From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Oct 19 11:18:33 2026 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71FF2A0A08 for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 11:18:33 -0600 (MDT) Authentication-Results: autox.team.net; Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic317-35.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (unknown [66.163.184.46]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9473EA09CA for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 11:10:03 -0600 (MDT) t=1792429771; bh=2YIV30rm/LjY/qlpeRR0V9gIfJkmPT7uMDd5AGd4PPU=; h=From:To:Date:Subject:References:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=FNb9vQlaIXcg+d882H+bXyH7B53BmCMDB0rwbVpJ/hASP3DG75YSmgOpuenpvovTVnRcz7qCytfikfGBEGlFO9I/L+rNj/tObWfgjO9xQgPQC56sGVEw5akNGQ4oWbOrweekEfTJdTm4i6KPs2TsffJIbtO6ctD9JxwIvcTgHLc= t=1792429771; bh=9RoekB3MJJOEV2ejMiPKa8+pHUUlMXwbG3zV/ob47iG=; h=X-Sonic-MF:From:To:Date:Subject:From:Subject; b=o7DW5DZIksLh8N+fIP67qqtRkWGvZe6Z3wcTVfJCGwIyZ/AJvuSUR+uZyENA27hm8xd1DSC5FLL5dNpck+AvPpWiwlRBxZBYnQvIjQjUgRUdlNQUUW88sSr2lgnv//JCz+vU9wB45IV4OMnnZFz7qQ6USM8fl1f6mqg2sKdQ1KKccRp0nneUybPYN0g4ZVGSIaw/74oqIUlxQHdxaYpVOKPsHShthhuNcp0FvTgb/0Uh0pA7LrRMWfUaG/BDtSRC6UBmE7oTl57qRK9SEniKLwKcv6+Tqbb/J87TT2QrE7ZCZHZ37w0kFGazhEELN2URi+KjFGio+EGw1vFOb7w0sg== 4Ppj772oRc1mLJK40TMV7vRjHIETdPJOr.N8kPhHBszOgbqlh8mE37Mi0ZM7GvYMMVQL_wivBCUE 1yQyunnU3Xrd1ws2.dSq2I7Lmi7_Dkdnl3sQySBJjKElatYhtrfUWPimC8IARCaeT2Y7gKICqJr3 wIq7iRJh_0_RoxRqNf7ZbOTZn0q1BFyHRKQ_d.J1xcCcOD0VJBar5NwUup43M.yW4jDGJmAqyYe4 nJKzWQp3sJjLBvt9rp50nLyxWvdgMfy70fi6dkvUaw5x8RDXXb1yLL1H2Yqs4UVJkDGbemNreZ59 1uU7AsxbP1RKsLO5Xcwk5ZzGJXdyLR1u1r_WgJhyAUWrJNr376srI4SbqVIrPNNOuqNTA4nomzwN JXpySTjybkzp622O_Wp75C5QQ7uigg6uV2DlA2FRwKXGRwWREtxe.W9c36s1pnULJTVkdZPaGweK qU3i6rHZJhsoCOM3J6mHLLAImCYyzR8z4CUFp.iKmINHbFXOpGBMfAFQYSj_V9R3mbodOQa_gX8t bHWuQO5hIjNlUHnwDMVfSjzmS9UPk0r3HFCdcWnDozF2k2PPjU9uhn_BN3M7s4n6KN9xucRe1saB qtkABqglB_zHygS2T.TG6QTS.4I8uPvqXckXa8gPrJkl1H9kONb9SOLGOVYgYpN5y.b2Ed9kxcFW qktMRGNzooOaiMZiKAD0lKZ9gNRREa6JNnxeKBL239wXKo4y7yetKQXKdkU_kU9mv2YRiYwm3_lP ow0GIpqhs.s1Dc542PjbGiKFklmJFRzuk06RCdN5wDUUOQMBmaIM949uqiomXo_BWEpE0aiRMVBE AKtyZoejVbPp_X_qDN42XJg2bpkHD6JcEFVUrgdnCeg70_JkUY.PZ8jwn1R6vCk3weQMf85MuRsD FvmNI_YoWoMNd0j3uPtWpWQgeLqXpfLO8RUaU1eelM0ZCGrbIGPTl1E2aHfaP81VZi4bXy6mlqgJ 0Jmn3g5CD8bXUJmqMQdx6vghDmXGdwaYXrDDQAXgcj46RqMhExgv6b7xUEGXiez7fbNVGh0n_eVh j5q3DsmTv2F1qc0jO5EjD0rUQn9y6qyeouOeeXguI4f.WxYQZrelSZ74d7rCXOBOcMbBYTbF4Rme zoCZO6LgZuAF2TmndiJ2mJKe2qJfYht0OhNnz73Hc9ESPZm2Wjiv2Z99PltcQXxijVRUJjQqwW3N ytHnjESdd9sfLSsPoWskhbX9PyQvEz5Y.rp3RNKcegKagvNRv0Kkm8A5Oqgtv1Tuikz_G1dcSJDY aohXhQVOJCW8U8ru2dtYARdV6H7FufqMXdSNmmQo6CDXtybuH6vhqkSw7UyW1w.ByusVtVqiomam QE8GptRPPHXtrW3SqiN90FNCxBMglAkv3XZbV_SZDtGuPdI5_e3Qy6iDkpF3dTqiMS8yz9J7lOL5 AiWkCWSXmePPYlCOh9h2XHtEtFoXcy4AkBaUM2HQNvnxMNn1QjQV9TIH51Z4wVBcUe36KZKQJFLD 13s9Rhl4fTz6LWsmnAU8X59j3RqwIDaUwTjlmEqXIGZRcHGFEnKArs2Lme4fPWxo6PiqwznQuXee 41IsczKG1iY7OGCx7vq8hyFKGc2nyPR3Aa3KZzbLoaI4R2Y3jT1KhBfWHV0T84ccDjKg98rtbIhM ldciDfvTYdW8hUPAHJn8Dq8ZEy_E77kf8_14sJgU5__7QX0Xb55S4Bw7.ZIwhme2wFlc5yAe6Jh. 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Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 29479cf4ba994b9c3cb9db3f6024884d; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 17:09:26 +0000 (UTC) From: "john niolon" To: "shop-talk" Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2026 12:09:24 -0500 User-Agent: OEClassic/5.4.1 (Win10.19045; P; 2026-08-13) References: <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY.ref@johns-desktop> mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Subject: [Shop-talk] flourescent to led changeover Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4058007733600194813== --------------040902010308090502060201 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Hi all =20 My 30 year old=20 8' t-12 (single pin) garage fixtures are slowly dying...(4 total double tub= e) the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (16-20 bucks a tube) =20 Want to change to led... lots of options - 8'=20 led tubes are expensive too ...=20 =20 I was gifted a box of 20=20 4' bi-pin bulbs that work with a ballast...(heat sink) =20 option 1=20 if I use these I'd=20 have to change all the tombstones to bi-pin and figure out the shunted vs non shunted type... AND find the 8' to 4' fixture conversion ki= ts=20 (adding the middle tombstones =20 option 2 8' type a led single pin tubes (about the same price as 8' fluorescent) and= use=20 a ballast not great reviews when shipped... =20 option 3 =20 replace all the crap with the internet specials linkable stick lights and = hope=20 they work =20 comments on options ???? =20 questions... when using the ballast type plug and plays... aren't I using m= ore electricity using the ballast=20 and heating it up... is there any savings here ??? =20 =20 please educate the old dummy on best (least expensive) options =20 =20 =20 --------------040902010308090502060201 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
Hi all
 
My 30 year old 8' t-12 (single pin) garag= e fixtures are slowly dying...(4 total double tube)
the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (= 16-20 bucks a tube)
 
Want to change to led... lots of options = - 8' led tubes are expensive too ...
 
I was gifted a box of 20 4' bi-pin bulbs that = work with a ballast...(heat sink)
 
option 1
if I use these I'd have to change all the tomb= stones to bi-pin and figure out the
shunted vs non shunted type...  AND find = the 8' to 4' fixture conversion kits (adding the middle tombstones
 
option 2
8' type a led single pin tubes (about the same= price as 8' fluorescent) and use a ballast
not great reviews when shipped...
 
option 3
 
replace all the crap with the internet special= s  linkable stick lights and hope they work
 
comments on options ????
 
questions... when using the ballast type plug = and plays... aren't I using more electricity using the ballast
and heating it up... is there any savings here= ???
 
 
please educate the old dummy on best (least ex= pensive) options
 
 
 
--------------040902010308090502060201-- --===============4058007733600194813== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============4058007733600194813==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Oct 19 11:37:49 2026 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91A68A0A08 for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 11:37:49 -0600 (MDT) Authentication-Results: autox.team.net; Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-pf1-f180.google.com (unknown [209.85.210.180]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 404C8A0A71 for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 11:25:08 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-pf1-f180.google.com with SMTP id d2e1a72fcca58-8a06b27bf9bso459352b3a.2 for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 10:24:35 -0700 (PDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; t=1792430675; cv=none; d=google.com; s=arc-20260327; b=WrL1atA9CJ2+GnrGRXOdVxcz3fNbubDzbJPL6vbH1eyq8t6ruzPVf3rxjjHzMuoq04 v3e1NdDXeI4cHl66IsyQtWKE4Pnz9GggVLfm6+nSfPlTbXcMDVsFpCiA1x/9ikBXhWxG FjZcljtVyO9TNtNbZ7LQ/M3lfr3EY7B224ryvmX+nnQwfRaEodghfDeZhR4ASl1ZL6ks 5tkAhV1BaIpElq8l9p4MDU4H2semWJfYjFzSSDktqr4CD+Vw+oSitenLxtq0vc0KZpGk 6lhWZBEI7QaeUF8TPhk3hUVqkNWUBd3YTJxZizNcmDK7yt8Bbokf+QdOZeQT9vLJCXD7 jEnw== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=arc-20260327; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references bh=AmWO2e34DUzKQ6gvjUvuZJ7UDkSKpWCnbnZOvOMAQ3o=; fh=SX1+miIjhFhyaW5N3ilZv/mqkPXFWbO/nN68Hv2TnHE=; b=dchwomNecBrDCHIWq/oQoLmq27aOhci60lm1nzvF9CoDo3zi0HbWmF7dKeZlwgfhjG jvVkXB1uxn7II8P9A+voNCOGsGz9HyvVZl7RPir0HJS+G5U/afWIqIOQ1G+V/EGFi5iw sMDq2YwXoXTEKdewiMuSdR/Etw/Pj9yCRaXpbq8nhd+S2TF5NioBDcUp7a34qBr8H+WE 3rcc4Uch0MvLfAMmwT4PQuCjUTBMspe+OC+XXcZpHx8GtdAkw8KAmtweEHK+FujEmVXV JT8FhycsfnXVIzwk4Wy+o3JcCyNFWLXEMkWDn9fDUWwQ4NIypx5lU3QSia1KNoS88Rvh JLKQ==; darn=autox.team.net ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.google.com; arc=none d=gmail.com; s=20251104; t=1792430675; x=1793035475; darn=autox.team.net; h=content-type:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to :references:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to :content-type; bh=AmWO2e34DUzKQ6gvjUvuZJ7UDkSKpWCnbnZOvOMAQ3o=; b=Q6UhU7nqlw4lSMLISBFUdvNCw1BW1GAdmf9zaldjZxPMG2PLr2A0bibtbTdMLHz4Qv z0BLR9frWBkEwRl13sVoEaH0ndCbmsttu4r2IX3mi7xsULU3QRToCW1fNpcNxLcI8DL/ s3ZFJPs+ENYx92vsITrUZmZ0cgJgTjsO4ZGEcni2iEFHss6o/8y7ZYiqno3peg+UzV0L X6jjrKaywwnJASKMT32mLle8ihY5nGQU7Wa00iGRrG/JGe/BAntis41l4WYLE2jJTrgv 7uUMwCRRZ79a26EDl44IkzgOPzUqglBa3BzjzELW4KImavuRGP9z24caCp2QlDx2OoeQ pqFA== d=1e100.net; s=20260707; t=1792430675; x=1793035475; h=content-type:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to :references:mime-version:x-gm-gg:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to:content-type; bh=AmWO2e34DUzKQ6gvjUvuZJ7UDkSKpWCnbnZOvOMAQ3o=; b=ycjeSIvAS3+79Lpy04uhN+QaGTR1Hjj4hzXYDkFXzVP0Ao7OaFhm1TNzP4uJxz3r/5 dVKz6Cwb5ky6R8Yfshht7vBudvWf4a3Jm2tOlVn1+H1EdKACBtCXvv5lhmbNaj0LdjXP 1wuVZgT3iaKcn8j2PpNF1gsAxN5zOgzCdP2tSPXOmKNpVK31ks7u/XOdXPxLxopQbrfr tGClOOUtkxFZx+Q1OqEFT9U53B2rsB26mS0mpATb1kHBNT1XDhNld69B/hhqJzNqJ5Mu gJDyl76YrVvbZo8z1rGkFKJW7omLakRkZ0ONrk3Qfnyq7J2r9QKrZUkdXZ/mbw+TNtoN VgCA== IPylrAIcFjLKLpykNi4pLg9RgY8nSh0XPJ//FCUbNSVTevp2hIHrvimfWFWrGcY7rgmjOUpmBH0 6KNFNYggKYgIAAfXLX+vREy9FJ2dVDNo= e3t8s1pDrYV26abAA0cpYK8k5Hw5tFfFcSXf2thireVf0fAVP8zuGYheCIGA1NHMl9ALDcUeTiC 5m1htVurmqgPETUru+b/8/GccMnDkRBj+tijKQOt1f3+Hj/kx+/AM3bH06wjL/ECk3+LPb8k+8F ni2VSJb3fuw1PeDPuqXJEgKVvoxpfgOwo4gggQlcQtX5TjtzAu1OoCCY+Ovp6bZ1fX5nd/6VbFf T9vMFCWWcUMXh1H9XCUXlA0ISFyfCaFhN4iZGNfI+68d8ZRMYp5KhnbOWR2uUDtCN3n2/eET2hu mH3PvNg2s4dwJRgJSTvOxTS5hMl3Znf/dgAWlojATjtFLaNFWXAN2lX19AQKDUwvu9soLwqMtky 6vsOj8/D+JsIH3kdYCf9o7rk8aNq4n6zrpXNrWjXcTw+/066pAKa1GKM2fEl44UOztl/8P3aY= adf61e73a8af0-3e22626fd7emr5691938637.20.1792430675141; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 10:24:35 -0700 (PDT) References: <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY.ref@johns-desktop> <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY@johns-desktop> From: Eric Russell Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2026 13:24:08 -0400 To: john niolon Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] flourescent to led changeover Cc: shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============7496196577797901884== --000000000000ad2c17065e34c91b Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I have changed all the 4' fluorescents in our garage to the eLcheapo (tm) LED linkable sticks. After 5+ years I've had one fail out of 12. I bought a few extras when they went on sale. Also (if it matters) no problems with them working in cold weather. (OK, cold in North Carolina may not be cold elsewhere but the fluorescents I had would often not work when it was cold.) EjR On Mon, Oct 19, 2026 at 1:17=E2=80=AFPM john niolon wrote= : > Hi all > > My 30 year old 8' t-12 (single pin) garage fixtures are slowly dying...(4 > total double tube) > the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (16-20 bucks a tube) > > Want to change to led... lots of options - 8' led tubes are expensive to= o > ... > > I was gifted a box of 20 4' bi-pin bulbs that work with a ballast...(heat > sink) > > option 1 > if I use these I'd have to change all the tombstones to bi-pin and figure > out the > shunted vs non shunted type... AND find the 8' to 4' fixture conversion > kits (adding the middle tombstones > > option 2 > 8' type a led single pin tubes (about the same price as 8' fluorescent) > and use a ballast > not great reviews when shipped... > > option 3 > > replace all the crap with the internet specials linkable stick lights an= d > hope they work > > comments on options ???? > > questions... when using the ballast type plug and plays... aren't I using > more electricity using the ballast > and heating it up... is there any savings here ??? > > > please educate the old dummy on best (least expensive) options > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ejrussell61@gmail.com > > --000000000000ad2c17065e34c91b Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I h= ave changed all the 4' fluorescents=C2=A0in our garage to the eLcheapo = (tm) LED linkable sticks. After 5+ years I've had one fail out of 12. I= bought a few extras when they went on sale. Also (if it matters) no proble= ms with them working in cold weather. (OK, cold in North Carolina may not b= e cold elsewhere but the fluorescents I had would often not work when it wa= s cold.)=C2=A0
=
EjR=C2=A0<= /div>

On Mon, Oct 19, 2026 at 1:17=E2=80=AFPM john nio= lon <jniolon@att.net> wrote:
Hi all
=C2=A0
My 30 year old 8' t-12 (single pin)=C2=A0g= arage fixtures are slowly dying...(4 total double tube)
the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (= 16-20 bucks a tube)
=C2=A0
Want to change to led... lots of options=C2=A0= - 8' led tubes are expensive too ...
=C2=A0
I was gifted a box of 20 4' bi-pin bulbs t= hat work with a ballast...(heat sink)
=C2=A0
option 1
if I use these I'd have to change all the = tombstones to bi-pin and figure out the
shunted vs non shunted type...=C2=A0 AND find = the 8' to 4' fixture conversion kits (adding the middle tombstones<= /font>
=C2=A0
option 2
8' type a led single pin tubes (about the = same price as 8' fluorescent) and use a ballast
not great reviews when shipped...
=C2=A0
option 3
=C2=A0
replace all the crap with the internet special= s=C2=A0 linkable stick lights and hope they work
=C2=A0
comments on options ????
=C2=A0
questions... when using the ballast type plug = and plays... aren't I using more electricity using the ballast <= /div>
and heating it up... is there any savings here= ???
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
please educate the old dummy on best (least ex= pensive) options
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
_____________________= __________________________

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Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

alk/ejrussell61@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://auto= x.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ejrussell61@gmail.com

--000000000000ad2c17065e34c91b-- --===============7496196577797901884== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============7496196577797901884==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Oct 19 11:55:49 2026 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4F89A0ABB for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 11:55:49 -0600 (MDT) Authentication-Results: autox.team.net; Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from hognose1.porkbun.com (unknown [35.82.102.206]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCDB6A0957 for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 11:38:40 -0600 (MDT) Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [68.239.50.138]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (Client did not present a certificate) (Authenticated sender: jamesf@groupwbench.org) by hognose1.porkbun.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 929544767A2; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 17:38:07 +0000 (UTC) s=default; t=1792431487; bh=tKuwkoEk51N2elDjcoGI+d9GQb3fusczkf6xSAvtvTA=; h=From:Subject:Date:In-Reply-To:Cc:To:References; b=QEc9BuDGBweZylupwDO+TlWgwayLo7bIcFIAg94e5v2UokP7rIjgOjcQ1OJr9BzQj +WHUtNnQmwlOxSdCkjnYAwZkpvTE5Q3lOrWRESTMfiNl/Lbuq9tra7iy+vOWG9lAD0 BIFx4OkD4Flb/SE5PC6vUOCTixlhjm0RyDH/8C7k= From: Jim Franklin Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2026 13:37:56 -0400 To: john niolon References: <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY.ref@johns-desktop> <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY@johns-desktop> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] flourescent to led changeover Cc: shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8037492474187336582== boundary="Apple-Mail=_B79E95CE-618D-4F19-B7DF-0B8D740F4C2B" --Apple-Mail=_B79E95CE-618D-4F19-B7DF-0B8D740F4C2B Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=us-ascii Just put in some 4' integrated LEDs and get on with life. All other = options for non-commercial use are a kludge and a time sink. I used = these in the basement and they're working fine: = https://www.lowes.com/pd/Utilitech-4-ft-Light-LED-Strip-Shop-Light/5000858= 987 jim > On Oct 19, 2026, at 1:09 PM, john niolon wrote: >=20 > Hi all > =20 > My 30 year old 8' t-12 (single pin) garage fixtures are slowly = dying...(4 total double tube) > the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (16-20 bucks a tube) > =20 > Want to change to led... lots of options - 8' led tubes are expensive = too ... > =20 > I was gifted a box of 20 4' bi-pin bulbs that work with a = ballast...(heat sink) > =20 > option 1 > if I use these I'd have to change all the tombstones to bi-pin and = figure out the > shunted vs non shunted type... AND find the 8' to 4' fixture = conversion kits (adding the middle tombstones > =20 > option 2 > 8' type a led single pin tubes (about the same price as 8' = fluorescent) and use a ballast > not great reviews when shipped... > =20 > option 3 > =20 > replace all the crap with the internet specials linkable stick lights = and hope they work > =20 > comments on options ???? > =20 > questions... when using the ballast type plug and plays... aren't I = using more electricity using the ballast > and heating it up... is there any savings here ??? > =20 > =20 > please educate the old dummy on best (least expensive) options > =20 > =20 > =20 > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jamesf@groupwbench.org >=20 --Apple-Mail=_B79E95CE-618D-4F19-B7DF-0B8D740F4C2B Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit charset=us-ascii Just put in some 4' integrated LEDs and get on with life. All other options for non-commercial use are a kludge and a time sink. I used these in the basement and they're working fine:


jim

On Oct 19, 2026, at 1:09 PM, john niolon <jniolon@att.net> wrote:

Hi all
 
My 30 year old 8' t-12 (single pin) garage fixtures are slowly dying...(4 total double tube)
the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (16-20 bucks a tube)
 
Want to change to led... lots of options  - 8' led tubes are expensive too ...
 
I was gifted a box of 20 4' bi-pin bulbs that work with a ballast...(heat sink)
 
option 1
if I use these I'd have to change all the tombstones to bi-pin and figure out the
shunted vs non shunted type...  AND find the 8' to 4' fixture conversion kits (adding the middle tombstones
 
option 2
8' type a led single pin tubes (about the same price as 8' fluorescent) and use a ballast
not great reviews when shipped...
 
option 3
 
replace all the crap with the internet specials  linkable stick lights and hope they work
 
comments on options ????
 
questions... when using the ballast type plug and plays... aren't I using more electricity using the ballast
and heating it up... is there any savings here ???
 
 
please educate the old dummy on best (least expensive) options
 
 
 
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
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Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

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--Apple-Mail=_B79E95CE-618D-4F19-B7DF-0B8D740F4C2B-- --===============8037492474187336582== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8037492474187336582==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Oct 19 12:21:12 2026 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F97DA0B8C for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 12:21:07 -0600 (MDT) Authentication-Results: autox.team.net; Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from relay1.stackmail.com (unknown [185.151.28.65]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFCD2A031B for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 12:01:18 -0600 (MDT) d=swiftrecruiters.com; s=key1; h=In-Reply-To:From:References:To:Subject: MIME-Version:Date:Message-ID:Content-Type:Sender:Reply-To:Cc: Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-ID:Content-Description:Resent-Date: Resent-From:Resent-Sender:Resent-To:Resent-Cc:Resent-Message-ID:List-Id: List-Help:List-Unsubscribe:List-Subscribe:List-Post:List-Owner:List-Archive; bh=eI9mznhs1UcbPwjW5N5y1rSRFMrt3GGp6fmcj9kGYH0=; i=@swiftrecruiters.com; t=1792432861; x=1792519261; b=dC4usAsQyiqG0r+WgvsR/gdIU35MFzNWuB5SM2hj+WYSCr2 s9M/wa4cT3t/wEidCWcucpn8RGID2bQyBGnW5B3sTQZgNpkqVC0Lrw1pE03NZqCfIR5voYpg1mkf4 yVa2+yCHIRoqOoOO/WGyPOM56MoxgONADs1qW1BvUwpKIcbAiNemk56OrIfqdo2b3pv9G6LwZ3Jue axstJRgIkd1aXulZj/yLM/Ezp1LxS0KBgc3CJVsO42UDkwFf87PMLCtuzG7OYMObAr/YoHOs4M11z hh/kz1l9+Ac5gRbfKszzzMxy+Qugvnyr3kfFfddlTVa6ps9bIkqjRbXZSRaKq1qQ==; Received: from smtp2.mail.stackcp.net ([10.4.13.36] helo=smtp2.lhr.stackcp.net) by relay1.stackmail.com with esmtps (TLS1.3) tls TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (Exim 4.99.5) (envelope-from ) id 1xIrfB-00000006KKM-1UN7 for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 19:00:45 +0100 Received: from cm-72-240-73-107.buckeyecom.net ([72.240.73.107] helo=[10.1.1.17]) by smtp2.lhr.stackcp.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.99.5) (envelope-from ) id 1xIrfB-0000000GZNE-053F for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 19:00:45 +0100 Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2026 14:00:43 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY.ref@johns-desktop> <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY@johns-desktop> From: John Bach Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] flourescent to led changeover Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============4060261622099521181== boundary="------------0vBcX2KnUkdawcVJt9VEYLuF" Content-Language: en-US This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------0vBcX2KnUkdawcVJt9VEYLuF Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit My garage has 12 4 foot 2 tube fixtures. about 5 years ago I dumped all the fluorescent bulbs and ballasts and went to led. Tombstones were fast and easy to change. Only need to do 1 end. Rewiring took 5 minutes per fixture. I used all 5000k daylight bulbs. Tremendous difference. I now have light in corners that were just shadows. I am in NW Ohio where it gets very cold. I put some in my shed and trailer with no heat and they come on immediately. I don't know for you if 4 foot or 8 foot will be cheaper but I do know I would do it again. Actually option 1 sounds like the way to go if 1 8 foot ballast will light 2 4 foot bulbs. I don't know that answer. If you need to buy more ballasts that could be bad. I used all no-ballast bulbs. Good luck. On 10/19/2026 1:09 PM, john niolon wrote: > Hi all > My 30 year old 8' t-12 (single pin) garage fixtures are slowly > dying...(4 total double tube) > the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (16-20 bucks a tube) > Want to change to led... lots of options  - 8' led tubes are expensive > too ... > I was gifted a box of 20 4' bi-pin bulbs that work with a > ballast...(heat sink) > option 1 > if I use these I'd have to change all the tombstones to bi-pin and > figure out the > shunted vs non shunted type...  AND find the 8' to 4' fixture > conversion kits (adding the middle tombstones > option 2 > 8' type a led single pin tubes (about the same price as 8' > fluorescent) and use a ballast > not great reviews when shipped... > option 3 > replace all the crap with the internet specials  linkable stick lights > and hope they work > comments on options ???? > questions... when using the ballast type plug and plays... aren't I > using more electricity using the ballast > and heating it up... is there any savings here ??? > please educate the old dummy on best (least expensive) options > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate:http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive:http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage:http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jbach@swiftrecruiters.com > --------------0vBcX2KnUkdawcVJt9VEYLuF Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

My garage has 12 4 foot 2 tube fixtures. about 5 years ago I dumped all the fluorescent bulbs and ballasts and went to led. Tombstones were fast and easy to change. Only need to do 1 end. Rewiring took 5 minutes per fixture. I used all 5000k daylight bulbs. Tremendous difference. I now have light in corners that were just shadows. I am in NW Ohio where it gets very cold. I put some in my shed and trailer with no heat and they come on immediately. I don't know for you if 4 foot or 8 foot will be cheaper but I do know I would do it again. Actually option 1 sounds like the way to go if 1 8 foot ballast will light 2 4 foot bulbs. I don't know that answer. If you need to buy more ballasts that could be bad. I used all no-ballast bulbs. Good luck.

On 10/19/2026 1:09 PM, john niolon wrote:
Hi all
 
My 30 year old 8' t-12 (single pin) garage fixtures are slowly dying...(4 total double tube)
the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (16-20 bucks a tube)
 
Want to change to led... lots of options  - 8' led tubes are expensive too ...
 
I was gifted a box of 20 4' bi-pin bulbs that work with a ballast...(heat sink)
 
option 1
if I use these I'd have to change all the tombstones to bi-pin and figure out the
shunted vs non shunted type...  AND find the 8' to 4' fixture conversion kits (adding the middle tombstones
 
option 2
8' type a led single pin tubes (about the same price as 8' fluorescent) and use a ballast
not great reviews when shipped...
 
option 3
 
replace all the crap with the internet specials  linkable stick lights and hope they work
 
comments on options ????
 
questions... when using the ballast type plug and plays... aren't I using more electricity using the ballast
and heating it up... is there any savings here ???
 
 
please educate the old dummy on best (least expensive) options
 
 
 

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
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They are "direct wire", so I had to tear out the ballasts, but that was easy to do. They also make a version that is 96" long with single-pin bases: https://www.lowes.com/pd/GE-Ultra-Bright-Direct-Wire-250-Watt-EQ-T8-Dayligh= t-Single-Pin-T8-LED-Light-Bulb-2-Pack/5013822219 Doug On Mon, Oct 19, 2026 at 1:24=E2=80=AFPM john niolon wrote= : > Hi all > > My 30 year old 8' t-12 (single pin) garage fixtures are slowly dying...(4 > total double tube) > the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (16-20 bucks a tube) > > Want to change to led... lots of options - 8' led tubes are expensive to= o > ... > > --0000000000000746bf065e35e606 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

They are super bright - at least twice as brigh= t as the old fluorescent bulbs I was using.=C2=A0 They are "direct wir= e", so I had to tear out the ballasts, but that was easy to do.
<= div>

Doug

On Mon, Oct 19, 2026 at 1:24= =E2=80=AFPM john niolon <jniolon@att.= net> wrote:
Hi all
=C2=A0
My 30 year old 8' t-12 (single pin)=C2=A0g= arage fixtures are slowly dying...(4 total double tube)
the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (= 16-20 bucks a tube)
=C2=A0
Want to change to led... lots of options=C2=A0= - 8' led tubes are expensive too ...
=C2=A0
--0000000000000746bf065e35e606-- --===============8009442789565770665== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8009442789565770665==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Oct 19 13:08:05 2026 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 075B3A0B8F for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 13:08:05 -0600 (MDT) Authentication-Results: autox.team.net; Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-oa1-f45.google.com (unknown [209.85.160.45]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B84AA060A for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 12:48:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-oa1-f45.google.com with SMTP id 586e51a60fabf-486f013db83so768528fac.0 for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 11:47:31 -0700 (PDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; t=1792435650; cv=none; d=google.com; s=arc-20260327; b=oAe7yX0r32MkfLOGNwclByHJlh2oD8JQyPU73X3njo1XUkmHS0W9QWNPr3eh9GeZHb ObXNoJnG+6wqvlY4ivuQtrjEPVqfD6lVLG/TPIl1WS6PvH/UjZ7UnnSVHxz+D9n0AzeT UyUgHv/EnrBStOL0m4dnnonk/UXZF2jvbtndcxM2cqN6GsUkVd0iSXvwwETKyqzPlenr kXuGMxfSCKJuWso2p2QlNgKVY9SNCux5gfaJuQ0iU3WJ4cv+oIp3TZLVCvv0rysWgkD4 401YRf+1aNEioIwzmJ5odcnEAcx5YL27lTOFm/CtEGFfhYtMiW3IM9V3ySBn41QQkPpX CJ9w== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=arc-20260327; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references bh=lE9rPfOI821KU5T+XBR/g4ePaj/jzQzpQa/ddhX7P6Q=; fh=k5HJNSV0jBXqjCzb/PtAziW7tUpazeLOCXv6Am6CEG4=; b=lLH9gAUpl0yDmCgq88upZBcg3mosicls2rdEIww6IV84+6vLg9AVgxJbg0mkYcKWJf +qgibi2+9jCfhl953wVBi6A49I39HiYAEpkCODMrIchgfRxHSPz9pnz3SYGqqoOx9/z8 uEraHO6S1q4HZsoM0iemV8lhdvsOkWUNyQG9KYC8PmpO4OQTL/i31XMw+lqpDkrkNFyz tPLyWhN4imuUMe3DEfAjbLu+UIo9DeHCVXT5xmgKmctFSVyqzJfHUq2vpbrnc2WveNN2 6srJQAVj8hZJozvJx6L5kTqkIpL7Lzje3VS30Oi46QvAhTPYkaTTKKvVRpi7NWxywHuD 2zMQ==; darn=autox.team.net ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.google.com; arc=none d=gmail.com; s=20251104; t=1792435650; x=1793040450; darn=autox.team.net; h=content-type:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to :references:mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to :content-type; bh=lE9rPfOI821KU5T+XBR/g4ePaj/jzQzpQa/ddhX7P6Q=; b=jfbLcdtf0Kwb7tX5Zr6rG4rQbKTSrHiV3rCXEutNf/W7cNfES6yrAaRi5mX9FbPhIR bQ9uUL8XRE25nnh6uPGfY701N6gZGzbKkDveZbPYZuO5qfCTUnaJuqrom0MX4fFdvZ5T 8/RWWbp13Y5bEeRGHctsiJ9Vq1J1aeU4fCod2niPgI5+WL/tu8FfJsH4rL4JQ35Hnl7N m8G9QKhRnSuwl2wh/Nne7/N0toTzCVb5MD6XrX1uqswFWMdspd/socJcc3FD7QSklxZU h8qBbz0WazfA6p3qgXC/HZLVpJEkEAIF24jkLWUHYck+nIoUcDSbGgNDLx3TLoo0LNjG S4aQ== d=1e100.net; s=20260707; t=1792435650; x=1793040450; h=content-type:cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to :references:mime-version:x-gm-gg:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc :subject:date:message-id:reply-to:content-type; bh=lE9rPfOI821KU5T+XBR/g4ePaj/jzQzpQa/ddhX7P6Q=; b=KJ2WsdtY671QE0tZzKqnjOcyjAceWTMiANEC4C5j/iMPoaqBnhZMMIOBf7UN+8ElYP zqWl41SKBwO2+VNrw7AlNq6LO7nGK5R2Yco3YFH/oHHP4ezTO/rLgEr9oHlGKPA3PVeO 2jYmcaBFLwzSJrbwj4d6e3+Ehl86nZNVrCy+HF9FynJm/nRWLHE+/1LbpgdC7+lL3m4H alKM3c8LSx7yXwzbglDNYp4u99bGZ7MCVdRxaSvl31MdxG2gKWZAYKWbtgHARipsTv99 OZGTnsSGAxInDB9VPUMTsrVw/vHbxFrwmfINhG1+e0rR9ECKBBVWTxxCE+3nStKHW+yS vJ0g== AKwUvBzTYuekQm/Uc8peY1JyhCgyMvY9jxF49nOKS0oT2tU8m9iXbsnHyrv47xTfObOqixmoHDXw9VGqMns=@autox.team.net vhvq0bYpimztRr7qkc5rE9xKupSP7elnKfAv//+5cSVsFkL/nOuvNJpe8kfm67k6BrAeYwgRepD USVXQ0eCIgsbz1R7DHjv1fPlzIDN2Abc= fjpmYwGb+3URzYk/lw969uxpL8a9q+mfA9g7t2tnVei4V5Gkwo54NCJOLCXzorwO0icPTIot8B4 dWDePdzRMJQEh0IY+s4BlRQZB1P/98FG8FN7KQ8X/aY5VHEzGtBfhL4ta6bBaviom3C+TBGDdM3 XbiRLKNrIvW3pjxUludSJ1PWzIrr5zlTLB6KJ29n1X7QF5g5QCNoy783OCbKucXTl9bnIYuXTu4 +W9Dkt/TqtC/QUKQgyc4KWNVLvFQQU/IMOpSxz5XA5I215yv+8If1f81K6i4p/WMZpAEDDOWLbc YtLoNOKQ3ya9EhKE= 586e51a60fabf-4a757b0f8a5mr6985139fac.45.1792435650315; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 11:47:30 -0700 (PDT) References: <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY.ref@johns-desktop> <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY@johns-desktop> <97147E8C-F24F-4C23-9CD4-2CD896F69244@groupwbench.org> From: Douglas Shook Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2026 11:47:17 -0700 To: Jim Franklin Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] flourescent to led changeover Cc: shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4497182968255836267== --0000000000003847d5065e35f2c2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I replaced my 8' single pin fluorescents with these non-ballast single pin LEDs about four years ago, no problems, terrific light, it was a very good decision for me: JESLED T8/T10/T12 8FT LED Tube Light Bulbs, 50W 6000LM, 5000K Daylight White, 8 Foot Single Pin FA8 LED Fluorescent Replacement for Shops Garage Light Fixtures, ETL Listed, Remove Ballast (4-Pack) - Amazon.com On Mon, Oct 19, 2026 at 10:59=E2=80=AFAM Jim Franklin wrote: > Just put in some 4' integrated LEDs and get on with life. All other > options for non-commercial use are a kludge and a time sink. I used these > in the basement and they're working fine: > > > https://www.lowes.com/pd/Utilitech-4-ft-Light-LED-Strip-Shop-Light/500085= 8987 > > jim > > On Oct 19, 2026, at 1:09 PM, john niolon wrote: > > Hi all > > My 30 year old 8' t-12 (single pin) garage fixtures are slowly dying...(4 > total double tube) > the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (16-20 bucks a tube) > > Want to change to led... lots of options - 8' led tubes are expensive to= o > ... > > I was gifted a box of 20 4' bi-pin bulbs that work with a ballast...(heat > sink) > > option 1 > if I use these I'd have to change all the tombstones to bi-pin and figure > out the > shunted vs non shunted type... AND find the 8' to 4' fixture conversion > kits (adding the middle tombstones > > option 2 > 8' type a led single pin tubes (about the same price as 8' fluorescent) > and use a ballast > not great reviews when shipped... > > option 3 > > replace all the crap with the internet specials linkable stick lights an= d > hope they work > > comments on options ???? > > questions... when using the ballast type plug and plays... aren't I using > more electricity using the ballast > and heating it up... is there any savings here ??? > > > please educate the old dummy on best (least expensive) options > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jamesf@groupwbench.org > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com > > --0000000000003847d5065e35f2c2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I r= eplaced my 8' single=C2=A0pin fluorescents with these non-ballast singl= e pin LEDs about four years ago, no problems, terrific light, it was a very= good decision for me:
JESLED T8/T10/T12 8FT LED Tube Lig= ht Bulbs, 50W 6000LM, 5000K Daylight White, 8 Foot Single Pin FA8 LED Fluor= escent Replacement for Shops Garage Light Fixtures, ETL Listed, Remove Ball= ast (4-Pack) - Amazon.com

On Mon, Oct 19, 20= 26 at 10:59=E2=80=AFAM Jim Franklin <jamesf@groupwbench.org> wrote:
Just put in some 4' integrated LEDs a= nd get on with life. All other options for non-commercial use are a kludge = and a time sink. I used these in the basement and they're working fine:=


jim

On Oct 19, 2026, at 1:09 PM, john niolon <jniolon@att.net> wrote:

Hi all
=C2=A0
My 30 year old 8' t-12 (single pin)=C2=A0g= arage fixtures are slowly dying...(4 total double tube)
the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (= 16-20 bucks a tube)
=C2=A0
Want to change to led... lots of options=C2=A0= - 8' led tubes are expensive too ...
=C2=A0
I was gifted a box of 20 4' bi-pin bulbs t= hat work with a ballast...(heat sink)
=C2=A0
option 1
if I use these I'd have to change all the = tombstones to bi-pin and figure out the
shunted vs non shunted type...=C2=A0 AND find = the 8' to 4' fixture conversion kits (adding the middle tombstones<= /font>
=C2=A0
option 2
8' type a led single pin tubes (about the = same price as 8' fluorescent) and use a ballast
not great reviews when shipped...
=C2=A0
option 3
=C2=A0
replace all the crap with the internet special= s=C2=A0 linkable stick lights and hope they work
=C2=A0
comments on options ????
=C2=A0
questions... when using the ballast type plug = and plays... aren't I using more electricity using the ballast <= /div>
and heating it up... is there any savings here= ???
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
please educate the old dummy on best (least ex= pensive) options
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
=C2=A0
_____________________= __________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.= html
Suggested annual donation =C2=A0$12.96
Archive: http://www.team.n= et/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jam= esf@groupwbench.org


___= ____________________________________________

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et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

alk/dirtbeard@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.= team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com

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PH7PR84MB2077.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM (2603:10b6:510:154::5) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.21.522.19; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 19:41:35 +0000 Received: from SA1PR84MB3895.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([fe80::4217:20e7:6af2:d6ce]) by SA1PR84MB3895.NAMPRD84.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM ([fe80::4217:20e7:6af2:d6ce%6]) with mapi id 15.21.0522.017; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 19:41:35 +0000 From: Brian and Wendy Warrick To: Doug Braun , john niolon Thread-Topic: [Shop-talk] flourescent to led changeover Thread-Index: AQHdX+59UJjuHujWj0ysr8CtJ37VercFM7aAgAAPY7A= Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2026 19:41:35 +0000 References: <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY.ref@johns-desktop> <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY@johns-desktop> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US msip_labels: x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: SA1PR84MB3895:EE_|PH7PR84MB2077:EE_ x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 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inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8981449596717491419==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Oct 19 14:30:22 2026 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7665FA0BF3 for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 14:30:22 -0600 (MDT) Authentication-Results: autox.team.net; Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic309-24.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (unknown [66.163.184.150]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C15E8A07B1 for ; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 14:00:13 -0600 (MDT) t=1792439981; bh=wXYqJ5AU8rfwZQ6KNkJdFYiOp6oFmJ4Zy6nW2aDqPhQ=; h=From:To:Date:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:From:Subject:Reply-To; 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Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic309.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 19:59:41 +0000 Received: by hermes--production-bf1-6d6877594b-4bzzg (Yahoo Inc. Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 2fb8a5b815ebe2ce7ec53d5bbac26a46; Mon, 19 Oct 2026 19:59:38 +0000 (UTC) From: "john niolon" To: "Eric Russell" , "shop-talk" Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2026 14:59:36 -0500 References: <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY.ref@johns-desktop> <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY@johns-desktop> User-Agent: OEClassic/5.4.1 (Win10.19045; P; 2026-08-13) mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] flourescent to led changeover Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============1933259588573642662== --------------090901090403040408080903 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline after considering all the options and work involved and cost...=20 I'm just gonna scrap what I got and I've order a 10 pacl of the stick light linking ones and install those... 6 will do what I need = so=20 I'll have 4 spares and will probably get more light than the flor tubes (especially since 4 bulbs are burned out now) :-) =20 =20 thanks for all the input =20 john =20 ----- Original Message ----- From: Eric Russell To: john niolon Cc: shop-talk Sent: 10/19/2026 12:24:08 PM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] flourescent to led changeover I have changed all the 4'=20 fluorescents in our garage to the eLcheapo (tm) LED linkable sticks. After = 5+=20 years=20 I've had one fail out of 12. I bought a few extras when they went on sale. = Also (if it matters) no problems with them working in cold weather. (OK, co= ld in North Carolina may not be cold elsewhere but the fluorescents I had w= ould often not work when it was cold.)=20 EjR=20 On Mon, Oct 19, 2026 at 1:17=E2=80=AFPM john niolon wrote= : Hi all =20 My 30 year old 8'=20 t-12 (single pin) garage fixtures are slowly dying...(4 total double tube) the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (16-20 bucks a tube) =20 Want to change to led... lots of options -=20 8' led tubes are expensive too ...=20 =20 I was gifted a box of 20 4' bi-pin=20 bulbs that work with a ballast...(heat sink) =20 option 1=20 if I use these=20 I'd have to change all the tombstones to bi-pin and figure out the shunted vs non shunted type... AND find the 8'=20 to 4' fixture conversion kits (adding the middle tombstones =20 option 2 8'=20 type a led single pin tubes (about the same price as=20 8' fluorescent) and use a ballast not great reviews when shipped... =20 option 3 =20 replace all the crap with the internet specials linkable stick lights and = hope they work =20 comments on options ???? =20 questions... when using the ballast type plug and plays... aren't=20 I using more electricity using the ballast=20 and heating it up... is there any savings here ??? =20 =20 please educate the old dummy on best (least expensive) options =20 =20 =20 _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive talk/ejrussell61@gmail.com --------------090901090403040408080903 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
after considering all the options and work inv= olved and cost... I'm just gonna scrap what I got and I've order a 10 pacl<= /FONT>
of the stick light linking ones and install th= ose... 6 will do what I need so I'll have 4 spares and will probably get mo= re light
than the flor tubes (especially since 4 bulbs = are burned out now) :-) 
 
thanks for all the input
 
john
 
= ----- Original Message -----
= From: Eric Russell <ejrusse= ll61@gmail.com>
= To: john niolon <jniolon@att.net<= /A>>
= Sent: 10/19/2026 12:24:08 PM
= Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] flourescent to led changeover
I have changed all th= e 4' fluorescents in our garage to the eLcheapo (tm) LED linkable stic= ks. After 5+ years I've had one fail out of 12. I bought a few extras when = they went on sale. Also (if it matters) no problems with them working in co= ld weather. (OK, cold in North Carolina may not be cold elsewhere but the f= luorescents I had would often not work when it was cold.) 

EjR 
=
On Mon, Oct 19, 2026 at 1:17=E2=80=AFPM j= ohn niolon <jniolon@att.net> w= rote:
Hi all
 
My 30 year old 8' t-12 (single pin) garag= e fixtures are slowly dying...(4 total double tube)
the old t-12s are hard to find and expensive (= 16-20 bucks a tube)
 
Want to change to led... lots of options = - 8' led tubes are expensive too ...
 
I was gifted a box of 20 4' bi-pin bulbs that = work with a ballast...(heat sink)
 
option 1
if I use these I'd have to change all the tomb= stones to bi-pin and figure out the
shunted vs non shunted type...  AND find = the 8' to 4' fixture conversion kits (adding the middle tombstones
 
option 2
8' type a led single pin tubes (about the same= price as 8' fluorescent) and use a ballast
not great reviews when shipped...
 
option 3
 
replace all the crap with the internet special= s  linkable stick lights and hope they work
 
comments on options ????
 
questions... when using the ballast type plug = and plays... aren't I using more electricity using the ballast
and heating it up... is there any savings here= ???
 
 
please educate the old dummy on best (least ex= pensive) options
 
 
 
_____________________= __________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
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--------------090901090403040408080903-- --===============1933259588573642662== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============1933259588573642662==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Oct 20 05:54:28 2026 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F992A0BCC for ; Tue, 20 Oct 2026 05:54:28 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from Deep13.mail.Megageek.com (unknown [34.199.103.79]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B515A0601 for ; Tue, 20 Oct 2026 05:46:29 -0600 (MDT) References: <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY.ref@johns-desktop> <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY@johns-desktop> To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net type=4; name=$KeepSent From: eric@megageek.com Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2026 07:45:56 -0400 10/20/2026 07:46:07 AM, Serialize complete at 10/20/2026 07:46:07 AM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] flourescent to led changeover Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multipart message in MIME format. --===============3119526672888252105== This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 0040A18885258E96_= AW, The moment I thought would never come is here. John, I have a few boxes (maybe 30 in total bulbs) of the 8' single pin lights. Come pick them up in NJ and they are yours for free. I doubt it would pay to ship them as they would require such protection to ship. Where are you located? Moose --=_alternative 0040A18885258E96_= AW, The moment I thought would never come is here.

John, I have a few boxes (maybe 30 in total bulbs) of the 8' single pin lights.

Come pick them up in NJ and they are yours for free.

I doubt it would pay to ship them as they would require such protection to ship.

Where are you located?

Moose --=_alternative 0040A18885258E96_=-- --===============3119526672888252105== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============3119526672888252105==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Oct 20 06:55:48 2026 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8465BA0C0E for ; Tue, 20 Oct 2026 06:55:48 -0600 (MDT) Authentication-Results: autox.team.net; Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic314-23.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (unknown [66.163.189.149]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2793A0CBC for ; Tue, 20 Oct 2026 06:26:05 -0600 (MDT) t=1792499133; bh=L3rmipiHakvLkO4NiqYrx58oY3Lj1eQtf3Brj8tV6MY=; h=From:To:Date:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=M7sXy/POT7HzKC1RHJFds8Z/c6LhLu29CN0W3XUgcN8jP4i7IRWoDx2ZGlbiVvY9Bswk1KMjyKqtTRNtiCoqpMqE6urxG4HSq+buQEutYtPpIoYO8GdPxtI89StjFbshfu+HqAMGP1otXaBQ7UrM2PpBeqhKPHnChbD4EHHgZD8= t=1792499133; bh=VnOGle+Knb+e2i+OXk79V4XefWt+YUcsWX7xF4QXvpZ=; h=X-Sonic-MF:From:To:Date:Subject:From:Subject; b=Cv58AmLU6JKFNAtCwpjivzDLNHP8j05vtFGBlXgQdFuWuTVNVbtXftkjMmtY9DaDoPspEdwxSO1I6uTO5IAYGnDwyE4QLopPTm/oG7VKz/01z6lu2IU9CpzHWPEb9pj4e+34q5p4Eil8/EA3Siw5iYZx7S1S0z4cJd7spBcRm83Qcs+LVekrpFxycc/oArp7fvFvvTgGnPdvfTOQ0EWw/TzhtflO1utTvDJbBJ4Nav/w3p3ciduchKoWSBXSwdfyMcKtS3qCg0lEk8H+6SK4TRZmIPoC6SA7M5fXco82oT2h9652UhrnE6LncbcF6lmFkW0k2VTbvBD+Z8XeSQlzgQ== zc9nmJlFckhkjXuPDsS07qe8ms5Ot9t4TdbvkuVAqUJlpZf9O5B3Ds9hwVZIhRp3PKZKGrOeAqoY Zrvwcf8WqcSQVsbIDEFbSEuI0GENE9MaKXjiobGh_1w1fsaPRPUDazW2hY6VUKQT8gB4feO59h2d pnCwEE6gJW.0JFoT0_0TtvkJnuWyv0WcFG47P0lP0DxnX81B9ZFbiSQRCULrzemE4P2lc2bv5c6e o4LuG0DAJ90PtfE542BvRLb0tWN9HRpw61iq1ibfYp8uldmKC0Iv1e4xxWHVmlelEQ1WBnMTN9fx rCi5TVxklJKn4S_by3NPgT0uxpNuYhHtQhe10xpSI1QY.11tvc8p8nyeG4qpx4RMYvUlW5fwsCUJ EIHhiJREfxBL5H74hKXZ6ciHp0.JFt7EjvdLGsu0Y7dVyOCGnZLT2Qh0QEgzFOpGgekBVHjKw9RY r4gVsqKzAMvOxzvBNHmiS_DigEpj.exo5LBTxGqVTU2.kCPzc8yBHeDuw0OEtqk3.sKGQbD7uUeX luEwCSxsgXHNDphAJ5r.Ivg4JaBqv3so9EbaGacvo4GFTbCio75U4S6P9BuwrR15RTDpL.fgCKXl 7IzD7ebsMaI8nH5BPJ1uic7DCzmvnxo4j_HAJtijH8NxrFfrq7Scvwrph5e1Z7GITCyb4YBPmzlD IGerawZhExJl3n1SXj4xOTR20t_7Xx_TnOxr6xAvKfz74pvEBp9g_5ppAy_14Tep1bdLbUg4z4u8 HuciYGj0tVo8fgmDMsYOI7flrkTHnJzUutVsQVPuk3Zrx38hM7aXxq4sqJacXBKB_5p6TvA2k2V3 5X8Yonk53CvgNSib1d8n11fyeGTMapMCYq71qd1ihMH5b81JCcng2CKojoMa2Ag3r9ewBsRavQ5A Nml.J2vL3Y4RnmEiF_X0kxxr64HsE.HJ44u6EzC.zODwpagw1sIjolP0Rc1X6BwMKuwkWs.MOOoF upZc8iz_Y4Gg_e2fUVfIUzQAvGRrUTl.Sm3CD0lcL8DULvvpKsvQNJNYWI1ryNCKvYcrtY3Xi5I2 NaH0PisYR82knVuMLdp2G07rT65HhcI9UvXAzyYsMHFYoAJlbyD4Y5eJh.rgqdOPsSI5dANr8A86 DGxLrzjmQCqODHvT8mNdUfBZ1MFte6v.ZEaqvzHAT6DHUSAbh2kzAGWDAb4SfEF17qz63SXTrdYV g6KSuNk5_GjrJ0g4qv2kcz86OtrFidTqxG6JdiKLTZ8sH1w.7u.ieaUfaNZblGX1Cf07XvFeO3St rpgs_YZxs6JiomdAR8CUAHt73xJCK.f6nCSeeuS6n3K3wlnx1mv.RVKpXozU24sbBlsnW5nqFQLd tAqK.E.FycXz5CLgS4Xb0nP9Zpy6vklwHV7udaQ0qV4Lu.P93uBIk4gZi.qOvmW5DGLtUWIHdKiC 36URg_k3VGuMDCGh5ecgXnNrg6_o7U8pWE7xcfPdM9.wBRyHiL4pmkBs3LMAYG4boXw9sUixcdS1 Uv1WjrPtkVzRDrGvF3dxTtGfoZSZdun6lLSc.Dhfy0nybsLjMXtJB22wPOjJ3GZlaM1vWBV2cM1D .1L4YmA0dQT5fJOrodadEnI6yQmiEUlGbU_URzekqWtwxRJK1.X8zuo1AStK2aHrkVhmux_VIhbT Ex9u_cD1977PxEbCFGY.EH3cWpnkol_B8uIMdf2m_WDpZ9Pfrkevbe9vYlhqbMoO6MkzMyV1kN5e 9OuPFNvAEujwn5Rhg.ofvxe_vEi6AOGZdAaFOp2ouGr9kXlBDoTamW4Mi7Orc32PrdEAO8C6o_fF yw1XNCPKzjPymfdxj.Dld8wQfnO3fW594mm7EO3WnRugPQbxuOMLxzz6V0A1YT4JRvTQn.RT4VHB w3yctovGlHRM0TNi2kiJKgjNY2tgIojpScUfPKY2o5k5HaozKM4rMsxxxNKtLZoGmblNwV7E7fx3 LNEti_g4UiR1dT38bjgVS1YbCpVcMrkh9.pV780wfRIbPQxP5oD_pASLkEYiOKpJUUOg5M2dUz4D 9D1HpPuOYPOvSGs5gDs6TqNetp2wAqu_IlVG2xtX3P4cb5IOfnw20K.gmWEiAmPv5ysA5EzZfJnk TLwxMRJlBGxN4sK6Wgl9cRJQkokBfa.ACtTSpHUWEDcxgCrzqkfYVflCvXkYasSnKf9oRWCXbwjF 5ufLhBau76iF.LpctMIXU6Ra0FKqbQ4sdeN1HXvzsYyJYw5_IN8VnLymBJv9J0VAyb.t9h44- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic314.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Tue, 20 Oct 2026 12:25:33 +0000 Received: by hermes--production-bf1-6d6877594b-7jv57 (Yahoo Inc. Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 3cd452f6fc1587dfad07a381de58b130; Tue, 20 Oct 2026 12:25:31 +0000 (UTC) From: "john niolon" To: eric@megageek.com, "shop-talk" Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2026 07:25:29 -0500 References: <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY.ref@johns-desktop> <1UnKbQNUVE.L2SszN5vGEY@johns-desktop> User-Agent: OEClassic/5.4.1 (Win10.19045; P; 2026-08-13) mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] flourescent to led changeover Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============1708045256383053307== --------------050402040101070301040500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline thanks Moose, amazing offer... but,=20 I'm in Alabama and the trip would be high $$$$$ =20 I went with the internet led stick lights...should be here by Friday... wil= l report on success =20 thanks john =20 ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Cc: john niolon Sent: 10/20/2026 6:45:56 AM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] flourescent to led changeover AW, The moment I thought would never come is here.=20 John, I have a few boxes (maybe 30 in total bulbs) of the 8'=20 single pin lights.=20 Come pick them up in NJ and they are yours for free.=20 I doubt it would pay to ship them as they would require such protection to = ship.=20 Where are you located?=20 Moose=20 --------------050402040101070301040500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
thanks Moose, amazing offer... but, I'm in Ala= bama and the trip would be high $$$$$
 
I went with the internet led stick lights...sh= ould be here by Friday... will report on success
 
thanks
john
 
= ----- Original Message -----
= From: <eric@megageek.com>= ;
= Cc: john niolon <jniolon@att.net<= /A>>
= Sent: 10/20/2026 6:45:56 AM
= Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] flourescent to led changeover
AW, The moment I thought would never come is here.

John, I= have a few boxes (maybe 30 in total bulbs) of the 8' single pin lights.

Come = pick them up in NJ and they are yours for free.

I doubt it would pay to ship = them as they would require such protection to ship.

Where are you located?

Moose<= /SPAN>
--------------050402040101070301040500-- --===============1708045256383053307== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============1708045256383053307==--