Subject: Re: [Fot] Oddity found in TR4 oil pan.

From: Mordy Dunst via Fot <[email-masked]>
Date: Sat, 15 Aug 2020 02:38:35 +0000 (UTC)

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Thats a lot of material. =C2=A0Magnetic? Cam bearing?=C2=A0

MDunstHeadgasket.com626.358.1616=C2=A0Fax=C2=A0626.628.3777=C2=A0Triple R M=
unitions, Inc626.201.9471=C2=A0TFFL 6,7 SOT 2
 On=C2=A0Friday, August 14, 2020,=C2=A0David Gott via Fot=C2=A0<[email-masked]=
eam.net>=C2=A0wrote:

So this was in the bottom of my oil pan. =C2=A0 Engine is out. =C2=A0 It is=
 not Thrust washers, and no rod bearings seem to have any excessive play. =
=C2=A0It is not from the timing chain tensioner. =C2=A0Center Main bearing =
looks great. =C2=A0 Any ideas? =C2=A0 These are large copper colored=C2=A0s=
hards, pic below. =C2=A0Appears to have some steel on them too, maybe. =C2=
=A0 Maine and=C2=A0Rod bearings are the king Tri-Metal and were calico coat=
ed. =C2=A0No sign of coating on these shards. =C2=A0 Anyone have a best gue=
ss? =C2=A0 Can=E2=80=99t find any play anywhere...
Thanks!
Dave Gott62 TR4

Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
_______________________________________________
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Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
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Thats a lot of material. &nbsp;Magnetic? Cam bearing?&nbsp;<br><br><div id=
=3D"__aol_mail_signature__">MDunst
<a dir=3D"ltr" href=3D"http://Headgasket.com" x-apple-data-detectors=3D"tru=
e" x-apple-data-detectors-type=3D"link" x-apple-data-detectors-result=3D"0"=
>Headgasket.com</a>
<a dir=3D"ltr" href=3D"tel:626.358.1616" x-apple-data-detectors=3D"true" x-=
apple-data-detectors-type=3D"telephone" x-apple-data-detectors-result=3D"1"=
>626.358.1616</a>&nbsp;<div>Fax&nbsp;<a dir=3D"ltr" href=3D"tel:626.628.377=
7" x-apple-data-detectors=3D"true" x-apple-data-detectors-type=3D"telephone=
" x-apple-data-detectors-result=3D"2">626.628.3777</a>&nbsp;</div><div>Trip=
le R Munitions, Inc
<a dir=3D"ltr" href=3D"tel:626.201.9471" x-apple-data-detectors=3D"true" x-=
apple-data-detectors-type=3D"telephone" x-apple-data-detectors-result=3D"3"=
>626.201.9471</a>&nbsp;</div><div>T
FFL 6,7 SOT 2</div></div>

<br><div class=3D"aolmail_replyHeader">
    On&nbsp;Friday, August 14, 2020,&nbsp;David Gott via Fot&nbsp;&lt;<a di=
r=3D"ltr" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" x-apple-data-detectors=3D"true=
" x-apple-data-detectors-type=3D"link" x-apple-data-detectors-result=3D"4">=
[email-masked]</a>&gt;&nbsp;wrote:
</div><br>
<blockquote style=3D"margin:0 0 0 9px;padding:0 0 0 9px;"><div id=3D"yiv261=
7292081"><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml><o:OfficeDocumentSettings><o:AllowPNG/><o:=
PixelsPerInch>96</o:PixelsPerInch></o:OfficeDocumentSettings></xml><![endif=
]--><div>
<br>So this was in the bottom of my oil pan. &nbsp; Engine is out. &nbsp; I=
t is not Thrust washers, and no rod bearings seem to have any excessive pla=
y. &nbsp;It is not from the timing chain tensioner. &nbsp;Center Main beari=
ng looks great. &nbsp; Any ideas? &nbsp; These are large copper colored&nbs=
p;shards, pic below. &nbsp;Appears to have some steel on them too, maybe. &=
nbsp; Maine and&nbsp;Rod bearings are the king Tri-Metal and were calico co=
ated. &nbsp;No sign of coating on these shards. &nbsp; Anyone have a best g=
uess? &nbsp; Can=E2=80=99t find any play anywhere...<div><br></div><div>Tha=
nks!</div><div><br></div><div>Dave Gott</div><div>62 TR4</div><div><br></di=
v><div><div><br></div><img class=3D"yiv2617292081ymail-preserve-class yiv26=
17292081inline-image-guid-E7CCA6A1-7E09-4C62-AE57-F94E5A6E4D57 yiv261729208=
1rte-inline-saved-image" src=3D"cid:E7CCA6A1-7E09-4C62-AE57-F94E5A6E4D57" y=
ahoo_partid=3D"2" alt=3D"Inline image" style=3D"width: 100%; visibility: vi=
sible;"><div><br></div><span id=3D"yiv2617292081yahoo-rte-cursor-span"></sp=
an><br><br><a rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_blank" href=3D"https://overview.m=
ail.yahoo.com/?.src=3DiOS">Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone</a><br></div>
</div></div>_______________________________________________<br><a ymailto=
=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">fot@autox=
.team.net</a><br><br><a href=3D"http://www.fot-racing.com" target=3D"_blank=
">http://www.fot-racing.com</a><br><br>Donate: <a href=3D"http://www.team.n=
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gte.net</a><br><br><br></blockquote>
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_______________________________________________
[email-masked]

http://www.fot-racing.com

Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot

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From: Greg Blake via Fot <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 14 Aug 2020 22:20:54 -0500

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I know you said you can=E2=80=99t find any play but I=E2=80=99d suggest a fu=
ll tear down. That amount of metal is not good. This is just what you are se=
eing in the pan, think of what got circulated through the motor. Pull your b=
earings. My guess is they are gone. I saw this in a cut oil filter once and t=
he rod bearings were shot. Actually crank was cracked in a couple locations t=
oo. Hopefully in your case just hammered bearings. My guess is your oil filt=
er and cooler are full
If this too. Good luck.=20

Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 14, 2020, at 9:43 PM, Mordy Dunst via Fot <[email-masked]> wrot=
e:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BFThats a lot of material.  Magnetic? Cam bearing?=20
>=20
> MDunst Headgasket.com 626.358.1616=20
> Fax 626.628.3777=20
> Triple R Munitions, Inc 626.201.9471=20
> T FFL 6,7 SOT 2
>=20
> On Friday, August 14, 2020, David Gott via Fot <[email-masked]> wrote:=

>=20
>=20
> So this was in the bottom of my oil pan.   Engine is out.   It is not Thru=
st washers, and no rod bearings seem to have any excessive play.  It is not f=
rom the timing chain tensioner.  Center Main bearing looks great.   Any idea=
s?   These are large copper colored shards, pic below.  Appears to have some=
 steel on them too, maybe.   Maine and Rod bearings are the king Tri-Metal a=
nd were calico coated.  No sign of coating on these shards.   Anyone have a b=
est guess?   Can=E2=80=99t find any play anywhere...
>=20
>=20
> Dave Gott
> 62 TR4
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gasket.works=
@gte.net
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/gblake58tr3@=
icloud.com
>=20
>=20

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">I know you said you can=E2=80=99t find any p=
lay but I=E2=80=99d suggest a full tear down. That amount of metal is not go=
od. This is just what you are seeing in the pan, think of what got circulate=
d through the motor. Pull your bearings. My guess is they are gone. I saw th=
is in a cut oil filter once and the rod bearings were shot. Actually crank w=
as cracked in a couple locations too. Hopefully in your case just hammered b=
earings. My guess is your oil filter and cooler are full<div>If this too. Go=
od luck.&nbsp;<br><br><div dir=3D"ltr">Sent from my iPhone</div><div dir=3D"=
ltr"><br><blockquote type=3D"cite">On Aug 14, 2020, at 9:43 PM, Mordy Dunst v=
ia Fot &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquo=
te type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">=EF=BB=BFThats a lot of material. &nbsp;Ma=
gnetic? Cam bearing?&nbsp;<br><br><div id=3D"__aol_mail_signature__">MDunst
<a dir=3D"ltr" href=3D"http://Headgasket.com" x-apple-data-detectors=3D"true=
" x-apple-data-detectors-type=3D"link" x-apple-data-detectors-result=3D"0">H=
eadgasket.com</a>
<a dir=3D"ltr" href=3D"tel:626.358.1616" x-apple-data-detectors=3D"true" x-a=
pple-data-detectors-type=3D"telephone" x-apple-data-detectors-result=3D"1">6=
26.358.1616</a>&nbsp;<div>Fax&nbsp;<a dir=3D"ltr" href=3D"tel:626.628.3777" x=
-apple-data-detectors=3D"true" x-apple-data-detectors-type=3D"telephone" x-a=
pple-data-detectors-result=3D"2">626.628.3777</a>&nbsp;</div><div>Triple R M=
unitions, Inc
<a dir=3D"ltr" href=3D"tel:626.201.9471" x-apple-data-detectors=3D"true" x-a=
pple-data-detectors-type=3D"telephone" x-apple-data-detectors-result=3D"3">6=
26.201.9471</a>&nbsp;</div><div>T
FFL 6,7 SOT 2</div></div>

<br><div class=3D"aolmail_replyHeader">
    On&nbsp;Friday, August 14, 2020,&nbsp;David Gott via Fot&nbsp;&lt;<a dir=
=3D"ltr" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]" x-apple-data-detectors=3D"true" x=
-apple-data-detectors-type=3D"link" x-apple-data-detectors-result=3D"4">fot@=
autox.team.net</a>&gt;&nbsp;wrote:
</div><br>
<blockquote style=3D"margin:0 0 0 9px;padding:0 0 0 9px;"><div id=3D"yiv2617=
292081"><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml><o:OfficeDocumentSettings><o:AllowPNG/><o:Pi=
xelsPerInch>96</o:PixelsPerInch></o:OfficeDocumentSettings></xml><![endif]--=
><div>
<br>So this was in the bottom of my oil pan. &nbsp; Engine is out. &nbsp; It=
 is not Thrust washers, and no rod bearings seem to have any excessive play.=
 &nbsp;It is not from the timing chain tensioner. &nbsp;Center Main bearing l=
ooks great. &nbsp; Any ideas? &nbsp; These are large copper colored&nbsp;sha=
rds, pic below. &nbsp;Appears to have some steel on them too, maybe. &nbsp; M=
aine and&nbsp;Rod bearings are the king Tri-Metal and were calico coated. &n=
bsp;No sign of coating on these shards. &nbsp; Anyone have a best guess? &nb=
sp; Can=E2=80=99t find any play anywhere...<div><br></div><div>Thanks!</div>=
<div><br></div><div>Dave Gott</div><div>62 TR4</div><div><br></div><div><div=
><br></div><div>&lt;IMG_1423.jpeg&gt;</div><div><br></div><span id=3D"yiv261=
7292081yahoo-rte-cursor-span"></span><br><br><a rel=3D"nofollow" target=3D"_=
blank" href=3D"https://overview.mail.yahoo.com/?.src=3DiOS">Sent from Yahoo M=
ail for iPhone</a><br></div>
</div></div>_______________________________________________<br><a ymailto=3D=
"mailto:[email-masked]" href=3D"mailto:[email-masked]">[email-masked]=
m.net</a><br><br><a href=3D"http://www.fot-racing.com" target=3D"_blank">htt=
p://www.fot-racing.com</a><br><br>Donate: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/don=
ate.html" target=3D"_blank">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br>Archive: <=
a href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive " target=3D"_blank">http://autox.tea=
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lank">http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot</a><br>Unsubscribe/Manage: <a href=3D=
"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/[email-masked]" target=3D"_=
blank">http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/[email-masked]</a><br=
><br><br></blockquote><div>&lt;IMG_1423.jpeg&gt;</div><span>________________=
_______________________________</span><br><span>[email-masked]</span><br=
><span></span><br><span>http://www.fot-racing.com</span><br><span></span><br=
><span>Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html</span><br><span>Archive: http=
://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot</span><br><span>=
loud.com</span><br><span></span><br><span></span><br></div></blockquote></di=
v></body></html>=

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From: Phil Gott via Fot <[email-masked]>
Date: Sun, 16 Aug 2020 06:52:20 -0400

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BTW,
As someone asked: the pile of metal is completely non-magnetic. Still a myst=
ery as to what it is and where it came from and how it got into the ground u=
p and hammered condition it is without going through any of the engine beari=
ngs, all of which looked scarcely worn, no scores.. Would be good to know.
Phil

Sent from my iPhone

> On Aug 15, 2020, at 9:05 PM, David Gott via Fot <[email-masked]> wrote=
:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BF Thank you all for all the responses!   Here are the results...
> ..but first, have you all seen Ford vs Ferrari?   Remember the scene where=
 Carrol throws a nut under the Ferrari in the pits, and it is later discover=
ed by the crew, and they all freak out?   Yes, this appears to be that.=20
>=20
> Tore down the engine and there is nothing currently in the engine that thi=
s came from; we inspected every moving part.   So must have been hiding some=
where in the block from before... or one of you put something in there when I=
 wasn=E2=80=99t looking at the Kastner cup!   Haha. Realistically something m=
ust have been lodged somewhere; although I=E2=80=99ve had the pan dropped se=
veral times since taking custody of the car and never found anything odd.   M=
aybe this was a copper washer that I lost at some point!
>=20
> One item we did find, however, which was good to find, is that cylinder on=
e small end on the connecting rod wasn=E2=80=99t reamed correctly and was ha=
nging up in the wrist pin a bit.   This is the only part (wrist pins and sma=
ll end bushes) I haven=E2=80=99t addressed in the engine, so off to the mach=
ine shop it goes for a new small end bush to be put in.  However, no appreci=
able material was worn from the bushing, and certainly not that amount of ma=
terial!   So a worthwhile project, but I=E2=80=99ll have to miss the night r=
ace at Thompson I was planning for this coming Saturday, I think.   It=E2=80=
=99s the price I pay for doing what I can, when I can!  But what fun would i=
t be if there wasn=E2=80=99t anything to do??
>=20
> Fun fact: Joe Gibbs Driven XP3 oil seems to be a solvent for Permatex Avia=
tion gasket cement.   The felts in the rear main cap were washed clean, resu=
lting in an oil leak which launched this process in the first place.
>=20
> Take care, and thank you all for the input on and off list!!
>=20
> Dave Gott
>=20
>=20
> On Saturday, August 15, 2020, 6:38 AM, fubog1 via Fot <[email-masked]>=
 wrote:
>=20
> Bearing...
>=20
> Glen Efinger
>=20
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: David Gott via Fot <[email-masked]>
> To: FOT List <[email-masked]>
> Sent: Fri, Aug 14, 2020 7:48 pm
> Subject: [Fot] Oddity found in TR4 oil pan.
>=20
>=20
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/[email-masked]=
om
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/triumphsix@y=
ahoo.com
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/vfracing@aol=
.com

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">BTW,<div>As someone asked: the pile of meta=
l is completely non-magnetic. Still a mystery as to what it is and where it c=
ame from and how it got into the ground up and hammered condition it is with=
out going through any of the engine bearings, all of which looked scarcely w=
orn, no scores.. Would be good to know.</div><div>Phil<br><br><div dir=3D"lt=
r">Sent from my iPhone</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><blockquote type=3D"cite">O=
n Aug 15, 2020, at 9:05 PM, David Gott via Fot &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wr=
ote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">=EF=
=BB=BF<!--[if gte mso 9]><xml><o:OfficeDocumentSettings><o:AllowPNG/><o:Pixe=
lsPerInch>96</o:PixelsPerInch></o:OfficeDocumentSettings></xml><![endif]-->
Thank you all for all the responses! &nbsp; Here are the results...<div>..bu=
t first, have you all seen Ford vs Ferrari? &nbsp; Remember the scene where C=
arrol throws a nut under the Ferrari in the pits, and it is later discovered=
 by the crew, and they all freak out? &nbsp; Yes, this appears to be that.&n=
bsp;</div><div><br></div><div>Tore down the engine and there is nothing curr=
ently in the engine that this came from; we inspected every moving part. &nb=
sp; So must have been hiding somewhere in the block from before... or one of=
 you put something in there when I wasn=E2=80=99t looking at the Kastner cup=
! &nbsp; Haha. Realistically something must have been lodged somewhere; alth=
ough I=E2=80=99ve had the pan dropped several times since taking custody of t=
he car and never found anything odd. &nbsp; Maybe this was a copper washer t=
hat I lost at some point!</div><div><br></div><div>One item we did find, how=
ever, which was good to find, is that cylinder one small end on the connecti=
ng rod wasn=E2=80=99t reamed correctly and was hanging up in the wrist pin a=
 bit. &nbsp; This is the only part (wrist pins and small end bushes)&nbsp;I h=
aven=E2=80=99t addressed in the engine, so off to the machine shop it goes f=
or a new small end bush to be put in. &nbsp;However, no appreciable material=
 was worn from the bushing, and certainly not that amount of material! &nbsp=
; So a worthwhile project, but I=E2=80=99ll have to miss the night race at T=
hompson I was planning for this coming Saturday, I think. &nbsp; It=E2=80=99=
s the price I pay for doing what I can, when I can! &nbsp;But what fun would=
 it be if there wasn=E2=80=99t anything to do??</div><div><br></div><div>Fun=
 fact: Joe Gibbs Driven XP3 oil seems to be a solvent for Permatex Aviation g=
asket cement. &nbsp; The felts in the rear main cap were washed clean, resul=
ting in an oil leak which launched this process in the first place.</div><di=
v><br></div><div>Take care, and thank you all for the input on and off list!=
!</div><div><br></div><div>Dave Gott<br><br><br><a href=3D"https://overview.=
mail.yahoo.com/?.src=3DiOS">Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone</a><br><br><p cl=
ass=3D"yahoo-quoted-begin" style=3D"font-size: 15px; color: #715FFA; padding=
-top: 15px; margin-top: 0">On Saturday, August 15, 2020, 6:38 AM, fubog1 via=
 Fot &lt;[email-masked]&gt; wrote:</p><blockquote class=3D"iosymail"><di=
v id=3D"yiv4382351064"><div><div style=3D"color:black;font:10pt Arial, Helve=
tica, sans-serif;">
<div> Bearing...</div>

<div><br clear=3D"none">
</div>

<div>Glen Efinger<br clear=3D"none">
</div>

<div> <br clear=3D"none">
</div>

<div> <br clear=3D"none">
</div>

<div style=3D"font-family:arial, helvetica;font-size:10pt;color:black;">----=
-Original Message-----<br clear=3D"none">
From: David Gott via Fot &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br clear=3D"none">
To: FOT List &lt;[email-masked]&gt;<br clear=3D"none">
Sent: Fri, Aug 14, 2020 7:48 pm<br clear=3D"none">
Subject: [Fot] Oddity found in TR4 oil pan.<br clear=3D"none">
<br clear=3D"none">

<div class=3D"yiv4382351064yqt2025764260" id=3D"yiv4382351064yqt08010"><div i=
d=3D"yiv4382351064">
<div>
<br clear=3D"none">
So this was in the bottom of my oil pan. &nbsp; Engine is out. &nbsp; It is n=
ot Thrust washers, and no rod bearings seem to have any excessive play. &nbs=
p;It is not from the timing chain tensioner. &nbsp;Center Main bearing looks=
 great. &nbsp; Any ideas? &nbsp; These are large copper colored&nbsp;shards,=
 pic below. &nbsp;Appears to have some steel on them too, maybe. &nbsp; Main=
e and&nbsp;Rod bearings are the king Tri-Metal and were calico coated. &nbsp=
;No sign of coating on these shards. &nbsp; Anyone have a best guess? &nbsp;=
 Can=E2=80=99t find any play anywhere...
<div><br clear=3D"none">
</div>

<div>Thanks!</div>

<div><br clear=3D"none">
</div>

<div>Dave Gott</div>

<div>62 TR4</div>

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