From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 1 18:23:47 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 950722585C79 for ; Fri, 1 Jan 2016 18:23:47 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from COL004-OMC3S10.hotmail.com (col004-omc3s10.hotmail.com [65.55.34.148]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 658B7258517B for ; Fri, 1 Jan 2016 18:23:36 -0700 (MST) Received: from na01-bl2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com ([65.55.34.137]) by COL004-OMC3S10.hotmail.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(7.5.7601.23008); Fri, 1 Jan 2016 17:28:23 -0800 Received: from CY1PR13MB0501.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.143) by CY1PR13MB0144.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.162.45.151) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.365.9; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 01:28:22 +0000 Received: from CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.145) by CY1PR13MB0501.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.143) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.365.9; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 01:28:21 +0000 Received: from CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.70.145]) by CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.70.145]) with mapi id 15.01.0365.016; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 01:28:21 +0000 From: "Tim ." To: "Shop Talk" Thread-Topic: water heater anode Thread-Index: AQHRRPxPhdO8lPrkp0yWUvgaKllY5A== Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2016 01:28:21 +0000 Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US header.d=none; autox.team.net; dmarc=none action=none header.from=outlook.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [1mP+frwUF+973++f/Rgvhhba+Hz85FJ1] x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; CY1PR13MB0501; 23:pBl6CB++9YdNXwerIhxd7m/34nM0Tidyi0wfrWoLJ6e5R+L8NweeW9cGIkYWpWyNhNTKVzj1bkqMKFRumibiN0YjlQ2pBvNKWCC5UvT0BhsajklPAEMjuSAXiuvPH3SBQTNtuFW8hli6kviQRzh13UgcD2cb5C2HY+aIclFSM23xtPXWN5ky06rVO+BXPEXcRqOwFl3r4YOPWOuE8KZEow==; 5:N4x3mu8iIjVQOSyjtpG+iVkFL1z5Eu4bSd6RW176s+svEX5bVClvM+XFf/beJjdE4rOMOYCYU2lQuvMzniaaClmUoEg+b0DB/4igNV6vqJ7QkeBpSZdH+4duc99WDOKPXEA9HK60JhIgufj0Vnsdbw==; 24:6Ms+VX/XSuISiO46/z8VNSBzs+PSrQog+a+xRmAHmWoKuOPKjOy/mxFmuv+h/ecOOsHEo/Gq4o2238b6ZaCNDRjJRBVI+zwA+bG5PY7v++Y= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:CY1PR13MB0501; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(432015012)(82015046); SRVR:CY1PR13MB0501; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:CY1PR13MB0501; x-forefront-prvs: 0809C12563 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(7070004)(98900002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1901; SCL:1; SRVR:CY1PR13MB0501; H:CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:23 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM 2:cxSehaMOLxJctAZI28MqfOBRFCXjZaqE0tKITj/5rntycUfXIv1nGMaxw7u8EN1/gvdrBSO+0LLISwgdMohscBPJgd0g8BoT4BcHOnlIV7HwWFGNWFyY7h4Uh9qiKDMdToNEnBn4qQ5Fdlfc61iEUw==; 23:HK43rpblfnjIQ7k49qyvC6VM6JivGhZv04esR5QgitFXpNeqexAU1t8QM81m3OP2MHOMt7iRZbJnR+c6Juf+iNEZAmqvbix7/Po8b6HOefg/oFXFxxso1T8gqTHWUlex4/FWKfj7wSnzO+coFrvHZxaE4nDUSfNFFBATnMTggkw= FILETIME=[DF1EF390:01D144FC] Subject: [Shop-talk] water heater anode Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8481087257241721869== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_CY1PR13MB0503F023355DE6CD1098E845B4F00CY1PR13MB0503namp_" --_000_CY1PR13MB0503F023355DE6CD1098E845B4F00CY1PR13MB0503namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi all, This house we bought has a Richmond electric water heater. I want to check = the anode but there is no hex nut on top. All I see are plastic plugs that,= when pulled, only expose insulation. I looked online and cannot find anything that shows how to do this on this = brand's units. I realize that I am search challenged but looked for quite a= while. I tried to send a message to the company via their website but the site wou= ld not allow me to send the message. Any thoughts or advice? thanks tim --_000_CY1PR13MB0503F023355DE6CD1098E845B4F00CY1PR13MB0503namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi all, 


This house we bought has a Richmond electric water heater. I want to che= ck the anode but there is no hex nut on top. All I see are plastic plugs th= at, when pulled, only expose insulation. 


I looked online and cannot find anything that shows how to do this on th= is brand's units. I realize that I am search challenged but looked for quit= e a while. 


I tried to send a message to the company via their website but the site = would not allow me to send the message. 


Any thoughts or advice? 

thanks

tim

--_000_CY1PR13MB0503F023355DE6CD1098E845B4F00CY1PR13MB0503namp_-- --===============8481087257241721869== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============8481087257241721869==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 1 20:13:51 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79D412585606 for ; Fri, 1 Jan 2016 20:13:51 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.202]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F30142584FFA for ; Fri, 1 Jan 2016 20:12:41 -0700 (MST) Received: from Steve-PC.optonline.net (ool-44c2b54e.dyn.optonline.net [68.194.181.78]) by mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-8.04 (built Feb 28 2007)) with ESMTPA id <0O0B00J0I2H029A0@mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Fri, 01 Jan 2016 22:17:28 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 01 Jan 2016 22:16:55 -0500 From: Steven Trovato To: "Tim ." , Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heater anode Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============0930791930161359292== boundary="Boundary_(ID_/BvxMeksI1bWIBv5a/bNwg)" --Boundary_(ID_/BvxMeksI1bWIBv5a/bNwg) Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT How about calling them? Here's the "contact us" page: http://www.richmondwaterheaters.com/Contact-Richmond-Water-Heaters It says: Customer Service Call Center 7:30am - 5:00pm Central Time Weekdays Phone: 800.621.5622 -Steve At 08:28 PM 1/1/2016, Tim . wrote: >Content-Language: en-US >Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > >boundary="_000_CY1PR13MB0503F023355DE6CD1098E845B4F00CY1PR13MB0503namp_" > >Hi all, > > >This house we bought has a Richmond electric water heater. I want to >check the anode but there is no hex nut on top. All I see are >plastic plugs that, when pulled, only expose insulation. > > >I looked online and cannot find anything that shows how to do this >on this brand's units. I realize that I am search challenged but >looked for quite a while. > > >I tried to send a message to the company via their website but the >site would not allow me to send the message. --Boundary_(ID_/BvxMeksI1bWIBv5a/bNwg) Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT How about calling them?  Here's the "contact us" page:
http://www.richmondwaterheaters.com/Contact-Richmond-Water-Heaters

It says:

Customer Service Call Center
7:30am - 5:00pm Central Time Weekdays
Phone: 800.621.5622

-Steve

At 08:28 PM 1/1/2016, Tim . wrote:
Content-Language: en-US
         boundary="_000_CY1PR13MB0503F023355DE6CD1098E845B4F00CY1PR13MB0503namp_"

Hi all,


This house we bought has a Richmond electric water heater. I want to check the anode but there is no hex nut on top. All I see are plastic plugs that, when pulled, only expose insulation.


I looked online and cannot find anything that shows how to do this on this brand's units. I realize that I am search challenged but looked for quite a while.


I tried to send a message to the company via their website but the site would not allow me to send the message.
--Boundary_(ID_/BvxMeksI1bWIBv5a/bNwg)-- --===============0930791930161359292== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============0930791930161359292==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 1 20:18:01 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B7F72585AD2 for ; Fri, 1 Jan 2016 20:18:01 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from COL004-OMC4S5.hotmail.com (col004-omc4s5.hotmail.com [65.55.34.207]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CA8462585AC7 for ; Fri, 1 Jan 2016 20:17:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from na01-by2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com ([65.55.34.200]) by COL004-OMC4S5.hotmail.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(7.5.7601.23008); Fri, 1 Jan 2016 19:22:44 -0800 Received: from DM3PR20MB0619.namprd20.prod.outlook.com (10.164.250.25) by DM3PR20MB0618.namprd20.prod.outlook.com (10.164.250.24) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.361.13; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 03:22:43 +0000 Received: from DM3PR20MB0619.namprd20.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.250.25]) by DM3PR20MB0619.namprd20.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.250.25]) with mapi id 15.01.0361.006; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 03:22:43 +0000 From: Brian and Wendy To: Shop Talk Thread-Topic: [Shop-talk] water heater anode Thread-Index: AQHRRQxNAQ+jel66+0eBF+8SC3HwiJ7nj4/o Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2016 03:22:42 +0000 References: <0O0B00J0J2H329A0@mta7.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US header.d=none;autox.team.net; dmarc=none action=none header.from=msn.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [Pd53PJLkXApuNkIPpBzaSBC8pNR2LBCv] x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DM3PR20MB0618; 23:/xGWlXjpdfFKnEzuKpAP6ZNmG9RMN018EvGIGy4qdc3dPSufELwxfonjlJuh4QlPEza73UzZ8Eo96M8mQ54XtWoyYxeQfLXuwwbqrPMYcP2zDcswhM3CVCyeMvVbVG/r6WgiphSZKQ6/9y5yxjd8GZf4DqQJOcjxWj7FVEki4HeWp6TwQba9T0vPeqnSI/ft1NeWEgmcNV1+Axq+H/OrCQ==; 5:iQgEXd1XY0ZUtFGdwX6Gq8mVk2NGWirSWSvcLoHNCZkc8OLOFimF4fRIVE9c6C/UdINJHyM3g8q1WNemDPfF+08Ot3vZmi08JX79K+M1yRgvH6BQZ979n7iSbL5T8n4Gvj5i8Y5WwccRlaJg1bWjBA==; 24:CJVerxxQzFMaW06Dog13H+527YCKJJ7Co4GR5vMBBQQzeL2SmNTScrE+dyuvTttDY56ejaPG8MDP+qFEsPCKS+7gmTXVjADIn/ASlB20rlE= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DM3PR20MB0618; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(432015012)(82015046); SRVR:DM3PR20MB0618; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:DM3PR20MB0618; x-forefront-prvs: 0809C12563 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(7070004)(98900002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1901; SCL:1; SRVR:DM3PR20MB0618; H:DM3PR20MB0619.namprd20.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:23 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM FILETIME=[D84E4FB0:01D1450C] Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heater anode Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============1630805692008486334== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_DM3PR20MB061908B969BF86A13E013DA7BBF00DM3PR20MB0619namp_" --_000_DM3PR20MB061908B969BF86A13E013DA7BBF00DM3PR20MB0619namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I have no personal experience, but I have heard that sometimes the anode is= located inside the water inlet. Maybe if you look at the inlet, you will s= ee an extra hex that would indicate the anode. Brian On January 1, 2016, at 8:18 PM, Steven Trovato wro= te: How about calling them? Here's the "contact us" page: http://www.richmondwaterheaters.com/Contact-Richmond-Water-Heaters It says: Customer Service Call Center 7:30am - 5:00pm Central Time Weekdays Phone: 800.621.5622 -Steve At 08:28 PM 1/1/2016, Tim . wrote: Content-Language: en-US boundary=3D"_000_CY1PR13MB0503F023355DE6CD1098E845B4F00CY1PR13MB05= 03namp_" Hi all, This house we bought has a Richmond electric water heater. I want to check = the anode but there is no hex nut on top. All I see are plastic plugs that,= when pulled, only expose insulation. I looked online and cannot find anything that shows how to do this on this = brand's units. I realize that I am search challenged but looked for quite a= while. I tried to send a message to the company via their website but the site wou= ld not allow me to send the message. --_000_DM3PR20MB061908B969BF86A13E013DA7BBF00DM3PR20MB0619namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I have no personal experience, but I have heard that sometim= es the anode is located inside the water inlet. Maybe if you look at the in= let, you will see an extra hex that would indicate the anode.

Brian



On January 1, 2016, at 8:18 PM, Steven Trovato <strovato@optonline.net&g= t; wrote:
How about calling them?  Here's the "contact us" page:<= br> http://www.richmondwaterheaters.com/Contact-Richmond-Water-Heaters<= br>
It says:

Customer Service Call Center
7:30am - 5:00pm Central Time Weekdays
Phone: 800.621.5622

-Steve

At 08:28 PM 1/1/2016, Tim . wrote:
Content-Language: en-US
         boundary=3D"_000_CY1P= R13MB0503F023355DE6CD1098E845B4F00CY1PR13MB0503namp_"

Hi all,


This house we bought has a Richmond electric water heater. I want to check = the anode but there is no hex nut on top. All I see are plastic plugs that,= when pulled, only expose insulation.


I looked online and cannot find anything that shows how to do this on this = brand's units. I realize that I am search challenged but looked for quite a= while.


I tried to send a message to the company via their website but the site wou= ld not allow me to send the message.
--_000_DM3PR20MB061908B969BF86A13E013DA7BBF00DM3PR20MB0619namp_-- --===============1630805692008486334== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============1630805692008486334==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 2 07:23:15 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A504025852E2 for ; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 07:23:15 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from COL004-OMC3S10.hotmail.com (col004-omc3s10.hotmail.com [65.55.34.148]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F35525852D2 for ; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 07:23:02 -0700 (MST) Received: from na01-by2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com ([65.55.34.135]) by COL004-OMC3S10.hotmail.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(7.5.7601.23008); Sat, 2 Jan 2016 06:27:49 -0800 Received: from CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.145) by CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.145) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.365.9; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 14:27:48 +0000 Received: from CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.70.145]) by CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.70.145]) with mapi id 15.01.0365.016; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 14:27:48 +0000 From: "Tim ." To: "Shop Talk" Thread-Topic: [Shop-talk] water heater anode Thread-Index: AQHRRPxPhdO8lPrkp0yWUvgaKllY5J7nqXMAgACeCB6AAAHqlA== Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2016 14:27:48 +0000 References: , , Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US header.d=none; autox.team.net; dmarc=none action=none header.from=outlook.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [CLgXaZv3FpyiJOS7erak/mVvewUq9b4X] x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; CY1PR13MB0503; 23:yRsbRYQxXPPrAKhSNwomxsGQJqOKCfePQVXUcPaxqzUjLQ8yk8oxuXxJGFixF5jL5sZTKCPcrE3nRDvALHJmmu1wI6IuDPoXP1nEumrFdOsW1Gxi1UpUao3KTw9Oy0n6Tnn4WBlQSZPZ/jtqkbQcw6Q73429c9dEOby+dLOi+1zHIAlWjhU3IfoUwaHTzBDCb3ijOAzAl6Oxuqvb9l3yDw==; 5:v2xYVYOtgy7q7w4nu+CM/Nao0zBfkVd1tMe7X+1bQU+3s6SOsSXyElma5GTIKQ1+hMQ8KaSlUXzTemj74H0nO/jHspfFPCgaqCcCGNApfx7UQikNJb5ZilyZ/U3ghDdvUgOHQTxXP69VEAw6Gjk7Og==; 24:rWsmt0aTlHDgoAbVkJiKuPT9oXNtl9zhI1cnWhAaNBaJ8wNUU2+JX5Ihomy0G3oxVfHpgSRPxrCv6mWQivW0lRE8/URmyr5prEh1RkYZ5P4= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:CY1PR13MB0503; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(432015012)(82015046); SRVR:CY1PR13MB0503; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:CY1PR13MB0503; x-forefront-prvs: 0809C12563 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(7070004)(98900002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1901; SCL:1; SRVR:CY1PR13MB0503; H:CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:23 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM FILETIME=[C207D1B0:01D14569] Subject: [Shop-talk] Fw: water heater anode Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net "There should also be some documentation online from the Richmond folks that you could read and/or download." The pdf that I downloaded did not have anything for my model number. "it probably is inline with the hot water port" Makes sense but I hope not. This increases the chances of Mr hamfist here breaking something. "Is it possible that if you dig down through the insulation you will come to the tank and a nice hex fitting that leads to the anode?" This seems plausible but the insulation is the kind that, once cured, is pretty hard. I can remove it but it just doesn't seem like this would be the way to access a replaceable part. thanks again everyone! tim _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 2 17:18:26 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 899A82585121 for ; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 17:18:26 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from BLU004-OMC4S34.hotmail.com (blu004-omc4s34.hotmail.com [65.55.111.173]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D79D32584CCE for ; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 17:16:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from na01-bn1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com ([65.55.111.135]) by BLU004-OMC4S34.hotmail.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(7.5.7601.23008); Sat, 2 Jan 2016 16:21:41 -0800 Received: from CY1PR13MB0501.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.143) by CY1PR13MB0410.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.163.239.16) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.365.9; Sun, 3 Jan 2016 00:21:40 +0000 Received: from CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.145) by CY1PR13MB0501.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.143) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.365.9; Sun, 3 Jan 2016 00:21:39 +0000 Received: from CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.70.145]) by CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.70.145]) with mapi id 15.01.0365.016; Sun, 3 Jan 2016 00:21:39 +0000 From: "Tim ." To: "Shop Talk" Thread-Topic: water heater anode revisited Thread-Index: AQHRRbvzerKrZIEDr0G7zz9BaPV1Dw== Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2016 00:21:39 +0000 Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US header.d=none; autox.team.net; dmarc=none action=none header.from=outlook.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [wpHx1tFLCRZLCiKK6kVCChIR3F3X2kPj] x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; CY1PR13MB0501; 23:BbhKLYftzmHmO1k6AIX1djcWFf1lP1CgMGgHXW/tQgrKKfwHltjBnW4DQDpR47zXguPiwUcdPW602tXP89Paj3IdTvMZNVApjlD+Or+UOw40rSg2lp4Z3Lc5P/KryG4LJmbKpxS5YApZl68nQ6cR08lFowhuqJEVqApzdXR9l67d93Jo39eTbktCveJsyrfSGNaOHHukvoW2vwDLuAqh7Q==; 5:sX9ORvt7BbrvnJaYPxsps3uoRYbnu2Owf2YnUYYSd8S7/QF7A12+ofHF6UwV08NABBcFpwEPP38fIuVtImSpYCC6GLqu1aNTZAoSCyq5r/Di9FXdSVbLUG1XDsPNDKBwtOIeKNGOcZaFE89CqRyKeQ==; 24:lqa1WvfVO+g2MiHUlD51Z2en8eZ4J7XaSuQwaqlx1aMWwUb1xYDygZaJ/eKM9bEiVgEJmSwOCwgFQzEDtAKqwpxjOUXTgD8Bjqkm9j9J8aQ= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:CY1PR13MB0501; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(432015012)(82015046); SRVR:CY1PR13MB0501; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:CY1PR13MB0501; x-forefront-prvs: 0810818DA0 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(7070004)(98900002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1901; SCL:1; SRVR:CY1PR13MB0501; H:CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:23 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM 2:O/adfbiZPis5iEDRr0nskSsri6lWN8548RqYZj4PAcD33KXHUJD9XU9POUJ/K/zccMRpm8hPHGgpBtO1YIyG/IeQclqOjp/yzctOPqePn2Bo64Kr/mp9jZp/ixItvJV9SsVfDD2MWLXVVcT70yhQuw==; 23:NHNnenoJgrBKYD0+RbY9pSunPEQ24MAFsB+I7SSbi/9MmBrNn10Q20MI6S3qrSvK7rFxIc9HPZKzM/ce+WW1gfjxMO9cjc3RfGun4hOS3r+8sXllEuX2N6cHTGMeW5mhO69jim/PYv2aWTxOOQVuDLp9ej/daC9V+aLdpfatkmg= FILETIME=[B84F0690:01D145BC] Subject: [Shop-talk] water heater anode revisited Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5320998908747292569== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_CY1PR13MB050373E5F1BFE5DBF19A748DB4F10CY1PR13MB0503namp_" --_000_CY1PR13MB050373E5F1BFE5DBF19A748DB4F10CY1PR13MB0503namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Today I dug out close to three inches of hard-ish insulation and exposed a = hex nut in one of the holes. My longest impact socket sticks out of the hol= e about an inch. Great frelling design. Anyway, I have a young neighbor, mid 20s, Sgt in the army, great shape, str= ong, etc. He was holding the tank and I was using a four foot pipe on the w= rench and the nut still didn't budge. (I was moving the tank.) Soooooo, any further suggestions? I think I have enough air hose to get fro= m my detached garage to the basement. Should I try an impact wrench? I hesi= tate to encourage my hamfist gene..... Thanks guys tim --_000_CY1PR13MB050373E5F1BFE5DBF19A748DB4F10CY1PR13MB0503namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Today I dug out close to three inches of hard-ish insulation and exposed= a hex nut in one of the holes. My longest impact socket sticks out of the = hole about an inch. Great frelling design. 


Anyway, I have a young neighbor, mid 20s, Sgt in the army, great sh= ape, strong, etc. He was holding the tank and I was using a four foot = pipe on the wrench and the nut still didn't budge. (I was moving the tank.)=  


Soooooo, any further suggestions? I think I have enough air hose to get = from my detached garage to the basement. Should I try an impact wrench? I h= esitate to encourage my hamfist gene.....


Thanks guys

tim

--_000_CY1PR13MB050373E5F1BFE5DBF19A748DB4F10CY1PR13MB0503namp_-- --===============5320998908747292569== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============5320998908747292569==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 2 18:33:39 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8701325856AF for ; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 18:33:39 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from cdptpa-oedge-vip.email.rr.com (cdptpa-outbound-snat.email.rr.com [107.14.166.228]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D5BC2585A98 for ; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 18:30:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from [172.248.153.253] ([172.248.153.253:3723] helo=rypc) by cdptpa-oedge02 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.0.35861 r(Momo-dev:tip)) with ESMTP id 94/AF-14215-1DA78865; Sun, 03 Jan 2016 01:35:14 +0000 From: "Randall" To: "'Tim .'" , "'Shop Talk'" Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2016 17:35:15 -0800 Thread-Index: AQHRRbvzerKrZIEDr0G7zz9BaPV1D57pAkwQ Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heater anode revisited Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > Soooooo, any further suggestions? Replace it with a better made heater? You could even make sure the drain pan works, and wait until it starts to leak ... -- Randall _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 2 18:40:39 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A6512585E0B for ; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 18:40:39 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.212]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07D492585DEE for ; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 18:40:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from Steve-PC.optonline.net (ool-44c2b54e.dyn.optonline.net [68.194.181.78]) by mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-9.20 (built Jul 15 2010)) with ESMTPA id <0O0C00EBWSVLO450@mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Sat, 02 Jan 2016 20:45:21 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 02 Jan 2016 20:44:04 -0500 From: Steven Trovato To: "Tim ." , Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heater anode revisited Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tim, Well, first I'll repeat my earlier advice. Call the customer service 800 number. Beyond that, how old is this water heater? There is usually a date on a plate somewhere. Sometimes you are better leaving well enough alone and just replacing the heater when it fails. I know there are benefits to maintaining a good anode. You just don't want your good intentions to result in having to replace the water heater now. Ultimately it is a judgment call based on what you are seeing and how much risk you want to take. -Steve At 07:21 PM 1/2/2016, Tim . wrote: >Content-Language: en-US >Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > >boundary="_000_CY1PR13MB050373E5F1BFE5DBF19A748DB4F10CY1PR13MB0503namp_" > >Today I dug out close to three inches of hard-ish insulation and >exposed a hex nut in one of the holes. My longest impact socket >sticks out of the hole about an inch. Great frelling design. > > >Anyway, I have a young neighbor, mid 20s, Sgt in the army, great >shape, strong, etc. He was holding the tank and I was using a four >foot pipe on the wrench and the nut still didn't budge. (I was >moving the tank.) > > >Soooooo, any further suggestions? I think I have enough air hose to >get from my detached garage to the basement. Should I try an impact >wrench? I hesitate to encourage my hamfist gene..... _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 2 20:25:59 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A24F25852CA for ; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 20:25:59 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from haybaler.sackheads.org (haybaler.sackheads.org [136.248.123.228]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28993258523F for ; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 20:25:45 -0700 (MST) Received: from localhost (localhost.sackheads.org [127.0.0.1]) by haybaler.sackheads.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4065F28625 for ; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 22:30:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from haybaler.sackheads.org ([136.248.123.228]) by localhost (haybaler.sackheads.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YE+54i7J9Wbk for ; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 22:30:32 -0500 (EST) Received: by haybaler.sackheads.org (Postfix, from userid 65534) id ED17028607; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 22:30:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from [10.0.1.14] (cpe-74-138-152-195.kya.res.rr.com [74.138.152.195]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jimmie@sackheads.org) by haybaler.sackheads.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADDA8285A7 for ; Sat, 2 Jan 2016 22:30:31 -0500 (EST) To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: From: Jimmie Mayfield Date: Sat, 2 Jan 2016 22:30:30 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.4.0 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] water heater anode revisited Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============4980492508878375758== boundary="------------030106030109070405060200" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------030106030109070405060200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Any chance it was left-handed threads? On 01/02/16 19:21, Tim . wrote: > > Today I dug out close to three inches of hard-ish insulation and > exposed a hex nut in one of the holes. My longest impact socket sticks > out of the hole about an inch. Great frelling design. > > > Anyway, I have a young neighbor, mid 20s, Sgt in the army, great > shape, strong, etc. He was holding the tank and I was using a four > foot pipe on the wrench and the nut still didn't budge. (I was moving > the tank.) > > > Soooooo, any further suggestions? I think I have enough air hose to > get from my detached garage to the basement. Should I try an impact > wrench? I hesitate to encourage my hamfist gene..... > > > Thanks guys > > tim > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/mayfield+shoptalk@sackheads.org > --------------030106030109070405060200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Any chance it was left-handed threads?

On 01/02/16 19:21, Tim . wrote:

Today I dug out close to three inches of hard-ish insulation and exposed a hex nut in one of the holes. My longest impact socket sticks out of the hole about an inch. Great frelling design. 


Anyway, I have a young neighbor, mid 20s, Sgt in the army, great shape, strong, etc. He was holding the tank and I was using a four foot pipe on the wrench and the nut still didn't budge. (I was moving the tank.) 


Soooooo, any further suggestions? I think I have enough air hose to get from my detached garage to the basement. Should I try an impact wrench? I hesitate to encourage my hamfist gene.....


Thanks guys

tim



_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums

--------------030106030109070405060200-- --===============4980492508878375758== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============4980492508878375758==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 5 18:13:23 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D90222587647 for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 18:13:23 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from nov-007-i609.relay.mailchannels.net (nov-007-i609.relay.mailchannels.net [46.232.183.163]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5CB7258754B for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 18:13:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from relay.mailchannels.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A985710080C for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 01:17:58 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ibis.arvixe.com (ip-10-220-9-73.us-west-2.compute.internal [10.220.9.73]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id F256A1008B9 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 01:17:57 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ibis.arvixe.com (ibis.arvixe.com [10.132.137.241]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384) by 0.0.0.0:2500 (trex/5.6.1); Wed, 06 Jan 2016 01:17:58 +0000 Received: from [166.175.189.97] (port=5841 helo=[192.168.1.154]) by ibis.arvixe.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1aGchT-0003ql-39 for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Tue, 05 Jan 2016 17:15:43 -0800 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net From: Matt Wehland Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2016 19:17:55 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.0 Subject: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net The Left rear Caliper on my 2006 Hyundai Elantra has been giving me fits. It is not releasing enough. I am on at least my third replacement (Autozone, I know I normally try to buy decent parts) Have changed guide pins (autozone supplied pins are undersized and let the caliper bang around, have real parts store pins that fit, but have tried the undersized ones again also). The caliper seems to move freely before mounting. I have a replacement brake hose but the connection for the brake hose is rusted and now the flare nut is stripped. I will need to cut it off and replace the flare nut and add an extension, kind of a pain as I will have to work back under the car for a good place to splice it in. What should I do next? How do I diagnose this better? Is it possible for the hose to be slightly blocked, allowing pressure to apply the brakes but keeping them from releasing? If the caliper wasn't sliding freely the pad wear should be uneven, last caliper replacement ate a brand new set of pads in less than 2K miles, very even wear on both pads, nothing like I have gotten with stuck pins. Something else in the braking system to look into. Except for replacing the hose I do not know what else to do or even how to trouble shoot this one. Thanks, Matt -- Matt Wehland (815) 295-4533 _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 5 18:27:53 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D79E2587708 for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 18:27:53 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from dogbert2.mail.megageek.com (nj-69-34-94-16.sta.embarqhsd.net [69.34.94.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4391A2587667 for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 18:23:11 -0700 (MST) References: <568C6B43.5010209@littlegrassy.com> To: shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net From: eric@megageek.com Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2016 20:00:12 -0500 01/05/2016 19:59:58, Serialize complete at 01/05/2016 19:59:58 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multipart message in MIME format. --===============8318344894539309053== This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 00081A7385257F32_= I just went through this on an older truck. I had to replace ALL rubber hoses on the system (upstream of that brake.) Once I did, I cut open the hoses to see that they were almost completely collapsed (even thought they looked fine from the outside.) I took pics of them, but I can't find them (I think I deleted them because they didn't come out that well.) I'd start there. Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. Eric P "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson --=_alternative 00081A7385257F32_= I just went through this on an older truck. I had to replace ALL rubber hoses on the system (upstream of that brake.)

Once I did, I cut open the hoses to see that they were almost completely collapsed (even thought they looked fine from the outside.)

I took pics of them, but I can't find them (I think I deleted them because they didn't come out that well.)

I'd start there.


Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem.
Eric P
"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson --=_alternative 00081A7385257F32_=-- --===============8318344894539309053== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============8318344894539309053==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 5 19:13:22 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25C90258538B for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 19:13:22 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ig0-f180.google.com (mail-ig0-f180.google.com [209.85.213.180]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40BCC2585279 for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 19:12:38 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ig0-f180.google.com with SMTP id mw1so24428322igb.1 for ; Tue, 05 Jan 2016 18:17:29 -0800 (PST) d=mcfetridge.org; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=Lsb/wBRjCT4W0DCT6IMTOIvJypnqrtx/2nWFtU3bV1g=; b=eFzpdNljKA3ugMyhldrWw3CXB5wLakZB7jia6i2FSUS7H3AX2CMBRpYcduzmuQMHkn FkOPmSSw/qpA9RJKW+/UpZM3ATJg/K0vhgbq0t6USzs7/VdCwpw7PQ37SE6FFyQCyYlB /diL6SzN5cXzCyxVPFHhgay/MUauXeMb96+is= d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=Lsb/wBRjCT4W0DCT6IMTOIvJypnqrtx/2nWFtU3bV1g=; b=RB4/8oKvkEBjTM+xZ5ZCQC0Nt1zpK7XFwOyJJuGljA3VZEcZ//bgGy7i7KTQHkEcDH 85DMGQ6fnfak83l70N1zLj57KGBpmLgwGiALPQ4rh4s/3wAbnIEirjP6cb8nXb0agh79 OYKBVW2H+YP5LfiLrawe95H0uuWhNRK8PZ3aacdbWxQ3hts7Qo8l38KzpHGV7edbWCmc BduU+w0xJyAGGlGnx0dOse/e6KxK2eFFEE9NhMP0g8JZgt4m2nh0/LFv5N8Ss8Uy8//p AuRg/sO3bRcVooYP06d2xtfg1gFjcQhbczKa3XPqGtP5lLI1/zvPxExRf+jL/BEnJB1y sVDg== 05 Jan 2016 18:17:28 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.107.131.16 with HTTP; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 18:17:28 -0800 (PST) References: <568C6B43.5010209@littlegrassy.com> Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2016 21:17:28 -0500 From: Ian McFetridge To: Matt Wehland Cc: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6125017921082026449== --001a1134145aacf7a20528a0f47c Is the left-rear caliper the furthest from the master cylinder? On my 4Runner (2004) this was the first one that would exhibit sticking (I measured the stickiness by driving around the block and measure the temperature on each rotor with an IR temp gun). All the pins, slides, and eventually the pistons would corrode and drag. I could take the calipers apart, sand, wire-wheel, and lubricate to get them to work again (and lower the relative temperature measured). OR, I found I could bleed the system (carefully/well) and get the far caliper to stop sticking for a while--I think you were going this direction with your logic of a blocked line. Perhaps, air in the lines doesn't allow enough vacuum to retract the piston? Or the bleeding washes out "gunk" (tech term!). Ymmv, Ian --001a1134145aacf7a20528a0f47c Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Is the left-rear caliper the furthest from the m= aster cylinder?=C2=A0 On my 4Runner (2004) this was the first one that woul= d exhibit sticking (I measured the stickiness by driving around the block a= nd measure the temperature on each rotor with an IR temp gun).=C2=A0 All th= e pins, slides, and eventually the pistons would corrode and drag.=C2=A0 I = could take the calipers apart, sand, wire-wheel, and lubricate to get them = to work again (and lower the relative temperature measured).=C2=A0 OR, I fo= und I could bleed the system (carefully/well) and get the far caliper to st= op sticking for a while--I think you were going this direction with your lo= gic of a blocked line.=C2=A0 Perhaps, air in the lines doesn't allow en= ough vacuum to retract the piston?=C2=A0 Or the bleeding washes out "g= unk" (tech term!).=C2=A0

Ymmv,
Ian
--001a1134145aacf7a20528a0f47c-- --===============6125017921082026449== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============6125017921082026449==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 5 19:44:59 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D93F25877FF for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 19:44:59 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ftx-008-i706.relay.mailchannels.net (ftx-008-i706.relay.mailchannels.net [50.61.143.6]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 666ED2586520 for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 19:43:08 -0700 (MST) Received: from relay.mailchannels.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3886B44C5 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 02:47:57 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ibis.arvixe.com (ip-10-213-14-133.us-west-2.compute.internal [10.213.14.133]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 8C8C4460C for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 02:47:56 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ibis.arvixe.com (ibis.arvixe.com [10.244.170.92]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384) by 0.0.0.0:2500 (trex/5.6.1); Wed, 06 Jan 2016 02:47:56 +0000 Received: from [166.175.189.97] (port=9735 helo=[192.168.1.154]) by ibis.arvixe.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1aGe6X-0005mm-G7 for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Tue, 05 Jan 2016 18:45:41 -0800 References: <568C6B43.5010209@littlegrassy.com> To: Shop Talk From: Matt Wehland Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2016 20:47:55 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.0 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Not sure, but I think the passengers side is the furthest. The brake fluid on this car is pretty clean, I flush it every time I change pads or work on it. The rear brake hoses were replaced in the last year or two. I bought front ones, but never put them on. Looks like I will be grabbing the flaring tools and digging up fittings and brake line in the morning so I can replace the brake hose. And replacing the fronts while I am at it. This car has been pretty decent, around 200k on it so far, some repairs alternator, master cylinder, rear suspension, O2's, but nothing that bothered me too bad for 10yrs 200k. But brakes have been a hassle from day 1. I always said that the master cylinder wasn't right, push down on the peddle and the car would start to stop fine, but then you had to keep apply more pedal pressure to keep it stopping. Dealer mechanics said ' it stops fine' And it did if you jammed the brakes, but used normally (and if you had a brain and some give a darn) you could tell something was wrong. That and the fact that it ate REAR brake pads, while the fronts looked fine. Master cylinder finally gave up, put new on in and the car stopped the way it should. Also emergency brake cable (driver side) froze up years ago, causing dragging that caused enough heat to kill the OEM caliper. Add to that pulling the whole rear interior apart looking for a clunking noise, just to finally figure out that the autozone supplied guide pins are too small and allowed the caliper to clunk around. And then getting correct guide pins, lubing them with wheel bearing grease only to find out that the rubber seal on the guide pin was not compatible with the grease. Rubber bushing swelled up like crazy. Not only did it eat the brake pads, but took me forever to get the guide pin out of the housing. Still like the car for what it is, but if I never have to touch the brakes again I would be a happy man. Thanks for the advice and letting me vent. Matt On 1/5/2016 8:17 PM, Ian McFetridge wrote: > Is the left-rear caliper the furthest from the master cylinder? On my > 4Runner (2004) this was the first one that would exhibit sticking (I > measured the stickiness by driving around the block and measure the > temperature on each rotor with an IR temp gun). All the pins, slides, > and eventually the pistons would corrode and drag. I could take the > calipers apart, sand, wire-wheel, and lubricate to get them to work > again (and lower the relative temperature measured). OR, I found I > could bleed the system (carefully/well) and get the far caliper to > stop sticking for a while--I think you were going this direction with > your logic of a blocked line. Perhaps, air in the lines doesn't allow > enough vacuum to retract the piston? Or the bleeding washes out > "gunk" (tech term!). > > Ymmv, > Ian -- Matt Wehland (815) 295-4533 _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 5 19:59:54 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BADAC2587B1E for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 19:59:54 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from smtp.centurylink.net (mail.centurylink.net [205.219.233.9]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F9282587A67 for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 19:59:47 -0700 (MST) X_CMAE_Category: , , a=I0wsP0/ub+0M/VQyKFHlEA==:117 a=I0wsP0/ub+0M/VQyKFHlEA==:17 a=K-v-2zaBAAAA:8 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=xwPayol1AAAA:8 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=iGDEHxs2kU8wz0exsnwA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 Authentication-Results: smtp03.agate.dfw.synacor.com smtp.user=ejrussell@mebtel.net; auth=pass (LOGIN) Received: from [99.194.29.42] ([99.194.29.42:62356] helo=EricJRussellPC) by smtp.centurylink.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.1.37854 r(Momo-dev:3.5.1.0)) with ESMTPA id C9/68-14214-5448C865; Tue, 05 Jan 2016 22:04:38 -0500 From: "Eric J Russell" To: , "Matt Wehland" References: <568C6B43.5010209@littlegrassy.com> Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2016 22:03:20 -0500 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > Is it possible for the hose to be slightly blocked, allowing pressure to > apply the brakes but keeping them from releasing? Yes, the hose can delaminate internally and act like a one-way valve. One way to check is to jack up the axle in question, apply & release the brakes and while noting the drag, crack open the bleed screw. If a little bit of brake fluid is expelled and the drag is noticeably reduced then a faulty hose is likely. Eric Russell Mebane, NC _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 5 20:29:07 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A96092587A2E for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 20:29:07 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ftx-008-i704.relay.mailchannels.net (ftx-008-i704.relay.mailchannels.net [50.61.143.4]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 400FA258516B for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 20:25:35 -0700 (MST) Received: from relay.mailchannels.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A62D169D66 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 03:30:25 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ibis.arvixe.com (ip-10-213-14-133.us-west-2.compute.internal [10.213.14.133]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 90DB7169A16 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 03:30:24 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ibis.arvixe.com (ibis.arvixe.com [10.123.149.232]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384) by 0.0.0.0:2500 (trex/5.6.1); Wed, 06 Jan 2016 03:30:24 +0000 Received: from [166.175.189.97] (port=35389 helo=[192.168.1.154]) by ibis.arvixe.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1aGeld-000GDB-Hr for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Tue, 05 Jan 2016 19:28:09 -0800 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <568C6B43.5010209@littlegrassy.com> From: Matt Wehland Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2016 21:30:23 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.0 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thanks Eric, just the type of advice I was looking for. Just tried it, got a little fluid expelled, but no decrease in drag. Even so, the more I think about it, the more I am leaning towards hoses. Thinking even the fronts could be impacting this, as if they swell/flex too much there might not be enough pressure in the system to retract the caliper. Also the last few times I have done brakes on this car, I have not been able to get as firm a pedal as I wanted. No matter how much nor how many times I bleed the brakes. Probably one of the reasons I bought the front hoses, but I just never got around to putting them on. Good intentions, lazy mechanic. Hopefully replacing all the hoses will bring me some improvement. Just not looking forward to spicing the hard line, not too hard, just never one of my favorite things. And the location/routing of this one is not lending itself to an easy splice. The hyundai was the wifes daily driver, and she works a weird changing schedule, so never had much good down time before. She just got a new car so it is now my second car (again). Need to get it fixed up good enough so I can park my Mustang again and start working on it, lots of TLC needed on that one. Lots needed. Fiscally foolish to even put the money needed into the Mustang, but it was my first new car and I always planned on keeping it until I die. So time to start spending 5k on a 3K car. Matt On 1/5/2016 9:03 PM, Eric J Russell wrote: >> Is it possible for the hose to be slightly blocked, allowing pressure >> to apply the brakes but keeping them from releasing? > > Yes, the hose can delaminate internally and act like a one-way valve. > > One way to check is to jack up the axle in question, apply & release > the brakes and while noting the drag, crack open the bleed screw. If a > little bit of brake fluid is expelled and the drag is noticeably > reduced then a faulty hose is likely. > > Eric Russell > Mebane, NC > > -- Matt Wehland (815) 295-4533 _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 5 21:14:40 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5BA22587768 for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 21:14:40 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from cdptpa-oedge-vip.email.rr.com (cdptpa-outbound-snat.email.rr.com [107.14.166.228]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F16C3258798F for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 21:10:10 -0700 (MST) Received: from [172.248.153.253] ([172.248.153.253:2893] helo=rypc) by cdptpa-oedge02 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.0.35861 r(Momo-dev:tip)) with ESMTP id 81/56-08984-4C49C865; Wed, 06 Jan 2016 04:15:01 +0000 From: "Randall" To: "'Matt Wehland'" , Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2016 20:15:02 -0800 Thread-Index: AdFIMxmSAhbybvipRHakKVgO/fEnQwABTLOw Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > Just tried it, got a little fluid expelled, but no decrease in drag. > > Even so, the more I think about it, the more I am leaning > towards hoses. If opening the bleed valve didn't decrease the drag, then you're almost certainly looking at mechanical binding rather than a hydraulic problem. I've no idea what Hyundai rear calipers look like; but could it be the parking brake or its linkage/cable? That's not to say the hoses couldn't need replacement as well. Randall _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 5 22:35:24 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CC622587BB6 for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 22:35:24 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from ftx-008-i772.relay.mailchannels.net (ftx-008-i772.relay.mailchannels.net [50.61.143.72]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCD312587A34 for ; Tue, 5 Jan 2016 22:35:13 -0700 (MST) Received: from relay.mailchannels.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECBC1120672 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 05:40:02 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ibis.arvixe.com (ip-10-213-14-133.us-west-2.compute.internal [10.213.14.133]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 498E012038D for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 05:40:02 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ibis.arvixe.com (ibis.arvixe.com [10.255.0.35]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384) by 0.0.0.0:2500 (trex/5.6.1); Wed, 06 Jan 2016 05:40:02 +0000 Received: from [166.175.189.97] (port=49749 helo=[192.168.1.154]) by ibis.arvixe.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1aGgn5-000F75-3y for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Tue, 05 Jan 2016 21:37:47 -0800 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <81.56.08984.4C49C865@cdptpa-oedge02> From: Matt Wehland Date: Tue, 5 Jan 2016 23:40:01 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.0 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Well then any more suggestions on what to look at? The rotor is new and seems fairly true by eye, no dial indicator to check hub/rotor runout. I need to put a tire on it to make sure the rotor is snugged up, or find some washers, the lug nuts are bottomed out with just the rotor on it, but it seems fairly snug with no play. The binding/dragging is 360 degrees, but is tighter at some spots. The parking brake cable is not hooked up, not does it even have an end on it. Cable froze up several years ago, just cut the end off, easy middle of winter fix. Wife never used the parking brake, so I never bothered replacing the cable. Now that I am back driving it, it is on my list of things to fix. I have to work all day tomorrow, probably won't touch it tomorrow. I will try some things out on Thursday and check back in. Matt On 1/5/2016 10:15 PM, Randall wrote: >> Just tried it, got a little fluid expelled, but no decrease in drag. >> >> Even so, the more I think about it, the more I am leaning >> towards hoses. > If opening the bleed valve didn't decrease the drag, then you're almost certainly looking at mechanical binding rather than a > hydraulic problem. I've no idea what Hyundai rear calipers look like; but could it be the parking brake or its linkage/cable? > > That's not to say the hoses couldn't need replacement as well. > > Randall > > -- Matt Wehland (815) 295-4533 _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 6 05:50:49 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72C392587BE1 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 05:50:49 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ig0-f169.google.com (mail-ig0-f169.google.com [209.85.213.169]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B5ACE2587BE0 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 05:50:38 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ig0-f169.google.com with SMTP id t15so4593688igr.0 for ; Wed, 06 Jan 2016 04:55:30 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=0N7a20+JzL9hQbbmaLRCbQpZ3Z7o1yzpM8yAlAk/EqI=; b=CazqsMc3qOTmwYf8NG2aynWmypG8CAwgg52UhqMlpkDyiV0AVKDOMUR2oQdYwXdwhx CWab36vXgIG3glVlTElgyip4RjldZpZQya4hPOJiD4V/dEnjogCZ+F+zjCexQtqq4W13 Y/Htshm6auPrmTh7fr/LCn4vPrYN99NDiT4ub9CZIfIj5rnURVwuDp2DcVrW9VFuaQW7 wTkCB77kSMCgAovzcTR8TGUjJSvhKWyIYXpzY27cUjhoXZshYyFOG+f16m0s7GXOnrER ELv7Ph6pQ3sfD8QTXKC+aw3uKEMBph5OWcKK+pZ82613LxX7f7wPhwAlrfQ+7mRMLVTZ SeAQ== 06 Jan 2016 04:55:29 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.36.206.7 with HTTP; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 04:55:29 -0800 (PST) References: <568C6B43.5010209@littlegrassy.com> <568C8A4F.2070507@littlegrassy.com> Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2016 07:55:29 -0500 From: Jeff Scarbrough To: Matt Wehland Cc: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net On Tue, Jan 5, 2016 at 10:30 PM, Matt Wehland wrote: > Even so, the more I think about it, the more I am leaning towards hoses. > Thinking even the fronts could be impacting this, as if they swell/flex too > much there might not be enough pressure in the system to retract the > caliper. It's my understanding that most modern two-circuit brake systems operate one front and one rear wheel on each circuit. So pressure held on a front brake might affect a rear brake. But you could easily verify by running the same apply>spin>bleed test on the front. I might look at the caliper support to make sure it's true to the hub and secure to the car. I also might try a different brand of caliper. Rock Auto has several choices for about the same as the AutoZone price. Looking at the pictures, I'd make sure that E-brake lever isn't flopping around and doing something unseemly. And would it be less trouble to replace the entire brake pipe instead of messing around underneath trying to make a splice? Where's the far end? Jeff Scarbrough Corrosion Acres, Ga. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 6 06:10:58 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE1422587CFB for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 06:10:57 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from homiemail-a80.g.dreamhost.com (sub5.mail.dreamhost.com [208.113.200.129]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEDEB2587CB2 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 06:10:50 -0700 (MST) Received: from homiemail-a80.g.dreamhost.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by homiemail-a80.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E5DE37A075 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 05:15:40 -0800 (PST) :content-type:message-id:mime-version:subject:date:references:to :in-reply-to; s=groupwbench.org; bh=aV1uCAS+pD5rLp3bekNRAu/24Bs= ; b=VI0cibb+Mq6VZIuuEwnwAmRoLm0tIZWr5dbjX9L89RbnKtchL1+Lr/ODkoUt koG+wH6F0SBDigJLltM+/OivdGdLBFW7T+sodNqXV2JzdZMykTvVJdss6ExyoQD8 Yi2k305Ktk0GZxWpvGMSli1CY/O+RaH1FqXjVtG8GCcD1as= Received: from jims-imac.home (pool-98-118-108-149.bstnma.fios.verizon.net [98.118.108.149]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jamesf@groupwbench.org) by homiemail-a80.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id DE3DC37A06F for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 05:15:39 -0800 (PST) From: Jim Franklin Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2016 08:15:37 -0500 References: <568C6B43.5010209@littlegrassy.com> <568C805B.1050100@littlegrassy.com> To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5056106449703272235== --Apple-Mail=_883AF206-00CF-4D2E-94D3-871AAD536FDA Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=us-ascii For what it's worth, both my Subaru Impreza and my Mini Cooper use rears = faster than fronts. And I can feel the rears bite before the front. = Maybe it's a safety thing, to settle the car before really slowing it? If I have to brake hard, I don't notice which bites first, but 99% of my = braking is the last 50' or so, or removing just a bit of speed, so light = braking, I can feel the rears, and sometimes I think that's all I'm = using. Did you replace the proportioning valve too? It might have a piece of = gunk in there messing the L-R balance up. jim On Jan 5, 2016, at 9:47 PM, Matt Wehland wrote: > That and the fact that it ate REAR brake pads, while the fronts looked = fine. --Apple-Mail=_883AF206-00CF-4D2E-94D3-871AAD536FDA Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable charset=us-ascii For = what it's worth, both my Subaru Impreza and my Mini Cooper use rears = faster than fronts. And I can feel the rears bite before the front. = Maybe it's a safety thing, to settle the car before really slowing = it?

If I have to brake hard, I don't notice which = bites first, but 99% of my braking is the last 50' or so, or removing = just a bit of speed, so light braking, I can feel the rears, and = sometimes I think that's all I'm using.

Did you = replace the proportioning valve too? It might have a piece of gunk in = there messing the L-R balance = up.

jim

On Jan 5, 2016, = at 9:47 PM, Matt Wehland <mjw@littlegrassy.com> = wrote:

That and the fact that it ate REAR = brake pads, while the fronts looked = fine.

= --Apple-Mail=_883AF206-00CF-4D2E-94D3-871AAD536FDA-- --===============5056106449703272235== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============5056106449703272235==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 6 06:20:26 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB84E2587D3C for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 06:20:26 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-io0-f169.google.com (mail-io0-f169.google.com [209.85.223.169]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E4CD2584E8C for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 06:15:54 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-io0-f169.google.com with SMTP id 1so170906291ion.1 for ; Wed, 06 Jan 2016 05:20:45 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=A2BbDDjhrXw6WacqYVDeUZp1GCV2cVDcszBKz5Qut9w=; b=IeASEkKqtFRxdhwbrPngJbCx+12rMR7JsoDqhuJq/G1aow4N8j0JDsiD0Y2OP6ugDh YPW/3O7c2qXvEU8QGlgt+UGm+7K3WAssQHtfQE1qWnNJjBJK/hrZd1rz1QqlYwB57WCC ZNVep6jqLkGnc/JAttwHcKCxNIgcz570nopXuUo7Wn47OhKsVXslkCZ7ERh68ssH1BD7 hIPd97LKHcs1Huple5WzBMEFKGrNqWLmxEmc0yN9eZplfKz1C8XD14EwnnvcRB9sAyjJ ldAbPuY9YHsu42kY2a87RXDsJq2SNxYb6Y/LGgCtrlvJFFd+ZiMWxPgKRKVoXB8EQ7ZI 2K/w== Wed, 06 Jan 2016 05:20:45 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.79.25.214 with HTTP; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 05:20:45 -0800 (PST) References: <568C6B43.5010209@littlegrassy.com> <568C805B.1050100@littlegrassy.com> Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2016 08:20:45 -0500 From: Paul Parkanzky To: Jim Franklin Cc: shop-talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============2569748000141844694== --001a11395ca8bddad50528aa3861 All of my VW's have also used the rears faster. Somebody once told me it was to make the car brake flatter so that you don't feel the nose dive with light braking. -Paul On Wed, Jan 6, 2016 at 8:15 AM, Jim Franklin wrote: > For what it's worth, both my Subaru Impreza and my Mini Cooper use rears > faster than fronts. And I can feel the rears bite before the front. Maybe > it's a safety thing, to settle the car before really slowing it? > > If I have to brake hard, I don't notice which bites first, but 99% of my > braking is the last 50' or so, or removing just a bit of speed, so light > braking, I can feel the rears, and sometimes I think that's all I'm using. > > Did you replace the proportioning valve too? It might have a piece of gunk > in there messing the L-R balance up. > > jim > > On Jan 5, 2016, at 9:47 PM, Matt Wehland wrote: > > That and the fact that it ate REAR brake pads, while the fronts looked > fine. > > --001a11395ca8bddad50528aa3861 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
All of my VW's have also used the rears faster.=C2=A0 = Somebody once told me it was to make the car brake flatter so that you don&= #39;t feel the nose dive with light braking.

-Paul

On Wed, Jan 6, 2016= at 8:15 AM, Jim Franklin <jamesf@groupwbench.org> wrot= e:
Fo= r what it's worth, both my Subaru Impreza and my Mini Cooper use rears = faster than fronts. And I can feel the rears bite before the front. Maybe i= t's a safety thing, to settle the car before really slowing it?
If I have to brake hard, I don't notice which bites first, = but 99% of my braking is the last 50' or so, or removing just a bit of = speed, so light braking, I can feel the rears, and sometimes I think that&#= 39;s all I'm using.

Did you replace the propor= tioning valve too? It might have a piece of gunk in there messing the L-R b= alance up.

jim

On Jan 5= , 2016, at 9:47 PM, Matt Wehland <mjw@littlegrassy.com> wrote:

That and= the fact that it ate REAR brake pads, while the fronts looked fine.=

--001a11395ca8bddad50528aa3861-- --===============2569748000141844694== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============2569748000141844694==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 6 06:20:44 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53EAC2587DAD for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 06:20:44 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from si-002-i39.relay.mailchannels.net (si-002-i39.relay.mailchannels.net [184.154.112.204]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0E8F2587CCD for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 06:19:56 -0700 (MST) Received: from relay.mailchannels.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DDC8100B7A for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 13:24:46 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ibis.arvixe.com (ip-10-42-131-234.us-west-2.compute.internal [10.42.131.234]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id B84FD1001EF for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 13:24:45 +0000 (UTC) Received: from ibis.arvixe.com (ibis.arvixe.com [10.224.9.28]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384) by 0.0.0.0:2500 (trex/5.6.1); Wed, 06 Jan 2016 13:24:46 +0000 Received: from [166.175.189.97] (port=46334 helo=[192.168.1.154]) by ibis.arvixe.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:RC4-SHA:128) (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1aGo2k-000Ddd-1e for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Wed, 06 Jan 2016 05:22:26 -0800 References: <568C6B43.5010209@littlegrassy.com> <568C8A4F.2070507@littlegrassy.com> Cc: "shop-talk@autox.team.net" From: Matt Wehland Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2016 07:24:40 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.0 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net On 1/6/2016 6:55 AM, Jeff Scarbrough wrote: > And would it be less trouble to replace the entire brake pipe instead > of messing around underneath trying to make a splice? Where's the far > end? Jeff Scarbrough Corrosion Acres, Ga. That is my thought too, have to get the front off the ground and get under it to see. -- Matt Wehland (815) 295-4533 _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 6 13:49:47 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57FDA2587C73 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 13:49:47 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from dogbert2.mail.megageek.com (nj-69-34-94-16.sta.embarqhsd.net [69.34.94.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F1E2258776E for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 13:30:45 -0700 (MST) To: Matt Wehland From: eric@megageek.com Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2016 15:07:49 -0500 01/06/2016 15:07:32, Serialize complete at 01/06/2016 15:07:33, Serialize by Router on DOGBERT2/Megageek(Release 7.0.1|January 17, 2006) at 01/06/2016 15:07:33 Cc: shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multipart message in MIME format. --===============6420451047023380871== This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 00712BCA85257F32_= If you're near NJ and want to put it on a lift in a heated garage, let me know. I love to do brake work! Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. Eric P "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson --=_alternative 00712BCA85257F32_= If you're near NJ and want to put it on a lift in a heated garage, let me know.  I love to do brake work!


Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem.
Eric P
"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson  --=_alternative 00712BCA85257F32_=-- --===============6420451047023380871== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============6420451047023380871==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 6 17:52:24 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6587425878A8 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 17:52:24 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from COL004-OMC3S3.hotmail.com (col004-omc3s3.hotmail.com [65.55.34.141]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7335C25878A8 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 17:24:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from na01-bl2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com ([65.55.34.136]) by COL004-OMC3S3.hotmail.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(7.5.7601.23008); Wed, 6 Jan 2016 16:29:40 -0800 Received: from CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.145) by CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.145) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.365.9; Thu, 7 Jan 2016 00:29:20 +0000 Received: from CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.70.145]) by CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.70.145]) with mapi id 15.01.0365.018; Thu, 7 Jan 2016 00:29:20 +0000 From: "Tim ." To: "Shop Talk" Thread-Topic: shipping international Thread-Index: AQHRSOIC9V+2Qzb7TEuiJoWwwXwN8g== Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2016 00:29:20 +0000 Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US header.d=none; autox.team.net; dmarc=none action=none header.from=outlook.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [aaPfBX2GhrOh4kKeOMY/nedqsXoN/+bl] x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; CY1PR13MB0503; 23:XbNEdnox5n3zy+4kH58cb3WX+PXSN0yInAnbFIDj+fLuU7PO8WWxtIBFFnvaafcN8G2L/Hc/8WgXJm1VPFiD/yErpQ9rpFKbw/ofQIeXwdHrB2hrEimjR7pi5Z2RtgZfiJiB2LyHPcnA5qQPUkeyJUQu57geCSjeK5FIETxKZ2IdnZKXi8Y6VNVflFQnTL9syJtSovv5QfWYUWK2GpjieQ==; 5:hHz79U8+afnUVejIPCRPGxD5LDD2udZ1fCFZ6fg0y2tFhl0lBibKWqt1sJlx8mRRhKxjTfyJE08Go1GP3jZ+bwzLT6dO7TMPj40OMkxLySYinEDu+bEzo9KfetK7ZpqadWMfDG0hG4fdH+HqNtGfdQ==; 24:zbiTZHMqElvfUCi8IdyJ+KCHCjYDiMm+0kxBc883jx9tu5Uav6Fq9V+o6qmfKJzYhO9iiyAFuJEkqB8bGJP7GVhJudYpFoLJAagccxWcDO8= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:CY1PR13MB0503; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(432015012)(82015046); SRVR:CY1PR13MB0503; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:CY1PR13MB0503; x-forefront-prvs: 0814A2C7A3 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(7070004)(98900002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1901; SCL:1; SRVR:CY1PR13MB0503; H:CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:23 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM FILETIME=[7F6E9F60:01D148E2] Subject: [Shop-talk] shipping international Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3947807084716832599== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_CY1PR13MB050325E03D7327D6E5613FC0B4F50CY1PR13MB0503namp_" --_000_CY1PR13MB050325E03D7327D6E5613FC0B4F50CY1PR13MB0503namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Does anyone have any experience using or a recommendation for a what was re= ferred to as a "freight forwarder" by a guy in Australia to whom I need to = ship some parts? I guess their dollar is down against the US dollar so am t= rying to help him save on shipping (and keep him buying parts!). I can do a google search but prefer to go by others' recommendations. thanks tim --_000_CY1PR13MB050325E03D7327D6E5613FC0B4F50CY1PR13MB0503namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Does anyone have any experience using or a recommendation for a what was= referred to as a "freight forwarder&= quot; by a guy in Australia to whom I need to ship some parts? I guess thei= r dollar is down against the US dollar so am trying to help him save on shipping (and keep him buying parts!).


I can do a google search but prefer to = go by others' recommendations. 


thanks

tim



--_000_CY1PR13MB050325E03D7327D6E5613FC0B4F50CY1PR13MB0503namp_-- --===============3947807084716832599== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============3947807084716832599==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 6 18:52:26 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19E5025877DB for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 18:52:26 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-wm0-f49.google.com (mail-wm0-f49.google.com [74.125.82.49]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 797C72587725 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 18:29:15 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-wm0-f49.google.com with SMTP id u188so80507137wmu.1 for ; Wed, 06 Jan 2016 17:34:07 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=KWW1kbfr7Q24l5ral3YNagVjcadyn4CKPOX7eWF0Ars=; b=A2fQFNS4A8YVy0deFSC0kejgTCGKCsJRWM9BpI2tRNppYhnIQupNa5A5QDLCqLhjOv RE7QzBNhzuXrUGd6c+cbfN86hsFd1VUwoeU73PyMiEbwo8XB1Sny1xIfjphJA/PTgnyn u1SLeI0jxd9qRNcGuB3QVxYmCTh0EZigVa3F+uEK2dRP91nF29CKTu/kUDKed5rd8lOu F45rsTjvmoIdn1KM/qv5YajgyoXDBA6jmqFyRNi7E2ZndNvRzegglefoJyfjqVElRa3H dBiELa7Mk97kI8lDgy8sT2MdQeD60QLoiQYaP0gLjC89H1yo6fpv3rv3xkrzwoMsB0Mr QQTw== Wed, 06 Jan 2016 17:34:06 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.27.129.213 with HTTP; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 17:34:06 -0800 (PST) References: <81.56.08984.4C49C865@cdptpa-oedge02> <568CA8B1.1090309@littlegrassy.com> Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2016 19:34:06 -0600 From: David Scheidt To: Matt Wehland Cc: shop-talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Sticking/Draging caliper Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > On Jan 5, 2016, at 23:40, Matt Wehland wrote: > > Well then any more suggestions on what to look at? > The rotor is new and seems fairly true by eye, no dial indicator to check hub/rotor runout. > My checklist for dragging brakes is: 1) check rotor size (an over thick rotor causes problems, and is hard to spot w/o measuring and it's easy to check and you feel like a moron when you waste four hours before checking. Not that I've ever done that twice, mind you) 2) caliper adjustment for sliding on pins, etc 3) bleed 4) hoses 5) master cylinder mechanical adjustments -- there are usually specs for clearance between the booster push rod and the master, and sometimes for the booster to pedal connection 5) other hydraulic components. 7) Head scratching. > I need to put a tire on it to make sure the rotor is snugged up, or find some washers, the lug nuts are bottomed out with just the rotor on it, but it seems fairly snug with no play > > The binding/dragging is 360 degrees, but is tighter at some spots. > > The parking brake cable is not hooked up, not does it even have an end on it. > Cable froze up several years ago, just cut the end off, easy middle of winter fix. > Wife never used the parking brake, so I never bothered replacing the cable. > > Now that I am back driving it, it is on my list of things to fix. > > I have to work all day tomorrow, probably won't touch it tomorrow. > I will try some things out on Thursday and check back in. > > Matt > > > On 1/5/2016 10:15 PM, Randall wrote: >>> Just tried it, got a little fluid expelled, but no decrease in drag. >>> >>> Even so, the more I think about it, the more I am leaning >>> towards hoses. >> If opening the bleed valve didn't decrease the drag, then you're almost certainly looking at mechanical binding rather than a >> hydraulic problem. I've no idea what Hyundai rear calipers look like; but could it be the parking brake or its linkage/cable? >> >> That's not to say the hoses couldn't need replacement as well. >> >> Randall > > > -- > Matt Wehland > (815) 295-4533 > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/dmscheidt@gmail.com > _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 6 19:08:55 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 291DF2587B52 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 19:08:55 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from dogbert2.mail.megageek.com (nj-69-34-94-16.sta.embarqhsd.net [69.34.94.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57E1C258779A for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 18:42:59 -0700 (MST) References: To: shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net From: eric@megageek.com Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2016 20:19:44 -0500 01/06/2016 20:19:46, Serialize complete at 01/06/2016 20:19:46 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] shipping international Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multipart message in MIME format. --===============5809196217286055784== This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 0009ECE485257F33_= First, STAY AWAY FROM "FREIGHT CENTER .COM"!!!!!!! They will be all nice to you and quote you a cheap price. Then, once it's delivered, they will hit you with all kinds of extra fees and charges. I weight everything before it ships and they tried to tell my one of my pallets was over 100LBS more than it really was! Here is the best way to do it. Call UPS Freight (I guess do this for Fedex as well.) Tell them that you want to open a commercial account. Then tell them that you know you will get about a 65% discount on the rates. It might take a few calls, but they will deeply discount their rates for freight shippers. Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. Eric P "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson --=_alternative 0009ECE485257F33_= First, STAY AWAY FROM "FREIGHT CENTER .COM"!!!!!!!  They will be all nice to you and quote you a cheap price.  Then, once it's delivered, they will hit you with all kinds of extra fees and charges.  I weight everything before it ships and they tried to tell my one of my pallets was over 100LBS more than it really was!

Here is the best way to do it.  Call UPS Freight (I guess do this for Fedex as well.)  Tell them that you want to open a commercial account.  Then tell them that you know you will get about a 65% discount on the rates.  It might take a few calls, but they will deeply discount their rates for freight shippers.

Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem.
Eric P
"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson
--=_alternative 0009ECE485257F33_=-- --===============5809196217286055784== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============5809196217286055784==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 6 19:38:04 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 15C182587937 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 19:38:04 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from cdptpa-oedge-vip.email.rr.com (cdptpa-outbound-snat.email.rr.com [107.14.166.230]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C3E3B25878B5 for ; Wed, 6 Jan 2016 19:12:53 -0700 (MST) Received: from [172.248.153.253] ([172.248.153.253:1793] helo=rypc) by cdptpa-oedge02 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.0.35861 r(Momo-dev:tip)) with ESMTP id 74/1C-02073-8CACD865; Thu, 07 Jan 2016 02:17:45 +0000 From: "Randall" To: "'Shop Talk'" Date: Wed, 6 Jan 2016 18:17:47 -0800 Thread-Index: AQHRSOIC9V+2Qzb7TEuiJoWwwXwN8p7vTe+g Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] shipping international Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > Does anyone have any experience using or a recommendation for > a what was referred to as a "freight forwarder" by a guy in > Australia to whom I need to ship some parts? I've used Forward Air and been happy with the results. But that was within the US (TX to CA) and they only handle North America; I'm not sure how to connect with a similar service in OZ. https://www.forwardair.com/ The folks in TX apparently loaned the seller a pallet, and helped him band the boxes (of engine parts) to the pallet. I cut the bands and left the pallet at the CA terminal. They offered to fork lift it into my truck; but since I was driving a station wagon, I needed to unload the pallet to make it fit. Strictly terminal to terminal, though, so you'll need to check where the nearest one is. Cost was very reasonable, they charged less for the whole pallet than UPS wanted for each box! (And UPS would not take the engine block.) -- Randall _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 8 16:53:28 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3484325887C9 for ; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 16:53:28 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from COL004-OMC4S8.hotmail.com (col004-omc4s8.hotmail.com [65.55.34.210]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20C32258876B for ; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 16:30:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from na01-by2-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com ([65.55.34.200]) by COL004-OMC4S8.hotmail.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(7.5.7601.23008); Fri, 8 Jan 2016 15:35:10 -0800 Received: from CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.145) by CY1PR13MB0502.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.144) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.365.9; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 23:35:08 +0000 Received: from CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.70.145]) by CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.70.145]) with mapi id 15.01.0365.019; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 23:35:08 +0000 From: "Tim ." To: "Shop Talk" Thread-Topic: shipping international Thread-Index: AQHRSOIC9V+2Qzb7TEuiJoWwwXwN8p7ySIQK Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2016 23:35:08 +0000 References: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US header.d=none; autox.team.net; dmarc=none action=none header.from=outlook.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [jrKyRjHXOmTOKMy/ph09No8pvFjx/O4u] x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; CY1PR13MB0502; 23:cUSHw3qEyI9l1Zv8dhaSk6iQdQx4EodK8y6nrXWTPkB/B1gdMOs3BYZnyjUjR07IjkKDsYdMnZHPnhB+3XIc/3EanTpwtUy8M6s8jtxzgGoUT0dINwp2zjwWC0w3tGFx1pOfgWWOeLTqOHZkubH7Qk4Zrf63uFnr+okw00mupIB8NPhX5Rte7Tx1j/ztnc5I68DmNNQ+hnKIFhSPyzjdPA==; 5:B8hj/W2DHdIZJTK3aVxf7N2E+BrtnJFiV6Azdfktq6QQ3wzm4YZzK24pXk9pGVgKlwebxXnbgJFAPpFl5+LmcmWM3hq/bcFtEPlmuvTt8auSgD1TO+zkU7qhee0tajx1/euoqN1xy9OZTW8PD5HoNw==; 24:vPcPD5Tjgir5ZiLm4fsy8wiMW/sg8xetT26/tD7rwOMjKyPr5lhDmeVrFEcCoOsWOJR2SpNwqdU8wJXyIBOkBnnMozzcu9bsn5O/BMJzG3w= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:CY1PR13MB0502; x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 06ac7686-fd2a-44ab-540b-08d318845859 x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(432015012)(82015046); SRVR:CY1PR13MB0502; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:CY1PR13MB0502; x-forefront-prvs: 0815F8251E x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(7070004)(98900002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1901; SCL:1; SRVR:CY1PR13MB0502; H:CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:23 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM FILETIME=[372BC0C0:01D14A6D] Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] shipping international Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5885610179538862854== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_CY1PR13MB05039C0AB032CF7CD5765CA1B4F60CY1PR13MB0503namp_" --_000_CY1PR13MB05039C0AB032CF7CD5765CA1B4F60CY1PR13MB0503namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks for the couple good pieces of information I received! ________________________________ From: Shop-talk on behalf of Tim . Sent: Wednesday, January 6, 2016 6:29 PM To: Shop Talk Subject: [Shop-talk] shipping international Does anyone have any experience using or a recommendation for a what was re= ferred to as a "freight forwarder" by a guy in Australia to whom I need to = ship some parts? I guess their dollar is down against the US dollar so am t= rying to help him save on shipping (and keep him buying parts!). I can do a google search but prefer to go by others' recommendations. thanks tim --_000_CY1PR13MB05039C0AB032CF7CD5765CA1B4F60CY1PR13MB0503namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Thanks for the couple good pieces of information I received! 



From: Shop-talk <shop-ta= lk-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Tim . <tims_datsun_stuff@outl= ook.com>
Sent: Wednesday, January 6, 2016 6:29 PM
To: Shop Talk
Subject: [Shop-talk] shipping international
 

Does anyone have any experience using or a recommendation for a what was= referred to as a "freight forwarder&qu= ot; by a guy in Australia to whom I need to ship some parts? I guess their = dollar is down against the US dollar so am trying to help him save on shipping (and keep him buying parts!).


I can do a google search but prefer to go= by others' recommendations. 


thanks

tim



--_000_CY1PR13MB05039C0AB032CF7CD5765CA1B4F60CY1PR13MB0503namp_-- --===============5885610179538862854== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============5885610179538862854==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 8 18:39:42 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A342B25880B7 for ; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 18:39:42 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ob0-f170.google.com (mail-ob0-f170.google.com [209.85.214.170]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 893CF2585B71 for ; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 18:09:35 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ob0-f170.google.com with SMTP id wp13so232783872obc.1 for ; Fri, 08 Jan 2016 17:14:28 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to:content-type; bh=Jfi186OfJaGGkhuxt7/RBjmP9V0BImjw3Y+eKYJp/Lg=; b=vo9rdd8KisvLuB5R+FVPOOtpxY9G9YfRvSDXbjQ2WE/1lHZXpmq4WtAPDn+q4gaydb eVB0NSHTfuf9MDIj8jynB3Vlf5ZcmOc1zMYooOPWg6XEq5IXRfmeAD5enuAgyHb6YH5y YacnTX/sD+Zq5MpXa/Ltn4E9IC0dDRBZgaiazLSWWlRErlM8p52SMh3B2WTHqxeDFvTe lH9HwxaHVbY6Kp4HeM5PLh2naUE1u57BNLeljFW6PNhqVZd2G78GiEX1QF6nJS37B746 HTbXc05ASpYyUrKqcp3/gZfg6v52JMfqX96uTnWVBJZRLzS5hANzmRpyjdpaERi8alne mxkw== Fri, 08 Jan 2016 17:14:28 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.202.197.142 with HTTP; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 17:13:48 -0800 (PST) From: Scott Hall Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2016 20:13:48 -0500 To: "Shop-talk@autox.team.net" Subject: [Shop-talk] Starting a boiler Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============8648571971788607314== --001a11c2e0dce3af4e0528dc6c64 New house has hot-water radiant heat. It was on when I looked at the house last winter. It's going to get into the teens here this weekend, so I thought I'd like to use it. I have no idea how to start a boiler. I've done what the interwebs said for bleeding the radiators (except for one--I bought the smallest vent key ACE had and it's too big for all the radiators and too-big-enough for one of them such that it won't turn the vent) and they've got water in them. I don't know how to make the water hot. The boiler is a big square box in the basement. It's got a gas line running to it. That gas line connects to a control box that has water-heater-looking controls on it--the twist on/off/pilot knob, and a copper line that I think is the pilot. Those go into the box, and there's no way I can see to light the pilot with a flame, but I don't see a piezo-electric sparker on it either. And pushing the pilot knob down does not produce a whoosing sound I associate with flowing gas. None of the HVAC people I called seemed very interested in coming out to light a boiler, which is just as well since I want to learn how to work this myself. Anybody got any ideas on where to start? Thanks. Scott --001a11c2e0dce3af4e0528dc6c64 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
New house has hot-water radiant heat. It was on when I loo= ked at the house last winter.

It's going to get into= the teens here this weekend, so I thought I'd like to use it.

I have no idea how to start a boiler.

=
I've done what the interwebs said for bleeding the radiators (exce= pt for one--I bought the smallest vent key ACE had and it's too big for= all the radiators and too-big-enough for one of them such that it won'= t turn the vent) and they've got water in them.

I don't know how to make the water hot. The boiler is a big square bo= x in the basement. It's got a gas line running to it. That gas line con= nects to a control box that has water-heater-looking controls on it--the tw= ist on/off/pilot knob, and a copper line that I think is the pilot. Those g= o into the box, and there's no way I can see to light the pilot with a = flame, but I don't see a piezo-electric sparker on it either. And pushi= ng the pilot knob down does not produce a whoosing sound I associate with f= lowing gas.

None of the HVAC people I called seeme= d very interested in coming out to light a boiler, which is just as well si= nce I want to learn how to work this myself.

Anybo= dy got any ideas on where to start?

Thanks.
<= div>
Scott
--001a11c2e0dce3af4e0528dc6c64-- --===============8648571971788607314== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============8648571971788607314==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 8 19:10:00 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F322125883BC for ; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 19:09:59 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from homiemail-a80.g.dreamhost.com (sub5.mail.dreamhost.com [208.113.200.129]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FC3F2588359 for ; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 18:49:20 -0700 (MST) Received: from homiemail-a80.g.dreamhost.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by homiemail-a80.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B87AE37A078 for ; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 17:54:11 -0800 (PST) content-type:mime-version:subject:from:in-reply-to:date :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to; s= groupwbench.org; bh=X1YU3SdbqNoTe1PUl8DbT9Dcf5g=; b=dC2QXlvHHVuT 6Qwn1OAVAKePuq/oizNu+JeKauryC6FvsmqWIaFc9tiX8o2xfb/+K61lobG0pATE CYUfcVTOmyS/m0UYCneK/FIKbpsLqStDJOowo+ex5y9tLRCppYJyaZFSrn8390fC TN421tGYa9oVtFJlh78abjCzY109sZE= Received: from jims-imac.home (pool-98-118-108-149.bstnma.fios.verizon.net [98.118.108.149]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: jamesf@groupwbench.org) by homiemail-a80.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 3CDF337A075 for ; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 17:54:10 -0800 (PST) From: Jim Franklin Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2016 20:54:09 -0500 References: To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Starting a boiler Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net It depends how it was shut off. Typically, there's an electric switch on the front, and/or on the wall in the stairwell, kitchen, etc, with a red switch cover. Turn it on and it just goes. Shouldn't have to twiddle any knobs. Are you sure there's a pilot? As far as I know, that predates modern radiant systems. Does the know say pilot? Is this a homebrew setup or a reputable system from a known manufacturer? Might help to post some pics. jim On Jan 8, 2016, at 8:13 PM, Scott Hall wrote: > New house has hot-water radiant heat. It was on when I looked at the house last winter. > > It's going to get into the teens here this weekend, so I thought I'd like to use it. > > I have no idea how to start a boiler. > > I've done what the interwebs said for bleeding the radiators (except for one--I bought the smallest vent key ACE had and it's too big for all the radiators and too-big-enough for one of them such that it won't turn the vent) and they've got water in them. > > I don't know how to make the water hot. The boiler is a big square box in the basement. It's got a gas line running to it. That gas line connects to a control box that has water-heater-looking controls on it--the twist on/off/pilot knob, and a copper line that I think is the pilot. Those go into the box, and there's no way I can see to light the pilot with a flame, but I don't see a piezo-electric sparker on it either. And pushing the pilot knob down does not produce a whoosing sound I associate with flowing gas. > > None of the HVAC people I called seemed very interested in coming out to light a boiler, which is just as well since I want to learn how to work this myself. > > Anybody got any ideas on where to start? > > Thanks. > > Scott > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jamesf@groupwbench.org > _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 8 20:10:28 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D8B3258765A for ; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 20:10:28 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from cdptpa-oedge-vip.email.rr.com (cdptpa-outbound-snat.email.rr.com [107.14.166.231]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C82722586574 for ; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 19:54:40 -0700 (MST) Received: from [172.248.153.253] ([172.248.153.253:3685] helo=rypc) by cdptpa-oedge01 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.0.35861 r(Momo-dev:tip)) with ESMTP id 50/88-24793-59770965; Sat, 09 Jan 2016 02:59:33 +0000 From: "Randall" To: "'Scott Hall'" , Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2016 18:59:35 -0800 Thread-Index: AdFKf0/D7dxZ5kJRSCKOfO59WssT2wACWzOQ Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Starting a boiler Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > Anybody got any ideas on where to start? Look around for any kind of panel you can open, large or small. There has to be a way to service the burner and thermocouple, which should let you see how to light the pilot. On my 60's furnace, you have to know to yank upwards on the front panel to get it off, then reach under the burner to get a match near the pilot light. Another possibility is a row of holes down the tube to the pilot. I had an old Teledyne pool heater that worked that way. Gas would flow from the holes as long as you held the knob down in the pilot position, so you just lit the row of holes and the flame ran down to the pilot under the burner. If all else fails, call your gas company (assuming you have natural gas). They should be willing to come light it for you, for free. Randall _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 8 20:55:57 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B737A25884D2 for ; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 20:55:57 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from filter03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net (filter03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net [66.133.183.233]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E261C25863F0 for ; Fri, 8 Jan 2016 20:26:22 -0700 (MST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by filter03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 653FB18A468 for ; Sat, 9 Jan 2016 03:31:15 +0000 (UTC) Received: from relay03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net ([66.133.182.166]) by localhost (filter03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net [66.133.183.233]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id m0DeYCZh-2UK for ; Sat, 9 Jan 2016 03:31:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (unknown [50.34.102.2]) by relay03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id AE75123AC0 for ; Sat, 9 Jan 2016 03:31:02 +0000 (UTC) To: "Shop-talk@autox.team.net" References: From: Dave Cavanaugh Date: Fri, 8 Jan 2016 19:31:11 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.0 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Starting a boiler Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Not surprised. Most commercial and residential HVAC people probably don't have a lot of boiler experience (and as an old stationary engineer, I didn't get a lot of commercial and residential experience, either...). What you need is a plumber. They can show you how to bleed the radiators, will probably have a key the correct size, and, most importantly, can check out the boiler and ignition system and show you how it works. On 1/8/2016 5:13 PM, Scott Hall wrote: > > None of the HVAC people I called seemed very interested in coming out > to light a boiler, which is just as well since I want to learn how to > work this myself. > _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 14 20:23:53 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD64D2584D5F for ; Thu, 14 Jan 2016 20:23:53 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from smtp.centurylink.net (mail.centurylink.net [205.219.233.9]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9174B2584CDD for ; Thu, 14 Jan 2016 20:23:39 -0700 (MST) X_CMAE_Category: , , a=I0wsP0/ub+0M/VQyKFHlEA==:117 a=I0wsP0/ub+0M/VQyKFHlEA==:17 a=K-v-2zaBAAAA:8 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=xwPayol1AAAA:8 a=r77TgQKjGQsHNAKrUKIA:9 a=UWhOKCVZoL6LBv7cur8A:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=5TfMRWjrpZ5Wp1VdALMA:9 a=ceTCXpHQepATBNMI:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 Authentication-Results: smtp02.agate.dfw.synacor.com smtp.user=ejrussell@mebtel.net; auth=pass (LOGIN) Received: from [99.194.29.42] ([99.194.29.42:53359] helo=EricJRussellPC) by smtp.centurylink.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.1.37854 r(Momo-dev:3.5.1.0)) with ESMTPA id 93/6D-03091-46768965; Thu, 14 Jan 2016 22:28:36 -0500 From: "Eric J Russell" To: "shop-talk" Date: Thu, 14 Jan 2016 22:28:16 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] winch for car trailer Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============1566678445515099300== boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0132_01D14F1A.DD2EF080" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0132_01D14F1A.DD2EF080 charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I'd like to add a winch to my car trailer. I use the car trailer to haul = an MGA vintage race car. Hopefully I'll always be able to drive the car = onto the trailer but it seems like a winch might be good insurance...=20 I see low-priced units at Harbor Freight & Northern Tool and higher = priced Warn units.=20 Two questions. 1) anyone have experience with the HF or NT low priced = winches? B) how much winch do I need? I see them from "2500 lbs" to = "9000 lbs".=20 Eric Russell Mebane, NC ------=_NextPart_000_0132_01D14F1A.DD2EF080 charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I'd like to add a winch to my car = trailer. I use=20 the car trailer to haul an MGA vintage race car. Hopefully I'll always = be able=20 to drive the car onto the trailer but it seems like a winch might be = good=20 insurance...
 
I see low-priced units at Harbor = Freight &=20 Northern Tool and higher priced Warn units.
 
Two questions. 1) anyone have = experience with the=20 HF or NT low priced winches? B) how much winch do I need? I see them = from "2500=20 lbs" to "9000 lbs".
 
Eric Russell
Mebane,=20 NC
------=_NextPart_000_0132_01D14F1A.DD2EF080-- --===============1566678445515099300== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============1566678445515099300==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 14 21:20:49 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 40E452584D4D for ; Thu, 14 Jan 2016 21:20:49 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-yk0-f177.google.com (mail-yk0-f177.google.com [209.85.160.177]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9D31258475E for ; Thu, 14 Jan 2016 21:20:41 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-yk0-f177.google.com with SMTP id a85so453359208ykb.1 for ; Thu, 14 Jan 2016 20:25:40 -0800 (PST) h=from:to:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to:reply-to :disposition-notification-to:user-agent:mime-version:content-type; bh=LOvzyymChWVVAlO8ouq6bic82oSTETEtaLKu/1imYFo=; b=Y4iVkx/7CkIVDwjW8EJeSVE+llVXQ4qC69r88f4wDszn4CmhSVLcyEfcrzeTCG23MP 8sALMffjrus50EjdOA9hGeUSDUSs2T1u4a1TiOn9+MiOAv1VDfnKRGY7HPyc53ETWn3g IHLGzZ9LIL/7BoRTSds+c4aawnaRamspUp+S3g7ZHm8nPZmXEC/T3qQBOpQEkhWVuvmn OyIwOfOuWlTDa/90g31BaT5M4rdoxLhuercleFf42arREo6KJBNBLa6h5ALUi257wKFn riZcCCxc+DOS7cJ6EQ9OxkFTY6gGL5/V+LxOcxIv67JiptM7VpM/yMvYAe44aZebT3VR fyjg== d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:from:to:subject:date:message-id:in-reply-to :reply-to:disposition-notification-to:user-agent:mime-version :content-type; bh=LOvzyymChWVVAlO8ouq6bic82oSTETEtaLKu/1imYFo=; b=BwcSE/RQpsP+wLT4nPeib76qb8HeBlQAErEOb2OsMTnIRV+616vfxmUu6LOZGIQ8o7 6atC8/S/YZJ4t8LhlQDOeyPpdjHm6opB0wnJzjmhF0zkvjA2jEBxtHyMZLyS9fdOYpA8 +hrj32fQ0lHriaeML4HtFILu/FtB1x3APING90o30ML1GH9qh4M14nFXBSPWDSF9gFc8 xnZO21OICkALMHckTcPop4tH/7IH0Odho6tZxrFH0vFQZZ+TbW7BkTJmjdOynLUkN2Kz wyr2FxKXd40H4mMRdnzh45FbT8HCgwxpcoJMfRjez/T2msmzNM5BoTcCZpRBvavnhqa4 PIHA== Thu, 14 Jan 2016 20:25:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.149] (71-82-107-19.dhcp.bycy.mi.charter.com. [71.82.107.19]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id z129sm6948587ywb.26.2016.01.14.20.25.37 (version=TLS1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128/128); Thu, 14 Jan 2016 20:25:38 -0800 (PST) From: Curious_John To: "Eric J Russell" , shop-talk Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2016 04:25:37 +0000 User-Agent: eM_Client/6.0.24144.0 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] winch for car trailer Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4844696379057895744== boundary="------=_MB2EAFB42F-A7AC-4237-8B50-483938D5716B" --------=_MB2EAFB42F-A7AC-4237-8B50-483938D5716B Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I would think the Harbor Freight "Marine Winch" would work for you. I=20 have had one of the "power in only " versions for a long time and used=20 it quite a bit without problems. The Marine version powers in and out,=20 and has a crank in case there is no power. 2000 lb pull capacity should= =20 be more than enough for rolling load of an MGA. You would want the No.=20 61237 as it has a longer hand crank than the 61876. I just bought one to= =20 add to my pop up to raise and lower the top. I will also use it to load= =20 a small boat onto the camper. Just my opinion. ------ Original Message ------ From: "Eric J Russell" To: "shop-talk" Sent: 1/14/2016 10:28:16 PM Subject: [Shop-talk] winch for car trailer >I'd like to add a winch to my car trailer. I use the car trailer to=20 >haul an MGA vintage race car. Hopefully I'll always be able to drive=20 >the car onto the trailer but it seems like a winch might be good=20 >insurance... > >I see low-priced units at Harbor Freight & Northern Tool and higher=20 >priced Warn units. > >Two questions. 1) anyone have experience with the HF or NT low priced=20 >winches? B) how much winch do I need? I see them from "2500 lbs" to=20 >"9000 lbs". > >Eric Russell >Mebane, NC --------=_MB2EAFB42F-A7AC-4237-8B50-483938D5716B Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I would think the Harbor Freight "Marine Winch" would work for you.&nb= sp; I have had one of the "power in only " versions for a long time and = used it quite a bit without problems.  The Marine version powers in= and out, and has a crank in case there is no power.  2000 lb pull = capacity should be more than enough for rolling load of an MGA.  You= would want the No. 61237 as it has a longer hand crank than the 61876. = I just bought one to add to my pop up to raise and lower the top.  = I will also use it to load a small boat onto the camper.
 
Just my opinion.
 
------ Original Message ------
From: "Eric J Russell" <ejr= ussell@mebtel.net>
To: "shop-talk" <shop-t= alk@autox.team.net>
Sent: 1/14/2016 10:28:16 PM
Subject: [Shop-talk] winch for car trailer
 
I'd like to add a winch to my car trailer.= I use the car trailer to haul an MGA vintage race car. Hopefully I'll alwa= ys be able to drive the car onto the trailer but it seems like a winch migh= t be good insurance...
 
I see low-priced units at Harbor Freight= & Northern Tool and higher priced Warn units.
 
Two questions. 1) anyone have experience= with the HF or NT low priced winches? B) how much winch do I need? I see= them from "2500 lbs" to "9000 lbs".
 
Eric Russell
Mebane, NC
--------=_MB2EAFB42F-A7AC-4237-8B50-483938D5716B-- --===============4844696379057895744== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============4844696379057895744==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Fri Jan 15 01:18:30 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94FFE2584C39 for ; Fri, 15 Jan 2016 01:18:30 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail.milleredp.com (fw.milleredp.com [198.144.208.110]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C06725848B8 for ; Fri, 15 Jan 2016 01:18:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from [10.1.2.100] ([::ffff:10.1.2.100]) (AUTH: PLAIN jem, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,128bits,AES128-SHA) by mail.milleredp.com with ESMTPSA; Fri, 15 Jan 2016 00:23:14 -0800 id 00000000002800AD.000000005698AC72.000025A2 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: From: John Miller Date: Fri, 15 Jan 2016 00:23:12 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.1 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] winch for car trailer Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net On 1/14/2016 7:28 PM, Eric J Russell wrote: > I'd like to add a winch to my car trailer. I use the car trailer to haul > an MGA vintage race car. Hopefully I'll always be able to drive the car > onto the trailer but it seems like a winch might be good insurance... > I see low-priced units at Harbor Freight & Northern Tool and higher > priced Warn units. I have a Harbor Freight "12000lb" winch on mine. It's worked well. It's massive overkill, and I sometimes think about replacing the fat cable that's on the thing with something smaller and more flexible... ...but last (November?) I took the trailer down to pick up a non-running E30 325i (Lemons project) and the seller had lost the key, so the steering was locked at about half a turn to the right and the seller's driveway was on a hillside (and I hadn't known/realized that a Sawzall applied to the top of the steering column will deal with the locking pin on those.) After we got it out of his driveway and fiddled around with trying to make it roll toward the trailer, the easiest way to get it on the trailer proved to be to have my partner in crime sit in the car and lock the brakes while I just thumbed the winch remote button to drag it up onto the trailer with the wheels locked. It'd slide straight even if it wouldn't roll that way. So at that point I was somewhat pleased I had way too much winch. John. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 16 11:29:58 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6FBD325851DA for ; Sat, 16 Jan 2016 11:29:58 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from dogbert2.mail.megageek.com (nj-69-34-94-16.sta.embarqhsd.net [69.34.94.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77B442584D75 for ; Sat, 16 Jan 2016 11:29:48 -0700 (MST) To: shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net From: eric@megageek.com Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2016 13:06:33 -0500 01/16/2016 13:06:26, Serialize complete at 01/16/2016 13:06:26 Subject: [Shop-talk] Preheating metal in an oven Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multipart message in MIME format. --===============0033334704374431500== This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 0066117485257F3C_= Afternoon friends. A quick question, when you are preheating metal items in your oven (for a cast iron weld) do you put it on bake or broil? Thanks! Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. Eric P "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson --=_alternative 0066117485257F3C_=
Afternoon friends.

A quick question, when you are preheating metal items in your oven (for a cast iron weld) do you put it on bake or broil?

Thanks!

Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem.
Eric P
"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson --=_alternative 0066117485257F3C_=-- --===============0033334704374431500== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============0033334704374431500==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sat Jan 16 11:37:23 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34ECB25851DA for ; Sat, 16 Jan 2016 11:37:23 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from filter02.dlls.pa.frontiernet.net (filter02.dlls.pa.frontiernet.net [199.224.80.229]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 930902584EBF for ; Sat, 16 Jan 2016 11:37:17 -0700 (MST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by filter02.dlls.pa.frontiernet.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9329A23126F; Sat, 16 Jan 2016 18:42:16 +0000 (UTC) Received: from relay04.dlls.pa.frontiernet.net ([199.224.80.247]) by localhost (filter02.dlls.pa.frontiernet.net [199.224.80.229]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id X4xgJuxdUqJS; Sat, 16 Jan 2016 18:42:04 +0000 (UTC) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (unknown [50.35.42.216]) by relay04.dlls.pa.frontiernet.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id A2DCD2F8094; Sat, 16 Jan 2016 18:42:03 +0000 (UTC) To: eric@megageek.com, shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net References: From: Dave Cavanaugh Date: Sat, 16 Jan 2016 10:42:33 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.1 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Preheating metal in an oven Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============8490486990558992281== boundary="------------080202070801060301030700" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------080202070801060301030700 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You want even heat so I would probably use bake, with convection if it's available. It's gonna be tough eatin', though. On 1/16/2016 10:06 AM, eric@megageek.com wrote: > > Afternoon friends. > > A quick question, when you are preheating metal items in your oven > (for a cast iron weld) do you put it on bake or broil? > > Thanks! > > Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. > Eric P > "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a > rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your > territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/cavanadd@frontier.com > --------------080202070801060301030700 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit You want even heat so I would probably use bake, with convection if it's available.  It's gonna be tough eatin', though. 

On 1/16/2016 10:06 AM, eric@megageek.com wrote:

Afternoon friends.

A quick question, when you are preheating metal items in your oven (for a cast iron weld) do you put it on bake or broil?

Thanks!

Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem.
Eric P
"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson 

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums

--------------080202070801060301030700-- --===============8490486990558992281== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============8490486990558992281==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 09:39:08 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20A3A2584F4B for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 09:39:08 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from smtp.centurylink.net (mail.centurylink.net [205.219.233.9]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 866302584DC7 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 09:38:54 -0700 (MST) X_CMAE_Category: , , a=I0wsP0/ub+0M/VQyKFHlEA==:117 a=I0wsP0/ub+0M/VQyKFHlEA==:17 a=K-v-2zaBAAAA:8 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=xwPayol1AAAA:8 a=r77TgQKjGQsHNAKrUKIA:9 a=qktwJq4hAAAA:8 a=XlsSwTe5FkuFP5OC7ZIA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=VsLTGyXlUzYfhdWV:21 a=_W_S_7VecoQA:10 Authentication-Results: smtp03.agate.dfw.synacor.com smtp.user=ejrussell@mebtel.net; auth=pass (LOGIN) Received: from [99.194.29.42] ([99.194.29.42:54579] helo=EricJRussellPC) by smtp.centurylink.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.1.37854 r(Momo-dev:3.5.1.0)) with ESMTPA id 31/2D-05006-BC76E965; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 11:43:55 -0500 From: "Eric J Russell" To: "shop-talk" Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 11:43:45 -0500 Subject: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============7985613911893762287== boundary="----=_NextPart_000_00D4_01D152AE.A7910020" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_00D4_01D152AE.A7910020 charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable We get the occasional snow/ice storm here in NC. NC doesn't plow/sand = much - they just wait for it to melt a day or two later. However, being = an ER nurse, I have to drive in it before Mother Nature takes care of = it. I have an F250, rear wheel drive with LSD. I can usually get around = with its "all season' tires. But when we get ice covered with snow it = gets very difficult. I do keep a few bags of sand in the bed.=20 I am considering either real snow tires (I doubt studs are available or = allowed) *or* chains.=20 http://www.etrailer.com/chains-1999_Ford_F-250+and+F-350+Super+Duty.htm?f= url=3D-c2-235%7C85~16=20 What say ye, learned shop-talkers?=20 Eric Russell Mebane, NC ------=_NextPart_000_00D4_01D152AE.A7910020 charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
We get the occasional snow/ice storm = here in NC. NC=20 doesn't plow/sand much - they just wait for it to melt a day or two = later.=20 However, being an ER nurse, I have to drive in it before Mother Nature = takes=20 care of it. I have an F250, rear wheel drive with LSD. I can = usually get=20 around with its "all season' tires. But when we get ice covered = with snow=20 it gets very difficult. I do keep a few bags of sand in the bed. =
 
I am considering either real snow tires = (I doubt=20 studs are available or allowed) *or* chains.
http://www.etrailer.com/chains-1999_Ford_F= -250+and+F-350+Super+Duty.htm?furl=3D-c2-235%7C85~16 
 
What say ye, learned shop-talkers? =
 
Eric Russell
Mebane,=20 NC
------=_NextPart_000_00D4_01D152AE.A7910020-- --===============7985613911893762287== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============7985613911893762287==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 10:03:24 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FF1B2584FCE for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 10:03:24 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.198]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A06D2584E39 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 10:03:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from Steve-PC.optonline.net (ool-44c2b54e.dyn.optonline.net [68.194.181.78]) by mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-8.04 (built Feb 28 2007)) with ESMTPA id <0O1700M2XM9VCM20@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:08:20 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:07:52 -0500 From: Steven Trovato To: Eric J Russell , shop-talk References: Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============7543744331603740488== boundary="Boundary_(ID_0CXgHN4LwRDanLKj32xmdA)" --Boundary_(ID_0CXgHN4LwRDanLKj32xmdA) Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Eric, From what Dr. Google tells me, studded snow tires are allowed in North Carolina without restriction. Snow tires will be better than all season tires, but a little rougher riding and a little noisier. Probably not a big problem in a truck. They will also wear out faster than all season tires. Studs will improve performance on ice, but will be another step noisier and rougher. Chains will be lots noisier and rougher, and only appropriate while roads are snow covered. You will have to put them on and take them off for each storm. Too bad your truck isn't four wheel drive. My four wheel drive suburban gets me through anything here in NY. -Steve At 11:43 AM 1/19/2016, Eric J Russell wrote: >We get the occasional snow/ice storm here in NC. NC doesn't >plow/sand much - they just wait for it to melt a day or two later. >However, being an ER nurse, I have to drive in it before Mother >Nature takes care of it. I have an F250, rear wheel drive with LSD. >I can usually get around with its "all season' tires. But when we >get ice covered with snow it gets very difficult. I do keep a few >bags of sand in the bed. > >I am considering either real snow tires (I doubt studs are available >or allowed) *or* chains. >http://www.etrailer.com/chains-1999_Ford_F-250+and+F-350+Super+Duty.htm?furl=-c2-235%7C85~16 > > >What say ye, learned shop-talkers? > >Eric Russell >Mebane, NC --Boundary_(ID_0CXgHN4LwRDanLKj32xmdA) Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Eric,

From what Dr. Google tells me, studded snow tires are allowed in North Carolina without restriction.  Snow tires will be better than all season tires, but a little rougher riding and a little noisier.  Probably not a big problem in a truck.  They will also wear out faster than all season tires.  Studs will improve performance on ice, but will be another step noisier and rougher.  Chains will be lots noisier and rougher, and only appropriate while roads are snow covered.  You will have to put them on and take them off for each storm.  Too bad your truck isn't four wheel drive.  My four wheel drive suburban gets me through anything here in NY. 

-Steve

At 11:43 AM 1/19/2016, Eric J Russell wrote:
We get the occasional snow/ice storm here in NC. NC doesn't plow/sand much - they just wait for it to melt a day or two later. However, being an ER nurse, I have to drive in it before Mother Nature takes care of it. I have an F250, rear wheel drive with LSD. I can usually get around with its "all season' tires. But when we get ice covered with snow it gets very difficult. I do keep a few bags of sand in the bed.
 
I am considering either real snow tires (I doubt studs are available or allowed) *or* chains.
http://www.etrailer.com/chains-1999_Ford_F-250+and+F-350+Super+Duty.htm?furl=-c2-235%7C85~16
 
What say ye, learned shop-talkers?
 
Eric Russell
Mebane, NC
--Boundary_(ID_0CXgHN4LwRDanLKj32xmdA)-- --===============7543744331603740488== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============7543744331603740488==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 10:09:58 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B360D258504B for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 10:09:58 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.212]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AE472584D54 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 10:09:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from Steve-PC.optonline.net (ool-44c2b54e.dyn.optonline.net [68.194.181.78]) by mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-9.20 (built Jul 15 2010)) with ESMTPA id <0O1700075MKUXA20@mta6.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:14:54 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:14:26 -0500 From: Steven Trovato To: Eric J Russell , shop-talk References: Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tirerack has a lot of good information: http://www.tirerack.com/winter/tech/index.jsp. They are also very helpful if you call them. -Steve _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 10:29:49 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8DFB25850B3 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 10:29:49 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from cdptpa-oedge-vip.email.rr.com (cdptpa-outbound-snat.email.rr.com [107.14.166.230]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E14CB2584714 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 10:26:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from [172.248.153.253] ([172.248.153.253:1256] helo=rypc) by cdptpa-oedge01 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.0.35861 r(Momo-dev:tip)) with ESMTP id 1C/CC-11985-3F27E965; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 17:31:32 +0000 From: "Randall" To: "'shop-talk'" Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 09:31:36 -0800 Thread-Index: AdFS2KesdlWr6sUFRo+LkMYFx9nbFgABSkXg Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > I am considering either real snow tires (I doubt studs are > available or allowed) *or* chains. IMO chains are a lot more hassle. As noted, you really should run them only when you are actually driving on snow, which can mean removing and installing several times per season. But at the same time, they are a lot more effective than snow tires even with studs. If I had to choose only one, and I had to get there in any kind of weather, I'd pick chains. But if you routinely have to drive to work on unplowed roads, IMO it's a false economy not to get snow tires *and* chains. Leave the tires on for the season, and carry the chains for when it gets really bad (like frozen rain topped with snow). -- Randall _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 10:44:58 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A189525850BE for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 10:44:58 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from homiemail-a80.g.dreamhost.com (sub5.mail.dreamhost.com [208.113.200.129]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54B242584C7D for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 10:44:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from homiemail-a80.g.dreamhost.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by homiemail-a80.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E04937A06B for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 09:49:44 -0800 (PST) message-id:in-reply-to:references:date:subject:from:to :mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s= groupwbench.org; bh=SxFw33ZObAyvsz1mAT7AlLZXAIo=; b=JyN6ng3ykr4l p9hKec0Bbt4+4z6b8D3hCxWK/IntRNVjub6Xp/R9nIRDIKzO8YXLwlAyE5adikbl P0A6W1168if1n3Eu+OiJuFouf+XbmPPDTXL1uEi4EJ8n3itrfcz+3LjPSMxgfNHy Lwdelzju1TT5z6/ndZgZSs1OoVQL9mQ= Received: from webmail.groupwbench.org (caiajhbihbdd.dreamhost.com [208.97.187.133]) (Authenticated sender: jamesf@groupwbench.org) by homiemail-a80.g.dreamhost.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 411AA37A020 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 09:49:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from 209.190.168.98 (SquirrelMail authenticated user jamesf@groupwbench.org) by webmail.groupwbench.org with HTTP; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:49:44 -0500 References: Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:49:44 -0500 From: "Jim Franklin" To: "shop-talk" User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.21 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net I'll start off by saying I have zero experience with chains, but lots with snow :-) For occasional use, I'd get cables, not chains. How much up/down hills do you do? If you decide on snows, get the tallest, narrowest ones you can fit. They need to bite into the snow, so wide ones only make you float, esp. with the relatively light rear end of a pickup. jim > We get the occasional snow/ice storm here in NC. NC doesn't plow/sand much > - they just wait for it to melt a day or two later. However, being an ER > nurse, I have to drive in it before Mother Nature takes care of it. I have > an F250, rear wheel drive with LSD. I can usually get around with its "all > season' tires. But when we get ice covered with snow it gets very > difficult. I do keep a few bags of sand in the bed. > > I am considering either real snow tires (I doubt studs are available or > allowed) *or* chains. > http://www.etrailer.com/chains-1999_Ford_F-250+and+F-350+Super+Duty.htm?furl=-c2-235%7C85~16 > > What say ye, learned shop-talkers? > > Eric Russell > Mebane, NC_______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jamesf@groupwbench.org > > _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 10:46:38 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4C2025850EC for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 10:46:38 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-po-03v.sys.comcast.net (resqmta-po-03v.sys.comcast.net [96.114.154.162]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79D4325850A8 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 10:46:34 -0700 (MST) Received: from resomta-po-09v.sys.comcast.net ([96.114.154.233]) by resqmta-po-03v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id 7trF1s00152QWKC01trcCC; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 17:51:36 +0000 Received: from [10.0.0.4] ([50.139.56.137]) by resomta-po-09v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id 7tra1s00L2xeFdN01trbKv; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 17:51:36 +0000 From: Brian Kennedy Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 09:51:37 -0800 References: <1C.CC.11985.3F27E965@cdptpa-oedge01> To: shop-talk s=q20140121; t=1453225896; bh=50JNFpaZ267+eDn+IFDu6cjd8Kx9u0XdzmCDfxM5ECw=; h=Received:Received:Content-Type:Mime-Version:Subject:From:Date: Message-Id:To; b=UDgL0cHXNQ8sqUR0KAAcQaN6k9Da7aKUAdWVSNAH1UDZvPSPZOAdWNpl0WmZkmh8q uCeptRMPLtesxrz7wh4ZBEZjhNph8d8nKqpkGZdo8q3bHkFwmFqD1RxB8haE+DjCMo FbNH8Q+G5vYzzHtpSzZVR8F9cR36ABMovsN9/jpVp+8128vy4Py370ZFowfc122YyE Ez8QaJdhkbUochtXEil0X4JHKoC/jzOgV7XaLCGEnLIcahh1bmUBBXmBk4PqJkUDg/ 17LUFUbvK7BNAtzAOeuq0dVoi3DYnqmLvbUJGOSCzoPfgiPY0lK+0rCt3bICfo3LkP wbMTksn9Mp6JA== Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net I grew up driving the backroads of Michigan in a '50 Ford. Snow tires meant just that, they worked well in snow. Only chains worked well on ice but are a hassle. Nowadays, all seasons work very great with all wheel drive. I now spend some time in Oregon and occasionally go to the mountains. I have all wheel drive, but I'd never want to be caught on an icy slick mountain road without chains. Chains are pretty cheap. With my '96 F150 limited slip, a few 40 lb bags of salt in the back does pretty well. My thought would b to put lots of weight in the back and carry chains until your tires need replacing, then I'd buy snows. As I recall, the way snow tires work is the snow gets lodged in the grooves and the real traction is snow to snow. Brian K. On Jan 19, 2016, at 9:31 AM, Randall wrote: >> I am considering either real snow tires (I doubt studs are >> available or allowed) *or* chains. > > IMO chains are a lot more hassle. As noted, you really should run them only when you are actually driving on snow, which can mean > removing and installing several times per season. But at the same time, they are a lot more effective than snow tires even with > studs. > > If I had to choose only one, and I had to get there in any kind of weather, I'd pick chains. But if you routinely have to drive to > work on unplowed roads, IMO it's a false economy not to get snow tires *and* chains. Leave the tires on for the season, and carry > the chains for when it gets really bad (like frozen rain topped with snow). > > -- Randall > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/kennedybc@comcast.net > _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 11:36:22 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1374258514E for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 11:36:22 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from smtp.centurylink.net (mail.centurylink.net [205.219.233.9]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AAE02584EEB for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 11:27:44 -0700 (MST) X_CMAE_Category: , , a=I0wsP0/ub+0M/VQyKFHlEA==:117 a=I0wsP0/ub+0M/VQyKFHlEA==:17 a=K-v-2zaBAAAA:8 a=L9H7d07YOLsA:10 a=9cW_t1CCXrUA:10 a=s5jvgZ67dGcA:10 a=xwPayol1AAAA:8 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=KA6EFgeMPzRxHK1ln84A:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 Authentication-Results: smtp03.agate.dfw.synacor.com smtp.user=ejrussell@mebtel.net; auth=pass (LOGIN) Received: from [99.194.29.42] ([99.194.29.42:58489] helo=EricJRussellPC) by smtp.centurylink.net (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.1.37854 r(Momo-dev:3.5.1.0)) with ESMTPA id A0/60-05006-D418E965; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 13:32:45 -0500 From: "Eric J Russell" To: "shop-talk" References: <000001d152e4$3c76e120$b564a360$@lotusowners.com> Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 13:32:41 -0500 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > How I look at it is that all you are doing is buying a second set of tires > early. Thanks for all the replies. I was leaning toward some real snow tires. I'd only need them for 2-3 months at most. And even then, I don't (need to) drive the truck every day. In the interest of full disclosure, I am a damn yankee - born & raised in Massachusetts - so I am used to driving in snow. But I did have real snow tires back then. I even had studded snow tires on my MGA when it was my only car/daily driver. In fact, I never got stuck driving the MGA in the winter. Not warm but not stuck either... Eric Russell Mebane, NC _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 11:36:43 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41183258510D for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 11:36:43 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net [167.206.4.200]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 756D42580601 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 11:34:29 -0700 (MST) Received: from Steve-PC.optonline.net (ool-44c2b54e.dyn.optonline.net [68.194.181.78]) by mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.2-8.04 (built Feb 28 2007)) with ESMTPA id <0O1700DDYQHLO440@mta5.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 13:39:21 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 13:38:04 -0500 From: Steven Trovato To: Tony Vaccaro , shop-talk References: <0O1700M2YM9VCM20@mta3.srv.hcvlny.cv.net> <000501d152e5$89a07dc0$9ce17940$@lotusowners.com> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============7832759613782258409== boundary="Boundary_(ID_yCSAdw4l9BxY160H9igl1Q)" --Boundary_(ID_yCSAdw4l9BxY160H9igl1Q) Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Tony, I think it depends on where you live and how important it is that you be able to drive through anything. I am retired now, so my requirements are different from critical hospital personnel. In all the years I spent commuting here in NY, the thing that hindered travel the most was traffic. Driving in a relatively hilly area with substantial traffic volume meant there was always someone who couldn't make it up a hill or bounced off a guard rail. I always tried to stay off the highways. When traffic stopped there, you could be stranded for hours. On the secondary roads, you could at least turn around and try a different route. -Steve At 01:16 PM 1/19/2016, Tony Vaccaro wrote: >As far as not using snows on a Suburban or in my case a Nissan >Pathfinder. While the weight and the 4 wheel drive will get you out >of most everything, there is no difference on ice. It is still just >plain rubber on ice. > >I had a Suburban and now my Pathfinder. Driven both with and without >snows. The difference with and without snows is quite remarkable. > >I am not saying that you cannot get along with not using snows on >heavy 4 wheel drive vehicles, I have. But the difference is quite amazing. > >My MINI S with snows was just amazing. I could zoom all over the >place. Pass snow plow equipped turcks, Drive on streets with >everyone else off the road in ditches. > >I honestly don't see why everyone does not get snows. Like I said, >all it is just getting your second set of tires early. Of course the >wheel cost is something to be considered but the damage done to my >wheels with salt makes that also worthwhile. > >The insurance companies should give a discount to those that have >snows on their cars. > >Tony V --Boundary_(ID_yCSAdw4l9BxY160H9igl1Q) Content-transfer-encoding: 8BIT Tony,

I think it depends on where you live and how important it is that you be able to drive through anything.  I am retired now, so my requirements are different from critical hospital personnel.  In all the years I spent commuting here in NY, the thing that hindered travel the most was traffic.  Driving in a relatively hilly area with substantial traffic volume meant there was always someone who couldn't make it up a hill or bounced off a guard rail.  I always tried to stay off the highways.  When traffic stopped there, you could be stranded for hours.  On the secondary roads, you could at least turn around and try a different route. 

-Steve

At 01:16 PM 1/19/2016, Tony Vaccaro wrote:
As far as not using snows on a Suburban or in my case a Nissan Pathfinder.  While the weight and the 4 wheel drive will get you out of most everything, there is no difference on ice. It is still just plain rubber on ice.
 
I had a Suburban and now my Pathfinder. Driven both with and without snows. The difference with and without snows is quite remarkable.
 
I am not saying that you cannot get along with not using snows on heavy 4 wheel drive vehicles, I have.  But the difference is quite amazing.
 
My MINI S with snows was just amazing. I could zoom all over the place. Pass snow plow equipped turcks, Drive on streets with everyone else off the road in ditches.
 
I honestly don’t see why everyone does not get snows. Like I said, all it is just getting your second set of tires early. Of course the wheel cost is something to be considered but the damage done to my wheels with salt makes that also worthwhile.
 
The insurance companies should give a discount to those that have snows on their cars.
 
Tony V
--Boundary_(ID_yCSAdw4l9BxY160H9igl1Q)-- --===============7832759613782258409== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============7832759613782258409==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 12:00:47 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 360452585173 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:00:47 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from itonami.pair.com (itonami.pair.com [209.68.2.178]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 436D3258506C for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 11:58:53 -0700 (MST) Received: by itonami.pair.com (Postfix, from userid 3198) id BACC68FC12; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 14:03:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by itonami.pair.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0DFF8FC0E for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 14:03:54 -0500 (EST) Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 14:03:54 -0500 (EST) From: David Hillman To: shop-talk References: <1C.CC.11985.3F27E965@cdptpa-oedge01> User-Agent: Alpine 2.02 (BSF 1266 2009-07-14) Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net On Tue, 19 Jan 2016, Brian Kennedy wrote: > With my '96 F150 limited slip, a few 40 lb bags of salt in the back > does pretty well. My thought would b to put lots of weight in the back > and carry chains until your tires need replacing, then I'd buy snows. > As I recall, the way snow tires work is the snow gets lodged in the > grooves and the real traction is snow to snow. [obligatory-resume]Since 1998, I've spent almost every winter racing mid-engined RWD cars on frozen lakes in Michigan and Wisconsin, whenever those lakes are hard enough -- over 300 races. I've tried or raced against virtually every snow tire made, and built a few sets of studded tires for racing purposes. Since I don't live in Michigan or Wisconsin, that means I've also got tens of thousands of miles towing my trailers and racecars out to the middle of nowhere in the dead of winter. [/obligatory-resume] First off, the last sentence above is not right. There can be some grip from packed snow, but that's not how they are designed to work. Snow tires actually work the same way as all other tires: the rubber deforms into microscopic imperfections in the road surface ( or whatever they are rolling on ) and that interface provides traction. The increased void ratio of off-road tires is there to give loose material ( snow, mud, etc ) somewhere to go, so it doesn't get trapped between the rubber and the road ( and interfere with the process above ). The best snow tires use rubber compounds that stay pliable down to sub-zero temperatures, so they can still mate with surface imperfections. I have some custom-made racing snows on which you can manually twist the tread blocks at 10 below. They probably wouldn't last 200 miles on a dry road, but that rubber is soft enough to grip imperfections in glare ice. Ironically, they are made in North Carolina! Also, modern snow tires have a 'traction material' molded into the rubber -- recycled industrial diamonds are a common choice, but there are a few others. This obviously increases bite on real ice. For this reason, the old logic about super-narrow snows is no longer important. I have run everything from 165s to 225s on my little car, and wider is faster/better in some conditions (not all). Second, weight is a mixed bag. It will help sometimes, and hurt sometimes. Many of the guys I race with are huge believers in adding ballast. My car is always by far the smallest and lightest in my class -- to the point where some guys have run as much __ballast__ as my cars weighs ( ~1 ton ) -- but still one of the fastest. TANSTAAFL, however, and while you have more traction as a result, you __need__ a lot more to go/stop/turn. Appropriate tires are a much better choice. The only time the heaviest cars win is when we have a half-frozen, slushy mix several inches deep. On dry snow, they have no chance. On smooth ice, they also lose. I am not a fan of chains, or street-legal studs. Metal doesn't work well with pavement, and neither bite into ice well. 1mm studs in snow are near useless. I don't think either are superior to top-notch snow tires -- basically, Blizzaks, Nokians, and a couple others. I can literally talk snow tires all day, and at the moment, I own at least four sets. For all of my street cars ( which were sometimes also racecars ) I would pick up a spare set of wheels, and mount up the best snows I could find, and I would go anywhere in any conditions. Everytime we get a big snow, I go out and drive around in it for hours for fun. I am positive that if Eric picks up some quality snows for his truck, he'll be just fine, and very happy. I'm trying to keep this as short as possible, but if we want to talk specific tire models, I'm game. It does make a huge difference... for example, with Blizzak LM series and WS. The former are just barely better than all-seasons, the latter are the ones you want from that brand. -- David Hillman _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 12:30:48 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA3142585199 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:30:48 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-qk0-f174.google.com (mail-qk0-f174.google.com [209.85.220.174]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10DE72584ED0 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:29:07 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-qk0-f174.google.com with SMTP id s68so2799646qkh.3 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 11:34:09 -0800 (PST) d=maracing-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=gU5C0NSKYpF9KwTvtP5kl+q099vqiwZIjKIyEiuQPyc=; b=z30HFaFefLUsuidfAc7VKGPLgPw1zbKFpPiqakZqKH5T6FlqUaBw6aLjN+Bv4CwDNF ll9nx/rgpUGjtKXrVB9WMgRozlu+KT1/I3RWzjBq/++xMaNQgMcoCb+RNgd50ubC78kw lOl+zJBij+b7urRaSLa2biHMidgZKdfYiN1a428CnK832J5UDc0+UXNlcZqBhAOTfT/J hXj11u5ZxR3BoBFVnIubYw+ilSUgrbvZRThJBqobcF/Flhnhj1Q4NWGJ5Zfwbi5zARFw jLv8JMCWKjKSwQv8fKEjirwxWSnk9ULtR1t8Qcy4h+cWzhuJVxMMSRlO2ohhqIwmSKmF leew== d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=gU5C0NSKYpF9KwTvtP5kl+q099vqiwZIjKIyEiuQPyc=; b=fOOST5PsC8hRiu3+FWpYUhtkX1nFQII3+jTVpbM+4S+Z3djO6OSZJ5ba+xLfni9wqG UpKkPUp5Wg5+xqtDZxpxGdBu/YryFtb+pCdfIDkbiN6yiVsYK2rJnL50ECcUBbBXwILo dTlKEgTh1KU6bnwMTqbZX/aieGyzyE4NbJ1Kk5HC5GRf0NeJ0eY4hncCMsKzuaaArlZQ cdQneyNnGeyl9Alz9sFx6Rr1oIs7AMCuruO517AOiyNI6m+39Hc9bR/KyoAvUDfsOPrh cZ+Sh6D/fbQGzEi+KVXtqlX9LBveZ6EISHagLAhhl3/QMFYkUO4YYSZWVxQthIdN/hW3 0ciA== Tue, 19 Jan 2016 11:34:08 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.140.29.194 with HTTP; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 11:34:08 -0800 (PST) References: Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 14:34:08 -0500 From: Mark Andy To: Eric J Russell Cc: shop-talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5293910646823881048== --001a114a9ad0089b010529b4f4b0 Howdy, Snow tires. Mark On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 11:43 AM, Eric J Russell wrote: > We get the occasional snow/ice storm here in NC. NC doesn't plow/sand much > - they just wait for it to melt a day or two later. However, being an ER > nurse, I have to drive in it before Mother Nature takes care of it. I have > an F250, rear wheel drive with LSD. I can usually get around with its "all > season' tires. But when we get ice covered with snow it gets very > difficult. I do keep a few bags of sand in the bed. > > I am considering either real snow tires (I doubt studs are available or > allowed) *or* chains. > > http://www.etrailer.com/chains-1999_Ford_F-250+and+F-350+Super+Duty.htm?furl=-c2-235%7C85~16 > > > What say ye, learned shop-talkers? > > Eric Russell > Mebane, NC > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: > http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka@maracing.com > > > --001a114a9ad0089b010529b4f4b0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Howdy,

Snow tires.

=
Mark

On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 11:43 AM, Eric J Russell <= ejrussell@mebtel.= net> wrote:
We get the occasional snow/ice storm h= ere in NC. NC=20 doesn't plow/sand much - they just wait for it to melt a day or two lat= er.=20 However, being an ER nurse, I have to drive in it before Mother Nature take= s=20 care of it. I have an F250, rear wheel drive with LSD. I can usually=C2=A0g= et=20 around=C2=A0with its "all season' tires. But when we get ice cover= ed with snow=20 it gets very difficult. I do keep a few bags of sand in the bed.
=C2=A0
I am considering either real snow tire= s (I doubt=20 studs are available or allowed) *or* chains.
=C2=A0
What say ye, learned shop-talkers?
=C2=A0
Eric Russell
Mebane,=20 NC

_______________________________________________

Shop-talk@autox.team.net et=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html
Archive: http://www.team.net/archive
Forums: http://www.team.net/forums
alk/marka@maracing.com" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://autox.t= eam.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/marka@maracing.com



--001a114a9ad0089b010529b4f4b0-- --===============5293910646823881048== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============5293910646823881048==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 13:16:04 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED0262585350 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 13:16:03 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-oi0-f43.google.com (mail-oi0-f43.google.com [209.85.218.43]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC65825850BE for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 13:13:13 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-oi0-f43.google.com with SMTP id p187so183085411oia.2 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:18:16 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to:content-type; bh=r5rbVX+9k3NsVVDrOedCBE7BTW4V1kRGMjLXvOZOTno=; b=m3k/HDYd924XYv5zesOEdTXSfSK+mJrO+q920WSXoLyADprsbq1iDyMDtwfu53cJCn E/rbpuwWKy1ixqTyokAZit5IappDyS4fbe+z1ykxgPutPeKKzrEnxUkMzNOiQiTlT8VQ AUy3c+nab/zJGomBuuFEI+t4jL+FZ8cKuxaTsF4/5rwtTwxDxfNvPLAY9UzAfwJVKc1y ITCv1Syp/m8hB1OUfMurMsT+Yu6qEUHZrKN2AH4tRqx1tciWJEPvNcl9HYIYRe4fewPw idbaXBMfnoxfKyX5RyXMc+7IDVmmb2vzRIdjJLciA/fOJdp2giUJ3hLQBuzo7yvhYGM4 r+Xg== d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-type; bh=r5rbVX+9k3NsVVDrOedCBE7BTW4V1kRGMjLXvOZOTno=; b=LX7YfFrFgQww4dU83HjRx0BDj6fxf+jPY6SXxGDqPURpVuynViYMlVDRD4zcfbnw2L yUKK3RvT3Z//HJ6SZCVWEZ5rTN++i3rPppm9nn4X9Yw9Drm1MLI/XRw/78JhxIk0OsRL 6RXmf0Kvne3Fc6Mp4gkZsd38ZWENqPETvYzBoTzJUo48TOEW+0VFcgnUKS15dswY7qt/ 2rBFtsUfQZpLkQgz2nxGW2uhcZ5jZVyIOgv7sELGF45ynSxbaGONuxmalrOIFkFkvnfQ +EfAi4bus5fBYQhpRK1B+52GP7fLSsMp8CrSztnGvzggeit1S9fi57YhlKBwKwRpdVFI +K3g== Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:18:15 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.202.197.142 with HTTP; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:17:35 -0800 (PST) From: Scott Hall Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 14:17:35 -0600 To: "Shop-talk@autox.team.net" Subject: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6802955199961161737== --001a113d2424ce0d270529b591b2 Doing this again: Setting up the garage here. I might bring some of the tools up here, but most will stay at home. I'm buying everything from scratch. So..."industrial" vs. "automotive"? I think I remember that one was accepted as better than another, but I don't remember why, and I think the differences were slight. Let's tear the top off this can of worms again. Which should I tool up for? --001a113d2424ce0d270529b591b2 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Doing this again:

Setting up the garage= here. I might bring some of the tools up here, but most will stay at home.= I'm buying everything from scratch.

So...&quo= t;industrial" vs. "automotive"? I think I remember that one = was accepted as better than another, but I don't remember why, and I th= ink the differences were slight.

Let's tear th= e top off this can of worms again. Which should I tool up for?
--001a113d2424ce0d270529b591b2-- --===============6802955199961161737== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============6802955199961161737==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 13:31:02 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9449A25853EF for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 13:31:02 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail.milleredp.com (fw.milleredp.com [198.144.208.110]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 24A672585383 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 13:27:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from [10.1.2.100] ([::ffff:10.1.2.100]) (AUTH: PLAIN jem, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,128bits,AES128-SHA) by mail.milleredp.com with ESMTPSA; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:32:43 -0800 id 000000000028001E.00000000569E9D6B.000035A2 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: From: John Miller Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:32:43 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.1 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net On 1/19/2016 12:17 PM, Scott Hall wrote: > Doing this again: > > Setting up the garage here. I might bring some of the tools up here, but > most will stay at home. I'm buying everything from scratch. > > So..."industrial" vs. "automotive"? I think I remember that one was > accepted as better than another, but I don't remember why, and I think the > differences were slight. I think it's mostly "what you grabbed when you first plumbed it" I've got the big T-plug fittings. John. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 13:40:01 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E874B2585416 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 13:40:00 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ob0-f175.google.com (mail-ob0-f175.google.com [209.85.214.175]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08F1525853FD for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 13:39:56 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ob0-f175.google.com with SMTP id vt7so197629599obb.1 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:44:58 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-type; bh=qKHLhrs8SAWk0+u1Xr9piPlczEVpx7XoLmcwE/pUU20=; b=xyvyPbGoVr9lefrZj5KMAjtI+wjN0Qw/LgYqZ1hiiPcwZxNOrpdZ2FwEpKZB7k8oBb FJrdvdldZKcMtOzmK4lboKeP1C+jb+U9oVjeQ/DIfsFXjKYwWAVDKO3fTNsUOUKE9qyc 3avf7wneP2mfojjjtolcovBV87g/QpiOrcNbG3E9osOSUj8SZrj5wsDtCupdf4I2dHEE gy9UNcyPw4Z20Z8JocFQEQDHhhf0u5aTZjRttT6ccQFnnyCOq+PDnlnDW2s3A6E8fylP W72X36AydQt2WqclsydbdqvCtI6Kr0AYVHG8zPP0ulax3cvATmXBNqdYDu/etQUUsntt hdKg== d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:content-type; bh=qKHLhrs8SAWk0+u1Xr9piPlczEVpx7XoLmcwE/pUU20=; b=fcu6VNpbWoFGA/HyLJdPgc3JTuYGPA44C5OuTn6CWVul4wfz9q8oQ2hdKZepb65cDC tg+7euI05Z/Lg+VsWUf94g8mrg+aYyxyd0hL/Y8LtHxZvERT7RqM4s06XFggp/Zxczcv ysQByLEaYnhLCFEME9UEp1ezHzyujG63mgAv0N26Z8Zk4k0vmapttqQkseWPppZrwi3l hfVx2Gu43fhrD2NoGDhFqDsIyHDuYe4jiQ0tqA8fSPSC3OKtpAxa9oVnQGh9j0qYWAUm e/LZg9ZqhhZ8M7Jivq/u4NIMeLjL/mYXzuAEzSCkCS9lv3Hs0Og1WOQNy11cbnDzPuZX Uhsg== Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:44:57 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.202.197.142 with HTTP; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 12:44:18 -0800 (PST) References: <569E9D6B.90602@milleredp.com> From: Scott Hall Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 14:44:18 -0600 To: "Shop-talk@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4335942405318259685== --047d7bd6c5124f4f9b0529b5f13d Yeah, I always had "automotive" plugs at home because that's what I had. I just remember reading a debate somewhere and there was finally a consensus...I just don't remember what it was. On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 2:32 PM, John Miller wrote: > On 1/19/2016 12:17 PM, Scott Hall wrote: > >> Doing this again: >> >> Setting up the garage here. I might bring some of the tools up here, but >> most will stay at home. I'm buying everything from scratch. >> >> So..."industrial" vs. "automotive"? I think I remember that one was >> accepted as better than another, but I don't remember why, and I think the >> differences were slight. >> > > I think it's mostly "what you grabbed when you first plumbed it" > > I've got the big T-plug fittings. > > John. > --047d7bd6c5124f4f9b0529b5f13d Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Yeah, I always had "automotive" plugs at home be= cause that's what I had. I just remember reading a debate somewhere and= there was finally a consensus...I just don't remember what it was.
=

On Tue, Jan 19, 2= 016 at 2:32 PM, John Miller <jem@milleredp.com> wrote:
On 1/19/2016 12:17 PM, Scott = Hall wrote:
Doing this again:

Setting up the garage here. I might bring some of the tools up here, but most will stay at home. I'm buying everything from scratch.

So..."industrial" vs. "automotive"? I think I remember = that one was
accepted as better than another, but I don't remember why, and I think = the
differences were slight.

 I think it's mostly "what you grabbed when you first plumbed it&qu= ot;

I've got the big T-plug fittings.

John.
--047d7bd6c5124f4f9b0529b5f13d-- --===============4335942405318259685== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============4335942405318259685==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 14:37:49 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E39825852CB for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 14:37:49 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-wm0-f46.google.com (mail-wm0-f46.google.com [74.125.82.46]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80A64258527C for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 14:37:38 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-wm0-f46.google.com with SMTP id n5so133863151wmn.0 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 13:42:40 -0800 (PST) d=dougbraun.com; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=rw64NZu98jJvDKkVczOAeCTvqmMlrvNHWx8mBA5Xe4Y=; b=zaKdCTMAmvxVaz9b0Jq1X0sgamg7miOvjALcL6sgHIWZzzZ4Eq8hm4BkmwYwPRjYNj hrYpFI0a5be/wKtQt3AvD25vGulBtr9lrh208SQTD34hA0qrMofNu9BzFfe1NKQgKAJS l5GF/vXwubY39oCkYFE8yZon7maitJFEGXhUM= d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=rw64NZu98jJvDKkVczOAeCTvqmMlrvNHWx8mBA5Xe4Y=; b=iQTi3HDf4EY9qAi4uQMFerkSO8dcj+mPgNuIshfYrAR4CKVyregengwqZhFKE+M1d/ lpKHVZkNDxxg7gVgeaS+DwYZOG7zYWkPMKow2zJRutb9dopmTGTccknqx+8TyqE11yRv Y9z/TZuMR4096QbUBEwulzPHTGILpjkD8/458uBP9TO7jxNhi6+LdMD3TL45jQvBxrYQ PGOT0XBRmYo68X13/g4WeHgtHaZrais8ahmCVRa5tJ6m2ZeGpbfDP0CbSJ9Hu7pp4fjK S/lNc+7zYL3WY9EO7WN9OZ4C+uu5BF1OVFSX3o1F9Pw2CcAWVLwhHtPqAMLAN+6NQ75d jAMw== Tue, 19 Jan 2016 13:42:39 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.28.159.212 with HTTP; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 13:42:39 -0800 (PST) References: <569E9D6B.90602@milleredp.com> Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 16:42:39 -0500 From: Doug Braun To: Scott Hall Cc: "Shop-talk@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6603175252325595252== --047d7bf0c6b6aa7e070529b6bf17 I used to use the "industrial" style, but then I threw them all out and replaced them with the Milton high-flow "V" style. The V female fittings are compatible with the common automotive style male fittings, so I have a few of those on my lesser-used tools. The Milton V fittings are very reliable and leak-free, especially compared to the common cheapo automotive and industrial fittings. On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 3:44 PM, Scott Hall wrote: > Yeah, I always had "automotive" plugs at home because that's what I had. I > just remember reading a debate somewhere and there was finally a > consensus...I just don't remember what it was. > > --047d7bf0c6b6aa7e070529b6bf17 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I used to use the "industrial" st= yle, but then I threw them all out and replaced them with the Milton high-f= low "V" style.
The V female fittings are compatible with= the common automotive style male fittings, so I have a few of those on
=
my lesser-used tools.

The Milton V fittings are very reliable and leak-free, especially compared=20 to the common cheapo automotive and industrial fittings.

On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 3:44 PM, Sco= tt Hall <scott.hall.personal@gmail.com> wrote:
Yeah, I always had "= automotive" plugs at home because that's what I had. I just rememb= er reading a debate somewhere and there was finally a consensus...I just do= n't remember what it was.


--047d7bf0c6b6aa7e070529b6bf17-- --===============6603175252325595252== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============6603175252325595252==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 14:47:03 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8650258563D for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 14:47:03 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from dogbert2.mail.megageek.com (nj-69-34-94-16.sta.embarqhsd.net [69.34.94.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42C0025852D2 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 14:46:58 -0700 (MST) To: shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net From: eric@megageek.com Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 16:23:30 -0500 01/19/2016 16:23:31, Serialize complete at 01/19/2016 16:23:31 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multipart message in MIME format. --===============2862697665788518853== This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 0078030285257F3F_= Eric, I actually have these chains (well, the duallie model) for a 3500 GMC mason dump that I use for fire wood delivery. With the duallie, I can't find a 4x4 (or is it 6x6 in a duallie?). It's great when I have the wood in the back, but once I deliver it, the bed is empty. So I get almost no traction, and, of course I can't put sand or weights in the back because it will be too heavy when I have the wood. They are a little bit of a hassle to put on and off, but you will not get stuck. I would trade chains for 4x4 anyday. But chains will get the truck where you want to go safety (albeit SLOWLY!) Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. Eric P "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson --=_alternative 0078030285257F3F_=
Eric,

I actually have these chains (well, the duallie model) for a 3500 GMC mason dump that I use for fire wood delivery.  With the duallie, I can't find a 4x4 (or is it 6x6 in a duallie?).  It's great when I have the wood in the back, but once I deliver it, the bed is empty.  So I get almost no traction, and, of course I can't put sand or weights in the back because it will be too heavy when I have the wood.

They are a little bit of a hassle to put on and off, but you will not get stuck.

I would trade chains for 4x4 anyday.  But chains will get the truck where you want to go safety (albeit SLOWLY!)

Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem.
Eric P
"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson --=_alternative 0078030285257F3F_=-- --===============2862697665788518853== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============2862697665788518853==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 15:04:49 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEAAF2585600 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 15:04:49 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-ch2-06v.sys.comcast.net (resqmta-ch2-06v.sys.comcast.net [69.252.207.38]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61DB825854A6 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 15:04:43 -0700 (MST) Received: from resomta-ch2-07v.sys.comcast.net ([69.252.207.103]) by resqmta-ch2-06v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id 7y9H1s0032EPM3101y9lBG; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 22:09:45 +0000 Received: from resmail-po-057v.sys.comcast.net ([162.150.176.67]) by resomta-ch2-07v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id 7y9l1s0091TddKW01y9lry; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 22:09:45 +0000 Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 22:09:45 +0000 (UTC) From: Bob Spidell To: Scott Hall References: <569E9D6B.90602@milleredp.com> Thread-Topic: Air line adapters Thread-Index: 9EyQ5y1jMM1ttR6/D3DADWiT9KG2eA== s=q20140121; t=1453241385; bh=2/PbKOOENhV4l+qUJPDKR5DDNXtQDbZmzJeQm8NgFfk=; h=Received:Received:Date:From:To:Message-ID:Subject:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=uFXFlE6LiGTQubR82G4yJ09GGc6I1KrvXL1nMA+C4SJNke/eSdoDj/qhy/do3QMHE k3MloCB131I2Xmq7pKW9GL+eRLAUutdAyD+2VhFfWiDuL+IX2sUD5uaww4NjJ50y+S z3E08IAdxC7ycDPGjCPN3m/4YOetJ+k42l+agMps88KZ9LQpV2c+tckpjNNUoVZt2Q rxdw4ybgpk5191jwvsRNzlrZwf/g0Rrt8EuToJKPSDPTPdI6kgcKlZEQzsTmJ3Rlyr mf4SDShBkiKD2j5XTrs1SOQ18wpJbbTczcI5ieh/BAxiCXiX2U033R9iQ4AOd9ORWK DuVkDbpn1FXsw== Cc: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============5176450085060864053== boundary="----=_Part_8078271_385282569.1453241385014" ------=_Part_8078271_385282569.1453241385014 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit FWIW, industrial seems to be the de facto 'standard.' I just checked, and Harbor Freight no longer carries the automotive styl (if that matters). On another note, the cheap (HF) automotive connectors I have seem to leak; do the industrial or non-HF ones hold air? Bob ----- Original Message ----- From: "Scott Hall" To: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2016 12:44:18 PM Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Yeah, I always had "automotive" plugs at home because that's what I had. I just remember reading a debate somewhere and there was finally a consensus...I just don't remember what it was. On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 2:32 PM, John Miller < jem@milleredp.com > wrote: On 1/19/2016 12:17 PM, Scott Hall wrote:
Doing this again: Setting up the garage here. I might bring some of the tools up here, but most will stay at home. I'm buying everything from scratch. So..."industrial" vs. "automotive"? I think I remember that one was accepted as better than another, but I don't remember why, and I think the differences were slight. I think it's mostly "what you grabbed when you first plumbed it" I've got the big T-plug fittings. John.
------=_Part_8078271_385282569.1453241385014 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
FWIW, industrial seems to be the de fa= cto 'standard.'   I just checked, and Harbor Freight no longer ca= rries the automotive styl (if that matters).

On another note, the= cheap (HF) automotive connectors I have seem to leak; do the industrial or= non-HF ones hold air?

=
Bob

F= rom: "Scott Hall" <scott.hall.personal@gmail.com>
To: S= hop-talk@autox.team.net
Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2016 12:44:18 = PM
Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters

<= div dir=3D"ltr">Yeah, I always had "automotive" plugs at home because that'= s what I had. I just remember reading a debate somewhere and there was fina= lly a consensus...I just don't remember what it was.

On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 2:32 PM, Joh= n Miller <jem@milleredp.com> wrote:
On 1/19/2016 12:17 PM, Scott Hall wrote:
Doing this again:
Setting up the garage here. I might bring some of the tools up here, but=
most will stay at home. I'm buying everything from scratch.

S= o..."industrial" vs. "automotive"? I think I remember that one was
acce= pted as better than another, but I don't remember why, and I think the
= differences were slight.
I think it's mostly "what you gra= bbed when you first plumbed it"

I've got the big T-plug fittings.<= br>
John.


<= div>
------=_Part_8078271_385282569.1453241385014-- --===============5176450085060864053== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============5176450085060864053==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 15:09:31 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 360F225855F9 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 15:09:31 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-wm0-f54.google.com (mail-wm0-f54.google.com [74.125.82.54]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E3142585593 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 15:09:27 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-wm0-f54.google.com with SMTP id r129so108764512wmr.0 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 14:14:29 -0800 (PST) d=dougbraun.com; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=xI64UFOr23VFMulfxarVwBKL9nJJT062v+rBCoBXbkQ=; b=Qdy7bpBSaA50eJnBrp91s4BH8ih/xatkJulC6sDCWdmAYP6Ik02ZOnur7e40755OWh IMBhnvWyRWJ0Qn/CJ2WgxSRemPYSb5MWFa3IvsJwcj+tblgYQaKXxq9dPiBXmezFexCE hNoO96Jlv1nXK/Cj2ESlgzz2cs3tcmnr4j91E= d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=xI64UFOr23VFMulfxarVwBKL9nJJT062v+rBCoBXbkQ=; b=CabItatf/qJVt7inzYMZOHb6v72NczyFn6Tlpn1G+HgQ5cKh7T8GmT8fVFoTRnl2ZH 1vdXw7rB+Deydoisy/cqQSEY2JLW0DOQX6d8tH5c7G6r3o11BwO8Ikc6m8I/f/O+0f+n t75LviPY3O/z9mY+qfaz1fgwVNi2pJ7lB2YdNNKnXGyUlf5djP7h9ZtQR7jvLbhyCaYM 2YpdAJ3zGx8iZL6g+4wLP3AOHcxkW0nsICFsKQ31pYHIM61epR7qQgj/E7j1gfdNhkyA 1Ujh0343clOgXuqOweNtE7a98W5wQwO1ychq7dW4H2pxTBeTjvzRyYtgMqqcIwe+LTNc +5Zg== Tue, 19 Jan 2016 14:14:28 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.28.159.212 with HTTP; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 14:14:28 -0800 (PST) References: <569E9D6B.90602@milleredp.com> Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 17:14:28 -0500 From: Doug Braun To: Scott Hall Cc: "Shop-talk@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3145516844039806415== --001a11c28308705f090529b73104 Oops, I got "automotive" and "industrial" mixed up! Let me correct myself: I used to use the "automotive" style, but then I threw them all out and replaced them with the Milton high-flow "V" style. The V female fittings are compatible with the common industrial style male fittings (the pointy-er style), so I have a few of those on my lesser-used tools. On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 4:42 PM, Doug Braun wrote: > I used to use the "industrial" style, but then I threw them all out and > replaced them with the Milton high-flow "V" style. > The V female fittings are compatible with the common automotive style male > fittings, so I have a few of those on > my lesser-used tools. > > The Milton V fittings are very reliable and leak-free, especially compared > to the common cheapo automotive and industrial fittings. > > --001a11c28308705f090529b73104 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Oops, I got "automotive" and "industrial&qu= ot; mixed up!=C2=A0 Let me correct myself:

I used to use the "automotive" style, but then I threw them all= out and replaced them with the Milton high-flow "V" style.
The V female fittings are compatible with the common industrial style m= ale fittings (the pointy-er style), so I have a few of those on
my= lesser-used tools.



<= div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jan 19, 2016 at 4:42 PM, Doug Braun <do= ug@dougbraun.com> wrote:
I used to= use the "industrial" style, but then I threw them all out and re= placed them with the Milton high-flow "V" style.
The V f= emale fittings are compatible with the common automotive style male fitting= s, so I have a few of those on
my lesser-used tools.

= The Milton V fittings are very reliable and leak-free, especially compared=20 to the common cheapo automotive and industrial fittings.


--001a11c28308705f090529b73104-- --===============3145516844039806415== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============3145516844039806415==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 18:11:44 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 907AF25852CB for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 18:11:44 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from cdptpa-oedge-vip.email.rr.com (cdptpa-outbound-snat.email.rr.com [107.14.166.231]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D00F2585258 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 18:11:33 -0700 (MST) Received: from [172.248.153.253] ([172.248.153.253:2254] helo=rypc) by cdptpa-oedge03 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.0.35861 r(Momo-dev:tip)) with ESMTP id 44/39-17146-2FFDE965; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 01:16:35 +0000 From: "Randall" Cc: Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 17:16:39 -0800 Thread-Index: AdFTIDa9IBQ8JFyqSGKNzKo/iOuXsw== Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > On another note, the cheap (HF) automotive connectors I have > seem to leak; do the industrial or non-HF ones hold air? Is "automotive" the same thing as "Tru-Flate" ? http://www.mcmaster.com/?m=true#6534kac/=10r8eum I was set up with all industrial type, from what I thought was a good source (not HF). After a few years of only occasional service, they all leaked enough to be annoying. So I switched to the "Tru-Flate" style from MMC about 10 years ago now, and I've been happy with them. One or two of the female couplers had a problem, but disassembling and cleaning the seal fixed the leak. RANDALL _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 19:08:04 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 742A32580ACA for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 19:08:04 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from bradakis.com (50-198-190-18-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net [50.198.190.18]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11C222585915 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 19:07:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from bradakis.com (50-198-190-18-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net [50.198.190.18]) by bradakis.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53BD7411ACE1 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 19:12:56 -0700 (MST) To: "Shop-talk@autox.team.net" References: From: Mark J Bradakis Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 19:12:56 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:41.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/41.0 SeaMonkey/2.38 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net I plumbed my garage with M style. Mike Bailey, who retired last year and moved to Oregon plumbed Bailey's Automotive with I type. On those occasions when I worked there I had a hose with male I and female M with me if I wanted to use one of my tools in his air lines. mjb. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 19:48:18 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDE012585EF9 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 19:48:17 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from bradakis.com (50-198-190-18-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net [50.198.190.18]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E3182585CD1 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 19:43:49 -0700 (MST) Received: from bradakis.com (50-198-190-18-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net [50.198.190.18]) by bradakis.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5899B411ACE1 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 19:48:51 -0700 (MST) To: "Shop-talk@autox.team.net" References: From: Mark J Bradakis Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 19:48:50 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:41.0) Gecko/20100101 Firefox/41.0 SeaMonkey/2.38 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net I'm pretty sure I have told this before, but I'll once again incriminate myself. Back in the days of homebrewing, some quick connect brass garden hose fittings came on the market. Just like the air line fittings, I got a bunch for the brew room, thinking it will make hooking up the bottle washer, the chiller and the spray nozzle easy as can be. Well, not quite like the air line fittings, which can be disconnected while under pressure. mjb. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 19:54:53 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 37AAD2585C87 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 19:54:53 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from BAY004-OMC2S11.hotmail.com (bay004-omc2s11.hotmail.com [65.54.190.86]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACB832585C39 for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 19:54:46 -0700 (MST) Received: from BAY402-EAS179 ([65.54.190.124]) by BAY004-OMC2S11.hotmail.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(7.5.7601.23008); Tue, 19 Jan 2016 18:59:48 -0800 From: Jack Brooks To: References: <780941478.8078272.1453241385015.JavaMail.zimbra@comcast.net> <44.39.17146.2FFDE965@cdptpa-oedge03> Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 18:57:58 -0800 Thread-Index: AQABAgME7KfMqDKk0Mpwmj9fChCVqQCtJDVEAJHIG8wA9GHibgD/HVgcoorE64A= Content-Language: en-us FILETIME=[A011FEF0:01D1532E] Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net I have several connectors and made short gender/style changing connectors to keep from having to replace multiple fittings and for borrowed tools. Jack -----Original Message----- From: Shop-talk [mailto:shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net] On Behalf Of Randall Sent: Tuesday, January 19, 2016 5:17 PM Cc: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters > On another note, the cheap (HF) automotive connectors I have seem to > leak; do the industrial or non-HF ones hold air? Is "automotive" the same thing as "Tru-Flate" ? http://www.mcmaster.com/?m=true#6534kac/=10r8eum I was set up with all industrial type, from what I thought was a good source (not HF). After a few years of only occasional service, they all leaked enough to be annoying. So I switched to the "Tru-Flate" style from MMC about 10 years ago now, and I've been happy with them. One or two of the female couplers had a problem, but disassembling and cleaning the seal fixed the leak. RANDALL _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/jibrooks@live.com _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Tue Jan 19 23:04:09 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2E302585E6D for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 23:04:09 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from cdptpa-oedge-vip.email.rr.com (cdptpa-outbound-snat.email.rr.com [107.14.166.230]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 722922585E4E for ; Tue, 19 Jan 2016 22:59:48 -0700 (MST) Received: from [172.248.153.253] ([172.248.153.253:4085] helo=rypc) by cdptpa-oedge03 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.0.35861 r(Momo-dev:tip)) with ESMTP id 47/19-17146-2832F965; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 06:04:50 +0000 From: "Randall" To: "'shop-talk'" Date: Tue, 19 Jan 2016 22:04:54 -0800 Thread-Index: AdFS6QZ6gSiAC5jxRYymtd/DBjw22wAXzhoQ Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > Not warm but not stuck either... Same here, except it was a TR3 and I used the tire chains from a defunct garden tractor on regular street tires. Randall _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 20 08:43:18 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A46A2585B76 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:43:18 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from gateway36.websitewelcome.com (gateway36.websitewelcome.com [192.185.200.11]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10F5625844DA for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:43:04 -0700 (MST) Received: from cm2.websitewelcome.com (cm2.websitewelcome.com [192.185.178.13]) by gateway36.websitewelcome.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DF49A150B0FE for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 09:48:06 -0600 (CST) Received: from gator4190.hostgator.com ([108.167.189.15]) by cm2.websitewelcome.com with id 8Fo41s01j0LNdck01Fo52S; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 09:48:06 -0600 Received: from [128.111.216.187] (port=45414 helo=[192.168.1.101]) by gator4190.hostgator.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA:128) (Exim 4.85) (envelope-from ) id 1aLuzM-000DrO-Ks for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 09:48:04 -0600 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <44.39.17146.2FFDE965@cdptpa-oedge03> From: Mike Rambour Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2016 07:48:03 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.1 please include it with any abuse report Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net I use exclusively Milton t-Style, switched to them decades ago. But I admit the only reason I did was that a auto body guy I knew quite well was retiring and gave me some air tools of his and that is what they had on them, since I had only one air tool and he gave me quite a few it made sense to switch and also that way I could go into the shop and use my tools in the shop when I needed a few extra dollars after school. I have never had any leak EXCEPT the Harbor Fright ones http://www.summitracing.com/parts/mli-s-783?seid=srese1&gclid=Cj0KEQiA_fy0BRCwiLaQ5-iFgpwBEiQA884sOe17iJQf44KwK2O1boD1s5Kjp0yvotWz6y6rxk9_TXsaAoAj8P8HAQ Mike On 1/19/2016 5:16 PM, Randall wrote: >> On another note, the cheap (HF) automotive connectors I have >> seem to leak; do the industrial or non-HF ones hold air? > Is "automotive" the same thing as "Tru-Flate" ? > http://www.mcmaster.com/?m=true#6534kac/=10r8eum > > I was set up with all industrial type, from what I thought was a good source (not HF). After a few years of only occasional > service, they all leaked enough to be annoying. So I switched to the "Tru-Flate" style from MMC about 10 years ago now, and I've > been happy with them. One or two of the female couplers had a problem, but disassembling and cleaning the seal fixed the leak. > > RANDALL > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/lists@dinospider.com > -- A gun is like a parachute, if you need one but don't have it, you'll probably never need one again. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 20 08:44:57 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0B12D2586056 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:44:57 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-ch2-04v.sys.comcast.net (resqmta-ch2-04v.sys.comcast.net [69.252.207.36]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C7F42585140 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:44:52 -0700 (MST) Received: from resomta-ch2-14v.sys.comcast.net ([69.252.207.110]) by resqmta-ch2-04v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id 8FlH1s0062PT3Qt01Fpvpy; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 15:49:55 +0000 Received: from resmail-po-057v.sys.comcast.net ([162.150.176.67]) by resomta-ch2-14v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id 8Fpu1s00e1TddKW01Fpuh4; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 15:49:55 +0000 Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2016 15:49:54 +0000 (UTC) From: Bob Spidell To: Randall References: <44.39.17146.2FFDE965@cdptpa-oedge03> Thread-Topic: Air line adapters Thread-Index: AdFTIDa9IBQ8JFyqSGKNzKo/iOuXs1WCoWxc s=q20140121; t=1453304995; bh=Xc0Tznxa6Kh37y+Gqbf3UlE0v+NhToRebjTSEZh8VgA=; h=Received:Received:Date:From:To:Message-ID:Subject:MIME-Version: Content-Type; b=b1c3yFfJLraSFENAn1bpijM641QToS3b0zdbZgFStGlpBwctyy9O2YYlfN4fyIFBA ZspgNmU9KGDQetIJGnc8cuojJpuL+AFfEtt7QiTPxQwrjvdkn6zMDsJweT42r+aAGF 7bGBz0IVxOiVlSKMSf4367r1ImbDnI+kEAgqFRBBrS/4d8Vc+ETIW8b9kOwCbFx6A2 K5DHmq7X7LeTLLCEWUbsY+D/pMmUOuGWN1kG2ZXx2IRXaI1p6v6twwnMgw2TtSCciO +mKguHoGkqmM3mVESlI4MicNsDgV36HFR/CRmo8eSwsbfbcdVtZZ94QuGxpUcpzkCK 6sugiv4yeoV3A== Cc: Shop-talk@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============4991950627954086707== boundary="----=_Part_8499837_411588334.1453304994511" ------=_Part_8499837_411588334.1453304994511 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit They appear similar. ----- Original Message ----- > On another note, the cheap (HF) automotive connectors I have > seem to leak; do the industrial or non-HF ones hold air? Is "automotive" the same thing as "Tru-Flate" ? http://www.mcmaster.com/?m=true#6534kac/=10r8eum I was set up with all industrial type, from what I thought was a good source (not HF). After a few years of only occasional service, they all leaked enough to be annoying. So I switched to the "Tru-Flate" style from MMC about 10 years ago now, and I've been happy with them. One or two of the female couplers had a problem, but disassembling and cleaning the seal fixed the leak. RANDALL ------=_Part_8499837_411588334.1453304994511 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
They appear similar.



> On another note, the cheap (HF= ) automotive connectors I have
> seem to leak; do the industrial or = non-HF ones hold air?

Is "automotive" the same thing as "= Tru-Flate" ?
http://www.mcmaster.com/?m=3Dtrue#6534kac/=3D10r8eum

I was set up with all industrial type, from what I thought was = a good source (not HF).  After a few years of only occasional
servi= ce, they all leaked enough to be annoying.  So I switched to the "Tru-= Flate" style from MMC about 10 years ago now, and I've
been happy with t= hem.  One or two of the female couplers had a problem, but disassembli= ng and cleaning the seal fixed the leak.

RANDALL

<= div>

------=_Part_8499837_411588334.1453304994511-- --===============4991950627954086707== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============4991950627954086707==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 20 08:57:45 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 365C52586140 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:57:45 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-ch2-08v.sys.comcast.net (resqmta-ch2-08v.sys.comcast.net [69.252.207.40]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED7E725860B4 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:57:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from resomta-ch2-10v.sys.comcast.net ([69.252.207.106]) by resqmta-ch2-08v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id 8G2V1s0052JGN3p01G2iYt; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 16:02:42 +0000 Received: from [IPv6:2601:600:4000:c20a:8162:b702:78c3:a477] ([IPv6:2601:600:4000:c20a:8162:b702:78c3:a477]) by resomta-ch2-10v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id 8G2h1s0093h2dj301G2iFF; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 16:02:42 +0000 To: Eric J Russell , shop-talk From: Bob Kegel Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:02:41 -0800 Importance: normal References: s=q20140121; t=1453305762; bh=ClcuZYDG4pq4UlatTYAlvRkhJvG443IJXflL9js4LKw=; h=Received:Received:MIME-Version:To:From:Subject:Date:Content-Type; b=CNsrxWUk0oLdrxNYplNUZxU43E7H4VBLtIcTZlwRFT/k201s554AUjOh92btIIMXo tHtK18qh4LwGBUvI0AxG60HYZCaViwzO0E9g7HRYUF7fyJ2t56vToWnUd8Mz6JwNTf KzDY1CGmS8n2Kyj/XjDQACboWcv573x3EnF6ryFFmgXuiY2KmKBkcpz82Gswh0ne7h U1N926+uPIjH4G0bHJ7L8p48RhrnXa1clOIIL5B1mlb/t+UP6E30AsDpwVdEVY0HIJ /ZljT6zVPemwhjNWx32yWbKUUA+h/bToPYaMEtBm6kLz2gIeQvjgakqOV8qxm6sk47 j9NVuTCHVH9Dw== Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3224946330579947048== boundary="_FCF5E56F-FB05-41E4-9A44-6058F0375097_" --_FCF5E56F-FB05-41E4-9A44-6058F0375097_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Best snow tire I=E2=80=99ve found is the Nokian=C2=A0Hakkapeliitta, made in= Finland. My son would borrow them, and the AWD Aerostar they were mounted = on, when he worked as a ski instructor. Nothing stopped then, he says. Bob K --_FCF5E56F-FB05-41E4-9A44-6058F0375097_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Best snow tire I=E2=80=99ve found is the Nokian Hakkapeliitta, mad= e in Finland. My son would borrow them, and the AWD Aerostar they were moun= ted on, when he worked as a ski instructor.=C2=A0 Nothing stopped then, he = says.

 

Bob K=

 

 

= --_FCF5E56F-FB05-41E4-9A44-6058F0375097_-- --===============3224946330579947048== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============3224946330579947048==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 20 09:44:55 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F49A2585B3B for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 09:44:55 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail.milleredp.com (fw.milleredp.com [198.144.208.110]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 332CC2585B0A for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 09:44:44 -0700 (MST) Received: from [10.1.2.100] ([::ffff:10.1.2.100]) (AUTH: PLAIN jem, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,128bits,AES128-SHA) by mail.milleredp.com with ESMTPSA; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:49:45 -0800 id 000000000028001B.00000000569FBAA9.000001E5 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <44.39.17146.2FFDE965@cdptpa-oedge03> <569FAC33.8000404@dinospider.com> From: John Miller Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:49:40 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.1 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Air line adapters Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net On 1/20/2016 7:48 AM, Mike Rambour wrote: > > I use exclusively Milton t-Style, Yeah, the T-style is the Tru-Flate, I use the 3/8in Tru-Flate exclusively. As far as leakage goes, my one lesson has been this: when I plumbed the garage for air a decade or so ago, I pointed all the quick-connect couplers down. Bad idea. Even with a fair amount of attention to drainage, and even with brass quick-connects, you still get just enough moisture in the lines to cause a little buildup and corrosion, and they'll end up sticky and leak-prone over time. Keep them at least horizontal, try to use them all regularly, squirt a little WD-40 or something in there periodically when you do. John. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 20 09:51:52 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F02DB2585D84 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 09:51:51 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ob0-f180.google.com (mail-ob0-f180.google.com [209.85.214.180]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 66E752585D44 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 09:49:48 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ob0-f180.google.com with SMTP id is5so11879591obc.0 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:54:51 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :content-type; bh=q2Zasbv/d+xIrXYzHZ9ROJDcu2IxMuZ9MRgY90qx6j8=; b=n8/qvrmMDQX3PJiBYA0/CWOIP2H5mgI1ABeoxItmbbVv89Whf3KO5/NFfkMOMXRIyg 4OWaVajzZI4RgEqP4aSKNwxdVEsnI1X0RL//TY3Pp3XquGE283xM7w3/Axvp6r4uqAbd IlZIFzqbCLcZlKii6nUChQYI32QBrjj7EJc4esrIb8AxUZoDhfNcava4ipgBeOfbEWOz 1V20fY+aRcqMSnSPqGTZh6XQWflrNYR3+aYtJsed4nMCHutze5gWg97uXy/8E/cid8aK gQmbPf4IVurPsjuj/Vqrfw4mJ1UM2DgVjF+jlF8EDV+74SmMEuW3gXlYy+rmk/l2xVvJ Jdhw== d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:content-type; bh=q2Zasbv/d+xIrXYzHZ9ROJDcu2IxMuZ9MRgY90qx6j8=; b=bNlKlZxv9Y2LwBO3FqpJqX+/C7XQwIW4ifdgtIhrCypabY+R8WPq35Jug2rnnLprXM oRd/u6onxxI3eTyN5B9T/JYJupFJaJj8OCm3Gf4FREz3fiSIwHGdjM4lzobUfWUwmtGY J8WGA/lW8Q4dmy45pBV5vfc9QMDH2t+dezFPTpBPzzdY9MBYY8GwkuAOqscwa/QLHqj9 2jfoIZlr6IUtlhzY3hq61ku9cudTk0SMDGMHqJeRExC4JzFJM8Bjg8+nIo5WiUcgVIj6 O99uuKDp10JQ1rSZ84fU+EFyxjWxHDG1zVr5WScAxw4dtCrEaevNGPE0mPlqCyoLw+WV SQnw== Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:54:51 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.202.197.142 with HTTP; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 08:54:11 -0800 (PST) References: <20160120155746.975AD2586154@autox.team.net> From: Scott Hall Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2016 10:54:11 -0600 To: "Shop-talk@autox.team.net" Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3703031157503390068== --047d7bd6c5123333fe0529c6d812 I've got a stupid question: when do you use snow tires? For example, it snowed six inches or so here last night, and I know I'd like some snow tires right now since the roads are still covered with snow and slush and only a few bare patches of pavement. By tonight, though, everything will have been plowed repeatedly and driven over such that the only snow I'll drive over will be a few patches in our parking lot before they melt by the end of this week. So...what do you do when you're only driving over actual 'snow' a few times a year? Do you still put on snow tires and leave them on until spring? It'll be cold here until early March, but I'll only drive on actual snow a few minutes per year. The rest of the time there will be paved roads. I'd ignore the whole issue, but even on my .8 mile commute home last night I got sideways at every intersection and the traction control and stability control were going crazy. And I never got over 20 m.p.h. It was a TREMENDIOUS amount of fun (it was 11:00 p.m. and I was the only one out) but there was really no question of going anywhere except home and then staying there. If I'd had to have driven somewhere, well, that would have been bad. --047d7bd6c5123333fe0529c6d812 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I've got a stupid question: when do you use snow tires= ?

For example, it snowed six inches or so here last nigh= t, and I know I'd like some snow tires right now since the roads are st= ill covered with snow and slush and only a few bare patches of pavement. By= tonight, though, everything will have been plowed repeatedly and driven ov= er such that the only snow I'll drive over will be a few patches in our= parking lot before they melt by the end of this week.

=
So...what do you do when you're only driving over actual 'snow= ' a few times a year? Do you still put on snow tires and leave them on = until spring? It'll be cold here until early March, but I'll only d= rive on actual snow a few minutes per year. The rest of the time there will= be paved roads.

I'd ignore the whole issue, b= ut even on my .8 mile commute home last night I got sideways at every inter= section and the traction control and stability control were going crazy. An= d I never got over 20 m.p.h. It was a TREMENDIOUS amount of fun (it was 11:= 00 p.m. and I was the only one out) but there was really no question of goi= ng anywhere except home and then staying there. If I'd had to have driv= en somewhere, well, that would have been bad.
--047d7bd6c5123333fe0529c6d812-- --===============3703031157503390068== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============3703031157503390068==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 20 10:37:05 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 148F62585FD9 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 10:37:05 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from dogbert2.mail.megageek.com (nj-69-34-94-16.sta.embarqhsd.net [69.34.94.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8270025850D8 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 10:34:40 -0700 (MST) References: <20160120155746.975AD2586154@autox.team.net> To: shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net From: eric@megageek.com Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2016 12:11:12 -0500 01/20/2016 12:11:14, Serialize complete at 01/20/2016 12:11:14 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multipart message in MIME format. --===============4182860740285731062== This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 006100B885257F40_= Scott asks about actual use of chains. Normally, what I do is just have them in the truck and put them on if I need them. Sometimes, I might just get stuck in a small patch of ice. I can just throw the chains down and drive over them, then I pick them back up. If the road are bad, I can put them on before I leave. but I take them off once the roads are somewhat clear. Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. Eric P "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson --=_alternative 006100B885257F40_= Scott asks about actual use of chains.

Normally, what I do is just have them in the truck and put them on if I need them.  Sometimes, I might just get stuck in a small patch of ice.  I can just throw the chains down and drive over them, then I pick them back up.

If the road are bad, I can put them on before I leave.  but I take them off once the roads are somewhat clear.


Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem.
Eric P
"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson --=_alternative 006100B885257F40_=-- --===============4182860740285731062== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============4182860740285731062==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 20 10:43:36 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 88C162585FC7 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 10:43:36 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from cdptpa-oedge-vip.email.rr.com (cdptpa-outbound-snat.email.rr.com [107.14.166.227]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F1CB2585544 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 10:43:30 -0700 (MST) Received: from [172.248.153.253] ([172.248.153.253:3821] helo=rypc) by cdptpa-oedge01 (envelope-from ) (ecelerity 3.5.0.35861 r(Momo-dev:tip)) with ESMTP id F6/4D-05673-178CF965; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 17:48:33 +0000 From: "Randall" To: Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2016 09:48:37 -0800 Thread-Index: AdFTo50L62Vw3vglQK2XMUg0QiHVHgABnY5A Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > So...what do you do when you're only driving over actual > 'snow' a few times a year? Do you still put on snow tires and > leave them on until spring? I just drive on it; with a set of chains in the trunk. Turn off the traction and stability control; and learn to drive with only 2% of normal traction. It can be done. Of course, now I live where it never snows; but "back in the day", I would routinely go out driving even when the state declared martial law and didn't even try to plow the roads. -- Randall _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 20 11:15:05 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3BC6E25860AC for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 11:15:05 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from itonami.pair.com (itonami.pair.com [209.68.2.178]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80B942586038 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 11:14:57 -0700 (MST) Received: by itonami.pair.com (Postfix, from userid 3198) id D37AC8FC17; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 13:19:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by itonami.pair.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1C948FC0E for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 13:19:59 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2016 13:19:59 -0500 (EST) From: David Hillman To: "Shop-talk@autox.team.net" References: <20160120155746.975AD2586154@autox.team.net> User-Agent: Alpine 2.02 (BSF 1266 2009-07-14) Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net On Wed, 20 Jan 2016, Scott Hall wrote: > So...what do you do when you're only driving over actual 'snow' a few times > a year? Do you still put on snow tires and leave them on until spring? > It'll be cold here until early March, but I'll only drive on actual snow a > few minutes per year. The rest of the time there will be paved roads. > > I'd ignore the whole issue, but even on my .8 mile commute home last night > I got sideways at every intersection and the traction control and stability > control were going crazy. And I never got over 20 m.p.h. It was a > TREMENDIOUS amount of fun (it was 11:00 p.m. and I was the only one out) > but there was really no question of going anywhere except home and then > staying there. If I'd had to have driven somewhere, well, that would have > been bad. This is basically the biggest single advantage of rubber snow tires over chains or studs. You can just put them on when the first snowfall is forecast, and take them off a few months later. They will be just fine as everyday tires. Yes, they will wear, but unless you drive a ton of miles, that won't matter. You're going to want to replace them after four or five winters anyway, as by that time the rubber will be aged and hardening up. Even if it's cold and dry, snow tires -- with their soft compound -- will probably have more grip than your all-seasons anyway. As long as you can find room to store an extra set of tires -- preferably cool and dry, there's really no downside. You can now buy better summer tires instead of all-seasons -- which are really just tires that suck all year long -- and if you care about the wheels on your car, you can keep them out of the salt over the winter. -- David Hillman _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 20 13:40:21 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 708F02586F53 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 13:40:21 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from seamless.hostnac.com (seamless.hostnac.com [199.189.253.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B3B52586F21 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 13:40:11 -0700 (MST) Received: from 192-0-144-53.cpe.teksavvy.com ([192.0.144.53]:46829 helo=johnpc.localnet) by seamless.hostnac.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1aLzct-0007bO-S1 for shop-talk@autox.team.net; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 15:45:11 -0500 From: "John P. New" To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2016 15:45:12 -0500 User-Agent: KMail/4.14.10 (Linux/4.1.13-5-default; KDE/4.14.10; x86_64; ; ) References: <20160120155746.975AD2586154@autox.team.net> please include it with any abuse report jnew@hazelden.ca Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net I live in Canada (London, Ontario). Somewhat cold in the winter (certainly not as cold as as Winnipeg) but very snowy. I drive with winter tires on all my winter cars and it makes a huge difference. Since I have been using snow tires, I can't recall ever getting stuck anywhere, even when we got almost 40 inches of snow over a 48-hour period a couple of years ago. For years now, the tire dealers here have avoided the term "snow tire" and have instead referred to them as "winter tires", because it's not the snow but the cold that affects tires the most (although obviously snow and cold go mostly hand-in-hand). The reasoning is this: when a summer or all-season tire gets cold, its rubber compound gets hard and loses the ability to grip the road surface. The magic temperature at which this starts happening has been marketed as 7 degrees C (about 45 degrees F). The rubber in winter tires is manufactured to stay soft, and therefore grippy, at much lower temperatures than summer/all-season (marketed here as 3-season) tires. So, even on dry pavement, non-winter tires will provide poor traction at -10 or -20 degrees; add slush, snow or ice to that and you have no hope of controlling your vehicle. I usually change over to winter wheels & tires when the average daily temperature gets around 5 degrees C (about 40 degrees F) for any length of time. I don't switch wheels/tires back to regular tires until it warms up in the spring, even if the temperature warms up for a while or I drive somewhere warmer; yes, winter tires wear faster in warmer weather, but I'm not about to change wheels/tires every couple of weeks. So remember, it's not the snow, it's the cold! John P. New London, Ontario, Canada On January 20, 2016 10:54:11 AM Scott Hall wrote: > I've got a stupid question: when do you use snow tires? > > For example, it snowed six inches or so here last night, and I know I'd > like some snow tires right now since the roads are still covered with snow > and slush and only a few bare patches of pavement. By tonight, though, > everything will have been plowed repeatedly and driven over such that the > only snow I'll drive over will be a few patches in our parking lot before > they melt by the end of this week. > > So...what do you do when you're only driving over actual 'snow' a few times > a year? Do you still put on snow tires and leave them on until spring? > It'll be cold here until early March, but I'll only drive on actual snow a > few minutes per year. The rest of the time there will be paved roads. > > I'd ignore the whole issue, but even on my .8 mile commute home last night > I got sideways at every intersection and the traction control and stability > control were going crazy. And I never got over 20 m.p.h. It was a > TREMENDIOUS amount of fun (it was 11:00 p.m. and I was the only one out) > but there was really no question of going anywhere except home and then > staying there. If I'd had to have driven somewhere, well, that would have > been bad. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 20 20:14:05 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E80F2586018 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 20:14:05 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-po-04v.sys.comcast.net (resqmta-po-04v.sys.comcast.net [96.114.154.163]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E16C2586006 for ; Wed, 20 Jan 2016 20:13:54 -0700 (MST) Received: from resomta-po-08v.sys.comcast.net ([96.114.154.232]) by resqmta-po-04v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id 8TJs1s003516pyw01TJwGH; Thu, 21 Jan 2016 03:18:56 +0000 Received: from [192.168.0.106] ([50.168.107.76]) by resomta-po-08v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id 8TJv1s00B1evlWS01TJwXg; Thu, 21 Jan 2016 03:18:56 +0000 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: From: Mark Miller Date: Wed, 20 Jan 2016 19:18:53 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.1 s=q20140121; t=1453346336; bh=m08IJ9P+WcJRceblJ/Vi60l+vw9vz8YMIvtWzCniQrc=; h=Received:Received:Subject:To:Reply-To:From:Message-ID:Date: MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=sV5gHEZZAoyqksJ4CKJQRjfoMMZQ1qptmClLF8jO9U6btDAH6Ey8TlywN5vfl03/2 9dg+8i1nIFZgGTSaFWIGmOI1A1Hux+niM80lIbLmTBny044Jb/BE4KRnD1mRMLwmeQ frWgOHMDvTm1ndHkc/NQHtfmKtXqPOONfpfmlxsWwuekdXYAUlxg5wexFfofuyWiHU 3gBQz/qQQjiHJ/uSyCC/loEOuI11XFu/R8glJ+khH4DsnShsynviqzEozKhEp+q+5D Bpfn959oGKu3+ZH6PtzBefaST44lFESWZzH95MlDLqO4GYPjacem7jaa6TGU4V7zIG 7w/fL6/ZBAtOw== Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Personally I found that I was a far worse driver with LSD. Even a bit of mescaline was enough to mess up any commute. That said, I'd recommend getting a set of snow tires for the winter, mount them on a spare set of rims (junkyard visit time), and put them on when weather approaches and keep them on till final thaw. I grew up with snow and now live where I have to choose to drive to it (Northern California). As most folks here have little to no everyday (or ever) experience with snow there is mandatory chain use when there is snow or ice. They are a pain, but do the job of at least slowing people way down. Regards, Mark Miller markmiller@threeboysfarm.com On 1/19/2016 10:34 AM, shop-talk-request@autox.team.net wrote: > Subject: [Shop-talk] chains vs snow tires > " > > We get the occasional snow/ice storm here in NC. NC doesn't plow/sand much - they just wait for it to melt a day or two later. However, being an ER nurse, I have to drive in it before Mother Nature takes care of it. I have an F250, rear wheel drive with LSD. I can usually get around with its "all season' tires. But when we get ice covered with snow it gets very difficult. I do keep a few bags of sand in the bed. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Wed Jan 27 16:11:51 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 244532585334 for ; Wed, 27 Jan 2016 16:11:51 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-ig0-f169.google.com (mail-ig0-f169.google.com [209.85.213.169]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A58B325852DB for ; Wed, 27 Jan 2016 16:11:42 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-ig0-f169.google.com with SMTP id mw1so843380igb.1 for ; Wed, 27 Jan 2016 15:16:51 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=stLkGlRQYobR89tDTjgsPYmIDPVh/y8ZvEhZd9UD7DA=; b=w4ohMLK5l3735WIkdupZFjg9khYXfzZPXHKBQgdKaTjDmWRbPuivrPnE5JpADH1UTS pkfZlb1NTPcXvadZulWORbk3h/S4w6rGXol6jXvnWvRRY5CvtF8y48NQ+Kh0w0DXKuCF DotrIhpSaDptGHCZcmHAxgteAw6Xxfz/djoOwTTcXey1X/SWxVsMZQXFTiYTBazE+Gl3 EZI5MOhLZdZK8fNkZfKqhc/8VrrCHXe3S/otXpXSJ6SyjKJSn5FT6evEQ+8AgDi8fINk Lg60YCG9lHeo28oNbt9ncC2EqgQb0gZz7K7bX6rXpF1mrrcwZyzDHvssWX1HvfsAr6NM C4Jw== d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=stLkGlRQYobR89tDTjgsPYmIDPVh/y8ZvEhZd9UD7DA=; b=ZmNsi7GGOgUWBYRUuJ0hRiHI5pwDVE4818PDI8+MUxlib50bof/gUdOtM7tnFOx2JU APxcoXO+9wKg7/f4GUiVPZNDQbw8vE9adKFS2l6bv9lwFDWYd3lCbJzFrMB8Edtvj/wB xla11YYhwggpqZS1o2dDAzlohi+RtZEuktKi9LC7/OnnuBSNuwGQxQJjlNt+CvqaFAp2 7HKyejHuDbP/wwVZTLMZx8A8cRrzF86nNgwvGhrkPbNhk2TVXo0ly5BPs8UYYZ7HXXZS beX3t7FF/h1nefSTw57bYPD/pv+QQgZMv0b75dxz6k4vv8IqVK4vBM64j/ydottCUQem 4YWQ== Wed, 27 Jan 2016 15:16:51 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.36.134.135 with HTTP; Wed, 27 Jan 2016 15:16:51 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 27 Jan 2016 17:16:51 -0600 From: Philip Ethier To: Shop-Talk , Philip Ethier Subject: [Shop-talk] Rust remover recomendation Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3619146993417808453== --047d7bdc12543d5b43052a58ffef This is from a well-known private publication that might sue me if I quote them: Best soak: Evaporust in one-gallon size for 23 bucks. Best brush-on: Bull Frog Rust Remover in 16 ounces for 11 bucks. Only one tested that prevents flash rusting. -- Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red, the only automatic of the bunch 2005 Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl 2005 Subaru Legacy GT Limited, Regal Blue Pearl http://www.mnautox.com --047d7bdc12543d5b43052a58ffef Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This is from a well-known private publication that might s= ue me if I quote them:

Best soak: =C2=A0Evaporust in one= -gallon size for 23 bucks.


Best bru= sh-on: =C2=A0Bull Frog Rust Remover in 16 ounces for 11 bucks.=C2=A0 Only o= ne tested that prevents flash rusting.
--
Phil Ethier West Side Saint Paul Minnesota USA
= 1973 Triumph Stag LE22439UBW "uncle jack", Sapphire Blue= 2004 Suburban 8.1, Sport Red, the only automatic of the bunch
2005 = Lotus Elise, Bordeaux Red Pearl
2005 Subaru Legacy GT Limited, Rega= l Blue Pearl
http= ://www.mnautox.com
--047d7bdc12543d5b43052a58ffef-- --===============3619146993417808453== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============3619146993417808453==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 28 09:59:18 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7C1E2585972 for ; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 09:59:18 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com (outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com [64.136.55.36]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 8E24C2585538 for ; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 09:59:08 -0700 (MST) t=1454000657; bh=47DEQpj8HBSa+/TImW+5JCeuQeRkm5NMpJWZG3hSuFU=; l=0; h=From:Date:To:Subject:Message-Id:Content-Type; b=XmLPN7ftPKGZlnqK4xH746lE7jG3nOdwoXMIXUkNxd0nWtUh8y+nGvqqxTe7JYy9x XepGhuiEhF2Rozn9J4GY6H0/gXuEHKY8V1bROSJCHKQXGTFrotvoi2g6/3fwH288CG puy7WSUMhGS8A2a72LLMpwzp3mS3T34TILVPcfZ0= Received: from outbound-bu1.vgs.untd.com (webmail09.vgs.untd.com [10.181.12.149]) by smtpout01.vgs.untd.com with SMTP id AABMLWUQ2A3PSCM2 for (sender ); Thu, 28 Jan 2016 09:03:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from [165.117.235.8] by webmail09.vgs.untd.com with HTTP: Thu, 28 Jan 2016 17:02:23 GMT From: "Matt" Full-Name: "Matt" Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2016 17:02:23 GMT To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Subject: [Shop-talk] wifi router again Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============0936925592730395529== ----__JWM__J3dc6d4a2.1ac974bS.7d99f189M Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline I have been messing around with my home network for many months a littl= e here and there with mixed results.I had been planning to make use of s= ome old b/g routers to add range but after running cat5e around the hous= e found that the old routers didn't have the capability to set for AP on= ly. I thought the wife and daughters would be happy with wired so ran s= ome more cable only to be advised recently that they still wanted strong= reliable wifi... I am throwing in the towel on my normal reuse mantra a= nd am prepared to throw $$ at the problem and buy a state of the art rou= ter. Just trying to determine the state of the art. I know some of you= guys are network knowledgeable so what say you. I have a 2 story house= , around 3K SF and looking to provide some signal in the yard as well. I= thought we had discussed this recently but the most recent that I could= find in the archive is 2011. I hope to pull the trigger on something fr= om Amazon or newegg tonight or tomorrow. TIA! Matt BarreColumbus, GA ----__JWM__J3dc6d4a2.1ac974bS.7d99f189M Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
 
I have been messing around with my home network for many months a l= ittle here and there with mixed results.
I had been planning to make use of some old b/g routers to add rang= e but after running cat5e around the house found that the old routers di= dn't have the capability to set for AP only.  I thought the wife an= d daughters would be happy with wired so ran some more cable only to be = advised recently that they still wanted strong reliable wifi...
 
I am throwing in the towel on my normal reuse mantra and am prepare= d to throw $$ at the problem and buy a state of the art router.  Ju= st trying to determine the state of the art.  I know some of you gu= ys are network knowledgeable so what say you.  I have a 2 story hou= se, around 3K SF and looking to provide some signal in the yard as well.=
 
I thought we had discussed this recently but the most recent that I= could find in the archive is 2011.
 
I hope to pull the trigger on something from Amazon or newegg tonig= ht or tomorrow.
 
TIA!
 
Matt Barre
Columbus, GA
 
 
 
----__JWM__J3dc6d4a2.1ac974bS.7d99f189M-- --===============0936925592730395529== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============0936925592730395529==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 28 11:16:11 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD50A2585FAB for ; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 11:16:11 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail.milleredp.com (fw.milleredp.com [198.144.208.110]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EE952585F74 for ; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 11:16:03 -0700 (MST) Received: from [10.1.2.100] ([::ffff:10.1.2.100]) (AUTH: PLAIN jem, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,128bits,AES128-SHA) by mail.milleredp.com with ESMTPSA; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 10:21:11 -0800 id 00000000002800C9.0000000056AA5C17.00004A28 References: <56AA5BFF.8070407@milleredp.com> To: shop-talk@autox.team.net From: John Miller Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2016 10:21:11 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.1 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] wifi router again Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > I am throwing in the towel on my normal reuse mantra and am prepared to > throw $$ at the problem and buy a state of the art router. I'm in the process of replacing my Zyxel USG20W with an ASUS RT-AC68U. There are some elements of the ASUS that are a step down from the Zyxel (in particular, a single DMZ host vs a complete DMZ subnet, this is a software dumbing-down issue 'cause the hardware can readily support it) but 802.11ac is starting to matter for me. John. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 28 12:58:51 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F01A25851E4 for ; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 12:58:51 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from BAY004-OMC2S4.hotmail.com (bay004-omc2s4.hotmail.com [65.54.190.79]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C1C2A2585169 for ; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 12:58:42 -0700 (MST) Received: from na01-bn1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com ([65.54.190.124]) by BAY004-OMC2S4.hotmail.com over TLS secured channel with Microsoft SMTPSVC(7.5.7601.23008); Thu, 28 Jan 2016 12:03:52 -0800 Received: from CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.145) by CY1PR13MB0501.namprd13.prod.outlook.com (10.164.70.143) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.396.8; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 20:03:50 +0000 Received: from CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.70.145]) by CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com ([10.164.70.145]) with mapi id 15.01.0396.010; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 20:03:50 +0000 From: "Tim ." To: "Shop Talk" Thread-Topic: Classic car insurance tangents Thread-Index: AQHRWgW495aZnblkHka4dwb28mA/gw== Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2016 20:03:50 +0000 Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US header.d=none; autox.team.net; dmarc=none action=none header.from=outlook.com; x-ms-exchange-messagesentrepresentingtype: 1 x-tmn: [n2pHCjheLbR68XZB00LEG6hIR2CF2aFc] x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; CY1PR13MB0501; 23:DtqZSg6k4clv4h6huWkggGrj4s0fsaHLjt1rzbNMCivdEiTpI4WlSLLX1YbBCUsd9mzIRVgKYsck5Yyc8u4DCiA0pyz3/0UzbViJxlHQ9bE89cQK1zbvoX1Qnd89cEZ114aNNtaivO6/lHvtLqaeRqoDP2mNtpDIcOv7ok9yqrSZPUBJFD+UXHkRGpW/h3pyEKvN8cuVXt4DXQAOEr/NRg==; 5:rnDUkq8MFklK+10jd5DCd0H341zlnCsQC5lx86aCCaWIgjoOzkJXz3HDiGQtNAzi+y6sHLx+X9LGmu0LR8VtDN5NM/Tbm121/nfpdkjjRQZKReI4Bo0X/bv+YdGX+BSHFi5/O0QCPEiRcEpfZ6VPKg==; 24:VOsZDcw8BzctbCITKIXexpZKt6V2Al7hezwMATUqwD/SruPU9nNBMzDGfF4jRiT/HJlwfhSE65bw6wwoAyxyuMT4dz9vbsgjb41eubRbnAs= x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:;BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:CY1PR13MB0501; x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 45427c9b-19f2-4f1a-50be-08d3281e23f0 x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(432015012)(82015046); SRVR:CY1PR13MB0501; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:CY1PR13MB0501; x-forefront-prvs: 083526BF8A x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(7070004)(98900002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1901; SCL:1; SRVR:CY1PR13MB0501; H:CY1PR13MB0503.namprd13.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:23 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM FILETIME=[0262DF00:01D15A07] Subject: [Shop-talk] Classic car insurance tangents Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============0770554870103406006== Content-Language: en-US boundary="_000_CY1PR13MB050362EB8DFAEAB92B72F458B4DA0CY1PR13MB0503namp_" --_000_CY1PR13MB050362EB8DFAEAB92B72F458B4DA0CY1PR13MB0503namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I didn't want to hijack the original thread..... First a question: How was your vehicle's value decided? I am especially int= erested in hearing from the Datsun Roadster guys (and any of you who might = have a FSJ; Full Size Jeep). A local Roadster owner was rear ended last yea= r. It was a very slow hit but the repair estimate was well over what his co= verage was. He has either grundy or hagerty. I do not remember. I am ready to switch the Jeep (71 Gladiator fully restored and lifted, etc = etc.) and my 70 Roadster to classic insurance but want to make sure they ar= e insured for what it would cost to fix them if the worst happened. Second, a knock on grundy: I looked into them when I got my Dad's Roadster.= At that time both of my daughters were in high school; one of which had he= r license, and the wife and I both had clean driving records. Well, because= my daughter didn't have her own car, grundy denied me coverage stating "th= e teen driver might take the Roadster for a drive because she didn't have h= er own car". (<-----this is almost verbatim) It didn't matter that the chil= d didn't know how to drive a manual or that fact that she wasn't allowed to= drive it. I have good kids and it would never have been an issue when they= were still at home. so, take the grundy feedback any way you want. I was not happy with how I w= as treated. I hope to hear about the first bit from any and all of you. Thanks tim --_000_CY1PR13MB050362EB8DFAEAB92B72F458B4DA0CY1PR13MB0503namp_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I didn't want to hijack the original thread.....


First a question: How was your vehicle's value decided? I am especially = interested in hearing from the Datsun Roadster guys (and any of you who mig= ht have a FSJ; Full Size Jeep). A local Roadster owner was rear ended last = year. It was a very slow hit but the repair estimate was well over what his coverage was. He has either gru= ndy or hagerty. I do not remember. 


I am ready to switch the Jeep (71 Gladiator fully restored and lifted, e= tc etc.) and my 70 Roadster to classic insurance but want to make sure they= are insured for what it would cost to fix them if the worst happened. = ;



Second, a knock on grundy: I looked into them when I got my Dad's Roadst= er. At that time both of my daughters were in high school; one of which had= her license, and the wife and I both had clean driving records. Well, beca= use my daughter didn't have her own car, grundy denied me coverage stating "the teen driver might tak= e the Roadster for a drive because she didn't have her own car". (<= -----this is almost verbatim) It didn't matter that the child didn't k= now how to drive a manual or that fact that she wasn't allowed to drive it. I have good kids and it would never have been an issue when t= hey were still at home. 


so, take the grundy feedback any way you want. I was not happy with how = I was treated. 


I hope to hear about the first bit from any and all of you. 


Thanks

tim

--_000_CY1PR13MB050362EB8DFAEAB92B72F458B4DA0CY1PR13MB0503namp_-- --===============0770554870103406006== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============0770554870103406006==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Thu Jan 28 14:28:03 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id B973F2585F38 for ; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 14:28:03 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-io0-f180.google.com (mail-io0-f180.google.com [209.85.223.180]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC3522585EC5 for ; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 14:26:57 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-io0-f180.google.com with SMTP id d63so52169722ioj.2 for ; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 13:32:07 -0800 (PST) h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=sSy71OGbWHUGUyuOF3IB4DjFqeQiEprb0H8fcbs9PzE=; b=By1mgyBrB+obeo4TY/gSVEigUpfmFkBtH1HjxonTzUpy63oNMvkJcd2Kf/8BpNpoNb keZ2DrBUliQiSJg8YNfQ+VZC72ZQhdTgZ++tgkEvpFVOEt8VpevRsbJZwca44Q922Rkl h53mGjiFfp3pHujYwNpP1pls/GTvuMxksvpsiI2U22xLzaSMV63roBumKi2eJpF6EJRD EgGXLOWspi0KOtRLTvodB2NK/3kxC1ppiu/vDj2xeDffEvtfHZPCeECohsThHsSkXZwW lNUgf+dS8qB+Cbyt8j72U9VM91OunYXuR/9sZfEVkmuKrzj7ZCmXdyXEMayJ72DgLE8q SDjA== d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=sSy71OGbWHUGUyuOF3IB4DjFqeQiEprb0H8fcbs9PzE=; b=HROfFKm63tVkoEVcnF4rrkrNt8tDOIT3Qjow2MStAX3QXHXrKqnI6Ay+XmzU5NNkJl 8Us677XutUT14r5Vc+A4bf4pjqm0Yp+1/zknwoQLtnszUel6L2Chybfa+zBfR5kQACqp NrAK5XDuDG2x3uuEDHkpTbVML38aNUOs02fYa0aQFqjVVFOCB1Ad3IDxA1YNodf4qswl 2U1xWAGMqECGl5ZqRWwWTzjPFqdGwEihyW9BQ9zQL4W3FNLa4XUQis/LQHPMjKfC1EdS q5vju1/PwmX/wsCw2iZD+HEEYEt9iTZ3YEmk2oQfZh+XMua3F+U6GyAXZzlZAGH1Okj9 oIaA== Thu, 28 Jan 2016 13:32:07 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.36.206.7 with HTTP; Thu, 28 Jan 2016 13:32:07 -0800 (PST) References: Date: Thu, 28 Jan 2016 16:32:07 -0500 From: Jeff Scarbrough To: "Tim ." Cc: Shop Talk Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Classic car insurance tangents Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net On Thu, Jan 28, 2016 at 3:03 PM, Tim . wrote: > > First a question: How was your vehicle's value decided? Hagerty has an agreed-on value, at least for me. > Well, because my > daughter didn't have her own car, grundy denied me coverage stating "the > teen driver might take the Roadster for a drive because she didn't have her > own car". (<-----this is almost verbatim) That's how you can get a classic car, agreed-on value policy for your car at a fraction of what your regular car insurance would cost. Because even though your kid is a good kid, someone else's isn't. And insurance is a pooled risk. Jeff Scarbrough Corrosion Acres, Ga. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 31 13:32:35 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4616225856A9 for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 13:32:35 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from dogbert2.mail.megageek.com (nj-69-34-94-16.sta.embarqhsd.net [69.34.94.16]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4C739258551B for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 13:22:12 -0700 (MST) To: shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net From: eric@megageek.com Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2016 14:57:17 -0500 01/31/2016 14:58:35, Serialize complete at 01/31/2016 14:58:35 Subject: [Shop-talk] The one tool we have never discussed here! Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net This is a multipart message in MIME format. --===============8602489393394599598== This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 00705EF185257F4B_= OK, I need some help trying to buy a new household vacuum. I have a 2 floor house, carpets on the top floor, hardwood, area rugs, and linelomun on the first floor. (two units isn't out of the question) I don't mind vacuuming if I have a good unit. In the past, I even tried a commercial backpack mounted one, but it was poorly designed (and VERY expensive.) I don't mind if it's heavy, I just want to make sure that it has a quick wand to pull out and get corners and such. On board tools is a must, BUT they have to be out of the way. My current dust devil constantly has the tools falling out or in the way. I don't need HEPA filters or anything (but I did love the Rainbow vacuum that used water as the filter. I just wish they had a 'messenger bag' style canister unit.) I prefer upright. and I don't want to have to replace bags. I have no problem cleaning a reusable filter. I'm even thinking 'whole house unit', but the installation might take a while I need something in the meantime. 8>( Price isn't a factor FOR A GREAT UNIT. I don't like 'stick' or 'rechargeable' models. With that said, anyone have any suggests? OB SHOP CONTENT- If I get a new vacuum, I'll take apart this one and build something stupid with it! 8>) Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. Eric P "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson --=_alternative 00705EF185257F4B_= OK, I need some help trying to buy a new household vacuum.  I have a 2 floor house, carpets on the top floor, hardwood, area rugs,  and linelomun on the first floor. (two units isn't out of the question)

I don't mind vacuuming if I have a good unit.  In the past, I even tried a commercial backpack mounted one, but it was poorly designed (and VERY expensive.)

I don't mind if it's heavy, I just want to make sure that it has a quick wand to pull out and get corners and such.  On board tools is a must, BUT they have to be out of the way.

My current dust devil constantly has the tools falling out or in the way.

I don't need HEPA filters or anything (but I did love the Rainbow vacuum that used water as the filter.  I just wish they had a 'messenger bag' style canister unit.)

I prefer upright. and I don't want to have to replace bags.  I have no problem cleaning a reusable filter.

I'm even thinking 'whole house unit', but the installation might take a while I need something in the meantime. 8>(

Price isn't a factor FOR A GREAT UNIT.  I don't like 'stick' or 'rechargeable' models.

With that said, anyone have any suggests?

OB SHOP CONTENT- If I get a new vacuum, I'll take apart this one and build something stupid with it! 8>)


Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem.
Eric P
"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson --=_alternative 00705EF185257F4B_=-- --===============8602489393394599598== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============8602489393394599598==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 31 19:19:10 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2519425854C6 for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 19:19:10 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-po-12v.sys.comcast.net (resqmta-po-12v.sys.comcast.net [96.114.154.171]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 55A0225853F3 for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 19:16:09 -0700 (MST) Received: from resomta-po-11v.sys.comcast.net ([96.114.154.235]) by resqmta-po-12v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id CqMD1s00554zqzk01qMMLJ; Mon, 01 Feb 2016 02:21:21 +0000 Received: from [IPv6:2601:600:4000:c20a:7483:18ff:c319:9b16] ([IPv6:2601:600:4000:c20a:7483:18ff:c319:9b16]) by resomta-po-11v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id CqMK1s0020LUG4m01qMKf1; Mon, 01 Feb 2016 02:21:20 +0000 To: "eric@megageek.com" , "shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net" From: Bob Kegel Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2016 18:21:14 -0800 Importance: normal References: s=q20140121; t=1454293281; bh=uyj75pCxcsVTv2B1oBr1ZUna3VEzLWMEZUR7f+PLAPg=; h=Received:Received:MIME-Version:To:From:Subject:Date:Content-Type; b=fAQV64t96qWG0HSTgidWrilJDATY4pU1XmvMEn+EvLsCMTO+FOf8csFE24XvC3y3Q Kjii3iAj88vmNj1UDNJMBgBVLTXz7/Koadp8KONCGxFJLvdtA/68XkBURmCGyAJF1z TehVhuVc9hu7TSOGCJS+/fdPPnhDYaB0HKtjKJmXLrSO/vI+RapIb7Uil3mnQfITMD oBD2sEiivorRXE5hp2JKJsOhH70fg9ktcdL81Otmk3dphQ85r1GOtwj+9aEiCzr7Ua e21fZWIsi3sJIkbbHCg515tsLs76I8NTzE/0oDVhvKfP6zRAANn+jf5Ho3T51VEy9n TxdeUfN9wLm9g== Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] The one tool we have never discussed here! Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============7798869390529336100== boundary="_B50D42B3-0D36-4341-8D26-735488062003_" --_B50D42B3-0D36-4341-8D26-735488062003_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable We have a Dyson DC07 and are very happy with it. It=E2=80=99s a 2003 model = and still sucks like new. It rarely clogs, and when it does, can be easily = cleared without tools. The crevice tool, brush, and upholstery tool don=E2= =80=99t come adrift. The cord is really long, enough to do three rooms from= the same outlet. It=E2=80=99s easy to maintain. The main filter is washable; the HEPA filter= is supposed to be lifetime. I replaced it last year because it was inexpen= sive. I=E2=80=99ve had to replace a few parts but they=E2=80=99re easy to f= ind online. I like the bagless design. The clear hopper lets you see when it=E2=80=99s = full and it can be emptied in a few seconds. The money we haven=E2=80=99t s= pent on bags probably equals the purchase price. Bob K --_B50D42B3-0D36-4341-8D26-735488062003_ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

We have a Dyson DC07 and are very ha= ppy with it. It=E2=80=99s a 2003 model and still sucks like new. It rarely = clogs, and when it does, can be easily cleared without tools. =C2=A0The cre= vice tool, brush, and upholstery tool don=E2=80=99t come adrift. The cord i= s really long, enough to do three rooms from the same outlet.

 

It=E2=80=99s easy to= maintain. The main filter is washable; the HEPA filter is supposed to be l= ifetime. I replaced it last year because it was inexpensive. I=E2=80=99ve h= ad to replace a few parts but they=E2=80=99re easy to find online.

 

I like the bagles= s design. The clear hopper lets you see when it=E2=80=99s full and it can b= e emptied in a few seconds. The money we haven=E2=80=99t spent on bags prob= ably equals the purchase price.

Bob K

<= o:p> 

 

= = --_B50D42B3-0D36-4341-8D26-735488062003_-- --===============7798869390529336100== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============7798869390529336100==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 31 19:33:48 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EF112585607 for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 19:33:48 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail.milleredp.com (fw.milleredp.com [198.144.208.110]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id C55A4258554B for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 19:31:45 -0700 (MST) Received: from [10.1.2.100] ([::ffff:10.1.2.100]) (AUTH: PLAIN jem, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,128bits,AES128-SHA) by mail.milleredp.com with ESMTPSA; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 18:36:57 -0800 id 00000000002800C5.0000000056AEC4C9.00007735 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: <20160201021918.81A1925854C9@autox.team.net> From: John Miller Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2016 18:36:57 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.1 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] The one tool we have never discussed here! Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net On 1/31/2016 6:21 PM, Bob Kegel wrote: > We have a Dyson DC07 and are very happy with it. It=92s a 2003 model and > still sucks like new. It rarely clogs, and when it does, can be easily > cleared without tools. The crevice tool, brush, and upholstery tool > don=92t come adrift. The cord is really long, enough to do three rooms > from the same outlet. We have a Beam central vac, put it in when we remodeled 2003ish. Was = not cheap. Paid someone to do the plumbing. The main sucking unit has been great. The collection bin capacity is = not industrial-dust-collector sized, so you need to empty it roughly = monthly. I've had to replace one wall socket wherein the electrical contacts came = apart. Actually, my then-eight-year-old daughter did most of the work, = with me handing her tools. That's why it's upside-down compared to the = rest, but it works fine and I'm not going to change it. We also put in a couple 'vac-pans' (kick open the duct, turns on the = motor, sweep your detritus over and it magically disappears) that have = proven a bit fragile, I've replaced both once and have to replace = another one now 'cause the electrical contacts have failed. The Beam power-brush head unit has needed repair a couple of times, = couple drive belts wore out, power brush clogged up with dog hair and = broke the cover under the brush once, most recently the neck that = connects the head to the pipe cracked. The good news is that it's a = remarkably simple design and comes thoroughly apart with a total of = about three snap clips and eight screws, and the 'net drops parts at = your doorstep quite cheaply, so after paying a local vacuum shop for the = first belt change none of the subsequent failures has cost more than $15 = to fix. John. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive utox.team.net From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 31 19:48:47 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 886962585597 for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 19:48:47 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail-wm0-f51.google.com (mail-wm0-f51.google.com [74.125.82.51]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD33A258557C for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 19:39:34 -0700 (MST) Received: by mail-wm0-f51.google.com with SMTP id l66so51136829wml.0 for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 18:44:47 -0800 (PST) d=dougbraun.com; s=google; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type; bh=0L+Sd7GWOFWE48CHkHn7vskTyS1Kup+7PA4poRELi0s=; b=ZO5dylNcwth/kdGP9u85RqiGnS691HD0OYHOKRVZVsDqOEwGHye2p9VWv+Vhl6WUHD eJgYFsNLuwYlXSiy4q7F654qRWBKNX9YFf55+AQA6Oc+aTEh9PTAtWjcPJ7ydNx9q015 +rjGM4XLSsM/fM1GrbYVl4RZmuKd/Cc5A+oUg= d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=0L+Sd7GWOFWE48CHkHn7vskTyS1Kup+7PA4poRELi0s=; b=S9Unz9LQ67zrNcAuyeL1GHKP/7VL/1JU41Y1UyTnMGMtNHfZaiyrlOS2EPpXyvXy7v JuBcYy9roYhnAYQs2XlDrvavn2SJGMdz+WTymdwopSZjyY8hDYK9yNL4IdRkaOUjiCao jjiPGgFlZmvoWIKlin6tlMevUknBQ/7B6pDAAQ6/JJ6NPK9AJYpqSWthsDpargrQyZBA uty3WYwLZXoxOCO5ZV6D0/9SrFKLgtptrqmgSCk4W3OnHas+U8artsryHplhB8C1Odem Zu9SkSSSEKm9Hgwgbn/4OUMvqYdLIsCe8Oi6htlhlZf5kpQATEe7Ct71b8d+tE7j4wF8 O4fA== Sun, 31 Jan 2016 18:44:46 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.28.159.13 with HTTP; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 18:44:46 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2016 21:44:46 -0500 From: Doug Braun To: "eric@megageek.com" , "shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net" Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] The one tool we have never discussed here! Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============6187268473915749791== --001a11418fd2348383052aac5eca Regarding built-in systems: My brother has a built-in vacuum system, and he says it is more trouble than it is worth: the hose is really long, and it is more hassle to drag from room to room than a regular vacuum cleaner. --001a11418fd2348383052aac5eca Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Regarding built-in systems:
My brother has a built-in v= acuum system, and he says it is more trouble=20 than it is worth:=C2=A0 the hose is really long, and it is more hassle to drag from room to room than a regular vacuum cleaner.


--001a11418fd2348383052aac5eca-- --===============6187268473915749791== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============6187268473915749791==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 31 20:34:09 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2BCE258575F for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 20:34:09 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail.milleredp.com (fw.milleredp.com [198.144.208.110]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C65F25854F7 for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 20:26:28 -0700 (MST) Received: from [10.1.2.100] ([::ffff:10.1.2.100]) (AUTH: PLAIN jem, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,128bits,AES128-SHA) by mail.milleredp.com with ESMTPSA; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 19:31:40 -0800 id 000000000028001B.0000000056AED19C.00007D22 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: From: John Miller Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2016 19:31:40 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.1 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] The one tool we have never discussed here! Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net On 1/31/2016 6:44 PM, Doug Braun wrote: > Regarding built-in systems: > My brother has a built-in vacuum system, and he says it is more trouble > than it is worth: the hose is really long, and it is more hassle to > drag from room to room than a regular vacuum cleaner. Glad you brought that up. It depends. For full-house vacuuming jobs it's far preferable. You haul the hose out, in our house you have to move the hose about four times to do the house. The thing sucks very well, the capacity is far greater than a single bag or filter in an upright, it's lighter and more maneuverable with the power brush and FAR FAR better than a hand-held wand tool attached to an upright (on which the hose is never quite long enough to do what you need to do without knocking the thing over three times.) But, yeah, for little jobs, for cleaning up the spilled morning coffee beans or something the kid knocked over, a smallish portable is definitely easier than dragging the hose out and plugging it in. Ah, but next we'll be talking about Steam-Vacs and the like. Perhaps I should have been asking around here about sources for sponge cord before I started rebuilding our Hoover, the mechanical bits were all perfectly fine but the seals between various pieces that eventually start leaking - mostly suction air - are all cut from lengths of sponge cord of a diameter not readily found at McMaster-Carr. John. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 31 21:20:06 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8357B2585670 for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 21:20:06 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com (outbound-mail02.vgs.untd.com [64.136.55.36]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with SMTP id 6DAB3258520B for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 21:18:28 -0700 (MST) t=1454300616; bh=47DEQpj8HBSa+/TImW+5JCeuQeRkm5NMpJWZG3hSuFU=; l=0; h=From:Date:Cc:Subject:Message-Id:Content-Type:To; b=q+pYFz8Wf2RRcFZYlY0TeK3tMRjTXVIlsYbRpHV4zvzEKd3a31Pw7Du4XREMx/sVE Ka1Em6TAo1oxzcj1h7qzUJ23pUGEDgGne6m9f2XwUYumpBTQBxYGvHvY+OTVjKWldt 10IJs04/qvPhGz1BioXjmBC8dIGR4mj12KAgdz0U= Received: from outbound-bu1.vgs.untd.com (webmail10.vgs.untd.com [10.181.12.150]) by smtpout03.vgs.untd.com with SMTP id AABML7ZPSAKFTDDJ for (sender ); Sun, 31 Jan 2016 20:23:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from [75.76.179.156] by webmail10.vgs.untd.com with HTTP: Mon, 1 Feb 2016 04:22:07 GMT From: "Matt" Full-Name: "Matt" Date: Mon, 1 Feb 2016 04:22:07 GMT Cc: shop-talk@autox.team.net To: Undisclosed-recipients:; Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] The one tool we have never discussed here! Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net --===============3319751685930300695== ----__JWM__J3303a978.29ea4dd0S.2c594aadM Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline I had a central vac in a previous house - I think it was beam.Worked gr= eat and yes the hose was quite long - didn't have the sweep port but I s= ure wanted one!That was years ago though. When my wife's sister passed a= way we got her Kirby - I love that thing! It is a Cadillac with the dri= ve but no onboard tools with this model. Nut if you have lots of plain = floor to vac - this is the device. The wife doesn't like it because it i= s so heavy. Her tool of choice is a Hoover wind tunnel that works well,= has neat onboard tools, is bagless and relatively easy to dump/clean, a= nd didn't break the bank. I recently used my mom's Dyson and it worked = well. I was particularly pleased with the integral pull out hose in the= handle but no way would I pay the crazy price for a new one. MATT = ---------- Original Message ---------- From: John Miller To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] The one tool we have never discussed here! Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2016 18:36:57 -0800 On 1/31/2016 6:21 PM, Bob Kegel wrote: > We have a Dyson DC07 and are very happy with it. It�s a 2003 mo= del and > still sucks like new. It rarely clogs, and when it does, can be easily= > cleared without tools. The crevice tool, brush, and upholstery tool > don�t come adrift. The cord is really long, enough to do three = rooms > from the same outlet. The main sucking unit has been great. The collection bin capacity is = not industrial-dust-collector sized, so you need to empty it roughly = monthly. John. ----__JWM__J3303a978.29ea4dd0S.2c594aadM Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline
 I had a central vac in a previous house - I think it wa= s beam.
Worked great and yes the hose was quite long - didn't have the swee= p port but I sure wanted one!
That was years ago though.
 
When my wife's sister passed away we got her Kirby - I love that th= ing!  It is a Cadillac with the drive but no onboard tools with thi= s model.  Nut if you have lots of plain floor to vac - this is the = device. The wife doesn't like it because it is so heavy.  Her = tool of choice is a Hoover wind tunnel that works well, has neat onboard= tools, is bagless and relatively easy to dump/clean, and didn't break t= he bank. 
 
I recently used my mom's Dyson and it worked well.  I was part= icularly pleased with the integral pull out hose in the handle but no wa= y would I pay the crazy price for a new one.
 
 MATT
 
 
 


---------- Original Message ----------
From: John Miller= <jem@milleredp.com>
To: shop-talk@autox.team.net
Subject: R= e: [Shop-talk] The one tool we have never discussed here!
Date: Sun, = 31 Jan 2016 18:36:57 -0800

On 1/31/2016 6:21 PM, Bob Kegel wrote:=
> We have a Dyson DC07 and are very happy with it. It�s a = 2003 model and
> still sucks like new. It rarely clogs, and when i= t does, can be easily
> cleared without tools.  The crevice t= ool, brush, and upholstery tool
> don�t come adrift. The co= rd is really long, enough to do three rooms
> from the same outlet= .


The main sucking unit has been great.  The collection = bin capacity is
not industrial-dust-collector sized, so you need to = empty it roughly
monthly.


John.

----__JWM__J3303a978.29ea4dd0S.2c594aadM-- --===============3319751685930300695== Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive --===============3319751685930300695==-- From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 31 21:35:51 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1A5B258563D for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 21:35:51 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-po-08v.sys.comcast.net (resqmta-po-08v.sys.comcast.net [96.114.154.167]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 010D525853A7 for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 21:35:39 -0700 (MST) Received: from resomta-po-20v.sys.comcast.net ([96.114.154.244]) by resqmta-po-08v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id CsgQ1s0035Geu2801sgsDs; Mon, 01 Feb 2016 04:40:52 +0000 Received: from [10.0.1.29] ([24.19.173.9]) by resomta-po-20v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id Csgr1s0040CXZm001sgrCQ; Mon, 01 Feb 2016 04:40:52 +0000 From: Bill Rabel Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2016 20:40:50 -0800 Cc: "shop-talk@Autox.Team.Net" References: s=q20140121; t=1454301652; bh=9JHZpGXcCKuO4VCh5jBszFYRqAKYHNCvyMuaRnsEIe8=; h=Received:Received:Content-Type:Mime-Version:Subject:From:Date: Message-Id; b=KxxE/D1782AWUpUHu6lT872HK1NgJFqPhkt6aKFqqdtH071y30TWSuGmlBebAzNVZ 734tJciLTnRTnFwVAZNN1pourTboxN9utZxRwqmEvxuVCbg8MHWcPu+pqFF01PUDIk Vy8u4ed8RX6QiMvTfk2wEAT0K8fserFR5nEjlyjMlHw7xr3onjxSgLPINQw+FveMFs WpHWkNBEJGJs5pgJkOio7tZBoWjwiFgyAcFiG3BUVTO0gzpmuCVuUrBmDLLaXRwnf5 Lll3o9hQ745EgitNH+9mVaGBYD1ZUY6XvfzCe1Twj852R7PQOGIUHoP/TikLbVVWle lkVCWt/fzvz+w== Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] The one tool we have never discussed here! Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net In Munich a couple of years ago, I saw a hotel employee vacuuming the halls, using a canister vacuum with a hose and wand. The notable feature was that it was cordless! I've been unable to find such a vacuum through searching the Internet. I've seen a line of rechargeable tools, E-Go, at Home Depot, that uses a 55-volt (or so) battery system. I bought the hedge trimmer, and it is a super tool, with 45 minutes of use before you have to recharge it. It seems like that system would lend itself to such a vacuum. That is on my wish list. In my own home, I have an in-wall vacuum system, where the hoses retract into the wall when you're done with them. You just release the locking collar at the wall and put your hand over the nozzle. Zip. Gone. - Bill Rabel Anacortes, WA > On Jan 31, 2016, at 6:44 PM, Doug Braun wrote: > > Regarding built-in systems: > My brother has a built-in vacuum system, and he says it is more trouble than it is worth: the hose is really long, and it is more hassle to drag from room to room than a regular vacuum cleaner. > > > _______________________________________________ > > Shop-talk@autox.team.net > Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html > Suggested annual donation $12.96 > Archive: http://www.team.net/archive > Forums: http://www.team.net/forums > Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/brabel@comcast.net > _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 31 21:49:27 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C78E25858FD for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 21:49:27 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from mail.milleredp.com (fw.milleredp.com [198.144.208.110]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 882082585739 for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 21:39:26 -0700 (MST) Received: from [10.1.2.100] ([::ffff:10.1.2.100]) (AUTH: PLAIN jem, TLS: TLSv1/SSLv3,128bits,AES128-SHA) by mail.milleredp.com with ESMTPSA; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 20:44:38 -0800 id 00000000002800C5.0000000056AEE2B6.00000330 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net References: From: John Miller Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2016 20:44:39 -0800 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.5.1 Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] The one tool we have never discussed here! Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net > In my own home, I have an in-wall vacuum system, where the hoses > retract into the wall when you're done with them. You just release > the locking collar at the wall and put your hand over the nozzle. > Zip. Gone. Something like these guys? http://www.hideahose.com/ I'm envisioning a short story where that goes wrong, either an Aliens remake or some flavor of Japanese porn... John. _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive From shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Sun Jan 31 23:35:06 2016 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mharc@autox.team.net Received: from autox.team.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0D682585787 for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 23:35:06 -0700 (MST) Delivered-To: shop-talk@autox.team.net Received: from resqmta-ch2-05v.sys.comcast.net (resqmta-ch2-05v.sys.comcast.net [69.252.207.37]) by autox.team.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA53E2585776 for ; Sun, 31 Jan 2016 23:32:25 -0700 (MST) Received: from resomta-ch2-04v.sys.comcast.net ([69.252.207.100]) by resqmta-ch2-05v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id Cudb1s0012AWL2D01udeyk; Mon, 01 Feb 2016 06:37:38 +0000 Received: from M6800.technologist.com ([65.216.230.3]) by resomta-ch2-04v.sys.comcast.net with comcast id CubS1s00G0533Qp01ubXlD; Mon, 01 Feb 2016 06:35:36 +0000 Date: Sun, 31 Jan 2016 19:22:30 -0500 To: shop-talk@autox.team.net From: Richard Beels mail.megageek.com> References: s=q20140121; t=1454308658; bh=nQzM0D4IPaxE5ChgNGcIcjgTXeewovyMX71BUyAzMsQ=; h=Received:Received:Date:To:From:Subject:Mime-Version:Content-Type; b=B5r20BnFaHChH+uVe3+EGw5hAa4HyHizwgRIUzasrbLpbJlJwNtiIrleqlJ2XxVND IYpF8I4kl6tnzrRtlVOgMcOTeNSZvDZxrtIEHeOD0Id462y/9ynrHNu2nXOmGhfHhp p47dBIap7ZV6rR3PNhhEYXKEs9m8+ArqmmIU1LUXjld/cAbd/kmnKCy+P0QZmIyw7Z I1GsZDzJo05VHe2NSqk+z+lApXjysMmkxJOcSh3+Hwq9rYojJo7dT0HSx3UOLGNMNW bwHn7XBH2HrX76T+BS/fWPxGg5Bq51WxqRVoj/SQqY0hixOzgrGSWP9nAtkSBkUhyZ GDtTU4InYstUA== Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] The one tool we have never discussed here! Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: shop-talk-bounces@autox.team.net Go here and read this guy's AMAs: https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/316tx6 The guy's advice is spot on. I have a Miele canister and the wife loves it. It was $700 but sucks like a vaccuum should. If you want to do carpets, you'll want an adjustable-height powerhead. And we have a $100 B&D dustbuster-type model (BDH2020FLFH) that is great for a quick zip around the corners and edges. At 01/31/2016 at 14:57, Shakespearean monkeys danced on eric@megageek.com's keyboard and said: >OK, I need some help trying to buy a new household vacuum. I have a >2 floor house, carpets on the top floor, hardwood, area rugs, and >linelomun on the first floor. (two units isn't out of the question) > >I don't mind vacuuming if I have a good unit. In the past, I even >tried a commercial backpack mounted one, but it was poorly designed >(and VERY expensive.) > >I don't mind if it's heavy, I just want to make sure that it has a >quick wand to pull out and get corners and such. On board tools is >a must, BUT they have to be out of the way. > >My current dust devil constantly has the tools falling out or in the way. > >I don't need HEPA filters or anything (but I did love the Rainbow >vacuum that used water as the filter. I just wish they had a >'messenger bag' style canister unit.) > >I prefer upright. and I don't want to have to replace bags. I have >no problem cleaning a reusable filter. > >I'm even thinking 'whole house unit', but the installation might >take a while I need something in the meantime. 8>( > >Price isn't a factor FOR A GREAT UNIT. I don't like 'stick' or >'rechargeable' models. > >With that said, anyone have any suggests? > >OB SHOP CONTENT- If I get a new vacuum, I'll take apart this one and >build something stupid with it! 8>) > > >Sent from my Commodore 64 on a 2400 Baud Modem. >Eric P >"Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a >rational being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your >territory." Ralph Waldo Emerson Cheers! _______________________________________________ Shop-talk@autox.team.net Archive: http://www.team.net/archive