Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Repairing plastic - weld or glue?

From: Darrell Walker <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 19:54:30 -0700

Wow, I didn't know there was such a thing as a plastic welder!

Is there any way to incorporate some metal reinforcement?  That's what I
usually try to do when fixing something plastic.

-Darrell
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From: John Miller <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 20:05:45 -0700

> or a competitor's product?  What are the odds of my being able to join the two
> pieces together well enough to stand up to repeated openings and closings?

With plastic, whether you're talking about heat-fusing or 
solvent-welding or something like an epoxy, it's ALL about what kind of 
plastic it is.

John.

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From: Bob Spidell <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 20:14:26 -0700

re: 'I didn't know there was such a thing as a plastic welder! '

You've never heard of a PIG welder?

bs

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Bob Spidell           San Jose, CA            [email-masked]

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From: Wayne <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 23:43:11 -0400

On 3/18/2013 10:43 PM, Jim Stone wrote:
> The plastic catch that holds the door closed on my refrigerator recently
> broke.  While it isn't necessary to the question I am about to ask, there are
> photos and more details about the broken part here:

Sorry, but it won't let you view pix unless registered & logged in.

> GE, in their infinite wisdom, doesn't sell a replacement catch alone; you have
> to buy a new door seal.  Nor to they even sell just one side alone (it is a

Might be able to find a new or partial replacement on ebay. To glue or 
weld, you need to know what kind of plastic it is. There are lots of 
guides on the 'net but some require destructive testing. Solvent cements 
work real well with a compatible plastic. Welding won't work if it's a 
thermoset plastic (one that will burn, not melt when heated.)

There are also services on ebay and elsewhere that will crank out 3D 
printed parts cheaply, given a CAD file of what you need.

-wc

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From: Todd Walke <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 20:43:03 -0700

>Wow, I didn't know there was such a thing as a plastic welder!

         Urethane Supply (www.urethanesupply.com/) carries supplies to 
repair most types of plastic.  Under the "How To" section they have info on 
how to identity and repair the various types of plastic.

Todd
Seattle,WA
'86 GTI, Red of course. (exciting racey car) 276,000 miles
'01 Golf TDI, silver.   (new work car)       396,000 miles
'87 Golf, Polar Silver. (retired work car)   654,000 miles <- Gone to a new 
home :(
http://www.pureluckdesign.com <-Ferrari & VW stuff
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From: Brian Kemp <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2013 21:43:31 -0700

Jim - It all depends on the type of plastic.  See if you can find the 
recycle triangle with a number in it on the back of a similar piece then 
look that up.

If it is a clean break and a plastic that responds well to solvent type 
glue, that is probably the best bet.

As to plastic welding, you may be able to use a soldering iron. I've 
used a 30W for fine stuff and a 100W pencil iron with a flat tip for 
bigger things.  If you want a more precise temperature control, use a 
dimmer controlled outlet.  If you go this route, you are going to need 
donor plastic and then do some cleanup.  I would guess that this is not 
a match for your application.

If you do try welding/melting, try a scrap of similar plastic first, 
maybe from a broken toy.  Some melts nice.  Other plastic just turns 
into hard brittle goo.

Melting did work well for my plastic gas tank on my B&S lawn mower gas 
tank.  Mowing around a tree, I hit a branch in the wrong place and 
cracked the tank.  I drained it, rinsed it with water, then let it dry 
in the sun.  It was black plastic, a little flexible and slightly 
slippery.  I forget the number now.  I had some similar plastic from the 
packing of kids toys that I used as my solder or welding rod 
equivalent.  I heated up the plastic and made a mound then blended it 
all together.   This was much more economical than the $75 I was quoted 
for a replacement tank from a local vendor. When you finish, wipe the 
iron tip with a wet sponge, then clean it with flux and re-tin it and it 
will be like before.

You might also want to call some appliance repair places in your area.  
If you get lucky, you might find a guy that collects used parts and sell 
you one cheap.  I was able to go this route for some spa cover clips.  A 
local service place always cut the clips off old covers because they get 
broken fairly often.

Brian

On 3/18/2013 7:43 PM, Jim Stone wrote:
> http://forum.appliancepartspros.com/refrigerator-freezer-repair/519815-broken
> -door-catch.html#post803233
>
> side-by-side fridge); you have to buy both sides for $225!  That is a heck of
> a lot of money to spend for a small piece of plastic.  So, I would like to try
> to repair this one before shelling out for the replacement pieces.  I have
> never had much luck gluing plastic, even with glues said to be made for it.
> And, the fact that this piece is under stress every time the door opens and
> closes (let alone the fact that it failed under such stress) doesn't give me
> much confidence in glue.  Still, if there is a glue or solvent that someone
> here knows of and thinks I should try, I am all ears.
>
> My other option is to purchase a plastic welder, something like this:
> http://www.harborfreight.com/plastic-welding-kit-with-adjustable-temperature-
> 96464.html  I have been interested in buying one of these for a while, and
> buying a $50 tool I can use again vs. paying $225 is a no-brainer, if this has
> a good chance of working.  Does anyone here have experience with one of these
> Thanks.
> Jim
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
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From: Jim Stone <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 07:30:18 -0500

Thanks guys.  Sorry for the delay; I have been traveling.  Some good ideas in
here.  I really like the idea of using a 3D printer; that would be very cool
and I would love to be able to say I did that.  I won't know if that is
possible until I remove the seal and see if I can take the broken piece out
and then put the seal back on.  Otherwise, I will need to repair it and put it
back on before the food in the fridge spoils.  In the meantime, I am keeping
an eye on eBay.  Since this seems to be a weak point on GE side by sides and
GE makes you buy a pair of them, it is possible that someone else will be
selling a single side.  And, I did discover an eBay appliance parts store that
sells the gaskets for $185, which is about $40 less than I had previously
found.

I did buy the HF plastic welder since I had a coupon that was going to expire
before I get home.  I will report back if I do decide to keep it and give it a
try.

> To: [email-masked]
> From: [email-masked]
> Date: Tue, 19 Mar 2013 08:36:36 -0400
> Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Repairing plastic - weld or glue?
>
> Jim,
>
> If you have a place close to you (there are a few around, I know of one in
> NYC) but you can go in to a hacker space and use their 3D printer.  They
> print in ABS and PLA plastics.
>
> I'm sure for a few "club Montes" (the unofficial soda of hacker spaces)
> you can even get a regular there scan it and print it for you.  They can
> even change the design to make it beefier.  (and you can get a copy of the
> file to print out more later.
>
> I'm thinking of buying a 3D printer myself, but I can't find one that
> meets my needs.
>
> Failing that, I'd love to hear how that plastic welder works.  I've seen
> it many times and have been tempted myself.
>
>
>
> Eric P
> "Be as beneficent as the sun or the sea, but if your rights as a rational
> being are trenched on, die on the first inch of your territory." Ralph
> Waldo Emerson
> Unsubscribe/Manage:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/shop-talk/[email-masked]
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From: "Eric J Russell" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 08:56:14 -0400 a=S_Peo7LoC_QA:10 a=P2oOn6vrs4wA:10 a=8nJEP1OIZ-IA:10 a=S2wpYzp2RsyRkoRNwqcm1Q==:17 a=gRDYRtYdAAAA:8 a=lQNyvxNZnh5qlu1s0gsA:9 a=wPNLvfGTeEIA:10 a=S2wpYzp2RsyRkoRNwqcm1Q==:117 reip=0.000, cl=1, cld=1, fgs=0

I have used Plastex  http://www.plastex.net/  to repair many plastic items. 
It has worked well for broken/missing attachment tabs on automobile consoles 
& motorcycle fairings.

Eric Russell
Mebane, NC

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From: Fred Katz <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 09:55:55 -0700

I have had great success using a product called Mxbon 105, along with baking
soda (sodium bicarbonate) to repair many plastic products. It's basically
super glue, or cyanoacrylate, but super refined and much more powerful than
regular super glue. It can be bought online, like at Amazon and hardware
outlets.

You spread a bit of baking soda powder in the crack, and then apply a drop of
super glue. It chemically alters the baking soda into becoming a plastic
polymer that bonds with your damaged plastic item. (It chemically reacts in
the presence of water vapor in the air and on the surface; no need to place
water there, it's invisible and always present). I've also recreated missing
portions of plastic in tools by filling in the area with baking soda and
applying this technique (do it outside as toxic fumes are created with large
portions, and wear gloves and goggles).

After a few seconds, you can sand the new plastic bond smooth. The finished
product is a polymer bond far stronger than epoxy or glue. I've had even
better results with sodium carbonate. You bake bicarbonate of soda (baking
powder) for 30 minutes on a cookie sheet, and it chemically transforms to
sodium carbonate (drives out the oxygen). Mxbon 105 is a fast acting super
glue. Mxbon 424 is a slower acting super glue to give more time to position
the pieces.

Fred

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From: Jim Stone <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 20:45:29 -0500

Thanks guys.  Some
really interesting options here.  I had
not heard of
either MxBon or Plastex and both sound really intriguing.  After reading up on
both, I just ordered a
starter kit of Plastex.  I may buy the MxBon
later, if
only just to keep it around, but thought Id wait since it seems to
have a
shelf life.  Depending on what I
find when I remove the gasket, I may try
casting a new part or piece of the
part, or just try bonding the two pieces
together.  Once it is all together I am also thinking
about embedding
something like a small brad across the break to reinforce it,
but Ill take it
one step at a time.

Now, I have to decide whether to keep the
plastic
welder or return it.   And, if
all else fails, AppliancePartsPros is where I
got the $225 price for the new
gasket.

More to follow.

Jim

> CC: [email-masked]
> From: [email-masked]
> Date: Fri, 22 Mar 2013 09:55:55 -0700
> To: [email-masked]
>
>
> You spread a bit of baking soda powder in the crack, and then apply a drop
of super glue. It chemically alters the baking soda into becoming a plastic
> <snip>

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