Subject: [Mgs] MG Icon

From: Paul Root <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 14:45:25 -0500

Pictures of the actual car. It does have a BGT feel to it. More than the
drawing had.

Seeing the real grill does throw back to the 1960s.

Yes, I know, it's not a proper MG, I'll never buy it. It's heresy that the
Chinese own the name, blah blah blah.

http://www.insideline.com/saic/mg-icon-concept-revealed-2012-beijing-auto-sho
w.html
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From: Dan DiBiase <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 13:45:05 -0700 (PDT)

Interesting, lots of MG cues on a grossly-expanded MINI-like body....
Taillights, from the side, headlights sunk into the fender at the bottom,
even
the shape of the body under the hatchback..... Nice to see them pick up a bit
of heritage....

Dan D
'65B, '76B
Central NJ USA
________________________________
 From: Paul Root <[email-masked]>
To:
"[email-masked] List" <[email-masked]> 
Sent: Wednesday, April 18,
2012 3:45 PM
Subject: [Mgs] MG Icon
 
Pictures of the actual car. It does have
a BGT feel to it. More than the
drawing had.

Seeing the real grill does throw
back to the 1960s.

Yes, I know, it's not a proper MG, I'll never buy it. It's
heresy that the
Chinese own the name, blah blah blah.
http://www.insideline.com/saic/mg-icon-concept-revealed-2012-beijing-auto-sho
w.html
_______________________________________________

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Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

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From: The Roxter <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 16:22:41 -0500

> http://www.insideline.com/saic/mg-icon-concept-revealed-2012-beijing-auto-sho

Looks like its Momma was scared by a BMW Mini.

-Rock

[email-masked]

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From: Max Heim <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 15:34:28 -0700

It looks like a cartoon. Even more so than most contemporary designs
(notably the Camaro, Kia Soul, most mid-size SUVs). I mean, they grafted on
some MG-like details, but the proportions are like a baby toy, not even a
Hot Wheel.

--

Max Heim
'66 MGB GHN3L76149
If you're near Menlo Park, CA,
it's the primer red one with chrome wires

> http://www.insideline.com/saic/mg-icon-concept-revealed-2012-beijing-auto-sho
\

[email-masked]

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From: David Breneman <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 16:08:23 -0700 (PDT)

> Pictures of the actual car. It
does have a BGT feel to it. More than the
> drawing had.
> 
> Seeing the real
grill does throw back to the 1960s.
> 
> Yes, I know, it's not a proper MG,
I'll never buy it. It's heresy 
> that the

Those protruding vertical lights on either side of the grille just
look strange.  Leaves me thinking "Twice the Edsel - Twice the fun!"
_______________________________________________

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From: David Breneman <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 16:10:06 -0700 (PDT)

From: The Roxter <[email-masked]>

> Looks like its Momma was
scared by a BMW Mini.

Funny you should say that, since the Mini started
out as
an MG/Rover project before BMW got involved.
_______________________________________________

[email-masked]

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From: "Larry Daniels" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 18:17:33 -0500

-----Original Message----- 
From: David Breneman
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2012 6:08 PM
To: [email-masked] List
Subject: Re: [Mgs] MG Icon

Exactly.  That protuberance under each of the headlights is just plain 
gross.  Was it Max that said it looks like a cartoon?  Agreed!

Jack up the MG badge on the rear and push what's left off a cliff and you 
have a good starting point.

Larry Daniels 

[email-masked]

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From: Paul Root <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 19:04:13 -0500

good one Rocky.

Yeah, I thought too much Mini in it as well. But it does have some BGT in it.
Keep the grill redo the rest of the front end.

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From: Murray Arundell <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2012 10:08:54 +1000

I really wish you jerks who are all still stuck in the 60's would wake up and
realize the the world has changed.  To make a statement "it's Chinese so I
wouldn't buy one" just smacks of ignorance.  The Chinese own MGs because MG
kept making the MGB well past it's sell buy date and look what happened?  Also
please don't give me that crap about Chinese quality. I'd have Chinese built
car over some wallowing land barge banged together in Detroit by guys who
can't see past their next meth hit any day. Wake up America... The world has
changed and the USA has missed the train.

Let the flames commence....

Murray Arundell
Australia

Sent from my iPhone

On 19/04/2012, at 9:08 AM, David Breneman <[email-masked]> wrote:

> Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

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From: Paul Root <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 19:34:23 -0500

Well Murray,

	There's no reason to be rude.

	I put those comments in, as a bit of humor, to try to stop a flame war of
this sort.

	I must say I'm a bit offended by your characterization of the America worker.
And the car for that matter. American cars are improving  considerably. While
I've never bought an "American" car, I do have cars built in America. I find
them better built than the one Japanese car that I have.

	Please read more carefully in the future, take a breath, and think twice
before you press send.

Paul.

[email-masked]

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From: The Roxter <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 20:02:55 -0500

> some MG-like details, but the proportions are like a baby toy, not even a

Yep. I would never buy one, even if I won the lottery.

If I did win the lottery, I would donate a big chunk to the Oklahoma 
Music Hall of Fame and another big chunk to the Ron Paul campaign, and 
then:
buy a Bugatti Type 35, an old Jaguar, an old Austin-Healy and a 
pre-1937 MG of some sort.

They did the Thunderbird well, I thought, as well as the Beetle: 
modern, but with retro styling that referenced the original, sort of a 
SteamPunk feel.

This is just some Anime-Fanboy jerk-off.

Should have done what Mazda did: hire some American MG-fans to design it.

-Rock

[email-masked]

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From: The Roxter <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 20:08:43 -0500

On 4/18/2012 6:10 PM, David Breneman wrote:
>   From: The Roxter<[email-masked]>
>
>
> Funny you should say that, since the Mini started out as
I participated in the early stages. Gave opinions on projected 
designs. Didn't like any of them.

-Rock

[email-masked]

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From: The Roxter <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 20:15:53 -0500

> Let the flames commence....
The American car market died because politicians started thinking they 
could design cars, or at least set the limits for designing cars.

If you want to see what too much government and socialistic leanings 
can accomplish, just look at Detroit.

-Rock

[email-masked]

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From: Max Heim <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 18:26:29 -0700

Not to start another flame war, but I have to say I'm curious where this
viewpoint is coming from -- clearly, all manufacturers who sold cars in the
US, not just the Detroit-based ones, were subject to the same government
regulations. So how did this kill the "American car market", which seems to
have survived to the present day? More different companies build cars in the
US today than did in the "unregulated" 1960s.

--

Max Heim
'66 MGB GHN3L76149

[email-masked]

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From: "Dave" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 20:50:05 -0500

I have to agree.  it was arrogance and naiivity that hurt detroit.

one executive was quoted as saying "why would you buy a japanese car when 
for the same money you can get a used chevrolet?"

-----Original Message----- 
From: Max Heim
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2012 8:26 PM
To: MG List
Subject: Re: [Mgs] MG Icon

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From: "Dave" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 20:54:30 -0500

that's a design exercise, right?  not the real thing?  does look awfully 
mini - ish

-----Original Message----- 
From: Paul Root
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2012 7:04 PM
To: The Roxter
Cc: [email-masked] List
Subject: Re: [Mgs] MG Icon

good one Rocky.

Yeah, I thought too much Mini in it as well. But it does have some BGT in 
it.
Keep the grill redo the rest of the front end.
_______________________________________________

[email-masked]

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From: David Breneman <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 19:27:07 -0700 (PDT)

From: Murray Arundell <[email-masked]>

> On 19/04/2012, at 9:08 AM,
David Breneman <[email-masked]> wrote:
>>  Those protruding
vertical lights on either side of the grille just
>>  look strange.  Leaves me
thinking "Twice the Edsel - Twice the 
>> fun!"
> I really wish you jerks
who are all still stuck in the 60's would wake up 
> and realize the the world
has changed.  To make a statement "it's 
> Chinese so I wouldn't buy one" just
smacks of ignorance.  \

I assume that since you're quoting and replying to my
post, I am
one of the "jerks" you're talking about.  Since I don't lower
myself to engage in ad hominem attacks, I won't call you names, but
I will
remind you that bad styling is bad styling no matter who does
it or when or
where it's done.  And to infer that, because I criticize
bad styling, I hold
some sort of brief against modern cars or Chinese-
own car companies is, to
say the least, presumptuous.
_______________________________________________

[email-masked]

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From: Mike Eldred <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2012 23:17:57 -0400

Yes. No one who lived through the '70s should be under any illusion that it
was "socialism" that killed American car manufacturing.

Sent from my iPad

>
> -----Original Message----- From: Max Heim
> Unsubscribe:
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]
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From: The Roxter <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2012 11:42:17 -0500

> US today than did in the "unregulated" 1960s.
Before the rabid environmentalists took over, cars were designed to be 
bought by people. American car manufacturers tried to build cars 
Americans wanted. Then the politicians got into the game, with "CAFE" 
standards and crash tests pushing the designs from opposite 
directions. Foreign car-makers were already making smaller cars, so 
they had an advantage under the new laws. The new standards weren't 
the only influence that killed Detroit; the unions helped in its 
demise. Perhaps you have seen the sets of pictures that show Hiroshima 
and Detroit today.

-Rock

[email-masked]

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From: Barrie Robinson <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:46:04 -0400

Having had considerable experience with UK unions I can attest to the 
collapse of the UK car makers was 90% the fault of the unions and 10% 
the fault of management who did not do anything about unions.   Only 
Margaret Thatcher had the guts to stand up and break the unions 
(miners) incredibly stupid position (..."we don't care if we are 
unproductive, the market for our goods has gone, and we are paid more 
than anyone else - we want better pay, more benefits and job 
security....") - and I come from a miner's family.  What is so very 
funny is that when the UK union bosses found that they too were out 
of work because the car industry had collapsed, they came over to 
North America.  Canada had Irish, Welsh and English trade unionists 
and I believe they had them in Detroit too.   Thus we had a Detroit 
with destructive union influences as well as design teams that could 
not design decent cars and did not have the skills to copy the 
surging Japanese (now Korean, Chinese et al).   I remember a saying 
attributed to the Pres of GM.  Who said "What is good for GM is good 
for the USA". Well, GM did crash only to be saved by someone stupidly 
loaning money.  The other Pres saying I remember is "We don't make 
cars, we make profits".  The Japanese concentrated on making cars and 
Detroit concentrated on ?

As for the public buying, one can attribute that to the massive 
expenditure of Detroit advertising,  and municipalities blinkered 
into building transportation for BIG horribly handling gas guzzling 
behemoths.   Just look at the NA sub divisions !!!  Of course the NA 
attitude of  "mine is bigger than yours" or "never mind the quality 
feel the width" helps too.

At 12:42 PM 4/19/2012, The Roxter wrote:
>>viewpoint is coming from -- clearly, all manufacturers who sold cars in th
>Before the rabid environmentalists took over, cars were designed to 
>be bought by people. American car manufacturers tried to build cars 
>Americans wanted. Then the politicians got into the game, with 
>"CAFE" standards and crash tests pushing the designs from opposite 
>demise. Perhaps you have seen the sets of pictures that show 
>Hiroshima and Detroit today.
>
>-Rock
>Unsubscribe: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/mgs/[email-masked]

Regards

Barrie
[email-masked]
(705) 721-9060 

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From: David Breneman <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2012 11:59:01 -0700 (PDT)

From: Barrie Robinson <[email-masked]>

> Having had considerable experience
with UK unions I can attest to the collapse 
> of the UK car makers was 90%
the fault of the unions and 10% the fault of 
> management who did not do
anything about unions. 

I can't help but think of Basil's hilarious rant on
Fawlty Towers:

Another car strike.  Marvelous, isn't it?  The taxpayers pay
them
millions each year so they can go on strike.  It's called socialism.
If
they don't like *making cars* why don't they get themselves 
another bloody
job, like designing cathedrals or composing violin
concertos?  That's it! The
British Leyland Concerto,
in four movements,
all of them slow,
with a
four-hour
tea break in between!  I'll tell
you why, it's because they're not
interested in anything,
except
lounging about on conveyor belts
stuffing
themselves with my money!
_______________________________________________

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From: Rod Williams <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2012 13:55:18 -0700

On Apr 19, 2012,
> Before the rabid environmentalists took overUnionsJapan bla-bla-bla

This is such a load of horse shit. Read "On A Clear Day You Can See General
Motors" written under cover while DeLorean still worked there. Makes you
wonder how we survived the '70s. Did we survive the '70s? (Rant over. Sorry.
Back to MGs)
--
Rod Williams
Petaluma, California
1967 MGB
_______________________________________________

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From: The Roxter <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2012 16:39:37 -0500

On 4/19/2012 3:55 PM, Rod Williams wrote: This is such a load of horse 
shit. Read "On A Clear Day You Can See General Motors" written under 
cover while DeLorean still worked there. Makes you wonder how we 
survived the '70s. Did we survive the '70s? (Rant over. Sorry. Back to 
MGs)

Well, Mister Williams, Please go fuck yourself. I can do without your 
insults. I'm out of here.

-Rock

[email-masked]

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From: "Larry Daniels" <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 19 Apr 2012 17:03:24 -0500

Rocky, you seem upset.  That may or may not be justified, but, regardless, 
was unnecessary.

Ok, folks, we now see the problems with introducing politics into our car 
forum.  Is everybody happy?

We also had somebody saying that GM was "saved by someone stupidly loaning 
money" even though a company was saved and returned to profitability while 
saving who knows how many jobs in how many countries.  I wonder how many 
people had a problem with that.

Now, can we return to MG related stuff before we piss off even more people?

Larry

P. S.  Rocky, cool off and stick around.  Nobody wants you "out of here".

-----Original Message----- 
From: The Roxter
Sent: Thursday, April 19, 2012 4:39 PM
To: Rod Williams
Cc: MG List
Subject: Re: [Mgs] Was MG Icon Now Detroit Rant

-Rock

[email-masked]
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From: Charley & Peggy Robinson <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 21 Apr 2012 11:01:51 -0500

The only problem I have with loaning GM money is that they don't seem to 
be paying it back now that they're "returned to profitability."

CR

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