setup  on one of my cars. When attempting to re-start
> after the hot car sits for a few minutes the engine only spins, and
> when it finally does start it feels like it is loaded up or the choke
> is on. In my case this was caused by the fuel boiling in the bowls,
> the pressure builds up and the fuel overflows into the carb, loading
> up the engine. I tried heat shields and thicker gaskets but there is
> no head room with the F4B so you cannot use a decent phenolic
> insulator. I fixed this by installing a toggle switch under the dash
> for the pump, and I shut off the pump a minute or so before I park the
> car. When I come back I switch the pump back on, turn the key to prime
> the carb for a couple seconds, and the car starts right up with fresh
great theft deterrent.
>
> It's easy to try, there should be a connector of some type or a fuse
> in your fuel pump's circuit. Get your car hot and disconnect the power
> to the pump for a minute before you shut off the engine. Wait about 15
> minutes then reconnect the pump, turn the key to let it prime for a
> couple seconds then see if the engine starts easily. If there is no
> change in its behavior then it's probably timing/spark issues.
> Bugz
>

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From: "Andy Walker" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 5 Aug 2013 19:06:45 -0500

That's an excellent idea, Mark!!!!  I may end up trying that myself as I
have the exact same setup on my Tiger and have experienced that problem
before.

Thanks,
Andy Walker
Edmond, OK
B382001600LRXFE
TAC #740

-----Original Message-----
From: [email-masked] [mailto:[email-masked]]
On Behalf Of Rense, Mark (GE, Appl & Light)
Sent: Monday, August 5, 2013 4:19 PM
To: Jay Laifman; Tiger's Den
Subject: Re: [Tigers] Tiger Today

Jay,
If I remember  correctly, your car has a smaller Holley 4BBL (465 CFM?) on
top of a F4B manifold. I have also had hot start problems using a similar
setup on one of my cars. When attempting to re-start after the hot car sits
for a few minutes the engine only spins, and when it finally does start it
feels like it is loaded up or the choke is on. In my case this was caused by
the fuel boiling in the bowls, the pressure builds up and the fuel overflows
into the carb, loading up the engine. I tried heat shields and thicker
gaskets but there is no head room with the F4B so you cannot use a decent
phenolic insulator. I fixed this by installing a toggle switch under the
dash for the pump, and I shut off the pump a minute or so before I park the
car. When I come back I switch the pump back on, turn the key to prime the
carb for a couple seconds, and the car starts right up with fresh cool (ish)
fuel flowing into the bowls. The "secret" switch also makes a great theft
deterrent.

It's easy to try, there should be a connector of some type or a fuse in your
fuel pump's circuit. Get your car hot and disconnect the power to the pump
for a minute before you shut off the engine. Wait about 15 minutes then
reconnect the pump, turn the key to let it prime for a couple seconds then
see if the engine starts easily. If there is no change in its behavior then
it's probably timing/spark issues.
Bugz

-----Original Message-----
From: Jay Laifman
Sent: Monday, August 05, 2013 11:30 AM
To: Tiger's Den
Subject: [Tigers] Tiger Today

Jay

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---

From: "Thomas Witt" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 06 Aug 2013 19:53:03 -0700

"The "secret" switch also makes a great theft deterrent."

And, if it is a Lucas switch, it is probably theft proof!
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