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Marty;
How certain are you that the loss of power is cam-related? It could be a fue=
l delivery issue. Easy to check with an air-fuel ratio gauge. You might noti=
ce the mixture getting leaner as revs increase.=20
Phil Gott
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jul 10, 2021, at 9:28 AM, LEE FOLLANSBEE via Fot <fot@autox.team.net> w=
rote:
>=20
> =EF=BB=BF
> Marty, how much over 7k are you taking your engine? Valve springs are ind=
eed a wear item, I replace them on the engines I build by probably the 3rd r=
ebuild. This is true for all makes of engines. I have a very nice spring c=
hecker that I use and checking the spring pressures at install height and no=
se (max compression) is an integral part of each rebuild.
>=20
> From: Fot <fot-bounces@autox.team.net> on behalf of Scott Janzen via Fot <=
fot@autox.team.net>
> Sent: Saturday, July 10, 2021 7:27 AM
> To: marty sukey <trmarty@hotmail.com>
> Cc: 'Friends of Triumph' Triumph <fot@autox.team.net>
> Subject: Re: [Fot] Valve spring pressures
> =20
> I shim mine to meet the cam maker=E2=80=99s requirements, and usually find=
there is a range of a few shims within which they are all set the same. I a=
lso find that after two seasons the springs have lost about 30 lb seat press=
ure. I routinely rev my GT6 to 7k (same valve train as your Spit) and figur=
ed out that at a typical race weekend at Summit Point it might go to redline=
560 times (about eight times a lap). your results may vary!
>=20
> Anyway, a 30 lb loss is over 10%. My settings are roughly 60 lb closed, 2=
30 lb open at 0.523 lift. I run the Isky VWE 005/SP116. They also make a s=
et with a softer inner spring (SP006) if you don=E2=80=99t need as much spri=
ng pressure.
> I have a fairly radical cam, and these springs are adequate, have been run=
ning them for years. Other manufacturers offer what seem to be similar but n=
ot identical spec springs, but if you open up the box and they have orange p=
aint on them, they are these Iskys. It seems others re-package and sell the=
m. I=E2=80=99ve found this twice from other manufacturers, such as comp cam=
s.
>=20
> My guesses are:
> you may not routinely run over 7k and have not noticed this before.
> It may be valve float
> If it=E2=80=99s a recent change, look for a broken valve spring
> make sure your spring loads match the cam maker=E2=80=99s requirements.
> If you have been running these springs =E2=80=9Cforever=E2=80=9D, replace t=
hem. They are a wear item.
>=20
> See you at Pitt race!
>=20
> On Jul 10, 2021, at 10:07 AM, ralph hansen via Fot <fot@autox.team.net> wr=
ote:
>=20
> I always set mine up with equal pressures at full closed. I would check th=
em at full open and sometimes adjust them a bit to get better balance when c=
losed. The pressure to open is more critical (told by a very old race tech f=
rom back in the day) to balance and smooth out the running at high rpm. Thin=
k of it as running through a series of eight spring loaded closed doors. If t=
hey are all the same spring pressure you fly through, with spring variances y=
ou get through some quicker, others impede your movement. I usually ended up=
with eight different shim stacks under my valves to achieve this but my und=
er-developed 1147 would pull to 8k nice a steady and run a few ticks off the=
flyboys and ahead of many stronger cars.=20
>=20
> On Saturday, July 10, 2021, 08:48:40 AM CDT, marty sukey via Fot <fot@auto=
x.team.net> wrote:
>=20
>=20
> Hey all. I am trying to decipher some power loss weirdness I was experienc=
ing on the dyno Thursday over 7000 rpm on my Spitfire. One of the paths I am=
going down is valve spring pressure at full open. I know its cam dependent b=
ut what are some of you other Spitfire folks running so I can get some ballp=
ark ideas. Heading to PittRace on Wednesday.=20
>=20
> Thanks,
> Marty
> _______________________________________________
> fot@autox.team.net
>=20
> http://www.fot-racing.com
>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/quikrx@yahoo=
.com
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> fot@autox.team.net
>=20
> http://www.fot-racing.com
>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
> Unsubscribe/Manage: http://autox.team.net/mailman/options/fot/sjanzen@me.c=
om
>=20
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> fot@autox.team.net
>=20
> http://www.fot-racing.com
>=20
> Donate: http://www.team.net/donate.html
> Archive: http://autox.team.net/archive http://www.team.net/pipermail/fot
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.com
>=20
>=20
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">Marty;<div>How certain are you that the los=
s of power is cam-related? It could be a fuel delivery issue. Easy to check w=
ith an air-fuel ratio gauge. You might notice the mixture getting leaner as r=
evs increase. </div><div>Phil Gott</div><div><br><br><div dir=3D"ltr">S=
ent from my iPhone</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br><blockquote type=3D"cite">On Ju=
l 10, 2021, at 9:28 AM, LEE FOLLANSBEE via Fot <fot@autox.team.net> wr=
ote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">=EF=
=BB=BF
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3DWindows-12=
52">
<div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; c=
olor: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Marty, how much over 7k are you taking your engine? Valve springs are i=
ndeed a wear item, I replace them on the engines I build by probably the 3rd=
rebuild. This is true for all makes of engines. I have a very n=
ice spring checker that I use and checking
the spring pressures at install height and nose (max compression) is an int=
egral part of each rebuild.</div>
<div>
<div id=3D"appendonsend"></div>
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size:12pt; colo=
r:rgb(0,0,0)">
<br>
</div>
<hr tabindex=3D"-1" style=3D"display:inline-block; width:98%">
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif" col=
or=3D"#000000" style=3D"font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Fot <fot-bounces@aut=
ox.team.net> on behalf of Scott Janzen via Fot <fot@autox.team.net>=
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, July 10, 2021 7:27 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> marty sukey <trmarty@hotmail.com><br>
<b>Cc:</b> 'Friends of Triumph' Triumph <fot@autox.team.net><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Fot] Valve spring pressures</font>
<div> </div>
</div>
<div class=3D"" style=3D"word-wrap:break-word; line-break:after-white-space"=
>I shim mine to meet the cam maker=E2=80=99s requirements, and usually find t=
here is a range of a few shims within which they are all set the same.  =
;I also find that after two seasons the springs
have lost about 30 lb seat pressure. I routinely rev my GT6 to 7k (sa=
me valve train as your Spit) and figured out that at a typical race weekend a=
t Summit Point it might go to redline 560 times (about eight times a lap). &=
nbsp;your results may vary!
<div class=3D""><br class=3D"">
<div class=3D"">Anyway, a 30 lb loss is over 10%. My settings are roug=
hly 60 lb closed, 230 lb open at 0.523 lift. I run the Isky VWE 005/SP=
116. They also make a set with a softer inner spring (SP006) if you do=
n=E2=80=99t need as much spring pressure.</div>
<div class=3D"">I have a fairly radical cam, and these springs are adequate,=
have been running them for years. Other manufacturers offer what seem=
to be similar but not identical spec springs, but if you open up the box &n=
bsp;and they have orange paint on them, they
are these Iskys. It seems others re-package and sell them. I=E2=
=80=99ve found this twice from other manufacturers, such as comp cams.</div>=
<div class=3D""><br class=3D"">
</div>
<div class=3D"">My guesses are:</div>
<div class=3D"">
<ul class=3D"x_MailOutline">
<li class=3D"">you may not routinely run over 7k and have not noticed this b=
efore.</li><li class=3D"">It may be valve float</li><li class=3D"">If it=E2=80=
=99s a recent change, look for a broken valve spring</li><li class=3D"">make=
sure your spring loads match the cam maker=E2=80=99s requirements.</li><li c=
lass=3D"">If you have been running these springs =E2=80=9Cforever=E2=80=9D, r=
eplace them. They are a wear item.</li></ul>
<div class=3D""><br class=3D"">
</div>
<div class=3D"">See you at Pitt race!</div>
<div><br class=3D"">
<div class=3D"">On Jul 10, 2021, at 10:07 AM, ralph hansen via Fot <<a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:fot@autox.team.net"; class=3D"">fot@autox.team.net</a>> wrote=
:</div>
<br class=3D"x_Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class=3D"">
<div class=3D"">
<div class=3D"x_ydp359c3cd6yahoo-style-wrap" style=3D"font-family:Helvetica N=
eue,Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif; font-size:13px">
<div class=3D""></div>
<div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"">I always set mine up with equal pressures at ful=
l closed. I would check them at full open and sometimes adjust them a bit to=
get better balance when closed. The pressure to open is more critical (told=
by a very old race tech from back
in the day) to balance and smooth out the running at high rpm. Think of it a=
s running through a series of eight spring loaded closed doors. If they are a=
ll the same spring pressure you fly through, with spring variances you get t=
hrough some quicker, others
impede your movement. I usually ended up with eight different shim stacks u=
nder my valves to achieve this but my under-developed 1147 would pull to 8k n=
ice a steady and run a few ticks off the flyboys and ahead of many stronger c=
ars. </div>
<div class=3D""><br class=3D"">
</div>
</div>
<div id=3D"x_ydp4d4ec34dyahoo_quoted_6793605569" class=3D"x_ydp4d4ec34dyahoo=
_quoted">
<div class=3D"" style=3D"font-family:'Helvetica Neue',Helvetica,Arial,sans-s=
erif; font-size:13px; color:#26282a">
<div class=3D"">On Saturday, July 10, 2021, 08:48:40 AM CDT, marty sukey via=
Fot <<a href=3D"mailto:fot@autox.team.net"; class=3D"">fot@autox.team.net=
</a>> wrote:
</div>
<div class=3D""><br class=3D"">
</div>
<div class=3D""><br class=3D"">
</div>
<div class=3D"">
<div id=3D"x_ydp4d4ec34dyiv9492892091" class=3D"">
<div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"">
<div class=3D"" style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size=
:12pt">Hey all. I am trying to decipher some power loss weirdness I was expe=
riencing on the dyno Thursday over 7000 rpm on my Spitfire. One of the paths=
I am going down is valve spring
pressure at full open. I know its cam dependent but what are some of you ot=
her Spitfire folks running so I can get some ballpark ideas. Heading to Pitt=
Race on Wednesday. </div>
<div class=3D"" style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size=
:12pt"><br class=3D"">
</div>
<div class=3D"" style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size=
:12pt">Thanks,</div>
<div class=3D"" style=3D"font-family:Calibri,Helvetica,sans-serif; font-size=
:12pt">Marty</div>
</div>
</div>
_______________________________________________<br class=3D"">
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<span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>fot@au=
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