Subject: [Shop-talk] Footings and piers for decks

From: Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2020 14:13:18 -0400

Having decided it's better to build a nice ornate deck out of PT than a small simple deck of of fancy materials, I'm looking at the foundation. Frost line here is 48" and I need 18" footings. I have found 3 options and I'm wondering if I missed anything:

1. Traditional concrete with forms and sonotubes
2. Pre-cast footings (22", 100 lbs)  and stackable piers (EZ-Tube)
3. Helical piles 

I haven't heard back from the town on that last one and they're the priciest at $275 per. The pre-cast are $150 per. Concrete will require hauling about 45,000 bags into the backyard. 

I'm leaning towards #2 . I don't own any yard equipment but I can rent a skid steer with auger, though not a 24" auger I don't think.

thanks,
jim
_______________________________________________

[email-masked]
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

---

From: Brian Kemp via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 21 Apr 2020 21:13:39 -0700 (GMT-07:00)

--===============4126272005030020310==
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head><style type=3D"text/css"><!-- DIV {margin:0px;} --></style></he=
ad><body><div style=3D"font-size: 13px;color: rgb(0, 0, 0);font-family: ari=
al, sans-serif;">Try a search for "concrete trailer" or call some local con=
crete companies.&nbsp; If you can drive a pickup or SUV near the footings, =
one of these might be the way to go.&nbsp; An explanation is at https://www=
.sepulveda.com/product_families/concrete_to_go/concrete_to_go.php <br><div>=
<br></div><div>Brian<br></div><blockquote style=3D"padding-left: 5px; margi=
n-left: 0px; border-left: #0000ff 2px solid; font-weight: normal; font-styl=
e: normal; text-decoration: none; font-size: 10pt; font-family: arial,sans-=
serif; color: black;">-----Original Message-----
<br>From: Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
<br>Sent: Apr 16, 2020 7:44 PM
<br>To: PJ McGarvey <[email-masked]>
<br>Cc: Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
<br>Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Footings and piers for decks

<br><br><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Du=
tf-8">Yep, 18" is spot on per the beam and joist spacing, but the pre-cast =
footer only comes in 22".&nbsp;<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div cl=
ass=3D"">Getting the concrete to the location will be difficult. The house =
is up a 100' inclined driveway that won't support a full sized truck, and t=
he then another 100' around back to the site. Even a pumper would need a lo=
t of hose. Are there smaller/lighter site-mix trucks now? I suppose they co=
uld pump it to the top of the driveway and wheelbarrow it around back...<br=
 class=3D""><div><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div c=
lass=3D"">On Apr 16, 2020, at 10:15 PM, PJ McGarvey &lt;<a target=3D"_blank=
" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]=
m</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D=
""><div style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-varian=
t-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: st=
art; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spac=
ing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; font-famil=
y: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;" class=3D"">I doubt you=
'll need more than 18" diameter footings for a deck.&nbsp;</div><div style=
=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: norma=
l; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-ind=
ent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -we=
bkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Calibri, H=
elvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;" class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><di=
v style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant-caps=
: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; t=
ext-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0=
px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Cal=
ibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;" class=3D"">In any case, I wo=
uld pay a bit more for concrete delivery. I did this in November for a 16'x=
16' screened porch I'm almost finished with. For that diameter and depth, t=
hat's alot of concrete to mix correctly. In an hour you can have it deliver=
ed, poured, and save alot of hassle.&nbsp;</div><div id=3D"appendonsend" st=
yle=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; =
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-=
spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;=
 white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; te=
xt-decoration: none;" class=3D""></div><div style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0,=
 0); font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; le=
tter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: =
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0p=
x; text-decoration: none; font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font=
-size: 12pt;" class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><hr tabindex=3D"-1" style=3D"=
caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-st=
yle: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing=
: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-=
space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-deco=
ration: none; display: inline-block; width: 710.5px;" class=3D""><span styl=
e=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; fo=
nt-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-sp=
acing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; w=
hite-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text=
-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class=3D""></s=
pan><div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr" style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0=
); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-varian=
t-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: st=
art; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spac=
ing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;" class=3D"=
"><font style=3D"font-size: 11pt;" class=3D"" face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif">=
<b class=3D"">From:</b><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>S=
hop-talk &lt;<a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
am.net" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; on behalf of Pa=
t Horne via Shop-talk &lt;<a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto:shop-talk@aut=
ox.team.net" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b c=
lass=3D"">Sent:</b><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Thurs=
day, April 16, 2020 7:14 PM<br class=3D""><b class=3D"">To:</b><span class=
=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Jim Franklin &lt;<a target=3D"_blan=
k" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]=
</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b class=3D"">Cc:</b><span class=3D"Apple-converted-=
space">&nbsp;</span>Shop-talk &lt;<a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto:shop-=
[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br class=
=3D""><b class=3D"">Subject:</b><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp=
;</span>Re: [Shop-talk] Footings and piers for decks</font><div class=3D"">=
&nbsp;</div></div><div class=3D"BodyFragment" style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, =
0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-va=
riant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align=
: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-=
spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><font=
 class=3D"" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt;" class=3D""><div cla=
ss=3D"PlainText">24=E2=80=9D diameter hole is pretty large. I had 24=E2=80=
=9D piers drilled by a company. They brought a large drill truck. I had 3 p=
iers drilled 25=E2=80=99 deep, including bell bottoms. Cost was $800. Only =
reason I brought this up is it might not be that much over the cost of the =
skid steer to have someone else drill them.<span class=3D"Apple-converted-s=
pace">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D""><br class=3D"">Peace,<br class=3D"">Pat<b=
r class=3D""><br class=3D"">Pat Horne<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">=
&nbsp;</span><br class=3D"">We support Habitat for Humanity<br class=3D""><=
br class=3D""><br class=3D"">&gt; On Apr 16, 2020, at 1:13 PM, Jim Franklin=
 via Shop-talk &lt;<a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]=
.net" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br class=3D"">&gt;=
<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D""><br class=
=3D"">=EF=BB=BFHaving decided it's better to build a nice ornate deck out o=
f PT than a small simple deck of of fancy materials, I'm looking at the fou=
ndation. Frost line here is 48" and I need 18" footings. I have found 3 opt=
ions and I'm wondering if I missed anything:<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">1=
. Traditional concrete with forms and sonotubes<br class=3D"">2. Pre-cast f=
ootings (22", 100 lbs)&nbsp; and stackable piers (EZ-Tube)<br class=3D"">3.=
 Helical piles<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=
=3D""><br class=3D"">I haven't heard back from the town on that last one an=
d they're the priciest at $275 per. The pre-cast are $150 per. Concrete wil=
l require hauling about 45,000 bags into the backyard.<span class=3D"Apple-=
converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D""><br class=3D"">I'm leaning tow=
ards #2 . I don't own any yard equipment but I can rent a skid steer with a=
uger, though not a 24" auger I don't think.<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">th=
anks,<br class=3D"">jim<br class=3D"">_____________________________________=
__________<br class=3D""><br class=3D""><a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto=
:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a><br class=
=3D"">Donate:<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a target=
=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" class=3D"">http://www.=
team.net/donate.html</a><br class=3D"">Suggested annual donation&nbsp; $12.=
96<br class=3D"">Archive:<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span=
><a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk" clas=
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[email-masked]

--===============4126272005030020310==--

---

From: Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2020 15:36:39 -0400

--===============3151129821528373622==
	boundary="Apple-Mail=_9F029FD3-31AC-4525-B2FA-290488CC5259"

--Apple-Mail=_9F029FD3-31AC-4525-B2FA-290488CC5259
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
	charset=utf-8

I found a "loophole" in the code. If the deck is freestanding and under =
30" high, it doesn't need to be at the frost line. I found these =
anchored surface footings that might do quite well:

https://shop.titanbuildingproducts.com/deck-foot.php =
<https://shop.titanbuildingproducts.com/deck-foot.php>

The only issue is that the new deck with be 4 steps down from the one =
anchored to the house, so the connection between the two needs to be =
fluid, which means one end of the stairs needs to float. I'm trying to =
come up with a design where the risers adjust as the lower deck rises =
and falls with frost, and the riser heights stay equidistant from each =
other, but I'm not getting there. Maybe I build a ramp instead...

jim

> On Apr 22, 2020, at 12:13 AM, Brian Kemp <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> Try a search for "concrete trailer" or call some local concrete =
companies.  If you can drive a pickup or SUV near the footings, one of =
these might be the way to go.  An explanation is at =
https://www.sepulveda.com/product_families/concrete_to_go/concrete_to_go.p=
hp =
<https://www.sepulveda.com/product_families/concrete_to_go/concrete_to_go.=
php>=20
>=20
> Brian
> -----Original Message-----=20
> From: Jim Franklin via Shop-talk=20
> Sent: Apr 16, 2020 7:44 PM=20
> To: PJ McGarvey=20
> Cc: Shop-talk=20
> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Footings and piers for decks=20
>=20
> Yep, 18" is spot on per the beam and joist spacing, but the pre-cast =
footer only comes in 22".=20
>=20
> Getting the concrete to the location will be difficult. The house is =
up a 100' inclined driveway that won't support a full sized truck, and =
the then another 100' around back to the site. Even a pumper would need =
a lot of hose. Are there smaller/lighter site-mix trucks now? I suppose =
they could pump it to the top of the driveway and wheelbarrow it around =
back...
>=20
>> On Apr 16, 2020, at 10:15 PM, PJ McGarvey <[email-masked] =
>>=20
>> I doubt you'll need more than 18" diameter footings for a deck.=20
>>=20
>> In any case, I would pay a bit more for concrete delivery. I did this =
in November for a 16'x16' screened porch I'm almost finished with. For =
that diameter and depth, that's alot of concrete to mix correctly. In an =
hour you can have it delivered, poured, and save alot of hassle.=20
>>=20
>> From: Shop-talk <[email-masked] =
>> Sent: Thursday, April 16, 2020 7:14 PM
>> To: Jim Franklin <[email-masked] =
>> Cc: Shop-talk <[email-masked] =
>> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Footings and piers for decks
>> =20
>> 24=E2=80=9D diameter hole is pretty large. I had 24=E2=80=9D piers =
drilled by a company. They brought a large drill truck. I had 3 piers =
drilled 25=E2=80=99 deep, including bell bottoms. Cost was $800. Only =
reason I brought this up is it might not be that much over the cost of =
the skid steer to have someone else drill them.=20
>>=20
>> Peace,
>> Pat
>>=20
>> Pat Horne=20
>> We support Habitat for Humanity
>>=20
>>=20
>> > On Apr 16, 2020, at 1:13 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk =
>> >=20
>>=20
>> =EF=BB=BFHaving decided it's better to build a nice ornate deck out =
of PT than a small simple deck of of fancy materials, I'm looking at the =
foundation. Frost line here is 48" and I need 18" footings. I have found =
3 options and I'm wondering if I missed anything:
>>=20
>> 3. Helical piles=20
>>=20
>> I haven't heard back from the town on that last one and they're the =
priciest at $275 per. The pre-cast are $150 per. Concrete will require =
hauling about 45,000 bags into the backyard.=20
>>=20
>> I'm leaning towards #2 . I don't own any yard equipment but I can =
rent a skid steer with auger, though not a 24" auger I don't think.
>>=20
>>=20
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html =
<http://www.team.net/donate.html>
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk =
<http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk> http://autox.team.net/archive =
<http://autox.team.net/archive>
>>=20
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked] =
<http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]>
>>=20
>>=20
>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html =
<http://www.team.net/donate.html>
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk =
<http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk> http://autox.team.net/archive =
<http://autox.team.net/archive>
>>=20
>> Unsubscribe/Manage: =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked] =
<http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]>

--Apple-Mail=_9F029FD3-31AC-4525-B2FA-290488CC5259
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
	charset=utf-8

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=3D"">I =
found a "loophole" in the code. If the deck is freestanding and under =
30" high, it doesn't need to be at the frost line. I found these =
anchored surface footings that might do quite well:<div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D""><a =
href=3D"https://shop.titanbuildingproducts.com/deck-foot.php" =
class=3D"">https://shop.titanbuildingproducts.com/deck-foot.php</a></div><=
div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">The only issue is =
that the new deck with be 4 steps down from the one anchored to the =
house, so the connection between the two needs to be fluid, which means =
one end of the stairs needs to float. I'm trying to come up with a =
design where the risers adjust as the lower deck rises and falls with =
frost, and the riser heights stay equidistant from each other, but I'm =
not getting there. Maybe I build a ramp instead...</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">jim<br class=3D""><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""><div><br =
class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div class=3D"">On Apr =
22, 2020, at 12:13 AM, Brian Kemp &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; =
wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-decoration: none; font-size: 13px; font-family: arial, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">Try a search for "concrete trailer" or call some local =
concrete companies.&nbsp; If you can drive a pickup or SUV near the =
footings, one of these might be the way to go.&nbsp; An explanation is =
at<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://www.sepulveda.com/product_families/concrete_to_go/concrete=
_to_go.php" =
class=3D"">https://www.sepulveda.com/product_families/concrete_to_go/concr=
ete_to_go.php</a><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0px;" class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div style=3D"margin: 0px;" class=3D"">Brian<br =
class=3D""></div><blockquote style=3D"padding-left: 5px; margin-left: =
0px; border-left-width: 2px; border-left-style: solid; =
border-left-color: rgb(0, 0, 255); font-weight: normal; font-style: =
normal; text-decoration: none; font-size: 10pt; font-family: arial, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">-----Original Message-----<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D"">From: Jim =
Franklin via Shop-talk<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><[email-masked] =
class=3D""><br class=3D"">Sent: Apr 16, 2020 7:44 PM<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D"">To: PJ =
McGarvey<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><[email-masked] =
class=3D""><br class=3D"">Cc: Shop-talk<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><[email-masked] =
class=3D""><br class=3D"">Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Footings and piers =
for decks<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br =
class=3D""><br class=3D"">Yep, 18" is spot on per the beam and joist =
spacing, but the pre-cast footer only comes in 22".&nbsp;<div class=3D"" =
style=3D"margin: 0px;"><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"" =
style=3D"margin: 0px;">Getting the concrete to the location will be =
difficult. The house is up a 100' inclined driveway that won't support a =
full sized truck, and the then another 100' around back to the site. =
Even a pumper would need a lot of hose. Are there smaller/lighter =
site-mix trucks now? I suppose they could pump it to the top of the =
driveway and wheelbarrow it around back...<br class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0px;" class=3D""><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite"=
 class=3D""><div class=3D"" style=3D"margin: 0px;">On Apr 16, 2020, at =
10:15 PM, PJ McGarvey &lt;<a target=3D"_blank" =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D"" style=3D"margin: =
0px;"><div class=3D"" style=3D"margin: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); =
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; =
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; font-family: =
Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;">I doubt you'll need =
more than 18" diameter footings for a deck.&nbsp;</div><div class=3D"" =
style=3D"margin: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-decoration: none; font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; =
font-size: 12pt;"><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"" style=3D"margin: =
0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: =
normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; =
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: =
none; font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;">In =
any case, I would pay a bit more for concrete delivery. I did this in =
November for a 16'x16' screened porch I'm almost finished with. For that =
diameter and depth, that's alot of concrete to mix correctly. In an hour =
you can have it delivered, poured, and save alot of =
hassle.&nbsp;</div><div id=3D"appendonsend" class=3D"" style=3D"margin: =
0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; =
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; =
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"></div><div =
class=3D"" style=3D"margin: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: =
normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: =
normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; =
white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-decoration: none; font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; =
font-size: 12pt;"><br class=3D""></div><hr tabindex=3D"-1" class=3D"" =
style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: =
14px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: =
normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; display: =
inline-block; width: 710.5px;"><span class=3D"" style=3D"caret-color: =
rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: =
normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: =
normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; =
white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline =
!important;"></span><div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"" =
style=3D"margin: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; =
font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; =
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; =
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: =
none;"><font class=3D"" face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif" style=3D"font-size: =
11pt;"><b class=3D"">From:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Shop-talk &lt;<a =
target=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; on behalf of Pat =
Horne via Shop-talk &lt;<a target=3D"_blank" =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Thursday, April 16, 2020 =
7:14 PM<br class=3D""><b class=3D"">To:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Jim Franklin &lt;<a =
target=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">Cc:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Shop-talk &lt;<a =
target=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Re: [Shop-talk] Footings =
and piers for decks</font><div class=3D"" style=3D"margin: =
0px;">&nbsp;</div></div><div class=3D"BodyFragment" style=3D"margin: =
0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; =
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; =
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><font class=3D"" =
size=3D"2"><span class=3D"" style=3D"font-size: 11pt;"><div =
class=3D"PlainText" style=3D"margin: 0px;">24=E2=80=9D diameter hole is =
pretty large. I had 24=E2=80=9D piers drilled by a company. They brought =
a large drill truck. I had 3 piers drilled 25=E2=80=99 deep, including =
bell bottoms. Cost was $800. Only reason I brought this up is it might =
not be that much over the cost of the skid steer to have someone else =
drill them.<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br =
class=3D""><br class=3D"">Peace,<br class=3D"">Pat<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">Pat Horne<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br=
 class=3D"">We support Habitat for Humanity<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D""><br class=3D"">&gt; On Apr 16, 2020, at 1:13 PM, Jim Franklin =
via Shop-talk &lt;<a target=3D"_blank" =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br class=3D"">&gt;<span=
 class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">=EF=BB=BFHaving decided it's better to build a nice ornate =
deck out of PT than a small simple deck of of fancy materials, I'm =
looking at the foundation. Frost line here is 48" and I need 18" =
footings. I have found 3 options and I'm wondering if I missed =
anything:<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">1. Traditional concrete with =
forms and sonotubes<br class=3D"">2. Pre-cast footings (22", 100 =
lbs)&nbsp; and stackable piers (EZ-Tube)<br class=3D"">3. Helical =
piles<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D""><br=
 class=3D"">I haven't heard back from the town on that last one and =
they're the priciest at $275 per. The pre-cast are $150 per. Concrete =
will require hauling about 45,000 bags into the backyard.<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">I'm leaning towards #2 . I don't own any yard equipment but I =
can rent a skid steer with auger, though not a 24" auger I don't =
think.<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">thanks,<br class=3D"">jim<br =
class=3D"">_______________________________________________<br =
class=3D""><br class=3D""><a target=3D"_blank" =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a><br class=3D"">Donate:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a target=3D"_blank" =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" =
class=3D"">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br class=3D"">Suggested =
annual donation&nbsp; $12.96<br class=3D"">Archive:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a target=3D"_blank" =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk" =
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class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a target=3D"_blank" =
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class=3D"">http://autox.team.net/archive</a><br class=3D""><br =
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com" =
class=3D"">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patintexas@iclo=
ud.com</a><br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">_______________________________________________<br =
class=3D""><br class=3D""><a target=3D"_blank" =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a><br class=3D"">Donate:<span =
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href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html" =
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annual donation&nbsp; $12.96<br class=3D"">Archive:<span =
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l.com" =
class=3D"">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pj_mcgarvey@hot=
mail.com</a></div></span></font></div></div></blockquote></div></div></sho=
[email-masked]></[email-masked]></[email-masked]=
></blockquote></div></div></blockquote></div><br =
class=3D""></div></div></body></html>=

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[email-masked]

--===============3151129821528373622==--

---

From: Pat Horne via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 22 Apr 2020 15:26:17 -0500

--===============5820232993354364447==
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	charset=utf-8
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I=E2=80=99ll do a drawing. Basically, instead of fixed stringers on the side=
s of the stairs, there is a piece on angle iron connecting the front edge of=
 all the stair treads & another piece of angle connecting all the rear edges=
 of the treads. These connections are not solid, but allow the treads to rot=
ate. The upper ends of the angles are likewise connected to a fixed landing e=
xtension of the upper deck. They are attached @ the same distance as the dep=
th of the treads. In my case there are wheels that allow the bottom of the s=
tairs to move around.=20

Picture to follow.=20

Pat Horne=20

> On Apr 22, 2020, at 3:16 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <[email-masked]=

=EF=BB=BFThe image came through but I couldn't get enough from it to underst=
and how they work. I'd be interested in the design from an intellectual stan=
dpoint but having done a bit of reading on this now, it seems the amount of r=
ise from frost would cause minimal change in angle of the treads (code allow=
s for 1/4" per foot) and that using a regular wood stringer, attached by a h=
inge at the top, would be well within that threshold.

thanks,
jim

> On Apr 22, 2020, at 4:03 PM, Pat Horne <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> Jim, I haves design that will work for your steps. I have a set of stairs t=
hat came from a local airport. They are the stairs that go from the jet way,=
 right at the plane to the tarmac. They have to allow for different height p=
lanes while keeping the stair treads level. I=E2=80=99ll draw up a rough dra=
wing for you if you like. I=E2=80=99ll also attach a photo to this email but=
 I think it will be stripped.=20
>> On Apr 22, 2020, at 2:46 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.=
team.net> wrote:
>>=20
>=20
> =EF=BB=BFI found a "loophole" in the code. If the deck is freestanding and=
 under 30" high, it doesn't need to be at the frost line. I found these anch=
ored surface footings that might do quite well:
>=20
> https://shop.titanbuildingproducts.com/deck-foot.php
>=20
> The only issue is that the new deck with be 4 steps down from the one anch=
ored to the house, so the connection between the two needs to be fluid, whic=
h means one end of the stairs needs to float. I'm trying to come up with a d=
esign where the risers adjust as the lower deck rises and falls with frost, a=
nd the riser heights stay equidistant from each other, but I'm not getting t=
here. Maybe I build a ramp instead...
>> Try a search for "concrete trailer" or call some local concrete companies=
.  If you can drive a pickup or SUV near the footings, one of these might be=
 the way to go.  An explanation is at https://www.sepulveda.com/product_fami=
lies/concrete_to_go/concrete_to_go.php=20
>> Yep, 18" is spot on per the beam and joist spacing, but the pre-cast foot=
er only comes in 22".=20
>>=20
>> Getting the concrete to the location will be difficult. The house is up a=
 100' inclined driveway that won't support a full sized truck, and the then a=
nother 100' around back to the site. Even a pumper would need a lot of hose.=
 Are there smaller/lighter site-mix trucks now? I suppose they could pump it=
 to the top of the driveway and wheelbarrow it around back...
>>=20
>>> On Apr 16, 2020, at 10:15 PM, PJ McGarvey <[email-masked]> wrot=
e:
>>> In any case, I would pay a bit more for concrete delivery. I did this in=
 November for a 16'x16' screened porch I'm almost finished with. For that di=
ameter and depth, that's alot of concrete to mix correctly. In an hour you c=
an have it delivered, poured, and save alot of hassle.=20
>>>=20
>>> From: Shop-talk <[email-masked]> on behalf of Pat Horn=
e via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
>>> To: Jim Franklin <[email-masked]>
>>> Cc: Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
>>> 24=E2=80=9D diameter hole is pretty large. I had 24=E2=80=9D piers drill=
ed by a company. They brought a large drill truck. I had 3 piers drilled 25=E2=
=80=99 deep, including bell bottoms. Cost was $800. Only reason I brought th=
is up is it might not be that much over the cost of the skid steer to have s=
omeone else drill them.=20
>>> > On Apr 16, 2020, at 1:13 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <shop-talk@aut=
ox.team.net> wrote:
>>> >=20
>>>=20
>>> =EF=BB=BFHaving decided it's better to build a nice ornate deck out of P=
T than a small simple deck of of fancy materials, I'm looking at the foundat=
ion. Frost line here is 48" and I need 18" footings. I have found 3 options a=
nd I'm wondering if I missed anything:
>>> I haven't heard back from the town on that last one and they're the pric=
iest at $275 per. The pre-cast are $150 per. Concrete will require hauling a=
bout 45,000 bags into the backyard.=20
>>>=20
>>> I'm leaning towards #2 . I don't own any yard equipment but I can rent a=
 skid steer with auger, though not a 24" auger I don't think.
>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/a=
rchive
>>>=20
>>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pati=
[email-masked]
>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/a=
rchive
>>>=20
>>> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/pj_m=
[email-masked]
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arc=
hive
>=20
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/patint=
[email-masked]

[email-masked]
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi=
ve

[email-masked]

--Apple-Mail-F6085A53-BB05-4A84-9AFD-ED02F605B7F4
	charset=utf-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">I=E2=80=99ll do a drawing. Basically, inste=
ad of fixed stringers on the sides of the stairs, there is a piece on angle i=
ron connecting the front edge of all the stair treads &amp; another piece of=
 angle connecting all the rear edges of the treads. These connections are no=
t solid, but allow the treads to rotate. The upper ends of the angles are li=
kewise connected to a fixed landing extension of the upper deck. They are at=
tached @ the same distance as the depth of the treads. In my case there are w=
heels that allow the bottom of the stairs to move around.&nbsp;<div><br></di=
v><div>Picture to follow.&nbsp;<br><br><div dir=3D"ltr">Pat Horne&nbsp;<div>=
We support Habitat for Humanity</div><div><br></div></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><=
br><blockquote type=3D"cite">On Apr 22, 2020, at 3:16 PM, Jim Franklin via S=
hop-talk &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><=
div dir=3D"ltr">=EF=BB=BF<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/h=
tml; charset=3Dutf-8">The image came through but I couldn't get enough from i=
t to understand how they work. I'd be interested in the design from an intel=
lectual standpoint but having done a bit of reading on this now, it seems th=
e amount of rise from frost would cause minimal change in angle of the tread=
s (code allows for 1/4" per foot) and that using a regular wood stringer, at=
tached by a hinge at the top, would be well within that threshold.<br class=3D=
""><div><br class=3D""></div><div>thanks,</div><div>jim</div><div><br class=3D=
""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div class=3D"">On Apr 22, 2020, at 4=
:03 PM, Pat Horne &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">pa=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newli=
ne"><div class=3D""><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; c=
harset=3Dutf-8" class=3D""><div dir=3D"auto" class=3D"">Jim, I haves design t=
hat will work for your steps. I have a set of stairs that came from a local a=
irport. They are the stairs that go from the jet way, right at the plane to t=
he tarmac. They have to allow for different height planes while keeping the s=
tair treads level. I=E2=80=99ll draw up a rough drawing for you if you like.=
 I=E2=80=99ll also attach a photo to this email but I think it will be strip=
ped.&nbsp;<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Peace,</div><=
div class=3D"">Pat</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D""=
><span id=3D"cid:F1E3008F-DFAB-48FD-8DFD-AA9A6720D9A3">&lt;image0.jpeg&gt;</=
span><br class=3D""><br class=3D""><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"">Pat Horne&nbs=
p;<div class=3D"">We support Habitat for Humanity</div><div class=3D""><br c=
lass=3D""></div></div><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><br class=3D""><blockquote=
 type=3D"cite" class=3D"">On Apr 22, 2020, at 2:46 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop=
-talk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">shop-talk@a=
utox.team.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br class=3D""><br class=3D""></blockquote></div=
><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"">=EF=BB=BF<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" cont=
ent=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8" class=3D"">I found a "loophole" in the co=
de. If the deck is freestanding and under 30" high, it doesn't need to be at=
 the frost line. I found these anchored surface footings that might do quite=
 well:<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D""><a href=3D"https:=
//shop.titanbuildingproducts.com/deck-foot.php" class=3D"">https://shop.tita=
nbuildingproducts.com/deck-foot.php</a></div></div></div></div></div></block=
quote><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div class=3D""><div dir=3D"auto"=
 class=3D""><div class=3D""><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><div class=3D""><br c=
lass=3D""></div><div class=3D"">The only issue is that the new deck with be 4=
 steps down from the one anchored to the house, so the connection between th=
e two needs to be fluid, which means one end of the stairs needs to float. I=
'm trying to come up with a design where the risers adjust as the lower deck=
 rises and falls with frost, and the riser heights stay equidistant from eac=
h other, but I'm not getting there. Maybe I build a ramp instead...</div><di=
v class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">jim<br class=3D""><div cla=
ss=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""><div class=3D"">=
<br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div class=3D"">On Apr 2=
2, 2020, at 12:13 AM, Brian Kemp &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" c=
lass=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-intercha=
nge-newline"><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0=
, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; le=
tter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: n=
one; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;=
 text-decoration: none; font-size: 13px; font-family: arial, sans-serif;" cl=
ass=3D"">Try a search for "concrete trailer" or call some local concrete com=
panies.&nbsp; If you can drive a pickup or SUV near the footings, one of the=
se might be the way to go.&nbsp; An explanation is at<span class=3D"Apple-co=
nverted-space">&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"https://www.sepulveda.com/product_fam=
ilies/concrete_to_go/concrete_to_go.php" class=3D"">https://www.sepulveda.co=
m/product_families/concrete_to_go/concrete_to_go.php</a><span class=3D"Apple=
-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0px;" cl=
ass=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div style=3D"margin: 0px;" class=3D"">Brian<b=
r class=3D""></div><blockquote style=3D"padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 0px;=
 border-left-width: 2px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(0,=
 0, 255); font-weight: normal; font-style: normal; text-decoration: none; fo=
nt-size: 10pt; font-family: arial, sans-serif;" class=3D"">-----Original Mes=
sage-----<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D"">From:=
 Jim Franklin via Shop-talk<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</spa=
n><[email-masked] class=3D""><br class=3D"">Sent: Apr 16, 2020 7:4=
4 PM<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D"">To: PJ=
 McGarvey<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><pj_mcgarvey@hot=
mail.com class=3D""><br class=3D"">Cc: Shop-talk<span class=3D"Apple-convert=
ed-space">&nbsp;</span><[email-masked] class=3D""><br class=3D"">S=
ubject: Re: [Shop-talk] Footings and piers for decks<span class=3D"Apple-con=
verted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D""><br class=3D"">Yep, 18" is spot on=
 per the beam and joist spacing, but the pre-cast footer only comes in 22".&=
nbsp;<div class=3D"" style=3D"margin: 0px;"><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D=
"" style=3D"margin: 0px;">Getting the concrete to the location will be diffi=
cult. The house is up a 100' inclined driveway that won't support a full siz=
ed truck, and the then another 100' around back to the site. Even a pumper w=
ould need a lot of hose. Are there smaller/lighter site-mix trucks now? I su=
ppose they could pump it to the top of the driveway and wheelbarrow it aroun=
d back...<br class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0px;" class=3D""><br class=3D"=
"><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div class=3D"" style=3D"margin: 0px;=
">On Apr 16, 2020, at 10:15 PM, PJ McGarvey &lt;<a target=3D"_blank" href=3D=
"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; w=
rote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D"" style=3D"=
margin: 0px;"><div class=3D"" style=3D"margin: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0=
); font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; lette=
r-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none=
; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; te=
xt-decoration: none; font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size:=
 12pt;">I doubt you'll need more than 18" diameter footings for a deck.&nbsp=
;</div><div class=3D"" style=3D"margin: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font=
-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spaci=
ng: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white=
-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-deco=
ration: none; font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;"=
><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"" style=3D"margin: 0px; caret-color: rgb=
(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: norma=
l; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transfo=
rm: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width:=
 0px; text-decoration: none; font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; fo=
nt-size: 12pt;">In any case, I would pay a bit more for concrete delivery. I=
 did this in November for a 16'x16' screened porch I'm almost finished with.=
 For that diameter and depth, that's alot of concrete to mix correctly. In a=
n hour you can have it delivered, poured, and save alot of hassle.&nbsp;</di=
v><div id=3D"appendonsend" class=3D"" style=3D"margin: 0px; caret-color: rgb=
(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font=
-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-ali=
gn: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word=
-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"></div=
><div class=3D"" style=3D"margin: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style=
: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: no=
rmal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space=
: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration=
: none; font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;"><br c=
lass=3D""></div><hr tabindex=3D"-1" class=3D"" style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0=
, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-vari=
ant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: s=
tart; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spac=
ing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; display: in=
line-block; width: 710.5px;"><span class=3D"" style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0=
, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-vari=
ant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: s=
tart; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spac=
ing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none=
; display: inline !important;"></span><div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr" c=
lass=3D"" style=3D"margin: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helv=
etica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-=
weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;=
 text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-=
stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><font class=3D"" face=3D"Calibri,=
 sans-serif" style=3D"font-size: 11pt;"><b class=3D"">From:</b><span class=3D=
"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Shop-talk &lt;<a target=3D"_blank" href=
=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">shop-talk-bounces@au=
tox.team.net</a>&gt; on behalf of Pat Horne via Shop-talk &lt;<a target=3D"_=
blank" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked]=
eam.net</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b class=3D"">Sent:</b><span class=3D"Apple-co=
nverted-space">&nbsp;</span>Thursday, April 16, 2020 7:14 PM<br class=3D""><=
b class=3D"">To:</b><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Jim Fra=
nklin &lt;<a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D=
"">[email-masked]</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b class=3D"">Cc:</b><span c=
lass=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Shop-talk &lt;<a target=3D"_blan=
k" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">[email-masked].=
net</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b class=3D"">Subject:</b><span class=3D"Apple-con=
verted-space">&nbsp;</span>Re: [Shop-talk] Footings and piers for decks</fon=
t><div class=3D"" style=3D"margin: 0px;">&nbsp;</div></div><div class=3D"Bod=
yFragment" style=3D"margin: 0px; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Hel=
vetica; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font=
-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px=
; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text=
-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><font class=3D"" size=3D"2"><spa=
n class=3D"" style=3D"font-size: 11pt;"><div class=3D"PlainText" style=3D"ma=
rgin: 0px;">24=E2=80=9D diameter hole is pretty large. I had 24=E2=80=9D pie=
rs drilled by a company. They brought a large drill truck. I had 3 piers dri=
lled 25=E2=80=99 deep, including bell bottoms. Cost was $800. Only reason I b=
rought this up is it might not be that much over the cost of the skid steer t=
o have someone else drill them.<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;<=
/span><br class=3D""><br class=3D"">Peace,<br class=3D"">Pat<br class=3D""><=
br class=3D"">Pat Horne<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><b=
r class=3D"">We support Habitat for Humanity<br class=3D""><br class=3D""><b=
r class=3D"">&gt; On Apr 16, 2020, at 1:13 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk &l=
t;<a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">s=
[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br class=3D"">&gt;<span class=3D"Appl=
e-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D""><br class=3D"">=EF=BB=BFHavin=
g decided it's better to build a nice ornate deck out of PT than a small sim=
ple deck of of fancy materials, I'm looking at the foundation. Frost line he=
re is 48" and I need 18" footings. I have found 3 options and I'm wondering i=
f I missed anything:<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">1. Traditional concrete wi=
th forms and sonotubes<br class=3D"">2. Pre-cast footings (22", 100 lbs)&nbs=
p; and stackable piers (EZ-Tube)<br class=3D"">3. Helical piles<span class=3D=
"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D""><br class=3D"">I haven't=
 heard back from the town on that last one and they're the priciest at $275 p=
er. The pre-cast are $150 per. Concrete will require hauling about 45,000 ba=
gs into the backyard.<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br c=
lass=3D""><br class=3D"">I'm leaning towards #2 . I don't own any yard equip=
ment but I can rent a skid steer with auger, though not a 24" auger I don't t=
hink.<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">thanks,<br class=3D"">jim<br class=3D"">_=
______________________________________________<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">=
<a target=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" class=3D"">Sho=
[email-masked]</a><br class=3D"">Donate:<span class=3D"Apple-converte=
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</div></div></blockquote></div><br class=3D""></div></div><span class=3D"">_=
______________________________________________</span><br class=3D""><span cl=
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