Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Plug for 14/2 solid wire?

From: Pat Horne via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 14:36:31 -0600

Jim,

> If you are not going to be plugging & unplugging the wire, just go ahead & use a regular plug. The better way to do it is to use a short piece of stranded cord that is attached to the Rolex. The problem with connecting the romex directly to the plug is that the solid wire will break with flexing. If it were me, I’d go ahead & connect the romex to the plug temporarily, then pick up a Piece of stranded & a junction box when convenient. 

Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity

> On Nov 10, 2019, at 2:00 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <[email-masked]> wrote:
> 

I'm addinng external carriage lights and have a 50' roll of 14/2 Romex I'd like to use up, not to mention 50' of 14/2 stranded is almost $1/ft. 

I'd like to have the lights on a timer. I have outlets in the garage, and I happen to have a mechanical timer that you'd use for a livingroom lamp, etc. 

Can I use a regular add-on plug that you'd normally use with stranded wire and just attach the Romex to it? Are there plugs made for solid wire? 

I could always use the Romex to extend the circuit to near the carriage lights and install an outlet for the timer and buy short lamp cord, but that means a trip to the store. That might turn out to be the most time/cost/safety efficient method, but if I don't have to get into the car AGAIN...

thanks,
jim_______________________________________________

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From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 15:44:53 -0500

Jim,

If these are regular wall mounted lights, they should be wired 
directly into a box.  You should add a line from power source to a 
switch and then to the lights.  All of this should be done within the 
walls, ceiling, etc of the building, or in conduit if mounted on the 
surface.  The switch you use can incorporate a timer if 
desired.  There should be no plugs involved, and no lamp cord.  Of 
course you can rig up anything you want and make the lights come on, 
but it won't be proper or safe like that.  Is this intended to be a 
permanent installation?  If it is, do it right.

-Steve

At 03:00 PM 11/10/2019, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote:
>I'm addinng external carriage lights and have a 50' roll of 14/2 
>Romex I'd like to use up, not to mention 50' of 14/2 stranded is almost $1/ft.
>
>I'd like to have the lights on a timer. I have outlets in the 
>garage, and I happen to have a mechanical timer that you'd use for a 
>livingroom lamp, etc.
>
>Can I use a regular add-on plug that you'd normally use with 
>stranded wire and just attach the Romex to it? Are there plugs made 
>for solid wire?
>
>I could always use the Romex to extend the circuit to near the 
>carriage lights and install an outlet for the timer and buy short 
>lamp cord, but that means a trip to the store. That might turn out 
>to be the most time/cost/safety efficient method, but if I don't 
>have to get into the car AGAIN...
>
>thanks,
>jim

[email-masked]

---

From: Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 15:59:02 -0500

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I should have prefaced that I know what "right" is, and it's just not =
gonna happen for various reasons. There will be proper boxes where the =
fixture wiring connects to the Romex, at least. It's the other end =
that's the issue.

A quick Google doesn't find any direct-wire single-gang switches with =
built-in timers, which would be neat. Do you know of any? There's an =
ugly floodlight already switched that I'd like to remove, and if I can =
repurpose the wiring to that into a junction box with the new light =
wiring, and replace the switch with a timered switch, that would be =
quite close to "right".

Heck, I might even get excited enough to buy some rigid conduit for the =
Romex instead of leaving it exposed :-)

jim

> On Nov 10, 2019, at 3:44 PM, Steven Trovato <[email-masked]> =
wrote:
>=20
> Jim,
>=20
> If these are regular wall mounted lights, they should be wired =
directly into a box.  You should add a line from power source to a =
switch and then to the lights.  All of this should be done within the =
walls, ceiling, etc of the building, or in conduit if mounted on the =
surface.  The switch you use can incorporate a timer if desired.  There =
should be no plugs involved, and no lamp cord.  Of course you can rig up =
anything you want and make the lights come on, but it won't be proper or =
safe like that.  Is this intended to be a permanent installation?  If it =
is, do it right.
>=20
>=20
>> I'm addinng external carriage lights and have a 50' roll of 14/2 =
Romex I'd like to use up, not to mention 50' of 14/2 stranded is almost =
$1/ft.
>>=20
>> I'd like to have the lights on a timer. I have outlets in the garage, =
and I happen to have a mechanical timer that you'd use for a livingroom =
lamp, etc.
>>=20
>> Can I use a regular add-on plug that you'd normally use with stranded =
wire and just attach the Romex to it? Are there plugs made for solid =
wire?
>>=20
>> I could always use the Romex to extend the circuit to near the =
carriage lights and install an outlet for the timer and buy short lamp =
cord, but that means a trip to the store. That might turn out to be the =
most time/cost/safety efficient method, but if I don't have to get into =
the car AGAIN...
>>=20
>=20

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[email-masked]

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From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 16:11:28 -0500

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OK, just don't want you to fry anyone or burn the place down.  What 
sort of timer are you looking for?  It seems to me that there are 
dozens of them.

<https://www.homedepot.com/b/Electrical-Wiring-Devices-Light-Controls-Timers/In-Wall/N-5yc1vZc334Z1z17mau>https://www.homedepot.com/b/Electrical-Wiring-Devices-Light-Controls-Timers/In-Wall/N-5yc1vZc334Z1z17mau 

-Steve

At 03:59 PM 11/10/2019, Jim Franklin wrote:
>I should have prefaced that I know what "right" is, and it's just 
>not gonna happen for various reasons. There will be proper boxes 
>where the fixture wiring connects to the Romex, at least. It's the 
>other end that's the issue.
>
>A quick Google doesn't find any direct-wire single-gang switches 
>with built-in timers, which would be neat. Do you know of any? 
>There's an ugly floodlight already switched that I'd like to remove, 
>and if I can repurpose the wiring to that into a junction box with 
>the new light wiring, and replace the switch with a timered switch, 
>that would be quite close to "right".
>
>Heck, I might even get excited enough to buy some rigid conduit for 
>the Romex instead of leaving it exposed :-)
>
>jim

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<body>
OK, just don't want you to fry anyone or burn the place down.&nbsp; What
sort of timer are you looking for?&nbsp; It seems to me that there are
dozens of them.&nbsp; <br><br>
<a href="https://www.homedepot.com/b/Electrical-Wiring-Devices-Light-Controls-Timers/In-Wall/N-5yc1vZc334Z1z17mau">
https://www.homedepot.com/b/Electrical-Wiring-Devices-Light-Controls-Timers/In-Wall/N-5yc1vZc334Z1z17mau</a>
 <br><br>
-Steve<br><br>
At 03:59 PM 11/10/2019, Jim Franklin wrote:<br>
<blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">I should have prefaced that I
know what &quot;right&quot; is, and it's just not gonna happen for
various reasons. There will be proper boxes where the fixture wiring
connects to the Romex, at least. It's the other end that's the
issue.<br><br>
A quick Google doesn't find any direct-wire single-gang switches with
built-in timers, which would be neat. Do you know of any? There's an ugly
floodlight already switched that I'd like to remove, and if I can
repurpose the wiring to that into a junction box with the new light
wiring, and replace the switch with a timered switch, that would be quite
close to &quot;right&quot;.<br><br>
Heck, I might even get excited enough to buy some rigid conduit for the
Romex instead of leaving it exposed :-)<br><br>
jim</blockquote></body>
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[email-masked]

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From: Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 16:20:54 -0500

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I must have used a poor phrase because those are exactly what I was =
hoping you meant. Thanks!

jim

> On Nov 10, 2019, at 4:11 PM, Steven Trovato <[email-masked]> =
wrote:
>=20
> OK, just don't want you to fry anyone or burn the place down.  What =
sort of timer are you looking for?  It seems to me that there are dozens =
of them. =20
> =
https://www.homedepot.com/b/Electrical-Wiring-Devices-Light-Controls-Timer=
s/In-Wall/N-5yc1vZc334Z1z17mau=20
>>=20
>> Heck, I might even get excited enough to buy some rigid conduit for =
>> jim

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From: Brian Kemp via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 13:22:08 -0800

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Jim - Here are two sample single gang timers.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Defiant-15-Amp-In-Wall-3-Way-Daylight-Adjusting-Digital-Timer-Switch-with-Screw-Terminals-White-32648/300524126

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Honeywell-7-Day-Programmable-Timer-Switch-for-Lights-and-Motors-RPLS730B1000-U/206311889

Also, you might want to check about Romex in conduit.  I don't think you 
can do that according to code, except for short sections open at both 
ends.  I think the issue is possible heat buildup and the thermal rating 
of the wire insulation.

Brian

On 11/10/2019 12:59 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote:
> I should have prefaced that I know what "right" is, and it's just not gonna happen for various reasons. There will be proper boxes where the fixture wiring connects to the Romex, at least. It's the other end that's the issue.
>
> A quick Google doesn't find any direct-wire single-gang switches with built-in timers, which would be neat. Do you know of any? There's an ugly floodlight already switched that I'd like to remove, and if I can repurpose the wiring to that into a junction box with the new light wiring, and replace the switch with a timered switch, that would be quite close to "right".
>
> Heck, I might even get excited enough to buy some rigid conduit for the Romex instead of leaving it exposed :-)
>
> jim
>
>> On Nov 10, 2019, at 3:44 PM, Steven Trovato <[email-masked]> wrote:
>>
>> Jim,
>>
>> If these are regular wall mounted lights, they should be wired directly into a box.  You should add a line from power source to a switch and then to the lights.  All of this should be done within the walls, ceiling, etc of the building, or in conduit if mounted on the surface.  The switch you use can incorporate a timer if desired.  There should be no plugs involved, and no lamp cord.  Of course you can rig up anything you want and make the lights come on, but it won't be proper or safe like that.  Is this intended to be a permanent installation?  If it is, do it right.
>>
>> -Steve
>>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]
>

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    Jim - Here are two sample single gang timers. <br>
    <br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.homedepot.com/p/Defiant-15-Amp-In-Wall-3-Way-Daylight-Adjusting-Digital-Timer-Switch-with-Screw-Terminals-White-32648/300524126">https://www.homedepot.com/p/Defiant-15-Amp-In-Wall-3-Way-Daylight-Adjusting-Digital-Timer-Switch-with-Screw-Terminals-White-32648/300524126</a><br>
    <br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://www.homedepot.com/p/Honeywell-7-Day-Programmable-Timer-Switch-for-Lights-and-Motors-RPLS730B1000-U/206311889">https://www.homedepot.com/p/Honeywell-7-Day-Programmable-Timer-Switch-for-Lights-and-Motors-RPLS730B1000-U/206311889</a><br>
    <br>
    Also, you might want to check about Romex in conduit.  I don't think
    you can do that according to code, except for short sections open at
    both ends.  I think the issue is possible heat buildup and the
    thermal rating of the wire insulation.<br>
    <br>
    Brian<br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 11/10/2019 12:59 PM, Jim Franklin
      via Shop-talk wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
      cite="mid:[email-masked]">
      <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">I should have prefaced that I know what "right" is, and it's just not gonna happen for various reasons. There will be proper boxes where the fixture wiring connects to the Romex, at least. It's the other end that's the issue.

A quick Google doesn't find any direct-wire single-gang switches with built-in timers, which would be neat. Do you know of any? There's an ugly floodlight already switched that I'd like to remove, and if I can repurpose the wiring to that into a junction box with the new light wiring, and replace the switch with a timered switch, that would be quite close to "right".

Heck, I might even get excited enough to buy some rigid conduit for the Romex instead of leaving it exposed :-)

jim

</pre>
      <blockquote type="cite">
        <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">On Nov 10, 2019, at 3:44 PM, Steven Trovato <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:[email-masked]">&lt;[email-masked]&gt;</a> wrote:

Jim,

If these are regular wall mounted lights, they should be wired directly into a box.  You should add a line from power source to a switch and then to the lights.  All of this should be done within the walls, ceiling, etc of the building, or in conduit if mounted on the surface.  The switch you use can incorporate a timer if desired.  There should be no plugs involved, and no lamp cord.  Of course you can rig up anything you want and make the lights come on, but it won't be proper or safe like that.  Is this intended to be a permanent installation?  If it is, do it right.

-Steve

At 03:00 PM 11/10/2019, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote:
</pre>
        <blockquote type="cite">
          <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">I'm addinng external carriage lights and have a 50' roll of 14/2 Romex I'd like to use up, not to mention 50' of 14/2 stranded is almost $1/ft.

thanks,
jim
</pre>
        </blockquote>
        <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">
</pre>
      </blockquote>
      <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">
</pre>
      <br>
      <fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
      <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________

<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>
Archive: <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk">http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk</a> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://autox.team.net/archive">http://autox.team.net/archive</a>

</pre>
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From: Jim Franklin via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 16:39:08 -0500

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The code is not clear, i.e. it states a few things that can be =
interpreted as "no Romex in conduit" but doesn't explicitly forbid it. I =
also think it explicitly permits it when going from a protected area (my =
garage walls) to an unprotected area (the new junction box flush mounted =
to the ceiling).=20

Realistically, I'd worry more about heat buildup in an insulated wall =
that I would metal conduit in a garage in New England. I suppose some =
future yahoo could repurpose ths wiring to run something beyond spec, =
but as it'll be hardwired to the 11 watt lights I'm not concerned enough =
to buy individual wires to run through the conduit I am not sure I'll be =
buying yet :-)

jim

> On Nov 10, 2019, at 4:22 PM, Brian Kemp <[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> Jim - Here are two sample single gang timers.=20
>=20
> =
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Defiant-15-Amp-In-Wall-3-Way-Daylight-Adjustin=
g-Digital-Timer-Switch-with-Screw-Terminals-White-32648/300524126
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Honeywell-7-Day-Programmable-Timer-Switch-for-=
Lights-and-Motors-RPLS730B1000-U/206311889
>=20
> Also, you might want to check about Romex in conduit.  I don't think =
you can do that according to code, except for short sections open at =
both ends.  I think the issue is possible heat buildup and the thermal =
rating of the wire insulation.
>>>>=20
>>>> I'd like to have the lights on a timer. I have outlets in the =
garage, and I happen to have a mechanical timer that you'd use for a =
livingroom lamp, etc.
>>>>=20
>>>> Can I use a regular add-on plug that you'd normally use with =
stranded wire and just attach the Romex to it? Are there plugs made for =
solid wire?
>> Donate:=20
>> http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>=20
>> Archive:=20
>> http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>>=20
>>=20
>> Unsubscribe/Manage:=20
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>=20

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