From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Nov 4 15:32:06 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91E18A08A0 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2019 15:32:06 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (unknown [167.206.4.203]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3365BA07F5 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2019 15:32:00 -0700 (MST) bh=i/2+x4nH/8FtBB2fcmzmWytR1/235lPF4gdxgY0JevQ=; h=Message-ID:Date:To:From:Subject; b=rjMN5nAS8rxxj/XjrMMzJbqypl6WL4vLuYGakzVJWkOehykRlezOY0VxVSw/yIfET xhjnxIjWDNt19NGAP/MmS3hwVMXvZgYRqWWmV8czUOQJdqo+HgcODmiixmiE7aarmh t1x13qWJcdIPjWuuDEqObhayzZFeAEM6nWkwF/gsV+Vn1Q8QV5u5kg+akNqGEwPZRi wIb3c4gT9aMonXL1mlBtktabNgQuvpEG5J84alnnKlwPFusX1/WGDDJ7riGS8kCdjo IvOwEjdYi9xQd6BnZ9UDFwuO7r2he4/joD/tUgdmMv+8Q+nNumIOmHVRTRUYCsYzom RvGicwGM4Izdw== Authentication-Results: mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net smtp.user=strovato; auth=pass (LOGIN) a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:117 a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:17 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=RHLcWf7OH1SiqX_L8NwA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 Received: from [67.83.27.177] ([67.83.27.177:54579] helo=Steve-PC.optonline.net) by mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.9.48312 r(Core:3.6.9.0)) with ESMTPA id 3A/EA-13198-FD6A0CD5; Mon, 04 Nov 2019 17:31:59 -0500 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2019 17:31:23 -0500 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <003901d58abc$09225f70$1b671e50$@GMail.com> Subject: [Shop-talk] tire balancing From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Two years ago, I purchased a set of Michelin tires for my Ford Expedition at BJs. It was not a great experience, and I don't think I'd do it again. The tires do come with a road hazard warranty, though, and free flat repair. I got a puncture in the right rear yesterday, so I ventured down to BJs once again. The guy there asked me if it was a front or rear tire. He said they balance them differently. He said it was "statically balanced" but on a machine that spins it and uses lasers. I don't know what he is talking about. I told him it is a rear tire, but that shouldn't matter, because it will be a front tire when I rotate them. He told me I shouldn't do that. I have to bring the vehicle to them to rotate and re-balance. None of this makes any sense to me. Have things changed drastically or is this guy nuts? I should note that all this stuff is free when you buy the tires there, so I don't really see any financial motive for them to want to do this. -Steve -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Nov 4 15:53:47 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 143A1A0415 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2019 15:53:47 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-oi1-f177.google.com (unknown [209.85.167.177]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3957BA03B1 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2019 15:53:43 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-oi1-f177.google.com with SMTP id y194so15760655oie.4 for ; Mon, 04 Nov 2019 14:53:43 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=oiCvCChZLbfcLAgK07BA4ooVzbIBq8n6+gBBXlk/U7c=; b=tu0iXN7f46cLmOdCg23Qp921vw1UjAzvCCp8PjDpHWS8pyjV+M8Fkh/q0yl/fnmvBQ dlvQ9LxwheR+dMKBBkk2FEuYq27quT5HBhFfxur4RaegHdJAsNgBXtLXx6iWUuzvFR86 heUytmK9hxjAPSUy9G1PAJsQhLfiOc57m9QtQbMxiNFz/V948XgaEBtLyDSAj2QevsY5 S0FRXCfdsIuGyt60Km+y6/itx9W/1/bdF+t5Fs9yBq+mYOeGM1lwCHZqXoEpkRCmepjt oLCuByGR41NfNuB84I4OongNqoypL8qQwPAYeP7dYsnBZ/KBSfoMTBuIPY9p0Ce4ZJhj DUbw== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=oiCvCChZLbfcLAgK07BA4ooVzbIBq8n6+gBBXlk/U7c=; b=U8TRBMrBAPBK+VlApAOjrE8+qahbJf6cgIy9dQejCoa1t38sSQe8fL8Dxfxjyu3k/5 inh3144YsnVFZ2QsfOplEm1SQ8EAT/WRAp6iOjsvCQCHwJ7cHFLWVkh0QFUO89HswyU9 KwiK0gjnkNufPo8Nh38ZnjAcL3f1zlCvtRwXza5DPhmGRu4ITnDMtzRlSl5Plq6mwYOB +zoKczxt3fPvawf+Hf8HomnXpnJ5WfemqJ0qBw7Kf4vJ6lLGiuu1ABAaRxq1Sehpn06Q GQW59+RMnhgzQqvCgWszQzRZ0e45qfCTPBPkZPDYzZKOxKC2S/eHwHdmRvsnYVZnfg2D 6RKA== SDZ9MeuDt8mq4ub4I5VC/1cXARcLDY1Kc4LD4ts= Mon, 04 Nov 2019 14:53:42 -0800 (PST) References: <003901d58abc$09225f70$1b671e50$@GMail.com> <3A.EA.13198.FD6A0CD5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2019 17:53:30 -0500 To: Steven Trovato Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] tire balancing From: Benjamin Zwissler via Shop-talk Cc: Shop-Talk List Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4279335172903306992== --000000000000f104a905968d2f11 Well, I vote he has no clue what he's talking about. What I learned was that static and spin balancing were not the same thing. Static was done with a bubble balance without spinning. Spinning meant spinning. There was spinning on the car and spinning off the car, but I don't think anyone does it on the car anymore. I don't know why they would balance front and back differently, seems like balanced is balanced regardless of front or rear. On Mon, Nov 4, 2019, 5:32 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk < shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote: > Two years ago, I purchased a set of Michelin tires for my Ford > Expedition at BJs. It was not a great experience, and I don't think > I'd do it again. The tires do come with a road hazard warranty, > though, and free flat repair. I got a puncture in the right rear > yesterday, so I ventured down to BJs once again. The guy there asked > me if it was a front or rear tire. He said they balance them > differently. He said it was "statically balanced" but on a machine > that spins it and uses lasers. I don't know what he is talking > about. I told him it is a rear tire, but that shouldn't matter, > because it will be a front tire when I rotate them. He told me I > shouldn't do that. I have to bring the vehicle to them to rotate and > re-balance. None of this makes any sense to me. Have things changed > drastically or is this guy nuts? I should note that all this stuff > is free when you buy the tires there, so I don't really see any > financial motive for them to want to do this. > > -Steve > > > -- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bjzwissler@gmail.com > > --000000000000f104a905968d2f11 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Well, I vote he has no clue what he's talking about.= =C2=A0 What I learned was that static and spin balancing were not the same = thing.=C2=A0 Static was done with a bubble balance without spinning.=C2=A0 = Spinning meant spinning.=C2=A0 There was spinning on the car and spinning o= ff the car, but I don't think anyone does it on the car anymore.

I don't know why they would bala= nce front and back differently, seems like balanced is balanced regardless = of front or rear.

On Mon, Nov 4, 2019, 5:32 PM Steven Trovato via Shop= -talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:
Two years ago, I purchased a set of Michelin tires for= my Ford
Expedition at BJs.=C2=A0 It was not a great experience, and I don't thi= nk
I'd do it again.=C2=A0 The tires do come with a road hazard warranty, <= br> though, and free flat repair.=C2=A0 I got a puncture in the right rear
yesterday, so I ventured down to BJs once again.=C2=A0 The guy there asked =
me if it was a front or rear tire.=C2=A0 He said they balance them
differently.=C2=A0 He said it was "statically balanced" but on a = machine
that spins it and uses lasers.=C2=A0 I don't know what he is talking about.=C2=A0 I told him it is a rear tire, but that shouldn't matter, <= br> because it will be a front tire when I rotate them.=C2=A0 He told me I
shouldn't do that.=C2=A0 I have to bring the vehicle to them to rotate = and
re-balance.=C2=A0 None of this makes any sense to me.=C2=A0 Have things cha= nged
drastically or is this guy nuts?=C2=A0 I should note that all this stuff is free when you buy the tires there, so I don't really see any
financial motive for them to want to do this.

-Steve


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Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/= shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
alk/bjzwissler@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer noreferrer" target= =3D"_blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bjzwissler@gmai= l.com

--000000000000f104a905968d2f11-- --===============4279335172903306992== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============4279335172903306992==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Nov 4 15:55:40 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E010A046B for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2019 15:55:40 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-vs1-f46.google.com (unknown [209.85.217.46]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4D4EA037F for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2019 15:55:37 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-vs1-f46.google.com with SMTP id y23so5629409vso.1 for ; Mon, 04 Nov 2019 14:55:37 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=lsClEjo1vsws6acQO+c+5qs11SOL+CzTQL8zwtJcQCE=; b=Z4GbsZpO4McUf0aNAbiJCbTJMIU/yKSiIqqJPwH5AGolZpkmb5spOKfiKVDhyl1gPG 8aeIAbhI/sKE8pzWP59/sGoM6LkucbQraM62OVuSTyOSAtbvckj0XOfj7XFXSfPmzp9T bmFBAD33qeua670sNGMI6slB7ovo39xRYR5GYl0CIns8YEo2yrcSivHHaGpnecoKqzb+ HO3VU5KgUuuDBRTwRvY1kuXaroB+79zcOSiGjay1Txb8Pw3KdBSEqiqFV2UnmudpJmz1 NlgoUSUhGRRfrONiCXz7Ko5RjyurTGWSRp7q7r3xO6l9vV2wUsIDZnKhW3uK2t83dSAm SPYA== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=lsClEjo1vsws6acQO+c+5qs11SOL+CzTQL8zwtJcQCE=; b=eag33Q0IRJzgm4pf0cxuF5cx0B7tAZI6Nd948R50Wd0t59TzV8VcYFKcIxmyieuTzq M++tYhuKwzLzTMLfeqa/xFdQmK7xNovUo2oLus2zVdHN54WiuppSN7IkyMSBqYEpAytf YCc1x9hSSXUGSA663e5vcwddd5HkPDY1m4s+0W1c6WKZrZlUeB5ODKSkntIMV8b5LGmW OUmG2GK4buTBkwjqegGencjYhSbsRazF5q5djppn2KuYGrT2VR0DBb/7BLuK16aNu7pi p+Ng+WCi+nz+ZtTjB9l+yDM/cxGm1rEnxYntdPYxA0SG4lzUoRpAqrYlbAQKzQ6zremJ AhgA== zNT0K7GQrCRZRYMa/wh6N+8y2jOBCcXahnJuKVk= c129mr13787954vsc.204.1572908137143; Mon, 04 Nov 2019 14:55:37 -0800 (PST) References: <003901d58abc$09225f70$1b671e50$@GMail.com> <3A.EA.13198.FD6A0CD5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2019 14:55:26 -0800 To: Steven Trovato Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] tire balancing From: old dirtbeard via Shop-talk Cc: shop-talk@autox.team.net Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8482398426016855895== --000000000000c7626305968d36b5 HI Steve, I believe that most tire warranties require tire rotation to be valid. If it is a Corvette with offset front and rears, I realize that you could not rotate front to rear, but for normal vehicles, this does not make sense to me... best, doug On Mon, Nov 4, 2019 at 2:32 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk < shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote: > Two years ago, I purchased a set of Michelin tires for my Ford > Expedition at BJs. It was not a great experience, and I don't think > I'd do it again. The tires do come with a road hazard warranty, > though, and free flat repair. I got a puncture in the right rear > yesterday, so I ventured down to BJs once again. The guy there asked > me if it was a front or rear tire. He said they balance them > differently. He said it was "statically balanced" but on a machine > that spins it and uses lasers. I don't know what he is talking > about. I told him it is a rear tire, but that shouldn't matter, > because it will be a front tire when I rotate them. He told me I > shouldn't do that. I have to bring the vehicle to them to rotate and > re-balance. None of this makes any sense to me. Have things changed > drastically or is this guy nuts? I should note that all this stuff > is free when you buy the tires there, so I don't really see any > financial motive for them to want to do this. > > -Steve > > > -- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@live.com > > --000000000000c7626305968d36b5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
HI Steve,

I believe=C2=A0that most tire= warranties require tire rotation to be valid.=C2=A0

If it is a Corvette with=C2=A0offset front and rears, I realize that you= could not rotate front to rear, but for normal vehicles, this does not mak= e=C2=A0sense to me...

best,

doug
On Mon, Nov 4, 2019 at 2:32 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk &l= t;shop-talk@autox.team.net&= gt; wrote:
Two y= ears ago, I purchased a set of Michelin tires for my Ford
Expedition at BJs.=C2=A0 It was not a great experience, and I don't thi= nk
I'd do it again.=C2=A0 The tires do come with a road hazard warranty, <= br> though, and free flat repair.=C2=A0 I got a puncture in the right rear
yesterday, so I ventured down to BJs once again.=C2=A0 The guy there asked =
me if it was a front or rear tire.=C2=A0 He said they balance them
differently.=C2=A0 He said it was "statically balanced" but on a = machine
that spins it and uses lasers.=C2=A0 I don't know what he is talking about.=C2=A0 I told him it is a rear tire, but that shouldn't matter, <= br> because it will be a front tire when I rotate them.=C2=A0 He told me I
shouldn't do that.=C2=A0 I have to bring the vehicle to them to rotate = and
re-balance.=C2=A0 None of this makes any sense to me.=C2=A0 Have things cha= nged
drastically or is this guy nuts?=C2=A0 I should note that all this stuff is free when you buy the tires there, so I don't really see any
financial motive for them to want to do this.

-Steve


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Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt= p://autox.team.net/archive

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--000000000000c7626305968d36b5-- --===============8482398426016855895== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8482398426016855895==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Nov 4 16:12:19 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C0D1A076C for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2019 16:12:19 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (unknown [167.206.4.202]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B343A06B3 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2019 16:12:13 -0700 (MST) bh=okjEibCCDF9mia7G8SA4jtNNBuQHjMSJNYTyjzRtJtc=; h=Message-ID:Date:To:From:Subject; b=Re1ivyz6I7YXwiA00ODALG3p7DBpYsUodmw41xMF6lNOWNNembUMe8MSjNQZnfo6S qNwksBrHwlvkR7AvSWsw1H1sivFHzNynNceXHMczY+BE+y1VbiuiqZLBXzfONM/qWO 5YbvUusCETOwDBSt7lX0K8XeB+gnDnOZnVW1TE8GEXaM7KHmrKmkXymqlQu55fkOeY 8Zoyr7pYm/LJD1bQBlVukfI4CN9mrtV8ECTKifoWdEBrZqzDDNIX6jUJVqUaHbLkQ4 N0ZSOocDCsDQ3Qf5+wA3ZW2Jo9CoPApttJ80wbLNWqNEUShe1Uf83bWZ5dUiBnvJLw idrqv0bGCai2g== Authentication-Results: mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net smtp.user=strovato; auth=pass (LOGIN) a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:117 a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:17 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=B6Fnm1GfkY3oYs9THYAA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=nL8ZNxYgLMx0OGOyQEAA:9 a=zCaGD9h07PFswrVk:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=GGGinmgZRQXmVEG1E52S:22 Received: from [67.83.27.177] ([67.83.27.177:63151] helo=Steve-PC.optonline.net) by mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.9.48312 r(Core:3.6.9.0)) with ESMTPA id CF/F5-09517-C40B0CD5; Mon, 04 Nov 2019 18:12:12 -0500 Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2019 18:11:50 -0500 To: Shop-Talk List Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] tire balancing From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============1474815094670883947== boundary="=====================_116384889==.ALT" --=====================_116384889==.ALT Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable All the stuff you guys are saying is exactly what I always understood. I am quite sure they are not doing on the car balancing. Especially not for this tire, because I just brought in the loose wheel while I kept using the car with the spare. I cannot report what was actually done because the garage area is completely separate from where the customer gets to be. Maybe if it was a hot summer day I could peek in the open garage door. The main question I had is whether different balancing on front and rear was now a "thing." Apparently not. Thanks. -Steve At 05:56 PM 11/4/2019, Ian McFetridge wrote: >Got me at a loss, unless it is done on the car >and they are also balancing the rotating >assembly, do front/rear could matter.=C2 It would >be telling to report what he actually does. > >On Mon, Nov 4, 2019 at 5:53 PM Benjamin Zwissler >via Shop-talk >Well, I vote he has no clue what he's talking >about.=C2 What I learned was that static and spin >balancing were not the same thing.=C2 Static was >done with a bubble balance without >spinning.=C2 Spinning meant spinning.=C2 There was >spinning on the car and spinning off the car, >but I don't think anyone does it on the car anymore. >I don't know why they would balance front and >back differently, seems like balanced is balanced regardless of front or r= ear. >On Mon, Nov 4, 2019, 5:32 PM Steven Trovato via e: > >Two years ago, I purchased a set of Michelin tires for my Ford >Expedition at BJs.=C2 It was not a great experience, and I don't think >I'd do it again.=C2 The tires do come with a road hazard warranty, >though, and free flat repair.=C2 I got a puncture in the right rear >yesterday, so I ventured down to BJs once again.=C2 The guy there asked >me if it was a front or rear tire.=C2 He said they balance them >differently.=C2 He said it was "statically balanced" but on a machine >that spins it and uses lasers.=C2 I don't know what he is talking >about.=C2 I told him it is a rear tire, but that shouldn't matter, >because it will be a front tire when I rotate them.=C2 He told me I >shouldn't do that.=C2 I have to bring the vehicle to them to rotate and >re-balance.=C2 None of this makes any sense to me.=C2 Have things change= d >drastically or is this guy nuts?=C2 I should note that all this stuff >is free when you buy the tires there, so I don't really see any >financial motive for them to want to do this. > >-Steve -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus --=====================_116384889==.ALT Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable All the stuff you guys are saying is exactly what I always understood.  I am quite sure they are not doing on the car balancing.  Especially not for this tire, because I just brought in the loose wheel while I kept using the car with the spare.  I cannot report what was actually done because the garage area is completely separate from where the customer gets to be.  Maybe if it was a hot summer day I could peek in the open garage door.     The main question I had is whether different balancing on front and rear was now a "thing."  Apparently not.  Thanks.

-Steve

At 05:56 PM 11/4/2019, Ian McFetridge wrote:
Got me at a loss, unless it = is done on the car and they are also balancing the rotating assembly, do front/rear could matter.=C2  It would be telling to report what he actually does.

On Mon, Nov 4, 2019 at 5:53 PM Benjamin Zwissler via Shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net > wrote:
Well, I vote he has no clue what he's talking about.=C2  What I learned was that static and spin balancing were not the same thing.=C2  Static was done with a bubble balance without spinning.=C2  Spinning meant spinning.=C2  There was spinning on the car and spinning off the car, but I don't think anyone does it on the car anymore.
I don't know why they would balance front and back differently, seems like balanced is balanced regardless of front or rear.
On Mon, Nov 4, 2019, 5:32 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net > wrote:

Two years ago, I purchased a set of Michelin tires for my Ford
Expedition at BJs.=C2  It was not a great experience, and I don't think
I'd do it again.=C2  The tires do come with a road hazard warranty,
though, and free flat repair.=C2  I got a puncture in the right rear
yesterday, so I ventured down to BJs once again.=C2  The guy there= asked
me if it was a front or rear tire.=C2  He said they balance them
differently.=C2  He said it was "statically balanced" but on a machine
that spins it and uses lasers.=C2  I don't know what he is talking=
about.=C2  I told him it is a rear tire, but that shouldn't matter,
because it will be a front tire when I rotate them.=C2  He told me= I
shouldn't do that.=C2  I have to bring the vehicle to them to rotate and
re-balance.=C2  None of this makes any sense to me.=C2  Have things changed
drastically or is this guy nuts?=C2  I should note that all this stuff
is free when you buy the tires there, so I don't really see any
financial motive for them to want to do this.

-Steve
--=====================_116384889==.ALT-- --===============1474815094670883947== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============1474815094670883947==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Mon Nov 4 20:18:30 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BAB61A076F for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2019 20:18:30 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-il1-f177.google.com (unknown [209.85.166.177]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74037A0754 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2019 20:18:24 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-il1-f177.google.com with SMTP id n18so9852014ilt.9 for ; Mon, 04 Nov 2019 19:18:24 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=y1x361Yf0pMT+gfBJhwmBnbFjHuQ4XytlVKQ1Xj0PZ8=; b=Fye44C60loZYk6oxhzx5yMedHp3yeAIR0q1nNSDuKTILqbjswHoTjsjsL+A5BAaVxA xsSmC3+a4HFko42hjtd9XAN37R5RL4yG6lqT/jXRhQp+INSfdWNIN8A3xg7PryfDtmhz TAb12MPLCg2BqIZGHoEZ56zNjfs+Qzt+cybiZYjRHSgsBbawPWakebpTp6XJ2dAjzQJm nVjKVWiGyi5F1iWubk8EqUoDrAMRqAPt6xUsMb02vxMNC6+TAQsF8b3GW9ftZx75q+7Z gXzMVtMARWRbv4oSdY5KqV+TmNMLgvwHvhoTKzkNJ0Oe+E/XfHxuQ6OTldT2HSOiRWBQ CMgQ== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=y1x361Yf0pMT+gfBJhwmBnbFjHuQ4XytlVKQ1Xj0PZ8=; b=P9XHe3odoDq7I8pj82YIERbu5AFHUw4MKY0SjyygPKbJuqATcTQxoaYWVNpuWUGL0r wpqvggYnXXTdcsVQNTKmSZ12fNwEJcp3Lt/7NjV6w0dhPdyJu0Vav6L7dNxi8XJp2xNu UA0I9+aTFVp5FpX0fgHa/swBFbKf3tkAcVqLhRWNva2c5hJLaSpthhgjxMFdXpuK7tIg Okrf2lH/kRrlUFkNXIl5km9Oh/aP7KJ3cAQm1CyhI8GYeF+pZzWdLB6Slnr6fRGNPT3q c55bIDPYPk2fwPHw1Qa5W05MZRIa6BRcNVYtPsHSfBRllrLSwPA6emYWJdHiyitgGcCP dOLg== 2HflqbHuShFw5lG1JPZhvbAVwIQw/4TSppR1hQ== Mon, 04 Nov 2019 19:18:23 -0800 (PST) References: <003901d58abc$09225f70$1b671e50$@GMail.com> <3A.EA.13198.FD6A0CD5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2019 21:18:12 -0600 To: Steven Trovato , shop-talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] tire balancing From: David Scheidt via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net On Mon, Nov 4, 2019 at 4:32 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk wrote: > > Two years ago, I purchased a set of Michelin tires for my Ford > Expedition at BJs. It was not a great experience, and I don't think > I'd do it again. The tires do come with a road hazard warranty, > though, and free flat repair. I got a puncture in the right rear > yesterday, so I ventured down to BJs once again. The guy there asked > me if it was a front or rear tire. He said they balance them > differently. He said it was "statically balanced" but on a machine > that spins it and uses lasers. I don't know what he is talking > about. I told him it is a rear tire, but that shouldn't matter, > because it will be a front tire when I rotate them. He told me I > shouldn't do that. I have to bring the vehicle to them to rotate and > re-balance. None of this makes any sense to me. Have things changed > drastically or is this guy nuts? I should note that all this stuff > is free when you buy the tires there, so I don't really see any > financial motive for them to want to do this. There are a fair number of shops that balance the front wheels-to-be when rotating tires. Fronts cause more complaints (you tend to feel the wobble in the steering wheel), so making sure they're balance can save a come back. The fronts are probably okay, or the the customer would complain. I can't imagine any reason to balance the ends differently, and any repaired tire should be balanced. (I, of course, repaired hundreds of tires without balancing them, or dismounting for inspection, when I did this stuff for money, but I never did my own that way, and wouldn't put up with it today on a modern low profile tire.) there are wheel balancers that have lasers, but I'll the ones I've ever seen just use it to put a line where the weight goes. (this saves much time, and given most wheel techs need bibs, mistakes.) There are fancy machines that use sonar to detect the size of the wheel assembly (which it needs to know to figure out weights). again saves time and errors/ -- David Scheidt dmscheidt@gmail.com _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 09:33:03 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEAADA0381 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 09:33:03 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qt1-f177.google.com (unknown [209.85.160.177]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD8EBA034A for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 09:32:48 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-qt1-f177.google.com with SMTP id r22so20113536qtt.2 for ; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 08:32:48 -0800 (PST) h=from:mime-version:subject:message-id:date:to; bh=DOsda2fmwXSfti5oX8oantO8OWcA0XeutVVOQydSFHU=; b=fYkQbyRqgTYYbHDWMiUezN55CAkdge5+Ze8dBMzmeAFckQTzB+fovwaFrkMUzKN/hH OBtyWyugED7rIu16ueYc3TfBIQ5S/izN4Bch6HwIl05kqdnx7P35Z+LXffBljJ1TpXUC srcPvRfOtMlwG3UJk2jV0n0De88yyFPSijXRug9M2IVmobrtpfRb15Tsj1SQ6wqLoVT5 PWYMyQNS5srlsJ4nl/B1mMfnjWbYWhOup+6aNOeDI/arzxKlPBXUVv3I1arvbRRorH54 PYj6sNnqudXGT3IHQbgExqMOZHOV5BFto/zJz9WS6DC31g774Llit7iFMEIgRN89MNyS +BoA== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:mime-version:subject:message-id:date:to; bh=DOsda2fmwXSfti5oX8oantO8OWcA0XeutVVOQydSFHU=; b=uYUaOdi8IFxA17O3uSahUmpNpF6ZQJlPUYl3rArxF2ZkRMa91GcV7SS1P6pmTPH/Bm Bz1zVE4EEsrgQWFzJ43abblwA22VT1QInAGpfTsNH9Or1CH2HGRo7kUGH8QXVOzulVBy eBxruk8Ug02iUElcPXtHDtUhoLlZicVDWgyPoRmvrYdkdlegzNe0WaBmbSFwxlrTa4Np sRFYBuw9X6xcn5RdMh9K0t+dKaYqiKD06is0SXl6hoP08LBOWdWDJxch1Q7z186Aj9NV XDbAeyvC2IEtSZMO8aI5OxEQbx+O2A7xdqRRwU09H5E8UeMB0pgP6yT3CWcIRrv/fmgF 0aJQ== eOxZVZgkSEKRDdfmyybxrIY87nJj Tue, 05 Nov 2019 08:32:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from macbook-pro-2.home (ool-43526917.dyn.optonline.net. [67.82.105.23]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id q3sm11066946qkf.18.2019.11.05.08.32.46 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 05 Nov 2019 08:32:46 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2019 11:32:45 -0500 To: Shop Talk Subject: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: Jim Stone via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4500850619441144109== boundary="Apple-Mail=_4815058E-B302-4E2B-8A46-491EB06BAC6F" --Apple-Mail=_4815058E-B302-4E2B-8A46-491EB06BAC6F Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 I need to drain and winterize my new sprinkler system and can=E2=80=99t = imagine I need to pay someone to do that job. While I understand the = =E2=80=98proper=E2=80=99 way to do it is to manually open each valve, I = was told a few years ago that it is easier to just pressurize the system = at the drain valve and then use the manual function on the controller to = run through each zone until no more water comes out. (FWIW, my system = is not that large and has 6 zones.). I was thinking about rigging = something up that would allow me to attach my compressor and walk away, = but found this on Amazon, which seems like a good investment that would = pay for itself on the first use: = https://www.amazon.com/Winterize-Sprinkler-Systems-Outdoor-Faucets/dp/B005= 5QAAIQ/ref=3Dasc_df_B0055QAAIQ/?tag=3Dhyprod-20&linkCode=3Ddf0&hvadid=3D30= 9735714375&hvpos=3D1o1&hvnetw=3Dg&hvrand=3D11131050794144962178&hvpone=3D&= hvptwo=3D&hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3Dc&hvdvcmdl=3D&hvlocint=3D&hvlocphy=3D9004590&hv= targid=3Dpla-570302725618&psc=3D1 = . I could save around $10 and just = buy a hose to quick disconnect fitting, but the shut off valve seems = like a good addition. I have fairly large compressor, but think it will be more trouble than = it is worth to get air to the master drain valve. Instead, I was = planning on just using my Harbor Freight 8 gal portable compressor. = (https://www.harborfreight.com/8-gal-2-hp-125-psi-oil-lube-air-compressor-= 68740.html = ). My water pressure is regulated to 60 lbs, so I figured = something around this should be sufficient. Am I missing anything? Is there any good reason to pay a professional = to do this job? It seems like a no-brainer to me, but I=E2=80=99ve been = called a no-brainer before. Thanks, Jim= --Apple-Mail=_4815058E-B302-4E2B-8A46-491EB06BAC6F Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 I = need to drain and winterize my new sprinkler system and can=E2=80=99t = imagine I need to pay someone to do that job.  While I understand = the =E2=80=98proper=E2=80=99 way to do it is to manually open each = valve, I was told a few years ago that it is easier to just pressurize = the system at the drain valve and then use the manual function on the = controller to run through each zone until no more water comes out. =  (FWIW, my system is not that large and has 6 zones.). I was = thinking about rigging something up that would allow me to attach my = compressor and walk away, but found this on Amazon, which seems like a = good investment that would pay for itself on the first use: https://www.amazon.com/Winterize-Sprinkler-Systems-Outdoor-Fauc= ets/dp/B0055QAAIQ/ref=3Dasc_df_B0055QAAIQ/?tag=3Dhyprod-20&linkCode=3D= df0&hvadid=3D309735714375&hvpos=3D1o1&hvnetw=3Dg&hvrand=3D= 11131050794144962178&hvpone=3D&hvptwo=3D&hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3D= c&hvdvcmdl=3D&hvlocint=3D&hvlocphy=3D9004590&hvtargid=3Dpl= a-570302725618&psc=3D1. I could save around $10 and just buy a = hose to quick disconnect fitting, but the shut off valve seems like a = good addition.

I = have fairly large compressor, but think it will be more trouble than it = is worth to get air to the master drain valve.  Instead, I was = planning on just using my Harbor Freight 8 gal portable compressor. =  (https://www.harborfreight.com/8-gal-2-hp-125-psi-oil-lube-air-c= ompressor-68740.html).   My water pressure is regulated to 60 = lbs, so I figured something around this should be sufficient.

Am I missing anything? =  Is there any good reason to pay a professional to do this job? =  It seems like a no-brainer to me, but I=E2=80=99ve been called a = no-brainer before.

Thanks,
Jim
= --Apple-Mail=_4815058E-B302-4E2B-8A46-491EB06BAC6F-- --===============4500850619441144109== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============4500850619441144109==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 09:40:13 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F2184A0541 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 09:40:12 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic303-27.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (unknown [98.137.64.208]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4193DA04E1 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 09:40:06 -0700 (MST) t=1572972005; bh=bpTV0F4So0Lq+2W2sKz8RLT96tVQ2FZ8qIZ1+SKWwSM=; h=From:To:References:In-Reply-To:Subject:Date:From:Subject; b=KuR3b5IU+KLQrPjXc54dPrPx8hcGgdDH44nLxVswrGbd+2RClNJ9oOor2fNiPskjmUsBmVQVTAYbiyPks5BSR3BaHuCQdZEqUd4bNdwcwd6HLjjdAEJS6V3REo0gv4LDa2Pdyjc5yXVwC3RzNC3dzwCnz/JyJW9x56IfvgSU4Rk= YAM09UQRVu6MgO5IIfk9CMy8nfiu_eop2TmB8qgtr7dsgbpZjPLeBEciRX4pJcqk1e3TigAMksPy .1L2nQTRTj6EqAWSYoLMnn5L1Faeb8r1BEl0dsqu7GKFcVOhZXgDJtBHFZU60yNEAQq2AA4yYUh8 ZVT8RmzRlf1uF_s8cjElAqR4Ub02K8aIoh12eU5gLabGqeH2dYLVWOrwuIdmdb4SWrC3exO_8OAa z_HU7PtvBAhvaoMNzAMzBxqRC9zj2_i3Jcp862wH41Sfds6xavl95WabiI429ZGz3j4oHp0AR6T. CuSPgq3nW_twM3Bxyajy4tU1dyWeRiLIIdaq7cGI57w0WT.BfGDRW3zye5StZnGw329xHZ9746.v o6mry19N9up0ZD_saKOnIQsU3oFpRY0Q00ZJaHxfnJ3Zn3Qhm8OzjoKPeItXgdBeX8.8ccLn3Atl 9ruFphWyQTJpMWSsdzYrgxGBrMUeU1NLm4iraundcK_cvCOpDdZi.I1ym.DO.eJikpD7vXTzGxhd ._aIYfBObssLnWno.6D8R.YMkPoho5kmhdtnTTx9hpxoWDLcWZ_.Qmaaa255IBW9jtvCXWp0BcfY cX3fps5pP70zG.oqyC1Ov.kKvbdwazg6nrxKlktT.c4BrNwuLEfUZuskxP4SssE79OSLGZLh1tlh Ass4sI3AZ6HyMSFtccsc6Q1BjfcvLgfkV9R0aXmP0IbtGPhLZU6adhN2YZ8cmMmgtse77gLXz4t6 exrvMj04Oyq8nA3qbFUq7R8xPAm.S8jXRHYlBX1hBqFZNGdyGSQJ0L_JH6OQyHLbZFyQbD46LiG5 1Nb758jfzzb87a6F8L4922pVDh6hEBG8CwWcmns4CBydhkS8YPbE2ni_ZtMv1xOL5WSUhYbOi4x. a8SzTbS2KxssCxgKUuQlBFV9m_u2Wz7XViwt2TczTCe756B1jKforBbqLuWtdBEOlu0OLSf7BmpX JKuHQAm1fqYcFFM9GloPg8MFORHW57cL7E8xGoczY.3jD7hkPIEUKxEzg0OW1q5J2SrZvJZz0jwZ gUueTrMzFl7Ha7A0K3aBDLavDsNxmwwSol9pYk._Wm29_pPlaOZZErf8Zd73X_4qVxeenQMz_QLn OKAq_3ZIwwwY5ArokcB9Z0osz0veplFlv4zOh6Xdttbqdm6GIRwXn8.mK7MglX0IpxylFtvdnLIb NwKnPlFGaDBmzBpld7h2TEYuTnWYXVu2gLgJurlAl_kP9.b7wjVOKUW5FoiLg_BtIyAaeEGT_hIf PdnmWoSkdl5ApDySPy_VBLez3r2TMGr13iOgIYMmP52m8jBmzzsg32OziBJxtIjP9pt97FA4l1EP ZR1tyGQU0A.iugQ-- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic303.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 16:40:05 +0000 Received: by smtp425.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID be5bdb757cce7c069223b5c4f94a4944; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 16:40:02 +0000 (UTC) To: "Jim Stone" <1789alpine@gmail.com>, "shop-talk" References: Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2019 10:40:02 -0600 Importance: Normal Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: john niolon via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============4422468503604430483== boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0950_01D593C5.61328980" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0950_01D593C5.61328980 charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Jim. I do the same every year. My system is a little larger = 1500=E2=80=99 of pipe in 7 zones. I have a backflow preventer valve on = my sprinkler main line from the house main. It has a port on each side = of the valve that you can screw a male air compressor fitting into. I = simply drag my hose out the box and using a standard quick coupler on = the hose connect it to the male fitting on the BFP valve. =20 Then, I manually cycle thru each zone till I get no water at the = farthest sprinkler head... easy to do and doesn=E2=80=99t take but a = minute or two on each zone. john=20 From: Jim Stone via Shop-talk=20 Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2019 10:32 AM To: Shop Talk=20 Subject: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System I need to drain and winterize my new sprinkler system and can=E2=80=99t = imagine I need to pay someone to do that job. While I understand the = =E2=80=98proper=E2=80=99 way to do it is to manually open each valve, I = was told a few years ago that it is easier to just pressurize the system = at the drain valve and then use the manual function on the controller to = run through each zone until no more water comes out. (FWIW, my system = is not that large and has 6 zones.). I was thinking about rigging = something up that would allow me to attach my compressor and walk away, = but found this on Amazon, which seems like a good investment that would = pay for itself on the first use: = https://www.amazon.com/Winterize-Sprinkler-Systems-Outdoor-Faucets/dp/B00= 55QAAIQ/ref=3Dasc_df_B0055QAAIQ/?tag=3Dhyprod-20&linkCode=3Ddf0&hvadid=3D= 309735714375&hvpos=3D1o1&hvnetw=3Dg&hvrand=3D11131050794144962178&hvpone=3D= &hvptwo=3D&hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3Dc&hvdvcmdl=3D&hvlocint=3D&hvlocphy=3D9004590&= hvtargid=3Dpla-570302725618&psc=3D1. I could save around $10 and just = buy a hose to quick disconnect fitting, but the shut off valve seems = like a good addition.=20 I have fairly large compressor, but think it will be more trouble than = it is worth to get air to the master drain valve. Instead, I was = planning on just using my Harbor Freight 8 gal portable compressor. = (https://www.harborfreight.com/8-gal-2-hp-125-psi-oil-lube-air-compressor= -68740.html). My water pressure is regulated to 60 lbs, so I figured = something around this should be sufficient. Am I missing anything? Is there any good reason to pay a professional = to do this job? It seems like a no-brainer to me, but I=E2=80=99ve been = called a no-brainer before. Thanks, Jim -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ------- _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jniolon@att.net ------=_NextPart_000_0950_01D593C5.61328980 charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Jim.  I do the same every year.  My system is a little = larger  1500=E2=80=99 of pipe in 7 zones.  I have a backflow = preventer valve=20 on my sprinkler main line from the house main.  It has a port on = each side=20 of the valve that you can screw a male air compressor fitting = into.  I=20 simply drag my hose out the box and using a standard quick coupler on = the hose=20 connect it to the male fitting on the BFP valve. 
Then, I manually cycle thru each zone till I get no water at the = farthest=20 sprinkler head... easy to do and doesn=E2=80=99t take but a minute or = two on each=20 zone.
 
john
 
Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2019 10:32 AM
Subject: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler = System
 
I=20 need to drain and winterize my new sprinkler system and can=E2=80=99t = imagine I need to=20 pay someone to do that job.  While I understand the = =E2=80=98proper=E2=80=99 way to do it=20 is to manually open each valve, I was told a few years ago that it is = easier to=20 just pressurize the system at the drain valve and then use the manual = function=20 on the controller to run through each zone until no more water comes = out. =20 (FWIW, my system is not that large and has 6 zones.). I was thinking = about=20 rigging something up that would allow me to attach my compressor and = walk away,=20 but found this on Amazon, which seems like a good investment that would = pay for=20 itself on the first use: https://www.amazon.com/Winterize-Sprinkler-S= ystems-Outdoor-Faucets/dp/B0055QAAIQ/ref=3Dasc_df_B0055QAAIQ/?tag=3Dhypro= d-20&linkCode=3Ddf0&hvadid=3D309735714375&hvpos=3D1o1&hvn= etw=3Dg&hvrand=3D11131050794144962178&hvpone=3D&hvptwo=3D&= ;hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3Dc&hvdvcmdl=3D&hvlocint=3D&hvlocphy=3D90= 04590&hvtargid=3Dpla-570302725618&psc=3D1.=20 I could save around $10 and just buy a hose to quick disconnect fitting, = but the=20 shut off valve seems like a good addition.=20
 
I have fairly large compressor, but think it will be more trouble = than it=20 is worth to get air to the master drain valve.  Instead, I was = planning on=20 just using my Harbor Freight 8 gal portable compressor.  (https://www.harborfreight.com/8-gal-2-hp-125-psi-oil-= lube-air-compressor-68740.html).  =20 My water pressure is regulated to 60 lbs, so I figured something around = this=20 should be sufficient.
 
Am I missing anything?  Is there any good reason to pay a = professional=20 to do this job?  It seems like a no-brainer to me, but I=E2=80=99ve = been called a=20 no-brainer before.
 
Thanks,
Jim

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------=_NextPart_000_0950_01D593C5.61328980-- --===============4422468503604430483== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============4422468503604430483==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 10:08:14 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85246A0B27 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 10:08:14 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ms11p00im-qufo17281601.me.com (unknown [17.58.38.53]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD7DEA058D for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 10:08:03 -0700 (MST) s=1a1hai; t=1572973680; bh=THeLUmrysch29mKNDy2H3tPII99Z441e46/dUa2uk2M=; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=W7/3aGRioyYtCB/4B1HxxCRaN04p/J6qJsb1V9UxOAXXaUAX7zYfaG09E/e0JtKOh H49BloN+cbTPHS/0mWo6f+lcH0L3UHOvoeG+rs1Ay1zVHOpgLZFF+SWk1BcrX6g7N2 IsbHQVMr+hzKwjxR0p8LJWvIFi8XLQ7gVaChA41u+Hvpo0kCwuPXjkkLTDN2JSlRfQ p3BrSUoHB3cdeZf8XDaZ7o2dCkKc1F+c2v0OFQ9XE99bn5A8fGRnGKLK3ecWI1Gj4+ sneCwh6mSD8JopM9iMaNuvtSlLQ+QkehVYKpc2SVwCX+QGmFo1UfXnIyFb1B/gAc4H /8lwZR3Ig9KUw== Received: from [192.168.88.70] (unknown [199.38.189.253]) by ms11p00im-qufo17281601.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 16FBBBE0E62; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 17:08:00 +0000 (UTC) Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2019 11:07:58 -0600 References: To: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> definitions=2019-11-05_06:, , signatures=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1908290000 definitions=main-1911050142 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: Pat Horne via Shop-talk Cc: Shop Talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2363074026073705219== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --Apple-Mail-7A0DAC6A-22D1-40D3-BFE5-469789803B83 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Might be worth having a =E2=80=9Cprofessional=E2=80=9D come out once to see h= ow it should be done.=20 Personally, I=E2=80=99d just use the compressor at the drain.=20 Peace, Pat Pat Horne=20 We support Habitat for Humanity > On Nov 5, 2019, at 10:33 AM, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote: >=20 =EF=BB=BFI need to drain and winterize my new sprinkler system and can=E2=80= =99t imagine I need to pay someone to do that job. While I understand the =E2= =80=98proper=E2=80=99 way to do it is to manually open each valve, I was tol= d a few years ago that it is easier to just pressurize the system at the dra= in valve and then use the manual function on the controller to run through e= ach zone until no more water comes out. (FWIW, my system is not that large a= nd has 6 zones.). I was thinking about rigging something up that would allow= me to attach my compressor and walk away, but found this on Amazon, which s= eems like a good investment that would pay for itself on the first use: http= s://www.amazon.com/Winterize-Sprinkler-Systems-Outdoor-Faucets/dp/B0055QAAIQ= /ref=3Dasc_df_B0055QAAIQ/?tag=3Dhyprod-20&linkCode=3Ddf0&hvadid=3D3097357143= 75&hvpos=3D1o1&hvnetw=3Dg&hvrand=3D11131050794144962178&hvpone=3D&hvptwo=3D&= hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3Dc&hvdvcmdl=3D&hvlocint=3D&hvlocphy=3D9004590&hvtargid=3Dpla= -570302725618&psc=3D1. I could save around $10 and just buy a hose to quick d= isconnect fitting, but the shut off valve seems like a good addition. I have fairly large compressor, but think it will be more trouble than it is= worth to get air to the master drain valve. Instead, I was planning on jus= t using my Harbor Freight 8 gal portable compressor. (https://www.harborfre= ight.com/8-gal-2-hp-125-psi-oil-lube-air-compressor-68740.html). My water p= ressure is regulated to 60 lbs, so I figured something around this should be= sufficient. Am I missing anything? Is there any good reason to pay a professional to do= this job? It seems like a no-brainer to me, but I=E2=80=99ve been called a= no-brainer before. Thanks, Jim _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archi= ve as@icloud.com --Apple-Mail-7A0DAC6A-22D1-40D3-BFE5-469789803B83 charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Might be worth having a =E2=80=9Cprofession= al=E2=80=9D come out once to see how it should be done. 

=
Personally, I=E2=80=99d just use the compressor at the drain. 

Peace,
Pat

Pat Horne=  
We support Habitat for Humanity


On Nov 5, 2019, at 10:33 AM, Jim Sto= ne via Shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:

=EF=BB=BFI need to drain and winterize my new sprinkler s= ystem and can=E2=80=99t imagine I need to pay someone to do that job.  = While I understand the =E2=80=98proper=E2=80=99 way to do it is to manually o= pen each valve, I was told a few years ago that it is easier to just pressur= ize the system at the drain valve and then use the manual function on the co= ntroller to run through each zone until no more water comes out.  (FWIW= , my system is not that large and has 6 zones.). I was thinking about riggin= g something up that would allow me to attach my compressor and walk away, bu= t found this on Amazon, which seems like a good investment that would pay fo= r itself on the first use: https://www.ama= zon.com/Winterize-Sprinkler-Systems-Outdoor-Faucets/dp/B0055QAAIQ/ref=3Dasc_= df_B0055QAAIQ/?tag=3Dhyprod-20&linkCode=3Ddf0&hvadid=3D309735714375&= amp;hvpos=3D1o1&hvnetw=3Dg&hvrand=3D11131050794144962178&hvpone=3D= &hvptwo=3D&hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3Dc&hvdvcmdl=3D&hvlocint=3D&am= p;hvlocphy=3D9004590&hvtargid=3Dpla-570302725618&psc=3D1. I coul= d save around $10 and just buy a hose to quick disconnect fitting, but the s= hut off valve seems like a good addition.

I have fairly large compressor, but think it will be more t= rouble than it is worth to get air to the master drain valve.  Instead,= I was planning on just using my Harbor Freight 8 gal portable compressor. &= nbsp;(https://www.harborfreight.com/8-gal-2-h= p-125-psi-oil-lube-air-compressor-68740.html).   My water pressure i= s regulated to 60 lbs, so I figured something around this should be sufficie= nt.

Am I missing a= nything?  Is there any good reason to pay a professional to do this job= ?  It seems like a no-brainer to me, but I=E2=80=99ve been called a no-= brainer before.

Th= anks,
Jim
__________________________________= _____________

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= --Apple-Mail-7A0DAC6A-22D1-40D3-BFE5-469789803B83-- --===============2363074026073705219== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2363074026073705219==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 10:16:56 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 234A2A09EE for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 10:16:56 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net Received: from mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (unknown [167.206.4.200]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E7E3A0033 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 10:16:45 -0700 (MST) bh=uZENB7Z9E2N66/taWguIW1gokw28/yXZwAuNv2VhMQ0=; h=Message-ID:Date:To:From:Subject; b=ec8zOv9bxMbx0hHKPNhs7kNFxV1xmws/GAl7j2K9p0hIy9lptQG4qAbjC++GlbWlc Fq5Cs1oykmTxEfaPO4ho1uyCcsd5t5hD0m6/aJ2AgfO0AejvRSVk9cpNaPHWGlgHi2 akpBTXUpRnq++KpoeVzOEVYZHaIbKagT114cjrCS6Z7Dk/eAb4fmQJ1oOlKVjvMrLL rxnw5H6Z0mizwFOPHEksaLMMle10BGlBpHzuIC690p9jVAfGx3J18oFCK/Y7kQmHAH 3oEu+4oCtmofNOK1JbJ87Jti3UmpQCjfaV+CKHEHobfcyvYqq7idfzc2VU0H6ytnCt h9dzCxISKy5Ow== Authentication-Results: mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net smtp.user=strovato; auth=pass (LOGIN) a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:117 a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:17 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=vggBfdFIAAAA:8 a=YieQUjN_AAAA:8 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=OLQTW-7YTi1UDRMUlgUA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=VIA-9phBKlgA:10 a=ow96lfyWL7wA:10 a=tFctxUxxNEJNk233EV4A:9 a=ZfLLTkmEWq2kw6xu:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 a=AcyrQYAOBbuLn6IW_Dii:22 Received: from [67.83.27.177] ([67.83.27.177:55005] helo=Steve-PC.optonline.net) by mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.9.48312 r(Core:3.6.9.0)) with ESMTPA id CF/2A-03419-C7EA1CD5; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 12:16:44 -0500 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2019 12:16:17 -0500 To: Shop Talk References: Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============7823117303994877913== boundary="=====================_181454809==.ALT" --=====================_181454809==.ALT Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jim, I rigged up an adapter like that many years ago and I have been using it every time I need to winterize a sprinkler system, summer home or other similar tasks. I usually run a garden hose from whatever drain valve I want to the compressor. I use my adapter at the compressor end of the garden hose to connect to the air supply. I have enough garden hose that routing to the drain valve isn't really a problem. I don't need a lot of air pressure, but I blast a lot of air volume through to push the water out. My main garage compressor is my first choice, but I have used a smaller portable one and it did OK. As for purchasing that adapter, I would do it. I don't know if such a thing existed when I made mine. Twenty bucks would be worth it to me for the convenience. Of course, if you have the pieces already and you don't want to wait for an adapter to arrive, making it would also be a reasonable thing to do. I don't have a shutoff on mine and I don't really miss it. -Steve At 11:32 AM 11/5/2019, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote: >I need to drain and winterize my new sprinkler >system and can=E2=80=99t imagine I need to pay someone >to do that job. While I understand the >=E2=80=98proper=E2=80=99 way to do it is to manually open >each valve, I was told a few years ago that it >is easier to just pressurize the system at the >drain valve and then use the manual function on >the controller to run through each zone until no >more water comes out. (FWIW, my system is not >that large and has 6 zones.). I was thinking >about rigging something up that would allow me >to attach my compressor and walk away, but found >this on Amazon, which seems like a good >investment that would pay for itself on the >first use: >https://www.amazon.com/Winterize-Sprinkler-= Systems-Outdoor-Faucets/dp/B0055QAAIQ/ref=3Dasc_df_B0055QAAIQ/?tag=3Dhyprod= -20&linkCode=3Ddf0&hvadid=3D309735714375&hvpos=3D1o1&hvnetw=3Dg&hvrand=3D11= 131050794144962178&hvpone=3D&hvptwo=3D&hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3Dc&hvdvcmdl=3D&hvloc= int=3D&hvlocphy=3D9004590&hvtargid=3Dpla-570302725618&psc=3D1. >I could save around $10 and just buy a hose to >quick disconnect fitting, but the shut off valve seems like a good additio= n. > >I have fairly large compressor, but think it >will be more trouble than it is worth to get air >to the master drain valve. Instead, I was >planning on just using my Harbor Freight 8 gal >portable >compressor. >(https://www.harborfreight.com/8-gal-2-hp-125-psi-oil-lube-air-c= ompressor-68740.html). >My water pressure is regulated to 60 lbs, so I >figured something around this should be sufficient. > >Am I missing anything? Is there any good reason >to pay a professional to do this job? It seems >like a no-brainer to me, but I=E2=80=99ve been called a no-brainer before.= > >Thanks, >Jim -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus --=====================_181454809==.ALT Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jim,
I rigged up an adapter like that many years ago and I have been using it every time I need to winterize a sprinkler system, summer home or other similar tasks.  I usually run a garden hose from whatever drain valve I want to the compressor.  I use my adapter at the compressor end of the garden hose to connect to the air supply.  I have enough garden hose that routing to the drain valve isn't really a problem.  I don't need a lot of air pressure, but I blast a lot of air volume through to push the water out.  My main garage compressor is my first choice, but I have used a smaller portable one and it did OK.  As for purchasing that adapter, I would do it.  I don't know if such a thing existed when I made mine.  Twenty bucks would be worth it to me for the convenience.  Of course, if you have the pieces already and you don't want to wait for an adapter to arrive, making it would also be a reasonable thing to do.  I don't have a shutoff on mine and I don't really miss it. 

-Steve

At 11:32 AM 11/5/2019, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote:
I need to drain and winteriz= e my new sprinkler system and can=E2=80=99t imagine I need to pay someone to do = that job.  While I understand the =E2=80=98proper=E2=80=99 way to do it is = to manually open each valve, I was told a few years ago that it is easier to just pressurize the system at the drain valve and then use the manual function on the controller to run through each zone until no more water comes out.  (FWIW, my system is not that large and has 6 zones.). I was thinking about rigging something up that would allow me to attach my compressor and walk away, but found this on Amazon, which seems like a good investment that would pay for itself on the first use: https://www.amazon.com/Winterize-Sprinkler-Systems-Outdoor-Faucets/dp/B0055= QAAIQ/ref=3Dasc_df_B0055QAAIQ/?tag=3Dhyprod-20&linkCode=3Ddf0&hvadi= d=3D309735714375&hvpos=3D1o1&hvnetw=3Dg&hvrand=3D11131050794144= 962178&hvpone=3D&hvptwo=3D&hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3Dc&hvdvcmdl= =3D&hvlocint=3D&hvlocphy=3D9004590&hvtargid=3Dpla-570302725618&= amp;psc=3D1 =2E I could save around $10 and just buy a hose to quick disconnect fitting, but the shut off valve seems like a good addition.

I have fairly large compressor, but think it will be more trouble than it is worth to get air to the master drain valve.  Instead, I was planning on just using my Harbor Freight 8 gal portable compressor.  ( https://www.harborfreight.com/8-gal-2-hp-125-psi-oil-lube-air-compressor-68= 740.html ).   My water pressure is regulated to 60 lbs, so I figured something around this should be sufficient.

Am I missing anything?  Is there any good reason to pay a professional to do this job?  It seems like a no-brainer to me, but I=E2=80=99ve been called a no-brainer before.

Thanks,
Jim

3D"" Virus-= free. www.avast.com
--=====================_181454809==.ALT-- --===============7823117303994877913== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============7823117303994877913==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 10:21:20 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 37D3DA0968 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 10:21:20 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (unknown [167.206.4.212]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02CF0A01B4 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 10:21:15 -0700 (MST) bh=B17VsZiglwfPyWg9LdYX0OI3tMIwbjz0MKGXN+PQBQw=; h=Message-ID:Date:To:From:Subject; b=klHxEVBt38nyX7cuFUZob4nbDgm8MnqSex03KrwxNU3OuwgW4I3cLBNlysMwntQ0t d4Y6jr/M2mVdbawqy+JRoaTJP1nKU9rZGV+ezYSoIEfYp2C49RqcGci3PPRCuyRNQk 01s0dV6IP875y2DXWyKlF8v1mdi9osJNGjFtWyi65VX39JkPKCJsITqwlpJzi2OgUN HJLEGwp8wHVI9+NwhhHU81Cr68I9VE7lEvwKX4kmUUCqr7TQmUQnFspl7yALw+N9zg aAFvqlW47VJSrOM9TPuwc3Q2GJglEXhNiEZ8rqhrJ+/4Mo/g46Zy1Fbm+Wyr2tcYf7 uXqGxJ8MzcIWw== Authentication-Results: mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net smtp.user=strovato; auth=pass (LOGIN) a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:117 a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:17 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=zOoktvdPAAAA:8 a=pGLkceISAAAA:8 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=synSuFIO8zQJx8JoxO0A:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=GGGinmgZRQXmVEG1E52S:22 Received: from [67.83.27.177] ([67.83.27.177:55596] helo=Steve-PC.optonline.net) by mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.9.48312 r(Core:3.6.9.0)) with ESMTPA id 8D/76-23065-A8FA1CD5; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 12:21:14 -0500 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2019 12:20:47 -0500 To: shop-talk mail.com> References: <003901d58abc$09225f70$1b671e50$@GMail.com> <3A.EA.13198.FD6A0CD5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] tire balancing From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thanks Dave. All of that is in line with my understanding. It was the whole front vs back question, because they "balance them differently" that had me puzzled! Still haven't heard a good explanation for that, other than that he doesn't know what he's talking about. I think that's the conclusion I'm going with! -Steve T. At 10:18 PM 11/4/2019, David Scheidt wrote: >On Mon, Nov 4, 2019 at 4:32 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk > wrote: > > > > Two years ago, I purchased a set of Michelin tires for my Ford > > Expedition at BJs. It was not a great experience, and I don't think > > I'd do it again. The tires do come with a road hazard warranty, > > though, and free flat repair. I got a puncture in the right rear > > yesterday, so I ventured down to BJs once again. The guy there asked > > me if it was a front or rear tire. He said they balance them > > differently. He said it was "statically balanced" but on a machine > > that spins it and uses lasers. I don't know what he is talking > > about. I told him it is a rear tire, but that shouldn't matter, > > because it will be a front tire when I rotate them. He told me I > > shouldn't do that. I have to bring the vehicle to them to rotate and > > re-balance. None of this makes any sense to me. Have things changed > > drastically or is this guy nuts? I should note that all this stuff > > is free when you buy the tires there, so I don't really see any > > financial motive for them to want to do this. > >There are a fair number of shops that balance the front wheels-to-be >when rotating tires. Fronts cause more complaints (you tend to feel >the wobble in the steering wheel), so making sure they're balance can >save a come back. The fronts are probably okay, or the the customer >would complain. I can't imagine any reason to balance the ends >differently, and any repaired tire should be balanced. (I, of course, >repaired hundreds of tires without balancing them, or dismounting for >inspection, when I did this stuff for money, but I never did my own >that way, and wouldn't put up with it today on a modern low profile >tire.) > >there are wheel balancers that have lasers, but I'll the ones I've >ever seen just use it to put a line where the weight goes. (this >saves much time, and given most wheel techs need bibs, mistakes.) >There are fancy machines that use sonar to detect the size of the >wheel assembly (which it needs to know to figure out weights). again >saves time and errors/ > >-- >David Scheidt >dmscheidt@gmail.com -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 10:48:58 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 71B05A03DD for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 10:48:58 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qv1-f54.google.com (unknown [209.85.219.54]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06A26A039B for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 10:48:53 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-qv1-f54.google.com with SMTP id g18so271081qvp.8 for ; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 09:48:52 -0800 (PST) h=from:mime-version:subject:date:references:to:in-reply-to:message-id; bh=pfCrjB0AiTrzuZwPfCAiw+FVw7zgYb3ZxS16CEAK19M=; b=P/bSQkg7IFf6+R2YBPjjogmSVAEX2LadpkaG4hobu9znEb1F5KzkN7JZl098i1R+d6 OYa6bDgWA06PkifAojGWtUYxyKhNoQoU65WmszNNWolGYuSaXAhS/EnIwAMztqxwXxvA oFGuFUj8kHDVBbAyAYO5v8jli7HL4wmB6jq/e3N7BIlrt2+1h151ANHgj9Gj2niGIXwT 5y5sGr958GIQqwGkT9ww+XOpSC+e6ID2BRDyO5O69xw1ANn3L7BUjZVYpxjKOUbE9hrd Mi6FN4x6C6lHsrZG2a8CKjXMgtEusGWZ6ZGe1Ql+rYs6iBla9dfWRbPqZWSuHqe78QSH VrHg== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:mime-version:subject:date:references:to :in-reply-to:message-id; bh=pfCrjB0AiTrzuZwPfCAiw+FVw7zgYb3ZxS16CEAK19M=; b=TfGzOdvCBPtnqGMgBAODzUxT4CIGJHzihp6XlJOVmvepkGH/w9k6BmDhfH9HE0SCuY mYG9PXvy3r+h/B0zRIm9cts4dpoI1lLcxerEpT7kpzyrnJCCzcpomedjP0CyM0PrGM4x mXP4+VIcyYLXDsf+bEDvujJRTwPDvIodTwedRm9VF0b6BsLPwbUxD8XpQ84ED0UpJtBS 5+IlfjW9FULqlwV233TU6ubVAeTSC5zg6LefdGxVrMBuY8YTXUwBNM9+2hpJ2MNaPZ3x YopwIj/JluZ/ddLCtykmcCw34xn8Mswwrcmj+p5dSuDbEfgUVoj1TGHIcQ5mFRM/Olt0 SoJg== qMqzzfSE6M54EKxRtSJ1vH31lF1m Tue, 05 Nov 2019 09:48:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from macbook-pro-2.home (ool-43526917.dyn.optonline.net. [67.82.105.23]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id z7sm10517147qth.85.2019.11.05.09.48.51 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 05 Nov 2019 09:48:51 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2019 12:48:50 -0500 References: To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: Jim Stone via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4753717707333948602== boundary="Apple-Mail=_D03C605D-76B4-447D-B507-F2C337AF657A" --Apple-Mail=_D03C605D-76B4-447D-B507-F2C337AF657A Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Thanks, guys. I just bought the adapter; it will be here on Thursday, = well ahead of any freezing temperatures. John=E2=80=99s comment about a backflow preventer valve does have me = rethinking one aspect of my plan. The system installer put in an = outside hose barb that he intended for blowing out the system, but I had = thought it made sense to move ahead of that and start where the system = originates in the basement. I can isolate the sprinkler from the rest = of the system and blow it out from there. Unless there is a good reason = not to do it that. If there is a backflow preventer valve between the = hose barb and the basement, might there be a problem blowing it out from = there? Jim > On Nov 5, 2019, at 12:16 PM, Steven Trovato via Shop-talk = wrote: >=20 > Jim, > I rigged up an adapter like that many years ago and I have been using = it every time I need to winterize a sprinkler system, summer home or = other similar tasks. I usually run a garden hose from whatever drain = valve I want to the compressor. I use my adapter at the compressor end = of the garden hose to connect to the air supply. I have enough garden = hose that routing to the drain valve isn't really a problem. I don't = need a lot of air pressure, but I blast a lot of air volume through to = push the water out. My main garage compressor is my first choice, but I = have used a smaller portable one and it did OK. As for purchasing that = adapter, I would do it. I don't know if such a thing existed when I = made mine. Twenty bucks would be worth it to me for the convenience. = Of course, if you have the pieces already and you don't want to wait for = an adapter to arrive, making it would also be a reasonable thing to do. = I don't have a shutoff on mine and I don't really miss it. =20 >=20 > -Steve=20 >=20 > At 11:32 AM 11/5/2019, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote: >> I need to drain and winterize my new sprinkler system and can=C3=A2=C2=80= =C2=99t imagine I need to pay someone to do that job. While I = understand the =C3=A2=C2=80=C2=98proper=C3=A2=C2=80=C2=99 way to do it = is to manually open each valve, I was told a few years ago that it is = easier to just pressurize the system at the drain valve and then use the = manual function on the controller to run through each zone until no more = water comes out. (FWIW, my system is not that large and has 6 zones.). = I was thinking about rigging something up that would allow me to attach = my compressor and walk away, but found this on Amazon, which seems like = a good investment that would pay for itself on the first use: = https://www.amazon.com/Winterize-Sprinkler-Systems-Outdoor-Faucets/dp/B005= 5QAAIQ/ref=3Dasc_df_B0055QAAIQ/?tag=3Dhyprod-20&linkCode=3Ddf0&hvadid=3D30= 9735714375&hvpos=3D1o1&hvnetw=3Dg&hvrand=3D11131050794144962178&hvpone=3D&= hvptwo=3D&hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3Dc&hvdvcmdl=3D&hvlocint=3D&hvlocphy=3D9004590&hv= targid=3Dpla-570302725618&psc=3D1 = . I could save around $10 and just = buy a hose to quick disconnect fitting, but the shut off valve seems = like a good addition. >>=20 >> I have fairly large compressor, but think it will be more trouble = than it is worth to get air to the master drain valve. Instead, I was = planning on just using my Harbor Freight 8 gal portable compressor. ( = https://www.harborfreight.com/8-gal-2-hp-125-psi-oil-lube-air-compressor-6= 8740.html = ). My water pressure is regulated to 60 lbs, so I figured = something around this should be sufficient. >>=20 >> Am I missing anything? Is there any good reason to pay a = professional to do this job? It seems like a no-brainer to me, but = I=C3=A2=C2=80=C2=99ve been called a no-brainer before. >>=20 >> Thanks, >> Jim >=20 > = = Virus-free. www.avast.com = = ________________________= _______________________ >=20 > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine@gmail.com >=20 --Apple-Mail=_D03C605D-76B4-447D-B507-F2C337AF657A Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Thanks, guys.  I just bought the adapter; it will be = here on Thursday, well ahead of any freezing temperatures.

John=E2=80=99s comment = about a backflow preventer valve does have me rethinking one aspect of = my plan.  The system installer put in an outside hose barb that he = intended for blowing out the system, but I had thought it made sense to = move ahead of that and start where the system originates in the = basement.  I can isolate the sprinkler from the rest of the system = and blow it out from there.  Unless there is a good reason not to = do it that.  If there is a backflow preventer valve between = the hose barb and the basement, might there be a problem blowing it out = from there?

Jim

On Nov 5, 2019, at 12:16 PM, = Steven Trovato via Shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:

Jim,
I rigged up an adapter like that many years ago and I have been using it every time I need to winterize a sprinkler system, summer home or other similar tasks.  I usually run a garden hose from whatever drain valve I want to the compressor.  I use my adapter at the compressor end of the garden hose to connect to the air supply.  I have enough garden hose that routing to the drain valve isn't really a = problem.  I don't need a lot of air pressure, but I blast a lot of air volume through to push the water out.  My main garage compressor is my first choice, but I have used a smaller portable one and it did = OK.  As for purchasing that adapter, I would do it.  I don't know if = such a thing existed when I made mine.  Twenty bucks would be worth it = to me for the convenience.  Of course, if you have the pieces already and you don't want to wait for an adapter to arrive, making it would = also be a reasonable thing to do.  I don't have a shutoff on mine and I don't really miss it. 

-Steve

At 11:32 AM 11/5/2019, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote:
I need to drain and = winterize my new sprinkler system and can=C3=A2=C2=80=C2=99t imagine I need to pay = someone to do that job.  While I understand the =C3=A2=C2=80=C2=98proper=C3=A2=C2=80=C2=99= way to do it is to manually open each valve, I was told a few years ago that it is easier = to just pressurize the system at the drain valve and then use the manual function on the controller to run through each zone until no more water comes out.  (FWIW, my system is not that large and has 6 zones.). I was thinking about rigging something up that would allow me to attach my compressor and walk away, but found this on Amazon, which seems like a good investment that would pay for itself on the first use: = https://www.amazon.com/Winterize-Sprinkler-Systems-Outdoor-Faucets/dp/B005= 5QAAIQ/ref=3Dasc_df_B0055QAAIQ/?tag=3Dhyprod-20&linkCode=3Ddf0&hva= did=3D309735714375&hvpos=3D1o1&hvnetw=3Dg&hvrand=3D11131050794= 144962178&hvpone=3D&hvptwo=3D&hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3Dc&hvdvc= mdl=3D&hvlocint=3D&hvlocphy=3D9004590&hvtargid=3Dpla-570302725= 618&psc=3D1 . I could save around $10 and just buy a hose to quick disconnect fitting, but the shut off valve seems like a good addition.

I have fairly large compressor, but think it will be more trouble than = it is worth to get air to the master drain valve.  Instead, I was planning on just using my Harbor Freight 8 gal portable = compressor.  ( = https://www.harborfreight.com/8-gal-2-hp-125-psi-oil-lube-air-compressor-6= 8740.html ).   My water pressure is regulated to 60 lbs, so I figured something around this should be sufficient.

Am I missing anything?  Is there any good reason to pay a professional to do this job?  It seems like a no-brainer to me, but I=C3=A2=C2=80=C2=99ve been called a no-brainer before.

Thanks,
Jim

3D"" Virus-free. www.avast.com
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Shop-talk@autox.team.net
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Archive: = http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

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= --Apple-Mail=_D03C605D-76B4-447D-B507-F2C337AF657A-- --===============4753717707333948602== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============4753717707333948602==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 11:08:07 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 154A5A0681 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 11:08:07 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net Received: from mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (unknown [167.206.4.199]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1068CA03E5 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 11:08:00 -0700 (MST) bh=raAg89wbeZ8Ces0cuU4z7RTs6fPvEeD1tvyAHbk1e1s=; h=Message-ID:Date:To:From:Subject; b=C2ZOuQM4PLBGUnQRI7zVcxDYIYB/pXdtUFEnq6vYEOCtcApoJWBakCaaL1FM/4bfd QlUcSzBWad+gxfGg5HJMwUplNxkwWLFRn/ssN2UEwm1SNhzmCWEaB87J2869QXeOhu 2BAC/46asf8rH3yzpMaBo1aTJJoqLWTGDGk1KyiGo7pjHrao3SLsRVMdTgvCc9VE29 qLTV242mPaVbY86AHpYTihIE/bFyAErB+PP+nehDvX2b5nzFBx/Rv/WMg1Ihvcs5qz T9jCuB1X+whP9wz3z7LYDnEThx1ypl2DIbLQy4THAzXGoKCJJ+kOPeaxQdTiUha8L6 Q+Iyl9oeq18tw== Authentication-Results: mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net smtp.user=strovato; auth=pass (LOGIN) a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:117 a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:17 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=yGarZ1JGxB48skJAlXAA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 Received: from [67.83.27.177] ([67.83.27.177:53411] helo=Steve-PC.optonline.net) by mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.9.48312 r(Core:3.6.9.0)) with ESMTPA id E3/BB-13198-08AB1CD5; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 13:08:00 -0500 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2019 13:07:36 -0500 To: Shop Talk References: Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net That's what I always did. The air you are = introducing is going in the same direction as the = usual water flow so it passes through without any problem. -Steve At 12:48 PM 11/5/2019, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote: >Thanks, guys. I just bought the adapter; it = >will be here on Thursday, well ahead of any freezing temperatures. > >John=E2=80=99s comment about a backflow preventer = >valve does have me rethinking one aspect of my = >plan. The system installer put in an outside = >hose barb that he intended for blowing out the = >system, but I had thought it made sense to move = >ahead of that and start where the system = >originates in the basement. I can isolate the = >sprinkler from the rest of the system and blow = >it out from there. Unless there is a good = >reason not to do it that. If there is a = >backflow preventer valve between the hose barb = >and the basement, might there be a problem blowing it out from there? > >Jim -- = This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive utox.team.net From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 11:17:10 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B59CFA08C6 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 11:17:10 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net Received: from mta9.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (unknown [167.206.4.204]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F943A0579 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 11:14:56 -0700 (MST) bh=e2/V0AdtoKxdz/TZWVbGY+M5pxejhn0j4jjRCo94vhU=; h=Message-ID:Date:To:From:Subject; b=SyNvvYTK/45wARyaSAQfHD+tCpTCk1ea9TnVTb18wyob2LVI581w2sL05KgZvM91v jAz0zHJoK3MLxxOJrl1uFafkdXO8UAtUCwX0nlwXAwWQ6vnILDY/q1GTRNlZ5pM7ks WuerApuTh/FhLGEK7EhSGxvr++PDyUnxXXYneLAuN/a4qJ91d3P2ueeBkhD9hTozlP VOIkBEVezUuJMazKzmFgm5R3749mElbHLAJrUGrtKMkP/CvKwdbILyt3nEYKB6DeGr X8CSQqEh0iNB0+KxOXsfCxvu5f0/xdT6ufS6a33NtcxIPjaie01m9XGiMcVOmholHQ xIyNkFg9b4qRQ== Authentication-Results: mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net smtp.user=strovato; auth=pass (LOGIN) a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:117 a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:17 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=_RiFHlKuHCA_WDH1LgQA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 Received: from [67.83.27.177] ([67.83.27.177:54014] helo=Steve-PC.optonline.net) by mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.9.48312 r(Core:3.6.9.0)) with ESMTPA id 4B/18-03419-F1CB1CD5; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 13:14:55 -0500 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2019 13:14:33 -0500 To: Shop Talk References: Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net I shouldn't really be speaking for John, but I = think he is just saying that his backflow = preventer has a convenient port that he uses to = connect. I don't think he is saying that the = backflow preventer presents any other problem for = the operation. I am sure John will let us know if I am correct. -Steve T. At 12:48 PM 11/5/2019, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote: >Thanks, guys. I just bought the adapter; it = >will be here on Thursday, well ahead of any freezing temperatures. > >John=E2=80=99s comment about a backflow preventer = >valve does have me rethinking one aspect of my = >plan. The system installer put in an outside = >hose barb that he intended for blowing out the = >system, but I had thought it made sense to move = >ahead of that and start where the system = >originates in the basement. I can isolate the = >sprinkler from the rest of the system and blow = >it out from there. Unless there is a good = >reason not to do it that. If there is a = >backflow preventer valve between the hose barb = >and the basement, might there be a problem blowing it out from there? > >Jim -- = This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive utox.team.net From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 11:21:29 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7CB31A09DE for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 11:21:29 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from cdptpa-cmomta03.email.rr.com (unknown [107.14.166.231]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D955A082C for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 11:21:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from [29.17.46.180] ([172.58.62.253]) by cmsmtp with ESMTPA id S3S8ixXXaQmgLS3SFixTCM; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 18:21:23 +0000 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2019 12:21:11 -0600 User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android References: <003901d58abc$09225f70$1b671e50$@GMail.com> <3A.EA.13198.FD6A0CD5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> To: shop-talk 9Mnir0UZrZ72gq+SrS63DraNePx0Gdaj+F0K8Yc3yHtjBFN+8sVY6z03q1Or5JPZy4ClKL4aA2hsdg== Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] tire balancing From: Randall via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5378395214552537097== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ------IEPIDBYEOJJJEXENQYGCMANN578ODX charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I don't know that this is relevant, but the manual for my on-the-car balanc= er (an antique so old it actually uses vacuum tubes) talks about "static" a= nd "dynamic" imbalance as two different tire/wheel conditions=2E Its sensor= only works in one direction, so first you check for the tire hopping up an= d down (which it call static imbalance), then for wobble from side to side = (dynamic)=2E IIRC, the dynamic check is only done on the front axle=2E -- Randall ------IEPIDBYEOJJJEXENQYGCMANN578ODX charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I don't know that this is relevant, but the manual for my on-the-car balanc= er (an antique so old it actually uses vacuum tubes) talks about "static" a= nd "dynamic" imbalance as two different tire/wheel conditions=2E Its sensor= only works in one direction, so first you check for the tire hopping up an= d down (which it call static imbalance), then for wobble from side to side = (dynamic)=2E IIRC, the dynamic check is only done on the front axle=2E
-= - Randall ------IEPIDBYEOJJJEXENQYGCMANN578ODX-- --===============5378395214552537097== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============5378395214552537097==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 11:41:17 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 998A4A09E5 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 11:41:17 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta8.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (unknown [167.206.4.203]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEC1FA08E6 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 11:41:09 -0700 (MST) bh=Tn315b9512An2EX7zM1+O52lG5u2LTbfzD8WM5mEXfY=; h=Message-ID:Date:To:From:Subject; b=o3dHeFjDLUFO7UOTT2s2vKkE9hAtCLnjBFVhfqDN6DFrO4ivSa4bKtPQVdEv3EYGQ W4RViCKGDgPonBeRIHwBI8Th5P5U4tDpMmPcB74DPQ4TatFXN6CZLZonNEVUofvvOu LJNQfmO8h4fJpRckVVOMKDQBGLCPrWeJ3hzbDjolodZ1aZyROf7p9YxbQpEHqoiI3I HMSfLp1Wx64ujrehFJm/YFUoUm+hl1bY7qIpoufApuYSdGuI9Zk6s/XJ2G8vzgmld3 DJzoEA/RPP2Cgk/u6eHHqLNJXd/R5c9aTjP5bwnzVC7BvJY+S4O+eVmIyLaFgCUxoj 59vsOXrzWT9fA== Authentication-Results: mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net smtp.user=strovato; auth=pass (LOGIN) a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:117 a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:17 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=_6GpL_ENAAAA:8 a=60QBGDvrJLfO6sSH3awA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 Received: from [67.83.27.177] ([67.83.27.177:1027] helo=Steve-PC.optonline.net) by mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.9.48312 r(Core:3.6.9.0)) with ESMTPA id 6A/75-13198-542C1CD5; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 13:41:09 -0500 Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2019 13:40:39 -0500 To: Randall ,shop-talk References: <003901d58abc$09225f70$1b671e50$@GMail.com> <3A.EA.13198.FD6A0CD5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] tire balancing From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net That's interesting. I always thought of static balancing as being done with a bubble balancer sitting still on the floor. And any balancing with the wheel actually spinning I would call dynamic. They obviously use the terms differently. I imagine it wouldn't hurt any if you did both for the rear as well, even if it isn't necessary. The whole premise of on-the-car balancing is that you don't want to move the tires around. Even if you remove and replace a wheel, you want to mark it so you put the same lug studs through the same wheel holes. I would think in modern off-the-car balancing they should just balance all of the wheels the best they can regardless of position. I suppose they could use a lower standard for the rears, but that seems pretty lame to me. -Steve At 01:21 PM 11/5/2019, Randall via Shop-talk wrote: >I don't know that this is relevant, but the manual for my on-the-car >balancer (an antique so old it actually uses vacuum tubes) talks >about "static" and "dynamic" imbalance as two different tire/wheel >conditions. Its sensor only works in one direction, so first you >check for the tire hopping up and down (which it call static >imbalance), then for wobble from side to side (dynamic). IIRC, the >dynamic check is only done on the front axle. >-- Randall -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 12:20:49 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F102EA0540 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 12:20:48 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic309-24.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (unknown [98.137.65.150]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E552AA035E for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 12:20:42 -0700 (MST) t=1572981642; bh=IjQ1hjt+aG5tJtmw55D3N/l2i9RnCc/rYwxFg/BZxLM=; h=From:To:References:In-Reply-To:Subject:Date:From:Subject; b=CABo6gXGLTOwfERfOCs8S3zt0nvhCIXTefsPG4J0X9RfhxgEuYsvxrDqgIt03Fnd94s9W/FZBRdqkM2BB/7itEc7h7gEjB/e4ErFqaHysaZzN5KY/Q1BtzxaXvE8pXa0Fa8zYBZXh4Cwh/rp5Jhk3gg6WzkhbaIhl5GBSS+BTug= yQ6B7v2dje7QCb9YbZaoD9x.n0DxcSOMVVKWq00XMtROMqUt.vsERXO32NtVWPcQdHC1Lna3ezcX .kUBUC_E3mn26Qv12.uMWy4NPFGo5ZeQWq0Mh3nQ5gS.MSNHAoTVFzWBGHLu5sfiuB52Jiw0TkhY H8BlLyovYOUSLXVOylRrWikioAIlKYrBYzESf4i0LJRTB.IVdyzy7LxWWhGf3p9q3_eTwWSvJzpN JttcCk8g1z7.48U0UyYmxGXxFI6drjF3tHrAFSY4.JCnbRONlS5KfklE78W9Ou89XI1f19T_NUQz qYk7fbjWcrX0uCjQNrDKg9hNcqbl3740stIyRGcGmvbm81ucP0NzjTEwOTHjcenBZyP6Ye6O.BXH aNuix0m_TZ02LjnxznxIrXX9CA6Loc4hlPXZa6lXdQ5dg3iXbMFPW._EKbYGMf9P5eh60wmtGfT1 _trbL2NVY_N1gRSExww9Gart7mDJUuJzehRyeswAu7OMassKmfwraYUuijq4xgipbqfuQ0GwbgcJ lRHtaLdxB8m9eD45Kilm_DqDmpbbLR00f0N0o9Z.cPTDTAA_0mkc6J4ADsBrTtCg05yb74mcbzyA DadM_hdPLlNC8ZZVs9A1x21rItSyUuAd1lWdzJnpRKVr.mkOLQhY__PgUZFlUk6AZkqe2zzwUXjR dL0LAGF_2rN0qTHiefupHkhbhYqcFFqJ8hpNGk2JFAP1X.4YEWCzoJeSpJu9GjiVQPnmHO4rnVjs hNlup.95X7RQty6eYHNONeFnIfCXXw8mSAY9T6Gi0Wbq9PJ7nHu1WMF6iXHtsVmQh1vOWAoMuXCl gRj0f3a7fmWJLvSnKuGW2EFFS5_ApPPjdG1M.5ohYOnfgAmAnmm5Kvx5FPuYtagAMIBZiubi9Hx3 kfMDjTbrDN4oLdvrm0RIOkmopusoGokNVbxjDmZwBYyBvIcG2PKEVUUwSiqbGv.raHQfoiebixp9 W0M2AEArLGz4TqNidFBPBBSwMlnJtRm5hS8ueE5AOWYKUXlXj3FxB58F8Oa98MCzXJS6kPiew0sI V1ATdgyQ8KlHnLa0B8nO.WEIBEbrk_VeO6khXNDCgT9jSA8VmzO4VbMN5yEJjoGl7IBBjv4keCtX hLWnv7NH5gCQ1iAHgvHLI8M6m48JhN1OUaeTAMopr4cqdBlje9zu88APtnWaArn8URvaYKN24JBh I6hc1KsLd3g_7Xrlw1n3ByNaDV6wWKVvk9f1X4MaPP3ZAFuvm1jiZdkwdc_fdvp2O3jNPLRTdYuK 2NVVXCLInO_aF9P0g.B4toh5n7GsE.75YWeQcQzuF7Gu5HQzWAfxrIqjGBTYHRtd2CnJyXT3xkUQ _W7TbkS7hsF0- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic309.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 19:20:42 +0000 Received: by smtp410.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID 5f84098c61f1c0cec60f9390b7fd91aa; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 19:20:37 +0000 (UTC) To: "Steven Trovato" , "shop-talk" References: <4B.18.03419.F1CB1CD5@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2019 13:20:37 -0600 Importance: Normal Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: john niolon via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net You are correct Steve.... the port on the BFP valve is down stream of the check valve on the sprinkler side of the valve so the BFP offers no resistance or blockage for the air at this point... really convenient for doing what we???re discussing. j -----Original Message----- From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2019 12:14 PM To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System I shouldn't really be speaking for John, but I think he is just saying that his backflow preventer has a convenient port that he uses to connect. I don't think he is saying that the backflow preventer presents any other problem for the operation. I am sure John will let us know if I am correct. -Steve T. At 12:48 PM 11/5/2019, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote: >Thanks, guys. I just bought the adapter; it will be here on Thursday, well >ahead of any freezing temperatures. > >John????????s comment about a backflow preventer valve does have me rethinking >one aspect of my plan. The system installer put in an outside hose barb >that he intended for blowing out the system, but I had thought it made >sense to move ahead of that and start where the system originates in the >basement. I can isolate the sprinkler from the rest of the system and blow >it out from there. Unless there is a good reason not to do it that. If >there is a backflow preventer valve between the hose barb and the basement, >might there be a problem blowing it out from there? > >Jim -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jniolon@att.net _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 12:32:29 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC88DA09FD for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 12:32:29 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-ch2-08v.sys.comcast.net (unknown [69.252.207.40]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18246A054A for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 12:29:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from resomta-ch2-12v.sys.comcast.net ([69.252.207.108]) by resqmta-ch2-08v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTP id RyZii8KQ0dlvIS4W3i47gu; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 19:29:23 +0000 s=20190202a; t=1572982163; bh=mF8EXm6CNifusS6k3F8A3tBlh/uOjhwKVXzMwaeutKs=; h=Received:Received:Subject:To:From:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=Lt1/LHXFf342BjMPG/pfgRWre8B4tJs0gn3UBWwG9AiS1/+BrNwUB6tfvckBWWOhP Q8EF+YdFb7TdtfszB5H0Fcr7fK10ZTFAi74gaIFryBBdslR1Tnsxr7t7SZToiAx0uy RN6QWPN4YnU2dcpNxeWtEDlvyO4UuFWsSkIaei9tQ2w0qzhPGdSFVjqBV7e26s0tHB Viy0PWyAXiHT2CFCBavgqeY4Wl4bwvRccB/1XY4VK0V0eoxjKmz648SIhQVHJKhNBx Qi9JP1cCn8H0h8pOec6U/O00YVVN2dLS8zZUt6Q5DWRe9WO7hcvYRu70JxNjH1A6Dp ZCPcHCoY9EXhA== Received: from [192.168.6.40] ([66.79.197.2]) by resomta-ch2-12v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTPA id S4Vuib1kpAumKS4VxiDFPT; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 19:29:21 +0000 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <003901d58abc$09225f70$1b671e50$@GMail.com> <3A.EA.13198.FD6A0CD5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <6A.75.13198.542C1CD5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2019 14:29:15 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; Win64; x64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.2.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] tire balancing From: Donald H Locker via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============1315300353472408785== boundary="------------250E78D705061588527B92E5" Content-Language: en-US This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------250E78D705061588527B92E5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Static vs. Dynamic - consider a yardstick (or metre-stick) with equal weights on either end. With one weight mounted an inch below the stick, the other three inches below, with both equidistant from the center of the stick. This is statically balanced similar to a balance - neither side will tend to rise or fall. BUT if you put an axle through it and rotate it about that axis, the weights will try to rotate about a point two inches below the yardstick and will alternately pull it up and down a bit with each revolution. Putting both weights equidistant radially and axially (which is what dynamic balancing does) removes that wobbling force. Here is some ASCII art (best viewed in a fixed-width font.) Static balance only            Static and Dynamic balance ---------------+--------------- ---------------+--------------- Wt             |                               |                |                Wt             |     Wt                |             Wt Donald. On 05-Nov-2019 13:40, Steven Trovato via Shop-talk wrote: > That's interesting.  I always thought of static balancing as being done > with a bubble balancer sitting still on the floor.  And any balancing > with the wheel actually spinning I would call dynamic. They obviously use > the terms differently.  I imagine it wouldn't hurt any if you did both > for the rear as well, even if it isn't necessary.  The whole premise of > on-the-car balancing is that you don't want to move the tires around.  > Even if you remove and replace a wheel, you want to mark it so you put > the same lug studs through the same wheel holes.  I would think in modern > off-the-car balancing they should just balance all of the wheels the best > they can regardless of position.  I suppose they could use a lower > standard for the rears, but that seems pretty lame to me. > > -Steve > > At 01:21 PM 11/5/2019, Randall via Shop-talk wrote: >> I don't know that this is relevant, but the manual for my on-the-car >> balancer (an antique so old it actually uses vacuum tubes) talks about >> "static" and "dynamic" imbalance as two different tire/wheel conditions. >> Its sensor only works in one direction, so first you check for the tire >> hopping up and down (which it call static imbalance), then for wobble >> from side to side (dynamic). IIRC, the dynamic check is only done on the >> front axle. >> -- Randall > > --------------250E78D705061588527B92E5 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Static vs. Dynamic - consider a yardstick (or metre-stick) with equal weights on either end. With one weight mounted an inch below the stick, the other three inches below, with both equidistant from the center of the stick. This is statically balanced similar to a balance - neither side will tend to rise or fall. BUT if you put an axle through it and rotate it about that axis, the weights will try to rotate about a point two inches below the yardstick and will alternately pull it up and down a bit with each revolution.

Putting both weights equidistant radially and axially (which is what dynamic balancing does) removes that wobbling force. Here is some ASCII art (best viewed in a fixed-width font.)

      Static balance only            Static and Dynamic balance
---------------+--------------- ---------------+---------------
Wt             |                               |
               |                Wt             |             Wt
               |             Wt

Donald.

On 05-Nov-2019 13:40, Steven Trovato via Shop-talk wrote:
That's interesting.  I always thought of static balancing as being done with a bubble balancer sitting still on the floor.  And any balancing with the wheel actually spinning I would call dynamic.  They obviously use the terms differently.  I imagine it wouldn't hurt any if you did both for the rear as well, even if it isn't necessary.  The whole premise of on-the-car balancing is that you don't want to move the tires around.  Even if you remove and replace a wheel, you want to mark it so you put the same lug studs through the same wheel holes.  I would think in modern off-the-car balancing they should just balance all of the wheels the best they can regardless of position.  I suppose they could use a lower standard for the rears, but that seems pretty lame to me.

-Steve

At 01:21 PM 11/5/2019, Randall via Shop-talk wrote:
I don't know that this is relevant, but the manual for my on-the-car balancer (an antique so old it actually uses vacuum tubes) talks about "static" and "dynamic" imbalance as two different tire/wheel conditions. Its sensor only works in one direction, so first you check for the tire hopping up and down (which it call static imbalance), then for wobble from side to side (dynamic). IIRC, the dynamic check is only done on the front axle.
-- Randall


--------------250E78D705061588527B92E5-- --===============1315300353472408785== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============1315300353472408785==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 15:40:39 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0061A09E8 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 15:40:39 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qk1-f170.google.com (unknown [209.85.222.170]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3801FA08FF for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 15:40:33 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-qk1-f170.google.com with SMTP id a194so22779667qkg.10 for ; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 14:40:33 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=LNqZPhH1BPx/yCg0P/swq3cIgpQFUHI9HOqX9gxYCU0=; b=W6Fdv7PPiVTWfjqXuKaqBNNQeu9Iy4sYrDLbfiGNwEhzx8KNT9qYayUhA2n3B+AASM x7sqF3ab6zc/kCo7QrGC1/sfkTIqUEXw/sKMROFbki9exNFTjH1p/J8XkEKFWMFwb8Vu eXs/IvzswFneou+yxPdWR+ZBatwXH0dxX8O240OEWCLSB0ueu9bC+eauyyec79p0G0wj bT3R98mJgmduo3069/0C5hXKvZwYD1Efc31MGuG76l76xXBiFyAzTS2QdBlz4BVZuos7 P1vAnLBTFz6RWZU9Yp7ebUG1GG4RsVcfiMcyz/XM0rUVDYGn9vc6DjGyH8zOIgR993Xj k07Q== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; bh=LNqZPhH1BPx/yCg0P/swq3cIgpQFUHI9HOqX9gxYCU0=; b=WkSZcvpQU1TfMfyJn/Ird4bfTTTR64J8dRCTbQvsioDxnT/qBIl2JXNlfkKALmhyi6 Hes6cJfaz4lRx3KWwq2R090Y+a5c3PSlynyC2L60Nm70cj8mhLNIPtO7oDBkVZe2guhU RJWnHv4dQ76486t3Tf/Q++UK0PzK7DnEnuG72cDPRcZxprF7XH62z0dkBdcSdD62S9J1 Q2cbHpgNWB79ygkS93KbeyDHeQMUMnvF+GPtKV3xgLmL7JdkOsk572o6yefVpiGrsFtQ GucdVG301j7Ag55hgAPcs2oKWzDK2ifKr/MVRriptTbbsI4yp/EI+Wrad1HLwJhBOTjO UyMQ== K0NJ+Ies2LzaQAlNfxxAn9E/sPoS 25mr24574550qks.75.1572993632347; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 14:40:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from macbook-pro-2.home (ool-43526917.dyn.optonline.net. [67.82.105.23]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id q17sm16732626qtq.58.2019.11.05.14.40.31 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 05 Nov 2019 14:40:31 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2019 17:40:29 -0500 References: <4B.18.03419.F1CB1CD5@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <5D224FD74C71461296FDE6CE228E9A5D@Johnsdesktop> To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: Jim Stone via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thanks guys. > On Nov 5, 2019, at 2:20 PM, john niolon via Shop-talk wrote: > > You are correct Steve.... the port on the BFP valve is down stream of the check valve on the sprinkler side of the valve so the BFP offers no resistance or blockage for the air at this point... really convenient for doing what we???re discussing. > > j > > -----Original Message----- From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk > Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2019 12:14 PM > To: Shop Talk > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System > > I shouldn't really be speaking for John, but I > think he is just saying that his backflow > preventer has a convenient port that he uses to > connect. I don't think he is saying that the > backflow preventer presents any other problem for > the operation. I am sure John will let us know if I am correct. > > -Steve T. > > At 12:48 PM 11/5/2019, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote: >> Thanks, guys. I just bought the adapter; it will be here on Thursday, well ahead of any freezing temperatures. >> >> John????????s comment about a backflow preventer valve does have me rethinking one aspect of my plan. The system installer put in an outside hose barb that he intended for blowing out the system, but I had thought it made sense to move ahead of that and start where the system originates in the basement. I can isolate the sprinkler from the rest of the system and blow it out from there. Unless there is a good reason not to do it that. If there is a backflow preventer valve between the hose barb and the basement, might there be a problem blowing it out from there? >> >> Jim > > > -- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jniolon@att.net > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine@gmail.com > _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 15:44:15 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41DCFA09DE for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 15:44:15 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from sonic302-25.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com (unknown [98.137.68.151]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A69DFA04E1 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 15:44:11 -0700 (MST) t=1572993851; bh=MP40HJ88GnJjRWJhFIuPfqedlDlG+B8e9WNW4S79T4s=; h=From:To:Subject:Date:References:From:Subject; b=QGqQQE8q2o0t/FIjjieb0iFOirKaqRKrnTRPpvV+Qkb4hf4mFGlNRfqU2+sF8Kax6UWZ64UJgj/K4REGEcc2oJQ8FhgS0psolhbWeCK0GDgipXFHCC5IaT/5EawkQjHx2ObFLA6MbOkte/1LQzExiJyUDNu0vA/+suWNiFIwY2A= 2itZaGtJx_Mj3JrQDcvfubyrt3AOZagjTKYiO6C6zyJQpcP0JyMOT3DKgaiewkn4JJR7fAARdqDS 7HXg0YlOKQFPQhkS94bsv0xD3QU_wM14Uo3re7.Rrh7gga82DIkI5IC3cCc7N1Z2qLk8PapxTRO8 q7XkmQO41Q23vJGZ0RUystTorXX5I5RqVNeYvOdn0B0odv9WAchl5O6DyyzQLm.AJ4GIv3DOj09i 8fEwMaUhiPL0y_HI3Ws4TtXaDPtHlfJb9N3ZyIFenH0KjLHztjcDs50auPNMqlAgnRfDbZIz7IVn iTGgV5EzCvxYIbX7vpLR1zNgTdcXAroZW3V5Y47NWP9L5ZMOI2Z3WZorzcpAkJSSUps6g.q3UHZC 9Ur9mI3RKDoZZaVGMqZwUmOVQJ4ODPN5IF02mNOU7lD7t3ZpvyYxcOkKW56Zk.5WBku1P4npP_oO LMNnkropwHagUxbnMprNDDB1Sc2xwOOBfJCcvwrIbVr8Ty_we2FGIjlOm2AraPBOF7j6_BMgNOtn Wp89b.lWI5NI7aAXbSIwGuWa.b75Bj20c9X.JXbnTnQPe6yV_b_xsSL7nT0S5hY9Y.kMVXsyUwvg ywcMp1kZmvk6kOL3OPNZ4WXyU6w9bAvaJvKXgNFlY0fc8dZzVF_I5yW1.1uaDXc_a9qDlYepY3Co ILQQh_.yWpO67yRHg023Per.XaV5jzfXS4IlbHb8loMKJmLHROT4Z80Trl5wyyaAZhXmuUxLnH0Y XQijjo_u5DghK09uCCCuKi7tAMOvyx7_f0juPfRoEFfGqi0YU_ztVGMu.D_3i4hmVRVmhyPRvFEn 4ZOG2JMmCLAx9XpnOXNiRXV00545j8rs.31hpv7u6udPipX.YKNKzTzubz19FCR5rBuYLhjAbhSl ANkN7LmjM27cNFU6kkwJbhqMinTpUKYVCJ7B61qFuhGO32dmxKZLwEm9VbD8.4gGno3XB0b2CXAV fq6z4g3k5HtM2fUimbEIFzPxsPY.K64LzCYg5NhfeoRmidJzfHfSaWDTCBROQld3HlWX6JsZq7KB oBQo4Ar5RfiQjShsgVXK7dnGa7aD0T3fEnv8_0DOozKz3e8NYCzlT1LNdjF_w1hVEOkxyqowXOG1 bG3fa2zxl9wLeFxRu6Vxj8ABy6IsenQrQgtSB9p3Gm2eMXzQMHn0A8hlSTAAn.r5OXDAme4HhqUW UkthS9xQCsIuSyEQ96lUzd0cgJNSi9dy5RBHVpIYhMV0JlVBfZPOl3PHj94Uaj8c7RecvRBAcHUO 11smZFD2FD0Rb5G2aUl1jI6Yz96KdZxoxuyPo8t_222n0Zqu3tCNcpUSwBmISn4p_9ylQOw-- Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic302.consmr.mail.gq1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 22:44:11 +0000 Received: by smtp426.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (Oath Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID c04d8e9c8dbce03386c3d0834d6f95ab; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 22:44:06 +0000 (UTC) To: "shop-talk" Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2019 16:44:06 -0600 Importance: Normal References: <08D0079D8B6442B4B94026E88965019E.ref@Johnsdesktop> Subject: [Shop-talk] keeping the smoke in----fuse selection for a circuit From: john niolon via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============8838621861171050926== boundary="----=_NextPart_000_09B7_01D593F8.3D476800" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_09B7_01D593F8.3D476800 charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I=E2=80=99m wiring for my power seats in my truck project. My wiring = harness didn't include this circuit so I'm coming off a battery = termination point. Thinking about fusing each seat. The internal wiring = is 14 ga and doing a amp check I read from 3-6 amps with any of the 3 = motors (tilt/raise/for-back) running and around 12 amps when you hit the = stops and the motor stalls. I know 14 ga is good for 18-20 amps but I'm = trying to decide how much to fuse it.. I wanna keep the smoke inside but = don't want to fuse too high.... would you consider a percentage over = stall amp draw or running amp draw..... and what safety factor ?? I = should already know this at my age... john https://jniolon.classicpickup.com/ ------=_NextPart_000_09B7_01D593F8.3D476800 charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I=E2=80=99m wiring for my power = seats in my truck=20 project. My wiring harness didn't include this circuit so I'm coming off = a=20 battery termination point. Thinking about fusing each seat. The internal = wiring=20 is 14 ga and doing a amp check I read from 3-6 amps with any of the 3 = motors=20 (tilt/raise/for-back) running and around 12 amps when you hit the stops = and the=20 motor stalls. I know 14 ga is good for 18-20 amps but I'm trying to = decide how=20 much to fuse it.. I wanna keep the smoke inside but don't want to fuse = too=20 high.... would you consider a percentage over stall amp draw or running = amp=20 draw..... and what safety factor ??  I should already know this at = my=20 age...

john
 

https://jniolon.classicpickup.com/
<= /HTML> ------=_NextPart_000_09B7_01D593F8.3D476800-- --===============8838621861171050926== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8838621861171050926==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 16:19:26 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2C23A09F4 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 16:19:26 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-ch2-11v.sys.comcast.net (unknown [69.252.207.43]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB4B2A056D for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 16:16:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from resomta-ch2-12v.sys.comcast.net ([69.252.207.108]) by resqmta-ch2-11v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTP id S1oxi9Yd7yGQ7S83eiIUpa; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 23:16:18 +0000 s=20190202a; t=1572995778; bh=yB+v5TsR0QhOKbjDlL5a3WILShpOfMEN81yfXch3FPQ=; h=Received:Received:Subject:To:From:Message-ID:Date:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=CTfQ7c2PoYklgD6H5nk07C/C6cslfORiTutA3fdxHHRnr5v6tRi6/wXOp2aySPGJg AAttHb3c4tkdxz4mYp9fwmTunj8gVr9QCYF9ZJSI/y/AiwYfoZYLAAQfMPRLm0r4nk lvXiMZR7aa9g9+R+x+pMZOwACI0VReFuTirj+vY2Hn24lN76lWF7k9G1XLKc8rKAhe QbuM1EFm5D6luwAMWK70qA4nrBXaSFzQFS/EMomsw+TMIme+AgXFhee2irXUAPwbTM RHtbuCNRlXSRVLU0RA1094BCBpYJhVfKQemELt+xVWnCa9BG7Jm+FGoDZwtJznjXt0 k12DaUZjuP8uQ== Received: from [192.168.1.133] ([68.32.79.140]) by resomta-ch2-12v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTPSA id S83dic1PpAumKS83eiDtxj; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 23:16:18 +0000 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <08D0079D8B6442B4B94026E88965019E.ref@Johnsdesktop> <08D0079D8B6442B4B94026E88965019E@Johnsdesktop> Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2019 18:16:16 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.9.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] keeping the smoke in----fuse selection for a circuit From: Donald H Locker via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net RnVzZSBmb3IgdGhlIHdpcmUgc2l6ZTsgc21va2UgZXNjYXBpbmcgZnJvbSB0aGUgd2lyZSBpcyBh IGZpcmUgaGF6YXJkLiAKSWYgdGhlIG1vdG9yIHN0YWxsIGN1cnJlbnQgaXMgY29uc2lzdGVudCBh dCAxMkEsIEknZCBnbyB3aXRoIDE1QSBmdXNlcyAtIAplbm91Z2ggdG8gY292ZXIgdGhlIG1vdG9y IGxvYWRzIGJ1dCBvbmx5IGp1c3QgZW5vdWdoLiAoQSAxNUEgYXV0b21vdGl2ZSAKZnVzZSB3aWxs IGNhcnJ5IDE1QSBmb3JldmVyIChjLmYuIApodHRwczovL3d3dy5saXR0ZWxmdXNlLmNvbS9+L21l ZGlhL2F1dG9tb3RpdmUvZGF0YXNoZWV0cy9mdXNlcy9wYXNzZW5nZXItY2FyLWFuZC1jb21tZXJj aWFsLXZlaGljbGUvYmxhZGUtZnVzZXMvbGl0dGVsZnVzZV9taW5pX2RhdGFzaGVldC5wZGYgCmFu ZCAKaHR0cDovL3d3dy5jb29wZXJpbmR1c3RyaWVzLmNvbS9jb250ZW50L2RhbS9wdWJsaWMvYnVz c21hbm4vRWxlY3RyaWNhbC9SZXNvdXJjZXMvcHJvZHVjdC1kYXRhc2hlZXRzLWIvYnVzLWVsZS1k cy0yMDA5LWF0Yy5wZGYpIApidXQgd2lsbCBmdXNlIGluIDc1MG1zIGF0IDIwQQoKSFRILApEb25h bGQuCi0tCipQbGFpbiBUZXh0KiBlbWFpbCAtLSBpdCdzIGFuIGFjY2Vzc2liaWxpdHkgaXNzdWUK KCkgbm8gcHJvcHJpZXRhcnkgYXR0YWNobWVudHM7IG5vIGh0bWwgbWFpbAovXCA8aHR0cDovL3d3 dy5nZW9yZ2VkaWxsb24uY29tL3dlYi9odG1sX2VtYWlsX2lzX2V2aWwuc2h0bWw+CgpPbiAyMDE5 LTExLTA1IDU6NDQgcC5tLiwgam9obiBuaW9sb24gdmlhIFNob3AtdGFsayB3cm90ZToKPiBJ4oCZ bSB3aXJpbmcgZm9yIG15IHBvd2VyIHNlYXRzIGluIG15IHRydWNrIHByb2plY3QuIE15IHdpcmlu ZyBoYXJuZXNzIAo+IGRpZG4ndCBpbmNsdWRlIHRoaXMgY2lyY3VpdCBzbyBJJ20gY29taW5nIG9m ZiBhIGJhdHRlcnkgdGVybWluYXRpb24gCj4gcG9pbnQuIFRoaW5raW5nIGFib3V0IGZ1c2luZyBl YWNoIHNlYXQuIFRoZSBpbnRlcm5hbCB3aXJpbmcgaXMgMTQgZ2EgYW5kIAo+IGRvaW5nIGEgYW1w IGNoZWNrIEkgcmVhZCBmcm9tIDMtNiBhbXBzIHdpdGggYW55IG9mIHRoZSAzIG1vdG9ycyAKPiAo dGlsdC9yYWlzZS9mb3ItYmFjaykgcnVubmluZyBhbmQgYXJvdW5kIDEyIGFtcHMgd2hlbiB5b3Ug aGl0IHRoZSBzdG9wcyAKPiBhbmQgdGhlIG1vdG9yIHN0YWxscy4gSSBrbm93IDE0IGdhIGlzIGdv b2QgZm9yIDE4LTIwIGFtcHMgYnV0IEknbSB0cnlpbmcgCj4gdG8gZGVjaWRlIGhvdyBtdWNoIHRv IGZ1c2UgaXQuLiBJIHdhbm5hIGtlZXAgdGhlIHNtb2tlIGluc2lkZSBidXQgZG9uJ3QgCj4gd2Fu dCB0byBmdXNlIHRvbyBoaWdoLi4uLiB3b3VsZCB5b3UgY29uc2lkZXIgYSBwZXJjZW50YWdlIG92 ZXIgc3RhbGwgYW1wIAo+IGRyYXcgb3IgcnVubmluZyBhbXAgZHJhdy4uLi4uIGFuZCB3aGF0IHNh ZmV0eSBmYWN0b3IgPz/CoCBJIHNob3VsZCAKPiBhbHJlYWR5IGtub3cgdGhpcyBhdCBteSBhZ2Uu Li4KPiAKPiAKPiBqb2huCj4gCj4gaHR0cHM6Ly9qbmlvbG9uLmNsYXNzaWNwaWNrdXAuY29tLwo+ IAo+IF9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fCj4gCj4g U2hvcC10YWxrQGF1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0Cj4gRG9uYXRlOiBodHRwOi8vd3d3LnRlYW0ubmV0L2Rv bmF0ZS5odG1sCj4gU3VnZ2VzdGVkIGFubnVhbCBkb25hdGlvbiAgJDEyLjk2Cj4gQXJjaGl2ZTog aHR0cDovL3d3dy50ZWFtLm5ldC9waXBlcm1haWwvc2hvcC10YWxrIGh0dHA6Ly9hdXRveC50ZWFt Lm5ldC9hcmNoaXZlCj4gCj4gVW5zdWJzY3JpYmUvTWFuYWdlOiBodHRwOi8vYXV0b3gudGVhbS5u ZXQvbWFpbG1hbi9vcHRpb25zL3Nob3AtdGFsay9kaGxvY2tlckBjb21jYXN0Lm5ldAo+IApfX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXwoKU2hvcC10YWxrQGF1 dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0CkRvbmF0ZTogaHR0cDovL3d3dy50ZWFtLm5ldC9kb25hdGUuaHRtbApTdWdn ZXN0ZWQgYW5udWFsIGRvbmF0aW9uICAkMTIuOTYKQXJjaGl2ZTogaHR0cDovL3d3dy50ZWFtLm5l dC9waXBlcm1haWwvc2hvcC10YWxrIGh0dHA6Ly9hdXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldC9hcmNoaXZlCgpVbnN1 YnNjcmliZS9NYW5hZ2U6IGh0dHA6Ly9hdXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldC9tYWlsbWFuL29wdGlvbnMvc2hv cC10YWxrL21oYXJjQGF1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0Cgo= From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Nov 5 20:04:11 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 239CBA09CB for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 20:04:11 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from dnvrco-cmomta01.email.rr.com (unknown [107.14.73.227]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E09DA04F7 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 20:04:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from [IPv6:::ffff:192.168.42.134] ([97.73.84.240]) by cmsmtp with ESMTPA id SBbtiu8SlgJPjSBc1igyXv; Wed, 06 Nov 2019 03:04:04 +0000 To: john niolon , shop-talk Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2019 21:04:03 -0600 Importance: normal References: <08D0079D8B6442B4B94026E88965019E.ref@Johnsdesktop> <08D0079D8B6442B4B94026E88965019E@Johnsdesktop> cLCRN1dTjqfWYBqAqTQqautPXsAB9El89K1zMHs1CX6+PaZEG0xObt9uxTRQFdWdRicaIJGcwUwV5iwoogmoDA1otWqBl21VfpUNNYURmf2zgEj3lYEQiLqn Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] keeping the smoke in----fuse selection for a circuit From: Randall via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8401793124502381739== boundary="_F2E6146D-313E-42FB-9F61-D840E6E64758_" --_F2E6146D-313E-42FB-9F61-D840E6E64758_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I would seriously consider a 20 amp circuit breaker instead of a fuse. Perhaps they aren=E2=80=99t all that way, but on my cars with power seats, = you can run 2 or 3 of the motors at the same time. Tilt, for example, runs= the front motor up and the rear motor down. -- Randall From: john niolon via Shop-talk Sent: Tuesday, November 5, 2019 4:44 PM To: shop-talk Subject: [Shop-talk] keeping the smoke in----fuse selection for a circuit I=E2=80=99m wiring for my power seats in my truck project. My wiring harnes= s didn't include this circuit so I'm coming off a battery termination point= . Thinking about fusing each seat. The internal wiring is 14 ga and doing a= amp check I read from 3-6 amps with any of the 3 motors (tilt/raise/for-ba= ck) running and around 12 amps when you hit the stops and the motor stalls.= I know 14 ga is good for 18-20 amps but I'm trying to decide how much to f= use it.. I wanna keep the smoke inside but don't want to fuse too high.... = would you consider a percentage over stall amp draw or running amp draw....= . and what safety factor ??=C2=A0 I should already know this at my age... john =C2=A0 https://jniolon.classicpickup.com/ --_F2E6146D-313E-42FB-9F61-D840E6E64758_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I would seriously consider a 20 amp = circuit breaker instead of a fuse.

 

Perhaps they aren=E2=80=99t all that way, but on = my cars with power seats, you can run 2 or 3 of the motors at the same time= .=C2=A0 Tilt, for example, runs the front motor up and the rear motor down.=

 

-- Randa= ll

 

From: john niolon via S= hop-talk
Sent: Tuesday, November 5, 2019 4:44 PM
To: shop-talk
Subject: = [Shop-talk] keeping the smoke in----fuse selection for a circuit

 

I=E2= =80=99m wiring for my power seats in my truck project. My wiring harness di= dn't include this circuit so I'm coming off a battery termination point. Th= inking about fusing each seat. The internal wiring is 14 ga and doing a amp= check I read from 3-6 amps with any of the 3 motors (tilt/raise/for-back) = running and around 12 amps when you hit the stops and the motor stalls. I k= now 14 ga is good for 18-20 amps but I'm trying to decide how much to fuse = it.. I wanna keep the smoke inside but don't want to fuse too high.... woul= d you consider a percentage over stall amp draw or running amp draw..... an= d what safety factor ??  I should already know this at my age...



joh= n

 


https://jniolon.class= icpickup.com/

 

= --_F2E6146D-313E-42FB-9F61-D840E6E64758_-- --===============8401793124502381739== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============8401793124502381739==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Nov 6 20:15:57 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B79D8A05B6 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2019 20:15:57 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-po-10v.sys.comcast.net (unknown [96.114.154.169]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 984A3A05A7 for ; Wed, 6 Nov 2019 20:15:47 -0700 (MST) Received: from resomta-po-20v.sys.comcast.net ([96.114.154.244]) by resqmta-po-10v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTP id SXd1i9GeAztAoSYGwiGKQH; Thu, 07 Nov 2019 03:15:46 +0000 d=comcastmailservice.net; s=20180828_2048; t=1573096546; bh=zo7kdA0qIFB/y5ecuiJUb6vM6zvvNuUPuGUwjCYKTow=; h=Received:Received:Subject:To:Reply-To:From:Message-ID:Date: MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=EQEX7fzbQ0cM7jmlrckYq4mCWXA+pZ8+dfcTyOrnoHx63hN8E1KOwlG0JGFiz2q7T gvypOhnRc7YG4IcNMgeUut8gKte3HzFJffRbPf/MWSGG6c//s5Q/byjv75PmGrIRT+ PaYe42qzlRMdP/P/RuVTINcobZQZ0z/aD9OieYdz+0jJpBMsnaxnfKN5kPPLSWmZjU L0stb62EXpkbbuQ2mejBdzIv3N5zDa+9mjYIN0KZ4LggFX+be2yUMIyhjY2UA3aQZt xMS6rNijkMt3igPMqHl9Sygl9ia6dFgRqk9CIAbDLbyFjOjuBpDy6KqkQwuKdB1hB8 L7rbelOytYwwA== Received: from [192.168.0.102] ([73.15.224.244]) by resomta-po-20v.sys.comcast.net with ESMTPSA id SYGtiqHNNBE3ZSYGwilOgC; Thu, 07 Nov 2019 03:15:46 +0000 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2019 19:15:50 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.9.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] keeping the smoke in----fuse selection for a circuit (Randall) From: Mark Miller via Shop-talk 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(Postfix) with ESMTP id D4125A0284 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2019 06:24:33 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qk1-f178.google.com (unknown [209.85.222.178]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9BBBA033C for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2019 06:24:25 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-qk1-f178.google.com with SMTP id 15so5210756qkh.6 for ; Fri, 08 Nov 2019 05:24:25 -0800 (PST) h=from:mime-version:subject:date:references:to:in-reply-to:message-id; bh=9YO8lRwqQuXqjDEnYEjZAVcs2yD/qWbsTMM3e0CHnRA=; b=MT/5auP4BzdE9/H7sNQlyBb2d+A15qEVqUwPnp15FszncqUkBNlkkgaAAV8rxVWvKW Q3WSkypT5KRMe+rXjLSAHleAc62vK/ftv4woE6krmkjpjy0fXIIkFkPtSfkguZSqwN9w duvwzfWZ72fV64aBxxpUrgCzv7noilrNklDP46nD4HTsk6CwCKdr/enOywX3yxhgBqGX I3LJECx9CQJY2vxDTsCu2NpT4/qlF+K4K2ozeqAh7rlH881oSWeBagytwRYSQR715Q0p TbUH7DS8PQNd7I9jhnFI+kjUHZAjntWcFP19uB9JoM7QR/dM/cBpfgpZS9koPit7y8ot AYUg== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:mime-version:subject:date:references:to :in-reply-to:message-id; 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[67.82.105.23]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id z17sm3910051qtj.95.2019.11.08.05.24.23 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 08 Nov 2019 05:24:24 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2019 08:24:22 -0500 References: To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: Jim Stone via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4749722895582341369== boundary="Apple-Mail=_D1A9E656-850C-4073-8BA1-E390D3635A16" --Apple-Mail=_D1A9E656-850C-4073-8BA1-E390D3635A16 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 The Amazon adaptor arrived yesterday, so I thought I=E2=80=99d update = this with some new information. The adaptor was well made and the = shut-off valve proved to be very handy; it was well worth the $20. It = also came with excellent instructions that mostly agreed with what was = said here, with one exception: it said =E2=80=9Cavoid blowing compressed = air through the PVB because doing so may damage the BVP.=E2=80=9D I = assume my system has a BVP in it, but can=E2=80=99t find it and just = went ahead and blew it out from the basement as discussed. The instructions also recommend that the compressor should be "as large = as possible, preferably 15 gallons or larger.=E2=80=9D I think that is = good advice, as my little HF 8 gallon compressor was barely (I think) up = to the task. I initially set it to 50 lbs, the recommended pressure, = but it was only putting out about 40 lbs during use, so I turned that up = to get it a little higher. Even so, the compressor would fully extend = the spray heads for the first 15 seconds or so, then just bubble water = out with the head retracted. The compressor ran constantly while the = system was on, so I gave it a rest between blowing out each zone. I = also blew out each zone at least three times, but there was sill some = spray at the beginning each time. I am going to do it one more time = today, but know it won=E2=80=99t be completely dry. I assume it won=E2=80= =99t be an issue when the little bit of water remaining in the system = freezes, but someone please let me know if I am wrong about this. My 60 = gal compressor is about 150 yards away from the water inlet, but I could = make that work if necessary. Just in time, as the cold weather arrived today, with the first below = freezing temps expected tonight. Cheers, Jim > On Nov 5, 2019, at 11:32 AM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: >=20 > I need to drain and winterize my new sprinkler system and can=E2=80=99t = imagine I need to pay someone to do that job. While I understand the = =E2=80=98proper=E2=80=99 way to do it is to manually open each valve, I = was told a few years ago that it is easier to just pressurize the system = at the drain valve and then use the manual function on the controller to = run through each zone until no more water comes out. (FWIW, my system = is not that large and has 6 zones.). I was thinking about rigging = something up that would allow me to attach my compressor and walk away, = but found this on Amazon, which seems like a good investment that would = pay for itself on the first use: = https://www.amazon.com/Winterize-Sprinkler-Systems-Outdoor-Faucets/dp/B005= 5QAAIQ/ref=3Dasc_df_B0055QAAIQ/?tag=3Dhyprod-20&linkCode=3Ddf0&hvadid=3D30= 9735714375&hvpos=3D1o1&hvnetw=3Dg&hvrand=3D11131050794144962178&hvpone=3D&= hvptwo=3D&hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3Dc&hvdvcmdl=3D&hvlocint=3D&hvlocphy=3D9004590&hv= targid=3Dpla-570302725618&psc=3D1 = . I could save around $10 and just = buy a hose to quick disconnect fitting, but the shut off valve seems = like a good addition. >=20 > I have fairly large compressor, but think it will be more trouble than = it is worth to get air to the master drain valve. Instead, I was = planning on just using my Harbor Freight 8 gal portable compressor. = (https://www.harborfreight.com/8-gal-2-hp-125-psi-oil-lube-air-compressor-= 68740.html = ). My water pressure is regulated to 60 lbs, so I figured = something around this should be sufficient. >=20 > Am I missing anything? Is there any good reason to pay a professional = to do this job? It seems like a no-brainer to me, but I=E2=80=99ve been = called a no-brainer before. >=20 > Thanks, > Jim --Apple-Mail=_D1A9E656-850C-4073-8BA1-E390D3635A16 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 The = Amazon adaptor arrived yesterday, so I thought I=E2=80=99d update this = with some new information.  The adaptor was well made and the = shut-off valve proved to be very handy; it was well worth the $20. =  It also came with excellent instructions that mostly agreed with = what was said here, with one exception: it said =E2=80=9Cavoid blowing = compressed air through the PVB because doing so may damage the BVP.=E2=80=9D=  I assume my system has a BVP in it, but can=E2=80=99t find it and = just went ahead and blew it out from the basement as discussed.

The instructions also = recommend that the compressor should be "as large as possible, = preferably 15 gallons or larger.=E2=80=9D  I think that is good = advice, as my little HF 8 gallon compressor was barely (I think) up to = the task.  I initially set it to 50 lbs, the recommended pressure, = but it was only putting out about 40 lbs during use, so I turned that up = to get it a little higher.  Even so, the compressor would fully = extend the spray heads for the first 15 seconds or so, then just bubble = water out with the head retracted.  The compressor ran constantly = while the system was on, so I gave it a rest between blowing out each = zone.  I also blew out each zone at least three times, but there = was sill some spray at the beginning each time.  I am going to do = it one more time today, but know it won=E2=80=99t be completely dry. =  I assume it won=E2=80=99t be an issue when the little bit of water = remaining in the system freezes, but someone please let me know if I am = wrong about this.  My 60 gal compressor is about 150 yards away = from the water inlet, but I could make that work if necessary.

Just in time, as the = cold weather arrived today, with the first below freezing temps expected = tonight.

Cheers,
Jim

On Nov = 5, 2019, at 11:32 AM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

I need to drain and = winterize my new sprinkler system and can=E2=80=99t imagine I need to = pay someone to do that job.  While I understand the =E2=80=98proper=E2= =80=99 way to do it is to manually open each valve, I was told a few = years ago that it is easier to just pressurize the system at the drain = valve and then use the manual function on the controller to run through = each zone until no more water comes out.  (FWIW, my system is not = that large and has 6 zones.). I was thinking about rigging something up = that would allow me to attach my compressor and walk away, but found = this on Amazon, which seems like a good investment that would pay for = itself on the first use: https://www.amazon.com/Winterize-Sprinkler-Systems-Outdoor-Fauc= ets/dp/B0055QAAIQ/ref=3Dasc_df_B0055QAAIQ/?tag=3Dhyprod-20&linkCode=3D= df0&hvadid=3D309735714375&hvpos=3D1o1&hvnetw=3Dg&hvrand=3D= 11131050794144962178&hvpone=3D&hvptwo=3D&hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3D= c&hvdvcmdl=3D&hvlocint=3D&hvlocphy=3D9004590&hvtargid=3Dpl= a-570302725618&psc=3D1. I could save around $10 and just buy a = hose to quick disconnect fitting, but the shut off valve seems like a = good addition.

I = have fairly large compressor, but think it will be more trouble than it = is worth to get air to the master drain valve.  Instead, I was = planning on just using my Harbor Freight 8 gal portable compressor. =  (https://www.harborfreight.com/8-gal-2-hp-125-psi-oil-lube-air-c= ompressor-68740.html).   My water pressure is regulated to 60 = lbs, so I figured something around this should be sufficient.

Am I missing anything? =  Is there any good reason to pay a professional to do this job? =  It seems like a no-brainer to me, but I=E2=80=99ve been called a = no-brainer before.

Thanks,
Jim

= --Apple-Mail=_D1A9E656-850C-4073-8BA1-E390D3635A16-- --===============4749722895582341369== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============4749722895582341369==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Nov 8 07:47:56 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 494FFA05C4 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2019 07:47:56 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ot1-f50.google.com (unknown [209.85.210.50]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F24E6A059B for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2019 07:47:48 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ot1-f50.google.com with SMTP id d5so5400060otp.4 for ; Fri, 08 Nov 2019 06:47:48 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=gZ3dCrxYN+B1zWg3N2wRUeJtBL761x0GXumlAOKJ5Os=; b=bLH4Es3JZWNKCjat5914/Glj/P0vNCdkPtgemueffGkaf2DTXlpG5aONpx20cPvlTL T7VlVHLvLeohfS+iW0VuELK8jxxocvtXTUwEHWD7+MFZRqIfOqNib1VJzZROhuqJjOuB XbuniZJ15ksN/Pm3zFDg3tnNLZvpWGQ8nv2igIZiVF7SBG75zzjIgKydUkWQFoFnMfaf P0rQMNh+h/00miNc/0VXoEr6FDI2mVOGcKu3ICntSYWYizY375bbW1coAtV/p5fAktR5 Ff3deohBG8H6AIusUOhyERRdtPU4JxvaL2paaaHSSG73WBrFuH9YjMF/f2J9GiuW77Cl +DCg== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=gZ3dCrxYN+B1zWg3N2wRUeJtBL761x0GXumlAOKJ5Os=; b=X3l/03spPL/kLrfEfHK68d7MvPqpkNyKO6Htk9LXr99vlDP7iThPLKow7J/lc6MKwN H8W3mUHyZQLqrs1ywP7SveZ6P3BPCqH6Js0FoJ8+xVt/wSE/wwesYTNo/Nyzi5lojOc7 5VPi28Pj2c7Q0tHREmQyBhjZ4ezXAg6U5X+lc5hjbC59Z7hDY+7lUgAudoOpHJR78BzH ZD+JKE+NgFyw1BUbvFBaMIMUwuU8VlxIIgwnrpqHY8EP8KHGqly1SqHAzSAsVA718nV0 mLXIL0OvLDE+GMVs13oL1UxbCuvHTxOlqvlPNO93/z3ovR2pEYwj7RjBH3mGfbs+3dwC hQMQ== u03OpggC3J4fK0Iw9X6ct1km08hMZdcS9U+H1imcRQ== Fri, 08 Nov 2019 06:47:47 -0800 (PST) References: Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2019 09:47:36 -0500 To: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: Scott Hall via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6452121912598530414== --0000000000008ccd4c0596d6ddbd Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jim, I'm going to assume this is a similar thing to winterizing a swimming pool. For pools, there are frequent warnings abounot using a compressor to blow the lines, or to make sure to keep the PSI below 20. It is frequently mentioned that a shop vac or dedicated blower tool is preferred. The thought is that to remove the air high pressure is not the goal (and that high pressure and damage the PVC pipe and related fittings) but rather high volume. And that a shop vac is the better way to achieve that. At least that's what the internet said. I used my compressor, set to 15 psi. I guess we'll know in the spring how I did--it just hit 18 degrees here this morning. It sounds like your sprinkler system operates similarly. On Fri, Nov 8, 2019, 8:24 AM Jim Stone via Shop-talk < shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote: > The Amazon adaptor arrived yesterday, so I thought I=E2=80=99d update thi= s with > some new information. The adaptor was well made and the shut-off valve > proved to be very handy; it was well worth the $20. It also came with > excellent instructions that mostly agreed with what was said here, with o= ne > exception: it said =E2=80=9Cavoid blowing compressed air through the PVB = because > doing so may damage the BVP.=E2=80=9D I assume my system has a BVP in it= , but > can=E2=80=99t find it and just went ahead and blew it out from the baseme= nt as > discussed. > > The instructions also recommend that the compressor should be "as large a= s > possible, preferably 15 gallons or larger.=E2=80=9D I think that is good= advice, > as my little HF 8 gallon compressor was barely (I think) up to the task. = I > initially set it to 50 lbs, the recommended pressure, but it was only > putting out about 40 lbs during use, so I turned that up to get it a litt= le > higher. Even so, the compressor would fully extend the spray heads for t= he > first 15 seconds or so, then just bubble water out with the head > retracted. The compressor ran constantly while the system was on, so I > gave it a rest between blowing out each zone. I also blew out each zone = at > least three times, but there was sill some spray at the beginning each > time. I am going to do it one more time today, but know it won=E2=80=99t= be > completely dry. I assume it won=E2=80=99t be an issue when the little bi= t of water > remaining in the system freezes, but someone please let me know if I am > wrong about this. My 60 gal compressor is about 150 yards away from the > water inlet, but I could make that work if necessary. > > Just in time, as the cold weather arrived today, with the first below > freezing temps expected tonight. > > Cheers, > Jim > > On Nov 5, 2019, at 11:32 AM, Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote: > > I need to drain and winterize my new sprinkler system and can=E2=80=99t i= magine I > need to pay someone to do that job. While I understand the =E2=80=98prop= er=E2=80=99 way to > do it is to manually open each valve, I was told a few years ago that it = is > easier to just pressurize the system at the drain valve and then use the > manual function on the controller to run through each zone until no more > water comes out. (FWIW, my system is not that large and has 6 zones.). I > was thinking about rigging something up that would allow me to attach my > compressor and walk away, but found this on Amazon, which seems like a go= od > investment that would pay for itself on the first use: > https://www.amazon.com/Winterize-Sprinkler-Systems-Outdoor-Faucets/dp/B00= 55QAAIQ/ref=3Dasc_df_B0055QAAIQ/?tag=3Dhyprod-20&linkCode=3Ddf0&hvadid=3D30= 9735714375&hvpos=3D1o1&hvnetw=3Dg&hvrand=3D11131050794144962178&hvpone=3D&h= vptwo=3D&hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3Dc&hvdvcmdl=3D&hvlocint=3D&hvlocphy=3D9004590&hvta= rgid=3Dpla-570302725618&psc=3D1. > I could save around $10 and just buy a hose to quick disconnect fitting, > but the shut off valve seems like a good addition. > > I have fairly large compressor, but think it will be more trouble than it > is worth to get air to the master drain valve. Instead, I was planning o= n > just using my Harbor Freight 8 gal portable compressor. ( > https://www.harborfreight.com/8-gal-2-hp-125-psi-oil-lube-air-compressor-= 68740.html). > My water pressure is regulated to 60 lbs, so I figured something around > this should be sufficient. > > Am I missing anything? Is there any good reason to pay a professional to > do this job? It seems like a no-brainer to me, but I=E2=80=99ve been cal= led a > no-brainer before. > > Thanks, > Jim > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/scott.hall.personal@gmail= .com > > --0000000000008ccd4c0596d6ddbd Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Jim,

I'm= going to assume this is a similar thing to winterizing a swimming pool.=C2= =A0=C2=A0

For pools, the= re are frequent warnings abounot using a compressor to blow the lines, or t= o make sure to keep the PSI below 20.=C2=A0=C2=A0
It is frequently mentioned that a shop vac or ded= icated blower tool is preferred.=C2=A0 The thought is that to remove the ai= r high pressure is not the goal (and that high pressure and damage the PVC = pipe and related fittings) but rather high volume.=C2=A0 And that a shop va= c is the better way to achieve that.=C2=A0

At least that's what the internet said.=C2=A0
<= div dir=3D"auto">
I used my compressor, set to 1= 5 psi.=C2=A0 I guess we'll know in the spring how I did--it just hit 18= degrees here this morning.=C2=A0=C2=A0

It sounds like your sprinkler system operates similarly.=C2= =A0=C2=A0

On Fri, Nov 8, 2019, 8:24 AM Jim Stone via Shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net> = wrote:
The Amazon adaptor arrived yesterday, = so I thought I=E2=80=99d update this with some new information.=C2=A0 The a= daptor was well made and=C2=A0the shut-off valve proved to be very handy; i= t was well worth the $20.=C2=A0 It also came with excellent instructions th= at mostly agreed with what was said here, with one exception: it said =E2= =80=9Cavoid blowing compressed air through the PVB because doing so may dam= age the BVP.=E2=80=9D =C2=A0I assume my system has a BVP in it, but can=E2= =80=99t find it and just went ahead and blew it out from the basement as di= scussed.

The instructions also recommend that the compre= ssor should be "as large as possible, preferably 15 gallons or larger.= =E2=80=9D =C2=A0I think that is good advice, as my little HF 8 gallon compr= essor was barely (I think) up to the task.=C2=A0 I initially set it to 50 l= bs, the recommended pressure, but it was only putting out about 40 lbs duri= ng use, so I turned that up to get it a little higher.=C2=A0 Even so, the c= ompressor would fully extend the spray heads for the first 15 seconds or so= , then just bubble water out with the head retracted.=C2=A0 The compressor = ran constantly while the system was on, so I gave it a rest between blowing= out each zone.=C2=A0 I also blew out each zone at least three times, but t= here was sill some spray at the beginning each time.=C2=A0 I am going to do= it one more time today, but know it won=E2=80=99t be completely dry.=C2=A0= I assume it won=E2=80=99t be an issue when the little bit of water remaini= ng in the system freezes, but someone please let me know if I am wrong abou= t this.=C2=A0 My 60 gal compressor is about 150 yards away from the water i= nlet, but I could make that work if necessary.

Jus= t in time, as the cold weather arrived today, with the first below freezing= temps expected tonight.

Cheers,
Jim
=

On Nov 5, 2019, at 11:32 AM, Jim St= one <1789alpine@gmail.com> wrote:

I need to drain and winte= rize my new sprinkler system and can=E2=80=99t imagine I need to pay someon= e to do that job.=C2=A0 While I understand the =E2=80=98proper=E2=80=99 way= to do it is to manually open each valve, I was told a few years ago that i= t is easier to just pressurize the system at the drain valve and then use t= he manual function on the controller to run through each zone until no more= water comes out. =C2=A0(FWIW, my system is not that large and has 6 zones.= ). I was thinking about rigging something up that would allow me to attach = my compressor and walk away, but found this on Amazon, which seems like a g= ood investment that would pay for itself on the first use:=C2=A0https://www.amazon.com/Wi= nterize-Sprinkler-Systems-Outdoor-Faucets/dp/B0055QAAIQ/ref=3Dasc_df_B0055Q= AAIQ/?tag=3Dhyprod-20&linkCode=3Ddf0&hvadid=3D309735714375&hvpo= s=3D1o1&hvnetw=3Dg&hvrand=3D11131050794144962178&hvpone=3D&= hvptwo=3D&hvqmt=3D&hvdev=3Dc&hvdvcmdl=3D&hvlocint=3D&hv= locphy=3D9004590&hvtargid=3Dpla-570302725618&psc=3D1. I could s= ave around $10 and just buy a hose to quick disconnect fitting, but the shu= t off valve seems like a good addition.

I have fairly la= rge compressor, but think it will be more trouble than it is worth to get a= ir to the master drain valve.=C2=A0 Instead, I was planning on just using m= y Harbor Freight 8 gal portable compressor. =C2=A0(https://www.harborfreight.com/8-gal-2-hp-= 125-psi-oil-lube-air-compressor-68740.html). =C2=A0 My water pressure i= s regulated to 60 lbs, so I figured something around this should be suffici= ent.

Am I missing anything?=C2=A0 Is there any goo= d reason to pay a professional to do this job?=C2=A0 It seems like a no-bra= iner to me, but I=E2=80=99ve been called a no-brainer before.
Thanks,
Jim

<= /div>
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
errer" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

alk/scott.hall.personal@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"= _blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/scott.hall.personal= @gmail.com

--0000000000008ccd4c0596d6ddbd-- --===============6452121912598530414== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6452121912598530414==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Nov 8 07:51:59 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4772AA060B for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2019 07:51:59 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net Received: from mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (unknown [167.206.4.196]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 001E8A059B for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2019 07:51:55 -0700 (MST) bh=rO3poq3ZyyZUhG3LGxJphAT8/qdqFBj8+RP9h8LdxbU=; h=Message-ID:Date:To:From:Subject; b=RMnfYEUjC2rrtAeNfYPPGgagQRG/2BjkoeV0RmIAZOUf+PlYgASUcgL4kNTSSSIGf jF7PRAbcUgTgugcipjvP4bcYfpzbvBz8KPQBykcHoB1U0HDPkJUN1aShPNEHel5hqk f/B/vDSMiOU/FQqrV+1/LyNlPQAhzlVvzVTUfzxB/F/CowqaM3BDH8eYhqoVJPjFCQ QQEAmX75yRtIPKU+twAmyh38DxtyXld6GHjTC+kQ16ZYA50ep8MG1Kuz1DfI+qhmum QDM5bDClwSTGCqUjZREUL9PZqbpaMCVvRHpcHbp3rIeIn0HJ1/2HFsIaanskRUqQZt RID3ORNrZzTTA== Authentication-Results: mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net smtp.user=strovato; auth=pass (LOGIN) a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:117 a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:17 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=NFCCdfRkDHlKeokGBFUA:9 a=bUPPq9qgGxJFyD8y:21 a=xM5dt7_LN5kMlSvV:21 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 Received: from [67.83.27.177] ([67.83.27.177:59557] helo=Steve-PC.optonline.net) by mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.9.48312 r(Core:3.6.9.0)) with ESMTPA id 7C/3F-03419-B0185CD5; Fri, 08 Nov 2019 09:51:55 -0500 Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2019 09:51:16 -0500 To: Jim Stone <1789alpine@gmail.com>,Shop Talk References: Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net It sounds like you have it under control. I = assume you are talking about a backflow = prevention valve? BPV =3D PVB =3D BVP? Apparently, = there are different types of these and there are = different places they can be installed, depending = on local codes and whether the original installer = did it right. I never worried about it and never = had a problem. The way my system is, I can't = really think of another way. Your experience = with the large vs small compressor is the same as = mine. It is not the pressure, it is the volume = of air that you need. I found that the larger = compressor was better, but the small one was good = enough. And yes, I never got mine 100% dry. It = was just drained enough that no water would = freeze and expand enough to break anything. I = think you did fine. I don't think a professional = service company would do more than that. -Steve At 08:24 AM 11/8/2019, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote: >The Amazon adaptor arrived yesterday, so I = >thought I=E2=80=99d update this with some new = >information. The adaptor was well made and the = >shut-off valve proved to be very handy; it was = >well worth the $20. It also came with excellent = >instructions that mostly agreed with what was = >said here, with one exception: it said =E2=80=9Cavoid = >blowing compressed air through the PVB because = >doing so may damage the BVP.=E2=80=9D I assume my = >system has a BVP in it, but can=E2=80=99t find it and = >just went ahead and blew it out from the basement as discussed. > >The instructions also recommend that the = >compressor should be "as large as possible, = >preferably 15 gallons or larger.=E2=80=9D I think = >that is good advice, as my little HF 8 gallon = >compressor was barely (I think) up to the = >task. I initially set it to 50 lbs, the = >recommended pressure, but it was only putting = >out about 40 lbs during use, so I turned that up = >to get it a little higher. Even so, the = >compressor would fully extend the spray heads = >for the first 15 seconds or so, then just bubble = >water out with the head retracted. The = >compressor ran constantly while the system was = >on, so I gave it a rest between blowing out each = >zone. I also blew out each zone at least three = >times, but there was sill some spray at the = >beginning each time. I am going to do it one = >more time today, but know it won=E2=80=99t be = >completely dry. I assume it won=E2=80=99t be an issue = >when the little bit of water remaining in the = >system freezes, but someone please let me know = >if I am wrong about this. My 60 gal compressor = >is about 150 yards away from the water inlet, = >but I could make that work if necessary. > >Just in time, as the cold weather arrived today, = >with the first below freezing temps expected tonight. > >Cheers, >Jim _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive utox.team.net From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Nov 8 08:02:38 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4887EA0614 for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2019 08:02:38 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta10.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (unknown [167.206.4.205]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E408CA05AA for ; Fri, 8 Nov 2019 08:02:34 -0700 (MST) bh=uFjeFzGInKCZlOrFiADozJQkWj+B70WEDLhHhaWng+k=; h=Message-ID:Date:To:From:Subject; b=qyf5HWbQrgGMWQDP5qtSYrSyi+xg4w+oBhMtwWIqDMj2/iPLd9E9jAF6dJ8dtRkEC dWzoWDA7xfbM/Y/BIMZzg/Z0bP/FoHNhRjPrZRYtlekgelVAGbAO3wagBH2/SYax/O 20dfVMMNMmag8R7pGlYw+urAXVbjKVxm63DzpZz7CucTYtQeCuQx38mj0I2XrCQnaH 4hT6h7Q+e96wMbQryVUqTayW5zNLwfmVjEMgsbhdOl/+7gkV1EAa72XJMMlLDuc2kR dW3CPKZjik+O1p2RJcnvI1PDGNpmRb0STYd4R7yuv+28pwPR+EGKh6fdy1BD1m4UC8 GeX69MXt/yyxw== Authentication-Results: mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net smtp.user=strovato; auth=pass (LOGIN) a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:117 a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:17 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=TZi6GMuBCArkyAJrkdMA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 Received: from [67.83.27.177] ([67.83.27.177:61619] helo=Steve-PC.optonline.net) by mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.9.48312 r(Core:3.6.9.0)) with ESMTPA id 2E/50-23065-A8385CD5; Fri, 08 Nov 2019 10:02:34 -0500 Date: Fri, 08 Nov 2019 10:02:05 -0500 To: Scott Hall , "shop-talk@autox.team.net" mail.com> References: Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net I am not sure if that is a good assumption. A = swimming pool is a closed system designed to = operate at whatever pressure the pump = produces. A sprinkler system is designed to = operate at the pressure of the water supply. A = sprinkler system may have hundreds of feet of = tubing. I used a shop vac to drain lines on a = hot tub. I can't imagine doing my whole sprinkler system that way. I am certainly no authority on this. I can just = tell you what I did. If I was going to do some = more research, though, I would try to find = something on how to winterize a sprinkler system, = rather than a swimming pool. -Steve At 09:47 AM 11/8/2019, Scott Hall via Shop-talk wrote: >Jim, > >I'm going to assume this is a similar thing to = >winterizing a swimming pool.=C2 =C2 > >For pools, there are frequent warnings abounot = >using a compressor to blow the lines, or to make = >sure to keep the PSI below 20.=C2 =C2 > >It is frequently mentioned that a shop vac or = >dedicated blower tool is preferred.=C2 The = >thought is that to remove the air high pressure = >is not the goal (and that high pressure and = >damage the PVC pipe and related fittings) but = >rather high volume.=C2 And that a shop vac is the better way to achieve t= hat.=C2 > >At least that's what the internet said.=C2 > >I used my compressor, set to 15 psi.=C2 I guess = >we'll know in the spring how I did--it just hit = >18 degrees here this morning.=C2 =C2 > >It sounds like your sprinkler system operates similarly.=C2 =C2 _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive utox.team.net From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Nov 9 14:58:46 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD732A086F for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2019 14:58:46 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-oi1-f172.google.com (unknown [209.85.167.172]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F130A0639 for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2019 14:58:37 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-oi1-f172.google.com with SMTP id e9so8376593oif.8 for ; Sat, 09 Nov 2019 13:58:37 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=4HcRH8GRx8fR3KfVC/Aaf1FSCKmc0rFJlwSF/lfXSnY=; b=erdlIg6puWEmheDBbL/lmA5SWO826IrooAIlTJ1iL1VCc8Bif/Tr2p9jWuQ+ci0sMc UHowJ90xo+bDm6tSEKsge5n21AHTT/03AxQTiK8gYjIvJw8s3s4q0NiRPKlzUtVzaGon vys6p+g+GClCX0nBVBtDMLhZijUkyRz1nA8+XXIHLkw5qegS+9lAW8MschYmbb4dUNXa 8LrnLc5tYx0jIa2RFdY9l35O5ZUhZ0sFOZYpMQsZ92t+Qd1HuRP73NsPQKmMjOGM8eHx Fsk+4P336UDz7WCMRecWWteRs4UJbA9DO9ES0I1dRCC4to1pLYRnb2v37Wo/RD08QnuW yG5w== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=4HcRH8GRx8fR3KfVC/Aaf1FSCKmc0rFJlwSF/lfXSnY=; b=HQRdYozEN1o/JYSB9tTThfjw0yfgrl+2zLm6mWPG2r9KtYPOtIrAhvbMkGMOF3i3uM l0CJQSSjl3CrWADIwgkglto2YaiPr7j58fk++ukraUc1sexhqr4o6AcT8orFD+/Ydryr udH38PiKRkL1yT99uY0YcOW8RYZzHZz8yKF7pIxSyWOn4fIFZeTU9jmtaAYZ+HUl5per L8Gn3YUG1/xzYQSDFcO8kq00WlB27lg06oYAhUIznsJeYrNYzACjefQXN4k8jpiowiOB e05qImWbhEVHLn+hb/1KM4YokQVH5OB2shPZ2P33oKJLmSPIMHjJ+zFMq87lvLb9tPQV u1vw== 823Peey+4TsBnkwo0ZmLiIl4o4YW2UyIkdCeMjgGvA== Sat, 09 Nov 2019 13:58:36 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2019 16:58:27 -0500 To: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" Subject: [Shop-talk] Hatchet From: Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2135683847905637488== --00000000000019ad6c0596f1000c Well, I've destroyed my ancient Plumb 14 inch hatchet. I probably shouldn't have abused it... Anyone bought a quality hatchet lately that they'd recommend? Jeff Scarbrough Corrosion Acres, Ga. --00000000000019ad6c0596f1000c Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Well, I've destroyed my ancient Plumb 14 inch hatchet.= =C2=A0 I probably shouldn't have abused it...

Anyone= bought a quality hatchet lately that they'd recommend?

<= /div>
Jeff Scarbrough
Corrosion Acres, Ga.
--00000000000019ad6c0596f1000c-- --===============2135683847905637488== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2135683847905637488==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Nov 9 16:06:21 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C67EA082A for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2019 16:06:21 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (unknown [209.86.89.68]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4898A036C for ; Sat, 9 Nov 2019 16:06:13 -0700 (MST) s=dk12062016; t=1573340773; bh=o7l1zHeCjHUrsoBoCgp1BaEVGz7/K7lVh97G eKg2U+0=; h=Received:Subject:To:References:From:Message-ID:Date: User-Agent:MIME-Version:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Language: X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; b=NdmZPjWaRcqVBpTMkPLpOCZQ9+SLpczsA GRzq4Tp9JAczePKMiW8YMu2e2i8CznG95ai1Qb6U5G8aREND6MQWnk2Sq1sgEathWdS hqLswL6M8/834Bae+6LS3rn2w91FIJVyImHV+40qnUdKz8/1qIsu/LSWRyBsshkcL+k gb94qJWpTXlfsr6jmtOf8iZw/rz9YW6B8RMQR9w9LnD82DoFjtOBkUnubiS2syn71ou ztAe+BVTOyQTIaIoEs2kYHDU0bokuVZpHYrE46Qrh1A55w8doj4UzW4J481jjbGbxyG ERk0H9GeAJqQJAbEk/QjTTDupS53jJDWV4Nid46Ag== DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk12062016; d=earthlink.net; b=fdHYWSt8rlR7F7RZkFtrs72FeQN89PPLOxG5ugl0kbdwug9YwbKQ6t5wgQeCcuCtn1jBkydIg/zCROOEvotzqmEBbqIzKZ8jLjcqfhJaVcgCqVGWeTwgAJ2HsZJXul9lRO1nQ0lG91Rga2i9hGzSoBYgwPacQyIua6ge/8wbgTydDfE7tUVr/1s8kVo5OGXXv2slN57NtcbUt1WCxyWZwzciJh+8p/FMOC507QHpcMJw0oLjPfnWq4r/sk4K/H7WdoV57HfxIYvGr47OH9USpYlR98Gpy5FdIaAXQj1TzJvXs3mUOrhbUD9dIgqu0DZjaedSjS4YbmvIQj+U65uwUw==; h=Received:Subject:To:References:From:Message-ID:Date:User-Agent:MIME-Version:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Language:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [184.181.124.168] (helo=[192.168.0.3]) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4) (envelope-from ) id 1iTZo4-0003J8-PD; Sat, 09 Nov 2019 18:06:13 -0500 To: Jeff Scarbrough , "shop-talk@autox.team.net" References: Date: Sat, 9 Nov 2019 15:05:48 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.9.1 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Hatchet From: Brian Kemp via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============7145750109808809754== boundary="------------8B7DAB4776A3AC39672427CB" Content-Language: en-US This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------8B7DAB4776A3AC39672427CB Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit A traditional hatchet is surprisingly hard to find at local retailers. The first two here are options you can likely pickup. https://www.harborfreight.com/search?q=hatchet I have the fiberglass handle version and it works fine.  Seems to hold an edge ok. Brian On 11/9/2019 1:58 PM, Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk wrote: > Well, I've destroyed my ancient Plumb 14 inch hatchet.  I probably > shouldn't have abused it... > > Anyone bought a quality hatchet lately that they'd recommend? > > Jeff Scarbrough > Corrosion Acres, Ga. > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bk13@earthlink.net > --------------8B7DAB4776A3AC39672427CB Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit A traditional hatchet is surprisingly hard to find at local retailers.

The first two here are options you can likely pickup.

https://www.harborfreight.com/search?q=hatchet

I have the fiberglass handle version and it works fine.  Seems to hold an edge ok.

Brian

On 11/9/2019 1:58 PM, Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk wrote:
Well, I've destroyed my ancient Plumb 14 inch hatchet.  I probably shouldn't have abused it...

Anyone bought a quality hatchet lately that they'd recommend?

Jeff Scarbrough
Corrosion Acres, Ga.

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive

--------------8B7DAB4776A3AC39672427CB-- --===============7145750109808809754== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============7145750109808809754==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Nov 10 08:26:43 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7335DA05CF for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 08:26:43 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-oi1-f179.google.com (unknown [209.85.167.179]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A42AA05B5 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 08:26:37 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-oi1-f179.google.com with SMTP id n16so9421929oig.2 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 07:26:37 -0800 (PST) h=content-transfer-encoding:from:mime-version:date:message-id:subject :in-reply-to:references:to; bh=BcTOLYnDX0pawyLr+f8xRjDiMbMbW+KwOdbNQM1kZi4=; b=m64GSZHOj8x6gf3M9C4X4/yRjb7+9SIvobWue3iuAob075iPN0goBkUJa9OG2AZitO DlXgHC0DEZ/QdAefclZjGPalDVX3cG4a5NTd7V7V8crHJjB3WMGOtPwWdwgxYAZ73Vq8 hNt5m+FpvtIgKmrIXMU5rGlIBBXf4+ADYirLUbCOyim+0m5OsWBuJJNNhtdUIx95Pykg 1P4Vpt9SZ/e/hssShHP7gm3NttEx2D795nsXnuDChKgWQEEa5Qt4LlSWebEfvhCP+opR xuivXQWGScty38ML1lBmHJLsgicX2ufxFa1CV6yRfoH81qPuyAIri2flZHenqakL9ZV+ aROw== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:content-transfer-encoding:from:mime-version:date :message-id:subject:in-reply-to:references:to; bh=BcTOLYnDX0pawyLr+f8xRjDiMbMbW+KwOdbNQM1kZi4=; b=nl//QMfBRsx0bQ4f3Z48FBSliyTj0DwS+962IdlMaUVkF9FEoBMm34mBwruA11euop r0KMHJsJ6Nr0n2omtDHcXTNNVJFo7AcDjEoS3W2Q0Zzd5hqFporYligRHiifZ+ZKwog6 haC0/P6FsMazWcLmeRIv5hXX5BY/zRwRRU2a7klZxEd+rGxxOWf5gg844303JuPcYjot CpCpbv5uL1Q3kdHE053WeTKVkCKTUsCkEG9QJxmYasp+pb9mgIndLeU4Dh9Jw11GyvlK BiPS+IYOfuMGswAoLo4KyQNk/lcXk6uLXHie5zT2tw1ePKiA51/DSWMXTXT5OvamQK/Y oP9w== i0QWvknkByH3pDxNXVh7adYx81A= j128mr18926043oia.153.1573399596865; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 07:26:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from ?IPv6:2600:1700:3040:d690:d83d:b22e:7816:4b78? ([2600:1700:3040:d690:d83d:b22e:7816:4b78]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id w10sm3077263oif.9.2019.11.10.07.26.36 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 10 Nov 2019 07:26:36 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 09:26:35 -0600 References: To: Jeff Scarbrough , "shop-talk@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Hatchet From: David Scheidt via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > On Nov 9, 2019, at 15:58, Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk wrote: > > Well, I've destroyed my ancient Plumb 14 inch hatchet. I probably shouldn't have abused it... > > Anyone bought a quality hatchet lately that they'd recommend? I have been using a Vaughn rigging axe as a camp hatchet. I did some thinning of the edge with a file and then put arazor edge on it. Holds an edge well, does all the things I want a small axe to do. If you use the poll to hit with, it might not work for you. But I rather have the hammer head > _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Nov 10 08:37:05 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0D51A06B0 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 08:37:05 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qk1-f179.google.com (unknown [209.85.222.179]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADA1BA0360 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 08:37:00 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-qk1-f179.google.com with SMTP id i19so9212909qki.2 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 07:37:00 -0800 (PST) h=from:content-transfer-encoding:mime-version:subject:date:references :to:in-reply-to:message-id; bh=60x+mfRiiPdk1UmhbuymKgnuhKVD/2fLTB5qy0A0HAk=; b=vdXrW6SB5Me2eTRr3SVPvZbysioTT4oyXbdd7L6Up4TJNDhkiN/vH44YUXANg5r11F fgsssRhgPgKIwIbQXGi64xBUQzaPkskU3cnjVh9mKxN5KIxywv3FhSJx+oRPBDuiZS6H Qm91O1HlR8fV7GgStFQRvNU9s3zEr48lt1TcBmhAxx1EfvQGKINlg5LTg5HrLQIf28mB VF0jjU66S3CuBEf0SRvXH0s/ekYb5DCCX1UNeWf8Iqg4iLciVMlsYz+21XF5DPyq/eoI opkj9IyA1ii+fj+3fTxGtel3j2i+AAujaa5Ye0z7spr2We877wceQThNOj2duWie3nKz 59kg== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:content-transfer-encoding:mime-version :subject:date:references:to:in-reply-to:message-id; bh=60x+mfRiiPdk1UmhbuymKgnuhKVD/2fLTB5qy0A0HAk=; b=jnh2X16ssG9e4k8eG40G96fPrsAVu4mAww+dSaW3egjSWmllJklekavfq2XM9qtRua e34TRhK6WIZb/BdYCIWz2CdC4Whim3g7Z9FXrOLwlOV+8ZaqId8TAKzK0J+jU4txoRox L1VRa3lxrJCRTtlZ7NUBEkmWBwW/W9+0h3gmGfQJRGa8P2J+j8xZhGrOuO/cbqd+KB4S 0uWOTtIRkjAakMoIRW4IS0fPisddSgya4twMJUflBu63UitdF6U9trvJ1hxXfxLjAAqZ Xx2jtI/ujOXqQId96XgjZ9+dHaiionWM9XXnL6LlK9amCATkJn5E3Adi/EqqA49cIwxo LoMQ== a1RPHzGVSwNWMG1N/dFdypaXH3Qq Sun, 10 Nov 2019 07:36:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from macbook-pro-2.home (ool-43526917.dyn.optonline.net. [67.82.105.23]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id r80sm5777277qke.121.2019.11.10.07.36.59 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 10 Nov 2019 07:36:59 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 10:36:56 -0500 References: <641FAE12-8FAF-4347-A9FB-D3C585F8DD6E@gmail.com> To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Hatchet From: Jim Stone via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net SGF2ZSB5b3UgdGhvdWdodCBhYm91dCBlQmF5PyAgVGhlcmUgYXJlIGh1bmRyZWRzIG9mIOKAnHZp bnRhZ2XigJ0gUGx1bWIgaGF0Y2hldHMgbGlzdGVkLiAgTG9va2luZyBhdCBzb2xkIGxpc3Rpbmdz IHR1cm5zIHVwIHNvbWUgdGhhdCBsb29rIGJhcmVseSB1c2VkIGZvciBhcm91bmQgJDMwLgoKPj4g T24gTm92IDksIDIwMTksIGF0IDE1OjU4LCBKZWZmIFNjYXJicm91Z2ggdmlhIFNob3AtdGFsayA8 c2hvcC10YWxrQGF1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0PiB3cm90ZToKPj4gCj4+IFdlbGwsIEkndmUgZGVzdHJv eWVkIG15IGFuY2llbnQgUGx1bWIgMTQgaW5jaCBoYXRjaGV0LiAgSSBwcm9iYWJseSBzaG91bGRu J3QgaGF2ZSBhYnVzZWQgaXQuLi4KPj4gCj4+IEFueW9uZSBib3VnaHQgYSBxdWFsaXR5IGhhdGNo ZXQgbGF0ZWx5IHRoYXQgdGhleSdkIHJlY29tbWVuZD8KPiAKPiBJX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18KPiAKPiBTaG9wLXRhbGtAYXV0b3gudGVhbS5u ZXQKPiBEb25hdGU6IGh0dHA6Ly93d3cudGVhbS5uZXQvZG9uYXRlLmh0bWwKPiBTdWdnZXN0ZWQg YW5udWFsIGRvbmF0aW9uICAkMTIuOTYKPiBBcmNoaXZlOiBodHRwOi8vd3d3LnRlYW0ubmV0L3Bp cGVybWFpbC9zaG9wLXRhbGsgaHR0cDovL2F1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0L2FyY2hpdmUKPiAKPiBVbnN1 YnNjcmliZS9NYW5hZ2U6IGh0dHA6Ly9hdXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldC9tYWlsbWFuL29wdGlvbnMvc2hv cC10YWxrLzE3ODlhbHBpbmVAZ21haWwuY29tCj4gCgpfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXwoKU2hvcC10YWxrQGF1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0CkRvbmF0ZTog aHR0cDovL3d3dy50ZWFtLm5ldC9kb25hdGUuaHRtbApTdWdnZXN0ZWQgYW5udWFsIGRvbmF0aW9u ICAkMTIuOTYKQXJjaGl2ZTogaHR0cDovL3d3dy50ZWFtLm5ldC9waXBlcm1haWwvc2hvcC10YWxr IGh0dHA6Ly9hdXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldC9hcmNoaXZlCgpVbnN1YnNjcmliZS9NYW5hZ2U6IGh0dHA6 Ly9hdXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldC9tYWlsbWFuL29wdGlvbnMvc2hvcC10YWxrL21oYXJjQGF1dG94LnRl YW0ubmV0Cgo= From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Nov 10 10:13:27 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6236BA0581 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 10:13:27 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-il1-f173.google.com (unknown [209.85.166.173]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E2CBA0459 for ; Mon, 4 Nov 2019 15:57:05 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-il1-f173.google.com with SMTP id f201so10761535ilh.6 for ; Mon, 04 Nov 2019 14:57:05 -0800 (PST) d=mcfetridge.org; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=g0kYPPyYI7qb1+oaNGNtmbA87RN7Vc/t2NqG++AWCcY=; b=JUwnV8zgN0g/cdGDBMH4FzPLUBZ9LKOrfGi/eLtF5CzAVAalYYi4F3iBuUoxuM/+6R l0dsLsuNSvJgDxXkqxmLhVdjaFMhnzd2Ybg2bAMSzTpEaGYTaQjqLAB0mjj08GTj891U q8hREjd2BWD9cfTEybgyMpxdb6V1ZMzK59D+8= d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=g0kYPPyYI7qb1+oaNGNtmbA87RN7Vc/t2NqG++AWCcY=; b=Kb6AsBFsSVt+kyyTvSbk7twh7gU2M26QmC/DYk9hLeRIlHMlbkZGRaYwo0YD99sudz 32D22ra8E+eJFGRycM8gdiEdczUpC3hBRuIkj9n7l7SKlsPWm2EnfFXUv2+zLFX68zqX olwSpEan8d0OKZUkC9ZDBNe50rLJKlwlNlnajnw0P0r6bGdnuX4f/I43oT82PfKDhzQF nfWQcKMdaD1l1QfDomnDjdSx9rqiCybtF1FTOxUzepmUTOP6pI/Lt7Tn8ntlWRxCVb3o MxWbbEft3MixK/92ifKQ1uTs5DfelKgfj5ZHkC8dSt2FaPyu+t3e1xYWnNDjJEU+VuLC nWsg== JqzwRS/weyXXzhbwp8OUUbxdSyqEih4+7ePD91q9TA== Mon, 04 Nov 2019 14:57:04 -0800 (PST) References: <003901d58abc$09225f70$1b671e50$@GMail.com> <3A.EA.13198.FD6A0CD5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Date: Mon, 4 Nov 2019 17:56:53 -0500 To: Benjamin Zwissler Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] tire balancing From: Ian McFetridge via Shop-talk Cc: Shop-Talk List Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6874360858211248405== --00000000000003875805968d3caf Got me at a loss, unless it is done on the car and they are also balancing the rotating assembly, do front/rear could matter. It would be telling to report what he actually does. On Mon, Nov 4, 2019 at 5:53 PM Benjamin Zwissler via Shop-talk < shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote: > Well, I vote he has no clue what he's talking about. What I learned was > that static and spin balancing were not the same thing. Static was done > with a bubble balance without spinning. Spinning meant spinning. There > was spinning on the car and spinning off the car, but I don't think anyone > does it on the car anymore. > > I don't know why they would balance front and back differently, seems like > balanced is balanced regardless of front or rear. > > On Mon, Nov 4, 2019, 5:32 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk < > shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote: > >> Two years ago, I purchased a set of Michelin tires for my Ford >> Expedition at BJs. It was not a great experience, and I don't think >> I'd do it again. The tires do come with a road hazard warranty, >> though, and free flat repair. I got a puncture in the right rear >> yesterday, so I ventured down to BJs once again. The guy there asked >> me if it was a front or rear tire. He said they balance them >> differently. He said it was "statically balanced" but on a machine >> that spins it and uses lasers. I don't know what he is talking >> about. I told him it is a rear tire, but that shouldn't matter, >> because it will be a front tire when I rotate them. He told me I >> shouldn't do that. I have to bring the vehicle to them to rotate and >> re-balance. None of this makes any sense to me. Have things changed >> drastically or is this guy nuts? I should note that all this stuff >> is free when you buy the tires there, so I don't really see any >> financial motive for them to want to do this. >> >> -Steve >> >> >> -- >> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >> https://www.avast.com/antivirus >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Shop-talk@autox.team.net >> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html >> Suggested annual donation $12.96 >> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk >> http://autox.team.net/archive >> >> Unsubscribe/Manage: >> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bjzwissler@gmail.com >> >> _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shop-talk2@mcfetridge.org > > --00000000000003875805968d3caf Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Got me at a loss, unless it is done on the car and t= hey are also balancing the rotating assembly, do front/rear could matter.= =C2=A0 It would be telling to report what he actually does.

On Mo= n, Nov 4, 2019 at 5:53 PM Benjamin Zwissler via Shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:
<= /div>
Well, I vote he has no clue what he= 's talking about.=C2=A0 What I learned was that static and spin balanci= ng were not the same thing.=C2=A0 Static was done with a bubble balance wit= hout spinning.=C2=A0 Spinning meant spinning.=C2=A0 There was spinning on t= he car and spinning off the car, but I don't think anyone does it on th= e car anymore.

I don't kno= w why they would balance front and back differently, seems like balanced is= balanced regardless of front or rear.

On Mon, Nov 4, 2019, 5:32 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk <shop-= talk@autox.team.net> wrote:
Two years ago, I purchased a set of Michelin tires for my Ford
Expedition at BJs.=C2=A0 It was not a great experience, and I don't thi= nk
I'd do it again.=C2=A0 The tires do come with a road hazard warranty, <= br> though, and free flat repair.=C2=A0 I got a puncture in the right rear
yesterday, so I ventured down to BJs once again.=C2=A0 The guy there asked =
me if it was a front or rear tire.=C2=A0 He said they balance them
differently.=C2=A0 He said it was "statically balanced" but on a = machine
that spins it and uses lasers.=C2=A0 I don't know what he is talking about.=C2=A0 I told him it is a rear tire, but that shouldn't matter, <= br> because it will be a front tire when I rotate them.=C2=A0 He told me I
shouldn't do that.=C2=A0 I have to bring the vehicle to them to rotate = and
re-balance.=C2=A0 None of this makes any sense to me.=C2=A0 Have things cha= nged
drastically or is this guy nuts?=C2=A0 I should note that all this stuff is free when you buy the tires there, so I don't really see any
financial motive for them to want to do this.

-Steve


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--00000000000003875805968d3caf-- --===============6874360858211248405== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6874360858211248405==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Nov 10 10:13:41 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92D82A0662 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 10:13:41 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-il1-f196.google.com (unknown [209.85.166.196]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DF389A05A4 for ; Tue, 5 Nov 2019 12:34:28 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-il1-f196.google.com with SMTP id r9so2650800ilq.10 for ; Tue, 05 Nov 2019 11:34:28 -0800 (PST) d=mcfetridge.org; s=google; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=/6TEvqPQ5xab8VE5QaHRHmonDHb4Ac42ScAUsj2rie4=; b=ls9VN8nkUnGgEKDYAsaOT8QqIbmrNfG35JW0QeprjKMwXodSMYX3xhNBftQhlZsURI 91xKOKNzINg3zBDcO6wN5TyUeNEwqirDnJyAfMvhFLRoB1GVkgvlDRSNCL38KiYDELb1 oQc1zbz/V46uIndCBsUDBBAu6MIfUCv66ovEQ= d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=/6TEvqPQ5xab8VE5QaHRHmonDHb4Ac42ScAUsj2rie4=; b=AwY9n1EJ3dh8/svxEMgxEGdLe9Ut+XUFpSeeciRuoBc2HJq4mO21KA6N6Urw7mqMhw cRhDr9OWj/maK9METZtrZW11OgO9vbM6kPdqavMSWGscpOeJqsOs7qSYSz7tehGROhtY 2wN66zhyz8d+KVXZt6r9pd9e3XTjCZJI79ihQbXzzzZ/t30WaVHxqkOGkh2z+/HJS0ul iVZemv9vkNJBQHyYgxbM3ppAw551r9VNR/thOwB1+2EGfGklOtj4Zc0mq5V9Gxy3j3W/ NxHdg7jZRkaHU0pFFWXbvgSF8AHyhUkt8DwMNhIvJhL2NwHmJT5pKCXRula1ZiciR08P VfsQ== jvIeFyY3uKMHi1N3hUgG1cOZskmmJ/QnpnA6LA95nw== Tue, 05 Nov 2019 11:34:28 -0800 (PST) References: <4B.18.03419.F1CB1CD5@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <5D224FD74C71461296FDE6CE228E9A5D@Johnsdesktop> Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2019 14:34:17 -0500 To: john niolon Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: Ian McFetridge via Shop-talk Cc: shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============1631480811695499565== --0000000000004141c505969e85c6 If you have any slope in your yard, blow out from top to bottom zone. I also remove my backflow over winter. On Tue, Nov 5, 2019 at 2:20 PM john niolon via Shop-talk < shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote: > You are correct Steve.... the port on the BFP valve is down stream of the > check valve on the sprinkler side of the valve so the BFP offers no > resistance or blockage for the air at this point... really convenient for > doing what we???re discussing. > > j > > -----Original Message----- > From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk > Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2019 12:14 PM > To: Shop Talk > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System > > I shouldn't really be speaking for John, but I > think he is just saying that his backflow > preventer has a convenient port that he uses to > connect. I don't think he is saying that the > backflow preventer presents any other problem for > the operation. I am sure John will let us know if I am correct. > > -Steve T. > > At 12:48 PM 11/5/2019, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote: > >Thanks, guys. I just bought the adapter; it will be here on Thursday, > well > >ahead of any freezing temperatures. > > > >John????????s comment about a backflow preventer valve does have me > rethinking > >one aspect of my plan. The system installer put in an outside hose barb > >that he intended for blowing out the system, but I had thought it made > >sense to move ahead of that and start where the system originates in the > >basement. I can isolate the sprinkler from the rest of the system and > blow > >it out from there. Unless there is a good reason not to do it that. If > >there is a backflow preventer valve between the hose barb and the > basement, > >might there be a problem blowing it out from there? > > > >Jim > > > -- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jniolon@att.net > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk > http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shop-talk2@mcfetridge.org > > --0000000000004141c505969e85c6 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

If you have any slope in your yard, b= low out from top to bottom zone.=C2=A0 I also remove my backflow over winte= r.

On Tue, Nov 5, 2019 at 2:20 PM john niolon via Shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:
=
You are correct Steve.... the port on the BFP valve = is down stream of the
check valve on the sprinkler side of the valve so the BFP offers no
resistance or blockage for the air at this point... really convenient for <= br> doing what we???re discussing.

j

-----Original Message-----
From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk
Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2019 12:14 PM
To: Shop Talk
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System

I shouldn't really be speaking for John, but I
think he is just saying that his backflow
preventer has a convenient port that he uses to
connect.=C2=A0 I don't think he is saying that the
backflow preventer presents any other problem for
the operation.=C2=A0 I am sure John will let us know if I am correct.

-Steve T.

At 12:48 PM 11/5/2019, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote:
>Thanks, guys.=C2=A0 I just bought the adapter; it will be here on Thurs= day, well
>ahead of any freezing temperatures.
>
>John????????s comment about a backflow preventer valve does have me ret= hinking
>one aspect of my plan.=C2=A0 The system installer put in an outside hos= e barb
>that he intended for blowing out the system, but I had thought it made =
>sense to move ahead of that and start where the system originates in th= e
>basement.=C2=A0 I can isolate the sprinkler from the rest of the system= and blow
>it out from there.=C2=A0 Unless there is a good reason not to do it tha= t.=C2=A0 If
>there is a backflow preventer valve between the hose barb and the basem= ent,
>might there be a problem blowing it out from there?
>
>Jim


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--0000000000004141c505969e85c6-- --===============1631480811695499565== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============1631480811695499565==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Nov 10 10:55:26 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 175BBA055A for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 10:55:26 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qt1-f178.google.com (unknown [209.85.160.178]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 37302A0327 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 10:55:19 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-qt1-f178.google.com with SMTP id t8so13151666qtc.6 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 09:55:19 -0800 (PST) h=from:mime-version:subject:date:references:to:in-reply-to:message-id; bh=uK5bLbOc6vvE6xyXUhSChCW728r0wK7OdCCHlgG9uCY=; b=jMKmHdMviWDDqKOChos/1cMySoGOi8Cq8+e89dmOy5OSn4SRfdbnCEZ0VvNpzfr9A6 z9zLcLfaxEh65GwQPhL9cLBXxejowe1qs1cBonxWrvy/OXOHRgHzE0v5ArtfMEJ8hI6p 7Kd6K93ogJFaRvvXMWLoR9VToaS80/5vWHCC8+XkHxJYhMo7NvJZCZnVQmCRmuBAuJcC RtDYHb6TsP/BqGfKtPoy74gd4CZUtdeCpZAS9HJWjLu6yh8rAkN4veheqjoj5YTcMn3t evesW1D9VS0AxH3bqEVU2Zlc3Y59iD0X0hvwHdxK3WHOzdJD7E3uEDo2sfuR7Ceb5VSJ 02QA== d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:from:mime-version:subject:date:references:to :in-reply-to:message-id; bh=uK5bLbOc6vvE6xyXUhSChCW728r0wK7OdCCHlgG9uCY=; b=mD6BTBAt/4whcjonR/+Yge6Vwv52WIieglZmoAW7uXaf8FnDAyXv36+N3Y0ufEXkw5 2wQ8EeeNXAftbPYSJI9RLDPLbPfB3HQKROhZHhdcz8mDGmKKVp7KERYNLigqEH48/mu5 17aAIgRHgCLJKI3rrb/MZ/FHdv4hVW4xXBA78ZRISYbzuQ0IGPZ6z4lt9J7us5De3gmk JnPNiNqo0/MEZ+meW3ONbFrhKRnoe9gtYjxYdsL9dmwl2VsSPGffUezpm4+iuE73KmRK 7uO9Fxcz61czwNVyRwcggN7ur8Yw7lgEvbKlTOZ/BAZTD0mhms5U2tjKYYw0gNzxtPWe Fn3g== DEHr/MwO9o2dXIFcHAH/IJBuYndl Sun, 10 Nov 2019 09:55:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from macbook-pro-2.home (ool-43526917.dyn.optonline.net. [67.82.105.23]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id n185sm6033663qkd.32.2019.11.10.09.55.17 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 10 Nov 2019 09:55:18 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 12:55:16 -0500 References: <4B.18.03419.F1CB1CD5@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <5D224FD74C71461296FDE6CE228E9A5D@Johnsdesktop> To: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System From: Jim Stone via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4232375839971193519== boundary="Apple-Mail=_7FC483DC-0AD2-442B-A44B-E05857F9A550" --Apple-Mail=_7FC483DC-0AD2-442B-A44B-E05857F9A550 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Good point! There is about 30=E2=80=99 of back to front slope in my = lot. Fortunately, and really just by accident, the zones pretty much run = back to front and I blew them out in order the first few times, then in = reverse order to be safe. I think I=E2=80=99ll be ok this year, but = definitely something to keep in mind for the future! > On Nov 5, 2019, at 2:34 PM, Ian McFetridge via Shop-talk = wrote: >=20 >=20 > If you have any slope in your yard, blow out from top to bottom zone. = I also remove my backflow over winter. >=20 > On Tue, Nov 5, 2019 at 2:20 PM john niolon via Shop-talk = > You are correct Steve.... the port on the BFP valve is down stream of = the=20 > check valve on the sprinkler side of the valve so the BFP offers no=20 > resistance or blockage for the air at this point... really convenient = for=20 > doing what we???re discussing. >=20 > j >=20 > -----Original Message-----=20 > From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk > Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2019 12:14 PM > To: Shop Talk > Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System >=20 > I shouldn't really be speaking for John, but I > think he is just saying that his backflow > preventer has a convenient port that he uses to > connect. I don't think he is saying that the > backflow preventer presents any other problem for > the operation. I am sure John will let us know if I am correct. >=20 > -Steve T. >=20 > At 12:48 PM 11/5/2019, Jim Stone via Shop-talk wrote: > >Thanks, guys. I just bought the adapter; it will be here on = Thursday, well=20 > >ahead of any freezing temperatures. > > > >John????????s comment about a backflow preventer valve does have me = rethinking=20 > >one aspect of my plan. The system installer put in an outside hose = barb=20 > >that he intended for blowing out the system, but I had thought it = made=20 > >sense to move ahead of that and start where the system originates in = the=20 > >basement. I can isolate the sprinkler from the rest of the system = and blow=20 > >it out from there. Unless there is a good reason not to do it that. = If=20 > >there is a backflow preventer valve between the hose barb and the = basement,=20 > >might there be a problem blowing it out from there? > > > >Jim >=20 >=20 > --=20 > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus >=20 > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html = > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = =20 > http://autox.team.net/archive >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage:=20 > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jniolon@att.net = =20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html = > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive = >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/shop-talk2@mcfetridge.org = >=20 > _______________________________________________ >=20 > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html = > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk = http://autox.team.net/archive = >=20 > Unsubscribe/Manage: = http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/1789alpine@gmail.com = --Apple-Mail=_7FC483DC-0AD2-442B-A44B-E05857F9A550 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=utf-8 Good = point!  There is about 30=E2=80=99 of back to front slope in my = lot. Fortunately, and really just by accident, the zones pretty much run = back to front and I blew them out in order the first few times, then in = reverse order to be safe. I think I=E2=80=99ll be ok this year, but = definitely something to keep in mind for the future!

On Nov 5, 2019, at 2:34 PM, Ian McFetridge via Shop-talk = <shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:


If you = have any slope in your yard, blow out from top to bottom zone.  I = also remove my backflow over winter.

On Tue, Nov = 5, 2019 at 2:20 PM john niolon via Shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:
You are = correct Steve.... the port on the BFP valve is down stream of the 
check valve = on the sprinkler side of the valve so the BFP offers no 
resistance = or blockage for the air at this point... really convenient for 
doing what = we???re discussing.

j

-----Original Message----- 
From: Steven = Trovato via Shop-talk
Sent: Tuesday, November 05, 2019 = 12:14 PM
To: Shop Talk
Subject: Re: = [Shop-talk] Winterizing Sprinkler System

I = shouldn't really be speaking for John, but I
think he is = just saying that his backflow
preventer has a convenient = port that he uses to
connect.  I don't think he is = saying that the
backflow preventer presents any other = problem for
the operation.  I am sure John will let = us know if I am correct.

-Steve T.

At 12:48 PM 11/5/2019, Jim Stone via Shop-talk = wrote:
>Thanks, guys.  I just bought the adapter; = it will be here on Thursday, well 
>ahead of = any freezing temperatures.
>
>John????????s comment about a backflow preventer valve = does have me rethinking 
>one = aspect of my plan.  The system installer put in an outside hose = barb 
>that he intended for blowing out the system, but I had = thought it made 
>sense to move ahead of that and start where the system = originates in the 
>basement.  I can isolate the sprinkler from the rest = of the system and blow 
>it out = from there.  Unless there is a good reason not to do it that.  = If 
>there is a backflow preventer valve between the hose barb = and the basement, 
>might there be a problem blowing it out from there?
>
>Jim


-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus = software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

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= --Apple-Mail=_7FC483DC-0AD2-442B-A44B-E05857F9A550-- --===============4232375839971193519== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============4232375839971193519==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Nov 10 11:59:07 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8F39A0490 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 11:59:07 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from NAM05-DM3-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (unknown [40.92.14.106]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B4C0A0382 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 11:59:00 -0700 (MST) ARC-Seal: i=1; a=rsa-sha256; s=arcselector9901; d=microsoft.com; cv=none; b=mjvfHMdhFQ+Wmza3O0zxwVNUh58rpx1eOI/vi0FGqCjQZnYG6g2gsN7KW6kXWOzCsF8vnxmDfG28IPRMbrJf5XZyKfxG6Zd+4LGU5qhUmboIaTUn6KsfUeFoFfHGBjjNhIMzyM6pWicubyOY8kgghbwHwDZ1EhOSsBMNq6J6l9zD22whCuue8xC2lmKK0Aym0EwKCVeXIjsEKhjlkiBgPxWO3pomD3sRdwmyu7w6LguweY9UQOkR+AIuXqsYg/rS69uxWZ4PGZful5DohB0gsJ0invaLb43EhRBVgZ82ssce4hwkfw/3NJgZlu7pxpM1VSPkq8h0515vR/J2Xl/7mg== ARC-Message-Signature: i=1; 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Sun, 10 Nov 2019 18:58:58 +0000 Received: from BY5PR11MB4152.namprd11.prod.outlook.com (10.152.96.54) by CO1NAM05FT024.mail.protection.outlook.com (10.152.96.132) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384) id 15.20.2451.15 via Frontend Transport; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 18:58:58 +0000 Received: from BY5PR11MB4152.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::c92d:8bd9:2fb0:ed56]) by BY5PR11MB4152.namprd11.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::c92d:8bd9:2fb0:ed56%4]) with mapi id 15.20.2430.023; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 18:58:58 +0000 To: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" , Steven Trovato Thread-Topic: [Shop-talk] tire balancing Thread-Index: AQHVk1+yrstYdCJSQk2AbUSCzbccI6eEys5t Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 18:58:58 +0000 References: <003901d58abc$09225f70$1b671e50$@GMail.com> , <3A.EA.13198.FD6A0CD5@mta4.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US x-incomingtopheadermarker: OriginalChecksum:277089F5F0B7E495A48360DFBE87239B4867D93A92D783470C6C64414CCE3F2B; UpperCasedChecksum:ADD14507EAFE72A9B6156482899869F6649E3A24998F6198723842315C3A6776; SizeAsReceived:7001; Count:45 x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [TI96YkxeG3XkAMY8bZFzQk5q/pGZJ0xi] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-incomingheadercount: 45 x-eopattributedmessage: 0 x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 25d36d50-1fa2-482a-57cc-08d766100b0f x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: CO1NAM05HT177: x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: LwJSzR1PhOgbgbPFll4YUtK4sxXF28eFwdMYr4vhkW2C4nU34ttNBWLa58T06P/CsLKn4xAY9yIlBINuvWi9XF1v/BX6HD+BLOs7Y1CcX3kLGdZ0B2IMvtll2HKKYr8DQtlTQmJkm/s2BKyGDMlA6khztc6gHupMGVhrgBWX6hiFa/VvmBa1fbKPMqmJ3pYS x-ms-exchange-transport-forked: True Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] tire balancing From: "Tim . via Shop-talk" Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============1881419608652816387== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_BY5PR11MB4152D6EE381B1597B40A54B7B4750BY5PR11MB4152namp_" --_000_BY5PR11MB4152D6EE381B1597B40A54B7B4750BY5PR11MB4152namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Were it me, find the contact form on the company's web site, explain what y= ou were told and ask for clarification about their methods, explanations, e= tc. just my .002 tim ________________________________ From: Shop-talk on behalf of Steven Trov= ato via Shop-talk Sent: Monday, November 4, 2019 4:31 PM To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Subject: [Shop-talk] tire balancing Two years ago, I purchased a set of Michelin tires for my Ford Expedition at BJs. It was not a great experience, and I don't think I'd do it again. The tires do come with a road hazard warranty, though, and free flat repair. I got a puncture in the right rear yesterday, so I ventured down to BJs once again. The guy there asked me if it was a front or rear tire. He said they balance them differently. He said it was "statically balanced" but on a machine that spins it and uses lasers. I don't know what he is talking about. I told him it is a rear tire, but that shouldn't matter, because it will be a front tire when I rotate them. He told me I shouldn't do that. I have to bring the vehicle to them to rotate and re-balance. None of this makes any sense to me. Have things changed drastically or is this guy nuts? I should note that all this stuff is free when you buy the tires there, so I don't really see any financial motive for them to want to do this. -Steve -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/arch= ive tsun_stuff@outlook.com --_000_BY5PR11MB4152D6EE381B1597B40A54B7B4750BY5PR11MB4152namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Were it me, find the contact form on the company's web site, explain what y= ou were told and ask for clarification about their methods, explanations, e= tc. 

just my .002
tim
From: Shop-talk <shop-ta= lk-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Steven Trovato via Shop-talk <= ;shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Sent: Monday, November 4, 2019 4:31 PM
To: shop-talk@autox.team.net <shop-talk@autox.team.net>
Subject: [Shop-talk] tire balancing
 
Two years ago, I purchased a set of Michelin tires= for my Ford
Expedition at BJs.  It was not a great experience, and I don't think <= br> I'd do it again.  The tires do come with a road hazard warranty,
though, and free flat repair.  I got a puncture in the right rear
yesterday, so I ventured down to BJs once again.  The guy there asked =
me if it was a front or rear tire.  He said they balance them
differently.  He said it was "statically balanced" but on a = machine
that spins it and uses lasers.  I don't know what he is talking
about.  I told him it is a rear tire, but that shouldn't matter,
because it will be a front tire when I rotate them.  He told me I
shouldn't do that.  I have to bring the vehicle to them to rotate and =
re-balance.  None of this makes any sense to me.  Have things cha= nged
drastically or is this guy nuts?  I should note that all this stuff is free when you buy the tires there, so I don't really see any
financial motive for them to want to do this.

-Steve


--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus=

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alk/tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.com"> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/tims_datsun_stuff@outlook.c= om

--_000_BY5PR11MB4152D6EE381B1597B40A54B7B4750BY5PR11MB4152namp_-- --===============1881419608652816387== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============1881419608652816387==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Nov 10 13:00:42 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01F38A056F for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 13:00:42 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from relay2-d.mail.gandi.net (unknown [217.70.183.194]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBCF9A029C for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 13:00:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.1.135] (c-73-253-103-15.hsd1.ma.comcast.net [73.253.103.15]) (Authenticated sender: jamesf@groupwbench.org) by relay2-d.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9E99D4000A for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 20:00:33 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 15:00:31 -0500 To: Shop-talk Subject: [Shop-talk] Plug for 14/2 solid wire? From: Jim Franklin via Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6815405291184708726== boundary="Apple-Mail=_38F4B421-345D-43C4-A143-6FEF921CCA77"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_38F4B421-345D-43C4-A143-6FEF921CCA77 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=us-ascii I'm addinng external carriage lights and have a 50' roll of 14/2 Romex = I'd like to use up, not to mention 50' of 14/2 stranded is almost $1/ft.=20= I'd like to have the lights on a timer. I have outlets in the garage, = and I happen to have a mechanical timer that you'd use for a livingroom = lamp, etc.=20 Can I use a regular add-on plug that you'd normally use with stranded = wire and just attach the Romex to it? Are there plugs made for solid = wire?=20 I could always use the Romex to extend the circuit to near the carriage = lights and install an outlet for the timer and buy short lamp cord, but = that means a trip to the store. That might turn out to be the most = time/cost/safety efficient method, but if I don't have to get into the = car AGAIN... thanks, jim= --Apple-Mail=_38F4B421-345D-43C4-A143-6FEF921CCA77 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=smime.p7s name=smime.p7s Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIDSDCCA0Qw ggIsoAMCAQICCmRy66DpH1wZiAswDQYJKoZIhvcNAQELBQAwUDEaMBgGA1UEAxMRSmFtZXMgRy4g RnJhbmtsaW4xJTAjBgkqhkiG9w0BCQEWFmphbWVzZkBncm91cHdiZW5jaC5vcmcxCzAJBgNVBAYT AlVTMB4XDTE3MDQxNTE0NDgxMloXDTIyMDQxNTE0NDgxMlowUDEaMBgGA1UEAxMRSmFtZXMgRy4g RnJhbmtsaW4xJTAjBgkqhkiG9w0BCQEWFmphbWVzZkBncm91cHdiZW5jaC5vcmcxCzAJBgNVBAYT AlVTMIIBIjANBgkqhkiG9w0BAQEFAAOCAQ8AMIIBCgKCAQEAmEusUttRQMymOSw8elNOep/BrnU9 MEmZNOH2Pz7+YgLwLBWCq7Yx2JCyeC4XvqMzdB2aPe4KyhWrcSsMirm0Kp/HfBfxf6xaYClOEhDE okCRDuGyNJaso8ZNzkxH84wGm3i0TemqNEaHhKIAJxcHU+RXSIgTBJW4VLQudHkqZ8xXSJPMKVU2 T13H0wosQ85EhieWt/RlvDYIMsO/0VMmr8NxLALM2PHSf/ejewuQXZ2YsLBg7fKiiM5DJ5rm5AWU bJLePVJFXCpKmOtVwtcqcgnMdmgW9MH9aIXshkdGyIlapyDmuOjVi5CmHP6/Gxk2FiIu+MsbWVdX BU0Y7B9EpQIDAQABoyAwHjAPBgkqhkiG9y8BAQoEAgUAMAsGA1UdDwQEAwIHgDANBgkqhkiG9w0B AQsFAAOCAQEAWvruNG4aYeyRq57pOCVVwJ7ybSMdI0t+xXxlx9srybW3LZpkw2YiY88S5g/XdTAW UNj4Lc2w2STE6vh5ZB2qAOHAkppdEXwA7g8xTI9ozvgFQtqPpodapj8Kd17TU5/qkATNLq9tQpUZ c06Klg2+Oh4Z2DijTo4uh/UXlr6VxrGtbW6lGkH4ZbvkLqiJUgGEPDpbzNIS/q6ZcdnaPwaWdwzH SVQK7eztRMmpmBhxXTc/dgZCXnSOjlsbn+TKFVBCyJLQXRP+YrhY1BtOvJ36Ul3LImX5g2vGMPDi HyWnGi7CoqZpdkOYIGJW89P0qOOVXptIUckSDP0sVz9u98tgsTGCAeQwggHgAgEBMF4wUDEaMBgG A1UEAxMRSmFtZXMgRy4gRnJhbmtsaW4xJTAjBgkqhkiG9w0BCQEWFmphbWVzZkBncm91cHdiZW5j aC5vcmcxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVTAgpkcuug6R9cGYgLMAkGBSsOAwIaBQCgXTAYBgkqhkiG9w0BCQMx CwYJKoZIhvcNAQcBMBwGCSqGSIb3DQEJBTEPFw0xOTExMTAyMDAwMzFaMCMGCSqGSIb3DQEJBDEW BBS13uUzI8ASRZQAWgYLql8Jo6KoTjANBgkqhkiG9w0BAQEFAASCAQCGbXaoD5eObi0ESlTkSD0h FgbB63sz5rcWjsLlLVogHe7/bh9nkjPKPryToYvAuQCgomm4hv0gtJzLxDJBAx25R/U17AzoBmEs 5DSo00pEg94jAcWr5TYKfUU9Z4OSv+Xtd5fB+UUYHGRPfbEz6npMR8BDJjvYHfx9XbltRjWRb3wS /xy30R1tomu5VugkJb4vT5smiQSN7GNkxD9XiKYVqiys/2599RS9GDBmdJ83E9hyX8cAoWKPxwOP 9mENdy6dhKpT35D6LwWII43L9MTYlBik0r7FhIi3PqfWrVoTGLpFy1SrjpfG2MDZSRm0KperncsC ejs5AL+s9l6TaY7mAAAAAAAA --Apple-Mail=_38F4B421-345D-43C4-A143-6FEF921CCA77-- --===============6815405291184708726== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============6815405291184708726==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Nov 10 13:36:40 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65368A05AC for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 13:36:40 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ms11p00im-qufo17282001.me.com (unknown [17.58.38.57]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBD1EA0291 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 13:36:35 -0700 (MST) s=1a1hai; t=1573418193; bh=RPzu4blJ1gh+Y5Tf/dmfOrwseKfNytDUEifFjJHO5gc=; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Date:Message-Id:To; b=wQf3Hx1WYwq+NV5jFXgbCBti0P7trjN4qPoVvTRv5xmBUOALQJhlDSZC5ryXSw7Wq Z8KOedLACen+60sX9E3n0gXgEAxLIDqVeCSAeYjHM28JkWOlJcA80/mppGGNREKOX+ j8Pq7s8W1C7/t4JYkrnhRRgo4qREyHZkUGhNIrBbx9YX0EVY+/AZsOoUiZwqrVj2Kf FSf0bVwCnMckXMuagNKGEqerfMCMqYOmlk4aO0v5EzCK7ixJ6eJATnGDRwf+Pkud0q x+fQDe1jdH8kexk/Cd1PYEijhN1Z5lr7SJ6+M6lb3u2uHmnjXlfMgjeutKrR8JbTA0 H+LCsCp5CXHVA== Received: from [192.168.88.70] (unknown [199.38.189.253]) by ms11p00im-qufo17282001.me.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 39990A00873; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 20:36:33 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 14:36:31 -0600 References: <513EE911-A1D6-4030-BCA1-21E6A5E703F8@groupwbench.org> To: Jim Franklin definitions=2019-11-10_06:, , signatures=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=866 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1908290000 definitions=main-1911100206 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Plug for 14/2 solid wire? From: Pat Horne via Shop-talk Cc: Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net SmltLAoKPiBJZiB5b3UgYXJlIG5vdCBnb2luZyB0byBiZSBwbHVnZ2luZyAmIHVucGx1Z2dpbmcg dGhlIHdpcmUsIGp1c3QgZ28gYWhlYWQgJiB1c2UgYSByZWd1bGFyIHBsdWcuIFRoZSBiZXR0ZXIg d2F5IHRvIGRvIGl0IGlzIHRvIHVzZSBhIHNob3J0IHBpZWNlIG9mIHN0cmFuZGVkIGNvcmQgdGhh dCBpcyBhdHRhY2hlZCB0byB0aGUgUm9sZXguIFRoZSBwcm9ibGVtIHdpdGggY29ubmVjdGluZyB0 aGUgcm9tZXggZGlyZWN0bHkgdG8gdGhlIHBsdWcgaXMgdGhhdCB0aGUgc29saWQgd2lyZSB3aWxs IGJyZWFrIHdpdGggZmxleGluZy4gSWYgaXQgd2VyZSBtZSwgSeKAmWQgZ28gYWhlYWQgJiBjb25u ZWN0IHRoZSByb21leCB0byB0aGUgcGx1ZyB0ZW1wb3JhcmlseSwgdGhlbiBwaWNrIHVwIGEgUGll Y2Ugb2Ygc3RyYW5kZWQgJiBhIGp1bmN0aW9uIGJveCB3aGVuIGNvbnZlbmllbnQuIAoKUGF0IEhv cm5lIApXZSBzdXBwb3J0IEhhYml0YXQgZm9yIEh1bWFuaXR5CgoKPiBPbiBOb3YgMTAsIDIwMTks IGF0IDI6MDAgUE0sIEppbSBGcmFua2xpbiB2aWEgU2hvcC10YWxrIDxzaG9wLXRhbGtAYXV0b3gu dGVhbS5uZXQ+IHdyb3RlOgo+IAoK77u/SSdtIGFkZGlubmcgZXh0ZXJuYWwgY2FycmlhZ2UgbGln aHRzIGFuZCBoYXZlIGEgNTAnIHJvbGwgb2YgMTQvMiBSb21leCBJJ2QgbGlrZSB0byB1c2UgdXAs IG5vdCB0byBtZW50aW9uIDUwJyBvZiAxNC8yIHN0cmFuZGVkIGlzIGFsbW9zdCAkMS9mdC4gCgpJ J2QgbGlrZSB0byBoYXZlIHRoZSBsaWdodHMgb24gYSB0aW1lci4gSSBoYXZlIG91dGxldHMgaW4g dGhlIGdhcmFnZSwgYW5kIEkgaGFwcGVuIHRvIGhhdmUgYSBtZWNoYW5pY2FsIHRpbWVyIHRoYXQg eW91J2QgdXNlIGZvciBhIGxpdmluZ3Jvb20gbGFtcCwgZXRjLiAKCkNhbiBJIHVzZSBhIHJlZ3Vs YXIgYWRkLW9uIHBsdWcgdGhhdCB5b3UnZCBub3JtYWxseSB1c2Ugd2l0aCBzdHJhbmRlZCB3aXJl IGFuZCBqdXN0IGF0dGFjaCB0aGUgUm9tZXggdG8gaXQ/IEFyZSB0aGVyZSBwbHVncyBtYWRlIGZv ciBzb2xpZCB3aXJlPyAKCkkgY291bGQgYWx3YXlzIHVzZSB0aGUgUm9tZXggdG8gZXh0ZW5kIHRo ZSBjaXJjdWl0IHRvIG5lYXIgdGhlIGNhcnJpYWdlIGxpZ2h0cyBhbmQgaW5zdGFsbCBhbiBvdXRs ZXQgZm9yIHRoZSB0aW1lciBhbmQgYnV5IHNob3J0IGxhbXAgY29yZCwgYnV0IHRoYXQgbWVhbnMg YSB0cmlwIHRvIHRoZSBzdG9yZS4gVGhhdCBtaWdodCB0dXJuIG91dCB0byBiZSB0aGUgbW9zdCB0 aW1lL2Nvc3Qvc2FmZXR5IGVmZmljaWVudCBtZXRob2QsIGJ1dCBpZiBJIGRvbid0IGhhdmUgdG8g Z2V0IGludG8gdGhlIGNhciBBR0FJTi4uLgoKdGhhbmtzLApqaW1fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXwoKU2hvcC10YWxrQGF1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0CkRv bmF0ZTogaHR0cDovL3d3dy50ZWFtLm5ldC9kb25hdGUuaHRtbApTdWdnZXN0ZWQgYW5udWFsIGRv bmF0aW9uICAkMTIuOTYKQXJjaGl2ZTogaHR0cDovL3d3dy50ZWFtLm5ldC9waXBlcm1haWwvc2hv cC10YWxrIGh0dHA6Ly9hdXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldC9hcmNoaXZlCgpVbnN1YnNjcmliZS9NYW5hZ2U6 IGh0dHA6Ly9hdXRveC50ZWFtLm5ldC9tYWlsbWFuL29wdGlvbnMvc2hvcC10YWxrL3BhdGludGV4 YXNAaWNsb3VkLmNvbQoKCl9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fCgpTaG9wLXRhbGtAYXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQKRG9uYXRlOiBodHRwOi8vd3d3LnRlYW0u bmV0L2RvbmF0ZS5odG1sClN1Z2dlc3RlZCBhbm51YWwgZG9uYXRpb24gICQxMi45NgpBcmNoaXZl OiBodHRwOi8vd3d3LnRlYW0ubmV0L3BpcGVybWFpbC9zaG9wLXRhbGsgaHR0cDovL2F1dG94LnRl YW0ubmV0L2FyY2hpdmUKClVuc3Vic2NyaWJlL01hbmFnZTogaHR0cDovL2F1dG94LnRlYW0ubmV0 L21haWxtYW4vb3B0aW9ucy9zaG9wLXRhbGsvbWhhcmNAYXV0b3gudGVhbS5uZXQKCg== From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Nov 10 13:45:30 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94BCCA055B for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 13:45:30 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta11.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (unknown [167.206.4.220]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0FEF4A055A for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 13:45:25 -0700 (MST) bh=0nPyzTxNekuho6S9ZHeAJT6J2D+CPBrvsvWf2XIO2eg=; h=Message-ID:Date:To:From:Subject; b=PJI0p1giPpaKwPJzX5cUxTDREBG+RcQAEbtRZlhOkNcFjnRX+zw7musrBYAN/6a6o WRdqHGBa1gUi8ILM+mjFsWlCIIcuvARgJHMH+NIWQ9Vt/bMtciXjIMX3GGrIrmTQQR KokMxkQ+vDIm5Ovq8djRgQaXRJrezQQmx8dlvMzX/Qp5BXl4vGIWyMWsvrjwYuoQ2+ KDON88YJeKCG2g2D2Vy2mn8N4R3YNVl+aS3zpOzY6yJjqRRjrV+XYphHxL2g757r2i MCZU2zn8ogclZjnxuI2+yN2tifKUOSevAjqiLirAWq0khaPYBBQN+MkxvPSF8Pq+GI KjiZOZziJOXZg== Authentication-Results: mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net smtp.user=strovato; auth=pass (LOGIN) a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:117 a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:17 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=kj9zAlcOel0A:10 a=tOMkvAyXNRYapRVcAkEA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 Received: from [67.83.27.177] ([67.83.27.177:53858] helo=Steve-PC.optonline.net) by mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.9.48312 r(Core:3.6.9.0)) with ESMTPA id 2D/0C-09517-5E678CD5; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 15:45:25 -0500 Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 15:44:53 -0500 To: Jim Franklin , Shop-talk References: <513EE911-A1D6-4030-BCA1-21E6A5E703F8@groupwbench.org> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Plug for 14/2 solid wire? From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Jim, If these are regular wall mounted lights, they should be wired directly into a box. You should add a line from power source to a switch and then to the lights. All of this should be done within the walls, ceiling, etc of the building, or in conduit if mounted on the surface. The switch you use can incorporate a timer if desired. There should be no plugs involved, and no lamp cord. Of course you can rig up anything you want and make the lights come on, but it won't be proper or safe like that. Is this intended to be a permanent installation? If it is, do it right. -Steve At 03:00 PM 11/10/2019, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote: >I'm addinng external carriage lights and have a 50' roll of 14/2 >Romex I'd like to use up, not to mention 50' of 14/2 stranded is almost $1/ft. > >I'd like to have the lights on a timer. I have outlets in the >garage, and I happen to have a mechanical timer that you'd use for a >livingroom lamp, etc. > >Can I use a regular add-on plug that you'd normally use with >stranded wire and just attach the Romex to it? Are there plugs made >for solid wire? > >I could always use the Romex to extend the circuit to near the >carriage lights and install an outlet for the timer and buy short >lamp cord, but that means a trip to the store. That might turn out >to be the most time/cost/safety efficient method, but if I don't >have to get into the car AGAIN... > >thanks, >jim _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Nov 10 13:59:11 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20D75A0598 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 13:59:11 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from relay1-d.mail.gandi.net (unknown [217.70.183.193]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6EFFA044F for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 13:59:06 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.1.135] (c-73-253-103-15.hsd1.ma.comcast.net [73.253.103.15]) (Authenticated sender: jamesf@groupwbench.org) by relay1-d.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3D05A240002; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 20:59:04 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 15:59:02 -0500 To: Steven Trovato References: <513EE911-A1D6-4030-BCA1-21E6A5E703F8@groupwbench.org> <2D.0C.09517.5E678CD5@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Plug for 14/2 solid wire? From: Jim Franklin via Shop-talk Cc: Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2769494829321361941== boundary="Apple-Mail=_7BC291B1-CE0B-4A48-9DEB-C61EEA4FD848"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_7BC291B1-CE0B-4A48-9DEB-C61EEA4FD848 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=us-ascii I should have prefaced that I know what "right" is, and it's just not = gonna happen for various reasons. There will be proper boxes where the = fixture wiring connects to the Romex, at least. It's the other end = that's the issue. A quick Google doesn't find any direct-wire single-gang switches with = built-in timers, which would be neat. Do you know of any? There's an = ugly floodlight already switched that I'd like to remove, and if I can = repurpose the wiring to that into a junction box with the new light = wiring, and replace the switch with a timered switch, that would be = quite close to "right". Heck, I might even get excited enough to buy some rigid conduit for the = Romex instead of leaving it exposed :-) jim > On Nov 10, 2019, at 3:44 PM, Steven Trovato = wrote: >=20 > Jim, >=20 > If these are regular wall mounted lights, they should be wired = directly into a box. You should add a line from power source to a = switch and then to the lights. All of this should be done within the = walls, ceiling, etc of the building, or in conduit if mounted on the = surface. The switch you use can incorporate a timer if desired. There = should be no plugs involved, and no lamp cord. Of course you can rig up = anything you want and make the lights come on, but it won't be proper or = safe like that. Is this intended to be a permanent installation? If it = is, do it right. >=20 > -Steve >=20 > At 03:00 PM 11/10/2019, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote: >> I'm addinng external carriage lights and have a 50' roll of 14/2 = Romex I'd like to use up, not to mention 50' of 14/2 stranded is almost = $1/ft. >>=20 >> I'd like to have the lights on a timer. I have outlets in the garage, = and I happen to have a mechanical timer that you'd use for a livingroom = lamp, etc. >>=20 >> Can I use a regular add-on plug that you'd normally use with stranded = wire and just attach the Romex to it? Are there plugs made for solid = wire? >>=20 >> I could always use the Romex to extend the circuit to near the = carriage lights and install an outlet for the timer and buy short lamp = cord, but that means a trip to the store. That might turn out to be the = most time/cost/safety efficient method, but if I don't have to get into = the car AGAIN... >>=20 >> thanks, >> jim >=20 --Apple-Mail=_7BC291B1-CE0B-4A48-9DEB-C61EEA4FD848 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=smime.p7s name=smime.p7s Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIDSDCCA0Qw ggIsoAMCAQICCmRy66DpH1wZiAswDQYJKoZIhvcNAQELBQAwUDEaMBgGA1UEAxMRSmFtZXMgRy4g RnJhbmtsaW4xJTAjBgkqhkiG9w0BCQEWFmphbWVzZkBncm91cHdiZW5jaC5vcmcxCzAJBgNVBAYT AlVTMB4XDTE3MDQxNTE0NDgxMloXDTIyMDQxNTE0NDgxMlowUDEaMBgGA1UEAxMRSmFtZXMgRy4g RnJhbmtsaW4xJTAjBgkqhkiG9w0BCQEWFmphbWVzZkBncm91cHdiZW5jaC5vcmcxCzAJBgNVBAYT AlVTMIIBIjANBgkqhkiG9w0BAQEFAAOCAQ8AMIIBCgKCAQEAmEusUttRQMymOSw8elNOep/BrnU9 MEmZNOH2Pz7+YgLwLBWCq7Yx2JCyeC4XvqMzdB2aPe4KyhWrcSsMirm0Kp/HfBfxf6xaYClOEhDE okCRDuGyNJaso8ZNzkxH84wGm3i0TemqNEaHhKIAJxcHU+RXSIgTBJW4VLQudHkqZ8xXSJPMKVU2 T13H0wosQ85EhieWt/RlvDYIMsO/0VMmr8NxLALM2PHSf/ejewuQXZ2YsLBg7fKiiM5DJ5rm5AWU bJLePVJFXCpKmOtVwtcqcgnMdmgW9MH9aIXshkdGyIlapyDmuOjVi5CmHP6/Gxk2FiIu+MsbWVdX BU0Y7B9EpQIDAQABoyAwHjAPBgkqhkiG9y8BAQoEAgUAMAsGA1UdDwQEAwIHgDANBgkqhkiG9w0B AQsFAAOCAQEAWvruNG4aYeyRq57pOCVVwJ7ybSMdI0t+xXxlx9srybW3LZpkw2YiY88S5g/XdTAW UNj4Lc2w2STE6vh5ZB2qAOHAkppdEXwA7g8xTI9ozvgFQtqPpodapj8Kd17TU5/qkATNLq9tQpUZ c06Klg2+Oh4Z2DijTo4uh/UXlr6VxrGtbW6lGkH4ZbvkLqiJUgGEPDpbzNIS/q6ZcdnaPwaWdwzH SVQK7eztRMmpmBhxXTc/dgZCXnSOjlsbn+TKFVBCyJLQXRP+YrhY1BtOvJ36Ul3LImX5g2vGMPDi HyWnGi7CoqZpdkOYIGJW89P0qOOVXptIUckSDP0sVz9u98tgsTGCAeQwggHgAgEBMF4wUDEaMBgG A1UEAxMRSmFtZXMgRy4gRnJhbmtsaW4xJTAjBgkqhkiG9w0BCQEWFmphbWVzZkBncm91cHdiZW5j aC5vcmcxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVTAgpkcuug6R9cGYgLMAkGBSsOAwIaBQCgXTAYBgkqhkiG9w0BCQMx CwYJKoZIhvcNAQcBMBwGCSqGSIb3DQEJBTEPFw0xOTExMTAyMDU5MDNaMCMGCSqGSIb3DQEJBDEW BBTTXzugC9TNtgERGkwaYT0QCUWLdTANBgkqhkiG9w0BAQEFAASCAQBZLjk1EoKJE3w0cG+pkjOR CkLwVYyI1+D+u1EQ20iagx0b/6rhscEiW8j/AXhq8D3t4v8wO1SyZxYU/u4QRFg+MDCfFjDE1uIw R8oIpNkoL2KSvrii6q+RM23JN1lcwJW35+3rviBgDMJhjympnyxLhZ6lzsG/tNmyyLcD1bOgi/mW QjM30yjSWeU8bxECRfE2YMixVjf6eFis/nIDdSCAn2woSXiuYEDkjQ9M3TNDWjTWbYWszdTGJPUV sxD/fKp//AvrStigvRoOS2wRHeMcAwXcmFEIguI6tjY6J3F1Zq+ZcasPzFRzaBPpKLqs8y0NFJko 57gba54tmBwZ+WIsAAAAAAAA --Apple-Mail=_7BC291B1-CE0B-4A48-9DEB-C61EEA4FD848-- --===============2769494829321361941== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============2769494829321361941==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Nov 10 14:12:05 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 92FCEA05B9 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 14:12:05 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (unknown [167.206.4.197]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E5C5A0295 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 14:12:00 -0700 (MST) bh=bEIBc7FK1KnKmBKdg/96JOsDKcigJA2T1xC8h1ty8M4=; h=Message-ID:Date:To:From:Subject; b=o3le0Pz5GUVw7L3JyQvGobETU9+jBJ8T/1acyglUv5E4GjMFnSoBBC/IIyPqrcvcn 17KsKUK/KYihcrL4e2KW5YNp3V4T8MJgeX3yOZ8GLNDiZVFLQJNAOAyTipHXfkGL29 fhCRoAhie7p5ZhBxRCWH+0jVjgI9Op1MpTHYrTYEIaqohV8iWbNfE5mbQcTitg/RU9 CnM1bzZ3bRVKqyQuGRsklBZ58Koylo0vCHj1hy7gtpU5Lw49cl4+bwiRY7KgY2AwK1 E4Q84k0GwPLMcoXgSJ0Ur6/JEx3MryjbrzU10v68WccmcVn2pEqJCPkUUHuLx5jAxe Z2mPVNknMulhw== Authentication-Results: mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net smtp.user=strovato; auth=pass (LOGIN) a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:117 a=IBeqreNX0NbDiaMtWAF5wQ==:17 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=jpOVt7BSZ2e4Z31A5e1TngXxSK0=:19 a=Z7itauT5AAAA:8 a=UsfXIKInzH17Ge4Ep1YA:9 a=CjuIK1q_8ugA:10 a=vukNVWws5d1WmXPqHdkA:9 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 Received: from [67.83.27.177] ([67.83.27.177:60222] helo=Steve-PC.optonline.net) by mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.6.9.48312 r(Core:3.6.9.0)) with ESMTPA id 9D/05-23065-F1D78CD5; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 16:11:59 -0500 Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 16:11:28 -0500 To: Jim Franklin References: <513EE911-A1D6-4030-BCA1-21E6A5E703F8@groupwbench.org> <2D.0C.09517.5E678CD5@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Plug for 14/2 solid wire? From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk Cc: Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============7895097555861136856== boundary="=====================_339004992==.ALT" --=====================_339004992==.ALT OK, just don't want you to fry anyone or burn the place down. What sort of timer are you looking for? It seems to me that there are dozens of them. https://www.homedepot.com/b/Electrical-Wiring-Devices-Light-Controls-Timers/In-Wall/N-5yc1vZc334Z1z17mau -Steve At 03:59 PM 11/10/2019, Jim Franklin wrote: >I should have prefaced that I know what "right" is, and it's just >not gonna happen for various reasons. There will be proper boxes >where the fixture wiring connects to the Romex, at least. It's the >other end that's the issue. > >A quick Google doesn't find any direct-wire single-gang switches >with built-in timers, which would be neat. Do you know of any? >There's an ugly floodlight already switched that I'd like to remove, >and if I can repurpose the wiring to that into a junction box with >the new light wiring, and replace the switch with a timered switch, >that would be quite close to "right". > >Heck, I might even get excited enough to buy some rigid conduit for >the Romex instead of leaving it exposed :-) > >jim --=====================_339004992==.ALT OK, just don't want you to fry anyone or burn the place down.  What sort of timer are you looking for?  It seems to me that there are dozens of them. 

https://www.homedepot.com/b/Electrical-Wiring-Devices-Light-Controls-Timers/In-Wall/N-5yc1vZc334Z1z17mau

-Steve

At 03:59 PM 11/10/2019, Jim Franklin wrote:
I should have prefaced that I know what "right" is, and it's just not gonna happen for various reasons. There will be proper boxes where the fixture wiring connects to the Romex, at least. It's the other end that's the issue.

A quick Google doesn't find any direct-wire single-gang switches with built-in timers, which would be neat. Do you know of any? There's an ugly floodlight already switched that I'd like to remove, and if I can repurpose the wiring to that into a junction box with the new light wiring, and replace the switch with a timered switch, that would be quite close to "right".

Heck, I might even get excited enough to buy some rigid conduit for the Romex instead of leaving it exposed :-)

jim
--=====================_339004992==.ALT-- --===============7895097555861136856== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============7895097555861136856==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Nov 10 14:21:03 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25120A0588 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 14:21:03 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from relay12.mail.gandi.net (unknown [217.70.178.232]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 674D5A0563 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 14:20:58 -0700 (MST) Received: from [192.168.1.135] (c-73-253-103-15.hsd1.ma.comcast.net [73.253.103.15]) (Authenticated sender: jamesf@groupwbench.org) by relay12.mail.gandi.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D9082200007; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 21:20:56 +0000 (UTC) Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 16:20:54 -0500 To: Steven Trovato References: <513EE911-A1D6-4030-BCA1-21E6A5E703F8@groupwbench.org> <2D.0C.09517.5E678CD5@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <9D.05.23065.F1D78CD5@mta2.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Plug for 14/2 solid wire? From: Jim Franklin via Shop-talk Cc: Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============0992712760561455876== boundary="Apple-Mail=_58349C93-6AED-4940-A83B-17D1D123C14A"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 --Apple-Mail=_58349C93-6AED-4940-A83B-17D1D123C14A Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=us-ascii I must have used a poor phrase because those are exactly what I was = hoping you meant. Thanks! jim > On Nov 10, 2019, at 4:11 PM, Steven Trovato = wrote: >=20 > OK, just don't want you to fry anyone or burn the place down. What = sort of timer are you looking for? It seems to me that there are dozens = of them. =20 >=20 > = https://www.homedepot.com/b/Electrical-Wiring-Devices-Light-Controls-Timer= s/In-Wall/N-5yc1vZc334Z1z17mau=20 >=20 > -Steve >=20 > At 03:59 PM 11/10/2019, Jim Franklin wrote: >> I should have prefaced that I know what "right" is, and it's just not = gonna happen for various reasons. There will be proper boxes where the = fixture wiring connects to the Romex, at least. It's the other end = that's the issue. >>=20 >> A quick Google doesn't find any direct-wire single-gang switches with = built-in timers, which would be neat. Do you know of any? There's an = ugly floodlight already switched that I'd like to remove, and if I can = repurpose the wiring to that into a junction box with the new light = wiring, and replace the switch with a timered switch, that would be = quite close to "right". >>=20 >> Heck, I might even get excited enough to buy some rigid conduit for = the Romex instead of leaving it exposed :-) >>=20 >> jim --Apple-Mail=_58349C93-6AED-4940-A83B-17D1D123C14A Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=smime.p7s name=smime.p7s Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIDSDCCA0Qw ggIsoAMCAQICCmRy66DpH1wZiAswDQYJKoZIhvcNAQELBQAwUDEaMBgGA1UEAxMRSmFtZXMgRy4g RnJhbmtsaW4xJTAjBgkqhkiG9w0BCQEWFmphbWVzZkBncm91cHdiZW5jaC5vcmcxCzAJBgNVBAYT AlVTMB4XDTE3MDQxNTE0NDgxMloXDTIyMDQxNTE0NDgxMlowUDEaMBgGA1UEAxMRSmFtZXMgRy4g RnJhbmtsaW4xJTAjBgkqhkiG9w0BCQEWFmphbWVzZkBncm91cHdiZW5jaC5vcmcxCzAJBgNVBAYT AlVTMIIBIjANBgkqhkiG9w0BAQEFAAOCAQ8AMIIBCgKCAQEAmEusUttRQMymOSw8elNOep/BrnU9 MEmZNOH2Pz7+YgLwLBWCq7Yx2JCyeC4XvqMzdB2aPe4KyhWrcSsMirm0Kp/HfBfxf6xaYClOEhDE okCRDuGyNJaso8ZNzkxH84wGm3i0TemqNEaHhKIAJxcHU+RXSIgTBJW4VLQudHkqZ8xXSJPMKVU2 T13H0wosQ85EhieWt/RlvDYIMsO/0VMmr8NxLALM2PHSf/ejewuQXZ2YsLBg7fKiiM5DJ5rm5AWU bJLePVJFXCpKmOtVwtcqcgnMdmgW9MH9aIXshkdGyIlapyDmuOjVi5CmHP6/Gxk2FiIu+MsbWVdX BU0Y7B9EpQIDAQABoyAwHjAPBgkqhkiG9y8BAQoEAgUAMAsGA1UdDwQEAwIHgDANBgkqhkiG9w0B AQsFAAOCAQEAWvruNG4aYeyRq57pOCVVwJ7ybSMdI0t+xXxlx9srybW3LZpkw2YiY88S5g/XdTAW UNj4Lc2w2STE6vh5ZB2qAOHAkppdEXwA7g8xTI9ozvgFQtqPpodapj8Kd17TU5/qkATNLq9tQpUZ c06Klg2+Oh4Z2DijTo4uh/UXlr6VxrGtbW6lGkH4ZbvkLqiJUgGEPDpbzNIS/q6ZcdnaPwaWdwzH SVQK7eztRMmpmBhxXTc/dgZCXnSOjlsbn+TKFVBCyJLQXRP+YrhY1BtOvJ36Ul3LImX5g2vGMPDi HyWnGi7CoqZpdkOYIGJW89P0qOOVXptIUckSDP0sVz9u98tgsTGCAeQwggHgAgEBMF4wUDEaMBgG A1UEAxMRSmFtZXMgRy4gRnJhbmtsaW4xJTAjBgkqhkiG9w0BCQEWFmphbWVzZkBncm91cHdiZW5j aC5vcmcxCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVTAgpkcuug6R9cGYgLMAkGBSsOAwIaBQCgXTAYBgkqhkiG9w0BCQMx CwYJKoZIhvcNAQcBMBwGCSqGSIb3DQEJBTEPFw0xOTExMTAyMTIwNTVaMCMGCSqGSIb3DQEJBDEW BBQmefbXS9C5hICfscyCYC3m5PHSXTANBgkqhkiG9w0BAQEFAASCAQBX7taHLdp6Cs+0XxgYAYYe 6J3QTafA3LNqBYUhaV5bTa1B/+fFrt3Sk6XbQWyJ8EtMLMfI34XJHbNTapE5KGdqoqg6vTzQpA5G IQvqWQiod4fLucQePpnnD6ma3YgD5IIMVFAxYpR+hjEWgZc1vg9noEO6FOUgkfGQxCSK7eEsIirs eXF4gpsJuc6Yc/GstYn/sTs/bVf13ZBBlvUNRjHQ3nU+xY3znuGG2xi7eyVjxxsZW3oR91hhSAyt p/7mKXsUe8z3fpEyLn2kACn0iP2FB+/PhgIaB/8ujFB2qr3u5oe1yPUDhwpmf3U5/4Ucz5aduXRc hYid1bqHJblxZ5uRAAAAAAAA --Apple-Mail=_58349C93-6AED-4940-A83B-17D1D123C14A-- --===============0992712760561455876== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive --===============0992712760561455876==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Nov 10 14:22:31 2019 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from [50.198.190.17] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A09CA0598 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 14:22:31 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (unknown [209.86.89.62]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F123A0458 for ; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 14:22:28 -0700 (MST) s=dk12062016; t=1573420948; bh=l/XX3vaSJz2CYb0QCKU8ez+bP6k/Z89kR3xK +oSGf/4=; h=Received:Subject:To:Cc:References:From:Message-ID:Date: User-Agent:MIME-Version:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Language: X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; b=F5bciDoqxxRO12xV113PZTfjSLkcvb7tR aDKdYoi9iMBAJhqWLxSmT8pl4WH5ipUg9fiNtFSoAFlHWeV3/wsvzIkdr0ApYLTd5Jx cBnQoAU+/Q+Gjo7y7c6XJZhPWZkrWJvboWmSlOD6OxSaZcIBC7qaXjEnlGErCAKCU6T LduSml5idXF2fp2mODxpZKDvcUvcHYYVuNXj0LIyVJpzUZ4Suyb9NLA3xs5OBRTb/1k nMP2ABYbkbUnaiiCg+uyTt2/9cDa/MPAnJT5LQ1w+TPCJPza26zSsol/n0/ruVINmlX a9V5GAoWLtd/GGHnunQCIEhGQqDze8PjUMS886H3A== DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk12062016; d=earthlink.net; b=f6wBzIqQRWRqYchIgZEZ3fPmDwz1PSwqDT+GVi68xB4NgU7RzwwPO0RaXziDCE8n9+3gcQMW893E9h4F6jerbtrYLoc3BXGyHrMOP+c5hybVduqItOKpzHSKlu32ajxBMeapGPrqtfLgMnmo9lLLLF5x1ETu3+NwsDZiQEmI8X0qOrS1c6KbwLNmzUVwHlQawYxZaDoPmifGi6hIXChIXsAXNtmAqtyzMR4KZtjvt6zk7MpUx7Yahm8/Kvl1vsQtgDxhXU9md5IrVm6XM8AJ4Yi9fZuetHaQeBCuocah86bICc6QlUQZ6O/cPoH5atQqSrWU2pXB4f8bxWIWr1fKmg==; h=Received:Subject:To:Cc:References:From:Message-ID:Date:User-Agent:MIME-Version:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Language:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [184.181.124.168] (helo=[192.168.0.3]) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4) (envelope-from ) id 1iTufD-000GeG-24; Sun, 10 Nov 2019 16:22:27 -0500 To: Jim Franklin References: <513EE911-A1D6-4030-BCA1-21E6A5E703F8@groupwbench.org> <2D.0C.09517.5E678CD5@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 13:22:08 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.9.1 Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Plug for 14/2 solid wire? From: Brian Kemp via Shop-talk Cc: Shop-talk Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============7839527942432427221== boundary="------------886D7F34377E4DD74D4BA576" Content-Language: en-US This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------886D7F34377E4DD74D4BA576 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Jim - Here are two sample single gang timers. https://www.homedepot.com/p/Defiant-15-Amp-In-Wall-3-Way-Daylight-Adjusting-Digital-Timer-Switch-with-Screw-Terminals-White-32648/300524126 https://www.homedepot.com/p/Honeywell-7-Day-Programmable-Timer-Switch-for-Lights-and-Motors-RPLS730B1000-U/206311889 Also, you might want to check about Romex in conduit.  I don't think you can do that according to code, except for short sections open at both ends.  I think the issue is possible heat buildup and the thermal rating of the wire insulation. Brian On 11/10/2019 12:59 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote: > I should have prefaced that I know what "right" is, and it's just not gonna happen for various reasons. There will be proper boxes where the fixture wiring connects to the Romex, at least. It's the other end that's the issue. > > A quick Google doesn't find any direct-wire single-gang switches with built-in timers, which would be neat. Do you know of any? There's an ugly floodlight already switched that I'd like to remove, and if I can repurpose the wiring to that into a junction box with the new light wiring, and replace the switch with a timered switch, that would be quite close to "right". > > Heck, I might even get excited enough to buy some rigid conduit for the Romex instead of leaving it exposed :-) > > jim > >> On Nov 10, 2019, at 3:44 PM, Steven Trovato wrote: >> >> Jim, >> >> If these are regular wall mounted lights, they should be wired directly into a box. You should add a line from power source to a switch and then to the lights. All of this should be done within the walls, ceiling, etc of the building, or in conduit if mounted on the surface. The switch you use can incorporate a timer if desired. There should be no plugs involved, and no lamp cord. Of course you can rig up anything you want and make the lights come on, but it won't be proper or safe like that. Is this intended to be a permanent installation? If it is, do it right. >> >> -Steve >> >> At 03:00 PM 11/10/2019, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote: >>> I'm addinng external carriage lights and have a 50' roll of 14/2 Romex I'd like to use up, not to mention 50' of 14/2 stranded is almost $1/ft. >>> >>> I'd like to have the lights on a timer. I have outlets in the garage, and I happen to have a mechanical timer that you'd use for a livingroom lamp, etc. >>> >>> Can I use a regular add-on plug that you'd normally use with stranded wire and just attach the Romex to it? Are there plugs made for solid wire? >>> >>> I could always use the Romex to extend the circuit to near the carriage lights and install an outlet for the timer and buy short lamp cord, but that means a trip to the store. That might turn out to be the most time/cost/safety efficient method, but if I don't have to get into the car AGAIN... >>> >>> thanks, >>> jim > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bk13@earthlink.net > --------------886D7F34377E4DD74D4BA576 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Jim - Here are two sample single gang timers.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Defiant-15-Amp-In-Wall-3-Way-Daylight-Adjusting-Digital-Timer-Switch-with-Screw-Terminals-White-32648/300524126

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Honeywell-7-Day-Programmable-Timer-Switch-for-Lights-and-Motors-RPLS730B1000-U/206311889

Also, you might want to check about Romex in conduit.  I don't think you can do that according to code, except for short sections open at both ends.  I think the issue is possible heat buildup and the thermal rating of the wire insulation.

Brian

On 11/10/2019 12:59 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote:
I should have prefaced that I know what "right" is, and it's just not gonna happen for various reasons. There will be proper boxes where the fixture wiring connects to the Romex, at least. It's the other end that's the issue.

A quick Google doesn't find any direct-wire single-gang switches with built-in timers, which would be neat. Do you know of any? There's an ugly floodlight already switched that I'd like to remove, and if I can repurpose the wiring to that into a junction box with the new light wiring, and replace the switch with a timered switch, that would be quite close to "right".

Heck, I might even get excited enough to buy some rigid conduit for the Romex instead of leaving it exposed :-)

jim


On Nov 10, 2019, at 3:44 PM, Steven Trovato <strovato@optonline.net> wrote:

Jim,

If these are regular wall mounted lights, they should be wired directly into a box.  You should add a line from power source to a switch and then to the lights.  All of this should be done within the walls, ceiling, etc of the building, or in conduit if mounted on the surface.  The switch you use can incorporate a timer if desired.  There should be no plugs involved, and no lamp cord.  Of course you can rig up anything you want and make the lights come on, but it won't be proper or safe like that.  Is this intended to be a permanent installation?  If it is, do it right.

-Steve

At 03:00 PM 11/10/2019, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote:

I'm addinng external carriage lights and have a 50' roll of 14/2 Romex I'd like to use up, not to mention 50' of 14/2 stranded is almost $1/ft.

I'd like to have the lights on a timer. I have outlets in the garage, and I happen to have a mechanical timer that you'd use for a livingroom lamp, etc.

Can I use a regular add-on plug that you'd normally use with stranded wire and just attach the Romex to it? Are there plugs made for solid wire?

I could always use the Romex to extend the circuit to near the carriage lights and install an outlet for the timer and buy short lamp cord, but that means a trip to the store. That might turn out to be the most time/cost/safety efficient method, but if I don't have to get into the car AGAIN...

thanks,
jim


      

      

      

      

      
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Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive




    

    

  


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Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 16:39:08 -0500
To: Brian Kemp 
References: <513EE911-A1D6-4030-BCA1-21E6A5E703F8@groupwbench.org>
 <2D.0C.09517.5E678CD5@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net>
 
 <751ee028-2b6e-8dc6-6a40-e85ec76d0f10@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Plug for 14/2 solid wire?
From: Jim Franklin via Shop-talk 
Cc: Shop-talk 
Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net


--===============7196562573109682674==
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The code is not clear, i.e. it states a few things that can be =
interpreted as "no Romex in conduit" but doesn't explicitly forbid it. I =
also think it explicitly permits it when going from a protected area (my =
garage walls) to an unprotected area (the new junction box flush mounted =
to the ceiling).=20

Realistically, I'd worry more about heat buildup in an insulated wall =
that I would metal conduit in a garage in New England. I suppose some =
future yahoo could repurpose ths wiring to run something beyond spec, =
but as it'll be hardwired to the 11 watt lights I'm not concerned enough =
to buy individual wires to run through the conduit I am not sure I'll be =
buying yet :-)

jim

> On Nov 10, 2019, at 4:22 PM, Brian Kemp  wrote:
>=20
> Jim - Here are two sample single gang timers.=20
>=20
> =
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Defiant-15-Amp-In-Wall-3-Way-Daylight-Adjustin=
g-Digital-Timer-Switch-with-Screw-Terminals-White-32648/300524126
>=20
> =
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Honeywell-7-Day-Programmable-Timer-Switch-for-=
Lights-and-Motors-RPLS730B1000-U/206311889
>=20
> Also, you might want to check about Romex in conduit.  I don't think =
you can do that according to code, except for short sections open at =
both ends.  I think the issue is possible heat buildup and the thermal =
rating of the wire insulation.
>=20
> Brian
>=20
> On 11/10/2019 12:59 PM, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote:
>> I should have prefaced that I know what "right" is, and it's just not =
gonna happen for various reasons. There will be proper boxes where the =
fixture wiring connects to the Romex, at least. It's the other end =
that's the issue.
>>=20
>> A quick Google doesn't find any direct-wire single-gang switches with =
built-in timers, which would be neat. Do you know of any? There's an =
ugly floodlight already switched that I'd like to remove, and if I can =
repurpose the wiring to that into a junction box with the new light =
wiring, and replace the switch with a timered switch, that would be =
quite close to "right".
>>=20
>> Heck, I might even get excited enough to buy some rigid conduit for =
the Romex instead of leaving it exposed :-)
>>=20
>> jim
>>=20
>>=20
>>> On Nov 10, 2019, at 3:44 PM, Steven Trovato 
>>>  wrote:
>>>=20
>>> Jim,
>>>=20
>>> If these are regular wall mounted lights, they should be wired =
directly into a box.  You should add a line from power source to a =
switch and then to the lights.  All of this should be done within the =
walls, ceiling, etc of the building, or in conduit if mounted on the =
surface.  The switch you use can incorporate a timer if desired.  There =
should be no plugs involved, and no lamp cord.  Of course you can rig up =
anything you want and make the lights come on, but it won't be proper or =
safe like that.  Is this intended to be a permanent installation?  If it =
is, do it right.
>>>=20
>>> -Steve
>>>=20
>>> At 03:00 PM 11/10/2019, Jim Franklin via Shop-talk wrote:
>>>=20
>>>> I'm addinng external carriage lights and have a 50' roll of 14/2 =
Romex I'd like to use up, not to mention 50' of 14/2 stranded is almost =
$1/ft.
>>>>=20
>>>> I'd like to have the lights on a timer. I have outlets in the =
garage, and I happen to have a mechanical timer that you'd use for a =
livingroom lamp, etc.
>>>>=20
>>>> Can I use a regular add-on plug that you'd normally use with =
stranded wire and just attach the Romex to it? Are there plugs made for =
solid wire?
>>>>=20
>>>> I could always use the Romex to extend the circuit to near the =
carriage lights and install an outlet for the timer and buy short lamp =
cord, but that means a trip to the store. That might turn out to be the =
most time/cost/safety efficient method, but if I don't have to get into =
the car AGAIN...
>>>>=20
>>>> thanks,
>>>> jim
>>>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> _______________________________________________
>>=20
>>=20
>> Shop-talk@autox.team.net
>>=20
>> Donate:=20
>> http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>=20
>> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
>> Archive:=20
>> http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>>=20
>>=20
>> Unsubscribe/Manage:=20
>> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/bk13@earthlink.net
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>=20


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Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 20:36:32 -0500
To: John Mitchell ,Shop Talk 
References: 
 
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Miter saw blade for plastic tiles
From: Steven Trovato via Shop-talk 
Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net

--===============4657952399454876311==
	boundary="=====================_14626341==.ALT"

--=====================_14626341==.ALT

I found lots of opinions on this, including some people who put the 
blade on the saw backwards!  Yes, on purpose.  I don't know about 
that, but  I found this:

https://www.garageflooringllc.com/2014/06/23/cut-garage-floor-tile/ 


There seem to be a lot of different approaches to this.  I guess if 
it was me, I would try it with whatever blade I have.  If I wasn't 
happy with that, I'd try a fine tooth laminate blade.

-Steve

At 07:18 PM 11/10/2019, John Mitchell via Shop-talk wrote:
>Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64I'm putting down racedeck type 
>garage tiles and I'm wondering what the
>best blade is for my miter saw.  Should I get the finest tooth blade I
>can find or will a 60 tooth 12" blade suffice?

--=====================_14626341==.ALT



I found lots of opinions on this, including some people who put the blade
on the saw backwards!  Yes, on purpose.  I don't know about
that, but  I found this:



https://www.garageflooringllc.com/2014/06/23/cut-garage-floor-tile/



There seem to be a lot of different approaches to this.  I guess if
it was me, I would try it with whatever blade I have.  If I wasn't
happy with that, I'd try a fine tooth laminate blade.  


-Steve


At 07:18 PM 11/10/2019, John Mitchell via Shop-talk wrote:


Content-Transfer-Encoding:
base64I'm putting down racedeck type garage tiles and I'm wondering what
the 

best blade is for my miter saw.  Should I get the finest tooth blade
I 

can find or will a 60 tooth 12" blade suffice?





--=====================_14626341==.ALT--


--===============4657952399454876311==
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive



--===============4657952399454876311==--


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References: 
 
 
Date: Sun, 10 Nov 2019 17:52:14 -0800
To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Subject: [Shop-talk] Fwd:  Miter saw blade for plastic tiles
From: old dirtbeard via Shop-talk 
Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net

--===============0707294532915123572==

--000000000000e8aabb0597085d6a

---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: old dirtbeard 
Date: Sun, Nov 10, 2019 at 5:07 PM
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Miter saw blade for plastic tiles
To: John Mitchell 


Hi John,

I just put down 980 sq ft of Racedeck tile in my garage and used the
regular multipurpose 10" blade that was on my compound miter saw. Worked
fine, but it threw plastic chips everywhere.

I eventually took it outdoors and sawed them there, but it still made a big
mess.

If I had it to do over, I would use a very fine blade or something else to
cut them. I was cleaning-up plastic chips for weeks...

best,

doug

On Sun, Nov 10, 2019 at 4:18 PM John Mitchell via Shop-talk <
shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:

> I'm putting down racedeck type garage tiles and I'm wondering what the
> best blade is for my miter saw.  Should I get the finest tooth blade I
> can find or will a 60 tooth 12" blade suffice?
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk@autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com
>
>

--000000000000e8aabb0597085d6a
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable




---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: old dirtbeard <dirtbeard@gmail.com><=
/span>
Date: Sun, Nov 10, 2019 at 5:07 PM
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Mi=
ter saw blade for plastic tiles
To: John Mitchell <jmitch@snet.net>


=
Hi John,

I just put down 980 sq ft of Racedeck tile in m=
y garage and used the regular multipurpose=C2=A010" blade that was on =
my compound miter saw. Worked fine, but it threw plastic chips everywhere.=
=C2=A0

I eventually took it outdoors and sawed the=
m there, but it still made a big mess.=C2=A0

If I =
had it to do over, I would use a very fine blade or something else to cut t=
hem. I was cleaning-up plastic chips for weeks...

=
best,

doug

On Sun, Nov 10, 2019 at 4:18 PM Jo=
hn Mitchell via Shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:
I'm putting down racedeck type=
 garage tiles and I'm wondering what the 

best blade is for my miter saw.=C2=A0 Should I get the finest tooth blade I=
 

can find or will a 60 tooth 12" blade suffice?





_______________________________________________



Shop-talk@aut=
ox.team.net

et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk htt=
p://autox.team.net/archive



alk/dirtbeard@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.=
team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com








--000000000000e8aabb0597085d6a--

--===============0707294532915123572==
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive



--===============0707294532915123572==--

From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net  Mon Nov 11 08:15:40 2019
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References: 
 
Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2019 10:15:23 -0500
To: John Mitchell 
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Miter saw blade for plastic tiles
From: Paul Parkanzky via Shop-talk 
Cc: Shop Talk 
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net

My current favorite flooring for my rentals is Quality Craft's
"Expressa" vinyl planking. One of the biggest selling points for me is
that it's solid PVC all the way through so it's genuinely completely
waterproof (You could store it in your swimming pool for a season and
still install it). Another upside to that is that it's super easy to
work with. It cuts great on a power miter saw, with a jig saw, a
dremel, etc.

Finer toothed blades make a slightly nicer cut but are a bit slower
(It won't matter much, no matter what you do it cuts like butter).
However, your options are a coarser blade and big piles of fluffy
chips or a fine-toothed blade and endless PVC dust (I'd wear a mask if
you choose the latter). Because of that, I just cut it with a normal
wood blade and sweep/shopvac up garbage bags full of chips.

I think you're facing the same decision with your RaceDeck.

On Sun, Nov 10, 2019 at 7:18 PM John Mitchell via Shop-talk
 wrote:
>
> I'm putting down racedeck type garage tiles and I'm wondering what the
> best blade is for my miter saw.  Should I get the finest tooth blade I
> can find or will a 60 tooth 12" blade suffice?
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk@autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/parkanzky@gmail.com
>
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive



From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net  Mon Nov 11 08:22:56 2019
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References: 
Date: Mon, 11 Nov 2019 10:22:40 -0500
To: Jeff Scarbrough 
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Hatchet
From: Paul Parkanzky via Shop-talk 
Cc: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" 
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net

If you want old-school, there are some small companies out there
making traditional axes and hatchets that people swear by. Expect to
be gouged though.

If you're open to modern, I've been endlessly impressed with all of
the Fiskars axes and hatchets I've used over the years. Under $30 on
Amazon. I know Estwing makes a hatchet too and I'd be willing to give
that a try since they're my go-to for hammers. They're what I'd buy if
I planned to occasionally use the back of an axe to drive it through a
stubborn round.

On Sat, Nov 9, 2019 at 4:59 PM Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk
 wrote:
>
> Well, I've destroyed my ancient Plumb 14 inch hatchet.  I probably shouldn't have abused it...
>
> Anyone bought a quality hatchet lately that they'd recommend?
>
> Jeff Scarbrough
> Corrosion Acres, Ga.
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk@autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/parkanzky@gmail.com
>
_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive



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References: 
 
 <74.CA.03419.64BB8CD5@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net>
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2019 07:13:57 -0500
To: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" 
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Miter saw blade for plastic tiles
From: Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk 
Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net

--===============8043772795327861808==

--0000000000005f83580597252fb3

On Sun, Nov 10, 2019 at 8:37 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk <
shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:

> I found lots of opinions on this, including some people who put the blade
> on the saw backwards!  Yes, on purpose.
>

I've built a lot of research equipment out of PVC pipe.  Table saw with the
blade on backwards makes absolutely the smoothest cut ever.

Jeff Scarbrough
Corrosion Acres, Ga.

--0000000000005f83580597252fb3
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable




=

On Sun, Nov 10, 2019 at 8:37 PM Steve=
n Trovato via Shop-talk <sho=
p-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:



I found lots of opinions on this, including some people who put the blade
on the saw backwards!=C2=A0 Yes, on purpose.=C2=A0
<=
br>
I've built a lot of research equipment out of PVC pipe.=
=C2=A0 Table saw with the blade on backwards makes absolutely the smoothest=
 cut ever.=C2=A0 =C2=A0

Jeff Scarbrough
=
Corrosion Acres, Ga.


--0000000000005f83580597252fb3--

--===============8043772795327861808==
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive



--===============8043772795327861808==--

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References: 
 
 <74.CA.03419.64BB8CD5@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net>
 
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2019 07:48:30 -0800
To: Jeff Scarbrough 
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Miter saw blade for plastic tiles
From: old dirtbeard via Shop-talk 
Cc: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" 
Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net

--===============0820969251941961623==

--000000000000aa62060597282e76

Thanks Jeff,

Does it reduce the amount of chip/dust mess?

On Tue, Nov 12, 2019, 4:14 AM Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk <
shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:

>
>
> On Sun, Nov 10, 2019 at 8:37 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk <
> shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:
>
>> I found lots of opinions on this, including some people who put the blade
>> on the saw backwards!  Yes, on purpose.
>>
>
> I've built a lot of research equipment out of PVC pipe.  Table saw with
> the blade on backwards makes absolutely the smoothest cut ever.
>
> Jeff Scarbrough
> Corrosion Acres, Ga.
> _______________________________________________
>
> Shop-talk@autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation  $12.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk
> http://autox.team.net/archive
>
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com
>
>

--000000000000aa62060597282e76
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Thanks Jeff,

Does it reduce the amount of chip/dust mess?

On Tue, Nov 12, 2019, 4:=
14 AM Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk <shop-talk@autox.team.net> wrote:

_______________________________________________



Shop-talk@autox.team.net

errer" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html

Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive



alk/dirtbeard@gmail.com" rel=3D"noreferrer noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">ht=
tp://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dirtbeard@gmail.com






--000000000000aa62060597282e76--

--===============0820969251941961623==
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive



--===============0820969251941961623==--

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Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2019 08:09:17 -0800
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 [128.111.216.187]:18413
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Miter saw blade for plastic tiles
From: Mike Rambour via Shop-talk 
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
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To: Mike Rambour , Shop Talk 
References: 
 
 <4c6d96cc-012b-d248-f49b-0efc3d60de46@dinospider.com>
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2019 13:17:28 -0500
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Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Miter saw blade for plastic tiles
From: John Mitchell via Shop-talk 
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net

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References: 
 
 <4c6d96cc-012b-d248-f49b-0efc3d60de46@dinospider.com>
 <68b880a1-da8d-9497-969e-af67340aaf43@snet.net>
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2019 10:34:46 -0800
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101
 Thunderbird/60.9.1
Content-Language: en-US
 please include it with any abuse report
 [128.111.216.187]:40799
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Miter saw blade for plastic tiles
From: Mike Rambour via Shop-talk 
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net

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From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net  Tue Nov 12 12:23:09 2019
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Cc: Shop Talk 
References: 
 <61D78BA8-4F8E-4C0B-AFBB-2D8C0AAECEE2@icloud.com>
 <1c54fcba-55f7-b6cd-f354-f972ff40146f@dinospider.com>
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2019 11:23:00 -0800
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101
 Thunderbird/60.9.1
Content-Language: en-US
 please include it with any abuse report
 [128.111.216.187]:43652
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Miter saw blade for plastic tiles
From: Mike Rambour via Shop-talk 
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net

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From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net  Fri Nov 15 18:38:53 2019
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Date: Tue, 12 Nov 2019 12:49:38 -0600
References: 
To: Mike Rambour 
 definitions=2019-11-12_06:, , signatures=0
 malwarescore=0
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Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Miter saw blade for plastic tiles
From: Pat Horne via Shop-talk 
Cc: Shop Talk 
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net

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References: 
 
 <74.CA.03419.64BB8CD5@mta1.srv.hcvlny.cv.net>
 
 
Date: Sun, 17 Nov 2019 10:03:53 -0500
To: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" 
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Miter saw blade for plastic tiles
From: Jeff Scarbrough via Shop-talk 
Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net

--===============1586781594724739216==

--00000000000005faca05978c249e

I got a couple of questions:



> Does it reduce the amount of chip/dust mess?
>
>>
As I recall, I ended up with a pile of flakes.  No messier than cutting
anything else.

> Do you think this would work on a sliding miter saw?  Does it matter how
fine a blade?

I used maybe a 40-tooth blade.  On a sliding saw, I'd be very wary of
something getting out of control - you're holding the material, you're
holding the saw...and you're doing something that's definitely
non-standard.  Probably void ing a warranty, too.  :)

--00000000000005faca05978c249e
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


I got a couple of questions:



Does it reduce the amount of chip/dust mess?

As I recall, I ended up with a pile o=
f flakes.=C2=A0 No messier than cutting anything else.

=

> Do you think this would work on a sliding miter saw?=C2=A0 Does i=
t matter how fine a blade?

I used maybe a 40-tooth=
 blade.=C2=A0 On a sliding saw, I'd be very wary of something getting o=
ut of control - you're holding the material, you're holding the saw=
...and you're doing something that's definitely non-standard.=C2=A0=
 Probably void ing a warranty, too.=C2=A0 :)


<=
/div>
=C2=A0


--00000000000005faca05978c249e--

--===============1586781594724739216==
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Disposition: inline

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/archive



--===============1586781594724739216==--

From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net  Sun Nov 17 13:00:37 2019
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 Sat, 16 Nov 2019 11:27:37 -0800 (PST)
Date: Sat, 16 Nov 2019 11:27:25 -0800
To: Mike Rambour , Pat Horne
 
References: 
 <61D78BA8-4F8E-4C0B-AFBB-2D8C0AAECEE2@icloud.com>
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Miter saw blade for plastic tiles
From: Berry Kercheval via Shop-talk 
Cc: Shop Talk 
Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net

--===============9177632019695149926==

--5dd04da8_327b23c6_7e94
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Disposition: inline

The SawStop brake cartridge is =2477 from Amazon, and you can change it y=
ourself.
https://www.amazon.com/SawStop-TSBC-10R2-Cartridge-10-Inch-Blades/dp/B001=
G9MGZQ
On Nov 15, 2019, 5:38 PM -0800, Pat Horne via Shop-talk , wrote:
> What does it cost for the puck after the hot dog trick=3F Back in the e=
arly days I think it was about =24175 & required a trip back to the facto=
ry.
>
> I=E2=80=99ve slightly nicked my finger twice on my powermatic 66. Had a=
 shop fire several years ago & it came through fine. Rebuilt it mechanica=
lly but didn=E2=80=99t have time for a repaint.
>
> Peace,
> Pat
>
> Pat Horne
> We support Habitat for Humanity
>
>
> > On Nov 12, 2019, at 12:35 PM, Mike Rambour via Shop-talk  wrote:
> >
>
>
> No never tried the hot dog trick, I went with my finger. Well, with my =
old saw after 35 years of no accidents, I sliced my finger with my table =
saw, nothing too serious, its still there. But I did get a little scared =
and went and got a Sawstop and replaced my Unisaw, my wife figured as I g=
et older, I may get a little more forgetful and besides my Unisaw was a 1=
.75HP model, so it was time to upgrade to 3HP anyway :)
>
> mike
>
>
> > On 11/12/2019 10:17 AM, John Mitchell wrote:
> > I've had some tiles down for 2 years and suddenly they started to cur=
l up around the edges. I installed them with plenty of gap for expansion.=
 I sent =22Garage =46loors=22 pictures and suddenly I had a delivery of a=
ll new tiles. I assume others may have had similar problems with that bat=
ch. Did you ever stick a hot dog into the saw stop=3F
> >
> > > On 11/12/2019 11:09 AM, Mike Rambour via Shop-talk wrote:
> > >
> > > I cut mine on my table saw with my regular wood blade, there was so=
me melting but not much. Other tiles I cut with my sabre saw.
> > >
> > > I remember reading where someone suggested putting the saw blade on=
 backwards to cut Racedeck, but my saw (Sawstop) wont work with the blade=
 backwards so I never even tried.
> > >
> > > You are going to love the tiles, had mine about 15 years now, just =
be careful when you weld or use your plasma cutter :)
> > >
> > > mike
> > >
> > > On 11/10/2019 4:18 PM, John Mitchell via Shop-talk wrote:
> > > > I'm putting down racedeck type garage tiles and I'm wondering wha=
t the best blade is for my miter saw. Should I get the finest tooth blade=
 I can find or will a 60 tooth 12=22 blade suffice=3F
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=
=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=

> > > >
> > > > Shop-talk=40autox.team.net
> > > > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> > > > Suggested annual donation =2412.96
> > > > Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.tea=
m.net/archive
> > > >
> > > > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-ta=
lk/lists=40dinospider.com
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
> --
> A gun is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have it,
> you'll probably never need one again.
>
> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=
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>
> Shop-talk=40autox.team.net
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Suggested annual donation =2412.96
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk http://autox.team.net/=
archive
>
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intexas=40icloud.com
>
>
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>
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ry=40kerch.com
>

--5dd04da8_327b23c6_7e94
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Disposition: inline









The SawStop brake cartridge is =2477 from Amazon, a=
nd you can change it yourself.






On Nov 15, 2019, 5:38 PM -0800, Pat=
 Horne via Shop-talk <shop-talk=40autox.team.net>, wrote:


Wh=
at does it cost for the puck after the hot dog trick=3F Back in the early=
 days I think it was about =24175 & required a trip back to the facto=
ry.



I=E2=80=99ve slightly nicked my finger twice on my powermatic 66. Had a s=
hop fire several years ago & it came through fine. Rebuilt it mechani=
cally but didn=E2=80=99t have time for a repaint.



Peace,

Pat



Pat Horne

We support Habitat for Humanity






On=
 Nov 12, 2019, at 12:35 PM, Mike Rambour via Shop-talk <shop-talk=40au=
tox.team.net> wrote:





=EF=BB=BF

No never tried the hot dog trick, I went with my finger. Well, with my ol=
d saw after 35 years of no accidents, I sliced my finger with my table sa=
w, nothing too serious, its still there. But I did get a little scared an=
d went and got a Sawstop and replaced my Unisaw, my wife figured as I get=
 older, I may get a little more forgetful and besides my Unisaw was a 1.7=
5HP model, so it was time to upgrade to 3HP anyway :)



mike






On=
 11/12/2019 10:17 AM, John Mitchell wrote:

I've had some tiles down for 2 years and suddenly they started to curl up=
 around the edges. I installed them with plenty of gap for expansion. I s=
ent =22Garage =46loors=22 pictures and suddenly I had a delivery of all n=
ew tiles. I assume others may have had similar problems with that batch. =
Did you ever stick a hot dog into the saw stop=3F




On=
 11/12/2019 11:09 AM, Mike Rambour via Shop-talk wrote:



I cut mine on my table saw with my regular wood blade, there was some mel=
ting but not much. Other tiles I cut with my sabre saw.



I remember reading where someone suggested putting the saw blade on backw=
ards to cut Racedeck, but my saw (Sawstop) wont work with the blade backw=
ards so I never even tried.



You are going to love the tiles, had mine about 15 years now, just be car=
eful when you weld or use your plasma cutter :)



mike



On 11/10/2019 4:18 PM, John Mitchell via Shop-talk wrote:


I'=
m putting down racedeck type garage tiles and I'm wondering what the best=
 blade is for my miter saw. Should I get the finest tooth blade I can fin=
d or will a 60 tooth 12=22 blade suffice=3F





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--

A gun is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have it,

you'll probably never need one again.



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