Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Plumbing fun

From: Jim Juhas via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2019 10:06:04 -0400

I used PEX on my kitchen remodel in 2011. Maybe I didn't know any better but I used the crimp rings on hot and cold sides, run to the icemaker, feed to dishwasher. Everything is still intact. Only downside is that PEX under the sink isn't as pretty as copper.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jul 30, 2019, at 9:35 PM, Jim Stone via Shop-talk <[email-masked]> wrote:
> 
> The union in the photograph doesn’t look terrible to me.  I’ve certainly successfully worked with worse.  If only to buy you some time, it can’t hurt to wrap a couple of extra turns of teflon tape around the new fitting - or goober it up with pipe dope - and see if it works.
> 
> That isn’t to say that a re-plumb isn’t in your future. The clogged pipe looks pretty scary.  I haven’t worked much with PEX, but have watched plumbers using it and am pretty impressed.  None of the pros seem to use crimpers for their connections, and they tell me they don’t trust crimped connections.  They use something like this: https://www.amazon.com/Milwaukee-2432-22-12-Volt-Propex-Expansion/dp/B0048EJX7U/ref=sr_1_1?crid=20YNES0KKJ2KB&keywords=milwaukee+pex+expander+tool&qid=1564536668&s=hi&sprefix=Milwaukee+pex%2Ctools%2C127&sr=1-1.  There are manual versions of this for sale, but I am sure this is the way to go if you are doing a fair amount of work. 
> 
> I have also been told by professionals that Shark Bite fittings are really good.  They are expensive if you are doing a lot of work, but a good way connecting PEX to other forms of pipe.
> 
> Jim
> 
>> On Jul 30, 2019, at 9:01 PM, Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk <[email-masked]> wrote:
>> 
>> So I cut out enough sheetrock to get some wrenching room, got the old pipes out without too much trouble.  I sprayed a few of the joints with WD40 a few times, maybe that helped, maybe it didn't.
>> 
>> 
>> So now the question is can I get the sealing face that rusty old union cleaned up enough to get a good seal, or am I going to have to replace it too, which might mean tearing into the wall in the next room.  Or maybe not.
>> 
>> And then, this project has got me thinking.  It might be my cue to buy a roll of PEX, a cutter and a crimper and start using it to fix this problem and the next one on my list, the washing machine.  At the moment when you select a hot water wash, the machine fills up at a rate of about a gallon a day.  Is it just the fill hose being clogged, or the valve, or the pipes feeding it?  Fun fun fun!
>> 
>> mjb.
>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> 
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From: Pat Horne via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2019 09:52:24 -0500

My understanding is that plumbers use the expansion method of termination because it is easier, faster & cheaper. They also don’t need to stock the crimp rings. 

I plumbed my shop w/apartment (4 sinks, 1 shower, 1 tub, 1 washer, 2 toilets & 2 hose bibs)using PEX & crimp rings. It was cheap & easy. That was a year ago & I have no leaks. 

In my house I used some shark bite connectors on a copper pipe & it started leaking. 

My use is just a single point but it worked fine for me.  YMMV

peace,
Pat

Pat Horne 
We support Habitat for Humanity

On Aug 1, 2019, at 9:06 AM, Jim Juhas via Shop-talk <[email-masked]> wrote:

Sent from my iPhone

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From: "Tim . via Shop-talk" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2019 17:54:50 +0000

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We recently changed insurance companies for home and auto. The home basical=
ly came along with the auto to get an even better discount than auto alone.

Anyway, I was told by the agent that the home insurance company would have =
denied us coverage if I had any pex in my house.

Has anyone heard of this? I though pex was the latest and greatest.....

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We recently changed insurance companies for home and auto. The home basical=
ly came along with the auto to get an even better discount than auto alone.=
&nbsp;</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;=
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<br>
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Anyway, I was told by the agent that the home insurance company would have =
denied us coverage if I had any pex in my house.&nbsp;</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;=
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<br>
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<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;=
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Has anyone heard of this? I though pex was the latest and greatest.....</di=
v>
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[email-masked]

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From: John Miller via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2019 11:26:49 -0700

> Anyway, I was told by the agent that the home insurance company would 
> have denied us coverage if I had any pex in my house.
>
PEX, or the earlier plastics?

Some of the earlier stuff is a disaster waiting to happen, but my 
understanding is that PEX is pretty much accepted under UPC everywhere.

John.

[email-masked]

---

From: David Scheidt via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2019 15:45:54 -0500

> My understanding is that plumbers use the expansion method of termination because it is easier, faster & cheaper. They also don’t need to stock the crimp rings.

There are other advantages, for one expansion fittings are closer to
full flow.  It also requires good quality tubing (pex-a), and not the
cheap stuff on offer at the borg. It's also possible to tell visually
inspect the joint and see that the fitting is properly installed.  The
joints also tend to get stronger over time,as the pex wants to
contract to its original diameter, so it grabs tighter on the fitting.
Expansion fittings do require an expansion ring, so they do have extra
parts to stock.

-- 
David Scheidt
[email-masked]

[email-masked]

---

From: Ian McFetridge via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 2 Aug 2019 08:04:09 -0400

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My house has some of these fittings that I had never seen before:
https://www.milwaukeetool.com/Products/Power-Tools/Plumbing-Installation/Pr=
ess-Tools
They're thicker than normal fittings and have an o-ring that is clamped
down on the pipe to form a seal.   I've not seen leaks at any of them, but
I wonder how that o-ring will age (hoping it is something more stable than
natural rubber!)  They're kind of like a hybrid of the pex crimping, but on
copper

On Thu, Aug 1, 2019 at 4:46 PM David Scheidt via Shop-talk <
[email-masked]> wrote:

> > My understanding is that plumbers use the expansion method of
> termination because it is easier, faster & cheaper. They also don=E2=80=
=99t need to
> stock the crimp rings.
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr">My house has some of these fittings that I had never seen =
before:=C2=A0=C2=A0

<a href=3D"https://www.milwaukeetool.com/Products/Power-Tools/Plumbing-Inst=
allation/Press-Tools">https://www.milwaukeetool.com/Products/Power-Tools/Pl=
umbing-Installation/Press-Tools</a><div>They&#39;re thicker than normal fit=
tings and have an o-ring that is clamped down on the pipe to form a seal.=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0I&#39;ve not seen leaks at any of them, but I wonder how that =
o-ring will age (hoping it is something more stable than natural rubber!)=
=C2=A0 They&#39;re kind of like a hybrid of the pex crimping, but on copper=
</div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_=
attr">On Thu, Aug 1, 2019 at 4:46 PM David Scheidt via Shop-talk &lt;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrot=
e:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0=
.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">On Thu, Aug 1=
, 2019 at 10:00 AM Pat Horne via Shop-talk<br>
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">shop-talk=
@autox.team.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; My understanding is that plumbers use the expansion method of terminat=
ion because it is easier, faster &amp; cheaper. They also don=E2=80=99t nee=
d to stock the crimp rings.<br>
<br>
<br>
There are other advantages, for one expansion fittings are closer to<br>
full flow.=C2=A0 It also requires good quality tubing (pex-a), and not the<=
br>
cheap stuff on offer at the borg. It&#39;s also possible to tell visually<b=
r>
inspect the joint and see that the fitting is properly installed.=C2=A0 The=
<br>
joints also tend to get stronger over time,as the pex wants to<br>
contract to its original diameter, so it grabs tighter on the fitting.<br>
Expansion fittings do require an expansion ring, so they do have extra<br>
parts to stock.<br>
<br>
<br>
-- <br>
David Scheidt<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]=
m</a><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
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et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>
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alk/[email-masked]" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://=
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From: Ronnie Day via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 30 Jul 2019 20:47:52 -0500

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We did our small cabin using primarily pex and the sharkbite push to
connect (PTC) connectors. Yes, individually they're expensive, but we spent
way less than a good crimper would've cost, about 3 years ago when I did
the plumbing lines. They also have the advantage of being more easily
changed than with a crimper. Shower, bathroom and kitchen sinks all grouped
together.

I would not buy rolled pex. It's NOT very flexible. The local plumbing
supply had sticks in 10 and 20 foot lengths and I used a simple hand held
cutter. It worked great. There are plenty of adapters and valves to connect
the pex to threaded pipe and fittings. HD and Lowes started carrying more
of the no traditional options since we did our place.

We're on 10 acres not far from Bryan/College Station and use rainwater
collection so the water is filtered probably better than a well without
extra filtering would be. The whole system has worked out very well.

RD

On Tue, Jul 30, 2019 at 8:17 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk <
[email-masked]> wrote:

> There are screens at the inlets where the hoses connect to the back
> of my washing machine.  When I have this problem, I always find a
> bunch of sediment and debris clogging up the screens.  It is easy to
> check and easy to fix.  Invest ten minutes in checking that before
> you start a major project. These are what I'm talking
> about:
> www.amazon.com/Danco-80070-Washers-Screen-Black/dp/B000KKULR2/ref=sr_1_11
>
> -Steve
>
> At 09:01 PM 7/30/2019, Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk wrote:
>
> >And then, this project has got me thinking.  It might be my cue to
> >buy a roll of PEX, a cutter and a crimper and start using it to fix
> >this problem and the next one on my list, the washing machine.  At
> >the moment when you select a hot water wash, the machine fills up at
> >a rate of about a gallon a day.  Is it just the fill hose being
> >clogged, or the valve, or the pipes feeding it?  Fun fun fun!
> >
> >mjb.
>
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr">We did our small cabin using primarily pex and the sharkbi=
te push to connect (PTC) connectors. Yes, individually they&#39;re expensiv=
e, but we spent way less than a good crimper would&#39;ve cost, about 3 yea=
rs ago when I did the plumbing lines. They also have the advantage of being=
 more easily changed than with a crimper. Shower, bathroom and kitchen sink=
s all grouped together.<div><br></div><div>I would not buy rolled pex. It&#=
39;s NOT very flexible. The local plumbing supply had sticks in 10 and 20 f=
oot lengths and I used a simple hand held cutter. It worked great. There ar=
e plenty of adapters and valves to connect the pex to threaded pipe and fit=
tings. HD and Lowes started carrying more of the no traditional options sin=
ce we did our place.<div><br></div><div>We&#39;re on 10 acres not far from =
Bryan/College Station and use rainwater collection so the water is filtered=
 probably better than a well without extra filtering would be. The whole sy=
stem has worked out very well.</div></div><div><br></div><div>RD</div></div=
><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tu=
e, Jul 30, 2019 at 8:17 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk &lt;<a href=3D"mail=
to:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br></d=
iv><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;bord=
er-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">There are screens at t=
he inlets where the hoses connect to the back <br>
of my washing machine.=C2=A0 When I have this problem, I always find a <br>
bunch of sediment and debris clogging up the screens.=C2=A0 It is easy to <=
br>
check and easy to fix.=C2=A0 Invest ten minutes in checking that before <br=
you start a major project. These are what I&#39;m talking <br>
about: <br>
<a href=3D"http://www.amazon.com/Danco-80070-Washers-Screen-Black/dp/B000KK=
ULR2/ref=3Dsr_1_11" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">www.amazon.com/Dan=
co-80070-Washers-Screen-Black/dp/B000KKULR2/ref=3Dsr_1_11</a><br>
<br>
-Steve<br>
<br>
At 09:01 PM 7/30/2019, Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk wrote:<br>
<br>
&gt;And then, this project has got me thinking.=C2=A0 It might be my cue to=
 <br>
&gt;buy a roll of PEX, a cutter and a crimper and start using it to fix <br=
&gt;this problem and the next one on my list, the washing machine.=C2=A0 At=
 <br>
&gt;the moment when you select a hot water wash, the machine fills up at <b=
r>
&gt;a rate of about a gallon a day.=C2=A0 Is it just the fill hose being <b=
r>
&gt;clogged, or the valve, or the pipes feeding it?=C2=A0 Fun fun fun!<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;mjb.<br>
<br>
<br>
---<br>
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From: John Innis via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2019 10:03:53 -0500

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Our home was built new in 2007 and is 100% PEX with crimp rings.  Not only
have we not had any issues with the PEX, we survived a hard freeze with no
damage and no leaks.  I have never used a shark-bite connector so can't
comment on those, but I am a big fan of PEX now.

On Thu, Aug 1, 2019 at 10:00 AM Pat Horne via Shop-talk <
[email-masked]> wrote:

> My understanding is that plumbers use the expansion method of termination
> because it is easier, faster & cheaper. They also don=E2=80=99t need to s=
tock the
> crimp rings.
>
> I plumbed my shop w/apartment (4 sinks, 1 shower, 1 tub, 1 washer, 2
> toilets & 2 hose bibs)using PEX & crimp rings. It was cheap & easy. That
> was a year ago & I have no leaks.
>
> I used PEX on my kitchen remodel in 2011. Maybe I didn't know any better
> but I used the crimp rings on hot and cold sides, run to the icemaker, fe=
ed
> to dishwasher. Everything is still intact. Only downside is that PEX unde=
r
> the sink isn't as pretty as copper.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > The union in the photograph doesn=E2=80=99t look terrible to me.  I=E2=
=80=99ve certainly
> successfully worked with worse.  If only to buy you some time, it can=E2=
=80=99t
> hurt to wrap a couple of extra turns of teflon tape around the new fittin=
g
> - or goober it up with pipe dope - and see if it works.
> >
> > That isn=E2=80=99t to say that a re-plumb isn=E2=80=99t in your future.=
 The clogged pipe
> looks pretty scary.  I haven=E2=80=99t worked much with PEX, but have wat=
ched
> plumbers using it and am pretty impressed.  None of the pros seem to use
> crimpers for their connections, and they tell me they don=E2=80=99t trust=
 crimped
> connections.  They use something like this:
> https://www.amazon.com/Milwaukee-2432-22-12-Volt-Propex-Expansion/dp/B004=
8EJX7U/ref=3Dsr_1_1?crid=3D20YNES0KKJ2KB&keywords=3Dmilwaukee+pex+expander+=
tool&qid=3D1564536668&s=3Dhi&sprefix=3DMilwaukee+pex%2Ctools%2C127&sr=3D1-1=
.
> There are manual versions of this for sale, but I am sure this is the way
> to go if you are doing a fair amount of work.
> >
> > I have also been told by professionals that Shark Bite fittings are
> really good.  They are expensive if you are doing a lot of work, but a go=
od
> way connecting PEX to other forms of pipe.
> >
> > Jim
> >
> >> So I cut out enough sheetrock to get some wrenching room, got the old
> pipes out without too much trouble.  I sprayed a few of the joints with
> WD40 a few times, maybe that helped, maybe it didn't.
> >>
> >>
> >> So now the question is can I get the sealing face that rusty old union
> cleaned up enough to get a good seal, or am I going to have to replace it
> too, which might mean tearing into the wall in the next room.  Or maybe n=
ot.
> >>
> >> And then, this project has got me thinking.  It might be my cue to buy
> a roll of PEX, a cutter and a crimper and start using it to fix this
> problem and the next one on my list, the washing machine.  At the moment
> when you select a hot water wash, the machine fills up at a rate of about=
 a
> gallon a day.  Is it just the fill hose being clogged, or the valve, or t=
he
> pipes feeding it?  Fun fun fun!
> >>
> >> mjb.
> >>
> >>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]
> >>
> >
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]
> >
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]
>
>
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]
>
>

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=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=3D Never offend people with style when you   =3D
=3D can offend with substance --- Sam Brown  =3D
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=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

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<div dir=3D"ltr">Our home was built new in 2007 and is 100% PEX with crimp =
rings.=C2=A0 Not only have we not had any issues with the PEX, we survived =
a hard freeze with no damage and no leaks.=C2=A0 I have never used a shark-=
bite connector so can&#39;t comment on those, but I am a big fan of PEX now=
.<br></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_a=
ttr">On Thu, Aug 1, 2019 at 10:00 AM Pat Horne via Shop-talk &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<b=
r></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex=
;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">My understanding =
is that plumbers use the expansion method of termination because it is easi=
er, faster &amp; cheaper. They also don=E2=80=99t need to stock the crimp r=
ings. <br>
<br>
I plumbed my shop w/apartment (4 sinks, 1 shower, 1 tub, 1 washer, 2 toilet=
s &amp; 2 hose bibs)using PEX &amp; crimp rings. It was cheap &amp; easy. T=
hat was a year ago &amp; I have no leaks. <br>
<br>
In my house I used some shark bite connectors on a copper pipe &amp; it sta=
rted leaking. <br>
<br>
My use is just a single point but it worked fine for me.=C2=A0 YMMV<br>
<br>
peace,<br>
Pat<br>
<br>
Pat Horne <br>
We support Habitat for Humanity<br>
<br>
<br>
On Aug 1, 2019, at 9:06 AM, Jim Juhas via Shop-talk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:s=
[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</a>&gt;=
 wrote:<br>
<br>
I used PEX on my kitchen remodel in 2011. Maybe I didn&#39;t know any bette=
r but I used the crimp rings on hot and cold sides, run to the icemaker, fe=
ed to dishwasher. Everything is still intact. Only downside is that PEX und=
er the sink isn&#39;t as pretty as copper.<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone<br>
<br>
&gt; On Jul 30, 2019, at 9:35 PM, Jim Stone via Shop-talk &lt;<a href=3D"ma=
ilto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">[email-masked]</=
a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; The union in the photograph doesn=E2=80=99t look terrible to me.=C2=A0=
 I=E2=80=99ve certainly successfully worked with worse.=C2=A0 If only to bu=
y you some time, it can=E2=80=99t hurt to wrap a couple of extra turns of t=
eflon tape around the new fitting - or goober it up with pipe dope - and se=
e if it works.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; That isn=E2=80=99t to say that a re-plumb isn=E2=80=99t in your future=
. The clogged pipe looks pretty scary.=C2=A0 I haven=E2=80=99t worked much =
with PEX, but have watched plumbers using it and am pretty impressed.=C2=A0=
 None of the pros seem to use crimpers for their connections, and they tell=
 me they don=E2=80=99t trust crimped connections.=C2=A0 They use something =
like this: <a href=3D"https://www.amazon.com/Milwaukee-2432-22-12-Volt-Prop=
ex-Expansion/dp/B0048EJX7U/ref=3Dsr_1_1?crid=3D20YNES0KKJ2KB&amp;keywords=
=3Dmilwaukee+pex+expander+tool&amp;qid=3D1564536668&amp;s=3Dhi&amp;sprefix=
=3DMilwaukee+pex%2Ctools%2C127&amp;sr=3D1-1" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_=
blank">https://www.amazon.com/Milwaukee-2432-22-12-Volt-Propex-Expansion/dp=
/B0048EJX7U/ref=3Dsr_1_1?crid=3D20YNES0KKJ2KB&amp;keywords=3Dmilwaukee+pex+=
expander+tool&amp;qid=3D1564536668&amp;s=3Dhi&amp;sprefix=3DMilwaukee+pex%2=
Ctools%2C127&amp;sr=3D1-1</a>.=C2=A0 There are manual versions of this for =
sale, but I am sure this is the way to go if you are doing a fair amount of=
 work. <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; I have also been told by professionals that Shark Bite fittings are re=
ally good.=C2=A0 They are expensive if you are doing a lot of work, but a g=
ood way connecting PEX to other forms of pipe.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Jim<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt; On Jul 30, 2019, at 9:01 PM, Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">shop-talk@autox.=
team.net</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt; So I cut out enough sheetrock to get some wrenching room, got the =
old pipes out without too much trouble.=C2=A0 I sprayed a few of the joints=
 with WD40 a few times, maybe that helped, maybe it didn&#39;t.<br>
&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt; So now the question is can I get the sealing face that rusty old u=
nion cleaned up enough to get a good seal, or am I going to have to replace=
 it too, which might mean tearing into the wall in the next room.=C2=A0 Or =
maybe not.<br>
&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt; And then, this project has got me thinking.=C2=A0 It might be my c=
ue to buy a roll of PEX, a cutter and a crimper and start using it to fix t=
his problem and the next one on my list, the washing machine.=C2=A0 At the =
moment when you select a hot water wash, the machine fills up at a rate of =
about a gallon a day.=C2=A0 Is it just the fill hose being clogged, or the =
valve, or the pipes feeding it?=C2=A0 Fun fun fun!<br>
&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt; mjb.<br>
&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt; &lt;20190730_183454.jpg&gt;_______________________________________=
________<br>
&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt; <a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">Shop=
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&gt; <br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
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<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" target=3D"_blank">Shop-talk@aut=
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et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>
Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk" rel=3D"norefer=
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alk/[email-masked]" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://auto=
x.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]</a><br>
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Archive: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk" rel=3D"norefer=
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alk/[email-masked]" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.te=
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<br>
</blockquote></div><br clear=3D"all"><br>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"g=
mail_signature">=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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style when you=C2=A0=C2=A0 =3D<br>=3D can offend with substance --- Sam Bro=
wn=C2=A0 =3D<br>=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
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[email-masked]

--===============8896027546901711632==--

---

From: jamesf--- via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 01 Aug 2019 16:50:51 +0100

At least here in Boston, everyone is using crimp rings. No one is using 
the expansion rings anymore and they are getting increasingly difficult 
to find. I sold my expander to a guy who'd been looking all over for one 
as he had a stash of expansion rings.

I have used Sharkbite without issues, but the surface needs to be 
exceptionally smooth; hard to do if you have a solder drip or can't get 
in there with emery cloth to fully clean it up. .

jim

On 2019-08-01 15:52, Pat Horne via Shop-talk wrote:
> termination because it is easier, faster & cheaper. They also don’t
> need to stock the crimp rings.
> 
> toilets & 2 hose bibs)using PEX & crimp rings. It was cheap & easy.
> That was a year ago & I have no leaks.
> 
> I used PEX on my kitchen remodel in 2011. Maybe I didn't know any
> better but I used the crimp rings on hot and cold sides, run to the
> icemaker, feed to dishwasher. Everything is still intact. Only
> downside is that PEX under the sink isn't as pretty as copper.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> The union in the photograph doesn’t look terrible to me.  I’ve 
>> certainly successfully worked with worse.  If only to buy you some 
>> time, it can’t hurt to wrap a couple of extra turns of teflon tape 
>> around the new fitting - or goober it up with pipe dope - and see if 
>> it works.
>> 
>> That isn’t to say that a re-plumb isn’t in your future. The clogged 
>> pipe looks pretty scary.  I haven’t worked much with PEX, but have 
>> watched plumbers using it and am pretty impressed.  None of the pros 
>> seem to use crimpers for their connections, and they tell me they 
>> don’t trust crimped connections.  They use something like this: 
>> https://www.amazon.com/Milwaukee-2432-22-12-Volt-Propex-Expansion/dp/B0048EJX7U/ref=sr_1_1?crid=20YNES0KKJ2KB&keywords=milwaukee+pex+expander+tool&qid=1564536668&s=hi&sprefix=Milwaukee+pex%2Ctools%2C127&sr=1-1. 
>>  There are manual versions of this for sale, but I am sure this is the 
>> way to go if you are doing a fair amount of work.
>> 
>> really good.  They are expensive if you are doing a lot of work, but a 
>> good way connecting PEX to other forms of pipe.
>> 
>> Jim
>> 
>>> pipes out without too much trouble.  I sprayed a few of the joints 
>>> with WD40 a few times, maybe that helped, maybe it didn't.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> So now the question is can I get the sealing face that rusty old 
>>> union cleaned up enough to get a good seal, or am I going to have to 
>>> replace it too, which might mean tearing into the wall in the next 
>>> room.  Or maybe not.
>>> 
> http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]

[email-masked]

---

From: "Tim . via Shop-talk" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 1 Aug 2019 19:38:11 +0000

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Guy definitely  asked about PEX. I think I'll call them back for clarificat=
ion and a "WTF?".

________________________________
From: Shop-talk <[email-masked]> on behalf of Tim . via S=
hop-talk <[email-masked]>
Sent: Thursday, August 1, 2019 12:54 PM
To: [email-masked] <[email-masked]>; Jim Juhas <james.f=
[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] PEX.....was Plumbing fun

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<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-=
1">
<style type=3D"text/css" style=3D"display:none;"> P {margin-top:0;margin-bo=
ttom:0;} </style>
</head>
<body dir=3D"ltr">
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;=
 color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Guy definitely&nbsp; asked about PEX. I think I'll call them back for clari=
fication and a &quot;WTF?&quot;.</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;=
 color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<br>
</div>
<div>
<div id=3D"appendonsend"></div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; col=
or:rgb(0,0,0)">
<br>
</div>
<hr tabindex=3D"-1" style=3D"display:inline-block; width:98%">
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif" co=
lor=3D"#000000" style=3D"font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Shop-talk &lt;shop-ta=
[email-masked]&gt; on behalf of Tim . via Shop-talk &lt;shop-tal=
[email-masked]&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, August 1, 2019 12:54 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> [email-masked] &lt;[email-masked]&gt;; Jim J=
uhas &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Shop-talk] PEX.....was Plumbing fun</font>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
</div>
<div dir=3D"ltr">
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; col=
or:rgb(0,0,0)">
We recently changed insurance companies for home and auto. The home basical=
ly came along with the auto to get an even better discount than auto alone.=
&nbsp;</div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; col=
or:rgb(0,0,0)">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; col=
or:rgb(0,0,0)">
Anyway, I was told by the agent that the home insurance company would have =
denied us coverage if I had any pex in my house.&nbsp;</div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; col=
or:rgb(0,0,0)">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; col=
or:rgb(0,0,0)">
Has anyone heard of this? I though pex was the latest and greatest.....</di=
v>
<div>
<div id=3D"x_appendonsend"></div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; col=
or:rgb(0,0,0)">
<br>
</div>
<div class=3D"x_BodyFragment"><font size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:11p=
t">
<div class=3D"x_PlainText"><br>
</div>
</span></font></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</body>
</html>

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[email-masked]

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---

From: Jim Stone via Shop-talk <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 4 Aug 2019 19:28:49 -0400

--===============2559454425427804691==
	boundary="Apple-Mail=_B78772CC-5C5B-41C1-9141-07B508DA3D20"

--Apple-Mail=_B78772CC-5C5B-41C1-9141-07B508DA3D20
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
	charset=utf-8

I=E2=80=99ve had good experience with SharkBite fittings, but one thing =
I don=E2=80=99t like about them is the fact that they allow the fitting =
to rotate after installation.  The first time I used them was to put =
shut off valves on a bathroom sink (the plumber was only responsible for =
the rough-in work).  They are leak-free 2 years on, but I don=E2=80=99t =
like the fact that the valves can rotate when you use them.  Since then, =
I=E2=80=99ve tried to design any other SharkBite uses such that =
everything is locked down when done.

> On Jul 30, 2019, at 9:47 PM, Ronnie Day via Shop-talk =
<[email-masked]> wrote:
>=20
> We did our small cabin using primarily pex and the sharkbite push to =
connect (PTC) connectors. Yes, individually they're expensive, but we =
spent way less than a good crimper would've cost, about 3 years ago when =
I did the plumbing lines. They also have the advantage of being more =
easily changed than with a crimper. Shower, bathroom and kitchen sinks =
all grouped together.
>=20
> I would not buy rolled pex. It's NOT very flexible. The local plumbing =
supply had sticks in 10 and 20 foot lengths and I used a simple hand =
held cutter. It worked great. There are plenty of adapters and valves to =
connect the pex to threaded pipe and fittings. HD and Lowes started =
carrying more of the no traditional options since we did our place.
>=20
> We're on 10 acres not far from Bryan/College Station and use rainwater =
collection so the water is filtered probably better than a well without =
extra filtering would be. The whole system has worked out very well.
>=20
> RD
>=20
> On Tue, Jul 30, 2019 at 8:17 PM Steven Trovato via Shop-talk =
> There are screens at the inlets where the hoses connect to the back=20
> of my washing machine.  When I have this problem, I always find a=20
> bunch of sediment and debris clogging up the screens.  It is easy to=20=

> check and easy to fix.  Invest ten minutes in checking that before=20
> you start a major project. These are what I'm talking=20
> about:=20
> =
www.amazon.com/Danco-80070-Washers-Screen-Black/dp/B000KKULR2/ref=3Dsr_1_1=
1 =
<http://www.amazon.com/Danco-80070-Washers-Screen-Black/dp/B000KKULR2/ref=3D=
sr_1_11>
>=20
>=20
>=20
> >And then, this project has got me thinking.  It might be my cue to=20
> >buy a roll of PEX, a cutter and a crimper and start using it to fix=20=

> >this problem and the next one on my list, the washing machine.  At=20
> >the moment when you select a hot water wash, the machine fills up at=20=

> >a rate of about a gallon a day.  Is it just the fill hose being=20
>=20
>=20
> https://www.avast.com/antivirus <https://www.avast.com/antivirus>
>=20
>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html =
<http://www.team.net/donate.html>
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk =
<http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk> http://autox.team.net/archive =
<http://autox.team.net/archive>
>=20
> Unsubscribe/Manage: =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked] =
<http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]>
>=20
>=20
> Archive: http://www.team.net/pipermail/shop-talk =
http://autox.team.net/archive
>=20
> Unsubscribe/Manage: =
>=20

--Apple-Mail=_B78772CC-5C5B-41C1-9141-07B508DA3D20
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
	charset=utf-8

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">I=E2=80=99ve had good experience with SharkBite fittings, but =
one thing I don=E2=80=99t like about them is the fact that they allow =
the fitting to rotate after installation. &nbsp;The first time I used =
them was to put shut off valves on a bathroom sink (the plumber was only =
responsible for the rough-in work). &nbsp;They are leak-free 2 years on, =
but I don=E2=80=99t like the fact that the valves can rotate when you =
use them. &nbsp;Since then, I=E2=80=99ve tried to design any other =
SharkBite uses such that everything is locked down when done.<br =
class=3D""><div><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Jul 30, 2019, at 9:47 PM, Ronnie Day via Shop-talk &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div dir=3D"ltr" =
class=3D"">We did our small cabin using primarily pex and the sharkbite =
push to connect (PTC) connectors. Yes, individually they're expensive, =
but we spent way less than a good crimper would've cost, about 3 years =
ago when I did the plumbing lines. They also have the advantage of being =
more easily changed than with a crimper. Shower, bathroom and kitchen =
sinks all grouped together.<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">I would not buy rolled pex. It's NOT very flexible. The local =
plumbing supply had sticks in 10 and 20 foot lengths and I used a simple =
hand held cutter. It worked great. There are plenty of adapters and =
valves to connect the pex to threaded pipe and fittings. HD and Lowes =
started carrying more of the no traditional options since we did our =
place.<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">We're on 10 =
acres not far from Bryan/College Station and use rainwater collection so =
the water is filtered probably better than a well without extra =
filtering would be. The whole system has worked out very =
well.</div></div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">RD</div></div><br class=3D""><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div =
dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Tue, Jul 30, 2019 at 8:17 PM Steven =
Trovato via Shop-talk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" =
class=3D"">[email-masked]</a>&gt; wrote:<br =
class=3D""></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px =
0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid =
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">There are screens at the inlets where =
the hoses connect to the back <br class=3D"">
of my washing machine.&nbsp; When I have this problem, I always find a =
<br class=3D"">
bunch of sediment and debris clogging up the screens.&nbsp; It is easy =
to <br class=3D"">
check and easy to fix.&nbsp; Invest ten minutes in checking that before =
<br class=3D"">
you start a major project. These are what I'm talking <br class=3D"">
about: <br class=3D"">
<a =
href=3D"http://www.amazon.com/Danco-80070-Washers-Screen-Black/dp/B000KKUL=
R2/ref=3Dsr_1_11" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank" =
class=3D"">www.amazon.com/Danco-80070-Washers-Screen-Black/dp/B000KKULR2/r=
ef=3Dsr_1_11</a><br class=3D"">
<br class=3D"">
-Steve<br class=3D"">
<br class=3D"">
At 09:01 PM 7/30/2019, Mark J Bradakis via Shop-talk wrote:<br class=3D"">=

<br class=3D"">
&gt;And then, this project has got me thinking.&nbsp; It might be my cue =
to <br class=3D"">
&gt;buy a roll of PEX, a cutter and a crimper and start using it to fix =
<br class=3D"">
&gt;this problem and the next one on my list, the washing machine.&nbsp; =
At <br class=3D"">
&gt;the moment when you select a hot water wash, the machine fills up at =
<br class=3D"">
&gt;a rate of about a gallon a day.&nbsp; Is it just the fill hose being =
<br class=3D"">
&gt;clogged, or the valve, or the pipes feeding it?&nbsp; Fun fun =
fun!<br class=3D"">
&gt;<br class=3D"">
&gt;mjb.<br class=3D"">
<br class=3D"">
<br class=3D"">
---<br class=3D"">
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