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It=E2=80=99s a start, though off the top of my head there are three =
suspension settings that influence that, and of course tire pressure is =
the most direct variable with camber second.=20
> On Jul 12, 2021, at 5:21 AM, Scott Janzen <sjanzen@me.com> wrote:
>=20
> I also just monitor tire temp across the tread and wear patterns, =
figuring that=E2=80=99s a decent indicator of how the rubber is hooked =
up.
>=20
> Sent from my iPhone
>=20
>> On Jul 12, 2021, at 8:07 AM, Ponostyle <ponobill@gmail.com> wrote:
>>=20
>> =EF=BB=BFYou can play with these suspension settings and try to =
detect the effect of the changes, assuming you have some way of =
obtaining an infinite amount of track time or a skid pad (limited but =
useful) to do the testing, or you could get a simulation program to play =
with. That=E2=80=99s how I initially dialed in Peyote and the results =
were good. These are dynamic systems with a lot of variables that =
interact. It=E2=80=99s not easy to optimize, but a good suspension =
simulation program can model everything that=E2=80=99s going on. The =
biggest problem then becomes modeling our ancient cars with their odd =
suspension components that no modern engineer would ever dream of using =
in a modern car. It can be done by approximation=E2=80=94even a =
TR3/4=E2=80=99s bonkers trunnion system can be approximated, it takes =
some work and will never be completely accurate=E2=80=94but it=E2=80=99s =
a lot closer than cut and try will get you.=20
>>=20
>> Bill Babcock
>> Beach Bum
>> https://www.Ponostyle.com
>>=20
>>> On Jul 12, 2021, at 4:40 AM, Scott Janzen via Fot =
>>>=20
>>> I can tell you what my GT6 has. What you run I=E2=80=99m sure =
depends to some extent on tires.
>>> I run Toyo R888Rs - radials. They like negative camber. =20
>>>=20
>>> Fronts - 2.6 degrees negative camber, 1/16=E2=80=9D toe in, castor 6 =
degrees. Stock is 4, +/- 1. I have to admit I have never tried to =
adjust this up or down. With more castor, I think the camber gets a =
little more negative with turn-in, which is probably good as it counters =
body roll on the outside wheel. However, now you=E2=80=99ve got me =
thinking, and I may dial it back to stock to see if I notice the =
difference.
>>>=20
>>> Rears - 2.5 degrees negative camber, slight toe in to counter =
suspension flex.
>>>=20
>>> Hoosier bias plies (like the TD, which comes in 13=E2=80=9D sizes) =
don=E2=80=99t like negative camber, so they are not interchangeable with =
these camber settings.
>>>=20
>>> You can also adjust the castor by playing with the amount of shims =
front and rear on the lower a-arm, which will move the trunnion end of =
the A-arm front and rear. Of course, that effects the camber, iterative =
process. =20
>>>=20
>>> I inherited my car with work done to reduce bump steer - mainly by =
bending the steering links down. Very little bump steer within the =
normal operating range.
>>>=20
>>> Be curious to hear what settings you end up with, or others use.
>>>=20
>>> Scott Janzen,
>>> =E2=80=9968 GT6, but with inner and outer u-joints at the rear and =
spicer sliding halfshafts.
>>>=20
>>> On Jul 2, 2021, at 5:32 AM, Enquiries Road & Track via Fot =
>>>=20
>>> could anyone racing a GT6 (or even a Spitfire) please offer some =
comment on front alignment "settings". In particular, have you made =
engineering changes to increase the static caster?=20
>>>=20
>>> The most obvious option is to change to the trunnionless vertical =
links used on various clubman type race cars ., eg Caterham or Birkin. I =
have a set of Birkin alloy uprights , but i'll have to make suitable =
wishbones .=20
>>>=20
>>> I'm trying to recommission our Mk2 GT6 racer which we have not used =
for many years, and my memory was the "stock" front end was not good =
with "modern" slicks and particularly mid-corner indecision.=20
>>>=20
>>> Any comments gladly accepted
>>>=20
>>> thanks
>>>=20
>>> Terry=20
>>> Australia
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>=20
>>> http://www.fot-racing.com <http://www.fot-racing.com/>
>>>=20
>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>> Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive =
http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
>>> Unsubscribe/Manage: =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/sjanzen@me.com
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>=20
>>> http://www.fot-racing.com
>>>=20
>>> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
>>> Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive =
http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
>>> Unsubscribe/Manage: =
http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bill@ponostyle.com
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>=20
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">It=E2=80=99s a start, though off the top of my head there are =
three suspension settings that influence that, and of course tire =
pressure is the most direct variable with camber second. <br =
class=3D""><div><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Jul 12, 2021, at 5:21 AM, Scott Janzen <<a =
href=3D"mailto:sjanzen@me.com"; class=3D"">sjanzen@me.com</a>> =
wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><meta =
http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8" =
class=3D""><div dir=3D"auto" class=3D"">I also just monitor tire temp =
across the tread and wear patterns, figuring that=E2=80=99s a decent =
indicator of how the rubber is hooked up.<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D""><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"">Sent from my iPhone</div><div =
dir=3D"ltr" class=3D""><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" =
class=3D"">On Jul 12, 2021, at 8:07 AM, Ponostyle <<a =
href=3D"mailto:ponobill@gmail.com"; class=3D"">ponobill@gmail.com</a>> =
wrote:<br class=3D""><br class=3D""></blockquote></div><blockquote =
type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"">=EF=BB=BF<meta =
http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8" =
class=3D"">You can play with these suspension settings and try to detect =
the effect of the changes, assuming you have some way of obtaining an =
infinite amount of track time or a skid pad (limited but useful) to do =
the testing, or you could get a simulation program to play with. =
That=E2=80=99s how I initially dialed in Peyote and the results were =
good. These are dynamic systems with a lot of variables that interact. =
It=E2=80=99s not easy to optimize, but a good suspension simulation =
program can model everything that=E2=80=99s going on. The biggest =
problem then becomes modeling our ancient cars with their odd suspension =
components that no modern engineer would ever dream of using in a modern =
car. It can be done by approximation=E2=80=94even a TR3/4=E2=80=99s =
bonkers trunnion system can be approximated, it takes some work and will =
never be completely accurate=E2=80=94but it=E2=80=99s a lot closer than =
cut and try will get you. <div class=3D""><br class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">
<div class=3D""><b class=3D"">Bill Babcock</b><br class=3D""><i =
class=3D"">Beach Bum</i><br class=3D""><a =
href=3D"mailto:bill@ponostyle.com"; class=3D"">bill@ponostyle.com</a><br =
class=3D""><a href=3D"https://www.Ponostyle.com"; =
class=3D"">https://www.Ponostyle.com</a><br class=3D""></div>
</div>
<div class=3D""><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Jul 12, 2021, at 4:40 AM, Scott Janzen via Fot <<a =
href=3D"mailto:fot@autox.team.net"; class=3D"">fot@autox.team.net</a>> =
wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><meta =
http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: =
space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=3D""><div dir=3D"auto" =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: =
after-white-space;" class=3D"">I can tell you what my GT6 has. =
What you run I=E2=80=99m sure depends to some extent on tires.<div =
class=3D"">I run Toyo R888Rs - radials. They like negative =
camber. </div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Fronts - 2.6 degrees negative camber, 1/16=E2=80=9D toe in, =
castor 6 degrees. Stock is 4, +/- 1. I have to admit I have =
never tried to adjust this up or down. With more castor, I think =
the camber gets a little more negative with turn-in, which is probably =
good as it counters body roll on the outside wheel. However, now =
you=E2=80=99ve got me thinking, and I may dial it back to stock to see =
if I notice the difference.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div=
class=3D"">Rears - 2.5 degrees negative camber, slight toe in to =
counter suspension flex.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Hoosier bias plies (like the TD, which comes in 13=E2=80=9D =
sizes) don=E2=80=99t like negative camber, so they are not =
interchangeable with these camber settings.</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">You can also adjust the castor by =
playing with the amount of shims front and rear on the lower a-arm, =
which will move the trunnion end of the A-arm front and rear. Of =
course, that effects the camber, iterative process. </div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">I inherited my car with =
work done to reduce bump steer - mainly by bending the steering links =
down. Very little bump steer within the normal operating =
range.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Be =
curious to hear what settings you end up with, or others use.</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Scott Janzen,</div><div =
class=3D"">=E2=80=9968 GT6, but with inner and outer u-joints at the =
rear and spicer sliding halfshafts.<br class=3D""><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""><div class=3D"">On Jul 2, 2021, at 5:32 AM, Enquiries Road =
& Track via Fot <<a href=3D"mailto:fot@autox.team.net"; =
class=3D"">fot@autox.team.net</a>> wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div dir=3D"ltr" =
class=3D"">could anyone racing a GT6 (or even a Spitfire) please offer =
some comment on front alignment "settings". In particular, have you made =
engineering changes to increase the static caster? <div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">The most obvious option =
is to change to the trunnionless vertical links used on various clubman =
type race cars ., eg Caterham or Birkin. I have a set of Birkin alloy =
uprights , but i'll have to make suitable wishbones . <div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">I'm trying to =
recommission our Mk2 GT6 racer which we have not used for many years, =
and my memory was the "stock" front end was not good with "modern" =
slicks and particularly mid-corner indecision. </div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Any comments gladly =
accepted</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">thanks</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Terry </div><div class=3D"">Australia</div></div></div>
_______________________________________________<br class=3D""><a =
href=3D"mailto:fot@autox.team.net"; class=3D"">fot@autox.team.net</a><br =
class=3D""><br class=3D""><a href=3D"http://www.fot-racing.com/"; =
class=3D"">http://www.fot-racing.com</a><br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">Donate: <a href=3D"http://www.team.net/donate.html"; =
class=3D"">http://www.team.net/donate.html</a><br class=3D"">Archive: <a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/archive"; =
class=3D"">http://autox.team.net/archive</a> <a =
href=3D"http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot"; =
class=3D"">http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot</a><br =
class=3D"">Unsubscribe/Manage: <a =
href=3D"http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/sjanzen@me.com"; =
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class=3D""><br class=3D""><br class=3D""></div></div><br =
class=3D""></div></div></div>_____________________________________________=
__<br class=3D""><a href=3D"mailto:fot@autox.team.net"; =
class=3D"">fot@autox.team.net</a><br class=3D""><br class=3D""><a =
href=3D"http://www.fot-racing.com"; =
class=3D"">http://www.fot-racing.com</a><br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html<br class=3D"">Archive: =
http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot<br =
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http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/bill@ponostyle.com<br =
class=3D""><br class=3D""><br class=3D""></div></blockquote></div><br =
class=3D""></div></div></blockquote></div></div></blockquote></div><br =
class=3D""></body></html>=
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