Subject: Re: [Fot] TR6 old race car

From: robert bownes <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2012 14:57:10 -0500

It's kind of like buying a serial number plate and a title. You can (in
some sanctioning bodies) build a totally new car with little or nothing
more than the logbook as long as the logbook doesn't say otherwise.

Bob

On Tue, Nov 6, 2012 at 2:15 PM, Richard Good <[email-masked]> wrote:

> I have an oppurtunity to by an older TR6 car that was a racer in the past.
> The
> car has been laid up for many years. The car comes with the racing log
> book.
> Is there any value to purchasing a car with a log book. The car itsef is in
> bad shape and has little value.Thanks.
>
> Richard Good
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From: Scott Janzen <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 06 Nov 2012 14:57:23 -0500

Only if Paul Newman's name is in the log book.

On Nov 6, 2012, at 2:15 PM, Richard Good wrote:

I have an oppurtunity to by an older TR6 car that was a racer in the past. The
car has been laid up for many years. The car comes with the racing log book.
Is there any value to purchasing a car with a log book. The car itsef is in
bad shape and has little value.Thanks.

Richard Good

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From: Jason Ostrowski <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2012 14:46:46 -0600

The log book definitely helps add value and certain lineage to the car. The
down side, in this case,  is that the log book goes with the car (which is
apparently pretty far gone). For the log book to have any real value beyond
its pretty picture and autographs and it's matter of historical record...it
would of coarse have to accompany a real car. That being said, perhaps a
primary portion of the car could remain for a restoration.
In this case, important features of log book identity has to do with the
number written in raised lettering on the front of the log book... It must
match the number stamped into the roll bar. I believe SCCA Started this
"official registration" for the 1972 season.
For an SCCA car...The number has 2 parts; the region the car is (was)
registered in (01), and the order it was registered.(001)
Hence (01-001)  = region 1, 1st car registered.
The number, once given, is unique to the car and log book combo and does
not expire or change. Supposedly the # and various facts exist somewhere in
an SCCA archive. Other club racing sanctioning bodies did similar numbering
or perhaps an official "approved" metallic sticker (again on the roll bar).

Jason Ostrowski
Friendly Ghost Racing

On Tue, Nov 6, 2012 at 1:15 PM, Richard Good <[email-masked]> wrote:

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From: robert bownes <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2012 16:13:18 -0500

Yup. You can saw out the portion of the main hoop with the serial number in
it, take that, the logbook, and the (new) car to the tech inspector and
claim to have put in a new hoop for 'updated safety' and as far as they are
concerned, it is the same car. (Or punch the number into the new roll bar.
But that is cheating. ;)) As I said, excepting if the log book reflects
that the car is totaled and not repairable for competition.

Not really worth doing unless you have a need to have a car with the
lineage.

Bob

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From: Bud Rolofson <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2012 15:50:50 -0700

Richard,

I bought a Spitfire race car recently that has a SCCA logbook starting  
in 1972. The car was a race car from day one and the logbook indicates  
it was raced at Limerock, Watkins Glen, and other tracks in the east.  
The logbook even has a couple polaroid pictures of the car in race  
trim stapled to it in the back.

I was told that having such a logbook adds to the cars value because  
it shows it has "racing provenance" and that there are some races  
(California I believe) that only include cars that have a long racing  
history as shown by their logbooks.

I'll venture a guess that those that have historical logbooks will  
believe that it adds value and those that don't have such logbooks  
will say it doesn't add value. So of course I'm in the former group  
now but certainly having a logbook adds sex appeal if not value and  
having one is better than not having one when the time comes to sell  
it. If nothing else it adds to the cool factor in my opinion.

Bud Rolofson

71TR6 CC57365 (Good 6)
71 Spitfire MK IV Race Car #3
66TR4A CTC57529 (The Project)
71F-250 Camper Special (Triumph Support Vehicle)
Z-50A Hardly Davidson 1977 Honda Mini-Trail Bike (Triumph Pit Bike)

On Nov 6, 2012, at 12:15 PM, Richard Good wrote:

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From: "Robert M. Lang" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2012 17:55:28 -0500 (EST)

Hi,

The logbooks does little more than establish "provenance" (in terms of 
vintage) and if you intend to use it on tracks where a logbook is 
required, you get to skip that step...

I'd be more interested in "what is it" and "what's been done" to it than 
the log book. Maybe "where did it run".

If it's like a lot of old race cars, it's probably "used up" so there may 
be little value in the car itself.

Just MHO.

l8r,
rml
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bob Lang              Triumph TR6!!            |  This space for rent
Former NER Solo Chair                          |
Voice:617-253-7438                             |  Cell: 339-927-4489
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From: "Richard Good" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 06 Nov 2012 21:26:41 -0500

Thanks to all who responded.  I posted the question for a friend, Boyd 
Wagner and will forward the responses to him.  Boyd has restored a few TR's 
and recently built a Sprite for autocross and hillclimb.  I nominated him to 
our group a while back and he received a second but he has not been 
receiving e-mails.  His e-mail address is [email-masked].  Does he 
need to introduce himself first?

Richard

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Robert M. Lang" <[email-masked]>
Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2012 5:55 PM
To: "Richard Good" <[email-masked]>
Cc: <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: [Fot] TR6 old race car

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From: "David Kettler" <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 6 Nov 2012 21:54:28 -0600

Richard:

If you intend to race the car again in SCCA, the role cage rules differ 
depending upon when the car was constructed/registered.  The logbook will 
show when the car was registered.  All cars registered after 1/1/08 have 
different construction requirements and tubing sizes than those registered 
prior to this date.

If it is an old car and you are going to go through it extensively, it might 
not be a bad idea to upgrade the cage also.

Dave Kettler
Divisional Administrator of Scrutineering
Central Division - SCCA

-----Original Message----- 
From: Richard Good
Sent: Tuesday, November 06, 2012 8:26 PM
To: 'Friends of Triumph' Triumph
Subject: Re: [Fot] TR6 old race car

Richard

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From: "Clark W. Nicholls" <[email-masked]>
Date: Wed, 7 Nov 2012 09:03:31 -0500

I remember a few years ago that VSCCA was not allowing MGA cars that had not
been race cars in the past to enter. Seems that there were so many folks
building their street cars into race cars they feared it would be like a
huge spec class! I think that restriction is no longer in effect, but I'd
keep the logbook and whatever it takes to build a reincarnation of the TR6
just in case. 

Just my $0.02...

Clark
Clark W. Nicholls
1972 Stag (LE7931E) for sale, 1974 Spitfire (FM14571U) 
and 1 rusty GT6 needing new owner (KC 5577 L) (it will have soon!)
www.botchagaloop.net for old racing photos
"Reality, it's not what you think." 
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