Subject: [Shop-talk] Re-wiring an outdoor outlet

From: Scott Hall <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2020 13:44:29 -0500

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I have this:

https://i.imgur.com/QWy2Ikn.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/s39fdds.jpg

Happening at the new house. Those rocks surround the pool deck for
ornamentation, I guess.

Shockingly (or not, heh), those outlets work. I'd like to re-do the whole
thing to be anchored into the ground and not make me nervous every time I
look at it.

The pool is about eight feet away. Maybe two feet of that rock...'garden'
then six feet of concrete decking. Those outlets themselves don't appear to
be GFCI, though I'd think it was a good idea. They have their own
sub-panel, on the side of the house maybe forty feet away.

I'm completely okay with throwing the breaker and installing a new actual
outlet, I'm soliciting advice on how to re-do that conduit (can you
'splice' conduit so I dig and then do it like I'd do PVC?) and anchor the
whole thing firmly to the ground. And for specific solutions you guys can
think of too--I was thinking I could pour a concrete 'rock' in the garage
with a hole for a gang box and then put that where this thing is now, etc.

Thanks guys.

Scott

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<div dir=3D"ltr">I have this:<div><br></div><div><a href=3D"https://i.imgur=
.com/QWy2Ikn.jpg">https://i.imgur.com/QWy2Ikn.jpg</a><br></div><div><a href=
=3D"https://i.imgur.com/s39fdds.jpg">https://i.imgur.com/s39fdds.jpg</a><br=
></div><div><br></div><div>Happening at the new house. Those rocks surround=
 the pool deck for ornamentation, I guess.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>S=
hockingly (or not, heh), those outlets work. I&#39;d like to re-do the whol=
e thing to be anchored into the ground and not make me nervous every time I=
 look at it.</div><div><br></div><div>The pool is about eight feet away. Ma=
ybe two feet of that rock...&#39;garden&#39; then six feet of concrete deck=
ing. Those outlets themselves don&#39;t appear to be GFCI, though I&#39;d t=
hink it was a good idea. They have their own sub-panel, on the side of the =
house maybe forty feet away.</div><div><br></div><div>I&#39;m completely ok=
ay with throwing the breaker and installing a new actual outlet, I&#39;m so=
liciting advice on how to re-do that conduit (can you &#39;splice&#39; cond=
uit so I dig and then do it like I&#39;d do PVC?) and anchor the whole thin=
g firmly to the ground. And for specific solutions you guys can think of to=
o--I was thinking I could pour a concrete &#39;rock&#39; in the garage with=
 a hole for a gang box and then put that where this thing is now, etc.</div=
><div><br></div><div>Thanks guys.</div><div><br></div><div>Scott</div></div=
>

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_______________________________________________

[email-masked]
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

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From: Bill Rabel <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 10 Jul 2020 14:18:02 -0700

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If you could use some lighting on the pathways, consider a pedestal with a l=
ight and outlets, usually seen on docks in marinas.=20

- Bill Rabel
  Anacortes

Since when do you have to agree with people to defend them from injustice?

- Lillian Hellman

> On Jul 10, 2020, at 12:54 PM, Jeff Scarbrough <[email-masked]> wrote:=

>=20
> =EF=BB=BFPat said he's put an in-use cover.  I'd add that the NEC requires=
 an
> in-use cover in this spot, and it's just smart to do it anyway.  John
> said mount it on a 4x4, that's probably easiest, unless you are going
> for aesthetics, in which case the cast rock may be an option.  You
> could also get one of those fake rocks that goes over a well pump and
> mount it in that somehow.
>=20
> Pull new wires, make sure there's GFCI protection, and rock on!
>=20
>=20
>> On Fri, Jul 10, 2020 at 3:05 PM Pat Horne <[email-masked]> wrote:
>>=20
>> Scott,
>>=20
>> Several thoughts. There needs to be a GFCI Function on any outside circui=
t. It could be a GFCI breaker in a panel or a GFCI outlet.
>>=20
>> I would get a GFCI outlet tester to see If the circuit has the GFCI funct=
ionality somewhere. It=E2=80=99s redundant to have a GFCI outlet & breaker o=
n the same circuit.
>>=20
>> Since this outlet doesn=E2=80=99t seem to be up to code I=E2=80=99d quest=
ion whether the sub panel was installed to code also. If it isn=E2=80=99t a r=
eal sub panel, but rather just a disconnect there may be something farther b=
ack in the system that is supplying the GFCI function, either a GFCI breaker=
 in another panel or a GFCI outlet in the garage or a bathroom.
>>=20
>> As for replacing the outlet/cutting the PVC, yes it can be done on the st=
raight conduct. If it were me, I=E2=80=99d cut the conduit back to a straigh=
t part and then complete the conduit with a flexible conduit like what is us=
ed on an A/C unit. That way I=E2=80=99d the outlet gets hit or stressed it w=
on=E2=80=99t break like your old one. I=E2=80=99d also install an in use cov=
er on the Outlet box so that it Will still be water resistant when something=
 is plugged into it.
>>=20
>> I=E2=80=99d be happy to discuss this further with you if desired.
>>=20
>> Peace,
>> Pat
>>=20
>> Pat Horne
>> We support Habitat for Humanity
>>=20
>>=20
>> On Jul 10, 2020, at 1:45 PM, Scott Hall <[email-masked]> w=
rote:
>>=20
>> =EF=BB=BF
>>=20
>>=20
>> Happening at the new house. Those rocks surround the pool deck for orname=
ntation, I guess.
>>=20
>> Shockingly (or not, heh), those outlets work. I'd like to re-do the whole=
 thing to be anchored into the ground and not make me nervous every time I l=
ook at it.
>>=20
>> The pool is about eight feet away. Maybe two feet of that rock...'garden'=
 then six feet of concrete decking. Those outlets themselves don't appear to=
 be GFCI, though I'd think it was a good idea. They have their own sub-panel=
, on the side of the house maybe forty feet away.
>>=20
>> I'm completely okay with throwing the breaker and installing a new actual=
 outlet, I'm soliciting advice on how to re-do that conduit (can you 'splice=
' conduit so I dig and then do it like I'd do PVC?) and anchor the whole thi=
ng firmly to the ground. And for specific solutions you guys can think of to=
o--I was thinking I could pour a concrete 'rock' in the garage with a hole f=
or a gang box and then put that where this thing is now, etc.
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/ar=
chive
>>=20
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patin=
[email-masked]
>>=20
>>=20
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/ar=
chive
>>=20
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/fishp=
[email-masked]
>>=20
>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arc=
hive
>=20
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/brabel=
@comcast.net
>=20

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">If you could use some lighting on the pathw=
ays, consider a pedestal with a light <u>and</u> outlets, usually seen on do=
cks in marinas.&nbsp;<div><br></div><div>- Bill Rabel</div><div>&nbsp; Anaco=
rtes<br><br><div dir=3D"ltr">

<p class=3D"p1"><span class=3D"s1">Since when do you have to agree with peop=
le to defend them from injustice?</span></p><p class=3D"p1"><span style=3D"f=
ont-size: 13pt;">- Lillian Hellman</span></p></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><blo=
ckquote type=3D"cite">On Jul 10, 2020, at 12:54 PM, Jeff Scarbrough &lt;fish=
[email-masked]&gt; wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquote type=3D"cit=
e"><div dir=3D"ltr">=EF=BB=BF<span>Pat said he's put an in-use cover. &nbsp;=
I'd add that the NEC requires an</span><br><span>in-use cover in this spot, a=
nd it's just smart to do it anyway. &nbsp;John</span><br><span>said mount it=
 on a 4x4, that's probably easiest, unless you are going</span><br><span>for=
 aesthetics, in which case the cast rock may be an option. &nbsp;You</span><=
br><span>could also get one of those fake rocks that goes over a well pump a=
nd</span><br><span>mount it in that somehow.</span><br><span></span><br><spa=
n>Pull new wires, make sure there's GFCI protection, and rock on!</span><br>=
<span></span><br><span></span><br><span>On Fri, Jul 10, 2020 at 3:05 PM Pat H=
orne &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:</span><br><blockquote type=3D"cite=
"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Scott,</span=
><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><b=
lockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Several thoughts. There needs to be a GFCI Fun=
ction on any outside circuit. It could be a GFCI breaker in a panel or a GFC=
I outlet.</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br>=
</blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>I would get a GFCI outlet teste=
r to see If the circuit has the GFCI functionality somewhere. It=E2=80=99s r=
edundant to have a GFCI outlet &amp; breaker on the same circuit.</span><br>=
</blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockq=
uote type=3D"cite"><span>Since this outlet doesn=E2=80=99t seem to be up to c=
ode I=E2=80=99d question whether the sub panel was installed to code also. I=
f it isn=E2=80=99t a real sub panel, but rather just a disconnect there may b=
e something farther back in the system that is supplying the GFCI function, e=
ither a GFCI breaker in another panel or a GFCI outlet in the garage or a ba=
throom.</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br></=
blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>As for replacing the outlet/cutti=
ng the PVC, yes it can be done on the straight conduct. If it were me, I=E2=80=
=99d cut the conduit back to a straight part and then complete the conduit w=
ith a flexible conduit like what is used on an A/C unit. That way I=E2=80=99=
d the outlet gets hit or stressed it won=E2=80=99t break like your old one. I=
=E2=80=99d also install an in use cover on the Outlet box so that it Will st=
ill be water resistant when something is plugged into it.</span><br></blockq=
uote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote typ=
e=3D"cite"><span>I=E2=80=99d be happy to discuss this further with you if de=
sired.</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br></b=
lockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Peace,</span><br></blockquote><blo=
ckquote type=3D"cite"><span>Pat</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"c=
ite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Pat Horne=
</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>We support Habitat f=
or Humanity</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><b=
r></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><bloc=
kquote type=3D"cite"><span>On Jul 10, 2020, at 1:45 PM, Scott Hall &lt;scott=
[email-masked]&gt; wrote:</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D=
"cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>=EF=BB=BF=
</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>I have this:</span><=
br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blo=
ckquote type=3D"cite"><span>https://i.imgur.com/QWy2Ikn.jpg</span><br></bloc=
kquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>https://i.imgur.com/s39fdds.jpg</span=
><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><b=
lockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Happening at the new house. Those rocks surrou=
nd the pool deck for ornamentation, I guess.</span><br></blockquote><blockqu=
ote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><s=
pan>Shockingly (or not, heh), those outlets work. I'd like to re-do the whol=
e thing to be anchored into the ground and not make me nervous every time I l=
ook at it.</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br=
></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>The pool is about eight feet a=
way. Maybe two feet of that rock...'garden' then six feet of concrete deckin=
g. Those outlets themselves don't appear to be GFCI, though I'd think it was=
 a good idea. They have their own sub-panel, on the side of the house maybe f=
orty feet away.</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></spa=
n><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>I'm completely okay with t=
hrowing the breaker and installing a new actual outlet, I'm soliciting advic=
e on how to re-do that conduit (can you 'splice' conduit so I dig and then d=
o it like I'd do PVC?) and anchor the whole thing firmly to the ground. And f=
or specific solutions you guys can think of too--I was thinking I could pour=
 a concrete 'rock' in the garage with a hole for a gang box and then put tha=
t where this thing is now, etc.</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"c=
ite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Thanks gu=
ys.</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br></bloc=
kquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Scott</span><br></blockquote><blockqu=
ote type=3D"cite"><span>_______________________________________________</spa=
n><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><=
blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>[email-masked]</span><br></blockquo=
te><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html</=
span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Suggested annual donat=
ion &nbsp;$12.96</span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span>Arch=
ive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive</=
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><span>_______________________________________________</span><br></blockquot=
e><blockquote type=3D"cite"><span></span><br></blockquote><blockquote type=3D=
"cite"><span>[email-masked]</span><br></blockquote><blockquote typ=
e=3D"cite"><span>Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html</span><br></blockqu=
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________</span><br><span></span><br><span>[email-masked]</span><br=
><span>Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html</span><br><span>Suggested ann=
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[email-masked]

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