Subject: Re: [Shop-talk] Loud Toilet

From: "Karl Vacek" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2012 08:46:53 -0600

Sounds like classic water hammer.  As the tank float drops, the fill valve
opens and water flow begins.  Might be that the new fill is just a little
more crisp in opening, giving a quicker start to the water flow, and more
hammer than with the old valve.

There should be a hammer trap in the water feed line near the valve on the
wall.  It's supposed to be full of air to absorb fast changes in water
pressure, which is what causes water hammer.  Over time, the air becomes
entrained in the water, and the hammer trap fills with water.  Eventually
there's just not enough air cushion left and hammer begins.  The trap is
just a vertical length of pipe teed into the line with a cap on top.  It
will be sealed in the wall, so you can't directly drain it or refill it with
air.  That means thoroughly draining that run of pipe.  It's often not much
harder to drain everything in the house at the same time and avoid the same
thing happening somewhere else soon.

In a long ranch house that's a little more difficult, but what you need to
do is get a drain opening in the water supply line as close to the shutoff
valve as possible.  Shut off the supply valve, open something as close to
the supply as possible and arrange a way for a few gallons of water to drain
without destroying your house, and then, starting at the furthest fixture,
open all faucets and flush all toilets to get all the water out of the
system.  Hammer traps may take a while to drain down, but they should all do
so eventually.  You may have to  remove the supply line to toilets to make
them drain properly, but usually just flushing the toilet will do the trick.

You want to start at the far end so you have maximum siphon effect and don't
leave a pocket of water somewhere, which can take longer of be really
difficult to drain.

Karl

-----Original Message-----
From: marty sukey
Subject: [Shop-talk] Loud Toilet
I have a 12 year old house. Master bathroom is at the opposite end of the
house from the water feed line. A few months ago the toilet in the master
bath started hammering when flushed. Like a water hammer shutter noise. I
replace the fill valve in the tank over the weekend, and it got worse???  As
the float is dropping to start filling the tank is when all the
shuttering/hammering takes place.  Any ideas?
Marty
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From: "Peter J. Thomas" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2012 10:14:03 -0500

On 12/18/2012 9:16 AM, marty sukey wrote:
> house from the water feed line. A few months ago the toilet in the master bath
> started hammering when flushed. Like a water hammer shutter noise. I replace
> the fill valve in the tank over the weekend, and it got worse???  As the float
> is dropping to start filling the tank is when all the shuttering/hammering
> takes place.  Any ideas?

I have a well and so have an expansion buffer in the form of a well 
tank.  I have had this hammering affect because of the value 
oscillating.  The valve opens and because of vibrations it briefly 
closes and reopens.  More vibration.  An air buffer may help but not 
always.  I've found simply partially closing down the shutoff valve 
cures the problem.  Toilet fills a little slower.

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From: Battmain <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 18 Dec 2012 07:56:26 -0800 (PST)

Try reducing the water pressure. Either at the valve under the tank or at
the main shutoff.
You should be able to reduce it without having a noticeable
effect on the other outlets.
The only thing to be aware of is the valve under
the toilet might leak of you touch it. 

B
>________________________________
> From: marty sukey <[email-masked]>
>To: shop-talk list <[email-masked]> 
>Sent: Tuesday, December 18,
2012 9:16 AM
>I have a 12 year old house.
Master bathroom is at the opposite end of the
>house from the water feed line.
A few months ago the toilet in the master bath
>started hammering when
flushed. Like a water hammer shutter noise. I replace
>the fill valve in the
tank over the weekend, and it got worse???  As the float
>is dropping to start
filling the tank is when all the shuttering/hammering
>takes place.  Any
ideas?

[email-masked]