From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 2 13:03:23 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F370A0997 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 13:03:23 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from NAM11-DM6-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (unknown [40.92.19.30]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDEA0A07FA for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 13:02:52 -0600 (MDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=V9YkWZJAnbjya9wVsWoMDmBLYs3ydN/bWK67k3PePqXZu50byhJqmGLhGo8aSX3JPNTx/j6ZCboj37tfUPRB/XH3INeV/aUXR3/5e5ZrneMVJStEl9YsPGA4KbR3MdDlDnY5zMEfYY+mMISQsQVFLDqAR4noSaLvy2p0HSE0q6tlbvfiqTrIqs95KFXRx7eJsqSs0lZbi46o10n2hq8EBGOrtAX0xX5sN2LWqZdm5ssTb3EpMbprFYgS5II/UPcUKUTbzgsxGqtcMbGxlnINd4DTtJoitzm9CTgd5V0cKjz7EL0hi9p3wj/Hab3xgg2luZ+usQ81K0es6xZh7xHCgA== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=RO8xkiMJRlcLTsrluvphFTyn4qRpHS2fWd7FZX/NR/k=; b=Awy8oFTQV1uXPtRkdXvC0nkViMvbvZCDkwVJRVfhVMh/F5wdhXGOSY7fimgMZP0cFPPXdjEdEgkayRtNKmNzNJFxEY1CJ+AP5r289kyZ93xeRPtKLdKXyq0Xf+pzcpSKV2gfMKTlZur1m+zfXn3FpbQt2J/EvR+6ypXuPv70WuXBMv8UhXKln4LW4k6BLD4zwy2KUfXzOONABZUiDRXyvCFrh/i1VzYx0Y1HXKx6WPHYc8bbbJRZp1lFHZ0r02tYTUE5u5cJ0hIxJV3neBFZC+TzytRLfbTV1eb7L2FvQcV7r1pD3ND078GOr8mA9drxmCHuAXeP2I5GN4O6NE/d/w== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=none; dmarc=none; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=RO8xkiMJRlcLTsrluvphFTyn4qRpHS2fWd7FZX/NR/k=; b=KnKm8jQVRVKBBCwKUIp0fL+o5VD64McNNoKkJXMsXDgehioFnN0l6JcmtAvVnIHi0trCWfyqRfh40jLZIA4mQbpbeOzjuSAg++ofPywrqaJCrgo0QVuBg2vQRIa50uA8jDaHtfjSa0bMPxA5sl7W/ZXM49xOOa1qObHmQgGC3RHT620t0UT/5wD0zNlL6qnizuE/MVuCJsd8q1a2+1YO4byDoHAfcMyfoDUujEG385akfNQmtt6Is1GC2dItegYLD/BEPok1RWS3dhUjHVWD31JOHUlwT/qkxtsx69SKAUNf+HNgf97dRDko5W2IH5HQc5lHTOolzDmpeU/nrKjBbA== Received: from CO1NAM11FT050.eop-nam11.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:3861::51) by CO1NAM11HT138.eop-nam11.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:3861::112) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4373.18; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 19:02:52 +0000 Received: from DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:3861::50) by CO1NAM11FT050.mail.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:3861::79) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4373.18 via Frontend Transport; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 19:02:52 +0000 Received: from DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::680f:df35:52ea:7751]) by DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::680f:df35:52ea:7751%4]) with mapi id 15.20.4373.026; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 19:02:52 +0000 From: "Tim ." To: "Shop Talk" Thread-Topic: water heating installation Thread-Index: AQHXh9BI4w0FAh7n9kmSevJ5J8tUDg== Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2021 19:02:52 +0000 Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-incomingtopheadermarker: OriginalChecksum:5FD772C1DD10AF04C6860FEDED8B7FA2998D1E96D4DA70D66AEE31CAC88D4FCF; UpperCasedChecksum:E404A83BC56BDBF85DDBCCAB399ADD20C8BA98497A733E888461CEE417050F51; SizeAsReceived:6772; Count:41 x-tmn: [wpvRmJ7mIb8efyMIWs++bQLWONvhsZyrjMwgYOF/aOT1SnhglEbKHdu1bfGEc0nbzLzPzVZHhY8=] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-incomingheadercount: 41 x-eopattributedmessage: 0 x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: efc9ac8a-3eec-4b05-d20c-08d955e8212e x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: CO1NAM11HT138: x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: V1wCaG5bgiJdc4VVfGEtdaqqjqLH2nO9J3AZkZEMsZYgvLPLReuf3qZoY1VdWB1F8ZZMrYTP81oawtUemfg007Cm3n57BFPcS+T4rLMVcZhINGE4DRRTZ2VJ5uMzpt+Q9kC42h4NWbu7tS8EDsvhy0548VVBtLoxLVd3rMVzmclHMNsQhYU2U08kFJuRKOuIdotgXU3he8tih9admJ3lWBMbBokMBQ8HXfTji8CLINNbsy769myqJemsF6W0jy6E9Pvjc3PB73zj2kaY9S1ymC9q7hVtFKflJ31O+kAs1mxVyWW+1b7Oen1Fujy7WG9zIS96sNFwO0LzuhkheJXXUu096I4NBEvuI4xq47PdZsfDUahedVIi1gwVQeL+lpO7tkZE8ZRz8BKjzYr0EKG+ggoZwXiXW0LeYwO3zDY2I/4GqnbnUdW2ZtMYNOcDxgro x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-chunkcount: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-0: 4XLRSZvQEHxwratra10nJEoBq0JRyPeQFvQY98vUxkc6LXhx4JMu/m2mLFGFb14ifUs4C79QfCnu9hNfjVyh2r0QX/ZunajIUY2ioijbxUUgOQq32cag3HPBzLxAp84n1wOxkKA+a9myj4noOK2vEjewLAuyNIOQ0AZbClyPDv4+wxfkNYTVj0bA7zOzEap0bzmtLWC+TjFYyxpA8BaR2g== x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True Subject: [Shop-talk] water heating installation Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6569380304028649832== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_DS7PR19MB4629588DF39F65AC1E1DC98DB4EF9DS7PR19MB4629namp_" --_000_DS7PR19MB4629588DF39F65AC1E1DC98DB4EF9DS7PR19MB4629namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are s= witching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including t= he venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI. thanks --_000_DS7PR19MB4629588DF39F65AC1E1DC98DB4EF9DS7PR19MB4629namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are s= witching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including t= he venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI. 
thanks
--_000_DS7PR19MB4629588DF39F65AC1E1DC98DB4EF9DS7PR19MB4629namp_-- --===============6569380304028649832== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6569380304028649832==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 2 13:13:05 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C832A0D38 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 13:13:05 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from NAM11-DM6-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (unknown [40.92.19.103]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 460DBA0D0F for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 13:12:47 -0600 (MDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=kc7fryF75CN+7jrdwzD1/fAkMoQWPe2S+IEJVZNsMwe84GO/Boxfxh7L0LC3F8InKUo4IehMFfP3NnXGukdsK63bEQvz36rN7Scxi6Z5x7SLY4K4Es00Vsa3qVQECoLQwODCHQxGTz29CfCYPU07DCxjKOHWqKQUX1G0Sk7vAzsKSStz1roXuUSFG/xm5MMu17vHkbn8ynLOKrsa1CHfbXJcQDYN0ROwE2NXka8Lk++FhD88e6wcvYlFpni236uVPdecEOSHll2hyi4BYoGxtvj8pSfY/ljbFs6OAPRl9rpqiZis+17LkE01X41JaNpiCENbos8Qb9frvjB/bH7lkw== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=azXXJLS6h8uewjKviShw1+pZzUNrHpkjQg+b8rDjoxc=; b=dKouLJ1P4RcEE8ssgnCGxqwXE8hXVjDHmBOEJMG1V1Ts5f4wUMj61RyFy20kZgCU/VrETMvx/TahmxLqn9x6QO0qM7Uri3BiG14HXQukaObwUFgF27KMJZeywBN0pzEpFFh5UVNzrLwnbl50yMPm6QPVN/y/76VyVpDTHHquUy56VlEFolQHWFLZpTkrvJFS1d7i6hVF1osmmMJAcv5nmQYMenNykTNrYmP7E1ShCNmrVS/zIP41bYQr/K7Uzyk4J3dSJNsdM62zZAtdHxbX79CqSCUXdyXCRbxxqGfS838roZ0zXopu0rM6nZscVRskfSkV/CW84VTkHe0SR4exEA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=none; dmarc=none; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=azXXJLS6h8uewjKviShw1+pZzUNrHpkjQg+b8rDjoxc=; b=uKxCiJLYH/6cejMwSeNMtO6POFRzY5prOQKTbvPTzyjndFCbn22WJ2LjQJ29+MQjQ0GgQ/2geFtDmxtNX2t0FPDFcjeMRdX7VdpS3U3Fkyu7xCz/s9BWUeunbh0LgEuZDgdvtU6g/vAewfdNqNTbAU1yzYpO2i4FKTRkb199q42OmrNTwB98iGUiM4J0lxz6chVoSAHpGsVEWX7qfwaMSf35VShDV6lIIQBBFRW2ECZNXBRu5qcWaqjFgLCo0KU0/wuXl6WBibJ2dkRa9AtRhHB03Jr4m7pVU0CVVU4UGvUQ8YYm35ZFDt2BtiPkvWCKSXhwPG3zlhHwlnUs3gGSLQ== Received: from CO1NAM11FT050.eop-nam11.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:3861::4b) by CO1NAM11HT169.eop-nam11.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:3861::477) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4373.18; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 19:12:47 +0000 Received: from DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:3861::4b) by CO1NAM11FT050.mail.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:3861::79) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4373.18 via Frontend Transport; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 19:12:47 +0000 Received: from DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::680f:df35:52ea:7751]) by DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::680f:df35:52ea:7751%4]) with mapi id 15.20.4373.026; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 19:12:46 +0000 From: "Tim ." To: "Shop Talk" Thread-Topic: [Shop-talk] water heating installation Thread-Index: AQHXh9BI4w0FAh7n9kmSevJ5J8tUDqtgk9OAgAAAvAM= Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2021 19:12:46 +0000 References: , Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-incomingtopheadermarker: OriginalChecksum:BCC6D11D8C16A93B19965D9ACE633127FFA8DCFB913CC7218DFB4B8BC4013C1B; UpperCasedChecksum:BBFD7347AA97D4CEC2FC2E7BCBE5D77A152D4D464FD19133D406199E9264B7F6; SizeAsReceived:7117; Count:44 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [lamEi0xSPCXNSH9OBWEXtLXN3B6pvWHDxLn0UPihF0aGjv1a9sf/ISgtoFHJy7zFn7swuZpNFT4=] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-incomingheadercount: 44 x-eopattributedmessage: 0 x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 8de53a3e-769f-493a-8a50-08d955e98335 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: CO1NAM11HT169: x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: lpZn3W3uIxAtiF1k33vWdJKFoYPIL0FgUZl27Upv4EfJFdmPfvNfpOdWDdLcEJ0TuNddI9KbKXFPoEGknFR651sXpn0NivB6D8m8Ul8rug25CHS0zks/EIoQkdie+2UzowTfxWZmqEdik2XyK3TeOLAj3CJMkFTiYL2y8oFS0pQ7Xj+bSyvK/eZDVGoHHh6tSpp1WfgR4StDufJ+hFbKe9sOlvEc6ECYBxH87i9f5HFj89ulWnxMnXH8TW2917myPHfFjRGMtbyhHbm9yXveeDyjy9topWckffvgob25m0mgcCiHBeRzzgbvSecBXjnxdlRtMDxnLAfB0tHTlNhYZzgI2/aEjRFNQpGF5K4nKYXoTWy7dkku2Js5QWBBeRFoNqs2yiCi6PKgSpB6cY8Ry3J7+ST5KECGtMD3KZskXlx7y14mmDajuHoUDN4uIyk060Wo8SoOKhuZ8rxYP+lqaT3KZ5+6h/h0pPOQ4H9l9mc= x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-chunkcount: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-0: gIo8VQTQdA/Zyy4CaXcYZv9A11Weup+243lCrYQu5BqVHnomvnPhL4Mf9+P8bpkuUfRXpX6KgWdKLoRXQ1E8N1MDMtUHgTr5J/6kLe+V1PusLUQHIpO/Bu6c95IhQ2xrwXVffWp7pksusOZBUGCIBIJUazifD6zfYtvGv3rKf2UIxzNEn6+ejRG5XUppHCxDkYp+N9p9oxqWFPxrhsx0nA== x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3723762292545331676== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_DS7PR19MB46298F61DC9E665E814068C6B4EF9DS7PR19MB4629namp_" --_000_DS7PR19MB46298F61DC9E665E814068C6B4EF9DS7PR19MB4629namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable House has gas with a "T" in the line for the water heater. The gas line wil= l be 10-12'. It is a good sized house with two full bathrooms. I want to make sure that = the water heater is big enough for a family when we finally sell. Would a slightly smaller sized tank make that much different in the price t= hough? ________________________________ From: John Innis Sent: Monday, August 2, 2021 2:08 PM To: Tim . Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation That seem within reason, but need more data. Do you already have other gas= appliances? If so, how far will new gas lines need to be run? That is a = HUGE water heater, are you sure you need 75 gallons? We went from a 60 Gal= lon electric to a 50 gallon gas and were quite happy, the gas heater recove= red much faster than the electric one. tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com>> wrote: We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are s= witching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including t= he venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI. thanks _______________________________________________ Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive @gmail.com -- =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D Never offend people with style when you =3D =3D can offend with substance --- Sam Brown =3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D --_000_DS7PR19MB46298F61DC9E665E814068C6B4EF9DS7PR19MB4629namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
House has gas with a "T" in the line for the water heater. The ga= s line will be 10-12'. 

It is a good sized house with two full bathrooms. I want to make sure that = the water heater is big enough for a family when we finally sell. 

Would a slightly smaller sized tank make that much different in the price t= hough?

From: John Innis <jdinni= s@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, August 2, 2021 2:08 PM
To: Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com>
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation
 
That seem within reason, but need more data.  Do you = already have other gas appliances?  If so, how far will new gas lines = need to be run?  That is a HUGE water heater, are you sure you need 75= gallons?  We went from a 60 Gallon electric to a 50 gallon gas and were quite happy, the gas heater recovered much faster t= han the electric one.

On Mon, Aug 2, 2021 at 2:03 PM Tim = . <tims_datsun_stuff@ou= tlook.com> wrote:
We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are s= witching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including t= he venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI. 
thanks
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
et=3D"_blank"> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

alk/jdinnis@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank"> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis@gmail.com



--
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D Never offend people with style when you   =3D
=3D can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
--_000_DS7PR19MB46298F61DC9E665E814068C6B4EF9DS7PR19MB4629namp_-- --===============3723762292545331676== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============3723762292545331676==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 2 13:17:19 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 399F9A14B7 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 13:17:19 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from gateway23.websitewelcome.com (unknown [192.185.48.104]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60028A0DF4 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 13:16:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cm16.websitewelcome.com (cm16.websitewelcome.com [100.42.49.19]) by gateway23.websitewelcome.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1550A28C413 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 14:13:32 -0500 (CDT) Received: from gator4190.hostgator.com ([108.167.189.15]) by cmsmtp with SMTP id AdNUmIZqgjSwzAdNUmqxob; Mon, 02 Aug 2021 14:13:32 -0500 Received: from ip184-187-184-85.sb.sd.cox.net ([184.187.184.85]:56255 helo=Nice-iMac.local) by gator4190.hostgator.com with esmtpsa (TLS1.2) tls TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1mAdNU-003WI9-3i for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Mon, 02 Aug 2021 14:13:32 -0500 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: From: Mike Rambour Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2021 12:13:30 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.15; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.12.0 Content-Language: en-US please include it with any abuse report [184.187.184.85]:56255 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============0957960386727603456== boundary="------------83920C24ACA10546BA7F0EF3" Content-Language: en-US This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------83920C24ACA10546BA7F0EF3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit   Offhand, I would say too high.  BUT how much work is involved ?   When going from gas to gas, its a simple half hour project.  I don't know what the work would be going from Electric to Gas, never done that.  I would assume the plumbing is simple, the only part I can't know about is installing the venting.  Is that a complicated install ? going through upstairs floor ? or just a simple hole in the ceiling and roof with a pipe ?  In So. Cal. one of the best things I did was move the water heater from inside the house to outside and built a shed around it, super easy to change now.  But in WI it might get too cold in winter for that to be reasonable, a lot of heat would be lost.  Not enough information to know for sure.     mike  On 8/2/21 12:02 PM, Tim . wrote: > We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We > are switching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor > (including the venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI. > thanks > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/lists@dinospider.com > -- A gun is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have it, you'll probably never need one again. --------------83920C24ACA10546BA7F0EF3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
  Offhand, I would say too high.  BUT how much work is involved ?   When going from gas to gas, its a simple half hour project.  I don't know what the work would be going from Electric to Gas, never done that.  I would assume the plumbing is simple, the only part I can't know about is installing the venting.  Is that a complicated install ? going through upstairs floor ? or just a simple hole in the ceiling and roof with a pipe ?

 In So. Cal. one of the best things I did was move the water heater from inside the house to outside and built a shed around it, super easy to change now.  But in WI it might get too cold in winter for that to be reasonable, a lot of heat would be lost.
 
 Not enough information to know for sure.

    mike

 On 8/2/21 12:02 PM, Tim . wrote:
We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are switching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including the venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI. 
thanks

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive





-- 
A gun is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have it,
you'll probably never need one again.
--------------83920C24ACA10546BA7F0EF3-- --===============0957960386727603456== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============0957960386727603456==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 2 13:57:33 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8B3CA1221 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 13:57:33 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from st43p00im-zteg10063401.me.com (unknown [17.58.63.175]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19E40A11E9 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 13:57:14 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1627934234; bh=n1HKF7UOtStNtP0z4DsG00kM4W/ru007IqgKhI6OiRg=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=YsZnj/1h8RzshFPqG3bcozqw8wnnPaLcp/pvFXgqjwjljt2y0PjKujnfmmXD4Y5Ki 1qbag6+UKngOWAstM67KA1imxO8Sx8gDPGu2uVNFe2KLAI7+z8NwL6Ij9+Mdmqt+RG FvNy56+8neSyXq0+ar6DsBHf652tsksPwLjnvYsa0nlxkAfdItVbGUKmJj/lQtgaxL Lmxzb3os4IUnKhHtMCRhFPgaGgmW+8OmmKXDv/VoGE/RMV3Z1k1YoW3R91OhIjNHSM 7n5rthGThfmFikAGdxkp4DWVnj2L1voU5Op4Sq8BifMnKpRUqcDUBgHVQ8C0KUFUHq 5amN1bLehSYCg== Received: from [192.168.50.18] (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by st43p00im-zteg10063401.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id DD1544A0262; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 19:57:13 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2021 14:56:52 -0500 References: To: "Tim ." definitions=2021-08-02_07:2021-08-02, 2021-08-02 signatures=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-2009150000 definitions=main-2108020128 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5489163278984241157== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-080879EE-89B4-4D34-83F8-8E8E59FD1BC9 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable It never hurts to get more estimates.=20 I had a furnace flue installed in my shop that took about 2 hours. It went t= hrough a metal roof, up the outside of the building about 5=E2=80=99, then t= hrough the overhang on the second floor - also metal. I supplied most of the= materials & they charged $500. This was last year in Texas.=20 Just guessing, but northern homes have basements, which will either require a= longer flue or a power vent, which can be quite expensive.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 2, 2021, at 2:03 PM, Tim . wrote: =EF=BB=BF We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are sw= itching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including the= venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI.=20 thanks _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com --Apple-Mail-080879EE-89B4-4D34-83F8-8E8E59FD1BC9 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable It never hurts to get more estimates. =

I had a furnace flue installed in my shop that took abou= t 2 hours. It went through a metal roof, up the outside of the building abou= t 5=E2=80=99, then through the overhang on the second floor - also metal. I s= upplied most of the materials & they charged $500. This was last year in= Texas. 

Just guessing, but northern homes hav= e basements, which will either require a longer flue or a power vent, which c= an be quite expensive. 

Peace,
Pat

Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity

On Aug 2, 2021, at 2:03 PM, Tim . <tims= _datsun_stuff@outlook.com> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF=
We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are sw= itching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including the= venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI. 
thanks
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.= net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.tea= m.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://au= tox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@icloud.com

= --Apple-Mail-080879EE-89B4-4D34-83F8-8E8E59FD1BC9-- --===============5489163278984241157== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============5489163278984241157==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 2 14:44:17 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BB05A15ED for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 14:44:17 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ej1-f52.google.com (unknown [209.85.218.52]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0920BA0DD6 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 14:43:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-ej1-f52.google.com with SMTP id gs8so32852918ejc.13 for ; Mon, 02 Aug 2021 13:43:37 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=ouyWjuWhMH7NMnnyNEpotybQXKG4zKVQR+QJSIiu3dA=; b=hcRtt+9x3vnqWapv9FCW6nK0KdQVXEk9mmmwXum7ghjD9QDJg53ZHLTEQQzeSzDBvB nUCg0hLLrJ1B7H3pU51bCwqbVNMNigHLE+FltusbPvoXPye9sjA5ITjx6v65qRubYxtw 8CE5nP2Dx+9ucOtX+cFbOOX6CW660IJ39ddFnNrJL64l5Mlrv5fIwgjpOLOSo8wU61ig Go8J7MvvCY3klGp4zK5jpiIs3qILRf/TCqwJSNzzl+au4KTdnn89/D7oM8KZNrOPFaTh 0M69rxgFqJZip24kF09zl4ja8vUSIeM4CTs6IV/52zpWOJMStFurO58Z2k0zSM8xL7DB n16w== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=ouyWjuWhMH7NMnnyNEpotybQXKG4zKVQR+QJSIiu3dA=; b=dQZcjEQFaSLFP1R4POkdsxV5wxG6KwICWmJKmX30wda/NC75eGE3Y8Xyazm+RnDbOp x/8ealqnvHMInFKPCbJcMWyd3ucvMYr0vAKCHptxnfafAinUEnMzq2xcE5+yOvfDvFzS nCk0xlnfLq/K8Z7xRZ+ZE6j7e8WOY0iDwU4gMMRoBuJHZoD3Y74mVEtsYnb+NsbkJzbo ZNgYxGQXOO8JskPbq6VLHmRgxrZiBj2Tpf67Gm17gK5gcQJ9XrlzGy9mQ1K4LmZ14nGd PYjkTvLohYSF7sweGXriphZxf1PkJTo3qChHnW5AOqeYo8UN6oFwPcx8vsOaYADdr0ku ux1g== MlWyOe6BVXXnT0RUZNTE+UY6mWQHUD0L8d6doaE= v11mr17163087ejb.482.1627937016981; Mon, 02 Aug 2021 13:43:36 -0700 (PDT) References: From: old dirtbeard Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2021 13:43:25 -0700 To: "Tim ." Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2889427133398115854== --0000000000009d2e0f05c8999f0a Hi Tim, It would be about $1,500 for the water heater and $1,500 for the installation. Without knowing how long the gas run would be, if there are obstacles, how long the flue would be, sealing the roof, if there are obstacles, etc., it does not sound ridiculous for a conversion. For a replacement, <$2K would be expected. I live in Los Angeles, though, and things almost certainly are more expensive here... best, doug On Mon, Aug 2, 2021 at 12:03 PM Tim . wrote: > We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are > switching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including > the venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI. > thanks > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com > > --0000000000009d2e0f05c8999f0a Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Tim,=C2=A0

It would be about $1,500 = for the water heater and $1,500 for the installation. Without knowing how l= ong the gas run would be, if there are obstacles, how long the flue=C2=A0wo= uld be, sealing the roof, if there are obstacles, etc., it does not sound r= idiculous=C2=A0for a conversion. For a replacement, <$2K would be expect= ed.

I live in Los Angeles, though, and things almost cer= tainly are more expensive=C2=A0here...

best,
=

doug

On Mon, Aug 2, 2021 at 12:03 PM Tim . &= lt;tims_datsun_stuff@outlo= ok.com> wrote:
We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are s= witching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including t= he venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI.=C2=A0
thanks
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

alk/dirtbeard@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.= team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com

--0000000000009d2e0f05c8999f0a-- --===============2889427133398115854== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2889427133398115854==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 2 16:13:26 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 874E9A1465 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 16:13:26 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (unknown [167.206.4.202]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 014ABA1456 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 16:13:05 -0600 (MDT) bh=Bo4limM/6pXR59t5qta7RoADHu/vPLwP07aVDNnuAA4=; h=Message-ID:Date:To:From:Subject; b=emTpcN2+b41PWIFht2znfDFuCr1PLHzHUe/0bRIz4S5HTk5tY8S14bcrUhKfvi0Gc 8N5YkF8TgNigsS8BbBo35bKOus8q8d4Vs8Vkow4WM5LMf3Gfm/XgtVdwoWaPFLgOCd fJYlRaqK4tQaKU/9kaiE4s5e6+h8lPLWT76hDIXrAudpkP/O7OGhGdpMnlHNLN7b78 1JUjWrSCK+gDLM2oqV5XEXFz1fRtqfygMt0tUYkp42H71terDpBL/1SDF7by+GmwUm OPHoefM9AqMj4bYMAb8e9o2Mpc0Gk0uC+coVjnvB/dsIVrTNFH/exq+fRpBeJEPS8X ki/9pk6JyuDCA== Authentication-Results: mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net smtp.user=strovato; auth=pass (LOGIN) a=BtHS1wCAVwFGGf/2A35Y6w==:117 a=BtHS1wCAVwFGGf/2A35Y6w==:17 a=HpEJnUlJZJkA:10 a=9hzyLWh0AAAA:8 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=tEFWEVO-Cz1WVCA4OBQA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=FCn-vfcZas2sHgGRoUAA:9 a=DgPuFW2L78vvoYeT:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=gf98C4-mNC9y8iGYiwyC:22 Received: from [68.194.179.118] ([68.194.179.118:60325] helo=Steve-PC.optonline.net) by mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.9.48312 r(Core:3.6.9.0)) with ESMTPA id 73/61-16221-2FD68016; Mon, 02 Aug 2021 18:13:06 -0400 Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2021 18:12:24 -0400 To: "Tim ." , "Shop Talk" From: Steven Trovato d19.prod.outlook.com> References: Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2686484922027077062== boundary="=====================_1032941104==.ALT" --=====================_1032941104==.ALT How did you come up with that size? From what I have read, gas heaters are typically smaller than electric because they recover quicker. For example, https://www.totalhomesupply.com/water-heater-sizes says if your family size is 5 or more, you'll need an 80-gallon tank (electric) or a 50-gallon tank (natural gas or liquid propane). As you said, I don't know how much the price would change with a smaller heater. Also, I assume you have considered the tankless option. -Steve T. At 03:02 PM 8/2/2021, Tim . wrote: >Content-Language: en-US >Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > >boundary="_000_DS7PR19MB4629588DF39F65AC1E1DC98DB4EF9DS7PR19MB4629namp_" > >We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. >We are switching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and >labor (including the venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI. >thanks -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus --=====================_1032941104==.ALT Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable How did you come up with that size?  From what I have read, gas heaters are typically smaller than electric because they recover quicker.  For example, https://www.totalhomesupply.com/water-heater-sizes says if your family size is 5 or more, you=92ll need an 80-gallon tank (electric) or a 50-gallon tank (natural gas or liquid propane).    As you said, I don't know how much the price would change with a smaller heater.  Also, I assume you have considered the tankless option. 

-Steve T.

At 03:02 PM 8/2/2021, Tim . wrote:
Content-Language: en-US
         boundary=3D"_000_DS7PR19MB4629588DF39F65AC1E1DC98DB4EF9DS7PR19MB4629na= mp_"

We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are switching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including the venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI.
thanks

3D"" Virus-= free. www.avast.com
--=====================_1032941104==.ALT-- --===============2686484922027077062== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2686484922027077062==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 2 16:17:49 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DA55A1507 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 16:17:49 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from st43p00im-zteg10071901.me.com (unknown [17.58.63.169]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CCBAA111E for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 16:17:16 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1627942636; bh=0aJwkHQpiFDtF+ufIwtufflZT2+fBAkh+8ii6xm8KAA=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=j+AmjtI8iFTaZw6tw4jxGZ9FlnZMVxhRoP6MOGJQsy/HcgFAAHyY6GfgOLkoHjvEA j5BXjjXX9SyAzLvk9CcLZ6NA3oNG4PcBWuS/9VOJBVjXdl6EGlYmgBeif7Gdcbv9/S 4giS+mNNqZcPXFTCMRQFcJsoyqrnhvNqVeFOXhf8Ox5vQl6fClgED6FdK9YafiLT90 /o8bkq73qovjP/w81vZntOqkoXpCPDB3jASyjRe8irnlioDToBGw1N72H8F8sS9f+D v5jlf0dj8b/RZgO01ipEeYwqZycv8Qo0Nanky6v6mD6tKrSOWaggK40Jhj7fRTzqEf johCTLTqYnKLQ== Received: from [192.168.88.248] (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by st43p00im-zteg10071901.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id B23ACD81058; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 22:17:15 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2021 17:17:13 -0500 References: <73.61.16221.2FD68016@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> To: Steven Trovato definitions=2021-08-02_07:2021-08-02, 2021-08-02 signatures=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-2009150000 definitions=main-2108020142 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5224177427603237823== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-C761D67D-69A5-41BA-B367-2C3F00729234 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Around here (Texas) they install 70-75 gallon gas heaters if you have a jacu= zzi tub. Most 2-3 bath homes get 40 gallon.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 2, 2021, at 5:14 PM, Steven Trovato wrote: =EF=BB=BF How did you come up with that size? =46rom what I have read, gas h= eaters are typically smaller than electric because they recover quicker. Fo= r example, https://www.totalhomesupply.com/water-heater-sizes says if your f= amily size is 5 or more, you=E2=80=99ll need an 80-gallon tank (electric) or= a 50-gallon tank (natural gas or liquid propane). As you said, I don't k= now how much the price would change with a smaller heater. Also, I assume y= ou have considered the tankless option. =20 -Steve T. At 03:02 PM 8/2/2021, Tim . wrote: > Content-Language: en-US > Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > boundary=3D"_000_DS7PR19MB4629588DF39F65AC1E1DC98DB4EF9DS7PR19MB4= 629namp_" >=20 > We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are s= witching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including th= e venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI.=20 > thanks Virus-free. www.avast.com _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com --Apple-Mail-C761D67D-69A5-41BA-B367-2C3F00729234 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Around here (Texas) they install 70-75 gall= on gas heaters if you have a jacuzzi tub. Most 2-3 bath homes get 40 gallon.=  

Peace,
Pat

Pat H= orne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


On Aug 2, 2021, at 5:14 PM, Steven Trovato <strovato@op= tonline.net> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF How did you come up with that size?  =46rom what I have read, gas heaters are typically smaller than electric because they recover quicker.  For example, https://www.totalhomesupply.com/water-heater-sizes says if your family size is 5 or more, you=E2=80=99ll need an 80-gallon tank (electric) or a 50-gallon tank (natural gas or liquid propane).    As you said, I don't know how much the price would change with a smaller heater.  Also, I assume you have considered the tankless option. 

-Steve T.

At 03:02 PM 8/2/2021, Tim . wrote:
Content-Language: en-US          boundary=3D"_000_DS7PR19MB4629588DF39F65AC1E1DC98DB4EF9DS7PR19MB4629namp_"
We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are switching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including the venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI.
thanks

3D"" Virus-free. ww= w.avast.com
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.= net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
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= --Apple-Mail-C761D67D-69A5-41BA-B367-2C3F00729234-- --===============5224177427603237823== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============5224177427603237823==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 2 16:26:40 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FB28A02C1 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 16:26:40 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ej1-f44.google.com (unknown [209.85.218.44]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BDD6AA15D9 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 16:25:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-ej1-f44.google.com with SMTP id u3so693428ejz.1 for ; Mon, 02 Aug 2021 15:25:12 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=v5f849dERAta3GEtzxEXOEIMNEt9VKuTobAfYy4onE4=; b=SJJYixkw9xQxRXBn/BC/1dRvJycLZrFkWvNAUdga6j2VQuiO4bYD5KPTi2pJMu93J9 L1n8w5ZCq9BaVhbz6IWmAq0Ohl7ulqKDDt79HvBxstpdD5+IQIDjE5W2H1U8oMn3SwFM VTGXIx+GhT4mntlRDZckjJvsShgEtVj2D5+WjjDnuxz0jND/4wpmy7cN/cZb6Lxced7G H/t3fehcb2MZ0jKubdUT2vAVP5CN4rJ2+2qqnkPGuhkFXlNKfRReUjvQ1hYrRocVT7yy VEKdIDLu94JwOh3zPtDKXKZnsRazd4eUBYU8Fe8F5PBVpxM0baJW6C7cLdZv16LTY8Yp uSCw== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=v5f849dERAta3GEtzxEXOEIMNEt9VKuTobAfYy4onE4=; b=tzmVl5wuuaSgbSbH7r40QKLmm2aXpNX5PBFcJjYg3H6zOCAod3rjJA+J9vWRpagk/e vGsEUpTqsCNNJ2xH6GO6ZFfMJjCtkWpmt8yu1803oVXt7J8SowGcmCJ7eBdBtHEA4Hji w4oyrEbzqxJ39j36pdR5Nup33XUyTIxRfoLQH2DYISxFy2Pmc5slB/I6dftv/P1+0KbB /c1fcVgY/SeyYoCFLqd7bPmZjl2azUAA27lKclk1yGPhjlCmC7Pk8wafoY4DflobKYOh Sstibf0u2GzpA023zvHqW2cRk8YScEqKWR8X8R6eIFqbqZAimCuhsfz5cQU8w4jTR1NX F7qA== v9pgqhpRfpu1llFOazEEpBhTdRWKttA6/oS7FBg= h4mr17535079ejl.460.1627943111521; Mon, 02 Aug 2021 15:25:11 -0700 (PDT) References: <73.61.16221.2FD68016@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> From: old dirtbeard Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2021 15:25:00 -0700 To: Pat Horne Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5608670373114481464== --000000000000e0789405c89b0af7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Here in Los Angeles, I believe it is determined by code based upon the number of bathrooms, bedrooms, etc., in the house. Our 4 bed/4 bath house has a 75 gallon gas water heater, no jacuzzi tub. On Mon, Aug 2, 2021 at 3:17 PM Pat Horne wrote: > Around here (Texas) they install 70-75 gallon gas heaters if you have a > jacuzzi tub. Most 2-3 bath homes get 40 gallon. > > Peace, > Pat > > Pat Horne > We support Habitat for Humanity > > > On Aug 2, 2021, at 5:14 PM, Steven Trovato wrote= : > > =EF=BB=BF How did you come up with that size? From what I have read, gas= heaters > are typically smaller than electric because they recover quicker. For > example, https://www.totalhomesupply.com/water-heater-sizes says if your > family size is *5 or more*, you=E2=80=99ll need an *80-gallon tank (elect= ric)* or > a *50-gallon tank (natural gas or liquid propane)*. As you said, I > don't know how much the price would change with a smaller heater. Also, = I > assume you have considered the tankless option. > > -Steve T. > > At 03:02 PM 8/2/2021, Tim . wrote: > > Content-Language: en-US > Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > > boundary=3D"_000_DS7PR19MB4629588DF39F65AC1E1DC98DB4EF9DS7PR19MB4629namp_= " > > We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are > switching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (includin= g > the venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI. > thanks > > > > Virus-free= . > www.avast.com > > <#m_-6699205806492531482_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@icloud.com > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com > > --000000000000e0789405c89b0af7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Here in Los Angeles, I believe it is determined by code ba= sed upon the number of bathrooms, bedrooms, etc., in the house. Our 4 bed/4= bath house has a 75 gallon gas water heater,=C2=A0no jacuzzi=C2=A0tub.
On M= on, Aug 2, 2021 at 3:17 PM Pat Horne <patintexas@icloud.com> wrote:
Around here (Texas) they inst= all 70-75 gallon gas heaters if you have a jacuzzi tub. Most 2-3 bath homes= get 40 gallon.=C2=A0

Peace,
Pat

Pat Horne=C2=A0
We support Habitat for Humanity

On Aug 2, 2021, at 5:14 PM, Steven Trova= to <strovato= @optonline.net> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF How did you come up with that size?=C2=A0 From what I have read, gas heaters are typically smaller than electric because they recover quicker.=C2=A0 For example, https://www.totalhomesupply.com/water-heater-sizes says if your family size is 5 or more, you=E2=80=99ll need an 80-gallon tank (electric) or a 50-gallon tank (natural gas or liquid propane).=C2=A0 =C2=A0 As you said, I don't know how much the price would change with a smaller heater.=C2=A0 Also, I assume you have considered the tankless option.=C2=A0

-Steve T.

At 03:02 PM 8/2/2021, Tim . wrote:
Content-Language: en-US
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 boundary=3D"_000_DS7PR19MB4629588DF39F65AC1E1DC98DB4EF9DS7PR19MB4629na= mp_"

We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are switching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including the venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI.
thanks

3D"" Virus-free. www.avast.com=
_______________________________________________

S= hop-talk@autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html<= /span>
Suggested annual donation =C2=A0$12.96
Arch= ive: = http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://au= tox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@icloud.com
=
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Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

alk/dirtbeard@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.= team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com

--000000000000e0789405c89b0af7-- --===============5608670373114481464== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============5608670373114481464==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 2 20:02:26 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56AA3A0FD1 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 20:02:26 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from st43p00im-ztbu10073701.me.com (unknown [17.58.63.183]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7B94A07C8 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 20:01:55 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1627956116; bh=kL5isx9FgeAN9OZ9M5CEJLRWVM0d0UgBcPDql1gX78c=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=F9/Rpu4m3ruOOBcc/wAfgyidfTn7hHkRgqgsCNGQumzReCZ9vgCH6KtOyBMkPE2Te gE+uWXjuSOBH3C3GwgYCoivlDLLg95P+6r7DB+E6uaR+Ut7ND3c9SPov8zLzd4bEqH Efoexsh/QnGICCTtZ96CFJd9Wrb0QIVgSyUqH4nDRYUgI2YKGHHv1s9pHPB+qEsXkl qMIEUoxe/b7965SHMNcY/iD7v2YYqPFs1DyyZzlUGhixYFil+7FsJCNw/UEN6pTjvA EBPt5i1+E+Gvb0rZoCy58u5PLv5Th8BxQPqNxh1jB63NXN/9Ieco1q4aldspK52Pt3 mucEBOW13smqw== Received: from smtpclient.apple (c-73-195-119-82.hsd1.nj.comcast.net [73.195.119.82]) by st43p00im-ztbu10073701.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id A014D4C079A; Tue, 3 Aug 2021 02:01:55 +0000 (UTC) From: Thomas Coradeschi Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2021 22:01:54 -0400 References: To: "Tim ." definitions=2021-08-02_10:2021-08-02, 2021-08-02 signatures=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1011 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=977 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-2009150000 definitions=main-2108030009 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6659090462168747127== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-58DFAC3A-C80D-4341-AC5C-72349EE26CE5 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I would strongly urge you to consider installing an on demand heater. We did= so several years ago to replace a 50 gallon tank type, and couldn't be more= pleased. Never run out of hot water, gas bill in the summer (we also heat w= ith gas, so in the winter that dominates our bill) is noticeably lower. With= rebates, the unit ended up costing me about 600 bucks ($1200 or so purchase= price), plus cost of some copper pipe, some iron pipe and about 4 hours of m= y time.=20 Tom Coradeschi tjcora@icloud.com > On Aug 2, 2021, at 3:03 PM, Tim . wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BF > We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are s= witching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including th= e venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI.=20 > thanks > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arc= hive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjcora= @icloud.com >=20 --Apple-Mail-58DFAC3A-C80D-4341-AC5C-72349EE26CE5 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I would strongly urge you to consider insta= lling an on demand heater. We did so several years ago to replace a 50 gallo= n tank type, and couldn't be more pleased. Never run out of hot water, gas b= ill in the summer (we also heat with gas, so in the winter that dominates ou= r bill) is noticeably lower. With rebates, the unit ended up costing me abou= t 600 bucks ($1200 or so purchase price), plus cost of some copper pipe, som= e iron pipe and about 4 hours of my time. 

Tom C= oradeschi
tjcora@icloud.com

On Aug 2, 2021, at 3:03 PM, Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook= .com> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF
We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are sw= itching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including the= venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI. 
thanks
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.= net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.tea= m.net/archive

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= --Apple-Mail-58DFAC3A-C80D-4341-AC5C-72349EE26CE5-- --===============6659090462168747127== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6659090462168747127==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 3 12:06:15 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 097C7A1E98 for ; Tue, 3 Aug 2021 12:06:15 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from NAM11-DM6-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (unknown [40.92.19.22]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C6D63A1D4C for ; Tue, 3 Aug 2021 12:00:19 -0600 (MDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=GqCeaUgshMozfSrbkQeVm0k06Uzw0IHTY0lZ89SHRG7lpSQfO1XzY/hE4UiFWUZE4XtWsriCU1LDwr1hxrV2kqq6i+4uheka3dFvXwoX20U2yAsPr8NsWNX4mcNzTh+DVJrftIKAP+V2TBt2DYJN6hwgULXbM8QHqIxTaBrIUqMBNqpenZbSODv1Nk6xv9nWlCus4yZomCUxZSVjPlaAApQ4LwNTimgi6BwP59EgKQM05dNOv46X+HLlXiVP0xtf4+GreZI6bepDgwkuWCf3di0V9hl8nWhJD3UlF8zBZk56xxydHuhfkVFMRWBUKHighsse32/NxNi/PC+atGKbxA== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=82E94PdN9P1nOgMwKv9adfihPIhPih0kWXKxs4F3FKA=; b=XbEbX90tpmtTgAQH3bzwY774l9bF+yFgzao1aENY0ljm72naQidxyjknLhCWbfXsDQqf3ZJul4SSFn7niZxFYIHQrD/VFP0aVq7O3zlWFFeSQbkeqF57PhiVqk22uylF2Li8QRZpGsfNtU6EnNySB1+J97IhSEFQJheQBw7RexogShLf6/C0tujE17iX8OqxcAY/1ZVIkdONqpVt/9ezWs7j2ZcMjTZdU65DUFV1qzYigZBi41o3GS6mPKfkN4+43g81YvvE4DfeJ1GV5c8wz2/GqB3RBoaaBvddKZ58PZOySHuP4dhGAdW6DlCAn7qjBtqwBHZWvR+R/ubpsh5vtQ== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=none; dmarc=none; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=82E94PdN9P1nOgMwKv9adfihPIhPih0kWXKxs4F3FKA=; b=pkMgI/EVxJOu+eTsQ5fIxtxszpC4MV9DYD/6FItNyUIQyx9afuQ77OqoNyMygsY2WlUJnDy31PvVkWAzhsR7c784IRX0bIyye5MsNc1ufTWZ+tgGrdA/V5N1yV7MMoKFDnCYVFcgHay+RoskFM2Se/FPN+VAivzWWQPFvFlgtPcHvAw8NITgj2Hzg2nDaAs/YyTKJAKgqDfdg4bYrNmFrsnKKVkjD/cWWRPAkjMxmOyqCxzxIMu9Vvojta9HUfJXz6Yb/9YomSB6ibE5JCQ/9/n7eODzHq23UCN55T7GNEDT9OZ69SssFTH8zpx2qxkd1hVvywNiNjbJutBjQpwBUQ== Received: from CO1NAM11FT007.eop-nam11.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:3861::44) by CO1NAM11HT012.eop-nam11.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:3861::155) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4373.18; Tue, 3 Aug 2021 18:00:19 +0000 Received: from DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:3861::47) by CO1NAM11FT007.mail.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:3861::131) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4373.18 via Frontend Transport; Tue, 3 Aug 2021 18:00:19 +0000 Received: from DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::680f:df35:52ea:7751]) by DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::680f:df35:52ea:7751%4]) with mapi id 15.20.4373.026; Tue, 3 Aug 2021 18:00:19 +0000 From: "Tim ." To: "Shop Talk" Thread-Topic: [Shop-talk] water heating installation Thread-Index: AQHXh9BI4w0FAh7n9kmSevJ5J8tUDqtgk9OAgAAAvAOAAX6giw== Date: Tue, 3 Aug 2021 18:00:19 +0000 References: , , Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-incomingtopheadermarker: OriginalChecksum:DB37FAA646AE162AB0BE29842B3F401C6624EE5A3ECD9367C1038AEBD61666C9; UpperCasedChecksum:110A18CCB521D34DF44E1C662DED12956936CA0ED0D667B6E3E725442A0CD3E9; SizeAsReceived:7220; Count:44 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [3vFvZsgUrDWmFe2kX/ovYj+lgjueHYwfzBdYp17W2QSvNNFQIHkJlGdaJVLhstKCxzlWPiPtCzo=] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-incomingheadercount: 44 x-eopattributedmessage: 0 x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 407ef256-e3c6-47ad-fe51-08d956a88e7a x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: CO1NAM11HT012: x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 0tlK1PfGHAyPTDfEtzFcr86RVClLB7rWTMAIt9udPlIeq/kzTN/t2Vtxti2HcGjC+tiY8CikytdNAwRqzQLX23jieOlvYDVwS3WZpFOFXs5Gjmiz0a9ca2dZv8jIhLTT3w6pT+z7vHJPWZDAaNoYtbrjgqpoMGaZEKBszE8FsJXwtUmLMhP+hP6L7IuptdkO6FVt+nJBgjhPglzf7XSEPH4QSHajLkBs2o9votEZLI6vHVlzcSgbiqe6P/alnhBjBZ1H5mDtZ+uQo5uFQm7qV5gRqEpRs4RtG9ZcySmQ++W4IZJIxbweKjfGEyCetu1gKrNvQBFWAaO9+/N53iPvTwm8qjunZc7jdJjz+KjmjmRni0MD7j32WNHPoGNDFD7JvzGyDo5pNtFoNLF6j5+kBf2o0/vvMSD1LEgLSJc35RbymXzo87i5O6XR1h75qDBbgGepPU2XAcK2pUQJakZd2GG7ipfUOnw4eQggCeR0rE4= x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-chunkcount: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-0: /bWgYqwbU0VxByYsF1DAYY1tXK6eP83pWXUFUUM+xmCYu42szCNBwBpzrd+hS+6LBaEtGgUndC+gskguCzuaW2sEsXg2mWG6j6ESjKZMtWkwceMgFimWlZfIeAwwR5qvCXf/MoaoCYjmHq4lvH1CfTOKdidHVkNoXXvgU22n3rMWNg8F/VOZ+rmaNmTlBArqRjFhOAbyC1Ezxy2GxH01jw== x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8453431404533998541== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_DS7PR19MB4629E1ACFBC328ACA87F70FFB4F09DS7PR19MB4629namp_" --_000_DS7PR19MB4629E1ACFBC328ACA87F70FFB4F09DS7PR19MB4629namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks for the replies guys. ________________________________ From: Shop-talk on behalf of Tim . Sent: Monday, August 2, 2021 2:12 PM To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation House has gas with a "T" in the line for the water heater. The gas line wil= l be 10-12'. It is a good sized house with two full bathrooms. I want to make sure that = the water heater is big enough for a family when we finally sell. Would a slightly smaller sized tank make that much different in the price t= hough? ________________________________ From: John Innis Sent: Monday, August 2, 2021 2:08 PM To: Tim . Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation That seem within reason, but need more data. Do you already have other gas= appliances? If so, how far will new gas lines need to be run? That is a = HUGE water heater, are you sure you need 75 gallons? We went from a 60 Gal= lon electric to a 50 gallon gas and were quite happy, the gas heater recove= red much faster than the electric one. tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com>> wrote: We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are s= witching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including t= he venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI. thanks _______________________________________________ Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive @gmail.com -- =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D Never offend people with style when you =3D =3D can offend with substance --- Sam Brown =3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D --_000_DS7PR19MB4629E1ACFBC328ACA87F70FFB4F09DS7PR19MB4629namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks for the replies guys. 

From: Shop-talk <shop-ta= lk-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outl= ook.com>
Sent: Monday, August 2, 2021 2:12 PM
To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation
 
House has gas with a "T" in the line for the water heater. The ga= s line will be 10-12'. 

It is a good sized house with two full bathrooms. I want to make sure that = the water heater is big enough for a family when we finally sell. 

Would a slightly smaller sized tank make that much different in the price t= hough?

From: John Innis <jdin= nis@gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, August 2, 2021 2:08 PM
To: Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com>
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heating installation
 
That seem within reason, but need more data.  Do you = already have other gas appliances?  If so, how far will new gas lines = need to be run?  That is a HUGE water heater, are you sure you need 75= gallons?  We went from a 60 Gallon electric to a 50 gallon gas and were quite happy, the gas heater recovered much faster t= han the electric one.

On Mon, Aug 2, 2021 at 2:03 PM Ti= m . <tims_datsun_stuff@= outlook.com> wrote:
We need to replace an aging electric water heater before it fails. We are s= witching to gas. Does close to $3000 for a 75 gallon and labor (including t= he venting) sound right to you all? We live in southern WI. 
thanks
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=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D Never offend people with style when you   =3D
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Thu, 5 Aug 2021 14:33:55 +0000 Received: by kubenode548.mail-prod1.omega.gq1.yahoo.com (VZM Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID e24177a46df6e4b32ec336261c9e49e8; Thu, 05 Aug 2021 14:33:52 +0000 (UTC) Date: Thu, 5 Aug 2021 09:33:50 -0500 From: "john niolon" To: "shop-talk" User-Agent: OEClassic/3.2 (Win10.19041; P; 2021-05-18) References: <1UZ4YZ76KH.7AHYM3yYtnG.ref@johns-desktop> mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problems with truck Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format --===============2957295480062895189== This is a multi-part message in MIME format --6=_dvWCO9gh1cIqqTi9Sa99blOBrHZv6LW Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Took the truck (53 ford f-100) out for a drive yesterday=E2=80=A6first= time since the=20 Grand Nationals (I=E2=80=99ve been busy) Ran great for about 30 minute= s with a couple=20 of stops during the ride=E2=80=A6 each time it started right and showe= d no problems.=20 Electric fan and a/c running the whole time As I pulled out of one bus= iness and=20 headed home the truck stumbled and died..almost like it was out of gas= =E2=80=A6 ( had=20 over a half a tank) I pulled into a business and tried to start it and= all I=20 got was a =E2=80=98click=E2=80=9D. Dash Volt meter read about 11 volts= with switch on and=20 dropped to zero when hitting the starter. Waited about 10 minutes and = it=20 started right up=E2=80=A6 got it home, shut it off and same thing =E2=80= =9Cclick=E2=80=9D. Battery has been on a battery tender full time since May and showed 13= =2E7 volts=20 on VOM connected to the battery before the ride. Battery is 2 years old Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA =E2=80=A6 =20 Davis DUI ignition (which could have quit when battery voltage got low= ) All cables are new with 1/0 welding cable for starting circuit and bat= tery=20 ground to frame engine to frame, frame to cab and frame to bed are all #4 wire to bare= metal=20 connection points with dialectic grease. At first glance...when running, the volt meter on dash shows over 13 = volts so=20 I think alternator is good=20 did a load test with a H.F. (100 amp) load tester showed battery dropp= ing to 10=20 volts during 10 second load... recovered to 12.=20 Put truck up on stands and dropped battery (under cab) checked all ca= bles and=20 connections from battery to starter including solenoid and ground conn= ections. all tight, no corrosion on terminals and cells full. this truck fini= shed last=20 year and everything is new. Starter solenoid is a Cole-Hersee 200 amp= =20 continuous draw solenoid. Starter is new last year and 6-7 inches away and below headers so heat= soak=20 isn't causing the problem Set it back down and charged it for 30 minutes at 10 amps... battery s= howed 12.9 volts.. started ok and put meter on alternator terminals... alternator putting out 14.5 - 14.8 volts... varies a lit= tle with engine speed.... so alternator is good I think. I did a load test again.,.. idle voltage reading 12.9 volts on two di= fferent fluke meters... and during the load test it dropped to 12.3 th= en recovered to 12.7...so I'm=20 assuming the battery is good, it was just low before the first load te= st. here's an odd thing.. I have a 12 volt terminal on the right frame rai= l that powers the elec radiator fan, tilt hood motors and trinary swit= ch with the a/c on, headlights on and elec radiator fan running (as much = load as I can put on it)... the alternator o/p at 14.5 volts, the volt= age at the terminal on rail reads 11.5 volts. The terminal is 4'=20 from battery and fed with #4 stranded wire. that's about all the detail I can give you... any ideas why it stalled= and quit..??? and why the terminal point only reads 11.5 versus the= 14.5 at the alternator. I'm=20 at the wall thanks john --6=_dvWCO9gh1cIqqTi9Sa99blOBrHZv6LW Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
Took the truck (53 ford f-100) out for a drive y= esterday=E2=80=A6first time since the Grand Nationals (I=E2=80=99ve be= en busy) Ran great for about 30 minutes with a couple of stops during = the ride=E2=80=A6 each time it started right and showed no problems. E= lectric fan and a/c running the whole time As I pulled out of one busi= ness and headed home the truck stumbled and died..almost like it was o= ut of gas=E2=80=A6 ( had over a half a tank) I pulled into a business = and tried to start it and all I got was a =E2=80=98click=E2=80=9D. Das= h Volt meter read about 11 volts with switch on and dropped to zero wh= en hitting the starter. Waited about 10 minutes and it started right u= p=E2=80=A6 got it home, shut it off and same thing =E2=80=9Cclick=E2=80= =9D.

Battery has been on a battery tender full time since May and = showed 13.7 volts on VOM connected to the battery before the ride.

Battery is 2 years old Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA =E2=80=A6 

<= BR style=3D'BOX-SIZING: border-box; FONT-SIZE: 13px; FONT-FAMILY: Verd= ana, geneva, lucida, "lucida grande", arial, helvetica, sans-serif; WH= ITE-SPACE: normal; WORD-SPACING: 0px; TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; FONT-WEIGH= T: 400; COLOR: rgb(34,34,34); FONT-STYLE: normal; ORPHANS: 2; WIDOWS: = 2; LETTER-SPACING: normal; BACKGROUND-COLOR: rgb(255,255,255); TEXT-IN= DENT: 0px; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; = -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration-thickness: initial; te= xt-decoration-style: initial; text-decoration-color: initial'>All cables are new with 1/0 welding cable for starting circuit and= battery ground to frame
engine to frame, frame to cab and frame to bed are al= l #4 wire to bare metal connection points with dialectic grease.

 
did a load test with a H.F. (100 amp)&nbs= p;load tester showed battery dropping to 10 volts during 10 second loa= d... recovered to 12. 
 
Put truck up on= stands and dropped battery (under cab)  checked all cables and c= onnections from battery to starter including solenoid and ground = connections.
all tight, no corrosion on terminals and  cells full.  this truck finished last year and every= thing is new.  Starter solenoid is a Cole-Hersee 200 amp con= tinuous draw solenoid.
 
Starter is new last year and 6-7 inches away and belo= w headers so heat soak isn't causing the problem
 
Set it back down and charged it for 30 minutes at 10 = amps... battery showed 12.9 volts..  started ok and put meter on = alternator
terminals... alternator putting out 14.5 - 14.8 volts= =2E..  varies a little with engine speed.... so alterna= tor is good I think.
 
 I did a load test agai= n.,.. idle voltage reading 12.9 volts on two different fluke mete= rs... and during the load test it dropped to 12.3 then recovered to 12= =2E7...so I'm assuming the battery is good, it was just low before the= first load test.
 
here's an odd thing.. I have a 12 volt terminal on th= e right frame rail that powers the elec radiator fan, tilt hood motors= and trinary switch
 
with the a/c on, headlights on and elec radiator= fan running (as much load as I can put on it)... the alternator = o/p at 14.5 volts, the voltage at the terminal on rail reads 11.5 volt= s.  The terminal is 4' from battery and fed with #4 stranded wire= =2E
 
that's about all the detail I can give you... any ide= as why it stalled and quit..???   and why the terminal point= only reads 11.5 versus the 14.5 at the alternator.
 
I'm at the wall
 
thanks
john
--6=_dvWCO9gh1cIqqTi9Sa99blOBrHZv6LW-- --===============2957295480062895189== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2957295480062895189==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Aug 6 03:19:47 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C33BA0A9D for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 03:19:47 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-lf1-f48.google.com (unknown [209.85.167.48]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B658A08D0 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 03:19:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-lf1-f48.google.com with SMTP id c24so13349569lfi.11 for ; Fri, 06 Aug 2021 02:19:01 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=XIq+WTIFFFI+gGM15N4j33ZG3h+QLb9uPSXyrpPfMZ0=; b=Xul2OG2GFIIaZSgrWkVJpW16LBNYrYVecdV9NoxK++E+yC1qKGnCJ/BQJ1Ad9LKigQ t3B5G0Wgynxx5kO9KzJY0HTfDXwIprMJg2mIQ0SJqClGqux7k97QKsFnH5doBtOXaREm r61BjLzNNZw6Gf0/PoPxHNNITozhExyVFTgkYWviFr48sKIMrIrLVmUVru0nMlQfldvt rn/Rn79y+ecWUyLqSI3427z+I6IZKcL8lRXtUtvQt78xjJHVsPmf+znQXsQpvp3SXuZG k7wvTAoQ+eNWXejcxwVrVcRA5n1mX742mulokYMHzNIl7wuLmY8X2d9hUqT7QVepgroQ 3j1g== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=XIq+WTIFFFI+gGM15N4j33ZG3h+QLb9uPSXyrpPfMZ0=; b=Rm9rLfXoyoj2D+pQcenx5qQ7FvVkQoteW6SnwOQymdUJC1yfglc1VUwhb/0RN2MErf cE5bVgzbIhNlHFdDptymByY27QF7BBE6WhEKHG23vdFCoLJUqWB1KQO18uAgcRtP4b/c uzlVkZY+Lgs/cB/sMvkS1bdlx7Xv424Jgxjqh2r/CT8tRZH47X8lLtKtB3br4LITxZx1 CxzBkeiEXaLefMSdlar8nZwsj1L3WSaIiIEXB2ax/6bPhXDpNpwjfeld3KcBCZH6uTKS CuzH0k2V1uNlVVV95i9Vh95pBi/ptNdwb5kbvLnbbck2Z3AhdRc0pzdVYdoaWlb0iuz/ USFQ== 9a4kVGROzJllcqeQ1G2viCZ+aYwlD4CCjNEeNgA= Fri, 06 Aug 2021 02:19:00 -0700 (PDT) References: <1UZ4YZ76KH.7AHYM3yYtnG.ref@johns-desktop> <1UZ4YZ76KH.7AHYM3yYtnG@johns-desktop> From: Jeff Scarbrough Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2021 05:18:49 -0400 To: john niolon Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problems with truck Cc: shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net V2hlbiBpdCBkaWVkLCBkaWQgYW55IG9mIHRoZSBlbGVjdHJpY2FsIGl0ZW1zIHN0aWxsIHdvcms/ ICBMaWdodHMsIGV0Yy4/CgpNeSBzdXNwaWNpb24gYmFzZWQgb24gcmVhZGluZyB0aGlzIGF0IDU6 MDAgQU0gaXMgYW4gaW50ZXJtaXR0ZW50IHNob3J0CmluIHRoZSBiYXR0ZXJ5IGl0c2VsZi4gIFJl Z3VsYXIgbGVhZC1hY2lkIGJhdHRlcnk/CgpKZWZmIFNjYXJicm91Z2gKQ29ycm9zaW9uIEFjcmVz LCBHYS4KCk9uIEZyaSwgQXVnIDYsIDIwMjEgYXQgMTI6MDcgQU0gam9obiBuaW9sb24gPGpuaW9s b25AYXR0Lm5ldD4gd3JvdGU6Cj4KPiBUb29rIHRoZSB0cnVjayAoNTMgZm9yZCBmLTEwMCkgb3V0 IGZvciBhIGRyaXZlIHllc3RlcmRheeKApmZpcnN0IHRpbWUgc2luY2UgdGhlIEdyYW5kIE5hdGlv 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D65F6A0D04 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 03:45:19 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-ch2-10v.sys.comcast.net (unknown [69.252.207.42]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10E3AA0AE9 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 03:39:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from resomta-ch2-18v.sys.comcast.net ([69.252.207.114]) by resqmta-ch2-10v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTP id BwJOmDNWohBViBwKUmXMpW; Fri, 06 Aug 2021 09:39:50 +0000 s=20190202a; t=1628242790; bh=wNXVAgdof7sBTKfloxbSNOz/34S+EamDqf7ZQQ2DvQs=; h=Received:Received:Subject:To:From:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=T3SUKIvs/LSBqClp+Bf6Cf/eYB69VJqdX2xDHpf/4+c2PqNrysgdZBWTU8ZuGvdrS NWlnsbo8gqvlqEsoETIQ79lbv2NLYsHyTHh6KC9hJoSiohGKN9TyKzvYxWp1SGwSSW ngAVG6x6ZhO8wVINBUWcoazrt7GrIlhZAmexiBg9aK1yA6Y9re+8OplBnFKkkt9jeU fU0u5T5YiOpZuIIshP/n2SUlviecRo4XWoGF4WWw9cMm9xoRpoCGAr6HpRAERFwfey esHdsUHfe7SM2BTBEyishkjxovgT2SyVejDOneh3vXl3FN+mFdWrdBdH3GyGicikQ9 MO8l5fBf/pFqg== Received: from [192.168.1.133] ([68.32.79.140]) by resomta-ch2-18v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTPSA id BwKOmMSTDbrhMBwKPmhqKi; Fri, 06 Aug 2021 09:39:50 +0000 To: john niolon References: <1UZ4YZ76KH.7AHYM3yYtnG.ref@johns-desktop> <1UZ4YZ76KH.7AHYM3yYtnG@johns-desktop> From: Donald H Locker Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2021 05:39:44 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.11.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problems with truck Cc: shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net [Re-sending because I failed to copy the list; if I've misstated anything, I want to hear the corrections.] How large is the cable from the alternator to the battery? That should be #4 minimum also, else the voltage drop from alternator to battery will reduce the battery's voltage such that it won't really charge. Voltage at the battery posts is what drives current in. If it is less than 13.2+/- volts, the battery won't be charging. The battery voltages all sound somewhat low, which is why I'm suspecting alternator-to-battery connection. It could also be resistance in the alternator frame to engine to vehicle frame to battery post connection chain. HTH, Donald. -- *Plain Text* email -- it's an accessibility issue () no proprietary attachments; no html mail /\ On 2021-08-05 10:33 a.m., john niolon wrote: > Took the truck (53 ford f-100)=A0out for a drive yesterday=85first time > since the Grand Nationals (I=92ve been busy) Ran great for about 30 > minutes with a couple of stops during the ride=85 each time it started > right and showed no problems. Electric fan and a/c running the whole > time As I pulled out of one business and headed home the truck stumbled > and died..almost like it was out of gas=85 ( had over a half a tank) I > pulled into a business and tried to start it and all I got was a > =91click=94. Dash Volt meter read about 11 volts with switch on and dropp= ed > to zero when hitting the starter. Waited about 10 minutes and it started > right up=85 got it home, shut it off and same thing =93click=94. > = > Battery has been on a battery tender full time since May and showed 13.7 > volts on VOM connected to the battery before the ride. > = > Battery is 2 years old Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA =85=A0 > = > Davis DUI ignition (which could have quit when battery voltage got low) > = > All cables are new with 1/0 welding cable for starting circuit and > battery ground to frame > engine to frame, frame to cab and frame to bed are all #4 wire to bare > metal connection points with dialectic grease. > = > At first glance...when running, =A0the volt meter on dash shows over 13 > volts so I think alternator is good > =A0 > did a load test with a H.F. (100 amp)=A0load tester showed battery > dropping to 10 volts during 10 second load... recovered to 12.=A0 > =A0 > Put truck up on stands and dropped battery (under cab)=A0 checked all > cables and connections=A0from battery to starter including solenoid and > ground connections. > all tight, no corrosion on terminals and=A0 cells full.=A0 this truck > finished last year and everything is new.=A0 Starter solenoid is > a=A0Cole-Hersee 200 amp continuous draw solenoid. > =A0 > Starter is new last year and 6-7 inches away and below headers so heat > soak isn't causing the problem > =A0 > Set it back down and charged it for 30 minutes at 10 amps... battery > showed 12.9 volts..=A0 started ok and put meter on alternator > terminals... alternator putting out 14.5 - 14.8 volts...=A0 varies > a=A0little with engine speed....=A0so alternator is good I think. > =A0 > =A0I did a load test again.,.. idle voltage reading 12.9 volts on two > different fluke=A0meters... and during the load test it dropped to 12.3 > then recovered to 12.7...so I'm assuming the battery is good, it was > just low before the first load test. > =A0 > here's an odd thing.. I have a 12 volt terminal on the right frame rail > that powers the elec radiator fan, tilt hood motors and trinary switch > =A0 > with the a/c on, headlights on and elec=A0radiator fan running (as much > load as I can put on it)...=A0the alternator o/p at 14.5 volts, the > voltage at the terminal on rail reads 11.5 volts.=A0 The terminal is 4' > from battery and fed with #4 stranded wire. > =A0 > that's about all the detail I can give you... any ideas why it stalled > and quit..???=A0=A0 and why the terminal point only reads 11.5 versus the > 14.5 at the alternator. > =A0 > I'm at the wall > =A0 > thanks > john > = > _______________________________________________ > = > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/ar= chive > = > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dhloc= ker@comcast.net > = _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive utox.team.net From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Aug 6 06:51:03 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 04D7BA0FF3 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 06:51:03 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic306-1.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com (unknown [74.6.132.40]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F985A0E96 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 06:49:22 -0600 (MDT) t=1628254162; bh=m/5/3+OOGID2oE1594B9qD559cGacMo3/VB+Mb8w73c=; h=Date:From:Reply-To:To:Cc:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=j3Fcftkm++ajYk5uxRtziqLuaeTIFHUX/afK+VLQoCQ6pBRqO+fxCb6b6Hlam2LBaEYUExj76aK/sMCM+bhZp0xRhifDEDHy6X/YjmvsN3vhxNlQGvSIASnKbp1LwfUNkhRNZHhGRBd4bxa+p4oWS95+bC7orqgcU0m2qBBcum/lBBOoWE0NEiCrv5QchQS5Lq68JtU429fOcsjuCzPE/7rZ+LRji92MArMgc7uZkFX/H9fg0T8vaYKh4EDImxqIm6wbLAAdF+p+qDBUPY6BYOkvp3EQWDNzZ8IUvDwlG9B4HUQMK6VVP/ptsPD13SoaUdMMtGQoWnUZb5ctsftvYA== t=1628254162; bh=aaJehffZHcX/lvNrzkgyn29tmhjt4b99Vu6umEQ1fnv=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Date:From:To:Subject:From:Subject; b=DzEXgE9HVrUYbZpkcIP/xGoTWmFo5mi8pyt24fQIiwiUzHXgMXwW4oOiJztxpDWbOfAjvJr/2rzf4wYog2FvhGsrWqpAuaTp+CzwbEZ6YN5x7qF9jR3cDD+di5IHZSEfYjg9f37R/Rpx9naUgLM0KkmZ4i6kiu4MrnueN2bu4iG9sQ6SXi4CC1krlBGSWLVwEsQ+3sbzyb1bY1Rspm8zhdWlOSjMQZ0Zavs00is++8GnSyecdnLkkinTBT3PSs7d6s3O/zkSSTK50FofzIn83ke530afWlWzBWWAzdXVzHa97upvv4KhO1jnolYdkoVblCHZWA//PxzCK8kuhWteTQ== _pn6OP7AQhfqyJOY44cPbi5upivMdYaySti3ZzT58AuMMubHhtbsOsgMXTYiQ116eJSU5HEOQBxQ Kn7S4NyysqbZw7d7vggEHWqMHYWC5w3FPBsEUGquN_sNh_BogznQ8cOKIVBPAERdP969M4SXW2Zb siYL1J3dPYVcycUSQcvl2RHOYQXSpN3OQ3KfZ5bZRWbaPRU8zSWZTQINHplUvPZo4QFvGSu9AjRa j98i5y_ZhdjMaat.SKQvzs5a2movlHXAQQ7zhQ0W.gEMNgpXNeZjODRIv3X9a9xKzy8nQn2qmUGh 9R2KdOb191NXJCfL601LB3g2nY5Px_PFKxnK2YjOO9cl_nBTZAox2Rp04BVY4B7.xf4erskcLlpI .eH29D4hulDSshxGuVSlJradxv4nTyNzbPffZmPHtxoZBtbiBvoPKSmHxO.E1h3YBWKlm6EMJb_s YnDGfRMLClDrOR92M1dy2Zvoe4hxrn.KMW7PyfYiM6gRXxzbfqXOGeEjPTkhm6oljBCsj735U7Gr ZA8K5kDd7Xj0U75MQXFHdvBlpDfNMfHmoy.dOyp5emI4Lwu6r1BH8bhX2KnUwfpXYmg0b91nwYM0 IX0BjJPpUZjrn3qyxJ9PBTIxOmhvPhL6dgZs1oYwpH4ySCXXqTvl7oLtgFrQiWlDgFCSC7JfPm6j rRQ4kBcxMDO3RfzHo3mmlTsPfdcLe96Kar.ls1Goohi0KHk_ql9W_yOm1tFNYvCsqANr_84yeNZT a5dmUBna2ewJ0HVy8Vgn0ei4TKTtUwdFaQWJ92Jwvt.TemyVuhAohQK6bi8Jy_l8mr0gkMFK9tqY IPIZDvuIB1KGPI58Smu3SJJ88v_FBXrJvcMEYkNyY_VKxKviWwRpMN7CyT0ngC5qEApQFvvLAkvN 76XdgB.VqjIVBP1vBnIHSKcR4gTxmEO7SOGlwRltHe6WJgtGPiJXV0uvTmPhbAQXa9zSJP9hRJPO mGKX5pPXbE3V6k0ob6dXSJDi9RHeMkwF_QYroZFLPh0D7iiXYLrItxfDmQn_2o.KfCUilHVMrhns 2YNAn6gLiwDAPgWHacfmZBCYQi8BCNWhmn1AdHSHJimG36QRaZvBwCgZpmaVcwkO0vgZJVcGPV0u jzFJ9PSR9MRR8de30jc8cP5wkaZg4kfcqIl_s8luzvKwFgvbxhZ7_MHQU1W6ZURioMqdPd8s02gP _.w0Qn1fb97d0ij5yK4mNVhAj6qt6auB9A1WXUrMWHX10DL7dssrFfa4rmkLZ8btgdRYhR_wPoE4 .YBQXqaMQP2USgQst59vDX72xh5ORdsX1WRJb2AYxG2Bjfrip4pgU_km7WewyERvna5yyfFfsGqE KgN8r_miB3ar6Lw3XS3mOzjrU4G59x1Yga1m8WkPJfazsVtWMpzYbyzmX1lbJxjFZSsyq2b6G70c yMCXLgkK3WgjknW4q7S2m84RLU90joEIdc47WjmQtcDE7RCsHhKQ5eisg5tviPfFeZp7qnqXuCF3 B4EAHPn6Ax6ajv5OZnyiFayLHKNbe3Hg9ZMu1zGdJ2x05WA9767vadg.uw8ouxjHFqp0BY3Ce7b9 7VKfc2tGbCLSwDIG4MovM43P6f.KyGwHU1p2vQF2R6UKYAekoUanYTqAm5O1WT1vAT5Y3ae9L0DB cFrCDT2qTHGH9W0_Lx0UUes7GmiIvClbcDVRoMjdtp32cZqTFsTo6gfsOROT6REY7rFymaHPwuET rRr87lS9ubHoLhBMhwrTrmAXm.tz45O6ZufvdP9VudH9cpKgjCD.E54pt9KJRJYxJaQEoaQr1bY0 xz6GDltLsfRzF0e1.BcryIjO4YiEu0RflCVYHYbm2A0nQPcQn5yUL0zzxViZRZTs9bZOglQfA7Im MHF1mcr_BJ_JqCa4NJa7y9aRMr0E0edg93dl1JxMKBntUes7AezlLqmQ8ihGzpFe_kK.Q8d.FDGv fAjuyaSfYwDIqWBl7MSEvIeYq0J6wxja5ZQmxDm4iyaIZMJnn2Fmt6iJp2f.qE9IRewNhYj9E6Vz q3Ihq6PAfnX5.gqfYtXDkHRwLR2lKSNjy4jxooAtm_SNc1_LaUsjZnuq0ClGIMlwOPbG9y109pJr d5cn9qGKrlvrWmPH0IPGEr5SCeH6nNCPDPvqCZiaWBhgGZI7WabxDSxBQG7VsFH7xyQ395h1ZwGf svbDDgxkoer1HuM6R6Q7PnT_LwEWkIcupbklnc_N_CMDLfphOTC.WX_69pD0PUjCShZyeTM_eITa xGD586nKOJP8C8H9pKI5duoONSlKUjlOEv7p0SpdwHyoE7PuvRp.jscPqbl7z9H0Rz1hjkOzIxXw 9YsaCQQcZ3wrYuiUzjKhXTmGwt4K9ha4QZI8WO7IjNMSRDWmeX8z_vUqUynWOa6sN_6MaEA1c6Ww eN6zFtaQhnBpAzr1DDIiyAYAWuYCMKru6br1EzJr.el6fSQx7uTM3RLuWRRi5iNz..oThwzRjJ8A NuDJBbAZANcL5tqsMcmiZ8pMeVP7ONHSwOud8xX50KoZ0zMCM0Jmf Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic306.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 12:49:22 +0000 Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2021 12:49:21 +0000 (UTC) From: DAVID MASSEY To: "fishplate@gmail.com" , "jniolon@att.net" References: <1UZ4YZ76KH.7AHYM3yYtnG.ref@johns-desktop> <1UZ4YZ76KH.7AHYM3yYtnG@johns-desktop> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problems with truck Cc: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3388567922725846693== boundary="----=_Part_71498_933446830.1628254161955" ------=_Part_71498_933446830.1628254161955 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I was thinking a dirty battery clamp. =20 Dave=20 =20 =20 -----Original Message----- From: Jeff Scarbrough To: john niolon Cc: shop-talk Sent: Fri, Aug 6, 2021 4:18 am Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problems with truck When it died, did any of the electrical items still work?=C2=A0 Lights, etc= .? My suspicion based on reading this at 5:00 AM is an intermittent short in the battery itself.=C2=A0 Regular lead-acid battery? Jeff Scarbrough Corrosion Acres, Ga. On Fri, Aug 6, 2021 at 12:07 AM john niolon wrote: > > Took the truck (53 ford f-100) out for a drive yesterday=E2=80=A6first ti= me since the Grand Nationals (I=E2=80=99ve been busy) Ran great for about 3= 0 minutes with a couple of stops during the ride=E2=80=A6 each time it star= ted right and showed no problems. Electric fan and a/c running the whole ti= me As I pulled out of one business and headed home the truck stumbled and d= ied..almost like it was out of gas=E2=80=A6 ( had over a half a tank) I pul= led into a business and tried to start it and all I got was a =E2=80=98clic= k=E2=80=9D. Dash Volt meter read about 11 volts with switch on and dropped = to zero when hitting the starter. Waited about 10 minutes and it started ri= ght up=E2=80=A6 got it home, shut it off and same thing =E2=80=9Cclick=E2= =80=9D. > > Battery has been on a battery tender full time since May and showed 13.7 = volts on VOM connected to the battery before the ride. > > Battery is 2 years old Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA =E2=80=A6 > > Davis DUI ignition (which could have quit when battery voltage got low) > > All cables are new with 1/0 welding cable for starting circuit and batter= y ground to frame > engine to frame, frame to cab and frame to bed are all #4 wire to bare me= tal connection points with dialectic grease. > > At first glance...when running,=C2=A0 the volt meter on dash shows over 1= 3 volts so I think alternator is good > > did a load test with a H.F. (100 amp) load tester showed battery dropping= to 10 volts during 10 second load... recovered to 12. > > Put truck up on stands and dropped battery (under cab)=C2=A0 checked all = cables and connections from battery to starter including solenoid and groun= d connections. > all tight, no corrosion on terminals and=C2=A0 cells full.=C2=A0 this tru= ck finished last year and everything is new.=C2=A0 Starter solenoid is a Co= le-Hersee 200 amp continuous draw solenoid. > > Starter is new last year and 6-7 inches away and below headers so heat so= ak isn't causing the problem > > Set it back down and charged it for 30 minutes at 10 amps... battery show= ed 12.9 volts..=C2=A0 started ok and put meter on alternator > terminals... alternator putting out 14.5 - 14.8 volts...=C2=A0 varies a l= ittle with engine speed.... so alternator is good I think. > >=C2=A0 I did a load test again.,.. idle voltage reading 12.9 volts on two = different fluke meters... and during the load test it dropped to 12.3 then = recovered to 12.7...so I'm assuming the battery is good, it was just low be= fore the first load test. > > here's an odd thing.. I have a 12 volt terminal on the right frame rail t= hat powers the elec radiator fan, tilt hood motors and trinary switch > > with the a/c on, headlights on and elec radiator fan running (as much loa= d as I can put on it)... the alternator o/p at 14.5 volts, the voltage at t= he terminal on rail reads 11.5 volts.=C2=A0 The terminal is 4' from battery= and fed with #4 stranded wire. > > that's about all the detail I can give you... any ideas why it stalled an= d quit..???=C2=A0 and why the terminal point only reads 11.5 versus the 14.= 5 at the alternator. > > I'm at the wall > > thanks > john > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation=C2=A0 $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/ar= chive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishp= late@gmail.com > _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive ssey@cs.com ------=_Part_71498_933446830.1628254161955 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I was thinking a dirty battery clamp.

Dave



-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Scarbrough <fishplate@gmail.com>
To: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
Cc: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: Fri, Aug 6, 2021 4:18 am
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problems with truck

When it died, did any of the electrical items still work?&= nbsp; Lights, etc.?

My suspicion based= on reading this at 5:00 AM is an intermittent short
in t= he battery itself.  Regular lead-acid battery?

Jeff Scarbrough
Corrosion Acres, Ga.

On Fri, Aug 6, 2021 at 12:07 AM john niolon = <jniolon@att.net> wrote:
>
> Took the truck (53 ford f-100) out for a drive yesterday=E2= =80=A6first time since the Grand Nationals (I=E2=80=99ve been busy) Ran gre= at for about 30 minutes with a couple of stops during the ride=E2=80=A6 eac= h time it started right and showed no problems. Electric fan and a/c runnin= g the whole time As I pulled out of one business and headed home the truck = stumbled and died..almost like it was out of gas=E2=80=A6 ( had over a half= a tank) I pulled into a business and tried to start it and all I got was a= =E2=80=98click=E2=80=9D. Dash Volt meter read about 11 volts with switch o= n and dropped to zero when hitting the starter. Waited about 10 minutes and= it started right up=E2=80=A6 got it home, shut it off and same thing =E2= =80=9Cclick=E2=80=9D.
>
> Battery= has been on a battery tender full time since May and showed 13.7 volts on = VOM connected to the battery before the ride.
>
> Battery is 2 years old Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA =E2=80=A6<= br clear=3D"none">>
> Davis DUI ignition (which cou= ld have quit when battery voltage got low)
>
> All cables are new with 1/0 welding cable for starting circu= it and battery ground to frame
> engine to frame, fram= e to cab and frame to bed are all #4 wire to bare metal connection points w= ith dialectic grease.
>
> At firs= t glance...when running,  the volt meter on dash shows over 13 volts s= o I think alternator is good
>
> = did a load test with a H.F. (100 amp) load tester showed battery dropping t= o 10 volts during 10 second load... recovered to 12.
>=
> Put truck up on stands and dropped battery (under c= ab)  checked all cables and connections from battery to starter includ= ing solenoid and ground connections.
> all tight, no c= orrosion on terminals and  cells full.  this truck finished last = year and everything is new.  Starter solenoid is a Cole-Hersee 200 amp= continuous draw solenoid.
>
> St= arter is new last year and 6-7 inches away and below headers so heat soak i= sn't causing the problem
>
> Set = it back down and charged it for 30 minutes at 10 amps... battery showed 12.= 9 volts..  started ok and put meter on alternator
&g= t; terminals... alternator putting out 14.5 - 14.8 volts...  varies a = little with engine speed.... so alternator is good I think.
>
>  I did a load test again.,.. idle volta= ge reading 12.9 volts on two different fluke meters... and during the load = test it dropped to 12.3 then recovered to 12.7...so I'm assuming the batter= y is good, it was just low before the first load test.
&g= t;
> here's an odd thing.. I have a 12 volt terminal o= n the right frame rail that powers the elec radiator fan, tilt hood motors = and trinary switch
>
> with the a= /c on, headlights on and elec radiator fan running (as much load as I can p= ut on it)... the alternator o/p at 14.5 volts, the voltage at the terminal = on rail reads 11.5 volts.  The terminal is 4' from battery and fed wit= h #4 stranded wire.
>
> that's ab= out all the detail I can give you... any ideas why it stalled and quit..???=   and why the terminal point only reads 11.5 versus the 14.5 at the a= lternator.
>
> I'm at the wall>
> thanks
> j= ohn
> _______________________________________________<= br clear=3D"none">>
> S= hop-talk@autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.tea= m.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation = ; $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipe= rmail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>= ;
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate@gmail.com=

>
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.ne= t
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archi= ve: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team= .net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: <= a shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/da= ve1massey@cs.com" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/s= hop-talk/dave1massey@cs.com

------=_Part_71498_933446830.1628254161955-- --===============3388567922725846693== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============3388567922725846693==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Aug 6 06:52:56 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B95A6A1115 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 06:52:56 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ot1-f46.google.com (unknown [209.85.210.46]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68102A0E8A for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 06:49:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-ot1-f46.google.com with SMTP id a5-20020a05683012c5b029036edcf8f9a6so8786950otq.3 for ; Fri, 06 Aug 2021 05:49:27 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=wmwNrgsnDRgNv46Nw2O6f2nYajYMzODoCOjqVWxYHHE=; b=J+ynNGr1iF4aUOVMcVSCDhDhzmkbBlbRnUKztv7Y8XUSQIaKsgXOAZKwb7GOHDRI1y /T0NlePM1X10aDNNgRgBPOFUECPQqdwhwMH0LEPxcXYAnvZY5WFcDNoWVehqN17HAH4d +uCC2YF2v9jESck15MbEIDkgBGeS04m0El/tQKueOajE5HoIttulwU6qzY3hiQZlruUi 3ETI05Ih1aVi+KbvJX4v+YgkZMG0XQvB82dp2puU6lpO0wWIY6bn2OyVZpS4cbLKWJig 3gWUeqCKXmAJPS3PUxMuAVMq2QPoRbJLB5tZsVzLxhM97AowCF6eCDZs3Tpg2P5beKdu 8eXw== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=wmwNrgsnDRgNv46Nw2O6f2nYajYMzODoCOjqVWxYHHE=; b=PFGNRYMLaCavOwzqUH3EkPHI8XqTikhiBHR6VohwOSICyYoBMuJrwuebikXiKHdv4t 6Obs5sJEMMbnV8Sr+09pD6GzcTuyOGftnoYfLEjGdC+7/3MxCyp8K93VaY30D763nbue tJi/jE7jyEHiBWDTVNZ9b5bsRDACqLq93h77n0mOYerOQul7CF6UL3kNeMOV/J2sRLXQ 2vr01vxFJc5CmnOIQHF3z5pbo0c94ax3CfHUaozrnGXlo33LfYnXPxq4eQa2GKHJWHkB ytwYiIHnNJ2ZQQPylCFOX0hfFN375lBKmTxktORrFjUyE2S0+fwHFV8UwTkgHESb/mK9 DjSw== Zi7vfCeg+cP1vSPASooyrXY+td3TGtzQtImhTUw= f14mr7318989otp.238.1628254166918; Fri, 06 Aug 2021 05:49:26 -0700 (PDT) References: <1UZ4YZ76KH.7AHYM3yYtnG.ref@johns-desktop> <1UZ4YZ76KH.7AHYM3yYtnG@johns-desktop> From: John Innis Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2021 07:49:15 -0500 To: john niolon Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problems with truck Cc: shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3630685227817797889== --000000000000392ab505c8e37708 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This sounds like a bad/intermittent ground. We had very similar issues on a friends car and eventually trace it to the engine to frame ground strap. The strap was loose and when it rattled just right there was a large voltage drop and stuff stopped working. But when we checked voltage, everything seemed fine. How is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to the motor? On Thu, Aug 5, 2021 at 11:07 PM john niolon wrote: > Took the truck (53 ford f-100) out for a drive yesterday=E2=80=A6first ti= me since > the Grand Nationals (I=E2=80=99ve been busy) Ran great for about 30 minut= es with a > couple of stops during the ride=E2=80=A6 each time it started right and s= howed no > problems. Electric fan and a/c running the whole time As I pulled out of > one business and headed home the truck stumbled and died..almost like it > was out of gas=E2=80=A6 ( had over a half a tank) I pulled into a busines= s and > tried to start it and all I got was a =E2=80=98click=E2=80=9D. Dash Volt = meter read about > 11 volts with switch on and dropped to zero when hitting the starter. > Waited about 10 minutes and it started right up=E2=80=A6 got it home, shu= t it off > and same thing =E2=80=9Cclick=E2=80=9D. > > Battery has been on a battery tender full time since May and showed 13.7 > volts on VOM connected to the battery before the ride. > > Battery is 2 years old Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA =E2=80=A6 > > Davis DUI ignition (which could have quit when battery voltage got low) > > All cables are new with 1/0 welding cable for starting circuit and batter= y > ground to frame > engine to frame, frame to cab and frame to bed are all #4 wire to bare > metal connection points with dialectic grease. > > At first glance...when running, the volt meter on dash shows over 13 > volts so I think alternator is good > > did a load test with a H.F. (100 amp) load tester showed battery dropping > to 10 volts during 10 second load... recovered to 12. > > Put truck up on stands and dropped battery (under cab) checked all cable= s > and connections from battery to starter including solenoid and ground > connections. > all tight, no corrosion on terminals and cells full. this truck > finished last year and everything is new. Starter solenoid is > a Cole-Hersee 200 amp continuous draw solenoid. > > Starter is new last year and 6-7 inches away and below headers so heat > soak isn't causing the problem > > Set it back down and charged it for 30 minutes at 10 amps... battery > showed 12.9 volts.. started ok and put meter on alternator > terminals... alternator putting out 14.5 - 14.8 volts... varies a little > with engine speed.... so alternator is good I think. > > I did a load test again.,.. idle voltage reading 12.9 volts on two > different fluke meters... and during the load test it dropped to 12.3 the= n > recovered to 12.7...so I'm assuming the battery is good, it was just low > before the first load test. > > here's an odd thing.. I have a 12 volt terminal on the right frame rail > that powers the elec radiator fan, tilt hood motors and trinary switch > > with the a/c on, headlights on and elec radiator fan running (as much loa= d > as I can put on it)... the alternator o/p at 14.5 volts, the voltage at t= he > terminal on rail reads 11.5 volts. The terminal is 4' from battery and f= ed > with #4 stranded wire. > > that's about all the detail I can give you... any ideas why it stalled an= d > quit..??? and why the terminal point only reads 11.5 versus the 14.5 at > the alternator. > > I'm at the wall > > thanks > john > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis@gmail.com > > --=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D Never offend people with style when you =3D =3D can offend with substance --- Sam Brown =3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D --000000000000392ab505c8e37708 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This sounds like a bad/intermittent ground.=C2=A0 We had v= ery similar issues on a friends car and eventually trace it to the engine t= o frame ground strap.=C2=A0 The strap was loose and when it rattled just ri= ght there was a large voltage drop and stuff stopped working.=C2=A0 But whe= n we checked voltage, everything seemed fine.=C2=A0 How is the volt meter i= n your truck grounded, to the frame or to the motor?

On Thu, Aug 5, 2021= at 11:07 PM john niolon <jniolon@att= .net> wrote:
Took= the truck (53 ford f-100)=C2=A0out for a drive yesterday=E2=80=A6first tim= e since the Grand Nationals (I=E2=80=99ve been busy) Ran great for about 30= minutes with a couple of stops during the ride=E2=80=A6 each time it start= ed right and showed no problems. Electric fan and a/c running the whole tim= e As I pulled out of one business and headed home the truck stumbled and di= ed..almost like it was out of gas=E2=80=A6 ( had over a half a tank) I pull= ed into a business and tried to start it and all I got was a =E2=80=98click= =E2=80=9D. Dash Volt meter read about 11 volts with switch on and dropped t= o zero when hitting the starter. Waited about 10 minutes and it started rig= ht up=E2=80=A6 got it home, shut it off and same thing =E2=80=9Cclick=E2=80= =9D.

Battery has been on a batter= y tender full time since May and showed 13.7 volts on VOM connected to the = battery before the ride.

Battery = is 2 years old Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA =E2=80=A6=C2=A0

Davis DUI ignition (which could have quit when batt= ery voltage got low)

All cables a= re new with 1/0 welding cable for starting circuit and battery ground to fr= ame
engi= ne to frame, frame to cab and frame to bed are all #4 wire to bare metal co= nnection points with dialectic grease.

At first glance...when running, =C2=A0the volt meter on dash shows ov= er 13 volts so I think alternator is good
=C2=A0
did a load te= st with a H.F. (100 amp)=C2=A0load tester showed battery dropping to 10 vol= ts during 10 second load... recovered to 12.=C2=A0
=C2=A0
Put truc= k up on stands and dropped battery (under cab)=C2=A0 checked all cables and= connections=C2=A0from battery to starter including solenoid and ground con= nections.
all = tight, no corrosion on terminals and=C2=A0 cells full.=C2=A0 this truck finis= hed last year and everything is new.=C2=A0 Starter solenoid is a=C2=A0Cole-= Hersee 200 amp continuous draw solenoid.
=C2=A0
Star= ter is new last year and 6-7 inches away and below headers so heat soak isn= 't causing the problem
=C2=A0
Set = it back down and charged it for 30 minutes at 10 amps... battery showed 12.= 9 volts..=C2=A0 started ok and put meter on alternator
term= inals... alternator putting out 14.5 - 14.8 volts...=C2=A0 varies a=C2=A0li= ttle with engine speed....=C2=A0so alternator is good I think.
=C2=A0
=C2=A0<= /span>I did a load test again.,.. idle voltage reading 12.9 volts on two di= fferent fluke=C2=A0meters... and during the load test it dropped to 12.3 th= en recovered to 12.7...so I'm assuming the battery is good, it was just= low before the first load test.
=C2=A0
here= 's an odd thing.. I have a 12 volt terminal on the right frame rail tha= t powers the elec radiator fan, tilt hood motors and trinary switch<= /div>
=C2=A0
with= the a/c on, headlights on and elec=C2=A0radiator fan running (as much load= as I can put on it)...=C2=A0the alternator o/p at 14.5 volts, the voltage = at the terminal on rail reads 11.5 volts.=C2=A0 The terminal is 4' from= battery and fed with #4 stranded wire.
=C2=A0
that= 's about all the detail I can give you... any ideas why it stalled and = quit..???=C2=A0=C2=A0 and why the terminal point only reads 11.5 versus the= 14.5 at the alternator.
=C2=A0
I= 9;m at the wall
=C2=A0
than= ks
john=
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

alk/jdinnis@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.te= am.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis@gmail.com



--
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D Never offend people with = style when you=C2=A0=C2=A0 =3D
=3D can offend with substance --- Sam Bro= wn=C2=A0 =3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
--000000000000392ab505c8e37708-- --===============3630685227817797889== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============3630685227817797889==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Aug 6 06:54:31 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E508A112F for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 06:54:31 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ms11p00im-qufo17291401.me.com (unknown [17.58.38.43]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47D8BA0F6F for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 06:50:28 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1628254229; bh=/YHCeb9ZEGLgAHjasDB03gFSPPcbJAEfTAx0oBOQXns=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Date:Subject:Message-Id:To; b=JkghsnrD78VaBD1UqAFXZjbihvw5CxR8/NI8jH+E4SaJ+SSAzRzpDbaphhjmT/RW5 2Wai/sdQHJ44ABjY5LNBWFJCUphu0ohYsFizH2orIk4sViugZOJqpjtOXp7a6alLOZ 8yuU1PJpg794Ai4Am9oiVdLmvmFpHb8FPui4uZERNxihw5XjS+xOACEIf1ooWeMiuh LsxivRHTiheLogdG8bQD1HLFDT12v9pgXJwuFtmpJ/hYuXuCUyDbucH3ZNVQSccCbq poeVYcoQbEFGHkjGOH3Lt21BnKn9LxyK/YgINyvdudgzYpUnJ0FNIPf3WFt/X7XZ3t 4aEYl8kRZvpiQ== Received: from [192.168.88.248] (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by ms11p00im-qufo17291401.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 75BFF760365; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 12:50:28 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2021 07:50:26 -0500 To: john niolon =?UTF-8?Q?2903e8d5c8f:6.0.391,18.0.790,17.0.607.475.0000000_definitions?= =?UTF-8?Q?=3D2021-08-06=5F04:2021-08-05=5F02,2021-08-06=5F04,2020-04-07?= =?UTF-8?Q?=5F01_signatures=3D0?= suspectscore=0 adultscore=0 malwarescore=0 clxscore=1011 mlxlogscore=448 spamscore=0 bulkscore=0 phishscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2108060090 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problems with truck Cc: shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sm9obiwgd2hhdCBpcyB0aGUgcmVsYXRpb25zaGlwIGJldHdlZW4gdGhlIGZyYW1lIHRlcm1pbmFs ICYgdGhlIHJlc3Qgb2YgdGhlIGVsZWN0cmljYWwgc3lzdGVtPyBJcyBpdCBhIGRlZGljYXRlZCBj b25uZWN0aW9uIHRvIHRoZSBiYXR0ZXJ5IG9yIGlzIGl0IGEgdGFwIGludG8gdGhlIHJlc3Qgb2Yg dGhlIGVsZWN0cmljYWwgc3lzdGVtPwoKSWYgaXTigJlzIGRlZGljYXRlZCwgSeKAmWQgbG9vayBA IHRoZSBwb3NzaWJpbGl0eSB0aGF0IHRoZSBiYXR0ZXJ5IGlzIGRpc2NoYXJnZWQgYW5kL29yIHRo ZSBjaGFuZ2luZyBzeXN0ZW0gaXMgbm90IHdvcmtpbmcgY29ycmVjdGx5LiBIYXZlIHRoZSBiYXR0 ZXJ5IGNoZWNrZWQuIAoKSWYgaXTigJlzIG5vdCwgSSBzdXNwZWN0IGVpdGhlciBhbiB1bmRlcnNp emVkIHdpcmUgb3IgYSBiYWQgY29ubmVjdGlvbi4gCgpZb3UgZG9u4oCZdCBtZW50aW9uIGFueSBm dXNlcyBpbiB0aGVzZSBjaXJjdWl0cy4gQ2hlY2sgdm9sdGFnZSBAIHRoZSBmdXNlcyBib3RoIHRv IGdldCBtb3JlIGRhdGEgJiBjaGVjayBmb3Igdm9sdGFnZSBkcm9wcy4gCgpQZWFjZSwKUGF0CgpQ YXQgSG9ybmUgCldlIHN1cHBvcnQgSGFiaXRhdCBmb3IgSHVtYW5pdHkKCgpPbiBBdWcgNSwgMjAy MSwgYXQgMTE6MDcgUE0sIGpvaG4gbmlvbG9uIDxqbmlvbG9uQGF0dC5uZXQ+IHdyb3RlOgoKX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18KClNob3AtdGFsa0Bh dXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldApEb25hdGU6IGh0dHA6Ly93d3cudGVhbS5uZXQvZG9uYXRlLmh0bWwKU3Vn Z2VzdGVkIGFubnVhbCBkb25hdGlvbiAgJDEyLjk2CkFyY2hpdmU6IGh0dHA6Ly93d3cudGVhbS5u ZXQvcGlwZXJtYWlsL3Nob3AtdGFsayBodHRwOi8vYXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQvYXJjaGl2ZQoKVW5z dWJzY3JpYmUvTWFuYWdlOiBodHRwOi8vYXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQvbWFpbG1hbi9vcHRpb25zL3No b3AtdGFsay9taGFyY0BhdXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldAoK From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Aug 6 07:31:03 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F24FA1097 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 07:31:03 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from chumdrop.sackheads.org (unknown [159.203.76.21]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0AC21A0BDD for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 07:18:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chumdrop.sackheads.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 88DBE14F1FF for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 09:18:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from chumdrop.sackheads.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (chumdrop.sackheads.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id l04dEk3Xs30h for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 09:18:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (cpe-96-28-86-122.kya.res.rr.com [96.28.86.122]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jimmie@sackheads.org) by chumdrop.sackheads.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 59AEE14F1ED for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 09:18:12 -0400 (EDT) To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <1UZ4YZ76KH.7AHYM3yYtnG.ref@johns-desktop> <1UZ4YZ76KH.7AHYM3yYtnG@johns-desktop> From: Jimmie Mayfield Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2021 09:18:11 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.12.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problems with truck Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============4260351639220695554== boundary="------------3A7AA7FE80AE2B2F2ECC648D" Content-Language: en-US This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------3A7AA7FE80AE2B2F2ECC648D Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit On 8/5/21 10:33, john niolon wrote: > with the a/c on, headlights on and elec radiator fan running (as much > load as I can put on it)... the alternator o/p at 14.5 volts, the > voltage at the terminal on rail reads 11.5 volts.  The terminal is 4' > from battery and fed with #4 stranded wire. I think this might be the smoking gun.  The voltage you're seeing at that terminal with the engine 'on' is roughly what I would expect to see if you were powering things only with your battery.  But let's check some things before I jump to conclusions... 1. Double-check the electrical path between this terminal and the battery/alternator to make sure there's no corrosion that might increase resistance. 2. What's the voltage at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off' ? 3. How big is the alternator?  Do you know offhand what its rated output is at various engine RPMs (some aftermarket manufacturers provide this info).  Sometimes folks with big audio systems will run into dead-battery problems after installing a high-output alternator because the new alternator's 'preferred' RPMs don't match up with the owner's typical driving style. -- J --------------3A7AA7FE80AE2B2F2ECC648D Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
On 8/5/21 10:33, john niolon wrote:
with the a/c on, headlights on and elec radiator fan running (as much load as I can put on it)... the alternator o/p at 14.5 volts, the voltage at the terminal on rail reads 11.5 volts.  The terminal is 4' from battery and fed with #4 stranded wire.

I think this might be the smoking gun.  The voltage you're seeing at that terminal with the engine 'on' is roughly what I would expect to see if you were powering things only with your battery.  But let's check some things before I jump to conclusions...

1. Double-check the electrical path between this terminal and the battery/alternator to make sure there's no corrosion that might increase resistance.

2. What's the voltage at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off' ?

3. How big is the alternator?  Do you know offhand what its rated output is at various engine RPMs (some aftermarket manufacturers provide this info).  Sometimes folks with big audio systems will run into dead-battery problems after installing a high-output alternator because the new alternator's 'preferred' RPMs don't match up with the owner's typical driving style.

-- J



--------------3A7AA7FE80AE2B2F2ECC648D-- --===============4260351639220695554== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============4260351639220695554==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Aug 6 07:58:55 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E42FAA11C5 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 07:58:55 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic310-23.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (unknown [98.137.69.149]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2869DA0D9B for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 07:58:17 -0600 (MDT) t=1628258297; bh=bvvxlaTTQNisHW/OEWuzKBQLMMxVfBWZYaoXDUM/FcA=; h=Date:From:To:Subject:References:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=PSngfR6dOjvq4Azg4sZJtVrfOADc0Bs6+Ckij6wZxnOFSnAoBQMt/Bm8D/f/Lmm9meeoIWFa1lB2N0ahVND4xYbFA++mdmH7x4Sd+t9YsYgezI0jPh7apKYxo+MPg9xB9UwKibBOsFTuDFMXbTmhPwMmHiOzUg5oIqTRzvtc7A8= t=1628258297; bh=770DBC5A0lnn3cVe+1GafLOOKoweaMAwSb1XGDs34Yi=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Date:From:To:Subject:From:Subject; b=mieSXcvXLD9ehTD6O3AeRP/XLaew6vVy7ENq2pAlENiDMPg8ZLu0YBJ/ZYsbu+Dq+fK6LQk55AKmctcPZiK6bbd2Mp+6NDETA3auUjJIx4pixFmSonfXRTMxFyb5UWqjjNfcVW75mU54uCDMg1fDraByWYJF/h3YpnhitC3ouPvYW3GS0tVyaazj2j8NNAQtchLItu7uEhJumyuVxdzggL7fwSpwcJoSOkTofPgMNY326/0BM1YL3DXB8R6cGVExyvdtsw/ECIlZo/8nhbwohEMrILuFjCYmAvRn0qD8zalcICfwWBCVvOkmpYYt9kxfyEJv9eoOYQzbFcsWco5Iyw== ZrGNz0u3tNc1FDPdcZ_8pwuvv4flKePlVXQhBHIQBqkP623QloBvuDmeiVbMn_SlneYg8qAyJQAi wiC2TCqDUBtbbgGKriyD3zrPHjs6sEyyY_1C1q5uLCdMwV92HVnXyjkilWuZxxAScmExyCaDfyRW TkC.diUcmHuTOwcrZe.RuGBJPWMPNWS17DVVLVjS.m6bc16Sphpnz5PVWhZWpCEBZGPyBnXZA0z4 Df29zCXhUZ2yyVqHargRCTJLMN1xo8I.oYoQ6Sv76CviuKQEpQBmSkVNwVzKKAl.0V932uaeR4LX cHxxCDj4iJiJPMdXiBIekcCRWsJ_AYuA.P.KImc9hD_D_gWnJkXMKyKhymUndp1UnfGv.vj3ezjT 56GKadP5qipl1_H2EqAYSyQpFx5jSog1dIRZXTRR0UmI0pvxplj6dCobaG1PtkJPz1.Xje5pEoJv QNRFxpfLwE2296..aIk7n9U8egl39yB.8PeWheSiiDnst95aqx4MYlfvB1lETdztp.pm6j3EcSqF 7vKl1TthOTn0ym1SOt7Od3HFBpbyEku5GwbzZt1Uj5Ydcu.7e9W37qFNzpBHtU.645iqzCErozjg Y8UNxNfBaEN8iDEDI.c_F66gl4kex4ISWbWXXAWOMUv6zZiVJkfU2HUcIebMs6K80Ux8Mv98r9Qs r5O_01rUsAvepSUu5WhhBWtdNIxt4_CPhq7rsl6szjR2pvCmJQytuVwOKtWBBTGaGoY4WvcNIdyk W9u4amZ5vAYCkFL._4kOs9jzMnNc62VycEzgxNB2FX.vCgWgeZ42dyQ9uQcekYIQ0fp7UlCatEKh hzlbk3rhxUtvGZ2PPvBbmKqCH6_4Ii37cqhVUL93WN2S3CdC_oJiyvSn2EfP4FsIWtxLv0_N.2vS OLlmQi9PST0JgeQMxrHTjtCMjTL_3J7xMmNO9IwNLwPoAgoGiPg9Z_nI88PB2XfYSe7IFg9kxsKR Fs0NM81t8RvFJkmair07eHf1Jt54rUYyoEFDzShk0Ia_J_..6GZWZFugPhFn3_3XlkkrwlvJfzID mc9R1bY9_YQLkGLaHHSwnpq1puPtJSxULPgGtAccihaUh9X9c5enQb9MBZhxnCVqyYOYa39_lEPy 2TWqfAWDbm5T3c.tFLUaQ7gEjTNTiyN95GYGoZPa3Xufbb60hmAQb_AeMh0Bg7_o0yDHJHbnYqdK 96Co2F06Zc3dBUKmESYjzJp3HvqZW23fflCoGwX6qELJKdGLXAoj9sdGj2Z7YaWzJPGkVl.lzVmr JVjFnvfKqOLeBv4AilzW9I7cEW9dlwEF5bB5Q4DBR0cce85qwq4aMEGzFBQCdgtoIaTD0J__Y74D ENvBDJL7q.MTXd0sP6tzeLuEqE1YNfABZKO_Imv48uWtAGARoBDKqq1q4_ZyjM6pAqE.NEKCEJPH sY.7kCgjRsF5w0WrTEm0FDizHKxDp1QHfC2IKjcJQ6gO8aeAT.gbVUvCNo4gpjhA2meSvnsU.SGI rrWiXAktQiszds3EGsEavQzn_qI1xJC_bOeCQYoCAbSqMFkjAqgg67heFX6VCt2FKs.Qop8mdwRy Q65jM34PNDt4.hpvGjjnqWM6Nm2LNkrrg6PnrMjw4jO1e9jD5P39qbFZRDz4t97dfca3RYVv53dV 3REuwjfoniMQ8qxSJ8tBNsSEtpnkNKjd4YySk.wkEZhVKwi4NJe5JgTn9M8p_UBjAMwZI7QO3Ut2 jsvIbR7SgUrEGuEucMiWJq_4hmsy_n7kqIFhH9SYHmpxanALbB7MdujJSBXKDrx7HZco1r.ta_Du VZAaoWxcf8EosbumAhTvLVINLq3uDzHs35kVkQQmdbZuzPho688XGeVkrSLl7WWUyZaDCPRWU4e2 iUnEJOYVPWjlRX3ZBYeltQRBHt16WXBHOBa2mzh2jiRBAYlw67PXGY8DcyKScO8l1ZEOKQtBF5Cq lKfwC4UiWdLtGr9gCWg6LWeszmErrxFseHXnK0rM9uQYdE.qa1VQT4nOVN2etadGQnXUlNUpmwAd LEZazrJ0rQiMQthVpm_uc8UfxvsYOitQ9E6QmLDkWqlJN98HeQY0rsXck32rpHeloMKRVJ6cUDUI zPkzWvRLwLQFNRHsX3RzUBfE2M6Lu92YYeMvYMKjPSC.J3PlMCPrKFmR7uAjJRhAGGyY4lrZG3LL Q6zVqMmHSHDfKLbfXq1Y0CG9JrTsqc7Xy0X26ZqzoI49ngNOgjxnPYUzRLBrWbPIUyttSdQW7nhJ v1221WsWFMa7COMgqkcT2EDakI_6_iofqndwvW6.NFMifU2SH.mNcS1Tc5_j4CsjZGHCEzzMgOBQ 0UkXXrU1463bV1DLLZ39rm0WYzUzCgilHHjaP9Q.xLy1pKwLDMLqMY9Hcbv0- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic310.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 13:58:17 +0000 Received: by kubenode504.mail-prod1.omega.ne1.yahoo.com (VZM Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID b890a21452bd93be66d64b9561dd2e3b; Fri, 06 Aug 2021 13:58:15 +0000 (UTC) Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2021 08:58:12 -0500 From: "john niolon" To: "shop-talk" User-Agent: OEClassic/3.2 (Win10.19041; P; 2021-05-18) References: <1UZ4ZeHN5p.88LXRt04Wgj.ref@johns-desktop> mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format --===============2254681061549867677== This is a multi-part message in MIME format --rHNHSA6EAa=_6g6sVopybAmAaTZnF2jU1K Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline jeff=E2=80=A6. regular led acid battery ?? Everstart Maxx27 80= 0 CCA regular=20 Walmart battery When it died, did any of the electrical items still work? Lights, etc= =2E? when=20 it first occurred ,, when I tried to restart, .. starter just clicked = and I=20 remember the a/c fan still blowing Donald... How large is the cable from the alternator to the battery? = feed=20 from battery to alternator is #4 wire Dave... I was thinking a dirty battery clamp. battery clamps are ne= w this=20 year and clean, no corrosion on connections John... How is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame o= r to the=20 motor? voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash frame voltmeter used = to check=20 under hood is grounded to frame not engine. =20 I'll go back and check ground connections. Alternator has a ground ter= minal of it's=20 own...=20 it's #10 wire grounded to the frame and of course the alternator is gr= ounded through it's=20 mount. Pat... what is the relationship between the frame terminal & the rest= of the=20 electrical system? Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a=20 4' piece of #4 wire from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from th= e battery is connected to the solenoid. Jimmie.. What's=20 the voltage at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine= 'off' =20 hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6 I'll do that How big is the alternator? 100 amp single wire from CVF racing ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck and some I haven't thoug= ht of... =20 going back through my diagnostics and check connections too. I bough= t a 500=20 amp load tester yesterday and will put sufficient load on the battery.= Battery=20 is under the cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with the l= ow truck,=20 I have to raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thought battery woul= d be a=20 low maintenance item ...duh. so checking at a shop somewhere is a ve= ry large=20 pain. points I'm considering.... larger ground wires from frame to engine...= =2E alternator to frame and check resistance from solenoid lug to the = terminal on the frame... the saga continues thanks for all the replies and points to check... you guys are the b= est john --rHNHSA6EAa=_6g6sVopybAmAaTZnF2jU1K Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
jeff=E2=80=A6.     regular led acid battery ?= ?     Everstart Maxx27 800 C= CA  regular Walmart battery
 
When it died, did any of the electrical items still work?  L= ights, etc.?  when it first occurred ,, whe= n I tried to restart, .. starter just clicked and I remember the = a/c fan still blowing
 
 
Donald...  How large is the cable from= the alternator to the battery?   feed from battery to alternator is #4 wire
 
Dave... I was thinkin= g a dirty battery clamp.    battery clamps are n= ew this year and clean, no corrosion on connections
 
John...   H= ow is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to the mo= tor?    voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash fr= ame  voltmeter used to check under hood is grounded to frame not = engine.  I'll go back and check ground connections. Alternator ha= s a ground terminal of it's own... it's #10 wire grounded to the frame=  and of course the alternator is grounded through it's mount.
 
Pat...  what is the relationship betwe= en the frame terminal & the rest of the electrical system?  <= /FONT>Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of  #4 wire= from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connect= ed to the solenoid.
 
Jimmie..    What's the volta= ge at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off'    hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6=   I'll do that
 How big is the alternator?&nbs= p;   100 amp single wire from CVF racing
 
ya'll have given me lots to check and reche= ck and some I haven't thought of...   going back through my = diagnostics and check connections too.  I bought a 500 amp load t= ester yesterday and will put sufficient load on the battery.  Bat= tery is under the cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with = the low truck, I have to raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thoug= ht battery would be a low maintenance item ...duh.   so chec= king at a shop somewhere is a very large pain.
 
points I'm considering.... larger ground wi= res from frame to engine.... alternator to frame and check resistance = from solenoid lug to the terminal on the frame...   the saga= continues
 
thanks for all the replies and points to ch= eck...   you guys are the best
 
john
 
 --rHNHSA6EAa=_6g6sVopybAmAaTZnF2jU1K-- --===============2254681061549867677== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2254681061549867677==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Aug 6 16:28:13 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9C76A13AE for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 16:28:13 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-oo1-f43.google.com (unknown [209.85.161.43]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 84C19A1258 for ; Fri, 6 Aug 2021 16:20:23 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-oo1-f43.google.com with SMTP id y14-20020a4acb8e0000b029028595df5518so2015020ooq.6 for ; Fri, 06 Aug 2021 15:20:24 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=RnACTMbKu6yBq5mPagMHlllLXk2arPp+qc8/PXKgI/M=; b=rGxx5GR3+e20DA6xiEOlNX4jk7HoQrZZtuKcOCv68kX40UcYFV76zGMRSZyTMNTvEq LTToU7QMgmJgZO9r/b4Res2zL4ufW31RJK/963V6F0GsxnSyE0TbU+tbDZUYYFYrCSbH W7798XPRr7Q36nsZxwY5hqL5DRMSOMKvGpDIBSo59yjy/ojmEykVb5ukoEcIOb8Sxvb1 E4kbCri0m6PkNEakWM46PQwwvwu8ZFecryUKm34xR0lnVWGVzvwCsKSKuJzS1PZs8J1n T2y0mN/cWyj8ifIDRVb9VgT4naREX3ZqAVlrxyXYJP5/A0bR+YE2YOnoMR+JqVAxvTLH hUQA== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=RnACTMbKu6yBq5mPagMHlllLXk2arPp+qc8/PXKgI/M=; b=eFeukrUtn8bDMoNnoM/4uAXAvIR55/5d1Qj4I3KdKGE51fkWCMuJWW8g/gVg/lSo+h ZRsawSNyEIZdksDpjVho8UWkSfmpqUhDd8ueN95tVtEmNLypmeO9afw0wlnaQ6CuO7Cj BQPWOtNzMczy/fhbjsBaW8ZVF9GNR9bq4MNi5GYz70LkWqwCc9bbF9o+R3pFoMT+g2Lj L2SmhNeeeYG0zQyFoymlxUp2UV1wuxr09Lg3jOFPJREwvEZkbn4FhlY50FLtu7XQcfT3 2Hnx2B+ZGTM1i3CEVE2VxoNCT5rd6Q2WSuKRUW6McSZb2y5zgypXfldD1vluJnDqrZAk r1wQ== T0kMFRmWw6b2JhKAtgUTZzDt+fQz45aoEfftMbDZgKazgZ0= m10mr1307336ooj.77.1628288423978; Fri, 06 Aug 2021 15:20:23 -0700 (PDT) From: John Innis Date: Fri, 6 Aug 2021 17:20:13 -0500 To: shop-talk Subject: [Shop-talk] 99 Suburban, Fuel Pump lock ring (snap ring style) failure Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8672480635369735077== --0000000000001a6d8d05c8eb71cd I recently (like 4 weeks ago) replace the rusted out fuel tank on my '99 Suburban. I did the whole 9 yards, new tank, new pump, new straps, etc. But today, when I filled the tank, gas started gushing out from under the vehicle. Looking at the opt of the tank it appears that the snap-ring style fuel pump retainer has failed and the pump is pressed up out of the tank. Anyone know why this happened? Did I just get a crappy snap ring? Is there some other step I was supposed to take after installing the lock ring? I have to say, I don't think this is an improvement over the old rotating style lock rings. -- ================================= = Never offend people with style when you = = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown = ================================= --0000000000001a6d8d05c8eb71cd Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I recently (like 4 weeks ago) replace the rusted out fuel tank on my=20 '99 Suburban. I did the whole 9 yards, new tank, new pump, new straps,= =20 etc. But today, when I filled the tank, gas started gushing out from=20 under the vehicle. Looking at the opt of the tank it appears that the=20 snap-ring style fuel pump retainer has failed and the pump is pressed up out of the tank. Anyone know why this happened? Did I just get a=20 crappy snap ring? Is there some other step I was supposed to take after installing the lock ring? I have to say, I don't think this is an=20 improvement over the old rotating style lock rings.
--
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D Never offend people with sty= le when you=C2=A0=C2=A0 =3D
=3D can offend with substance --- Sam Brown= =C2=A0 =3D
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
--0000000000001a6d8d05c8eb71cd-- --===============8672480635369735077== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8672480635369735077==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 9 12:02:01 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EA0AA0DC6 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 12:02:01 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic313-23.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (unknown [98.137.65.86]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3083DA0FD1 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 11:55:55 -0600 (MDT) t=1628531755; bh=j9rpLbopBgKVDVasYTqobgaB9lW8N0Lzr1bAhlEe6qg=; h=References:Date:In-Reply-To:From:To:Subject:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=kG4mKeyRjW3kcTqHM25dbpOFW8aCDC+E7+uTssNpkW+AuPnbIU9MNmTQDvLVP6e0rPZjhYGtn0HuMMsbvgvv4ON4nOAsZg6rYpQ/1n5sK0QYhwzzhbHfjwZ9Wikkl3BoKnBqYH/BJAgR7jAeOKOLe0z1tRxU8Lu3CMabki5mAyE= t=1628531755; bh=fuvAn4ZLrOQj4gOmOCiXl8xx9oUnAiYnirr87jhfPmp=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Date:From:To:Subject:From:Subject; b=WSaDFUZ+9U9u6MuCBwzSo6ERZgMbbistiOVlUEQiIQ4PzY3rFu/iLzfmPfCg7pB8i2JjW/8vjKZBRHTAKEiidiBJcziUjpJZcDzICa2ECrljAY4HLPhHnZiZGC2E8hxy3WEqGnPja0r5kU87x5BePtrue5aAN7bUj12gSQKsMAymIlhCdL2igU5iqNvCjZSu8fvwo2AYGnq4B/3DOnqPkYqXR+CkRd4LRmHwp/wSDvP3GOWLI9glfEWM4RKXatdbjXacyxkjvWdgLXpuQEsqg31PAjS5e7z5yY7qHp6r8ehK0bsXMw/aO6fUbFxl35L+YBbxCveh+x5FgqgqeHT9Bw== M_R2qOAH2BMk2bDVWlwR7X1p1IwvFg6pEDVxXWBq0IC7hDO41i3RAJ66u5fUxwY7wOqXHAh2.ze8 AMZfKpNyuNewJoUHymRAo1QaSKqzgA8pWooltW6ZBIMjdcxCJDeta_7cvIl9Xxqf8I5Ml3Bjh.Ra 8BVPhYW4VOmkuxzGum9TNpsOnlgzegU7TvxihWKVs6QBJNbHP.jfY8R8y6UqEqy2aQTMqDKA7PtY 5CCP49CfQARk_V8eKRpiUQN2PciWXW.9OJrAv.BZrPVsN.r8djJgBHbJyCnKnn4PcPcwU0VfdOKo qsreognuNQltKYnNUfnnlh2jQ.lKqmOQCjO_t7sLt61_5.vRIATCeTr.r3SJfR_L_qOYOPf7GxOI c_5u.NcwtVhb4HEoB8zOJkP16N3J56bsAnvhKXz8PgIrm4rrz8z87eZ8FWOTDRWLQ3qj86BY3u1g g132ZJybFKvxyf_hI5DhJe8JeWXlpHdl61uslsPQkxV8suvjpW64ZkHdApGdxaUR4JVJuxinBSKo 61BsDd7FsV4Dkpwshu0emA1ppcIQ2.4YCjRk3QAp1Q0mAszrHVHcBNJ6ZmqMHsoTm47mnOl322ow LXLfRgRjLSvwKfYJdhVX8yTyBo2dgj4YH58w5XEJe0HdCiyaZ3MhK0OalXthfWNIEFE.h.n9rs5T PqK9rLBoBQSPWyc.sfpxyk5rXXNPllZIJgB0T8mk.WWqdl71SM0jreJ1.beIuAUVuaE3diBypCUz xnTlPCFpC3NxI2BPMilNhkDXGfo8HZDMCyYYSS73ZeGy8ZwNF42x6pZ7wmoiz49bNm7WTAPjm0vx vlyzluG0MRtJ5WzGKqIOLJxBGrYx7t._l4kbLE5tA9FUv1wams__v_Pv4eA0KNstsfJVkGV8KSpF v.HFCkj0ggwTX.rClb0l9gFkKZhUHtbH.080FAoFsk0N5Nk13m4yYzXcVNvXMdvA3SqVq1ZtdO3h P8marfYw4Dwfh5tEselaRwpZ0STrMjBuaA2QJkrcW3ZEJ1QcEzqe.Ggl.hUs7usPRTbMWZVzjxbE tLJ50CtFAYQft_wuE_FZQjQbaH_AmSSsGZnahxUfneDSCq0D_AZnBU2hxfn.q05hksUg0kY7T.rj zXTzAXsCgBeZ8a_3_LHQmtHhIPdWJXaptFjtr6J_wFoyeEiUZ986f09zItf6xpx0x4x.sXY8RK77 dKQJ5HxkbyrKfqtDACxLhxK3XAEgDHJaLiG0J1UWnPn4FDVUXwYNox1IKLnlb.AqovWlFIxLUY2L melI7ZLenzyb2olWKxjpqqqgsMpF26x0pcML3e98FJAIgU9yC57rQPBFGKvWzU7aMUMYB8GMEZbd mf4TwOjk9V7oXwwWi.YIbBWbVL8lWpoRW7YpZ9rWLMQKk3.qwBPUs4a_wOgGJq7JsVQ1wIWJcHnm oPQWDwjpKCuwa00HAmch1qvnsq_COetVh5cI5S.LkGWUfBY0d1GU6jwLn7nee7LE8IXQxKxBY..G NiPUqckdYEXvwGcRpXjk2vN1NK8uuCKrYkYKbDMyTua7mt4nEc3N_JLU_qO5AApt2afKDipdKEq2 pFgWnEMdjQR39tESTtmIp6Q3f7TP0c8JJPa2rsSxZF51iCK3xzkC5lkt4_F7aSjljUxE4aHSj9IR 27x2GuejrkdbQ25Tv5.J7JB._5MO7BYzSNDojT_VNXgiVJ.VgQgbL28WlJtIuCF4qI1H4vOvx2C0 Q6fYU7gXtrBpIzHFaWCftOW6yAVQJSbeHqXJ5df5_MhbILkguxf3ptBBvxhaxwelBEo4Vay27IGx zgw7h13q1_Uom.UaDiFihNCeTqRWlK.VH.6JTBeHkoAVlfPxJeg5GhFJj66kcJqt9n7q5BHpp.rl oiND5tdQ9eMsqpo7yeVx8_XNtlp.mlNOv0UKvW09v9oEalN0GXHT4c0GDbjM77anxNNqjX8DLGPK dxf58G_mzvfE.bxrR3.TvVEtF9blepJf1Rj3XLJIX_bym2gZ90x6cfuriJLDM2PbjWpdpAdgAeTZ psh3dOLnipcMPMGDLyQrusJRxmoQQQCVkT9d5i18GmWu4mhTiAf1LFwFjQIxt96S_rtijc06vDwq s0OBBgthvlFi19t7aIf6mCxlPRGQSRmdckwkbuQ_Ua1O74WYWyOXjRZq7mSnaFMpa9QVtcLARELC woS7yezivc4p0QLWT14fddgrFVx9moWANHUSR0YNdLfQzj_0AuDjFPSA9ICn1KMkiSlBFudWqTKx 09pR3en5BNAPss_Kbkw21e3i70.t.QExTyqdOllO_G.ukhs36tf_5IiJPEPWZzj3ad2m90zwN..f .n1EMrlfxDrK_FnbUZ3AmRsCq1mFezoHrLf69erUGNh6aov0y2puGu3CCoNdYwFtuiLD0IMlmwwN mWHTOe8E- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic313.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 17:55:55 +0000 Received: by kubenode535.mail-prod1.omega.gq1.yahoo.com (VZM Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 65859e2491be4eab41f2ba6a88d8e1c1; Mon, 09 Aug 2021 17:55:53 +0000 (UTC) References: <1UZ4ZeHN5p.88LXRt04Wgj.ref@johns-desktop> <1UZ4ZeHN5p.88LXRt04Wgj@johns-desktop> Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2021 12:55:51 -0500 From: "john niolon" To: "shop-talk" User-Agent: OEClassic/3.2 (Win10.19041; P; 2021-05-18) mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format --===============2225034903003288273== This is a multi-part message in MIME format --iuPdilL7EUf6iZMk6GD2I4N=_tu6xJfrvo Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline sorry for slow response... helping daughter and sil move...priorities!= !! Monday a.m. report fresh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle char= ger since=20 then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different mete= rs hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester, voltage reading same as VOM at 13.= 4 voltage at frame rail terminal also 13.4 battery has 800 CCA capacity started test... over 15 second test the battery slowly dropped to 320 = amps and=20 voltage read 10.8 (still in the green scale) stopped test at 15 seconds and two minutes later battery was back up t= o 12.7 next step will be check alternator output at battery and terminal poin= t ok... started truck... engine at 1200 rpm meter on alternator o/p- voltage is 14.6 meter on battery voltage is 13.5 hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....that don't sound right need to measure resistance of cable I guess... as an aside... checked voltaged between frame ground and the case of t= he=20 alternator... 0.0001 volts I also took battery back to Wal mart and Quintella checked it... batt= ery is=20 good based on her years of battery experience ----- Original Message ----- From: john niolon To: shop-talk Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck jeff=E2=80=A6. regular led acid battery ?? Everstart Maxx27 80= 0 CCA regular=20 Walmart battery When it died, did any of the electrical items still work? Lights, etc= =2E? when=20 it first occurred ,, when I tried to restart, .. starter just clicked = and I=20 remember the a/c fan still blowing Donald... How large is the cable from the alternator to the battery? = feed=20 from battery to alternator is #4 wire Dave... I was thinking a dirty battery clamp. battery clamps are ne= w this=20 year and clean, no corrosion on connections John... How is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame o= r to the=20 motor? voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash frame voltmeter used = to check=20 under hood is grounded to frame not engine. =20 I'll go back and check ground connections. Alternator has a ground ter= minal of it's=20 own...=20 it's #10 wire grounded to the frame and of course the alternator is gr= ounded through it's=20 mount. Pat... what is the relationship between the frame terminal & the rest= of the=20 electrical system? Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a=20 4' piece of #4 wire from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from th= e battery is connected to the solenoid. Jimmie.. What's=20 the voltage at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine= 'off' =20 hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6 I'll do that How big is the alternator? 100 amp single wire from CVF racing ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck and some I haven't thoug= ht of... =20 going back through my diagnostics and check connections too. I bough= t a 500=20 amp load tester yesterday and will put sufficient load on the battery.= Battery=20 is under the cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with the l= ow truck,=20 I have to raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thought battery woul= d be a=20 low maintenance item ...duh. so checking at a shop somewhere is a ve= ry large=20 pain. points I'm considering.... larger ground wires from frame to engine...= =2E alternator to frame and check resistance from solenoid lug to the = terminal on the frame... the saga continues thanks for all the replies and points to check... you guys are the b= est john --iuPdilL7EUf6iZMk6GD2I4N=_tu6xJfrvo Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
 
Monday a.m. report

fresh charge on b= attery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle charger since then ..= battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different meters

<= BR style=3D"BOX-SIZING: border-box">hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester= , voltage reading same as VOM at 13.4
voltage at frame rail terminal also 13.4

battery has 800 CCA ca= pacity
started test... over 15 sec= ond test the battery slowly dropped to 320 amps and voltage read 10.8 = (still in the green scale)
stopped= test at 15 seconds and two minutes later battery was back up to 12.7<= BR style=3D"BOX-SIZING: border-box">

3D""
3D=

next step will= be check alternator output at battery and terminal point

ok... sta= rted truck... engine at 1200 rpm
m= eter on alternator o/p- voltage is 14.6
meter on battery voltage is 13.5

hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' o= f 1/0 cable....that don't sound right
need to measure resistance of cable I guess...

as an aside... c= hecked voltaged between frame ground and the case of the alternator...= 0.0001 volts

I also took battery back to Wal mart and Quintella ch= ecked it...  battery is good based on her years of
battery experience
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
To: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM
Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
jeff=E2=80=A6.     regular led acid battery ?= ?     Everstart Maxx27 800 C= CA  regular Walmart battery
 
When it died, did any of the electrical items still work?  L= ights, etc.?  when it first occurred ,, whe= n I tried to restart, .. starter just clicked and I remember the = a/c fan still blowing
 
 
Donald...  How large is the cable from= the alternator to the battery?   feed from battery to alternator is #4 wire
 
Dave... I was thinkin= g a dirty battery clamp.    battery clamps are n= ew this year and clean, no corrosion on connections
 
John...   H= ow is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to the mo= tor?    voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash fr= ame  voltmeter used to check under hood is grounded to frame not = engine.  I'll go back and check ground connections. Alternator ha= s a ground terminal of it's own... it's #10 wire grounded to the frame=  and of course the alternator is grounded through it's mount.
 
Pat...  what is the relationship betwe= en the frame terminal & the rest of the electrical system?  <= /FONT>Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of  #4 wire= from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connect= ed to the solenoid.
 
Jimmie..    What's the volta= ge at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off'    hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6=   I'll do that
 How big is the alternator?&nbs= p;   100 amp single wire from CVF racing
 
ya'll have given me lots to check and reche= ck and some I haven't thought of...   going back through my = diagnostics and check connections too.  I bought a 500 amp load t= ester yesterday and will put sufficient load on the battery.  Bat= tery is under the cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with = the low truck, I have to raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thoug= ht battery would be a low maintenance item ...duh.   so chec= king at a shop somewhere is a very large pain.
 
points I'm considering.... larger ground wi= res from frame to engine.... alternator to frame and check resistance = from solenoid lug to the terminal on the frame...   the saga= continues
 
thanks for all the replies and points to ch= eck...   you guys are the best
 
john
 
--iuPdilL7EUf6iZMk6GD2I4N=_tu6xJfrvo-- --===============2225034903003288273== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2225034903003288273==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 9 12:30:55 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEBC0A1C33 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 12:30:55 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from st43p00im-ztdg10063201.me.com (unknown [17.58.63.182]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81957A1AED for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 12:30:37 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1628533838; bh=gCxb+xcP+ptC141/kbCm2yFxBgBP7WUYkR/inou+HcE=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=AEB0RO9E9JKtL0AsirOq6DqQPl13iFmr4waMRh6es8cFaB/jbTwArt2KsbdpO2XhY aPasXWKF7dBb1ASt/a28vazUROWB5D9pkmg3UObh6KQQCjGoKVWjFlG2CkKW8cA3wD B41yHlTw0AIcedGD1+eePcO2g0odMs9qFSnWtp5EqcvBdgSslRRHd9J48WunQE9Zek Drt+SoqUMVdCQiTa84ivFY+ZmePIIHGqNbpQ3SPlE4T8cWM/3WntDJ6Q02vENUQqdH HAsJ5ye7YKjAW6sesg9FjPvRTTVqeHfDb/3Z3Fop15DtC3stXGAtvlJ1Y31fopjHvb BJpoAsTdd+JTQ== Received: from [192.168.88.248] (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by st43p00im-ztdg10063201.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id A18205403E7; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 18:30:37 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2021 13:30:34 -0500 References: <1UZ4cxznpw.APi6hx7gINL@johns-desktop> To: john niolon =?UTF-8?Q?2903e8d5c8f:6.0.391,18.0.790,17.0.607.475.0000000_definitions?= =?UTF-8?Q?=3D2021-08-09=5F06:2021-08-06=5F01,2021-08-09=5F06,2020-04-07?= =?UTF-8?Q?=5F01_signatures=3D0?= spamscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 malwarescore=0 mlxscore=0 clxscore=1015 adultscore=0 suspectscore=0 phishscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2108090130 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck Cc: shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8749109233011142522== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-243B09E6-ECCC-43F0-AB36-87C857E96C28 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable John, Check charging voltage @ alternator post, alternator terminal, terminal on o= ther end of 1/0 cable, post that terminal connects to. If you can get to the= conductor in the 1/0 cable, get that too. That should be enough to find the= problem.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 9, 2021, at 1:02 PM, john niolon wrote: =EF=BB=BF sorry for slow response... helping daughter and sil move...priorities!!! =20 Monday a.m. report fresh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle charger si= nce then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different meters= hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester, voltage reading same as VOM at 13.4 voltage at frame rail terminal also 13.4 battery has 800 CCA capacity started test... over 15 second test the battery slowly dropped to 320 amps a= nd voltage read 10.8 (still in the green scale) stopped test at 15 seconds and two minutes later battery was back up to 12.7= next step will be check alternator output at battery and terminal point ok... started truck... engine at 1200 rpm meter on alternator o/p- voltage is 14.6 meter on battery voltage is 13.5 hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....that don't sound right need to measure resistance of cable I guess... as an aside... checked voltaged between frame ground and the case of the alt= ernator... 0.0001 volts I also took battery back to Wal mart and Quintella checked it... battery is= good based on her years of battery experience =20 =20 ----- Original Message ----- From: john niolon To: shop-talk Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck jeff=E2=80=A6. regular led acid battery ?? Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA = regular Walmart battery =20 When it died, did any of the electrical items still work? Lights, etc.? wh= en it first occurred ,, when I tried to restart, .. starter just clicked and= I remember the a/c fan still blowing =20 =20 Donald... How large is the cable from the alternator to the battery? feed= from battery to alternator is #4 wire =20 Dave... I was thinking a dirty battery clamp. battery clamps are new this= year and clean, no corrosion on connections =20 John... How is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to t= he motor? voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash frame voltmeter used to c= heck under hood is grounded to frame not engine. I'll go back and check gro= und connections. Alternator has a ground terminal of it's own... it's #10 wi= re grounded to the frame and of course the alternator is grounded through it= 's mount. =20 Pat... what is the relationship between the frame terminal & the rest of th= e electrical system? Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of #4= wire from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connecte= d to the solenoid. =20 Jimmie.. What's the voltage at the terminal with those accessories 'on' b= ut the engine 'off' hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6 I'll= do that How big is the alternator? 100 amp single wire from CVF racing =20 ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck and some I haven't thought of.= .. going back through my diagnostics and check connections too. I bought a= 500 amp load tester yesterday and will put sufficient load on the battery. = Battery is under the cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with th= e low truck, I have to raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thought batte= ry would be a low maintenance item ...duh. so checking at a shop somewhere= is a very large pain. =20 points I'm considering.... larger ground wires from frame to engine.... alte= rnator to frame and check resistance from solenoid lug to the terminal on th= e frame... the saga continues =20 thanks for all the replies and points to check... you guys are the best =20 john =20 _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com --Apple-Mail-243B09E6-ECCC-43F0-AB36-87C857E96C28 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable John,
Check charging voltage @ alternat= or post, alternator terminal, terminal on other end of 1/0 cable, post that t= erminal connects to. If you can get to the conductor in the 1/0 cable, get t= hat too. That should be enough to find the problem. 

Peace,
Pat


Pat Horne&nbs= p;
We support Habitat for Humanity


On Aug 9, 2021, at 1:02 PM, john niolon <jniolon@att.net> wr= ote:

=EF=BB=BF
sorry for slow response... helping daughter and sil move..= .priorities!!!
 
Monday a.m.= report

fresh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle charg= er since then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different m= eters


hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester, v= oltage reading same as VOM at 13.4
volta= ge at frame rail terminal also 13.4

battery has 800 CCA capacity
started test... over 15 second test the battery slowly d= ropped to 320 amps and voltage read 10.8 (still in the green scale)
stopped test at 15 seconds and two minutes later= battery was back up to 12.7


3D""
3D""<= /picture>

next step will be check alternator output at battery and terminal poi= nt

= ok... started truck... engine at 1200 rpm
meter on battery voltage is 13.5

hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....t= hat don't sound right
need to measure re= sistance of cable I guess...

as an aside... checked voltaged between frame groun= d and the case of the alternator... 0.0001 volts

I also took battery back to Wa= l mart and Quintella checked it...  battery is good based on her years o= f
battery exp= erience
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
To: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM
Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
jeff=E2=80=A6.     regular led acid battery ?? = ;    Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA  r= egular Walmart battery
 
When it died, did any of the electrical items still work?  Lights,= etc.?  when it first occurred ,, when I tried t= o restart, .. starter just clicked and I remember the a/c fan still blo= wing
 
 
Donald...  How large is the cable from the= alternator to the battery?   feed f= rom battery to alternator is #4 wire
 
Dave... I was thinking a= dirty battery clamp.    battery clamps are new this y= ear and clean, no corrosion on connections
 
John...   How= is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to the motor?    voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash frame  volt= meter used to check under hood is grounded to frame not engine.  I'll g= o back and check ground connections. Alternator has a ground terminal of it'= s own... it's #10 wire grounded to the frame and of course the alternat= or is grounded through it's mount.
 
Pat...  what is the relationship between t= he frame terminal & the rest of the electrical system?  Term= inal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of  #4 wire from the i/p so= lenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connected to the solenoid.
 
Jimmie..    What's the voltage a= t the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off' =    hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6  I'll do t= hat
 How big is the alternator? &n= bsp;  100 amp single wire from CVF racing
 
ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck a= nd some I haven't thought of...   going back through my diagnostic= s and check connections too.  I bought a 500 amp load tester yesterday a= nd will put sufficient load on the battery.  Battery is under the cab a= nd I have to lower it to check it out and with the low truck, I have to rais= e truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thought battery would be a low maintenan= ce item ...duh.   so checking at a shop somewhere is a very large p= ain.
 
points I'm considering.... larger ground wires f= rom frame to engine.... alternator to frame and check resistance from soleno= id lug to the terminal on the frame...   the saga continues=
 
thanks for all the replies and points to check.= ..   you guys are the best
 
john
 
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= --Apple-Mail-243B09E6-ECCC-43F0-AB36-87C857E96C28-- --===============8749109233011142522== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8749109233011142522==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 9 13:02:54 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60B38A1853 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 13:02:54 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic305-2.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com (unknown [74.6.133.41]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 449FDA17C9 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 13:02:33 -0600 (MDT) t=1628535753; bh=jnQJAEFflwM10EuZ94Dd+/fYtxzA0jw3sfxE8VtJeY0=; h=Date:From:Reply-To:To:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=p4xw1zOZAwjd+J/Cn86M/DzePqlb6CEVTXoGFtIo5VKHZORXBSfzZQ7pjOXlUfnwOWmMfzqYCD1F1gZ7FGNqsbENygLWVwTbTGLaOEIwWrOauRF5Eh8efrRxxFRzYvzFD5Fx0OWn0cJX7TDtWXJdSi9EPa4aVHHn269z+80fOzI0g54mHHuk7PMFOy8TliAyEH3oIUPoA6BwLjhkSsX69JKnTcOOK3P/6llTNSBMOQS/j2EOYiCjvmrajU/vxJcYH7MsX7U0Ej/HJcA0L243VStPATaQQPz1yA298CIUj88H3hWkFMrotE+WLCLyuaMTjAj67JdTgXWPP4FB3atM+g== t=1628535753; bh=2MFVhr1NKGxv+k1mLpE/fz5didwpUMlKI2ZlGGhewBk=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Date:From:To:Subject:From:Subject; b=uaqzCxCNazG+EfqMoQgQHkKFUg4ZkTZfvZrT6AfSQzX4S/2jLowL2bjQeUrx+jU6lcBro0NqiSJE9O3RNFUATDt6TkioRx3ZWI+UBSVCx+PVGRRiPiM94aXp7RqbXLWAJ832apTfMjOJeTYlAPmI4UntGw6dxrmyFcaZHx1qWbkdwmZObUyTj1QejdxyWTKFaiV6WBqKSvm3bdtVvvaefyS118gn8ziEIkqvms6EbKlBIGMbvDXE+nBa7B87rTq/3PT06HrJgZOE/Ub4IjJcQr00XEx4839eRpHJlGVHY4aNhtnG3QVpTQjr4Iw9D6dxTzaH04yLGfoJJpMmAyqkfQ== RwFYaDXoA827rkvIW3AikIdIauSjx2m1nY7bbw5_Qhhx6zG3GklfzNOYOwm.UIGA8mlgKsuAcN4_ PRsaFJ5nZrLLqurAExpJcmPIl3Si9_LZbwhtNrbMtgylXwQVrbCrHQ4CbKtpdioMbsLSK_wCfPp2 67Z1lUetReF46kgwepCspOg_Kmk2j7xB32rR6yCuVyrq.1HQcOIYWwLZZq6LROvoo60Upa__Pplr 4ofJnq2EjeJ9TUrxYz4SH.sI0OzRzX3GRfxmuv1V239CvOz9tf9NdpGkHWIx0b.MznAZjXpooZ.L mMa1TslkpP2v6UoFDpa4dI3CMZ1qy8NmFkzbzPkfI4wN_SC7LqiOCA0ED0tQUq.mmHG9VW5wt5DX YDwbjLksjNLhgciLryliknUzG_AHdIhDe5TISqSwvn0Wvm3m_oBn1QsrblfAQjyzL8ARTgEYsiG2 mbNlbP0BSPV6BSrFS7udVMznx3Q5HqPfjvEZ4yDK3SSe7buVNZPVl_dO45Ukblq0eQ.JOJHAtqjb _NnbKHfJUBKZpGkjzLVn4ggRzHrHHC66r6D_eLIcs8qOVjhg0CgnVKVk7sMs8UioFzITwm5lb9kP Y8hl0g_v4y_g3NwPkmEV9YEJCbK_AU39srS9fvJkocf7vIuFKQeJMfSPEGCFIbduRYViIIUcV1W. nPwumRhCv1ZZxNmggC6XVRIxtYXuGR3SBF9TQ2Tm3rBBV2adjtuCKyb.Gqkun8Sig5cxd3.6we6q Qj1UhPYYcIMB3xoNPM.ZX1FpMpKQYFVtbVyhVlGGrm7ZBSXTvZh7P3T_L7If7Rzelah.Zqpowc4e Sh2nT7BDYqy24HNFZ0YMBH9fz53usNTk8.jSTlDj.7Kh_dt7xVvf9vadA2ifOce22vKZYdNvwbve GO4zDN77XHNrfMqfz_9HqpO6JxX1NqxS3z7bk3h2MeyXYqLPFKVhl8_ECChGJGd1j410SyNMdR1. 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I was thinking a dirty battery clamp.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 batte= ry clamps are new this year and clean, no corrosion on connections=C2=A0Joh= n...=C2=A0=C2=A0 How is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame= or to the motor?=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash f= rame=C2=A0 voltmeter used to check under hood is grounded to frame not engi= ne.=C2=A0 I'll go back and check ground connections. Alternator has a groun= d terminal of it's own... it's #10 wire grounded to the frame=C2=A0and of c= ourse the alternator is grounded through it's mount.=C2=A0Pat...=C2=A0 what= is the relationship between the frame terminal & the rest of the electrica= l system?=C2=A0 Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of =C2=A0#4= wire from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connect= ed to the solenoid.=C2=A0Jimmie..=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 What's the voltage at t= he terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off'=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0 hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6=C2=A0 I'll do that=C2= =A0How big is the alternator?=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 100 amp single wire from CV= F racing=C2=A0ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck and some I have= n't thought of...=C2=A0=C2=A0 going back through my diagnostics and check c= onnections too.=C2=A0 I bought a 500 amp load tester yesterday and will put= sufficient load on the battery.=C2=A0 Battery is under the cab and I have = to lower it to check it out and with the low truck, I have to raise truck o= n jackstands.. silly me, I thought battery would be a low maintenance item = ...duh.=C2=A0=C2=A0 so checking at a shop somewhere is a very large pain.= =C2=A0points I'm considering.... larger ground wires from frame to engine..= .. alternator to frame and check resistance from solenoid lug to the termin= al on the frame...=C2=A0=C2=A0 the saga continues=C2=A0thanks for all the r= eplies and points to check...=C2=A0=C2=A0 you guys are the best=C2=A0john= =C2=A0_______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive ssey@cs.com ------=_Part_396034_1968158864.1628535752142 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Check between frame ground and battery negative.&nbs= p; A rusty connection there can cause all manner of similar problems.

Dave



-----Original Message-----
From: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
To: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: Mon, Aug 9, 2021 12:55 pm
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck

sorry for slo= w response... helping daughter and sil move...priorities!!!
 
Monday a.m. report

fresh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on sat= urday trickle charger since then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked = with two different meters


hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester,= voltage reading same as VOM at 13.4
voltage a= t frame rail terminal also 13.4

battery has 800 CCA capacity
s= tarted test... over 15 second test the battery slowly dropped to 320 amps a= nd voltage read 10.8 (still in the green scale)
stopped test at 15 seconds and two minutes later battery was back up to 1= 2.7


3D""=
3D""

next= step will be check alternator output at battery and terminal point

ok... started truck... = engine at 1200 rpm
meter on alternator o/p- vo= ltage is 14.6
meter on battery voltage is 13.5=

hmmm...1.1 volt= drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....that don't sound right
need to measure resistance of cable I guess...

as an aside... checked voltaged between= frame ground and the case of the alternator... 0.0001 volts

I also took battery back to Wa= l mart and Quintella checked it...  battery is good based on her years= of
battery experience
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
To: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM
Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
jeff=E2=80=A6.     regular led acid battery ??&nbs= p;    Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA = regular Walmart battery
 
When it died, did any of the electrical items still work?  Lights= , etc.?  when it first occurred ,, when I trie= d to restart, .. starter just clicked and I remember the a/c fan still= blowing
 
 
Donald...  How large is the cable from th= e alternator to the battery?   fee= d from battery to alternator is #4 wire
 
Dave... I was thinking= a dirty battery clamp.    battery clamps are new thi= s year and clean, no corrosion on connections
 
John...   Ho= w is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to the motor?    voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash frame  v= oltmeter used to check under hood is grounded to frame not engine.  I'= ll go back and check ground connections. Alternator has a ground terminal o= f it's own... it's #10 wire grounded to the frame and of course the al= ternator is grounded through it's mount.
 
Pat...  what is the relationship between = the frame terminal & the rest of the electrical system?  Te= rminal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of  #4 wire from the i/p= solenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connected to the solenoid= .
 
Jimmie..    What's the voltage = at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off'&nbs= p;   hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6  I'll d= o that
 How big is the alternator? &= nbsp;  100 amp single wire from CVF racing
 
ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck = and some I haven't thought of...   going back through my diagnost= ics and check connections too.  I bought a 500 amp load tester yesterd= ay and will put sufficient load on the battery.  Battery is under the = cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with the low truck, I have t= o raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thought battery would be a low ma= intenance item ...duh.   so checking at a shop somewhere is a ver= y large pain.
 
points I'm considering.... larger ground wires= from frame to engine.... alternator to frame and check resistance from sol= enoid lug to the terminal on the frame...   the saga continues
 
thanks for all the replies and points to check= ...   you guys are the best
 
john
 
------=_Part_396034_1968158864.1628535752142-- --===============6816338737206214304== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6816338737206214304==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 9 13:59:09 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15D2FA1A56 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 13:59:09 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic315-10.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (unknown [98.137.65.34]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBCE8A19E2 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 13:57:54 -0600 (MDT) t=1628539075; bh=cVIjc97uWR+fxJEf4zmOustFkRebED3snnajpCiGDgE=; h=References:Date:In-Reply-To:From:To:Subject:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=Z856JFrNa3pOOj+sHXWUatvokPm55MVq5ATSWOeyl9wymMWIpfgKkq64LmJ28SyE+4DQVYBAkANlVwdBNvsmhlHXd/MOLI3UUdnQadY61OHLrqXiAIvins2yKJmqkGwFM8TjnO20WfWy+uduAuoxmg/Gvrqh3sQ79PRTqnk75zE= t=1628539075; bh=wzvDjNb2tbVcwdGYYeWsF6VXSrBEEk+hvUKCtK+Ll7X=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Date:From:To:Subject:From:Subject; b=Fd5nd0tNcsbc1JR4CNy+CAFwqbxLI3e4d+poNYsdaxwL9XToW/dk8HSUDTT3GdN3qPZkIpUvHIaOuHHmfiJJl6Wbr0P0i+/s7n9BjWwUaYA7PUk/fdDXqRqHAkZOs3/hdW+aegcg2mcjYTU+oT6CMuGVbQ5F5ej0nfGMKnGYOAd1v8Nrn0qrWdRubWusr1IXrh9D0sj6YqbsqqzOQCMxeBfFwC/t+3JnFml1QYYt/Hpnka076HXoPgfNwabVzAFccS6iTd59jBPUOdAFl3Ifhi83gd0E7fARYUQax2KiajjJB+up2Jxjm1QnznAhCN7JqGlVjiH2OcipfvJrOpGa4A== Cv_duzeQp59Ms2Iv4oS0V4v4WzX9eA8oqsRckmZAkaizE0HwH4id1fDfqZD1fIasH6PPRQN2aMQJ TrDW4lqz5UfXFDxtmLIpKq3U9VhK2PNsScJ7aziSGksHBxFGYdWsSGFI2lAXTkMK.gU3MuT51NTH ufzuiTmFBZTk.4wT9QtzsyaulnT0c9v5xDIUFZvMHqSzXisdlGM3T3IsGKI.6qLqkNbkHmvT621k HIgSfMOpLkIkSUmW3NSHAygB2ObQcMEqqQO0PYJ2Kgw3LPW4t9951qFvcKKHu.EylqNOlDndWI7. 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A rusty connection t= here can=20 cause all manner of similar problems. Dave=20 -----Original Message----- From: john niolon To: shop-talk Sent: Mon, Aug 9, 2021 12:55 pm Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck sorry for slow response... helping daughter and sil move...priorities!= !! Monday a.m. report fresh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle char= ger since=20 then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different mete= rs hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester, voltage reading same as VOM at 13.= 4 voltage at frame rail terminal also 13.4 battery has 800 CCA capacity started test... over 15 second test the battery slowly dropped to 320 = amps and=20 voltage read 10.8 (still in the green scale) stopped test at 15 seconds and two minutes later battery was back up t= o 12.7 next step will be check alternator output at battery and terminal poin= t ok... started truck... engine at 1200 rpm meter on alternator o/p- voltage is 14.6 meter on battery voltage is 13.5 hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....that don't sound right need to measure resistance of cable I guess... as an aside... checked voltaged between frame ground and the case of t= he=20 alternator... 0.0001 volts I also took battery back to Wal mart and Quintella checked it... batt= ery is=20 good based on her years of battery experience ----- Original Message ----- From: john niolon To: shop-talk Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck jeff=E2=80=A6. regular led acid battery ?? Everstart Maxx27 80= 0 CCA regular=20 Walmart battery When it died, did any of the electrical items still work? Lights, etc= =2E? when=20 it first occurred ,, when I tried to restart, .. starter just clicked = and I=20 remember the a/c fan still blowing Donald... How large is the cable from the alternator to the battery? = feed=20 from battery to alternator is #4 wire Dave... I was thinking a dirty battery clamp. battery clamps are ne= w this=20 year and clean, no corrosion on connections John... How is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame o= r to the=20 motor? voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash frame voltmeter used = to check=20 under hood is grounded to frame not engine. =20 I'll go back and check ground connections. Alternator has a ground ter= minal of it's=20 own...=20 it's #10 wire grounded to the frame and of course the alternator is gr= ounded through it's=20 mount. Pat... what is the relationship between the frame terminal & the rest= of the=20 electrical system? Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a=20 4' piece of #4 wire from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from th= e battery is connected to the solenoid. Jimmie.. What's=20 the voltage at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine= 'off' =20 hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6 I'll do that How big is the alternator? 100 amp single wire from CVF racing ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck and some I haven't thoug= ht of... =20 going back through my diagnostics and check connections too. I bough= t a 500=20 amp load tester yesterday and will put sufficient load on the battery.= Battery=20 is under the cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with the l= ow truck,=20 I have to raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thought battery woul= d be a=20 low maintenance item ...duh. so checking at a shop somewhere is a ve= ry large=20 pain. points I'm considering.... larger ground wires from frame to engine...= =2E alternator to frame and check resistance from solenoid lug to the = terminal on the frame... the saga continues thanks for all the replies and points to check.. you guys are the be= st john _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net= /archive ve1massey@cs.com --S3j2kSsADEILAV2Jx9O4k4j=_V6ANVkmJC Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
checked all ground connections and resistance thru cables
 
neg post on battery to ground bolt in frame  0.37 ohms
=
all 1/0 cables read 0.2 to 0.3 ohms
 
----- Original Message -----
From: DAVID MASSEY <dave1massey@cs.com>
=
Reply-To: DAVID MASSEY <dave1massey@cs.com>
Sent: 8/9/2021 2:02:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
Check between frame ground and battery negative.&n= bsp; A rusty connection there can cause all manner of similar problems= =2E

Dave



-----Original Message-----
From: john niolon &l= t;jniolon@att.net>
To: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>= ;
Sent: Mon, Aug 9, 2021 12:55 pm
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] elect= rical problem with truck

sorry for slow= response... helping daughter and sil move...priorities!!!
 
Monday a.m. report

fr= esh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle charge= r since then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two differ= ent meters


hooked up= H.F. 500 amp load tester, voltage reading same as VOM at 13.4
voltage at frame rail terminal also 13.4

battery has 800 CCA capacity
started test= =2E.. over 15 second test the battery slowly dropped to 320 amps and v= oltage read 10.8 (still in the green scale)
stopped te= st at 15 seconds and two minutes later battery was back up to 12.7



3D""

next = step will be check alternator output at battery and terminal point

ok... started truck... engine at 1200 rp= m
meter on alternator o/p- voltage is 14.6
meter on battery voltage is 13.5

hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....that don't sound right
need to measure resistance of cable I guess...

as an aside... checked voltaged between frame gr= ound and the case of the alternator... 0.0001 volts
I also took battery back to Wal mart and Quintella chec= ked it...  battery is good based on her years of
battery experience
 
<= /DIV>
 
----- Original Message -----
From: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
To: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM
Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
jeff=E2=80=A6.     regular led acid battery ?= ?     Everstart Maxx27 800 C= CA  regular Walmart battery
 
When it died, did any of the electrical items still work?  L= ights, etc.?  when it first occurred ,, whe= n I tried to restart, .. starter just clicked and I remember the = a/c fan still blowing
 
 
Donald...  How large is the cable from= the alternator to the battery?   feed from battery to alternator is #4 wire
<= /DIV>
 
Dave... I was thinkin= g a dirty battery clamp.    battery clamps are n= ew this year and clean, no corrosion on connections
 
John...   H= ow is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to the mo= tor?    voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash fr= ame  voltmeter used to check under hood is grounded to frame not = engine.  I'll go back and check ground connections. Alternator ha= s a ground terminal of it's own... it's #10 wire grounded to the frame=  and of course the alternator is grounded through it's mount.
 
Pat...  what is the relationship betwe= en the frame terminal & the rest of the electrical system?  <= /FONT>Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of  #4 wire= from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connect= ed to the solenoid.
 
Jimmie..    What's the volta= ge at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off'    hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6=   I'll do that
 How big is the alternator?&nbs= p;   100 amp single wire from CVF racing
 
ya'll have given me lots to check and reche= ck and some I haven't thought of...   going back through my = diagnostics and check connections too.  I bought a 500 amp load t= ester yesterday and will put sufficient load on the battery.  Bat= tery is under the cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with = the low truck, I have to raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thoug= ht battery would be a low maintenance item ...duh.   so chec= king at a shop somewhere is a very large pain.
 
points I'm considering.... larger ground wi= res from frame to engine.... alternator to frame and check resistance = from solenoid lug to the terminal on the frame...   the saga= continues
 
thanks for all the replies and points to ch= eck..   you guys are the best
 
john
 
_____________________________= __________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Donate: <= A href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" shape=3Drect rel=3D"norefer= rer noopener" target=3D_blank>http://www.team.net/donate.html
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= --S3j2kSsADEILAV2Jx9O4k4j=_V6ANVkmJC-- --===============6151157298917250847== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6151157298917250847==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 9 14:10:54 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0CD5A1A8C for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 14:10:54 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic310-24.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (unknown [98.137.69.150]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18671A19CD for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 14:10:36 -0600 (MDT) t=1628539837; bh=/ZwApwcDXkRxTAMjGSWJy7uQ1WHKtDH04C/PQLcf4hs=; h=References:Date:In-Reply-To:From:To:Cc:Subject:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=1x7q5RQq5rAHaDx8IMtErHmUhGU59tXF3XXKqjH1adOAtimj/ybMyYttl51iFTBAYuHLIGpysJ6P/rryeK0utEw2BBxAqe67nZzKbnQqt4nFXrDFFJmbeb7bj0P6qYdtBCFVimADe90Z9JRISrfE5Q7GT78RCa0wRPJ0a3AEsUE= t=1628539837; bh=yhs0eNZqjwrhpgn2g1rUZo0lyRLbnPOsdLke+vSmUjS=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Date:From:To:Subject:From:Subject; b=Odh6bF71C/lUQmzcB/Zwm05Kc39XSB3XxPlNXFH7k5MgYPcSjHJWtPDR6mRwUhG87HSgYlzlhhI1pcQ7Uf/5iVctvoEDnHoCrLlbY14jeE6a+5SrnzjeaWcQ+Pv7yH1GE4bUxK/CvDSGOpVPxgO/2E4MhQ86+8aupHIEoeZvVxkFiJE2fugB7nUddWjXeAKu30kmVJOZANr8E5ZZ6YVewIPIob7q4h/orplip26dRuiPeN7OTqwSy9h0cRxlZTh7gbaIJkZVez7aUZU7/LTaWg5JrMDTXpK6wH5JV9s3XRkPpB9YRDdcj1tNwDJsyMGdy2FzapYaFP2NwMRFHiSzzg== kQR9ZiMUGg7ATDUi7h3pZePcJjdMHNCAKmG2BzYtZil1nFo3RzqSQuo9Aso.TOXEL1fEosEO57lS jooYhT6bBNNU5gwNBVFo_z9rjehJWbbiXoZXxUgqToWGrpRyhTDjJvlJIJcOXThpao8REZbLbhWt LQi0J6cbxcodMj0uX2Ty5vS2woxVd8lAKCgKg23XeG6OZIdEHZAtHfzsWTrOX1OYCNu6GbmNCMfl mt40UpoPrY1WElH.fN7AE3vPEdAqx99yBSBAP_1vi4rN0dyD_7.544yvb5NTtvMeNZ8bOfLHyhAP Kt.QbS4zQ11gQL5Z6iHLUu.Pch8v64pcekP7a5ivTOCH7yUQW4x5z09W0XUd6yTcTK_VvClJY_1Q 3GYnccYOtVYWiJL9J8E6uhajBZe77J.tJ7eA4ZmDD0leU5wacfj2T8W_Jw2y17f6tPN73__4nzr2 ooywHJ4TPa.QiPHs1iBgewTv8juE1SRvl4UclqmnR9REEPkBoH9.InAduEZOf2puZzLA3rWsFnXO CNpqkThTZ1eE3MmOQzym6NdSmXQj2Ycg49xwArituWAnQzH5TEuX2sA.dBFV9n.pFvTZFxAP93Xe 523XLBwad6IFzHJV9bhmKL.0Kg4W1XSErIMvj6hHidyqrEzuzRirw96IEXn7IX7SmB0w5VmPRi1C BnYb8vwmFw0NGlaNEEk62o_mDXuoydHAGrHe5wG003iEX9mOtIJ1RfO_uG4697Nd.JAS_iGXkgVp rifouxaQkgA8YeB0oynvKLfOZXlSG4PQ6e8UQF0I763y05UxZBIf0lI0CCynB81wzJuiIJpGYJdQ GkqpCZQVnjdx6BMW4s0wfnWaJSSbT6DyqOD4ROnwkS.ta1bGAufGBx0BNVV7UFrG0ycU5uRqLWFV LTbC9Pxc06EB3d2gEoMqizw1PhKlqTBKSonQ4oyES9OWC9xItef_KmjHsEpnbgF.qSkdyGF78O_R Eo2EDvimryFTbS_7uxq5Gy3kt2amtOg7kutKoCO7m7ghDA9QrP3nTGUMdy0TNQuBi9LuiyIeonMb S5gX5ipwnOVUZZs3V3BMi5.rY69qTVRhBML7fn11UgZ67gLM312smPRkNDlmE4d43kT4QiPff0jK 8IZf33tRTyq18dKYxcgjtxiju.1A9zAUzcz4_6YyvDCsi1lRJgOpS3hzM_aJgAR_E.k0G3ft1WE9 mToc4CLpjERG5EmSgC1kFdUujEu1fmhd51qts1gcqLGGiQOHfJPDtZENK7qcpoFBGpVzDLF7okUl 1xgFcPTli1xJGrhW6XZ8d1GIX6Z._qdnXLXVMfP0O40Fsks80omAj1NpSDIeH5pQIF6kxQ1vNFbi 9tM0Rdjs0qtwzs86C1shiG5UztZC4tubyvXCLmut3wEdrZfmCUMWVu_8lHNU6x6g80Qwbqv9onJ6 8IG4Bt8IytLr0.Mjbvxs8NXgdsQo.o21qJy2wbnpBzxuqsNET4oLX_GKiAW8bwgGsAq8c79dC0hT M.fFR1F1pV09d19kKiGcr.7hDfpWWF3xnBDl5comOiusK7UKy3HX8L_Cagm.VF_DeZi94fY68Jen VDHJXy8n1hpJfqop4kBFQqNieNYB7YAwvo8ULptFPjBZmNNpqq2_g3RihduijLhUyhrBTeqvIg.V Rm8lqsjmubjJi6iVT8jjMaDb.z146Yf.rhuXjh2XlbihmijIHnsEc2_ncQGzppyIJuNYAT10hghy WP66r2Yz4TrGI.ppW09IVGFD.wlHG9ixTAk3eI8cRtowj1cuvtKMsmzdw77JquT6paXyFWuYdyVI vaw7VaTmh.dNGJkjaE5Fir5keh0u8jW8cKAkQ6XubdqNdCzNSLvBBoY8vgQmH5IJiLKkwrqana3L _Zi7LtvSZyx1JDSWZ7ceewpTIuppaUBy069xl_qh9yNHuOqSk5QUDQarDws0LBBxjeJDVm00BAc. 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Vlw_l13uyD3zw9luiWjFbkZONSR4jzV6hNTnaoHxPQiSwhGOFJIDyH9E.c91rzJqFOkYco7OYkga 7ekSvHkbWIllPVkl.RMO8KoxGLA_dJfUBCZPan_kmXwYRoH5Ly_GB2RM7HhiQbhO7eNY2regdaJe vPNZu6Yp0VRbf6k2W4f71GZ03poAMs4YLijkCmz8Ojx8xzQYLutRP5O7lvoefWaehxDfIDdIXrOV 0OLfw69ICgtMwInWt.sGk3tLiMhv7N9_fdNxl4BMIK2u7pahpKGR3nkNk99r6nFFm6BU7OkkDIOM IyLjEjbG3ebxPS62obMIQ_AZhU_jhtvI- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic310.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 20:10:37 +0000 Received: by kubenode547.mail-prod1.omega.ne1.yahoo.com (VZM Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 7efcfc19b99c48021260fd05b1d6dee1; Mon, 09 Aug 2021 20:10:32 +0000 (UTC) References: <1UZ4cxznpw.APi6hx7gINL@johns-desktop> <2924AE66-4A9B-41DC-8630-03C0E6CB8E51@icloud.com> Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2021 15:10:29 -0500 From: "john niolon" To: "Pat Horne" User-Agent: OEClassic/3.2 (Win10.19041; P; 2021-05-18) mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck Cc: shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format --===============1581731711776119455== This is a multi-part message in MIME format --ZWoim84rG2yavyjaJXtkJcu5=_yikjknLV Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Pat, while the battery was out I checked resistance on all battery, st= arter and=20 ground cables... all read from .003 to .004 ohm resistance end to end also rechecked the charging voltage again with engine at 1200 rpm 14= =2E6=20 volts... as I increased the rpm the voltage flickered down to 14.3 - 1= 4.4 to =20 then back up to 14.6 as rpm decreased back to 1200 did this both with VOM leads on battery terminals AND alternator termi= nals j ----- Original Message ----- From: Pat Horne To: john niolon Cc: shop-talk Sent: 8/9/2021 1:30:34 PM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck John, Check charging voltage @ alternator post, alternator terminal, termina= l on=20 other end of 1/0 cable, post that terminal connects to. If you can get= to the=20 conductor in the 1/0 cable, get that too. That should be enough to fin= d the=20 problem.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 9, 2021, at 1:02 PM, john niolon wrote: =EF=BB=BF=20 sorry for slow response... helping daughter and sil move...priorities!= !! Monday a.m. report fresh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle char= ger since=20 then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different mete= rs hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester, voltage reading same as VOM at 13.= 4 voltage at frame rail terminal also 13.4 battery has 800 CCA capacity started test... over 15 second test the battery slowly dropped to 320 = amps and=20 voltage read 10.8 (still in the green scale) stopped test at 15 seconds and two minutes later battery was back up t= o 12.7 next step will be check alternator output at battery and terminal poin= t ok... started truck... engine at 1200 rpm meter on alternator o/p- voltage is 14.6 meter on battery voltage is 13.5 hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....that don't sound right need to measure resistance of cable I guess... as an aside... checked voltaged between frame ground and the case of t= he=20 alternator... 0.0001 volts I also took battery back to Wal mart and Quintella checked it... batt= ery is=20 good based on her years of battery experience ----- Original Message ----- From: john niolon To: shop-talk Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck jeff=E2=80=A6. regular led acid battery ?? Everstart Maxx27 80= 0 CCA regular=20 Walmart battery When it died, did any of the electrical items still work? Lights, etc= =2E? when=20 it first occurred ,, when I tried to restart, .. starter just clicked = and I=20 remember the a/c fan still blowing Donald... How large is the cable from the alternator to the battery? = feed=20 from battery to alternator is #4 wire Dave... I was thinking a dirty battery clamp. battery clamps are ne= w this=20 year and clean, no corrosion on connections John... How is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame o= r to the=20 motor? voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash frame voltmeter used = to check=20 under hood is grounded to frame not engine. =20 I'll go back and check ground connections. Alternator has a ground ter= minal of it's=20 own...=20 it's #10 wire grounded to the frame and of course the alternator is gr= ounded through it's=20 mount. Pat... what is the relationship between the frame terminal & the rest= of the=20 electrical system? Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a=20 4' piece of #4 wire from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from th= e battery is connected to the solenoid. Jimmie.. What's=20 the voltage at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine= 'off' =20 hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6 I'll do that How big is the alternator? 100 amp single wire from CVF racing ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck and some I haven't thoug= ht of... =20 going back through my diagnostics and check connections too. I bough= t a 500=20 amp load tester yesterday and will put sufficient load on the battery.= Battery=20 is under the cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with the l= ow truck,=20 I have to raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thought battery woul= d be a=20 low maintenance item ...duh. so checking at a shop somewhere is a ve= ry large=20 pain. points I'm considering.... larger ground wires from frame to engine...= =2E alternator to frame and check resistance from solenoid lug to the = terminal on the frame... the saga continues thanks for all the replies and points to check.. you guys are the be= st john _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net= /archive tintexas@icloud.com --ZWoim84rG2yavyjaJXtkJcu5=_yikjknLV Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline Pat, while the battery was o= ut I checked resistance on all battery, starter and ground cables... a= ll read from .003 to .004 ohm resistance end to end
 also rechecked the charging voltage again with engine at 12= 00 rpm  14.6 volts... as I increased the rpm the voltage flickere= d down to 14.3 - 14.4 to  then
back up to 14.6 as rpm decreased back to 1200
 
did this both with VOM leads on battery terminals AND alternator = terminals
 
j
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Pat Horne <patintexas@icloud.com>
=
To: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
Cc: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 8/9/2021 1:30:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
John,
Check charging voltage @ alternator post, alternator terminal, te= rminal on other end of 1/0 cable, post that terminal connects to. If y= ou can get to the conductor in the 1/0 cable, get that too. That shoul= d be enough to find the problem. 

Peace,
Pat


Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


On Aug 9, 2021, at 1:02 PM, john niolon <jniolon= @att.net> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF=20
 
Monday a.m. report

fresh charge on b= attery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle charger since then ..= battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different meters

<= BR style=3D"BOX-SIZING: border-box">hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester= , voltage reading same as VOM at 13.4
voltage at frame rail terminal also 13.4

battery has 800 CCA ca= pacity
started test... over 15 sec= ond test the battery slowly dropped to 320 amps and voltage read 10.8 = (still in the green scale)
stopped= test at 15 seconds and two minutes later battery was back up to 12.7<= BR style=3D"BOX-SIZING: border-box">

3D""
3D""

next step will be check alter= nator output at battery and terminal point

ok... started truck... e= ngine at 1200 rpm
meter on alterna= tor o/p- voltage is 14.6
meter on = battery voltage is 13.5

hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....th= at don't sound right
need to measu= re resistance of cable I guess...
=
as an aside... checked voltaged b= etween frame ground and the case of the alternator... 0.0001 volts

= I also took battery back to Wal mart and Quintella checked it... = battery is good based on her years of
battery experience
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
To: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM
Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
jeff=E2=80=A6.     regular led acid battery ?= ?     Everstart Maxx27 800 C= CA  regular Walmart battery
 
When it died, did any of the electrical items still work?  L= ights, etc.?  when it first occurred ,, whe= n I tried to restart, .. starter just clicked and I remember the = a/c fan still blowing
 
 
Donald...  How large is the cable from= the alternator to the battery?   feed from battery to alternator is #4 wire
 
Dave... I was thinkin= g a dirty battery clamp.    battery clamps are n= ew this year and clean, no corrosion on connections
 
John...   H= ow is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to the mo= tor?    voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash fr= ame  voltmeter used to check under hood is grounded to frame not = engine.  I'll go back and check ground connections. Alternator ha= s a ground terminal of it's own... it's #10 wire grounded to the frame=  and of course the alternator is grounded through it's mount.
 
Pat...  what is the relationship betwe= en the frame terminal & the rest of the electrical system?  <= /FONT>Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of  #4 wire= from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connect= ed to the solenoid.
 
Jimmie..    What's the volta= ge at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off'    hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6=   I'll do that
 How big is the alternator?&nbs= p;   100 amp single wire from CVF racing
 
ya'll have given me lots to check and reche= ck and some I haven't thought of...   going back through my = diagnostics and check connections too.  I bought a 500 amp load t= ester yesterday and will put sufficient load on the battery.  Bat= tery is under the cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with = the low truck, I have to raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thoug= ht battery would be a low maintenance item ...duh.   so chec= king at a shop somewhere is a very large pain.
 
points I'm considering.... larger ground wi= res from frame to engine.... alternator to frame and check resistance = from solenoid lug to the terminal on the frame...   the saga= continues
 
thanks for all the replies and points to ch= eck..   you guys are the best
 
john
 
___________________________= ____________________

Shop-talk@autox.= team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
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Arch= ive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arc= hive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox= =2Eteam.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@icloud.com
=
--ZWoim84rG2yavyjaJXtkJcu5=_yikjknLV-- --===============1581731711776119455== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============1581731711776119455==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 9 16:23:25 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B493CA1954 for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 16:23:25 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-lf1-f42.google.com (unknown [209.85.167.42]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95F45A193D for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 16:22:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-lf1-f42.google.com with SMTP id c24so10427929lfi.11 for ; Mon, 09 Aug 2021 15:22:31 -0700 (PDT) d=dougbraun.com; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=fPC2zB3OESQpi8zj6wxZDDaSmIjeq6XadFoBrLwoZa4=; b=tc8/Vn+BXzQt2VjJRf12t9pJyxiCy8ACzrBeOfZAUjvz43dAgbI4G8CJ8rthcguq/G Pn5UAfzbVuhifbDOkya3BlF9kWRo35SphzTSmh57YtyO69Ld9Cm7MZAztz4FeFc0Pahj yoauL9CCXgFXCD5fRYOGqOpph6JCa8PUVyYbs= d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=fPC2zB3OESQpi8zj6wxZDDaSmIjeq6XadFoBrLwoZa4=; b=XC1nve1Qb9KxSJtfFUaB4+upCndC9Q64sqeYa8oCTYtuy79TQ+FP8Rj/sO1R6g/3AA K1147kz3LR7jC8IrZe2wJdZRqmC8mVOWKQZVv6n6sl4KZkSPpBh2paNgsyYChVSyvGf2 5OFzSTTftZY7XKeQsBfM2JUUViQoojMXXip17FCzpZv+yYSbH1+uOXMOhfY9rcxOM2fD 4TLKneagKZOuxtsPIiZdxA1ci+2OoLLiJAOwYPwRDRRy6G+7YvSQj5nm6LXhKtZNFdGJ IwXCs+xsJdeR2gQB0u+7r/MMbbxUWRDwYHKJPousFzu93/3dT/cMjxvfQdydmCz3BzYC qB2w== UA4q80/FeYLDMhcEaywaw6WOiga5YoNylq5XysCi8Q== Mon, 09 Aug 2021 15:22:30 -0700 (PDT) References: <1UZ4ZeHN5p.88LXRt04Wgj.ref@johns-desktop> <1UZ4ZeHN5p.88LXRt04Wgj@johns-desktop> <1UZ4cxznpw.APi6hx7gINL@johns-desktop> <1642131687.396035.1628535752145@mail.yahoo.com> <1UZ4czMXy8.BHcJHdT5bis@johns-desktop> From: Doug Braun Date: Mon, 9 Aug 2021 18:22:19 -0400 To: john niolon Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck Cc: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============9113140018680115892== --0000000000002dd0ab05c927d282 What does your meter read when you just touch the two leads to each other? A lot of meters will never show a value less than 0.1 or 0.2 ohms. But the 0.37 is definitely suspicious. Doug On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 3:59 PM john niolon wrote: > checked all ground connections and resistance thru cables > > neg post on battery to ground bolt in frame 0.37 ohms > all 1/0 cables read 0.2 to 0.3 ohms > > > --0000000000002dd0ab05c927d282 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
What does your meter read when you just touch the two= leads to each other?
A lot of meters will never show a value les= s than 0.1 or 0.2 ohms.

But the 0.37 is definitely= suspicious.

Doug

On Mon, Aug 9, 2021 at 3:= 59 PM john niolon <jniolon@att.net> wrote:
checked all ground connections and resistance thru cables
=C2=A0
neg post on battery to ground bolt in frame=C2=A0 0.37 ohms
all 1/0 cables read 0.2 to 0.3 ohms
=C2=A0

--0000000000002dd0ab05c927d282-- --===============9113140018680115892== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============9113140018680115892==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 9 20:01:29 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8601BA1DDC for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 20:01:29 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic312-22.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com (unknown [74.6.128.84]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 910D6A1BEB for ; Mon, 9 Aug 2021 19:57:26 -0600 (MDT) t=1628560647; bh=gq9xTvCLa6zU77Iqym81SMtFXmzpEFYZzMNuH1iqeVw=; h=Date:From:Reply-To:To:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=ZuqF3En1llFRibyTFlDUpqJWBlumr9j5d3kRImD4j//uO1Ai1PUwBp9JS3qca+1UjsP9ypGAPx94Rg6Gwmaass7UTwn4jZEic5FQDGNavx17xO2wwhpqJxzZ+i4/DpWzNLN8evpFtHhYxAjcCfuC/lRrzm2pR6Fdbh0tFSo3qf6dyzeu2wyJuRtQ4HkaECfCwck5lB8NNqoQgB6zRMszgVV2ogTQMyAXxoFa6MW2tlgxCkTD+Fc+aX9YBfkzvU3pE7UNp+fhcoKcFqnA0IoX8GwML5NQRAScmwqu2GHyM4L0xRCmSYSAOciI5KTM674egk/+7Ki8agu+xz/0DW3hRw== t=1628560647; bh=DFVW0McJdjwgverX9oIfgYYDfFvopae8DRk4lpBp9Ne=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Date:From:To:Subject:From:Subject; b=Tblq/roFnpY7gvhrdGaKF1fRfrYE4RrxvlFV70NgUEh6XY1k+tShBto0l3Mm0VJF7LmDNsZ7uiFGBTWL870r5CaprBL3pCOrfWvn/oE6/K32lGkf0n7TYyHeQjk1/Af55perwi+fzIutIbw8eJ+wB4L7wSEGhsE7E8mbOUMJbBwUnpx3B/Qv4RfaijOALHcval3KMdcteGp1XFjZUbCTLQGRF2Jr98rGAl3BAz5kyiqJGTpn05X6C6Iz40N7rOnMXZxBBN82H/HAoGGMDpzS6++EOj84xk2L8zkORXE12JE0hUjC/2u2IiqwZjXYOx0D1Si4HwLVEVAsFakRGKBogg== eOQR48um7akSXS5sDDu90iZyYUSIZ2UOZARszbuNXHXk_8IVo1o6ugA5DuTFgwYd3oNWJb2MyTW1 nwaqrEmL_xliLUbfjiH2Acf3Xl7YBWzrw_NLNlEAbXHnGbRkFNuaxyc87wCVJSY4_8qx6w37ltEg B8ZxGZVnUGoWLLwdE8KIp6gnkt2x2Lh9AxzLSDY_tlSY9tHGbYMjtm7uYv8r99PTQsCx4UgSo1Qb _Wbygq0h0IR5G3VMzIMpakl81vS0CXNTRe2nRiBsV_u3ZZTxfrNQ1gdPkirT1Zrzat9RbHcvPG3r WRSLf6I0rvBiefdAskGn3gpHnG8pQyf66gU5wR0LQ2aAtf553t_SCM4HUFTBfh4011DzWknixOlh eMgEc2geos79D2vyJHxGAoqyAHiyMQ0gRGzdD0lGkVbh77LHq_UUBc993LrkKxiivHxwQMigj_mF uwLEktXDFll8nUSeU9JiiRmNF0GDCP1KqHDjIEkd56WUQXBOwCav6CxU5NE32iMqFoR.7FFhDP_w Cl.QjLG_VDgerBE15wAHwNdF3Eo1V1qW7MD7Rfjs4jPwi5aJO64aWVEDjpEeX46XhGDMXRPJuvPW 0_vXeiAOaDoYLe5UzoVun17M9jTaODct1dJmaWPTwNVjs7IFbSpAPlq0mZJ.hVYXZKftzGRKhsf0 v_o3Qi9xJ_Dol47ChBvgrCPCEzT9r4dP.lUBJOlF6NQZQuoTbksz6W9DDjvBbAxChAJsE_5C2qHj jMrTjfLwfvW2997vResJbnxH8xsCaTSW4ndIag0gv0rUtMS3W3NhZ3r3rEtxnw1_jeYnx7F.9wcY lp9PYuuOaFb1YMspTd5DSl1L_Kf_47rj0piRE_YDfz0angY4qPQM_3wFEQbTPxYRulkmydZpnMoG JtRzRJjVzIKvkTUKUjNBlcaqrtwB4NG0tQ0is8kZMCWD349.fWhzlKWEmKzrHuNjoCDEC3j2JNIl kXKtgjei1n8wWmxfgHyHJrk8uE91htCMuu72_P_9z2J_MXGKJfeRxPHnJE8YLVwO5r08cUWl1Ybl WSR8V6iEi8qaV.4tl_DW7p_39LMPudP9Ljr69F3.EwdggyHpXUP6eaFHzsqPmBCAb48kyUswwbok BkZeDUUzILDOvAYqoV_bMv2.7uNyBYKranYcQyGktStfYKbQ_5RtBLGDxJEB9fuOstmCT75Hrvin 6CJ2HyMDNxAyOxclkh4SyZfpYTdRxmRk2mp3Mwjnjg85wp_ouYezaTPITyP16rG2cX7ku42DtmRG Affsju_IcbrtFqNkA4.U19sXHbccVHIA2DnEMxxNp2H_CDgdj7qd6ZL1nWaeEUuiLRmo0MI589TF Ch1tYB6J_seKFq5Vp4l7et2zyC3DK.TcSLafHm.Jp4530Eg4kix8CDpEsCiy0s7OjrYcriqbg0Jn K4WVOrD34exWJs_p3HYzXGAt0mvhUKBnIA9jyelTnvPPcy9f.Md9jQEOsTmAAE5ofCx9P46HvqK5 Xj1UvqXZzIQKNJHm4Y8vkiDFJ1BE9tDNPk5GjkUTbGbwESODFgC4OpTxRrTY0Q9ri9u4UdgM9LI9 t9QpUV3louYn5IKy80oeaGMdoRIyS4up9WsC_dXYqJ9YMNqOJp9jPTZ0NYVHsXyT6srE6Y90ehKL Qkr3LxLB7OUdkxr3bMbCcZzwMy3MFTHMzfC1gA9jhzZy1V7FGjRg1IJTW5WDzYlA8N6REjj9l0Ya tRj8FvcTVkD8gy0d8OfbHfwQNJaopWL8ubTDLpy5AnvrgxFCAv4F0yyn4H9U1J9Tj9y7y82k_c9K AaimYtsXhIHQ89fzeQ0msN4jqmnVWzYAYg1wsM7TICBfHbxPNLgQRnwC8pb_Div5Hs6VtambpZJv dUiVE2tROBozLG8hflTxuDJ5arqXMzICmzoqB45KVguum9Hc_rpuBCE2pZyX6_d68Xd0KhsbZapY VvY3AbEiXH_CYvKP0ZPoGJslEEG03lFRbgQCV.JwaxXnYSjR6EdrJkK_laI8qj0UoK1k5ihxg6X6 7I0POIoYmsZKpoaIL0kj4_dEd2SHiq4BZfGXd4h8YPzrY3rsW906vVfMmYllpA0W9THP583X26KW oZqHRbxA45I65LMxXC7A3feNQKmfNW7XA4n_HeEKg9GDlBBBgqiVB.a7dQQOmEBFiaPc_lMRZCY3 Qc4N41V8zaZ29BbPes0uYIqce3y0B6zc6UJ_eKFvigOm9IxKRo9GK4WpYxnJogqDfYXSRnidB4eF uiKzFVJL4RzROkxXjsr9zAHGN7iJRJNb_fd6h9EyxCbJW1pgq9iwIXDnRF4aM4PhBNKjthPNLr4x gCR4jakfnubJhxJtBStyOqvudQ2i4FWFJEparoKmCpOHyRgidauuzI3vQQbBQGm4Gwx_4ZzhVx9t NCucfWnZQOG1hrbWWa3rwxUGopwkeyQeORnz7sqqvgpzo3Cw7xk.8rkNQ9Ew- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic312.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 01:57:27 +0000 Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 01:57:24 +0000 (UTC) From: DAVID MASSEY To: "jniolon@att.net" , "shop-talk@autox.team.net" References: <1UZ4ZeHN5p.88LXRt04Wgj.ref@johns-desktop> <1UZ4ZeHN5p.88LXRt04Wgj@johns-desktop> <1UZ4cxznpw.APi6hx7gINL@johns-desktop> <1642131687.396035.1628535752145@mail.yahoo.com> <1UZ4czMXy8.BHcJHdT5bis@johns-desktop> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3075018588334002603== boundary="----=_Part_534792_1771713866.1628560644512" ------=_Part_534792_1771713866.1628560644512 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable That's pretty high.=C2=A0 If the current is 10A you will have a 3 volt dro= p across that cable. =20 Dave=20 =20 =20 -----Original Message----- From: john niolon To: DAVID MASSEY ; shop-talk@autox.team.net Sent: Mon, Aug 9, 2021 2:57 pm Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck #yiv1494141348 body {margin:0.7em;}#yiv1494141348 body.yiv1494141348OECFntD= ef, #yiv1494141348 body.yiv1494141348OECFntDef div {font-family:Tahoma, Ver= dana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12pt;}checked all ground conne= ctions and resistance thru cables=C2=A0neg post on battery to ground bolt i= n frame=C2=A0 0.37 ohmsall 1/0 cables read 0.2 to 0.3 ohms=C2=A0 ----- Original Message -----From: DAVID MASSEY Reply-To= : DAVID MASSEY To: , Sent: 8/9/2021 2:02:32 PMSubject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical probl= em with truckCheck between frame ground and battery negative.=C2=A0 A rusty= connection there can cause all manner of similar problems. Dave=20 -----Original Message----- From: john niolon To: shop-talk Sent: Mon, Aug 9, 2021 12:55 pm Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck #yiv1494141348 body {margin:0.7em;}#yiv1494141348 body.yiv1494141348OECFntD= ef, #yiv1494141348 body.yiv1494141348OECFntDef div {font-family:Tahoma, Ver= dana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12pt;}sorry for slow response.= .. helping daughter and sil move...priorities!!!=C2=A0Monday a.m. report fresh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle charger s= ince then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different mete= rs hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester, voltage reading same as VOM at 13.4 voltage at frame rail terminal also 13.4 battery has 800 CCA capacity started test... over 15 second test the battery slowly dropped to 320 amps = and voltage read 10.8 (still in the green scale) stopped test at 15 seconds and two minutes later battery was back up to 12.= 7 next step will be check alternator output at battery and terminal point ok... started truck... engine at 1200 rpm meter on alternator o/p- voltage is 14.6 meter on battery voltage is 13.5 hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....that don't sound right need to measure resistance of cable I guess... as an aside... checked voltaged between frame ground and the case of the al= ternator... 0.0001 volts I also took battery back to Wal mart and Quintella checked it...=C2=A0 batt= ery is good based on her years ofbattery experience =C2=A0=C2=A0 ----- Original Message -----From: john niolon To: shop-tal= k Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AMSubject: [Shop-talk] e= lectrical problem with truck#yiv1494141348 body {margin:0.7em;}#yiv14941413= 48 body.yiv1494141348OECFntDef, #yiv1494141348 body.yiv1494141348OECFntDef = div {font-family:Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12= pt;} jeff=E2=80=A6.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 regular led acid battery ??=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA=C2=A0 regular Walmart battery=C2= =A0When it died, did any of the electrical items still work?=C2=A0 Lights, = etc.?=C2=A0 when it first occurred ,, when I tried to restart,=C2=A0.. star= ter just clicked and I remember the a/c fan still blowing=C2=A0=C2=A0Donald= ...=C2=A0 How large is the cable from the alternator to the battery?=C2=A0= =C2=A0 feed from battery to alternator is #4 wire =C2=A0Dave... I was thinking a dirty battery clamp.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 batte= ry clamps are new this year and clean, no corrosion on connections=C2=A0Joh= n...=C2=A0=C2=A0 How is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame= or to the motor?=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash f= rame=C2=A0 voltmeter used to check under hood is grounded to frame not engi= ne.=C2=A0 I'll go back and check ground connections. Alternator has a groun= d terminal of it's own... it's #10 wire grounded to the frame=C2=A0and of c= ourse the alternator is grounded through it's mount.=C2=A0Pat...=C2=A0 what= is the relationship between the frame terminal & the rest of the electrica= l system?=C2=A0 Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of =C2=A0#4= wire from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connect= ed to the solenoid.=C2=A0Jimmie..=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 What's the voltage at t= he terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off'=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0 hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6=C2=A0 I'll do that=C2= =A0How big is the alternator?=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 100 amp single wire from CV= F racing=C2=A0ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck and some I have= n't thought of...=C2=A0=C2=A0 going back through my diagnostics and check c= onnections too.=C2=A0 I bought a 500 amp load tester yesterday and will put= sufficient load on the battery.=C2=A0 Battery is under the cab and I have = to lower it to check it out and with the low truck, I have to raise truck o= n jackstands.. silly me, I thought battery would be a low maintenance item = ...duh.=C2=A0=C2=A0 so checking at a shop somewhere is a very large pain.= =C2=A0points I'm considering.... larger ground wires from frame to engine..= .. alternator to frame and check resistance from solenoid lug to the termin= al on the frame...=C2=A0=C2=A0 the saga continues=C2=A0thanks for all the r= eplies and points to check..=C2=A0=C2=A0 you guys are the best=C2=A0john=C2= =A0_______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive ssey@cs.com ------=_Part_534792_1771713866.1628560644512 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
That's pretty high.  If the current is 10A you = will have a 3 volt drop across that cable.

Dave



-----Original Message-----
From: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
To: DAVID MASSEY <dave1massey@cs.com>; shop-talk@autox.team.net <s= hop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: Mon, Aug 9, 2021 2:57 pm
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck

checked all ground connections and resistance thru cables
 
neg post on battery to ground bolt in frame  0.37 ohms
all 1/0 cables read 0.2 to 0.3 ohms
 
----- Original Message -----
Reply-To: DAVID MASSEY <dave1massey@cs.com>
Sent: 8/9/2021 2:02:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
Check between frame ground and battery negative. = ; A rusty connection there can cause all manner of similar problems.=

Dave
=


-----Original Message-----
From: john niolo= n <jniolon@att.net>
To: shop-talk <shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net>
Sent: Mon, Aug 9, 2021 12:55 pm
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck

sorry for slo= w response... helping daughter and sil move...priorities!!!
 
Monday a.m. report

fresh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle charger = since then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different met= ers


hooked up H.F. = 500 amp load tester, voltage reading same as VOM at 13.4
= voltage at frame rail terminal also 13.4

battery has 800 CCA capacity
started test... over 15 s= econd test the battery slowly dropped to 320 amps and voltage read 10.8 (st= ill in the green scale)
stopped test at 15 seconds and tw= o minutes later battery was back up to 12.7


3D""
3D""

next step will be check altern= ator output at battery and terminal point

ok... started truck... engine at 1200 rpm
meter on al= ternator o/p- voltage is 14.6
meter on battery voltage is= 13.5

hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/= 0 cable....that don't sound right
need to measure resista= nce of cable I guess...

as an aside...= checked voltaged between frame ground and the case of the alternator... 0.= 0001 volts

I also took battery back to= Wal mart and Quintella checked it...  battery is good based on her ye= ars of
battery experience
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
To: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM
Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
jeff=E2=80=A6.     regular led acid battery ??&nbs= p;    Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA = regular Walmart battery
 
When it died, did any of the electrical items still work?  Lights= , etc.?  when it first occurred ,, when I trie= d to restart, .. starter just clicked and I remember the a/c fan still= blowing
 
 
Donald...  How large is the cable from th= e alternator to the battery?   fee= d from battery to alternator is #4 wire
 
Dave... I was thinking= a dirty battery clamp.    battery clamps are new thi= s year and clean, no corrosion on connections
 
John...   Ho= w is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to the motor?    voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash frame  v= oltmeter used to check under hood is grounded to frame not engine.  I'= ll go back and check ground connections. Alternator has a ground terminal o= f it's own... it's #10 wire grounded to the frame and of course the al= ternator is grounded through it's mount.
 
Pat...  what is the relationship between = the frame terminal & the rest of the electrical system?  Te= rminal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of  #4 wire from the i/p= solenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connected to the solenoid= .
 
Jimmie..    What's the voltage = at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off'&nbs= p;   hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6  I'll d= o that
 How big is the alternator? &= nbsp;  100 amp single wire from CVF racing
 
ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck = and some I haven't thought of...   going back through my diagnost= ics and check connections too.  I bought a 500 amp load tester yesterd= ay and will put sufficient load on the battery.  Battery is under the = cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with the low truck, I have t= o raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thought battery would be a low ma= intenance item ...duh.   so checking at a shop somewhere is a ver= y large pain.
 
points I'm considering.... larger ground wires= from frame to engine.... alternator to frame and check resistance from sol= enoid lug to the terminal on the frame...   the saga continues
 
thanks for all the replies and points to check= ..   you guys are the best
 
john
 
------=_Part_534792_1771713866.1628560644512-- --===============3075018588334002603== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============3075018588334002603==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 06:53:53 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 764E5A2314 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 06:53:53 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from st43p00im-zteg10071901.me.com (unknown [17.58.63.169]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86C16A2302 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 06:49:11 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1628599752; bh=YlgBBfACTXw8OBm08beO6Ub8oEjxOjFjaKFuMFvpc7M=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=E0vnSsdN9s4Slycnh7de8Pb8evhSZ2H8zARg4LiKoaCwJIZCqa6d2P47H9Pbldgqd FiakLdTf3wNwB8k+rw7Fp9pLsOQamnrmYiLbd8ZALtL0zqEmHr0qXgS4NFfjf6aboO gcVdePYhFmjsddFU5sgWlxYAOqUMoQCUJLeH5qx4q1mipedmq67R3AcXCGTrPOnj+O 4dUJVguuC8L7vyvJ7zKKR9SScB1Zwkbm0bk9rZHWC1A2VQKXcPYgu8COhfWUR4r2L0 mRX8EUbJn08Vry0UN0/HBCFCn4otH4gVKPAPvL6gaX0EKNuOOfQO0a89u5URvBCIjp J8/BG3oac7S3A== Received: from [192.168.88.248] (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by st43p00im-zteg10071901.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9DA68D80F19; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 12:49:11 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 07:49:10 -0500 References: <1UZ4czii2p.CEVo1rpNaml@johns-desktop> To: john niolon definitions=2021-08-10_05:2021-08-10, 2021-08-10 signatures=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-2009150000 definitions=main-2108100082 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck Cc: shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============0003291229274675443== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-800816E1-AEB1-4281-9658-21BB0A99BDF0 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable John, here=E2=80=99s a little electrical theory for you, hope it helps.=20 Resistance measurements on a vehicle are not generally useful for circuits t= hat handle higher currents but works better for circuits that deal with sign= als. It is useful just as a open/short diagnosis. Here=E2=80=99s an example.= A wire carrying 40A current with 1V drop will have a resistance of .025 ohm= , much too low to be a real indication. Voltage, either to ground (the same g= round point for all measurements) or voltage drop across a wire is the best w= ay to find bad connections or undersized wires, your readings will not be ne= ar the end of the range or the meter. That=E2=80=99s why I recommended the s= eries of voltage readings all along the wire from the alternator to the batt= ery.=20 This approach also works well for grounds. When working with grounds it is b= est to use a single ground reference point or do voltage drops across each g= round wire.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 9, 2021, at 3:10 PM, john niolon wrote: =EF=BB=BF Pat, while the battery was out I checked resistance on all battery= , starter and ground cables... all read from .003 to .004 ohm resistance end= to end also rechecked the charging voltage again with engine at 1200 rpm 14.6 vol= ts... as I increased the rpm the voltage flickered down to 14.3 - 14.4 to t= hen back up to 14.6 as rpm decreased back to 1200 =20 did this both with VOM leads on battery terminals AND alternator terminals =20 j =20 ----- Original Message ----- From: Pat Horne To: john niolon Cc: shop-talk Sent: 8/9/2021 1:30:34 PM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck John, Check charging voltage @ alternator post, alternator terminal, terminal on o= ther end of 1/0 cable, post that terminal connects to. If you can get to the= conductor in the 1/0 cable, get that too. That should be enough to find the= problem.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 9, 2021, at 1:02 PM, john niolon wrote: =EF=BB=BF sorry for slow response... helping daughter and sil move...priorities!!! =20 Monday a.m. report fresh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle charger si= nce then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different meters= hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester, voltage reading same as VOM at 13.4 voltage at frame rail terminal also 13.4 battery has 800 CCA capacity started test... over 15 second test the battery slowly dropped to 320 amps a= nd voltage read 10.8 (still in the green scale) stopped test at 15 seconds and two minutes later battery was back up to 12.7= next step will be check alternator output at battery and terminal point ok... started truck... engine at 1200 rpm meter on alternator o/p- voltage is 14.6 meter on battery voltage is 13.5 hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....that don't sound right need to measure resistance of cable I guess... as an aside... checked voltaged between frame ground and the case of the alt= ernator... 0.0001 volts I also took battery back to Wal mart and Quintella checked it... battery is= good based on her years of battery experience =20 =20 ----- Original Message ----- From: john niolon To: shop-talk Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck jeff=E2=80=A6. regular led acid battery ?? Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA = regular Walmart battery =20 When it died, did any of the electrical items still work? Lights, etc.? wh= en it first occurred ,, when I tried to restart, .. starter just clicked and= I remember the a/c fan still blowing =20 =20 Donald... How large is the cable from the alternator to the battery? feed= from battery to alternator is #4 wire =20 Dave... I was thinking a dirty battery clamp. battery clamps are new this= year and clean, no corrosion on connections =20 John... How is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to t= he motor? voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash frame voltmeter used to c= heck under hood is grounded to frame not engine. I'll go back and check gro= und connections. Alternator has a ground terminal of it's own... it's #10 wi= re grounded to the frame and of course the alternator is grounded through it= 's mount. =20 Pat... what is the relationship between the frame terminal & the rest of th= e electrical system? Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of #4= wire from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connecte= d to the solenoid. =20 Jimmie.. What's the voltage at the terminal with those accessories 'on' b= ut the engine 'off' hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6 I'll= do that How big is the alternator? 100 amp single wire from CVF racing =20 ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck and some I haven't thought of.= .. going back through my diagnostics and check connections too. I bought a= 500 amp load tester yesterday and will put sufficient load on the battery. = Battery is under the cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with th= e low truck, I have to raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thought batte= ry would be a low maintenance item ...duh. so checking at a shop somewhere= is a very large pain. =20 points I'm considering.... larger ground wires from frame to engine.... alte= rnator to frame and check resistance from solenoid lug to the terminal on th= e frame... the saga continues =20 thanks for all the replies and points to check.. you guys are the best =20 john =20 _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com --Apple-Mail-800816E1-AEB1-4281-9658-21BB0A99BDF0 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable John, here=E2=80=99s a little electrical th= eory for you, hope it helps. 

Resistance measurement= s on a vehicle are not generally useful for circuits that handle higher curr= ents but works better for circuits that deal with signals. It is useful just= as a open/short diagnosis. Here=E2=80=99s an example. A wire carrying 40A c= urrent with 1V drop will have a resistance of .025 ohm, much too low to be a= real indication. Voltage, either to ground (the same ground point for all m= easurements) or voltage drop across a wire is the best way to find bad conne= ctions or undersized wires, your readings will not be near the end of the ra= nge or the meter. That=E2=80=99s why I recommended the series of voltage rea= dings all along the wire from the alternator to the battery. 

This approach also works well for grounds. When working with= grounds it is best to use a single ground reference point or do voltage dro= ps across each ground wire. 

Peace,
Pat

=
Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


On Aug 9, 2021, at 3:10 PM, john nio= lon <jniolon@att.net> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF Pat, while the battery was out I checked resistance on all battery, starter a= nd ground cables... all read from .003 to .004 ohm resistance end to end
 also rechecked the charging voltage again with engine at 1200 rpm=   14.6 volts... as I increased the rpm the voltage flickered down to 14= .3 - 14.4 to  then
back up to 14.6 as rpm decreased back to 1200
 
did this both with VOM leads on battery terminals AND alternator termin= als
 
j
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Pat Horne <patintexas@icloud.com>
To: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
Cc: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 8/9/2021 1:30:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
John,
Check charging voltage @ alternator post, alternator terminal, terminal= on other end of 1/0 cable, post that terminal connects to. If you can get t= o the conductor in the 1/0 cable, get that too. That should be enough to fin= d the problem. 

Peace,
Pat


Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


On Aug 9, 2021, at 1:02 PM, john niolon <jniolon@att= .net> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF=20
sorry for slow response... helping daughter and sil move..= .priorities!!!
 
Monday a.m.= report

fresh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle charg= er since then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different m= eters


hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester, v= oltage reading same as VOM at 13.4
volta= ge at frame rail terminal also 13.4

battery has 800 CCA capacity
started test... over 15 second test the battery slowly d= ropped to 320 amps and voltage read 10.8 (still in the green scale)
stopped test at 15 seconds and two minutes later= battery was back up to 12.7


3D""
3D""<= /picture>

next step will be check alternator output at battery and terminal poi= nt

= ok... started truck... engine at 1200 rpm
meter on battery voltage is 13.5

hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....t= hat don't sound right
need to measure re= sistance of cable I guess...

as an aside... checked voltaged between frame groun= d and the case of the alternator... 0.0001 volts

I also took battery back to Wa= l mart and Quintella checked it...  battery is good based on her years o= f
battery exp= erience
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
To: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM
Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
jeff=E2=80=A6.     regular led acid battery ?? = ;    Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA  r= egular Walmart battery
 
When it died, did any of the electrical items still work?  Lights,= etc.?  when it first occurred ,, when I tried t= o restart, .. starter just clicked and I remember the a/c fan still blo= wing
 
 
Donald...  How large is the cable from the= alternator to the battery?   feed f= rom battery to alternator is #4 wire
 
Dave... I was thinking a= dirty battery clamp.    battery clamps are new this y= ear and clean, no corrosion on connections
 
John...   How= is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to the motor?    voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash frame  volt= meter used to check under hood is grounded to frame not engine.  I'll g= o back and check ground connections. Alternator has a ground terminal of it'= s own... it's #10 wire grounded to the frame and of course the alternat= or is grounded through it's mount.
 
Pat...  what is the relationship between t= he frame terminal & the rest of the electrical system?  Term= inal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of  #4 wire from the i/p so= lenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connected to the solenoid.
 
Jimmie..    What's the voltage a= t the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off' =    hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6  I'll do t= hat
 How big is the alternator? &n= bsp;  100 amp single wire from CVF racing
 
ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck a= nd some I haven't thought of...   going back through my diagnostic= s and check connections too.  I bought a 500 amp load tester yesterday a= nd will put sufficient load on the battery.  Battery is under the cab a= nd I have to lower it to check it out and with the low truck, I have to rais= e truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thought battery would be a low maintenan= ce item ...duh.   so checking at a shop somewhere is a very large p= ain.
 
points I'm considering.... larger ground wires f= rom frame to engine.... alternator to frame and check resistance from soleno= id lug to the terminal on the frame...   the saga continues=
 
thanks for all the replies and points to check.= .   you guys are the best
 
john
 
_________________________________= ______________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
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Archive: http://www.team.net= /pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/= patintexas@icloud.com

= --Apple-Mail-800816E1-AEB1-4281-9658-21BB0A99BDF0-- --===============0003291229274675443== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============0003291229274675443==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 07:24:32 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F8D8A2254 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 07:24:32 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from omta012.uswest2.a.cloudfilter.net (unknown [35.164.127.235]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A8FEA1AD2 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 07:23:37 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cxr.smtp.a.cloudfilter.net ([10.0.16.145]) by cmsmtp with ESMTP id DP7Omt5J9fFugDRjGm41oX; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 13:23:38 +0000 Received: from John-PC.cox.net ([24.254.211.210]) by cmsmtp with ESMTPSA id DRjEmFjWxLISyDRjFmLdHY; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 13:23:38 +0000 Authentication-Results: cox.net; auth=pass (LOGIN) smtp.auth=jblair1948@cox.net a=vytuAFhf8Npo5rJvX1IL5Q==:117 a=vytuAFhf8Npo5rJvX1IL5Q==:17 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=kviXuzpPAAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=q6SfDYXhAAAA:8 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=rXFt4RuNMJpK-DpMU3IA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=aav4MXMyVXkA:10 a=4zxjrV59PHAA:10 a=bz_d9vehOyUA:10 a=qrIFiuKZe2vaD64auk6j:22 a=GGGinmgZRQXmVEG1E52S:22 a=R7nWeq4dleIJhz-CJ_3q:22 Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 09:23:37 -0400 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net From: "John T. Blair" kR46qcIFA/Z9Xvl9blavqCBavRc0KRdh8hcJrjHGUIZW5CvM7Hp+ahqK+2qWQi68F/M447kz+1vFqRipC1Ed8yUCmvlyiLM1dIA= Subject: [Shop-talk] Compressor woos Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Hey gang, I have a Craftsman 5 hp 30 gal compressor that I purchased some time around '90. Here are the particulars: Compressor: Model 919.176951 MO-6436 Motor: GE Model 5KCR48SR59W Part #: C-MO 3013 RPM: 3450 Volt: 230 Amp: 13.1A Shaft size: 5/8" or 16mm SCFM @ 40 PSI 11.3 90 PSI 9.3 125 PSI 8.0 Cut In pressure - 100 Cut Out pressure - 125 The other day I was using my nail gun putting up molding around a window in my family room. All of a sudden the nail gun quit nailing. After checking the nail gun and not finding anything obviously wrong with it, I went down into the shop to see if the compressor was on or if I had inadvertently turned it off (old age, I forget what I just did). Anyway, the switch on the compressor was in the ON position, but there was only about 40 psi in the tank. I pulled the compressor's plug and stuck in the 220V recepticle, and was getting a reading of 0V on both legs. So I go to the circuit breaker panel and reset the breaker, nothing. So for some reason the breaker has bit the dirt. I pull the breaker and head off the hardware store for a new breaker. Put it in and the compressor fires back up, and I finish putting the trim on the window. Well the next day, I needed the compressor so I turned it on, and I was working around the shop. The compressor came up to pressure and shut off. After using the air to clean off the filter on my shop vac, the compressor went to cut on, but it didn't start. I could hear a humming. I run over the the compressor, but before I can turn it off, it trips the new breaker. I pull the saftey shield and try to turn the flywheel to see if the compressor/motor has frozen. It moved easily, so both compressor and motor were OK. I turn the compressor back on, and it fires up. After a few cycles, I hear the humming again. Again, but the time I can get to it, it has tripped the breaker. So there is something wrong with the motor. Anyone have any ideas? I was thinking that it is either a bad spot on the armature, or a bad start capacitor. If it's the capacitor, why would it start after I moved the position of the motor a few degrees? I check with a local shop and they want $200 to put it on their bench! I think that's a little steep. So I guess I'll open it up and shot gun the start capacitor. Is there anything else I should l for while I'm in there? I do plan on cleaning all the parts while it's apart. I also don't see any place to oil the motor. So I'm assuming that it has bearings that are lubricated for live. Or is there something I should do there, oil, grease? TIA John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948@cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." In God We Trust Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for oneself; freedom from control or restriction -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 07:32:57 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29B0BA1B97 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 07:32:57 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from st43p00im-ztdg10071801.me.com (unknown [17.58.63.171]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA6E3A1AF3 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 07:32:38 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1628602359; bh=fc4sZMTc6BCNmtqtug/ELXaeY4sjAzNHmLudI5os19E=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=ou6ZjiXakmdym2TdLX4CaTk4VotS/CY/HfytSdfOh1l9UXbpPzKXSaeANJwD5KE3E 5HwVxJ05otDJ32gMO1SS7TiM3EG7MXSl8x7bdlU3jp0WPMUoTFylzMUeghpYkaUUPv cS+E4JIqxwS07yhfaJIo2BArtjV5IhtPJ6wXjcnsLUJULtCF5NGLqNGNwc+pWrTWnU IZF+X7HUuK1/EPxVzm0ONXusa84TINDtj4D43uD4Gn98JO8sQwdKNyDbeDglghsTwQ sTSenoePZt+sJxG65vCCqpAFp1C2jrTq5Qn0SqYkmWkDh28KkJ1n3d06Glnk+OF+uj 8Jq+aWtG4OLYQ== Received: from [192.168.88.248] (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by st43p00im-ztdg10071801.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id CD5EF540073; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 13:32:38 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 08:32:36 -0500 References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810090603.04b82da0@cox.net> To: "John T. Blair" definitions=2021-08-10_05:2021-08-10, 2021-08-10 signatures=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=451 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-2009150000 definitions=main-2108100087 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Compressor woos Cc: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net John, is there a start capacitor on the motor? If so, see if it is leaking or swollen. You should be able to have the motor shop test it for free. If there are two capacitors, one is start & one is run. They will be of different capacities so you can get them back in the correct place. Peace, Pat Pat Horne We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 10, 2021, at 8:25 AM, John T. Blair wrote: the the compressor, but before I can turn it off, it trips the new breaker. I pull the saftey shield and try to turn the flywheel _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 08:40:11 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D372EA22FA for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 08:40:11 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from chumdrop.sackheads.org (unknown [159.203.76.21]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 559D6A1AA8 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 08:32:18 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chumdrop.sackheads.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21F3D14F0B0 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 10:32:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from chumdrop.sackheads.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (chumdrop.sackheads.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id E_mdr9VFdeWv for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 10:32:19 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (cpe-96-28-86-122.kya.res.rr.com [96.28.86.122]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jimmie@sackheads.org) by chumdrop.sackheads.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id F181914F070 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 10:32:18 -0400 (EDT) To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810090603.04b82da0@cox.net> From: Jimmie Mayfield Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 10:32:18 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.12.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Compressor woos Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net T24gOC8xMC8yMSAwOToyMywgSm9obiBULiBCbGFpciB3cm90ZToKPgo+IGNvbXByZXNzb3Igd2Vu dCB0byBjdXQgb24sIGJ1dCBpdCBkaWRuJ3Qgc3RhcnQuwqAgSSBjb3VsZCBoZWFyIGEgCj4gaHVt bWluZy7CoCBJCj4gcnVuIG92ZXIgdGhlIHRoZSBjb21wcmVzc29yLCBidXQgYmVmb3JlIEkgY2Fu IHR1cm4gaXQgb2ZmLCBpdCB0cmlwcyAKPiB0aGUgbmV3Cj4gYnJlYWtlci4gCgoKVHJ5IHRoZSBm b2xsb3dpbmc6CgoxLiBUdXJuIHRoZSBjb21wcmVzc29yIG9mZgoyLiBCbGVlZCBvZmYgdGhlIHBy ZXNzdXJlIGluIHRoZSB0YW5rIGRvd24gdG8sIHNheSwgMzAtNDBwc2kKMy4gVHVybiB0aGUgY29t cHJlc3NvciBvbi4KCldoYXQgaGFwcGVucz/CoCBEb2VzIGl0IHN0YXJ0PwoKU291bmRzIGxpa2Ug eW91ciB1bmxvYWRlciB2YWx2ZSBtaWdodCBiZSBnb2luZyBiYWQgdGhvdWdoIHNpbmNlIHlvdSBo YXZlIAphIGJvbmFmaWRlIDVocCBtb3RvciwgSSdtIGEgbGl0dGxlIHN1cnByaXNlZCBpdCBjYW4n dCBwb3dlciB0aHJvdWdoIGl0LsKgIApXaGF0IHNpemUgY2lyY3VpdCBkbyB5b3UgaGF2ZSBpdCBv bj/CoCAzMEE/CgoKCl9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fCgpTaG9wLXRhbGtAYXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQKRG9uYXRlOiBodHRwOi8vd3d3LnRlYW0ubmV0 L2RvbmF0ZS5odG1sClN1Z2dlc3RlZCBhbm51YWwgZG9uYXRpb24gICQxMi45NgpBcmNoaXZlOiBo dHRwOi8vd3d3LnRlYW0ubmV0L3BpcGVybWFpbC9zaG9wLXRhbGsgaHR0cDovL2F1dG94LnRlYW0u bmV0L2FyY2hpdmUKClVuc3Vic2NyaWJlL01hbmFnZTogaHR0cDovL2F1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0L21h aWxtYW4vb3B0aW9ucy9zaG9wLXRhbGsvbWhhcmNAYXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQKCg== From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 08:41:14 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D993EA22F6 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 08:41:14 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-lj1-f178.google.com (unknown [209.85.208.178]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5098DA227A for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 08:33:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-lj1-f178.google.com with SMTP id y7so18466505ljp.3 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 07:33:53 -0700 (PDT) d=dougbraun.com; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=cfwYK7WjNWGnf/u/AetcDXQEO6uwJzTZ2ce1trCSO+8=; b=3yLwIk6FJmZH7UyI15YjPvH9+EZ6kNrXxtDCordl/YbpicTMiwUGB8nRj4Yjkj3XdC 70P4vlj5bZ328NK84Ab7aeBVHqA7Fv7skkYWWZzG18Sx29dtPhZrQzTN+rRkKHdZjd6A RUiAZgeESh+mwxQ42GTgcFrjN3IvI7lMJRP1g= d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=cfwYK7WjNWGnf/u/AetcDXQEO6uwJzTZ2ce1trCSO+8=; b=uO+6Aaoso/SxWS3d1SXC5bnFurDnpRBojNcC5UEqQzBIfa5pOWc5wyR7K12BgD7T2T sStQcjvOqzu+wn/bw/G6HLdmZWIVqrgGLoVkPTS8/U+WplnQGF+kQJZNnZ9lMnfcvy6D 0rJ99Ofv4dSDYsNK6xiH1pJpqSn2pyKEuzg6tJOiYE62xE35qo4mAyP2c8xnnq17kMLZ 0Ous1Di+lHEzFGZRsKUaAwe4LzIQKlFmMEHKfMaCADGvUDG3YhD+wosx/y2ZtPsmWtmd AO60NmpqcUspwFSHZ0ip02CoLc8Lfq+24wjzK241+P2U2xH6soiPoZPGD3vegQn7uTkf Cazg== b5CBZOnDlpZL3jHNu55FYqqlhYJh/I2GYr4eSiJCyw== Tue, 10 Aug 2021 07:33:52 -0700 (PDT) References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810090603.04b82da0@cox.net> From: Doug Braun Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 10:33:41 -0400 To: "John T. Blair" Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Compressor woos Cc: shop-talk@autox.team.net Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2531504393802072448== --00000000000008aecc05c93564f1 Isn't there a centrifugal switch that disconnects the start capacitor as soon as the motor starts spinning? Possibly that isn't working properly? Doug On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 9:25 AM John T. Blair wrote: > > Anyone have any ideas? I was thinking that it is either a bad spot on the > armature, or a bad start capacitor. If it's the capacitor, why would it > start > after I moved the position of the motor a few degrees? > > I check with a local shop and they want $200 to put it on their bench! I > think that's a little steep. So I guess I'll open it up and shot gun the > start > capacitor. Is there anything else I should l for while I'm in there? > > I do plan on cleaning all the parts while it's apart. I also don't > see any place > to oil the motor. So I'm assuming that it has bearings that are > lubricated for > live. Or is there something I should do there, oil, grease? > > --00000000000008aecc05c93564f1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Isn't there a centrifugal switch that disconnects= the start capacitor as soon as the motor starts spinning?
Possib= ly that isn't working properly?=C2=A0

Dou= g

On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 9:25 AM John T. Blair <jblair1948@cox.net> wrote:

Anyone have any ideas?=C2=A0 I was thinking that it is either a bad spot on= the
armature, or a bad start capacitor.=C2=A0 If it's the capacitor, why wo= uld it start
after I moved the position of the motor a few degrees?

I check with a local shop and they want $200 to put it on their bench!=C2= =A0 I
think that's a little steep.=C2=A0 So I guess I'll open it up and s= hot gun the start
capacitor.=C2=A0 Is there anything else I should l for while I'm in the= re?

I do plan on cleaning all the parts while it's apart.=C2=A0 I also don&= #39;t
see any place
to oil the motor.=C2=A0 So I'm assuming that it has bearings that are l= ubricated for
live.=C2=A0 Or is there something I should do there, oil, grease?

--00000000000008aecc05c93564f1-- --===============2531504393802072448== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2531504393802072448==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 09:02:18 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E3679A227E for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 09:02:18 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-po-01v.sys.comcast.net (unknown [96.114.154.160]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D07DA1BF7 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 09:01:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: from resomta-po-14v.sys.comcast.net ([96.114.154.238]) by resqmta-po-01v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTP id DT7MmWNvWKqmEDTGLmx5D9; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 15:01:53 +0000 s=20190202a; t=1628607713; bh=QuYEnFVH3/R0IuvF/wyol6W61I2DcAwcdZBNwcQ8dVQ=; h=Received:Received:Subject:To:From:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=NoqZv/JscmLKabqSBXne9g81uihoGaBc2/CZF1oKYvm/fIbIuUt/rrxTo0DwsBlYq 59kn2bRYMMRbHbvs/JP1y4DGbeReJuyirYe6v1hq25uJOXJX2T8E7WdnXKIjkDyPCg CYOd/0Wz/vo0ZvcT629Ivt9797LhF0Qqil6smYsAFrJJjvmKMYLjDIarmcFkCfFsAd RFQBrrMSlHBFGbjfaKE3f+6azwSxgKAM8E79gqZNrNDpOfXyDUpvo2Tj3dUdlLlS/M BnbS9jgvm0JnbHXBrQeAWbIjH7QcSA8fbPQX6gzKZVTC+AsqRGVAUuom/nZ2WCOJZs Yup4PtnFzO1nQ== Received: from [IPv6:2601:601:1501:a870:cd9d:1240:b29b:ded5] ([IPv6:2601:601:1501:a870:cd9d:1240:b29b:ded5]) by resomta-po-14v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTPSA id DTGKmedKIh8dKDTGLmpbIw; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 15:01:53 +0000 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810090603.04b82da0@cox.net> <0fd32c48-1002-34ba-2b3e-938e4c7ff013@sackheads.org> From: Mike Sinclair Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 08:01:52 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.12.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Compressor woos Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============6116904970119025720== boundary="------------2221E560CC6947AFB8717F26" Content-Language: en-US This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------2221E560CC6947AFB8717F26 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit If the motor is "humming" without starting, it is likely unable to overcome the existing pressure.  Bleeding down as Jimmie wrote will ease the load.  Do you have a long extension cord to the compressor?  This will increase the load considerably, and trip the breaker. Mike On 8/10/2021 7:32 AM, Jimmie Mayfield wrote: > On 8/10/21 09:23, John T. Blair wrote: >> >> compressor went to cut on, but it didn't start.  I could hear a >> humming.  I >> run over the the compressor, but before I can turn it off, it trips >> the new >> breaker. > > > Try the following: > > 1. Turn the compressor off > 2. Bleed off the pressure in the tank down to, say, 30-40psi > 3. Turn the compressor on. > > What happens?  Does it start? > > Sounds like your unloader valve might be going bad though since you > have a bonafide 5hp motor, I'm a little surprised it can't power > through it.  What size circuit do you have it on?  30A? > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation  $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/phoenix722@comcast.net > --------------2221E560CC6947AFB8717F26 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

If the motor is "humming" without starting, it is likely unable to overcome the existing pressure.  Bleeding down as Jimmie wrote will ease the load.  Do you have a long extension cord to the compressor?  This will increase the load considerably, and trip the breaker.

Mike

On 8/10/2021 7:32 AM, Jimmie Mayfield wrote:
On 8/10/21 09:23, John T. Blair wrote:

compressor went to cut on, but it didn't start.  I could hear a humming.  I
run over the the compressor, but before I can turn it off, it trips the new
breaker.


Try the following:

1. Turn the compressor off
2. Bleed off the pressure in the tank down to, say, 30-40psi
3. Turn the compressor on.

What happens?  Does it start?

Sounds like your unloader valve might be going bad though since you have a bonafide 5hp motor, I'm a little surprised it can't power through it.  What size circuit do you have it on?  30A?



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--------------2221E560CC6947AFB8717F26-- --===============6116904970119025720== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6116904970119025720==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 09:27:20 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CD41A17A4 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 09:27:20 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from NAM10-BN7-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (unknown [40.92.40.104]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C03C4A172E for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 09:26:57 -0600 (MDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=greBdHKpuqHZjxfl6qUx2qnCKvjY2wOWVm3SrMGIs4k4cS5rfZP+VBHZPbcw08Iqhhez+q5DvcVLAXFjebeyLSZSvfzS1rJmIje38Z8uZQmq6eb4hgAofl1t406HpOn65oLHE1HkNn4sdBtJ1aZwbUMJC9LSqnWsSowUlmyqgtdJahLoJOoYWuU6IbU1GJqUNAnZv+Wg8OAm9js+o/sPM43ereXpDJRXMCm+JxCH+ccjUfmgcIX+kC2WgI/tCIy9UIu82Fhd/eJXEZPsc+6HLi/dVHjfjuEU1hMbwQ/XaTbOuxG7Q+jydVevF4EJJ2SotPYUR27vPNS44+a+KBdXxA== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=WGhu3dFcZ3zvQLreGo1LS8R3TblyanPm7C6OYtZE7Ek=; b=egrDrUAeKczJXC4bEgKVEyk7cQrMc7ad/c/EyqoFSrUJdKowGRbGrDUo0QUuWsAmCIuvtSa1n7sf4LLqeiS06kUOpJrpe1bm2nYf/1tNeerFBqGW7nrd9ZAbUaWnLRRNaKQeNcm97psYwfJP4kqQmVcBbqRkS+W/AUuSaDSraQ7N3fIobJvzUXMuBaWko1Bjj03wsbvF2V56R389AWTz/6B336kC+WOQsFdkZuf/zqB2Jop8NrdhNH+3SgJ8kqzg8iPlKsfvXBma2TdrVltdsdBXNrFH/qIySh/refBqCshotNpRIZCo30Bs8wmS1SeYDv2goOY6MuZN4pAJGvRY/g== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=none; dmarc=none; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=WGhu3dFcZ3zvQLreGo1LS8R3TblyanPm7C6OYtZE7Ek=; b=sC41h+JVsOxCz6v3mTcYFJ5D0sXYafZV0NMq4d0orK06gfG91JQqDgCak1ObBV4K4xylJWBGgpng3uSanG/IZ/xEPHTLXBC/obvkBdT7j/QXq991nVWUjjf89LFMjj/h72DV47FTAcYf2QDEPsjZ6a+owCBEpP2nBtynPkmFXLHAO9Fpe8XQYCQeeKFP22Fv5c3ShrYk6VOzR0iRMJPG5ZoTu1NQ05d6jj7XELZ3a3nVykletVjkPO2YCvKRfXy8sUpts4t6vwX1qb4Fkgrtoya46r6BxNX6btK797qemq3fnXtG0N41Q6GEclJ78uZovyxNXgsQ1NldAiz2CsF2Bg== Received: from MW2NAM10FT043.eop-nam10.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:7e87::47) by MW2NAM10HT023.eop-nam10.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:7e87::330) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4394.16; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 15:26:57 +0000 Received: from MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:7e87::41) by MW2NAM10FT043.mail.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:7e87::265) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4394.16 via Frontend Transport; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 15:26:57 +0000 Received: from MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::64e8:26d3:2011:95e2]) by MW2PR07MB3978.namprd07.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::64e8:26d3:2011:95e2%7]) with mapi id 15.20.4373.026; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 15:26:57 +0000 From: Brian and Wendy Warrick To: "John T. Blair" , "shop-talk@autox.team.net" Thread-Topic: [Shop-talk] Compressor woos Thread-Index: AQHXjesZ3lHRRMvv80qiVcGtU8EmV6ts3CFu Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 15:26:57 +0000 References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810090603.04b82da0@cox.net> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-incomingtopheadermarker: OriginalChecksum:29A93B466679AFE60BC3CAE476B6CE3D0C873DB1CBE8066C1D731ADCA56A5F1A; UpperCasedChecksum:ED8D364DFE463DD0F832CF6A298F4671092E2156207A3417BFCEB50707E351EF; SizeAsReceived:6820; Count:44 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [JLcy+ag0fWpL2bcHZwr+2Dk110HiJh+M] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-incomingheadercount: 44 x-eopattributedmessage: 0 x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: f90b216f-fd3a-46a6-25ec-08d95c134ab6 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MW2NAM10HT023: x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: hEG0oiWeM831c55Tk8TVOWcyVa7/r2ujPu45DZlZnRt1/CrzypKfuXzctW3OpCb575WLuC8foLltRWZnqaezEkkrmDvFQ0Xy+shSCvP8BFOoZ50dEFawTzVpMvr5Ksc5SolKr4cOdKHDUnYBauRjNe7mNt/g4380f8QoHgbgN9z+zC3iQOzfoNf6oMi73Kso1Owz1Kc0PG7x4OAVhUlpPw1w+r+xI9AeuW+FIVAPdXW0v4hSuVebiOC54BXzIBf8z7e5u2cKXC3eF/m/W4A8RAYfwVId0395lKlOFscGUkP656RH9wLpB7KPwZVJIewTxuPtseSF40Q5dSTstuXqx38QNaVHdctLy0/xw0/sQkU4ViRq0gVGmxgv8ZFjkx525kBG+ljw/8FkwtX0/aCUd/eU1qVCX7ucBOjP3/mFlN0j5hnIlcykAm89WSVEdHA0MQcfJfldiLQGf5sd10ICSa+7p5OMTdiiBih7IZuIdLY= x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-chunkcount: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-0: 8t6Z8U1+/cqelLGB4evksFuogQPxJ79Lwx8FZzuWS0lqePp9wgXAEDKQ7voP3CtSJFRmlOEeFTRSMgOtPvLQd/iXUhGHTPtg92Y6wNB9shiCvSF7JtZeUo356SHCNFffmw1jAxJnZQMd5j/jYLa+yw== x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Compressor woos Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4564596180129908964== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_MW2PR07MB397890B7A1408AA96AFC2A6CBBF79MW2PR07MB3978namp_" --_000_MW2PR07MB397890B7A1408AA96AFC2A6CBBF79MW2PR07MB3978namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Take a look at the contacts in the pressure switch. They may be burnt or pi= tted and both legs of power are not making contact at the same time. I had = this happen both on an air compressor and a well pump. Brian Nampa, ID ________________________________ From: Shop-talk on behalf of John T. Bla= ir Sent: Tuesday, August 10, 2021 7:23 AM To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Subject: [Shop-talk] Compressor woos Hey gang, I have a Craftsman 5 hp 30 gal compressor that I purchased some time around '90. Here are the particulars: Compressor: Model 919.176951 MO-6436 Motor: GE Model 5KCR48SR59W Part #: C-MO 3013 RPM: 3450 Volt: 230 Amp: 13.1A Shaft size: 5/8" or 16mm SCFM @ 40 PSI 11.3 90 PSI 9.3 125 PSI 8.0 Cut In pressure - 100 Cut Out pressure - 125 The other day I was using my nail gun putting up molding around a window in my family room. All of a sudden the nail gun quit nailing. After check= ing the nail gun and not finding anything obviously wrong with it, I went down into the shop to see if the compressor was on or if I had inadvertently turned it off (old age, I forget what I just did). Anyway, the switch on t= he compressor was in the ON position, but there was only about 40 psi in the tank. I pulled the compressor's plug and stuck in the 220V recepticle, and was getting a reading of 0V on both legs. So I go to the circuit breaker panel and reset the breaker, nothing. So for some reason the breaker has bit the dirt. I pull the breaker and head off the hardware store for a new breaker. Put it in and the compressor fires back up, and I finish putting = the trim on the window. Well the next day, I needed the compressor so I turned it on, and I was working around the shop. The compressor came up to pressure and shut off. After using the air to clean off the filter on my shop vac, the compressor went to cut on, but it didn't start. I could hear a humming. I run over the the compressor, but before I can turn it off, it trips the new breaker. I pull the saftey shield and try to turn the flywheel to see if t= he compressor/motor has frozen. It moved easily, so both compressor and motor were OK. I turn the compressor back on, and it fires up. After a fe= w cycles, I hear the humming again. Again, but the time I can get to it, it has tripped the breaker. So there is something wrong with the motor. Anyone have any ideas? I was thinking that it is either a bad spot on the armature, or a bad start capacitor. If it's the capacitor, why would it st= art after I moved the position of the motor a few degrees? I check with a local shop and they want $200 to put it on their bench! I think that's a little steep. So I guess I'll open it up and shot gun the s= tart capacitor. Is there anything else I should l for while I'm in there? I do plan on cleaning all the parts while it's apart. I also don't see any place to oil the motor. So I'm assuming that it has bearings that are lubricated= for live. Or is there something I should do there, oil, grease? TIA John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948@cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." In God We Trust Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for oneself; freedom from control or restriction -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive family@msn.com --_000_MW2PR07MB397890B7A1408AA96AFC2A6CBBF79MW2PR07MB3978namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Take a look at the contacts in the pressure switch. They may be burnt or pi= tted and both legs of power are not making contact at the same time. I had = this happen both on an air compressor and a well pump.

Brian
Nampa, ID

From: Shop-talk <shop-ta= lk-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of John T. Blair <jblair1948@cox= .net>
Sent: Tuesday, August 10, 2021 7:23 AM
To: shop-talk@autox.team.net <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Subject: [Shop-talk] Compressor woos
 

Hey gang,

I have a Craftsman 5 hp 30 gal compressor that I purchased some time
around '90.  Here are the particulars:

Compressor:  Model 919.176951
            &nb= sp;     MO-6436

Motor:        GE Model 5KCR48SR59W
Part #:       C-MO 3013
RPM:           3450
Volt:          230
Amp:         13.1A
Shaft size:   5/8" or 16mm

SCFM @ 40 PSI   11.3
            &nb= sp; 90 PSI     9.3
           125 PSI &= nbsp;      8.0

Cut In  pressure - 100
Cut Out pressure - 125

The other day I was using my nail gun putting up molding around a window in my family room.  All of a sudden the nail gun quit nailing.  A= fter checking
the nail gun and not finding anything obviously wrong with it, I went down<= br> into the shop to see if the compressor was on or if I had inadvertently
turned it off (old age, I forget what I just did).  Anyway, the switch= on the
compressor was in the ON position, but there was only about 40 psi in the tank.  I pulled the compressor's plug and stuck in the 220V recepticle= , and
was getting a reading of 0V on both legs.  So I go to the circuit brea= ker
panel and reset the breaker, nothing.  So for some reason the breaker = has
bit the dirt.  I pull the breaker and head off the hardware store for = a new
breaker.  Put it in and the compressor fires back up, and I finish put= ting the
trim on the window.

Well the next day, I needed the compressor so I turned it on, and I was
working around the shop.  The compressor came up to pressure and shut<= br> off.  After using the air to clean off the filter on my shop vac, the<= br> compressor went to cut on, but it didn't start.  I could hear a hummin= g.  I
run over the the compressor, but before I can turn it off, it trips the new=
breaker.  I pull the saftey shield and try to turn the flywheel to see= if the
compressor/motor has frozen.  It moved easily, so both compressor and<= br> motor were OK.  I turn the compressor back on, and it fires up.  = After a few
cycles, I hear the humming again.  Again, but the time I can get to it= , it
has tripped the breaker.  So there is something wrong with the motor.<= br>
Anyone have any ideas?  I was thinking that it is either a bad spot on= the
armature, or a bad start capacitor.  If it's the capacitor, why would = it start
after I moved the position of the motor a few degrees?

I check with a local shop and they want $200 to put it on their bench! = ; I
think that's a little steep.  So I guess I'll open it up and shot gun = the start
capacitor.  Is there anything else I should l for while I'm in there?<= br>
I do plan on cleaning all the parts while it's apart.  I also don't see any place
to oil the motor.  So I'm assuming that it has bearings that are lubri= cated for
live.  Or is there something I should do there, oil, grease?

TIA

John







John T. Blair  WA4OHZ     email:  jblair1948@= cox.net
Va. Beach, Va          &n= bsp;       Phone:  (757) 495-8229

           48 TR1800 = ;   48 #4 Midget    65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)=
      75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)    77= Spitfire    71 Saab Sonett III
            &nb= sp;           65 Rambler = Classic

Morgan:    www.team.n= et/morgan
Bricklin:     www.b= ricklin.org

If you can read this         &= nbsp;   - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

 From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
      e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."=
      In God We Trust
      Liberty - the  power  of  cho= osing,  thinking,  and  acting  for
            &nb= sp;      oneself; freedom  from  control=   or  restriction




--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
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Shop-talk@autox.team.net
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Archive: http://www.tea= m.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive=

alk/maynerdfamily@msn.com"> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/maynerdfamily@msn.com
--_000_MW2PR07MB397890B7A1408AA96AFC2A6CBBF79MW2PR07MB3978namp_-- --===============4564596180129908964== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============4564596180129908964==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 12:24:19 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26BD6A253B for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 12:24:19 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from omta013.useast.a.cloudfilter.net (unknown [34.195.253.204]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5095A2356 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 12:09:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cxr.smtp.a.cloudfilter.net ([10.0.16.146]) by cmsmtp with ESMTP id DQS4mJjvV67fKDWBWmJUby; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 18:09:06 +0000 Received: from John-PC.cox.net ([24.254.211.210]) by cmsmtp with ESMTPSA id DWBTmizvj5Ib2DWBVmz1bm; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 18:09:06 +0000 Authentication-Results: cox.net; auth=pass (LOGIN) smtp.auth=jblair1948@cox.net a=vytuAFhf8Npo5rJvX1IL5Q==:117 a=vytuAFhf8Npo5rJvX1IL5Q==:17 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=kviXuzpPAAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=q6SfDYXhAAAA:8 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=kys2UyXWj07vxxawFQMA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=aav4MXMyVXkA:10 a=4zxjrV59PHAA:10 a=bz_d9vehOyUA:10 a=qrIFiuKZe2vaD64auk6j:22 a=GGGinmgZRQXmVEG1E52S:22 a=R7nWeq4dleIJhz-CJ_3q:22 Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 14:07:42 -0400 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net From: "John T. Blair" References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810090603.04b82da0@cox.net> 4W/+ieRZEEgTfdCzkndZkLM955SuQBJIED1DrHv3JPWahvhnV1yOR5Fhgn6odq70mzGUJCSu8TsAZv9vR2/3nSFJA1MXa/8qiPI= Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Compressor woos Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thanks to everyone that has replied with ideas and suggestions. Unfrounately, I didn't post this problem until after I had pulled the motor. So I think I'm going to try and open it up and see about getting a replacement capactor, trying to find & clean the centrifgual switch and cleaning up the motor. I can't say now that I remember hearing the unloader valve firing. So the compressor trying to start agains a high head pressure is a possibility. After I replace the cap. I'll replace the motor and test it and pay attention to the unloading of the pressure when the motor cuts off. I know I've heard it in the past, I just can't say for sure that it is doing that now. :( Thanks again, I'll keep you all informed. John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948@cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." In God We Trust Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for oneself; freedom from control or restriction -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 12:25:12 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34553A2573 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 12:25:12 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from omta013.useast.a.cloudfilter.net (unknown [34.195.253.204]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB64DA23F9 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 12:19:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cxr.smtp.a.cloudfilter.net ([10.0.16.208]) by cmsmtp with ESMTP id DSQsmJpgx67fKDWL8mJWiC; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 18:19:02 +0000 Received: from John-PC.cox.net ([24.254.211.210]) by cmsmtp with ESMTPSA id DWL5mGj8DJsXRDWL7mSRLL; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 18:19:02 +0000 Authentication-Results: cox.net; auth=pass (LOGIN) smtp.auth=jblair1948@cox.net a=vytuAFhf8Npo5rJvX1IL5Q==:117 a=vytuAFhf8Npo5rJvX1IL5Q==:17 a=kviXuzpPAAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=q6SfDYXhAAAA:8 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=5f-PP4KBX5N0zcxMjTgA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=aav4MXMyVXkA:10 a=4zxjrV59PHAA:10 a=bz_d9vehOyUA:10 a=u5VkieaxcqrPYX8wUDIA:9 a=qcy-TCHBWOQenAho:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=qrIFiuKZe2vaD64auk6j:22 a=GGGinmgZRQXmVEG1E52S:22 a=R7nWeq4dleIJhz-CJ_3q:22 Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 14:18:57 -0400 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net From: "John T. Blair" N5yGfCtiKDeQUvcvWE15IQtaOBDt4pKFh350RJ0g1PddHWAMxtzpOcPaTeEm2V2phayRjOPlDt/8K7+QpCaXr6wFCbxi2OR4dUI= Subject: [Shop-talk] More compressor questions Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6271406883128930677== boundary="=====================_19898270==.ALT" --=====================_19898270==.ALT Thanks again for all the replies to my original post about my compressor motor not working. With all this going on, I have been doing some thinking about having to buy a new compressor if I can't get this motor running. That said, this compressor appears to come with a 3hp, 4hp, and 5hp motor. I have the 5hp. I know that when it comes to getting a new compressor, bigger is better, to the extent of your budget. 1. What is the advantage of the different hp motors. I know the big advantage for the 5hp is it runs on 220V. But how does the hp affect the compressor. Based on the info in the manual, it appears that all 3 versions have the same SCFM specs. My current compressor is an oil lubricated one. 2. I see oil-less compressors that supposedly have fantastic specs for air supply that are so much cheaper than oil lubed versions. Any thoughts? 3. Any body have an oil-less compressor? How do you like it? I was reading an article that was talking about how the oil-less versions have come a long ways. They were saying that the biggest advantage for the oil liubes was for high air demand over a long time like in a commercial shop. But my dad's compressor, a 4hp 220V 20 gal unit and my 5hp 220V 30 gal rig were all oil lubed. We got dad's compressor back in the 60s and it was still running when he passed in 2015. I bought mine back about '90. So I lean toward them. But is that realistic? John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948@cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." In God We Trust Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for oneself; freedom from control or restriction -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus --=====================_19898270==.ALT
Thanks again for all the replies to my original post about my compressor motor
not working.

With all this going on, I have been doing some thinking about having to buy a new 
compressor if I can't get this motor running.  That said, this compressor appears
to come with a 3hp, 4hp, and 5hp motor.  I have the 5hp.  I know that when it
comes to getting a new compressor, bigger is better, to the extent of your budget. 

1. What is the advantage of the different hp motors.  I know the big advantage
for the 5hp is it runs on 220V.  But how does the hp affect the compressor. 
Based on the info in the manual, it appears that all 3 versions have the same
SCFM specs.

My current compressor is an oil lubricated one. 

2. I see oil-less compressors that supposedly have fantastic specs for air supply
that are so much cheaper than oil lubed versions.  Any thoughts?

3.  Any body have an oil-less compressor?  How do you like it?  I was reading an
article that was talking about how the oil-less versions have come a long ways. 
They were saying that the biggest advantage for the oil liubes was for high air
demand over a long time like in a commercial shop.  But my dad's compressor,
a 4hp 220V 20 gal unit and my 5hp 220V 30 gal rig were all oil lubed.  We got dad's
compressor back in the 60s and it was still running when he passed in 2015.  I
bought mine back about '90.  So I lean toward them.  But is that realistic?

John




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This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
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John T. Blair  WA4OHZ     email:  jblair1948@cox.net
Va. Beach, Va                  Phone:  (757) 495-8229

          48 TR1800    48 #4 Midget    65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
     75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)    77 Spitfire    71 Saab Sonett III
                       65 Rambler Classic

Bricklin:     www.bricklin.org

If you can read this             - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
     e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
     In God We Trust
     Liberty - the  power  of  choosing,  thinking,  and  acting  for 
                  oneself; freedom  from  control  or  restriction 


--=====================_19898270==.ALT-- --===============6271406883128930677== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6271406883128930677==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 12:39:10 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EC66A1C7B for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 12:39:10 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ms11p00im-qufo17291701.me.com (unknown [17.58.38.46]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62E73A1AF4 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 12:38:52 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1628620733; bh=/1k+WIriJA0mIteE/8qpdHU6d17MwF5oCoI+OSMHF+g=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=X3FjceIoWpw5e6rrVnGF9BNFWKz3fwcy7Ij12JLJTX0TUjv8+klqP+dru++bU0mO1 h/HaNHiF64hCIkjSLKDOgom7STYCJnBsGfoiRZEmOORm400K34ajGIXMTJaE4mqOex u1PvxkixJetdBMA90seYCnoIM7jIyJedhY4JVyFqHu9tMZ6rsehuMTgGGNdKVUCxAN epR79gvqgTcmtiH3x34TPhlxhhWWlfvmKrg5ZRbbjkyELiA2MIqnQ6U3LrVw0x4geB PadqAL7tCpemnvw80sj7lTGINYunuDgaPtk8G/D3+mjaGoszVSI1gyFc5DUPqhu4xp VQ2dtehAUosjg== Received: from [10.172.149.167] (mobile-107-92-58-143.mycingular.net [107.92.58.143]) by ms11p00im-qufo17291701.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id B898264017D; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 18:38:52 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 13:38:51 -0500 References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810140842.06832f90@cox.net> To: "John T. Blair" =?UTF-8?Q?2903e8d5c8f:6.0.391,18.0.790,17.0.607.475.0000000_definitions?= =?UTF-8?Q?=3D2021-08-10=5F08:2021-08-06=5F01,2021-08-10=5F08,2020-04-07?= =?UTF-8?Q?=5F01_signatures=3D0?= mlxscore=0 adultscore=0 clxscore=1015 malwarescore=0 spamscore=0 bulkscore=0 suspectscore=0 phishscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2108100122 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] More compressor questions Cc: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5681544047344605118== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-B4C937DF-837A-46A0-A949-5D5FAD7E11A6 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Good questions. I think it all depends how much you are going to use it & ho= w reliable it NEEDS to be.=20 As to what hp rating, I suspect with the CFM & pressure being equal that the= main difference is how much headroom the motor has. If the motor is running= at or near capacity it won=E2=80=99t last as long.=20 If you are using lots of air & your budget allows, consider a 2 stage compr= essor.=20 I had a small oil less compressor that I used on job sites it worked fine un= til one day it just started running longer, then pressure dropped. The pisto= n seal died. I purchased an oil lubricated unit to replace it.=20 If you are mainly using air tools & not painting, I=E2=80=99d go with oil. M= ost of my usage is air tools & media blasting. When we needed to paint a veh= icle we just added an oil separator & filter. Worked fine.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 10, 2021, at 1:25 PM, John T. Blair wrote: =EF=BB=BF=20 Thanks again for all the replies to my original post about my compressor mot= or not working. With all this going on, I have been doing some thinking about having to buy a= new =20 compressor if I can't get this motor running. That said, this compressor ap= pears=20 to come with a 3hp, 4hp, and 5hp motor. I have the 5hp. I know that when i= t comes to getting a new compressor, bigger is better, to the extent of your b= udget. =20 1. What is the advantage of the different hp motors. I know the big advanta= ge for the 5hp is it runs on 220V. But how does the hp affect the compressor. = =20 Based on the info in the manual, it appears that all 3 versions have the sam= e=20 SCFM specs. My current compressor is an oil lubricated one. =20 2. I see oil-less compressors that supposedly have fantastic specs for air s= upply that are so much cheaper than oil lubed versions. Any thoughts? 3. Any body have an oil-less compressor? How do you like it? I was readin= g an article that was talking about how the oil-less versions have come a long wa= ys. =20 They were saying that the biggest advantage for the oil liubes was for high a= ir demand over a long time like in a commercial shop. But my dad's compressor,= a 4hp 220V 20 gal unit and my 5hp 220V 30 gal rig were all oil lubed. We go= t dad's compressor back in the 60s and it was still running when he passed in 2015. = I=20 bought mine back about '90. So I lean toward them. But is that realistic? John =09 This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.=20 www.avast.com John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948@cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! =46rom Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." In God We Trust Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for=20 oneself; freedom from control or restriction=20 _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com --Apple-Mail-B4C937DF-837A-46A0-A949-5D5FAD7E11A6 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Good questions. I think it all depends how m= uch you are going to use it & how reliable it NEEDS to be. 
As to what hp rating, I suspect with the CFM & pressure bein= g equal that the main difference is how much headroom the motor has. If the m= otor is running at or near capacity it won=E2=80=99t last as long. 

If you are using lots of air & your budget allows,=  consider a 2 stage compressor. 

I had a= small oil less compressor that I used on job sites it worked fine until one= day it just started running longer, then pressure dropped. The piston seal d= ied. I purchased an oil lubricated unit to replace it. 

<= /div>
If you are mainly using air tools & not painting, I=E2=80=99d g= o with oil. Most of my usage is air tools & media blasting. When we need= ed to paint a vehicle we just added an oil separator & filter. Worked fi= ne. 

Peace,
Pat

Pat Hor= ne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


On Aug 10, 2021, at 1:25 PM, John T. Blair <jblair1948@cox= .net> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF
Thanks again for all the replies to my original post about my compressor motor
not working.

With all this going on, I have been doing some thinking about having to buy a new 
compressor if I can't get this motor running.  That said, this compressor appears
to come with a 3hp, 4hp, and 5hp motor.  I have the 5hp.  I know that when it
comes to getting a new compressor, bigger is better, to the extent of your budget. 

1. What is the advantage of the different hp motors.  I know the big advantage
for the 5hp is it runs on 220V.  But how does the hp affect the compressor. 
Based on the info in the manual, it appears that all 3 versions have the same
SCFM specs.

My current compressor is an oil lubricated one. 

2. I see oil-less compressors that supposedly have fantastic specs for air supply
that are so much cheaper than oil lubed versions.  Any thoughts?

3.  Any body have an oil-less compressor?  How do you like it?  I was reading an
article that was talking about how the oil-less versions have come a long ways. 
They were saying that the biggest advantage for the oil liubes was for high air
demand over a long time like in a commercial shop.  But my dad's compressor,
a 4hp 220V 20 gal unit and my 5hp 220V 30 gal rig were all oil lubed.  We got dad's
compressor back in the 60s and it was still running when he passed in 2015.  I
bought mine back about '90.  So I lean toward them.  But is that realistic?

John




3D"Avast

This email has been checked for viruses by A= vast antivirus software.
www.avast.com


<= /a>

John T. Blair  WA4OHZ     email:  jblair1948@cox.net
Va. Beach, Va            &n= bsp;     Phone:  (757) 495-8229

          48 TR1800    48 #4 Midget    65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
     75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)    77 Spitfire    71 Saab Sonett III
            &nbs= p;          65 Rambler Classic
Bricklin:     www.bricklin.org=

If you can read this            = - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

=46rom Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
     e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
     In God We Trust
     Liberty - the  power  of  choosing,  thinking,  and  acting  for 
            &nbs= p;     oneself; freedom  from  control  or  restriction 


_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.= net/donate.html
Suggested annual donation  $12.96
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.tea= m.net/archive

Unsubscribe/Manage: http://au= tox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@icloud.com

= --Apple-Mail-B4C937DF-837A-46A0-A949-5D5FAD7E11A6-- --===============5681544047344605118== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============5681544047344605118==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 12:42:49 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38971A21B5 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 12:42:49 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ej1-f51.google.com (unknown [209.85.218.51]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C349CA1969 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 12:42:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-ej1-f51.google.com with SMTP id u3so37287476ejz.1 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 11:42:31 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=DRVS3whQIjk3e9sWI2/ewj8DUTvaDhjgWXb+kxW1FUY=; b=mZAYQ4ydleJqauFlgVB+m6p1LJ8Y13VUeFe6+CSf5YVvdqrozyN+Eb6Ro+ReDdEqy8 rIdtN9mwSbEbb45C2ad+4sfKZ39HVzw0UtIlIi2s5z6rDETnXg+Yy0RyEAM+OlZ6/wzJ 9Y5BVHPqVXEkWPJ5iudqav2/LWlPqrOZ3E0lXPUi2UmkHjNa64PFOpizRnpAJqs2tmpZ WR8WBPfYrOijq0ZHh0YQXaaFPDbVGLA6aWRx5Puj0jjSKEURG1yBR34Tyjqm9CxQKTq5 S+inEKkdpzURsa0PZzn5vtz+NBNFtJi1ESxpXkknpbrRGOApiy/Fk2Ltj0oL659O/DId RzIQ== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=DRVS3whQIjk3e9sWI2/ewj8DUTvaDhjgWXb+kxW1FUY=; b=BIxhsuPEIssKVBXDri5q91hKzaeqoCmGTEQh/SYPqUlwC3D976Pz4U7G9Ue5yXoTW5 1x/S8XrrUxydJCd1eK0k2EdNvQ3mTMC8P4kRjg/ExxF97oImt/N5/AgExqZLK6/AadX2 KV2i373RNQ5COfUrdMwYD9cDJ+MrGjNjjoYlnpb/sA20qywGInnwEzDz7LLKcT20oZIa mLMrErnSKhQTjm/+SgLvuPEa1CfbzMNPa6XxJa8G3lx1ZFtSaxpvmf8uvQnJzA8wBkJX 0drcDHPBlmXJ2jPUr8BaZKvm0iwjhcF4JOee4jkzfX0jqNRNW2HR5vfnPxxgpYyRQZVV HS/Q== c7cd5eXx8ghBXDSIoHQwT5fnuQyH5ktPmAa/t+0= kv15mr15574766ejc.460.1628620950945; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 11:42:30 -0700 (PDT) References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810140842.06832f90@cox.net> From: old dirtbeard Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 11:42:19 -0700 To: "John T. Blair" Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] More compressor questions Cc: shop-talk@autox.team.net Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============1789235935519181189== --0000000000004161f205c938dd8a Hi John, The oil-less compressors probably are good enough for casual use, but the ones that I have been around were noisy, probably because they tend to have aluminum blocks and that they tend to spin at higher RPM than the larger, heavier cast iron oil-type compressors. The noise they make also seems more annoying to my ear, anyway. A larger, slower spinning pump emits noise, of course, but it does not seem as harsh as the noise from the oil-less compressor that I have heard. One advantage of the oil-less compressors is that they will not inject oil into the air supply if you are spraying paint. FYIW best, doug On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 11:25 AM John T. Blair wrote: > > Thanks again for all the replies to my original post about my compressor > motor > not working. > > With all this going on, I have been doing some thinking about having to > buy a new > compressor if I can't get this motor running. That said, this compressor > appears > to come with a 3hp, 4hp, and 5hp motor. I have the 5hp. I know that when > it > comes to getting a new compressor, bigger is better, to the extent of your > budget. > > 1. What is the advantage of the different hp motors. I know the big > advantage > for the 5hp is it runs on 220V. But how does the hp affect the > compressor. > Based on the info in the manual, it appears that all 3 versions have the > same > SCFM specs. > > My current compressor is an oil lubricated one. > > 2. I see oil-less compressors that supposedly have fantastic specs for air > supply > that are so much cheaper than oil lubed versions. Any thoughts? > > 3. Any body have an oil-less compressor? How do you like it? I was > reading an > article that was talking about how the oil-less versions have come a long > ways. > They were saying that the biggest advantage for the oil liubes was for > high air > demand over a long time like in a commercial shop. But my dad's > compressor, > a 4hp 220V 20 gal unit and my 5hp 220V 30 gal rig were all oil lubed. We > got dad's > compressor back in the 60s and it was still running when he passed in > 2015. I > bought mine back about '90. So I lean toward them. But is that realistic? > > John > > > > > ------------------------------ > [image: Avast logo] > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > www.avast.com > > <#m_-911417382658544781_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> > > John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948@cox.net > Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 > > 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) > 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III > 65 Rambler Classic > > Morgan: www.team.net/morgan > Bricklin: www.bricklin.org > > If you can read this - Thank a teacher! > If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! > > From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: > e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." > In God We Trust > Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for > oneself; freedom from control or restriction > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com > > --0000000000004161f205c938dd8a Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi John,

The oil-less compressors proba= bly are good enough for casual use, but the ones that I have been around we= re noisy, probably because they tend to have aluminum blocks and that they = tend to spin at higher RPM than the larger, heavier cast iron oil-type=C2= =A0compressors.

The noise they make also seems mor= e annoying to my ear, anyway. A larger, slower spinning pump emits noise, o= f course, but it does not seem as harsh as the noise from the oil-less comp= ressor that I have heard.

One advantage of the oil= -less compressors is that they will not inject oil into the air supply if y= ou are spraying paint.

FYIW

best,

doug

On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 11:25 A= M John T. Blair <jblair1948@cox.ne= t> wrote:

Thanks again for all the replies to my original post about my compressor motor
not working.

With all this going on, I have been doing some thinking about having to buy a new=C2=A0
compressor if I can't get this motor running.=C2=A0 That said, this compressor appears
to come with a 3hp, 4hp, and 5hp motor.=C2=A0 I have the 5hp.=C2=A0 I know that when it
comes to getting a new compressor, bigger is better, to the extent of your budget.=C2=A0

1. What is the advantage of the different hp motors.=C2=A0 I know the big advantage
for the 5hp is it runs on 220V.=C2=A0 But how does the hp affect the compressor.=C2=A0
Based on the info in the manual, it appears that all 3 versions have the same
SCFM specs.

My current compressor is an oil lubricated one.=C2=A0

2. I see oil-less compressors that supposedly have fantastic specs for air supply
that are so much cheaper than oil lubed versions.=C2=A0 Any thoughts?

3.=C2=A0 Any body have an oil-less compressor?=C2=A0 How do you like it?=C2=A0 I was reading an
article that was talking about how the oil-less versions have come a long ways.=C2=A0
They were saying that the biggest advantage for the oil liubes was for high air
demand over a long time like in a commercial shop.=C2=A0 But my dad's compressor,
a 4hp 220V 20 gal unit and my 5hp 220V 30 gal rig were all oil lubed.=C2=A0 We got dad's
compressor back in the 60s and it was still running when he passed in 2015.=C2=A0 I
bought mine back about '90.=C2=A0 So I lean toward them.=C2=A0 But is that realistic?

John




3D"Avast

This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
www.a= vast.com



John T. Blair=C2=A0 WA4OHZ=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 email:=C2=A0 jblair1948@cox.net<= /a>
Va. Beach, Va=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Phone:=C2=A0 (757) 495-8229

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 48 TR1800=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 48 #4 Midget=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 77 Spitfire=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 71 Saab Sonett III
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 65 Rambler Classic
Bricklin:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 www.bricklin.org

If you can read this=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0 - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 In God We Trust
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Liberty - the=C2=A0 power=C2=A0 of=C2=A0 choosing,=C2=A0 thinking,=C2=A0 and=C2=A0 acting=C2=A0 for=C2=A0
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 oneself; freedom=C2=A0 from=C2=A0 control=C2=A0 or=C2=A0 restriction=C2=A0


_______________________________________________

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et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

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--0000000000004161f205c938dd8a-- --===============1789235935519181189== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============1789235935519181189==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 13:05:32 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 574CBA220D for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 13:05:32 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-yb1-f171.google.com (unknown [209.85.219.171]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A6B5BA01B4 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 12:59:48 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-yb1-f171.google.com with SMTP id b133so38039053ybg.4 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 11:59:49 -0700 (PDT) d=maracing-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=WKcqbHAoM9SoSv9DhypP+0Rea8yoHitH0tWDSQT/hHw=; b=ZRlie5klyHA8LQxsx5Lj8nTj0j/d+VKQ2FO3u6sv+ABF3V2ErrnG1IQj2kAsWSV0KB oYt8UxQ+HZShm1ksopujHgF4Dfq44vww6SGf3CIuanddtJK1CuqIMU5m+5Jo5AuVP299 7NxwpKOnWWWPIBNQkLoBRt8WiLbdSH6hdpNJcvhbrPct2YP+4lfEAiAAd62A2k04sA70 I4/JULS9lGKDMyU/AJB3GXButsiGHo46k5YC2WA+xkoLar3FZMXjQA0vOGubMPKofUH8 SOnMjVRaH8h1NR/43VI43gWEZGmJdvZTq9V3sCWenoH+9biBj1O09z+qvtV7+wJLmDkY 8gLA== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=WKcqbHAoM9SoSv9DhypP+0Rea8yoHitH0tWDSQT/hHw=; b=glTC8KgPG727l6zBxjqAYAmgLSSTDFef5xxHsVkXPz4MXZjuqFJ+/QlpCG8oi5zteV KDUHktdv5JJ3FqsmYnvD2egSt50H62+u0Py/PkPQVLa8BYDN9vhD5RDlTndIrrZJ5dO7 plpPZF8CXqKVq65kMdjFUKSw4A/+9CgNDoXZqNRbXT6pUqDlLAFBx/6RmyKYNexvkLG/ OYQYDswwbk/PSWSB4yHMPWt1dk7jnud5Xcs7bTkKIu83D5tQTZViy2pkA+diNDY0AdkM XdkTTuiuZpGiDUdYyn7oZCzbZ5QxenLNOuAsyyiRss0wngKML2zlOtOdtCZg3IdKJ6By mH9w== l2SIaqX44mIzfsIUvSE0zFOow826PJSI8jemyoU9XVgWDYRwEPqY n184mr41970319ybn.496.1628621989213; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 11:59:49 -0700 (PDT) References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810140842.06832f90@cox.net> From: Mark Andy Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 14:59:42 -0400 To: ShopTalk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] More compressor questions Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3597148406550712118== --00000000000024066a05c9391bb3 Howdy, If I were buying a compressor today and the air requirements were modest, I would be looking HARD at one of the super quiet compressor types that are available now. HF link just because it's easy, but there are also name brand versions of this type of thing IIRC... https://www.harborfreight.com/26-gallon-175-psi-ultra-quiet-vertical-shopauto-air-compressor-57336.html Mark On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 2:42 PM old dirtbeard wrote: > Hi John, > > The oil-less compressors probably are good enough for casual use, but the > ones that I have been around were noisy, probably because they tend to have > aluminum blocks and that they tend to spin at higher RPM than the larger, > heavier cast iron oil-type compressors. > > The noise they make also seems more annoying to my ear, anyway. A larger, > slower spinning pump emits noise, of course, but it does not seem as harsh > as the noise from the oil-less compressor that I have heard. > > One advantage of the oil-less compressors is that they will not inject oil > into the air supply if you are spraying paint. > > FYIW > > best, > > doug > > On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 11:25 AM John T. Blair wrote: > >> >> Thanks again for all the replies to my original post about my compressor >> motor >> not working. >> >> With all this going on, I have been doing some thinking about having to >> buy a new >> compressor if I can't get this motor running. That said, this compressor >> appears >> to come with a 3hp, 4hp, and 5hp motor. I have the 5hp. I know that >> when it >> comes to getting a new compressor, bigger is better, to the extent of >> your budget. >> >> 1. What is the advantage of the different hp motors. I know the big >> advantage >> for the 5hp is it runs on 220V. But how does the hp affect the >> compressor. >> Based on the info in the manual, it appears that all 3 versions have the >> same >> SCFM specs. >> >> My current compressor is an oil lubricated one. >> >> 2. I see oil-less compressors that supposedly have fantastic specs for >> air supply >> that are so much cheaper than oil lubed versions. Any thoughts? >> >> 3. Any body have an oil-less compressor? How do you like it? I was >> reading an >> article that was talking about how the oil-less versions have come a long >> ways. >> They were saying that the biggest advantage for the oil liubes was for >> high air >> demand over a long time like in a commercial shop. But my dad's >> compressor, >> a 4hp 220V 20 gal unit and my 5hp 220V 30 gal rig were all oil lubed. We >> got dad's >> compressor back in the 60s and it was still running when he passed in >> 2015. I >> bought mine back about '90. So I lean toward them. But is that >> realistic? >> >> John >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> [image: Avast logo] >> >> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >> www.avast.com >> >> >> <#m_283659243399797963_m_-911417382658544781_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> >> >> John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948@cox.net >> Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 >> >> 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) >> 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III >> 65 Rambler Classic >> >> Morgan: www.team.net/morgan >> Bricklin: www.bricklin.org >> >> If you can read this - Thank a teacher! >> If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! >> >> From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: >> e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." >> In God We Trust >> Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for >> oneself; freedom from control or restriction >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk >> http://autox.team.net/archive >> >> Unsubscribe/Manage: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka@maracing.com > > --00000000000024066a05c9391bb3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Howdy,

If I were buying=C2=A0a compress= or today and the air requirements were modest, I would be looking HARD at o= ne of the super quiet=C2=A0compressor types that are available now.

= HF link just because it's easy, but there are also name brand versions = of this type of thing IIRC...

https://www.harborfreight.com/26-gallon-175-psi-ultra-quiet-vertical-sho= pauto-air-compressor-57336.html

Mark

On Tue, Aug 10, 2021= at 2:42 PM old dirtbeard <dirtbe= ard@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi John,

The oil-less comp= ressors probably are good enough for casual use, but the ones that I have b= een around were noisy, probably because they tend to have aluminum blocks a= nd that they tend to spin at higher RPM than the larger, heavier cast iron = oil-type=C2=A0compressors.

The noise they make als= o seems more annoying to my ear, anyway. A larger, slower spinning pump emi= ts noise, of course, but it does not seem as harsh as the noise from the oi= l-less compressor that I have heard.

One advantage= of the oil-less compressors is that they will not inject oil into the air = supply if you are spraying paint.

FYIW
<= br>
best,

doug

On Tue, Aug 10, 2021= at 11:25 AM John T. Blair <jblair1948@cox.net> wrote:

Thanks again for all the replies to my original post about my compressor motor
not working.

With all this going on, I have been doing some thinking about having to buy a new=C2=A0
compressor if I can't get this motor running.=C2=A0 That said, this compressor appears
to come with a 3hp, 4hp, and 5hp motor.=C2=A0 I have the 5hp.=C2=A0 I know that when it
comes to getting a new compressor, bigger is better, to the extent of your budget.=C2=A0

1. What is the advantage of the different hp motors.=C2=A0 I know the big advantage
for the 5hp is it runs on 220V.=C2=A0 But how does the hp affect the compressor.=C2=A0
Based on the info in the manual, it appears that all 3 versions have the same
SCFM specs.

My current compressor is an oil lubricated one.=C2=A0

2. I see oil-less compressors that supposedly have fantastic specs for air supply
that are so much cheaper than oil lubed versions.=C2=A0 Any thoughts?

3.=C2=A0 Any body have an oil-less compressor?=C2=A0 How do you like it?=C2=A0 I was reading an
article that was talking about how the oil-less versions have come a long ways.=C2=A0
They were saying that the biggest advantage for the oil liubes was for high air
demand over a long time like in a commercial shop.=C2=A0 But my dad's compressor,
a 4hp 220V 20 gal unit and my 5hp 220V 30 gal rig were all oil lubed.=C2=A0 We got dad's
compressor back in the 60s and it was still running when he passed in 2015.=C2=A0 I
bought mine back about '90.=C2=A0 So I lean toward them.=C2=A0 But is that realistic?

John




3D"Avast

This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
www.a= vast.com



John T. Blair=C2=A0 WA4OHZ=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 email:=C2=A0 jblair1948@cox.net<= /a>
Va. Beach, Va=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Phone:=C2=A0 (757) 495-8229

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 48 TR1800=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 48 #4 Midget=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 77 Spitfire=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 71 Saab Sonett III
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 65 Rambler Classic
Bricklin:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 www.bricklin.org

If you can read this=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0 - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 In God We Trust
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Liberty - the=C2=A0 power=C2=A0 of=C2=A0 choosing,=C2=A0 thinking,=C2=A0 and=C2=A0 acting=C2=A0 for=C2=A0
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 oneself; freedom=C2=A0 from=C2=A0 control=C2=A0 or=C2=A0 restriction=C2=A0


_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

alk/dirtbeard@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.= team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com

_______________________________________________

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et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

alk/marka@maracing.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.t= eam.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka@maracing.com

--00000000000024066a05c9391bb3-- --===============3597148406550712118== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============3597148406550712118==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 13:40:06 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82CA8A2384 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 13:40:06 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-lf1-f51.google.com (unknown [209.85.167.51]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D1E3A2326 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 13:36:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-lf1-f51.google.com with SMTP id w20so96746lfu.7 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 12:36:31 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=OMw0QPS3sD3TaDZHGW23cxJ/MOtdbeVi1aFOA/PuDB8=; b=tH5UbshSpZeDQn0QzZJmqE5t3TgtprAfL/pNRRtipW9sIThQEF/+UoU5wULLR2Eblu elhz1z9AJcnYvCvDzgkdR6Hmpyb2g7ZUV37zXTA9OS6/7tChm0DmoAG9SVtZV9ECZDg0 FAvtKUNI8rkTUIuMVT6hp7fqWTJVIAO4iBl5DlI6HX6jd+ZOFkn6kGTC8MRzf2U3k8OI EYbaaHNqHl5B3zgZZZsICiBJCVXSoDaR3feY6M5jZUxC7W8GT9Jd+RZ3R/pevIB4bVBZ 9KrtmRpDlal5iMA3kb8uqlwR9QEErejfv0gEXg7HoBQ3W5fKymdVJyn3mCjadMz3Zo69 FWaw== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=OMw0QPS3sD3TaDZHGW23cxJ/MOtdbeVi1aFOA/PuDB8=; b=BD3KPzIBAO7vdoRIP+ABZb0eR23WvWblMkdmU9II784XU13EhQu6McD2NvnZoITBRf 0AQjXyk/x5ylFhLG+k2dHcsKiwZBK0hw1SOh7jNtYIN6wAZidG6gCYsMcfEx1xQj/CPF L7qmfrAmp6D5BJKm/aeQPoCE3Gftb1EroyabL8DlNaFekcUUe+jRQk/MzHpHeUFvaL3Q u1bhRcic/RbUIZ8BRzbTPxxOqt11e3FohAOJoJs/0p2ljBvoOH0u8eBwceocwqfuW+fb QfFXh/E71IN4BIDFQaxctCT+oG3IbjtckmRYMm0FHC+Yhc1W8/fHtZ0cO11ncCATtbib Q3fQ== cDC7hhhSBa43OiqHrfSeOtxdOCmUWwXhfnLV8VQ= Tue, 10 Aug 2021 12:36:28 -0700 (PDT) References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810090603.04b82da0@cox.net> From: Jeff Scarbrough Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 15:36:17 -0400 To: Doug Braun Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Compressor woos Cc: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============9023383656485653750== --0000000000003f930c05c9399e46 I like this one. A squirt of WD-40 should loosen it up. My table saw does this occasionally, but it's only 66 years old On Tue, Aug 10, 2021, 10:41 Doug Braun wrote: > Isn't there a centrifugal switch that disconnects the start capacitor as > soon as the motor starts spinning? > Possibly that isn't working properly? > > Doug > > On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 9:25 AM John T. Blair wrote: > >> >> Anyone have any ideas? I was thinking that it is either a bad spot on the >> armature, or a bad start capacitor. If it's the capacitor, why would it >> start >> after I moved the position of the motor a few degrees? >> >> I check with a local shop and they want $200 to put it on their bench! I >> think that's a little steep. So I guess I'll open it up and shot gun the >> start >> capacitor. Is there anything else I should l for while I'm in there? >> >> I do plan on cleaning all the parts while it's apart. I also don't >> see any place >> to oil the motor. So I'm assuming that it has bearings that are >> lubricated for >> live. Or is there something I should do there, oil, grease? >> >> _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate@gmail.com > > --0000000000003f930c05c9399e46 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I like this one.=C2=A0 A squirt of WD-40 should loosen it= up.=C2=A0 My table saw does this occasionally, but it's only 66 years = old=C2=A0

On Tue, Aug 10, 2021, 10:41 Doug Braun <doug@dougbraun.com> wrote:
Isn't there a centrifugal switch th= at disconnects the start capacitor as soon as the motor starts spinning?
Possibly that isn't working properly?=C2=A0

=
Doug

On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 9:25 AM John T. Blair <jblair= 1948@cox.net> wrote:

Anyone have any ideas?=C2=A0 I was thinking that it is either a bad spot on= the
armature, or a bad start capacitor.=C2=A0 If it's the capacitor, why wo= uld it start
after I moved the position of the motor a few degrees?

I check with a local shop and they want $200 to put it on their bench!=C2= =A0 I
think that's a little steep.=C2=A0 So I guess I'll open it up and s= hot gun the start
capacitor.=C2=A0 Is there anything else I should l for while I'm in the= re?

I do plan on cleaning all the parts while it's apart.=C2=A0 I also don&= #39;t
see any place
to oil the motor.=C2=A0 So I'm assuming that it has bearings that are l= ubricated for
live.=C2=A0 Or is there something I should do there, oil, grease?

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
errer" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

alk/fishplate@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">ht= tp://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate@gmail.com

--0000000000003f930c05c9399e46-- --===============9023383656485653750== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============9023383656485653750==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 14:41:29 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC40AA23B8 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 14:41:29 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-lf1-f44.google.com (unknown [209.85.167.44]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0CB8A23B2 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 14:40:16 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-lf1-f44.google.com with SMTP id w20so493488lfu.7 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 13:40:18 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=fFB4b0m5Gb0jCOVpdofQg3YD3rLpqKLdprmNEo2zTj8=; b=Bhxx+I5brIegXiDF1ODZKIFIonpuO5QIiPm6JDFcHTscAbo+iB9Qr6dWJAUDvNJ+DW oCgm35AWyhU+XCVJdxkBrPucCvk6ggO7Wx7KaSyTpBz3hNmX0MK0+LEFcQ/6NPG7N/2T Np8WEpGEJbRCG/0YRvVLjaQj31fXC60NQYyQ5pMopeQqT35HSC31S27pjw/pCU7W6doW Yw+s1bQCRRK0qDns4S2VaqRFd0KCmD8Nwyz82FYlZjewvCmOEJ/K2zTb8j6lCC/eQ8xC rwBx8pmL0a56q620cDhx9jHzeH7AgJSh+7+1NtoFE1gHdy+2KtHIuRLUKWgljaszeC6I ffQA== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=fFB4b0m5Gb0jCOVpdofQg3YD3rLpqKLdprmNEo2zTj8=; b=t55bWFN22EVTIwx6t/Xsk+qZW7UPFoUzTITL4GC/g2PczpuIWcLW/L94j41Ya6+0+y i84pbVGhJlT4p3B3HvbdTEgErgSQwjGZAcvve1Y9Wa/sOcIV1ziZVMuOcGarCIxCQx95 EhhBPhxEiwgVBhtpfR+ZEWvX+/GUN25VM7uobMdNa9AsjvaCZpDUpjY256dpINL9altQ D0vAnNGM0jo9BEArbu/P8HmbLZkEpq8dJbA2zfQiJ6xSoytma1+bL9Ovqjait5LVZDW7 8J1B7Bcj+hyPMYtG6HJgRkoXyaBrl5oinuOd8rZUuhbQdWB7lBXp2+dtIww2II9WCNOa EBEg== QOHzR/WPOkfMN5X7DltiAgKE5DOZCyY8IWymflk= Tue, 10 Aug 2021 13:40:16 -0700 (PDT) References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810140842.06832f90@cox.net> From: Jeff Scarbrough Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 16:40:05 -0400 To: Mark Andy Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] More compressor questions Cc: ShopTalk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5870102064915100658== --0000000000006ac87a05c93a82e9 We just bought a Kobalt version of that to sun some scanning equipment in our new air filtration system. Have only turned it on once so far, but it's definitely not as loud as I thought it would be. On Tue, Aug 10, 2021, 15:05 Mark Andy wrote: > Howdy, > > If I were buying a compressor today and the air requirements were modest, > I would be looking HARD at one of the super quiet compressor types that are > available now. > > HF link just because it's easy, but there are also name brand versions of > this type of thing IIRC... > > > https://www.harborfreight.com/26-gallon-175-psi-ultra-quiet-vertical-shopauto-air-compressor-57336.html > > Mark > > On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 2:42 PM old dirtbeard wrote: > >> Hi John, >> >> The oil-less compressors probably are good enough for casual use, but the >> ones that I have been around were noisy, probably because they tend to have >> aluminum blocks and that they tend to spin at higher RPM than the larger, >> heavier cast iron oil-type compressors. >> >> The noise they make also seems more annoying to my ear, anyway. A larger, >> slower spinning pump emits noise, of course, but it does not seem as harsh >> as the noise from the oil-less compressor that I have heard. >> >> One advantage of the oil-less compressors is that they will not inject >> oil into the air supply if you are spraying paint. >> >> FYIW >> >> best, >> >> doug >> >> On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 11:25 AM John T. Blair >> wrote: >> >>> >>> Thanks again for all the replies to my original post about my compressor >>> motor >>> not working. >>> >>> With all this going on, I have been doing some thinking about having to >>> buy a new >>> compressor if I can't get this motor running. That said, this >>> compressor appears >>> to come with a 3hp, 4hp, and 5hp motor. I have the 5hp. I know that >>> when it >>> comes to getting a new compressor, bigger is better, to the extent of >>> your budget. >>> >>> 1. What is the advantage of the different hp motors. I know the big >>> advantage >>> for the 5hp is it runs on 220V. But how does the hp affect the >>> compressor. >>> Based on the info in the manual, it appears that all 3 versions have the >>> same >>> SCFM specs. >>> >>> My current compressor is an oil lubricated one. >>> >>> 2. I see oil-less compressors that supposedly have fantastic specs for >>> air supply >>> that are so much cheaper than oil lubed versions. Any thoughts? >>> >>> 3. Any body have an oil-less compressor? How do you like it? I was >>> reading an >>> article that was talking about how the oil-less versions have come a >>> long ways. >>> They were saying that the biggest advantage for the oil liubes was for >>> high air >>> demand over a long time like in a commercial shop. But my dad's >>> compressor, >>> a 4hp 220V 20 gal unit and my 5hp 220V 30 gal rig were all oil lubed. >>> We got dad's >>> compressor back in the 60s and it was still running when he passed in >>> 2015. I >>> bought mine back about '90. So I lean toward them. But is that >>> realistic? >>> >>> John >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> [image: Avast logo] >>> >>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >>> www.avast.com >>> >>> >>> <#m_-3996500071811484852_m_283659243399797963_m_-911417382658544781_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> >>> >>> John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948@cox.net >>> Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 >>> >>> 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) >>> 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III >>> 65 Rambler Classic >>> >>> Morgan: www.team.net/morgan >>> Bricklin: www.bricklin.org >>> >>> If you can read this - Thank a teacher! >>> If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! >>> >>> From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: >>> e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." >>> In God We Trust >>> Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for >>> oneself; freedom from control or restriction >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> >>> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk >>> http://autox.team.net/archive >>> >>> Unsubscribe/Manage: >>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk >> http://autox.team.net/archive >> >> Unsubscribe/Manage: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka@maracing.com >> >> _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate@gmail.com > > --0000000000006ac87a05c93a82e9 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
We just bought a Kobalt version of that to sun some scann= ing equipment in our new air filtration system.=C2=A0 Have only turned it o= n once so far, but it's definitely not as loud as I thought it would be= .

On Tue, Aug 10, 2021, 15:05 Mark Andy <marka@maracing.com> wrote:
Howdy,

If I were buying=C2=A0a com= pressor today and the air requirements were modest, I would be looking HARD= at one of the super quiet=C2=A0compressor types that are available now.
HF link just because it's easy, but there are also name brand vers= ions of this type of thing IIRC...

https://www.harborfreight.com/= 26-gallon-175-psi-ultra-quiet-vertical-shopauto-air-compressor-57336.html

Mark

Hi John,

The oil-less co= mpressors probably are good enough for casual use, but the ones that I have= been around were noisy, probably because they tend to have aluminum blocks= and that they tend to spin at higher RPM than the larger, heavier cast iro= n oil-type=C2=A0compressors.

The noise they make a= lso seems more annoying to my ear, anyway. A larger, slower spinning pump e= mits noise, of course, but it does not seem as harsh as the noise from the = oil-less compressor that I have heard.

One advanta= ge of the oil-less compressors is that they will not inject oil into the ai= r supply if you are spraying paint.

FYIW

best,

doug

On Tue, Aug 10, 20= 21 at 11:25 AM John T. Blair <jblair1948@cox.net> wrote:

Thanks again for all the replies to my original post about my compressor motor
not working.

With all this going on, I have been doing some thinking about having to buy a new=C2=A0
compressor if I can't get this motor running.=C2=A0 That said, this compressor appears
to come with a 3hp, 4hp, and 5hp motor.=C2=A0 I have the 5hp.=C2=A0 I know that when it
comes to getting a new compressor, bigger is better, to the extent of your budget.=C2=A0

1. What is the advantage of the different hp motors.=C2=A0 I know the big advantage
for the 5hp is it runs on 220V.=C2=A0 But how does the hp affect the compressor.=C2=A0
Based on the info in the manual, it appears that all 3 versions have the same
SCFM specs.

My current compressor is an oil lubricated one.=C2=A0

2. I see oil-less compressors that supposedly have fantastic specs for air supply
that are so much cheaper than oil lubed versions.=C2=A0 Any thoughts?

3.=C2=A0 Any body have an oil-less compressor?=C2=A0 How do you like it?=C2=A0 I was reading an
article that was talking about how the oil-less versions have come a long ways.=C2=A0
They were saying that the biggest advantage for the oil liubes was for high air
demand over a long time like in a commercial shop.=C2=A0 But my dad's compressor,
a 4hp 220V 20 gal unit and my 5hp 220V 30 gal rig were all oil lubed.=C2=A0 We got dad's
compressor back in the 60s and it was still running when he passed in 2015.=C2=A0 I
bought mine back about '90.=C2=A0 So I lean toward them.=C2=A0 But is that realistic?

John




3D"Avast

This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
www.avast.com



John T. Blair=C2=A0 WA4OHZ=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 email:=C2=A0 = jblair1948@cox.net
Va. Beach, Va=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Phone:=C2=A0 (757) 495-8229

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 48 TR1800=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 48 #4 Midget=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 77 Spitfire=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 71 Saab Sonett III
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 65 Rambler Classic

Morgan:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 www.team.net/morgan
Bricklin:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 w= ww.bricklin.org

If you can read this=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0 - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 In God We Trust
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Liberty - the=C2=A0 power=C2=A0 of=C2=A0 choosing,=C2=A0 thinking,=C2=A0 and=C2=A0 acting=C2=A0 for=C2=A0
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 oneself; freedom=C2=A0 from=C2=A0 control=C2=A0 or=C2=A0 restriction=C2=A0


_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
errer" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

alk/dirtbeard@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">ht= tp://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
errer" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

alk/marka@maracing.com" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">htt= p://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka@maracing.com

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
errer" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

alk/fishplate@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">ht= tp://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate@gmail.com

--0000000000006ac87a05c93a82e9-- --===============5870102064915100658== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============5870102064915100658==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 15:35:34 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A24CFA23C4 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 15:35:34 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-ch2-09v.sys.comcast.net (unknown [69.252.207.41]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DB30A2212 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 15:32:27 -0600 (MDT) Received: from resomta-ch2-11v.sys.comcast.net ([69.252.207.107]) by resqmta-ch2-09v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTP id DYd4m8idqkWizDZMKmoc2v; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 21:32:28 +0000 s=20190202a; t=1628631148; bh=/vw0obnxNYgABd14qI1ocMjQitt47nBNzQ9cpgvD0cE=; h=Received:Received:Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date: Message-Id:To; b=ULwRmrbuj2VT5hyNYszpAhzh1KjF2wP0jFa+dLwd7HUMc0BjEa0jlrCoN/mawLNIA fK2adskp022l6LMSXim7W77hlPcozTd7GuaoaQZ1616e+/crsU1s0tMnqLCoEddrAV bmv4JvlFSzo2GDgllVP0M00Nhx7i5xAmtD+hzj2XVRQdME0u2yQVMsGSGKML2zsrLB 6K8YtELbwfNodLUPLCVDo5fagdD9f9mG//9mz2242A+w1OFwZwGnYUwQ/ZtCSbI4ny +aJCNlMAIQDT6g8wm7NzBORsKZPCuryI5/YerOVISCk3oqsECIgiI0dUK+ldnp/Guz ef1V+yGrD/0wA== Received: from smtpclient.apple ([73.17.214.72]) by resomta-ch2-11v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTPSA id DZM8mnAHp6H6cDZM8mnaXT; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 21:32:17 +0000 From: Robert Rochlin Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 17:32:15 -0400 References: To: Mark Andy Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] More compressor questions Cc: ShopTalk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3548936308572899831== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-0B4C3062-82F2-4C72-ACB2-8B58178B33C6 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I=E2=80=99ve had the same Craftsman oil-less unit for about 25 years. The o= nly repair has been the regulator a couple years ago. My biggest like is th= at the air is clean when I use it for painting, biggest drawback is the incr= edibly high noise level. I=E2=80=99ve got a shut off valve right at the air= output that does a great job of holding the line pressure. I keep the comp= ressor on all the time and when I go to use it it has full pressure so avoid= start up pressurization racket. =20 Best,=20 Bob Sent from my iPhone > On Aug 10, 2021, at 3:05 PM, Mark Andy wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BF > Howdy, >=20 > If I were buying a compressor today and the air requirements were modest, I= would be looking HARD at one of the super quiet compressor types that are a= vailable now. >=20 > HF link just because it's easy, but there are also name brand versions of t= his type of thing IIRC... >=20 > https://www.harborfreight.com/26-gallon-175-psi-ultra-quiet-vertical-shopa= uto-air-compressor-57336.html >=20 > Mark >=20 >> On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 2:42 PM old dirtbeard wrote= : >> Hi John, >>=20 >> The oil-less compressors probably are good enough for casual use, but the= ones that I have been around were noisy, probably because they tend to have= aluminum blocks and that they tend to spin at higher RPM than the larger, h= eavier cast iron oil-type compressors. >>=20 >> The noise they make also seems more annoying to my ear, anyway. A larger,= slower spinning pump emits noise, of course, but it does not seem as harsh a= s the noise from the oil-less compressor that I have heard. >>=20 >> One advantage of the oil-less compressors is that they will not inject oi= l into the air supply if you are spraying paint. >>=20 >> FYIW >>=20 >> best, >>=20 >> doug >>=20 >>> On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 11:25 AM John T. Blair wrot= e: >>>=20 >>> Thanks again for all the replies to my original post about my compressor= motor >>> not working. >>>=20 >>> With all this going on, I have been doing some thinking about having to b= uy a new =20 >>> compressor if I can't get this motor running. That said, this compresso= r appears=20 >>> to come with a 3hp, 4hp, and 5hp motor. I have the 5hp. I know that wh= en it >>> comes to getting a new compressor, bigger is better, to the extent of yo= ur budget. =20 >>>=20 >>> 1. What is the advantage of the different hp motors. I know the big adv= antage >>> for the 5hp is it runs on 220V. But how does the hp affect the compress= or. =20 >>> Based on the info in the manual, it appears that all 3 versions have the= same=20 >>> SCFM specs. >>>=20 >>> My current compressor is an oil lubricated one. =20 >>>=20 >>> 2. I see oil-less compressors that supposedly have fantastic specs for a= ir supply >>> that are so much cheaper than oil lubed versions. Any thoughts? >>>=20 >>> 3. Any body have an oil-less compressor? How do you like it? I was re= ading an >>> article that was talking about how the oil-less versions have come a lon= g ways. =20 >>> They were saying that the biggest advantage for the oil liubes was for h= igh air >>> demand over a long time like in a commercial shop. But my dad's compres= sor, >>> a 4hp 220V 20 gal unit and my 5hp 220V 30 gal rig were all oil lubed. W= e got dad's >>> compressor back in the 60s and it was still running when he passed in 20= 15. I=20 >>> bought mine back about '90. So I lean toward them. But is that realist= ic? >>>=20 >>> John >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> =09 >>> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.=20 >>> www.avast.com >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948@cox.net >>> Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 >>>=20 >>> 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) >>> 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III >>> 65 Rambler Classic >>>=20 >>> Morgan: www.team.net/morgan >>> Bricklin: www.bricklin.org >>>=20 >>> If you can read this - Thank a teacher! >>> If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! >>>=20 >>> =46rom Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: >>> e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." >>> In God We Trust >>> Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for=20= >>> oneself; freedom from control or restriction=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>>=20 >>> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/a= rchive >>>=20 >>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirt= beard@gmail.com >>>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >>=20 >> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/ar= chive >>=20 >> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka= @maracing.com >>=20 > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arc= hive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/rrochl= in@comcast.net >=20 --Apple-Mail-0B4C3062-82F2-4C72-ACB2-8B58178B33C6 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I=E2=80=99ve had the same Craftsman oil-les= s unit for about 25 years.  The only repair has been the regulator a co= uple years ago.  My biggest like is that the air is clean when I use it= for painting, biggest drawback is the incredibly high noise level.  I=E2= =80=99ve got a shut off valve right at the air output that does a great job o= f holding the line pressure.  I keep the compressor on all the time and= when I go to use it it has full pressure so avoid start up pressurization r= acket.  
Best, 
Bob
Sent from my iPhone=

On Aug 10, 2021, at 3:0= 5 PM, Mark Andy <marka@maracing.com> wrote:

=
=EF=BB=BF
Howdy,<= div>
If I were buying a compressor today and the air requ= irements were modest, I would be looking HARD at one of the super quiet = ;compressor types that are available now.

HF link just because it's e= asy, but there are also name brand versions of this type of thing IIRC...
https://www.harborfreight.com/2= 6-gallon-175-psi-ultra-quiet-vertical-shopauto-air-compressor-57336.html=

Mark

On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 2:42 PM old dirtbeard <dirtbeard@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi John,
=
The oil-less compressors probably are good enough for casual u= se, but the ones that I have been around were noisy, probably because they t= end to have aluminum blocks and that they tend to spin at higher RPM than th= e larger, heavier cast iron oil-type compressors.

<= div>The noise they make also seems more annoying to my ear, anyway. A larger= , slower spinning pump emits noise, of course, but it does not seem as harsh= as the noise from the oil-less compressor that I have heard.

=
One advantage of the oil-less compressors is that they will not i= nject oil into the air supply if you are spraying paint.

FYIW

best,

doug

= On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 11:25 AM John T. Blair <jblair1948@cox.net> wrote:

Thanks again for all the replies to my original post about my compressor motor
not working.

With all this going on, I have been doing some thinking about having to buy a new 
compressor if I can't get this motor running.  That said, this compressor appears
to come with a 3hp, 4hp, and 5hp motor.  I have the 5hp.  I know that when it
comes to getting a new compressor, bigger is better, to the extent of your budget. 

1. What is the advantage of the different hp motors.  I know the big advantage
for the 5hp is it runs on 220V.  But how does the hp affect the compressor. 
Based on the info in the manual, it appears that all 3 versions have the same
SCFM specs.

My current compressor is an oil lubricated one. 

2. I see oil-less compressors that supposedly have fantastic specs for air supply
that are so much cheaper than oil lubed versions.  Any thoughts?

3.  Any body have an oil-less compressor?  How do you like it?  I was reading an
article that was talking about how the oil-less versions have come a long ways. 
They were saying that the biggest advantage for the oil liubes was for high air
demand over a long time like in a commercial shop.  But my dad's compressor,
a 4hp 220V 20 gal unit and my 5hp 220V 30 gal rig were all oil lubed.  We got dad's
compressor back in the 60s and it was still running when he passed in 2015.  I
bought mine back about '90.  So I lean toward them.  But is that realistic?

John




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This email has been checked for viruses by A= vast antivirus software.
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John T. Blair  WA4OHZ     email:  jblair1948@cox.net
Va. Beach, Va            &n= bsp;     Phone:  (757) 495-8229

          48 TR1800    48 #4 Midget    65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
     75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)    77 Spitfire    71 Saab Sonett III
            &nbs= p;          65 Rambler Classic
Bricklin:     www.bricklin.org

If you can read this            = - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

=46rom Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
     e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
     In God We Trust
     Liberty - the  power  of  choosing,  thinking,  and  acting  for 
            &nbs= p;     oneself; freedom  from  control  or  restriction 


_______________________________________________

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t=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://= autox.team.net/archive

lk/dirtbeard@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.te= am.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com

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=
= --Apple-Mail-0B4C3062-82F2-4C72-ACB2-8B58178B33C6-- --===============3548936308572899831== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============3548936308572899831==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 10 20:57:52 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7B75A2385 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 20:57:52 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from omta014.useast.a.cloudfilter.net (unknown [34.195.253.205]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4032A1916 for ; Tue, 10 Aug 2021 20:53:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cxr.smtp.a.cloudfilter.net ([10.0.16.208]) by cmsmtp with ESMTP id DYcnmKE9q67fKDeMZmKsL0; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 02:53:03 +0000 Received: from John-PC.cox.net ([24.254.211.210]) by cmsmtp with ESMTPSA id DeMWmJebEJsXRDeMYmT8DP; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 02:53:03 +0000 Authentication-Results: cox.net; auth=pass (LOGIN) smtp.auth=jblair1948@cox.net a=vytuAFhf8Npo5rJvX1IL5Q==:117 a=vytuAFhf8Npo5rJvX1IL5Q==:17 a=YieQUjN_AAAA:8 a=kviXuzpPAAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=q6SfDYXhAAAA:8 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=iVAur8Dain9WPuw0DX4A:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=aav4MXMyVXkA:10 a=4zxjrV59PHAA:10 a=bz_d9vehOyUA:10 a=02o3UlWG9VIA:10 a=e2_5MfQ5yXoA:10 a=GGwxkeRKJ0dr3Umyi5gA:9 a=xrUhiDBt_KwRk50u:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=AcyrQYAOBbuLn6IW_Dii:22 a=qrIFiuKZe2vaD64auk6j:22 a=GGGinmgZRQXmVEG1E52S:22 a=R7nWeq4dleIJhz-CJ_3q:22 Date: Tue, 10 Aug 2021 22:52:20 -0400 To: "ShopTalk" From: "John T. Blair" mail.com> References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810140842.06832f90@cox.net> 1OBHeq8ltONCjdkpraryeL8FmyL5hP09U7LeajpaJVIKSQzFYNHiMpnSj3CXXHIQs0OPYS5oVVmh15X4hvvWJCiLryjB19VaJJE= Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] More compressor questions Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8874863418334149958== boundary="=====================_504148==.ALT" --=====================_504148==.ALT At 02:59 PM 8/10/2021, Mark Andy wrote: >If I were buying a compressor today and the air requirements were modest, I >would be looking HARD at one of the super quiet compressor types that are >available now. Again thanks to everyone. Mark mentions the harbor freight compressor: https://www.harborfreight.com/26-gallon-175-psi-ultra-quiet-vertical-shopauto-air-compressor-57336.html Looking at it's basic specs, it is only rated at 4.5 SCFM @ 90PSI. My compressor is rated at 9.3 SCFM @ 90 PSI. I've have used my compressor for everything from painting cars, sanding, impact hammers, die grinders, and both media blasting cabinets & pressure blasting. And I'm always running out of air and stopping to let the compressor catch up. So that brings up more questions: 1. What really controls how much a comperssor can generate, ie. SCFM? 2. What controls how long your compressor can supply air before having to start the motor to refill the tank? I realize that some air tools use a LOT more air, but I'm speaking for any given tool, not compairing something like spray painting to undoing 5 lugnuts on a car. 3. Why is a bigger tank better? After the compressor's pressure switch kicks on, doesn't it take longer for the compressor to reach the shut off pressure with a larger tank? 4. How can a 1.7 hp compressor deliver a peek of 175 psi and a regulated 155 psi when my 5 hp can only charge to 125 psi. I realize part of that is due to the pressure switch, mine is 110 on - 125 off, but really. Can I put a pressure switch in mine and 175 psi. I don't really think so. Is this more advertising hype like when they were rating compressors at their starting current vs running current for hp? They could get 7hp of of a 110V motor - NOT! John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948@cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." In God We Trust Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for oneself; freedom from control or restriction -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus --=====================_504148==.ALT At 02:59 PM 8/10/2021, Mark Andy wrote:

>If I were buying a compressor today and the air requirements were modest, I
>would be looking HARD at one of the super quiet compressor types that are
>available now.

Again thanks to everyone.  Mark mentions the harbor freight compressor:

https://www.harborfreight.com/26-gallon-175-psi-ultra-quiet-vertical-shopauto-air-compressor-57336.html

Looking at it's basic specs, it is only rated at  4.5 SCFM @ 90PSI.  My compressor
is rated at  9.3 SCFM @ 90 PSI.  I've have used my compressor for everything
from painting cars, sanding, impact hammers, die grinders, and both media blasting
cabinets & pressure blasting.  And I'm always running out of air and stopping to let
the compressor catch up.

So that brings up more questions:

1. What really controls how much a comperssor can generate, ie. SCFM?

2. What controls how long your compressor can supply air before having to start
the motor to refill the tank?  I realize that some air tools use a LOT more air, but
I'm speaking for any given tool, not compairing something like spray painting to
undoing 5 lugnuts on a car. 

3. Why is a bigger tank better?  After the compressor's pressure switch kicks on,
doesn't it take longer for the compressor to reach the shut off pressure with a
larger tank?

4. How can a 1.7 hp compressor deliver a peek of 175 psi and a regulated 155 psi
when my 5 hp can only charge to 125 psi.  I realize part of that is due to the
pressure switch, mine is 110 on - 125 off, but really.  Can I put a pressure switch in mine and 175 psi.   I don't really think so.  Is this more advertising hype like
when they were rating compressors at their starting current vs running current for
hp?  They could get 7hp of of a 110V motor - NOT!

John



Avast logo

This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
www.avast.com



John T. Blair  WA4OHZ     email:  jblair1948@cox.net
Va. Beach, Va                  Phone:  (757) 495-8229

          48 TR1800    48 #4 Midget    65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
     75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)    77 Spitfire    71 Saab Sonett III
                       65 Rambler Classic

Bricklin:     www.bricklin.org

If you can read this             - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
     e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
     In God We Trust
     Liberty - the  power  of  choosing,  thinking,  and  acting  for 
                  oneself; freedom  from  control  or  restriction 


--=====================_504148==.ALT-- --===============8874863418334149958== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8874863418334149958==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Aug 11 07:25:18 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90FCAA102F for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 07:25:18 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ed1-f43.google.com (unknown [209.85.208.43]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A53DBA1004 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 07:24:34 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-ed1-f43.google.com with SMTP id y7so3740931eda.5 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 06:24:35 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=F84EaKa46XTMcN1yKZY1aKA0xZy9nNeChsInU8G7Ji0=; b=YytPdSTZz5VLX0JF/wjdO+QAL1Bjyi1oYR8m4YWNyN1IayFV2SMhbTFiUPJ1dl0J4b HQ41r5C5nczx9OwW2rnRGUhahOsUxUIIYmsvICh+RlTKYAP32hG0jx5ciCGp9IZTk5T0 YrrLYA/0amB9REqGg12ISEtv6LSawzraI2mX770h1ElM2n9by0pUN7Pxt1vspZXrtyPW p16QJ3qeKrbT9i9bHelofSau0ZDCsyzfEyJrc9nvg93WwnS8sndPf8rt4Lq6MOBaaU2G 16yvVSSQzos0cx/XfiTaDyjHSKIDjQ//zR6gaMst0UVt3hllv7ycqk4+6MnSBDt/S99Z mr8A== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=F84EaKa46XTMcN1yKZY1aKA0xZy9nNeChsInU8G7Ji0=; b=DQXMaZfIy+h7FaeqqtHO5X1XojFLNCAiKFGf/Lx0gXyPMQXY3RvGc+kY6rWZKS7bap csev0H29OK+dBbroTAZX0MGzN3rIA9APn9QeMYWBzK448LoP0NO0FFM0FUqm6dBfJ8nY JdEVkRLNM69YcbpuHU4tMslXLTgQ0HqmMvQUDYkw0bZRInedtIXZiwnBAMO7F5uIZmq5 tp4fYq5sstXLJJ1a4+Ay0BhJZ4t8liQPNXcKoRg5CP+agyEAcENZgqA9kjmJ8Nztrwk2 G7P2gCWn5wHI0Xh678TiyX3YPFXMBUUg5tVpI6YvTd6WH/bzbMWCrBz+19u5GeY/JzZ2 2ONA== /ZT7uJz0AJMXpSeXYJ2UIk+IV5/sSKykv7rn6M4= Wed, 11 Aug 2021 06:24:34 -0700 (PDT) References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810140842.06832f90@cox.net> <6.2.5.6.1.20210810152131.068322c0@cox.net> From: old dirtbeard Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2021 06:24:22 -0700 To: "John T. Blair" Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] More compressor questions Cc: ShopTalk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8666431353813871573== --000000000000148d5c05c9488a98 1. What really controls how much a comperssor can generate, ie. SCFM? Mostly the amperage of the motor and the design of the pump. You can ignore the HP ratings for the most part and just look at the current draw assuming you are looking at the same voltage (e.g., 220VAC). Some pumps are more efficient, but mostly the power of the motor will determine what size pump and how fast you can spin it, which will determine the CFM. 2. What controls how long your compressor can supply air before having to start the motor to refill the tank? I realize that some air tools use a LOT more air, but I'm speaking for any given tool, not compairing something like spray painting to undoing 5 lugnuts on a car. Here it is just the storage capacity of the tank minus the continuous draw of the tool. Larger tanks will require less frequent pump cycling with the same amount of draw than would a smaller tank. 3. Why is a bigger tank better? After the compressor's pressure switch kicks on, doesn't it take longer for the compressor to reach the shut off pressure with a larger tank? See above, but the larger the tank, generally the longer the motor off cycles against a similar load. Think of it like a battery in a cordless drill. the larger the battery, the longer it will run before it needs to be recharged. The same metaphor works for the pump and the tank. 4. How can a 1.7 hp compressor deliver a peek of 175 psi and a regulated 155 psi when my 5 hp can only charge to 125 psi. I realize part of that is due to the pressure switch, mine is 110 on - 125 off, but really. Can I put a pressure switch in mine and 175 psi. I don't really think so. Is this more advertising hype like when they were rating compressors at their starting current vs running current for hp? They could get 7hp of of a 110V motor - NOT! Most compressors with a 175 psi rating are dual stage, a primary and a secondary piston or sets of piston. The first piston compresses the air to 125 psi and the second one to 175 psi. Most single stage pumps are limited to 125 -135 psi. One advantage of a two-stage pump is that by compressing the air to 175 psi, you increase the amount of compressed air stored in a given size tank. One achieves about 40% more stored compressed air in a tank if the pump is capable of 175 psi vs. 125 psi. The single stage pumps generally are lower cost than the dual stage pumps. You should not try to increase your psi rating by changing the limit switch, The psi rating is determined by the design of the pump. Again, the best rating for the power of the motor is the continuous amperage rating. The start-up amperage will be significantly higher. Ignore the HP rating for the most part. best , Doug On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 7:58 PM John T. Blair wrote: > At 02:59 PM 8/10/2021, Mark Andy wrote: > > >If I were buying a compressor today and the air requirements were modest, > I > >would be looking HARD at one of the super quiet compressor types that are > >available now. > > Again thanks to everyone. Mark mentions the harbor freight compressor: > > > https://www.harborfreight.com/26-gallon-175-psi-ultra-quiet-vertical-shopauto-air-compressor-57336.html > > Looking at it's basic specs, it is only rated at 4.5 SCFM @ 90PSI. My > compressor > is rated at 9.3 SCFM @ 90 PSI. I've have used my compressor for > everything > from painting cars, sanding, impact hammers, die grinders, and both media > blasting > cabinets & pressure blasting. And I'm always running out of air and > stopping to let > the compressor catch up. > > So that brings up more questions: > > 1. What really controls how much a comperssor can generate, ie. SCFM? > > 2. What controls how long your compressor can supply air before having to > start > the motor to refill the tank? I realize that some air tools use a LOT > more air, but > I'm speaking for any given tool, not compairing something like spray > painting to > undoing 5 lugnuts on a car. > > 3. Why is a bigger tank better? After the compressor's pressure switch > kicks on, > doesn't it take longer for the compressor to reach the shut off pressure > with a > larger tank? > > 4. How can a 1.7 hp compressor deliver a peek of 175 psi and a regulated > 155 psi > when my 5 hp can only charge to 125 psi. I realize part of that is due to > the > pressure switch, mine is 110 on - 125 off, but really. Can I put a > pressure switch in mine and 175 psi. I don't really think so. Is this > more advertising hype like > when they were rating compressors at their starting current vs running > current for > hp? They could get 7hp of of a 110V motor - NOT! > > John > > > > ------------------------------ > [image: Avast logo] > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > www.avast.com > > <#m_8777314284171356316_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> > > John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948@cox.net > Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 > > 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) > 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III > 65 Rambler Classic > > Morgan: www.team.net/morgan > Bricklin: www.bricklin.org > > If you can read this - Thank a teacher! > If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! > > From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: > e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." > In God We Trust > Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for > oneself; freedom from control or restriction > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com > > --000000000000148d5c05c9488a98 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

1. What really controls how much a comperssor can generate, ie. SCFM?=

Mostly the amperage of the motor and the design = of the pump. You can ignore the HP ratings for the most part and just look = at the current draw assuming you are looking at the same voltage (e.g., 220= VAC). Some pumps are more efficient, but mostly the power of the motor will= determine what size pump and how fast you can spin it, which will determin= e the CFM.

2. What controls how long your compressor can= supply air before having to start
the motor to refill the tank?=C2=A0 I realize= that some air tools use a LOT more air, but
I'm speaking for any given tool= , not compairing something like spray painting to
undoing 5 lugnuts on a car.=C2= =A0
Here it is just the storage capacity of the tank minus= the continuous draw of the tool. Larger tanks will require less frequent p= ump cycling with the same amount of draw than would a smaller tank.

3. Why is a bigger tank better?=C2=A0 After the compressor'= s pressure switch kicks on,
doesn't it take longer for the compressor to rea= ch the shut off pressure with a
larger tank?
See above, but the= larger the tank, generally the longer the motor off cycles against a simil= ar load. Think of it like a battery in a cordless drill. the larger the bat= tery, the longer it will run before it needs to be recharged. The same meta= phor works for the pump and the tank.=C2=A0
<= br style=3D"font-size:medium">4. How can a= 1.7 hp compressor deliver a peek of 175 psi and a regulated 155 psi=
when my 5 h= p can only charge to 125 psi.=C2=A0 I realize part of that is due to the
pressur= e switch, mine is 110 on - 125 off, but really.=C2=A0 Can I put a pressure = switch in mine and 175 psi.=C2=A0=C2=A0 I don't really think so.=C2=A0 = Is this more advertising hype like
when they were rating compressors at their st= arting current vs running current for
= hp?=C2=A0 They could get 7hp of of a 110V = motor - NOT!=C2=A0

Most compressors with a 175 psi rating are dual stage, a pr= imary and a secondary piston or sets of piston. The first piston compresses= the air to 125 psi and the second one to 175 psi. Most single stage pumps = are limited to 125 -135 psi. One advantage of a two-stage pump is that by c= ompressing the air to 175 psi, you increase the amount of compressed air st= ored in a given size tank.=C2=A0 One achieves about 40% more stored compres= sed air in a tank if the pump is capable of 175 psi vs. 125 psi. The single= stage pumps generally are lower cost than the dual stage pumps.
=
You should not try to increase your psi rating by changing t= he limit switch, The psi rating is determined by the design of the pump.=C2= =A0
Again, the best rating for the power of the motor is the cont= inuous amperage rating. The start-up amperage will be significantly higher.= Ignore the HP rating for the most part.

best ,
Doug

On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 7:58 PM John T. Blair <jblair1948@cox.net> wrote:
<= blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-l= eft:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
At 02:59 PM 8/10/2021, Mark Andy wrote:

>If I were buying a compressor today and the air requirements were modest, I
>would be looking HARD at one of the super quiet compressor types that are
>available now.

Again thanks to everyone.=C2=A0 Mark mentions the harbor freight compressor:

https://www.harborfreight.com/26-gallon-175-psi-ultra-quiet-vertical-shopau= to-air-compressor-57336.html

Looking at it's basic specs, it is only rated at=C2=A0 4.5 SCFM @ 90PSI.=C2=A0 My compressor
is rated at=C2=A0 9.3 SCFM @ 90 PSI.=C2=A0 I've have used my compressor for everything
from painting cars, sanding, impact hammers, die grinders, and both media blasting
cabinets & pressure blasting.=C2=A0 And I'm always running out of a= ir and stopping to let
the compressor catch up.

So that brings up more questions:

1. What really controls how much a comperssor can generate, ie. SCFM?

2. What controls how long your compressor can supply air before having to start
the motor to refill the tank?=C2=A0 I realize that some air tools use a LOT more air, but
I'm speaking for any given tool, not compairing something like spray painting to
undoing 5 lugnuts on a car.=C2=A0

3. Why is a bigger tank better?=C2=A0 After the compressor's pressure switch kicks on,
doesn't it take longer for the compressor to reach the shut off pressur= e with a
larger tank?

4. How can a 1.7 hp compressor deliver a peek of 175 psi and a regulated 155 psi
when my 5 hp can only charge to 125 psi.=C2=A0 I realize part of that is due to the
pressure switch, mine is 110 on - 125 off, but really.=C2=A0 Can I put a pressure switch in mine and 175 psi.=C2=A0=C2=A0 I don't really think so.=C2=A0 Is this more advertising hype like
when they were rating compressors at their starting current vs running current for
hp?=C2=A0 They could get 7hp of of a 110V motor - NOT!

John



3D"Avast

This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
www.a= vast.com



John T. Blair=C2=A0 WA4OHZ=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 email:=C2=A0 jblair1948@cox.net<= /a>
Va. Beach, Va=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Phone:=C2=A0 (757) 495-8229

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 48 TR1800=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 48 #4 Midget=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 77 Spitfire=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 71 Saab Sonett III
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 65 Rambler Classic
Bricklin:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 www.bricklin.org

If you can read this=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0 - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 In God We Trust
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Liberty - the=C2=A0 power=C2=A0 of=C2=A0 choosing,=C2=A0 thinking,=C2=A0 and=C2=A0 acting=C2=A0 for=C2=A0
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 oneself; freedom=C2=A0 from=C2=A0 control=C2=A0 or=C2=A0 restriction=C2=A0


_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

alk/dirtbeard@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.= team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com

--000000000000148d5c05c9488a98-- --===============8666431353813871573== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8666431353813871573==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Aug 11 08:17:24 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C7E3A0E89 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 08:17:24 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qk1-f179.google.com (unknown [209.85.222.179]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 893D6A16F2 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 08:15:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-qk1-f179.google.com with SMTP id w197so2513528qkb.1 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 07:15:22 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=ZuANyac/W/yv4qS9LXOPXwesCSjOQaEDvJ3XLwe1uoM=; b=A3jgWSYhlnRsd5mhyg5YCeurRtY9u5NlHVi9LkKAqw/4KHpcriigcNPM1IWtS/vMRm JI3Xr7WNtuLlfZP/4v1WXcRE9Uh7Ga6D3NZ0cS8am7ElTf8CIypMUpP/V7gxvZSNtvch J3hSfjIbqvbp0/Dp8S3b5xwnp0hy5PDv6bty3dno20OJWhAVovp3msE9b6bePuT/mi1Y PEVj6kSI8R4JVIOXIomjXkSQHkJNygc/n5ANLRbpdrq2rZA1k5+07cd5epjZM7egLxGE XSZpedmn66La/Qk6vFlWm38+TwYLRnfRPQx9Zj/FeE0WO4G+bK8R3a8Cz6TSuyIQJbQd ZS7A== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=ZuANyac/W/yv4qS9LXOPXwesCSjOQaEDvJ3XLwe1uoM=; b=aMvkaAXSPzSXJWKavLIPfh9XFU+kYFTza4K59hRcw+Pu6PGiI9TKWd1aBOewEh22vP PC7WeF+nLIvlAs3Q8hIAWwPe1TIiP5Z/3tOs25Iht2DKw4kgCRSfVeqjUlj854Je/WZ0 b8FbfG/yMiw4ZgqsbCPu8mCcOa8EUGktGOFDVAqlkSIR+zw0nYdXFAh4XKDGreDwcyma dsURTVpflXnalfNHNGrGbmksY719tXhYjuE4BGZ7BmN+/BFGb+5GYRgG39gR9R+6JVPB EuZvSKCZYY6hQIirOzokZON/hPXeQtz+qVPfzqFD6a24AO/BGq+dcsCE0bVPqagGePUV NZ+g== Bw0Wtix9MlTbi9yNPtmUpiVR6s5JdlXsA1w+vg1Fiw/udA== x5mr31930966qkj.144.1628691322119; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 07:15:22 -0700 (PDT) References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810140842.06832f90@cox.net> From: David Scheidt Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2021 09:15:11 -0500 To: shop-talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] More compressor questions Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============7440310093176824851== --000000000000b429e805c9493fce On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 1:43 PM old dirtbeard wrote: > Hi John, > > The oil-less compressors probably are good enough for casual use, but the > ones that I have been around were noisy, probably because they tend to have > aluminum blocks and that they tend to spin at higher RPM than the larger, > heavier cast iron oil-type compressors. > There are two kinds of oil less compressor. The really loud ones, and the really quiet ones. the really loud ones are cheap, which is their only real redeeming feature (they have no oil in the air, which matters for some applications, too.). They have been around a long time, and basically, they suck. But they're cheap, so, they sell. the quiet ones are not cheap, although prices have come down. The best known variety are sold by California Air Tools (they're made in china, don't be fooled by the name.), but lots of people offer similar (or identical) compressors these days. For a given set of specs, they're much of a muchness, and you'd do well to buy based on price, warranty, ease of purchase, color, or whatever. They reduce noise by having big pistons running at relatively low speed, and by having lots of plastic and teflon parts. They're not going to last forever, probably a 1000 hours of pump operation. I've got a little one, with a 2 gallon tank, which I expect will last me years (it's used to air up bike tires, dust off parts from time to time, and run a couple trim nailers.). On a job site, it'd be dead in a year, but it's likely to get dropped, stolen, run over by a forklift, or otherwise killed first, so the pump life span isn't a big a limitaion as it might seem. If you're running shop tools using loads of air, like sand blasters, etc, you want an old fashioned oil lubricated pump, rotating as low an RPM as possible. If you have lower volume air needs, the quiet compressors are tempting. >> >> --000000000000b429e805c9493fce Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 1:43 PM old dirtbeard <dirtbeard@gmail.com> wrote:
=
Hi= John,

The oil-less compressors probably are good enough for casual use, but the=20 ones that I have been around were noisy, probably because they tend to=20 have aluminum blocks and that they tend to spin at higher RPM than the=20 larger, heavier cast iron oil-type=C2=A0compressors.

There are two kinds of oil less compressor.=C2=A0 The really loud ones, and the= =20 really quiet ones.=C2=A0 the really loud ones are cheap, which is their onl= y=20 real redeeming feature (they have no oil in the air, which matters for=20 some applications, too.).=C2=A0 They have been around a long time, and=20 basically, they suck.=C2=A0 But they're cheap, so, they sell.

the quiet ones are not cheap, although prices have come down.=C2=A0 The best= =20 known variety are sold by California Air Tools (they're made in china,= =20 don't be fooled by the name.), but lots of people offer similar (or=20 identical) compressors these days.=C2=A0 For a given set of specs, they'= ;re=20 much of a muchness, and you'd do well to buy based on price, warranty,= =20 ease of purchase, color, or whatever.=C2=A0
They reduce nois= e=20 by having big pistons running at relatively low speed, and by having=20 lots of plastic and teflon parts.=C2=A0 They're not going to last forev= er,=20 probably a 1000 hours of pump operation.=C2=A0 I've got a little one, w= ith a 2 gallon tank, which I expect will last me years (it's used to air up=20 bike tires, dust off parts from time to time, and run a couple trim=20 nailers.).=C2=A0 On a job site, it'd be dead in a year, but it's li= kely to=20 get dropped, stolen, run over by a forklift, or otherwise killed first,=20 so the pump life span isn't a big a limitaion as it might seem.=C2=A0 <= br>

If you're running shop tools using loads of air, like sand blasters, etc,= =20 you want an old fashioned oil lubricated pump, rotating as low an RPM as possible.=C2=A0 If you have lower volume air needs, the quiet compressors= =20 are tempting.=C2=A0



=
--000000000000b429e805c9493fce-- --===============7440310093176824851== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============7440310093176824851==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Aug 11 09:43:34 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3BB9A11E9 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 09:43:34 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-io1-f42.google.com (unknown [209.85.166.42]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFDC1A0F37 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 09:37:52 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-io1-f42.google.com with SMTP id 188so4178545ioa.8 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 08:37:53 -0700 (PDT) h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-language; bh=ofnS1jgwY2NkyTPQklf1/EnPM7H9m5B1UtMQCstrZcE=; b=dEJE4Tv1qAnMlq2qY/R4eQEaC0fRXJ14E9cujB+KMrZdFn9OIFwEkmByv0L7oPbIxG +XH6InynEQAVGOIhJxnZ1kuHYKF4bMtQk7jy0n9LuXE0d0afV2zC9IQWkuAPm2Se46PM AydxXgTIynV54YoeWFh3jI0NGXyE4Spg0TirG8Z0ytykOx/6zHw/eSMntMh8tHg+BYNZ r5VPtFAk9+OX+s0S1HWtNyofHQ6/k2gnCMl7fj6Zc2d5wYvf1Dqz2i0PioaIhf3BFRET IZdPW4lr/y3+VklH/IWf5biS1RR64KmMKU2DtvYHO64ipgalcbdhDDyQGUu5eo+QPukk Y7og== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language; bh=ofnS1jgwY2NkyTPQklf1/EnPM7H9m5B1UtMQCstrZcE=; b=uApjk5zNAZk2jYvFaUcXXbgiP1hhIwmMGUntWbyE8hB97uq3oeMLSzRXKOeEXc+9sX +BI8BwO+C7dnpw24pXs1Wa61IFSmeSzNzjXSmuTg2TKz0MEjB9YU72xNaaiFry3lDgLO R0HZMoLYucFrZxTnX5l3cnJ+cv9S5yeEIa4rUZjWf1mlCIDZdq6LVvlbP5XaHkIDPZyk bl+Hudyc3l/Eeqg0xNOHxkm7XZS9sKmKjkWu3lD2l0vfxogFGoOfDPjGA3Y7WwUn3/9p iXoLLuEm23/DoLn3ALSrmc+KNooO4sWJdLTBJ1HJWtVg8rZMrMBsVmBq1NeWsALAjjHs Sjag== 6NAQ4OLTKb0mtzhneBJSELU2P3yC4gyJAA== e8mr32150169jaq.66.1628696273178; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 08:37:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.63] ([76.164.52.114]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id n14sm12818789ili.22.2021.08.11.08.37.52 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 11 Aug 2021 08:37:52 -0700 (PDT) To: David Scheidt , shop-talk References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810140842.06832f90@cox.net> From: Arvid Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2021 10:37:51 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.11.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] More compressor questions Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============3284578639200836952== boundary="------------A19C789870EC4AD7D2C791DF" Content-Language: en-US This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------A19C789870EC4AD7D2C791DF Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Agree with the "as low an RPM as possible". When I bought mine they offered a muffler\silencer for the intake. Google and YouTube offer a lot of suggestions for DIY silencers. I highly recommend anything on the intake along with the the standard filter. On 8/11/21 9:15 AM, David Scheidt wrote: > > Hi John, > > The oil-less compressors probably are good enough for casual use, but the ones that I have been around were noisy, probably because they tend to have aluminum blocks and that they tend to spin at higher RPM than the larger, heavier cast iron oil-type compressors. > > > There are two kinds of oil less compressor.  The really loud ones, and the really quiet ones.  the really loud ones are cheap, which is their only real redeeming feature (they have no oil in the air, which matters for some applications, too.).  They have been around a long time, and basically, they suck.  But they're cheap, so, they sell. > > the quiet ones are not cheap, although prices have come down.  The best known variety are sold by California Air Tools (they're made in china, don't be fooled by the name.), but lots of people offer similar (or identical) compressors these days.  For a given set of specs, they're much of a muchness, and you'd do well to buy based on price, warranty, ease of purchase, color, or whatever. > They reduce noise by having big pistons running at relatively low speed, and by having lots of plastic and teflon parts.  They're not going to last forever, probably a 1000 hours of pump operation.  I've got a little one, with a 2 gallon tank, which I expect will last me years (it's used to air up bike tires, dust off parts from time to time, and run a couple trim nailers.).  On a job site, it'd be dead in a year, but it's likely to get dropped, stolen, run over by a forklift, or otherwise killed first, so the pump life span isn't a big a limitaion as it might seem. > > If you're running shop tools using loads of air, like sand blasters, etc, you want an old fashioned oil lubricated pump, rotating as low an RPM as possible.  If you have lower volume air needs, the quiet compressors are tempting. > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/arvidj999@gmail.com > --------------A19C789870EC4AD7D2C791DF Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Agree with the "as low an RPM as possible". When I bought mine they offered a muffler\silencer for the intake. Google and YouTube offer a lot of suggestions for DIY silencers. I highly recommend anything on the intake along with the the standard filter.


On 8/11/21 9:15 AM, David Scheidt wrote:
On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 1:43 PM old dirtbeard <dirtbeard@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi John,

The oil-less compressors probably are good enough for casual use, but the ones that I have been around were noisy, probably because they tend to have aluminum blocks and that they tend to spin at higher RPM than the larger, heavier cast iron oil-type compressors.
There are two kinds of oil less compressor.  The really loud ones, and the really quiet ones.  the really loud ones are cheap, which is their only real redeeming feature (they have no oil in the air, which matters for some applications, too.).  They have been around a long time, and basically, they suck.  But they're cheap, so, they sell.

the quiet ones are not cheap, although prices have come down.  The best known variety are sold by California Air Tools (they're made in china, don't be fooled by the name.), but lots of people offer similar (or identical) compressors these days.  For a given set of specs, they're much of a muchness, and you'd do well to buy based on price, warranty, ease of purchase, color, or whatever. 
They reduce noise by having big pistons running at relatively low speed, and by having lots of plastic and teflon parts.  They're not going to last forever, probably a 1000 hours of pump operation.  I've got a little one, with a 2 gallon tank, which I expect will last me years (it's used to air up bike tires, dust off parts from time to time, and run a couple trim nailers.).  On a job site, it'd be dead in a year, but it's likely to get dropped, stolen, run over by a forklift, or otherwise killed first, so the pump life span isn't a big a limitaion as it might seem. 

If you're running shop tools using loads of air, like sand blasters, etc, you want an old fashioned oil lubricated pump, rotating as low an RPM as possible.  If you have lower volume air needs, the quiet compressors are tempting.  




_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
--------------A19C789870EC4AD7D2C791DF-- --===============3284578639200836952== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============3284578639200836952==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Aug 11 09:46:35 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3E47A135C for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 09:46:35 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qv1-f43.google.com (unknown [209.85.219.43]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B7B5A1233 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 09:46:09 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-qv1-f43.google.com with SMTP id kl2so1352071qvb.11 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 08:46:10 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=UwXEknhOvJM4/D+4qYp/AXto731hzMBWtAZdoUZk9t8=; b=YZpldeDvMu1mbY+vp4j6oyZgqyXGHuDcFz/ml7FCWU+2CUsLhc6BNIUw01iS44cAll 1kz4b4WiMNmhOYk5JGpj4Lq0awE6QjgiKDX6wF+ZaHfyR50AysURzoxFvUQ809H2Kf2L phENwy8hiZtzTS4aSog06ruELpvfVVqzXbypIszU5HUe3+rft8nS3n6Fi3aaVMPCRXWL 1cvlC/WTF2qWeItp9V+eiUibzEUHEcQdES7knJQcti5KOIYe4PeX6WNPznl248Eyus4h JAH2VlhVci2l9ds2XaU97daMbf+NT3eYgbgo/R9ZXW3BMDo3VDd9amCcVqVogFG/DCDg 7XqQ== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=UwXEknhOvJM4/D+4qYp/AXto731hzMBWtAZdoUZk9t8=; b=t6ua2EyvzESG6jj2+F+UyOxr6AMCABbr33F+pIvG0PI6W0D7nOIL684ei0kpwaO+Km OaNSRbNNj6SlvZ1wgWKwo8jeXKSBSEXv1RE9cEBopRejl+CfzqLxjaZ8LN460/s9K22C QoCEfsSMrUfUlMSBMoQhakVk4EqnXqkl1AIm42fzCKiFN5Wr5/3Rbex5cxj1qIm7zaRI jC+ZGTEbvsnZbE5tVlGbzBjPOWAeS20ot2h9L2xalbBwsDE6ZhR+53iM+6lX9SSogou4 ny027zpVkw9Lbh0VwYS7DsAL7ldAC5tvJybEkSKfORjePtgVD/pQhFTzialDeq1YbWTJ Pc2w== b2mr23732133qvt.0.1628696770081; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 08:46:10 -0700 (PDT) References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210810140842.06832f90@cox.net> <6.2.5.6.1.20210810152131.068322c0@cox.net> From: David Scheidt Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2021 10:45:59 -0500 To: "John T. Blair" , shop-talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] More compressor questions Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net On Tue, Aug 10, 2021 at 9:58 PM John T. Blair wrote: > > 1. What really controls how much a comperssor can generate, ie. SCFM? Actual power available from the motor, more or less. More power, more air. > > 2. What controls how long your compressor can supply air before having to start > the motor to refill the tank? I realize that some air tools use a LOT more air, but > I'm speaking for any given tool, not compairing something like spray painting to > undoing 5 lugnuts on a car. Size of tank, the pressure of the stored air, and the settings on the pressure switch. Bigger tank means longer run time before the compressor kicks in, higher pressure means longer run time before the compressor starts. Pressure switch controls when it comes on, so there can be more or less usuable air in the tank. Most tools are limited to 90 psi, so as long as the system pressure is above that, the compressor doesn't need to run. In industrial settings, where there can be strict requirements about air pressure, the cut in pressure can be different. I used to work in a shop with three compressors ganged together, and they were set up with different cut in pressures. First one would come on, and if pressure kept falling, the second would start; more pressure drop, the last one cut in. They'd all run until 175 psi was reached. Siz> > 3. Why is a bigger tank better? After the compressor's pressure switch kicks on, > doesn't it take longer for the compressor to reach the shut off pressure with a > larger tank? It holds more air which lets you have surge capacity that uses more air than your compressor produces, at least for a little while. It also gives the air longer to cool down, which lets water condense out of it. > > 4. How can a 1.7 hp compressor deliver a peek of 175 psi and a regulated 155 psi > when my 5 hp can only charge to 125 psi. I realize part of that is due to the > pressure switch, mine is 110 on - 125 off, but really. Can I put a pressure switch in mine and 175 psi. I don't really think so. Is this more advertising hype like > when they were rating compressors at their starting current vs running current for > hp? They could get 7hp of of a 110V motor - NOT! > Pump design, and how its been chosen to be driven. Higher pressure means more storage in a tank, and more pressure to overcome pressure drop in lines. the last shop I worked in, I was 75 pipe feet or more away from the compressors, I had to set the regulator at my drop to 130psi to get a running psi of 90 or so on my impact gun. The lift closest to the compressor, I could turn it down to 95 or 100. In tuned industrial applications, pumps are often run at less than maximum capacity, for less noise, less power use, and longer life. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Aug 11 10:07:59 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71DC8A0FEA for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 10:07:59 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from omta015.useast.a.cloudfilter.net (unknown [34.195.253.206]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68A5AA0C70 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 10:07:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cxr.smtp.a.cloudfilter.net ([10.0.16.145]) by cmsmtp with ESMTP id Dkwtm4b5QMRfUDqlPmkzXE; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 16:07:31 +0000 Received: from John-PC.cox.net ([24.254.211.210]) by cmsmtp with ESMTPSA id DqlNmNhLlLISyDqlOmNazE; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 16:07:30 +0000 Authentication-Results: cox.net; auth=pass (LOGIN) smtp.auth=jblair1948@cox.net a=vytuAFhf8Npo5rJvX1IL5Q==:117 a=vytuAFhf8Npo5rJvX1IL5Q==:17 a=kviXuzpPAAAA:8 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=q6SfDYXhAAAA:8 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=tI7_YS-sjcG2jIi5HK4A:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=aav4MXMyVXkA:10 a=4zxjrV59PHAA:10 a=bz_d9vehOyUA:10 a=ydOPsBrXXWKY01TVze0A:9 a=-fCRBkSAS08rx8fR:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=qrIFiuKZe2vaD64auk6j:22 a=GGGinmgZRQXmVEG1E52S:22 a=R7nWeq4dleIJhz-CJ_3q:22 Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2021 12:07:28 -0400 To: "ShopTalk" From: "John T. Blair" Fmo6/rprZac/h1Y3iD1WIUAVQfPnsuBPiqiWloXh2yopXV5gpRFKam5MthrZHTmH9rxIdRqGcoqOf8tF0/Ew5S+XzpBUwiADn2U= Subject: [Shop-talk] Compressor resolution Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============7146072695006627992== boundary="=====================_11333332==.ALT" --=====================_11333332==.ALT Well gang, it really pays when you find a good company. My son heard of a local company that fixes motors, I'd never heard of them. I tried the couple of places that I've done business with in the past, the main one, didn't do AC motors any more as the fellow that did them retired. The 2nd shop wanted $200 to put it on their bench. So I called the place my son had heard of. They wanted $35 to put it on the bench. So this morning I head over there and arrive about 10:30. I tell the lady at the counter what's going on with the motor, and she says, "lets check the capacitors". So standing at the counter, Charlie pulls the start cap, it's bad, and he replaces it. Then he pulls the run cap, it's also bad, and he replaces it. Takes it over to a bench and fires it up, it runs not problem. Then he writes out my ticket. I figuer about $35 to inspect, and at least $10 each for the caps, so about $50. He hand me the bill for less than $25! I give him a $5 tip and tell him to go "get some lunch". I'm out of there in less than 1/2 hr. Man am I happy! No I just have to go brave the 94deg. temp and put the motor back on the compressor. Again thanks to every one for their insight and support. I really should have dug into this at my house, but did like working in the 94 shop. One of these days I'll get an AC unit for there. Not to mention for $25 it wasn't worth getting my hands dirty. I'll still have to get dirty & sweaty putting the motor back on the compressor. John John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948@cox.net Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III 65 Rambler Classic Morgan: www.team.net/morgan Bricklin: www.bricklin.org If you can read this - Thank a teacher! If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." In God We Trust Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for oneself; freedom from control or restriction -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus --=====================_11333332==.ALT
Well gang, it really pays when you find a good company.  My son heard of a local
company that fixes motors, I'd never heard of them.  I tried the couple of places
that I've done business with in the past, the main one, didn't do AC motors any more as the fellow that did them retired.  The 2nd shop wanted $200 to put it on
their bench.  So I called the place my son had heard of.  They wanted $35 to put
it on the bench.  So this morning I head over there and arrive about 10:30.  I tell
the lady at the counter what's going on with the motor, and she says, "lets check
the capacitors".  So standing at the counter, Charlie pulls the start cap, it's bad,
and he replaces it.  Then he pulls the run cap, it's also bad, and he replaces it. 
Takes it over to a bench and fires it up, it runs not problem.  Then he writes out
my ticket.  I figuer about $35 to inspect, and at least $10 each for the caps, so
about $50.  He hand me the bill for less than $25!  I give him a $5 tip and tell him
to go "get some lunch".  I'm out of there in less than 1/2 hr.  Man am I happy!
No I just have to go brave the 94deg. temp and put the motor back on the
compressor.

Again thanks to every one for their insight and support.  I really should have dug
into this at my house, but did like working in the 94 shop.  One of these days I'll
get an AC unit for there.  Not to mention for $25 it wasn't worth getting my hands
dirty.  I'll still have to get dirty & sweaty putting the motor back on the
compressor.

John



Avast logo

This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
www.avast.com



John T. Blair  WA4OHZ     email:  jblair1948@cox.net
Va. Beach, Va                  Phone:  (757) 495-8229

          48 TR1800    48 #4 Midget    65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
     75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)    77 Spitfire    71 Saab Sonett III
                       65 Rambler Classic

Bricklin:     www.bricklin.org

If you can read this             - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
     e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
     In God We Trust
     Liberty - the  power  of  choosing,  thinking,  and  acting  for 
                  oneself; freedom  from  control  or  restriction 


--=====================_11333332==.ALT-- --===============7146072695006627992== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============7146072695006627992==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Aug 11 10:16:56 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5DAA9A1007 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 10:16:56 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ed1-f46.google.com (unknown [209.85.208.46]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A80B6A1030 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 10:16:21 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-ed1-f46.google.com with SMTP id t1so4568564edd.6 for ; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 09:16:22 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=0ZzduKymKU2zDDAJSMQ+KUptw41gtvwLnLJ4igsVFwk=; b=g1uUw00QLgCSqBEKMXfJtXTjHJrGG9QFiFtecsLpaTL0FkP1YETL1+UIorF00RRs0W e47hGDYniKS+tLE2d1VviymuRIURYzgjmpsvlJzaKSqrCGHyEilxAl9Z1rQ4k6AC/OsS g7u4X+Je3Kxv3lXmTmnqWU7Y5Rh/WkVe0XxuBduRj2tTGqkYbcWVSUmKuP6OSWjqrSqC +ByEcRK1TmfxGNetWt6ql+7JM5EbQjLUVixXamX4ktFsV/Otm25c16n2XMfAd2/M0+bd QTVTPK8B82K38xQGJSVK/C51K4V77U7t+8hzZ7oKSCpcPQPXsJaLGSe1YSm+UgnmlCNp Wk+A== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=0ZzduKymKU2zDDAJSMQ+KUptw41gtvwLnLJ4igsVFwk=; b=JtKcuVHxuKUKOQKI7sCaW5KlJndvYfwCVCrEMVsRcOn/b2Lrr4NA1vG0xxj3McDPDf QSh/SAsImYFodYkP41xPkgkILJEjeEvP4tCrFfr0w5oKLoAeVce++eh0+bvv+G0hXyeH U8zRZjyvaWmdfpgZ5i0wmTjhAFSGIfERF2s97hMzN7WxDD+0D2FBT2s33b6udqozWP9b 7vm2XDyYxUIv9CTDqG9iZSMX1Bi3yRl0d5b/8O/Mvxr4am9nbR1frrHR70nO3MUR9fnM f/D2B28DaDkCG6VitDDFtLxr3J19G4mzbWSorBKbtmr9zHHY7FJVx60a2H6kO/qHO7Ge ZoKQ== Ro9yXy+fU3sKKy5dIkV74NjwhopNOVtlbM8DLUA= ee29mr12575615edb.289.1628698581883; Wed, 11 Aug 2021 09:16:21 -0700 (PDT) References: <6.2.5.6.1.20210811115722.04cad9a8@cox.net> From: old dirtbeard Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2021 09:16:09 -0700 To: "John T. Blair" Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Compressor resolution Cc: ShopTalk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============1720410651274501640== --0000000000006b65ab05c94af0ee That is a terrific outcome! On Wed, Aug 11, 2021 at 9:08 AM John T. Blair wrote: > > Well gang, it really pays when you find a good company. My son heard of a > local > company that fixes motors, I'd never heard of them. I tried the couple of > places > that I've done business with in the past, the main one, didn't do AC > motors any more as the fellow that did them retired. The 2nd shop wanted > $200 to put it on > their bench. So I called the place my son had heard of. They wanted $35 > to put > it on the bench. So this morning I head over there and arrive about > 10:30. I tell > the lady at the counter what's going on with the motor, and she says, > "lets check > the capacitors". So standing at the counter, Charlie pulls the start cap, > it's bad, > and he replaces it. Then he pulls the run cap, it's also bad, and he > replaces it. > Takes it over to a bench and fires it up, it runs not problem. Then he > writes out > my ticket. I figuer about $35 to inspect, and at least $10 each for the > caps, so > about $50. He hand me the bill for less than $25! I give him a $5 tip > and tell him > to go "get some lunch". I'm out of there in less than 1/2 hr. Man am I > happy! > No I just have to go brave the 94deg. temp and put the motor back on the > compressor. > > Again thanks to every one for their insight and support. I really should > have dug > into this at my house, but did like working in the 94 shop. One of these > days I'll > get an AC unit for there. Not to mention for $25 it wasn't worth getting > my hands > dirty. I'll still have to get dirty & sweaty putting the motor back on > the > compressor. > > John > > > > ------------------------------ > [image: Avast logo] > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > www.avast.com > > <#m_-7668917758623764675_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> > > John T. Blair WA4OHZ email: jblair1948@cox.net > Va. Beach, Va Phone: (757) 495-8229 > > 48 TR1800 48 #4 Midget 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106) > 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887) 77 Spitfire 71 Saab Sonett III > 65 Rambler Classic > > Morgan: www.team.net/morgan > Bricklin: www.bricklin.org > > If you can read this - Thank a teacher! > If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!! > > From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy: > e pluribus Unum, "from many, one." > In God We Trust > Liberty - the power of choosing, thinking, and acting for > oneself; freedom from control or restriction > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com > > --0000000000006b65ab05c94af0ee Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
That is a terrific outcome!

On Wed, Aug 11, 2021 at 9:08 AM= John T. Blair <jblair1948@cox.net= > wrote:

Well gang, it really pays when you find a good company.=C2=A0 My son heard of a local
company that fixes motors, I'd never heard of them.=C2=A0 I tried the couple of places
that I've done business with in the past, the main one, didn't do A= C motors any more as the fellow that did them retired.=C2=A0 The 2nd shop wanted $200 to put it on
their bench.=C2=A0 So I called the place my son had heard of.=C2=A0 They wanted $35 to put
it on the bench.=C2=A0 So this morning I head over there and arrive about 10:30.=C2=A0 I tell
the lady at the counter what's going on with the motor, and she says, "lets check
the capacitors".=C2=A0 So standing at the counter, Charlie pulls the start cap, it's bad,
and he replaces it.=C2=A0 Then he pulls the run cap, it's also bad, and he replaces it.=C2=A0
Takes it over to a bench and fires it up, it runs not problem.=C2=A0 Then he writes out
my ticket.=C2=A0 I figuer about $35 to inspect, and at least $10 each for the caps, so
about $50.=C2=A0 He hand me the bill for less than $25!=C2=A0 I give him a $5 tip and tell him
to go "get some lunch".=C2=A0 I'm out of there in less than 1= /2 hr.=C2=A0 Man am I happy!
No I just have to go brave the 94deg. temp and put the motor back on the
compressor.

Again thanks to every one for their insight and support.=C2=A0 I really should have dug
into this at my house, but did like working in the 94 shop.=C2=A0 One of these days I'll
get an AC unit for there.=C2=A0 Not to mention for $25 it wasn't worth getting my hands
dirty.=C2=A0 I'll still have to get dirty & sweaty putting the moto= r back on the
compressor.

John



3D"Avast

This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
www.a= vast.com



John T. Blair=C2=A0 WA4OHZ=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 email:=C2=A0 jblair1948@cox.net<= /a>
Va. Beach, Va=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Phone:=C2=A0 (757) 495-8229

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 48 TR1800=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 48 #4 Midget=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 65 Morgan 4/4 Series V (B1106)
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 75 Bricklin SV1 (#0887)=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 77 Spitfire=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 71 Saab Sonett III
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 65 Rambler Classic
Bricklin:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 www.bricklin.org

If you can read this=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0 - Thank a teacher!
If you are reading it in English - Thank a Vet!!

From Dennis Prager - The American Trilogy:
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 e pluribus Unum, "from many, one."
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 In God We Trust
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Liberty - the=C2=A0 power=C2=A0 of=C2=A0 choosing,=C2=A0 thinking,=C2=A0 and=C2=A0 acting=C2=A0 for=C2=A0
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 oneself; freedom=C2=A0 from=C2=A0 control=C2=A0 or=C2=A0 restriction=C2=A0


_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

alk/dirtbeard@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.= team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com

--0000000000006b65ab05c94af0ee-- --===============1720410651274501640== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============1720410651274501640==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Aug 12 14:35:27 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB7B5A123B for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 14:35:27 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from omta013.useast.a.cloudfilter.net (unknown [34.195.253.204]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9E1BA111B for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 14:33:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cxr.smtp.a.cloudfilter.net ([10.0.16.208]) by cmsmtp with ESMTP id E97tmLcFi67fKEHNymQ4rf; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 20:33:06 +0000 Received: from app-13.app.iad.rs.oxcs.net ([146.20.112.67]) by cmsmtp with ESMTPA id EHNxmWGnyJsXREHNxmVxq1; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 20:33:05 +0000 a=IN5e7ORV7WapKVHgxEPmgA==:117 a=kZcrUJlVhRsA:10 a=jgqJokmoj88A:10 a=JgpeA7MdGYugCC8YZJcA:9 a=QEXdDO2ut3YA:10 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2021 16:33:04 -0400 (EDT) From: jblair1948@cox.net To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Importance: Medium QJF2E3JqlvMtz/vPUcHtyl4xIzLUDv7mEQlFkGmLxjEaBPgjISu1ChuR5C8/CLTL+55AdltUXYvSbbijdt2mncbr1TsZmCUT0Rw= Subject: [Shop-talk] Power lift hatches Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6541419331124807887== boundary="----=_Part_11617_452250980.1628800384937" ------=_Part_11617_452250980.1628800384937 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Gang, Got a different question this time, not compressors. My neighbor has a 2018 Ford Escape with the power lift hatch. A couple of weeks ago she went someplace and had the load something in the back of her car. She told them, "Don't close the hatch, I will close it from in here!" Well guess what, they tried to close the hatch. After that her hatch has had all kind of problems, not opening correctly/completely, not closing correctly, etc. She tried to pull the fuse to "reset" the controller for the power hatch. I'm spent a lot of time doing internet searches for "how do they work", "troubleshooting power lift hatches", etc. to no avail. I'm wondering if anyone know what type technology they use for all these power lift hatches? I only way I can think of them working is with a linear actuactor. And I did find an excellent video on linear actuactors and controlling them. But a linear actuactor is basically a long screw and a nut. As the screw turns the nut moves either up or down. If they are using a linear actuactor that can't be manually over riden. And I'd assume that it would bend either the hinges on the hatch or the actual hatch itself. And I can't believe that a manufacturer would build something like that into a car. Every one is used to pulling down on a hatch or a trunk. So it seems to me that having someone helping you load your car with anything is likely to try and manually close your hatch/trunk. So anyone know if these things are really linear actuactors or what they are? Untill my neighbor desides to replace hers, I don't have one to cut open and look inside. :) TIA, John ------=_Part_11617_452250980.1628800384937 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Gang,

Got a different question this time, not compressors. My neighbor has a 2018 Ford Escape with the power lift hatch. A couple of weeks ago she went someplace and had the load something in the back of her car. She told them, "Don't close the hatch, I will close it from in here!" Well guess what, they tried to close the hatch. After that her hatch has had all kind of problems, not opening correctly/completely, not closing correctly, etc. She tried to pull the fuse to "reset" the controller for the power hatch.

I'm spent a lot of time doing internet searches for "how do they work", "troubleshooting power lift hatches", etc. to no avail.

I'm wondering if anyone know what type technology they use for all these power lift hatches?

I only way I can think of them working is with a linear actuactor. And I did find an excellent video on linear actuactors and controlling them. But a linear actuactor is basically a long screw and a nut. As the screw turns the nut moves either up or down.

If they are using a linear actuactor that can't be manually over riden. And I'd assume that it would bend
either the hinges on the hatch or the actual hatch itself. And I can't believe that a manufacturer would build something like that into a car. Every one is used to pulling down on a hatch or a trunk. So it seems to me that having someone helping you load your car with anything is likely to try and manually close your hatch/trunk.

So anyone know if these things are really linear actuactors or what they are? Untill my neighbor desides to replace hers, I don't have one to cut open and look inside. :)

TIA,

John

------=_Part_11617_452250980.1628800384937-- --===============6541419331124807887== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6541419331124807887==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Aug 12 14:57:24 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FF0BA1201 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 14:57:24 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-lf1-f52.google.com (unknown [209.85.167.52]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 344D2A1275 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 14:56:29 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-lf1-f52.google.com with SMTP id w20so15863260lfu.7 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 13:56:30 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=BfFGF/oAhAVyyNgnKRgtl446VIWBhRwTlGayGOhU2RU=; b=Djac8FGM/3Uxyu3KwKfLsv0wSdjr2m9u5Dca0XM4tlbnZDe4/Lrm7+lxd/K20yJIiY xgGIAtWLCtqakDF/5kFhWodYOWQtRBulRcLBKJwi47H2WuRjj/7snO+glohRhGjlvSbc YBvuxXBL4kdEKkmHENkRqaGfApXJrRZpj/mpwL5NQsJ6YKvxzQvaLQey+3PCnmx2leS0 FCDshX+gn7BbznnHJIbdVIQRaNXeLBA8HvoU9DdfZLlFsR9ybSvd4Wqhfl2LPa6XWe4U Hj15qEzS3pv3zhb12zvTcoQ9y4YnSDpqgMsUnkQBlQYq4a6MjoLifkIdE0SBst3sxtRQ pPIA== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=BfFGF/oAhAVyyNgnKRgtl446VIWBhRwTlGayGOhU2RU=; b=XW6LJgtlLpE5mWnll3geVuUmckOmOugQaEBYrQY8LfpfZXo8QA9FUqHL0AoQXDZyYb hvSqPz1iLtFtLtsrFAlDKY8QG6IvY31ORmyyQEbZxyhxREg14k1g+ywjfsQpefudjIh+ 7Dod8H234NrRSQ9xmKK3SeGV+L+24GYx80HQCmRhFnU9qguIa+276wU1O07bOae94H6X HVxFlh8Pgah9CTyrh+DuZRc/O05pSn2IfBjh6SrX3HUIUxFJekCZkLLSPzsIAxJYSumj OY01iVhyhT7kwPVDke27FziQM48Ni8aHKXV+4HlVrAK0dh6Xdt3qcdkLSK70yZtqgxZo AP/A== KULSlTVg0kveGT+yV83mCrRv2U8baPcLEawc+KA= Thu, 12 Aug 2021 13:56:29 -0700 (PDT) References: <1985636491.11618.1628800384939@myemail.cox.net> From: Jeff Scarbrough Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2021 16:56:17 -0400 To: "John T. Blair" Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Power lift hatches Cc: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6265488000487184169== --00000000000010a8ab05c962f8f7 I've been thinking about this and looking at the struts on our Subaru. Some important things: you can move it independently of the motor operation, but it will try to move by motor if you do that; it can be set to a "preferred" height based on key used or seat settings, and.only one strut has a wire. I'm guessing it's an actuator that uses some sort of drive wheel on the rod, and a stepper motor of some sort to drive it. Possibly it has lost its zero point? It might be educational to disconnect the hatch end and operate it unloaded. See if it stutters then, and verify the hinges themselves don't have a problem. On Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 16:35 wrote: > Hi Gang, > > Got a different question this time, not compressors. My neighbor has a > 2018 Ford Escape with the power lift hatch. A couple of weeks ago she went > someplace and had the load something in the back of her car. She told them, > "Don't close the hatch, I will close it from in here!" Well guess what, > they tried to close the hatch. After that her hatch has had all kind of > problems, not opening correctly/completely, not closing correctly, etc. She > tried to pull the fuse to "reset" the controller for the power hatch. > > I'm spent a lot of time doing internet searches for "how do they work", > "troubleshooting power lift hatches", etc. to no avail. > > I'm wondering if anyone know what type technology they use for all these > power lift hatches? > > I only way I can think of them working is with a linear actuactor. And I > did find an excellent video on linear actuactors and controlling them. But > a linear actuactor is basically a long screw and a nut. As the screw turns > the nut moves either up or down. > > If they are using a linear actuactor that can't be manually over riden. > And I'd assume that it would bend > either the hinges on the hatch or the actual hatch itself. And I can't > believe that a manufacturer would build something like that into a car. > Every one is used to pulling down on a hatch or a trunk. So it seems to me > that having someone helping you load your car with anything is likely to > try and manually close your hatch/trunk. > > So anyone know if these things are really linear actuactors or what they > are? Untill my neighbor desides to replace hers, I don't have one to cut > open and look inside. :) > > TIA, > > John > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate@gmail.com > > --00000000000010a8ab05c962f8f7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I've been thinking about this and looking at the stru= ts on our Subaru.=C2=A0 Some important things:=C2=A0 you can move it indepe= ndently of the motor operation, but it will try to move by motor if you do = that; it can be set to a "preferred" height based on key used or = seat settings, and.only one strut has a wire.

I'm guessing it's an actuator that uses some sort o= f drive wheel on the rod, and a stepper motor of some sort to drive it.

Possibly it has lost its ze= ro point?=C2=A0 It might be educational to disconnect the hatch end and ope= rate it unloaded.=C2=A0 See if it stutters then, and verify the hinges them= selves don't have a problem.

=
On Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 16:35 <jblair1948@cox.net> wrote:
=20 =20 =20

Hi Gang,

Got a different question this time, not compressors. My neighbor has a= 2018 Ford Escape with the power lift hatch. A couple of weeks ago she went= someplace and had the load something in the back of her car. She told them= , "Don't close the hatch, I will close it from in here!" Well= guess what, they tried to close the hatch. After that her hatch has had al= l kind of problems, not opening correctly/completely, not closing correctly= , etc. She tried to pull the fuse to "reset" the controller for t= he power hatch.

I'm spent a lot of time doing internet searches for "how do t= hey work", "troubleshooting power lift hatches", etc. to no = avail.

I'm wondering if anyone know what type technology they use for all= these power lift hatches?

I only way I can think of them working is with a linear actuactor. And= I did find an excellent video on linear actuactors and controlling them. B= ut a linear actuactor is basically a long screw and a nut. As the screw tur= ns the nut moves either up or down.

If they are using a linear actuactor that can't be manually over r= iden. And I'd assume that it would bend
either the hinges on the hat= ch or the actual hatch itself. And I can't believe that a manufacturer = would build something like that into a car. Every one is used to pulling do= wn on a hatch or a trunk. So it seems to me that having someone helping you= load your car with anything is likely to try and manually close your hatch= /trunk.

So anyone know if these things are really linear actuactors or what th= ey are? Untill my neighbor desides to replace hers, I don't have one to= cut open and look inside. :)

TIA,

John

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
errer" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

alk/fishplate@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">ht= tp://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate@gmail.com

--00000000000010a8ab05c962f8f7-- --===============6265488000487184169== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6265488000487184169==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Aug 12 15:04:11 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A052CA120E for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 15:04:11 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-oi1-f176.google.com (unknown [209.85.167.176]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A54CA11F2 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 15:03:36 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-oi1-f176.google.com with SMTP id u10so12542993oiw.4 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 14:03:37 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=NCr5p6hKzrEdX0W5g2Tquz4Sh6ThGLUGErNrCXuHgoQ=; b=ZrYj5qXkLyBYazf0+gIjmsCXAJdW8uzFS1h3HZDo+Cv3wffQhugi2x9wyThiEyjqDx sGoKOef0iI3uXO7b4z+1cZRv/wKYsvzxGkpbQI6gH77m1VbI9e0+G3HzV2tt2e3QbgEr 3Alv63zsRuLHX4cRTLSUGqY8cNBbDY/3aMs4bBLHx/pT1SezrNzFjP9c4RTM60Dboh7/ tBby+pANQdimIg/ru/uOhtv1QA+sO3G/BitcMH0jiVi5lIplGrXN2ZvRq5/uYBwjYDHN KM8xDlMuA1ICgrLeFX/MgzLZrap3oQht07vThTI5eTyHNokb5DMbV8cHSXS6k5rfcZbd mUpQ== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=NCr5p6hKzrEdX0W5g2Tquz4Sh6ThGLUGErNrCXuHgoQ=; b=HM+/ya8NSz8L6lRJbbdf0TOrDv8AtiWHHQcKnxOpvYduN0QbqWtzoajvAj1rQyaWlR K5cob4lJQ9KK0yLFPbSHLJAZs6dXJGjVlfwS3XD0HMHYSbW4ceed4xr6YUR5qTSfTHrD q2pGnGsCV/IxWzA3CMl7XC37zHtAYRJi4JBolD5zd5oQFlPMQCVK1M/4VVMtpKsRKU6C eBNZj5pZXn3lJ1/47afOWZT646wc89gvsoJZAP+drWTQ+CjSCKrz8uG0ve2DsX8Vebg7 1wL/rD6IKnzmsua21TaRXUOJmk/V1rdMidRdQnmvq2R2xQhncGMSBy4FwxLySk5CbzxZ +Nxw== nTtVK+J5XoZuUHe8cLbaly808OkjMR4MKdtw9yU= bi9mr13593217oib.139.1628802217408; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 14:03:37 -0700 (PDT) References: <1985636491.11618.1628800384939@myemail.cox.net> From: Eric Russell Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2021 17:03:25 -0400 To: Jeff Scarbrough Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Power lift hatches Cc: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3963057225583399492== --00000000000093fb3e05c96311a7 https://youtu.be/znnJrlpku-U On Thu, Aug 12, 2021 at 4:57 PM Jeff Scarbrough wrote: > I've been thinking about this and looking at the struts on our Subaru. > Some important things: you can move it independently of the motor > operation, but it will try to move by motor if you do that; it can be set > to a "preferred" height based on key used or seat settings, and.only one > strut has a wire. > > I'm guessing it's an actuator that uses some sort of drive wheel on the > rod, and a stepper motor of some sort to drive it. > > Possibly it has lost its zero point? It might be educational to > disconnect the hatch end and operate it unloaded. See if it stutters then, > and verify the hinges themselves don't have a problem. > > On Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 16:35 wrote: > >> Hi Gang, >> >> Got a different question this time, not compressors. My neighbor has a >> 2018 Ford Escape with the power lift hatch. A couple of weeks ago she went >> someplace and had the load something in the back of her car. She told them, >> "Don't close the hatch, I will close it from in here!" Well guess what, >> they tried to close the hatch. After that her hatch has had all kind of >> problems, not opening correctly/completely, not closing correctly, etc. She >> tried to pull the fuse to "reset" the controller for the power hatch. >> >> I'm spent a lot of time doing internet searches for "how do they work", >> "troubleshooting power lift hatches", etc. to no avail. >> >> I'm wondering if anyone know what type technology they use for all these >> power lift hatches? >> >> I only way I can think of them working is with a linear actuactor. And I >> did find an excellent video on linear actuactors and controlling them. But >> a linear actuactor is basically a long screw and a nut. As the screw turns >> the nut moves either up or down. >> >> If they are using a linear actuactor that can't be manually over riden. >> And I'd assume that it would bend >> either the hinges on the hatch or the actual hatch itself. And I can't >> believe that a manufacturer would build something like that into a car. >> Every one is used to pulling down on a hatch or a trunk. So it seems to me >> that having someone helping you load your car with anything is likely to >> try and manually close your hatch/trunk. >> >> So anyone know if these things are really linear actuactors or what they >> are? Untill my neighbor desides to replace hers, I don't have one to cut >> open and look inside. :) >> >> TIA, >> >> John >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk >> http://autox.team.net/archive >> >> Unsubscribe/Manage: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate@gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ejrussell61@gmail.com > > -- Eric Russell Mebane, NC --00000000000093fb3e05c96311a7 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
= On Thu, Aug 12, 2021 at 4:57 PM Jeff Scarbrough <fishplate@gmail.com> wrote:
I've been thinking about this and looking at the st= ruts on our Subaru.=C2=A0 Some important things:=C2=A0 you can move it inde= pendently of the motor operation, but it will try to move by motor if you d= o that; it can be set to a "preferred" height based on key used o= r seat settings, and.only one strut has a wire.

=
I'm guessing it's an actuator that uses some sort= of drive wheel on the rod, and a stepper motor of some sort to drive it.

Possibly it has lost its = zero point?=C2=A0 It might be educational to disconnect the hatch end and o= perate it unloaded.=C2=A0 See if it stutters then, and verify the hinges th= emselves don't have a problem.

On Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 16:35 <jblair1948@cox.net> wrote:
=20 =20 =20

Hi Gang,

Got a different question this time, not compressors. My neighbor has a= 2018 Ford Escape with the power lift hatch. A couple of weeks ago she went= someplace and had the load something in the back of her car. She told them= , "Don't close the hatch, I will close it from in here!" Well= guess what, they tried to close the hatch. After that her hatch has had al= l kind of problems, not opening correctly/completely, not closing correctly= , etc. She tried to pull the fuse to "reset" the controller for t= he power hatch.

I'm spent a lot of time doing internet searches for "how do t= hey work", "troubleshooting power lift hatches", etc. to no = avail.

I'm wondering if anyone know what type technology they use for all= these power lift hatches?

I only way I can think of them working is with a linear actuactor. And= I did find an excellent video on linear actuactors and controlling them. B= ut a linear actuactor is basically a long screw and a nut. As the screw tur= ns the nut moves either up or down.

If they are using a linear actuactor that can't be manually over r= iden. And I'd assume that it would bend
either the hinges on the hat= ch or the actual hatch itself. And I can't believe that a manufacturer = would build something like that into a car. Every one is used to pulling do= wn on a hatch or a trunk. So it seems to me that having someone helping you= load your car with anything is likely to try and manually close your hatch= /trunk.

So anyone know if these things are really linear actuactors or what th= ey are? Untill my neighbor desides to replace hers, I don't have one to= cut open and look inside. :)

TIA,

John

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
errer" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

alk/fishplate@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">ht= tp://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishplate@gmail.com

_______________________________________________

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et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

alk/ejrussell61@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://auto= x.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ejrussell61@gmail.com



--
Eric Russell
Mebane, NC
--00000000000093fb3e05c96311a7-- --===============3963057225583399492== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============3963057225583399492==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Aug 12 15:33:56 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FA08A0ED4 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 15:33:56 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic306-24.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (unknown [98.137.68.87]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85919A0E2E for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 15:33:21 -0600 (MDT) t=1628804002; bh=SYcq340Ym1nUMwdgyy0QGBamUX/3zJRSs3j95VwY2hs=; h=References:Date:In-Reply-To:From:To:Subject:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=k5sMLiG5DLTd0Czuw/MwwSCX7YptH8rh/gPqW1v95E7yqv/ESVUWdyqCPB9SOpFbXia5QntIJvCzU3/ER/mfeoLNmGj2hEYPIRS6qBaQhGBSateqDTPl6dgaOBeh3gsJBWF52Mp16YfXrIQQPiX3wUi44rJHZvOwmk2cgVcksUE= t=1628804002; bh=Lw8yePmW5naTyTk/kprXu6zkz6pC6j2u9jEc3ZLWuXA=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Date:From:To:Subject:From:Subject; b=S7779RmRv7jrhuxUhfImLK+aJUHg/v3GuTuuVBOjR6NnMiRWO0y+9CP5Q9vA0bpKzvMib5tB0tTfCMoLMoscpqMLDudlA04KRvEtcHTZ7/mONvRL/HqZMcpMp1mjaVmQzhR9wpdW95GPQgm2qngZBG52bAgvQNGFtIeOLktecmki+g1rTJgz0KRmuIsPjWxtr+IZ92Sr2p1pWLdNAmz+qxI2vHpIxdd3QcK66x+/8vNqsMzcrOzjMjUUjsMm8t2pCFUC02sM+zD9PC641bYw9r2g4tVnKixz9yaGFRV/ah20xi92N1h6XchJzjFrDU4LVKq083OOw9XlnRHhutZv2g== ll_K1h7vqmZoeFVoC7SU8Fvh80DAewKJyj38xijh3qa8gn8iwrkfoETukZDibgFlnL9PHb8hKXVW tf87ExWKmfVXIxhwctufdIlXKuV2CZOCo9UtJsmUKyfwTzDrC8_FjFneGT2.r260ZkBQIoeX9Oan 5sxD7wxeYc5hL99alptAqxwVQPbJleI1skOgilB2hF9xWYXQKOqBejS2a62iAy4mLce21VU.oFeW FvbfCcAUm7xBK265e_ZzF1cIGWWpZ.K0Zu3Fcp.u1GkJV2y4NTgWtOsVcdUajusqd71PvXQTeLUt INCHKP3Ontl.2nfAW24f7prQSnIONNOiLrNxUYgx4c.4i851oxQAh7ohpzXbwafLR8ewnPZFhco8 9GHPfD0Bo0KQxLZNS4EUfsEQlKOpqpLi5z.t.ln2kM3L0Lgr9ZFMQCNIh_T0xt.wARpuJYP3uvsZ s5A2ogTEYnPEqug44R_PXefi3ooh0rJa4XH5NbcB0ZY.b.90M8qJO1YmClq2TWOScrildxwzDidL r8l8e8GIhA3t_Jn4z_dkavUS5BRNJ4mE.oATa3fP.H2NhkskTX3D0Xg4o9IQI_tu5aDREze0Z3xm YWYEqtbrFE65HOf4DZfFfI5BZSEdbhvmyfOq0w43zueGnLDqz34GMSmxNi5.qGmh_crkbfSpYghY 2ngkNOMsFpOATnWp7yidXyS88aeiiIqdwu15nxvlpJlUiqOiA9zBaxFoaWrkWclHMb5CfMEwbbkX NlRWjoDFJHnOdU6kQCYgM5MYN0xz80e8wexW.tzRZVNY7v1B.TpnxYVkm5ZeVW8wCV5GmiX.d2wE zKwfZnnzQd4SmkMO74pJXGxJVgbPHQKgrXHcM.9F8Bzc4.iNkCUVfwJ0iEMBipwbzp814o8RpQOo s2muT.KwCEZo2H_fsITsRWJ_AiVr.YGd9tAW8UOgglZKZtsYKpv_qTjQAw3ynBTkrQWeDnHgK2dE kzZ803ZCoIqCdZkmFFdsk4ctFYqEeRO7yKWl7TJhRwtiyVrGLkdLFEOc37miisZ.AKcNLZoP9B4d V5MHgPUcFSKgUoiKBHFhn3yN_7utXsKVdW2eZARpbBa3EnL_xjJozD3Xdq7iGOZ6szinGnggoReF mxHCbsjPxR6nptl.UYV2bKwLAmxSRNR83gV.Q9IN8IQOnYzc_sAiuPIoVREKT7BxQTj2.YCoAn15 ylPJsGWeeMrGvkcCzLJnvqdbZwoEOfsJcDJKb5RsPU_ujIaeExAUPyW1cdu7.eqL0QeOxnoCMh2X pdnjjWl6Wj9Chr2ihnmuP8KaB6QXQFgLajyFDIVLaVHAL9F0Dcv9tPvAgdC0t.ZbfWJ3lbr2lZPd jcoxQgj9Al97tra05xyUOJG_PvobUO9Ggq_kSrkDtsFictBxzGNYzbrzRuM5uGl6rJVgsJG71iQH nt7T1EvOT8k28jhOJ0ms3171UWXfkss.cVe6QKebLv3VXHmLcDZM6FAfFiJeDubQk9aSdDJFei8J qmDEJ9lNX.oyZVBjAcpf7Yz8dacIseU6rIm.xoWXZZtgqU0XEFWr8JT6iUPtiTNPLSHgPoAdPneu wc7xYLLJ9UNOLZHDI0HFEcBV39h9JRFzAqqTPRTIAhHvYxaCjsOtxM0xPlGGSH5c7jm.s1nN0yF0 7DID7P5RVVU1IWl_8dMVRX20V1Wgy0exxRtyHVLhxMeZG1N7gbYB3Rawn7TMS4hw1Zdag_3lMHi2 CEcA8Hq_IQjU0rhBng_eYV4xIXtH2LJRJHRxvj5XUjSSbKSXDPQHzCloaxK1HN1n955SeGkkoJ4t CPEi_HJZMCpfmrTkp8LtfvVXKghinIZ2HA0RE0txkf9WoWZIQRTxLKaimt4lD7nomF.0NW8PCSJ7 APHsNf6MX1TH4ZePMo4k_Pe6Y1QRl2odqAqz4mIZ7n15WIM_Yp4k8akDzts8DQQ.xhiLS15EL.e2 LXxp0DJQdtgNQdhVK8tHnJP5mRuIFKtP9sApRzRr9h71iSiCvT0JSRkC3TG4wHIdRdfGnSzj4rr0 _Pk5zmFuJ_GYtjp4Q6_06WiTbGP.i6hhNIoaQTT_yOsvuOZVRYxod.x.E6bMuHDASjrt2wwclar9 pUTs68SWdgfuXXjmcv1mFsbU_qiKnFBHjwl6w2iXe4BO7IxDzz36lTYASWIQk8tr2NWe4wMf7PPJ Zdj0pRTyIPXndVUPnQZhv8wbspwuBLjr_O617wWMaqyvM5_clgHu7EbJyztN1itIBUZhiQIDtYyL FQG.W1yeCp75kNsr31hrt8wU- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic306.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 21:33:22 +0000 Received: by kubenode514.mail-prod1.omega.gq1.yahoo.com (VZM Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID a82aa303b9637dbc84e5247ffdb6cf02; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 21:33:16 +0000 (UTC) References: <1UZ4czii2p.CEVo1rpNaml@johns-desktop> Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2021 16:33:14 -0500 From: "john niolon" To: "shop-talk" User-Agent: OEClassic/3.2 (Win10.19043; P; 2021-05-18) mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.yahoo Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format --===============8914787316588993180== This is a multi-part message in MIME format --6EuL4dFWn0qdsT=_znni7i2Xj5cBHEjZaY Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline well, that's three days or so I'll never see again... started over on = the=20 diagnosis... A fellow ford guy in Canada mentioned something about the= =20 alternator exciter wire being used when alternator was larger than 80 = amps. I=20 didn't use one... I called EZ-wire tech guy and we discussed it. He as= sured me that with a one wire unit the exciter wire wasn't=20 used (it gets itself excited ) As we talked he asked what my battery v= oltage=20 was when the alternator was above 1500 rpm and I told him in the 13 vo= lt range.=20 Then he asked what my alternator voltage was and it was 14.6 or so... = He said=20 just to check it and bypass all the wiring to run a wire straight from= the=20 alternator to the battery +... I asked him if it cured the problem sho= uld I=20 just leave it in place... he said sure , that way you are getting char= ging=20 voltage straight from alternator So I built a #4 cable and installed it from alternator to battery +...= guess=20 what ??? 14.6 at alternator and 14.6 at the battery... All this high t= ech=20 diagnosis... was just an exercise... At least I know that all my conne= ctions=20 and terminals and electrical stuff is good and well grounded and bless= ed ., I=20 think=20 I'm gonna call him back tomorrow and get him to explain EX-wires reaso= n for not having that direct charge wire in the first place. Thanks f= or sticking with me trying to figure this out and for all the informat= ion, ideas, suggestion, CWAGs and un mentioned comments about how I ca= n be so dumb and yet so good looking at the same time... john John, here=E2=80=99s a little electrical theory for you, hope it helps= =2E=20 Resistance measurements on a vehicle are not generally useful for circ= uits that handle higher currents but works better for circuits that de= al with signals. It is useful just as a open/short diagnosis. Here=E2=80= =99s an example. A wire carrying 40A current with 1V drop will have a = resistance of .025 ohm, much too low to be a real indication. Voltage,= either to ground (the same ground point for all measurements) or volt= age drop across a wire is the best way to find bad connections or unde= rsized wires, your readings will not be near the end of the range or t= he meter. That=E2=80=99s why I recommended the series of voltage readi= ngs all along the wire from the alternator to the battery.=20 This approach also works well for grounds. When working with grounds i= t is best to use a single ground reference point or do voltage drops a= cross each ground wire.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 9, 2021, at 3:10 PM, john niolon wrote: =EF=BB=BF Pat, while the battery was out I checked resistance on all b= attery, starter and ground cables... all read from .003 to .004 ohm re= sistance end to end=20 also rechecked the charging voltage again with engine at 1200 rpm 14= =2E6 volts... as I increased the rpm the voltage flickered down to 14.= 3 - 14.4 to then back up to 14.6 as rpm decreased back to 1200 did this both with VOM leads on battery terminals AND alternator termi= nals j ----- Original Message ----- From: Pat Horne To: john niolon Cc: shop-talk Sent: 8/9/2021 1:30:34 PM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck John,=20 Check charging voltage @ alternator post, alternator terminal, termina= l on other end of 1/0 cable, post that terminal connects to. If you ca= n get to the conductor in the 1/0 cable, get that too. That should be = enough to find the problem.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne =20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 9, 2021, at 1:02 PM, john niolon wrote: =EF=BB=BF=20 sorry for slow response... helping daughter and sil move...priorities!= !! Monday a.m. report fresh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle char= ger since then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two diff= erent meters hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester, voltage reading same as VOM at 13.= 4 voltage at frame rail terminal also 13.4 battery has 800 CCA capacity started test... over 15 second test the battery slowly dropped to 320 = amps and voltage read 10.8 (still in the green scale) stopped test at 15 seconds and two minutes later battery was back up t= o 12.7 next step will be check alternator output at battery and terminal poin= t ok... started truck... engine at 1200 rpm meter on alternator o/p- voltage is 14.6 meter on battery voltage is 13.5 hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4'=20 of 1/0 cable....that=20 don't sound right need to measure resistance of cable I guess... as an aside... checked voltaged between frame ground and the case of t= he alternator... 0.0001 volts I also took battery back to Wal mart and Quintella checked it... batt= ery is good based on her years of battery experience ----- Original Message ----- From: john niolon To: shop-talk Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck jeff=E2=80=A6. regular led acid battery ?? Everstart Maxx27 80= 0 CCA regular Walmart battery When it died, did any of the electrical items still work? Lights, etc= =2E? when it first occurred ,, when I tried to restart, .. starter ju= st clicked and I remember the a/c fan still blowing Donald... How large is the cable from the alternator to the battery? = feed from battery to alternator is #4 wire Dave... I was thinking a dirty battery clamp. battery clamps are ne= w this year and clean, no corrosion on connections John... How is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame o= r to the motor? voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash frame voltme= ter used to check under hood is grounded to frame not engine. I'll=20= go back and check ground connections. Alternator has a ground terminal= of=20 it's own... it's #10 wire grounded to the frame and of course the alte= rnator is=20 grounded through=20 it's mount. Pat... what is the relationship between the frame terminal & the rest= of the electrical system? Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a 4'=20= piece of #4 wire from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from the b= attery is=20 connected to the solenoid. Jimmie.. =20 What's the voltage at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the= engine 'off' hmmm ?? don't=20 remember checking that, =E2=80=A6 =20 I'll do that How big is the alternator? 100 amp single wire from CVF racing ya'll=20 have given me lots to check and recheck and some I=20 haven't thought of... going back through my diagnostics and check co= nnections too. I bought a 500 amp load tester yesterday and will put = sufficient load on the battery. Battery is under the cab and I have t= o lower it to check it out and with the low truck, I have to raise tru= ck on jackstands.. silly me, I thought battery would be a low maintena= nce item ...duh. so checking at a shop somewhere is a very large pai= n. points I'm=20 considering.... larger ground wires from frame to engine.... alternato= r to=20 frame and check resistance from solenoid lug to the terminal on the fr= ame... =20 the saga continues thanks for all the replies and points to check.. you guys are the be= st john _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net= /archive talk/patintexas@icloud.com --6EuL4dFWn0qdsT=_znni7i2Xj5cBHEjZaY Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
well, that's = three days or so I'll never see again... started over on the diagnosis= =2E.. A fellow ford guy in Canada mentioned something about the a= lternator exciter wire being used when alternator was larger than 80 a= mps. I didn't use one... I called EZ-wire tech guy and we discussed it= =2E He assured me that with a one wire unit the exciter wire wasn't us= ed (it gets itself excited 3D"") As we talked he asked= what my battery voltage was when the alternator was above 1500 rpm an= d I told him in the 13 volt range. Then he asked what my alternator vo= ltage was and it was 14.6 or so... He said just to check it and bypass= all the wiring to run a wire straight from the alternator to the batt= ery +... I asked him if it cured the problem should I just leave it in= place... he said sure , that way you are getting charging voltage str= aight from alternator

So I built a #4 cable and installed it from a= lternator to battery +... guess what ??? 14.6 at alternator and 14.6 a= t the battery... All this high tech diagnosis... was just an exercise.= =2E. At least I know that all my connections and terminals and electri= cal stuff is good and well grounded and blessed ., I think I'm gonna c= all him back tomorrow and get him to explain EX-wires reason for not h= aving that direct charge wire in the first place. Thanks  for sti= cking with me trying to figure this out and for all the information, i= deas, suggestion, CWAGs and un mentioned comments about how I can be s= o dumb and yet so good looking at the same time...
 
 
John, here=E2=80=99s a little electrical theory for you, hope it helps= =2E 

Resistance measurements on a vehicle are not generally useful for= circuits that handle higher currents but works better for circuits th= at deal with signals. It is useful just as a open/short diagnosis. Her= e=E2=80=99s an example. A wire carrying 40A current with 1V drop will = have a resistance of .025 ohm, much too low to be a real indication. V= oltage, either to ground (the same ground point for all measurements) = or voltage drop across a wire is the best way to find bad connections = or undersized wires, your readings will not be near the end of the ran= ge or the meter. That=E2=80=99s why I recommended the series of voltag= e readings all along the wire from the alternator to the battery. = ;

This approach also works well for grounds. When working with grou= nds it is best to use a single ground reference point or do voltage dr= ops across each ground wire. 

Peace,
Pat

Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


On Aug 9, 2021, at 3:10 PM, john niolon <jniolon= @att.net> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF=20 Pat, while = the battery was out I checked resistance on all battery, starter and g= round cables... all read from .003 to .004 ohm resistance end to end=20=
 also rechecked the charging voltage again with engine at 12= 00 rpm  14.6 volts... as I increased the rpm the voltage flickere= d down to 14.3 - 14.4 to  then
back up to 14.6 as rpm decreased back to 1200
 
did this both with VOM leads on battery terminals AND alternator = terminals
 
j
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Pat Horne <patintexas@icloud.com>
=
To: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
Cc: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 8/9/2021 1:30:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
John,=20
Check charging voltage @ alternator post, alternator terminal, te= rminal on other end of 1/0 cable, post that terminal connects to. If y= ou can get to the conductor in the 1/0 cable, get that too. That shoul= d be enough to find the problem. 

Peace,
Pat


Pat Horne =20
We support Habitat for Humanity


On Aug 9, 2021, at 1:02 PM, john niolon <jniolon= @att.net> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF=20
 
Monday a.m. report

fresh charge on b= attery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle charger since then ..= battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different meters

<= BR style=3D"BOX-SIZING: border-box">hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester= , voltage reading same as VOM at 13.4
voltage at frame rail terminal also 13.4

battery has 800 CCA ca= pacity
started test... over 15 sec= ond test the battery slowly dropped to 320 amps and voltage read 10.8 = (still in the green scale)
stopped= test at 15 seconds and two minutes later battery was back up to 12.7<= BR style=3D"BOX-SIZING: border-box">

3D""
<= SOURCE style=3D"BOX-SIZING: border-box" data-srcset=3D"" srcset=3D"htt= ps://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.ford-trucks.com-vbulletin/360x270/amps1_= d85e8a6155a607aae42c4fe2bbfde35778478032.jpg" media=3D"(max-width: 580= px)">3D""
next step will be check alterna= tor output at battery and terminal point

ok... started truck... eng= ine at 1200 rpm
meter on alternato= r o/p- voltage is 14.6
meter on ba= ttery voltage is 13.5

hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....th= at don't sound right
need to measu= re resistance of cable I guess...
=
as an aside... checked voltaged b= etween frame ground and the case of the alternator... 0.0001 volts

= I also took battery back to Wal mart and Quintella checked it... = battery is good based on her years of
battery experience
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
To: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM
Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
jeff=E2=80=A6.     regular led acid battery ?= ?     Everstart Maxx27 800 C= CA  regular Walmart battery
 
When it died, did any of the electrical items still work?  L= ights, etc.?  when it first occurred ,, whe= n I tried to restart, .. starter just clicked and I remember the = a/c fan still blowing
 
 
Donald...  How large is the cable from= the alternator to the battery?   feed from battery to alternator is #4 wire
 
Dave... I was thinkin= g a dirty battery clamp.    battery clamps are n= ew this year and clean, no corrosion on connections
 
John...   H= ow is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to the mo= tor?    voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash fr= ame  voltmeter used to check under hood is grounded to frame not = engine.  I'll go back and check ground connections. Alternator ha= s a ground terminal of it's own... it's #10 wire grounded to the frame=  and of course the alternator is grounded through it's mount.
 
Pat...  what is the relationship betwe= en the frame terminal & the rest of the electrical system?  <= /FONT>Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of  #4 wire= from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connect= ed to the solenoid.
 
Jimmie..    What's the volta= ge at the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off'    hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6=   I'll do that
 How big is the alternator?&nbs= p;   100 amp single wire from CVF racing
 
ya'll have given me lots to check and reche= ck and some I haven't thought of...   going back through my = diagnostics and check connections too.  I bought a 500 amp load t= ester yesterday and will put sufficient load on the battery.  Bat= tery is under the cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with = the low truck, I have to raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thoug= ht battery would be a low maintenance item ...duh.   so chec= king at a shop somewhere is a very large pain.
 
points I'm considering.... larger ground wi= res from frame to engine.... alternator to frame and check resistance = from solenoid lug to the terminal on the frame...   the saga= continues
 
thanks for all the replies and points to ch= eck..   you guys are the best
 
john
 
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--6EuL4dFWn0qdsT=_znni7i2Xj5cBHEjZaY-- --===============8914787316588993180== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8914787316588993180==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Aug 12 15:50:29 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68C6AA131E for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 15:50:29 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from st43p00im-zteg10073401.me.com (unknown [17.58.63.181]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97714A11F7 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 15:39:23 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1628804364; bh=UdXMyqdkJt7XGROh+0YBUJK68nt1XS2n70gpVxg6iG8=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=hL7Xm5fOghP39ePpihh+Msv5PaPmBz1gcarwQRafdVEZlgiJlt4lHuzrcu6uuwEIC 0OEuedFIWXCQiDHDHnktqGiCZItiJ7u64gkeZoqEJBHz4yTl3Dt63VRDBLkFo2WgHF Cmndw9UHn8Q8hLb3Eej4DwgoLFTa3i5bdO9HxMPSkPWbSIHYFUeSHPk3sCT4XPza0C IIGJfS0yD2bZIWNpPQQBq97jWOoccBMdJl/mlPu7Tqhh1GGzqQBEaa8nAl529A99co F43pGeJk7T59iMzu7rKa2PX2sNI1pUmDS8QfIJWL5wWbk/62qDxSDCLye7aDoj5o3q 5syIcrfBrMygw== Received: from [192.168.88.248] (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by st43p00im-zteg10073401.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 8646F5E03BC; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 21:39:23 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2021 16:39:17 -0500 References: <1UZ4gHZwoN.17NujlMnNJR@johns-desktop> To: john niolon =?UTF-8?Q?2903e8d5c8f:6.0.391,18.0.790,17.0.607.475.0000000_definitions?= =?UTF-8?Q?=3D2021-08-12=5F06:2021-08-11=5F01,2021-08-12=5F06,2020-04-07?= =?UTF-8?Q?=5F01_signatures=3D0?= malwarescore=0 mlxlogscore=999 mlxscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 suspectscore=0 adultscore=0 bulkscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2108120139 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck Cc: shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============7288720556330606890== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-69CBEA7B-F1CB-42A8-A42F-541CD044A3DC charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Glad you found it! Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 12, 2021, at 4:34 PM, john niolon wrote: =EF=BB=BF well, that's three days or so I'll never see again... started over on the di= agnosis... A fellow ford guy in Canada mentioned something about the alterna= tor exciter wire being used when alternator was larger than 80 amps. I didn'= t use one... I called EZ-wire tech guy and we discussed it. He assured me th= at with a one wire unit the exciter wire wasn't used (it gets itself excited= ) As we talked he asked what my battery voltage was when the alternator was= above 1500 rpm and I told him in the 13 volt range. Then he asked what my a= lternator voltage was and it was 14.6 or so... He said just to check it and b= ypass all the wiring to run a wire straight from the alternator to the batte= ry +... I asked him if it cured the problem should I just leave it in place.= .. he said sure , that way you are getting charging voltage straight from al= ternator So I built a #4 cable and installed it from alternator to battery +... guess= what ??? 14.6 at alternator and 14.6 at the battery... All this high tech d= iagnosis... was just an exercise... At least I know that all my connections a= nd terminals and electrical stuff is good and well grounded and blessed ., I= think I'm gonna call him back tomorrow and get him to explain EX-wires reas= on for not having that direct charge wire in the first place. Thanks for st= icking with me trying to figure this out and for all the information, ideas,= suggestion, CWAGs and un mentioned comments about how I can be so dumb and y= et so good looking at the same time... john =20 =20 John, here=E2=80=99s a little electrical theory for you, hope it helps.=20 Resistance measurements on a vehicle are not generally useful for circuits t= hat handle higher currents but works better for circuits that deal with sign= als. It is useful just as a open/short diagnosis. Here=E2=80=99s an example.= A wire carrying 40A current with 1V drop will have a resistance of .025 ohm= , much too low to be a real indication. Voltage, either to ground (the same g= round point for all measurements) or voltage drop across a wire is the best w= ay to find bad connections or undersized wires, your readings will not be ne= ar the end of the range or the meter. That=E2=80=99s why I recommended the s= eries of voltage readings all along the wire from the alternator to the batt= ery.=20 This approach also works well for grounds. When working with grounds it is b= est to use a single ground reference point or do voltage drops across each g= round wire.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 9, 2021, at 3:10 PM, john niolon wrote: =EF=BB=BF Pat, while the battery was out I checked resistance on all battery= , starter and ground cables... all read from .003 to .004 ohm resistance end= to end also rechecked the charging voltage again with engine at 1200 rpm 14.6 vol= ts... as I increased the rpm the voltage flickered down to 14.3 - 14.4 to t= hen back up to 14.6 as rpm decreased back to 1200 =20 did this both with VOM leads on battery terminals AND alternator terminals =20 j =20 ----- Original Message ----- From: Pat Horne To: john niolon Cc: shop-talk Sent: 8/9/2021 1:30:34 PM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck John, Check charging voltage @ alternator post, alternator terminal, terminal on o= ther end of 1/0 cable, post that terminal connects to. If you can get to the= conductor in the 1/0 cable, get that too. That should be enough to find the= problem.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 9, 2021, at 1:02 PM, john niolon wrote: =EF=BB=BF sorry for slow response... helping daughter and sil move...priorities!!! =20 Monday a.m. report fresh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle charger si= nce then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different meters= hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester, voltage reading same as VOM at 13.4 voltage at frame rail terminal also 13.4 battery has 800 CCA capacity started test... over 15 second test the battery slowly dropped to 320 amps a= nd voltage read 10.8 (still in the green scale) stopped test at 15 seconds and two minutes later battery was back up to 12.7= next step will be check alternator output at battery and terminal point ok... started truck... engine at 1200 rpm meter on alternator o/p- voltage is 14.6 meter on battery voltage is 13.5 hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....that don't sound right need to measure resistance of cable I guess... as an aside... checked voltaged between frame ground and the case of the alt= ernator... 0.0001 volts I also took battery back to Wal mart and Quintella checked it... battery is= good based on her years of battery experience =20 =20 ----- Original Message ----- From: john niolon To: shop-talk Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck jeff=E2=80=A6. regular led acid battery ?? Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA = regular Walmart battery =20 When it died, did any of the electrical items still work? Lights, etc.? wh= en it first occurred ,, when I tried to restart, .. starter just clicked and= I remember the a/c fan still blowing =20 =20 Donald... How large is the cable from the alternator to the battery? feed= from battery to alternator is #4 wire =20 Dave... I was thinking a dirty battery clamp. battery clamps are new this= year and clean, no corrosion on connections =20 John... How is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to t= he motor? voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash frame voltmeter used to c= heck under hood is grounded to frame not engine. I'll go back and check gro= und connections. Alternator has a ground terminal of it's own... it's #10 wi= re grounded to the frame and of course the alternator is grounded through it= 's mount. =20 Pat... what is the relationship between the frame terminal & the rest of th= e electrical system? Terminal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of #4= wire from the i/p solenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connecte= d to the solenoid. =20 Jimmie.. What's the voltage at the terminal with those accessories 'on' b= ut the engine 'off' hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6 I'll= do that How big is the alternator? 100 amp single wire from CVF racing =20 ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck and some I haven't thought of.= .. going back through my diagnostics and check connections too. I bought a= 500 amp load tester yesterday and will put sufficient load on the battery. = Battery is under the cab and I have to lower it to check it out and with th= e low truck, I have to raise truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thought batte= ry would be a low maintenance item ...duh. so checking at a shop somewhere= is a very large pain. =20 points I'm considering.... larger ground wires from frame to engine.... alte= rnator to frame and check resistance from solenoid lug to the terminal on th= e frame... the saga continues =20 thanks for all the replies and points to check.. you guys are the best =20 john =20 _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com --Apple-Mail-69CBEA7B-F1CB-42A8-A42F-541CD044A3DC charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Glad you found it!

Peace= ,
Pat

Pat Horne 
We support Habit= at for Humanity


On Aug 12, 20= 21, at 4:34 PM, john niolon <jniolon@att.net> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF
= well, that's three days or so I'll never see again... start= ed over on the diagnosis... A fellow ford guy in Canada mentioned somet= hing about the alternator exciter wire being used when alternator was larger= than 80 amps. I didn't use one... I called EZ-wire tech guy and we discusse= d it. He assured me that with a one wire unit the exciter wire wasn't used (= it gets itself excited 3D"") As we talked he asked what my b= attery voltage was when the alternator was above 1500 rpm and I told him in t= he 13 volt range. Then he asked what my alternator voltage was and it was 14= .6 or so... He said just to check it and bypass all the wiring to run a wire= straight from the alternator to the battery +... I asked him if it cured th= e problem should I just leave it in place... he said sure , that way you are= getting charging voltage straight from alternator

So I built a #4 cable and in= stalled it from alternator to battery +... guess what ??? 14.6 at alternator= and 14.6 at the battery... All this high tech diagnosis... was just an exer= cise... At least I know that all my connections and terminals and electrical= stuff is good and well grounded and blessed ., I think I'm gonna call him b= ack tomorrow and get him to explain EX-wires reason for not having that dire= ct charge wire in the first place. Thanks  for sticking with me trying t= o figure this out and for all the information, ideas, suggestion, CWAGs and u= n mentioned comments about how I can be so dumb and yet so good looking= at the same time...

john
 = ;
 
John, here=E2=80=99s a little electrical theory for you, hope it helps. = ;

Resistance measurements on a vehicle are not generally useful for circu= its that handle higher currents but works better for circuits that deal with= signals. It is useful just as a open/short diagnosis. Here=E2=80=99s an exa= mple. A wire carrying 40A current with 1V drop will have a resistance of .02= 5 ohm, much too low to be a real indication. Voltage, either to ground (the s= ame ground point for all measurements) or voltage drop across a wire is the b= est way to find bad connections or undersized wires, your readings will not b= e near the end of the range or the meter. That=E2=80=99s why I recommended t= he series of voltage readings all along the wire from the alternator to the b= attery. 

This approach also works well for grounds. When working with grounds it= is best to use a single ground reference point or do voltage drops across e= ach ground wire. 

Peace,
Pat

Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity


On Aug 9, 2021, at 3:10 PM, john niolon <jniolon@att= .net> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF=20 Pat, while the b= attery was out I checked resistance on all battery, starter and ground cable= s... all read from .003 to .004 ohm resistance end to end=20
 also rechecked the charging voltage again with engine at 1200 rpm=   14.6 volts... as I increased the rpm the voltage flickered down to 14= .3 - 14.4 to  then
back up to 14.6 as rpm decreased back to 1200
 
did this both with VOM leads on battery terminals AND alternator termin= als
 
j
 
----- Original Message -----
From: Pat Horne <patintexas@icloud.com>
To: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
Cc: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 8/9/2021 1:30:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
John,=20
Check charging voltage @ alternator post, alternator terminal, terminal= on other end of 1/0 cable, post that terminal connects to. If you can get t= o the conductor in the 1/0 cable, get that too. That should be enough to fin= d the problem. 

Peace,
Pat


Pat Horne =20
We support Habitat for Humanity


On Aug 9, 2021, at 1:02 PM, john niolon <jniolon@att= .net> wrote:

=EF=BB=BF=20
sorry for slow response... helping daughter and sil move..= .priorities!!!
 
Monday a.m.= report

fresh charge on battery 40 amp for 30 minutes on saturday trickle charg= er since then .. battery voltage 13.4 this a.m. checked with two different m= eters


hooked up H.F. 500 amp load tester, v= oltage reading same as VOM at 13.4
volta= ge at frame rail terminal also 13.4

battery has 800 CCA capacity
started test... over 15 second test the battery slowly d= ropped to 320 amps and voltage read 10.8 (still in the green scale)
stopped test at 15 seconds and two minutes later= battery was back up to 12.7


3D""
3D""<= /picture>

next step will be check alternator output at battery and terminal poi= nt

= ok... started truck... engine at 1200 rpm
meter on battery voltage is 13.5

hmmm...1.1 volt drop in 4' of 1/0 cable....t= hat don't sound right
need to measure re= sistance of cable I guess...

as an aside... checked voltaged between frame groun= d and the case of the alternator... 0.0001 volts

I also took battery back to Wa= l mart and Quintella checked it...  battery is good based on her years o= f
battery exp= erience
 
 
----- Original Message -----
From: john niolon <jniolon@att.net>
To: shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 8/6/2021 8:58:12 AM
Subject: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck
jeff=E2=80=A6.     regular led acid battery ?? = ;    Everstart Maxx27 800 CCA  r= egular Walmart battery
 
When it died, did any of the electrical items still work?  Lights,= etc.?  when it first occurred ,, when I tried t= o restart, .. starter just clicked and I remember the a/c fan still blo= wing
 
 
Donald...  How large is the cable from the= alternator to the battery?   feed f= rom battery to alternator is #4 wire
 
Dave... I was thinking a= dirty battery clamp.    battery clamps are new this y= ear and clean, no corrosion on connections
 
John...   How= is the volt meter in your truck grounded, to the frame or to the motor?    voltmeter in dash is grounded to dash frame  volt= meter used to check under hood is grounded to frame not engine.  I'll g= o back and check ground connections. Alternator has a ground terminal of it'= s own... it's #10 wire grounded to the frame and of course the alternat= or is grounded through it's mount.
 
Pat...  what is the relationship between t= he frame terminal & the rest of the electrical system?  Term= inal on the frame rail is fed by a 4' piece of  #4 wire from the i/p so= lenoid lug where the cable from the battery is connected to the solenoid.
 
Jimmie..    What's the voltage a= t the terminal with those accessories 'on' but the engine 'off' =    hmmm ?? don't remember checking that, =E2=80=A6  I'll do t= hat
 How big is the alternator? &n= bsp;  100 amp single wire from CVF racing
 
ya'll have given me lots to check and recheck a= nd some I haven't thought of...   going back through my diagnostic= s and check connections too.  I bought a 500 amp load tester yesterday a= nd will put sufficient load on the battery.  Battery is under the cab a= nd I have to lower it to check it out and with the low truck, I have to rais= e truck on jackstands.. silly me, I thought battery would be a low maintenan= ce item ...duh.   so checking at a shop somewhere is a very large p= ain.
 
points I'm considering.... larger ground wires f= rom frame to engine.... alternator to frame and check resistance from soleno= id lug to the terminal on the frame...   the saga continues=
 
thanks for all the replies and points to check.= .   you guys are the best
 
john
 
_________________________________= ______________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
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Archive: http://www.team.net= /pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/= patintexas@icloud.com

_______________________________________________

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= --Apple-Mail-69CBEA7B-F1CB-42A8-A42F-541CD044A3DC-- --===============7288720556330606890== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============7288720556330606890==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Aug 12 16:02:04 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0BC90A0F4A for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 16:02:04 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from NAM04-BN8-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (unknown [40.92.47.11]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82C53A1265 for ; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 15:57:00 -0600 (MDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; 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cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4415.16 via Frontend Transport; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 21:57:00 +0000 Received: from CO1PR06MB7994.namprd06.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::9103:ba23:d29a:b0d]) by CO1PR06MB7994.namprd06.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::9103:ba23:d29a:b0d%5]) with mapi id 15.20.4415.018; Thu, 12 Aug 2021 21:57:00 +0000 From: Jack Brooks To: john niolon , shop-talk Thread-Topic: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck Thread-Index: AQHXiss0MZZIpM+ur0iH99eqfhwWNqtref6AgAAJswCAABvrgIABFwcAgAO3FgCAAAE3QA== Date: Thu, 12 Aug 2021 21:56:50 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Thu, 12 Aug 2021 21:56:15 +0000 References: <1UZ4czii2p.CEVo1rpNaml@johns-desktop> <1UZ4gHZwoN.17NujlMnNJR@johns-desktop> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-incomingtopheadermarker: OriginalChecksum:3C47F726DBB88CAF364625B08FA827C67F794EF50ED9CB1D3BF01B1194432BA9; UpperCasedChecksum:2C76816DDE95561CE9B7D3A5D22D744959C3870D99FD60A51C604267BBAC7274; SizeAsReceived:6948; Count:44 x-tmn: 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x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2728917293171904293== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_CO1PR06MB7994554E3F77BF2B3190C7F3A8F99CO1PR06MB7994namp_" --_000_CO1PR06MB7994554E3F77BF2B3190C7F3A8F99CO1PR06MB7994namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 R2xhZCB0byBoZWFyIGl0IGlzIGZpbmFsbHkgY2hhcmdlZCBhbmQgdGhhdCB0aGUgc29sdXRpb24g d2FzIHNpbXBsZSENCg0KDQpNYWpvciBzaWRldHJhY2sgZm9sbG93c+KApuKApi4NCg0KVGhpcyBy ZW1pbmRzIG1lIG9mIG15IGNoYW5nZSBvdmVyIGZyb20gYSBnZW5lcmF0b3IgdG8gYW4gYWx0ZXJu YXRvciBpbiBteSAxOTYwIFRyaXVtcGggVFIzLiAgSSBpbnN0YWxsZWQgYSAzMEEgbm9uLXJlZ3Vs YXRlZCBhbHRlcm5hdG9yIGZyb20gYSBIb25kYSBDaXZpYy4gVGhlIG9sZCBnZW5lcmF0b3IgcGVh a2VkIGF0IDE3QSwgc28gaXQgd2FzIGEgbmljZSB1cGdyYWRlLiAgSSBoYWQgdGhlIGFsdGVybmF0 b3IgY2hlY2tlZCBvdXQgYnkgYW4gb2xkIGZhc2hpb25lZCBhbHRlcm5hdG9yIHNob3AuICBJdCB3 b3JrZWQgcGVyZmVjdGx5LiAgSGUgc29sZCBtZSBhbiBlbGVjdHJvbmljIHJlZ3VsYXRvciwgdGhh 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--_000_CO1PR06MB7994554E3F77BF2B3190C7F3A8F99CO1PR06MB7994namp_-- --===============2728917293171904293== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2728917293171904293==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Aug 13 07:06:48 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4AFAA0F57 for ; Fri, 13 Aug 2021 07:06:48 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic306-2.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com (unknown [74.6.132.41]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06D41A0F84 for ; Fri, 13 Aug 2021 07:03:26 -0600 (MDT) t=1628859807; bh=AoYXT2X6tMGDGJajbCSU3T3Fzml9w1HvfrWiv2QrC30=; h=Date:From:Reply-To:To:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:From:Subject:Reply-To; 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EwsH4QyYXlGectiunKxyDRhiw3SJYiTMVzETx7ffb2r_Ky7RS3VMDHZ8xtcBI00JINHYRpvsMF6N GxzIL_3O6kiZKNTz13S1AvJQQ3rWA2Nv_KgB.G9Qsu9tTOsOSuQQwtCXEnpJyx53Ym_BGN7COQrV HVgnzn1a_tv3xGyB_z61efUJNntLFbV1FBYSVQaN5gCWVHHo_akH8Jnk_Ah02T22W Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic306.consmr.mail.bf2.yahoo.com with HTTP; Fri, 13 Aug 2021 13:03:27 +0000 Date: Fri, 13 Aug 2021 13:03:22 +0000 (UTC) From: DAVID MASSEY To: Jack Brooks , john niolon , shop-talk References: <1UZ4czii2p.CEVo1rpNaml@johns-desktop> <1UZ4gHZwoN.17NujlMnNJR@johns-desktop> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] electrical problem with truck Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============0223598480348210822== boundary="----=_Part_129079_1845747316.1628859802108" ------=_Part_129079_1845747316.1628859802108 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Alternators, and generators, have what is called residual magnetism.=C2=A0 = The steel laminates in the field (the rotor in the case of an alternator) w= ill become magnetized.=C2=A0 As the rotor spins the rotating magnets will g= enerate current in the stator coils.=C2=A0 This is important since power fo= r the exciter field comes from the alternator output.=C2=A0 Basically it li= fts itself up by the bootstraps.=C2=A0 The amount of residual magnetic field=C2=A0 strength is small so it takes m= ore speed to achieve enough voltage to start exciting the field will take m= ore speed than that required during normal operation.=C2=A0 My TR6 alternat= or has a charge indicator light connected between the exciter power and the= battery.=C2=A0 =C2=A0This provides a small amount of current to the excite= r to help get things going more quickly.=C2=A0 The TR6 alternator will reli= ably start charging at or below 1,000 RPM with the light installed but if I= reomove the light it sometimes needs 1,800 RPM.=C2=A0=C2=A0 BTW, alternators are not direction sensitive since the rectification is acc= omplished wit semiconductor diodes. It appears your new regulator is of a newer generation that actvates the IG= N light directly.=C2=A0 Oh, and three very good reasons for selecting that alternator.=C2=A0 Dave=20 =20 On Thu, Aug 12, 2021 at 17:02, Jack Brooks wrote: __= _____________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive ssey@cs.com =20 ------=_Part_129079_1845747316.1628859802108 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Alternators, and generators, have what is called residual magnetism.  = The steel laminates in the field (the rotor in the case of an alternator) w= ill become magnetized.  As the rotor spins the rotating magnets will g= enerate current in the stator coils.  This is important since power fo= r the exciter field comes from the alternator output.  Basically it li= fts itself up by the bootstraps. 

The amount of residual magnetic field  strength is small so it tak= es more speed to achieve enough voltage to start exciting the field will ta= ke more speed than that required during normal operation.  My TR6 alte= rnator has a charge indicator light connected between the exciter power and= the battery.   This provides a small amount of current to the ex= citer to help get things going more quickly.  The TR6 alternator will = reliably start charging at or below 1,000 RPM with the light installed but = if I reomove the light it sometimes needs 1,800 RPM.  

BTW, alternators are not direction sens= itive since the rectification is accomplished wit semiconductor diodes.

It appears your new regulator is= of a newer generation that actvates the IGN light directly. 

Oh, and three very good reasons for s= electing that alternator. 

= Dave

On Thu, Aug 12, 2021 at= 17:02, Jack Brooks
<JIBrooks@live.com> wrote:
=
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.te= am.net
Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html<= br clear=3D"none">Suggested annual donation  $12.96
= Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://auto= x.team.net/archive

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=
------=_Part_129079_1845747316.1628859802108-- --===============0223598480348210822== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============0223598480348210822==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 12:07:51 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E02B0A0D6D for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:07:51 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qk1-f181.google.com (unknown [209.85.222.181]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0DEDAA0C5D for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:05:20 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-qk1-f181.google.com with SMTP id e14so14452791qkg.3 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 11:05:22 -0700 (PDT) h=from:mime-version:subject:message-id:date:to; bh=koqqBEI7Qp86Ci3jAtOSbSftjF28OZMtwWGuoRnuLvg=; b=BEXZqDo2VTBIEq5iycZ/l4Zn37VaQK79YEfhoIUI3qyw2gp/999mqaPgL+jCm+ylI0 /fMPDBtNwRUXv6VZR2U8Hus1eL6tcIIKokcglYNC5kmdZGPSt2d84wPGMBYj1aEoLReF MjSLycrNHdISV7+BqATg3MSqlMsnrxQdsFq1ioyLpV/IbBSTB8cfBOSZHVEtFoVUuaiw V7rirErtMGIl4+enjL1nYqBP455eA9Vpisu5Wt/zWo2Gv3w5Vx9FOoUWFCTuXZs4AHQ3 cOWqlZxEiLq67OqkvCfFrzyvNwllFD392lEI26WQl0osyT0N8I1XdAW7Y50AM2OZQbel 8Dng== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:mime-version:subject:message-id:date:to; bh=koqqBEI7Qp86Ci3jAtOSbSftjF28OZMtwWGuoRnuLvg=; b=WqI8GmOZT9dWr/aJOyZKKLzAQjahG5nHLDUUA1/4EZbZZBTPlMKRgFNUEFww5QHHb8 681wqycacPocmivwVEOlYCoA87ZKuSwIkSrStHhtt1MoL6F4TdskPAS9cWVe5rR+gA3D c5qC6+mHo20rM7J4PBWWOngGcSRP0SGTT7G1AJ14gGeBjaBlW+1dIY3+NA5kslwHsuNK C0VqNdh7jMbW1pF5ba+kMEomtggK2ILxQLs0Px8aG5boz/mx5zudXRqeDPpfWDYX9zAn 3YbaLoeBpYiU2PY0aoyhC2nD5DPxKF9EHdtU8ehzkR5ZL2oXEinunTQa+HZCaLzKHWpO fQGA== R3K4T5r1FDPkLYq5LHGr1uMjSouPpeFjyQ== t124mr11021800qke.293.1629569122234; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 11:05:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from macbook-pro-2.lan (ool-4350ed26.dyn.optonline.net. [67.80.237.38]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id bl26sm4876688qkb.34.2021.08.21.11.05.21 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 21 Aug 2021 11:05:21 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 14:05:20 -0400 To: Shop Talk Subject: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8829733690409366974== boundary="Apple-Mail=_C5611E64-F897-4A44-A667-8BAC7E6B4EE1" --Apple-Mail=_C5611E64-F897-4A44-A667-8BAC7E6B4EE1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 I am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths of = Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without power, = although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. = Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator = (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generat= or/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0= MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, of course, I have never = needed, although I do run it periodically to be safe. It is designed to = run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard regulator. A little = Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: Low Pressure Regulator Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. = I had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just = in case I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the = generator directly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the = portable tanks. The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here = are the specs for the water heater: Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR Max Working Pressure: 150psi Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator = directly to the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I = tried it once with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80= =99t put out any appreciable power. I always meant to research this = before I needed it, but like many of us, never got around to it until = now. Thanks, Jim --Apple-Mail=_C5611E64-F897-4A44-A667-8BAC7E6B4EE1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 I = am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths of = Hurricane Henri.  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without = power, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. =  Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propa= ne-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO= 0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, of = course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to be = safe.  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a = standard regulator.  A little Googling shows the following specs = for the regulator:

  • Low Pressure Regulator
  • Inlet Pressure:             =   25-250PSIG
  • Outlet Pressure:     =        280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.)
  • Flow = Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)

    • We use Propane for DHW and heat = and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an outside gas line = stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case I ever needed it = and I would like to be able to connect the generator directly to the = house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.  The = house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the = water heater:

    • Max Inlet Gas = Pressure:    13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet = Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Recovery = Rating:               = 206/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure:     = 150psi
    • Max Output:           =             180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:               =            11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold Pressure:             = 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input)

    Am I missing anything, or should I be = able to hook the generator directly to the house supply without the = regulator?  For the record, I tried it once with the regulator = attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any appreciable = power.  I always meant to research this before I needed it, but = like many of us, never got around to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Jim


    = --Apple-Mail=_C5611E64-F897-4A44-A667-8BAC7E6B4EE1-- --===============8829733690409366974== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8829733690409366974==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 12:39:05 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C79EA0D84 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:39:05 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ms11p00im-qufo17291601.me.com (unknown [17.58.38.45]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74A49A0D74 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:38:28 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1629571110; bh=8ZcDenL2C1kxgHK0y4MwjwGBqFG9m09aKVOckZhItGA=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=RyF9f2Ln6/ONje7bFJrThdyZLKT0VmHbQ6xgD8q34i/QP5c0I/b6zYAnxGBGFA6ol N5nZ6CQ/6vQShMYkCzJPlkuQyFSvPyxRZ4bKWks3tMBNDNr2Hido1a9peB1GYPr39b n4r7TGuPyzrOsHgiPOiNH+OnvKjeQo5pTD2ooYfMyuDBTxZv13nNRf7qwH6k6baTJy mgqW5j6BBx30jigglWHy9tqFHMBe1gXtCD7g3Ya3VeKb/X7fFItRbategkJ0C8VvNj umNB/aI3Iyx07a3k1dX04+14WH/+0icBC8KDi/Py3CtInnFKZj0F8hzykV6DELJx89 I5IrSrRmSViYw== Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by ms11p00im-qufo17291601.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id B6389200083; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 18:38:29 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:38:27 -0500 References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> To: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> =?UTF-8?Q?2903e8d5c8f:6.0.391,18.0.790,17.0.607.475.0000000_definitions?= =?UTF-8?Q?=3D2021-08-21=5F08:2021-08-20=5F03,2021-08-21=5F08,2020-04-07?= =?UTF-8?Q?=5F01_signatures=3D0?= adultscore=0 malwarescore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 suspectscore=0 clxscore=1011 phishscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2108210116 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5701069488889535492== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-D8F51482-7ED3-431D-A615-78FAA4E32C72 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Looks like it should work without the regulator. What size pipe did the do t= he new pipe in? What size line did you run between the pipe & generator? Jus= t because the the pressures match, flow rate also has to be sufficient.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths= of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without power,= although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. Shortly a= fter Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tool= s-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEi= wAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) w= hich, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to b= e safe. It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard reg= ulator. A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: Low Pressure Regulator Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. I ha= d an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case= I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator direc= tly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks. T= he house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the w= ater heater: Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR Max Working Pressure: 150psi Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly to= the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I tried it once wi= th the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any a= ppreciable power. I always meant to research this before I needed it, but l= ike many of us, never got around to it until now. Thanks, Jim _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com --Apple-Mail-D8F51482-7ED3-431D-A615-78FAA4E32C72 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Looks like it should work without the regul= ator. What size pipe did the do the new pipe in? What size line did you run b= etween the pipe & generator? Just because the the pressures match, flow r= ate also has to be sufficient. 

    Peace,
    Pat=

    Pat Horne 
    We support Habitat for Humanity=


    On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM,= Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths o= f Hurricane Henri.  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without pow= er, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy.  S= hortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen40= 00lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu= 7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) w= hich, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to b= e safe.  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standar= d regulator.  A little Googling shows the following specs for the regul= ator:

    • Low Pressure Regulator
    • Inlet Press= ure:               25-250PSIG
    • Outlet Pressure:            280mmH2O=3D= (11"W.C.)
    • Flow Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr= )

    We use= Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had= an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case I= ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator directl= y to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks. &nbs= p;The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for t= he water heater:

    <= ul class=3D"MailOutline">
  • Max Inlet Gas Pressure:    = ;13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
  • Min Inlet Gas Pressure:    = 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
  • Recovery Rating:       &= nbsp;       206/Gallons/HR
  • Max Working Pre= ssure:     150psi
  • Max Output:     &nb= sp;                 180,000 BTU/HR
  • Max Input:              = ;            11,000 BTU/HR
  • = Manifold Pressure:             3.9 =E2=80=9CW.= C. (For Max Input)

    • Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly= to the house supply without the regulator?  For the record, I tried it= once with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put o= ut any appreciable power.  I always meant to research this before I nee= ded it, but like many of us, never got around to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Ji= m


    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://= www.team.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12= .96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://= autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: h= ttp://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@icloud.com<= br>
    = --Apple-Mail-D8F51482-7ED3-431D-A615-78FAA4E32C72-- --===============5701069488889535492== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============5701069488889535492==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 12:39:53 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 014F8A0D9C for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:39:53 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ms11p00im-qufo17291601.me.com (unknown [17.58.38.45]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DBA7A0D7E for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:39:05 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1629571146; bh=pwCckyr3e65K0uJHOf2W/l8raMGcD8CRC6xn7vfaLEY=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=jEfcoeUNjAzQJJbb/EvaXi9yxbNhukToUML7CRSixiNHsiXOSKTLXVDxV+bYxc3+5 r/AUdY0nZg5Rrisn9opDD/GfMhOps4dr4NkJUV4PJMCkfFnCZDEccLy0UT0KztKqFr xuZoGmTV+Y3fGUwus5jFjTESr7UsSxSi6tggiXAjZHqu0PCyJxU7R9jGCiCi+19Qd7 APFYZc48ROS1e6yMG25K9RjwPhZlJExh73K4aiMBhmYSMOCuN8sW44lQuXEQ8S/pdq re4Wf/ND5qqoeD+ht9i42ySVlV3WjyBtwLtyTCCO7/RywNMxrV6SNNNWC6H1cnUKVv LiyqlYrOIs3Pg== Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by ms11p00im-qufo17291601.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7AC6E200108; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 18:39:05 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:39:05 -0500 References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> To: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> =?UTF-8?Q?2903e8d5c8f:6.0.391,18.0.790,17.0.607.475.0000000_definitions?= =?UTF-8?Q?=3D2021-08-21=5F08:2021-08-20=5F03,2021-08-21=5F08,2020-04-07?= =?UTF-8?Q?=5F01_signatures=3D0?= adultscore=0 malwarescore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 suspectscore=0 clxscore=1015 phishscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2108210116 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2483302489767674569== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-E5732877-BB93-4B4E-ABAB-4E6CBB5B4886 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Oh, & good luck with the storm.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths= of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without power,= although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. Shortly a= fter Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tool= s-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEi= wAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) w= hich, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to b= e safe. It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard reg= ulator. A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: Low Pressure Regulator Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. I ha= d an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case= I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator direc= tly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks. T= he house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the w= ater heater: Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR Max Working Pressure: 150psi Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly to= the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I tried it once wi= th the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any a= ppreciable power. I always meant to research this before I needed it, but l= ike many of us, never got around to it until now. Thanks, Jim _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com --Apple-Mail-E5732877-BB93-4B4E-ABAB-4E6CBB5B4886 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Oh, & good luck with the storm. 
    Peace,
    Pat

    Pat Horne&nbs= p;
    We support Habitat for Humanity


    On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com>= ; wrote:

    =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, di= rectly in one of the projected paths of Hurricane Henri.  We are being t= old to plan for 7-10 days without power, although FWIW we were only powerles= s for 4 days following Sandy.  Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Ge= nerator (https:= //www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3D= off&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaE= HYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, of course, I have never needed, a= lthough I do run it periodically to be safe.  It is designed to run off= of LP tanks and comes with a standard regulator.  A little Googling sh= ows the following specs for the regulator:

    • Low Pressure Reg= ulator
    • Inlet Pressure:          =     25-250PSIG
    • Outlet Pressure:     &= nbsp;      280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.)
    • Flow Capa= city(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)

    We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 50= 0 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an outside gas line stubbed out when t= he house was remodeled, just in case I ever needed it and I would like to be= able to connect the generator directly to the house supply and avoid having= to depend on the portable tanks.  The house supply is regulated and, a= s an example, here are the specs for the water heater:
    =
    • Max Inlet Gas Pressure:    13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • = Recovery Rating:               206/Gallon= s/HR
    • Max Working Pressure:     150psi
    • Max Output:                = ;       180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:   &= nbsp;                     &= nbsp;11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold Pressure:      = ;       3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input)

    Am I missing anything, or should I= be able to hook the generator directly to the house supply without the regu= lator?  For the record, I tried it once with the regulator attached and= it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any appreciable power.  I alw= ays meant to research this before I needed it, but like many of us, never go= t around to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Jim


    ____________________= ___________________________

    Shop-talk@autox= .team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    = Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http:/= /www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/optio= ns/shop-talk/patintexas@icloud.com

    = --Apple-Mail-E5732877-BB93-4B4E-ABAB-4E6CBB5B4886-- --===============2483302489767674569== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2483302489767674569==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 13:00:16 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A886A0DB8 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:00:16 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qv1-f54.google.com (unknown [209.85.219.54]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E902A0D46 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:59:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-qv1-f54.google.com with SMTP id eh1so7386712qvb.11 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 11:59:04 -0700 (PDT) h=from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc:to :references; bh=uRv+ZjtP85LEuSYMsz7e0rVmHAysdYnn2HEdvAFsQWI=; b=gARgB46p0Zwbv82Dln9HR7olEzRd6uKL290YYhi6GfpG4ilG5DxDaIei2sXbqcZ6Kj QPuKNlBj8YryGY4WgBophh5avIQViLqpUbRNn5oSFw4pvv6BcLrMebZV5wWIAGvc7Ynw kjz35BYnYdc9/la/JZ0AqCnlRbuJBqBH4PRK4ZTZYdUyg0xOOABCH5hp1hga3yTEjg28 d6oeEGNrlH9CvsivdLborg8qR7WCuDr0BMfW+qHVw4HKzGxoQFDIqfdMVASCj0L3AvzU qMdYuhrQ/EokDWyq4Ns0EGuLaF5HiWgnnclIIdAM+T91DeAxzzaL/wRq3+84zIX/rNsQ h9Iw== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date :in-reply-to:cc:to:references; bh=uRv+ZjtP85LEuSYMsz7e0rVmHAysdYnn2HEdvAFsQWI=; b=VmIIDqbB3Ywtj33PZDn4kTrEOLpHcgFCXLVs3B7VcOW0KI8lOBHH8NBJD2JcZ1br96 ZCf/idbppsen9LXaKmBKqPuK5gP4hzl//lBCOpahIXFCyn42lrzvnVvAYXqdGIu0guiU houaq8a2ntPsHM/dXaXQVy83SgXts1wxPzkR/ceLof+SZpBjpgSWOrZsT5kA35g/deG5 YnWkoqAsxM6s8YZn0dbGUU/SYBDIchjn94fV8eyTG1bKpOKkJmhG2Ew6T+XJOxoPvyc0 j5xqQCNaYJy+yaLohqjD8ukzZC4SfBI1kJGy5h5VgRJuxINepWPNa3DAUem7MZfMkETG 4JSw== psj2SSKR3L+83GaNOpR+rvc= do5mr26357019qvb.0.1629572343625; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 11:59:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from macbook-pro-2.lan (ool-4350ed26.dyn.optonline.net. [67.80.237.38]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id bi3sm4959224qkb.133.2021.08.21.11.59.02 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 21 Aug 2021 11:59:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 14:59:02 -0400 To: Pat Horne References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> <20F11C5F-900C-49B9-B4F8-6F7699DBCBAE@icloud.com> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5543957565646197753== boundary="Apple-Mail=_51A4B085-0479-4515-B5F5-7DF26ABEA7A6" --Apple-Mail=_51A4B085-0479-4515-B5F5-7DF26ABEA7A6 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Thanks, Pat. We=E2=80=99re only about 250 yards from a bay, but about = 12 feed above sea level, so the only real concern is the wind and trees. = At the peak, the water from Sandy flooded the expensive real estate = right on the water and one house in, but it would have taken an = apocalypse for the water to get up the street to us. As for the gas line, both the original and my replacement are 5/16 LP = hose. The only difference between the two, other than the regulator, is = that the original line is 5 ft long and the unregulated line is 10 ft. Jim > On Aug 21, 2021, at 2:39 PM, Pat Horne wrote: >=20 > Oh, & good luck with the storm.=20 >=20 > Peace, > Pat >=20 > Pat Horne=20 > We support Habitat for Humanity >=20 >=20 > On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected = paths of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days = without power, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following = Sandy. Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator = (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generat= or/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0= MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE = ) which, of course, I have never = needed, although I do run it periodically to be safe. It is designed to = run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard regulator. A little = Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: >=20 > Low Pressure Regulator > Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG > Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) > Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >=20 > We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. = I had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, = just in case I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the = generator directly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the = portable tanks. The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here = are the specs for the water heater: >=20 > Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. > Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. > Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR > Max Working Pressure: 150psi > Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR > Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR > Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >=20 > Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator = directly to the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I = tried it once with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80= =99t put out any appreciable power. I always meant to research this = before I needed it, but like many of us, never got around to it until = now. >=20 > Thanks, > Jim >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@icloud.com >=20 --Apple-Mail=_51A4B085-0479-4515-B5F5-7DF26ABEA7A6 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Thanks, Pat.  We=E2=80=99re only about 250 yards from a = bay, but about 12 feed above sea level, so the only real concern is the = wind and trees.  At the peak, the water from Sandy flooded the = expensive real estate right on the water and one house in, but it would = have taken an apocalypse for the water to get up the street to us.

    As for the gas line, = both the original and my replacement are 5/16 LP hose.  The only = difference between the two, other than the regulator, is that the = original line is 5 ft long and the unregulated line is 10 ft.

    Jim

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 2:39 PM, Pat Horne <patintexas@icloud.com> wrote:

    Oh, & good luck with the = storm. 

    Peace,
    Pat

    Pat Horne 
    We = support Habitat for Humanity


    On Aug = 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected = paths of Hurricane Henri.  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days = without power, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following = Sandy.  Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propa= ne-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO= 0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, of = course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to be = safe.  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a = standard regulator.  A little Googling shows the following specs = for the regulator:

  • Low Pressure Regulator
  • Inlet Pressure:             =   25-250PSIG
  • Outlet Pressure:     =        280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.)
  • Flow = Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)

    • We use Propane for DHW and heat = and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an outside gas line = stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case I ever needed it = and I would like to be able to connect the generator directly to the = house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.  The = house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the = water heater:

    • Max Inlet Gas = Pressure:    13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet = Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Recovery = Rating:               = 206/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure:     = 150psi
    • Max Output:           =             180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:               =            11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold Pressure:             = 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input)

    Am I missing anything, or should I be = able to hook the generator directly to the house supply without the = regulator?  For the record, I tried it once with the regulator = attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any appreciable = power.  I always meant to research this before I needed it, but = like many of us, never got around to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Jim


    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@iclo= ud.com


    = --Apple-Mail=_51A4B085-0479-4515-B5F5-7DF26ABEA7A6-- --===============5543957565646197753== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============5543957565646197753==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 13:06:01 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08102A0DCE for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:06:01 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from st43p00im-ztbu10073601.me.com (unknown [17.58.63.184]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E478A0DB0 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:04:13 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1629572655; bh=HhTzSNjZo9qs9MPdRK6/AWPDsFnp/8oYpvxejBe1X6g=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=KxK21QOWwm8yO9Jv88aM0hpgZcuv+K+ZVwuCQd074Mpv8e06SqmVA5cxKMbrHWjyx HrzGYIv7u2JRMSpQKYmHoXg0KPq5SWQWjdi5KpXglJNweZBNaZvhsFJgUCtCOFHfMI /4cU9OvyQFay3pHrCLGHV0neiVz0b9n3sXTsSRupULcNe9r7hVnhiFyIFt8srBRicb gdvNVhkw2UleVdy6kPRwJkBoq3Zv+gg6COdb/UGhnfVeC7qm1ZEm94fpWN5UeK4449 pT6DO+d5PLoK7YT/fPMmk4ttYIZRdeL+pqx0Uz96vHO0I4F1cE6+St/8GB1rOXE8Ix +Cg5rZxjUobBw== Received: from smtpclient.apple (c-73-195-119-82.hsd1.nj.comcast.net [73.195.119.82]) by st43p00im-ztbu10073601.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 399AD82040B; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 19:04:15 +0000 (UTC) From: Thomas Coradeschi Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 15:04:13 -0400 References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> To: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> =?UTF-8?Q?2903e8d5c8f:6.0.391,18.0.790,17.0.607.475.0000000_definitions?= =?UTF-8?Q?=3D2021-08-21=5F07:2021-08-20=5F03,2021-08-21=5F07,2020-04-07?= =?UTF-8?Q?=5F01_signatures=3D0?= suspectscore=0 spamscore=0 malwarescore=0 mlxscore=0 adultscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 clxscore=1011 bulkscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2108210119 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============7340043623260089645== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-E1D26424-103C-4373-9F03-55DA667AC4D4 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jim: You should be good to go. Time=E2=80=99s a wastin=E2=80=99! Tom Coradeschi tjcora@icloud.com > On Aug 21, 2021, at 2:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected pat= hs of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without powe= r, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. Shortly= after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-to= ols-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBP= EiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE)= which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to= be safe. It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard r= egulator. A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: >=20 > Low Pressure Regulator > Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG > Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) > Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >=20 > We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. I h= ad an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in cas= e I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator dire= ctly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks. T= he house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the w= ater heater: >=20 > Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. > Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. > Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR > Max Working Pressure: 150psi > Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR > Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR > Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >=20 > Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly t= o the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I tried it once w= ith the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any a= ppreciable power. I always meant to research this before I needed it, but l= ike many of us, never got around to it until now. >=20 > Thanks, > Jim >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arc= hive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjcora= @icloud.com >=20 --Apple-Mail-E1D26424-103C-4373-9F03-55DA667AC4D4 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jim: You should be good to go. Time=E2=80=99= s a wastin=E2=80=99!

    Tom Coradeschi
    tjcora@icloud.com

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 2:= 08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Isl= and, directly in one of the projected paths of Hurricane Henri.  We are= being told to plan for 7-10 days without power, although FWIW we were only p= owerless for 4 days following Sandy.  Shortly after Sandy I purchased a= n LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator= /?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0= MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, of course, I have never n= eeded, although I do run it periodically to be safe.  It is designed to= run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard regulator.  A little Goo= gling shows the following specs for the regulator:

    • Low Pressu= re Regulator
    • Inlet Pressure:         &= nbsp;     25-250PSIG
    • Outlet Pressure:   &n= bsp;        280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.)
    • Flo= w Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)

    We use Propane for DHW and heat and hav= e a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an outside gas line stubbed out w= hen the house was remodeled, just in case I ever needed it and I would like t= o be able to connect the generator directly to the house supply and avoid ha= ving to depend on the portable tanks.  The house supply is regulated an= d, as an example, here are the specs for the water heater:

    • Max Inlet Gas Pressure:    13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Recovery Rating:               206/Gallo= ns/HR
    • Max Working Pressure:     150psi
    • Max Output:                = ;       180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:   &= nbsp;                     &= nbsp;11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold Pressure:      = ;       3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input)

    Am I missing anything, or should I= be able to hook the generator directly to the house supply without the regu= lator?  For the record, I tried it once with the regulator attached and= it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any appreciable power.  I alw= ays meant to research this before I needed it, but like many of us, never go= t around to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Jim


    ____________________= ___________________________

    Shop-talk@autox= .team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    = Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http:/= /www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/optio= ns/shop-talk/tjcora@icloud.com

    = --Apple-Mail-E1D26424-103C-4373-9F03-55DA667AC4D4-- --===============7340043623260089645== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============7340043623260089645==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 13:20:27 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6020A0DD7 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:20:27 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qv1-f54.google.com (unknown [209.85.219.54]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55FB6A0D57 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:19:00 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-qv1-f54.google.com with SMTP id c14so7405606qvs.9 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:19:02 -0700 (PDT) h=from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc:to :references; bh=SnC/tZlSCtMCHr1ZnG0oKzoWl8XkIEPHLrdGwe7hpi0=; b=Z6K4fS9T6FGYJKik/iF8LdX4RkBktZrUvkDi0BL5lO6OJ/qt+vQpT9Rw1FbvFZtTcc S0vIASwWkNvwbNceb8N69FHccHiQZ0r8ZaZDBn+HDpVJC1EUx4rbDZszUSmT4gWCD8Dm UjRyxqaAG89EI9NYcHSOnVjra8uKA1RMrDy7sNhdA9dkva5f+YWChAv/uYKM0J5SgXfx kp+ymaUwhLWXiUo2ZJ0ZvZ0WPBT7mb2iihO3snC7AxT7UkZP0JdVePwZmt1xRwiPd5IC hiVobo1iNGy5Q16Ab7EI/idlGBSeAJyC6zvodOo9tK5rY6GvLW4+s10rLTBZP2m+ghgD H0Og== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date :in-reply-to:cc:to:references; bh=SnC/tZlSCtMCHr1ZnG0oKzoWl8XkIEPHLrdGwe7hpi0=; b=XQHzbxa+Ci1eGRDFgG4lepy7DeVMBIlPHIXNphC1ZPglTCgp1Qn3Fkw7qEZGV75Aqp QbrA+8HQiOyHWA9JnGyZ+SpRflgrmLWjGevLJhCSyOgsOw5/CxDVCKe0btN3Y1Nw4IR1 jdxVtDsymeFrX1GOjnj5Xu+CwNMbeF9MOyjvp4JvZ2ZLN8JTGBG2x329bj1c7UAGvYhO O7pMyF2QdhrSSz9H/TrEFc7skk4DuzNBfKc/LehlDmh+zER3wUnN8eKKQaW1OLC8mnWo z96+KNirgdzLFLFDrvB/zdx37lgHNZZFvqGPCNX1e6fz5/MnhURmSd3sMugeHyyznFVW ntrw== zGbm9yg7DeiRmNqVBtzwx7Y= w4mr25995515qvs.35.1629573541793; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:19:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from macbook-pro-2.lan (ool-4350ed26.dyn.optonline.net. [67.80.237.38]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id f124sm5403511qkj.85.2021.08.21.12.19.01 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:19:01 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 15:19:00 -0400 To: Thomas Coradeschi References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5762826260288052804== boundary="Apple-Mail=_43FA8FD5-A3C1-43F9-A842-48E5618C7405" --Apple-Mail=_43FA8FD5-A3C1-43F9-A842-48E5618C7405 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Thanks. The generator is currently sitting in a screened-in porch and, = as long as it is reasonably dry in there during the storm, I wiI run it = there off of the tanks at first and connect it to the house supply once = the rain stops. I think our hatches are sufficiently battened down. It = is helpful that this will hit during daylight hours. And, some really = tall, unhealthy trees have already been removed from our house and the = two adjacent properties, which is certainly good. =20 I assume I will know a heck of a lot more in 24 hours or so! > On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:04 PM, Thomas Coradeschi = wrote: >=20 > Jim: You should be good to go. Time=E2=80=99s a wastin=E2=80=99! >=20 > Tom Coradeschi > tjcora@icloud.com >=20 >> On Aug 21, 2021, at 2:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >>=20 >> =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the = projected paths of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 = days without power, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days = following Sandy. Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator = (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generat= or/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0= MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE = ) which, of course, I have never = needed, although I do run it periodically to be safe. It is designed to = run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard regulator. A little = Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: >>=20 >> Low Pressure Regulator >> Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG >> Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) >> Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >>=20 >> We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. = I had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, = just in case I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the = generator directly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the = portable tanks. The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here = are the specs for the water heater: >>=20 >> Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >> Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >> Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR >> Max Working Pressure: 150psi >> Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR >> Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR >> Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >>=20 >> Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator = directly to the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I = tried it once with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80= =99t put out any appreciable power. I always meant to research this = before I needed it, but like many of us, never got around to it until = now. >>=20 >> Thanks, >> Jim >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >>=20 >> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive >>=20 >> Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjcora@icloud.com >>=20 --Apple-Mail=_43FA8FD5-A3C1-43F9-A842-48E5618C7405 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Thanks.  The generator is currently sitting in a = screened-in porch and, as long as it is reasonably dry in = there during the storm, I wiI run it there off of the tanks at first and = connect it to the house supply once the rain stops.  I think our = hatches are sufficiently battened down.  It is helpful that this = will hit during daylight hours.  And, some really tall, unhealthy = trees have already been removed from our house and the two adjacent = properties, which is certainly good.  

    I assume I will know a heck of a lot = more in 24 hours or so!

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:04 PM, = Thomas Coradeschi <tjcora@icloud.com> wrote:

    Jim: You should be good to go. = Time=E2=80=99s a wastin=E2=80=99!

    Tom Coradeschi
    tjcora@icloud.com

    On Aug = 21, 2021, at 2:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long = Island, directly in one of the projected paths of Hurricane Henri. =  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without power, although = FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy.  Shortly = after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propa= ne-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO= 0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, of = course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to be = safe.  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a = standard regulator.  A little Googling shows the following specs = for the regulator:

  • Low Pressure Regulator
  • Inlet Pressure:             =   25-250PSIG
  • Outlet Pressure:     =        280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.)
  • Flow = Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)

    • We use Propane for DHW and heat = and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an outside gas line = stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case I ever needed it = and I would like to be able to connect the generator directly to the = house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.  The = house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the = water heater:

    • Max Inlet Gas = Pressure:    13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet = Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Recovery = Rating:               = 206/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure:     = 150psi
    • Max Output:           =             180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:               =            11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold Pressure:             = 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input)

    Am I missing anything, or should I be = able to hook the generator directly to the house supply without the = regulator?  For the record, I tried it once with the regulator = attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any appreciable = power.  I always meant to research this before I needed it, but = like many of us, never got around to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Jim


    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjcora@icloud.c= om


    = --Apple-Mail=_43FA8FD5-A3C1-43F9-A842-48E5618C7405-- --===============5762826260288052804== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============5762826260288052804==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 13:21:25 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D14E2A0DEA for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:21:25 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-io1-f54.google.com (unknown [209.85.166.54]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BECE4A0D57 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:19:05 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-io1-f54.google.com with SMTP id a15so16581026iot.2 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:19:07 -0700 (PDT) h=content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to :date:cc:message-id:references:to; bh=c20YZl47vu78F2X71n7PgssfDEE2itUzg87ij55MFOU=; b=TtXTqehnaB64kpG9HyIsKYovFgolej/HCCj17Ra3DHFPdi4g9N0A70ZYaOm1LMPJdk lixE0XY9Rl+xLViRUyMl3deWBvkE5H+Nwvi51ZyuzT9JzHZqJ7xCs42gsbE1bIWsaW6l YF+9Gf9spFFrocQ90PnumTesiFbRxAhxmoVF1oeHxpbfKgAaFteNnUxorF3EAlvSaZIv W2kvuZIAYbcndT2LwNNQ8zYEhNmoEoyDIQNs1vZ/Jdfo0n5GM4E1nwWE13L7TNsfBKnk WhCj9gWrqYf7EjEhFUmt6ewQkonL+BfsH1iCOouc4cW3lCpH57ETk9EJleX8wdezePOP dC+Q== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:subject :from:in-reply-to:date:cc:message-id:references:to; bh=c20YZl47vu78F2X71n7PgssfDEE2itUzg87ij55MFOU=; b=DDA4O1egCMyoBu9nI9OcWxy9YdLaVXFvr+tBJ7XhHIYa4VpjVuWljTNCc7/aHaUn9l oBPb+IyEc/oYdmdMea/WFVZDkdUk2YCgV3oANgFCnCLjBDVdDDC6Blobh056GqDKR82q rCLwrJQFw3Brqkh7nsY6LOyMzn439Vd5wAa6rKjIFKSRnxUG9ijb69CmhqNVsIRjSPT+ 5aulbMfmIQA02e7ongA7VQw1w9htPFo0U7UyvZwMTc8rKqWO0OZIq2t6/kY1t3Up51d6 byuWaXSxZ8Zp2uCU6pitOsE+Mf5XIKtMUdFgwKQo/LPzW7YGfhxy5FvtqYatcdc5KXdo KLeg== dqKGCwPWYLPxG/1dtoJO/6M= z5mr22893354jaj.3.1629573547381; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:19:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtpclient.apple ([73.94.200.107]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id q14sm5645852ilj.34.2021.08.21.12.19.06 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:19:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Phil Ethier Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 14:19:05 -0500 References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> To: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============0381535075044091281== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-17532F72-CE8B-4772-91C0-680403A26471 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable No. LP gas and household natural gas are different. You need to rejet produc= ts to change over.=20 Sent from my iPhone > On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:07 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected pat= hs of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without powe= r, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. Shortly= after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-to= ols-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBP= EiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE)= which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to= be safe. It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard r= egulator. A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: >=20 > Low Pressure Regulator > Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG > Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) > Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >=20 > We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. I h= ad an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in cas= e I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator dire= ctly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks. T= he house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the w= ater heater: >=20 > Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. > Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. > Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR > Max Working Pressure: 150psi > Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR > Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR > Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >=20 > Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly t= o the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I tried it once w= ith the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any a= ppreciable power. I always meant to research this before I needed it, but l= ike many of us, never got around to it until now. >=20 > Thanks, > Jim >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arc= hive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pethie= r7@gmail.com >=20 --Apple-Mail-17532F72-CE8B-4772-91C0-680403A26471 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable No. LP gas and household natural gas are di= fferent. You need to rejet products to change over. 

    Sent from my iPhone

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:07 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:=

    =EF=BB= =BF= I am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths of Hurri= cane Henri.  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without power, alt= hough FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy.  Shortly a= fter Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-400= 0-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54= VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, o= f course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to be safe.=  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard regul= ator.  A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator:
    • Low Pressure Regulator
    • Inlet Pressure: &n= bsp;             25-250PSIG
    • Outlet Pressure:            280mmH2O=3D (11"W= .C.)
    • Flow Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)
      • =

    We use Propa= ne for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an ou= tside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case I ever= needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator directly to t= he house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.  The h= ouse supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the wate= r heater:

    • Max Inlet Gas Pressure:    13.0 =E2= =80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80= =9CW.C.
    • Recovery Rating:         &nbs= p;     206/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure: &nb= sp;   150psi
    • Max Output:        =               180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:                 &= nbsp;        11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold P= ressure:             3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Ma= x Input)

    Am I m= issing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly to the h= ouse supply without the regulator?  For the record, I tried it once wit= h the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any ap= preciable power.  I always meant to research this before I needed it, b= ut like many of us, never got around to it until now.
    <= br class=3D"">
    Thanks,
    Jim


    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.tea= m.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.t= eam.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://= autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pethier7@gmail.com
    =
    = --Apple-Mail-17532F72-CE8B-4772-91C0-680403A26471-- --===============0381535075044091281== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============0381535075044091281==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 13:22:57 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F280A0DF6 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:22:57 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from st43p00im-zteg10061901.me.com (unknown [17.58.63.168]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 481E0A01EC for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:22:07 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1629573728; bh=w7AuOkRZgdpNbU1+Mnk7Jbxcs5v67oE1qxmIwoP4GLs=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=WDNLQU+Hs/BOGWNJxLtuSJ3Ok5t55bj/rC1+ouQVvvxyAceIMSoOZLnmgbsJBmPk3 67r0Hl+iylZebNjp/JajU3OfQ64BXEWj0BwmtQHBrq8bwAGT+3YU+oNzk3MZ3Fcp0I kDgFLV5+VtKDUzt2zfMHEsyqQd5/CbC42p+AS6eQmp2rXE7iLeggfK22xEhsnBbqy+ tzlsNTRSpUM/eIoMjVq+0LanntIXGw6H9oci6qzHaTYjBHplM9I/mRCJBORKSkaQw+ f/SuVH/eBN58N+Mt4NZFMcrqBl5mcL8RCQzFlgDZIm2B2u2cPhvLd5ed7epBHaAOaW /0ioFEGFYmSyw== Received: from smtpclient.apple (c-73-195-119-82.hsd1.nj.comcast.net [73.195.119.82]) by st43p00im-zteg10061901.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4F286860285; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 19:22:08 +0000 (UTC) From: Thomas Coradeschi Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 15:22:07 -0400 References: <670A53E0-C784-47B0-9A56-B4A5CA883728@gmail.com> To: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> definitions=2021-08-21_08:2021-08-20, 2021-08-21 signatures=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-2009150000 definitions=main-2108210121 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4510398928351358916== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-99C77E1D-F8D7-419D-B79D-A8EA39F2890D charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Probably preaching to the choir, but make sure any windows to that porch are= closed! Tom Coradeschi tjcora@icloud.com > On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:20 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFThanks. The generator is currently sitting in a screened-in porc= h and, as long as it is reasonably dry in there during the storm, I wiI run i= t there off of the tanks at first and connect it to the house supply once th= e rain stops. I think our hatches are sufficiently battened down. It is he= lpful that this will hit during daylight hours. And, some really tall, unhe= althy trees have already been removed from our house and the two adjacent pr= operties, which is certainly good. =20 >=20 > I assume I will know a heck of a lot more in 24 hours or so! >=20 >> On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:04 PM, Thomas Coradeschi wrote:= >>=20 >> Jim: You should be good to go. Time=E2=80=99s a wastin=E2=80=99! >>=20 >> Tom Coradeschi >> tjcora@icloud.com >>=20 >>>> On Aug 21, 2021, at 2:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>=20 >>> =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected p= aths of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without po= wer, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. Short= ly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-= tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBh= BPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_Bw= E) which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically t= o be safe. It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard r= egulator. A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: >>>=20 >>> Low Pressure Regulator >>> Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG >>> Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) >>> Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >>>=20 >>> We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. I= had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in c= ase I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator di= rectly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.= The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for t= he water heater: >>>=20 >>> Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >>> Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >>> Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR >>> Max Working Pressure: 150psi >>> Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR >>> Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR >>> Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >>>=20 >>> Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directl= y to the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I tried it onc= e with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out a= ny appreciable power. I always meant to research this before I needed it, b= ut like many of us, never got around to it until now. >>>=20 >>> Thanks, >>> Jim >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>>=20 >>> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/a= rchive >>>=20 >>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjco= ra@icloud.com >>>=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail-99C77E1D-F8D7-419D-B79D-A8EA39F2890D charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Probably preaching to the choir, but make s= ure any windows to that porch are closed!

    Tom Coradeschi
    tjcora@i= cloud.com

    O= n Aug 21, 2021, at 3:20 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:
    =EF=BB=BF= Tha= nks.  The generator is currently sitting in a screened-in porch and, as= long as it is reasonably dry in there during the storm, I wiI run= it there off of the tanks at first and connect it to the house supply once t= he rain stops.  I think our hatches are sufficiently battened down. &nb= sp;It is helpful that this will hit during daylight hours.  And, some r= eally tall, unhealthy trees have already been removed from our house and the= two adjacent properties, which is certainly good.  
    I assume I will know a heck of a lot more i= n 24 hours or so!

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:04 PM, Thomas Coradeschi &= lt;tjcora@icloud.com>= wrote:

    Jim: You should be good to go. Time=E2=80=99s a= wastin=E2=80=99!

    <= span style=3D"background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);" class=3D"">Tom Cora= deschi
    tjcora@icloud.com
    On Aug 21, 2021, at 2:08 P= M, Jim Stone <1789alpi= ne@gmail.com> wrote:

    =
    =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths of= Hurricane Henri.  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without powe= r, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy.  Sh= ortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen400= 0lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7= zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) w= hich, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to b= e safe.  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standar= d regulator.  A little Googling shows the following specs for the regul= ator:

    • Low Pressure Regulator
    • Inlet Press= ure:               25-250PSIG
    • Outlet Pressure:            280mmH2O=3D= (11"W.C.)
    • Flow Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr= )

    We use= Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had= an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case I= ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator directl= y to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks. &nbs= p;The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for t= he water heater:

    <= ul class=3D"MailOutline">
  • Max Inlet Gas Pressure:    = ;13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
  • Min Inlet Gas Pressure:    = 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
  • Recovery Rating:       &= nbsp;       206/Gallons/HR
  • Max Working Pre= ssure:     150psi
  • Max Output:     &nb= sp;                 180,000 BTU/HR
  • Max Input:              = ;            11,000 BTU/HR
  • = Manifold Pressure:             3.9 =E2=80=9CW.= C. (For Max Input)

    • Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly= to the house supply without the regulator?  For the record, I tried it= once with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put o= ut any appreciable power.  I always meant to research this before I nee= ded it, but like many of us, never got around to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Ji= m


    _______________________________________________

    <= a href=3D"mailto:Shop-talk@autox.team.net" class=3D"">Shop-talk@autox.team.n= et
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.htmlSuggested annual donation  $12.96<= br class=3D"">Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archiv= e

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/option= s/shop-talk/tjcora@icloud.com


    = --Apple-Mail-99C77E1D-F8D7-419D-B79D-A8EA39F2890D-- --===============4510398928351358916== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============4510398928351358916==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 13:24:13 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F6BDA0E0F for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:24:13 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from st43p00im-zteg10061901.me.com (unknown [17.58.63.168]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43B49A0D56 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:22:46 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1629573767; bh=2WpzSKwuKq3mqvurgKXX2pufT1OP+jQVLZiN662zNII=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=VFIgmoXBcJXgAW6ksHOPryNiW8qYn5WOA/AIOK/nlyI8CpcG2R1xSe5vYaIifEMS4 jZNGNBknfNGMk01fzUqKbv9IVz04bXR4IQKnRWel8umpY6JObGeGPKuK9rtr7bFyAa nWuI33ppaQQcu6iUydd6UBTiIfSftZSGm790mMQhU/G+FiLproGZZgg6GbPL1iHbFR xkUQKpfAw7AxaQTXxPasStWpg3hnGjQXfUcXE28JwpSG469n8jA7Q1AzUZJAHEdACI lR3tHdKdKBxJPN/xdwZl6a19YcmTl/AAjAAUejym7QBJrvWiWre35TeNiiQfrPAO2J Aq3YPe7OwyJuQ== Received: from smtpclient.apple (c-73-195-119-82.hsd1.nj.comcast.net [73.195.119.82]) by st43p00im-zteg10061901.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 66BD5860225; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 19:22:47 +0000 (UTC) From: Thomas Coradeschi Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 15:22:47 -0400 References: <4DCE368C-5DC1-4BDE-B9AB-912C429BF950@gmail.com> To: Phil Ethier definitions=2021-08-21_08:2021-08-20, 2021-08-21 signatures=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-2009150000 definitions=main-2108210121 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============0079416962625860467== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-033214AF-9FF9-4CA9-B438-FD4BBB3DB65D charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Phil - he has an LP generator and a 500 gallon LP tank. All good.=20 Tom Coradeschi tjcora@icloud.com > On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:21 PM, Phil Ethier wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFNo. LP gas and household natural gas are different. You need to r= ejet products to change over.=20 >=20 > Sent from my iPhone >=20 >>> On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:07 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >>>=20 >> =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected pa= ths of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without pow= er, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. Shortl= y after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-t= ools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhB= PEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE= ) which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically t= o be safe. It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard r= egulator. A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: >>=20 >> Low Pressure Regulator >> Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG >> Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) >> Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >>=20 >> We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. I= had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in c= ase I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator di= rectly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.= The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for t= he water heater: >>=20 >> Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >> Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >> Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR >> Max Working Pressure: 150psi >> Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR >> Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR >> Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >>=20 >> Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly= to the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I tried it once= with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out an= y appreciable power. I always meant to research this before I needed it, bu= t like many of us, never got around to it until now. >>=20 >> Thanks, >> Jim >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >>=20 >> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/ar= chive >>=20 >> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pethi= er7@gmail.com >>=20 > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arc= hive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjcora= @icloud.com >=20 --Apple-Mail-033214AF-9FF9-4CA9-B438-FD4BBB3DB65D charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Phil - he has an LP generator and a 500 gal= lon LP tank. All good. 

    Tom Coradeschi
    tjcora@icloud.com

    On Aug 21, 202= 1, at 3:21 PM, Phil Ethier <pethier7@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BFNo. LP gas and h= ousehold natural gas are different. You need to rejet products to change ove= r. 

    Sent from my iPhone
    <= br>
    On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:07 PM, Jim Stone <1789= alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of t= he projected paths of Hurricane Henri.  We are being told to plan for 7= -10 days without power, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days foll= owing Sandy.  Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/b= uffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjw= KCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54Tpho= C__4QAvD_BwE) which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run i= t periodically to be safe.  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and c= omes with a standard regulator.  A little Googling shows the following s= pecs for the regulator:

    =
    • Low Pressure Regulator
    • Inlet Pressure:               25-2= 50PSIG
    • Outlet Pressure:          = ;  280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.)
    • Flow Capacity(MAX):   &= nbsp;119000(BTU/hr)

    We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground t= ank.   I had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodel= ed, just in case I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the= generator directly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the po= rtable tanks.  The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here a= re the specs for the water heater:

    • Max Inlet Gas Pres= sure:    13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet Gas Press= ure:     8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Recovery Rating: &nb= sp;             206/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure:     150psi
    • Max Output:=                      = ; 180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:         &= nbsp;                11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold Pressure:           &nbs= p; 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input)

    Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook th= e generator directly to the house supply without the regulator?  For th= e record, I tried it once with the regulator attached and it barely ran and d= idn=E2=80=99t put out any appreciable power.  I always meant to researc= h this before I needed it, but like many of us, never got around to it until= now.

    Thanks,
    Jim


    ________________________________________= _______

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    = Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Suggested annu= al donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/piperm= ail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pethier= 7@gmail.com

    ____________= ___________________________________

    Shop-ta= lk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive= : http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailm= an/options/shop-talk/tjcora@icloud.com

    = --Apple-Mail-033214AF-9FF9-4CA9-B438-FD4BBB3DB65D-- --===============0079416962625860467== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============0079416962625860467==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 13:33:16 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FFD8A0E1E for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:33:16 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qk1-f174.google.com (unknown [209.85.222.174]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80A27A0E05 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:32:47 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-qk1-f174.google.com with SMTP id y144so14641840qkb.6 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:32:49 -0700 (PDT) h=from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc:to :references; bh=lPKJFrF0eWNf22ErUgU0MGNI7zF4AfUVrWATuokyVWk=; b=aXlyTJhDliJYsJfHQEpwpUlYtEIK+MihQzemLXCe/lzwy5ie3kNuvgyS6TQBHDDgTW Oe9w6WkXf83ksy7LDxv+F1uFzGvxdCCRt/C7oHNZn6JycAF0STcJeAutEg2ysq76E6wI OHKRxyXKrMAaomDEhHPTA0B9SgY7Nvd3zK4Rmb7PDHyaC++102nXEl9NH14bNzdSg4d4 Z/66KJ4XsTnctuOzCyQdQOldkcg9utHKUr2vEMtL7c/SegO8rUzoBcPUqHe0i2l95kG1 OEFPYSvK0AYH4CC/jylNfVCn49ZbQEDqz51N24S+3cOf+SZUuxOYVkNq0gqT+PwS8Qon r7Tg== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date :in-reply-to:cc:to:references; bh=lPKJFrF0eWNf22ErUgU0MGNI7zF4AfUVrWATuokyVWk=; b=D8qdjAO7nTBQZKJGmZA4oihhz8c6TcHLXaU9YI9PnO8TkMqyFVAWsMIzKQkKwe+Saj DdkLan81pQks2BrMz5OKmRyRGzVBgebe5iraLJv5+3pJHoV1rPvRxxrH/o9UZfzhbcWs O28KelEw6/84XhdIkM1RwOxD9aH+Uxt8Dc9E0jeLEoYQmwQHgfRZWoHfcY+uCLNk1bxF c/c+Jj+t8NepFQrFrh4hHtsED23iVSfIk+gCdMkyRdX6QuGR2GrE0iVqhBr90+7W4xcg u0UtJFY74JEZ3WafrmF2JxpHT5mXJjg+eVg5btQOdyTPWDGx9GA3YlQvMJx7rH6aajA5 iyxA== kzKh4eThG91rJE6sunYCrVs= Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:32:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from macbook-pro-2.lan (ool-4350ed26.dyn.optonline.net. [67.80.237.38]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id c10sm4297081qtb.20.2021.08.21.12.32.47 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:32:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 15:32:46 -0400 To: Thomas Coradeschi References: <4DCE368C-5DC1-4BDE-B9AB-912C429BF950@gmail.com> <725FDE02-1223-4EDD-9D82-383176EB6615@icloud.com> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8581760896653379456== boundary="Apple-Mail=_A1E37722-FE50-4CB6-AABA-F01D8DC38634" --Apple-Mail=_A1E37722-FE50-4CB6-AABA-F01D8DC38634 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 On the other hand, my daughter just sent me the following screenshot. = Note the red circled =E2=80=9Cus=E2=80=9D. The project path line is = about 1.25 miles away. =F0=9F=98=A7 > On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:22 PM, Thomas Coradeschi = wrote: >=20 > Phil - he has an LP generator and a 500 gallon LP tank. All good.=20 >=20 > Tom Coradeschi > tjcora@icloud.com >=20 >> On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:21 PM, Phil Ethier wrote: >>=20 >> =EF=BB=BFNo. LP gas and household natural gas are different. You need = to rejet products to change over.=20 >>=20 >> Sent from my iPhone >>=20 >>> On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:07 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >>>=20 >>> =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the = projected paths of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 = days without power, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days = following Sandy. Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator = (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generat= or/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0= MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE = ) which, of course, I have never = needed, although I do run it periodically to be safe. It is designed to = run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard regulator. A little = Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: >>>=20 >>> Low Pressure Regulator >>> Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG >>> Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) >>> Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >>>=20 >>> We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground = tank. I had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was = remodeled, just in case I ever needed it and I would like to be able to = connect the generator directly to the house supply and avoid having to = depend on the portable tanks. The house supply is regulated and, as an = example, here are the specs for the water heater: >>>=20 >>> Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >>> Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >>> Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR >>> Max Working Pressure: 150psi >>> Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR >>> Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR >>> Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >>>=20 >>> Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator = directly to the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I = tried it once with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80= =99t put out any appreciable power. I always meant to research this = before I needed it, but like many of us, never got around to it until = now. >>>=20 >>> Thanks, >>> Jim >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>>=20 >>> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive >>>=20 >>> Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pethier7@gmail.com >>>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >>=20 >> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive >>=20 >> Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjcora@icloud.com >>=20 --Apple-Mail=_A1E37722-FE50-4CB6-AABA-F01D8DC38634 type="text/html"; boundary="Apple-Mail=_E4A5CD58-E316-4B8D-96C9-6B633555E2D6" --Apple-Mail=_E4A5CD58-E316-4B8D-96C9-6B633555E2D6 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 On = the other hand, my daughter just sent me the following screenshot. =  Note the red circled =E2=80=9Cus=E2=80=9D.  The project path = line is about 1.25 miles away.  =F0=9F=98=A7



    On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:22 PM, Thomas Coradeschi <tjcora@icloud.com> = wrote:

    Phil - he has an LP generator = and a 500 gallon LP tank. All good. 

    Tom Coradeschi
    tjcora@icloud.com

    On Aug = 21, 2021, at 3:21 PM, Phil Ethier <pethier7@gmail.com> = wrote:

    =EF=BB=BFNo. LP gas and household natural gas are different. You need = to rejet products to change over. 

    Sent from my iPhone

    On Aug = 21, 2021, at 1:07 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long = Island, directly in one of the projected paths of Hurricane Henri. =  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without power, although = FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy.  Shortly = after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propa= ne-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO= 0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, of = course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to be = safe.  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a = standard regulator.  A little Googling shows the following specs = for the regulator:

  • Low Pressure Regulator
  • Inlet Pressure:             =   25-250PSIG
  • Outlet Pressure:     =        280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.)
  • Flow = Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)

    • We use Propane for DHW and heat = and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an outside gas line = stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case I ever needed it = and I would like to be able to connect the generator directly to the = house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.  The = house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the = water heater:

    • Max Inlet Gas = Pressure:    13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet = Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Recovery = Rating:               = 206/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure:     = 150psi
    • Max Output:           =             180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:               =            11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold Pressure:             = 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input)

    Am I missing anything, or should I be = able to hook the generator directly to the house supply without the = regulator?  For the record, I tried it once with the regulator = attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any appreciable = power.  I always meant to research this before I needed it, but = like many of us, never got around to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Jim


    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pethier7@gmail.= com

    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
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13:35:04 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from st43p00im-zteg10073501.me.com (unknown [17.58.63.180]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50828A0E12 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:34:35 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1629574476; bh=pW9n5mR8kNHX7uI+B0lntQrmB6BT/xrpMUdnEjjgn3E=; h=Content-Type:Mime-Version:Subject:From:Date:Message-Id:To; b=e/tBJJJunHiw+BKQ8iSkmj9So5UlaaaPbOiX4lmdNP+5QqRGy1G1COIJd/sNxHl/u WuxCfkGGN77temTbuwXurjCwNAOOdmACOKoDVrXRw9iAI9wprnRh0ExFuz7zbTaua1 jeTx5jBWb2MQBqDFe99ckrV+wstzgGhm+txJeZ3GJr4v9Zain0jGpvj5ppuLJjwu7E GSXxu+zRpXqjeQ6qiAuX9CG9RLJsHHjjZX4+r/beB0BQtyd8CgbplmzN8jbJspoIFZ iijGRoipjMHmAjHcg5PFN020vw0BYTWzMC13k881JprhuHwM/IF0X0Ld753WtLASfc p+J35JHkaAU6w== Received: from [10.0.1.55] (c-73-195-119-82.hsd1.nj.comcast.net [73.195.119.82]) by st43p00im-zteg10073501.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 5A7BCAE03D2; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 19:34:36 +0000 (UTC) From: Thomas Coradeschi Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 15:34:35 -0400 References: 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ESMTPSA id l19sm5577479ilk.26.2021.08.21.12.41.54 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 21 Aug 2021 12:41:54 -0700 (PDT) From: David Scheidt Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 14:41:51 -0500 References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> To: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8847722493802144057== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-41D315FC-CA9B-4BB5-8AE6-233E3F63CC62 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable You need a low pressure regulator. Input is 10 to 15ish inches of water. Ou= tput is 10 inches water.=20 Steal the one from your furnace, if you need to.=20 > On Aug 21, 2021, at 13:08, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected pat= hs of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without powe= r, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. Shortly= after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-to= ols-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBP= EiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE)= which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to= be safe. It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard r= egulator. A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: >=20 > Low Pressure Regulator > Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG > Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) > Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >=20 > We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. I h= ad an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in cas= e I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator dire= ctly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks. T= he house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the w= ater heater: >=20 > Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. > Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. > Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR > Max Working Pressure: 150psi > Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR > Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR > Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >=20 > Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly t= o the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I tried it once w= ith the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any a= ppreciable power. I always meant to research this before I needed it, but l= ike many of us, never got around to it until now. >=20 > Thanks, > Jim >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arc= hive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dmsche= idt@gmail.com >=20 --Apple-Mail-41D315FC-CA9B-4BB5-8AE6-233E3F63CC62 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    You need a low pressure regulator. Input is 10 to 15ish inches of water. &n= bsp;Output is 10 inches water. 
    Steal the one fro= m your furnace, if you need to. 


    On Aug 21, 2021, at 13:08, Jim Ston= e <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in= one of the projected paths of Hurricane Henri.  We are being told to p= lan for 7-10 days without power, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 d= ays following Sandy.  Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (= https://www.jbt= ools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&g= clid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0s= QxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, of course, I have never needed, although I= do run it periodically to be safe.  It is designed to run off of LP ta= nks and comes with a standard regulator.  A little Googling shows the f= ollowing specs for the regulator:

    • Low Pressure Regulator
    • Inlet Pressure:             &= nbsp; 25-250PSIG
    • Outlet Pressure:       &n= bsp;    280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.)
    • Flow Capacity(MAX= ):    119000(BTU/hr)

    We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon= in-ground tank.   I had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house= was remodeled, just in case I ever needed it and I would like to be able to= connect the generator directly to the house supply and avoid having to depe= nd on the portable tanks.  The house supply is regulated and, as an exa= mple, here are the specs for the water heater:

    • Max In= let Gas Pressure:    13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inl= et Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Recovery= Rating:               206/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure:     150psi
    • Max Output:                  =     180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:     &n= bsp;                    11= ,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold Pressure:        = ;     3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input)
    <= br class=3D"">
    Am I missing anything, or should I be ab= le to hook the generator directly to the house supply without the regulator?=  For the record, I tried it once with the regulator attached and it ba= rely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any appreciable power.  I always me= ant to research this before I needed it, but like many of us, never got arou= nd to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Jim


    __________________________= _____________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.= net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    = eam.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/sho= p-talk/dmscheidt@gmail.com

    = --Apple-Mail-41D315FC-CA9B-4BB5-8AE6-233E3F63CC62-- --===============8847722493802144057== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8847722493802144057==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 13:49:04 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26F28A0E3E for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:49:04 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ms11p00im-qufo17282101.me.com (unknown [17.58.38.58]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F857A07D2 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:46:51 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1629575212; bh=juqu9+gfI3Z1+eNqSd1n/g6FlifQ045rC+BNG9iZPyI=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=yxECHEpSaVXqgzVZ6+21wg/qwAt6WTMuEhDW1EHIEbIlXBg59GVEiF1LmHC7eC0dn 5kE4i+OgR+n1H+6AxU+vTew08WRl1lA2/f5aJf1TBbScw2rY55VBQrk24D52B/ie4l siQXZs6q6XIMZUFnfr3JYuRk38j21X4x1eaz0cketeCqE++ocgXRFHklT+C2q5eY/U YRO3TLMU75NgAOZbJZcu0IF4X45PG4kDobpKYlFdIn12IAHxfJ57FZi/nLjmYM7T3D AkgEkPTaRKXKc65Bre9qOucxLGXUOK7/Zrs18+1nJHzTq5hX2dwEzUZASk6EbXr3Ns fie1wdP5a/T0g== Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by ms11p00im-qufo17282101.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 97CB07802B6; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 19:46:52 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 14:46:51 -0500 References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> To: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> =?UTF-8?Q?2903e8d5c8f:6.0.391,18.0.790,17.0.607.475.0000000_definitions?= =?UTF-8?Q?=3D2021-08-21=5F08:2021-08-20=5F02,2021-08-21=5F08,2020-04-07?= =?UTF-8?Q?=5F01_signatures=3D0?= spamscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 suspectscore=0 clxscore=1015 malwarescore=0 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2108210123 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5139344982350372128== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-F948A1DC-F61B-4F1D-AA19-D8A1A6DB69CC charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Silly question. Did you talk to the folks that installed the generator? Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths= of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without power,= although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. Shortly a= fter Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tool= s-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEi= wAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) w= hich, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to b= e safe. It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard reg= ulator. A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: Low Pressure Regulator Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. I ha= d an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case= I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator direc= tly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks. T= he house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the w= ater heater: Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR Max Working Pressure: 150psi Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly to= the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I tried it once wi= th the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any a= ppreciable power. I always meant to research this before I needed it, but l= ike many of us, never got around to it until now. Thanks, Jim _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com --Apple-Mail-F948A1DC-F61B-4F1D-AA19-D8A1A6DB69CC charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Silly question. Did you talk to the folks t= hat installed the generator?

    Peace,
    Pat

    =
    Pat Horne 
    We support Habitat for Humanity


    On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Sto= ne <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BF= I a= m on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths of Hurrican= e Henri.  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without power, althou= gh FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy.  Shortly aft= er Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-= watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH= 4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, of c= ourse, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to be safe. &n= bsp;It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard regulato= r.  A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator:

      Low Pressure Regulator
    • Inlet Pressure:  =             25-250PSIG
    • Out= let Pressure:            280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.)=
    • Flow Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)

    We use Propane f= or DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an outsid= e gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case I ever nee= ded it and I would like to be able to connect the generator directly to the h= ouse supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.  The hous= e supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the water h= eater:

    • Max Inlet Gas Pressure:    13.0 =E2=80= =9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80=9C= W.C.
    • Recovery Rating:           &= nbsp;   206/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure:   &= nbsp; 150psi
    • Max Output:         &nbs= p;             180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:                  =        11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold Pressu= re:             3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Inp= ut)

    Am I missi= ng anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly to the house= supply without the regulator?  For the record, I tried it once with th= e regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any apprec= iable power.  I always meant to research this before I needed it, but l= ike many of us, never got around to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Jim


    _______________________________________________
    <= br>Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.ne= t/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96<= br>Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.= net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://auto= x.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@icloud.com
    <= /span>
    = --Apple-Mail-F948A1DC-F61B-4F1D-AA19-D8A1A6DB69CC-- --===============5139344982350372128== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============5139344982350372128==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 14:29:01 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1379A0E54 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 14:29:00 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qt1-f173.google.com (unknown [209.85.160.173]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41855A0C81 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 14:28:30 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-qt1-f173.google.com with SMTP id b1so10524163qtx.0 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:28:32 -0700 (PDT) h=from:mime-version:subject:date:references:to:in-reply-to:message-id; bh=ItsJr2MhmawoDdTlUZgKxe4lAhiMEsr5NyD7tQCH6wY=; b=dWtxtxxgoA/uIAtMHYq14GCz5DOaVth31PuYRKCN7SlfEifinyD5CqqYgVLF570BSy uIcTQz3r32koesBEaKeHx0bXgW4ifwqPrFLI16sIgEbK3MTGTe3eZeL9yjsNpD2k3ILr rf2GVX16cYGywwTFON8Hppsqk5BMNpgsqMav0sZziOlsiKXtI8tqAHfGGLXk2yBXO89l DvR9MIWGWGd/Yz32YrpsG2f+wPmxeidwgIswQ6ElNBbpzwUt/EfvYsjbza61Tk3JiGEM aAi4cMEwcRcZbLcr0QiDgX/ZNYnqcgN+3m5FQun3a+bvimCOyqAEEDCR5UZbXj56/Ymg C06w== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:mime-version:subject:date:references:to :in-reply-to:message-id; bh=ItsJr2MhmawoDdTlUZgKxe4lAhiMEsr5NyD7tQCH6wY=; b=ixmd1fGAJX6R4OJMS1mcVwn+OJY0g6RlzQy5qQHYdI86KV4f8S1BTlpckqS6pPcQsO zkLoIHc3nVgaaor7ZvJgg/vapScgi8EuzS/IBGapgHg44g2DZ+VRLGVV6yBBOxwDZ1kY 0+MATdMU4KYahK1hRoOGzbWUnR8RkbCOo3iQTHWWXs1gp6++sGN/2YgrcxAVgKOxRwKQ CHWdJ/zno8BXkFYbuCJM6uvEIPOFHesJyGhKOxe3KJ0xsstD4ePGfqxRjt529n2CwKxu MlQAmI2HsfIMvadL0jhZewh1UXxSWOLJ3n/3qEytBbeiZe8Ou7A02WxjBVCVlz/PlRIh 4cLA== wdrgo35e2pS59Aes2u/B4pVwN3YXjx196g== z9mr23285127qtw.67.1629577711464; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:28:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from macbook-pro-2.lan (ool-4350ed26.dyn.optonline.net. [67.80.237.38]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id j2sm4417992qtn.46.2021.08.21.13.28.30 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:28:31 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 16:28:30 -0400 References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4386573776634348808== boundary="Apple-Mail=_47969CE6-D5A4-4B95-B285-11B3E8F53EEE" --Apple-Mail=_47969CE6-D5A4-4B95-B285-11B3E8F53EEE Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 =46rom David: > You need a low pressure regulator. Input is 10 to 15ish inches of = water. Output is 10 inches water.=20 Steal the one from your furnace, if you need to. There is a regulator between the tank and the house, so it comes in = before the line to the outside. It is hard to read the regulator, as it = is under the porch, which is why I gave the stats for the water heater.=20= =46rom Pat: > Silly question. Did you talk to the folks that installed the = generator? Not silly, but it isn=E2=80=99t a permanent whole house generator. = I=E2=80=99ve thought about installing one, and certainly will if weather = patterns change enough that we are dealing with this more often, but the = price didn=E2=80=99t seem justified given the amount of use that it = would get. As I said, I have had this one for about 8 years and never = had to use it. My main worry has always been an extended outage in the = winter, but we don=E2=80=99t need much amperage with propane heat for = the furnaces. (Separate heat in the shop. Hey! Shop content!). I = haven=E2=80=99t done the exact math, but believe that 4000 Surge = Watts/3250 Running Watts will be enough to keep things going here for as = long as it takes=E2=80=A6as long as I can run off of the in-ground tank. > On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:46 PM, Pat Horne wrote: >=20 > Silly question. Did you talk to the folks that installed the = generator? >=20 > Peace, > Pat >=20 > Pat Horne=20 > We support Habitat for Humanity >=20 >=20 > On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected = paths of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days = without power, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following = Sandy. Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator = (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generat= or/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0= MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE = ) which, of course, I have never = needed, although I do run it periodically to be safe. It is designed to = run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard regulator. A little = Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: >=20 > Low Pressure Regulator > Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG > Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) > Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >=20 > We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. = I had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, = just in case I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the = generator directly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the = portable tanks. The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here = are the specs for the water heater: >=20 > Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. > Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. > Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR > Max Working Pressure: 150psi > Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR > Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR > Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >=20 > Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator = directly to the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I = tried it once with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80= =99t put out any appreciable power. I always meant to research this = before I needed it, but like many of us, never got around to it until = now. >=20 > Thanks, > Jim >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@icloud.com >=20 --Apple-Mail=_47969CE6-D5A4-4B95-B285-11B3E8F53EEE Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 =46ro= m David:

    You need a low pressure regulator. Input is 10 = to 15ish inches of water.  Output is 10 inches = water. 
    Steal the one from = your furnace, if you need to.

    There is a regulator between the tank and the house, so it = comes in before the line to the outside.  It is hard to read the = regulator, as it is under the porch, which is why I gave the stats for = the water heater. 

    =46rom Pat:

    Silly question. Did you talk to the folks that installed the = generator?

    Not = silly, but it isn=E2=80=99t a permanent whole house generator. =  I=E2=80=99ve thought about installing one, and certainly will if = weather patterns change enough that we are dealing with this more often, = but the price didn=E2=80=99t seem justified given the amount of use that = it would get.  As I said, I have had this one for about 8 years and = never had to use it.  My main worry has always been an extended = outage in the winter, but we don=E2=80=99t need much amperage with = propane heat for the furnaces. (Separate heat in the shop.  Hey! =  Shop content!).  I haven=E2=80=99t done the exact math, but = believe that 4000 Surge Watts/3250 Running Watts will be enough to = keep things going here for as long as it takes=E2=80=A6as long as I can = run off of the in-ground tank.

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:46 PM, = Pat Horne <patintexas@icloud.com> wrote:

    Silly question. Did you talk to = the folks that installed the generator?

    Peace,
    Pat

    Pat = Horne 
    We support Habitat for Humanity


    On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected = paths of Hurricane Henri.  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days = without power, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following = Sandy.  Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propa= ne-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO= 0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, of = course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to be = safe.  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a = standard regulator.  A little Googling shows the following specs = for the regulator:

  • Low Pressure Regulator
  • Inlet Pressure:             =   25-250PSIG
  • Outlet Pressure:     =        280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.)
  • Flow = Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)

    • We use Propane for DHW and heat = and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an outside gas line = stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case I ever needed it = and I would like to be able to connect the generator directly to the = house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.  The = house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the = water heater:

    • Max Inlet Gas = Pressure:    13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet = Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Recovery = Rating:               = 206/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure:     = 150psi
    • Max Output:           =             180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:               =            11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold Pressure:             = 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input)

    Am I missing anything, or should I be = able to hook the generator directly to the house supply without the = regulator?  For the record, I tried it once with the regulator = attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any appreciable = power.  I always meant to research this before I needed it, but = like many of us, never got around to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Jim


    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
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    = --Apple-Mail=_47969CE6-D5A4-4B95-B285-11B3E8F53EEE-- --===============4386573776634348808== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============4386573776634348808==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 14:43:51 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54CE0A0DF9 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 14:43:51 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-po-12v.sys.comcast.net (unknown [96.114.154.171]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFED4A0DF9 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 14:43:32 -0600 (MDT) Received: from resomta-po-13v.sys.comcast.net ([96.114.154.237]) by resqmta-po-12v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTP id HXbxmRR0dfSZqHXq2m8jLL; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 20:43:34 +0000 d=comcastmailservice.net; s=20180828_2048; t=1629578614; bh=CIcjU81vAssgTYuU1LLTHf/nml1saGsabM2R7aqfSzU=; h=Received:Received:Subject:To:Reply-To:From:Message-ID:Date: MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=SsQA/8zMbqLvFNLgnuikEj/jbjWu00GuTc6jTDgsIes5wjX0YKOeSFlU0gpaS0pCp rzOwFJqGEQnmkVzL4/crlStTj8GDPp0/ml+Cn41+KqBHdc7oAf4tMf3rbUq1mZul7e azbrhL+kUtdBNZWX5fyzCt5j9xsF/+3p7W061pPRcnGshdpjCq0lkatwIpNiDyRkG+ rbkngcXhS24vnBAwqAr4YxnS7uNUkkq/wdXatD4nwyvL6xrLQUa9nc738BWN548erd 37XYSwXSPnckk8Z6399v6SsnTy9NfMBCSPHg9XdITeDdd5yFRMEJeka2BUBCVJyDUl OtueSlIFaqHPg== Received: from [IPv6:2601:645:380:4500:1da9:6053:68ca:d39] ([IPv6:2601:645:380:4500:1da9:6053:68ca:d39]) by resomta-po-13v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTPSA id HXq1mIQewQdRwHXq1mUQES; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 20:43:34 +0000 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: From: Mark Miller Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 13:43:32 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.13.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: 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from st43p00im-zteg10062001.me.com (unknown [17.58.63.166]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E813A0E42 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 15:15:23 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1629580524; bh=i2uPG/H5Wt6G94A6zWzmdiH++wh2fybggvP7AmJeQCU=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=A6PU5Cublv9nFrtc0BVWywe2Y39Vb0DpaqFAx+Or7bMZod7Zu4se/iD3SWztJ55jU LbwOGTpUx3DE+T01PT6BCGqmnDH/wuMUgy5MPyF0Au3OqB+xdziZlajwDzzVOWMUBm QBnHskv1IpHKcN+3pjz8mnw1cr8rSky0Q7jC5+ZfXQdKHtv0BauKUH1S8X4JILtRiX xB/ObBb0KM20x0QGm4BjFUwbPA5QXoOUg5uAbiK7KoWV+tpHHPLdPisO67tq3AzuCe HjSdWsYhSux6iKxN/MSolfR5mw63zL8b1THg6/a6A6m+otiFbz4coWHEwlKZpw5Zzw P+QjSXI0+lNig== Received: from smtpclient.apple (c-73-195-119-82.hsd1.nj.comcast.net [73.195.119.82]) by st43p00im-zteg10062001.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 6451E6C03F6; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 21:15:24 +0000 (UTC) From: Thomas Coradeschi Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 17:15:23 -0400 References: To: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> definitions=2021-08-21_09:2021-08-20, 2021-08-21 signatures=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-2009150000 definitions=main-2108210134 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============0400843202522576858== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-3711F390-C01A-4181-90EF-460E975B710A charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable You=E2=80=99ll be good with what you have. I have a 3 kW Honda on a 10 circu= it transfer switch, feeding a 2600 ft2 house. We can=E2=80=99t run the the b= ig power hogs - A/C or electric oven - but other than that, we are good. We r= un some lighting, internet/computer/TV, NG powered heat, HW, cooktop, dryer= and grill, etc. Its an inverter based system and it rarely runs much above i= dle unless heat, both fridges, freezer and coffee maker are all calling for p= ower at the same time. Tom Coradeschi tjcora@icloud.com > On Aug 21, 2021, at 4:29 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BF=46rom David: >=20 >> You need a low pressure regulator. Input is 10 to 15ish inches of water. = Output is 10 inches water.=20 > Steal the one from your furnace, if you need to. >=20 > There is a regulator between the tank and the house, so it comes in before= the line to the outside. It is hard to read the regulator, as it is under t= he porch, which is why I gave the stats for the water heater.=20 >=20 > =46rom Pat: >=20 >> Silly question. Did you talk to the folks that installed the generator? >=20 >=20 > Not silly, but it isn=E2=80=99t a permanent whole house generator. I=E2=80= =99ve thought about installing one, and certainly will if weather patterns c= hange enough that we are dealing with this more often, but the price didn=E2= =80=99t seem justified given the amount of use that it would get. As I said= , I have had this one for about 8 years and never had to use it. My main wo= rry has always been an extended outage in the winter, but we don=E2=80=99t n= eed much amperage with propane heat for the furnaces. (Separate heat in the s= hop. Hey! Shop content!). I haven=E2=80=99t done the exact math, but beli= eve that 4000 Surge Watts/3250 Running Watts will be enough to keep things g= oing here for as long as it takes=E2=80=A6as long as I can run off of the in= -ground tank. >=20 >> On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:46 PM, Pat Horne wrote: >>=20 >> Silly question. Did you talk to the folks that installed the generator? >>=20 >> Peace, >> Pat >>=20 >> Pat Horne=20 >> We support Habitat for Humanity >>=20 >>=20 >> On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >>=20 >> =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected pa= ths of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without pow= er, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. Shortl= y after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-t= ools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhB= PEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE= ) which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically t= o be safe. It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard r= egulator. A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: >>=20 >> Low Pressure Regulator >> Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG >> Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) >> Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >>=20 >> We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. I= had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in c= ase I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator di= rectly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.= The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for t= he water heater: >>=20 >> Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >> Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >> Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR >> Max Working Pressure: 150psi >> Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR >> Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR >> Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >>=20 >> Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly= to the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I tried it once= with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out an= y appreciable power. I always meant to research this before I needed it, bu= t like many of us, never got around to it until now. >>=20 >> Thanks, >> Jim >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >>=20 >> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/ar= chive >>=20 >> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patin= texas@icloud.com >>=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arc= hive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjcora= @icloud.com >=20 --Apple-Mail-3711F390-C01A-4181-90EF-460E975B710A charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable You=E2=80=99ll be good with what you have. I= have a 3 kW Honda on a 10 circuit transfer switch, feeding a 2600 ft2 house= . We can=E2=80=99t run the the big power hogs - A/C or electric oven - but o= ther than that, we are good. We run some lighting, internet/computer/TV, NG p= owered  heat, HW, cooktop, dryer and grill, etc. Its an inverter based s= ystem and it rarely runs much above idle unless heat, both fridges, freezer a= nd coffee maker are all calling for power at the same time.

    Tom Coradesc= hi
    tjcora@icloud.com

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 4:29 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.c= om> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BF=46rom David:

    You need a low pressure regulator. Input is 10 to 15ish in= ches of water.  Output is 10 inches water. 
    Steal the one from your furnace, if you need to.    <= /div>

    There is a regulator between the tank and the h= ouse, so it comes in before the line to the outside.  It is hard to rea= d the regulator, as it is under the porch, which is why I gave the stats for= the water heater. 

    =46rom Pat:

    Silly que= stion. Did you talk to the folks that installed the generator?

    Not silly, but it isn=E2=80=99t a perman= ent whole house generator.  I=E2=80=99ve thought about installing one, a= nd certainly will if weather patterns change enough that we are dealing with= this more often, but the price didn=E2=80=99t seem justified given the amou= nt of use that it would get.  As I said, I have had this one for about 8= years and never had to use it.  My main worry has always been an exten= ded outage in the winter, but we don=E2=80=99t need much amperage with propa= ne heat for the furnaces. (Separate heat in the shop.  Hey!  Shop c= ontent!).  I haven=E2=80=99t done the exact math, but believe that = ;4000 Surge Watts/3250 Running Watts will be enough to keep things going her= e for as long as it takes=E2=80=A6as long as I can run off of the in-ground t= ank.

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:46 PM, Pat Horne <patintexas@icloud.com> wrote:

    Silly question. Did you talk to the folks that installed the genera= tor?

    Peace,
    Pat

    Pat Ho= rne 
    We support Habitat for Humanity


    On A= ug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long I= sland, directly in one of the projected paths of Hurricane Henri.  We a= re being told to plan for 7-10 days without power, although FWIW we were onl= y powerless for 4 days following Sandy.  Shortly after Sandy I purchase= d an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generat= or/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-= t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, of course, I have never= needed, although I do run it periodically to be safe.  It is designed t= o run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard regulator.  A little Go= ogling shows the following specs for the regulator:

    • Low Pre= ssure Regulator
    • Inlet Pressure:       &nbs= p;       25-250PSIG
    • Outlet Pressure:  = ;          280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.)
    • Flow Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)
    We use Propane for DHW and heat and= have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an outside gas line stubbed o= ut when the house was remodeled, just in case I ever needed it and I would l= ike to be able to connect the generator directly to the house supply and avo= id having to depend on the portable tanks.  The house supply is regulat= ed and, as an example, here are the specs for the water heater:

    • Max Inlet Gas Pressure:    13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Recovery Rating:               20= 6/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure:     150psi
    • Max Output:             &nbs= p;         180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input: &= nbsp;                     &= nbsp;  11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold Pressure:    = ;         3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input)

    Am I missing anything, or s= hould I be able to hook the generator directly to the house supply without t= he regulator?  For the record, I tried it once with the regulator attac= hed and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any appreciable power. &nbs= p;I always meant to research this before I needed it, but like many of us, n= ever got around to it until now.

    <= div class=3D"">Thanks,
    Jim


    __= _____________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    = Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: ht= tp://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@ic= loud.com


    _________= ______________________________________

    Shop= -talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html=
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Arch= ive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/ma= ilman/options/shop-talk/tjcora@icloud.com

    <= /blockquote>= --Apple-Mail-3711F390-C01A-4181-90EF-460E975B710A-- --===============0400843202522576858== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============0400843202522576858==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 20:41:25 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0919A0EAA for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 20:41:25 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qt1-f174.google.com (unknown [209.85.160.174]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4143A0DDE for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 20:41:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-qt1-f174.google.com with SMTP id u21so7936293qtw.8 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 19:41:06 -0700 (PDT) h=content-transfer-encoding:from:mime-version:subject:date:message-id :references:cc:in-reply-to:to; bh=31uW2mE5b5vvIJJ/XA1d+jw+7YmC1J0Z5f7oHZq6+MA=; b=ADb/iCSgVrbeoH8fn1su8Oo/JbG19ZCEEwaVh5Bqrnh5nYBj/raJb6ua4o7g8UX/IM d+hFRw0hLbP0HQhbPvo4rMw5DljsEOCZNSb37cWomVFWK45uMN2NeqmbvXjOCWWTJw51 OKfB/M3jztdNtiCh0IXOfMCmX+fGs+LMe4NjYuUvfsaEZ6KRWMFV8xFQL5c7fkjDrBwP vxdqnWAlyHYr1j2I1+Hy5hcD5g1LUcbMyoRIWHnZGNHrb/C+y5BOtMvpJnYdC73z3sqt r4VtZtc32QIyMCsdqqoTysrK5jJSKecztgvbxJMnrdr4u8VErOpW8EzxZDKZ6GRWAU7a eruw== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:content-transfer-encoding:from:mime-version :subject:date:message-id:references:cc:in-reply-to:to; bh=31uW2mE5b5vvIJJ/XA1d+jw+7YmC1J0Z5f7oHZq6+MA=; b=DXamZesbrpw4WPzdBKj2HNEu3aZ+JelaCuwCIKhupIoCNjySDzSTZc9KIUjR0PxZxr AOmWncb+/H0s+dljdL2wRKPR72xcSjRvuYvxV8UozYKD7t6bWDCxmGACfwB/3s1H1cRQ O6iiFCeAMMDwYGp+s4ln/tYjbNZJrmS0jAVI5dpgrEtar5fFE8x8FCOxRO+WgYnQoCiv jaWa7C9BWRxgVkoTYM9FcsI+fJOEk7ZfvYoMhJNWIyox9VBbaWSC5qKmNm8BoyMDzCdu N5lCyTcl3XKW/fB2+TVnZj5nRxEO2nRcI9uy6sadxdjN724cX15eE6lZXvDFaKIa9JUd yIUg== bhtx907AvDlEskTCTUWa2XizBk/t0KXPiQ== Sat, 21 Aug 2021 19:41:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtpclient.apple (ool-4350ed26.dyn.optonline.net. [67.80.237.38]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id i6sm4099120qti.30.2021.08.21.19.41.05 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 21 Aug 2021 19:41:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 22:41:04 -0400 References: <6BDCC293-14C1-488A-AFFA-937C9DA14B28@icloud.com> To: Thomas Coradeschi Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2409870839136319022== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-A3DEFB78-E2B2-4A0B-9E46-2063C3E4EA42 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks, Tom. I have transfer switch for the house furnace; a bigger one has= long been on the to do list. This may move that up a bit.=20 Sent from my iPhone > On Aug 21, 2021, at 5:15 PM, Thomas Coradeschi wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFYou=E2=80=99ll be good with what you have. I have a 3 kW Honda on= a 10 circuit transfer switch, feeding a 2600 ft2 house. We can=E2=80=99t ru= n the the big power hogs - A/C or electric oven - but other than that, we ar= e good. We run some lighting, internet/computer/TV, NG powered heat, HW, co= oktop, dryer and grill, etc. Its an inverter based system and it rarely runs= much above idle unless heat, both fridges, freezer and coffee maker are all= calling for power at the same time. >=20 > Tom Coradeschi > tjcora@icloud.com >=20 >>> On Aug 21, 2021, at 4:29 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >>>=20 >> =EF=BB=BF=46rom David: >>=20 >>> You need a low pressure regulator. Input is 10 to 15ish inches of water.= Output is 10 inches water.=20 >> Steal the one from your furnace, if you need to. >>=20 >> There is a regulator between the tank and the house, so it comes in befor= e the line to the outside. It is hard to read the regulator, as it is under= the porch, which is why I gave the stats for the water heater.=20 >>=20 >> =46rom Pat: >>=20 >>> Silly question. Did you talk to the folks that installed the generator? >>=20 >>=20 >> Not silly, but it isn=E2=80=99t a permanent whole house generator. I=E2=80= =99ve thought about installing one, and certainly will if weather patterns c= hange enough that we are dealing with this more often, but the price didn=E2= =80=99t seem justified given the amount of use that it would get. As I said= , I have had this one for about 8 years and never had to use it. My main wo= rry has always been an extended outage in the winter, but we don=E2=80=99t n= eed much amperage with propane heat for the furnaces. (Separate heat in the s= hop. Hey! Shop content!). I haven=E2=80=99t done the exact math, but beli= eve that 4000 Surge Watts/3250 Running Watts will be enough to keep things g= oing here for as long as it takes=E2=80=A6as long as I can run off of the in= -ground tank. >>=20 >>> On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:46 PM, Pat Horne wrote: >>>=20 >>> Silly question. Did you talk to the folks that installed the generator? >>>=20 >>> Peace, >>> Pat >>>=20 >>> Pat Horne=20 >>> We support Habitat for Humanity >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >>>=20 >>> =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected p= aths of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without po= wer, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. Short= ly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-= tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBh= BPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_Bw= E) which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically t= o be safe. It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard r= egulator. A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: >>>=20 >>> Low Pressure Regulator >>> Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG >>> Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) >>> Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >>>=20 >>> We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. I= had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in c= ase I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator di= rectly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.= The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for t= he water heater: >>>=20 >>> Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >>> Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >>> Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR >>> Max Working Pressure: 150psi >>> Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR >>> Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR >>> Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >>>=20 >>> Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directl= y to the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I tried it onc= e with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out a= ny appreciable power. I always meant to research this before I needed it, b= ut like many of us, never got around to it until now. >>>=20 >>> Thanks, >>> Jim >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>>=20 >>> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/a= rchive >>>=20 >>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pati= ntexas@icloud.com >>>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >>=20 >> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/ar= chive >>=20 >> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjcor= a@icloud.com >>=20 --Apple-Mail-A3DEFB78-E2B2-4A0B-9E46-2063C3E4EA42 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks, Tom. I have  transfer switch f= or the house furnace; a bigger one has long been on the to do list. This may= move that up a bit. 

    Sent from my iPhone
    =

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 5:15 PM, T= homas Coradeschi <tjcora@icloud.com> wrote:

    =
    =EF=BB=BFYou=E2=80=99ll be good with= what you have. I have a 3 kW Honda on a 10 circuit transfer switch, feeding= a 2600 ft2 house. We can=E2=80=99t run the the big power hogs - A/C or elec= tric oven - but other than that, we are good. We run some lighting, internet= /computer/TV, NG powered  heat, HW, cooktop, dryer and grill, etc. Its a= n inverter based system and it rarely runs much above idle unless heat, both= fridges, freezer and coffee maker are all calling for power at the same tim= e.

    Tom Coradeschi
    tjcora@icloud.com

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 4:29 PM, Jim Stone &= lt;1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BF=46rom David:

    You need a low pressure regulator.= Input is 10 to 15ish inches of water.  Output is 10 inches water. = ;
    Steal the one from your furnace, if you= need to.
    There is a regulator be= tween the tank and the house, so it comes in before the line to the outside.=  It is hard to read the regulator, as it is under the porch, which is w= hy I gave the stats for the water heater. 

    =46rom Pat:

    Silly question. Did you talk to the folks that installed the g= enerator?

    Not silly, but it= isn=E2=80=99t a permanent whole house generator.  I=E2=80=99ve thought= about installing one, and certainly will if weather patterns change enough t= hat we are dealing with this more often, but the price didn=E2=80=99t seem j= ustified given the amount of use that it would get.  As I said, I have h= ad this one for about 8 years and never had to use it.  My main worry h= as always been an extended outage in the winter, but we don=E2=80=99t need m= uch amperage with propane heat for the furnaces. (Separate heat in the shop.=  Hey!  Shop content!).  I haven=E2=80=99t done the exact mat= h, but believe that 4000 Surge Watts/3250 Running Watts will be enough t= o keep things going here for as long as it takes=E2=80=A6as long as I can ru= n off of the in-ground tank.

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:46 PM, Pat Horne <patintexas@icloud.com&= gt; wrote:

    Silly question. Did you talk to the folks th= at installed the generator?

    Peace,
    Pat

    Pat Horne 
    We support Habitat for Humani= ty


    On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BF= I am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths of Hurri= cane Henri.  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without power, alt= hough FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy.  Shortly a= fter Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-400= 0-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54= VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, o= f course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to be safe.=  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard regul= ator.  A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator:
    • Low Pressure Regulator
    • Inlet Pressure: &n= bsp;             25-250PSIG
    • Outlet Pressure:            280mmH2O=3D (11"W= .C.)
    • Flow Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)
      • =

    We use Propa= ne for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an ou= tside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case I ever= needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator directly to t= he house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.  The h= ouse supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the wate= r heater:

    • Max Inlet Gas Pressure:    13.0 =E2= =80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80= =9CW.C.
    • Recovery Rating:         &nbs= p;     206/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure: &nb= sp;   150psi
    • Max Output:        =               180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:                 &= nbsp;        11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold P= ressure:             3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Ma= x Input)

    Am I m= issing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly to the h= ouse supply without the regulator?  For the record, I tried it once wit= h the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any ap= preciable power.  I always meant to research this before I needed it, b= ut like many of us, never got around to it until now.
    <= br class=3D"">
    Thanks,
    Jim


    _______________________________________________
    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsu= bscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-= talk/patintexas@icloud.com
    =

    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.te= am.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.= team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http:/= /autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjcora@icloud.com
    =
    = --Apple-Mail-A3DEFB78-E2B2-4A0B-9E46-2063C3E4EA42-- --===============2409870839136319022== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2409870839136319022==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 21 20:52:27 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95116A0EC2 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 20:52:27 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ms11p00im-qufo17281401.me.com (unknown [17.58.38.51]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A462A0CE9 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 20:51:51 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1629600712; bh=+/VcgOKpw7qXapwzR5vR+iQQ8fUkIkv/wZNm5SmUqZg=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=HcM0oJzx57WjDIq7snv0cWekBUdbTGcN++m/T0VOnPbJVbyUnykdzZzmt69F79J0c 4calDk8OWqokqevHJcA1dI3JjzXBP+XWhn8kBr/2P0AelC3syvA4groxdt8snQW9yH O9HaNL5hrixw7TWspvqev2gLUrwx7Y2sj0Z3ng4HrHsq/ejTEC2WxyS/yVuYlnU6hr bP9jE4t9Y5zmM9sUUL4cKXH8XdjtlSLLss/ZVHK2asf/9mBa3EgdyVBEgnQOAa9ZE3 qU4x/ZVzx/6gxyw+awBwGfYk2ndOf7KWCTdo3hUdQIOLn2E4xkmBd6awC+jR/1apu0 W3uWAnvpKkuhw== Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by ms11p00im-qufo17281401.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 413BABC00EF; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 02:51:51 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 21:51:49 -0500 References: To: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> =?UTF-8?Q?2903e8d5c8f:6.0.391,18.0.790,17.0.607.475.0000000_definitions?= =?UTF-8?Q?=3D2021-08-21=5F11:2021-08-20=5F02,2021-08-21=5F11,2020-04-07?= =?UTF-8?Q?=5F01_signatures=3D0?= spamscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 suspectscore=0 clxscore=1011 malwarescore=0 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2108220018 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Thomas Coradeschi , Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============0142581782544653586== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-D7633AAC-204C-4A16-B88A-D612B9F1C9CB charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable You also might look into a gas quick disconnect so it=E2=80=99s faster, easi= er & safer to connect the generator next time. The connectors are similar to= air hose fittings except the male fitting also has a valve in it. I purchas= ed what was called an extended stay kit for an RV. There are a bunch of diff= erent ones, some just fittings. It might be hard to find connectors big enou= gh at RV supply centers.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 21, 2021, at 9:42 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: =EF=BB=BFThanks, Tom. I have transfer switch for the house furnace; a bigge= r one has long been on the to do list. This may move that up a bit.=20 Sent from my iPhone > On Aug 21, 2021, at 5:15 PM, Thomas Coradeschi wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BFYou=E2=80=99ll be good with what you have. I have a 3 kW Honda on= a 10 circuit transfer switch, feeding a 2600 ft2 house. We can=E2=80=99t ru= n the the big power hogs - A/C or electric oven - but other than that, we ar= e good. We run some lighting, internet/computer/TV, NG powered heat, HW, co= oktop, dryer and grill, etc. Its an inverter based system and it rarely runs= much above idle unless heat, both fridges, freezer and coffee maker are all= calling for power at the same time. >=20 > Tom Coradeschi > tjcora@icloud.com >=20 >> On Aug 21, 2021, at 4:29 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >>=20 >> =EF=BB=BF=46rom David: >>=20 >>> You need a low pressure regulator. Input is 10 to 15ish inches of water.= Output is 10 inches water.=20 >> Steal the one from your furnace, if you need to. >>=20 >> There is a regulator between the tank and the house, so it comes in befor= e the line to the outside. It is hard to read the regulator, as it is under= the porch, which is why I gave the stats for the water heater.=20 >>=20 >> =46rom Pat: >>=20 >>> Silly question. Did you talk to the folks that installed the generator? >>=20 >>=20 >> Not silly, but it isn=E2=80=99t a permanent whole house generator. I=E2=80= =99ve thought about installing one, and certainly will if weather patterns c= hange enough that we are dealing with this more often, but the price didn=E2= =80=99t seem justified given the amount of use that it would get. As I said= , I have had this one for about 8 years and never had to use it. My main wo= rry has always been an extended outage in the winter, but we don=E2=80=99t n= eed much amperage with propane heat for the furnaces. (Separate heat in the s= hop. Hey! Shop content!). I haven=E2=80=99t done the exact math, but beli= eve that 4000 Surge Watts/3250 Running Watts will be enough to keep things g= oing here for as long as it takes=E2=80=A6as long as I can run off of the in= -ground tank. >>=20 >>> On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:46 PM, Pat Horne wrote: >>>=20 >>> Silly question. Did you talk to the folks that installed the generator? >>>=20 >>> Peace, >>> Pat >>>=20 >>> Pat Horne=20 >>> We support Habitat for Humanity >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >>>=20 >>> =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected p= aths of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without po= wer, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. Short= ly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-= tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBh= BPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_Bw= E) which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically t= o be safe. It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard r= egulator. A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: >>>=20 >>> Low Pressure Regulator >>> Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG >>> Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) >>> Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >>>=20 >>> We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. I= had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in c= ase I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator di= rectly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.= The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for t= he water heater: >>>=20 >>> Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >>> Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >>> Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR >>> Max Working Pressure: 150psi >>> Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR >>> Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR >>> Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >>>=20 >>> Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directl= y to the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I tried it onc= e with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out a= ny appreciable power. I always meant to research this before I needed it, b= ut like many of us, never got around to it until now. >>>=20 >>> Thanks, >>> Jim >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>>=20 >>> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/a= rchive >>>=20 >>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pati= ntexas@icloud.com >>>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >>=20 >> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/ar= chive >>=20 >> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjcor= a@icloud.com >>=20 _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com --Apple-Mail-D7633AAC-204C-4A16-B88A-D612B9F1C9CB charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable You also might look into a gas quick discon= nect so it=E2=80=99s faster, easier & safer to connect the generator nex= t time. The connectors are similar to air hose fittings except the male fitt= ing also has a valve in it. I purchased what was called an extended stay kit= for an RV. There are a bunch of different ones, some just fittings. It migh= t be hard to find connectors big enough at RV supply centers. 

    =
    Peace,
    Pat

    Pat Horne 
    = We support Habitat for Humanity

    <= br>On Aug 21, 2021, at 9:42 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote= :

    =EF=BB=BFThanks, Tom. I have  transfer swi= tch for the house furnace; a bigger one has long been on the to do list. Thi= s may move that up a bit. 

    Sent from my iPhone<= /div>

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 5:15= PM, Thomas Coradeschi <tjcora@icloud.com> wrote:

    =
    =EF=BB=BFYou=E2=80=99ll be good= with what you have. I have a 3 kW Honda on a 10 circuit transfer switch, fe= eding a 2600 ft2 house. We can=E2=80=99t run the the big power hogs - A/C or= electric oven - but other than that, we are good. We run some lighting, int= ernet/computer/TV, NG powered  heat, HW, cooktop, dryer and grill, etc.= Its an inverter based system and it rarely runs much above idle unless heat= , both fridges, freezer and coffee maker are all calling for power at the sa= me time.

    Tom Coradeschi
    tjcora@icloud.com

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 4:29 PM, Jim St= one <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BF=46rom David:

    You need a low pressure regulato= r. Input is 10 to 15ish inches of water.  Output is 10 inches water.&nb= sp;
    Steal the one from your furnace, if y= ou need to.
    =
    There is a regulator b= etween the tank and the house, so it comes in before the line to the outside= .  It is hard to read the regulator, as it is under the porch, which is= why I gave the stats for the water heater. 

    =46rom Pat:

    Silly question. Did you talk to the folks that installed the g= enerator?

    Not silly, but it= isn=E2=80=99t a permanent whole house generator.  I=E2=80=99ve thought= about installing one, and certainly will if weather patterns change enough t= hat we are dealing with this more often, but the price didn=E2=80=99t seem j= ustified given the amount of use that it would get.  As I said, I have h= ad this one for about 8 years and never had to use it.  My main worry h= as always been an extended outage in the winter, but we don=E2=80=99t need m= uch amperage with propane heat for the furnaces. (Separate heat in the shop.=  Hey!  Shop content!).  I haven=E2=80=99t done the exact mat= h, but believe that 4000 Surge Watts/3250 Running Watts will be enough t= o keep things going here for as long as it takes=E2=80=A6as long as I can ru= n off of the in-ground tank.

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 3:46 PM, Pat Horne <patintexas@icloud.com&= gt; wrote:

    Silly question. Did you talk to the folks th= at installed the generator?

    Peace,
    Pat

    Pat Horne 
    We support Habitat for Humani= ty


    On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BF= I am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths of Hurri= cane Henri.  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without power, alt= hough FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy.  Shortly a= fter Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-400= 0-watt-propane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54= VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, o= f course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to be safe.=  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard regul= ator.  A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator:
    • Low Pressure Regulator
    • Inlet Pressure: &n= bsp;             25-250PSIG
    • Outlet Pressure:            280mmH2O=3D (11"W= .C.)
    • Flow Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)
      • =

    We use Propa= ne for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an ou= tside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case I ever= needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator directly to t= he house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.  The h= ouse supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the wate= r heater:

    • Max Inlet Gas Pressure:    13.0 =E2= =80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80= =9CW.C.
    • Recovery Rating:         &nbs= p;     206/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure: &nb= sp;   150psi
    • Max Output:        =               180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:                 &= nbsp;        11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold P= ressure:             3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Ma= x Input)

    Am I m= issing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly to the h= ouse supply without the regulator?  For the record, I tried it once wit= h the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any ap= preciable power.  I always meant to research this before I needed it, b= ut like many of us, never got around to it until now.
    <= br class=3D"">
    Thanks,
    Jim


    _______________________________________________
    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsu= bscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-= talk/patintexas@icloud.com
    =

    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
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    = --Apple-Mail-D7633AAC-204C-4A16-B88A-D612B9F1C9CB-- --===============0142581782544653586== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============0142581782544653586==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Aug 22 03:57:42 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB2ECA0EC6 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 03:57:42 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sender4-of-o50.zoho.com (unknown [136.143.188.50]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 755EBA0D48 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 03:57:08 -0600 (MDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; t=1629626228; cv=none; d=zohomail.com; s=zohoarc; b=YJhpj6NsbVFDF5VHeJA3Nl4sn+XkyD1JT6o0Ua/q77D2Y51fHXTB/kc5bneUzce3AMx7nlO2pVOrtO5GXN85Sl5LDwPbgn3D+O5w3WJ6Y+dBntVuVMNat0c46Z8Kdt0OMJnQwTEpZ3urFUPdNDsJ9lcIEAi2MfifMZJlwg6RCfI= ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=zohomail.com; s=zohoarc; t=1629626228; h=Content-Type:Date:From:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Message-ID:References:Subject:To; bh=HItCQcV742OsoxQ/qLhqM4lSKuGmaPQIauXM7ss/JC8=; b=QI+Q/g0zHKsk09kiHdwpHLMLtZ4mcGd1zOBNPU0KBK1n89u0MROco3cWThEXsJwZNSoFPmt5430/d9bqdhxhFEA38yqltmkYmWTXLGyytOLVhjrnD/CfkWh2h2yh3cF5DfyYFZzkPcyVlEwfH6eXQGQPgQAcQQwp70ht29b0Mbk= ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.zohomail.com; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=nick@landform.co.uk; dmarc=pass header.from= s=zoho; d=landform.co.uk; i=nick@landform.co.uk; h=From:Subject:To:References:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version:In-Reply-To:Content-Type; bh=HItCQcV742OsoxQ/qLhqM4lSKuGmaPQIauXM7ss/JC8=; b=AUztmu8N+OZiBw5lxAGzOpvVxVjUN5afm0MQJWXTU+Li/4Sx8+gflAuTEGPCJbS2 eHQsdsR9CQso9tObKCfKyBrzFOMoqqMk95Pnwn93vCQ+aSk9Z6Ad/DxnRtdF6YuqOLc aaDeqCwzdOS6txPhYS5gwcLUBSAfLrBUsaEkkMt0= Received: from [192.168.1.64] (host86-168-8-181.range86-168.btcentralplus.com [86.168.8.181]) by mx.zohomail.com with SMTPS id 1629626226193989.5935212998403; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 02:57:06 -0700 (PDT) From: nick brearley To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> <4DCE368C-5DC1-4BDE-B9AB-912C429BF950@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 10:56:56 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.13.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============0510778560248079905== boundary="------------05B9FD67A5D9B11D61639882" Content-Language: en-US This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------05B9FD67A5D9B11D61639882 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Surprised nobody's responded to Phil's very valid concerns. I realise that this may not be helpful to Jim who's having to study the weather radar at hourly intervals but I did a net search and came up with this among other items: https://generatorgeek.com/can-a-propane-generator-run-on-natural-gas/ Short answer, no without modification. As a minimum it must be worth a phonecall to http://www.sportsmangenerators.com/contact.html. Although bearing in mind these are wholesale importers they may not be the ultimate authority. And not available until Monday. Good luck with the storm. Nick Brearley On 21/08/2021 20:19, Phil Ethier wrote: > No. LP gas and household natural gas are different. You need to rejet > products to change over. > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:07 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>  I am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths >> of Hurricane Henri.  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without >> power, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following >> Sandy.  Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator >> (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=off&gclid=CjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE >> ) >> which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it >> periodically to be safe.  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and >> comes with a standard regulator.  A little Googling shows the >> following specs for the regulator: >> >> * Low Pressure Regulator >> * Inlet Pressure:               25-250PSIG >> * Outlet Pressure:            280mmH2O= (11"W.C.) >> * Flow Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr) >> >> >> We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. >>   I had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, >> just in case I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect >> the generator directly to the house supply and avoid having to depend >> on the portable tanks.  The house supply is regulated and, as an >> example, here are the specs for the water heater: >> >> * Max Inlet Gas Pressure:    13.0 “W.C. >> * Min Inlet Gas Pressure:     8.0 “W.C. >> * Recovery Rating:               206/Gallons/HR >> * Max Working Pressure:     150psi >> * Max Output:                       180,000 BTU/HR >> * Max Input:                          11,000 BTU/HR >> * Manifold Pressure:             3.9 “W.C. (For Max Input) >> >> >> Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator >> directly to the house supply without the regulator?  For the record, >> I tried it once with the regulator attached and it barely ran and >> didn’t put out any appreciable power.  I always meant to research >> this before I needed it, but like many of us, never got around to it >> until now. >> >> Thanks, >> Jim >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation  $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk >> http://autox.team.net/archive >> >> Unsubscribe/Manage: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pethier7@gmail.com >> > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate:http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive:http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage:http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/nick@landform.co.uk > --------------05B9FD67A5D9B11D61639882 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

    Surprised nobody's responded to Phil's very valid concerns.

    I realise that this may not be helpful to Jim who's having to study the weather radar at hourly intervals but I did a net search and came up with this among other items:

    https://generatorgeek.com/can-a-propane-generator-run-on-natural-gas/

    Short answer, no without modification. As a minimum it must be worth a phonecall to http://www.sportsmangenerators.com/contact.html. Although bearing in mind these are wholesale importers they may not be the ultimate authority. And not available until Monday.

    Good luck with the storm.

    Nick Brearley


    On 21/08/2021 20:19, Phil Ethier wrote:
    No. LP gas and household natural gas are different. You need to rejet products to change over. 

    Sent from my iPhone

    On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:07 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

     I am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths of Hurricane Henri.  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without power, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy.  Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generator/?wi=off&gclid=CjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to be safe.  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard regulator.  A little Googling shows the following specs for the regulator:

    • Low Pressure Regulator
    • Inlet Pressure:               25-250PSIG
    • Outlet Pressure:            280mmH2O= (11"W.C.)
    • Flow Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)

    We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the generator directly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.  The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the water heater:

    • Max Inlet Gas Pressure:    13.0 “W.C.
    • Min Inlet Gas Pressure:     8.0 “W.C.
    • Recovery Rating:               206/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure:     150psi
    • Max Output:                       180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:                          11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold Pressure:             3.9 “W.C. (For Max Input)

    Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator directly to the house supply without the regulator?  For the record, I tried it once with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn’t put out any appreciable power.  I always meant to research this before I needed it, but like many of us, never got around to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Jim


    _______________________________________________

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    --------------05B9FD67A5D9B11D61639882-- --===============0510778560248079905== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============0510778560248079905==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Aug 22 04:24:39 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27C03A0EE9 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 04:24:39 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-ch2-03v.sys.comcast.net (unknown [69.252.207.35]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF58BA0DB2 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 04:24:06 -0600 (MDT) Received: from resomta-ch2-15v.sys.comcast.net ([69.252.207.111]) by resqmta-ch2-03v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTP id HkczmIRzLzQhpHke8mWjBu; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 10:24:08 +0000 s=20190202a; t=1629627848; bh=QRuU1Rlnu+XOdGP0DIfzR18rYh6uz9+FbeEMSKWO21s=; h=Received:Received:To:From:Subject:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=gs19QIKHhHSItzfNDubtJUNDUo7UthbXOO0cPAYhn4i2sXKMjsmqRGsMu8dwV3/P+ G+BWRoCdLAmrZv7u1y7QGPNtepCYJQFWVY5VqyHl4TvE6IZ7imoULJDvxEtXOwZRBy 87I6gtSY/vtty4lrCTsaOtJmh421mczi6hmo6TZPeA+eUAxQ3Njz3QQUc5GIsBwJhV J9ypMe1zqqBgVocNPVUamMulCohzwPG7X5nImYeCv1WN31UgjSoCQsB/PGN2d0+pMU KVDddmJBg+zSE0O6ZRTF3t+lsFBMEYP86+f3i3Eq8bRwDpXmXZJtIfOqXcDL5TU5T+ 22UqoWjidJFKA== Received: from [192.168.1.133] ([68.32.79.140]) by resomta-ch2-15v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTPSA id Hke7mCp4fSIWBHke7mVInG; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 10:24:08 +0000 To: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> <4DCE368C-5DC1-4BDE-B9AB-912C429BF950@gmail.com> From: Donald H Locker Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 06:24:07 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.11.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator 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[67.80.237.38]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id a9sm6713283qkk.82.2021.08.22.04.38.18 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 22 Aug 2021 04:38:18 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 07:38:18 -0400 References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> <4DCE368C-5DC1-4BDE-B9AB-912C429BF950@gmail.com> To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8345676169215094126== boundary="Apple-Mail=_AD3BB839-1914-43E5-9F7D-B533F8D43FF9" --Apple-Mail=_AD3BB839-1914-43E5-9F7D-B533F8D43FF9 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 All is good, guys. The latest forecast shows the storm moving east and = it looks like the eye is going to miss Long Island. There will = certainly be lots of rain and wind and I still expect to lose power at = some point, so this will all be of use very soon. Right now it is just = wet and windy, but nothing like we are expecting in a few hours. More = later. Jim > On Aug 22, 2021, at 6:24 AM, Donald H Locker = wrote: >=20 > I'm surprised to see responses assuming natural gas is the house = supply. >=20 > In the original post, Jim specifically stated that he has LPG/Propane > house heating with a large tank for supply. Someone, somewhere along = the > line missed that fact and that piece of conversation went off the = rails. >=20 > Donald. > -- >> On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com = >>=20 >> =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the = projected paths of >> Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without >> power, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following >> Sandy. Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator >>=20 > = > >> which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it >> periodically to be safe. It is designed to run off of LP tanks and >> comes with a standard regulator. A little Googling shows the >> following specs for the regulator: >>=20 >> Low Pressure Regulator >> Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG >> Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) >> Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >>=20 >>=20 >> We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. >> I had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, >> just in case I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect >> the generator directly to the house supply and avoid having to depend >> on the portable tanks. The house supply is regulated and, as an >> example, here are the specs for the water heater: >>=20 >> Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >> Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >> Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR >> Max Working Pressure: 150psi >> Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR >> Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR >> Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >>=20 >>=20 >> Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator >> directly to the house supply without the regulator? For the record, = I >> tried it once with the regulator attached and it barely ran and = didn=E2=80=99t >> put out any appreciable power. I always meant to research this = before >> I needed it, but like many of us, never got around to it until now. >>=20 >> Thanks, >> Jim >=20 > On 2021-08-22 5:56 a.m., nick brearley wrote: >> Surprised nobody's responded to Phil's very valid concerns. >>=20 >> I realise that this may not be helpful to Jim who's having to study = the >> weather radar at hourly intervals but I did a net search and came up >> with this among other items: >>=20 >> https://generatorgeek.com/can-a-propane-generator-run-on-natural-gas/ >>=20 >> Short answer, no without modification. As a minimum it must be worth = a >> phonecall to http://www.sportsmangenerators.com/contact.html. = Although >> bearing in mind these are wholesale importers they may not be the >> ultimate authority. And not available until Monday. >>=20 >> Good luck with the storm. >>=20 >> Nick Brearley >>=20 >>=20 >> On 21/08/2021 20:19, Phil Ethier wrote: >>> No. LP gas and household natural gas are different. You need to = rejet >>> products to change over.=20 >>>=20 >>> Sent from my iPhone >>>=20 >>>> On Aug 21, 2021, at 1:07 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> = wrote: >>>>=20 >>>> =EF=BB=BF I am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the = projected paths >>>> of Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days = without >>>> power, although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following >>>> Sandy. Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator >>>> = (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generat= or/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0= MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE >>>> = >) >>>> which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run it >>>> periodically to be safe. It is designed to run off of LP tanks and >>>> comes with a standard regulator. A little Googling shows the >>>> following specs for the regulator: >>>>=20 >>>> * Low Pressure Regulator >>>> * Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG >>>> * Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) >>>> * Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground = tank. >>>> I had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was = remodeled, >>>> just in case I ever needed it and I would like to be able to = connect >>>> the generator directly to the house supply and avoid having to = depend >>>> on the portable tanks. The house supply is regulated and, as an >>>> example, here are the specs for the water heater: >>>>=20 >>>> * Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >>>> * Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. >>>> * Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR >>>> * Max Working Pressure: 150psi >>>> * Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR >>>> * Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR >>>> * Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator >>>> directly to the house supply without the regulator? For the = record, >>>> I tried it once with the regulator attached and it barely ran and >>>> didn=E2=80=99t put out any appreciable power. I always meant to = research >>>> this before I needed it, but like many of us, never got around to = it >>>> until now. >>>>=20 >>>> Thanks, >>>> Jim >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>=20 >>>> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >>>> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >>>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk >>>> http://autox.team.net/archive >>>>=20 >>>> Unsubscribe/Manage: >>>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pethier7@gmail.com >>>>=20 >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>>=20 >>> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >>> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive >>>=20 >>> Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/nick@landform.co.uk >>>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >>=20 >> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive >>=20 >> Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dhlocker@comcast.net = >>=20 > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html = > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive = >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine@gmail.com = --Apple-Mail=_AD3BB839-1914-43E5-9F7D-B533F8D43FF9 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 All = is good, guys.  The latest forecast shows the storm moving east and = it looks like the eye is going to miss Long Island.  There will = certainly be lots of rain and wind and I still expect to lose power at = some point, so this will all be of use very soon.  Right now it is = just wet and windy, but nothing like we are expecting in a few hours. =  More later.
    Jim

    On Aug = 22, 2021, at 6:24 AM, Donald H Locker <dhlocker@comcast.net> wrote:

    I'm surprised to see responses assuming natural gas is the = house supply.

    In the = original post, Jim specifically stated that he has LPG/Propane
    house heating with a large tank = for supply. Someone, somewhere along the
    line missed that fact and that piece of conversation went off = the rails.

    Donald.
    --
    On = Aug 21, 2021, at 1:08 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BFI am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the = projected paths of
    Hurricane Henri.  We are being = told to plan for 7-10 days without
    power, although FWIW we = were only powerless for 4 days following
    Sandy. =  Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator

    <https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propa= ne-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO= 0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE>
    which, = of course, I have never needed, although I do run it
    periodically to be safe.  It is designed to run off of = LP tanks and
    comes with a standard regulator.  A = little Googling shows the
    following specs for the = regulator:

       Low Pressure = Regulator
       Inlet Pressure: =             &n= bsp; 25-250PSIG
       Outlet Pressure: =            280mmH2O= =3D (11"W.C.)
       Flow Capacity(MAX): =    119000(BTU/hr)


    We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon = in-ground tank.
    I had an outside gas line stubbed out when = the house was remodeled,
    just in case I ever needed it and = I would like to be able to connect
    the generator directly = to the house supply and avoid having to depend
    on the = portable tanks.  The house supply is regulated and, as an
    example, here are the specs for the water heater:

       Max Inlet Gas Pressure: =    13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
       Min = Inlet Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
       Recovery Rating: =             &n= bsp; 206/Gallons/HR
       Max Working = Pressure:     150psi
       Max Output: =             &n= bsp;         180,000 = BTU/HR
       Max Input: =             &n= bsp;           &nbs= p;11,000 BTU/HR
       Manifold Pressure: =             3.= 9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input)


    Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the = generator
    directly to the house supply without the = regulator?  For the record, I
    tried it once with the = regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t
    put = out any appreciable power.  I always meant to research this = before
    I needed it, but like many of us, never got around = to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Jim

    On 2021-08-22 5:56 a.m., nick brearley wrote:
    Surprised nobody's responded to Phil's very valid = concerns.

    I realise that this may not be = helpful to Jim who's having to study the
    weather radar at = hourly intervals but I did a net search and came up
    with = this among other items:

    https://generatorgeek.com/can-a-propane-generator-run-on-natura= l-gas/

    Short answer, no without = modification. As a minimum it must be worth a
    phonecall to = http://www.sportsmangenerators.com/contact.html. Although
    bearing in mind these are wholesale importers they may not be = the
    ultimate authority. And not available until Monday.

    Good luck with the storm.

    Nick Brearley


    On = 21/08/2021 20:19, Phil Ethier wrote:
    No. LP gas and household natural gas are = different. You need to rejet
    products to change = over. 

    Sent from my iPhone

    On Aug = 21, 2021, at 1:07 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BF I am on Eastern Long Island, = directly in one of the projected paths
    of Hurricane Henri. =  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without
    power,= although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following
    Sandy.  Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP = Generator
    (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-prop= ane-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneV= O0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE
    <https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propa= ne-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO= 0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE>)
    which, of course, I have never needed, although I do run = it
    periodically to be safe.  It is designed to run = off of LP tanks and
    comes with a standard regulator. =  A little Googling shows the
    following specs for the = regulator:

     * Low Pressure = Regulator
     * Inlet Pressure:       =         25-250PSIG
     * Outlet = Pressure:            280mmH2O=3D = (11"W.C.)
     * Flow Capacity(MAX):   =  119000(BTU/hr)


    We use = Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.
      I = had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled,
    just in case I ever needed it and I would like to be able to = connect
    the generator directly to the house supply and = avoid having to depend
    on the portable tanks.  The = house supply is regulated and, as an
    example, here are the = specs for the water heater:

     * Max = Inlet Gas Pressure:    13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
     * = Min Inlet Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
     * Recovery Rating:           =     206/Gallons/HR
     * Max Working Pressure: =     150psi
     * Max Output:     =                   180,000 = BTU/HR
     * Max Input:         =                  11,000 = BTU/HR
     * Manifold Pressure:       =       3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input)


    Am I missing anything, or should I be able to = hook the generator
    directly to the house supply without = the regulator?  For the record,
    I tried it once with = the regulator attached and it barely ran and
    didn=E2=80=99t = put out any appreciable power.  I always meant to research
    this before I needed it, but like many of us, never got = around to it
    until now.

    Thanks,
    Jim


    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: =  $12.96
    Archive: = http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
    http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage:
    http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pethier7@gmail.= com


    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: =  $12.96
    Archive: = http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/nick@landform.co.uk


    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: =  $12.96
    Archive: = http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dhlocker@comcas= t.net

    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine@gmai= l.com

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b=W2XIXb94xM+kMYtvZK4UX7aSvgdUdjRM1uGQIqgbFUgPNHJnuYXLJ68LBtmRhazn hd4/Kfg05CxEesZUNjxOPGKxR3L3m5Sx3oCU8YJemkyOVQWxVn263RgM2Vjkf7NgYTH SiBxiaRZZZZjVIALDuin09epePW9Cxf6SDAxrF7s= Received: from [192.168.1.64] (host86-168-8-181.range86-168.btcentralplus.com [86.168.8.181]) by mx.zohomail.com with SMTPS id 1629634159664273.76147116250377; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 05:09:19 -0700 (PDT) To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> <4DCE368C-5DC1-4BDE-B9AB-912C429BF950@gmail.com> From: nick brearley Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 13:09:12 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.13.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net U29ycnkuIENsYXNzaWMgY2FzZSBvZiAiTG9vayBiZWZvcmUgeW91IGxlYXAiLiBIYXZpbmcgYSBI b25kYSBnZW5lcmF0b3IgCndoaWNoIEkgY29udmVydGVkIHRvIExQRyBhcyBiYWNrIHVwIHBvd2Vy 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[67.80.237.38]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id x3sm6956735qkx.62.2021.08.22.11.35.06 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 22 Aug 2021 11:35:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 14:35:05 -0400 References: <027899F9-876C-4CD0-8A43-33F46A324516@gmail.com> To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6474764760870815793== boundary="Apple-Mail=_A6C8A345-B4C1-422F-A20A-8C98316F2F8D" --Apple-Mail=_A6C8A345-B4C1-422F-A20A-8C98316F2F8D Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Time for an update! It really looks like we dodged a bullet here. Henri = missed eastern Long Island, made landfall in RI and all we got was a = wet, windy day. And, not all that wet or windy. We=E2=80=99ve had = plenty worse. So, I haven't needed the generator. Of course, a branch = could still fall and take out a critical line, so I=E2=80=99ll leave it = on the porch and ready to go, just in case. And, I will spend a little = time researching better ways to utilize it the next time, as there will = definitely be a next time. As always, thanks for the help and advice! Jim > On Aug 21, 2021, at 2:05 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >=20 > I am on Eastern Long Island, directly in one of the projected paths of = Hurricane Henri. We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without power, = although FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy. = Shortly after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator = (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propane-generat= or/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO0jmOzjdgwy6-t0= MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE = ) which, of course, I have never = needed, although I do run it periodically to be safe. It is designed to = run off of LP tanks and comes with a standard regulator. A little = Googling shows the following specs for the regulator: >=20 > Low Pressure Regulator > Inlet Pressure: 25-250PSIG > Outlet Pressure: 280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.) > Flow Capacity(MAX): 119000(BTU/hr) >=20 > We use Propane for DHW and heat and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank. = I had an outside gas line stubbed out when the house was remodeled, = just in case I ever needed it and I would like to be able to connect the = generator directly to the house supply and avoid having to depend on the = portable tanks. The house supply is regulated and, as an example, here = are the specs for the water heater: >=20 > Max Inlet Gas Pressure: 13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. > Min Inlet Gas Pressure: 8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C. > Recovery Rating: 206/Gallons/HR > Max Working Pressure: 150psi > Max Output: 180,000 BTU/HR > Max Input: 11,000 BTU/HR > Manifold Pressure: 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input) >=20 > Am I missing anything, or should I be able to hook the generator = directly to the house supply without the regulator? For the record, I = tried it once with the regulator attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80= =99t put out any appreciable power. I always meant to research this = before I needed it, but like many of us, never got around to it until = now. >=20 > Thanks, > Jim >=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail=_A6C8A345-B4C1-422F-A20A-8C98316F2F8D Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Time = for an update! It really looks like we dodged a bullet = here.  Henri missed eastern Long Island, made landfall in RI = and all we got was a wet, windy day.  And, not all that wet or = windy.  We=E2=80=99ve had plenty worse.   So, I haven't = needed the generator.  Of course, a branch could still fall and = take out a critical line, so I=E2=80=99ll leave it on the porch and = ready to go, just in case.  And, I will spend a little time = researching better ways to utilize it the next time, as there will = definitely be a next time.

    As always, thanks for the help and advice!

    Jim


    On Aug = 21, 2021, at 2:05 PM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

    I am on Eastern Long = Island, directly in one of the projected paths of Hurricane Henri. =  We are being told to plan for 7-10 days without power, although = FWIW we were only powerless for 4 days following Sandy.  Shortly = after Sandy I purchased an LP Generator (https://www.jbtools.com/buffalo-tools-gen4000lp-4000-watt-propa= ne-generator/?wi=3Doff&gclid=3DCjwKCAjwyIKJBhBPEiwAu7zll1U54VH4euJneVO= 0jmOzjdgwy6-t0MUdEtaEHYXf_7W0sQxKo54TphoC__4QAvD_BwE) which, of = course, I have never needed, although I do run it periodically to be = safe.  It is designed to run off of LP tanks and comes with a = standard regulator.  A little Googling shows the following specs = for the regulator:

  • Low Pressure Regulator
  • Inlet Pressure:             =   25-250PSIG
  • Outlet Pressure:     =        280mmH2O=3D (11"W.C.)
  • Flow = Capacity(MAX):    119000(BTU/hr)

    • We use Propane for DHW and heat = and have a 500 gallon in-ground tank.   I had an outside gas line = stubbed out when the house was remodeled, just in case I ever needed it = and I would like to be able to connect the generator directly to the = house supply and avoid having to depend on the portable tanks.  The = house supply is regulated and, as an example, here are the specs for the = water heater:

    • Max Inlet Gas = Pressure:    13.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Min Inlet = Gas Pressure:     8.0 =E2=80=9CW.C.
    • Recovery = Rating:               = 206/Gallons/HR
    • Max Working Pressure:     = 150psi
    • Max Output:           =             180,000 BTU/HR
    • Max Input:               =            11,000 BTU/HR
    • Manifold Pressure:             = 3.9 =E2=80=9CW.C. (For Max Input)

    Am I missing anything, or should I be = able to hook the generator directly to the house supply without the = regulator?  For the record, I tried it once with the regulator = attached and it barely ran and didn=E2=80=99t put out any appreciable = power.  I always meant to research this before I needed it, but = like many of us, never got around to it until now.

    Thanks,
    Jim



    = --Apple-Mail=_A6C8A345-B4C1-422F-A20A-8C98316F2F8D-- --===============6474764760870815793== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6474764760870815793==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Aug 22 14:13:41 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16267A0EBF for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 14:13:41 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-yb1-f178.google.com (unknown [209.85.219.178]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27F00A0E2B for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 14:12:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-yb1-f178.google.com with SMTP id z18so30025575ybg.8 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 13:12:59 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=/s13gPV7uIIbxWE79sZCXqK/GXH0nzMHTcpy5ZNUmYM=; b=ndBTBU3hRsTQWvvJoG0B1wYQx79/qJcVPaVf9uAkbM+G4FVycha5EfFUGP+JS4D4YD h1utqsHdLH8WAQFpp7b8aXSvv9id+SMDmccE3FTvtLUl39JvThxk10QSt9sGm0pzjHFz 4T1QTSITo5vHbZGWuLGqybbADEGTUxbmV+K2AgOYIukY+luhTEEt/LC4LHyKLjMuDFaW tE8Dz74LxutBEDYev2evPz21riHRRTPfdtFBRoI/qfDgf/ghXmCy6is2NftC0pQbCVBK XM7j9SUkxcglZ1Rv7slYsGqiCYcMes/IgrmXNPWXN3S+7m811jDWsPoLCuc8e7EbbHtr yiww== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=/s13gPV7uIIbxWE79sZCXqK/GXH0nzMHTcpy5ZNUmYM=; b=JRh7LT6a7JUFInYiVbcQkuWNTHvq/xdQYxBRG3xB67lEbiP30i1QokI59q4l42+UJt ygxqZH7zle4ds+38BAjiUsYZxbqb6VzCc6K/+8+dXZluQBaj7YshsMMxwPN9+PmcQCdN BkxI23M6olBG8SwT8uZcHPXmC/TbtkXthfvt9SudEnRhPTR97RHk8g0S5+ozkv3zUwF3 f5Unw6OAAaGMLYtc4jrkOKwgHIYwm6j9q/snj3D6Je/SISl/UOdc8UUmJ7ctWBFJ4Fiq 5fjHRgJmJ6D64TyD42z6HzNbD6nAelQIBmbP9V4rwq1LKO+g35XwJWO339/tZQ1aQhiv uwUg== qtQSxRO1W+ZPlUbGSYlPmPTEtYFAchkrO14CJOA= Sun, 22 Aug 2021 13:12:58 -0700 (PDT) References: <4DCE368C-5DC1-4BDE-B9AB-912C429BF950@gmail.com> <725FDE02-1223-4EDD-9D82-383176EB6615@icloud.com> From: Philip Ethier Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 15:12:47 -0500 To: Thomas Coradeschi Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] LP Generator supply Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6722192899687826054== --000000000000dee7b205ca2b86aa On Sat, Aug 21, 2021 at 2:22 PM Thomas Coradeschi wrote: > Phil - he has an LP generator and a 500 gallon LP tank. All good. > > Tom Coradeschi > tjcora@icloud.com > Clearly, I need a Reading-Comprehension refresher-course. --000000000000dee7b205ca2b86aa Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


    =
    On Sat, Aug 21, 2021 at 2:22 PM Thoma= s Coradeschi <tjcora@icloud.com= > wrote:
    Phil - he has an LP generator and a 500 gallon LP tank. All g= ood.=C2=A0

    Tom Coradeschi
    Clearly, I need a Reading-Comprehension refresher-course.=C2= =A0

    --000000000000dee7b205ca2b86aa-- --===============6722192899687826054== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6722192899687826054==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Aug 22 17:26:03 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 955F3A0F38 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 17:26:03 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from NAM10-BN7-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (unknown [40.92.40.56]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BA2DA0E14 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 17:23:39 -0600 (MDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=N6upYQOj91A0jTKt2AV0tiAJP2BHVi/d3Q50g0UD8djR8GzehZVX3SXSW06UijiOPEjyiGgZanZAYz4kcQxgcN8O6aRxkc1dKw775m2KpT+JD+rLmRQ/5HHpA+m2gV+2U/tj8+SOeMz9FtyNveZgMjIQ0MktBUYKrYCEbEWkQQk1oK6nkNLiJyE8F8YtZ4k7q8mLQzn42JWgPV0lLlJNyNv73xW04HIRpa8pFWRxn9fH88Uz9d/LkIw7Iq7C+Zcac2m5eS0RRQvKRZPLZL96a3d2AS856idfadPjlU4dCChTqZmu7hl35kWNiHQvd584iHjt2NwtI+BAYh01r+YDmQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=6IlN82e3mQ99ccsqu1RbvuQXtz9ojoQY/Wp9wP8QIUw=; b=cFT7NFEyPsUNTffBfYm4jV3AtndpcJjyXk5UljxCpEkjeSSSq81Ps+CzJJt867gwt5M1G8rDZO7rdiQrWhThSexMT0V2EviuhpzqTusg7Z17yiHU1++KgP96pH8ZTqJOPyFCWznwD7JPeVUx8wzeqRQAtprnrlyw77ZZIVv55irwLtvgauBzQclC23BQ/Qqmdl0FbEX1NHN88zsgueh4rr5Hc7B3EBzXP4Yxpyn7pzrx6ZIMn9altIbq6KdRoZ3UFOdOdYBrIZrahkkuC0PlCOxBPsfKfTODiGzTnS/nbYlKXhKEnzkQK96EkNXLU3+I61CFi0zVUu3ltwxO/QHUgA== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=none; dmarc=none; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=6IlN82e3mQ99ccsqu1RbvuQXtz9ojoQY/Wp9wP8QIUw=; b=NksR2h2SASLvO5TfaGWcOqMIGhmUMSxQxEtjhSrM1IZQVNJrWVB+0LFSztE1qZiA2wtQjxMECYakr0VzLRTsN8DTbE/Uw2VHeokhwkSSpyAryVOw9iF8jpWvxC4y1I3Lm1/sFnbhTWQ3MjXcuK8h+26F+jAB0moXnOFLBLT6/8psi9ZgLTni/tUuPFqv2bTrQeDhIjKvxo4xVrK/YPzsqzWasQ91KVYFUfOtmaImhiLUOJ4jV8q6UgmPvKRwufEd6eSslLGwCMZL640X8yssyPwcoTwzQESmihRox+5CChtLIcJZ7TCpGhN+MD8aLTU6mlcuyuwWnyZ5viAXhfWLdw== Received: from DM6NAM10FT032.eop-nam10.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:7e86::45) by DM6NAM10HT091.eop-nam10.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:7e86::412) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4436.19; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:23:40 +0000 Received: from DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:7e86::52) by DM6NAM10FT032.mail.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:7e86::306) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4436.19 via Frontend Transport; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:23:40 +0000 Received: from DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::5996:25ff:fb0e:984]) by DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::5996:25ff:fb0e:984%3]) with mapi id 15.20.4436.024; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:23:40 +0000 From: "Tim ." To: "Shop Talk" Thread-Topic: "portable" AC units Thread-Index: AQHXl6wy9KVIsLYvr0ydsJgernxLWQ== Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:23:40 +0000 Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-incomingtopheadermarker: OriginalChecksum:6A4AED183B2C84DDC2E2ED16CF0B04CB6D8C2C352EE3E3B5192C7AEB4303FA56; UpperCasedChecksum:EDA7DFE2ACF7D9BDA700987EA6CF8E9C0CDB2844C18A2CC489D6EDF906C860C2; SizeAsReceived:6766; Count:41 x-tmn: [6ihKM632WB33TU96yD/pWXDLERF8W/PVLDZcyZ6jNnpV8gxe1pnXHavYtmZ08Ta6h6F+z8N/eRA=] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-incomingheadercount: 41 x-eopattributedmessage: 0 x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 1f445cc0-0c49-42d2-9727-08d965c3e038 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: DM6NAM10HT091: x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: wadik6rLZv1Oz8ii3fLn9xuOlUv6ikMjgTPrdrjQQ3qdoMmjqaTw8xxFcNLi3I2FF4NbZHNii4jPpjzDkHOP+8+xzWFdfVNITzQN6kf/3quhC9ozyZXefGXLGNuTPPYWVPNuelbikvnV0qFV0t76ePse/afC6mb1PhVHqlYclLofCTZu05kqmOP7VMDGZn82y7r4sDJeiMhTxTx1xEaFxRmzJp2yyyshxnsuZLb5L5Sp2A/Fnm7xTsU2Hk3JBVsHha6aVszfeoKpYXnBy7vkQyW8JhzvYPb8uDOUlAprKHXP6Acg2TlMKowMcy9oUW3B/T7ZroafMEcHwNTOtlig+aOQdIh+tVboyVumazAUhgN8PH8Ta1cadVHvF1CLKwTu20QopVHfMqi/n/k0Vm9BMDUld/7aWj3VvDPOfjUbsfgSNoyZ5epRVmAzY3eZY82U x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-chunkcount: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-0: GmZxuPNWAZVKHyRVKyrXJ7tqiX5p5SVxD0+t3qwGAcvld/8OgUE62M15WYAR/HO2s49yadBwN1XTtJvt+g43etDr0HDV//7eL0uvkgLZSGwMCK4/sQUjAprTQY1HkUav4A3ice78INmcskfPbQyKpB4/yQMp1Er3ha48+LjqErkPERpu/hnlaxfI1bZAevxHqDryrLSMacOf209HQjMG6w== x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2841864535748440173== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_DS7PR19MB46293C837EAB564A8479D349B4C39DS7PR19MB4629namp_" --_000_DS7PR19MB46293C837EAB564A8479D349B4C39DS7PR19MB4629namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? thanks --_000_DS7PR19MB46293C837EAB564A8479D349B4C39DS7PR19MB4629namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? 

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    --_000_DS7PR19MB46293C837EAB564A8479D349B4C39DS7PR19MB4629namp_-- --===============2841864535748440173== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2841864535748440173==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Aug 22 17:30:18 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64DB0A0F51 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 17:30:18 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ms11p00im-qufo17291201.me.com (unknown [17.58.38.41]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F09EDA0F4D for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 17:29:49 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1629674991; bh=eygUGxEPMvTA92bFXOENXMh4Kc0tkEXRnNCvCvdcMDQ=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=fcnJc1P4P1/8vrDWHC6j2vvC9ciTNqpOLMyLLMza0hQI2z+FqEhDoCZI0vB1oEMho Ud7nMazPIuYuJYmQUDw78DmfqWorgH+XmOot4vxtdbQsDJBkVxlSqzp13iFzGIZExP CFZFAi0GJ/W9ulj6FEEgZGjLP1coZyWAoNM9Erd80PHS+oo41Vvj2hDNOg7iM+zAAc dy9EA3s/4lk8Tkxt59lcqwafH1jejjMcbgqHYepw8Jy7+/ZjzgpeQafw6LIiSgNb/n LMMgeiJP30vmDEKnbMXDoR2qIvHjY15YSIy4qI9hEKi26gE2p+B8/TblCBAHaBZ8sq KDEDvFYc5hwXQ== Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by ms11p00im-qufo17291201.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 656CDBC0271; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:29:49 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 18:29:47 -0500 References: To: "Tim ." =?UTF-8?Q?2903e8d5c8f:6.0.391,18.0.790,17.0.607.475.0000000_definitions?= =?UTF-8?Q?=3D2021-08-22=5F06:2021-08-20=5F03,2021-08-22=5F06,2020-04-07?= =?UTF-8?Q?=5F01_signatures=3D0?= adultscore=0 malwarescore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 suspectscore=0 clxscore=1011 phishscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2108220158 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============0544436263789452554== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-D020FB1C-15D3-4E29-8382-D41E0111BED3 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Any I=E2=80=99ve seen have a duct that goes outside, usually through a windo= w. They use a filer panel like on a window AC would have, only smaller.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 22, 2021, at 6:26 PM, Tim . wrote: thanks _______________________________________________ --Apple-Mail-D020FB1C-15D3-4E29-8382-D41E0111BED3 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Any I=E2=80=99ve seen have a duct that goes= outside, usually through a window. They use a filer panel like on a window A= C would have, only smaller. 

    Peace,
    Pat
    Pat Horne 
    We support Habitat for Humanity


    On Aug 22, 2021, at 6:26 PM, Ti= m . <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com> wrote:

    thanks
    _______________________________________________
    = = --Apple-Mail-D020FB1C-15D3-4E29-8382-D41E0111BED3-- --===============0544436263789452554== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============0544436263789452554==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Aug 22 17:35:45 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D31CEA0F69 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 17:35:45 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ot1-f42.google.com (unknown [209.85.210.42]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32090A0F41 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 17:35:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-ot1-f42.google.com with SMTP id x10-20020a056830408a00b004f26cead745so31582275ott.10 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 16:35:05 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=KGuKpNJb+6ragiIw/MMcIar81k6LqREVt9HRa0mlb6c=; b=JVWF8b5MItKAF7rZ7zsWJt40aWxygdo2ClSEWDyMLPht4/OEmtEAav/8tKT03Y5j+c P7BzoMc27KJ48jJFOVtRctwBL5BiABGFuim2k40rFvfOtjuMz8Pik8Wk289c518vBVVq Uj7UKvkKaSen3sUuZTCukWbErigNAvwzM82KhrCa+Bc7k+IFRzFwqMk899ZDy6FpHxkX UptB4Y6lEg4Oh9o52zS2/PKwK5fcP+tGjw3p9RwILFRxQZP5/LoRBp+f9tP8TP7B98Yi 1XAgEHv3gNayRuBMjRxKb/6HzkSV1dXAZ2ng9HQNU3En2uLFt7olFTT7ftovMxzkycN6 //8w== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=KGuKpNJb+6ragiIw/MMcIar81k6LqREVt9HRa0mlb6c=; b=Gt//LVvl6yKqV0fT82U8Y/5yz6Kxyx4ARskKClytbzrd76Tm8XRod5O9rEkK8tbf7a DJvnf95c7dNLz/cGO8hqOmd94H3sIUv9WGHP159r82nLrlWwzzO9Fvwcxm3sjGZeKcMh xTGWag8KxwH94rvXJG2B/0EldNdksUMdc31Z+hhGugJIAbOWZ20oJ9xB/ioU78lTSA4u fkzpKhF9Gl+DSotaXIuasImteZuKiKtPDQsEvMm9Uu3Rl78dl5UZw2vvhD78YTvZFITa wQthlfeAdySmTJ3O5mso1mvHlGJ2iL+VuvFtRn9Xdrxh0txPJsf4mDWqdRoIkxVHlrBz MFkA== 9twdWI5TmSlktLRhFTJf8kEQEHm44N/VrEeHi0g= h3mr9359441otu.198.1629675304820; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 16:35:04 -0700 (PDT) References: From: John Innis Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 18:34:53 -0500 To: "Tim ." Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2076449638964300494== --000000000000a4a10d05ca2e5940 No personal experience, but I have not heard good things. Check out this youtube: https://youtu.be/_-mBeYC2KGc On Sun, Aug 22, 2021 at 6:26 PM Tim . wrote: > Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? > > My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an > exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? > > thanks > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis@gmail.com > > -- ================================= = Never offend people with style when you = = can offend with substance --- Sam Brown = ================================= --000000000000a4a10d05ca2e5940 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    No personal experience, but I have not heard good thi= ngs.=C2=A0 Check out this youtube:

    On Sun, Aug 22, 2021 at 6:= 26 PM Tim . <tims_datsu= n_stuff@outlook.com> wrote:
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance?=C2=A0

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
    et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

    alk/jdinnis@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.te= am.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis@gmail.com



    --
    =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
    =3D Never offend people with = style when you=C2=A0=C2=A0 =3D
    =3D can offend with substance --- Sam Bro= wn=C2=A0 =3D
    =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
    --000000000000a4a10d05ca2e5940-- --===============2076449638964300494== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2076449638964300494==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Aug 22 17:41:26 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE1B2A0F76 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 17:41:25 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic309-21.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (unknown [66.163.184.147]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A4A3A0F5F for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 17:40:42 -0600 (MDT) t=1629675644; bh=nm9JKlp7KN88IKe5IzcUgGbKExNpLF0622yZ/t7hHmw=; h=Date:From:Reply-To:To:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=dyex65M/mXFh26e4L+8mG8+5I00IRJuU8DCYX/XVjGYQOEwr86fwjMezN2l9cfc+Ig6epCTeeVlGyWAnuruA1Ylf7bn+2S4slMfB4Jr62SmTVWJQE2Z8rZj6ybcarGNiyJKEdLOmQ/BEogiyF50VOGvr/U5PvzeipX7uAnuYG37Q3omTAcZvQXy6/LZzd5x2Su60b4O/ebClnbAxH/bS+ZizhGawFapeGH3VSjsrAetVxb3HYTvzS5lTxVxXzl5rrhd2IFuZexiU1W76YpAAd0XlDev0IxOMSAt61NuP/IOh0p9pvzrDM6Jfj7PkH4yYYROpHnudbAxNbbcRIcaPvg== t=1629675644; bh=+mMe5/ac5tEuANGhqbTLAtbCLWfJ2Sv0eHJGPJ/Tm80=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Date:From:To:Subject:From:Subject; b=uOS1QCI6vod3gMrz9FYJ+rBZCU7omw1JIMFqqYxYx6C3Ub9LaFUSgnHWCqTVXu5XbN9vKkoVp8n2mzcC+RMRYwMR8MdJYe1LDl9NaWQ/7BU1Kfi4OPrFPx4O5l3lvDc/zFqCk7XSKYkjNT1lVqGJfWqlenuBHEfMP8nSwkPuW8A1JMLtE6QSpdKKFuSJXxpcXxNABH8wwLUJjT1UqQiqybZUGzJfvlZ1YgahTb8xtKlFCt5be+EGv6m+GSsScVw/+jcegLWoBRoD6Xxr5LBLdqjfdUhAZ/aQaj+ieQ/31Vn+ibAtoy+mpb9waiX4urdPDB4CjfCOBtlOziGiHPgS0g== c1uWC.6sWtaqHiezIlwRCVrxo7PQhWU9aO0gkeSq6gIqsWSk1OmjG3N3PzSlEYZlH5t6uUCjxBvd F1Sq3NKIjVyvrpmEM.1kExdVblzX6CdWIvT6oyJ3XSjscEHJx7GNPfNaaTFv4ry3uVXyZtHEanAD uFwvAkbKASPVRBagFw_wH.Q5HUOtDBxGZ3T37p_ovGvc1NAiKpPX_s2lMEkgI5tfPYHghzeN5zuv GFT3g9Ho_zFVB8Ydwl9nbJtc1zMonw_X.Pw7wFT1EN1GhwqwZ3GhkJV4Znm1EpHDJEU5On1seBFq 9nRU3q92X_pQo6xaiTds_J7QY0tbWcSS3OYxGqqaImUe2l6UJRDGdcQXhPCcVGfG61KUgoJ37J_9 YVzF0J7ymKHWhPMDRecXezy.s0WeOMvBpFwWfdaadKPDM8bar4WkQ_iSHBRuEqA3e7HWKOCDWqeI VgZBuOD.zAtFCProHX91xinGX3MklyLH2wBz25MV9EZivOMeIutUEvdhwFO1KhKOxdzFIaiWhtRD 7swYzWdsFi.aFfw5lkgNv63aoKAPGYgpTl0zam6_wttt5Ra2QT7dHMGK70Je4Py2fo0FGFLVGPVT h65HeEh3IdKS2pSOw22WYL6USu3KJE5XBUr1ufeiDD51uFpWhvGXlWsUpBoKQ6fhzSH74EsV2vWF Zyrdwdtd8zIeclZXOlrhfUdN4ZblHOGIfnU_pHpIkb5BixLo8hzSs7XZA3QCTjga8E4dJluXGCBQ iqA8fY2.pbXIjcAEgRjWm3NhHc6DeB96DJYHWHuW_vJRJZouS0PYZ0P8ReTQunFD2iRNb7NiuFw1 x3vHkp9VhWo1Y8_VDiq4TpoeivAMFwr274Sqas18_0eM9C03hA_YI1ZPtIOoWQbkj5HB4cLavn0t x7buMrBVTvzGVpUJnMg0.E5n4JweWvnwB9E8qdKe.Cb8RpgWILbk_0lCijBucng7oB2JpuED.wtD eWFCgrhWeH9RGSlM4ACXvYcWgbNAQf9P8eGtkiCfB9nYXgAgpAaRajiFKIidOumMj12ooex15QiM i368TdSEPSqM7FZYqfTGGU519_Y6KZrFBaUs5HYnCV9ca.i5rlNCSv8O0mwfQFPl7qCHE.9Pg8Bw kvWhbSI0shXzzLX9D1jlgoov1po02F2Ha9qspFziep8700aRVQeZEVS7aucwwvL6vAUu_t2rJ4cO tt_h1tbNUNEr_bc3sAnKQQbfkXDB76eTRefTooTbz4JRE0jNrDT9UxA7KC0bBUlPLv6FWUduI89e NeFlTTbi0ik5UpyXfizjlej6bVY.FNpI3tih4z.RlceYgRIFzr8qfYc9CMomLw22qv1iMMW.on_F FH6IeLG66SNdZn0bp2GiutLSVpPhh5ug9w9y2qGJ8P3lUOnIRBhz9hq5xg_58zm3ooih1s7hmvNy z99tatdRxGr_bgennEErtLsCmUaR5Ir54sqij3AG5xjMOI7IwdKaVPTAG_ROOpqFHDktxW243B5L pIBMH4uqXLh84mdE9HoMB.duH62BbiAVAcPgd1IBnRPU1qJ.7eU_6EHsYubhftra4EMPn1FE1cbB dTP6Ljqai.mNBwagtzsVeo5cymsNaVzpKinYhb4BYWwpvXxTjxRnfZwI6I.3dd1zIV.hbze8dnBZ qchx_cfQh3c1Eq3yhF2jPD4J7mMNpoF0ZuGjinZbS86LsOzwcM6jiQW0F0jkNIiE.y7JPiFT8eIe 4A6ceCk7g2bbjV4VwtHTCigP_Pi52TE3mZoSkUPpCB0YPXzsZ71UzGutRVUj8kl_9c2OvO8Bbjrh Xw97Kej29dOeJ2rmIGHkRzIyz8DbVCR5ew57UxUcmc.zPC1V1bACjAC7d_fzM30px4Tq.jWOTwZP DX.J0VxlwOMRxGj1uV_qjl.I3yx0gSOn1bOJAnJM1Df8x3SWBARMkdOZ7rgLEhDRtAo9ybbN3EV1 dVFlUX5yrDHpWTfNYWsFHh2.UQxKUrH_Ayd5MEhQq3NDY6OSm20_dQ_z6jOHjJLzjwU0kFgNvLP6 txkbiKdRd5iaThHF6WhCXurkUReQcq5_RKv50clD0Rc8C78KOhNfq2vwFztUYC8qtgER6JMbWZee E1Tlr4t5.xItd9NS3gaSnauWPMUEh66n5Pmqa_7ZOl33BjSjgemlIauZt5b3LHaLrShem_0MNww_ CrLFuBNTfwSMqJ_pHetgoyFWpHdVFSPGv9YqUq0_jyC8Qj41iVQlPWCniJzsSoCGSuO4ZYzNoWV8 9ECns2ehoBeuypAczHyNXVaHLPVVf11p0uM17FlX2PyL4zXKvVrsVrt5ebkl4_R.P.jSfLMHmhSB CtO2bbpwQggJYQlYooc13kc2_XBzj8Skk7IL_m_c7MQiwanZKeFU- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic309.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:40:44 +0000 Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:40:35 +0000 (UTC) From: Battmain To: "Shop-talk@autox.team.net" References: Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6063935343706107218== boundary="----=_Part_451716_914533110.1629675635785" ------=_Part_451716_914533110.1629675635785 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable At work, we exhausted above the drop ceiling. Supposed to be outside.=C2=A0= Some units have both exhaust and intake hoses. Measure carefully the area.= These things are power hogs for the amount of cooling. Mini Splits are way= better if possible.=C2=A0=20 =20 On Sun, Aug 22, 2021 at 7:26 PM, Tim . wro= te: #yiv9526583957 P {margin-top:0;margin-bottom:0;}Does anyone here hav= e any experience with said appliance?=C2=A0 My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? thanks_______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive n@yahoo.com =20 ------=_Part_451716_914533110.1629675635785 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
    At work, we exhausted above the drop ceiling. Supposed to be outside.  Some units have both exhaust and intake hoses. Measure carefully the area. These things are power hogs for the amount of cooling. Mini Splits are way better if possible. 

    On Sun, Aug 22, 2021 at 7:26 PM, Tim .
    <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com> wrote:
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? 

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

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    ------=_Part_451716_914533110.1629675635785-- --===============6063935343706107218== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6063935343706107218==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Aug 22 17:45:07 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F5C2A0FE2 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 17:45:07 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from NAM04-MW2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (unknown [40.92.46.90]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A2B0A0690 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 17:44:25 -0600 (MDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=fPh089wh/05g6UBjGhYQO9UZDaqA6hSWQg3oQs4760SunsUOk8SDrqNCNZj90TETfw4M1i5ob6egkao0gUcUqy545IrXfYgIELeqYdGr8ZU9XpZtk/JT8ZAYudT0llHdGYIxkMKAdv5CowwM0y2jgCnV3W6ZvEm9l8sEYk/MJEihbsqVw2gHWol1dBkKsg97LRmKpTcN7Cf+O9cdStSZd9+h+Jvsd5Yg6MwmMRXzn27beL2lW5H8rY4T8oNThtHbsdwvcKw/JwoB5SfAlm7aUHhHbLx5DnIZGPO1EtnL0Wb80FBBqi8YLuM85VTALzgrxk9Iu4fLZLnSEK7eWQFSXQ== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; 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Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:44:26 +0000 Received: from CO1PR06MB7994.namprd06.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::9103:ba23:d29a:b0d]) by CO1PR06MB7994.namprd06.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::9103:ba23:d29a:b0d%4]) with mapi id 15.20.4436.024; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:44:26 +0000 From: Jack Brooks To: "Shop Talk" Thread-Topic: "portable" AC units Thread-Index: AQHXl6wy9KVIsLYvr0ydsJgernxLWauALr9A Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:44:13 +0000 Deferred-Delivery: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:43:38 +0000 References: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-tmn: [5tu5LlrdjS4b34PjcETraUh9MGF0zPMW] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 27620d57-bfde-4de3-4615-08d965c6c6d6 x-ms-exchange-slblob-mailprops: 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 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: MW4PR06MB8268: x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: 27IyoiSFlGYBhi9ymFHK/9UYX1b+ebv6YHCNW+qxlwOp5DA2nNFV7rRoK8VdZAoVqWL7qdYe1QMqeKNkZSGAKWRCx0wt4mi0qujP01DD6Hnq7RStX5czDxjIvHQOUEDxIheuobezztfZ2UqQKA/dUHtLlx+7Cr5SIRGsEXvkO3YVnfC42l51nQulYkta4wwLhJtVwpd2D69Lr82w7yalDLv29NqvGz2Ch1juUfmNG1NLIVrlOTs9WiKdZF9bu64nG0xjf+YT+D7YmmtPXpprbHnM+zIdLVPhhmNc3DTk8aLS7wuqYNZRnTOGaY+GTydl/oRkznpBmEJwJ2DyV1EW6LmoOo0RPIiHu0BTgRmvjpL91tsc6L/Q9mYuIMB0HY8zUR2H9Z+rMACSg6yguXuZNy6G1ljMMN8oevD1pWD42laiKdeSLKtMxNmjIOUIjI+g x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-chunkcount: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-0: t6NUW7ZMW8WFIGLFq1bObdn+YqIT1UbWRKTpnqf+bEVgxKU9vqrcXhfAWs0rDTlgExxy3/gvrtxQ2XNFQTksM/IvmLIc2c8V4eTbAJCtdAe5pfr6iNX024IkseTFPJsbpeFbyNrr6cFvKFL/gZPAGA== x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2283102745294051214== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_CO1PR06MB79945BCD60D921B508777BBAA8C39CO1PR06MB7994namp_" --_000_CO1PR06MB79945BCD60D921B508777BBAA8C39CO1PR06MB7994namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The better ones have two ducts that vent outside, one for inlet and one for= exhaust otherwise you are drawing in air from outside, etc. From what I h= ave seen people discussing in the RV world, efficiencies are typically noto= riously low. Many RV'ers are installing inverter style mini splits instead. They are jus= t hanging the "outside" portion on the outer wall of the RV. The kicker is= that they seem to be able to find HVAC guys that will check over and fill = a system they install resulting in much lower installed costs. Jack From: Shop-talk On Behalf Of Tim . Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 4:24 PM To: Shop Talk Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? thanks --_000_CO1PR06MB79945BCD60D921B508777BBAA8C39CO1PR06MB7994namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

    The better ones have two ducts tha= t vent outside, one for inlet and one for exhaust otherwise you are drawing= in air from outside, etc.  From what I have seen people discussing in the RV world, efficiencies are typically notoriously = low.

     

    Many RV’ers are installing i= nverter style mini splits instead. They are just hanging the “outside= ” portion on the outer wall of the RV.  The kicker is that they seem to be able to find HVAC guys that will check over and fill a sys= tem they install resulting in much lower installed costs.

     

    Jack

     

     

    From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces@autox.t= eam.net> On Behalf Of Tim .
    Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 4:24 PM
    To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
    Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units

     

    Does an= yone here have any experience with said appliance? <= /p>

    &n= bsp;

    My main= wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exhaust &qu= ot;port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    &n= bsp;

    thanks<= o:p>

    --_000_CO1PR06MB79945BCD60D921B508777BBAA8C39CO1PR06MB7994namp_-- --===============2283102745294051214== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2283102745294051214==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Aug 22 18:15:17 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE9CCA0FEA for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 18:15:17 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ot1-f43.google.com (unknown [209.85.210.43]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91C01A0FE9 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 18:14:41 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-ot1-f43.google.com with SMTP id l7-20020a0568302b0700b0051c0181deebso88090otv.12 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 17:14:43 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=x1wviF2X49BujEwj9fFnGN8j10Hq5GEIaPyH4MjthTo=; b=pUucKstqqSOQsINVf2yetaeyBCRw8roVvKq9HKIvJriv9y8Ghw2rj/gCPh/1KLxdpR CWO1B+jOzjGHF9X80Zx9MJZ1J94jPQYxub2kDOIwFi9qKS0UwPAqCCKihqDiCgsaA2gk vpUNSG2UsHyDITMGm/RN/6YW9x4b+bg4y/yDlvRQAjoR7PQNMMTS0Bfw3m22M8n+oAZM Q6JcKvk0SNTzPfcZtzKCt/mf3t+CBk7rStxayr3HHirnkIs+E8WcwujtNy4iRohx4lk8 QmLYvQRMx9cQjGu5d9WyWGfta6rTm7ZDQ0HGAH/G8ApBiVwjvtQny3JAvhW80iXoTzdq h6oQ== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=x1wviF2X49BujEwj9fFnGN8j10Hq5GEIaPyH4MjthTo=; b=hwu47/nkN4y0Yg8gW0lVi8WjMHwdxjInFRLn8Pqx03Es5pIRzJzvs2uE9VqOYt9kiu s8JXyZxoyS/zbXvli/ls3V1EHep4AEmAe6HQwW1dBtsh9fhzkHH7UrWnFKzXM7LdXiKi kblwQFuAwtLITKXTALtqPM8cl2skzq+75vtYhsLIArOTf9LEWqgxwrhvfopEdaEel3KD PmIKaRz2XWXyQbCNhS2lcPPBUFPw+/KnK9cEM9HyAMuwkcf1BK8wIMAm3U+VGctvwqFR P+PwSi5HA6pfwIRZKUKbLkQLHLeWCvuEM9SV9C5gPapos4rtSsQG/+Ed50DCYBzXl9X1 P9EQ== F7L+WPV3V5mxy3jjA8jybhqF1iJ0HvU4RZ5am8jkdwA= Sun, 22 Aug 2021 17:14:42 -0700 (PDT) References: From: Ronnie Day Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 19:14:05 -0500 To: Shop-Talk List Subject: [Shop-talk] Fwd: "portable" AC units Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4323633739098444465== --000000000000631b1e05ca2ee7e8 We've got an LG (I think) in a 14 x 28 building we use as a wood shop. It works pretty well in our fairly humid, recently hot central Texas location. We bought the building pre-built, and it was trucked in. We then had it spray foam insulated, we put 3/8 plywood on the walls and then surface mounted the power. The A/C is only portable insofar as it's not mounted in a window or wall. It's pretty heavy! It's the largest portable that HD offers. The two windows aren't big enough for a big enough window unit, and we didn't want to poke a hole in a wall. As has been mentioned, it exhausts via about an 8 inch corrugated plastic hose maybe 7 feet long to a panel in one of the windows. We're happy with it. We use a couple of big pedestal fans to move air around the rest of the shop. FWIW, RD On Sun, Aug 22, 2021 at 6:26 PM Tim . wrote: > Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? > > My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an > exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? > > thanks > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie.day@gmail.com > > --000000000000631b1e05ca2ee7e8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    We've got an LG (I think) in a 14 x 28 building= =C2=A0we use as a wood shop. It works pretty well in our fairly humid, rece= ntly hot central Texas location. We bought the building pre-built, and it w= as trucked in. We then had it spray foam insulated, we put=C2=A03/8 plywood= on the walls and then surface mounted the power. The A/C is only portable = insofar as it's not mounted in a window or wall. It's pretty heavy!= It's the largest portable that HD offers. The two windows aren't b= ig enough for a big enough window unit, and we didn't want to poke a ho= le in a wall.

    As has been mentioned, it exhausts v= ia about an 8 inch corrugated=C2=A0plastic hose maybe 7 feet long to a pane= l in one of the windows. We're happy with it. We use a couple of big pe= destal fans to move air around the rest of the shop.

    FWIW,
    RD

    On Sun, Aug 22, 2021 at 6:26 PM Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@ou= tlook.com> wrote:
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance?=C2=A0

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
    et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

    alk/ronnie.day@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox= .team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie.day@gmail.com

    --000000000000631b1e05ca2ee7e8-- --===============4323633739098444465== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============4323633739098444465==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Aug 22 19:14:05 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C448A101F for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 19:14:05 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-po-12v.sys.comcast.net (unknown [96.114.154.171]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD5EEA1011 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 19:11:11 -0600 (MDT) Received: from resomta-po-02v.sys.comcast.net ([96.114.154.226]) by resqmta-po-12v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTP id HyLJmT0e9fSZqHyUbmB0Bp; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 01:11:13 +0000 s=20190202a; t=1629681073; bh=7GvGAttuheNLae8d/CC/zfU+uXFWPcaf41z4rcKg5hc=; h=Received:Received:Subject:To:From:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=YJ/ghFG15YOxRn7Jasn1EN1eHvT/bxkwqZYYTCT4C/YDJ+ZzRdFs1oHhN25bIHKzg 4TOoC62lpN8aSqpjm+XQz6BpnzKA4rCe4KNbc8TikEJ8Eg61gL2QexsvNAO7wbK4lT bDDlekqMu7s9M2wyYjM77SWcQegx8t4opvHGWNcGb9J3fVTpDKMpbkILEpT7bVeU/z zWVMYziFdsNGdg6m/ZmogXxDMaY2pDmTOWux44YEoGcX4bIuoEAws6i+5MyPVVb9qS U/YmQb49Ly9J00/7hIlmQF9zaB64Hr2MUL0WKwU0VnYl9IsLL63JcLuIhcGakHlzcu ULq/tW2rlHCWw== Received: from [172.20.1.138] ([66.185.167.231]) by resomta-po-02v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTPA id HyUUm5qyeqUwvHyUUmUcs8; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 01:11:10 +0000 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: From: Bob Spidell Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 18:11:06 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.13.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============0428195989640739028== boundary="------------1EE5B073B4E242B607388D29" Content-Language: en-US This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------1EE5B073B4E242B607388D29 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit When the A/C crapped out in the house we were renting a couple months ago we got a 'portable' unit for the upstairs bedroom. This was a 2-story house and even when we had functional central air the upstairs was always 3-4degF hotter than the downstairs. The portable unit was a little larger than a 13-gal garbage can and did a fair job (this when ambient air was triple digits here in the Central Valley). It had a single duct and an extendable panel to seal it in a semi-open window; honestly, I don't know if it was for fresh air or exhaust (probably exhaust, I think it just recirculated room air). I've seen similar units at Lowes for $300-400. Bob On 8/22/2021 4:23 PM, Tim . wrote: > Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? > > My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an > exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? > > thanks > --------------1EE5B073B4E242B607388D29 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit When the A/C crapped out in the house we were renting a couple months ago we got a 'portable' unit for the upstairs bedroom. This was a 2-story house and even when we had functional central air the upstairs was always 3-4degF hotter than the downstairs. The portable unit was a little larger than a 13-gal garbage can and did a fair job (this when ambient air was triple digits here in the Central Valley). It had a single duct and an extendable panel to seal it in a semi-open window; honestly, I don't know if it was for fresh air or exhaust (probably exhaust, I think it just recirculated room air). I've seen similar units at Lowes for $300-400.

    Bob

    On 8/22/2021 4:23 PM, Tim . wrote:
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? 

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks


    --------------1EE5B073B4E242B607388D29-- --===============0428195989640739028== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============0428195989640739028==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 23 00:39:55 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18547A100B for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 00:39:55 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ej1-f51.google.com (unknown [209.85.218.51]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C162DA1000 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 00:39:03 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-ej1-f51.google.com with SMTP id a25so8030290ejv.6 for ; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:39:05 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=npDfg94GgV7MIG34tIcW2JHyGjQFlDzwRCVqEWM/9uo=; b=H7l4qC5NjVMJp7nHobHOWCQj18Twu/ufV4sSXf8OKeovIsvwcSEK5QdSbcdhEz33eS OaOIxlvzWqfgqBgRfPKFHI7sVBGzaPFlVWsEetT3G/+FTMNFu1dLxswRgPt0zqJq1EDI bpTw4bvqxcQtwYTzMNvgt2jLvO5vIygWFMm7MINmNCUm2SzArT8iS71WrEMOWoxhQaBP bZC4moAJUM3lCwvt8Kmfo88tvdDN7xEurU7AL14KlZ6eR1ve7IZp2I2KOiDpyoeCSrBK CVEU+fX7h9MZdecjeTw574oTWbojBPeTX0tjAFGtsSgJuQjgUgF/ePlcxB9pbr63QrWI thyw== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=npDfg94GgV7MIG34tIcW2JHyGjQFlDzwRCVqEWM/9uo=; b=fJOHQDkj38BMz5pIC++RqKrrYt1J4p0uZVqTEDg1ywJMdEVIf5wYqMT4BRfQai3G/F QLCrvFY6kTUtLNcMl6Go2/hFpZTvjgRDm48pD8k7AGoxmbFmReK/UMCBvTI1fKoAtP9/ hEFFzUfV2BZmY8N9BuYbhO8fRsgyNcnDh3lTiuze0YFK967ih29xp2dz8XZoBnEi9Ufz LnXTx4GKo4TG8OL7Td2Jf7m34CjSlzSzq1pCitQdv2YM1bvhgFYnQQcBKU16mQ/3HO2k qZ4KY9UnfEbkGyPFxm9YrOcWNMkNc9ed/ERLC9tJM/yfzHwgXppAVd4LKpPJqpu0gbxu s+RA== W6pqXnyP64M546dXkNELz26izsXd7FkvprIqEmI= kx21mr33573893ejc.463.1629700745013; Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:39:05 -0700 (PDT) References: From: Shannah Miller Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2021 23:38:55 -0700 To: "Tim ." Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3925446563092667584== --000000000000ff2d5205ca34455c We have this unit: https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B003MQBYYU We've had it since 2015 and it still works great. It vents to the outside. It's cooling the equivalent of a 1 car garage, plus or minus. Even though the structure is brick, it keeps up pretty well. Shannah On Sun, Aug 22, 2021 at 4:26 PM Tim . wrote: > Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? > > My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an > exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? > > thanks > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shannahquilts@gmail.com > > --000000000000ff2d5205ca34455c Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    We have this unit:


    We've had it since= 2015 and it still works great.=C2=A0 It vents
    to the outside.=C2= =A0 It's cooling the equivalent of a 1 car
    garage, plus = or minus.=C2=A0 Even though the structure is
    brick, it keeps up p= retty well.

    Shannah

    On Sun, Aug 22, 2021= at 4:26 PM Tim . <tims= _datsun_stuff@outlook.com> wrote:
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance?=C2=A0

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
    et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

    alk/shannahquilts@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://au= tox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shannahquilts@gmail.com

    --000000000000ff2d5205ca34455c-- --===============3925446563092667584== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============3925446563092667584==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 23 11:14:21 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF30AA10B5 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 11:14:21 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from NAM12-BN8-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (unknown [40.92.21.44]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E25FA1055 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 11:13:16 -0600 (MDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=SIMfDOrVrW+27HCdhsXnxOduGqFwPIsExmhljwOaZZby73bYP4YLAzrl2/QmVquo+7GQnYpCFYdnGvZr/FKKa9aDPEzQhqNFs0E1mBtNpdlZe4C/p+wyTcNuu4IKC8y9oslSiq0jJfog5tzbzVwkEgTTBfkkt9No18q3fzNdzLPQmAJsB6vjz8gjrdSgviYWqrUOA84oZ34DOcdfN1BulJynAkbJVOdH8DrwdcLe9senaPOUJOuQFNa5OzXqeLqJ2/FH3DokxtYtWfeF+r4fSQAjvt9k4smo1k9s+n/z/GklAsAxgoTtOrAc+Oj1EeQz+2U2L3OQbzLxf0DEOLvURA== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=g+5AJg3XogOV8TFf0t1ohvg1MtjGehzjyHCkwVhYXD0=; b=O54FhDN5AGyf8qshlVWD0oEoiizT/U3x0CXFob7HyU7MUsMrJezUpNlI0nJnTpGzAZCBPlWEB5c1KcQYvPv19lwYiy9NTYDCaVUL7JYvzRFjjKEaFbodltk2A6HLDrXgXgP47p+WwT0zTBXz2CKg3p5WXwyBWnMN1WvOzq4IrWnKhKuWg4q85ktAPpGOSl3/7Sp8MHn5En7d3IM+e+F9w5LHt1eP2Nf7oLmFcrys9cQiyzfXfDTUT3NQ9pE/ndbmzuXLNCzikQSFOdNXKHyvZ1xJOjKj3gANFQpTZMglV3GeuEKCq89Ps99Aks1vHZl7/CMPv/hi0OIyB2YW6pcuDw== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=none; dmarc=none; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=g+5AJg3XogOV8TFf0t1ohvg1MtjGehzjyHCkwVhYXD0=; b=uPoYbm3BZ2s5Mci5T7mR3z7UN8sPwwgoXFL/vad/MnAXs3LFjoqpgdb3/+BdvHsQtOANkrIVeuC32T5dJwt3oxydz87E9InlrYm63/9K0J8/idWD9wfHtfcmM1WyIXTgrDOwezZiMg/GKwr3ccgm1v6G/dXwxlWvv1RZLAl3heLxok3qt5qI4xTiWEaxAlWagCddY3dq+P6/0DHdp0u7pYZwGAgc8/tppKEmyOpNVKkvr7v5oIJnyD96zz+OBAv+w9PBYWmhhBciCsz1+fqbBIkiAFCQOcz/ELVcY8QuRd9cP7jwSvRP4L1sQBeFyXDj1K2W6rD7Btphg/a3Rq479Q== Received: from BN8NAM12FT017.eop-nam12.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:fc66::43) by BN8NAM12HT098.eop-nam12.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:fc66::341) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4457.8; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 17:13:17 +0000 Received: from DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:fc66::51) by BN8NAM12FT017.mail.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:fc66::170) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4457.8 via Frontend Transport; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 17:13:17 +0000 Received: from DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::5996:25ff:fb0e:984]) by DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::5996:25ff:fb0e:984%3]) with mapi id 15.20.4436.024; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 17:13:17 +0000 From: "Tim ." To: "Shop Talk" Thread-Topic: "portable" AC units Thread-Index: AQHXl6wy9KVIsLYvr0ydsJgernxLWauBVKJH Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 17:13:17 +0000 References: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-incomingtopheadermarker: OriginalChecksum:816AA4B8D203D69A7388CC7417F2E32443165BCF291B6D924C32BF83595E84D8; UpperCasedChecksum:A836E5781F939250AD3BE9243622359E8B3454195E7C7E0EA52CA9502D880512; SizeAsReceived:6828; Count:44 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [p169c3TX87hR8eB0HQQjUqc0wvRM84Cp] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-incomingheadercount: 44 x-eopattributedmessage: 0 x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 7770e73d-5eb4-462e-5c73-08d966594ce6 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: BN8NAM12HT098: x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: tnnioGyi12QWMYcAgHkXWmoI0+EJ6kqmQKxFIW5vUvwkqcsIWqomNqLAHd/Uzb7U42FuWlR3Ue8MTAFzCIzDd3onf1EyA10TDtZjepxNnHqv/EqMfgJl5uyeTlMZjnUXXIlkkLXsruKilzpBwMAvjE0wBMDNix4+xmlpHKoWjcfJDk8vVMY3IE2ee4mSYlEPzchiZ7XJ6hPUY6i6oic1NUmBZ7iQNJvlOjX/28y3ja1kQxzbC5S49NEzDnTVTout/xQSBNXtE8wqP7On8SE/woRZZKK2nYUdXU0kMulRwk9OyDJD0s+JmdmgybqIAa+LZdeMTp8qmyydCKZlwNXhotZwtUgrtmKSUBF9SBbL737+wOKX2dE6cIA09QJfcBb8ZG2pEuH5zx13v28p/VS9n4B84kYCRmEhTY/VtFzB71jHdTaoiVdzpZpRN9fZ22+t x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-chunkcount: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-0: REP8hbLkxtn3f2G0r22lVWs0/FlEyiTQvywIfYpkCSIonoMLmaQgcIrJEFVvpNLVKeJzr2xAC8lrnUSolBiaCNxtiMITx51wQErWR88BQsrs5njc4tI6YGR9Q2+fkQu0U9t3cCjV7pNd7Y3+PtEnsQ== x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2927105033306311009== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_DS7PR19MB4629A69E083235660337D468B4C49DS7PR19MB4629namp_" --_000_DS7PR19MB4629A69E083235660337D468B4C49DS7PR19MB4629namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks for the replies all. I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I would= have to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder if o= ne of these units would work? ________________________________ From: Shop-talk on behalf of Tim . Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM To: Shop Talk Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? thanks --_000_DS7PR19MB4629A69E083235660337D468B4C49DS7PR19MB4629namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    Thanks for the replies all. 

    I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I would= have to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder if o= ne of these units would work?



    From: Shop-talk <shop-ta= lk-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outl= ook.com>
    Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM
    To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
    Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units
     
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? 

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    --_000_DS7PR19MB4629A69E083235660337D468B4C49DS7PR19MB4629namp_-- --===============2927105033306311009== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2927105033306311009==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 23 11:42:46 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEA5FA0D7A for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 11:42:46 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ot1-f50.google.com (unknown [209.85.210.50]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52D98A0D21 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 11:42:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-ot1-f50.google.com with SMTP id c19-20020a9d6153000000b0051829acbfc7so38396084otk.9 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 10:42:28 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=rb1Xayj4pBi0jqeFiP0vMq9mly90r7Um1f7bza47D3M=; b=PEHncPnnktY/6vwh9mF7WBDD45+5jzq+sr9V6hMGvZSROkF1LN4v7yi8pKXklzUZVg Dm/RnjT0dWR0Wy+yJQhQ0JMinwrJNWPY5A0F18TUketHAVD3nboz5hfBHnuw4x12Zwow phczXig4FYgyFalsaHKSd8AggXAW9pDKfWrzujMKaOES8v1hpi0SE7EEzgdSYAUmCp8P J+Gv7iZYTqYXkfZFABMCcf0Z1yZZVrBMxwcE44acX2DnAgJe6Wq2GEL9L5fZ1hFHewMN tQkMawDiO+Qtc1BbIgcZi+RyW7xvf9ybSKAxe3qYfRePIZamMn581uKukA8gmxNQ78mX grBA== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=rb1Xayj4pBi0jqeFiP0vMq9mly90r7Um1f7bza47D3M=; b=rU27F/Xsa9OYmYghkE1pWnE9hBf4CQg/naxBR3e978l3Jhm+qkTkwCc0GzZ9QDqD4X eR8qBLTmBybJJ1ILISkA/stW8aCcRPasS3ol+/B/5k8HJBJvZDA+ViKtfPNG9QKs0e5h eK1OukIMvtn6jJoYz/qUeYuRJa4Az3+/TbXvics+ov1Kqbh5KRT1BbDWFAWgJV9yLLox bVH33U73d+kd3XHL7j4uF2JLdh6Y/ot6ibK1M8Qs+TKEzK9KmTnXCxaZ1tyrI+FNg8HU Oyvv47g/XmfCm5rOmEzYqJ7xX7n+GPTAJsaSUeDzPkbHz8PK58ChWjEeg9BMlb9aGw1T C1cQ== Yk7gYWeKcXzRqJAfYAPjkR385xwsDyrn9zt+Fw== w3mr28745704otp.49.1629740547842; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 10:42:27 -0700 (PDT) References: From: Ronnie Day Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 12:41:49 -0500 To: "Tim ." Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2635876409830347833== --0000000000006e260505ca3d8a37 Maybe. You'd need to extend the exhaust "hose", which isn't usually recommended but it might work since you'd be venting up. You'd probably need at least one more exhaust hose depending on how high the ceiling is and some way to connect them together. Maybe a length of PVC or something that fits inside the hoses and duct tape or gaffers tape (better) to hold those joints together. Then you'd need to fab a panel to connect the hose end to the dropped ceiling. Does the ceiling use 2 x 4 tiles? If so it should be easy to cut a piece of 3/8 to replace a tile and mount the flange to connect the upper end of the exhaust hose. How large an area is there above the dropped ceiling and is that area limited to the footprint of your office? That hot exhaust air, and it's pretty hot, has to have space to spread out and cool down. Oh, these things aren't real quiet, either. Try to get near one that's running to see if that might bother you after a few minutes. HTH On Mon, Aug 23, 2021 at 12:14 PM Tim . wrote: > Thanks for the replies all. > > I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I > would have to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder > if one of these units would work? > > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Shop-talk on behalf of Tim . < > tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com> > *Sent:* Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM > *To:* Shop Talk > *Subject:* [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units > > Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? > > My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an > exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? > > thanks > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie.day@gmail.com > > --0000000000006e260505ca3d8a37 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    Maybe. You'd need to extend the exhaust "hose&quo= t;, which isn't usually recommended but it might work since you'd b= e venting up. You'd probably need at least one more exhaust hose depend= ing on how high the ceiling is and some way to connect them together. Maybe= a length=C2=A0of PVC or something that fits inside the hoses and duct tape= or gaffers tape (better) to hold those joints together. Then you'd nee= d to fab a panel to connect the hose end to the dropped ceiling. Does the c= eiling use 2 x 4 tiles? If so it should be easy to cut a piece of 3/8 to re= place a tile and mount the flange to connect=C2=A0the upper end of the exha= ust hose. How large an area is there above the dropped ceiling and is that = area limited to the footprint of your office? That hot exhaust air, and it&= #39;s pretty hot, has to have space to spread out and cool down.

    Oh, these things aren't real quiet, either. Try to get near on= e that's running to see if that might bother you after a few minutes.

    HTH

    <= div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Mon, Aug 23, 2021 at 12:14 PM Tim .= <tim= s_datsun_stuff@outlook.com> wrote:
    Thanks=C2=A0for the replies all.=C2=A0

    I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I would= have to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder if o= ne of these units would work?



    From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net= > on behalf of Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com>
    Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM
    To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
    Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units
    =C2=A0
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance?=C2=A0

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
    et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

    alk/ronnie.day@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox= .team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie.day@gmail.com

    --0000000000006e260505ca3d8a37-- --===============2635876409830347833== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2635876409830347833==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 23 11:51:48 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 361EEA0EE9 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 11:51:48 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ms11p00im-qufo17291201.me.com (unknown [17.58.38.41]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CF0AA0E4A for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 11:51:29 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1629741091; bh=v2GYDOylYd3bSl8eRSA8cduH3xIWJqXnIdZzI8mImLA=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=jlA34Ql54WRm61Ld/TAPZRQDPmPig/RSNUEvWFixSkvy8o399bEZha5gd8n8BlR8V vOfv3N1hhOb1LsZx+LJwXUNwjwDmRD1WtMxvynMKWlqAA+5T79i24kYSiH3W8sujg/ U/NQoxvqI8284jylHBepXIg0612s+LmMV+xs/gpNFJIjyI8M1PZT0xZUZmSth0hIKZ TqsHDvnADv2nciYA5qPUS2Csl5W3tDeOmmDkkyHz1IRfvIAM0PHXVsPo5LeDM4Lq4b s7hXdLSZGEfnqxYrXkeS7fvDPBgLkECLPRpbCSK8A7Gq+4T9eS1/DyPBdBGgHHZmVx qMHmXNuYvkupQ== Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by ms11p00im-qufo17291201.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 0E252BC02C5; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 17:51:31 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 12:51:28 -0500 References: To: Ronnie Day =?UTF-8?Q?2903e8d5c8f:6.0.391,18.0.790,17.0.607.475.0000000_definitions?= =?UTF-8?Q?=3D2021-08-23=5F03:2021-08-20=5F03,2021-08-23=5F03,2020-04-07?= =?UTF-8?Q?=5F01_signatures=3D0?= malwarescore=0 spamscore=0 adultscore=0 clxscore=1015 phishscore=0 mlxscore=0 suspectscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2108230122 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============7355064185456358751== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-7085B8C4-7ACB-4712-B8EA-014CBB7D1D95 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable If the area above the ceiling is a return air space, you should be good to g= o. If the space is just a dead air space, it won=E2=80=99t work.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 23, 2021, at 12:43 PM, Ronnie Day wrote: =EF=BB=BF Maybe. You'd need to extend the exhaust "hose", which isn't usually recommen= ded but it might work since you'd be venting up. You'd probably need at leas= t one more exhaust hose depending on how high the ceiling is and some way to= connect them together. Maybe a length of PVC or something that fits inside t= he hoses and duct tape or gaffers tape (better) to hold those joints togethe= r. Then you'd need to fab a panel to connect the hose end to the dropped cei= ling. Does the ceiling use 2 x 4 tiles? If so it should be easy to cut a pie= ce of 3/8 to replace a tile and mount the flange to connect the upper end of= the exhaust hose. How large an area is there above the dropped ceiling and i= s that area limited to the footprint of your office? That hot exhaust air, a= nd it's pretty hot, has to have space to spread out and cool down. Oh, these things aren't real quiet, either. Try to get near one that's runni= ng to see if that might bother you after a few minutes. HTH On Mon, Aug 23, 2021 at 12:14 PM Tim . wrote= : > Thanks for the replies all.=20 >=20 > I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I woul= d have to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder if o= ne of these units would work? >=20 >=20 >=20 > From: Shop-talk on behalf of Tim . > Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM > To: Shop Talk > Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units > =20 > Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance?=20 >=20 > My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exh= aust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? >=20 > thanks > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arc= hive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie= .day@gmail.com >=20 _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com --Apple-Mail-7085B8C4-7ACB-4712-B8EA-014CBB7D1D95 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable If the area above the ceiling is a return a= ir space, you should be good to go. If the space is just a dead air space, i= t won=E2=80=99t work. 

    Peace,
    Pat

    <= div dir=3D"ltr">Pat Horne 
    We support Habitat for Humanity


    On Aug 23, 2021, at 12:43 PM, Ronnie D= ay <ronnie.day@gmail.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BF=
    Maybe. You'd need to extend the exhaust "hose", which isn't= usually recommended but it might work since you'd be venting up. You'd prob= ably need at least one more exhaust hose depending on how high the ceiling i= s and some way to connect them together. Maybe a length of PVC or somet= hing that fits inside the hoses and duct tape or gaffers tape (better) to ho= ld those joints together. Then you'd need to fab a panel to connect the hose= end to the dropped ceiling. Does the ceiling use 2 x 4 tiles? If so it shou= ld be easy to cut a piece of 3/8 to replace a tile and mount the flange to c= onnect the upper end of the exhaust hose. How large an area is there ab= ove the dropped ceiling and is that area limited to the footprint of your of= fice? That hot exhaust air, and it's pretty hot, has to have space to spread= out and cool down.

    Oh, these things aren't real quiet, e= ither. Try to get near one that's running to see if that might bother you af= ter a few minutes.

    HTH

    On Mon, Aug 23, 2021= at 12:14 PM Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com> wrote:
    Thanks for the replies all. 

    I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I would h= ave to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder if one o= f these units would work?



    From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net&g= t; on behalf of Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com>
    Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM
    To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
    Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units
     
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? 

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exhau= st "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@auto= x.team.net
    t=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://= autox.team.net/archive

    lk/ronnie.day@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.t= eam.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie.day@gmail.com

    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.= net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.tea= m.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://au= tox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@icloud.com

    = --Apple-Mail-7085B8C4-7ACB-4712-B8EA-014CBB7D1D95-- --===============7355064185456358751== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============7355064185456358751==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 23 13:57:41 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA574A0D58 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 13:57:41 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from st43p00im-zteg10072001.me.com (unknown [17.58.63.167]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 910DCA0507 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 13:57:20 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1629748642; bh=UlG2IFM3Jxe1LnSBsOQdvWybGwB3KPtGrAQS6SyVCl4=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=TUDFWSj4DKBohrAb0Ry0BvkpUkeZJd3iApq1qwit6hR5oL2+k0SS1y3ry4WnRdgmf ad2ZqT/Wlh1nFaVQVjQXtTQHvGcAmShMzDbuRdEgkGhZXaQMQgKTcfh9yH1kJM3x3b /HHxfb8hQAe9z6NFPq3HbHUjsTYzST3DG82SIme+NL93Q552QeAnbGGBKetN1asJAZ cVcSGjR2K/Ljlgde+MBXghX0qbPo2ojjo1tfbDIPARlwbCxajIKihOCZjzyE7yDgvj vMm2BHf2FjPEcvHCMQC0aklNaOswrx8jGOd89WzZA+jl09+DvxnQNQlj3sgwIUDJrR svnmrsrcwEkug== Received: from smtpclient.apple (211.sub-174-198-2.myvzw.com [174.198.2.211]) by st43p00im-zteg10072001.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id E61FFC0701; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 19:57:21 +0000 (UTC) From: Thomas Coradeschi Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 15:57:20 -0400 References: To: "Tim ." definitions=2021-08-23_04:2021-08-23, 2021-08-23 signatures=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-2009150000 definitions=main-2108230137 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============1373595219641849919== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-F05DEE4F-CD74-457B-8147-F84361CED933 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable My son bought one (Army barracks in Europe don=E2=80=99t have A/C) and it se= ems to work well for him. I assume you are talking about a true A/C unit and= not a swamp cooler. I can=E2=80=99t imagine efficiencies are very good, bu= t for occasional use=E2=80=A6 Tom Coradeschi tjcora@icloud.com > On Aug 22, 2021, at 7:26 PM, Tim . wrote: >=20 > =EF=BB=BF > Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance?=20 >=20 > My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exh= aust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? >=20 > thanks > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arc= hive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjcora= @icloud.com >=20 --Apple-Mail-F05DEE4F-CD74-457B-8147-F84361CED933 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable My son bought one (Army barracks in Europe d= on=E2=80=99t have A/C) and it seems to work well for him. I assume you are t= alking about a true A/C unit and not a swamp cooler. I can=E2=80=99t imagine= efficiencies are very good,  but for occasional use=E2=80=A6


    Tom Coradeschi
    tjcora@icloud.com

    On Aug 22, 2021, at 7:26 PM= , Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BF
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? 

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exhau= st "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.= net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.tea= m.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://au= tox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tjcora@icloud.com

    = --Apple-Mail-F05DEE4F-CD74-457B-8147-F84361CED933-- --===============1373595219641849919== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============1373595219641849919==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 23 14:51:45 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43F6BA04F1 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 14:51:45 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ed1-f49.google.com (unknown [209.85.208.49]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C46FA0BEC for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 14:46:53 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-ed1-f49.google.com with SMTP id q3so28199331edt.5 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 13:46:55 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=m0IqqgM7c6fLJTa85GFM9wVsIGxkKa49b2N9FapgwJs=; b=cdg0foes+Z+vv6i5AUYlBVjVnXMvckVIby+/NTjTigjRqG9rXhbC99hhoKNN4OlbBc TbfUPlxUPU0jhs3IikeXdVxKgYRUfIjvt683krbPh9FHTYw0IvufmROAgSwzuWSSW30Q vJ0xoEoZf47pqyAf/uoSQanvrvnHecpi6YINU9sEIRAEZcVu8XBQYP/fZv1BYKLmeA5W xQBwdywzuKTdK6J+XojFDrhoe6abnvRmNOkgU8olLxoU1VcWdcwcbqYaoJ6yRGy/58VY 4JB8HFuGvRxJD18DFlNBbp3+zBZDlB5oBM1udggsr7EhVugGof/xd77WQIW29GF2p0nI cE/g== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=m0IqqgM7c6fLJTa85GFM9wVsIGxkKa49b2N9FapgwJs=; b=Qhnxg5ad1aIMCgwa2ljBr07lz9NQWi7/Bdo3N1NDrmuf11p88MBjFD0EIZS4IEeoq3 8gHV6D2fYJyUcIacyD4fI7k6+izurUdiCug9TiLQPUAM1D4xx/o5iW4vr083ytTWYNPG kFbXZ70xgMbYoYWt5Wgvv2yi7cmvoS03U6bhzb6vL3YH+w/vfMSUr7r6wO+dBPmd1XYb RavORqf91+QG7TzGsxHU5IGz88iNZZZNH5DJL2rjlUG2bJkSCbqVj1kcnpV/96oahL+q Hvz407TJ+s/bDC/v21K+1xr3Z+diW33oURRoCM1Db9YiyTGitJlBZDKM1D2SmHAjgPf3 qdGg== uH6aY6kkAfScY4PJHwMXjhkHYQMFizR4ABABt2M= i16mr11589637edx.129.1629751614486; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 13:46:54 -0700 (PDT) References: From: Shannah Miller Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 13:46:43 -0700 To: "Tim ." Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5827710439020273113== --0000000000000dbc3505ca401e1e Ronnie has a good point - the one we have really is noisy. Also, I don't think that an exhaust that long will be good for the machine. What about a mini-split so you could put the noisy part outside? Shannah On Mon, Aug 23, 2021 at 10:14 AM Tim . wrote: > Thanks for the replies all. > > I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I > would have to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder > if one of these units would work? > > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Shop-talk on behalf of Tim . < > tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com> > *Sent:* Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM > *To:* Shop Talk > *Subject:* [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units > > Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? > > My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an > exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? > > thanks > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shannahquilts@gmail.com > > --0000000000000dbc3505ca401e1e Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    Ronnie has a good point - the one we have really is n= oisy.
    Also, I don't think that an exhaust that long will be g= ood for
    the machine.

    What about a mi= ni-split so you could put the noisy part
    outside?

    <= /div>
    Shannah

    On Mon, Aug 23, 2021 at 10:14 AM Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com> wrote:
    Thanks=C2=A0for the replies all.=C2=A0

    I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I would= have to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder if o= ne of these units would work?



    From= : Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . = <tims= _datsun_stuff@outlook.com>
    Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM
    To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
    Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units
    =C2=A0
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance?=C2=A0

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
    et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

    alk/shannahquilts@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://au= tox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shannahquilts@gmail.com

    --0000000000000dbc3505ca401e1e-- --===============5827710439020273113== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============5827710439020273113==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 23 17:24:06 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2768A1180 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 17:24:06 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from NAM11-DM6-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (unknown [40.92.19.56]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8679AA0F79 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 17:23:19 -0600 (MDT) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=Sz/mRmfJmulS7wfypIsaMNRQI8EOYD7k4E6YePvenvWw1SO/UVOaJ4cIEW65gMo7qoTIa+QrmU16n6HZ2JO+DZ/dghe1f2OCBA6oz4mfPcE3kGbknrqBayhzbSk1dbaLr8f0MQLwUu/U/F6QnsBhGRrEtLmxcPmc6tGMiGtDWZp48W5b4UTR8NrPWrfxFKPfQv0i3Ob1MxQkkmUdt2G61y8b9BijjMqnpuKj7C969IznjssbS9Mj5eGNqUx0KnG0CnmM4IY4uJr2mKnLs8Ht74nQ5TYEwqxcaHdUxPniXo61TmUCxCmzqJgutFjhmL0rgnEIJ8vlkS+j6yOYz6m2ZA== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=microsoft.com; s=arcselector9901; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=lcabwjSVQPnRI+TKc6hbsavPy8MjXwJr2MSIDNg+WZA=; b=HJxmBQWqcB7uq73SizTSNcCoxYcIdJZdGi8a4OJPO4+n4GdhAKIdcLnHGY/RiTUTQ79MiZ3qNwHJZquPKU47zkeHAKIcJGXztXj5H0pZXjCp1fjTAlS0/ciwTfLG1DevNvj4JOWaoX+c3Su6wixhOR9HHVuBilrO+ieY5vsqDt5P/aynWoVTaUtU5lpZ+WOg/9ppZAXQ6mDJ03iOzP3au9VCISDmN/DMc1FE6dTL/3uDFNvQnNNSU2jaK+ObfBBGO/5JVFLAO01KhguyB0OkU3mTWNcRBMlZ3V+lp78Db6hav+CN98We9SgU6gyugrvKK2Cqqei6FeiRM2a+p6zGFg== ARC-Authentication-Results: i=1; mx.microsoft.com 1; spf=none; dmarc=none; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=lcabwjSVQPnRI+TKc6hbsavPy8MjXwJr2MSIDNg+WZA=; b=DOvvfaI5haAZML1GMwQLM+cQI+ompIjfyz67B7CABd7YYW72BBCO1Q7jAAaBq/i3/nQYwc+L/M7d0Uomj50QzDQZaLOvQu9xtHjEJ6Hp3iBYzpIUPtTsZq2KspUGFk9/cY+F8ZxU40MxX5LFQ7NF5TYzWoMI12XMDB45FlidNiPngQNn/HpLB8MiFfeyY0rPLXmU0PCz/wN4vWgZ4/AGYLnCw5pT5k6cFJRwFg/8e/WWrLCP4+X+4MF4DB/PuBPGXuKKOSYsQWdppveUlJ40W7iB86Cu9hiPS7ZqsOwRug7syPQkFmPTU1LVtRvrlBB//yMVMTvH5l0ysug9foVZwQ== Received: from DM6NAM11FT034.eop-nam11.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:fc4d::53) by DM6NAM11HT088.eop-nam11.prod.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:fc4d::424) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4436.19; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 23:23:21 +0000 Received: from DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:fc4d::46) by DM6NAM11FT034.mail.protection.outlook.com (2a01:111:e400:fc4d::303) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.4436.19 via Frontend Transport; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 23:23:21 +0000 Received: from DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::5996:25ff:fb0e:984]) by DS7PR19MB4629.namprd19.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::5996:25ff:fb0e:984%3]) with mapi id 15.20.4436.024; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 23:23:21 +0000 From: "Tim ." To: "Shop Talk" Thread-Topic: "portable" AC units Thread-Index: AQHXl6wy9KVIsLYvr0ydsJgernxLWauBVKJHgABnlTI= Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 23:23:21 +0000 References: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-incomingtopheadermarker: OriginalChecksum:3C3F66203E147BE4A284B3E978BB1B75C70E5A0B05506A05CBF1A2BEA2D5DA37; UpperCasedChecksum:97E62207A765C53F2C965F3EC13FAB07050178BF97F43DE373F1F466A67A0883; SizeAsReceived:7089; Count:44 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [kwsUsznA5/dMLtytPNXqTuUsTFD/zK+R3zSYHud9gBY28lCvFFA1Wlp8+WMUTnqX] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-incomingheadercount: 44 x-eopattributedmessage: 0 x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 57d9625d-dcc8-4393-14eb-08d9668cff25 x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: DM6NAM11HT088: x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: vhlQ24udR05+BMJeMavT8wxdvYXTecn67zALL1hBr65b/kddGrm45RFI5UjyCI5/T7ekOSjCfXkrAjbZkSnhkLFVMlnNp7uuRP7cHNQQtCtOKOqhDnzJ6M4CsFKWLGGTFyiavE0JHe33RxNA8iSpRX7F5EOc2vdVxrmq2QW7y2hjXrBKEtZ+vOh2CmwSbwijqBp+C34r74+wzckSYED03DiWZWgrn53rv68mqUq+njE8Lirbf9UOjMVfWviny4LftMeSyOm2onBgtOgxX9yvZyVR94DulIhyliJqyk6nTyDsbOJ5f2QR2N78MpYakFRadQqUvYSLfe4zZeOHQF8b2wBdaDXrz/irQP+Z9sussN57QSfxWdDQkAnUTcophemMGXIR5rSXk/qXIVz9MjaeK5HZOhIpERG1hN2K27VMv1v0Fg7rqwvcrNNVDbpTEh1o x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-chunkcount: 1 x-ms-exchange-antispam-messagedata-0: /2+AOMb/36cY/0U7KFVD1hlnvv08qziJFmP68pk2h9w3ia3Y3hQjf72K6Z7JNh2FWUHAyVjjT5o/1/3aTySEFtsT6FyTVPCPUzBm8gt62GEjBCgFmCP1+tBS0H8dpz6SLHQhcj+bdZwCnxxkoh5k0Z8aRCMSKGYBjb8gZSK+AbyU4mGQAXk9Q835flDU1RMYnl4+vi71GP2reKK+plBJ/g== x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5623869104471339189== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_DS7PR19MB4629B9BD2256C5180CA468E9B4C49DS7PR19MB4629namp_" --_000_DS7PR19MB4629B9BD2256C5180CA468E9B4C49DS7PR19MB4629namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I think the noise will be the deal killer. If they hear it I will loose it.= (confiscated) thanks again all ________________________________ From: Shop-talk on behalf of Tim . Sent: Monday, August 23, 2021 12:13 PM To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Thanks for the replies all. I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I would= have to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder if o= ne of these units would work? ________________________________ From: Shop-talk on behalf of Tim . Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM To: Shop Talk Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? thanks --_000_DS7PR19MB4629B9BD2256C5180CA468E9B4C49DS7PR19MB4629namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    I think the noise will be the deal killer. If they hear it I will loose it.= (confiscated)
    thanks again all
    From: Shop-talk <shop-ta= lk-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outl= ook.com>
    Sent: Monday, August 23, 2021 12:13 PM
    To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
    Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units
     
    Thanks for the replies all. 

    I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I would= have to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder if o= ne of these units would work?



    From: Shop-talk <shop-= talk-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@ou= tlook.com>
    Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM
    To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
    Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units
     
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? 

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    --_000_DS7PR19MB4629B9BD2256C5180CA468E9B4C49DS7PR19MB4629namp_-- --===============5623869104471339189== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============5623869104471339189==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 23 17:36:27 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A668A1198 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 17:36:27 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ms11p00im-qufo17292001.me.com (unknown [17.58.38.49]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F2B7A0528 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 17:35:47 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1629761749; bh=mCz/yktV4uLEDewgMIkU/4ssdUa+UXfYxAzHTZsFWmo=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=L051+7e8c45DU7phA51svJJA26Wi2NeWGTxFUxtwsE96htmNELZ7NrJcP4dbQHImY C0/QweChywaedd9xTxMe351Mdj9Wbv0cRW08Q+Ye0UKngWGTaAoQ4ZjlLp5gluvOs2 /GDn/Y2It7OJKFVNVImYsRXatF1d+H8kOSGzGHqHYGPidh6cPcvxhr7rjP+83J/ald qgz+I495w3LlcOF2NAn/S+dDb7HYmDCv0iR2mCk54QEeV0EGAypktOCjEyuCisCyU1 SVRAZPj85SC/AH7egRYxLr8yyfWcoRcfu/stJVReYbzIB1gFnNno4THU0RG+ag+sFV IPC1oRJMJ724Q== Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by ms11p00im-qufo17292001.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 61E10140260; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 23:35:49 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 18:35:47 -0500 References: To: "Tim ." =?UTF-8?Q?2903e8d5c8f:6.0.391,18.0.790,17.0.607.475.0000000_definitions?= =?UTF-8?Q?=3D2021-08-23=5F04:2021-08-20=5F03,2021-08-23=5F04,2020-04-07?= =?UTF-8?Q?=5F01_signatures=3D0?= mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 suspectscore=0 malwarescore=0 bulkscore=0 phishscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2108230159 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============7897257665691881784== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-C027645B-F666-4312-BFE4-58465D945FCD charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Time for plan B How about a cool vest? Check out www.cool shirt.com. You could build your o= wn with an ice chest, small water pump, some tubing to put in the ice, conne= ct the pump the vest. =20 Probably cheaper than an AC too! Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity On Aug 23, 2021, at 6:24 PM, Tim . wrote: =EF=BB=BF I think the noise will be the deal killer. If they hear it I will loose it. (= confiscated) thanks again all From: Shop-talk on behalf of Tim . Sent: Monday, August 23, 2021 12:13 PM To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units =20 Thanks for the replies all.=20 I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I would h= ave to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder if one o= f these units would work? From: Shop-talk on behalf of Tim . Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM To: Shop Talk Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units =20 Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance?=20 My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exhau= st "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? thanks _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com --Apple-Mail-C027645B-F666-4312-BFE4-58465D945FCD charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Time for plan B

    How abou= t a cool vest?  Check out www.cool shirt.com. You could build your own w= ith an ice chest, small water pump, some tubing to put in the ice, connect t= he pump the vest.  

    Probably cheaper than an A= C too!

    Peace,
    Pat

    Pat Horne 
    We support Habitat for Humanity


    On Aug 23, 2021, at 6:24 PM, Tim . <tims_dat= sun_stuff@outlook.com> wrote:

    =EF=BB=BF
    I think the noise will be the deal killer. If they hear it I will loose it. (= confiscated)
    thanks again all
    From: Shop-talk <shop-talk= -bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook= .com>
    Sent: Monday, August 23, 2021 12:13 PM
    To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
    Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units
     
    Thanks for the replies all. 

    I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I would h= ave to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder if one o= f these units would work?



    From: Shop-talk <shop-ta= lk-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outlo= ok.com>
    Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM
    To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
    Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units
     
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? 

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exhau= st "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.= net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.tea= m.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://au= tox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@icloud.com

    = --Apple-Mail-C027645B-F666-4312-BFE4-58465D945FCD-- --===============7897257665691881784== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============7897257665691881784==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 23 17:45:42 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 673CAA11A1 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 17:45:42 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qt1-f181.google.com (unknown [209.85.160.181]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD026A1198 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 17:45:22 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-qt1-f181.google.com with SMTP id l3so15328446qtk.10 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 16:45:25 -0700 (PDT) h=from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc:to :references; bh=fG5PA6a4ywZU+wmq944m0uZnGXqWSrHEijg6M1jIFh0=; b=V17ElJDWMoHydNX6Dur/LT27mIcEGKkb7dKCODoWARfyddgVvcXTiGKmMUsOkwc40W gcyZH03clvk0YxXBlZaL23MRpCTE4IYEUteWAQVlzWzb5WJcckjASkgGVvgDezywEEjv zaPSvs2Ci/fTPjhMcBDac2es3JUu5YR4wrD+BJe00dbdGdZiRX1LPtTXmKxGmngYBstb DJ8qhIqUeEmLnVcWId5AIiHsPUGC0xL/d6mgLo2UebU+qPdbgtus58NjU8IUIM+PVJGZ BHmRKhmdlYJjkBZ3KtCIsgs9q5dzCWlko7xYCRKYI8qHXTUnvjsDO75gXCp4r827btDD e0cA== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date :in-reply-to:cc:to:references; bh=fG5PA6a4ywZU+wmq944m0uZnGXqWSrHEijg6M1jIFh0=; b=tIL78skLT/gGJTSAJlTPl2iVH1YmqspD9yGdJ+NqqzhbrMv6n6X6dovzsEGAdz69vT yTKmEUfq9Yat0M+WEYoLm8Tj9C0FDtrMaYB9Q1nDbtOiUx8dkt6ExKLl9hXCGlrEOEBK b6pBt6WFaLvzEcZF3y3ESw90xQEuGwbEsmS5nWyHrMXP2NELGp6rsHTtkE/6TLowqgMC TiNQvs3+lNfMO7ufCSfgt0qwy1QKYK280W4IRWVOXcHltmn7j0N/b/SZ9LZV6PoAkE+X s5a2A44E5/s6U15smN6cFfjpeJKsJXpqdbAsI6J3pFoqP+lQ5IPCgQO5Sl1E3VGTQGqc HSIA== nnlXOKvv8eAlSlDoneogRn4= f9mr32180688qte.24.1629762324553; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 16:45:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from macbook-pro-2.lan (ool-4350ed26.dyn.optonline.net. [67.80.237.38]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id q11sm9346070qkm.56.2021.08.23.16.45.23 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 23 Aug 2021 16:45:24 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 19:45:23 -0400 To: "Tim ." References: Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============7290581768026926537== boundary="Apple-Mail=_899791A8-DF63-492D-97F7-3CAD5B872EE0" --Apple-Mail=_899791A8-DF63-492D-97F7-3CAD5B872EE0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Tim: I don=E2=80=99t know if this will help your situation at all, but = years ago I had an office that was at the very end of the HVAC run and = had very poor air circulation. In the winter, I would sit at my desk = freezing and then stand up and find it was 10 degrees warmer near my = head. I assume the exact opposite would have happened in the summer. = The office had just been renovated and the contractor stopped by one day = to check things out. I talked to him about my office and he returned = the next day with a new ceiling vent with a built in ceiling fan. It = looked a lot like a small ceiling fan but it was air powered. The = blades turned slowly when the system was blowing hot or cold air and did = nothing the rest of the time. I was very skeptical of it as an = effective solution, but it actually did the trick. It provided enough = air circulation that the office was comfortable in all seasons. I have = never seen another like it and just tried unsuccessfully to find one = online, but maybe someone else will know the proper search terms. Jim > On Aug 23, 2021, at 7:23 PM, Tim . = wrote: >=20 > I think the noise will be the deal killer. If they hear it I will = loose it. (confiscated) > thanks again all > From: Shop-talk Sent: Monday, August 23, 2021 12:13 PM > To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units > =20 > Thanks for the replies all.=20 >=20 > I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I = would have to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I = wonder if one of these units would work? >=20 >=20 >=20 > From: Shop-talk Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM > To: Shop Talk Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units > =20 > Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance?=20 >=20 > My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an = exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? >=20 > thanks > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html = > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive = >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine@gmail.com = --Apple-Mail=_899791A8-DF63-492D-97F7-3CAD5B872EE0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Tim: = I don=E2=80=99t know if this will help your situation at all, but years = ago I had an office that was at the very end of the HVAC run and had = very poor air circulation.  In the winter, I would sit at my desk = freezing and then stand up and find it was 10 degrees warmer near my = head.  I assume the exact opposite would have happened in the = summer.  The office had just been renovated and the contractor = stopped by one day to check things out.  I talked to him about my = office and he returned the next day with a new ceiling vent with a built = in ceiling fan.  It looked a lot like a small ceiling fan but it = was air powered.  The blades turned slowly when the system was = blowing hot or cold air and did nothing the rest of the time.  I = was very skeptical of it as an effective solution, but it actually did = the trick.  It provided enough air circulation that the office was = comfortable in all seasons.  I have never seen another like it and = just tried unsuccessfully to find one online, but maybe someone else = will know the proper search terms.

    Jim

    On Aug = 23, 2021, at 7:23 PM, Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com> wrote:

    I think the noise will be the deal killer. = If they hear it I will loose it. (confiscated)
    thanks again = all
    From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . = <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com>
    Sent: Monday, August 23, 2021 = 12:13 PM
    To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
    Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" = AC units
     
    Thanks for the replies = all. 

    I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at = work. I would have to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop = ceiling. I wonder if one of these units would work?



    From: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . = <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com>
    Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 = 6:23 PM
    To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
    Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC = units
     
    Does anyone here have any experience with = said appliance? 

    My main wonder is where does = the exhaust go? Does these things have an exhaust "port" that I can hook = a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
    Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Suggested annual donation  $12.96
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine@gmai= l.com

    = --Apple-Mail=_899791A8-DF63-492D-97F7-3CAD5B872EE0-- --===============7290581768026926537== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============7290581768026926537==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 23 19:59:28 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C866BA11B3 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 19:59:28 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-oo1-f49.google.com (unknown [209.85.161.49]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0828AA0B71 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 19:59:01 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-oo1-f49.google.com with SMTP id v20-20020a4a2554000000b0028f8cc17378so2329972ooe.0 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 18:59:04 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=LOMkFCrqZFpjBVIsh/UT+LzqUy30OnVmr/VfXkZ2I9k=; b=EC1UTp0vi9WrkTeVyDhRQDBMhNjpCdy5CXootksZ2o8T8rU2IxF6pBgIYPKdM5EVVb vXPf6/V0Jv/TOIlOlV9pSFZXFHnCc999c3LtFe0+P7xud860bZc9djokGMRWk1twsdoK XhfpyC11oVkU9aPwJGh1tY4lhPFpbGWcqNgP3Wr8wWJ/H1ERO2pWzS2AIiJzZphH8Blo t0hGSUHRXnc0oJWJw6PGbGY2Hh5ITjjsVdSBFiTPFGe9B1DlacVOyg3Y3ZzU/gBox2WO ry1N7vA3GKaT0jGWeWd/Y5cH5PjnQe59Wh4xdnps7CRMsNo6fwabl59LzLPQti8MGpNF /VCg== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=LOMkFCrqZFpjBVIsh/UT+LzqUy30OnVmr/VfXkZ2I9k=; b=HoOyJkfhDaaVlnRauXWd3UMeVjZ5iD6/otkLDa5Uwc3qS3F8PnDlAAa2g8jBAiKOmx dxZr+77SAmOf5hHsVXY2uGsPb6JDUtscdSuSWhzVxT405/5W4E9F9WJAHUXaTZCpb2uT jM4HdSQTBT580cgtJBpBRO8RnCIUKajiRAz6eYwgbHZZp2c+1ERXpVd71/BAY5kFg2cH ozgWw+jEvBSEHmpxOhwbGibAvdxHWrIl2WWnpJWmvxI+1S0upmtjTV6hLdqloMRwcoyJ LiiGc330QYrMgo/Y+ay7aWUUuOXjprFoRCAFVW1tTA9Qeh3TI+MAYHZ6ibofXJtUleId FiKA== XnB2SYDOtb8ro3TfRmfb1jgy/JOev4oH8UjcaA== Mon, 23 Aug 2021 18:59:03 -0700 (PDT) References: From: Ronnie Day Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 20:59:23 -0500 To: "Tim ." , Shop-Talk List Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6033796327182219859== --00000000000065687b05ca447a2e And I just remembered our draws quite a bit of current, at least 12 amps. That could easily be a problem. On Mon, Aug 23, 2021 at 6:24 PM Tim . wrote: > I think the noise will be the deal killer. If they hear it I will loose > it. (confiscated) > thanks again all > ------------------------------ > *From:* Shop-talk on behalf of Tim . < > tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com> > *Sent:* Monday, August 23, 2021 12:13 PM > *To:* Shop Talk > *Subject:* Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units > > Thanks for the replies all. > > I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I > would have to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder > if one of these units would work? > > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Shop-talk on behalf of Tim . < > tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com> > *Sent:* Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM > *To:* Shop Talk > *Subject:* [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units > > Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? > > My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an > exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? > > thanks > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie.day@gmail.com > > --00000000000065687b05ca447a2e Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    And I just remembered our draws quite a bit of current, at= least 12 amps. That could easily be a problem.

    On Mon, Aug 23, 2021 at 6:24= PM Tim . <tims_datsun_= stuff@outlook.com> wrote:
    I think the noise will be the deal killer. If they hear it I will loose it.= (confiscated)
    thanks=C2=A0again all
    From= : Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . = <tims= _datsun_stuff@outlook.com>
    Sent: Monday, August 23, 2021 12:13 PM
    To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
    Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units
    =C2=A0
    Thanks=C2=A0for the replies all.=C2=A0

    I want to get something for my office (that has no window) at work. I would= have to run the exhaust vent up into/above the drop ceiling. I wonder if o= ne of these units would work?



    Fr= om: Shop-talk <shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim = . <ti= ms_datsun_stuff@outlook.com>
    Sent: Sunday, August 22, 2021 6:23 PM
    To: Shop Talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
    Subject: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units
    =C2=A0
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance?=C2=A0

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exha= ust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
    et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

    alk/ronnie.day@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox= .team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/ronnie.day@gmail.com

    --00000000000065687b05ca447a2e-- --===============6033796327182219859== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6033796327182219859==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Aug 24 00:10:02 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCB97A0F28 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 00:10:02 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta-101a.oxsus-vadesecure.net (unknown [51.81.61.60]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E0BBA0EF3 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 00:03:13 -0600 (MDT) BHWV4=; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=earthlink.net; h=from:reply-to:subject: date:to:cc:resent-date:resent-from:resent-to:resent-cc:in-reply-to: references:list-id:list-help:list-unsubscribe:list-subscribe:list-post: list-owner:list-archive; q=dns/txt; s=dk12062016; t=1629784995; x=1630389795; b=gku3taFPM0u+rI50oFw8Vjywc9A36gj680erBzGXNPAwI+42jgScEUc y6LEEsbRLUNi1dopyDXQHpO0GoGVoMhBCpVkQQn5HjxAqXi63reoypIyrpSR2BLqAlsFp// 7ioMdvA9YAYuyT4jvkqQrJ6MVpTESF2NfKUvMM5hQpeEYYbckP2YHWHNMSwV1cKjI5Y0Wrq ZpeN4r1dSzKj/VouDQYoskZYhw/omuaGKovT6XWz67w6w/8nl9Kv1qjS8uihyjMUQro2ixj T96ONoD109PuEz5oHwpexTF6rkbzHIO5T5hzro4skittHxTcHJfVuv9JRHFee7jQmnK8Pst Cig== Received: from [192.168.1.241] ([99.9.152.26]) by smtp.oxsus-vadesecure.net ESMTP oxsus1nmtao01p with ngmta id 4616faae-169e28d179edb0cd; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 06:03:15 +0000 To: "Tim ." , Shop Talk References: From: Brian Kemp Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 23:03:15 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.13.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============2284425888387932497== boundary="------------7E80CD67DCB86CCF4CD71B6A" Content-Language: en-US This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------7E80CD67DCB86CCF4CD71B6A Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I bought a single duct portable AC for a bedroom that had a sliding window in a house without AC.  The duct is similar to a dryer exhaust and can be permanently mounted in the wall like a dryer or bathroom exhaust vent.  This unit had a 4" duct. Too loud to use while sleeping.  The single duct exhausted the conditioned room air outside like a powerful exhaust fan. In a network closet at work they installed a better unit with 8" supply and return ducts and a condensate pump.  It is even louder to the point that you can't have a conversation nearby, but does keep the room at 65 deg.  This unit is installed with both ducts going to a bracket that mounts in the suspended ceiling.  They had to get a plumber to run a drain line for the condensate pump.  An electrician also had to install a dedicated 20A circuit. I'd encourage other solutions.  Had problems with no air in my office and finally got a facilities guy to take a look.  It turns out they ran some big conduit for lots of network cables and the supply duct was in the way, so they just disconnected it and the duct was blowing cold air above the ceiling.  The guy moved the supply grill to a different ceiling grid location and reconnected the duct.  Maybe you can get this lucky.  Most offices also have a baffle or damper to balance air flow.  Maybe yours is shut because the previous person found it too cold. I've also seen people take a box fan and use some coat hanger wire to attach it to the ceiling return grid to serve as an exhaust fan, removing hot air from the office. Brian On 8/22/2021 4:23 PM, Tim . wrote: > Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? > > My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an > exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? > > thanks > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bk13@earthlink.net > --------------7E80CD67DCB86CCF4CD71B6A Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I bought a single duct portable AC for a bedroom that had a sliding window in a house without AC.  The duct is similar to a dryer exhaust and can be permanently mounted in the wall like a dryer or bathroom exhaust vent.  This unit had a 4" duct.

    Too loud to use while sleeping.  The single duct exhausted the conditioned room air outside like a powerful exhaust fan.

    In a network closet at work they installed a better unit with 8" supply and return ducts and a condensate pump.  It is even louder to the point that you can't have a conversation nearby, but does keep the room at 65 deg.  This unit is installed with both ducts going to a bracket that mounts in the suspended ceiling.  They had to get a plumber to run a drain line for the condensate pump.  An electrician also had to install a dedicated 20A circuit.

    I'd encourage other solutions.  Had problems with no air in my office and finally got a facilities guy to take a look.  It turns out they ran some big conduit for lots of network cables and the supply duct was in the way, so they just disconnected it and the duct was blowing cold air above the ceiling.  The guy moved the supply grill to a different ceiling grid location and reconnected the duct.  Maybe you can get this lucky.  Most offices also have a baffle or damper to balance air flow.  Maybe yours is shut because the previous person found it too cold.

    I've also seen people take a box fan and use some coat hanger wire to attach it to the ceiling return grid to serve as an exhaust fan, removing hot air from the office.

    Brian

    On 8/22/2021 4:23 PM, Tim . wrote:
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? 

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever?

    thanks

    _______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

    --------------7E80CD67DCB86CCF4CD71B6A-- --===============2284425888387932497== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2284425888387932497==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Aug 26 09:28:26 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40D0CA0D99 for ; Thu, 26 Aug 2021 09:28:26 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-lj1-f179.google.com (unknown [209.85.208.179]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE95CA0C23 for ; Thu, 26 Aug 2021 09:25:57 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-lj1-f179.google.com with SMTP id y6so5884825lje.2 for ; Thu, 26 Aug 2021 08:26:00 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=7WV3bWA0qSvjiggOGmLP4TbZyj1A3t0Q1a1M9XMdzk0=; b=bmOlQmWpYQ5iZIkmJTzjksLMFAxD/uVlHERcEyZCSOzDgIieEFULNyYOm+d//DwNP8 YKiIUSJ5/egJ0iMsH4x/B3w84tpExWVOW3WoNB2m0RA0LA+pDwYsn14wgoV9mDN8oWLa U38kFHosD/+a6ZBc+47pJgx9BEQSV98WzQUfDW9Gn2fZEXVDPPcIYOwYm8DM0rmnMtwx mAucYwEdi+Y6jcT1ZZNnH4nx87W6zpaaI8fhfTsRAm7Q9VuN3LkFS4UREQKl2wTQ3OiZ ZeOJW78gdWbnpHUJ2kQW5YkgaeL35UpOENXCrJ41UyMxtHfIQ/jzcS8WLz9ZAowGAJX8 Se4w== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=7WV3bWA0qSvjiggOGmLP4TbZyj1A3t0Q1a1M9XMdzk0=; b=gUI/wBC6M8BrDwZNfWmwoBI0rue09qI1KmeJI0j3iKaJNvbZJs5lRZxD0AJ1zwbfhr 6yqY4HLt7qSeCmzgzFmkTDxbO5qHButbZ/BT9I3bRb2G7BWPykKDaslBKe4zvpRwuGXO vCaBGOrkr9qR1ZlBQtb/H8YMycVZP+tz8GI2oplBUcO/0VtqLKel8E1atUvC1I7NtupQ 9V7m68a2IKmv+i+VkZLt/MTgNZA6/gnL6gZf0ebUV7QB9PSZZSbyCanFMaf/ALT4z9Zv 4fQs3fB+xP5SYWEGyA6F2WY4v+yibIOgFFMbvp1btO9EryM083hbZCRi2+7lAwifwc/E kL1Q== phBNuirOIftIjSUp2sJMo0gZJX9UUc8w8O5+JOwgGH6XaH8= h8mr3515626ljh.160.1629991558868; Thu, 26 Aug 2021 08:25:58 -0700 (PDT) References: <3764b999-e00f-0520-0c32-bf7defe6a354@earthlink.net> From: Peter Murray Date: Thu, 26 Aug 2021 11:25:42 -0400 To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8162708845350373037== --000000000000da733605ca77fbb4 I have a fair amount of experience with these sorts of units. As has been mentioned earlier, they're pretty noisy, and not terribly efficient. Simpler units have just a single output hose and a condensate tank/pump. Slightly less simple units will send that moisture out via the hot exhaust. Fundamentally, there are two inputs and two outputs - evaporator in/out, which absorbs heat from the conditioned space and outputs cool air, and the compressor in/out, which takes outside (unconditioned space) air and exhausts the heat from the compressor coil. Most simpler units combine the compressor and evaporator intake - which leads to negative air pressure in the conditioned space (because all intake air comes from the conditioned space), and outside (unconditioned) air leaks in through any available aperture (or the room approaches a vacuum), and therein is a big source of inefficiency. If your office has forced-air ventilation, but just doesn't have enough airflow, perhaps a duct booster blower like this would help? https://www.homedepot.com/p/VENTS-US-162-CFM-Dryer-Booster-Fan-with-4-in-Duct-VENTS-VK-100-PS/206398496 Of course, if your office is pretty dry while hot, you could employ some evaporative cooling. -Peter On Tue, Aug 24, 2021 at 2:10 AM Brian Kemp wrote: > I bought a single duct portable AC for a bedroom that had a sliding window > in a house without AC. The duct is similar to a dryer exhaust and can be > permanently mounted in the wall like a dryer or bathroom exhaust vent. > This unit had a 4" duct. > > Too loud to use while sleeping. The single duct exhausted the conditioned > room air outside like a powerful exhaust fan. > > In a network closet at work they installed a better unit with 8" supply > and return ducts and a condensate pump. It is even louder to the point > that you can't have a conversation nearby, but does keep the room at 65 > deg. This unit is installed with both ducts going to a bracket that mounts > in the suspended ceiling. They had to get a plumber to run a drain line > for the condensate pump. An electrician also had to install a dedicated > 20A circuit. > > I'd encourage other solutions. Had problems with no air in my office and > finally got a facilities guy to take a look. It turns out they ran some > big conduit for lots of network cables and the supply duct was in the way, > so they just disconnected it and the duct was blowing cold air above the > ceiling. The guy moved the supply grill to a different ceiling grid > location and reconnected the duct. Maybe you can get this lucky. Most > offices also have a baffle or damper to balance air flow. Maybe yours is > shut because the previous person found it too cold. > > I've also seen people take a box fan and use some coat hanger wire to > attach it to the ceiling return grid to serve as an exhaust fan, removing > hot air from the office. > > Brian > > On 8/22/2021 4:23 PM, Tim . wrote: > > Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance? > > My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an > exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? > > thanks > > _______________________________________________ > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bk13@earthlink.net > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/peterwmurray@gmail.com > > --000000000000da733605ca77fbb4 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    I have a fair amount of experience with these sorts of uni= ts. As has been mentioned earlier, they're pretty noisy, and not terrib= ly efficient.=C2=A0

    Simpler units have just a single out= put hose and a condensate tank/pump. Slightly less simple units will send t= hat moisture out via the hot exhaust.

    Fundamentall= y, there are two inputs and two outputs - evaporator in/out, which absorbs = heat from the conditioned space and outputs cool air, and the compressor in= /out, which takes outside (unconditioned space) air and exhausts the heat f= rom the compressor coil.

    Most simpler units combin= e the compressor and evaporator intake - which leads to negative air pressu= re in the conditioned space (because all intake air comes from the conditio= ned space), and outside (unconditioned) air leaks in through any available = aperture=C2=A0(or the room approaches a vacuum), and therein is a big sourc= e of inefficiency.

    If your office has forced-air v= entilation, but just doesn't have enough airflow, perhaps a duct booste= r blower like this would help?


    Of course, if your office is pretty dry while hot, you could emplo= y some evaporative cooling.

    -Peter

    =
    On Tue, Au= g 24, 2021 at 2:10 AM Brian Kemp <bk13@earthlink.net> wrote:
    =20 =20 =20
    I bought a single duct portable AC for a bedroom that had a sliding window in a house without AC.=C2=A0 The duct is similar to a dryer exhaust and can be permanently mounted in the wall like a dryer or bathroom exhaust vent.=C2=A0 This unit had a 4" duct.

    Too loud to use while sleeping.=C2=A0 The single duct exhausted the conditioned room air outside like a powerful exhaust fan.

    In a network closet at work they installed a better unit with 8" supply and return ducts and a condensate pump.=C2=A0 It is even louder = to the point that you can't have a conversation nearby, but does keep the room at 65 deg.=C2=A0 This unit is installed with both ducts going = to a bracket that mounts in the suspended ceiling.=C2=A0 They had to get a plumber to run a drain line for the condensate pump.=C2=A0 An electrici= an also had to install a dedicated 20A circuit.

    I'd encourage other solutions.=C2=A0 Had problems with no air in my office and finally got a facilities guy to take a look.=C2=A0 It turns out they ran some big conduit for lots of network cables and the supply duct was in the way, so they just disconnected it and the duct was blowing cold air above the ceiling.=C2=A0 The guy moved the supply grill to a different ceiling grid location and reconnected the duct.=C2=A0 Maybe you can get this lucky.=C2=A0 Most offices also h= ave a baffle or damper to balance air flow.=C2=A0 Maybe yours is shut because the previous person found it too cold.

    I've also seen people take a box fan and use some coat hanger wire to attach it to the ceiling return grid to serve as an exhaust fan, removing hot air from the office.

    Brian

    On 8/22/2021 4:23 PM, Tim . wrote:
    =20 =20
    Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance?=C2=A0

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and r= un it where ever?

    thanks

    _______________________________________________

Shop-talk@aut=
ox.team.net
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alk/bk13@earthlink.net" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/opt=
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    Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
    et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
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    alk/peterwmurray@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://aut= ox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/peterwmurray@gmail.com

    --000000000000da733605ca77fbb4-- --===============8162708845350373037== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8162708845350373037==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Aug 28 16:31:58 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55260A0C2E for ; Sat, 28 Aug 2021 16:31:58 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qv1-f46.google.com (unknown [209.85.219.46]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 055E6A0BD7 for ; Sat, 28 Aug 2021 16:31:12 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-qv1-f46.google.com with SMTP id s16so4381665qvt.13 for ; Sat, 28 Aug 2021 15:31:15 -0700 (PDT) h=from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:cc:to :references; bh=EsRgNW6RO1c+RIDFUmuGdUmtmgJHpGziGXKNzPjFUWE=; b=UzVDBdBtyv2si46HkBmhchCzZCVMLJKdMDb0PCDpLnlgA6SxHv5HgN8fFADjI7wBOY Gqiabib2F5S4NKUI/P2XDHdLBt/wZnz0FjEtExSIrywHphBRZDalwqztO9fbP8QHB3Ky QegynEnYJmb7U2ey4QgxxiclFlO13Gk9VQug58buUbzOy4NE+5LvAXdku07La2tMWY16 finGJrn1A+qWzvoCFxXQS6YkAlocoXQr6Qi9/DTM5icYNyBlfvtgiyO0knPsD8X3uCkf ytJcTecnLeUMWXdG7Dq1PbPloBDEnyfU2xlxFur2hVRjY45bYCZvPadgPcb0egp6+V/E rl6g== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:message-id:mime-version:subject:date :in-reply-to:cc:to:references; bh=EsRgNW6RO1c+RIDFUmuGdUmtmgJHpGziGXKNzPjFUWE=; b=RhOQ6bsw9XuI+77Mfq76j+ToWQwbX3G/jykS/gBT3tUBOgXiukyI3iWTiqEDmalRI/ zwLFDA/X7cR7xBxLj3WsMuRqoLwjQqzponPfP//YTJntYAgATD8FyTpfPX9YyTEGAtAb pY7Y2KgtQme2i4EXSp3yiLX5jO5v+Wk/X/yxAdc84rD1Pwp5CxPP1CQXYuRI6Plyq/sH YvUXmp+PLOxg9nYI77tFJ7PAwGDPOAHLWLasz0TF2Fs0KZi7E9piY8s7AetECToKflYX yRPso7i5z7IOpZhxEjG33DvI2lbW8O+gg6jUsXYM1lWJe09oKaW48+HJTBYJYY/lZ9T1 JHWw== PDBbMAskFUMsOhpOwJrGJRYSauXkrv3DUQ== Sat, 28 Aug 2021 15:31:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from jims-air.lan (ool-4350ed26.dyn.optonline.net. [67.80.237.38]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id g11sm5681264qtk.50.2021.08.28.15.31.14 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-ECDSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 28 Aug 2021 15:31:14 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> Date: Sat, 28 Aug 2021 18:31:13 -0400 To: "Tim ." References: Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] "portable" AC units Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============0550861759322986689== boundary="Apple-Mail=_20B4C47D-923A-4EDC-95A0-B7069143AAE4" --Apple-Mail=_20B4C47D-923A-4EDC-95A0-B7069143AAE4 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Just saw this in Popular Mechanics. They didn=E2=80=99t appear to test = the noise levels, but they did mention that the LG "impressed us with = its ability to quickly and quietly cool an area while drawing as little = current as possible=E2=80=A6=E2=80=9D. In theory, that might work for = you.=20 = https://www.popularmechanics.com/home/g3066/best-portable-air-conditioners= /?source=3Dnl&utm_campaign=3Dnl24855514&utm_medium=3Demail&utm_source=3Dnl= _pop&utm_term=3DAAA%20--%20High%20Minus%20Dormant%20and%2090%20Day%20Non%2= 0Openers > On Aug 22, 2021, at 7:23 PM, Tim . = wrote: >=20 > Does anyone here have any experience with said appliance?=20 >=20 > My main wonder is where does the exhaust go? Does these things have an = exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up to and run it where ever? >=20 > thanks > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html = > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive = >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine@gmail.com = --Apple-Mail=_20B4C47D-923A-4EDC-95A0-B7069143AAE4 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Just = saw this in Popular Mechanics.  They didn=E2=80=99t appear to test = the noise levels, but they did mention that the LG "impressed us with = its ability to quickly and quietly cool an area while drawing as little = current as possible=E2=80=A6=E2=80=9D. In theory, that might work for = you. 

    https://www.popularmechanics.com/home/g3066/best-portable-air-c= onditioners/?source=3Dnl&utm_campaign=3Dnl24855514&utm_medium=3Dem= ail&utm_source=3Dnl_pop&utm_term=3DAAA%20--%20High%20Minus%20Dorma= nt%20and%2090%20Day%20Non%20Openers

    On Aug = 22, 2021, at 7:23 PM, Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com> = wrote:

    Does anyone here have any experience with = said appliance? 

    My main wonder is where does the exhaust = go? Does these things have an exhaust "port" that I can hook a hose up = to and run it where ever?

    thanks
    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@autox.team.net
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    = --Apple-Mail=_20B4C47D-923A-4EDC-95A0-B7069143AAE4-- --===============0550861759322986689== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============0550861759322986689==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 30 10:46:16 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A62D7A0A9F for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 10:46:16 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com (unknown [64.136.55.36]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 6C4BBA0A8B for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 10:45:30 -0600 (MDT) t=1630341931; bh=47DEQpj8HBSa+/TImW+5JCeuQeRkm5NMpJWZG3hSuFU=; l=0; h=From:Date:To:Subject:Message-Id:Content-Type; b=O3EK19gP/5M599kju1j27sUSKx5juRG+o6KBQmoiLli0PJlfMpXdeTLpCgVJbnOLj b6vUSvfw8Fl8IiTwp8LEElybdkVxuxJ7/Q0OU7RmlqSC+6ridhVoDt1JdVz6YEPCCr kHnGJZ/9S9w+//5pA7V5ePXMEz6MuDNkJw+16Lcw= Received: from outbound-mail.vgs.untd.com (webmail05.vgs.untd.com [10.181.12.145]) by smtpout02.vgs.untd.com with SMTP id AABSU4C2GAKZC4YA for (sender ); Mon, 30 Aug 2021 09:44:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [173.16.81.166] by webmail05.vgs.untd.com with HTTP: Mon, 30 Aug 2021 16:43:44 GMT From: "Matt" Full-Name: "Matt" Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2021 16:43:44 GMT To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [Shop-talk] Lighting question Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net OK, so it is kitchen lighting but it is where I make my sandwiches that I e= at in the SHOP! I have a 2 x2 surface mount fixture with 2 T12 bent tube fluorescents. Work= s fine but occasionally you have to flip the switch multiple times to get i= t on. I thought probably a bad switch but it is on a dual switch and it is= intermittent on both�. Two bad switches or maybe a ballast going ba= d? I was semi surprised to find that the bulbs are still available for $10 eac= h. An electronic ballast isn=92t much more so I can completely replace the= guts for $30. Before I do, should I upgrade to T8, T5 or even LED? I cou= ld easily fit an 18 inch round or square led panel into the existing fixtur= e. Any thoughts? _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive utox.team.net From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 30 10:50:11 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F61BA0CB8 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 10:50:11 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-oo1-f49.google.com (unknown [209.85.161.49]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEF53A07A7 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 10:49:42 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-oo1-f49.google.com with SMTP id g4-20020a4ab044000000b002900bf3b03fso3769024oon.1 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 09:49:45 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=gb2FmNHc9iM+ctAdIAqi1KrcbxJZGLIzn0AHN7QgtXs=; b=LsDwzf9ZT6FYHTFFQIE2d4sgPWiUefhn+TvRF06v4e7zoVNrrv/AB7k88EtQmKXLtI b/b3mfBginjh79eqzw8CAPp/QpygwImJrZJPMkkDpgAgDUSu/CGdqzo40ANOQwlqtsrI Y3xz0kbg/8R/6tL9yGuk3oR2qOigvDKaC2ynsNYDJTCuOVCFPneFhrx0TQQYBo4Ysjdu 3zUZ1XFzMd2bWbS+rmqQx8xQZTzSKAiJ945ZFyMQCjxiQDNJ512REFbpyS7CLyRnBCGw VQpG1bJjuUnPHJgSPjaLj5z947+9fJu834QG60pBOBwrZwlH2Jz4PQvI79Hs4zZiXTX0 CcWw== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=gb2FmNHc9iM+ctAdIAqi1KrcbxJZGLIzn0AHN7QgtXs=; b=PJbVARpH1nbD2N1YLwNZI8b7uy71nzwjsGR9nTOYK2oSspsHLRUbrZgHMRfjWe8hSC l4vGvnTn/OChcBNP4aqU+5qqauoMvk3blP5Ent/98w4tskpyYCDPsujxHFApYOCmUz2G c1owFhtPxyg6pbVDEIo8cIBMao/3PGjcA6G+9+lujZENM5/UC28uDeb7BQX0qvYwLP99 +fV4Ep1wGZIJtv+kkK1+5vZ3y3bIlLUwnNYOGxV5dq4AGh0ceQulU8U+eKxnCaBrFsLT Qcfcum8P+viZzJPLdtiQzfqB4amVdcuB2YSepObexQuFj65av59gdjNmLW6OaDZF4em5 BD6Q== IpTmCxvCsaTqXI8woi9YgUcdj1RW4dsgRxZlVUA= Mon, 30 Aug 2021 09:49:44 -0700 (PDT) References: <20210830.124344.5142.0@webmail05.vgs.untd.com> From: John Innis Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2021 11:49:33 -0500 To: Matt Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Lighting question Cc: shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============1051408064541247725== --000000000000cb165e05cac99e4b Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'd be tempted to go LED, but beware a lot of the square LED fixtures use a different approach to dimming. If you want dimming capability, this might matter to you. If not, Just go for it. 2x2 LED's designed for drop ceilings are pretty cheap and can be had a variety of different outputs and color temperatures. On Mon, Aug 30, 2021 at 11:46 AM Matt wrote: > OK, so it is kitchen lighting but it is where I make my sandwiches that I > eat in the SHOP! > > I have a 2 x2 surface mount fixture with 2 T12 bent tube fluorescents. > Works fine but occasionally you have to flip the switch multiple times to > get it on. I thought probably a bad switch but it is on a dual switch an= d > it is intermittent on both�. Two bad switches or maybe a ballast > going bad? > > I was semi surprised to find that the bulbs are still available for $10 > each. An electronic ballast isn=E2=80=99t much more so I can completely = replace > the guts for $30. Before I do, should I upgrade to T8, T5 or even LED? = I > could easily fit an 18 inch round or square led panel into the existing > fixture. > > Any thoughts? > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis@gmail.com > > --=20 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D Never offend people with style when you =3D =3D can offend with substance --- Sam Brown =3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D --000000000000cb165e05cac99e4b Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    I'd be tempted to go LED, but beware a lot of the squa= re LED fixtures use a different approach to dimming.=C2=A0 If you want dimm= ing capability, this might matter to you.=C2=A0 If not, Just go for it.=C2= =A0 2x2 LED's designed for drop ceilings are pretty cheap=C2=A0 and can= be had a variety of different outputs and color temperatures.
    On Mon, A= ug 30, 2021 at 11:46 AM Matt <mbarre@= juno.com> wrote:
    OK, so it is kitchen lighting but it is where I make my sandwiches = that I eat in the SHOP!

    I have a 2 x2 surface mount fixture with 2 T12 bent tube fluorescents. Work= s fine but occasionally you have to flip the switch multiple times to get i= t on.=C2=A0 I thought probably a bad switch but it is on a dual switch and = it is intermittent on both&#65533;. Two bad switches or maybe a ballast= going bad?

    I was semi surprised to find that the bulbs are still available for $10 eac= h.=C2=A0 An electronic ballast isn=E2=80=99t much more so I can completely = replace the guts for $30.=C2=A0 Before I do, should I upgrade to T8, T5 or = even LED?=C2=A0 I could easily fit an 18 inch round or square led panel int= o the existing fixture.

    Any thoughts?
    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
    et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

    alk/jdinnis@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.te= am.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jdinnis@gmail.com



    --
    =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
    =3D Never offend people with = style when you=C2=A0=C2=A0 =3D
    =3D can offend with substance --- Sam Bro= wn=C2=A0 =3D
    =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
    --000000000000cb165e05cac99e4b-- --===============1051408064541247725== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============1051408064541247725==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 30 10:51:08 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 281D6A0D2A for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 10:51:08 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ms11p00im-qufo17292001.me.com (unknown [17.58.38.49]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5862DA0D13 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 10:50:14 -0600 (MDT) s=1a1hai; t=1630342216; bh=otCk0cY2qhC7WffG2ow7zp0gzVDl8lXBGgqNCTZG98U=; h=Content-Type:From:Mime-Version:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=q8opJ8pEiAdvrQl/cVKUgna1qq306T/bmO7hEXNdKkZws2dXYzlrAJ5ZG9kwPUdLb 1RxbdRpp+FSY+XyzGs544khKQL8Ni3ISaipHIWrgO/jUt3RVro02nJgbOq4XYk+RrE 19YMfykPwiaQQutnafbKOw9WClQDnO002bUQVd6H+mofmyRBZTNwI4tZTKTiLRy46Z nDM7O0HxVDvnXTGWt0d346+veYvLKxSe/qwyHxpc/bjnnemNMUQRNT/ZRrqzZ3Axng LUDrr2YfVYNOk9LhCmaOm5Ae253ZJKwWydmK7SCz/LBwOpyPtaYAHPnWsQb5EW4QFO 5PuijbrCVReZQ== Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [199.38.189.252]) by ms11p00im-qufo17292001.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 742A5140336; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 16:50:16 +0000 (UTC) From: Pat Horne Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2021 11:50:14 -0500 References: <20210830.124344.5142.0@webmail05.vgs.untd.com> To: Matt =?UTF-8?Q?2903e8d5c8f:6.0.391,18.0.790,17.0.607.475.0000000_definitions?= =?UTF-8?Q?=3D2021-08-30=5F04:2021-08-27=5F01,2021-08-30=5F04,2020-04-07?= =?UTF-8?Q?=5F01_signatures=3D0?= malwarescore=0 adultscore=0 bulkscore=0 suspectscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 spamscore=0 phishscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2108300115 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Lighting question Cc: shop-talk@autox.team.net Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net TWFrZSBzdXJlIHRoZSBmaXh0dXJlIGlzIGdyb3VuZGVkLiBJZiBpdCBpc27igJl0LCBpdCBjYW4g Y2F1c2UgdGhpcyBzeW1wdG9tLiAKClBlYWNlLApQYXQKClBhdCBIb3JuZSAKV2Ugc3VwcG9ydCBI YWJpdGF0IGZvciBIdW1hbml0eQoKCk9uIEF1ZyAzMCwgMjAyMSwgYXQgMTE6NDYgQU0sIE1hdHQg PG1iYXJyZUBqdW5vLmNvbT4gd3JvdGU6Cgrvu79PSywgc28gaXQgaXMga2l0Y2hlbiBsaWdodGlu ZyBidXQgaXQgaXMgd2hlcmUgSSBtYWtlIG15IHNhbmR3aWNoZXMgdGhhdCBJIGVhdCBpbiB0aGUg U0hPUCEKCkkgaGF2ZSBhIDIgeDIgc3VyZmFjZSBtb3VudCBmaXh0dXJlIHdpdGggMiBUMTIgYmVu dCB0dWJlIGZsdW9yZXNjZW50cy4gV29ya3MgZmluZSBidXQgb2NjYXNpb25hbGx5IHlvdSBoYXZl IHRvIGZsaXAgdGhlIHN3aXRjaCBtdWx0aXBsZSB0aW1lcyB0byBnZXQgaXQgb24uICBJIHRob3Vn aHQgcHJvYmFibHkgYSBiYWQgc3dpdGNoIGJ1dCBpdCBpcyBvbiBhIGR1YWwgc3dpdGNoIGFuZCBp dCBpcyBpbnRlcm1pdHRlbnQgb24gYm90aCYjNjU1MzM7LiBUd28gYmFkIHN3aXRjaGVzIG9yIG1h eWJlIGEgYmFsbGFzdCBnb2luZyBiYWQ/CgpJIHdhcyBzZW1pIHN1cnByaXNlZCB0byBmaW5kIHRo YXQgdGhlIGJ1bGJzIGFyZSBzdGlsbCBhdmFpbGFibGUgZm9yICQxMCBlYWNoLiAgQW4gZWxlY3Ry b25pYyBiYWxsYXN0IGlzbuKAmXQgbXVjaCBtb3JlIHNvIEkgY2FuIGNvbXBsZXRlbHkgcmVwbGFj ZSB0aGUgZ3V0cyBmb3IgJDMwLiAgQmVmb3JlIEkgZG8sIHNob3VsZCBJIHVwZ3JhZGUgdG8gVDgs IFQ1IG9yIGV2ZW4gTEVEPyAgSSBjb3VsZCBlYXNpbHkgZml0IGFuIDE4IGluY2ggcm91bmQgb3Ig c3F1YXJlIGxlZCBwYW5lbCBpbnRvIHRoZSBleGlzdGluZyBmaXh0dXJlLgoKQW55IHRob3VnaHRz PwpfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXwoKU2hvcC10 YWxrQGF1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0CkRvbmF0ZTogaHR0cDovL3d3dy50ZWFtLm5ldC9kb25hdGUuaHRt bApTdWdnZXN0ZWQgYW5udWFsIGRvbmF0aW9uICAkMTIuOTYKQXJjaGl2ZTogaHR0cDovL3d3dy50 ZWFtLm5ldC9waXBlcm1haWwvc2hvcC10YWxrIGh0dHA6Ly9hdXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldC9hcmNoaXZl CgpVbnN1YnNjcmliZS9NYW5hZ2U6IGh0dHA6Ly9hdXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldC9tYWlsbWFuL29wdGlv bnMvc2hvcC10YWxrL3BhdGludGV4YXNAaWNsb3VkLmNvbQoKX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18KClNob3AtdGFsa0BhdXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldApEb25h dGU6IGh0dHA6Ly93d3cudGVhbS5uZXQvZG9uYXRlLmh0bWwKU3VnZ2VzdGVkIGFubnVhbCBkb25h dGlvbiAgJDEyLjk2CkFyY2hpdmU6IGh0dHA6Ly93d3cudGVhbS5uZXQvcGlwZXJtYWlsL3Nob3At dGFsayBodHRwOi8vYXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQvYXJjaGl2ZQoKVW5zdWJzY3JpYmUvTWFuYWdlOiBo dHRwOi8vYXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQvbWFpbG1hbi9vcHRpb25zL3Nob3AtdGFsay9taGFyY0BhdXRv eC50ZWFtLm5ldAoK From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 30 10:52:02 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B41BBA0A9E for ; 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bh=RgUhjnXtIYNo1WYxrJVyL8EoVJIEUKaLvScq8npNuLE=; b=ddznRt0ZzE1BKjL0PZufZlKnFtSdUVAU3x1PwHWY2yLAQvJQJmVpgu+BxO/xK6gdMf mlu7hjEq92UfyWmw8zi3iciyMQjJZY82TJNM5x6NZ78RPaG38JvtHA4E4+kLFAsMVq0f JOWuXdPtEsLiDgwI+fpieOQHwHgA1l2yIn8PRPn5kPSjZC3rHqwbRR+Wu81gnKUA8Fgx UwSWcwdJ95nnMUXhrpzSes5Ps2N4WlgHZpl848SUHmU7tsxNjLnTdZhV6bJexeJZPfT4 aQM3O04Z6z4QKFkKxHviEsUhXSo9MTAbC8DIiidaKzlZzu05K7HzC+PK46bOD1SqJzBB WRLQ== ypztHgutislI6iSW/YOqhzBWbXept/QOiYV2Kj59bVcR 20mr22207579ljq.164.1630342253565; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 09:50:53 -0700 (PDT) References: <20210830.124344.5142.0@webmail05.vgs.untd.com> From: Jeff Scarbrough Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2021 12:50:42 -0400 To: Matt Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Lighting question Cc: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net SWYgeW91IGNhbiBmaXQgYW4gTEVEIGZpeHR1cmUgaW4gdGhlcmUsIEkgZG9uJ3QnIHNlZSBhbnkg cmVhc29uIG5vdCB0by4KCk9uIE1vbiwgQXVnIDMwLCAyMDIxIGF0IDEyOjQ2IFBNIE1hdHQgPG1i YXJyZUBqdW5vLmNvbT4gd3JvdGU6Cj4KPiBPSywgc28gaXQgaXMga2l0Y2hlbiBsaWdodGluZyBi dXQgaXQgaXMgd2hlcmUgSSBtYWtlIG15IHNhbmR3aWNoZXMgdGhhdCBJIGVhdCBpbiB0aGUgU0hP UCEKPgo+IEkgaGF2ZSBhIDIgeDIgc3VyZmFjZSBtb3VudCBmaXh0dXJlIHdpdGggMiBUMTIgYmVu dCB0dWJlIGZsdW9yZXNjZW50cy4gV29ya3MgZmluZSBidXQgb2NjYXNpb25hbGx5IHlvdSBoYXZl IHRvIGZsaXAgdGhlIHN3aXRjaCBtdWx0aXBsZSB0aW1lcyB0byBnZXQgaXQgb24uICBJIHRob3Vn aHQgcHJvYmFibHkgYSBiYWQgc3dpdGNoIGJ1dCBpdCBpcyBvbiBhIGR1YWwgc3dpdGNoIGFuZCBp dCBpcyBpbnRlcm1pdHRlbnQgb24gYm90aCYjNjU1MzM7LiBUd28gYmFkIHN3aXRjaGVzIG9yIG1h eWJlIGEgYmFsbGFzdCBnb2luZyBiYWQ/Cj4KPiBJIHdhcyBzZW1pIHN1cnByaXNlZCB0byBmaW5k IHRoYXQgdGhlIGJ1bGJzIGFyZSBzdGlsbCBhdmFpbGFibGUgZm9yICQxMCBlYWNoLiAgQW4gZWxl Y3Ryb25pYyBiYWxsYXN0IGlzbuKAmXQgbXVjaCBtb3JlIHNvIEkgY2FuIGNvbXBsZXRlbHkgcmVw bGFjZSB0aGUgZ3V0cyBmb3IgJDMwLiAgQmVmb3JlIEkgZG8sIHNob3VsZCBJIHVwZ3JhZGUgdG8g VDgsIFQ1IG9yIGV2ZW4gTEVEPyAgSSBjb3VsZCBlYXNpbHkgZml0IGFuIDE4IGluY2ggcm91bmQg b3Igc3F1YXJlIGxlZCBwYW5lbCBpbnRvIHRoZSBleGlzdGluZyBmaXh0dXJlLgo+Cj4gQW55IHRo b3VnaHRzPwo+IF9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f Cj4KPiBTaG9wLXRhbGtAYXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQKPiBEb25hdGU6IGh0dHA6Ly93d3cudGVhbS5u ZXQvZG9uYXRlLmh0bWwKPiBTdWdnZXN0ZWQgYW5udWFsIGRvbmF0aW9uICAkMTIuOTYKPiBBcmNo aXZlOiBodHRwOi8vd3d3LnRlYW0ubmV0L3BpcGVybWFpbC9zaG9wLXRhbGsgaHR0cDovL2F1dG94 LnRlYW0ubmV0L2FyY2hpdmUKPgo+IFVuc3Vic2NyaWJlL01hbmFnZTogaHR0cDovL2F1dG94LnRl YW0ubmV0L21haWxtYW4vb3B0aW9ucy9zaG9wLXRhbGsvZmlzaHBsYXRlQGdtYWlsLmNvbQo+Cl9f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fCgpTaG9wLXRhbGtA YXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQKRG9uYXRlOiBodHRwOi8vd3d3LnRlYW0ubmV0L2RvbmF0ZS5odG1sClN1 Z2dlc3RlZCBhbm51YWwgZG9uYXRpb24gICQxMi45NgpBcmNoaXZlOiBodHRwOi8vd3d3LnRlYW0u bmV0L3BpcGVybWFpbC9zaG9wLXRhbGsgaHR0cDovL2F1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0L2FyY2hpdmUKClVu c3Vic2NyaWJlL01hbmFnZTogaHR0cDovL2F1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0L21haWxtYW4vb3B0aW9ucy9z aG9wLXRhbGsvbWhhcmNAYXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQKCg== From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 30 12:00:25 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 041D9A108A for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 12:00:25 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from chumdrop.sackheads.org (unknown [159.203.76.21]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55E6EA1071 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 11:59:43 -0600 (MDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by chumdrop.sackheads.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0F7F14FE59 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 13:59:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from chumdrop.sackheads.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (chumdrop.sackheads.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fkLGoawjPVtQ for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 13:59:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: from [10.0.1.4] (cpe-96-28-86-122.kya.res.rr.com [96.28.86.122]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jimmie@sackheads.org) by chumdrop.sackheads.org (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9AFEA14FD72 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 13:59:45 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2021 13:59:45 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:91.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/91.0.2 Content-Language: en-US To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <20210830.124344.5142.0@webmail05.vgs.untd.com> From: Jimmie Mayfield Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Lighting question Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net QmVmb3JlIHlvdSBzcGVuZCB0b28gbXVjaCBtb25leSByZXRyb2ZpdHRpbmcgdGhhdCBmaXh0dXJl LCBoYXZlIHlvdSAKY29uc2lkZXJlZCBpbnN0YWxsaW5nIHNvbWUgTEVEIHRyYWNrLWxpZ2h0aW5n IGluIGl0cyBwbGFjZT/CoCBJIGhhZCBvbmUgCm9mIHRob3NlIGR1YWwtVSBmbHVvcmVzY2VudCBm aXh0dXJlcyBpbiB0aGUga2l0Y2hlbiB3aGVuIEkgbW92ZWQgaW4uwqAgCkNvdWxkIG5ldmVyIGdl dCBzaGFkb3ctZnJlZSBsaWdodGluZyBvbiB0aGUgY291bnRlcnMgd2hlbiBJIHdhcyAKd29ya2lu Zy7CoCBXb3VuZCB1cCBpbnN0YWxsaW5nIHNvbWUgZ2VuZXJpYyB0cmFjayBpbiBhbiAiTCIgc2hh cGUgYW5kIApib3VnaHQgOCBQQVIzMCBMRUQgZml4dHVyZXMuwqAgVG90YWwgb3V0bGF5IHdhcyBh Ym91dCAkMTUwIGJ1dCBub3cgSSBoYXZlIAphcm91bmQgOTAwMCBsdW1lbnMgaW4gdGhlIGtpdGNo ZW4gYW5kIHRoZSBsaWdodCBpcyB3aGVyZSBJIG5lZWQgaXQuwqAgRm9yIAphIHdoaWxlLCBJIGhh ZCBiZXR0ZXIgbGlnaHRpbmcgaW4gdGhlIGtpdGNoZW4gdGhhbiBJIGhhZCBpbiBteSBnYXJhZ2Uh CgoKT24gOC8zMC8yMSAxMjo0MywgTWF0dCB3cm90ZToKPiBPSywgc28gaXQgaXMga2l0Y2hlbiBs aWdodGluZyBidXQgaXQgaXMgd2hlcmUgSSBtYWtlIG15IHNhbmR3aWNoZXMgdGhhdCBJIGVhdCBp biB0aGUgU0hPUCEKPgo+IEkgaGF2ZSBhIDIgeDIgc3VyZmFjZSBtb3VudCBmaXh0dXJlIHdpdGgg MiBUMTIgYmVudCB0dWJlIGZsdW9yZXNjZW50cy4gV29ya3MgZmluZSBidXQgb2NjYXNpb25hbGx5 IHlvdSBoYXZlIHRvIGZsaXAgdGhlIHN3aXRjaCBtdWx0aXBsZSB0aW1lcyB0byBnZXQgaXQgb24u ICBJIHRob3VnaHQgcHJvYmFibHkgYSBiYWQgc3dpdGNoIGJ1dCBpdCBpcyBvbiBhIGR1YWwgc3dp dGNoIGFuZCBpdCBpcyBpbnRlcm1pdHRlbnQgb24gYm90aCYjNjU1MzM7LiBUd28gYmFkIHN3aXRj aGVzIG9yIG1heWJlIGEgYmFsbGFzdCBnb2luZyBiYWQ/Cj4KPiBJIHdhcyBzZW1pIHN1cnByaXNl ZCB0byBmaW5kIHRoYXQgdGhlIGJ1bGJzIGFyZSBzdGlsbCBhdmFpbGFibGUgZm9yICQxMCBlYWNo LiAgQW4gZWxlY3Ryb25pYyBiYWxsYXN0IGlzbuKAmXQgbXVjaCBtb3JlIHNvIEkgY2FuIGNvbXBs ZXRlbHkgcmVwbGFjZSB0aGUgZ3V0cyBmb3IgJDMwLiAgQmVmb3JlIEkgZG8sIHNob3VsZCBJIHVw Z3JhZGUgdG8gVDgsIFQ1IG9yIGV2ZW4gTEVEPyAgSSBjb3VsZCBlYXNpbHkgZml0IGFuIDE4IGlu Y2ggcm91bmQgb3Igc3F1YXJlIGxlZCBwYW5lbCBpbnRvIHRoZSBleGlzdGluZyBmaXh0dXJlLgo+ Cj4gQW55IHRob3VnaHRzPwo+IF9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fCj4KPiBTaG9wLXRhbGtAYXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQKPiBEb25hdGU6IGh0dHA6Ly93 d3cudGVhbS5uZXQvZG9uYXRlLmh0bWwKPiBTdWdnZXN0ZWQgYW5udWFsIGRvbmF0aW9uICAkMTIu OTYKPiBBcmNoaXZlOiBodHRwOi8vd3d3LnRlYW0ubmV0L3BpcGVybWFpbC9zaG9wLXRhbGsgaHR0 cDovL2F1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0L2FyY2hpdmUKPgo+IFVuc3Vic2NyaWJlL01hbmFnZTogaHR0cDov L2F1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0L21haWxtYW4vb3B0aW9ucy9zaG9wLXRhbGsvbWF5ZmllbGQrc2hvcHRh bGtAc2Fja2hlYWRzLm9yZwo+CgpfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fXwoKU2hvcC10YWxrQGF1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0CkRvbmF0ZTogaHR0cDovL3d3dy50 ZWFtLm5ldC9kb25hdGUuaHRtbApTdWdnZXN0ZWQgYW5udWFsIGRvbmF0aW9uICAkMTIuOTYKQXJj aGl2ZTogaHR0cDovL3d3dy50ZWFtLm5ldC9waXBlcm1haWwvc2hvcC10YWxrIGh0dHA6Ly9hdXRv eC50ZWFtLm5ldC9hcmNoaXZlCgpVbnN1YnNjcmliZS9NYW5hZ2U6IGh0dHA6Ly9hdXRveC50ZWFt Lm5ldC9tYWlsbWFuL29wdGlvbnMvc2hvcC10YWxrL21oYXJjQGF1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0Cgo= From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 30 13:51:20 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 982B5A0FF9 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 13:51:20 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-lf1-f49.google.com (unknown [209.85.167.49]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D82D7A0A06 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 13:48:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-lf1-f49.google.com with SMTP id x27so33595421lfu.5 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 12:48:05 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=/6H/yHObJTOU56WXk/vkjZFAXOS213NB9iwHVoHq8TM=; b=F0FaJl8KW4OrpdZi//zf12Ng1u3Gxb6IMxCiQc7fbkORd2P6TyXjp04VitJwNgXnAF HGDU8pVZ2G3pkdxxtejhEw9XOKD0H73iofcdYg3AbxgA9uYXIuWozNZTKhk5UtEgHGPL 23UzkNLbHI/74qfQkEeh8nua30eQsESLcoQoaq7YqPc6SXeB1HYHixj4VdcWq9rMoIdZ 09mqWeaKyIyHmfl6yaEnCrTi0Gh2Nna6Yfhd6cO8vVCHz0hWYlmimiaXOo4cGYq0znWu gsaif6SzxhwpQ1w17OUQTBYpiobfdG1pvQvPPuYDqF33LX70tI6kFHC6KAiu65ZE2O40 PWhg== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=/6H/yHObJTOU56WXk/vkjZFAXOS213NB9iwHVoHq8TM=; b=WUYpGCd8B8Fzwv49m2RMzp0SZ+SSpJ4HdMnHbz2O40mFgSi/EVUzeST7EwuXJVNNtH 4fioCu+wy5tlTw5t3QpUSaD1+XemXMdFNKO0nXM/6XIY0F0YM6RadYunZaNk7x33Lno/ /+5jMI/Z4hgfkxJ4erOM3IM1tkDXWadovy8s8NhA7zMG/3tvX0SmAlOFiFaXvwFJFuay LCmPw78lrdK3SAbCqv1q/U12OsXfcGSTDXCe/ib8SlyRah+kT2Fg0KSvcRtB4lXTSJoC olAJ5acZViPlwnqc1UCgvxn+ZMB3wV0AWYNdOwTb74tAgtIPpmpg8mD/cLdDYBrsSPsN 68SQ== Lo7lj8ZCVGxQwPgJzi2cdyZmSpdskNAfIpFlXSYwZJLw4k8= j13mr4165782lfe.69.1630352884088; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 12:48:04 -0700 (PDT) References: <20210830.124344.5142.0@webmail05.vgs.untd.com> <19178e50-7630-f6b4-43ea-2c6975fe8a80@sackheads.org> From: Peter Murray Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2021 15:47:48 -0400 To: Shop-Talk List Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Lighting question Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============0674848529074831902== --00000000000083c4fd05cacc1c20 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable If you're wedded to the fixture, then a ballast or switch could fix that issue. If you just want the light to work, perhaps one of these 2' X 2' LED ceiling fixtures would be an easy (no paintwork needed) replacement: https://www.lowes.com/pd/Lithonia-Lighting-2-ft-x-2-ft-LL-CPANL-LED-Flat-Pa= nel-with-3300-Lumens-and-3500-to-5000K-Switchable-CCT-with-Direct-Ceiling-M= ount-Bracket/5001878521 My MiL had one installed in her kitchen (replaced a 2' X 4' fluorescent) and it works incredibly well. Color temperature is adjustable to suit your desires. -Peter On Mon, Aug 30, 2021 at 2:00 PM Jimmie Mayfield < mayfield+shoptalk@sackheads.org> wrote: > Before you spend too much money retrofitting that fixture, have you > considered installing some LED track-lighting in its place? I had one > of those dual-U fluorescent fixtures in the kitchen when I moved in. > Could never get shadow-free lighting on the counters when I was > working. Wound up installing some generic track in an "L" shape and > bought 8 PAR30 LED fixtures. Total outlay was about $150 but now I have > around 9000 lumens in the kitchen and the light is where I need it. For > a while, I had better lighting in the kitchen than I had in my garage! > > > On 8/30/21 12:43, Matt wrote: > > OK, so it is kitchen lighting but it is where I make my sandwiches that > I eat in the SHOP! > > > > I have a 2 x2 surface mount fixture with 2 T12 bent tube fluorescents. > Works fine but occasionally you have to flip the switch multiple times to > get it on. I thought probably a bad switch but it is on a dual switch an= d > it is intermittent on both�. Two bad switches or maybe a ballast > going bad? > > > > I was semi surprised to find that the bulbs are still available for $10 > each. An electronic ballast isn=E2=80=99t much more so I can completely = replace > the guts for $30. Before I do, should I upgrade to T8, T5 or even LED? = I > could easily fit an 18 inch round or square led panel into the existing > fixture. > > > > Any thoughts? > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/mayfield+shoptalk@sackhea= ds.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/peterwmurray@gmail.com > > --00000000000083c4fd05cacc1c20 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
    If you're wedded to the fixture, then a ballast or swi= tch could fix that issue. If you just want the light to work, perhaps one o= f these 2' X 2' LED ceiling fixtures would=C2=A0be an easy (no pain= twork needed) replacement:


    My MiL had = one installed in her kitchen (replaced a 2' X 4' fluorescent) and i= t works incredibly well. Color temperature is adjustable to suit your desir= es.

    -Peter

    On Mon, Aug 30, 2021 at 2:00 PM Ji= mmie Mayfield <mayf= ield+shoptalk@sackheads.org> wrote:
    Before you spend too much money retrofitting tha= t fixture, have you
    considered installing some LED track-lighting in its place?=C2=A0 I had one=
    of those dual-U fluorescent fixtures in the kitchen when I moved in.=C2=A0 =
    Could never get shadow-free lighting on the counters when I was
    working.=C2=A0 Wound up installing some generic track in an "L" s= hape and
    bought 8 PAR30 LED fixtures.=C2=A0 Total outlay was about $150 but now I ha= ve
    around 9000 lumens in the kitchen and the light is where I need it.=C2=A0 F= or
    a while, I had better lighting in the kitchen than I had in my garage!


    On 8/30/21 12:43, Matt wrote:
    > OK, so it is kitchen lighting but it is where I make my sandwiches tha= t I eat in the SHOP!
    >
    > I have a 2 x2 surface mount fixture with 2 T12 bent tube fluorescents.= Works fine but occasionally you have to flip the switch multiple times to = get it on.=C2=A0 I thought probably a bad switch but it is on a dual switch= and it is intermittent on both&#65533;. Two bad switches or maybe a ba= llast going bad?
    >
    > I was semi surprised to find that the bulbs are still available for $1= 0 each.=C2=A0 An electronic ballast isn=E2=80=99t much more so I can comple= tely replace the guts for $30.=C2=A0 Before I do, should I upgrade to T8, T= 5 or even LED?=C2=A0 I could easily fit an 18 inch round or square led pane= l into the existing fixture.
    >
    > Any thoughts?
    > _______________________________________________
    >
    > Shop-tal= k@autox.team.net
    > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
    > Suggested annual donation=C2=A0 $12.96
    > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
    >
    > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/mayfield+shoptalk@sackh= eads.org
    >

    _______________________________________________

    Shop-talk@aut= ox.team.net
    et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
    Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

    alk/peterwmurray@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://aut= ox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/peterwmurray@gmail.com

    --00000000000083c4fd05cacc1c20-- --===============0674848529074831902== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============0674848529074831902==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Aug 30 20:08:46 2021 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9ADADA115E for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 20:08:46 -0600 (MDT) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ua1-f42.google.com (unknown [209.85.222.42]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27C50A106A for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 20:08:04 -0600 (MDT) Received: by mail-ua1-f42.google.com with SMTP id l24so8886137uai.1 for ; Mon, 30 Aug 2021 19:08:06 -0700 (PDT) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-transfer-encoding; bh=XMxNK4kxfz8CrdgRUyKBeoaEH2zrDlA/WKfCbnHZhHM=; b=Y627ynDCJdlbnm0uh/pyY9zjiRLmsGZiTmLmZNK/cMMP5omBd4Mx72AQoAmJY+5boX XojjeGSv7F2cYWOgcX/fXdUbkQDxANsnHz0jXH2lZvoAXRSr4UtUio8ncBEAExObsFGl xPfiTcoVHukI/ywl5+LzFBWcHnUFPPNlXhRx92KLsCOzQdXL5R5VcixTa0B4dN6DcK/Z VZZObzSb/fMGQqSv61UXj6Ggg62xCUm7LozevGmba4BxdN+3Zui3eAnE1hTLATVaHOMj uhCzwRs5o2EP50QhwFYBflpvRpW5uj8jugyndLQ+1/h1IspkLdfK+V0LPNAbugFEEVAz eDAw== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=XMxNK4kxfz8CrdgRUyKBeoaEH2zrDlA/WKfCbnHZhHM=; b=R+0gOnShEwwISQtqSiErvjWSx5ttwooq7ffBXmtU27XPgekFTeU3GA1/GOIr9VHKz2 76shcVQljsrF2lq7xTUJ2v4xNQY54Qvo5iCTGWd3dBagWZx0O14wrbry5G6csh05PzWD 3OwvEQoQGzPE743NmOY44GDmhBV7h9CbbB7bPTvZ/rjL+LsPa1VLAv+lgGVVqbVAOXhT JOlWt5Xg2fqgKuo0dUzL28i4WyRVirpScALa52VIp9YD3CDnNm7dPM3ssYPy4zWRjpHN /KjJ7hYbS5wN+TKgNO4eEzNVikkH8ZZ9+x4S+CiPPKr5VnbjzkY4icoUfYgss0lX4hLF ujhQ== nB2felpvelbv9J1oxLNaBCnXutECAY57brB0VA== Mon, 30 Aug 2021 19:08:06 -0700 (PDT) References: <20210830.124344.5142.0@webmail05.vgs.untd.com> From: David Scheidt Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2021 21:07:54 -0500 To: Matt , shop-talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Lighting question Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net On Mon, Aug 30, 2021 at 11:46 AM Matt wrote: > > OK, so it is kitchen lighting but it is where I make my sandwiches that I eat in the SHOP! > > I have a 2 x2 surface mount fixture with 2 T12 bent tube fluorescents. Works fine but occasionally you have to flip the switch multiple times to get it on. I thought probably a bad switch but it is on a dual switch and it is intermittent on both�. Two bad switches or maybe a ballast going bad? > Sounds like a bad starter. Is it built into the tube, or is independent? Replace the tube or starter, depending. Or replace the fixture, if that's your thing. I wouldn't replace the ballast, unless you want the retro 70s look. -- David Scheidt dmscheidt@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive